[00:11] <tonyyarusso> I thought the eBox in Ubuntu repos was significantly reworked to work with Ubuntu rather than doing what guntbert claims?
[00:12] <jussi01> tonyyarusso: that was my understanding also
[05:56] <Madpilot> lots of bots. yay.
[05:56] <bazhang> removed
[06:28] <elky> indus doesn't know what dcc is?
[07:13] <Flannel> Meh.
[07:14] <Flannel> Madpilot: That was rude
[07:14] <Madpilot> removing a juvenile troll is rude now?
[07:15] <Flannel> Said person stopped when confronted by floodbots, the ops call was extremely premature
[07:16] <Madpilot> meh. it was a remove, not a ban, so they can come back if they're willing to behave
[07:16] <Flannel> Removal with "go away" was rude though
[07:16] <Madpilot> and from someone who has contributed nothing else in the last hour or so, according to my scrollback
[07:16] <Madpilot> I'll say please next time
[07:16] <Flannel> Right, trolls don't generally join and then wait 5.5 hours to troll though
[07:17] <Flannel> I'm just saying, ard... jumped the gun on the ops call, and we don't exist solely to remove people who have had ops called on them
[07:48] <dholbach> good morning
[08:32] <ardchoille> I have been trying to add this:
[08:33] <ardchoille> !clicheats is There is a nice command line cheatsheet located at: http://ardchoille42.blogspot.com/2009/08/command-line-cheatsheet.html
[08:33] <ardchoille> Is there some reason this is being overlooked?
[08:33] <Myrtti> why not put it in the wiki?
[08:33] <ardchoille> It is a nice page and would be very helpful as a trigger in #ubuntu
[08:34] <ardchoille> Myrtti: Didn't think of that, will do that asap :)
[08:34] <ikonia> why do we need this ?
[08:34] <ardchoille> Was just hoping to add another resource for new users
[08:34] <ikonia> factoids are normally targeted at ubuntu information
[08:34] <Myrtti> if nothing else for a reason, then because factoids aren't usually pointed to an outside webpage
[08:34] <ardchoille> Myrtti: Ah, ok. Thanks :)
[08:35] <Myrtti> but ikonias...
[08:35] <Myrtti> oh well
[08:35] <ikonia> ?
[08:35] <ikonia> am I wrong ?
[08:35] <Myrtti> no
[08:35] <ikonia> good
[08:35] <Myrtti> I was just about to say that
[08:37] <Myrtti> ikonia: if you want to explain that to him, you're welcome, you have better insight to your own thoughts :-)
[08:37] <ikonia> nah
[11:22] <elky> nhandler, nixternal, i just want to follow up on the mdeonte stuff from a few weeks back. I'm noticing he is coming online from a shellium account...
[11:34] <Myrtti> my wrapping paper is so brilliant ♥
[11:34] <Myrtti> Merry Yule everyone http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/4208658964/
[11:34] <Myrtti> penguins ♥
[11:34] <elky> pinguuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuus
[15:33] <nhandler> elky: I haven't seen him in #ubuntu-chicago since you told him to apologize and make ammends with the LoCo
[15:56] <genii> Did a +b on "lavatory", his pastebin was a large ASCII-art "FECES"
[16:00] <jussi01> genii: lovely...
[16:02] <nalioth> genii: you can pull the +b
[16:03] <genii> nalioth: OK
[16:05] <topyli> i'm up north with folks through ex-mas. will be /away a lot i guess. easy to contact through email and jabber though. jabber =<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[16:10] <genii> Bleh. i think my -b command alias is screwed
[16:21] <jussi01> genii: /mode -b mask - simple :D
[17:05] <MenZa> topyli: gotcha. :3
[17:59]  * genii hates the caffeine withdrawal
[18:07] <genii> Interesting. http://ns2.canonical.com/ is a synonym for http://packages.ubuntu.com/
[18:45] <jussi01> genii: so thats the server its on ;)
[19:34] <Amaranth> kick == ban?
[19:35] <Seeker`> Amaranth: web user, I tihnk
[19:35] <Amaranth> I know
[19:35] <Amaranth> Just wondering when the bot starting banning web users who get kicked
[19:36] <Seeker`> I think it has been in place for a while
[19:44] <Seeker`> any way of getting a list of web client users in a channel?
[20:03] <Flannel> Amaranth: It's been that way as far as I remember
[20:31] <nhandler> Seeker`: You can use /who to see the hosts of all people in a channel. irssi also has an /ls script where you can do: /ls .*gateway/.*
[20:39] <Seeker`> ty


[17:27] <vibol> Hello, Why do Juju doc recommend to install Juju vai ppa. Can i install both juju and maas without ppa ?
[17:29] <pmatulis> vibol, b/c the better juju is in the PPA
[17:29] <pmatulis> which will soon be in the regular archives
[17:30] <vibol> Is ppa perform good after a major upgrade example from lts to next lts ?
[17:31] <pmatulis> vibol, what ubuntu version are you currently running?
[17:32] <vibol> I'm running 14.04
[17:33] <pmatulis> and when do you intend on upgrading to 16.04?
[17:34] <vibol> I'm on a  testing purpose..
[17:34] <vibol> And... i'm notice that. Upgrading a whole infrastrure is not a good idea
[17:34] <pmatulis> vibol, then i would recommend using 16.04
[17:35] <vibol> i trying to understand one by one about upgrading a major version with a work software juju, maas, landscape also openstack
[17:35] <vibol> i'm just to come here for some recommendation
[17:37] <pmatulis> recommendation is to use 16.04 from the start and avoid upgrading
[17:43] <vibol> so what happen when the current version has reach EOL ?
[17:43] <vibol> destroy the whole environment ?
[18:57] <pmatulis> upgrade it, but why not start with the latest LTS to avoid an upgrade as long as possible?
[19:56] <bdx> stokachu: ping
[21:03] <twitch> Question watching an older video on juju, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9h5hgfnZcBQ  in the current state when a deploy is run against a local lxc provider is it deployed as a container or an instance?
[21:22] <zeestrat> twitch: If by current state, you mean today, then the default local provider in Juju 2.0 is lxd (which is like lxc 2.0 just with some nicer wrapping) so deploying with that would get you lxd containers
[21:23] <twitch> And on amazon prime?
[21:23] <twitch> aws sorry
[21:29] <zeestrat> On AWS you would spin up instances. Note, if you want, you can actually you can deploy lxd containers on those AWS instances as well.
[21:30] <zeestrat> See https://jujucharms.com/docs/stable/clouds for some more info on the different clouds supported by Juju.
[21:31] <twitch> awesome ty
[21:34] <zeestrat> No worries. I recommend checking out https://jujucharms.com/docs/stable/getting-started which starts you out with the local lxd provider/cloud.
[21:34] <zeestrat> The cool things is when you get the feel for how to deploy locally with juju, you can basically just switch to the AWS cloud in juju, bootstrap a new controller there, and deploy the exact same thing in the cloud.
[21:38] <twitch> will the container tech always be focused on lxd containers or is work being done on other container software like docker?
[21:44] <zeestrat> I'm not affiliated with juju so take it with a grain of salt, but I think the main focus for local providers/clouds is on lxd containers at the moment. However one of the flagship juju charms is for deploying Kubernetes (https://jujucharms.com/canonical-kubernetes/) and I know there are people who are using docker containers in juju charms.
[21:46] <zeestrat> I suggest checking back in here next week and/or ask the mailing list (https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/juju) if you have some more questions regarding docker and juju.
[21:47] <zeestrat> I'm off so good luck!


[08:06] <petesant> I upgraded to 10.04..  I need the volume mixer that is missing.  Any Ideaes?
[17:54] <brianherman> !last philbull
[17:54] <ubot4> Factoid 'last philbull' not found
[17:55] <brianherman> !last
[17:55] <ubot4> Factoid 'last' not found
[17:56] <brianherman> Hey mewshi! Have you heard anything from phil bull about the ubuntu manual?
[17:57] <mewshi> No, I haven't
[17:57] <mewshi> not to my knowledge, anyway
[17:57] <godbyk> brianherman: What are you looking for?
[17:58] <brianherman> Oh I think I found it
[17:58] <brianherman> I thought that phil would send me an email about the manual or something
[17:58] <brianherman> but there is this link that has everything on his previous email.
[17:58] <godbyk> ah, okay.
[17:59] <mewshi> Can you give me said link?
[18:00] <brianherman> mewshi: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/contributions
[18:02] <godbyk> brianherman: You might be better off with the more recent version of that info: http://ubuntu-manual.org/getinvolved
[18:02] <godbyk> The wiki is mostly obsolete now.
[18:02] <brianherman> oops
[18:02] <mewshi> What's going on?
[18:12] <brianherman> I think you are just supposed to pick something and work on it.
[18:14]  * godbyk is confused.
[18:17] <brianherman> godbyk: ?
[18:18] <godbyk> brianherman: Did you need any help with something related to the ubuntu manual project?
[18:18] <brianherman> oh no
[18:18] <brianherman> i am fine
[18:19] <godbyk> Ah, okay. Just checking. :)


[04:33] <bemis> I asked a few days back but didn't get any response; trying again - are there any centos/rhel/oel/sl users in here?
[11:58] <setner> Hi everyone. I am trying to understand the differences between ansible and cloud-init. Why do people tend to use cloud-init in conjunction with ansible? Why not just ansible or just cloud-init? Can ansible and cloud-init perform the same actions?
[13:39] <setner> Can anyone help me with this question: what can cloud-init do that ansible (for example) can't do?
[13:43] <smoser> ybaumy: if you could open a bug with details of what is not working we can take a look.
[13:44] <smoser> setner, cloud-init is often times the first thing that is used, and its in the image already.  It helps bootstrapping.  it will set up a user and import ssh keys that may then be used by ansible.
[13:46] <setner> smoser: ok, it helps on the bootstrap process. But isn't that also achievable with ansible?
[13:48] <Odd_Bloke> bemis: There are people around; if you have a specific question, it's probably best to ask it so they can respond when they are around.
[13:57] <smoser> setner: i dont know how you would do that with ansible
[13:57] <smoser> take a stock image and get your ssh keys into it
[14:41] <bemis> Odd_Bloke: :) fair enough, thanks
[14:44] <bemis> specifically i'm looking for help getting 18.1 packaged for rhel6/rhel7
[14:44] <bemis> and hoping that perhaps others have walked this path before me and can guide me around the jagged edges
[15:02] <ch007m> Does one of you know how we can disable biosdevname when we use cloud-init / user-data config file ?
[15:35] <smoser> blackboxsw: https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/341349
[15:35] <smoser> could you take a quick look at that ? simple-ish removal of duplicate code.
[15:36] <smoser> bemis: we have daily builds of trunk in copr
[15:36] <smoser>  at https://copr.fedorainfracloud.org/coprs/g/cloud-init/cloud-init-dev/
[15:37] <smoser> ch007m: biosdevname kind of happens too late.
[15:37] <smoser> you can build your imgaes with changes to disable it.
[15:40] <ch007m> So we can't define bootloader as we can do with kickstart then - https://goo.gl/PUjERh ?
[15:46] <ch007m> As `packages:` will install yum packages the first time the vm will start, how can we know that all the packages defined are installed ?
[16:03] <smoser> ch007m: they'll be installed when cloud-init finishes.  you can look at /run/cloud-init/result.json to see the result.
[16:03] <smoser> is that what you're asking ?
[16:03] <smoser> you can't change the bootloader in an image for the first boot, cloud-init runs after that.
[16:30] <ybaumy> smoser: its not a but .. it wont work the way it was working years ago anymore since those features you were using dont exist in the commands anymore. things changed
[16:31] <ybaumy> s/but/bug
[16:34] <smoser> ybaumy: i need more information. I'm really not sure what you're talking about. Please file a bug and explain clearly what you were expecting to work and what is not working.
[16:35] <ybaumy> smoser: doesnt really matter what the current status is. its not what we need. psyrabbit is going to try to implement a new datasource provider for vcloud
[16:35] <ybaumy> this is what we should focus on
[16:36] <smoser> blackboxsw: so on your snap branch
[16:38] <blackboxsw> yes all ears
[16:38] <blackboxsw> just got through your jsonschema branch. landing it now
[16:38] <blackboxsw> post a tox run
[16:41] <bemis> smoser: whoa, thanks!
[16:42] <smoser> blackboxsw: i just hit 'submit' there.
[16:43] <ybaumy> smoser: we hope .. we can get a little support from you guys when he is implementing the datasource for vcloud. we think we found a way to handle data transfers
[16:43] <blackboxsw> smoser: checking
[16:47] <blackboxsw> https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/341349 merged
[16:48] <bemis> smoser: did the project drop EL6 support at some point between 0.75 and now?
[16:51] <dpb1> ybaumy: support time will be limited over the next couple weeks
[16:51] <dpb1> ybaumy: we have a release we are pushing for end of month
[16:51] <dpb1> ybaumy: but we will do what we can
[16:52] <ybaumy> dpb1: ok this is not a "no" for an answer and thats what we need
[16:52] <dpb1> ybaumy: ok
[16:52] <dpb1> bemis: it likely still works, are you seeing something broken?
[16:53] <bemis> dpb1: i wasn't finding el6 builds in the copr link pasted - i've since found them and am doing some testing now
[16:53] <dpb1> ah ok
[16:53] <dpb1> bemis: it's not something we stay on top of that much, but would be an interesting data point
[16:53] <dpb1> (tip on el6)
[16:53] <bemis> what led to the join initially was the conditional logic around systemd was removed at some point and the service file required components that aren't in el7
[16:53] <bemis> so i thought maybe the el landscape was an afterthought
[16:54] <ybaumy> dpb1: we have no timeline set on the project so its no problem if help is 1 day apart
[16:55] <dpb1> bemis: not an afterthought, but I'm not of how widely used it is at this point in the lifecycle of 6. :)
[16:55] <dpb1> so there are likely gaps
[16:55] <bemis> dpb1: that's fair - i'll make sure to update here as my project progresses then :)
[16:55] <bemis> thank you
[16:55]  * dpb1 nods
[17:17] <blackboxsw> smoser: thanks for the snap config review comments. I'm inclined to add the error exception message as you suggested instead of just listing the failed command.  I'm also hesitant to move the instance-data.json tests into base because we run them on every test case, increasing the cost of each of our tests by another ssh roundtrip to pull down that file & validate the same content
[17:18] <dojordan> @blackboxsw, sorry to bother but can you take a look at my MP? https://code.launchpad.net/~dojordan/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/340546
[17:18] <blackboxsw> dojordan: hiya, sorry about my silence earlier, I was on vacation monday/tuesday
[17:19] <dojordan> ah no worries!
[17:19] <blackboxsw> I'm digging out of my backlog and hopefully can get to that branch soon. It'll be reviewed this week for sure
[17:20] <blackboxsw> I had one exception path I wanted to test dojordan, connection not present versus, path not present on existing service(404)
[17:20] <blackboxsw> we thought maybe there was a better way to handle things since you are dropping the timeout
[17:20] <blackboxsw> dojordan: like maybe using readurl instead of wait for url
[17:21] <blackboxsw> but I wanted to test that before giving you the suggestion
[17:21] <blackboxsw> might as well say that now so you could glance at that as a potential solution
[17:21] <dojordan> sure, thats a good idea
[17:23] <blackboxsw> yeah it just seemed clunky that we were using wait_for_url there (which calls readurl and actually has the content of the url but ignores it only to return the endpoint's URI). So your branch would effectively be calling readurl twice on success path, once in wait_for_url to see that the service is up and once to actually recapture the content
[17:24] <blackboxsw> that wait made sense when the timeout was larger, but not so much anymore :/. Ok thanks for glancing at the potential
[17:24] <dojordan> right- we were actually discussing this recently. the other option is make wait for url return both success and optionally content but read_url seems cleaner
[17:25] <dojordan> if the connection is not present we would re-DHCP anyway as it would still bubble up to a url error
[17:27] <blackboxsw> yeah I thought about the same too (augmenting wair_for_url), but it looked like we were just using the wrong tool for the job.  wait_for_url was really only meant to iterate through a list of potential metadata URLs to return the first one that responds. smoser and I had talked about the potential of dropping the wait_for_url function at some point in the future since there are only a couple of callsites that
[17:27] <blackboxsw> could be consolidated into a simpler helper. so something that uses readurl directly would make things simpler if we drop wait_for_url.
[17:27] <dojordan> cool, ill make the change
[17:27] <blackboxsw> good deal thanks dojordan
[17:31] <ch007m> when I log on the first time to the vm, some packages are still installed as the yum process is locked -> https://www.dropbox.com/s/dh0zewvgpy0o80y/Screenshot%202018-03-14%2018.31.24.png?dl=0
[17:32] <ch007m> Is there a command that I could pass or use to know what are the packages currently downloaded for installation in order to know the status of the progressions ?
[17:33] <smoser> ch007m: probalby some 'ps' or look at /var/log/cloud-init-output.log
[17:36] <ch007m> this line is recorded -> "2018-03-14 17:30:54,672 - util.py[DEBUG]: Running command ['yum', '-t', '-y', 'install', 'git', 'docker', 'openssl', 'net-tools', 'NetworkManager'] with allowed return codes [0] (shell=False, capture=False)". When that will happen, I suppose then that all the packages will be installed then ?
[17:37] <smoser> when it finishes yes. its possible that it is locked/blocked for some reason
[17:41] <ch007m> When is cloud-init executed exactly during vm bootstrapping ?
[17:45] <smoser> ch007m: fairly late.
[17:46] <smoser>  cloud-init-final.service
[17:46] <smoser> which is After=multi-user.target
[17:48] <ch007m> +1. Thanks.
[17:48] <ch007m> I suppose that OOTB, it is packaged within this image (CentOS-7-x86_64-GenericCloud-1802.qcow2c) ?
[17:57] <ch007m> My centos qcow2 includes this version `cloud-init 0.7.9` which isn't the latest. Have you discussed with Centos team to do a an upgrade ?
[18:00] <dpb1> ch007m: no, not really
[18:01] <dpb1> ch007m: you'd need to get in touch with one of the rhel disto guys to see what their plans were
[18:02] <ch007m> ok
[18:49] <smoser> blackboxsw: https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/341417
[18:54] <okie> good morning everyone
[18:54] <okie> actually afternoon
[18:56] <okie> i got a question if anyone can assist. I am running a centos 7 aws image and having a problem with cloud-init it looks like. I have consistant network device naming turned off but cloud init is not respecting that. I can advise it is cloud init as there are ifcfg-ens* entries with a comment in each of them advising this was automatically generated by cloud-init
[18:57] <okie> how do i get cloud init to respect that i have disabled consistent network device naming.
[18:59] <smoser> okie: cloud-init doesnt really do anything with that. what is the problem you're trying to solve ?
[19:00] <smoser> then also, blackboxsw https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/341420
[19:01] <blackboxsw> heh, smoser I'm circling the unit test drain on https://code.launchpad.net/~chad.smith/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/339720
[19:01] <okie> so right now device names are using predictable network device naming or otherwise known as consistent network device naming... So instead of eth0 i have ens{insert number}. I want to go back to the "traditional" way which is eth0. I have followed the redhat docs on how to do this but ens entries are being generated by cloud-init
[19:03] <okie> grep ^ /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-*
[19:03] <okie> #/etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-ens3:# Created by cloud-init on instance boot automatically, do not edit.
[19:03] <okie> #/etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-ens5:# Created by cloud-init on instance boot automatically, do not edit.
[19:04] <smoser> okie: you may possibly need to clean up a bit.
[19:04] <smoser> your image.. if its not pristin.
[19:04] <okie> its a base centos7 image from aws market place
[19:05] <smoser> in most cases, c loud-init reads the devices rthat it sees asa they are. and then configures networking, and ensures that the names it writes are right.
[19:06] <smoser> can you post a /var/log/cloud-init.log ?
[19:06] <okie> ya
[19:07] <smoser> https://hastebin.com/
[19:07] <smoser> is wonderful (before you went to pastebin.com)
[19:11] <okie> https://hastebin.com/onekedolod.sql
[19:12] <okie> file was too big to save in hastebin so you got part of the cloud init log
[19:14] <smoser> oh. really ? it said too big ?
[19:14] <okie> yuppers
[19:14] <smoser> well then, feel free to paste the whole thing somewehere else
[19:14] <smoser> paste.ubuntu.com is good
[19:16] <okie> way to go ubuntu pastebin.. that works
[19:16] <okie> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/YbT9RWQ8zm/
[19:16] <smoser> yeah, but in ubuntu pastebin you have to log in to get raw
[19:18] <smoser> okie: when cloud-init ran it saw devices named 'ens3'
[19:18] <smoser> so i thii if you were expecting to get 'eth0' device, then you must have done something wrong.
[19:19] <okie> where is it looking sysconfig/network-scripts/ or where?
[19:20] <okie> that it is determining this.. as the base centos7 image is disabling the udev rule to use consistent network device names..
[19:20] <okie> i dont get where cloud-init is pulling ens3 from?
[19:26] <smoser> okie: it looks in /sys for the names.
[19:26] <smoser> and then writes config making sure that they stay with those names.
[19:26] <okie> thanks
[19:32] <dojordan> @blackboxsw, pushed the changes: https://code.launchpad.net/~dojordan/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/340546
[19:56] <blackboxsw> smoser: pushed the unit test coverage for set-hostname-early branch https://code.launchpad.net/~chad.smith/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/339720. I'm done now with that and hitting your reviews
[19:59] <blackboxsw> thx dojordan\
[20:05] <okie> @smoser thanks for the help... It was helped me in the right direction
[20:06] <smoser> great!
[21:11] <blackboxsw> smoser: minor nit on your doc branch https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/341420 and approved
[22:23] <blackboxsw> smoser: I think 46cb6716c27d4496ce3d2bea7684803f522f277d broke util.subp
[22:23] <blackboxsw> it treats args as a list always, which isn't true, so any pure string passed to subp will fall apart
[22:24] <blackboxsw> as it gets treated as an iterable character by character
[22:27] <dojordan> (sorry to but in) but that's what broke get_hostname on azure
[22:28] <blackboxsw> dojordan: yeah, I recall your comment on how that branch shouldn't have passed CI.  yeah, just hit it on my branch too (where I provide strings to subp instead of lists too). I figured your fix was still safe/good practice etc.
[22:29] <dojordan> One possibility is to add an assertion on the type being passed into util.subp?
[22:29] <blackboxsw> dojordan: yes, you are correct. I just looked through that subp encoding changeset in more detail to see what the intent was (instead of blazing past it).  And sure enough
[22:30] <dojordan> Also, this is me just rambling, but at some point type hints could help prevent things like this...
[22:30] <blackboxsw> true, I think thanks probably a nice feature, to catch other potential programming errors on what gets passed into subp. though subp should support both string and list
[22:30] <dojordan> true, it could just construct a 1 element tuple if need be
[22:31] <blackboxsw> rambling welcome. and preaching to the choir ;)    Yes I want generally to have strict schema validation on all user-provided content from cloudinit's config modules which would both document expected types and explicitly warn/error on invalid types.
[22:32] <dojordan> *dojordan swoons*
[22:32] <blackboxsw> it's a long road on that front, but handling that on common utility functions like subp is a good start to prevent misuse of core functions/methods
[22:32] <blackboxsw> "cloud-init devel schema --doc"
[22:32] <blackboxsw> only currently about 7 examples of schema types
[22:33] <blackboxsw> or locally in your repo directory: python3 -m cloudinit.cmd.main devel schema --doc
[22:33] <dojordan> nice, its a good start
[22:33] <blackboxsw> gotta start somewhere :)
[22:46]  * blackboxsw heads out for a bit. checking in later


[00:42] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: haskell-prettyprinter-convert-ansi-wl-pprint [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [1.1-1] (no packageset)
[00:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: haskell-prettyprinter-convert-ansi-wl-pprint [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [1.1-1] (no packageset)
[00:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: haskell-prettyprinter-convert-ansi-wl-pprint [i386] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [1.1-1] (no packageset)
[00:54] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: wine [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [3.0.1-1] (no packageset)
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[06:19] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-prettyprinter-convert-ansi-wl-pprint [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [1.1-1]
[06:19] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-prettyprinter-convert-ansi-wl-pprint [armhf] (cosmic-proposed) [1.1-1]
[06:19] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-prettyprinter-convert-ansi-wl-pprint [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed) [1.1-1]
[06:19] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-prettyprinter-convert-ansi-wl-pprint [arm64] (cosmic-proposed) [1.1-1]
[06:19] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted wine [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [3.0.1-1]
[06:19] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-prettyprinter-convert-ansi-wl-pprint [i386] (cosmic-proposed) [1.1-1]
[07:35] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New sync: haskell-hedgehog (cosmic-proposed/primary) [0.5.3-1]
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[11:18] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: php-dflydev-fig-cookies [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [1.0.2-1] (no packageset)
[11:18] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: php-fabiang-sasl [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [1.0.0-1] (no packageset)
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[11:18] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: php-embed [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [3.3.1-1] (no packageset)
[11:18] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: django-ldapdb [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [1.0.0+ds-1] (no packageset)
[11:19] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: php-react-zmq [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [0.4.0-1] (no packageset)
[11:19] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: php-nesbot-carbon [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [1.27.0-1] (no packageset)
[17:04] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New sync: haskell-config-ini (cosmic-proposed/primary) [<IP_ADDRESS>-1]
[17:07] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New sync: haskell-ini (cosmic-proposed/primary) [0.3.5-1]
[17:30] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New sync: haskell-tasty-hedgehog (cosmic-proposed/primary) [<IP_ADDRESS>-1]
[20:00] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: language-selector (bionic-proposed/main) [0.188 => 0.188.1] (core, personal-gunnarhj)
[21:26] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New sync: haskell-hslua-module-text (cosmic-proposed/primary) [<IP_ADDRESS>-1]
[21:27] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New sync: haskell-microstache (cosmic-proposed/primary) [<IP_ADDRESS>-1]
[21:29] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New sync: haskell-thyme (cosmic-proposed/primary) [<IP_ADDRESS>-2]
[23:40] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted django-ldapdb [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [1.0.0+ds-1]
[23:40] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted php-defuse-php-encryption [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [2.2.0-1]
[23:40] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted php-embed [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [3.3.1-1]
[23:40] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted php-nesbot-carbon [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [1.27.0-1]
[23:40] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted php-cocur-slugify [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [3.1-1]
[23:40] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted php-fabiang-sasl [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [1.0.0-1]
[23:40] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted php-dflydev-fig-cookies [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [1.0.2-1]
[23:40] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted php-react-zmq [amd64] (cosmic-proposed) [0.4.0-1]
[23:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-config-ini [sync] (cosmic-proposed) [<IP_ADDRESS>-1]
[23:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-hslua-module-text [sync] (cosmic-proposed) [<IP_ADDRESS>-1]
[23:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-microstache [sync] (cosmic-proposed) [<IP_ADDRESS>-1]
[23:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-thyme [sync] (cosmic-proposed) [<IP_ADDRESS>-2]
[23:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-hedgehog [sync] (cosmic-proposed) [0.5.3-1]
[23:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-tasty-hedgehog [sync] (cosmic-proposed) [<IP_ADDRESS>-1]
[23:41] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New: accepted haskell-ini [sync] (cosmic-proposed) [0.3.5-1]
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[23:51] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: haskell-thyme [s390x] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [<IP_ADDRESS>-2] (no packageset)
[23:52] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: haskell-thyme [ppc64el] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [<IP_ADDRESS>-2] (no packageset)
[23:55] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: haskell-hedgehog [arm64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [0.5.3-1] (no packageset)
[23:55] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- New binary: haskell-thyme [amd64] (cosmic-proposed/universe) [<IP_ADDRESS>-2] (no packageset)


[00:08] <dasen> hi guys, does anyone know when will unity have a functioning application menu?
[00:08] <dasen> the new version I mean
[00:08] <bazhang> dasen, after the alpha release?
[00:09] <dasen> bazhang: do u know when it will arrive?
[00:09] <bazhang> dasen, you might wish to check the release schedule referenced in the /topic here
[00:10] <dasen> oh yeah, sorry :)
[00:10] <bazhang> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NattyReleaseSchedule
[07:10] <magn3ts> I have an interesting idea.
[07:10] <magn3ts> Release daily builds as patches of a common base!
[07:10] <magn3ts> Or have a common Ubuntu image that everything patches.
[07:10] <magn3ts> I've downloaded Ubuntu, I don't know how many times. Think if I was just downloading some sort of patch
[07:11] <magn3ts> But then I remember compression. :/
[07:11] <rww> just zsync the new one from the last one you downloaded?
[07:11] <magn3ts> how does this work??
[07:11] <magn3ts> does ubuntu distribute .zsync files?
[07:11] <rww> yes
[07:12] <magn3ts> >_>
[07:12]  * magn3ts aptitude's zsync
[07:12] <rww> note the .zsync files on e.g. http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/ :)
[07:12] <magn3ts> Yeah, had that window open looking for torrent files, but this is much better. thanks!
[07:13]  * magn3ts was so proud of himself
[07:13] <rww> no torrents of daily builds. it'd be hard to do for something that's only relevant for 24 hours
[07:13] <magn3ts> Yeah, I wondered... I thought I might have previously but those were probably even alphas.
[14:22] <mhall119> hi everyone, I'm trying to load the daily desktop ISO in virtualbox, but it gets stuck showing the desktop and mouse only, or sometimes just a black screen, anyone know if this is a problem with the ISO, or am I just unlucky?
[16:06] <mhall119> okay, some apps are throwing errors saying the can't close file descriptors, others are throwing errors saying there are too many open files
[16:06] <mhall119> this is causing all the Gnome stuff (metacity, gnome-panel, etc) from running
[16:17] <fagan> mhall119: I havent seen that myself
[16:17] <fagan> the only big issue im getting is unity with compiz not working at all
[16:21] <fagan> I wouldnt mind but compiz works just fine on my laptop even though its really old its just unity+compiz doesnt
[16:38] <cfx_> anyone know if it is possible to have each individual workspace shown by separate monitors? like 2 workspaces , 2 monitors, 1 on each.
[16:38] <coz_> cfx_,  with compiz  no
[16:39] <coz_> not that I am aware of
[16:39] <cfx_> coz_, without?
[16:39] <coz_> cfx_,  :) well I rarely dont use compiz but let me check
[16:40] <cfx_> thanks coz_
[16:41] <coz_> cfx_,  the only thing I can think of is seperate xscreens
[16:41] <cfx_> you mean X sessions?
[16:41] <coz_> cfx_,  no  xscreens... let me find a link
[16:42] <coz_> cfx_,   this is for nvidia   https://help.ubuntu.com/community/NvidiaMultiMonitors
[16:43] <cfx_> coz_, im using ati lol
[16:43] <coz_> cfx_,  ooo
[16:43] <fagan> coz_: thats a bit old I think so it may not work too well
[16:43] <coz_> fagan,  probably
[16:44] <coz_> and for ati  I am not sure...maybe xinerama but then compiz will not work with that
[16:44]  * fagan thought there was a setting to make workspaces work properly but never tried it
[16:45] <coz_> fagan,  let me check in 0.9 compiz
[16:45] <cfx_> coz_, what does xscreens do? is there a screenshot/photo?
[16:45] <coz_> cfx_,  essentially  separate xscreens is going to allow a different workspace on each monitor however no dragging of windows between the monitors
[16:46] <fagan> well there is no real benefit in using seperate workspaces between monitors anyway
[16:46] <fagan> since the extended display system actually works fairly nice
[16:47] <cfx_> fagan, hm?
[16:47] <coz_> yeah I agree... cfx_   what is the thinking with this ?  why separate  workspaces on each monitor?
[16:47] <cfx_> coz_, i want to have documentation on the 2nd screen and coding on the 1st one
[16:47] <cfx_> i will simply have all doc related stuff on 2nd workspace
[16:48] <fagan> cfx_: you can drag the docs to the second monitor and it sould do that
[16:48] <coz_> cfx_,  well with some of compiz plugins  you can use either viewports or each monitor for windows to open on specific monitors or viewports
[16:48] <fagan> *should
[16:48] <coz_> cfx_,   or use group and tab plugin to group all of the similar windows together on each monitor
[16:49] <coz_> cfx_,  or  tile and grid plugins  or any combination...with Place windows plugin you can specify location ofwindows
[16:49] <coz_> that you want to open
[16:49] <coz_> so    IDE on primary   and text on secondary
[16:50] <cfx_> what is compiz, im confused, i thought default ubuntu didnt use compiz
[16:50] <cfx_> just regular gnome
[16:50] <cfx_> fagan, i dont understand, is there a howto or smth that illustrates that?
[16:50] <coz_> cfx_,  well default ubuntu compiz with compiz and you can check to see if it is activated under /system/preferences/appearance and the visual effects tab
[16:51] <coz_> rathe comes with compiz
[16:52] <coz_> cfx_,  and if you   sudo apt-get install compizconfig-settings-manager  you can set specific plugins and their settings
[16:53] <cfx_> coz_, so you're essentially saying that this is possible with some compiz plugins?
[16:54] <coz_> cfx_,  absolutely... you would have to familiarize yourself with the plugins and their capabilities but ,,,yes
[16:54] <cfx_> i have normal on visual effects, does that mean compiz is enabled?
[16:55] <coz_> cfx_,  remember   compiz is a  "window manager"  yes it is enabled
[16:55] <coz_> cfx_,  now install compizconfig-settings-manager  and open either under system/preferences  or    ccsm in terminal or run dialog
[16:56] <cfx_> coz_, ah i see it, but which of those should i enable to make that work?
[16:56] <coz_> cfx_,  ok  well... Place windows plugin under the window management category ,,,if you click that to get into its settings  , you will see its options listed there
[16:57] <coz_> cfx_,  to enable a specific application window to open on one of those options you click the plus (+)  icon then the "grab" button and click the window to include it into the  window match string
[16:59] <coz_> cfx_,  for example, under Place window plugin ,,click the  "Fixed window placement"  tab
[16:59] <coz_> cfx_,   there you see 3 options
[16:59] <cfx_> yes i see them
[16:59] <coz_> fixed position   fixed placement  and fixed viewport
[17:00] <cfx_> right
[17:00] <coz_> fixed placement should allow you to place a window on either monitor and it will open on that same monitor each time
[17:00] <coz_> cfx_,  when you click the "New" button, a dialog opens with a (+)  button
[17:01] <cfx_> please go on
[17:01] <coz_> cfx_,  when you click the (+)  button another dialog opens with a "Grab" button and when you click that the cursor chanes to cross hair that allows  you to click on an open application window  to set that into the window rules string
[17:02] <coz_> there is also an "Invert" button which would "EXCLUE"  a window from that rule so you dont want that right now
[17:02] <coz_> cfx_,  the first dialog that opened will allow x an y positioning of the window you chose
[17:03] <coz_> cfx_,  its takes a bit of practice to deal with window rules and placement sliders but you will find it works well
[17:04] <cfx_> ok so you're saying i should select all the doc related windows and add them to fixed viewport ?
[17:04] <coz_> cfx_,  yes ,, one at a time
[17:05] <coz_> cfx_,  test your settings with the x/y sliders
[17:05] <cfx_> and you say that there is a threshold e.g. x <1000 = monitor1 where x>1001 is monitor2?
[17:05] <coz_> cfx_,  you can always reset to defaults and start gain with that little yellow whisk broom icon
[17:08] <coz_> cfx_,  something like that... I am not great with these sliders myself and I am support for compiz  but I generally just play with the sliders until I get it correct however there is also a pull down menu "Mode"   for thinkgs like cascade,, center  etc  on the first dialog
[17:08] <coz_> cfx_,  even open under pointer
[17:09] <coz_> cfx_, open under pointer of course opens an application window  where ever the cursor is locatedd
[17:09] <coz_> located
[17:13] <cfx_> coz_, how can i disable that annoying effect when switching workspaces?
[17:14] <coz_> cfx_,  which is that?
[17:14] <coz_> cfx_,  the cube?
[17:14] <mrmcq2u> on reboot I am getting stuck on checking battery state, anyone know what could cause it?
[17:14] <mrmcq2u> Im on a desktop with no battery
[17:14] <charlie-tca> yup
[17:14] <cfx_> coz_, no. i mean there is a transition phase "FX" when switching workspaces
[17:14] <charlie-tca> X didn't start
[17:14] <charlie-tca> ?
[17:15] <coz_> cfx_,  can you describe it a bit better ?  there are several things it could be
[17:15] <charlie-tca> mrmcq2u: usually when I get that, restarting works. Sometimes, though, I have to use recovery mode and clean the packages
[17:15] <coz_> cfx_,   is it scroll whell switching?
[17:15] <cfx_> coz_, on bottom right when you click the 2nd workspace it doesnt just "appear" in front of you. there is a dizzying effect
[17:15] <cfx_> coz_, exactly
[17:16] <mrmcq2u> right thanks charlie-tca will try dpkg-reconfigure
[17:16] <coz_> cfx_,  ok in ccsm  under the  Viewport switcher plugin  click the  "Desktop-based viewport switching" tab
[17:16] <coz_> cfx_,   Move Next and Move Prev  are set to what?
[17:17] <cfx_> disabled
[17:17] <coz_> cfx_,  ok then thats not the effect
[17:18] <coz_> cfx_,  oh you are using gnome's  desktop switcher  ...yes?
[17:18] <cfx_> coz_, yes default ubuntu here
[17:18] <cfx_> with gnome
[17:18] <coz_> cfx_,  well you can go into ccsm again and disable  desktop cube and enable  Desktop wall instead
[17:19] <coz_> also disable Rotate cube first
[17:19] <cfx_> coz_, also what's the hotkey to change workspaces ?
[17:19] <coz_> cfx_,  then try the workspace siwtcher and see if that is better
[17:19] <coz_> cfx_,   yes  ctrl+alt+left and right arrows
[17:20] <cfx_> coz_, cube is already disabled, wall is enabled
[17:20] <coz_> cfx_,  oh!!
[17:20] <coz_> cfx_,  ok for topic reasons  meet me in #compiz
[17:20] <cfx_> thanks for the hotkey, that works
[17:20] <coz_> cool
[17:20] <coz_> cfx_,   but lets pick this up in #compiz if you have more compiz related issues and questions :)
[17:21] <cfx_> i'm already there
[17:43] <zniavre> good evening
[17:43] <zniavre> wich package to install the new desktop > ubuntu-desktop seems not in repos
[17:44] <fagan> zniavre: its not ready yet but you can try an older version
[17:44] <fagan> sudo apt-get install unity
[17:45] <zniavre> ok thank you
[17:45] <fagan> then log out and select ubuntu-netbook when you are loging in
[17:45] <fagan> zniavre: the maverick version is very broken though
[17:45] <fagan> you should wait for natty
[17:45] <zniavre> in fact i got for now only bases system
[17:46] <zniavre> natty*
[17:46] <zniavre> found it thank you
[17:47] <fagan> no problem
[17:47] <zniavre> :o)
[17:48] <fagan> its going to be completely different when natty is released though
[17:48] <fagan> there are so many problems with it at the moment
[18:52] <xteejx> Hi all. I can't see any alternate CD images for Natty, have they not been generated yet?
[18:54] <yofel> looks like iso failed to build to me, since the folders are empty
[18:54]  * yofel forgot where the build logs are kept...
[18:56] <yofel> firefox backlog to the resque... http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/cd-build-logs/ubuntu/natty/
[18:56] <yofel> yep, failes to build
[18:56] <yofel> *fails
[18:56] <xteejx> yofel: Damn :( My vbox install won't work, it gets up to the gdm login but doesn't show it, and Ctrl+Alt+F1 does it on my system, not the vbox :(
[18:56] <xteejx> Booo :( lol
[18:56] <yofel> hm, I know how to switch to tty in kvm, but not in vbox..
[18:57] <xteejx> yofel: I don't think you can insert keypresses in vbox sadly
[18:57] <yofel> wasn't that a slightly different key combination?
[18:57] <xteejx> oh well have to wait for a built alternate, the live doesnt work
[18:58] <yofel> xteejx: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1292037 ?
[18:58] <charlie-tca> xteejx: did you try right-ctl F1 ?
[18:58] <charlie-tca> The vbox key replaces Crlt+Alt usually
[18:58] <xteejx> charlie-tca: Really? :O I'm gonna try that
[19:00] <xteejx> charlie-tca: Nice one Charlie, it worked thank you :D
[19:00] <charlie-tca> no problem
[19:01] <charlie-tca> I use VBox a lot for testing
[19:02] <xteejx> same, its alot easier/safer than messing up a production machine
[19:03] <yofel> natty works fine on my eeePC so far, well almost
[19:04] <yofel> when the display turns off, and I move the mouse, the display turns back on, but not the backlight. I have to close the lid and open it again for the backlight to turn on o.O
[21:32] <magn3ts> What was the last live cd build that worked?
[21:32] <magn3ts> the last two I've tried were broken


[00:48] <Irishmanluke> ChinnoDog: at first I thought you meant he'd be easier to find because he's "tied down"
[00:48] <Irishmanluke> no more wild adventures
[00:48] <ssweeny> Irishmanluke, that is certainly not the case
[00:48] <jedijf> ssweeny: which statement is not the case?
[00:49] <jedijf> there are two
[00:49] <ssweeny> i guess both
[00:49] <jedijf> or, everything that happens at UDS, stays at UDS
[00:50] <ssweeny> i don't know how being married affects one's ability to find me, especially since my wife's not here
[00:50] <ssweeny> and i have had some wild adventures
[00:50] <ssweeny> even before i got here
[00:51] <jedijf> i think ChinnoDog meant a frosh forty of the marriage variety
[00:52] <jedijf> that's what i thought anyway....but with ChinnoDog, clarification is always in order
[00:52] <jedijf> ssweeny: how is it so far?
[00:53] <ssweeny> jedijf, it is a magical experience
[00:53] <ssweeny> also pleia2 seemed to find me without much trouble
[00:54] <jedijf> ssweeny: for you, it's just great timinmg; there is almost no better way to start a new job
[00:54] <ssweeny> we just spent the last several hours in a bar with a couple of my newfound coworkers
[00:54] <jedijf> see
[00:54] <ssweeny> yep
[01:02] <ChinnoDog> lol. With me clarification is always in order?
[01:02] <ChinnoDog> I was referring to marriage making one larger and hence easier to see
[01:02] <ChinnoDog> "frosh forty"??
[01:03] <Irishmanluke> no I got it after the second time through
[01:04] <Irishmanluke> fat is good, what if we all end up camped out in a bunker somewhere, who do you think is going to live the longest?
[01:04] <ChinnoDog> The one that likes the taste of friends
[01:05] <ssweeny> mmm, friends
[01:06] <Irishmanluke> ok, fat and muscle
[01:06] <Irishmanluke> you need both
[01:07] <jedijf> ChinnoDog: honeymoon heavy? is that better?
[01:07] <teddy-dbear> all I need is stuffing :-D
[01:07]  * Irishmanluke grabs teddy-dbear by the throat
[01:08]  * teddy-dbear hugs Irishmanluke back
[01:09] <jedijf> ssweeny: so to summarize ChinnoDog and Irishmanluke, i guess you should cannablilize your most threatening new co-worker
[01:11] <teddy-dbear> go after lamalex, nobody will care ;-)
[01:11]  * ssweeny still hasn't met him in person
[01:11] <ssweeny> he's here somewhere
[01:11] <jedijf> i think this is going to be the perpetual miss
[01:12] <ssweeny> pleia2 said she'd introduce us but he's nowhere to be found
[01:12] <teddy-dbear> somebody must have already got to him
[01:13] <teddy-dbear> either that or he's in a bar somewhere
[01:14] <Irishmanluke> PennBot: Lamalex
[01:14] <PennBot> It has been said that Lamalex is yo daddy or in need of a life or a big proponent of latex or jthan's hero or MIA or in big trouble or lazy or jthan's father or This is your lamalex. This is your lamalex on drugs: < lamalex> my ldft arm os fuuuucjrf, Irishmanluke
[01:16] <Irishmanluke> it used to say he was punk as fu*k
[01:16] <Irishmanluke> PennBot: uptime
[01:16] <PennBot> Irishmanluke: I have been running for 17 weeks, 0 days, 7 hours, 17 minutes, and 31 seconds.
[01:17] <Irishmanluke> oh not too long
[01:25] <Irishmanluke> I guess I wasn't here or I didn't notice the last time he went down
[01:32] <Irishmanluke> I wrote a little testing script in perl today
[01:33] <Irishmanluke> perl is a pretty neat language
[01:34] <teddy-dbear> teddy bear is much better...... it's all in your head
[01:41] <Irishmanluke> my friend just told me that bash sucks, we can't be friends anymore
[01:47] <jedijf> that's no friend
[01:48] <Irishmanluke> yeah, "I mostly did python and .NET"
[01:49] <Irishmanluke> I thought he was going to be a real hacker but I was so wrong
[01:50] <Irishmanluke> "I don't like perl so I don't know very much about it"
[01:50] <Irishmanluke> spoken like a windows user
[01:52] <Irishmanluke> it's amazing the arrogance you can find among my colleagues, a few classes and they think they're experts
[01:53] <ChinnoDog> Sounding an awful lot like a linux snob right now.
[01:55] <Irishmanluke> yeah I know I went overboard
[01:56] <Irishmanluke> what annoys me is that people can be so dismissive about things they really know nothing about
[02:02] <Irishmanluke> apperently there's a class I have to take where we write assembly code
[02:02] <Irishmanluke> my goal: make the electrical and computer engineers look dumb
[02:03] <ChinnoDog> You could write code that modifies itself
[02:03] <Irishmanluke> in assembly?
[02:03] <ChinnoDog> yes
[02:04] <Irishmanluke> yeah it would modify itself and then break
[02:04] <ChinnoDog> Just overwrite instructions in memory and then flush the queue
[02:04] <ChinnoDog> I did it when I learned assembly
[02:04] <Irishmanluke> oh nice
[02:06] <ChinnoDog> You have to flush the queue before you get to the instruction though. Otherwise the old instruction could still be in the instruction pipeline
[02:06] <Irishmanluke> In my aunts apartment someone left a bunch of computer books lying out so I took a couple, most of them werent' that intersting though
[02:06] <Irishmanluke> ChinnoDog: back up a second, what is the queue?
[02:07] <ChinnoDog> I forget all the correct terminology. lol. x86 CPUs read ahead and decode instructions before they are executed
[02:07] <ChinnoDog> By the time you are executing one instruction a bunch of others are already being loaded into the CPU
[02:08] <ChinnoDog> If it has already read in an instruction from memory and then you modify it in memory, it will have no effect
[02:08] <Irishmanluke> this queue is something inside of the CPU?
[02:08] <ChinnoDog> You have to force a JMP to flush it
[02:08] <ChinnoDog> I thought you were learning assembly :-p
[02:08] <Irishmanluke> no, I'm going to be, next term
[02:08] <Irishmanluke> er in two terms
[02:09] <ChinnoDog> oh, k. Yes. This is what originally gave the x86 series of CPUs their performance advantage. It allows pipelining.
[02:09] <ChinnoDog> It is also why AMD CPUs are faster than Intel per clock cycle. Shorter pipeline.
[02:09] <Irishmanluke> JMP is the instruction?
[02:10] <ChinnoDog> Any kind of jump is fine, whether it is JMP or a conditional jump
[02:10] <ChinnoDog> Jumps have performance penalties though.
[02:10] <Irishmanluke> aruond how many instructions do modern processers have?
[02:11] <ChinnoDog> idk. I only ever used the original 8086 instruction set. :-)
[02:11] <ChinnoDog> I'm pretty sure I had a 286 I was testing stuff on, so I couldn't have been using 386 instructions.
[02:14] <waltman> Irishmanluke: Do you know Dave Richardson at SIG?
[02:14] <ChinnoDog> I didn't write anything really fancy. Just some DOS toy apps. I'm no Steve Gibson
[02:17] <Irishmanluke> waltman: no I don't think so, is he in Market Data?
[02:17] <Irishmanluke> ChinnoDog: there are not many people that can say they've written programs in assembly
[02:20] <Irishmanluke> on the Ti you can actually edit machine code in hex
[02:21] <Irishmanluke> well I would be very impressed with someone that could hack something together that way I would also wonder about them
[02:23] <waltman> Irishmanluke: He works on high-performance computing, but I don't know the actual name of the group.
[02:23] <waltman> I wrote a bit of assembly back in the day :)
[02:25] <Irishmanluke> and now you're just a lazy perl hacker :)
[02:25] <waltman> I had an assignment as an undergrad where we had to write a towers of hanoi program in 68000 assembler
[02:26] <Irishmanluke> did you do it recursively?
[02:26] <waltman> of course!
[02:26] <waltman> actually I'm not positive I did
[02:26] <waltman> But I remember that we got points for how few instructions we used, so I guess I probably did use recursion
[02:27] <Irishmanluke> is recursion difficult in assembly?
[02:28] <waltman> It was a LONG time ago, but I don't think it's particularly difficult.
[02:28] <waltman> probably no different from calling any other function
[02:28] <waltman> at least on this instruction set
[02:30] <Irishmanluke> you mean you can define a subroutine and it will just automatically be pushed to a stack when you call it?
[02:30] <waltman> That actually turned out to be a useful class, because afterwards I ended up working on Stratus computers which used very similar CPUs. I never wrote assembler there, but it was occasionally useful in debugging to see what instructions were getting generated.
[02:31] <ChinnoDog> Nothing is automatic except what the hardware provides, Irishmanluke
[02:31] <ChinnoDog> Push your calling arguments onto the stack and then jump to the subroutine start
[02:31] <ChinnoDog> That is, if you prefer C calling convention. There are others.
[02:32] <Irishmanluke> ah
[02:32] <waltman> I think you just pushed some parameters onto the stack and then jumped to a tag marking the beginning of the "subroutine". First thing that would do was pop the stack and store them in registers or suchlike.
[02:32] <ChinnoDog> You can use your registers as arguments if you are writing assembly because you have full control on what is there. In a compiled higher level language you have to follow convention.
[02:33] <waltman> 68000 assembly was a lot cleaner and simpler than intel's x86 instruction set
[02:33] <Irishmanluke> right
[02:34] <Irishmanluke> so I picked up a book called Modern Operating Systems
[02:34] <Irishmanluke> don't know what kind of gold is in there
[02:34] <waltman> how "modern" does it get?
[02:34] <Irishmanluke> not sure
[02:35] <Irishmanluke> It was published in 1992
[02:35] <waltman> is it Tannenbaum's book?
[02:35] <Irishmanluke> yep
[02:36] <Irishmanluke> I literally picked it up, it was lying in my aunts apartment
[02:36] <waltman> I checked that out of the library at one point when I was taking the grad OS course. I liked it a lot better than the official book for the class.
[02:37] <Irishmanluke> the Drexel course?
[02:38] <waltman> yeah
[02:38] <waltman> I hope they've revamped it by now.  It was the worst grad course I took.
[02:38] <Irishmanluke> it looks linteresting
[02:38] <Irishmanluke> the book that is
[02:39] <Irishmanluke> did you read chapter 8 case study 2: Ms-Dos
[02:41] <waltman> I think I just skimmed through a few parts.
[02:41] <mikedep333> Irishmanluke: I shudder to think what's in the case study for MS-DOS!
[02:45] <Irishmanluke> If I get the time I will definitely try to read this book, if it's not to dense for me
[02:46] <waltman> Don't you have to take an OS class at some point anyway?
[02:46] <Irishmanluke> that's a good question
[02:50] <Irishmanluke> doesn't look like it really
[02:55] <Irishmanluke> you can take CS 370 Operating Systems as an elective
[03:00] <Irishmanluke> the dependency tree for CS 370 is like 4 or 5 deep though
[03:10] <Irishmanluke> ok I figured it out, there a three other classes I would have to take in order to take that class
[03:14] <Irishmanluke> I should write a script to traverse this website and figure out the dependency trees for classes, then display them
[11:33] <JonathanD> Morning.
[11:34] <ssweeny> pfft... you mean afternoon
[11:35] <JonathanD> Well, it is a bit late.
[11:36] <ssweeny> almost lunch time
[11:49] <teddy-dbear> morning JonathanD
[11:49] <teddy-dbear> afternoon ssweeny
[11:49] <ssweeny> afternoon teddy-dbear
[11:50] <teddy-dbear> o/
[11:51] <pleia2> morning JonathanD, teddy-dbear
[11:51] <teddy-dbear> o/
[11:51] <pleia2> (almost lunch time)++
[11:51]  * ssweeny is fairly certain that pleia2 is in the same time zone as him
[11:52] <pleia2> maybe even the same room!
[11:52] <ssweeny> maybe even sitting next to me
[11:52] <pleia2> \o/
[11:52] <ssweeny> \o/ indeed
[11:54] <JonathanD> Oh my!
[11:54] <JonathanD> I think I'm going for a run.
[11:54] <JonathanD> still early enough, I think.
[11:55]  * ssweeny is going to run to lunch
[11:58]  * rmg51 is going to run to the bathroom
[11:59] <teddy-dbear> TMI!!!!1 :P
[12:04] <JonathanD> Back.
[12:23]  * rmg51 now runs off to work :-(:P
[14:02]  * InHisName thinks the runs are less evil than the opposite
[14:04] <InHisName> Morning to: JonathanD, rmg51, teddy-dbear  and anyone else awake.
[14:04] <InHisName> Is it time to say 'evening' to you 2 ?   ssweeny & pleia2
[14:06] <HowdyDoody> Well, its been 3 days 21 hours up and still not frozen.
[14:08] <HowdyDoody> The trick I am using is to ctrl-alt-f1 just before switching away with the kvm, so alt-F7 is not in any connected state.  So far so good.
[14:14] <HowdyDoody> Now, I guess I'll just leave it in alt-F7 mode (desktop) and see if it freezes there after a few hours.
[14:15] <ssweeny> InHisName, still afternoon
[14:21] <InHisName> ssweeny: strange didn't you say lamalex is there too?  Frequently I log in thru some Europeon connection here in PA, while lamalex goes to Europe and logs in via Corvallis OR...
[14:29] <ssweeny> InHisName, actually i just met lamalex a while ago
[14:29] <lamalex> ssweeny, sorry for the haste, I had to poop real bad
[14:29] <ssweeny> i have no idea about his irc connection habits
[14:29] <lamalex> tmi
[14:29] <ssweeny> lamalex, no sweat. been there.
[14:30] <lamalex> oh, there was sweat
[14:31] <ssweeny> fair enough
[14:45] <InHisName> gettin' sweaty over there ?
[14:46] <InHisName> They must be workin' you all very much.
[15:28] <knightzero> Morning all.
[15:42] <InHisName> Howdy, knightzero
[16:28]  * ChinnoDog yawns
[16:47] <ChinnoDog> Whats new in Ubuntu land?
[16:55] <ssweeny> nothing much going on really
[16:55] <ssweeny> slow week
[17:00] <InHisName> ssweeny: you already know most everything being said ?   Nothing new ?    I sure could of had lots fun finding new stuff to learn !
[17:07] <jedijf> well there's a memorable meeting
[17:08] <jedijf> i'd love to stay and 'chit' chat, but...
[17:12] <ssweeny> InHisName, i was being sarcastic
[17:39] <ChinnoDog> hi Kevin_Sweeney
[18:56] <ChinnoDog> I see how it is.
[19:21] <HowdyDoody> Still working after a few hours
[21:52] <ChinnoDog> @crickets
[21:52] <PennBot> http://www.instantcrickets.com


[04:33] <ScottK> Rhonda: IA-32 libs didn't even sound like a good idea at the time, it was just something that could be done quickly.
[06:18] <Rhonda> ssh, don't debunk my catch phrase :)
[06:23] <ajmitch> don't let facts get in the way of a good argument? :)
[06:34] <Rhonda> 'sactly!
[06:54] <dholbach> good morning
[07:28] <Rhonda> huhm
[07:28] <Rhonda> I think I now saw the issue with packages.ubuntu.com myself …
[08:30] <Rhonda> \o/ tumbleweed :)
[08:33] <tumbleweed> Rhonda: lintian wasn't very impressed with it, though
[08:47] <Rhonda> hmm?
[08:47] <tumbleweed> E: gitolite: control-file-has-bad-permissions md5sums 0664 != 0644
[08:47] <tumbleweed> E: gitolite: control-file-has-bad-permissions templates 0664 != 0644
[08:47] <Rhonda> duh, how did that happen? Doesn't over here
[08:48] <Rhonda> Ah, some umask probably playing into it on the build server
[08:48] <tumbleweed> yeah, ubuntu changed umask recently
[08:49] <Rhonda> but there is this "find $(TMP) ! -type l -print0 2>/dev/null | xargs -0r chmod go=rX,u+rw,a-s" in debian/rules which should adjust that?
[08:49] <Rhonda> ah, wait, templates and md5sums, the control files
[08:49] <tumbleweed> heh, I see Rhonda doesn't like packaging helpers :P
[08:49] <Rhonda> which get generated _after_ the fixperms
[08:50] <Rhonda> Hey, I wanted to know what kind of magic was going on in the background. Apparently not that much. :)
[08:52] <Rhonda> tumbleweed: not liking is based on bad experiences where I had to do handstand coding to get rid of some annoyances, but that was years ago :)
[08:54] <tumbleweed> it's a rather short rules for a no-helper package, I guess it helps that it's a nice simple one
[08:57] <Rhonda> I tried to keep it short and simple so that it can be used as example :)
[08:57] <Rhonda> Maybe I should throw in comments like "# this is the magic that dh_fixperms is actually doing"
[08:58] <Rhonda> For more complex packages it though gets complicated and irritating. Don't look at spl's debian/rules.  ;)
[08:59] <Rhonda> Hmm, not that overwhelming than I thought, but that might just be me and my experience with code …  226 lines
[09:01] <Rhonda> tumbleweed: Should I fix the lintian issues you are seeing and request again, does that mean the package is now blocked, or is it even though it's an error acceptable?
[09:02] <tumbleweed> I'd either suggest uploading 2.0.3-1ubuntu1 with that fixed, or just fix that in Debian and sync. If you made other changes in Debian too, I'd want to review it again
[09:03] <Rhonda> I'd fix some other lintin output too
[09:03] <tumbleweed> if that's manpages, that's fine with me
[09:03] <Rhonda> debian-rules-missing-recommended-target
[09:03] <Rhonda> out-of-date-copyright-format-uri
[09:04] <Rhonda> Those three lines
[09:04] <tumbleweed> fine
[09:06] <Laney> the guy requesting the inkscape backport is my new best friend
[09:13] <hrw> ok. I do not catch it. Package libc6-dev-armhf-cross provides libc6-dev-armhf-armel-cross but gcc-4.6-multilib-arm-linux-gnueabi depends on libc6-dev-armhf-armel-cross and complains on install that libc6-dev-armhf-armel-cross is not installed. Why "provides" does not solve it?
[09:14] <Laney> is the depends versioned?
[09:15] <hrw> Laney: package is 2.13 and depends is on >= 2.5
[09:16] <Laney> versioned deps on virtual packages won't work http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html#s-virtual
[09:17] <hrw> thanks
[09:17] <hrw> will have to create dummy packages then
[09:18] <hrw> let amd speeds up with buldozer cpus... I need to upgrade my machine
[09:37] <Rhonda> tumbleweed: uploaded. :P
[10:36] <Rhonda> hmm. Now I have gitolite_2.0.3-2_source.changes - what next? Never used syncpackage before, where to upload that to? :)
[10:39] <Rhonda> And why did syncpackage re-sign the .dsc file while it already had a good signature?
[10:39] <Laney> are you trying to do a --no-lp upload?
[10:40] <Rhonda> No clue. :)
[10:40] <Rhonda> So far I only did upload to my PPA, and did requestsync :)
[10:40] <tumbleweed> oh, sorry Rhonda I should have been clearer when I suggested using syncpackage :)
[10:41] <tumbleweed> I meant a new syncpackage that can do LP native syncing
[10:41] <Rhonda> No problem, I want to learn. :)
[10:41] <tumbleweed> >= 0.129
[10:43] <Rhonda> ubuntu-dev-tools                          0.101
[10:43] <tumbleweed> ah, we don't have a backport to debian stable
[10:44] <Laney> I bet that's a rather small userbase :-)
[10:44] <tumbleweed> although the PPA build for maverick might work on there
[10:44] <Rhonda> Laney could do it, he got upload permissions to backports recently. :P
[10:44] <tumbleweed> otherwise, it should run fine out of a bzr checkout
[10:44] <Laney> it requires some other backports too
[10:44] <Laney> since some scripts moved about
[10:44] <Rhonda> Anyway, I let it rest for now, will try at home from my wheezy laptop
[10:44] <tumbleweed> yeah, stuff moved to devscripts, distro-info, and lp-tools
[10:45] <Laney> bdrung said a backport to natty would be too hard, so stable …
[10:45] <tumbleweed> Laney: OTOH, backporting this specific feature anywhere wouldn't be that hard
[10:45] <ScottK> I'm fine with that.
[10:45] <bdrung> Laney: you can do it, if you backport devscripts, distro-info, lp-tools, and python-debian
[10:46] <Laney> if [list of tiresome things]
[10:47] <Laney> I wouldn't know enough about how cherry-pickable syncpackage is — didn't it require some changes in ubuntutools/?
[10:47] <Laney> but, I support doing that
[10:47] <tumbleweed> I'm happy to do some exploration into that
[10:48] <Rhonda> Laney: I wouldn't accept a cherry-picked backport anyway. :P
[10:49] <Laney> I was referring to natty-backports
[10:49] <tumbleweed> this is a generally useful thing to backport in Ubuntu
[10:49] <tumbleweed> probably less so in Debian
[10:51] <tumbleweed> talking of which, I still need someone to review my u-d-t SRUs in Ubuntu. I don't like verifying my own SRUs
[10:53] <Laney> Rhonda: btw, is there any plan for backports integrating with the bts? Like it learning about backports versions and so on.
[11:30] <Rhonda> Laney: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2011/06/msg00247.html and following
[11:32] <Rhonda> Laney: tl;dr - no version tracking in the BTS, but most important: No concept of different maintainers for a package
[11:33] <Laney> well yeah, but that's not unsolvable
[11:33] <Laney> if backporting, change the maintainer and let the bts know that different versions can have different maintainers
[11:33] <Laney> but i will read it
[11:33] <Rhonda> I'll tell don that we have a volunteer  \o/
[11:34] <Rhonda> But that's exact the issue: The bts doesn't has the concept yet that different versions can have different maintainers
[11:36] <Laney> or have backports bugs sent to some pts keyword that the maintainer isn't subscribed to by default
[11:40] <Rhonda> There are loads of ideas how it could be done, but noone doing the actual code. The issue is known since a pretty long time now. (in this case) unfortunately there isn't a canonical behind Debian that would make sure that such things get done in a timely manner, and it didn't itch noone big enough yet to fix it
[11:41] <Rhonda> I'd be more than interested in digging into it, but there are so much other tasks that I look after that otherwise would be lying around because they are also uninteresting to others
[11:41] <Laney> :-)
[11:42] <Rhonda> Heck, I haven't got to looking at the squeeze RC graph since a few months, and squeeze is meant to be a supported release.  %-/
[12:10] <tumbleweed> Laney, bdrung: I did a quick and dirty backport in bug 860506
[12:10] <tumbleweed> there is unecessary stuff included, but I don't think it's dangerous, and I preferred to backport whole files where possible
[12:12] <Laney> cool
[12:12] <Laney> it'd be good to test various types of sync
[12:13]  * tumbleweed only did simulated requestsync and syncpackage
[14:11] <hrw> why when I am dputting http://paste.ubuntu.com/697897/ to ppa I do not get orig.tar.gz uploaded http://paste.ubuntu.com/697898/ ?
[14:11] <Zhenech> did you include it in "build"?
[14:12] <hrw> good point. _source.changes lacks it
[14:12] <Zhenech> -sa to debbuild
[14:14] <hrw> Zhenech: thx
[14:14] <Zhenech> it defaults to include it in -1 uploads and do not in everything else
[14:15] <hrw> but there was no uploads of it previously and package is -1~linaro5 for a reason
[14:15] <hrw> ok, /me -> code
[14:15] <Zhenech> weill, -1~linaro5 isn't -1 ;)
[14:17] <Zhenech> and debuild doesnt know that you didnt upload anything else yet
[14:17] <hrw> yep
[17:26] <SMJ> is Box2D going to be updated any time soon?
[17:28] <SMJ> oh, feature freeze.
[18:40] <tumbleweed> SMJ: yeah, it would require lots of jumping up and down to make it happen (and a good reason, and some testing)


[15:42] <qense> good afternoon!
[17:04] <Nafai> Who hear is in charge of notify-osd?
[17:04] <Nafai> here
[17:05] <seb128> hey Nafai
[17:05] <seb128> Nafai, MacSlow
[17:05] <seb128> why?
[17:05] <Nafai> ok
[17:05] <Nafai> I think I've run out of trails to go down to figure out why the wrong album cover is being shown
[17:06] <Nafai> And I've found a couple other bugs that might be related and wondering if he bug is in notify-osd itself
[17:06] <seb128> right
[17:06] <Nafai> (bugs on launchpad, that is)
[17:06] <seb128> what I was thinking too when we discussed the empathy one yesterday
[17:06] <seb128> can you make notify-osd write extra infos in its logs?
[17:06] <jcastro> Nafai: I get the feeling that you're going to end up fixing lots of things in notify-osd. :D
[17:06] <seb128> that would be a good start
[17:07] <seb128> like flags received
[17:07] <Nafai> seb128: Sure, that does sound like a good start
[17:07] <seb128> and images
[17:07] <Nafai> jcastro: Yeah, sounds like it :)
[17:07] <seb128> it does write to .cache/notify-osd.log
[17:07] <Nafai> btw, I see you tumbled my blog entry
[17:07] <seb128> but that has only the text right now
[17:07] <jcastro> Nafai: yeah that was actually an accident, but it's a good article anyway, heh
[17:08] <jcastro> Nafai: check this out: https://edge.launchpad.net/notify-osd/+patches
[17:08] <Nafai> Is this a pending patches view?
[17:08] <jcastro> yeah
[17:08] <jcastro> so those are bugs with patches attached
[17:08] <jcastro> it would probably be a good idea to go through those at some point
[17:08] <Nafai> ok
[17:08] <jcastro> but less priority than what seb has assigned you
[17:09] <Nafai> I found https://bugs.launchpad.net/notify-osd/+bug/525546 and https://bugs.launchpad.net/notify-osd/+bug/518021 that both sound related
[17:09] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 525546 in notify-osd "Unable to update notification if content doesn't differ much (affects: 1)" [Medium,Fix committed]
[17:09] <Nafai> btw, gdb question
[17:09] <Nafai> is there a way without having a breakpoint that I can have it spit out the value of a variable at a point?
[17:09] <Nafai> I don't want to have to keep hitting continue, but I'd like to monitor it
[17:10] <Nafai> (been a while since I've used gdb for much more than getting back traces)
[17:17] <seb128> Nafai, that one should be fixed in lucid
[17:17] <Nafai> ok
[17:17] <seb128> Nafai, rebuild with a printf where you want?
[17:18] <Nafai> I could do that too :)
[17:19] <seb128> it's not like notify-osd was long to build
[18:24] <jono> kenvandine, ping?
[18:37] <kenvandine> jono, pong
[18:39] <jono> is there a gwibber hug day planned?
[18:39] <kenvandine> jono, not that i know of
[18:39] <kenvandine> there was one a few weeks back i think
[18:39] <kenvandine> but
[18:39] <kenvandine> we should have one soon
[18:40] <jcastro> gwibber bug day is tomorrow
[18:40] <jcastro> kenvandine: you had me schedule one remember?
[18:40] <kenvandine> oh yeah
[18:40] <kenvandine> cool!
[18:40]  * kenvandine had forgotten
[18:40] <jono> lol
[18:41] <jono> jcastro, I would like to talk about scheduling some more QA days
[18:41] <jcastro> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/Planning
[18:41] <Nafai> Hey jono
[18:42] <jcastro> jono: basically the workflow is "tell pedro and add it to the list"
[18:42] <jcastro> kenvandine: the package has been adopted by 2 people too, so the bugs should get way less suckier
[18:42] <kenvandine> awesome
[18:42] <jono> jcastro, ok, I just think we can do a better job of building buzz around it
[18:42] <jono> does each event have targeted bug lists?
[18:42] <kenvandine> jcastro, after we talked about that i got spammed with bug mail
[18:42] <kenvandine> so thought it happened :)
[18:43] <jcastro> kenvandine: no that was an opportunistic stab at my part.
[18:43] <kenvandine> jcastro, you rock!
[18:44] <jcastro> jono: yes, one moment
[18:44] <jcastro> jono: here's an example: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20100311
[18:44] <jcastro> jono: here's the last gwibber one: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/20091105
[18:46] <jono> jcastro, awesome: so it sounds well organized, we just need to build some buzz
[18:46] <jcastro> yeah, the word gets out in the existing QA channels
[18:46] <jcastro> but not outside those usually tbh
[18:55] <manish> jcastro, I got the code for gwibber, the setup is broken
[18:55] <manish> just asking
[18:55] <jcastro> what do you mean?
[18:58] <qense> jcastro: Did you read the mail Jono CC'ed you? I was wondering what plans you had for bringing 'opportunities' under the attention of potential contributors.
[19:00] <jcastro> qense: which one, the Wanted one?
[19:00] <qense> jcastro: yes
[19:00] <qense> the Wanted One
[19:01] <jcastro> I need to think about it for a bit
[19:01] <qense> that's fine
[19:01] <qense> We're not in a hurry (yet.)


[18:00] <pleia2> ok, meeting time :)
[18:00] <pleia2> #startmeeting
[18:00] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Apr 10 18:00:06 2012 UTC.  The chair is pleia2. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[18:00] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[18:00] <pleia2> who all is here for our meeting?
[18:00] <System76Chick> I'm here!
[18:00]  * AlisonW raises hand (though you can't see it)
[18:00] <akk> o/
[18:01] <pleia2> #link http://wiki.ubuntu-women.org/Meetings/Agenda
[18:03] <pleia2> so the biggest thing on our agenda is our blueprint
[18:03] <akgraner> o/
[18:03] <pleia2> #topic Precise Blueprint
[18:03] <pleia2> #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu-women.org/+spec/community-p-ubuntu-women-project-goals
[18:05] <pleia2> jledbetter, nigelb, any updates regarding reaching out to other organizations about their in-person events that we can draw from?
[18:05] <pleia2> I'm in email contact with susan-spencer about the profiles of women we're seeking to target with our efforts, I owe her an email with my thoughts
[18:06] <jledbetter> o/ (sorry, late)
[18:06] <pleia2> and I think I'll do one cycle-through of the wiki and then mark "Review wiki pages" as DONE since it's an ongoing process forever
[18:06] <jledbetter> pleia2: No updates from me on that. Sorry.
[18:06] <pleia2> no worries, just checking in :)
[18:06] <nigelb> Nothing yet, sorry, been a bit busy with real life stuff.
[18:06] <pleia2> thanks
[18:07] <pleia2> the other action item I had from last meeting was fixing the planet.ubuntu-women.org, which I was actually able to do without submitting a ticket
[18:07] <pleia2> even tossed our new logo up there
[18:07] <jledbetter> Cool
[18:07] <pleia2> I also went through all the feeds and commented out any of the inactive ones
[18:09] <pleia2> Cindy McKee from our last meeting took some time to set up a blog with a theme that can be configured via the wordpress web interface we may want to try out and see if canonical can install next cycle, I owe her an email too
[18:09] <Cheri703> I am here but mobile, sorry
[18:10] <pleia2> any other comments blueprint-wise? we should mark them either DONE or DEFERRED before release, so I'll follow up with folks later to make some decisions
[18:12] <pleia2> ok, our next scheduled meeting lands on the week of the Ubuntu Developer Summit
[18:13] <pleia2> so I'm inclined to push it back a week, so it ends up on the 3rd Tuesday and we can discuss what we discussed at UDS and can finalize the blueprint
[18:14] <pleia2> I'll create the outline of the blueprint this week and we can brainstorm some ideas on list
[18:14] <pleia2> and here :) anyone have any thoughts about our plans for the next 6 months?
[18:16] <jledbetter> +1 to pushing back
[18:16] <pleia2> ok great
[18:16] <jledbetter> Plans... I guess finish up what we didn't get done this sprint?
[18:16] <pleia2> yeah, do we want to just mark the item you and nigelb have as deferred?
[18:16] <pleia2> re-evaluate at/around UDS time
[18:17] <pleia2> #action pleia2 to create community-q-ubuntu-women-project-goals blueprint
[18:17] <meetingology> ACTION: pleia2 to create community-q-ubuntu-women-project-goals blueprint
[18:17] <jledbetter> I think so. nigelb?
[18:25] <jledbetter> So, yes :)
[18:29] <pleia2> alright, that's all I really had meeting-wise and it sounds like no one else has things to add yet :)
[18:29] <pleia2> thanks everyone
[18:29] <akgraner> thanks pleia2!
[18:29] <pleia2> #endmeeting
[18:29] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Apr 10 18:29:39 2012 UTC.
[18:29] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-women-project/2012/ubuntu-women-project.2012-04-10-18.00.moin.txt
[18:29] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-women-project/2012/ubuntu-women-project.2012-04-10-18.00.html


[00:41]  * jjohansen back on later
[08:02] <pmcenery> I'm trying to rebuild the source package linux-image-2.6.38-8-generic using sbuild
[08:03] <pmcenery> I get the following error EE: Previous or current ABI file missing!
[08:04] <pmcenery> I have read you need to define the following environment varibale before the build AUTOBUILD=1
[08:04] <pmcenery> Does anyone know how to do this with sbuild?
[09:16] <cooloney> apw: hey, andy
[09:16] <apw> cooloney, s'up
[09:17] <cooloney> apw: yeah, i am trying to merge master ubuntu -8.41 and -8.42 patches on our ti-omap4
[09:17] <cooloney> apw: but got lots of conflicts
[09:17] <apw> i thought you already did that
[09:18] <apw> or more correctly, i thought tim pulled in your previous pull-request for that
[09:19] <cooloney> right, tim pull my previous one
[09:19] <cooloney> which is just -7.39 based
[09:19] <cooloney> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/ubuntu-natty.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/ti-omap4
[09:20] <cooloney> apw: so i try to merge those patches like you did
[09:20] <cooloney> apw: but face too many conflicts, i'm not sure i did right command
[09:20] <apw> well to do the merge i reconstructed your base tree to be merges
[09:21] <apw> to avoid all the conflicts having patches on both sides causes
[09:22] <apw> that version is pushed up to my tree on zinc if you want to look at/use it
[09:22] <apw> cooloney, ^^
[09:22] <cooloney> apw: yeah, i am looking at it.
[09:22] <cooloney> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=apw/ubuntu-natty.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/ti-omap4
[09:22] <cooloney> apw: is this one ^^
[09:23] <apw> cooloney, yep thats the one, what i did was dropped all the commits which would have come from .40 and merge that instead, then applied your local delta for the branch, then compared that to your original tree, and it was the same
[09:23] <apw> (well other than some spacing changes in aufs, so you had to use git diff -b to confirm its a null diff)
[09:24] <cooloney> apw: looks like we need to reconstruct the tree again.
[09:25] <apw> cooloney, why ?
[09:25] <cooloney> apw: i mean change some commints which are in ti-omap4 ubuntu branch,
[09:26] <cooloney> not just merge patches on it
[09:26] <apw> which commits need changes ?
[09:26] <apw> you mean you also want to add some new patches ?
[09:27]  * bryceh waves to apw
[09:27] <apw> bryceh, hii
[09:27] <apw> cooloney, i am not quite understanding you
[09:28] <bryceh> apw, thanks for the new kernel dailies; I put them to good use today
[09:28] <cooloney> apw: i found this http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=apw/ubuntu-natty.git;a=commitdiff;h=d7faeb2d5c3c7d126add877f2ca450a225a02272 in your tree
[09:28] <apw> bryceh, oh did they actually rebuild, good
[09:28] <bryceh> apw, indeed, and at least a few reports so far of issues solved by it
[09:28] <cooloney> so we need try this firstly and applied ti-omap4 delta, and merge .41 .42
[09:28] <apw> cooloney, but that is exactly what is on my tree ?
[09:29] <cooloney> looks like we need to replace the ubuntu ti-omap4 with a new branch now
[09:29] <cooloney> not just try to put .41 .42 patches on top
[09:30] <apw> cooloney, right ... let me make a ti-omap4 which matches exactly your tip
[09:30] <apw> and you can base off that for your next pull, and you can do the merges
[09:31] <cooloney> apw: awesome, since I can merging patches from linaro guy without any conflicts
[09:31] <cooloney> apw: so i try to creat a ti-omap4 like this
[09:31] <apw> cooloney, ok give me a few mins, to pull out the base, as i have it here
[09:32] <cooloney> 1208.11 + merging linaro patches + merging ubuntu master patches + 1208.12/1209.12
[09:32] <cooloney> apw: thanks a lot, man
[09:34] <apw> cooloney, also reember when you do a merge (or a rebase) you need to use debian/scripts/misc/insert-ubuntu-changes to copy over the changelog fragments
[09:34] <apw> i note that you have not been doing this before, and that makes tracking bugs and cves hard
[09:34] <cooloney> apw: oh, got it. yeah, it is my first time to do merging
[09:35] <apw> cooloney, ok you should find a new branch ti-omap4-40 which represents the latest upload but in merge form
[09:35] <apw> you should find you can pretty simply merge into that from the Ubuntu-2.6.38-8.42 tag for instance
[09:36] <cooloney> great, let me fetch it
[09:36] <apw> then you would do debian/scripts/misc/insert-ubuntu-changes debian.ti-omap4/changelog Ubuntu-2.6.38-8.40 Ubuntu-2.6.38-8.42
[09:36] <apw> to get the changes copied over, then commit that as 'merge in Ubuntu-2.6.38-8.42'
[09:36] <apw> then you can merge in linaro or apply local patches or whatever
[09:36] <apw> then fdr insertchanges as normal and you are good to make a pull request
[09:39] <apw> cooloney, when you are done, push it up and i can review it
[09:40] <cooloney> apw: yeah, no problem
[09:40] <cooloney> oh, how about just run 'fdr insertchanges'
[09:40] <cooloney> before that i normally try fdr printchanges'
[09:41] <apw> sensible, but not required, printchanges just displays what will go in
[09:41] <cooloney> yeah, just take a look at that
[09:42] <cooloney> then use fdr insertchanges
[09:42] <apw> you would expect to see just two merges one which is the real merge, and one which is the commit containing the changelog update
[09:42] <cooloney> got it.
[09:43] <cooloney> i saw your branch contains those merging commits
[09:43] <apw> yeah, i was experiemtning, though you released between so it is stale now
[13:39] <apw> cking, did you electrician turn up in the end?
[13:40] <tgardner> apw, did you catch in scroll back yesterday where I bugged you about upstreaming the fb dev locking patch?
[13:40] <apw> ahh no i didn't
[13:40]  * apw adds it to his todo
[13:41] <tgardner> apw, I saw a discussion on LKML where someone else was hitting the same problem
[13:41] <apw> ahh right, thanks, got a pointer to the thread ?
[13:42] <tgardner> apw, yeah, right. snort...
[13:42] <apw> tgardner, :)
[13:42] <tgardner> apw, it would have been too handy if I'd have written it down at the time
[13:43] <apw> heh yeah, i never do that either, and annoy myself often
[13:44] <cking> apw, yep, now waiting for the certification process to kick in
[13:47] <apw> cking, that sounds mad, if its not cirtified do they burn your house to the gruond ?
[13:49] <cking> it means I can sell the house if I want to
[14:21] <ogasawara> apw: the delta config scripts you have, can you point me to them?  I hacked together scripts of my own to generate the output on the wiki, but I wouldn't mind double checking our scripts produced the same data.
[14:22] <apw> ogasawara, i have more experimental options changing than you i think
[14:22] <apw> i think you have none
[14:22] <apw> i think i have two or something
[14:24] <tgardner> sforshee, lemme know when you're done on tangerine. it needs a reboot for a kernel update.
[14:26] <apw> ogasawara, am looking at sucking it all up together
[14:27] <ogasawara> apw: that'd be good.  maybe we can check it into kteam-tools.
[14:27] <apw> ogasawara, yeah will do that now
[14:28] <apw> then you can fix it :)
[14:28] <ogasawara> heh
[14:28] <sforshee> tgardner, that's weird, I'm not using tangerine, don't know what those jobs are
[14:28] <sforshee> go ahead and reboot
[14:30] <smb> /me should have paid attention to tgardner as he *was* using tangerine. Meh...
[14:30] <tgardner> smb, it'll be back in 5 minutes
[14:31] <smb> tgardner, good enough
[14:40] <tgardner> apw, you're audio is totally scrogged now
[14:45] <tgardner> smb, tangerine is back
[14:45] <smb> tgardner, yup, I know. :) Thanks
[14:46] <tgardner> updating natty schroot
[15:15] <apw> ogasawara, you do not want to run this script on a slow computer :)
[15:15] <ogasawara> apw: heh, good to know
[15:15] <apw> its been running for about 20 mins on my netbook :)
[15:15] <tgardner> apw, why wouldn't you do it on one of our servers?
[15:16] <apw> tgardner, oh that would have been much more sensible, and once its in kteam tools -- it'll be easy too
[15:16] <apw> i am just confirming it is disconnected from my home directory
[15:16] <tgardner> apw, hmm, last I noted you still had commit rights :)
[15:17] <apw> yep, i thought i'd just run it quick before committing it, to make sure i'd done it right
[15:17] <apw> it might have been quicker to push it, then do it
[16:39] <ogasawara> apw: just fyi, kees asked us yesterday that when we update the ubuntu-cve-tracker if we could switch "-" for "~" if we note something is released.  eg.  released (2.6.39~rc1) so that it conforms to debian versioning.
[16:40] <ogasawara> apw: only reason I mention it is it looks like the atuo triage tool you have might need tweaking
[16:47] <JFo> <- grabbing food
[17:07] <bdmurray> bjf: the staging bug title change made it into apport
[17:08] <bjf> bdmurray, sweet! thanks for handling that
[17:10] <bdmurray> bjf: your question change should probably be SRU'ed too I'd think
[17:11] <bjf> bdmurray, i did a bug with SRU text in it
[17:13] <cprofitt> tgardner: I am trying to make heads or tails of the iwlagn issue and it looks as though things might be getting around to solved based on the latest reports on LP
[17:14] <cprofitt> I was curious if you could help clarify if that is correct for the 5300 and 6300 series of the cards
[17:14] <tgardner> cprofitt, well, sort of. I think there are still likely issues with 802.11n
[17:14] <tgardner> cprofitt, Intel claims they should be working
[17:14] <tgardner> in fact. they are only focused on newer cards. 3945 and 4965 are in community maintenance mode
[17:15] <cprofitt> does Natty B2 have the Intel fixes -- should I work on testing that?
[17:15] <cprofitt> I have a 5300 and was debating getting a new laptop with the 6300 in it...
[17:15] <tgardner> you could be running from https://launchpad.net/~kernel-ppa/+archive/pre-proposed
[17:16] <cprofitt> hey... there is the other key person involved with the Intel iwlagn
[17:17] <cprofitt> I do appreciate the work you guys are doing
[17:18] <bjf> bdmurray, bug 765178
[17:18] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 765178 in apport "remove user-input questions from linux source package hooks" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765178
[17:20] <cprofitt> tgardner: I have been following bug 630748 -- is that the correct one to follow or is there another for the issue?
[17:20] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 630748 in linux "iwlagn degrades quickly during normal wifi session" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/630748
[17:21] <tgardner> cprofitt, that is pretty much the uber-bug for this particular issue.
[17:22] <cprofitt> tgardner: alright -- if you need testing on anything let me know. I will take a look at the PPA when I get home tonight
[17:23] <tgardner> cprofitt, ack
[17:23] <cprofitt> tgardner: are the 6300 series cards ok, or do they also suffer from the issue?
[17:24] <tgardner> cprofitt, dunno for sure. I've no personal experience with them.
[17:25] <cprofitt> k... will have to see if i can find a person who has one for testing prior to making a purchase.
[17:25] <cprofitt> thanks for taking the time to answer the questions
[17:43] <JFo> bug of note: bug 759213
[17:43] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 759213 in linux "[HP Compaq 6005 Pro] Suspend does not resume" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/759213
[17:49] <JFo> apw, tgardner didn't we remove the ability to hibernate?
[17:50] <tgardner> JFo, its still in the kernel, but its been removed from the user space choices AFAIK
[17:50] <JFo> hmmm
[17:50] <JFo> bug 760036
[17:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 760036 in linux "[Dell Inspiron 580] Hibernate unable to resume properly" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/760036
[17:51] <JFo> cert blocker
[17:51]  * JFo goes to verify on his natty machine
[17:51] <tgardner> ick
[17:51] <JFo> yeah
[17:51] <ohsix> you can't hibernate anymore? D:
[17:52] <bdmurray> tgardner: if its removed the menu should it really block certification then?
[17:52] <tgardner> likely not, but we should check that its really gone from the menu
[17:52] <ohsix> i'm on natty and i still see menu entries for it
[17:52] <bdmurray> ohsix: with unity or classic?
[17:52] <ohsix> and i've not seen any changelog or release change notices that say that's being removed
[17:52] <ohsix> classic
[17:53] <JFo> sorry, had to boot it first
[17:53] <JFo> it is still there in my netbook
[17:53] <JFo> tgardner, ^
[17:54] <cking> hrm, my natty install with unity has a hibernate option
[17:54] <JFo> see cking I told you :-P
[17:54] <ohsix> if it's being considered for removal consider this my official request that it's not :D
[17:54] <tgardner> well, I thought it was the result of our rally discussions in Dallas
[17:54] <JFo> same here
[17:54] <ohsix> in fact i would have been SOL just yesterday without hibernate
[17:54] <JFo> I distinctly remember it having been decided
[17:54] <cking> hibernate on the natty kernel is much improved now it uses compression
[17:56] <jjohansen> JFo: I remember it being decided, and wasn't even there
[17:56] <JFo> jjohansen, :-)
[18:06] <JFo> so I guess someone un-decided it and deglected to tell us
[18:18] <apw> ogasawara, ok i've pushed the scripts to kteam tools, new subdir devel, the one of interest is devel-config-summary ubuntu-natty ubuntu-oneirc ... note it will do lots of futsing in your repos which will end up being reset hard to their current HEAD (which you'd want to be master-next)
[18:19] <apw> the report is straight to stdout, so i normally | tee SUMMARY
[18:19] <apw> an example which looks right against te current tips is in zinc:~apw/SUMMARY
[18:28] <ogasawara> apw: cool, i'll test it out when i get back
[18:28]  * ogasawara bails for a bit
[19:00]  * tgardner --> lunch
[19:31] <JFo> stepping away for a while. I have errands to run before some places close for tomorrow and I have some early dinner plans. be back on later
[19:34]  * apw calls it a day .. have fun
[19:34] <tgardner> apw, have a good weekend
[19:35]  * bjf[afk] -> lunch
[20:21] <godber> hi, is it unusual for a kernel to be in both updates and proposed, as 2.6.32-31.61 is here: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux
[20:57] <njin> hello, can someone tell me if the bcm 4331 driver is shipped ? thanks
[20:57]  * jjohansen -> lunch
[21:03] <pmcenery> Hi. I'm trying to apt-get source linux-image-2.6.38-8-generic, apply a path, bump the version and recombile with sbuild. I noticed there is a debian and debian.master folder. Which one do I bump the version in?
[22:29] <komputes> Can someone from the kernel team please have a look at Bug #768497 - It seems the card reader on a Acer Aspire 5943G ignore PCI bus 4 unless the system is booted with an SD card present.
[22:30] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 768497 in linux "[STAGING] " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/768497
[22:33] <komputes> JFo: ^
[22:33] <komputes> bbl
[22:34] <sconklin> pmcenery: the recommended way to build an ubuntu kernel is from the git repo, see this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/BuildYourOwnKernel
[22:34] <sconklin> pmcenery: and you would change the version in debian.master/changelog right before you do the fakeroot debian/rules clean
[22:35] <bjf> komputes, nice drive-by
[22:57] <eruditehermit> hello
[22:57] <eruditehermit> is anyone here an Ubuntu kernel developer?
[23:02] <eruditehermit> I have a request for the kernel
[23:05] <eruditehermit> to enable laptops with multiple GPUs to boot properly, CONFIG_FRAMEBUFFER_CONSOLE_DETECT_PRIMARY must be set in Kconfig. The kernel developer for X Dave Airlie is going to enable it by default in upstream kernels from now on but it would be nice if Ubuntu could activate it for current kernels as it makes some laptops boot properly.
[23:06] <eruditehermit> brb
[23:17] <bjf> eruditehermit, please file a bug and then come back here and tell us what the bug number is
[23:17] <eruditehermit> bjf, ok
[23:18] <eruditehermit> bjf, is there a way to file bugs through the web or is it ubuntubug?
[23:18] <bjf> eruditehermit, the kernel is frozen, it will take a SRU (stable release update request) for a fix
[23:18] <bjf> eruditehermit, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+filebug
[23:25] <jjohansen> rebooting
[23:27] <eruditehermit> bjf, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/768645
[23:27] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 768645 in linux "CONFIG_FRAMEBUFFER_CONSOLE_DETECT_PRIMARY should be SET in kernel config" [Undecided,New]
[23:27] <bjf> eruditehermit, thanks
[23:28] <bjf> JFo, ^ can we get that added to the list ?
[23:29] <eruditehermit> bjf, someone mentioned that ubuntu has build servers for ppas?
[23:29] <eruditehermit> can I build a kernel on it with that enabled if I get a ppa?
[23:29] <bjf> eruditehermit, does that config option already exist ?
[23:29] <eruditehermit> yes
[23:29] <eruditehermit> its just not set
[23:30] <eruditehermit> in natty
[23:32] <eruditehermit> bjf, cat /boot/config-2.6.38-8-generic | grep CONFIG_FRAMEBUFFER_CONSOLE_DETECT_PRIMARY
[23:32] <bjf> yes, i'm looking at it now
[23:34] <bjf> eruditehermit, are you looking for an amd64 or i386 kernel ?
[23:34] <eruditehermit> I am using amd64
[23:37] <bjf> eruditehermit, give me a sec and i should have a kernel for you
[23:37] <eruditehermit> bjf, nice thanks =)
[23:38] <bjf> eruditehermit, to answer your previous question, yes we do have build resources available via ppa, however, it's kind of a slow way to go
[23:39] <eruditehermit> whats the fastest way to go
[23:40] <eruditehermit> I have to install all the dependencies on my machine to build anything because its my daily use laptop
[23:40] <bjf> eruditehermit, for me to do it for you :-), though it will be more than a second, it shouldn't be very long
[23:40] <eruditehermit> ok
[23:40] <eruditehermit> thanks
[23:40] <bjf> eruditehermit, i have access to a very big build server
[23:40] <bjf> eruditehermit, np
[23:40] <eruditehermit> well let me restart
[23:41] <eruditehermit> I am currently on software rasterizer
[23:41] <eruditehermit> brb with intel
[23:44] <eruditehermit> hello again
[23:50] <eruditehermit> bjf, so do you think this will get in sometime for natty? even if its an update shortly after release?
[23:56] <bjf> eruditehermit, it's building now, shouldn't take too long
[23:57] <bjf> eruditehermit, i'd guess so, but without digging in more to understand what enabling that config option also drags in and the impact on other code, i can't say for sure
[23:58] <bjf> eruditehermit, if Dave Airlie can it to the default config and get that in as a stable upstream commit, it would have more weight behind it
[23:58] <bjf> eruditehermit, is this a laptop that has multiple gpus or a desktop ?


[05:35] <ubotu> New bug: #184259 in ubuntu-doc "update crash in hardy alpha3  (/var/log/dist-upgrade/) " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/184259
[08:30] <Kr0ntab> good evnin/mornin folks...