[16:57] <Dron3> New record: 10 users in the channel!
[18:25] <hggdh> record in low presence, you mean?


[16:47] <Drazisil> Looking at my stracktrace, looks like it couldn't find symbols for anything. What do I need to do in that case, download the -dev versions?
[16:49] <charlie-tca> Drazisil: You can install the debugging symbols by following this - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash
[16:49] <Drazisil> charlie-tca: Thank you.
[16:49] <charlie-tca> You are welcome
[17:17] <Drazisil> What happens if an application silent crashes with no error and doesn't launch apport. Is there another way for me to find the logs?
[17:23] <charlie-tca> You can look in /var/log for the crash. try /var/log/syslog or /var/log/dmesg


[13:37] <RikMills> feature freeze is tomorrow. shout if there is anything really needed to be in. my mum has been unwell, so I am not 100% on top of that
[15:53] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[19:27] <valorie> sorry to hear about your mum, RikMills
[19:28] <valorie> my best to her and you
[19:29] <Mekaneck> best wishes to you and your mom RikMills, hope she feels better soon.
[20:50] <tsimonq2> I can't see the context, but I do wish you and your mom the best, RikMills.
[21:24] <Mekaneck> tsimonq2: in cas you missed it: <RikMills> feature freeze is tomorrow. shout if there is anything really needed to be in. my mum has been unwell, so I am not 100% on top of that
[21:26] <tsimonq2> Thanks.
[21:27] <Mekaneck> np :)
[23:55] <valorie> tsimonq2: ltns, how are ya?
[23:57] <valorie> whoopsie, dinner time here


[05:11] <unstable> I use an external monitor with my laptop periodically. Often when this happens a window willi 'disappear'. Right now I can't find sublime. If I hit alt + tab, I can see the sublime icon.. when I select it, nothing shows up.
[05:11] <unstable> Is this a bug? Is there a way to force an app to show in unity?
[05:11] <unstable> I know if I kill sublime and then open it, it will work. Though that seems silly
[05:11] <unstable> I don't have additional work spaces enabled afaict
[05:12] <unstable> I have basically all the defaults for unity
[08:06] <Saviq> tsdgeos, o/
[08:08] <Saviq> \o
[08:14] <tsdgeos> Saviq: o/
[08:14] <tsdgeos> Saviq: how did the snow thing went?
[08:14] <Saviq> tsdgeos, pretty good, thanks :)
[08:14] <Saviq> tsdgeos, all extremities present and working
[08:14] <tsdgeos> good stuff
[08:15] <Saviq> tsdgeos, let me know when you can hangout/mumble to catch up
[08:15] <tsdgeos> deleting emails
[08:15] <tsdgeos> giive me 5 mins
[08:16] <Saviq> lol
[08:16] <tsdgeos> i mean reading ^_^
[08:33] <tsdgeos> Saviq: ready, what you want to do?
[08:34] <Saviq> tsdgeos, let's hang out, gimme a sec
[08:37] <Saviq> tsdgeos, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7ecpjurc16fos5ado5tbg00pis?
[08:48] <Cimi> welcome back Saviq
[08:48] <Saviq> Cimi, hey
[09:10] <tsdgeos> mhr3: Saviq: what's your opinion on https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1280477 ? I thought we were supposed to have previews of everything
[09:11] <mhr3> tsdgeos, indeed, scope not returning previews are incomplete scopes
[09:12] <Saviq> mhr3, will you comment on the bug please?
[09:12] <Saviq> mhr3, o/ btw
[09:12] <mhr3> in the process
[09:12] <mhr3> Saviq, wb!
[09:19] <karni> Saviq: welcome back :)
[09:19] <Saviq> karni, o/
[09:53] <Cimi> Saviq, hey
[09:53] <Cimi> Saviq, to follow up on the carousel thing
[09:53] <Cimi> Saviq, I noticed the minimum number to show it was decreased on the new scopes branch
[09:53] <Cimi> Saviq, however this breaks because of the width thing
[09:54] <Saviq> Cimi, yes, we need it to be dynamic
[09:54] <Cimi> Saviq, best would be calculating this magic minimum number before loading I think
[09:55] <Cimi> how? dunno yet, I can spend time to see if I have an idea
[09:55] <Saviq> Cimi, I just replied to the bug - CardTool is there for that
[09:55] <Cimi> Saviq, I saw
[09:55] <Cimi> Saviq, card tool will have a function to have the carousel count?
[09:56] <Saviq> Cimi, no, it just gives you the width, based on that you can calculate how many items are required
[09:56] <Saviq> Cimi, only now it's "inside" CardCarousel / CardFilterGrid etc.., but we might need to move it up
[09:56] <Saviq> Cimi, or actually make CardCarousel handle that internally (I think I'd prefer that)
[09:56] <Saviq> Cimi, instead of GenericScopeView itself
[09:57] <Cimi> ok
[09:57] <tsdgeos> mzanetti: now that https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/unity8/lvwph_resize_item_bug/+merge/206140 CI passes do you think you can do it? Or should i nag someone else to review?
[09:58] <mzanetti> tsdgeos: sure, will do
[09:58] <tsdgeos> tx
[10:00] <Saviq> mzanetti, thostr_ reported a "ghost" grey app in the right edge stack, rings a bell?
[10:00] <mzanetti> Saviq: hmm, no, haven't seen that so far
[10:00] <mzanetti> Saviq: well, yeah... it somewhat rings a bell indeed
[10:00] <Saviq> mzanetti, ok, /me runs the ppa to see
[10:01] <mzanetti> Saviq: most likely he started multiple apps very quickly without waiting for each one to start up
[10:01] <mzanetti> Saviq: that messes up with upstart/unity-mir states quite badly
[10:01] <mzanetti> Saviq: even to an extent where apps paint on the wrong surface etc
[10:01] <mzanetti> like: 5 running apps, 2 surfaces they all paint on etc
[10:02] <thostr_> mzanetti: Saviq: I just rebooted and the grey page is gone now...
[10:02] <mzanetti> thostr_: could it be that this happened ^^
[10:02] <mzanetti> ?
[10:02] <thostr_> mzanetti: yes, I started a lot of apps quickly
[10:03] <mzanetti> thostr_: yeah.. this is known and happens in trunk too
[10:03] <mhr3> Saviq, so re scope activation - we have two cases, activating a scope that's already favourited, and one that isn't yet, i could add signals for both of these cases
[10:03] <mzanetti> thostr_: its just bad that showing off the right edge makes you want to start multiple apps while you don't usually do that otherwise
[10:04] <Saviq> mhr3, so the activation would come from the scope in that case (as opposed to shell-internal)?
[10:04] <Saviq> mhr3, how would we discern between that and preview?
[10:04] <mhr3> Saviq, it's similar to the other activation types (hideDash() etc)
[10:05] <mhr3> and for preview you get previewRequested(result)
[10:05] <mhr3> which needs to be hooked up btw
[10:07] <Saviq> mhr3, yeah, what I mean is: how do we discern between single-click-to-activate vs. single-click-to-preview
[10:07] <Saviq> mhr3, right now we have click scope hardcoded to activate instead of preview
[10:07] <mhr3> we always default to single-click to preview, and exceptions are very specific and i don't think scopes should be able to request them
[10:08] <mhr3> so only click and scopes scope will have them
[10:08] <Saviq> mhr3, so hardcoded again?
[10:08] <Saviq> mhr3, ok
[10:08] <mhr3> yes
[10:08] <mhr3> otherwise it'll be a mess
[10:10] <mhr3> Saviq, so, i can add signals gotoScope(string scopeId) and openScope(Scope*)
[10:10] <Saviq> mhr3, sounds fine
[10:10] <mhr3> Saviq, plus method scopeClosed(Scope*) for the temp one?
[10:10] <mhr3> rather closeScope(Scope*)
[10:11] <mhr3> which is basically - i don't need it anymore, destroy it
[10:18] <Saviq> mhr3, why would you need to send that?
[10:18] <mhr3> Saviq, i don't, i want you to *call* it
[10:19] <Saviq> mhr3, ah
[10:20] <Saviq> mhr3, or you could not own the Scope* from openScope() and QML would destroy it?
[10:20] <Saviq> tsdgeos, so, I
[10:20] <Saviq> 've no running apps in click scope from right-edge ppa, ideas?
[10:20] <mhr3> Saviq, that's error-prone with signals, what if there's noone listening to it?
[10:21] <Saviq> mhr3, right
[10:21] <Saviq> mhr3, ok, sounds good
[10:21] <mhr3> ok, /me goes hacking
[10:22] <tsdgeos> Saviq: not really, can you try the demo-stuff ppa?
[10:22] <Saviq> tsdgeos, mhm, doing
[10:22] <mhr3> is it possible that click in right-edge is old?
[10:22] <mhr3> thostr_, ^?
[10:22] <Saviq> mhr3, there is no click scope in right-edge indeed
[10:23] <mhr3> Saviq, wget from demo-stuff then
[10:23] <Saviq> mhr3, but then -click is newer in trusty
[10:23] <mhr3> oh, nvm then
[10:24] <karni> FYI guys, I decided to take today off and get more rest after returning yesterday from States. I'll catch you in the evening/tomorrow.
[10:24] <Saviq> karni, o/
[10:24] <karni> \o
[10:30] <Cimi> what does new scopes require?
[10:30] <Cimi> the branch
[10:31] <Cimi> I merged it into unity8 and it complains for not dxisting nativeOrientationAngle
[10:33] <Saviq> Cimi, sounds like unity-mir
[10:34] <tsdgeos> need new uitk i think
[10:34] <tsdgeos> well not need
[10:34] <tsdgeos> err
[10:34] <tsdgeos> i mean
[10:34] <tsdgeos> well not new but the one from demo-stuff
[10:34] <Saviq> ah yeah, it's in MainView
[10:34] <Saviq> Cimi, ↑↑ new uitk from demo-stuff PPA
[10:34] <tsdgeos> Cimi: i just added a needs fixing comment to the Reviews review
[10:35] <Cimi> tsdgeos, not thanks
[10:35] <Cimi> hah
[10:35] <tsdgeos> sorry ^_^
[10:36] <Cimi> tsdgeos, you right
[10:36] <Cimi> doing it
[10:54] <Saviq> mzanetti, what branch is unity8 in https://launchpad.net/~unity-team/+archive/phone-right-edge/+packages built from?
[10:55] <mzanetti> Saviq: one sec
[10:55] <mzanetti> Saviq:  lp:~unity-team/unity8/merge-new-scopes-right-edge-2
[10:57] <Saviq> mzanetti, btw, still misses deps to require unity-api / unity-mir upgrade - I could upgrade unity8 alone and apt won't complain
[10:57] <mzanetti> Saviq: yep, I know... will fix
[10:58] <Saviq> mzanetti, want me to create a recipe to build that branch (it's behind for the running apps in click scope apparently)
[10:59] <mzanetti> Saviq: I think there actually is already one... but I'm not exactly sure how those work
[11:00] <Saviq> mzanetti, ah, it failed to buiold
[11:00] <mzanetti> oh.. interesting
[11:00]  * Saviq fixes
[11:00] <mzanetti> Saviq: where did you see that?
[11:00] <Saviq> mzanetti, there's a conflict in Shell.qml
[11:00] <Saviq> https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/+recipe/u8-phone-right-edge
[11:01] <mzanetti> Saviq: you merging that?
[11:01] <Saviq> mzanetti, yes
[11:01] <mzanetti> ok
[11:39] <Cimi> I have to reinstall ubuntu because of new xorg... sorry guys
[11:41] <seb128> Cimi, what about the new xorg?
[11:41] <Cimi> seb128, doesn't work with parallels
[11:41] <Saviq> mzanetti, can you file a bug for the "too many apps launched too quickly" against unity-mir (and mir?) so that we don't lose track?
[11:41] <seb128> Cimi, what is parallels?
[11:42] <Cimi> seb128, virtualization software
[11:42] <seb128> can't you use another one?
[11:42] <seb128> vmware, virtualbox, ...?
[11:42] <Saviq> (or not use it at all)
[11:42] <Cimi> seb128, it's the best I tried on os x
[11:43] <seb128> oh, you run Ubuntu in a vm on OsX?
[11:43] <Cimi> I'm going for the latter
[11:43] <Cimi> I want to buy a desktop pc to keep home
[11:43] <Cimi> and use ubuntu
[11:43] <seb128> shrug
[11:43] <seb128> well, you can't blame your OsX vm not working on Ubuntu
[11:43] <seb128> or on xorg updates
[11:44] <Cimi> seb128, I used to have ubuntu and osx, but two years ago wifi stop working on ubuntu
[11:44] <Cimi> seb128, so I removed ubuntu and started using VMs
[11:44] <Cimi> which are quite handy to be honest
[11:44] <Cimi> you can pause your work and restore where you left
[11:45] <seb128> until it stops working because the VM stuff doesn't like what is in the VM...
[11:45] <Cimi> indeed
[11:45] <Cimi> so I'm putting 13.10 and not update
[11:45] <Saviq> mzanetti, ok, so your right-edge changes are incompatible with the running apps override, can you guys please look at it?
[11:45] <Saviq> tsdgeos, ↑
[11:45] <mzanetti> yeah...
[11:45] <seb128> Cimi, that's not a solution/wrong, everybody should be running the current version
[11:46] <seb128> Cimi, start using vmware or something that works, or just install Ubuntu on a different partition
[11:46] <tsdgeos> Cimi: i don't think you can use 13.10 at this stage for all the stuff we do
[11:46] <tsdgeos> mzanetti: Saviq: ouch
[11:46] <Saviq> Cimi, indeed, you need to be on trusty
[11:47] <mzanetti> tsdgeos: does your implementation still use the ApplicationManagerWrapper?
[11:47] <Cimi> Saviq, tsdgeos I'll use the other pc then
[11:47] <Cimi> no problem
[11:47] <Cimi> it's on trusty
[11:47] <Cimi> just slower
[11:47] <tsdgeos> Cimi: or just pin x not to update
[11:47] <mzanetti> Saviq: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-mir/+bug/1281075
[11:47] <tsdgeos> mzanetti: hmm, i guess :D
[11:47] <Saviq> mzanetti, thanks
[11:48] <mzanetti> tsdgeos: yeah... so, that one has gone... And we only have one model now (not sidestage/mainstage models)
[11:48] <tsdgeos> mzanetti: fix it then :-P
[11:48] <tsdgeos> mzanetti: this is what i did https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/unity8/apps-special-category/+merge/205738
[11:49] <tsdgeos> mzanetti: you just need to change countObject and make sure RunningApplicationsGrid.qml works
[11:49] <tsdgeos> mzanetti: i can have a look if you want
[11:49] <mzanetti> tsdgeos: hmm... doesn't look that bad actually
[11:50] <mzanetti> tsdgeos: I fixed RunningApplicationsGrid already
[11:50] <Saviq> mzanetti, then it's probably just the countObject
[11:50] <mzanetti> tsdgeos: seems we just need to merge lines 50 and 51
[11:50] <mzanetti> right, and the count should be ApplicationManager.count instead of ms.count + ss.count
[11:50] <Cimi> tsdgeos, can I pin x to upgrade till a specific version?
[11:51] <Cimi> tsdgeos, I'm on 13.10
[11:51] <tsdgeos> Cimi: i don't know much about pinning tbh
[11:51] <mzanetti> Saviq: tsdgeos: the bigger question is how/where to merge it to keep track of the branches
[11:51] <Cimi> tsdgeos, not sure the archives have history
[11:51] <anpok> mzanetti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dialer-app/+bug/1240400 this one is similar
[11:51] <Saviq> mzanetti, indeed
[11:51] <tsdgeos> i know you can do it, since i pinned twinkle not to update
[11:51] <mzanetti> because we can't merge it into new-scopes yet, we can't merge it into right-edge-2 yet
[11:51] <Saviq> mzanetti, just leave it in new-scopes-right-edge
[11:52] <tsdgeos> +1
[11:52] <mzanetti> definitely ok for MWC. but: this gets nasty if both, right-edge and new-scopes still need a while to land to trunk
[11:53] <Saviq> mzanetti, "a while" for new scopes will not be huge
[11:53] <Saviq> mzanetti, like a week, maybe two past mwc
[11:53] <mzanetti> ah ok. no prob in that case
[11:53]  * mzanetti fixes the merged branch
[11:54] <Saviq> /food
[11:59] <gatox> Saviq, mhr3 hi, i was wondering if something changed in unity or anything?? the same scopes that on friday were showing previews, now they doesn't work, i already upgraded my system, unity and the scope branches, rebuild everything.... and still not showing any preview
[12:01] <Cimi> tsdgeos, why do I need trusty?
[12:01] <tsdgeos> Cimi: because we depend on lots of stuff like the toolkit, scopes, etc that i don't think have been released in 13.10
[12:05] <gatox> tsdgeos,  hi, i was wondering if something changed in unity or anything?? the same scopes that on friday were showing previews, now they doesn't work, i already upgraded my system, unity and the scope branches, rebuild everything.... and still not showing any preview
[12:05] <tsdgeos> gatox: not that i know
[12:06] <tsdgeos> gatox: but if you tell me what scope i can try having a look (if it's not too hard to setup)
[12:07] <gatox> tsdgeos, please: lp:~diegosarmentero/unity-scope-click/all-previews (sudo apt-get build-dep unity-scope-click) should install the deps
[12:08] <tsdgeos> gatox: phone, destkop or both?
[12:08] <gatox> tsdgeos, desktop
[12:08] <tsdgeos> ok
[12:08] <mhr3> gatox, hm, no nothing major changed
[12:08] <gatox> tsdgeos, should work on both, but i'm testing on desktop right now
[12:08] <tsdgeos> sure
[12:08] <mhr3> gatox, well... do you have latest uitk?
[12:08] <mhr3> gatox, but if you didn't unity wouldn't even run
[12:09] <mhr3> (including the scope-tool)
[12:09] <mhr3> gatox, any errors you get?
[12:09] <gatox> mhr3, yes, i upgraded everything this morning
[12:10] <gatox> mhr3, i get this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6948482/
[12:10] <gatox> but there was always some output about failing properties in unity
[12:11] <gatox> i'm not sure which ones are actually new
[12:11] <mhr3> gatox, you don't have latest unity-plugin-scopes
[12:11] <mhr3> it's in demo ppa
[12:11] <gatox> mhr3, i have that ppa.... and i upgraded everything this morning :S
[12:12] <mhr3> apt-cache policy
[12:12] <mhr3> gatox, ah, they were releasing unity7, that overridden the latest version
[12:12] <gatox> mhr3, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6948485/
[12:13] <mhr3> gatox, i meant `apt-cache policy unity-plugin-scopes`
[12:13] <gatox> mhr3, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6948488/
[12:14] <mhr3> gatox, yea, force the ppa version
[12:14] <mhr3> gatox, `apt-get install unity-plugin-scopes=0.3.1+14.04.20140211.1-1newscopes1~51~ubuntu14.04.1`
[12:15] <mhr3> gatox, anyway, it will fix itself once unity7 is properly released
[12:15] <mhr3> these transitions suck :/
[12:16] <gatox> mhr3, mmm trying to force the version gaves me unmet dependencies with libunity-core
[12:16] <mhr3> sigh, then you need to wait
[12:16] <gatox> mhr3, is going to take long?? just to know
[12:17] <mhr3> gatox, no, i got pinged 5minutes ago that it's almost released, just need to wait for the merge to trunk to happen and will rebuild the ppa pkg
[12:17] <mhr3> ~20minutes
[12:17] <tsdgeos> ahhhhhhhhhhh, restart scope-registry restarted by unity again
[12:18] <tsdgeos> gatox: works for me
[12:18] <tsdgeos> oh, seems you found the problem meanwhile
[12:18] <gatox> mhr3, tsdgeos ack.... thanks to both
[12:18] <mhr3> gatox, you upgrade too often :P
[12:18] <gatox> :P
[12:19] <mhr3> gatox, do you have proposed enabled btw?
[12:19] <mhr3> gatox, cause this wouldn't happen until an hour ago if you didn't
[12:19] <gatox> mhr3, yes
[12:19] <greyback> dammit, stupid internet, irc keeps falling over
[12:47] <tsdgeos> Saviq: something is defenitely off, we are creating 154 cards when expanding the click scope
[12:47] <tsdgeos> when only like 6 fit on screen
[13:08] <mhr3> Saviq, won't that be auto-fixed with the show more | show less?
[13:08] <mhr3> tsdgeos, eh ^
[13:13] <Saviq> tsdgeos, so delegate ranges wrong?
[13:13] <Saviq> mhr3, not necessarily, if the scope sends too many results, it could still happen
[13:14] <Saviq> mhr3, i.e. we're probably not going to put it through LimitProxy any more, since we can just let the *View handle it internally
[13:14] <mhr3> Saviq, show more is supposed to increase the number of results in increments, not like now limited -> unlimited
[13:14] <Saviq> mhr3, unrelated
[13:15] <mhr3> ok :)
[13:15] <Saviq> mhr3, what tsdgeos is saying is that we're creating all of them even though not all of them are on screen
[13:15] <Saviq> mhr3, which needs fixing
[13:16] <Cimi> tsdgeos, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6948704/
[13:18] <mzanetti> Saviq: hmm... as of today, unity always crashes when the screen blanks with:  what():  error during hwc set()
[13:18] <mzanetti> the merged branch that is
[13:18] <Saviq> mzanetti, mako?
[13:18] <mzanetti> yes
[13:18] <Saviq> mzanetti, didn't see that at all
[13:18] <mzanetti> ok...
[13:19] <Saviq> mzanetti, try in #ubuntu-mir
[13:31] <kgunn> mzanetti: hey, do you mean it crashes on pwr button hit or timeout ? or both ?
[13:32] <kgunn> and mir landed back on feb 12...hadn't changed since
[13:41] <mzanetti> kgunn: hmm... seems only to happen on timeout. but there are chances that something doesn't match in my device setup
[13:42] <kgunn> mzanetti: you know...one other change that didn't really come from the mir team...was that nested mir
[13:42] <kgunn> got added
[13:42] <kgunn> means using 1 mir for unity8 and then unity-system-compositor gets its own mir
[13:43] <mzanetti> ah, ok. interesting. might be related
[13:43] <kgunn> i would have thot ogra would have tested that...hmmm
[13:43] <kgunn> and it might be racy
[13:43] <mzanetti> kgunn: correction: happens when pressing the power button too
[13:43] <mzanetti> but only with the very latest merged-new-scopes-right-edge-2 aparently
[13:43] <kgunn> so its not 100%....
[13:44] <mzanetti> I'll dig deeper... maybe something with my setup here indeed
[13:44] <kgunn> mzanetti: ok, i'll let you dig a bit...kdub would be best to pull in on it
[13:45] <kgunn> oh crap...kdub likely off today
[13:46] <kgunn> US holiday...
[13:50] <mzanetti> kgunn: the build recipe for the merged branch, should that trigger on its own or do I manually run it when I push something to the branch?
[13:55] <kgunn> mzanetti: i think it autotriggers once a day (if there are changes on the base branch)...so if you want it updated, you can hit "request build" on the recipe
[13:55] <mzanetti> ok, thanks
[13:56] <Saviq> mhr3, where do we add -scopes and -mediascanner2 so that they get pulled in? should we branch libunity?
[13:57] <Saviq> kgunn, ↑
[14:00] <Saviq> greyback, cwayne reports no launcher on landscape N7, that known?
[14:00] <tsdgeos> Cimi: looks reasonable
[14:01] <Cimi> tsdgeos, go ahead review then :)
[14:01] <tsdgeos> Saviq: hmmm, printing the delegaterange looks ok, i need to dig more to find out what's the problem
[14:01] <greyback> Saviq: I'm using and there's a launcher
[14:01] <Saviq> greyback, /me installing now, let's see
[14:01] <Saviq> tsdgeos, please do, thanks
[14:02] <cwayne> Saviq, so i found that if you swipe from the very top left you can get it
[14:02] <greyback> cwayne: on what screen?
[14:04] <cwayne> greyback, any
[14:06] <greyback> cwayne: on dash, or with a main stage app open, I can open launcher no prob. I updated the n7 this morning, using the dmeo-stuff PPA. Same?
[14:06] <cwayne> greyback, when i originally reported it it was a slightly older image, let me try and reproduce today
[14:06] <cwayne> greyback, i believe it was with just a sidestage open
[14:07] <greyback> cwayne: you're right in that with a single side stage app open, the launcher is not available. bug 1281094
[14:07] <Saviq> greyback, cwayne, I can't get launcher on greeter, otherwise seems to work fine
[14:07] <greyback> cwayne: think same on greeter screen
[14:08] <Saviq> and GU is much too big on the N7, btw
[14:08] <Saviq> IMO
[14:08] <greyback> Saviq: I didn't choose it. I'm assuming somebody qualified did?
[14:09] <Saviq> greyback, wasn't directed at you
[14:09] <Saviq> greyback, good question, too
[14:10] <thostr_> Saviq: who did the music player preview control again?
[14:10] <Saviq> thostr_, Cimi
[14:11] <thostr_> Cimi: is it a bug or a feature that music player preview control doesn't show anything but a play button by default?
[14:11] <Saviq> thostr_, no title etc.? bug
[14:11] <thostr_> Cimi: once it's playing I get a least a timeline, even though no time, no title etc
[14:12] <thostr_> Saviq: right, there is nothing
[14:12] <Saviq> thostr_, or maybe it's there, but white on white?
[14:12] <thostr_> Saviq: it's looks, well, suboptimal...
[14:12] <Saviq> thostr_, definitely needs fixing
[14:12] <Cimi> Saviq, I think we're using the wrong theme
[14:12] <thostr_> Saviq: YES, ;you're right
[14:12] <thostr_> it's actually white font
[14:12] <Cimi> Saviq, we should stop using surudark
[14:13] <Cimi> Saviq, and use Ambiance
[14:13] <Saviq> Cimi, dash should, not the whole shell
[14:13] <Saviq> Cimi, but we can't, not until we extract the dash from the shell
[14:13] <Cimi> so what do we do?
[14:13] <Cimi> Saviq, the widgets are using the right colours from the palette
[14:13] <Saviq> Cimi, hardcode colors in new-scopes branch for now (+ TODO)
[14:13] <Cimi> ok
[14:14] <Cimi> Saviq, which are the shell parts incompatible with Ambiance?
[14:14] <Cimi> Saviq, indicators?
[14:14] <thostr_> Saviq: Cimi: also, what about horizontal separator as seen at https://drive.google.com/a/canonical.com/?tab=co#folders/0B-a_7E3tDxOgTTBybG1TZG9GWnM (dash_music_preview_song)
[14:14] <Saviq> Cimi, yes, and launcher
[14:15] <Saviq> https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/file/d/0B-a_7E3tDxOgUUY0MjFTQThBZFE/edit
[14:15] <Saviq> greyback, bug #1281082
[14:15] <Saviq> greyback, is dupe, right?
[14:15] <greyback> Saviq: probably
[14:15] <greyback> Saviq: dandrader looking into it now
[14:15] <Saviq> thostr_, the separators are somewhat tricky, there's no ruleset on where to put them, and where not to
[14:16] <thostr_> Saviq: sure, I just thought we could make them up for demo for now
[14:16] <thostr_> Saviq: we cannot rely on design for everything right now...
[14:16] <Saviq> thostr_, lol ;)
[14:17] <thostr_> :)
[14:17] <thostr_> so, will you get this fixed?
[14:18] <Saviq> thostr_, yeah, we'll hack something up, seems "around text and audio widgets" would be good enough approximation of what we need
[14:18] <thostr_> exactly. great. thanks!
[14:19] <Saviq> Cimi, can you have a look at ↑↑?
[14:19] <Cimi> Saviq, carousel or this?
[14:19] <Cimi> Saviq, was looking into carousel
[14:19] <Saviq> Cimi, keep on doing carousel for now, separators are simple
[14:20] <Saviq> greyback, bug #1281092 - side stage width is fine
[14:21] <Saviq> greyback, but in RunningApplicationsGrid we're assuming aspect ratio of the N10
[14:21] <greyback> Saviq: well I was a bit worried as some apps don't fit in it (e.g. sudoku - need to check if it's using GU or not)
[14:22] <Saviq> greyback, I'd say that's because of the wrong GU, the side stage is too small in height
[14:22] <Saviq> greyback, cwayne, no launcher on N10 either, so it seems to be the tablet-style greeter's fault
[14:22] <greyback> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1281122
[14:23] <Saviq> ah
[14:24] <mhr3> Saviq, i was asking if we could just seed them
[14:25] <Saviq> mhr3, they're never seeded, we can make unity8 depends on them in new-scopes
[14:25] <Saviq> mhr3, but libunity was the "right" way until now
[14:26] <mhr3> Saviq, but seeding them manually sounded like good enough solution for now
[14:27] <mhr3> but yea, we should have a meta-pkg solution like we did with libunity-scopes*
[14:28] <Saviq> mhr3, well, we only want them on new-scopes for now, and seeding them there basically means we need to branch lp:ubuntu-touch or whatever the seed is
[14:28] <Saviq> greyback, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtubuntu/+bug/1204595/comments/5
[14:29] <mhr3> Saviq, i don't see reason why we couldn't have them in the old-scopes image too
[14:29] <Saviq> mhr3, so we can have them in lp:libunity, then
[14:29] <Saviq> mhr3, although that would pull all the new unity-scopes unnecessarily for now
[14:29] <mhr3> no, libunity pkg definitions are complicated
[14:30] <Saviq> mhr3, ok, I'm adding to Recommends in new-scopes for now, then
[14:30] <mhr3> Saviq, is doing that really fixing anything?
[14:30] <Saviq> @unity: standup
[14:31] <Saviq> mhr3, yes, they actually end up in the image built from demo-stuff
[14:31] <Saviq> (would)
[14:31] <mhr3> Saviq, oh, we're indeed building an image from there?
[14:31] <Saviq> cwayne, ↑
[14:31] <mhr3> then i'm fine with it
[14:31] <Saviq> mhr3, yes
[14:36] <greyback> Saviq: replied. All good
[14:39] <cwayne> yeah, we're building a rootstock image with demo-stuff atm
[14:40] <greyback> Saviq: cwayne: regarding launcher on tablet greeter, there's explicit code to disable launcher for multi-user greeter in shell. Maybe it was intended?
[14:41] <Saviq> greyback, hum, mzanetti, thoughts ↑?
[14:42] <mzanetti> one sec. on a meeting
[14:46] <mzanetti> greyback: Saviq: cwayne: so yes. it is intended IF the greeter is locked
[14:47] <mzanetti> note there is a difference between locked and shown
[14:47] <mzanetti> locked means, it cannot be swiped away with a right-edge swipe
[14:47] <gatox> hi, does any one knows how to change the card size in the scope results?? any pointers?
[14:47] <mzanetti> because you need to supply the passwd
[14:47] <Saviq> mzanetti, right, so a bug
[14:47] <Saviq> gatox, "card-size": "small"
[14:48] <gatox> Saviq, where is that?? is it part of the scope code or unity?
[14:48] <mzanetti> Saviq: greyback: cwayne: yep. a bug. seems the greeter always reports "locked: true" lately
[14:48] <Saviq> mhr3, is there api for changing card size ↑↑?
[14:48] <gatox> Saviq, i wass told you have a new guy to specify the card size from the scope
[14:48] <gatox> Saviq, new way
[14:48] <mzanetti> :D
[14:48] <Saviq> gatox, http://people.canonical.com/~mhr3/unity-scopes-api/classunity_1_1scopes_1_1_category_renderer.html
[14:49] <gatox> Saviq, thanks
[14:51] <paulliu> Saviq: about the zoomable image. how can I write a pinch gesture in test? I've tested the code on device already. Thinking about writing a unit test.
[14:51] <Saviq> paulliu, good question
[14:52] <Saviq> tsdgeos, mzanetti, do you know how to do multi-touch qmltests?
[14:53] <mzanetti> hmm... I think the DDA tests do that. but not sure Daniel has created something to be used in qml only
[14:53] <tsdgeos> Saviq: paulliu: is this about the zoomable image preview widget?
[14:53] <paulliu> tsdgeos: yes
[14:54] <tsdgeos> paulliu: because afair we did not actually implement the zoomable bit
[14:54] <tsdgeos> Cimi: right?
[14:54] <paulliu> tsdgeos: I'm working on it.
[14:54] <tsdgeos> ah
[14:54] <paulliu> tsdgeos: I mean I've already have a branch for it. But thinking about how to write unit test.
[14:54] <Saviq> paulliu, take a look at UnityTestCase.qml
[14:54] <mzanetti> paulliu: I think you can check out UnityTestCase.qml. there is a mouseFlick which lets you specify which finger, press/release etc. something like that might do
[14:54] <paulliu> Saviq: ok
[14:54] <tsdgeos> Cimi: i see sorry ^_^
[14:55] <Saviq> paulliu, yeah, look at touchFlick() in UnityTestCase.qml
[14:55] <paulliu> mzanetti: ok. I'll try it. Who I should ask if I have the questions about those functions/methods?
[14:55] <Saviq> paulliu, something like this, but you'll need to create two events by calling touchEvent twice, and pass 0 and 1 to touchId
[14:56] <paulliu> Saviq: ok.. Got it.
[14:57] <mzanetti> paulliu: Daniel created it, but I guess everyone in here should be able to help if you get stuck
[14:57] <mzanetti> feel free to ask me
[14:57] <paulliu> mzanetti: ok.. thanks a lot.
[15:10] <Saviq> mhr3, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/libunity/new-scopes/revision/313 ?
[15:11] <mhr3> Saviq, no json needed, just change control
[15:12] <Saviq> mhr3, you mean in unity8/new-scopes ?
[15:12] <mhr3> Saviq, yes
[15:16] <dandrader> Saviq, do you know where it
[15:16] <dandrader> it's specified on the Nexus 10
[15:16] <dandrader> Saviq,  that unity8 should start with tablet dimensions?
[15:17] <Saviq> dandrader, it's always fullscreen
[15:17] <Saviq> dandrader, under the mir QPA
[15:18] <Saviq> dandrader, main.cpp:135
[15:18] <dandrader> Saviq, hmm, I run it manually and it started with "phone" dimensions, taking only ~ 1/4 of the screen width
[15:18] <dandrader> Saviq, heh, main.cpp:135 has "delete application;". Are you on lp:unity8?
[15:19] <Saviq> dandrader, :)
[15:19] <Saviq> dandrader, :125 then
[15:21] <Saviq> mhr3, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/new-scopes/revision/643 then
[15:21] <mhr3> Saviq, +1
[15:22] <Saviq> mhr3, ok, kicking recipes
[15:22] <Cimi> Saviq, can you explain me the fixme in cardcarousel
[15:23] <Cimi> Saviq, about reversing the carousel?
[15:23] <Saviq> Cimi, the middle/selected item should be scale: 1.0, others should be scaled down, as opposed to what's happening today
[15:24] <Saviq> Cimi, where the middle/selected item is scale: selectedItemScaleFactor while others are scale: 1.0
[15:25] <Saviq> Cimi, otherwise we need to do what I did and scale fonts down etc.
[15:26] <cwayne> is the app scope going to be scaled down a bit?
[15:27] <cwayne> or do we expect HUGE icons
[15:27] <mhr3> they'll fix it
[15:27] <Saviq> cwayne, I believe gatox is looking into changing the card size to small
[15:27] <gatox> cwayne, Saviq yes
[15:30] <mhr3> mhall119, ping?
[15:30] <mhr3> mhall119, another update pls?
[15:30] <cwayne> Saviq, gatox wonderful, thanks
[15:33] <MacSlow> Saviq, thostr_: ping... "greeter-only notification"-meeting .. can you make it?
[15:38] <Cimi> Saviq, it makes math harder
[15:38] <Cimi> (dunno why I did not receive notification, damn gnome shell)
[15:42] <tsdgeos> Saviq: the delegaterange patch needs updating :/
[15:42] <tsdgeos> somehow the new-scopes code seems to excercise a codepath i had not contemplated when doing the code
[15:44] <Saviq> tsdgeos, uh oh, interesting
[15:45] <tsdgeos> seems like previously we were probably resetting models and now we are properly inserting or something
[15:47] <Saviq> tsdgeos, sounds about right, yeah
[15:47] <Saviq> tsdgeos, the new system is much more nimble with the result models
[15:48] <tsdgeos> problem is i'm a bit more scared with this patch
[15:48] <tsdgeos> since it's in a bigger function than the previous one that was ultra obvious
[15:49] <tsdgeos> but still should be ok
[15:50] <tsdgeos> Saviq: so one do we do this one? shall i qtdeclarative-opensource-src-5.0.2/debian/patches/qtquick_delegate_creation_range_itemviews.patch and open a bug with the updated version?
[15:52] <greyback> Anyone else have this issue with QtCreator. Open a file, click somewhere, scroll it so the cursor is off screen. Then Alt-Tab away & back. QtC scrolls the file to show the cursor. Drives me nuts
[15:56] <mhall119> mhr3: are you going to get me a qdoc version of them?
[15:57] <mhr3> mhall119, no
[15:57] <mhr3> mhall119, any why would i? it's not qt-api
[15:57] <mhall119> because I can easily import qdoc into the new API website
[15:59] <mhall119> for that matter, *you* could easily import them into the new API website
[16:01] <mhall119> mhr3:  where are the new docs?
[16:03] <mhr3> mhall119, a sec, uploading to my people.canonical.com
[16:06] <mhr3> mhall119, http://people.canonical.com/~mhr3/scopes.tgz
[16:08] <Saviq> tsdgeos, yeah, I can help with getting a branch for Mirv  and such, if you get the patch updated
[16:08] <Saviq> greyback, +1
[16:08] <tsdgeos> Saviq: battling with quilt  ^_^
[16:08] <Saviq> tsdgeos, can help with that, too
[16:08] <tsdgeos> Saviq: do you know how i add a file to an existing file?
[16:08] <Saviq> greyback, didn't have that in vim mode, but that's been broken in < 3.0 for a while
[16:09] <tsdgeos> i got to "quilt refresh" to update changes of files that were part of the patch
[16:09] <Saviq> quilt add path/to/file
[16:09] <tsdgeos> and then?
[16:09] <Saviq> tsdgeos, ↑, then modify, then quilt refresh
[16:09] <tsdgeos> hmmm
[16:09] <tsdgeos> did that, didn't seem to work
[16:09] <tsdgeos> will do again
[16:12]  * tsdgeos hits himself
[16:12] <tsdgeos> editing the wrong file ^_^
[16:12]  * Saviq pats tsdgeos on the back
[16:21] <tsdgeos> Saviq: ok, i've an updated patch, what do i do with it, email to you?
[16:22] <cwayne> Saviq, will you let me know when all the packages will get pulled in? i need to make a new rootfs when that's ready
[16:26] <Cimi> greyback, you re not alone http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.lib.qt.creator/9741
[16:26] <greyback> Cimi: So it seems. I'm not using fakevim tho
[16:27] <dandrader> Saviq, weird. only way I could get lp:unity8 to show fullscreen on the N10 was hardcoding witdh and height in Shell.qml.
[16:27] <dandrader> I event commented out that if{}else{} in main.cpp to force showFullscreen, but that's not the problem
[16:27] <dandrader> even
[16:28] <Saviq> dandrader, sounds like QPA got confused
[16:30] <dandrader> Saviq, or, alternately, commenting out the width and height entries in Shell.qml (so that the Shell item does fill out all the QQuickWindow space)
[16:31] <Saviq> dandrader, it's explicitly set view->setResizeMode(QQuickView::SizeRootObjectToView);
[16:31] <dandrader> there must be something passing this -geometry argument...
[16:31] <Saviq> dandrader, so as long as QPA tells it to resize its surface to something, nothing in Shell.qml should affect it
[16:33] <mzanetti> Saviq: dandrader: FWIW, on my last right-edge stuff merge I noticed that the shell now start up with some certain size (w,h),  then resizes itself to (0,0), and then resizes back to (w,h)
[16:33] <mzanetti> that confused my stages logic quite a bit...
[16:33] <mzanetti> maybe its related somehow
[16:33] <mzanetti> this happens only since friday
[16:36] <dandrader> well, now it's working as it should (taking the entire screen without having to tamper with the code) again. go figure.....
[16:40] <dandrader> ah, no. it's still broken. I forgot to uncomment one of the width/height definitions in Shell.qml. Good.
[16:40]  * dandrader ignores this problem for now
[16:42] <ricmm> bregma: ping
[16:42] <ricmm> bregma: so I upgraded and I lost all toolkit styles, it feels like 2006 GTK
[16:43] <ricmm> also my keyboard went to a different layout, and fonts are not responding correctly to system-wide settings
[16:52] <sil2100> mhr3: ok, so your branches are in silo 003, but since the spreadsheet got reverted things got ugly etc. etc.
[16:52] <sil2100> mhr3: but they're up and ready for building again
[16:53] <mhr3> sil2100, they're already published, merged and cleaned
[16:53] <sil2100> mhr3: then even better! Crap
[17:02] <tsdgeos> Saviq: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtdeclarative-opensource-src/+bug/1281188
[17:04] <tsdgeos> Saviq: also there's a few things to land in https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/trunk/+activereviews may want to do it soon-ish
[17:06] <dandrader> tsdgeos, what's likely the issue (ie, what did I break) when I manually launch unity8 and all scopes are empty?
[17:06] <tsdgeos> dandrader: you are using new-scopes?
[17:07] <tsdgeos> if so, you need new scopes
[17:07] <tsdgeos> :D
[17:07] <tsdgeos> iinstall unity-scope-click
[17:07] <dandrader> tsdgeos, lp:unity8 (7.84+14.04.20140212-0ubuntu1, revision 718)
[17:07] <tsdgeos> dandrader: doesn't tell me much
[17:07] <tsdgeos> dandrader: from ppa or from trusty?
[17:08] <dandrader> tsdgeos, built it myself just now
[17:08] <tsdgeos> apt-cache policy will know
[17:08]  * tsdgeos can't read
[17:08] <tsdgeos> dandrader: hmmmm, maybe you have new scopes polluting your stuff then
[17:09] <tsdgeos> dandrader: give ~unity-team/unity8/new-scopes/ a try
[17:09] <tsdgeos> and see if anything shows up in there
[17:09] <tsdgeos> if it does
[17:09] <tsdgeos> but actually doesn't make sense
[17:09] <tsdgeos> i get both new and old scopes to run at the same time without any problem
[17:10] <tsdgeos> dandrader: try "restart scope-registry"?
[17:11] <dandrader> tsdgeos, rebooting solved it. some daemon probably died or something....
[17:11] <tsdgeos> probably
[17:12]  * tsdgeos EODs
[17:22] <mhr3> Saviq, btw support for widget columns != 1 for tablet?
[17:22] <mhr3> Saviq, coming?
[17:24] <cwayne> greyback, popey seems to see the same thing i saw re: launcher not showing up on n7 unless you drag fromt he very top left
[17:24] <popey> ya, filing a bug
[17:24] <greyback> cwayne: yep he said same to me.
[17:24] <greyback> thanks!
[17:27] <popey> cwayne: bug 1281199
[17:27] <cwayne> popey, thanks
[17:27] <popey> np
[17:28] <popey> cwayne: how should I update this device?
[17:28] <cwayne> popey, generally re-run the script
[17:28] <popey> ok
[17:29] <popey> seems vertically (in landscape) very tight.. is that due to be fixed soon?
[17:29] <popey> everything is in chunky-vision
[17:30] <mhr3> Saviq, btw here's the activation branch if you want to test
[17:30] <mhr3> lp:~mhr3/unity-scopes-shell/scope-activation
[17:30] <mhr3> pressing the "search" from within scope preview should work with that ^
[17:31] <mhr3> or well... you'll get the signals :)
[17:32] <Saviq> mhr3, re: columns, we're mostly ready
[17:35] <gatox> did anyone notice that when you try to override the category, the dialog opens in this way: http://ubuntuone.com/5z8n0GYAm2vXJV1MXJaJDC ??
[17:36] <cwayne> Saviq, do we have a fix for no icons for non-click apps?
[17:37] <cwayne> greyback, also, did you notice all apps launching in sidestage are opened landscape'd even when its in portrait mode
[17:37] <greyback> cwayne: on nexus10, yep, my bug, fixing
[17:39] <cwayne> greyback, awesome!  what about the random blank side-stage showing up?
[17:39] <greyback> cwayne: being worked on
[17:39] <cwayne> lovely, thank you greyback
[17:39] <greyback> cwayne: popey: just to be 100% clear, would you mind putting the device you are testing into the bug description
[17:39] <cwayne> greyback, sure thing
[17:39] <greyback> as there are different code paths being followed on N10 versus N7
[17:40] <greyback> cwayne: thanks
[17:40] <popey> ya
[17:41] <popey> greyback: do you want code names or colloquial names? i.e. I put "flo" in the description. do you want "nexus 7 2013"?
[17:42] <greyback> popey: code names handiest I guess
[17:55] <popey> cwayne: bug 1281214 maybe related to what you just discussed about rotation?
[17:55] <cwayne> popey, i think that's the same one i mentoned above to greyback
[17:55] <popey> ok
[17:58] <cwayne> thostr_, hi, is it expected that a lot of scopes in the scope scope dont have icons?
[19:10] <cwayne> anyone here know much about the fake multi-user greeter?
[19:15] <greyback> cwayne: mterry might be able to help you, but he's got national holiday today
[19:25] <Saviq> cwayne, he described what's possible in https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/unity8/demo-users/+merge/203823
[19:25] <Saviq> cwayne, check the description out
[19:26] <cwayne> Saviq, yeah, i have it *mostly* working, i thought there was a way to force different backgrounds too
[19:26] <cwayne> but i can't seem to get that working
[19:29] <Saviq> cwayne, that might need more code actually
[19:29] <Saviq> cwayne, not a lot, but some
[19:30] <cwayne> Saviq, ah, ok
[19:30] <cwayne> marketing seems to think we'll be demoing that
[19:32] <Saviq> cwayne, we will, something along the lines of http://paste.ubuntu.com/6950584/
[19:34] <cwayne> Saviq, hm, not sure how we'd be able to preseed those settings
[19:34] <cwayne> oh
[19:35] <Saviq> cwayne, in ~phablet/
[19:35] <cwayne> or is that jsut in that ini file
[19:35] <Saviq> cwayne, we need a file dropped in there
[19:35] <Saviq> cwayne, yes
[19:35] <cwayne> Saviq, that'd be perfect
[19:37] <Saviq> cwayne, we need a file dropped in ther
[19:37] <cwayne> yeah, i already have that int he custom tarball
[19:38] <cwayne> but that bit you jsut sent isn't in trunk yet right?
[19:40] <Saviq> cwayne, no, I just wrote it ;)
[19:40] <Saviq> cwayne, testing and will MP in a sec
[19:40] <Saviq> (or some minutes, actually)
[19:42] <cwayne> awesome :)
[19:42] <cwayne> now if only there were a way to easily fake the infographic data
[19:43] <cwayne> rather than having to created a bunch of users
[19:44] <Saviq> cwayne, well, we did have some fake infographic data, maybe we can still salvage it
[19:44] <Saviq> cwayne, I'll talk to mterry tomorrow
[19:53] <cwayne> is scope-registry still hardcoded to look in /usr/share?
[22:20] <mhall119> mhr3: new scopes API docs should be up
[22:22] <mhr3> mhall119, did the url change?
[22:23] <mhr3> mhall119, cause i see feb 6th @ http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/devel/ubuntu-14.04/cplusplus/libunity-scopes/index.html
[22:30] <mhall119> mhr3: how about now?
[22:30]  * mhall119 copied them one directory up by mistake
[22:33] <mhr3> mhall119, yep, better


[00:01] <mainmeister> Yes you look good
[01:42] <guille> Si!
[06:52] <dholbach> good morning
[08:46] <boom> hey folks
[09:03] <fr33r1d3> isn't it suppost to start now?
[22:26] <bvincent> i can
[22:27] <bvincent> do you do other software
[22:30] <bvincent> Question: do you do other software
[22:31] <bvincent> it will


[06:27] <Cantide> http://www.news24.com/Technology/News/Mxlish-the-12th-official-SA-language-20130328 <- hahahaha April fools anyone?
[07:07] <Symmetria> haha
[07:07] <Symmetria> I like this bit
[07:07] <Symmetria> Reports suggest that three companies from Limpopo have been included on the preferred bidders' list.
[07:19] <Cantide> :p
[08:33] <Trixar_za> Kilos: I checked this morning - seems they just moved the 2G+1GB promo deal to Telkom Mobile
[08:34] <Kilos> oh my goodness so i bought mine early all for nothing
[08:34] <Kilos> what a waste hey
[08:35] <Kilos> morning Trixar_za  superfly  and others
[08:35] <Trixar_za> Oh, it wasn't a complete waste. I'm still using mine :P
[08:35]  * Trixar_za is listening to: Village Of All Beginnings  -- Playstation by Tomba!
[08:35] <Trixar_za> Listening to streaming music too
[08:36] <Trixar_za> I've always been a fan of game music, especially early console music
[08:36] <Kilos> hehe
[08:36] <Trixar_za> Not so much because they were chiptunes, but because you had such a limited range of sounds and you had to make it work
[08:36] <Trixar_za> True talent that
[08:42] <Kilos> hi Vince-0
[08:42] <Vince-0> hi
[08:49] <Cantide> i bought the 60 + 60 yesterday =_=
[08:49] <Cantide> Telkom are evil
[08:49] <Cantide> Trixar_za, I like chiptunes, too :) and all retro game music :)
[08:50] <Kilos> why you say they are evil Cantide  ?
[08:51] <Cantide> i could have waited a day and then it would last me another month
[08:52] <Kilos> oh ya thats what i did because i was scared the 2+1 would be gone
[08:53] <Cantide> yeah :/
[08:53] <Cantide> oh well
[08:53] <Cantide> at least i have enough data until i leave
[08:53] <Cantide> and then i will give the sim to my dad
[08:53] <Kilos> when you leaving?
[08:54] <Cantide> probably September
[08:54] <Cantide> i'm not 100% sure yet
[08:55] <Kilos> ah so quite a while yet
[08:55] <Cantide> yeah
[08:55] <Cantide> just need monies '-'
[08:55] <Cantide> so i will work for a few more months
[08:55] <Kilos> whats that?
[08:55] <Cantide> then relax for a few months before i go
[08:55] <Cantide> money *
[08:55] <Cantide> :p
[08:56] <Kilos> that stuff that used to grow on trees
[08:56] <Cantide> yes, that stuff :p
[08:56] <Kilos> hehe
[08:56] <Cantide> now it grows in mines - requires hard work and lives lost to dig it out
[09:01] <Kilos> i wish maaz would return
[09:02] <Kilos> got so many links saved with him
[11:24]  * Squirm[A] pops in
[11:39] <sakhi> howzit popin?
[12:43] <Cantide> oh yeah
[12:43] <Cantide> oops
[12:43] <Cantide> wrong channel :p
[13:34] <tumbleweed> http://ograblog.wordpress.com/2013/04/01/important-changes-in-ubuntu-engineering/ :)
[13:37] <Cantide> haha
[13:37] <Cantide> there seem to be a lot of these going around today :D
[14:22] <zeref_debian> lol @ article
[15:49] <Trixar_za> Even Ubuntu had to make an Easter Fool's day joke
[16:59] <Kilos> hmm... you drowning in nicks Cantedious
[17:00] <Cantedious> haha
[17:00] <Cantedious> yeah
[17:00] <Cantedious> busy trying to make my own input method for ibus
[17:00] <Cantedious> so far it's not working out..
[17:04] <Squirm> Trixar_za: http://mybroadband.co.za/news/government/74427-bittorrent-downloads-websites-to-be-blocked-in-sa.html
[17:04] <Squirm> I lol'd
[17:05] <Squirm> only saw it after they edit the title
[17:05] <Trixar_za> lol
[17:06] <Squirm> s/edit/edited
[17:14] <Squirm> anyone know where I can find good prepaid phone deals?
[17:15] <Cantedious> game or pep?
[17:15] <Squirm> looking for a smartphone
[17:16]  * Squirm looks on the Game website
[17:19] <Squirm> Trixar_za: the S3 Mini at Game is R4000, the S3 Mini from FNB is R150pm for 24months = R3600
[17:19] <Squirm> cheaper and you pay it off slowly
[17:20] <Squirm> same with the S3
[17:20] <Squirm> R600 cheaper
[17:20] <Squirm> go go FNB
[17:24] <Trixar_za> It's R4000 now. In 2 years time, that price would be about 1/4 that it is now
[17:27] <Squirm> but I can't wait 2 years for a new phone :P
[17:27] <Squirm> I'm getting the phone now
[17:27] <Squirm> in the metaphorical sense
[17:29] <Trixar_za> lol
[17:29] <Trixar_za> True, but just remember the math when you make decisions
[17:30] <Trixar_za> In the long run they're overcharging, but it's cheaper than buying new right now
[17:30] <Squirm> I don't understand how they're overcharging
[17:30] <Squirm> in total I'd pay say R4000 from Game, R3600 from FNB
[17:30] <Trixar_za> Long run - thing lose value over time
[17:30] <Squirm> they lose the same value whether you pay for it in full or not
[17:30] <Trixar_za> Would you buy a 2 year old car at the price it was when it was new?
[17:31] <Squirm> but I'm not
[17:31] <Squirm> :/
[17:31] <Squirm> come now logically minded Trixar_za
[17:32] <Trixar_za> lol, most people lack the ability to think in days, months and years. I have never had that problem and it's been my crutch since forever
[17:32] <Squirm> I may still be paying for it in a year and 6 months. but I've still had it for a year and 6 months
[17:32] <Squirm> 1.5 years
[17:32] <Squirm> :/
[17:33] <Trixar_za> And by that time it would be only like 1,2k to buy it 'new'
[17:33] <Trixar_za> :P
[17:33] <Squirm> so whether I buy a phone for R4000 or R150pm. in 2 years time I'll have paid less for the same phone worth the same amount of money
[17:33] <Squirm> yes, THEN
[17:33] <Squirm> but this is NOW
[17:33] <Trixar_za> But don't overthink it too much
[17:33]  * Cantedious agrees with Squirm
[17:34] <Cantedious> you're getting the phone now, not in 2 years
[17:34] <Cantedious> so paying less over time makes no difference
[17:34] <Cantedious> except saving money
[17:34] <Cantedious> also, rands might be worth less in 2 years :p
[17:34] <Squirm> oh I hope not
[17:35] <Trixar_za> This is like explaining 3 dimensional space to people in a 2 dimensional world.
[17:35] <Squirm> convenient for me to pay R150pm as well, I don't have R4k cash. cept it ties me down :/
[17:35] <Cantedious> yeah
[17:35] <Trixar_za> Point is: You are getting the phone now, but your not saving long term. Stop thinking in terms of what it's priced now, but when your pay it off. You are not saving in the LONG RUN. End of story.
[17:36] <Tonberry> mmm
[17:36] <Cantedious> i'm considering getting the galaxy pocket - just to last me 6 months
[17:36] <Tonberry> i don't follow your logic
[17:36] <Trixar_za> Mind you, most companies cash in on people's inability to think long term
[17:36]  * Squirm looks at Trixar_za
[17:36] <Squirm> you're really not understanding me :/
[17:37] <Squirm> Trixar_za: in the long run. i.e. 2 years time, I'd have paid R3600
[17:38] <Squirm> and say I pay R4k cash now
[17:38] <Squirm> in 2 years time
[17:38] <Squirm> I'd have still spent R4k on the phone
[17:38]  * Squirm thinks Trixar_za is sober
[17:40] <Trixar_za> Yes, but by the time you do actually pay it off, the price would have dropped drastically. The phone wouldn't be worth 4k at that time. In fact, I estimate, you'd have payed R2600 more for the phone by then. But it doesn't matter.
[17:40] <Tonberry> bugger that. S3 costs R8000ish prepaid. Contract payments if you subtract the non phone bits only add up to R5000ish
[17:40] <Tonberry> how am I not saving money going the contract route
[17:40] <Tonberry> ?
[17:40] <Squirm> Tonberry: this isn't a contract route
[17:41] <Squirm> FNB has the S3mini for R150pm*24months = R3600. Game has the Mini for R4k
[17:41]  * Tonberry scrolls up
[17:41] <Trixar_za> So all I'm saying is: You don't save in the long term. End of argument. :P
[17:41] <Squirm> Trixar_za: thinks in the long run it'd be more expensive to go with FNB
[17:41] <Squirm> Trixar_za: no
[17:41] <Squirm> if I got the phone at the END of the 2 years, yes
[17:41] <Squirm> but I'd get the phone now
[17:42] <Trixar_za> No, I don't. I'm just disagreeing with you about you 'saving' money in the long run with the deal. It's still a good deal by today's standards, even if they screw you a little in the long run.
[17:42] <Squirm> :/
[17:42] <Tonberry> so i still lose money if i give the 3600 to some third party and let him pay it of vs paying 4000 upfront?
[17:43] <Trixar_za> You'd lose money either way
[17:43] <Cantedious> lol
[17:43] <Tonberry> but you lose more giving away 4000
[17:43] <Trixar_za> Either way the phone still loses value over the years
[17:43] <Squirm> Trixar_za: at the end I'd still have paid less on the FNB side
[17:44] <Tonberry> by that logic no one would ever buy technology
[17:44]  * Trixar_za sighs
[17:44]  * Squirm sighs
[17:44] <Tonberry> ok what do you suggest someone does if they want to buy the phone
[17:44]  * Squirm lets other people figure out Trixar_zas illogical logic and goes and has a beer
[17:45]  * Tonberry sips his white wine
[17:45] <Trixar_za> Let me try it like this: Compared to today's game price, the end total of the 24 month deal looks cheap. But if you compare the price of the phone at the time when you pay of the phone, there would be a drastic loss in value. Still with me? It's relative to which end of the transaction your looking at.
[17:46] <Trixar_za> The bank has enough sense to realize that they can sell you something for cheaper, because in the long run they'll be making profit.
[17:46] <Tonberry> but the bank has to pay his suppliers for the phone now
[17:47] <Trixar_za> Which they probably get a cost and/or bulk price
[17:47] <Trixar_za> Either way, the bank won't be making a loss.
[17:47] <Trixar_za> And you probably won't either
[17:48] <Tonberry> but they aren't really screwing you either
[17:48] <Trixar_za> It's a good deal. Go with it. Just don't think it's a saving when it's not :P
[17:50] <Cantedious> if it's normally 4K, but they can give it to you for 3.6K, then you're saving
[17:50] <Cantedious> of course the phone will lose value over time - it will no matter how you pay for it
[17:51] <Cantedious> pay less for same product now = win
[17:51] <Trixar_za> But your not paying for the same product now. Your paying for the same product then.
[17:58] <magespawn> evening all
[17:58] <Trixar_za> Evening magespawn
[17:59] <magespawn> My 2 cents, by paying it off your are also paying the same monthly amount for a phone that is worth less each month
[18:00] <Kilos> hi magespawn  and others
[18:00] <magespawn> can you open a sql database created with access with another sql manager or do you need to convert it?
[18:01] <magespawn> hey Kilos
[18:02] <magespawn> Trixar_za: this logic does not only apply to phones but anything that goes down in value
[18:03] <Trixar_za> magespawn: Exactly and it's by what most companies that sell something at a monthly rate makes money off of
[18:05] <magespawn> Squirm: that article on my bb is very close to what is happening in the states and europe
[18:05] <Trixar_za> It's just hard to explain to people. I've always thought in long terms, which has always tripped me up. Only time I think only short term is while I'm completely sloshed :P
[18:06] <magespawn> Trixar_za: imagine paying off the game s3 with an rcs card, pay 3 times the price
[18:06] <magespawn> my bug bear is 'free' when they mean included
[18:06] <Trixar_za> I'm actually abusing that logic for my own gain too - well if we get that club bar
[18:07] <Trixar_za> We're including the mix in the price, but telling them it's 'free'
[18:07] <magespawn> Trixar_za: they probable also make money off the transacti9ns themselves by owning the authorising company
[18:08] <Kilos> shame guys Squirm  really wants that fone
[18:08] <magespawn> typing is horrendous tonight
[18:08] <magespawn> i got my tablet through fnb and IT is the best deal for it
[18:09] <Trixar_za> Then let him buy it. We never said it was a bad deal.
[18:09] <magespawn> you are just not saving money you are just spending/losing  less
[18:09] <Kilos> squirm if you take the R150 per month and pay R200 per month it drastically shortens the 2 years
[18:09] <superfly> magespawn: no. Access is not SQL (nor would I ever call it a database)
[18:09] <magespawn> they do not allow that
[18:09] <superfly> magespawn: you can use mdbtools
[18:10] <Kilos> oh my. not same as buying a house?
[18:10] <magespawn> superfly the book i have has of course used access so was wondering
[18:10] <Kilos> or has that also changed
[18:10] <magespawn> no Kilos
[18:11] <Kilos> ai!
[18:11] <superfly> magespawn: you can try LibreOffice Base
[18:11] <magespawn> depends on your terms but with the fnb phone/tablet deal fixed amount has to be repayed
[18:11] <superfly> magespawn: most Access courses depend a LOT on the Forms
[18:11] <superfly> which is stupid beyond belief, but hey
[18:12] <magespawn> they have four db they use through out the book, would hate to have to set them up first
[18:14] <Trixar_za> Yeah, that's what I meant. He'd be losing less than if he bought the thing new. But he'd still be losing. The only saving is in a lower loss rate.
[18:15] <Trixar_za> Personally, I would go for the deal too.
[18:19] <magespawn> anybody know more about this http://www.nedbank.co.za/website/content/mediakit/media_content.asp?page=top&article=current&prID=1472
[18:22] <magespawn> found some more here http://simplybiz.co.za/nedbank-pocketpos%E2%84%A2-question-and-answers
[18:22] <nuvolari_> o/
[18:22] <Kilos> lo nuvolari_
[18:22] <nuvolari_> hi oom Kilos
[18:23] <nuvolari> hoe gaan dit oom?
[18:23] <nuvolari> ek is weer terug in die beskawing
[18:23] <Kilos> ok dankie en jy seun?
[18:23] <Kilos> hehe
[18:23] <nuvolari> dit gaan goed dankie oom!
[18:23] <Kilos> werk more?
[18:23] <nuvolari> darm eilig gery
[18:23] <nuvolari> *darm veilig gery
[18:23] <nuvolari> ja-nee oom, die lewee gaan aan
[18:23] <nuvolari> *lewe
[18:27] <nuvolari> lol a couple of google april-fools jokes
[18:31] <Kilos> hi cocooncrash  maaz is dead? do you have time to fix him?
[18:32] <Kilos> ty cocooncrash
[18:33] <inetpro> Kilos: he's back
[18:33] <Kilos> magespawn: wb
[18:33] <inetpro> good evening
[18:33] <Kilos> hi inetpro
[18:33] <Kilos> did you do it inetpro  ?
[18:33] <inetpro> Kilos: no
[18:33] <magespawn> lol @ Kilos
[18:33] <Kilos> magespawn: coffee on
[18:34] <inetpro> Maaz: coffee on
[18:34]  * Maaz flips the salt-timer
[18:34] <Kilos> qa dont make lekker coffee
[18:34] <magespawn> neither do i, ask my wife
[18:34] <Kilos> haha
[18:35] <Kilos> some peeps do it on purpose to get out of making again
[18:36] <Kilos> ive given up with bios flash via floppy magespawn
[18:37] <Kilos> cant fir the flash and update onna floppy
[18:37] <Kilos> fit
[18:37] <smile4ever> good night
[18:37] <smile4ever> :)
[18:37] <Kilos> hi smile4ever
[18:37] <Kilos> oh night
[18:37] <Kilos> sleep tight
[18:37] <smile4ever> Kilos: sorry ;)
[18:37] <smile4ever> thanks
[18:38] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for inetpro!
[18:40] <Kilos> oh my goodness the bot didnt give me coffee
[18:40] <Kilos> .
[18:40] <Kilos> apartheid
[18:40] <inetpro> Kilos: you didn't ask him
[18:41] <inetpro> Maaz: danke
[18:41] <Maaz> Bitteschön
[18:41] <Kilos> i got probs here with kde. keeps going slow
[18:41] <inetpro> Kilos: define slow
[18:42] <Kilos> so slow when i type here it takes minutes before even showing
[18:42] <Kilos> and other things battle to close
[18:42] <inetpro> Kilos: run htop
[18:43] <inetpro> or just press CTRL+ESC
[18:43] <inetpro> look at what is eating your cpu
[18:45] <Kilos> xorg 19% krunner 6% konvers 9%
[18:45] <inetpro> Kilos: do it when it's slow again
[18:45] <Kilos> ok
[18:46] <Kilos> it isnt the pc telling me its time for a reinstall??
[18:46] <Kilos> hehe
[18:46] <magespawn> no Kilos no no no no no
[18:46] <inetpro> Kilos: you have a talking pc?
[18:46] <magespawn> lol
[18:46] <Kilos> hahaha
[18:47] <Kilos> well if it isnt running right there is something wrong hey?
[18:47] <inetpro> find the problem and then fix it
[18:54] <Kilos> why does plasma say disk sleep?
[18:54] <Kilos> there it did it but couldnt see percentages just disk sleep kept popping up
[19:00] <magespawn> maybe the hard drive power saving is set to make the disk sleep quickly
[19:01] <Kilos> where you find that thing magespawn
[19:01] <Kilos> there again and now it was konvers saying disk sleep
[19:02] <magespawn> not too sure look under system settings under power settings
[19:02] <Kilos> btw my other drive with kde on vlc shows that video perfectly
[19:03] <magespawn> hmm strange maybe some install difference then
[19:04] <Kilos> ok turned off button events handling, we see now
[19:04] <Kilos> weird hey
[19:04] <Kilos> and both installed from my saved archives
[19:05] <magespawn> you need to let people know about this sort of thing
[19:05] <magespawn> you find problems nobody else does
[19:12] <Kilos> ya but why?
[19:12] <Kilos> why not you clever peeps
[19:13] <magespawn> thats the thing, by reporting with data settings etc, maybe people can find out why
[19:14]  * inetpro can't see how it can be caused by "button events handling"
[19:15] <Kilos> thats the only place that was still ticked in the power settings
[19:15] <Kilos> and only place i saw the word sleep
[19:15] <Kilos> but will watch it now
[19:25] <Kilos> wb inetpro_
[19:26] <Kilos> aw did it again
[19:26] <inetpro_> uh oh
[19:26] <Kilos> pidgin and konvers showed disk sleep
[19:26] <Kilos> but not for long
[19:27] <inetpro> Kilos: what is the exact error message and how do you see it?
[19:27] <Kilos> im watching that system activity thing
[19:27] <Kilos> the column under cpu usage
[19:28] <Kilos> dont get error messages
[19:29] <inetpro> Kilos: can you make a screenshot when you see it again?
[19:30] <Kilos> how on kde
[19:30] <Kilos> quick
[19:30] <Kilos> ?
[19:31] <inetpro> Kilos: hang on, you're not the only one having that problem
[19:31] <inetpro> http://forums.opensuse.org/english/get-technical-help-here/install-boot-login/406191-disk-sleep-hang.html
[19:31] <Kilos> aha
[19:32] <Kilos> but thats on suse
[19:32] <inetpro> Kilos: kde is kde
[19:33] <inetpro> but regardless, I don't think that posting has a solution for you
[19:33] <Kilos> oh dont see kde in the link, sorry
[19:33] <inetpro> google is your friend
[19:34] <Kilos> ai!
[19:34] <inetpro> actually I think this might not even be a kde issue
[19:35] <inetpro> have you checked your bios?
[19:35] <Kilos> what do i look for in bios
[19:35] <Kilos> its not after long time sometimes minutes apart the sleep thing
[19:36] <inetpro> are you running your kde off a secondary disk?
[19:36] <Kilos> nope first disk
[19:36] <Kilos> sda
[19:36] <inetpro> a samsung disk?
[19:37] <Kilos> havent checked if sdb does the same yet
[19:37] <Kilos> maxtor methinks
[19:37] <Kilos> or seagate
[19:38] <Kilos> so , if sdb dont do it as well its the drive?
[19:38] <Kilos> ai!
[19:39] <inetpro> check for advanced power management settings or such
[19:40] <Kilos> ok will do that.ty
[19:41] <Kilos> if i dont come back i got too tired and will see youall tomorrow\
[19:44] <magespawn> good night all
[19:51] <Kilos> fsck found an inconsistency in sda7 and said run fsck manually
[19:52] <Kilos> whatever sda7 might be
[19:56] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight
[20:18] <Cantide> good night '-'/~
[22:50] <Guest38454> Hey guys :)


[01:21] <BadUser> hello?
[01:23] <BadUser> hello?
[01:23] <lynorian> yes BadUser
[01:23] <BadUser> I'm new to linux... looking for some help.
[01:24] <lynorian> BadUser: help on what?
[01:24] <BadUser> getting video card installed.
[01:24] <BadUser> hardinfo says "unknown"
[01:24] <lynorian> what kind and what version of lubuntu?
[01:24] <lynorian> 18.04?
[01:25] <BadUser> yeah i think... maybe 18.10... can't remember this sec.
[01:25] <BadUser> not sure how to look either.
[01:25] <lynorian> 18.10 doesn't have hardinfo
[01:25] <lynorian> by default
[01:25] <BadUser> I've been using windows for 20+ years..
[01:25] <BadUser> I did the sudo getapp hardinfo thing
[01:27] <lynorian> do you have 2048-qt as a game?
[01:27] <lynorian> if so you probablty have 18.10
[01:28] <lynorian> and this will be of use to you if this is true
[01:28] <lynorian> https://manual.lubuntu.me/4/4.3/software_sources.html
[01:28] <BadUser> how to i look for it?  To be honest... Back in like 2001 I had a copy of Redhat gnome, and it was 1000 times easier for me than any new version of linux ive tried.
[01:29] <lynorian> BadUser: 2048-qt would be in games in the menu
[01:29] <BadUser> yes.. its there
[01:30] <BadUser> so under OS in hardinfo:
[01:30] <lynorian> are you completely uncomfortable in the termianl
[01:30] <BadUser> Kernel: Linux <IP_ADDRESS>-generic
[01:30] <lynorian> BadUser: appearantly you have the development version ???
[01:31] <lynorian> unless you upgraded that
[01:31] <BadUser> I'm ok with the terminal if the commands are given to me.. lol
[01:31] <BadUser> I've already broken and reinstalled about 10 times in the past two days
[01:31] <lynorian> BadUser: can you paste the output of lspci
[01:32] <BadUser> and I downloaded whatever the lastest was on the lubuntu site..
[01:32] <BadUser> lspci 00:00.0 Host bridge: Intel Corporation Xeon E3-1200 v5/E3-1500 v5/6th Gen Core Processor Host Bridge/DRAM Registers (rev 02) 00:01.0 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation Xeon E3-1200 v5/E3-1500 v5/6th Gen Core Processor PCIe Controller (x16) (rev 02) 00:14.0 USB controller: Intel Corporation 100 Series/C230 Series Chipset Family USB 3.0 xHCI Controller (rev 31) 00:14.2 Signal processing controller: Intel Corporation 100 Series/C230
[01:33] <lynorian> not seeing a graphics card that would need drivers in this output
 BadUser: what's the problem with your graphic card?
[01:34] <BadUser> under hardinfo, for graphics, it just says "unknown"  I have a gtx660 in this system.
[01:34] <BadUser> hardinfo: display: "vendor: Unknown"
 Ok
[01:35] <lynorian> might be a hardinfo problem not recognizing it
 Go to preferences - > software sources
[01:35] <lynorian> are you getting display to the screen?
[01:36] <BadUser> it could be.. I'm not sure how to tell if the driver is installed or not... I went to software: drivers: and selected the nvidia driver, but nothing changed
[01:36] <BadUser> and I have display... I'm using lubuntu right now.
 In software sources go to additional drivers tab
[01:37] <BadUser> thats where i selected the "usining nvidia driver meta...."
 And after the search has ended it would be good to see what appears
[01:38] <BadUser> and the bottom says
[01:38] <BadUser> "1 proprietary driver in use"
 If Nvidia is the only proprietary you have, then it's ok
[01:39] <BadUser> so then Hardinfo is probably just wrong?
 Could be, I'm not sure how it works
[01:40] <lynorian> BadUser: probably
[01:40] <BadUser> lol.. me neither
 But I'm sure how additional driver tab works
[01:40] <lynorian> although could be lspci not showing it that therefore hardinfo doesn't show it
 I know there is another way to see it in the terminal, but I'm on my phone now and don't remember how it is
[01:42] <BadUser> well... So 1st thing i did was download the linux driver from nvidia which was a .run file..  It wouldn't run so I googled how to force it, and made it run.. Then it complained because of some other video driver.. So I disabled that. ran it again.  Then did a bunch of Sudo get-update commands and about 5 others that i can't remember..
[01:44] <BadUser> long story..  nvidia418 is showing up under "additional drivers" tab and thats whats selected now, but i'm worried I broke it by doing the other stuff..
 Aaaaa, you might have conflicts, there is no need to do that in *Ubuntu it has Nvidia drivers
 Type in terminal
 ubuntu-drivers
[01:46] <BadUser> "ubuntu-drivers" gives me a usage error... It needs an argument behind it like -h or something
[01:47] <BadUser> i did ubuntu-drivers list
 Then try … ubuntu-drivers devices
[01:47] <BadUser> I get Nvidia-driver-418, nvidia-driver-396 and 3 more
 Is there one in bold?
[01:47] <BadUser> ~$ ubuntu-drivers devices == /sys/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:01.0/0000:01:00.0 == modalias : pci:v000010DEd000011C0sv00003842sd00002662bc03sc00i00 vendor   : NVIDIA Corporation model    : GK106 [GeForce GTX 660] driver   : nvidia-driver-396 - third-party free driver   : nvidia-driver-390 - distro non-free driver   : nvidia-340 - distro non-free driver   : nvidia-driver-415 - third-party free driver   : nvidia-driver-418 - distro no
[01:48] <BadUser> nothing in bold
 There is one that says "recommended"?
[01:50] <BadUser> Let me ask this... Is there a version of linux that's closer to windows?  Like with a control panel?  or something where i can install things from the gui rather then CLI?
[01:50] <BadUser> and yes... Nvidia-driver-418 says distro non-free recommended
[01:51] <BadUser> thats the one selected under the "additional drivers" tab
 @BadUser [<BadUser> thats the one selected under the "additional drivers" tab], Then it's ok
[01:52] <BadUser> ok... well.. Let me find a game of some kind, and see if i can install it and play it... Any Ideas?
[01:53] <BadUser> something free that uses the video card?
[01:54] <BadUser> for 3D.. like opengl or something... I know everything uses the videocard. lol
[01:57] <BadUser> ok... HOW do I fix this?
[01:57] <BadUser> ANYTHING I download and try to open, opens in ARK...
[01:57] <BadUser> *.run or *.deb
[01:58] <BadUser> I just downloaded steam for linux and its a .deb file, but won't launch like an installer... should it?
 Try right clicking on it and opening with Discover.
[02:01] <BadUser> i had to Right Click and say open with QApt installer
 That works too. I forgot we have that now.
 You can search for software in muon as well. I think the Steam installer is in there.
[02:02] <BadUser> what is  moun
 In the menu under system tools —> muon package manager
[02:03] <BadUser> and what is all this?  It looks like gibierish to me.. lol
 It is an easier way to search for software, somewhat like a software store.
 The categories at the left are for types of software or if you know what you are looking for (i.e. Steam) you can type that in the search box at the top.
[02:05] <BadUser> one of the other linux i tried had a software store that was really easy to use..
[02:06] <BadUser> in this i'm seeing : "Asterick-core-sounds-en-gsm" and stuff like it
 Discover is easier in some ways but it can be more resource intensive.
[02:07] <BadUser> This system has a core i7-7700 with 8gb ddr4.. And an SSD.. Resources are barely being touched right now..
[02:07] <BadUser> I
 For reference here is a link to our muon page in the manual: https://manual.lubuntu.me/4/4.2/muon.html
 Discover should be good then.
[02:08] <BadUser> I'm trying to learn linux.. I don't care if it slows down as long as it makes things easier until i get the hang of it.
 Here is a link to that: https://manual.lubuntu.me/4/4.1/discover.html
 It sounds like you are on your way so far, we all start somewhere.
[02:09] <BadUser> I'm on my way.. Down the rabbit hole. lol...
 :)
[02:10] <BadUser> What's so hard for me, Its two things... 1) My Ego!!! I've been an MCSE tech since win2000.  Been using windows since the 3.1days
[02:11] <BadUser> 2nd) Its because I've been using windows for 20+ years... I just know where things are, and I have NOTHING to relate to in linux..
[02:12] <BadUser> I built a Hackintosh too..   IDK what I could do in Linux that I can't in Windows..
 Give it a little time, I think it will come to you.
[02:15] <BadUser> So let me ask you a question... Do you do any programming?
 Not really a program creator per say but I can follow along with some.
[02:16] <BadUser> I'll tell you what I want to do... I'm really a hardware guy.. I fix boards on a componient level.. Like desolder, resolder when they go bad...
 That is probably more in my wheelhouse too. It is where my formal education lies.
[02:17] <BadUser> And I want to learn how to write motherboard BIOS's... maybe just modify at first, but eventually learn and write FULL aftermarket computer BIOS's.. With more features.
[02:18] <BadUser> your formal EDU is in?
 BIOS is a tough one. Those are pretty locked down I think.
 Electrical Engineering Technology
[02:19] <BadUser> Bios are only 1/2 locked... If you see, ppl mod bios already... Like added support for I7-gen8's to the z270 chipsets...
[02:19] <BadUser> Thats part of it...
[02:20] <BadUser> I want to make a company that offers aftermarket bios's for a bunch of different boards, that will "Turn-on" software locked features.
[02:21] <BadUser> or if you rembmer 4 years ago, Gigabyte, Asus, asrock.. All had a bios that allowed overclocking on NON-Z chipsets, then on Non-K cpu's... It was all pulled when intel found out, but the bios is still out there.
[02:21] <BadUser> I'm sure if you could take the existing bios, add back in some of those features, like non-k overclocking and such, ppl would buy your "Aftermarket" bios/
[02:23] <BadUser> and A LOT of the Hex / Bios editors i've seen are linux based.. So I need a linux machine I can use..
 <kc2bez>: where are you from?
 I am from the US. Makes sense that people would be interested. I don't want to carry the conversation too far off-topic here in the support channel though. If you have any more Lubuntu questions please let us know.
[02:25] <BadUser> I may shortly... I'm working on installing steam, then i'll give some of those games a try... I'll let you know how it goes in a min
 I am signing off for the night but there may be someone else around. Good luck and nice chatting with you.
 Steam should work ok on a 660
[02:38] <BadUser> Alrighty... Thanks for your help and good night
[03:49] <BadUser><PHONE_NUMBER>8888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888888
[12:07] <jack4> hi guys, I installed lubuntu 18.10 from live DVD, but I cannot boot without live DVD it shows a white screen and a cursor I can move
[12:07] <jack4> I tried to enable wifi dongle but it cannot be enabled
[12:08] <jack4> I tried updates from liveDVD but after shutting down all updates are lost
[12:08] <jack4> I would like to enable wifi dongle from command line and try updates
[12:09] <jack4> but it cannot be enabled
[12:20] <jack4> i tried to enable wifi from command line interface
[12:20] <jack4> but it cannot be enabled
[12:21] <jack4> what should I do?
[12:31] <jack4> I want to boot from live dvd but later install permanent updates to my pc how can I do this?
[12:32] <jack4> whenever I try to install permanent updates it says read only
[12:33] <jack4> If I boot without live dvd it boots to a white screen
[12:33] <jack4> and I cannot do anything
[12:34] <jack4> I am stuck and I dont know how to continue
[12:39] <jack4> anyone has lubuntu 18.10 to an old laptop?
[12:51] <jack4> hi taunix
[12:52] <jack4> do you have lubuntu 18.10 in old laptop?
[12:53] <taunix> hi jack4 simply hardware
[12:55] <taunix> the suspend mode, was on, is just off
[12:55] <jack4> tauinx I installed lubuntu 18.10 to an old laptop and cannot boot without live DVD
[12:55] <jack4> if I boot with live DVD it boots ok
[12:56] <jack4> but without live DVD shows a white screen
[12:56] <jack4> and I can move cursor
[12:56] <jack4> but only a white screen
[12:56] <jack4> I tried to enable wifi dongle
[12:56] <jack4> and I could not
[12:56] <jack4> how to fix this white screen
[12:57] <jack4> it says lubuntu is installed on pc
[12:57] <taunix> i never hve this bug
[12:58] <jack4> I use command line and it works with ctrl alt f4
[12:58] <taunix> im boot the live system from usb-drive
[12:58] <jack4> but if I go to ctrl alt f1 shows white screen
[12:58] <jack4> instead of live usb-drive I use live dvd
[12:59] <jack4> it is the same I think
[13:27] <walterwoj> hello! I there a better user management tool I can install?  I can't see any if the user privileges in the default user management tool provided.  I'm trying to lock a install down for use as a web kiosk and want to take away everything that isn't needed


 OMG, I FINALLY HAVE LIVE C++ INSPECTION ON EMACS @_@
 ON WINDOWS
 https://i.gyazo.com/1d36227b7a40266d1268573fd3dea6b9.mp4
 Its so beautiful 😢 I've wanted this for years. Rtags had trouble working on windows- then GoodGuyMicrosoft put out the Language Server Protocol a few years ago, and people have been migrating over to it. This is now using CQuery, Clang, and LLVM.
 COMPLETION https://i.gyazo.com/a6c881ccad12ece15bc762d8130dadbc.mp4
 Now the big question is, once I get some Linux binaries compiled, can I do this through console? The color theme is specifically 256-color supported for terminals, and the completion mode doesn't utilize anything other than buffer writing I think.
 Similar functionality in my vim environment. Works great in a remote session (or tty). Let me know how yours goes
 The LSP protocol should provide instant support for emacs, vim, VSCode, atom, whichever has an lsp client
 So you may be able to get even c# on vim
 It's Cyber Monday! Who's doing cybering?
 Who wants to Cyber?
 Any good deals?
 @AdamOutler, Bro
 Cyber all the things
 @AdamOutler, Last time I said yes to that, you sent me some photos that I am still going to a therapist weekly to get the images out of my head
 @RazPi, Any support for R?
 https://www.amazon.com/b/ref=CMDO18_GW_Desk_Dashboard_EN?node=5550342011&pf_rd_p=1149a8c1-8f48-4640-b364-50b20f29b92c&pf_rd_r=VF9P23JXHBSS732NZP0C
 Got about a week to get caught up on R
 I didn't see any good deals that peaked my interest
 @KMyers @Ivoriesablaze @AdamOutler I found battletech stuff..
 I thought you found all that is still around
 I got all the models and two sourcebooks for a huge duscount
 *discount
 In NC?
 Yes! Asheville
 I walked in because I thought it was a videogame store but it was an actual gaming store
 You know how sometimes you find programmers in the mountains. They have one or two hobbies like retro computers and model airplanes and wear flannels and kinda keep to themselves?
 Yes, I have seen this for myself
 sounds like the a good life
 and yes, raz, we can totally see you doing that
 It hit me while I was collecting old computer magazines from a bookstore out in the middle of nowhere.. yep.
 @Ivoriesablaze, I cant see him growing a neckbeard however
 6_9 I like it and I'm scared of it at the same time.
 you never know
 Hahaha
 I can't grow a beard xD so there's that
 But it's like, hey, sounds comfy.
 But also, I need the excitement and the bleeding edge. I need the storms. But man, working on my emacs config the past few days has been some of the most  serene development environment out there in the woods. You could really focus
 Maybe you don't need to be in a tech hub to be bleeding edge of research.
 you just kinda need access to amazon, i would think
 "i need this particular part" *orders from amazon*
 I love it when the energy and gas company says my payment is late when I setup Autopay 10 days before the bill was due.
 When Amazon fails, use eBay
 Xcell billing is a joke
 I can't believe I'm gonna say this, but I miss fpl