[01:17] <JackFrost> bluesabre: What are your thoughts?
[03:05] <bluesabre> JackFrost: It raises a few other questions. Does maybe-ubiquity give us any real benefit on the main iso? If we can keep instructions the same between the two versions, that'd be preferable. For those that need the additional boot options, is Xubuntu Core the only flavor they can install/use? Are boot options accessible for the maybe-ubiquity images?
[03:07] <bluesabre> I'd be fine with dropping maybe-ubiquity from both if it doesn't have any real impact. :)
[03:23] <JackFrost> It's prettier?  I have no idea, I only know how to do it from the other.  I haven't booted main for a bit.
[03:51] <arraybolt3[m]> Personally, I like maybe-ubiquity. In fact, the Lubuntu team currently doesn't have anything like it, and we're purposefully trying to create a similar Qt-based app that we can use. But it adds needless bulk and even some slowdown to the minimal Xubuntu ISO, IMO.
[03:51] <arraybolt3[m]> (The Lubuntu equivalent we're working on is very fast, much faster than maybe-ubiquity, so that's why it works for us even though we're a light flavor.)
[03:53]  * arraybolt3[m] resumes fighting with the infinity of cables involved in setting up a desktop system somewhere else
[03:57] <arraybolt3[m]> It is a minimal ISO after all. It sacrifices nice-to-haves for tinyness. That's its whole job.
[04:01] <bluesabre> Right... but it's no smaller without maybe-ubiquity. It's just a different workflow from power-on to installer, right?
[04:01] <bluesabre> I want to make sure I really understand it so I can make our case correctly.
[04:02] <bluesabre> (The last thing I want is for this thing to drag out too long and the Canonical folks lose interest again)
[04:02] <JackFrost> Understandable.
[04:03] <Eickmeyer> So, the primary function of maybe-ubiquity is that question that is proposed when you get the first GUI and are presented with the two options: Install Xubuntu or Try Xubuntu.   The grub menu has 'try or install', 'try safe mode', and "OEM install". :D
[04:05] <Eickmeyer> Yes, that's the part provided by isolinux.
[04:06] <Eickmeyer> I'm talking about the GUI piece.
[04:06] <JackFrost> Yeah I'm saying the non-gui bits only provide installer for OEM, that's just fantastic. :P
[04:08] <bluesabre> With maybe-ubiquity, do you lose access to the advanced options... or are they just accessed in another way?
[04:08] <JackFrost> I'll have to check the main desktop ISO.
[04:09] <JackFrost> (Unless arraybolt3 knows, he does a lot of testing and may have weird hardware.)
[04:11] <JackFrost> `kvm -m 1000 -cdrom` at least gives you that option.
[04:12]  * JackFrost misses isolinux, looked nicer and had the install option. :(
[04:13] <JackFrost> bluesabre: Sorry, yeah looks like I'm remembering more from the isolinux timeframe. :/
[04:17] <Eickmeyer> This image is maybe-ubiquity: https://ubuntucommunity.s3.dualstack.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/original/2X/4/49a92ce6373041a7f8f50ddf6495f8ac539ad275.jpeg . It's called "maybe-ubiquity" because ubiquity is officially launched when you hit "Install Ubuntu". Otherwise it'll just quit and continue to the live session.
[04:18] <Eickmeyer> I've gotten intimately familiar with ubiquity and its components when I was working for Kubuntu Focus.
[04:18] <Eickmeyer> If you don't have maybe-ubiquity, it'll continue to the live session without that choice.
[04:19] <bluesabre> Right... so, if I'm understanding correctly, having maybe-ubiquity doesn't prevent the user from accessing the advanced boot options?
[04:19] <Eickmeyer> Correct.
[04:19] <JackFrost> Yeah it replaces the old try/install option with a more graphical one.  Benefit of going with 'try only' is that you don't have to load the desktop.  We wouldn't want people choosing that for low memory systems (if they can't run both, they likely can't reasonably use Xubuntu anyway.)  But there might be other reasons.
[04:20] <Eickmeyer> Well, it doesn't load the desktop at all in this case. Instead, it loads "Ubiquity DM" which is its own display manager and, in your case, uses Xfce as the WM.
[04:20] <Eickmeyer> Very lightweight.
[04:22] <bluesabre> Right, Xubuntu desktop doesn't get loaded unless they select try. Otherwise, it's just Ubiquity running.
[04:22] <Eickmeyer> Correct.
[04:35] <JackFrost> ...Huh, one can still run the desktop and installer on 1G of ram.  Didn't expect that.
[04:41] <bluesabre> Nifty. Restored maybe-ubiquity to minimal. Will follow up if we get any additional feedback.
[04:49] <JackFrost> Yeah sorry about that one.  I imagine there's a boot param to invoke ubiquity DM and it's just lacking, but a bit of a moot point.
[04:51] <JackFrost> bluesabre: Thanks again for pushing this, I didn't expect it to make it anywhere this time around. :3
[04:56] <bluesabre> Just happened to be good timing.
[05:01] <JackFrost> Looks like the install-only option is just over 100M lighter on resources, though not sure we're still aiming for under 1G ram.  We do hit there at least.
[05:08] <arraybolt3> JackFrost: Sorry to miss your message for a while.
[05:08] <arraybolt3> Yeah, the advanced options in GRUB are still accessible with or without.
[05:08] <arraybolt3> *with or without maybe-ubiquity
[05:08] <arraybolt3> But it looks like you got things sorted already.
[05:09] <arraybolt3> (re: may have weird hardware) I think it's safe to say that I have plenty of weird hardware. :D
[05:11] <arraybolt3> Speaking of testing, I assume I'll be finding any new Minimal ISOs on iso.qa.ubuntu.com from now on, rather than on unit193.net?
[05:11] <JackFrost> Presuming this gets merged, yes.
[05:14] <arraybolt3> Nice.
[05:19] <JackFrost> Then I'll be given my freedom. \o/
[05:23] <bluesabre> Neverrrr
[05:23] <bluesabre> Then we’ll just find a new problem for you ;)
[05:24]  * arraybolt3 makes bluesabre a Launchpad sysadmin and tells the rest of the staff to go home
[05:26] <JackFrost> ...Urgh, this means I'll have to change my site to...say other words. :/
[05:36] <JackFrost> Did you see that you can test out xfce4-panel and xfdesktop on sway/etc?
[19:24] <pleia2> JackFrost: I think pinging me first to make sure I'm around in case of issues is probably best re:reboots :)
[19:24] <pleia2> I recall us briefly pondering using native kernels instead of the linode ones, but I kinda lost the thread on that
[19:25] <pleia2> anyway, I booted into the latest Linode kernel
[23:48] <JackFrost> pleia2: Yeah, since new Linodes use distro kernels I figure that's preferred.  I also just saw the postfix in Debian added support for "linux 6", so I'm gonna check if that actually breaks on kenerl 6.x. :3


[00:09] <poolie> Noldorin_, if you want to get in, change something, and get it landed, that's what i'd recommend
[00:09] <Noldorin_> fair enough
[00:10] <poolie> i will help you (in #launchpad-dev) get it running and do the change
[00:10] <Noldorin_> poolie, was thinking back to that little Downloads type suggestions we discussed :-)
[00:10] <Noldorin_> poolie, ah yes, sorry i forget i'm in #bzr sometimes!
[00:10] <Noldorin_> yeah i'd appreciate that
[00:10] <Noldorin_> perhaps later this week, else after Christmas
[00:19] <Noldorin_> poolie, okay, catch you later :-)
[00:19] <Noldorin_> *heads off to sleep*
[06:01] <meoblast001> hi
[06:02] <meoblast001> i set up a personal directory for each user on my server to maintain personal branches... is it possible to maintain multiple branches this way, or would a new directory have to be made for each branch?
[06:11] <roryy> what's the style guide for splitting operands of + over a line; is it "foo = bar + \\n    quux" or foo = \\n bar + quux" or "foo = (bar + \n quux)" or something else?
[06:13] <poolie> roryy, for patches to bzr?
[06:13] <roryy> poolie: yebo
[06:13] <poolie> any of them is acceptable
[06:13] <roryy> poolie: i mean, yes
[06:13] <poolie> i tend to us ethe second
[06:13] <poolie> what were you going to do?
[06:13] <roryy> erm, i had the first
[06:14] <roryy> i quite like the last, actually, cos emacs understands it
[06:14] <roryy> but i'll use the second :)
[06:18] <poolie> that's also fine
[07:28] <vila> hi all !
[07:54] <poolie> hi there vila, how's it going?
[07:54] <vila> good, how about you ?
[07:55] <poolie> good
[07:55] <poolie> catching up on some reading and trying to write up some stuff about piloting
[08:04] <poolie> jelmer, mgz, hi?
[08:04] <jelmer> hi poolie
[08:05] <poolie> hi there
[08:05]  * jelmer grabs his gear
[08:06] <mgz> morning!
[08:06] <jelmer> yo!
[08:07] <poolie> ready to mumble?
[08:08] <mgz> yup
[08:08] <mgz> nearly awake too :)
[08:09] <poolie> vila, hi?
[08:10] <vila> yup
[08:13] <tsdgeos> hi, is it possible to rewrite the history in bazaar? i did a commit with a wrong merge and i'd like to make as if that commit was never wrong
[08:14]  * tsdgeos finds http://wiki.bazaar.canonical.com/Rewrite
[08:16]  * tsdgeos gets a no revisions to rebase
[08:17] <jelmer> tsdgeos: you can "bzr uncommit"
[08:18] <tsdgeos> unfortunately my wrong merge is not my last commit
[08:18] <tsdgeos> i did a few more before realizing the mistake
[08:18] <tsdgeos> can i uncommit multiple times?
[08:23]  * tsdgeos tries
[08:24] <tsdgeos> ahhh, yes you can
[09:26] <hypnocat> i just tried:   bzr branch lp:ikarus ikarus
[09:26] <hypnocat> and bzr downloaded over 300 MB before i interrupted it
[09:27] <hypnocat> ikarus is a scheme compiler:  https://launchpad.net/ikarus/
[09:28] <hypnocat> the tar.gz snapshot is less than 4 MB, so i don't see how a bzr branch could possibly be downloading over 300 MB of data
[09:29] <hypnocat> something must be wrong..
[09:52] <mgz> hypnocat: have you done `bzr launchpad-login` and set up an ssh key?
[09:52] <hypnocat> nope
[09:54] <mgz> also launchpad has a note on the branch page that it's not been able to access upstream since May
[09:56] <jelmer> hypnocat: perhaps it's got some big files in its history that have since been removed?
[09:57] <hypnocat> strange
[09:57] <mgz> 670776334 Mar 25  2008 3ceaf52ea0e9019a6387927841b360a2.pack
[09:57] <hypnocat> btw, if i interrupt the bzr branch with control-c, where are the temporary files stored?
[09:58] <hypnocat> wow.. 670 MB.. glad i stopped it at around 300
[09:59] <mgz> not all of that is nessersarily referenced history
[09:59] <jelmer> hypnocat: it removes the files if it interrupts
[09:59] <hypnocat> great, thanks
[09:59] <mgz> so, using bzr+ssh to access may well avoid the issue
[10:00] <mgz> otherwise you could grab N revs at a time to see where things start going wrong
[10:01] <jelmer> mgz: I'm not sure there is much to debug, it's just a very large branch
[10:03] <mgz> and pretty dead.
[10:05] <jelmer> it's got some checked in binaries; if those have been updated over time, that would probably explain the size of the branch
[10:19] <mgz> remind me to build py3k over lunch
[10:37] <mgz> roryy is a hero, I see why he was having problems with test_dirstate
[13:09] <caravel> hello all, I've read again about shared repos and stacked branches, not sure what I should go for -- could you please advise ? :
[13:09] <caravel> the idea is to have one trunk and some "contrib" branch that would be ideally stacked (?)
[13:10] <fullermd_> I'd just ignore stacked branches.
[13:10] <caravel> oh :)
[13:11] <caravel> the idea is that teamA would work on trunk, while teamB would punctually post suggestions on contrib
[13:11] <fullermd_> Using a repo shared between the two branches will save you disk space and IO.  It won't [shouldn't] make any difference semantically to having the two branches standalone.
[13:11] <fullermd_> (this assuming of course that the branches get merged a lot.  If they actually just diverge, you don't save much)
[13:12] <caravel> they'd get merged all the time
[13:14] <caravel> there's one thing I don't quite get : say I setup such shared repo on some bzr+ssh space, with 2 branches in it (trunk and contrib). Then on each local PC we should also setup a shared repo, and bzr branch/push each (trunk and contrib), right ?
[13:16] <fullermd_> That's a setup.  Bear in mind that everythin'gs independent; you can have the two branches sharing a repo on the server, but standalone on the clients, or vice versa, or any combination.
[13:16] <fullermd_> Aside from creating the repo in the first place, you only ever interact at the branch level; using/not a shared repo happens internally.
[13:20] <fullermd_> And you can take two standalone branches and switch them (in-place) to sharing a repo.  And vice versa.  So, don't overthink yourself into paralysis on that question.
[13:22] <caravel> fullermd_: yes, I see, still it's a little paralising :)
[13:24] <caravel> One of ours teamA members would update his respective trunk and contrib from srv, merge and commit to local trunk, then push to srv trunk. As per pulling trunck changes into contrib, should that be done server side typically ?
[13:26] <caravel> (or should that be typically teamB members duty, to pull new changes from trunk and merge them into contrib in a manual manner ?)
[13:27] <caravel> (teamB is supposed to oversee teamA and eventually fix/contribute)
[13:28] <caravel> (but NOT commit to trunk)
[14:06] <caravel> fullermd_: sorry to buzz you, I missed to quote you in my replies - could you please confirm ?
[14:17] <vila> jelmer: can you remind me of the plan for 'bzr branches' in bzr core vs the one in bzrtools ?
[14:18] <vila> jelmer: I had a test failing and was quite surprised that the culprit was bzrtools (related to colo)
[14:18] <jelmer> vila: IIRC the plan is to have the one in bzrtools removed at some point
[14:18] <vila> good
[14:20] <mgz> speaking of bzrtools, I've got a bug fix that needs review, bugging abentley is the way forward?
[14:34] <jelmer> mgz: yep
[16:16] <mgz> has anyone done coverage stuff to go with selftest?
[16:18] <vila> mgz: not really, there is a bzr option that can be used
[16:18] <vila> mgz: I've used it here and there but never for the whole test suite
[16:18] <mgz> I'm reasonably sure the code roryy's bug fix in isn't exercised at all by bt.test_dirstate
[16:19] <vila> --coverage=DIRNAME
[16:22] <mgz> oddly using '=' there breaks, need space
[16:22] <mgz> otherwise looks promising, thanks vila
[16:22] <vila> crap, copied it from 'bzr help selftest'
[16:24] <mgz> global option parsing is a bit of a mixed bag :)
[16:26] <vila> ;)
[16:28] <mgz> looks good... is there a basic description of the output format anywhere?
[16:28] <vila> dunno, from memory, each line is prefixed with the number of executions
[16:29] <mgz> and the >>>>>> markers?
[16:29] <mgz> dead code?
[16:29] <mgz> *uncovered
[16:29] <vila> yes, as far as I remember, not sure if it's this marker or no marker at all
[16:35] <caravel> side question : would anyone know how to get the fancy tortoisebzr icons working correctly on a virtualbox drive (xp guest) ?
[16:38] <mgz> okay, this is pretty neat.
[16:41] <mgz> forgot how useful this was for informing testing.
[18:48] <kees> hola. I'm curious why I can't create a branch-for-merging of lp:ubuntu-security-tools. I tried pushing as lp:~kees/ubuntu-security-tools/update and it fails.
[18:51] <jelmer> kees: hi
[18:51] <jelmer> kees: how does it fail?
[19:04] <caravel> would anyone know how to get the fancy tortoisebzr icons working correctly on a virtualbox drive (xp guest) ?
[19:06] <caravel> (i.e. it would work from c: drive, but it doesn't for eg d: vbox share)
[19:06] <mgz> caravel: you might be best posting to the list about it, or just filing a bug. the main tortoisebzr guys are japanese and not on irc
[19:08] <caravel> mgz: ok, thanks for your answer anyway
[19:09] <mgz> I don't see any reason apart from a packaging bug or something weirder that they wouldn't appear on a different drive
[19:11] <caravel> mgz: such share is seen by the OS as some kind of a network drive -- do these icons work fine with a "local" repo located in a standard samba share ? I guess nobody uses such a setup (apart from a vbox share, maybe), hence why
[19:11] <caravel> (no samba to test here)
[19:14] <caravel> they probably restricted the feature to true "local" drives (as seen by the OS). Same limitations happens for eg. ActivePerl install (localisation fails), or OCX registration (refused) etc
[19:17] <mgz> may even be deliberate, if it would be bad perf over network drives... could also be easy enough to override locally, if you know the right magic
[19:17] <caravel> mgz: right -- that's my guess indeed. Unfortunately (for me) some network shares should not suffer since they have perf "very close to local" !
[19:18] <caravel> As per the magic, I've seeeeearched for it quite a few times, hence my question here :) Any suggestion welcome
[19:19] <caravel> (I really really can't afford to stick these data within the vdi here, hence I'll have to do without icons ^^)
[19:20]  * caravel is going away for a little while
[19:23] <mgz> will branch lp:tortoisebzr and have a quick grep for you
[19:28] <mgz> looks like you may be able to set the config option 'icon_overlays.include_path', see also doc/preferences.txt and tbzr.conf under your bzr home directory
[19:30] <mgz> 'context_menu.include_path', 'queried_drives.remote', and 'queried_drives_cmenu.remote' may also be of interest to you
[19:40] <kees> jelmer: bzr: ERROR: Permission denied: "~kees/ubuntu-security-tools/updates/": : You cannot create branches in "~kees/ubuntu-security-tools"
[19:44] <wgz> kees: you (hilariously) appear not to be a member of ~ubuntu-security
[19:45] <wgz> why that should prevent you creating a branch in your own namespace I know not, but it feels more like a launchpad... security... feature than a bzr bug
[19:46] <kees> wgz: right, I'm not in that group any more, but it's still ~ME/PROJECT/NAME ... why would that not work?
[19:46] <kees> wgz: and it's a public branch...
[19:48] <jelmer> kees: something is tripping up the logic in Launchpad for branch mapping
[19:49] <jelmer> kees: it'll error out with PermissionDenied if you try to push to something that it does not consider a branch
[19:49] <jelmer> it's not necessarily actually related to permissions
[19:51] <jelmer> kees: I can reproduce it
[19:51] <jelmer> bzr: ERROR: Permission denied: "~jelmer/ubuntu-security-tools/update/": : You cannot create branches in "~jelmer/ubuntu-security-tools"
[19:51] <kees> well, at least I'm not crazy. ;)
[19:52] <james_w> is there a branch privacy policy in place on that project?
[19:54] <kees> I don't think so. There was a private branch at one time, but that was a separate, iiuc.
[19:54] <kees> jelmer, james_w: jdstrand has access to look at the project settings. is there anything he should look at?
[19:55] <jdstrand> I may need some hand-holding
[19:57] <james_w> I'm not sure where to look to find out unfortunately
[19:57] <kees> jdstrand: there was a private branch once on that project, can you see if there are any weird settings hidden in there?
[19:58] <jdstrand> kees: sure, where would I look for them?
[19:59]  * jdstrand still has security-tools-private.abandoned laying around
[19:59] <kees> jdstrand: I'm not really sure; I don't have the buttons any more. check https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-security-tools and see what admin toggles there?
[19:59] <kees> s/there/there are/
[20:00] <james_w> webops ping, would you look at the branch security policy on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-security-tools for us please?
[20:00] <kees> and then check https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-security/ubuntu-security-tools/trunk for stuff? I'm really not sure.
[20:00] <kees> jdstrand: if nothing jumps out, don't worry about it. :P
[20:00] <jdstrand> nothing interesting in ubuntu-security-tools/+edit
[20:00] <thedac> james_w: sure
[20:00]  * thedac waves at kees
[20:00] <kees> heya thedac! :)
[20:01] <kees> thedac: we missed you at the quilting. :)
[20:01] <thedac> good to see you. Yeah, I am the only one in my tz
[20:01] <kees> true, true.
[20:01] <jdstrand> kees: poking around I don't see anything...
[20:02] <thedac> james_w: default is forbidden and private for the ubuntu security team
[20:02] <thedac> what am I looking for in https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-security/ubuntu-security-tools/trunk?
[20:03] <thedac> oh, maybe that wasn't for me
[20:03] <james_w> jdstrand, kees: do you want it changed to be a fully public project now?
[20:03] <kees> thedac: sorry, yeah, confusing. that was for jdstrand
[20:03] <jdstrand> ~ubuntu-security/ubuntu-security-tools/trunk/+edit tells me the 'Keep branch confidential' is unchecked
[20:03] <kees> lp:~ubuntu-security/ubuntu-security-tools/private-trunk should probably stay private
[20:04] <jdstrand> I don't know what that is...
[20:04] <kees> it's ancient and abandoned
[20:04] <jdstrand> kees: was that the saved old one?
[20:04] <kees> yeah
[20:04] <kees> if it's breaking u-s-t maybe we should eliminate it?
[20:04] <jdstrand> I'm cool with deleting it if needed
[20:04] <jdstrand> like I said, I have a local branch of that. I can push it somewhere I guess
[20:04] <thedac> kees: jdstrand let me know if I need to change privacy settings on any of these branches
[20:05] <james_w> so it sounds like you want the defaults changing, but keeping that one branch private?
[20:05] <kees> thedac: the problem seems to be that while ~ubuntu-security/ubuntu-security-tools/trunk is public, I can't create branches of it.
[20:05] <kees> james_w: if possible, yeah
[20:06] <jdstrand> that would work for me as well
[20:06] <james_w> thedac, do you know if changing the policy will change existing branches?
[20:06] <thedac> james_w: it will not.
[20:06] <jdstrand> ubuntu-security-tools/private-trunk/+edit is marked 'Keep branch confidential'
[20:06] <james_w> thedac, ok, so it sounds like we'd like the default changed please
[20:07] <james_w> thedac, public for everyone, no-one forbidden
[20:07] <thedac> james_w: ok, I will change that
[20:08] <james_w> thedac, probably also worth checking the bug policy as well?
[20:08] <jdstrand> it isn't setup for bugs yet, if that makes a difference
[20:09] <thedac> ok, default branch visibility is fully public now
[20:09] <thedac> checking on default bug setting
[20:09] <james_w> jdstrand, ah, ok
[20:09]  * jdstrand confirms private-trunk is still private, and it is
[20:09] <thedac> jdstrand: bug default is public
[20:10] <jdstrand> cool
[20:10] <thedac> I have also confirmed that ~ubuntu-security/ubuntu-security-tools/trunk is public. So if that is still not working for kees I can see if there is an LP dev around to question
[20:10] <james_w> kees, you should be able to push now?
[20:10] <jdstrand> (that is what I would have expected if I/we set that up in the future)
[20:10] <kees> james_w: let me check, one moment...
[20:12] <kees> \o/
[20:12] <kees> thanks everyone! :)
[20:13] <james_w> thanks thedac
[20:13] <kees> jdstrand: and if you have a moment, can you merge my 1 character test-change? ;)
[20:13] <jdstrand> kees: sure
[20:13] <thedac> james_w: kees: great.
[20:18] <jdstrand> kees: done
[20:23] <kees> jdstrand: sweet
[20:23] <kees> alrighty, thanks again folks.
[21:10] <caravel> mgz thanks ! ...if you ever read this irc log ^^
[21:10] <caravel> night all
[21:10] <wgz> it worked?
[21:11] <caravel> nothing worked, just read your comments :) took note, will try somthing tomorrow
[21:11] <wgz> cool.
[21:14] <caravel> yes, you see, no solution but just looking into my little issue, did deserve my thanks :) night
[22:09] <poolie> hi all
[22:36] <Noldorin_> hi poolie
[22:36] <Noldorin_> how's it going?
[23:03] <wgz> I'm going to merge roryy's branch unless anyone else wants to look over it quickly
[23:06] <jelmer> 'morning poolie, Noldorin_
[23:06] <jelmer> wgz: go for it
[23:08] <poolie> hi there
[23:08] <poolie> it's pretty good
[23:13] <Noldorin_> hi jelmer
[23:13] <Noldorin_> jelmer, i thought you were Dutch? ;-)
[23:13] <Noldorin_> it's not morning there heh
[23:13] <poolie> where are you, Noldorin_, north america?
[23:14] <Noldorin_> nay
[23:14] <Noldorin_> England.
[23:15] <Noldorin_> poolie, USA yourself?
[23:18] <poolie> Sydney
[23:19] <Noldorin_> oh right
[23:19] <Noldorin_> poolie, sorry. i knew it was somewhere English-speaking and not my time-zone, that's all!
[23:21] <Noldorin_> jelmer, i think you're taunting me with all the updates except on my most desperate one ;-)
[23:21] <Noldorin_> all the bug updates*
[23:44] <jelmer> Noldorin_: heh
[23:45] <jelmer> Noldorin_: there are plenty of other bug reports apart from yours that I haven't touched yet either.. :)
[23:45] <Noldorin_> jelmer, i know, i kid :-) it's just the ones i receive email notifications for heh...
[23:49]  * wgz subscribes Noldorin to ~jelmer
[23:49] <wgz> you will drown in email!
[23:50] <Noldorin_> heh
[23:51] <BlindWolf8> Hi all. I have a clien who is getting this error:
[23:52] <BlindWolf8> bzr: ERROR: Permission denied: "<OUR_DIR>/.bzr/checkout/lock/held/info": [Errno 13] Permission denied
[23:52] <BlindWolf8> I am not sure how to solve this
[23:52] <BlindWolf8> He is on a Windows box
[23:53] <wgz> BlindWolf8: get the full traceback from .bzr.log (run `bzr version` to find out where)
[23:53] <wgz> it will also have other things we need like what version he's running and if bzr-explorer etc are involved
[23:54] <Noldorin_> poolie, btw, do i have any other option for testing Launchpad other than my own Ubuntu VM?
[23:54] <wgz> Noldorin: that'll just be way the easiest option
[23:54] <BlindWolf8> Thanks. Once I have the log file, where would you like it?
[23:54] <wgz> poolie was trying to save you pain by suggesting that
[23:54] <wgz> !pastebin
[23:55] <Noldorin_> wgz, i'm annoyingly using an SSD drive with no space left on it
[23:55] <Noldorin_> :-(
[23:55] <wgz> heh, you won't be able to get launchpad either then, it's not small :)
[23:56] <Noldorin_> bugger
[23:56] <Noldorin_> wgz, someone just give me access to a VPS with it on heh? :-)
[23:56] <wgz> Noldorin: I can suggest you bugs to work on if you're eager, you tend to find things that are way to hard
[23:56] <Noldorin_> heh
[23:57] <Noldorin_> wgz, i discussed a simple one with poolie not long ago. adding additional content types to downloads :-)
[23:57] <Noldorin_> wgz, but sure, feel free to... once i have an instance set up heh
[23:58] <wgz> bzr is nice and easy to work on :-"
[23:59] <Noldorin_> wgz, oh sorry, i read it as launchpad :-P
[23:59] <Noldorin_> i always blend them into one heh
[23:59] <Noldorin_> i suppose it's because i use both together so frequently...
[23:59] <BlindWolf8> Here ya go: http://paste.ubuntu.com/776942/


[10:06] <czajkowski> aloha
[10:09] <slashtommy> good morning
[10:09] <slashtommy> we haz snow!
[10:09] <czajkowski> I heard
[10:09] <czajkowski> :(
[10:10] <slashtommy> "Wintry showers in coastal counties of the south, west and north will add to the danger and may give snow accumulations of up to 3cm. "
[10:11] <czajkowski> breaking news site for weather is a not accurate then
[10:11] <slashtommy> http://met.ie/
[10:11] <slashtommy> we have had a good dusting of snow here
[10:12] <czajkowski> oh joy
[10:16] <ebel> aye just a bit of frosting on ground
[10:17] <ebel> you can see it on the dublin city traffic cam http://www.dublincity.ie/dublintraffic/
[10:19] <slashtommy> don't worry czajkowski, you'll get here fine... then the snow will come and you won't be able to leave! :)
[10:20] <czajkowski> lol
[10:20] <czajkowski> I also need the bf to get in as well
[10:20] <czajkowski> he flys in on the 24th
[10:20] <slashtommy> has he met the family yet?
[10:21] <czajkowski> nope he's doing it at xmas
[10:29] <ebel> awwww
[10:29] <ebel> yet another irish person who goes over to the england to steal their men.
[10:29] <ebel> me, you, my sister. :)
[10:30] <czajkowski> my mum my aunt
[10:30] <czajkowski> :)
[10:31] <ebel> tis like a mediæval army invasion.
[10:31] <slashtommy> :P
[10:31] <ebel> Run over, hit with sticks, steal the menz, run away
[10:32] <slashtommy> has he ever been to ireland?


[00:00] <ironhalik> It seems the smallest move the cursor can make with touchpad is around 8-10px
[00:05] <penguin42> some acceleration setting of some type - I'm using a mouse here
[05:40] <drocsid> hi ubuntu people I would like to know where I can find the driver mentioned here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1119837
[05:40] <drocsid> Of course I have already searched for it
[05:41] <drocsid> Is there an ubuntu developer channel?
[05:42] <drocsid> wish i could log into launchpad
[06:34] <magn3ts> Am I the only one with massive audio problems after the last update?
[11:23] <BluesKaj> Howdy all
[16:02] <sdrhrgjkng> How do I enable the touchscreen features in 13.04?
[17:49] <Ronalds_M> hello
[17:49] <Ronalds_M> can I upgrade to raring
[17:49] <Ronalds_M> with repo?
[17:49] <penguin42> you can upgrade, remember it's not released yet
[17:50] <Ronalds_M> I mean unstable releases
[17:50] <Ronalds_M> or just unity part
[17:50] <Ronalds_M> I wan't to get rid of show workspaces
[17:50] <Ronalds_M> and maybe newest things
[17:50] <Ronalds_M> btw precise
[17:50] <penguin42> I'm not sure about just upgrading unity, there might be a ppa for that, but I don't really follow it to know
[17:50] <SonikkuAmerica> I didn't think there was... he's using Precise right now
[17:51] <Ronalds_M> I want just unity part
[17:55] <Ronalds_M> ppa:unity-team/staging
[17:55] <Ronalds_M> is it that unstable
[17:55] <Ronalds_M> ?
[17:56] <genii-around> That's more than unstable
[17:56] <genii-around> !staging
[17:57] <genii-around> Ronalds_M: It's not a ppa for people other than devs to use normally. It's where the packages they are currently working on are kept for testing. So they could be in any stage of brokenness
[17:59] <Ronalds_M> ok
[18:00] <Ronalds_M> ok
[18:00] <Ronalds_M> can't wait for raring lts release
[18:00] <bazhang> Ronalds_M, raring is not lts
[19:36] <Andy80> hi
[19:37] <penguin42> Hey
[20:37] <SonikkuAmerica> Hello! Currently have a problem that occurred out of the blue: I have Pidgin installed (don't ask why) and config'ed to run at startup. When my session starts, though, it appears to clone itself. Apart from that, a Konsole shows up. I checked my Startup and Shutdown and there's only 1 instance of Pidgin and no Konsole to be found. What's going on?
[20:37] <SonikkuAmerica> (This is 13.04, that's why I'm asking here)
[20:38] <SonikkuAmerica> And yes, it's Kubuntu
[20:58] <tux__> hey, sound stopped working a few mins ago in 13.04
[20:58] <tux__> any ideas?
[21:12] <SBNexus7> Quick question does anyone have the 1/30 or any of the builds from January for Nexus 7 13.04?
[21:12] <tux__> http://www.ubuntu.com/testing : fail, should be raring ringtail
[22:46] <love> updating ubuntu-sdk && libqtmultimedia5 failed recently dpkg error
[22:49] <love> It didn't fail on precise for me.  anyone else have this issue in raring?
[23:15] <love>  Problem with recent update to libqtmultimedia5-dev in Raring.  I tried to update it and get a broken dependancy problem.  dpkg returns an error code.  so I have to use dpkg to remove ubuntu-sdk and the library package.  anyone else have this happen?


[08:29] <elacheche> pong Kilos
[08:32] <Kilos> helloooo africa
[08:32] <Kilos> morning elacheche im going past there on the 30th
[08:33] <Kilos> 2 hours in abu dabi on my way to aus
[08:38] <elacheche> Hey! Great! :) I wish happiness  :) :)
[08:38] <Kilos> ty
[15:22] <elacheche> Na3iL: I got a legend "Achievements" in codingame x)
[15:23] <Kilos> well done
[15:23] <Na3iL> hahaha elacheche I knnew that you can do it :D
[15:23] <Kilos> hi Na3iL
[15:23] <Na3iL> Kilos, hello :D
[15:23] <Na3iL> How are you today
[15:23] <Kilos> ok ty and you?
[15:24] <Na3iL> okay as well
[15:24] <elacheche> L00L.. I'm not a genius, just find a way to get that with a trick that the game devs didn't think about x)
[15:24] <elacheche> https://www.codingame.com/profile/1a8efae38d8f1e0da2b7252792935eec738417
[15:25] <elacheche> Infact it's like cheating, but legal one as it's not my fault :p
[15:25] <Na3iL> hahaha x)
[15:29] <elacheche> So officially I solved a game using every possible language they offer x)
[15:30] <Na3iL> lol xD thats amazing! you are going to be dev guy! :D
[15:31] <elacheche> loool.. I bet that when you'll findout what I did that you'll be laughing very high and saying what a dammy x)
[15:35] <Na3iL> hahaha xD


[03:42] <Demuy> hello
[03:43] <Demuy> anyone here?
[03:43] <lotuspsychje> good morning
[05:28] <ducasse> good morning


[03:22] <qman> hello...I have a bit of an issue with ip forwarding
[03:23] <qman> I had my box set up and the power went out. Once I booted it back up, for some reason, ipv4/ip_forward was set to 0, even though /etc/sysctl.conf is set to have it as 1
[03:23] <qman> am I missing another conf file or something?
[03:28] <qman> Setting it manually as root fixed the problem, so I'm fairly sure it's not a prerequisite issue, although it required opening a root terminal with "sudo -i"; simply "sudo echo "1" > .../ip_forward" gave access denied.
[04:49] <CuriosX11> Hi
[04:53] <ScottK> Hello.
[07:41] <dezmaeth> hi, i used to have ubuntu 5.10 and i use it as a server, now i installed 7.04 server, the thing is , i was used to lampp on the /opt/lampp folder, but ubuntu server allready installed lampp... but i dont know on wich folder :S ...
[07:46] <dezmaeth> anyone?
[07:46] <dezmaeth> :S
[07:49] <pschulz01> dezmaeth: Any particular package?
[07:49] <dezmaeth> pschulz01, xampp
[07:50] <pschulz01> dezmaeth: Try - dpkg -L xampp
[07:50] <dezmaeth> pschulz01, k
[07:50] <pschulz01> dezmaeth: Is is a debian/ubuntu package?
[07:50] <dezmaeth> pschulz01, yes...
[07:51] <dezmaeth> pschulz01, k , didnt find it... so i suppose it installed apache2 , mysql and php4
[07:51] <dezmaeth> pschulz01, how can i disable or enable a aplication from starting on boot?
[07:51] <pschulz01> Most LAMP packages go into /var/www
[07:51] <qman> what method did you install it with?
[07:51] <pschulz01> ?
[07:51] <pschulz01> Install what?
[07:52] <dezmaeth> qman, i installed it via the install of the ubuntu server
[07:52] <qman> like, did he use a deb package, apt, the check box
[07:52] <pschulz01> qman: Sorry.. confused :-)
[07:52] <dezmaeth> qman, it said to me "do you wish to install one of the following" DNS Server , Lampp server, so i sayd lampp
[07:52] <qman> the check box sets apache's htdocs location to /var/www
[07:53] <dezmaeth> k
[07:53] <dezmaeth> :D
[07:53] <dezmaeth> so, if i want to use phpmyadmin , i just get it on that folder?
[07:53] <qman> sudo apt-get install phpmyadmin
[07:53] <dezmaeth> qman, :D
[07:53] <qman> it'll install it and set it up for you
[07:54] <dezmaeth> quite impresive :D
[07:55] <dezmaeth> qman, thanks! it worked!
[07:56] <qman> no problem, things like these are why I use ubuntu
[08:00] <qman> this ip_forward issue still has me quite confused, though
[08:00] <dezmaeth> qman, u r using iptables?
[08:00] <qman> yes
[08:01] <qman> thing is
[08:01] <qman> I have sysctl.conf set correctly to enable ipv4 forwarding
[08:01] <qman> but for some reason, after the system boots, ipv4 forwarding is turned off
[08:01] <dezmaeth> do u have a batch file with the port forwading config?
[08:02] <qman> I set up a bash script with my config, yes
[08:02] <dezmaeth> oo
[08:02] <dezmaeth> mm...
[08:02] <dezmaeth> i really couldnt help u
[08:02] <dezmaeth> :S
[08:02] <dezmaeth> sorry
[08:02] <dezmaeth> hey, one last thing , do u know where the php.ini is?
[08:03] <qman> after the system boots, if I manually do "echo "1" > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward" as root, everything magically starts working
[08:03] <dezmaeth> i cant seem to find it anywere
[08:03] <qman> let me find it
[08:04] <qman> /etc/php5/apache2/php.ini
[08:05] <dezmaeth> :D
[08:05] <dezmaeth> qman, how do u use the "find" command?
[08:05] <qman> I don't, I use slocate
[08:05] <qman> you have to install it to use it, though
[08:05] <dezmaeth> k
[08:06] <dezmaeth> its asking me for the cd in order to install it :S
[08:06] <qman> you first generate the database with "sudo slocate -u", then you can find files with "slocate filename"
[08:06] <dezmaeth> damm
[08:06] <qman> you don't need the cd
[08:06] <qman> just comment out the cdrom repository in /etc/apt/sources.list
[08:06] <qman> it'll look online instead
[08:06] <dezmaeth> ok! :D
[08:08] <dezmaeth> qman, perfect
[08:11] <qman> just remember to update the slocate database once in a while, or else it'll get out of date
[08:12] <qman> probably a good thing to schedule on a cron job during slow hours
[08:13] <qman> if you don't have a lot of files it doesn't take long at all, but on my desktop system I've got around 450 gigs of data and it takes a good five to ten minutes
[09:05] <kraut> moin
[05:05] <sommer> hey all, anyone know if there is a way to migrate machine account from Samba using smbpasswd file to LDAP without having to rejoin the domain?
[05:35] <nealmcb> I'm interested in the ramifications and clean-up solutions related to debian Bug#397886
[05:36] <nealmcb> http://www.nabble.com/Bug-397886:-apache2.2-common:-non-wanted-behaviour-during-upgrade:-charset%09MUST-not-be-created-without-user-consent-t2606841.html
[05:36] <nealmcb> This has been committed as part of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apache2/+bug/127537
[05:36] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 127537 in apache2 "[Sync request]  Sync request apache2 (2.2.4-2) from Debian unstable (main) (dup-of: 126641)" [Undecided,New]
[05:36] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 126641 in apache2 "sync apache2 (2.2.4-2) debian sid main" [Wishlist,Fix released]
[05:36] <nealmcb> for gutsy
[05:38] <nealmcb> The deal is that during some period of time, ubuntu and debian  apache installs set up a default charset, and now we recognize that was a bad idea.
[05:39] <nealmcb> I'm not sure when it started, and I'm wondering if we have advice for folks that want to remove that config and make sure that they don't break any pages.  Actually my issue is that my colleagues upgraded a big site to ubuntu, and this bug is probably affecting a bunch of pages, and now I don't know of a good way to find out which ones, and whether taking the default charset out would help or hurt now....
[05:40] <nealmcb> so are there good tools for scanning a site and finding charset problems?
[06:48] <reya276> Can anyone help me setup POSTFIX?
[06:49] <ScottK> Possibly.  What help do you need?
[06:49] <reya276> I actually have most of it setup, I can send and receive email, I'm just having issues with Evolution it tells me it can't find the host name
[06:50] <reya276> I configure Evolution with the standard pop and smtp protocols but for some reason is not working.
[06:50] <Nafallo> doesn't sound like a postfix issue then.
[06:50] <Nafallo> rather DNS
[06:50] <reya276> POP is mail.frgtracker.com and smtp is also mail.frgtracker.com
[06:50] <reya276> DNS
[06:51] <reya276> oh
[06:51] <reya276> I
[06:51] <reya276> I'm using BIND on webmin for that
[06:52] <Nafallo> mail.frgtracker doesn't resolve.
[06:52] <ScottK> reya276: I agree with Nafallo.
[06:52] <Nafallo> mail.frgtracker.com doesn't resolve.
[06:52] <ScottK> Also, get rid of webmin would be my other advice.
[06:52] <Nafallo> oh. I misspelled it.
[06:53] <Nafallo> it does resolve.
[06:53] <reya276> yes I know, but I come from a wincrap server background and right now SSH is not an option I need something with a GUI as setting up this mail server is extremely time sensitive
[06:54] <reya276> I will get rid of it as soon as I configure this
[06:54] <Nafallo> have you tried just following the tutorials on help.ubuntu.com?
[06:55] <Nafallo> that would be the sane thing IMHO
[06:55] <reya276> nah I rather not mess with the command line right now as I don't know how to really do anything with it
[06:55] <Nafallo> k
[06:56] <reya276> and I like I said this Email stuff is a sensitive issue for the company
[06:57] <reya276> so you guys are saying it does not resolve, I wonder why
[06:57] <reya276> hum....
[06:57] <Nafallo> reya276: a quick nmap on that host says smtp is filtered. can you verify thats what I should see?
[06:57] <Nafallo> reya276: no. I changed my mind. it does resolve.
[06:58] <reya276> oh ok
[06:58] <reya276> filter I never setup any filter, maybe is the default config
[06:58] <reya276> let me check, you guys are awsome
[07:00] <Nafallo> grep 127 /etc/postfix/main.cf should give you a first thing to check.
[07:02] <reya276> grep: /etc/postfix/main.cf: No such file or directory
[07:03] <Nafallo> have you installed postfix?
[07:04] <reya276> yes
[07:04] <reya276> installed it through webmin
[07:04] <reya276> ok try ping to mail.frgtracker.com
[07:04] <Nafallo> please get a shell and try to type the command I gave you.
[07:05] <Nafallo> no luck
[07:05] <reya276> wow
[07:06] <reya276> I wonder if it is a firewall issue
[07:06] <Nafallo> are the MUA behind the firewall?
[07:06] <reya276> MUA?
[07:06] <Nafallo> Mail User Agent
[07:07] <reya276> oh yes
[07:07] <reya276> try this telnet mail.frgtracker.com 25
[07:08] <Nafallo> wont work. I've already ran nmap and told you the port is filtered.
[07:08] <Nafallo> and it still is
[07:08] <reya276> I though I opened that port on my firewall, port 25 right
[07:09] <Nafallo> dooh!
[07:09] <Nafallo> my ISP blocks outgoing SMTP. sorry.
[07:09] <Nafallo> just remembered.
[07:20] <ScottK> reya276: I can connect to it via telnet.
[07:21] <reya276> really
[07:21] <reya276> wow some can and some Can't I wonder why
[07:22] <reya276> but no one can do a regular ping that is an issue
[07:22] <infinity> Uhm.
[07:22] <infinity> Guys.
[07:22] <reya276> but I can send and receive email, the only host that rejects the mail is yahoo.com
[07:22] <infinity> What exactly are you trying to diagnose here?
[07:23] <infinity> If the issue is that Evolution can't connect, that may be because you don't have a POP server installed.
[07:23] <reya276> well I need to be able to setup my Evolution so that I can check the email I setup with Postfix email server
[07:23] <reya276> but when I do a sent and receive it gives me an error
[07:23] <ScottK> reya276: As infinity says, for that you need either a pop or imap server (and Postfix doesn't do that).
[07:23] <infinity> Postfix is an MTA, not a POP server.
[07:23] <reya276> hostlookup failed
[07:24] <reya276> ok what do I need to install so that it can wok
[07:24] <reya276> what is an MTA
[07:24] <ScottK> Mail Transfer Agent
[07:24] <reya276> ok
[07:24] <ScottK> reya276: Which release are you using?
[07:24] <ScottK> Of Ubuntu
[07:24] <infinity> adconrad@cthulhu:~$ telnet mail.frgtracker.com 110
[07:24] <infinity> Trying <IP_ADDRESS>...
[07:24] <infinity> telnet: Unable to connect to remote host: Connection refused
[07:24] <infinity> adconrad@cthulhu:~$ telnet mail.frgtracker.com 25
[07:24] <infinity> Trying <IP_ADDRESS>...
[07:24] <Nafallo> infinity: hehe. good point. I understood it as sending mail :-)
[07:24] <infinity> Connected to mail.frgtracker.com.
[07:24] <infinity> Escape character is '^] '.
[07:24] <infinity> 220 krusty-desktop.localdomain ESMTP Postfix
[07:24] <reya276> can I use DOVCOT IMAP/POP3 server
[07:25] <infinity> You have Postfix setup just fine, you have no POP server.
[07:25] <infinity> Yeah, dovecot works fine.
[07:25] <infinity> apt-get install dovecot-pop3d
[07:25] <reya276> cool
[07:25] <ScottK> reya276: What Ubuntu release are you on?
[07:25] <reya276> feisty 7.04
[07:26] <ScottK> Yes, Dovecot is good then.
[07:26] <reya276> I did not download the server version
[07:26] <reya276> I just got the additional packages
[07:26] <ScottK> Doesn't really matter.  It's all in the same repository.
[07:26] <reya276> ok I tried to install it through webmin and it failed, let me go to the actual machine and do it
[07:26] <ScottK> reya276: https://help.ubuntu.com/7.04/server/C/dovecot-server.html
[07:27] <ScottK> reya276: Don't use webmin.  It's just not a good idea.
[07:27] <infinity> reya276: webmin is going to cause you a lot more problems than it solves.
[07:27] <infinity> There's a reason I completely removed it from the Ubuntu archive.
[07:27] <reya276> I know, but is the only thing close to GUI I can use right now, unless you know of something better
[07:27] <infinity> And it's not just beause I'm a big meanie.
[07:27] <ScottK> reya276: Don't use a gui.
[07:27] <infinity> s/beause/because/
[07:28] <ScottK> The directions I posted a link for aren't that hard.
[07:28] <reya276> I'm not experience enough to use CLI
[07:28] <reya276> and I need to get this up ASAP
[07:28] <ScottK> Well if you use webmin you'll probably end up shooting yourself in the foot.
[07:28] <reya276> after this is done I will dive into using the CLI
[07:28] <infinity> What you'll break following simple instructions on the command line will be a lot less than what you'll break using webmin.
[07:28] <infinity> I assure you.
[07:28] <reya276> ok
[07:29] <infinity> At this point, you'll pretty much want to reinstall fresh and start over, because webmin mangles packages and config files in ways that you can't recover from, unless you really know the system.
[07:29] <infinity> Which, as you admit, you don't.
[07:29] <ScottK> Or if you insist on using webmin and need someone to come in and clean up the mess afterwards, I have consulting rates.... ;-)
[07:29] <infinity> On the command line, you can't really break anything without knowing exactly what you're breaking when you do it.
[07:29] <reya276> can I use synaptic to install Dovcot
[07:29] <infinity> Sure.
[07:30] <infinity> Synaptic is just a front-end to apt, anyway.
[07:30] <reya276> got yah Scott
[07:30] <ScottK> reya276: Did you look at the documentation link I gave you?
[07:30] <reya276> no not yet
[07:30] <infinity> Well, a GUI apt-alike, but let's not split hairs.
[07:30] <ScottK> That's a step byt set way to do it.
[07:30] <ScottK> step by step
[07:31] <reya276> ok
[07:31] <infinity> There's more than one step to installing dovecot?
[07:31] <reya276> I use that guide
[07:31] <reya276> BRB
[07:31] <ScottK> installing and configuring.
[07:31] <ScottK> It's not much more than one step.
[07:32] <infinity> Meh, I hate "configuration toturials" in our official documentation.
[07:32] <infinity> It's always "community member X thinks this is how it should be tweaked, and now everyone will cargo-cult that same config to their systems".
[07:33] <infinity> This being a good example:
[07:33] <infinity> pop3_uidl_format = %08Xu%08Xv
[07:33] <infinity> No explanation of what that does, just that someone thinks it's a good idea.
[07:33] <infinity> (If it was necessary, it should be in the package's default config, not on a website)
[07:33] <Nafallo> infinity: isn't it?
[07:33] <Nafallo> I think I recognise it...
[07:34] <ScottK> infinity: That isn't community documentation though.  That's official docs.
[07:34] <Nafallo> ScottK: from wiki.dovecot.org?
[07:34] <ScottK> No, Ubuntu docs.
[07:34] <Nafallo> ScottK: or maybe even the configfile?
[07:34] <Nafallo> hm. oki.
[07:34] <infinity> ScottK: help.ubuntu.com is community driven.
[07:35] <Nafallo> infinity: no
[07:35] <infinity> (yes)
[07:35] <Nafallo> infinity: help.ubuntu.com/community, right?
[07:35] <infinity> Canonical doesn't write those docs, and neither does core-dev.
[07:35] <ScottK> It's not in the comunity section, no, but the ubuntu-docs team controls it.
[07:35] <Nafallo> hmm. ubuntu-docs team should count as communitydriven... :-)
[07:35] <ScottK> It's not a random driveby wiki update.
[07:36] <infinity> No, I realise it's not a drive-by wiki update, but it's still cargo-cult stuff from various sources, afaict.
[07:36] <infinity> I'm occasionally bitter that we think having everything documented poorly is better than having no docs sometimes. :)
[07:37] <infinity> (Note that uidl formats, for instance, don't matter one bit, unless you're changing POP servers... And if you are, you want to set the format to be the same as your last one, which varies)
[07:38] <reya276> how the heck do you configure this
[07:38] <reya276>  You should configure your Mail Transport Agent (MTA) to transfer the incoming mail to this type of mailbox if it is different from the one you have configured.
[07:38] <Nafallo> infinity: that string is suggested in the package configfile that we ship. commented, but still suggested.
[07:38] <infinity> Nafallo: In which case, the docs are redundant.
[07:39] <infinity> (FWIW, that string matches the uw-pop3d uidl format, which is why it's recommended, because when we originally rolled the dovecot sources into Debian, we were trying to do it as a UW upgrade path)
[07:39] <Nafallo> infinity: they sure it. I just looked, and it's not only suggested, but the default :-)
[07:40] <infinity> Someone who's not an Exim disciple (like I am..) might want to help reya276 with his "how do I tell postfix to deliver to mbox or maildir" question above...
[07:41] <infinity> And don't start any mbox versus maildir holy wars in the process. :P
[07:41] <infinity> We all know that mbox works great for everyone except nerds who keep 6 gigs of mailing list archives in their IMAP folders.
[07:41] <Nafallo> infinity: or bosses that keep ALL mails ever received in the ticketer ;-)
[07:42] <infinity> Yeah.  The default ISP-like setup of "limited size mailboxes, and users download-and-delete from POP" though works well with mbox.
[07:42] <infinity> And much less hassle.
[07:44] <ScottK> reya276: I'm looking for some docs for you.
[07:45] <infinity> I would suspect, without even looking, that a default potfix and a default dovecot will "just work" without configuration on that front.
[07:45] <infinity> Unless webmin mangled his postfix config beyond repair.
[07:57] <ScottK> That's probably true.
[07:58] <ScottK> The key point I do remember is that you put "/" on the end of the delivery path to get maildir and leave it off to get mbox.
[08:03] <reya276> wow people take to heart when you ask for help, I just went into the Dovecot channel and these guys are like you wont get any help from us, LOL
[08:03] <reya276> wow
[08:04] <reya276> pretty much useless to go there
[08:05] <reya276> why would they even have a channel, I though that it was the reason to have a channel so people can go there for help
[08:06] <infinity> Most of us use IRC to get work done, not to provide free support.
[08:07] <infinity> This channel used to have a "no support" policy too, until I handed off the server team to kinder, gentler people than I.
[08:08] <reya276> well I understand, but what is the point to have a channel then?
[08:08] <infinity> reya276: To communicate with fellow developers.
[08:08] <khermans> apache2-ssl-certificate is missing from feisty, it is a known bug, how to fix?
[08:09] <khermans> i cannot generate my cert
[08:09] <infinity> reya276: I, for instance, work for Canonical.  I live in Melbourne, and not a single one of my coworkers does.
[08:09] <infinity> khermans: It's not a bug.  Use ssl-cert instead.
[08:09] <infinity> (make-ssl-cert)
[08:10] <reya276> oh for some reason when I installed DoveCot it generated one for me
[08:10] <khermans> infinity, thx dude -- hey maybe i will work for canonical :-)
[08:10] <infinity> reya276: Yes, it does.
[08:10] <khermans> infinity, do they pay well?
[08:10] <mathiaz> khermans: bug 77675
[08:10] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 77675 in apache2 "apache2-ssl-certificate has gone missing since feisty" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/77675
[08:10] <infinity> I get paid in satisfaction and love.
[08:11] <infinity> mathiaz: Ooo, a bug.  Can I go invalid it? :P
[08:11] <khermans> infinity, yeah thats cool too
[08:11] <mathiaz> infinity: hum... it's tagged as a whishlist.
[08:11] <khermans> i lovew ubuntu, since warty baby!
[08:11] <mathiaz> infinity: I wouldn't marked it as invalid.
[08:11] <khermans> anyways, thx for the help
[08:12] <mathiaz> infinity: the reason being that a lot of people still expect apache2-ssl-certificate
[08:12] <infinity> mathiaz: The whole point was to move to ssl-cert being the One True Way to make all this go, instead of each package having its own broken certificate generation.
[08:12] <mathiaz> infinity: it's referred by a lot of ressources on the internet.
[08:12] <mathiaz> infinity: I agree. I don't say that we should reinclude apache2-ssl-certificate
[08:12] <infinity> mathiaz: Documentation needs to keep up.  Keeping cruft for the sake of docs is wrong.
[08:13] <mathiaz> infinity: may be have a warning that says to use ssl-cert instead of apache2-ssl-certificate
[08:13] <infinity> I'd perhaps be amenable to including an apache2-ssl-certificate shell script that just tells you to use make-ssl-cert. :P
[08:13] <mathiaz> infinity: that would be a good compromise.
[08:14] <mathiaz> infinity: we cannot change all the documentation that refers to apache2-ssl-certificate
[08:14] <mathiaz> infinity: that's why I'd like to keep the bug open to avoir more reports.
[08:14] <infinity> No, but I will happily ignore it.
[08:14] <infinity> (the docs, that is)
[08:14] <mathiaz> infinity: now that LP has a way to present potential duplicate when filling a new bug.
[08:15] <infinity> It's like claiming that Debian could never change its default MTA, because all the docs refer to how to configure smail.
[08:15] <infinity> (Yes, I'm old, shut up)
[08:17] <ScottK> infinity: How old?
[08:17] <infinity> ScottK: Younger than you, I think we established.
[08:17] <ScottK> OK.
[08:17] <ScottK> I'm old and I forget stuff.
[08:17] <infinity> But "old" in the sense that "I remember when Debian's default MTA was smail".
[08:19] <Nafallo> infinity: Potato had that, no? :-)
[08:19] <infinity> Actually, how old were you?  Now it's my turn to forget things.
[08:19] <infinity> I'm 30 in a month.
[08:19] <infinity> Nafallo: potato was exim.  So was slink, I believe.
[08:19] <infinity> Nafallo: hamm might have been smail.
[08:20] <Nafallo> I don't even remember my first Debian :-/
[08:20] <Nafallo> damnit!
[08:20] <Nafallo> I know I switched to Ubuntu 2004 :-P
[08:23] <tck> i think everyone got tired of waiting for debian releases :P
[08:23] <tck> switched to ubuntu
[08:23] <infinity> I still run both.
[08:24] <tck> to infinity and beyond
[08:25] <Nafallo> tck: well. I wanted official x86_64 :-)
[08:25] <leonel> in  my  case  better than  releases  ..  security updates ...
[08:26] <leonel> the kernel had no security updates more than a year .. and  as soon sarge was released  no updates for a month
[08:26] <infinity> I always roll my own kernels on Debian anyway, so that was never a concern for me.
[08:26] <infinity> And their userspace security support was fine.  It was only that period of kernel silence that got them bad press.
[08:26] <tck> when people are paid to do it, always more enthusiasm ;)
[08:27] <leonel> that was what I ended  doing  but  always  a bad feeling on reboot to new kernels  and even for my customers ..
[08:27] <leonel> tck: yes
[08:28] <leonel> the bad thing  about security is when  everyone  thinks  there are no security bugs  because there are no security updates
[08:28] <infinity> Less about the enthusiasm, more about the fear of losing our jobs. :)
[08:28] <Nafallo> hmm. so the box isn't dead...
[08:28] <Nafallo> what the heck is it doing then...
[08:29] <tck> does anyone have the Ubuntu Certified Professional cert ?
[08:31] <Nafallo> btw. what is the best nullmailer out there? and why isn't that one in main? :-)
[08:31] <infinity> How null do you want it?
[08:32] <infinity> "nullmailer" is about as good as it gets for just losing your mail.
[08:32] <Nafallo> just sending the stuff to another smtp
[08:32] <infinity> For relaying, I like ssmtp
[08:32] <Nafallo> it's a backupserver.
[08:32] <infinity> That is, relaying from local to remote.  ssmtp doesn't accept mail.
[08:33] <infinity> Just provides a sendmail binary to get stuff off the system to a smarthost.
[08:33] <Nafallo> nice! thanks Adam :-)
[08:33] <Nafallo> exactly what I want
[08:33] <infinity> NP.
[08:35] <infinity> I tend to have it on all my hosts (because not being able to use mail(1) form the command line makes me a sad panda), and forward to my One True Relay on the edge of my network, which spools and spits mail off to wherever.
[08:36] <infinity> That way I get no sending delays or queueing on the desktop machine.
[08:36] <infinity> s/machine/machines/
[08:36] <Nafallo> yea. this server should only run backuppc really :-)
[08:36] <Nafallo> (and deps ofcourse)
[08:59] <close2__> hello, i have my / on a software raid1 and lvm
[08:59] <close2__> but when I disconnect a disk, and try to boot
[09:00] <close2__> i get the message that "ALERT! /dev/mapper/ROOT does not exist. Dropping to a shell"
[09:01] <close2__> right after grub
[09:01] <ivoks> cd to /dev/mapper
[09:01] <ivoks> and check if there is ROOT
[09:01] <ivoks> i'm sure that's wrong name, there should be something like option1-option2
[09:01] <Nafallo> vg-lv even :-)
[09:01] <close2__> only a control
[09:02] <ivoks> right :)
[09:02] <close2__> i.e. /dev/mapper/control
[09:02] <ivoks> then there aren't lvm groups
[09:02] <Nafallo> and I'm not sure you can use dm-thingies in the bootline anyway.
[09:02] <close2__> FYI i am in the initramfs shell
[09:02] <infinity> Is this raid-over-lvm, or lvm-over-raid?
[09:02] <close2__> lvm over raid
[09:03] <infinity> Kay, then I suspect I know your problem.
[09:03] <infinity> Let me just install mdadm quickly here. :)
[09:06] <infinity> close2__: "sed -i -e 's/--no-degraded//' /usr/share/initramfs-tools/scripts/local-top/mdadm"
[09:06] <reya276> hey you guys happen to know what it the default web URL for SquirrelMail
[09:07] <infinity> close2__: The problem is that, in our infinite wisdom, we've decided to not allow you to boot from degraded arrays.
[09:07] <infinity> close2__: There's much discussion surrounding this issue right now.
[09:07] <ivoks> kill that feature :/
[09:07] <infinity> (There are valid reasons for it, like not being able to tell the difference between a degraded array, or one that udev is still activating the hardware for...)
[09:08] <infinity> So, it needs some thought to solve correctly, sadly.
[09:08] <close2__> ok, so if I reboot, with my 2nd disk attached, and execute this command, it should boot, right?
[09:08] <infinity> close2__: Anyhow, if you yank "--no-degraded" out of that file, and then "update-initramfs -u", you should be good to go.
[09:08] <close2__> because, I was just testing, if it would boot
[09:09] <close2__> thanks, i will try it right away
[09:12] <Nafallo> fuck this!
[09:12] <Nafallo> the damn server doesn't come back :-(
[09:12] <infinity> ?
[09:12] <close2__> do I have to fear, that this "feature" will be reactivated whenever I update the kernel?
[09:12] <Nafallo> [42952646.970000]  3w-9xxx: scsi0: AEN: <NULL> (0x04:0x00E6): :
[09:12] <Nafallo> nafallo@remembrance:~$ dmesg | grep NULL | wc -l
[09:12] <Nafallo> 1232
[09:12] <infinity> close2__: It's a feature of the "mdadm" package.  If you don't want that change overwritten, you can put it on hold...
[09:13] <infinity> echo "mdadm hold" | dpkg --set-selections
[09:13] <Nafallo> after a while of that I rebooted, and now the mac doesn't come up on the switch. link is up at full speed though.
[09:14] <Nafallo> a collegue thinks one of the SATA-cables got disconnected again and it stopped in BIOS trying to tell us...
[09:14] <infinity> Seems plausible.
[09:23] <close2__> another question, when I boot my server the boot-lines are messed up, as if there was no CR (and the login starts right at the beginning)
[09:24] <Nafallo> infinity: thanks for backing that up.   Or if anyone knows...
[10:06] <sommer> right now they both aren't running...one is test the other live.
[10:09] <sommer> I'll find out tomorrow at any rate...going live with Samba and LDAP.
[10:09] <khermans> sommer, where did you get info on how ot set it up?
[10:09] <khermans> sommer, i see many online sources
[10:09] <khermans> sommer, which is the best guide, or did you crib form many source?
[10:09] <sommer> a few places acutally.  The Samba online docs have probably the best guide.
[10:10] <khermans> sommer, the goal is to replace an existing AD, is it easier now?
[10:10] <khermans> sommer, could you email me any links/guides/configs you found helpful?
[10:10] <khermans><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[10:10] <sommer> khermans: No I currently have Samba as PDC, but it's authenticating to local smbpasswd.
[10:11] <sommer> khermans: sure, I'll compile a list.
[10:11] <khermans> sommer, thanks dude
[10:11] <khermans> i will try to put it on the wiki.ubuntu.com
[10:11] <khermans> there is already a guide there
[10:11] <khermans> but want to enhance it
[10:12] <khermans> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=active+directory&titlesearch=Titles
[10:16] <syuroff> hi all.  I'm having a network problem with a new ubuntu server install
[10:17] <syuroff> I can move files around the LAN all I want.  But any downloads (notably, apt-get) croak at about 5 megs.
[10:17] <syuroff> I've knocked down the MTU, and turned off window scaling- no good.  Anything else to try?
[10:19] <ScottK> syuroff: Look at firewall configurations/logs
[10:20] <syuroff> it's an out of the box 6.06LTS configuration- just installed it this morning.
[10:23] <ScottK> I'm thinking between the box and whatever you are downloading.
[10:23] <syuroff> ah.
[10:24] <syuroff> thing is, I can apt-get from the machine right next to it.  same network path.
[11:23] <syuroff> ScottK: well, this is interesting.  I bypassed the NAT router, and all is well.  It's been here for years and never had a machine behave like that.
[11:23] <ScottK> Odd, but NAT can be odd in unexpected ways.  Not sure what to tell you.
[11:24] <syuroff> yeah... since this is going to be a problem for the long term.
[11:24] <ScottK> I'd take a tcpdump and look at the details if I was in your position.
[11:26] <syuroff> I'll have to do that.  And maybe, just maybe, software upates will make it behave like the other machines.


[01:09] <Riddell> ScottK: accepted
[01:19]  * Riddell goes to hotel gym
[01:24] <Hobbsee> there si a gym?
[01:24] <Hobbsee> where?
[01:27] <ScottK> Riddell: Thanks.
[02:44] <Riddell> Hobbsee: on the way to the pool
[06:39]  * seele yawns
[06:39] <seele> i dont care what the local time is
[06:39] <seele> i'm going to bed
[06:40] <NCommander> seele, you here at UDS?
[06:53] <Riddell> NCommander: she is, you missed her :)
[06:59] <manchicken> Riddell: Howdy.
[06:59] <Riddell> evening manchicken
[07:00] <manchicken> Been a while since we've come across one another.
[07:06] <Riddell> manchicken: are you secretly at UDS?
[07:06] <manchicken> That would be fun, no?
[07:06] <manchicken> But unfortunately not.
[07:06] <Riddell> just checking
[07:06] <manchicken> I don't even know where UDS is this time... that's how sorely out of the loop I am.
[07:07] <Riddell> chez google
[07:07]  * Riddell sleeps
[07:07] <manchicken> Mountainview?
[07:08] <Riddell> yes
[07:08] <manchicken> Ah.
[07:08] <manchicken> I'll be in California next week though.
[07:08] <manchicken> South of MV though.
[07:09] <Riddell> me too
[07:09] <manchicken> Where will you be next week?
[07:10] <Riddell> dunno, wherever my bike takes me
[07:10] <manchicken> I'm going to be in Westlake Village, CA, a suburb of LA.
[07:10] <manchicken> Work is sending flying me to our home office.
[07:10] <Riddell> probably a bit too south to cycle to
[07:10] <manchicken> Heh, I would tend to agree.
[07:16] <manchicken> Riddell: If there's a time at which you'll be around to answer me (I know it's getting late in CA), I'd love to ask you the awkward question of what needs doing with the project.
[07:17] <manchicken> I don't have oodles of time, but I will have some time.
[07:25] <NCommander> ScottK, you floating around
[11:36] <ScottK> NCommander: Am now.
[13:43] <ScottK-laptop> So I'm looking for the spec about "Let's make our translations at least not worse than upstreams" and I'm not finding it.
[13:45] <ScottK-laptop> NCommander: Please note you need to change your "selective-backport-support" spec to "discussion".
[14:18] <NCommander> ScottK-laptop, that was an LP bug :-)
[14:19] <ScottK-laptop> NCommander: OK.
[14:19] <NCommander> ScottK-laptop, anyway, I have python-qt4 for you
[14:20] <NCommander> But there is a slight ... snag
[14:20]  * ScottK-laptop cringes.
[16:03] <freeflying> any special reason for disable build msn protocol in kopete?
[16:04] <JontheEchidna> yes: http://www.kubuntu.org/node/58
[16:05] <freeflying> JontheEchidna: thanks
[16:10] <freeflying> JontheEchidna: is there anyone working on libmsn?
[16:11] <JontheEchidna> yeah, it's being mentored in debian
[16:11] <JontheEchidna> once it gets uploaded we can sync it and then get a main inclusion request in for it
[16:17] <ScottK-laptop> Would someone who's @UDS please get us some infos on how to listen in?  Riddell, seele, NCommander ....
[17:03] <Riddell> hi ScottK-laptop, apparantly it'll all be videoed, not sure how to listen in currently but presumably it'll have SIP addresses you can connect to
[17:03] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: I'll take a vido feed too ...
[17:04] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: There are a number of people asking on different channels and there is no info.
[17:13] <lool> NCommander: Dunno when you pinged me but I was like afk the whole of yesterday
[17:13] <NCommander> lool, don't worry, we followed up in real life :-)
[17:16]  * smarter waves
[17:16] <NCommander> smarter, you floating here at the Googleplex?
[17:17] <DaSkreech> On the Mooon?
[17:17] <smarter> for the UDS? I wish I could
[17:17] <smarter> but unfortunately I can't miss school
[17:18] <NCommander> smarter, next year
[17:18] <smarter> probably, if it's during the holiday :)
[17:31] <Riddell> apachelogger: cprov of soyuz was asking if there's anything that can be changed in PPAs to make them better for neon
[18:18] <seele> *cough*kde4*cough*
[18:19]  * DaSkreech gives seele 2 kks of koff medikine
[18:51] <FireRabbit>  hey nixternal has there been any changes with the kde bindings package?
[18:51] <ScottK-laptop> FireRabbit: Since when?  We got the mono packages done.
[18:52] <FireRabbit> oh? awesome
[18:52] <FireRabbit> lemme take a look
[18:53] <jjesse> trying to install kjots from the ppa and it is trying to  /usr/share/icons/oxygen/scalableactions/editpdelete-page.svgz
[18:53] <jjesse> and fails
[18:57] <FireRabbit> ScottK-laptop: will this build on intrepid? could the kubuntu-experimental ppa be updated?
[18:58] <ScottK-laptop> FireRabbit: We'd need mono 2.0 first.
[18:58] <FireRabbit> ah.. I do have that in my PPA. I'll try building the kdebindings package there.
[19:00] <ScottK-laptop> FireRabbit: You'll also have to build against the kubuntu experimental ppa too.
[19:00] <FireRabbit> nod. i've got that as a ppa dependency
[19:06] <DaSkreech> We use mono?
[19:06] <ScottK-laptop> DaSkreech: We have KDE bindings for it.
[19:06] <ScottK-laptop> We don't have any core packages that use it.
[19:07] <DaSkreech> ah ok
[19:09] <ScottK-laptop> Anyone @ UDS going to the session on cooperation between flavors at the next block.
[19:19] <DaSkreech> edubuntu-desktop-kde ftw
[20:02] <steveire> jjesse: Hey, I don't see edit-delete-page in the kdepim/kmail/icons directory. Any idea where it comes from? Might kubuntu have added it?
[20:03] <jjesse> steveire: i have no idea
[20:03] <jjesse> someone able to a swer above query?
[20:03] <steveire> Hmm, ok. Did you get my email about korganizer for blogging?
[20:04] <jjesse> steveire: yes i did tyring it out for uds this time
[20:04] <steveire> I haven't tried it myself yet
[20:04] <JontheEchidna> steveire: It's probably in the old version of package. We just need the new the new kjots package to conflict older versions of kmail
[20:04] <JontheEchidna> totally a bug on our part, and very easy to fix too
[20:04] <steveire> OK cool. Thanks JontheEchidna
[20:05] <Riddell> steveire: kdepim-4.1.2/kjots/icons/ox16-actions-edit-delete-page.png
[20:05]  * JontheEchidna brbs
[20:05] <jjesse> thanks jon for figuring that out
[20:05] <steveire> Riddell: Yep, but on the ml, there was apt output saying it was also in the kmail package
[20:06] <jjesse> Riddell: that was the error i got today trying to install kjots
[20:06] <steveire> Riddell: Did you cycle everywhere on that trip through Europe you blogged about? Or take the bike on the train or anything?
[20:07] <Riddell> hmm, you're right
[20:08] <jjesse> Riddell: i
[20:08] <Riddell> steveire: it's fixed in jaunty
[20:08] <jjesse> Riddell:  im in the server team room let me know when we talk kubuntu :)
[20:15] <smarter> Riddell: you're referring to the fix I pushed to bzr some hours ago?
[20:15] <cbr> will you package beta2 asap? or for the release date or smth?
[20:16] <Riddell> smarter: I am?
[20:16] <smarter> cbr: KDE don't want distros to release packages before the version is officialy available
[20:17] <smarter> Riddell: well, I fixed the kjots bug here: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kdepim/ubuntu/revision/3
[20:17] <smarter> I was wondering if you were speaking of that or if somehow someone managed to fix it and upload it before me :]
[20:18] <Riddell> just grepped the jaunty packaging
[20:18] <jjesse> is that fix making it to the ppa for intrepid then?
[20:19] <Riddell> smarter: why is it in libkdepim4? is it needed by both apps?
[20:19] <smarter> jjesse: as soon as it is actually built and therefore can be tested
[20:19] <smarter> Riddell: yes
[20:19] <smarter> well, I assume so
[20:19] <smarter> if not, then why is it in kmail to begin with?
[20:20] <Riddell> is it in kmail?
[20:20] <smarter> I mean, in kmail.install
[20:20]  * smarter grep kmail sources to see if it's actually used
[20:21] <Riddell> doesn't seem to be
[20:21] <smarter> oh, then I'll make another revision
[20:22] <smarter> but you said it was already fixed in jaunty, are you sure?
[20:22] <Riddell> I looked at 4.1.73 and say it was in kjots
[20:24] <smarter> http://paste.ubuntu.com:80/82628/
[20:24] <smarter> looks like someone messed a .install upgrade :}
[20:25] <smarter> (4.1.80-0ubuntu2)
[20:25] <JontheEchidna> ScottK-laptop: I found this: http://icecast.ubuntu.com/
[20:25] <ScottK-laptop> JontheEchidna: Yeah.  That's it, but it's so faint on mylaptop I can barely hear it.
[20:25]  * JontheEchidna had to pump it to 11
[20:26]  * smarter prepares proper fix for bzr branch
[20:26] <Riddell> there's just one microphone (on the camera) in the corner of the room
[20:27] <seele> Riddell: tell ken, he might be able to adjust the input
[20:32] <smarter> Riddell: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kdepim/ubuntu/revision/4 actual fix :)
[20:38]  * JontheEchidna is listening to the desktop bug session
[20:41] <seele> jjesse: ping
[20:41] <jjesse> seele: pong
[20:41] <seele> oh oh nevermind
[20:41] <seele> i thought we were crew on thursday and there are two kubuntu sessions
[20:41] <seele> and we're on wednesday when not much is going on
[20:41] <jjesse> oh, when are we crew
[20:41] <jjesse> btw did we meet already?
[20:41] <seele> wednesday i guess
[20:41] <seele> i dunno.. where are you?
[20:42] <jjesse> in server right now
[20:42] <seele> did you sit with Riddell and nixternal and rgreening during the intro?
[20:42] <steveire> Is some meeting on at the moment?
[20:42] <jjesse> yes i was right next to him on his right
[20:42] <Riddell> he was on my left
[20:42] <jjesse> the other side of rich
[20:42] <steveire> fosscamp or something?
[20:42] <jjesse> oh yeah left
[20:43] <jjesse> steveire:  ubuntu developer summit in mountain view
[20:43] <seele> Riddell: there was an empty seat on your left
[20:43] <steveire> Ah, right.
[20:43] <nixternal> jeesh, don't even know your left from your right :)
[20:43] <Riddell> seele: it wasn't empty, it was reserved for my smoothie
[20:43] <jjesse> my right
[20:43] <seele> Riddell: jjesse is a smoothie?
[20:43] <jjesse> yes i am a blueberry smoothier
[20:43] <nixternal> a smoothie he thought I sat on :)
[20:43] <Riddell> jjesse was on the left of the smoothie
[20:44] <seele> oooh
[20:44] <seele> hmm..
[20:44] <seele> wait.. tonio got you coffee?
[20:45] <jjesse> no tonio didnt get me coffee
[20:46] <seele> ok, then i dont think we met
[20:46] <seele> heh
[20:47] <Riddell> I'm still unconvinced NCommander is really here
[20:47] <Hobbsee> Riddell: he is, he is...
[20:48] <Hobbsee> Riddell: poke him in the ribs
[20:48] <Riddell> I can't until I know who he is
[20:49] <jjesse> i think NCommander was in the last session i was in?
[20:50] <NCommander> jjesse, I'm with mobile
[20:50] <NCommander> Riddell, care to eat launch?
[20:50] <NCommander> Hobbsee, shoosh
[20:51] <Hobbsee> NCommander: <evil grin>
[20:53] <NCommander> Hobbsee, I will get revenge for that
[20:53] <Hobbsee> :P
[20:54]  * ScottK-laptop advises NCommander to avoid trying to out revenge Hobbsee.
[20:54] <Riddell> NCommander: you'd need to find me first :)
[20:54] <NCommander> Riddell, I saw you when I arrived last night!
[20:54] <Riddell> did I see you?
[20:54] <NCommander> Yes, you talked to me and introduced yourself
[20:54] <NCommander> I was wearing a red dress shirt, and a black jacket
[20:55]  * seele read that as "I was wearing a red dress"
[20:55] <jjesse> so did i
[20:55] <seele> too much matrix
[20:55] <Riddell> I met a lot of people last night, I'm not sure I met anyone in a red shirt
[20:55]  * NCommander rewrites the matrix to remove seele's memories of it
[20:56] <DaSkreech> Were you looking at the NCommander in the red dress?
[20:56]  * ScottK-laptop looks for needles for his eyes.
[20:56] <DaSkreech> A cat like it or the same cat?
[20:56] <NCommander> ScottK, I perfer acid
[20:56] <ScottK-laptop> Needles are traditional.
[20:59] <ScottK-laptop> Looking at the enabling third party repos discussion we'll definitely need a KDE apturl for Juanty.
[21:00] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: ^^
[21:00]  * ScottK-laptop runs off to shuffle kids around ....
[21:01] <seele> food?
[21:02] <ScottK-laptop> No, we don't eat the kids.  They frown on that.
[21:02]  * ryanakca grins and wishes he was in MV
[21:03] <ryanakca> Does each item get it's seperate IRC channel (since they aren't using SIP this year)?
[21:04] <seele> ryanakca: yes, althought it seems like some of the rooms don't have IRC channels (yet?)
[21:04] <ryanakca> seele: *nod*
[21:04]  * ryanakca wishes they had SIP...
[21:15] <DaSkreech> hunger: Hi
[21:23] <hunger> DaSkreech: ho.
[21:23] <DaSkreech> hunger: how goes?
[21:23] <hunger> DaSkreech: Not too well. I'm sick.
[21:24] <DaSkreech> Oh Sorry to hear
[21:24] <DaSkreech> what with?
[21:30] <hunger> DaSkreech: Nothing mayor, just a common cold. Just a bit harder than usual.
[21:30] <DaSkreech> I had an uncommon cold once
[21:30] <DaSkreech>  was horible
[21:30] <DaSkreech> :)
[21:31] <hunger> Well, the common one can be nasty enough:-)
[21:32] <DaSkreech> Yeah Esp in winter
[21:37] <EagleScreen> I think that there is no way to change the font size of some KDE applications in Kubuntu 8.10, for instance: Adept, gdebi-kde..
[21:37] <smarter> EagleScreen: that's because they're run by root
[21:37] <smarter> which has it's own parameters
[21:37] <smarter> so you have to launch systemsettings as root(using kdesudo systemsettings) if you want to change parameters used by these apps
[21:38] <EagleScreen> smarter surely you have reason, thanks
[21:38] <smarter> thought it's workaround, real solution involves policykit and at least 1 more year of development I'd say :p
[21:38] <smarter> EagleScreen: you're welcome
[21:39] <smarter> 'night people
[21:39] <EagleScreen> i think OpenSuse 11.1 will use Policykit for KDE 4.1
[21:40] <EagleScreen> it is releases 18th december
[22:13] <yuriy> hmm uds is on for a day now isn't it? is there a schedule up?
[22:15]  * ScottK-laptop hands yuriy http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-jaunty/
[22:16] <yuriy> thanks ScottK-laptop
[22:20] <FireRabbit> ScottK-laptop: hey, this is wrong: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kdebindings/ubuntu/annotate/7?file_id=qyoto.pc-20081202130636-qf2gdt7wssmot037-52
[22:22] <ScottK-laptop> FireRabbit: OK, what should it be (and chat with directhex about it, because I think he did that)?
[22:23] <FireRabbit> ah okay. it should be "kdebindings-4.4" instead of "qyoto-4.3" in the libs path. this should move upstream though.
[22:23] <ScottK-laptop> Why?  qyoto is the binary package name (IIRC)
[22:24] <FireRabbit> qt-dotnet.dll is installed into /usr/lib/cli/kdebindings-4.4/
[22:25] <ScottK-laptop> Oh.
[22:30] <Ch1ppy> Does anyone know what is happening with kopete and msn in the 4.2 beta? When can we expect libmsn to be added and such?
[22:30] <ScottK-laptop> Ch1ppy: Yes we know.  If you want everything to work, don't run a beta.
[22:31] <Ch1ppy> ScottK-laptop: Er, not what I was asking. I know it doesn't work, I'm asking when it will :)
[22:32] <ScottK-laptop> Ch1ppy: I'm telling you if you want it to work, go back to 4.1.
[22:32] <Ch1ppy> ScottK-laptop: I'm on 4.1. I'm waiting for this so I can check out 4.2. So I'm wondering when that will be.
[22:33] <ScottK-laptop> Ch1ppy: It's hard to tell exactly.  Sorry if I seem short, but you are about that bazillionth person to show up and ask.
[22:34] <Ch1ppy> ScottK-laptop: No worries, I know how it is. Will it be in a week or so? Before the end of the month? I'm just wondering about a ballpark.
[22:34] <ScottK-laptop> Not in a week or so.  Hard to tell.
[22:36] <Ch1ppy> ScottK-laptop: Alright, thanks. Will it be announced on kubuntu.org, or will the 4.2 beta article just be updated?
[22:37] <ScottK-laptop> I'd expect it'll get a mention in the next relevant post, but I'm not the one that'll write it, so who knows.
[22:37] <Ch1ppy> ScottK-laptop: Alright. Thanks for the help :)
[22:38] <cbr> libmsn is in Debian's NEW queue at the moment
[22:39] <cbr> has been for 6 days
[22:39] <DaSkreech> Debian has something going on?
[22:39] <cbr> http://ftp-master.debian.org/new.html
[22:39] <cbr> see for yourself
[22:42] <Ch1ppy> cbr: That's just the amd64 version isn't it?
[22:43] <cbr> well, other stuff usually gets built automagically by the buildd's with a small delay iirc
[22:43] <cbr> but dunno
[23:01] <FireRabbit> ScottK-laptop: did you guys see that debian has kdebindings 4.2 packages as well?
[23:01] <ScottK-laptop> FireRabbit: Yes.  Riddell did ours first, so there are some differences.  We need to sort those out.  Probably after NCommander gets off his backside and fixes armel.
[23:02] <FireRabbit> okay.
[23:46] <Riddell> seele: is it socially acceptable to share nail clippers?  (and if so do you have any I can borrow?)
[23:48] <seele> Riddell: since we're close friends and all i think it would be ok.. not nearly as intimate as a toothbrush :P
[23:49] <seele> Riddell: but unfortunately i dont have any clippers.  i do have a nail file if that will help?
[23:49] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: They may have them to give you at the hotel.
[23:52] <JontheEchidna> gap-analysis session in ~20 minutes?
[23:52] <jjesse> what room is that one in?
[23:54] <Riddell> anseris mons, our sessions are on Mars
[23:54]  * JontheEchidna has the desktop live stream queued up
[23:54] <JontheEchidna> they're talking about boring networking stuff right now
[23:54] <Riddell> I realise the camera is pointing straight at me, the video from this session is going to be really boring
[23:55] <jjesse> what building is anseris mons?
[23:55] <JontheEchidna> there is a video feed?
[23:56] <jjesse> the sessions are being recorded and will show up later
[23:56] <JontheEchidna> oh, nice
[23:56] <jjesse> what building are you in Riddell?
[23:57] <Riddell> the other side of the building we had lunch in
[23:58] <jjesse> ok gotta go find it
[23:58] <jpds> Riddell: I wonder if the camera is even on.


[01:41]  * micahg wonders where the sponsoring queue went
[04:56] <maxiaojun> hi
[04:57] <maxiaojun> I want to make "tegaki-zinnia-traditional-chinese" into Ubuntu. pad.lv/1069292
[07:19] <dholbach> good morning
[07:22] <obounaim> Good morning everybody
[08:33] <iulian> Morning dholbach.
[08:35] <dholbach> hi iulian
[09:06] <vibhav> hmm, anybody knows what happened to the sponsor queue?
[09:16] <Laney> dholbach: ^?
[10:32] <dholbach> Laney, what is the question?
[10:32] <dholbach> vibhav, ^
[10:32] <dholbach> Last updated at: Mon, 22 Oct 2012 10:24:30 -0000
[10:32] <dholbach> looks fine to me
[10:33] <Laney> am i going to the wrong link?
[10:33] <Laney> !sponsoring
[10:33] <dholbach> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
[10:33] <vibhav> reqorts
[10:33] <vibhav> Its http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/ on the topic
[10:33] <Laney> yeah reqorts?!
[10:34] <dholbach> so
[10:34] <dholbach> ?
[10:34] <dholbach> what's the question? :)
[10:34] <Laney> has that always been it?
[10:34] <Laney> did reports work before?
[10:34] <Laney> it's at least linked from that wiki page
[10:34] <Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
[10:34] <dholbach> in the last few years it's always been there
[10:34] <Laney> (and in my browser history as reports)
[10:35] <vibhav> dholbach: the topic links to http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/ and not  http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring
[10:35] <Laney> I suspect some redirect stopped working
[10:35] <dholbach> ok, then maybe it should be fixed there
[10:35] <dholbach> I've got to rush off, so I'll leave you guys to it :)
[10:35] <dholbach> see you in a bit
[10:35] <Laney> heh
[10:35] <Laney> I'd rather not fix every link
[10:36] <vibhav> Can I do it then?
[10:36]  * Laney asks IS
[10:37] <vibhav> I always that it was reports, wierd :|
[10:37] <vibhav> what does reqorts mean anyway?
[10:37] <Laney> I strongly suspect that there was a redirect
[10:37] <vibhav> probably
[10:38] <Laney> checking
[10:46] <Laney> anyone seen python-keyring (or whatever it is) forcing you to reset your keyring password every time?
[10:46] <Laney> Please enter password for encrypted keyring:
[10:46] <Laney> Please set a password for your new keyring:
[10:46] <Laney> Please confirm the password:
[10:48] <xnox> Laney: did you change your user password?
[10:49] <xnox> in a non-gui way?
[10:49] <Laney> no, I just created the keyring
[10:49] <Laney> there is no GUI, it's inside lxc
[10:49] <xnox> horum. sorry, no idea.
[10:50] <Laney> that makes two of us
[10:50] <vibhav> Laney: nope
[11:13] <Laney> vibhav: should be coming back soonish
[11:14] <vibhav> thanks
[11:14] <Laney> dholbach: Turns out reports.qa.u.c got moved to a new server which didn't have the old /reports/ stuff (reqorts is the old server which used to be reports)
[11:15] <vibhav> reposts!
[11:15] <vibhav> Anyways, thanks again
[11:38] <cjwatson> All you folks doing syncs to raring may want to hold off a bit.
[11:38] <cjwatson> Depending on how our upload changes work out, they may end up being rejected.
[11:39] <Laney> what about manual uploads?
[11:40] <cjwatson> Those should be fine
[11:40] <cjwatson> (Not that I'm encouraging people to do manual uploads that should be syncs)
[11:40] <Laney> no, I meant real ones
[11:40] <cjwatson> If you must do syncs early, then for now I suggest targeting raring-proposed rather than raring.
[11:40] <cjwatson> Worst case for that is a bit of extra work for archive admins.
[11:41] <Laney> hm, UDD seems unhappy
[11:41] <Laney> http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/ "11228 outstanding jobs"
[11:42] <Laney> is this a usual release opening thing?
[11:42] <Laney> bzr branch lp:debian/unstable/<anything> fails
[11:46] <cjwatson> Laney: need to ask for it to be re-enabled - trying to figure that out now
[11:46] <Laney> cjwatson: great, cheers
[11:58] <mitya57> dholbach: online?
[11:58] <Laney> Rhonda: could you make packages.u.c list quantal-{updates,backports}?
[11:58] <Laney> also possibly raring (and maybe it is now interesting to list -proposed for the dev series?)
[11:59] <cjwatson> That would encourage users to use <dev>-proposed, so I wouldn't recommend that
[11:59] <cjwatson> quantal-{updates,backports} and raring should indeed happen though
[12:00] <dholbach> mitya57, yes
[12:00] <Laney> yeah, maybe it would
[12:01] <mitya57> dholbach: I won't be happy until developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html is fixed :)
[12:01] <Laney> -backports is now extant for the development release, on the other hand
[12:01] <mitya57> (now everything returns 403)
[12:01] <Laney> d.u.c works here
[12:02] <Laney> packaging guide's css is busted though
[12:02] <geser> Laney: if you find a work-around for the password changing (from python-keyring) let me know plz. I see it in my dev chroot too and it's annoying :(
[12:02] <mitya57> that's because it's now symlinked to /usr/share/ubuntu-packaging-guide/
[12:02] <Laney> geser: I've been hacking scripts to set credentials_file
[12:03] <Laney> perhaps we should, like, debug it
[12:03] <dholbach> mitya57, I know - it's on my list - today is a crazy day
[12:03] <dholbach> mitya57, I'll take care of it in a bit
[12:04] <mitya57> dholbach: I understand...
[12:04] <dholbach> ok
[12:04] <dholbach> will let you know when it's fixed
[12:04] <mitya57> dholbach: not needed
[12:18] <geser> Laney: I was simply using requestsync to trigger it
[12:19] <Laney> geser: yes, it's trivial to trigger
[12:19] <Laney> i'm saying we should find out why it happens and file a bug
[12:47] <Rhonda> Laney: Ah, of course.
[12:48] <Rhonda> Laney: "are we there yet? are we there yet? are we there yet?"
[12:54] <Rhonda> natty is discontinued now, right?
[13:04] <mitya57> Rhonda: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/anypackage says it's still supported
[13:05] <mitya57> The close date is something like Oct 28
[13:08] <Rhonda> I won't let it in, commit the change for quantal release now and remove it in a week's time from the packages site.
[13:08] <Rhonda> That doesn't make much sense to me. :)
[13:09] <al-maisan> is there a way of setting the JAVA_HOME env. variable in arch-independent fashion so that the JVM is found irrespective of 32/64 bit installation?
[13:10] <al-maisan> Right now I use JAVA_HOME="/usr/lib/jvm/java-6-openjdk-amd64" but I guess that won't work on a 32-bit system, right?
[13:12] <Rhonda> hahahaha, MOTD on jubany.c.c  :D
[13:12] <Rhonda> "do not reboot" in banner lettering. :)
[13:12] <Rhonda> hmmmm
[13:24] <al-maisan> hmm .. /usr/lib/jvm/default-java is arch-independent and what I was looking for
[13:28] <Rhonda> Laney, cjwatson: Should be done, after the next cron job/mirror push.
[13:31] <cjwatson> Thanks
[13:56] <Laney> Rhonda: great
[13:56] <Laney> maybe you want to remove Frank's name ;-)
[14:18] <Rhonda> He's still there?
[14:19] <Laney> at the top, yeah
[14:19] <Laney> ... and the bottom
[14:19] <Rhonda> huhm, right
[14:19] <Rhonda> … and this MOTD motivates me to finally start up aewan again and produce some ubuntu branded ascii art. :)
[14:20] <Rhonda> … including offering my own figlet font for the lettering.
[14:20] <nigelb> You have your own figlet font?
[14:20]  * nigelb bows
[14:20] <Rhonda> Yes.
[14:20]  * highvoltage needs new figlet fonts
[14:21] <Rhonda> Actually I should pester sam to include it as default for toilet, but I think he's more interested in utf8 fonts
[14:21] <Laney> figlet FIG figlet FIG
[14:22] <Rhonda> http://fav.me/d7ghx8 is one of the favorites of my creations.  ;)
[14:22] <highvoltage> that looks gimped.
[14:28] <Rhonda> :)
[14:28] <Rhonda> Laney: Hmm, well, I'm looking after it these days, but I wouldn't call it maintaining.  I'm uncertain.  Not until I changed a bit more of the code. :)
[14:28] <Rhonda> But, the "to report a problem" I will change right ahead, yes.
[14:40] <Rhonda> ok, the dynamic pages already have my email address at the bottom, the rest will follow after the next rerun
[14:41] <Rhonda> (and I expect to get spammed even more now …
[14:41] <Laney> ;-)
[15:32] <mitya57> dholbach: will now try the sphinx patch
[15:32] <mitya57> (though it's a bit strange that the pull request has been deleted)
[15:33] <mitya57> wow, there's a new pull request that attempts to fix japanese LaTeX problems!
[15:41] <dholbach> mitya57, yeah, I saw it - we should maybe ping upstream :)
[15:41] <dholbach> barry knows upstream IIRC
[15:42] <barry> dholbach, mitya57 sphinx upstream?
[15:42] <dholbach> yes
[15:42] <dholbach> they have a bunch of pull requests which didn't get reviewed :)
[15:43] <barry> dholbach: i think georg has just been swamped lately, but i think i've seen some recent activity from him on sphinx
[15:43] <dholbach> particularly the i18n stuff would be good to get in
[15:46] <mitya57> I get this trying to build sphinx with that patch: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1297780/
[15:50] <mitya57> oops, the same happens without the patch :(
[15:51] <mitya57> ah, that's because I'm using new docutils I built for raring...
[15:51] <mitya57> https://bitbucket.org/birkenfeld/sphinx/issue/998/docutils-010-will-break-sphinx-manpage
[16:14] <mitya57> dholbach: when I revert last three translation commits and do "make html-es", that succeeds
[16:15] <mitya57> does that mean that the patch works?
[16:15] <dholbach> err
[16:15] <mitya57> I thought there was some workaround in the translations...
[16:16] <dholbach> I'm not quite sure - are you trying this with the sphinx upstream patch now?
[16:18] <mitya57> dholbach: yes
[16:18] <dholbach> and with the the last 3 changes applied it doesn't work?
[16:19] <dholbach> is the crash report the same as in the bug?
[16:20] <mitya57> with the last 3 changes applied it should always work (even without the patch), shouldn't it?
[16:20] <dholbach> no, it crashes for me
[16:21] <mitya57> will try now
[16:21] <dholbach> it seems like the translated href names were a red herring, so not the actual problem :/
[16:21] <mitya57> succeeds
[16:21] <dholbach> NICE
[16:22] <mitya57> As the package now lives in Debian, we'll need jwilk to accept this patch
[16:22] <dholbach> do you think you can upload the source package into your PPA maybe?
[16:22] <dholbach> sphinx I mean
[16:22] <dholbach> then I'll have a look at it, play around with it some more and stick it into our team ppa for the time being (until we can fix it in ubuntu itself)
[16:23] <mitya57> dholbach: but I can, yes
[16:23] <dholbach> mitya57, thanks so much for your work on this
[16:23] <mitya57> no, we can't fix it in ubuntu itself: ^^
[16:23] <dholbach> in an SRU then
[16:25] <mitya57> SRU is fine, yes
[16:25] <dholbach> perfect
[16:42] <bobweaver> Hello there I am trying to make a meta package that installs like a top 20 list of things that I do after installing Ubuntu. but I would like to use debconf to make this happen. like for the meta package "Ubuntu restricted extras"  I would like to have a debconf that says "Ubuntu restricted extras installs X,Y&Z . Would you like to install this package. " thus giving the end-user the option to select Yes or No . but I can not figure out
[16:42] <bobweaver>  how to implant that in debconf. This is how I think that I will do it. set up stanzas for debconf and have then answer store then call them. maybe I should make "debian/ubuntu-restricted-extras.install" and if yes in debconf install. How would you do it?  or have any tips ?
[16:43] <bobweaver> ^^ in debian policy manner that is ^^
[16:44] <cjwatson> You can't do that in debconf, because apt/dpkg aren't re-entrant - a package can't conditionally install another package in its maintainer scripts.
[16:45] <micahg> bobweaver: I think sessioninstaller is closer to what you're looking for
[16:45] <cjwatson> You would have to write a script that does the installation, outside of the context of postinst scripts etc.
[16:49] <bobweaver> cjwatson,  micahg  thanks a ton !  cjwatson  could script be to launch other app that was installed 1st. er... so like say I am writing app (qml) that is tutorial for new users (like about unity press super for this have super button symbol show up on screen.) could I use something like that but would it have to be in nm PreDepends sorry. I am just trying to make a program (qml) that takes and gives tour of Ubuntu desktop then on tour g
[16:49] <bobweaver> ives option to install packages.
[16:50] <micahg> bobweaver: sessioninstaller is what you're looking for
[16:51] <bobweaver> Oh cool this is dbus reader thanks again micahg
[16:52] <cjwatson> But just to re-explain my comments: while your package's postinst script is running, you can't install any other packages.
[16:53] <cjwatson> It doesn't matter whether you hide that in some other script.
[16:53] <bobweaver> because dpkg is already busy correct ?
[16:53] <cjwatson> It would have to be something the user ran separately (and, yes, probably involving sessioninstaller or something like it).
[16:53] <cjwatson> Correct.
[16:53] <cjwatson> And you don't want to use Pre-Depends.
[16:54] <cjwatson> If your program runs outside the context of installing the package containing it, then dpkg won't be busy and you can install stuff.
[16:58] <bobweaver> I see cjwatson  I am going to read more into sessioninstaller but I think i am going to have to just write something into the app like declarative onfirsttimelaunch.cpp or something like that. Thanks again everybody :)
[17:41] <maveze> Hi, anyone know what can i do with that error: dpkg-shlibdeps: error: couldn't find library libgstinterfaces-0.10.so.0 needed by... (ELF format: 'elf32-i386'; RPATH: '')??
[18:19] <jtaylor> is it normal that you get binary-nmu-debian-revision-in-source lintian warning with backport version numbers?
[18:20] <jtaylor> binary-nmu-debian-revision-in-source 0.13.1-1~ubuntu12.10.1~ppa1
[18:21] <micahg> sounds normal from the description
[18:22] <jtaylor> I didn't get it with ~code-name~ppa
[18:22] <jtaylor> what is confusing lintian here?
[18:22] <micahg> 12.10.1
[18:22] <jtaylor> ah
[18:22] <jtaylor> thx
[18:22] <jtaylor> never seen a three part binnmu version
[18:23] <micahg> it sounds old
[18:23] <micahg> "(The +b form is the current standard; the three-part version number now obsolete.)"
[18:28] <jtaylor> micahg: has bug 1040756 been overlooked or is it just to invasive?
[18:28] <micahg> I didn't see it yet
[18:29] <jtaylor> the rdeps are scary, but there was only one issue in 6 month were a package used fftw3 wrong
[18:29] <jtaylor> (obscure science package)
[18:32] <micahg> jtaylor: none of the rdeps are marked as tested
[18:32] <jtaylor> micahg: its impossible to test so much
[18:33] <jtaylor> I was thinking that the lack of bugs might be enough :)
[18:33] <tumbleweed> you can at least test a reasonable number of them
[18:34] <tumbleweed> preferably the high-popcon ones
[18:34] <tumbleweed> (but I am not a backporter) :P
[18:34] <jtaylor> I would expect high popcon ones to already have noticed something
[18:35] <micahg> different versions of the rdeps could also affect things
[18:38] <jtaylor> that should be pretty unlikely
[18:39] <jtaylor> the library hasn't really changed that much, just got support for new cpu instructions under the hood
[18:39] <jtaylor> but I'm fine with waiting a little longer
[18:39] <jtaylor> probably avx enabled cpu's are still to rare
[18:40] <micahg> jtaylor: I would like to see some build/install/run testing of at least the on-image packages
[18:41] <micahg> seems like most of this stuff would affect Ubuntu studio mostly
[18:41]  * micahg wonders if reverse-depends could learn about what's on an image
[18:42] <jtaylor> libmagickcore5 looks like a decent candidate
[18:42] <jtaylor> lets see what it uses it for
[18:42] <micahg> jtaylor: are you coming to UDS?
[18:42] <jtaylor> no
[18:43] <jtaylor> stupid work always shedules my trips to be at the same time as uds or debconf ...
[18:43] <jtaylor> and then the trip gets canceled to late for me to go ._.
[18:45] <tumbleweed> micahg: that was the point of seeded-in-ubuntu
[18:46] <micahg> tumbleweed: that just tells you if it's on an image, not which binaries/sources are reverse dependencies on an image
[18:55] <tumbleweed> oh, I seew hat you mean
[18:56] <jtaylor> tumbleweed: you have an avx cpu right?
[18:57] <tumbleweed> jtaylor: yup, my laptop does
[18:57]  * tumbleweed probably shouldn't admit that, though
[18:57] <jtaylor> :)
[18:58] <tumbleweed> there's useful testing to be done without an AVX CPU, surely
[18:58] <jtaylor> fftw has an extensive testsuite and really only does one thing
[18:58] <jtaylor> avx is the thing I can't cover :/
[18:59] <jtaylor> but it would be enough if you have the time to just run this: convert -fft /usr/share/doc/texlive-base/pdftex/manual/samplepdf/pic.jpg tmp.jpg
[18:59] <jtaylor> or with any jpg
[19:00] <jtaylor> but only when you have the time, its really not urgent
[19:01] <micahg> jtaylor: what was the outcome of Bug #1069954
[19:01] <micahg> (not that bug specifically, but the issue as we discussed it before quantal's release)
[19:01]  * tumbleweed can probably do that
[19:01] <jtaylor> hm as I understood it wait until main universe distinction is gone
[19:02] <jtaylor> I forgot to fix the yorick-av ftbs ._.


[11:29] <tjaalton> hrm, need to revert moar stuff to make blur nice and quick again
[11:55] <tjaalton> there
[14:02] <mlankhorst> ok, can you upload to raring too? :-)
[14:04] <tjaalton> sure
[14:44] <ricotz> tjaalton, hi :)
[14:45] <ricotz> tjaalton, be aware mesa needs an rebuild agains the new wayland package layout, but the synced wayland package doesnt have sufficient breaks against the old libwayland0
[14:45] <tjaalton> ricotz: laney fixed that
[14:45] <tjaalton> and mesa already got uploaded, ftbfs due to llvm
[14:46] <ricotz> tjaalton, alright :)