[00:46] <jo-erlend> where can I find documentation for writing appindicators in Python?
[08:32] <MacSlow> good morning everybody
[08:38] <jahkop> What do you think about this? http://www.whatdoestheinternetthink.net/index.php?s=ubuntu+unity&st=all
[10:38] <vish> mpt: hi, seen bug 785571 ? if we have changed that maybe we need to update » <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoundMenu#A.2BIBw-Sound_Preferences.2BICYgHQAvIBw-Sound_Settings.2BICYgHQ-> ?
[11:37] <dbarth> jaytaoko: ping? when you wake up, do you have the bug ref. for the vsync problem? fta is looking for it
[11:48] <ronoc> HarryHaaren, skype ?
[11:48] <ronoc> call me when you are ready
[12:00] <zniavre> good afternoon
[12:00] <zniavre> what is new about this bug please ? > https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/762478
[12:01] <zniavre> can we think it could be solved in Oneiric ?
[13:09] <Ianster_guy> Hello my name is Ian and I'm a Ubuntu/windows user. On my Ubuntu desktop I have a usb surround sound card that stopped working after a upgrade. Who is interested in a problem like this or where do I drop a bug report.
[13:09] <Ianster_guy> :)
[13:10] <Ianster_guy> I've gone through the trouble shooting already
[14:08] <mpt> vish, you're right. Fixed.
[14:14] <vish> mpt: i guess we should re-open the bug to keep the ellipses?
[14:14] <mpt> vish, no, the update retains them
[14:15] <vish> mpt: oh..?  ok,Cool! i hadnt checked the update, just saw the bug
[14:16] <mpt> vish, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/73655618/indicator-sound_0.7.0-0ubuntu1_0.7.1-0ubuntu1.diff.gz
[14:16] <mpt> vish, it does reveal, though, that it's using "..." when it should be using "…"
[14:17] <vish> k..
[14:19] <vish> mpt: yea, it just seems the changelog entry was not updated.
[14:29] <jo-erlend> can someone help me find some working examples of Python appindicators? None of them work. This one, for instance: http://conjurecode.com/create-indicator-applet-for-ubuntu-unity-with-python/
[14:30] <jo-erlend> appindicator does not have any Indicator member.
[14:30] <tedg> jo-erlend, I'd grab the weather indicator, I'm pretty sure that's in Python.
[14:33] <jo-erlend> tedg, no, Vala.
[14:33] <jo-erlend> like all the other Python examples I've found...
[14:34] <c10ud> jo-erlend, https://github.com/emesene/emesene/blob/master/emesene/gui/gtkui/Indicator.py
[14:37] <jo-erlend> c10ud, but that also says appindicator should have a Indicator member. I can't find that here.
[14:38] <c10ud> what says what?
[14:38] <jo-erlend> your example.
[14:38] <c10ud> i don't get it
[14:39] <jo-erlend> there is no Indicator class in the appindicator module.
[14:40] <jo-erlend> >>> import appindicator \n >>> dir(appindicator) \n ['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__', '__package__', 'appindicator', 'gobject', 'gtk']
[14:41] <c10ud> well, that should work in lucid and maverick, not sure about natty though
[14:41] <jo-erlend> are you running natty?
[14:41] <c10ud> nope
[14:42] <jo-erlend> you're right. On Lucid, appindicator does have an Indicator class.
[14:48] <jo-erlend> hmm. Strange. I had a file named "appindicator" in my home, which was imported instead :)
[14:57] <Wolf1978> hi, i'm just here to inquire about unity and wether canonical will continue to use unity as standard desktop in the future.
[15:00] <tedg> Wolf1978, We have no plans to stop Unity development that I know of.
[15:03] <tedg> jo-erlend, I'd like to get the Python examples updated to start using GObject introspection for Oneric, since that's the way all GTK stuff is going.  I'm not too familiar with Python myself though.
[15:04] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, that's very likely.
[15:04] <Wolf1978> tedg: to be more specific about my question: i really dislike unity, after working for it for 2 weeks now, and would rather switch distribution than going through the pain of uninstalling unity from ubuntu. if unity will stay in ubuntu, i guess ubuntu ist "just not right" for me... which would be sad, as I have been using ubuntu for some years now.
[15:04] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, Unity is not a "desktop" though. The desktop is still Gnome. Unity is just one shell for it.
[15:05] <jo-erlend> in 11.10, you'll be able to switch between Unity and Gnome Shell as easily as you do with Unity and Gnome Panel now, for instance.
[15:05] <tedg> Wolf1978, Okay, that's your choice.  Sorry that you don't like it.  There are other desktop shells you can try on Ubuntu, including Kubuntu and Xubuntu.  But if you feel a different distribution is right for you, that's okay too.
[15:05] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, Unity is just a plugin for Compiz. You can easily switch to Gnome panel. There is absolutely no reason to reinstall or uninstall anything.
[15:06] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, takes about five seconds to switch. Installing a different distro will take more effort.
[15:07] <Wolf1978> well, it uses up disk-space. ubuntu stands for one application for one purpose, unlike e.g. opensuse, where you just have too much applications for the same purpose. thats why I like ubuntu, but having unity on it does not make sense when i am not using it. i am a purist, and would rather have it uninstalled, which seems complicated. and sorry if my english is horrible to your ears.
[15:08] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, just choose Ubuntu Classic when you login and you're back to the way Ubuntu was before.
[15:08] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, how much space does Unity take?
[15:08] <Wolf1978> will gnome get the same attention as unity in the future, or will you focus on unity?
[15:09] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, Unity is a shell for Gnome. But yes, Gnome Shell will be back in 11.10, as I said.
[15:10] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, but since Gnome has killed Gnome Panel, that will not get any more attention in any distro I reckon. It would be very surprising, anyway, since nobody has worked on it for years now.
[15:12] <jo-erlend> oh... And btw: according to apt-cache, Unity takes 620KB.
[15:12] <Wolf1978> true... but i like it still more than unity ;) will definately try out 11.10
[15:12] <Wolf1978> ok, that is not very much indeed...
[15:13] <Wolf1978> may i ask another question regarding the detection of my graphic adapter?
[15:13] <jo-erlend> seems a little bit off topic in this channel?
[15:14] <Wolf1978> i see, will try somewhere else. thank you again for answering
[15:14] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, have you discovered the keyboard functions in Unity, btw? Lots of people doesn't know about them. Or right-clicking on lenses in the launcher, etc.
[15:15] <jo-erlend> I have big difficulties understanding why anyone would prefer Gnome Panel to Unity.
[15:16] <jo-erlend> btw: you can still use gnome-panel with Unity, if you want a bottom panel, for instance.
[15:16] <Wolf1978> maybe because everyone has worked with gnome for so many years now, and with unity the feel of linux changes a lot.
[15:17] <jo-erlend> yes. Finally being able to use the keyboard properly, is one of the things I personally love about Unity. Easier access to files and apps is another. :)
[15:18] <Wolf1978> i have not used any keyboard commands with unity, i dont even know of them...
[15:19] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, that doesn't surprise me. Most people that have complained about Unity, doesn't. Here are some simple ones: press and hold super (winkey). You'll see numbers over the launcher and if you press that number while holding super, you switch to that application, or start it if it isn't running.
[15:20] <jo-erlend> if you press that number twice, then you get an overview of all the windows that belongs to that application. If you press shift, then you start another instance of the application. Press super+w to get an overview of all open windows, super+a to go directly to your applications or super+f to go directly to files and folders.
[15:21] <HarryHaaren> jo-erlend: How can one change the delay before the launcher pops out, & displays the numbers?
[15:21] <jo-erlend> HarryHaaren, I don't know.
[15:21] <jo-erlend> why would you want to?
[15:22] <Wolf1978> i really dislike, that i can not give parameters to starters... e.g. --geometry 80x25 to the terminal...
[15:22] <Wolf1978> or change the background color of starters at all.... at least i did not find out how
[15:22] <HarryHaaren> jo-erlend: hate waiting for my computer to respond to me :D
[15:22] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, you can't?
[15:23] <jo-erlend> HarryHaaren, oh, you want it to not animate, but appear instantly?
[15:23] <HarryHaaren> yep
[15:24] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, you mean on the launcher, right? The background colour depends on the icon used.
[15:26] <Wolf1978> on the launcher, yes. why can i not make it the color i want? and where do i enter parameters?
[15:26] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, when you make the launcher, you can enter parameters as you like.
[15:27] <Wolf1978> when i start a gnome-terminal, and tell it to stay on the launcher, where can i set the parameters?
[15:29] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, if you want a custom launcher, then you have to make it. Right click on the desktop and "create starter" (I don't use english desktop, so your label might be different)
[15:29] <jo-erlend> then drop it onto the launcher.
[15:30] <Wolf1978> ok, when i delete the starter from the desktop is is gone on the launcher also...
[15:31] <jo-erlend> hmm. Really? That's strange. Let me have a look.
[15:34] <Wolf1978> definately...
[15:34] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, you'd probably want to place it in ~/.local/share/applications anyway, so that shouldn't be a real problem.
[15:35] <jo-erlend> (that way, it'll show up in dash and be counted in recent applications as well)
[15:36] <Wolf1978> it is just more complicated than is was before unity. i'm just trying to tell you WHY i do not like unity in its current state... the color thing is just another example. there SHOULD also be an option to disable global menu, instead of having the user use google to find a guid on how to disable it.
[15:38] <jo-erlend> sure. I personally like to use the keyboard and have the system learn from my actions so I don't have to repeat myself, but others prefer to use the mouse and click a lot. That's fine.
[15:40] <Wolf1978> the system to learn from my actions? is unity doing that?
[15:40] <jo-erlend> yes.
[15:41] <Wolf1978> how?
[15:42] <jo-erlend> it counts when and why you run applications, and optionally where you are when you do it. So, over time, it'll learn what you're trying to do. Actually, it's zeitgeist that does that, but Unity uses that kind of data to display files, applications, etc.
[15:44] <jo-erlend> if you have a morning meeting every monday from 9AM to 10AM, for instance, then it makes sense that documents related to those meetings should be easily available around that time. You shouldn't have to navigate your filesystem for them.
[15:44] <Wolf1978> isn't that dangerous? is this data transmitted anywhere?
[15:44] <jo-erlend> no.
[15:44] <Wolf1978> ok, another one. can i change the size of the icons on the launcher?
[15:45] <jo-erlend> I don't think you can atm.
[15:46] <jo-erlend> Wolf1978, I would recommend that you give Unity another chance. It has many "hidden" features that I'm sure you'll come to love. If you want to, you can always run a gnome-panel at the bottom and right to lean on until you get comfortable.
[15:47] <Wolf1978> will unity get feature updates on the same interval as ubuntu releases new versions, or is it updated more often?
[15:48] <jo-erlend> that's a good question. I don't really know. I don't think I'd mind if it were made an exception to the SRU rule, since there's obviously many things to improve yet.
[15:48] <HarryHaaren> Wold1978: Launcher icons, yes, terminal -> ccsm (advanced compiz thingy), Scroll to "unity panel plugin", advanced tab, icon size :)
[15:48] <jo-erlend> ah :)
[15:48] <HarryHaaren> Wolf1978, see above post by me
[15:49] <Wolf1978> jo-erlend: guess i'm giving it another chance...
[15:50] <jo-erlend> HarryHaaren, that's great. Thanks. They were a little big for my taste. :)
[15:50] <Wolf1978> HarryHaaren: thank you
[15:51] <HarryHaaren> 32 is a little big for my taste :P There's a bug report floating about to make the range bigger though
[17:41] <andyrock> hi all
[17:41] <andyrock> i can't compile unity from lp, after gtk+3 porting
[17:42] <andyrock> cmake works good
[17:42] <andyrock> but make -j2 give me this:
[17:43] <andyrock> In file included from /usr/include/unity-misc/unity-misc/na-tray-manager.h:32:0,
[17:43] <andyrock>                  from /usr/include/unity-misc/unity-misc/na-tray.h:32,
[17:43] <andyrock>                  from /home/andyrock/Desktop/unity/src/PanelTray.h:32,
[17:43] <andyrock>                  from /home/andyrock/Desktop/unity/src/PanelView.h:35,
[17:43] <andyrock>                  from /home/andyrock/Desktop/unity/tests/TestPanel.cpp:28:
[17:43] <andyrock> /usr/include/unity-misc/unity-misc/na-tray-child.h:44:3: error: ‘GtkSocket’ does not name a type
[17:43] <andyrock> /usr/include/unity-misc/unity-misc/na-tray-child.h:53:3: error: ‘GtkSocketClass’ does not name a type
[17:43] <andyrock> make[2]: *** [tests/CMakeFiles/test-panel.dir/TestPanel.cpp.o] Error 1
[17:43] <andyrock> make[1]: *** [tests/CMakeFiles/test-panel.dir/all] Error 2
[17:43] <andyrock> make[1]: *** Waiting for unfinished jobs....
[17:43] <andyrock> sorry: http://pastebin.com/du1r8UQb
[17:48] <mterry> Heyo!  Is there any way to have bamf treat multiple executables as part of the same app?  So far, for bamf to recognize an executable, it needs its own .desktop file and bamf treats each .desktop file as a separate app
[17:48] <mterry> njpatel, ^
[17:50] <njpatel> DBO, for you ^
[17:50]  * njpatel can just chain on pings like it was his day job
[17:51] <mterry> :)
[17:51] <mterry> njpatel, it's not?
[17:51] <DBO> mterry, no, why would we need to?
[17:52] <mterry> DBO, I'll give the case of my pet project deja-dup.  It has several desktop files for technical reasons.  But ideally, the user would just see the various windows as part of the same "app"
[17:52] <DBO> you mean various executable?
[17:52] <mterry> DBO, both several desktops and several executables (they are 1-1)
[17:53] <DBO> uhm
[17:53] <DBO> how are they launched?
[17:53] <njpatel> mterry, shush!
[17:54] <mterry> DBO, it has changed in various versions of DD, but I can walk you through the various .desktop relationships if that would help paint the picture
[17:55] <DBO> mterry, more I was curious if one exe is launching the next
[17:55] <mterry> DBO, it happens to be the case in the oneiric version that they are, but in natty, they could be launched separately
[17:55] <DBO> so in the oneiric version are there still multiple desktop files?
[17:55] <mterry> DBO, yes
[17:56] <DBO> why?
[17:57] <mterry> DBO, I am fine with explaining this, but are you merely curious or trying to challenge the idea that an app should ever have multiple .desktop files?
[17:57] <DBO> I am both curious and confused as to why you might do this
[17:57] <DBO> to me if a user sees multiple desktop files
[17:57] <DBO> well no
[17:57] <DBO> I mean to me what you have described are multiple applications
[17:57] <DBO> so I am trying to figure out why they wouldn't be
[17:58] <mterry> DBO, well (A) not all .desktop files are visible.  (B) It's a technical limitation of .desktop files that they can only describe one executable.  But certainly you can imagine a logical "App" that had multiple executables?
[17:58] <DBO> sure but not one that would also have multiple launchers
[17:59] <mterry> DBO, well, I could imagine that being debatable, but let's say the app author wanted the window to be well-described by bamf when it came up.  So they wrote a NoDisplay .desktop file for the second executable
[17:59] <mterry> To provide translated name and icon
[18:00] <mterry> But now the app author is stuck with two entries on the launcher.  The second .desktop file the author wrote is really to workaround the fact that he/she can't associate the second executable with the first .desktop file
[18:01] <mterry> DBO, that's basically the situation deja-dup is in now
[18:01] <DBO> you could easily associate multiple executable with the same desktop file provided they down have their own
[18:01] <mterry> DBO, it has a preference window and a 'worker executable' each with their own .desktop file
[18:01] <DBO> make sure they all have the same wm-class that matches the desktop-id of the desktop file
[18:01] <DBO> and done
[18:02] <mterry> DBO, ah, excellent.  I will look into that.  That helps for the oneiric case.  But I'm also curious how one might solve the problem of natty deja-dup
[18:03] <DBO> I dont really know
[18:03] <mterry> DBO, that had two entry points into the "app"
[18:03] <DBO> to bamf, those are different applications
[18:03] <DBO> we would have to I guess add some metadata to the desktop file
[18:03] <DBO> that bamf could read
[18:03] <DBO> basically linking to the primary desktop file
[18:03] <mterry> DBO, if an executable described in .desktop A had a wm-class for .desktop B, which would bamf associate it with?
[18:04] <DBO> that depends
[18:04] <DBO> if it was launched from desktop file A
[18:04] <DBO> it would match to A
[18:04] <DBO> if it was launched by some other means
[18:04] <DBO> it would likely match to B
[18:05] <mterry> DBO, well, the wm-class trick will help me for now.  I set wm-class to (e.g.) "deja-dup.desktop"?  or "deja-dup"
[18:06] <DBO> deja-dup
[18:06] <DBO> desktop-id == foo for foo.desktop
[18:07] <mterry> DBO, cool, thanks!
[19:59] <Zhenech> tedg, mailing contributor-agreement@ and you is sufficient? or someone else too? indicator-datetime isnt listed on that page
[20:00] <tedg> Zhenech, Yeah, those two is good.  I'll forward it on.
[20:00] <tedg> Odd that it's not on there...
[20:01] <Zhenech> btw, as exchange you fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/gwibber/+bug/705363 for me :)
[20:11] <Zhenech> tedg, done, going to bed now :)
[20:12] <tedg> Zhenech, Thank you!
[21:55] <jo-erlend> hmm. Appindicators only supports menus, as I've understood it. But things like the media indicator has other stuff, like play and volume controls. How can that be?
[21:55] <jo-erlend> normal gtk menus doesn't support stuff like that?
[23:23] <meebey> who is in charge of the debian/ubuntu packages of libindicate? I wonder if the lib should suggest or even recommend something from the indicate stack else the app that provides the indicators land in the bin


[12:26] <waldo323> good morning
[12:37] <Scary_Guy> greetings
[12:59] <cmaloney> Good morning
[13:47] <jrwren> Good Morning, how are you all?
[13:49] <rick_h> wheee
[13:51] <jrwren> same.
[13:52] <jrwren> cut myself by reaching into sink to set the stopper and grazing my razor. have been bleeding profusely every sense. Great start to the day.
[13:58] <cmaloney> Ouch
[13:58] <cmaloney> That's no fun
[16:41] <waldo323> ouch :-\
[16:42] <cmaloney> Apparently one of the local churches in the area is sending is a flier for their Football Sunday
[16:42] <cmaloney> featuring U of M's coach somebody-or-other
[16:43] <cmaloney> Combining a Holy-Ghost Revival with Football fever is pretty much my definition of Hell.
[16:43] <jrwren> Harbough?
[16:43] <cmaloney> I think so
[16:45] <jrwren> Grandma says that xtian holy-ghost revival is what made america great. Eric Metaxas, If You Can Keep It, fuels the revisionist history of the church.
[16:53] <waldo323> is the super bowl in 1 week or 2?
[16:53] <rick_h> feb 4
[16:54] <waldo323> thanks
[16:54] <cmaloney> Have they decided the participants?
[16:55] <rick_h> Philly Eagles and NE Patriots
[16:56] <waldo323> OT: I finally got the video of Kattni's CircuitPython talk up on youtube. If you're interested:  https://youtu.be/307Ia_mv8AA
[16:57] <waldo323> this was my first time using OBS and found there is a bunch to learn
[16:57] <cmaloney> waldo323: ++
[16:57] <cmaloney> rick_h: Ah, I'd read that the Patriots were headed there
[16:57] <cmaloney> Outside of knowing that it's LII (which is kind of hilarious) I know little about what's going on