<p>Ok, so you are having multiple problems, lets break it down:</p>
<p>At the speed you are pushing, it would not be weird to have the Y belt slipping around. Also inertia comes into play, so please, dont do that.</p>
<p>What you are mentioning about the filament going out a bit, also makes sense. You are exceeding the max volumetric flowrate for the ender 3. I would recommend going for a higher flow nozzle/Hotend combo.</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-10-07T00:02:47.797Z
2021-10-07T00:02:47.797Z
Eduardo Pujol
<p>TL;DR: Don't do that.</p>
<p>Detailed answer: You need motion limit parameters that actually make physical sense, and firmware capable of executing a motion plan according to them. Your jerk and acceleration settings absolutely don't. Marlin's whole implementation of jerk is wacky (note: modern Marlin versions don't even use it but an alternative they call &quot;junction deviation&quot; instead) and likely to cause problems above very low values; I never was able to take it above 25 or so on Marlin without layer shifts. Acceleration is dependent on the stepper motor torque and the mass you'll be accelerating. For the Y axis, that's the bed, and it has enough mass you won't accelerate it above 12000 mm/s² or so, much less the requested 1 km/s² plus near-infinite acceleration from the extreme near-instantaneous 400 mm/s velocity change (&quot;jerk&quot;).</p>
<p>The speed of 400 mm/s is achievable if you don't do it instantaneously. Stepper motors begin to rapidly lose torque beyond a certain speed due to limits on how fast the magnetic field can build up and be reversed, which has to happen for each step. <a href="https://www.daycounter.com/Calculators/Stepper-Motor-Calculator.phtml" rel="noreferrer">This calculator</a> can compute the limits if you know the properties of your motor. For the Ender 3 Y axis motor, the limit is around 425 mm/s or so if I'm remembering right.</p>
<p>For actual print speed, though, the hotend and extruder cannot keep up with anything nearly that high. 150 mm/s is about the limit with that hotend, and it might even be lower with a stock extruder. Fortunately, Benchy is mostly acceleration-bound, not top-speed-bound, so if you can get your acceleration profile right, you can still print quite fast.</p>
<p>Now the next limit you'll hit is Marlin. Marlin is... not good at high speeds and accelerations. Often the layer shifts you hit with Marlin aren't even physical limits but Marlin bugs. If you want to go fast, you need Klipper, not only because it lacks these step timing bugs, but because you need its Input Shaper feature to keep the high acceleration from tearing your printer apart (literally, vibrating all the screws out!).</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T12:48:40.527Z
I printed a benchy at 300 mm/s and it came out fine. Actually it did surprisingly well. I set the speed to 150 mm/s, then on the printer's main screen turned up the print speed to 200%.
Proxy303
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T13:02:41.943Z
@Proxy303: How long did it take to print? I have a strong feeling it did not actually print at the speed you thought it did.
R.. GitHub STOP HELPING ICE
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T13:10:11.717Z
A benchy with the same settings except print speed usually takes 4-5 hours. (100% infill). This one took 58 minutes.
Proxy303
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T13:55:07.240Z
@Proxy303: 4-5 hours for a benchy is pretty long. Why are you printing with 100% infill? You shouldn't change print speed in printer's main screen.
kosteklvp
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T17:13:03.700Z
@Proxy303: 58 minutes is crazy long for a benchy. If you were actually printing at 400 mm/s and essentially infinite acceleration, it'd be more like 4 minutes. So your settings just aren't being honored, for whatever reason. For comparison, my fastest benchies on Ender 3 are around 13 minutes with around 200 mm/s and 12000 mm/s² accel.
R.. GitHub STOP HELPING ICE
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T17:17:25.430Z
Follow-up: I missed the 100% infill - that will add some time. Sliced for 100% infill with 150 mm/s and 10000 mm/s² for the solid fill, I get an estimate of 39 minutes to print. I'm not going to actually waste the material to print it but these estimates are usually very close to actual.
R.. GitHub STOP HELPING ICE
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T21:15:26.853Z
How did you get 13 minutes? What settings?
Proxy303
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T23:29:26.523Z
@Proxy303: Layer height, walls, top/bottom layers, etc. according to #speedboatrace rules. I lost my exact profiles in disk issue (may be recoverable) but roughly: travel at 420 mm/s and 21000 mm/s², print at 160 mm/s and 9000 mm/s², maybe faster for some types of lines. Square corner velocity was probably something like 50 mm/s. With Klipper and SKR Mini E3 V2.0 mainboard. If you search YouTube or look on the Annex Discord server at entries, you can find Ender 3's much faster than mine, too.
R.. GitHub STOP HELPING ICE
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T23:32:38.363Z
(Those numbers I just cited were pulled out of gcode files I found, reading the `G0 F...`, `G1 F...`, and `M204` commands - I'm not sure which of them was best, but all were in similar range.)
R.. GitHub STOP HELPING ICE
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T12:37:58.117Z
2021-09-29T12:37:58.117Z
R.. GitHub STOP HELPING ICE
<p>I am printing Benchies at high speed, I successfully printed one at 300 mm/s. If I set the speed to 400 mm/s, the Y axis begins shifting around. This is usually accompanied by a banging sound.</p>
<p>In addition, the extruder motor occasionally clicks. When it clicks, the filament shoots back out a little bit.</p>
<p>Print settings:</p>
<ul>
<li>Infill: 100 %</li>
<li>Hotend: 200 °C</li>
<li>Bed: 60 °C</li>
<li>Material: PLA</li>
<li>Infill: Lines</li>
<li>Walls: 2</li>
<li>Top/bottom layers: 2</li>
<li>Speed: 400 mm/s</li>
<li>Jerk: 400 mm/s</li>
<li>Acceleration: 1000000</li>
</ul>
<p>I am running custom Marlin-based firmware on the stock mainboard.</p>
<p>The printer shakes my desk when printing like this.</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T12:30:23.627Z
This is very fast printing speed. Why you want to print this fast?
kosteklvp
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-09-29T12:53:34.547Z
I'm trying to print many things in a day, but I can only print one at a time because of my warped bed. At least, I think it's warped. Prints come out fine in the center, but adhesion becomes poorer and poorer toward the outside edges of the bed, to the point where it won't stick at all in about an inch from the edges.
Proxy303
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-10-04T14:07:37.130Z
What layer height do you use?
0scar
CC BY-SA 4.0
2021-10-04T18:49:53.233Z
Just the normal 0.2mm
Proxy303
<creality-ender-3><fdm>
Creality Ender 3: Layer shifting at high speeds
Proxy303
# Creality Ender 3: Layer shifting at high speeds

(Asked by: username_0 on 2021-09-29)

I am printing Benchies at high speed, I successfully printed one at 300 mm/s. If I set the speed to 400 mm/s, the Y axis begins shifting around. This is usually accompanied by a banging sound.

In addition, the extruder motor occasionally clicks. When it clicks, the filament shoots back out a little bit.

Print settings:

* Infill: 100 %
* Hotend: 200 °C
* Bed: 60 °C
* Material: PLA
* Infill: Lines
* Walls: 2
* Top/bottom layers: 2
* Speed: 400 mm/s
* Jerk: 400 mm/s
* Acceleration: 1000000

I am running custom Marlin-based firmware on the stock mainboard.

The printer shakes my desk when printing like this.

**Tags:** creality-ender-3, fdm
> **Comments:**
> **username_1**: This is very fast printing speed. Why you want to print this fast?  
> **username_0**: I'm trying to print many things in a day, but I can only print one at a time because of my warped bed. At least, I think it's warped. Prints come out fine in the center, but adhesion becomes poorer and poorer toward the outside edges of the bed, to the point where it won't stick at all in about an inch from the edges.  
> **username_2**: What layer height do you use?  
> **username_0**: Just the normal 0.2mm  

---

## 2 answers

### Answer by username_4 on 2021-09-29. Score: 6 | Accepted answer

TL;DR: Don't do that.

Detailed answer: You need motion limit parameters that actually make physical sense, and firmware capable of executing a motion plan according to them. Your jerk and acceleration settings absolutely don't. Marlin's whole implementation of jerk is wacky (note: modern Marlin versions don't even use it but an alternative they call "junction deviation" instead) and likely to cause problems above very low values; I never was able to take it above 25 or so on Marlin without layer shifts. Acceleration is dependent on the stepper motor torque and the mass you'll be accelerating. For the Y axis, that's the bed, and it has enough mass you won't accelerate it above 12000 mm/s² or so, much less the requested 1 km/s² plus near-infinite acceleration from the extreme near-instantaneous 400 mm/s velocity change ("jerk").

The speed of 400 mm/s is achievable if you don't do it instantaneously. Stepper motors begin to rapidly lose torque beyond a certain speed due to limits on how fast the magnetic field can build up and be reversed, which has to happen for each step. [This calculator](https://www.daycounter.com/Calculators/Stepper-Motor-Calculator.phtml) can compute the limits if you know the properties of your motor. For the Ender 3 Y axis motor, the limit is around 425 mm/s or so if I'm remembering right.

For actual print speed, though, the hotend and extruder cannot keep up with anything nearly that high. 150 mm/s is about the limit with that hotend, and it might even be lower with a stock extruder. Fortunately, Benchy is mostly acceleration-bound, not top-speed-bound, so if you can get your acceleration profile right, you can still print quite fast.

Now the next limit you'll hit is Marlin. Marlin is... not good at high speeds and accelerations. Often the layer shifts you hit with Marlin aren't even physical limits but Marlin bugs. If you want to go fast, you need Klipper, not only because it lacks these step timing bugs, but because you need its Input Shaper feature to keep the high acceleration from tearing your printer apart (literally, vibrating all the screws out!).

> **Comments:**
> **username_0**: I printed a benchy at 300 mm/s and it came out fine. Actually it did surprisingly well. I set the speed to 150 mm/s, then on the printer's main screen turned up the print speed to 200%.  
> **username_4**: @Proxy303: How long did it take to print? I have a strong feeling it did not actually print at the speed you thought it did.  
> **username_0**: A benchy with the same settings except print speed usually takes 4-5 hours. (100% infill). This one took 58 minutes.  
> **username_1**: @Proxy303: 4-5 hours for a benchy is pretty long. Why are you printing with 100% infill? You shouldn't change print speed in printer's main screen.  
> **username_4**: @Proxy303: 58 minutes is crazy long for a benchy. If you were actually printing at 400 mm/s and essentially infinite acceleration, it'd be more like 4 minutes. So your settings just aren't being honored, for whatever reason. For comparison, my fastest benchies on Ender 3 are around 13 minutes with around 200 mm/s and 12000 mm/s² accel.  
> **username_4**: Follow-up: I missed the 100% infill - that will add some time. Sliced for 100% infill with 150 mm/s and 10000 mm/s² for the solid fill, I get an estimate of 39 minutes to print. I'm not going to actually waste the material to print it but these estimates are usually very close to actual.  
> **username_0**: How did you get 13 minutes? What settings?  
> **username_4**: @Proxy303: Layer height, walls, top/bottom layers, etc. according to #speedboatrace rules. I lost my exact profiles in disk issue (may be recoverable) but roughly: travel at 420 mm/s and 21000 mm/s², print at 160 mm/s and 9000 mm/s², maybe faster for some types of lines. Square corner velocity was probably something like 50 mm/s. With Klipper and SKR Mini E3 V2.0 mainboard. If you search YouTube or look on the Annex Discord server at entries, you can find Ender 3's much faster than mine, too.  
> **username_4**: (Those numbers I just cited were pulled out of gcode files I found, reading the `G0 F...`, `G1 F...`, and `M204` commands - I'm not sure which of them was best, but all were in similar range.)  

---

### Answer by username_3 on 2021-10-07. Score: 0

Ok, so you are having multiple problems, lets break it down:

At the speed you are pushing, it would not be weird to have the Y belt slipping around. Also inertia comes into play, so please, dont do that.

What you are mentioning about the filament going out a bit, also makes sense. You are exceeding the max volumetric flowrate for the ender 3. I would recommend going for a higher flow nozzle/Hotend combo.


---

