[06:20] <didrocks> good morning
[06:53] <pitti> Good morning
[06:54] <pitti> robru: yes, have a look at python3-mock (http://www.voidspace.org.uk/python/mock/)
[06:54] <pitti> robru: with that you can replace any existing method of any object with a stub
[06:55] <didrocks> guten morgen pitti!
[06:55] <pitti> robru: however, in this case I'd actually recommend to just take apart the result again with the multipart iterator and just check that the individual parts are right; then you don't need to hardcode the technical details of MIME, just check that it is parseable and has the right contents
[06:55] <pitti> hey didrocks, ça va?
[06:56] <didrocks> pitti: ça va bien, déjà bien chargé en terme de travail, mais ça va :) et toi?
[06:56] <pitti> haha, sonne comme UDS
[06:57] <pitti> je vais bien, merci!
[06:58] <didrocks> pitti: post-UDS "surprise" plutôt :)
[07:50] <simpleirc> how do i install xfce instead of unity
[07:52] <simpleirc> o
[07:52] <sarnold> looks like there's an xfce package, try 'apt-get install xfce'
[07:53] <simpleirc> thx , will it propagate in the login window like gnome , gnome 2d automatically
[07:53] <sarnold> I hope so; if it doesn't, that feels like a reasonable bug report :)
[07:54] <simpleirc> yep ! sorry im a windoz dork happy to find the world of FOSS
[07:55] <simpleirc> cheers
[07:55] <pitti> ah, gone; I was about to point out xubuntu-desktop
[07:56] <sarnold> zounds, what a metapackage :)
[07:57] <sarnold> but yes, that might have been a faster way to a more useful system.
[08:59] <robru> pitti, oops, I guess what I really meant to ask was 'what is the name of the method that I should mock in order to accomplish this?' ;-)
[09:01] <pitti> robru: hm, I'm not sure; there doesn't seem to be an obvious method for that in the meail.mime package
[09:01] <pitti> robru: but as I said, I wouldn't actually go that far, as you are influencing the very thing you want to test
[09:02] <pitti> I'd iterate over it with msg = email.message_from_binary_file(...) and msg.walk(), and check the individual components
[09:04] <robru> pitti, wait, what are we talking about? I'm talking about using libsoup to upload files in multipart/form-data format... currently I am running a WSGI server in test mode that mirrors everything back to me, so I can submit a real request, and then the response is the result I sent; then I test that what was sent is what I expected. but to do so I need to determine what separator is being used.
[09:04] <pitti> robru: but a multipart/MIME message shoudl tell you the separator in a header field
[09:05] <pitti> robru: and you can use the email.mime python package to dissect it
[09:05] <pitti> you can also compare the actual string, but that seems harder to me, and unnecessary
[09:05] <robru> pitti, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~super-friends/friends/trunk/view/63/friends/tests/test_download.py#L229
[09:06] <robru> pitti, yes, it is harder and unnecessary, that's why I want to simplify this test ;-)
[09:07] <robru> pitti, (the purpose of this test is just to ensure that my uploading module is creating multipart messages correctly; so I can be notified if anything ever changes it's behavior)
[09:07] <pitti> robru: email.mime shoudl handle multipart/POST requests just fine; I'm using it in apport (although the other way around)
[09:08] <didrocks> oh, we don't have python3 bindings for launchpadlib?
[09:08] <pitti> nope
[09:08] <didrocks> ok, thanks pitti :)
[09:08] <robru> pitti, are you saying I should be using email.mime *instead* of libsoup, or just to use it within the test to ensure that the message is valid? (I'm not familiar with email.mime)
[09:08] <pitti> robru: right, the latter
[09:09] <robru> pitti, ok, I'll look at that in a bit. but first: breakfast!
[09:09] <robru> pitti, thanks ;-)
[09:09] <pitti> robru: i. e. feed raw_sent into an email.mime parser, and have it dissect the result
[09:09] <robru> pitti, thanks again, brb ;-)
[09:10] <pitti> robru: i. e. email.message_from_bytes(raw_sent) should do that
[09:11]  * duflu crashes X again.
[09:25]  * didrocks crashes in gnome-keyring launchpad call
[09:25] <didrocks> (was transient though)
[09:57] <dholbach> hello my friends
[09:58] <didrocks> re dholbach ;)
[09:58] <dholbach> if I have a window which does not turn up in unity or in alt-tab - which information should I include in a bug report and what should I file it on?
[09:58] <dholbach> or maybe there's a bug for it already
[09:59] <dholbach> it's a tomboy note - last night it still worked and showed up, today it doesn't
[09:59] <didrocks> dholbach: it's a known issue, but debug info can help, please head on #ubuntu-unity and ping trevhino/andyrock about it
[09:59] <didrocks> none of them are online unfortunately right now :/
[10:00] <dholbach> yeah, I just noticed :)
[10:00] <dholbach> slackers
[10:00]  * dholbach shakes head in disbelief
[10:01] <didrocks> heh :)
[10:08] <seb128> dholbach, lut
[10:08] <dholbach> salut mon ami :)
[10:08] <seb128> dholbach, comment ça va à Berlin ?
[10:09] <dholbach> ça va - et toi? qu'est-ce qui se passe là-bas?
[10:11] <mlankhorst> oui, langue package officiele c'est francois?
[10:11] <seb128> mlankhorst, oui, on parle français ici ;-)
[10:12] <seb128> dholbach, ca va, mon ubuflu commence à partir
[10:12] <seb128> dholbach, content de voir qu'Obama a gagné également
[10:12] <mlankhorst> mon français est terrible!
[10:12] <dholbach> mlankhorst, c'était comme ça  depuis 2005 ou quelque-chose comme ca :)
[10:12] <dholbach> seb128, très bien!
[12:52] <desrt> yawn
[12:52] <larsu> desrt, morning :)
[12:53] <desrt> another night, another election
[12:53] <desrt> larsu: good morning
[12:53] <desrt> too bad about NC, eh?
[12:53] <larsu> ha, yeah. kenvandine will be saaaaaad
[12:54]  * desrt is a bit sad too
[12:54] <desrt> my favourite entertainment source is gone
[12:55] <larsu> :)
[12:56] <larsu> I'm happy that we'll get actual news again in a couple of days
[13:24] <ogra_> seb128, was the onscreen keyboard blueprint dropped or did you just not get to it yet ?
[13:25]  * ogra_ tries to assemble a list of workitems for himself
[13:25] <seb128> ogra_, I didn't draft it yet, will do that today
[13:25] <seb128> ogra_, it's https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-onscreen-keyboard-review
[13:25] <ogra_> yep, thats what i'm looking at, just wanted to know if its still planned
[13:26] <seb128> ogra_, it is
[13:27] <ogra_> thx
[13:31] <mvo> seb128: I guess you don't mind if I upload a new glade to raring - make gtkbuttons actually be usable again ;)
[13:32] <seb128> mvo, please do, sorry I forgot that you mentioned that during UDS ... is that broken in quantal as well?
[13:32] <mvo> seb128: yes
[13:32] <mvo> seb128: no worries
[13:32] <mvo> seb128: I can SRU it there too if you want
[13:32] <seb128> mvo, please
[13:32] <seb128> mvo, danke
[13:32] <mvo> seb128: or maybe we can simply copy it?
[13:33] <seb128> mvo, copy? pocket copies you mean? no, SRU team said they only do that before the new serie opens, they want stuff rebuilt with the new toolchain now
[13:34] <mvo> seb128: ok
[13:34] <seb128> ogra_, ok, drafter, pending approval from didrocks
[13:34] <seb128> drafted*
[13:34] <seb128> mvo, danke, I will do the SRU verification for you ;-)
[13:35] <mvo> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glade/+bug/1075957 fwiw
[13:35] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1075957 in glade (Ubuntu Quantal) "3.14.0 can not edit a GtkButton label" [Medium,In progress]
[13:35] <seb128> mvo, it's 2012, I can't believe people still use buttons btw :p
[13:35] <ogra_> seb128, merci !
[13:35]  * seb128 hides
[13:35] <seb128> ogra_, de rien ;-)
[13:38] <mlankhorst> mvo: apt sru? :D
[13:40] <seb128> Laney, when you are done drafting specs please set "definition" to "pending approval"
[13:40] <seb128> Laney, it seems like you drafter the patch burden and gst ones but they are still on "new"
[13:40] <mvo> mlankhorst: indeed
[13:52] <mvo> seb128: uploaded to quantal-proposed
[13:52] <seb128> mvo, \o/
[13:52] <seb128> mvo, danke
[13:52] <mvo> yw
[13:55] <mlankhorst> mvo: I mean I want to do the apt sru for bug 1062503 but my only involvement with it was that I reported the bug and tested the fix, I can't really do a fair analysis for a fix I didn't write. :-)
[13:55] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 1062503 in apt (Ubuntu Quantal) "apt fails to install libglapi-mesa-lts-quantal correctly on switching x stacks" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1062503
[14:05] <mvo> mlankhorst: yeah, I knew what you mean :) I will do the merge in a bit, just want to finish my current task
[14:05] <mlankhorst> sure np
[14:25] <Laney> seb128: yeah I already did that for the gstreamer one
[14:25] <Laney> not sure if the description should be more verbose though
[14:27] <jbicha> Sweetshark: congrats http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/announce/msg00135.html
[15:28] <Sweetshark> jbicha: heh, thanks.
[15:30] <Sweetshark> jbicha: The ESC (containing me) has appointed three devs (including me) to decide the certification of devs (including me) on behalf of the Board of Directors (including me).
[15:30] <Sweetshark> ETOOMANYJOBS
[15:32] <jbicha> Sweetshark: well that was nice of you to give yourself a certification and another job :)
[15:40] <Sweetshark> Others show beautiful ladies their collection of stamps. I show my collection of LibreOffice titles ...
[15:42] <ogra_> you have them in an album ?
[15:43] <Sweetshark> ogra_: the ladies?
[15:43] <ogra_> lol
[15:46]  * kenvandine rofl
[15:56] <seb128> kenvandine, hey, how are you?
[15:57] <kenvandine> happy obama won, but bummed NC was red :/
[15:58] <seb128> kenvandine, yeah, luckily for you NC was not needed for him to win
[16:00] <kenvandine> i do wonder how it is that florida consistently has trouble getting results
[16:00] <jcastro_> old people
[16:01] <desrt> kenvandine: sorry dude
[16:01] <desrt> just wasn't in the cards
[16:01] <kenvandine> NC was less than 100K away from being blue :)
[16:01] <desrt> kenvandine: i reckon you have a good crack at it 4 years from now
[16:02] <seb128> the "all or nothing" system is a bit weird
[16:02] <desrt> seb128: the situation is far worse in canada, i assure you :)
[16:03] <seb128> desrt, Canada doing something worse than the US, I don't believe you :p
[16:03] <kenvandine> haha
[16:03] <desrt> take the US system
[16:03] <seb128> desrt, it would seem logical to have the number of seats being proportional to the results
[16:03] <desrt> except instead of basing it on states you base it on arbitrarily-drawn-up ridings
[16:03] <desrt> and then throw in 5 parties instead of 2
[16:04] <desrt> but still winner-takes-all
[16:04] <kenvandine> oh, they draw different boundaries for election results?
[16:04] <didrocks> seb128: hem, we don't really have that as well for the parliament (for some arguably good reasons)
[16:04] <desrt> good way to get a PM who 2/3 of the country voted against
[16:04] <desrt> kenvandine: explaining the canadian system to an american: our PM is selected in the same way that you select your speaker of the house
[16:04] <desrt> kenvandine: except there are 5 parties in our house
[16:05] <kenvandine> ah
[16:05] <desrt> and we call it "parliament"
[16:05] <seb128> didrocks, well, we do elect our députés directly though
[16:06] <didrocks> seb128: that's true, but it doesn't really represent the overall % of votes of the nation
[16:06] <seb128> desrt, it just feel weird that having 90% of 51% of the votes makes no difference
[16:06] <didrocks> something similar happen on another scale in the US :)
[16:06] <seb128> didrocks, right
[16:06] <desrt> seb128: strictly speaking, having 90% or 40% doesn't matter
[16:06] <desrt> since it's possible to have 40% and still win
[16:07] <seb128> well, you should get a stronger lead if you have a stronger part of the population following you
[16:07] <seb128> it's weird that 1% difference in one state can make the whole election goes one way or another
[16:08] <seb128> where it might not be even a representative picture of the country's opinion
[16:08] <kenvandine> i think it would make more sense to use the popular vote these days
[16:08] <kenvandine> the reasons for the electorial college are outdated now
[16:09] <seb128> yeah
[16:09] <larsu> this might fix it... http://www.nationalpopularvote.com/
[16:09] <kenvandine> of course then the media can't capitalize on their forecasts as much :)
[16:09] <larsu> it won't ever fix the 2-party system, though
[16:10] <kenvandine> it sucks that some people's vote really doesn't matter at all
[16:10] <kenvandine> in the current system
[16:20] <seb128> jbicha, hey, do you know if there is anything blocking the cogl update or if we could sync 1.12 from debian?
[16:20] <didrocks> larsu: even with 2 rounds, most of the 2 main parties in France try to advocate the "useful vote" for the 1st round.
[16:22] <larsu> didrocks, instead of a strategic vote?
[16:24] <didrocks> larsu: "useful vote" is strategic, like "ensure this candidate (which almost surely will be in the second round) has a lot of votes/support even in the first round"
[16:25] <didrocks> it's killing the small parties
[16:25] <larsu> didrocks, :(
[16:25]  * larsu never understood the french system :)
[16:25] <seb128> larsu, we got an election where the extrem right kicked out the left from the second round by beating them in the first round of the election
[16:26] <didrocks> yeah, in 2002
[16:26] <seb128> larsu, and people don't want that to happen again
[16:26] <didrocks> so it's a little bit of a traumatism
[16:26] <seb128> larsu, so they try to "make sure that the left/right" made to the second round
[16:26] <seb128> make it*
[16:26] <larsu> hm, that makes sense ...
[16:26] <didrocks> larsu: they were a lot of small left parties in 2002, that's why this situation happened
[16:27] <seb128> larsu, it's like "if you vote green your vote might be the one which makes the left to not be there on the second turn and let us between screwed to pick right or extrem right"
[16:27] <seb128> between->being
[16:27] <didrocks> to be on the second turn, you need at least 20% of voters
[16:27] <larsu> that sucks
[16:27] <didrocks> which means mainly 2 parties…
[16:32]  * didrocks hugs kiki
[16:32] <didrocks> best regexp tool ever!
[16:33] <seb128> kenvandine, versions says we have outdated signon-keyring-extension &  gnome-control-center-signon & unity-firefox-extension
[16:33] <seb128> kenvandine, just pointing it in case you didn't notice those during UDS or something
[16:33] <kenvandine> yeah
[16:33] <kenvandine> i know :)
[16:33] <seb128> ok, good
[16:33] <seb128> ignore me then ;-)
[16:33] <kenvandine> on my todo list for this week
[16:33] <kenvandine> i am glad they are on the versions page :-D
[16:33] <didrocks> seb128: stop doing that! I just wrote "ken" as my next variable name :p
[16:33] <seb128> lol
[16:33] <kenvandine> hehe
[16:34] <didrocks> kenvandine: once you will inline packaging, that will never happen again ;)
[16:34] <kenvandine> indeed
[16:34] <seb128> didrocks, oh, I'm sure I will found stuff to ping Ken about ... like empathy ;-)
[16:34] <kenvandine> didrocks, i am going to do one as an example and let robru do the rest :)
[16:34] <seb128> it's also on the red list
[16:34] <didrocks> kenvandine: mterry almost have all his inline packaging merge, I think you can follow the theme after that!
[16:34] <didrocks> seb128: empathy yeah ;)
[16:35] <didrocks> kenvandine: cool! you can take what mterry did with NOCONFIGURE=1 dh_autoreconf ./autogen.sh
[16:35] <seb128> didrocks, or try to talk to cassidy about adopting your ps workflow :p
[16:35] <kenvandine> didrocks, most of mine already do that :)
[16:35] <didrocks> seb128: ahah, sure sure… he will be delighted :p
[16:35] <seb128> didrocks, I'm sure he will love it ;-)
[16:35] <didrocks> seb128: can we put the packaging in his empathy branch?
[16:35] <didrocks> you still have your git gnome commit access, as pitti
[16:35] <kenvandine> i figure this will be a good way to get robru familiar with the webapps/accounts packages
[16:35] <seb128> didrocks, he's not coming to JDLL right? :p
[16:35] <didrocks> kenvandine: excellent! ensure to try in a chroot so that you don't forget any build-dep, like gnome-common :)
[16:36] <kenvandine> yeah :)
[16:36] <didrocks> seb128: no, he isn't, so you can push that silently :)
[16:36] <seb128> ;-)
[16:36] <kenvandine> well, i've added that all over the place already
[16:36] <kenvandine> i gave up on keeping those trim ages ago
[16:36] <didrocks> \o/
[16:36] <kenvandine> twice a week having to tweak it last cycle... easier to just leave the bloat in
[16:37] <didrocks> heh, indeed
[16:38] <kenvandine> didrocks, mind if i do an SRU for dee?
[16:38] <kenvandine> i have a fix from mhr3 i need
[16:38] <didrocks> kenvandine: I don't mind at all, but SRU depending on another SRU, is it policy compliant?
[16:38] <didrocks> kenvandine: or does you gwibber doesn't regress without the SRU?
[16:39] <kenvandine> not for gwibber :)
[16:39] <kenvandine> but for friends
[16:39] <kenvandine> bug in SharedModel
[16:39] <desrt> can someone remind me of the magical incantation for replacing the appmenu indicator?
[16:39] <kenvandine> friends won't be in quantal of course, but this might be causing problems we haven't noticed yet
[16:40] <kenvandine> and it is safe
[16:40] <didrocks> kenvandine: good to me then, please do ;)
[16:40] <desrt> or unity-panel-service
[16:40] <didrocks> Mirv: FYI ^^
[16:40] <desrt> larsu, charles: ?
[16:40]  * kenvandine files the bug :)
[16:40] <larsu> desrt, export INDICATOR_SERVICE_REPLACE_MODE=1
[16:41] <desrt> on u-p-s?
[16:41] <larsu> no, on the indicator-service
[16:41] <desrt> isn't indicator-appmenu in u-p-s?
[16:41] <larsu> half/half ;)
[16:41] <desrt> it's a .so file....
[16:42] <larsu> yeah, only the hud parts are in a service
[16:42] <desrt> so how do i restart unity-panel-service?
[16:42] <larsu> killall
[16:42] <larsu> (it restarts automatically)
[16:42] <desrt> i want to see the stderr in my terminal
[16:43] <larsu> mv the binary, then start it from your terminal
[16:43] <desrt> and/or valgrind
[16:43] <desrt> cool.
[16:43] <larsu> (yes, that's stupid, but it's the only way around the self-restarting)
[16:43]  * desrt winces
[16:43] <larsu> there's a tool that loads a single indicator .so which we usually use for debugging, but it doesn't work for indicator-appmenu
[16:44] <larsu> because appmenu depends on some other window having focus
[16:44] <larsu> bbiab
[16:49] <Laney> gah
[16:49] <Laney> new firefox broke pentadactyl
[16:49]  * Laney 's brain turns to mush
[16:53] <kenvandine> didrocks, Mirv: we are going to wait on the dee SRU, just do it along with the next set of unity SRUs
[16:55] <didrocks> kenvandine: ah excellent
[16:55] <kenvandine> i fixed it in raring already, which is all i really need for right now
[16:56] <didrocks> ok, good :)
[17:06] <ritz> seb128 hi, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-messages/+bug/1003898
[17:06] <ubot2> ritz: Error: launchpad bug 1003898 not found
[17:06] <seb128> ritz, hey
[17:06] <ritz> does this look fine for ubuntu-sponsor ?
[17:08] <seb128> ritz, what source is the patch against? there is no seen-db.c in indicator-messages
[17:09] <ritz> this is against precise
[17:09] <seb128> ritz, no, what source package
[17:09] <seb128> e.g what component
[17:09] <ritz> indicator-messages
[17:09] <seb128> oh
[17:10] <ritz>  indicator-messages (Ubuntu)
[17:10] <seb128> is there any chance you could put a merge request up for review there?
[17:10] <ritz> I have added this to the lp
[17:11] <ritz> sounds good. I am kindda stuck with trying to add a patch to this package
[17:11] <ritz> I suck a lot at deb
[17:11] <ritz> will try this bit
[17:11] <ritz> seb128, thanks. Will have one by tomorrow , hopefully :)
[17:12] <seb128> ritz, can you put up a merge request against https://code.launchpad.net/~indicator-applet-developers/indicator-messages/trunk.0.6 ?
[17:12] <ritz> will do :)
[17:16] <ritz> seb128, I could update the code in place, or do I need to write debian/patches/patch_name.patch ?
[17:18] <seb128> ritz, for the merge request?
[17:18] <seb128> bzr branch lp:indicator-messages/0.3
[17:18] <seb128> cd indicator-messages
[17:18] <seb128> edit the file
[17:18] <seb128> bzr commit
[17:18] <seb128> bzr push lp:~ritz/indicator-messages/lp-1003898 (or use a public for reference)
[17:18] <seb128> then propose the branch for merging
[17:19] <seb128> it will be on the webpage for the branch
[17:19] <seb128> you can bzr lp-open to go the page
[17:19] <ritz> sweet, thank you :)
[17:19] <seb128> yw
[17:31] <jbicha> desrt: ok, here's a hack for getting rid of the extra Ubuntu panels from GNOME; we can have 2 .desktop's and use OnlyShowIn to hide the panels from System Settings but not from the Overview when running GNOME
[17:32] <seb128> jbicha, what do you mean "extra Ubuntu panels"?
[17:33] <seb128> jbicha, what is "overview"? the g-s dash? what's the point to have panels there if they are not used in g-c-c?
[17:33] <jbicha> seb128: Backup, Privacy, Software Sources, Ubuntu One, etc.
[17:33] <jbicha> oh I guess that doesn't quite work either :(
[17:34] <seb128> no that doesn't
[17:34] <seb128> you can't call a panel that is not listed in the g-c-c overview
[17:34] <seb128> if it's not listed it doesn't exist for g-c-c and there is no way to load it
[17:34] <seb128> we had an hack to make that work for the goa panel in precise but it was a code patch and hackish
[17:35] <larsu> seb128, `gnome-control-center <panel>` doesn't work for the hidden ones?
[17:35] <seb128> larsu, no
[17:36] <seb128> larsu, the model used by the iconview is the same model they use for other things like call panels
[17:37] <larsu> seb128, makes sense, the blacklisting in desktop files probably works on the .so level
[17:37] <seb128> larsu, yeah, they need an entry in the model to set the title, icon etc
[17:37] <seb128> if you mask the .desktop you loose those items
[17:37] <seb128> items->infos
[17:38]  * larsu nods
[17:39] <jbicha> seb128: well it works for Software Sources & Ubuntu One since those aren't real panels
[17:39] <seb128> jbicha, right
[17:39] <seb128> hacks on hacks ;-)
[17:40] <seb128> jbicha, doesn't work for deja-up, privacy, etc though
[17:40] <seb128> jbicha, do you really have users complaining about having backups in system settings?
[17:40] <jbicha> seb128: it would be neat if the library could do that filtering
[17:41] <didrocks> james_w: yeah, do you have a minute for a lame launchpadlib lame question?
[17:41] <jbicha> seb128: I think Backup isn't really objectionable since that really should be part of core GNOME
[17:42] <jbicha> Software Sources is ugly since it shouldn't be a separate popup
[17:42] <seb128> jbicha, it seems like to me that you could keep deja-dup, and filter out software-source & ubuntuone & privacy
[17:43] <seb128> the privacy stuff is not useful under gnome-shell anyway, they don't really use zg
[17:43] <seb128> so you don't even need it in the overview
[17:43] <jbicha> Privacy & Ubuntu One are a little annoying because they make the Personal section too big, but...it sounds like GNOME really wants to add their own Privacy & Sharing panels for 3.8 (as 2 separate panels)
[17:44] <ritz> seb128 thanks. done.
[17:44] <seb128> jbicha, btw did you see my cogl question earlier?
[17:44] <seb128> jbicha, oh, and thanks for the rhythmbox udpate ;-)
[17:45] <jbicha> seb128: oh I think I was disconnected then, the only thing blocking cogl for me was that I no longer have upload rights to have done it myself
[17:46] <james_w> didrocks, for you? of course
[17:46] <seb128> ritz, thanks, maybe you could also open a public bug so we can use that for the SRU tracking?
[17:46] <ritz> sure
[17:46] <seb128> jbicha, so I can sync it?
[17:46] <seb128> ritz, thanks
[17:46] <jbicha> seb128: yes please
[17:47] <didrocks> james_w: \o/ so, I want to open bugs against a particular ubuntu serie for a source package. I was thinking using bug.addTask(target=source_package)
[17:47] <seb128> jbicha, great, then we need to follow up with rebuilds ... should clutter stack be updated as well in the same run?
[17:47] <seb128> jbicha, things will not move out of proposed until the rebuilds are done
[17:47] <didrocks> james_w: however, I only find one kind of bug_task for source packages: source_package = lp.distributions['ubuntu'].getSourcePackage(name = "unity") for instance
[17:47] <didrocks> which isn't tied to any serie, like quantal, precise…
[17:48] <james_w> didrocks, maybe it's addNomination that you want?
[17:49] <james_w> didrocks, I'm just guessing though, I've not done this myself
[17:49] <didrocks> james_w: addNomination take a bug_task as well, isn't it?
[17:49] <didrocks> bug_target I meant
[17:49] <james_w> Nominate a bug for an IDistroSeries or IProductSeries
[17:49] <jbicha> it looks like nothing really depends on activity-log-manager-control-center except ubuntu-desktop so (and you can quote me): privacy's not worth worrying about
[17:49] <didrocks> I didn't find a way to have bug_target for a source package in one serie
[17:49] <jbicha> seb128: it looks like we're already on the latest stable clutter
[17:50] <james_w> didrocks, so I would think it would take lp.distributions['ubuntu'].getSeries(name_or_version=whatever)
[17:50] <james_w> didrocks, and nominate for all source packages
[17:50] <seb128> jbicha, versions says 1.12.0 against 1.12.2
[17:50] <seb128> jbicha, 1.3.2 vs 1.4 for clutter-gtk
[17:50] <james_w> didrocks, alternatively, maybe getSourcePackage(name=whatever) on distro_series will work as a bug_target for addTask?
[17:50] <didrocks> james_w: ok, so I need to addTask first for the source package, and then addNomination
[17:51] <james_w> didrocks, that's my guess, based on how the web UI works, but I don't know
[17:51] <didrocks> hum, let me try that, didn't see getSourcePackage on distro_series :)
[17:51] <james_w> didrocks, bdmurray might know
[17:52] <jbicha> seb128: ok, yes then :)
[17:53] <didrocks> james_w: your last suggestion beautifully worked \o/ https://bugs.staging.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/123
[17:53] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 123 in Launchpad itself "There's no direct way to see the project info when translating it" [Medium,Fix released]
[17:53] <didrocks> thanks a lot ;)
[17:53] <seb128> jbicha, cogl synced, I will start doing some rebuilds once the binaries are there and NEWed
[17:53] <james_w> didrocks, woo
[17:53] <james_w> didrocks, looks a bit odd because unity (Ubuntu) is grayed out
[17:54] <james_w> didrocks, so I think this is a state that you can't get in to with the web ui, do beware of bugs
[17:54] <didrocks> james_w: yeah, because there is no "current serie" task
[17:54] <james_w> or maybe all this changed since I last did it
[17:54] <didrocks> james_w: yeah, I'll look into that, anyway, thanks a bunch, will experiment now :)
[17:54] <james_w> great
[18:06] <GunnarHj> Laney: Hi Iain!
[18:06] <GunnarHj> Laney: Saw that you are piloting... I have a few items in the sponsorship queue, and the most urgent are the MP + SRUs at http://pad.lv/875435, since they affect quite a few Asian users. It's really the SRUs that are interesting, but I suppose we should do it in the right order. Do you have time to take a look? The MP is reviewed and approved.
[18:06] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 875435 in OEM Priority Project precise "iBus indicator does not show on the panel" [Medium,In progress]
[18:06] <Laney> GunnarHj: I'm signing off now I'm afraid
[18:07] <GunnarHj> Laney: Ok, then I try someone else.
[18:07] <Laney> if you don't get a bite from one of the others I'll look tomorrow for you though
[18:07] <GunnarHj> Laney: Great, good to know!
[18:10]  * Laney goes away
[18:10] <Laney> goodnight!
[18:10] <GunnarHj> mdeslaur: Hi Mark!
[18:10] <GunnarHj> mdeslaur: Saw that you are piloting... I have a few items in the sponsorship queue, and the most urgent are the MP + SRUs at http://pad.lv/875435, since they affect quite a few Asian users. It's really the SRUs that are interesting, but I suppose we should do it in the right order. Do you have time to take a look? The MP is reviewed and approved.
[18:10] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 875435 in OEM Priority Project precise "iBus indicator does not show on the panel" [Medium,In progress]
[18:11] <mdeslaur> GunnarHj: I'm done for the day, and still have a couple of things pending...could you possibly ask someone else doing patch piloting?
[18:11] <mdeslaur> @pilot out
[18:12] <mdeslaur> GunnarHj: sorry about that
[18:12] <GunnarHj> mdeslaur: Sure, you were the second one I asked. ;-)  One more to try...  No problem, of course.
[18:13] <mdeslaur> GunnarHj: darn, sorry about that...bad timing :(
[21:04] <chrisccoulson> hah, "Get horny using tablets" - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/577251/comments/12
[21:04] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 577251 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Problem Loading Page" [Undecided,Expired]
[21:04] <chrisccoulson> is this why everyone got a nexus 7 at UDS?
[21:15] <attente> heh, they're magical tablets :)
[21:15] <desrt> wait
[21:15] <desrt> tablets?
[21:15] <desrt> oh boy you got me!!
[21:38] <desrt> Laney: hey.  can you SRU the make with the webkit argument length fix to precise as well?
[21:40] <bryceh> TheMuso, around by chance?  Valve contacted me about an alsa issue on i386
[21:41] <bryceh> TheMuso, I'll fwd the email.
[21:44] <TheMuso> bryceh: Yeah I am around.
[21:46] <bryceh> TheMuso, they say 12.04 has 1.0.24 as the i386 package, but 1.0.25 for amd64.  but I can't confirm that; looks like there is a i386 package for 1.0.25?
[21:47] <TheMuso> bryceh: Do you mean alsa-lib, or alsa-utils?
[21:49] <TheMuso> Yeah, we have 1.0.25 accross x86 in precise. If there was an FTBF I would have been on it ages ago...
[21:49] <TheMuso> Sounds like their mirror is horribly out of date.
[21:49] <TheMuso> Which ever mirror they use.
[21:49] <bryceh> TheMuso, they were ambiguous on what package it is
[21:50] <bryceh> could it be ia32-libs?
[21:51] <TheMuso> They shouldn't be using ia32-libs... Alsa is all multi-arch now.
[21:51] <TheMuso> Has been since oneirif IIRC.
[21:51] <TheMuso> oneiric even.
[21:51] <bryceh> hmm
[21:53] <TheMuso> And whilst I think the internal kernel version may be alsa 1.0.24, that should be the same for both 32-bit and 64-bit systems.
[21:54]  * TheMuso fires up a precise VM to check.
[21:55] <TheMuso> bryceh: Perhaps if you bounced the email to me instead of forwarding, I could group reply and query a few things.
[21:55] <TheMuso> That way if it were bounced, I could keep threading in tact for all concerned.
[21:56] <bryceh> ok
[21:56] <TheMuso> Thanks.
[21:57] <bryceh> bounced
[21:57] <TheMuso> Thanks, will follow up and keep you in the loop.
[22:00] <bryceh> thanks TheMuso
[22:03] <TheMuso> np


[01:13] <Jack_Sparrow> [17:09] <sleepcat> NetLarIrvine: if you're having trouble with ubuntu, you may try Solaris 10.  It is a bit easier to get going
[01:18] <somerville32> What is the factoid about compiling your own drivers?
[01:22] <LjL> hm
[01:23] <LjL> can't find any
[01:23] <LjL> there is of course !kernel
[01:23] <LjL> but no generic factoid about module assistant
[01:23] <LjL> there's this
[01:23] <LjL> !alsa-source
[01:23] <ubotu> Want to use alsa 0.11? Grab and install http://archive.progeny.com/debian/pool/main/a/alsa-driver/alsa-source_1.0.11-2_all.deb, install linux-headers-$(uname -r) module-assistant and build-essential and run sudo module-assistant a-i alsa-source
[01:25] <stdin> hmm, isn't that a bit old now?
[01:25] <LjL> no idea
[01:25] <LjL> it's the only factoid mentioning module-assistant
[01:26] <stdin> well gutsy has 1.0.14-1ubuntu2 so it seems a bit out of date
[01:26] <ardchoille> Gutsy here: alsa-base-1.0.14-1ubuntu2
[01:27] <ardchoille> stdin types faster than I do :/
[01:27] <LjL> well who cares about that factoid anyway
[01:27] <LjL> but perhaps we should have one about using module-assistant
[01:28] <LjL> can't find much on the wiki either
[01:29] <stdin> me either
[01:31] <stdin> all I can find is a spec for module-assistant
[01:31] <LjL> the one to run it automatically after kernel updates?
[01:32] <stdin> yeah
[01:36] <LjL> !modules
[01:36] <ubotu> To blacklist a module, edit /etc/modprobe.d/my_blacklist and add « blacklist <modulename> » to the end of that list - To explicitly load modules in a specific order, list them in /etc/initramfs-tools/modules and type « sudo update-initramfs -u »
[01:37] <LjL> !-modules
[01:37] <ubotu> modules is <alias> blacklist - added by LjL on 2007-01-26 02:51:55
[01:37] <LjL> !no modules is <reply> To compile modules and drivers that are not bundled with the standard !kernel, install the relevant package, usually called "<modulename>-source", and run « sudo module-assistant » (you will have to do this again after kernel updates). To prevent specific modules from loading, see !blacklist
[01:37] <ubotu> I'll remember that LjL
[01:38] <somerville32> troll in #ubuntu-offtopic
[01:39] <somerville32> LjL, Maybe he should be klined? He is just trolling channels at random it seems
[01:41] <LjL> #perv...
[01:41] <LjL> how many channels i didn't know the existence of, and am glad i don't, i wonder
[01:41] <somerville32> yea, pretty freaky
[01:41] <elkbuntu> how on earth did you find that one
[01:42] <LjL> i didn't, this sam troll just mentioned it on #teensonlinux
[01:43] <LjL> ouch i just couldn't resist
[01:44]  * somerville32 doesn't want to know what LjL just gave into :P
[01:44] <LjL> somerville32: that little comment on #teens
[01:45] <somerville32> haha
[01:45]  * somerville32 nods.
[01:46] <ubotu> MenZa called the ops in #ubuntu (motherlode)
[01:47] <ubotu> nickrud called the ops in #ubuntu ()
[01:47] <LjL> done
[01:48] <nalioth> LjL: klined
[01:48] <LjL> yeah, saw him in #gentoo :|
[02:50] <LjL> ardchoille: client coming for you
[02:51] <ardchoille> LjL: ?
[02:51] <LjL> ardchoille, unless i'm mistaken and "ardachcile" is someone else, but i doubt it
[02:52] <LjL> perhaps he won't come
[02:52] <LjL> anyway FYI
[02:52] <ardchoille> LjL: I'm confused
[02:52] <LjL> #ubuntu:
[02:52] <LjL> [03:50:06] <nonoo> unban me from #kubuntu someone
[02:52] <LjL> [03:50:10] <nonoo> ardachcile is a faggit
[02:52] <ardchoille> in #kubuntu? or PM?
[02:52] <LjL> [03:50:36] <LjL> nonoo: #ubuntu-ops
[02:53] <ardchoille> The only ban I have set was atwo
[02:53] <ardchoille> You remember him?
[02:53] <elkbuntu> ardchoille, it's completly concivable they've changed nick a few times to try get back in
[02:53] <LjL> something we'll find out as soon as the bantracker loads
[02:53] <LjL> which is probably tomorrow
[02:54] <ardchoille> according to /whois, that's him
[02:54] <ardchoille> elkbuntu: Yeah
[02:54] <LjL> it is indeed
[02:55] <LjL> i don't think he should join #ubuntu again, either, seeing his eagerness to call people names
[02:55] <ardchoille> He was causing trouble, cursing, general bad attitude, disrespect to other, disregarding channel rules.. he had many warning from several ops. I finally got tired of it and banned him.
[02:55] <LjL> now he's atwo1
[02:56] <LjL> don't think he has a clue how to get a different address, though, so let him change nicknames as he likes
[02:56] <elkbuntu> that 'realname' he has set is ringing bells
[02:56] <LjL> it is?
[02:57] <ardchoille> he started out as atwo1, got banned from a channel, changed nicks to atwo and now he is nonoo
[02:57] <ardchoille> Sounds of ban evasion to me.
[02:57] <elkbuntu> yeah, but i have no clue who it's a reminder of
[02:57] <LjL> no, he's atwo1 again now
[02:57] <LjL> anyway, he's certainly attempted ban evasion, but will hardly manage it
[02:57] <elkbuntu> but i know he's not the first troll to use that realname
[02:58] <LjL> elkbuntu, i'm grepping logs, but i can't remember
[02:58] <elkbuntu> LjL, so it's familiar to you too?
[02:59] <LjL> no, not really, but perhaps there's something in the logs
[02:59] <ardchoille> Where is the ban tracker?
[02:59] <ardchoille> Do I have access to it?
[02:59] <LjL> ardchoille, nope, you currently don't have access to it, we'll need seveas
[03:00] <ardchoille> I should ask him to give me access
[03:00] <LjL> the only Pandemonium i have is on march 25, nickname (not realname), not kicked or banned
[03:00] <elkbuntu> his presence is somewhat required, so you could be waiting a while
[03:01] <ardchoille> No problem, I can wait :)
[03:04] <elkbuntu> LjL, i cant find it in my logs either, but im starting to think the server tab doesnt get logged in xchat
[03:05] <stdin> it does, probably ~/.xchat2/xchatlogs/Ubuntu\ Servers-.log
[03:08] <stdin> more like ~/.xchat2/xchatlogs/Ubuntu\ Servers-ubuntu\ servers.log  actually
[03:08] <elkbuntu> aaah... there it hides
[03:10] <stdin> odd naming scheme though
[03:11] <elkbuntu> aaaaaaaha!
[03:12] <ardchoille> elkbuntu: >
[03:12] <elkbuntu> all i needed to do was grep all my ubuntu logs:
[03:12] <ardchoille> ?
[03:12] <elkbuntu> Jul 11 01:07:00 *       pandemonium<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has joined #ubuntu
[03:12] <elkbuntu> Jul 11 01:07:10 <pandemonium>   hez
[03:12] <elkbuntu> Jul 11 01:07:12 <pandemonium>   hez
[03:12] <elkbuntu> Jul 11 01:07:20 <pandemonium>   hey....whats up here
[03:12] <elkbuntu> Jul 11 01:08:08 *       pandemonium has quit (Client Quit)
[03:12] <ardchoille> What did you find?
[03:12] <elkbuntu> i remember that now
[03:13] <elkbuntu> this is proof of how obscure my brain works
[03:15] <elkbuntu> LjL, i was thinking of what you found
[03:15] <elkbuntu> actually no, it's a different one
[03:16] <elkbuntu> the pandemonium person above also had connection issues on aug 6
[03:17] <ardchoille> How fasat are the logs updated?
[03:17] <elkbuntu> ardchoille, the logs? you mean the ones i log locally? realtime
[03:17] <elkbuntu> ubuntulog, every 20 mins or so
[03:17] <ardchoille> No, the http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ logs
[03:17] <elkbuntu> see latter
[03:18] <elkbuntu> well that's what fabbione used to run them at, i dont know what the sysadmins run them at now
[03:19] <elkbuntu> also, if you ever notice them missing, let one of us know so we can poke the sysadmins
[03:24] <ardchoille> Well, I found the place in the logs where I banned him, but it doesn't show in the logs
[03:28] <stdin> ardchoille: well, if you want a log http://stdin.pastebin.com/d66fa01cc is from the bantracker
[03:28] <ardchoille> stdin: Ah, thakn you much
[03:29] <ardchoille> Last three lines of that log
[03:30] <stdin> yep, the bantracker logs 200 lines from the event (the /kick in this case)
[03:30] <ardchoille> Wow, nice tracker :)
[03:31] <stdin> it comes in handy from time to time :)
[03:31] <nalioth> stdin: i have a question
[03:31] <stdin> nalioth: yes?
[03:32] <nalioth> why isn't there a dedicated KDE web browser?
[03:32] <stdin> you mean konqueror?
[03:32] <nalioth> it's not dedicated
[03:32] <stdin> it is more so in kde4
[03:32] <nalioth> it doesn't have web history, or web-centric stuff
[03:34] <nalioth> know of any QT/kde based web browser (besides konq)?
[03:35] <stdin> konqueror generally a jack of all trades, the only other Qt bases browser I know off the top of my head is opera
[03:35] <nalioth> opera is closed source
[03:35] <nalioth> and it's not kde-centric
[03:35] <stdin> the kde4 konqueror is more web-centric
[03:36] <stdin> and it does have a history
[03:36] <nalioth> so i have to wait?
[03:37] <stdin> that's part of the reason to make dolphin the file manager and konqueror a (real) web browser in kde4
[03:37] <stdin> konqueror didn't really have a purpose as such
[03:37] <nalioth> i prefer konqueror as file mangler
[03:37] <nalioth> unless dolphin has made great leaps
[03:38] <stdin> if you're comparing it to the kde3 version then don't :p they are extremely different
[03:38] <stdin> dolphin is actually useful in kde4 :)
[03:39] <stdin> and not as clunky
[03:39] <ardchoille> That's very good to hear
[03:39] <ardchoille> Because I was severely disappointed with dolphin in gutsy
[03:40]  * nalioth has kde4 on his test machine, but is currently unable to change over to it . . . .
[03:41] <stdin> you can start dolphin from your kde3 session too, just run "dolphin-kde4"  it will work from the kmenu as soon as it gets backported
[03:41] <stdin> (or I may just upload it to the -kde4 ppa myself)
[03:41] <nalioth> so it runs now, but won't run from the kmenu until it gets backported?
[03:42] <stdin> well the .desktop files were a bit broken because the Exec= line was wrong
[03:42] <nalioth> could not open dolphin-kde4
[03:43] <stdin> you have it installed?
[03:43] <nalioth> stdin: you packaged it
[03:43] <stdin> yeah, but I don't know if you installed it
[03:44] <nalioth> i installed everything that had "kde4" in it
[03:44] <stdin> wow :p
[03:44] <stdin> what version of dolphin-kde4 do you have? (should be4:3.97.0-1ubuntu3~gutsy1~ppa1)
[03:45] <nalioth> your update mechanism isn't working right, i don't think
[03:46] <stdin> why?
[03:47] <nalioth>  i've got 4:3.96.0-1ubuntu1~ppa1
[03:47] <stdin> ahh, you haven't got the new PPA ;)
[03:47] <stdin> deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/kubuntu-members-kde4/ubuntu/ gutsy main
[03:47] <nalioth> the PPA doesn't update it's release.gz?
[03:48] <stdin> we moved it to another ppa so more than one person could upload (other than me)
[03:48] <nalioth> nice of you to tell us  :|
[03:49] <stdin> it's on the announcement page...
[03:49] <stdin> http://kubuntu.org/announcements/kde4-rc2.php
[03:50] <nalioth> i don't surf the web much
[03:50] <stdin> it's in the #kubuntu topic too, and on !kde4 :)
[03:50] <nalioth> i don't talk to bots, either  :(
[03:51] <tonyyarusso> I'd sure hope you read topics though
[03:51] <nalioth> nope
[03:51] <stdin> the only reason we used my PPA in the first place was because it was already built there and would take ages to backport or build in the kubuntu-members ppa
[03:52] <nalioth> stdin: would you like access to a powerpc box?
[03:52] <stdin> to do what?
[03:52] <nalioth> to do what, indeed.
[03:53] <stdin> I've never used anything powerpc, never had a mac
[03:53] <nalioth> but lots of ubuntu users _DO_ have powerpc hardware, and might like to try out kde4
[03:55] <stdin> right now the only way to build powerpc packages is with the ubuntu build system, PPA run on xen so can only build i386/amd64/lpia
[03:55] <nalioth> are you kidding me?
[03:55] <nalioth> i used to build powerpc packages
[03:56] <stdin> well, that's what the launchpad admins tell me
[03:56] <nalioth> you can build packages anywhere
[03:57] <stdin> can you install the powerpc debs from apt in a chroot on a i386 box?
[03:58] <nalioth> stdin: a chroot only works for simliar arch packages
[03:58] <stdin> that's what all the packages are built in though, chroots with only build-essential installed
[03:59] <nalioth> stdin: get the PM?
[03:59] <stdin> yeah just noticed it, I had sound muted
[04:09] <ubotu> yama called the ops in #ubuntu-au ()
[04:09] <ubotu> praetorian called the ops in #ubuntu-au ()
[04:46] <ubotu> yama called the ops in #ubuntu-au ()
[04:46] <elkbuntu> it's just testing, somerville32 you dont need to be there
[04:48] <ubotu> yama called the ops in #ubuntu-au ()
[04:48] <elkbuntu> ignore again
[05:06] <Tm_T> hm
[05:59] <ubotu> In ubotu, Jordan_U said: windows is For discussion and help with Microsoft Windows, please visit ##windows. See http://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/1 http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm and !equivalents
[06:18] <ubotu> nickrud called the ops in #ubuntu ()
[06:20] <Tm_T> Jordan_U: ?
[06:20] <Tm_T> !windows
[06:20] <ubotu> For discussion and help with Microsoft Windows, please visit ##windows or your nearest mental health institute. See http://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/1 http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm and !equivalents
[06:21] <Jordan_U> Tm_T, I don't think the immature windows bashing is needed
[06:21] <Tm_T> Jordan_U: agreed there, it's joke, but not nice one
[06:21] <Tm_T> !nixternal
[06:21] <ubotu> Oh no!  The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived!  He's rumoured to be giving out free money, too!
[06:22] <Tm_T> nixternal: what'dya say?
[06:22] <nixternal> huh?
[06:22] <Jordan_U> nixternal, I'll take some free money
[06:22] <nixternal> so will I
[06:22] <Tm_T> nixternal: about !windows factoid, should do we remove the health institute bit?
[06:22] <Jordan_U> nixternal, Nice, I hear nixternal is giving some away
[06:23] <Jordan_U> ;)
[06:24] <Tm_T> ubotu: no windows is <reply> For discussion and help with Microsoft Windows, please visit ##windows. See http://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/1 http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm and !equivalents
[06:24] <ubotu> In #ubuntu-ops, Tm_T said: ubotu: no windows is <reply> For discussion and help with Microsoft Windows, please visit ##windows. See http://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/1 http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm and !equivalents
[06:24] <Tm_T> hmmmmh
[06:24] <Tm_T> ubotu: no windows is <reply> For discussion and help with Microsoft Windows, please visit ##windows. See http://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/1 http://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm and !equivalents
[06:24] <ubotu> I'll remember that Tm_T
[06:24] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 1 in ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,Confirmed]
[06:24] <Tm_T> thanks
[06:24] <Tm_T> Jordan_U: happy with?
[06:25] <Jordan_U> Tm_T, Yes, thank you
[06:25] <nixternal> as long as the !windows doesn't have something controversial or disrespectful, then it is fine
[06:25] <Tm_T> nixternal: isn't "or your nearest mental health institute" disrespectful then? ;)
[06:26] <nixternal> yup
[06:27] <nixternal> plus, the person who created it, probably has a windows machine on his/her desk
[06:27] <Hobbsee> that's offensive towards the mental health institutes.  i'm sure they want regular visitors too, to help out.
[06:27] <nixternal> haha
[06:27] <ardchoille> hahaha
[06:27] <elkbuntu> many of us think the wording of bug #1 itself to be disrespectful in itself, since it should be 'proprietary software' rather than 'microsoft'
[06:27] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 1 in ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1
[06:29] <nixternal> bug #1 is flat out stupid anyways...after they tested that LP worked with it, they should have removed it or changed it
[06:29] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 1 in ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1
[06:29] <nixternal> shut up ubotu
[06:29] <elkbuntu> nixternal, having it there as like a mission statement/goal is fine, but being so shallow as to target one single company is ridiculou
[06:30] <nixternal> very true
[06:30] <elkbuntu> not to mention in itself non-CoC compliant ;)
[06:57] <Tm_T> yu
[07:00] <Tm_T> okie, see you next year or so ->
[07:23] <Myrtti> am I not getting it, but do peeople really need medibuntu still?
[07:32] <ardchoille> Myrtti: I need libdvdcss2. I realise I can get that in other ways, but I feel Medibuntu is important.
[07:32] <ardchoille> I mean, who knows what new and exciting things it may hold in the future.
[07:33]  * Hobbsee has only found that she needs libdvdcss2 from it.
[07:34] <ardchoille> I used the Seveas repo in Edgy and I think it's good to have a repo for things that can't be put into the official repos.
[07:34] <ardchoille> Just my opinion, tho
[09:51] <tritium> I'm having the *toughest* time setting up xchat on my laptop to use the irssi-proxy on my server.
[09:52] <tritium> I'm getting "channel 2: open failed: connect failed: Connection refused" when trying to setup the ssh tunnel.
[13:27] <ubotu> erUSUL called the ops in #ubuntu (indiangal)
[13:42] <Myrtti> yet another day, yet amother apartment I'd love
[13:44] <jussi01> Myrtti: oh.. so you missed out on the last one?
[15:15] <kbrooks> can you please add a factoid to ubuntu that warns on dangerous commands?
[15:16] <nalioth> kbrooks: do it.  say "uboto foo is bar"
[15:17] <jpatrick> !rm | kbrooks
[15:17] <ubotu> kbrooks: The linux terminal or command-line interface is very powerful. Open a terminal via Applications -> Accessories -> Terminal (Gnome) or K-menu -> System -> Konsole (KDE).  Guide: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UsingTheTerminal
[15:17] <jpatrick> oh, I thought that one had a warning..
[15:19] <ubotu> In ubotu, kbrooks said: dcommands is <reply>Please do not mention, even as a joke, dangerous commands that remove user's files or the operating system.
[16:31] <PriceChild> Gah this is like dialup
[16:32] <PriceChild> gah now i'm loading a link hobbsee left me (.com.au) and its like dialup through my mobile :P
[16:37] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> Hello
[16:37] <jrib> hi
[16:37] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> Are you gusy responsible for #ubuntu-de, too?
[16:37] <Myrtti> hullo
[16:39] <PriceChild> Dr_vOn_pSiE, What do you need?
[16:43] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> Well, fist sorry for my bad english, but thats not the point. I guess I was kicked from the channel #ubuntu-de by fr00d without a reason. I pasted, yes I am guilty, but I did as it is regulated in the TOPIC of that channel, which says, that you are supposed to used paste-service if you are pasting more than 3 lines. Well I pasted 3 and added a 4th one with my own words and got kicked immediadly, without being warned before.
[16:44] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> I just want to tell you guys this as I thing that this is not fair
[16:45] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> And then this guy told me that that the TOPIC aren't rules, just guidelines.
[16:45] <PriceChild> so you appeared to be pasting a large text.... and were removed?
[16:45] <PriceChild> How was he to know that there wasn't another 50 lines coming?
[16:46] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> no, i pasted like 10 words in total
[16:46] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> and he knew
[16:46] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> but alright i see. I just did what the guideline said
[16:47] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> noting more, nothing less
[16:47] <PriceChild> Have you tried to talk to him in pm about it?
[16:47] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> well he thinks that he is right
[16:47] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> i am not his opinion
[16:47] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> but he helped me in pm though
[16:48] <somerville32> Dr_vOn_pSiE, Are you banned?
[16:48] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> I don't know
[16:49] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> no
[16:49] <PriceChild> What do you mean "and he knew"?
[16:50] <somerville32> Dr_vOn_pSiE, So, what are you looking to resolve? :)
[16:50] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> i just want to tell you guys that if you have a guidline and someone follows it you can't kick him
[16:51] <Myrtti> yes?
[16:51] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> and with he knew i meant that he was supposed to konw what is going to be my paste, as he asked me the use the command compiz --replace
[16:51] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> and tell him the output
[16:52] <somerville32> Dr_vOn_pSiE, Okay.
[16:52] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> well
[16:52] <somerville32> Dr_vOn_pSiE, You might want to speak with the channel contact for #ubuntu-de as he or she is responsible for that channel.
[16:53] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> lol
[16:53]  * PriceChild sighs
[16:53] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> i asked you guys in the beginning
[16:53] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> so who is the cannel contace for #ubuntu-de
[16:54] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> contact i mean
[16:54] <somerville32> Dr_vOn_pSiE, /msg chanserv info #ubuntu-de
[16:54] <PriceChild> I really really don't think this is needed...
[16:54] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> ok thx
[16:54] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> well look
[16:56]  * somerville32 agrees with PriceChild.
[16:56] <PriceChild> It really hasn't seemed like it.
[16:56] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> it is that we all just want to have fun with our ubuntu and for me as a newcommer this is very diappointing if i am trying to get some help in the official irc channel
[16:56] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> and being handled like this
[16:57] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> i am trying my best to switch from win to linux but is not easy
[16:58] <mc44> Dr_vOn_pSiE: people are kicked when pasting because it's the easiest way to stop the pasting continuing and the channel being flooded. Sometimes people make mistakes
[16:58] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> but anyway thanks for the conversation
[16:58] <PriceChild> please don't /quit....
[16:58] <PriceChild> To be honest, I'm not totally up to speed with what you're complaining about? You agree you pasted 4 lines (could have been more coming) and were removed?
[16:58] <PriceChild> "pasted"
[16:59] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> well he asked me to use the command compiz --replace and tell him the output
[16:59] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> i guess he must know what the output will be
[17:00] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> i pasted 3 lines
[17:00] <somerville32> Dr_vOn_pSiE, Please use pastebin in the future and you won't have this problem. M'Kay? :)
[17:00] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> and wrote one by myself
[17:00] <PriceChild> how should he know? He's not the one watching and copying the terminal output
[17:00] <PriceChild> there could have been a lot more errors
[17:01] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> Well, sorry guys I did as the topic says
[17:01] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> pasting 3 lines is ok
[17:01] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> And he referred to the TOPIC after he kicked me
[17:01] <nalioth> Dr_vOn_pSiE: nobody has said that it wasn't ok
[17:02] <kbrooks> PriceChild, can i comment?
[17:02] <somerville32> Dr_vOn_pSiE, He must have thought you were going to paste more. It was a simple misunderstanding. :)
[17:02] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> yes
[17:02] <nalioth> Dr_vOn_pSiE: but if you speak quickly after your 3d pasted line, how do we know if a large paste is coming?
[17:02] <Jack_Sparrow> Morning, just got up..   are fallen and flyback talking about pirated serials or am I just seeing the end of the conversation
[17:02] <PriceChild> Jack_Sparrow, vmware
[17:03] <Jack_Sparrow> k
[17:03] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> well he kicked me like 10 seconds after that and in my 4th line was telling him sorry for paste, but this is the fastest way
[17:04] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> I could even tell him thanks to what he added when i was pasting
[17:04] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> then he kicked me
[17:04] <kbrooks> Dr_vOn_pSiE, i suggest you talk to the channel contact
[17:04] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> he must have been to busy kicking me, so he couldn't see that i am writing more
[17:05] <somerville32> Dr_vOn_pSiE, I'm sorry you are upset by being kicked but let me reassure you it isn't a big deal. :)
[17:06] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> Well, thanks for the comversation.
[17:06] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> I know
[17:06] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> I don't know how to say this right
[17:07] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> but i guess he thinks that he is someting better than "normal users" are
[17:07] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> anyway i konw that it isn't a too big deal
[17:07] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> i guess i will talk to him about that and hope to get a appology..
[17:08] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> CYA guys, and have fun.
[17:08] <somerville32> Dr_vOn_pSiE, I hope you feel comfortable to be able to rejoin #ubuntu-de and get your Ubuntu questions answered. :)
[17:09] <Dr_vOn_pSiE> yep
[17:58] <ubotu> Jack_Sparrow called the ops in #ubuntu (slipttees)
[17:58] <jpatrick> well do all you #ubuntu guys get all the fun..
[17:58] <nixternal> slipttees had a warning, no reason to quiet or kick I don'tt hink
[17:58] <nixternal> he apologized for the slip up
[17:59] <Myrtti> erm, yes
[18:00] <Jack_Sparrow> thanks.. just thought that was going to turn bad fast
[18:00] <LjL> i didn't mean to ban
[18:01] <ikonia> LjL: thanks for explaining
[18:01] <nixternal> bah, I am talking to him in PM, he is off to another OS already :(
[18:01] <nixternal> we need to slow down a bit when some one slips with a cuss word
[18:02] <Jack_Sparrow> he didnt apologize until AFTER the ops call
[18:02] <nixternal> ya he did
[18:02] <somerville32> He swore in excitement. I don't quite see how that required an ops call at all.
[18:03] <nixternal> somerville32: +100000000
[18:03] <Jack_Sparrow> Family friendly...
[18:03] <nixternal> 11:58:12 [ slipttees] ikonia, ops sorry :(
[18:03] <LjL> ok no need to make a huge fuss of this
[18:03] <nixternal> 29 seconds after he slipped up
[18:03]  * somerville32 levels up.
[18:03] <nixternal> not making a huge fuss, we just don't need to be so jumpy
[18:03] <LjL> Jack_Sparrow, just if something looks like *going* to turn out bad, but hasn't yet, ping here rather than !opsing
[18:04] <Tm_T> hm
[18:04]  * Mez did a remove and was planning on contacting... hence hwy I remoevd the ban.. Isaw the ops call, saw the swearing ... did a remove
[18:04] <somerville32> What happened to giving warnings for small offences like that? :S
[18:04] <Jack_Sparrow> LjL: I was already offended when I called...   but will be a bit more tolerant
[18:06] <nixternal> how could anyone be offended by fuckinhell? I know everyone here doesn't have virgin ears, plus you can see he was excited that someone helped him :)
[18:07] <jpatrick> nixternal: +1
[18:08] <Jack_Sparrow> what the fuckinghell is your problem...
[18:08] <nixternal> does anyone happen to read the planet btw? it is far more public than our IRC channels, and you see all kinds of cuss words...so I have a problem with taking action other than a warning when it comes to cussing..makes us look all hypocrtical and shit..ya I swore, big deal :p
[18:08] <Jack_Sparrow> sorry
[18:32] <ubotu> astro76 called the ops in #ubuntu (darkone_)
[18:33] <nalioth> klined
[18:33] <nalioth> wow, cloning, too
[18:34] <LjL> cloning?
[18:34] <ikonia> the darkeone guy has been a pain
[18:34] <nalioth> when a kline hits, i see all the users who were on that IP
[18:34] <nalioth> that IP had clones
[18:35] <LjL> ah, right, i /whois'd, i didn't /who
[18:35] <LjL> well i /who'd but only after you'd already klined
[18:35] <crdlb> do you see a problem with the nick 'cumknot' ? (maybe it's just me :) )
[18:36] <nalioth> crdlb: is that person trolling?
[18:36] <LjL> as long as it isn't pigcum again, i'm willing to let it pass
[18:36] <crdlb> no
[18:49] <ubotu> In ubotu, Jord said: tcprelay is a port forwarder
[18:49] <LjL> !info tcprelay > jord
[18:49] <LjL> uhm, except it's not a package i guess
[18:50]  * somerville32 nods.
[18:51] <ubotu> In ubotu, Jord said: tcpxd is TCP/IP relay or proxy, allowing a connection to a port on a system to be forwarded to another port on any other system. It is useful for firewalls and service relocations, and is small, simple, and fast. http://quozl.us.netrek.org/tcpxd/
[18:51] <LjL> that's better
[18:51] <Jord> :)
[18:52] <LjL> Jord, that's nice, but isn't there something in the repositories to achieve the same?
[18:52] <LjL> when something is available from the repositories, we'd much rather have a factoid on that, than on something that isn't
[18:52] <Jord> i wish i could find something
[18:52] <Jord> i need a program that does the same as tcpxd except i need to be able to bind it to a port
[18:52] <Jord> to an interface*
[18:53] <Jord> according to the changelog, tcpxd can do it
[18:53] <LjL> Jord, iptables does it fine... you just need to know how to use it
[18:53] <Jord> but i cant find documentation about that
[18:53] <LjL> Jord, this is not a support channel, but please ask in #ubuntu what exactly you need to do, i'll try to see if i can help you
[18:53] <Jord> yeah, it probably can, but i was hoping for something simpler
[18:53] <Jord> :)
[18:54] <Jord> yeah, soz, its ok
[18:54] <LjL> Jord, it's really quite simply, it's most probably one command line
[18:54] <Jord> bye :)
[18:54] <LjL> Jord, i'm not kidding though, do ask. i'm not an iptables guru, but i do have some port forwarding running on my server
[18:55] <Jord> ok
[19:08] <LjL> Jord, see my message in #ubuntu, and also
[19:08] <LjL> !iptables
[19:08] <ubotu> Ubuntu, like any other linux distribution, has firewall capabilities built-in. The firewall is managed using the 'iptables' command (see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/IptablesHowTo), or GUI applications such as Firestarter (Gnome) or Guarddog (KDE).
[19:41] <ubotu> Minataku called the ops in #kubuntu-offtopic ()
[20:24] <tritium> Are any of you running irssi-proxy successfully?
[20:24] <LjL> mc44
[20:24] <LjL> well, "successfully"
[20:25] <mc44> tritium: yup
[20:25] <tritium> mc44: mind if I pick your brain a bit?
[20:25] <mc44> they're not doing anything else :)
[20:25] <LjL> if you have an electronic microscope
[20:25] <mc44> ^ funny
[20:26] <LjL> i don't even deserve a unicode arrow?
[20:26] <tritium> heh
[20:26] <mc44> LjL: if only I could do those without copying and pasting
[20:26] <LjL> mc44: uhm, you can
[20:26] <tritium> mc44: do you setup an ssh tunnel to the machine running the proxy?
[20:26] <mc44> tritium: whats the problem?
[20:26] <mc44> tritium: yep
[20:27] <tritium> mc44: Well, can't connect a client.  I'm not even sure the proxy is running properly.
[20:27] <LjL> an ssh tunnel... to an untrusted machine? how sound.
[20:27] <tritium> What's untrusted about it?
[20:27] <mc44> LjL: ... er..
[20:27] <LjL> tritium: well, mc44's is untrusted
[20:28] <tritium> mc44: when I try to connect my client, this is what I get:
[20:28] <tritium>  channel 2: open failed: connect failed: Connection refused
[20:28] <mc44> tritium: how are you trying to connecT?
[20:28] <tritium> That error is in the console where I started the tunnel, not in the irc client
[20:28] <mc44> wait, you're not trying to ssh straight to the proxy are you? :)
[20:29] <tritium> mc44: no
[20:29] <tritium> mc44: I do two things:
[20:29] <tritium> ssh -NfL 6667:localhost:6667 htpc
[20:29] <tritium> (proxy is running on htpc on port 6667)
[20:29] <mc44> yep
[20:29] <tritium> Then, in irc client: /server localhost 6667 <password>
[20:30] <tritium> In the irc client, connection is established and then immediately lost
[20:30] <tritium> mc44: can you telnet to the port your proxy is running on?  (I cannot)
[20:31] <LjL> uhm, both ports 6667? for some reason that doesn't sound right to me
[20:31] <tritium> LjL: I've tried many different port combinations
[20:31] <tritium> Doesn't work in any case.
[20:32] <mc44> tritium: yep telnet works directly
[20:32] <mc44> well it says, Connect to blah
[20:32] <tritium> mc44: hrm, so I think the proxy isn't running right.
[20:32] <LjL> uhm ok. i still don't quite understand why you need SSH anyway... after all the connection is all in plaintext from the proxy to the IRC server
[20:32] <somerville32> Just FYI:
[20:32] <somerville32> [16:17] <PhobiaBB> thanks you fucking faggots
[20:32] <somerville32> [16:18] * PhobiaBB has quit ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox <IP_ADDRESS>/2007120410]")
[20:32] <PriceChild> And then he left
[20:33] <LjL> where?
[20:33] <PriceChild> x
[20:33] <LjL> ah
[20:33] <tritium> mc44: thanks for checking that out.  I wonder why my proxy isn't running properly.
[20:33] <LjL> ban, so it'll show in the bantracker
[20:33] <tritium> Do I need to edit /etc/inetd.conf, or something?
[20:33] <mc44> tritium: the module is loaded? :)
[20:33] <tritium> mc44: yes, with port and password set
[20:34] <mc44> tritium: you have the port set like: freenode=6667
[20:34] <tritium> LjL: yeah, I'd connect directly too, if I could.
[20:34] <tritium> mc44: yes
[20:34] <mc44> tritium: then I'm out of obvious suggestions :)
[20:34] <somerville32> LjL, ban his nick?
[20:34] <LjL> somerville32: nick will do
[20:35] <tritium> mc44: what does your /set proxy show you?  (Don't give me your password, of course)
[20:35] <LjL> no, *do* give me your password
[20:35] <tritium> heh
[20:36] <somerville32> PriceChild, How did you get his IP?
[20:36] <LjL> somerville32: /whowas phobiabb
[20:36] <PriceChild> chanserv.py does a whowas...
[20:36] <PriceChild> and it also shows up in the quit message
[20:37] <somerville32> oh cool
[20:37] <LjL> uhm why can't you use irssi-proxy without SSH? from the descriptions i see on the web, it simply provides an IRC server on a port. shouldn't need SSH
[20:40] <mc44> LjL: if you don't want an open port on your server, for example
[20:40] <tritium> aye
[20:40] <LjL> mc44: uh... it's open anyway if you SSH to it, isn't it?
[20:40] <mc44> I'd trust SSH over irssi in terms of security
[20:42] <jdong> LjL: well with ssh you'd bind irssi-proxy to localhost
[20:42] <tritium> What a pain...
[20:42] <jdong> LjL: which is different than binding it to a public interface, then transmitting the password to it in cleartext...
[20:43] <LjL> jdong: use the same password as the nickserv one... it's already in plaintext :)
[20:44] <jdong> LjL: point :)
[20:44] <jdong> LjL: not like IRC is a secure medium at any rate :)
[20:45] <Mez> jdong? really?
[20:45]  * Mez shouts into collar "ABORT!! ABORT!!"
[20:45] <LjL> jdong: which i why i don't very much seeing the point of using SSH for a proxy to begin with
[20:46] <tritium> yay, got it working
[20:46] <tritium> Thanks, mc44
[20:46] <jdong> LjL: right, I get your point, but I trust the network that my main session is on a lot more than $random_wifi_hotspot
[20:47] <mc44> tritium: no problem
[20:48] <LjL> jdong: well... yeah, i suppose
[20:48] <jdong> LjL: I'm also not confident enough about the security of irssi-proxy to allow it to offer a publically accessible port... I'd rather have a layer of ssh around it to even talk to the daemon
[20:50] <LjL> jdong: well, if it were me, i'd be running it chrooted anyway
[20:50] <jdong> LjL: apparmored :)
[20:50] <LjL> i'm still in search of a hassle-free packaged irc proxy without weird quirks myself
[20:50] <LjL> jdong: doubt it
[20:50] <jdong> 15:50 -!-   My connected client only sees 8 of the channels I'm in.
[20:54] <tritium> mc44: is there some limit I need to increase?
[20:54] <LjL> mc44: look, a quirk!
[20:54] <tritium> hah!
[20:54] <mc44> tritium: not that I've come across, but I'm not in 8 channels :)
[20:55] <mc44> LjL: I like quirky
[20:55] <LjL> mc44: but i wasn't talking about you, i was talking about me
[20:55] <LjL> as a rule, it's generally all about me
[20:55] <mc44> see, theres your problem :P
[20:55] <tritium> mc44: sheesh, only 2 channels?
[20:55] <mc44> tritium: only two which you're in ;)
[20:55] <LjL> !modes
[20:55] <ubotu> There are many different channel and user modes on Freenode (see !freenode). Here's a list: http://freenode.net/using_the_network.shtml
[20:56] <LjL> that factoid by the way is...
[20:56] <tritium> mc44: ah ;)
[20:56] <LjL> !no modes is <reply> There are many different channel and user modes on !freenode. Here's a list: http://freenode.net/using_the_network.shtml
[20:56] <ubotu> I'll remember that LjL
[21:02] <Mez> any staff awake?
[21:04] <nalioth> Mez: you can't be arsed to look at 2 minutes of scrollback?
[21:05] <Mez> nalioth, 2 mins of scrollback? I talked at least 5 mins after the last channel msg ;)
[21:05] <Mez> see /msg anyways
[21:05] <nalioth> what /msg ?
[21:06] <nalioth> and in #freenode i just spoke right before you asked
[21:06] <Mez> nalioth, yeah yeah... I didnt notice in tehre and my /msg went astray
[21:24] <PriceChild> Gouki (/GoukiPT) is incoming
[21:24] <PriceChild> Remember UbuntuStats? He's reviving it again and should be back for good.
[21:24] <LjL> PriceChild, gouki is in this channel already
[21:24] <PriceChild> wow so he is
[21:25] <somerville32> lol
[21:25] <somerville32> I love UbuntuStats :)
[21:27] <PriceChild> but anyway... so yes... checking channel list, and i suggested possibility of an ubuntu cloak perhaps
 rings a bell in #ubuntu
[21:43] <PriceChild> What specs of hardware is ubotu currently on?
[21:44] <LjL> OperationalError rings a bell in bantracker
[21:46] <LjL> PriceChild, i suspect there is one person who knows
[22:30] <PriceChild> ccvp also rings a bell
[22:30] <LjL> yes PriceChild, old aquaintance, as you've probably guessed from the way i banned
[22:31] <PriceChild> :P
[22:31] <LjL> i probably removed the knology ban unadvertedly yesterday when i cleaned some bans up
[22:47] <gouki> Hi everyone!
[22:48] <gouki> As PriceChild mentioned before, UbuntuStats is coming back for good. I bought a cheap plan at VPSLink.com, which gives me root access and a good connection, so I should not have the problems that made me quit the first time.
[22:49] <gouki> I have the list of channels I plan on gathering logs, can someone take a look at it?
[22:50] <PriceChild> pastebin please ;)
[22:55] <gouki> http://goukivps.net/list.txt
[22:56] <PriceChild> I'm wondering if we should ask -women about it?
[22:56] <LjL> gouki: please, remove #ubuntu-ops from there. also, i suppose you really should ask the contacts of the various channels, as well
[22:56] <PriceChild> They are very against logging etc.
[22:57] <gouki> Yeah, right. -women doesn't want it.
[22:58] <gouki> As for the other ones, I remember having them on the old times
[22:58] <gouki> I'll update the list and remove -ops and -women
[22:59] <gouki> Pizza is here. Please, give me suggestions.
[23:00] <LjL> gouki, you've covered the main channels i think. dunno what else - perhaps some other loco channels wouldn't mind.
[23:01] <jpatrick> gouki: you can get #kubuntu-es
[23:02] <jpatrick> gouki: and I'll speak to the #ubuntu-es guys about it later for you