[02:40] <UndiFineD> hajour has a "finished" wiki page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/hajour
[02:43] <MichelleQ> sounds like she might be a real benefit to having on the accessibility team
[02:44] <MichelleQ> I can't sentence today...  Let's try that again.  It sounds like she'd be a real benefit to the team
[02:45] <UndiFineD> :D maybe she can help dutchie on the persona profile of Simon
[02:45] <dutchie> well, do it for me considering the amount of work i have on
[02:46] <dutchie> although term finishes a week today \o/
[02:46] <MichelleQ> dutchie: which persona is Simon?  I've forgotten
[02:46] <dutchie> http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/simon
[02:46] <MichelleQ> Ah, OK.
[02:46] <dutchie> wonder how much i could simulate simon by taking my glasses off
[02:46] <dutchie> might try that over the holidays
[02:47] <MichelleQ> I'm supposed to be working on the cognatively impaired persona...  She might be able to pitch in on that, too
[02:47] <MichelleQ> I'm hoping to have a chance to get to work on that, just as soon as I'm not spending every third day at the clinic.
[02:49] <UndiFineD> youre a nurse ?
[02:50] <MichelleQ> haha, no, I wish.
[02:50] <MichelleQ> Patient
[02:51] <UndiFineD> dutchie, hajour says: she likes to work on the profile together, first project you see
[02:51] <dutchie> oh, ok
[02:51] <dutchie> fair enough
[02:53] <UndiFineD> dutchie, hajour says: you can emulate the sight with 2 cocktail glasses
[02:54]  * MichelleQ recruits hubby for sight-impairment testing
[02:54] <UndiFineD> ;)
[02:54] <dutchie> UndiFineD: i am very short sighted, i was wondering how close my unaided eyes are to an officially visually-impaired person
[02:54] <UndiFineD> I use font size increasement, alot
[02:54] <MichelleQ> without his lenses, he's pretty impaired.  I'm sure he'd be willing to help out.  :-)  What's one more project?
[02:55] <dutchie> my prescription is -10 dioptres and i have only met one person who is as bad as me
[02:57] <hajour_> hai all
[02:58] <hajour_> its 4 o clock at night here so i stay 10 minits .then i go to sleep
[02:58] <MichelleQ> good gracious, hajour!
[02:58] <UndiFineD> tomorrow we 'll let her sign the CoC
[02:59] <MichelleQ> It's 10pm my time, and I'm struggling to maintain consciousness.
[03:00] <hajour_> dutchie  if you take to glasses with thick soil and look treu it.then you see like the person
[03:00] <dutchie> 3 am for me \o/
[03:00] <dutchie> hajour_: ah, thanks. i will try that when term has finished
[03:01] <hajour_> the memory person. is that problems with short memory just like me?
[03:02] <MichelleQ> if memory serves, it's a short-term impairment, yes
[03:02] <hajour_> ok
[03:06] <hajour_> imagine you go to a page but you don t find it immediately.and you are 3 pages far.then you already forgot what you are looking for
[03:06] <hajour_> ore maiby at page s 2 already
[03:06] <hajour_> is there no spellings control on this chat?
[03:07] <hajour_> now i have to go to google translate every time
[03:08] <hajour_> what good help with that problem is.a place in the corner of the monitor  were can note what the person is looking for
[03:09] <hajour_> i have to study the persons better.but that was coming right in my mind.
[03:11] <hajour_> if 1 of you want to ask something about me about that sort of things. just ask.you sal not hurt my feelings ore something :P
[03:14] <hajour_> michelleQ  dont fall asleep on your keyboard else you got tommorow a alphabet tattoo on your face :)
[03:17] <dutchie> hmm, i will finish this problem sheet in the morning
[03:17] <dutchie> goodnight everyone
[03:17] <hajour> i reely need to sleep. tomorow i sal be on chat again.mostly in the evening here
[03:17] <hajour> sweet dreams dutchie
[03:18] <hajour> i dont now how late it is in outher country s then
[03:18] <dutchie> it's 20 past 3 here in the UK
[03:19] <hajour> here a hour later
[03:19] <MichelleQ> Night everyone.  I'm headed to bed, too.  :-D
[03:19] <hajour> night michelle.
[03:20] <hajour> sweet dreams everyone i am going to sleep to.
[11:29] <hajour> hai all
[11:29] <AlanBell> hi
[11:30] <hajour> already got some information on my wiki page.
[11:31] <hajour> if i have it understand correctly pendulum is on vacation
[11:32] <hajour> AlanBell, if i got understand correctly pendulum is on vacation.
[11:33] <AlanBell> it is thanksgiving weekend in the US
[11:33] <AlanBell> which seems to be a bigger deal than Christmas
[11:36] <hajour> but i wonder .if i got a question about the program.wo i can talk to then
[11:37] <AlanBell> just ask your question
[11:37] <AlanBell> either someone will know the answer, or perhaps not!
[11:38] <AlanBell> or we might be able to point you in the right direction to get it answered
[11:38] <hajour> ok because its the first time i ever work about something like this
[11:42] <hajour> beter say .i have not got a job in about 18 years because of my handicaps.i just being looking around 1 month.because i now finally can concentrate thanks to the medicin i have from 2 months ago.
[11:43] <hajour> all i now and can do i have learned myself by doing and reading on internet so mutch i can.
[11:44] <hajour> and by experience
[14:39] <hajour> AlanBell,  your person  Faisal got rheumatoid arthritis. this sal be mutch more bad. if the disease sal  progressing.he sal not be able to use his hands at all.he needs a speach commando program with voice recognition.the voice recognition is needed.because he need it also in class
[14:42] <mhall119> Pendulum: I created a new series in ubuntu-website: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-website/light-a11y-theme
[14:42] <Pendulum> mhall119: thanks :)
[14:42] <mhall119> you can start targetting your a11y bugs there, and if the design team doesn't get off their butts on this we'll just start doing it ourselves
[14:42] <mhall119> I'm tired of this back and forth
[14:42] <Pendulum> so'm I
[14:42] <mhall119> I just want to see something done
[14:43] <Pendulum> thanks
[14:43] <mhall119> so if you and charlie-tca can start collecting ideas of what would make it better, put it there
[14:43] <hajour> AlanBell, i now it because my mother got that disease
[14:43] <mhall119> np
[14:43] <hajour> and i got the beginning symptoms
[14:45] <hajour> Pendulum,  what you think about my wiki page.its it clear enough for other people?
[14:45] <hajour> wiki.ubuntu.com/hajour
[14:46] <UndiFineD> great work mhall119
[14:49] <Pendulum> hajour: you have 4 children? how do you manage to ever have time for yourself? ;-)
[14:51] <Pendulum> hajour: the only thing I'd suggest is removing one of the headings that says "hajour"
[14:51] <Pendulum> otherwise looks good for now :)
[14:52] <hajour> i have no time fore myself.:))
[14:53] <hajour> the 2 times hajour was not the meaning.undifined is already looking at it
[14:53] <Pendulum> :)
[14:54] <hajour> the inmoprtant thing is.is that it is understandeble for others
[14:55] <hajour> i got to look for some spelling control for here in chat :(
[14:58] <hajour> what also need to be in my wiki profile is:sometimes my the fingers of my left hand refuse to cooperate
[15:00] <hajour> then i cant use them at all.by exsample then my daughter cut my meat with diner
[15:01] <hajour> mhall119,  i have heard from undifined what you going to do.realy great
[15:04] <hajour> o and i already have found 10 alfabet sighn Languages
[15:04] <hajour> stil looking for the french
[15:06] <hajour> who has person Henrietta?
[15:11] <hajour> Faisal need also contrasting colors.because he seeing al kind of grey .meaning more like black on white
[15:11] <hajour> instead of by exsample yellow he seeing light grey
[15:12] <hajour> my cousin is colorblind thats why i now it :)
[15:16] <hajour> Pendulum i now a lot of things for the persons but i can type there because my writing is very bad.undifined was last night 2 hours bussy to make my page with out mistakes :(
[15:18] <hajour> before that i had checkt already on google for spelling and then with google translate.
[15:19] <hajour> so 3 and half hours work for me and stil not good
[15:20] <hajour> mhall119,  i got a question
[15:21] <Pendulum> hajour: wow. tbh, that's better than a lot of early wiki pages I've seen
[15:22] <hajour> o i dont now ore it have to be a question on you mhall119
[15:22] <hajour> thank you Pendulum
[15:23] <hajour> mmm what means tbh
[15:23] <Pendulum> hajour: sorry, tbh means to be honest
[15:23] <hajour> ok:)
[15:24] <hajour> i have put some information in chat
[15:27] <hajour> i have tried to use.short lines as posible.pity i could not Select other  fonts
[15:34] <hajour> Pendulum, think the program can be used on a note book.? i mean taking into account of the strength from the Proccesor?
[15:35] <Pendulum> hajour: what program?
[15:35] <hajour> the accessible program
[15:35] <Pendulum> (sorry, i've been drafing a long e-mail and not paying a huge amount of attention)
[15:35] <hajour> np :)
[15:36] <Pendulum> as far as I know, Orca runs fine on a notebook, I know the on screen keyboards and dasher work fine on them
[15:36] <Pendulum> hajour: does that answer your question?
[15:37] <hajour> this machine i am using is an  eeepc 901
[15:37] <Pendulum> heh
[15:37] <hajour> runni9ng xubuntu 10,10
[15:38] <Pendulum> I haven't tried Orca on something that small
[15:38] <hajour> my old pc is dead
[15:38] <Pendulum> I do use on screen keyboards on my Dell Mini10v, though
[15:38] <hajour> undifined have say to me orca is to heavy
[15:38] <Pendulum> ah
[15:39] <hajour> thats the problem
[15:42] <hajour> Pendulum, how i can give al of my knowledge for the persons.with out put the chat full of it.they ask me to do some persons.but i have a great problem with writhing.and that is not only in english.also in my own laughwich
[15:43] <Pendulum> hajour: are you asking how to give feedback without writing it or how to give feedback on a place other than IRC?
[15:44] <Pendulum> If you are okay giving written feedback, you could e-mail me<EMAIL_ADDRESS>, the mailing list<EMAIL_ADDRESS>, or possibly AlanBell (but I won't give out his e-mail without his permission)
[15:46] <Pendulum> If you'd rather do oral feedback, if you can do it in English, we could either set up a call using something like skype for some point in the next week or so or you could record your feedback and mail it to me or post it somewhere and I could transcribe it
[15:50] <Pendulum> hajour: welcome back :)
[15:50] <hajour> pust the wrong button
[15:50] <Pendulum> I do that all the time :)
[15:50] <hajour> then the notebook was out
[15:50] <Pendulum> Unfortunately, I know almost no Dutch so I can't help as much with the Dutch -> English issue
[15:51] <Pendulum> (I started learning Dutch a bit over a year ago and then was really ill for a while so it got put on hold and I've not gotten back to it)
[15:54] <hajour> Pendulum, i have not al the lines what you just have say from my question till hajour welcom back the part between i miss
[15:54] <hajour> i just have look back on undifineds pc
[15:55] <hajour> mmm already lost what there was write down.
[15:55] <Pendulum> hajour: are you asking how to give feedback without writing it or how to give feedback on a place other than IRC?
[15:56] <Pendulum> hajour: are you asking how to give feedback without writing it or how to give feedback on a place other than IRC?
[15:56] <Pendulum> bah, that didn't work
[15:56] <Pendulum> let me trying pasting that again ;)
[15:57] <Pendulum> If you are okay giving written feedback, you could e-mail me<EMAIL_ADDRESS>, the mailing list<EMAIL_ADDRESS>, or possibly AlanBell (but I won't give out his e-mail without his permission)
[15:57] <Pendulum> If you'd rather do oral feedback, if you can do it in English, we could either set up a call using something like skype for some point in the next week or so or you could record your feedback and mail it to me or post it somewhere and I could transcribe it
[15:57] <hajour> I will not be annoying to fill the entire chat by spamming
[15:58] <hajour> of my knowledge
[15:58] <Pendulum> :)
[15:59] <hajour> sorry it takes long.have to check first and then translate
[15:59] <Pendulum> that's fine
[15:59] <hajour> first i read back
[16:00] <AlanBell> hi all
[16:00] <AlanBell><EMAIL_ADDRESS>gets to me
[16:00] <Pendulum> hey AlanBell
[16:00] <AlanBell> but chat here or on the list is best because more people see it that way and can learn from it
[16:01] <Pendulum> yeah
[16:01] <Pendulum> I was just thinking on personas-specific things it may be more useful to e-mail one of us directly
[16:01] <hajour> ok
[16:01] <Pendulum> AlanBell: btw, you may want to check out the long conversation had in -locoteams today
[16:02] <AlanBell> yes, I have seen some of that
[16:02] <hajour> i have put some info here for your person to AlanBell
[16:02] <AlanBell> just reading back here too
[16:02] <hajour> :))
[16:02] <AlanBell> thanks for that hajour, really helpful
[16:02] <hajour> ok.was hoping already that you har something on it
[16:03] <hajour> hat i mean
[16:04] <hajour> wo have henrietta?
[16:05] <hajour> she looks like me thought :P very bad memory
[16:05] <Pendulum> hajour: MichelleQ does, although I don't think she's here right now. I suspect she'd love any help you want to give!
[16:07] <hajour> already now solution in monitor
[16:07] <hajour> for that person
[16:08] <hajour> and speak memory program
[16:08] <hajour> i head is full of idea s
[16:09] <hajour> to bad i only can up idea s and not more then that
[16:12] <Pendulum> :)
[16:17] <hajour> ok i going to eat now.i sal think how i is the best way.o and i dont have a microphone.
[16:26] <hajour> for i forget.is there also thought about persons wit discalculie?
[16:33] <Pendulum> hajour: we'd love to think about that, but we just don't have information on it. One of the major limiting factors when it came to personas was where we did or didn't get survey respondants
[16:34] <UndiFineD> to compute, to calculate, then why is a computer so bad at doing that ?
[16:38] <hajour> a friend of my daughter got discalculie
[16:39] <hajour> I can gather information about that
[16:40] <hajour> I have enough resources where I can get the information from
[16:42] <hajour> just think about spreadsheets by exsample for office work
[16:43] <hajour> ore programs fore on school
[16:43] <hajour> there  is almost nothing fore discalculie
[16:45] <hajour> children get discalculie abacuses in klas.en that in the year 2010
[16:46] <hajour> why not a pc program?
[17:26] <hajour> the  programs that are available are mostly very exspensive.schools dont buy them because of that
[17:28] <hajour> most of the schools anyway in netherland.same count for the programs for dislectie.i realy find this program realy great
[19:56] <charlie-tca> mhall119, thank you for helping on that bug
[20:54] <xrdodrx> Hi guys
[20:54] <xrdodrx> Kind of an odd question here: Are there any plans to add speech recognition to ubuntu?
[20:59] <AlanBell> hi xrdodrx
[21:00] <AlanBell> perfectly good question :)
[21:01] <AlanBell> there are two types of speech recognition, speech control which has a limited vocabulary of commands usually trained by the user
[21:01] <AlanBell> and natural language recognition which is computationally much harder
[21:06] <xrdodrx> I mean the second one
[21:08] <xrdodrx> I'm very accustomed to using Dragon and that's one of the reasons I don't use Ubuntu all the time :-(
[21:10] <xrdodrx> By I'm not here to complain. I just wanted to know about were any plans to add it in the future
[21:10] <xrdodrx> :)
[21:11] <Pendulum> xrdodrx: there are technically a couple programs in universe that do voice recognition, however, as far as I know none of them work very well. The problem is that voice recognition is a wider problem in open source software and until the program exists somewhere else, Ubuntu can't add it
[21:12] <xrdodrx> Oh, I think I'm confused about it then.
[21:12] <xrdodrx> I thought Ubuntu made its own Acessibility software
[21:12] <xrdodrx> Sorry :(
[21:12] <Pendulum> that's okay :)
[21:13] <Pendulum> most of our accessibility software comes from GNOME
[21:13] <Pendulum> but GNOME didn't develop all of it
[21:14] <xrdodrx> Well, we can only hope that one day someone will develop it
[21:14] <xrdodrx> Or that Nuance open-sources its software
[21:14]  * xrdodrx laughs :P
[21:14] <Pendulum> heh
[21:14] <xrdodrx> thanks anyway :D
[21:14] <Pendulum> there was an early version of ViaVoice that actually worked on debian and red hat, but this was 5-6 years ago
[21:14] <Pendulum> doesn't exist anymore :(
[21:15] <Pendulum> and what I'd like to see is one of the projects that's out there now such as Sphinx or Julian to get to the point where it works well, especially, since they're both still active projects
[21:16] <xrdodrx> Yeah.
[21:16] <xrdodrx> What's really strange is why proprietary companies don't release Linux versions :(
[21:17] <Cheri703> Nuance encompasses a LOT of software these days (they make one of the scanning packages that xerox ships)
[21:17] <Pendulum> they don't care about it
[21:17] <xrdodrx> Cheri703: yeah, OmniPage
[21:17] <xrdodrx> I've used them both
[21:17] <Pendulum> they don't see Linux to be as important to revenue to bother to port stuff to it
[21:17] <Pendulum> plus Linux is so varied that it's hard to release "a linux version"
[21:17] <AlanBell> I think the projects to watch are the ones that get into devices like GPS systems for cars
[21:18] <AlanBell> or telephone voice control
[21:18] <Pendulum> not impossible, but you can't release one place
[21:18] <Pendulum> AlanBell: unfortunately a lot of that is being done by places like Dragon
[21:18] <xrdodrx> AlanBell: and then you could use that codebase?
[21:18] <Pendulum> I don't know if you're interested in contributing, but I've been told a couple times that one thing that they always need is more voice samples
[21:18] <AlanBell> or something like http://live.gnome.org/GnomeVoiceControl for devices without keyboards
[21:18] <Pendulum> they = the open source voice recognition projects
[21:18] <xrdodrx> Pendulum: I could do that
[21:19] <xrdodrx> I don't know how to code, but I could talk :P
[21:19] <AlanBell> actually there is a nice list of applications for sphinx http://cmusphinx.sourceforge.net/wiki/sphinxinaction
[21:19] <Cheri703> xrdodrx: apparently DNS in wine works for some people
[21:20] <xrdodrx> Cheri703: I use DNS on a lot of machines; the one I'm on right now is a netbook. Wine would slow it down terribly :(
[21:20] <Cheri703> :/
[21:20] <Cheri703> well, for reference: http://grcomputerworks.blogspot.com/2010/05/installing-dragon-naturally-speaking-in.html
[21:20] <xrdodrx> But I have used it in Wine before ^^
[21:21] <Cheri703> ah, ok
[21:22] <xrdodrx> Also, voice recognition isn't really just an accessibility thing: sure, it's helpful for disabled people, but it's also very useful just for writing documents.
[21:22] <xrdodrx> (IMO)
[21:22] <Pendulum> xrdodrx: I agree :)
[21:23] <Pendulum> AlanBell: is Sphinx in the software center, do you remember?
[21:23] <Pendulum> I keep thinking it isn't, which is frustrating because it's generally the first open source voice recognition people mention IME
[21:23] <AlanBell> !info spinx2-bin
[21:23] <ubot2> AlanBell: Package spinx2-bin does not exist in maverick
[21:24] <AlanBell> !info sphinx2-bin
[21:24] <ubot2> AlanBell: sphinx2-bin (source: sphinx2): speech recognition utilities. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.6-2.1 (maverick), package size 126 kB, installed size 488 kB
[21:24] <Pendulum> \o/
[21:24] <xrdodrx> Only 500 kB?
[21:24] <Pendulum> I happen to know a few people who've used it successfully to program robots to respond to voice commands
[21:24] <xrdodrx> That doesn't sound possible xD
[21:24] <AlanBell> xrdodrx: I think it pulls in other stuff
[21:24] <xrdodrx> Ah.
[21:25] <Pendulum> also, I'm not sure if it has a GUI
[21:25] <AlanBell> !info pocketsphinx-utils
[21:25] <ubot2> AlanBell: pocketsphinx-utils (source: pocketsphinx): lightweight speech recognition - command-line tools. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.5.1+dfsg1-0ubuntu1 (maverick), package size 22 kB, installed size 112 kB
[21:25] <AlanBell> that too
[21:26] <xrdodrx> Pendulum: That would kill it for me.
[21:26] <xrdodrx> (make it useless)
[21:26] <Pendulum> yeah
[21:26] <AlanBell> yeah, last time I looked they seemed like "here is an awesome library, all you have to do is write an entire front end to it"
[21:27] <Pendulum> OTOH, the library is generally the hard part
[21:27] <AlanBell> yes, very true
[21:27] <AlanBell> !info python-pocketsphinx
[21:27] <ubot2> AlanBell: python-pocketsphinx (source: pocketsphinx): lightweight speech recognition - Python module. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.5.1+dfsg1-0ubuntu1 (maverick), package size 35 kB, installed size 180 kB
[21:27] <xrdodrx> Well, I guess we'll just have to see what the future holds :D
[21:28] <AlanBell> I was trying to get the python wrapper to talk to me (or vice versa as it happens)
[21:28] <xrdodrx> If someone gives me somewhere to send voice samples, I can do that much
[21:28] <xrdodrx> :)
[21:28] <Pendulum> one of the things that I've noticed with a lot of open source accessibility software is that it's done by universities
[21:29] <xrdodrx> Probably people that want to work for Nuance
[21:29] <xrdodrx> or similar
[21:29] <Pendulum> nah. a lot of the people have moved on to do nothing in accessibility at all
[21:30] <AlanBell> yeah, lots of almost identical not quite finished things done by students who move on
[21:30] <Pendulum> right
[21:30] <Pendulum> or where it gets moved on between students over time (i.e. dasher)
[21:31] <JanC> there isn't much money to gain in accessibility for linux currently, while there are innitial costs for research etc.
[21:31] <Pendulum> I know :(
[21:31] <xrdodrx> Other than my eternal gratitude
[21:31] <xrdodrx> XD;
[21:31] <Pendulum> also, this is not an issue for something being worked on by graduate students, but I know as an undergrad in the programming courses I took, we never worked on developing anything using a GUI
[21:31] <Pendulum> actually, not quite true, we did do java applets
[21:32] <Pendulum> but that was it
[21:32] <Pendulum> and I know that the python and C classes didn't do any developing of a GUI program
[21:33] <Pendulum> (and the current students at my uni would even get the java applets since they no longer teach java at all)
[21:33] <xrdodrx> Still, this would probably hurt nuances business. It wouldn't take long for a very useful Linux application to be ported to Windows
[21:33] <xrdodrx> I just sometimes wish that it would work vice versa
[21:33] <xrdodrx> :-)
[21:33] <Pendulum> heh
[21:34] <JanC> you can buy nuances technology for linux, just no end-user stuff
[21:34] <JanC> it's used in the embeded market though
[21:35]  * xrdodrx is an end-user
[21:37] <xrdodrx> Embedded market? Do you mean like cell phones and stuff?
[21:38] <JanC> more like phone menus and other stuff
[21:38] <xrdodrx> Because most cell phones are based on Linux/Unix
[21:39] <xrdodrx> As far as I know
[21:39] <JanC> actually, most cell phones are based on Symbian
[21:39] <xrdodrx> Symbian?
[21:39]  * xrdodrx goes to Google
[21:39] <JanC> OS from Nokia, became open source recently
[21:39] <Cheri703> symbian is rapidly losing market share though
[21:40] <xrdodrx> I was talking about iPhone (unix/Mac OS),
[21:40] <JanC> Cheri703: they have > 50% of the smartphone market, and a huge lump of the ordinary phone market
[21:40] <Cheri703> android is linux though
[21:40] <Cheri703> *too
[21:40] <xrdodrx> Android (linux), that other one that starts with an M...
[21:40] <Cheri703> meego I think? maybe?
[21:41] <xrdodrx> Yeah
[21:41] <JanC> Maemo/Meego
[21:41] <xrdodrx> I was thinking of Maemo
[21:41] <xrdodrx> actually
[21:41] <JanC> there are no Meego phones yet, but it is a fusion of Maemo with Intel's mobile linux
[21:41] <Cheri703> http://blog.connectedplanetonline.com/unfiltered/2010/11/10/android-ios-overtake-rim-hone-in-on-symbian/
[21:42] <Cheri703> symbian (according to these numbers) has more like 37% and falling
[21:42] <Cheri703> (smartphone)
[21:42] <xrdodrx> Wait, is the BlackBerry OS Linux or Symbian?
[21:42] <Cheri703> but most "dumbphones" won't be having speech recognition included in general
[21:42] <xrdodrx> LOL dumb phones
[21:43] <JanC> Blackberry is an OS based on AROS or something like that IIRC
[21:43] <Pendulum> I wish I could find a stat on Symbian that wasn't off their own website (which is where the >50% thing comes from)
[21:44] <Pendulum> I have also been under the impression that Symbian was on a downturn and whether they can reverse that or not has yet to be seen
[21:44] <JanC> oh no, QNX
[21:44] <Cheri703> supposedly symbian.org is closing down next month
[21:44] <Cheri703> Pendulum: search "android ios symbian market share"
[21:44] <JanC> ah no, it's their new OS that is based on QNX
[21:44] <Cheri703> that's where I found that link
[21:44] <AlanBell> I remember QNX, they did an amazing OS on a single floppy
[21:45] <JanC> well, Nokia is working on Meego to replace Symbian for high end phones
[21:45] <JanC> for Smarphones basically
[21:45] <JanC> AlanBell: the Blackberry tablet OS is based on QNX
[21:46] <Pendulum> Nokia has some major issues with selling smartphones in the US
[21:46] <Pendulum> or at least has in the past
[21:47] <JanC> Pendulum: they are still the largest smartphone manufacturer in the world
[21:47] <Pendulum> (largely because they haven't managed to strike deals with the mobile phone networks so things like the N95 were $800)
[21:47] <Pendulum> yeah
[21:47] <Pendulum> but even they admit that that's not due to sales in the US
[21:47]  * Cheri703 is an HTC fan
[21:47] <xrdodrx> I do not even think that any Nokia phones are offered by my carrier
[21:48] <Pendulum> I like my iPhone. I've liked the Nokia smartphones I've used, but I'd never be able to afford them in the US
[21:48] <Pendulum> xrdodrx: who is your carrier?
[21:48] <xrdodrx> Cheri703: yeah, I have an HTC EVO
[21:48] <xrdodrx> Pendulum: Sprint
[21:48] <JanC> locking a phone to a carrier is forbidden in Belgium  :P
[21:48] <Pendulum> heh
[21:48] <Pendulum> I wish it were here too
[21:48] <Cheri703> I'm lusting after the evo, I'm due for an upgrade, but waiting til the price drops a bit
[21:48] <Cheri703> I have the hero
[21:48] <Pendulum> I think it's forbidden in France as well
[21:49]  * xrdodrx wishes it was forbidden in the US
[21:49] <xrdodrx> Well, we can't even get net neutrality, but that's a whole different matter
[21:49] <Pendulum> on the other hand, the phones might end up being as expensive as unlocked phones are generally
[21:49] <Pendulum> JanC: how expensive are smartphones in Belgium?
[21:50] <JanC> phones are expensive, but you can get free or cheap phones with some contracts, they just can't lock the phone to it
[21:50] <Pendulum> ah, okay
[21:50] <JanC> you still have to pay the contract of course
[21:50] <Pendulum> so that does still happen
[21:50] <Pendulum> yeah
[21:51] <Pendulum> we can get free, cheap, or cheaper-than-full price phones in the US with contract
[21:51] <JanC> but no "iPhones only work with network X"
[21:51] <Pendulum> or we can get really expensive phones that aren't locked to one network
[21:51] <Pendulum> (like the Nokia smartphones)
[21:52] <xrdodrx> JanC: do they sell iPhones in Belgium?
[21:53] <JanC> xrdodrx: they do (first refused to do so while they lobbied to get the law changed, but that didn't work :P )
[21:56] <JanC> even "cheap" contracts that don't come with free/cheaper phone are more expensive than prepaid for me, so I'm totally not interrested in any of those expensive contract offers that come with "a cheaper smartphone"...  :P
[21:59] <AlanBell> mhall119: got a sec to talk about this light-a11y-theme thing?
[23:17] <mhall119> AlanBell: sure
[23:24] <AlanBell> so looks like it is based on light-base-theme
[23:24] <AlanBell> I haven't really used that, what is it for?
[23:25] <AlanBell> and is this series something that would ever get deployed anywhere?
[23:32] <mhall119> AlanBell: right now it's a direct copy of light-base-theme
[23:33] <mhall119> but it's going to be the place I start implementing accessibility changes
[23:33] <AlanBell> great
[23:34] <AlanBell> we learned some interesting things over the last few days, principally that ubuntu-website is nothing to do with website design
[23:35] <mhall119> it's goal is to be the implementation of the design team's designs
[23:35] <mhall119> light-a11y-theme is going to break from that unless and until we get an accessible design from the design team
[23:36] <AlanBell> ok, so what prevents us doing a stack of work on light-ally-theme which then sits there not being used on any websites?
[23:36] <mhall119> I'm hoping it won't be more than alternate css stylesheets, so they can be adopted by the other light-*-theme branches
[23:37] <mhall119> AlanBell: well, I maintain the light-django-theme, so I'll make sure it goes there
[23:37] <mhall119> you're doing light-moin-theme, aren't you?
[23:37] <AlanBell> well kind of
[23:37] <AlanBell> in fact no, I am not
[23:38] <mhall119> well, however maintains those others would be responsible for incorporating the accessible design changes
[23:38] <AlanBell> I have offered code to fix some bugs in light-moin-theme
[23:38] <mhall119> all light-a11y-theme will do will be provide them with the settings
[23:38] <mhall119> kind of like what light-base-theme was
[23:38] <AlanBell> there isn't any direct inheritance of base theme though is there?
[23:39] <mhall119> not technically, though light-django-theme uses unmodified css from the base theme
[23:39] <mhall119> but I think light-django is the only one that does
[23:40] <AlanBell> ok, I have done stuff with light-moin-theme and light-wordpress theme but I don't recognise much in light-base-theme
[23:41] <mhall119> I think light-wordpress-theme used an existing wordpress theme and modified that to look like the base theme, instead of going the other way
[23:41] <mhall119> not sure how moin came about
[23:42] <mhall119> who is maintaining the moin theme?
[23:42] <AlanBell> newz2000 is maintaining it
[23:42] <mhall119> ok
[23:42] <AlanBell> it wasn't on launchpad until I made a fuss about it
[23:42] <AlanBell> and now the trunk on launchpad is behind the production server as some live changes were made
[23:43] <mhall119> glad you did, cause I've got some changes to it for him
[23:43] <mhall119> live changes, FTL
[23:43] <AlanBell> indeed
[23:43] <AlanBell> especially as there is an outstanding approved merge request with the changes in
[23:44] <AlanBell> some bits got cherry picked from that and implemented live without updating trunk


[05:02] <Kilos> hi mazal Squirm and all others
[05:06] <mazal> More oom
[05:10] <mazal> Handy doc for Libre Office Calc users : https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/images/4/47/CG41-CalcGuideLO.pdf
[05:17] <Kilos> so. wat se jy van mate?
[05:46] <mazal> Nie te bad nie. So hier en daar iets kleins wat ek mis van Unity. Maar niks major nie
[05:46] <mazal> Wil op 'n stadium kubuntu-desktop ook opsit en check
[05:46] <Kilos> hehe dis heel anders maar baie lekker
[05:48] <Kilos> ian het van vensters gegaan na kde.hy hou nie van gnome nie
[05:50] <mazal> Dis mos net kubuntu-desktop wat ek moet install ne ?
[05:50] <Kilos> ya
[05:50] <mazal> Sal kyk oor die naweek dalk
[05:52] <inetpro> goeie more
[05:53] <Kilos> more inetpro
[05:56] <Squirm> morning
[05:58] <mazal> Morning inetpro , Squirm
[06:02] <Kilos> hard to believe that power packs caused all my probs. since using a second psu for drives ive had no probs
[06:09]  * Symmetria looks in
[06:09] <Kilos> hi Symmetria you winning?
[06:10] <Symmetria> heh, sitting in my empty house waiting for the furniture vans ;p
[06:10] <Kilos> lol
[06:10] <Kilos> here or up there
[06:11] <Kilos> you not moving here are you?
[06:11] <Symmetria> lol in Kenya
[06:11] <Symmetria> heh have furniture vans apparently arriving in an hour and I have the people to come do the fiber surveys on the way
[06:11] <Kilos> was just gonna say moving all your local setup is like a lifetime job
[06:12] <Kilos> cool direct fibre?
[06:12] <Kilos> you dont like slow connections
[06:12] <Symmetria> heh, well, I kinda cheated slightly ;p and decided that if we had really high speed access in here
[06:12] <Symmetria> I could sell high speed internet to all the other complex clients
[06:12] <Symmetria> so my house is becoming a metro node on our network
[06:13] <Kilos> aha
[06:13] <Symmetria> ;p with redundant 10G fibers into it
[06:13] <superfly> aloha
[06:13] <Kilos> cool
[06:13] <Kilos> hi superfly
[06:13] <Symmetria> lol strange how I had to move to kenya to get real bandwidth into my house ;p
[06:13] <Symmetria> the max I ever managed to pull off in ZA was a coupla hundred meg
[06:19] <Kilos> hi ThatGraemeGuy
[06:19] <mazal> Hehe , just figured out how to add launchers to the top panel. I forgot all about that and how handy it is :)
[06:20] <Kilos> ya worked well that hey
[06:20] <Kilos> mazal, have you installed mate onto the faulty unity?
[06:20] <mazal> I'm feeling sooooo 1995 now lol
[06:21] <mazal> Yes , my same OS
[06:21] <Kilos> no man 10.10 was the last gnome2
[06:21] <Kilos> and the prob is gone?
[06:21] <Kilos> so unity de was sick
[06:21] <mazal> I dunno , haven't been in Unity again since I installed Mate
[06:21] <Symmetria> I wanna stick a mirror server in my house
[06:21] <Symmetria> so I never have to download anything again
[06:22] <Kilos> lol
[06:22] <mazal> Symmetria, I would also like that :)
[06:22] <Symmetria> mazal lol I got the bandwidth into my house to run the mirror for all of east africa ;p
[06:23] <mazal> Wow ok
[06:24] <mazal> bbl , need to image
[06:45] <Kilos> sjoe, memories, found a shakespear big stick in storeroom
[07:05] <ThatGraemeGuy> so i recently got myself a camera, and i'm looking at getting a tele zoom lens sometime
[07:05] <ThatGraemeGuy> http://www.ormsdirect.co.za/canon-ef-200-400mm-f-4l-is-usm-lens-with-internal-1-4x-extender
[07:05] <ThatGraemeGuy> I'm taking donations :-p
[07:06] <Kilos> lol
[07:23] <Kilos> hi Vince-0
[07:33] <nuvolari> oh hi Vince-0, oom Kilos, ThatGraemeGuy, Symmetria, mazal, superfly, Squirm
[07:33] <Kilos> hi nuvolari
[07:33] <ThatGraemeGuy> g'day :)
[07:33] <Squirm> 'lo
[07:33] <Squirm> nuvolari: I hear you're busy joining in with the festivities over the past few days
[07:34] <Squirm> kudos to you
[07:41] <mazal> Hi nuvolari
[07:44] <Vince-0> ! nuvolari
[07:44] <Vince-0> an mese
[07:44] <Vince-0> mense*
[07:52] <Kilos> do we never need stuffs like http://www.rootkit.nl/projects/lynis.html
[08:14] <mazal> Oom Kilos , you don't perhaps can remember how big the download is for kubuntu-dekstop ?
[08:14] <mazal> My alie jeuk om te try , maar het nie baie data hier nie
[08:15] <Kilos> sjoe maybe 170m of so iets
[08:15] <Kilos> ek het kubuntu-desktop-full
[08:16] <Kilos> if you can name the packages i can give you the size of each
[08:16] <Kilos> hehe
[08:17] <sakhi> Morning
[08:17] <Kilos> hi sakhi howsit
[08:17] <Kilos> ohi kbmonkey
[08:17] <sakhi> Good thanks and you Kilos ?
[08:17] <Kilos> good ty
[08:18] <mazal> Seker beter om daai "full" een te install ne ?
[08:19] <Kilos> dit kry baie meer goed mazal
[08:19] <Kilos> kde werk sonder die full
[08:20] <Kilos> ek het full gekry net om data klaar te maak een maand
[08:22] <mazal> Ek hou van baie " goed "
[08:22] <mazal> Baie goed beteken baie dinge om mee te speel :)
[08:23] <mazal> En te karring....en te krap...en te peuter
[08:23] <Kilos> sjoe baie tools en goed
[08:24] <Kilos> ek het nog nie eers 1/4 pad gekom nie
[08:24] <Kilos> baie van die goed is vir slimmes
[08:24] <mazal> Ek's baie happy met die mate sover. Is nog baie vroeg en baie apps moet nog getoets word , maar op die stadium is hy nice
[08:25] <Kilos> en vinniger as unity
[08:26] <Kilos> ek het vroeg mate probeer toe kon ek niemand help met unity nie to gooi ek mate uit
[08:31] <mazal> Ek besef nou 'n ding , ek het mos aanmekaar daai irreterende boodskap gekry " system has encountered a problem " En dan het jy mos opsie om dit te stuur na Ubuntu toe
[08:31] <mazal> Aanmekaar , elke dag. Dit het nog nie vandag gebeur in mate nie.    Need to get 920mb
[08:52] <mazal> Will defnitely be done at home :P
[08:55] <Kilos> ja
[08:55] <Kilos> sjoe
[09:06] <Kilos> hi Tonberry
[09:24] <Kilos> hi psyatw
[09:25] <psyatw> hi Kilos
[10:01] <charl> good morning
[10:01] <charl> Maaz: coffee on
[10:01]  * Maaz puts the kettle on
[10:01] <charl> ah the maid is back :)
[10:05] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for charl!
[10:06] <charl> Maaz: thanks
[10:06] <Maaz> charl: Sure
[10:06] <psyatw> good morning charl
[10:06] <charl> hi psyatw
[10:06] <charl> how's it going
[10:06] <psyatw> going well
[10:07] <psyatw> recovering from the weekend
[10:07] <psyatw> :)
[10:07] <psyatw> and you?
[10:07] <charl> psyatw: ha ha ! did you have a rough weekend? you went to warsaw right?
[10:07] <charl> i'm doing well thanks
[10:07] <psyatw> charl, yeah, I´ve been travelling again
[10:07] <psyatw> and I sleep on buses generally, which is far from perfect
[10:08] <psyatw> but the weekend is so short, so I have to do something
[10:08] <charl> i also do that, and yes, it's far from perfect indeed
[10:08] <charl> that's the way i went to oktoberfest actually
[10:08] <psyatw> especially beccause it takes 5 hours to go to or from warsaw
[10:08] <charl> because the hotels around that time in munich are so expensive that i just sleep on the train
[10:08] <psyatw> yes, indeed
[10:08] <charl> i arrive early morning in time for the 10.00 opening of the beer tents and i left in the evening
[10:09] <psyatw> I spent one night at the mcdonald´s in warsaw in october :)
[10:09] <psyatw> because I didn´t know where to look for a hostel
[10:09] <charl> there were a number of people in munich at the mcdonalds who also did that
[10:09] <psyatw> but now I know
[10:09] <psyatw> haha
[10:09] <charl> at the top floor they had some places where it was convenient to sleep
[10:10] <charl> i was surprised that they allowed people to do that
[10:10] <psyatw> yes
[10:10] <charl> i only had a (really terrible) cappuccino and left
[10:10] <charl> the american coffee is as weak as it ever could be
[10:10] <psyatw> best is not to eat or drink anything there
[10:10] <charl> oh sorry no, that was at a starbucks, not a mcdonalds
[10:10] <psyatw> unless you have no choice
[10:11] <charl> no it was a mcdonalds indeed
[10:11] <charl> sorry my memory is a little messed up from oktoberfest :)
[10:11] <psyatw> hahaha
[10:11] <psyatw> well, I remember when you told me about it :)
[10:11] <charl> that's what drinking three litre of helle will do to you
[10:11] <psyatw> it was something like a ´bliksembezoek´ indeed
[10:12] <psyatw> wow
[10:12] <charl> yeah exactly
[10:12] <psyatw> I can´t even drink 3 litres of water on a day
[10:12] <charl> went half way across europe for a day of oktoberfest
[10:12] <psyatw> hmm, could we be related in any way?
[10:12] <psyatw> I´ve been called crazy for my unplanned visits
[10:13] <psyatw> but somehow I find it exciting to do things like that
[10:13] <charl> oh me too, believe me, both crazy bastards i guess :)
[10:13] <psyatw> :D
[10:13] <charl> yeah me too
[10:15] <psyatw> I always meet new people this way and can tell exciting stories about my adventures
[10:15] <psyatw> taking a flight is so boring in comparison
[10:15] <charl> yeah i had a great conversation with a german women who grew up in munich and is now living in bremen
[10:16] <charl> told me about what she thinks of oktoberfest people :) and to watch out for criminals
[10:16] <charl> she also said bavaria is the most educated state in germany
[10:16] <charl> but the bavarians are really awesome people all-round
[10:17] <psyatw> yes, I have found the same :)
[10:17] <psyatw> and I usually get along very well with germans too
[10:17] <charl> at oktoberfest i had a chat with a really cute bavarian girl who told me she does beer brewing for a living
[10:18] <charl> i almost didn't believe her, i told her, is that a common occupation for women i bavaria?
[10:18] <charl> in
[10:18] <psyatw> did you get her number? :)
[10:18] <charl> no she had a boyfriend (who was also there) :)
[10:18] <psyatw> hahaha
[10:18] <charl> believe me, if that wasn't the case... ;)
[10:18] <psyatw> my friends always ask me what I girls I meet wherever I go
[10:19] <psyatw> because I always meet someone new
[10:19] <charl> nah it was great fun, i would do it again, but this time i also know more of what to expect
[10:19] <psyatw> yes, you´re right
[10:19] <psyatw> the first time is often just exploring what´s there
[10:19] <charl> yeah and getting to know the ropes... "ontgroening" :)
[10:20] <psyatw> :)
[10:21] <psyatw> if only I drank beer, then I would join you at oktoberfest some time
[10:21] <charl> i guess drinking beer isn't a requirement but it does kinda spoil it if you don't ;)
[10:22] <charl> some people apparently drink wine but i haven't seen any of them :P
[10:22] <psyatw> I had some shot of vodka in ukraine so I was allowed to enter the restaurant, that was enough alcohol for me :)
[10:22] <psyatw> hahaha
[10:22] <charl> you have to have a shot of vodka before you can enter a restaurant?  :S
[10:24] <psyatw> it wasn´t extreme or anything
[10:24] <psyatw> more like funny
[10:24] <psyatw> and the only place open at that time
[10:25] <charl> heh now that is an adventure !
[10:25] <psyatw> so this ukrainian friend took me there
[10:25] <Squirm> that could be fun
[10:25] <psyatw> well, life with me is always an adventure
[10:25] <psyatw> sometimes a bit too much, I guess
[10:25] <psyatw> :)
[10:25] <Squirm> I try and make it one
[10:25] <charl> i don't want to get whipped though... everyone has their fetishes, mine is cute japanese maids
[10:25] <charl> i don't judge :)
[10:26] <psyatw> haha
[10:26] <psyatw> well, it was the first time for me too :)
[10:32] <charl> ok i'm off, need to get some work done
[10:32] <charl> have a good day all !
[12:39] <mazal> Bye everyone , have a nice evening
[14:24] <Kilos> inetpro, jy kan begin planne maak ne
[14:33] <Kilos> oops
[14:37] <Kilos> hi nlsthzn no one even greeted you
[14:37] <Kilos> sorry man
[14:37] <Kilos>  i was sleeping
[14:37] <nlsthzn> np
[14:37]  * nlsthzn noms dinner... back later
[14:58]  * Kilos goes to kde for a while
[15:03] <Kilos> ouch... 3 min boot time
[18:20] <Kilos> inetpro, ?
[19:02] <inetpro> Kilos: ?
[19:02] <Kilos> i messed up the agenda sir. added that day bit but didnt number it
[19:03] <Kilos> used to add as a follow on from 3 or 4 now it dont
[19:03] <Kilos> sorry
[19:03] <Kilos> dunno how to remove or move it down
[19:03] <inetpro> Kilos: np
[19:03] <Kilos> ty
[19:04] <inetpro> can always be moved by renumbering the items
[19:04] <Kilos> i can try do it
[19:05] <inetpro> just open up ech item to check its number then work out a sequence and go change
[19:05] <Kilos> ok ill try ty
[19:05] <inetpro> they are probably all on the same number
[19:05] <Kilos> 0ver 100mm rain so far
[19:05] <inetpro> I used to set the last item as 100
[19:05] <Kilos> 10
[19:06] <inetpro> 100mm rain? Wow!
[19:06] <Kilos> 10 man
[19:06] <Kilos> bouncy finger
[19:06] <inetpro> ahh... that sounds better
[19:06]  * inetpro goes to check... don't think we had that much
[19:09] <Kilos> oo yay ty inetpro
[19:09] <inetpro> 4mm
[19:10] <Kilos> aw
[19:10] <inetpro> but I had a bonus today
[19:10] <Kilos> what kind?
[19:10] <inetpro> wild mushroom found on my own plot
[19:11] <inetpro> oh so tasty
[19:11] <Kilos> black underside?
[19:11] <inetpro> thought they only grow in KZN
[19:11] <inetpro> no white
[19:11] <Kilos> i see we got about 5 or 6 white ones and white under
[19:11] <Kilos> i dunno if they safe to eat
[19:11] <inetpro> the wrong one can be deadly
[19:12] <Kilos> how do you tell
[19:12] <inetpro> eish! I just know from experience on the farm
[19:12] <Kilos> in natal the makauwe must be black underneath
[19:12] <Kilos> those that get big like dinner plates
[19:12] <inetpro> it has a very specific look and smell
[19:13] <Kilos> high dome?
[19:13] <inetpro> yep this was a makauwe, but white underneath
[19:13] <inetpro> flat
[19:13] <Kilos> ah these are a high dome type
[19:14] <inetpro> see https://plus.google.com/114254397525521567468/posts/hKQytw4JxQ1
[19:14] <Kilos> ok
[19:15] <Kilos> il check again tomorrow
[19:15] <Kilos> i love them things
[19:16] <inetpro> very tasty indeed
[19:16] <Kilos> thse were still high dome but not big yet
[19:16] <Kilos> i dont think the bad ones get big
[19:16] <Kilos> yeah they much tastier than cultivated mushrooms
[19:17] <Kilos> sis says kowes got black bottom
[19:18] <Kilos> and thats how i remember the natal ones
[19:25] <inetpro> can't remember ever eating the ones with a black bottom
[19:25] <Kilos> i used to walk miles in utrecht after storms
[19:26] <Kilos> they so lekker my mouth is watering just thinking about them
[19:29] <Kilos> these are on a thin stem. i think thats part of the seeing the poison ones
[19:38] <inetpro> I would trust any that I don't know for sure
[19:38] <inetpro> would never*
[19:38] <Kilos> yeah
[19:38] <Kilos> i only know the black bottom utrecht ones so i stay clear of any here
[19:39] <Kilos> anyway. sleep tight
[19:39] <Kilos> night all . sleep tight
[19:39] <Kilos> ty for the help inetpro
[19:39] <inetpro> friend of mine landed in hospital after eating one with friends who thought that they had found the right one
[19:39] <Kilos> ai!
[19:40] <Kilos> not worth taking a chance if you not sure
[19:40] <inetpro> definitely
[19:40] <inetpro> anyway, good night oom


[12:32] <manchicken> Okay, why the hell in 3.5.7 does switching from one desktop to another using hotkeys stick so much?
[12:32] <manchicken> This is just getting irritating...
[12:48] <manchicken> Wow, quanta+ is very unstable.
[12:54] <RadiantFire> whats it doing?
[12:58] <manchicken> Crashing.
[12:58] <crimsun> wobbling.
[01:01] <manchicken> All I want is a more GUI-ified emacs...
[01:03] <crimsun> emacs in a Konsole doesn't suffice? ;)
[01:05] <apachelogger> anyone with kubuntu running thinkpad around?
[01:07] <lucky_lucas> me
[01:07] <lucky_lucas> apachelogger:
[01:07] <apachelogger> oh
[01:07] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: can try a kopete plugin for me?
[01:07] <lucky_lucas> for sure
[01:07] <lucky_lucas> kopete / kde 4 ?
[01:07] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: http://aplg.kollide.net/kubuntu/kopete-thinklight/kopete-thinklight_0.1-0ubuntu1_i386.deb
[01:08] <apachelogger> kopete from kde3
[01:08] <lucky_lucas> cool
[01:08] <lucky_lucas> and if it works, I would be very pleased to keep it
[01:08] <apachelogger> the plugin should be able to use your flash light on incoming messages
[01:08] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: of course can keep it :D
[01:08] <lucky_lucas> i know it was the only thing is miss from gaim
[01:09] <apachelogger> that's how I like it, make everyone happy ^_^
[01:09] <manchicken> crimsun: Not for everything.
[01:09] <lucky_lucas> dpkg
[01:09] <lucky_lucas> ..
[01:10] <lucky_lucas> a friend just send me a message but nothing happens
[01:10] <lucky_lucas> I should activate it ^  ^
[01:10] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: ye activated it?
[01:10] <apachelogger> lol
[01:12] <lucky_lucas> Me can't figure out how plugins configuration is done in kopete (shame on beers)
[01:13] <lucky_lucas> apachelogger:
[01:13] <apachelogger> now if I had an english kopete :D
[01:13] <apachelogger> sec
[01:13] <apachelogger> KDE_LANG=en_US
[01:13] <apachelogger> muahaha
[01:13] <apachelogger> settings -> configure plugins
[01:13] <lucky_lucas> can try in french if you want
[01:14] <lucky_lucas> me can't figure out where is configure plugins...
[01:15] <lucky_lucas> just have configure
[01:15] <lucky_lucas> configure shortcuts
[01:15] <lucky_lucas> and configure tool bar
[01:15] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: got a plug as icon
[01:15] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: http://aplg.kollide.net/images/tmp047.png
[01:16] <lucky_lucas> don't have such options ?
[01:16] <apachelogger> Oo
[01:16] <apachelogger> *wonder*
[01:16] <lucky_lucas> do you have the normal kde 3  kopete ?
[01:16] <apachelogger> yeah
[01:17] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: you got the configure shortcuts menu?
[01:17] <lucky_lucas> yes
[01:17] <lucky_lucas> but not the global shortcuts
[01:17] <lucky_lucas> neither notifications
[01:18] <apachelogger> something's wrong with your kopete :P
[01:18] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: go to configure shortcuts
[01:18] <apachelogger> ans search for plugins
[01:20] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: are you in the settings menu of the kopete main widow, or a chat window's?
[01:20] <lucky_lucas> main window i guess
[01:20] <lucky_lucas> shame on me, was the window,.........
[01:20] <apachelogger> omg
[01:20] <apachelogger> :D
[01:20] <lucky_lucas> chat window
[01:21] <lucky_lucas> sorry i just come back from outise and had a few beers
[01:21] <lucky_lucas> it one o clock here
[01:21] <apachelogger> ^_^
[01:21] <apachelogger> almost halfpast 2 it is
[01:23] <lucky_lucas> i have a warning, this device file is not writable talking a bout /proc/... light
[01:23] <lucky_lucas> I guess, i should put it as 777
[01:24] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: what file?
[01:24] <lucky_lucas>  /proc/acpi/ibm/light
[01:24] <apachelogger> don't get /proc/* permission lost on reboot?
[01:24] <lucky_lucas> that0s the file, i m setting it 777
[01:24] <lucky_lucas> and i tell
[01:24] <apachelogger> yeah
[01:25] <lucky_lucas> not necessary
[01:25] <lucky_lucas> waitinit works
[01:26] <apachelogger> yeah
[01:26] <apachelogger> but how does a user know what to do when this message pops up?
[01:26] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: ever used the gaim thinklight?
[01:26] <lucky_lucas> yes
[01:27] <lucky_lucas> I know it because i know pretty well apci function of it
[01:27] <lucky_lucas> but for instance it just writes the file blabla is not writeable
[01:28] <lucky_lucas> I don't know if it's enough feedback for you
[01:28] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: yeah, at least I know it works :)
[01:29] <lucky_lucas> thank you i keep it
[01:29] <apachelogger> yeah
[01:29] <lucky_lucas> it's a good tool don't mess to port it on kopete / kde 4
[01:29] <apachelogger> gotta talk to upstream about some sudo magic for permission
[01:29] <lucky_lucas> yeah
[01:29] <lucky_lucas> nice tool anyway
[01:30] <lucky_lucas> just add a init file in the deb
[01:30] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: init file?
[01:30] <apachelogger> oh
[01:30] <apachelogger> good idea
[01:30] <lucky_lucas> copy a script that set the light to 777 in init.d
[01:31] <lucky_lucas> that's the only time you hace a "pervasive " access to sudo
[01:33] <lucky_lucas> me proud to help the kopete-thinklight devs .....
[01:34] <lucky_lucas> I sais i'm lucky, Jjust open the notebook and someone comes with bleeding edge technos for me.
[01:37] <lucky_lucas> apachelogger: What philantropics ideas push you to develop packages for thinkpad, as you don't seem to own one
[01:37] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: I didn't develop that one
[01:37] <apachelogger> just package :P
[01:37] <apachelogger> and I package right now everything packagable
[01:40] <lucky_lucas> hey cool
[01:40] <lucky_lucas> apachelogger: You made me happy I'll sleep well tonight
[01:42] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: hehe :)
[01:42] <lucky_lucas> A thing i want to test, what happens if  I use it with the light on
[01:45] <lucky_lucas> apachelogger: The plugins rocks, it even works when I have the light on before the message comes in and it let the light on
[01:45] <lucky_lucas> after the blink
[01:46] <lucky_lucas> apachelogger: thank you, is it available for gutsy or in feisty ?
[01:48] <apachelogger> lucky_lucas: will be available in gutsy
[01:48] <apachelogger> not yet in the repos though
[01:49] <lucky_lucas> ok, but since i have it know, I don't really care ^^
[01:49] <lucky_lucas> -know + now
[01:49] <apachelogger> ^^
[01:58] <lucky_lucas> apachelogger: thank you and good night, I need  to sleep, will be back tommorow
[02:01] <nixternal> kdepim is looking much better now
[02:15] <nixternal> down to 126 bugs now
[02:16] <nixternal> and rising :)
[02:34] <apachelogger> omg
[02:34] <apachelogger> revu doesn't like me anymore
[02:34] <apachelogger> because I'm uploading too much :(
[02:34] <apachelogger> thinklight doesn't want to get up
[02:35] <apachelogger> hm
[02:35] <apachelogger> gotta go to bed
[02:35] <apachelogger> nini
[04:30] <nixternal> hey, we don't preload Konqueror ootb do we?
[04:30] <nixternal> I guess we do
[04:36] <Daskreech> does anyone know if Konqueror can be spatial?
[04:36] <nixternal> Konqueror is special
[04:39] <nixternal> did somebody go through and confirm all of the apport crash bugs for kdelibs?
[04:40] <crimsun> Daskreech: I don't believe os
[04:40] <crimsun> *so
[04:40] <Daskreech> crimsun: yeah someone is asking if you can turn on a mode like that.
[04:41] <crimsun> I don't know why someone would want it, but no...
[04:41] <Daskreech> strange how some people keep complaining that KDe has too many options while so many people keep asking for more
[04:41] <Daskreech> crimsun: Me either. It soooo lends it self to practical jokes
[04:41] <crimsun> can't please everyone.
[04:43] <Daskreech> *laughs* tell that to Bill
[04:43] <crimsun> Bill who?
[04:44] <Daskreech> Gates :)
[04:45] <nixternal> jeesh
[04:45] <crimsun> he doesn't actually have very much to do with the strategic direction of the company
[04:45] <nixternal> people enjoy assigning themselve and freakin' loco teams to damn bug reports
[04:45] <nixternal> and have no clue wth is going on
[04:45] <crimsun> yay, rich and ubuntu-chicago want alsa* bugs?    Livewithit.
[04:47] <crimsun> :-]
[04:48] <nixternal> does the apport bot thing or whatever go through and "Confirm" every apport bug report?
[04:48] <crimsun> the retracer?
[04:48] <nixternal> I don't get how all of these bugs are confirmed when all there is, is the traces and nothing else
[04:48] <nixternal> ya, the retracer
[04:49] <crimsun> yep
[04:49] <nixternal> why does it "confirm"?
[04:49] <nixternal> just because the retraces match up?
[04:49] <crimsun> you'll need to see the spec
[04:49] <nixternal> I guess so
[04:53] <nixternal> ok, the spec says nothing about "confirming" though
[04:55] <nixternal> ahh, so I am guessy the bug bot is buggy...and is assigning loco teams and people who have submitted one bug in their life as the person or people fixing it
[04:55] <nixternal> guessy? wth is that....guessing
[04:57] <mhb> Evil Bot Ruined Popular Linux Distro
[05:10] <nixternal> hehe
[05:12] <nixternal> hey, is the synaptics settings in System Settings installed by default now? Or does it only install when you install ksynaptics or such?
[05:19] <Daskreech> Ahhh kynaptics... evil E-Vill!!
[05:22] <nixternal> hiya Hobbsee
[05:23] <Hobbsee> hiya
[05:24] <nixternal> well, kdepim is cleaned out
[05:24] <nixternal> kdelibs is an apport mess
[05:39] <Hobbsee> nixternal: NICE WORK!!!
[05:39] <nixternal> why thank you :)
[05:39] <freeflying> Daskreech: hi
[05:39] <freeflying> hi all
[05:39] <Hobbsee> :)
[05:39] <Hobbsee> hiya freeflying!
[05:40] <nixternal> Hobbsee: do you know if ksynaptic/libsynaptics is installed ootb now? i.e. Touchpad config in System Settings
[05:40] <nixternal> or is that something I installed and can't grep from the logs
[05:40] <Daskreech> Hobbsee: aren't they in High KDE4 churn right now?
[05:40] <Hobbsee> nixternal: it's still in universe
[05:41] <Hobbsee> Daskreech: pretty much
[05:41] <Hobbsee> Daskreech: but still fixing bugs
[05:41] <nixternal> any plans getting that into main so there is touchpad support ootb in system settings?
[05:41] <Hobbsee> nixternal: see http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/seeds/kubuntu.gutsy/
[05:42] <Hobbsee> er...that's not a bad idea
[05:42] <nixternal> it is a wishlist item in lp for over a year now
[05:42] <Hobbsee> ahh.  i'd forgotten about it
[05:43] <manchicken> Does anybody know if Riddell has been keeping his systemsettings changes in subversion?
[05:43] <nixternal> I have it on my laptop, didn't know if I installed it though..guess I did
[05:43] <nixternal> nice feature
[05:43] <Hobbsee> nixternal: it's feasible, anyway, if someone writes the MIR
[05:43] <Hobbsee> we've got the cd space, it appears
[05:43] <nixternal> maybe something to look into
[05:43] <nixternal> need to find out if you just need libsynaptics or is system settings utilizing ksynaptics
[05:44] <Hobbsee> i've no idea :)
[05:44] <nixternal> have to research that and find out
[05:44] <Hobbsee> i dont end up using it - my touchpad Just Works
[05:44] <Hobbsee> fabo: is the debian contact
[05:44] <nixternal> ya, mine too, but then again I rarely use mine, external mouse
[05:46] <manchicken> Wow, syystemsettings loads KCM modules.
[05:46] <manchicken> It crashes going back to the overview, but still, what a startt.
[05:47] <manchicken> Riddell must have been busy.
[05:48] <Hobbsee> manchicken: 3 or 4?
[05:48] <manchicken> 4
[05:49] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[05:49] <Hobbsee> 3 seems crashy here too
[05:50] <manchicken> I haven't done much in gutsy yet.
[05:50] <manchicken> My lappy still needs to be super stable for work.
[05:50] <manchicken> But I suppose I'll settle for Feisty...
[05:50] <manchicken> :)
[05:58] <manchicken> I got that crash to go away, but that's treating the symptom, not the disease.
[05:58] <manchicken> The search bar needs fixing.
[06:01] <Daskreech> ha ha
[06:01] <Daskreech> !root
[06:01] <ubotu> do not try to guess the root password, that is impossible. Instead, realise the truth.. there is no root password. Then you will see that it is sudo that grants you access and not the root password. Look at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RootSudo
[06:02] <Hobbsee> !-root
[06:02] <ubotu> root has no aliases - added by Seveas on 2006-06-18 01:18:28
[06:02] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:04] <Daskreech> Hobbsee: right I forgot you got a new toy :)
[06:04] <Daskreech> !hobbsee
[06:04] <ubotu> I phear the stick so shhhhh
[06:04] <Hobbsee> bug 34041
[06:04] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 34041 in kdenetwork "Kopete displays the wrong name in conversation windows" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/34041
[06:11] <Hobbsee> nixternal: have you seen http://people.ubuntu-in.org/~carthik/bugstats/?
[06:12] <nixternal> nope
[06:12] <nixternal> interesting
[06:12] <Hobbsee> yep :)
[06:13] <Hobbsee> Jucato: are you going to be one of the cool people too?
[06:13] <Hobbsee> Jucato: http://people.ubuntu-in.org/~carthik/bugstats/
[06:13] <nixternal> I am trying to interprate this
[06:14] <nixternal> ahh, I see
[06:14] <Jucato> I won't bother :)
[06:14] <Jucato> Hobbsee: I can't be for the next few days...
[06:14] <nixternal> not to shabby..that was a lot of bugs closed
[06:14] <Hobbsee> Jucato: awww  :P
[06:14] <Hobbsee> nixternal: indeed!
[06:15] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:15] <Jucato> iirc, it worked ootb on Edgy...
[06:15] <nixternal> I know I closed quite a bit, and out of all the ones I closed, only one reopened...the rest were commented with "ya I don't have this issue anymore"
[06:18] <Jucato> I haven't done bug triaging in months :)
[06:18] <nixternal> udev control how usb devices are used? i.e. executing files from a usb drive?
[06:18] <Jucato> hm... lunch... bbl
[06:18] <nixternal> they have it under kubuntu-meta and ubuntu-meta, however I can't confirm the issue, yet a bunch of others are reporting the issue
[06:50] <Hobbsee> nixternal: no idea, sorry
[06:53] <nixternal> tis ok, I changed it to pmount since that is what pmount does, if it isn't pmount, then who ever triages that can change it accordingly :)
[06:53] <nixternal> it definitely isn't a meta issue though
[06:53] <Hobbsee> indeed
[06:59] <Daskreech> Hobbsee: that's a deceptive graph :)
[06:59] <Hobbsee> Daskreech: why so?
[06:59] <Hobbsee> as long as you understand what it's set out to say...
[07:00] <Hobbsee> it doesnt start from 0 bugs, you're right.
[07:01] <Daskreech> Hobbsee: I was seeing the 30000 bugs from the corner of my eye and thinking My that's a lot of load shedding
[07:01] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[07:01] <Hobbsee> it makes me wonder exactly where all those bugs are though
[07:03] <nixternal> wow
[07:04] <nixternal> I didn't know this, but when you install language-support-$cc
[07:04] <nixternal> you get firefox and thunderbird as well
[07:04] <Hobbsee> i wonder if one could get a list of bugs per source package.  like https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-team/+packagebugs or something
[07:04] <Daskreech> I have a whole heap of gnome stuff on my computer
[07:04] <Daskreech>  metacity etc
[07:04] <nixternal> the language support package depends on the the mozilla locales packages for the country code, which both depend on firefox and thunderbird instead of suggest
[07:04] <Daskreech>  noooo clue how it got there :(
[07:26] <nixternal> would be nice to see what we can implement in gutsy
[07:27] <Hobbsee> nixternal: search for them - status wishlist, with text of kde
[07:27] <nixternal> can I do "kde" or "kubuntu"?
[07:27] <nixternal> hell, I know you can :)
[07:27] <Hobbsee> you'll have to do one at a time
[07:27] <nixternal> don't know why I asked
[07:28] <Hobbsee> :)
[07:28] <nixternal> you used to be able to feed it boolean
[07:30] <Hobbsee> heh
[07:30] <Jucato> b.k.o doesn't accept search terms below 4 letters. :)
[07:30] <Jucato> so you can't use css, kjs, kde, etc :)
[07:31] <Hobbsee> bugzilla search is a pain, though
[08:07] <Hobbsee> hiya Lure
[08:07] <Hobbsee> yay, more bug closings!
[08:09] <nixternal> hehe
[08:10] <Hobbsee> yay, nixternal!
[08:11] <nixternal> hehe
[08:11] <nixternal> it was end of the day an hour and 11 minutes ago
[08:11] <Hobbsee> then you've got another ~23 hours
[08:13] <nixternal> kubuntu-grub-splashimages had 6 bugs, all the same pretty much...duplicate! down to 1 bug now
[08:13] <Hobbsee> yay!
[08:13] <nixternal> argh, kubuntu-docs has bugs...wth! :)
[08:13] <Hobbsee> what's the bug?
[08:14] <Lure> Hobbsee: hi
[08:14] <nixternal> Riddell: you can close one of them by getting the edgy updates in for localisation :)
[08:14] <nixternal> Lure: I just duped your grub bug that you confirmed over a year ago :)
[08:14] <nixternal> I remember the guy who reported it on IRC
[08:15] <nixternal> messing with them silly splash images had my system so hosed
[08:15] <Lure> nixternal: I do not even recall it ;-)
[08:16] <Lure> nixternal: right, universe package...
[08:16] <nixternal> ya, I doubt it still works, however nobody has been reporting anything
[08:16] <nixternal> we figured out it was something with the .gz files or what not, and he ended up converting it to something else and it worked
[08:16] <nixternal> I remember, he wanted the debian image the most
[08:19] <Lure> Hobbsee: task for your new powers ;-) http://apachelog.blogspot.com/2007/06/free-injections.html
[08:20] <Hobbsee> Lure: fun stuff.  that should be a recommends, nto a depends, iir.c
[08:20] <Lure> Hobbsee: yep, we should do Recommends for most non-essentail packages...
[08:22] <Hobbsee> it appears that kubuntu-meta doesnt actually have a bzr version
[08:24] <Hobbsee> Lure: i wonder if Riddell's got some of them kept there for a reason
[08:24] <Hobbsee> Lure: because there's a heck of a lot of packages that that coudl apply to
[08:25] <Lure> Hobbsee: I doubt, as he was changing some others to Recommends on request (for example digikam, kipi-plugins, knetworkmanager...)
[08:25] <Hobbsee> fair enough
[08:25] <Lure> Hobbsee: but I agree that it may be good to discuss it at least with him if not on kubunut-devel
[08:25] <Lure> Hobbsee: maybe you should suggest a list of "demotions" to Recommends and send it to ML
[08:25] <Hobbsee> file a bug about it, and subscribe me, about all the apps that shouldnt be on there?
[08:26] <Lure> Hobbsee: will do
[08:26] <Hobbsee> Lure: http://rafb.net/p/RromAg15.html is the current depends list
[08:37] <Hobbsee> actually, the seeds are in bzr, it's just kubuntu-meta that isnt.
[08:37] <Hobbsee> hm.  i wonder how these recommends are actually done, per se. i'll have to ask Riddell
[08:38] <Lure> Hobbsee: bug 119467
[08:38] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 119467 in kubuntu-meta "make non-essential packages Recommends and not Depends" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119467
[08:38] <Hobbsee> k, will look later
[09:25] <nixternal> kdetoys menus are wrong
[09:25] <nixternal> bug 102750
[09:25] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 102750 in kdetoys "kworldclock in wrong category in xubuntu menu" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102750
[09:25] <nixternal> it shouldn't be Games/Toys I don't think
[09:29] <nixternal> I just poked ana about the the kdetoys issues, see about getting them fixed there and then merging here
[09:31] <nixternal> http://people.ubuntu-in.org/~carthik/bugstats/?
[09:31] <nixternal> wo0t
[11:55] <mhb> nixternal: oh my god, just how many bugs did you triage today?
[12:01] <mhb> nixternal: I have got around 50 mails in my recieved mail, all with your name on them... your bug-triaging skills rock!
[12:08] <mhb> nixternal: ooh, a hundred (according to your blog) ... I am speechless
[12:29] <crimsun> mhb: yep, it's nice to see him stepping up.
[01:42] <Hobbsee> nixternal!!!
[01:55] <apachelogger> lol
[01:55] <Hobbsee> it's good..but sheesh.
[01:57] <xerosis> if a bug doesn't appear in a later version do i set to 'fix released'?
[01:57] <apachelogger> xerosis: I'd say so
[01:58] <xerosis> apachelogger: upstream marked as WORKSFORME
[01:58] <apachelogger> anyone in revu mood?
[01:58] <apachelogger> xerosis: so mark it invalid... or however that is called in LP
[01:58] <xerosis> apachelogger: it has been confirmed though
[01:59] <apachelogger> hm
[01:59] <apachelogger> it's getting complicate
[01:59] <xerosis> bug #31055
[01:59] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 31055 in Ubuntu "Konqueror crash on Real Media streams" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/31055
[01:59] <apachelogger> xerosis: has it been confirmed on kubuntu, or on other system as well?
[01:59] <xerosis> just kubuntu afaik
[02:00] <apachelogger> hm
[02:00] <apachelogger> xerosis: ask for info, whether it still appears on feisty
[02:00] <apachelogger> if not mark as fix released
[02:00] <xerosis> apachelogger: well it's fixed in gutsy...
[02:01] <apachelogger> fix released
[02:01] <apachelogger> doesn't really make any difference whether you close the bug now or when gutsy is out ;-)
[02:02] <xerosis> apachelogger: okay, thanks
[02:03] <xerosis> Lure_: I was just asking about bug #31055 and i see you were the last commenter...
[02:03] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 31055 in Ubuntu "Konqueror crash on Real Media streams" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/31055
[02:03] <apachelogger> uhm
[02:03] <apachelogger> wtf is up with revu?!
[02:07] <ktulu77> hi there!
[02:08] <ktulu77> i would like to contribute  to kubuntu
[02:09] <ktulu77> I've just learn Qt, perhaps I can help?
[02:17] <mhb> hello ktulu77
[02:17] <mhb> ktulu77: you can help in plenty of ways
[02:19] <mhb> ktulu77: if you want to code applications, then it might be better to join the KDE project itself
[02:20] <Lure_> xerosis: I do not recall that bug - I think I was just relaying the fix from goldenear
[02:20] <mhb> ktulu77: we do documentation, packaging and related stuff
[02:20] <Lure_> xerosis: what about it?
[02:21] <xerosis> Lure_: a crash with real player plugins
[02:21] <xerosis> Lure_: i was going to mark as fix released
[02:21] <Lure_> xerosis: I think this was due to kaffeine used in dapper - we changed to kmplayer for edgy/feisty, but gutsy will have fixed kaffeine again
[02:21] <Lure_> xerosis: I think you can
[02:22] <xerosis> Lure_: I can't reproduce it in gutsy, so it seems it is fixed
[02:22] <mhb> ktulu77: and of course, we find and triage bugs
[02:22] <Lure_> mhb: nixternal has only closed 100 bugs, but have triaged much more than that !
[02:22] <ktulu77> mhb but I heard there was developpers in kubuntu
[02:22] <ktulu77> and less than for gnome
[02:23] <Hobbsee> ktulu77: sure, but they work on kde stuff
[02:23] <ktulu77> so I thought I could help
[02:23] <Lure_> xerosis: just put ploite note that they can reopen if they can reproduce with feisty/gutsy
[02:23] <Hobbsee> or packaging stuff, ro bugs stuff, etc
[02:23] <xerosis> Lure_: will do, thanks
[02:23] <ktulu77> hmm oky
[02:23] <ktulu77> I've installed gutsy with virtual machine
[02:24] <mhb> Lure_: even better :o)
[02:24] <ktulu77> but I don't know how to do
[02:24] <Lure_> mhb: nixternal is just unbelivable!
[02:26] <mhb> ktulu77: you can fix bugs in KDE applications themselves, that involves coding, of course - and you help both kubuntu and kde
[02:27] <mhb> ktulu77: or you can port applications from the KDE3 bindings to the KDE4 bindings, that is also very helpful
[02:27] <ktulu77> mhb: yes
[02:27] <ktulu77> why not
[02:27] <ktulu77> I don't know how to do tha
[02:28] <ktulu77> that
[02:28] <ktulu77> download the sources?
[02:29] <ktulu77> I saw there is a repository for kde4 and ubuntu
[02:30] <mhb> ktulu77: you can start with compiling the latest kde4 code from svn, I guess
[02:30] <ktulu77> on my kubuntu ?
[02:31] <mhb> ktulu77: http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Build/KDE4
[02:31] <mhb> ktulu77: yes
[02:32] <ktulu77> mhb: thanks !
[02:32] <ktulu77> it will not break my kubuntu?
[02:32] <mhb> ktulu77: it should be painless, if you follow the instructions
[02:32] <ktulu77> mhb: all right !!
[02:32] <ktulu77> mhb: thank you for the link !!
[02:32] <mhb> ktulu77: there is a lot of useful information for starters at techbase.kde.org
[02:33] <ktulu77> it should be amazing
[02:33] <ktulu77> mhb: ok i didn't know this link !
[02:33] <mhb> ktulu77: if you need some more directions, feel free to email to our kubuntu-devel mailing list
[02:33] <ktulu77> ok thanks !!
[02:34] <mhb> ktulu77: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/kubuntu-devel
[02:34] <xerosis> when do i mark as 'fix released' and when do i reject?
[02:40] <ktulu77> mhb: i have just subscribed :)
[02:42] <ktulu77> mhb: Are you sure i need to build the svn ? deb http://kubuntu.org/packages/kde4-3.90.1/ feisty main
[02:44] <ktulu77> mhb I can't do this : sudo aptitude install libqt4-dev-kdecopy libdbus-1-dev cmake
[02:45] <ktulu77> packages conflict :(
[03:00] <hunger> You did mess again with the dpi settings:-(
[03:00] <Hobbsee> hunger: ubuntu did
[03:00] <Hobbsee> we didnt, afaik
[03:00] <hunger> Hobbsee: I updated guidance yesterday. I assumed that was the misfit.
[03:02] <hunger> I keep setting my resolution and ubuntu messes them up each release:-(
[03:04] <Hobbsee> check the changelog for guidance
[03:05] <hunger> Hobbsee: displayconfig was changed again.
[03:06] <Hobbsee> who by?
[03:06] <Hobbsee> oh, i see
[03:06] <Hobbsee> ask Riddell if it was intentional, i guess.
[03:07] <hunger> Hobbsee: My display has 120 dpi. I had to live with kubuntu assuming it to be 100 for the last couple of releases, today I am down to 75:-(
[03:07] <Hobbsee> kubuntu set it at 96, last i knew.  *shrugs*
[03:07] <Hobbsee> you should be able to set it in xorg.conf anyway
[03:08] <hunger> Hobbsee: That gets overriden too often.
[03:09] <Hobbsee> fair enough
[03:09] <hunger> Hobbsee: And that should either work or it should be configurable in the gui.
[03:09] <Hobbsee> actually, i used The Proper Way, and set the horizontal and vertical distances in xorg.conf
[03:09] <Hobbsee> true that.  but you are running a develpment version, where things changes, remember
[03:10] <hunger> gnome is fine by the way... it has kept the proper (aka. old) resolution.
[03:11] <hunger> Hobbsee: I know. But I will still bitch about stuff changing in unexpected ways.
[03:11] <Hobbsee> fair enough.     i'll remember to ignore you next time
[03:13] <hunger> Hobbsee: Feel free to do so.
[03:14] <xerosis> Hobbsee: in which situations do you set 'fix released' and which 'rejected'?
[03:14] <Hobbsee> xerosis: i tend to hit "fix released" for when upstrema releases a fix, we release a fix, or the bug is reported as fixed with an upgrade.  if it's a pebkac error, or a bad bug, then i'll reject.
[03:15] <Hobbsee> ie, fix released for "it's a legit bug".  rejected for "this is not a legit bug"
[03:15] <hunger> Damn... forcing the dpi to 96dpi in the font config dialog gets ignored as well.
[03:15] <mhb> ktulu77: it is best for you (as a developer) to compile those libraries yourself
[03:16] <mhb> ktulu77: those packages are for testing KDE4, but the code changes very often
[03:16] <xerosis> Hobbsee: ah okay
[03:16] <Hobbsee> xerosis: either way, it's fairly moot.  it doesnt show up on bug searches
[03:17] <Hobbsee> it's just if people find it again, or if someone does bugstats on "how many were rejected, vs fix released"
[03:17] <xerosis> Hobbsee: so for a fairly reasonable bug, if it's not present in gutsy, mark as fix released
[03:17] <Hobbsee> yeah
[03:17] <Hobbsee> like i say, it really doenst end up mattering.
[03:17] <Hobbsee> or reject.  i dunno.
[03:18] <xerosis> i'll find a coin then :p
[03:18] <Hobbsee> hehe
[03:18] <Hobbsee> both things lead to the same end
[03:19] <jjesse> nixternal: back in chicago o'hare airport, have i told you i don't like that place?
[03:20] <xerosis> also, is it bad form to triage a bug assigned to someone else?
[03:20] <Hobbsee> not really
[03:20] <Hobbsee> what's the status on it?
[03:20] <xerosis> erm, let me find it
[03:21] <Hobbsee> well, it can be.  depends on the context, and what the bug is
[03:22] <xerosis> it was a pretty poor bug with it mentioning a duplicate bug, the assignee had replied, the reporter then changed the duplicate number, the assignee had set another bug a duplicate of this one...
[03:27] <Hobbsee> xerosis: just fix it :)
[03:27] <xerosis> Hobbsee: okay, thanks :)
[03:45] <hunger> Hmmm... kdm still uses the same font sizes as always, so does gnome. kde-guidance is disabled during startup, so that can't be the problem either.
[03:45] <hunger> Any ideas how to fix the font sizes?
[03:49] <jjesse> morning
[03:49] <jjesse> nothing like spending a saturday morning in an airport/flying
[03:49] <Hobbsee> heh
[03:49] <Hobbsee> indeed!
[03:53] <Hobbsee> ouchy
[03:53] <Hobbsee> i dont miss jetlag
[03:53] <jjesse> jet lag has never really affected me
[03:56] <Lure_> hunger: the right thing is to fix xorg.conf with DisplaySize
[03:56] <Lure_> hunger: I suspect new Xorg does not detect properly your display size
[03:59] <hunger> Lure_: It does. KDM has the usual font sizes.
[03:59] <hunger> Lure_: And it is fine in gnome.
[03:59] <Lure_> hunger: others are bitching that kdm has wrong fonts :-)
[03:59] <Lure_> gnome does not respect dpi at all
[03:59] <ktulu77> mhb: ok i will compiule the svn
[04:00] <ktulu77> but i can't install libqt4-kdecopy
[04:00] <ktulu77> dev
[04:00] <Lure_> gnome always works in 75 this is why it is ok for you
[04:00] <hunger> Lure_: I can not force the dpi in the kcontrol font applet either.
[04:00] <Lure_> hunger: what kind of graphics card do you have
[04:00] <Lure_> hunger: you have to fix xorg dpi, not font dpi
[04:01] <hunger> Lure_: ATI FireGL M24 GL, some mobile graphics adaptor.
[04:01] <Lure_> hunger: see hints here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AchimBohnet
[04:01] <hunger> Lure: It was fine yesterday.
[04:02] <Lure_> hunger: similar as mine (FireGL V5000) - also broken with Xorg 7.2 (feisty & gutsy)
[04:02] <Lure_> hunger: good news is that new ati driver has fix for this
[04:02] <hunger> I am using the free drivers.
[04:02] <hunger> The ATI drivers keep crashing the box.
[04:02] <Lure_> hunger: if you want to try: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XorgOnTheEdge
[04:02] <Lure_> hunger: this will enter gutsy rsn
[04:03] <Lure_> hunger: me to - I hate fglrx
[04:14] <hunger> Lure_: I have 92 dpi now, but the fonts have not changed at all:-(
[06:48] <Jucato> Tm_T: ping? (please? )
[07:46] <apachelogger> :S
[07:47] <Hobbsee> he did appear for a bit
[07:47] <nixternal> heh, afternoon
[07:47] <nixternal> jeesh, I slept until 12:30pm
[07:47] <nixternal> crazy
[07:47] <Hobbsee> heh
[07:47] <apachelogger> hm
[07:48] <apachelogger> so
[07:48] <apachelogger> now I'm sitting here
[07:48] <apachelogger> on my packages
[07:48] <apachelogger> waiting for revu to love me again :D
[07:48] <apachelogger> what a shame
[07:49] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:49] <Hobbsee> anywhere is good.
[07:50] <apachelogger> as long as the beer is good :D
[07:51] <Hobbsee> apachelogger: as long as you drink the beer, and dont make me drink it, then it's all good, yes.
[07:52] <apachelogger> Hobbsee: you don't like beer? Oo
[07:52] <Hobbsee> apachelogger: i dont drink alcohol - dont like the taste
[07:53] <apachelogger> Hobbsee: well, after you got enough of it, you don't recognize it anymore ;-)
[07:53] <apachelogger> but hey, I usually don't drink alcohol either
[07:53] <apachelogger> it's just that I can't upload to revu, so I need something else to do :|
[07:53] <Hobbsee> apachelogger: that's true....it'd just be the first few that would be the prblem.  and that leads to a whole lot more other problems
[07:53] <Hobbsee> heh
[07:54] <apachelogger> ^_^
[07:54] <Hobbsee> it's so weird, people telling me what happened that night...and me just going "i dont remember that"
[07:54] <Hobbsee> or "oh, i remember that...but i cant remember why that happened" or whatever
[07:54] <Hobbsee> and a few bits of "yeah, rubbish.  i know i didnt do that"
[07:55] <Hobbsee> i suspect alcohol would make that worse.
[07:59] <apachelogger> Hobbsee: oioi
[07:59] <Hobbsee> apachelogger: hrm?
[08:00] <apachelogger> Hobbsee: sounds kinda weird
[08:00] <apachelogger> which reminds me on:
[08:00] <apachelogger> arrsome song
[09:17] <xerosis> for a bug with an importance and confirmed but for an older version, do you leave or mark as fixed?
[09:18] <ScottK> If the problem is fixed in a newer version, mark it fix released.
[09:18] <xerosis> ScottK: thanks
[10:37] <jjesse> hello
[11:14] <siretart> apachelogger: sorry?
[11:15] <apachelogger> siretart: my uploads in revu got stuck in rejected
[11:16] <apachelogger> Hobbsee already tried to fix it, though it didn't work out
[11:16] <apachelogger> siretart: would be really nice if you could have a look at it :)
[11:16] <crimsun> either needed a mv or a straight rm
[11:16] <crimsun> I don't have privileges to do that on tiber.
[11:20] <siretart> crimsun: we can change that ;)
[11:21] <siretart> oh damn
[11:29] <siretart> the keyring sync script has problems
[11:29] <crimsun> is it the script itself or just the archive?
[11:30] <crimsun> I've been having connectivity issues to the Canonical IPs for a couple days now
[11:30] <crimsun> three different homed hosts, so it shouldn't be my ends...
[11:30] <nn-gentoo_> hi
[11:33] <siretart> crimsun: seem to be several problems here
[11:34] <siretart> crimsun: the most obvious is the limited connectivity on tiber. we have about 20k/s bandwith available, and I have no idea why
[11:34] <crimsun> siretart: right, it seems hard-shaped too.  I didn't attempt to list any netfilter rules since I didn't/don't have privs, but it certainly seemed capped on the provider side
[11:47] <giangy> apachelogger: are you there?
[11:47] <apachelogger> ahoy giangy
[11:47] <giangy> ahoy :)
[11:47] <giangy> can you try to do one test, please?
[11:47] <giangy> Steps to Reproduce:
[11:47] <giangy> 1. right click menu -> internet -> Firefox Web Browser
[11:47] <giangy> 2. select 'add to main panel'
[11:47] <giangy> 3. right click firefox icon on the panel,  select 'Configure firefox web browser button'
[11:47] <giangy> 4. switch to the application tab
[11:48] <giangy> 5. click advanced options button
[11:48] <giangy> 6. unselect 'enable launch feedback'
[11:48] <giangy> 7. click 'OK', 'OK'
[11:48] <apachelogger> omfg
[11:48] <giangy> the firefox icon disappears...
[11:48] <giangy> (the same thing happened with others apps)
[11:49] <apachelogger> Oo
[11:49] <apachelogger> uhm
[11:49] <giangy> you reproduced this?
[11:49] <fdoving> what rightclick menu?
[11:50] <giangy> fdoving: on the task bar
[11:50] <fdoving> giangy: ah, reproduced.
[11:51] <giangy> sounds strange.. (but the problem, if is it.. seems upstream)
[11:51] <fdoving> giangy: so, you want to know why the icon disappears?
[11:51] <giangy> fdoving: yep..
[11:51] <giangy> if it's normal, well..sorry for the mistake =)
[11:52] <fdoving> because the .desktop file is modified, copied and modified.
[11:52] <fdoving> once you edit anything the copy is made.
[11:52] <apachelogger> fdoving is right
[11:52] <apachelogger> somehow the icon value doesn't get copied
[11:53] <apachelogger> ~/.kde/share/apps/kicker/firefox.desktop or something
[11:53] <apachelogger> doesn't have a icon property
[11:54] <giangy> mh, okey
[11:54] <apachelogger> the icon value doesn't get saved - correct word usage :D
[11:58] <apachelogger> omg
[11:58] <apachelogger> siretart++
[11:58] <apachelogger> siretart: everything works as expected again?
[12:01] <giangy> fdoving: adding "Icon=firefox" into mozilla-firefox.desktop seems to work..
[12:02] <fdoving> giangy: yep, need to make kicker do that itself.
[12:02] <giangy> fdoving: can I file a bug upstream?
[12:02] <giangy> (bugs.kde.org)
[12:03] <siretart> apachelogger: I need to contact the guys at serverpronto.
[12:03] <apachelogger> ok
[12:03] <siretart> apachelogger: I don't think I'll catch them before monday, sorry
[12:03] <fdoving> giangy: please do. don't expect it to be fixed in 3.5.x though.
[12:03] <siretart> apachelogger: but I resynced the keyring manually and reprocessed all uploads
[12:03] <apachelogger> my HD will explode
[12:03] <apachelogger> siretart: k, thx
[12:03] <giangy> fdoving: understand :-). thanks anyway.
[12:03] <siretart> apachelogger: you check if it has been accepted
[12:03] <giangy> apachelogger: thanks to you too :)
[12:04] <apachelogger> giangy: yw
[12:04] <fdoving> giangy: reporting it might help getting it fixed  in kde 4, if the issue is still there.
[12:04] <apachelogger> siretart: just got mails
[12:04] <apachelogger> anyway
[12:04] <apachelogger> siretart: can I do some uploads?
[12:05] <siretart> apachelogger: should work
[12:05] <apachelogger> k
[12:05] <siretart> good night!
[12:05] <apachelogger> siretart: nini, and thanks :)