[02:22] <smoser> hallyn_, stgraber what happened with this
[02:22] <smoser> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=29829732
[02:22] <smoser> did that get in in some form ?
[02:45] <sarnold> smoser: I saw some keen monitor mechanism when I did the lxc MIR audit; check out src/lxc/monitor.c and see if it looks like what you need or want
[02:46] <sarnold> (normally I'm against anything that deviates too far from APUE's daemonize() or daemon() function, but this was surprising in a nice way. :)
[02:49] <smoser> hm.. i didn't even bother looking at code.
[02:49] <smoser> reading that thread, i kind of wished they'd gone a similar route to qemu guest agent
[04:09] <roasted> hello friends
[06:17] <ScottK> Looks like nodejs can be synced.  That would fix installability of node-resolve.
[07:56] <Pupeno> Is there a way to see the stdout of a process that cron is running right now?
[10:29] <cefk> hi allesamt. wenns um routing geht - ohne nat - gibts da nen trick oder ist in sysctl mit ip_forward = 1 alles getan? ich kriegs nämlich nicht hin - hab mittlerweile auch routing-regeln editiert etc .. weiss nicht mehr weiter. - hat jemand kurz zeit und nerv für sowas?
[11:00] <cefk> wrong language, sorry. I have an 8-NIC ubuntu server, that should route between 8 different networks. I do not want it to do NAT, so as I understand the Routing-Wiki, I need to set ip_foward to 1 via sysctl and be done. Is that true, or do I have to use the nat-rule (postrouting/masquerading)?
[11:29] <ivoks> zul: pingy pongy
[11:29] <zul> ivoks:  just waking up
[11:29] <ivoks> zul: here's something to make it quicker ;) https://bugs.launchpad.net/cloud-archive/+bug/1214275
[11:29] <zul> ivoks:  cool ill have a look
[11:30] <ivoks> or jamespage ^
[11:30] <jamespage> ivoks, thanks....
[11:30] <jamespage> I'll let zul backport that  :-)
[11:30] <ivoks> it's not easy
[11:30] <ivoks> we also have this one: https://bugs.launchpad.net/horizon/+bug/1210253
[11:39] <jamespage> Daviey, if you have time python-websocket-client, python-jujuclient and juju-deployer are all in the NEW queue for saucy now
[11:43] <ivoks> zul: i believe this is specific to django 5.1
[11:43] <zul> greeeeat...
[11:49] <Daviey> jamespage: Yes, i'm sure i can do them today
[11:50] <jamespage> Daviey, thanks!
[11:50] <Daviey> jamespage: I am wondering if UCA needs some better tooling to check deps are satisfied
[11:50] <Daviey> There has been a few whoopees
[11:54] <jamespage> Daviey, probably - do you know how the installability checker works in -proposed? that would be useful
[11:55] <Daviey> jamespage: it's plain Britney ?
[12:55] <Daviey> jamespage: Hmm, do you know why the Havana uploads for UCA 'b3' rather than 'h3' ?
[12:55] <Daviey> For Grizzly we did G3.
[12:56] <jamespage> Daviey, just lining up behind how upstream named things for havana
[12:57] <Daviey> jamespage: Oh, you are quite right
[12:59] <zul> jamespage:  im going to be synching up the cloud-archive today
[12:59] <jamespage> zul, +1 please do
[12:59] <jamespage> we are a few weeks off h3 but good to get it done in advance
[12:59] <jamespage> zul, pls can you remember to backport the packages in the lab as well so we stay in sync
[13:00] <zul> jamespage:  ack
[13:02] <zul> jamespage:  the new openvswitch is ok for the CA i know that we had problems with libvirt so im delaying libvirt for now at least
[13:03] <jamespage> zul, openvswitch -> CA - OK
[13:03] <jamespage> zul, ack on libvirt
[13:08] <hallyn_> smoser: we've never agreed on a sufficiently distro-generic solution.  In the end (in another thread iirc) people agreed they should do it manually for now.  For example have lxc.mount.entry bind-mount a file or dir into the container which userspace in the container updates when it is read
[13:09] <hallyn_> smoser: i can mail you an mbox with most of that thread for easier perusal than the web interface
[13:09] <hallyn_> (i hate the sf mail archive interface)
[13:09] <smoser> hallyn_, nah. no worries.
[13:09] <smoser> one comment i have i sthat it seems *very* simlar to the qemu-agent
[13:10] <smoser> in overall goal / function / usefulness
[13:10] <smoser> it'd be very good if a solution could be made that utilized that
[13:11] <hallyn_> do you use qemu-ga?
[13:12] <hallyn_> it's not too far from what i'm suggesting.  we bind-mount a file or a socket into the container so that the container can update it.
[13:12] <zul> jamespage:  looking at the qa report greenlet is at ubuntu2 in the ppa but ubuntu1 is in the ca
[13:13] <jamespage> zul, is ok in the staging PPA
[13:13] <zul> jamespage:  i think so
[13:13] <jamespage> its*
[13:13] <jamespage> zul, yeah - I did the update in ubuntu so I pushed to the staging ppa as well
[13:13] <zul> jamespage:  ack
[13:16] <hallyn_> smoser: http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/61388  QEMU Guest Agent CVE-2013-2231 Local Privilege Escalation Vulnerability
[13:17]  * hallyn_ dives deeper to make sure i'ts not a fundamental design issue
[13:18] <smoser> hallyn_, nice. :)
[13:18] <hallyn_> yeah no so qemu-ga wants to provide full QMP access.  i really don't think we want anything like that.  just a 'done booted' status update, maybe a few more like that (maybe a free-form text field)
[13:19] <hallyn_> that's all you want right?
[13:19] <smoser> hallyn_, i really dont care about a silly 'booted'
[13:19] <hallyn_> then what do you care about?
[13:19] <hallyn_> i'm sure it's not "silly"
[13:19] <smoser> if you're going to create a communication pipe, then you should create a communication pipe.
[13:20] <hallyn_> to what end
[13:20] <hallyn_> hm, http://www.securiteam.com/securitynews/5DP2Y2KAWA.html seems to be a different one
[13:20] <smoser> people want such things. i'm not sure why.
[13:20] <smoser> but generally, it seems like a useful thing
[13:20] <smoser> but doing a one way pipe seems not that useful to me.
[13:20] <hallyn_> to what end, when you can just lxc-attach into the container
[13:21] <hallyn_> well, two-way pipe, maybe.  having guest send requests for action to host, i dno't think so
[13:21] <smoser> those actions can be ignored.
[13:21] <smoser> the pipe is the big thing really.
[13:21] <hallyn_> yeah sure if the host is functioning perfectly
[13:21] <hallyn_> or, "always ignored"?  ok :)
[13:21] <smoser> and qemu-ga is trying to have some communication protocol over a generic pipe
[13:22] <smoser> thats what i think is sane.
[13:23] <hallyn_> i'm not opposed, once we have specific examples of needs.  so far,
[13:23] <smoser> i dont have strong feelings here. but i dont think that doing a little one way status pipe is particularly useful.
[13:23] <hallyn_> we've had several requests for 'done booting' message - from different ppl at different times.
[13:23] <hallyn_> and that's all we've ever gotten that i can recall
[13:23] <smoser> yeah.
[13:24] <smoser> i just saw the discussion and thought it was interesting.
[13:24] <smoser> openstack basically has this same desire
[13:24] <smoser> in the end its very guest dependent.
[13:24] <smoser> thus my desire for some standard communication protocol
[13:25] <smoser> over a hypervisor specific bi-directional socket
[13:25] <hallyn_> right, so you want lxc to provide what qemu provides so guests can be hypervisor independent
[13:25] <hallyn_> i'm not opposed to that, i just need more specific examples :)  nova uses something like that?
[13:25] <hallyn_> could cloud-init use it by chance?
[13:25] <smoser> nova does not use anything like this yet.
[13:26] <smoser> the only usecase that i can ever actually come up with where the guest would need such a thing is "snapshot"
[13:26] <smoser> ie, where guest would freeze its filesystem, and then ask the host to snapshot it, and then unfreeze.
[13:26] <smoser> to ensure consistent.
[13:27] <smoser> i figure at some point nova will end up with something like this.
[13:27] <smoser> and at that point i would like a generic guest agent (or at least generic communication protoco)
[13:28] <smoser> and at that point i'd like our images to have a agent, and i'd like for them to "just work" to do the same generic stuff on lxc as on openstack
[13:28] <smoser> :)
[13:35] <jamespage> zul, I ready backported ceph - http://people.canonical.com/~jamespage/ca/
[13:35] <jamespage> but I've not uploaded yet
[13:36] <zul> jamespage:  +1, im just doing build testing here
[13:42] <Hakameda> Aynone that could help me with a script for running a minecraft server. Specfically it will load from a hardrive to a ramdisk, Run, The when its done save to a hardrive before exiting. I'm making some sort of silly mistake no doubt in the script
[13:50] <RoyK> Hakameda: you shouldn't need a ramdisk - linux does good caching as it is, and with a ramdisk, you'll lose it all if the system goes down
[13:51] <Hakameda> It's just an old server, Trying to run a 121 Mods on it. Figured may get some extra out of it with a ram disk. The script does a save and a backup on intervals as well
[13:52] <RoyK> Hakameda: linux should do this caching for you automatically
[13:53] <Hakameda> So if we did set it up, It most likely wouldn't help? Still new to using it. Lots to learn
[13:53] <RoyK> well, it would help, but if you just use a normal disk, linux will cache whatever most used and keep that in RAM
[13:54] <Hakameda> We had it set up and running without the ram disk, It was getting massive lag spikes when it came to world generation
[13:57] <RoyK> oh, ic
[13:57] <RoyK> perhaps an SSD would do better?  ;)
[13:58] <Hakameda> I guess worst case remove some mods but that does take away the fun haha. Upgrading hardware just wasn't an option atm
[14:05] <RoyK> it's true that linux' caching won't help much for writes
[14:06] <RoyK> ext4 supports delayed writes, and that would help a bit, but not a whole lot
[14:06] <RoyK> which filesystem are you using?
[14:06] <mardraum> how much ram are you giving to minecraft
[14:07] <Hakameda> I used just the default install, The server just runs TS3 and now this MC Server
[14:07] <Hakameda> It's getting 2GB
[14:08] <mardraum> 2GB is fine for a lightly loaded minecraft server, try it without your mods and it shoudl run ok
[14:10] <Hakameda> I can run it with 2GB on Windows and it does fine, But it just stutters when trying to do it on the ubuntu server. The mods is the whole reason for the server =)
[14:11] <mardraum> so you try it on windows with identical mods and no other services on the same hardware and internet connection and it works fine?
[14:13] <Hakameda> Yes, I first ran it from Windows. Thought i could get more preformance by using an Ubuntu Server
[14:14] <mardraum> looks like you can't hey
[14:15] <mardraum> if, as you say, all is equal on each side, then perhaps your mods are better optimised to run under the windows java implementation
[14:17] <RoyK> Hakameda: is this with oracle java or openjdk?
[14:18]  * LargePrime runs a Tekkit Classic server with 100 people that never uses over 1GB
[14:18] <Hakameda> Royk: openjdk
[14:20] <mardraum> LargePrime: 100 simultaneous on 1GB?
[14:20] <LargePrime> are the mods using mysql?
[14:20] <LargePrime> ya
[14:20] <LargePrime> mardraum: ya
[14:20] <LargePrime> mcpc+ for the win
[14:21] <mardraum> is it public?
[14:21] <LargePrime> well an old spigot build
[14:21] <LargePrime> ya, and cracked
[14:21] <Hakameda> The one im doing is 120 Mods, Specfically Its FTB Unleashed + Gregtech and some other smaller mods
[14:21] <LargePrime> FTB and greg is very heavy and laggy
[14:22] <mardraum> you run a cracked minecraft server for 100 people on 1GB of ram
[14:22] <LargePrime> i dont know why
[14:22] <LargePrime> mardraum:  no, it has 3GB, but never uses over 1GB
[14:22] <Hakameda> Its only the world generation thats causing grief, I tried to grab Nallar's Tickthreading but the jenkins for it was down when i last checked
[14:22] <LargePrime> mardraum:  so sorts?
[14:23] <mardraum> is it because you all stand around the same area be dickheads?
[14:23] <mardraum> being*
[14:23] <LargePrime> mardraum: I object!  we dont have to stand around together to be dickheads
[14:23] <LargePrime> we can be dickheads apart
[14:23] <Hakameda> Only trying to run a 4 person server too
[14:24] <LargePrime> I got a World border at 3000 blocks
[14:24] <LargePrime> Hakameda:  I also have a FTB server, ultimate and 1.4.7.  it has 8 people and no server lag, and get tonns of client lag
[14:25] <LargePrime> and it makes no sence to me
[14:25] <Hakameda> I don't get client lag, Its Worldgen Lag. Block Lag.
[14:26] <zul> jamespage:  looks like flask needs python-itsdangerous
[14:26] <LargePrime> hak, does it cause ticl lag?  like does /lag show a drop?
[14:27] <LargePrime> ticl=tick
[14:27] <Hakameda> When new chunks are generated, It does cause Tick lag
[14:27] <LargePrime> you can pregen all the chunks
[14:27] <LargePrime> with worldguard?
[14:27] <Hakameda> So says cofh tps, As i can't download tickthreading atm
[14:27] <Hakameda> The jenkins is down
[14:28] <LargePrime> you run MCPC+
[14:28] <LargePrime> ?
[14:28] <Hakameda> Nope, No need its a private. I thought the plugins would be extra strain that i didn't need
[14:28] <jamespage> zul, hrm - yes
[14:29] <jamespage> zul, I thought I uploaded to saucy already?
[14:29] <jamespage> nope
[14:29] <jamespage> zul, in which case yes we do need to include python-itsdangerous
[14:29] <LargePrime> MCPC+ is also lighter and faster
[14:29] <jamespage> sorry - I must have missed that
[14:29] <LargePrime> i recommend
[14:30] <LargePrime> you dont HAVE to run the plugins
[14:30] <Hakameda> MCPC+ itself would be another larger mod to add
[14:30] <zul> jamespage:  for the CA
[14:31] <jamespage> zul, yep
[14:31] <jamespage> ceilometer uses entry points so everything #explodes unless deps line up!
[14:32] <LargePrime> CAn I ask a mysql silly noob question?  I want to move all my mysql stuff to /home cause need room.  can i just move it all and symlink /var/lib/mysql to the dir?
[14:32] <LargePrime> and restart?
[14:32] <LargePrime> or is that stupid
[14:37] <LargePrime> was it something i said?
[14:57] <zul> jamespage:  also python-pbr will be need to built before the clients and swift as well
[14:58] <jamespage> zul, why?
[14:58] <jamespage> if so please version the build dependency
[14:58] <jamespage> otherwise things get complicated...
[14:58] <zul> jamespage:  otherwise ftbfs because a newer pbr is required
[14:58] <jamespage> zul, OK _ so version the BD
[14:58] <zul> jamespage:  ack
[14:58] <jamespage> that way it gets a dep-wait rather than fud
[14:59] <jamespage> and things just sort themselves out
[15:12] <zul> http://people.canonical.com/~chucks/ca
[15:29] <Siebjee> Does some one know the new IRC channel of Canonical, or has a phone numer of the sales department ?
[15:31] <arosales> smoser, fyi you are on the hook for todays ubuntu server meeting
[15:32] <arosales> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting
[15:33] <smoser> oh joy.
[15:33] <smoser> Siebjee, what are you looking for help with ?
[15:33] <Siebjee> Support Sales
[15:34] <smoser> there isn't a cnaonical support irc channel
[15:34] <Siebjee> #canonical has been moved, and the link they have in the irc channel no one has permissions to view it :)
[15:36] <smoser> Siebjee, http://www.ubuntu.com/about/contact-us/form
[15:36] <smoser> i think the reason for the move was that '#canonical' was an internal canonical channel, which is now moved to an internal server.
[15:36] <zul> jamespage:  https://code.launchpad.net/~zulcss/python-ceilometerclient/pbr/+merge/181079
[15:36] <smoser> but you should be able to use that web form. above.
[15:37] <Siebjee> smoser, already filled it in 2 days ago. However, i need to have a chat with them like yesterday. Was hoping to speak to them sooner before they contact me
[15:38] <zul> jamespage/roaksoax: https://code.launchpad.net/~zulcss/python-novaclient/pbr/+merge/181080
[15:38] <Pici> Siebjee: The "Our Address" section of this page has phone numbers: http://www.canonical.com/about-canonical/contact
[15:39] <Siebjee> Pici, already tried. They aint redirecting my call correctly.. All of them seem to be out of the office :x
[15:40] <zul> jamespage/roaksoax: https://code.launchpad.net/~zulcss/python-cinderclient/pbr/+merge/181082
[15:40] <jamespage> zul, +1 +1
[15:41] <jamespage> cinderclient - not sure - do you still need to drop all the patches?
[15:42] <jamespage> zul, for reference - https://code.launchpad.net/~james-page/python-cinderclient/drop-patches/+merge/180230
[15:42] <jamespage> that was a trunk fix
[15:42] <jamespage> zul, oh - a btw flash looks like its creating issues in ceilometer
[15:43] <zul> flask you mean?
[15:43] <smoser> for anyone reading backscroll, i got Siebjee hooked up.  Sorry that was difficult.
[15:44] <jamespage> zul: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ceilometer/+bug/1212851
[15:45] <jamespage> zul; yeah- I do mean that
[15:46] <zul> iso8601 im gonig to get rid of iso8601 last update according to pypi was 2007
[15:48] <rbasak> zul: what do you mean by get rid of it?
[15:48] <zul> rbasak:  replace it with dateutil
[15:49] <rbasak>  ValueError: Unable to parse date string u'Mon, 27 Aug 2012 07:00:00 GMT'
[15:49] <rbasak> That's not an iso8601 formatted date anyway
[15:50] <rbasak> Anyway my concern was just that I use python-iso8601 in other stuff. No comment on the ceilometer bug.
[16:09] <Patrickdk> people use iso dates? other than mysql?
[16:10] <ogra_> Patrickdk, yes, 99% of the world use iso dates
[16:47] <arosales> smoser, thanks for following up with Siebjee
[17:07] <Arrick> hey all, I am trying to get cron jobs to run on ubuntu 12.04 LTS... every time I try to run it, it tells me cron is not running.... how do I get it to run?
[17:09] <rbasak> !details | Arrick
[17:09] <rbasak> Please define "every time I try to run it", paste the actual output, not your interpretation of what it says, etc.
[17:12] <Arrick> I am trying to get a cron.php script to run every 5 minutes, and I have used crontab -e to put in this minus quotes "*/5 * * * * /usr/bin/php /path/to/cron.php" .... If I try to run the cron.php file using "php /path/to/cron.php" it runs fine... I also have a cron_watcher.php in the same directory that */15 * * * * /usr/bin/php /path/to/cron.php" is supposed to run every 15 minutes.... when I run it manually, it reports "Cron is not running".
[17:13] <Arrick> I am using ubuntu server 12.04 LTS, which is running "Totara LMS"... I need to setup the cron job for the updates, etc.
[17:13] <Arrick> so... my question is "how do I get Cron running?"
[17:13] <Pici> Arrick: What do you mean by "when I run it manually, it reports "Cron is not running""? What exactly are you typing in?
[17:14] <Arrick> I am typing in php  /path/to/cron_watcher.php
[17:14] <Arrick> which reports if cron is running or not.
[17:14] <Arrick> totara lms is basicaly a customized moodle install.
[17:15] <ogra_> did you check your logs ?
[17:15] <Arrick> I havent got a clue where to look.
[17:15] <Pici> Does  service cron status   actually tell you that cron is running?
[17:15] <ogra_> /var/log/syslog for a start
[17:16] <Arrick> cron start/running, process 1152
[17:16] <ogra_> so cron runs fine
[17:18] <rbasak> Sounds like a problem or incompatibility with your cron_watcher.php. It might be better to try their community channel for help.
[17:19] <Arrick> thats what i am starting to think now that I see what that said.
[17:19] <rbasak> For cron.php itself, are you sure you're running the cron job as the correct user?
[17:20] <rbasak> Also note that PATH may not match, since cron's default PATH is rather insane. It's documented in the manpage.
[17:20] <Arrick> running it as root presently for testing, should be running properly.
[17:20] <Arrick> im looking at the logs now
[17:20] <Arrick> it looks like the cron.php is running now.
[17:51] <hallyn_> smoser: good news is i've got snapshot dependency tracking working..
[17:51] <smoser> nice.
[17:52] <hallyn_> right now though i'm out for a walk and lunch - will post the patch later today
[19:03] <arges> whats the difference between updated and outstanding merges?
[19:03] <arges> oops, this was meant for -devel
[21:10] <roasted_> hello friends
[21:10] <roasted_> have any of you had success with having a server running root on an SSD
[21:10] <roasted_> cause so far I've burnt out two SSDs running /
[21:11]  * RoyK has
[21:11] <roasted_> in a matter of 5 months
[21:11] <roasted_> RoyK: do you have swap on your server
[21:11] <roasted_> with the SSD on
[21:11] <roasted_>  /
[21:11] <RoyK> yes
[21:11] <roasted_> why the snot did I have two fry
[21:11] <roasted_> this is enraging me
[21:11] <RoyK> but not much memory pressure - 8 gigs of ram
[21:11] <roasted_> yeah - I have 4gb
[21:11] <roasted_> I rarely hit half that
[21:15] <roasted_> I don't think I'm going to bother putting an SSD back in this
[21:15] <roasted_> I'm sick of this :/
[21:15] <roasted_> plus I have no other SSDs to spare
[21:17] <LargePrime> 2 ssd in 5 months, means all under warranty?
[21:17] <LargePrime> ssd had a bad batch some while ago
[21:17] <LargePrime> could be pure luck
[21:18] <genii> Those Vertex 2 had issues
[21:19] <genii> eg: They would hibernate and never wake up
[21:19] <roasted_> these are Corsairs
[21:19] <roasted_> V4 and M4
[21:19] <roasted_> bought about 4 months apart
[21:22] <LargePrime> you play with swappyness?
[21:25] <genii> Hm. Looks like some of the Corsair same type of issue, according to http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=96663   ( in this case they do a Windows regedit to disable powersave )
[21:27] <roasted_> genii: I wonder if that's kind of a different issue, though...
[21:27] <roasted_> genii: it'll run great for months, then the issue comes up again. Some people are saying, yeah been 24h running great...
[21:27] <roasted_> on a brand new SSD, it was perfect from the get go for a long time, then out of no where, RO
[21:28]  * genii sips and ponders.
[21:28] <roasted_> I have some spare hdds. I just might throw one in and be done with it.
[21:29] <roasted_> the main advantage with a server/ssd combo was less moving parts, so I figured it would last longer. But at this rate, screw that.
[21:29] <roasted_> I didn't even have this many failures with seagate HDDs. :P
[21:30] <roasted_> fortunately I tar /var and /etc nightly and rsync it to a 2nd server on my LAN, so I have backups of my configs. I can install ubuntu server, install some services, copy/paste, done in no time.
[21:32] <roasted_> plus I have 5 160GB HDDs on the shelf... I might use one of them, pull a full disk image, and that way I have a full image + spare drives on the ready.
[21:33] <LargePrime> while ssd's have less moving parts, they still are a newer tech.  so failures are bond to happen?  Are lower MTBFs expected with SSds?
[21:33] <LargePrime> bound*
[21:33] <roasted_> LargePrime: what gave me confidence about these SSDs is we have the same model SSDs running Linux on desktops at work...
[21:33] <roasted_> there's been 1 or 2 failures, but there's like... 200? 300 systems?
[21:34] <roasted_> been running all day every day (during school anyway, not on during summers or at night) for a year.
[21:34] <LargePrime> so you are saying this was just luck
[21:34] <roasted_> I swear by SSDs on my end user systems 10000X
[21:34] <roasted_> what I'm wondering is if an SSD in a *server* plays a different role that is working against me.
[21:34] <LargePrime> cant see it
[21:35] <LargePrime> smart have any help for you?
[21:35] <roasted_> I ran smart against the last drive - it was definitely toast. I'll run it against this one quick...
[21:36] <roasted_> if I can remember the command...
[21:37] <roasted_> I didn't instal smartmontools, and it's refusing to let me install right now due to the fact it's hosed.
[21:37] <LargePrime> lol
[21:37] <roasted_> I'll pull the drive and USB bridge it into my laptop and scan it. That's waht I did last time.
[21:37] <roasted_> this SSD has only been 'live' for... 3 weeks? a month?
[21:37] <roasted_> long enough for me to fine tune it, at the very least.
[21:37] <roasted_> ironically I was going to take it down this weekend and pull an image of it since it's *finally* where I want it. derp.
[21:37] <LargePrime> that seems right.  if they fail, typically, they fail fast
[21:38] <roasted_> at any rate, it's not the image that matters most to me. Waht matters most to me are the configs.
[21:38] <roasted_> and I have a nettop running ubuntu server on my LAN too... I rsync configs to it nightly.
[21:38] <roasted_> so I can have all of my services running as quickly as I can nano into each config and paste the contents in
[21:41] <roasted_> can you run / on a pair of mdadm RAID'd drives?
[21:41] <roasted_> I run mdadm on my data drives in a mirror, but I never tried to run mdadm on a software RAID'd drive.
[21:42] <roasted_> bad idea, perhaps? good idea? eh...
[21:51] <Patrickdk> it's ok, but you must configure it correctly
[21:51] <Patrickdk> or it won't boot
[21:52] <roasted_> maybe I'll just stick to a single drive for /
[21:52] <roasted_> and rely on image backups and my nightly config backups
[21:53] <roasted_> the data is what maters most, and that's backed up and on a mirrored array anyway, so... I just want to avoid having to redo the OS drive as much as possible as its a real pain
[22:01] <sidnei> genii: i had issues with Vertex too, had to RMA it, when i got a replacement I sold it and got an intel one instead *wink*.
[22:03] <roasted_> vertex is.... corsair?
[22:03] <genii> roasted_: OCZ
[22:03] <roasted_> ah
[22:03] <roasted_> yeah I read about OCZ issues
[22:03] <roasted_> hese are crucial
[22:03] <roasted_> I think I said corsair earlier on accident.
[22:03] <genii> I think there are more generalized problems with the Sandforce controller though, which is in models by many different manufacturers
[22:04] <sarnold> (including new intel)
[22:08] <Patrickdk> heh? pretty sure the sandforce issues where solved
[22:08] <Patrickdk> many ssd's using them don't have issues
[22:08] <Patrickdk> lots of them using it, doesh ave issues


[01:32] <BlueAidan> for some reason, LP won't send a confirmation email to my main email account. could it be that the server is on my personal machine, on a residential IP?
[01:42] <lifeless> BlueAidan: shouldn't matter. is it hitting your spam filter perhaps ?
[01:43] <BlueAidan> no, it never connects to my server.
[01:44] <BlueAidan> I watch the log for awhile after I click the "send confirmation" button, but no connects from LP. I get other mail fine.
[01:45] <lifeless> mail is batched out from lp
[01:45] <lifeless> but we dont have filters on sending /to/ dial up ips etc - I recieve mail in what sounds to be a similar setup
[01:45] <BlueAidan> I've tried doing it 4-5 times now, for the past month or so and haven't gotten one yet.
[01:46] <lifeless> have you filed a bug/support request ?
[01:46] <BlueAidan> not yet...
[01:46] <lifeless> that will give us a place to have a discussion, record things to search in the logs etc
[01:46] <BlueAidan> ok
[01:47] <BlueAidan> jeez... one just got through!
[01:47] <BlueAidan> heh
[01:47] <BlueAidan> ah well
[02:42] <theCore> is possible to know how the Karma is counted?
[02:50] <sladen> theCore: you could ask on #launchpad
[02:50] <lifeless> sladen: this IS #launchpad
[02:51] <sladen> ha!
[02:51] <theCore> sladen, ?
[02:51] <theCore> hehe
[02:51] <lifeless> theCore: its recorded as specific actions, then counted daily. The answer is then balanced according to a algorithm that we change
[02:52] <lifeless> its changed so that the different areas of launchpad dont overwhelm each other, and to reduce the overwhelming amount of karma canonical employees tend to generate
[02:53] <theCore> lifeless, would it be possible to know the value given for the different actions?
[02:53] <lifeless> no
[02:53] <theCore> :(
[02:53] <lifeless> its really irrelevant
[02:53] <lifeless> its like 3 steps removed from the value that ends up against your name
[02:53] <lifeless> and like I say we balance it all the time, so the number is effectively not fixed.
[02:54] <theCore> I understand
[02:54] <lifeless> To know the number we'd have to work backwards through all the math
[02:54] <theCore> I just wanted to cheat a little bit, work on the most rewarding area to boost my karma
[02:54] <theCore> anyway
[02:54] <lifeless> I know. Its structured so that that it doesn't work like that ;)
[02:55] <theCore> thanks, for info
[02:55] <lifeless> also, karma decays
[02:55] <lifeless> if you have high karma, but stop contributing, it will fade away
[02:55] <lifeless> this is good for new contributors, because it means that after a while, you've caught up with everyone that is already here.
[02:56] <lifeless> (assuming you are contributing as much)
[02:56] <theCore> that's pretty nice
[02:57] <theCore> it's bit inconvient for the people that don't work directly with launchpad. though
[02:58] <lifeless> how so, you dont need to work directly with it to get karma
[02:58] <theCore> I assume my contributions worth more than karma points...
[02:58] <theCore> how so?
[03:00] <lifeless> well, what do you do ? If you do uploads of packages for instance, that generates karma
[03:02] <theCore> I work on the h.u.c documention, some IRC support, and I do upstream bug reports on development version of certain apps
[03:03] <theCore> may start to work with the MOTUs soon, so that will boost the karma points I have
[03:08] <theCore> lifeless, just another question, does my email address is reachable by the search bots if I make it viewable to other Launchpad users?
[03:09] <theCore> nevermind, I found it out
[03:09] <lifeless> no
[03:09] <lifeless> if you are not logged in, you cant see any email
[03:10] <theCore> yeah, I just saw that, it seems the spams came through wiki.ubuntu.com
[03:13] <theCore> lifeless, by the way, Launchpad is a really nice piece of software, continue your great work :)
[03:14] <Burgundavia> lifeless: personally, I think the gnome bugzilla points methods works very well
[03:14] <Burgundavia> be harder to abstract across a larger domain on expertise/work
[03:15] <lifeless> I got spammed in the weekend on /all/ my gpg uids
[03:15] <lifeless> so I think some f*cker has done a search of one of the keyservers
[03:15] <jamesh> lifeless: or harvested addresses from one of the PGP key stats websites
[03:15] <jamesh> which is more likely
[03:17] <lifeless> yeah
[03:17] <lifeless> also, some muppet in debian land is exposing maintainer email addresses to the wide wide masses
[03:18] <Burgundavia> lifeless: doesn't packages.debian.org do that anyway?
[03:18] <lifeless> probably
[03:18] <lifeless> $muppets
[03:18] <theCore> lifeless, possible but my GPG key doesn't have the email address which I'm getting spam
[03:18] <Burgundavia> dude, you have to know who to email about a package
[03:19] <lifeless> Burgundavia: yes, and? the BTS is the contact address
[03:19] <lifeless> I'm a DD, if anyone is allowed to complain, surely I am
[03:20] <lifeless> mind you, wrong channel ;)
[03:20] <Burgundavia> what if I have a question that is not a bug?
[03:20] <Burgundavia> it is hard enough figuring out who to talk to about a package already
[03:20] <Burgundavia> lets not make it harder
[03:22] <jamesh> Burgundavia: use the support tracker :)
[03:22] <Burgundavia> jamesh: and in debian? :)
[03:22] <jamesh> Burgundavia: they don't have one yet?
[03:23] <Burgundavia> debian is to actually used by real people, so they don't need a support tracker
[03:23] <jamesh> don't real people need a place to ask questions?
[03:30] <Burgundavia> jamesh: debian users mostly use the mailing list and that new forum
[03:30] <Burgundavia> the issue is people who are little bit more savvy that the forums but not quite a developer
[03:30] <Burgundavia> people like myself
[04:30] <mpt> Goooooooooooooooood afternoon Launchpadders!
[04:31] <lifeless> mpt: do we have a help.l.c page for WhyTheFuckAmIHere ?
[04:31] <mpt> no
[04:44] <lifeless> we had a lot of requests for account deletions over the weekend
[04:46] <jamesh> it coincides with the word "account" being splashed over non-active person pages
[04:49] <lifeless> ah, I did not realise that there had been a change there
[04:51] <jamesh> see the right hand portlet of https://launchpad.net/people/mzqrovna
[04:52] <jamesh> mpt: if you have ideas for alternative wording, that would be useful.
[04:57] <theCore> how do I confirm a bug?
[05:03] <mpt> jamesh, cause and effect perhaps
[05:05] <jamesh> also, the "Claim this account" link there should go to the person merge page rather than +forgottenpassword, since I'm logged in
[05:05] <mpt> ok
[05:05] <jamesh> I assume that's what we want to direct people to do when they find a duplicate
[05:06] <jamesh> rather than have two active accounts
[05:06] <mpt> yes
[05:15] <jamesh> mpt: so spiv found an SF URL that gives you a bug without needing the group_id or atid.  That should simplify things greatly.
[05:16] <mpt> cool
[05:17] <mpt> Does there need to be a spec on simplifying bug watch entry?
[05:17] <jamesh> couldn't hurt
[05:25] <Ubugtu> New bug: #57946 in rosetta "Aggregate suggestions from similar languages" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/57946
[05:39] <Burgundavia> jamesh: to be brutally honest, I think the non-free-ness of LP is going to be a larger and larger liability to Ubuntu as we go forward
[07:21] <jamesh> mpt: what do you think of bug 57414 and 57715?
[07:21] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 57414 in malone "Two comment boxes are confusing" [Low,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/57414
[07:21] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 57715 in malone "Lost comments on bug #57607" [Untriaged,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/57715
[07:21] <jamesh> mpt: people entering a comment in one comment box, and submitting the other form of the page
[07:21] <jamesh> thus losing the comment
[07:23] <mpt> jamesh, I think and have always thought that the bug page should have only one comment field, and only one "Save Changes" button
[07:24] <jamesh> mpt: I think it should be possible to do without too much trouble using the new formlib machinary
[07:24] <Burgundavia> mpt: related question: is there a bug somewhere for when you change a description and end up with a duplicate?
[07:25] <mpt> Burgundavia, yes, and BjornT has been fixing that recently afaik
[07:25] <Burgundavia> cool, thanks
[07:25] <Burgundavia> it bugged me again today
[08:32] <carlos> morning
[08:56] <carlos> mpt: hi
[08:56] <carlos> I would need some minutes of your time to help me with some UI changes to the translation form
[08:56] <carlos> Do you have time today?
[08:57] <mpt> carlos, now's good
[08:57] <carlos> ok
[08:57] <carlos> let me prepare my local launchpad server so you can take a look to what I have atm
[08:58] <carlos> the changes are to implement TranslationReview spec
[08:58] <jamesh> mpt: I reviewed your mpt/launchpad/trivial branch, btw.  Mostly okay, but one query about your fix for bug 55831
[08:58] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 55831 in malone "branches shouldn't be hidden in the bug text" [Low,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55831
[09:00] <carlos> mpt: http://gollum.pemas.net:8086/distros/ubuntu/hoary/+source/evolution/+pots/evolution-2.2/es/+translate
[09:00] <carlos> mpt: use my login details in our sample data
[09:01] <carlos> mpt: the copy buttons are not working, just focus on the UI
[09:01] <carlos> please
[09:02] <carlos> mpt: the message #5 is the most important, it has suggestions and I don't find the best way to render that information...
[09:19] <SteveA> morning
[09:20] <carlos> mpt: hi?
[09:20] <carlos> SteveA: morning
[09:21] <mpt> carlos, sorry, lost X-Chat there for a moment
[09:21] <mpt> What was the address?
[09:22] <carlos>  http://gollum.pemas.net:8086/distros/ubuntu/hoary/+source/evolution/+pots/evolution-2.2/es/+translate
[09:24] <mpt> whoo, "Translated by:"
[09:24] <mpt> great work
[09:25] <carlos> mpt: that's already in rocketfuel ;-)
[09:25] <carlos> mpt: so it would be deployed tomorrow
[09:30] <danilos> carlos: on that topic, care to prepare a report for kiko on stuff happened in rosetta? :)
[09:30] <danilos> btw, morning :)
[09:30] <carlos> danilos: morning
[09:31] <mpt> carlos, so the problem is the suggestions are taking up too much space?
[09:31] <carlos> yeah, let me finish with mpt and I will prepare my report
[09:31] <carlos> mpt: yeah
[09:31] <danilos> carlos: sure :)
[09:31] <carlos> mpt: danilos suggested some collapsing so we don't show all the information by default
[09:31] <mpt> carlos, the problem seems to be with the 'Spanish (es) translation of evolution-2.2 in Ubuntu Hoary package "evolution"'
[09:32] <carlos> (it was taking much more space than it's taking right now)
[09:32] <mpt> That could just be "evolution evolution-2.2"
[09:32] <carlos> yeah
[09:32] <carlos> so instead of using its display name
[09:33] <carlos> I should create my custom displayname there?
[09:33] <mpt> or "Ubuntu evolution evolution-2.2"
[09:33] <mpt> yes
[09:33] <carlos> with a single link?
[09:33] <mpt> the current displayname formatting isn't really good for much, I think
[09:33] <carlos> or being Ubuntu, evolution and evolution-2.2 different links?
[09:34] <mpt> one, I thinkd
[09:34] <carlos> mpt: take care that there will be many templates that will have the same sourcepackagename and translation domain
[09:34] <mpt> why?
[09:34] <carlos> so we would get: Ubuntu gedit gedit
[09:34] <mpt> hmmmm
[09:35] <mpt> so maybe we could omit the domain?
[09:35] <carlos> I guess
[09:35] <danilos> I think it makes more sense to omit the sourcepackagename
[09:35] <mpt> brb
[09:35] <carlos> danilos: not really
[09:36] <danilos> carlos: why not? what would be the problem?
[09:36] <carlos> for some packages, people will know that evolution-2.8 comes from evolution package
[09:36] <danilos> the link would still point to that particular package name
[09:36] <danilos> yeah, and the cases where it wouldn't be obvious would be?
[09:36] <carlos> but for instance, the man pages are imported with the translation domain 'man-page' (or somehting like that)
[09:36] <carlos> so you would get: Ubuntu man-page
[09:36] <danilos> (not that it wouldn't be solved simply by following a link)
[09:37] <carlos> and you don't know which man page it comes from
[09:37] <danilos> hum, I see your point
[09:37] <carlos> sure, but you need to follow the link
[09:37] <carlos> I think is more easy to just say the sourcepackage were it's from
[09:37] <carlos> and you don't need to follow the link to know if it fits the glossary your application follows
[09:38] <danilos> yeah, but what if you're translating evolution-2.8 and the translation comes from evolution-2.4 (a much more common case, I'd say)
[09:38] <carlos> think on KDE vs GNOME translations, not just Ubuntu ones
[09:38] <danilos> it'd be "Hum, this is already used in evolution, what?"
[09:38] <carlos> hmm
[09:38] <mpt> danilos, but sometimes the translation domain is something like "trunk", right?
[09:38] <mpt> or "main"
[09:38] <mpt> or something similarly vague
[09:39] <danilos> mpt: rarely afaik
[09:39] <carlos> mpt: yeah, that's what I just told him
[09:39] <carlos> but he did also a good point
 yeah, but what if you're translating evolution-2.8 and the translation comes from evolution-2.4 (a much more common case, I'd say)
 it'd be "Hum, this is already used in evolution, what?"
[09:39] <danilos> carlos: you told me that this is common for man-pages import and such, not quite common with regular packages
[09:39] <mpt> carlos, so is it usually true that the name of the package and the name of the domain are the same?
[09:39] <carlos> danilos: man pages are part of different packages
[09:40] <carlos> so evolution would have a man-page domain, gedit too, gcc, etc...
[09:40] <carlos> mpt: yeah, usually, it's true
[09:41] <carlos> but there are exceptions like evolution, gcc and many libraries (to allow more than one version installed at the same time)
[09:42] <mpt> carlos, so perhaps omit the domain if it's the same as the package name?
[09:42] <carlos> danilos: https://launchpad.net/potemplatenames/58320
[09:43] <SteveA> mpt: I recommend irssi + screen :-)
[09:43] <carlos> Another thing I was thinking on is to show 'Ubuntu Dapper - Evolution'
[09:43] <carlos> that will allow you to know whether it comes from a newer or an older version
[09:44] <carlos> and for products 'Evolution trunk' 'Evolution - 2.18', that's '$product - $productseries'
[09:45] <carlos> danilos, mpt: What do you think?
[09:45] <danilos> carlos: sure, that might make sense, but also watch out for the number of queries there (as I mentioned earlier, that's the most common timeout in bug 30602)
[09:45] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 30602 in rosetta "Timeout errors in +translate" [Critical,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30602
[09:46] <carlos> danilos: the problem with #30602 is more with a multiple row queries, in this case we are using and Index and getting just one row
[09:47] <carlos> I know that's still extra queries
[09:47] <carlos> but I don't think that's something we should care too much right, now. The problem there is the multiplejoins to get all suggestions
[09:47] <danilos> carlos: btw, I see your point with "manpage", but it obviously is not that bad, since there are only a dozen or so of them :)
[09:47] <carlos> that's the bottleneck
[09:47] <carlos> danilos: well, because we started importing documentation with dapper ;-)
[09:47] <danilos> mpt, carlos: I also like mpt's suggestion of showing domain only if different (or maybe if not .startswith())
[09:48] <carlos> danilos: the 'if not .startswith()' would leave outside evolution
[09:48] <carlos> is that ok for you?
[09:49] <danilos> ah, right, ignore the suggestion
[09:49] <danilos> I was thinking of showing the domain if it .startswith(sourcepackagename)
[09:49] <carlos> danilos, mpt: Anyway, the extra line that currently renders the pofile name will still be there
[09:50] <danilos> i.e. is there also eg. "gtk+-properties"?
[09:50] <danilos> yeah, lets get back on that topic
[09:50] <carlos> so the space of that page will be the same, just with less text
[09:50] <carlos> danilos: gtk20-properties is what we have right now
[09:51] <danilos> carlos: yeah, and gtk20, no? :)
[09:51] <carlos> yeah
[09:51] <danilos> ok, so evolution-* case is not isolated, just wanted to check that
[09:51] <danilos> mpt: I also feel most of that data is distracting from core information: suggestion text
[09:53] <mpt> yes
[09:54] <mpt> For one thing, the CSS should say that links inside class="discreet" don't get colored, just underlined
[09:55] <danilos> probably no need to use two different ways to differentiate suggestions from regular text as well (i.e. smaller font and gray colour)
[09:56] <danilos> i.e. I'd make the text of the same size as current translation, just of different colour; carlos, what do you think?
[09:57] <carlos> I think main text is more important than suggestions
[09:57] <danilos> carlos: yeah, but the colour is different: you're diminishing it in two ways, instead of only one, which should be enough imho
[09:57] <carlos> and a different colour would just mean that we should explain why it has a different colour
[09:58] <carlos> but I'm easy with that
[09:58] <danilos> well, as I said, this is just mh(non-designer)o, I'd wonder what mpt thinks :)
[10:00] <carlos> mpt: btw, I would also to know what do you suggest to render 'Current Spanish' for message #4
[10:01] <carlos> mpt: the spec says that we should use '(no translation yet)' when there is no translation at all, but I guess we should show to our users that it's not a translation that says '(no translation yet)' but a message about that fact
[10:02] <carlos> You don't need to give me an answer now, I think would be good enough if you could take that branch and give it some love when I'm done with it...
[10:03] <mpt> carlos, sure, sorry I was a little bit distracted
[10:03] <carlos> mpt: don't worry ;-)
[10:04] <mpt> mail me the URL of the branch, and I'll have a go
[10:05] <carlos> ok, thank you. I will send you the email as soon as I finish the form changes
[10:05] <carlos> I will put there a list of issues I think we should solve before going to production
[10:05] <carlos> danilos: I will ping you before sending that email so you can do another review first and add your comments too, ok?
[10:06] <danilos> carlos: sure :)
[11:05] <ddaa> Dzien dobry
[11:05] <ddaa> Sorry for being a bit late this morning, had some network problem.
[11:06] <ddaa> What happened to #canonical, did the passkey change?
[11:07] <carlos> ddaa: yes
[11:07] <carlos> ddaa: look at the warthogs mailing list
[11:08] <ddaa> thx
[11:08] <jamesh> ddaa: had a nice holiday?
[11:09] <ddaa> Not exactly fun as a barrel of puppies, but interesting and instructive.
[11:09] <ddaa> And very effective at flushing all work stuff out of my medium term memory too.
[11:10] <jamesh> we did a launchpad-bazaar meeting last week without you
[11:10] <jamesh> I've put up some minutes on the wiki
[11:10] <ddaa> Ale teraz mowi troche po polsku.
[11:11] <ddaa> Dzinkuj
[11:14] <danilos> carlos, jordi: I'm ok with spending between half an hour and one hour a day on import queue; I can start today between 16h and 17h (our time :)
[11:17] <jordi> danilos: sounds cool. Let's talk about it when I'm "at work" this evening at 17h?
[11:18] <danilos> jordi: sure (this was in relation to carlos' emailjust so you know if you haven't seen it :)
[11:19] <jordi> haven't seen it :p
[11:23] <carlos> danilos: ok
[11:23] <carlos> I think .pot files would be handled between today and tomorrow
[11:24] <jordi> yeah
[11:25] <danilos> carlos: yeah, that would be great: it should also mean that the queue would go dramatically down, right?
[11:25] <jordi> is the main import chunk done now?
[11:27] <carlos> jordi: yes
[11:27] <sivang> morning
[11:27] <carlos> danilos: well, I think it will have around 5000 - 6000 entries
[11:27] <carlos> with corner cases
[11:27] <carlos> perhaps less
[11:30] <ddaa> SteveA: lifeless: jamesh: spiv: meeting in 30 mins
[11:31] <danilos> carlos: ok
[12:27] <cprov> good morning, guys
[12:32] <sivang> morning cprov
[12:32] <cprov> sivang: hi dude !
[12:35] <sivang> cprov: how cool are you today? :-)
[12:37] <cprov> sivang: wow, depends what you mean by /cool/ <wink> I'm still recovering from along flight from london.
[12:37] <lifeless> reviewer meeting in 23
[12:39] <sivang> cprov: :)
[12:57] <lifeless> meeting in 3
[12:59] <lifeless> meeting in 1
[01:00] <lifeless> reviewer meeting time
[01:00] <lifeless> who art here ?
[01:00] <jamesh> I am
[01:01] <lifeless> spiv: ?
[01:01] <lifeless> SteveA: ?
[01:01] <lifeless> BjornT: ?
[01:01] <spiv> here
[01:01] <BjornT> i'm here
[01:01] <lifeless> oh right, I remember, BjornT and SteveA will be on leave
[01:01] <lifeless> BjornT: thanks!
[01:02] <lifeless>  * Next meeting
[01:02] <lifeless>  * Queue status.
[01:02] <BjornT> lifeless: well, afaik i shouldn't be on leave :)
[01:02] <lifeless> BjornT: ah, interesting :)
[01:02] <lifeless> BjornT: I thought it was a public holiday
[01:02] <lifeless> 2006-09-04 at 1100 UTC.
[01:02] <lifeless> thats when I propose the next meeting be
[01:02] <jamesh> it is in the UK
[01:02] <lifeless> 1 week
[01:02] <lifeless> jamesh: ah, that 'splains it
[01:03] <jamesh> sounds fine
[01:03] <lifeless> all opposed say 'moo'
[01:03] <lifeless> ok, that it is
[01:03] <lifeless> queue status - looking goood
[01:03] <SteveA> hi lifeless
[01:03] <jamesh> I finished off the month old branch today
[01:04] <lifeless> 4 core reviews, oldest is 2 days (not counting the weekend)
[01:04] <lifeless> and 3 tiny tiny branches
[01:04] <SteveA> lifeless: it's a UK public holiday today, but not a lithuanian one.  for historical reasons, I take UK holidays
[01:04] <lifeless> so we're caught up again, but I suspect that may just mean there is lots of needs-reply coming back through
[01:04] <lifeless> SteveA: I get it now
[01:05] <SteveA> lifeless: I have a bunch of intense stuff to arrange this week, so I'd appreciate no new code reviews for the next few days.
[01:05] <lifeless> spiv: what were we talking about on thursday, that I suggested you raise today ?
[01:05] <lifeless> SteveA: sure, I can arrange that
[01:05] <SteveA> thanks
[01:06] <lifeless> hey everyone, steve says stop work !!!
[01:06] <lifeless> :)
[01:06] <spiv> lifeless: um
[01:06] <spiv> lifeless: I can't remember.
[01:06] <lifeless> SteveA: seriously, no problems, review team is in good shape
[01:06] <spiv> lifeless: I'll let you know if it comes back to me
[01:06] <lifeless> ok.
[01:06] <lifeless> how are the voice calls going ?
[01:07] <jamesh> I haven't had one in a number of week
[01:07] <jamesh> s
[01:07] <lifeless> have we all published our 'office hour' ?
[01:07] <jamesh> where do we do that?
[01:08] <lifeless> I assumed we'd do in in the staffcalendar - where our daily schedules are published
[01:08] <spiv> I thought that was on hold pending a conversation between Steve and kiko after the last lp meeting?
[01:08] <lifeless> spiv: ah.
[01:08] <lifeless> in which case, last call for any new business ?
[01:09] <lifeless> 5
[01:09] <lifeless> 4
[01:09] <lifeless> 3
[01:09] <lifeless> 2
[01:09] <lifeless> 1
[01:09] <lifeless> ---<Meeting Ends>---
[01:10] <lifeless> tchau-for-now
[02:26] <ddaa> mhmh
[02:27] <ddaa> I've got an interesting bug report
[02:27] <ddaa> https://launchpad.net/products/bzrk/+bug/56881
[02:27] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 56881 in bzrk "Not redirected to bzr-gtk" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]
[02:27] <ddaa> This user wants /products/bzrk to redirect to /products/bzr-gtk
[02:27] <ddaa> Launchpad cannot do that AFAIK.
[02:27] <ddaa> Do we want it to?
[02:28] <LarstiQ> I don't think so.
[02:28] <LarstiQ> at least, in this specific case.
[02:29] <ddaa> Ha, LarstiQ
[02:29] <ddaa> can you handle that bug please?
[02:29] <LarstiQ> will do.
[02:29] <ddaa> I'm open to suggestions for new launchpad features, but I'm way out of touch for bzrk bugs.
[02:30] <LarstiQ> ddaa: aliases for a product might make sense, but if there is prior history, I'm very reluctant to hide that
[02:31] <ddaa> Agreed. I can imagine ways to report that a product is deprecated in favor of another, but I'm not going to say any more because I do not think it's important enough a use case to implement in the forseeable future.
[02:32] <LarstiQ> agreed
[02:32] <LarstiQ> welcome back btw :)
[02:32] <ddaa> Prosz
[02:33] <ddaa> let's continue on #bzr
[02:38] <asabil> hello all
[02:39] <asabil> is it normal to have a delay between the time we push something in the bzr repo
[02:39] <asabil> and the time it can be accessed ?
[02:42] <spiv> asabil: yes
[02:42] <spiv> asabil: it should be short (a few minutes)
[02:42] <asabil> how much time ?
[02:42] <asabil> okidoki thanks
[02:43] <LarstiQ> asabil: do you mean bazaar.launchpad.net, and sftp vs http?
[02:43] <spiv> If it's not, please let us know here or file a bug and we'll take a look.
[02:43] <spiv> LarstiQ: that's what I'm assuming...
[02:43] <asabil> yes
[02:43] <spiv> Phew :)
[02:43] <LarstiQ> spiv: and that takes a few minutes? I thought up till a day?
[02:43] <asabil> sftp vs. http
[02:43] <asabil> on bazaar.launchpad.net
[02:43] <spiv> LarstiQ: We've tweaked the cron jobs involved :)
[02:43] <LarstiQ> spiv: ah, good to hear that :)
[02:47] <asabil> it has been 20 minutes already
[02:47] <asabil> is that normal ?
[02:48] <spiv> asabil: hmm, that's a bit slow
[02:48] <spiv> what's the branch?
[02:49] <asabil> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~jprieur/pymsn/cocoon/
[03:07] <spiv> asabil: the mirroring script seems to be stuck.  I'll poke an admin.
[03:07] <spiv> asabil: thanks for the report.
[03:08] <asabil> I am the one who should thank you
[03:08] <asabil> :)
[03:22] <salgado> spiv, is there any changes I still need to do on my support-tracker-karma branch?
[03:25] <spiv> salgado: dunno, what does my review say? :)
[03:26] <salgado> spiv, well, the status is merge-conditional, and I think I addressed all the points you made, but IISTR that my last reply had some new points
[03:27] <salgado> yeah, about adding the user to the 'Karma added:' line on doctests
[03:28] <salgado> spiv, do you think it's worth doing it, even though we'll make them less readable?
[03:28] <spiv> salgado: if readability is significantly hurt, no.
[03:29] <spiv> if it has a really, really slight readability impact, then maybe the benefit would be justified.  But in *doc*tests, readability comes first.
[03:29] <spiv> If you can't comfortably do all the testing you want in a doctest... take the hint, and don't use a doctest :)
[03:31] <spiv> (not that readability can be ignored in plain python unit tests, but you can do lots of comprehensive assertions of little details much more readably there, and you don't have to worry about detracting from the quality of docs.
[03:31] <spiv> )
[03:32] <spiv> doctests are really good at being testable documentation.  They're not necessarily ideal for tests themselves.
[03:33] <salgado> agreed.  but I usually prefer a doctest in a directory other than the system doctests one instead of a unit test
[03:34] <salgado> unless we need to test too many different corner cases and stuff, like what we do in the mirror prober
[03:35] <spiv> Right.
[03:37] <spiv> So my point with adding a user to the "Karma added:" lines is that it seems to me that perhaps the docs are becoming more tests of details than docs.  We don't need to be perfectly rigid of course, but when in doubt I'd do what keeps the docs more like docs than like tests.
[03:39] <salgado> yeah, that's a good point
[03:39] <asabil> still not fixed ?
[03:40] <spiv> asabil: no :(
[03:40] <asabil> :/
[03:41] <asabil> could you notify me when fixed please ?
[03:44] <spiv> asabil: ok.
[03:45] <asabil> thanks
[03:56] <bradb> flacoste: Did you see jjesse's email to l-u@? He was wondering why there's a support ticket portlet on his person page, which also showed Answered and really old tickets, and how he could remove it.
[03:56] <spiv> asabil: the relevant script has restarted, hopefully it'll work this time.
[03:57] <asabil> thanks
[03:57] <spiv> asabil: I'm looking into the cause, but it's about time for me to sleep...
[03:57] <flacoste> bradb: yes, I saw that one
[03:57] <asabil> okey :)
[03:57] <spiv> asabil: it's possible it's already got to your branch, you might like to check.
[03:57] <asabil> thanks for your help
[03:57] <asabil> not yet :(
[03:57] <spiv> Ah well.  It seems to be running fine at the moment, so it's probably not long before it gets to you.
[04:26] <crimsun> When attempting to report a bug against a source package (xmame) in Ubuntu multiverse, LP is telling me the source package and all of its binary packages don't exist in Ubuntu. Is this intentional?
[04:27] <danilos> carlos: ping
[04:27] <carlos> danilos: pong
[04:27] <danilos> carlos: I'm about to start working through imports queue
[04:28] <danilos> carlos: I might have some questions as I go on
[04:28] <carlos> ok
[04:28] <carlos> danilos: sure
[04:28] <danilos> just so you know :)
[04:28] <carlos> ping me
[04:28] <salgado> crimsun, in which page you're experiencing this?
[04:28] <carlos> danilos: just a hint
[04:28] <danilos> sure
[04:28] <crimsun> salgado: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+filebug
[04:29] <carlos> danilos: all man pages have as the translation domain 'man-pages'
[04:29] <danilos> carlos: yeah, got that one already :)
[04:29] <carlos> danilos: if you find one package with more than one man-page... we have troubles ;-)
[04:30] <carlos> about .pot files with .desktop information
[04:30] <danilos> carlos: right; but, how do I tell if a POT is actually for a man page?
[04:30] <carlos> danilos: they should have exactly the same translation domain as filename (most of those will be from KDE)
[04:30] <danilos> carlos: ah, ok
[04:31] <carlos> danilos: you can download it and guess it from the content but most of the time, the filename gives you enough clues
[04:31] <salgado> crimsun, please use https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/xmame/+filebug for now.  I'll investigate the issue and report a bug, if not already reported
[04:31] <carlos> danilos: also, for now, ignore every .pot file inside debian/ directory
[04:31] <crimsun> salgado: I've tried that, too.
[04:31] <danilos> carlos: ok
[04:32] <salgado> crimsun, eek. that doesn't work either?
[04:32] <carlos> there are some we should not import and others have some special names so let's give you less corner cases to start with ;-)
[04:32] <danilos> carlos: postgres has a number of pots, how do I handle that? (i.e. why was it not automatically approved)?
[04:32] <crimsun> salgado: nope. What's puzzling is that I'm attempting to file a bug against the xmame source to resolve an issue that was just raised (bug 57995)
[04:33] <Ubug2> Malone bug 57995 in xmame "Impossible to use configuration menus in xmess" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/57995
[04:33] <carlos> danilos: that one is because the path has a version specific directory
[04:34] <danilos> carlos: ah, ok, so I just go ahead and import them if the domain exists? (if not, I create a proper one, right?)
[04:34] <carlos> danilos: if you edit the old potemplate and change the path to the new one, it will be automatically imported after that
[04:34] <carlos> danilos: right
[04:35] <danilos> carlos: ok, so what's better? to change potemplate name here and set to "approved" manually, or change path in the old potemplate?
[04:35] <carlos> danilos: whatever you prefer ;-)
[04:35] <danilos> ok :)
[04:35] <salgado> bradb, around?
[04:35] <carlos> I usually change the path
[04:36] <bradb> salgado: hi
[04:36] <carlos> so the .pot and .po files are approved at the same time
[04:36] <carlos> but both solutions should work
[04:36] <BjornT> crimsun: that's a strange bug. but to work around it you can leave the package blank, then set it after the bug has been filed. or you could file it against xmess-x, that seems to work..
[04:36] <crimsun> BjornT: ok, I'll try that approach, thanks.
[04:37] <danilos> carlos: ok, I'll do that way as well
[04:37] <salgado> bradb, hey. nm, BjornT already replied
[04:37] <bradb> salgado: ok :)
[04:37] <carlos> danilos: ok
[04:39] <BjornT> bradb: maybe you have an idea of what's wrong though? it's not possible to file a bug on xmame directly, even though it seems to be published in ubuntu. filing it on (the binary package) xmess-x works, though, it sets the source package to xmame.
[04:43] <bradb> one sec, just finishing up an email
[04:44] <kiko> morning
[04:45] <BjornT> bradb: nm, i think i found it
[04:46] <BjornT> it seems that xmame is a binary package name, and since it's not published, a NotFoundError exception is raised before checking if a source package is published
[04:47] <kiko> BjornT, in guessPackageNames?
[04:47] <BjornT> kiko: yeah
[04:47] <kiko> bummer man
[04:47] <danilos> carlos: now, with gcc-4.1; we've got gcc-4.0, but no 4.1: do I create new potemplatenames, or what?
[04:48] <flacoste> kiko-fud: morning! had a nice trip back?
[04:48] <kiko> flacoste, not really. but it's nice being home :)
[04:48] <carlos> danilos: well, that sounds like they didn't change the translation domain....
[04:48] <flacoste> kiko-fud: airport procedures still sucks i guess
[04:49] <carlos> danilos: those cases have an ugly solution... usually getting the source package and check the source...
[04:49] <danilos> carlos: yeah, most likely they didn't
[04:49] <bradb> BjornT: You say it's a binary package, and unpublished, but:
[04:49] <bradb> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/xmame
[04:49] <bradb> That makes it look like an sp name, and published
[04:49] <kiko> spiv, are you around?
[04:49] <danilos> carlos: yay :)
[04:49] <danilos> carlos: I've got gcc.pot, so it probably means no template name change, right?
[04:50] <carlos> danilos: usually, main gcc has 'gcc' translation domain
[04:50] <bradb> BjornT: ah, nm, i see what you mean
[04:50] <BjornT> right
[04:51] <carlos> danilos: and the others have the translation domain renamed to allow more than one version installed at the same time
[04:51] <danilos> carlos: yeah, but there are several others; and the 4.0 has used gcc-4.0 as the template name, afaict: https://launchpad.net/potemplatenames/461/+edit
[04:52] <carlos> danilos: it changes from release to release
[04:52] <danilos> ok, so I'll check the source
[04:52] <kiko> SteveA, do you know something about the auth code?
[04:52] <carlos> hmm
[04:53] <kiko> the wiki auth code in particular
[04:53] <danilos> it would have probabl helped if I ran edgy myself :(
[04:53] <carlos> danilos: in fact I did a mistake... 'gcc' didn't exist ever, or at least in our database
[04:54] <carlos> danilos: well, I usually change deb-src lines in sources.lists to edgy and that's enough
[04:55] <danilos> carlos: yeah, I can do that probably :)
[05:01] <Ubug2> New bug: #57999 in launchpad-bazaar "Broken grub imports" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/57999
[05:01] <Ubug2> New bug: #58000 in malone "Not possible to file a bug on xmame directly" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58000
[05:03] <ddaa> elmo: Znarl: help!
[05:04] <danilos> carlos: btw, for gcc, it's enough if one downloads a .diff.gz from http://packages.ubuntulinux.org/edgy/source/gcc-4.1 to check the bindtextdomain change :)
[05:05] <carlos> ;-)
[05:05] <carlos> yeah, it's a local change from Debian/Ubuntu
[05:05] <ddaa> there's no /srv/importd on escudero anymore!!!
[05:05] <ddaa> all vcs imports are broken!
[05:05] <ddaa> where's my data??????
[05:05] <kiko> ddaa, #canonical-sysadmin perhaps?
[05:07] <ddaa> kiko: thanks
[05:09] <salgado> hey kiko.  will you have some time to look at https://launchpad.canonical.com/PersonCreationRationale today?
[05:10] <kiko> salgado, yes.
[05:15] <kiko> does anyone know if a rollout is planned for tomorrow?
[05:16] <danilos> carlos: re pq imports/domanis: even if I changed paths, they are still in the review queue; do I need to do anything else for it to be picked up, or just need to wait for poimports script to run (10 mins have passed)
[05:16] <carlos> danilos: just wait
[05:17] <danilos> carlos: ok; also, there are same POTs imported from gcj as well as gcc; do I reject those for gcj?
[05:17] <carlos> danilos: https://launchpad.net/rosetta/imports/+index?target=all&status=APPROVED&type=all
[05:17] <carlos> there are already approved things
[05:18] <carlos> so the script needs to finish with them before approving new ones
[05:18] <asabil> is launchpad still broken ?
[05:18] <kiko> asabil, broken?
[05:18] <carlos> was it broken?
[05:18] <LarstiQ> branch replication was stuck
 asabil: the mirroring script seems to be stuck.  I'll poke an admin.
 asabil: thanks for the report.
[05:19] <danilos> carlos: ok, but some things (like my gcc updates) have already gotten into the queue
[05:19] <asabil> it is still stuck i thing
[05:19] <asabil> think*
[05:20] <carlos> danilos: let's wait a bit
[05:20] <carlos> danilos: about gcj, block the ones duplicated there or just leave them to be reviewed by jordi or me so we double check those things
[05:20] <asabil> anyone ?
[05:21] <kiko> asabil, we're still looking into it. ddaa will update you.
[05:21] <asabil> okey thanks
[05:21] <jordi> hey carlos, danilo
[05:22] <jordi> man there were 6000 emails waiting for mae at the mail server
[05:22] <carlos> jordi: hey
[05:22] <ddaa> kiko: mh, I though that was done, I'll try to figure out what's going on
[05:22] <jordi> fscking edgy merges
[05:23] <carlos> jordi: ;-)
[05:31] <carlos> jordi, danilos: I need to go out, will be back later. Do you need anything from me?
[05:33] <danilos> jordi: I didn't send all of them, don't blame me this time :)
[05:33] <danilos> carlos: no, I guess jordi will be able to help with any issues I've got :)
[05:33] <carlos> ok
[05:33] <carlos> anyway, I should be back in less than one hour
[05:44] <salgado> mpt, around?
[05:46] <asabil> still not fixed :'(
[05:47] <kiko> asabil, it's a holiday in the UK today, so our admins team is running half-bar
[05:47] <kiko> ddaa, do you have an idea of what is up? does it indeed require admin intervention?
[05:48] <asabil> oh, sorry didn't know
[05:48] <kiko> yeah, I just remembered
[05:50] <jordi> danilos: how do we split this stuff?
[05:56] <danilos> jordi: I don't know
[05:56] <danilos> jordi: I've done postgres stuff
[05:57] <jordi> ok
[05:57] <jordi> I should try to finish up the KDE mail before doing queue though
[05:57] <jordi> that's getting old alreadhy
[05:57] <danilos> jordi: I'm also done with the queue for today
[05:57] <jordi> ok
[05:57] <danilos> jordi: yeah, go for it :)
[05:58] <ddaa> kiko: no clue
[05:58] <ddaa> did not have time to check that yet
[06:00] <kiko> ddaa, would be nice to get asabil with at least a schedule
[06:01] <LarstiQ> I thought spiv thought that it was running again?
[06:02] <ddaa> yep, I'll try to get a sense of what's going on
[06:02] <ddaa> he apparently thought that
[06:02] <LarstiQ> gah!
[06:03] <LarstiQ> and instead of being taken to that product/package, it opens to change the status
[06:04] <kiko> LarstiQ, I think we're fixing that very soon now
[06:06] <Kuhrscher> Hi, is the import of upstream translations for edgy already finished?
[06:09] <LarstiQ> kiko: that would be very nice
[06:18] <salgado> somebody removed arrowBlank.gif from our tree, but it's used in lib/contrib/templates/sorttable.js
[06:18] <ddaa> duh, somebody asked an import of that: http://twpug.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/phpsurveyor/
[06:19] <ddaa> actually the user gave the root of the svn repo...
[06:19] <ddaa> not sure if I should fix the svn url or just leave it to fail
[06:19] <salgado> I think this is likely to happen again, since we don't usually grep for references to things we're removing in the contrib directories
[06:19] <salgado> kiko, would it be okay to move that sortable.js into launchpad/templates?
[06:20] <salgado> (rationale above)
[06:20] <kiko> salgado, it's non-JS code, so, hmmm, no.
[06:20] <kiko> err
[06:20] <kiko> contributed code
[06:20] <kiko> we could however avoid this happening...
[06:20] <kiko> salgado, adding a comment in the zcml should be enough to avoid people clobbering it, no?
[06:21] <salgado> maybe
[06:21] <salgado> if I add a new "var foo = "/++resource++foo.gif"; there I won't remember to add a comment on the zcml of foo
[06:22] <salgado> anyway, I think it'll do for now
[06:23] <kiko> yeah
[06:23] <kiko> var arrowBlank?
[06:24] <salgado> eh?
[06:27] <kiko> salgado, you said "var foo".
[06:28] <salgado> I meant:  if I add a new launchpad resource there, I won't remember to add a comment on that resource's zcml
[06:28] <salgado> which could lead to this problem happening again
[06:28] <ddaa> kiko: I need to got out buy food
[06:29] <ddaa> I'll look at the branch puller once I get a chance this evening
[06:29] <kiko> ddaa, fix the URL for now?
[06:29] <ddaa> yeah, I fixed that import
[06:29] <ddaa> it's a taiwanese lug svn repo apparently
[06:29] <ddaa> so it makes sense
[06:30] <kiko> I see
[06:30] <kiko> ddaa, so it's working now? asabil should be appeased?
[06:30] <ddaa> dunno
[06:30] <ddaa> been doing importd maintenance
[06:31] <ddaa> being interrupted by girl now
[06:34] <ddaa> does not appear fixed though
[06:55] <asabil> sorry was away
[06:55] <asabil> not fixed, still the same
[08:07] <jordi> carlos: https://launchpad.net/products/picard/main/+pots/picard
[08:07] <jordi> how can we move Norwegian to nb and remove English?
[08:07] <carlos> DBA requests
[08:08] <carlos> jordi: please, file a bug
[08:08] <jordi> okay
[08:08] <carlos> and I will prepare the request
[08:15] <Ubug2> New bug: #58024 in rosetta "Please remove English and move "no" to "nb"" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58024
[08:20] <flacoste> kiko-fud: ping
[08:26] <Ubug2> New bug: #58025 in launchpad-support-tracker "Don't show portlet with old and answered support requests at /people/$person page." [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58025
[08:39] <flacoste> matsubara: thanks for replying to jonathan jesse
[08:40] <matsubara> flacoste: np
[08:48] <ddaa> okay, let's see what's bothering the branch puller
[08:48] <ddaa> well, it's been spewing errors as usual
[08:48] <ddaa> looks like it's running...
[08:49] <asabil> oO
[08:49] <ddaa> asabil: the errors I'm talking about are not serious
[08:49] <asabil> okidoki
[08:50] <ddaa> failure to access some sftp-hosted branches, and things the data center which are not routable from there, and anyway should not carry public data
[08:50] <ddaa> asabil: which branch do you have a problem with?
[08:50] <asabil> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~jprieur/pymsn/cocoon/
[08:51] <ddaa> okay, three revisions there
[08:52] <ddaa> the absence of visible files is normal, although confusing
[08:52] <ddaa> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~jprieur/pymsn/cocoon/.bzr/
[08:53] <asabil> yes I know
[08:53] <asabil> I have been using bzr for a while
[08:53] <asabil> the problem is this :
[08:53] <asabil> 0 revision(s) pulled.
[08:53] <ddaa> sorry
[08:54] <ddaa> when doing what?
[08:54] <asabil> you don't have to be sorry :p
[08:54] <asabil> bzr pull
[08:54] <asabil> i should receive 2 revisions
[08:55] <ddaa> so, that's the branch page https://launchpad.net/people/jprieur/+branch/pymsn/cocoon
[08:55] <asabil> yes ?
[08:55] <asabil> the prob is the sync between sftp and http
[08:55] <ddaa> right
[08:56] <ddaa> I'll dig into the supermirror and find the sftp data to compare
[08:56] <asabil> k thanks
[09:05] <ddaa> okay, there are five revs on the sftp filesystem
[09:06] <kiko-fud> flacoste, pong?
[09:07] <ddaa> hey kiko, is there an easy way to talk xmlrpc to the authserver manually?
[09:07] <ddaa> need to check what it gives to the branch puller, there's obviously something wrong going on
[09:07] <kiko> ddaa, I'm not familiar with how the authserver works, unfortunately. I think there are wiki docs on it though
[09:08] <flacoste> kiko: do you think you'll have time to approve the SupportTrackerWorkflow spec soon?
[09:08] <kiko> ddaa, hmmm, interesting -- there has been a problem with wiki auth today
[09:09] <ddaa> mh
[09:09] <ddaa> I do not think it would be the same problem
[09:09] <ddaa> the branch puller appears to be working normally
[09:09] <ddaa> it's not doing what it's supposed to do
[09:10] <ddaa> so I think it's rather a regression
[09:10] <ddaa> kiko: there was a rollout today, right?
[09:15] <asabil> :/
[09:20] <kiko> flacoste, I should, ddaa not that I know of -- LaunchpadProductionStatus was not updated at least.
[09:21] <Mez> hey, an import of a SVN branch failed, can someone have a look see why ?
[09:21] <ddaa> Mez: I'm the guy to do that, but I cannot look at it right now
[09:22] <ddaa> Mez: well, which import is that?
[09:22] <Mez> ddaa: katapult
[09:22] <ddaa> ha
[09:22] <Mez> https://launchpad.net/products/katapult/mainstream
[09:22] <ddaa> I know
[09:22] <ddaa> I babysitted it just today
[09:22] <Mez> lol
[09:22] <Mez> whats wrong with it ?
[09:23] <ddaa> see https://help.launchpad.net/VcsImportRequests
[09:23] <ddaa> It's in "Unsorted failures"
[09:24] <ddaa> IOW, the log says katapult/katapult.desktop is modified in revision 522145, but it's not present in the imported tree at this point.
[09:25] <ddaa> Might be a svn repo inconsistency, or a bug in cscvs leading to an incorrect tree.
[09:26] <Mez> ddaa, last change to it was  575873
[09:26] <Mez> oh, it gets the whole history?
[09:27] <ddaa> Mez: it would help if you could confirm that the log for svn://anonsvn.kde.org/home/kde/trunk/extragear/utils/katapult up to revision 522145 actually reports a change that can be applied given a checkout from the first revision mentioned in the log.
[09:27] <ddaa> Mez: according to the cscvs output, the history starts as 521764, then 522145
[09:27] <ddaa> so it's effectively the second revision of the import
[09:28] <Mez> ddaa: see here http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/extragear/utils/katapult/katapult/katapult.desktop?rev=575873&view=log
[09:28] <ddaa> yes, we get the whole history for the specified branch
[09:29] <Mez> ddaa: what are you asking me to confirm?
[09:30] <Mez> diff from 521764 to 522145 = http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/extragear/utils/katapult/katapult/katapult.desktop?rev=522145&r1=521764&r2=522145&makepatch=1&diff_format=u
[09:32] <ddaa> that the log for the svn branch starts with 521764, then 522145. And that a checkout of 521764 does not contain katapult/katapult.desktop, and that the log for 522145 says that this file was changed.
[09:33] <ddaa> If all of that is true, it's an inconsistency in the svn repo, or it's another svn corner case I am not aware of yet.
[09:33] <Mez> 521764 DOES contain katapult/katapult.desktop
[09:34] <ddaa> Thank you.
[09:34] <ddaa> Then that's a bug in cscvs. But I do not think I'll be able to fix it soon.
[09:34] <ddaa> very weird, in any case
[09:35] <Mez> ddaa: 521764 was a move in SVN... which may be the probelm
[09:35] <ddaa> not really, since that's the point the branch is created
[09:35] <ddaa> mh
[09:35] <Mez> ddaa: there is a history for the branch before that though ...
[09:36] <ddaa> wtf???
[09:36] <Mez> ddaa: have a look at
[09:36] <Mez> http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/extragear/utils/katapult/katapult/katapult.desktop?rev=575873&view=log
[09:36] <Mez> 519805 = initial import to KDE's SVN
[09:36] <ddaa> it's not the log we care about here
[09:37] <ddaa> we care about the log of the branch
[09:37] <Mez> 521764 = where it was moved from trunk/playground to trunk/extragear
[09:37] <Mez> or am i just getting myself confused here?
[09:42] <ddaa> Mez: Launchpad imports currently completely ignore renames and moves
[09:42] <ddaa> they turn them into add+remove
[09:43] <Mez> ddaa: i've no idea what the problem is then
[09:43] <ddaa> looking
[09:45] <ddaa> mh
[09:52] <ddaa> Okay
[09:53] <ddaa> It's pretty clear that when the initial revision of an import is a move, it's not handled properly
[09:54] <ddaa> the imported tree, with only one revision so far, has _no_ file in it
[10:03] <Mez> :(
[10:05] <ddaa> I'll write the finding down and file a bug.
[10:05] <ddaa> But I cannot afford to dig into the code now.
[10:05] <ddaa> I have a much bigger problem with launchpad not longer updating the mirror of hosted branches.
[10:13] <Mez> ddaa: fun
[10:13] <Mez> at least we can get it rhgouh sftp
[10:16] <ddaa> Bah, Mez is gone. For the record it's bug 58029.
[10:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 58029 in launchpad-bazaar "svn import fail when branch is created by a move" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58029
[10:23] <jkakar> Is there any policy around changing the status of a bug against the Launchpad product?
[10:23] <jkakar> I've discovered a bug is already present for my problem.  I want to change the status to "Confirmed".
[10:25] <ddaa> I do not think there's a policy against that.
[10:25] <Ubugtu> New bug: #58029 in launchpad-bazaar "svn import fail when branch is created by a move" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58029
[10:29] <Kuhrscher> Hmm, is it possible that the translation of ktorrent-2.0.1 has not been imported to rosetta?
[10:29] <ddaa> Sweet, I do not have the privs to run the branch puller :(
[10:29] <ddaa> kiko: cannot easily diagnose anything about the branch puller if I cannot even tweak the verbosity of the cron job.
[10:31] <ddaa> I'll file some RT requests and call it a day.
[10:43] <kiko> ddaa, RT requests, good idea.
[10:44] <ddaa> cool, two of my production systems blocked offline and blocked on RT :(
[10:48] <ddaa> Good night all
[10:50] <mememe> hi, how do I unregister / delete myself from launchpad?
[10:53] <mhz> hi guys
[10:53] <salgado> kiko, did you look at that spec already? :)
[10:54] <mhz> if a Moin version/macro  could actually count and sum every single page a user has contributed to, would that mean Karma will consider wiki contribs?
[10:55] <Ubugtu> New bug: #58036 in launchpad "Broken link pointing to non-existent gnome-product" [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58036
[11:02] <lifeless> moining
[11:02] <LarstiQ> moin lifeless
[11:11] <kiko> salgado, nope.
[11:12] <SteveA> hi kiko
[11:12] <SteveA> you asked about auth code something?
[11:12] <mhz> in other words, what will it take for LP to accept Moin counting user contribs to be added to karma?
[11:12] <kiko> mhz, hmmm. hmmm!
[11:13] <kiko> interesting idea.
[11:13] <mhz> but?
[11:13] <kiko> it's not exactly trivial to implement with our current architecture
[11:13] <kiko> but worth a bug and some consideration
[11:14] <mhz> well, currently, moin only counts user contribs is the NameLastname is actually written on the page, so I am designing a couple of ideas to have moin actually count user contribs even if NameLastname has not been specified
[11:14] <mhz> is = if
[11:15] <kiko> mhz, we know the user logged in, of course
[11:15] <mhz> of course
[11:15] <mhz> however, Moin does not sum it
[11:15] <mhz> so, working on cache + RC could be a way
[11:16] <mhz> the idea, of course is not to slower it down
[11:17] <mhz> kiko: and considering Moin 1.6 implements emails to be CC'ed to create wiki pages
[11:18] <mhz> and also allows users to Sync pages from local to server instance... counting user support/contribs can become essential
 if a Moin version/macro  could actually count and sum every single page a user has contributed to, would that mean Karma will consider wiki contribs?
[11:19] <kiko> to answer your question: our Karma is calculated based on a sum of Karma events that happen over time.
[11:19] <kiko> so more likely we would just add a moin edit Karma event and update it when user X edited a page.
[11:19] <mhz> hmm
[11:20] <kiko> to distinguish between minor and major events we could use the amount of text added or changed
[11:20] <kiko> though.. that's not fail-safe of course
[11:21] <mhz> yeah, interesting pont
[11:21] <mhz> point
[11:22] <mhz> but...the thing is that sometimes, users on wikis may edit grammar
[11:22] <mhz> or stuff like that, that is not 'amount' but 'quality'
[11:29] <mdke> while on the subject of moin, it would be nice to abolish the distinction between Launchpad homepages and wiki personal pages
[11:29] <kiko> mhz, it's hard to gauge, I know.
[11:29] <mdke> I bet it would be easy to get Moin to link people's WikiNames with their LP homepages instead of WikiPages
[11:30] <mhz> indeed
[11:34] <kiko> that would be indeed an easy change. but.. well, their LP homepages are not really good wikipage-substitutes.
[11:35] <mdke> why?
[11:35] <Ubugtu> New bug: #58040 in malone "Also affects: distribution should select current distro by default" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58040
[11:35] <mhz> but.... LP could point homepages to Moin pages
[11:35] <kiko> mdke, well, for one, you can't use moin syntax in LP!
[11:36] <mdke> kiko: sounds good :) I don't think people need clever moin features in their homepages
[11:36] <mdke> it's mainly contact details and so on
[11:36] <kiko> but basic markup would be nice
[11:37] <mdke> mhz: no, that wouldn't work: launchpad isn't associated with one specific wiki. It would be cool to be the other way round so people can use the same homepage for lots of wikis
[11:39] <mhz> well, people can
[11:39] <mhz> and yes, basic syntax would be cool
[11:43] <mhz> Interwiki feature allows people to share wikiwide
[11:43] <kiko> Note BradB: a TWO COLUMN BUG PAGE! Thought you'd like that
[11:43] <bradb> kiko: indeed :)
[11:43] <kiko> you'd think!
[11:44] <kiko> salgado, what should I look at?
[11:44] <salgado> kiko, outstanding issues?
[11:44] <kiko> what URL to start out with
[11:44] <salgado> https://launchpad.canonical.com/PersonCreationRationale
[11:50] <mhz_off> well, bytes, you all
[11:55] <matsubara> bradb, BjornT: so entering a non-alphanumeric (e.g. #, &) character into the tag field returns a 'Wrong contained type' message. Is that a known bug or not?
[11:56] <kiko> not that I know of matsubara
[12:10] <Ubugtu> New bug: #58043 in malone "Tag field should say it accept only alphanumeric characters instead of 'Wrong contained type'" [Low,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/58043