[11:45] <nico8481> i can't get apt-get to install mplayer-586... says it is broken or something... is it normal?
[11:45] <nickrud> Stew2, afroman it's /etc/X11/xorg.conf
[11:45] <Stew2> afroman Ubuntu is playing it safe by only allowing 640x480.... it was frustrating for me.
[11:45] <Jorkar> Are you sure nalioth ? This adress doesn't exist apparently
[11:45] <nalioth> nickrud: sorry? i'm just watchin the data flow by
[11:45] <xolotl_> afroman, go to /etc/X11/xorg.conf and look for Section "Screen"
[11:45] <gm78> Hey everyone. I am getting a buzzing sound coming out of my speakers with Hoary. I don't have this with CentOS and never did with Warty
[11:45] <afroman> and then..??
[11:45] <kuntu> i hate the irc god like admins
[11:45] <loply> hey folks how are you meant to change the screen res in X thesedays? Ive added 1280x1024 to xorg.conf and restarted, but it wont go into it still
[11:45] <nalioth> kuntu: can you make your horns bigger?
[11:45] <kimo> psychonate: how do u add this, the way I know is generating X mode lines, which is freaking complex
[11:45] <munki> nico8481 , get the source ? -it's not on apt-get anymore .
[11:45] <loply> either by ctrl+plus on the numpad or by the config GUI program thing
[11:45] <nickrud> nalioth, a pointer to a good repository
[11:46] <kuntu> nalioth, no but you can kiss my ass
[11:46] <nalioth> Jorkar: let me see
[11:46] <chaps0063> is there a script I can run to change the brightness on my laptop's lcd?
[11:46] <psychonate> kimo, Monitor section in your xorg.conf
[11:46] <afroman> xolotl: wot do I do then???
[11:46] <nalioth> hmmmm hmmmmm hmmmmmm
[11:46] <Howitzer> i'm having problems with RTCW:ET
[11:46] <psychonate> kimo, change the HorizSync and VertRefresh ranges to the ones recommended by the manufacturer.
[11:46] <pepsi> woooo... only 2 packages held back now :) stupid mozilla-firefox fails when i try to remove it
[11:46] <psychonate> kimo, you can usually find the ranges in your user's manual or on a monitor database.
[11:46] <gm78> I think the buzzing sound might have something to do with esd but im not sure. i switched over to alsa and it seems to be a bit better (as well as actually playing sound) but the esd process keeps opening
[11:46] <psychonate> That is what I do anyway.
[11:47] <nickrud> afroman, it that file I mentioned, you need to set the section in http://pastebin.com/299120 for your monitor
[11:47] <xolotl_> afroman, look under the sections that say: mode "1024x760" ...  and add in the resolutions of your monitor in the format "<horiz>x<vert>" "<horiz>x<vert>"
[11:47] <kimo> psychonate: lol! yeah that's easy. Is this somehow new :)
[11:47] <psychonate> Works well for me.
[11:47] <nico8481> can't xine or totem use external subtitles? it doesn't seem to work :( "xine file.avi subfile.sub" just plays the movie without any subtitle
[11:47] <nalioth> nickrud: musta missed that
[11:47] <psychonate> kimo, is it new?
[11:47] <psychonate> kimo, not that I know of.
[11:47] <nickrud> nalioth, no, you just kick out so much good info, you miss the thanks now and then :)
[11:48] <xolotl_> afroman, careful not to type out full nicks unless you get them right - use tab - otherwise irc clients won't highlight your responces / questions properly
[11:48] <nalioth> nickrud: what is the URL for packages.ubuntu* blah?
[11:48] <nickrud> lol, add a .com
[11:48] <psychonate> it's really not that hard though. I usually just google "<monitor model> specs" and get the ranges"; then put them in the xorg.conf
[11:48] <psychonate> not hard
[11:48] <kimo> psychonate: well thnx. Which one H or V, is what we usually call "refresh rate"
[11:48] <nalioth> shi***
[11:48] <Howitzer> argh
[11:48] <nalioth> Jorkar: packages.ubuntu.com
[11:49] <pepsi> vertical
[11:49] <nickrud> heh, I spent some time today on a dead path, because I looked in the wrong part of that page
[11:49] <Howitzer> i can't install the latest version of FF
[11:49] <psychonate> yeah, horizontal sync and vertical refresh
[11:49] <nalioth> Jorkar: sorry, thought everything ubuntu was org
[11:49] <psychonate> the latter causes the "flicker"
[11:49] <nickrud> Howitzer, you don't need a ff other than what's in the repositories
[11:49] <confrey> anybody knowing something about 3d support for a sis M760?
[11:49] <kuntu> why dosent any one ansers security question on this damned irc network ?
[11:49] <Jorkar> nalioth: thank you very good
[11:49] <Howitzer> it says: Fatal Errir [-618] : Couldn't open xpistub library
[11:50] <Howitzer> FF=Firefox? :/
[11:50] <nickrud> nalioth, ubuntulinux is org, ubuntu is com
[11:50] <kuntu> how do i detup a difrent mac adress at every bot ?
[11:50] <Howitzer> and RTCW:ET also gives me an error
[11:50] <nickrud> Howitzer, yes, the 1.0.2 in the repositories will have all the needed stuff from 1.0.4
[11:50] <kuntu> how do i setup a difrent mac adress at every bot ?
[11:50] <afroman> nickrud, wot is that website U gave me
[11:51] <nomasteryoda> bot/boot
[11:51] <nomasteryoda> ?
[11:51] <xolotl_> afroman, you may have to restart X in order to get it to recognize your new settings.  also - have you tried using the quick keys to get to a usable screen size?
[11:51] <gm78> Does anyone know how to get esd to quit loading all the time since i use alsa
[11:51] <gm78> ?
[11:51] <Myrtti> lag
[11:51] <nickrud> http://pastebin.com/299120 that section in /etc/X11/xorg.conf needs to be set to the values for your monitor
[11:51] <Howitzer> nickrud, i want to download some themes and extensions but the FF site doesn't allow it because i have an outdated version
[11:51] <kuntu> how do i setup a difrent mac adress at every bot ?
[11:51] <kuntu> how do i setup a difrent mac adress at every bot ?
[11:51] <kuntu> how do i setup a difrent mac adress at every bot ?
[11:51] <xolotl_> afroman, <ctrl><alt><shift> <keypad +> OR <keypad ->
[11:51] <kuntu> how do i setup a difrent mac adress at every bot ?
[11:51] <kuntu> how do i setup a difrent mac adress at every bot ?
[11:51] <kuntu> how do i setup a difrent mac adress at every boot ?
[11:51] <Howitzer> kick kuntu  :x
[11:51] <kuntu> how do i setup a difrent mac adress at every boot ?
[11:51] <Stew2> kuntu you suck
[11:51] <psychonate> kuntu, wtf is your problem
[11:51] <psychonate> die
[11:51] <nickrud> Howitzer, in about:config, search for vendorsub, and change it to 1.0.4
[11:51] <Stew2> kuntu You are sucking more..
[11:52] <xolotl_> kuntu, dude - bad idea
[11:52] <kuntu> yes so do you
[11:52] <kimo> kuntu: u cant
[11:52] <nickrud> that'll fool ff.
[11:52] <Stew2> kuntu more and more as time goes on.... the drain on the channel is palpable.
[11:52] <CarlFK> lspci shows: "Broadcom Corporation BCM4306 802.11b/g Wireless LAN Controller" - setup didn't detect it, network pref dialog doesn't see it.  anyone have any ideeas?
[11:52] <kuntu> of course i can
[11:52] <Howitzer> nickrud, could you explain me that a bit more detailed? :x
[11:52] <xolotl_> kuntu, you'll get better results if you simply be patient and change your question up
[11:52] <afroman> xolotl_, the thing is that I don\t know what rate to use
[11:52] <nickrud> Howitzer, np
[11:52] <kuntu> i can change the mac adress every boot
[11:52] <nalioth> Howitzer: in your address bar of FF, put "about:config"  search the page for "vendorsub" and chenge the number to 1.0.4
[11:53] <nickrud> in the location bar in firefox, type about:config
[11:53] <kuntu> your just holding bat the information
[11:53] <kuntu> back
[11:53] <Howitzer> omg
[11:53] <Howitzer> cool
[11:53] <Howitzer> :x
[11:53] <nalioth> i'm missing all the kuntu fun, alas, i /ignored him
[11:53] <xolotl_> kuntu, sounds like you're up to something shifty - why the heck would you want to be changing the mac every boot
[11:53] <nickrud> then, in the filter line, type vendorsub
[11:53] <Howitzer> are there any other pages like that nickrud / nalioth ?
[11:53] <pepsi> where are breezy bug reports filed at?
[11:53] <nickrud> about:plugins is the best one
[11:53] <kuntu> for privacy
[11:53] <gm78> ok, im gonna try rewording this :P The Enlightenment Sound Daemon loads every time I log in, how do I make it not load?
[11:54] <kuntu> security
[11:54] <nalioth> Howitzer: you can break your FF at that page
[11:54] <nalioth> Howitzer: or you can pimp it up
[11:54] <Howitzer> oh
[11:54] <Howitzer> lol
[11:54] <nalioth> Howitzer: tread lightly
[11:54] <kimo> kuntu: it's built into hardware. U cant change it
[11:54] <Howitzer> pimpin' :D
[11:54] <afroman> xolotl_, the thing is that I don\t know what rate to use
[11:54] <kuntu> the least the hacker know about me the better
[11:54] <CarlFK> pepsi - https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/
[11:54] <Howitzer> lol
[11:54] <confrey> anybody knowing something about 3d support for a sis M760?
[11:54] <xolotl_> kuntu,  get a router
[11:54] <arkainium> Is there an ubuntu package for devkitPro (arm/ppc cross-compiler)
[11:54] <pepsi> CarlFK, thanks
[11:54] <kuntu> you can change the way software reads it
[11:55] <kuntu> you can mask it or something
[11:55] <xolotl_> kimo, not exactly built into the hardware, but close enough
[11:55] <Howitzer> please make it work \ o /
[11:55] <jadam> ok
[11:55] <Howitzer> wooooooooo
[11:55] <Howitzer> it does work!
[11:55] <Howitzer> you two are my heroes
[11:55] <xolotl_> afroman, that's a matter for research then - gotta find out what monitor you have and what it's specs are
[11:55] <kuntu> isnt linux able to route ?
[11:55] <Howitzer> now i can FINALLY do my tabbrowsing  o /
[11:56] <hendrik> sorry folks, where am i?
[11:56] <kimo> xolotl_: it's not in hardware !! in firmware then ?
[11:56] <xolotl_> afroman, or you could run xorgconfig
[11:56] <robert__> xolotl_: ok, dhcp client definitely crashes and gives the msg "No working leases in persistant database."
[11:56] <robert__> er, dhclient
[11:56] <afroman> all right
[11:56] <robert__> This is after running ifup eth0 and then running dhclient
[11:56] <pepsi> kuntu, ifconfig <interface> hw ether <mac>
[11:57] <xolotl_> robert__, whoever is giving out your dhcp addies has no more dhcp addies left...
[11:57] <nickrud> afroman, you need to look it up in your monitor handbook, or find it on the net
[11:57] <xolotl_> robert__, or at least, that's what they're telling you
[11:57] <flodine> can someone piont me to s link to help me with my resolution 1900x1200
[11:57] <flodine> please
[11:57] <Howitzer> now i know why FF is the best again! Extensions rule you all!!!!
[11:57] <nickrud> afroman, if ubuntu did not set it up right at install, it won't when you run dpkg-reconfigure xserver.org
[11:57] <kimo> flodine: open /etc/X11/xorg.conf
[11:57] <robert__> xolotl_: eh, I dont think so... Comcast uses DHCP and I'm running the DHCP client here fine
[11:57] <xolotl_> rob_lt, that sitll doesn't make any sense if you traded hdds and it still wouldn't pick up an addy
[11:57] <Stew2> I'm using xchat for winblows, how come '/ignore kuntu all' doesn't work?
[11:57] <robert__> I have no router
[11:58] <flodine> kimo
[11:58] <zerokills> hey, if i type in pkill esd. how do i turn it back on?
[11:58] <flodine> ok
[11:58] <afroman> xolotl_, can U help me find my monitor resolution, I have a compaq presario v510
[11:58] <nickrud> afroman, if ubuntu did not set it up right at install, it won't when you run dpkg-reconfigure xserver-org
[11:58] <robert__> root      5683  0.0  0.1   2140   976 ?        S<s  15:54   0:00 dhclient3 -pf /var/run/dhclient.eth0.pid -lf /var/run/dhclient.eth0.leases eth0
[11:58] <robert__> This is running the install that works fine...
[11:59] <flodine> kimo what do i do
[11:59] <kimo> change the resolution
[11:59] <xolotl_> afroman, did you try xorgconfig and look for your monitor in there?
[11:59] <robert__> then when I run ps aux|grep dhclient on the install that doesn't work, doesn't bring up dhclient at all, so I know it's crashing
[11:59] <afroman> I'm going to
[11:59] <xolotl_> afroman, hmm - the monitor - you need the model and make of the monitor
[11:59] <flodine> kimo i added 1900x1200 still wont see it
[11:59] <Miks> mm i already edited a file in "nano" but i dont know how to save the changes :(...how can i?
[12:00] <kuntu> how do i get  ifconfig eth0 hw ether <mac> to run every boot and to setup a random mac ?
[12:00] <kimo> flodine: u could launch xorgconfig
[12:00] <robert__> ctrl+x


[02:33] <Lyca> im trying to update xubuntu but it still says "waiting" after 20 minutes, what gives?
[07:04] <JoeR1> Hello folks, Gnome 2 still supported custom login themes correct?
[07:14] <covidiu> Hello. Does anyone have problems with Xorg after the latest updates? Mine climbs to about 30% CPU every 8 seconds or so, and the screen flashes twice. Then it goes back to normal. The computer freezes while this happens. I have a GeForce 9400 GT. :(
[08:13] <Sysi> covidiu: what driver are you using?
[08:13] <covidiu> nouveau
[08:13] <covidiu> But it's actually starting to look more like a hardware problem.
[08:14] <covidiu> I booted from an older USB drive and I have the same problem.
[10:17] <grifo74> hello it´s possible update bios in xubuntu , exist software?
[10:24] <Sysi> grifo74: depends about bios, everything else than acer should be updatable outside OS
[10:26] <grifo74> i have a acer
[10:26] <Sysi> too bad, only possible with windows then
[10:27] <grifo74> lool
[10:28] <grifo74> isn´t importantat, windows no.
[10:53] <paul_uk> hey all, i've got a set of usb headphones.  im having trouble getting ubuntu to use them as the default device.  how do i do that?
[11:00] <paul_uk> I've noticed I don't have Settings -> Settings Manager -> Sound <--
[11:00] <paul_uk> Or maybe it's been moved.  I'm looking at docs from 2008 and 2009 sigh
[11:10] <paul_uk> anyone?
[11:19] <paul_uk> sorted, had to install PulseAudio Device Chooser utility from Synaptic and choose the device.  except now controls on the headphones don't work :(
[20:00] <Arthur_D> when resuming my computer from hibernation, I get trouble with gaming performance. If I do a reboot, it works perfectly fine. Any clue on where to search for such bugs, or report a new one?
[20:00] <Sysi> what graphics card?
[20:01] <Arthur_D> NVIDIA Geforce 250 GTS
[20:01] <Arthur_D> I've tried several other distros, and all appear to have the same problem
[20:01] <Sysi> you propably have nvidia-driver and nouveau both loaded, there might is bug about this
[20:02] <Arthur_D> ok, so I should try uninstalling the nouveau driver?
[20:04] <Sysi> add 'options nouveau modeset=0' to /etc/modprobe.d/something.conf
[20:04] <Sysi> for a start, reboot and see if that still happens
[20:04] <Arthur_D> thanks a lot, will try that :)
[20:19] <Arthur_D> Sysi, it seems to have helped somewhat, but still, framerates can drop from 60 to 10 in an instant, for a few seconds
[20:20] <Sysi> what xubuntu version?
[20:20] <Arthur_D> 11.04
[20:21] <Arthur_D> should I turn off compositing?
[20:21] <Sysi> you can try
[20:22] <Arthur_D> xubuntu doesn't use compiz, right?
[20:22] <charlie-tca> right, but it does have it xfwm compositing built in
[20:22] <Arthur_D> apparently, compositing is already turned off
[20:24] <Sysi> what if you relogin, not reboot?
[20:25] <Arthur_D> can try that. Will just do another test first
[20:35] <Arthur_D> still no luck
[20:36] <Arthur_D> logging out and in again didn't do anything
[20:41] <Arthur_D> could it be an ACPI issue?
[23:25] <slarty> hello
[23:27] <slarty> I have reinstalled xubuntu 10.10 and am having problems with locale settings (en_NZ) and keyboard keys sometimes require two presses to register a character. This may also be the reason I can seem to log on to either gmail or yahoo as the username/password aren accepted. Any suggestions, eg articles to assist here? tx
[23:52] <lukinfore> some launchpad triagers here? charlie-tca, are you still the one of?
[23:52] <lukinfore> can you tell me what's wrong in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/alsa-plugins/+bug/672837 ?
[23:53] <charlie-tca> looking
[23:53] <lukinfore> hello
[23:55] <charlie-tca> I am not good with audio bugs, but I think they want you to try it the way Luke suggested in comment #5 and tell them the results
[23:55] <lukinfore> well
[23:56] <lukinfore> i thought i've told enough to understand - that way is works
[23:57] <lukinfore> and have no meaning in using alsa-pulse plugin
[23:57] <charlie-tca> Then you have to be specific. Those guys are the top people on audio stuff, and if they can pin it down, they will.
[23:58] <lukinfore> uhm
[23:58] <lukinfore> what do you mean - specific?
[23:59] <charlie-tca> "tested it using pulseaudio ??? and it works/fails to work"
[23:59] <charlie-tca> "Can not test it that way because ???"


[13:53] <Delfino1983> hello people
[14:13] <Delfino1983> it's start o'clock?
[14:16] <TigerLuo> Hi
[15:02]  * skellat is ready and waiting for the first round of community roundtable this vUDS
[15:04] <dholbach> who wants to join the hangout?
[15:05] <skellat> o/
[15:05] <skellat><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[15:08] <dholbach> anyone else interested in joining in on the hangout?
[15:10] <dholbach> any more topics for the community roundtable?
[15:11] <rrnwexec> i can join too
[15:11] <rrnwexec> topic: Planet Ubuntu staleness
[15:12] <skellat> And my local broadband is deciding to fail on me so I'm out
[15:12]  * skellat trundles off to go deal with the networking and other plumbing & disengages from vUDS
[15:14] <rrnwexec> not seeing a link in G+
[15:14] <dholbach> rrnwexec, sent you the link in pm
[15:15] <dholbach> or PM me your email address and I'll invite you
[15:15] <ballock> I am interested to hear why Mark referred to Fedora and Tizen as 'being competition' and 'spreading FUD'.
[15:16] <dholbach> link to the bugs: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-community-website
[15:24] <Ampelbein> That sounds like you are participating from on board the ISS ;-)
[15:24] <dholbach> haha
[15:24]  * dholbach hugs Ampelbein
[15:25]  * Ampelbein hugs dholbach
[15:25] <dholbach> :)
[15:30] <linuxtech> Where are the slides, I wanted to see the detail on one of them?
[15:32] <ballock> ok, thanks
[15:34] <Ampelbein> When removing blogs I think the first question should be: Is the blog still relevant to Ubuntu? If yes, then keep it, despite the author is not a member.
[15:34] <rrnwexec> sorry guys, i'll try to type
[15:34] <rrnwexec> there are bloggers that have openly expressed their resignation
[15:35] <asomething> it would be pretty simple to parse http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~planet-ubuntu/config/main/view/head:/config.ini and check for ubuntu membership
[15:35] <rrnwexec> i would be happy to manually review the list, and/or ask people to re-opt-in to the Planet blogroll
[15:38] <dholbach> asomething, I can't remember what exactly the problem was, but I think there was something with Nick names or team blogs or some such
[15:38] <hggdh> beware of censorship, or looking like it.
[15:38] <dholbach> hggdh, +1
[15:41] <rrnwexec> this isn't censorship
[15:44] <rrnwexec> i have some notes on the etherpad on how we might make the decision
[15:48] <rickspencer3> tbh, I only get bummed out when people post negative stuff
[15:50] <hggdh> rickspencer3: but being negative, I think, is also important. It gives us a chance to think and review
[15:50] <hggdh> (I do not like it either, but I respect their opinion)
[15:50] <rickspencer3> hggdh, oh, if it's from an active community member, then I care what they think, negative or not
[15:51] <hggdh> rickspencer3: ack, and agreed :-)
[15:51] <rickspencer3> but if it's someone who has left the community, I don't really want to be exposed to their negativity
[15:51] <rickspencer3> if they aren't active and also not negative, their presence doesn't much bother me
[15:51] <cielak> I remember one particular post I read some longer time ago - don't remember whose it was - which was a very clear offensive FUD from someone who switched projects a long time ago
[15:52] <hggdh> if someone has left the community, then s/he should not be in Planet. The question, then, goes back to what is "left the community"
[15:52] <dholbach> asomething, yes, the problem is that "nick" is not necessarily Launchpad ID
[15:52] <hggdh> I guess I am a member of Planet, but I have never blogged (there or elsewhere)
[15:52] <linuxtech> Not all of us blog on a regular basis.
[15:53] <dholbach> asomething, but yeah, we could probably get a bit closer by using "name" and checking in the list of people in ~ubuntumembers
[15:53] <asomething> dholbach, i see but if nothing else it would give a shot list to look over
[15:53] <dholbach> yes, that's right
[15:54] <dholbach> asomething, let's have a chat about it later on
[15:54] <beuno> hggdh, it is very clearly defined that people who are no longer in the ubuntu members LP team, should not be on planet
[15:55] <beuno> there's just now automated cleanup process
[15:55] <beuno> it's manual, someone just does it whenever it itches
[15:57] <jono> ballock, hey
[15:57] <jono> ballock, you are running the enterprise roundtable?
[15:58] <ballock> jono: I can't run it with Google+ if that's what you mean, can only join.
[15:58] <ballock> but yeah, I'm there
[15:58] <jono> ballock, can you join the hangout session though?
[15:59] <jono> I am asking who is going to be on the hangout?
[15:59] <ballock> Hope so :)
[15:59] <ballock> there's Ove from my organization
[15:59] <jono> ballock, can you create a hangout on air session and I will add it to summit?
[15:59] <ballock> nope
[15:59] <jono> why?
[16:00] <ballock> my G+ account has no access to creating Google on air hangouts
[16:00] <ballock> some privacy stuff
[16:00] <jono> ballock, eh? all G+ accounts can create Google On Air hangouts
[16:00] <jono> go to https://plus.google.com/u/0/hangouts
[16:00] <jono> and click the Start a Hangout On Air button
[16:00] <ballock> not the corporate ones
[16:00] <jono> ok, but you can join a hangout?
[16:00] <ballock> those can be decided by the corporation
[16:01] <ballock> yup
[16:01] <jono> ok
[16:01] <jono> I will set it up in a few mins
[16:01] <jono> weird, we have a corporate G+ acct at Canonical and we can run hangouts on air
[16:01] <jono> ahhh so you mean corporate policy can turn them off
[16:01] <workingwriter> BTW, as a new person, I don't see how to become a member on the front page of community.ubuntu.com.
[16:01] <ballock> now you got it
[16:01] <jono> ballock, ahhh gotcha :-)
[16:02] <jono> ballock, join https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/edfad062d74d819880c39bfb05cf2aa674ea3420?authuser=0&hl=en
[16:03] <dholbach> jono, ballock: JFYI you're in community 2
[16:03] <jono> dholbach, yup
[16:03] <jono> moving there
[16:08] <CheeseBurg> Where is the etherpad?
[16:08] <rsalveti> http://pad.ubuntu.com/uds-1308-community-1308-app-story-hardware-requirements
[16:21] <dholbach> any more input from folks in here?
[16:25] <CheeseBurg> What if the user has multiple touch screens. Like a laptop where the keyboard is a touchscreen.
[16:25] <dholbach> fugue88, do you want to join in on the hangout - you seem to type a lot?
[16:26] <fugue88> dholbach: nah.
[16:26] <dholbach> fugue88, gotcha - I didn't even know you used this nick here :)
[16:27] <fugue88> :)
[16:28] <CheeseBurg> Ok a more realistic question, what about walcom tablet. Some of them have more features than a mouse so is that a special case?
[16:30] <fugue88> CheeseBurg: What extra features does a wacom tablet have that a mouse or touchscreen doesn't?
[16:32] <rickspencer3> the goal is to filter the list of apps to those which the user has the capabilties to run, right?
[16:32] <rickspencer3> I think that wacom tablet gets a bit fine grained
[16:32] <rickspencer3> like, you would never see the app if you didn't have the tablet plugged in
[16:33] <rickspencer3> I think at the highest level is phone vs. tablet vs. desktop
[16:33] <cjwatson> wacom is probably on the edge; I can imagine pro graphics tools that you really can't make use of without a proper tablet
[16:33] <rickspencer3> cjwatson, right, but you might not have it plugged in
[16:33] <cjwatson> I don't think it's a huge deal to get it exactly right up front as long as the schema is extensible
[16:33] <rickspencer3> when you are browsing apps
[16:33] <cjwatson> rickspencer3: Yep, dholbach raised the matter of removable devices earlier
[16:33] <rickspencer3> I think that you need know that the user is on a desktop, so *could* make use of a wacom tablet app
[16:34] <dholbach> would anyone like to join the hangout? :)
[16:34] <cjwatson> I said I'll need to look into the PackageKit API to see if there's a way that I can interpose a "you seem to be missing <hardware> - are you sure?" question, perhaps
[16:34] <fugue88> dholbach: What happens if we include an item in the schema, and later decide to remove it?
[16:34] <dholbach> maybe it'd be good not to list "needs: <some device>" but more something like "needs: <functionality>" (like 'pointing device' or 'drawing pad' or some such)
[16:34] <rickspencer3> o/
[16:34] <rickspencer3> I'd be happy to join
[16:35] <fugue88> fugue88: Okay, I'll join for a minute.
[16:35] <CheeseBurg> fugue88: The pen can have 3 to 6 button that do special command on applications like Photoshop. And the base has 3 - 7 with some fancy thingys. I don't use one but my artist friends do.
[16:35] <CheeseBurg> Also when I say walcom I mean any drawing tablets
[16:35] <cjwatson> Right, I think we should avoid being brand-specific if we can
[16:36] <CheeseBurg> Also what about TV apps?
[16:37] <dholbach> CheeseBurg, want to join in on the hangout too?
[16:37] <CheeseBurg> I wish lol. Unfortunately I am at work so I can't.
[16:37] <dholbach> (totally fine if you don't want to - just asking :-))
[16:37] <dholbach> ok, no worries
[16:37] <dholbach> :)
[16:39] <CheeseBurg> Most laptops have both touchscreens and gps now
[16:39] <CheeseBurg> Windows 8 laptops
[16:40] <ralsina_> screen size is not all that good to tell form factors apart. I have a phone and a notebook with the exact same screen size in pixels. Are we talking about screen sizes in cm/inches?
[16:42] <dholbach> ralsina_, want to join in on the call as well? :)
[16:42] <ralsina_> dholbach:my mic is in the fritz today :-(
[16:43] <dholbach> gotcha
[16:43] <ralsina_> dholbach:I am getting a new one later
[16:43] <dholbach> cool
[16:43] <ralsina_> Also, keyboards can be attached or detached at any point, they are not a device property
[16:47] <ralsina_> some developers may want to make the tablet version pay and the phone version free (I've seen it in android and iOS), so a maximum screen size may make sense
[16:58] <ralsina_> yay!
[17:01] <fugue88> o/
[17:01] <ralsina_> Ironic? ME???
[17:01] <fugue88> :D
[17:18] <istimsak> Why doesn't xubuntu have a Mac version
[17:20] <istimsak> Are there any online ubuntu locos? For those who don't have the luxury to travel.
[18:08] <jdstrand> dholbach: I think you have your youtube window up along with your google+-- massive looping
[18:08] <jdstrand> well, I don't know who does
[18:09] <jdstrand> oh, haha
[18:09] <jdstrand> it was me. durr
[18:09]  * dholbach hugs jdstrand
[18:09] <jdstrand> dholbach: sorry! :)
[18:09] <dholbach> jdstrand, want to join in?
[18:10] <lool> I think we at least need to be able to upload the app
[18:10] <lool> like, in case it's horribly broken or has security issues or something
[18:10] <lool> if it has any issue, it's part of an ubuntu image so we need to be able to fix it
[18:11] <lool> so we need some shared ownership for preinstalled apps
[18:11] <dholbach> can you all please help taking notes? http://pad.ubuntu.com/uds-1308-community-1308-policy-of-default-click-packages
[18:12] <asomething> if they'll be installed by default, it seems like there should be some kind of MIR-like check
[18:12] <rickspencer3> o/
[18:12] <lool> dholbach: if there's space left, happy to join a bit
[18:13] <ogra_> click on desktop will fall under the same restrictions
[18:13] <dholbach> jdstrand, I think you mic was a bit low
[18:13] <dholbach> mic volume
[18:13] <dholbach> but you only spoke very briefly, so I might be wrong :)
[18:14] <jdstrand> thanks. I don't know why it does that sometimes
[18:14] <jdstrand> (it was)
[18:14] <rsalveti> let me jump to the accessibility session for a while
[18:14] <rickspencer3> dholbach, can I join briefly? I think I can represent slangasek's concerns a bit until he gets here
[18:14] <rsalveti> we got enough people in here :-)
[18:14] <dholbach> rickspencer3, sure
[18:15] <ogra_> pitti, sw center packages dont need to be free sw
[18:16] <pitti> ogra_: right, but I thought this session is about the (small) subset which are installed by default?
[18:16] <ogra_> ah, right, indeed
[18:16] <lool> jdstrand: toolbox banner for your name?
[18:16] <pitti> but even if they aren't free, they still need to have a proper license and QA
[18:17] <ogra_> for the default image definitely
[18:26] <lool> I dont hear cjwatson
[18:26] <ogra_> i do
[18:26] <lool> for some strange reason I guess
[18:26] <ogra_> i dont see him
[18:26] <lool> out of all the streams, it's the onlyone I dont hear; weird
[18:26] <ogra_> well, i see him, but he is blue in the face and doesnt move at all
[18:27] <dholbach> ogra_, maybe he unplugged the webcam?
[18:27] <ogra_> ah, that turms people blue, right :)
[18:28] <dholbach> :)
[18:29] <pitti> ogra_: for the default image I'd require DFSGness really
[18:29] <ogra_> pitti, for the nexus image probably ...
[18:30] <ogra_> pitti, the majority of images we release will hopefully be for OEMs :)
[18:30] <pitti> ogra_: sure, but these aren't "ubuntu" images and thus not under our jurisdiction anyway
[18:30] <pitti> i. e. for those it's the OEM's job to ensure they have a license to ship their default apps
[18:31] <ogra_> i agree the freely installable nexus image needs to come in the same way a desktop iso comes
[18:31] <ogra_> but the policy we define here will affect OEM images as well
[18:31] <ogra_> and there might be something in the sw-center thats nonfree that they want to ship
[18:32] <xnox> slangasek: e.g. facebook is in Apple Store, yet it is still pre-installed as well.
[18:32] <slangasek> right
[18:32] <aquarius> Presumably if you decide to package my app in the default image (and I agree, and we have a good relationship) and then that relationship sours somehow, there is nothing stopping me publishing that app *again* in Ubuntu Software Centre under a different name?
[18:33] <beuno> aquarius, correct
[18:33] <aquarius> The "go back to the pre-installed version if you remove the updates" thing is how Android works with pre-installed apps, too -- if Facebook was pre-shipped on your phone, you can remove the updates to it but you can't remove *it*.
[18:33] <xnox> cjwatson: will that share data though, I'd be surprised to have to login again if this dual-app is facebook.
[18:34] <aquarius> This conversation seems to be about people who Ubuntu trust enough to have their stuff in the default image but have since decided that they're unhappy about that? (I mean, otherwise we'd just say "go ahead and publish updates to your pre-installed apps on your own schedule", which is (as far as I know) what other platforms do.)
[18:35] <aquarius> I love that Dropping Letters is the example of an uncooperative upstream. Thanks, dudes. ;-)
[18:37] <cjwatson> xnox: Yes
[18:38] <cjwatson> xnox: Data location is independent of app unpack location
[18:38] <cjwatson> aquarius: android> indeed, that's why I more or less assumed it would be an acceptable approach :)
[18:40] <cjwatson> aquarius: I don't think it's about having decided we or they are unhappy; but rather that we want to make sure that the testing (etc.) that goes into preinstalled apps pre-release also applies to updates
[18:41] <aquarius> cjwatson, but com.ubuntu.* is for stuff *written by* Ubuntu, not *blessed* by Ubuntu, right? I mean, will a default Facebook app (if one happens) be under com.ubuntu?
[18:41] <asomething> as for the social piece, is there any plans for including core app devs into ubuntu governance? obviously they qualify for membership, but is there anything like DMB for commit access to the core apps?
[18:42] <cjwatson> aquarius: Probably not.  I certainly don't think we should have a policy that goes "only stuff in com.ubuntu is eligible to be preinstalled"
[18:42] <cjwatson> So it's true that we don't have a namespacing in the app store that's exactly what pitti's getting at
[18:42] <cjwatson> To me that kind of thing seems more like a tag we might apply after the fact that would be searchable via solr
[18:43] <pitti> I'm less concerned about the mechanics of that, but I am concerned about having some way to mark apps as "meets ubuntu standards" (DFSG, QA) and only consider default apps from that pool
[18:44] <asomething> most of the current core apps also have "ubuntu" right in their names. so they certainly blessed by the project
[18:44] <ogra_> asomething, thats probably beyond the session topic, but surely a good question for #ubuntu-touch :)
[18:44] <pitti> I guess some kind of "ubuntu app archive" might be important for actually building the images (pulling from third-party servers might be tricky), but that's a technical implementation detail
[18:44] <slangasek> cjwatson: so in fact, I was seeing it the other way, that if com.ubuntu is the namespace for trusted apps, the way we get an app blessed for preinstallation is copying it into the com.ubuntu namespace
[18:44] <cjwatson> lool: wow.  you may not be able to hear me, but HOLY SHIT I can hear you
[18:44] <dholbach> lool, your mic volume is quite high
[18:45] <lool> sorry
[18:45] <dholbach> :-)
[18:45] <slangasek> haha
[18:45] <ogra_> lol
[18:45] <cjwatson> pitti: I think it needs to be a tag approach rather than a separate repository, really
[18:45] <pitti> sure
[18:46] <cjwatson> slangasek: I had certainly been envisaging the namespace as indicating origin rather than signed-off-by
[18:46] <slangasek> ok
[18:46] <beuno> yes, me too
[18:46] <slangasek> I don't feel strongly about this point
[18:46] <beuno> origin
[18:46] <pitti> I'd just like to have a reasonable interpretation of "official ubuntu images can only include stuff from ubuntu" for click
[18:46] <pitti> i. e. on the official ISOs we must not enable PPAs and similar
[18:46] <slangasek> I do think we need to preserve the upstream's capability of updating the app via a different "channel" than whatever is used for updates to the preinstalled app
[18:47] <pitti> likewise on touch images we mustn't include software which we haven't vetted
[18:47] <cjwatson> preinstallations currently happen via that hacky directory on people.c.c
[18:47] <ogra_> pitti, we try the same for touch ... but PPAs are so sticky nowadays
[18:47] <cjwatson> so we could just carry on doing something like that rather than preinstalling from the app store
[18:47] <cjwatson> and then it's basically a matter of copying known-good versions
[18:48] <cjwatson> although we don't update from there, so maybe that's no good
[18:48]  * slangasek nods
[18:48] <ogra_> well, as long as the updates then dont come with a different app with the same name ...
[18:48] <pitti> I do agree that they should be able to get updated just like any other click app
[18:49] <pitti> (cf. vetting the app and its upstream initially)
[18:50] <lool> cjwatson: +1
[18:52] <xnox> jono: we'll fork.
[18:54] <xnox> beuno: and more people upload updates.
[18:56] <xnox> beuno: we'd want to share the updates.
[18:57] <asac> i would prefer if upstream does the updates
[18:57] <asac> :)
[18:57] <xnox> asac: but i still want to be able to unbreak my phone as a core-dev.
[18:57] <asac> or at least allow them to care ontheir own if they want to
[18:57] <xnox> asac: yeah, not exclusive.
[18:59] <ogra_> xnox, pfft, who cares about you as a core-dev ... we are hopefully the smallest minority of ubuntu touch users soon :)
[18:59] <cjwatson> putting testing requirements in place isn't mutually exclusive with giving upstream control
[18:59] <xnox> ogra_: =)
[18:59] <cjwatson> we can give them control within a framework that requires quality
[19:00] <ogra_> we are currently already getting them to write tests ... we should just cultivate that habit more
[19:00] <asac> yeah true
[19:00] <ogra_> not necessarily through policy
[19:00] <slangasek> no, absolutely through policy :)
[19:00] <ogra_> but imho each app we have should at some point have its own tests
[19:00] <slangasek> maybe in other ways too, but it should be required by policy
[19:01] <ogra_> including the store apps from third parties
[19:01] <cjwatson> slangasek: agreed
[19:01] <lool> I kind of feel that if we say we'll review updates in a speedy manner, it's ok to gatekeep updates to preinstalled apps all the time and allow upstreams to
[19:01]  * xnox <3 community writting autopilot tests for ubiquity =))))
[19:01] <lool> easily push updates
[19:01] <lool> not as easily as to not preinstalled apps, but almost
[19:01] <cjwatson> lool: like I said, I don't know that the update gatekeeping has to be manual
[19:01] <cjwatson> depends on how much we decide we trust the testing rigour
[19:01] <lool> indeed
[19:02] <pitti> I think it's ok to just reserve the possibility to stop/block/fix them; not necessarily having to gatekeep each single update
[19:02] <jdstrand> there could be conditions that redflag for manual review but otherwise are automatic
[19:02] <cjwatson> something like that, yeah
[19:02] <ogra_> btw, do we have a rollback story for slipped through bad updates ?
[19:03] <jdstrand> well, we have a method to ship an empty package. we could just grab a known good package and rev the version
[19:03] <sergiusens> lool: ogra_ yes
[19:03] <ogra_> (beyond, grab the last click package from the author and upload it with a newer version)
[19:03] <sergiusens> ogra_: oh, then no
[19:03] <aquarius> cjwatson, surely Ubuntu would already have a pretty high confidence in the testing rigour of an app otherwise it wouldn't have qualified for the default image in the first place? :)
[19:03] <beuno> right,  what cjwatson said
[19:04] <beuno> we have a story to remove malicous apps
[19:04] <beuno> but not dowgrade
[19:04] <cjwatson> I don't think we have the same "versions must go forward" constraint for click packages
[19:04] <cjwatson> necessarily
[19:04] <sergiusens> ogra_: that was one of the topics discussed
[19:04] <cjwatson> I can't remember where that argument wound up :)
[19:04] <beuno> cjwatson, we've decided we do
[19:04] <rickspencer3> hi aquarius o/
[19:04] <cjwatson> beuno: ah, ok
[19:04] <beuno> to make it easier on the client
[19:04] <aquarius> heya rickspencer3 :)
[19:04] <cjwatson> (that was actually my preferred answer but I thought I'd been overruled)
[19:04] <cjwatson> aquarius: quite :)
[19:04] <jdstrand> cjwatson: oh interesting-- that is an assumption I had, but yes, we haven't defined what updates look like yet :)
[19:04] <rickspencer3> beuno, omg, does that mean it will be hard to revert click packages?
[19:05] <rickspencer3> please please please tell me it will be easy to revert
[19:05] <beuno> rickspencer3, you can uninstall an update easily
[19:05]  * lool coughs
[19:05] <beuno> this is more about the appstore pushing an older version and the client downgradng
[19:05] <ogra_> beuno, without uninstalling the app ?
[19:05] <beuno> ogra_, sure, the user can uninstall an upgrade easily
[19:05] <beuno> we keep arpound the folders for the previous versions
[19:05] <cjwatson> err
[19:05] <beuno> so it's just changing a symlink
[19:06] <beuno> unless things have changed?
[19:06]  * rickspencer3 braces
[19:06] <cjwatson> that's only because garbage-collection is unimplemented
[19:06] <aquarius> all previous versions are kept in perpetuity? I am surprised at that
[19:06] <rickspencer3> well, at least we could keep around the last version?
[19:06] <aquarius> aha, cjwatson is also surprised at it ;)
[19:06] <beuno> aquarius, not forever  :)
[19:06] <ogra_> aquarius, ++
[19:06] <beuno> we haven't done the work
[19:06] <cjwatson> we can't carry on keeping all old versions
[19:06] <ogra_> right
[19:06] <beuno> but garbage collection doesn't mean everything
[19:06] <rickspencer3> cjwatson, tell that to the kernel team
[19:06] <cjwatson> last version - maybe.  might depend on size since some apps are huge
[19:06] <beuno> we can keep the last one, we get to decide
[19:06]  * rickspencer3 ducks
[19:06] <beuno> right
[19:07] <ogra_> but will we keep the "last good" version around ?
[19:07] <ogra_> bah, beuno is to fast for me
[19:07] <aquarius> cjwatson, gotta sort of be prepared for that anyway with the multiuser case, though, no?
[19:07] <cjwatson> click has no idea what is good
[19:07] <jdstrand> well, last one is different then last known good
[19:07] <cjwatson> aquarius: multiuser's different
[19:07] <rickspencer3> my concern is that our inability to revert causes a lot of pain and slowness when things go badly
[19:07] <cjwatson> aquarius: in that case there are references for each user who has it installed
[19:07] <YokoZar> I believe you are in fact live jono
[19:07] <cjwatson> and we absolutely keep referenced versions
[19:07] <sethj> You're live
[19:07] <philipballew> Loud and clear Jono
[19:08] <cjwatson> anyway, yeah, we're being kicked out
[19:08] <beuno> rickspencer3, you mean like you get an update and it sucks, and you as a user want to go back to the previous version?
[19:08]  * ogra_ guesses we should move to #ubuntu-touch
[19:08] <jono> community team feedback hangout: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/cce17ac5775c2cc2a27eb5dfb3e9f490155cf739?authuser=0&hl=en
[19:08] <rickspencer3> beuno, like we have a buggy update in the development release
[19:08] <jdstrand> rickspencer3: well, even if it is as bad as picking an old one and revving the version, it is still loads better than anything we have with deb because there aren't inter-app dependencies
[19:08] <rickspencer3> the dashboard turns red
[19:08] <rickspencer3> we can't just revert the package
[19:08] <jdstrand> but it would be nice to not have to do that
[19:08] <beuno> rickspencer3, you version forward
[19:09] <rickspencer3> I'm not sure what we care about in terms of applications already  on the device
[19:09] <beuno> right
[19:09] <cjwatson> what jdstrand said.  the reason you can't necessarily do that with .deb is that there might be things like automatic shlibdeps around
[19:09] <rickspencer3> right
[19:09]  * beuno moves to #ubuntu-touch
[19:10] <dholbach> any feedback on how the Canonical Community Team works?
[19:13] <rickspencer3> g+ and reddit both have tons of "community" content, but it tends to be outside the realm of the CoC
[19:17] <rrnwexec> perhaps the task of communicating with Ubuntu "consumers" ought to be delegated more to local groups
[19:17] <rrnwexec> (sorry i'm late)
[19:17] <asomething> not sure if I have any bright ideas for it, but one thing that might be worth thinking about is how to bring together people working on disparate aspects of ubuntu
[19:18] <asomething> most contributing packaging work for instance probably don't interact with touch core app devs
[19:18] <asomething> and touch core app devs might not know anyone working on say mir
[19:19] <rickspencer3> "unrelenting"?
[19:19] <rickspencer3> lol
[19:24] <rickspencer3> YokoZar o/
[19:24] <YokoZar> High five?
[19:24] <rickspencer3> do you think it makes a difference that Canonical has so many developers working on Ubuntu now?
[19:25] <jcastro> hi!
[19:25] <jcastro> can I join the hangout?
[19:25] <YokoZar> rickspencer3: I do think there's some selection effect where a good chunk of the people who were super into ubuntu core bits in the beginning are now Canonical employees ;)
[19:26] <rickspencer3> fair enough
[19:26] <rickspencer3> but I remember when I started at Canonical, the team of paid developers was much much smaller
[19:26] <rickspencer3> I can't help wonder how that impacts the community interactions
[19:26] <YokoZar> For sure.  My feeling is that Canonical has spread a bit more widely, doing lots of things with the extra staff rather than putting more staff on the same things
[19:27] <jcastro> dholbach: can I join the discussion in the G+?
[19:27] <YokoZar> So the perception is more "Canonical is doing more things" than "there's all these more canonical people on this one thing"
[19:27] <dholbach> jcastro, sure
[19:31] <hggdh> communications, communications, communications (following rrnwexec's comment)
[19:33] <linuxtech> I would like to see someone take the lead on making sure we have latest stable releases of some server software.  https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-server/2013-August/006703.html
[19:33] <linuxtech> Robie Basak agreed with me!
[19:53] <asomething> i though that was gotten rid of last uds?
[19:58] <dholbach> philipballew, and call it community-1308-<something>
[19:58] <philipballew> will do dholbach
[19:58] <dholbach> rock on


[00:39] <wgrant> cjwatson: db=me
[00:39] <wgrant> er no, actually
[00:48] <cjwatson> Hm yes, I suppose it does
[00:50] <cjwatson> I wonder if we could contrive explicit tests for common kinds of FKs that need indexes
[00:50] <wgrant> cjwatson: Mostly for deletions, I mean, rather than anything relating to the new feature
[00:50] <cjwatson> Yeah
[00:50] <wgrant> And yes, a linter here would be good
[00:50] <cjwatson> Could just be in the test suite rather than linting the SQL as such - less convenient, but probably much easier to write, and would still run before stuff gets as far as an FDT
[00:52] <wgrant> Oh yeah, that's what I mean, sorry
[00:52] <wgrant> We already have a lot of the tools required
[00:52] <wgrant> Used by person merge and librarian GC
[00:53] <cjwatson> Right
[00:54] <cjwatson> Anyway, index pushed
[21:46] <pappacena> For the folks working on OCI, I've added the screenshot of proposed UI for OCI recipe list on the doc (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1hwFnrmEKfg7rimkjj2TC9J5i5gdzUPMZJTUUTFGmlR4/edit#heading=h.bgo6hibhf4m). Let me know if it looks ok that way, so I can implement tests, preloads and performance checks...


[02:47] <Viper550> hello everyone!
[02:58] <Viper550> troy_s? you there?
[03:31] <Viper550> hello? anyone here? ryanakca? klepas? troy_s?
[03:43] <troy_s> what Viper550 ?
[03:43] <Viper550> Work on gNewSense has begun in the Ponder phase
[03:43] <Viper550> We just decided on our GTK theme engine, we will be using Murrine.
[03:46] <Viper550> oh yeah troy_s: I already begun work on the GTK theme... http://bay01.imagebay.com/full_view.php?view=8803_gnewsense1.png
[03:49] <ryanakca> hmm?
[03:50] <Viper550> ryanacka: is the hmm about the rounded buttons?
[03:50] <ryanakca> I dunno
[03:50] <ryanakca> You pinged me
[03:50] <ryanakca> lemme see
[03:50] <ryanakca> looks good
[03:51] <ryanakca> that what ubuntu feisty will look like?
[03:51] <ryanakca> well, what it might look like?
[03:51] <Viper550> ryanacka: this is not Feisty, this is an entirely different distribution, although it is based off Ubuntu though
[03:52] <ryanakca> ah
[03:52] <Viper550> if you wanna join us, #gnewsense
[03:52] <ryanakca> looks good
[03:52] <ryanakca> kk
[03:54] <Viper550> Oh yeah, I recall asking the Murrine developer about rounded buttons one day...but now they are finally here!
[03:55] <ryanakca> yeah
[03:55] <ryanakca> bbl
[04:22] <Viper550> Here are the ideas we have so dar: http://wiki.gnewsense.org/ArtworkPlan/Ponder
[02:20] <PingunZ> !seen fschoep
[02:40] <effraie> \o/ all
[02:40] <effraie> does we have an idea when goals for feisty artwork will be known ?
[02:43] <kwwii_> for kubuntu, yes
[02:44] <kwwii_> anyway...time for sleep
[02:44] <kwwii_> bbl
[02:56] <Viper550> I made an installable package for the Gnome 2.16 icons
[03:35] <effraie> Viper550: where is it?
[03:35] <Viper550> what? theme or gnome 2.16 icons?
[03:36] <Viper550> both are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Viper550
[05:29] <ryanakca> kwwii_:  know what icon set this is? http://www.kde-look.org/content/pre1/45095-1.jpg
[05:30] <ryanakca> Crystal something?
[06:57] <kwwii_> ryanakca: looks like crystal, with quite a few diffrent icons
[07:03] <ryanakca> kwwii_: I found it on kde-look...
[07:03] <ryanakca> NuovoX by the looks of it :)
[07:20] <kwwii_> yeah, that is a mix of several sets
[07:20] <kwwii_> not too big on it myself
[07:28] <ryanakca> no?
[07:30] <ryanakca> It would be better if they merged OS-K and NuovoX together though


[00:42] <Unit193> I'm sure it's pointless to say, but "Quick Links" also goes over on FF10 (New website, FAQ page)
[00:42]  * pleia2 has a look
[00:43] <Unit193> I'm slowly reading the backlog, but that was already talked about a little
[00:45] <knome> it's fixed in my local stylesheet
[00:59] <Unit193> Don't shoot me, but would it also help to have a "How does Xubuntu differ from Lubuntu?" (I've seen this a little, but I don't remember what channel :( )
[01:01] <knome> i don't think we need that if we specify what xubuntu is and how does it differ from ubuntu well enough
[01:01] <knome> we can quickly mention the other derivatives too, but imo, they should define themself how they differ from ubuntu
[01:02] <Unit193> Kk, I'll just read it silently now :)
[18:56] <Pjotr> Hello, I have a feature request for Xubuntu 12.04. It's in this bug report:
[18:56] <Pjotr> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfdesktop4/+bug/893718
[18:57] <Pjotr> I've filed it against xfdesktop4, but I'm not sure whether that's the right package.
[18:59] <Pjotr> What do you think?
[19:00] <mr_pouit> xubuntu-default-settings
[19:01] <Pjotr> mr_pouit: thanks, I'll change it. :-)
[19:01] <Pjotr> mr_pouit: and what do you think about the feature request itself?
[19:03] <mr_pouit> I never use the desktop, so I don't have any strong opinion (but with your settings, usb keys mounted  won't show)
[19:05] <Pjotr> that's correct, but that is no problem: Thunar opens automatically with the contents of the USB stick anyway. No need for a desktop icon...
[19:12] <Pjotr> I've added the USB stick issue to the bug description...
[20:08] <cody-somerville> knome, Hi. just wanted to let you know I got your e-mail the other day. I'll be sure to get around to it before I go on vacation this Thursday.
[22:19] <ochosi> knome: hm, now that canonical has decided to drop banshee in favor of rhythmbox again i think we probably shouldn't follow their example. it will just make us look as "flipping" as they are
[22:57] <micahg> ochosi: there's still a work item to reevaluate at the last alpha
[23:03] <ochosi> micahg: i know, i was just saying what i think. knome's the mighty PL anyway ;)
[23:04]  * micahg thinks we should do a proper evaluation and do what's best, IMHO flipping on something is changing a core value, not making an appropriate decision based on current facts
[23:07] <ochosi> i agree with you in general, i just think that a lts-release (yeah i know, for xubuntu you can discuss whether it really is lts, but still the core ubuntu packages stay maintained) is maybe not the ideal timing. but anyway, i'm looking forward to proper application evaluations again, we haven't had them since 2 years or so
[23:08] <micahg> well, all the more reason to do a proper evaluation and look at what the LTS user would want
[23:11] <ochosi> yeah, you're probably right.


[01:46] <cjohnston> Greetings, I installed the daily last night. When I get to the login screen, I click on my username, and then I just get a background and a mouse.. No toolbars, no enter password, nothing.. Any ideas?
[01:47] <cjohnston> If I ctrl alt f1, I get a terminal and can login through that.. I ran update and upgrade to no avail
[02:01] <cjohnston> I just found out that if I click on my username is when it goes blank, but I can select other, type in the same username, password, and then it will log me in
[03:11] <snadge> does someone know off hand if the xorg-edgers ppa version of libva/libva-dev is patched for xvba support?
[09:19] <antihero> Argh, any idea why my gdm says "failed to load session Ubuntu"?
[09:33] <jbicha> antihero: gdm or lightdm?
[09:36] <antihero> jbicha: gdm. Looking at .xession-errors it seems that glx isn't loaded. I've done nvidia-xconfig and now it fails to load X as apparently my nvidia module isn't loaded
[09:36] <antihero> modprobe nvidia fails to find the module
[09:37] <jbicha> yeah, there are problems with the Nvidia drivers
[09:37] <antihero> jbicha: In that they entirely don't work? I'm sure I did have it working at some point.
[09:37] <jbicha> I uninstalled xserver-xorg-video-nouveau and reinstalled nvidia-current to get my wife's computer working
[09:38] <jbicha> but that may not be the "right answer"
[09:38] <jbicha> antihero: yes, the nvidia drivers worked until fairly recently
[09:38] <antihero> Are ubuntu working towards using nouveau then?
[09:39] <antihero> I'll reboot
[09:40] <jbicha> bug 811701 maybe
[09:40] <jbicha> I think nouveau is loading itself too early even if blacklisted by the Nvidia drivers
[09:42] <antihero> jbicha: Aye, I remember a similar problem when a nvidia related module loaded early in order to provide a high res console, and preventend the actual nvidia module loading.
[09:42] <antihero> lol apparently I'm running out of battery (I'm on mains)
[09:43] <antihero> The new settings panel sucks, where is appearance settings etc?
[09:45] <jbicha> antihero: that's a GNOME 3 design decision
[09:45] <jbicha> you can change your background but for other stuff, you may want to install gnome-tweak-tool
[09:46] <antihero> jbicha: That's pretty unfair to all the countless theme creators :\
[11:39] <penguin42> hmm a new unity-panel-services crasher today
[13:08] <penguin42> yofel: How's KDE being for you in +1 ?
[13:09] <yofel> nice, but for you everything that somehow uses kate, or has an embedded texteditor should be broken at least
[13:10] <penguin42> hmm not sure I use any of those
[13:12]  * penguin42 only has this <--- machine on +1 at the moment which is Gnome, and am thinking doing that machine ----> which is mostly KDE
[13:12] <penguin42> unity-panel-services is quite unstable on Gnome at the moment
[14:15] <IdleOne> why is reqonk defaulting to Catalan when the rest of the system is in English?
[14:16] <Ampelbein> IdleOne: LANG=C reqonk ;-)
[14:17] <BluesKaj> Howdy
[14:37] <nperry> Does lightdm still use xsession files?
[14:38] <Ampelbein> nperry: it should
[14:39] <Ampelbein> nperry: bug 800192 was fixed
[15:11] <nperry> sudo service lightdm restart
[15:12] <nperry> any cleaner way to exit back to lightdm, I'm in xmonad atm.
[15:16] <penguin42> just quit your  session
[15:46] <jakubo> hi, is there a way to reset volume and input settings in pulse audio?
[15:49] <jakubo> or rather output
[15:55] <BluesKaj> jakubo, both input and out can be turned up full with,  alsamixer -V all
[15:56] <jakubo> and if alsamixer isnt working?
[15:56] <jakubo> pulseaudio seems to be autonomously
[15:56] <penguin42> jakubo: paman
[15:57] <BluesKaj> jakubo, if alsamixer isn't working then your pulseaudio won't either , pulseaudio get's it's signals from alsa afaik
[15:57] <jakubo> how does pulseaudio store its output settings?
[15:58] <jakubo> besides, its alsamixer thats not working not alsa itself
[15:58] <BluesKaj> jakubo, install pavucontrol , that will hold your settings, but alsamixer has to be working
[15:59] <BluesKaj> type alsmixer in the terminal , make sure there's no M in the boxes at the bottom of the ctrls
[16:00] <jakubo> i tried with pavucontrol
[16:00] <BluesKaj> pulse audio is just another layer soundserver , it needs alsa to work
[16:01] <penguin42> one more turtle on the pile
[16:02] <dupondje> What would be the best place to report a bug in Intel Wireless driver ?
[16:03] <jakubo> i asked for it before... ill recapulate
[16:03] <jakubo> sound is there put very quiet although all pulseaudio bars ar up to 120%, alsamixer saays there is no mixer device, it seems that my chip CM-6501 is seen as USB and maybe has some oss mixer which is obviously deprecated, at least the alsa site says so. sound has been working quite well until i changed the output to analog stereo and then back to analog speakers. any idea?
[16:04] <jakubo> i just want to get back to where it was, ... for now, i tried to purge pulseaudio and pulseaudio utils, nothing changed after reinstall
[16:05] <jakubo> and pulseaudio hangs sometimes, but thats a different story
[16:05] <BluesKaj> jakubo, install alsa-utils
[16:06] <jakubo> please DO read my posts
[16:06] <jakubo> im sry, my fault
[16:06] <jakubo> it is installed
[16:06] <BluesKaj> no need to purge , the utils gets taken out with pulseaudio
[16:07] <jakubo> but not the configurations obviously
[16:08] <BluesKaj> then, sudo apt-get install --reinstall alsa-base , them alsa-utils ...your audio driver conf files have stripped with the purge
[16:08] <BluesKaj> err  them=then
[16:09] <jakubo> treid that the last time aswell
[16:11] <jakubo> my driver conf files did "what"?
[16:13] <jakubo> usually pulse audio is treated as a card in alsamixer on its own isnt it?
[16:17] <babilen> Hi all. Would oneiric be the suite that new packages should be based on? Which mirror contains oneiric if that is the case?
[16:22] <bjsnider> jakubo, the userland config files are in hidden directories in your home directory, such as ~/.pulse
[16:23] <jakubo> ok thx
[16:23] <dupondje> Nobody around with a "Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6230" ?
[16:23] <bjsnider> the guest account doesn't use those files so you might try logging in as guest and testing sound
[16:23] <babilen> Is oneiric available on the mirrors?
[16:23] <bjsnider> if sound works as expected in the guest account it's a userland problem
[16:24] <jakubo> ok ill try
[16:26] <jakubo> is anyone else not able to logout properly?
[16:27] <bjsnider> does _anything_ work on that system
[16:27] <bjsnider> does the frigging mouse pointer still work
[16:27] <jakubo> actually yet, everything else
[16:28] <jakubo> i got the logout problem on my laptop too
[16:28] <jakubo> i guess thats something with light dm
[16:30] <jakubo> its rather quiet on the guest account too
[16:30] <bjsnider> well then it's probbaly an oeniric bug
[16:31] <bjsnider> unless it's bad hardware
[16:31] <bjsnider> but you can test that with an older livecd
[16:31] <bjsnider> oneiric _is_ alpha software at this point
[16:31] <jakubo> you think its bad hardware if i triggered itvis pulseaudio configs instantly?
[16:31] <bjsnider> you don't have any right to demand stability
[16:32] <jakubo> i didnt i just ask for advice how to set things back
[16:32] <bjsnider> well, the easiest way is to clean install natty
[16:32] <bjsnider> you can get that done in 15 minutes
[16:33] <jakubo> not if you are having a software raid set up
[16:33] <jakubo> but i would be too lazy even if i didnt
[16:33] <bjsnider> copy your home directory to an external backup source like a hdd
[16:34] <bjsnider> or you could report a bug and wait for a fix to be released
[16:35] <jakubo> there are bug reports on the net... there have been for years actually...
[16:38] <jakubo> at least for the alsa driver
[16:51] <BluesKaj> bjsnider, is there command to dircect dd to use mulitple cpu cores while copying to iso ..one core is at 20% and the other at 95% while copying and the reslts were fine on one disc but total pixellation on another
[16:53] <BluesKaj> correction on=from
[16:53] <penguin42> what was the dd command you used/
[16:54] <penguin42> they really shouldn't use much CPU
[17:04] <yofel> you want to increase the blocksize, uses more memory but less CPU
[17:09] <BluesKaj> I just used  bs=1024, means byte size I think
[17:09] <yofel> block size, 1024 would be 1KB, if you're copying an iso $((1024*1024)) == 1MB would be faster
[17:10] <yofel> default is 512 bytes which takes ages for that amount of data
[17:13] <bjsnider> would the seek/write cycle of the drive be the biggest choke point in dd?
[17:13] <bjsnider> i mean is the cpu time iowait?
[17:13] <BluesKaj> ok , so , M  =1024*1024
[17:13] <bjsnider> if your cpu is up at 90% is most of it iowait?
[17:14] <BluesKaj> one core is ar 95% , the other is only at 20% ..wouldn't sharing the load be more efficient
[17:15] <BluesKaj> iowait?
[17:15] <bjsnider> yeah, input/output wait
[17:16] <bjsnider> means the cpu is waiting for hardware to give it info it has requested
[17:24] <BluesKaj> yofel what's blocksize command ..I have the man page open but... count=BLOCKS , .what size ? ..speed isn't necessary just accuracy
[17:35] <penguin42> if it's showing a core at a % it's not normally iowait
[17:35]  * penguin42 would use bs= at least 2048 on an iso to a drive; CDs basic sectors are 2k (for data)
[17:36] <yofel> BluesKaj: no, bs= is blocksize, you don't need count= if you're dd-ing a fiel
[17:36] <yofel> *file
[17:39] <BluesKaj> ok, yofel thanks , looks like the disc is problematic ...not dd
[18:10] <BluesKaj> odd tho , when I play the disk , it works fine , but when I try to dd or cp , it's totally pixellated and unwatchable
[18:13] <BluesKaj> the first disc in this set dd 'd  fine to an iso , the 2nd plays ok , but seems uncopyable
[18:44] <BluesKaj> anyway k9copy worked , copied the 2nd disc to an iso without a hitch
[18:48] <bjsnider> you shouldn't need any extra software to copy a disc to an iso, just right-click and select copy disc
[18:51] <penguin42> BluesKaj: Is it just data or is it video/audio ?
[18:52] <BluesKaj> video/audio
[18:54] <penguin42> DVD?
[18:55] <BluesKaj> bjsnider, the playback on vlc was totally corrupt on the 2nd disc iso with dd and cp , the first disc dd to iso, plays fine ...go figure
[18:55] <BluesKaj> penguin42, yeah dvd
[18:55] <bjsnider> maybe the disc was still encrypted. maybe libdvdcss2 couldn't grab the key
[18:56] <penguin42> BluesKaj: None-data discs are a bit special; their sectors are actually different sizes for the audio and video data; I've never tried dding one directly
[18:57] <BluesKaj> this pc is our media server , so i'm copying  our fav dvds to the hdd,
[19:00] <BluesKaj> penguin42, well, this packaged set , Cream at the Royal Albert, the first one dd > iso and plays fine on vlc , dd-ing the 2nd iso wasn't playable ...rather odd, no ?
[19:01] <penguin42> indeed
[19:01]  * penguin42 prefers Clapton when he was playing alone
[19:01] <BluesKaj> k9copy seemed to do the trick on the 2nd , anyeay
[19:01] <BluesKaj> anyway
[19:03] <BluesKaj> penguin42, well for my generation , the Cream reunion was historical
[19:26] <dupondje> Bugs bugs bugs :(
[19:26] <dupondje> :p
[19:27] <dupondje> my new laptop got to many exotic hardware it seems :p
[19:53] <dupondje> cdbs: You also have an XPS 15 I sse ?
[19:55] <Pici> Well, I upgraded to Oneiric.
[20:03] <dupondje> Damn
[20:04] <dupondje> gotto love Intel Wireless team :)
[20:04] <dupondje> Bugreported, and 2 hours later a good response :)
[21:30] <dsdale> Hey folks, I think there might be an issue in numpy's distutils that needs to be patched for 11.10. In /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.7/numpy/distutils/system_info.py, the default_x11_{lib,include}_dirs are pointing to nonexistent directories, and should be changed to
[21:30] <dsdale>    default_x11_lib_dirs = libpaths(['/usr/lib/X11', '/usr/lib'], platform_bits)
[21:30] <dsdale>     default_x11_include_dirs = ['/usr/include/X11', '/usr/include']
[21:32] <micahg> dsdale: that doesn't sound right, considering multiarch
[21:33] <dsdale> well, /usr/X11/lib and /usr/X11/include don't exist
[21:34] <micahg> dsdale: oh, that's definitely wrong :)
[21:34] <micahg> dsdale: can you file a bug for this?
[21:35] <dsdale> sure. Could you please provide a link?
[21:35] <micahg> dsdale: ubuntu-bug python-numpy
[21:35] <dsdale> Sorry, that doesn't mean anything to me
[21:36] <micahg> dsdale: you can just run it on the command line
[21:36] <dsdale> ah
[21:36] <micahg> it'll open up launchpad with some information about the package
[21:36] <dsdale> thanks
[21:37] <dsdale> Traceback (most recent call last):
[21:37] <dsdale>   File "/usr/share/apport/apport-kde", line 36, in <module>
[21:37] <dsdale>     apport.fatal('Could not import module, is a package upgrade in progress?  Error: %s', str(e))
[21:37] <dsdale> NameError: name 'apport' is not defined
[21:38] <micahg> ugh, I guess apport is broken as well
[21:40] <micahg> yofel: any ideas ^^
[21:42] <yofel> dsdale: works for me, does 'apport-cli python-numpy' in konsole fail too?
[21:43] <dsdale> no
[21:44] <yofel> uh, now that's fun, from the trace it seems that an import error happens, but before apport is loaded, then the error message tries to use the not-imported apport and that call crashes too
[23:49] <alex_mayorga> !gnome
[23:56] <alex_mayorga> Does anyone know if this is implemented already? http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/27614
[23:58] <alex_mayorga> how do I restore the "Ubuntu classic" option?


[03:32] <KiethS> Having a problem with WiFi, running Lubuntu. The O/s is fine, I'm sure, but each time I boot, and wake from sleep, I have to manually power off and power on my wifi for it to work.
[03:32] <KiethS> Is there a way to automate the wifi power cycle in Lubuntu?
[03:33] <ianorlin> what do you mean manually power on and power off hardware button in the applet on the panel to disconnect and reconnect
[03:34] <ianorlin> I don't know how to automate a hardware button
[03:34] <KiethS> Same
[03:34] <ianorlin> so does it not connect when coming back up and you have to press the button twice?
[03:34] <KiethS> But not exactly my meaning.  Hoping to somehow disable the device, then reenable it.
[03:35] <KiethS> The lid of the notebook opening wakes it from sleep...
[03:35] <KiethS> But the scenario extends to cold boot as well.
[03:36] <ianorlin> have you tried like a script with rfkill block then unblock
[03:36] <KiethS> Not as yet.  Haven't heard of rfkill, honestly.
[03:38] <KiethS> Looks possible.  Will experiment.  Thanks for the input!
[04:28] <Tarminquay> "I like Windows 10, it is VERY, VERY light. I have been using Windows 10 for about 3 months and I can say that it is by far lighter than Linux Mint, It uses far less resources than Linux Mint."
[04:28] <Tarminquay> What do you make of this?
[04:29] <Tarminquay> "Even though Linux Mint is way more resource intense than Windows 10, it has a nice feel."
[14:44] <lifieo> how to become # in 1510 livecd
[14:46] <leszek> lifieo: sudo su
[17:10] <utu8o> anyone running 15.10?
[17:10] <SlidingHorn> utu8o: plenty of folks are...do you have a support question?  Go ahead and ask :)  Just be as detailed as possible & keep it to one line
[17:11] <utu8o> i'm might upgrade to it
[20:17] <django_1> hey all
[20:17] <django_1> how do i find screenshots


[00:19] <mmikowski> kforge
[03:52] <RikMills> mmikowski: can't build packages in the main archive or to ship to users in a ppa with that
[12:10] <RikMills> launchpad publisher still seem borked
[12:23] <mamarley> It did finally get all of 5.26.3 published for Lunar overnight. :)
[12:23] <mamarley> (Yes, I already upgraded xD)
[12:25] <RikMills> mamarley: the archive publisher seems not too bad. it is the ppa one that seems really borked
[12:26] <RikMills> trying to get 5.26.3 built for kinetic and no progress
[12:26] <mamarley> Yeah, one of my PPA builds is jammed up too.
 😶🌫🥶 (re @IrcsomeBot: <RikMills> trying to get 5.26.3 built for kinetic and no progress)
[13:21] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[14:08] <RikMills> builds going again, finally
 \0/
 building wheels moving...
 few more packages in progress. ...
 \0/ : https://irc-attachments.kde.org/6f6640c5/image_2022_11_09_16_15_58.png
[15:24] <fenris> 5.26.3 so far so good !


[00:02] <Bookman> Thanks for all your help this evening!  Merry Christmas.
[00:56] <delight> did somebody try to install a virtualbox on lucid (maybe the karmic version as there is no lucid version on the virtualbox repos yet)
[01:01] <BUGabundo> $ apt-cache policy virtualbox-ose
[01:01] <BUGabundo> virtualbox-ose:
[01:01] <BUGabundo>   Installed: (none)
[01:01] <BUGabundo>   Candidate: 3.0.8-dfsg-1ubuntu1
[01:01] <BUGabundo> are you sure delight?
[01:01] <BUGabundo> meww no 3.1 ? bah
[01:06] <delight> BUGabundo: I wasn't talking about the ose ;) ... I'm trying to install the karmic deb on lucid right now ... let's see how that works :-\
[01:06] <delight> :-D
[01:07] <BUGabundo> ahh
[01:07] <BUGabundo> should work
[01:07] <BUGabundo> you just need kernel support
[01:07] <BUGabundo> that is done by KMS
[01:07] <BUGabundo> I have it running in debian unstable for kernel .32
[01:08] <delight> http://download.virtualbox.org/virtualbox/3.1.2/ or deb http://download.virtualbox.org/virtualbox/debian karmic non-free <<< is what i ment ... but I'll find out
[01:09] <BUGabundo> that's what I said
[01:11] <delight> BUGabundo: ^^^yes ;) and as it seems it works great on my box too ;)
[03:11] <billybigrigger> hey all, is anyone alive tonight? or is it a bad time to be looking for support? :P
[03:12] <crimsun> yes, and yes
[03:14]  * cwillu_at_work stabs xsplash in the heart
[03:18] <IdleOne> lol crimsun
[03:19] <IdleOne> billybigrigger: if you don't mind half druken response :)
[05:46] <biovore> anyone know how to get lynx to boot and not start X?   Is there kernel command line to make it so it dosn't start X.
[05:49] <crimsun> boot into single-user, disable gdm, then continue
[05:49] <biovore> single start X ,  X kills box..
[05:49] <biovore> thus no console :-(
[05:50] <crimsun> tried specifying init explicitly, then?
[05:50] <biovore> can't get a console to do that..
[05:51] <biovore> could make it not start gdm.. but if I can't get a console I can't do any of these methods..
[05:51] <crimsun> you can't get to a grub menu?
[05:51] <biovore> yes
[05:51] <crimsun> you can? then pass init=/bin/sh
[05:51] <biovore> use to be able to do a -b and get it to drop to a shell..
[05:51] <biovore> yeah.. I can try that..
[05:54] <biovore> hmm that show some promise..  But seems to just stalls..  Dosn't seem to spawn a sh
[05:54] <biovore> finishes /scripts/init-bottom from the ramdisk then just stops..
[05:58] <biovore> init=/bin/bash -b worked though..  thanks
[06:12] <om26er> will lucid support installation on btrfs?
[06:24] <taygalove> !climm | taygalove
[06:25] <taygalove> !lynx | taygalove
[06:26] <bazhang> taygalove, /msg ubottu
[07:46] <om26er> !udev
[07:48] <taygalove> !udev
[07:52] <om26er> is MeMenu gonna be a part of indicator-applet-session ?
[08:02] <om26er> !test
[08:28] <mac_v> om26er: doesnt seem so
[08:29] <mac_v> there are not session shutdown/logout options
[08:29] <mac_v> no*
[12:10] <soee> hi
[15:29] <BluesKaj> Merry Christamas To All ! :>)
[15:52] <CosmiChaos> how to stop GDM/X in TTY in +1. on execution of "sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop" (like it used to work) it wont and recommends to run "service gdm stop", on doing that it just says: stop: Rejected send message, 1 matched rules; type="method_call", sender=":1.56" (uid=1000 pid=13070 comm="stop) interface="com.ubuntu.Upstart0_6.Job" member="Stop" error name="(unset)" requested_reply=0 destination="com.ubuntu.Upstart" (uid=0 pid=1 comm="/sbin
[15:52] <CosmiChaos> /init))
[15:57] <CosmiChaos> found it out myself howto stop gdm/x, superuser does the job from inside a X terminal (sudo service gdm stop) that shut it down and took me to TTY1 ;)
[16:00] <CosmiChaos> heres how i found out how to get around the crazy boot-animation/TTY graphic issues i had. grub booted my kernels automatically with vga=795, i just removed them from the menu.lst, its just low res but its ok for terminal and bootanim.
[16:42] <billybigrigger> hey all
[16:56] <Hans_Henrik> just ran a ubuntu daily live cd (x64) and.. how the heck am i suppose to log in?
[16:57] <nysosym> hi there
[16:58] <nysosym> my macbook centers the cursor, based on the motion sensors (i can move the curse with the angle of my macbook) but how can i disable this "feature"?
[16:58] <nysosym> i cant find any xorg.conf
[16:58] <nysosym> curse = cursor
[17:09] <Sarvatt> nysosym: sudo rmmod applesmc
[17:11] <SoftwareExplorer> Am I the only one that can't login when I'm running the latest daily image off live cd/usb?
[17:12] <Hans_Henrik> no
[17:12] <airstrike> no, Hans_Henrik has the same problem
[17:12] <Hans_Henrik> i got that problem too (downloaded like 3 hours ago)
[17:13] <SoftwareExplorer> I did notice you can get to a already logged in shell if you do Ctrl Alt F3 though. Don't know if that helps.
[17:14] <nysosym> Sarvatt: Thank you sooooo much! :)
[17:14] <Hans_Henrik> SoftwareExplorer: thanks for the tip, ill try it later :p
[17:15] <SoftwareExplorer> Hans_Henrik: Your welcome.  :)
[17:19] <nysosym> hmmm i had a sporadic desktop flicker on my macbook 2G (GMA 950)
[17:19] <nysosym> known issue=
[17:19] <nysosym> ?
[17:21] <yofel> nysosym: did you suspend macbook?
[17:21] <yofel> *your
[17:23] <nysosym> i'll check mom
[17:25] <nysosym> works finde
[17:25] <nysosym> fine
[17:27] <yofel> well, I have an 945GME and am suffering from bug 492392, the flashes don't start immediately after wakeup though
[17:28] <nysosym> hmm its just a short flicker every 3-5min
[17:28] <Amaranth> macbook never used 945
[17:28] <yofel> yep, exactly that
[17:28] <yofel> Amaranth: he has a 950
[17:28] <nysosym> but i dont get a blank screen
[18:51] <Sarvatt> yofel: thanks for linking that bug, been looking for one of those to put the fix info on :)
[18:53] <Sarvatt> its fixed with a drm-intel-next kernel 12-22 or newer from the mainline kernel site if you need a fix before it gets backported
[18:57] <SwedeMike> nutte
[18:57] <SwedeMike> oops, wrong channel
[19:03] <bjsnider> ghostcube, ping
[19:03] <ghostcube> bjsnider: pong
[19:03] <bjsnider> i've got some libxine pckages probably working with jack
[19:03] <ghostcube> oh cool
[19:04] <bjsnider> https://launchpad.net/~nvidia-vdpau/+archive/testing-ppa
[19:04] <bjsnider> i'm not mpving them over to the main ppa until and unless they work, so you're going to be the guinea pig
[19:05] <ghostcube> ;)
[19:06] <ghostcube> van i pull everything so just add ppa
[19:06] <ghostcube> or is this not good ?
[19:08] <bjsnider> what?
[19:09] <ghostcube> if i just add the ppa or if i sho0uld install libxine manually?
[19:11] <bjsnider> add the ppa
[19:13] <ghostcube> ok done :)
[19:13] <ghostcube> brb
[19:18] <bjsnider> well, he didn't have to restart
[19:18] <bjsnider> it's only libxine
[19:33] <ghostcube> http://picpaste.de/pics/Bildschirmfoto17.1261769520.jpeg  bjsnider
[19:37] <ghostcube> works fine so far
[19:45] <bjsnider> cool
[19:47] <ghostcube> brb
[20:23] <patcito> hi
[20:24] <patcito> I get more than 80% CPU because of plasma systray, when I remove it cpu usage goes down, anyone has a similar experience?
[21:28] <SoftwareExplorer> Does anyone know how to get the nvidia driver working in Lucid?
[21:30] <yofel> SoftwareExplorer: use the drivers  from the nvidia vdpau ppa
[21:30] <yofel> -.-
[21:30] <yofel> SoftwareExplorer: use the drivers  from the nvidia vdpau ppa
[21:31] <yofel> the 190 drivers from xorg edgers should work too afaik
[21:32] <SoftwareExplorer> yofel: Ok, thanks. Is this the right ppa https://launchpad.net/~nvidia-vdpau/+archive/ppa?
[21:32] <bjsnider> the 190 or 195
[21:33] <bjsnider> the problem with the nvidia blob in the lucid repos is that it needs to be rebuild against the new x server
[21:33] <yofel> SoftwareExplorer: yes
[21:33] <SoftwareExplorer> yofel: Ok, thanks. :)
[21:46] <knittl> hi, has anybody else got problems with ureadahead (or plymouth??)
[21:47] <knittl> i get a lot of error messages after grub
[21:47] <knittl> ureadahead terminated with status 4
[21:47] <knittl> mountall: cannot connect to plymouth
[21:47] <knittl> plymouth-log: $something
[21:47] <knittl> cannot start session: no such file or directory
[21:52] <DanaG> that reminds me... I should file a bug report about plymouth refusing to display splash if it gets console= on the kernel command line.
[21:53] <DanaG> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=22239
[21:53] <DanaG> there's the existing upstream bug report.
[21:53] <joaopinto> knittl, I am getting those also
[21:53] <joaopinto> i need to boot without the splash option
[21:54] <DanaG> oh, and ureadahead exits with status 1, upon trying to preload stuff in /home
[21:54] <bjsnider> i thought there was one where plymouth wouldn't work if there were any extra kernel line options
[21:55] <knittl> i tried quiet splash and splash only
[21:55] <knittl> happens with both
[21:55] <knittl> also starting after logging in in gdm takes a lot of bjsnider
[21:55] <knittl> * a lot of time
[21:56] <knittl> lol xD
[21:56] <knittl> bjsnider: but i also got problems with nvidia drivers
[21:56] <bjsnider> it takes a lot of me?
[21:56] <knittl> i have to run dpkg-reconfigure nvidia-glx-195 almost everytime, otherwise i'll get an errorbox saying my desktop started in low graphics mode
[21:57] <knittl> bjsnider: no, a lot of time. i was faster typing than thinking :D
[21:57] <knittl> * typing faster
[21:57] <knittl> meh :-$
[21:57] <bjsnider> did you use jockey to install the nvidia driver?
[21:58] <knittl> what's jockey? i used apt-get to install them from the vdpau ppa
[21:58] <knittl> ah, no i didn't use the hardware drivers manager
[21:58] <knittl> it wouldn't find them anyway
[21:59] <bjsnider> it wouldn't find what?
[22:00] <knittl> nvidia drivers
[22:00] <bjsnider> i don't see why not
[22:00] <knittl> and even now it tells me there are no restricted drivers in use on my system. it won't recommend any eihter
[22:01] <bjsnider> you're using the updated nvidia-common from hte ppa and the modaliases packages?
[22:01] <knittl> hm no
[22:01] <knittl> let me install that :)
[22:02] <knittl> i was only using nvidia-glx-195
[22:03] <bjsnider> you need the nvidia-common and the modaliases packages for jockey to work
[22:05] <knittl> and a restart?
[22:06] <bjsnider> no
[22:06] <bjsnider> well, jockey might need to restart
[22:07] <knittl> no proprietary drivers in use on this system
[22:09] <knittl> but installing nvidia-common was a good thing to do ^^
[22:10] <bjsnider> does it see and recommend the 195 driver?
[22:10] <knittl> nop
[22:10] <bjsnider> do you have the 195 modaiases package installed?
[22:10] <knittl> it doesn't show anything
[22:11] <knittl> state: installed
[22:14] <legend2440> i am able to run the clonezilla iso using Grub2 without having to burn the iso.  can i do the same thing with Lucid?
[22:32] <joaopinto> legend2440, it's the same grub version, so yes
[22:32] <legend2440> joaopinto: ok thanks
[23:10] <karioke> I have a query related to the customized ubuntu based live CD I have. Is this the correct forum for queries regarding it?
[23:11] <bazhang> karioke, which version of ubuntu
[23:11] <karioke> bazhang, karmic. I used this to build the iso: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCDCustomizationFromScratch
[23:12] <bazhang> karioke, this is for lucid, 10.04 ; karmic would be in #ubuntu
[23:12] <karioke> bazhang, ok. thanks
[23:29] <nysosym> hi there, how can i define i915.modeset=0 as bootoption?
[23:30] <nysosym> i have tried it with "GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX="i915.modeset=0"" in /etc/default/grub
[23:30] <nysosym> but it doesn't work
[23:36] <nysosym> sry for that, i had a crash
[23:39] <yofel> hm... it's been a  while since I had to use that, but iirc you create some config file in /etc/modprobe.d/
[23:39] <yofel> lemme google...
[23:41] <yofel> ah, found it, create some random config file, I'll use i915-kms.conf so that it makes sense, and put 'options i915 modeset=0' in there
[23:43] <yofel> when the kernel loads the module KMS should be off
[23:43] <yofel> nysosym: ^^^
[23:56] <nysosym> thank you yofel, ill try :)
[23:56] <nysosym> br
[23:56] <nysosym> b


[00:03] <mwhudson> bigjools: oh, the other thing that was confusing me was whether i should set the nodes to pxe or disk boot by default
[00:03] <bigjools> mwhudson: always pxe
[00:03] <mwhudson> or if it doesn't matter and maas always runs "chassis bootdev $arg" as appropriate anyway
[00:03] <mwhudson> ok
[00:03] <bigjools> maas will make the node DTRT
[01:59] <mwhudson> bigjools: does maas work to deploy quantal on arm server do you know?
[01:59] <mwhudson> i got some error when i tried, but well, i was doing all sort of things i didn't understand at that point
[02:04] <mwhudson> bigjools: also will i be happier with packages from quantal(-updates) or the daily or stable ppa?
[02:05] <bigjools> mwhudson: PPA is better right now but there's and SRU imminent
[02:05] <bigjools> an*
[02:05] <mwhudson> this ppa? https://launchpad.net/~maas-maintainers/+archive/dailybuilds/+packages
[02:05] <bigjools> yes
[02:05] <mwhudson> ta
[02:05] <bigjools> also raring is better
[02:05] <mwhudson> oh ok
[02:05] <bigjools> it has a few more features
[02:06] <bigjools> I don't know about deploying quantal on arm, I'd talk to rbasak
[02:07] <mwhudson> i don't know how to install raring on highbank...
[02:08] <bigjools> do you need to install the server on arm?
[02:08] <bigjools> you can run it on x86 and deploy to arm
[02:09] <mwhudson> hm
[02:09] <mwhudson> for now it's probably easier to install on arm
[02:11] <mwhudson> http://ports.ubuntu.com/dists/raring/main/installer-armhf/current/images/generic/netboot/ looks promising
[03:30] <lifeless> mwhudson: whatchya working on?
[03:30] <mwhudson> lifeless: arm server stuff
[03:31] <mwhudson> benchmarking, in particular
[03:33] <lifeless> mwhudson: ah, so automated bare metal setups ?
[03:33] <mwhudson> yeah
[03:33] <mwhudson> and deployment of services that one might want to benchmark
[03:33] <lifeless> mwhudson: this a linaro thing?
[03:33] <mwhudson> yep
[18:44] <Matrix3000> anyone able to explain why dhcp doesn't work on clients after install maas-dhcp
[18:44] <Matrix3000> can't get them to PXE boot, when everything is permitted
[18:44] <Matrix3000> there are no other dhcp servers on the network
[18:44] <Matrix3000> where should dhcp be finding the config file
[19:24] <Matrix3000> anyone here that can explain the dhcp pxe boot issues, installed maas-dhcp, still nothing broadcasted
[19:35] <roaksoax> Matrix3000: Did you configure maas to provide DHCP?
[19:43] <Matrix3000> how do I specify that
[19:43] <Matrix3000> cause on 12.04 implementation it was fairly automatic, but in 12.10 doesn't look to be
[20:09] <roaksoax> Matrix3000: go to the web UI and modify the settings there fro a cluster controller
[20:09] <roaksoax> you'll be able to add it
[20:09] <Matrix3000> ok will try in a minute
[20:20] <roaksoax> bigjools: let me know when around
[20:39] <Matrix3000> roaksaox: that did not help, but i found where to change it
[20:39] <Matrix3000> still not gettign any dhcp sent to it
[22:49]  * mwhudson is installing maas for the third time in the last 3 working days...
[22:49] <mwhudson> (this time for sure!)
[22:55] <bigjools> \o/
[22:55] <bigjools> yo roaksoax
[22:55] <mwhudson> although h,,
[22:55] <mwhudson> hmm
[22:56] <mwhudson> i thought i'd be clever and install it in a raring container on a precise host
[22:56] <mwhudson> but i guess i'll need to do something cleverer to make sure that pserv can get tftp traffic
[22:57] <lifeless> naaaaat
[22:57] <mwhudson> that's the problem rather than the solution isn't it?
[22:58] <bigjools> there's your problem - don't try and be clever :)
[22:58] <mwhudson> i guerss
[22:59] <bigjools> accept the matrix
[23:00] <roaksoax> bigjools: o/
[23:00] <roaksoax> bigjools: hey so I was thinking ... we should just go for a migration path fro the SRU
[23:03] <bigjools> roaksoax: how would you see that working?
[23:04] <roaksoax> bigjools: if in upgrade from the precise version we have DNS/DHCP configured, configure it in MAAS itself
[23:05] <bigjools> roaksoax: you would have to parse the dhcpd.conf
[23:05] <roaksoax> bigjools: i can get the info from debconf i think :)
[23:05] <bigjools> I am not sure this effort is worth the hassle
[23:05] <roaksoax> if precise still does that (can't even remember :) )
[23:06] <roaksoax> bigjools: i know, but its the only way it will get accepted
[23:06] <roaksoax> at least from his perspective
[23:06] <bigjools> roaksoax: grarrrrr.  remind me of the bug number again?
[23:06] <roaksoax> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/maas/+bug/1109283
[23:06] <bigjools> ta


[09:31] <pikselprojekt> Hello, I've got problem and I was wondering is there a solution waht don't take to much time and will work correctly with my newest version of Ubuntu Studio. I neet to install old Inkscape 4.8.5! Anyone?
[13:02] <georgeowell> compile it from source?
[14:31] <tim_> Hi. I'm having trouble playing any videos in Firefox or Opera. How can I correctly install Flash? TIA.
[14:37] <OvenWerks> playing videos from firefox has worked out of the box for me.
[14:37] <OvenWerks> you might want to ask on #xubuntu or #ubuntu too as there are a lot more people there
[15:11] <tim_> Thanks.


[05:37] <guiverc_t> tsimonq2, when you get a chance; post alpha 2 (dustin & you) release notice to fridge .... I want URL for uwn :)
[05:37] <tsimonq2> guiverc_t: ack


[07:05] <trijntje> Hi all, I want to get a printer-friendly version of the Dutch ubuntu-docs for precise. I've been reading the wiki page but I get stuck with building the documentation, is this page outdated? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/BuildingDocumentation
[07:07] <trijntje> in which directory should I run the 'make all' command?
[23:53] <Amoz> Any plans for porting the new designs to the wiki?
[23:53] <Amoz> give me a ping if there are


[01:26] <TheLordOfTime> Is anyone on the release team available to respond to a comment from a user on the Ask Ubuntu site regarding the package manifests for releases?
[01:26] <TheLordOfTime> I'm not qualified to respond and would not mind someone who knows what they're talking about to respond.
[01:26] <TheLordOfTime> http://askubuntu.com/questions/401772/running-software-center-from-command-line-as-root/401784#comment515647_401851 is the comment on their site.
[01:32] <cjwatson> TheLordOfTime: replying
[01:36] <cjwatson> (done)
[01:50] <TheLordOfTime> cjwatson: thanks.
[01:50] <TheLordOfTime> cjwatson: sorry to bother the release team on this, but I wanted it to come from someone a LOT higher up on the food chain than us mere plebs on Ask Ubuntu.
[01:50] <TheLordOfTime> cjwatson: sorry to bother the release team on that, but I wanted it to come from someone a LOT higher up on the food chain than us mere plebs on Ask Ubuntu.
[01:51] <TheLordOfTime> bleh, stupid system...
[01:51] <TheLordOfTime> sorry for the double post (the second has been typo-fixed)
[08:35] <apw> looks like adt may be sick for the linux package
[21:16] <sergiusens> can someone check ^^ please?


[01:11] <thafreak> +1 I'll look him up
[01:12] <dzho> the 'n' is important
[01:12] <dzho> there's an asshole who goes by djsumdog or something like that with an 'm'
[01:12] <dzho> the good one runs the 'toot-lab' domain
[01:12] <thafreak> is he on reclaim.technology?
[01:12] <thafreak> ok
[01:13] <dzho> ah yeah I think that's the guy
[14:59] <yano> Amateur Radio Club at OSU will be Zoom-ing from 4pm to 7pm (TODAY) for the Involvement Fair, https://osu.zoom.us/j/96065091681?pwd=QWVHUVhYdzJGL2x5aFgwYmpURlpxQT09 if anyone is interested


[11:38] <SergioSchvezov[m> Hi, can anyone tell me why I don't have permissions to view https://launchpad.net/~/+snaps ?
[11:50] <cjwatson> SergioSchvezov[m: do you get an OOPS by any chance?  that would help to track it down
[11:52] <cjwatson> I _think_ that the visibility filtering might not be quite right for private snaps that aren't owned by you but that are attached to branches/repositories you own.  Maybe
[11:53] <SergioSchvezov[m> I get a standard "Not allowed here" message with no OOPS
[11:55] <SergioSchvezov[m> FWIW, I am in no hurry for this
[11:55] <cjwatson> damn.  ok, could you please file a bug as I think I can see what the problem might be from code inspection?
[11:55] <cjwatson> but I'll need to do some database digging to verify that, and write a test
[12:02] <SergioSchvezov[m> logged LP: #2012379, with all the information I could grab
[12:02] -ubottu:#launchpad- Launchpad bug 2012379 in Launchpad itself "Permission denied for /~/+snaps" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2012379
[12:04] <cjwatson> SergioSchvezov[m: the relevant query is https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/p8kBqPWqCP/ if you want a sense of complexity ;-)  (fortunately we don't work on it in that form, that's after it's gone through a query compiler)
[12:06] <cjwatson> I think basically we need a Snap.owner condition in a couple more places
[12:11] <cjwatson> Hm no, the privacy filter should be enough
[12:13] <cjwatson> I think the problem is `~sergiusens/+snap/snapcraft-build1`, which is a private snap recipe using a git repository by URL with no access grants allowing anyone to see it - this may have been an old way to do private builds
[12:15] <SergioSchvezov[m> it rings a bell, it was for that one time CVE we had years ago
[12:16] <cjwatson> This may have been a bad migration - we moved to relying on explicit subscribers for access, but maybe there were few enough snap recipes in this situation that we didn't migrate them properly
[12:16] <SergioSchvezov[m> I can leave that lying around if you want to fix this and have me test; or try and remove it to verify your theory
[12:16] <cjwatson> You won't be able to see it to remove it, for the same reason
[12:16] <cjwatson> I think this is both a bad migration and a bad listing query
[12:17] <cjwatson> So we might want to figure out if there are any other snaps in the same situation first
[12:20] <cjwatson> OK, there are two, yours and a similar snapd one
[12:21] <SergioSchvezov[m> I was going to suggest mvo, as I followed the guide he created for dealing with CVEs
[16:29] <cjwatson> SergioSchvezov[m: That page should load for you now, I think (though the other part of the bug means that https://launchpad.net/~sergiusens/+snaps won't currently load for anyone else)
[19:02] <SergioSchvezov[m> works, thank you!