[08:10] <dholbach> good morning
[16:54] <nigelb> dholbach: nice to see you've kicked ubuflu back :)
[17:01] <dholbach> almost, yes :)
[17:01] <nigelb> ok, so we've made some progress over the last 2 days
[17:02] <nigelb> Have you seen https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-reviewers late?
[17:02] <nigelb> *lately
[17:39] <dholbach> nigelb: nope, how are we looking? :)
[17:39] <nigelb> dholbach: I've been working on subscribing us to every bug, so we can keep track of our subset
[17:39] <dholbach> so we'll look a bit busier in the next few days :)
[17:39] <nigelb> but the script is giving me 410 errors
[17:40] <dholbach> what does it say?
[17:40] <nigelb> can you debug and re-run the script some place with fast LP acess?
[17:40] <nigelb> lemme pastebin
[17:40] <nigelb> dholbach: http://paste.ubuntu.com/439434/ this is the top half of the error
[17:41] <dholbach> where's the script?
[17:42] <dholbach> nigelb: ^
[17:44] <dholbach> this is what I use with launchpadlib:    bug.subscribe(person=some_person_object)
[17:46] <dholbach> nigelb: drop me a mail about it and I'll have a look at it either later when I get back again or early tomorrow
[17:47] <dholbach> I'll head out now :)
[18:11] <persia> nigelb: You're encountering latency errors?  Or something else.
[18:54] <james_w> nigelb: you are accessing a person that was a spammer and so had their account disabled in LP
[19:05] <persia> But how, when it's trying to subscribe a team that is known to exist.
[19:05] <persia> is there some automatic spammer detection that would flip on when someone ran a script like this from an odd place?
[19:27] <james_w> not that I know of
[19:28] <james_w> if it's just ~ubuntu-reviews being subscribed then it could be something like one of the members of ~ubuntu-reviews having been disabled, or someone subscribed to the bug or similar, which would make it an LP bug.


[00:12] <xu-help72w> Hello, anybody there?
[00:25] <xu-help72w> Just updated system -18.04-bionic, rebooted and lost external monitor. Have not been able to get it back. Display settings do not show external monitor available. Settings editor has HDMI checked. Tried updates - no joy. Restart several times. gpu-manager states: Error: can't open /lib/modules/4.15.0-177-generic/updates/dkms. Not sure where to go.
[00:26] <xu-help72w> Can anyody help???
[00:48] <xu-help72w5> need help with Display
[00:48] <xu-help72w5> anybody on?
[19:53] <alexp11223> Any ideas how to solve this lagginess? https://www.reddit.com/r/MiniPCs/comments/usj4uq/xubuntu_is_very_laggy_on_mele_quieter3q_mini_pc/
[19:58] <arktvrvs> i would try using a monitor first
[21:24] <siix> does anyone know how to get teamviewer working on 22.04?
[21:25] <siix> Launching TeamViewer GUI ...
[21:25] <siix> Aborted (core dumped)
[21:25] <siix> ^   this crash that happens right after it tries to load the GUI
[21:26] <arktvrvs> i googled your exact question and found this
[21:26] <arktvrvs> Ok so I found out that Ubuntu's windowing sistem, Wayland, and TeamViewer don't like each other. To use TeamViewer on Ubuntu 22.04, you need to use X11. Now everything is working fine.
[21:26] <siix> i found the same
[21:26] <siix> but...  echo $XDG_SESSION_TYPE  ->  x11
[21:26] <siix> doesn't look like wayland is active atm
[21:26] <arktvrvs> hmm
[21:29] <arktvrvs> have you checked 'sudo teamviewer ziplog'?
[21:30] <siix> yup
[21:30] <siix> QGLXContext: Failed to create dummy context
[21:30] <siix> Failed to create OpenGL context for format QSurfaceFormat(version 2.0, options QFlags<QSurfaceFormat::FormatOption>()
[21:30] <siix> this is the only GUI-related thing i found
[21:30] <siix> still googling around about it
[21:32] <arktvrvs> maybe ldd `which teamviewer`?
[21:32] <arktvrvs> and look for any 'not found'
[21:35] <siix> that's actually a script (which sources another script) but the actual binary has no missing dynlibs
[21:41] <siix> my feeling is that this is a problem stemming from the differences between xubuntu and ubuntu
[21:42] <siix> ubuntu users seem to be stable (either in the default config or once they have dropped wayland) whereas xubuntu might need more attention
[21:42] <siix> it's hard to tell exactly what's happening to piss it off when it hardly logs anything -.-
[21:43] <siix> and xubu userbase << ubu userbase
[21:55] <siix> GUI also crashes when using the generic linux tarball package
[22:05] <jiml71> Upgrading to 22.04 LTS. Documentation about Software Updater says "If a new version of Xubuntu is available, a box at the top of the window will appear saying that a new distribution release is available." I'm not seeing that box yet. Have  /etc/update-manager/release-upgrades set to 'prompt=lts'. Should I just wait? Or should I do a standard
[22:05] <jiml71> install?   thanks in advance for any suggestions.
[22:08] <siix> are you comfortable with basic shell commands?
[22:08] <siix> @ jiml71
[22:09] <jiml71> Yes. I often prefer shell commands.
[22:10] <siix> https://linuxconfig.org/how-to-upgrade-ubuntu-to-22-04-lts-jammy-jellyfish
[22:17] <jiml71> That makes sense for updating ubuntu. Will that upgrade xubuntu/xfce as well? Or are there additional steps for xubuntu?
[22:19] <siix> the only difference between ubuntu and xubuntu for most users is the default package set.  ubuntu uses cinnamon, xubuntu uses xfce
[22:30] <siix> arktvrvs: fixed it. it was opengl-related. adding my account to the video group fixed the crash
[22:31] <siix> nowhere in the docs do they say you need to do that... nowhere in the script do they check for it and handle it.... just..... omg
[22:31] <arktvrvs> ah well done.  i didnt want to insult you by asking if you had drivers installed
[22:31] <siix> anyway fixed.  thanks for trying to help
[22:31] <arktvrvs> have a good day
[22:32] <siix> already done :)   you do the same
[22:40] <Bashing-om> jiml71: release upgrades from 20.04 to 22.04 will not be "generally" available until the 22.04.1 release . Until the .1 release the status is as (d)evelopment - to iron out the bugs. There is a means however to go to 22.04 with the -d flag >> ' sudo apt update ; sudo do-release-upgrade -d ' :D
[23:34] <xu-irc51w> Hi, I just updated to 22.04... and started having problems... Is here an appropriate place to get help?
[23:40] <xu-irc51w> since I have already mentioned that I'm having issues, I will "specify" these here, even though I'm now thinking it is somewhat complex, and I will have to investigate further
[23:44] <xu-irc51w> I was happily running 21.10, and immediately after I updated to 22.04 and restarted, this is happening:
[23:48] <kurly> are the mainline 5.17.8 and 5.17.9 from ubuntu busted? getting a bunch of mt76: disagrees about version of symbol ieee80211_sta_register_airtime
[23:50] <kurly> 5.17.7 works - http://dpaste.com/CXRQXQMR9
[23:51] <xu-irc51w> 1) the ksoftirqd/0 process started to run 100% of one of my cpu cores.. this seems to have been momentary issue (1 or 2 minutes, and seems to be gone)
[23:51] <xu-irc51w> 2) I am now having permanent internet stability issues (for some hours now)... cannot browse, and then all the sudden, everything just works, and then stop connecting again... DNS_PROBE_POSSIBLE message.. or just show i'm not connected. Very strange. I'm a very happy Xubuntu user for at least 5 or 6 years, and it's the first time i'm am having some
[23:51] <xu-irc51w> serious issue.
[23:51] <kurly> 5.17.9 sadness - http://dpaste.com/DPNQ2YWTZ  (line 1450ish)
[23:53] <kurly> would be fine to stick with 5.15.x built in, but seems not to support the volume keys (??), maybe hardware is too new


[00:04] <Riddell> sebas: I'll poke bryce (X man) with that tomorrow
[00:20] <sebas> Riddell: cool, thanks :)
[00:42] <vorian> nhandler: you have a plasmoid eh?
[00:42] <nhandler> vorian: I packaged it on REVU with a lot of help from JontheEchidna.
[00:44]  * vorian checks it out
[00:46] <vorian> ah, nhandler debian/copyrighty Public License can be found in `/usr/share/common-licenses/GPL'.
[00:46] <nhandler> I thought I had that
[00:46] <vorian> GPL-2 please
[00:46]  * nhandler goes to look
[00:46] <nhandler> Oh, lol
[00:46] <vorian> :)
[00:46] <vorian> ls
[00:46] <vorian> pfft
[00:46] <nhandler> Anything else before I upload a new version?
[00:47] <vorian> i'm still looking
[00:47] <vorian> what is the patch for?
[00:47] <nhandler> It doesn't build without it
[00:47] <nhandler> http://kde-look.org/content/show.php/Spell+Check?content=94113
[00:47] <nhandler> It was mentioned in the comment too
[00:48] <vorian> nhandler: get rid of dirs
[00:49] <nhandler> Yeah, and docs too probably
[00:49]  * nhandler really can't package in the morning
[00:49] <vorian> hehe
[00:51] <vorian> nhandler: in debian/control, do you need ${misc:Depends}?
[00:52] <ScottK> vorian: If he uses dephelper at all, he does.
[00:52] <ScottK> See the newest Lintian in Jaunty.
[00:52] <vorian> did you get the one from debian then, ScottK? \o/
[00:52] <ScottK> Just merged it a couple of days ago.
[00:52] <vorian> nhandler: other than that, looks good
[00:53] <nhandler> vorian: So should I leave the ${misc:Depends}?
[00:53] <ScottK> The idea is that at some point debhelper will grow the ability to detect missing depends and add them via that mechanis, so they are trying to prep the archive by having all packages that use dephelper add it.
[00:54] <vorian> nhandler: yes
[00:56] <nhandler> vorian: I just uploaded a new version that makes the necessary changes.
[00:57] <vorian> excellent
[01:00] <Hobbsee> ScottK: so, if i hope you'll fix the libkipi mess hard enough, will you do it?  :D
[01:00] <nhandler> vorian: So can you advocate it?
[01:00] <vorian> nhandler: i'm build ing now
[01:02] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I'm leaving town for Christmas vacation tomorrow, so it'd have to be REALLY hard.
[01:03] <ScottK> Hobbsee: My advice is find some enthusiastic youngster anxious to show his stuff.
[01:03]  * ScottK looks at nhandler to prove he can do non-crack stuff too.
[01:05] <Hobbsee> ScottK: hrm... OTOH, it's been uninstallable since UDS or so
[01:05] <ScottK> Yes.
[01:05] <Hobbsee> so a few more days may not hurt
[01:05] <Hobbsee> ;)
[01:05] <ScottK> The alternative to fixing it is to convince Riddell it's time to switch to the KDE4 digikam and push libkipi0 out of the archive.
[01:06] <Riddell> i'm all for that
[01:06] <Riddell> i think
[01:06] <ScottK> Hobbsee: It's in Experimental if you want to do a merge.
[01:07] <Riddell> did alpha 2 get released?
[01:07] <Hobbsee> yes
[01:07] <Hobbsee> assuming you mean kubuntu
[01:07] <ScottK> Riddell: Yes.  We had a release announcement, release notes, and everything.
[01:08] <nhandler> vorian: Did it build? The first version uploaded to REVU built in pbuilder and in my ppa. I didn't try the second one
[01:08] <vorian> nhandler: yeah, i was just messing around with it now
[01:08] <ScottK> Riddell: It also fit on the CDs, but it took some very draconian measures to do it.
[01:08] <vorian> excellent work nhandler :)
[01:08] <nhandler> Thanks vorian. This was my first app packaged from scratch
[01:09] <ScottK> Riddell: I think getting mysql/akonadi/amarok under control needs to be really high priority.
[01:09] <ScottK> vorian: Did you grepi -ir copyright * over the source to make sure he didn't miss anything?
[01:09] <vorian> ScottK: yepper
[01:09] <ScottK> Ignore the extra 'i' in there.
[01:09] <ScottK> Great.
[01:09] <Riddell> thanks scottk, much appreciated
[01:09] <nhandler> ScottK: There were about 2 files to look at ;)
[01:09] <vorian> only one author, so pretty easy copyright
[01:09] <ScottK> Great.
[01:10] <ScottK> Riddell: Back over to you now.  As an added bonus I merged qt4-x11 from Debian to pick up several new patches from the trolls.
[01:10] <nhandler> So vorian: Can I go ahead an upload it?
[01:11] <vorian> nhandler: yessir
[01:11] <vorian> just make sure you archive the package on revu
[01:11] <vorian> thanks for contributing to Kubuntu
[01:12] <nhandler> :D
[01:13] <nhandler> What mailing list do I notify of the new package?
[01:13] <ScottK> nhandler: MOTU ML.
[01:13] <nhandler> Thanks ScottK
[01:14] <vorian> JontheEchidna: what's up with the panelspacer package?
[01:16] <JontheEchidna> it should be in pretty good shape, but I still don't really know anything about this rpath issue
[01:17] <JontheEchidna> 31) of sebner's revu
[01:17] <vorian> hrmrm
[01:18] <vorian> there's like 4 plasmoids trapped in revu!
[01:21] <vorian> apachelogger: when you awake, can you clarify what the heck you mean in your final revu of panelspacer?
[01:21] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: he's revuing sebner's revu
[01:21] <vorian> i'm not sure if he's revuing the package or the revu
[01:21] <vorian> ah, ok
[01:22] <JontheEchidna> for his motu app
[02:09]  * nixternal thinks that packaging plasmoids is a bit silly since they are super easy to install via the plasmoid property installer thingamajiggy
[02:10]  * nhandler just packaged what he was told to
[02:10] <nixternal> ya, just saying
[02:11] <nixternal> I just installed a bunch of plasmoids from kde-look.org that required 0 interaction except for pressing the "install" button from the dialog
[02:12] <nhandler> nixternal: There are a few advantages to having stuff in the repos. The user will receive updates for the plasmoid without having to go back to kde-look. It also makes it easier to automate the installation of a bunch of plasmoids
[02:12] <nixternal> good point...I don't know if you get update notifications or not from installing
[02:13] <vorian> nixternal: i think the ninja's were having nhandler learn some kde style packaging
[02:13] <nixternal> but remember, people will have to maintain those plasmoids and keep them up to date in the repos
[02:13] <nhandler> nixternal: That is true. And without watch files, it is a little more difficult.
[02:14] <vorian> nhandler: keep up with em on rss :)
[02:14] <nixternal> ya, which sucks since most plasmoids are on kde-look.org, which watch files do not work with at all
[02:17] <nhandler> vorian: I just subscribed to the plasmoid, so I should get an email every time a new version is uploaded
[02:18] <vorian> good work :)
[02:18] <ScottK> nixternal: I think it's good to package them for the same reasons as, for example, we package mozilla extenstions even though it's easy to install them directly.
[02:18] <nixternal> ya, the mozilla extensions were a waste of space imho as well
[02:18] <JontheEchidna> nixternal: only scripted plasmoids can be installed via the installer
[02:18] <vorian> speaking of which, i should blog about dekorator
[02:19] <JontheEchidna> c++ plasmoids must be packaged
[02:19] <JontheEchidna> or compiled by hand
[02:19] <JontheEchidna> or plasmoid authors should just script plasmoids
[02:19] <nixternal> ahh, that I didn't know...don't know what all languages the plasmoids I installed were programmed with
[02:20] <JontheEchidna> probably ruby or python or superkaramba
[02:21] <Hobbsee> ScottK: the mozilla extensions have even less of a reason - they prompt you, and you can update them with one click in yoru browser.
[02:21] <nixternal> eww ruby
[02:21] <nixternal> 6
[02:21] <ScottK> True.
[02:21] <nixternal> err
[02:21] <nhandler> Well, while you guys are debating this, I think I'll go and hunt down another plasmoid to package. I have two weeks break, and I need something to do ;)
[02:21] <ScottK> nhandler: Great.
[02:22] <ScottK> nhandler: If you really want some fun figure out how to re-architect the mysql package to we don't have to drag in 20MB of crap onto the CD to support akonadi.
[02:22] <nixternal> nhandler: must be nice :)
[02:22] <nhandler> ScottK: I think I'll stick to plasmoids for now ;)
[02:22] <jjesse> ah two weeks break, i remember college
[02:22] <jjesse> but too bad i had to work through break to pay for school
[02:22] <nhandler> nixternal: Yeah, but finals are right after the break
[02:22] <nixternal> college got more than 2 weeks break
[02:23] <ScottK> OK, well you said you were looking for something to do ....
[02:23] <nixternal> haha, suicide is not an option there ScottK :)
[02:23] <nixternal> spacewalk is chewing up my damn RHN server
[02:23] <ScottK> nixternal: I was kidding about him doing it, but it's something we absolutely need to figure out.
[02:24] <ScottK> Soon too because unless akonadi goes on a diet, it and kontact, kmail, etc aren't gonna be on the CD.
[02:25] <NCommander> ScottK, I think we need to recompress some of the debs with lzma compression
[02:25] <NCommander> THat should help to greatly reclaim space
[02:25] <NCommander> (at the cost of build speed)
[02:26] <nixternal> lzma + deb == shit compression
[02:26] <Hobbsee> nixternal: about your blog post - often it's the youngest people who find it easiest to learn new procedures, and such
[02:26] <nixternal> been tried, somewhere on the debian mailing lists
[02:26] <Hobbsee> so the "but these young kids can do it!" is a bit...
[02:26] <nixternal> Hobbsee: are you saying you can't teach us old dogs new tricks?
[02:26] <Hobbsee> nixternal: no, but i'ts harder to do so.
[02:26] <nixternal> look at ScottK!!!! :p
[02:27] <Hobbsee> nixternal: that's why they teach kids multiple languages at school - because it's easier to do so when htey're kids, and it's easier to pick up more when you've done 2 already
[02:27] <nixternal> RichEd taught me how to open a beer with another beer at UDS...so it is possible!
[02:27] <Hobbsee> heh, neat
[02:27] <nixternal> Hobbsee: that might be in Australia...here in the US, they don't teach crap, unless you go to nhandler's school with the unlimited budget
[02:27] <NCommander> nixternal, not if you compress the data.tar with lzma, it does make a large difference
[02:28] <NCommander> (the desktop team does so)
[02:28] <Hobbsee> nixternal: i'm fairly sure you find it in a lot of european schools and such too, fwiw.
[02:28] <nixternal> most kids here in the US go to public schools where their #1 goal is to just graduate..who cares what happens after that
[02:28] <nhandler> nixternal: They don't teach crap, just java :P
[02:28] <nixternal> nhandler: at least they teach java
[02:28] <Hobbsee> nixternal: your schools sucking is irrelevant :P
[02:28] <nixternal> when I was in high school, they taught us basic and cobol/fortran (can't remember which one of those it was)
[02:28] <vorian> basic!
[02:28] <Hobbsee> back in the deep dark ages...
[02:28] <nixternal> ass
[02:28] <Hobbsee> ;)
[02:28] <jjesse> they taught something in high school?
[02:29] <ScottK> nixternal: Here we switched our kids from a private college prep school to public school and the academics (in the honors classes) got harder.
[02:29] <vorian> thats what i learnt
[02:29] <Hobbsee> when dinasours ruled the earth...
[02:29] <nixternal> they taught me how to get suspended
[02:29] <jjesse> i think i learned ms works
[02:29]  * ScottK did COBOL and ForTran both.
[02:29] <vorian> :o
[02:29]  * NCommander has done COBOL
[02:29] <ScottK> On punch cards.
[02:29] <NCommander> IDENTIFICATION SECTION
[02:29] <Hobbsee> we did html and object oriented programming in school - or at least, the concepts of it
[02:29] <NCommander> WORKING GROUP SECTION :-)
[02:29] <nixternal> ScottK: ya, we did punch cards as well
[02:30] <nhandler> Our school just stopped teaching True basic a few years ago.
[02:30] <jjesse> i had a keyboarding class
[02:30] <ScottK> OO programming just made my head hurt for the longest time.
[02:30] <Hobbsee> jjesse: ah yes, so did i.  they still seem to teach them
[02:30] <jjesse> using typing books?
[02:30] <Hobbsee> nah.  a typing program
[02:31] <nixternal> haha, our keyboard class was on a typewriter in 1987
[02:32] <vorian> I was in typrewriter class when Janet Reno burned down the Davidians
[02:32] <ScottK> $ELDEST_CHILD (who is 17, but not at all technical) wanted to get pictures off her camera yesterday.  I gave her a USB cable and told her to plug it in the front panel of the computer.  She came back because she was confused if she should plug it into the computer (monitor) or the 'big box thingy next to the computer' (the computer).
[02:32] <ScottK> She wants to be a fashion designer.
[02:33] <jjesse> depends did the monitor have a usb port ?
[02:33] <ScottK> jjesse: No.
[02:33] <Hobbsee> ouch
[02:33] <Hobbsee> mind you, there are a lot of things at the back of a computer, if you don't know where it is
[02:33] <Hobbsee> but askign about the monitor is a bit..interesting
[02:33] <ScottK> This one has front panel USB.
[02:34] <jjesse> some monitors have usb ports in them
[02:34] <nixternal> mine does
[02:34] <nhandler> Macs do
[02:35] <Hobbsee> well, if you can't see a port for it, that is
[02:35] <ScottK> Right, but I told her to plug it into the computer (aka the big box thingy).
[02:36]  * Hobbsee knows people who think that going near the big part of the computer that isn't the monitor will get you electrocuted.
[02:36] <ScottK> She uses the computer a lot (gotta be up to date on facebook) and I wonder if she has ever wondered before why the big box thingy was there.
[02:37] <Hobbsee> oh, it's probably a paperweight ;)
[02:37]  * ScottK seems to vaguely recall Hobbsee teaching them that so the wouldn't mess with it.
[02:37] <nhandler> ScottK: Sure she has. Where else do those CDs go?
[02:37] <Hobbsee> ScottK: no, no, i didn't teach them that...
[02:37] <Hobbsee> ScottK: doens't help that the machines in questions are all POS anyway
[02:38] <ScottK> Are you sure.  I thought I remembered something about you arranging to convince someone they shouldn't open them or something.
[02:38] <ScottK> Like about a year and a half ago.
[02:38] <Hobbsee> hrm.  no.  i convinced them that they should tell me how to go about fixing the lack of sound, and that *i* wouldn't get electrocuted.
[02:38] <ScottK> Ah.  That's it.
[02:38] <Hobbsee> yup
[02:39] <Hobbsee> interestingly, i've also done things like fix the display resolution on other computers, and people are like "oh, i can't tell the difference"
[02:39] <Hobbsee> apparently they don't notice the flickering screen
[02:39]  * Hobbsee has also been using the "I glared at it, told it to behave, and magic happened" method of fixing things, too.
[02:40] <nixternal> lol
[02:40] <Hobbsee> so now they tend to come to me, if i'm there
[02:40] <Hobbsee> then the boss gets all questioney, and goes "but how did you *do* it?" "magic" "but how????"
[02:45] <ScottK> It wouldn't work for you, but sometimes I say stuff like, "I learned in the Navy.
[02:45]  * ScottK guesses nixternal does too.
[02:46] <nixternal> not me!
[02:46] <nixternal> :)
[03:08] <crimsun> if i had a nickel for everytime i hear that...
[03:19] <nixternal> if I had a nickel!
[03:40] <yuriy> hmm I think it's time for some kubuntu stuff
[03:40] <yuriy> what coding is needed?
[03:41] <nixternal> all of it
[03:42] <yuriy> all of it? ok, will start with a kernel...
[03:42] <nixternal> lol
[03:42] <nixternal> way to go!
[04:01] <NCommander> apachelogger, ping
[04:04] <NCommander> or ScottK ping
[04:05] <ScottK> NCommander: Pong.
[04:06] <NCommander> ScottK, I'm currently testbuilding a patch for akondai to change the debs to use lzma compression, which should help get us some space back on theCD
[04:06]  * NCommander can also look to see where else we can cut stuff out to make more space)
[04:06] <ScottK> NCommander: The bigger problem is mysql.  We don't need all of it, so it needs some splitting out.
[04:07] <NCommander> what is it depending on in mysql?
[04:07] <ScottK> Akdonadi.
[04:07] <NCommander> no
[04:07] <ScottK> Amarok will use the Mysql 5.1 embedded lib once we go to Amarok 2 also.
[04:08] <NCommander> Oh
[04:08] <ScottK> Yes.
[04:08] <NCommander> The embedded lib?
[04:08]  * NCommander has actually coded against it
[04:08] <ScottK> Hmmmm.
[04:08] <NCommander> Not sure if I would call it embedded, but ...
[04:08] <NCommander> I used it as a database in an IE plugin
[04:08] <NCommander> back when I was younger and stupider
[04:09] <ScottK> You can look at the Amarok 2 packages in whatever PPA they're stuffed in.
[04:09] <NCommander> We don't provide the embedded only version, we seem to only provide the much larger connection library ...
[04:10] <ScottK> 5.0 doesn't have the embedded.
[04:12] <NCommander> we don't have 5.1 in the archive?
[04:12] <ScottK> Not yet.  It's in Debian Experimental.
[04:49]  * ScottK test builds mysql 5.1.
[05:01]  * ScottK is also realizing he is coming down with a cold, just in time to travel  and then infect his entire extended family.
[05:03] <nhandler> ScottK: Just stay away from jcastro ;)
[05:05] <ScottK> Why, does he have a delicate constitution?
[05:06] <nhandler> ScottK: He is sick too
[05:06] <ScottK> Ah.
[05:06] <nhandler> This is why you need to get on identi.ca ;)
[05:06] <crimsun> i avoided the uds illness by not being present for the entire summit!
[05:10] <ScottK> Apparently I failed to avoid it even though I didn't go....
[05:10] <crimsun> i suppose you could blame me or seele ;)
[05:10] <ScottK> Right, infected the entire metropolitan area and got me too.
[05:11] <crimsun> hehe
[05:15] <jcastro> I was ok for uds, I bulked up on vitamin C
[06:18] <NCommander> ScottK, ping
[06:54] <NCommander> Riddell, ping
[06:59] <apachelogger> there I don't get a ping because last time I didn't pong :P
[06:59] <apachelogger> NCommander: the thing wiht embedded mysql is that you don't need a lib
[06:59] <apachelogger> the only runtime dependency is -data
[06:59] <apachelogger> and even that could be stripped further for amarok
[06:59] <NCommander> well, normally embedded mysql becomes a .a
[07:04] <apachelogger> soyuz is spamming!
[07:05] <apachelogger> my package related imap dir currently contains 212 unread mails -.-
[07:56] <Riddell> NCommander: hi
[07:57] <NCommander> how goes it Riddell :-)
[07:57] <Riddell> super thanks
[08:01] <apachelogger> ~np
[08:01] <kubotu> apachelogger is listening to "All in One" by Bob Marley & The Wailers & The Upsetters
[08:01]  * apachelogger hugs NCommander and Riddell
[08:01] <NCommander> ~np
[08:01] <kubotu> NCommander listened to "Main Theme of Final Fantasy VII" by 植松伸夫 [Final Fantasy VII: Original Soundtrack (disc 2), 1997] 3 hours ago
[08:01] <NCommander> w00t, it works
[08:05] <apachelogger> Riddell: do you know someone we could poke about https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18373
[08:06] <apachelogger> no progress is too little progress IMHO :-)
[08:07] <Riddell> apachelogger: xdg list?
[08:07] <apachelogger> point
[08:07] <apachelogger> Riddell: are you subscribed?
[08:08] <Riddell> no idea
[08:09] <apachelogger> hehe, ok :)
[08:44] <NCommander> Riddell, are you a DD?
[08:45]  * NCommander tries to remember ...
[08:47] <NCommander> Riddell or apachelogger, if your in a sponsoring mood, I'd appericate if you can sponsor a patch for me ...
[08:47] <NCommander> which will fix kde4bindings finally
[08:49]  * apachelogger is running batl10n right now, so he doesn't have much bandwith to work with
[08:53] <NCommander> Riddell, ?
[09:22]  * NCommander sighs
[09:24] <Hobbsee> actually fix it?
[09:29] <NCommander> Hobbsee, fix I have
[09:29] <NCommander> no one wants to sponsor
[09:30] <Hobbsee> patch location?
[09:30] <Hobbsee> not committing to sponsor it, but i'll look at it
[09:30] <NCommander> I committed it to Debian python-modules SVN
[09:30]  * NCommander digs for it
[09:31] <NCommander> Hobbsee, you wouldn't happen to be a DD in hiding would you :-)?
[09:31] <Hobbsee> oh.  nope
[09:31] <Hobbsee> i thought it was for ubuntu
[09:31] <NCommander> It is for Ubuntu
[09:31] <Hobbsee> i'm no help for debian stuff
[09:32] <NCommander> I can rip the patch out and slap it on an Ubuntu package :-)
[09:32] <NCommander> Which will fix kde4bindings for ARM finally
[09:33] <Hobbsee> ahh
[09:33] <Hobbsee> oh, that'd be nice
[09:33] <NCommander> I'm trying to get Debian to accept it so we don't have to carry an ubuntu diff
[09:35] <Hobbsee> good idea!
[09:38] <NCommander> I'm just waiting for a sponsor to wait up :-)
[09:39] <Hobbsee> try poking them in the ribs?
[09:40] <NCommander> That was so funny I forgot to laugh.
[09:41] <apachelogger> hm
[09:41]  * apachelogger is wondering why libdpkg-ruby doesn't have a debian/* parser
[09:42] <NCommander> apachelogger, can you commit to the KDE SVN repo?
[09:42] <apachelogger> NCommander: yes
[09:42] <apachelogger> .!!!~~~~>Bat l10n WARNING: he not yet in the archives - please package manually!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[09:42] <apachelogger> .!!!~~~~>Bat l10n WARNING: gu not yet in the archives - please package manually!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[09:42] <apachelogger> oh dear!
[09:42] <NCommander> o-O;
[09:42] <NCommander> apachelogger, mind kicking the kubuntu_qt_ftbfs patch into SVN? Part off it has already gone, I'd like to get everything in however
[09:43] <apachelogger> NCommander: did you talk to upstream?
[09:44] <NCommander> apachelogger, I thought I was doing that with you ;-)
[09:44]  * apachelogger is not exactly a kdelibs maintainer :P
[09:45] <NCommander> One of the larger ARM patches went, this one got left behind I think (the cmake rules one went)
[09:45] <NCommander> I can ask an upstream dev
[09:46] <apachelogger> NCommander: I suggest you mail it to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[09:46] <NCommander> Shall be done
[09:46] <NCommander> I'll poke sime on the other side of the KDE bindings patch
[09:46] <apachelogger> should be most efficient way to get it at least approved, if not committed
[09:47]  * apachelogger prepares kde4libs 4.1.85a
[09:47] <Nightrose> NCommander: he is on holiday
[09:47] <Nightrose> you might want to find someone else
[09:47] <NCommander> d'oh
[09:47] <NCommander> apachelogger, ack, no, please ;.;
[09:47] <NCommander> apachelogger, I just got everything building
[09:48] <apachelogger> NCommander: so? the new tarball only should change docbook entities AFAIK
[09:48] <NCommander> apachelogger, oh ...
[09:48] <NCommander> If it was code changes ...
[09:48] <NCommander> ;.;
[09:49] <apachelogger> ^_^
[09:49] <apachelogger> the good thing is, with rc1 everything will break all over again :P
[09:50] <apachelogger> <3 batpull
[09:50] <NCommander> Not really
[09:50] <NCommander> most of it is already in SVN
[09:50] <apachelogger> NCommander: bindings always finds new ways on breaking
[09:51] <NCommander> Just let me have my one thing compile :-P
[09:51] <apachelogger> :)
[11:34] <NCommander> Riddell, feel like sponsoring still?
[11:34] <Tm_T> NCommander: if you feel sponsoring, I might need a new keyboard for my phone/pda
[11:36] <NCommander> o_O?
[11:36] <Riddell> NCommander: sure
[11:36]  * NCommander has to rip his changeset out of Debian SVN
[11:40] <NCommander> ok, done
[11:41] <NCommander> now to test build the sucker
[12:03]  * apachelogger can parse deps \\o/
[12:24]  * Riddell updates automoc
[12:31] <smarter> http://kde42.debian.net/debian/pool/main/k/kdevelop/ << we need to steal this :P
[12:31] <apachelogger> wasn't someone working on that?
[12:31]  * apachelogger seems to remember someone wanted to do it
[12:31] <Riddell> needs renamed to not clash with kdevelop from kde 3
[12:31] <Riddell> of which there's a new version too
[12:31] <smarter> right
[12:35] <NCommander> Riddell, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-qt4/+bug/308814
[12:35] <NCommander> WHen you test build it, please install it and make sure the symlink comes out properly
[12:36] <NCommander> (I'm testing it here as well, but I might have remants of old versions lying aroubnd)
[12:39] <Riddell> NCommander: test build python-qt4?
[12:39] <NCommander> I attached the 2ubuntu2 debdiff
[12:39] <apachelogger> I must say, I am pretty awesome at times
[12:41] <Riddell> apachelogger: we always said so
[12:44] <apachelogger> :)
[13:00] <Arby> if a bug is fixed in our 4.2beta2 packages is that enough to close it as fixed or should the fix be backported to 4.1.x ?
[13:00] <Arby> and on that note, did 4.1.4 get cancelled?
[13:01] <Arby> specifically bug 274170
[13:01] <apachelogger> Arby: depends if it backportwothy+backportable
[13:01] <Riddell> Arby: 4.2 beta 2 is in jaunty so it can be closed as fixed
[13:02] <apachelogger> .4 was pushed back to january
[13:02] <Arby> ok so would fixing that crash be considered backportworthy, or just wait for 4.1.4?
[13:03] <Arby> I'd plump for just wait
[13:03] <Arby> it's annoying but not critical.
[13:03] <Arby> and the work around is trivial
[13:03] <Riddell> yeah
[13:03] <Riddell> wait
[13:03] <Arby> cool, thanks.
[13:03] <Arby> I'll add a comment to the bug
[13:03] <Riddell> 4.1.4 was delayed because it clashed with beta 2
[13:04] <Arby> didn't we know that months ago?
[13:04] <Arby> wonder why they waited
[13:04] <apachelogger> Arby: also the amount of commits weren't enough for a release
[13:05] <Arby> ok that's a more sensible argument
[13:05] <Arby> I'm jut curious because there are several bug fixes to system-config-printer-kde that should come with .4
[13:06] <Arby> s/jut/just/
[13:07] <Arby> while we're on the subject, are we planning to make 4.2.0 available in -updates on intrepid or ppa only?
[13:07] <Riddell> not -updates
[13:07] <Riddell> -backports if it's tested
[13:08] <apachelogger> I'd say kubuntu-members-kde4 => aggregate testing => copy to -backports
[13:08] <Riddell> yep
[13:08] <Arby> sorry, I get confused between -updates, -backports and -proposed
[13:08] <Riddell> it gets confusing
[13:09] <smarter> especially if you consider all the PPAs we have and the usecase for them which changes every week :P
[13:20]  * NCommander considers bed
[13:22] <seele> argh.. ScottK i forget which quassel i need to install from your PPA.  quassel-client or just quassel?
[13:22] <smarter> seele: quassel
[13:28] <seele> smarter: ok thanks
[13:28] <jjesse> morning
[13:29] <NCommander> Riddell, the patch I gave you works
[13:35] <Riddell> NCommander: just finished compiling here
[13:35] <Riddell> NCommander: what am I looking for?
[13:37] <NCommander> Riddell, install it, and make sure /usr/lib/python*/site-packages/PyQt4/pyqtconfig.py is a symlink
[13:37] <NCommander> And that removing python-qt4-dev doesn't remove it, but removing python-qt4 does
[13:37] <Riddell> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 39 Dec 22 13:36 /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/PyQt4/pyqtconfig.py -> /usr/share/pyshared/PyQt4/pyqtconfig.py
[13:38] <Riddell> yes and yes
[13:40] <NCommander> Cool
[13:40] <NCommander> Upload when ready
[13:40] <NCommander> I know the symlink is weird, but blame dh_pycentral
[13:42] <Riddell> uploaded
[13:43] <NCommander> Riddell, ok, when it builds on armel, and is status: Done, punch retry on kde4bindings on armel
[13:43] <NCommander> It should just build
[13:43]  * Riddell raises eyebrow noting that Arby and _seelenn_ are connected from the same IP address
[13:44]  * NCommander sees Riddell and raises him a second eyebrow
[13:44] <Arby> not rocket science dude, she's about 4 feet away :)
[13:45] <NCommander> damn it, Debian import kicked in for the day
[13:45] <NCommander> Hobbsee, ping
[13:45] <NCommander> Riddell, can you rescore?
[13:45] <Riddell> I can not
[13:46] <NCommander> and we're down an ARM builder ...
[13:46] <NCommander> ;.;
[13:47] <NCommander> Second BTW, Riddell, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libaio/+bug/309350
[13:47] <NCommander> :-)
[13:50] <Riddell> NCommander: groovy, uploading
[13:50] <NCommander> soren asked me to look at it, thus I did
[14:13]  * ScottK files the removal bug for guidance-power-manager.
[14:13] <apachelogger> hm
[14:14] <apachelogger> 51 languages uploaded
[14:14] <Riddell> ScottK: why remove it?
[14:15] <apachelogger> Riddell: kde-l10n-he and kde-l10n-gu are in NEW, so if you get a chance please accept them
[14:15] <Riddell> hebrew?
[14:15] <ScottK> Riddell: Your spec say it'll get automatically removed on upgrade.  People won't be able to remove powerdevil and having two power managers running on your system just seems crazy.
[14:15] <apachelogger> Riddell: yes
[14:16] <ScottK> Plus it's buggy and a PITA to maintain so let's just push it out of the archive and let it RIP.
[14:16] <Riddell> ScottK: how's it buggy?
[14:16] <ScottK> It has lots of open bugs.
[14:17] <apachelogger> ScottK: IMHO we should create a dummy package to ensure that it really disappears, there is no telling what can happen if both powerdevl and gpm are running
[14:17] <apachelogger> I wouldn't want to chances
[14:17] <ScottK> Plus it doesn't support ondemand, so it's arguably obsolete.
[14:18] <ScottK> apachelogger: The spec says to have the upgrader remove it.
[14:18] <Riddell> https://bugs.kde.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=guidance-power-manager  six?  some of those seem obsolete
[14:18] <ScottK> I think that's cleaner.
[14:18] <Riddell> ondemand?
[14:18] <ScottK> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/guidance-power-manager - 38
[14:19] <ScottK> Riddell: If you run sudo powertop one of the thing it'll suggest you  do is set ondemand power management mode.
[14:19] <apachelogger> ScottK: as long as it works that is also fine with me :)
[14:19] <freeflying> apachelogger: so we are using l10n from upstream now?
[14:19] <apachelogger> freeflying: no
[14:19] <ScottK> If you've read some of mjg59's blog posts, it's the future.
[14:19] <freeflying> apachelogger: will we sync with upstream sometime before release?
[14:20] <ScottK> Riddell: Since we're going to automatically remove it from upgraded systems, why would we want it in the archive?
[14:20] <apachelogger> freeflying: we import upstream => cripple it => break it => add some more broken and low quality languages => export to the ubuntu launchpage packs
[14:21] <freeflying> apachelogger: but for chinese, the quality on lp is really low, compare with upstream
[14:21] <apachelogger> and at some point we release 9.04 which will make me use it in german for 2 weeks and for that time keep me busy bitching about how our l10ns suck and then we all will forget about it until 9.10
[14:21] <ScottK> Riddell: You tell me.  If you  want it to stay in, I won't ask it removed.  I'll just arrange not to get the bugmail.  To me keeping it at all is pointless.
[14:21] <apachelogger> freeflying: for every language I am capble of understanding it is
[14:22] <apachelogger> Riddell: did you discuss rosetta issues at UDS?
[14:25] <Riddell> ScottK: I'd prefer to keep it in universe
[14:25] <ScottK> K
[14:26] <Riddell> apachelogger: yes, bunch of different problems, should all be much smoother this time (well, can but be optimistic)
[14:29] <ScottK> Riddell: guidance-power-manager is sitting in component mismatches waiting to be dropped to Universe.  Once it's there smarter can maintain it without sponsorship.
[14:30]  * ScottK has unsubscribed from bugmail for it.
[14:32] <apachelogger> Riddell: ok, let's hope for the best ^_^
[14:51] <ScottK> So, are we to the point in Intrepid where the language packs at least aren't worse than what upstream gives us?
[14:54] <Riddell> we should be but that's not what freeflying has been saying
[14:55] <Riddell> nixternal, jjesse: how did kubuntu-jaunty-documentation get approved?
[14:55]  * ScottK remains (not suprsingly) sceptical.
[14:57] <ScottK> Here that should probably be skeptical.
[15:09] <jjesse> i thought nixternal approved it?
[15:18] <ScottK> Riddell: Bug 310599
[15:19] <ScottK> I'd say let's get it in the archive so we can start on Amarok 2 (even if it has to drop to Universe for a while).
[15:23] <ScottK> Riddell: Given the limitations of packagekit (the conffile thing is a big problem for me), I think we ought to make sure it's a desktop recommends and not depends so people can remove it without removing kubuntu-desktop.
[15:38] <Riddell> ScottK: mysql needs to go through server team
[15:38]  * ScottK is on that too.
[15:40] <ScottK> Riddell: Discussing it there now.
[15:42] <ryanakca> Riddell: Mind if we make kubuntu.org fluid width so that it matches the new wiki theme? ^seelenn^ is getting us some screenshots, but you can see what it looks like at my testsite
[15:43] <smarter> ryanakca: that would be cool :)
[15:43] <Riddell> ScottK: recommends should be fine for kpackagekit
[15:44] <Riddell> ryanakca: well, I do prefer variable width, but seele seems to think fixed width is a good idea for reasons I havn't worked out
[15:45] <ryanakca> Riddell: readability... when you have more than... I forget... something in the 60s or 70s... characters on a line, it's hard on your eyes... think of reading a lovely paragraph, or the same thing all on one line.   Or so I'm told :)
[15:49] <Riddell> CSS needs a max-width attribute
[15:49] <ryanakca> 876px
[15:51] <ryanakca> Riddell: refresh, I added one to #container as well (The content blob inside the rounding)
[15:52] <Riddell> ooh, that works
[15:52] <Riddell> how does it match the wiki theme?  what's changing there?
[15:52] <Riddell> the screenshots don't seem to load
[15:53]  * Riddell out to shop
[15:53] <rgreening> ryanakca: whats the test site again'
[15:53] <ryanakca> Riddell: At the meeting a month and a half ago (mid-November), they had voted to change the wiki theme... I got caught up in school work, but now that I have Christmas break, I can get back to work on them
[15:54] <ryanakca> Riddell: mdke's ubuntunew (on the Help wiki) in the kubuntu.org colour palette
[15:58] <apachelogger> Nightrose: http://aplg.kollide.net/images/osiris/snapshot193.png
[15:59] <apachelogger> Nightrose: so, how do I tell amarok to convert ogg=>mp3 upon media device transfer?
[16:00] <smarter> Let it Snow! Let it Snow! Let it Snow! :p
[16:00] <Nightrose> apachelogger: ewwwwwwww
[16:00] <apachelogger> smarter: checkout the other entries :P
[16:00] <Nightrose> apachelogger: and no idea if that is possible yet
[16:01] <davmor2> smarter: wow that's a really unobvious command
[16:01] <apachelogger> now that is more ewwww than Kopfschuss from Frank :P
[16:01] <smarter> danimo: :d
[16:02] <smarter> hmm, s/danimo/davmor2/
[16:02] <smarter> danimo: sorry for the hl
[16:02] <davmor2> smarter: Curse us for the use of tab ;)
[16:02] <apachelogger> quassel strikes again!
[16:04] <apachelogger> ScottK: how many days should the quassel-core certificate be valid?
[16:04] <ScottK> apachelogger: If we do a new one per release, how about 18 months?
[16:05] <ScottK> Actually more to cover the pre-release time.
[16:07] <ScottK> apachelogger: Does that make sense?
[16:07] <apachelogger> ScottK: 18+6 maybe?
[16:07] <apachelogger> that should cover pre-release + support
[16:07] <ScottK> yeah.
[16:08] <ScottK> apachelogger: Of course you'll need to figure out how to replace it on upgrade.
[16:08] <apachelogger> ScottK: there is a postinst anyway
[16:09] <ScottK> OK.
[16:12] <JontheEchidna> anybody started on the pykde4 port of ubiquity? I'm in a python-y mood right now
[16:15] <apachelogger> eww
[16:15] <apachelogger> Sput: ping
[16:19]  * JontheEchidna registers ubiquity branch for kubuntu-members
[16:20] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: while you are at it mark the system-config-printer thingy as merged or whatever fits moved-to-svn
[16:23] <JontheEchidna> abandoned?
[16:23] <JontheEchidna> mm, maybe merged is better
[16:26] <Arby> merged is good, it's likely to get replaced soon
[16:26] <Arby> I'm working on a newer version that implements a redesigned ui
[16:27] <Arby> currently it lives here https://code.launchpad.net/~rbirnie/system-config-printer/new_ui
[16:28] <Arby> but it probably ought to move to kubuntu-members at some stage
[16:34] <apachelogger> Arby: it ought to move to KDE SVN at some stage
[16:34] <apachelogger> sysconfig printer is not maintained in bzr anymore
[16:34] <Arby> I know, but I don't want to do that until after 4.3
[16:35] <Arby> it's a fairly substantial ui change
[16:35] <Arby> in the mean time I needed somewhere to put it
[16:35] <Arby> sorry after 4.2
[16:35] <Arby> in time for 4.3
[16:36] <apachelogger> m-e-h
[16:36] <apachelogger> bug 305536
[16:37] <apachelogger> quassel + quassel-core \o/
[16:37] <apachelogger> remind me to propose that Description: gets dropped from the debian policy
[16:37] <apachelogger> no one reads that anyway
[16:37] <apachelogger> ScottK: maybe I should make -client and quassel also conflict?
[16:37] <Sput> apachelogger: pong if it's a quivky
[16:38] <apachelogger> Sput: would quassel start whining if the SSL cert gets exchanged at some point?
[16:38] <Sput> apachelogger: I don't think so
[16:38] <apachelogger> ok, I'll give it some testing anyway :)
[16:38] <ScottK> apachelogger: Makes sense.  Actually I think it'd make more sense to use alternatives.
[16:39] <Sput> but best to poke EgS, he has some work on SSL stuff in his local repo still, not sure if that only affects the cert-based ircd auth
[16:39] <apachelogger> kthx
[16:39] <apachelogger> ScottK: -client doesn't qualify as alternative for quassel IMHO
[16:39] <Sput> we currently don't relay problems with the cert to the client, only gets output on the core's console output afaik, though we wanted to look into that more deeply
[16:40] <ScottK> apachelogger: I guess that's right.
[16:40] <Sput> (QSslSocket sucks a bit, it's not possible to defer connecting before accepting/rejecting the cert)
[16:41] <ScottK> I guess it depends on if it's there to provide transmission security or end point spoofing protection.
[16:41] <ScottK> Personally, I'm happy with the former.  With that latter you really need self signed certs and it's painful.
[16:42] <Sput> yep, the former case is no problem, the latter case is a bit harder
[16:42] <Sput> yep
[16:42] <Sput> if that's enough for ubuntu security, I'd be happy with that :)
[16:42] <Sput> we'll probably send status info back to the client in that case at some point, and use a different icon then
[16:43] <ScottK> Security going to primarly worry about the monolithic client since that's what we're proposing as a potential default.
[16:43] <Sput> but we failed with doing more advanced stuff, like popping up a msgbox on the client and asking
[16:43] <apachelogger> Sput: KDE would make that so much easier :P
[16:43] <Sput> yeah, that doesn't open a port by default
[16:43] <Sput> apachelogger: yeah
[16:43] <Sput> as a matter of fact, I am having a local branch named "kde" here
[16:43] <Sput> :)
[16:43] <apachelogger> uhhh fancy
[16:43]  * apachelogger hands Sput a cookie
[16:44] <Sput> if all goes well, we should have basic KDE integration (icons/colors/knotify) in 2008
[16:45] <Tm_T> Sput: talking about what app?
[16:45] <Sput> not sure if that will extend to some of the more fancy stuff like kwallet (though that would make a lot of sense) and the ssl stuff though
[16:45] <Sput> quassel.
[16:45] <Tm_T> ah
[16:45] <apachelogger> yeah, staying at the ballmer peak should be a lot easier with holidays and all ;-)
[16:46] <Tm_T> interesting app that, never used
[16:46] <Sput> apachelogger: having two weeks of vacation and mostly nothing planned helps even more :)
[16:46] <apachelogger> hehe
[16:46] <Sput> anyway, there still is the xmas market, so I will migrate there now and get wasted with mulled wine
[16:46] <Sput> or worse
[16:46] <Sput> l8r
[16:46] <apachelogger> lolz
[16:46] <apachelogger> cya Sput
[16:47] <ScottK> apachelogger: Ballmer peak requires very fine tuning and lots of practice.
[16:47]  * Sput has that
[16:47] <Sput> :)
[16:47] <apachelogger> very true
[16:47] <apachelogger> both of these statements
[16:47] <Sput> so far, I never had to revert stuff on the next day at least :)
[16:47] <Sput> though I did manage to screw up a newly installed system once
[16:48]  * apachelogger does that all the time
[16:48] <apachelogger> oh dear, it appears to me there was a bug in the quassel-core.postinst since 27 jun
[16:51] <apachelogger> ScottK: do you think bug 305536 is SRU worthy? ... introducing the conflicts
[16:51] <ScottK> apachelogger: No.
[16:51] <apachelogger> okies
[16:51] <apachelogger> phew
[16:51] <apachelogger> :D
[17:37] <ScottK-desktop> apachelogger or Nightrose: For the PPA amarok 2 packages, how do you build mysql in?  Are you using the package from Debian Experimental?
[17:37] <Riddell> ScottK-desktop: there's mysql packages in that PPA
[17:38] <Riddell> presumably based on Debian Experimental
[17:38]  * ScottK-desktop is a bit short on time today, so was hoping they'd simply say "Yes, we use Debian Experimental".
[17:38]  * ScottK-desktop can't remember which PPA anyway (too many).
[17:46] <Riddell> kubuntu-experimental I think
[17:47] <nixternal> Riddell: I have no clue...can't remember if I approved it or not
[17:52] <rgreening> I just bought a Acer One UMPC.. any idea how hard/easy to get Ubuntu loaded?
[17:52] <rgreening> :)
[18:10] <cbr> lol how many times does the systray fix get included in qt?
[18:11] <cbr> is it broken again constantly?
[18:11] <JontheEchidna> So how does one test ubiquity?
[18:11] <jpds> rgreening: Aspire One?
[18:13] <rgreening> jpds: yus
[18:13] <Riddell> JontheEchidna: you can run it as a normal app as long as you don't go past the last page
[18:14] <jpds> rgreening: Have you installed Ubuntu on it?
[18:14] <rgreening> its the A0A-110-1588 Saphire Blue. 8GB SSD+8GBSDHC
[18:14] <rgreening> jpds: no, I need to
[18:14] <JontheEchidna> cool, thanks
[18:14] <jpds> rgreening: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/FromUSBStick
[18:16] <jpds> rgreening: I personally used the "Create a startup USB" option that comes on Ubuntu.
[18:17] <rgreening> you have buntu running off a netbook
[18:17] <rgreening> jpds: ^
[18:18] <jpds> rgreening: Pardon?
[18:19] <rgreening> jpds: do you know how much ETX3 will shorten the life of the SSD?
[18:20] <jpds> rgreening: No, but there are tips on it's page: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/AspireOne110L - on how to improve it.
[18:43] <apachelogger> ScottK-desktop: No, we don't use Debian Experimental
[18:44] <seele> any quassel experts? what does "Use internal core" mean?
[18:44] <ScottK> apachelogger: So did you package it yourself?
[18:44] <apachelogger> ScottK-desktop: it was based upon experimental mysql but doesn't have much in common anymore
[18:44] <ScottK> seele: That's what you want.  It means the local bit an not a remote one.
[18:45] <ScottK> seele: I've already mentiond to them that needs to be way more default/obvious.
[18:45] <seele> ScottK: how is that different from creating a new core on localhost?
[18:45] <ScottK> seele: Dunno (not a true exper), but for the monolithic client (the one you  have) it's what's wanted.
[18:46] <ScottK> exper/expert.
[18:47] <ScottK> apachelogger: Could you propose a patch to the current Experimental package that would make it useful for Amarok?  I'm trying to convince the server people to go ahead and bring 5.1 into Ubuntu.
[18:47]  * ScottK looks at apachelogger for quassel expertise (or \\sh).
[18:47] <seele> ScottK: do you know any quassel devs?  i thought there was one in here at some point
[18:47] <seele> or one of them if they know lots about it :)
[18:47] <apachelogger> ScottK: patch as in redefined packaging?
[18:47] <ScottK> apachelogger: Yes.
[18:47] <ScottK> patch/merge, ....
[18:47] <apachelogger> seele: Sput
[18:48] <apachelogger> or EgS in #quassel
[18:48] <apachelogger> I would suppose both are getting drunk right now though ;-)
[18:48] <seele> hum, then i guess I will have to compile questions for later instead of ask them as i review
[18:48] <ScottK> apachelogger: As long as they hit the balmer curve right it'll be fine.
[18:49] <apachelogger> seele: the main difference is really that with the internal core no network port gets opened
[18:52]  * seele . o (wow.. havent had plasma crash like that for a while..)
[18:52] <seele> apachelogger: ok.. so given the two, it's silly to set up a localhost core if you can juse use an internal core?
[18:52] <seele> i'm trying to figure out if having "localhost" as the default config for a new core would make the internal core concept more confusing
[18:53] <apachelogger> seele: partically it is not
[18:53] <seele> it's not silly and it does make sense?
[18:54] <apachelogger> you might want to have a local core to use in your network but connect using a monolithic binary
[18:54] <ScottK> But not opening the port is a much better idea from a security perspective.
[18:54] <apachelogger> seele: it makes sense if you understand the concept
[18:54] <seele> right.. but it's a freaking irc client.  there shouldnt be much to understand
[18:55]  * seele should probably do this tomorrow. she's already annoyed
[18:55] <apachelogger> IMHO
[18:55] <seele> apachelogger: ok.. thanks fo the info
[18:55] <apachelogger> anything that addresses a the concept of having a remote host should be completely wiped from teh mono build
[18:56] <apachelogger> the monolithic binary will only be built when the appropriate cmake switch is defined, which means that only people who explicetly want an all-in-one client would use it
[18:56] <ScottK> seele: Everyone agrees the current quassel won't do.  The question is can it be made suitable.
[18:56] <seele> it seems like if it is just the client, it should do internal core automatically.  if you want to do the server stuff, then you can choose if you want to do localhost or not
[18:56] <apachelogger> in which case the understading of client vs. core is completely obsolete
[18:56] <ScottK> seele: I think that's way apachelogger just said.
[18:56] <seele> ScottK: ok
[18:56] <ScottK> way/what
[18:56] <seele> i'm having a hard time understanding how this can be changed
[18:57] <seele> if it could be set up as internal core by default, install -server and then you get all the fixings if you want -- that would be optimarl
[18:57]  * apachelogger starts a vm to test an initial quassel setup
[18:57] <seele> *optimal
[18:58]  * ScottK decides he better concentrate on $WORK.
[18:58] <seele> ScottK: CTRL+A+D ;)
[18:58] <ScottK> ;-)
[19:05] <seele> hum.. did wiki.kubuntu.org just die?
[19:05] <apachelogger> seele: what needs to happen is that the core-connection dialog gets removed, instead quassel (the monolithic binary) needs to use the internal core right away
[19:06] <nhandler> seele: Internal Server Error
[19:07] <apachelogger> seele: also IMO one should be able to edit the identity settings from within the networks dialog
[19:08] <apachelogger> once a new network connection has been added it probably should autoconnect to the network
[19:08] <seele> apachelogger: i was just trying to find how to do that
[19:09] <apachelogger> seele: editing the identity?
[19:09] <seele> yeah
[19:10] <apachelogger> seele: menubar: settings -> Configure -> General
[19:10] <apachelogger> I have no idea how a human being is supposed to find that though :P
[19:12] <jjesse> is that kvirc you are discussing?
[19:13] <seele> jjesse: quassel
[19:13] <seele> i havent looked at kvirc yet
[19:13] <jjesse> ah
[19:14] <quassel2511> the intial nick should get some random number and a couple of intial $NICK_ $NICK__ etc.
[19:15] <quassel2511> otherwise one can't connect due to nick conflict
[19:16] <quassel2511> default network and default view element settings
[19:17]  * ryanakca decides to try quassel
[19:17] <ryanakca> Can one have it connect to an irssi proxy?
[19:17]  * quassel2511 has no idea what an irssi proxy is
[19:19] <ryanakca> quassel2511: I should probably google first, but from the little I've read, quassel has a ``daemon'' type thing that stays connected and then a client that connects to it? Well, irssi-proxy is the ``daemon'' part.
[19:19] <batlogger> ic
[19:19] <batlogger> ryanakca: you can't connect to an irssi-proxy but you can connect to a quassel core
[19:20] <ryanakca> batlogger: but I suppose I could have quassel core connect to irssi-proxy? *shrug*
[19:21] <ryanakca> batlogger: we should continue in #kubuntu-offtopic
[19:21] <batlogger> ryanakca: isn't that redundant?
[19:21] <batlogger> core => proxy
[19:22] <ryanakca> batlogger: I know, but I don't want to abandon irssi just yet, and I'd rather not have ryanakca and ryanakca_ :)
[19:23] <batlogger> Oo intersting use case
[19:34] <nhandler> Can someone confirm LP Bug #298712? I'm preparing an update for it, and I'll include a patch for this bug if it is valid
[19:34] <ryanakca> seele: ping, mind looking at the changes we made to the theme and letting me know if there are any useability issues?
[19:37] <apachelogger> nhandler: grepping for agent doesn't bring anything up
[19:37] <nhandler> apachelogger: Ok, because based on the description, it looks like it would need it
[19:37] <apachelogger> nhandler: I don't think the description is detailed enough to believe it ;-)
[19:38] <nhandler> Ok, I'll just update the package then. Do you want to add a comment to the bug?
[19:40] <seele> ryanakca: changes?
[19:40] <ScottK-desktop> Riddell: It looks like once we go to amarok2, all the uses of kdebindings (the kde3 one) can go away except krita2.  I think two sets of bindings is a lot to maintain for one IM client and it should go before release.
[19:41] <apachelogger> nhandler: I suppose $USER meant $GUI for $PASSWORD
[19:41] <apachelogger> in other words pinentry
[19:41] <apachelogger> Nightrose: btw, I just abused you for testing :P
[19:41] <Nightrose> apachelogger: ohnoes
[19:41] <Nightrose> what did you do?
[19:41] <ryanakca> apachelogger: Are there any plans to port pinentry to Qt4 ?
[19:42] <apachelogger> Nightrose: I sent you a gpg encrypted message via jabber
[19:42] <Nightrose> *lol*
[19:42] <apachelogger> you didn't get it?
[19:42] <apachelogger> ryanakca: pinentry-qt4
[19:42] <Nightrose> i got "this message is encrypted" in gmail
[19:42] <ryanakca> apachelogger: oh, nevermind then... *upgrades*
[19:42] <Nightrose> i am on gmail webinterface while i am not at home
[19:42] <Riddell> ScottK-desktop: IM client?
[19:43] <ScottK-desktop> Riddell: krita2 is an IM client for some Japanese IM system (or maybe I remember the package name wrong).
[19:43]  * ScottK-desktop checks
[19:43] <apachelogger> nhandler: I would recommend gnupg-agent ... it depends on pinentry-gtk2 | pinentry-curses | pinentry
[19:44]  * apachelogger is wondering why it doesn't depend on pinentry-x11
[19:44] <ScottK-desktop> Riddell: Kita2, not Krita2.
[19:44]  * apachelogger better stops wondering before he gets lost again
[19:45] <ScottK-desktop> Apparently upstream is working on porting kita2.  At a guess "You'll vanish from Kubuntu" might be an incentive to hurry.
[19:45] <nhandler> Sure thing apachelogger
[19:45] <Riddell> ScottK-desktop: good good, more things to drop
[19:46] <ScottK-desktop> Riddell: That's my conclusion from the thread I started on kubuntu-devel.
[19:46] <apachelogger> we should just remove everything kde3ish and fix broken stuff as people start whining about it :P
[19:46] <ScottK-desktop> Riddell: This is also part of my urgency about mysql 5.1 and amarok2.  It lets a bunch of other stuff die.
[19:46] <ScottK-desktop> apachelogger: Some stuff doesn't have equivalents and with my Klamav maintainer hat on, I object.
[19:47] <apachelogger> oi vei!
[19:47] <ScottK-desktop> I think out of Main or at least off the CD is fine, but I think kdelibs can hang around a while.
[19:49] <Riddell> ScottK-desktop: mm, mysql 5.1 might not be as easy as we'd hope
[19:50] <ScottK-desktop> apachelogger got it working
[19:50] <ScottK-desktop> Maybe embed a copy in amarok for now then.
[19:50] <ScottK-desktop> or threaten to, anyway
[19:51] <apachelogger> usr/share/doc/mysql-server-5.1/
[19:51]  * ScottK-desktop runs off for a ehile.
[19:51] <Riddell> anyone remember what was the problem with 5.0?
[19:51] <ScottK-desktop> ehile/while
[19:51] <apachelogger> or not because it is the doc
[19:51]  * apachelogger is silly today
[19:51] <ScottK-desktop> No embedded lib
[19:51] <apachelogger> well
[19:51] <apachelogger> it is there
[19:51] <apachelogger> it is just complete crap if I may say so
[19:52] <apachelogger> ScottK-desktop: usr/share/mysql/ ought to go to -data ... if it only contains arch:all, which I doubt TBH
[19:53] <apachelogger> another way would be to construct amarok-mysql-data and keep a more tight set of files to reduce the package size
[19:53] <apachelogger> I am not sure it's going to be much space saving though
[20:01] <apachelogger> ScottK-desktop: I think the best course of action would be to have mysql-server-5.1-data shared accross mysql, amarok and akonadi. in addition to that a mysql-server-5.1-akonadi which comes with a reduced set of binaries from mysql-server-5.1 and can be replaced by that package
[20:03] <apachelogger> actually it would be even better if we strip the libs to libmysqlserver, so that mysql-server-5.1 only contains the binaries ... if akonadi only uses mysqld (which is the case AFAIK) we can include just that as mysqld-akonadi in the myql-server-5.1-akonadi package and make mysql-server and -akonadi coinstallable
[20:04] <apachelogger> which prevents issues in case $USER would want to remove mysql-server at some point, because I am not sure apt-get would be intelligent enough to reinstall the replaced mysql-server-5.1-akonadi
[20:25] <ScottK-palm> mcasadavall: How'd python-qt4 work out?
[20:26] <ryanakca> What should be done for bug 310030 ? The Community and Support page is more for getting help in <xyz> language...
[20:27]  * ScottK-palm hit retry on armel kde4bindings, but it's two days away from starting.
[20:30] <ScottK-palm> ryanakca: I've got a FAQ update that was sent to me.  It needs some editing. Would you be up for adding it?
[20:31] <ryanakca> ScottK-palm: sure.
[20:31] <ryanakca> ScottK-palm: is it supposed to replace the current one or be an addition to it?
[20:31] <ScottK-palm> ryanakca: Would you please /msg me the email address you want it sent to?
[20:31] <ScottK-palm> Replace I think.
[20:32]  * ScottK-palm doesn't recall for sure.
[20:32]  * ryanakca is having fun clearing out the list of bugs filed against kubuntu-website
[20:37] <ryanakca> Can one of the PPA people confirm bug 280922 for me please?
[20:37] <ryanakca> According to https://edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members-kde4/+archive , it should be what it's currently set to (
[20:37] <ryanakca> According to https://edge.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members-kde4/+archive , it should be what it's currently set to (
[20:37] <ryanakca> deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/kubuntu-members-kde4/ubuntu intrepid main
[20:38] <ryanakca> Oops, sorry
[20:38] <ryanakca> Anyways, but I'm not familiar enough with the PPA to be sure. "Won't Fix", or do I fix?
[20:39]  * smarter doesn't have a slash, and it works
[20:39] <smarter> would be stupid if it wouldn't
[20:40] <smarter> it's Invalid, not Won't Fix
[20:40] <ryanakca> smarter: ok, thanks
[20:40] <smarter> y/w ;)
[20:41] <smarter> ryanakca: btw, you speak French?
[20:42] <ryanakca> smarter: Oui.
[20:42] <smarter> ah, on est plus que je ne le pensais sur ce chan alors ;)
[20:44] <ryanakca> smarter: oui, je crois que plusieurs d'entre nous parlent Français... nous devrions former un #kubuntu-devel-fr :P
[20:44] <smarter> y'a déjà #ubuntu-devel-fr mais je suis le seul sous KDE ^^
[20:44] <smarter> euh,  #ubuntu-fr-devel
[21:53] <ScottK-palm> Hobbsee: Would you please rescore kde4bindings on armel?
[21:53] <hunger> Anyone else having trouble to log into kde in jaunty?
[21:58] <nhandler> hunger: What problem are you having?
[21:59] <hunger> nhandler: I get kicked back to KDM.
[21:59] <nhandler> hunger: Jaunty alpha 2?
[21:59] <hunger> nhandler: jaunty whatever is current.
[21:59] <nhandler> hunger: It is an xserver issue
[21:59] <hunger> xsession-errors has something about konsole attempting to use QAction change-profile.
[21:59] <nhandler> hunger: Look at the second post in this thread: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=6402241
[22:00] <hunger> nhandler: Nope. gnome works fine.
[22:00] <nhandler> Really?
[22:00] <nhandler> I can't get past the login screen on gnome or kde (jaunty alpha 2)
[22:00] <hunger> nhandler: Well, I am logged into gnome to hang out here.
[22:00] <nhandler> hunger: I am connected to my jaunty computer (which is in recovery mode) from an intrepid laptop (via ssh) to be here
[22:01] <JontheEchidna> meh, nvidia proprietary drivers are gonna break with xorg 1.6 :(
[22:01] <JontheEchidna> right after they release legacy drivers for 1.5....
[22:01]  * JontheEchidna is sad
[22:01]  * ScottK-palm hugs his Intel grahics.
[22:04] <hunger> xorg is extremly unstable with my ATI and keeps freezing my box.
[22:04] <hunger> But apart from that it does work for me.
[22:08] <hunger> Just confirmed that gnome works for me with different accounts. KDE does just get me back to the KDM prompt.
[22:46] <ryanakca> Shouldn't there be a Conflict: between pkg-kde-tools and kdesdk, since both attempt to write to /usr/lib/kubuntu-desktop-i18n  ?
[23:14] <Hobbsee> ScottK: done
[23:26] <seele> what is the use case for wanting to connect to a random irc server? especially if there is a prioritized list
[23:43] <Hobbsee> seele: where someone wants to join their friends on a particular server, and it's not on the list of common ones?
[23:43] <Hobbsee> if it's a private irc network, for eg, or just a small one
[23:48] <seele> i'm not sure that's how this option is supposed to work
[23:48] <seele> it looks like it randomly connects to one of the irc networks on your list instead of following the prioritization
[23:48] <seele> Hobbsee: I'm looking at Quassel, not sure if you've used it
[23:48] <Hobbsee> seele: i haven't, but i've seen some screenshots of it, a while ago
[23:49]  * Hobbsee was giving a generalised answer, as someone who does end up connecting to various, non-predefined irc networks
[23:49] <Hobbsee> that's....kinda odd
[23:51] <seele> i'll just finish my review and make a note to talk to the quassel guys before i finish it
[23:52] <seele> it could be a weird functionality.. or it could be a common functionality with just a bad label
[23:56] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Sthanks.
[23:56] <ScottK> Thanks even
[23:56] <Hobbsee> ScottK: you're welcome
[23:59] <ScottK> Urgh.  Not buildable until after apachelogger's kde4libs update builds.


[23:20] <bkerensa-ODS> Hello Translators.... We are uploading docs soon! Thanks for your work this cycle


[09:03] <s-fox> o.
[09:03] <s-fox> o/
[15:14] <genii-around> Hello all, anyone alive in here?
[15:17]  * genii-around makes more coffee
[15:22] <genii-around> dscassel_ , bjonkman , possibly others: I was forced to move the Toronto party from Thursday to Saturday. I just now changed the details on the loco page and sent off an email to the mailing list about it.
[18:52]  * genii-around sips


[09:04] <mup> PR snapd#7849 closed: osutil: cmd: add ltrace <Created by sd-hd> <Closed by sd-hd> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/7849>
[17:15] <mup> PR snapd#7906 opened: o/devicestate,o/snapstate: move the gadget.yaml check <UC20> <Created by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/7906>
[20:08] <pokk> Trying to build https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~snappy-dev/snappy-hub/rsync/view/head:/snapcraft.yaml but getting https://pastebin.com/XYxxJ5UC
[20:08] <pokk> Using docker to run it doing  docker run --rm -v `pwd`:/build -w /build snapcore/snapcraft:stable snapcraft
[20:08] <pokk> any ideas on what this might cause it?


[03:47] <Sanny> Hello
[06:56] <dholbach> good morning
[13:34] <mugur> Hi
[13:38] <SirDevon> I can see you too
[13:39] <hangger> hello
[13:39] <grasshopper> hello
[13:39] <SirDevon> hello
[13:39] <tonrakms> hello
[13:47] <hangger> is now waiting for the video :D
[13:48] <mhall119> video starts at 1400 UTC, so ~15 minutes
[13:49] <hangger> i had wait for 30 min,.hhe
[14:02] <mhall119> if you have any questions, ask them here starting with the word "QUESTION" in all caps
[14:02] <Sofiero> What are the plans after 14:10?
[14:02] <mhall119> Sofiero: ^^ ask with "QUESTION" at the start
[14:03] <onetempi> QUESTION Hi, I'm excited about trying Unbuntu 14.4 on my Dell Optiplex 740, but I'm having booting/freezing issues.  What version should I try?  Thank you!!!
[14:04] <mrbrownstone3g> QUESTION:  Does Cannonical have any staf working on trajita yet?
[14:06] <Sofiero> Will you be able to use android directly in Ubuntu on the desktop? That to me is important!
[14:08] <Chris_> QUESTION: how can i use ubuntu for small business? I want to easily set up an intranet with shared files &printing, email etc(I'm a noob and want my business friends to leave xp)
[14:10] <grasshopper> QUESTION: what languages will be supported for app development? Python, Java?
[14:11] <mrbrownstone3g> QUESTION:  Will mir benefit from the work on GLAMOR/DRI3/Precent extension
[14:11] <Sofiero> I only use Ubuntu, but does that work with Android apps, have not tried, I only have ubuntu on desktop ..
[14:12] <popey> QUESTION: When do we expect the FFe for SDL 2.0.2 (with Mir support) to land in the image? (for kgunn) ☻
[14:12] <grasshopper> QUESTION: Will Mir have any advantages for thin client (LTSP) applications?
[14:12] <Saviq> popey, FFe? we're in devel release now?
[14:13] <adi__> QUESTION: Any speculations on when we will be able to see Unity 8 preview shapping up for Desktop?(When will it turn from mobile version, to Desktop version)
[14:13] <popey> true!
[14:13] <mrbrownstone3g> QUESTION:  Will a converged desktop be a qt port of unity 7?
[14:15] <Sofiero> Why not walk away from Firefox (mozill) to Goggle Crome instead of the base installation?
[14:17] <adi__> Thank you.
[14:17] <kgunn> grasshopper: wrt you're question on GLAMOR/DRI3/Precent
[14:18] <kgunn> we were just discussing the other day how dri2 actually caused
[14:18] <kgunn> some hw to become "no longer useful"
[14:18] <Saviq> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/topic-u-unity-ui
[14:19] <kgunn> i have't looked, but wondering if that might be a concern there as well
[14:19] <kgunn> grasshopper: if you know, glad to learn what you might have to share
[14:20] <Chris_> QUESTION will mir fix the slight tearing effect i get from moving windows around on my screen?
[14:21] <mrbrownstone3g> QUESTION: Will oxied be carried on to the desktop or is a mobile only solution
[14:21] <mhall119> Chris_: running Unity 8, or Unity 7 with XMir?
[14:21] <Saviq> mrbrownstone3g, oxide is on desktop alrady, as webapps, isn't it?
[14:22] <mhall119> it is on Trusty, yes
[14:22] <mrbrownstone3g> I meant as replacement for friefox
[14:22] <mhall119> not anytime soon
[14:22] <kgunn> Chris_: yes, mir is fully sync'd by default
[14:22] <Saviq> mrbrownstone3g, there's more to a browser than just the renderer
[14:23] <Sofiero> Swedish air is also air, still wondering what's going on, I bought as my apps using Google apps to use them with Ubuntu?
[14:23] <Saviq> Sofiero, can you restate your question, I'm not sure we understand
[14:23] <grasshopper> QUESTION: It seems Python2 is still needed - how long till the important libraries are all available in Python3?
[14:25] <Sofiero> Can I use my apps for Android in the future directly in Ubuntu?
[14:26] <adi__> Sofiero, if they are build with Qt/Qml or HTML5 you would might.
[14:26] <mhall119> Sofiero: not likely, not reliably anyway
[14:26] <Chris_> I think we will have to settle for Gennymotion
[14:26] <mrbrownstone3g> QUESTION:  under usc will lightdm and a window manager be necessary
[14:26] <iBobX> Question: What phone you recommend me to buy where I can install Ubuntu and get a very good peformance and, if possible, a way to connect to a monitor and get it to work as a desktop Ubuntu? Is this possible?
[14:27] <mrbrownstone3g> nexus 4 iBobXC
[14:27] <adi__> But they need to be build for the specific platform, so if you are asking if you can install a ,apk app into Ubuntu, that's 99.9% no
[14:29] <mhall119> get your questions in now ifyou want them answered
[14:31] <iBobX> I see. Thanks
[14:31] <Sofiero> The apps that work from android, maybe should be lifted then, there is not many people know this! Perhaps it may be more visible
[14:32] <iBobX> That's a key for me! Both worlds! But yeah, I'll keep an eye on them... Thanks
[14:32] <meepmeep_> Does it mean that Unity 8 = "ubuntu for android" where you can dock it?
[14:32] <hatlabufarkas_HU> I HAVE :D
[14:32] <hatlabufarkas_HU> a question :D
[14:32] <Innosoftpro> how would you update the ubuntu
[14:32] <popey> meepmeep_: no
[14:32] <Innosoftpro> because i have tried but it doesnt update
[14:33] <hatlabufarkas_HU> i have a question :S
[14:33] <hatlabufarkas_HU> anyone still se my text ?
[14:33] <meepmeep_> ok... thanks all for the q&a session
[14:33] <meepmeep_> hatlab - sounds like you have a support question?
[14:33] <hatlabufarkas_HU> it is over ? :S
[14:33] <onetempi> thank you!!! bye
[14:33] <hatlabufarkas_HU> i have a question :S
[14:33] <popey> ask it
[14:33] <hatlabufarkas_HU> he is wanna leave
[14:33] <hatlabufarkas_HU> YEE :D
[14:33] <hatlabufarkas_HU> so :S
[14:34] <hatlabufarkas_HU> i have use 12.04
[14:34] <hatlabufarkas_HU> and
[14:34] <Chris_> lol
[14:34] <hatlabufarkas_HU> 3 (triple ) monitor setup
[14:34] <Innosoftpro> how do you update
[14:34] <mhall119> just ask the question
[14:34] <hatlabufarkas_HU> :S here is the question :D
[14:34] <meepmeep_> the anticipation :D
[14:34] <Innosoftpro> how do you update ubuntu touch
[14:34] <hatlabufarkas_HU> if i have 3 monitors, why I AM unable
[14:34] <Innosoftpro> tried it but it doesnt install it
[14:34] <hatlabufarkas_HU> to PLUG the Fourth ?
[14:34] <hatlabufarkas_HU> :S
[14:34] <hatlabufarkas_HU> it is DISABLED
[14:34] <hatlabufarkas_HU> :S
[14:34] <iBobX> ZzzZzzZzZZZzZZZZZZzzzZZZ
[14:34] <iBobX> :)
[14:34] <meepmeep_> lol
[14:35] <Chris_> bye
[14:35] <hatlabufarkas_HU> i have a MIC !
[14:35] <popey> #ubuntu or http://askubuntu.com
[14:35] <hatlabufarkas_HU> :S
[14:35] <hatlabufarkas_HU> in short form:
[14:35] <iBobX> Closing in 1...
[14:35] <iBobX> 2....
[14:35] <hatlabufarkas_HU> Why the fourth monitor is DISABLED ?
[14:35] <iBobX> 3...
[14:35] <iBobX> :)
[14:35] <hatlabufarkas_HU> ASK ubuntu ? :S
[14:35] <hatlabufarkas_HU> never answer one of my questions :S
[14:35] <popey> hatlabufarkas_HU: nvidia?
[14:35] <hatlabufarkas_HU> check it
[14:35] <iBobX> Thank you guys.
[14:35] <hatlabufarkas_HU> AMD radeon
[14:35] <iBobX> bye
[14:36] <popey> some video cards only support 3 displays, it's usually down to the video driver that determines that
[14:36] <hatlabufarkas_HU> i have a AMD HD 6990
[14:40] <Sofiero> What do I do as a user of Ubuntu on the desktop, I'm afraid desktop disappears!
[14:43] <Sofiero> 'm Always afraid of change!
[16:57] <r0073r> hey guys


[00:00] <m_3> dazz: o/
[00:01] <dazz> SO!  I've been tasked to learn myself some juju.  Using a local environment.  All was well for the first deploy of wordpress/mysql - awesome.  Killed that environment.  Tried to write my own charm.  Got stuff installing.  Killed that environment, now I can't get anything out of a state: pending....
[00:01] <dazz> where would you suggest I go to find why nothing seems to be happening?
[00:02] <dazz> I'm getting feedback from debug-log - started service unit wordpress/0 - but juju status is still pending?
[00:05] <m_3> dazz: so local provider can be a little quirky atm... we're workign to fix that
[00:05] <dazz> kk.  So it's nothing that can be helped at the moment.
[00:05] <m_3> what I'd recommend in the mean time is wiping your lxc cache when you see strange things happening
[00:05] <dazz> hokaydokay
[00:06] <m_3> make sure you start with a 'juju destroy-environment'
[00:06] <m_3> then once everything's down, you can wipe /var/lib/lxc
[00:06] <dazz> nothing seems to be present in /var/lib/lxc...
[00:07] <m_3> hmmm...
[00:07] <dazz> should juju always be run as root in this event?
[00:07] <dazz> maybe it's a permission thing / not getting sudo where required
[00:07] <m_3> well then I'd go through another cycle of 'juju bootstrap' and then deploy something
[00:07] <dazz> should I try as root?
[00:07] <m_3> so juju should be run as a user, but it'll ask for sudo password when it needs it
[00:07] <m_3> better as a user
[00:08] <dazz> yeah cool.  Thought as much
[00:08] <m_3> try a 'groups' as the user
[00:08] <m_3> make sure you see libvirtd
[00:08] <m_3> try 'virsh net-list --all'
[00:08] <m_3> should see 'default' and it should be active
[00:08] <dazz> yeap
[00:08] <dazz> confirmed both those
[00:08] <m_3> ok, then bootstrap and deploy something
[00:09] <m_3> during the first deploy, it's gonna sit in 'pending' state for a _long_ time
[00:09] <m_3> (it's installing an operating system template)
[00:09] <m_3> once you've successfully got something like mysql in a 'started' state, then subsequent deploys _should_ go quicker
[00:10] <dazz> roughly how long is a "long" time?
[00:10] <m_3> (it'll cache the machine template in /var/lib/lxc)
[00:10] <dazz> 15-20 minutes?
[00:10] <m_3> yeah... depends on your connection
[00:10] <dazz> excellent.  Cheers.
[00:10] <dazz> I know the first time was about 5-10 minutes.
[00:10] <m_3> I'd worry if it takes more than 30mins... typically 10 for me I guess
[00:10] <dazz> cool cool
[00:11] <dazz> Is there a way to get feedback on it's current deployment?
[00:11] <m_3> don't know the best way to see that with the local provider... lemme poke around
[00:15] <m_3> dazz: so there're some lxc tools 'lxc-'<hit tab> and then some logs that go into your 'data-dir' configured in your .juju/environments.yaml
[00:19] <dazz> what is roots passwords for the containers?  Default toor for lxc doesn't seem to work.
[00:19] <dazz> does it use an environment setting?
[00:19] <dazz> mysql seems to be running
[00:20] <dazz> I can query it.  the mysqld service is not running however.
[00:20] <m_3> dazz: does it show 'started'?  if so, you should be able to 'juju ssh mysql/0'
[00:21] <m_3> it'll pick up your primary key
[00:21] <dazz> juju reports that it's waiting for the unit to come up
[00:21] <dazz> but lxc suggests it's already running
[00:22] <m_3> ok, sounds good... the unit will take a bit once the machine is up to install msyql packages and actually run the charm
[00:22] <dazz> hokay-dokay
[00:23] <dazz> so rule number one - don't destroy the environments
[00:23] <dazz> remove the units
[00:23] <dazz> <_<
[00:24] <m_3> you can ssh directly to the machine once it's running 'ssh -lubuntu 192.168.122.xxx'
[00:24] <m_3> rule number one is to wait that first time for a full cache to be built... that happens a lot
[00:25] <m_3> we've got some bugs open to better inform users what the heck is going on
[00:25] <m_3> it's totally confusing and seems like it's jammed
[00:25] <dazz> juju seems really awesome - but it's current documentation is pretty limited.
[00:25] <m_3> yup
[00:25] <dazz> so "long time" and... lol.  10 minutes is long for me XD
[00:26] <dazz> I must have done something the first couple of times when deploying the charms...
[00:26] <m_3> we're working hard to fix that
[00:26] <dazz> no it's okay :)  That's what now-informed-users are for.
[00:26] <m_3> ha!
[00:27] <m_3> yeah, the next release is a long-term-support one, so it's gotta be cleaned up by then
[00:29]  * m_3 bbaib... (coffeeshop -> home)
[00:30] <dazz> cheers sir!
[00:30] <dazz> o/
[00:47] <m_3> dazz: on the way home I realized I told you the wrong cache to clear... it's /var/cache/lxc and not /var/lib/lxc
[00:47] <dazz> ah ha
[00:47] <dazz> let me try that.
[00:47] <m_3> so if things still aren't good, I'd destroy the environment, wipe that cache, then try again
[00:47] <dazz> cause it's still stalled.
[00:47] <dazz> cheers!
[00:47] <m_3> sorry
[00:47] <dazz> it's all good.
[01:01] <SpamapS> dazz: there's a bug that will cause it to wait forever on a failed instance...
[01:02] <SpamapS> dazz: do you see an 'lxc-wait' running?
[01:03] <dazz> not at the moment
[01:03] <dazz> I see lxc-create
[01:04] <dazz> it's probably working better at the moment since I've deleted that cache.
[01:04] <dazz> as in debug-log I see it creating.  I haven't been posted "ready" yet.
[01:05] <dazz> was just going to have a shower, come back and see how it's going
[01:05] <dazz> when is the long-term support of juju being released?  In 3-6 months or something like that?
[01:10] <SpamapS> Along with 12.04
[01:10] <SpamapS> Though I expect quality will continue to improve well after that. :)
[01:11]  * SpamapS disappears
[01:20] <dazz> o/ SpamapS
[01:21] <dazz> cheers
[02:08] <dazz> bad file descriptor while attempting to start the containers....
[02:09] <dazz> ooo
[02:09] <dazz> shit be happening
[02:09] <dazz> lol
[03:23] <dazz> m_3: you about good sir?  How does one debug the db-relation-changed process?
[03:24] <dazz> oh....  appears while debugging you hold commands back.... hang 2. Think I'm okay.
[03:24] <SpamapS> dazz: juju debug-hooks
[03:25] <SpamapS> dazz: opens a tmux window with the name of the hook you are meant to run
[03:25] <dazz> yes but when you catch lets say, a db-change and a new terminal opens... changes don't happen (like, updating the charm or another db-relation-change) until that window is closed.
[03:25] <dazz> or so it appears.
[03:25] <SpamapS> right
[03:25] <SpamapS> thats the entire point. :)
[03:25] <dazz> yeah I missed that <_<
[03:26] <dazz> so I was screaming why -x wasn't working
[03:27] <dazz> when a new tmux window is opened, am I meant to be seeing output of what's going on in my script?
[03:29] <SpamapS> no you're meant to run your script
[03:29] <SpamapS> or pretend to run it and do something else..
[03:30] <SpamapS> its pausing just before execution, and will respect the return code of your shell (so if you 'exit 1' during an install hook, then your service will be in state: install_error)
[03:30] <dazz> fantastic
[03:30] <dazz> !
[03:30] <dazz> !!!!
[03:30] <dazz> lol
[03:30] <dazz> awesome - so - I can only do the script - while in that state.
[03:30] <SpamapS> right, thats the idea
[03:30] <dazz> re: when I was trying ./db-relation-changed I was probably in db-relation-joined
[03:30] <dazz> cheers
[03:30] <dazz> yeap
[03:30] <dazz> getting it
[03:31] <dazz> man I am so documenting all of this
[03:32] <SpamapS> https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/write-charm.html#debugging-hooks
[03:32] <SpamapS> good luck
[03:32]  * SpamapS goes off to do family stuff
[03:33] <dazz> cheers again sir
[05:42] <dazz> so, is it possible to have two databases on the one mysql unit?
[11:24] <niemeyer> Morning!
[11:44] <rog> niemeyer: yo!
[12:29] <mpl> hello gustavo
[13:04] <andrewsmedina> hi
[13:24] <lynxman> nijaba: Hey nijaba, what was the charm that you wrote that uses certificate transfer between charms?
[14:24] <lynxman> nijaba: nevermind found it
[15:26] <lynxman> when you do a juju charmname set var=something it calls config-changed right?
[15:27] <marcoceppi> lynxman: Correct
[15:27] <lynxman> marcoceppi: cool. thanks :)
[15:30] <_markh_> I'm new to juju - have a basic question. I understand juju works with LXC ( http://cloud.ubuntu.com/2011/09/juju-in-11-10-beta2-lxc-and-openstack-improvements/ ), but it's not clear to me whether that behaviour made it into oneiric. I'm also having trouble tracking down how I'd go about telling deploy to use LXC rather than Amazon ECS. Is there some fairly complete documentation somewhere?
[15:32] <koolhead17> _markh_: askubuntu.com/questions/65359/how-do-i-configure-juju-for-local-usage  might help
[15:46] <_markh_> Thx
[16:54] <hazmat> argh.. digging out this twisted regression is definitely like being a rat in a maze
[16:56] <jimbaker> hazmat, in twisted itself?
[16:57] <hazmat> jimbaker, yeah.. some sort of change to ssl handling had a regression from 11.0 to 11.1 wrt to juju's usage for orchestra provider storage usage
[16:57] <jimbaker> hazmat, got the scope
[16:58] <hazmat> i tried treating the sympton which gets most of the tests working except some which just hang.. just digging through the changelog and while its germaine its not realy clearly what's the operational change.. http://twistedmatrix.com/Releases/Twisted/11.1/NEWS.txt
[17:09] <secbrid> chaps when i run juju status -e sample the output seems to be yaml parse-able , however the command also spits out the INFO section so that if i parse the output to python  and run print yaml.load(status_command_output) it errors on the last line. Is there a way to output in pure yaml or without the INFO status line?
[17:11] <hazmat> secbrid, afaicr it should log on stderr and output on stdout
[17:11] <hazmat> if not then it should get a bug report
[17:11] <secbrid> ooh riight!! excellent! thanks hazmat will check that now
[17:28] <SpamapS> indeed, logs are on stderr over here
[18:05] <secbrid> nice that works when i separate out the streams. thanks guys
[19:51] <m_3> lp:charm is now lp:charms
[19:52] <m_3> change your push branches accordingly (i.e., lp:~mark-mims/charms/oneiric/mycharm/trunk)
[20:10] <SpamapS> bzr pull --remember lp:charms/foo works
[20:10] <poolie> you'll need to re-set the push location separately
[20:11] <SpamapS> is there a way to do that without calling push --remember ?
[20:11] <SpamapS> reconfigure doesn't seem to have an option
[20:11] <SpamapS> poolie: ?
[20:14] <poolie> vi .bzr/branch.conf
[20:14] <poolie> or i think maybe bzr configure
[20:15] <poolie> bzr config push_location=lp:....
[20:15] <SpamapS> perfect
[20:15] <SpamapS> oh and that makes extracting the current values cleaner too
[20:15]  * SpamapS de-awks his script
[20:16] <m_3> does that make it less awk-ward?
[20:17] <SpamapS> less tawk more rawk
[20:19] <m_3> wow, it's just stand-up night in the channel
[21:05] <koolhead17> is someone doing something at http://charms.kapilt.com/charms
[21:06] <koolhead17> i see charms being repeated in the list
[21:06] <koolhead17> jcastro: sir if you have time check at my merge request :)
[21:07] <m_3> koolhead17: I think jcastro is traveling right now
[21:07] <koolhead17> m_3: ooh okey.
[21:08] <m_3> koolhead17: also we've made some changes to launchpad that'll cause problems for all charm-related tools
[21:08] <m_3> fixes in progress, but it'll probably leak into the weekend for some tools
[21:08] <koolhead17> m_3: np. i just saw so was bit confused.
[21:09] <SpamapS> hazmat: I suspect charms.kapilt.com needs to be redirected at the new lp:charms
[21:10] <SpamapS> oh looks like it was, but something else caused the dupes
[21:12] <hazmat> hmm, haven't addressed it at all
[21:12] <hazmat> curious how it handles ;-)
[21:12] <hazmat> ah.. dups everything because it keeps historical values
[21:13] <hazmat> on the notion that once published ... well its published and possibly installed
[21:13] <hazmat> i'll reset it
[21:54] <SpamapS> hazmat: how long should it take to refresh?
[22:01] <m_3> SpamapS: looks like it's refreshed
[22:02] <hazmat> yeah.. should be good now
[22:05] <SpamapS> ah ok it wasn't at 13:54, done now. :)
[22:05] <SpamapS> hazmat: thanks!
[22:06] <SpamapS> doh
[22:07]  * SpamapS now knows what its like to try and inhale about 0.5oz of sugar free red bull
[22:07] <SpamapS> swallowing + laughing == near death experience
[22:10] <hazmat> SpamapS, a cautionary tale ? ;-)
[22:11] <SpamapS> The Curse of The Caffeine Addicted Hacker
[22:13] <avoine> hehe


[00:29] <paultag> oh man
[00:29] <paultag> where the dick is jacob?
[00:29] <paultag> gilbert: I gotcha covered, I did not see that nonfree license *at all*
[00:30] <paultag> gilbert: thanks so much for helping make sure fluxbox is legal :)
[02:31] <Unit193> canthus13: Ping - FreeNX
[02:32] <canthus13> PONG!
[02:33] <Unit193> I can't seem to figure out how to show the right/normal desktop in Xubuntu (xfce4-session seems to be the right command, but it's not the normal desktop) any ideas?
[02:38] <Unit193> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3521811/create-a-xubuntu-remotely-through-an-ssh-session-instead-of-an-xfce4-session
[02:39] <canthus13> Hmm.
[02:39] <canthus13> Not sure.  FreeNX seems to be geared toward KDE/Gnome.
[02:43] <canthus13> Unit193: this is old and dated, but might help:  http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=223665
[02:44] <canthus13> Ah.  here ya go:  http://muzso.hu/2007/05/05/connecting-to-a-linux-server-to-xfce-using-freenx
[02:46] <Unit193> canthus13: I found the second link, but it doesn't seem to load the default/normal desktop :(
[02:46] <canthus13> Hmm.
[02:47] <Unit193> FreeNX seems to be real fast
[02:47] <canthus13> I wouldn't try to log in with the same user that's already logged into the computer. it makes weird things happen.
[02:47] <canthus13> That it is.. I'm loving it.
[02:48] <Unit193> And if it only has 1 user?
[02:48]  * canthus13 hasn't tried it with KDE, mostly because he hates KDE.
[02:48] <canthus13> Dunno then. I just know that if I log in as the same user that's already logged in on the machine at home, Firefox freaks out, other programs just plain crash.
[02:49]  * Unit193 tested with the desktop at the login screen
[02:51] <canthus13> I have a separate user set up on this machine for remote login. What's really neat is I can still get to my webcam from the remote computer, so I can use cheese to see what's going on without it showing up on the screen. :)
[02:52] <canthus13> Unit193: tried this?  http://muzso.hu/2007/05/05/connecting-to-a-linux-server-to-xfce-using-freenx#comment-1234
[02:56] <Unit193> Still goes to xfce4 desktop not Xubuntu desktop
[02:57] <Unit193> In the login screen there is an option for Xubuntu Desktop and XFCE4 Desktop (with others too)
[02:58] <Unit193> s/desktop/session
[03:02] <Unit193> More then one session type... nice....
[03:38] <Unit193> This is going to endlessly drive me crazy....
[03:46] <Unit193> Thanks for trying to help canthus13 (the login screen seems to call /usr/share/xubuntu/session.sh and that still didn't work...)
[03:50] <canthus13> No prob.
[22:34] <canthus13> Cheri703: Hey... still looking for a job?
[22:35] <Cheri703> for the most part...
[22:35] <canthus13> I talked to a Ricoh tech who said they're looking for break/fix types.
[22:35] <canthus13> s/types/techs/
[22:35] <Cheri703> interesting
[22:35] <canthus13> I have contact info if you want it...
[22:35] <Cheri703> I didn't do that stuff before, but I could do it I'm sure, yeah, toss it in a pm
[22:36] <canthus13> 'k
[22:36] <Cheri703> what region are they looking to cover?
[22:36] <canthus13> Not really sure.
[22:38] <Cheri703> o.O http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jrhKmB9gHAeF5m0mvXcEMH11p2Zw?docId=eaf14658d1b44ef2a0b5098394eaf477
[22:39] <Cheri703> kk, I'll look into it
[22:42] <Cheri703> counting from 2:56am, I have 438 posts in my google reader feed...
[22:43]  * Cheri703 is trying to refrain from reading any for 24 hours, just to see how high it gets
[22:44] <canthus13> Heh.