[19:34] <jacqolive> HI
[19:35] <jacqolive> Does anyone know how to get involved with developing for Ubuntu in java?
[19:57] <mhall119|work> jacqolive: probably bug triaging is a good place to start
[19:57] <mhall119|work> then bug fixing or packaging
[19:57] <mhall119|work> I know there's a java packaging push going on
[20:33] <jacqolive> mhall119|work: thanks, would launchpad be the place to get involved in this or is there some other place that i can have a look at?
[20:42] <maxb> What exactly do you want to get involved in?
[20:42] <maxb> Writing new things in Java for Ubuntu? Packaging more Java software for Ubuntu? Improving the packaging of Java software already in Ubuntu?
[20:43] <maxb> Launchpad is likely to figure heavily in doing *anything* Ubuntu related, but it's more a tool, than a place to communicate
[20:44] <maxb> jacqolive: ^
[20:46] <jacqolive> maxb: i would like to develop new things in java for ubuntu
[20:51] <maxb> I'm not very familiar with the "new features" process, but I think early discussion of the things you want to create, such that you work out a rough specification, is important, and you'll want to have a look at the launchpad blueprints system. The ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing lists or #ubuntu-devel IRC channel seem like good places to air an initial idea and solicit pointers about where best to discuss it further


[02:20] <xivulo1> if anyone is interested in helping out on the artwork for the ubuntu windows installer, please let me know via email (gmail): agostino . russo
[11:32] <troy_s> kwwii: Added yet another to the wiki.  On a side note, if you have the 'shorterlist' finished, I can do the leg work of montaging them and such.
[11:33] <kwwii> troy_s: cool, I'll check it out...the list should go online by monday I guess
[11:33] <kwwii> I'll let you know if I need help :-)
[11:34] <kwwii> it is now empty and I intend to keep it that way
[11:39] <kwwii> I could use some ideas on formating the page...let's talk about that when the list is ready
[11:43] <troy_s> kwwii: Well _someone_ had to clean that queue out.
[11:43] <troy_s> kwwii: I offered to volunteer for some of it, but there wasn't a reply.
[11:44] <kwwii> seems like the moderators that are listed are not very active anymore
[11:44] <kwwii> we should have a meeting sometime soon and work out that and a couple of other issues
[11:45] <troy_s> kwwii: At any rate, let me know.  I have a boatload of stuffs to click on this weekend re the other projects, but default bits will have some time allocated assuming need.
[11:45] <kwwii> cool, will do
[11:45] <troy_s> kwwii: Did skuttlebiscuit have anything to say about any of the subs?
[11:46] <kwwii> yeah, I think he was amazed at how many nice pics there are on that page
[11:47] <troy_s> kwwii: Lol.  Same as always.  Edgydejavu.
[11:47] <kwwii> he sent me a list of his favorites...I am going to combine that with my favorites and a couple others from the comments on the wiki, etc
[11:47] <troy_s> kwwii: The problem was more about steering (as can be again exemplified by the almost identical state of affairs.)
[11:48] <troy_s> kwwii: What was he leaning towards?  It could probably help to generate further things along similar lines.
[11:48] <kwwii> 4874 from joseph seems to be his favorite so far (that is also the one I tweaked and put with my first submissions)
[11:48] <troy_s> (although who knows.  It seems a big enough struggle to get the same hue as the samples provided)
[11:49] <troy_s> Yeah figured as much.  It is a bloody blows knockoff from win98
[11:49] <troy_s> lol
[11:49] <kwwii> it is not only a problem of getting the hue right
[11:49] <kwwii> I found that simply taking a design and using the same colors doesn't work well
[11:49] <kwwii> it really depends on the individual design
[11:50] <kwwii> heh? I do not remember win98 having a background like that
[11:50] <troy_s> kwwii: Sure, unless you are developing for shuttle.  His hue sense tends to be in direct relationship to something else.
[11:50] <kwwii> wow, mystical is pretty awesome
[11:50] <troy_s> kwwii: Uh... let me see if I can dig it up.
[11:51] <troy_s> kwwii: It was vaguely like the vista wallpaper -- but more sweepy curvey -- just like xubuntu's (well almost identical)
[11:52] <troy_s> kwwii: More or less a tweaked time lapsed light based bit of photography.
[11:52] <kwwii> luckily I am an old school mac user so nobody can say I copied windows :p
[11:52] <troy_s> kwwii:  I found vista's ocean referential wallpaper interesting in tones though.
[11:52] <kwwii> those pics from joseph are all made from photographs
[11:53] <troy_s> kwwii: Yes... they look suspiciously like long term exposures.
[11:53] <kwwii> never seen that
[11:53] <troy_s> kwwii: Vista's default?
[11:53] <kwwii> never even seen vista :p
[11:53] <troy_s> kwwii: A few bits of ocean rays more or less (although it is restated enough that it is not quite 'underwater')
[11:54] <kwwii> cool, I should google for it
[11:54] <troy_s> http://www.piplos.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/05/windows-vista-aurora-wallpaper.jpg
[11:54] <troy_s> Ocean tone + rays + sweepy bloody curves.
[11:54] <troy_s> lol
[11:54] <kwwii> wow, that is the default in vista?
[11:55] <kwwii> I wonder why they couldn't get something better
[11:55] <troy_s> kwwii: Well it is pretty well executed in my mind.  Albeit about 5 years overdone.
[11:56] <troy_s> kwwii: Leopard's new wallpaper isn't much better, but is probably symptomatic of a larger move away from that glassy shiny plastic.
[11:56] <kwwii> yeah
[11:57] <troy_s> kwwii: You have seen the silverlight promo -- its close to that xp style (which appears to be what shuts is heading for)
[11:57] <troy_s> http://www.bit-101.com/misc/silverlight_wallpaper.jpg
[11:58] <troy_s> which was close to osx's wall from <can't remember version)
[11:58] <troy_s> http://www.bit-101.com/misc/panther_wallpaper.jpg
[11:58] <kwwii> actually I do not think that mark is really pushing for something like that but it is, in his eyes, one of the better pics of those available on the wiki
[11:59] <troy_s> But the vista thing very clearly takes some cues from underwater photography -- which is rather interesting as it tends to translate well to the abstracts.
[11:59] <kwwii> I guess he did not see your versions (unless he checks the wiki often which I doubt
[11:59] <troy_s> http://xtreview.com/images/windows-vista-5728/vista-first-install-screen.jpg
[11:59] <troy_s> i doubt he would like either quite frankly.
[11:59] <kwwii> I like that background better than the whole desktop
[12:00] <troy_s> the fucking monochrome thing must die.
[12:00] <troy_s> it really is a deal breaker.
[12:00] <kwwii> the desktop pic (as compared to the installer) has very distracting lines (and the part on the lower right looks crappy, if you ask me)
[12:01] <troy_s> you can't even fully execute a sense of 'awe' or anything close when you are locked into a single hue with only varying value.
[12:01] <troy_s> the contrast of hues is what helps to deliver that.
[12:01] <kwwii> I agree with that - I will talk to him about the whole direction in october
[12:01] <kwwii> I am trying to avoid discussing this with him per email
[12:01] <troy_s> the problem is you can't say things like 'In oil painting it is common to use a highlight composed of the complimentary colour'
[12:01] <troy_s> lol
[12:03] <troy_s> Anywho... I'm off for yet another night shoot's sleep.
[12:03] <troy_s> Hit me with email or whatever.
[12:04] <kwwii> sleep well
[12:04] <kwwii> I will
[12:05] <troy_s> That brown elephant texture is pretty bloody amazing.
[12:07] <troy_s> Although my personal vote goes for Physalis
[12:36] <andreasn> I thought the elephant was nice as well
[12:38] <andreasn> although picking a default wallpaper is hell, so I'm staying out of this discussion :)
[12:44] <lapo> hi
[08:04] <titanix88> hey nothlit
[08:06] <titanix88> anyone there?
[08:20] <nothlit> titanix88: heyas
[08:28] <titanix88> nothlit : i upload it in the attachments!
[08:29] <titanix88> gutsy incoming wiki...
[08:32] <nothlit> ooh its there now :D
[08:33] <titanix88> nothlit what abt the second one?
[08:34] <nothlit> titanix88: thats an interesting backdrop
[08:34] <nothlit> titanix88: you may want to go with more interesting placement, or angles
[08:35] <nothlit> also fiddle with the lighting, and play with the thickness and bevel of the logo a bit so its not standard
[08:35] <nothlit> and get rid of the plastic look =p
[08:36] <titanix88> download the 2nd .blend and find what i didn't do there . but in the end i some how could not like a perspective.
[08:38] <titanix88> it is beveled. 3d. the second layer has a particle generated logo which i did not use.
[08:38] <titanix88> maybe u can configure it for me.
[08:40] <titanix88> only creative was the background i say:(
[08:42] <nothlit> titanix88: import the svg, and once you convert it to a mesh, extrude the faces gradually or however you want to do it
[08:43] <nothlit> you can join it all together for easier editing
[08:43] <nothlit> and then just vertex paint it or assign vertices materials
[08:44] <nothlit> titanix88: yeah creative use of bumpmapping :)
[08:44] <titanix88> i do not have time anymore as i have to go back to my hoestel tommorrow. :(
[08:48] <titanix88> nothlit:anyone will say it's a plain 2d logo. but it is not.;)
[08:52] <nothlit> titanix88: you could also create an interesting form and then assign it as the bevel object for your representative logo curves
[08:52] <nothlit> titanix88: lol :)
[08:55] <titanix88> one interesting exp: i tried to engrave it one a cube and then boolean took 2hours.lol
[08:56] <nothlit> yeah blender booleans are supposed to suck
[08:57] <titanix88> why?
[08:58] <nothlit> underworked area of code
[08:58] <nothlit> there is a script though, but you could also just use a different modeler
[09:02] <titanix88> i dont like the way curve to mesh looks.
[09:05] <titanix88> u can never subdivide a converted mesh frm curve. it will look ugly as hell.
[09:06] <nothlit> titanix88: you can choose how many steps you want in the curve properties
[09:09] <titanix88> i mean lot's of triangular faces makes it harder to control
[09:11] <nothlit> oh lol
[09:12] <titanix88> nothlit: btw u wanna improve it?
[09:12] <nothlit> nah i have a few ideas i'm fiddling with
[09:13] <nothlit> titanix88: this was my happy accident yesterday with a little bit of photoshopping https://people.fluxbuntu.org/~nothlit/communitytheme/gutsy/wallpapers/buntuindigo.png
[09:14] <_titanix88> i'm back.
[09:14] <_titanix88> so...
[09:15] <nothlit> oh
[09:15] <nothlit> did you get any of my messages?
[09:16] <_titanix88> no
[09:17] <_titanix88> :(
[09:17] <nothlit> 03:10:45 < titanix88> nothlit: btw u wanna improve it?
[09:17] <nothlit> 03:10:59 < nothlit> nah i have a few ideas i'm fiddling with
[09:17] <nothlit> 03:11:32 < nothlit> titanix88: this was my happy accident yesterday with a little bit of photoshopping https://people.fluxbuntu.org/~nothlit/communitytheme/gutsy/wallpapers/buntuindigo.png
[09:19] <_titanix88> got it.congrats!
[09:23] <_titanix88> got to go! bye


[03:46] <bluesabre> First slideshow screen: https://imgur.com/a/pFFcyIa
[03:48] <bluesabre> I'm going to do the most basic migration of our current slideshow for the POC
[04:22] <pleia2> knome: no, but I can put in a support request to Canonical to do it
[04:41] <bluesabre> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOzKoD1woT8 The Xubuntu flutter installer is coming along pretty nicely
[04:41] <bluesabre> (currently running in a Budgie session, need to figure out what thing is missing from Xubuntu session to make it run)
[09:31] <knome> pleia2, aaah, then i can do it myself as well :)
[09:32] <knome> main thing is, do we want to "do eet"?
[09:33] <knome> wow the language slider has a looooot of empty space and not too many languages shown (:
[09:33] <knome> but looks like good progress
[14:00] <pleia2> sounds good to me
[14:48] <knome> no objections on the dead ML either, so let's pick a (sum)domain
[14:48] <knome> reldocs.xubuntu.org?
[14:48] <knome> or would releases.xubuntu.org be better?
[14:48] <knome> i'm thinking it might be a bit misleading
[14:48] <knome> i think i'd prefer our wp release pages to be teh landing points
[18:41] <Eickmeyer> bluesabre: You'll have to tell me how you replaced the Minotaur on the front with the Xubuntu logo so I can do something similar.
[21:19] <fossfreedom_> Eickmeyer drop a mascot.png into the assets folder
[21:19] <Eickmeyer> fossfreedom_: Yeah, I just did, rebuilding now.
[21:20] <Eickmeyer> (figured it out)
[21:25] <Eickmeyer> bluesabre: To get it actually working under xfce, make sure after `git submodule update --init --recursive` you also `git submodule update --remote --merge` to get this morning's commit that fixes the issue of running under non-GNOME environments.


[12:22] <gnomefreak> is there a known issue with fonts?
[12:52] <pygi> sivang, poke
[12:52] <pygi> sorry to bug at this time, but I need you
[01:10] <gnomefreak> what is the meta package for Xfonts?
[01:18] <decrypt> Seveas kontaktgestoort zeker? Problemen thuis of zo? En ik de dupe. Nou je bent een schande voor de community
[01:19] <decrypt> Seveas ik weet ook wel dat je weet dat je dom reageerd. Maar helemaal zielig dat je het dan ook niet durft toe te geven.
[01:20] <Seveas> decrypt, stop right here. this channel is not for escalating problems from #ubuntu or other channels. If you want to discuss, calm down and come to #ubuntu-ops
[01:27] <bddebian> Heya
[01:53] <^ohoel> does metacity in edgy come with compositor support?
[01:54] <^ohoel> sorry, wrong channel and bad question
[02:38] <bluefoxicy> Seveas: You do know that went right over my head, right?
[02:39] <Seveas> bluefoxicy, ?
[02:39] <bluefoxicy> Seveas:  <user> @!*# @$*^  some language I don't get !@@^* @^ <Seveas> *says something in english*
[02:40] <Seveas> bluefoxicy, ah -- that person was just swearing
[02:40] <Seveas> people tend to think they can be abusive in here after being thrown out of another ubuntu channel for that reason
[02:40] <bluefoxicy> Ah.   It's amusing though, watching a conversation occur in two different languages is extremely disorienting.
[02:41] <bluefoxicy> Seveas:  Is it ever too early to open a new spec that builds on an old one?  :)
[02:42] <Seveas> you can always start a spec
[02:43] <bluefoxicy> Seveas:  I'm still working on one that attempts to describe a method for using pitti's AutomatedProblemReports to categorize and tag problems in ways that bring more attention to likely security vulnerabilities; but it feels a little premature because I really have no idea what pitti's stuff is going to do besides collect data and cram it somewhere probably at launchpad
[02:44] <bluefoxicy> For all I know he could have figured this all out ages ago ;)
[04:43] <desrt> anyone played with edgy xen yet?
[04:46] <crimsun> desrt: zul.
[04:46] <desrt> zul?
[04:46] <desrt> oh.  zul.
[04:46] <desrt> zul; 'sup?
[04:47] <bddebian> Heya crimsun
[04:47] <crimsun> heya.
[04:52] <zul> desrt: hey
[04:53] <desrt> zul; xen me up, baby
[04:53] <desrt> how's it working?
[04:53] <zul> one or two issues that im working with but its cool..
[04:53] <zul> wait for the upload for monday
[04:53] <desrt> is it in the stock edgy kernel yet or do you have to install a -xen kernel?
[04:54] <zul> its not in the stock edgy kernel there is a kernel in universe that needs to be rebuilt because of a ftbfs but i have the kernel-image if you want it
[04:54] <desrt> i can wait for monday :)
[04:54] <zul> ok
[04:54] <desrt> thanks for the info.
[04:55] <zul> no probs
[05:02] <desrt> zul; one more question.  2.x or 3.x?
[05:04] <zul> 3
[05:08] <bluefoxicy> I love how I'll make a Wiki page, rabidly edit it, fill up my mail box
[05:08] <bluefoxicy> and there's like 6 more devs that get e-mailed everything
[05:08] <bluefoxicy> I am waiting for the day I get a bunch of e-mails entailing people being pissed at me and something about full inboxes.
[05:14] <nictuku> l
[05:15] <bddebian> m
[05:21] <bddebian> I thought XbuildX versions got synced automagically?
[07:11] <bluefoxicy> big comment at the end.
[07:13] <bluefoxicy> aww.
[07:13] <bluefoxicy> My comment didn't dwarf the rest of the content of that page
[07:13] <bluefoxicy> I'm losing my edge.
[07:14] <Hobbsee> hi all.  who broke dhclient
[07:14] <bluefoxicy> Hobbsee:  wasn't me.  I appear to have sat on somebody's glasses though.
[07:15] <Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: ah.  great.
[07:15] <Hobbsee> someone broked my eth0 :(
[07:16] <desrt> drinking from the firehose?
[07:16] <imbrandon_> moins Hobbsee, i've almost got a a new box finished up, adding some hardware and such tonight ( bout the only time i've had to work on it the laste few days )
[07:17] <Hobbsee> imbrandon_: yay!!!
[07:17] <Hobbsee> desrt: a spec, to do with bug tracking.
[07:17] <desrt> ah.
[07:17] <desrt> each bug is a drop of water
[07:18] <desrt> malone is becoming a firehose
[07:18] <desrt> got it
[07:18] <Hobbsee> yeah, there are about that many of them...
[07:18] <Hobbsee> :P
[07:30] <bluefoxicy> desert yeah.  I've been working on some stuff and I saw it and was like 'You know you could probably...'
[07:32] <bluefoxicy> the best part of that comment is "encouraging users to not report crashes may be an option"
[07:54] <bluefoxicy> ahh screw it
[07:55] <bluefoxicy> I'll continue butchering pitti's stuff by spawning loads of excessive specifications on top of his barely started specifications XD
[08:18] <bluefoxicy> memory is what the hell?  I find that hard to believe.  *checks top*
[08:18] <bluefoxicy> Mem:    970916k total,   924908k used,    46008k free,    15472k buffers
[08:18] <bluefoxicy> Swap:  4208944k total,    19148k used,  4189796k free,   362060k cached
[08:18] <bluefoxicy> gnome's multi-load applet says memory is "100% in use by programs, 0% in use by cache"
[08:18] <bluefoxicy> does 362/970 look like 0%?
[08:19] <bluefoxicy> (I know what the problem is...)
[08:19] <bluefoxicy> Fixed.
[08:20] <bluefoxicy> The applet was 1 pixel high.  I jiggered with it, it fixed itself.  wHy the hell is it basing its calculations on its visual display instead of data from the system
[08:54] <bluefoxicy> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AutomatedProblemReportsTagging is a horrid, ugly brain dump.
[08:56] <Burgundavia> bluefoxicy: john moser tends to write like that
[08:57] <bluefoxicy> Burgundavia:  I just wrote that out, AutomatedProblemReportsTaggingForSecurity was a bit cleaner before I started but I'm trying to abstract parts of the spec into other specs to avoid diluting the different bits.
[08:58] <bluefoxicy> I'm working on cleaning them all up.
[09:29] <bluefoxicy> ok, I am going to sleep
[09:29] <bluefoxicy> That stuff looks relatively clean.
[10:38] <HiddenWolf> Yagisan, please turn of the away-script in this channel, thank you.
[10:39] <Yagisan> HiddenWolf, thanks I've already been chatised for trying a new client. It should be stopped now
[12:10] <hunger__> What can I do to debug "Command failed" when running update-initramfs -u
[12:15] <infinity> hunger__: sh -x /usr/sbin/update-initramfs -u
[12:16] <hunger__> infinity: Thanks.
[12:17] <hunger__> infinity: Just wrote a bugreport about initramfs (#54423). It does include that output now.
[12:19] <infinity> Erm, that's curious...
[12:21] <infinity> What the heck is giving you that "Command failed" output?
[12:21] <infinity> Is that from your shell?
[12:21] <hunger__> infinity: I am in a root shell and enter "update-initramfs -u"
[12:21] <infinity> Cause it sure doesn't come from either mkinitramfs or update-initramfs.
[12:21] <hunger__> infinity: I do see that during upgrades sometimes, too.
[12:22] <StevenK> infinity: It looked to come from mkinitramfs to me.
[12:22] <infinity> StevenK: it doesn't.
[12:22] <hunger__> infinity: return code of update-initramfs is 0 by the way, maybe that helps?
[12:22] <infinity> (Unless it's coming from some random hook script from some package or other I don't have installed)
[12:22] <StevenK> Could it be a dash thing?
[12:23] <infinity> hunger__: It will always be 0 if mkinitramfs exited 0, so that's not so helpful.
[12:23] <infinity> StevenK: My /bin/sh appears to be dash here..
[12:24] <StevenK> infinity: As in 'Command failed' is coming from dash
[12:24] <hunger__> infinity: so is mine.
[12:24] <infinity> StevenK: Oh, possibly, but I wouldn't expect dash to be that verbose.
[12:24] <infinity> (base)adconrad@cthulhu:~$ dash
[12:24] <infinity> $ false
[12:24] <infinity> $
[12:24] <infinity> Nah.  Not verbose at all.
[12:24] <StevenK> Well, Herbert has certainly left his mark on dash.
[12:24] <StevenK> infinity: It might be a bashism in mkinitramfs
[12:25] <StevenK> However, I suspect they have probably been shaken out already.
[12:25] <hunger__> infinity: Where are those hook scripts?
[12:25] <infinity> StevenK: Again, not likely, since I'm running dash here too.  And it was always written with dash in mind anyway.
[12:25] <infinity> (Since half of it has to be able to run in dash in the initrd)
[12:25] <StevenK> How about we just get hunger__ to run mkinitramfs with -x?
[12:25] <infinity> hunger__: /usr/share/initramfs-tools
[12:26] <infinity> StevenK: Yeah, that was my next call.
[12:26] <hunger__> infinity: I got cryptroot, evms, kernelextras, lvm, md, thermal, udev and usplash in /u/s/irf-t/hooks.
[12:26] <infinity> hunger__: mkinitramfs -o /tmp/junk.img 2.6.17-5-686
[12:27] <infinity> Err, with a "sh -x /usr/sbin/" on the front of that. :)
[12:27] <hunger__> infinity: Command failed.
[12:28] <hunger__> infinity: lots of output, last line "Command failed"
[12:28] <StevenK> Second last line?
[12:28] <hunger__> initlist= cryptroot evms kernelextras lvm md thermal udev usplash
[12:28] <hunger__> then
[12:28] <hunger__> + set - cryptroot evms kernelextras lvm md thermal udev usplash
[12:28] <hunger__> then Command failed.
[12:29] <infinity> Right, add a "set -x" somewhere to the top of /usr/share/initramfs-tools/hooks/cryptroot
[12:29] <infinity> And then try again.
[12:30] <infinity> And if that's the one bombing, reassign the bug, I don't ship that script. :)
[12:30] <hunger__> infinity: "Command failed" happens right after "+ dmsetup info -c --noheadings -j 8 -m 4"
[12:30] <hunger__> infinity: So this is not your bug I think:-)
[12:30] <infinity> \o/
[12:31] <infinity> Add that info to the bug report, and reassign like the wind.
[12:31] <hunger__> infinity: reassign to?
[12:31] <infinity> dpkg -S /usr/share/initramfs-tools/hooks/cryptroot
[12:31] <infinity> Whatever paqckage that spits out. :)
[12:31] <infinity> package, too.
[12:33] <ajmitch> StevenK: what have they done now?
[12:33] <StevenK> The afl.com.au website is breaking.
[12:34] <ajmitch> right, so nothing important
[12:34] <StevenK> Well no, since I'm listening to the streaming audio call.
[12:35] <hunger__> Is it save to just delete scripts I do not need from the hook dir?
[12:36] <StevenK> hunger__: You could remove the package in question.
[12:36] <StevenK> Depends if anything depends on it.
[12:37] <StevenK> Oh geez, that sentence makes sense.
[12:37] <hunger__> StevenK: I do need that package or I would not have it installed:-)
[12:37] <hunger__> I have crypted volumes, but by / is not encrypted.
[12:37] <StevenK> Ah. I think that script only deals with a encrypted rootfs, so you probably could delete it.
[12:38] <StevenK> hunger__: Which package is to blame, by the way?
[12:38] <hunger__> cryptsetup
[12:39] <hunger__> s/them/themselves/
[12:40] <hunger__> I love that almost as much as -doc debs depending on the executable:-(
[01:28] <jono> hey
[01:39] <tseng> heya jono
[01:42] <jono> hey tseng
[01:43] <TheMuso> c
[01:45] <imbrandon> moins TheMuso
[01:45] <TheMuso> Hey imbrandon.
[02:55] <cypher1> can i program an application and submit to ubuntu ?
[02:56] <Zdra> cypher1: if you make a package you can upload it for review on ubuntu-motu
[02:58] <bddebian> Hello
[02:59] <cypher1> Zdra, it is not a package..if someone writes a program which he thinks is useful, can he submit to ubuntu..or should he do it to sourceforge or somewhere else similar ?
[03:00] <cypher1> hi bddebian
[03:00] <zul> well i would write the program put it somewhere and then package it and then upload to revu
[03:00] <Hobbsee> so sourceforge, yeah
[03:02] <bddebian> Hello cypher1, zul
[04:11] <Pupeno> Hello.
[04:11] <Pupeno> is it possible to compile linux-source-2.6.17_2.6.17-5.16 only for my architecture instead of for all of them ?
[04:33] <lucas> how can I force a package to include a TOC on the ubuntu wiki ?
[04:57] <wasabi> and the zeroconf thread continues.
[05:03] <bddebian> wasabi: Continues?  It never ends :-)
[05:03] <Treenaks> it's like Debian's duelling banjos
[05:03] <Treenaks> it never stops
[05:03] <wasabi> No new points have been raised in over 2 weeks on this thread.
[05:03] <wasabi> But I think, since nobody reads all 2 weeks worth of content before posting, they keep going over the same thing in circles.
[05:23] <mdz> I stopped reading it on the first day
[05:24] <Hobbsee> mdz: kill the remains of suspend2 while your'e at it?  although it looks like that has almost died.
[05:26] <bluefoxicy> mdz:  now that I read it, the spec says it'll be disabled by default and enabled by user action... isn't everyone bitching because they don't want it enabled by default?
[05:27] <mjg59> Lots of people want it enabled by default
[05:27] <mdz> I stopped reading it on the first day
[05:27] <mdz> we took a decision on this about a year ago
[05:27] <bluefoxicy> mjg59:  ah so instead of "OMFG DON'T TURN IT ON BY DEFAULT *HOLYWAR*" you're getting "OMFG BUT I'M TOO LAZY TO CLICK A BUTTON *HOLYWAR*"?
[05:28] <shackan> do macs enable it by default or not ?
[05:29] <slomo_> shackan: they do
[05:29] <bluefoxicy> Also there should be a "Not a single remote hole in the default installation in 2 years" notice on the front page to mock OpenBSD </OBSD troll>
[05:29] <mjg59> Can we please not have this discussion here?
[05:29] <shackan> then why shouldn't you? well, ok, this discussion doesn't belong here
[05:29] <mjg59> The technical details are well understood, it's a policy decision
[05:30] <bluefoxicy> shackan:  open by default means a default permit policy for incoming connections or something like that (magical network setup behind the scenes); and also violates the "no ports open by default" policy
[05:30] <mjg59> bluefoxicy: Ssh
[05:31] <bluefoxicy> mjg59:  into what?  :)
[05:31] <angasule> hello, as can be seen in: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=55173&   joystick support is close to non-existent, in my case, after plugging an analog joystick to the soundcard gameport, I had to mknod and modprobe to get it to work, the GUI only said it couldn't find a joystick device (and gave no help on how to set it up), I'm using kubuntu, but this is an ubuntu magic issue, so it shouldn't matter, I guess
[05:31] <madduck> Hobbsee: suspend2 has not died, it's just experiencing name and maintainer change
[05:31] <mjg59> madduck: Not really
[05:31] <mjg59> madduck: We're talking about the irritating thread on ubuntu-devel
[05:31] <mjg59> /That/ seems to have died
[05:31] <bluefoxicy> heh
[05:31] <madduck> ah, okay. want me to revive it? :)
[05:32] <mjg59> madduck: Want me to brutally murder you? :)
[05:32] <madduck> mjg59: that could be fun. :)
[05:32] <madduck> mjg59: will you be at the party?
[05:32] <bluefoxicy> murder-death-kill
[05:32] <mjg59> madduck: Ought to be
[05:32] <madduck> sweet.
[05:32] <mjg59> angasule: Can you file a bug about that, please?
[05:32] <bddebian> Hey, I want to go to the kill madduck party! :-)
[05:33] <madduck> bddebian: sorry, only VIPs. :)
[05:33] <Hobbsee> heh
[05:33] <bddebian> heh
[05:33] <mjg59> angasule: The issue is likely to be over how information about joystick ports is actually exposed to the OS
[05:33] <bluefoxicy> if there's ever a party in baltimore somebody call me
[05:33] <bddebian> Oh man there is such a wide opening for a joke in that statement
[05:33] <madduck> bddebian: it's not the killing party, but http://wiki.earth.li/DebianParty2006
[05:34] <bluefoxicy> bddebian:  this is a family oriented channel, or something.  Despite how many times Keybuk can say 'fuck' in under an hour when something goes wrong.  :)
[05:34] <angasule> what is the ubuntu bugzilla? bugzilla.ubuntu.com requests a password and recommends going to bugzilla.ubuntu.com ...
[05:34] <Philip5> hi guys, i have a problem when building a deb package with dpkg-buildpackage and everthing starts fine, gets configed but when dpkg-parsechangelog is to run the debian/changelog have been been deleted somehow... anyone know if there is a comman problem that makes this behaviour?
[05:34] <mjg59> angasule: launchpad.net
[05:34] <bddebian> madduck: Oh, cool
[05:34] <mjg59> angasule: And then if you could let me know the bug number
[05:34] <bluefoxicy> I should spec that now.  A counter in the bottom right of the status bar in xchat-gnome
[05:35] <angasule> mjg59: analog joystick on soundcard gameport is too simple, even if the magic can't detect it, there should be an automatic script to enable it on user command
[05:35] <bluefoxicy> to tally the amount of foul language developers spout off.
[05:35] <mjg59> angasule: It would be preferable to just make it work all the time
[05:35] <angasule> yes, of course
[05:35] <mjg59> madduck: I can't find my wiki password, and the reminder mail thing is broken
[05:35] <bluefoxicy> mjg59:  this is an issue of "can hal see it"
[05:36] <bluefoxicy> I think.  You know what I have nfc.
[05:36] <madduck> mjg59: will add you then?
[05:36] <mjg59> bluefoxicy: ISA cards provide the information via isapnp
[05:36] <mjg59> madduck: Sure
[05:36] <mjg59> bluefoxicy: The issue is PCI cards with legacy gameport hardware
[05:36] <angasule> also, I have a USB HID-compliant joystick which I'll connect in a week or two when i get the time, those two should cover a lot of ground (although I'm guessing the USB one will work without much trouble)
[05:37] <mjg59> angasule: Yeah, USB should just work
[05:37] <Treenaks> mjg59: it does for me (2 logitech pads, one with "feedback")
[05:37] <slomo_> mdz: are you fine with updating evolution-sharp to a cvs snapshot that works with our latest evolution-data server? (compatibility for this was the only change)
[05:37] <mjg59> It might well just be a matter of adding the PCI IDs of all the appropriate soundcards to the ns558 driver
[05:37] <angasule> also, qjoypad or a similar utility is a *must*, since hats have a tendency to be detected as axes, I don't know why
[05:37] <mdz> slomo_: yep
[05:38] <slomo_> mdz: thanks
[05:38] <mjg59> angasule: Or we could try to fix that bug
[05:38] <mjg59> (to the extent possible)
[05:39] <angasule> mjg59: well, qjoypad does a lot more than just provide a workaround for that
[05:42] <mjg59> Then it's somewhat less of a must
[05:42] <angasule> 52257 and 17245 are related bugs, I'll post a bug now (I was checking existing bugs)
[05:43] <mjg59> Hang on, just let me check those ones
[05:43] <mjg59> Ok, file a new one
[05:48] <bluefoxicy> Slapping the user with a dialog vs. pulsing an icon in the Notification Area
[05:48] <bluefoxicy> a dialog is annoying and invasive; but an active icon in the notification area may draw excess CPU?
[05:48] <bluefoxicy> I dunno.
[05:49] <doko> mdz: openoffice.org-experimental in edgy, it even installs and starts
[05:50] <angasule> mjg59: bug 54458  https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/54458
[05:50] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 54458 in Ubuntu "Analog joystick on soundcard gameport not detected" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/54458
[05:50] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 54458 in Ubuntu "Analog joystick on soundcard gameport not detected" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]
[05:51] <bluefoxicy> doko:  what is -experimental?
[05:51] <mdz> doko: neat
[05:51] <bluefoxicy> hi pitti
[05:51] <pitti> hi
[05:52] <mjg59> angasule: Thanks
[05:52] <mjg59> angasule: What sort of gameport do you have? Is it part of your soundcard?
[05:53] <doko> bluefoxicy: native build
[05:53] <angasule> yes
[05:53] <bluefoxicy> pitti:  I was bored from 2am-4am last night, did you see I forked a bazillion specs out of the automated-problem-reports spec?
[05:53] <bluefoxicy> doko:  so amd64?
[05:53] <angasule> it's the old kind, that uses a couple of 100k ohm resistors and such
[05:54] <mjg59> angasule: Right. But is it part of your soundcard?
[05:54] <angasule> yes, it's part of my soundcard
[05:54] <mjg59> What sort of soundcard?
[05:54] <angasule> it's a Sound Blaster Live (I mentioned it in the report)
[05:54] <mjg59> Ok
[05:54] <mjg59> Does the emu10k1-gp driver get loaded?
[05:54] <angasule> not sure exactly /which/ SB Live, I could find out, if it's important
[05:55] <bluefoxicy> pitti:  there's one to describe the feedback mechanism ("if it detects a crash report it can read, it creates a notification which points to the file and asks to file a bug." <-- describe this); one on tagging and searching to find similar (likely the same bug) crashes; and one (which may become mainly informational) on using the tagging and sorting to locate likely security bugs
[05:56] <angasule> mjg59: lsmod says: emu10k1_gp              4224  0
[05:56] <angasule> mjg59: I currently have the joystick modules loaded, should I remove the script, reboot, and give you clean data?
[05:57] <mjg59> angasule: Ok. Is the ns558 module loaded?
[05:57] <angasule> mjg59: no
[05:57] <mjg59> angasule: Ok
[05:57] <bluefoxicy> ok I'm going to go take a shower.
[06:02] <mjg59> How do I add another package to a bug in launchpad?
[06:04] <zul_> no idea
[06:15] <bluefoxicy> Is anyone else having gksu problems?
[06:44] <AlinuxOS> mjg59, ping.
[06:45] <mjg59> AlinuxOS: Hi
[06:46] <AlinuxOS> mjg59, I would like to ask you if you have some time to package BPG's new fonts.
[06:46] <mjg59> AlinuxOS: It's done
[06:46] <mjg59> Just needs to be synced from Debian
[06:47] <AlinuxOS> mjg59, I've created georgian users suitable fonts.conf file.
[06:47] <mjg59> AlinuxOS: Yeah, I've included that
[06:48] <AlinuxOS> mjg59, :) heh great.
[06:49] <AlinuxOS> mjg59, and how about if there is more then 1 users ?
[06:49] <mjg59> AlinuxOS: It's installed system-wide
[06:49] <AlinuxOS> is fonts.conf installed in each /home/user/.fonts  or there is other way to do this ?
[06:49] <AlinuxOS> mjg59, ah ok
[06:51] <AlinuxOS> ttf-bpg-georgian-fonts in 0.2 version there was missed entry in /etc/defoma/hints/ttf-bpg-georgian-fonts.hints, is it corrected in 0.3 version ?
[06:53] <AlinuxOS> mjg59, and I hope that 0.3 will be available for Dapper too :) not only for Edgy.
[06:53] <AlinuxOS> ;)
[06:57] <AlinuxOS> mjg59, http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/t/ttf-bpg-georgian-fonts/ttf-bpg-georgian-fonts_0.3/changelog
[06:57] <AlinuxOS> ok everything is clear now.
[06:57] <AlinuxOS> I'll test it as soon as possible.
[07:18] <amnezia> hi. when I'm compiling lirc, it needs bttv.h in the kernel sources which is nowhere in dapper. considering the bttv module is in dapper, I don't see why it's headers are missing. is this a bug or intended to be so?
[07:28] <bmonty_away> amnezia: you need to install the appropriate linux-headers package, but you should really ask this question in #ubuntu
[07:41] <mikearthur> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.15/+bug/34508
[07:41] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 34508 in linux-source-2.6.15 "2.6.15 kernel fails to boot on ppc machine" [High,Fix released]
[07:41] <mikearthur> was this never fixed?
[07:42] <mikearthur> I know it says fixed
[07:42] <mikearthur> but I'm still getting the same problem on the latest linux-image
[09:04] <carthik> Hi, could someone take a look at Bug 54475 - a cdimage.u.c. bug which I can't seem to find the best way to bring to the notice of whoever manages the site? Thanks.
[09:04] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 54475 in ogre "cdimage.u.c/daily breezy" [Untriaged,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/54475
[09:08] <infinity> carthik: Oddly enough, filing the bug DOES get it to the right people.
[09:08] <infinity> carthik: It's not catastrophic, it doesn't need extra enforcement on IRC, we'll poke it when we get to it (ie: when people are at work, rather than 5am on Sunday)
[09:09] <carthik> infinity, notice that the bug is filed against the wrong "package" and there is no package I could find that was suitable. Sorry if I shouldn't have mentioned it here.
[09:12] <infinity> Oh, I didn't notice the wrong package.  Should be against ubuntu-cdimage.  I'll reassign.
[09:13] <carthik> thanks infinity - sorry for any aggravation caused :)
[09:57] <amnezia> bmonty:  sure thanks. I asked here because I searched for the header file on packages.ubuntu.com and no package provided it
[09:58] <gnomefreak> amnezia: try linux-headers package
[10:05] <amnezia> gnomefreak:  no bttv.h there either
[10:13] <amnezia> thanks for the info, will look deeper into it at a later time
[10:28] <bluefoxicy> wow.  There's a spec for Fluxbox Ubuntu
[10:30] <LaserJock> I thought that was already done
[10:33] <^ohoel> flubuntu?
[10:43] <pygi> fubuntu
[10:45] <bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  enlightenment or flux?
[10:46] <LaserJock> bluefoxicy: both
[10:46] <bluefoxicy> I don't see an enlightenment one off the top of my head on launchpad
[10:47] <LaserJock> hmm, I'm not sure there is a spec on LP for it, but there's stuff out there on it
[10:48] <crimsun> (ebuntu & flubuntu iirc)
[10:51] <bluefoxicy> heh
[10:51] <bluefoxicy> ctrl+alt+delete to launch gnome-system-monitor except I always use ctrl+shift+escape
[10:51] <LaserJock> I think ebuntu might have died out in favor of something else
[10:52] <ogra> it never really existed, unless you call something fully based on checkinstall a distro :)
[10:53] <bluefoxicy> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommonCustomizations <-- this thing keeps saying stuff about gnome-app-install
[10:53] <LaserJock> ogra: well, they did have a website and a livecd ;-)
[10:53] <ogra> sure
[10:53] <LaserJock> bluefoxicy: yeah
[10:53] <bluefoxicy> I am thinking that adding more stuff to g-a-i is not going to help users much; they'll be like "I have a new system-- ooh a jillion kwhatevertheselooklikegamse hey why do they not look like the rest of my GNOME apps?"
[10:54] <ogra> i could make fedorubuntu based on alien an put that on a livecd :)
[10:54] <LaserJock> lol
[10:54] <bluefoxicy> also I still would like to be able to disable KDE/GNOME stuff in g-a-i
[10:54] <bluefoxicy> so if using Kubuntu (not that I ever would but..) GTK+ apps won't accidentally be installed, and if using Ubuntu KDE apps won't accidentally be installed.
[10:55] <bluefoxicy> Qt/GTK mix and match UIs look like shit, seriously
[10:56] <bluefoxicy> at any rate
[10:57] <LaserJock> bluefoxicy: as usual, file bugs and write patches ;-)
[10:57] <bluefoxicy> If the solution to "we need X Y and Z easily available to the user because these are common things he will install" is "put it in gnome-app-install," you should probably fix the default page in Firefox to have a link to /usr/share/doc/something/getting_started.html or whatnot, and list the various things the user may like to install
[10:58] <bluefoxicy> complete with screenshots and step by step instructions of course ;) (if this is legal... is it legal to tell people to go install msttcorefonts?)
[10:58] <bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  nods.  I probably will.  When I finish searching for the Sky Temple keys.
[11:46] <pygi> mdz, you here perhaps?
[12:06] <CarlFK> Should the edgy installer give me fd0 as a install choice?  http://dev.personnelware.com/carl/temp/Jul29/b/EdgyInstallToFloppy.png
[12:07] <CarlFK> and is debian-installer the package to bug?


[00:05] <bazhang> :0
[00:06] <Seeker`> :/
[00:06] <bazhang> they've all gone mad or evil!
[00:06] <Seeker`> not me!
[00:06] <MadMule> mwahaha
[00:06] <Seeker`> I've always been mad!
[00:06] <bazhang> ohnoez
[00:50] <bazhang> mikebrady is keithclark
[00:51] <Flannel> Is that significant?
[00:51] <bazhang> could be
[00:51] <Flannel> Is KC banned?
[00:52] <bazhang> he was giving some very odd info on how he ever got linux onto his computer, then claimed linux cannot be installed without cd-rom
[00:52] <bazhang> first it was via pclinuxos, then ubuntu, then some 'link specific to internet' that he could no longer find
[00:53] <jdong> what the?
[00:53] <jdong> lol
[00:53] <bazhang> grub error 15
[00:53] <jdong> he didn't install it by using paperclips to flip the bits?
[00:53] <bazhang> hehe
[00:54] <bazhang> no floppy, computer is too old to use usb...
[00:54] <bazhang> err boot from usb
[00:54] <bazhang> 'how did you install?'  'internet'
[01:07] <Flannel> Geez.  What's with people tonight?  Trying to make it as hard as possible for me to help them.
[01:08] <bazhang> seems that way here too
[01:09] <Flannel> It's like pulling teeth.  Ask them for a pastebin, they give you pieces of what you asked for.  And then tell you they got a brand new error! but, of course, telling you what it is doesn't make sense.
[01:27] <Seeker`> Flannel: I've got a problem; can you help?
[01:27] <Flannel> Seeker`: Um.  I can try!
[01:29] <Flannel> ah!     Do we have a translator?
[01:42]  * Amaranth hides
[02:13] <Seeker`> is everyone feeling a bit less hate-ful now?
[02:14] <LjL> Seeker`: i hate to be hateful, but i still hate you :(
[02:15] <Seeker`> :'(
[02:15] <Seeker`> that makes me sad
[02:15] <LjL> Seeker`: strange. it makes me grap.
[02:18] <Seeker`> "grap"?
[02:18] <LjL> Seeker`: think about it carefully, without excluding any sort of extremely dry humor when examining possibilities
[02:19] <Seeker`> am too tired to think
[02:19] <bazhang> or just /ignore
[02:20] <bazhang> no hate from these quarters
[02:21] <LjL> bazhang: quarters past three?
[02:22] <LjL> my hatred goes on am and pm
[02:22] <bazhang> this is the same grant-a who said he left ubuntu because it was akin to slavery and erm something else unpleasant
[02:23] <LjL> bazhang: i dunno, he was certainly the same grant-a who got banned sometime
[02:24] <bazhang> LjL, yep, and was all 'let me quote the logs on that'
[02:25] <bazhang> LjL, better cellphone than t he E71 in your opinion (if you have one)
[02:25] <bazhang> a cellphone that is
[02:26] <LjL> bazhang: err i don't know... i've got an E50 but i'm not really big into cellphones, although i played with S60 a little software-side
[02:26] <bazhang> LjL, okay thanks
[02:26] <bazhang> know you have no end to opinions, just wanted to clarify :)
[02:27] <LjL> bazhang: well, all i can say is i'm not extremely fond of my E50... also, since they seem to say that the E50's battery lasts long, i dare not imagine the others.
[02:28] <bazhang> not extremely fond=a lasting and durable hatred I am guessing
[02:30] <LjL> bazhang: no... just not extremely fond. it's fancy, it's funny, but my plain nokia 3510 with b/w screen made calls just fine and the battery lasted in excess of a week, and it didn't take 10 seconds to open up the SMS editing "application" or the phonebook
[02:47] <bazhang> abusive!
[02:48] <Seeker`> blah
[03:02] <Seeker`> at least if i'm not an op i don't have to deal with silly people, I can just walk away
[03:03] <bazhang> heh
[03:03] <bazhang> I'm not operator in there either; never have been
[03:03] <Seeker`> I think I only have ops in -uk
[03:03] <Seeker`> and -scribes
[03:04] <bazhang> you wish in #ubuntu ?
[03:04] <Seeker`> huh?
[03:04] <bazhang> to have operator privileges?
[03:05] <Seeker`> not particularly bothered
[03:05] <bazhang> aha
[03:05] <Seeker`> if someone wants to make me an op in #u I wont object
[03:06] <Seeker`> but i'm not going to pester anyone for it or anything
[03:09] <Seeker`> ssssh, he's back!
[03:10] <bazhang> ohnoez
[03:10] <nickrud> where, where?
[03:11] <bazhang> not sure who one would pester exactly, it seems to be a very ad-hoc way of deciding those types of things
[03:12] <Seeker`> bazhang: would probably start with the irc council
[03:12] <Flannel> Yeah.  It's not ad-hoc
[03:13] <nickrud> what things?
[03:14] <Seeker`> nickrud: who gets to be an op in #u
[03:14] <nickrud> oh yeah, ad hoc'ing it for years
[03:14] <bazhang> heh
[03:15] <Seeker`> i think it is deicded through a complex series of equations, tests and "eney-meeny-miny-moe"
[03:16] <nickrud> although the last round, the only one I've seen there was some general discussion about who to ask iirc. No formal stuff that I saw anywhere
[03:16] <tritium> Have not all current ops been asked to be such?
[03:17] <nickrud> no I stole a password
[03:17] <bazhang> haha
[03:17] <tritium> Figures, nickrud ;)
[03:17] <Seeker`> tritium: I believe there is a discussion that happens on some level to decide suitable candidates, then they are asked if they want the position
[03:18] <nickrud> can't see anything wrong with the choices made so far (and to you too, tritium :)
[03:18] <bazhang> the uber-level
[03:18] <tritium> nickrud: :)
[03:18] <tritium> Seeker`: that may be
[03:19] <Seeker`> nickrud: you say that, but remember, bazhang is an op :O
[03:20] <Seeker`> and jrib :O
[03:20] <bazhang> :(
[03:20] <nickrud> some poor soul has to spend time in #kubuntu. Better him than me
[03:20] <Seeker`> haha
[03:21] <jrib> :o
[03:21] <nickrud> Seeker`, hey, I just remembered, I was asked about bazhang and I recommended him >:|
[03:21] <Seeker`> nickrud: that was silly!
[03:21] <bazhang> :/
[03:21] <Seeker`> I mean...erm...great choice...
[03:22] <Seeker`> :)
[03:22] <nickrud> well, they were looking for quantity of help over quality at the time, it was right about when I was chosen :)
[03:23] <Seeker`> if they ever look for time spent idling in channels, i'm well in!
[03:24] <Amaranth> wtf
[03:24] <Amaranth> I can't remove bans via ChanServ anymore
[03:24] <Seeker`> where?
[03:24] <bazhang> haha
[03:24] <Amaranth> #ubuntu-offtopic
[03:24] <bazhang> -ot
[03:24] <Pici> I got you
[03:24] <Seeker`> Amaranth: that'll teach you!
[03:25] <Seeker`> Amaranth: what error message do you get?
[03:25] <Amaranth> -ChanServ- You are not authorized to perform this operation.
[03:25] <Seeker`> :O
[03:29] <Seeker`> no idea what could cause that
[03:30] <tritium> Amaranth: you're only the first entry on the access list!  Bizarre...
[03:31] <Amaranth> looks like no one except the council has permission to clear bans via chanserv
[03:31] <Seeker`> Amaranth: in any #ubuntu channel?
[03:32] <Amaranth> in #ubuntu-offtopic at least
[03:32] <Amaranth> #ubuntu has the same permissions though
[03:32] <Seeker`> Grant-A: how can we help you?
[03:32] <Grant-A> whoops
[03:32] <Grant-A> wrong channel
[03:32] <Grant-A> sorry
[03:32] <Seeker`> banforward?
[03:32] <Seeker`> @btlogin
[03:33] <Flannel> Nope
[03:33] <Flannel> Looks like he's banned here though?
[03:33] <Flannel> Oh, those are marks.
[03:34] <Seeker`> There should be an "action" column in the bna tracker
[03:35] <Seeker`> Mark, Kick, Ban
[03:35] <Seeker`> just to make it a bit more obvious at half 3 in the morning
[03:35] <Flannel> kicks are by name, bans generally arent.  and marks have the entire host/ident/etc
[03:36] <Seeker`> yes, but it takes some looking at to work it out
[03:36] <Flannel> Seeker`: If youre that groggy at 3am, you likely ought not to be doing op stuff ;)
[03:37] <Seeker`> i'm not that groggy at 3am
[03:37] <Seeker`> at 3:30am maybe :P
[03:43] <Seeker`> bedtime
[03:43] <Seeker`> night
[03:43] <tritium> Good night, Seeker`.
[03:43] <bazhang> night
[03:45] <elky> Flannel, it would make it quicker in general if there was a column with M, K, or B
[03:49] <Seeker`> elky++
[03:49]  * Seeker` really gone
[03:59] <elky> ikonia, um, i forgot about the whole '4g of ram' thing, and installed i386. d'oh!
[04:01] <Flannel> He's beliggerent.
[04:02] <Flannel> Mmm, and that's not spelt correctly.
[04:02] <tritium> elky: is there 64bit flashplugin-nonfree now?
[04:02] <elky> tritium, i genuinely do not know
[04:02] <tritium> elky: there may not be
[04:02] <elky> what a revolting name...
[04:03] <JohnLesbergtion> ok
[04:03] <JohnLesbergtion> I wish to report a rebuse
[04:03] <JohnLesbergtion> abuse*
[04:03] <jrib> tritium: for a few releases now installing flashplugin-nonfree will work fine on amd64
[04:03] <jrib> JohnLesbergtion: ok
[04:03] <tritium> jrib: that's good to know.  Java too?
[04:03] <JohnLesbergtion> ok
[04:03] <JohnLesbergtion> Flannel
[04:03] <jrib> tritium: no browser plugin from sun, but I think that's changing in jaunty
[04:03] <JohnLesbergtion> banned me for no reason
[04:04] <tritium> jrib: thanks
[04:04] <JohnLesbergtion> he banend me for away
[04:04] <JohnLesbergtion> but
[04:04] <JohnLesbergtion> that is no good reason
[04:04] <JohnLesbergtion> and that is considered op abuse
[04:04] <JohnLesbergtion> He is a bad op
[04:04] <jrib> JohnLesbergtion: #ubuntu is a very busy channel, so we ask that users not use public away messages like that.     You should respect those policies.
[04:07] <elky> JohnLesbergtion, there are no staff.
[04:07] <jrib> I'd like ops in this channel to be able to remove people like that
[04:07] <bazhang> heh
[04:07] <jrib> (seriously)
[04:07] <elky> jrib, had it continued any longer, he would have been removed
[04:08] <tritium> Aye.
[04:08] <elky> @mark JohnLesbergtion
[04:08] <bazhang> I'd like a pony
[04:08] <Amaranth> @btlogin
[04:08] <elky> jrib, the only reason i didn't do so as soon as you would have liked, is because he's now left us a sample of his personality
[04:08] <Amaranth> that's cool
[04:08] <Amaranth> the @mark, I mean
[04:09] <elky> Amaranth, yah
[04:09] <elky> @mark
[04:09] <bazhang> Flannel, was that the belligerence you referenced?
[04:09] <elky> Flannel, did you have him in PM?
[04:09] <Flannel> He was like that in query for a bit too.  Which is why I actually banned him (well, forwarded).  Once the "You can't tell me how to run my IRC client" thing turned into a "I'm going to start flaming your system" and "finding exploits" etc, etc.
[04:09] <Flannel> elky: I did.  Like a paste?
[04:09] <Flannel> The PM is what originally prompted the ban.
[04:09] <bazhang> that was so over the top
[04:09] <elky> Flannel, comment on the ban in the bt
[04:09] <Flannel> Alright
[04:10] <Flannel> You want me to just remove the forward and make it a proper ban?
[04:10] <elky> yeah, and drop it altogether tomorrow
[04:11] <tritium> Wha?
[04:11] <bazhang> erry too?
[04:11] <Flannel> erry?
[04:11] <bazhang> errietta
[04:12] <elky> what about err*
[04:12] <elky> ?
[04:12] <bazhang> the one who threatened to sue freenode if they didnt fix her script? after being banned in #ubuntu and #apache ?
[04:13] <tritium> I don't see the motivation for removing JohnLesbergtion's ban tomorrow.
[04:14] <Flannel> I'd just as soon leave it as a forward, so we can talk to him next time he comes back (hopefully a little calmer)
[04:14] <Flannel> Then again, I suppose plenty of banned people find their way here anyway
[04:14] <bazhang> @bansearch errietta
[04:15] <Flannel> Is today the 13th?
[04:15] <Flannel> Oh, so it is.
[04:15] <tritium> Friday, even.
[04:15] <bazhang> 14th here
[04:15] <Flannel> bazhang: Happy Pi day!
[04:15] <bazhang> Flannel, thanks!
[04:15] <elky> bazhang, i imagine that is a freenode issue now then
[04:16] <bazhang> elky, they then removed her cloak
[04:18] <elky> bazhang, then so long as her script is fixed, and she's not actually making threats, and it's been a day or two, then she can be let back in. it's easy enough to re-apply the ban, and it will then give you the argument to keep the ban on
[04:18] <bazhang> elky, ok
[04:19] <elky> bazhang, it's much easier to argue to keep someone out when they have reoffended, then if they haven't
[04:19] <elky> you just have to give them enough rope
[04:20] <bazhang> true
[04:20]  * Flannel wonders what happened to elky, and who has replaced her.
[04:21] <bazhang> hehe
[04:21] <bazhang> that password stealing nickrud I bet
[04:21] <Flannel> Ah.  Makes sense.
[04:25] <elky> Flannel, nobody's replaced me, dear
[04:25] <Flannel> elky: Did you get into a car accident?  Do you remember where you live?
[04:25] <Flannel> What hospital are you staying at?  we can send flowers.
[04:26] <elky> Flannel, <elky> you just have to give them enough rope
[04:26] <Flannel> elky: Yeah, I know.  You're still all for bannination.  It's just not in your usual manner.
[04:26] <tritium> bannination, eh?
[04:26] <Flannel> We got in an argument over a similar issue not too long ago.
[04:26] <tritium> Is that like bannage?
[04:27] <elky> if you want to wait and talk to him first, fine. go for it. otherwise, just let him back in and watch him like a hawk
[04:27] <Flannel> tritium: Yep.  banninating the countryside, banninating the peasants.
[04:27] <tritium> Got it.
[04:27] <Flannel> tritium: banninating all the peoples in the... thatched roof cottages!
[04:28] <elky> Flannel, my point is that arguing with them for days over a first offense is what wears most of us down
[04:31] <tritium> nixternal: didn't like screen-profiles, eh?
[04:31] <nixternal> nope, they get in the way of irssi and my userlist
[04:32]  * Flannel never understood the point of screen profiles.
[04:33] <nixternal> well, they make it easier for new screen users I think
[04:33] <nixternal> if you have to use a bunch of screens then I can understand it
[04:33] <Flannel> Why would a new screen user have more than one screen?
[04:34] <Flannel> There should just be a default hardstatus set to alwayslastline, and then we'll be done with it.
[04:34] <nixternal> right
[04:36] <jrib> !dvd =~ s#http://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/desktopguide/C/common-tasks-chap.html#https://help.ubuntu.com/8.10/musicvideophotos/C/video.html#
[04:36] <jrib> :/
[04:37] <Flannel> !-dvd
[04:37] <Flannel> jrib: do it to codecs
[04:38] <jrib> !codecs =~ s#http://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/desktopguide/C/common-tasks-chap.html#https://help.ubuntu.com/8.10/musicvideophotos/C/video.html#
[04:38] <jrib> Flannel: thanks
[04:38] <Flannel> Mmmm, perhaps bots should warn about that.
[04:38] <Flannel> if regexping an alias
[04:38] <Flannel> Nothing changed there (it is an alias)
[04:38] <jrib> they should just do the smart thing
[04:41] <elky> and change the parent? yeah
[04:59] <tritium> Bed time.  Good night, folks.
[05:00] <bazhang> night
[05:43] <Myrtti> elky: poit
[05:43] <elky> ?
[05:51] <Myrtti> holycow?
[05:51] <Myrtti> @bansearch holycow
[05:52] <Myrtti> even I know that nice
[05:52] <Myrtti> nick
[05:52] <Myrtti> should he not be on #u?
[05:52] <Flannel> I think he got cleaned
[05:52] <bazhang> he reformed iirc
[05:53] <Flannel> Removed Feb 11... that'd be during the cleaning
[05:53] <Myrtti> Flannel: you have different results than I do
[05:54] <Flannel> Myrtti: same host as above, i-k-o.... set and removed
[05:55] <Flannel> set on Jan 16, removed Feb 11. alogn with another one for 11 days in Nov
[05:55] <Myrtti> ok
[05:56] <Myrtti> elky: pm?
[06:39] <Myrtti> hmmm
[06:39] <Myrtti> coffee?
[06:47]  * elky wonders what she needs for the fingerprint reader...
[06:49] <Flannel> hardware.
[06:50] <Flannel> A capacitive touch sensor, an IR (or some other light) source, and a receiver for said light source.  (an array would be best)
[06:50] <Flannel> and... that's about it!
[06:51] <elky> the vostro has the hardware...
[06:51] <Flannel> Ooooh
[06:51] <Flannel> libpam-thinkfinger
[06:51] <elky> for dells?
[06:51] <Flannel> and then follow the instructions in the readme.debian
[06:52] <elky> there's also another one
[06:52] <Flannel> for a good chunk of the fingerprint readers, yes.
[06:52] <Flannel> Its MFC based, not laptop brand
[06:52] <elky> MFC?
[06:52] <Flannel> Manufacturer
[06:53] <Flannel> that is, the brand of the fingerprint reader (more specifically, the chipset), and not the laptop/etc
[06:58] <elky> um, ok... now how do i use the thinkfinger thing?
[06:58] <Flannel> read the README.Debian file, it tells you what to add in PAM
[06:58] <Flannel> and tells you how to enroll, and then you're done!
[06:58] <Flannel> or, maybe it doesn't tell you how to enroll.  Let me know.
[07:04] <elky> that file needs updating. it references tf-tools which should be thinkfinger-tools and the path to the enable script still has the redundant lib/libpam- instead of /lib/pam-
[07:06] <elky> and tf-tool is not very userfriendly
[07:08] <elky> tf-tool --aquire refuses to work
[07:09] <Flannel> Maybe your fingerprint reader doesn't work with it.  There's,... a list somewhere on the interblags
[07:09] <elky> please find. i'm sure it'd be a trivial detection thingie
[07:10] <Flannel> It'll be connected via usb, so youcan already poke around to see what lsusb gives you
[07:10] <Flannel> elky: you using sudo?
[07:10] <elky> it sees it fine
[07:10] <elky> :(
[07:10] <Flannel> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ThinkFinger
[07:11] <Flannel> elky: what brand fingerprint reader is it?
[07:11] <elky> um, didn think of that
[07:11] <Flannel> Ah
[07:12] <elky> sgs thompson microelectronics
[07:12] <Flannel> Yep, that's the right kind.
[07:12] <Flannel> Mmmm
[07:12] <Flannel> Half of the time?
[07:12] <elky> the 'error' is 'mode undefined'
[07:12] <Flannel> USB ID 0483:2016 ? that one?
[07:13] <elky> yah
[07:13] <Flannel> Then the reader is good.  Try --verbose too
[07:15] <nalioth> can anyone tell me why intrepid is still broken?
[07:16] <elky> Flannel, it only tells me that it's in verbose mode, then the same 'mode undefined'
[07:16] <Flannel> Odd.  No idea.
[07:16] <elky> nalioth, define 'broken'
[07:17] <nalioth> well, i just dist-upgraded from hardy to inteprid, and have no gui
[07:17] <nalioth> gdm starts up twice without issue, but nothing happens
[07:17] <Myrtti> nalioth: multifail
[07:18] <nalioth> Myrtti: i take it this hasn't been reported?
[07:19] <nalioth> i just can't believe we're almost to jaunty release, and this still happens
[07:19] <nalioth> this is why i don't upgrade when a release appears
[07:20] <nalioth> but you'd think 5+ months would be long enough for the bugs to disappear
[07:20] <elky> i dont know what video card you have, what you had installed, what you had removed, whether you're using proprietary drivers, or why you're sounding like the 'fix this now, slave' trolls in #ubuntu
[07:20] <nalioth> my apologies.
[07:20] <nalioth> just venting
[07:20] <elky> accepted
[07:20]  * Myrtti huggles elky and nalioth
[07:21] <elky> yeah, i know.
[07:21] <elky> and most of the kids in #ubuntu are just venting too ;)
[07:21] <nalioth> i mean FIVE MONTHS . .
[07:21] <Myrtti> I love you both
[07:21] <Myrtti> silly rabbits
[07:22] <elky> nalioth, my mother had a similar issue for a whole release a while back (she got gui, but with painfully slow refresh, hence web browsing was agonising), she tried several times  to upgrade, but rolled back each time
[07:22] <Myrtti> there's a similar thing with xubuntu
[07:23] <Myrtti> gdm launches several xfce session managers
[07:23] <elky> well, she didn't roll back, i helped her set up a 'test' partition
[07:23] <Myrtti> can't remember was it h -> i or i -> j though
[07:23] <elky> she'd log in and do all updates, but it never resolved until the next release
[07:24] <elky> this was dapper -> feisty iirc
[07:24] <elky> so a fair time ago now
[07:26] <Myrtti> gaah
[07:26] <Myrtti> my ginger tablets are too big :-C
[07:30] <elky> um, was m0nik3r5_ unbanned?
[07:30] <elky> @btlogin
[07:31] <elky> hrm, none showing up...
[07:31] <elky> @bansearch m0nik3r5
[07:32] <nalioth> hmmmkay
[07:32] <nalioth> something very weird going on here
[07:35] <elky> nalioth, is it still friday there?
[07:40] <nalioth> elky: it's been saturday for almost 3 hours
[07:41] <nalioth> seems my nvidia driver didn't get upgraded
[07:41] <nalioth> with much hiliarity
[07:41] <elky> is the 'ubuntu-desktop' package still installed?
[07:52] <nalioth> elky: nope, it didn't arrive with the upgrade
[07:52] <elky> then apt-get it down
[07:52] <nalioth> already tried that
[07:53] <elky> didnt fix it?
[07:53] <nalioth> only the ubuntu-desktop metapackage is not installed (all else is)
[07:53] <nalioth> all that it calls
[07:53] <elky> can you pull down an older kernel at all?
[07:53] <nalioth> my nvidia driver didn't get installed (and am doing so now)
[07:54] <elky> a guy at work has an nvidia card and it's had probs in the past fortnight only
[07:58] <nalioth> i have no idea what to do
[07:59] <nalioth> my "Hardware Drivers" thingy won't let me enable it
[07:59] <nalioth> i've installed the nvidia driver at the console, but it's not taken effect
[08:00]  * Myrtti huggles the considerably less evil Gary
[08:00] <Gary> oooo huggles neat
[08:10] <Myrtti> Dear $DEITY. Please forgive me that I want to smack ASUS-tek for being an annoying brat
[08:14]  * nalioth pushes the smart person who decided to not install nvidia drivers during an upgrade in behind ASUS-tek
[08:14] <Myrtti> TAKE IT OFF
[08:14] <Myrtti> TAKE IT OFF
[08:14] <Myrtti> make him go away
[08:15] <Myrtti> PLEASE
[08:15] <Myrtti> I'm so close to killing him over the Internet
[08:15] <elky> Myrtti, where?
[08:15] <elky> nm, i se
[08:15] <Myrtti> his stupidity and language makes my brain melt
[08:15] <Myrtti> though I have to admit
[08:15] <Myrtti> he doesn't even pretend to speak proper english
[08:16] <Myrtti> so I guess this mystical creature land of christels called NORGE is acceptable
[08:18] <Myrtti> hopefully I can be few hours without his stupidity in -ot now
[08:21] <Myrtti> I also get the feeling he's taunting me on purpose nowadays
[08:22] <nalioth> Myrtti: this channel is logged, so he might just be
[08:22] <Myrtti> true
[08:23] <Myrtti> I just looooove this net stalkers
[08:23] <Myrtti> I've got three requests of totally unknown people in facebook currently
[08:24] <Myrtti> s/this/these/
[08:24] <Myrtti> damned English language
[08:24] <Myrtti> here I am, ranting about how someone else misuses it, and fail in it myself
[08:26] <Myrtti> I should probably stop using IRC altogether
[08:26] <Myrtti> this isn't my place anymore
[08:27] <jussi01> Myrtti: your fine... just relax!
[08:27] <Myrtti> though, that would drop me from the Ubuntu Community altogether, since I don't really use forums, attend any meetings, read or write on mailing lists or anything
[08:31] <Myrtti> or perhaps I'll just drop -offtopic from my channels
[08:35] <nalioth> 5 months and KDE is still broken, too

[08:35] <nalioth> it's 0330 here, y'all stay warm
[08:37] <Myrtti> I have a rant inside of me, but I'll just bottle it up and let it pass. *sigh* I should clean this place up and start packing.
[08:38] <jussi01> nini nalioth
[08:38] <Myrtti> I actually think I'll go back to bed for a while. Have fun with hynix.
[08:38]  * elky huggles Myrtti
[08:39] <elky> Myrtti, you cant stop ircing. i'll cry :(
[09:11] <bazhang> he was --> <---this close to a kb earlier
[10:11] <jussi01> jdong: do you really have to have that increadibly annoying bot in #ubuntuforums?
[10:15] <elky> no wonder other users want annoying bots
[10:16] <jussi01> elky: huh?
[10:16] <bazhang> meoblast
[10:16] <elky> if annoying bots are permitted in other ubuntu channels
[10:20] <bazhang> * [aky] (n=akhenato@unaffiliated/akh3n4t0n): akhenaton <--archlinux-offtopic user
[10:20] <jussi01> elky: yeah, I would like to see it gone to be honest.
[10:20] <bazhang> jussi01, twssbot or pyckupline
[10:21] <jussi01> bazhang: both of them, but particularly pyckupline
[10:22] <bazhang> is ubuntuforums an official ubuntu channel?
[10:56] <Seeker`> hihi
[11:04] <bazhang> o/
[11:05] <Seeker`> bazhang: you still up?!
[11:05] <Seeker`> I thought that we only "owned" #ubuntu-
[11:05] <bazhang> Seeker`, its early evening here, so yeah
[11:06] <bazhang> aha
[11:06] <bazhang> so getting JDONG to shut down the bots is not under irc council?
[11:07] <Seeker`> what do yo mean?
[11:07] <elky> bazhang, ubuntuforums.org is the official forum of ubuntu, and that channel is the official channel of that forum. that would imply by basic logic that it is an official ubuntu channel.
[11:07] <bazhang> I've been trying to reform them btw (teaching it star-spangled banner, joni mitchell, james taylor, julie andrews songs)
[11:08] <Seeker`> bazhang: you're trrying to reform them the wrong way then!
[11:08] <bazhang> heh
[11:09] <Seeker`> Jdong has access in #ubuntuforums, and by the looks of it fairly high levels of access
[11:09] <Seeker`> if you spoke to him about removing someone/thing and it was reasonable, I suspect he would do it
[11:09] <bazhang> that is the whole point
[11:09] <bazhang> is it reasonable or not.
[11:10] <elky> Seeker`, #kubuntu, #edubuntu and #xubuntu too
[11:10] <Seeker`> well, what bots do you want shut down?
[11:11] <bazhang> all of them there according to jussi01
[11:11] <Seeker`> what are they doing?
[11:11] <bazhang> why not just slap a language filter on the bad words
[11:11] <elky> having that sort of garbage in an ubuntu branded channel makes a. ubuntu look bad and b. makes it harder for us to maintain decency in the main channels
[11:12] <bazhang> mostly the curse words are what I suspect is objected to
[12:12]  * Myrtti sighs
[12:12] <Myrtti> do I dare to look at -offtopic?
[12:12] <bazhang> yeah
[12:13] <bazhang> just majnoon moo'ing right now
[12:14] <Myrtti> no hynix?
[12:14] <bazhang> hynix et alia has been warned in no uncertain to cease and desist with ALL stalking
[12:14] <bazhang> +terms
[12:14] <Myrtti> I wish I could stand him better but it's like banging my head on the wall
[12:14] <bazhang> he is idle there
[12:15] <bazhang> he was warned that next time will be it.
[12:18]  * Mez does a little dance
[12:20] <Myrtti> I can't even explain it
[12:20] <bazhang> no need
[12:20] <bazhang> several of us have been stalked
[12:20] <bazhang> every one that spends any time in that channel know of his creepy behaviour/multiple nicks
[12:21] <bazhang> his bannination is way long overdue imo
[12:21] <Myrtti> he's not even stalking anymore
[12:21] <bazhang> along with groovyaspatchesapplesorangeapples
[12:22] <Myrtti> apart from last sunday with his weird pm "happy womens day"
[12:22] <bazhang> he did me two days ago
[12:22] <bazhang> and when asked about it: 'I dont do that so much anymore' (????)
[12:26] <Myrtti> I hate to be paranoid, but I seriously think that he or someone of his acquaintances in IRC reads these logs or something and then he taunts me/us on purpose
[12:29] <bazhang> nah
[12:30] <bazhang> very few as deeply troubled as he and groovyapples
[12:34] <Myrtti> what I think is the case is
[12:34] <Myrtti> that he is a) young(ish) and from a culture that has set hierarchy
[12:35] <Myrtti> b) he assumes that Internet and IRC doesn't have that hierarchy
[12:35] <Myrtti> c) whatever hierarchy he might see, he actively ignores is or brushes it aside, because b)
[12:36] <bazhang> I disagree
[12:36] <Myrtti> so if I or you tell him to stop doing foobarbaz, he conveniantly forgets or ignores the requests
[12:36] <Myrtti> because of b)
[12:36] <bazhang> may want to k tarfart in #kubuntu
[12:46] <bazhang> * tarfart<EMAIL_ADDRESS>pasted a foul link
[13:23] <Myrtti> hrmrhm
[13:23] <bazhang> he's just trolling #k now
[13:25] <bazhang> jussi01, Tm_T ^^
[13:25] <Tm_T> again
[13:25] <bazhang> yep
[13:35] <bazhang> when someone is on about 'this linux crap sucks', its hard to want to help them
[13:44] <Myrtti> @bansearch Myztikal_
[13:50] <bazhang> a budding limcore in tarfart
 this linux garbage is giving me a head ache
[13:58] <Nafallo> then don't use it
[14:14] <bazhang> gah
[14:15] <bazhang> may as well remove #k from auto-join from now on
[14:32] <Tm_T> bazhang: thats childish, son
[14:32] <bazhang> Tm_T, true
[14:32] <bazhang> but with drostie on about kubuntu is the place to discuss jaunty issues
[14:32] <Tm_T> brrrh
[14:33] <bazhang> just a bit fed up, venting is all. my apologies.
[15:13] <Myrtti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/131099/
[15:14] <Tm_T> Myrtti: hmm?
[15:14] <bazhang> whoa
[15:14] <bazhang> leguin has the lion's share
[15:15] <Myrtti> well that's what I see
[15:15] <Myrtti> with my irssi
[15:17] <Myrtti> bazhang: objections agains /mode -b<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[15:18] <bazhang> Myrtti, was that errietta?
[15:19] <Myrtti> no, it's one of yours from Jan
[15:20] <bazhang> cant see that on this server; but as el ky said, if they are reformed then great, if not then reban
[15:20] <bazhang> or words to that effect in essence
[15:23] <Myrtti> too tired to go through that
[15:24] <Myrtti> Tm_T: irssi/grep/sed magic from week ago
[15:26] <bazhang> removed yesterdays ban, did not see the one you referred to Myrtti
[15:26] <Myrtti> bazhang: line 91
[15:27] <Myrtti> bazhang: I always check bantracker, you see
[15:27] <Myrtti> it's yours
[15:27] <bazhang> Myrtti, okay will remove
[15:28] <Myrtti> that's why going through both #ubuntu and #ubuntu-offtopic took me about four hours last Sat
[15:28] <Myrtti> and now there's atleast a mark on all the bans of #ubuntu
[15:29] <Myrtti> there's three or four of something so old there isn't anything
[15:29] <Myrtti> like<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[15:30] <bazhang> well seemingly if they are really well known and unreformed they will be easy to spot
[15:30] <Myrtti> I just left them there because I took only the clear cases of expired off
[15:33] <Myrtti> I love how you can access the plain info with http://paste.ubuntu.com/131099/plain/
[15:37] <Myrtti> hm
[15:37]  * Myrtti goes to buy cider
[16:15] <bazhang> Myrtti, removed
[16:16] <Myrtti> I was just called a decadent weirdo
[16:16] <Myrtti> and also that I need to find a hobby and get vacation
[16:17] <bazhang> wth
[16:17] <bazhang> by whom
[16:17] <Myrtti> in reply to http://identi.ca/notice/2785895
[16:17] <Myrtti> in irc :-D
[16:18] <Myrtti> I feel like that bear, apart that I don't do prime numbers, I do regexps
[16:18]  * bazhang huggles Myrtti
[16:20] <Myrtti> now, where was I... oh yes. the debug log
[16:45] <Nafallo> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
[16:46] <Nafallo> someone kill them!
[16:54] <Nafallo> !search playing
[16:54] <Nafallo> !search abuse
[16:54] <Nafallo> !bot abuse
[16:54]  * Nafallo waits for the next one
[16:54] <bazhang> or else
[16:54] <bazhang> I like that :)
[17:43]  * Myrtti sings to Elton John
[17:54] <Seeker`> Myrtti: you have elton john there?!
[17:54] <Myrtti> I've got about a dozen of his CD's... and a tour t-shirt
[17:55] <Myrtti> and an autographed photo...
[17:55] <Myrtti> and a concert ticket from 1998
[17:56] <Tm_T> and I still wonder how she is my twinsister
[17:57] <Myrtti> Spotify is starting to annoy me
[19:28] <Myrtti> ubottu: tell gsteinert about away
[20:10] <Myrtti> that was the second time from that ip
[20:10] <Myrtti> with the same nickname
[20:15] <nalioth> Myrtti: klined
[20:21] <Myrtti> nalioth: thankie dear
[20:41] <Flannel> Hi hrehf, how can we help you?
[20:41] <hrehf> hrmm, just got banned by your dcc bug port
[20:42] <hrehf> 1) the wiki page should explain what the actual problem is, and why connecting to a different port helps
[20:42] <Flannel> And it looks like you were then tested by floodbots, and are removed.
[20:42] <hrehf> 2) aren't you guys causing a lot of disconnects/rejoins for OTHER channels?
[20:42] <Flannel> hrehf: How would we be doing that?
[20:43] <hrehf> until i even noticed i was banned in ubuntu my client tried to reconnect ~20 times
[20:43] <hrehf> causing 20 x 10 channels of rejoins
[20:43] <Flannel> That doesn't make sense.
[20:44] <hrehf> Flannel err, quote this http://archives.neohapsis.com/archives/bugtraq/2006-02/0639.html
[20:44] <hrehf> Flannel how does that not make sense?
[20:44] <Flannel> hrehf: Because when you tried to reconnect, you were disconnected, so you weren't cycling other channels.
[20:44] <hrehf> Flannel additionally, make clear its buggy firmware on the router that seems to inspect the irc packets and is disconnecting if it sees such a packet
[20:44] <Flannel> hrehf: Once you reconnect, and join #ubuntu, you get forwarded to the exploit channel
[20:45] <hrehf> Flannel i am autojoining the other channels?
[20:45] <Flannel> hrehf: Yes, but you're not connected to freenode at that time.
[20:45] <hrehf> err
[20:45] <hrehf> 2009-03-14 21:38:53 * Disconnected
[20:45] <hrehf> 2009-03-14 21:38:56 * Attempting to rejoin channel ##java
[20:45] <hrehf> Flannel i am indeed connected to freenode
[20:45] <hrehf> :)
[20:45] <Flannel> being banned (well, forwarded) in a channel has nothing to do with reconnecting.
[20:45] <hrehf> Flannel lol
[20:46] <Flannel> hrehf: You were disconnected from the entire network.
[20:46] <hrehf> Flannel maybe you should read https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FixDCCExploit
[20:46] <hrehf> yes
[20:46] <hrehf> and my client is reconnecting fn
[20:46] <Flannel> hrehf: Yes.   We did not cause you to be disconnected from freenode.
[20:48] <hrehf> nickspoon oh?
[20:48] <hrehf> nickspoon what does test me do then?
[20:48] <hrehf> nickspoon why did you ban me in the first place?
[20:49] <hrehf> i'd be interested in that
[20:49] <Flannel> hrehf: If you've fixed the exploit, then the test won't disconnect you.
[20:49] <hrehf> aren't you purposefully sending exploit packets?
[20:49] <hrehf> maybe i should report you
[20:49] <Flannel> Also, the test is voluntary, you knew it was coming, etc.
[20:49] <hrehf> Flannel the first ban?
[20:49] <hrehf> ;-)
[20:49] <Flannel> hrehf: No.  We didn't cause that.
[20:49] <Flannel> hrehf: malicious users did.
[20:50] <Myrtti> who, btw, is now k-lined
[20:50] <Flannel> hrehf: Again, I think you're misunderstanding how this all works.
[20:50] <hrehf> Flannel see 1)
[20:50] <hrehf> erm
[20:50] <Flannel> hrehf: I fail to see how 1) is relevant.
[20:50] <hrehf> are you serious?
[20:50] <Myrtti> !exploit
[20:50]  * Myrtti reads the wikipage
[20:51] <Flannel> hrehf: How does the content of the wiki page affect you before you've visited said wiki page?
[20:51] <hrehf> Flannel HUH?
[20:51] <hrehf> lol
[20:51] <hrehf> Flannel I think you're misunderstanding how this all works.
[20:51] <Myrtti> the actual problem is that you have a buggy router
[20:51] <hrehf> :)
[20:51] <Myrtti> and the problem is stated on that wikipage
[20:52] <Flannel> hrehf: If you want to be difficult, go right ahead and be difficult, you won't get help here with an attitude.
[20:52] <hrehf> Myrtti it's stated badly
[20:52] <Myrtti> the secondary problem is that there are some idiots, who think it's funny to exploit that
[20:52] <hrehf> Flannel YOU are the difficult one
[20:52] <Myrtti> and that is also stated on that wikipage
[20:52] <hrehf> *i* am just telling you that i found the wiki page not really helpful at all
[20:52] <hrehf> i am not changing any settings without background on the actual problem
[20:52] <Myrtti> hrehf: so, which part would you like to have changed, and please give good suggestions?
[20:52] <hrehf> and 'router buggy' isn't the actual problem
[20:53] <hrehf> it's a vague description
[20:53] <Myrtti> oh?
[20:53] <Flannel> hrehf: Yeah, itis.
[20:53] <Flannel> Its an overzealous "magic firewall"
[20:53] <hrehf> Flannel I think you're misunderstanding how this all works.
[20:53] <nalioth> hrehf: we're not here to teach trolls how to knock peole offline
[20:53] <hrehf> Flannel the wikipage doesn't say that
[20:53] <Flannel> hrehf: It doesn't need to.
[20:53] <hrehf> nalioth huh?
[20:53] <hrehf> lol
[20:53] <nalioth> hrehf: you can certainly ask google anything you like
[20:53] <hrehf> bah
[20:53] <Flannel> hrehf: The specifics of why it happen aren't relevant, and are likely to confuse people.
[20:54] <hrehf> why are you guys so zealot like
[20:54] <nalioth> and it's not like we're asking you to parade all your passwords around  - just a simple oort change
[20:54] <Flannel> If you want to know specifics, theres lots of information on the web.
[20:54] <hrehf> it's like the guys on wikipedia who enforce rules without thinking about it
[20:54] <nalioth> port change, even
[20:54]  * Myrtti can't see the problem since the banforward is removed and all
[20:54] <hrehf> and you have to argue that you're right for half an hour until they give in
[20:55] <Flannel> hrehf: We've noted your objection to the vagueness of the wiki page.  Is there anything else we can help you with?
[20:55] <hrehf> nalioth maybe 8001 directs me to a different server that's yours
[20:55] <LjL> hrehf, contacting an op in PM rather than using this channel risks to fail if said op is away...
[20:55] <Myrtti> hrehf: which parts of that wikipage do you want to be changed, and how. Specific examples and suggestions are welcomed, but not necessarily applied
[20:55] <hrehf> LjL just following the bot's advice...
[20:55] <nalioth> hrehf: if you distrust the ubuntu community that much, perhaps you shouldn't be here
[20:56] <Myrtti> did the bot tell you to pm someone? hardly? surely not?
[20:56] <LjL> hrehf: no
[20:56] <LjL> the bot tells you to read the *topic*
[20:56] <LjL> and the topic tells you to check #ubuntu-ops
[20:56] <hrehf> Myrtti i'd like it to state that the bug is in the firmware that is inspecting the packet, and that connecting to 8001 fools the firmware into not inspecting the packet
[20:56]  * Myrtti looks at everyone
[20:56] <LjL> like 99% of the people reading the page would know what that's about
[20:57] <hrehf> Myrtti which would explain why connecting to 8001 actually helps
[20:57] <Myrtti> LjL: could it be on italics on near the bottom of the page?
[20:57] <hrehf> LjL ill search the quote..
[20:57] <LjL> "The issue is due to a bug in certain routers. However, even when the router itself cannot be fixed (which is, unfortunately, often the case), a workaround is available."
[20:57] <Flannel> hrehf: Alright.  We'll take note of your suggestion and consider it.  Is there anything else we can help you with today?
[20:57] <LjL> "Most router manufacturers have provided an updated firmware for their router that fix this particular exploit. Please check with their website for upgrades and installation instructions."
[20:58] <hrehf> Flannel don't treat users immediately like noobs in a zealotish way
[20:58] <hrehf> that would help a shitton
[20:58] <Seeker`> hrehf: watch your language please
[20:58] <Flannel> hrehf: When you come in saying you were spamming channels 20 times, it was obvious you were confused.
[20:58] <hrehf> LjL i have the latest firmware on my router, i am sure
[20:58] <LjL> hrehf: then your router manufacturer is lousy
[20:59] <LjL> hardly anyone's fault
[20:59] <hrehf> LjL yes it is
[20:59] <Seeker`> hrehf: whose fault is it?
[20:59] <hrehf> the manufacturer's i guess
[20:59] <LjL> also
[20:59] <LjL> there is a whole "Background details" chapter on the page
[20:59] <LjL> for those who'd like to dig into what exactly the issue is about
[20:59] <nalioth> hrehf: in some cases, the firmware does bupkus
[20:59] <LjL> and those people, i'm sure, also know how to use google
[21:00] <nalioth> yes, Google does have the answers
[21:00] <hrehf> Flannel the first three i read weren't useful
[21:00] <hrehf> just bug reports without any further info
[21:00] <Seeker`> the first three what?
[21:00] <Flannel> hrehf: You mean LjL, or nalioth, not me.
[21:00] <hrehf> oh, sorry, it was directed at ljl ;)
[21:01] <LjL> hrehf: if you can't read a security vulnerability report in standard wording, that's not anyone's fault either
[21:01] <LjL> or
[21:01] <LjL> what you actually want to see on the page
[21:01] <LjL> is perhaps detailed instructions for script kiddies on how to activate the exploit?
[21:01] <hrehf> LjL there's your quote: "(@FloodBot1): hrehf: Either say « test me » after following the instructions, or consult the operators if unclear "
[21:01] <LjL> because i'm sure that's not the purpose of our wiki
[21:02] <LjL> hrehf: yes. before that, it DID mention to you to read the /topic
[21:02] <Flannel> hrehf: Anyway, if there's nothing else we can help you with today.  We ask users don't idle here to keep the noise down.  Thanks for stopping by.
[21:02] <LjL> [21:08:14] <FloodBot1> hrehf: Hello, You can't « /join #ubuntu » because of a problem with your connection. Please type « /topic » and read the instructions.
[21:02] <hrehf> Flannel bwaha
[21:02] <hrehf> well
[21:02] <LjL> Your router is buggy 1) Please follow these instructions: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FixDCCExploit to FIX it (yes, it can be fixed) 2) after carrying out those instructions please type « test me » and wait few minutes | if this fails, type « /join #ubuntu-ops » to be tested manually
[21:02] <hrehf> this attitude doesn't exactly make me support stuff
[21:02] <hrehf> good day
[21:02] <Flannel> I don't even know what that means.
[21:03] <LjL> @mark #ubuntu-ops hrehf Troll.
[21:03] <Flannel> Now, is itjust me, or did he come here originally and think we were the first ones to exploit him?
[21:03] <LjL> Flannel: well, i was away
[21:03] <Seeker`> I connected to port 8001 once.  Maybe I was a little harsh, but there's not really any harm done.
[22:00] <jdong> elky / jussi01: The two bots were in the channel for fun; they have been removed and will not be in the channel anymore
[23:04] <LjL> my eeepc has a life of its own.
[23:04] <LjL> jdong: you've been infesting our channels with bots?!
[23:06] <Seeker`> LjL: AI eeepc?
[23:07] <LjL> Seeker`: more likely the broken SSD causing xchat to hang for ages and then suddenly come back to life briefly...
[23:07] <Seeker`> eww
[23:07] <LjL> so i guess yeah, considering what natural intelligence most often consists of
[23:07] <Seeker`> AI eeepc would be much more fun
[23:21] <Myrtti> gpryatel: anything else we can help you with?
[23:21] <gpryatel> i think its working now, if not i'll come back :)
[23:21] <Myrtti> thanks for flying with Ubuntu
[23:22] <Myrtti> have a nice day...
[23:22] <topyli> haha
[23:22] <LjL> topyli: yeah, i've just been too lazy to phone them yet...
[23:22] <LjL> no route to host, how might that be
[23:23] <topyli> LjL: ah good
[23:23] <LjL> topyli: (besides, are there *any* eeepcs around that aren't under warranty?)
[23:23] <topyli> i guess not :)
[23:23] <Flannel> LjL: If you open it up/etc its likely possible to void it
[23:23] <bazhang> mine is not
[23:23] <LjL> ah yes
[23:24] <topyli> bazhang: you've hacked it to hell i presume? :)
[23:24] <bazhang> topyli, nope; bought on second day globally available though :)
[23:24] <Flannel> topyli: It's just a handheld calculator that he scratched an "eee" into!
[23:24]  * Flannel hides.
[23:24] <topyli> hehe
[23:26] <topyli> bazhang: ah i got mine from my mobile operator with a 2 year mobile "broadband" deal, the warranty is the same
[23:27] <bazhang> gpryatel, how may we help you
[23:27] <bazhang> topyli, nice
[23:28] <topyli> bazhang: i don't think they realize what they got themselves into. i actually use it all the time and have it with me all the time. i'll be surprised if it lasts two years :)
[23:29] <LjL> gpryatel: try the test now please
[23:52] <Seeker`> hmm ,gpryatel is still here


[00:56] <bgamari> How does one continue boot from the recovery prompt root shell
[00:57] <bgamari> or even just get a list of jobs that would start if the boot were to continue
[00:57] <bgamari> some job is thrashing right after "normal boot" begins
[00:58] <bgamari> and Upstart refuses to tell me which one it is
[00:58] <bgamari> even with --verbose
[00:58] <bgamari> For all of it's nice features, Upstart really sucks to troubleshoot
[01:07] <bgamari> How does one send SIGINT during boot?
[08:06] <Terminus-> hello. is there a way to get the value of $DISPLAY on login-session-start? i tried echoing it to a logfile but i'm not getting the display number of the xserver.


[19:13]  * highvoltage *finally* starts putting together a list of faq questions for Edubuntu that we can refer people to
[19:17]  * alkisg needs a faq entry for "how to convince *DM developers that countries exist that actually need multiple keyboard layouts" :(
[19:28] <alkisg> Yey!!! Possible workaround: ship an /etc/X11/Xkbmap!
[19:30] <highvoltage> hehe
[19:45] <highvoltage> alkisg: btw, we get around 3-5 emails a week via the edubuntu web contact form, would you mind being on that list and help reply to some of them?
[19:46] <highvoltage> (not sure if I asked you before but I know I've been meaning to)
[19:46] <alkisg> You didn't, are those similar to the edubuntu-users list?
[19:46] <alkisg> I mean, questions about ltsp, edubuntu etc?
[19:46] <highvoltage> it's a bit different, we discourage support questions to that address
[19:46] <highvoltage> but sometimes a few do come through
[19:47] <alkisg> If you think I can answer them, sure, np, but /me reminds highvoltage that he hasn't even installed edubuntu 12.04 yet...
[19:47] <highvoltage> it's often just questions about edubuntu and what it's about. we try to answer most of them, I'd like to make it easier by having more of the content on the site so that we could just reply and point to it if the answer is already there and well explained
[19:48] <highvoltage> alkisg: hehe, no. you don't have to answer all of them. even replying to one a week or so would already help a lot
[19:48] <highvoltage> stgraber: ^^^ could you add alkisg to the list?
[19:48] <highvoltage> (for edubuntu-webcontact)
[19:50] <stgraber> highvoltage: will do
[19:51] <stgraber> alkisg: when replying we also always Cc<EMAIL_ADDRESS>so the other know what has been answered, so it's easy to figure out what the "usual" response is for a given subject
[19:52] <alkisg> stgraber: is there an archive for the<EMAIL_ADDRESS>list? I don't think I'm subscribed to it, it would help to read previous questions/answers...
[19:54] <stgraber> alkisg: so, it's just an alias that goes to highvoltage, mgariepy and I (and very soon you). I have most e-mails on my account though so I can forward them all to you if you want.
[19:54] <alkisg> Nah, no need, I'll get the hang of it after the first few mails
[19:56] <highvoltage> alkisg: I've responded to around 40 of them the last 2 weeks and have another 18 to go before the backlog is cleared, so you'll have some examples of replies, at least :)
[19:57] <stgraber> alkisg: added
[19:57] <stgraber> I also sent a test e-mail
[20:04] <highvoltage> stgraber: I'm currently adding images to the content bzr branch and uploading them manually afterwards to the website. just want to check that you have it on your todo list to set up the syncing for that?
[20:05] <stgraber> highvoltage: yeah, it's on the todo
[20:05] <highvoltage> great
[20:09] <highvoltage> stgraber: You know what would be really cool? a drupal module like the deployments page for the marketplace where you could list by type of service or location
[20:09] <highvoltage> (I know you don't have the time for that, but I'm just saying ;) )
[20:44] <highvoltage> stgraber: I also need write permission to /srv/www.edubuntu.org/www-drupal7/edubuntu/edubuntu/css
[20:45] <stgraber> highvoltage: try now
[20:48] <highvoltage> stgraber: merci