[04:10] <Alinux> hello, someone who speaks italian?
[04:10] <Alinux> or can help me :)
[04:22] <jamesh> I don't speak italian, but may be able to help you
[04:23] <Alinux> ;)
[04:24] <jamesh> what is the problem?
[04:24] <Alinux> jamesh, I'm georgian translation team administrator... but I can't understan why I can't validate a translation... from rose ---> to green color
[04:24] <jamesh> Alinux: that's one area I'm not so familiar with :(
[04:25] <Alinux> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+lang/ka
[04:25] <jamesh> Alinux: if you wait a while, carlos and jordi should come online
[04:25] <jamesh> alternatively you could ask on the rosetta mailing list
[04:25] <Alinux> and some breezy applications, are not checkable in dapper translation list...
[04:26] <jamesh> Alinux: iirc, the green colour is stuff that gets imported from the packages
[04:26] <Alinux> jamesh, do you know what's initial ubuntu installer package name?
[04:26] <jamesh> Alinux: the colour should change automatically once the translations get rolled out in language packs
[04:26] <jamesh> debian-installer, maybe?
[04:26] <Alinux> mmm
[04:27] <Alinux> I don't know from where I can import this application.
[04:27] <Alinux> launchpad is quite confused for me :)
[04:28] <Alinux> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/nautilus/+pots/nautilus/ --- here for example....all translations are green...and georgian is not included...
[04:28] <Alinux> I can't understand the reason.
[04:44] <jamesh> Alinux: do you have georgian selected as one of your preferred languages?
[04:45] <Alinux> yes of course
[04:45] <jamesh> https://launchpad.net/rosetta/prefs <- if you have it selected here, Georgian will always be displayed in the list of translations, even if there are zero translations
[04:47] <jamesh> e.g. on the URL you listed, "English (Australian)" is listed for me, even though there are no translations
[04:47] <Alinux> I know this I have 3 prefered languages...
[04:48] <Alinux> I'm talking about general translations... I can't see general resultats... almost 98% of translations are colored green.
[04:48] <Alinux> but georgian is not. :(
[04:49] <Alinux> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+translations here for example
[04:56] <Alinux> http://l10n-status.gnome.org/gnome-2.14/ and what's about this? should I translate here too?
[05:06] <Alinux> jamesh, by the way tnak you for replying :)
[05:20] <stub> spiv: You back on board or still sick?
[05:21] <spiv> stub: I'm back.  Hmm, I guess I should've mailed about that.
[05:22] <spiv> I see you've got more LibrarianGarbageCollection code, and a librarian bug/feature for me :)
[05:22] <spiv> (updating last accessed)
[05:25] <stub> Yup ;)
[05:29] <jamesh> spiv: if you have some time, could you look at my ValidatingSignOnlyGpgKeys branch?
[05:30] <jamesh> spiv: the large line count on the pending-reviews/ page is due to deleting unneeded copies of some PGP keys
[05:30] <spiv> jamesh: Ah :)
[05:31] <spiv> jamesh: Is there any particular reason your bugzilla-import branch is unreviewed, btw?
[05:31] <jamesh> spiv: no.
[05:31] <jamesh> no one has reviewed it
[05:32] <jamesh> spiv: I added diffstat output to the tops of the diffs too, btw
[05:32] <spiv> Oh, nice.
[05:33] <spiv> That was a good idea!
[05:33] <jamesh> I'll add the "diff -p" output once https://launchpad.net/products/bzr/+bug/4047 gets fixed
[05:33] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #4047: bzrlib.diff.show_diff() can't send output to a file when using external diff Fix req. for: bzr (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: New http://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/4047
[07:40] <zerokarmaleft> hello
[07:45] <jamesh> spiv: thanks for the review
[07:45] <jamesh> hi zerokarmaleft
[08:05] <zerokarmaleft> wow, rosetta looks like an awesome for translations
[09:13] <jordi> meh
[09:13] <jordi> missed the georgian guy.
[10:04] <lifeless> SteveA: meeting time ?
[10:04] <SteveA> lifeless: not sure... my appointment .txt file is on my laptop, which i'm currently having some problems with
[10:04] <lifeless> ah
[10:04] <lifeless> 1000 UTC I thought
[10:05] <SteveA> for... ?
[10:05] <lifeless> you me and ddaa
[10:05] <lifeless> re bzr pipeline
[10:05] <SteveA> ah, yeah
[10:05] <SteveA> i'll check my email
[10:06] <lifeless> what happens on your laptop ?
[10:06] <ddaa> Thought it was in 1h as well.
[10:06] <SteveA> i wake it up from sleeping.  i've changed physical location, so i reconfigure the wireless: iwconfig eth1 essid any
[10:06] <SteveA> then i say dhclient eth1
[10:06] <SteveA> then it suspends
[10:07] <lifeless> rotfl
[10:07] <SteveA> it was doing it at UBZ too
[10:07] <lifeless> dmesg have anything interesting ?
[10:07] <SteveA> it happens only sometimes, so i'm trying to keep it in that state until someone turns up who can help debug it
[10:07] <lifeless> (and why do you not use ifup/ifdown ?
[10:07] <SteveA> no, nothing interesting in dmesg
[10:07] <lifeless> what about daemon.log ?
[10:07] <SteveA> haven't checked daemon.log
[10:08] <ddaa> "User try to use me. Oh No! Going back to sleep."
[10:09] <lifeless> SteveA: have a look now ?
[10:09] <SteveA> ifup / ifdown means i'd need to edit /etc/network/interfaces
[10:09] <ddaa> "to disable this feature, run 'echo 0 > /proc/sys/acpi/lazy_lemming'"
[10:09] <SteveA> yeah, if i can get it to remain awake long enough :-)
[10:09] <lifeless> SteveA: no it does not
[10:10] <lifeless> for example, this is my config from interfaces for TELUS:
[10:10] <lifeless> -----
[10:10] <SteveA> in any case, i'm pretty sure that ifup / ifdown has the same effect
[10:10] <lifeless> iface telus inet dhcp
[10:10] <lifeless>         wireless-mode managed
[10:10] <lifeless>         wireless-essid TELUS
[10:10] <lifeless> -----
[10:10] <lifeless> then after sleep when we were there I did:
[10:10] <SteveA> how does it know that's eth1?
[10:10] <lifeless> 'sudo ifdown eth1 && sudo ifup eth1=telus'
[10:11] <SteveA> aha
[10:11] <lifeless> so, anything interesting in daemon.log ?
[10:11] <SteveA> i need to be in a meeting now...
[10:11] <SteveA> so, i'll look a little later
[10:11] <lifeless> yes, with me - is it not 1010UTC ?
[10:12] <lifeless> oh
[10:12] <lifeless> right, 50 minutes
[10:12] <ddaa> I think it's 0910UTC
[10:12] <lifeless> see you both then :0
[10:22] <carlos> morning
[11:01] <SteveA_> lifeless, ddaa: i'll be with you in 5 mins, just concluding this meeting
[11:03] <lifeless> k
[11:06] <SteveA_> ddaa, lifeless: i'm ready
[11:07] <ddaa> here or #canonical-meeting?
[11:07] <lifeless> the latter I think
[11:07] <SteveA_> think marius may have worked what's up with the laptop, at least vaguely
[11:07] <ddaa> join #canonical-meeting
[11:07] <ddaa> gr
[11:07] <SteveA_> i still had pitti's 0telus connection script in the if-up scripts
[11:08] <lifeless> heh
[11:08] <SteveA_> it is possible that was running synchronously with acpi stuff
[11:08] <SteveA_> and acpi scripts got confused about it timing out etc.
[11:29] <zkl|laptop> what's the distinction b/w "used elsewhere" and "suggested elsewhere" on rosetta?
[11:51] <carlos> zkl|laptop, used meand that the string is being used already as a valid translation
[11:51] <carlos> zkl|laptop, suggested is that someone added it as a suggestion but that someone should review it before it's used
[11:52] <SteveA_> to the FAQ with that!
[11:52] <carlos> so the 'used' one would be better
[11:52] <carlos> I think we have it already...
[11:52] <SteveA_> even better ;-)
[11:52] <jordi> hmm
[11:52] <jordi> we don't
[11:52] <jordi> ?
[11:52] <jordi> I will DO IT
[11:53] <carlos> no, it's not
[11:53] <carlos> jordi, cool ;-)
[11:53] <carlos> jordi, are you already back at home?
[11:53] <jordi> yes
[11:53] <jordi> SteveA_: where are logs of lp meetings?
[11:53] <zkl|laptop> thanks carlos
[11:53] <jordi> carlos: even better
[11:53] <jordi> I actually have ADSL at home
[11:54] <jordi> dude, I can do work at home.
[11:54] <SteveA_> jordi: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs/launchpad-current.html
[11:54] <jordi> I feel useful at nights again
[11:54] <SteveA_> are launchpad logs in general
[11:54] <SteveA_> i mailed a summary of the last launchpad meeting out to the launchpad list last week
[11:54] <carlos> jordi, ;-)
[11:54] <SteveA_> and i'll take corrections, and post it on the wiki later today
[11:55] <WaterSevenUb> hey
[11:55] <WaterSevenUb> is it possible to get a list of all the teams in one page? with summary info of pages like https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-l10n-pt/
[11:55] <WaterSevenUb> ?
[11:56] <zkl|laptop> carlos, if used elsewhere translations are valid, then why aren't they showing up as messages that have already been translated on launchpad?
[11:57] <carlos> WaterSevenUb, https://launchpad.net/rosetta/groups/ubuntu-translators
[11:57] <carlos> zkl|laptop, because are valid in another package, that does not means that will be always valid for other packages
[11:57] <WaterSevenUb> thanks
[11:57] <jordi> SteveA_: oh, I see the summary now
[11:58] <matsubara> good morning!
[11:59] <jordi> After the meeting, Steve and Carlos talked through the issue in detail, and
[11:59] <jordi> came up with an explanatory diagram and a policy explained from the point of
[11:59] <jordi> view of each of the main actors: translators, upstream maintainers, package
[11:59] <jordi> maintainers.
[12:00] <jordi> I need this diagram to write the wiki page
[12:00] <zkl|laptop> carlos, ok i see, these xchat2 translations i'm looking at are also used in xchat-gnome
[12:01] <carlos> jordi, didn't I send you it??
[12:01] <carlos> hmmm
[12:01] <carlos> sorry, I thought I did
[12:01] <zkl|laptop> and all i have to do is verify that the translation is still valid
[12:01] <carlos> jordi, people.ubuntu.com/~stevea/rosetta-flow.png
[12:02] <carlos> jordi, in the same directory you have also the oo.org2 document that SteveA did to generate that image
[12:03] <jordi> hmm
[12:03] <jordi> I think this deosn't help me establish a policy regarding non-ubuntu translations
[12:03] <jordi> I'll draft and ping you two so you have a look
[12:05] <lifeless> jamesh: ping
[12:05] <jamesh> lifeless: pong
[12:05] <lifeless> calendar foo
[12:05] <lifeless> did the urls move ?
[12:05] <jamesh> no
[12:06] <lifeless> also, why does it ask me if I want to subscribe to my own calendar ?
[12:06] <carlos> jordi, ok
[12:06] <jamesh> that's a bug I need to fix
[12:06] <lifeless> jamesh: is there a bug # or should I file one ?
[12:07] <SteveA_> jordi: there was the diagram, which helped me understand the whole system.  but then, there was some policy that carlos and i discussed.
[12:07] <jamesh> lifeless: there is a bug #, but I don't have it handy
[12:07] <lifeless> jamesh: webcal://launchpad.net/people/lifeless/+calendar/+icalendar <- is that right ?
[12:07] <jamesh> that should work
[12:08] <SteveA_> jordi: the policy is quite conservative.  what we should do is to take that policy, and then work out how we can improve it in order to get more upstream stuff imported without annoying translators or upstreams.
[12:08] <SteveA_> carlos / jordi: do you have a copy of what carlos and i discussed last week?
[12:09] <carlos> SteveA, I do
[12:10] <SteveA_> has jordi seen it?
[12:11] <carlos> not yet, I'm preparing it to send it, I thought I did it already....
[12:12] <lifeless> night all
[12:14] <jamesh> /me wonders where his pqm success/failure message is
[12:14] <carlos> jordi, sent
[12:18] <lifeless> jamesh: its still running
[12:19] <jamesh> lifeless: ah.  I saw it had disappeared from http://pqm.ubuntu.com/
[12:19] <lifeless> it'll be mirroring I think
[12:20] <lifeless> mmm. dapper has ssh NICE - the auto controlmaster stuff
[12:21] <lifeless> ok, really gone. Night
[12:34] <SteveA_> hi niemeyer
[12:40] <niemeyer> Morning!
[12:41] <SteveA_> lifeless, ddaa and i had a chat this morning about the bzr / imports related stuff
[12:41] <SteveA_> i want to go for lunch shortly.  can you, ddaa and i meet up later, in a few hours, to talk about the same stuff?
[12:41] <niemeyer> Of course
[12:41] <niemeyer> Would be very nice
[12:41] <SteveA_> that's great
[12:41] <niemeyer> What time?
[12:44] <SteveA_> it is 1144 UTC now
[12:44] <SteveA_> ddaa is off getting a train ticket or something
[12:45] <SteveA_> i think he'll be back soon.  so, shall we say 1400 UTC?
[12:45] <SteveA_> 2h15 from now
[12:45] <niemeyer> That's 12h here..
[12:45] <niemeyer> Ok, deal. :)
[12:45] <SteveA_> ok, great
[01:06] <jordi> carlos, SteveA_: got it
[01:15] <cprov> jordi: hi, have you looked at CodeOfConductTranslation ? are you happy with that ?
[01:15] <jordi> cprov: haven't had time yet. Let me have a look
[01:15] <cprov> jordi: right
[01:19] <jordi> cprov: for the outstanding bits, I meant if signing the Brazilian version has the same value as signing the original, English version
[01:19] <jordi> jdub said it should, IIRC.
[01:21] <cprov> jordi: yes, so do I, apart of the technical issues, do you think that organizing CoC by version and available/official translation would be fine ?
[01:22] <jordi> yes
[01:22] <jordi> I'm wondering if it should be extended for other possible docs though
[01:22] <sivang> jordi: I have a translated version of the CoC to hebrew, let me know when and where to put it
[01:23] <jordi> imagine we end up with a document like the CoC, but launchpad oriented, not ubuntu oriented.
[01:23] <jordi> sivang: ok
[01:23] <jordi> sivang: so it looks like the labour party could even win the elections
[01:23] <jordi> that would rock a lot
[01:23] <sivang> jordi: in here? :)
[01:23] <jordi> sivang: in .il, yes
[01:24] <cprov> jordi: uhm, I don't know, personally I think it will be scary to convince the spec approver
[01:24] <sivang> jordi: unimanginably nice, Prim Minister is leaving his original party to join the labour :)
[01:24] <jordi> cprov: my second concern in the spec comes from translation teams consisting of 1 or2 persons
[01:24] <jordi> which might produce a really bad translation
[01:24] <jordi> cprov: so maybe, you should have a revision for translations
[01:24] <jordi> ie, CoC 1.0
[01:25] <jordi> and Coc-ES 1.0-1
[01:25] <jordi> sivang: Sharon? No, he's creating his own party
[01:25] <jordi> I hope he's not joining the labour party at least :)
[01:25] <siretart> is gina the girl who is importing bugzilla bugs to malone or katie sourcepackages to soyuz?
[01:26] <cprov> jordi: could be, both produce the same practical result, isn't it ?
[01:26] <jordi> siretart: gina is katie's young sister.
[01:26] <siretart> jordi: oh. who is she doing? ;)
[01:26] <jordi> siretart: katie was doing archive work
[01:26] <sivang> jordi: he's going to have his own party, but probably would "join" or go together with the labour, or for sure with same goals. He already has many followers and surprised his original party with steps he tooks towards stablilization
[01:26] <jordi> now it's going to be gina. :)
[01:27] <siretart> jordi: I had a look at the source of dak ;)
[01:27] <jordi> cprov: if revision 1 of CoC-ES has a horrid mistake nobody noticed, you can do 1.0-2 without bumping the real version number
[01:27] <jordi> so the version number stays in sync with the English CoC
[01:28] <cprov> jordi: siretart: gina is a simple dak -> launchpad  model importer
[01:28] <jordi> siretart: oh. good.
[01:28] <jordi> You found elmo's harem
[01:28] <sivang> jordi: He gets less and less accepted in the right wings due to what he did, but the amount of resistance seems to be dropping which is nice :-) he belives he has enough supporters to go alone
[01:28] <jordi> cprov: I thought it was like a rewrite of dak/katie
[01:28] <jordi> nod
[01:29] <cprov> jordi: the 'official' field (workflow) should avoid horrid mistakes like that, but your idea might be worth, let me think
[01:29] <jamesh> siretart: bugzilla-import.py is the one that will be importing bugzilla bugs ;)
[01:30] <sivang> cprov: from what I understood from kiko, it's a mere source tar.gz's imported that just arranges it nicely for launchpad to consume ?
[01:31] <jordi> cprov: in some cases, only one person or two will do the translation and correct it, if it's a samll team. If a few months later someone a lot more clued finds there's a horrid translation and it's set on stone, it'd be quite bad not to be able to change it.
[01:31] <cprov> jordi: not really, it's more like part of LP model is a rewrite of dak (they are not the same, it's not official, it's an analogy) and gina handle the differences
[01:33] <cprov> jordi: right, I will think about this use-case, you're right we should be able to handle later fix in the workflow
[01:33] <jordi> cprov: ok
[01:34] <cprov> sivang: true, you have a simpler and nicer understanding
[01:36] <sivang> cprov:  If I didn't have the power of reduction at my disposal, I would have been so lost .... and launchpad is a big thing :)
[01:37] <cprov> sivang: gina allows LP data model to offer similar functionality we have in dak
[01:37] <cprov> sivang: indeed
[01:38] <sivang> cprov: are source pkgs stored as blobs in the db?
[01:38] <cprov> sivang: no, we have Librarian for that
[01:40] <cprov> sivang: https://wiki.launchpad.canonical.com/Librarian
[01:48] <sivang> cprov: server.tac is the Librarian code right?
[01:49] <cprov> sivang: Librarian Server code, pretty much 'yes'
[01:50] <cprov> sivang: twisted based web server associated with a customized uploader server (RD/WR solution)
[01:51] <sivang> cprov: RD/WR?
[01:51] <Kinnison> read/write
[01:51] <cprov> sivang: sorry, no abreviations, I suck ... read/write
[01:52] <sivang> cprov: oh, you could then use R/W
[01:55] <cprov> cprov: yes, old electronic world vicious, hope it's clarified
[02:09] <sivang> cprov: lol -> http://librarian.launchpad.net/
[02:09] <sivang> cprov: droids?
[02:10] <Kinnison> sivang: it's a star-wars quote
[02:10] <sivang> Kinnison: ah, suck to be on the douglas adam's camp on not on Lucas's :)
[02:10] <sivang> the latter seems to gain so much popularity lately
[02:11] <sivang> Kinnison: how are you?
[02:11] <Kinnison> tired but not so ill :-)
[02:14] <Keybuk> sivang: ?!  what's dna got to do with anything?
[02:14] <Kinnison> Keybuk: if all your cultural references are dna based, then you won't recognise lucas quotes
[02:15] <Keybuk> such a person would be very worrying indeed
[02:15] <sivang> Keybuk: I think it would be nice if that page would say "I can tell you the answer, but you're not going to like it" :)
[02:16] <cprov> sivang: aha, the depressed robot
[02:16] <sivang> and besides, dna was british, doesn't that give him any favor over Lucas ? ;=)
[02:16] <Kinnison> Nope, because the librarian was written by australians :-)
[02:17] <Keybuk> the Star Wars movies were filmed in Britain too
[02:17] <sivang> cprov: deep thoughts as well :)
[02:18] <jordi> Keybuk: if I have bind removed, conffiles remain, and bind9 installed, I assume purging bind will leave my precious conffiles alone, even if they are shared, right? :)
[02:18] <cprov> sivang: yes, yes ;)
[02:19] <Keybuk> jordi: those conffiles that are owned by bind9 will be purged
[02:19] <Keybuk> there's no such thing as "shared" conffiles
[02:20] <jordi> Keybuk: how do I purge bind without losing my bind9 files then?
[02:20] <Keybuk> "don't"
[02:20] <sivang> hehe
[02:20] <jordi> sucks
[02:20] <Nafallo> purge != remove :-)
[02:20] <Keybuk> purge = remove conffiles
[02:20] <Keybuk> if you want to remove bind9 without removing conffiles, use "remove"
[02:20] <jordi> Keybuk: but there's another package installed which also has those same conffiles registered
[02:20] <Keybuk> no there isn't
[02:20] <jordi> Keybuk: I want to remove bind
[02:20] <jordi> not bind9
[02:20] <jordi> bind is removed, bind9 is installed
[02:20] <Keybuk> ah, ok
[02:20] <Keybuk> sorry, misread that
[02:21] <Keybuk> bind9 should own its conffiles
[02:21] <Keybuk> so purging bind should work fine
[02:21] <jordi> ok
[02:21] <jordi> that was scary
[02:21] <Keybuk> there used to be a bug eons ago where bind9 wouldn't own most of them
[02:21] <Keybuk> so depending _when_ you installed bind9, it may not work ;)
[02:21] <jordi> and you sounded so confident it should get blown up
[02:21] <jordi> 1 week ago :)
[02:21] <Keybuk> ok, that's fine
[02:22] <Keybuk> for some reason, I read that you wanted to purge bind9 and have bind's conffiles that it also owned remain
[02:22] <jordi> hehe, no
[02:22] <Keybuk> if bind9 replaces bind, then bind9 will own the conffiles
[02:22] <Keybuk> (you can check with dpkg -S)
[02:26] <jordi> it went ok
[03:04] <SteveA_> ddaa: hello
[03:04] <SteveA_> niemeyer: hello
[03:04] <niemeyer> SteveA: Pong
[03:04] <ddaa> SteveA_: pong
[03:04] <SteveA_>  #canonical-meeting please
[03:16] <buntux> hi folks :)
[03:20] <buntux> are ubuntu cds really free?
[03:21] <SteveA_> yes
[03:21] <SteveA_> you can get them sent to you from shipit.ubuntu.com
[03:21] <SteveA_> and you can copy and modify them as you wish
[03:22] <buntux> free? no money?
[03:22] <SteveA_> it is possible that your countries customs office will charge some money for you to receive the CDs
[03:22] <buntux> u-n-b-l-i-e-v-ab-l-e !!!
[03:22] <SteveA_> but there is no charge from canonical to send you ubuntu CDs
[03:22] <SteveA_> just to to shipit.ubuntu.com and ask for some
[03:23] <buntux> got some friends and family, would my asking for 40CDs be satisfied?
[03:24] <SteveA_> i expect so, if you know 40 people who could use the CDs
[03:24] <Kinnison> and regardless of how much I try to give them away, I always end up with a few spare
[03:24] <Kinnison> so be careful ordering 40
[03:26] <buntux> ok, anyway, i'll order 20 and tell'em to burn copies for themselves :)
[03:30] <Kinnison> buntux: good idea
[03:32] <stu1> That was fun - laptop would wake up and immediately sleep again :-(
[03:32] <SteveA_> mine did that
[03:33] <SteveA_> do you still have the 0telus connection script from UBZ in there?
[03:34] <stu1> Nope - never used it
[03:34] <stu1> Had to power cycle the thing
[03:37] <stu1> Ahh.... there appears to be an acpi update today
[03:37] <stu1> Might fix it
[03:37] <SteveA_> every time i do an acpi update, the next suspend is screwed
[04:47] <bradb> lifeless: my bzr merge (now trying it on two different local branches) has been sitting like this:
[04:47] <bradb> bradb@oxygen:~/canonical/malone-initial-bug-contacts $ bzr merge ../launchpad-upstream/
[04:47] <bradb> [=                                             ]  fetch revision   4/188 0:02:41
[04:47] <bradb> for the last 10-15 minutes. is that normal?
[04:48] <bradb> 28415 bradb     25   0  123m 115m 2908 R 49.9  9.2  10:27.06 bzr
[04:48] <bradb> 28514 bradb     25   0  100m  93m 2908 R 49.9  7.4   4:21.57 bzr
[04:48] <ddaa> bradb: you're just feeling the love from my branch
[04:49] <ddaa> it's a nasty one, because it fills a bunch of ghosts.
[04:49] <ddaa> bad news: you will just have to wait
[04:49] <ddaa> good news: it's a one off
[04:51] <bradb> ddaa: ok, thanks
[04:51] <ddaa> Brutal Love.
[04:51] <ddaa> Red Red Love?
[05:17] <cprov> does anyone know how to fix this error in LP + pgsql-8.0 : 14:46:55 WARNING No permissions specified for [u'"public"."plpgsql_validator"(oid)']  ?
[05:22] <niemeyer> cprov: Adding a line for it on security.cfg?
[05:24] <cprov> niemeyer: I'm affraid it isn't that simple. Anyway if it's a LP issue I will bug stub, then he can decide
[05:24] <cprov> niemeyer: tks
[05:26] <cprov> stub: ohh, you couldn't arrive in better time. I was talking about you
[05:27] <stub> I was crashing my laptop :-(
[05:30] <cprov> stub: hope you have time & hardware to take a look at bug # 4697 about pgsql-8.0 warning
[05:31] <cprov> stub: not that urgent, anyway
[05:31] <stub> That is just a one line fix to security.cfg
[05:34] <bradb> hm, I've been waiting on bzr for an hour so far
[05:35] <ddaa> bradb: that does sound like too long...
[05:35] <cprov> stub: niemeyer suggested the same, if you think it's sane I'm happy you fix it when you have time, as I said, it's not urgent.
[05:36] <ddaa> bradb: are you pulling through sftp?
[05:36] <SteveA_> bradb: when you're having problems with bzr, mail robert, and be as detailed as possible about what you are doing.  cc me.
[05:36] <bradb> ddaa: it is making progress though (at 140/188 and 66/188, respectively)
[05:36] <stub> cprov: I'll land it
[05:36] <bradb> ddaa: nope, locally
[05:36] <ddaa> bradb: here, when I merged my branch into rocketfuel, locally, it took about 40 mins.
[05:36] <cprov> stub: thanks
[05:36] <ddaa> On my fearsome Mobility 1.7GHz
[05:36] <bradb> right, that sounds about right then, because i'm doing two at once
[05:37] <bradb> the only get 50% CPU each!
[05:37] <ddaa> reweaving is slow
[05:37] <SteveA_> and you're splitting your disk cache in half
[05:37] <ddaa> that kind of stuff ought not be written python
[05:37] <SteveA_> you might be a lot better running them serially
[05:37] <ddaa> SteveA_: that's not really i/o intensive, I think.
[05:38] <SteveA_> pyrex... ?
[05:38] <ddaa> I think that would help, yes.
[05:38] <SteveA_> would be interesting to see some profiler output
[05:39] <bradb> presumably bzr merge knows how to resume if I Ctrl-C? I'm afraid to learn this lesson the hard way.
[05:39] <ddaa> but OTOH, reweaving is not something that occurs normally. It's largely a artefact of baz2bzr.
[05:39] <ddaa> bradb: yes, SIGINTing _should_ be safe.
[05:39] <bradb> ok :)
[05:40] <ddaa> but you can also SIGSTOP :)
[05:40] <bradb> ah right, /me brainfarts
[05:40] <ddaa> just be if you do that, that will hold the branch lock.
[05:40] <ddaa> * just be aware
[05:40] <bradb> yeah
[05:41] <bradb> seemed to resume ok after a Ctrl-C, but i restarted the proc and ctrl-z'd just to feel a bit more fuzzy
[05:43] <carlos> ddaa, is there any plan to improve the 'bzr push' performance?
[05:43] <ddaa> carlos: well, AFAIK the current bzr push is a rsync hack...
[05:44] <carlos> ddaa, usually, I'm using rsync because is much more faster...
[05:44] <ddaa> it's not even a real push
[05:44] <carlos> ddaa, but takes ages!
[05:44] <carlos> rsync is much more faster
[05:44] <ddaa> ha, looks like real push has landed then :)
[05:44] <ddaa> well, all the network pain is planned to be fixed yes
[05:44] <ddaa> but i'm not following bzr devel closely nowadays, as you can see.
[05:44] <carlos> ddaa, I'm not talking about network push....
[05:45] <carlos> las Thursday I did a local push
[05:45] <carlos> s/las/last/
[05:45] <ddaa> ha, never did that :)
[05:45] <carlos> and it took more than 30 minutes
[05:46] <ddaa> all I can say, is "if it's painful, they probably plan to fix it".
[05:46] <carlos> ;-)
[05:59] <bradb> Did somebody (attempt to) remove the the lib/canonical/arch directory?
[06:00] <bradb> https://launchpad.net/products/bzr/+bug/4700
[06:01] <ddaa> bradb: It might have been removed as part of my branch.
[06:02] <bradb> ddaa: is there a lib/canonical/arch dir in your working tree?
[06:02] <ddaa> nope
[06:02] <bradb> ok
[06:02] <ddaa> I zapped it.
[06:02] <ddaa> Bunch of cruft.
[06:02] <ddaa> Was nice to rm it to oblivion :)
[06:03] <ddaa> mh... I guess you had some .pyc left there...
[06:03] <ddaa> The output indeed looks confusing
[06:18] <carlos> bradb, I did
[06:19] <carlos> bradb, I got some conflicts because the .pyc prevented to remove it
[06:19] <carlos> but that's all
[06:19] <elmo> lifeless: ?
[06:19] <carlos> mental note... read the answers before write anything....
[06:19] <bradb> carlos: i was just asking who actually bzr rm'ed it, just to confirm before i blew it away.
[06:20] <carlos> bradb, anyway, the history has it so it should not be a problem ;-)
[07:51] <Alinux> hello, why my "rose" translation don't become green?
[07:57] <carlos> Alinux, because the maintainer needs to download it and include with his/her package so Rosetta detects that it was included upstream
[07:57] <carlos> jordi, a new entry for our FAQ....
[07:58] <Alinux> thank you carlos...
[07:58] <Alinux> and how often he do this?
[07:59] <Alinux> and where I can find the list of basic gnome packages, to translate firs the main things... interface etc...
[07:59] <Alinux> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+lang/ka
[08:00] <Alinux> and the best way to import .po files from breezy to dapper?
[08:00] <WaterSevenUb> carlos, some translators would like to see indication of which package comes from main, universe, etc... is that feature planned?
[08:01] <WaterSevenUb> carlos, also they would like to see if some work is being reused upstream or not... (remember, just in a user perspective)
[08:01] <carlos> Alinux, unfortunatelly, that depends on the Ubuntu maintainers so it's not automated at all
[08:02] <carlos> Alinux, about breezy -> dapper... we were planning to do the import automatically, but we had a small bug that added new translations to dapper before we had it ready....
[08:03] <Alinux> so I ust import everything automatically?
[08:03] <Alinux> manualy
[08:03] <carlos> WaterSevenUb, if it comes from main, universe, etc... will be noted as soon as we start using launchpad to handle Ubuntu developement
[08:03] <Alinux> i mean.
[08:04] <WaterSevenUb> carlos, also... 2 and 3 points in http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/rosetta-users/2005-November/001032.html
[08:04] <jordi> carlos: yeah
[08:04] <carlos> WaterSevenUb, usually, if it's gree, is because upstream are using the translations (either upstream like GNOME, Debian or directly the Ubuntu source packages)
[08:04] <jordi> I want to write this stuff in an hour ro so
[08:04] <carlos> jordi, ok, thanks
[08:05] <carlos> Alinux, what ever is best for you. Anyway, in the next three months we will have an easy way to reuse the translations from other releases with a specific review interface
[08:05] <Alinux> carlos, so there will be a new version of rosetta in the future? more intuitive and flaxible?
[08:06] <carlos> Alinux, Rosetta is a moving system, we are adding new features all time
[08:06] <carlos> but sometimes are internal features and you don't see them
[08:06] <carlos> but I work full time on Rosetta
[08:07] <Alinux> carlos, and where can I find some howtos, guides and this sort of stuff?
[08:07] <carlos> Alinux, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Rosetta and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RosettaFAQ
[08:07] <carlos> Alinux, if you don't find your answer there
[08:07] <carlos> ask me or jordi and we will add it
[08:08] <WaterSevenUb> carlos, in breezy it was a madness to notice that templates were changing without warning for translators worried with that specific  template
[08:08] <Alinux> and a very stupid question :) Who is Rosetta? Someones girlfriend's name?
[08:08] <carlos> is better if you ask jordi, but if he's not around, ping me
[08:08] <jordi> see the FAQ :)
[08:08] <WaterSevenUb> carlos, so a subscription service would be great.... no?
[08:08] <carlos> WaterSevenUb, we have a spec for the subscription feature, but not implemented yet and I don't think it will be implemented in next three months...
[08:09] <carlos> WaterSevenUb, https://launchpad.net/products/rosetta/+spec/translation-subscriptions
[08:09] <WaterSevenUb> carlos, subscription feature for template changes and also translation changes?
[08:09] <WaterSevenUb> ok
[08:09] <carlos> Alinux, https://launchpad.net/products/rosetta/+specs <--- There you have many documentation about the way Rosetta works
[08:10] <carlos> but it's too technical
[08:10] <Alinux> ;)
[08:10] <WaterSevenUb> carlos, template changes.... so how about if a product is 100% translated and someone goes there and by accident changes something... the other translator will not be allowed to subscribe to that kind of changes...
[08:11] <carlos> WaterSevenUb, if the spec does not fits your requirements, please, file a bug report and we will try to improve the spec
[08:11] <Alinux> and where I can find a basic gnome-ubuntu packages list... the main packages I mean... to work with them fist of all.
[08:11] <carlos> WaterSevenUb, anyway, let me read the spec, I don't remember all the details
[08:13] <WaterSevenUb> carlos, hhmm I'm confused. This Use Case Paul is the French Ubuntu translator for Evolution. seems to be what I was talking about, isn't it?
[08:13] <carlos> Alinux, we don't have such list yet...
[08:14] <carlos> WaterSevenUb, yes, please, file a bug report referencing the spec and noting that is lacking a solution for that use case
[08:14] <Alinux> carlos, but I think it will be very useful, to know what is more or less important package....
[08:15] <Alinux> and what about initial terminal installer? I can't find packages name to translate is...
[08:16] <carlos> Alinux, If we don't have it, it doesn't mean we will not implement it ;-)
[08:16] <carlos> Alinux, https://launchpad.net/products/rosetta/+specs notes also what are we working on
[08:17] <Alinux> ;)
[08:17] <carlos> the High priority and approved are the ones we will implement soon
[08:18] <Alinux> and what about installer?
[08:20] <Alinux> hehe I found you mini foto carlos :) Spanish brother :)
[08:20] <Alinux> thank you for your work :)
[08:21] <Alinux> and sorry for my sometimes silly questions :)
[08:21] <Alinux> can you tell me , where I can find installer's package template?
[08:21] <carlos> Alinux, I talked with Kamion about a plan for the Debian installer
[08:22] <carlos> but I cannot give you a date when will be implemented...
[08:22] <carlos> Alinux, it's not yet imported for dapper
[08:26] <Alinux> and for breezy? I can start with breezy...no probs.
[08:28] <carlos> It makes no sense to translate breezy's or hoary's installer, it's not going to change
[08:31] <lifeless> elmo: around?
[08:31] <Alinux> so what can I do  to implement Georgian language in installer too?
[08:32] <carlos> Alinux, for breezy?
[08:32] <carlos> I don't think you can do anything there, sorry
[08:32] <Alinux> for breezy :) or future dapper :) for me is the same
[08:32] <elmo> lifeless: yes
[08:33] <carlos> Alinux, I think you only need to translate it. Kamion will get the translations directly from Rosetta
[08:33] <lifeless> elmo: I was pinging you about two things. The asterix project and the i386 chroot
[08:34] <elmo> lifeless: read your email; the i386 chroot is done
[08:34] <Alinux> Kamion? Ca you tell me the packages name...or link, something...
[08:34] <elmo> lifeless: what about the asterix?
[08:35] <lifeless> mark asked if you'd negotiate the contract foo, AIUI.
[08:35] <lifeless> ahha, 5am for the chroot - thanks!
[08:35] <elmo> meh, ok
[08:36] <lifeless> nov 13, 're: Pictures & Asterisk'
[08:36] <lifeless> coordinate a proposal.
[08:36] <lifeless> anyway, I'm not clear whose meant to talk money to the guy, and the current outstanding questions he has are on hardware.
[08:37] <elmo> yeah, I've been watching the exchange, I'll see about replying
[08:37] <lifeless> that would be great
[08:38] <lifeless> I think he wants to do more than we do ;).
[08:39] <lifeless> let me check my understanding with yours: we are aiming for a internal PBX facility - voip between any two staff members - and thats it.
[08:39] <carlos> Alinux, the installer is not yet imported
[08:39] <carlos> Alinux, it will be as part of 'debian-installer' package
[08:39] <carlos> time to leave
[08:39] <carlos> see you tomorrow!
[08:39] <Alinux> ;) ah ok... thank you :)
[08:39] <lifeless> night carlos
[08:40] <lifeless> elmo: ^^
[08:40] <elmo> lifeless: that's the basic requirement yes; tho I imagine if we do this, we ought to be able to do conferences if they're not much more effort
[08:40] <lifeless> ah right.
[08:40] <lifeless> point to point and conferencing between staff
[08:40] <elmo> yeah
[08:41] <lifeless> but we don't care (in the first implementation) to have external connections
[08:42] <lifeless> I'm trying to rule out things like voice cards and connections to other voip exchanges, which asterix folk love, but add to the complexity
[08:43] <elmo> well, I dunno, if we don't do external, we can only do conference with people on voip?
[08:43] <lifeless> if we rule those out, then it should be very simple, and give us the primary benefits. We can always come back and setup a connection to BT later, or to the outside world.
[08:43] <elmo> OTOH, conference is definitely second stage
[08:43] <lifeless> I suspect most of our conferences are within the group of folk we're getting voip for anyway.
[08:45] <lifeless> so how about I reply back with requirements in two steps - step one is 'conference and normal calls within the staff and anyone else we give an 'extension number' to.'
[08:46] <lifeless> step two is 'external connectivity via either landlines or other voip switches or both.'
[08:46] <lifeless> ok with you ?
[08:49] <elmo> lifeless: sounds fine, yeah
[08:49] <lifeless> thanks!
[08:59] <lifeless> done
[09:37] <niemeyer> Anyone knows about a script which may be considered as "the right way to do cronjobing in Launchpad" to be used as a model?
[09:38] <mdz> anyone seen kiko?
[09:38] <niemeyer> mdz: He's still on leave, I guess..
[10:02] <ddaa> niemeyer: did you look at launchpad/cronscripts?
[10:34] <WaterSevenUb> I had a translator asking how is the karma measured...
[10:34] <WaterSevenUb> is that written somewhere?
[11:02] <niemeyer> ddaa: Doesn't look like there's anything special about these..
[11:06] <niemeyer> ddaa: I mean, where are the mentioned tests for instance?
[11:06] <OgMaciel> I think Rosetta is going nuts... my karma keeps going down no matter what I do
[11:06] <ddaa> hum...
[11:06] <OgMaciel> anyone know why by any chance?
[11:08] <ddaa> niemeyer: there's also lib/canonical/launchpad/scripts
[11:09] <niemeyer> ddaa: Yes, that looks like a bunch of utilities for scripts..
[11:10] <ddaa> but the tests do not seem very relevant to the cronscripts...
[11:10] <niemeyer> ddaa: bzrsync even imports some functions from there already.
[11:12] <ddaa> the annoying thing is also that the various people SteveA suggest to ask to are all .au folks
[11:12] <ddaa> mh... except stub who is now in thailand... but that does not fix the tz
[11:13] <ddaa> I think we ought to displace one of them to canada or something
[11:17] <ddaa> niemeyer: I do not see much specific stuff, except the _pythonpath, logging, lockfile, execute_zcml_for_scripts and initZopeless.
[11:18] <ddaa> ha, there's also the launchpad.config integration
[11:19] <ddaa> * launchpad.conf
[11:19] <niemeyer> ddaa: We're already using most of it..
[11:19] <niemeyer> (in bzrsync)
[11:19] <ddaa> that much less to do
[11:20] <ddaa> the specific dbuser for each script... that would mean some changes in the security.cfg to separate what is needed for cscvs and what is needed for bzrsync
[11:23] <ddaa> also, there should probably be some sort of email reporting
[11:23] <niemeyer> ddaa: Understood
[11:23] <ddaa> I'll drill the .au guys tomorrow
[11:23] <ddaa> morning, before you wake up
[11:23] <niemeyer> ddaa: Ok, thanks
[11:23] <ddaa> about the way cronscripts are handled in prod, and about testing practices
[11:24] <ddaa> It looks like somebody intended to make a consistent framework, but stopped at mid-course...
[11:27] <niemeyer> ddaa: Meanwhile, I'll make bzrsync do what it's not yet doing (lockfile)
[11:29] <ddaa> niemeyer: might be good to use the canonical.launchpad.scripts logging stuff. I do not know if and how it differs from the existing logging, but it appears to be consistently used in existing cronscripts.
[11:31] <niemeyer> ddaa: Indeed.. that's a one liner, since we're already using logger.
[11:31] <niemeyer> ddaa: We must also implement option parsing..
[11:31] <ddaa> right, I'm not sure how much is actually needed for bzrsync...
[11:31] <ddaa> ...
[11:32] <ddaa> ha, here's the thing... this cronscript thing is not bzrsync itself
[11:32] <ddaa> bzrsync does one branch, right?
[11:32] <ddaa> the cronscript should do all branches on the public area of the supermirror
[11:33] <ddaa> configuration data will include the sftp root of the public supermirror.
[11:33] <ddaa> dbuser to use
[11:34] <ddaa> mh... I cannot think of anything else
[11:35] <niemeyer> ddaa: Well, this is bzrsync, but with additional changes.
[11:35] <niemeyer> ddaa: Or you mean we'll need the current bzrsync for something else?
[11:36] <ddaa> I'd be inclined toward leaving the doing-business part of bzrsync, with tests in importd, and only putting the cronscript machinery in cronscripts.
[11:36] <ddaa> But that's a matter of taste.
[11:37] <niemeyer> I see
[11:37] <ddaa> Eventually, I think we'll want bzrsync not be a cronscript.
[11:38] <ddaa> When we have importd->push-sftp->xmlrpc->supermirror->public area->xmlrpc->bzrsync.
[11:39] <ddaa> So latency between rcs imports and new data displayed in launchpad will be minimised.
[11:39] <ddaa> But we're nowhere near there yet.
[11:41] <niemeyer> ddaa: We need the branch-id -> supermirror-url method in Branch objects.
[11:41] <ddaa> nah
[11:41] <niemeyer> ddaa: This is something that will change with nullable urls in the near future
[11:41] <niemeyer> ddaa: nah?
[11:41] <ddaa> you should sftp to the supermirror and use the backend, id-based, file system hierarchy.
[11:42] <ddaa> Already talked that bit through with spiv and jblack.
[11:43] <ddaa> Given a Branch in the DB, you get the id, then you can find the branch directly on the SM. No need to use the Branch.url at all.
[11:44] <niemeyer> Is there a reason for it, given that the supermirror has http access to these branches anyway?
[11:44] <niemeyer> and that we need to know the supermirror url inside Launchpad anyway
[11:44] <ddaa> Robustness against concurrent renames.
[11:45] <ddaa> not a big deal, but it's the more correct and simplest way of doing it
[11:45] <ddaa> do you there's a problem with that approach?
[11:45] <ddaa> * do you think
[11:46] <niemeyer> ddaa: Agreed
[11:47] <niemeyer> ddaa: Not at all.. was just wondering why the extra effort
[11:47] <ddaa> obviously, if the id-based fs hierachy is not there... it would be saner to use http and add (dunno where) the logic to compute SM public urls for branches.
[11:48] <ddaa> you're caught in a maze of interlocking subsystems, all different
[11:48] <ddaa> it's getting dark in there
[11:48] <ddaa> you might be eaten by a grue
[11:49] <niemeyer> :-)
[12:00] <niemeyer> ddaa: Do you know if the "backend" of SupermirrorFSH is in place already?
[12:01] <ddaa> I don't.
[12:01] <niemeyer> ddaa: I mean, if we have a directory structure with ids inside the server already
[12:01] <ddaa> I understand.
[12:01] <niemeyer> Ok
[12:01] <ddaa> lifeless said something about jblack's script, so I think he would be the guy to sync with about that.
[12:02] <ddaa> he=lifeless
[12:02] <ddaa> lifeless: ping


[07:06] <oSoMoN> good morning
[07:19] <MacSlow> hello there
[11:09] <mick_> njpatel: Did you have time to look at the problems I had with unity and the spotify lens I wrote?
[11:18] <njpatel> mick_, damn, sorry, I just forgot :S
[11:18] <njpatel> mick_, let me try and take  a look tonight
[11:19] <hicham> no progress on upstreaming gtk menuproxy patch ?
[11:19] <njpatel> not sure, not in charge of that :)
[11:19] <mick_> njpatel: No problem :) Do it when you have time. Im not in a hurry.
[11:20] <API> njpatel, one question, it is still possible to build unity on natty
[11:20] <API> Im trying to use this guide:
[11:20] <API> http://askubuntu.com/questions/28470/how-do-i-build-unity-from-source
[11:20] <hicham> njpatel: who is in charge ? kenvandine ?
[11:20] <API> and your mail
[11:20] <API> https://lists.launchpad.net/ayatana-dev/msg00198.html
[11:20] <njpatel> hicham, he does packaging, I believe tedg would be in charge
[11:20] <API> but Im having some problems
[11:20] <njpatel> API, I don't think it's possible at this point
[11:21] <hicham> njpatel: thanks
[11:21] <API> njpatel, ok, so I guess that I need to move to oneiric, right?
[11:21] <njpatel> API, we've all moved to Oneiric now, especially due to the gtk3/gnome3 stuff
[11:21] <mhr3> njpatel, how come you're not in #awn? :-o
[11:21] <njpatel> API, yeah :)
[11:21] <API> njpatel, ok thanks
[11:21] <njpatel> mhr3, new laptop, don't have all my favourite channels stored in :)
[11:21] <mhr3> ah, ok then :)
[12:39] <kim0> seb128: Howdy o/
[12:40] <kim0> This is Ahmed, I'm working with Jorge on the community side
[12:40] <kim0> seb128: Could you please check out https://code.launchpad.net/unity-place-applications/+activereviews
[12:40] <kim0> it's been idling for quite some time .. thanks
[12:41] <seb128> hey kim0
[12:41] <kim0> hey :)
[12:41] <seb128> you want to talk to dx people, i.e njpatel
[12:41] <seb128> desktop team (where I work) is doing packaging, not upstream code reviews
[12:41] <seb128> jcastro, ^
[12:41] <kim0> ok then, thanks
[12:42] <seb128> yw
[12:42] <kim0> njpatel: Hey o/ Can someone please check on https://code.launchpad.net/unity-place-applications/+activereviews
[12:46] <njpatel> kim0, will do today
[12:49] <kim0> njpatel: Thanks a lot man
[13:51] <kenvandine> jjardon, indicator-power uses upower directly right?
[15:35] <jjardon> kenvandine: no, It uses the g-p-m dbus interface to get the data
[15:36] <kenvandine> jjardon, oh... ok... are you working on changing that to support g-s-d?
[15:36] <kenvandine> since it is getting merged into gsd?
[15:36] <jjardon> kenvandine: yeah, Iḿ aware of that
[15:40] <jjardon> kenvandine: but the change is trivial, only a change in the dbus call
[15:43] <jjardon> kenvandine: anyway the code is still not in g-s-d, if you want to track the status: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=649470
[15:43] <kenvandine> jjardon, no worries, there will be a number of things broken by that :)
[15:43] <kenvandine> it is planned for 3.1.4 though
[16:24] <andyrock> MacSlow, «The strings used for the notification need to be translated» Done! I don't know if that is the right way to show osd notifcation (my first time!)
[16:25] <MacSlow> andyrock, that just fine
[16:25] <andyrock> MacSlow, ok thx
[16:25] <MacSlow> andyrock, do you nkow about the _("") macro for make strings translateable to the gnome tool-set?
[16:26] <MacSlow> andyrock, btw... see my second comment on that particular bug
[16:26] <andyrock> MacSlow, i know _("")... but i am idiot and i forgot it :)
[16:28] <MacSlow> andyrock, I did two reviews of your proposed branches already... they are approved and by now merged to trunk... working on the fourth of your branches now
[16:29] <andyrock> MacSlow, i have just add the _("") macro...
[16:29] <MacSlow> andyrock, today is "all attention to Andrea"-day :)
[16:30] <andyrock> MacSlow, ahahahahah... there is another big merge proposal... but njpatel is the reviewer and there is some problems :(
[16:30] <andyrock> *there are
[16:30] <MacSlow> andyrock, well by the end of the day, you should have at least four of your branches in unity trunk... better than nothing :)
[16:31] <MacSlow> andyrock, I like the mem-leak fix best
[16:32] <andyrock> MacSlow, my best record is three branch in just a day :)
[16:32] <andyrock> MacSlow, mem-leaks suck!
[16:33] <MacSlow> andyrock, this day we'll break that record :)
[16:49] <MacSlow> andyrock, ok... three branches in trunk now... atm looking at your fix-750311 branch
[16:50] <andyrock> MacSlow, the less secure than other... :)
[17:06] <MacSlow> andyrock, lp:~andyrock/unity/fix-750311 doesn't work here... the trashcan does not pulse at all.
[17:06] <andyrock> MacSlow, it should pusle just once...
[17:07] <MacSlow> andyrock, it does not pulse at all here... not sure why that's the case... I need to run now... take a look at this again... tomorrow I'll revisit this, if you had time to look into it
[17:08] <andyrock> MacSlow, ok thx.... i will try again... :)
[17:09] <MacSlow> andyrock, see you tomorrow then
[17:21] <njpatel> andyrock, dude, I *never* see "Keep In Launcher" for devices....which ones are meant to show?
[17:21] <njpatel> show it*
[17:21] <andyrock> whith last commit it should be visible for all unremovable devices...
[17:22] <andyrock> i know that the design consider removable (usb, etc) devices too... but IMHO it has no sense...
[17:26] <andyrock> njpatel, ^^^
[17:28] <njpatel> andyrock, okay, that makes sense, let me test again and then i think i can merge it :D
[17:29]  * andyrock is crossing his fingers
[17:30] <njpatel> andyrock, give me a couple of mins, need to do a rebuild
[17:31] <andyrock> njpatel, dont'worry... i can wait


[07:40] <mpt> “This message contains an event that has already been processed.” Dear Thunderbird, I have no idea what that means.
[07:41] <ochosi> :>
[07:44] <jibel> I lost the overlay scrollbars on wily after an update this morning, how can I get it back?
[07:46] <seb128> jibel, you can't, those have been deprecated
[07:46] <seb128> in favor of the gtk equivalent
[07:46] <seb128> but those are not o-s, they are in the win
[07:48] <jibel> seb128, ah, currently I see a large light grey scrollbar, is it the equivalent? or there is a way to have a thin one like the overlay was?
[07:49] <seb128> jibel, that's the "equivalent", but they are unthemed atm
[07:49] <seb128> they are going to be changed to be thinner and more integrated
[07:49] <seb128> unsure why Laney and larsu decided to upload GTK before doing the minimal theming tweaks though :-/
[07:51] <jibel> seb128, ok, thanks.  They look exactly like they looked before when you disabled overlay-scrollbars
[08:08] <larsu> I seriously don't know what the fuzz is about
[08:08] <larsu> (fuss?)
[08:08] <seb128> well, for somebody used to o-s they look like quite a regression
[08:09] <larsu> "oh, all my windows have the same scrollbar as firefox now"
[08:09] <seb128> see jibel's comment about them being "visually annoying and distractive"
[08:09] <larsu> I hope he doesn't look at firefox too often, then
[08:10] <seb128> except that in firefox they are there and don't change
[08:10] <seb128> in gedit they keep fading in and out
[08:10] <seb128> I find it quite distractive as well
[08:11] <larsu> fair enough
[08:12] <seb128> oh, that makes me realize a difference of behaviour with o-s
[08:12] <Laney> I guess I naively hoped that people on the development release could put up with things being in flux for a while.
[08:12] <seb128> with o-s the colored thumb doesn't fade out when you move the mouse out of the win
[08:12] <Laney> Instead of blocking the update and everything that depends on gtk 3.16 until we have the final experience
[08:13] <seb128> Laney, I might naively think that using the upstream styling would be deleting a blob of 30 css lines in our theme where it's likely more complicated?
[08:14] <seb128> I'm not speaking about having an updated look&feel
[08:14] <Laney> Yes
[08:14] <seb128> just about deleting our buggy rules
[08:14] <Laney> Unless I'm wrong this is GTK's default style
[08:14] <seb128> you are wrong :p
[08:14] <seb128> cf backlog from yesterday afternoon on this channel
[08:14] <seb128> default upstream is fine, their bars are thinner
[08:15] <Laney> OK then I'll review your merge proposal
[08:15] <seb128> Laney, https://blogs.gnome.org/mclasen/files/2013/08/zoomscrollbar.png
[08:15] <seb128> is how upstream looks like
[08:16] <seb128> k :-)
[08:16]  * seb128 bzr fetch the theme
[08:17] <Laney> What I resent is implying that we are somehow being lazy or deliberately making it crap
[08:17] <Laney> Maybe that's not what you mean but it feels like it to me
[08:17] <Laney> ;9
[08:17] <Laney> :9
[08:17] <Laney> FFS
[08:17] <Laney> :(
[08:17] <seb128> sorry :-/
[08:17] <seb128> no, I meant that deleting those few lines in the theme seemed like an easy change
[08:17] <seb128> and I didn't get why that was not done before uploading
[08:19] <Laney> seems I wrongly thought that this was the default style & adwaita had themed it differently themselves
[08:21] <larsu> seb128: don't worry, I can do it today if people feel so strongly about it
[08:21]  * larsu has a 1:1 first though and needs fooooooooood
[08:21] <willcooke> larsu, shall we begin?
[08:21] <willcooke> oh
[08:21] <willcooke> hrm
[08:22] <willcooke> When your day starts with an email from "Have I been pwned"....
[08:22] <Laney> spam / phish?
[08:22] <larsu> willcooke: morning :)
[08:23] <seb128> Laney, larsu, sorry I didn't mean to make a fuzz about it either, they are just unpleasant and we started having users asking about them
[08:23] <willcooke> no, some l33t haxors got the passwords for some forum I must have signed up to a long time ago
[08:23] <larsu> uh oh
[08:23] <willcooke> seems I signed up with a different email address to usual
[08:27] <seb128> Laney, do you have any idea about https://launchpadlibrarian.net/208330071/buildlog_ubuntu_wily_i386_ubuntu-desktop-next_BUILDING.txt.gz ?
[08:27] <seb128> mv: cannot stat 'device.tar.gz': No such file or directory
[08:29] <Laney> nope, this is where you get out of my area of knowledge I'm afraid
[08:30] <Laney> the code is in livecd-rootfs
[08:30] <Laney> but I have no idea what device.tar.gz is meant to be
[08:31] <Laney> o_gra is probably the person to ask
[08:31] <seb128> yeah, I'm moving to -devel
[08:31] <seb128> cjwatson might also know
[08:31] <Laney> wait, is this just a bug?
[08:31] <Laney> pull-lp-source livecd-rootfs
[08:31] <Laney> look at live-build/auto/config
[08:31] <Laney> line 343 and line 356
[08:32] <Laney> seems to do the same thing twice no?
[08:32] <seb128> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/livecd-rootfs/trunk/view/head:/live-build/auto/config#L343 ?
[08:33] <Laney> oops /auto/build
[08:34] <Laney> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/livecd-rootfs/trunk/view/head:/live-build/auto/build#L343
[08:35] <seb128> hum
[08:36] <seb128> that was part of didrocks changes in https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/livecd-rootfs/desktop-next/+merge/257056
[08:37] <seb128> yeah, feels like a bug
[08:37] <seb128> if you look on that mp, on the first version he duplicated the section
[08:38] <seb128> and Colin in the review said to "Rather than duplicating this between ubuntu-core and ubuntu-desktop-next, maybe share this code? "
[08:38] <seb128> I guess he should have deleted the extra section then
[08:38]  * seb128 does that
[08:39] <Laney> nod
[10:17] <larsu> Laney: how do you want the backported totem patch?
[10:18] <Laney> larsu: on the bug is fine
[10:18] <Laney> will it fix the other issues?
[10:19] <larsu> which are the other issues?
[10:19] <larsu> it won't add the fullscreen menu button back
[10:19] <Laney> I don't know that we can SRU a patch which removes that
[10:20] <larsu> hm, I was planning to do this work on gtk master :/
[10:20] <larsu> backporting all of that would be quite a lot of work
[10:20] <Laney> ya
[10:20] <Laney> I guess we could leave the bug in vivid?
[10:20] <Laney> or just try it and see what the SRU guys say
[10:21] <larsu> how about removing those two sections in the fullscreen menu?
[10:21] <larsu> Languages and Subtitles, I mean
[10:21] <larsu> not sure where people use them more
[10:22] <Laney> are they going to be broken there?
[10:23] <Laney> if we remove the prefers_app_menu check for the fullscreen case
[10:23] <larsu> yes
[10:24] <larsu> this is the whole issue: we can't have dynamic menus in two different sections of the ui
[10:24] <Laney> oh right
[10:24] <Laney> gtk somehow is deciding which one to use
[10:28] <larsu> yes, it simply uses the first
[10:28] <larsu> it can find
[10:28] <larsu> (it's by id)
[10:30] <Laney> what do you think we should do?
[10:30] <Laney> SRU and delete the fullscreen app menu, SRU and keep it without those dynamic bits, don't SRU?
[10:30] <larsu> I was about to ask you the same :)
[10:30] <willcooke> what's the main fix for the backport?
[10:31] <larsu> willcooke: right now, you can only select subtitles from the fullscreen menu in totem
[10:31] <larsu> not from the menu bar
[10:32] <larsu> of course it should be in both, but we've never had the case where an application needed to insert dynamic menus in two places at the same time
[10:32] <larsu> and we're fixing that, but that's too big a change for an SRU
[10:32] <willcooke> I imagine that once it's in full screen mode then people generally wont want to change menu items
[10:32] <willcooke> like,
[10:32] <larsu> yes, I agree
[10:32] <willcooke> you get it set up and then once your done you go fullscreen
[10:32] <larsu> better in the "real" menu than in the fullscreen one, if we have to chose
[10:32] <larsu> *choose
[10:32] <willcooke> +1
[10:33] <larsu> Laney: d'accord?
[10:33] <Laney> fair enough
[10:33] <Laney> The SRU team gets the final decision here anyway
[10:33] <Laney> did you fix the empty menu case?
[10:33] <willcooke> ok, thats good
[10:34] <larsu> no, I simply left it removed
[10:34] <larsu> doing that now
[10:35] <Laney> I don't know if removing it, making it insensitive (if possible) or showing "No languages" is preferable
[10:35] <Laney> probably avoid a new string
[10:35] <larsu> No languages would be wrong, no?
[10:35] <Laney> No selectable languages
[10:35] <Laney> this is clunky :)
[10:36] <larsu> well, you could still select them in the menu bar
[10:36] <Laney> I'm talking about the other issue
[10:36] <Laney> empty submenu if there are no languages to choose from
[10:36] <larsu> ah. should be insensitive in that case, not hidden
[10:36] <Laney> cool
[10:36] <larsu> oh wait, weird
[10:36] <larsu> I guess you're right
[10:37] <larsu> I'd even remove it
[10:37] <larsu> but then that wouldn't signify that there are no languages to choose from
[10:38]  * larsu changes opinion to "should be hidden"
[10:38] <larsu> that's quite a ui change for an sru thoguh
[10:38] <Laney> ya maybe insensitive is best there
[10:38]  * Laney doesn't know
[10:54] <larsu> argh!
[10:55] <larsu> so, this needs much more work
[10:55] <larsu> all of the plugins use dynamic menus as well
[10:55] <larsu> so the fullscreen gear menu won't have screenshot, rotation, etc
[10:55]  * larsu was wondering why this menu was so sparse
[10:57] <Laney> flexiondotorg: you here? We've got a test failure in nemo: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/wily-adt-nemo/lastBuild/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/console
[10:57] <Laney> Should these files be added to POTFILES.in?
[10:57] <larsu> Laney: this is not really fixable unless we touch every plugin
[10:58] <larsu> because they don't know about the possibility of multiple menus
[10:58] <Laney> haha
[10:58] <larsu> there just like: where should I insert my items? Ok, insert(), insert(), insert()
[10:58] <Laney> can totem handle it itself?
[10:58] <larsu> no
[10:58] <Laney> connect to a changed signal and populate the other menu ...
[10:58] <Laney> like the rb link menus thing
[10:58] <Laney> (or however that works)
[10:58] <larsu> urgh
[10:59] <larsu> it could... but really?
[10:59] <Laney> :)
[10:59] <larsu> and it would need to be hardcoded for every plugin
[10:59] <larsu> because we need to know the section id
[11:00] <larsu> they way plugins insert menus in totem is kind of bad
[11:00] <larsu> but that's not something to fix in an SRU
[11:02] <Laney> agreed
[11:02] <larsu> Laney: so, I think we should backport with the fullscreen menu removed
[11:02] <larsu> let's see what SRU people say
[11:03] <larsu> but I'd be uncomfortable with bigger patches in there
[11:03] <larsu> this is already quite bug
[11:03] <larsu> *big
[11:16] <Laney> sure
[11:16] <Laney> so just the insensitive/remove/... empty menu thing I think?
[11:18] <larsu> yes
[11:18] <larsu> and I think we should go with insensitive
[11:18] <larsu> (again)
[11:19] <larsu> to signify "there's something here sometimes"
[11:19] <larsu> I wonder what upstream does
[11:19] <larsu> ah, empty sub sections
[11:26] <Laney> lemme know when it's ready!
[11:26]  * larsu is cursing desrt
[11:26] <larsu> things that should be simple: making a submenu item insenstive
[11:27] <larsu> now let me tell you about something that is impossible…
[11:30] <desrt> larsu: why?
[11:30] <larsu> desrt: morning :)
[11:30] <desrt> hi :)
[11:30] <larsu> how do I make a menu item that has a submenu insensitive?
[11:30] <desrt> you don't, apparently :)
[11:31] <larsu> ya...
[11:31] <desrt> only thing i can guess about is via submenu-action
[11:31] <larsu> doesn't work
[11:31] <desrt> well, it was just a guess :)
[11:31] <larsu> my first guess as well
[11:35] <seb128> Laney, can you retry the desktop-next image build?
[11:35] <Laney> yus
[11:35] <seb128> livecd-rootfs is in wily
[11:35] <seb128> thanks
[11:36] <Laney> should be running
[11:38] <seb128> thx
[11:56] <larsu> Laney: new string is impossible to SRU?
[11:56] <larsu> hiding and making insensitive is impossible without patching gtkmenutracker
[11:56] <larsu> actually hiding might work if I move the creation into the .c file
[11:57] <Laney> remove and add an insensitive item?
[11:57] <larsu> it wouldn't look like a submenu item then
[11:57] <larsu> i.e., missing the triangl
[11:58] <Laney> indeed
[11:58] <Laney> removing altogether is probably better than a new string
[11:58] <Laney> unless you can find one which is already translated
[11:59] <larsu> I was thinking about "Empty", which would be a very small patch
[11:59] <larsu> if I remove I might as well make insensitive
[11:59] <Laney> thought you couldn't do that
[11:59] <larsu> do what?
[11:59] <Laney> or you can in code?
[11:59] <larsu> yes, I can move the whole thing into code
[11:59] <larsu> really ugly
[12:00] <larsu> but better than what we have now
[12:00] <Laney> maybe Empty is already translated?
[12:01] <larsu> it is, but only in a couple of languages
[12:01] <larsu> probably an old string
[12:01]  * larsu checks in the only language that matters, fr
[12:02] <seb128> what are you talking about?
[12:03] <larsu> that was much quicker than I thought :)
[12:03] <larsu> seb128: totem shows empty sub menus when no language/subtitles exist for a movie
[12:03] <Laney> sound the fr alarm
[12:03] <larsu> we're looking for the least-intrusive way to SRU a fix
[12:03] <seb128> what should it display?
[12:04] <larsu> either hide the menu item or make it insensitive
[12:04] <larsu> honestly, I think we could leave it as is
[12:04] <larsu> and find a proper way to do it in W
[12:04] <larsu> (but don't tell Laney that)
[12:05] <Laney> har de har
[12:07] <larsu> Laney: I've attached the backport for now. Gotta grab some lunch
[12:08] <seb128> yeah, if the menu is supposed to be empty it's just cosmetic
[12:08] <seb128> not the end of the world
[12:09] <Laney> never said it was
[12:09] <Laney> I am surprised that this is unfixable though
[12:24] <larsu> Laney: me neither. I'm disliking GMenu more and more :/
[12:24]  * larsu actually goes to lunch now
[12:24] <Laney> oh well, let's take what you have done already
[12:25] <Laney> thanks for the patch!
[12:26] <larsu> Laney: sorry :(
[12:26] <Laney> no sweat
[12:27] <seb128> larsu, Laney, did ctrl-f/g still works for you in gedit to cycle through search matches?
[12:33] <Laney> ctrl-g does, f doesn't do that but raises the search window again
[12:33] <Laney> seems the same on a utopic vm
[12:34] <Laney> oh there is a difference: ctrl-g doesn't work if the search field is focused
[12:39] <seb128> Laney, right, that's what I meant
[12:39] <seb128> usually I do ctrl-f then press ctrl-g to cycle
[12:39] <seb128> cftrl-f used to work as well in the focus box
[12:39] <seb128> iirc
[12:45] <Laney> seems to be ctrl-g and shift-ctrl-g but that doesn't work inside the box
[12:45] <Laney> up/down does, that's what I always used
[12:45] <Laney> but probably is a bug I guess
[12:46] <seb128> I think it's due to the gtk update
[12:46] <seb128> need to try with old gtk
[12:47] <Laney> other keys work
[12:47] <Laney> eg ctrl-shift-k to clear the highlight
[12:49] <seb128> Laney, I guess we need https://git.gnome.org/browse/gedit/commit/?h=gnome-3-16&id=18cd0a02e0c654da0ce9817385989acc61a0263c
[12:50] <seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gedit/commit/?h=gnome-3-16&id=611d788b15c68722b7d5aeaf42634ada2e6ccd06
[12:50] <seb128> esc doesn't work either
[12:51] <Laney> ya just found that
[12:52] <Laney> I will look this afternoon
[12:52] <seb128> thanks
[12:52] <Laney> still trying to fix autopkgtest fun
[12:54] <Laney> flexiondotorg: I uploaded that nemo thing, could you take a look/forward/fix differently if you want to?
[12:54] <Laney> or let me know what you want
[12:55] <Laney> (assuming it works)
[13:31] <larsu> seb128: weird, indeed
[13:31] <larsu> I wonder if this is because of hergetme's accel changes
[13:31] <larsu> Laney: let me know if that commit seb128 linked to doesn't work out
[14:35] <seb128> Laney, when you are back can you retry the desktop-next build?
[14:45] <Laney> seb128: another one or is that obsolete?
[14:46] <seb128> Laney, another one
[14:46] <Laney> ok!
[14:46] <seb128> thanks :-)
[14:46] <Laney> we should set up a release team for desktop-next then you can do it yourself from the iso tracker
[14:47] <seb128> hopefully once they start working I/we don't need manual work anymore though
[14:47] <Laney> ha
[14:48] <Laney> seeing the amount of stuff they have in there for core I bet a few rounds of tweaks will be wanted
[14:48] <Laney> running
[14:51] <seb128> thanks
[14:54] <Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/208366019/buildlog_ubuntu_wily_i386_ubuntu-desktop-next_BUILDING.txt.gz
[14:54] <Laney> nearly there ;-)
[14:55] <Laney> (not a clue why we have this)
[14:56] <seb128> bah!
[15:04] <seb128> Laney, do you understand what's the group mismatch from the log? is that just the md5 from the log to copy to the config?
[15:05] <Laney> I guess you have to update the file in the source with some piece of output
[15:05] <Laney> can't think what it is for though
[15:05] <Laney> maybe we don't need it for desktop-next
[15:06] <seb128> yeah, I don't understand much those bits
[15:10] <seb128> bah, I don't understand
[15:11] <Laney> fairly sure it is og rah's work if you want an explanation
[15:12] <seb128> lol
[15:15] <seb128> Laney, looks like 02-add_user_to_groups.chroot isn't used
[15:15] <seb128> dunno why
[15:15] <seb128> and dunno why ubuntu-core doesn't have the same issue
[15:16] <seb128> echo "I: add $USER to ($DEFGROUPS) group(s)"
[15:16] <seb128> that's not showing in https://launchpadlibrarian.net/208331223/buildlog_ubuntu_wily_arm64_ubuntu-core_BUILDING.txt.gz
[15:16] <seb128> nor https://launchpadlibrarian.net/208366019/buildlog_ubuntu_wily_i386_ubuntu-desktop-next_BUILDING.txt.gz
[15:18] <Laney> it's the 00-uid-... one
[15:19] <seb128> Laney, you mean? that fails?
[15:20] <seb128> yeah, but what I don't get is that the config there includes the "docker" user
[15:20] <seb128> but docker is not installed
[15:21] <seb128> unsure why ubuntu-core doesn't get the same issue
[15:21] <Laney> it seems to overwrite the files
[15:21] <Laney> if they match some known hashes at the start of the run
[15:22] <seb128> yeah, I'm unsure why the md5 are different between -core and -desktop
[15:25] <Laney> I guess we have some different stuff installed
[15:25] <seb128> I'm pondering just updating the md5 from the config with the ones from the log :p
[15:26] <seb128> trying to follow https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2011-June/033458.html to see if I can debug that locally instead first though
[15:26] <Laney> would be good to know what it's for
[15:26] <Laney> ogra_: can you educate us or share a link about the passwd/groups hash stuff in livecd-rootfs?
[15:29] <ogra_> Laney, cant link, no ... i dont think it was ever documented ... effectively livecd-rootfs has checksums for all readonly password files and is supposed to fail if the passwd db differs in any way from that so you can manually adjust the values ... (UIDs and GIDs can not change since we are readonly)
[15:29] <seb128> ogra_, why does it need a copy?
[15:30] <seb128> ogra_, is there an easy way to see the differences?
[15:30] <ogra_> seb128, it doesnt have a copy ... only a checksum
[15:30] <ogra_> the build log shows a diff if the files differ
[15:31] <seb128> ogra_, e.g https://launchpadlibrarian.net/208366019/buildlog_ubuntu_wily_i386_ubuntu-desktop-next_BUILDING.txt.gz is a failing build
[15:31] <seb128> unsure what is wrong though
[15:31] <ogra_> seb128, right, so you scroll to the end and there are the diffs ... then you compare to an installed system
[15:32] <seb128> ogra_, "installed system"?
[15:32] <seb128> we don't have one, we are trying to get that iso going :p
[15:32] <ogra_> seb128, if you do your very first build i guess you first need to do a local debootstrap and create the right checksums
[15:32] <seb128> ogra_, any idea why they are different from ubuntu-core? we should have a similar base
[15:32] <ogra_> creatin the starting point is all manual
[15:33] <ogra_> you likely have other packages (recommends) installed
[15:35] <seb128> ogra_, I should compared the content from http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/livecd-rootfs/trunk/view/head:/live-build/ubuntu-desktop-next/hooks/00-uid-gid-fix.chroot_early to the bootstrap one then?
[15:36] <seb128> ogra_, diff gives me http://paste.ubuntu.com/11590387/
[15:36] <ogra_> seb128, well, adjust your check to match your file and you are done ...
[15:36] <seb128> ogra_, but I don't understand why ubuntu-core has docker it is config (http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/livecd-rootfs/trunk/view/head:/live-build/ubuntu-core/hooks/00-uid-gid-fix.chroot_early)  where docker is not installed
[15:37] <ogra_> probably a hack that mvo added
[15:38] <ogra_> (ask him on monday) ...
[15:39] <seb128> yeah
[15:39] <seb128> ogra_, thanks
[15:40] <ogra_> oh, and that passwd db thing will definitely bite you more
[15:40] <seb128> you mean?
[15:40] <ogra_> the writable passwd db is handled by libnss-extrausers ...
[15:40] <ogra_> which adduser can not properly work with
[15:40] <ogra_> (there is a bug open since ages)
[15:40] <ogra_> it is an overlay ...
[15:41] <seb128> well, desktop-next is a copy of ubuntu-core, if core works desktop should as well?
[15:41] <ogra_> core doesnt add users :)
[15:41] <ogra_> and touch doesnt either
[15:41] <ogra_> so both dont have that problem
[15:42] <ogra_> (i mean. both add users, but hardcoded ones during build time)
[15:42] <seb128> desktop-next shouldn't add users either
[15:42] <ogra_> ah, k
[15:43] <ogra_> i thought you were aiming for an actual desktop install
[15:43] <ogra_> (with adding a personalized user etc)
[15:43] <Laney> installer might need to exist first :)
[15:43] <ogra_> heh, ok
[15:43] <seb128> ogra_, no, aiming at doing an image with a different seed
[15:43] <seb128> so more installed from there
[15:43] <ogra_> well, once we need to add users that issue will bubble up again
[15:44] <Laney> he's just trying to get a first image to work from atm
[15:44] <ogra_> yeah
[15:44] <Laney> basically core-system-image with the desktop-next seed installed
[15:45] <ogra_> yup
[15:45] <ogra_> btw, if you have any idea how we can solve the UID/GID thing any better ....
[15:45] <ogra_> this obviously scales very very badly :)
[15:45] <seb128> shrug, I don't understand
[15:45] <seb128> "/etc/passwd post-debootstrap hash doesn't match record"
[15:45] <Laney> would need to understand the problem it solves first
[15:45] <seb128> but passwd_bootstrap="1050cdb2fcde4d10c86399616f64dfdb"
[15:46] <seb128> $ md5sum cache/bootstrap/etc/passwd
[15:46] <seb128> 1050cdb2fcde4d10c86399616f64dfdb  cache/bootstrap/etc/passwd
[15:47] <ogra_> Laney, direcotries on disk are owned by a certain UID/GID ... during build UID and GID for users are assigned dynamically ... so each build can differ ... but the readonly rootfs wont adjust the dir ownership so we need to make sure UID and GID always stay the same
[15:48] <ogra_> so if a UID or GID changes during build, we dont want that image to finish building but tell us there was a change so we can force the ID back to what the rootfs expects
[15:48] <ogra_> the wonderful world of readonly rootfses :)
[15:50] <Laney> Alright I'll try to think about it at some point
[15:50] <ogra_> btw,m there are two ID checks ... one after bootstrap and one after the chroot was filled
[15:51] <Laney> seb128: I think just update the hash and the contents of the files that get outputted
[15:51] <ogra_> (the latter indeed adds more system users)
[15:51] <ogra_> right
[15:51] <Laney> to establish the baseline
[15:51] <ogra_> for your first image just update to what you get manually
[15:51]  * Laney switches topics *swoosh*
[15:52] <Laney> Noskcaj: darkxst: can you update the gnome shell extensions?
[15:52] <Laney> Noskcaj: darkxst: holding gtk and shell back in proposed because they dep on specific versions of shell
[15:52] <Laney> I did -extensions itself but the other seem more irritating :)
[16:12] <Laney> cyphermox: yo
[16:12] <Laney> cyphermox: how can I start ubiquity to the slideshow step?
[16:17] <seb128> Laney, http://paste.ubuntu.com/11591093/ seems fine to you?
[16:17] <Laney> doubt we need the docker hack
[16:18] <Laney> can't you just copy and paste passwd/group/etc into the file?
[16:18] <seb128> Laney, what docker hack?
[16:18] <Laney> you kept the docker user
[16:18] <seb128> well
[16:20] <seb128> you want me to replace the ones in that file with the system ones?
[16:21] <Laney> I think it makes sense to start from those
[16:21] <seb128> well, I don't understand why the docker hack got added
[16:21] <seb128> but I think that's something useful for snappy
[16:21] <Laney> probably to demo a snap of docker
[16:23] <Laney> but that is just my advice/feeling, keep it if you think it is better
[16:23] <seb128> well, I don't understand snappy enough to know if it's needed for some snappy feature to work
[16:23] <seb128> so I'm reluctant to delete it
[16:24] <seb128> I would keep the core/desktop diff minimal if possible
[16:24] <seb128> I guess that can wait monday to pick mvo's knowledge of the topic
[16:24] <seb128> the diff I posted make it success the first step at least
[16:24] <Laney> you could upload that and change it again later
[16:25] <Laney> if necessary
[16:30] <seb128> Laney, http://paste.ubuntu.com/11591496/ ? ;-)
[16:31] <Laney> +1
[16:31] <seb128> thanks :-)
[17:00] <Laney> right
[17:00] <Laney> see you!
[17:05] <seb128> Laney, have a good w.e
[17:05] <seb128> Laney, if you walk by the computer later can you do a retry of the desktop next build if livecd-rootfs is in?
[17:06] <seb128> otherwise don't bother, I guess it's going to daily try over the w.e
[17:06] <seb128> likely not something I'm going to work more on today
[17:14] <larsu> seb128: first try at making it similar to adwaita, with a bit less ugly and more orange: https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/ubuntu-themes/overlay-scrollbars
[17:14] <larsu> but really, you should not try this now. It's Friday :)
[17:14] <seb128> lol, I'm happy to try ;-)
[17:16] <larsu> gtk weirdly always shows the "expanded" scrollbar when using a track point or mouse
[17:16] <larsu> and the small ones only on a touch pad
[17:16] <larsu> (or touch)
[17:16] <larsu> I think we might want to patch that out or make it configurable upstream
[17:17] <willcooke> hope you all have a great weekend,  Cya next week
[17:18] <seb128> larsu, looks nicer to me
[17:19] <seb128> larsu, it's a bit weird how it goes from scroll handle to thin line when you are on the border of the win and move out of it
[17:20] <seb128> it's obvious when you move in/out a win
[17:20] <seb128> with the cursor
[17:20] <seb128> but otherwise looks good to me :-)
[17:21] <larsu> seb128: hm, usually I go fast enough to not notice that
[17:22] <seb128> larsu, you mean?
[17:22] <seb128> well you mouseover something and move out from the win, the border change from thumb to line
[17:22] <seb128> without transition/animation
[17:26] <larsu> seb128: trackpoint or touchpad?
[17:26] <larsu> it shouldn't be expanded when you're using a touchpad, unless you're very close to the border
[17:27] <seb128> larsu, trackpoint
[17:28] <seb128> oh, using the touchpad I just get the thin line
[17:28] <larsu> right, that's what I meant above
[17:28] <larsu> because with the touchpad you can two-finger scroll
[17:28] <larsu> so you usually don't need the scrollbar
[17:28] <larsu> but you can get it by hovering
[17:28] <seb128> right
[17:29] <larsu> not sure that always showing it in the other case makes sense tbh
[17:31] <seb128> yeah, it just looks weird that it goes from one shape to the other one without animation
[17:31] <seb128> it feels jerky
[17:31] <larsu> indeed
[17:41] <cyphermox> Laney: hey
[17:41] <cyphermox> seb128: why do we need all these new groups and users?
[17:41] <seb128> cyphermox, which ones?
[17:41] <cyphermox> in your paste for live-build
[17:42] <cyphermox> I'm just curious, I have no opinion on it :)
[17:51] <cyphermox> Laney: to answer your question about slideshow, I don't think there is a way, aside from loading a daily image, booting in live, and upgrading ubiquity before you start it
[17:58] <Laney> cyphermox: right, ok, thanks
[17:58] <Laney> seb128: ok will do if I see it in time
[18:11] <seb128> Laney, you can do it njow ;-)
[21:25] <darkxst> Laney, oops, I did do -extensions, but seems I didnt upload it!
[21:46] <darkxst> Laney, I am somewhat against the other extensions even being package in the archives, so guess they just synced from debian
[22:02] <attente> mitya57: hi. i'm trying to figure out why this still doesn't seem to be fixing the qt5 indicator submenus
[22:03] <attente> mitya57: http://code.qt.io/cgit/qt/qtbase.git/commit/?id=03dc2b2e82750d1c531cf00a406368cde4a8928b
[22:25] <Laney> darkxst: ya, sadly they are and so block migration :(
[22:25] <darkxst> Laney, yes I saw that
[22:25] <darkxst> hopefully Noskcaj can look? I'm busy all day today
[22:26] <Laney> they seem kind of tedious to update
[22:27] <darkxst> they shouldnt be there in the first place! pretty much guaranteed to break every shell update,
[22:28] <darkxst> Laney, can we delete/block from syncing?
[22:29] <Laney> in theory, might be best to discuss with debian first though
[22:29] <Laney> could possibly also demote them to proposed
[22:41] <darkxst> Laney, ok well gtg now


[10:50] <knome> madnick, you here?
[11:40] <madnick> knome: for a while :)
[11:41] <knome> madnick, how well do you know the current lightdm greeter?
[11:42] <madnick> knome: the one that is in the image atm?
[11:42] <knome> yes
[11:42] <madnick> Well, I got the source code, and Ive looked at it a lot
[11:43] <knome> okay, good to know
[11:43] <knome> we're thinking that we might just try to fix some issues in that for P
[11:43] <madnick> okay
[11:43] <madnick> which issues?
[11:44] <knome> we'd like a bit better theming, maybe dark panel and dialog, and change the computer icon
[11:44] <madnick> oh okay
[11:44] <knome> little things like that
[11:45] <madnick> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lightdm-team/lightdm-gtk-greeter/trunk/view/head:/data/greeter.ui
[11:46] <knome> yeah, we know
[11:46] <madnick> :)
[11:48] <knome> i need to take a shower
[11:48] <knome> bbl
[11:50] <madnick> :P
[13:33] <ochosi> hey madnick
[20:20] <Unit193> Did you end up with all the tests you needed for yesterday?
[20:20] <charlie-tca> No
[20:20] <charlie-tca> I am still running kubuntu lucid tests today
[20:21] <Unit193> I can't run 64, but I was doing the Xubu ones late.
[20:21] <charlie-tca> Okay
[20:21] <charlie-tca> I will run them tomorrow, probably. I won't be able to today
[20:22] <Unit193> It'll be easier to run some today, need a few still?
[20:23] <charlie-tca> sure. We don't have any done today


[07:37] <ochosi> JackFrost: k, was just wondering because it doesnt seem to use thr Keywords from
[07:37] <ochosi> .desktop files and the code says that it does that stsrting with garcon 0
[07:37] <ochosi> 0.6.2
[10:46] <Priem19> Is there any way to remove some uploaded wallpaper contest submission?
[10:48] <Priem19> I tweaked the level on a photo last night, with my screen dimmed, but only now I see some white colors are overexposed
[10:56] <Priem19> Ah I see it's because of compression; saving at 99%. Anyway, any possibility in removing a pic?
[10:57] <Priem19> https://contest.xubuntu.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/meadow_crop_96pct.png
[10:57] <Priem19> this one
[11:21] <jphilips> bluesabre: ^^^
[13:50] <Priem19> This PC is shutting down, but I'm still listening with cubo-cube
[19:35] <bluesabre> For Priem19 if he returns, try uploading the wallpaper as a jpg instead of png
[20:45] <xubuntu19> hello
[23:04] <JackFrost> cubo-cube: It's been recommended that you upload jpgs instead.


[18:20] <wligtenberg> I just reported #1354730 is there anything I can do to make the report better?
[18:21] <wligtenberg> Here is the full link: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub-installer/+bug/1354730
[18:39]  * penguin42 looks
[18:43] <penguin42> wligtenberg: Given that other bug you mention was debian-installer-utils may be more appropriate? but I don't know the details , but the bug report looks ok - although I'd be tempted to add some detail of what your disk/filesystem setup is
[18:45] <wligtenberg> Well, that is detailed in the link I mentioned
[18:45] <penguin42> yeh, I mean just to make it easier for someone scanning past the bug
[18:48] <wligtenberg> just updated it
[18:49] <wligtenberg> thank you for the feedback
[18:53] <penguin42> no problem
[20:47] <Rosco2> Can someone from bug control look at bug 1354109?
[20:48] <Rosco2> I think it should be set to "wishlist" importance, and set to "Triaged"
[20:48] <penguin42> ooh that's a fun one to figure out impact of
[20:49] <Rosco2> :-)
[20:52] <penguin42> ok, so gramps has edubuntu-desktop-gnome as a Task, so it's a core package
[20:53] <penguin42> Rosco2: I've set it as a Medium
[20:54] <Rosco2> Thanks
[20:54]  * penguin42 can see people fighting these type of problems in database definitions for decades to come
[20:55] <penguin42> it's quite hard to define definitions that fits all combinations
[20:57] <Rosco2> Yes it wasn't really a problem recording relationships from the 1800s and before
[21:04] <penguin42> Rosco2: I can see people could class it as wishlist (which I think that's where it is upstream) but especially since since it has a task for Edubuntu it seems more important to get it right
[21:06] <Rosco2> I know upstream are starting to think about what should be included in the next major release
[21:06] <penguin42> nod
[21:06] <Rosco2> I will point them to the bug on their mailing list to see if someone will take it on