[13:54] <c2tarun> anyone here?? how much time is left in today's class
[13:54] <c2tarun> ??
[13:55] <bilalakhtar> c2tarun: 5 mins
[13:55] <c2tarun> thanks
[13:56] <skfin> :)
[14:01] <bilalakhtar> Hello people, and welcome to the Packaging tutorial session!
[14:01] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/11/23/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
[14:02] <bilalakhtar> Before we move ahead, I would like to tell you people how to ask questions and the like
[14:02] <bilalakhtar> The session will go on here
[14:02] <bilalakhtar> this channel is moderated
[14:03] <bilalakhtar> you will have to ask the questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat , prefixed with QUESTION: , like this:
[14:03] <bilalakhtar> QUESTION: What does a deb file do?
[14:03] <bilalakhtar> New, let's begin!
[14:03] <bilalakhtar> *now
[14:03] <bilalakhtar> I would like everyone to install these packages:
[14:03] <bilalakhtar> build-essential dpkg-dev fakeroot devscripts autotools-dev debhelper dh-make
[14:04] <bilalakhtar> To install them, run this in a terminal:
[14:04] <bilalakhtar> sudo apt-get install build-essential dpkg-dev fakeroot devscripts autotools-dev debhelper dh-make
[14:04] <bilalakhtar> (let it install in the background)
[14:05] <bilalakhtar> Now, make an empty directory called ubuntu-packaging
[14:07] <bilalakhtar> and cd into it from a terminal
[14:07] <bilalakhtar> Then, download the source code of a very simple programme which we would package (in this case, GNU hello) Download it my typing this in a terminal:
[14:07] <bilalakhtar> wget http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/hello/hello-2.6.tar.gz
[14:07] <bilalakhtar> Then, rename it by typing this:
[14:08] <bilalakhtar> mv hello-2.6.tar.gz hello_2.6.orig.tar.gz
[14:08] <bilalakhtar> Then, extract the archive:
[14:08] <bilalakhtar> tar xzf hello_2.6.orig.tar.gz
[14:09] <bilalakhtar> Now, you will have a directory hello-2.6, cd into it
[14:09] <bilalakhtar> If you don't have a GPG key already, run this command:
[14:09] <bilalakhtar> gpg --gen-key
[14:09] <bilalakhtar> and follow the steps
[14:11] <bilalakhtar> Now, set your full name and e-mail env variables in your system for use by the packaging tools, like this:
[14:12] <bilalakhtar> echo "export DEBFULLNAME=\"YOUR FULL NAME HERE\"" >> ~/.bashrc
[14:12] <bilalakhtar> echo "export<EMAIL_ADDRESS>>> ~/.bashrc
[14:13] <bilalakhtar> After that, run these commands to set the vars in the current session as well:
[14:13] <bilalakhtar> export DEBFULLNAME="YOUR FULL NAME HERE"
[14:13] <bilalakhtar> export<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[14:13] <bilalakhtar> I hope you replaced YOUR FULL NAME HERE and<EMAIL_ADDRESS>with your name and e-mail address
[14:14] <bilalakhtar> now, let us move ahead with the packaging!
[14:14] <bilalakhtar> I hope you are in the hello-2.6 folder
[14:14] <bilalakhtar> then run this command:
[14:14] <bilalakhtar> dh_make -c gpl3 -s
[14:15] <bilalakhtar> Hit enter if every information is correct
[14:15] <bilalakhtar> If not, then say 'NO' in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
[14:16] <bilalakhtar> I assume it worked for everyone
[14:16] <bilalakhtar> now, cd into the newly-created debian subdirectory in the hello-2.6 folder
[14:16] <bilalakhtar> Then run these commands to clear the unnecessary files in the folder
[14:17] <bilalakhtar> rm *ex *EX
[14:17] <bilalakhtar> rm docs info README.*
[14:18] <bilalakhtar> Now, let us analyse the files remaining in the directory
[14:18] <bilalakhtar> Ignore the compat file and the source folder, they are parts of the source which are never touched
[14:19] <bilalakhtar> (not never, but not touched usually)
[14:19] <bilalakhtar> Open the control file in your favourite text editor
[14:19] <bilalakhtar> Set the Section: field from unknown to misc
[14:19] <bilalakhtar> Delete the two #Vcs-* lines
[14:20] <ClassBot> c2tarun asked: what is misc?
[14:20] <bilalakhtar> misc -> Miscellaneous
[14:21] <bilalakhtar> There are many debian sections that can be written there
[14:21] <bilalakhtar> examples are video, net, etc
[14:22] <bilalakhtar> let me give you a list
[14:22] <bilalakhtar> The possible sections are:
[14:22] <bilalakhtar> admin, cli-mono, comm, database, devel, debug, doc, editors, electronics, embedded, fonts, games, gnome, graphics, gnu-r, gnustep, hamradio, haskell, httpd, interpreters, java, kde, kernel, libs, libdevel, lisp, localization, mail, math, misc, net, news, ocaml, oldlibs, otherosfs, perl, php, python, ruby, science, shells, sound, tex, text, utils, vcs, video, web, x11, xfce, zope.
[14:23] <bilalakhtar> FYI: perl, php, python, lisp sections are for language modules, not apps made in that language
[14:23] <bilalakhtar> okay, so let us move ahead
[14:23] <bilalakhtar> In the Homepage: field replace <insert the upstream URL, if relevant>
[14:23] <bilalakhtar> with http://www.gnu.org/software/hello/
[14:24] <bilalakhtar> Now, the package description
[14:24] <bilalakhtar> Replace <insert up to 60 chars description>
[14:24] <bilalakhtar> with a short description of the package
[14:25] <bilalakhtar> In this case: Hello program that prints out Hello World!
[14:25] <bilalakhtar> Replace the <insert long description, indented with spaces> thing with this:
[14:26] <bilalakhtar>  GNU Hello prints out Hello World! and is translateable.
[14:26] <bilalakhtar>  It is a good example of how an application should be made and
[14:26] <bilalakhtar>  follow the GNU coding standards
[14:27] <bilalakhtar> IMPORTANT: There should be a space before every line in the long description
[14:28] <bilalakhtar> Correction: Please change the short description to: Program that prints out Hello World!
[14:28] <bilalakhtar> According to Debian policy we should not have the package name at the beginning of the short description
[14:28] <bilalakhtar> Now, open the copyright file
[14:29] <bilalakhtar> Replace the placeholders there with the appropriate information
[14:30] <bilalakhtar> (this file is very important in actual packaging, but in a tutorial it makes little sense to add info there)
[14:30] <bilalakhtar> Now, the rules file
[14:31] <bilalakhtar> Since our package is a pure C program that uses autotools, we don't need to edit the rules file
[14:31] <bilalakhtar> but in the case of python apps/modules, perl scripts, or anything that doesn't use makefiles and autotools, you will need to edit the rules file as well
[14:32] <bilalakhtar> let me give you link to documentation on that
[14:33] <bilalakhtar> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Basic has good info
[14:33] <ClassBot> tarora asked: how to find package dependencies?
[14:33] <bilalakhtar> Since our package uses autotools, the packaging tools will automatically provide a list of package dependencies when we build the package
[14:34] <bilalakhtar> But in other cases, like python modules and other non-autotools packages
[14:35] <bilalakhtar> you will need to replace the ${shlibs:Depends} in the Depends: field of the control file with a comma-separated list of dependencies
[14:35] <bilalakhtar> but always leave ${misc:Depends} there
[14:36] <ClassBot> ongolaBoy asked: where do we find a complete reference of debian section ?
[14:36] <bilalakhtar> The most comprehensive information you would find would be the Debian policy manual http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/
[14:37] <bilalakhtar> It is the base of all other documentation
[14:37] <bilalakhtar> However, if you want tutorial-style docs, you would like https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide
[14:37] <ClassBot> c2tarun asked: what is the function of rules file??
[14:38] <bilalakhtar> The rules file is like a makefile
[14:38] <bilalakhtar> it contains information for the packaging tools to build the package
[14:38] <ClassBot> c2tarun asked: what are  ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends}
[14:39] <bilalakhtar> The former gets replaced automatically by a list of package dependencies that are unique to the package
[14:39] <bilalakhtar> If the package would be a rhythmbox plugin (for example), this would be replaced by rhythmbox, and other deps
[14:40] <bilalakhtar> in this case, it would be replaced by libc6 and other basic things, since this is a very basic package
[14:40] <bilalakhtar> ${misc:Depends} gets replaced by a list of dependencies common to every package
[14:41] <bilalakhtar> like: glibc, linux, and things without which the system would be unusable
[14:41] <ClassBot> boulabiar asked: is there any GUI for all of this?
[14:41] <bilalakhtar> not at the moment :)
[14:41] <bilalakhtar> If you want to develop stuff, and want to get your feet wet in packaging, you have to sacrifice the luxury of a GUI
[14:42] <ClassBot> c2tarun asked: when will this replacement occur??
[14:42] <bilalakhtar> When we build the package
[14:42] <bilalakhtar> (which is the next step
[14:42] <bilalakhtar> )
[14:42] <bilalakhtar> Now, let us build the package, to do that, type this:
[14:42] <bilalakhtar> debuild
[14:42] <bilalakhtar> That would do it all
[14:43] <bilalakhtar> Some stuff will be printed on the screen
[14:44] <bilalakhtar> When it asks you for the gpg passwords, enter the password of your gpg key
[14:44] <bilalakhtar> Once that is done, you shall have a deb file in the ubuntu-packaging directory
[14:45] <bilalakhtar> Okay, I forgot to mention about the changelog file
[14:46] <bilalakhtar> The package should build properly nevertheless
[14:46] <bilalakhtar> The very first line of the file should be like this:
[14:46] <bilalakhtar> hello (2.6-1) unstable; urgency=low
[14:46] <bilalakhtar> hello -> package name
[14:46] <bilalakhtar> 2.6-1 -> package version number
[14:47] <bilalakhtar> If you are packaging a new package for Ubuntu it would rather be 2.6-0ubuntu1
[14:47] <bilalakhtar> 0 is the debian revision, 0ubuntu1 means this package isn't in Debian yet
[14:47] <bilalakhtar> 2.6 is upstream version number
[14:48] <bilalakhtar> The second line onwards contains the changes made:
[14:48] <bilalakhtar> and the rest is not important for discussion ATM
[14:48] <bilalakhtar> Did the package build well?
[14:49] <ClassBot> c2tarun asked: what about the Makefile?? dont we have to create it??
[14:49] <bilalakhtar> the configure script creates it when we run debuild
[14:49] <ClassBot> c2tarun asked: can u explain what exactly debuild did??
[14:49] <bilalakhtar> Debuild did nothing but executed the debian/rules file with a different set of arguments
[14:50] <bilalakhtar> which built the package
[14:50] <bilalakhtar> man debuild will tell you what it did
[14:50] <bilalakhtar> It basically runs dpkg-buildpackage, then lintian, then debsign
[14:51] <bilalakhtar> dpkg-buildpackage does the main work
[14:51] <bilalakhtar> man dpkg-buildpackage will tell you about it
[14:51] <ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
[14:51] <ClassBot> c2tarun asked: where is the configure script??
[14:51] <bilalakhtar> In the hello-2.6 directory
[14:51] <bilalakhtar> it is supplied by upstream
[14:52] <bilalakhtar> Questions, please!
[14:52] <bilalakhtar> Okay, about PPAs
[14:52] <bilalakhtar> debuild must have created many files apart from a deb
[14:53] <bilalakhtar> If you want to upload the package to a PPA
[14:53] <bilalakhtar> make sure that you replace 'unstable' in the changelog file with 'maverick' or 'lucid' or the version of ubuntu you want to upload for
[14:54] <bilalakhtar> By version I mean codename of the release (hardy, jaunty, intrepid, etc) not numbers (8.04, 9.04, etc)
[14:54] <bilalakhtar> then run debuild -S
[14:54] <bilalakhtar> then install package dput
[14:55] <bilalakhtar> https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/PPA/Uploading will help you then
[14:55] <ClassBot> c2tarun asked: i can see four configure files here? which one is the one guiding for Makefile
[14:55] <bilalakhtar> The one that is named 'configure'
[14:55] <bilalakhtar> that one
[14:55] <bilalakhtar> not configure.ac or something
[14:56] <ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
[14:56] <ClassBot> c2tarun asked: there is a file name configure.ac . can u please explain that file??
[14:56] <bilalakhtar> Beyond scope, but I will explain briefly
[14:56] <bilalakhtar> Developers use it to create 'configure' using autoconf
[14:57] <bilalakhtar> it is a helper file in reality
[14:57] <bilalakhtar> but of no use to the user or packager
[14:57] <bilalakhtar> < maxpaguro> where to learn more about correct libs and howto correct handle?
[14:57] <bilalakhtar> YOu mean correct dependencies?
[14:58] <bilalakhtar> they are usually listed in the README file in the upstream tarball
[14:58] <bilalakhtar> 2 minutes remaining, might answer 2 more Qs
[14:58] <bilalakhtar> quick!
[14:59] <ClassBot> maxpaguro asked: dependencies and libraries if updating a package
[14:59] <bilalakhtar> If you are updating a package
[14:59] <bilalakhtar> usually the deps remain the same
[15:00] <bilalakhtar> In autotools packages the deps are taken care of automatically
[15:00] <bilalakhtar> but in non-autotools packages, check the upstream changelog (not debian/changelog)
[15:00] <bilalakhtar> Almost time up!
[15:00] <bilalakhtar> Thanks for everyone who attended
[15:01] <ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/11/23/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
[15:01]  * bilalakhtar waits for the bot to call off
[15:02] <c2tarun> today was my first class. it was good :) where can i get logs of previous classes
[15:02] <leoquant>  http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/11/23/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
[15:03] <c2tarun> leoquant: at ur link i saw the log of todays class...  what about previous classes??
[17:45] <c2tarun> what is the timing of next class??
[17:47] <coolbhavi> c2tarun, please see the topic :)
[17:49] <c2tarun> how can i convert the given time according to indian time?
[17:51] <m4n1sh> c2tarun: +5:30
[18:05] <c2tarun> can i get the log files of previous classes
[18:09] <pleia2> c2tarun: they are all linked on the wiki page in the topic
[22:36] <airborn> ale chuj jestes
[22:36] <airborn> ups
[22:36] <airborn> sorry
[22:36] <airborn> :(


[04:18] <Unit193> pitti: Good morning.
[04:20] <darkxst> Unit193, hey, can you make a branch against lp:ppa-versions with your changes, I couldnt download the paste
[04:20] <darkxst> (will merge everything except the change of debian tracker, kind of like the new better)
[04:21] <Unit193> darkxst: Uhh, sure.  I wouldn't recommend it though, I don't know python so it's all hacks. :P
[04:23] <darkxst> Unit193, it looked ok to me
[04:30] <pitti> Good morning
[04:30] <pitti> FTR, I lost overnight scrollback; thanks to unity crashing 30 seconds after I started my session (during dist-upgrade)
[04:39] <darkxst> hey pitti
[04:45] <darkxst> pitti, anyidea how to change the location of /tmp in python? I tried to set TMPDIR, but retracer is failing
[04:45] <darkxst> dpkg-deb: error: unable to create temporary directory: No such file or directory
[04:47] <pitti> darkxst: hm, did you create $TMPDIR actually?
[04:47] <darkxst> pitti, yes, its in my home folder
[04:47] <pitti> darkxst: AFAIK the tempfile module ought to respect $TMPDIR
[04:48] <darkxst> thats what I though
[04:48] <darkxst> thought
[04:49] <Unit193> darkxst: Try that?  And don't say I didn't warn you. :P
[04:49] <pitti> $ mkdir /tmp/x; TMPDIR=/tmp/x python3 -c 'import tempfile; print(tempfile.NamedTemporaryFile().name)'
[04:49] <pitti> /tmp/x/tmpfkpdqt0l
[04:49] <pitti> seems fine to me, I also tried with mkstemp()
[04:50] <pitti> darkxst: hm, no idea then; can you run strace on it and see what it tries to do?
[04:54] <darkxst> pitti, nm, was just a typo
[04:55] <darkxst> Unit193, are you using some script that messes with whitespaces?
[04:55] <Unit193> No.
[04:56] <darkxst> Unit193, why are there unrelated whitespace changes in your commits then? http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unit193/ppa-versions/xfce-changes/revision/45 for example
[04:58] <Unit193> darkxst: 'commit file.py -m' vs 'commit -m', noticed I missed them too late in rev 41.
[04:58] <darkxst> Unit193, can you generalise this, so the list comes from the profiles (http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unit193/ppa-versions/xfce-changes/revision/40)
[04:59] <darkxst> and make it get_upstream_extra
[04:59] <darkxst> will use it in gnome for freedesktop modules
[04:59] <Unit193> Uhh.
[05:00] <Unit193> Had to filter out the veeery old (not in Debian, don't actually have releases, etc.) packages, so it's a bit specific.
[05:02] <darkxst> err, right misread that
[05:03] <darkxst> was only glancing though looked like you were adding a list of extra packages to pull in
[05:04] <Unit193> No, but thought about that next as there's a few more I'd like to track.
[05:04] <Unit193> But, not sure that'd actually work.
[05:09] <darkxst> Unit193, add a dictionary to the profiles, something: upsteam_extra = {upstream:package, ... }
[05:14] <darkxst> may need a path in there as well though I suppose
[05:15] <Unit193> Yeah, and upstreams tend to be a bit different.
[05:15] <darkxst> Unit193, maybe upstream:path would be better
[05:15] <darkxst> or you can do a list of tuples
[05:16] <darkxst> [(upstream, package, path)]
[05:16] <darkxst> I think the ubuntu-desktop script does something like that
[05:17] <darkxst> Unit193, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-desktop-versions/trunk/view/head:/packages.py
[05:31] <darkxst> pitti, the symlink hackery ok with you or should it perhaps live in sandboxutils?
[05:52] <pitti> darkxst: haven't looked in detail yet, but probably okay
[05:55] <darkxst> pitti, its all a little horid, but the auto-load framework way pre-dates the introduction of python scripts
[05:55] <darkxst> and solib-absolute-path gets stuff in the middle of the file names
[05:57] <darkxst> I've not seen anything in the scripts I have worked on (mainly glib and mozjs) that would require deadlock versioning, but then I also haven't seen any of the old .gdb scripts
[06:11] <AndrewMock> I would like to know why the trusty/nginx-light package includes so many extras...
[07:38] <jamespage> pitti, Daviey: morning - I have a conditional release team ack for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ceph/+bug/1423601
[07:39] <jamespage> but I need a willing archive admin for the minor python-* package split that I'm tracking from upstream packaging - would one of you be OK with doing the binary NEW's for that?
[07:40] <pitti> jamespage: yes, can do if it happens today (will be on vac next week)
[07:42] <jamespage> pitti, will upload shortly - thanks!
[07:43] <jamespage> pitti, ok - uploading now - it will take a few hours to complete the builds
[08:10] <dholbach> good morning
[08:21] <Unit193> darkxst: Hah, whoops.  When re-importing the changes, I spelled 'utcnow' as 'uctnow', FYI.
[09:11] <ogra_> cjwatson, i got an oops fo you :) https://launchpadlibrarian.net/200087368/upload_22505_log.txt
[09:12] <ogra_> *for
[09:13] <pitti> Unit193: question for you in bug 1431200
[09:19] <cjwatson> ogra_: Apparently livecd.ubuntu-touch.system-i386+generic_x86.img was zero-sized.  Do you know why?
[09:20] <Unit193> pitti: Answer for you.
[09:21] <ogra_> cjwatson, no, i got a build log by mail where it seems to finish fine
[09:22] <ogra_> hmm
[09:22] <pitti> Unit193: thanks; I wanted to see if it was ConditionFailed=, such as in a VM; daemon-reload would retry those
[09:22] <ogra_> Unmounting chroot for build LIVEFSBUILD-22505...
[09:22] <ogra_> RUN: /usr/share/launchpad-buildd/slavebin/remove-build ['remove-build', 'LIVEFSBUILD-22505']
[09:22] <ogra_> Removing build LIVEFSBUILD-22505
[09:22] <ogra_> cjwatson, thats the last three lines
[09:22] <cjwatson> ogra_: Right, so did I, the build clearly succeeded but appears to have resulted in one of the output files being zero-length
[09:23] <cjwatson> Where the previous version was 105.4 MiB
[09:29] <cjwatson> ogra_: I'm afraid I don't have an explanation for you, other than that the zero-sized file is what caused this OOPS (perhaps we could make that more obvious, but it still ought to fail because it's broken).  There's no sign of a cause of this in the livefs build log nor in the buildd-manager logs, and livecd-rootfs is just copying that file out of the android binary package where it isn't zero-sized.  The only suggestion I have is to ...
[09:29] <cjwatson> ... dispatch a new build.
[09:31] <ogra_> cjwatson, yeah, will do that and see
[09:32] <pitti> Unit193: can you actually reproduce this with just daemon-reload?
[09:32] <pitti> Unit193: I can't, I need apt-get install --reinstall systemd
[09:32] <Unit193> pitti: Yes, I can.  I just did in fact.
[10:32] <pitti> zyga: ah, you and your C locale.. :-)
[10:32] <pitti> this really doesn't belong on a desktop..
[10:33] <zyga> pitti: hmm? what :)
[10:33] <pitti> folks, at least use C.UTF-8 for $deity's sake :)
[10:33] <zyga> pitti: where?
[10:33] <zyga> pitti: :D
[10:33] <pitti> zyga: bug 1431421
[10:33] <pitti> zyga: sorry, bug 1430773
[10:34] <pitti> zyga: (fixed now)
[10:34] <zyga> pitti: I don't set the C locale anywhere
[10:34] <zyga> pitti: (thanks)
[10:34] <zyga> pitti: I don't know why that happened
[10:34] <zyga> pitti: could it be because my pl_PL.UTF-8 locale was unavailable in my sid sbuild chroot?
[10:34] <pitti> zyga: you call this as part of some sbuild command, right? perhaps that removes the locale at the time whne you call adt-run
[10:34] <zyga> yes
[10:35] <zyga> pitti: http://paste.ubuntu.com/10590142/
[10:35] <zyga> this is my .sbuildrc
[10:35] <pitti> zyga: ah, you call adt-run *inside* the schroot? and then let this start  another chroot?
[10:35] <zyga> not sure, this is from sbuild debian wiki page
[10:35] <pitti> ah ok, I blame sbuild then :)
[10:35] <zyga> looks like it yeah
[10:35] <zyga> those run inside the chroot AFAIK
[10:35] <zyga> pitti: though I totally agree about C being evil
[10:36] <pitti> apw, jodh: \o/ on #1429756, nice work!
[10:38] <apw> pitti, jodh gets a prize for a reproducer i could fit in a VM
[10:38] <pitti> apw: ah, and then git bisect run FTW? :-)
[10:39] <apw> pitti, no i read the 600M strace log to find the symptoms, and from there i could find the commit that changed that area, and then ...
[10:39] <jodh> pitti: right, apw really deserves the prize for finding the needle in the 600M haystack! :-)
[10:39] <pitti> ok, I'm afraid you guys have to share the prize then..
[10:40]  * apw gets a cookie out of the jar
[10:40] <pitti> especially since it's already so small -- it's a silly green bullet in jenkins! :-)
[10:41] <zyga> pitti: wow, I nice catch with "you've"
[10:42] <zyga> pitti: I pasted that from twine docs
[10:42] <pitti> zyga: well, it's legit -- debian control files are UTF-8
[10:42] <pitti> (and changelogs, etc.)
[10:43] <zyga> pitti: yeah though mainly for names
[10:43] <zyga> pitti: sbuild should have better defaults IMHO
[10:52] <ogra_> cjwatson, same error on rebuild, i uploaded a livecd-rootfs with more verbosity for the copying of the android bits ...
[10:52] <cjwatson> and did it reveal anything?
[10:52] <cjwatson> oh, the rebuild wasn't with that upload
[10:53] <ogra_> hasnt migrated yet
[10:53] <ogra_> right
[10:53] <ogra_> it looks to me like it never even hits the copy code on i386
[10:53] <cjwatson> that wouldn't explain a zero-length file
[10:53] <ogra_> right
[10:53] <cjwatson> if it never hit the copy code the file in question would be missing instead
[11:29] <Riddell> mvo: what is stopping packagekit being updated to 0.9 ?
[11:31] <cjwatson> Riddell: needs https://code.launchpad.net/~mvo/click/native-dbus
[11:31] <cjwatson> well, that might be for 1.0.0
[11:32] <cjwatson> yeah, plugin support went away in 1.0.0 not 0.9
[11:56] <doko> didrocks, please could you fix the recommends for grilo-plugins? http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches-proposed.svg
[12:03] <darkxst> doko, grilo-plugins-extra was never meant to be main'ed, but no one knows who promoted it
[12:07] <didrocks> doko: not sure why this is directed to me, seems the guy who promoted it didn't read the MIR (nor changed the bug report status)
[12:07] <didrocks> doko: so, we need to discuss it first once the people acting on the bug are around
[12:15] <doko> didrocks, afaicr you were the person requesting that in the past. anyway, demoted the extra package
[12:16] <didrocks> doko: I never requested promoting grilo, only review the MIR. I wouldn't request btw as I can promote it myself
[12:18] <didrocks> doko: I get you are mixing with darkxst (but we all start with a d :p)
[12:22] <Odd_Bloke> Does the 7 day SRU timer start from it hitting -proposed, or from verification-done?
[12:24] <infinity> Odd_Bloke: The former.
[12:25] <Odd_Bloke> \o/
[12:25] <Odd_Bloke> infinity: Thanks. :)
[12:25] <didrocks> infinity: oh btw, you will be pleased to know that I nuked this morning the whoopsie conffiles
[12:25] <didrocks> bdmurray: mind merging my 2 uploads to whoopsie and whoopsie-preferences?
[12:28] <infinity> didrocks: \o/
[12:29] <infinity> didrocks: Swapped from conffile to config file?
[12:29] <infinity> didrocks: Or did away with the need for it entirely?
[12:30] <didrocks> infinity: unfortunately, couldn't go away completely, so config file for one remaining option, but basing the enabled checkbox based on service status (being under upstart or systemd)
[12:31] <jamespage> pitti, ceph is built on some archs - I'm working on ppc* and armhf right now
[12:33] <ogra_> cjwatson, LOL
[12:34] <ogra_> cjwatson, so i replaced all cp with "cp -v" to get more info ... and now the build just succeeds
[12:35] <cjwatson> Heh
[13:12] <mvo> Riddell: if plugins are still supported, then nothing
[13:14] <Riddell> mvo: is packagekit(-qt) a reasonable choice for e.g. dolphin file manager installing samba so it can share files?
[13:17] <mvo> Riddell: is that something that you would add? that should be fine, the session installer api supports "install_packages" which you can just feed the samba names
[13:18] <Riddell> mvo: I'm thinking of a gsoc project to add that sort of feature in various places
[13:19] <Riddell> mvo: and the samba name could be hardcoded or could use appstream? except appstream has limited support in ubuntu
[13:19] <mvo> Riddell: yeah, the limited support is a issue as is that the packagename is different in different distros :/
[13:27] <Riddell> mvo: if DEP-11 gets implemented by debian does that help ubuntu at all?
[13:28] <mvo> Riddell: a bit maybe, but because debian uses dak and ubuntu LP for the archive I doubt it will help that much, maybe, depends how deeply this is entangled into dak I guess
[13:30] <Riddell> mvo: right
[13:36] <caribou> Is there a specific method to add a patch to a dkms package that doesn't use quilt or just add the file in ./patches & edit dkms.conf ?
[13:40] <infinity> caribou: dkms.conf:PATCHES[#]= is the correct way.
[13:40] <caribou> infinity: thanks
[14:31] <seb128> pitti, bdmurray, btw bug #1427264 has details about the schroot/ecryptfs/userdir mount issue, not specific to ecryptfs but to configs where /home is a separate mount
[14:39] <tyhicks> seb128: you mean where /home/USER is a separate mount
[14:39] <tyhicks> seb128: /home being a separate mount is no problem
[14:39] <seb128> tyhicks, right
[14:39] <seb128> sorry ;-)
[14:39] <tyhicks> no prob :)
[14:49] <tyhicks> seb128: after we have a chance to better test the fstab change, do you think we should change the fstab file in the click package to do the rprivate /home?
[14:50] <seb128> tyhicks, I don't understand enough about the implications to have an opinion on whether that's the right solution I think :-/
[14:50] <seb128> but if it works +1 from me
[14:50] <tyhicks> (after I get to test it some more, I plan on updating https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=648459 to suggest that the default profile be changed)
[14:52] <tyhicks> seb128: ok, I know someone that can review the change and tell me about the implications
[15:02] <seb128> tyhicks, great, let me know how it goes, I'm happy to help testing
[15:06] <stokachu> @pilot in
[15:22] <doko> jamespage, rbasak: I think even updating golang to 1.4 will break building some of the ubuntu-touch apps. thanks due to embedded outdated go packages not packaged for ubuntu :-/
[15:29] <jamespage> doko, ohno
[15:36] <doko> jamespage, plus will break golong-log4go. there exist some patches in the upstream package, but this project seems to be dead
[15:37] <doko> should be updated by somebody having go coding experience
[16:10] <doko> jamespage, subscribed you to 1431872
[16:30] <flexiondotorg_> didrocks, Please would you be able to take another look at - https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubuntu-mate-update/+merge/251487 ?
[16:33] <didrocks> flexiondotorg_: I guess better to ask that to the patch pilot
[16:33] <didrocks> flexiondotorg_: or wait for my shift
[16:33] <flexiondotorg_> didrocks, Tanks.
[16:34] <flexiondotorg_> Or Thanks, you choose.
[16:34] <didrocks> ;)
[16:34] <flexiondotorg_> stokachu, While you're piloting, please could you take a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubuntu-mate-update/+merge/251487
[17:14] <stokachu> flexiondotorg_: sure!
[20:31] <flexiondotorg_> stokachu, Yo.
[20:31] <flexiondotorg_> stokachu, Thanks for looking at my merge proposal.
[20:31] <flexiondotorg_> I am very sick right now, so my initial comment in there is not friendly.
[20:31] <flexiondotorg_> stokachu, I apologise for that.
[20:32] <flexiondotorg_> stokachu, Regarding https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubuntu-mate-update/+merge/251487
[20:32] <stokachu> yea i got that...
[20:32] <flexiondotorg_> I am not sure how to resolve the source-is-missing lintian errors.
[20:33] <stokachu> dunno dude im off duty now
[20:33] <stokachu> @pilot out
[20:33] <flexiondotorg_> Please can you spare some wisdom.
[20:37] <Unit193> flexiondotorg_: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubuntu-mate-update/+merge/251487/comments/628312 seems to say he'll take care of the other lintian warnings.
[20:39] <flexiondotorg_> Unit193, Thanks for bring y attention to that comment. Just refreshed and see it now :)
[20:39] <flexiondotorg_> I can fix the warning at least :)
[21:08] <doko> stgraber, please file MIRs for new lua-filesystem b-d's: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches-proposed.svg
[21:19] <stgraber> doko: done
[21:20] <stgraber> not sure how I missed the build-depends when I did the lua-filesystem MIR...
[21:23] <doko> meh, the nth text to html converter
[21:26] <doko> stgraber, bug subscribers missing ...
[21:26] <stgraber> doko: ah yeah, I'll subscribe to both
[21:27] <stgraber> doko: done
[21:28] <doko> stgraber, not lxc-team like lua-filesystem?
[21:28] <stgraber> doko: well, if lua-filesystem is broken, that affects lxc, if the b-d of lua-filesystem are broken for something other than lua-filesystem, the lxc team won't care
[21:29] <doko> then subscribe foundations, but not a single person
[21:29] <stgraber> I'd have subscribed foundations if I could have, you need to be team admin to subscribe a team...
[21:30] <doko> bdmurray, ^^^
[21:30] <stgraber> oh, actually, looks like I can use ubuntu-foundations-team
[21:31] <stgraber> because canonical-foundations-team admins it
[21:32] <stgraber> doko: done, moved to foundations
[21:33] <bdmurray> it should be foundations-bugs subscribed
[21:33] <bdmurray> to lua-filesystems is it?
[21:33] <doko> no, markdown and dh-lua
[21:35] <bdmurray> okay, done
[21:40] <doko> stgraber, please unsubscribe ubuntu-foundations-team
[21:40] <stgraber> done


[01:27] <Fudge> AlanBell  you fail :p
[01:28] <Fudge> look forward to seeing/hearing these vids
[06:53] <AlanBell> http://www.markshuttleworth.com/
[06:53] <AlanBell> First-class accessibility for those with special interaction needs <- with a link to the release notes we did
[08:21] <Fudge> AlanBell  is that link for videos
[08:22] <AlanBell> I have not re-recorded the vidoes yet (waiting for some time to do it, plus a fix for the epic fail with return mapped to "e" on the scanning onboard layout)
[12:05] <AlanBell> http://twitter.com/#!/alanbell_libsol/status/126967503560777728
[12:05] <Pendulum> :)
[13:14] <joanie> AlanBell: Sorry, I needed to sleep.
[13:14] <joanie> AlanBell: It looks good. How much hacking did you do to the original meetbot?
[13:14] <AlanBell> thats no excuse :)
[13:14] <joanie> I'm thinking of further hacking ours.
[13:14] <AlanBell> mainly adding voting to the debian meetbot
[13:14] <joanie> but the diff for subtopic would be handy
[13:15] <AlanBell> the original mootbot for Ubuntu was TCL/eggdrop, the debian rewrite was in python/supybot
[13:19] <AlanBell> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-bots/ubuntu-bots/meetingology/view/head:/meeting.py#L316
[13:19]  * joanie looks
[16:41] <gxoptg> hello. Can somebody help me? what mean 'click-type window' in OnBoard? I want to translate it into Russian
[16:43] <gxoptg> hey?
[19:27] <charlie-tca> AlanBell: ready for tomorrow?
[19:27] <AlanBell> hmm?
[19:27] <charlie-tca> Open week session at 15:00 UTC
[19:28] <AlanBell> ah, that!
[19:29] <charlie-tca> yeah, that one. You gonna field some of the questions, right?
[19:29] <AlanBell> yeah
[19:31] <AlanBell> I will do a bit of prep at some point
[19:31] <AlanBell> I am in a pub right now
[19:32] <charlie-tca> Okay. I'm flexible. Let me know what if you want to do some of the briefing or just take questions. I hate most of the questions, so any help is great
[19:49] <AlanBell> maybe set up an etherpad and put some notes in it, I will add stuff later


[00:32] <AndChat467409> Hey, I am getting the "Alert! /dev/disk/by-uuid/######### does not exist. Dropping to shell!" After trying to install windows on a empty part of my drive. Now nothing will boot, not even live CDs. Anybody know what's up? I'm beginning to think if bricked my computer.
[00:41] <lamont> has anyone seen a situation where traffic passing through a linux firewall (precise in this case) fails for win8 clients talking to a variety of far-side destinations, while it works (1) through a cable modem, and (2) if handed to a squid on the lan which then goes through the very firewall.  traffic looks sane on the firewall, haven't caught traffic yet in the working case
[00:41] <lamont> firewall nats, of course
[03:26] <infinity> lamont: I saw that on my friend's network for a while, but every attempt at diagnosis never allowed us to make any sense of it.
[03:26] <infinity> lamont: And upgrading to trusty made it go away, so we gave up caring.
[08:47]  * apw yawns theatrically
[08:53]  * ogra_ throws a single bee
[09:41] <niluje> hi
[09:41] <niluje> how can I debug this kernel panic? http://blackhole.brmzkw.info/2014-05-20/panic.txt
[09:41] <niluje> # uname -a
[09:41] <niluje> Linux vtydc2-p10cp-c01b16n12 3.14.4 #1 SMP Tue May 13 16:27:33 CEST 2014 armv7l armv7l armv7l GNU/Linux
[09:41] <niluje> # mount
[09:41] <niluje> /dev/nbd0 on / type ext4 (rw)
[09:41] <niluje> # ps auxw | grep nbd-client
[09:41] <niluje> root      1041  0.3  0.0   1312    72 ?        Ss   00:00   0:00 /sbin/nbd-client <IP_ADDRESS> 4448 /dev/nbd0 -persist
[09:42] <niluje> I get this kernel panic when running : mkdir /root/toto && chmod 777 /root/toto && strace bonnie++ -d /root/toto -r 2048 -u nobody
[09:45] <apw> 3.14.4 ... does it occur with the 3.15 series ?
[09:48] <xnox> niluje: do you have a picture?
[09:48]  * xnox has kernel panics on ext4 with 3.15 package
[09:49] <apw> xnox, yeah i had a look at your picture, you mentioned the fs is dirty ?  is that just i hard powered off, or is it in serious trouble
[09:49] <apw> xnox, niluje's is http://blackhole.brmzkw.info/2014-05-20/panic.txt (3.14.4)
[09:50] <niluje> apw: didn't try with 3.15
[09:51] <xnox> apw: it's as dirty as it gets under systemd. As far as i can tell, because we are missing whole bunch of init-scripts (removed as not needed under upstart) systemd just hold the fs open and kills the power.
[09:51] <apw> xnox, quality error handling for the win
[09:51] <xnox> thus on next boot, either systemd/mountall do the "reboot required" thing and auto-reboot
[09:51] <xnox> then you get fsck
[09:51] <xnox> and then can finally boot again.
[09:52] <xnox> .... or not boot with 3.15.
[09:52] <apw> you are asking to not have a root doing that, i hope you don't have data on there you care about
[09:52] <niluje> (my real question is "how can I debug this?" and not "what is the problem?" :-))
[09:53] <xnox> i have little clue about niluje jibberish in the log.
[09:53] <xnox> but last line indicates that a reboot is required....
[09:53] <apw> niluje, well firstly i would read the source for n_tty_receive_buf_common to see what it might be memcpying, and then i'd be asking (as indeed i did) what versions do not have this issue
[09:53] <xnox> niluje: is this on powerpc? or an ARM board?
[09:54] <apw> niluje, to see what might have changed there to trigger this
[09:54] <niluje> xnox: an ARM board
[09:55] <niluje> apw: ok, I'm gonna try to setup a kernel 3.14 with the minimal set of options then I'll try to see if 3.15 fixes the problem or not
[09:55] <niluje> thanks
[10:18] <apw> niluje, i had a quick look at changes to n_tty since 3.14.4 but cannot see anything interesting, there is the output panic CVE thing but nothing input related
[10:19] <apw> niluje, unless in some what that could be the other side perhaps of the transaction which corrupted the tty
[10:20] <niluje> apw: I'm currently trying with a 3.2.34
[10:27] <apw> henrix, do i assume that netfilter bpf fix for the "lastest two cves" are coming down the stable route ?
[10:28] <henrix> apw: yep, that's correct
[10:28] <apw> henrix, great, then i can ignore them :)
[11:23] <zequence> infinity: So, only precise and quantal needed to be updated this time?
[11:27] <zequence> infinity: Reason why I'm asking is that the saucy bug report was handled differently from the rest, making the new unversioned one a duplicate of the original one
[11:27] <zequence> Never mind, I updated saucy. Seems it was like the rest
[11:49] <zequence> Well, a new ABI for saucy, in fact. Anyway, all uploaded now.
[11:52] <infinity> zequence: A new ABI for saucy?   That seems unlikely.
[11:53] <mlankhorst> infinity: can you review xorg-lts-trusty in precise?
[11:53] <infinity> zequence: Err, oh.  You rebased against the wrong one, that's why. :/
[11:54] <infinity> zequence: 22.38 is the one we're trying to catch up with.  But if you want to skip it and go straight to 23.39, that works too.
[11:54] <zequence> infinity: I don't rebase manually, so I don't get to control that :)
[11:55] <infinity> Oh.  I assume you picked a tag to rebase against or something.
[11:55] <apw> by default it updates against the latest master tag
[11:55] <apw> though you can "fix" that manually
[11:55] <infinity> Kay, well, nevermind then.  Easy enough to just let lowlatency skip the mess that this last cycle was and skip ahead to next cycle. :P
[11:56] <zequence> Cool. Less brainwork for me.
[11:57] <infinity> mlankhorst: I can after I've napped a bit.  I'm on the wrong end of night right now.
[11:58] <mlankhorst> ok
[13:00] <GortiZ> I've question about bug #1318531
[13:02] <GortiZ> It has been marked "triaged" without any comment and tagged as "cherry-pick reverse-bisect-done".
[13:02] <GortiZ> Does it means that the fix will be backported on the current LTS kernel (3.13) so that in future I'll only need to update to the latest KUbuntu 14.04 to make it work on my pc?
[13:09] <apw> oi ubottu
[13:13] <apw> GortiZ, no idea if penalvch is going to continue the hunt, but the next logical step is reverting that commit against tip and testing there
[15:01] <jsalisbury> **
[15:01] <jsalisbury> ** Ubuntu Kernel Team Meeting - Today @ 17:00 UTC - #ubuntu-meeting
[15:01] <jsalisbury> **
[15:35] <lamont> infinity: that is good to hear.  I have a trusty upgrade in my week.
[16:16] <GortiZ> apw: that commit doesn't need to be reverted but to be integrated (the newer works the older doesn't) anyway thanks for the answer. I'll wait and if nothing new happens I'll ask to penalvch :) (I was just wondering which of the two things falls in the "Triaged" definition)
[16:17] <apw> Triaged just means there is enough info for someone to progress it
[16:55] <jsalisbury> ##
[16:55] <jsalisbury> ## Kernel team meeting in 5 minutes
[16:55] <jsalisbury> ##


[04:21] <mgalvin> hey rob^, been busy huh, great work :)
[04:21] <mgalvin> rob^, one suggestion, if you use java 1.5 for the java section then the mozilla/firefox plugin will work
[04:27] <mgalvin> either way i think we also need to determine how gij and the jre might effect each other, i have seen issues arise when both are on a system together
[04:57] <rob^> yeah
[04:58] <rob^> at least we now have a method that doesnt rely on bad repos :)
[04:58] <rob^> I'll have another look at it
[05:01] <rob^> mgalvin, blackdown doesnt seem to have an installer for 1.5 yet
[05:05] <mgalvin> rob^, only sun has a working 1.5 implementation thus far
[05:05] <rob^> http://serios.net/content/debian/java/with-java-package.php
[05:06] <rob^> good page that
[05:06] <mgalvin> cool
[05:12] <rob^> once the apply the patch I just sent in, I'll update that java stuff
[05:14] <mgalvin> rob^ did you "apply" for commit access yet, if not you should
[05:15] <rob^> they are still getting around to adding an account for me
[05:15] <mgalvin> same here, still waiting on mine too
[05:26] <mgalvin> l8r
[06:09] <rob^> has anyone applied my patch I sent eariler yet?
[06:10] <rob^> ^earlier
[07:57] <froud> morning
[08:01] <rob^> morning, did you get my patch
[08:01] <froud> yes I just applied it
[08:01] <rob^> ty
[08:01] <froud> np
[08:03] <froud> in sources.list. If installation is done over network what will
[08:03] <froud> deb cdrom:[Kubuntu 5.04 _Hoary Hedgehog_ - Release i386 (20050407)] / hoary main restricted
[08:03] <froud> be
[08:05] <rob^> well that line points to your cd for a start
[08:05] <froud> yes but what if I instaled from network
[08:05] <rob^> just edit out that line and enable the other repos
[08:05] <froud> FTP, TFTP
[08:06] <froud> lets say I did not use a cd to install
[08:06] <rob^> what are you trying to make apt do? not use the cd at all
[08:06] <froud> I created a bootdisk and selected to install from a network resource
[08:06] <rob^> yes
[08:06] <froud> not trying to do anything
[08:07] <froud> just trying to write about it
[08:07] <rob^> oh
[08:07] <froud> in breezy we are supposed to have network installation
[08:07] <rob^> I would assume that there wouldn't be a line like that at all
[08:07] <froud> so if user installs form NFS or TFP what will the line say
[08:07] <froud> there should be
[08:08] <froud> because there are many packages on the network share
[08:08] <rob^> all the packages should be contained on what ever repo you installed from
[08:08] <rob^> or network share
[08:08] <froud> its just like copying the cd to a disk and exporting it using nfs
[08:09] <rob^> hmm
[08:09] <rob^> not sure, dont do to many installs like that
[08:46] <Burgundavia> salut all
[08:46] <Burgundavia> I love live cds
[08:46] <Burgundavia> no more XP for me
[08:47] <froud> XP you been on XP all this time
[08:47] <Burgundavia> no
[08:47] <Burgundavia> see planet.ubuntu
[08:48] <Burgundavia> see planet.ubuntu0
[08:48] <Burgundavia> hmm
[08:48] <Burgundavia> right
[08:48] <Burgundavia> I run Breezy at home
[08:51] <froud> Burgundavia:  Ha ha when you gonna write to the docs?
[08:52] <Burgundavia> when I get commit access
[08:52] <Burgundavia> I havent been able to catch elmo again
[08:53] <froud> did you send elmo your key again
[08:53] <Burgundavia> I did
[08:53] <froud> I think you need to send enrico you new key and let him do it
[08:54] <Burgundavia> ok
[08:54] <Burgundavia> once I get my machine booted at home I will do it
[08:55] <Burgundavia> moving my gf this weekend, should be fun
[09:06] <Burgundavia> all right, night
[09:07] <froud> night
[09:44] <froud> rob^: patches applied :-) thanks
[09:45] <froud> bbl school run
[11:12] <Liz> greetings froud
[11:12] <froud> ello Liz
[11:12] <froud> all good dwn there
[11:12] <mdke_> morning everyone
[11:13] <froud> morn, its near afternoon, you just woke up?
[11:18] <mdke_> not entirely
[11:18] <mdke_> its 10 o clock here but I've been up for a while
[11:20] <Liz> its nearly 7.20pm here
[11:21] <Liz> sorry, got distracted by themovie
[11:21] <Liz> lilo and stitch..heh
[11:28] <mdke_> awesome work on the faqguide rob^
[11:43] <rob^> mdke, thanks
[11:47] <Liz> bbtomorrow
[02:38] <jjesse> morning everyone :)
[02:38] <froud-work> morn dude
[02:38] <froud-work> has anyone tried web-min on Ubuntu?
[02:38] <jjesse> its probablly afternoon for you froud?
[02:39] <froud-work> any suggestions other than web-min
[02:39] <jjesse> you have to enable root before you can use webmin
[02:39] <froud-work> yep noon
[02:39] <jjesse> webmin requires a first sign on to be root and from localhost not from another box
[02:40] <jjesse> so when i install it on my server w/o X installed i have to use lynx to sign on and allow other ip addresses
[02:40] <froud-work> you cant login using the browser on another host?
[02:41] <froud-work> or use ACLs
[02:41] <jjesse> i'm not a webmin expert i just know when it is installed the first time it only accepts connections localy
[02:42] <froud-work> Hmm, so you ssh in login with Lynx allow another IP-address rights then use that hosts web browser?
[02:42] <jjesse> yes
[02:42] <froud-work> why dont you just leave your hosts IP addres allowed?
[02:43] <froud-work> or wont it allow the login despite knowing the IP address
[02:43] <jjesse> hold on just setup a debian box checking how i did
[02:44] <jjesse> just did an apt-get install webmin on a debian (sarge) box
[02:45] <jjesse> and it setups webmin as only allow from listed addresses
[02:45] <jjesse> and the listed addresses are <IP_ADDRESS>
[02:45] <froud-work> yes
[02:45] <froud-work> add your host to th elist and you should be able to access from that hosts web browser and logon
[02:46] <jjesse> correct thats swhat i do
[02:46] <froud-work> of course you need apache to make it available
[02:46] <froud-work> and you can always secure the url with authentication
[02:47] <jjesse> correct
[02:47] <froud-work> so the user needs to logon twice
[02:47] <jjesse> but w/ webmin under ubuntu you need to enable root first
[02:47] <froud-work> jjesse: yes I expect it wont know what to do with sudo
[02:48] <froud-work> jjesse: have you tried any other tools like webmin
[02:48] <froud-work> jjesse: do any of them understand sudo
[02:48] <jjesse> froud i haven't had a chance to really
[02:48] <froud-work> :-) do what you know, no time for experiments :)
[02:49] <jjesse> well i do experiment w/ lots of stuff, just haven't branched out from webmin
[02:56] <jjesse> ls
[02:56] <jjesse> doh wrong window :)
[06:05] <jsgotangco> salut
[06:06] <jsgotangco> what's been happening lately in ubuntu-doc?
[06:08] <mdke> hey dude
[06:09] <mdke> :)
[06:09] <jsgotangco> mdke: you doing good?
[06:09] <mdke> yes i'm ok
[06:09] <mdke> you?
[06:09] <jsgotangco> well my laptop got busted today
[06:10] <mdke> bad news
[06:10] <jsgotangco> i got myself a loaner but its running XP heh
[06:10] <mdke> guess you need a new one eh?
[06:10] <jsgotangco> well Taiwan-made laptops really dont last long
[06:10] <mdke> haha
[06:10] <jsgotangco> despite their great specs
[06:10] <mdke> well fingers crossed on getting one off Canonical
[06:11] <jsgotangco> hehe i thought they gave those already?
[06:11] <mdke> dunno
[06:11] <mdke> not to me!
[06:11] <mdke> you neither huh?
[06:12] <mdke> i don't think they've given em tbh
[06:12] <jsgotangco> ahhh
[06:12] <jsgotangco> jeezz xp fonts are really nice
[06:13] <jsgotangco> i tried running mIRC and i couldnt understand a thing
[06:13] <jsgotangco> so i just downloaded gaim for win
[06:14] <mdke> good call
[06:15] <jsgotangco> actually i dumped all the free software i can get for windows
[06:15] <mdke> :)
[06:15] <mdke> the open cd?
[06:15] <jsgotangco> the only non-free on this laptop is xp itself and PowerDVD
[06:16] <jsgotangco> yeah, open cd and some more
[06:16] <mdke> when I installed XP on my laptop recently I found some cool free stuff
[06:16] <mdke> clamwin
[06:16] <mdke> hahaha
[06:17] <jsgotangco> haha
[06:17] <mdke> hahaha
[06:17] <mdke> anyhow as i was saying
[06:17] <jsgotangco> pretty dumb exit key
[06:17] <mdke> clamwin
[06:18] <mdke> also some cool putty based scp stuff
[06:18] <jsgotangco> hmm i have PuTTY
[06:18] <jsgotangco> AbiWord
[06:18] <jsgotangco> 7-zip
[06:18] <mdke> even whois for windows ;)
[06:18] <jsgotangco> its really nice
[06:18] <jsgotangco> ooohh
[06:19] <jsgotangco> hmmm what's SILC?
[06:20] <mdke> no idea
[06:21] <jsgotangco> JEEZZ
[06:21] <mdke> ;)
[06:21] <jsgotangco> the close button really closes gaim DUH
[06:22] <mdke> windows is intuitive like that
[06:22] <mdke> oh i see what you mean
[06:22] <mdke> instead of minimising it?
[06:22] <jsgotangco> yeah
[06:22] <jsgotangco> really dumb for an IM
[06:24] <jsgotangco> grrr local politics here really suck
[06:24] <jsgotangco> we don't deserve a democracy :)
[06:24] <mdke> they suck everywhere
[06:25] <mdke> i have to go out, supermarket
[06:25] <mdke> later mate
[06:25] <jsgotangco> later
[06:25] <jsgotangco> i gotta sleep too
[06:25] <jsgotangco> (12:25AM)
[07:36] <jsgotangco> froud: hey what's up buddy
[07:41] <jsgotangco> oh well maybe later, good night anways its almost 2am
[07:47] <Soneras> huhu, froud, you there?
[07:49] <froud> Soneras: hi
[07:50] <Soneras> ah, hi
[07:50] <Soneras> some questions
[07:50] <froud> sure
[07:51] <Soneras> when I do a change (like now with the screenshots) and do an svn up before I make the diff, wouldn't that overwrite my changes?
[07:52] <froud> no
[07:52] <froud> svn up will merge changes into the xml instance
[07:52] <froud> this way you can chck for C (conflict)
[07:53] <froud> I am working in the Kubuntu System Settings section at present so, so long as you stay clear of that section we should not conflict
[07:53] <Soneras> ok, next one (wasn't clear to me yesterday): when I send my changes as a diff to you. can I keep working with my current xml before my patch goes into svn and then send you more changes (including the previous ones)  and that would be ok?
[07:53] <froud> so hack the src and trust svn
[07:54] <Soneras> (haven't worked with any versioning system, thus the questions)
[07:54] <froud> better to finish your work session then patch
[07:54] <froud> wait for commit
[07:54] <froud> and svn up again before new session
[07:54] <Soneras> ok, thought small patches were better
[07:55] <froud> yes but when making changes of the nature you are doing now, the fewer the better
[07:55] <froud> however, if you are writing sections it is a good idea to patch small
[07:56] <Soneras> hmm. yes, that's why I ask . I'm finished with the layout shifting stuff and do consider o write a bit (if that's ok)
[07:56] <Soneras> sooo: when I change the actual docs (write some stuff, not just layout changes) you will review this (the english, writing layout) when I send you the patch? So I can basically edit, where I see fit? Adding some stuff, like more manual links and some more explanaitions (like kjobviewer and other one-sentence paragraphs).
[07:56] <froud> sure
[07:56] <Soneras> (sorry for the many questions)
[07:57] <froud> no questions are good
[07:57] <froud> just go ahead, scratch any itches you have and I will help
[07:58] <froud> Soneras: a few others work on kubuntu here. they are jjesse judax gtaylor mgalvin
[07:59] <Soneras> oh good, more people to annoy with questions ^^
[07:59] <froud> hehe
[08:00] <jjesse> grin i only use kubuntu
[08:00] <jjesse> btw intereseting discussion on slashdot on the announcement about the ubuntu foundation
[08:00] <Soneras> something kubuntu related? :D
[08:00] <froud> url
[08:01] <judax> Kubuntu rocks!
[08:01] <froud> lol
[08:01] <Soneras> hey, I like this channel
[08:01] <jjesse> http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/07/08/1240241&tid=163
[08:01] <froud> konqueror your desktop with konqi
[08:02] <froud> sometimes we have kde vs. footprint wars ;-)
[08:02] <judax> hehe, I have been spending some time in 'footprint' lately
[08:02] <jjesse> gasp on purpose?
[08:03] <Soneras> well, as long as they are less ugly as they get on slashdot sometimes... ;)
[08:03] <froud> sabdfl is going for mass adoption now
[08:03] <judax> yeah, just messing around, but I can't handle naut at all so I am not there long
[08:03] <froud> critical mass that's how foss works
[08:04] <Soneras> yeah, nautiluts (even the browser mode) is somewhat lacking, isn't it?
[08:06] <Soneras> froud: send you a patch - only the small layout changes. maybe I'll do some writing now (and the doc links). only system-settings is a no go at this time?
[08:07] <jjesse> i feel so far behind in my contributions to the kuserguide :(
[08:08] <judax> froud: are the kubuntu doc deb packages worked out yet?
[08:08] <froud> Soneras: yes, leave that section
[08:08] <froud> judax: yes, form tomorrow the name of the package is settled
[08:09] <froud> judax: we will be using kubuntu-docs_5.10-0.1 kubuntu-docs_5.10-0.2 kubuntu-docs_5.10-0.3 etc
[08:09] <froud> judax: then on release the number beocmes kubuntu-docs_5.10-1.0
[08:09] <froud> judax: over the weekend kubuntu-docs is getting uploaded so we have a footprint in th edistro
[08:10] <judax> froud: ok, are they hosted at http://lnix.net/~froud?
[08:10] <mdke> are you putting po files in the upload package?
[08:10] <froud> judax: yes, each night, providing there are changes, there is an update of that url and the package is built
[08:10] <froud> mdke: no not yet
[08:10] <mdke> ah ok good
[08:11] <froud> mdke: thought we do that as per release schedule
[08:11] <mdke> :)
[08:11] <froud> right?
[08:11] <judax> froud: ok, cool
[08:11] <mdke> i agree yeah
[08:11] <froud> jjesse: yes you are way behind dude
[08:12] <jjesse> grin thanks froud i know i'm way way behind
[08:12] <jjesse> everyone else is writing so much more then me
[08:12] <froud> jjesse: my stratergy is to write one section a day
[08:12] <froud> jjesse: if I can do more I do
[08:12] <judax> jjesse: I need to finish doc specs and do some writing too, been busy with work lately
[08:13] <froud> judax: content in the docs take priority IMHO
[08:13] <froud> specs, nice to have
[08:14] <jjesse> froud any response on the whole kynaptic vs apt-get vs kapture debate?
[08:14] <judax> froud: agreed
[08:14] <froud> jjesse: no, but as I learn things or notice them I add authorblurbs
[08:14] <froud> these are displayed in the reports
[08:15] <froud> so if these is a change or I think something needs note I mention it
[08:15] <froud> speak of the devil
[08:15] <froud> here's mgalvin
[08:15] <mgalvin> howdy
[08:15] <froud> nearly all the Kubuntu team here tonight
[08:15] <mgalvin> whats up
[08:16] <froud> we're just discussing kubuntu docs
[08:16] <froud> mgalvin: news is that kubuntu-docs_5.10_0.1_all.deb will be uploaded this weekend
[08:17] <froud> so we have a footprint in the daily builds
[08:17] <mgalvin> cool
[08:17] <froud> mgalvin: hows work
[08:17] <froud> stuf working, getting funding
[08:19] <froud> jjesse: its good to authorblurb if you find or learn something
[08:20] <froud> is everybody cool with the way Kubuntu docs is working at present?
[08:21] <jjesse> yes i am cool :)
[08:21] <judax> yeah
[08:21] <jjesse> froud are you cool?
[08:21] <judax> were you referencing something more specific?
[08:22] <froud> yeah, I just tend to move ahead and forget that others are lost
[08:22] <froud> so just making sure
[08:22] <froud> I think the main thing to focus on now is the content
[08:22] <froud> outlines are there, make system and packaging system
[08:22] <froud> oh and preview system
[08:22] <mgalvin> froud, funding? for what
[08:23] <judax> I will certainly ask if I get too lost
[08:23] <froud> mgalvin: never mind :-) r you cool with the way kubuntu-docs is going
[08:23] <mdke> funding?
[08:23] <froud> mdke: never mind
[08:24] <mdke> too late for that now
[08:24] <froud> geeze mention money and everybody is here
[08:24] <judax> froud said he was funding new laptops for the doc team
[08:24] <mgalvin> i just didn't know what you meant, i don't work where funding is needed
[08:24] <froud> mgalvin: no matter
[08:25] <mgalvin> yes, i'm cool with how kubuntu-docs is going :)
[08:25] <froud> ok
[08:25] <mdke> froud, its unusual of you to mention something then say "oh never mind" as if something secret is going on
[08:25] <mdke> its normal that people are gonna ask
[08:25] <froud> lol
[08:26] <froud> do the ppl working on kubuntu think that they can each contribute one sect a day between now and string freeze
[08:27] <jjesse> when is string freeze?
[08:28] <mgalvin> that sounds resonable... what about the ubuntu docs (gnome focused)? since i use ubuntu, i will be contributing more of that content
[08:29] <judax> my issue will be that fact that I will be going on a 2-week vacation starting 7/16 and will be traveling
[08:29] <mdke> mgalvin, no strict rules about contributions on the ubuntu docs to my knowledge
[08:31] <froud> judax: ok can you do what you can?
[08:31] <judax> froud: you bet
[08:31] <froud> mdke: when is string freeze again?
[08:31] <froud> judax: just take one section a day and write it
[08:32] <mdke> 7th september iirc
[08:32] <froud> judax: big or small
[08:34] <mgalvin> svn commit access, argh :)
[08:34] <mdke> mgalvin, we've been bugging elmo, also I asked henrik to bug him about it
[08:35] <froud> jjesse: can you do a section a day?
[08:36] <jjesse> i will try my hardest
[08:37] <froud> just for the record these are not strict rules
[08:37] <froud> just trying to get momentum on the work
[08:37] <froud> I find that if I do a section a day that it soon amounts to lots of work
[08:38] <froud> and the work becomes fun
[08:38] <froud> if I leave it then I find it hard to get started and going is slwo
[08:38] <froud> think it may be the same of others
[08:38] <jjesse> i thought work got fun when you got paid for it :P
[08:39] <froud> you want to get paid?
[08:39] <jjesse> grin nope just joking :)
[08:39] <froud> what country are you in again?
[08:39] <jjesse> us :)
[08:39] <froud> Ah yes
[08:40] <jjesse> i'm joking about getting paid to docs, trying be a smartass
[08:40] <froud> I know
[08:43] <judax> froud: sorry had to attend to work, I will try
[08:43] <froud> OK
[08:44] <froud> just do your best
[08:44] <froud> i figure if we each do a section a day that soon we will have completed a whole chunk of the work
[08:44] <froud> and we can start improving and tweaking
[08:45] <froud> splitting hairs and all that stuff
[08:45] <judax> one of our best storage architects just resigned, trying to put out fires
[08:45] <froud> yeah
[08:45] <froud> fires are nasty
[08:46] <judax> daily seems like
[08:46] <froud> judax: your in the us also right?
[08:47] <judax> yes, austin, texas
[08:47] <froud> and where is jjesse ?
[08:49] <froud> k
[08:49] <froud> Im back to work
[08:49] <judax> ok
[09:58] <mdke> ok i have wangled some webspace for ubuntu preview and status docs
[09:58] <mdke> thanks go to tseng
[09:58] <froud> cool
[09:59] <mdke> will build, upload and email later
[10:00] <mdke> bbl
[10:17] <mgalvin> i don't get it, all of my network speeds to ubuntu servers are at less then 5k/s, its taking forever to check out ubuntu-doc
[10:18] <froud> you still on breezy?
[10:18] <mgalvin> i just tried downloading the fedora iso to see if it me, i get 800k/s to their servers
[10:18] <mgalvin> yes
[10:18] <mgalvin> on breezy
[10:19] <froud> hmm I just did a deb build, it svn co from canonical at good spead
[10:19] <froud> speed
[10:20] <mgalvin> maybe a bad link btwn new york and your side of the globe
[10:20] <froud> I'm in co.za
[10:20] <froud> my traffic goes via new york
[10:21] <mgalvin> hmm
[10:22] <mgalvin> za goes thru the us, i didn't know that
[10:22] <froud> yeah, depends on your ISP
[10:23] <mdke> connects quite well here afaics
[10:23] <froud> mdke: the server is right next door to you ;-)
[10:24] <froud> mdke: cool on the web space
[10:24] <mdke> true and yeah
[10:24] <froud> beats waiting for people
[10:24] <froud> :-)
[10:24] <mdke> agreed
[10:24] <froud> lemme know if you need help with anything
[10:24] <mdke> i was already thinking of something ;)
[10:25] <mdke> i need to edit some files to include the gentoo address for the stylesheets
[10:25] <froud> I am mostly focusing on Kubuntu, but I dont want to see Ubuntu suffer for no good reason
[10:25] <mdke> can you tell me which files I need to edit?
[10:25] <froud> the xsl's in libs/
[10:26] <mdke> all of em?
[10:26] <froud> no, just a sec lemme see
[10:26] <froud> why you working on gentoo anyways
[10:27] <froud> that thing is only good for servers
[10:28] <mdke> hmm i wouldnt run it on a server ;)
[10:28] <mdke> its fun to play with tho
[10:28] <froud> no gentoo on server is good
[10:28] <mdke> right now my laptop is at the menders
[10:28] <mdke> it will be back next week but right now i need to use gentoo
[10:29] <froud> ok looks like jeffsch has the make system for ubuntu working from gnome/Makefile
[10:29] <froud> in Makefile you need to change
[10:29] <froud> else
[10:29] <froud> # SuSE
[10:29] <froud> NWDBXSL=/usr/share/xml/docbook/stylesheet/nwalsh/current/html/docbook.xsl
[10:29] <froud> endif
[10:29] <mdke> you adapted the stylesheet address for suse too right? I could just add it underneath
[10:30] <froud> no you need to replace
[10:30] <froud> or do an elseif
[10:30] <froud> just replace
[10:30] <mdke> ok
[10:31] <froud> then see gnome/libs/gnome-ubuntu.xsl
[10:31] <froud> change the import
[10:31] <froud> <xsl:import href="/usr/share/xml/docbook/stylesheet/nwalsh/html/profile-chunk.xsl"/>
[10:32] <froud> do you build styleguide?
[10:32] <mdke> i'll build anything
[10:32] <froud> then do the same in libs/style-guide-html.xsl
[10:32] <mdke> right
[10:33] <froud> that's it I think
[10:33] <mdke> now i just need to find the right address
[10:33] <froud> address?
[10:33] <mdke> for gentoo stylesheets
[10:34] <froud> Ah should be under the same area
[10:34] <froud> but may use current/
[10:34] <froud> here somewhere /usr/share/xml/docbook/stylesheet/nwalsh/current/
[10:34] <mdke> /usr/share/sgml/docbook/xsl-stylesheets-1.68.1/html/profile-chunk.xsl
[10:34] <mdke> ??
[10:35] <froud> yes those are the old paths
[10:35] <froud> do you have the new ones
[10:35] <mdke> those are the only files called profile-chunk.xsl
[10:35] <froud> then gentoo still uses the old path
[10:35] <froud> cool
[10:36] <froud> Updated http://www.lnix.net/~froud/
[10:38] <jeffsch> http://mypage.uniserve.ca/~jeffsch/writing/styleguide/index.html
[10:38] <jeffsch> style guide previews
[10:38] <froud> cool jeffsch
[10:38] <mdke> jeffsch, if you like I can put them on tseng's webspace, your call
[10:38] <jeffsch> doh! I just spent the morning setting it up...
[10:39] <jeffsch> but i will keep it for now
[10:39] <mdke> no problem if we leave it there
[10:39] <froud> he he
[10:39] <jeffsch> if my isp complains about traffice, then I will go to tseng
[10:39] <mdke> i'll just upload the gnome things then
[10:39] <froud> yep, good idea
[10:42] <mdke> hmm
[10:42] <mdke> some issues building
[10:42] <mdke> I get a lot of "No localization exists for "c" or "". Using default "en"." Is that bad?
[10:42] <mdke> by a lot, I mean a lot
[10:43] <mdke> (am doing make all)
[10:43] <froud> normal and wanted
[10:43] <froud> :-)
[10:43] <mdke> ah
[10:43] <mdke> it fails at about-ubuntu
[10:43] <mdke> i need to edit /libs/about-ubuntu-html-cust.xml i think
[10:45] <mdke> that one is built separately?
[10:52] <mdke> i edited that one, now "make all" has stopped at faqppc
[10:52] <mdke> Complete. Find outputs at ../build/gnome/faqppc/
[10:52] <mdke> (arg: 2)
[10:52] <mdke> it wants me to tell it something?
[10:52] <froud> huh
[10:53] <mdke> i pressed return and it returned me to the prompt
[10:53] <mdke> dunno what that (arg: 2) means
[10:54] <froud> when it says that then it should be finished
[10:54] <mdke> ok it looked like it was finished
[10:55] <mdke> has it built status reports too?
[10:55] <jeffsch> mdke: are the files in build/gnome/gaqppc?
[10:55] <mdke> looks like it
[10:55] <froud> chaps I must call it a night
[10:56] <mdke> ok thanks for your help froud
[10:56] <froud> mdke: nice one on the webspace
[10:56] <jeffsch> later dude
[10:56] <mgalvin> gnight froud
[10:56] <froud> jeffsch: nice one on the style guide
[10:56] <mdke> jeffsch, has "make all" updated the things in build/status for me?
[10:56] <jeffsch> hold on, i'll take a look at the makefile
[10:57] <froud> look forward to seeing ubuntu-docs_5.10-0.1_all.deb hitting the nightly builds
[10:57] <mdke> heh
[10:58] <mdke> i'm uploading
[10:58] <mdke> its 31MB so it will be a short while
[11:00] <froud> have you optimized
[11:01] <mdke> i haven't done anything
[11:08] <jeffsch> mdke: build/status is updated when you do make all
[11:08] <mdke> jeffsch, rock!
[11:08] <mdke> ok its nearly done uploading
[11:11] <mdke> jeffsch, now all we need to do is make a package ;)
[11:12] <mdke> what was that froud said about optimising?
[11:13] <jeffsch> i have no idea
[11:13] <mdke> must have been a way to make images smaller
[11:15] <mdke> http://tseng2.ath.cx/~ubuntu-doc/
[11:15] <mdke> i'll update the wiki
[11:17] <jeffsch> awesome man. and it works too!
[11:20] <mdke> :)
[11:20] <mdke> thanks for all your work on the build docs
[11:22] <jeffsch> anh, twernt nuthin :)
[11:22] <mdke> hmm
[11:22] <mdke> no faqguide status
[11:23] <jeffsch> faqguide status is not in makefile
[11:24] <jeffsch> hold on a sec, i'll add it.
[11:28] <jeffsch> mdke: add gnome/default.css to http://tseng2.ath.cx/~ubuntu-doc/
[11:33] <mdke> ok will do that
[11:35] <mdke> wiki page should be sorted now
[11:36] <jeffsch> ok. svn up and try "make status"
[11:37] <mdke> i ought to set up an rsync cron job to do some automatic upload
[11:37] <mdke> s
[11:38] <jeffsch> when you do, lemme know so i can copy it
[11:38] <jeffsch> i know nothing about that stuff
[11:39] <mdke> jeffsch, ok css is there
[11:40] <jeffsch> awesome
[11:40] <mdke> jeffsch, can we get default.css in build/gnome/?
[11:41] <mdke> actually maybe unnecessary
[11:41] <jeffsch> i have a default.css in my build/gnome
[11:42] <mdke> not me
[11:42] <mdke> i uploaded the whole folder
[11:43] <jeffsch> hmm... i must have put it there myself. I don't remember doing it, but that's not surprising!
[11:43] <mdke> ;)
[11:44] <jeffsch> oh wait! it's put there when you build the style guide, so if you didn't build the styleguide, then it won't be there
[11:44] <jeffsch> i can change that though, if you want, so that it always goes there
[11:45] <jeffsch> you can do it yourself if you want... see the lines
[11:46] <jeffsch> 	# copy style sheet to build directory
[11:46] <jeffsch> 	cp default.css ../build/gnome/default.css
[11:46] <jeffsch> in the makefile?
[11:48] <mdke> i will look
[11:48] <jeffsch> never mind... I'm testing it now...
[11:48] <mdke> i guess we will need it for the proper css when we build the final files
[11:48] <mdke> ok I am experimenting with rsync
[11:48] <mdke> doesn't look like it will work on tseng's server
[11:53] <mdke> jeffsch, here is a guide on how to do it though http://www.jdmz.net/ssh/
[12:00] <mdke> ah cool it works for tseng's server too


[12:25] <riassmismans> Hello, someone added this under my name without my permissions, can someone delete this? http://spreadubuntu.org/en/node/826


[12:40] <daker> newz2000, if i remember correctly, you were asking for something to monitor webpages right ?
[12:44] <daker> newz2000, https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/alertbox/
[16:13] <joey> mhall119: hi. phones in rooms = yes but they are likely to be conf bridges.   Nice screenshot
[16:17] <mhall119> joey: okay, we can add a phone number field easily enough, but that won't be considered by the scheduler, just so you know
[16:18] <joey> mhall119: not needed. There's a separate bug for the phone number stuff
[16:18] <mhall119> so if only a few rooms have a phone, and you have a meeting that specifically needs one, you'll have to get an admin (marianna or michelle) to manually schedule it in a room with a phone
[16:18] <mhall119> if all rooms have a phone, then that's not a problem
[16:19] <nigelb> I feel guilty at not being around :(
[16:19] <mhall119> you should
[16:19] <mhall119> :P
[16:19]  * nigelb needs a new job
[16:19] <mhall119> you just got a new job
[16:20] <nigelb> Yeah. But these unstable hours are killing my open source contributions
[17:17] <nigelb> newz2000: ping
[17:18] <nigelb> newz2000: can we do something about the wiki's bad wrapping?
[18:21] <newz2000> nigelb: can you give an example? Is this related to <pre> stuff?
[18:21] <nigelb> newz2000: Indeed.
[18:21] <nigelb> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/appdevweek1109/MakingYourAppSpeakLanguageswithLaunchpadTranslations
[18:26] <newz2000> nigelb: does white-space: pre-wrap; provide an acceptable solution? The example you posted is less beautiful but maybe that's workable
[18:26] <nigelb> newz2000: Yup, it does.
[18:27] <newz2000> I'll add it to my todo list to get an update pushed out
[18:27] <nigelb> Great! thanks :)
[18:47] <cjohnston> mhall119: do you know what the status on getting openid-auth updated?
[18:49] <cjohnston> and is there a real difference between rt 17731 and 17498?
[18:50] <mhall119> cjohnston: dunno, I'll have to check on them later
[18:50] <cjohnston> mind if i start checking into 17731?
[18:51] <cjohnston> sorry.. its actually 17810 and 17498.
[20:53] <cjohnston> mhall119: is it in a ppa somewhere that I can install it locally?
[21:16] <mhall119> hmm, I don't know if the ISD PPA is public
[21:16] <mhall119> nope, it's not
[21:17] <mhall119> you can build it from the branch though
[21:19] <mhall119> or just put the branch into your PYTHONPATH
[21:23] <cjohnston> that sounds hard
[21:25] <mhall119> I could make it easier by putting it in the Makefile
[21:26] <cjohnston> the one that i dont use?
[21:28] <cjohnston> james_w: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/security-o-apparmor-dbus  any idea what can be done to fix status complaining about the milestone target of later?
[21:28] <james_w> no, not currently
[21:29] <cjohnston> uggh.. ok