[00:09] <M0DCM_Dave> Any news on 10.04?
[00:10] <Some_Person> Does anyone here speak Chinese by any chance? I need something translated
[00:10] <rsk> M0DCM_Dave what kind?
[00:10] <penguin42> Some_Person: Doesn't google language tools?
[00:10] <M0DCM_Dave> I'd like to know if it now supports the Intel GMA500
[00:10] <Some_Person> penguin42: How do I type this into Google Translator: http://i42.tinypic.com/2ahvbrr.jpg
[00:10] <rsk> M0DCM_Dave easy way is to boot a nightly cd and chek
[00:10] <penguin42> Some_Person: Ah
[00:11] <arand> M0DCM_Dave: or virtualbox'it
[00:11] <M0DCM_Dave> cheers, I don't even mind if they do backporting like they've done in 9.10
[00:11] <yofel> arand: how does virtualboxin help with a driver test?
[00:12] <M0DCM_Dave> dunno
[00:12] <arand> Ah, didn't see the latter comment, yea liveCD is what to go for then..
[00:13] <M0DCM_Dave> I'll give it a try on a weekly basis
[00:13] <M0DCM_Dave> there's more than myself that has a netbook with the GMA500 chipset that are crying out for GMA500 support
[00:16] <brianherman> so on the latest version of wubi
[00:16] <brianherman> it formats every reboot
[00:16] <brianherman> lol
[00:17] <M0DCM_Dave> does it?
[00:18] <brianherman> i just rebooted lucid wubi
[00:18] <brianherman> it reinstalled everything
[00:18] <brianherman> ...
[00:18] <M0DCM_Dave> oh boy
[00:20] <M0DCM_Dave> I've only been running Ubuntu since January, and I can say Billy "Bob" Gates is no match
[00:20] <Nikola> ok, need some help.. 10.04 freezes seemingly on random moments.. and I can't do anythig than manual restart
[00:21] <histo> What was your problem with 9.10?
[00:21] <histo> btw
[00:21] <histo> Nikola: ^^^^^^^^^
[00:21] <M0DCM_Dave> mine??
[00:21] <M0DCM_Dave> or his
[00:21] <histo> his
[00:21] <histo> sry
[00:21] <M0DCM_Dave> it sounds like grafix
[00:21] <Nikola> Well it just freezes same as 10.04....
[00:21] <Nikola> and sound stucks in a loop
[00:22] <Ian_Corne> are you sure it's not overheating?
[00:22] <M0DCM_Dave> what card you running
[00:22] <histo> Nikola: how old is your hardware?
[00:22] <histo> Nikola: I know i've seen issues with power management due similiar stuff.
[00:22] <Nikola> yes, it's not overheating.. graphic card is ATI radeon @ 512 GDDR3.. and hardvare is  new
[00:22] <histo> Nikola: Try booting with acpi=off on the kernel line
[00:23] <Nikola> how to do that?
[00:23] <histo> Nikola: when you turn it on hold <shift> to get to the grub menu
[00:23] <penguin42> Nikola: Is it really new? I mean have you had anything run stabily on it?
[00:23] <histo> Nikola: Then move down to the most recent kernel and press the E key
[00:23] <Nikola> windows 7 runs great on it...
[00:23] <histo> penguin42: he said window 7 runs stable on it.
[00:23] <Nikola> also windows xp
[00:23] <penguin42> ok
[00:24] <histo> Nikola: then append to the end of the line acpi=off
[00:24] <lucian_> i'm getting no sound when trying to run pasuspender
[00:24] <histo> Nikola: press enter to but see how it goes.
[00:24] <histo> lucian_: lot of sound updates today I noticed
[00:24] <lucian_> i've noticed this issue since yesterday
[00:25] <histo> lucian_: have you done a dist-upgrade today?
[00:25] <lucian_> but i've never used it before because i've been used to just shutting off pulseaudio
[00:25] <Nikola> ok, I'll try that... and another thing I noticed, not really sure if it's relevant but the kern.log clears every data after the freezing thing happens...
[00:25] <Nikola> because someone told me to post log from the time the freezing happens....
[00:25] <histo> Nikola: who knows until you try.
[00:26] <lucian_> i've tried pasuspender on every app i could think of and no sound
[00:28] <lucian_> i've tried streaming radio in secondlife running pulseaudio and it sounds like a skipping cd
[00:28] <lucian_> so i decided to use pasuspender instead, no sound in second life all together
[00:29] <histo> lucian_: did you preform a dist-upgrade and grab the newest sound packages
[00:29] <lucian_> yes i did
[00:29] <lucian_> no emprovments
[00:29] <lucian_> improvments*
[00:29] <Blue11> lucian_: yeah sound still choppy here
[00:30] <histo> lucian_: bug?
[00:30] <lucian_> i still get the left side all distorded and scratchy, i have to go into tty1 before logging into gnome and do an also force-reload to get rid of the scratchy left side
[00:31] <Blue11> lucian_: that sounds TOO familiar
[00:31] <litropy> I've got "/ filesystem has errors [SIFM] w/ the niiiiice looking ner ubuntu load screen on my netbook's display right now. Random occurrence; had it suspended or hybernated (can't remember which), opened the lid, only had a blank screen and a cursor. Cold rebooted, and this is the result. My question is: Can I get it to go verbose in what it's doing right now?
[00:31] <lucian_> when i log into gnome, pulseaudio is stuck, i can t shut it off
[00:31] <Blue11> lucian_: i have to jiggle the volume control knob
[00:31] <litropy> ]"
[00:31] <litropy> new* gosh, sorry for the spelling errors.
[00:32] <lucian_> i'm kinda upset that distros are intergrading pa more and more while pa and alsa are still not working right, together
[00:32] <penguin42> litropy: the SIFM is an option of keys to press but I can't remember what they all are; M is maintenance I think, I can't rmeember the others
[00:33] <ZykoticK9> lucian_, after you mentioned it i tried using pasuspender with audacious2 (changed output to alsa), and I too am getting no sound
[00:34] <litropy> thank you, penguin42. All else: while I google, wanna save me time while I get the meanings?
[00:34] <lucian_> i have to do alsa force-reload, but i can nolonger do it while logged into gnome because pulseaudio refused to shutdown
[00:34] <lucian_> i even disabled autospawn for pa and it still restarts its self!
[00:36] <lucian_> does anyone know of a really good soundcard that works will with alsa and pulseaduio?
[00:36] <siddhartha> question: i was running a karmic installation.. i somehow managed to change change my release type to eeebuntu after adding some package repos.  Recently i added lucid repos. Is there any way to change the distribution release type ? lsb_release -a tells me im still running eeebuntu.
[00:36] <lucian_> this intergraded one i've got just isn't making the grade
[00:38] <penguin42> lucian_: See http://share.skype.com/sites/linux/   and search down for 'To disable'
[00:38] <lucian_> penguin42: ok
[00:38] <bsmith093> i am having a crapload of package configuration problems. is there a way to force all unconfigured packages to configure?
[00:38] <lucian_> To disable auto-spawn, edit or create the file ~/.pulse/client.conf and add a line containing "autospawn = no" there.
[00:39] <lucian_> i've done that and it still restarts regardless
[00:39] <litropy> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/01/27/%23ubuntu-devel.txt
[00:40] <bsmith093> also are there any torrents for the cd images they are downloading VERY slowly
[00:40] <lucian_> see? i really disagree with the decision to make so pulseaduio stays locked on no matter what
[00:41] <lucian_> that's very mac like
[00:41] <penguin42> lucian_: It really should go if you put that autospawn = no in there
[00:41] <yofel> bsmith093: dpkg --configure -a ?
[00:41] <lucian_> penguin42: in lucid, it it restarts its self nomatter what
[00:41] <bsmith093> i am having a crapload of package configuration problems. is there a way to force all unconfigured packages to configure?
[00:42] <lucian_> the only way to keep it from respawning is to uninstall it along with all its dependencies
[00:42] <bsmith093> yofel: tried that no go
[00:42] <yofel> bsmith093: and if you mean the beta cd images, they are quite old now, you should use a daily
[00:42] <ZykoticK9> I've started to get the non-text Plymouth using the nvidia-blob :)
[00:42] <penguin42> lucian_: If it's ignoring the respawn flag then that sounds like a bug
[00:42] <bsmith093> it just say errors were found
[00:42] <yofel> bsmith093: and where does it fail?
[00:42] <bsmith093> what do you mean
[00:42] <lucian_> it's ignoring it
[00:42] <litropy> okay all - I just successfully logged into my other partition. What fsck command shoould I run to check the damage?
[00:42] <yofel> bsmith093: well, *what* error?
[00:43] <bsmith093> un configured packages
[00:43] <lucian_> if you can confirm it that would be great
[00:43] <yofel> bsmith093: we had/have quite a broken plymouth package that could break other packages yesterday
[00:43] <bsmith093> unmet dependencies package blah depends on foobar but foobar is not confugured
[00:43] <bsmith093> so should i just install the newest daily
[00:44] <bsmith093> this one is just 2 days old
[00:44] <bsmith093> also what is plymouth ive been hearing alot about it
[00:44] <penguin42> bsmith093: It's the boot splash these days
[00:44] <yofel> bsmith093: where exactly does it fail? we can't help you without knowing the error message
[00:46] <bsmith093> hold on ill pastebin it
[00:47] <lucian_> also where can i shut off services?
[00:47] <lucian_> like bluetooth and all that?
[00:47] <bsmith093> http://pastebin.com/tLkw4f98
[00:47] <lucian_> used to be an option in system -- administration --- services
[00:47] <Nikola> ok I tried adding acpi=off on boot, but it still freezes :/
[00:47] <lucian_> what happened to services?
[00:48] <ZykoticK9> lucian_, it was removed in Karmic
[00:48] <lucian_> wh
[00:48] <lucian_> why?
[00:48] <bsmith093> did anyone check it out yet
[00:48] <yofel> bsmith093: lemme guess, your system crashed or you ran out of battery?
[00:48] <lucian_> i liked it
[00:48] <lucian_> can i get it back?
[00:49] <ZykoticK9> lucian_, with the update to upstart i guess it hasn't been updated yet
[00:49] <bsmith093> not to be pushy but if i should just install the latest daily please tell me
[00:49] <Nikola> histo I tried your suggestion, it doesn't work... any other suggestions?
[00:49] <lucian_> is there another way to shut down services?
[00:49] <bsmith093> yofel: umm actually i closed the lid
[00:49] <bsmith093> its a laptop
[00:49] <bsmith093> so am i screwed
[00:50] <bsmith093> or should i just install the daily fo today
[00:50] <litropy> k, just fsck -n -v 'ed. Anyone want to help out before I just fix?
[00:50] <yofel> bsmith093: yes, but exec format error is usually caused by the package scripts being empty files as their contents weren't synced to disk before the disk failed (I/O error, poweroff, crash, ...)
[00:51] <bsmith093> yofel could u give me more detil please
[00:53] <yofel> bsmith093: dpkg uses shell scripts to handle the configuration of the packages. when you install a package it unpacks the scripts and package contents and later configures the package. If now the system crashes the contents of the scripts will not yet be written to disk, only the metadata saying that the file exists...
[00:53] <histo> Nikola: memtest?
[00:53] <penguin42> yofel: But I thought that was also the reason it just got so slow was because it added sync's to stop that
[00:53] <Nikola> done it.. shows it's ok....
[00:53] <yofel> bsmith093: so when you try to configure the package later on dpkg will fail telling you that it can't execute the empty scripts
[00:54] <histo> Nikola: and maybe searching the forums for your mobo cpu usually random lockups are power related.
[00:54] <bsmith093> so is this fixable without a reinstall
[00:54] <yofel> penguin42: yes, but that patch was reverted I think cause it was just TOO slow
[00:54] <penguin42> yofel: Ah got you - it was grimly slow!
[00:54] <histo> Nikola: maybe others would have suggestions but its goign to be really difficult to trouble shoot on a beta systme aswell. Could be multipile causes
[00:55] <yofel> bsmith093: it is, a reinstall might be faster though. You'll find more information on bug 512096
[00:55] <Nikola> haven't tried that... but if it's working normally with windows why wouldn't it work with linux. and btw. as I already said before I had the same problem on stable version of ubuntu that is 9.10
[00:55] <bsmith093> also could someone PLEASE torrent the dailies i have a 1 mbit broadband connection and it dl ing at 200kb 47 minutes left
[00:56] <litropy> k. well, that fixed it.
[00:56] <litropy> thx all
[00:56] <bsmith093> pardon me 10 mbit connection
[00:56] <yofel> bsmith093: why don't  you just zsync them? (if you already have an image on your hdd)
[00:57] <bsmith093> umm i dont have an image
[00:57] <bsmith093> im dl ing one really slowly
[00:59] <Nikola> histo I just noticed that almost always when it freezes I'm using flash, like on youtube etc.. could this be the problem?
[00:59] <bsmith093> hey i just thought could i make an iso out of the disc i burned yesterday
[00:59] <bsmith093> and zsync that
[02:00] <bsmith093> or would that be a bad idea
[02:00] <yofel> might work, but just downloading the torrent should be faster at this point
[02:01] <bsmith093> yeah thanks but the download just picked up a lot
[02:01] <bsmith093> now `800kb
[02:03] <litropy> upgrading to daily is sudo aptitude update && sudo aptitude safe-upgrade, correct?
[02:05] <litropy> ooh, new headers :P
[02:06] <arand> litropy: lucid→lucid yep
[02:07] <litropy> should I tell grub to update since new headers are being installed? I imagine it does so automatically, but just checking
[02:08] <arand> litropy: should be done automatically, if needed.
[02:08] <litropy> kthx
[02:09] <litropy> gosh, this is a huge upgrade. You guys are working hard!
[02:09]  * litropy says, at the risk of sounding naive.
[02:11] <lucian_> how do i install an older version of gnome-volume-control? like 2.26?
[02:11] <arand> lucian_: download from packages.ubuntu.com
[02:11] <lucian_> one that doesn't rely on pulseaduio
[02:12] <arand> lucian_: good luck... I had little when stripping pa before..
[02:33] <lucian_> i'd like to file a bug report that pulseaudio restarts its self even if autospawn is set to no in /etc/pulse/client.conf
[02:34] <yofel> lucian_: 'ubuntu-bug pulseaudio' ?
[02:34] <BUGabundo> yofel: he as a file in ~
[02:35] <yofel> didn't he set that to 'no' as well?
[02:36] <lucian_> yofel: ok will do :)
[02:36] <yofel> lucian_: what did you put in ~/.pulse/client.conf ?
[02:36] <lucian_> just set autospawn to no
[02:37] <lucian_> but pulseaudio is ignoring it for some reason
[02:37] <yofel> hm
[02:37] <lucian_> so when i do a pulseaudio --kill
[02:37] <litropy> How do I get "Default" to auto-unlock upon initial bootup? I hate having to enter my pw every time.
[02:37] <lucian_> it shuts off but right away starts up again
[02:37] <litropy> There's no option for it in the dialogue
[02:49] <lucian_> hmm it appears now its working
[02:49] <lucian_> looks like autospawn was typoed as Autospawn
[02:49] <lucian_> in the client.conf
[02:51] <lucian_> well since im in a bug reporting mood, might as well report pasuspender giving no sound
[03:01] <lucian_> oh one thing i wanted to ask, when i shut down pulseaudio to play something like second life, i lose the volume applet, but when i start pa back up, i still dont see the applet
[03:02] <lucian_> how do i get the volume applet back up?
[03:10] <daniskami> lucian_: gnome-volume-control-applet
[03:21] <nishanth> my ubuntu has been crashing frequently today can anyone help me?
[03:21] <lucian_> daniskami: it doesn't do anything
[03:22] <lucian_> oh wait
[03:22] <lucian_> its because i dont have pa running at the moment
[03:22] <daniskami> lucian_: yes, it relies on pulseaudio
[03:23] <daniskami> lucian_: I don't know if it survives killing and restarting pulse
[03:23] <lucian_> it doesn't
[03:23] <lucian_> but it should
[03:23] <lucian_> i dont like fact that it now relies on pulseaduio to run
[03:24] <lucian_> i'd prefer the older gnome-volume-control-applet
[03:24] <lucian_> the one that used alsa
[03:24] <nishanth> my lucid has been freezing a couple of time today. can anyone help me with this?
[03:24] <lucian_> unless there's an alternative
[03:25] <lontra> how can i stop ubuntu one from syncing? i click stop syncing folder but it continues to do so w/ nautilus and eats up all my CPU and RAM
[03:26] <daniskami> lucian_: ah, I see that now in the scrollback
[03:26] <lontra> is ubuntu one just really broken?
[03:26] <daniskami> lucian_: I am not using pulseaudio at all (is that an alternative?)
[03:26] <lucian_> the new gnome-volume-control-applet will not run without pulseaudio
[03:27] <lucian_> and thats a bummer
[03:27] <daniskami> correct, so I am not able to use that either
[03:27] <lucian_> because i cant have pa running all the time with certain apps
[03:27] <nishanth> can someone help with lucid freezing issue?
[03:28] <daniskami> lucian_: Is there any benefit in using pulseaudio for you?
[03:28] <yofel> nishanth: "freezing" is very vague...
[03:28] <lucian_> not really, unless i'm using remote desktop to my other tower
[03:29] <nishanth> yofel : well i cant use my mouse or my keyboard all of a sudden
[03:29] <nishanth> and i have to turn of the power to start it again
[03:29] <yofel> :(
[03:29] <lucian_> it kinda ticks me off that ubuntu decided to intergrade pulseaudio into the system like this
[03:29] <yofel> sry, no idea where  to start debugging
[03:30] <nishanth> any way of inding what could be wrong?
[03:30] <lucian_> i prefered it to be an option that i can shut off and continue to have sound and volume control
[03:30] <yofel> lucian_: blame gnome, not only ubuntu for this
[03:30] <lucian_> allot of game players are mad because of this too
[03:31] <lucian_> because pulseaudio still cant handle games
[03:31] <lucian_> especially wine
[03:32] <yofel> wait, for games you might even need libsdl1.2debian-alsa maybe
[03:36] <lucian_> For those without PulseAudio, the old (GStreamer) mixer will still be available and has even been augmented with a sound theme tab to match the new interface.
[03:36] <lucian_> so it says
[03:45] <DanaG> I'd rephrase that:
[03:45] <DanaG> Wine can't handle PulseAudio.
[03:45] <DanaG> I've run Nexuiz through PulseAudio... it works just fine.
[03:49] <DanaG> argh, on my netbook, every other time I boot, it sits there at plymouth, looking like it's starting up and shutting down over and over again (thanks to the badly-designed 0%-100%-0% looping progress bar).
[03:53] <DanaG> And when shutting down... it also looks like it's starting up.
[03:54] <MikeChelen> audio is currently working for me in 3d games, but not in wine
[03:54] <MikeChelen> using default config
[03:55] <MikeChelen> in 9.10, this system often had trouble with 3d game audio, unless pulseaudio was removed
[03:55] <DanaG> okay, now it's even weirder: instead of a splash screen, I just get blank black.
[03:56] <DanaG> oh, and at gdm, it keeps resetting itself to blindingly-bright maximum brightness.
[03:56] <DanaG> And there's no easy way to change the default brightness at GDM.
[04:14] <lucian_> is there a rt-kernal available for lucid that would improve pulseaudio latency?
[04:14] <lucian_> kernel*
[04:15] <Damascene> is Lucid too slow this days?
[04:16] <lucian_> running pa in games is so bad
[04:16] <lucian_> or games with pa on, so many audio skipts
[04:16] <lucian_> skips*
[04:17] <lucian_> the only one i see thats available is <IP_ADDRESS>-rt
[04:29] <ZykoticK9> lucian_, specifically what linux-native game is giving you audio problems in Lucid?  Quake4 for instance had terrible audio for me under Karmic yet works well under Lucid.
[04:35] <DanaG> ureadahead: Error while tracing: No such file or directory
[04:52] <bullgard> Why is indicator-applet not shown on my Lucid computer? The DEB program packages 'indicator-applet' and 'indicator-applet-session' are installed.
[04:56] <crimsun> bullgard: http://pastebin.com/t4nrUWT9
[04:58] <crimsun> bullgard: and, of course, the obvious: make sure "Indicator applet" is ticked in System> Preferences> Startup Applications> Startup Programs
[05:05] <tanath> i'm having trouble with rhythmbox trying to put music on an ipod touch
[05:05] <tanath> the music transfers, but the ipod doesn't show the transfer, and doesn't see the music
[05:07] <tanath> this rhythmbox feature is new as far as i know. anyone know if it works yet?
[05:07] <bbordwell> tanath, are you talking about the music store?
[05:07] <tanath> bbordwell,
[05:07] <tanath> bbordwell, no
[05:08] <tanath> just copying music from the computer to the ipod through rhythmbox. it's the only thing that sees it
[05:08] <tanath> itunes doesn't work
[05:08] <bullgard> crimsun: System> Preferences> Startup Applications> Startup Programs does not exist on my Lucid computer. System> Preferences> Startup Applications> Startup Programs does not exist on my Karmic computer although indicator-applet works all right here, Can you comment.
[05:08] <tanath> itunes for windows doesn't see the ipod
[05:08] <bbordwell> tanath, I did that in lucid
[05:08] <bbordwell> karmic i mean
[05:09] <tanath> oh, was gonna say
[05:09] <tanath> i'm on 10.04 now
[05:09] <tanath> got it on 2 computers. same prob on both
[05:10] <bbordwell> tanath, i have not tried it in lucid yet but it should be working. its a regression if not
[05:10] <tanath> music transfers. i can see free space go down, and the files on it in nautilus
[05:10] <tanath> it never worked then either
[05:10] <tanath> and these are new installs
[05:11] <bbordwell> tanath, what type of ipod?
[05:11] <tanath> ipod touch. 64gb
[05:11] <tanath> previously, i forget what type
[05:11] <tanath> not touch though
[05:11] <bbordwell> tanath, yes the iphone and ipod touch not supported yet AFIK
[05:11] <bbordwell> AFAIK*
[05:11] <tanath> :-/
[05:11] <tanath> aware of an ETA?
[05:11] <bbordwell> tanath, close i belive
[05:12] <bbordwell> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=ODA5Mg
[05:13] <bbordwell> that was 4 days ago, I think if you resarch and work at it you can get it working, but not in lucid by default
[05:13] <bbordwell> The only currently supported way in ubuntu involves jailbreaking
[05:13] <tanath> thanks
[05:19] <ShawnR> i'm trying to run a game in wine on 10.04 and seem to be lacking opengl for my intel 945 IGP
[05:19] <ShawnR> can someone point me in the right direction pls?
[05:21] <gnomefreak> ShawnR: do you have 3d graphic drivers installed for you card?
[05:21] <ShawnR> that's what i'm trying to figure out
[05:21] <ShawnR> i've read somet things about kms and ums and i'm not sure what to do
[05:21] <gnomefreak> ShawnR: what grtaphic card?
[05:21] <ShawnR> right now it is just the built-in drivers
[05:21] <ShawnR> it's a laptop with intel 945 chipset
[05:22] <gnomefreak> i was thinking the 3d drivers for intel was installed by default but open the hardware drivers menu item and see what it shows
[05:23] <gnomefreak> install as needed and reboot and hope it works ;)
[05:23] <ShawnR> it shows agpgart-intel
[05:23] <ShawnR> that's what my question is, where do i go to install the intel gfx drivers?
[05:24] <gnomefreak> the repos has them i just cant recall what ones support what card
[05:24] <crimsun> bullgard: the last one, Startup Programs, is a tab. It's the default one.
[05:25] <gnomefreak> xserver-xorg-video-intel im thinking that is it
[05:26] <gnomefreak> ^^ installed by default
[05:26] <gnomefreak> crimsun: isnt there a 3d driver outside of the driver above?
[05:26] <DanaG> One thing I've found: on a 64-bit host, ia32libs has OLD mesa!
[05:27] <DanaG> ... at least, old compared to, say, xorg-edgers.
[05:27] <crimsun> gnomefreak: not that I'm aware
[05:27] <DanaG> oh yeah, and when I try hl2dm in Wine (with fglrx), it gets the X server stuck.
[05:27] <gnomefreak> everything is old compared to *-edgers
[05:27] <gnomefreak> crimsun: i didnt think so but wortha  try
[05:28] <crimsun> shipping -edgers's mesa in the repo (proper)'s ia32libs would be A Very Bad Idea
[05:28] <DanaG> Anyway, I guesss edgers should have an ia32-libs package.
[05:28] <DanaG> I mean, xorg-edgers should have an xorg-edgers ia32-libs.
[05:28] <gnomefreak> ShawnR: xserver-xorg-video-intel supports i810, i815, i830, i845, i855, i865, i915, i945 and i965
[05:28] <ShawnR> thanks, i'm looking into that now
[05:28] <gnomefreak> ShawnR: it should be installed and active without you needing to do anything
[05:29] <ShawnR> apt-get says that's already at the latest version
[05:29] <ShawnR> correct
[05:29] <bullgard> crimsun: I found the tab System> Preferences> Startup Applications> Startup Programs. But this tab does not list "Indicator applet" on my Lucid computer while it does list it on my Karmic computer.
[05:29] <gnomefreak> bullgard: scroll down the list. its there for me :)
[05:30] <gnomefreak> it may be greyed out
[05:32] <bullgard> gnomefreak: I scrolled down on both computers. It is not listed on my Lucid computer. It is listed on my Karmic computer.
[05:33] <gnomefreak> bullgard: thats odd
[05:38] <mbt> Does anyone know if there is a way to set configuration defaults w/ udisks (formerly policykit-disks) such that certain types of media are mounted with the "sync,dirsync" flags?
[05:40] <bbordwell> mbt, I assume this can be accomplished by editing your fstab
[05:40] <bbordwell> but with udisk i do not know
[05:41] <mbt> bbordwell, fstab is useless since the device gets a different name fairly regularly and other devices might get its name. I just want a particular type (e.g., usb-floppy) to be mounted with these options.
[05:41] <bbordwell> mbt, ahh i did not read your question carefully enough
[05:41] <mbt> Seems like there is a lot of migrating from things that worked and had useful configuration options to things that work but don't have them; I can't find anything anywhere that would let me do this, sadly.
[05:42] <voidmage> I'm getting this error when i plug in a usb PS2 controller adapter, does anyone know what it means?
[05:42] <voidmage> Mar 28 00:39:35 phoenix kernel: [364131.030060] generic-usb: probe of 0003:0B43:0003.000B failed with error -71
[05:42] <jmcantrell> anyone use nx/freenx/neatx with lucid?
[05:47] <almoxarife> phoenix kernel???
[05:49] <Guest11262> Hi, whenever I try to lock the computer or the computer goes into standby or sleep there is about a 30 second delay where the screen slowly dims
[05:50] <Guest11262> Anyone know how to fix this?
[05:51] <ShawnR> it takes 30 seconds to dim?
[05:51] <jmcantrell> anyone use nx/freenx/neatx with lucid?
[05:51] <Guest11262>  About
[05:51] <mbt> Guest11262, 30 seconds? Do you have a problem with your display driver, using VESA or something? It should only take two seconds or so; possibly less
[05:51] <ShawnR> my guess is you need to update graphics drivers.  jmcantrell: not me
[05:51] <Guest11262> I'm using the latest restricted NVIDIA drivers
[05:52] <Guest11262> Had no problems like this in Karmic
[05:52] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/devicekit-power/+bug/539843
[05:52] <DanaG> argh
[05:52] <almoxarife> Guest11262: have you looked at the log?
[05:52] <Guest11262> It will dim about 5 percent, wait, 5 more, wait, etc
[05:52] <Guest11262> How do I do so?
[05:52] <mbt> Guest11262, Have you an extremely low output for glxgears?
[05:53] <TravisO> I'm afraid I really don't know.  I've never actually poked around my linux boxes.
[05:54] <TravisO> I don't where the logs are or what glxgears isw
[05:54] <bullgard> bbordwell: Yesterday Update Manager offered a distant-upgrade. Afterwards my Kexi program does not exist any more. But the 3 essential software packages still exist in my directory /home/detlef/Downloads. How to install them?
[05:54] <mbt> TravisO, if you open a terminal window, and then type "glxgears", every 5 seconds the terminal will show you how many frames per second it drew. Can you tell us what that number is?
[05:55] <TravisO> sec, need to install
[05:55] <TravisO> 9940 frames
[05:55] <TravisO> 9252
[05:55] <DanaG> ah, that's good enough.
[05:55] <mbt> Well, then it isn't a graphics problem with speed of output.
[05:56] <mbt> Hrm.
[05:56] <dividedby0zero> hey guys, could the lucid beta be installed now and rollupdated into final versions?
[05:56] <TravisO> Nope, graphics run very well for me
[05:56] <almoxarife> mbt: the pm-sleep log/.?
[05:56] <bullgard> dividedby0zero: Yes.
[05:57] <GSF1200S> has notify-osd gained anymore config options in lucid over the version in karmic?
[05:57] <dividedby0zero> lets say that there are packages that are default now that change later. would they be automatically installed and uninstalled based on the updates?
[05:57] <GSF1200S> karmic's notify-osd really needs some options
[05:57] <bullgard> dividedby0zero: Yes.
[05:58] <dividedby0zero> ok thanks
[05:58] <mbt> Well, I don't see any options in the gnome-screensaver configuration that would have the potential for lengthening the fade-out period.
[05:58] <kushalone> HI, I seem to be unable to use Flash in 10.04b in Firefox. It seems that it is installed but firefox (default installation) cannot see it. It it changes anything, I am using the 10.04b which was upgraded from 9.10 (not a clean install)
[05:59] <TravisO> One more thing, forgot to mention, it seems whenever I come out of sleep or lock I get a "serious kernel problem"
[05:59] <mbt> TravisO, "serious kernel problem"?
[05:59] <TravisO> yes
[05:59] <bbordwell> bullgard, I am guessing it upgraded the koffice-data and koffice-libs
[05:59] <TravisO> the little red explosion icon next to clock
[05:59] <bbordwell> you need to revert to the versions you installed
[05:59] <almoxarife> TravisO: yeah, sounds serious, anything else you might of not shared?
[05:59] <TravisO> sorry
[05:59] <GSF1200S> kushalone, 32 or 64bit?
[06:00] <mbt> TravisO, Can't say that I have seen that. I'd make the assumption that your problem is related there to the kernel problem.  Have you reported this to Launchpad?\
[06:00] <bbordwell> bullgard, You should have locked the versions in synaptic to avoid update manager updating hthem
[06:00] <voidmage> almoxarife: phoenix is my box name
[06:00] <TravisO> Well, the only issues I'm having right now is the fade thing, kernel issue, and can't connect to printer (printer program crashes)
[06:00] <kushalone> GSF1200S: 32 bit, I believe. Ubuntu i686 iso on AMD Athlon XP 2000 MHz
[06:01] <kushalone> (I burned my own CD and I chose the default 32 bit download)
[06:01] <mbt> TravisO, Have you reported the kernel issue to Launchpad?  If so, what's the bug number?
[06:02] <bullgard> bbordwell: I did not lock the versions in Synaptic. The DEB program packages are now in /home/detlef/Downloads. How can I install them in order to be able to use my program Kexi in Lucid again?
[06:02] <GSF1200S> kushalone, download flash from adobes website for 32bit linux, create a plugins directory in the .mozilla folder, and put the libflashplayer.so file in there.. restart firefox
[06:02] <GSF1200S> kushalone, done. You can check to make sure it sees it by typing about:plugins in firefox's address bar
[06:03] <kushalone> GSF will try that (Firefox is not running now but I will check anyways)
[06:03] <TravisO> I have, how do I check though?
[06:03] <bbordwell> bullgard, in synaptic install the newer versions, then gdebi should be able to install the .debs you have
[06:03] <GSF1200S> does anyone on here have 10.04 and use notify-osd? I tried asking in #ubuntu and they told me to f off to here..
[06:03] <mbt> TravisO, you should have received email from your bug report, or you can go to Launchpad and look for bugs that you have reported.
[06:03] <bbordwell> Then you should lock them in synaptic so update-manager no longer upgrades them
[06:04] <GSF1200S> kushalone, should work great- thats how I use the alpha flash plugin for 64bit
[06:05] <bullgard> bbordwell: As you will remember, Synaptic does not provide no newer versions of Kexi. Rather, it does not provide any Kexi versions at all.
[06:06] <almoxarife> bullgard: you got a deb in a folder?
[06:06] <TravisO> hmm, looks like I didn't report it
[06:06] <ZykoticK9> GSF1200S, is notify-osd the old verision of OSD or the one that was introduced in karmic?
[06:06] <bullgard> almoxarife: Yes. But not only one but three. All three are needed for the Kexi program.
[06:06] <mbt> UGH. The GNOME people think that "[I] shouldn't have to mess around with mount options, [they] should do the right thing out of the box." *That* is insanely frustrating.
[06:07] <GSF1200S> ZykoticK9, im not sure- does the one you have allow you to configure it at all?
[06:07] <almoxarife> bullgard: use nautilus much?
[06:07] <ZykoticK9> GSF1200S, think it must be the new one - as it's installed on my Lucid.   --  I am using Nautilus much, yes.
[06:08] <GSF1200S> ZykoticK9, can you move it around or do anything with it? If not, its prolly the same version thats in karmic
[06:08] <TravisO> Is there a log that records all the bugs that bring up the crash notification?
[06:08] <GSF1200S> kushalone: killall firefox
[06:08] <ZykoticK9> GSF1200S, no it's locked in that inch below the corner all the time
[06:08] <almoxarife> bullgard: go to the folder that the debs are in using nautilus, click or double click on one of the debs, tell me what happens
[06:09] <kushalone> ok, done. Now to... ugh oops. I need to open firefox again to download flash :P
[06:09] <GSF1200S> ZykoticK9, yeah, same ole crap.. you think theyd do something about that
[06:09] <mbt> TravisO, I think you can find information on crash reports in /var/crash
[06:09] <DanaG> another gnome thing that frustrates me: no option to have both edge-scrolling and two-finger scrolling.
[06:09] <TravisO> got it
[06:09] <ZykoticK9> GSF1200S, i have seen a patch somewhere to move it to the corner (more work then it was worth in my opinion)
[06:10] <almoxarife> DanaG: I can edge scroll, its an option in mouse menu I believe
[06:10] <ZykoticK9> GSF1200S, but that was a patch for Karmic - not sure if it would even work on Lucid
[06:10] <mbt> It stinks; I want a stable desktop environment that gives me tweakables and lets me get work done the way I do it.
[06:10] <bullgard> almoxarife: A program window "Package Installer - Koffice-data" opens.
[06:10] <DanaG> Yeah, but there's no option to allow both edge-scrolling and two-finger scrolling TOGETHER.
[06:10] <DanaG> It's either one or the other.
[06:11] <DanaG> That'
[06:11] <GSF1200S> ZykoticK9, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD   read the first part about implementation for Lucid- It looked as if maybe they were going to do something about it
[06:11] <TravisO> How do I get the address bar back in file browser?
[06:11] <DanaG> That's an entirely artificial limitiation.
[06:11] <almoxarife> bullgard: that is the deb you want installed?
[06:11] <bullgard> almoxarife: It is one of three. Yes.
[06:11] <almoxarife> bullgard: see 'install' on the top right?
[06:12] <bullgard> almoxarife: Yes.
[06:12] <mbt> TravisO, Control+L
[06:12] <TravisO> ah
[06:12] <TravisO> it's different
[06:12] <ZykoticK9> TravisO, / is even faster - if you want it permanently see http://sites.google.com/site/alucidfs/how-i-do/location-bar-in-nautilus
[06:12] <almoxarife> bullgard: press it and it will install, btw, I assume you want something to do with kubuntu?
[06:12] <bbordwell> bullgard, yes but kexi depends of koffice-libs and koffice-data which both have newer versions in synaptic
[06:13] <mbt> ZykoticK9, Ah, that works, too.  I just remember Control+L because it's the same for Web browsers to get to the location bar; tried it accidentally one day out of habit and it worked so I stuck with it.
[06:13] <bullgard> almoxarife: Yes.
[06:13] <TravisO> Ok, i have the latest crash report
[06:13] <ZykoticK9> mbt, i was using ctrl+l till i found out about /
[06:13] <almoxarife> bullgard: then press the install
[06:13] <mbt> TravisO, k, you'll want to file that as a bug, what's the crash report file name?
[06:14] <TravisO> linux-image-2.6.32-17-generic.129960.crash
[06:14] <TravisO> Reporting it
[06:14] <TravisO> Has this issue been confirmed to exist with the upstream kernel? -- what does that mean?
[06:15] <TravisO> ah
[06:15] <kushalone> GSF1200S: so you don't want me to use APT?
[06:15] <kushalone> I guess I need to download the tar.gz then?
[06:15] <mbt> TravisO, The question is whether or not you have tried with a vanilla (e.g., from the official kernel sources at kernel.org) kernel. You probably haven't.
[06:16] <GSF1200S> kushalone, whatever works works.. I dont use apt for flash because it uses this wrapper..
[06:16] <TravisO> wow, this is a lot of work...
[06:16] <mbt> TravisO, Are you using the ubuntu-bug program to report the bug?
[06:16] <GSF1200S> kushalone, its not gonna hurt anything throwing it in a plugins folder
[06:16] <TravisO> mbt: yes
[06:17] <mbt> It should just let you enter a subject and enter a description, unless they've changed the reporting progress for linux kernel bugs
[06:17] <GSF1200S> you download a tarball from adobe, extract the libflashplayer.so, and place it in the plugins folder (that you create) in /home/user/.mozilla
[06:17] <kushalone> k... done now to restart Firefox (:
[06:17] <TravisO> I'm using Report a Problem
[06:18] <mbt> Oh, I see, they added questions to the report process before hitting LP
[06:18] <mbt> You can just say that you're not willing to test an upstream kernel
[06:18] <TravisO> there we go
[06:18] <mbt> That's a pretty advanced sort of thing to do.
[06:18] <TravisO> yeah
[06:18] <TravisO> This problem report is damaged and cannot be processed.
[06:18] <TravisO> IOError(13, 'Permission denied')]
[06:18] <mbt> Oy.
[06:18] <almoxarife> GSF1200S: why so complicated a way to get flash???? what's wrong with taking the deb from adobe thru synaptic?
[06:19] <mbt> TravisO, What's the owner of the crash report?
[06:19] <kushalone> GSF1200S: success! youtube works now XD
[06:19] <TravisO> owner is kernoops
[06:19] <TravisO> not me
[06:20] <mbt> TravisO, try "chmod 666 /var/crash/THE_CRASH_FILE" and try to report again
[06:20] <kushalone> GSF1200S: Thank you very much. (: BTW, if someone else is trying to do what I did... I went to Help > Troubleshooting info to get to the .mozilla directory
[06:20] <GSF1200S> almoxarife, that would work too I guess, but im not familiar with that method: im on 64bit and dont have that luxury
[06:20] <mbt> TravisO, you will probably need to add a "sudo" in front of that, because I forgot it.  Sorry.
[06:20] <TravisO> yep
[06:20] <TravisO> np
[06:21] <TravisO> I should have caught the permissions
[06:21] <GSF1200S> kushalone: glad it helped.. you can get it from the repos too apparently, im on 64bit so i didnt think of that
[06:21] <TravisO> sorry, brain's fried tonight
[06:21] <bullgard> almoxarife: Great! It works! --  Thank you for your help. --  How can I prevent Update manager to delete this program during its next dist-upgrade? Is there something like "pinning" of packages so that they will not be deleted?
[06:21] <mbt> TravisO, mine too, about to head to sleepyland soon myself.
[06:21] <TravisO> Now I got a different one... [Errno 1] Operation not permitted: '/var/crash/linux-image-2.6.32-17-generic.129952.crash'
[06:21] <mbt> TravisO, Alright, just report the bug directly and attach the gzip'd crash file
[06:22] <TravisO> Sure
[06:22] <almoxarife> bullgard: why would update kill it?
[06:22] <GSF1200S> almoxarife, they freeze the flash release dont they? If he does it this way, he can just put a new flashplayer in the plugins folder when it comes out.
[06:22] <bbordwell> bullgard, in synaptic select the packages and then in the package menu press lock package
[06:22] <kushalone> GSF1200S: previously Ubuntu Software Center said it was installed but Firefox would still not work with any flash.
[06:22] <bbordwell> update manager will no longer update it
[06:23] <mbt> TravisO, I have to head out, but if you subscribe me to the bug, I'll look at it tomorrow and see if I can offer any additional advice
[06:23] <TravisO> How does one manually report?
[06:23] <TravisO> thanks
[06:23] <mbt> TravisO, Just select "Subscribe someone else" and add me, I'm mtrausch (mike
[06:23] <mbt><EMAIL_ADDRESS>on LP
[06:23] <DanaG> argh, ubuntu-arm is rather quiet now.
[06:23] <GSF1200S> kushalone, hmmm.. strange. I would check Synaptic and see what flash package it says is installed, but at least it works for you now :)
[06:23] <mbt> TravisO, Try this link:  https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+filebug
[06:23] <crimsun> DanaG: surprise? they're mostly asleep?
[06:23] <almoxarife> bullgard: the debs you selected that can be updated should be allowed to update, anything that does not have an update is left untouched
[06:24] <TravisO> uploading now
[06:24] <bbordwell> almoxarife, Is he still talking about kexi?
[06:24] <randomusr> anyone here having trouble with Flashplayer on youtube? I use the 64 bit release...
[06:24] <DanaG> oh, right... 10:30 PM on pacific (where I am).
[06:24] <mbt> Night everyone.
[06:24] <SNN> hey guys, the guys in #ubuntu redirected me here. I'm having issues using port 80 on a default installation of 10.04. I did "netstat -l -a -n | grep 80" and it returns nothing. I was told to try to telnet into the port 80 on that server. It was unable to establish a connection. Does anyone have any ideas?
[06:24] <GSF1200S> randomusr: I can help you- what issue are you having?
[06:24] <almoxarife> GSF1200S: that's thing, if you didn't use apt or synaptic it won't show up
[06:25] <almoxarife> bbordwell: I believe so
[06:25] <GSF1200S> almoxarife, he says it said it was installed in Ubuntu Software center, which is apt of course.. I dont know what the issue is on his system, but at least it works now..
[06:25] <bbordwell> almoxarife, I orignaly helped him install it, It depends on old versions of koffice-libs and koffice-data, if update manager updates the packages that he manualy installed it will break it
[06:25] <randomusr> so, the full screen button in youtube doesn't work. Also, moving around to different time on the video, and other flash plugin freezes
[06:26] <bullgard> almoxarife: Because the KDE people want to put Kexi into another programming environment. But they do not have a maintainer that maintains Kexi. So I have to use the old established packages for a while until the KDE people provide new DEB packages via Synaptic.
[06:26] <randomusr> When watching hulu by itself it works just fine
[06:26] <bbordwell> bullgard, did you get my message telling you how to stop update-manager from updating them?
[06:26] <GSF1200S> randomusr: the flash that comes with 64bit ubuntu is some kind of wrapper.. I hate it because it freezes and all kinds of crap- do you use Firefox?
[06:26] <randomusr> I'm using the compatable 32 bit flash plugin as opposed to the 64 bit one
[06:26] <randomusr> yes firefox
[06:27] <almoxarife> bullgard: follow bbordwell advice then, you have a strange setup needing special handling
[06:27] <kushalone> <IP_ADDRESS>ubuntu1 as of right now, GSF1200S
[06:27] <bullgard> bbordwell: I have got it. But I have had no time yet to read it and understand it. Just a minute please.
[06:27] <ZykoticK9> randomusr, are you saying "clicking" in flash isn't working?  or just it's freezing?
[06:27] <randomusr> it would be nice to have a fix. GSF1200S, have you tried installing from adobe?
[06:27] <GSF1200S> randomusr: I use the alpha 64bit plugin from adobe, but I have had NO issues, crashes, or problems
[06:28] <GSF1200S> randomusr: if you want, I can tell you how to make that work
[06:28] <kushalone> flashplugin-installer is installed flashplugin-nonfree is not
[06:28] <randomusr> Zykotick, clicking in general on youtube video, sometimes flash video doesn't load or it hangs when multiple flash is loaded
[06:28] <Imunalia> I think I have a unique problem, my laptops screen fails to turn back on after closing the lid, any suggestions?
[06:28] <GSF1200S> kushalone, hold on.. let me look
[06:28] <bullgard> bbordwell: Synaptic does not provide these packages any more. So I cannot follow your advice.
[06:29] <ZykoticK9> randomusr, if you want to fix clicking not working see http://sites.google.com/site/alucidfs/how-i-do/clicking-in-flash-not-working (these are the directions for 64bit OS)
[06:29] <randomusr> could someone post the non-free repos
[06:29] <gnomefreak> we kept flashplugin-nonfree so people could update Ubuntu releases without causing issues
[06:29] <TravisO> mbt you leave?
[06:29] <GSF1200S> kushalone: yeah, nonfree is just a transitional package.. I dont know whats up if the flash package is installed but not working- at least it works for you now..
[06:30] <randomusr> gnomefreak, do you mean nonfree comes standard?
[06:30] <randomusr> flash that is
[06:30] <bullgard> bbordwell: More exactly: Synaptic does not provide the main package any more. But it provides newer versions of the two library packages. But the Kexi package cannot cooperate with the newer library versions.
[06:30] <GSF1200S> gnomefreak, right.. I see that, im not saying the package is bad :)
[06:31] <bbordwell> bullgard, you will have to re-install them manualy again. do you still have the .debs you downloaded around?
[06:31] <bullgard> bbordwell: Yes.
[06:31] <GSF1200S> randomusr: if you fail to get it working with the other guys help, we can try the alpha flash plugin from adobe.. works great for me.. let me know
[06:31] <GSF1200S> brb guys
[06:31] <randomusr> ok
[06:32] <GSF1200S> randomusr: ill be back in like 5-8 mins
[06:32] <randomusr> mmmk
[06:32] <bbordwell> bullgard, okay first make sure the newer versions are uninstalled in synaptic. then re-install those packages. once that is done lock the packages in synaptic
[06:33] <DebianUT> can anyone tell me how to fix this? http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/ffc9f64d86.png  thx
[06:33] <bazhang> !controls | DebianUT
[06:33] <kushalone> GSF1200S: Correct me if I am wrong but since we are already in beta, does that mean that 10.04 will ship with this error?
[06:33] <bullgard> bbordwell: How does one "lock" a package in Synaptic?
[06:34] <DebianUT> bazhang: Is not about the button location, please take a look to the minimiza button
[06:34] <DebianUT> bazhang: Is messed up
[06:34] <bbordwell> bullgard, select the package, then select the menu called package on the top of the screen. then select "lock version"
[06:34] <randomusr> again, could someone post the nonfree repos? I want to enjoy the multimedia goodness along with all the non-free goodies
[06:35] <bazhang> DebianUT, I looked, you can switch it back to the 'normal' way
[06:36] <DebianUT> bazhang: no no, I don't want to Move Buttons to Right Side
[06:36] <bbordwell> randomusr, update-manager>settings>software sources> you should be able the check the nonfree repositories there
[06:36] <DebianUT> bazhang: I want the minimize button don't look out of place in the them
[06:36] <DebianUT> thene*
[06:36] <DebianUT> bazhang: In the link you can see how the minimize button is not according to the theme
[06:37] <DebianUT> bazhang: This was after a moved the buttons to the right and moved them back to the left
[06:37] <bazhang> DebianUT, I would suspect that is part of the non-finalized decision on the buttons, as this is beta 1 iirc
[06:37] <GSF1200S> randomusr: search google for medibuntu.. but first lets do this flash
[06:37] <bullgard> bbordwell: I have done as you suggested. --  Will my action not interfere with Update Manager's automatic operation next time?
[06:38] <GSF1200S> randomusr: http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/flashplayer10/64bit.html
[06:39] <GSF1200S> download the one under download and discuss
[06:39] <GSF1200S> once downloaded, extract the libflashplayer.so file
[06:39] <randomusr> GSF1200S, i'm over the flash thing, I'll mess around with the available versions to come up with a compromise
[06:40] <GSF1200S> go to /home/user/.mozilla and create a directory called plugins, place libflashplayer.so in that folder, and restart firefox, done
[06:40] <ZykoticK9> DebianUT, how did you move the buttons?  Did you use a PPA to do it?
[06:40] <randomusr> Is there a dummy package/Alias to install most of the non-free codecs and media that one might want?
[06:40] <GSF1200S> randomusr: ok.. easy fix and it should work perfect though.. your call
[06:40] <randomusr> thanks man
[06:40] <tgpraveen12> ubuntu-restricted
[06:41] <ZykoticK9> randomusr, do you mean ubuntu-restricted-extras?
[06:41] <DebianUT> ZykoticK9: I used gconf-editor
[06:41] <randomusr> ZykoticK9, i thought that was just the repository?
[06:41] <ZykoticK9> DebianUT, you minimize and maximize are backwards - the new themes don't allow for that
[06:41] <GSF1200S> ubuntu-restricted-extras or add the repos from medibuntu at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Medibuntu
[06:41] <DebianUT> oh
[06:42] <DebianUT> one sec
[06:42] <ZykoticK9> randomusr, repository?  you mean Medibuntu?
[06:42] <randomusr> And yes I'd like to use the restricted extras, but I want to know if there's a way to install the whole restricted extras using apt-get
[06:42] <randomusr> no no no
[06:42] <ZykoticK9> randomusr, ubuntu-restricted-extras is a package that installs non-free codecs
[06:42] <randomusr> nice
[06:43] <randomusr> how can I enable the repository that they reside in?
[06:43] <DebianUT> ZykoticK9: Thank you, it is the way I wan't it now.
[06:43] <ZykoticK9> DebianUT, glad to help
[06:43] <almoxarife> ubuntu-tweak includes the ppa for adobe flash 64
[06:44] <randomusr> the adobe flash 64 alpha is available to me in the main repos
[06:45] <almoxarife> ubuntu-tweak includes the ppa for adobe flash 64 and medibuntu and a lot of other useful ppa's
[06:46] <randomusr> almoxarife, isn't a ppa just some type of certificate?
[06:47] <randomusr> i really wish my neighbors would stop doing it.....
[06:48] <almoxarife> randomusr: ppa is a source for deb packages outside the main repos
[06:48] <randomusr> meh, why would anyone want that?
[06:48] <voidmage> i know when the default flash on 64 bit crashes it just takes out npviewer and makes the flash objects gray
[06:49] <voidmage> but back when i used 32 it would take down firefox with it
[06:49] <voidmage> how does the 64 bit flash handle crashes?
[06:49] <vish> !schedule
[06:49] <randomusr> voidmage, I had the same problem with the 64 bit and 32 bit flash plugin on 64 bit ubuntu
[06:49] <SNN> Does anyone know why port 80 might be used from a default install of 10.04?
[06:50] <kushalone> I think Firefox 3.7 separates flash as a part of spidermonkey project or something
[06:50] <voidmage> randomusr do you mean that firefox is taken down with flash, or flash objects go gray?
[06:52] <randomusr> the flash area becomes grey without ever playing but this is genereally true for 64 bit
[06:53] <randomusr> although, this occasionally occurs with the 32 bit wrapped version of flash player when using a 64 bit kernel
[06:53] <voidmage> that's what happens for me (64-bit ubuntu 32 bit flash with nspluginwrapper)
[06:53] <randomusr> it sucks, I don't think there's a fix for it
[06:54] <voidmage> i still prefer that to firefox getting taken down with flash which is what happened last time i used ubuntu 32 bit
[06:54] <voidmage> that was back around edgy or feisty though
[06:54] <randomusr> i trade functionality depending on what I want to work in flash
[06:55] <randomusr> voidmage, you should use the 64 bit plugin and scrap the 32 bit wrapped version
[06:55] <voidmage> the important thing to me is that when flash crashes, firefox isn't taken down with it
[06:55] <voidmage> so if the 64 bit plugin starts crashing firefox that's no good for me, i'd rather deal with the gray boxes
[06:55] <randomusr> got rid of boxee damnit
[06:56] <randomusr> nice
[06:56] <randomusr> so boxee doesn't work with 64-bit?
[06:56] <randomusr> that sucks arse
[06:56] <voidmage> i don't know, i don't use boxee
[06:58] <randomusr> don't matter, is just bites that it don't work with 64 bit sorta
[06:58] <randomusr> I'd have to use 32 bit flash i think. weird
[06:59] <randomusr> is there a way to get my system to auto update supported packages without having to authenticate each time?
[07:00] <voidmage> system->administration->software sources->updates
[07:00] <voidmage> there's an option to auto install security updates
[07:00] <voidmage> doesn't look like you can get more specific than that
[07:03] <randomusr> i hope it don't break anything
[07:11] <SNN> mk thanks guys
[07:12] <LLStarks> ayaya
[07:12] <LLStarks> what has keybuk done?
[07:12] <LLStarks> he pulled in plymouth-theme-fade-in
[07:12] <LLStarks> why?
[07:13] <bullgard> Why is indicator-applet not shown on my Lucid computer? The DEB program packages 'indicator-applet' and 'indicator-applet-session' are installed.
[07:14] <voidmage> LLStarks: is that why my screen fades after coming out of lock or screensaver?
[07:15] <voidmage> or is that something else?
[07:16] <LLStarks> no.
[07:29] <jleeperry> does anyone in here know of a good way to convert a full .avi movie to MPEG-4?
[07:31] <genii> ffmpeg
[07:31] <jleeperry> okay.
[07:31] <DanaG> avidemux works, too, if you want a gui.
[07:32] <jleeperry> Okay, thanks much :_
[07:32] <jleeperry> :)
[07:42] <almoxarife> lost the weather condition portion of the date applet, that happen to anyone else?
[08:18] <ZykoticK9> genii, just as an FYI MPEG4 typically uses AAC as the audio and due to bug #374900 ffmpeg can't output AAC currently - Handbrake is a much better suggestion right now
[08:19] <genii> ZykoticK9: Ah, good to know, thanks.
[08:39] <bullgard> Why is indicator-applet not shown on my Lucid computer? The DEB program packages 'indicator-applet' and 'indicator-applet-session' are installed.
[08:42] <gnomefreak> i recall this question hours ago and answered by crimsun
[08:45] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, are you experienced is using gdb to get backtraces?
[08:45] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: depends i have been yes but havent needed to since apport has gotten good at it
[08:47] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, ah I have a bug (not a crash) and the upstream developer at GNOME wanted a backtrace, i did one and he said this
[08:47] <bbordwell> To get a useful stack trace, you'll need to run rhythmbox under gdb with '-D
[08:47] <bbordwell> something' as arguments.  It will then break at the point where it's printing
[08:47] <bbordwell> the error messages about g_object_ref and g_object_unref, which is where I want
[08:47] <bbordwell> a stack trace.
[08:47] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: mainly you need to make sure you have all the needed debug packages
[08:47] <bbordwell> the error messages he was refering to were printed in a terminal
[08:49] <gnomefreak> ok i know its really really early but you still were ablet o confuse me. what was it that you did that you shouldnt have?
[08:50] <bbordwell> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/543892
[08:50] <bbordwell> there is the bug
[08:51] <bbordwell> on there is the error messages that get printed out when i run rhythmbox in a terminal, and in the upstream bug are my backtraces
[08:52] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, I did not know about the debugging symbols when i did the backtrace, i have since installed them
[08:52] <bbordwell> this is my first backtrace and I am not realy sure what the upstream developer is asking me to do
[08:54] <gnomefreak> doesnt apport-collect 543892 work?
[08:55] <gnomefreak> oh and upstream always says ....works for me :)
[08:55] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, I have noticed....
[08:56] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, my apport information is already on the bug
[08:56] <gnomefreak> i still dont see rhythmbox-plug-in-cdrecorder in archives
[08:56] <bbordwell> but since it is not a crash it does not provide a backtrace
[08:57] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, there is no dash between plug and in
[08:57] <gnomefreak> oh good point
[08:58] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: ther eis a wiki on how to create stacktraces (dont recall what it is atm)
[08:58] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, yes thats how i figured out how to do the first one
[08:58] <gnomefreak> but it didnt give you stacktrace did it?
[08:59] <bbordwell> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Backtrace
[08:59] <gnomefreak> mind you ive been up for well over 36 hours
[08:59] <bbordwell> I used that, i made a backtrace which i uploaded to GNOME but the devoloper was unhappy with what i did
[09:00] <bbordwell> well not unhappy, but said i needed to do something else
[09:00] <Dr_Willis> Heh - when are they ever happy.
[09:00] <Dr_Willis> :)
[09:01] <AbortD> whenever i add a new icon to my top bar in gnome it has a white background is there any fix for this
[09:01] <AbortD> i have tried google with no help
[09:02] <gnomefreak> AbortD: karmic support in #ubuntu
[09:02] <AbortD> im in lucid
[09:02] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: did you try https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Strace
[09:02] <AbortD> not karmic
[09:02] <gnomefreak> stack trace is not the same as back*
[09:02] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, I will take a look at it
[09:02] <gnomefreak> AbortD: than what ar eyou using?
[09:03] <AbortD> lucid
[09:03] <gnomefreak> AbortD: why were you asking for suport in #ubuntu for Lucid?
[09:03] <AbortD> cause it helps sometimes
[09:03] <AbortD> but now i need support in here
[09:03] <AbortD> so can you help me
[09:05] <gnomefreak> AbortD: that is not a Lucid bug but more of a theme bug. some icons turn out with white background when applied to a color panel and so on. It would depends on the icon and the theme you are using
[09:05] <shinjitestroch> Any netbook or eee users out there?
[09:05] <gnomefreak> shinjitestroch: best to ask your question
[09:06] <AbortD> there a way i can fix it gnomefreak
 whenever i add a new icon to my top bar in gnome it has a white background is there any fix for this
[09:06] <bbordwell>  i have tried google with no help
[09:06] <Dr_Willis> try different themes.
[09:06] <bbordwell> oops sorry
[09:07] <gnomefreak> AbortD: im not sure that would depend on the exact problem and what has been tried
[09:07] <AbortD> bbordwell, i am asking the same thing
[09:07] <AbortD> what bbordwell said
[09:07] <Dr_Willis> 0_o
[09:07] <AbortD> i changed themes and it works on the high contrast ones
[09:07] <gnomefreak> AbortD: you are using alltray?
[09:07] <AbortD> no
[09:07] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, I am that bothers me....
[09:07] <AbortD> this is gmail notifier
[09:07] <gnomefreak> AbortD: what theme are you using?
[09:08] <AbortD> ambiance
[09:08] <AbortD> it happens in all tray too though
[09:08] <AbortD> with whatever i add
[09:08] <gnomefreak> that is why (most likely) there are a few bugs ont hat theme
[09:08] <gnomefreak> s/ont hat/on that
[09:08] <AbortD> all the dark themes do the same
[09:08] <AbortD> except high contrast
[09:09] <gnomefreak> AbortD: its the light-theme package
[09:09] <gnomefreak> i suggest filing a bug on it but im fairly sure it is already filied however i went through >500 bugs in last 8 hours
[09:10] <ZykoticK9> AbortD, bug #532403
[09:10] <AbortD> looks like im stuck with light themes
[09:10] <shinjitestroch> Ok I upgraded from the update manager and also went through with partial upgrade unwittingly. My fault. So boot into the development version and first message to pop up is plymoth won't connect or something like that. The system then boots into what I'm guessing is xserver but has 10.04 beta at the bottom. I've tried what the people have told me in this forum so far no luck
[09:10] <shinjitestroch> http://forum.eeeuser.com/viewtopic.php?id=84149
[09:10] <gnomefreak> ZykoticK9: thanks saves me a trip
[09:10] <ZykoticK9> gnomefreak, that happens to be a bug i reported the day after light-theme came out
[09:11] <gnomefreak> ZykoticK9: i would remember it too :)
[09:11] <gnomefreak> shinjitestroch: did the commands work for you?
[09:11] <AbortD> it said fix released but no link....
[09:12] <shinjitestroch> Also I have installed and created a new partition, but I cannot find that one in the boot menu. Just xp and the linux option.
[09:12] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  ive often had to go to the console and update/upgrade with 10.04 to get things working.
[09:12] <gnomefreak> update dist-upgrade - install ect...
[09:12] <rabbit1> guys, i am trying with 10.04, will give u lot of bugs, be ready ;)
[09:12] <shinjitestroch> The commands partially workedd I think.
[09:12] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  a new partition to do what?
[09:12] <Mike1> good Morning!
[09:12] <shinjitestroch> A new partition using the Live CD install instead.
[09:12] <Mike1> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/505452 this bug is still affecting me … please fix it! it’s easy!
[09:13] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  if you have a linux entry.. then that is the linux partiion.
[09:13] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  or else we are confused about what you mean
[09:13] <shinjitestroch> It is on the system somewhere on a split partition. I am running on a duel boot system.
[09:13] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:   dual boot = windows and linux. so you are expecting what? a 2nd lnux entry?
[09:13] <shinjitestroch> The Live CD version.
[09:14] <shinjitestroch> Yeah I know sounds silly right.
[09:14] <Dr_Willis> You just said you upgraded..  not installed new.. or did you do both?
[09:14] <shinjitestroch> I upgraded first.
[09:14] <gnomefreak> Mike1: than feel free to fix it if its "easy" as you say
[09:15] <bbordwell> mike1, that bug is marked as triaged, that tells the devolpers that it is ready to be worked on so it should hopefuly get fixed soon
[09:15] <gnomefreak> Mike1: i also think you and shinjitestroch are having same bug. shinjitestroch please confirm
[09:15] <shinjitestroch> Then when that did not work, I figured I try a complete new install side by side with xp and the partially upgraded ubuntu. I have no clue where. Give me  sec to confirm first time in irc I know total nub.
[09:16] <Mike1> bbordwell: but it’s importance is low! :-(
[09:17] <shinjitestroch> I don't think it is the same error.
[09:17] <shinjitestroch> No such device showed once I think.
[09:18] <shinjitestroch> That was before I hit partial upgrade.
[09:18] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  if you want to do a clean install. you could repartition the disk and delete the old linux partitions and let the installer remake them. Or tell the installer to use the old / and swap.
[09:18] <shinjitestroch> Which basically removed all the well very essential packages needed for UI and apps too.
[09:18] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  you cood of tried to fix the upgrded install also.. but that may be  a bigger issue now.
[09:19] <shinjitestroch> Yeah I realize that.
[09:19] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  you have any imporntant stuff on there you want to save?
[09:19] <shinjitestroch> If it is possible to save xp since this is essentially the back up OS I'm using.
[09:19] <gnomefreak> Mike1: low is because its not hindering the use of any running apps
[09:19] <Dr_Willis> deleting the linux partitions will not affect xp
[09:20] <shinjitestroch> Ok, I thought you were thinking of formatting the whole hard drive.
[09:20] <gnomefreak> most theme bugs are low
[09:20] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, his bug is not the theme bug
[09:20] <shinjitestroch> Yeah I have no problem with losing data.
[09:20] <bbordwell> his keyboard is not working correctly
[09:21] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  delete the old linux partitions and let the installer remake them. Or tell the installer to use the old / and swap.
[09:21] <gnomefreak> oh thats right
[09:21] <bbordwell> mike1, what are hotkeys exactly?
[09:21] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: sorry im still wishing to sleep but you can see how well that is working
[09:21] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  or use a /  a /home and a  swap partition. If you want to be fancy :)
[09:21] <AbortD> its high priority
[09:22] <Mike1> bbordwell: the keys for volume up/down, wlan on/off etc.
[09:22] <shinjitestroch> Walk me through, if anything I would like to avoid using the live cd installer since that would require a reboot and takes very long just to get to the desktop.
[09:22] <bbordwell> mike1, the only thing i can tell you is to look at this https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance
[09:22] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  a long time? thats  odd.. takes me all of 30 sec to get to the desktop here on even my old machines
[09:22] <bbordwell> if you feel that according to that that it should be higher than low then post it to ubunut-bugs
[09:23] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  what are you on right now?
[09:23]  * gnomefreak wonders why you are not using latest kernel makes me think update isnt complete
[09:23] <shinjitestroch> XP, the factory version of xp this EEE came with.
[09:23] <bbordwell> mike1, the comment about bugs making the keyboard not working making the bug a high priority do not apply since they are accessory buttons
[09:24] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, maybe they didn't restart?
[09:24] <abhinav> what are the packages required to get ATI non-free drivers working with lucid ? (and compiz on that)
[09:24] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: it can be alot of issues but still a very low kernel and nothing states if a lower version of kernel will boot
[09:24] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:   so.. you are planing on using a WUBI install  or how ecactly do you plan on installing Linux ?
[09:24] <gnomefreak> and so on
[09:25] <Mike1> bbordwell: it’s not just hotkeys though, it makes it impossible to control the hardware of it (turn W-LAN on/off, use Asus SHE, turn Cam on/off, turn Cardreader on/off etc.)
[09:25] <gnomefreak> 7 releases to be off is too much
[09:26] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: mike are you talking abotu bug 505452?
[09:26] <shinjitestroch> First of all delete Linux completely. Then install it using Live CD. It takes awhile though since I'm gonna guess using an external USB dvd/cd drive is going to make the install process slow. Gotta remember these little netbooks don't have a cd drive.
[09:27] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  i always make bootable usb install media with a flash drive to install from
[09:27] <gnomefreak> Mike1: the hot keys not working since it cant load the modules is not a high priority however the booting is different but the correct packages and correct versions need to be installed
[09:27] <Dr_Willis> I have a notebook.  it takes it very little time to boot via the usb setup :)
[09:27] <Dr_Willis> and i find the USB flash installer tobe faster then via cd
[09:28] <ZykoticK9> abhinav, for ATI see (i don't have an ATI card so I don't personally know) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/494699
[09:28] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  so do you have a 10.04 cd? You may want to grab the latest daily build.
[09:28] <shinjitestroch> Heh don't I know flash drives are nice. Mine have essentially run out of write cycles. I have used them as a live cd before. Yes I have the 10.04 cd on a blank dvd if that matters
[09:29] <abhinav> ZykoticK9: I have the latest package. Compiz doesn't work .. not sure what's wrong
[09:29] <Dr_Willis> cd on a dvd? thats weird.
[09:29] <gnomefreak> also can you confirm https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/505452/comments/20 works
[09:29] <ZykoticK9> abhinav, sorry i really can't help with that - no ATI here
[09:29] <abhinav> ZykoticK9: sure, np ..
[09:29] <gnomefreak> these are things that we need to know before we change importance/status ect...
[09:30] <Dr_Willis> You can delete the partitioons from windows if you wanted to. or delete them after you boot the live-cd
[09:30] <shinjitestroch> From windows would be good.
[09:30] <shinjitestroch> I'll go search that now. Didn't think it was possible.
[09:31] <bbordwell> mike1, go to #ubuntu-bugs and write that you think it should be high based on the fact that it causes your laptop built-in wireless not to work, and based on this page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance it should be high
[09:31] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: i gave info that would be helpful to answer beofre it is changed
[09:32] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: Mike1 please update bug with latest package versions and if work around works ect... comment it on bug report
[09:33] <gnomefreak> Setting acpi_osi=Linux  work around being the biggest
[09:33]  * gnomefreak smoke
[09:33]  * bbordwell thinks gnomefreak should sleep instead
[09:34] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: that would be great but i would wake up wife if i cant so smoke is best choice ;)
[09:37] <AbortD> can i revert my theme packages to fix it gnome freak?
[09:37] <AbortD> uninstall and install a older version
[09:39] <Dr_Willis> AbortD:  you are thinking in windows terms
[09:39] <AbortD> hahaha
[09:39] <Dr_Willis> Unnstalling packages do NOT alter the users settings. and if you reinstall a package that has a bug.. well you just reinstalled the buggy bersion
[09:40] <AbortD> reinstalling the older package that doesnt have the bug
[09:40] <Dr_Willis> update/upgrade - see if the bnug vanishes.. also make a new user - see if they hae the issue
[09:40] <Dr_Willis> whats the point in using an olde version when a fix may be hrs away
[09:40] <AbortD> i am up to date
[09:40] <AbortD> maybe not haha
[09:42] <gnomefreak> ok ill make it real easy use the following command and than ask for importance to be bumped. command is apport-collect 505452
[09:43] <AbortD> hm
[09:44] <gnomefreak> fairly simple patch too
[09:46] <AbortD> cant login
[09:48] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, the rhythmbox devel is working now and we are communicating, we seem to be getting somewhere :)
[09:48] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: cool
[09:49] <shinjitestroch> Oh man finding a simple command for deleting the partitions is hard.
[09:49] <almoxarife> anyone else have the vanishing weather applet?
[09:50] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  learn the partioning tools.. dont look formagical commands
[09:50] <bbordwell> almoxarife, Any steps to reproduce?
[09:50] <bbordwell> you mean the weather thing in add to panel?
[09:50] <almoxarife> bbordwell: not that I know of
[09:51] <almoxarife> bbordwell: yeap, that one
[09:51] <almoxarife> bbordwell: maybe not, the weather next to date/time
[09:51] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: almoxarife any chance it is not updating?
[09:52]  * gnomefreak has weather applet and it works but i have seen a few bugs on it not updating
[09:52] <bbordwell> mine just says 0
[09:52] <almoxarife> gnomefreak: mine may have been the single instance
[09:52] <gnomefreak> 39 here
[09:52] <bbordwell> buts its not that cold here
[09:52] <almoxarife> 55f here
[09:52] <shinjitestroch> great windows can't see linux. It only sees itself and the factory settings on the d drive.
[09:52] <shinjitestroch> oh boy!
[09:52] <gnomefreak> 39f here giv eor take
[09:52] <bbordwell> there we go
[09:52] <bbordwell> 37
[09:53] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, where are you located you are a pretty similar temp to me
[09:54] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: norht carolina
[09:54] <gnomefreak> norht even
[09:54] <bbordwell> lol not very close....
[09:54] <gnomefreak> ok north
[09:54] <bbordwell> im in iowa
[09:54] <gnomefreak> yeah not so close
[09:54] <almoxarife> sunny seattle
[09:55] <bbordwell> when i tell people i am from iowa they usualy ask about the potatoes........
[09:55] <bbordwell> then i have to inform them that idaho has the potatoes
[09:55] <gnomefreak> if it wasnt 4:55am here i might have thought of that
[09:55] <almoxarife> bbordwell: how's the corn?
[09:55] <bbordwell> almoxarife, Very good!
[09:56] <Dr_Willis> We got corn here in Indiana. :) and SOybeans.. and Pigs. :P
[09:56] <bbordwell> haha good to see some people know the Midwestern states
[09:56] <bbordwell> Dr_Willis, yep same store here
[09:56] <Dr_Willis> and we are one of the largest producers of Ducks :)
[09:56] <bbordwell> - the ducks
[09:56] <almoxarife> we got barristas here
[09:57] <bbordwell> almoxarife, I feel like that was supposed to be funny but it went completly over my head
[09:57] <gnomefreak> let try to leave "funny" in #ubuntu-offtopic please
[09:57] <almoxarife> bbordwell: barristas=the helpers(usually female) at coffee stands
[09:59] <bbordwell> almoxarife, ah
[09:59] <bbordwell> seattle has lots of bikers right?
[10:00] <Dr_Willis> Nice i9mprovement they made to burning iso files in 10.04 - you can just pop in disk after disk and it keeps making copies. :)
[10:01] <bbordwell> Dr_Willis, are you able to make audio CD's?
[10:01] <bbordwell> not working for me....
[10:01] <Dr_Willis> I rarely try to make Music cd's
[10:01] <Dr_Willis> perhaps 3 a year. :) heh
[10:02] <bbordwell> oddly enough i was able to use the make image function in brasero to make an image of my audio cd, and then burn that to a disk
[10:02] <gnomefreak> maybe try something other than rythmbox it should work great :)
[10:02] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, nope brasero does not work for me either.....unless i use that work around ^
[10:03] <gnomefreak> i cant make an audio cd way too much music to burn so i keep it on a dvd
[10:03] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, do you not have a car?
[10:03] <gnomefreak> gnomebaker still my favorite
[10:03] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, well i guess i use my ipod in my car...
[10:03] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: i have a few cars
[10:03] <gnomefreak> 1 have 3 wife has 1
[10:04] <gnomefreak> s/1/i
[10:04] <bbordwell> nice, i have 1 car + one motorcycle
[10:05]  * gnomefreak still looking for a buyer for my bike but too many more important things have come up but i havent used it in a few maybe 4 years
[10:05]  * bbordwell puts 3x as many miles on my bike than my car
[10:05] <gnomefreak> can we please move non support stuff to #ubuntu-offtopic before i have to remove myself and others
[10:05] <skhater> i have dvb-s twinhan 1027 card and ubuntu 10.4 beta1
[10:05] <ZykoticK9> skhater you might want to see bug #268846 (this is an old, non-lucid bug mind you)
[10:05] <bbordwell> haha sorry
[10:06] <skhater> how can i install that dvb-s
[10:09] <Dr_Willis> if support for it has been removed from the kernel.. well..
[10:09] <Dr_Willis> its possible a kernel update may sometime fix it..
[10:09] <bullgard> Why is indicator-applet not shown on my Lucid computer? The DEB program packages 'indicator-applet' and 'indicator-applet-session' are installed.
[10:10] <gnomefreak> there is a patch but havent looked to see if it is sane or not
[10:10] <shinjitestroch> ok well deleted linux from disk management.
[10:10] <ZykoticK9> Dr_Willis, skhater that's actually an error on my part - different model #
[10:10] <shinjitestroch> Deleted instantly though will be back hopefully.
[10:10] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  would of been faster to learn to use the tools on the live cd i think. :)
[10:11] <shinjitestroch> Yeah probably, but for now being new I should be safe about things you know. What I will do now is reboot and hopefully come back lol.
[10:11] <ZykoticK9> skhater, another old post (that probably doesn't help at all) http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=993967
[10:11] <Dr_Willis> with linu deleted.. xp wont boot.. becuase of no grub files shinjitestroch ....
[10:11] <Dr_Willis> so its going tobe Live cd. or install.. shinjitestroch  :)
[10:13] <shinjitestroch> Wait you are telling me xp won't boot because the boot loader used before linux was deleted by it and replaced by the duel boot loader oh boy so much for sleep.
[10:13] <shinjitestroch> So live cd installing inside windows or what?
[10:14] <Dr_Willis> You just deleted the linux partitions.. that removed the GRUB boot and config files.. but not the grub mbr
[10:14] <Dr_Willis> You now must boot the live cd and install linux.. or restore the windows bootloader  if  you want to get to XP.
[10:14] <kklimonda> good morning
[10:14] <bbordwell> kklimonda, good morning
[10:14] <shinjitestroch> Joy joy.
[10:15] <shinjitestroch> What did you mean by the daily build?
[10:15] <Dr_Willis> !daily
[10:15] <Dr_Willis> a daily build will save you a few 100+mb of downooads/updates after you install
[10:16] <bbordwell> Dr_Willis, plus have the latest version of ubiquity and any of the bug fixes related with it
[10:17] <Dr_Willis> i wonder how daily-live differs from daily
[10:17] <bbordwell> though i suppose there is that new update installer button....
[10:17] <bbordwell> Dr_Willis, it is a live CD
[10:17] <Dr_Willis> yea - thats a nice feature
[10:17] <bbordwell> the other is not
[10:17] <Dr_Willis> so daily = server and alt cd's ?
[10:17] <Dr_Willis> dailyl0live = the desktop cd.
[10:17] <bbordwell> i think just alt
[10:17] <bbordwell> i think server has its own site right?
[10:17] <bbordwell> could be wrong though
[10:18] <shinjitestroch> So what you are saying is one of the files will update the ISO I already have?
[10:18] <shinjitestroch> How is that done?
[10:18] <Dr_Willis> shinjitestroch:  No... the daily build isos are Updated ISO's
[10:18] <Dr_Willis> there is also a feature to update the installer.. but thats  not the same thing
[10:18]  * gnomefreak has script do it for me :)
[10:18] <Dr_Willis> Daily - has not much in it.. daily-build has the iso files for ubuntu
[10:19] <Dr_Willis> but no sign of kubuntu :) or UNR dailies
[10:19] <shinjitestroch> Right so what did you mean by saving me a few 100mb?
[10:19] <Dr_Willis> the iso you hjave installs OLDER versions
[10:20] <bbordwell> shinjitestroch, If you use the daily cd image it is up to date, if you use beta you will have to download all the updates from since beta came out
[10:20] <Dr_Willis> thers 200+mb of updates a day here from what ive seen
[10:20] <gnomefreak> shinjitestroch: if you use zsync or rsync you can download the ISO once than use either one to update it (without re downloading the whole image)
[10:20] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, That sounds realy cool but i have no idea how do do what you just said
[10:21] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: i have a few scripts do it for me
[10:21] <shinjitestroch> Yeah that's what I was thinking of having to download the whole image again.
[10:21] <bbordwell> shinjitestroch, haha good point 200mb for updates is less than 600mb for a new image....
[10:22] <Dr_Willis> im seeint perhaps 200mb a DAY of updates :)  so from beta1 to current may be 500+ mb of updates
[10:22] <Dr_Willis> I dont see a lubuntu daily build. Hmm
[10:22] <bbordwell> dr_willis, many of these are the same packages getting upgraded over and over though
[10:22] <shinjitestroch> Alright downloaded do I just insert cd and open zsync and follow the instructions?
[10:23] <ZykoticK9> my apt-cache since Beta1 is 538MB
[10:23] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: this script does both live nad alt. ISO's you would have to make changes to where they are saved http://paste.ubuntu.com/403700/
[10:23] <gnomefreak> i rather like the rsync scripts more coltrol over them
[10:24] <Dr_Willis> bbordwell:  yep. So your MB may vary :)
[10:24] <gnomefreak> someone else did all the hard work i just update as needed
[10:24] <bbordwell> ZykoticK9, how do you get that value?
[10:24] <st4aluck> My laptop freezes when I switch from AC to battery. On 8.04 I have no problems with it. Can sombody help me please!!!!
[10:24] <Dr_Willis> and openoffice updates are proberly 1/2 the updates
[10:24] <Dr_Willis> st4aluck:  check for bug reports on  the issuye yet?
[10:24] <st4aluck> Dr_Willis: Nop
[10:24] <ZykoticK9> bbordwell, i have a number of VMs so I create a folder with all the updates and copy them to each VM (to easy downloading from server)
[10:25] <gnomefreak> now that i dont think i saw but i have seen some ac->battery bugs
[10:25] <bbordwell> ZykoticK9, ahh
[10:25] <bbordwell> st4aluck, I am looking for a bug report on your issue
[10:26] <st4aluck> Dr_Willis: it's not only on 10.04 but the same on 9.10
[10:27] <st4aluck> bbordwell: Where to send it
[10:28] <bbordwell> you will want to use the command "ubuntu-bug gnome-power-manager" to make a report
[10:28] <gnomefreak> it would be nice to find the app that is causing it so you can use ubuntu-bug to reprort it :)
[10:28] <gnomefreak> ah good chooice
[10:28] <gnomefreak> run it without the "
[10:28]  * gnomefreak back to my script updating
[10:29] <Dr_Willis> I wonder how well Lubuntu is getting along. I dont see it even having a directroy at the daily-build servers
[10:30] <Dr_Willis> wasent it suppsed to be an officially supported variant this release?
[10:30] <gnomefreak> Dr_Willis: yes and i think it is at least since we have packages in our repos
[10:30]  * gnomefreak broke something :(
[10:31] <Dr_Willis> Id like lubuntu more - if it used a different file manager. :)
[10:31] <st4aluck> bbordwell:  I've just tested it on live 8.04 and it works but with live Knoppix which has the same kernel as 10.04 doesn't
[10:31] <AbortD> gnomefreak, it happens to all of my themes if i change the color to the background
[10:32] <AbortD> it will adapt to the default though
[10:32] <gnomefreak> AbortD: that doesnt change much of what i said i dont think just please dont ask me to remember thats really really hard to do atm
[10:33] <bbordwell> st4aluck, are you trying to say it may be a kernel bug?
[10:33] <AbortD> :P remember
[10:33] <gnomefreak> AbortD: bbordwell would remember every word i said i think
[10:33] <AbortD> i remember
[10:33] <AbortD> i tried the command
[10:33] <gnomefreak> not likley a kernel bug
[10:33] <AbortD> it said i wasnt the one that posted the bug
[10:33] <AbortD> i know
[10:33] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: g-p-m uses the kenrel modules i think
[10:33] <bbordwell> st4aluck, does knoppix use GNOME?
[10:34] <gnomefreak> it does
[10:34] <gnomefreak> may not just be gnome
[10:34] <mfraz74> how do i reset the apperance settings back to the defaults for UNR?
[10:34] <Dr_Willis> mfraz74:  i often delete all the config files in my users home.
[10:34] <Dr_Willis> but thats a bit extreme
[10:34] <AbortD> i updated and mythbuntu was installed :P
[10:34] <gnomefreak> mfraz74: system>preferences>appearence  maybe it has use defaults or reset to defaults
[10:35] <bbordwell> Dr_Willis, I seem to remember a bug a while back about GDM not working if you deleted the config fiel
[10:35] <mfraz74> can't see any button that says reset or defaults
[10:35]  * gnomefreak deletes Dr_Willis's homes dir
[10:36] <bbordwell> st4aluck, Perhaps try a kubuntu image and see if it has the same problem.
[10:36] <gnomefreak> mfraz74: than there is a good chance you will need to find where the settings are held
[10:36] <st4aluck> bbordwell: I am on Kubuntu
[10:37] <bbordwell> ahh
[10:37] <bbordwell> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-power-manager/+bug/481312
[10:37] <bbordwell> thats not your bug, but looks like there are some issues with connecting/disconnecting the power
[10:37] <st4aluck> ubottu: it'''s not the same problem. I have no problem here
[10:38] <mfraz74> gnomefreak: i was hoping i wouldn't have to do that
[10:39] <st4aluck> bbordwell: so I have to open new thread then!?!?!
[10:39] <shinjitestroch> Oh boy
[10:39] <shinjitestroch> Install time go...
[10:39] <shinjitestroch> bbs?
[10:39] <bbordwell> st4aluck, you could perhaps comment on that bug report about your problem, could have the same root cause
[10:40] <bbordwell> in which case it would be the same bug with different symptoms
[10:40] <st4aluck> bbordwell: I'll do
[10:40] <yofel> st4aluck: you use KDE?
[10:40] <Imperion> someone explain to me why the hell does my screen change its shape very slightly while I'm using gnome-terminal
[10:41] <bbordwell> yofel, yes he does
[10:41] <Imperion> e.g., when I'm selecting text
[10:41] <st4aluck> yofel: Yes
[10:41] <Imperion> it stretches vertically
[10:41] <yofel> bbordwell: then him commenting on a bug about gnome-power-manager wouldn't make much sense
[10:41] <bbordwell> yofel, good point
[10:41] <st4aluck> yofel: I said I am on Kubuntu but it doesn't matter the gnome is the same
[10:41] <Imperion> at least when it's maximized
[10:41] <yofel> I would either blame linux or pm-utils I guess
[10:42] <mfraz74> is firefox 3.6 going to be updated before release?
[10:42] <bbordwell> mfraz74, yes
[10:42] <mfraz74> good :)
[10:42] <bbordwell> mfraz74, you mean to 3.6.2?
[10:42] <AbortD> well i upgraded lucid from the upgrade manager now it says im booting into mythbuntu
[10:42] <AbortD> i think i may as well go to karmic
[10:43] <mfraz74>  bbordwell: yes that's what i mean. thought that change was a security issue?
[10:43] <bbordwell> mfraz74, the high profile security issue you are thinking of was windows only AFAIK
[10:44] <bbordwell> but yes there were some smaller issues fixed
[10:44] <bbordwell> it is in the works
[10:44] <bbordwell> almost done AFAIK
[10:44] <shinjitestroch> How can I use zsync within windows?
[10:44] <mfraz74> that's good. heard about the security issues, didn't realise they were windows only though
[10:44] <gnomefreak> shinjitestroch: you cant :) you would have to finda  download for it
[10:45] <bbordwell> mfraz74, not all of them but the high profile one in the news was
[10:45] <gnomefreak> shinjitestroch: not sure if ther eis one but that is always a good starting place. IIRC rsync has a win version
[10:45] <bbordwell> mfraz74, 3.6.2 fixed 111 bugs, i think 8 were secruity issues
[10:45] <gnomefreak> please tell me 3.6.2 doesnt refer to firefox version
[10:46] <bbordwell> sure does
[10:46] <bbordwell> mfraz74, was asking about it
[10:46] <gnomefreak> correct answer was no gnomefreak that refers to windows 3.6.2
[10:46] <shinjitestroch> okay here I go hope I don't crash and burn.
[10:46] <gnomefreak> i dont want to have to fix things
[10:46] <gnomefreak> and if it is why isnt 3.6.2 released that is very easy
[10:47] <bbordwell> windows 3.6.2 is that a real thing?
[10:47] <gnomefreak> idk
[10:47] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, yes he was asking if it would be updated
[10:47] <howlymowly> hi poeple...   -->  i get the following error when updating with aptitude right now:    somehow plymouth got currupted?  I already reinstalled the plymouth package.. but no success...   "/var/lib/dpkg/info/ubuntustudio-plymouth-theme.postinst: 10: /usr/sbin/plymouth-set-default-theme: not found"
[10:47] <gnomefreak> firefox 3.6.2 will not be pushed in archives until nss nspr are fixed
[10:47] <gnomefreak> bbordwell: ^^^
[10:48] <bbordwell> gnomefreak, I knew this, mfraz74 is the one looking for that message :)
[10:48] <Dr_Willis> Trying to use the 'usb startup disk creator' tool - Unmount my flash drives . (keeping one plugged in) run the tool.. it then remounts them.. and wont let me reformat  the flash drive. I cant slide the 'live save file' slider either...
[10:48] <Dr_Willis> anyone care to confirm this odd behavior?
[10:48] <ZykoticK9> howlymowly, I think you just need to create a fake file to complete updates "sudo touch /usr/sbin/plymouth-set-default-theme"
[10:49] <ZykoticK9> howlymowly, might need to be set executable as well
[10:49]  * gnomefreak has had 3 people (diff nicks) maybe same user but until nss/nspr are complete we will not be getting updates for it
[10:49] <mfraz74> i got it now!
[10:49] <gnomefreak> i will try to find out monday if i see chris how the progress is
[10:50] <howlymowly> ZykoticK9: but what about the "real" plymouth-set-default-theme then? my plymouthdoes not work, too... will it be fixed in one of the updates?
[10:50] <ZykoticK9> howlymowly, we are all waiting for the "real" fix
[10:50] <howlymowly> ahh..  kk.. i c
[10:57] <bbordwell> ZykoticK9, It did not work at all before the "fake fix"
[10:57] <bbordwell> so much improved :)
[11:01] <gnomefreak> !daily
[11:01] <gnomefreak> hmmm
[11:02] <gnomefreak> well that explains why the script isnt working
[11:05] <gnomefreak> ok seems there is either a problem with the alt. ISOs or they moved. waiting for a response atm
[11:06] <bbordwell> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/20100327/
[11:06] <bbordwell> couple of days old but its there
[11:08] <mfraz74> that's only yesterday
[11:12] <gnomefreak> that == too much work for tonight
[11:12] <gnomefreak> i have live ISO to fall back on
[11:14] <st4aluck> bbordwell: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=9039341#post9039341
[11:19] <parag0n> does anyone else have a problem with passwd not working?
[11:19] <parag0n> i cant create a new user, change any user's passwords or anything
[11:20] <parag0n> this is ubuntu desktop i386, upgraded to lucid from karmic
[11:21] <yofel> parag0n: do you get an error?
[11:22] <parag0n> parag0n@Sylveste:~$ sudo passwd
[11:22] <parag0n> passwd: System error
[11:22] <parag0n> passwd: password unchanged
[11:22] <yofel> why do you use sudo?
[11:22] <parag0n> to change the root password
[11:23] <yofel> you're not supposed to have a root password
[11:23] <yofel> use sudo -i if you need a root shell
[11:23]  * gnomefreak gets the feeling he thinks root and sudo are same
[11:23] <parag0n> i need direct login to the root account, because my account's panel is broken
[11:23] <gnomefreak> well thats a bad idea
[11:23] <parag0n> so i need ot remove my account and recreate
[11:23] <parag0n> then relock the root account
[11:24] <parag0n> either way, passwd is still broken, i cant create a user, change any users password or anything
[11:24] <parag0n> parag0n@Sylveste:~$ passwd
[11:24] <parag0n> Changing password for parag0n.
[11:24] <parag0n> (current) UNIX password:
[11:24] <parag0n> passwd: System error
[11:24] <parag0n> passwd: password unchanged
[11:25] <parag0n> parag0n@Sylveste:~$ sudo adduser test
[11:25] <parag0n> Adding user `test' ...
[11:25] <parag0n> Adding new group `test' (1002) ...
[11:25] <parag0n> Adding new user `test' (1002) with group `test' ...
[11:25] <parag0n> Creating home directory `/home/test' ...
[11:25] <parag0n> Copying files from `/etc/skel' ...
[11:25] <parag0n> passwd: System error
[11:25] <parag0n> passwd: password unchanged
[11:25] <parag0n> anything that uses it fails
[11:26] <yofel> !paste | parag0n
[11:34] <penguin42> hello from summer time
[11:34] <yofel> passwd seems indeed broken o.O
[11:35] <yofel> hi penguin42
[12:09] <KatieKitty> guys, the final release of lucid, the window buttons will still be at the left?
[12:09] <kklimonda> yes
[12:09] <oxymoron> Why on left side if I may ask?
[12:09] <KatieKitty> so the design team refuse to change it back to right?
[12:10] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: refusal would implicate that there is someone in power who wants it changed
[12:11] <KatieKitty> so this means mark has decided not to change it back to right?
[12:11] <jibadeeha> i heard they have moved them to the left to make space for something on the right
[12:12] <KatieKitty> jibadeeha: that is some useless changes.....
[12:12] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: at this time changing this for 10.04 is almost impossible anyway
[12:12] <BUGabundo> m0rning
[12:12] <jibadeeha> KatieKitty, you can move to the right with gconf setting
[12:13] <KatieKitty> jibadeeha: or i can go back to debian........
[12:13] <jibadeeha> http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/13535/move-window-buttons-back-to-the-right-in-ubuntu-10.04/
[12:13] <oxymoron> jibadeeha: Interesting, wonder what its gonna be :)
[12:13] <KatieKitty> it is sad to see this......
[12:13] <jibadeeha> well that is your choice KatieKitty
[12:13] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: or you could change theme
[12:14] <jibadeeha> oxymoron, yeah i can't think of anything useful that they could place on the right
[12:14] <KatieKitty> it is sad to see he community's voice is no longer be heard....
[12:14] <jibadeeha> KatieKitty, ubuntu is not a democracy
[12:14] <oxymoron> If the creator/developer for plymouth on *ubuntu or logo design is here, thank you man/woman your awesome. Finally *buntu going to look better than Windows on bootup
[12:15] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: not really, community voice is overrated
[12:15] <oxymoron> jibadeeha: They could be kind of creative on ubuntu team :P Hopefully standard icon size of the window buttons will be larger.
[12:16] <oxymoron> jibadeeha: I know you can change it yourself, but I personally think default settings should be perfect from the beginning that adept to the largest audience
[12:16] <jibadeeha> oxymoron, i really like the new wave theme and the button icons they used for that theme ... just wish the menu's were a dark gray
[12:17] <kklimonda> oxymoron: largest audience don't really care about it that much
[12:17] <jibadeeha> oxymoron, agree ... wish they would default the buttons to the right
[12:18] <oxymoron> kklimonda: No, but it make it difficult and an annoying moment to fix it. Factory settings could be nice, and doesnt have to look like I dont know ...
[12:18] <kklimonda> oxymoron: they are nice
[12:18] <jibadeeha> i also like the title text to be in the centre
[12:18] <oxymoron> jibadeeha: I havent see the new themes, maybe its time to test ubuntu soon if its gonna look better than kubuntu, but I doubt that :P
[12:19] <oxymoron> kklimonda: They are not nice, especially not in Kubuntu
[12:19] <kklimonda> oxymoron: that's a different distribution
[12:19] <KatieKitty> it is sad to see that the community's voice is no longer be heard......
[12:19] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Yeah, but same core and almost the same concept except for Gnome vs KDE
[12:20] <kklimonda> oxymoron: that doesn't really make sense - GNOME vs KDE is all that really matters
[12:20] <oxymoron> btw, does somebody know how to remove grub from mbr on hdd?
[12:20] <KatieKitty> everyone wants it go back to be at the right side, but ubuntu now has not listen to the community anymore.....
[12:20] <jibadeeha> KatieKitty, it is only the positioning of a set buttons - does it really matter that much?
[12:20] <kklimonda> those are two different platforms for developers and users
[12:20] <KatieKitty> jibadeeha: yes
[12:20] <jibadeeha> KatieKitty, why?
[12:20] <kklimonda> because!
[12:20] <jibadeeha> because of what?
[12:20] <kklimonda> change is bad yadda yadday
[12:20] <KatieKitty> jibadeeha: it shows that the developers do not care about the community
[12:21] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Whats the difference?
[12:21] <jibadeeha> KatieKitty, i don't think that is true
[12:21] <topyli> the developers are the community. fyi
[12:21] <kklimonda> oxymoron: everything - Ubuntu is a distribution by Canonical and Kubuntu is a community project based on Ubuntu
[12:21] <KatieKitty> jibadeeha: but now it is the facts already.....
[12:21] <jibadeeha> how is it fact?
[12:21]  * oxymoron is happy that developers finally understand GUI does actually matter the experience of *buntu
[12:21] <KatieKitty> kklimonda: the community consist of the users as well.....
[12:22] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Yeah, almost the same in other words ;)
[12:22] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: yes - but "users" as whole have no expertise to make decisions
[12:23] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: FLOSS projects have always been a meritocracies of sort - if you want your voice to be heard prove that it's worth hearing
[12:23] <jibadeeha> KatieKitty, do you think debian works any different in terms of community?
[12:23] <KatieKitty> kklimonda: not everyone accepted to be the developers anyway.....
[12:24] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: what do you mean?
[12:25] <KatieKitty> kklimonda: nothing....
[12:26] <bazhang> !controls
[12:26] <kklimonda> we should add that they are on the left only in the default theme
[12:27] <bazhang> kklimonda, care to suggest an edit to the factoid
[12:28] <fetkmg> You can change it in the GUI with ubuntu tweak
[12:28] <bazhang> fetkmg, is that part of Ubuntu, or a 3rd party
[12:29] <fetkmg> http://ubuntu-tweak.com/
[12:29] <bazhang> 3rd party then
[12:29] <nigelb> bazhang, 3rd party
[12:30] <bazhang> nigelb, thanks :)
[12:30] <KatieKitty> although the default theme only have the buttons at the left
[12:30] <KatieKitty> but this will cause a lot of new users not able to adapt to the changes and decides to not even try ubuntu at all....
[12:30] <bazhang> KatieKitty, not really a support issue
[12:31] <kklimonda> !controls is In Lucid you may notice that the default theme has window controls (min/max/close) on the left side. | For more information please see http://alturl.com/yvgv | To change it back to right side either change the theme or see http://alturl.com/x5d6 for how to change button location and order using the terminal.
[12:31] <nigelb> you need a <reply> ?
[12:31] <KatieKitty> kklimonda: users who are not familiar with this will not even care to search for this......
[12:32] <bazhang> yep, can add no problem :)
[12:32] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: it's for us
[12:32] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: so we don't have to type it every time someone asks the question
[12:32] <bazhang> KatieKitty, join the mailing list or #ubuntu-offtopic please
[12:32] <nigelb> KatieKitty, you can talk about in on the ayatana mailing list if you want.  this is not the place, please
[12:32] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: and if users are not willing to accomodate this change then Ubuntu (and Linux desktop) have way bigger problems
[12:32] <KatieKitty> ok
[12:33] <KatieKitty> kklimonda: only ubuntu, not others that is using gnome... :P
[12:33] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: if users are not able to change such a small habit then they won't be able to use Linux at all.
[12:34] <KatieKitty> kklimonda: it is changes to adapt for ubuntu only in this case, not other distros....
[12:34] <KatieKitty> ppl do not expect they have to threat ubuntu like Mac while closing a window....
[12:34]  * yofel doesn't get why ubuntu has to look like every other distro out there
[12:35] <KatieKitty> we are penguins, we are not fruit....
[12:35] <bazhang> !ot
[12:35] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: I see no difference - Ubuntu is not "yet another linux distribution", we want to change the way that people see linux on desktops
[12:35] <kklimonda> bazhang: is it really that offtopic?
[12:35] <kklimonda> we should have a #ubuntu-future channel probably
[12:35] <bazhang> kklimonda, seems to be so, as it is more meta, than support
[12:35] <kklimonda> or #ubuntu-advocacy
[12:35] <bazhang> ubuntu-gripes
[12:35] <yofel> bazhang: this is a discussion channel too
[12:35] <kklimonda> bazhang: it's a discussion about development release though
[12:36] <[TGA]> hiho/2
[12:37] <KatieKitty> i really hope that the design team do consider about what the ppl suggest for change it back to right side...
[12:37] <KatieKitty> coz myself do not hope that ubuntu loses support from the ppl and hop back to debian or knopix
[12:37] <yofel> KatieKitty: there is a bug about making it theme-dependent, then you can just change the theme if you don't like it
[12:38] <void^_> are they going to make this themeable now, or is it going to remain on the level of dirty metacity workarounds?
[12:38] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: they won't consider what people suggests - they will consider raw data that they are able to gather
[12:38] <kklimonda> yofel: it's already done
[12:38] <KatieKitty> yofel: this is not the issue of personal preference....
[12:38] <yofel> KatieKitty: it is...
[12:38] <yofel> kklimonda: oh, didn't know :)
[12:39] <oxymoron> I have installed grub 1.98 but when do grub-install -v I got (grub-install (GNU GRUB 1.97+experimental), is that correct? :S
[12:39] <cemc> how can I disable hdd spindown on a laptop ?
[12:39] <KatieKitty> it seems like there will be no way to change the design team's decision already rite?
[12:39] <cemc> I mean I don't want it to put hdparm -B128 when on battery
[12:39] <yofel> oxymoron: it says grub-install (GNU GRUB 1.98-1ubuntu2) here
[12:40] <kklimonda> oxymoron: not really
[12:40] <kklimonda> so lahggy..
[12:41] <oxymoron> yofel: Weird, what could that be? I just removed grub from mbr and reinstalled but yet I got the 1.97~experimental :S
[12:41] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: you will be always able to override the theme setting using gconf
[12:42] <yofel> oxymoron: what does $ apt-cache policy grub-pc    tell you for the installed version?
[12:43] <oxymoron> yofel: 1.98-1ubuntu2
[12:43] <yofel> o.O
[12:43] <yofel> then it shouldn't say 1.97...
[12:44] <KatieKitty> kklimonda: i know, but the default settings is wat i am talking about
[12:44] <devilsadvocate_> its not about 'looking like every other distro out there'. its more about not changing stuff for the _only_ reason that its different from or the same as  something else. if its better usability wise to have it on this side, then fine. otherwise changing it is retarded
[12:44] <devilsadvocate_> kklimonda, gconf is not usable
[12:44] <oxymoron> yofel: I know before I installed experimental once from grub repository and then it got like ***~experimental ... Where is every single file you should delete to completly remove grub?
[12:45] <oxymoron> yofel: Do you know where the grub version number is stored. that one that get in grub title bar on bootup?
[12:45] <yofel> no, I don't know that much about grub
[12:45] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: the default belongs to developers and dx team members to decide - they are going to be wrong but what Ubuntu and Linux in general need is for someone to take a lead in making new, interesting changes
[12:45] <kklimonda> KatieKitty: you should probably read http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/330
[12:46] <oxymoron> yofel: Its really strange, I have like removed files and grub completly once and reinstalled but still got that.
[12:46] <kklimonda> devilsadvocate_: it's (and ubuntu-tweak) is enough for those who are really offended by Canonical making any decision - other are just going to accept it.
[12:47] <devilsadvocate_> kklimonda, is there any published justification as to _how_ this is better? it represent a major diversion both from upstream and from general user expectation
[12:49] <oxymoron> Is it risky to remove the whole /boot folder? :D I want to remove grub and all kernels and reinstall them?
[12:49] <kklimonda> it's major? huh.. but no, I haven't seen any justification nor do I think they have to justify their decision - that's probably the difference. I believe that they are the best people to do the job available so I'm going to trust them.
[12:49] <devilsadvocate_> oxymoron, thats a rather risky proposition. why do you want to do it?
[12:50] <oxymoron> devilsadvocate_: My partition /dev/sdc doesnt boot and the grub version is faulty in mbr or some setting somewhere. I want to cleanup and reinstall the kernels and grub2 from scratch to maybe get boot into Lucid work.
[12:51] <devilsadvocate_> kklimonda, IMO any changes from upstream should be limited to branding and distro level integration fixing efforts, and not changes that really mess with how upstream works. everything else should be pushed upstream as soon as possible. there is enough entropy in the linux world as it is
[12:51] <devilsadvocate_> kklimonda, we all know what happened with xubuntu's xfce
[12:52] <oxymoron> devilsadvocate_: If I remove, do I remove the kernels completly then? I am in chroot on /dev/sdc2 on LiveCD now, would it still be possible to do apt-get or dpkg if I remove kernels?
[12:53] <devilsadvocate_> oxymoron, it will, but i dont know whether reinstalling the kernels would go smothly
[12:53] <devilsadvocate_> oxymoron, i'dd suggest just reinstalling grub
[12:53] <yofel> oxymoron: you would have to mount the chroot like your system is set up usually
[12:53] <kklimonda> devilsadvocate_: but Ubuntu have never been a "yet another distribution" - we are trying to create something new and appealing to users who are not familiar with Linux. There is only that much you can do without "messing" with upstream.
[12:53] <oxymoron> devilsadvocate_: I have tried just to reinstall grub but it doesnt work, still same error
[12:54] <yofel> oxymoron: but as devilsadvocate_ says, purging grub and the kernels will propably not go smooth, apt might remove a lot of other stuff (use dpkg --force-depends maybe)
[12:54] <penguin42> oxymoron: I'm curious, this is your sdc, what have you got on sda and how exactly do you install grub?
[12:54] <penguin42> (and sdb for that matter)
[12:54] <devilsadvocate_> kklimonda, all i'm saying is making it better is different from making it 'different'. if this is indeed better, then go ahead. but i dont see _how_ this is better or any data suggesting that it is better
[12:54] <oxymoron> yofel: I was thinking of remove the files manually and not in apt or dpkg
[12:55] <yofel> oxymoron: BAD idea
[12:55] <devilsadvocate_> kklimonda, i hope the decision was not brought about by developers who are as used to OSX as their users are to Windows, bcasue if that is the case this is a train wreck waiting to happen
[12:55] <yofel> oxymoron: better purge the packages, it might not be the files on /boot bug some config file or whatever that's broken
[12:56] <yofel> s/bug/but/
[12:56] <oxymoron> penguin42: sda is my sandbox partition, sdc is my default one that is messed up after karmic => lucid, sdb and sdd are storage disks. I have tried to remove grub with # dd if=/dev/null of=/dev/sdX bs=446 count=1 and rm -r /boot/grub and also apt-get remove grub*
[12:57] <penguin42> oxymoron: But this arrangement used to work on karmic?
[12:57] <penguin42> oxymoron: That dd needs to be if=/dev/zero not null
[12:57] <oxymoron> yofel: Yes, I wonder where that config file is ... somewhere its some grub config file that doesnt disappear if I remove grub with dpkg
[12:57] <kklimonda> devilsadvocate_: it was not and it was accepted by Shuttleworh anyway before it got published. Apparently the DX team was able to convince him that this change is worth trying
[12:57] <kushalone> Hey guys, Could someone please verify is the little triangle to sort data in the system monitor in 10.04b is in correct order? Thanks
[12:58] <yofel> oxymoron: do you remove or purge the packages? removing them will leave the config files in place
[12:58] <oxymoron> penguin42: Yeah kind of worked, but I still got 1.97~experimental which is wrong even on Karmic, it should be 1.97~beta4
[12:58] <oxymoron> penguin42: Oh, well I googled that and it said null, but why zero?
[12:58] <penguin42> oxymoron: I wonder if it's installing it on the right disk
[12:59] <oxymoron> yofel: I have tried both purge and remove
[12:59] <penguin42> oxymoron: Reading /dev/null gives you nothing, therefore you can't write it anywhere, reading /dev/zero gives you a stream of 0's and that command would then write 446 of them to the start of the disk
[12:59] <oxymoron> penguin42: Do you know whats code 449 is?
[12:59] <oxymoron> 446*
[13:00] <oxymoron> penguin42: And yeah it should be installed on right disks.
[13:00] <penguin42> oxymoron: Not 100% sure - I *think* it might be everything in the boot sector except the partition table; do you want to wipe the whole partition disk or very carefully just grub?
[13:00] <oxymoron> penguin42: I though have grub on both sda and sdc
[13:00] <oxymoron> penguin42: ONly grub, not the partition table then it should be code 512
[13:00] <oxymoron> refered to google ...
[13:00] <penguin42> yeh
[13:01] <oxymoron> 446 just say to go to beginning and change mbr I think
[13:02] <oxymoron> yofel: How would you remove grub2, which command? should I do apt-get remove --purge grub*
[13:02] <devilsadvocate_> oxymoron, nake sure you have all your backups first
[13:02] <yofel> either apt-get purge or dpkg --purge
[13:02] <devilsadvocate_> oxymoron, dd to the start of disk an things of that sort are quite  ... risky
[13:04] <Dr_Willis> how to trash your system - method #4 - mistakes while using dd. :)
[13:04] <oxymoron> devilsadvocate_: Yeah, I dont save anything on my OS partitions ;) That I have learned by years, isolate OS disks from important data except apps then of course
[13:05] <oxymoron> devilsadvocate_: But I copy my home folder now just in case
[13:05] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: lol :D
[13:08]  * oxymoron wonders if its possible to boost speed of moving/copying files on hdd? He wants at least 100 MB/s
[13:08] <Dr_Willis> with enought $$$ yes
[13:08] <Dr_Willis> :)
[13:09] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: I meant mostly software-wise :P Of course with power raptor or sdd disks ... but I wonder SATA2 should in theory support like 600 MB/S but I only get like 30 MB/S
[13:09] <Dr_Willis> i think all those #'s are highly inflated
[13:09] <Dr_Willis> marketing
[13:09] <Dr_Willis> :)
[13:10] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: How do you mean? :P
[13:10] <jussi01> FYI:
[13:10] <jussi01> !currentissues
[13:11] <yofel> jussi01: thx, btw: is it possible to get channel specific factoids in a query?
[13:12] <jussi01> yofel: yes: !factoid-#channel
[13:14] <oxymoron> jussi01: Btw, if the buttons are on left, you have to change that thing when drag the mouse pointer to upper left corner it goes into that windows selection mode :P
[13:15]  * penguin42 isn't sure but I do wonder if the reason for the change was the notify-osd messages covering the buttons
[13:15] <Dr_Willis> i doubt it penguin42
[13:16]  * jussi01 has no idea, isnt a devloper and doesnt have any input in it.
[13:16]  * oxymoron wonders if the full title bar will be used sometime in the OS history xD
[13:16] <jussi01> I dont even use gnome, so it doesnt even affect me. Now, back to Lucid support?
[13:16] <kklimonda> penguin42: notify-osd has already been changed in karmic to display non-sync notifications a bit lower because of that (and firefox search bar)
[13:17] <kklimonda> penguin42: so I'm pretty sure it had nothing to do with the change
[13:17] <penguin42> kklimonda: Yeh it always still seems to be above where my buttons are :-)
[13:17] <kklimonda> penguin42: heh
[13:18] <oxymoron> jussi01: Yeah, you could explain for me what should happen after plymouth cool video loading? :P For me last time tried the loader goes really slow and took like 10 minutes to go 100% and then it just freezes and the video doesnt end and desktop doesnt hook and chainload after plymouth :P
[13:18] <kklimonda> heh, I have to force fsck to see plymouth at all :/
[13:19] <penguin42> oxymoron: That shouldn't happen - it should take a handful of seconds
[13:19] <oxymoron> kklimonda: For me the problem that plymouth didnt appear was that quiet splash command wasnt added to kernel boot xD
[13:19] <kklimonda> oxymoron: for me it's entirely about the speed of the boot
[13:20] <kklimonda> it's just too fast ;)
[13:20] <oxymoron> penguin42: Yes I know, but I wonder why it do that in the first place :P Would be cool in plymouth if you could press a button "see chain info command lines" and then get a info window somewhere when you see exactly what happens on bootup, I would like that :)
[13:20] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Haha, how fast ? :P
[13:20] <penguin42> yeh it's always nice to know what's going on
[13:21] <kklimonda> oxymoron: no idea, don't have bootchart installed right now
[13:21] <kklimonda> oxymoron: but probably under 20 seconds
[13:21] <kklimonda> (it was 17 last time I've had bootchat installed)
[13:21] <oxymoron> kklimonda: I just wonder if it was a huge change since karmic :P
[13:21] <kklimonda> 17 seconds to the idle desktop
[13:22] <kklimonda> one thing I hate is that plymouth doesn't kick in until ureadahead is done reading files.
[13:22] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Hopefully the desktop bootstrap will be improved as well, I know there is something going on for KDE anyway to vastly improve speed
[13:22] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Yeah, you mean that second the screen is black? :P
[13:24] <kklimonda> oxymoron: for me it's a full 7 or 8 seconds of black screen with only blinking cursor, then kms kicks in, a moment later plymouth and X
[13:24] <oxymoron> Then I dont understand why befoere when you dont get splash and see command lines instead, you always get a lot of errors and messages, why is it so?  But strange plymouth doesnt start if you dont have splash command :P
[13:27] <kklimonda> udev messages are bugs in rules
[13:27] <kklimonda> i wonder why
[13:27] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Bug or not, I hate error messages no mather if I see them or not :P
[13:28] <oxymoron> Ignorance is a bless though, but mostly these days my brain have learned how to world works with hacks and errors behind the scenes everywhere, no matter its in the computer world or anywhere else
[13:28] <oxymoron> *the world
[13:29] <eagles0513875> heyo odyi
[13:29] <eagles0513875> whoops wrong person
[13:29] <eagles0513875> heyo oxymoron
[13:29] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: Hi there :)
[13:29] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: Any success with lucid for ya?
[13:29] <eagles0513875> i gave up
[13:29] <eagles0513875> ill wait till its released
[13:29] <eagles0513875> at least im on it on a virtual machine
[13:30] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: I am to stubborn to give up, I just sit with this until I either understand the whole bootup process or make it work.
[13:30] <eagles0513875> rofl
[13:31] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: Hopefully beta2 in lucid will fix some problems, I guess they hold the packages and not release them yet to beta1 as updates :P
[13:31] <kklimonda> they don't
[13:31] <eagles0513875> oxymoron: http://www.debianhelp.co.uk/boot.htm
[13:31] <eagles0513875> how the boot process works lol
[13:31] <eagles0513875> oxymoron: they only hold the packages if there is a problem
[13:31] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Alright, nobody have fixed plymouth and all that in other words? :P
[13:32] <eagles0513875> what doesnt make sense is whey mountall for me wants to pull libplymouth2 if i dont even have an nvidia in this particular machine
[13:32] <eagles0513875> or is plymouth not just for nvidia
[13:32] <kklimonda> oxymoron: it's not broken
[13:32] <kklimonda> oxymoron: if it's broken in your configuration then you should report it
[13:33] <oxymoron> kklimonda: No, but the interaction between the protocols are ...
[13:33] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Sorry to say but I am to lazy and bored by reporting bugs so I have quit doing it.
[13:34] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: No plymouth isnt nvidia specific ;)
[13:34] <eagles0513875> ok i thought it was
[13:34] <kklimonda> oxymoron: then you don't really have the right to complain, do you?
[13:34] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: And what I meant with bootup process I meant how the stages work programming wise :P
[13:35] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Mostly things in the world arent "right", so it doesnt matter if I have the right to "complain" or not, I do it anyway :D
[13:35] <eagles0513875> ahh oxymoron take a look at the source code for example grub and other steps in the boot process
[13:35] <kklimonda> oxymoron: pfff,
[13:35] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: Where to find grub source code?
[13:36] <kklimonda> oxymoron: you are just wasting our time then.
[13:36] <penguin42> oxymoron: apt-get source grub
[13:36] <eagles0513875> apt-get source hehe is ur friend
[13:36] <eagles0513875> grub2 to be exact penguin42
[13:36] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: Actually I tried to understand kernel source before, but there I actually give up, to many thousand of code lines ...
[13:36] <eagles0513875> hehe
[13:37] <oxymoron> kklimonda: Maybe someone else have the time to report bug ... I just ask, and not only wineing of the bugs :P I want to fix them
[13:37] <oxymoron> penguin42: Thank you :)
[13:38] <eagles0513875> oxymoron: why not if you have the programming ask in ubuntu-motu for mentoring if not then hang tight
[13:39] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: I dont know really :P If I dont get this working I actually might :P
[13:40] <oxymoron> eagles0513875: I just have to get enough pissed first :D rofl xD
[13:41] <oxymoron> I would like to provide with design, programming IM-client, fix grub once and for all, polish the look and interface overall, make things a lot faster and otimize code
[13:42] <Dr_Willis> grub2 is the first step in 'fixing grub' :)
[13:42] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: Yeah, grub2 go way to slow it has been developed so long that someone else could have done the grub3 in the meanwhile :P
[13:43] <Dr_Willis> GrubVista
[13:43] <oxymoron> Haha grubvista :D
[13:43] <oxymoron> would be nice having a common mbr and bootstrap for Mac, WIndows and Linux :) Then it could be freaking awesome :)
[13:44] <oxymoron> Lucid have 1.98-1 of grub I think, does somebody know whats left to code?
[13:45] <Dr_Willis> themes
[13:45] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: Only themes? :P
[13:45] <Umeaboy> Is GRUB going to become graphical soon?
[13:45] <Umeaboy> Not textbased.
[13:45] <fetkmg> Are the new themes, ambiance and radiance, a WIP? As I noticed many sore spots.
[13:46] <Dr_Willis> its allready themable Umeaboy  but those features are still in testing . andi belive left out of theubuntu versions
[13:46] <Dr_Willis> fetkmg:  this is beta1 :) everything is a WIP
[13:46] <penguin42> Dr_Willis: What makes you say it's become themable? I know there is a patch for it flying around but I didn't think the patch had gone very far
[13:46] <Umeaboy> Dr_Willis: Okey.
[13:47] <Umeaboy> What do I have to do to theme it?
[13:47] <Dr_Willis> penguin42:  ive seen PPAs for the patched version and screenshots.. but i dont worry to much about  eyecaney like that
[13:47] <Umeaboy> I'd like to discuss a matter......a small matter.
[13:47] <penguin42> Dr_Willis: Ah yeh
[13:47] <Dr_Willis> Umeaboy:  theres patched/updated ppa's of grub2 with the versions that has some theme features
[13:47] <Umeaboy> It's a suggestion for the upcoming installer in Ubuntu.
[13:47] <droke> Hello, are there any news regarding fglrx in Lucid. I see the package is considered low urgency :(
[13:47] <penguin42> Dr_Willis: I'm not sure if there are any movement to it going in either an official package or upstream
[13:48] <Dr_Willis> Umeaboy:  i doubt if that features going to get added.
[13:48] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: Do you think its possible to combine grub and plymouth and make them interact someway?
[13:48] <Dr_Willis> Perhaps in the nect release
[13:48] <Dr_Willis> oxymoron:  personally I remove Pymouth
[13:48] <Umeaboy> Could someone make it possible to inside the installation remove panels from the enviroment & change colours?
[13:48] <fetkmg> So we have a music store now, when does the book store arrive?
[13:48] <Umeaboy> A friend of mine installed Ubuntu on his computer.
[13:49] <Umeaboy> His OLDER computer.
[13:49] <Umeaboy> The thing is.
[13:49] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: I like watching the video effects while waiting :) WOuld be cool having a time counter, is that possible? I mean like, its 27 seconds left ...
[13:49] <Umeaboy> He's a bit stubborn.
[13:49] <penguin42> oxymoron: It's really difficult to predict times
[13:49] <fetkmg> including books in the public domain.
[13:49] <Umeaboy> Stubborn when it comes to seeing things as they are.
[13:50] <oxymoron> penguin42: Well, isnt it possible to make statistics from each individs computer and predict upstart time from that?
[13:50] <Glowball> I have tried two alpha versions and now the beta 1, and none of them are even booting in Virtualbox - I got the purple splash screen, but then it gets stuck at a black window with a white _ (unable to type anything), while my processors are driving crazy
[13:50] <oxymoron> penguin42: Which mean first times it doesnt show time left, but after 3 times maybe :P
[13:50] <Dr_Willis> oxymoron:  proberly is/will be.. but  sounds like more for me to disable :)
[13:50] <Glowball> (I haven't tried to actually burn it to a cd and try the live edition though)
[13:50] <Umeaboy> In short, he was not happy with the colour of the desktop even thou he could change it.
[13:50] <penguin42> oxymoron: Yeh, even so it's not necessarily that accurate, and if you tell people there's 20 seconds left and it takes 30 people feel disappointed, but if you double it to 40 to be sure people aren't happy either!
[13:51] <Umeaboy> He complaint about the colour orange. He complained about have two panels.
[13:51] <oxymoron> penguin42: Haha yeah, or maybe the one thing I said before, see whats going on in the background, that would calm me down :)
[13:51] <oxymoron> Umeaboy: Install Kubuntu for him instead ;)
[13:51] <Umeaboy> I can't remember if he didnät complain about something at all.
[13:51] <droke> Which kernel is currently supported by the pre-release fglrx drivers in edgers? 2.6.32 only?
[13:52] <penguin42> Umeaboy: I have the same problem whenever I install something for my dad...
[13:52] <Dr_Willis> Umeaboy:  at work - had a similer guy companing.. my responce.. 'too bad...'
[13:52] <void^_> i use a top panel only in gnome, os2v4 style.
[13:52] <Dr_Willis> or 'thats an interesting missconception'
[13:52] <yofel> droke: I think yes
[13:52] <Dr_Willis> :)
[13:52] <oxymoron> Umeaboy: Kubuntu is blue mostly and only have one panel, or you could add more ones if you would like
[13:52] <Umeaboy> oxymoron: Yeah, but he did the online test to see what distro he should use.
[13:52] <Dr_Willis> kde 4.4X has gotten a lot of nice improvements
[13:52] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: Yeah, but KDE 4.5 will be the ONE <3
[13:53] <topyli> uh, if the number of panels or desktop background color are the main users here, we're doing pretty nicely
[13:53] <Mike1_> I want my Panel-Applets as single entity back! I want to be able remove that Indicator-thingy! I’m using UNE … is there a way to do it? :-(
[13:53] <topyli> er, main problems
[13:53]  * yofel is happy that he doesn't get any plasma crashes anymore since 4.4.1 :D
[13:53] <fetkmg> Google Chrome's default theme puts the close buttons on the right side, (inconsistancy)
[13:53] <Umeaboy> I don't know how to convince him because he still believes Windows is better even thou he uses alot of free software in Windows.
[13:53] <Umeaboy> If he can get it for free he prefers that.
[13:54] <Umeaboy> It's the same when asking him out for an activity that involves money.
[13:54] <droke> Something I like in KDE is the auto-window-resizing when you touch the sides of the screen as you drag a window. Especially on 24" monitors it is a MUST. Boosts productivity by ALOT IMO.
[13:54] <Umeaboy> In short........he's kind, but only for his own good.
[13:54] <droke> I could hack this into GNOME with Compiz, but hack = not user-friendly :(
[13:55] <oxymoron> Umeaboy: Tell him to test Kubuntu, I am pretty sure he will like it and the new KDE 4.4.1 ;) I prefer that to Windows. If he doesnt play games in Windows or use video editing and heavy grpahics and so on, GNU/LInux Kubuntu I would recommend because it mostly look like WIndows but much better IMO :P
[13:56] <droke> Umeaboy, it is his choice at the end of the day. If he does not like it then is not for him. Do not try to convince people, unless you are to be paid a commission I guess. My advice (from experience good and bad :) ).
[13:57] <Umeaboy> He does play games in Windows.
[13:57] <Umeaboy> Mostly FPS-games & FM or CM-games.
[13:57] <oxymoron> Umeaboy: Its possible to do dual-boot and VMware is always an option ;)
[13:57] <droke> Umeaboy, you can play most FPS in Ubuntu through Wine.
[13:58] <Umeaboy> I even tried showing him to use Linux via Virtualbox, but he's to stubborn to test it.
[13:58] <oxymoron> Umeaboy: I would not prefer GNU/Linux before WIndows if weyre talking computer gaming, but in almost any other case GNU/Linux would be to prefer
[13:59] <Umeaboy> oxymoron: I prefer Linux-games since they're free to adapt & to develop.
[13:59] <oxymoron> Umeaboy: Yeah, but the most important thing ... stability and perfomance
[13:59]  * yofel makes a note that audio/video editing is sub-optimal in linux too :/
[14:00] <oxymoron> Umeaboy: Me myself doesnt play games anymore on my computer, but I would never ever play games on e Linux machine
[14:00]  * penguin42 is fortunately satisfied by simple flash games and simple stuff
[14:00] <oxymoron> yofel: Its coming more and more editors to the market though. More developers are provide good alternatives to Adobe and that kind of things which Windows has
[14:01] <penguin42> yofel: It's good ptivi is now in Ubuntu, but I hope people don't think it's sorted because of something simple like that
[14:01] <oxymoron> penguin42: You must try N64 emulator and play Super MArio 64, thats freaking awesome and kills the flash games ...
[14:01] <yofel> penguin42: I tested pitivi, it can't read the video files from my DVR, only vlc and kdenlive can read those
[14:02] <kklimonda> penguin42: sorted?
[14:02] <yofel> and kdenlive is far from stable :/
[14:02] <penguin42> kklimonda: Finished with etc
[14:03]  * oxymoron wonders if gimp or Krita will become better than Photoshop or if PS will be ported to QT or GNU/LInux
[14:03] <Dr_Willis> i doubt if t5hers any proffit in porting PS to linux
[14:03] <yofel> I wonder what's so hard about makin a linux version of PS, there's a mac version after all
[14:03] <Dr_Willis> $$$$
[14:03] <kklimonda> penguin42: but what do you mean by that? is it too simple? it's not a replacement for adobe premiere and the rest of the professional stuff after all
[14:04] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: Probably not, but Adobe have been release a version for Android for free ... So I guess there is some kind of market in there :P
[14:04] <Dr_Willis> Its all about the Money
[14:04] <penguin42> yofel: It's a lot of work to rewrite the GUI and a phenomenal cost to keep testing it
[14:04] <Dr_Willis> a version of PS for android?
[14:04] <yofel> well, that's true
[14:04] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: Yes, Adobe Photoshop MObile or something like that, really awesome neat little app for my mobile :)
[14:04] <penguin42> kklimonda: Yeh too simple; in the sense that people won't think there's need to write something more complete
[14:05] <kklimonda> Dr_Willis: it's a chicken and egg problem - there is no market for applications like PS because there are no applications like PS to create the market ;)
[14:05] <Dr_Willis> oxymoron:  i imagine its not the same codebase as PS. :) of course that means they have ported it to linux then.. so ask them to release it.
[14:05] <WoAnerges> hi guys!
[14:05] <WoAnerges> have VAIO with "ATI mobility radeon HD 4570" and Intel Core2 DUO T6600 @ 2.2GHz.
[14:05] <WoAnerges> can't install ubuntu 10.04 normally. problems with video appearance.
[14:05] <WoAnerges> need help.
[14:05] <WoAnerges> i know - the image in attachment - it looks like video card owerheat, but it's not an owerheat of vc processor. i am sure about that, because i had a vc that was damaged by owerheating. this is not that case. i think there's a compability problem with laptop hardware. dear development team,,, you must fix it :S
[14:05] <penguin42> yofel: Never underestimate the cost of testing
[14:05] <WoAnerges> don't leave me without ubuntu. (=
[14:05] <WoAnerges> http://ubuntuforums.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=151676&d=1269750326
[14:05] <Dr_Willis> I wouldent use PS if it did eist for linux. I cant afford it.. and i dont need it.
[14:05] <yofel> penguin42: I can imagine that
[14:06] <kklimonda> penguin42: pitivi is a alternative for iMovie. to create good alternatives for professional software you would need a market for it.
[14:06] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: I wish Koffice, OpenOffice, GIMP and apps like that will vastly improve the interfaces and eyecandy, then it could be better than Photoshop. Most features it has like Photoshop has, but the interface really is bad. I would look on Microsoftt Office and make the interface better than that
[14:06] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: Of course you dont buy software ...
[14:08] <Umeaboy> oxymoron: He had problems getting the connection-interface up.
[14:09] <oxymoron> Umeaboy: Connection interface for what?
[14:09] <Umeaboy> Ethernet.
[14:09] <WoAnerges> anyone?
[14:09]  * Dr_Willis wonders how 'eyecandy' would make office apps better....
[14:10]  * penguin42 hands Dr_Willis a dancing paperclip
[14:10] <yofel> WoAnerges: no ati experts here right now it seems
[14:10] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: Not eyecandy, more interface polish to make productivity go faster, more fun and enjoy to use the app ;) Eyecandy is second
[14:10] <fabio333> hi there
[14:11] <fabio333> someone here is going to recompile firefox 3.6 with cairo enabled?
[14:11] <kklimonda> fabio333: why would we do it? devs are going to do it when legal stuff is sorted out
[14:11] <fabio333> hi <kklimonda>
[14:12] <Dr_Willis> 'the software owuld be better... if the software was better....'
[14:12] <kklimonda> fabio333: if we create firefox 3/6 package we'll have to rename it to Shiretoko(?). remove mozilla branding and hear complains about it
[14:12] <Dr_Willis> :)
[14:12] <fabio333> damn
[14:12] <oxymoron> Dr_Willis: Seriously, look on OpenOffice, it looks like hell :P Buttons everywhere which make you confused, not logical menus and well it must be polished. KOffice have been trapped in the same trap and its horrible to use.
[14:12] <penguin42> oxymoron: OOo 3 is a hell of a lot better than 2 - but yeh I agree