[10:38] <elfy> hi knome - really sorry about weekend, I put my back out :(
[10:38] <knome> elfy, aha - no problem
[10:39] <knome> elfy, i didn't even remember it myself
[10:39] <elfy> I'm off work for a week now - so anytime you have some to spare for me I'll be about
[10:39] <elfy> lol
[10:39] <knome> elfy, hope you're feeling better now
[10:39] <knome> how about in 15 mins?
[10:39] <elfy> yea - funnily enough I then fell down the stairs and put it back in lol
[10:39] <elfy> yep - that will be great - ping me :)
[10:40] <knome> sure
[10:40]  * knome tries to get some coffee into the machine
[10:40] <knome> the human machine
[10:40] <smartboyhw> knome, oh how much coffee is the machine missing?>
[10:40] <knome> no idea
[10:41] <astraljava> Still no IV for caffeine... *sigh*
[10:44] <elfy> lol
[10:50] <astraljava> C'mon science, how much longer?
[10:50] <astraljava> *grumble* This isn't it either.
[10:56] <knome> elfy, ok, i'm all set
[10:56] <elfy> ok - basically I'm still confused lol
[10:57] <knome> yep, just ask anything you need
[10:57] <knome> we even have astraljava here
[10:57] <elfy> what is it exactly you want from a QA manager :)
[10:57] <elfy> lead or what you want to call them
[10:57] <knome> the task is pretty much making sure testing will get done
[10:57] <knome> so 1) send call for testing emails
[10:58] <knome> 2) if that doesn't work, try other ways
[10:58] <knome> 3) if that doesn't work, be in contact with me/others about how we could fix the situation
[10:58] <smartboyhw> elfy, on 2) you have the power on the forums so should be easy for you...
[10:58] <elfy> :)
[10:58] <knome> during the R cycle, we want to look at automated testing too
[10:58] <knome> if you know about that, it's great!
[10:59] <knome> if you don't, there will be others with you on it
[10:59] <elfy> knome: I 'know' about it and was set to check the utah things at UDS - unfortunately work interfered
[10:59] <knome> we need to see how we can make use of automated testing anyway, and that essentially means people *managing things* should be doing most of the stuff anyway
[10:59] <elfy> can catch up on that quite quickly I think
[10:59]  * smartboyhw needs to learn more about UTAH too
[11:00] <knome> well, "most"; at least, they should tell what they'd need from automated testing
[11:00] <knome> i was at a "UTAH school" session, but that was quite boring. i skipped the other part.
[11:00] <knome> (same goes for pleia2)
[11:00] <elfy> from my understanding the automated stuff is mostly checking that stuff actually installs - is that correct - in a basic sense?
[11:01] <knome> for exampel, UTAH itself isn't hard. the hard part is figuring out how we will benefit from it
[11:01] <knome> elfy, installs, or pretty much anything that returns with an error/pass code
[11:01] <smartboyhw> knome, oh? I thought it should be fun. (But then probably autopkgtest is better)
[11:01] <knome> there are other automated testing things too, but i'm not too familiar with them
[11:01] <elfy> yep - I can spend some time over the next 7 days getting that automated straight in my head and thinking on how we can use it
[11:01] <smartboyhw> knome, autopkgtest is what I heard about most
[11:02] <knome> if you have the time and motivation, it would be great if you could get your head around them, and maybe send some kind of email to the mailing list telling about what they are and how you think we could use them
[11:02] <smartboyhw> elfy, congrats that you have so much time. (I don't with Physics test on Monday and Geography open-book test on Wednesday
[11:02] <knome> ultimately, i don't care about automated testing for R or S.
[11:02] <elfy> ok knome
[11:03] <astraljava> knome: Yeah, I'm here. What is it good for? I have no idea.
[11:03] <elfy> am I right in saying no alphas this cycle and 2 betas
[11:03] <knome> but if we can benefit from that, we should start looking at it so we don't need to build the infrastructure during the LTS cycle, when we want/need the tests the most
[11:03] <knome> yes, we will have two betas but no alphas
[11:03] <elfy> so we're going to be wanting people to do daily tests when they can and reporting to the tracker
[11:03] <elfy> and
[11:03] <smartboyhw> elfy, yep. You got harder work than me then (one beta for Studio only)
[11:03] <knome> testing before betas shall be "social alphas", and we need to communicate when we want those and what to specifically test
[11:03] <elfy> also testing specifics as and when they turn up
[11:04] <elfy> yep - thought I had that right :)
[11:04] <knome> if we could get daily testing in a better shape, that would be awesome
[11:04] <knome> again, let's try to pump it slowly up for the LTS
[11:04] <elfy> one of the other forum admins is also testing xubuntu
[11:05] <knome> ok, that's great. is he sending testing reports? :)
[11:05] <elfy> I'm sure he will - he's the one who's heavily involved in testing
[11:05] <knome> if you have ideas how to organize daily testing and get the coverage higher, any ideas are welcome
[11:05] <knome> the mailing list is a good place to throw ideas and brainstorm
[11:05] <elfy> I'll be posting on the forum in the testing section too - try and get some more of those people involved
[11:06] <knome> that would be great
[11:06] <smartboyhw> elfy, try to "bother" balloons as much as he accepts, he really does help you along:D
[11:06] <knome> we need reliability over quantity really
[11:06] <elfy> yea - I'll post a couple of threads to the m/l in the next few days then - one about how we'll be testing this cycle and another asking for thoughts about testing generally
[11:06] <elfy> knome: +1
[11:06] <knome> yeah, balloons (nick skaggs) can help you with a lot of things
[11:07] <elfy> smartboyhw: yea I know all about nick :)
[11:07] <smartboyhw> elfy, LOL
[11:07] <ochosi> hmm, i don't want to interrupt you too much, but have you discussed the testing of individual apps that are targeted for R yet?
[11:07] <knome> i even fixed his website theme just for fun so i can blackmail him if he's acting wonky :P
[11:07] <knome> ochosi, no, not yet
[11:07] <elfy> ha ha ha
[11:07] <smartboyhw> knome, what?
[11:07] <knome> smartboyhw, ?
[11:07] <knome> elfy, so yeah, we're introducing a "few" new apps for R
[11:08] <elfy> menulibre for instance?
[11:08] <knome> elfy, we want "social alphas" to test those
[11:08] <smartboyhw> knome, you mean you changed balloons' website theme just to blackmail him?
[11:08] <knome> menulibre, display dialog, gtk color chooser
[11:08] <smartboyhw> elfy, "social alphas" = cadence testing
[11:08] <elfy> aah yes - dispaly was the other I remembered vaguely
[11:08] <knome> smartboyhw, no, i fixed it just for fun. but that allows some blackmailing too d:
[11:08] <smartboyhw> knome, LOL
[11:09] <ochosi> well anyway, if/when you discuss testing the individual apps for R, feel free to ping me
[11:09] <knome> elfy, SUBSCRIBE https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/other-r-xubuntu-testing :)
[11:09] <elfy> ochosi: cheers
[11:09]  * smartboyhw will subscribe to the blueprint too
[11:09] <elfy> done knome
[11:10] <knome> elfy, the assignee is xubuntu team just because i don't want to make you feel like you have to work on it. if you rather want it to say elfy, i can change that
[11:10] <elfy> nah - fine as it is :)
[11:10] <knome> elfy, and if there is any work items you are working on that aren't listed, please add them and keep the status up-to-date
[11:10] <elfy> yep - will do that
[11:10] <knome> elfy, are you familiar with work items or should we go through that?
[11:11] <elfy> quick run through would be helpful - I did it once
[11:11] <knome> ok
[11:11] <knome> so the format is
[11:11]  * astraljava raises eyebrows... "all about nick?"
[11:11] <knome> [assignee] work item: STATUS
[11:11] <elfy> astraljava: enough perhaps :)
[11:11] <knome> assignee is a launchpad nick, you can use teams too
[11:12] <knome> work item is a short but accurate description what to do
[11:12] <knome> if you can't keep it in one line, you probably should split it into two or more separate work items
[11:12] <smartboyhw> astraljava, if elfy knows everything about balloons I will surely tell balloons to hide
[11:12] <knome> STATUS is one of: BLOCKED, TODO, INPROGRESS, DONE
[11:12] <knome> they are quite straightforward
[11:13] <elfy> aah yes - I remember fighting that status thing last time :)
[11:13] <knome> use BLOCKED whenever you need somebody else to do something before proceeding
[11:13] <elfy> k
[11:13] <knome> or even if you need broader discussion before continuing
[11:13] <knome> and if you mark something as blocked... you probably should add another work item
[11:13] <elfy> yep - that makes sense
[11:13] <knome> [lp-nick] do something that unblocks another item: TODO
[11:14] <elfy> fairly logical really
[11:14] <knome> yep
[11:14] <elfy> cool - that all makes sense to me then
[11:14] <knome> we should be tracked at status.ubuntu.com sooner than later
[11:14] <elfy> so I could in effect change Look at UTAH testing with balloons: TODO from you to me
[11:14] <knome> well, i already changed that item
[11:14] <knome> refreshed
[11:15] <knome> i was thinking to do that @ UDS, but that didn't work out
[11:15] <elfy> yea - see the changes
[11:16] <knome> there seems to be a lot of partly overlapping work items
[11:16] <knome> change as you see fit, and feel free to do that along the way too
[11:16] <elfy> ok
[11:16] <knome> it's a way to track progress, but it's also a very useful tool for assignees
[11:16] <knome> to keep track what they need to do
[11:17] <elfy> yea - done properly all will know what everyone is up to
[11:17] <elfy> I can see the usefulness in that :)
[11:17] <knome> yeah, and it's easier to track what's actually left to do
[11:17] <elfy> :)
[11:17] <smartboyhw> I like status.ubuntu.com
[11:17] <smartboyhw> It shows you the progress:D
[11:18] <knome> it's only directional though, not all work items are "worth" the same
[11:18]  * smartboyhw realizes that the Xubuntu and Studio blueprint are not at the page
[11:18] <elfy> anyone know if there is an easy way to filter 'our' new bugs with LP
[11:18] <elfy> or am I hoping for a good summer
[11:18]  * elfy hates searching Launchpad
[11:19] <knome> elfy, you probably should ask mr_pouit/micahg for lp-fu tips
[11:19] <elfy> ok - I will then :)
[11:19] <knome> they'll hate me for telling you to do so, but oh well
[11:19] <knome> ;)
[11:19] <elfy> ha ha ha
[11:19] <elfy> on a completely unrelated note - do you know what the html code is for xubuntu blue?
[11:20] <knome> i do
[11:20] <knome> http://xubuntu.org/marketingresources/
[11:20] <knome> #04a
[11:20] <knome> or, #0044aa
[11:21] <knome> you know, sleeving cards kind of sucks
[11:21] <knome> but unsleeving - oh man, this is unbearable
[11:21] <elfy> excellent - there's only one person on the forum with user title in xubuntu blue :) http://ubuntuforums.org/member.php?u=610428
[11:21] <knome> hehe
[11:21] <smartboyhw> elfy, LOL
[11:22] <elfy> smartboyhw: no you can't before you ask - admin privilege :D
[11:22] <smartboyhw> elfy, grrr.
[11:23] <elfy> knome: right - thanks for that - I am a bit clearer in my head now
[11:23] <knome> no problem
[11:23] <knome> just ask if you have more questions
[11:24] <elfy> knome: only other thing is to let you know that I am week on week off at work - so 2 weeks in 4 I am about - but less so
[11:24] <elfy> but it's a funny week - starts on a Thursday
[11:24] <knome> yeah, np :)
[11:25] <elfy> I realise everyone else works as well - but last cycle I was about more or less constantly, just thought I should give you heads up on that
[11:25] <knome> yeah, not a problem at all. if there's longer periods when you can't do anything, just tell people (as soon as you know), and we'll get stuff done
[11:25] <smartboyhw> elfy, I forgotten: In last cycle when did you appointed QA contact ?
[11:26] <elfy> knome: yep
[11:26] <elfy> at the end smartboyhw
[11:26] <smartboyhw> elfy, yeah so last cycle more or less constantly isn't a big problem compared to this one then I think
[11:27] <elfy> ?
[11:27] <smartboyhw> elfy, you said last cycle you weren't about that much right?
[11:27] <elfy> no - completely the opposite :)
[11:28] <smartboyhw> elfy, then please decode "last cycle I was about more or less constantly".......
[11:28] <elfy> cheers knome - bacon sarnie time for me now I think - and more tea :)
[11:28] <knome> hehe, again, np. and bon appetit :)
[11:28] <elfy> more or less - means mostly all the time smartboyhw :)
[11:29] <elfy> this cycle will be less constantly than last
[11:29] <smartboyhw> elfy, oh OK since you have work now:D
[11:29] <elfy> yea :)
[11:29] <knome> probably the same for me, at least at the end of the cycle..
[11:30] <smartboyhw> knome, the end of it? Meaning like, March 2013?
[11:30] <knome> next year
[11:31] <smartboyhw> Gee that is bad then
[11:31] <knome> i'll take care i'll be around when needed
[11:32] <knome> but generally people should take more responsibility of their assigned items
[11:32] <knome> i'm not needed to micro-manage everything
[11:32] <elfy> +1
[11:32] <smartboyhw> Yeah volunteer projects are like that...You may be more busy when you thought you weren't
[11:32] <smartboyhw> knome, +10000000000000000
[11:59] <ochosi> mr_pouit, micahg: there have been various bugreports (and i've been able to confirm that myself) with e.g. app-icons not rescaling in gtk-menus. there are issues with e.g. picasa, jabref, scilab, tgif etc. i'm wondering whether this could be a general gtk2 issue, as i don't see anything xfce-specific in this problem. thoughts? (it looks like this btw: http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-11152012-023047am.php )
[11:59] <ochosi> not sure there are real bugreports on lp about that yet tbh, but at least i've read about it in #xubuntu
[12:00] <astraljava> knome: You may not be _needed_, but IT'S ALWAYS GOOD TO KNOW SOMEONE CARES!!!!11one
[12:01] <knome> we should really take the social stuff to -offtopic
[12:01] <knome> just saying... :)
[15:41] <mr_pouit> ochosi: Bug #1066591 already reported (but it only occurs with xpm icons)
[15:42] <ochosi> hm, ok, well good to know
[15:42] <ochosi> it's really weird that people still ship xpm icons
[15:42] <ochosi> i mean i can see why it's useful in xfwm4
[15:42] <ochosi> but for app-icons...
[15:44] <mr_pouit> anyway, that's very low on my "mmh, I'm bored let's look into this" list
[15:45] <GridCube> this bug has been reported many times this week
[15:45] <GridCube> at least twice in my watch
[15:49] <ochosi> mr_pouit: yeah, actually andrzej also pointed me to it. but yeah, imo app-maintainers should simply ship icons in a less deprecated format...
[15:58] <mr_pouit> yeah, I've no idea who's at fault here, gdk-pixbuf maybe
[22:49] <pleia2> we need to finish our FAQ :\
[22:49] <knome> yeah
[22:50] <knome> i just hit my toenail and it's about to come out sooner or later
[22:50] <knome> :/
[22:50] <pleia2> ew
[22:50] <knome> yes, IT HURT.
[22:50] <knome> anyway, yeah
[22:50] <pleia2> Q: Why does knome's toe hurt? A: Click here for pictures
[22:50] <knome> no replies in the mailing list :<
[22:50] <knome> eww! :D
[22:51] <pleia2> hehe
[22:51] <pleia2> we can include the release notes errata
[22:51] <knome> :)
[22:53] <GridCube> :( i'm sorry
[22:53] <knome> GridCube, it's not your fault people aren't helping
[22:53] <GridCube> we can add a question about the xpm icons issue though
[22:54] <GridCube> and if xfce supports gtk3, thats a fairly usual question, i mean, as questions go
[22:54] <knome> anything works for me
[23:22] <Unit193> Where is the Xubuntu rum stored?
[23:23] <knome> rum?
[23:24] <Unit193> For the FAQs, I'm sure that's a good question.  Alacarte should be fixed, thunar should be too, xfdesktop...
[23:24] <knome> :P
[23:24] <Unit193> (At least, so says -proposed)


[00:07] <Bauer1> huh, interesting.. well if its the same "behaviour" on other distros as well, not 13.04 specific problem then.. like I said not used to this behaviour in linux partitions
[01:13] <bandit-led> any one seeing kernel 3.8 breaking console on laptops?
[01:16] <bandit-led> i am finding bug reports on fedora but not ubuntu
[01:20] <bandit-led> https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?pid=1241071
[01:32] <bjorkintosh> so i succesfully run 13.04 on my machine till i got the latest updates.
[01:33] <bjorkintosh> now my machine refuses to boot. at all.
[01:33] <bekks> bandit-led: 3.8 worked fine, so does 3.9rc1
[01:33] <bandit-led> bekks,  well crap i dont want to biscet this back to 3.7
[01:33] <bandit-led> bisect'
[01:34] <bjorkintosh> what is bisect?
[01:34] <bandit-led> its working great on my desktop but the laptop is broken with any-thing other than 3.7's
[01:34] <bandit-led> bjorkintosh,  its building the kernel looking for a bug
[01:35] <alankila> bjorkintosh: bisection is the process of finding a point in a line by dividing it to two at the middle and then testing whether a condition is true at that point, an recursing to the remaining section
[01:35] <bandit-led> any time i switch to console or logout with any of the 3.8's it blackscreens and wont come back
[01:35] <bekks> bandit-led: It is rolling back each single git commit until the bug doesnt occur anymore.
[01:35] <bjorkintosh> are there any known issues? mine booted just fine until 3.9
[01:35] <bjorkintosh> alankila, hehe. thanks.
[01:35] <alankila> bjorkintosh: in case of git, you look for the change that broke stuff by starting at a commit in the middle and testing if the kernel is broke or not
[01:36] <bekks> btree stuff.
[01:36] <bandit-led> must be a laptop specific thing
[01:36] <bjorkintosh> i suspect it has to do with the graphics card.
[01:36] <bandit-led> maybe i will build 3.9rc1 and see if that works
[01:36] <bjorkintosh> bandit-led, what sort of gfx card was it?
[01:36] <bjorkintosh> or laptop?
[01:36] <bandit-led> tits a nvidia geforce 7300go
[01:36] <bjorkintosh> mine's a samsung.
[01:37] <bandit-led> 6 year old card
[01:37] <bjorkintosh> ah. i think it's an nvidia i have as well.
[01:38] <bandit-led> maybe when 13.04 is out we find more bug reports :)
[01:38] <bjorkintosh> till then, what's my best option for recovering from this snafu?
[01:38] <bandit-led> you getting any errors?
[01:38] <bjorkintosh> nope. just the capslock key blinking.
[01:39] <bjorkintosh> err. light, not key.
[01:39] <bjorkintosh> ah wait. i see something.
[01:39] <alankila> hmm I got update to nvidia-310. Does that mean I can't boot now?
[01:39] <bandit-led> bjorkintosh,  thats a kernel panic
[01:39] <bjorkintosh> kernel panic - not syncing: VFS Unable to mount root fs on unknown block(0,0)
[01:40] <bjorkintosh> i get that with the 3.9, which worked just fine.
[01:40] <bekks> bjorkintosh: Then you forgot to build the device driver you need.
[01:40] <bjorkintosh> i don't get that with 3.11, which was what i was rebooting to. after that, it does nothing.
[01:40] <bekks> 3.11 --whats that?
[01:40] <bjorkintosh> sorry. the kernel.
[01:40] <bjorkintosh> 3.8.something.11
[01:41] <bandit-led> <IP_ADDRESS>
[01:41] <bekks> There is no <IP_ADDRESS> at kernel.org :)
[01:41] <bandit-led> 3.8.0-11'
[01:41] <bekks> ah. 3.8.0 build #11
[01:41] <bjorkintosh> correct.
[01:42] <bandit-led> i was confused for a second when he said 3.9
[01:42] <bjorkintosh> typically, it's able to recover gracefully by using an older build. but none of them are working.
[01:42] <bekks> 3.11 was confusing too:P
[01:42] <bjorkintosh> sorry.
[01:42] <bjorkintosh> never had a problem with ubuntu+1, till now.
[01:43] <bandit-led> i have never had this many problems with +1 until this release cycle
[01:43] <bandit-led> bjorkintosh, hope you get some help figuring it out
[01:44] <shann> hi i found little bug in raring
[01:44] <shann> when start firefox in large screen at right a litte band appear
[01:49] <shann> http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/9145/littleband.png screensaver
[01:50] <shann> in quantal no problems
[01:51] <shann> when resize dash, the window automatically resize correctly but i close and reopen the window, the bug again.
[02:08] <raccarti> Where did http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=ntfsprogs go in raring?
[02:15] <IdleOne> ntfs-3g
[02:16] <IdleOne> !info ntfs-3g
[02:16] <raccarti> Already installed. But partitionmanager won't format in NTFS.
[02:16] <IdleOne> hmm, that i don't know about, sorry.
[02:17] <raccarti> In quantal it needed ntfsprogs to do so. And http://packages.ubuntu.com/raring/partitionmanager actually lists the "Package not available" ntfsprogs as a suggested dependency even in raring.
[02:18] <IdleOne> !info ntfs-config
[02:18] <IdleOne> could that be what you need?
[02:18] <IdleOne> I'm taking shots in the dark here to be honest
[02:18] <raccarti> Could be. Worth a try.
[02:21] <raccarti> Ah, no, it's a little GUI tool which has options to "Enable write support for external device" and "Enable write support for internal device". partitionmanager doesn't care either way.
[02:22] <IdleOne> I tried
[02:22] <IdleOne> :/
[02:22] <raccarti> Yeah, thanks for the suggestion anyway.
[02:22] <raccarti> Looked reasonable.
[02:23] <dr_willis> ntgs-config can be problematic at times..
[02:24] <raccarti> I'll admit to not being totally certain why one would want to use it.
[02:25] <dr_willis> it creates fstab entries fir your ntfs partitions and can tweak the udev rules
[02:25] <raccarti> Oh, for dual-booters.
[02:25] <dr_willis> it normally works.. but can fail to exit. and have other weird errors/bugs
[02:26] <dr_willis> or for people with usb flash in ntgs/vfat
[02:26] <raccarti> Well the fstab part won't matter. I guess udev does
[02:27] <raccarti> But, it mostly seems odd to go through that effort and restrict it to ntfs (and it does vfat too? it doesn't obviously indicate that). The fstab parsing and the udev update logic is basically identical for any of these FSes
[02:27] <dr_willis> it does vfat
[02:28] <dr_willis> and ntfs
[02:30] <raccarti> Any idea about ntfsprogs or otherwise formatting NTFS on raring?
[02:31] <IdleOne> from the description of partitionmanager it says "Note that to gain support for a
[02:31] <IdleOne>  specific file system other than ext2/3/4, you should install the corresponding suggested package."
[02:32] <IdleOne> make sure you have all the suggested packages installed
[02:32] <raccarti> Yes; and the suggested package for ntfs is apparently ntfsprogs. I linked to http://packages.ubuntu.com/raring/partitionmanager above
[02:32] <IdleOne> ah.
[02:32] <IdleOne> !search ntfsprogs
[02:33] <IdleOne> helpful indeed
[02:33] <raccarti> http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=ntfsprogs says it exists right through quantal.
[02:34] <IdleOne> either it has been dropped (which I doubt) or it is a bug.
[02:37] <trism> raccarti: ntfsprogs is empty in quantal, it's just transitional for ntfs-3g
[02:39] <raccarti> Okay. So is the best way to persuade raring's partitionmanager to format NTFS to install quantal's empty transitional ntfsprogs?
[02:39] <IdleOne> So the question is why doesn't partitionmanager let him format to ntfs?
[02:39] <raccarti> If it's empty, it at least can't do any harm.
[02:41] <raccarti> dpkg says: "ii  ntfs-3g               1:2013.1.13-1+0 amd64           read/write NTFS driver for FUSE"
[02:42] <raccarti> And it indeed contains /sbin/{mmkntfs,mkfs.ntfs}
[02:42] <raccarti> So what is the actual indicator that partitionmanager is checking for that I need to fool it?
[02:49] <raccarti> Ah, installing quantal's ntfsprogs does not suffice. And indeed it's just two files in /usr/share/doc anyway: http://packages.ubuntu.com/quantal/all/ntfsprogs/filelist
[02:54] <trism> raccarti: looking at the code it checks for ntfsresize, ntfslabel, mkfs.ntfs, ntfsclone, dd, and blkid, you aren't missing any of those are you?
[02:56] <raccarti> Oh. Wtf. It's a dangling symlink: /sbin/mkfs.ntfs -> /usr/sbin/mkntfs
[02:57] <raccarti> Rest exist.
[02:57] <raccarti> However /sbin/mkntfs does exist.
[02:58] <raccarti> So it's pointing the wrong place. Just a moment, trying to hook up this symlink system...
[02:59] <raccarti> And that does it. Created a symlink in /usr/sbin to /sbin/mkntfs
[02:59] <raccarti> Works.
[03:03] <raccarti> So: (1) ntfs-3g sets up its symlink incorrectly; and (2) partitionmanager should replace ntfsprogs with ntfs-3g as a suggested dependency.
[03:07] <trism> raccarti: bug 1148541 for (1) it seems
[03:09] <raccarti> Ah, well, at least it's already been spotted and filed.
[03:09] <raccarti> (2) is less important since ntfs-3g's a default install anyway.
[03:14] <bcbc2> Anyone else have their brightness Fn-Keys stop working and backlight off after resume from suspend? I'm running a Dell N4010 with intel GPU? bug 1105604
[03:19] <psusi> is it just me or is the raring-server-amd64.iso daily image completely fscking broken?  trying to run it under a vm and it can't find the cdrom no matter what I do, even when I manaully mount it in /cdrom on the other tty
[03:20] <alankila> bcbc2: happens to me on nvidia gpu
[03:22] <bcbc2> alankila: it's been over a month now... wondering if I was alone ;) Good to know I'm not
[03:22] <bcbc2> not sure if the devs are aware of it though
[03:23] <alankila> while it would be convenient to have that work, I'm merely grateful about the fact that suspend and resume actually works
[03:23] <alankila> I think there was a 10 year period where it never worked on any linux laptop I had, so it's small beans that I can't change brightness now
[03:24] <bcbc2> fair enough. but the dev releases have been pretty good since precise. And when the same thing happened there it was fixed very promptly.
[03:25] <bcbc2> also having the backlight now off after suspend, you have to blind type to get the brightness up again.
[03:26] <alankila> oh? for me it picks the brightness setting I left when I went for suspend
[03:26] <alankila> it just doesn't change it afterwards
[03:27] <bcbc2> it just started blacking out the past couple of weeks. before that there was no difference after suspend
[03:28] <bcbc2> my fn brightness keys don't work so I have to echo | tee the brightness in manually
[03:28] <bjorkintosh> i discovered a possible reason for which 13.04 is not booting on my machine.
[03:28] <bjorkintosh> my /boot is empty!
[03:36] <psusi> bjorkintosh, that would be a problem ;)
[03:39] <dr_willis> boot got the  boot!
[03:46] <bjorkintosh> something to do with grub, perhaps?
[03:47] <psusi> did you try to set up a separate /boot when you installed or something?
[03:47] <bjorkintosh> no. it has always been separate.
[03:47] <bjorkintosh> perhaps i should just edit fstab
[03:48] <psusi> umm.. so you did manual partitioning and told it to use a separate /boot?
[03:48] <bjorkintosh> no. all of this was done automatically with 12.04 when i installed it last year. never asked for a separate /boot
[03:48] <psusi> then you don't have one
[03:49] <bjorkintosh> i don't have one what?
[03:49] <psusi> in which case, it shouldn't be possible for it to be empty... installing has to put a kernel in there at least
[03:49] <psusi> ./boot
[03:49] <psusi> partition that is
[03:49] <bjorkintosh> i do. /dev/sda2
[03:49] <bjorkintosh> it is just not in /etc/fstab for some reason.
[03:50] <psusi> well. if you chose manual partitioning and created one, it should have been added to /etc/fstab
[03:51] <bjorkintosh> wow. it even discarded all the settings for my display.
[03:51] <bjorkintosh> this was rough.
[04:25] <MoPac> Hi all - I'm really suffering from bugs in 12.10 with workspace management, particularly breakage of edge scrolling and the OS's amnesia about my custom keyboard shortcuts.  I'm hoping to get a sense of the resolution of these issues in Ringtail
[04:25] <MoPac> (e.g., https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/964270 as one example)
[04:26] <MoPac> And if it's working smoothly in Ringtail, are there serious problems I need to look out for in upgrading now?
[04:29] <dr_willis> hmm.. i dident notivce edge scrolling working earlier today.. dident pay  much attention to it. i tend to use the move to destop type menu items
[04:31] <MoPac> dr_willis: At the moment in 12.10, my workspace management is basically unusable. My keyboard shortcuts get forgotten, edge scrolling stops working after one scroll until I move manually....  Since Devilspie's workspace/viewport setting function appears broken, I depend on an xdotool script to engage my keyboard shortcut before window opening.  With the shortcut forgotten, it breaks
[04:31] <MoPac> So a ringtail is looking appetizing if this compiz/unity workspace stuff is fixed there
[04:32] <MoPac> sorry, edge scrolling was a brain fart on my part
[04:32] <MoPac> I mean edge flipping
[04:56] <bcbc2> does anyone else get the corrupted desktop where an image of old open windows remain frozen? This happens both on 12.10 and 13.04. bug 1067580
[05:00] <bcbc2> I doubt whether I filed the bug against the right package. But there's one with no response after 5 months and still happening.
[05:01] <bcbc2> still it's more a minor irritation - sometimes I click on stuff and wonder why nothing happens, and then realise I closed the windows already :)
[05:04] <bcbc2> but on the plus side, the new swirly ubuntu icon in the launcher is really cool :P
[05:20] <dr_willis> really when i upgraded to 13.04 i dident notice much of a change. ;) guess it is still using  my old themes/settings..  i did notice  the icon was differnt. other  then that.. not much else.
[05:20] <dr_willis> except  window-quicklists
[05:20] <dr_willis> was the radio  lens in 12.04?  :) i  noticed it in 13.04 -
[05:36] <bjorkintosh> i sorta fixed my issue.
[05:41] <bcbc2> they also removed the multiple desktops by default if I recall correctly and I saw the other day that the desktop switcher was animated. All minor stuff. Actually I prefer that there is no major UI changes because it makes all the guides obsolete and you need screenshots by release.
[08:38] <user82> hello. daily builds for today should arrive in around 6 hours i suppose?
[08:38] <user82> somewhat 9am?
[08:41] <smartboyhw> user82, why don't you use the latest daily build and upgrade to the latest packages?
[08:42] <user82> smartboyhw i want to set up a usb stick once that then does not get connected to the internet again. it is kind of special porpose it is only there to run a app on my neigbpurs pc and nothing else
[08:42] <user82> and since i g2g now anyway i will start the download later
[08:42] <smartboyhw> user82, well then can't the app run on 12.10 or 12.04.2?
[08:43] <user82> smartboyhw it is a brand new mac with thunderbolt...iirc the support is under heavy development and *should* be better with linux 3.8
[08:43] <smartboyhw> user82, OK. Just use the latest daily build then
[08:43] <user82> i will try it at least
[08:45] <user82> (it might get messy with a retina display over thunderbolt anyway ;) )
[10:56] <tux_> anyone running mir ? https://launchpad.net/~mir-team/+archive/staging
[11:22] <smartboyhw> tux_, not me at least
[11:26] <rohdef> I've been trying to install 13.04, but the installer seems to freeze at drive setup, what can I do?
[11:28] <alankila> rohdef: I've quit the installer and relaunched it. Doing this few times helped.
[11:28] <alankila> Also you can install ubuntu-server and then just install ubuntu-desktop
[11:28] <alankila> provided you have networking that the server install can cope with. Wireless drivers appear to not be featured on the server disk, sadly
[11:29] <alankila> I generally start my ubuntus from the server install because it's text based, over quicker, and more likely to work
[11:29] <alankila> for instance on a macbook air, the official desktop installer gives me nouveau, and it is so broken it is a miracle if the OS hangs together long enough to finish installation so you can install nvidia driver instead
[11:30] <alankila> with nouveau even gnome terminal just gave me multicolored squares instead of glyphs. :-/
[11:36] <rohdef> alankila, hmm will consider the server option, although I'll try to relaunch installer a few times
[11:36] <rohdef> alankila, do you know if usb modems work on server?
[11:36] <alankila> no
[11:36] <alankila> I doubt it
[11:36] <rohdef> I only have wifi and cell phone access atm
[11:36] <alankila> it's very much wired networking kind of thing
[11:36] <rohdef> blast
[11:37] <alankila> though with ubuntu server I was able to connect the macbook's broadcom wireless by manually writing a wpa_supplicant conf
[11:37] <alankila> so that was doable at least
[11:37] <alankila> so anyway it might or might not work. You should examine the package lists of the server disk and see if it has the stuff you think you need
[11:37] <rohdef> alankila, could do that although I recall wpa_supplicant as a pain
[11:37] <alankila> and you have to configure it without network manager or such things
[11:38] <rohdef> well I've done a lot of manual network setups through time, but not many with wifi, I used to use gentoo ;)
[11:40] <alankila> but yeah it's kinda disappointing that the installer is right now sort of broken
[11:41] <alankila> and it probably has a good reason why it's broken, and I suspect it has something to do with a disk scan. It likely looks for something that only terminates after a long timeout
[11:41] <alankila> on the other hand installers have been broken recently a lot. I remember hearing that fedora's new gui installer is totally idiotic as well
[11:42] <alankila> so the rule of thumb is that these things are hard to do and they have difficult minefield of problems to solve. In case of Fedora it was just some UI designer given free reign and these people rarely seem to know what they are doing, I guess.
[11:43] <alankila> disappointing given that linux could just run on microsoft's coattails and clone their installer step by step. Microsoft has likely spent a lot of money making sure most normal people can work it out.
[11:43] <rohdef> perhaps, I'll give it a few retries then
[11:43] <rohdef> well I think there's a bit more complexity in writing a *nix installer if it's to behave nicely
[11:44] <rohdef> Windows hardly care about dual boot for instance
[11:44] <alankila> I argue neither should Linux. But I already live in the world where you go buy linux laptops from the shops
[11:45] <alankila> in any case if you don't trash the partition, grub can pick it up and it's not really a problem. ntfs resize seems to work and all that. Minimal steps to support windows are possible and have in fact been done for a long time.
[11:45] <rohdef> and Linux-users for instance don't like to be forced to ext4, they want the choise between raiser, ext2-4 and whatever there is
[11:45] <rohdef> they should, dual boot is important, that's also part of why mac had a lot of success switching to Intel
[11:45] <rohdef> they can't ignore windows
[11:45] <alankila> Possible, though ubuntu's style is to just go with ext4 unless you do the whole setup manually
[11:46] <alankila> I installed with ext4 and used btrfs-convert to go with btrfs myself now.
[11:46] <rohdef> true, I like that way of doing it, because crazies like me can do manual setups, and rest can do default
[11:47] <alankila> yes, nothing wrong with that... though I do think that current linux desktop userbase can probably be ignored if it means improved mainstream acceptability
[11:48] <alankila> after all, current userbase is < 2 %, and while it has developers and such people, you don't need them if you can sell a linux product and hire your own developers to work with it. And if you reach something like OS X penetration -- around 10 % world wide, I guess -- then you are doing very well relative to other linux distributions
[11:49] <alankila> it should be doable, but it takes cash. I hoped Canonical could be the party doing this, and it sounds like shuttleworth understands this, but his way of getting there sucks.
[11:49] <alankila> so I guess we end up running something Google-originated unless Canonical is very lucky with these new innovations.
[11:50] <alankila> chromeos could be a mortal threat to all other linux distributions out there if it works well enough for regular people.
[11:51] <alankila> just like OS X sucked in almost all the people who wanted a functioning unix desktop
[11:51] <rohdef> well to be quite honest one of the reasons I think Linux don't get through is partly due to how much people like GTK+/Gnome, as far as I see it that's also part of why unity was made, to patch up the broken product
[11:53] <rohdef> I've seen a lot of patchwork projects to try and "fix" the problems with Gnome/GTK+ where I've been thinking, if all that work was put in KDE they'd come so much further :(
[11:53] <alankila> if someone took KDE and ripped out all the crap in it, that would be great
[11:53] <alankila> unity might be the KDE without the crap.
[11:54] <alankila> after all, they plan to rewrite it on top of Qt/QML, and KDE itself is trying to avoid "libkde", they want to make their applications just Qt applications as much as possible
[11:55] <alankila> so there's a kind of convergence on the horizon. Unfortunately I disagree with the UI choices that KDE people make, they have a lot of the "linux is about choice" mantra stuck in their heads, and they try to cater to everybody and do everything concurrently...
[11:55] <alankila> KDE can almost be configured to look and act nice. Almost. But I ended up uninstalling it today, because I run into bugs in it constantly.
[11:56] <alankila> and all I do is run a fullscreen terminal and fullscreen browser. It takes some effort to make that user experience suck.
[12:04] <alankila> So ... I'll check out how gnome 3 is next. I really hope they fixed the fullscreen windows being obscured by the gnome 3 top bar and stuff like that bugs that I ran into last time.
[12:14] <rohdef> alankila, hope they have, will also have to look at Gnome 3 at some point :)
[12:15] <alankila> It's kinda painful to switch between desktop environments... these things leave so many packages behind
[12:16] <alankila> if you want a clean install you'll debfoster the ubuntu-desktop (say) out first and only when you think everything has been removed, can you install something else
[12:17] <alankila> and if you configured lightdm to autologin into some environment, it's too stupid to notice that environment doesn't exist anymore
[12:17] <alankila> X flashes on and then dies
[12:17] <alankila> so many rough edges :-/
[12:20] <rohdef> agreed
[14:33] <BluesKaj> Howdy all
[17:15] <skulltip> what 10" tablet is recommended for ubuntu
[17:15] <IdleOne> !touch
[17:16] <skulltip> thanks
[17:22] <skulltip> i take it i can update the tablet after installed using apt-get update and upgrade?
[17:39] <MoPac> Howdy all.  An in -place upgrade from quantal to raring has broken my system, and I'm hoping for advice on how to repair from a live quantal live USB, which I'm using now
[17:41] <MoPac> The x server never seems to have started under the upgrade -- I was able to log in a few times, but there was no ability to move windows.  I updated al packages and the kernel.  I also ran update-manager -d a couple times and followed its restart instructions
[17:42] <MoPac> But now, when I get to the login screen (at a bizarre resolution because the system can't seem to handle my display), entering my password just results in a brief flash to a full-screen terminal and then cycles back to the account login screen -- no way in
[17:43] <MoPac> Booting in safe mode seems to stop as soon as it reaches some mapped network drives that are in my fstab.  They connection attempts to them exit with code 32, and then nothing else happens
[17:44] <MoPac> *safe mode / recovery mode
[19:15] <ovidius2> hi. is this the right place for questions about kubuntu+1, too?
[19:16] <trism> ovidius2: it is, lots of kubuntu users here (not me though)
[19:17] <ovidius2> trism: thanks.
[19:20] <ovidius2> i did an update on my laptop from 12.10 to 13.04 yesterday and have two major issues.  first: networkmanager from kde does not work anymore. i need to start nm-applet to get wifi connections. is this a known problem?
[19:24] <yofel> define "does not work anymore" - crashes plasma, sees no interfaces, fails to connect, freezes, ...
[19:25] <ovidius2> yofel: sees interface, but no networks. nm-applet does everything fine. if i conect via nm-applet, kde nm widget shows me as connected as well
[19:27] <yofel> networkmanager puts its logs in /var/log/syslog. Maybe watching that while after disabling and enabling networking can tell what's wrong
[19:27] <yofel> -while
[19:28] <ovidius2> yofel: thanks. will try. and come back with results.
[19:46] <ovidius2> yofel: nothing strange to see there. the nerworkmanager widget for kde just does not show the list of wifi networks in reach. it is empty there
[19:46] <yofel> o.O
[19:46] <yofel> show more is empty too?
[20:07] <ovidius2> filled it as a bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/plasma-widget-networkmanagement/+bug/1153041
[20:08] <ovidius2> yofel. thanks again for your input
[20:09] <yofel> can you please at least attach /var/log/syslog to the bug?
[20:13] <ovidius2> yofel: yes. anything else that could be helpful?
[20:14] <yofel> ovidius2: actually, haven't tried this in a while, but run 'sudo apport-collect -p network-manager 1153041'
[20:21] <ovidius2> yofel: done.
[20:21] <yofel> oh, it worked, great
[20:21] <yofel> I think that should be all that could be useful
[20:24] <krabador> i want only know if software-properties-gtk will run in so many seconds, like today raring live
[20:45] <krabador> why software-properties-gtk on raring is so heavy to load?
[21:03] <omac> I tried ubuntu one to share some files the other day.  It's very nice.
[21:24] <krabador> omac: yes, really great
[22:54] <jtaylor> why does the new software updater have A in its symbol?
[22:55] <jtaylor> I can't figure out what that could stand for
[22:56] <jtaylor> Auto update?
[23:42] <penguin42> and what has B ?


[02:22] <mojtaba> .
[02:59] <webchat77> hello, i have some issues and havent find any solution online , do ubuntu have a help channel by any chance^
[02:59] <tomreyn> you are in it
[02:59] <teear> Yeah
[03:00] <teear> You need to go there
[03:03] <webchat77> oh nice, so here is my problem , yesterday i backed up all my config files on my cloud and did a fresh install , when i downloaded them back to get some of my old config back i have been able to extract them but they are "locked" aparently i dont have the permission to access them , i dont have the "rights" and permission is denied , those are rofi
[03:03] <webchat77> polybar and theme files and the likes
[03:04] <webchat77> i cant really figure out how to get them back and its a bit infuriating since it took me months to build them hehe
[03:04] <webchat77> any help would be very apreciated
[03:05] <webchat77> sorry for my english its not my mother thongue
[03:07] <webchat77> as an example i have a startpage that i use for brave browser , the index.html is extracted so the other related files but there is a orange lock on them , if i try to load it in the browser it says access denied
[03:09] <webchat77> its like if the files "belongs" to my previous install and cant be read on my new install since "i am not" the same root user
[03:13] <rfm> webchat77, that can happen, depending on exactly how you did the backup and restore.  You mention you can't access them in the browser.  Are these file: URLs or are you running a local webserver?
[03:13] <jhutchins> Time to hit the command line.
[03:14] <jhutchins> A wild guess says that the user who created the files is not the user who restored them, and there is an ownership issue.
[03:14] <jhutchins> webchat77: Do you have root access to your cloud system?
[03:14] <JoeBk> chown would fix ownership
[03:15] <webchat77> well for the startpage exemple the index and related files just sit in a folder called "my_startpage" in home/,config
[03:15] <webchat77> i literally drag and dropped the folder in protondrive , do a fresh install , and downloaded them back
[03:15] <jhutchins> webchat77: Examine the ownership of the files and directories.
[03:15] <webchat77> i just set the index and my homepage in my browser xd
[03:15] <webchat77> as my*
[03:16] <jhutchins> webchat77: Linux systems do not actually identify users by name, but index the corresponding number against a local list.  The name on one system may not match the same name on another.
[03:16] <webchat77> i have the same issue with all config file i >backed up> like rc.lua rofi.config etc
[03:17] <webchat77> heum
[03:19] <webchat77> if i right click properties on any file its greyd out and say owner root group root security context unknow , you are not the owner you cannot change the permission
[03:19] <webchat77> idk if it helps ..
[03:19] <webchat77> i will read on chom command joe mentioned
[03:19] <JoeBk> do you have root access to the system?
[03:19] <webchat77> yes
[03:20] <webchat77> i mean there is that sudo thing hehe
[03:20] <JoeBk> go into the root account and change ownership.
[03:20] <JoeBk> sudo works
[03:21] <JoeBk> use the chown command
[03:22] <webchat77> do i have to change permission on the folder only or all the files in them ?
[03:22] <webchat77> because they are all root read only etc
[03:23] <webchat77> i mean all the files in every folder are in the same state
[03:23] <webchat77> my configs folders i mean , not the rest of the /home
[03:23] <jhutchins> webchat77: We should really ask you to learn this yourself, because there's a lot more with it you need to know, but sudo chown -R <user>:<group> <target> is what you're looking for.  Understand that if you do that in the wrong place, you can wreck your system.
[03:24] <webchat77> i will go and read everything there is to know about this , thanks for showing me where to look for
[03:24] <jhutchins> Linux permissions and ownership is what you're looking for.
[03:27] <webchat77> is there anything i could do to avoid this situation in the future , i plan on backing up configs and formating quite often in the weeks to come , as i am actually learning and may eventually mess up my install, i often see peoples backing up configs on github? may it be a better solution for my need?
[03:29] <jhutchins> webchat77: What are you using for backup & for restore?
[03:31] <webchat77> well in fact i just save a copy of the config files in proton drive ( its a web cloud like dropbox )
[03:31] <webchat77> i dont use any backup and restore program for now as i dont know how to use them yet
[03:32] <webchat77> im quite new to linux
[03:32] <jhutchins> webchat77: Once you are comfortable with the chown command, and have maybe explored why the user ID numbers were different, it's trivial to just do that each time, as long as the ownership is consistent (as long as the whole file tree is the same).
[03:33] <jhutchins> webchat77: We were all new some time.
[03:45] <webchat77> i managed to solve my issue! Thanks for the help! Now im gonna read a little bit more on this command because i can see how usefull it can be hehe
[03:45] <JoeBk> type man chown
[04:25] <earthling__> should I get involved in local ubuntu groups?
[04:25] <earthling__> lugs?
[04:25] <earthling__> back to normal as pandemic winds down?
[04:27] <JoeBk> earthling__, Do you even have a local Ubuntu group?
[04:28] <earthling__> dunno, I'm in Florida,USA
[04:28] <earthling__> vaguely recall something many years ago
[04:28] <earthling__> in my state
[04:28] <earthling__> in your area?
[04:29] <JoeBk> The local group here has a chat channel, but it has been dead for a long time.
[04:29] <JoeBk> I'm on Philadelphia, PA
[04:30] <JoeBk> in
[04:31] <earthling__> I'm guessing NYC or Boston has many
[04:31] <earthling__> I should move to a cool city
[04:31] <JoeBk> search for a channel, they may have one.
[04:32] <earthling__> good idea
[04:33] <JoeBk> they may have a website too.  google it.
[04:34] <earthling__> btw philly has one on meetup.com
[04:35] <earthling__> though RMS hates meetup
[04:35] <earthling__> ehh looks like florida has ancient groups
[04:36] <earthling__> I don't like google that much
[04:37] <earthling__> prefer duckduckgo
[04:53] <JoeBk> earthling__, I should use duckduckgo more.
[04:53] <JoeBk> I should change the default search engine.
[04:57] <matsaman> much better default than Google, although duckduckgo is still a for-profit company and could go the same route whenever they want
[07:18] <rickbit-21> halo
[07:18] <luna> hi
[07:41] <mhe> hi all-i have a ssd 120G total i'd like two partitions made from the disk one that i can install Ubuntu on and another that will auto mount as a storage drive(partition2) how do i need to partition my disk will format it create an new partition table and two/three partitions one for os one for the storage drive if need be others for grub/swap/boot. can anyone tell me what i need eg primary extended swap os am a little unsure
[07:42] <mhe> that didnt work
[07:43] <mhe> can anyone help me re what my sdd should look like if i would like a partition for os, another for storage; what do i need for grub/bootpartition size and format; what do i need for swap (have 16Gram) 120G total size of my sdd
[07:46] <mhe> i was thinking 30G for Ubuntu ext4, ? for swap, ? for boot/grub/partition, ? the rest for the "storage partition" all ext4 yes no?
[07:47] <BASHitup> I don't know, but whatever it is you do, I recommend using zram instead of traditional swap
[07:47] <BASHitup> ... and I'm off to bed on that note. Read about zram
[07:48] <BASHitup> ... you'll have to set up zram after the install.
[07:48] <mhe> cheers
[07:49] <JoeBk> mhe, with 16G of ram you shouldn't much swap if any at all.  I have 16G and swap is never used.
[07:51] <mhe> yeah tbh i dont have the need for it either but i thought i'd see if i could notice any difference by allocating in the next clean install given i'll probably break it a few times b4 i am content
[07:51] <JoeBk> I just looked actially, I'm using 279 MB for swap. I don't know why it's using so much.
[07:51] <mhe> whats using it
[07:51] <mhe> htop
[07:52] <JoeBk> I dunno
[07:52] <mhe> can you see it with that
[07:52] <JoeBk> htop
[07:52] <JoeBk> oops
[07:54] <JoeBk> I don't see it.
[07:55] <JoeBk> htop shows it being use but I don't see what is using it.
[07:55] <mhe> lol blind leading the blind but did you run as sudo (warning not sure you should run it as sudo but wondering if it will be accurate without)
[07:57] <JoeBk> I ran it again root. still do see it.
[07:59] <JoeBk> I know the system runs fine without swap.
[08:00] <mhe> yeah
[08:00] <JoeBk> I search said I should run smem
[08:01] <mhe> had you heard about zram (i'd not)
[08:01] <JoeBk> I have no clue what zram is.
[08:02] <mhe> how many partitions do i need if i want to install os (can i just make two partitions of ext4 or do i need another for grub)
[08:02] <JoeBk> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zram
[08:03] <mhe> yeah had a read very cool will def be implementing
[08:03] <JoeBk> I never create partitons.  I let the system do it when installing.
[08:03] <alkisg> mhe: if you're installing under UEFI, you'll need one ESP partition of e.g. 1 GB. Otherwise you can use a single partition for everything else, to avoid frequent writes at the same place
[08:03] <mhe> thing is i want a storage partition
[08:03] <alkisg> Yeah let the installer do things automatically you don't need to get clever...
[08:03] <mhe> no its legacy bios
[08:03] <alkisg> What do you mean by "storage", is it the same as "/home" for you?
[08:04] <alkisg> You could e.g. reserve 50 GB for /, and the rest for /home
[08:04] <mhe> i'd like say a 50G partition of ext4 that i can store my files in regardless of whether i nuke the OS partition
[08:04] <JoeBk> why bother doing that?
[08:04] <alkisg> Note that you can reinstall without clearing /home
[08:05] <alkisg> You don't need a separate partition in order to be able to reinstall
[08:05] <alkisg> But anyway sure go for 50GB /, and 70GB /home (i.e. your "storage")
[08:05] <JoeBk> I just throw everything on one big partition.
[08:07] <mhe> sorry kids distracted me
[08:08] <mhe> do i need a partition of say 2MB or something small for grub or some boot time files?
[08:08] <JoeBk> mhe, how big is your drive?
[08:08] <alkisg> No
[08:08] <mhe> 120G
[08:08] <mhe> so id like the os the home the storage partition and if i need another please let me know
[08:08] <JoeBk> I never use anything smaller than 1TB.  hard drives are cheap nowadays.
[08:09] <mhe> rofl
[08:09] <mhe> =) no choice at present
[08:10] <alkisg> mhe: why 3 partitions? Why isn't /home the same as storage?
[08:11] <JoeBk> a 1TB hgst drive is 50USD
[08:11] <mhe> it can be tbh i dont care what i do care about is finding out what format and the number of partitions i need to make myself manually. I feel like i might need a small partition for grub is this wrong
[08:11] <mhe> good point actually
[08:12] <ducasse> mhe: you need an efi partition if you boot in uefi mode
[08:12] <mhe> i dont its bios
[08:12] <JoeBk> the installer makes the efi partition.
[08:12] <mhe> do i need anything special for bios
[08:12] <alkisg> No
[08:13] <JoeBk> you said you do bios boot?
[08:13] <JoeBk> My system won't do a bios boot and I hate UEFI.
[08:14] <mhe> so two ext4 partions will be sweet?  mount point is "/" for th "Os" & "/home" for the "home dir" ??
[08:14] <alkisg> Yes
[08:15] <mhe> thank you
[08:15] <mhe> JoeBk, yes that correct
[08:15] <mhe> *that
[08:15] <mhe> *that's
[08:15] <JoeBk> I have a 512MiB fat32 partition labeled /boot/efi
[08:16] <JoeBk> the rest is ext4
[08:16] <mhe> ima reboot n repartion homies until a little later ciao =) thanks for your help
[08:17] <mhe> yeah JoeBk but dont you run UEFI on your box. I run bios on my box.
[08:17] <JoeBk> I don't see the point partitioning.
[08:18] <JoeBk> mhe is that a laptop or a real computer?
[08:18] <mhe> i like to break my OS frequently, and given this i'd like to be able to reflash it easily
[08:18] <mhe> old pc
[08:18] <JoeBk> oh
[08:18] <JoeBk> you need to buy a hard drive.  better would be an SSD.
[08:19] <mhe> i need to buy an entire pc man but the price of chips n every thing else is bs atm (no value in the prices)
[08:20] <mhe> so ima hold out until i dont know we find some minerals on the moon and war accross the globe ends
[08:20] <mhe> i'll be waiting a few epochs i know
[09:15] <prestocaso[m]> hey everyone
[09:25] <prestocaso[m]> Is this the official Ubuntu IRC chat?
[09:26] <JoeBk> this is the support chanel
[09:28] <prestocaso[m]> Ok thanks I am connecting thru a Matrix connection thru Element and wasn't sure
[12:19] <ulgen> hi
[12:22] <wez> hi
[12:23] <ulgen> how are you
[12:25] <wez> OK. Trying to put the lil man to sleep
[12:25] <wez> He turn 2 in 35 mins
[12:27] <ulgen> wtf
[12:27] <wez> ulgen: ?
[12:29] <ulgen> why is no one talking
[12:30] <wez> I'm talking, I'm some one
[12:30] <wez> It's probably a timezone thing
[12:31] <ulgen> where are the others
[12:33] <wez> ulgen: Asleep
[12:33] <wez> Or raving
[12:33] <wez> It's 23:33 on a Sunday here
[12:35] <ulgen> here at 15:00
[12:35] <wez> oh nice
[12:36] <ulgen> yes
[13:23] <hey_bloke> well im stuck couldn't get my install to boot when i tried to install with multi partitions one for / one for /home
[13:24] <hey_bloke> any ideas ppl i have an old pc with bios so tried making an efi and a reserved for boot partition plus two more each primary (gpt)
[13:26] <hey_bloke> so far as i can tell i dont need an efi partition-thats only for uefi which i dont have so i should only need one partition for "reserved for bios-assume this is where bootloader is installed, but how big 1MB or 500MB?"
[13:28] <hey_bloke> and then i should have two ext4 partitons one primary and one extended, the former housing "/" and the latter /home. is this correct?
[13:35] <alkisg> hey_bloke: for BIOS, you only need a single / partition. If you want to use a separate home, then OK you can use 2 partitions
[13:35] <alkisg> You don't need a separate smaller partition for anything
[13:37] <hey_bloke> so if i make one ext4 primary and one ext4 extended and install onto / and /home im good to go in theory even with bios?
[13:37] <hey_bloke> sorry, install onto "/"
[13:38] <alkisg> You're good to go ONLY with BIOS. While if you had UEFI, you'd need an ESP partition
[13:38] <hey_bloke> primary being the os and extended being the /home
[13:38] <alkisg> (a fat32 partition to host the grub.efi binaries etc)
[13:38] <hey_bloke> how big
[13:38] <alkisg> Sure, either two primaries or one primary and one extended is fine
[13:38] <hey_bloke> fat32
[13:38] <alkisg> You don't have UEFI
[13:39] <hey_bloke> no i dont
[13:39] <alkisg> So you don't need it
[13:40] <hey_bloke> but when i look at what partitions are there using the installer it has made an efi system partition so im confused
[13:40] <alkisg> Didn't you say you created these manually?
[13:42] <hey_bloke> guided installation with seems to have three partitions one is 1MB another is 513MB fat32 and the third is ext4
[13:42] <alkisg> hey_bloke: what's the output of `sudo fdisk -l | nc termbin.com 9999`
[13:42] <alkisg> If you partitioned your disk using GPT when you're on BIOS, you might confuse the installer
[13:43] <hey_bloke> i have done that
[13:44] <hey_bloke> so re that confusion if i revert to the old format ms mbr or whatever will it fix that installer confusion
[13:46] <alkisg> Or use manual partitioning, since you already know what you want to do
[13:46] <hey_bloke> what you mean like Gparted or fdisk
[13:47] <hey_bloke> ?
[13:47] <alkisg> Or the installer itself, it has a "something else" option that lets you do manual formatting
[13:48] <alkisg> E.g. https://askubuntu.com/questions/343268/how-to-use-manual-partitioning-during-installation
[13:51] <hey_bloke> thank you thats perfect
[13:51] <hey_bloke> =)
[14:13] <BluesKaj> Hi folks
[14:32] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> Invite me to #programming
[14:32] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> asked this on #web
[14:33] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> nobody is there, stop bullying me irc
[14:34] <lotuspsychje> Ronalds_Mazitis_: this is also not the channel to vent such
[14:34] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> you or me or ubuntu
[14:35] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> I seriously gon flip shit if yall keep stupidity online
[14:35] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> it's not my fault \
[15:47] <Protocol2> Stupid question, how do I add a custom repository again?
[15:48] <KBar> Protocol2: `sudo add-apt-repository ppa:user/ppa-name`
[15:49] <Protocol2> Aaah thanks! I thought I copied it correctly but I missed a dash. Thanks!
[15:54] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> ThePendulum
[15:54] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> invite me to #programming
[15:54] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> i WANT TO PROGRAM UBUNTU
[15:54] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> libera chat
[15:57] <tomreyn> Ronalds_Mazitis_: please stop, this is not the topic of this channel, #ubuntu. final warning.
[15:57] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> I want to program ubuntu
[15:57] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> final warning
[15:57] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> this is topic about #ubuntu
[15:57] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> stop #lies
[15:57] <KBar> Ronalds_Mazitis_: join #ubuntu-dev
[15:57] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> there is only me there
[15:58] <Ronalds_Mazitis_> stop #lies again
[15:59] <KBar> tomreyn: thanks
[16:33] <Savage> hello there... I am a new linux user who still prefers the windows UI and i was wondering what customisation settings i could use to get as close to a windows look possible
[16:33] <Savage> im running linux mate by the way
[16:35] <jhutchins> Savage: There are a lot of ways to approach that, but you might consider learning what kinds of customizations and even defaults are available in Linux, finding out what you can do with it.
[16:35] <jhutchins> Savage: In other words, rather than finding ways to make it look and work like Windows, find out how to make it work for you.
[16:36] <jhutchins> Savage: What particular Windows features are you looking for?
[16:36] <Savage> ooh i see
[16:36] <Savage> that would be a more reasonable approach i suppose
[16:36] <Savage> thanks!
[17:10] <webchat83> good day
[17:12] <jhutchins> wez: Glad to hear it.
[17:14] <jhutchins> Hmmm... not so good that he stayed on line.
[17:16] <frost-core> so
[17:16] <frost-core> how do i know if i run uefi or efi?
[17:16] <frost-core> or are they just, THE same thing
[17:19] <jhutchins> frost-core: Strictly speaking, efi is a sub-set of uefi, but they're really the same thing, and nobody's careful about usage.
[17:20] <frost-core> i just want to see if there are any limitations with efi
[17:20] <frost-core> i currently run efi here
[17:20] <jhutchins> frost-core: "U" is for "universal", applied when the hardware it was designed for was expanded.
[17:20] <frost-core> also, i see that uefi has a nice gui
[17:20] <jhutchins> frost-core: It's pretty unlikely that you run efi on a system that's less than three racks.
[17:20] <frost-core> but efi does not
[17:20] <jhutchins> frost-core: The GUI is not standard.
[17:21] <jhutchins> frost-core: I'll bet that there are several thousand pages documenting the whole thing.
[17:21] <jhutchins> !efi
[17:29] <Maik> frost-core: you said you're on Arch, then why not ask there or over at #linux for general linux questions? You know this is a Ubuntu support channel
[17:29] <frost-core> Maik : this is my other pc
[17:30] <frost-core> i am now using it as normal
[17:30] <frost-core> its fine
[17:30] <Maik> you never mentioned having another PC.... but ok
[17:34] <JoeBk> I was just looing at the install stuff for ubuntu on the web.  I think they need to update the procedure for creating the flash drive to include Ventoy which is a much better way to create the bootable install drive.
[17:34] <JoeBk> looking*
[17:35] <jhutchins> JoeBk: You could create a page that lists tools to create bootable flash drives, with links to each and a brief description of what each one offers.
[17:36] <jhutchins> JoeBk: That page could then be linked to the install instructions, and could be maintained independently.
[18:19] <JoeBk> jhutchins, I don't do web stuff.  If I did I would get on it.
[18:21] <jhutchins> No reason not to take notes and poste them on blogger.com.
[18:22] <jhutchins> This stuff only works if everybody pitches in.
[18:55] <ednash> I am on Ubuntu 20.04 LTS and I want to switch to Ubuntu 21.10 _Minimal_
[18:56] <ednash> Can I do that without having to reformat and fresh install?
[18:56] <Maik> nope, at least not Minimal
[18:56] <ednash> ok
[18:57] <Maik> ednash: and why switch from LTS to non-LTS?
[18:57] <ednash> I found a few old packages
[18:57] <Maik> the next LTS release is around the corner, April 21st
[18:57] <ednash> Actually that's a good question
[18:57] <ednash> What gets updated if I stay on an LTS?
[18:57] <Maik> so i'd wait until then
[18:58] <ednash> Yeah... just read about that. I was trying to get ahead and see how the update process looks like
[18:58] <ednash> As I have today afternoon to tinker with
[18:58] <Maik> about "old" packages..
[18:59] <Maik> !latest
[18:59] <lotuspsychje> ednash could install 21.10 and let the install preserve his /home ?
[18:59] <ednash> So question - will Ubuntu 21.10 have newer packages than 20.04? With a six-months cycle, would it be a lot more fresh?
[18:59] <frost-core> hello guys
[18:59] <frost-core> i am running ubuntu 21.10 here
[18:59] <frost-core> i have an annoying issue
[19:00] <frost-core> when i press a number on my numberpad
[19:00] <Maik> ednash: it will have newer packages than 20.04
[19:00] <frost-core> it does not work
[19:00] <frost-core> but 2
[19:00] <Maik> but it's only supported until July
[19:00] <frost-core> is like down arrow
[19:00] <ednash> frost-core: did you try pressing the Numlock?
[19:00] <frost-core> oh
[19:01] <ednash> Maik: what is the process to upgrade when support ends?
[19:01] <ednash> is it difficult?
[19:01] <frost-core> there is no numlock key
[19:01] <frost-core> its like in delete key
[19:01] <ednash> or rather i should ask, does it require a fresh install?
[19:01] <frost-core> under it says num lock
[19:01] <Maik> how do you mean ednash?
[19:01] <ednash> frost-core: probably you are using a laptop? if it has an "Fn" key (usually lower left) try pressing Fn + Delete
[19:02] <Maik> you can upgrade in place or choose to do a fresh install
[19:02] <enigma9o7[m]> Sounds like a laptop, you probably have a Fn key.
[19:02] <frost-core> i have an fn key
[19:02] <frost-core> also im on laptop
[19:02] <ednash> Maik: oh cool i will update in place then
[19:02] <frost-core> thank you
[19:02] <frost-core> my issue is fixed
[19:02] <ednash> does updating in place just preserve all my packages, or also install new stuff that i don't have / didn't want (like say mail client etc.)
[19:03] <enigma9o7[m]> just updates packages you have, and their dependencies
[19:03] <ednash> nice! then i might just want to do that
[19:03] <ednash> don't see any downsides...?
[19:03] <ednash> except that i will have to upgrade
[19:03] <ednash> more frequently
[19:03] <ednash> (which is probably exactly what i want if i want newest packages)
[19:04] <ednash> e.g. cmake is years old
[19:04] <enigma9o7[m]> We're not that long away from the next LTS either...
[19:04] <lotuspsychje> ednash: snaps, !backports,..
[19:05] <ednash> yeah don't like snap that much. though that's what i'm using
[19:05] <ednash> it crowds lsblk with many loop devices
[19:05] <ednash> !backports
[19:06] <frost-core> also
[19:06] <frost-core> how do i get gestures in lxqt?
[19:06] <frost-core> im running 21.10 as said, and i upgraded
[19:07] <ednash> frost-core: You can use touchegg.
[19:07] <frost-core> ive heard of it
[19:07] <frost-core> but idk how to install it
[19:07] <frost-core> and configure
[19:07] <ednash> I'm reading this: https://askubuntu.com/questions/1140108/how-can-i-use-multitouch-gestures-under-lxqt-with-a-touchscreen
[19:07] <ednash> Installation instructions are here: https://github.com/JoseExposito/touchegg
[19:08] <ednash> Specifically for Ubuntu: https://github.com/JoseExposito/touchegg#ubuntu-debian-and-derivatives
[19:08] <ednash> You need to just type those 3 lines
[19:08] <ednash> on a console
[19:09] <ednash> Then it should just show up as a desktop GUI application, and you can configure it https://github.com/JoseExposito/touchegg#configuration
[19:09] <frost-core> oooh
[19:09] <frost-core> an issue
[19:09] <lotuspsychje> !info touchegg
[19:10] <lotuspsychje> its just on the repos ednash
[19:10] <frost-core> http://paste.debian.net/1232430/
[19:10] <ednash> yeah but the git says better install from there ppa
[19:10] <ednash> but frost-core i think it may be simpler to do what lotuspsychje says
[19:10] <ednash> just type this single line and you're done -
[19:11] <ednash> sudo apt install touchegg
[19:11] <ednash> ...on a console (it will ask for your password)
[19:11] <frost-core> yeah
[19:11] <frost-core> im not a new to linux user
[19:11] <frost-core> i already know that
[19:11] <ednash> oh my apologies
[19:12] <frost-core> dont worry,
[19:14] <frost-core> also,
[19:14] <frost-core> when running touchegg from terminal, nothing
[19:15] <ednash> may be i will hold out till the LTS update comes in April!
[19:15] <ednash> thank you enigma9o7[m] lotuspsychje Maik
[19:16] <lotuspsychje> ednash: adviced to wait till 22.04.1 releases to upgrade from 20.04
[19:18] <ednash_afk> lotuspsychje: what's 22.04.1? do you mean i should wait until all issues with 22.04 are hammered out and ignore the update prompt till then?
[19:18] <tomreyn> actually there will be no prompt until roughtly around the 22.04.1 release
[19:19] <tomreyn> (and LTS upgrades won't be supported until then)
[19:19] <tomreyn> 22.04.1 is the first "point release" after 22.04(.0)
[19:22] <tomreyn> frost-core: i did not follow the conversation, but if http://paste.debian.net/1232430/ is a problem you're currently facing, then this is a result of a (temporary?) server error/misconfiguration on the server providing the apt repository you were trying to configure. or the command you ran just could not work the way you did - but we don't know which command produced this output)
[19:42] <ednash> i see makes sens tomreyn
[19:43] <ednash> will those on non-LTS 21.10 also get the prompt to update to LTS 22.04.1
[19:44] <Maik> 21.10 is set to upgrade to every release
[19:44] <Maik> so it will prompt to 22.04
[19:44] <ednash> so yes then
[19:44] <ednash> oh i see
[19:44] <ednash> as i am planning to install steam, wondering if i should get on the 21.10
[19:45] <ednash> to avoid potential complications that can arise if i don't have up-to-date packages
[19:46] <Maik> but... if you don't change it in after the upgrade to 22.04 it will prompt you again when 22.10 comes out. However you can change it to upgrade to LTS releases only
[19:47] <lexar> and thats why when you freeze stuff the tension is higher and it starts to exhibit the same effects
[19:47] <ednash> thanks Maik sounds good
[19:47] <ednash> interesting... looks like nvidia driver is (nearly) the latest one even though i am on 20.04
[19:48] <ednash> probably it comes from a different PPA? i have 510.47.03
[19:48] <ednash> nvidia page says latest is 510.54, so probably not very far off
[19:51] <ednash> i wonder if dist upgrade is anything more than switching the default PPA for ubuntu and running an upgrade
[20:07] <alkisg> apt-get dist-upgrade is a simple upgrade of packages. Maybe you mean `do-release-upgrade` instead
[21:17] <Diagon> I have posted an SE question regarding /sys/firmware/efi/efivars/dump-* files, here: https://superuser.com/questions/1707250/uefi-variable-storage-removing-sys-firmware-efi-dump-files-when-kernel-variab
[21:18] <Diagon> "UEFI Variable Storage (removing /sys/firmware/efi dump files) when Kernel Variables CONFIG_EFIVAR_FS & CONFIG_EFI_VARS both =y as in Ubuntu 20.04"
[21:50] <tomreyn> Diagon: looks like a uefi firmware bug, look for a vendor upgrade
[22:04] <wez> jhutchins: I went to bed :)
[22:05] <wez> but I think you meant someone else and tab completed to me cause they left.
[22:10] <jhutchins> wez: Right.
[22:18] <wez> 👍


[03:18] <valorie> happy new year!
[03:18] <valorie> just back from the cabin where we welcomed it in
 Thank you and same to you.
 Happy new year all!
[21:35] <gsilvapt> Hello everyone
[21:35] <gsilvapt> I was catching up with your docs and seems some links are down here: https://phabricator.kde.org/w/kubuntu/getting_involved/
[21:35] <gsilvapt> Is there anywhere I can read more about the roles you are looking for? I know they all require Kubuntu membership but I'm curious
 I wonder if they were ever made since it seems it's waiting on KC approval.
 If someone can handle the social media a bit that would be good. I would imagine @RikMills could use the extra help with testing and packaging as well.
 gsilvapt
[21:37] <gsilvapt> hi, ahoneybun! Happy New Year! Long time no speak
 it doesn't really need kubuntu membership to some degree, at least getting started. Packaging on your own could use it for permissions.
 Long time indeed.
[21:38] <gsilvapt> Thanks for catching up. Yes, I'm interested in getting back to the game. I think spending some years in the industry may actually help me perform better
[21:38] <gsilvapt> But I admit I forgot the entire process in the meantime :sweat_smile:
[21:52] <valorie> those "vacant" roles are sort filled by people just stepping up and doing the work
[21:52] <valorie> gsilvapt: /j #kubuntu-council where we talk about non-packaging /coding work to be done, and planning for the future
[21:53] <gsilvapt> valorie, thanks but that might make sense after me getting back and being able to do some things on my own, don't you think?
[21:53] <valorie> sure
[21:53] <valorie> I mean
[21:54] <valorie> when I feel like tweeting something for kubuntu, I drop a word in teh chan and one of us does it
[21:54] <valorie> etc.
[21:54] <gsilvapt> I got it, thanks :)
[21:54] <valorie> we do miss Nate being the product manager
[21:54] <valorie> however, he's doing such great work we still get the benefit
[21:55] <valorie> in KDE
[21:57] <gsilvapt> I bet so
[21:57] <gsilvapt> For the time being, I just want to get back doing some packaging but I guess I have forgotten most things
[21:57] <gsilvapt> Hopefully things can escalate to bigger things
[22:11] <valorie> this channel and #ubuntu-flavors are where most of the packaging discussions happen
[22:13] <gsilvapt> Thansk for pointing it out
[23:08] <mparillo> And of particular interest to Kubuntu is #ubuntu-qt


[00:29] <ali1234> how do i get bzr to show the current revision of the working dir?
[00:29] <mwhudson> ali1234: bzr revno
[00:29] <vadi2> I updated to 0.100.0-2ubuntu2, wrote a really big commit log, it asked me whenever to commit with unknowns in the repo - I clicked yes, and the dialog froze. It's not accepting any clicks on yes or no buttons and is just sitting there.
[00:30] <vadi2> No errors in the terminal. Has anyone else experienced this?
[00:30] <vadi2> The only thing clickable is the X and it does nothing, the dialog doesn't go away.
[00:30] <ali1234> ok, given that i tried to bisect between 1363 and 1448, why is the working dir at 1455?
[00:30] <ali1234> (i am using bzr-bisect)
[00:31] <mwhudson> ah i guess bzr revno gives you the revno of the branch really
[00:31] <mwhudson> if you've used bzr revert or something that's just tree modifying, i don't know how you can find out which version corresponds to the current state
[00:31] <ali1234> well the current revision doesn't build so i need to move dorwards or backwards
[00:31] <ali1234> but i can't do that if i don't know the current revision
[00:32] <ali1234> and bzz bisect move needs an exact revision
[00:32] <ali1234> and yeah i gather it does use revert
[00:32] <mwhudson> i've not used bzr-bisect
[00:32] <mwhudson> you can probably use bzr revert -r $revno to move to a different revno though
[00:33] <ali1234> moving isn't the problem
[00:33] <ali1234> the problem is i need to move to $current_revno+1
[00:33] <ali1234> and i don't know $current_revno
[00:35] <ali1234> so how do you all usually do bisects?
[00:36] <ali1234> by hand?
[00:36] <fullermd> 'revno --tree' will tell you the base revno of the working tree.
[00:37] <fullermd> Of course, if you've flung things around with 'revert', you haven't changed the base revno, so that won't tell you anything.
[00:37] <ali1234> yeah, that also say 1455
[00:37] <fullermd> Yeah, I think bisect does that.  Annoying.  It really needs to be updated...
[00:39] <fullermd> Presumably the plugin stashes its current state somewhere; if you can dig that up, it should tell you.  You'd expect it to have a command for that too...
[00:44] <ali1234> it has bzr bisect log
[00:44] <ali1234> but that doesn't really tell you anything useful
[00:45] <ali1234> it prints <commiter>-<timestamp>-<hash> but not revno
[00:45] <ali1234> and only for the points you've already said yes or no to
[00:45] <fullermd> That's thre revid.
[00:46] <fullermd> You can look up the revno from that.
[00:46] <fullermd> First way that comes to mind is with log.  Various other probably more direct internally (if less simple/obvious interface-wise).
[00:47] <ali1234> but it doesn't tell me the current point anyway
[00:47] <ali1234> also "yes" and "no" are undefined
[00:47] <fullermd> (it's not really committer-timestamp-hash, it's opaque; just happens to be built that way.  And it's random data, not a hash anyway...)
[00:47] <ali1234> and if you get them the wrong way around it jumps to somewhere outside the range
[00:48] <ali1234> maybe i should just convert this to a git repository :)
[00:49] <fullermd> I've never touched the bisect plugin, so I don't know whether it stores its data in a particularly easy-to-read form.  Or where it is, for that matter.
[00:50] <fullermd> Probably either the root of the tree or somewhere under .bzr/.
[09:31] <MvG> jam: wrt https://code.launchpad.net/~gagern/bzr/bug483661-pull-bound-testcase/+merge/73147 : you quoted the relevant change yourself: I dropped the possible_transports kwarg. So what "actual changes" are you missing?
[14:50] <antivirtel> hello!
[14:51] <antivirtel> I'm using bzr-explorer on Ubuntu. How can I add a spell checker language? Which spell checking method is it using?
[15:02] <jelmer> antivirtel: hi
[15:02] <jelmer> antivirtel: I think it uses the Qt spell support
[15:03] <antivirtel> hmm, jelmer has it got a package?
[15:04] <jelmer> antivirtel: no idea, sorry. I haven't used it myself.
[15:06] <antivirtel> thanks, I google it
[23:40] <poolie> hi all
[23:46] <jelmer> g'morning poolie, did you have a good weekend?
[23:50] <poolie> great thanks
[23:50] <poolie> the superbike school was very fun
[23:50] <poolie> how are you?
[23:52] <jelmer> poolie: cool :) what's super about superbikes vs regular bikes?
[23:52] <poolie> :)
[23:53] <poolie> i think it's a bit of an anachronistic term
[23:53] <poolie> it means sporty production bikes as opposed to grand prix bikes
[23:53] <poolie> however, most people came on regular road-going bikes, as i did
[23:54] <jelmer> ah :)
[23:58] <poolie> this stuff http://www.superbikeschool.com/curriculum/the-levels.php


[17:02] <Pendulum> While this is specific to sci-fi/fantasy conventions it would be cool if we could get more tech companies and conventions on board with this (especially making it possible for outside people to know how to report to employers): http://whatever.scalzi.com/2013/06/28/reporting-harassment-at-a-convention-a-first-person-how-to/
[20:32] <maco> Mary Robinette Kowal's follow up: http://www.maryrobinettekowal.com/journal/why-am-i-afraid-to-name-the-editor/
[21:26] <Pendulum> maco: not sure if you saw but the guy was outed in the comments (by someone claiming to be the host of the party the incident happened at)
[21:27] <Pendulum> err, comments on Scalzi's post
[21:29] <Pendulum> but, yeah, I think both parts can be important
[21:32] <Pendulum> I don't think I ever ran into him when I was working with Tor, at least.
[22:00] <pdurbin> Pendulum: I agree, it would be cool