[00:01] <wgrant> lifeless: Foreign keys on trigger-maintained denorm tables -- any opinions?
[00:01] <wgrant> Seems like they're basically just going to slow things down.
[00:05] <StevenK> wgrant: https://devpad.canonical.com/~stevenk/query.log.gz
[00:07] <wgrant> waitwhat
[00:07] <wgrant> accesspolicy_pkey should be a serial
[00:08] <wgrant> It can't conflict, unless you're not dirtying the DB properly.
[00:11] <StevenK> I don't get it either. :-/
[01:17] <lifeless> wgrant: stub wants them
[01:17] <lifeless> wgrant: I'm not strongly enough opinionated to debate either way yet.
[01:17] <lifeless> wgrant: intel SSD+1
[01:19] <wgrant> lifeless: Well, we can't do them for array columns...
[01:23] <StevenK> lifeless: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/869213/
[01:24] <wgrant> The enterprise ID probably can't include the instance like that.
[01:24] <wgrant> Since they're clones of production.
[01:24] <wgrant> But that's rather awkward.
[01:24] <lifeless> StevenK: might want a qualifier added - e.g. 'object_to_enterpriseid(bug, 'comments')
[01:24] <StevenK> wgrant: I was following lifeless' mail on the subject
[01:24] <StevenK> lifeless: Why?
[01:25] <lifeless> StevenK: I sketched out some thoughts on the txlongpoll discussion last weekend or so
[01:25] <lifeless> StevenK: can always add it later
[01:25] <lifeless> StevenK: it looks fine to me in all other regards
[01:26] <StevenK> I don't see the point. We're converting an object to a representation of one, *not* a method/property on an object.
[01:27] <StevenK> lifeless: I have hit a roadblock for enterpriseid_to_object(), in that I can't seem to get it return the object
[01:27] <lifeless> StevenK: there is a relatively low cost of change here if we're careful, so I'm fine leaving it out.
[01:27] <lifeless> StevenK: it wasn't in my initial emails after all :)
[01:27] <StevenK> IE, going from 'Person' to Person()
[01:28] <lifeless> StevenK: sys.modules['Person'] isn't what you want
[01:28] <lifeless> StevenK: you want sys.modules['lp.registry.model.person'].Person
[01:28] <StevenK> Right, which is fine for Person, but not PackageUpload
[01:28] <lifeless> StevenK: I think you'll probably need something a bit more directly connected to the LP code layout than what you have
[01:29] <lifeless> e.g. it may not be possible to JustSupport everything.
[01:29] <lifeless> also remember that type needs to be unique
[01:29] <lifeless> and your current implementation would be broken if e.g. lp.services.email grew a Person class
[01:29] <lifeless> so, I suggest having an explicit map of supported types to strings, and strings to factories
[01:30] <lifeless> e.g. known_types = [
[01:30] <lifeless>     (Person, 'Person'),
[01:30] <lifeless>     ]
[01:30] <lifeless> types = dict(known_types)
[01:31] <lifeless> factories = dict((label, klass) for klass, label in known_types)
[01:31] <lifeless> # adjust for taste
[03:18] <StevenK> wgrant: I've pushed my branch to lp:~stevenk/launchpad/accesspolicy-garbo if you can peer at it.
[03:33] <wgrant> StevenK: Looking
[03:34] <wgrant> Ah
[03:34] <wgrant> There's the problem.
[03:34] <wgrant> test_hourly_script doesn't dirty its DB
[03:34] <wgrant> test_daily_script does
[03:34] <wgrant> StevenK: Try fixing that.
[03:44] <StevenK> AH HA
[03:44] <StevenK> About time :-(
[03:51] <lifeless> wgrant: 'psycopg2.ProgrammingError: syntax error at or near "."
[03:51] <lifeless> LINE 3: ALTER TABLE BugJob RENAME TO todrop.BugJob;
[03:52] <lifeless> '
[03:52] <lifeless> wgrant: I think your advice is wrong :)
[03:52] <StevenK> Haha
[03:52] <wgrant> lifeless: That wasn't my command.
[03:52] <wgrant> ALTER SCHEMA todrop
[03:52] <StevenK> SET SCHEMA todrop
[03:52] <lifeless> wgrant: you cleverly preserved it :>
[03:52] <wgrant> Er, that
[03:52] <wgrant> lifeless: I didn't really read the first sentence.
[03:53] <wgrant> It was there already :)
[03:55] <StevenK> wallyworld: Are you up for reviewing a branch of mine?
[03:55] <wallyworld> ok
[03:55] <StevenK> wallyworld: https://code.launchpad.net/~stevenk/launchpad/accesspolicy-garbo/+merge/95834
[04:03] <wallyworld> StevenK: i think you mean embardgoessecurity, not proprietary
[04:04] <StevenK> wgrant: ^
[04:05] <wgrant> The wallyworld is correct.
[04:05] <wallyworld> proprietary is only for products with commercial subscriptions
[04:06] <wallyworld> StevenK: i'd like the tests to check the data as well as just the count
[04:06] <wallyworld> StevenK: because i'm stupid, why did you need to make a call to DatabaseLayer.force_dirty_database()  ?
[04:07] <StevenK> wallyworld: Because test_hourly_script is broken
[04:07] <wallyworld> of course :-)
[04:07] <StevenK> test_daily_script did it, but test_hourly_script did not.
[04:07] <wallyworld> and existing tests didn;t need this?
[04:07] <StevenK> And it was causing test failures in unrealted tests
[04:08] <wallyworld> ok
[04:08] <wallyworld> thanks for explaining
[04:08] <wgrant> It depended on ordering.
[04:08] <wgrant> Depending on what the next test did, it would have worked even with the dirty DB
[04:08] <wgrant> eg. if it was just deleting stuff
[04:08] <wallyworld> yuk
[04:08] <wgrant> Or using a non-serial primary key.
[04:09] <StevenK> wallyworld: I don't see the point of testing the APs themselves in the test.
[04:09] <wgrant> I would.
[04:09] <wgrant> And it's like 2 lines.
[04:09] <wallyworld> StevenK: it's not testing the api, but that you have told the garbo scrip tto insert the correct data
[04:10] <wallyworld> ah, can't read, i thought you said api
[04:11] <wallyworld> but my point stands :-)
[04:11] <StevenK> wallyworld: Anything else?
[04:12] <wallyworld> StevenK: no, looks nice otherwise
[04:16] <lifeless> wgrant: could I ask a favour? ec2 land https://code.launchpad.net/~lifeless/launchpad/bugjob/+merge/95837 ?
[04:17] <wgrant> lifeless: Self-reviewing a DB patch? Dubious.
[04:17] <wgrant> But OK :)
[04:17]  * lifeless shrugs
[04:18] <lifeless> I don't require stub to block on me for his schema changes.
[04:20] <StevenK> wallyworld: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/869352/
[04:22] <wallyworld> StevenK: i'd use assertContentEqual to ignore sorting differences and you don't need the .count() check if you are conparing the actual values
[04:23] <StevenK> wallyworld: Good point.
[04:28] <StevenK> wallyworld: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/869357/
[04:29] <wallyworld> StevenK: i had a thought. will the logic fail if we add a policy to a pillar by hand? i think it will
[04:30] <wallyworld> it will think the pillar is already processed
[04:30] <wallyworld> but there may not be the 2 required policy types
[04:30] <StevenK> Not for the test data, but I can't see us doing so until the garbo jobs are done
[04:31] <StevenK> Distribution I can see being done during the first run
[04:31] <wallyworld> yes :-)
[04:31] <StevenK> Product will take a little longer
[04:31] <wallyworld> yes, i'm concerned though since the fflag will be on for select users
[04:31] <wallyworld> and they can use the gui
[04:31] <wallyworld> perhaps we delay the fflag being on till garbo kob done
[04:33] <StevenK> Right
[04:34] <lifeless> .
[04:35] <StevenK> lifeless: Your DSL sucks.
[04:35] <StevenK> wallyworld: I've commited and pushed those changes.
[04:36]  * wallyworld taps fingers
[04:38] <StevenK> wallyworld: Diff is updated
[04:38] <wallyworld> yes
[04:38] <StevenK> I was just pondering filing a bug or [no-qa]
[04:41] <wallyworld> StevenK: r=me. to not cut corners, you should probably do qa on it
[04:46] <StevenK> wallyworld, wgrant: QA-Landing looks awesomely full -- is it the truth?
[04:55] <wallyworld> StevenK: yes, i have a 4 pipe landing
[04:56] <wallyworld> but 2 yui tests are failing on ec2
[04:56] <wallyworld> so am trying to fix
[05:00] <StevenK> Ah yes, QA-Landing really has been wallyworlded.
[05:49] <lifeless> mmm
[05:49]  * lifeless forgets when implicit db user switches occur
[05:50] <lifeless> wgrant: sanity check me - we can drop the calculate-bug-heat db user and permissions
[06:12] <StevenK> Why does https://launchpad.net/oops-tools say "This project is currently inactive." ?
[06:12] <lifeless> because it is
[06:13] <lifeless> you want python-oops-tools
[06:13] <huwshimi> wgrant: On the +sharing page when you are selecting a team to share with, why are there options to grant access to public and public security... am I missing something? It seems like you don't need to grant access for those things.
[06:13] <huwshimi> wallyworld: ^
[06:14] <lifeless> huwshimi: for private projects
[06:14] <lifeless> huwshimi: or projects with private-by-default artifacts
[06:15] <huwshimi> lifeless: I feel like I'm missing something. So "Public" for a private project is private?
[06:15] <huwshimi> I thought this was the whole point of the policies
[06:16] <huwshimi> to have this stuff make sense :)
[06:16] <lifeless> oh I see, you're saying that any artifact covered by the public policy really should be public
[06:16] <lifeless> I'd need to page a bit more in to answer that; so I'll let wallyworld / wgrant / StevenK do so ;)
[06:18] <huwshimi> :)
[06:21]  * StevenK is neck deep in Django
[06:21]  * StevenK glares at lifeless
[06:26] <huwshimi> oop, gotta go
[07:22] <nigelb> StevenK: should we send someone after you? :)
[09:06] <czajkowski> aloha
[09:10] <adeuring> good  morning
[09:42] <StevenK> Errr, why did lifeless land a DB patch to devel?
[09:50] <czajkowski> StevenK: do you actually sleep ?
[10:19] <stub> Whoopsies
[10:29] <StevenK> czajkowski: Sometimes.
[10:30] <micahg> is it even sleep time in StevenK's TZ?
[11:15] <czajkowski> jtv: any reason why on the RT we get mails *to*<EMAIL_ADDRESS>on a daily basis?
[11:15] <jtv> czajkowski: we stopped using that address a while back (it generated more pain than gain), so I'd guess there's a "legacy" forwarding to RT.
[11:16] <czajkowski> jtv: aye on a daily basis at least 3-4 rts are created
[11:16] <jtv> So you may want to figure out why the email gets there.  For instance, users may be replying to outgoing mail that accidentally still uses<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[11:17] <czajkowski> jtv: MAILER-DAEMON"<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[11:34] <wgrant> lifeless: Yes, they can go.
[11:34] <wgrant> lifeless: AFAIK I removed them from the codebase a while back.
[11:34] <wgrant> lifeless: But they need to be manually dropped from prod.
[11:34] <wgrant> (the bug heat users)
[12:17] <salgado> mrevell, hey there.  sorry to keep nagging, but I was wondering if you'll have some time to work with us on that work-items help text today?  we would like to land it together with the new UI, if possible :)
[12:18] <czajkowski> salgado: morning
[12:18] <salgado> hi czajkowski!
[12:32] <mrevell> salgado, Email incoming! :)
[12:35] <salgado> mrevell, perfect timing, thanks a bunch!
[12:36] <mrevell> My pleasure :) Let me know if you need to talk about it. I'll be afk for 40 mins or so.
[12:39] <salgado> mrevell, there was a typo and the list of states was incomplete. I guess you won't mind me fixing that :)
[12:39] <salgado> mrevell, and https://help.launchpad.net/WorkItems doesn't exist yet
[13:50] <salgado> benji, I've put a trivial one up for review (https://code.launchpad.net/~salgado/launchpad/workitems-widget-help-popup/+merge/95894), if you have a couple minutes :)
[13:51] <benji> salgado: sure
[13:53] <salgado> benji, fwiw, mrevell gave me the text you see there and I've already told him the wiki page linked to from there doesn't exist yet. I suppose he plans to steal the one from wiki.u.c
[13:53] <benji> salgado: ok
[13:53] <mrevell> salgado, benji: Hey, back from lunch. I'll create the wiki page this afternoon.
[13:53] <mrevell> salgado, Thanks for making the corrections :)
[13:54] <benji> salgado: review done
[13:57] <salgado> thanks benji. do you know how I'd go about using CSS to format the <pre> block there?
[13:59] <benji> salgado: only with inline styles, but I suspect there's a CSS class already in existance for that
[13:59] <salgado> benji, ah, that'd be nice. I'll see if I can find it
[14:08] <salgado> benji, can't seem to find anything that would do it. is it ok if I just inline a margin-top: there?
[14:09] <benji> salgado: you'd better ask someone more font-endy than me, we generally frown on inline style, but I don't know where the line is drawn, precisely
[14:12] <salgado> benji, ok, will do. anyone you'd recommend?
[14:12] <salgado> (don't really know who to ask for that these days)
[14:12] <salgado> deryck, maybe? ;)
[14:13] <deryck> salgado, hi. what's up?
[14:13] <benji> salgado: Huw (huwshimi) would be a good start, but mrevell probably knows too
[14:13] <salgado> deryck, hi there.  we're discussing how to avoid a blank line in a <pre> block: https://code.launchpad.net/~salgado/launchpad/workitems-widget-help-popup/+merge/95894
[14:13] <mrevell> salgado, Yeah, it's best if you ask for a review from huwshimi.
[14:14] <salgado> and benji asked me to check with somebody more frontend-y than him, right when you joined
[14:14] <mrevell> salgado, He'll help with the CSS side of things.
[14:14] <salgado> deryck, looks like you don't need to worry, though; I'll bug huw :)
[14:14] <deryck> salgado, ah, ok. cool :)
[14:14] <salgado> mrevell, cool, will do that
[14:14] <mrevell> salgado, Huw's in Tasmania, so he won't be around for a few hours yet.
[14:32] <deryck> adeuring, abentley -- I'm coming, just taking a bit for the hangout to start for me.
[14:33] <mabac> rick_h_, could you have another look at the review since I fixed the info message for the whiteboard? I used your javascript
[14:34] <deryck> mabac, rick_h_ is unavailable until wed. maybe jcsackett could take it, since he's the mentor of rick_h_
[14:34]  * jcsackett perks up, goes to take a look
[14:35] <mabac> deryck, ok thanks
[14:36] <mabac> jcsackett, great thanks!
[14:37] <jcsackett> mabac: oh wow, this branch has had a lot happen since i last looked at it.
[14:39] <mabac> jcsackett, oh I hoped it wasn't too bad. it should just be changing the order of the text fields and then the js for displaying an info message when editing the whiteboard.
[14:39] <jcsackett> mabac: no, it's not bad. just a case of me sorting out all the activity so i know what i'm looking at. :-P
[14:39] <mabac> jcsackett, hehe ok. note that two revisions where backed out entirely
[14:40] <mabac> jcsackett, 14855 and 14856 are reverted in 14857
[14:48] <sinzui> benji, do you have time to review my branches listed on https://code.launchpad.net/launchpad/+activereviews
[14:48] <benji> sinzui: sure
[14:54] <czajkowski> sinzui: morning I think this one is a you question, as I remember I can't change a projects licience. https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/189488
[14:55] <sinzui> czajkowski, we do not own the project.
[14:55] <sinzui> czajkowski, reactivate the project, then explain to the user that he can use the Change details link to update the license
[14:56] <czajkowski> sinzui: thank you.
[14:59] <rick_h_> jcsackett: I'm in/out (snack time for the boy) let me know if you need anything from me. Sorry it ran over until I was out
[14:59] <mrevell> salgado, https://help.launchpad.net/WorkItems now redirects to a draft page that I'll flesh out and make live when we're ready.
[15:00] <salgado> mrevell, cool!
[15:08] <czajkowski> deryck: allenap what is the max apport attachment that can be uploaded to a bug ?
[15:09] <deryck> czajkowski, hmmm, not sure actually.  I can poke at code to see if allenap doesn't know off the top of his head.
[15:09] <deryck> rick_h_, geez, man, we're going to have to start calling you lifeless2
[15:09] <czajkowski> deryck: asking as someone reported a bug at the weekend, but just wondering was things crashing as lotta folks submitting things due to UGJ
[15:09] <czajkowski> deryck: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/945629
[15:09] <_mup_> Bug #945629: Launchpad chokes on tiny package, deeper throat required? <Launchpad itself:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/945629 >
[15:11] <deryck> czajkowski, ah, this is a known bug.
[15:11] <deryck> czajkowski, it's not attachment limits, am looking for the bug.
[15:15] <abentley> adeuring: are you up for a chat?
[15:19] <benji> sinzui: I just finished your two reviews.
[15:21] <allenap> czajkowski: Comments (or at least bug descriptions) have a limit of 50,000 characters. I don't know of a limit for attachments, so... what deryck said :)
[15:21] <deryck> czajkowski, this is bug 194558.  I'll dupe against it.
[15:21] <_mup_> Bug #194558: Project file upload timeout (and often do not OOPS) <arm> <escalated> <linaro> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/194558 >
[15:22] <czajkowski> allenap: deryck thank you
[15:22] <sinzui> thank you benji
[15:22] <benji> my pleasure
[15:23] <deryck> allenap, yeah, I guess we have no limits for how many attachments.
[15:24] <adeuring> abentley: sure. mumbleß
[15:24] <adeuring> =
[15:24] <abentley> adeuring: sure.
[15:24] <rick_h_> deryck: heh, love my job and all that right? Can't be too far from the laptop.
[15:24] <deryck> rick_h_, heh, fair enough. Just don't love it so much that you hate it in 6 months from burnout. ;)
[15:27] <benji> sinzui: Gary points out that my code in the reviews isn't syntacticly correct, but I bet you'll get the gist
[15:28] <sinzui> benji, thank. Your point is correct and I am playing with it now
[15:56] <abentley> adeuring: celery does indeed implement soft timeouts via a signal handler: celery/concurrency/processes/pool.py:188
[15:56] <adeuring> abentley: cool.
[15:58] <abentley> adeuring: However, I was wrong about soft timeouts being configurable from the apply_async invocation.  They are only configurable on a task-type basis.  We may need RunFastJob, RunSlowJob, RunReallySlowJob tasks.
[15:59] <adeuring> abentley: ok, sounds good
[16:27] <sinzui> jcsackett, do you have a few minutes to discuss a bug I am working on http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/870095/
[16:55] <jcsackett> sinzui: sure, i'm free.
[16:59] <sinzui> jcsackett, fab. mumble or hangout
[17:00] <jcsackett> sinzui: i can do either. hangouts worked well last time.
[17:00] <sinzui> okay hangout.
[17:03] <sinzui> jcsackett, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/c264c08394aabf490ee4492d4bc30adeb7741e97?authuser=0&hl=en#
[17:10] <adeuring> abentley: lp:~adeuring/launchpad/lazr.jobrunner-oops
[17:11] <abentley> adeuring: thanks!
[17:12] <adeuring> abentley: I think we should add a class BaseJob to runjob.py / jobrunner.py, just to document which methods and properties are required
[17:13] <abentley> adeuring: That makes sense.  We could extract it from FakeJob
[17:14] <adeuring> abentley: yes, that's what I basically meant ;)
[17:25] <abentley> adeuring: I've put some changes in trunk, so it's a good idea to merge trunk.
[17:25] <adeuring> abentley: right
[17:26] <abentley> adeuring: It looks interesting-- so we just build up an oops report and publish.
[17:27] <adeuring> abentley: basically, yes. We still need to properly configure the OOPS reporting -- but that should not be done in lazr.jobrunner
[17:27] <adeuring> (where "configure" means to pull in things like including a timeline, for exmaple)
[17:27] <abentley> adeuring: On the launchpad side, can we re-use the existing oops configuration?
[17:28] <adeuring> abentley: I think we need to refactor the ErrorReportingUtility
[17:28] <abentley> adeuring: Oh, I see.
[17:29] <adeuring> abentley: but generally my dea is that we can use the same, or at least a similar, oops_config in ErrorReportingUtility and in lazr.jobrunner
[17:29] <abentley> adeuring: Sounds good.
[18:48] <sinzui> benji, do you have time to review https://code.launchpad.net/~sinzui/launchpad/commercial-project-picker/+merge/95970
[19:11] <matsubara> hi there, I'm trying to run the workitems branch but can't run it locally. I keep getting this error:  https://pastebin.canonical.com/61627/ when I make schema. Anyone have ideas how to fix that?
[19:20] <salgado> matsubara, if nobody has any ideas you might want to run ./utilities/launchpad-database-setup again
[19:20] <matsubara> salgado, I did that already
[19:21] <salgado> hmm
[19:23] <salgado> are you running with postgresql8.4 or 9.1?
[19:27] <matsubara> salgado, I think I have both installed. this last time I ran lp-db-deps it ran against the 9.1 db
[19:27] <matsubara> do you have a debversion in your tree somewhere?
[19:28] <salgado> lib/lp/archivepublisher/debversion.py
[19:28] <matsubara> right, same here
[19:28] <matsubara> psql:launchpad-2209-00-0.sql:1230: ERROR:  could not access file "$libdir/debversion": No such file or directory
[19:28] <matsubara> this is the error I'm getting
[19:28] <salgado> but that's not it
[19:28] <matsubara> what's the libdir variable?
[19:29] <salgado>  /usr/lib/postgresql/8.4/lib/debversion.so
[19:29] <salgado> that's the one
[19:29] <salgado> you seem to lack
[19:30] <salgado> I'd say get rid of 9.1 and try with 8.4. that works for me, on oneiric
[19:30] <salgado> there's a postgresql-8.4-debversion package, btw
[19:30] <salgado> but launchpad-database-dependencies depends on it
[19:33] <matsubara> salgado, right, for 8.4 I had the debversion file, but not for 9.1
[19:33] <matsubara> salgado, I stopped 9.1 and left only 8.4 running and am trying again
[19:33] <matsubara> (I'm precise btw)
[19:33] <matsubara> (I'm on precise btw)
[19:34] <salgado> good luck, then :)
[19:34] <matsubara> :-)
[19:34] <salgado> I tried to set it up on precise about a month ago and gave up; ended up setting up an Oneiric container
[19:36] <matsubara> salgado, it's applying the db patches now, so I think it's fixed. thanks salgado
[19:36] <sinzui> salgado, I believe 9.1 can be used. I think we are switching to it soon
[19:38] <matsubara>   File "/home/matsubara/devel/canonical/lp-sourcedeps/eggs/txlongpollfixture-0.1.3-py2.7.egg/txlongpollfixture/server.py", line 131, in _start
[19:38] <matsubara>     raise Exception("Timeout waiting for txlongpoll to start.")
[19:38] <matsubara> Exception: Timeout waiting for txlongpoll to start.
[19:38] <matsubara> now I got that error when I make run
[19:38] <matsubara> and it looks like it's running: 25320 pts/9    Sl     0:02 txlongpoll: accepting connections on 22435
[19:40] <matsubara> ok, trying again worked.
[20:48] <abentley> sinzui: to support the move of ec2 scripts from lp:launchpad to lp-dev-tools, I am thinking of copying the lastest bzr-pqm packages from the bzr daily PPA to the launchpad PPA.  Does that make sense?
[20:50] <sinzui> abentley, could be. I run my own hacked version though since pqm-submit does not work on precise
[20:50] <lifeless> abentley: that would be easier for folk w/out the bzr ppa
[20:50] <sinzui> It would be nice to get the fix when someone actually applies my patch
[20:51] <sinzui> Or discovered why I needed to write such am atrocious patch to make pqm-submit worl
[20:52] <abentley> sinzui: Where is your patch?
[20:53] <sinzui> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr-pqm/+bug/922741
[20:53] <abentley> lifeless: Yes, that was my thinking.  I assume not everyone is on the dailies.
[20:53] <sinzui> abentley, ^
[20:53] <_mup_> Bug #922741: AttributeError: 'BzrBranch7' object has no attribute 'get_config_stack' <amd64> <apport-bug> <patch> <precise> <running-unity> <Bazaar PQM Plugin:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/922741 >
[20:54] <abentley> sinzui: Just going by the title, that may have been fixed in r86
[20:55] <sinzui> well. I think I can test that in a few minutes. I am about submit a branch
[20:55] <abentley> sinzui: which bzr are you running?
[20:55] <poolie> o/
[20:56] <abentley> poolie: \o
[20:56] <sinzui> abentley, 1.4.0~bzr83-1
[20:56]  * sinzui looks at his own branch
[20:56] <abentley> sinzui: which bzr, not which bzr-pqm?
[20:57] <sinzui> oh duh
[20:57] <abentley> though from the traceback, I'd guess 2.5
[20:57] <sinzui> 2.5.0-1ubuntu1
[20:59] <abentley> sinzui: This is wacky, because in 2.5, BzrBranch7 does provide get_config_stack.
[20:59] <sinzui> abentley, wacky indeed
[21:00] <sinzui> I really don't think I should have needed that patch
[21:01] <sinzui> abentley, I pulled tip (bzr-pqm) and submitted.
[21:02] <sinzui> Look like it did its part correctly
[21:02] <abentley> sinzui: I'm glad of that.
[21:02] <sinzui> abentley, and It was a success.
[21:03] <sinzui> I think I can mark my patch invalid now
[21:04] <abentley> sinzui: I don't really get what happened there, though I'll mention ec2 is using the egg version of bzr, not the system version.
[21:05] <sinzui> abentley, given the oddness of my patch (wallyworld ran it too), I think there were version inconsistencies for about 6 weeks
[21:08] <abentley> sinzui: It appears that the egg version of bzr did not support get_config_stack-- it landed in r6157.
[21:09] <abentley> sinzui: So we could chalk this up to launchpad running a beta bzr.
[21:10] <sinzui> fab
[21:10] <sinzui> I will tell my team
[21:11] <abentley> sinzui: I don't understand how a direct pqm-submit would be broken, unless you ran "bin/bzr".
[21:11] <abentley> sinzui: Or were also running a similar beta version.
[21:12] <sinzui> abentley, ec2 <land|test> and pqm-submit were all broken for me at the time I reported the bug
[21:13] <abentley> sinzui: Are you certain ec2 test was broken?  It shouldn't be using pqm-submit at all.
[21:13] <sinzui> abentley, yes it was. I had to use a different computer for a week
[21:13] <sinzui> until I decided to add the hack
[21:15] <abentley> sinzui: Okay.  I guess you were using "ec2 test -s" or similar?
[21:16] <sinzui> yes, that is right
[21:16] <abentley> sinzui: forgive my confusion about ec2 test.  I don't use it, so I didn't realize it can land branches.
[21:26] <salgado> huwshimi, hi there. I've proposed a trivial branch (https://code.launchpad.net/~salgado/launchpad/workitems-widget-help-popup/+merge/95894) and my reviewer had some CSS-related questions so I was pointed at you :)
[21:26] <salgado> it'd be great if you could have a look and tell me how I should proceed there :)
[21:27] <huwshimi> salgado: Sure! Let me take a look
[21:28] <huwshimi> salgado: Would you like me to comment here or on the mp?
[21:29] <salgado> huwshimi, either way is fine with me
[21:33] <huwshimi> salgado: I just replied on the mp
[21:34] <salgado> oh, of course!
[21:34] <salgado> thanks huwshimi!
[21:35] <huwshimi> salgado: Hopefully that will give you proper spacing, but if not we can look at some CSS
[21:37] <salgado> yep, confirming that now
[21:39] <mwhudson> salgado: you should steal my greasemonkey work items editor at some point :)
[21:45] <salgado> mwhudson, we considered that but in the name of simplicity we decided to use a textarea for now
[21:45] <mwhudson> fair enough
[21:46] <mwhudson> it will be trivial to adapt the greasemonkey to that i assume
[21:46] <mwhudson> although the parsing/unparsing/parsing thing will be a bit strange
[21:46] <mwhudson> salgado: you are exposing the work items on the api i assume?
[21:47] <salgado> mwhudson, yes, for now only as a text field, using the same format as before. so you just have to change .whiteboard to .workitems_text, hopefully
[21:48] <mwhudson> salgado: oh, the api representation is as text as well?
[21:49] <salgado> mwhudson, yep
[21:49] <mwhudson> ok
[21:50] <mwhudson> salgado: how does this help status.l.o then?  you just know that it's formatted correctly?
[21:52] <salgado> mwhudson, yes, and we catch/fix errors when users enter them so they won't have to be nagged by status to go back and fix it later.  our actual goal is not really to help status though -- we want to implement work item reports in LP: https://dev.launchpad.net/Projects/WorkItems
[21:52] <mwhudson> ah ok
[22:28] <StevenK> lifeless: So why did your DB patch branch hit devel?
[22:29] <lifeless> hahhaa bad defaults.
[22:29] <lifeless> fortunately it will do no harm
[22:30] <StevenK> What? We had db-devel as the default for YEARS
[22:30] <StevenK> And it caused no end of issues
[22:33] <sinzui> StevenK, regardless of future sharing and past legacy rules, user should be permitted to see public bugs. https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/872870
[22:33] <_mup_> Bug #872870: Public bug cannot be viewed when linked to a private branch <403> <branches> <bugs> <disclosure> <privacy> <ui> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/872870 >
[22:58] <sinzui> wallyworld_, your can pull https://code.launchpad.net/html5-browser I tested the env using
[22:58] <sinzui> HTML5BROWSER_USE_PYGTK='true' ./test.py
[23:05] <sinzui> wallyworld_, see https://code.launchpad.net/~sinzui/+recipe/html5-browser-daily
[23:12] <bigjools> morning
[23:12]  * StevenK 's world crashes down
[23:12] <sinzui> wallyworld_, have you run this yet
[23:12] <sinzui> apt-add-repository ppa:sinzui/ppa
[23:12] <wallyworld_> sinzui: sure have
[23:13] <wallyworld_> just waiting for build now :-)
[23:20] <lifeless> wgrant: do youi know of a way to say 'fuk it everything will need [SELECT|UPDATE|DELETE] on table Y' ?
[23:21] <wgrant> lifeless: public
[23:21] <wgrant> lifeless: But please don't.
[23:21] <wgrant> THe only things that really belong there are...
[23:21] <wgrant> hmm
[23:21] <wgrant> SELECT on featureflag
[23:21] <wgrant> And nothing else.
[23:22] <wgrant> Ah, that's there already.
[23:22] <wgrant> And pillarname
[23:33] <wallyworld_> huwshimi: hi, sorry i missed you yesterday - was buying food for dinner. with your question, the +sharing page is wip. those options are being fixed and other stuff also being sorted out
[23:33] <huwshimi> wallyworld: No problems
[23:33] <huwshimi> wallyworld: So will the public options still be there?
[23:34] <wallyworld> huwshimi: nope. only embargoes security and userdata, and for commercial projects, proprietrary
[23:34] <huwshimi> wallyworld: OK great, thanks for that!
[23:35] <wallyworld> huwshimi:  np. i have a branch that i'm about to land with those changes, plus there are now checkboxes so you can select more than one
[23:35] <huwshimi> wallyworld: Ah great
[23:36] <wgrant> wallyworld: The new packages should be published.
[23:45] <wallyworld> wgrant: thanks, that was fast
[23:47] <lifeless> wgrant: mail sending
[23:48] <wgrant> wallyworld: Queue-jumping is handy :)
[23:48] <wallyworld> indeed
[23:48] <wgrant> lifeless: I await it in fear.
[23:49] <lifeless>  /win goto mbarnett
[23:49] <lifeless> bah
[23:49] <wgrant> That makes me even more concerned.
[23:49] <mbarnett> lifeless: that was more like a summon!
[23:49] <lifeless> mbarnett: My fingers apologise to you.
[23:50] <wgrant> lifeless: I see no mail.
[23:50] <wgrant> Did it go via forster?
[23:50] <wgrant> lifeless: you suck
[23:50] <wgrant> 2012-03-05 23:50:25 WARNING Bad object name 'public.bugjob'
[23:51] <lifeless> wgrant: you suck too. But enough of the compliments.
[23:51] <lifeless> wgrant: you're talking about bugjob landing on the wrong branch? Has it caused a buildbot failure ?
[23:51] <wgrant> lifeless: No, but you forgot to remove DB permissions.
[23:51] <wgrant> So security.py whinges.
[23:52] <wgrant> The mislanding won't cause any problems.
[23:52] <lifeless> yeah
[23:52] <wgrant> It just makes you the first violator of your policy :)
[23:52] <StevenK> Haha
[23:52] <lifeless> wgrant: does anything need calculate-bug-heat, talking of security.cfg ?
[23:52] <wgrant> lifeless: No.
[23:52] <wgrant> I apparently forgot to remove it from security.cfg
[23:52] <wgrant> In my cleanup a few months back.
[23:52] <lifeless> (and from prod)
[23:53] <wgrant> And then it needs to be manually dropped from prod
[23:53] <wgrant> yeah
[23:53] <wgrant> And cleaned up from pgpass etc
[23:53] <lifeless> I will leave that to you, enough WIP as it is
[23:53] <wgrant> I may demolish it along with bugjob permissions in a few seconds.
[23:54] <wgrant> lifeless: Oh, by "mail sending" you meant you were talking about permissions for sending mail, rather than that you were sending a mail about the permissions?
[23:54] <lifeless> right
[23:54] <wgrant> That explains why I see no email.
[23:54] <lifeless> and notifications more generally.
[23:54] <wgrant> I shall stop looking for the problem with forster.
[23:55] <lifeless> wgrant: hah! indeed.
[23:58] <bigjools> poolie: sat here chuckling at your tweet
[23:58] <wgrant> Is that a replacement for "lol"?
[23:59] <bigjools> lolling is not chuckling
[23:59] <bigjools> lol is for when people want you to think they liked something your said but are not really laughing at all
[23:59] <bigjools> you* said, even
[23:59] <wgrant> True, true.


[09:44] <f_g> is the rationale for the ("tentative") choice of 4.15 for Bionic public somewhere? I already asked on-list some time ago (in reply to an even earlier question regarding the same), but there hasn't been a reply
[09:48] <apw> f_g, mostly it is about the tension between new h/w support which is useful for upcoming machines and stability from a longer baked kernel; that take with a view on when we will get the kernle relative to our cycle
[09:52] <f_g> apw: but why specifically 4.15 instead of 4.14, which is an upstream LTS release? is there some feature that landed in 4.15 that is more important than upstream LTS support? just "it's one cycle newer" seems kinda.. thin? :P
[09:54] <f_g> I know the general balance between newer kernel - better HW support - shiny new features / older kernel - less breakage - more stability
[09:54] <apw> f_g, we get input from vendors on where they are landing feature support, and that tends to be late in the game
[09:54] <apw> the upstream stable kernles are generally chosen to be non-alighned with our cycle
[09:55] <apw> we have to balance the work we will have to do porting stable fixes, against porting features
[09:56] <apw> though iirc there was a change to how long LTS stables will be supported which may well make them more attractive
[09:57] <f_g> apw: I am not sure whether the latter applies to upstream stable in general, or just certain ones? 4.4 got 6  years IIRC
[09:57] <apw> thye all started claiming to be 2, but i do think they may well be doing longer now
[09:58] <apw> 4.15 is still a tentative, and we will have a hard think before we move 4.14 -> 4.15 as we are not committed till that point
[09:59] <f_g> apw: understood. thanks for taking the time to answer - it looks surprising from an outsider / downstream perspective, especially since 16.04 had 4.4
[09:59] <apw> f_g, that was somewhat lucky for sure
[10:00] <f_g> we moved from 4.4 to 4.10 and now 4.13 (downstream, based on Ubuntu kernel packages), and especially the move to 4.13 has been quite painful so we are a bit wary of 4.15
[10:02] <apw> it is a difficult balancing act, newer is almost always better in terms of h/w support a big driver for desktop users who want the new shiney laptop to just work
[10:02] <f_g> I know - which is why we use Ubuntu's as a base - there is no other distro kernel with the same mix of uptodateness and HW testing/support ;)
[10:03] <apw> so we must be doing something right
[10:03] <f_g> :)
[10:04] <apw> we will be reviewing the plan as we always do as we get each kernel in and "stable", 4.14 is still bouncing around in -proposed
[10:05] <f_g> most of the pain with 4.13 was not Ubuntu's fault at all btw - just the usual upstream breakage. but much of it only got fixed in 4.15 and 4.14 stable updates, not in the short period of upstream 4.13 support
[10:05] <f_g> great, I'll keep an eye out for future updates / plans then!
[10:06] <apw> f_g, it is easier when there is an upstream LTS nearby to keep those updates flowing that is for sure
[10:06] <apw> 4.13 is as far from an upstream stable as you can be
[10:09] <f_g> indeed. there's only LP#1726519 left atm thankfully, but that seems to have stalled upstream
[12:52] <dupondje> pcieport 0000:00:1d.0: AER: Corrected error received: id=00e8 => any idea on such error? tested daily kernel, but still seems to happen :(
[12:55] <dupondje> 00:1d.0 PCI bridge: Intel Corporation Sunrise Point-H PCI Express Root Port #9 (rev f1) (prog-if 00 [Normal decode])
[12:55] <dupondje> hmm :)
[13:00] <dupondje> oh my nvme disk is on that :(
[18:29] <dupondje> Is there some daily linux-firmware package available?


[02:27] <lotuspsychje> good morning
[02:42] <lotuspsychje> morning Square
[02:44] <Square> Hey. I'm curious about trying a tiling window manager. "Sway" seems to be a good one. Sadly ubuntu (wayland) support seems patchy at best.
[02:44] <lotuspsychje> Square: they all seem to love hyperland on unixporn these days
[02:45] <Square> unixporn?
[02:45] <lotuspsychje> https://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn/
[02:45] <lotuspsychje> go get some ideas, then pick the right one for you
[02:45] <Square> oh ok
[02:46] <lotuspsychje> a lot of users like an ubuntu-server base with i3 too
[02:46] <lotuspsychje> depends a bit wich road you want to take and what needs you have Square
[02:59] <Square> Seems tiling window manager world hates NVidia.
[03:00] <lotuspsychje> well nvidia doesnt like wayland too much, not sure if thats the case for tiling
[15:59] <Square> What, NOT-terminal based, irc client do you prefer?
[16:00] <Square> Wanting to ditch hexchat/xchat that seems to have gone EOL
[16:00] <Square> ..or development stopped
[16:04] <jeremy31> I thought hexchat was still maintained
[16:10] <oerheks> indeed https://github.com/hexchat/hexchat
[16:10] <oerheks> choose one supporting sasl
[16:10] <oerheks> https://libera.chat/guides/sasl
[16:11] <Square> I thought the last developer update sounded really tired. And it feels like its been standing still forever.
[19:41] <JanC> it's mostly in maintenance mode, but occasionally new features are added too when people submit them


[01:49] <mcsadmin> gnome-terminal
[01:49] <mcsadmin> cd
[05:06] <guruprasad> valorie, any specific files to check?
[05:07] <guruprasad> Everything under ~/.config seems to be owned by my user account
[05:44] <mmikowski> guruprasad: Check them all with this: cd ~/.config; find ./ -printf '%u %p \n' |grep -v "^${USER} ";
[05:45] <mmikowski> guruprasad: Sorry if that's too remedial, btw. I thought it might help.
[05:54] <guruprasad> mmikowski, as expected, there was nothing returned for the find command. So the permissions appear to be in order.
[06:06] <mmikowski> yup, so that's a no-go.
[06:06] <mmikowski> Recently, had a customer report he had to run locale-gen.
[06:07] <mmikowski> to fix a locale issue (Canadian English, IIRC).
[06:09] <mmikowski> Good luck!
 Hi all
 I wanna add fedora to my grub i've tried os-prober but it only findes windows which is already added to grub is there any way to do it ?
 I don't wnat to use fedora grub it is messy
[12:45] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[14:33] <djibb> Hi all. Have some issue with suspend. When I've installed 22.04, between June and February is has worked as expected : when suspend was called, my laptop had LED blinking, then after woke up, ask me my password. Now... suspend via systemd doesn't work anymore, LED is always on, screen is black, the only thing I can do is power off at button ( have no try magic keys).  uname : 5.19.0-35-generic   hwinfo : https://pastebin.com/haDjdjyR
[14:34] <djibb> I can suspend with pm-suspend, hit hit, then quickly close the screen... then it's suspended... ;) If i am too slow, had to reboot...
[17:11] <WJC42> I'm running Kubuntu 22.04. I have a few snap packages installed. 2 of them keep giving me notifications 'Pinding update of "firefox" snap. Close the app to avoid disruptions (6 days left)'.  I have also run sudo snap refresh. That results in it telling me "all packages are up to date" and ironically it triggers the same annoying notifications about
[17:11] <WJC42> pending updates. Any ideas?
[17:50] <alba> hi im new on kubuntu, can i ask here for support?
 Yeah of course (re @IrcsomeBot: <alba> hi im new on kubuntu, can i ask here for support?)
[19:53] <user|77> hello


[01:15] <netritious> Heyo
[01:58] <Unit193> Heya, netritious!
[03:35] <netritious> Hey Unit193! How are the things?
[06:33] <Unit193> netritious: Getting hot, so not liking that, but otherwise I think decent enough.  I guess life updates would be "My one sister is married, lives in Texas, and is expecting".  You?
[08:53] <netritious> Unit193: same here, hot as heck! Daughter graduated HS, full ride to Uni, doing honors biz school, life is ok. :D Still using Ubuntu? Have d/l but not installed 20.04 yet. :/
[08:54] <Unit193> Wow, congrats on that!  I use Debian now.
[09:10] <netritious> yeah, Debian is pretty nice. Been a while for me though.
[09:10] <netritious> And thanks :D She did all the hard work tbh
[12:39] <wrst> hello netritious!!!
[12:40] <wrst> that's great news
[13:17] <netritious> hello wrst! how's it going bud? and thanks, she is a hard worker
[13:20] <wrst> that's awesome
[13:20] <wrst> going pretty well here, still working from home, and not fully adjusted to that yet
[13:21] <netritious> yeah, it's hard for everyone ... but meeee lol
[13:21] <netritious> honestly it does get a bit old though
[13:22] <wrst> I'm starting to get to the point i'm able to get out and look at some jobs and go to some of our plants so that breaks it up, but I'm at home today
[13:22] <netritious> ok, cool
[13:22] <netritious> still running arch?
[13:28] <wrst> I am running ubuntu, actually using it for work at the moment, I have a corporate laptop that I haven't fired up at home in months now :)
[13:28] <wrst> running a windows vm on my home server to access vpn stuff
[13:28] <wrst> using libvirtd and virt-manager
[13:29] <wrst> btw 20.04 is  a very solid release when you get to the point of wanting to install it
[13:29] <netritious> will do!
[13:29] <netritious> I really liked 16.04 and 18.04 even more
[13:30] <netritious> the minimal install for desktop is a game changer
[13:30] <wrst> If our IT people weren't well... a level above useless I would use ubuntu for work vpn stuff but would have to get them to help and isn't worth it when I can just use a windows vm on my server
[13:30] <wrst> it really is great
[13:31] <netritious> show 'em who the real techie is wrst :D
[13:31] <wrst> I really liked running arch, but with snap, flatpack etc you can kinda have your cake and eat it too without the setup of arch
[13:32] <netritious> will check out flatpack, doesn't ring a bell
[13:32] <wrst> netritious: I'm in sales now, and I do some tech support at some of our locations becuase I have a pulse and do know how to turn a computer on
[13:32] <wrst> netritious: https://flatpak.org/
[13:32] <wrst> I like snap but it is not as open as flatpak
[13:39] <netritious> cool will check that out!
[13:39] <netritious> and knowing how to turn on a computer is pretty dang important wrst :)
[13:40] <wrst> the power button is more elusive than we can imagine some times
[13:40] <netritious> hahaha
[13:40] <netritious> how's fam?
[13:58] <wrst> doing ok, Bri needs school to start back, a 9 year old without any shape of a schedule is not  good for any one's sanity :)
[20:46] <netritious> haha I hear you wrst
[20:58] <netritious> Clara got so bored she started applying for jobs everywhere
[20:59] <netritious> of course was after she completed Pokemon game on her switch lol
[22:23] <Unit193> Oooh, speaking of VPN stuff, 20.04 has support for wireguard too!
[22:29] <netritious> nice, I need to just install it already :D
[22:32] <Unit193> I would recommend it, seems to work nicely to me and there's even mobile apps.
[22:35] <netritious> mobile apps? as in I can android apps natively?
[22:37] <netritious> *can run android apps
[22:45] <Unit193> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.wireguard.android


[02:17] <bluesabre> flocculant, ochosi: a couple questions about defaults... 1) Do we want notifications to fade out? This was the behavior prior to 0.4.0 I think, and 2) Do we want to add the notifyd plugin to the panel? It seems like a nice addition to me and fits in nicely to the left of indicator-messages
[02:18] <bluesabre> (also welcome feedback from everybody else)
[04:17] <flocculant> bluesabre: first off from my perspective I'd say no to both - all turned off here :p
[04:18] <Unit193> I thought they did fade out by default, but yeah added the plugin and didn't see too much of a benefit. :3
[04:18] <flocculant> from not my perspective 1 - not sure what you mean - when I test it for ochosi I thought it faded out
[04:19] <flocculant> 2 - the plugin isn't too obtrusive and I don't see having it there would be an immediate fail
[04:19] <flocculant> Unit193: ha ha
[04:19] <flocculant> I can imagine if you had them on - the plugin allows you to dnd pretty quickly
[04:20] <Unit193> For the only thing that matters, my irssi notifications don't fire if ~/.dnd exists.
[04:20] <flocculant> Unit193: suspend screwed up a terminal I had running irssi, was dead, logging out and it was still dead - had to reboot
[04:25] <flocculant> aah it moves off stage right - doesn't fade
[04:27] <Unit193> 0_o
[04:28] <flocculant> apparently I have electron installed ... https://i.imgur.com/sVA1FaM.png
[04:28] <flocculant> pretty sure I don't - but I do have something built with it (if that's what I read right)
[08:52] <willem> good moring all
[08:53] <willem> morning
[08:53] <Unit193> Heya, willem.
[08:54] <willem> flocculant, as to an update-manager icon appearing in my panel: today I fired up my laptop around 9 o'clock. So far -it's now almost 10- there's no icon to be seen.
[08:55] <willem> (I'm refering to an earlier exchange about update-manager)
[08:57] <willem> I ran sudo apt update in the terminal, and it tells me that there are 23 upgradable packages. There is still no update-manager in the panel however.
[08:57] <willem> Should I report this as an issue do you think?
[09:58] <bluesabre> flocculant, Unit193, yeah, it used to fade by default, but the default changed recently to just disappear
[09:58] <bluesabre> Unit193: that .dnd thing... that sounds like how it should work?
[10:11] <Unit193> bluesabre: Irssi/application specific, thus personally have no need for notifyd's version which is what the plugin provides access to.
[10:12] <bluesabre> Unit193: ah, gotcha
[10:13] <bluesabre> but similarly, you wouldn't be bothered by its inclusion
[10:13] <Unit193> Yeah, only insofar if I have to re-install, something to remove, but that's not hard so not a big deal. :P
[10:14] <bluesabre> :)
[10:24] <bluesabre> flocculant: there's a lot of Electron apps now, so very possible you may have used one at some point
[10:25] <bluesabre> I actually need a file a bug about those, fonts are rendering horribly bad in them in bionic
[10:32] <Unit193> bluesabre: So, happy with Bionic?  With the LTS status?
[10:35] <ali1234> https://i.imgur.com/iCOm6os.png missing icons
[10:38] <bluesabre> ali1234: in humanity?
[10:39] <ali1234> in ubuntu-mono-light and elementary-xfce
[10:39] <bluesabre> Unit193: yes, I think we're in a pretty good position. Everything is rock solid and we only have a few minor issues here and there
[10:39] <ali1234> and yeah humanity too
[10:40] <bluesabre> elementary-xfce looks good over here
[10:40] <ali1234> i installed with the daily image downloaded about 2 hours ago
[10:40] <bluesabre> huh
[10:40] <bluesabre> the orange home folder you have there is not elementary-xfce
[10:40] <ali1234> corrent, it is ubuntu-mono-light
[10:40] <ali1234> the icons are missing regardless of what icon set i choose
[10:42] <bluesabre> will take a look tonight
[10:42] <ali1234> hmm, wait, it does have an icon in elementary-xfce
[10:43] <ali1234> it's just that it's an amorphous grey blob so i could not see it :(
[10:44] <ali1234> also what is this: https://i.imgur.com/iCyTLXr.png
[10:50] <willem> I think I may be seeing the same thing: http://i.imgur.com/xhsjUAV.png; below the bluetooth icon, the mouse and touch pad entry seems to be missing the icon.
[10:51] <ali1234> yeah, cos you've changed icon theme as well
[10:52] <ali1234> oh hre's something: the gnome icon theme is not missing the icon
[10:52] <ali1234> i bet gnome renamed the icon and then nobody fixed all the old themes
[10:53] <willem> I just changed the icon theme to adwaita. Now more icons are missing it seems: http://i.imgur.com/p9hLM9a.png
[10:54] <ali1234> me too. adwaita seems to have almost no icons at all
[10:54] <ali1234> although perhaps that is to be expected
[10:54] <ali1234> i'm not sure why it is even listed and even the preview has a missing icon
[10:56] <ali1234> ah you need adwaita-icon-theme-full to get the full theme
[10:56] <willem> Unit193, as to being happy with Bionic: I've been using it as my everyday install for some 5 days now. Not found any reason to reboot 16.04 so far.
[10:56] <willem> So it's doing well
[10:56] <willem> :-)
[11:00] <ali1234> hmm yep, most icon themes do have those icons
[11:00] <ali1234> faenza, human, breath all have them
[11:01] <ali1234> i guess ubuntu-mono is just unmaintained now
[11:02] <Unit193> Oh nice, can't get the dropbox indicator to show up.
[11:02] <Unit193> willem: Yep, been using it for quite some time myself.
[11:14] <willem> Unit193, my dropbox icon in 18.04 is working (unlike in 16.04). It does however not show any menu if i click/tap on it. It does show atatus messages when I hover over it.
[11:19] <ali1234> hmm installing adwaita-icon-theme-full fixes ubuntu-mono-light as well
[11:19] <ali1234> i dont think i will ever understand how icon themes work :(
[11:25] <Unit193> willem: I can get either to work in Artful, though it seems only if I use indicator-application, hmm.
[11:26] <Unit193> willem: I usually force it into tray icon mode, but was looking to see if I could get indicators working.
[11:27] <ali1234> ah i see
[11:28] <ali1234> Inherits=Humanity,Adwaita,hicolor <- that's the problem
[11:30] <Unit193> OK, so yes I can confirm on Bionic too.
[11:41] <willem> have to leave for now; thanks
[12:02] <ochosi> bluesabre: i would set it to fade out by default. not sure if you also want to enable slide out. i would also add the plugin for easy access to DND
[12:03] <ochosi> ali1234: if you find missing icons in elementary-xfce let me know! and yeah, humanity is in terrible shape
[12:03] <ochosi> just don't use it
[12:03] <ali1234> i'm not trying to use humanity but ubuntu-mono-light
[12:04] <ali1234> but it is also messed up for some reason
[12:04] <ali1234> but installing adwaita-icon-theme-full fixes it for some reason
[12:04] <ali1234> i'm now writing a tool to tell me why
[12:05] <ali1234> can you tell me the name of those icons?
[13:15] <ali1234> okay the icon in question is preferences-desktop-peripherals
[13:15] <ali1234> this icon only exists inside the 'gnome' icon theme
[13:16] <ali1234> this code snippet find the icon even though the gnome theme is selected and the selected theme does not inherit from it http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/f9HmqWSkC6/
[13:17] <ali1234> it works on both 16.04 and 18.04 so i don't understand why it isn't drawing the icon on 18.04
[13:47] <ali1234> araraghgrhaghrgha
[13:47] <ali1234> this is the worst thing ever
[13:47] <ali1234> the icon exists
[13:47] <ali1234> somebody changed it to a copy of the missing icon icon
[13:50] <ali1234> nope, that's not right either
[15:29] -SwissBot:#xubuntu-devel- ::xfce4-announce:: ANNOUNCE: xfce4-terminal <IP_ADDRESS> released @ http://xfce.10915.n7.nabble.com/ANNOUNCE-xfce4-terminal-0-8-7-2-released-tp50792.html (by Igor Zakharov)
[16:40] <willem> hi guys. I think I am seeing some weird behaviour when the laptop battery is almost empty. Please see the picture here http://i.imgur.com/x2vCDj3.png
[16:41] <willem> This screen appeared all of a sudden, and the white squares moves when I move the mouse/touchpad
[16:41] <willem> It happened twice
[16:41] <willem> Not sure how to investigate this. Any suggestions?
[16:46] <GridCube> willem: I have the suspicion that's a hardware issue
[16:48] <willem> It think it happens when the battery is very low, and the laptop wants to shut down, and ask me to save my work before the complete shutdown. When I press the on/off button, the Xubuntu-windoing down windows shows up and the laptop turns off
[16:49] <willem> This has not happened before. Is there any log I can have a look at to find out more? Or should I ask that somewhere else?
[17:18] <willem> I found a log message which may be related and posted on launchpad: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1550779
[17:54] <flocculant> willem: what do you have in update tab of software and updates - just screen shot it for me
[17:56] <flocculant> bluesabre: it was early - yea I have electron app - iirc etcher is electron - not sure why notify just calls things electron?
[18:01] <willem> flocculant, I hope you mean this: http://i.imgur.com/wksmBeI.png
[18:02] <willem> The option I meant is in this tab: http://i.imgur.com/EdLwRUO.png
[18:03] <flocculant> yea - last one - don't turn that on
[18:03] <flocculant> yea - last one - don't turn that on
[18:03] <flocculant> I'll repeat that :p
[18:03] <willem> Thank you
[18:03] <willem> thank you
[18:04] <willem> I wont
[18:04] <willem> I really won't
[18:04] <willem> :-)
[18:04] <flocculant> heh
[18:05] <flocculant> ok - so first screenie - set them to same as mine and see what happens tomorrow
[18:06] <flocculant> tbh I'm not overly concerned about update-mangler - that's a Canonical thing - they get paid to sort their stuff out :D
[18:09] <willem> flocculant, Is there a way for me to know what yours looks like? :-)
[18:10] <flocculant> oops - wonder where I posted that then
[18:10] <flocculant> https://i.imgur.com/9K2gnwG.png
[18:10] <flocculant> or I thought I was going to - then didn't
[18:16] <willem> well, my update tab looks the same;now, except for the security updates; there I have Download immediately and install... Is that alright?
[18:17] <willem> Remember though: I have not seen an update icon in system tray yet
[18:17] <flocculant> yep - leave the security one how you have it
[18:18] <flocculant> and yes - trying to trigger it for you by telling it to display immediately
[18:18] <flocculant> how the tool works is that 2 times per day shortly after and admin logs in (you) it checks and should display
[18:19] <willem> well, I have not seen that display yet.
[18:19] <willem> still: food calls
[19:35] <willem> I was looking at https://wiki.xubuntu.org/releases/18.04/release-notes; I noticed that the link in "xubuntu-desktop (changelog)" doesn't work.
[19:36] <willem> same: xubuntu-wallpapers (changelog)
[20:14] <flocculant> willem: thanks :)
[20:18] <krytarik> willem: Regarding update-manager not showing up even though you get packages to upgrade using APT directly, there is this too which might play a role here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PhasedUpdates
[20:25] <dc_coder_84> I am testing Xubuntu 18.04 64 Bit on real hardware and have found some weird things. When I execute
[20:25] <dc_coder_84> xfce4-terminal --hold --command "echo hello"
[20:25] <dc_coder_84> I everytime get a popup with this message: "Child process exited normal with status zero". Should I open a bug report for it?
[20:26] <willem> krytarik, thanks. That may well be the reason. I'll have a better look over there shortly.
[20:30] <ali1234> ochosi: getting deeper into this missing icon thing. Gtk+3 has added hardcoded look ups against Adwaita and gnome icon themes in addition to hicolor and whatever your theme inherits
[20:31] <ali1234> Gtk+2 never did this, so i don't understand how garcon could ever find the missing icons at all, since they'ev only ever existing in the gnome theme on my system
[20:55] <ali1234> hmm https://github.com/GNOME/gtk/commit/a093cd2a22173369424878eb6d8c38124e7aa1f9
[21:08] <ali1234> got it! setting that setting to "gnome" fixes everything
[21:08] <ali1234> just need to figure out why that is not required on 16.04 now
[22:05] <ali1234> flocculant: here's all the bugs i found in the beta so far: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/JfKCv3P6bw/
[22:07] <bluesabre> flocculant: etcher works well :)
[22:07] <ali1234> etcher is electron... didn't someone say they are busted on 18.04?
[22:07] <bluesabre> ali1234: they work, but fonts seem to be poorly rendered in 18.04
[22:08] <bluesabre> especially noticeable in atom and visual studio code
[22:08] <ali1234> bluesabre: do you have any suggestions where i could look for this fallback icon theme setting?
[22:08] <ali1234> like where do the default settings live?
[22:09] <bluesabre> ali1234: I don't know... but I gtk lets you set whether to use fallback icons in case of a failed load
[22:09] <ali1234> it does but the problem is i didnt tell it to but under 16.04 it did anyway
[22:09] <ali1234> but now under 18.04 it does not
[22:09] <ali1234> as far as i can tell no settings changed
[22:10] <ali1234> and neither did the source code
[22:10] <ali1234> nor any of the icon themes
[22:10] <bluesabre> :D
[22:10] <ali1234> so... i have no idea
[22:10] <bluesabre> no idea
[22:10] <ali1234> what do you think about just setting the setting in the xfconf defaults?
[22:11] <ali1234> it fixes the problem and it's just one key that doesn't appear to affect anything else
[22:11] <bluesabre> What's the setting?
[22:12] <ali1234> xsettings\Net\FallbackIconTheme = "gnome"
[22:12] <bluesabre> Seems like a reasonable inclusion
[22:12] <ali1234> there's a bug report... in the pastebin i linked above... number 4
[22:13] <ali1234> i don't like fixing things without understand why they fix it :(
[22:13] <bluesabre> thanks ali1234
[22:13] <ali1234> i will keep searching for the answer and update the bug
[22:13] <bluesabre> Cool
[22:13] <bluesabre> Let me know if you find anything, otherwise I'll just add it to our defaults
[22:40] <ali1234> hmm... i reproduced it on 16.04 and now i don't understand why
[22:41] <ali1234> i found a bunch of other keys that specify an icon theme but the xsettings one really seems to be the only one that does anything


[12:57] <mdke> nixternal: around?
[12:59] <nixternal> yes sir
[12:59] <mdke> nixternal: o yee which is good with drupal, do you know how I remove the authoring information from pages on a site?
[01:00] <nixternal> yes
[01:00] <nixternal> let me fire up a drupal site here really quick
[01:02] <nixternal> there is a setting in one of the admin modules that allows you to turn it off for the type of content (i.e. story, page, etc.)
[01:03] <mdke> I can't find it :(
[01:04] <nixternal> I am looking at 5.0 and don't see it, and I didn't see it on the fridge site either
[01:04] <mdke> I'm on 5.0 too
[01:04] <nixternal> maybe it was a setting in the theme (page.php, block.php, or something)
[01:05] <nixternal> let me look at the source really quick
[01:05] <nixternal> on my site that is
[01:07] <nixternal> check out page.tpl.php file in your theme. In there you should see something around the posts section. my theme doesn't have it by default
[01:07] <nixternal> ooh, let me just download a theme really quick
[01:07] <nixternal> oh wait...I forgot this server has Drupal on it ;)
[01:07] <mdke> i'll look
[01:11] <nixternal> in node.tpl.php
[01:11] <mdke> where is that?
[01:11] <nixternal> there is a line that has $submitted, comment that out and it should remove it
[01:12] <nixternal> I believe that submitted is the info you are looking to remove
[01:13] <mdke> nothing like that in any of my theme files :(
[01:13] <nixternal> interesting
[01:13] <mdke> I don't have node.tpl.php, unless perhaps the theme includes another theme
[01:14] <nixternal> hrmm, I would think it would have the node, unless $submitted is being called from another file
[01:14] <mdke> I grepped in my theme directory, nothing
[01:16] <nixternal> hrmm, everyone of my themes have the node.tpl.php and the submitted info in there
[01:16] <mdke> AHA
[01:16] <nixternal> found it?
[01:17] <mdke> it's in the global settings bit of themes
[01:17] <mdke> admin/build/themes/settings
[01:17] <nixternal> interesting
[01:17] <mdke> sorry to bother ya
[01:18] <nixternal> hehe, no problem. Getting ready to head to Philosophy & Logic class, yay
[05:29] <jjesse> argh
[05:29] <LaserJock> hi jjesse
[05:29] <jjesse> so one of my images in the official ubuntu chapter was wrong, and now i get to update all the references and all the file names :(
[05:29] <jjesse> hiya LaserJock
[05:29] <LaserJock> fun
[05:32] <jjesse> microsoft word is such a better program then open office, i'm sorry to say
[05:33] <LaserJock> yep
[05:33] <LaserJock> PowerPoint is the bomb too
[05:36] <jjesse> i agree w/ that one as well
[05:36] <jjesse> how are things going LaserJock long time no talk
[05:36] <LaserJock> I'm incredibly busy as usual
[05:37] <jjesse> me 2, i'm trying to leave on vacation but can't utnil i get this ##&%#% chapter finished
[06:29] <nixternal> jjesse: you got that chapter straightened out?
[06:29] <nixternal> I created a spec to help us clean up the tbh for 7.10 as well
[06:29] <jjesse> still finishing, how do you setup autologin?
[06:29] <jjesse> cool subscribe me
[06:29] <nixternal> will do
[06:29] <nixternal> autologin for?
[06:29] <nixternal> KDE?
[06:29] <jjesse> yeah
[06:29] <jjesse> it was a tip in the chpt, but things have changed in system settings and the tip is now wrong
[06:29] <nixternal> I think I don't know...there is a place to do is in KControl, but I don't know where it is in System Settings
[06:30] <nixternal> I am guessing under the user stuff
[06:30] <jjesse> how do you do it in kcontrol?
[06:30] <jjesse> found it
[06:31] <nixternal> ahh
[06:32] <nixternal> System Settings -> Advanced -> Login Manager -> Convenience
[05:35] <XiXaQ> How do I edit the pages on https://help.ubuntu.com/6.10/ubuntu/desktopguide?
[10:40] <Burgwork> jono: you pinged?
[10:40] <jono> Burgwork: ahhh its cool, sorted it now :)
[10:40] <Burgwork> ok
[10:57] <freshblueO2> Hello. I'm going through the 7.04 Sever documentation. I'm wondering if i can help out by correcting some stuff in exchange for some help on other issues.
[11:00] <freshblueO2> The section of Version Control Systems is not really working out. I've tried SVN and CVS and I'm hoping someone can help me out on this.
[11:02] <freshblueO2> There are some new things in the postgresql section that need correcting. And there are a couple things in the postfix section that are different as well.
[11:14] <freshblueO2> Hello abcde.... Do you have anytime to help out?
[11:27] <mdke> freshblueO2: hi there. We are quite keen on gaining new contributors, and the server material in particular is in need of well-informed help! Would be great if you can help out
[11:30] <freshblueO2> Thanks :) And now, i might be needing to go. When can we resume?
[11:31] <mdke> freshblueO2: mailing list? also the link to my blog on the wiki has some notes on how to contribute
[11:31] <mdke> on the wiki/in the topic
[11:35] <freshblueO2> OK. I've got to take off now. I'll try to read up more about this tonight/tommarrow. I Look foward to talking more. Thanks
[11:37] <mdke> bye


[08:56] <borntraeger> xnox, regarding machines types 1.1.1 is somewhere in between 2.4 and 2.5, so please do not provide these machine type names for ubuntu/debian


[07:07] <diplo> Morning all
[08:24] <popey> Morning
[08:27] <JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Dump the Pump Day and happy World Refugee Day! :-)
[08:29] <Laney> dump the pump!?!?
[08:30] <mungbean> wonders if JamesTait does this manually or there's a web scarper for him
[08:31] <mungbean> s/ar/ra
[08:32] <dogmatic69> mysql workbench on 13.04 is a bit broken. http://i.imgur.com/QS6pdxd.png
[08:32] <JamesTait> mungbean, I really should script it, but no, I just check the two web pages myself and pick one that looks interesting.
[08:32] <dogmatic69> any idea what is going on there?
[08:32] <dogmatic69> I have tried a few versions now and all doing the same.
[08:32] <mungbean> obligatory xkcd about scripts
[08:51] <dwatkins> this one, mungbean? http://xkcd.com/974/
[08:56] <diplo> Learning bzr at the mo, so basically I've created a repo on my local PC using init-repo called python-scripts/trunk
[08:57] <diplo> Decided I want to have a main server that's always on in headoffice to host
[08:57] <diplo> I've installed bzr on there, want to push my initial commits from my local PC to there
[08:58] <diplo> Do I need to init a repo on the remote box, or bzr clone from the remote box from my repo ?
[09:18] <brobostigon> good morning everyone,
[09:59] <davmor2> Morning all
[10:12] <czajkowski> davmor2: *pokes*
[10:14] <davmor2> czajkowski: I got something here for you...../me digs around in his pocket for bit..................................../me produces a  PROD! from his pocket
[10:15] <Gary> a prod, umm sure
[10:15]  * Gary prods davmor2
[10:15] <Gary> giggity
[10:39] <MartijnVdS> cattle prod?
[10:50] <TheOpenSourcerer> Who said "Cattle Prod"? https://twitter.com/opensourcerer/status/347667649204994048/photo/1
[11:14] <davmor2> MartijnVdS: no I'm not that cruel, well not currently anyway, I'll wait till she really annoys me for that :)
[12:20] <mungbean> its funny to see people from this irc channel commenting on reddit with the same names
[12:20] <mungbean> seems out of place
[12:20] <popey> hah
[12:22] <mungbean> notice BigRedS_  and directhex there
[12:22] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: Reddit names tend to be more.. vulgar
[12:23] <mungbean> potato_in_my_anus
[12:23] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: that's you?
[12:23] <mungbean> no lol
[12:23] <directhex> why's it odd? directhex is my identity on the webs.
[12:24] <mungbean> dunno why, i expect reddit to be more anonymous
[12:24] <MartijnVdS> directhex: but it's not vulgar and/or offensive!
[12:24] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: "back in the day" reddit was just like any other site you need a username for..
[12:24] <mungbean> suddenly by associating it with a known nom-de-plume gives it connections to other sites
[12:25]  * MartijnVdS dusts off his "5 year club" trophy
[12:25] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: I think I know your reddit username though ;)
[12:25] <mungbean> i have a lot
[12:25] <mungbean> i do have one connected with this irc , yes
[12:26] <mungbean> (theyreby negating my argument) but i have 3 others,
[12:26] <MartijnVdS> mungbean: you're cationbot! :)
[12:26] <MartijnVdS> (not the lack of 'p')
[12:27] <mungbean> seems to have only UPPERCASE letters
[12:28] <directhex> mungbean, i never said it was my *only* reddit account
[12:28] <directhex> mungbean, there's also the one i use for posting naked pictures...
[12:28] <mungbean> of course, we all have that
[12:28] <popey> o/
[12:28] <popey> I don't
[12:28] <mungbean> *doesn't either
[12:28] <directhex> you post naked under yoiur main popey account? :o
[12:29] <popey> popeydc
[12:30] <mungbean> dc stands for?
[12:30] <popey> dot com
[12:30] <popey> its what i use when popey is unavailable
[12:31] <popey> my nickname was in fact popey dot com before it was popey, oddly
[12:32] <Gary> popey, where are these pictures you tempt me with?
[12:32] <mungbean> eww
[12:33] <directhex> lol
[12:34] <mungbean> i haven't been out in the garden for a couple of weekends and the grass is > 3ft high
[12:34] <dwatkins> popey: broken link on there to http://uk.linkedin.com/in/popey
[12:39] <mungbean> changed some cleartype settings on my laptop and can't reverse them or reset to defaults :(
[12:39] <mungbean> turning off is terrible too
[12:40] <popey> dwatkins: where?
[12:42] <dwatkins> popey: IT professional, iirc
[12:42] <popey> dwatkins: no, i mean where is the link?
[12:42] <dwatkins> oh, on your homepage eluded to above
[12:42] <dwatkins> the one with the dictionary-like display
[12:43] <popey> ah
[12:43] <popey> ta
[12:43] <dwatkins> welcome :)
[12:43] <popey> \o/ fixed
[12:44] <dwatkins> I like your fix, too.
[12:44] <popey> ☻
[12:45] <dwatkins> not sure if unicode circle or some other character
[12:45] <popey> smiley
[12:46] <dwatkins> I blame iTerm2 for getting it wrong.
[12:46] <mungbean> WFM
[12:46] <dwatkins> ...or possibly OS X
[12:49] <shauno> it works here, it just looks like a solid dot at most sensible sizes
[12:50] <MartijnVdS> 😂
[12:51] <shauno> ☺ seems to work better because it has an empty fill instead of a solid fill
[12:51] <popey> the woman behind the ouya has freaky coloured eyes
[12:52] <dwatkins> interesting, if I copy & paste the character into TextWrangler, it displays correctly as a face.
[12:52]  * dwatkins unhibernates his Ubuntu vm
[12:53] <shauno> WFM in iterm, just the features are barely perceivable
[12:53] <popey> 40 quid for another ouya controller
[12:53] <mungbean> how much is the device
[12:53] <mungbean> 99£?
[12:53] <MartijnVdS> popey: PS3 controllers are €60 here
[12:54] <MartijnVdS> 😒
[12:54] <dwatkins> popey's original smiley looks fine from Ubuntu terminal/ssh/irssi, of course
[12:55] <shauno> http://cl.ly/image/122s3M1V0Y1s   it's there, it's just useless at that size :(
[12:55] <mungbean> i have small text in this sesh
[12:56] <mungbean> ctrl - 2 or 3 times from a normal terminal for irc
[12:57] <popey> yes mungbean
[12:57] <popey> http://www.game.co.uk/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/HubArticleView?hubId=214785&articleId=214786&storeId=10151
[12:57] <popey> 99 in game
[12:57] <popey> inc one controller
[12:57] <mungbean> oh, they sell them in shiops?
[12:57] <mungbean> if i had a proper telly i would get one
[12:57] <popey> starts selling next week
[12:58] <mungbean> only scart in mine
[12:58] <popey> so I hear
[12:58] <mungbean> cool
[12:59] <mungbean> at the casual end of gaming
[12:59] <mungbean> what video out , only hdmi?
[13:00] <popey> yes
[13:00] <popey> not a great selection of launch titles
[13:01] <popey> the fact that it runs N64 emulator is nice though ☻
[13:04] <mungbean> so it can run standard android market games?
[13:04] <mungbean> and if i've bought them on my tablet already?
[13:04] <popey> not that i can see so far
[13:05] <popey> unless you get the apk and "side load" (ick)
[13:05] <mungbean> no to 1) or 2)?
[13:05] <mungbean> or both :(
[13:05] <popey> same question phrased differently really
[13:05] <popey> however, it has a micro-usb port
[13:05]  * popey looks for a cable and adb
[13:05] <dwatkins> I hate the phrase "side load", but I hear it all the time in relation to iOS
[13:05] <popey> i hate the phrase
[13:06] <BigRedS_> what is side loading? It was all over the comments for an app I was looking at the other day
[13:06] <mungbean> can you browse the regular android market from ouya and install apps?
[13:06] <dwatkins> http://www.itworld.com/personal-tech/358540/how-side-load-apps-ouya-console for anyone not already on this page
[13:06] <popey> no
[13:06] <mungbean> BigRedS_: popping the apk onto the device , bypassing app store
[13:07] <mungbean> liek what you do if you wanted to run asus supernote on a non asus tablet
[13:07] <ali1234> is this ouya?
[13:07] <popey> yes
[13:07] <mungbean> has anyone released ouyabunu?
[13:07] <ali1234> does it run the humble bundle android stuff?
[13:07] <popey> hah
[13:07] <mungbean> ouyabuntu
[13:08] <mgdm> that reads like you've just stubbed your toe
[13:08] <ali1234> ubuntu port should be pretty easy with libhybris
[13:09] <popey> the standard android settings screen is somewhat limited
[13:09] <popey> can't even turn on usb debug it seems
[13:09] <ali1234> wat
[13:09] <ali1234> how do you develop games for it then?
[13:09] <popey> oh, no
[13:09] <popey> i didnt scroll far enough ☻
[13:10] <Gary> popey, when are you going to release a version of ubuntuphone for the mako? :p
[13:10] <popey> its already out Gary
[13:10] <Gary> O_O  isitwootwhereiwantit
[13:10] <popey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install#Supported_devices_and_codenames
[13:10] <popey> the preview anyway
[13:10] <popey> hmm, how do you make "adb devices" show it?
[13:11] <popey> its in about device, then tap the jellybean isnt it?
[13:11] <BigRedS_> mungbean: oh. The tone of the comments made it sound like something rather more complex than that. Ta!
[13:11] <ali1234> make sure to accept the key
[13:11] <ali1234> tapping the versions enables developer mode which enables usb debugging etc
[13:11] <Gary> oh balls, I need a second mako
[13:11] <ali1234> a few of the versions unlock different things but i forgot which one does what
[13:12] <ali1234> just keep tapping everything in that menu
[13:12] <popey> hmm
[13:13] <popey> doesn't seem to do it the same as on my nexus devices
[13:13] <ali1234> well probably not
[13:13] <ali1234> just wait for someone to make a custom firmware for it?
[13:15] <Azelphur> Ended up buying that HP Microserver I mentioned yesterday :)
[13:15] <ali1234> http://d3nevzfk7ii3be.cloudfront.net/igi/F2OfDQWwAuJGNtWh.huge
[13:15] <ali1234> i bet J3 is a serial debug port
[13:15] <Azelphur> by the time you add up the cashback, selling the internal HDD/RAM, it almost costs nothing
[13:15] <popey> http://forums.ouya.tv/discussion/1380/recovery-mode
[13:15] <popey> lengthy discussion about it
[13:16] <ali1234> yeah confirmed
[13:16] <ali1234> RX doesn't work? there will be an empty SMT pad nearby where you solder in a 0 ohm resistor
[13:17] <popey> i haven't opened it up
[13:17] <popey> interesting that most of the games that are at launch are made with the free version of unity, rather than the paid version
[13:18] <ali1234> where can i buy one for bitcoins?
[13:18] <popey> wonder if there is a correlation between that and the low quality of tha games
[13:18] <ali1234> lol
[13:18] <ali1234> the games are low quality?
[13:18] <ali1234> but can't you play any android game on it?
[13:19] <ali1234> like GTA 3?
[13:19] <popey> maybe, i see no way to install that
[13:19] <popey> it has its own storefront, not play store
[13:20] <popey> and the device doesn't "know" my google account
[13:20] <ali1234> what is the deal with the free version of unity? what's the licensing on that?
[13:20] <popey> most of the games seem modded for ouya, they mention ouya buttons or show a picture of the controller
[13:20] <ali1234> or, why does anyone pay for it if there is a free verion?
[13:20] <popey> there's more features in the pay one
[13:20] <popey> there's a comparison on their site
[13:20] <ali1234> i see
[13:21] <popey> also, the free one shows a splash screen, which gives it away they used the free one
[13:21] <ali1234> yeah
[13:21] <ali1234> are these third party games then
[13:21] <popey> yes
[13:21] <popey> they're almost all limited
[13:21] <popey> time limited or number of runs limited
[13:21] <popey> so you have to pay to continue to play
[13:21] <ali1234> lol
[13:22] <ali1234> but they're not very good anyway?
[13:22] <popey> most, yeah
[13:22] <popey> a few are fun
[13:22] <popey> there's some usual ones like canabalt
[13:23] <popey> ..which only lets you play 5 times
[13:25] <dwatkins> I think I have that on pretty much every device I own.
[13:25] <popey> ahh, 5 goes per day
[13:25] <popey> it told me to upgrade or come back tomorrow
[13:25] <dwatkins> does it do Netflix, Lovefilm or anything similar, though?
[13:26] <popey> not yet
[13:26] <popey> well, not figured out how yet
[13:27] <dwatkins> well, if it officially does Netflix (which shouldn't be difficult, assuming Netflix allow this) that will be a major selling point
[13:27] <mungbean> just tried that game
[13:27] <mungbean> killed my eyes
[13:27] <ali1234> that's the building jumping game right?
[13:27] <mungbean> yes
[13:27] <mungbean> its like we've gone back to 1984
[13:27] <mungbean> with mars lander on acron electron
[13:28] <ali1234> i had that game
[13:28] <ali1234> it was really hard
[13:28] <dwatkins> mungbean: I still have a working BBC Micro ;)
[13:28] <dwatkins> (in fact, I have two, one's a B+)
[13:28] <mgdm> \o/
[13:29] <popey> i really like that game
[13:29] <ali1234> ah, the starter pack
[13:29] <mgdm> I know someone who had one with a dead motherboard, she was busy building a gizmo to convert the original keyboard to PS/2 so she could put an Atom board inside it
[13:29] <mgdm> wonder if she finished it
[13:29] <popey> although I have paid for it at least twice I think
[13:29] <popey> so ruluctant to pay again on ouya
[13:29] <ali1234> well sideload the HiB app then?
[13:29] <dwatkins> I'm waiting for the DataCentre from RetroClinic to be available again so I can start using the B+
[13:29] <dwatkins> http://www.retroclinic.com/acorn/datacentre/datacentre.htm
[13:30] <mungbean> i have a acorn a3000 and electron somewhere
[13:30] <popey> yeah, should do
[13:30] <ali1234> you know what HiB reminds me of
[13:30] <mungbean> MiB?
[13:30] <mungbean> play it again sam?
[13:30] <ali1234> you know when they used to send those book club leaflets to schools every few months
[13:30] <mungbean> chip club
[13:30] <popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ChX5s4Qy3Kw
[13:31] <popey> pc games on ouya via remote control
[13:31] <mgdm> ali1234: heh, yes
[13:31] <ali1234> and the books rotated each time, but then they had the most popular old ones on the back
[13:31] <ali1234> so if you missed it you could get it still
[13:32] <ali1234> i got those type-in game books from that
[13:32] <ali1234> never managed to type in the whole game
[13:32] <mungbean> typed them in regularly from electron user
[13:32] <mungbean> my sister reading and me typing
[13:33] <ali1234> these were loooooong
[13:33] <mungbean> the 6502 assembler ones were fun
[13:33] <ali1234> and my nan never understood you have to read exactly what it says like capital letters and punctuation
[13:33] <ali1234> lol
[13:33] <mungbean> debugging typos took 2x longer than the first pass of typing
[13:34] <mungbean> i never had them working perfectly
[13:34] <mungbean> ok its drawn the grand prix circuit but where are the cars
[13:34] <mungbean> i learned a lot about coding from that
[13:36] <popey> i remember typing in something from a CPC magazine. It said there was a BASIC compiler inside the ROM and you just needed some machine code to bootstrap it, and make your BASIC run faster as machine code..
[13:36] <popey> typed it all in, saved to tape, loaded it, ran it, it asked for a BASIC thing to compile, then spat out a binary on tape
[13:36] <popey> took ages
[13:36] <popey> then when you load the resulting machine code you get..
[13:36] <popey> "APRIL FOOL!"
[13:36] <mungbean> argh
[13:37] <mungbean> april fools shold never be more than 10 lines
[13:37] <dwatkins> lol
[13:37] <mgdm> popey: hah! gits
[13:37] <mungbean> i remember the acron user one was getting colour on your b/w TV
[13:37] <popey> hah
[13:37] <popey> sinclair user did one of them for the zx81 too
[13:37] <mungbean> i was about 8, told my dad, he was sceptical
[13:38] <mungbean> learned a lesson that day
[13:38] <mungbean> typed it out, dad was right
[13:39] <mgdm> popey: got a minute for a PM?
[13:42] <ali1234> does anyone remember a children's book series about pirates?
[13:43] <mungbean> hmm
[13:43] <popey> mgdm: of course
[13:43] <ali1234> there was probably about 20-30 books, each one fairly short, like 20 pages
[13:43] <mgdm> popey: OK - 2 mins
[13:43] <mungbean> not captain pugwash?
[13:43] <ali1234> no.
[13:43] <ali1234> and not the one where the kid enters a painting of a pirate ship
[13:43] <mungbean> they had a lot of books, 32pages
[13:44] <ali1234> this was a continuing story across all the books
[13:44] <ali1234> each one ended on a cliff hanger
[13:45] <popey> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ouya_software
[13:45] <ali1234> but the catch is they were graded for reading level
[13:45] <popey> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griffin_Pirate_Stories
[13:45] <ali1234> YES
[13:45] <popey> ☻
[13:45] <ali1234> that's it, nice one popey
[13:45] <popey> My google skills are strong.
[13:46] <ali1234> from the same person as roger red hat et al
[13:46] <popey> https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=pirate+children+book+1980
[13:46] <popey> ☻
[13:46] <ali1234> i suspected as much
[13:46] <popey> pics on ebay
[13:46] <popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/The-Stolen-Ship-Griffin-Pirate-Stories-1974-/390609437091?pt=Pre_School_Picture_Books&hash=item5af22301a3
[13:46] <popey> that looks familiar
[13:47] <ali1234> hmm i recognise the design of the title but not sure about that cover
[13:47] <ali1234> "The Breaking of the Chain" that sounds *really* familiar
[13:48] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raid_on_the_Medway ?
[13:48] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: we have lots of streets named after Michiel de Ruyter (who "broke the chain") ;)
[13:48] <ali1234> nah this was a literal chain that the pirate had to break... with a magic knife iirc
[13:48] <ali1234> but yeah obviously inspired by this event
[13:49] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: this was also a literal chain, blocking the harbor
[13:49] <MartijnVdS> ali1234: or the river, or whatever
[13:49] <ali1234> this was a chain that had chained him to somehting... like a rock on an island where he was stranded after the mean pirates stole his ship or somehting
[13:49] <MartijnVdS> ah
[13:50] <ali1234> but hey this was like 25 years ago... i could be totally misremembering
[13:51] <ali1234> "the griffin" also had a literal griffin in it ... on the cover even iirc
[13:51] <ali1234> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Griffin-Pirate-Stories-Breaking-McCullagh/dp/0560005520
[13:51] <ali1234> yup
[13:54] <ali1234> oh wow, the pirate books with the silver pirate ship are also by the same person
[13:54] <ali1234> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buccaneers_%28series%29
[13:55] <ali1234> pretty much every book i ever read in infant and primary school was written by this person. crazy
[14:05] <ali1234> http://thumbs2.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mucjCI7zx7ooUSHjjgCzQiw.jpg dat griffin...
[14:09] <mungbean> bodes well for getting my colleagues to turn main lights off in here, as there's a couple of mac users
[14:09] <mungbean> strip lighting + mac = glare
[14:09] <mungbean> no lighting = relaxed mungbean
[14:20] <dwatkins> I don't switch on the lights in the morning in the office, as it's much nicer when it's a bit dark
[14:35] <shauno> I like doing that when I have early shifts.  letting sunrise happen on its own seems to hurt less than flooding the floor with fluorescent lights
[14:36] <dwatkins> sunrise is currently at about 5am here, though
[14:37] <shauno> heh, yeah, it doesn't work so well at the moment.  but it won't be long :/
[14:38] <dwatkins> I wish I lived nearer the equator sometimes, but then I look out the window and see the hills around here.
[14:38] <neuro> WHAT'S UP DUDES!
[14:39] <mgdm> THE SKY
[14:39] <dwatkins> Your capslock key certainly isn't ;)
[14:39] <neuro> \O/
[14:39] <neuro> it never really gets dark up here this time of year
[14:39] <neuro> i was out at midnight last night and there was still a tinge of blue in the sky
[14:39] <dwatkins> whereabouts are you, neuro?
[14:39] <neuro> sky starts getting light at about 3-3:30am
[14:40] <neuro> dwatkins: just NE of glasgow
[14:40] <dwatkins> I'm in Edinburgh
[14:40] <neuro> and it's proper daylight by 6ish
[14:40] <neuro> dusk doesn't really start happening until about 10pmish
[14:40] <dwatkins> most days I get woken by the sun at 5am
[14:40] <dwatkins> yeah, it's still warm untii then, too
[14:41] <neuro> my lounge and upstairs bedrooms are south facing
[14:41] <neuro> so you can see the light through the curtains by about 4am
[14:41] <neuro> well, i say south facing
[14:41] <neuro> more like SE-facing
[14:42] <neuro> and of course in six months it'll be equally mental
[14:42] <dwatkins> I'm considering putting solar panels on my bedroom window, or next to it
[14:42] <neuro> hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
[14:42] <neuro> *breathe*
[14:42] <neuro> hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
[14:42] <neuro> solar panels
[14:42] <neuro> in scotland
[14:42] <neuro> you're a funny guy :)
[14:43] <dwatkins> you've seen the weather we're having
[14:43] <dwatkins> it's superb
[14:43] <ali1234> it's raining here
[14:43] <neuro> yeah, we get this for like maybe 10-20 days
[14:43] <neuro> a year
[14:43] <dwatkins> I don't need much power for my phone, anyway
[14:43] <neuro> and in the winter when the sun is out, it's only out for about 15 minutes, then it smegs off again
[14:43] <dwatkins> I reckon a 20 Watt panel will charge a battery that'll charge at least one phone, if not more.
[14:44] <neuro> *rises* "oh hello everyone, blimey, bit parky today, innit, right, my work here is done, see you tomorrow" *sinks*
[14:44] <neuro> scumbag solar body
[14:44] <dwatkins> how dare it... oh wait, it's not the sun's fault
[14:44] <neuro> it is, you know
[14:45] <neuro> if it adjusted its gravitational field to permit our orbit to become perfectly circular ...
[14:45] <neuro> and gave us a wee poke to stabilise our rotation ...
[14:46] <neuro> mind you, if our rotational axis was straightened, in this country we'd be screwed
[14:46] <dwatkins> ...most of the animals would be confused
[14:46] <neuro> we'd end up getting charbroiled
[14:52] <neuro> 18 URLs active,  7436 URLs queued, 160507 URLs checked, runtime 1 hour, 5 minutes
[14:52] <neuro> 20 URLs active,  7447 URLs queued, 160612 URLs checked, runtime 1 hour, 5 minutes
[14:52] <neuro> scumbag linkchecker, where the queued URLs just keep goin' up
[15:58] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Network_Video_Interface_Forum
[15:58] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: did you know about that one?
[16:00] <MartijnVdS> a standard to talk to ip cams \o/ :)
[16:05] <dwdorig> Ah, "Open" to anyone willing to shell out large sums of money.
[16:05] <MartijnVdS> still
[16:05] <MartijnVdS> multiple vendors using one standard beats having to implement each vendor's custom protocol
[16:06] <dwdorig> Only if you're allowed to implement that one standard...
[16:07] <MartijnVdS> you might have to reverse-engineer it, but (a) it's a web camera, how hard can it be (possibly h.264, too)
[16:07] <MartijnVdS> (b) it's what we've been doing to talk to network cams forever
[16:10] <MartijnVdS> dwdorig: also http://www.onvif.org/specs/DocMap-2.3.html
[16:10] <MartijnVdS> dwdorig: spex!
[16:14] <MartijnVdS> byzantine specs, but specs
[18:28] <twager> Anyone know if an ISP can read mails in a clients maler
[18:29] <twager> .........Mailer..
[18:29] <Azelphur> twager: whoever owns the mailserver can, yes
[18:29] <Azelphur> if you want safety, the only answer is PGP.
[18:30] <diddledan_> or S/MIME
[18:30] <diddledan_> the advantage of S/MIME is more clients support it
[18:31] <diddledan_> and there's a hierarchy of certificate authorities
[18:31] <Azelphur> S/MIME?
[18:31] <diddledan_> the downside is there's a hierarchy of certificate authorities
[18:31] <twager> Thanks for the info..
[18:31] <diddledan_> Azelphur, S/MIME uses a certificate issued by verisign or some such
[18:31] <Azelphur> I see
[18:32] <diddledan_> so it's less peer-to-peer
[18:33] <diddledan_> there have been extensions proposed for GPG-based S/MIME however, but I don't know whether that got standardised at all
[18:35] <diddledan_> the main issue with pgp/gpg is that it still hasn't become widespread - most clients feature it as an optional extra often developed by a third party
[18:45] <AlanBell> humans don't appear to want it
[18:47] <AlanBell> Lotus Notes had a completely integrated public key infrastructure, pretty seamless and solid. Most common request was to ditch the private keys and just have username/password logon and if encryption and signatures were the price to pay then fine
[18:48] <diddledan_> well fooey
[18:49] <AlanBell> I still see people describing a .jpg scan of a signature pasted on to a document as being a "digital signature"
[18:52] <diddledan_> well they're right twice, but still missing the point
[18:52] <diddledan_> it's both a signature and digital
[18:52] <diddledan_> but hardly a "digital signature"
[19:01] <MartijnVdS> With the previous version of Outlook, people kept asking why I sent "empty emails"
[19:01] <MartijnVdS> \o/ PGP/MIME
[19:02] <diddledan_> joy
[19:02] <MartijnVdS> diddledan_: I told them to fix their mail client, still sign my mail
[19:03] <diddledan_> unfortunately I don't have that luxury - I have to deal with governmental types, so I have to not use gpg
[19:03] <MartijnVdS> :(
[19:04] <directhex> Crusader Kings 2 is half off this weekend. I'd be surprised if it's not 75% off for one day between now and monday, though
[19:05] <directhex> it's a half off publisher sale, with game-specific 75% off 1-day sales
[19:05] <MartijnVdS> what kind of game is it?
[19:08] <directhex> i dunno, some strategy nonsense. that's pretty much all Paradox publishes
[19:10] <diddledan_> is susan boyle still recording?
[19:10] <MartijnVdS> diddledan_: probably, why?
[19:10] <MartijnVdS> diddledan_: need a birthday present for an ex?
[19:10] <diddledan_> (she just came on my randomiser)
[19:10] <diddledan_> lol
[19:20] <shauno> my roomba's stuck under my rack.  do I rescue it, or let it learn a lesson?
[19:22] <MartijnVdS> shauno: yes.
[19:25] <diddledan_> I really have too much rubbish on the floor to even consider an autonomous vacuum cleaner
[19:26] <shauno> that was actually my motivation. lil dude's training me
[19:27] <diddledan_> I have a path from here to the bathroom - that's all I need, right?
[19:28] <shauno> it helps if you can answer the door before the pizza dude figures he's got the wrong address
[19:28] <diddledan_> :-)
[19:28] <diddledan_> pizza dude
[19:28] <diddledan_> good idea
[19:28] <diddledan_> :-p
[19:29] <MartijnVdS> diddledan_: have you been featured on the "Hoarders" TV show? ;)
[19:29] <diddledan_> MartijnVdS, not that I'm aware, but they could easily hide in here without me knowing :-p
[19:30] <shauno> but if we do have any crazy inventors, I would suggest the next leap in autonomous housekeeping would be a robot that can track down cutlery and deliver them to the dishwasher
[19:31] <diddledan_> the laundrobot would be awesome, too
[19:31] <diddledan_> picks up random discarded clothing from wherever it landed
[19:31] <shauno> havint rescued socks from the roomba, I'm not sure I'd be an early-adopter on that one
[19:31] <diddledan_> lol
[20:36] <mungbean> someone do me a favour, go to www.google.co.uk while signed in to google
[20:36] <mungbean> type a word, e.g. arsenal
[20:36] <mungbean> look at url
[20:37] <mungbean> what's all that gubbins?
[20:41] <AlanBell> mungbean: same as it does on maps now
[20:42] <AlanBell> it updates the location to a url with all the information to retrieve the page you are on, bit odd
[20:42] <mungbean> its much longer via the webpage
[20:42] <mungbean> than via ctrl-k
[20:43] <mungbean> #sugexp=crnk_timediscountb&gs_rn=17&gs_ri=psy-ab
[20:43] <mungbean> etc
[20:44] <brobostigon> /win 1
[20:44] <mungbean> apparently a bearded lady is appearing on question time
[20:44] <popey> it's always done that for me
[20:45] <diddledan_> popey, the bearded lady?
[20:46] <popey> google
[20:46] <popey> url is always had guff in it
[20:48] <mungbean> LOL
[20:49] <mungbean> http://www.thatvideosite.com/v/9531/drunk-girl-ruins-wedding
[20:49] <mungbean> you know whats gonna happen
[20:49] <mungbean> but i still LOLled
[20:50] <mungbean> ah,,,scrap that...it was fake
[20:50] <mungbean> i'll never trust the internet again :(
[21:05] <popey> directhex: is monogame used much in commercial games?
[21:06] <directhex> popey, pretty much any XNA game nowadays is really using monogame.
[21:07] <directhex> you can't publish xna games to the win8 app store, but you can publish monogame games, as an example
[21:07] <directhex> also playstation vita/ps4 games
[23:07] <dogmatic69> Anyone seen apps that show all text like blocks □□□□□□ (13.04)
[23:07] <dogmatic69> I have mysql workbench doing this and could really do with it working properly :(
[23:10] <daftykins> sounds like character set / locale issues
[23:10] <dogmatic69> so far this is the only one I had a problem with
[23:10] <dogmatic69> tried various versions
[23:11] <dogmatic69> I don't know anything about locale settings being English and all :D
[23:11] <dogmatic69> never used them
[23:11] <dogmatic69> its only parts of it...
[23:12] <dogmatic69> the important parts though.. menus are displaying ok
[23:12] <daftykins> i don't know the program nor use desktop ubuntu sadly
[23:13] <daftykins> it's a GUI program i take it?
[23:13] <dogmatic69> yes
[23:14] <dogmatic69> http://i.imgur.com/ChWfBiC.png
[23:14] <dogmatic69> that is the problem
[23:14] <dogmatic69> you can see the lower panel has the correct text, along with the pop up thing
[23:15] <daftykins> wowzer!
[23:15] <daftykins> perhaps it could even be a missing font
[23:16] <daftykins> although weird that the program wouldn't be consistent
[23:16] <dogmatic69> maybe. I did try change all the fonts in the config to helvetica or whatever
[23:16] <daftykins> and that didn't change a thing - or?
[23:16] <dogmatic69> did nothing
[23:16] <daftykins> i take it helvetica is present? :D
[23:18] <daftykins> was your 13.04 install an upgrade or clean?
[23:18] <dogmatic69> clean
[23:25] <daftykins> what happens if you open a terminal and run "locale | pastebinit" ?
[23:25] <dogmatic69> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5785291/
[23:25] <daftykins> alright well at least everythings in English XD
[23:25] <dogmatic69> hehe
[23:25] <daftykins> i wonder if it's worth running this sql workbench from a terminal to see if it gives away any errors?
[23:25] <daftykins> though tbh it's probably fair to say i'm too inexperienced for this one and it might be worth just trying in the more active #ubuntu main channel
[23:25] <dogmatic69> Fontconfig warning: "/etc/fonts/conf.d/50-user.conf", line 9: reading configurations from ~/.fonts.conf is deprecated.
[23:25] <dogmatic69> interesting...?
[23:25] <daftykins> does seem a bit, yeah
[23:25] <dogmatic69> that line it references
[23:25] <dogmatic69> <include ignore_missing="yes" deprecated="yes">~/.fonts.conf</include>
[23:25] <daftykins> how did you install sql workbench?
[23:25] <dogmatic69> apt-get install and download
[23:25] <dogmatic69> various versions, all the same
[23:25] <dogmatic69> it was working on 12.04 before I upgraded
[23:25] <dogmatic69> ha
[23:25] <dogmatic69> fixed it
[23:26] <daftykins> mm?
[23:26] <dogmatic69> this is the file of the error
[23:26] <dogmatic69> http://bin.cakephp.org/view/182432270
[23:26] <daftykins> ooh how handy
[23:26] <dogmatic69> I bought the future forward a bit...
[23:26] <daftykins> so you edited the path? or that's a replacement?
[23:27] <dogmatic69> deleted below the comment
[23:27] <dogmatic69> those two lines
[23:27] <daftykins> ah
[23:27] <dogmatic69> I wonder what else uses that stuff
[23:27] <daftykins> hrmm, it might be handy if you could find someone to contact about that issue
[23:28] <dogmatic69> ubuntu-bug ...
[23:29] <daftykins> no idea ^_^
[23:33] <dogmatic69> daftykins: thanks for pointing me in the right direction
[23:34] <daftykins> my pleasure ^_^
[23:34] <daftykins> not bad considering XD


[13:29] <Guest72555> how do i stop screen saver in lbuntu
[13:30] <leszek> Guest72555: I guess ending the xscreensaver process
[13:31] <Guest72555> The screen saver kicks on and I have to enter password 2 times
[13:33] <Guest72555> OK, thanks. bye
[14:25] <uberjoo> Hmm
[14:26] <uberjoo> I'm hoping to find some direction regarding dual booting Windows and Lubuntu. I've Googled, and it seems to be a common problem with the system automatically booting into Windows after installation with no option to select Lubuntu to boot.
[14:26] <uberjoo> I haven't found a sufficient solution, though. I really am lost. I was hoping someone might shed some light :x