[12:27] <martinald> hi guys
[12:27] <martinald> quick question: will breezy be using a standard clearlooks theme or a modified one?
[12:27] <martinald> the*
[12:28] <martinald> anyone?
[12:30] <martinald> hm - looking at the OSdir screenshot tour it seems that a modified one is being used. why?
[12:30] <tseng> because ubuntu branding has always been brown
[12:30] <tseng> we had brown industrial theme before
[12:31] <martinald> but gnome has asked that distros use a standard one, and it really reduces consistency across the linux desktop
[12:31] <tseng> meh
[12:31] <tseng> its the same theme
[12:31] <tseng> with a different color
[12:32] <martinald> well not only is it a fairly disgusting colour (IMO) it will make documentation a lot harder
[12:32] <seb128> how/where/when GNOME has asked that?
[12:32] <bob2> how does it make documentation harder?
[12:32] <bob2> (not that I use the default theme anyway)
[12:32] <martinald> http://www.gnome.org/~davyd/gnome-2-12/
[12:32] <mjg59> martinald: The theme is consistent, merely a different colour
[12:33] <martinald> "All of the screenshots have been done in Clearlooks. A theme that we hope will be the default choice of every GNOME vendor, giving GNOME a unified face, no matter which vendor you choose.
[12:33] <martinald> "
[12:33] <tseng> great, case closed then
[12:33] <tseng> we are using Clearlooks
[12:33] <tseng> davyd doesnt speak for "GNOME" either.
[12:33] <seb128> martinald: a page doesn't make "GNOME" opinion, and as stated Ubuntu uses clearlooks
[12:34] <martinald> the problem for the documentation team is that we need to take screenshots inside ubuntu
[12:34] <martinald> instead of being able to save time by using gnome/other distros who use clearlooks standard
[12:34] <mjg59> martinald: Which documentation team? The Ubuntu one or the Gnome one?
[12:34] <martinald> well, both. the ubuntu one primarily
[12:35] <tseng> why would the ubuntu doc team take screenshots of some other distro
[12:35] <martinald> no, let's say on gnome.org there is a screenshot of xyz feature
[12:35] <martinald> the docu team could just copy and paste that into the documenation for ubuntu
[12:35] <martinald> but because of the colour of the theme, they must find it in ubuntu and take it
[12:36] <martinald> and same for other distros - if they all used the same colour scheme it would be much easier to pool documentation resources
[12:37] <martinald> i don't see the advantage ubuntu gains from using its own colour scheme but there are some fairly major downsides
[12:37] <tseng> youve come up with one disadvantage to a very small group of people
[12:37] <tseng> but ok.
[12:37] <mjg59> martinald: Yes, in an ideal world that would be how things work
[12:38] <martinald> 'a very small group of people', great, no wonder they are very small when they are belittled like that
[12:38] <mjg59> martinald: But distributions seek to distinguish themselves for one another. Colour is an important part of branding
[12:38] <mjg59> This is reality.
[12:38] <martinald> why do they need to though!?
[12:38] <mjg59> martinald: So that it's recognisable that people are using their distribution
[12:38] <martinald> it's stupidity
[12:39] <mjg59> martinald: No, it's the way the world works
[12:39] <lifeless> martinald: that will convince people
[12:39] <martinald> well sorry, but it is
[12:39] <lifeless> martinald: 'hey you disagree, you STUPID'
[12:39] <martinald> i'd expect that from microsoft or apple
[12:39] <bob2> good to bring it up 10 days before preview freeze, too
[12:39] <bob2> after it's been like that for 5 months
[12:39] <mjg59> martinald: You may personally disagree, but that's not going to result in people changing their minds
[12:39] <lifeless> bob2: what baz is in breezy at the moment?
[12:39] <seb128> martinald: you can say the same about having different distros, why not getting everybody working on 1 distro ... no issue
[12:39] <martinald> seb: because there are different markets and audiences to aim at
[12:40] <seb128> probably not the same amount of market as the number of distro
[12:40] <martinald> no of course not
[12:40] <bob2> lifeless: 1.4.2-1
[12:40] <martinald> but ubuntu is not going to go away any time soon
[12:40] <mjg59> martinald: And choosing different branding is one way of appealing to different audiences
[12:40] <martinald> ok, straw poll, how many people here use the default ubuntu theme?
[12:40] <martinald> i don't. the first thing i do is change theme and desktop image
[12:40] <seb128> you are not on the right place to ask that
[12:41] <martinald> please just answer the question
[12:41] <mjg59> martinald: Oddly enough, I do.  The people you are talking to here are not the people that make that decision.
[12:41] <martinald> who are then?
[12:41] <mjg59> martinald: The appropriate forum to discuss a change like this would probably be the technical board
[12:42] <martinald> and i can find them at?
[12:42] <mjg59> martinald: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/community/processes/techboard
[12:42] <lathiat> Morning peoples
[12:43] <mjg59> martinald: It's one of the set of things that is defined by the distribution rather than any individual maintainer
[12:43] <martinald> ok, i'll submit it for the agenda
[12:43] <seb128> good, that's the right way to get an official reply on that
[12:44] <martinald> i don't think i will be able to get to the meeting though, but i'll try my best
[12:44] <seb128> there is a meeting every 2 week
[12:44] <mjg59> martinald: However, it's unlikely to change before release. So the Ubuntu doc team should not depend on that.
[12:44] <tseng> if no one is going to show up to represent the topic, it will probably be passed on to a later date
[12:44] <martinald> yes but it's at 7PM and  i will most likely be coming back from work
[12:44] <martinald> but i shall try
[12:44] <tseng> it would also be good to list your objections on the wiki
[12:45] <mjg59> martinald: If you can't make it, then there's no problem with sending someone else to represent the position
[12:45] <martinald> anyone want to represent my position here?
[12:45] <tseng> so that people can come up with a rational reply instead of being forced on the defensive
[12:45] <tseng> about things being disgusting et al
[12:45] <mjg59> But yes, as tseng says having a page that lists the objections makes it a lot more likely that it will be considered reasonably
[12:45] <martinald> oki
[12:45] <martinald> ok
[12:47] <martinald> is anyone attending the meeting and would like to put my PoV across if i put a page on the wiki and can't turn up myself?
[12:47] <jdub> ahr!
[12:47] <tseng> pants!
[12:47] <martinald> i'll take that as a no then
[12:48] <SloMoSnail> martinald: and it's clearly a matter of taste if someone likes the standard ubuntu theme or something else... i don't think you can get an objective discussion about such things ;) and you can't find something that is the perfect solution for everyone...
[12:48] <martinald> ignore the part about taste, i shouldn't of said that
[12:48] <lathiat> jdub: ahr! http://www.bur.st/~lathiat/avahi/announcement-0.1 hot off the press
[12:49] <martinald> but my points about pooling of documenation and consistency across the gnome desktops remains
[12:49] <tseng> lathiat: guten tag!
[12:49] <jdub> lathiat: oooh!
[12:49] <lathiat> QaplaH! :)
[12:49] <tseng> too bad about preview freeze
[12:49] <lathiat> yeh
[12:49] <lathiat> whinge
[12:49] <tseng> mdns me
[12:50] <mjg59> lathiat: Love
[12:50] <jdub> martinald: well, the good thing is that the theme engine ought to be consistent across most distros after 2.12
[12:50] <SloMoSnail> martinald: and that's imho a valid point... but nothing that critical... it isn't that hard to do screenshots of something
[12:50] <lathiat> mjg59: :)
[12:51] <jdub> (blender is in main?!)
[12:51] <tseng> quite.
[12:52] <luis_> SloMoSnail: it isn't that *hard*, but it is boring and very time consuming, esp. across something as large as the gnome docs
[12:52] <martinald> well if i want to document a feature for ubuntu, i have to make sure i'm on the right release so that gnome has it, take a screenshot, crop it, then document it
[12:53] <martinald> and for example, if you are like me and use stable ubuntu i can't take a screenshot of the feature because i don't have it but i can document it easy enough
[12:54] <mjg59> martinald: There's no guarantee that any given feature in Ubuntu works identically to the one in Gnome, anyway
[12:54] <mjg59> Yes, it sucks. But.
[12:54] <martinald> well i agree, but it's extremely likely and it lets us get a start on it. if it isn't the case for the 1% of stuff that doesn't look the same, then we can rescreenshot those
[12:54] <jdub> lathiat: nice contributor list :-))
[12:55] <jdub> lathiat: looks like avahi may get a place on the 770 ;-)))
[12:55] <lathiat> jdub: how is it nice? :)
[12:55] <jdub> lathiat: which would be an EXTREMELY good direction
[12:55] <lathiat> jdub: yeh, we had some nokia interest previously
[12:55] <lathiat> i CCd the guy who contacted me with the release announcement
[12:55] <lathiat> havent heard from them for a bit
[12:55] <lathiat> they wanted a DBUS APi
[12:55] <lathiat> which we now have so
[12:58] <tseng> looks like gnome 2.14 will be full of zeroconf love
[12:58] <martinald> iChat AV has that and it's extremely cool
[12:59] <mjg59> People ought to be able to set up IP tunnels via IM
[12:59] <tseng> exploits to that would be evil
[12:59] <SloMoSnail> tseng: where did you find the 2.14 plans? :)
[12:59] <mjg59> So files can be transferred sensibly, rather than layered in bizarre protocols on top of other bizarre protocols
[12:59] <Robot101> mjg59: shh :P
[12:59] <tseng> SloMoSnail: I ate jdub's brain
[12:59] <Robot101> mjg59: it's on my todo list :)
[01:00] <mjg59> Robot101: Haha
[01:00] <jdub> lathiat: congratulations :-)
[01:00] <HrdwrBoB> introduce http tunnelling as a standard feature, see how many people start screaming
[01:00] <bob2> lifeless: do you want a 1.5 snapshot in there?
[01:00] <SloMoSnail> tseng: lol... how does it taste? ;) what other thoughts regarding gnome did you find? ;)
[01:00] <lathiat> jdub: thanks :)
[01:01] <tseng> SloMoSnail: not as bad as most of the food in .au
[01:01] <Robot101> is gamin unbuggy now?
[01:01] <tseng> they even make cheeseburgers funny
[01:01] <tseng> Robot101: it doesnt totally suck, if thats what you mean
[01:01] <mjg59> Nobody's responded to my "They don't want Bruce on the committee because he's a whiny git" mail yet
[01:03] <SloMoSnail> Robot101: definitely not... the latest version in breezy consumed ~120 mb for me ;)
[01:04] <luis_> tseng: if you didn't like .au food, that is because you ate at the wrong places :)
[01:04] <luis_> krissa and I had some spectacular meals in .au
[01:04] <luis_> granted several were stupidly expensive
[01:04] <tseng> the only place that was really great was hibachi
[01:04] <luis_> but even some of the cheap ones were very good
[01:07] <luis_> gah.
[01:08] <wasabi> gam_server is causing me loads of problems.
[01:08] <wasabi> it hits 100% cpu all the time.
[01:08] <wasabi> and stays there
[01:27] <lifeless> evolution ate my gpg pubring
[01:27] <lifeless> I blame evo
[01:28] <lathiat> just hope it doesnt eat your secret ring
[01:28] <lifeless> it didn't
[01:29] <lifeless> I think it started a request, and then killed the process when it switched away from looking at the signed email, while gpg was going a trustdb rebuild
[01:29] <lifeless> it ended up with a blank keyring :[
[01:37] <bob2> someting in hoary keeps eating my puring
[01:37] <bob2> er, pubring
[01:37] <lifeless> oh ?
[01:37] <lifeless> do you use evo ?
[01:37] <lifeless> do you have automatic trust db updates on or off ?
[01:38] <bob2> mutt, and I have it turned off
[01:38] <bob2> well, no-auto-check-trustdb, anyway
[01:46] <LinuxJones> Will the GUI based installer make it into Breezy ?
[01:47] <mjg59> LinuxJones: Unlikely
[01:48] <LinuxJones> mjg59, It probably won't make it into Grumpy either I guess :D
[02:36] <lathiat> mjg59: bah, new grub ate my boot process
[02:37] <TerminX> which version of grub is that?  haven't rebooted in 18 days..
[02:37] <mjg59> lathiat: Hm
[02:38] <lathiat> mjg59: "GRUB "
[02:38] <mjg59> lathiat: I think this isn't the new grub, but is in fact something to do with the manual installation
[02:38] <mjg59> TerminX: Grub doesn't get upgraded automatically
[02:38] <lathiat> mjg59: well ive done that before and it worked fine?
[02:38] <mjg59> lathiat: with grub-install?
[02:38] <mjg59> Gngh. That's more interesting.
[02:38] <TerminX> oh, yeah, right, duh
[02:39] <lathiat> mjg59: yeh i did grub-install /dev/hda
[02:39] <mjg59> Hang on. Let me try to reproduce.
[02:40] <sjmorgan> i know this isn't strictly the place to ask but could somebody please help me with a grub problem i'm having? i've tried #ubuntu, #grub and read god knows how many forum posts where people ask the same question and get nowhere and i'm still no further forward
[02:40] <bob2>  /topic
[02:41] <bob2> also, that's not true, you've moved forward
[02:41] <sjmorgan> no i haven't
[02:41] <bob2> you were at "cannot boot at all", now you're at "using a livecd, I can't use grub-install due to $blah"
[02:42] <sjmorgan> man
[02:42] <sjmorgan> how the hell do you think i asked the initial question?
[02:42] <sjmorgan> i've been using a livecd the whole time
[02:42] <jdub> mjg59: around?
[02:42] <bob2> but you didn't seem to know to run grub-install to begin with
[02:43] <sjmorgan> yeah, i did
[02:43] <sjmorgan> the only thing i didn't know about was chroot, but that doesn't seem to have helped
[02:44] <mjg59> jdub: Hi
[02:44] <jdub> yo!
[02:44] <sjmorgan> grub-install /dev/sda1 just spits out (yet another) error at me
[02:44] <jdub> mjg59: so i don't actively use my ir port, but want to provide you with the info
[02:44] <jdub> mjg59: i don't seem to have any irda drivers loaded, i don't think
[02:44] <mjg59> jdub: Rock
[02:44] <sjmorgan> so i'm getting the distinct sensation one would get whilst smashing their head against a brick wall
[02:44] <jdub> (i assume that's because they're not autoconfigured)
[02:44] <mjg59> jdub: Can you stick up cat /sys/bus/pnp/devices/*/id somewhere?
[02:45] <jdub> yeah, in the email i'm sending
[02:45] <sjmorgan> i've tried running grub from a shell and feeding it commands but just get even more errors
[02:46] <mjg59> lathiat: Oh, that's interesting. Yes, it's broken here too.
[02:46] <mjg59> Hmm.
[02:46] <lathiat> mjg59: used grub install off hoary and works good now
[02:47] <lathiat> sjmorgan: why dont you try lilo
[02:47] <sjmorgan> because grub was working before
[02:48] <lathiat> so install it off a hoary livecd, mount your rootfs on /media then apt-get install grub; grub-install --root-directory=/media /dev/sda (or hda or whatever)
[02:48] <sjmorgan> i converted some partitions to logical and understandably grub is a touch confused, i'd just like to know how to rectify the situation
[02:48] <lathiat> bah
[02:49] <lathiat> 'format'
[02:49] <sjmorgan> hrmm
[02:50] <sjmorgan> that actually seemed to work
[02:50] <mjg59> http://www.cooltechzone.com/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=1703&Itemid=0&limit=1&limitstart=1 - sounds familiar
[02:50] <sjmorgan> whenever i did grub-install before it would get all pissy
[02:50] <sjmorgan> probably cause i was doing it from within a chroot
[02:52] <Burgundavia> oh the world of pain --> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=58828
[02:52] <mjg59> jdub: Ok. Can you work out which directory in /sys/bus/pnp/devices contains the id line "NSC6001"?
[02:52] <sjmorgan> ok so is the device.map file that grub-install generates exactly how grub sees the hard drives as being mapped?
[02:53] <sjmorgan> i.e. if it says hd2 is /dev/sda that's what i should specify as the groot in menu.lst
[02:53] <jdub> $ cat /sys/bus/pnp/devices/00:08/id
[02:53] <jdub> NSC6001
[02:54] <mjg59> Ok. Can you cat /sys/bus/pnp/devices/00:08/resources ?
[02:55] <jdub> state = active
[02:55] <jdub> io 0x2f8-0x2ff
[02:55] <jdub> irq 3
[02:55] <jdub> dma 3
[02:55] <mjg59> Ok. Can you sudo setserial /dev/ttyS1 uart none
[02:55] <mjg59> sudo modprobe nsc-ircc
[02:56] <jdub> heh, no setserial
[02:56] <mjg59> Ah. You'll need that one.
[02:57] <jdub> hrm, give me a few minutes, in the middle of an update
[02:57] <mjg59> Ok
[02:57] <mjg59> jdub: How's the artwork going?
[02:57] <jdub> been away for the weekend :-)
[02:59] <luis_> s/platform/OS/
[02:59] <Burgundavia> mjg59, what sort of art for the usplash do you need?
[03:00] <mjg59> Burgundavia: It's being worked on, I'm told
[03:01] <sjmorgan> who was it who sugested grub-install --root-directory?
[03:01] <sjmorgan> i want to kiss them
[03:01] <Burgundavia> mjg59, if you run out of time, mail me. I can something hackish done is about 30 minutes (thanks to ogra packaging the ubuntu font)
[03:01] <lathiat> that was me
[03:01] <lathiat> next time, read grub-install --help. :)
[03:01] <sjmorgan> i did
[03:01] <sjmorgan> along with a ton of other stuff
[03:02] <jdub> Burgundavia: it's a particularly hard piece of artwork, given the restrictions (we have something hackish already - reboot and see!)
[03:02] <sjmorgan> it was the fact i was doing it in a chroot i think
[03:02] <Burgundavia> jdub, yes
[03:02] <mjg59> Can grub run off a usb stick?
[03:02] <sjmorgan> but nothing i read indicated that it wouldn't work
[03:02] <Burgundavia> jdub, with inkscape I can export to whatever dimension I like
[03:03] <jdub> Burgundavia: dimension is not the challenge
[03:03] <Burgundavia> jdub, you need 16 colour too eh?
[03:03] <lathiat> mmm 16 bit
[03:03] <lathiat> err
[03:03] <lathiat> bah
[03:03] <jdub> 4 bit :-)
[03:03] <lathiat> 16 colours. :)
[03:04] <opi> GRUB logo? ;)
[03:04] <jdub> opi: usplash
[03:04] <opi> right :-)
[03:05] <sjmorgan> if there was such a thing as an effigy of grub, i would be stabbing it right now
[03:05] <Burgundavia> mjg59, is it useful for this ir stuff (and other stuff you ask for) to go the list or just to you?
[03:05] <mjg59> Burgundavia: Either is fine, but doing it via IRC is better
[03:06] <Burgundavia> mjg59, ok
[03:06] <jdub> mjg59: so does this end up being a check-all-driver-examples thing, or something you can programatically deduce, once you grok the patterns?
[03:06] <mjg59> jdub: In theory the PNP information gives us everything we want to know
[03:07] <mjg59> But I don't have many machines with IR, so I want to check
[03:07] <sjmorgan> thanks again lathiat, i appreciate it
[03:08] <jdub> hrm, perhaps we should give some IR love to nautilus-sendto after this :-)
[03:09] <Burgundavia> finally we get an Avahi release
[03:11] <mjg59> Oh man.
[03:12] <mjg59> Now I need to get grub installed to USB mass storage.
[03:12] <mjg59> This will be pain.
[03:20] <Burgundavia> mjg59, is there any way to prettify the resume dialog?
[03:22] <mjg59> Burgundavia: Which one?
[03:22] <Burgundavia> mjg59, the one that has 5 lines of text, then switches to grey then the xscreensaver login screen
[03:23] <mjg59> Burgundavia: Not trivially
[03:23] <Burgundavia> mjg59, breezy+1 then, ok
[03:23] <mjg59> Right, there we go.  But it would be easy enough.
[03:26] <jdub> luis_: casper works on usb :-)
[03:26] <jdub> (though it's quite chunky for doing that)
[03:28] <luis_> huh
[03:28] <luis_> eenteresting
[03:28] <luis_> did not know.
[03:35] <Diablo-D3> grarghn
[03:35] <Diablo-D3> imagine simpsons in your head
[03:35] <Diablo-D3> where homer is choking bart
[03:35] <Diablo-D3> except Im homer, and X is bart.
[03:46] <Diablo-D3> so, is it normal for X to completely unwork in Breezy?
[03:46] <luis_> see, but, in the simpsons, bart always survives
[03:46] <luis_> and in breezy, X... not so much always with the surviving.
[03:47] <luis_> more like kenny in South Park
[03:47] <luis_> daniels always manages to revive it for the next episode
[03:47] <Diablo-D3> omg, breezy killed X, you bastard!
[03:47] <luis_> but in the current episode, it is always dying a spectacularly and interesting death
[03:47] <luis_> s/ly//
[03:47] <Diablo-D3> hehehe
[03:49] <Diablo-D3> hrm
[03:49] <Diablo-D3> do I absolutely /need/ xserver-xorg installed?
[03:49] <Diablo-D3> I have xserver-xorg-core and -driver-savage and -input-{kbd, mouse}
[03:51] <mjg59> Hmm. Ok, so I've found the grub problem.
[03:51] <mjg59> No idea why it does it, though.
[03:54] <TerminX> Diablo-D3: no, you don't need it
[03:55] <Diablo-D3> okay, so thats not it.
[03:55] <Diablo-D3> er
[03:55] <Diablo-D3> oh
[03:55] <TerminX> what problem are you having?
[03:55] <Diablo-D3> goddamnit! >_<
[03:55] <Diablo-D3> I bet I know what it is
[03:55] <Diablo-D3> I have synaptic setup in my xorg.conf
[03:55] <Diablo-D3> but I dont have xorg-synaptic installed because it hasnt been converted to the new world
[03:56] <TerminX> you mean xorg-driver-synaptics?
[03:57] <Diablo-D3> er yeah
[03:57] <Diablo-D3> it still requires xorg-xserver and shit
[03:58] <TerminX> you mean xserver-xorg
[04:00] <Diablo-D3> argh
[04:00] <Diablo-D3> yes
[04:00] <Diablo-D3> sorry, today's cup of coffee hasnt reached my brain yet
[04:00] <TerminX> :p
[04:08] <Diablo-D3> fek
[04:08] <Diablo-D3> gaim is crashhappy now
[04:09] <TerminX> uhhh...
[04:09] <TerminX> wtf
[04:09] <TerminX> in gedit, got *** glibc detected *** malloc(): memory corruption: 0x0845d880 *** in terminal
[04:09] <Diablo-D3> and I cant upgrade it to the newest package because it requires cario1
[04:13] <mjg59> Arse. Now I'm *really* confused.
[04:17] <lathiat> how come morgue.ubuntu.com isnt updated anymore?
[04:17] <Diablo-D3> because nothing dies?
[04:18] <luis_> disk space problems, someone said yesterday
[04:18] <lathiat> luis_: ah
[04:20] <jdub> we go through a *lot* of revisions
[04:20] <Burgundavia> 52 previous versions of xorg?
[04:43] <Diablo-D3> wtf
[04:43] <Diablo-D3> something isnt right here
[04:43] <Diablo-D3> I have the synaptics stuff commented out
[04:43] <Diablo-D3> so why the fuck is it still trying to use it?
[04:44] <daniels> because it's still in the ServerLayout section
[04:44] <Diablo-D3> nope its not
[04:45] <Diablo-D3> thats commented out to
[04:45] <daniels> then maybe you could be more specific and do something like provide a /var/log/Xorg.0.log
[04:45] <Diablo-D3> # is the comment character, right?
[04:45] <daniels> yes
[04:47] <Diablo-D3> (**) |-->Input Device "Configured Mouse"
[04:47] <Diablo-D3> (**) |-->Input Device "Synaptics Touchpad"
[04:48] <Diablo-D3> but
[04:48] <Diablo-D3> #Section "InputDevice"
[04:48] <Diablo-D3> #        Identifier      "Synaptics Touchpad"
[04:48] <Diablo-D3> and
[04:48] <Diablo-D3>         #InputDevice    "Synaptics Touchpad"
[04:49] <Diablo-D3> (II) LoadModule: "synaptics"
[04:49] <Diablo-D3> (II) Loading /usr/X11R6/lib/modules/input/synaptics_drv.o
[04:49] <Diablo-D3> (II) Module synaptics: vendor="The XFree86 Project"
[04:49] <Diablo-D3>         compiled for 4.2.0, module version = 1.0.0
[04:49] <Diablo-D3>         Module class: XFree86 XInput Driver
[04:49] <Diablo-D3>         ABI class: XFree86 XInput driver, version 0.3
[04:49] <Diablo-D3> now I'm really confused.
[04:49] <Diablo-D3> I dont have the synaptics driver installed, so where is it getting it from?
[04:50] <Diablo-D3> I've never had xfree86 4.2.0 installed on this box either
[04:50] <daniels> i'd say it's getting it from /usr/X11R6/lib/modules/input/synaptics_drv.o
[04:51] <Diablo-D3> but such a file cant exist
[04:51] <daniels> as opposed to just making it up.  as for the paste, next time don't flood, use a pastebin or just put it up somewhere.
[04:51] <daniels> okay, you're right, the X server is absolutely juts making it up.
[04:51] <lathiat> daniels: are you aware of cases of autodetection of resolution/sync failing where it worked on hoary?
[04:51] <daniels> please seek further help in #ubuntu.
[04:51] <Diablo-D3> [diablo@absolute /usr/X11R6/lib/modules/input] $ ls
[04:51] <Diablo-D3> kbd_drv.o  mouse_drv.o
[04:51] <daniels> lathiat: no
[04:51] <Diablo-D3> daniels: yup, its making it up.
[04:51] <lathiat> daniels: ok i'll file more bugs then, i've got an open bug about my laptop tho
[04:51] <lathiat> daniels: which still applies
[04:51] <daniels> lathiat: except I saw a bug from you in nv in passing
[04:51] <daniels> lathiat: right
[04:52] <lathiat> had it on another laptop which is s3 savage
[05:01] <mjg59> Ah! Got it
[05:01] <mjg59> jdub: Ping?
[05:02] <Diablo-D3> ...
[05:02] <Diablo-D3> daniels: I figured it out
[05:02] <Diablo-D3> for some reason X wasnt writing it's log
[05:02] <Diablo-D3> so that log was outdated, back to when I actually was using the synaptics touchpad driver
[05:04] <jdub> mjg59: pong
[05:05] <mjg59> jdub: Had a chance to install setserial, or are you still downloading?
[05:06] <mjg59> lathiat: Still around? I have a grub for you
[05:07] <lathiat> mjg59: yep
[05:07] <mjg59> lathiat: Hang on, just building a deb
[05:07] <mjg59> Then I just need to check it on the machine that the patch was to fix in the first place...
[05:08] <lathiat> mjg59: heh
[05:08] <mjg59> (Ironically it worked fine there, due to a quirk of the x86 architecture)
[05:10] <Burgundavia> daniels, can https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13214 be closed as glxinfo is now in mesa-utils? (which probably should be installed by default)
[05:12] <mjg59> Ok, that seems to work
[05:12] <mjg59> lathiat: http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~mjg59/tmp/grub_0.95+cvs20040624-17ubuntu6_i386.deb
[05:12] <mjg59> lathiat: If you could give that a go and let me know if it works, I'll upload it
[05:12] <lathiat> mjg59: ok
[05:15] <daniels> Burgundavia: it's growing a dependency on mesa-utils in <IP_ADDRESS>-1
[05:15] <lathiat> mjg59: this better not break ;p
[05:16] <mjg59> lathiat: Yeah, if it does I don't get to go to bed yet...
[05:17] <Burgundavia> daniels, should I then close the bug or change it to "mesa-utils needs to be installed for glxinfo"?
[05:17] <daniels> Burgundavia: mmm, might as well just PENDINGUPLOAD it
[05:17] <Burgundavia> ok
[05:18] <Burgundavia> daniels, done
[05:18] <daniels> ta
[05:19] <lathiat> mjg59: \o/
[05:20] <mjg59> lathiat: Success?
[05:20] <lathiat> mjg59: yep
[05:20] <lathiat> works fine
[05:20] <mjg59> lathiat: Rock. I'll upload that now.
[05:20] <lathiat> mjg59: question, any idea why when the kernel starts it now takes like 5-10 seconds to continue booting? (i think its an initramfs thing?)
[05:20] <lathiat> also, is usplash supposed to disappear after a short time?
[05:20] <infinity> mjg59 : Say, do you have a copy of culchie that isn't on codon.org.uk (which appears to be nonexistant...)
[05:21] <mjg59> infinity: Oh, good question. I'll try to get that machine up tomorrow - still haven't sorted all the networking here
[05:21] <mjg59> infinity: Ok, uploaded
[05:24] <jdub> mjg59: doing massive mirror sync atm, so can't actually update
[05:24] <jdub> maybe i'll pull setserial directly
[05:24] <mjg59> jdub: Ok, no problem
[05:26] <jdub> mjg59: ok, done the setserial and modprobe
[05:27] <jdub> [4311698.792000]  NET: Registered protocol family 23
[05:27] <jdub> [4311698.797000]  nsc-ircc, Found chip at base=0x02e
[05:27] <jdub> [4311698.797000]  nsc-ircc, driver loaded (Dag Brattli)
[05:27] <jdub> [4311698.799000]  IrDA: Registered device irda0
[05:27] <jdub> [4311698.799000]  nsc-ircc, Found dongle: Differential serial interface
[05:27] <jdub> [4311698.799000]  nsc_ircc_init_dongle_interface(), Differential serial interface not defined by irda yet
[05:27] <jdub>
[05:27] <jdub> btw, do you know what these are:
[05:27] <jdub> [4311622.804000]  ACPI: acpi_ec_space_handler: bit_width should be 8
[05:27] <jdub> [4311622.806000]  ACPI: acpi_ec_space_handler: bit_width should be 8
[05:27] <jdub> [4311622.808000]  ACPI: acpi_ec_space_handler: bit_width should be 8
[05:27] <jdub> [4311652.809000]  ACPI: acpi_ec_space_handler: bit_width should be 8
[05:27] <jdub> [4311652.811000]  ACPI: acpi_ec_space_handler: bit_width should be 8
[05:27] <jdub> [4311652.812000]  ACPI: acpi_ec_space_handler: bit_width should be 8
[05:27] <jdub> [4311682.814000]  ACPI: acpi_ec_space_handler: bit_width should be 8
[05:27] <jdub> [4311682.816000]  ACPI: acpi_ec_space_handler: bit_width should be 8
[05:27] <jdub> [4311682.818000]  ACPI: acpi_ec_space_handler: bit_width should be 8
[05:27] <jdub>
[05:27] <mjg59> jdub: ACPI bitching about a bug in your DSDT
[05:27] <mjg59> Should work anyway
[05:27] <jdub> oh
[05:28] <jdub> dsdt again
[05:28] <mjg59> jdub: Hm. The "Differential
[05:28] <mjg59>               serial interface not defined by irda yet"
[05:28] <mjg59> bit is a bit worrying
[05:29] <daniels> jdub: ack, mein leben
[05:30] <mjg59> jdub: Do you have any IrDA devices?
[05:30] <jdub> mjg59: how do i find out? :)
[05:30] <mjg59> jdub: Does your phone have IR?
[05:30] <jdub> oh
[05:30] <jdub> right
[05:30] <jdub> yes
[05:31] <mjg59> Can you switch it on and put it in front of the IR area on your laptop, wait a few seconds and then cat /proc/net/irda/discovery ?
[05:32] <lathiat> Diablo-D3: infrared
[05:32] <Diablo-D3> my laptop doesnt have it =/
[05:32] <jdub> don't seem to be getting anything
[05:32] <daniels> mjg59: do we still need to do the kernel boot line hack for irda on the x40, or is it all good now?
[05:33] <jdub> nup
[05:33] <jdub> nowt
[05:33] <mjg59> jdub: Oh, duh. Sorry - irattach irda0
[05:33] <mjg59> daniels: Boot line hack?
[05:33] <jdub> mjg59: what's irattach in?
[05:33] <mjg59> irda-utils
[05:33] <bob2> which module do I need for x40 irda love, anyway?
[05:34] <jdub> hmm, universe
[05:34] <whiprush_> wow. jdub, it was a year ago and 6 days since you invited me to "no-name-yet".
[05:35] <ajmitch> jdub: needs motu love, or should be in main? :)
[05:35] <jdub> whiprush_: going to launch fridge on 1 year anniversary of warty preview :-)
[05:35] <mjg59> bob2: nsc-ircc with dongle_id=0x09
[05:35] <whiprush_> woo
[05:36] <bob2> ah, with 2.6.12
[05:36] <daniels> mjg59: right, you still need to pass arguments
[05:36] <mjg59> daniels: Oh, to the module? Yes. I'm trying to figure out the best approach to that.
[05:36] <lathiat> jdub: we have a fridge?
[05:37] <jdub> lathiat: it's more of an icebox atm
[05:37] <jdub> ajmitch: with mjg59's work, it'll probably end up in main
[05:37] <jdub> mjg59: yep, not getting squat
[05:37] <lathiat> jdub: extra cool?
[05:37] <jdub> lathiat: more like manual cooling atm ;)
[05:37] <lathiat> haha
[05:38] <lathiat> well we must have made an impression one of the apple guys subscribed to avahis ml and asked a few detailed questions. :)
[05:38] <jdub> excellent :-)
[05:39] <mjg59> jdub: Ok.  This has got to be an improvement.
[05:47] <luis_> heh
[05:47] <luis_> well
[05:47] <luis_> it is a pretty spectacular something
[05:47] <luis_> open new tab in epiphany (which it turns out I do all the time)
[05:47] <luis_> -> 100% CPU usage by X
[05:47] <mjg59> jdub: So that means that at the moment my script of love will work out of the box on your machine
[05:47] <jdub> did daniels take your browser away again?
[05:48] <jdub> mjg59: yay!
[05:48] <jdub> mjg59: so does it leave autodetection on all the time, or...?
[05:48] <bob2> so
[05:48] <daniels> jdub: gtk took his browswer away
[05:48] <bob2> how do I read saved form information with firefox?
[05:48] <luis_> jdub: I'm not blaming daniels yet... I have a nagging feeling it is cairo or gtk
[05:48] <mjg59> jdub: It tries as hard as it can to autodetect
[05:50] <jdub> mjg59: sucking power at the same time?
[05:50] <daniels> luis_: heh.
[05:51] <mjg59> jdub: Indeed.
[05:51] <luis_> daniels: to be fair, I can't test whether or not it is 'just' a leaky/broken X, because I'm afraid to restart X ;)
[05:51] <mjg59> jdub: UI for controlling that may be... interesting
[05:51] <mjg59> (To be fair, the power draw of an IR chipset is pretty tiny)
[05:53] <daniels> luis_: hah
[05:53] <daniels> mjg59: LAPTOPPOWERMISSION
[05:54] <daniels> mjg59: if we make that one a zero, we can save power and/or fight crime
[05:54] <Diablo-D3> heh
[05:54] <Diablo-D3> I wouldnt mind having a longer uptime.
[05:55] <Diablo-D3> 2.5 hours just isnt enough.
[05:57] <mjg59> daniels: Haha
[05:58] <hub>  Gdk-WARNING **: locale not supported by Xlib <- why ? I can't google any valid answer
[05:59] <daniels> hub: because you're using fr_FR and not fr_FR.UTF-8
[05:59] <hub> LANG=en_CA
[05:59] <hub> daniels: never assume
[05:59] <daniels> hub: in any case, note that you're missing a .UTF-8
[05:59] <hub> and ubuntu set it for me
[06:00] <hub> so it should have told me
[06:00] <daniels> err, we've been using utf-8 since hoary
[06:00] <hub> well hoary never did that
[06:00] <hub> and hoary picked that up
[06:01] <hub> or was it warty distupgraded
[06:01] <hub> maybe
[06:01] <bob2> there you go
[06:01] <daniels> if it's warty dist-upgraded, then you'll probably need to flick over to utf-8
[06:01] <bob2> wiki.ubuntu.com/HoaryUpgradeNotes
[06:01] <hub> regenerating the locales then
[06:01] <daniels> in any case, i'll look at it and try to figure it out
[06:01] <mjg59> mdz: grub is sorted. For my next trick I'm going to inflict irda-utils on everyone.
[06:02] <hub> crap I have to report that too
[06:02] <Burgundavia> mjg59, you still going to be able to push stuff into main at this late date?
[06:03] <luis_> he is mjg59
[06:03] <luis_> he'll use his super powers for good instead of evil
[06:03] <luis_> for once
[06:04] <Burgundavia> jdub, how does the artwork freeze interact with the UI freeze?
[06:08] <mjg59> Burgundavia: When it's part of a BreezyGoal, yeah
[06:08] <Burgundavia> mjg59, figured as much
[06:09] <lathiat> jdub: so, how do i propose to pet a zeroconf goal for breezy+1 including avahi and nss-mdns? :)
[06:09] <jdub> Burgundavia: artwork doesn't include changes to code
[06:09] <jdub> lathiat: write a spec on the wiki using the spec template :)
[06:09] <Burgundavia> jdub, does artwork include icons and themese?
[06:10] <lathiat> jdub: and when ?
[06:10] <lathiat> err
[06:10] <ajmitch> lathiat: get those packages ready for review! :)
[06:10] <lathiat> and then
[06:10] <jdub> Burgundavia: yes
[06:10] <lathiat> ajmitch: yeh waiting for ross to stick his head up
[06:10] <jdub> lathiat: you can do a spec any time, and it will be discussed at the developer summit in october
[06:10] <Burgundavia> jdub, that means that our screenshots are going might be out of date?
[06:10] <jdub> lathiat: i will back it pretty heavily :-)
[06:11] <Burgundavia> jdub, lets move to -doc
[06:11] <daniels> jdub: november is more accurate than october
[06:11] <wasabi> Wonder what ever happened with Ape support in gstreamer.
[06:11] <wasabi> Monkey Audio!
[06:11] <daniels> jdub: given there's only like one day in october
[06:11] <lathiat> jdub: ok, dont suppose the summit will be in australia again? :P
[06:11] <jdub> lathiat: almost
[06:11] <jdub> lathiat: canada :)
[06:11] <lathiat> heh
[06:11] <Burgundavia> montreal!
[06:11] <lathiat> so who wants to give me their spare change so i can go
[06:11] <AndyFitz> mjg59: ping
[06:12] <crimsun> wasabi: the proverbial license issue, more than likely
[06:12] <ajmitch> lathiat: start swimming!
[06:12] <lathiat> ajmitch: do you think if I start now i could make it?
[06:12] <wasabi> I thought that guy was going to relicense.
[06:12] <ajmitch> a bit over 2 months.. yeah, if you go fast enough
[06:12] <lathiat> ok, bb very later :)
[06:13] <crimsun> wasabi: dilinger would probably know more about that
[06:13] <jdub> daniels: i start on 26th
[06:13] <daniels> jdub: hra har
[06:14] <lathiat> daniels: what tool outputs the horizsync/vertrefresh X uses?
[06:14] <mjg59> AndyFitz: Hi
[06:15] <jdub> luis_: how are the 2.12 live cds faring with breezy?
[06:15] <luis_> jdub: I haven't tested in a week
[06:15] <luis_> jdub: they needed some love then, though we could manually provide love
[06:15] <daniels> lathiat: xresprobe-ish
[06:15] <AndyFitz> mjg59,  I've sent you 2 16 colour png's for usplash.  do they suit ?
[06:16] <lathiat> daniels: well more to the point, what can i type to make it spit it out without makign it generate an X config? or is it not possible ?
[06:16] <mjg59> AndyFitz: Ooh, pretty
[06:16] <daniels> lathiat: sudo xresprobe <driver>
[06:16] <lathiat> daniels: well that only tells me the resolution
[06:17] <mjg59> AndyFitz: I think jdub was talking about coordinating artwork - you may want to liase with him briefly
[06:17] <lathiat> daniels: is that why autodetection is failign then?
[06:17] <daniels> lathiat: oh, is this the laptop?
[06:17] <lathiat> daniels: yeh
[06:17] <luis_> what have we come to that we use words like liase?
[06:17] <luis_> stop the madness.
[06:17] <lathiat> sorry should have specified
[06:18] <bob2> luis_: it's ok for the English
[06:18] <daniels> lathiat: then it won't spit out any at all
[06:18] <daniels> lathiat: xserver-xorg.postinst will say 'ah, nv on a laptop, we should probably do sync ranges', and there's some magic voodoo shit form thereon in
[06:18] <lathiat> daniels: oh, so where does it get them from then?
[06:18] <luis_> bob2: if he was being English, shouldn't he have stuck in a gratuitous 'u' somewhere?
[06:18] <lathiat> ah right
[06:18] <luis_> artwourk or something like that?
[06:18] <luis_> :)
[06:18] <daniels> lathiat: it sort of makes them up
[06:18] <lathiat> daniels: ah
[06:18] <bob2> luis_: it was liase, not liaze, I think it's enough
[06:18] <lathiat> daniels: well, its making them up wrong :)
[06:19] <luis_> blah
[06:19] <luis_> daniels? would it be your fault if gtk is no longer building for me with some errors about freetype headers?
[06:20] <lathiat> daniels: on that savage it also gave me a list of resoltions to choose from when installing
[06:20] <luis_> oh, hrm
[06:20] <luis_> daniels: nm, probably
[06:20] <lathiat> daniels: (is that related?)
[06:21] <daniels> luis_: seb's
[06:21] <daniels> lathiat: oh, it's savage, not nv
[06:21] <lathiat> daniels: i had 2 cases
[06:21] <lathiat> daniels: altho i just tested and my nv seems to be guessing it right again
[06:21] <daniels> cool
[06:21] <lathiat> do you care about the savage?
[06:23] <lathiat> ahh i seem in the savage its not specifying a HorizSync/VertRefresh at all
[06:23] <daniels> yeah
[06:23] <lathiat> and with -phigh asks for the res
[06:24] <lathiat> (it did have the right one selected tho)
[06:24] <lathiat> ah wtf xresprobe wasn't installed
[06:25] <lathiat> daniels: why doesnt ubuntu-desktop dep on it?
[06:25] <daniels> lathiat: it ... should ...
[06:26] <infinity> It doesn't... It's only in the live seed.
[06:26] <lathiat> yeh
[06:29] <Diablo-D3> does anyone have a copy of libcairo1 (>= 0.6.0)?
[06:30] <daniels> Diablo-D3: please take this to #ubuntu
[06:30] <Diablo-D3> daniels: libcairo1 >= 0.6.0 isnt in hoary.
[06:31] <daniels> Diablo-D3: 'please take this to #ubuntu'
[06:31] <AndyFitz> mjg59,  its all good. there's another bloke sorting out usplash artwork
[06:31] <bob2> 'Ubuntu Development (not support, even with breezy)'
[06:36] <wasabi> Somehow file metadata needs to be editable from Nautilus.
[06:43] <fabbione> morning
[06:45] <\sh> mornin
[06:45] <\sh> g
[06:53] <infinity> \sh : How do you feel about transitions this morning?
[06:53] <\sh> infinity: 6:53 local time...I need to go to office..but shock me
[06:54] <infinity> \sh : I'm cleaning up the whole universe mesa FTBFS mess, but a little bit of help with the grunt work might be nice.
[06:54] <infinity> \sh : Especially since I'm not actually an MOTU. :)
[06:54] <ajmitch> infinity: sure, hit us with whatever you need
[06:55] <\sh> infinity: u r main :) so it's a superset of MOTU ,-)
[06:55] <ajmitch> hey jsgotangco
[06:55] <\sh> infinity: let me rush to office...and then lets give a go to your mesa stuff :)
[06:56] <jsgotangco> hey ajmitch, hello all
[06:56] <lathiat> im not the only one having gnome-panel crash every 10 minutes right?
[06:56] <\sh> infinity: btw...why is libwxgtk2.6 not installable? ,-)
[06:56] <\sh> lathiat: come on it's fun :)
[06:56] <lathiat> not when i accidentally hit restart application
[06:56] <lathiat> which causes that stupid
[06:56] <lathiat> I've detected a panel already running and will now quit
[06:56] <infinity> \sh : Dunno, but I just uploaded a new version.  Didn't even know the current one was broken (other than the breakage I'm fixing right now)
[06:56] <lathiat> followed by gnome-session restarting it
[06:57] <lathiat> which means no matter how many times i hit ok
[06:57] <lathiat> it stays there
[06:57] <lathiat> :)
[06:57] <infinity> lathiat : It crashed a few times on me yesterday, hasn't so far today..
[06:57] <lathiat> infinity: lucky!
[06:57] <infinity> lathiat : I promised myself not to worry about it until seb128 gets GTK fixed and the new gnome-panel builds.
[06:58] <lathiat> infinity: :) yeh
[06:58] <\sh> infinity: k...ok...give me at least one hour...rushing to office, grab a coffee, put my laptops in place...and then...I will fetch a rdepend list and give it a go...
[06:58] <infinity> \sh : Ping me before you start.  Coordinatoin may be nice.
[06:58] <ajmitch> infinity: so what motu work are you needing done?
[06:58] <\sh> infinity: sure..I told u earlier...we're there for you :)
[06:58] <ajmitch> I've been behind by a few days
[06:58] <\sh> so..rush to office
[07:03] <mdz> \sh_away: I would not mind at all if you wanted to merge mythtv 0.18.1 into multiverse ;-)
[07:43] <fabbione> elmo: friday crack reuploaded with proper copyright..
[07:47] <\sh> uh moment...let me switch the computer
[07:53] <dilinger> wasabi: the monkey's audio author disappeared shortly after saying he was going to relicense
[07:53] <dilinger> that was over a year ago, i believe
[07:54] <dilinger> i gave up expecting any sort of answer, i consider MA pretty much dead at this point
[07:56] <\sh> ok...
[07:56] <\sh> infinity: ping
[08:11] <infinity> \sh : 'sec. :)
[08:12] <\sh> infinity: take your time...I need to check our nagra system...
[08:12] <\sh> brb
[08:12] <brz> um.. i could be crazy, but... could someone else try running "pkg-config --help" a few times in a row and see if they get any weird output?
[08:13] <infinity> brz : Wow, special.
[08:13] <Burgundavia> brz, confirmed
[08:13] <brz> nice. :)
[08:14] <infinity> Mithrandir : ping, pkg-config is teh suck.  Try pkg-config --help a few times and watch the crazy corrupted output and segvs.
[08:14] <daniels> Mithrandir: works fine on amd64, breaks on i386.
[08:22] <tepsipakki> daniels: how about fixing lrm-manager in linux-restricted-modules-common (13363)? Simple fix, PATH is not set..
[08:22] <daniels> tepsipakki: in good time
[08:24] <tepsipakki> ok
[08:31] <pitti> Morning
[08:32] <fabbione> hey pitti
[08:35] <\sh> back
[08:36] <infinity> \sh : Alright, want to do me a favour? :)
[08:37] <infinity> \sh : Check breezy-changes for everything I've been uploading recently for the xorg -> mesa GL/GLU transition, and hunt down anything that's FTBFS. :)
[08:37] <Mithrandir> infinity: I know, it's a popt bug.
[08:37] <Mithrandir> infinity: nobody calls pkg-config by hand anyhow, so I haven't bothered to fix it yet.
[08:38] <doko> good morning
[08:38] <ajmitch> morning doko
[08:38] <\sh> infinity: can do
[08:38] <Mithrandir> daniels: X ate my keyboard.
[08:39] <Treenaks> speaking of X.. *points at #13572*
[08:39] <Treenaks> (but that's a resolution thing)
[08:39] <daniels> Mithrandir: works for me
[08:39] <Mithrandir> daniels: it ate it after complaining that it couldn't find a core pointer (which I have to admit was fair; my mouse was plugged into the other box)
[08:40] <daniels> Mithrandir: define 'ate'
[08:40] <daniels> it ingested your keyboard, and it's now useless?
[08:41] <Mithrandir> yes, but it gave it back to me after I rebooted.
[08:41] <Mithrandir> just a few tooth marks and stuff
[08:41] <daniels> Treenaks: yeah, will check it out
[08:41] <Treenaks> daniels: thanks
[08:41] <daniels> Mithrandir: ... ok
[08:42] <Mithrandir> daniels: (more seriously): it seemed to grab control of the keyboard completely, not even NumLock worked.
[08:43] <\sh> hmm
[08:44] <infinity> \sh : Oh, and if anything that build-deps on gtk+2.0 appears to be failing to build due to pkg-config or linking issues, just make a note of it and give me the list after seb128 fixed GTK.
[08:44] <infinity> s/fixed/fixes/
[08:44] <\sh> xorg + synaptic touchpad + usb mouse + mousewheel works after coming up normally...when I'm unplugging the usb mouse, and replugging the mouse it doesn't work anymore..and yes zaxismapping is configured
[08:44] <\sh> infinity: sure :)
[08:45] <ajmitch> \sh: care for any build help?
[08:46] <\sh> infinity: something like wxwidgets2.6, right?
[08:46] <\sh> ajmitch: fire
[08:47] <infinity> \sh : wxwidgets may well be the sort of failure I'm looking for, yes.  Also, look at hoe gnome-panel fails currently, you may see that.
[08:47] <daniels> Mithrandir: ... cool.
[08:47] <infinity> \sh : But, more to the point, anything that fails at all in any way dealing with gtk+2.0, just put it on a list for "later".
[08:48] <daniels> \sh: it's probably PS/2 being the suck.
[08:48] <infinity> \sh : When GTK is fixed, we can retry those and see if they're still broken or magically fixed.
[08:48] <Mithrandir> daniels: ssh-ing into the box works fine.  Replugging the keyboard doesn't help.
[08:48] <daniels> Mithrandir: bongtasmic
[08:48] <\sh> daniels: the mouse is ImPS/2
[08:48] <daniels> Mithrandir: that can happen sometimes, but seems to be rather random.  i've only seen it once or twice.
[08:48] <daniels> \sh: right, and synaptics does stupid things with ps/2 proxies.
[08:48] <Mithrandir> daniels: it's consistent across reboots here, fwiw.
[08:49] <\sh> infinity: i will take notes
[08:49] <daniels> Mithrandir: tags -1 + unreproducible
[08:49] <\sh> infinity: how many packages actually for universe?
[08:50] <Mithrandir> daniels: I can proxy-debug if you actually care about the bug.
[08:50] <daniels> Mithrandir: not at the moment, to be honest.  can I kick you in like a week?
[08:50] <infinity> \sh : Erm, by the time I'm done today, at least 90 source packages.
[08:50] <\sh> k
[08:50] <infinity> \sh : I've only done 15 so far.  Time to pick up the pace.
[08:51] <Mithrandir> daniels: sure.
[08:51] <infinity> \sh : I'm trying to avoid dependency issues, so...
[08:54] <\sh> infinity: check libopengl-perl it won't find libGLU etc.
[08:55] <\sh> infinity: and libopengl-dylan has dep problems with libgc1
[08:55] <\sh> to be more precise: gwydion-dylan-dev has dep problems :)
[08:57] <infinity> libopengl-perl is on crack.  Put that on a list for later.
[08:58] <infinity> The dylan thing should be sorted by someone who isn't me.  <hint, hint>
[08:58] <infinity> But you can have me retry the libopengl-dylan build after you fix grydion-dylan-dev.
[08:58] <infinity> gwydion, too.
[09:00] <Treenaks> infinity: it has been for ages
[09:00] <\sh> infinity: i will check it...
[09:05] <\sh> good morning mvo
[09:10] <mvo> hey \sh
[09:11] <ajmitch> hi mvo
[10:16] <pitti> Hey seb128
[10:17] <seb128> hi pitti
[10:18] <jdub> morning seb128
[10:19] <seb128> hey jdub
[10:20] <daniels> seb128: morning sebarino
[10:20] <seb128> hey daniels
[10:21] <Mithrandir> jdub: can you send Colin a new image for 7514?
[10:22] <sivang> morning all
[10:24] <pitti> Hi sivang
[10:25] <Mithrandir> hi Simira
[10:26] <Simira> morning
[10:28] <jdub> Mithrandir: 7514? i don't understand :)
[10:28] <jdub> oh
[10:28] <JaneW> lo all
[10:28] <JaneW> *Nag Alert*
[10:28] <JaneW> *** Attention BreezyGoals Owners  All Breezy Goals must now be past WIP status and moved to Implemented or beyond. Now that the Feature Feeze is in place unless it's a) a must-have goal, or b) they've sent Matt Zimmerman a proposal for a freeze exception, it's too late. Any goals which aren't in one of those two categories must either implemented or deferred, no more WIP ***
[10:28] <jdub> bug #?
[10:29] <jdub> Mithrandir: aha, looking
[10:31] <fabbione> JaneW: my irc client starts to hate you...
[10:32] <fabbione> flood over 4 lines = autoignore for 24 hours...
[10:32] <daniels> ... that was three lines
[10:32] <fabbione> not here...
[10:32] <fabbione> i am at 80x24
[10:34] <fabbione> elmo: i really need xbitmaps in the archive.. can you please give it some NEW love asap
[10:34] <seb128> mvo: around?
[10:34] <mvo> seb128: yes
[10:34] <seb128> mvo: how is that going with lpi?
[10:34] <seb128> on your list for today ?
[10:35] <mvo> seb128: yes
[10:35] <seb128> cool
[10:35] <siretart> JaneW: I see xen was deferred, Do you know the status about this? Is this perhaps a target for universe?
[10:35] <fabbione> siretart: no.. deferred to breezy+1
[10:35] <siretart> :(
[10:35] <mvo> seb128: there isn't a lot missing, right? we just need to upload (unless we want to change the python import name). right?
[10:36] <seb128> you said to wait friday, so you know :)
[10:36] <seb128> it was fine enough to upload for me
[10:36] <siretart> fabbione: is there some repositories to look at? I'm quite interested in xen and would like to have a look at what is in place now and what would be needed to do to get it working
[10:37] <fabbione> siretart: there is nothing packaged. the issue is not making the packages.. that's dead easy. The issue is the xen patch upstream
[10:37] <mvo> seb128: ok, so nothing new over the WE :) that's fine, please upload then. I'll do uploads for g-a-i and (if you want) hal-device-manager
[10:37] <fabbione> siretart: their last release was against .11 and it doesn't build easily on .12
[10:37] <infinity> seb128 : I'll love you forever if you fix gtk+2.0 so stuff stops FTBFSing against it.
[10:37] <fabbione> siretart: that means doing a huge amount of porting and testing.
[10:38] <seb128> infinity: on my list for today, I'll start with that
[10:38] <fabbione> siretart: the porting itself is easy.. get it to compile .. a bit less
[10:38] <seb128> infinity: daniels could have fixed that with his upload yesterday :)
[10:38] <siretart> fabbione: I see. do you think having a xen-utils package in universe, with a note that a nonstandard, custom patched kernel is required, would help
[10:38] <daniels> seb128: see? clearly I'm not cut out to be the gtk maintainer
[10:38] <siretart> ?
[10:38] <daniels> seb128: obviously you have to keep it.  tragic news.
[10:38] <fabbione> siretart: afaik there are xen packages in universe..
[10:39] <infinity> seb128 : Danke.
[10:39] <seb128> daniels: that makes you sad? You can take it if you want, I'm not like that :)
[10:39] <infinity> seb128 : Merci, too, if you prefer that.
[10:39] <fabbione> siretart: oh there are the old ones.. new ones aren't synced..
[10:39] <daniels> seb128: no, I've tried and failed.  you must keep it, for the good of Ubuntu.
[10:39] <seb128> infinity: de rien ;)
[10:39] <fabbione> siretart: we can sync them...
[10:40] <fabbione> elmo: please sync xen_2.0.6 from debian/main.. i guess it's in experimental
[10:40] <siretart> cool
[10:40] <fabbione> siretart: there are only the sources in universe for the old version
[10:41] <siretart> fabbione: I was thinking about playing around with linux vserver patch. Upstream declared the 2.6 port stable, and released a 'stable' release. I was thinking about packaging the new version of vserver-utils and a customized breezy kernel in a private repository first and then decide if it's mature enough for inclusion into universe. any objections
[10:41] <siretart> ?
[10:42] <siretart> grr. this compose key on sparc type6 keyboards is awfully placed..
[10:42] <fabbione> siretart: only one.. you need to make absolutely sure that:
[10:42] <daniels> dude, I have a type5 where backspace is not in the top irght.
[10:42] <fabbione> 1) it is marked as NON supported kernel
[10:42] <daniels> top-right is `~, backspace is underneath that
[10:42] <fabbione> 2) you keep it in sync
[10:43] <siretart> fabbione: I intended to add a -vserver EXTRAVERSION. Is some note in README.Debian enough for the branding as NON supported?
[10:46] <fabbione> siretart: hmmm.. well more or less.. i would be more glad to see also the description mentioning UNSUPPORTED
[10:46] <fabbione> siretart: users tend not to read and just complain afterward
[10:47] <siretart> ah, package description. Sure thing.
[10:48] <eruin> http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software_2fAvahi?action=highlight&value=%2FAvahi
[10:48] <eruin> breezy +1 ?
[10:51] <eruin> directed at jdub, really
[10:54] <siretart> elmo: please sync util-vserver from unstable. TIA!
[10:55] <pitti> elmo: please also sync dutch
[10:57] <JaneW> siretart: it was given to one of the Google Summer of Code students and he went AWOL/MIA so it simply wasn't done
[10:57] <JaneW> siretart: I guess it will be Bountyable again
[10:58] <daniels> seb128: do we want to get an exception for VPR, or is gstreamer good enough?
[10:58] <daniels> seb128: arguably removing features isn't a feature, so it can't really be frozen ...
[10:58] <ogra_> seb128, my panel is crashing constantly today, i suspect its something i have in the notification area, did the code/protocol change there ?
[10:59] <siretart> ogra_: bugzilla has already a bug about this, seems to be a race in gnome-menus
[10:59] <siretart> ogra_: fixed in CVS upstream
[10:59] <siretart> appearently
[10:59] <ogra_> oh, ok
[11:00] <ogra_> i just recognized it crashes faster if i put something in the notification area
[11:00] <siretart> may be an other, unrealted problem. I'm just guessing
[11:01] <ogra_> lets see, it kept stable since 5min now, without any notification stuff
[11:01] <ogra_> (before it crashed once a min)
[11:01] <seb128> works fine for me
[11:01] <seb128> I blame the new inotify
[11:01] <seb128> I've everything but linux uptodate
[11:02] <siretart> HA. there again for me. it mostly does during apt-getting stuff
[11:02] <ogra_> i'll try the old kernel as soon as i'm able to reboot
[11:02] <seb128> daniels: totem-xine is better than totem-gst atm, but we shipped warty/hoary with the second, so we can keep this way...
[11:02] <daniels> seb128: your call
[11:02] <fabbione> seb128: what kernel are you running?
[11:03] <ogra_> but it seems not to be the notification stuff... gnome-panel cpu usage is up to 95% again...
[11:03] <Treenaks> my gnome-panel is suicidal.. sometimes it just kills itself and reloads
[11:03] <seb128> fabbione: 2.6.12-3-k7
[11:03] <Burgundavia> daniels, seb128 for the record, -gstreamer is totally useless for non-free stuff. There are few users that I know of that use it
[11:03] <Burgundavia> it gives totem a bad name
[11:03] <fabbione> seb128: than inotify doesn't even work for you
[11:03] <fabbione> because the kernel did change from /dev/inotify to syscalls
[11:03] <seb128> fabbione: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13861 is the bug
[11:04] <seb128> "I only get panel crashes using the latest 2.6.12-7-686 kernel with some system
[11:04] <seb128> load, while there are no crashes on 2.6.12-6-686. Tested this with running
[11:04] <seb128> updatedb to produce some i/o activity."
[11:04] <seb128> according to the comments
[11:04] <seb128> fabbione: I know that :)
[11:04] <seb128> fabbione: 2.6.12-6-686 has working inotify?
[11:04] <fabbione> seb128: they both work..
[11:04] <seb128> panel crashes with 2.6.12-7-686 but not 2.6.12-6-686
[11:04] <ogra_> heh, nautilus constantly swallows two files on my desktop... ctrl-r brings them back.... looks suspicious like inotify
[11:05] <fabbione> the difference between -6 and -7 are ppc syscalls
[11:05] <fabbione> and 2 race condition fixes
[11:05] <fabbione> so fix your gtk bugz :)
[11:05] <ogra_> i wonder why its only these two
[11:05] <seb128> dunno why that happens with one and not the other
[11:05] <fabbione> seb128: does gnome-panel use gamin or inotify directly?
[11:06] <seb128> gamin
[11:06] <fabbione> seb128: if kernel/gamin were the issue, none of the apps using gamin would work
[11:06] <seb128> there is a known gnome-menus issue
[11:06] <seb128> but it's triggered by the new linux package, dunno why
[11:06] <seb128> gnome-menus will be updated today, no big deal
[11:07] <fabbione> seb128: you would see the problem on all apps using gamin, not just -panel or -menu
[11:07] <seb128> no issue at all here
[11:07] <seb128> ask to people who complains
[11:07] <fabbione> seb128: iirc metacity use gamin too, right?
[11:07] <seb128> no
[11:07] <Treenaks> my nautilus crashed too yesterday
[11:07] <seb128> nautilus does
[11:07] <fabbione> oh yeah nautilus
[11:08] <fabbione> Treenaks: anything interesting in dmesg?
[11:08] <Treenaks> fabbione: no
[11:08] <fabbione> like OOPs or someting
[11:08] <fabbione> ok
[11:08] <seb128> a comment states it doesn't happen without update-notifier
[11:08] <Treenaks> well
[11:08] <Treenaks> let me check
[11:08] <seb128> (the panel issues)
[11:08] <Treenaks> yes, an oops
[11:08] <fabbione> Treenaks: can you show it somewhere?
[11:09] <Treenaks> fabbione: I'll pastebin it, 1 sec
[11:09] <fabbione> sure
[11:09] <ogra_> seb128, yes, every time evonotify announces new mail to me it happens too within the next minute thats why i was suspecting the notification area
[11:10] <Treenaks> fabbione: http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/1506
[11:10] <Treenaks> fabbione: this could be another oops, related to umount/ejecting my MP3 player
[11:10] <Treenaks> fabbione: or unmount/ejecting my USB harddrive
[11:11] <fabbione> Treenaks: that's definetely not inotify
[11:11] <Treenaks> fabbione: it's still an oops :)
[11:11] <siretart> *blink* there is webcal in breezy?! i.e. calderaring over webdav?!
[11:11] <fabbione> Treenaks: file a bug? ;)
[11:11] <Treenaks> fabbione: I don't know what causes it exactly
[11:11] <fabbione> Treenaks: try to restart the system and reproduce it
[11:11] <seb128> siretart: evolution-webcal? It's here since warty ..
[11:12] <Treenaks> fabbione: ok, later today
[11:12] <fabbione> it looks more related to an hotplug process
[11:12] <fabbione> like you said..
[11:13] <siretart> seb128: then I must be blind. :) - will try it as soon ;)
[11:14] <jdub> siretart: that's not what webcal is :-)
[11:14] <siretart> argl. I mixed it up with caldav. sorry
[11:14] <jdub> siretart: and that module is just a mime handler to provide evolution integration with ics files
[11:14] <siretart> jdub: I suppose caldav is not a target for breezy, is it?
[11:15] <torkel> siretart: is there anything actually using caldev yet?
[11:16] <jdub> siretart: i was under the impression evo was going to support it in 2.12, but perhaps not
[11:16] <torkel> jdub: don't think so
[11:18] <fabbione> Treenaks: http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/1507 <- patch to fix that OOPS
[11:18] <Treenaks> fabbione: ah, ok :)
[11:21] <sivang> hmm, /usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/GMenuSimpleEditor/main.py:21: SyntaxWarning: import * only allowed at module level
[11:22] <sivang> (was dist-upgradinig)
[11:22] <sivang> fabbione: good hunting
[11:23] <seb128> sivang: known issue
[11:23] <sivang> seb128: k, thanks
[11:28] <mez_> mdz: ping
[11:30] <cassidy> I have a crash during Colony CD3 installation, on which package must i send the bugreport? installation-report?
[11:37] <jdub> hmm, very smooth upgrade to breezy on my server
[11:38] <Treenaks> jdub: </sarcasm>?
[11:38] <jdub> well, in terms of dependencies and so on
[11:38] <jdub> no, not at all
[11:38] <jdub> then i'll do my remote server :-)
[11:38] <seb128> daniels: what package creates /etc/X11/default-display-manager ?
[11:38] <sivang> mvo: hi, I saw there were some changes to lpint by you - looks like you created python binding for using lpint's lib stuff? :)
[11:39] <Treenaks> jdub: btw, people have started sending me email about my post being at the top of planet for almost 2 days now..
[11:39] <daniels> seb128: xdm and gdm and kdm's postinst, or something, isn't it?
[11:39] <seb128> daniels: not sure, that's because of https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13565
[11:39] <seb128> daniels: let me check that
[11:39] <mvo> sivang: yes, for the pygtk apps. code is in james tree already
[11:40] <sivang> mvo: I noticed :) What pygtk apps do we have to patch?
[11:40] <mvo> sivang: gnome-app-install, hal-device-manager and possibly others
[11:41] <seb128> sivang: have you worked on some patches?
[11:43] <sivang> seb128: I've been experimenting crashing gnomemeeting :) I will try to finish it today, and the other before UIF - are you already done with pygtk apps?
[11:45] <seb128> there is only 2 gtk apps
[11:46] <seb128> s/gtk/pygtk/
[11:47] <mvo> sivang: no worries about the pygtk stuff, I'll take care of it
[12:00] <sedak> the man pages for x11 client side functions are not supposed to be in libx11-dev ?
[12:00] <sedak> i can't find them anymore ...
[12:03] <\sh> g'afternoon JaneW
[12:04] <sedak> daniels, should i fill a bug for this ?
[12:04] <ajmitch> hi JaneW
[12:08] <jdub> hmm
[12:09] <jdub> i'm getting a lovely little hald segfault
[12:09] <jdub> pitti: around?
[12:09] <pitti> Hi jdub
[12:09] <pitti> jdub: can you get a sane trace?
[12:11] <jdub> hrm
[12:12] <jdub> #60 0xb7ea8fe0 in g_value_get_flags () from /usr/lib/libgobject-2.0.so.0
[12:12] <jdub> whoa
[12:12] <pitti> iz gtk bug
[12:12] <jdub> very strange character borkage
[12:13] <jdub> seb128: thoughts?
[12:13] <Mithrandir> jdub: boomed stack?
[12:13] <jdub> yeah, that's what gdb suggests
[12:14] <seb128> jdub: 1 function with no debug symbol is crap :)
[12:14] <jdub> "Previous frame inner to this frame (corrupt stack?)"
[12:14] <jdub> seb128: :-)
[12:14] <Mithrandir> jdub: valgrind it
[12:21] <HrdwrBoB> is breezy still going to have esd?
[12:21] <daniels> sedak: they're just not linked
[12:21] <daniels> HrdwrBoB: unfortunately, yes
[12:21] <doko> elmo: pleasse could you update g++-4.0 on davis/breezy and install libgpmg1-dev and quilt
[12:22] <HrdwrBoB> daniels: argh, about 10 million people/day ask why their game/whatever doesn't work and why movie sound sync is horribly, terribly, utterly broken
[12:23] <HrdwrBoB> * may be somewhat exaggerated
[12:24] <ploum> ARGH 8
[12:24] <daniels> HrdwrBoB: tell me about it
[12:25] <sedak> daniels, when i do dpkg -L libx11-dev|grep man
[12:25] <sedak> there is nothing
[12:25] <seb128> ploum: mine works fine :)
[12:25] <daniels> hm
[12:25] <daniels> it should be ok
[12:25] <sedak> and i have this :
[12:25] <sedak> ii  libx11-dev                6.2.1+cvs.20050722-6      X11 client-side library (development headers)
[12:25] <cassidy> ploum, bug seems to be fixed in upstream (see 13861)
[12:25] <ploum> cassidy, I've seen the bug report
[12:26] <seb128> cassidy: the new version has been packaged/uploaded too
[12:26] <ploum> but anyway, today is the "Day of the Pain"
[12:26] <seb128> let me know if that fixes the issue
[12:26] <seb128> I don't get any crash here
[12:26] <seb128> so I've no clue if it's fixed
[12:26] <seb128> it just works fine for me :)
[12:27] <cassidy> the problem is that i have crashed my breezy (thanks grub) and can't reinstall ubuntu-desktop (prob with libcairo1)
[12:27] <ploum> seb128, cool, I will wait until it hits the repo
[12:28] <ploum> I've seen the new notification balloons
[12:29] <ploum> But I don't understand fully : in order to make the balloon disapears, you have to click on an empty space in this ballon ?
[12:29] <ploum> If this is the case, it's not really discoverable and not very user friendly
[12:29] <cassidy> which ballons?
[12:29] <pitti> you can click anywhere or just wait for the timeout
[12:30] <ploum> (also : does clicking to the lightbuld something special ? I'm not sure due to crash)
[12:30] <ploum> pitti, the "clicking anywhere but the link" is a bit annoying IMHO
[12:31] <seb128> ploum: you can click on it to not get a message again
[12:31] <sivang> mvo: cool, thanks
[12:32] <ploum> seb128, indeed but if I want to get message again but just making this one disappears ?
[12:33] <ploum> I've found that clicking "anywhere but the links" works
[12:33] <ploum> But I don't found this very usable
[12:33] <ploum> and not discoverable
[12:33] <seb128> ploum: just wait
[12:33] <jdub> pitti, seb128: http://people.ubuntu.com/~jdub/2005/hald-valgrind.txt
[12:34] <seb128> ploum: it vanishes automatically
[12:34] <seb128> jdub: is that a debug build?
[12:34] <seb128> jdub: there is no function name here :/
[12:35] <jdub> seb128: no, want one?
[12:35] <seb128> ==7729== Invalid read of size 1
[12:35] <jdub> ok
[12:35] <seb128> ==7729==    at 0x80675CE: (within /usr/sbin/hald)
[12:35] <seb128> ==7729==    by 0x80681D6: (within /usr/sbin/hald)
[12:35] <seb128> ==7729==    by 0x8068465: (within /usr/sbin/hald)
[12:35] <pitti> jdub: ==7729==  Address 0x0 is not stack'd, malloc'd or (recently) free'd
[12:35] <pitti> jdub: ok, we access a NULL pointer
[12:35] <seb128> but where?
[12:35] <pitti> jdub: but I need a stack trace to know where
[12:35] <jdub> now i'm looking for jbailey :)
[12:35] <pitti> jdub: DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nostrip,noopt debuild -us -uc -b
[12:35] <pitti> jdub: ^ in hal source dir
[12:36] <jdub> doing now :)
[12:36] <pitti> jdub: alternatively, if I can ssh in your box, I can debug this myself
[12:36] <pitti> jdub: but a proper stack trace is certainly helpful, thanks
[12:37] <jdub> meanwhile, my server is running breezy, and initramfs didn't like my md setup :)
[12:38] <doko> seb128: gnome-control-center, metacity, gnome-panel, gnome-python-extras need a rebuild?
[12:40] <sivang> pitti: what does nostrip, nooopt and -b do ?
[12:40] <pitti> sivang: nostrip = don't run strip on binaries (maintain debug symbols)
[12:40] <pitti> sivang: noopt = compile with -O0
[12:40] <cassidy> doko, have you also a problem with libcairo1?
[12:41] <pitti> sivang: -b : build only debs, no source package
[12:42] <siretart> whops
[12:42] <siretart> (EE) I810(0) vm86() syscall generated signal 4.
[12:43] <seb128> doko: no, why?
[12:43] <sivang> pitti: thx
[12:43] <doko> seb128: mind to look at the build logs?
[12:43] <doko> seb128: still libcairo1 deps
[12:44] <seb128> doko: what about them?
[12:44] <doko> seb128: FTBFS
[12:44] <seb128> doko: they didn't build for random reason (libpixmap.la, daniels who broke GTK, etc)
[12:44] <cassidy> seb128,   gnome-control-center: Depends: libcairo1 (>= 0.6.0) but it is not installable
[12:44] <seb128> doko: I know, they need to be retried
[12:44] <seb128> cassidy: that's know, please be patient, that's an unstable version and a transition
[12:45] <cassidy> seb128, no problem. thx
[12:46] <jdub> Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.
[12:46] <jdub> 0x08068f2a in battery_refresh (d=0x8088a90, handler=0x8079d54) at acpi.c:393
[12:46] <jdub> 393                             if (strcmp (reporting_unit, "mWh") == 0) {
[12:46] <jdub> pitti, seb128: ^^^ :)
[12:47] <seb128> can you put the bt on the same place you but the valgrind?
[12:47] <pitti> jdub: ok, thanks; so reporting_unit is NULL, I guess
[12:47] <jdub> ok, one sec
[12:47] <seb128> bah, pitti is on it, no need to duplicate :)
[12:47] <jdub> (how do i put a bt out to file in gdb?)
[12:48] <seb128> dunno, I just select/middle click usually :)
[12:49] <jdub> i've updated the valgrind output
[12:49] <jdub> pitti: need anything else?
[12:50] <hughsie> jdub: there was a fix for hal that checked for reporting_unit == NULL
[12:50] <pitti> jdub: should be fine, thanks
[12:50] <pitti> hughsie: I'll look in upstream cvs (well, on the arch supermirror, that is :-)
[12:51] <hughsie> pitti, there are *loads* of fixes for broken acpi in cvs hal
[12:51] <hughsie> trust me :-)
[12:51] <pitti> I know
[12:51] <pitti> but we can't update to the new upstream version any more
[12:51] <pitti> and I already applied a great deal of fixes
[12:52] <hughsie> pitti: n/p -- just look at the cvs history of hal/hald/acpi.c and you'll see the indervidual patches since 0.5.3
[12:53] <hughsie> 0.5.4 comes out tomorrow (joke) :-)
[12:56] <siretart> daniels: do you know if there are any open issues with i810 and multihead setups? are they supposed to work?
[12:56] <siretart> in breezy, that is
[12:57] <sivang> daniels: ping
[12:57] <daniels> sivang: mmm?
[12:57] <daniels> siretart: they should be OK, but your BIOS might be SIGILLing
[12:59] <siretart> daniels: woah. sounds great :/
[01:00] <sivang> daniels: actuall,y that would probably betterserved over #ubuntu, I have some issue with using a projector as a display - ok to ask you there?
[01:01] <daniels> sivang: you can ask me there if you like ...
[01:06] <sivang> daniels: well, since you are not logged there, I'll start here: Is anything special need be done to allow an ubuntu R50 laptop to use the projector as a display, or a second one on multihead configs?
[01:07] <daniels> sivang: that's got a radeon in it?
[01:09] <sivang> daniels: nvidia
[01:09] <sivang> daniels: erm, at least so I've been told by the laptop owner
[01:11] <daniels> sivang: errrrrr
[01:11] <daniels> sivang: probably won't work withou tthe binary driver, then
[01:11] <sivang> daniels: available through l-r-m ?
[01:11] <TheMuso> If it is a ThinkPad R50, it should be radeon.
[01:12] <daniels> sivang: yeah
[01:12] <sivang> daniels: k, thanks
[01:13] <michele> the r50 has a mobility radeon 7500 or 9000
[01:13] <michele> http://thinkwiki.org/wiki/Category:R50
[01:14] <mvo> ping jamesh
[01:23] <JaneW> is anybody else having problems with SLOW response on wiki.ubuntu.com?
[01:24] <pitti> JaneW: yes, that sucks
[01:24] <pitti> JaneW: btw, a question about LanguagePackRoadmap: most of the parts of it are implemented, but the ooo/moz integration isn't yet; how should this be reflected in the state?
[01:25] <pitti> JaneW: it's not completed yet, but deferred would only be true partly
[01:30] <pitti> fabbione: do you think that you still can update the kernel's alsa driver to 1.0.9b to fix that snd_pcm_drain race?
[01:33] <Mithrandir> so, grub in breezy doesn't work for me on this system
[01:34] <bob2> mjg59 has hot grub love
[01:34] <Mithrandir> well, hoary's grub worked
[01:34] <pitti> Mithrandir: ubuntu6 works fine for me, btw
[01:35] <Mithrandir> pitti: if you run grub-install /dev/hda as well?
[01:35] <pitti> Mithrandir: yes, that's what I did, according to your mail
[01:36] <pitti> Mithrandir: but you didn't ask for positive replies on the ML
[01:36] <pitti> Mithrandir: amd64, two IDE hds
[01:36] <Mithrandir> pitti: uhm, huh?   I uploaded a new version yesterday building fine in my pbuilder. lamont? around?
[01:47] <Mithrandir> siretart: that's a buildd admin, not an ftp-master.
[01:48] <siretart> Mithrandir: oh. sorry. who are buildd admins for i386?
[01:48] <pitti> hughsie, jdub: odd, I already have the "if (reporting_unit == NULL)" check
[01:49] <pitti> jdub: what is your hal version?
[01:49] <pitti> oh, nevermind
[01:50] <pitti> hughsie: the check in hal is not sufficient; it is in battery_refresh_poll, but not in battery_refresh...
[01:51] <fabbione> pitti: i doubt.. you will need to talk with Ben C.
[01:51] <pitti> ok
[01:51] <fabbione> pitti: we are too far into freeze status
[01:52] <pitti> darn
[01:52] <pitti> fabbione: last time I asked you about this you thought that we already had the latest version :-(
[01:52] <pitti> ok, anyway, we just leave the workaround in esound then
[01:52] <fabbione> pitti: ask Ben, perhaps he has no objections.. personally neither do i
[01:53] <pitti> ok, will do
[01:53] <fabbione> pitti: i don't write the release schedule :)
[01:54] <hughsie> pitti: sorry, having lunch.
[01:54] <hughsie> pitti: is it in cvs now?
[01:54] <pitti> hughsie: nevermind, I send a patch to the hal list
[01:54] <pitti> hughsie: no, jdub's bug is not in hal cvs
[01:54] <hughsie> pitti, okay, thanks.
[01:56] <pitti> Hi jordi!
[01:58] <hughsie> pitti, you said you sent a mail to hal-devel? I'm subscribed and got no email :-(
[01:58] <pitti> hughsie: no, I will send it (just finished the patch); I usually send to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[01:59] <hughsie> sure, okay. got me worried there :-)
[02:01] <Mithrandir> heh, go cdebconf:
[02:01] <Mithrandir> --> INPUT critical debconf/priority
[02:01] <Mithrandir> <-- 0 question will be asked
[02:01] <Mithrandir> --> GO
[02:01] <Mithrandir> <-- 100 internal error
[02:03] <pitti> hughsie: sent
[02:04] <hughsie> pitti: thanks, i'll try to fast-track it before 0.5.4 comes out
[02:17] <JaneW> hi Saba_Z
[02:17] <Saba_Z> Hi
[02:21] <Saba_Z> DNS and DHCP configurations are completed. Now, I'm working on the "add machine" script of samba.
[02:22] <Saba_Z> The script should add the new machine in DNS configuration file, and introduce MAC address of the new machine to DHCP to set as a host.
[02:22] <fabbione> hi Saba_Z
[02:23] <Saba_Z> hi fabbione
[02:23] <fabbione> neat :)
[02:23] <fabbione> sounds very nice
[02:24] <Saba_Z> I think I can send a deb package in 2 days.
[02:24] <fabbione> Saba_Z: that would be awesome.. can you do in less than 24hours?
[02:25] <Saba_Z> ok, but I can't test Squid. It's partly ready but not tested.
[02:26] <fabbione> Saba_Z: ok that would be fine for me. Please publish asap your .orig.tar.gz .diff.gz and .dsc
[02:44] <bob2> haha https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OptimizingNvidia
[02:44] <tseng> bob2: we should merge the wiki with gentoo forums
[02:44] <bob2> hahahahaha
[02:45] <tseng> dont want to miss out on this kind of invaluable info
[02:45] <tseng> #
[02:45] <tseng> #
[02:45] <tseng> Videoram: for example if you have 128MB then 128*1024=131072
[02:45] <tseng> ^ cool.
[02:46] <bob2> I liked this diff:
[02:46] <bob2> = Fix permissions errors and increase performance =
[02:46] <bob2> According to the [http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=300434 following thread]  it will not only fix any permissions errors but also increase the performance!
[02:46] <daniels> can we please delete optimizing nvidia?
[02:46] <bob2> {{{
[02:46] <bob2> sudo chmod 0666 /dev/nvidia*
[02:46] <bob2> }}}
[02:46] <bob2> and
[02:46] <bob2> {{{
[02:46] <bob2> sudo chown root /dev/nvidia*
[02:46] <bob2> }}}
[02:46] <Treenaks> bob2: yes, and then reboot.. yay udev
[02:46] <bob2> stop opressing the users
[02:46] <tseng> haha
[02:46] <tseng> so that is why linspire runs as root
[02:46] <tseng> performance!
[02:46] <bob2> making files writable by everyone INCREASES PERFORMANCE
[02:47] <bob2> 'tis gone
[02:48] <Treenaks> tseng: of course! that must be it!
[02:48] <sivang> daniels: do we have any automatic "workaround" for the old geforce 2 gpu problem? (for instance mine is not recognized anymore by the current l-r-m driver)
[02:48] <daniels> sivang: not as such, no
[02:49] <sivang> daniels: do we have the driver downloaded as a package from the repo?
[02:49] <fabbione> sivang: mail nvidia support
[02:49] <daniels> sivang: not at the moment
[02:50] <sivang> fabbione: why? They are still releasing the driver , don't they? (i.e., we just need to have the packages ? O:-) )
[02:50] <fabbione> sivang: uh?? if their latest driver doesn't support it..
[02:52] <daniels> fabbione: nvidia got split into two streams -- 'normal' and 'legacy'
[02:52] <fabbione> daniels: ahhh..
[02:53] <fabbione> didn't know that
[02:53] <fabbione> just to make things more complicated
[02:53] <fabbione> and of course the 2 drivers can't be installed at the same time
[02:53] <daniels> right
[02:53] <daniels> yay nvidia
[02:54] <mjg59> daniels: Is the legacy driver actually available yet?
[02:55] <HiddenWolf> *g* what a mess
[02:55] <daniels> mjg59: i think so
[02:56] <mjg59> daniels: It's not obviously on their website
[02:57] <daniels> mjg59: no, I can't find it either
[02:58] <daniels> \o/
[02:58] <mjg59> Go nvidia
[02:58] <Mithrandir> heh
[02:59] <Mithrandir> interesting failure:
[02:59] <Mithrandir> first, init complains about not finding /sys/bus/scsi/devices/*/type
[02:59] <Mithrandir> then, it fails to load the "unknown" module, and fails to mount /dev/hda1 on /root
[02:59] <Mithrandir> something is on a bit of crack here
[03:00] <sivang> damn nvidia
[03:14] <siretart> bob2: ping. updated lyx packages? :) *duck*
[03:27] <siretart> where did libxp-dev go? was it relocated?
[03:29] <siretart> seems to be gone. xpdf need this. Help!
[03:32] <siretart> hm lesstif2-dev seems broken
[03:33] <lathiat> mjg59: yes, the 'legacy' driver is just version 6629
[03:33] <lathiat> dan	too
[03:34] <lathiat> daniels: too, rather
[03:34] <lathiat> (its not very obvious)
[03:38] <mjg59> Oh holy christ.
[03:39] <mjg59> Why do Nvidia think it's a good idea to have an excessively fat guy all over their website?
[03:40] <lathiat> now now mjg59
[03:41] <mjg59> Really. He doesn't make me think "Oh, this company must make fast graphics cards"
[03:42] <lathiat> but it can render that whoel guy really fast
[03:43] <[SemTeX] > mjg59: it's a reminder "don't game too much, or you'll look like this soon"
[03:44] <siretart> lol
[03:45] <Treenaks> [SemTeX] : the "Gamer" stereotype"
[03:45] <lathiat> haha
[03:46] <mjg59> NNNNNGH.
[03:46] <mjg59> static struct pci_device_id nv_pci_table[]  = {
[03:46] <mjg59>     {
[03:46] <mjg59>         .vendor      = PCI_VENDOR_ID_NVIDIA,
[03:46] <mjg59>         .device      = PCI_ANY_ID,
[03:46] <mjg59>         .subvendor   = PCI_ANY_ID,
[03:46] <mjg59>         .subdevice   = PCI_ANY_ID,
[03:46] <mjg59>         .class       = (PCI_CLASS_DISPLAY_VGA << 8),
[03:46] <mjg59> LIES.
[03:47] <siretart> poor mjg59
[03:47] <mjg59> rm_is_legacy_device is the important function
[03:47] <mjg59> Guess which part of the module it's in - the open bit or the closed bit?
[03:48] <lathiat> i'll take 3 guesses
[03:48] <\sh> closed
[03:48] <lathiat> the closed bit?
[03:48] <mjg59> Go on, guess
[03:48] <mjg59> YES
[03:48] <mjg59> HURRAH
[03:48] <siretart> :/
[03:48] <lathiat> WE ALL LOVE NVIDIA
[03:48] <\sh> i won another bugging night with mjg59
[03:48] <mjg59> So there is in fact NO WAY OF TELLING whether a card is legacy or not without loading the driver, failing and then loading the legacy driver
[03:49] <Treenaks> mjg59: "intelligent design"
[03:49] <mjg59> Thanks, nvidia. Thnvidia.
[03:49] <\sh> u know what? I'm compiling now gwydion stuff for over 2 hours
[03:49] <Mithrandir> mjg59: everybody knows actually _USING_ the PCI IDs are for wussies.
[03:50] <daniels> mjg59: keep a list of legacy devices by pci id and explicitly redirect them to the legacy driver, else try the new one
[03:51] <mjg59> daniels: Which means getting the PCI IDs of the legacy devices
[03:51] <daniels> mjg59: which is in their README
[03:51] <mjg59> Which would be trivial if, say, they'd actually written a proper module
[03:51] <Treenaks> mjg59: they're nvidia, what do you expect?
[03:52] <mjg59> Oh, so they are. Ok, that makes life easier.
[03:52] <daniels> ftp://download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86/1.0-7664/README.txt
[03:52] <mjg59> Goddamned documentation.
[03:53] <mjg59> I still don't entirely understand why it doesn't use the pci_device_id struct properly
[03:53] <mjg59> Or, indeed, why their numbering system seems to have no sense whatsoever.
[03:54] <fabbione> infinity: can you please try to kick back mysql-dfsg-4.1 on ppc ??
[03:55] <fabbione> the FTBFS is WEIRD..
[03:55] <fabbione> given that there is no code change at all
[03:57] <doko> daniels: what's the replacement for xlibs-pic?
[03:58] <daniels> doko: ... what were you using it for?
[03:59] <doko> daniels: metacity depends on it, but maybe seb128 is already working on it
[04:00] <seb128> nop
[04:02] <seb128> does somebody knows a way to get back some files on an ext3 parition after a rm -f?
[04:02] <daniels> OH ARGH
[04:02] <daniels> seb128: can gnome-pkg-tools PLEASE tank the build if control has been modified and control.in not or something
[04:02] <lathiat> seb128: yeh uh hrmm ouch, use reiserfs its much easier with reiser. :)
[04:03] <seb128> lathiat: not for me, and it's already done :p
[04:03] <seb128> daniels: you have overwritten your control changes? :)
[04:03] <lathiat> easier as in its easier to recover shit ;p
[04:03] <fabbione> seb128: yes.. umount the partition and grep on the device for something you think it was in that file...
[04:03] <lathiat> theres e2undel and recover.. nfi how good
[04:03] <lathiat> or that.. if its text
[04:03] <fabbione> seb128: than use a forensic tool to rebuild the inode chains to recover the file
[04:04] <fabbione> lathiat: ext3 doesn't have undelete
[04:04] <daniels> seb128: control.in is for losers
[04:04] <seb128> "forensic tool" what's this?
[04:05] <fabbione> seb128: tools to do data recovery or security analisis of a disk OFFLINE
[04:05] <seb128> ok, thanks
[04:05] <fabbione> but if you didn't umount your partition immediatly..
[04:05] <lathiat> yeh well i was lucky that
[04:05] <fabbione> you already said KTHXBYE to your data
[04:05] <doko> daniels: use control.m4
[04:05] <lathiat> i was using reiserfs at the time i screwed up
[04:05] <lathiat> so i ran a --rebuild-tree -S
[04:05] <lathiat> and it foudn them alla nd stuck them in /lost+found
[04:05] <daniels> doko: are you drunk?
[04:06] <ogra_> daniels: its 4pm here...
[04:06] <ogra_> daniels: he shouldnt be drunk yet :)
[04:06] <ogra_> (but with doko you never know ;) )
[04:07] <doko> ogra_: go and fix gcompis ... ;-)
[04:07] <ogra_> :p
[04:09] <doko> daniels: do you look at metacity, or have a hint, what to replace?
[04:09] <daniels> doko: already fixed it
[04:09] <doko> daniels: thanks :)
[04:16] <dieman> fabbione: im still harassing dell on that damn keyboard issue
[04:16] <dieman> fabbione: debian sarge users are starting to show up on the list complaining too.
[04:16] <fabbione> dieman: meh dude.. do you expect me to remember?
[04:16] <dieman> oh, you reassigned it :)
[04:16] <fabbione> what was that about?
[04:16] <dieman> 12247 :)
[04:17] <dieman> you touched the bug ~3 minutes ago ;)
[04:17] <fabbione> dieman: from today ENOTMYPROBLEM...
[04:17] <dieman> cool
[04:17] <fabbione> dieman: i did a 270 bugs reassignment in a shot..
[04:17] <dieman> you got other things to do?
[04:17] <fabbione> no idea your was there...
[04:17] <dieman> ahh
[04:17] <dieman> leaving? or get told to do other work?
[04:18] <fabbione> it was [ Select All ]   * Reassing<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[ KTHXBYE ]
[04:18] <dieman> heh
[04:18] <fabbione> other work...
[04:18] <fabbione> i am not leaving
[04:18] <dieman> cool
[04:18] <fabbione> you can't get rid of me
[04:18] <pitti> BenC: here?
[04:19] <jane__> I am going to have to keep sending the update message until the Breezy Goals are updated, and progressed from WIP and pending
[04:19] <JaneW> please
[04:20] <pitti> 13:24:58 <pitti>      JaneW: btw, a question about LanguagePackRoadmap: most of the parts of it are implemented, but the ooo/moz integration isn't yet; how should this be reflected in the state?
[04:20] <pitti> 13:25:19 <pitti> JaneW: it's not completed yet, but deferred would only be true partly
[04:20] <pitti> JaneW: any  idea what do do about these roadmap specs?
[04:20] <fabbione> JaneW: start to treat people that they will get the "bag of death" from Mataro', if they don't update the wiki :)
[04:20] <JaneW> pitti: oic, thanks (my line's been terrible today)
[04:21] <pitti> JaneW: mine too, don't worry :-)
[04:21] <pitti> argh, no deathbags any more, please
[04:21] <JaneW> fabbione: nice idea, I'll start preparing them now... I think I have some tofu...
[04:21] <pitti> mmmmmmrrghhaaargh
[04:22] <JaneW> pitti: what we are doing when as much of a goal has been implemented as is going to be, we move it to green, and then add a line in the deferred table detailing the section that didn't get done and isn;t going to be done now...
[04:22] <JaneW> pitti: see EarlyUserSpace etc...
[04:22] <pitti> JaneW: ok, thanks, will do that
[04:23] <pitti> maybe we manage the firefox bit, too
[04:23] <pitti> carlos: ping; any luck with the ffox extraction?
[04:23] <jane_> pitti: many thanks :) let me know if you can't or e-mail me and I'll do it later (when my line is more reliable)
[04:24] <carlos> pitti, I did some updates to the wiki. It's only missing the final steps to introduce the updates from Rosetta
[04:24] <carlos> pitti, it should be ready today
[04:24] <JaneW> lol ok I'll stick to this one
[04:24] <pitti> carlos: oh, you are already that far?
[04:24] <pitti> carlos: merely exporting the po files would already be a great step forward
[04:24] <carlos> pitti, I did last week already, but I lost all the text so it's a matter of remember what I wrote :-)
[04:24] <pitti> carlos: I thought the updates would be performed separately in a langpack builder
[04:24] <pitti> ?
[04:25] <pitti> ouch
[04:25] <carlos> pitti, I'm talking about the spec
[04:25] <carlos> well, the spec is more or less the script as I have there all commands we need to execute
[04:25] <pitti> ah, ok
[04:25] <carlos> pitti, if you want, we can start producing the .po files now
[04:25] <carlos> pitti, I have that part documented
[04:25] <pitti> carlos: would be cool
[04:26] <pitti> carlos: do you want to do the ffox mods or shall I?
[04:26] <carlos> pitti, could you take a look at the spec then?
[04:26] <pitti> sure
[04:26] <pitti> carlos: in some minutes?
[04:26] <carlos> pitti, I'm not editing it atm
[04:26] <pitti> no, I need some  minutes to finish my current task
[04:26] <carlos> pitti, and the .po creation part should be more or less finished so, read it when you have some time to do it
[04:26] <carlos> ok
[04:26] <carlos> :-)
[04:26] <infinity> fabbione : mysql-dfsg-4.1 failed the same way the second time, looks like you broke it.
[04:27] <pitti> carlos: what was the URL again?
[04:27] <doko> pitti: btw, did the sdf files arrive in rookery?
[04:27] <carlos> pitti, https://wiki.launchpad.canonical.com/RosettaFirefoxAndOpenOfficeSupport
[04:27] <pitti> doko: in rookery? by which route?
[04:27] <pitti> carlos: merci
[04:33] <HiddenWolf> omg
[04:33] <HiddenWolf> ubuntu.com, canonical.com, launchpad.com, and you still need a wiki.launchpad.canonical.com? ;)
[04:33] <HiddenWolf> .com / .org
[04:34] <HiddenWolf> when that fridge idea gets off the ground, it'd better include a big project sitemap. :)
[04:37] <doko> pitti: OOo2 build
[04:37] <doko> checking for gtk+-2.0 >= 1.3.13 ... Package xfixes was not found in the pkg-config search path. Perhaps you should add the directory containing `xfixes.pc' to the PKG_CONFIG_PATH environment variable Package 'xfixes', required by 'GDK', not found
[04:37] <doko> configure: error: Library requirements (gtk+-2.0 >= 1.3.13 ) not met; consider adjusting the PKG_CONFIG_PATH environment variable if your libraries are in a nonstandard prefix so pkg-config can find them.
[04:38] <doko> seb128, daniels: ^^^ any idea, what `xfixes.pc' is
[04:38] <pitti> doko: ah, lemme look
[04:38] <daniels> doko: sebarino already fixed that, just needs to be built with a new libgtk2.0-dev
[04:38] <seb128> libxfixes
[04:38] <seb128> doko: you want gtk 2.8.0-1ubuntu2
[04:38] <doko> ok
[04:40] <pitti> doko: hm, the latest tarball does not look significantly different from the previous ones
[04:40] <doko> ahh, yes, that should change with -12 ...
[04:45] <pitti> infinity: can you please check that pkgstriptranslations 14 is installed in all buildds?
[04:46] <pitti> infinity: this version is supposed to strip off OO.o2 translation files, but that didn't happen
[04:47] <infinity> pitti : Uhm, 14 is ancient, it certainly should be in all the chroots.  I'll check anyway.
[04:47] <pitti> infinity: could also be a bug in pkgstriptranslations; but thanks for checking
[04:50] <doko> seb128: ../../../lib/libwx_gtk2u_core-2.6.so: undefined reference to `pango_x_get_context'
[04:50] <doko> collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
[04:50] <seb128> doko: what package is that?
[04:50] <doko> only on i386, not on amd64 and powerpc
[04:50] <doko> wxwidgets2.6
[04:50] <seb128> what version of gtk?
[04:51] <infinity> pitti : It's current in all 12 chroots.
[04:51] <doko> 2.something
[04:52] <doko> I don't know, it did work 2 weeks ago
[04:52] <pitti> infinity: ok, thanks
[04:52] <mjg59> seb128: #13970 - any chance of working that in?
[04:53] <infinity> doko : I'll retry it, it probably biult against a sketchy version of GTK.
[04:53] <doko> ok
[04:54] <seb128> mjg59: should be easy, I'll have a try on it when I'm uptodate with GNOME 2.11.92
[04:54] <mjg59> seb128: Rock, thanks
[04:55] <seb128> np
[04:58] <pitti> fabbione: thanks for reassigning some linux bugs from me :-)
[05:00] <fabbione> pitti: ehehe
[05:02] <JaneW> mvo: what the status of systemupgradetool?
[05:03] <fabbione> infinity: i think ppc buildd's are having issues...
[05:03] <infinity> This is news?
[05:04] <infinity> But your MySQL failure isn't the usual "PPC buildds segv" thing, cause it failed identically both times.
[05:04] <infinity> So, uhm, try again.
[05:04] <mvo> JaneW: deferred
[05:04] <fabbione> nope
[05:04] <fabbione> infinity: the second time it's 3k
[05:04] <fabbione> infinity: sort of impossible to be the same log as 26k
[05:05] <fabbione> and there are no ppc changes there...
[05:05] <fabbione> so it must build
[05:05] <JaneW> mvo: ok.
[05:05] <fabbione> and if it doesn't i blame any of its build-dep
[05:06] <infinity> Er, I saw two identical logs.
[05:06] <fabbione> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/m/mysql-dfsg-4.1/4.1.12-1ubuntu1/ <-
[05:06] <fabbione> one is 26K and one is 3K
[05:07] <fabbione> i find hard to believe that the first gzip run was sooo bad...
[05:07] <infinity> Oh, the other identical log hasn't been uploaded yet.
[05:07] <infinity> Ignore the 3k log.
[05:08] <fabbione> infinity: let's wait and see also for mysql-dfsg_4.0
[05:08] <infinity> Oooor... Maybe I'm on crack.
[05:08] <infinity> Feh.
[05:08] <infinity> I must be half asleep.
[05:08] <infinity> I blame the time.
[05:10] <fabbione> elmo: ping?
[05:10] <elmo> ?
[05:10] <fabbione> elmo: for all the stuff sitting in NEW, i absolutely need xbitmaps...
[05:11] <fabbione> do you think you can manage it by tomorrow?
[05:11] <elmo> for main or universe?
[05:11] <fabbione> and i did fix the copyright file on all the others...
[05:11] <fabbione> universe is fine
[05:11] <pitti> elmo: can you please sync dutch postgresql-7.4 and postgresql-8.0 (the latter from incoming)?
[05:11] <daniels> elmo: main
[05:11] <JaneW> pitti: I have updated languagepackroadmap for you...
[05:11] <fabbione> right now, i don't need anything in main of all that stuff
[05:11] <pitti> JaneW: merci
[05:12] <fabbione> elmo: and if you can kindly sync xen-2.0.6 from Debian to our universe. i think 2.0.6 is in experimental
[05:12] <JaneW> chmj: is bluetoothsupport deferred in it's entirety, or has some of it been completed?
[05:12] <pitti> JaneW: hm, you mean on the BreezyGoals page?
[05:13] <JaneW> pitti: yes may take a few hours to laod the page though ;)
[05:13] <pitti> JaneW: it reloaded, but no changes; well, I'll try again in some minutes
[05:13] <pitti> JaneW: I hope to add Firefox POT export today, so I waited...
[05:14] <JaneW> check now...
[05:14] <chmj> JaneW: no
[05:14] <JaneW> it was waiting on my side
[05:14] <chmj> JaneW: some of it has been completed
[05:14] <JaneW> chmj: we need the completed parts listed with 'imlemented' status, the rest must be moved down to the deferred table
[05:15] <pitti> JaneW: cool :-)
[05:16] <chmj> JaneW: ok
[05:16] <JaneW> the WIP and Pending goals *must* move
[05:17] <JaneW> pitti: please remind me why AudioInfrastructure can't be marked complete?
[05:18] <pitti> JaneW: well, I actually fixed that bug this morning...
[05:18] <pitti> JaneW: so now we could call it complete
[05:18] <pitti> JaneW: shall I update?
[05:19] <JaneW> yay, I'll do it... so nothing's defrerred then?
[05:19] <pitti> JaneW: no :-)
[05:19] <JaneW> :))
[05:19] <pitti> YAY
[05:19] <JaneW> the most co-operative person today...
[05:21] <JaneW> anyone else wanna Go Green?
[05:21] <pitti> infinity: wise decision :-) sleep well
[05:22] <daniels> JaneW: i have XRoadmap sitting here waiting to be uploaded, just need the very final all-clear from mdz when he wakes up
[05:23] <JaneW> daniels: ok, he did say some of it was deferred...
[05:23] <daniels> JaneW: yeah, things sort of got a little more fluid after that
[05:24] <teprrr> hmm, so, what was the reason of libXrender.la and libXcursor.la removal? looks like sources still have those..
[05:24] <mvo> JaneW: what should we do with FindingPackages? It's 75% done and in the archive but the remaining bits need to be adressed in breey+1
[05:24] <daniels> teprrr: because libtool is pain, and causes build failures left, right and centre
[05:25] <daniels> speaking of bed ...
[05:25] <JaneW> mvo same as I said to pitti...
[05:25] <teprrr> daniels, so how kde stuff should be compiled then? or do you think kde will stop using libtool?
[05:25] <teprrr> uh, he's gone
[05:25] <JaneW> pitti: what we are doing when as much of a goal has been implemented as is going to be, we move it to green, and then add a line in the deferred table detailing the section that didn't get done and isn;t going to be done now...
[05:25] <JaneW> pmvo^
[05:25] <JaneW> mvo even ^
[05:26] <JaneW> mvo: make sense?
[05:26] <mvo> JaneW: yes, that makes sense, thanks
[05:27] <mvo> JaneW: should I move it to green myself? or do you want to do it?
[05:27] <ogra_> gah since when does xorg use xorg.conf in ~/ by default if it finds one youi just struggled for 1h to get my X wotking because i had a xorg.conf from another PC backed up in my home GRR
[05:28] <pitti> ogra_: erm, whose ~?
[05:28] <JaneW> mvo: either way, which is easier?
[05:28] <mvo> JaneW: if you already have it open for editing, go ahead :)
[05:28] <fabbione> infinity: i was right...
[05:28] <ogra_> pitti: mine
[05:28] <JaneW> mvo: if you want me to do it please give me details of what's deferred
[05:28] <fabbione> something in mysql-dfsg-* B-D is broken on ppc
[05:29] <fabbione> infinity: also mysql-dfsg_4.0 is FTBFS
[05:29] <fabbione> and 4.1 keeps failing in different ways
[05:29] <ogra_> pitti: i have a xorg.conf for my laptop in my ~/ ... apparently gdm reads that and i got very odd glu errors (since my lappie is nv and my desktop is mga)
[05:30] <pitti> ah, gdm, ok
[05:30] <pitti> Hi jbailey
[05:31] <jbailey> Heya Martin!
[05:31] <ogra_> pitti: startx starts X but chokes with weird xlib errors... as soon as i rename the file to xorg.cong.bak, everything works :)
[05:31] <ogra_> conf indeed
[05:32] <elmo> fabbione: there's a bunch of these were not all the copyright stuff is included, and/or the original has no copyright in the cource
[05:33] <fabbione> elmo: only one has no copyright in the source and daniels told me that upstream agreed to place all of them as TOG
[05:34] <elmo> unless upstream == original author, upstream doesn't get to do that
[05:34] <fabbione> elmo: and for the copyright i did copy paste from the source code.. which one did i miss?
[05:35] <fabbione> elmo: daniels said to do that way as they agreed upstream to do it.. no idea if the author was involved but given that the same code was in xfree86 and xorg.. it should be ok
[05:35] <pitti> BenC: would you consider updating the kernel alsa driver to 1.0.9b? they fixed some serious bugs
[05:36] <pitti> BenC: and this version is out for over a month now
[05:36] <elmo> fabbione: yah huh
[05:36] <pitti> BenC: so it shouldn't break much
[05:36] <elmo> anyway, the last one I noticed was xclock
[05:36] <elmo> there were some others, but I didn't take notes, and none of them are particularly serious
[05:37] <fabbione> elmo: i found some sources with 3 licences in it.. but i am sure all of them are DFSG..
[05:37] <fabbione> elmo: the worst case is missing the Copyright: foo or Copyright: bar
[05:37] <JaneW> ok I need to go, please all update goals and progress to implemented what is done, and defer what hasn't made it. Thanks :)
[05:37] <fabbione> where foo or bar are company names
[05:38] <fabbione> nobody did restrict the code
[05:38] <elmo> fabbione: dude, you can't leave out licenses because they're all  DFSG
[05:39] <elmo> Clock.c has two very distinct licenses, not just with different company names
[05:39] <elmo> I know it's unfair that the copyright gets more closely examined, but that's just one of the side effects of splitting
[05:40] <Robot101> anyone know why hald causes a BUG() in 2.6.12-6-686?
[05:40] <fabbione> elmo: if i missed a licence, i did it by mistake.. not because i wanted to
[05:41] <lathiat> pitti: notifications daemons arrow is broken if you have a higher dpi
[05:41] <lathiat> pitti: you end up with two
[05:41] <pitti> uh, mvo ^ ?
[05:41] <Robot101> http://rafb.net/paste/results/D1zBgW98.html
[05:41] <fabbione> elmo: where did you find the second licence?
[05:41] <pitti> mvo: for the arrow position calculation, do you rely on some libnotify numbers or how do you do that?
[05:42] <fabbione> elmo: ah ok.. i did look at xclock.c..
[05:42] <fabbione> elmo: didn't see the other one.. ok REJECT IT
[05:42] <mvo> lathiat: can you do a screenshot and file a bug please?
[05:42] <lathiat> i mean like
[05:42] <fabbione> elmo: i will reupload as soon as i see the mail from you
[05:42] <lathiat> tghe arrow is right
[05:42] <lathiat> but the actual drawing of the arrow
[05:42] <lathiat> on the popup
[05:42] <lathiat> you en dup with two
[05:42] <lathiat> and the window isnt hinted
[05:42] <mvo> pitti: I used the code that is available in notification-daemon and made it a bit smarter about arrows close to the right border
[05:42] <lathiat> its just a big square
[05:43] <mvo> lathiat: and assign the bug to me?
[05:43] <lathiat> mvo: ok
[05:43] <lathiat> also, we have no python-dbus
[05:44] <hughsie> pitti: you get my mail?
[05:44] <pitti> hughsie: no, I check now
[05:45] <hughsie> pitti: could you test this for me, and tell me if it works?
[05:48] <pitti> hughsie: if you talk about the patch, jdub experienced the crash, so he should test it
[05:48] <hughsie> jdub: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.freedesktop.hal/2998 - could you try that please
[05:48] <hughsie> thanks pitti.
[05:48] <fabbione> elmo: thanks.. reuploading now
[05:48] <pitti> hughsie: patch looks good at first sight
[05:50] <hughsie> pitti: thanks. This is the *billionth* acpi bug we've tried to fix
[05:50] <hughsie> acpi is so broken
[05:50] <elmo> THIS IS SO MUCH FUN
[05:50] <pitti> hughsie: still better to fix it in hal than to fix it in a dozen other packages :-)
[05:51] <hughsie> pitti: i know. everyone's slowly agreeing with that
[05:52] <pitti> just to reassure you :-)
[05:52] <fabbione> elmo: can you please install mysql-dfsg and mysql-dfsg-4.1 BuildDeps on davis?
[05:52] <hughsie> pitti: altho i still get angry emails from creators of bespoke software that does one specific thing just for apm or pmu.
[05:52] <hughsie> oss people get so protective :-)
[05:54] <elmo> fabbione: done, just also dist-upgrading
[05:55] <fabbione> elmo: perfect.. thanks
[05:56] <elmo> (done)
[05:56] <fabbione> OH JEEEEEEE... another DoS...
[05:56] <fabbione> somebody doesn't want me on the net...
[05:56] <lathiat> nice
[05:57] <lathiat> you should get a cl04k
[05:57] <fabbione> lathiat: they can't drop me off... but they can slow me down a lot
[05:57] <lathiat> heh
[05:57] <fabbione> the NAT table just saturate to death with their nmap scans
[06:00] <pitti> carlos: with your recipe I don't get a standard .po file header - is that important for you?
[06:00] <carlos> pitti, you get a standard one but without real data
[06:00] <carlos> pitti, that's a problem with pootle's tools
[06:00] <carlos> we will need to fix it later
[06:00] <carlos> pitti, and you will get a really huge comment
[06:01] <pitti> carlos: so the mere msgcat'ed one is enough?
[06:01] <pitti> carlos: shall I filter out the comments?
[06:01] <carlos> pitti, I'm not sure
[06:01] <pitti> carlos: I mean just the huge initial comment
[06:01] <carlos> pitti, the comments are sometimes useful for translators
[06:01] <pitti> carlos: not the per-msg commetns
[06:02] <carlos> pitti, if you can do it easily.. it would be good
[06:02] <carlos> yes
[06:02] <pitti> hm, they aren't generated by pootle
[06:03] <pitti> msgcat blows away the .po headers
[06:03] <fabbione> infinity: ping?
[06:03] <carlos> pitti, all headers are the same
[06:03] <carlos> pitti, default vaules + encoding set to UTF-8
[06:06] <pitti> carlos: hm, comment filtering is not that trivial; FWIW, they don't actually hurt, I guess
[06:07] <carlos> pitti, no, they don't hurt
[06:09] <pitti> carlos: it is ok that firefox generates the POT and m-firefox-locale-all (and a few others) generate the matching po files?
[06:09] <carlos> pitti, no
[06:10] <carlos> both .pot and .po files should be included into the same translations.tar.gz
[06:10] <carlos> and also, to regenerate the language packs, we need the .pot files
[06:10] <pitti> carlos: but I don't have the translations in the ffox package
[06:11] <pitti> carlos: and we don't have an up to date en-US.jar in m-f-l-a
[06:11] <carlos> pitti, that's why I asked you to copy the en-US.jar file into the locale-all
[06:11] <fabbione> elmo: can you please kick back mysql-dfsg on ppc? i think one buildd is not behaving properly.
[06:11] <pitti> argh, no
[06:11] <pitti> carlos: that's evil
[06:11] <fabbione> elmo: mysql-dfsg-4.1 failed 3 times and than succeeded
[06:11] <carlos> pitti, we talked about that...
[06:12] <pitti> carlos: there  is not just m-f-l-a, there are a bunch of other source pkgs with translations
[06:12] <carlos> I need that file to get a .pot file
[06:12] <carlos> pitti, look at it as the special files that OO needs
[06:12] <pitti> carlos: we need to collect the generated pot and po files from the translation tarballs
[06:12] <pitti> carlos: not copy around files in the source package
[06:12] <carlos> without that, I cannot go from the .po file to the firefox language pack
[06:13] <pitti> carlos: same thing, we can msgmerge
[06:13] <elmo> fabbione: given back
[06:13] <fabbione> elmo: thanks
[06:13] <fabbione> YAY FOR THE SPAM
[06:13] <carlos> pitti, msgmerge? with what?
[06:14] <pitti> carlos: moz2po, msgmerge with rosetta data, po2moz
[06:14] <pitti> in an arbitrary m-f locale source packagre
[06:14] <carlos> pitti, no, that's impossible
[06:14] <pitti> hm?
[06:14] <carlos> pitti, po2moz needs a big list of .po files
[06:14] <carlos> not just one .po file
[06:14] <carlos> as Rosetta gives to us
[06:15] <pitti> carlos: but msgmerge can certainly cope with that
[06:15] <Nafallo> seb128: could we update screem after breezy get's released? new stable upstream since May. kthxbye.
[06:15] <pitti> it just merges the relevant part into the appropriate file
[06:15] <carlos> pitti, sure, but if you have the .pot files
[06:15] <fabbione> elmo: yeah.. it's definetely a problem with one of the ppc buildd.. it builds fine on davis too..
[06:15] <carlos> otherwise you will lose translations
[06:15] <pitti> hmmm
[06:15] <fabbione> elmo: thanks a lot dude..
[06:15] <pitti> carlos: but, we can't go around and manually maintain 7 copies of en-US.jar
[06:16] <pitti> carlos: that's crazy
[06:16] <seb128> Nafallo: why do you ask that to me?
[06:16] <carlos> pitti, There is another option, but that would mean that we don't have firefox language packs for Breezy
[06:16] <seb128> Nafallo: it has not been updated before freeze because new versions didn't work with gnome-menus 2.11 API
[06:16] <pitti> carlos: which one?
[06:16] <carlos> pitti, and is develop/improve pootle's scripts to be able to regenerate the language pack from a singe .po file
[06:17] <Nafallo> seb128: you where the last one that touched it ;-).
[06:17] <carlos> pitti, the .po file format has support to store all the meta information we need
[06:18] <Nafallo> seb128: hmm, oki. I try to figure out how to upload stuff with it, and the new release seems to have an upload druid ;-).
[06:18] <pitti> carlos: ok, so if we need the XPI, then let's store the XPI into the translation tarball
[06:18] <pitti> carlos: and grab the current one in the langpack builder
[06:18] <carlos> pitti, ugly, really ugly :-(
[06:18] <pitti> carlos: rather than manually copying around ~ 40 jar files (think about mozilla and tbird)
[06:18] <carlos> but you are the one that needs to cope with that....
[06:19] <pitti> carlos: right, but each translation has its own source apckage for moz and tbird, and there are still about 6 or 7 ffox l10n source packages
[06:19] <carlos> pitti, if you are happy with that solution, I'm happy too
[06:19] <pitti> carlos: so I can't generate a pot from, let's say de_DE.jar?
[06:20] <pitti> carlos: or, rather, update the translations in it with moz2po/msgmerge/po2moz
[06:20] <carlos> pitti, no, de_DE.jar does not have any english string
[06:21] <pitti> carlos: ok, then I change pkgstriptranslations again to store the XPI
[06:21] <pitti> carlos: unless you have another idea
[06:21] <carlos> pitti, what's our timeline?
[06:21] <pitti> it's h4ckish
[06:21] <carlos> we are in feature freeze already
[06:21] <pitti> carlos: for feature freeze? two weeks ago
[06:22] <carlos> pitti, to have language packs done
[06:22] <pitti> but since this doesn't affect the debs at all, I guess it's ok
[06:22] <pitti> carlos: I doubt that I can do that anytime soon
[06:22] <carlos> pitti, the .xpi export and the script to regenerate the language pack?
[06:23] <pitti> carlos: xpi export is fine
[06:23] <pitti> I'm doing it right now
[06:23] <carlos> pitti, then, what do you mean with "I doubt that I can do taht anytime soon"?
[06:24] <pitti> carlos: the machinery to produce updated ffox langpacks
[06:24] <pitti> that requires severe archive restructuring
[06:24] <pitti> and we can't do that for breezy
[06:24] <pitti> we can only manually generate xpis for breezy and manually update the l10n packages
[06:24] <pitti> for breezy+1 we need to generate the mozilla locale packages  completely synthetically
[06:25] <carlos> pitti, do you think that firefox will be done by hand for breezy?
[06:25] <carlos> ok
[06:25] <pitti> carlos: maybe, but not too often, I guess
[06:26] <Nafallo> seb128: I guess screem does not count as gnome (and has UVF exception)? that error where fixed three days after UVF ;-).
[06:26] <pitti> carlos: for breezy+1 we need to completely drop all those different moz/tbird/ffox locale source packages, I guess
[06:26] <seb128> Nafallo: nop
[06:26] <seb128> Nafallo: you can try to ping mdz with a rationnal of why updating
[06:27] <Nafallo> seb128: oki, I will merge it and try if I can find one :-)
[06:27] <Nafallo> seb128: thanx :-)
[06:27] <seb128> np
[06:28] <pitti> carlos: that means that m-f-l-a can't generate POTs during build; darn, why it needs en_US.xpi to generate a German translation? What did upstream drink when they invented this crap???
[06:28] <pitti> carlos: we can't seriously download a file from rookery on the buildd
[06:28] <carlos> pitti, firefox is not using .po files
[06:29] <pitti> carlos: I mean, why does moz2po need en-US.jar to generate de.po
[06:29] <pitti> from de_DE.xpi
[06:29] <carlos> pitti, my plan includes that Rosetta exports .xpi files for firefox I think it's doable
[06:29] <pitti> no, that wouldn't help
[06:29] <carlos> pitti, because de_DE.xpi does not includes any english string
[06:30] <pitti> carlos: can we do anything without having en_US.jar at that time?
[06:30] <pitti> carlos: i. e. generate some file that can later be merged against m-f.pot to produce a real de.po?
[06:31] <carlos> pitti, no
[06:31] <carlos> unless you want that people get msgids in German
[06:31] <pitti> carlos: ok, then we can't produce po files in breezy, just the pot
[06:31] <pitti> carlos: when we have a fully synthetic moz locale pkg builder, we can do this again
[06:32] <carlos> pitti, we could do that, but implies also changes in pootle
[06:32] <pitti> but I don't see how this should work with the current packages
[06:32] <carlos> instead of use the english string as msgid
[06:32] <carlos> we use the key name
[06:32] <carlos> but that makes difficult to maintain translations
[06:32] <pitti> carlos: we need a tool that merges the real pot and the pot with german msgid and empty msgstr to a real de.po
[06:33] <carlos> pitti, that's 100% impossible
[06:33] <carlos> to do that the msgids should be the same
[06:33] <pitti> #: linknotfound
[06:33] <pitti> msgid "Link not found: \""
[06:33] <pitti> msgstr ""
[06:33] <pitti> carlos: so "linknotfound" is the unique key?
[06:33] <carlos> yes
[06:34] <pitti> ok, so in theory we could knit together a valid de.po with the keys
[06:34] <pitti> so that we only need the m-f.pot for updating the moz l10n packages
[06:35] <carlos> pitti, and how the people knows what they need to translate?
[06:35] <pitti> carlos: from the pot?
[06:35] <carlos> linknotfound != Link not found: \"
[06:35] <pitti> msgid "Link not found: \""
[06:36] <pitti> that's the template
[06:36] <carlos> pitti, and the already existing translations? you need to link them to the .pot msgids
[06:36] <pitti> carlos: ok, lemme look at an actual output from de_DE.xpi first
[06:36] <carlos> ok
[06:37] <carlos> pitti, what about OO language packs? are they doable for breezy?
[06:38] <pitti> doko already uploaded a version that exports sdf files, and pkgstriaptranslations has been changed to export them
[06:40] <mdz> Nafallo: Burgundavia wanted a new screem; I said it was OK, but a proper request was never sent to James to sync the package
[06:40] <pitti> Hi mdz
[06:40] <mdz> hi
[06:41] <carlos> pitti, I don't understand that, I thought we agree on forget about .sdf files...
[06:41] <carlos> pitti, and recreate them on build time
[06:42] <seb128> mdz: hey
[06:42] <Nafallo> mdz: oki. I'll see what I can do :-). I guess it's still okey?
[06:42] <seb128> mdz: I've some new version requests, should I ping on IRC or mail you about them?
[06:42] <pitti> carlos: doko wasn't happy with that
[06:43] <carlos> doko, pitti, ok, is the spec up to date with this way to do it?
[06:43] <lathiat> fabbione: whoah
[06:44] <pitti> carlos: no, not really
[06:44] <hughsie> jdbu: ping?
[06:45] <hughsie> jdub: ping?
[06:45] <carlos> doko, pitti, mark needs to read the spec and approve it
[06:45] <carlos> doko, pitti so please, update that part
[06:45] <mdz> seb128: either way, but email is probably better because you can provide a longer explanation
[06:46] <pitti> doko: can you please update it since I never really understood the reason for doing it externally?
[06:47] <mjg59> mdz: I'd like to push irda-utils and wacom-tools to main, if possible - I'm working on getting them to autoconfigure hardware
[06:47] <mdz> mjg59: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuMainInclusionQueue
[06:47] <mdz> explains how it works
[06:48] <mjg59> mdz: Yeah. I just wanted to sound it out with you first - the wacom-tools one gets us tablet PC support out of the box, irda-utils is less necessary
[06:48] <mdz> while there's no particular deadline for moving packages to main, it is a bit late in the game for adding features
[06:48] <mdz> I'm assuming that in addition to moving to main, you would want them to become part of the default desktop
[06:49] <mjg59> mdz: Ideally
[06:53] <ogra> lamont-away, ?
[06:53] <lamont-away> dropped the SCC architectures
[06:53] <pitti> OMG, fabbione is in the XSF again? :-)
[06:54] <ogra> lamont-away, i'll add them in the end again... the update script times out on the SCC arches every second time i use it...
[06:54] <lamont-away> XSF?
[06:54] <fabbione> pitti: DIE!
[06:54] <fabbione> :P
[06:54] <ogra> X strike force
[06:54] <lamont-away> pitti: LOL
[06:54] <fabbione> lamont-away: it looks like ogra has problems with ports.ubuntu.com
[06:54] <pitti> lamont-away: current b-changes is scary :-)
[06:54] <lamont-away> ogra: I understand...
[06:54] <ogra> lamont-away, youre not the first one who complains ...
[06:55] <lamont-away> where did fabbione hide is shiny armor, I wonder....
[06:56] <lamont-away> infinity: so is mesa -0ubuntu5 going to still require some manual love to build?
[06:57] <fabbione> lamont-away: i wanted to be nice for the first time in my life..
[06:57] <fabbione> lamont-away: if that doesn't get fixed by the next upload, i will powerup the sodomotron :)
[06:57] <ogra> grumpf seb128 is overwriting /etc/gdm/factory-gdm.conf the only way to set a default theme for gdm ?
[06:58] <seb128> what about /etc/gdm/gdm.conf ?
[06:58] <ogra> seb128, both would require a overwrite...
[06:58] <fabbione> mdz: of all the little X apps, i miss only 4 that i will do tomorrow morning.
[06:58] <mdz> mjg59: I have doubts about there being enough time before preview to catch any problems caused by it
[06:58] <fabbione> mdz: i had to wait for others to enter archive as B-D
[06:58] <seb128> ogra: I don't do anything different from the Debian package anyway
[06:59] <seb128> ogra: what is the factory used for?
[06:59] <mdz> fabbione: thanks, will you also add the necessary deps to the metapackages?
[06:59] <fabbione> mdz: i am not sure if i can manage that by tomorrow..
[06:59] <fabbione> but i will look at what i can do
[06:59] <fabbione> one of the packages left is a royal PITA
[06:59] <ogra> seb128, no idea, i just looked into the package to see how to enable the edubuntu theme there... and i'm not really after overwriting conf files...
[07:00] <ogra> seb128, but it seems the only way... :/
[07:00] <seb128> ogra: change the gdm.conf to change the default theme, that's what we do
[07:00] <ogra> ok
[07:00] <mjg59> mdz: How about I quickly show you the code logic, and you can see what you think?
[07:01] <mjg59> I'm happy enough to defer the irda stuff. The wacom stuff would buy us rather a lot of love.
[07:01] <mjg59> (The code path should be tablet specific)
[07:02] <mdz> mjg59: I am available for persuasion
[07:02] <ogra> mjg59, wacom support will be in the next hal anyway...
[07:02] <ogra> do we really want to go our own path ?
[07:02] <mjg59> ogra: In what form? The serial devices need to be setup up. Will hal be doing that?
[07:02] <pitti> certainly not
[07:02] <ogra> mjg59, it will detect them and provide the info...
[07:02] <mjg59> Right. That's what I'm trying to sort here.
[07:02] <pitti> it can't, privilege-wise
[07:03] <ogra> mjg59, ah, ok, then you could adjust them later to read from hal :)
[07:03] <mjg59> ogra: It's one thing to present a known wacom device to the user, it's another to configure the system so it's presented at all
[07:03] <mdz> doko: why add gcc-3.3-doc to supported?  shouldn't we be able to move -3.3 to universe?
[07:04] <pitti> mdz: doesn't the kernel still build with 3.3?
[07:04] <fabbione> nope
[07:04] <fabbione> 3.4
[07:04] <pitti> oh, cool
[07:04] <mdz> doko: also, oo.o 1.x and dictionaries now moved to universe, thanks for your help
[07:04] <elmo> mdz: grub
[07:04] <mdz> elmo: breezy-changes
[07:05] <mjg59> mdz: We walk /sys/bus/pnp/devices looking for something that's WACf004 or WACf005 (which uniquely identify Wacom devices in tablet PCs). Then we check the resources and use setserial to configure an unused ttyS to refer to it.
[07:05] <doko> mdz: as long as gcc-3.3 is in, gcc-3.3 should be there as well. but grub and libpng have the b-d removed now
[07:05] <elmo> eww
[07:05] <mjg59> Then that serial port gets linked to /dev/wacom0 so X has a known point to grab it
[07:05] <seb128> elmo: please drop ximian-connector, it has been rename to evolution-exchange upstream
[07:06] <doko> elmo: it did survive an install and a boot
[07:07] <elmo> seb128: done
[07:07] <seb128> elmo: thanks
[07:07] <mdz> mjg59: what's involved in the setserial configuration?
[07:08] <mdz> mjg59: my primary concern would be discovering systems where the kernel bits have never been configured, and when they are, it hangs the machine or other nastiness
[07:08] <siretart> elmo: could you please sync util-vserver from unstable? it is needed for new vserver patch, and is universe anyway
[07:08] <lamont-away> libnurbs/internals/sorter.h:43: warning: 'class Sorter' has virtual functions but non-virtual destructor
[07:08] <lamont-away> libnurbs/internals/flistsorter.h:48: warning: 'class FlistSorter' has virtual functions but non-virtual destructor
[07:08] <lamont-away> go nurbs!
[07:08] <siretart> lamont-away: could you please un-depwait transcode on i386?
[07:08] <mdz> mako: what ever happened with the spell checking stuff?  we seem to still be stuck with ispell :-/
[07:08] <mjg59> mdz: Well, firstly this will only be executing on tablets (other machines won't present Wacom devices in sysfs)
[07:09] <mjg59> mdz: At the moment, every tablet requires setserial to be run to configure a serial device
[07:09] <mdz> mjg59: oh, so normal wacom devices don't show up there ever?
[07:09] <mjg59> No, only ones that are actually built into the hardware
[07:09] <lamont-away> siretart: I undepwaited everything an hour or so ago
[07:09] <mjg59> This is information from the BIOS - it won't know about ones that are plugged into standard serial pors
[07:10] <fabbione> night fellas
[07:10] <elmo> siretart: done
[07:10] <mvo> night fabbione
[07:10] <ogra> ciao fabbione
[07:10] <mdz> mjg59: I'll seed them to supported so we can see if there are any lurking surprises in terms of deps
[07:11] <mjg59> mdz: Ok. I haven't made the change yet
[07:11] <mdz> mjg59: if you do the inclusion reports, they can move into main now, and we can discuss later about adding them to desktop once your changes are in
[07:11] <mjg59> mdz: Ok
[07:11] <siretart> lamont-away: oh. great. thanks
[07:11] <siretart> elmo: thanks!
[07:12] <mako> mdz: as far i can tell, arsen got sidetracked with some university application and didn't do anything the last two weeks
[07:13] <mdz> mako: our deadline was August 11th, and google's deadline is (I think) September 1st
[07:15] <mdz> mako: I haven't seen any code from him yet; have you?
[07:15] <mako> mdz: he claims the ispell stuff is solved but i haven't seen that code either
[07:16] <mako> mdz: he's got incomplete myspell code but i don't think he implemented the work around he'd discussed either
[07:17] <mako> mdz: he tried to message me when i was sat the doctor this morning but logged off before i got back
[07:17] <Burgundavia> mdz, for screem, a request was sent, but screem uses things like dbus and thus the package needed changing, which was beyond my technical ability
[07:18] <mdz> Burgundavia: the new version of screem won't work in breezy unmodified?
[07:18] <seb128> current version builds fine with current dbus imho
[07:18] <seb128> they have 2 dbus case, 0.2 and 0.3
[07:18] <Burgundavia> ok
[07:19] <Burgundavia> it didn't build for me, so I left it
[07:19] <mdz> Burgundavia: did you find in the course of your test that it didn't build or didn't work?
[07:19] <mdz> hmm
[07:19] <Burgundavia> it may have just been me. In any case, I don't really have the spare time anymore to futz with it
[07:23] <mdz> I have no problem with a new upstream version of screem, but of course it has to be verified to build and work as least as well as the current one on breezy
[07:23] <mdz> otherwise it just creates work for us
[07:24] <ogra> pitti, ping, nvu... i worked with \sh on it, your requirement to split out the mozilla source cat be fulfilled without a rewrite... (i'm sure you guessed that) ... what can i do now.... ?
[07:24] <pitti> ogra: OMG, please do not intoduce another copy of mozilla code
[07:24] <ogra> mdz, pitti thinks the current nvu we have cant go to main as it is... what shall i do ? drop it ?
[07:24] <pitti> ogra: did they reaally modify the original moz sources so heavily?
[07:24] <Nafallo> mdz: I kickoff a build of the debian sources right now :-)
[07:25] <ogra> pitti, yes, you cant split it out...
[07:25] <\sh> pitti: nvu uses a different mozilla codebase then mozilla itself...
[07:25] <ogra> pitti, all i can do is make it complie with the nspr-dev we have but nothing more...
[07:25] <pitti> \sh: that's just plain crazy...
[07:25] <ogra> pitti, yes
[07:25] <mvo> pitti: I plan a hal upload to add LaunchpadIntegration to hal-device-manager
[07:25] <pitti> mvo: cool :-)
[07:26] <\sh> pitti: nvu is a changed composer addon
[07:26] <mvo> pitti: ok, thanks. I just wanted to know if that's ok with you :)
[07:26] <\sh> and they're using older mozilla code...
[07:26] <pitti> mvo: oh, sure :-)
[07:26] <pitti> \sh: but the older code is full of known holes...
[07:27] <pitti> we have enough trouble with supporting the official moz code, we can't security-patch the nvu one
[07:27] <\sh> pitti: but nvu is no browser...thats why..
[07:28] <\sh> pitti: i will try one thing now...
[07:28] <mdz> ogra: if it isn't supportable, we can't ship it in main
[07:28] <pitti> \sh: but it certainly can edit arbirary html documents, right?
[07:28] <\sh> pitti: i just checkedout the composer component from cvs mozilla...and now I'm moving the nvu composer directory to this base...and see what's happening
[07:28] <pitti> \sh: so download a malicious page, open it in nvu, and wham, you are f**ed
[07:29] <mdz> 2 mozilla codebases is already too many; 3 would be worse
[07:29] <\sh> pitti: don't tell it to me..tell it linspire...who is sponsoring this damn editor
[07:29] <pitti> mdz: s/2/3/ and s/3/4
[07:29] <\sh> nvu is worst case
[07:29] <pitti> mdz: moz, ffox, tbird
[07:29] <mdz> pitti: ugh
[07:29] <ogra> mdz, yes, but we have other html editors... i can either drop html editing at all, go for bluefish (universe), quanta or screem
[07:29] <mdz> pitti: we need to convince sabdfl and silbs to use a new MUA ;-)
[07:29] <pitti> mdz: moz still builds nspr and libnss, and epy and co break with ffox' variants
[07:29] <mdz> ogra: screem is already in main
[07:29] <ogra> mdz, quanta too
[07:29] <pitti> mdz: "mutt sucks less" :-)
[07:30] <ogra> mdz, only bluefish is universe
[07:30] <pitti> also security wise
[07:30] <\sh> ogra: quanta is more mature..IMHO
[07:31] <ogra> \sh, the last times i tested it, it crashed constantly .... but thats a while ago (before edubuntu summit)
[07:31] <\sh> ogra: well...
[07:31] <mdz> fabbione: do you know the difference between DEBUG_XORG_PACKAGE and DEBUG_XORG_DEBCONF, if any?
[07:32] <ogra> \sh, quanta pulls a lot of other stuff in... thats not very nice
[07:32] <ogra> kfilereplace klinkstatus kommander
[07:33] <mdz> hmm, the difference seems to be that DEBUG_XORG_PACKAGE implies XRESPROBE_DEBUG
[07:34] <\sh> ogra: yes...kommander is needed
[07:34] <\sh> it
[07:34] <\sh> it's the dialog manager..everything is configurable for quanta
[07:34] <ogra> gah
[07:34] <ogra> thats SO KDE
[07:35] <\sh> so u can write your own extentions without knowing qt/kde
[07:35] <\sh> (type of)
[07:35] <\sh> ok..moved the composer base from nvu-1 to cvs head mozilla tree
[07:36] <\sh> lets see
[07:36] <\sh> 1.2GHz how long for nvu?
[07:36] <ogra> \sh, 2-3h ?
[07:36] <ogra> depends on your mem
[07:37] <pitti> \sh: that would be slightly better, but still insane
[07:37] <pitti> \sh: building against mozilla-dev doesn't work at all?
[07:37] <ogra> pitti, nope
[07:38] <ogra> pitti, they use the source code, not the interface.... you cant work with -dev packages here
[07:38] <pitti> ok
[07:38] <\sh> pitti: mozilla-dev are interfaces for external apps
[07:39] <\sh> pitti: but nvu is not an external apps...it uses the sources of mozilla...nvu is the composer component actually
[07:39] <\sh> ogra: 512m..but the cpu
[07:39] <seb128> panel is not broken !
[07:39] <\sh> ogra: it's fixed since the latest upgrade
[07:39] <seb128> what is the issue ?
[07:39] <seb128> update gnome-menus to 2.11.92
[07:40] <ogra> seb128, 100%cpu usage.... we talked about it this morning already
[07:40] <ogra> seb128, i dist-upgraded after we talked about sabayon ....
[07:40] <seb128> dpkg -l gnome-menus ?
[07:40] <\sh> oh I
[07:40] <\sh> I'm a stupid
[07:40] <\sh> anyways the next reinstall of breezy is coming
[07:40] <ogra> seb128, ok...
[07:41] <\sh> and I don
[07:41] <\sh> 't think the inventor of this laptop thought ever, that it can me misused for building mozilla
[07:42] <ogra> \sh, on my amd64 it takes nearly 2h... but i have a very slow disk...
[07:43] <\sh> ogra: and i have a burning r200 :)
[07:44] <\sh> i don't mind...burn in test
[07:46] <ogra> ARGH
[07:46] <ogra> quanta uses kdewebdev-doc-html heavily... but thats in universe
[07:48] <ogra> gah... why does it depend on silly stuff like kfielreplace but not on the documentation that it uses all over the place
[07:52] <\sh> ok..configure was without any problems
[07:52] <\sh> ok...make -f client.mk build
[07:53] <\sh> pitti: lets make a deal...
[07:53] <ogra> haha
[07:54] <\sh> pitti: if this is working, can we put the nvu component from nvu-1.0 as add tar.gz into mozilla source package...and we create another package from mozilla source?
[07:54] <\sh> it's only the composer/ dir (i hope so)
[07:54] <ogra> \sh, nope... i tired that already...
[07:54] <\sh> ogra: I know I'm crazy...
[07:54] <\sh> ogra: no diff...
[07:55] <ogra> \sh, it didnt build when i tried that with our source...
[07:55] <\sh> ogra: see...I'm on crack lets try again
[07:55] <\sh> right now i
[07:55] <pitti> \sh: sounds relatively sane, as long as the actual nvu code is robust against moz changes?
[07:55] <ogra> \sh, youre the C++ guy... go ahead
[07:56] <\sh> pitti: we will see...i mean it's the worst idea I ever have...one thing I was told since the beginning.."never deal with netscape sh*t"
[07:56] <\sh> and now
[07:58] <pitti> \sh: but you know the "$foo touched it last" rule, don't you?
[07:58] <\sh> ogra: u build this source with gcc4 right? the orig nvu sources
[07:58] <\sh> pitti: go away ;)
[07:58] <ogra> \sh, yup
[07:58] <ogra> pitti, i take the blame, since he does it for me
[07:59] <pitti> ogra: fine for me :-)
[07:59] <ogra> heh
[07:59] <pitti> ok, I'm out for a bit
[08:01] <\sh> pitti: u will here me crying and screaming..
[08:01] <ogra> hmm, whats wrong with the i386 buildd again ? E: Package debhelper has no installation candidate
[08:02] <elmo> ignore it, it's a temporary thing that'll auto-correct itself
[08:02] <ogra> ok, thanks elmo  :)
[08:04] <\sh> i don't have eggs..but i could fry now eggs on this baby
[08:04] <ogra> err, since when do we have a ndiswrapper-modules package ?
[08:04] <ogra> and why does it depend on kernel-headers... ?
[08:05] <mdz> ogra: since Hoary or so
[08:06] <mdz> it's a virtual package provided by the kernel images or by a .deb built by ndiswrapper-source
[08:06] <elmo> no, it's a source package
[08:06] <elmo> imported from Debian
[08:06] <ogra> mdz, i thought is was included in linu-image...
[08:06] <ogra> linux even
[08:06] <elmo> ndiswrapper-modules-i386 |      1.1-2 | breezy/universe | source
[08:07] <elmo> at least that's the only thing matching '.*ndiswrapper-modules.*' in the archive
[08:07] <mdz> ogra: it is, that's why they provide it
[08:07] <ogra> thats even older then our ndiswrapper, 1.1-4
[08:07] <ogra> then there shouldnt be an additional one in universe...
[08:08] <ogra> (i know our ndiswrapper package in main pretty well and know it doesnt build the modules package, since i need to compile it on every kernel upgrade for amd64)
[08:09] <ogra> s/ndiswrapper package/ndiswrapper source package/
[08:14] <mdz> mjg59: presumably toshset wants to be seeded? (it isn't)
[08:16] <Mez> elmo: ping
[08:16] <Mez> mdz: ping
[08:17] <Mez> ogra: ndiswrapper works fine for me through restricted-modules
[08:17] <mdz> Mez: it's a much better idea to say what you have to say, rather than pinging every few hours.  that way, I can answer you even if you're not around when I see your message.
[08:18] <ogra> Mez, restricted... ? isnt it in linux-image itself ?
[08:18] <Mez> mdz: apologies... I was just wondering if maybe we should formalise some way of "requesting" something to be backported officially
[08:19] <Mez> ogra: er - might be - ... I sorta remember it not being there when I didnt have fglrx... so assumed it was in restricted - might have just been an oversight of mine
[08:19] <Mez> and elmo: was just wondering if you re-added libgda2 to backports yet, so I can poke someone to clear the dep-wair
[08:19] <ogra> Mez, but i talk about amd64... its not built for amd64
[08:21] <Mez> ogra: oh ...
[08:21] <mjg59> mdz: Yeah
[08:21] <mdz> mjg59: you know where the seed archive is and stuff?
[08:22] <mjg59> mdz: Nope
[08:22] <elmo> Mez: what are you talking about?