[08:11] <Kilos> o/
[09:46] <inetpro> hi
[11:41] <Kilos> lo
[12:42] <psydroid> and behold
[13:07] <inetpro> :-D
[13:08] <inetpro> Kilos: at least it's getting a bit warmer again this week


[00:51] <ScottL> astraljava, did you ask about the -menu package updating and building a new .deb file in #ubuntu-motu?
[00:51]  * ScottL doesn't want to ask a redundant question there
[08:56] <astraljava> Yes I did, and I was told to file a FFe bug about it.
[08:56] <astraljava> Actually, asked on -devel.
[09:35] <astraljava> \m/ No unity on the current image! Of course, I haven't tested if it's installable, yet...
[09:55] <astraljava> Good news is that so far, we're only about 82Mb bigger than the last LTS. So a little bit relief for not getting all too bloaty. Granted, we
[09:55] <astraljava> we're not final yet, but that can go either way.
[09:55] <astraljava> There might be some cruft still.
[10:09] <falktx> damn I forgot to download it yesterday
[10:09] <falktx> it's impossible now at work :(
[10:09] <falktx> astraljava: did the menu package got up?
[10:26] <astraljava> falktx: Not yet. I need to file an FFe bug about it.
[15:23] <scott-work> i tested the QA image last night and it installed correctly :)
[15:24] <scott-work> apparently the computer with which I was testing was not reading the new discs/images correctly :(
[15:24] <scott-work> i burnt yesterday's QA image and one machine didn't work, but i put the same disc into another machine and it install :/
[15:24] <scott-work> but it looks like we have yet _another_ image email today
[15:25] <astraljava> I'm hearing a lot of weird errors like that lately, or so it seems. Think it's happening more these days than before, but it might be only because I'm more active now than ever before.
[15:25] <astraljava> Yeah we got a new image for today as well. And it's got NO unity! w00T!
[15:26] <astraljava> I'll test the QA image soon, too.
[15:32] <scott-work> well, i found it surprising that i pulled out an older disc (ubuntu studio 11.04 i think) and tested it on the machine that didn't want to boot with the oneiric QA/daily images
[15:33] <scott-work> and it worked!
[15:33] <scott-work> *shrug* i don't know
[15:34] <scott-work> can i ask people who did test to make sure and report the test on the QA website?
[15:34] <scott-work> i can provide the links again if it will help
[15:35] <scott-work> remember, if we don't get this images test we might not have image to release Oo
[16:34] <astraljava> Yep, I'll be reporting soon, but people please, we need more!
[17:07] <scott-work> email sent to -devel list as well
[17:15] <charlie-tca> asked in QA meeting too
[17:15] <astraljava> I asked on user channel as well, so far only one goal.
[17:18] <charlie-tca> I will do some after Xubuntu, it might take a while, though. If I get the images synced, I will run one test on each arch to make sure they work
[17:35] <charlie-tca> testing ubuntustudio 64 with encrypted lvm install
[18:07] <scott-work> charlie-tca:  have you automated the testing process?
[18:09] <charlie-tca> nope
[18:09] <charlie-tca> I still have to figure that part out
[18:10] <charlie-tca> I seem to be a having a bit of difficulty understanding how to make the process automated
[18:12] <scott-work> ah, okay, i had read a few things where it seemed like various people had automated this
[18:12] <scott-work> just a general note: i made a new blog post and copied it to the -devel mailing list and g+ as well
[18:13] <scott-work> i hope to develop more web presence again for ubuntu studio
[18:56] <charlie-tca> hm, long time blue background only during this install. Is my video card too old?
[18:57] <charlie-tca> very old nvidia MX-4000t
[18:57] <charlie-tca> pp[d
[18:57] <charlie-tca> ooops
[18:57] <charlie-tca> mesages in the logs
[18:58] <charlie-tca> failed to execute '/lib/udev/watershed' 'watershed sh -c '/sbin/lvm/vgscan; /sbin/lvm vgchange -a y'': No such file or directory
[18:58] <charlie-tca> got a segfault to go with it
[19:01] <charlie-tca> will burn another dvd and try again
[19:08] <scott-work> charlie-tca: was this with the ubuntu studio image?
[19:08] <charlie-tca> yup
[19:08] <charlie-tca> 64bit encrypted lvm
[19:09] <charlie-tca> burning a new dvd on a different computer, will attempt the install again to verify it is not my dvd.
[19:11] <charlie-tca> seems like a bad thing, too
[19:11] <charlie-tca> Trying again, different dvd
[19:15] <charlie-tca> scott-work: blaming it on my disk
[19:16] <scott-work> charlie-tca: i had a few those as well i think :/
[19:16] <scott-work> but i still have one machine that will not boot _any_ of the new images
[19:16] <charlie-tca> This attempt is working better
[19:17] <charlie-tca> oh, I had one of those machines
[19:17] <charlie-tca> probably still in the closet
[19:17] <charlie-tca> Makes working on these development releases much harder
[19:27] <scott-work> yeah, but this machine would boot a 10.04 ubuntu studio dvd :/
[19:27] <scott-work> strange, but oh well
[19:28] <charlie-tca> I had tested quite a few releases on mine when it decided not to test new onew
[19:28] <charlie-tca> s /onew/ones
[19:28] <charlie-tca> and it still works with older images
[19:28] <charlie-tca> big red failure screen - oh-oh
[19:29] <charlie-tca> scott-work: they need to kick the server and cut new images for you
[19:30] <charlie-tca> It is almost the same errors I got with Xubuntu Alternate images
[19:30] <charlie-tca> the build is bad
[19:33] <charlie-tca> no error in log
[19:34] <charlie-tca> here is the log from the installation:
[19:34] <charlie-tca> http://paste.ubuntu.com/679164/
[19:37] <astraljava> scott-work: What is that machine, that boots not one of our images? Proc, memory, chipsets, graphics, audio card?
[19:37] <charlie-tca> I pasted the log in #ubuntu-release
[19:38] <astraljava> Uh oh.
[19:39] <astraljava> That's nothing we can touch, anyhoo.
[19:39]  * astraljava takes the dog for a walk
[19:39] <scott-work> astraljava: it's a gateway machine that i'm not terribly familiar with, but it's a i386 machine
[19:40] <astraljava> scott-work: Would be good to dig out the details, might be something that's not overly tested in the circles.
[19:40] <scott-work> astraljava: when i get home i can do that
[19:49] <charlie-tca> They are respinning the images; let's hope it works
[20:37] <scott-work> hmmph, i'm feeling overwhelmed at work :(
[20:39]  * holstein gives scott-work some coffee :)
[20:50] <scott-work> lol
[20:51] <scott-work> when we were rebuilding the department i did all the scheduling for both engineers and detailers for a few years
[20:52] <scott-work> then we hired an engineer (i'm not) who would supervise the entire department
[20:52] <scott-work> i (gratefully and gracefully) slid out of that position and focused on trainging and quality of our output
[20:52] <scott-work> he scheduled and went to meetings (yuck!)
[20:52] <scott-work> he is out this week on vacation so i'm inundated with fabrication and scheduling
[20:53] <scott-work> ....and meetings (yuck! again)
[20:54] <scott-work> i tend to be a very direct person who likes to solve problems rather than talk about them
[20:54] <scott-work> so i don't suffer meetings very well, especially the people who like to repeat the same explanation over and over
[20:54] <scott-work> i'm like, "shut up!  i already know what we need to do!"
[20:54] <scott-work> well, not really, but that's what i'm thinking in me noggin'
[21:03] <rlameiro> evening
[21:38] <falktx> hm, fresh images
[21:38] <falktx> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntustudio/daily/current/
[21:39] <falktx> rlameiro: oh, btw, I have network at home now
[21:39] <rlameiro> falktx, super :D
[21:40] <falktx> libunity5_4.0.0-0ubuntu4_i386.deb is there, but I guess that's unavoidable
[21:40] <scott-work> falktx: are you still interested in maybe fixing the lightdm background?
[21:40] <scott-work> i have some information that might help
[21:40] <falktx> scott-work: background?
[21:40] <scott-work> theme or whatever it is
[21:40] <scott-work> something better than that fekking pink background
[21:41] <holstein> scott-work: you dont likey da pink :)
[21:41] <falktx> scott-work: hm, I had submitted a theme some days ago...
[21:41] <scott-work> falktx: you did?  really?
[21:41] <charlie-tca> Yeah, I pushed a respin since it failed on Trying to install 64bit encrypted lvm
[21:42] <scott-work> falktx: against the main lightdm package?
[21:42] <falktx> scott-work: a US lightdm theme
[21:42] <scott-work> did we have one before?  or did you create a new package within -settings or other package?
[21:42] <falktx> the theme works, but we need to set -settings to apply it
[21:43] <falktx> scott-work: it's a new brand package, a theme to lightdm for US
[21:43]  * falktx sometimes feels ignored
[21:43]  * holstein gives falk a fist-bump
[21:44] <falktx> holstein: scott-work: kxstudio.sourceforge.net/tmp/ubuntustudio-lightdm-theme_0.1.tar.gz
[21:44] <falktx> oops
[21:44] <falktx> http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/tmp/ubuntustudio-lightdm-theme_0.1.tar.gz
[21:45] <falktx> I showed this before
[21:45] <falktx> screenshot -> http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/tmp/scr023.png
[21:45] <holstein> falktx: cool
[21:46] <holstein> that'll do it :)
[21:46] <scott-work> falktx: i remember this but i thought we were going to make our own package
[21:46] <falktx> scott-work: well, use that one
[21:46] <falktx> and modify as you need
[21:46] <scott-work> although i'm not sure would be the way to do it (i.e. make our own)
[21:46] <falktx> it's already working...
[21:46] <holstein> yeah, just put it in there, however charlie-tca suggests
[21:46] <falktx> scott-work: we only need to set the default lightdm greeter to gtk, everything else is handled
[21:46] <holstein> you guys need soemthing like that for xubuntu right?
[21:47] <charlie-tca> heheheh
[21:47] <scott-work> charlie-tca: did you see falktx 's link?  you might want to pass that on to mr_pouit or madnick
[21:47] <falktx> scott-work: probably xubuntu does it too, so we just need to borrow some code and it's all set
[21:47] <holstein> charlie-tca: or are you not using lightdm?
[21:47] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit said we are waiting until the next cycle to touch lightdm
[21:47] <falktx> remember
[21:47] <falktx> we only need to set the default lightdm greeter to gtk, everything else is handled
[21:47] <holstein> charlie-tca: right...
[21:47] <charlie-tca> We worked too hard just to get it usable
[21:47] <falktx> charlie-tca: this is just a theme
[21:48] <charlie-tca> yeah, I know
[21:48] <charlie-tca> but when Ubuntu did "just a theme", it broke lightdm bad
[21:48] <charlie-tca> Took us a month to get it to work again
[21:48] <falktx> charlie-tca: afaik, this is a separate package, not affiliated with lightdm
[21:49] <charlie-tca> bad taste and all that, I guess
[21:49] <charlie-tca> You can talk to mr_pouit and madnick about it. I don't care either way
[21:49] <falktx> charlie-tca: it's just like another ubuntustudio-* package, won't hurt ubuntu
[21:49] <charlie-tca> madnick is the person working on it for Xubuntu
[21:50] <falktx> well, we first have to push it into the repos
[21:50] <scott-work> falktx: so if i took this package and built it at home on my oneiric machine i should be able to install it, yes?
[21:50] <falktx> scott-work: yes
[21:50] <charlie-tca> I am not concerned with hurting Ubuntu. They will hurt all of us soon enough
[21:50] <holstein> scott-work: i can test too if needed
[21:50] <scott-work> falktx: i have an oneiric working currently, i will try to test it tonight
[21:50] <scott-work> if it installs well then i will see about getting it into the repos
[21:50] <holstein> i should say, i have the means to test.. assuming i can figure out how
[21:51] <falktx> scott-work: as I said, just need to change lightdm greeter (a conf file) to gtk, something like s/unity/gtk/
[21:51] <falktx> scott-work: it can be easily done in *-settings
[21:51] <falktx> holstein: just grab the package and do "debuild -rfakeroot" to generate the deb
[21:52] <falktx> holstein: at the end, the package will complain that you're not the author, but that's ok
[21:52] <charlie-tca> scott-work: the re-spin worked; the image is installing this time
[21:52] <falktx> ;)
[21:52] <holstein> falktx: id need to debuild on oneiric though right?
[21:52]  * falktx is still downloading
[21:52] <falktx> holstein: I don't think so
[21:53] <falktx> holstein: nope, it has no dependencies at all, you're ok to go
[21:53] <holstein> falktx: i'll give it a shot
[21:53] <falktx> you'll need lightdm though
[21:54] <falktx> but at least you get to build the package
[21:54] <holstein> THB, i dont know what debuild -rfakeroot meabs
[21:54] <holstein> means*
[21:54] <holstein> ill have to take some time and RTFM later
[21:54] <falktx> debuild == build deb
[21:54] <holstein> on the oneiric box
[21:54] <falktx>  -rfakeroot  == build as fakeroot user
[21:55] <falktx> can I be honest here...?
[21:55] <holstein> falktx: please do :)
[21:56] <falktx> well, I've seen my stuff working, both menus and this
[21:56] <falktx> but it seems like this is a matter of trust
[21:56] <falktx> I feel like you guys still don't trust me...
[21:56] <scott-work> charlie-tca: that is good information :)
[21:57] <scott-work> falktx: it's not that we don't trust you
[21:57] <scott-work> i'll mention two things
[21:57] <scott-work> 1. i'm not blindly pushing a change for something that i haven't seen fix something
[21:58] <scott-work> 2. if you have something that works you should have rights to push it to the bzr branch as well
[21:58] <scott-work> for #1 that's for anyone
[21:58] <scott-work> i'm not as good of a packager, much less a coder, as you falktx
[21:59] <scott-work> if i was like luke emmet and knew crap loads and done this for years i might do different
[21:59] <scott-work> but if i'm responsible i want to see the fix before i will push
[21:59] <falktx> I understand
[21:59] <scott-work> this includes my own stuff and i test it myself but also try to get others to test as well
[21:59] <scott-work> falktx: i am honest, i WANT you to do stuff and get it into ubuntu studio
[22:00]  * holstein +1
[22:00] <falktx> thanks
[22:00] <scott-work> i ask that you either push it to the bzr branch yourself or i will do it, but i will want to test it myself before i do ;)
[22:00] <falktx> ok
[22:01] <scott-work> another way to look at it is that it's not that i don't trust you, rather i don't trust me
[22:02] <falktx> lol, that sounds bad
[22:03] <scott-work> if i had luke's or emmet's experience i probably would have a different threshold for what i would accept or not
[22:03] <scott-work> but since i don't i feel that i need to see the problem and then see the fix
[22:03] <falktx> scott-work: so, I'm ok to push things to bzr?
[22:03] <scott-work> you are part of the team, yeah
[22:04] <scott-work> all that i ask is that you check your changes after they are pushed and fix it if things go wrong ;)
[22:04] <scott-work> well, you don't have to check them yourselves, it could be me or astraljava or holstein or whomever
[22:04] <falktx> yep
[22:04] <scott-work> i just want to make sure any changes that happen from anyone fix stuff instead of break them ;)
[22:04] <falktx> I don't usually show you broken stuff though
[22:05] <scott-work> lols
[22:05] <scott-work> no you don't
[22:05] <falktx> ppas are different
[22:05] <falktx> I know my ppas have some small issues, but that's not part of US
[22:06] <falktx> if I want to push something to US, I usually am more responsible and check everything before showing it
[22:06] <scott-work> i probably need to update my testing methods to use VM as well
[22:26]  * falktx tries to get menus forward
[22:29] <falktx> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntustudio-menu/+bug/838434
[22:30] <charlie-tca> Is that tied into not having a studio session yet?
[22:30] <charlie-tca> Since xfce session is starting, the menu may not be able to override the xfce menu
[22:32] <falktx> charlie-tca: I've tested it myself
[22:32] <falktx> it works fine in oneiric
[22:33] <falktx> charlie-tca: http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/tmp/scr024.png
[22:33] <charlie-tca> neat!
[22:33] <falktx> charlie-tca: note that, using my ppas, I have lots of more apps than in standard ubuntu though
[22:33] <charlie-tca> That's what I expected to see in my install
[22:33] <falktx> these new apps were not added to the menu, as scott demanded
[22:33] <charlie-tca> right
[22:34] <falktx> charlie-tca: what can we do to push this up?
[22:34] <charlie-tca> I don't know
[22:34] <falktx> create a debdiff?
[22:34] <charlie-tca> I rely on mr_pouit for that kind of stuff
[22:34] <falktx> damn
[22:34] <charlie-tca> Should be just an upload to fix the bug, I think
[22:35] <charlie-tca> where is astraljava ? He seems to understand a lot of that stuff
[22:35] <charlie-tca> persia knows how to do it, too
[22:36]  * falktx added 1 more comment
[22:36] <charlie-tca> I been trying for three years to learn how to make things happen without saying "mr_pouit, can you..."
[22:36] <falktx> charlie-tca: I did once for lucid zynadd package (from revu), but I don't remember the process now
[22:36] <falktx> and for US it should be different
[22:37] <charlie-tca> yeah, should be something like push the upload through, but if in beta freeze, you got to get the archive admin to approve it, I think
[22:37] <charlie-tca> If there is a patch pilot on in #ubuntu-devel, they might be able to do it, too
[22:46] <falktx> charlie-tca: holstein: can you "this bug affects me" there?
[22:46] <falktx> so it gets as confirmed
[22:46] <charlie-tca> I can confirm it, can't I?
[22:47] <holstein> falktx: did i miss a link for it?
[22:47] <falktx> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntustudio-menu/+bug/838434
[22:47]  * holstein found it
[22:47] <holstein> :)
[22:48] <falktx> thanks
[22:49] <falktx> holstein: now it's incomplete... what's missing?
[22:49] <charlie-tca> That's because I hit the wrong key
[22:49] <holstein> hehe
[22:49] <charlie-tca> It is now triaged, high
[22:50] <charlie-tca> and it is going to get tagged "iso-testing" too
[22:50] <charlie-tca> all of which helps get the fix in
[22:50] <falktx> ah, nice
[22:50] <falktx> oh, high importance!
[22:51] <charlie-tca> I only understand little bits of stuff, but I know you need all that to get the fix pushed in
[22:51] <falktx> charlie-tca: do you know how to create a new branch in the US code?
[22:51] <falktx> for lightdm theme
[22:51] <charlie-tca> no, I have no idea
[22:51] <charlie-tca> I can't even figure out how to find such things
[22:51] <falktx> I don't think I can do it (permissions), but I'm not sure how I would do it in the first place
[22:52] <charlie-tca> Did I tell you, I don't know how to do most of the developer side of things?
[22:52] <charlie-tca> Maybe micahg can. He is very helpful when asked if he has time
[22:53]  * falktx is still downloading the image
[22:54] <charlie-tca> I am just a poor, braindead user...
[22:56] <astraljava> Confirmed the bug, but am a little bit puzzled by the branch.
[22:57] <astraljava> Turned it into a FFe bug, and subscribed ubuntu-release on it, but what was the revision number you committed, falktx?
[22:57] <falktx> astraljava: FFe bug?
[22:57] <falktx> oh
[22:58] <astraljava> It needs to be a Feature Freeze exception bug now.
[22:58] <falktx> astraljava: rev 56, as the bug says
[22:58] <falktx> astraljava: this is a fix, so it should be ok...
[22:58] <astraljava> Sorry, yeah there it is.
[23:00]  * falktx will be expecting an ubuntu mail about the new package ;)
[23:00] <charlie-tca> Okay, I have to take a break; will check which images still need to be run in a couple of hours
[23:00] <astraljava> Okay, well, IMHO that bug should now contain enough information for it to be uploaded as a new package.
[23:00] <astraljava> charlie-tca: Thanks a bunch!
[23:00] <astraljava> And sorry I haven't had time for Xubuntu, until tomorrow.
[23:01] <astraljava> Hope that's enough for QA purposes.
[23:01] <falktx> I'm still confused
[23:01] <falktx> astraljava: what you just did, were I able to do it?
[23:01] <charlie-tca> That's no problem. Help falktx get the bug fix figured out now
[23:01] <charlie-tca> falktx needs to know how to make that stuff happen
[23:01] <astraljava> You were, it just needed to be re-phrased as a FFe bug, and ubuntu-release needed to be subscribed to it.
[23:01] <astraljava> That's all.
[23:02] <falktx> astraljava: you do you make it a FFe bug? tag?
[23:02] <astraljava> If they agree to it, it will get uploaded. If not, they will state why not.
[23:02] <astraljava> Then we will make modifications accordingly.
[23:03] <astraljava> Just mention that in the subject, that should do it.
[23:03] <falktx> what is 'FFe' btw?
[23:03] <astraljava> Feature Freeze exception
[23:03] <falktx> yep
[23:03] <falktx> got it
[23:04] <astraljava> Thanks a lot for filing it!
[23:05] <falktx> now we one to take care of lightdm
[23:05]  * falktx fills a bug report
[23:10] <falktx> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntustudio-menu/+bug/838446
[23:11] <falktx> astraljava: holstein: set as "affects me" please
[23:11] <charlie-tca> actually, 32bit is pink, 64bit is blue
[23:11] <falktx> really?
[23:11] <charlie-tca> so, you want that one triaged too?
[23:11] <charlie-tca> really.
[23:12] <falktx> charlie-tca: this does not have a branch, but if it's possible, yes
[23:13] <astraljava> Yep. That's true.
[23:13] <falktx> astraljava: is it recent? I never noticed it...
[23:13] <astraljava> They're really pushing people towards the 64-bit now? :D
[23:14] <holstein> falktx: got it :)
[23:14]  * falktx is trying to make UbuntuStudio better
[23:14] <charlie-tca> done
[23:14] <astraljava> falktx: ...and you're doing a terrific job at that! :D
[23:14] <charlie-tca> well, boys, anyway
[23:14] <charlie-tca> girls probably like the pink
[23:15] <falktx> ahah, yeah
[23:15] <astraljava> Hehe. :)
[23:15] <falktx> basically ubuntu says - "32bit is for pussies!"
[23:15] <falktx> lol
[23:15] <astraljava> :D
[23:40] <falktx> Scott Kitterman commented on the bug, so we got their attention
[23:43]  * falktx wonders if his name will remain on the changelog


[10:20] <ducasse> can someone add a small note to the top of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Reference/ZFS that zfs is only supported for data storage, not /, as it comes up in #ubuntu now and then? the page says it's immutable, so i guess i can't do it myself.
[11:12] <knome> ducasse, done
[11:12] <ducasse> thanks :)
[11:13] <knome> np
[11:29] <ducasse> i've been spending time setting up my yubikey lately, and had to piece together info from all over the web. would anyone find a yubikey wiki page helpful? if so, i'd be happy to try writing one.
[12:47] <knome> i'd say everything can be helpful for somebody :)
[13:36] <ducasse> ok, i'll read up on the wiki editing guidelines and give it a go :)
[13:46] <knome> ducasse, mostly: "use common sense" :)
[13:47] <knome> but yeah, there are some structural etc. things that are good to read through i guess
[13:49] <ducasse> sounds reasonable :) shouldn't be impossible to get through.
[13:51] <ducasse> i'm not a great coder, so i was thinking the wiki might be something i could help out with, and using the yubikey with ubuntu is something i know pretty well by know.


[01:22] <smp4488> anyone home?
[01:23] <StevenK> Somewhat
[01:24] <smp4488> im wanting to install mobile for my car pc
[01:25] <smp4488> the menlow image will that work with via processors?
[01:25] <StevenK> I would suggest the McCaslin image
[01:26] <smp4488> is it standalone or do i need an install of ubuntu first?
[01:26] <StevenK> It is standalone
[01:27] <smp4488> but for development on my main pc would i be better off installing ubuntu
[01:27] <smp4488> im a gentoo user
[01:27] <StevenK> Yes.
[01:28] <smp4488> what version?
[01:28] <StevenK> 8.04.1 is the current released version for both.
[01:28] <smp4488> gotcha
[01:28] <smp4488> this looks like it is going to be fun
[01:30] <smp4488> so what are your opinions so far?
[01:33] <StevenK> It does sound like fun
[01:33] <smp4488> what do you think of using it as a car pc interface?
[01:33] <StevenK> I've heard of other people trying it as well
[01:34] <smp4488> we will see how i do
[03:58] <Omeg1> Hello hello.
[03:59] <Omeg1> I have some questions on UME, anyone lurking?
[04:18] <persia> Omeg1: At least 40 people not including yourself.
[07:20] <Omeg1> persia, well - I was hoping someone might be on while I was...
[07:21] <persia> Omeg1: Yes, but many people were on then.  Asking if there are lurkers only interests the very very bored.  Asking some other question may interest someone.
[07:22] <Omeg1> Alright.  First off, how exactly does one get started with a dev environment for UME?  I installed all the ubuntu mobile packages, but I really haven't got any leads on where to go from there.
[07:22] <Omeg1> Kinda hoping I could get an environment set up.
[07:23] <Omeg1> I also installed ubuntu-mobile, but didn't really get more than some new apps in my Applications menu (cool games!)
[07:23] <persia> Well, there are two ways to do it.  One can install Ubuntu MID and do the development on the target machine, or one can do development on a remote machine, and pass packages to the target machine.
[07:24] <persia> I tend to use the latter model: editing and changing packages on an amd64 workstation, building an lpia .deb, and then installing that on the target machine.
[07:24] <Omeg1> I'll likely be doing python...
[07:24] <Omeg1> So it wouldn't matter either way.
[07:25] <Omeg1> Although how do you install UME only on a machine?
[07:25] <Omeg1> Is there a VM for that?
[07:25] <persia> I personally use vi and sbuild for 95% of what I do, so the packages I need installed locally are sbuild, vim, less, and devscripts.  There's also some useful stuff in ubutu-dev-tools, and the recommends will pull more than you need.
[07:26] <persia> You can install Ubuntu MID on a target machine using the images linked in the /topic, or run in KVM.
[07:26] <persia> Just boot the image, and it ought install.
[07:26] <Omeg1> Alright, so now I have on my 64bit machine here the ubuntu-mobile images
[07:27] <Omeg1> But when I run hildon-desktop, I get some pretty elaborate crashes.
[07:28] <persia> That's not surprising.  You really want to have your machine installed as the lpia architecture if you're going to use the 8.04.1 images.
[07:30] <persia> Mind you, if you're getting elaborate crashes with an lpia install, that's something that ought get fixed.
[07:32] <Omeg1> Yeah, I don't have an lpia machine...
[07:32] <Omeg1> Just my 64bit desktop
[07:33] <persia> Hrm.
[07:33] <persia> While you ought to be able to run lpia on your desktop, the hildon environment may not be ideal for typical desktop use.
[07:34] <persia> I'll recommend you run lpia in a virtual machine, and use that for testing.
[07:43] <Omeg1> That's what I'm leaning towards as well.
[07:43] <Omeg1> So lpia, is that an app or a platform then?
[07:44] <persia> lpia is an architecture.
[07:44] <persia> "lpia" is similar in role to "i386" or "amd64", and all three will probably run on your desktop.
[07:46] <Omeg1> What are the chances of the UME project taking on other architectures like ARMEL?
[07:53] <persia> Omeg1: Well, there's a general goal of trying to find a way to make the hildon packages less architecture-specific for MID, and the Mobile seed works in any architecture supported by Ubuntu (although there are few hppa handhelds).
[07:54] <gishaust> I have a ipaq 112 just given to me am I able to try embed ubuntu
[07:54] <persia> There was talk about armel support at UDS, but there's been no announcement.
[07:54] <persia> You might look at mojo.handhelds.org: not exactly official packages, but they ought run on armel.
[08:01] <gishaust> thanks for the info I will have a look
[08:07] <Omeg1> Yeah, I have an N810 and I'm hoping that UME comes around to supporting more than the intel devices.
[08:07] <Omeg1> intel-based I should say.
[08:07] <Omeg1> Maemo on the N810 seems weak - but is so close to what UME is... I'm surprised they haven't just put the work in themselves.
[08:38] <lool> persia: Around?
[08:39] <persia> lool: Generally :)
[08:39] <lool> persia: At the release meeting on friday, I mentionned the installer drop for alpha 5
[08:39] <lool> slangasek indicated that there's a deadline to get your code changes in before a5
[08:39] <persia> I saw that.
[08:39] <persia> Mind you, lpia is broken in other ways, so I have no expectation of a5 working anyway.
[08:40] <lool> persia: are the ubiquity tweaks on-track to be in the archive before Tuesday (milestone freeze)?
[08:40] <lool> -- was his question
[08:40] <lool> persia: Wow, it's not going to work at all?
[08:41] <persia> No.  You still can't even run apt-get
[08:41] <lool> persia: Please raise red flag here and mail the team/list/david/me whoever
[08:41] <lool> persia: Ah you mean the images are borken
[08:41] <persia> Yes, but I very much don't believe it's the images.
[08:42] <lool> Well I think it's qemu <-> kernel interactions
[08:42] <persia> Anyway, I'm hacking livecd-rootfs to build me i386 -mid images, and when I have that working, will go back to working on the installer.
[08:42] <persia> The issue can be replicated on a Q1U.
[08:42] <persia> It fails on real hardware.
[08:42] <persia> It has *nothing* to do with virtualisation.
[08:42] <lool> Hmm
[08:43] <lool> I think I should raise this with Michael
[08:43] <persia> I thought you did that on Friday.
[08:43] <lool> I did?
[08:44] <lool> I think we discussed moving to .27
[08:44] <persia> Oh.  I thought the fact that things didn't work was discussed as well.
[08:44] <lool> I don't really trust my memory, it could be, but I don't recall discussing any specifics
[08:49] <persia> Anyway, yeah, it doesn't work.  How and why it doesn't work is beyond my understanding.
[08:50] <persia> I get failures in renaming files.
[08:50] <lool> I really think this points all the way at kernel
[08:55] <lool> Is there a package carrying the CFLAGS used on the buildds?
[08:55] <lool> I think they add -Wformat=security or something like that, but would like to check exactly what
[08:56] <lool> format-security rather
[09:07] <persia> I don't know the name of the package: it may just be default settings for the tools themselves.  Check with keescook
[11:49] <heruan> how can I install Ubuntu MID on my Acer Aspire One (Atom based)?
[11:53] <persia> heruan: Which video chip does that use?
[11:59] <heruan> uhm... intel
[12:00] <heruan> now I search the model
[12:00] <heruan> Intel GMA 950
[12:01] <persia> OK.  I'd suggest booting the mccaslin image then, as I think the menlow image assumes -psb.  Note that this will reformat your machine, so you want to have a backup, etc. first.
[12:01] <heruan> persia: sure, thanks
[12:02] <persia> heruan: Good luck!
[13:38] <heruan> persia: uhm, I downloaded mccaslin
[13:38] <persia> heruan: OK.  And?
[13:38] <heruan> it's a .img file
[13:38] <heruan> dd to usb stick?
[13:39] <persia> Yep.
[13:39] <persia> A number of people have reported issues with bare dd: I'll recommend adding bs=1024K for best results.
[13:39] <heruan> persia: ok, thank you!
[13:41] <heruan> bs=1024 or bs=1024K ?
[13:41] <persia> I think 1024K
[13:42] <persia> (1 meg).  That ends up being a little over 500 blocks.
[13:42] <persia> If that doesn't work, you can try with 1k blocks.
[13:42] <persia> Ideally, it oughtn't make any difference, as the data in the .img doesn't consist of record blocks, but there seems to be some oddities about how dd handles very large numbers of blocks.
[13:43] <persia> There's a bug report against dd that seems to imply the issue is related to a 28-bit boundary, but I don't really understand dd well enough to know.
[13:44] <heruan> persia: ok, perfectly clear
[13:44] <heruan> :)
[14:48] <heruan> persia: ok, installed :)
[14:48] <heruan> but the mouse doesn't work...
[14:48] <heruan> no touchpad, nor usb mouse...
[14:50] <ogra> the menlow image is pretty specifically built for the samsung Q1 ultra, you need to make some changes to the used xorg.conf (mainly change the mouse entry to /dev/inut/mice in xorg-samsungq1ultra.conf or how that file is called)
[14:51] <heruan> ok, thank you. what's the user/pass to login on vty1?
[14:52] <ogra> ume ... no passwd
[14:52] <heruan> ok
[15:03] <heruan> touchpad works :)
[15:04] <heruan> and now... I can I enable the clutter UI?
[15:04] <heruan> *how
[15:10] <persia> Heh.  See, the clutter UI and the MID package aren't actually integrated in any particular way :)
[15:11] <persia> That said, you could certainly remove some packages and add others to do that, but I'm not sure which packages you specifically need to adjust.
[15:11] <persia> I believe the clutter-based UI stuff is based more on Ubuntu Desktop than on Ubuntu MID.
[15:12] <heruan> persia: oh, I didn't know... I saw the clutter UI at http://www.ubuntu.com/products/mobile
[15:13] <heruan> it seems to be running on hildon desktop
[15:14] <heruan> I'll search how to do that ;)
[15:20] <persia> Hrm.  That page is significantly out of date.  Oh well.
[15:20] <persia> Thanks for the pointer.
[15:23] <heruan> :)
[15:25] <heruan> but, on balance... on an Acer Aspire One, is better to install a normal Ubuntu or the MID edition?
[15:28] <persia> I don't think either is right for that sort of model.  I have a Kohjinsha SR, and find both to be a poor fit.
[15:29] <persia> For intrepid, there will be both Ubuntu MID and Ubuntu Mobile, with the latter designed for 7-9" screens.
[15:29] <persia> But I doubt you want to wait until October :)
[15:30] <heruan> persia: eheh, of course I don't want to wait :p
[15:31] <heruan> persia: very interesting that thing about ubuntu mobile
[15:31] <heruan> and what about this: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-mid/intrepid/current/
[15:31] <heruan> ?
[15:32] <persia> That's Ubuntu MID, for 4-6" devices.  You're encouraged to play with it, but it's mostly just a version refresh of the stuff you just installed.
[15:32] <persia> Also note it's not been debugged much, so use with caution :)
[15:32] <heruan> eheh, I like to be on the cutting edge
[15:32] <heruan> I use Intrepid on my notebook
[15:33] <heruan> mainly for NM 0.7
[15:33] <persia> In that case, go ahead any play with the daily.  It's essentially the current state of Ubuntu MID for intrepid.
[15:34] <heruan> so at this moment there isn't a version of Intrepid for 7-9"?
[15:34] <heruan> nor a testing version?
[15:35] <persia> Well, there's an ubuntu-mobile seed, and an ubuntu-mobile metapackage.  If you do a minimal install of Ubuntu with the alternate CD, and install ubuntu-mobile you ought get that.
[15:35] <persia> On the other hand, at this point I think about two people have tried it, so you'll be very much involved in helping get it in shape.
[15:36] <persia> Comments / opinions / thoughts welcome here, and please file *lots* of bugs.
[15:36] <heruan> of course!
[15:37] <heruan> bugs are to be fired against ubuntu-mobile package?
[15:37] <persia> heruan: You don't happen to be a developer, do you?
[15:37] <persia> No, against whichever package actually has the bug.
[15:37] <heruan> ok
[15:38] <persia> So, if, for instance, the bluetooth applet didn't respond to touchscreen events properly, you'd file a bug against bluez-gnome.
[15:40] <DNi1> Will ubuntu MID edition compatible with Wubi ?
[15:42] <persia> DNi1: I hadn't thought about that at all, and don't actually have a windows machine on which to test.
[15:42] <persia> DNi1: If you'd like to stuff casper-lupin into an image, and give it a shot, it might be worth seeing if it works.
[15:42] <persia> ogra: Where was the guide on adding stuff to images again?
[15:43] <persia> Oops.  That's "lupin-casper"
[15:43] <DNi1> that's what i thought :)
[15:44] <heruan> persia: here I am... sorry
[15:45] <heruan> that's the price to pay for using bleeding edge versions :p
[15:45] <heruan> random freezes
[15:45] <persia> heruan: No worries.  I haven't said anything of importance ince your last comment :)
[15:45] <heruan> I read your last comment, I will fire bugs to related packages
[15:45] <heruan> I was saying...
[15:46] <heruan> I'm not a very experienced developer, but I had recompiled few packages to fit my needs in the past
[15:47] <heruan> so maybe I'll be able to investigate on some bugs...
[15:47] <persia> That'd be great!  We've not so many developers looking at mobile: few have the hardware, and of those that do, many are just using -desktop.
[15:49] <heruan> okay, so let's go and try to install that ubuntu-mobile ;)
[15:51] <heruan> I have a local mirror of Intrepid repositories so I do a pxe-boot and netinstall... but it'll take a very long time, Aspire One has a solid state disk and it seems to have long writing access times...
[15:51] <heruan> I'll report here my impressions
[15:54] <persia> Great.  It ought look something like http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/ubuntu-mobile-intrepid.png
[15:55] <heruan> whoa, that's great :D
[15:55] <heruan> and here I can install the clutter UI?
[15:56] <persia> I suspect so, but I've not sure.  I've not personally tried ubuntu-mobile yet.
[15:57] <heruan> ok, I'll find it out
[16:16] <DNi1> persia: ah ! there is a kvm image now ?
[16:16] <DNi1> persia: sorry it's been a while i didnt see the repository of images
[16:20] <persia> DNi1: There is a KVM image for hardy.  The intrepid images seem to work as well in KVM as they do on hardware.
[16:23] <DNi1> persia: there seems many improvements on the interface with intrepid. are there other ?
[16:24] <ogra> the build system :)
[16:25] <ogra> and the input system (not fully working yet ut soon)
[16:25] <DNi1> ogra: can you tell me more about that ?
[16:25] <ogra> its using the livecd tools now
[16:25] <DNi1> really ?
[16:25] <ogra> the installer will be ubiquity in a cut down version
[16:26] <DNi1> my dreams come true ? :)
[16:26] <ogra> so you can actually influence the install, select a language and location etc
[16:26] <DNi1> great improvements
[16:26] <ogra> and we're working on an additional seed for the slightly bigger screens based on gnome and some extra pieces
[16:27] <ogra> i.e. ubuntu mid -> 800x480 and very small screens, ubuntu-mobile -> 1024x600 7-10"
[16:28] <ogra> very small 4-7" iirc
[16:28] <DNi1> my htc shift is based on a 7"
[16:28] <ogra> tough mobile will only be a first shot in intrepid ...
[16:28] <ogra> *though
[16:28] <DNi1> but the native resolution is 840x480
[16:29] <ogra> thats mid then
[16:29] <DNi1> ii can do 1024x600 but it's not very nice
[16:29] <ogra> ah, compressed video mode or some such
[16:30] <DNi1> i think so
[16:30] <ogra> yeah, that usually breaks fonts etc
[16:30] <DNi1> a feature of intel drivers maybe
[16:30] <ogra> being rather blurry
[16:30] <DNi1> yeah
[16:30] <DNi1> useful for some web pages very big
[16:31] <ogra> for the classmate pc (7" 800x480) i developed a little screen switcher applet to do 800x600 panning mode ... thats a bit more usable
[16:31] <ogra> but has its own usability probs indeed
[16:32] <DNi1> i see
[16:32] <DNi1> maybe i can reuse it to do 1024x600
[16:34] <ogra> you can try with a different virtual size ... but that only works on hardy, i have never tested it with intrepid (since the classmate image is only aimed at hardy)
[16:34] <ogra> you can check the classmate-tools package, its in the archive
[16:35] <ogra> but needs the i810 driver and a special xorg.conf (shipped in the /usr/share/doc/classmate-tools dir)
[16:37] <DNi1> where is the intrepid version of MID edition ?
[16:38] <DNi1> i didnt see it on the official repository
[16:39] <ogra> its still not ready for mainstream ... will soon be there
[16:39] <ogra> persia is working on the last bits of the installer
[16:39] <ogra> (doesnt make much sense to have an uninstallable image)
[16:40] <DNi1> that's right
[16:45] <DNi1> thx for the details
[18:51] <va75a77a> I am developing on the Gumstix platform, would anyone know if there is a way to support or build ubuntu MID for the gumstix ARM architecture


[21:34] <MrChrisDruif> Awfully quiet here :P
[21:39] <AlanBell> BOOOOO
[21:39] <AlanBell> approaching the end of the month
[21:39] <MrChrisDruif> aahhhh!!! :D:D:D
[21:40] <MrChrisDruif> Indeed, about 30 days till Natty :D


[00:42] <wrst> chris4585: that is my life... being in the dark :) it can be a happy place ;)
[00:44] <chris4585> not when you don't know what you work lol
[00:53] <wrst> well that would be different :)


[15:47] <Mkaysi> JoseeAntonioR: It's related to your discussion with philballew
[17:40] <coolbhavi> JoseeAntonioR, hey!
[17:40] <JoseeAntonioR> hi, coolbhavi! :)
[17:40] <coolbhavi> thanks for the mail and all your efforts regarding the open week
[17:41] <JoseeAntonioR> thanks to you for volunteering!
[17:41] <JoseeAntonioR> it's been hard to fill the schedule this time
[17:43] <coolbhavi> no mention!


[03:26] <Unit193> Everybody ready to party? :P
[04:01] <jrgifford> party for... what?
[04:02] <Unit193> Well, it was supposed to be a severe thunderstorm.
[04:22] <jrgifford> oh right.
[05:01] <Unit193> jrgifford: Oh heeey, got a sec?
[12:49] <belkinsa> I will write a update on our LoCo today on my blog since it seems that we will be power for god who knows.
[12:51] <belkinsa> And I just noticed that our LP page (https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-us-ohio) doesn't say anything about new members having their Code of Conduct signed.
[15:48] <belkinsa> Darkwing, ping.
[16:09] <thafreak> ninja
[16:10] <belkinsa> Everyone is a ninja here in this channel.  ;)
[16:10] <thafreak> exactly
[16:11] <thafreak> anyone in here hack on raspberry pi's?
[16:12] <thafreak> i'm wondering if I can use an old floppy disk ribbon cable to breakout the pins
[16:12] <dzho> I wouldn't dignify what I've done with a pi "hacking" quite
[16:12] <thafreak> but i think the pi's like 26 pins (i didn't count them though) and a floppy was like 34 or something
[16:12] <belkinsa> thafreak, you could ask the mailing-list of the team or maybe find the channel that you need?
[16:13] <dzho> belkinsa++
[16:13] <thafreak> meh, i don't need an answer THAT bad
[16:13] <dzho> I keep meaning to blog my one possibly useful pi trick
[16:13] <belkinsa> Ah.
[16:13] <thafreak> i mean at worse i go grab a floppy cable from my storage room and try it out :)
[16:14] <dzho> imagine that
[16:14] <thafreak> i just bought these jumper wires to go to a breadboard, but i didn't notice they were male on both ends
[16:14] <thafreak> and the rpi's pins are male
[16:15] <thafreak> i'll probably order a ribbon cable from somewhere honestly, I'm pretty sure some one makes one to connect to a breadboard
[16:15] <thafreak> I'm new to this kind of stuff...
[16:16] <thafreak> i've only ever used my raspberry pi's so far as little servers
[16:17] <thafreak> Anyway, so, I'm trying something new
[16:17] <thafreak> dzho: you may be interested
[16:17] <thafreak> i'm getting out of academia...at least as far as teaching goes
[16:18] <thafreak> I'm starting something where I work closely with a small group of students instead
[16:18] <thafreak> Currently working on finding the right group of students to start out with
[16:19] <thafreak> Plus i need to come up with a way to incentivize students to join me...
[16:19] <thafreak> right now all I have is, you will learn cool useful stuff and I will vouch for your skills to recruiters
[16:21] <thafreak> It'll be like a cross between college course, an internship, and an apprenticeship [sic]
[16:59] <dzho> thafreak: ah, yes, very interested


[12:11] <nibbon_> I found where to fetch the dependencies: https://launchpad.net/~canonical-server/+archive/ubuntu/server-backports-build


[12:38] <ubotu> New bug: #134431 in xserver-xorg-driver-nv (main) "LiveCD initial GUI broken" [Medium,Triaged]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/134431
[05:18] <bryce> I've gone through all of the fedora patches - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Fixes_to_Backport
[05:18] <bryce> I'm running a build of all the patches that applied and configured cleanly
[05:56] <ubotu> New bug: #134271 in compiz (main) "mpeg-1 playback does not work (dup-of: 111257)" [Medium,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/134271
[05:56] <ubotu> New bug: #134272 in totem (main) "theora playback does not work (dup-of: 111257)" [Low,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/134272
[10:40] <tepsipakki> bryce: the fedora mesa-patch supercedes our copy
[10:41] <tepsipakki> keescook: selinux-support is going in xserver 1.5
[10:45] <tepsipakki> http://wiki.x.org/wiki/Releases/7.4
[11:30] <ubotu> New bug: #31009 in xserver-xorg-driver-ati "Targa Traveller 826 - built-in LCD not recognised by x-server (dup-of: 22985)" [Unknown,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/31009
[06:45] <ubotu> New bug: #136615 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (main) "X server crashes on suspend to RAM after recent Gutsy update" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/136615
[07:41] <bryce> tepsipakki: ah, ok.  Looks like it's going to take a bit of massaging to get it in
[07:42] <bryce> tepsipakki: I would appreciate it if you could go through that wiki page and flag patches that you know should or shouldn't be included, and the ones I included but that I wasn't sure about if you have an opinion on them
[09:01] <tepsipakki> bryce: sure
[09:11] <tepsipakki> bryce: btw, did you look at the fedora xserver specfile? The patches are grouped in different categories, and the ones that are redhat-specific should probably be left out
[09:11] <bryce> ah, no I didn't
[09:14] <tepsipakki> xserver-1.3.0-newglx-offscreen-pixmaps.patch is a new version of 120-...
[09:18] <bryce> is that the tfp patch?  it looked rather small to be the tfp stuff, but I didn't see another patch that looked like it.
[09:18] <tepsipakki> also, the patch order can be seen from the specfile
[09:18] <tepsipakki> and changelog :)
[09:18] <bryce> good point
[09:19] <tepsipakki> so, the mesa-patch needs to be applied before exa-update and newglx...patch
[09:19] <bryce> ok
[09:30] <tepsipakki> mesa-patch conflicts with patches 21, 125, 126, 127
[09:30] <tepsipakki> they all can be commented out
[09:30] <bryce> excellent
[09:30] <tepsipakki> 21 only affects arches Ubuntu doesn't support
[09:31] <tepsipakki> and in fact, 125-127 can be dropped since they are ours :)
[09:38] <tepsipakki> hmm, add patch 43 to the list
[09:38] <bryce> 43 as one to drop?
[09:39] <tepsipakki> as one conflictiong
[09:39] <tepsipakki> -o
[09:39] <bryce> ok
[09:40] <tepsipakki> leaving that out the mesa/exa/newglx-patches applied fine
[09:42] <bryce> did you update the ordering as well?
[09:42] <tepsipakki> the mesa-patch removes some files, one of which 43 touched
[09:43] <tepsipakki> I just put those three as 133/134/135 (mesa/exa/newglx)
[09:56] <tepsipakki> I'll continue with the rest tomorrow :)
[10:03] <bryce> awesome.  I'll kick off a build myself with these changes.
[10:04] <bryce> Btw, this morning I also started drafting up a X Quick Check list for our testers:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Testing/QuickCheck
[10:04] <bryce> next I'm working on one for gamers
[10:36] <bryce> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Testing/GamerTest