[00:04] <Davidc_3> *downgrading like a pro*
[00:50] <LLStarks> i really like the new scrolling options for the dash. touchpad scrolling, scroll wheel, but no arrow/page key input.
[00:51] <LLStarks> still nice though
[02:25] <j1mc> hi all
[07:27] <bbigras> I 'compiz --replace' supposed to take a long time? It seems frozen.
[07:28] <fagan> bbigras: are you trying to restart unity?
[07:28] <bbigras> fagan: yes
[07:28] <fagan> if you are try doing a unity --reset
[07:32] <bbigras> fagan: I got an exception and a core dump. Is the instructions at http://askubuntu.com/questions/28470/how-do-i-build-unity-from-source/28472#28472 still good?
[07:33] <fagan> bbigras: hmmm interesting was unity working fine before?
[07:33] <fagan> well build instructions change a bit but should be fine
[07:33] <fagan> (some things get added sometimes)
[07:34] <bbigras> fagan: I don't know, it's the first time I try it from source. I'll rebuild in case the lib packages changed.
[07:34] <fagan> bbigras: if it was working before report a bug with the traceback and they will look at it
[07:35] <fagan> just say you are running trunk in the bug too
[07:35] <bbigras> fagan: ok thanks
[08:02] <oSoMoN> good morning
[08:21] <MacSlow> hi there everybody!
[08:25] <fagan> Hmmmm how exactly do you put a window onto the second monitor if there is that grid snap thing that makes the window half the size of the first monitor
[08:25]  * fagan has his second monitor working now in unity but cant get anything onto the second window
[08:29] <didrocks> good morning
[08:58] <zniavre> good morning
[08:59] <zniavre> where are pictures for the launchers stocked please ? modify launcher-background-top/middle/bottom.png  did nothing on the launcher
[10:35] <cdbs> Hi, as for bug #729074, is it not implemented yet? Or is it implemented but a bug is not making the quicklist come up? I can work on the fix
[10:38] <klattimer> dbarth, mpt: I'm thinking about replacing a huge raft of bugs with a single bug for "IDO calendar should have a new calendar widget and not rely on GtkCalendar" as the gtk calendar is causing most of the difficulties with keyboard navigation, focus and interaction
[10:41] <mpt> klattimer, I agree that a new calendar widget (or at least, calendar code plugged into IDO grid layout) would potentially fix many bugs
[10:42] <klattimer> as far as I can tell, I'm just yak shaving trying to find a solution to some of these with the current widget
[10:42] <mpt> klattimer, I generally find though that bug reports describing solutions are risky. A new calendar widget may fix all those bugs, but it might leave one or two of them unfixed initially.
[10:42] <klattimer> true
[10:43] <klattimer> well, how about I create a new bug report, and reference all of the sub bugs?
[10:43] <mpt> Bug reports centered around solutions, I mean (describing a solution is fine)
[10:43] <klattimer> right
[10:45] <mpt> I'll be delighted to review the existing bug reports when you publish a branch with the new widget. :-)
[10:48] <apinheiro> njpatel, you here?
[10:48] <apinheiro> rodrigo has just approved one of my branches
[10:48] <apinheiro> njpatel, can I merge it, or we are out of the deadline?
[10:56] <njpatel> apinheiro, merge it
[10:56] <apinheiro> njpatel, ok, thanks
[12:11] <dbarth> apinheiro: ping?
[12:12] <dbarth> rodrigo_: ping as well?
[12:12] <rodrigo_> dbarth, pong
[12:12] <dbarth> have you guys seen luke's email with the issues he still mentions
[12:12] <rodrigo_> yes, was looking at it
[12:12] <dbarth> Bug #740698 for example
[12:12] <dbarth> or a slew of missing indicators description like Bug #740723
[12:13] <rodrigo_> dbarth, yes, luke's doing the indicators branches, afaik, isn't he?
[12:13] <apinheiro> dbarth, here
[12:14] <apinheiro> dbarth, about the quicklist, as I said in my answer
[12:14] <apinheiro> we knew that from a lot time ago
[12:14] <apinheiro> but we focused on launcher
[12:14] <apinheiro> and now in the dash
[12:14] <apinheiro> to get something
[12:14] <apinheiro> at least the alt+f2 dialog
[12:14] <apinheiro> with something meaningful
[12:44] <artfwo> could anyone reopen bug 709461? I tried to, but all the statuses are disabled for me, weird
[13:25] <lamalex> njpatel, the new multimonitor menubar is awesome!
[13:29] <kenvandine> lamalex, it really is... makes me want to go buy a second monitor so i can use it full time :)
[13:29] <lamalex> I need to find my mouse now
[13:29] <lamalex> touchpad across a massive monitor is not so good
[13:30] <lamalex> I think I could use a magic mouse
[13:49] <mariokemper> Hi all, I have added support for static quicklist items to my application. What happens to those entries when the .desktop file is used with other distributions. Are those entries ignored silenty or will they generate any errors?
[13:56] <lamalex> mariokemper, they'll be ignored
[13:57] <mariokemper> ok, thanks
[14:37] <apinheiro> njpatel, you know if jay will be connected today?
[14:43] <njpatel> apinheiro, yep, maybe a little later though
[14:43] <apinheiro> njpatel, ok thanks, anyway, just in case, do you know something about the eventinspector on the windowthread? ;)
[14:44] <njpatel> Heh, sorry, that's out of my skill set :)
[14:51] <njpatel> jaytaoko, apinheiro
[14:51] <njpatel> Have fun :)
[14:51] <stefano-palazzo> kenvandine, are you around?
[14:51] <kenvandine> stefano-palazzo, yup
[14:51] <kenvandine> stefano-palazzo, what's up?
[14:51] <apinheiro> jaytaoko, just a question about the event inspectors
[14:52] <apinheiro> jaytaoko, hi, btw ;)
[14:52] <jaytaoko> apinheiro: hello
[14:52] <apinheiro> on the definition of the eventinspector
[14:52] <apinheiro> the first variable is a nux::Area
[14:52] <apinheiro> so I guess that it is supposed to be the Area receiving the event
[14:52] <apinheiro> but on the call inspector method
[14:52] <apinheiro> it is always NULL
[14:52] <stefano-palazzo> kenvandine, it's happening again :-) https://bugs.launchpad.net/askubuntu-lens/+bug/742350
[14:52] <apinheiro> not sure if there is something missing
[14:53] <kenvandine> stefano-palazzo, ugh!
[14:54] <jaytaoko> apinheiro: let me check
[14:54] <apinheiro> jaytaoko, ok, thanks
[14:55] <kenvandine> stefano-palazzo, i can't look right now, but can you have him confirm he has gir1.2-dee-0.5 = 0.5.16-0ubuntu4
[14:55] <stefano-palazzo> kenvandine, just a sec, I have the same bug
[14:55] <kenvandine> i know he shows he ran an upgrade
[14:55] <kenvandine> oh you do?
[14:55] <kenvandine> and it was working for your right?
[14:55] <stefano-palazzo> yeah it happend after today's update (in my case, I downloaded a fresh ISO)
[14:56] <stefano-palazzo> kenvandine, yep the version is 0.5.16-0ubuntu4
[14:57] <jaytaoko> apinheiro: yes, the Area is null, I am not quite sure why I added it
[14:58] <stefano-palazzo> sorry to keep bugging you with this, the package must be cursed (:
[14:58] <jaytaoko> apinheiro: can you use it with the area being Null?
[14:58] <apinheiro> jaytaoko, yes, in fact Im using it for the key events
[14:58] <apinheiro> for that I don't need it
[14:58] <apinheiro> just trying to check if I could use it to get
[14:58] <apinheiro> the event nux_enter_focus
[14:59] <apinheiro> and the area
[14:59] <apinheiro> but no problem
[14:59] <apinheiro> I could do that in other way
[14:59] <jaytaoko> apinheiro: alright, I will try to figured out why I added it
[15:00] <kenvandine> stefano-palazzo, i see why...
[15:00] <kenvandine> pygobject update yesterday
[15:00] <kenvandine> crap
[15:00]  * kenvandine sighs
[15:01]  * bcurtiswx hands kenvandine a few free coupons for coffee (a.k.a. caffeine)
[15:02] <apinheiro> jaytaoko, ok, thanks
[15:03] <kenvandine> bcurtiswx, thx
[15:03] <kenvandine> stefano-palazzo, i'll get it fixed
[15:07] <stefano-palazzo> kenvandine, thanks a lot
[15:09] <lamalex> hey jcastro can you fire up skype or mumble and tell me if you experience https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/742530
[15:10] <lamalex> oh even better you're already on skype
[15:10] <jcastro> skype is my windows box
[15:10] <lamalex> ah
[15:10] <jcastro> but I can confirm in mumble
[15:11] <jcastro> happens in skype too, confirming
[15:11] <lamalex> danke
[15:34] <cyphermox_> sladen, ping?
[15:42] <lamalex> hm where is ted
[15:42] <lamalex> he's never around when I have bugs I need to ask him about
[15:46] <kenvandine> stefano-palazzo, fix for dee and libunity uploaded... thx for pointing that out so fast!
[15:49] <Davidc_3> stefano-palazzo: ping
[15:51] <lamalex> is there a shortcut to initiate window picker for a single application?
[15:58] <stefano-palazzo> I'm here :-)
[15:58] <stefano-palazzo> kenvandine, awesome! that was quick
[15:58] <stefano-palazzo> Davidc_3, pong
[15:59] <Davidc_3> stefano-palazzo: is your place working with the new python-gobject?
[16:00] <stefano-palazzo> Davidc_3, is that already published? I don't see any updates
[16:01] <Davidc_3> stefano-palazzo: I'm talking about the python-gobject update from last night :)
[16:03] <Davidc_3> 2.28.3-1
[16:03] <stefano-palazzo> Davidc_3, that seems to have broken Dee, which broke my Place
[16:04] <kenvandine> Davidc_3, u just uploaded the fix for Dee and Unity
[16:04] <kenvandine> s/u/i
[16:05] <Davidc_3> stefano-palazzo, kenvandine: oh awesome.
[16:06] <stefano-palazzo> sorry I'm a little preoccupied :-) Yes that problem was discovered rather quickly
[16:10] <Davidc_3> I'm currently having some difficulties with Python, I've never touched anything more than php and bash and my Place needs to deal with a lot of APIs. Where can I find the best Python doc ever? :)
[16:12] <bbigras> Davidc_3: I have no idea, but maybe you could start with http://docs.python.org/tutorial/index.html . There was also a book 'dive into python' but I'm not sure if it's up-to-date.
[16:14] <stefano-palazzo> Davidc_3, bbigras dive into python is up-to-date, and it's brilliant, if you already know _a_ programming language
[16:15] <bbigras> stefano-palazzo: from this site http://diveintopython.org/toc/index.html ? The copyright ends in 2004.
[16:15] <stefano-palazzo> Davidc_3, have a look at this: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/194812
[16:16] <Davidc_3> bbigras, stefano-palazzo: Thanks, all of your links seem great.
[16:17] <bbigras> stefano-palazzo: oh there's a dive into python 3. and nice link btw. thanks
[16:18] <bbigras> Davidc_3: yw
[16:20] <stefano-palazzo> I love this SO question, it's the first place to look if you want to learn pretty much anything to do with programming
[16:21] <Davidc_3> ATM, I'm not hitting walls and Google APIs are fairly easy to use (thanks to your code stefano-palazzo), but when I try to add others APIs, I'm pretty much running in the dark :)
[16:21] <zniavre> good afternoon > does launcher panel and icons for globalmenu are hardcoded please ?
[16:21] <zniavre> launcher background **
[16:22] <stefano-palazzo> Davidc_3, be careful with the google API, it has hidden dangers :)
[16:23] <Davidc_3> stefano-palazzo, like the TOS?
[16:23] <stefano-palazzo> I've spend a day converting everything to use the StackExchange API instead. They are deprecating this API, and the successor is pretty expensive
[16:23] <stefano-palazzo> Plus _I think_ my code doesn't comply with the ToS
[16:25] <stefano-palazzo> We've also looked into Bing and Yahoo, they're no good either. Bing has an awful contract for you to sign (which doesn't let you do anything with the search results), and yahoo is expensive and unreliable (i.e. they may change their pricing tomorrow)
[16:26] <Davidc_3> I'm using the Books and Images APIs, not the search one, AFAIK I'm still in the TOS lines, I hope.
[16:26] <stefano-palazzo> Oh I think they are fine, it's the search one that they make a lot of money from. You should be okay
[16:27] <stefano-palazzo> you might also want to have a look at the DuckDuckGo.com api. They do a 0-click thing, giving you things like definitions of words, amazon products and lots more
[16:28] <nigelb> stefano-palazzo: hey, got a minute? :)
[16:28] <Davidc_3> DDG api does Amazon? I was hesitating about taking an Amazon key... Hmm. Let's see.
[16:29] <stefano-palazzo> nigelb, kindasorta :) I need to leave in a minute, what's up?
[16:29] <nigelb> stefano-palazzo: For Ubuntu Developer Week, we had this Project Lightning talks, where people would introduce cool project they've done for about 5 to 6 minutes and how folks can help, want to talk about the stackexchange app during the app devel week?
[16:29] <nigelb> (Logs from UDW https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/devweek1103/ProjectLightningTalks)
[16:30] <stefano-palazzo> nigelb, yes that would be great!
[16:31] <nigelb> stefano-palazzo: awesme, I'll put you down for it! its on friday 15 apr at 2100 UTC
[16:32] <stefano-palazzo> nigelb, that's fantastic :-)
[16:33] <stefano-palazzo> nigelb, I don't see the 15th of april in the ubuntu wiki, am I looking at the right page?
[16:34] <nigelb> stefano-palazzo: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAppDeveloperWeek/Timetable
[16:34] <stefano-palazzo> ah there we are
[16:35] <stefano-palazzo> nigelb, thanks a lot, I'll try to come up with something good (i.e. cram everything into five minutes)
[16:35] <nigelb> stefano-palazzo: you can probably take 7 to 8 minutes :)
[16:35] <stefano-palazzo> looking forward to it
[16:36] <stefano-palazzo> right I really need to go for a bit. see you
[16:36] <nigelb> thanks stefano-palazzo :)
[16:54] <Inkwina> I was wondering if it is possible to have an indicator app written in pygtk with a menu more like that of sound menu instead of simple text entries.
[16:55] <Inkwina> the docs say that GtkMenuItem can have any widget as a child, not just Label, but when I try it all i get is a seperator
[17:18] <lamalex> ronoc, I really like the sound menu for checking what's playing. It's quite nice!
[17:19] <ronoc> lamalex, thanks, looking good now I hope
[17:24] <Daekdroom> Unfortunately the sound menu isn't displaying the album cover for rhythmbox
[17:26] <fta> jcastro, hi, when is the xterm fix supposed to land?
[17:27] <jcastro> fta: not sure
[17:27] <jcastro> didrocks: sam blogged that he fixed an issue with xterms but he just left a patch attached to the bug
[17:28] <jcastro> fta: do you have the bug # handy?
[17:28] <fta> bug 692463
[17:29] <didrocks> jcastro: I think it's in upstream trunk
[17:29] <didrocks> jcastro: anyway, natty is frozen for beta
[17:29] <jcastro> fta: ok so probably the first update after beta
[17:29] <didrocks> right
[17:30] <fta> which package is the patch for? it's not clear to me reading the patch
[17:30] <fta> i want to give it a try locally
[17:31] <didrocks> fta: let me look at the patch
[17:31] <didrocks> fta: this is the main compiz package, so "compiz"
[17:33] <fta> ok, thanks
[17:33] <fta> (good it's not the whole xorg beast)
[17:33] <didrocks> :)
[17:36] <robtaylor> didrocks: smspillaz: hey guys, just to let you know, i'm going to be handing over to aruiz, who's awesome. I decided I'm far too rusty and out of practice...
[17:37] <didrocks> robtaylor: thanks for the work you've done! :)
[17:37] <robtaylor> didrocks: thanks to you for helping out so much :)
[17:37] <didrocks> yw :)
[18:41] <fta> jcastro, \o/
[18:41] <jcastro> fta: I take it worked?
[18:41] <fta> yep
[18:45] <jcastro> kenvandine: jono can't get the AU lens to work, I am suspecting this dee/GI thing again
[18:46] <fta> jcastro, looking at the patch, it was a more general issue than just xterms. windows geometry seemed broken.
[18:46] <jcastro> jono: in a terminal try: /usr/lib/unity-place-askubuntu/unity-askubuntu-daemon
[18:47] <jcastro> and tell me what happens
[18:47] <jono> jono@forge:~$ /usr/lib/unity-place-askubuntu/unity-askubuntu-daemon
[18:47] <jono> ERROR:root:Could not find any typelib for Unity
[18:47] <jono> Traceback (most recent call last):
[18:47] <jono>   File "/usr/lib/unity-place-askubuntu/unity-askubuntu-daemon", line 28, in <module>
[18:47] <jono>     from gi.repository import Unity
[18:47] <jono> ImportError: cannot import name Unity
[18:47] <jono> jono@forge:~$
[18:47] <jcastro> aha, same issue we had before
[18:48] <jono> I might not have got the new dee yet
[18:49] <jono> jcastro, is the package called dee or libdee?
[18:49] <jcastro> I am trying to figure that out
[18:50] <jono> np
[18:50] <jcastro> Binary: libdee-1.0-1 libdee-dev libdee-1.0-1-dbg libdee-doc gir1.2-dee-0.5
[18:50] <jcastro> the source package is "dee"
[18:50] <jcastro> dpkg -l libdee-1.0-0
[18:50] <jcastro> what version does that show?
[18:51] <stefano-palazzo_> Huh, I've never seen this error
[18:51] <jono> I just installed libdee
[18:52] <jcastro> stefano-palazzo_: it's a packaging bug kenvandine fixed earlier today
[18:52] <jono> No packages found matching libdee-1.0-0.
[18:52] <jcastro> oh dude
[18:52] <jcastro> here it is
[18:52] <jcastro> dpkg -l libdee-1.0-1
[18:53] <jono> ii  libdee-1.0-1   0.5.16-0ubuntu model to synchronize mutiple instances over
[18:54] <stefano-palazzo_> jcastro, I see. That bug presented completely differently on my (and the bug reporters') machines
[18:54] <jcastro> jono: it seems to have truncated the version after the "ubuntu" part of the version
[18:54] <jcastro> 0.5.16-0ubuntu5 is what I have
[18:55] <jono> how do I find that out if it is trucating it
[18:55] <jono> let me check in my cache
[18:55] <jono> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root  49738 2011-03-25 09:05 libdee-1.0-1_0.5.16-0ubuntu5_i386.deb
[18:55] <jcastro> because there's supposed to be a number after "ubuntu" in the version string
[18:56] <jcastro> hmm
[18:56] <jono> maybe I should reinstall the PPA package
[18:56] <jcastro> k
[18:56] <jcastro> kenvandine will know how to fix it, he can fix anything!
[18:58] <jono> brb testing
[18:58] <jcastro> jono: I take it you don't have the icon on the launcher?
[18:58] <jono> jcastro, I do
[19:00] <jono> jcastro, it throws a crash dialog for the daemon
[19:00] <jono> but then won't allow me to file it
[19:00] <jcastro> right
[19:00] <jono> and doesnt tell me any debugging info, which is not useful
[19:01] <jcastro> the error you are getting is it trying to run that daemon which I had you run in a terminal before
[19:01] <jono> I had a few different binaries for the unity-place-askubuntu
[19:01] <stefano-palazzo_> jono, you can get the errors by manually running it in a terminal:
[19:01] <stefano-palazzo_> /usr/lib/unity-place-askubuntu/unity-askubuntu-daemon
[19:01] <jono> I removed the packages and reinstalled
[19:01] <jono> jono@forge:~$ /usr/lib/unity-place-askubuntu/unity-askubuntu-daemon
[19:01] <jono> ERROR:root:Could not find any typelib for Unity
[19:01] <jono> Traceback (most recent call last):
[19:01] <jono>   File "/usr/lib/unity-place-askubuntu/unity-askubuntu-daemon", line 28, in <module>
[19:01] <jono>     from gi.repository import Unity
[19:01] <jono> ImportError: cannot import name Unity
[19:01] <jono> looks like the libgi-dee might be broken
[19:02] <jono> libgir, rather
[19:02] <jcastro> as soon as ken is online I'll poke him
[19:02] <jono> Version: 0.5.16-0ubuntu5
[19:03] <jono> for gir1.2-dee-0.5
[19:03] <jono> thanks jcastro
[19:03] <jcastro> this morning he was like "hey so the gir/dee thing was all broken but I fixed it"
[19:04] <jono> right
[19:04]  * jcastro luckily is still on the same session from yesterday
[19:04] <jcastro> I wonder if I restart if it will break my place
[19:05] <stefano-palazzo_> Is there another bug report? This was this morning's:
[19:05] <stefano-palazzo_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/askubuntu-lens/+bug/742350
[19:05] <stefano-palazzo_> (not the one you're having)
[19:05] <jcastro> jono: fyi here's my file list: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/585548/
[19:06] <jcastro> I've had that gi.repository import Unity error before
[19:07] <jcastro> though it doesn't make sense that it would work for us and not him
[19:07] <jcastro> let me try it on my laptop, I never installed local stuff there
[19:07] <stefano-palazzo_> Okay that sounds better. I was thinking maybe it's something totally unrelated
[19:16] <jono> jcastro, looks the same as mine
[19:42] <LLStarks> bug 742720, mushihime-sama
[19:43] <bbigras> I reported bug 742610 this morning about Unity
[19:44] <jcastro> stefano-palazzo_: works fine on my laptop, and ken says he tested it on 3 seperate machines, must be some other issue
[19:46] <stefano-palazzo_> jcastro, sounds about right, If the package was broken it shouldn't work on my machine either
[19:46] <stefano-palazzo_> "Cannot import Unity" sounds pretty weird too :)
[19:46] <LLStarks> jcastro, i can't alt-sysreq-k after compiz crashes. my lvds turns funky colors and i then need to restart.
[19:47] <jcastro> ouch
[19:47] <kenvandine> does he have gir1.2-unity-3.0 installed?
[19:47] <jcastro> jono: ^
[19:47] <carlos2> Typo at   http://unity.ubuntu.com/about/  "A powerful desktop and netbook environment things brings consistency and elegance to the Ubuntu experience."
[19:48] <LLStarks> i've seen it in the past with compiz, but now it happens upon any unity crash that i can't restart unity from using an open and focused nautilus window.
[19:48] <jono> kenvandine, nope installing now
[19:48] <kenvandine> ok
[19:48] <jono> brb relogging in
[19:48]  * kenvandine adds the deps
[19:48] <kenvandine> i guess the python deps aren't discovered
[19:48] <kenvandine> for gir
[19:50] <jono> it works! :-)
[19:50] <jono> nice :-)
[19:50] <jono> thanks kenvandine
[19:50] <jono> thanks jcastro, stefano-palazzo_
[19:50] <stefano-palazzo_> phew :)
[19:51] <jcastro> maybe we should add a dependancy on the place?
[19:52] <jcastro> jono: ok so just search for something in the dash or the place and it should work
[19:52] <jcastro> like "unity keyboard shortcuts"
[19:52] <jono> jcastro, cool :-)
[19:52] <jono> wow, it is *fast*
[19:52] <jcastro> yeah
[19:53] <jcastro> unfortunately that google API is deprecated
[19:53] <jcastro> so we'll have to use something else
[19:53] <stefano-palazzo_> jono, if you right click the launcher, select users and type "jono", you'll notice something is missing ;-)
[19:54] <LLStarks> bug 742726, mushihime-sama
[19:56] <kenvandine> jcastro, i added the dep
[19:56] <kenvandine> committing now
[19:57] <jcastro> thanks kenvandine
[19:58] <stefano-palazzo_> oh jcastro did you get a chance to the the ungooglyfied version?
[19:58] <kenvandine> jcastro, please update the daily builds recipe to use lp:~ken-vandine/askubuntu-lens/packaging
[19:59] <kenvandine> i think we are finally past the project rename fallout :)
[19:59] <jcastro> stefano-palazzo_: I can check it now actually, let me update the recipe and ppa
[19:59] <jcastro> stefano-palazzo_: anything to commit to trunk before I fire off a build?
[19:59] <stefano-palazzo_> jcastro, nope, all is well
[20:00] <jcastro> https://bugs.launchpad.net/askubuntu-lens/+bug/741861
[20:00] <jono> stefano-palazzo_, :-)
[20:00] <jcastro> is this a lens' job to do that or is that the dash itself?
[20:01] <stefano-palazzo_> jcastro, not a clue. It could be either. I suppose kamstrup or kenvandine know more?
[20:01] <kenvandine> good question
[20:01] <kenvandine> i don't know how it orders it
[20:01] <stefano-palazzo_> also, it's very hard to reproduce, most of the time it works fine. maybe it has to do with how fast results are returned
[20:01] <jcastro> yeah
[20:01] <jcastro> like, imagine if you had 5 lenses installed
[20:02] <kenvandine> ugh
[20:02] <jcastro> the normal dash would become a mess
[20:02] <kenvandine> i think the dash should have a pretty well defined list of priorities
[20:02] <kenvandine> although...
[20:02] <jcastro> right
[20:02] <kenvandine> it would be cool if it was smart
[20:02] <jcastro> stefano-palazzo_: oh cool you landed gravatar support
[20:03] <kenvandine> like usually jorge selects a result from askubuntu lense when he searches
[20:03] <kenvandine> so over time give you those first
[20:03] <stefano-palazzo_> jcastro, yeah, I did that in an hour or something, really stellar work by the places api people
[20:03] <kenvandine> but if i usually select gwibber posts from the gwibber lense
[20:03] <jcastro> rock and roll
[20:03] <kenvandine> those bubble up for me
[20:03] <kenvandine> and if someone else clicks on the application launchers most of the time those bubble to the top
[20:04]  * kenvandine is probably dreaming too big :)
[20:04] <kenvandine> but hey, that is what i do :)
[20:06] <stefano-palazzo_> jcastro, you will notice, the non-google version is pretty slow (it's close to unusable from my perfectionist perspective). I really need to think of something clever to make that work. It takes more than a second. But let me know if you have any thoughts anyway. It does some things differently
[20:12] <c10ud> jcastro, this is the wrong place et. al. but i recently run into #402814 and seems like other projects did. i just wanted to ask if you could have some influence on the lp guys and help app devs out :)
[20:13] <jcastro> c10ud: it's a high priority thing that I've brought up a bunch of times
[20:13] <c10ud> i wouldn't normally spam this channel, but it's has been two damn years, and we just need not to except, no need for handling the submodule
[20:13] <jcastro> they're working on it unfortunately it wasn't as simple as I thought it would be
[20:13] <jcastro> right, which means without imports we can't do easy daily builds
[20:14] <c10ud> i tried in the lp-dev channel, but they were very quiet (no response)
[20:14] <c10ud> you know, it's not a big deal.. but the recipe feature is really cool and we wanted to try it out :)
[20:14] <jcastro> I whine about it on a cron-like basis
[20:14] <c10ud> (especially when there's some good guy running his ppa-creation script by hand from his own box hehe)
[20:16] <c10ud> if i remove the git submodule, $some_hardcore_distro guys won't be happy, if you could tell the devs yet-another-time "please just import without the submodule.. don't throw a failing exception" i would be happy
[20:16] <c10ud> lol
[20:17] <c10ud> thanks for your time and sorry for the offtopic
[20:26] <jcastro> c10ud: well, at least we got the me menu support in for natty at least, heh
[20:27] <jcastro> stefano-palazzo_: do you have anything to commit today? It seems I can't just rebuild with a change in the packaging branch, lp wants a higher revision than 19. :-/
[20:27] <stefano-palazzo_> hehe, sure give me a second
[20:27] <stefano-palazzo_> we're at 19, right?
[20:28] <jcastro> yeah
[20:29] <c10ud> yeah that's great, but i found out ayatana devs to be usually friendlier than most of the category (i submitted a patch for changing icon paths for indicators from python, and was promptly accepted:))
[20:29] <Omega> I wonder, is there a way to blacklist folders from the dash?
[20:29] <Omega> (maybe only hidden folders?)
[20:29] <lamalex> c10ud, good to hear!
[20:29] <stefano-palazzo_> I'll clean up the code to comply with pep8 guidelines
[20:29] <jcastro> Omega: yeah there's a blacklist in zeitgeist
[20:29] <c10ud> :D
[20:30] <Omega> jcastro: Oh, cool, I thought that only worked for activity journal though.
[20:31] <jcastro> well I added things to the activity journal blacklist
[20:31] <jcastro> and it stopped showing up in my dash
[20:31] <Omega> Awesome!
[20:31] <stefano-palazzo_> jcastro, okay all done
[20:32]  * jcastro clicks a button
[20:45] <Omega> jcastro: How does the blacklist work?
[20:45] <Omega> Do you add folder paths?
[20:47] <jcastro> yeah
[20:47] <jcastro> I add like file:///path/to/folder
[20:47] <nmarques> kenvandine, LP#742760
[20:47] <nmarques> kenvandine, patch attached ;)
[20:47] <kenvandine> nmarques, woot
[20:48] <kenvandine> bug 742760
[20:48] <kenvandine> nmarques, i love patches
[20:48] <nmarques> kenvandine, it was probably a glitch ;)
[20:48] <nmarques> or a tipo
[20:48] <kenvandine> knowing me, a typo
[20:48]  * kenvandine looks
[20:49] <kenvandine> nmarques, probably an oversight
[20:50] <kenvandine> nmarques, how current are all of your packages?
[20:50] <kenvandine> the past couple of weeks have fixed tons of bugs
[20:50] <Omega> jcastro: With wildcards?
[20:50] <nmarques> kenvandine, including all the updates till yesterday ;)
[20:50] <kenvandine> nmarques, excellent
[20:50] <nmarques> kenvandine, for the indicator stack
[20:50] <jcastro> Omega: not sure, I'm not very zeitgeist proficient I'm afraid
[20:50] <kenvandine> we are in beta freeze, so don't expect  much before the end of next week
[20:51] <kenvandine> nmarques, so you should be in good shape
[20:51] <Omega> jcastro: It seems to work with wildcards :)
[20:51] <nmarques> kenvandine, you guys doing awesome job :)
[20:51] <jcastro> oh nice!
[20:51] <kenvandine> thx
[20:51] <nmarques> kenvandine, our official repository is being populated with the latest packages
[20:52] <nmarques> kenvandine, gonna release it within a few days :)
[20:52] <kenvandine> official? like the opensuse repos?
[20:52] <nmarques> https://build.opensuse.org/project/show?project=GNOME:Ayatana
[20:52] <nmarques> it's a part of our GNOME Team projects :)
[20:53] <nmarques> the main problem to make it available on the distro relies on the GTK2 package
[20:54] <kenvandine> yeah :(
[20:54] <nmarques> not making politial comments on that
[20:54] <nmarques> just that I find it sad :/ my vision of upstream is that they should be as feature rich as possible
[20:55] <nmarques> it's their game... I'm happy I can at least make this options available to our users :)
[20:55] <nmarques> I have already prepared a GNOME2 Spin with this indicators by default and some other candies
[20:56] <kenvandine> great
[20:56] <kenvandine> nmarques, thanks for all that effort, we really appreciate it
[20:57] <nmarques> would you guys be available for a email interview? Would canonical allow it? if so, whats the right procedures ?
[20:57] <nmarques> mainly focusing the indicators and their relation with user experience :)
[20:57] <seiflotfy> Omega, how can i help
[20:58] <seiflotfy> please come to #zeitgeist
[20:58] <seiflotfy> we will help you there
[20:58] <kenvandine> nmarques, interview for what?
[20:58] <kenvandine> i think tedg would be the best person for that
[20:58] <nmarques> kenvandine, a bit on the story on the indicators so I can include it on the release materials about this repository
[20:58] <nmarques> kenvandine, because it's a repo only based on your work :)
[20:58] <kenvandine> tedg definitely then
[21:01] <nmarques> kenvandine, I will send him a few questions and leave it for you appreciation. Gonna be published on news.opensuse.org and on the project wiki page... alongside with a 'thank you' message to your Team for the help you guys have given me so far. And so that everyone is aware, I never had a question unanswered from you side, and this is quite important for me.
[21:03] <kenvandine> nmarques, awesome :)
[21:03] <jcastro> that'd be awesome
[21:03] <nmarques> gotta run :) weekend and girlfriend to please ;)
[21:03] <nmarques> guys, once more, a huge thank you for all the help
[21:04] <jcastro> thanks for your work nmarques!
[21:04] <nmarques> jcastro, I am the one who is pleased with your commitment ;)
[21:05] <nmarques> jcastro, differentiation and innovation are important... all the grunting and ranting from others isn't shared by me and by many users, never forget that!
[21:05] <nmarques> peace
[21:05]  * kenvandine waves to nmarques
[21:13] <bcurtiswx> is there a way to minimize all open windows? cntrl+alt+d ?
[21:15] <bcurtiswx> ah, super D
[21:15] <bcurtiswx> but it crashed my compiz
[21:17] <bcurtiswx> woo crash file !
[21:17] <bcurtiswx> now i can apport that file right.. like apport _usr_bin_compiz....
[21:23] <bcurtiswx> ah, seems it's similar to the alt+tab crash, but i did it with super+d
[21:23] <bcurtiswx> do I need to report or are there already enough bugs for that crash?
[21:32] <bcurtiswx> ah ha, found the bug
[21:32] <bcurtiswx> nvm, thanks for the help ;)
[23:12] <jcastro> stefano-palazzo_: hey if you want to use a real API a launchpad lens would be amazing.
[23:13] <jcastro> my efforts to convince launchpadders to make one haven't been fruitful, they're all too busy, heh
[23:23] <fta> is there a pref somewhere to make the dashes bigger? they are taking less than 25% of my screen


[23:01] <Nevare_> I've upgraded quite a few servers lately, but this hasn't happened before
[23:01] <punzada> Nevare_: you can always use the find command to make sure that file is on your system at all (maybe in one of the other /bin/ directories) and copy it into the proper place
[23:01] <stroyan> parceltounge: Do you have the libpcsclite-dev package installed?   "sudo apt-get install libpcsclite-dev".
[23:01] <mas2> tj83: never used it myself but a friend of mine uses Kino.
[23:02] <hajmola> when I run sdptool browse on my GPS device, it doesn't display anything...
[23:02] <balleyne> rblst: hmm... well, I'm not sure exactly what to do (and I've gotta go), but I have a couple suggestions: (1) I find Ubuntu autodetects monitors well on boot, even if the Fn+LCD key isn't working -- a reboot could test that out, (2) I used to use i810switch to get Fn+LCD functionality working (sudo apt-get install i810switch), but I'm not sure if that's the "right" answer
[23:02] <Flannel> tj83: Kino or cinelerra are the two standard movie things
[23:02] <mas2> tj83: I only imports dv files tho but it can easily be converted with Avidemux. Or at least it was before if I rember right.
[23:02] <thebloggu> when i do killall stalonetray && stalonetray, almost all of my icons in the tray dissappear even though they are still running, how can i solve this ?
[23:03] <Nevare_> punzada: Well, it aint there.
[23:03] <_wendy_> how can i see the how much ram i have?
[23:03] <timebomb> tj83: theres another big one
[23:03] <Nevare_> punzada: I run postfix as my MTA too.
[23:03] <Nevare_> As opposed to sendmail.
[23:03] <Sylphid> _wendy_, free -m
[23:03] <mas2> _wendy_: in windows or ubuntu?
[23:03] <rblst> balleyene, i appreciate your help; could you pastebin your xorg.conf, please?
[23:03] <_wendy_> ubuntu\
[23:03] <baldur> I need help in changins files that belong to root user in my computer i cant find out how i do that ??? (these are freechiv files i want to changse)
[23:03] <punzada> well you can always just remove the cronjob if you don't need it no Nevare_ ?
[23:04] <_wendy_> mas2: ubuntu
[23:04] <thebloggu> when i do killall stalonetray && stalonetray, almost all of my icons in the tray dissappear even though they are still running, how can i solve this ?
[23:04] <Nevare_> punzada: part of the problem is that i'm not quite sure what it does
[23:04] <Nevare_> :P
[23:04] <Nevare_> i dont want to accidentally break something
[23:04] <VideoSmith> Hey guys, I have a problem with khelpcenter.  I keep attempting to look up the help for different programs and it says it can't access khelpcenter.  Any thoughts?
[23:04] <mas2> _wendy_: as Sylphid said "free -m" in the terminal.
[23:04] <energY_> I am currently on a livecd. Apt-get is dead. My cdrom is dead. I have formated my hd. So I won't be able to reboot. How can I install ubuntu?
[23:04] <_wendy_> mas2:  mem 944 is that 1gig?
[23:04] <mas2> _wendy_: yeah
[23:04] <hajmola> whats with no bluez-pin in the ibex repositories
[23:04] <punzada> reboot into the live cd
[23:04] <baldur> I need help in changins files that belong to root user in my computer i cant find out how i do that ??? (these are freechiv files i want to changse)
[23:04] <punzada> to make sure those thigns arn't 'dead'
[23:05] <flashblind> Status:	Resolving IP-Address for ftp.hackthisbox.org
[23:05] <flashblind> Status:	Connecting to <IP_ADDRESS>:21...
[23:05] <flashblind> Status:	Connection established, waiting for welcome message...
[23:05] <flashblind> Response:	220---------- Welcome to Pure-FTPd [TLS] ----------
[23:05] <flashblind> Response:	220-You are user number 1 of 32255 allowed.
[23:05] <FloodBot3> flashblind: Please don't flood, use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste, don't use Enter as punctuation.
[23:05] <balleyne> rblst: I'm don't actually have a second monitor on my machine, tried it out on a laptop I was setting up at work, but I didn't have to modify xorg.conf at all in intrepid
[23:05] <flashblind> Response:	220-Local time is now 23:37. Server port: 21.
[23:05] <thebloggu> when i do killall stalonetray && stalonetray, almost all of my icons in the tray dissappear even though they are still running, how can i solve this ?
[23:05] <rblst> okay, many thanks, balleyne
[23:05] <timebomb> i don't think so
[23:05] <_wendy_> mas2: the frst partition is primary, the second is logical? or still primary?
[23:05] <balleyne> rblst: good luck
[23:05] <Nevare_> punzada: thanks though :)
[23:05] <flashblind> Check out this link http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/11/business/11ubuntu.html?emc=eta1
[23:06] <punzada> oh well, took a shot ;p
[23:06] <rblst> energY_: what do you mean your cd-rom is dead?
[23:06] <thebloggu> when i do killall stalonetray && stalonetray, almost all of my icons in the tray dissappear even though they are still running, how can i solve this ?
[23:06] <Guest25440> is there a postgresql 7.4 package for 8.04
[23:06] <Flannel> flashblind: That's not really appropraite for this channel.  Try #ubuntu-offtopic
[23:06] <Sylphid> _wendy_, logical partitions are >4 ... ie sda5
[23:06] <energY_> rblst: My cd-rom drive is not responding anymore.
[23:07] <thebloggu> when i do killall stalonetray && stalonetray, almost all of my icons in the tray dissappear even though they are still running, how can i solve this ?
[23:07] <Flannel> !repeat | thebloggu
[23:07] <Sylphid> _wendy_, 1-4 are primary
[23:07] <outofthemadness> does anyone in here know how the syntax highlighting in gedit works?
[23:07] <phytopius> everytime when i try to share my internet from my computer to my laptop the network manager button disappears
[23:07] <zenlunatic> how can I get the network monitor thing back in gnome panel?
[23:07] <cousteau> is there a way to upgrade from Hardy to Jaunty without reinstalling or previously upgrading to Intrpid?
[23:08] <_wendy_> ok so i have a 120 gigs, i will make 3 partitions, /, /home, swap. / and /home will be primary?
[23:08] <Flannel> cousteau: No.
[23:08] <thebloggu> Flannel, for someone a little experienced in linux i think it is an easy problem to solve
[23:08] <cousteau> not even with the Alternate C?
[23:08] <Flannel> thebloggu: That's all good and well, but that doesn't give you the right to spam the channel.
[23:08] <mas2> _wendy_: you don't have to make partion for /home, / and swap if you don't want to. You can let the Ubuntu setup make it for you. So you just set how much of your hdd you want to use. Could be better in your case.
[23:08] <cousteau> CD?
[23:08] <lolwut> any people using AFP to share betweein mac and ubuntu?
[23:08] <_wendy_> mas2: i know but i like /home so if i reintall i dont need to move things around
[23:08] <Sylphid> zenlunatic, nm-applet in a terminal
[23:08] <baldur> I need help in changins files that belong to root user in my computer i cant find out how i do that ??? (these are freechiv files i want to changse)
[23:08] <Flannel> cousteau: Nope.  You need to upgrade one release at a time.  Only intrepid upgrades to jaunty (well, thats the only upgrade that's tested/provided for)
[23:08] <thebloggu> Flannel, sorry but i am here for minutes and no one tries to help
[23:09] <lolwut> any people using AFP to share betweein mac and ubuntu?
[23:09] <cousteau> ok, thanks
[23:09] <mas2> _wendy_: yeah that is true.
[23:09] <teknicaL> I guess there is no postgresql 7.4 package for 8.04 ?  I guess I have to install it from source?
[23:09] <_wendy_> so both primary mas2?
[23:09] <dentid4hed> This is my second attempt, day two of switching to Ubuntu and I still can't get it to install. Progress bar hangs up less than a quarter of the way there.
[23:09] <timebomb> i would ask some stalonetray dev
[23:09] <Flannel> thebloggu: Yes.  But everyone who's online read your question the first time.  We don't need to reread it every 90 seconds.
[23:09] <timebomb> but personally im guessing no
[23:10] <mas2> _wendy_: I'm not 100% sure about that so ask the folks in the channel about this one. sorry
[23:10] <Sylphid> dentid4hed, have you tried the alternate cd
[23:10] <benzss> does anyone know if it's possible to back up ktorrent?
[23:10] <malacosteus> baldur do you have the root password?
[23:10] <dentid4hed> Alternate cd?
[23:10] <dentid4hed> I downloaded 8.10 and burned it to a cd.
[23:10] <zc00gii> baldur: use chmod....
[23:10] <Flannel> baldur: What are you trying to change?
[23:10] <cousteau> dentid4hed: maybe the ISO didn't download well; try the Torrent downloads
[23:11] <zc00gii> !chmod > baldur
[23:11] <mas2> it there any way to add a resolution to my xorg.conf without editing in manualy? I use the fgrlx driver. Is it possible with an ati command?
[23:11] <dentid4hed> I used two separate ISO's. Two different cd's from two different computers. Both cd's hang up in the same place. It's my computer.
[23:11] <baldur> malacosteus:  zc00gii Flannel i allredy did sudo passwd to make the root password
[23:11] <Flannel> baldur: Don't do that.  There's absolutely no reason to set a root password.
[23:11] <malacosteus> baldur: chmod will only work if you have the root or sudo password
[23:11] <IndyGunFreak> dentid4hed: or its how you're burning them.
[23:11] <Flannel> baldur: Also, you likely won't need to chmod either.  What are you trying to do to those files?
[23:12] <dentid4hed> In case one, I used CDBurnerXP and the other I used MagicISO
[23:12] <zc00gii> baldur: unless you own the file
[23:12] <markpee> anyone know anything about the history with Israeal & Plaestine
[23:12] <Sylphid> dentid4hed, the alt cd is a cli based installer usefull if the regular cd fails
[23:12] <baldur> Flannel: i wanna changse the game config and i cant since i am not the owner of the files
[23:12] <zc00gii> baldur: like the files in/home/<user name>
[23:12] <malacosteus> baldur: okay so then you can use chmod 777 filpath
[23:12] <Flannel> markpee: Please take offtopic chatter elsewhere.
[23:12] <Sylphid> dentid4hed, at what point does it fail
[23:12] <Flannel> malacosteus: Please don't give wrong advice.
[23:12] <mas2> could someone take a quick look at this, http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1036640 it's about adding resolution for my external monitor.
[23:13] <zc00gii> baldur: sudo chmod 777 /path/to/game/config
[23:13] <baldur> malacosteus: okei
[23:13] <timebomb> later
[23:13] <Flannel> baldur: You'll use sudo with the command to edit the files: `gksu gedit /path/to/file` for instance (or sudo nano /path/to/config)
[23:13] <travis_> uh, got through installing the thinkfinger alright, i'm having problems integrating it into PAM now
[23:13] <Flannel> zc00gii: Please don't give wrong advice.
[23:13] <Flannel> baldur: *dont* chmod
[23:13] <malacosteus> flannel: what would you suggest
[23:13] <zc00gii> Flannel: before he said he wanted to change the permissions....
[23:13] <Flannel> travis_: read the README.Debian file, it gives you like three commands that do it automagically.
[23:13] <travis_> the walkthrough said to modify /etc/pam.d/common-auth, which i think is the issue, because i am able to properly verify my user in the thinkfinger utility
[23:14] <Flannel> zc00gii, malacosteus: changing the permissions isn't what he wants to do.  He merely wants to edit it: start a text editor with sudo.
[23:14] <travis_> Flannel: where is that located
[23:15] <Flannel> travis_: /usr/share/doc/libpam-thinkfinger/README.Debian
[23:15] <malacosteus> flannel: he had said he wanted to change permissions.
[23:15] <travis_> Flannel: thanks
[23:15] <mib_r9kfdvxn> hello people, could someone please explain to me the following commands in more details and more importantly why i need todo them before i "chroot" a partition???? i have already looked online and run "man mount" but i am still a lil confused "mount -t proc none /mnt/ubuntu/proc" and "mount -o bind /dev /mnt/ubuntu/dev"
[23:15] <lolwut> Flannel: do youuse the AFP to share between mac and ubuntu?
[23:15] <Flannel> malacosteus: Right, but that's not what he actually wants to do.  He wants to change the configuration.
[23:15] <baldur> Flannel: so i should type in "sudo nano /path/to/config/file
[23:15] <zc00gii> malacosteus: no he didn't
[23:15]  * zc00gii facepalms
[23:16] <Flannel> baldur: Yes.  And also, do `sudo passwd -l root` (to re-lock the root account)
[23:16] <lolwut> I need to know how to assign folders for sharing with AFP
[23:16] <Flannel> baldur: that'll give you a nano window (text editor for the terminal) with the config file.  If you want to use a graphical editor, alt-f2 then gksu gedit /path/to/config/file
[23:17] <baldur> Flannel:  sudo nano  /usr/share/games/freeciv/nations afghani.ruleset
[23:17] <baldur>   <--- this is the command i did and i got an eamty file
[23:17] <Flannel> baldur: Does the filename actually have a space in it?
[23:18] <baldur> Flannel: it has a . in the middle
[23:18] <Flannel> baldur: Right, but what about "nations afghani.ruleset"?
[23:18] <baldur> Flannel: nations is a folder
[23:18] <Flannel> baldur: Case matters.  And also, you can use tab complete to help out.
[23:19] <baldur> Flannel: ahh worked
[23:20] <lolwut> can ANYBODY help me with apple sharing, between ubuntu and apple, I did set up all the apf stuff, I am able to see home from my macbook, but in ubuntu I can only seem to pic which files to share over the windows network
[23:20] <baldur> Flannel: it worked thanks
[23:20] <tobias> anyone good at initramfs stuff?
[23:20] <miloz> whois romgo
[23:21] <baldur> Flannel: i wanna learn more about and how to use the terminal to do my biddings what do you recomend i do for practice and such ?
[23:21] <Flannel> !cli | baldur
[23:21] <baldur> Flannel: thanks :)
[23:22] <meloco> Does anybody know how to stop the flickering with film playback?
[23:22] <miranda_psi> lolwut: I have never done it before, but I would guess that you would need to configure samba on both ubuntu and the mac
[23:24] <outofthemadness> does anyone here know the syntax highlighting for gedit works?
[23:25] <aprilhare> hello
[23:25] <eeePingJocky> outofthemadness: yeah, i think it depends on the files your looking at
[23:25] <aprilhare> odd: the application demands the flash plugin - but the flash plugin was installed for firefox.
[23:26] <miranda_psi> outofthemadness: what is it that you are having a problem with? It should do  it automatically and you can also select the highlighting manually
[23:27] <dumcypher> Hello
[23:27] <outofthemadness> eeePingJocky: I mean, how might you edit what languages it recognizes? I just started messing around with processing, and whenever I load a processing file in gedit, it comes up with C syntax highlighting
[23:27] <lain_wired> Hiya, sorry to bore everyone with this but a friend of mine asked me to put her music on her new iPod Nano 4Gb.
[23:28] <outofthemadness> miranda_psi: trying to add another language to the ones recognized by syntax highlighting
[23:28] <lain_wired> I have had no trouble getting ubuntu to recognize thedevice, but it seems to mount as read only, and I've been unable to copy anything across to it, even with gtkpod--aac
[23:28] <Moguri> After a while in ubuntu, my graphics card's fan just revs up and stays at what I think is max. And the only way I've found to get the fan back down is to restart Ubuntu :s
[23:28] <dumcypher> I'm looking for somebody or some channel about java , I've a problem with javax.sound and I need Help, please ¿Do you know about?
[23:28] <Sylphid> !ipod | lain_wired
[23:28] <Moguri> It's only at 60C
[23:29] <lain_wired> Sylphid, ah thanks :p
[23:30] <lain_wired> Sylphid, uh. That article is mostly telling me I should already be able to do this.
[23:30] <miranda_psi> outofthemadness: sorry but I don't know how to do that
[23:31] <dumcypher> please, any idea?
[23:31] <eeePingJocky> outofthemadness: looks like its going to be more than skin deep, you may have to alter the language  highlighting and im not sure where that is at
[23:31] <yow|laptop> lain_wired - was it formatted in Linux?
[23:31] <eeePingJocky> well not in gedit anyway
[23:31] <doxy> Has anyone had issues with VLC and Qt recently? All of my other Qt programs seem to work fine, but VLC is giving me QtApplication errors and segfaulting
[23:31] <lain_wired> yow|laptop, no - and it's not my iPod to format either.
[23:32] <yow|laptop> then it likely won't work from what ive seen
[23:32] <outofthemadness> ah okay thanks anyway guys
[23:32] <yow|laptop> windows and apple are the same with ipods as well, you cant just switch them between os's
[23:33] <kvillaville> hola
[23:33] <kvillaville> que tal!!
[23:33] <lain_wired> yow|laptop, in that case, may i say, I really dislike the iPod.
[23:33] <Flannel> !es | kvillaville
[23:33] <sloopy> yow|laptop, you can if the ipod was used on a windows pc first
[23:33] <sloopy> (or so i have been told)
[23:34] <dumcypher> ubottu: ¿do you know about some java channel ?
[23:34] <yow|laptop> sloopy - perhaps, ive just noticed that its not something thats easily interchangeable
[23:34] <kvillaville> AHHH
[23:34] <kvillaville> ok
[23:34] <kvillaville> i understand
[23:34] <kvillaville> so
[23:34] <kvillaville> hi guys!!
[23:35] <sloopy> yow|laptop, from what i understand, when an ipod is first connected it is formatted with the native fs of the OS setting it up
[23:35] <yow|laptop> correct sloopy
[23:35] <sloopy> windows doesnt understand osx fs's
[23:35] <sloopy> but osx does ntfs fine
[23:35] <Tyrath> is there a stock watcher program for shell that anyone knows about?
[23:35] <Sylphid> yow|laptop, can it be formatted fat32 to be cross compatible?
[23:36] <yow|laptop> yes, but then there is the issue of not finding the library too
[23:36] <Tyrath> !stock
[23:36] <gerob> !nvidia 180.22
[23:36] <bakermd> I've installed the Kickstart configuration tool and created my kickstart cfg file - but I cannot find out what the next step is... When a computer hits my PXE boot server, how do I tell it to use the ks file?
[23:36] <Tyrath> !nvidia | gerob
[23:36] <yow|laptop> not sure Sylphid - but keep in mind that fat32 has a 4gb filesize limit so that could cause other issues
[23:36] <sloopy> i dont use my ipod maybe i should mess with it and write 'another' howto
[23:37] <LargeHardonColli> picket
[23:37] <yow|laptop> i only use my ipod in osx86 and i dont bother swapping it around
[23:37] <gerob> Tyrath:  I have downloaded the latest driver from their site but im having some trouble getting it to run
[23:37] <Sylphid> yow|laptop, yes but (correct me if im wrong) ipod nanos only have a 4G hard drive
[23:37] <Flannel> Tyrath: There's a few.  Fire up synaptic and search for stock and start perusing
[23:37] <Tyrath> sloopy: I don't know what your problem is but have you tried using gtkpod ?
[23:37] <yow|laptop> Sylphid - i have an 8gb nano
[23:37] <Tyrath> Flannel: thanks
[23:38] <Tyrath> Flannel: do you use one that you'd recommend?
[23:38] <Flannel> Tyrath: I don't, no.
[23:39] <user002> hi, is ms-sys included on ubuntu 8.10 ?  I dont have an internet connection (or working MBR)
[23:39] <yow|laptop> Sylphid - its up to you, if you have it wiped clean, you can certainly try it out and let us know the result
[23:39] <Sylphid> yow|laptop, sorry wasnt me with the ipod it was lain_wired
[23:40] <user002> Sylphid: wireless problem?
[23:40] <yow|laptop> i personally dont really like my ipod that much as a device, but its 8gbs and very portable
[23:40] <user002> Sylphid: did you try the troubleshooting link?
[23:40] <Tyrath> gerob: System -> Administration -> Hardware Drivers ? Have you tried activating the latest driver ?
[23:40] <Tyrath> gerob: sorry to take so long to respond
[23:40] <Sylphid> user002, huh??
[23:40] <yow|laptop> oh i thought you had one Sylphid since you were talking about the 4gb limit, my mistake
[23:41] <gerob> Tyrath: the latest there isnt the actual latest one and I have had no luck with those ones ... i am fairly new to this though and could be doing something wrong
[23:41] <Sylphid> yow|laptop, no sorry was helping  lain_wired out
[23:41] <user002> Sylphid: perhaps you have a similar handle as someone last night with a wireless problem, I just joined the room
[23:41] <Sylphid> user002, sorry wasnt me
[23:41] <lain_wired> yow|laptop, as far as mp3 players go, i much prefer my creative zen v. I've never known an electronic device to be so resilient.
[23:41] <user002> sylphid: my bad
[23:42] <lain_wired> i've gotten it wet, dropped it, slept on it, etc. It mounts instantly with gnomad2. :D
[23:42] <user002> hi, is ms-sys included on ubuntu 8.10 ?  I dont have an internet connection (or working MBR)
[23:42] <dr_willis> !info ms-sys
[23:42] <dr_willis> !find ms-sys
[23:42] <yow|laptop> lain_wired - my issue with the ipod is that you cant just easily copy files on and off it using usb mass storage, its software driven, plus the controls drive me nuts while im using it at the gym
[23:42] <user002> thanks
[23:43] <lain_wired> yow|laptop, yes, that too. I don't know why they feel the need to make things complicated.
[23:43] <Ochian> Anyone know what exactly Firestarter does?  And how I can get it to start on boot?
[23:43] <yow|laptop> lain_wired - since you cant wipe it, the only other thing that comes to mind is that the folder where it was mounted might be read only. you could check that
[23:43] <Tyrath> gerob: the best advise I can give you is to type this in shell: sudo apt-get install nvidia-glx-180 nvidia-settings
[23:43] <lain_wired> I was considering buying the zen x-fi next, but I'm hearing mixed reviews. :\
[23:43] <dr_willis> !firewall
[23:44] <dr_willis> Ochian,  see the above urls
[23:44] <Tyrath> gerob: if that doesn't work i'm not sure
[23:44] <Ochian> Yay, bots.
[23:44] <yow|laptop> lain_wired - my ipod was a gift, otherwise i wouldn't own one :)
[23:44] <Tyrath> you may need to use the program nvidia-settings to set the driver to nvidia-glx-180
[23:44] <Tyrath> gerob: you may need to use the program nvidia-settings to set the driver to nvidia-glx-180
[23:44] <lain_wired> yow|laptop, fair enough. I've always been a Creative fan. :p
[23:44] <gerob> Tyrath I have sh NVIDIA-Linux-x86-180.22-pkg1.run but I need to close my X to run it
[23:44] <Sylphid> yow|laptop, my wife is wanting an mp3 player ... what would you recommend
[23:45] <gerob> Tyrath:  The instructions dont tell me how to do that
[23:45] <Tyrath> gerob: .run? i've never seen tht extension before... not too sure
[23:46] <yow|laptop> lain_wired - i would have probably bought an Archos device myself if i never received my ipod
[23:46] <Nomexous> gerob: Try booting into a root shell
[23:46] <dr_willis> gerob,  you have tried the drivers in the repositories and via envyng if those failed FIRST?
[23:46] <Tyrath> gerob: i'd suggest what i told you, otherwise i wouldn't hve a clue, sorry
[23:46]  * Tyrath hasn't had any graphic driver issues since he first installed 8.10
[23:46] <lain_wired> yow|laptop, I've never used Archos, but I will check them out for my next player upgrade.
[23:47] <dr_willis> gerob,  if you really MUST use the nvidia instrallers.. go to console (alt-ctrl-f1) and use sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop    to make X stop. then run the installer  'sudo sh whatever.run'
[23:47] <lain_wired> Still no success on the ipod front, but the way.
[23:47] <dr_willis> gerob,  good luck getting them to work... :) the repo versions or envy0ng is a better bet.
[23:47] <yow|laptop> Sylphid - id be inclined to agree with lain_wired in that zens are nice. easy controls
[23:47] <Tyrath> dr_willis: just curious. what's .run? shouldn't it be .sh ?
[23:47] <gerob> dr_willis:  I couldnt get envyng to run
[23:47] <gbear14275> need advice
[23:47] <dr_willis> gerob,  just an idiotic extension they use the means 'run me'
[23:47] <gbear14275> with selecting an OS
[23:48] <Tyrath> !ask | gbear14275
[23:48] <cousteau> speaking of graphic drivers, will Nvidia GeForce2 MX/MX 400 (driver 96) work on Jaunty (X.org 1.6)?
[23:48] <dr_willis> gerob,  it could be a binary, not  a shell script.. i imagine that file is a bit of both
[23:48] <Sylphid> yow|laptop, thanks
[23:48] <lain_wired> yow|laptop, Sylphid If the Zen V Plus series is still out, I recommend them. They're adorable and yet impossible to hurt.
[23:48] <gerob> dr_willis: I believe it a bit of both
[23:48] <Tyrath> gbear14275: you shouldn't come to ubuntu and ask advice on selecting an OS. the answer they'll give you will probably be ubuntu given this is a ubuntu channel :P
[23:48] <gerob> dr_willis: im willing to try envng if I can get it to run
[23:49] <dr_willis> !envy
[23:49] <lain_wired> I FINALLY got a minute scratch on mine after I left it uncovered in a bag of coins and wires. Don't even ask why I thought that was a good idea.
[23:49] <yow|laptop> yeah and i try to stick to ones that dont have a lot of extras so that i can just use drag n drop for files. my PSP is great that way but a bit big for taking to the gym
[23:49] <Tyrath> !beancounter
[23:49] <gerob> dr_willis, so do I use the gtk one then?
[23:49] <eseven73> Tyrath: yeah and if someone suggested Fedora or anything *except* Ubuntu, they'd be yelled at for being OT and whatnot
[23:49] <jgarbers> have done something weird to my video config. how can i get Ubuntu to re-do whatever it did at installation time and put everything back the way it was?
[23:50] <gbear14275> Tyrath: is there an ubuntu install ISO that will install ubuntu with XFCE and will it run well enough on a p2 machine with 300mb's of RAM and
[23:50] <dr_willis> gerob,  if you want.  its for gnome
[23:50] <Tyrath> eseven73: lol
[23:50] <yow|laptop> and i dont like that i cant delete a file directly from the ipod itself either
[23:50] <Tyrath> !xubuntu
[23:50] <Tyrath> !xubuntu | gbear14275
[23:50] <gbear14275> Tyrath: got it thanks
[23:51] <lavanta> Hi, I've just installed 8.10. At first boot network manager listed my wireless card and asked to download restricted drivers. After installing driver (bcm43xx) and reboot I can't see my wireless connection. ifconfig shows it
[23:51]  * Tyrath hates static electricity! he seems to get zapped by any random power cord these days
[23:52] <yow|laptop> lavanta - did you try giving it an ip and setting /etc/resolv.conf manually with your nameserver to see if that works?
[23:52] <Tyrath> !libfinance
[23:52] <Tyrath> meh
[23:52] <Tyrath> :(
[23:52] <Ochian> !girls
[23:53] <Tyrath> me wonders why cups just reloaded randomly
[23:53] <Ochian> lol
[23:53] <Tyrath> haha @ Ochian
[23:53] <gerob> dr_willis: ok .... i got it through the package manager now what?
[23:53] <lavanta> yow|laptop, I don't have a wireless modem just now.
[23:53] <dr_willis> gerob,  run it?
[23:54] <yow|laptop> oh ok, lavanta, not much point then ;)
[23:54] <CaptainMorgan> !topic
[23:54] <gerob> dr_willis: there is no GUI for it and the envyng -t comes up with an error
[23:55] <Tyrath> CaptainMorgan: try /topic, it's much more friendly to your peers :)
[23:55] <Tyrath> CaptainMorgan: or /msg ubottu topic
[23:55] <CaptainMorgan> why would I do that Tyrath ?
[23:55] <dr_willis> gerob,   No idea then. last i ran it from a terminal on my other laptop it ran fine for me   - You did run       sudo envyng-gtk ?
[23:55] <Tyrath> CaptainMorgan: well why did you type !topic ?
[23:55] <CaptainMorgan> Tyrath, my attempt was to keep the topic on support not the above recent
[23:56] <Tyrath> CaptainMorgan: ahh k
[23:56] <gerob> dr_willis: sudo: envyng-gtk: command not found
[23:56] <Tyrath> gerob: apt-cache search envyng-gtk and see if anything comes up
[23:56] <kintarotpc> Hey there
[23:57] <Tyrath> gerob: that should give you a list of installable programs with that contained in the name
[23:57] <Flannel> gerob, dr_willis: -gtk is a metapackage for envyng, there's no -gtk version due to some stability issues.  -qt exists, as does the CLI
[23:58] <dr_willis> there ya go gerob  install/use envy-qt I guess...
[23:58] <jeeves_Moss> are there any evoulition guys in here?
[23:58] <gerob> dr_willis: flannel: ok ill try that
[23:59] <Tyrath> !ask | jeeves_Moss
[23:59] <lain_wired> I am about to cry. Sleep deprivation and weak hardware support don't mix.
[23:59] <jeeves_Moss> Tyrath, yea, thanks.  I know how it works.
[23:59] <dr_willis> gerob,  just to clarify - you DID use the 'restricted-drivers manager' tool to try the nvidia drivers in the repositories FIRST?
[23:59] <kintarotpc> Question: Has anyone here encountered a situation in which Gnome will display only a blank white screen within a normal session but display everything fine in a failsafe session (no startup scripts) ?
[23:59] <jeeves_Moss> lain_wired, lol, welcome to my world most nights @ about 3:30am


[00:04] <pauljw> it is for her and other than rain it's a perfect spot.
[00:05] <pauljw> guess i'm gonna be standing watch and moving the babies as needed to keep them alive...  i'll take em out, she'll put em back... :(
[00:08] <daftykins> doh!
[00:08] <daftykins> i'd throw in a board that can be climbed up if possible :>
[00:10] <pauljw> they're only a week old with eyes still closed, don't know if they'd figure that out...
[00:10] <daftykins> ah i see
[00:10] <daftykins> unlike them... ;x
[00:50] <pauljw> heheh...
[00:51] <OerHeks> 3 more days, after 10 days the eyes will open, and then trouble starts as they start crawling :-D
[00:51] <daftykins> :D
[00:51] <daftykins> into _everything_!
[00:52] <pauljw> i just hope we can keep them safe till weened and then take them to the spca for adoption.  i don't trust folks in the area to do the right thing and get them fixed.
[00:53] <daftykins> indeed :S
[00:53] <OerHeks> kittens need to be 10 weeks with their mum, no?
[00:53] <daftykins> Guernsey used to be overrun with cats, but a very strict policy means there are actually waiting lists for kittens now, so i've heard
[00:54] <pauljw> yes, OerHeks 8 to 10 weeks
[00:54] <OerHeks> Dogs a little longer, 12-14 weeks tops.
[00:55] <OerHeks> By then the mum is glad they go, really :-D
[00:55] <pauljw> :)
[01:02] <OerHeks> "everytime I wake from suspend I cannot connect to wifi." ... impatience, 30 sec is a long time..
[01:03] <daftykins> that's pretty bad in fairness!
[01:04] <OerHeks> I thought i suffered that 'bug'too, but after 30 seconds .. bling!
[01:32] <OerHeks> 91 keys .. mamamia
[01:32] <nacc> ridiculous :)
[01:33] <daftykins> hmm?
[01:33] <OerHeks> and he is trolling, i don't believe he has 91 keys
 happyfr0gg: Ouch !! .. just how many keys do you have ' ls /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d | wc -l ' ? <happyfr0gg> Bashing-om,  91
[01:34] <OerHeks> i have only 2 ..
[01:35] <daftykins> oh that type of key :>
[01:36] <OerHeks> daftykins, talk to the ops, you miss all the fun
[01:36] <daftykins> ;) no thanks!
[01:37] <Bashing-om> OerHeks: well i have 7 .. and no idea how come so many .. maybe I best do and find .. but 91 .. 91 !
[01:38] <nacc> i think some are installed by default, e.g., the ubuntu key, the debian keys (maybe)
[01:38] <nacc> not 100%
[01:39] <OerHeks> i have 2 ( + normal repo keys)
[01:39] <daftykins> could it be a PPA fiend?
[01:44] <OerHeks> i guess he is trolling.. i haven't seen proof that he is using so much ppa's >> feb 24 03:22:48 <happyfr0gg>	OerHeks - http://pastebin.com/QMAF12A8
[01:45] <pauljw> that's a lot of ppa's
[01:46] <OerHeks> 45 tops
[01:47] <OerHeks> I need more beer if you want the exact number *hips*
[01:48] <pauljw> lol
[01:48] <OerHeks> oh Calvin, .. http://calvinhobbesdaily.tumblr.com/image/157653330354
[01:49] <daftykins> ls -al /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ | pastebinit
[01:49] <daftykins> :)
[01:50] <pauljw> :)
[01:50] <OerHeks> nacc, ppas are windows executables, let him win
[01:50] <nacc> OerHeks: lol, not enough beer indeed
[01:50] <daftykins> D:
[01:51] <daftykins> i sense IT sanity is being violated
[01:51] <pauljw> http://paste.ubuntu.com/24062260/
[01:52] <OerHeks> yay, 1 key \o/
[01:53] <OerHeks> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nassi_IM8nI
[03:22] <pauljw> well, gnite all.  eyes are getting heavy. :)
[05:04] <Bashing-om> !info deluge-gtk xenial
[05:08] <Bashing-om> OerHeks: How come this is not making any sense : http://pastebin.com/WyMFH6gc where we have deluge-gtk as a dependency, but ' apt-cache depends deluge-gtk ' says it breaks deluge and even more it replaces deluge ?? Where am I failing to understand ?
[05:08] <OerHeks> Bashing-om, beats me too, i gave up looking. ppa's and ppa's combo do funny things.
[05:09] <OerHeks> noobslab ppa, or webupd8 ?
[05:29] <OerHeks> Bashing-om, i learned my lesson these last 3 days, people with ppa-hell >> reinstall, bye, see you in 30 minutes !
[05:31] <Bashing-om> OerHeks: Agreed - is the easyist thing to do .. and then it is clean . But I got nothing better to do than to see what I can learn :)
[06:05] <pavlushka> on #System76 toothe> when is System76 going to release their 15" lappies again?
[06:47] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[06:57] <ducasse> hi all
[06:57] <ducasse> morning lotuspsychje
[06:58] <lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
[06:58] <ducasse> hi Bashing-om
[06:58] <lotuspsychje> cuppa tea here
[06:58] <lotuspsychje> and working day at 12H
[06:58] <ducasse> me too - tea is utterly necessary to get started :)
[06:59] <Bashing-om> Aye .. the passing of the watch :)
[07:04] <Bashing-om> ducasse: What is it with yalls powers - seems while yall have the morning tea the channel comes to a halt .
[07:05] <ducasse> Bashing-om: everyone else is having theirs as well? :)
[07:06] <Bashing-om> ducasse: Well a logical expanation :) else asleep ?
[07:06] <ducasse> it _is_ the weekend, so i'm guessing tooday will be slow
[07:06] <ducasse> *today
[07:07] <lotuspsychje> unless 17.04 beta users come flood us :p
[07:09] <lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/entroware-launches-ubuntu-powered-aether-laptop-with-intel-kaby-lake-cpus-513291.shtml
[07:09] <Bashing-om> from what I see, 17.04 even in beta is solid .
[07:09] <lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: did you test already?
[07:10] <lotuspsychje> !zesty
[07:12] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: zesty enters beta today?
[07:12] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: beta1 23feb
[07:12] <Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: 17.04 about 3 weeks past . Seems mir has some catchup to do . but unity and gome3 are good on AMD platform here .
[07:12] <lotuspsychje>  Current dev version: Zesty Zapus | Schedule: http://ubottu.com/y/zz
[07:13] <ducasse> bah - mir :-/ waste of effort, imo.
[07:13] <lotuspsychje> really wondering how still story will end
[07:13] <lotuspsychje> this
[07:14] <ducasse> my guess: wayland will eventually 'win'
[07:14] <ducasse> but x will be there for years yet
[07:15] <lotuspsychje> as for what i understand, canonical will leave the user to choose if the future will be X or mir
[07:15] <ducasse> yes, that's what i heard too. even if canonical wants mir they will be in trouble if devs only choose to support wayland.
[07:18] <ducasse> gnome supports wayland, as does kde, every other distro adopts wayland and ignores mir, intel refuses to add mir-only patches - it's really not looking good for mir.
[07:18] <lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/02/ubuntu-17-04-beta-1-download
[07:19] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: and still phones and snap are deep based on mir plans already reall curious how they will go further
[07:20] <ducasse> _that_ is an issue, in my view. i'd love to see ubuntu phones/tablets catch on...
[07:20] <ducasse> what do you mean snap is based on mir?
[07:20] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: no i mean phones are mir, and they want the snap system on unity
[07:20] <lotuspsychje> also for desktop
[07:21] <ducasse> ah - i started to wonder :)
[07:22] <lotuspsychje> my dream scenario would be that ubuntu touch makes a version to get installed on all phones
[07:22] <lotuspsychje> if nothing happens with manufacturers, users will take over themselfs
[07:23] <lotuspsychje> i think budgie and mate are also a good example of users taking over
[07:24] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: have you tested budgie?
[07:24] <lotuspsychje> not yet, but looks promising
[07:25] <ducasse> and of course we need another desktop environment - too few to choose from ;)
[07:26] <lotuspsychje> lol
[07:29] <ducasse> we're getting to the point where it would probably be better for users if the devs focused on making a smaller number of them better...
[07:30] <lotuspsychje> yeah
[07:31] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: so, are you working the entire weekend?
[07:32] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: sunday off :p but next week much work as its holiday
[07:32] <lotuspsychje> not sure how its called in english
[07:33] <lotuspsychje> crocus holiday lol
[07:33] <ducasse> me neither :) translated from norwegian it would just be 'winter holiday' :)
[07:36] <lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: what time is on your place?
[07:36] <Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: it be 01:36 .
[07:37] <lotuspsychje> serious overtime :p
[07:37] <lotuspsychje> 8h37 here
[07:38] <Bashing-om> 'bout to my jumping off place .
[07:39] <ducasse> Bashing-om: well, have a good night's sleep, might see you when you return :)
[07:39] <lotuspsychje> yeah jump back to irc when you finished :p
[07:40] <ducasse> i need to reboot because systemd is stupid :-(
[07:40] <lotuspsychje> lol
[07:41] <ducasse> more tea first! :)
[07:42] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: working all of next week or going away too?
[07:42] <lotuspsychje> working : (
[07:42] <lotuspsychje> alot of tourists at our city in holidays= more kitchen work
[07:43] <ducasse> at least that brings in money so you can go away later :)
[07:43] <lotuspsychje> lol
[07:44] <lotuspsychje> thats optimistic indeed
[07:44] <ducasse> :)
[07:47] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: they hired someone new in the kitchen, also hope that will give me a few days more
[07:49] <ducasse> it's good that they're not too reliant on you, at least, so you can have time off etc
[07:49] <lotuspsychje> well for now, they pretty reliant on me as i started when the business opened
[07:50] <lotuspsychje> ideal would be 20h/week
[07:52] <ducasse> how much are you working now?
[07:52] <lotuspsychje> 38+ : (
[07:52] <ducasse> so, full time..
[07:53] <lotuspsychje> yep
[07:53] <lotuspsychje> and summer havent started yet
[07:54] <lotuspsychje> oh well hoping on better times :p
[07:54] <lotuspsychje> dont wanna nag
[07:54] <ducasse> well, at least it brings in money, right?
[07:55] <lotuspsychje> yeah thats the bright part
[07:55] <lotuspsychje> and i also love doing kitchen work also
[07:56] <lotuspsychje> mcrt: welcome
[07:56] <lotuspsychje> mcrt: think drivers on a linux has been problematic from the start
[07:57] <lotuspsychje> mcrt: all we can hope is linux to get bigger and bigger and more support
[07:58] <lotuspsychje> mcrt: also newer hardware needs newer hardware support
[07:58] <lotuspsychje> *driver
[07:58] <Bashing-om> mcrt: If ya tunning a later released card , in good shape ; else AMD and our community still working on a good driver .
[07:58] <Bashing-om> running*
[07:59] <mcrt> right. im dont actually have an amd card, just curious about the issue
[08:00] <Bashing-om> mcrt: https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2340914#post13561269 ; https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2317199#post13540589 .
[08:00] <ducasse> mcrt: the thing about amd drivers is that amdgpu is very new, it hasn't had time to mature yet. they probably dropped fglrx too early, but i guess they couldn't have that many people working on linux drivers.
[08:00] <mcrt> seems like there are patches to make fglrx compile on newer kernels too
[08:02] <ducasse> mcrt: you also need old x.org
[08:03] <lotuspsychje> alkisg: welcome to the club :p
[08:03] <alkisg> Hello!
[08:03] <alkisg> Not sure which topics would go here though...
[08:03] <alkisg> I know about #ubuntu-devel, #ubuntu-motu etc etc...
[08:03] <lotuspsychje> alkisg: we discussing all new stuff happening to ubuntu
[08:04] <lotuspsychje> alkisg: to be a better support in main
[08:04] <alkisg> OK, I'll lurk here to see... :)
[08:04] <lotuspsychje> great!
[08:04] <lotuspsychje> brb scrambled eggs are waiting for me
[08:07] <mcrt> ducasse: gotcha. im pretty much stuck on xorg-1.9 myself
[08:08] <mcrt> funnily enough this is a laptop that was sold with linux.
[08:10] <ducasse> in all fairness, older cards with the radeon driver are usually very stable, as opposed to nvidia + nouveau.
[08:10] <mcrt> gpu chip on this is intel
[08:10] <mcrt> well, actually powervr
[08:12] <mcrt> but yeah, the machine was originally sold with ubuntu preinstalled...
[08:13] <mcrt> these days even unity fails to run. it's a 7 year old machine though, but still... so much for LTS
[08:18] <ducasse> mcrt: i'm sure you can get help with that in #ubuntu, alternatively just switch to a lighter desktop
[08:21] <Bashing-om> OH Kay ,, here is muy back side , catch up on the flop :)
[08:21] <lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: nite nite
[08:22] <Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Laters .
[08:22] <mcrt> ducasse: thanks, it works fine for me. but it is still a sad story
[08:22] <mcrt> ducasse: only thing you can gather from it is that binary drivers are not a very good option for the long haul
[08:23] <lotuspsychje> mcrt: the #gamingonlinux community seems also to experiment with mesa and such
[08:23] <mcrt> when the money moves, so does the driver support, and then you're pretty much out of luck
[08:23] <lotuspsychje> mcrt: also interesting to hang there, to see how they fix
[08:24] <lotuspsychje> and following phoronix driver news can be enlighting
[08:24] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: finished breakfast? :)
[08:24] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: yeah, lol was it fast?
[08:25] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: maybe it just seemed fast to me :)
[08:25] <mcrt> lotuspsychje: thanks :) ive got zsnes and dosbox running smoothly, that's pretty much all i need on this machine ;)
[08:26] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: too intering here to miss :p
[08:26] <lotuspsychje> *interesting
[08:27] <lotuspsychje> mcrt: http://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=phoronix_news
[08:38] <mcrt> lotuspsychje: that page is so much nicer than the default landing on phoronix.com
[08:38] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: http://www.deviantart.com/art/dark-cyan-i3-linux-663774452
[08:38] <lotuspsychje> mcrt: yeah isnt it, nice category look
[08:43] <lotuspsychje> isnt that cool, zesty kde on surface pro 3: http://www.deviantart.com/art/Kubuntu-17-04-Surface-Pro-3-659930569
[08:51] <lotuspsychje> morning BobbyJr
[08:51] <BobbyJr> Good morning
[09:06] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: nice, but i don't like the color scheme...
[09:46] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: dont like dark themes?
[09:46] <ducasse> dark themes are ok, i don't like the cyan ;)
[09:46] <lotuspsychje> ah
[09:47] <ducasse> i'm not all that fond of dark gtk themes, though, few of them work well in all applications
[09:48] <lotuspsychje> i like the vanilla windowmanagers + nice wallpaper
[09:51] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: does i3 have themes by default?
[09:52] <ducasse> lotuspsychje: no, just a default color scheme and default font.
[09:52] <lotuspsychje> kk
[09:53] <ducasse> you _can_ make it look very nice, though, i've just made it practical and comfy :)
[09:53] <lotuspsychje> yeah i like comfy tweaking aswell under the hood
[09:54] <lotuspsychje> a system should be smooth to work with, very anyoing to work with windows these days
[09:56] <ducasse> i3 is pretty nice to work with by default, but it gets a lot better by adding a few tools, setting your own keybindings etc
[09:57] <ducasse> by now i have everything in muscle memory, so i hardly notice it's there
[09:57] <lotuspsychje> yeah you told me the other day i3 pretty fast start compare to unity aswell
[09:58] <lotuspsychje> for me its interesting to tweak unity same way, so i can bring this to my customers desktops
[09:59] <lotuspsychje> too bad those snaps need launchpad account, so i have to make one for new customers
[10:00] <ducasse> weird, really, as you don't need one to install them from cli
[10:01] <lotuspsychje> ill test again later from ubuntu software
[10:01] <ducasse> i've heard others say it's needed, so i'm sure you're right
[10:02] <lotuspsychje> yeah also saw it passby main, they got errors about an account
[10:02] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: same way you need the account on ubuntu-touch
[10:03] <ducasse> i have mixed feelings about snap, especially that canonical won't let you host your own repo
[10:03] <lotuspsychje> they idea is good, but the structure is complicated indeed
[10:05] <lotuspsychje> no ppa's and cool software like telegram i find fantastic
[10:06] <ducasse> i get slightly suspicious about things like that, and flatpak is completely open. flatpak requires systemd, though, so nothing's perfect ;)
[10:07] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: would love to see a bright future with the user got the complete choice over everything
[10:07] <lotuspsychje> maybe thats too much asked
[10:08] <ducasse> hehe, too many corps and govs who don't want that :)
[10:08] <lotuspsychje> yeah
[10:08] <lotuspsychje> ducasse: off to work mate, ttyl ; )
[10:09] <lotuspsychje> have a nice weekend
[10:09] <ducasse> you too!
[10:09] <lotuspsychje> tnx
[10:09] <lotuspsychje> laterz guys
[11:00] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[11:04] <ducasse> \o BluesKaj
[11:04] <ducasse> did i tell you xbian has switched to kodi 17 now?
[11:07] <BluesKaj> Hi ducasse , I see, I still prefer jarvis, think krypton(17) is a terrible gui, it's much clunkier than jarvis, it's actually harder to navigate
[11:08] <ducasse> i actually think it's much nicer :)
[11:08] <BluesKaj> for me at least
[11:08] <ducasse> although i've not used it that much yet
[11:08] <BluesKaj> it's pk if you don't use addons
[11:08] <BluesKaj> ok
[11:09] <BluesKaj> too many menus
[11:11] <ducasse> i really only use the kodi interface itself, not a lot of addons, so that might explain it
[11:12] <ducasse> i keep noticing little things i think are done better, like the ui being better presented etc
[11:12] <ducasse> BluesKaj: do you know if zesty has relatively new kde packages?
[11:15] <BluesKaj> not really, thay're mainly the same packages, just upgraded using the plasma5 DE
[11:16] <ducasse> ok. tried to play with kde connect, but it seems the yakkety packages are not very useful
[13:54] <tarball> why is there a piece of software on ubuntu that produces its output in Microsoft Windows Excel format? since when supposedly FOSS systems use MS formats?
[13:54] <tarball> hello again to those who were not just in ubuntu channel
[13:58] <ducasse> which software?
[14:09] <tarball> ducasse, "Checkbox"
[14:11] <ducasse> tarball: never heard of it, but i can't see why the developer shouldn't be free to choose whatever format they please
[14:13] <ducasse> tarball: looking at the wikipedia page, it doesn't seem like there are any limitations to using it in foss
[14:14] <tarball> ducasse, regardless of hows and whats of 'xslx' format, I cant even imagine an MS-Office format -yes, it is one- in a FOSS system when there are alternatives. plain as that.
[14:14] <ducasse> so, anything developed by ms is tainted beyond hope?
[14:24] <tarball> ducasse. I guess it is a motive to comply with the broader ubuntu view of today to respond with arguments a la 'what is wrong with X'..still I answer your question; yes.
[14:24] <tarball> and it is a direction
[14:24] <tarball> that is deliberately taken
[14:24] <tarball> why not alternatives when they are there and when they are FOSS?
[14:25] <ducasse> i consider myself fairly strict on foss issues, but there is nothing in the licence that prevents foss from using it. sorry, but saying 'because ms' is just silly, imo.
[14:32] <tarball> I already ventured into hearing from some that it is, no worries. but the fact is that it is not. for, again, 1. it has FOSS alternatives, why not use them instead if you are developing for a FOSS system 2. ubuntu is already known not to be strict about this distinction, and openly putting an MS format out there seems to be a statement for what is yet to come, frankly.
[14:33] <tarball> and last, it disturbs me to see right in the middle of my desktop an MS Office file
[14:35] <ducasse> this is _one_ application in the repos. there are tons of programs there with more worrying licence issues. 'because it was developed by ms' reminds me of people who won't use systemd because lennart poettering is the originator.
[14:35] <ducasse> but whatever, you are entitled to your opinion.
[14:35] <tarball> I dont know about that program. anyway, you're right about more worrying licenses
[14:36] <tarball> and after having opted-out of third party programs during installation, I got graphic isses I never had, as a sidenote
[14:36] <tarball> issues*
[16:55] <OerHeks> when one stops feeding trolls, ..
[16:56] <BluesKaj> OerHeks, it's the wekend , they seem to be mopre active this weekend than usual
[16:57] <ducasse> seems there's been an influx of newbies lately, maybe it's just me.
[16:57] <OerHeks> i know, still i know there are serious people needing a direction.
[16:58] <OerHeks> and a lot of lonely people ♫
[16:58] <BluesKaj> there seems to be one or two in every chat I'm monitoring
[17:00] <ducasse> anyone seen Eric^^ today?
[17:03] <BluesKaj> ducasse, whois doesn't show him anywhere on freenode
[17:04] <OerHeks> actually, i have never seen him.
[17:05] <OerHeks> :-(
[17:05] <ducasse> OerHeks: :-P
[17:05] <OerHeks> eric could be a girl with curly hair ...
[17:05] <BluesKaj> OerHeks,
[17:06] <BluesKaj> ??
[17:06] <OerHeks> oke oke i stop my fantasy
[17:07] <BluesKaj> he lives in a dangerous city
[17:07] <OerHeks> Beirut, yes?
[17:07] <BluesKaj> yup
[17:08] <BluesKaj> very helpful fella tho
[18:36] <Bashing-om> Back ! .. Ready to do this again, see what a Saturday brings .
[18:37] <BluesKaj> Hey Bashing-om, been quiet here for the 90 mins or so
[18:38] <BluesKaj> last
[18:40] <Bashing-om> BluesKaj: Hey hey - Quiet on the channel, generally means I get inquisitive and break something on my system . Just can not leave well enough alone :)
[18:41] <OerHeks> Just finished the kitchen, now doing some ironing..
[18:41] <BluesKaj> well, inquisitive has it's benefits, like learning how stuff breaks :-)
[18:41] <ducasse> hehe, i've resisted upgrading to zesty all day, maybe i'll go ahead and break it properly now before bedtime :)
[18:41] <Bashing-om> BluesKaj: And we then know " do what I say; not what I do !) .
[18:42] <BluesKaj> ducasse, zesty beta 1 is more stable than the daily
[18:43] <BluesKaj> it's still in freeze anyway, I think
[18:43] <ducasse> i might still be able to break it if only i try hard enough ;)
[18:43] <BluesKaj> oh no doubt
[18:43] <Bashing-om> BluesKaj: ducasse Have yet to see any issue within my zesty install ( not counting mir - have not muchly explored ) .
[18:46] <BluesKaj> ahh, i'm running kde/plasma5 here, there a few small issues, like konverstion supposedly crashing after I close it...strange behaviour there
[18:47] <Bashing-om> BluesKaj: Follow up the error report . see if it is an identified issue ?
[18:48] <ducasse> BluesKaj: weirdness. anything if you launch it from shell?
[20:13] <BluesKaj> sorry ducasse, was called afk, haven't tried from the shell yet
[20:49] <Bashing-om> !grub


[21:54] <checkers> hi, is this wiki page still relevant for ubuntu >10.04? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/CrashdumpRecipe


[00:19] <elhoir> hello guys
[00:19] <elhoir> im getting an strange error message in dmesg:
[00:19] <elhoir> "EXT4-fs (sda4): unable to read superblock"
[00:20] <elhoir> but im using system normally.... what does it mean?
[00:22] <penguin42> what is sda4 - is that a partition you recognise?
[00:22] <elhoir> i think its the linux partition - let me tell you via gparted
[00:23] <elhoir> ah no
[00:23] <elhoir> sd4 is the extended partition
[00:24] <elhoir> which contains sda5 - the linux swap fs
[00:25] <elhoir> so its normal? i mean, sd4 does not contain a superblock in its own, right?
[00:25] <elhoir> sda4*
[00:26] <penguin42> yeh, so the question is why the heck is it trying to mount it - it only gives you that error if you try and mount it
[00:26] <elhoir> penguin42, because i have the swap fs in it
[00:26] <elhoir> so its always mounting it
[00:28] <elhoir> in the /proc/partitions file sda4 does not exist
[00:28] <penguin42> but it shouldn't normally try and mount the extended partition
[00:31] <rww> it might be in fstab for some reason?
[00:32] <elhoir> rww no it isnt
[00:32] <elhoir> penguin42, im uploading a picture for you to see
[00:33] <elhoir> (better said, trying to..... f****ng 1mb adsl)
[00:33] <penguin42> a picture of what?
[00:33] <elhoir> gparted
[00:33] <elhoir> https://imageshack.com/i/exYPdVvkp
[00:34] <penguin42> elhoir: fdisk -l    would have got the same info as text
[00:34] <elhoir> ugh... heh... see, im still a n00b
[00:34] <elhoir> :P
[00:35] <elhoir> well, anyway, you can see the sda4 partition is extended
[00:35] <elhoir> and inside it, i have the swap partition
[00:35] <penguin42> yeh - it's actually an odd layout
[00:35] <penguin42> elhoir: As rww says; can you check your /etc/fstab to see if it mentioned sda4 ?
[00:35] <rww> i think they said it doesn't
[00:35] <elhoir> it doesnt
[00:36] <elhoir> it mentions sda5 - the swap one
[00:36] <elhoir> but not sda4
[00:36] <penguin42> hmm weird then
[00:38] <elhoir> http://pastebin.com/pCpyUSLC
[00:40] <penguin42> odd, oh well - it's difficult to track down what's trying to mount it
[00:42] <elhoir> lets see if dmesg gives a clue.....
[00:45] <elhoir> nah... no clue
[00:45] <elhoir> http://pastebin.com/YLJPYHLA
[00:46] <elhoir> " 584.155102] FAT-fs (sda4): Can't find a valid FAT filesystem" <-------------- funny. Of course you cant! there is NOT any FAT fs inside!
[00:46] <elhoir> xD
[00:47] <elhoir> nor HFS fs xD
[00:48] <penguin42> yeh that's where it's tried to mount it and gone through them all and each one has moaned that it's not one of them
[00:50] <elhoir> do you mean kernel is mounting all of the partitions to verify the fs, and then unmounts them?
[00:50] <penguin42> no
[00:51] <penguin42> for some reason it's trying to mount that partiton; but it doesn't know what type to expect, so it's trying to mount it with each of the filesystem types in turn
[00:51] <elhoir> ah ok
[00:52] <elhoir> should i take any action?
[00:53] <penguin42> I don't think so
[00:54] <Nothing_Much> xmir is pretty laggy in 14.10
[00:54] <elhoir> what about xserver 1.16 ? i havent upgraded yet
[00:56] <Nothing_Much> elhoir: how do I check which xserver I have?
[00:56] <Nothing_Much> terminal?
[00:57] <elhoir> no idea
[00:57] <Nothing_Much> well..
[00:57] <Nothing_Much> I'm running 7.7+7ubuntu1
[00:57] <elhoir> thats xorg
[00:57] <Nothing_Much> yeah
[00:58] <elhoir> i was just about to install libmirserver25 but i dont know what will happen after reboot :P
[00:59] <Nothing_Much> if you have two monitors
[00:59] <Nothing_Much> there's a regression
[00:59] <elhoir> no i havent
[00:59] <elhoir> only 1
[00:59] <Nothing_Much> where the monitors aren't resolution..ed properly
[00:59] <Nothing_Much> oh okay
[00:59] <Nothing_Much> well your games may lag a bit
[00:59] <Nothing_Much> otherwise, basic desktop usage is okayish
[00:59] <Nothing_Much> for 14.10
[01:00] <Nothing_Much> 14.04 has laggy games too, but it's not nearly as bad
[01:00] <elhoir> the question is... how do u knwo you are on top of Mir instead X ?
[01:00] <Nothing_Much> but I'm on radeonSI
[01:00] <Nothing_Much> hold up
[01:00] <Nothing_Much> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Mir/Installing
[01:00] <elhoir> ah
[01:01] <Nothing_Much> verifying that unity-system-compositor is running
[01:01] <Nothing_Much> but honestly, I think the most important one is the first one
[01:01] <Nothing_Much> since the other 2 don't do much, if at all
[01:01] <Nothing_Much> wait
[01:02] <Nothing_Much> the second one is the most important one
[01:02] <Nothing_Much> the grep one
[01:03] <elhoir> so its the same as
[01:03] <elhoir> sudo apt-get install libmirserver25 xserver-xorg-mir
[01:03] <elhoir> and than
[01:04] <elhoir> sudo restart lightdm
[01:04] <elhoir> then*
[01:05] <elhoir> acording the the page, you are running X on top of Mir
[01:07] <Nothing_Much> the Xmir compatibility layer yeah
[01:08] <elhoir> i dont use 3d games in this laptop....
[01:08] <elhoir> what about 2d performance?
[01:08] <elhoir> what do u think?
[01:08]  * elhoir is thinking in changing to Mir)
[01:09] <elhoir> video playback, and so .....
[01:09] <Nothing_Much> elhoir: well..
[01:09] <Nothing_Much> since they use the FOSS drivers..
[01:09] <Nothing_Much> I'd say you're in good hands
[01:09] <elhoir> :D
[01:09] <Nothing_Much> they being xmir
[01:10] <elhoir> i use a radeon HD 5145 here
[01:10] <elhoir> using radeon 7.4.0 driver
[01:10] <Nothing_Much> me too :D
[01:10] <Nothing_Much> well
[01:10] <elhoir> lol
[01:10] <Nothing_Much> I have an APU
[01:10] <Nothing_Much> but I use radeonSI :D
[01:11] <elhoir> what is radeonSI exactly?
[01:11]  * penguin42 is glad you asked that....
[01:11] <elhoir> any difference with the xserver-xorg-video-radeon driver?
[01:12] <Nothing_Much> elhoir: it's the mesa driver for radeon 7xxx and higher o.o
[01:12] <Nothing_Much> r600 is used for 6xxx to 4xxx I think
[01:12] <elhoir> ahhhh
[01:12] <elhoir> my desktop computer has an HD 6570
[01:13] <elhoir> and my other laptop is an APPU with radeon HD 8400
[01:13] <elhoir> so i think i only use that driver for the Acer laptop
[05:00] <rainbowwarrior> hello
[10:12] <BluesKaj> 'Morning folks
[11:19] <penguin42> lightdm has broken for me :-(
[11:23] <elfy> oh dear - I had a bunch of that sort of thing last week
[11:24] <lordievader> I'm upgrading now to Utopic, lets see if it breaks for me too.
[11:25] <penguin42> this machine has been running utopic for a month+ and it's been fine
[11:25]  * penguin42 filed it as https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/1369250
[11:26] <penguin42> hmph I expected it would upload some of the logs but it doesn't seem to have bothered
[11:26] <elfy> it also says that lightdm is not installed
[11:27] <lordievader> That's odd, it should not throw lightdm off an machine during an update.
[11:29] <elfy> hi BluesKaj
[11:29]  * penguin42 thinks he's found the minor problem
[11:29] <BluesKaj> hey elfy
[11:29] <penguin42> elfy: Yeh
[11:30] <penguin42> brb
[11:30] <elfy> perhaps they forgot to include the brown paper and vinegar with the updates you got :)
[11:33] <elfy> working now?
[11:33] <penguin42> yep
[11:33] <elfy> \o/
[11:34] <jtaylor> does apt-get tab completion not work in utopic?
[11:34] <penguin42> I'm not sure where the bug is though; I did an autoremove yesterday so that must have removed the lightdm; but removing lightdm should select a new dm or not try and start X at all; and it looks like upstart is still trying to start it
[11:34] <elfy> jtaylor: doesn't for me in recovery, but works fine in desktop
[11:36] <elfy> penguin42: possibly - check the history log I guess
[11:40] <elfy> jtaylor: I think there's a bug with apt so tab complete doesn't work with apt install foo
[11:41] <jtaylor> yes apt doesn't work
[11:41] <jtaylor> got apt-get to work, some weirdness in my local file ...
[11:42] <elfy> :)
[13:00] <Nothing_Much> does xmir get some loving on occasion? or will that happen during 15.04?
[14:02] <lordievader> Upgrade to Utopic went without troubles :D
[14:06] <Nothing_Much> lordievader: Same here
[14:06] <Nothing_Much> Does xmir get some loving on occasion? or will that happen during 15.04?
[14:07] <lordievader> Nothing_Much: Last I heard it will take some time before mir is used. However I know nothing about Unity ;)
[14:07] <Nothing_Much> lordievader: Well, Mir keeps getting updated for phones and tablets
[14:07] <Nothing_Much> XMir is the compatibility layer for "legacy" xorg apps
[14:07] <Nothing_Much> such as Bitfighter and Steam
[14:08] <Nothing_Much> and pretty much every application that's on GNU/Linux
[14:09] <Nothing_Much> XMir on 14.04 though did work somewhat, stuttering happened in Source games, but 14.10 the multi monitor support was borked
[14:09] <lordievader> To quote a conversation of a few days ago: 20:45 < ktogias> Hi. I just downloaded the latest utopic daily build for testing purposes, and I realized that the live systems runs on X server. Isn't it supposed that utopic will ship with unity 8 over Mir display server? Have I missed something?
[14:09] <lordievader> 20:48 < rww> no, utopic is not supposed to ship with unity 8 over mir
[14:09] <lordievader> 20:49 < rww> and to answer the question you're about to ask: some time before 16.04, I believe
[14:12] <Nothing_Much> Regarding XMir, I meant when development will start to chug along faster, not when it's going to be enabled by default
[14:12] <Nothing_Much> which may happen in 15.04 or 15.10
[14:12] <Nothing_Much> most likely 15.10
[14:13] <Nothing_Much> and Unity 8 for desktops I really want to happen for 15.10 especiallyy
[14:13] <Nothing_Much> *especially
[14:17] <Daekdroom> There is a Utopic ISO that ships with Mir and Unity 8, but it's for testing purposes only.
[14:17] <lordievader> Nothing_Much: Like I said I know nothing about Unity. Cannot help you with that.
[14:17] <Nothing_Much> lordievader: Yeah, no problem
[14:18] <Nothing_Much> Daekdroom: Yeah, but I wish I could use my VM to test it, but Virtualbox doesn't support Mir yet
[14:18] <Daekdroom> Use a LiveUSB
[14:19] <lordievader> Nothing_Much: KVM might support it.
[14:19] <BluesKaj> Daekdroom, got a url ?
[14:20] <BluesKaj> i wouldn't install 14.10 with Unity/mir on my hdd but live media image would be fun to try
[14:20] <Daekdroom> Bluefoxicy, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-desktop-next/daily-live/current/
[14:20] <Daekdroom> Oops.
[14:20] <Daekdroom> BluesKaj, ^
[14:20] <BluesKaj> thanks Daekdroom
[14:22] <popey> Nothing_Much: i will ask about xmir but i think the focus is on mir at the moment
[14:22] <Nothing_Much> popey: yeah that's what's happening *right now*
[14:22] <Nothing_Much> I'm talking about future endeavours :)
[14:23] <popey> i know
[14:23] <popey> the goal is to have unity8 on mir by default "By 16.04"
[14:24] <popey> which means it really needs to either be in 15.04 or 15.10, but I don't think that's been decided yet
[14:24] <Nothing_Much> yeah, intend to do that!
[14:24] <popey> don't think we want to have another x based release in 2016
[14:24] <Nothing_Much> nobody does I'm sure
[14:24] <Nothing_Much> except Valve
[14:29] <BluesKaj> don't kde/kubuntu is going with mir. seems wayland is in it's future
[14:30] <BluesKaj> think
[14:30] <Nothing_Much> depends, really
[14:30] <Nothing_Much> they could just implement both
[14:30] <Nothing_Much> shouldn't take long, right?
[14:31] <lordievader> Nothing_Much: The KDE developers rather want to spend time in a display system that is used on more than one distro ;)
[14:32] <Nothing_Much> it's confusing to me though
[14:32] <BluesKaj> lordievader, +1 :)
[14:32] <Nothing_Much> since Mir is a display server and Wayland is a protocol
[14:32] <BluesKaj> semantics
[14:32] <Nothing_Much> but yeah I see the point, but there's tons of different things that power the Internet as well as Linux
[14:32] <Nothing_Much> semantics?
[14:35] <BluesKaj> Nothing_Much, for all intents and purposes, yes. if kubuntu implements wayland , the X is going by the wayside (no pun intended) whetherr it's a prortocol or server won't matter in the end to users
[14:36] <ikonia> I thought kubuntu had decided wayland was the way to go and mir was off the table
[14:36] <Nothing_Much> that's what happened
[14:37] <lordievader> Thought so too.
[14:38] <BluesKaj> yup ikonia afaik wayland is in kubuntu's future
[14:39] <ikonia> ok cool, I'm on the same page then
[14:41] <popey> (which is of course fine)
[14:43] <ikonia> why would it be a problem ?
[14:43] <ikonia> (or bad)
[14:43] <popey> well indeed.
[14:43] <Bluefoxicy> WAT
[14:43] <popey> lots of people seem to paint it as a problem
[14:44] <ikonia> I don't see why
[14:44] <ikonia> you use the tools that fit your need
[14:44] <BluesKaj> perhaps my choice of words could have been better about the semantics comments, I wasn't implying that wayland wasn't going to be used, merely that whether it's a server or a protocol makes no difference to the user
[14:44] <popey> I think because people perceive that an official ubuntu flavour not using the same technology underneath that the main distro uses is some kind of big issue
[14:45] <popey> but also it didn't help that there were some heated public discussions about it
[14:45] <popey> which painted canonical / ubuntu in a bad light from the k side
[14:45] <ikonia> the only issue is that it suited the project to use X instead of Y because X met the needs
[14:45] <ikonia> it's not really it's a choice
[14:45] <ikonia> the same as anyone is free to do
[14:46] <BluesKaj> well, i guess ubuntu is seeking a different direction and kubuntu will follow the mainstream with all the other distros that adopt wayland
[14:46] <ikonia> that's clear
[14:46] <ikonia> but ubuntu isn't making any secret of it's leading it's own path
[14:46] <ikonia> so not everything will fit with other distros
[14:47] <BluesKaj> wonder about debian's course
[14:47] <popey> debian will wait and see I expect
[14:47] <popey> they wont want to break any of the main desktops
[14:48] <ikonia> it looks like debian will go towards X/wayland from the discussions I've read
[14:48] <ikonia> it's still very earliy in the day though
[14:51] <BluesKaj> I'm going to give the Unity 8/mir image a try on usb