[00:16] <LinDol> Is 16.04 supported Intel Skylake?
[00:56] <craysiii> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=ubuntu-1604-compilers&num=1 it would appear so.
[01:02] <LinDol> lol!!!
[01:04] <LinDol> Thank you :) I am finding the new laptor that has i5 or i7 (skylake core) CPU :) I need to check whether it is supported on Ubuntu GNOME :)
[13:03] <djr013> did a fresh install of 15.10 and I'm tearing my hair out trying to figure out how to set my DPI system wide
[13:04] <djr013> (among other things, but being able to read guides without craning my neck into my screen would help >_>)
[13:05] <djr013> keep getting this despite mucking around in xorg.conf.d and even xinit scripts: intel(0): DPI set to (96, 96)
[13:06] <djr013> xorg says it's not a bug, they hardcode dpi so they can fix your browser for you; hoping someone knows where I can work around this on a system level
[13:20] <djr013> I ask here rather than the bigger ubuntu channel because the solution might be GDM related, I had LightDM related fixes on my last install
[16:26] <djr013> amazing, I managed to screw something up with xorg even after I deleted the xorg.conf.d configs I was attempting to change dpi with
[19:38] <bogusjokes> hi, I'm trying to build gnome-todo on ubuntu 15.10 with gnome-staging ppa but it wont install the -dev packages because they are from the main ubuntu reps
[19:38] <bogusjokes> is their a way to install -dev packages with the packages from gnome-staging ppa?


[00:03] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Just as soon leave as is - what the poster posted.
[00:04] <guiverc> fair enough...  i'm still reading (very slowly though)
[00:13] <Bashing-om> ack
[00:23] <guiverc> looks good Bashing-om
[00:24] <guiverc> ps: Bashing-om, I've asked UCC if we want to list our meeting (mentioned in Monica's post on agenda items) on fridge & uwn; no response yet... do you mind if added (if requested in time)..  meeting 26-sept-2023
[00:25]  * guiverc about to head off (physio appt)
[00:25] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Wow - was somewhat painful getting it together - though I checked it over 3 times - was sure to have missed "something" :D
[00:27] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Sure - I can add the UCC meeting.
[01:57] <Eickmeyer> LGTM. Thanks for mentioning the Ubuntu Studio post. Money is slowly trickling in but it's been just that... a trickle. One person tried calling out that a job should come before our son's education when, in the U.S., a child can be taken if they're not enrolled in school as truancy is considered a form of child neglect in most states.
[02:04] <Bashing-om> Eickmeyer: I do admire that you place your child's welfare before a job. Hang in there. surely something good will happen.
[02:05] <Eickmeyer> I sure hope so. :)
[02:49] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::planet:: Alan Pope: Ringtones on iOS @ https://popey.com/blog/2023/09/ringtons-on-ios/
[20:36] <Bashing-om> UWN: Pulling "WIP
[20:37] <Bashing-om> UWN: Pulling "WIP" - no further edits are known - will start the push soomest.
[20:49] <Bashing-om> UWN: M/L is away - Posting to the Forums next.
[21:00] <Bashing-om> UWN: Posted to the Forums - Doing the Discourse posting next.
[21:12] <Bashing-om> UWN: Posted to Discourse - Making up a Mastodon blog next :D
[21:57] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::omg!ubuntu:: Ubuntu 23.10 Makes Firefox’s Native Wayland Mode Default @ https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2023/09/wayland-firefox-snap-default
[22:02] <Bashing-om> UWN: Mastodon blog done - pending now is release to the other Social Media.
[22:14] <guiverc> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/ubuntu-weekly-newsletter-issue-805/38734/2
[22:14] <guiverc> sorry;   copy didn't work.
[22:14] <guiverc> https://fridge.ubuntu.com/2023/09/18/ubuntu-weekly-newsletter-issue-805/
[22:15] <guiverc> (discourse paste was making up what I'll use shortly for elsewhere...   away briefly for birbs.. back soon to continue)
[22:22] <Bashing-om> Fridge: Spot check -- looks good :D
[22:42] <guiverc> posted uwn 805 to twitter, telegram, (mewe)
[22:43] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Clean/rinse now and prep to repeat ?
[22:43] <guiverc> yep, scrub away Bashing-om
[22:44] <Bashing-om> doing ^ :D
[22:52] <Bashing-om> UWN: We do 806 :D


[01:00] -BottyMcBotFace:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Ubuntu Blog: WSLConf: The first conference dedicated to Windows Subsystem for Linux goes virtual @ https://ubuntu.com/blog/wslconf-the-first-conference-dedicated-to-windows-subsystem-for-linux-goes-virtual
[04:20] -BottyMcBotFace:#ubuntu-news- ::Security:: Episode 65 @ https://ubuntusecuritypodcast.org/episode-65/
[05:07] -BottyMcBotFace:#ubuntu-news- ::Softpedia:: Canonical Cancels Physical Windows Subsystem for Linux Event, Now Online-Only @ https://news.softpedia.com/news/canonical-cancels-physical-windows-subsystem-for-linux-event-now-online-only-529364.shtml (by Bogdan Popa, Microsoft News Editor)
[07:28] -BottyMcBotFace:#ubuntu-news- ::Softpedia:: Red Hat Summit Switches to Online-Only Over Coronavirus Concerns @ https://news.softpedia.com/news/red-hat-summit-switches-to-online-only-over-coronavirus-concerns-529366.shtml (by Bogdan Popa, Microsoft News Editor)
[09:52] -BottyMcBotFace:#ubuntu-news- ::Softpedia:: Microsoft PowerShell 7.0 Now Available for Download on Windows, Linux, and Mac @ https://news.softpedia.com/news/microsoft-powershell-7-0-now-available-for-download-on-windows-linux-and-mac-529369.shtml (by Bogdan Popa, Microsoft News Editor)
[15:59] -BottyMcBotFace:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Ubuntu Blog: Design and Web team summary – 5 March 2020 @ https://ubuntu.com/blog/design-and-web-team-summary-5-march-2020
[17:20] -BottyMcBotFace:#ubuntu-news- ::OMG!Ubuntu:: Zorin OS 15.2 Released, Now Available to Download @ https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/?p=165083 (by Joey Sneddon)
[17:59] -BottyMcBotFace:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Erich Eickmeyer: Putting-On a New Hat @ https://ericheickmeyer.com/2020/03/05/putting-on-a-new-hat/
[18:17] -BottyMcBotFace:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Simos Xenitellis: Using command aliases in LXD to exec a shell @ https://blog.simos.info/using-command-aliases-in-lxd-to-exec-a-shell/


[02:52] <HowdyDoody> On us 33 just outside of Harrisonburg, VA at the outer corner of the high school property is a statue of a GIANT turkey with sign saying welcome to turkey capital of the world.   Made me think the HS mascot was the turkey!.   Its really the largest farm crop of the county.
[02:52] <HowdyDoody> Not all that far from VA tech.
[03:08] <waltman> Harrisonburgh is the home of James Madison U.
[03:08] <waltman> burg
[11:59] <rmg51> Morning
[18:03] <MutantTurkey> anyone have a good get rich quick scheme?
[18:11] <waltman> MutantTurkey: Ponzi scheme?
[18:11] <waltman> Found a new religion?
[18:12] <MutantTurkey> what if I start the pyramid sch4eme
[18:12] <MutantTurkey> or religion
[18:12] <MutantTurkey> I was thinking about that, get a fancy printer, make up some fake prints, sell these prints
[18:12] <MutantTurkey> want to be a priest, a pope or whatnot? want a B.S from BS university? here ya go
[18:13] <MutantTurkey> or I could sell trinkets in magazines
[18:13] <waltman> There's a lot of money to be made in pseudoscience.
[18:14] <MutantTurkey> i know, people are idiots
[18:15] <waltman> I know how to make a small fortune in auto racing.
[18:15] <waltman> You start with a large fortune.
[18:17] <MutantTurkey> I am doing this. this is my idea
[18:18] <MutantTurkey> make pendents from http://symbols.com/... say they are blessed or good luck, sell, profit
[18:18] <MutantTurkey> http://www.symbols.com/encyclopedia/20/207.html
[18:18] <MutantTurkey> venus god of good fortune
[18:19] <MutantTurkey> I just need a 3d printer
[18:20] <MutantTurkey> and an etsy account
[18:28] <MutantTurkey> okay new idea.
[18:28] <MutantTurkey> I get a 3d printer, print new printers and sell the printers
[18:31] <MutantTurkey> like, they sell for 1000 dollars? but it should be cheaper than that to build it (obviously) so i could make them and sell em
[18:34] <MutantTurkey> waltman: does drexel CS have a 3d printer? I just need to print parts for a printer
[18:36] <waltman> MutantTurkey: probably somewhere, but not anywhere I have access to
[18:36] <MutantTurkey> waltman: me neither, I bet engineering has one
[18:36] <MutantTurkey> somewhere
[18:36] <MutantTurkey> or it's hidden under Geoffs desk or something
[22:19] <MutantTurkey> my cube times are going back down
[22:19] <MutantTurkey> floating around 1:12
[22:22] <waltman> cube times?
[22:24] <MutantTurkey> rubiks
[22:31] <waltman> ah
[22:31] <waltman> the 4^3 cube?
[22:31] <MutantTurkey> 3x3'
[22:32] <TheLordOfTime> you know they make a 4x4x4 cube right?
[22:32] <MutantTurkey> got one for xmas ;)
[22:32] <MutantTurkey> mostly the same as the 3x3
[22:32] <TheLordOfTime> bit harder :p
[22:32] <MutantTurkey> well you can percieve it to the be same though
[22:32] <TheLordOfTime> they also have a 5x5x5 cube :P
[22:32] <MutantTurkey> because once you join the centers correctly, and the edges, ther corners are viewed like a 3x3
[22:32] <MutantTurkey> up to 7x7 where it becomes infeasable
[22:33] <TheLordOfTime> do they make 7x7x7?
[22:33] <MutantTurkey> I believe so
[22:33] <TheLordOfTime> damn
[22:33] <waltman> I've never been really good at solving the cube, but 1:12's pretty slow, isn't it?
[22:33] <TheLordOfTime> unless 1min12sec
[22:33] <MutantTurkey> 1 min 12 sec sucks.
[22:33] <MutantTurkey> best time now is like 5 seconds
[22:33] <TheLordOfTime> :P
[22:33] <MutantTurkey> my personal best was 34 seconds
[22:33] <MutantTurkey> but I am lazy and haven't learned efficent methods
[22:34] <MutantTurkey> at all... like it's a miracle i have this far
[22:34] <MutantTurkey> it's half in the hands and half in the brain
[22:34]  * TheLordOfTime sends MutantTurkey an 7x7x7 cube
[22:34] <MutantTurkey> bring it on bitchezzz
[22:35]  * TheLordOfTime has them custom-make a 9x9x9 cube
[22:35] <MutantTurkey> I think they once made a 17x17
[22:35] <TheLordOfTime> i was next going to say 50x50x50 :P
[22:35] <MutantTurkey> but basically after 7x7 it is just not even fun, I have a 5x5 which I hate.
[22:35] <MutantTurkey> the 4x4 is still fun though
[22:35] <MutantTurkey> it has additional parity to make it fun
[22:37] <TheLordOfTime> just hope they dont make a hexagonal puzzle :P
[22:37] <TheLordOfTime> or whatever elsee
[22:37] <TheLordOfTime> or even worse: hope they don't make a spherical puzzle :P
[22:38] <MutantTurkey> they have them
[22:38] <MutantTurkey> very cool and interesting
[22:38] <MutantTurkey> also oddball shape cubes
[22:38] <MutantTurkey> still same rules, but weirdly shaped
[22:45] <MutantTurkey> just got my fsf email "happy GNU year" lol
[22:48] <jedijf> printrbot jr's are like 450 now -
[22:48] <jedijf> assembled
[22:49] <jedijf> 400 in kit http://printrbot.com/shop/printrbot-jr/
[22:51] <jedijf> http://www.makershed.com/Printrbot_Jr_Assembled_p/dspb1.htm
[22:57] <MutantTurkey> thanks
[22:58] <MutantTurkey> jedijf: do they have a standard interface for these things?
[22:59] <MutantTurkey> jedijf: I've seen some diy printers also..


[04:01] <swift110-phone> hey
[15:35] <Skyrider> Is anyone familiar with mouse/keyboard issues? Demo of Lubuntu works fine.. but after installation, mouse/keyboard refuses to work.
[15:58] <sodomy> Skyrider: USB keyboard/mouse?  Try an lsusb -t
[15:58] <sodomy> (from a remote login obviously)
[16:50] <gordonjcp> ayeup
[16:50] <gordonjcp> what's the minimum amount of space that it's possible to install Lubuntu on?
[17:29] <Skyrider> sodomy: indeed, USB.
[17:29] <Skyrider> is remote enabled by default?
[17:29] <wxl> Skyrider: nope. just boot up with a live cd/usb.
[17:30] <Skyrider> live/demo works.
[17:30] <Skyrider> It's the full installation which is the issue.
[17:30] <wxl> right so use lsusb to get information
[17:30] <Skyrider> I'm lost ^^.
[17:31] <wxl> there have been no reports about the keyboard/mouse not working
[17:31] <wxl> therefore, it is highly likely that you have a particular set of hardware that others don't have
[17:31] <wxl> so in order to troubleshoot the problem, we need more information
[17:31] <wxl> lsusb provides said information
[17:31] <Skyrider> Ah.. I get it.. I just thought you wanted to get some information that I can't type on the lubuntu having the issue :p
[17:32] <wxl> nope
[17:32] <Skyrider> So.. lsusb -t, brb.. rebooting into live mode.
[17:32] <wxl> if you want easy access to remote just install ssh
[17:34] <Skyrider> Currently on windows.
[17:44] <Skyrider> wxl: http://imgur.com/FRL0XnF
[17:45] <Skyrider> Still weird that live works perfectly.
[17:52] <wxl> Skyrider: um, hate to be a pain, but could you pastebin that?
[17:54] <Skyrider> No can do.
[17:54] <Skyrider> I have to keep switching os's.
[17:54] <wxl> lsusb -t | pastebinit (install pastebinit if you haven't already)
[17:58] <Skyrider> cant view image?..
[17:59] <wxl> images are difficult to deal with when dealing with text; also it seems that some text is missing
[17:59] <Skyrider> That is the complete info that lsusb gave.
[18:04] <wxl> so you have an input devices that's attached to a hub that's attached to a hub that's attached to a hub ???
[18:05] <Skyrider> keyboard/mouse -> hub -> pc.
[18:05] <Skyrider> no other hubs in between.
[18:05] <wxl> does the keyboard have a hub in it?
[18:06] <wxl> i.e. is the mouse connected to the keyboard?
[18:06] <Skyrider> Nope. Both seperated
[18:06] <Skyrider> **separated
[18:06] <wxl> how bizarre. that tree is nuts.
[18:07] <wxl> what happens if you get rid of the hub and connect straight to the pc?
[18:07] <Skyrider> I see..
[18:07] <Skyrider> Keyboard has USB connections.
[18:07] <Skyrider> Never really, knew.. lol
[18:07] <Skyrider> First time I'm finding this out.
[18:07] <wxl> ok that makes sense then, sheesh
[18:08] <Skyrider> Wonder why I never noticed this.
[18:11] <Skyrider> Using Mouse in keyboard to pc connection now, removed the hub..
[18:11] <Skyrider> lets see if that works.
[18:12] <Skyrider> Weird if it does though.. linux mint had no issues with the keyboard/mouse, and its the same os.
[18:13] <wxl> well, potential difference in kernel
[18:17] <Skyrid3r> Weird stuff, still nothing
[18:18] <Skyrid3r> .Strangest thing is.. even the network is disconnected.
[18:18] <Skyrid3r> Live version works fine though
[18:18] <wxl> well it might be a broadcom chip
[18:18] <wxl> they usually require more oeffort in the installed version
[18:18] <Skyrid3r> I'm pretty sure I tagged the download stuff at installation.
[18:19] <Skyrid3r> inc, third party.
[18:19] <wxl> yeah that doesn't necessarily mean anything unfortunately
[18:19] <wxl> you can use `lspci -nnk` to figure out what chip you have and what kernel module it's using
[18:19] <wxl> if it's broadcom you'll need this—
[18:19] <wxl> !b43
[18:23] <Skyrid3r> Why would the packages differ from live / installed version?
[18:24] <Skyrid3r> I mean, if it 'works' on the live version.. wouldn't you expect that those things also work on the installed version?
[18:24] <wxl> there is occassionally a bit of a difference. updates account for some of that. it could certainly be a regression that causes a problem
[18:24] <Skyrid3r> I doubt I installed it incorrectly ^^, I had linux mint installed.. wiped that partition and installed Lubuntu over it.
[18:25] <wxl> yeah i don't think you did anything wrong for sure
[18:25] <wxl> it's really curious. different ports don't produce different results?
[18:25] <Skyrid3r> 'fraid not.
[18:25] <wxl> what version of lubuntu is this again?
[18:26] <Skyrid3r> 16.04
[18:27] <wxl> i wish you had remote access
[18:27] <wxl> it would be interesting to see if lsusb produces different results in the installed system
[18:27] <wxl> we could also grep the logs at that point
[18:27] <Skyrid3r> Ya, dito... unless I can override it somehow.
[18:27] <wxl> invariably there's a clue there somewhere
[18:28] <wxl> well, you could try to fix the wireless issue
[18:28] <Skyrid3r> ethernet connected.
[18:28] <Skyrid3r> So, not using wireless.
[18:28] <wxl> ah there you go
[18:28] <wxl> so
[18:28] <wxl> 1s
[18:29] <Skyrid3r> ?
[18:29] <wxl> so there's a wiki page that deals with re-installing kernels when you've deleted them all
[18:29] <wxl> you can use this to install your package
[18:29] <wxl> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Documentation/RemoveOldKernels/Problems
[18:30] <Skyrid3r> I don't remember removing any kernels.
[18:30] <wxl> except when you get to installing your kernel, just install the broadcom package
[18:30] <wxl> (instead of the kernel)
[18:30] <wxl> and of course you won't need to update grub
[18:30] <wxl> that is assuming that the package will solve your problem
[18:31] <wxl> first you'll have to see if you have a broadcom chip and fi you do which one so you know which package to install based on:
[18:31] <wxl> !b43
[18:31]  * wxl kicks ubottu
[18:31] <Skyrid3r> Realtek
[18:32] <wxl> oh
[18:32] <wxl> right you have ethernet
[18:32] <wxl> i forgot about that
[18:32] <Skyrid3r> ^_^
[18:32] <wxl> so go through that process and instead of installing the kernel, install `ssh`
[18:32] <Skyrid3r> I do have wireless plugged in, just not using it atm.
[18:32] <wxl> then you can boot to it and you should be able to connect to it over ssh using another computer on the network
[18:33] <wxl> heck you could use your phone :)
[18:34] <wxl> hope that makes sense
[18:37] <Skyrid3r> wth is going on..
[18:37] <Skyrid3r> Oh, ya.. it does.. using debian myself on my pi2.
[18:37] <Skyrid3r> Been working with linux for a few years now.
[18:38] <Skyrid3r> Failed to fetch http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/xenial/InRelease  Temporary failure resolving 'archive.ubuntu.com'
[18:38] <Skyrid3r> When trying to update.
[18:39] <wxl> Skyrider: did you do the resolv.conf trick?
[18:39] <Skyrid3r> Ya, did the complete list up to apt-get install
[18:39] <Skyrid3r> can't install anything without updating the list though.
[18:40] <wxl> i assume you can't ping archive.ubuntu.com?
[18:40] <Skyrid3r> Not from the terminal.
[18:41] <wxl> argh
[18:41] <Skyrid3r> Strange....
[18:41]  * wxl sighs
[18:42] <Skyrid3r> Actually, can't ping anything..
[18:42] <wxl> try disconnecting and reconnecting the ethernet cable and then doing the resolv.conf bit?
[18:43] <Skyrid3r> So that tutorial makes a direct connection with my local installation?
[18:44] <Skyrid3r> Because when I exit the connection, I can ping again.
[18:45] <wxl> correct
[18:45] <wxl> the idea is that since it's not connected, your local installation doesn't have networking set up properly
[18:45] <wxl> so you need to copy over the working configuration from the running system over to the mounted local install in order to get the internet to work when you chroot into the local install
[18:46] <Skyrid3r> Tried copying the file, didn't work though.
[18:46] <Skyrid3r> Why can't the connection make use of the existing network connection I have now on the live version?
[18:46] <wxl> brb
[18:48] <wxl> technically you probably could but it would take some rewriting
[18:49] <wxl> the thing is that the system is set to look for /etc/resolv.conf
[18:49] <wxl> when you mount --bind and chroot, you're making /etc refer to your local install's /etc
[18:49] <wxl> (among other things)
[18:50] <wxl> you might want to make sure you're booted into the live desktop environment and make sure that nm-applet has your connection set up properly first
[18:50] <wxl> and then check the content of the live /etc/resolv.conf
[18:52] <wxl> it should be nothing more than the likes of a nameserver ip (usually <IP_ADDRESS>) and a search domain
[18:56] <wxl> well, actually the search domain is optional and probably not relevant
[19:01] <Skyrider> weird stuff.
[19:04] <charlie_sanders> how Do I tell ubuntu to use my custonm downloaded of JAVA so it's not constantly trying to download a java-runtime ?
[19:05] <wxl> charlie_sanders: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Java#Choosing_the_default_Java_to_use
[19:06] <charlie_sanders> ok, I tried alternatives, let me read that and try again
[19:07] <wxl> charlie_sanders: it's possible that the way you have it installed, maybe it doesn't provide an alternatives option. you'll have to rtfm and figure out how to take care of that. alternately, read the whole page and see if anything there doesn't apply to how you want to install.
[19:07] <charlie_sanders> ugh, it says theres only one choice, and so its the default, but any package that relies on java is trying to download headless-java
[19:07] <charlie_sanders> oh hmm
[19:08] <wxl> oh yeah that's going to be problematic, too.
[19:08] <charlie_sanders> maybe theres a headless java alt
[19:08] <charlie_sanders> yeah, cause I need to tell my _package manager_ that I have a java installed
[19:08] <wxl> you're using Oracle Java?
[19:08] <charlie_sanders> yes
[19:08] <wxl> 7 or 8?
[19:09] <charlie_sanders> 9
[19:09] <charlie_sanders> oops
[19:09] <charlie_sanders> 8
[19:09] <charlie_sanders> i come from the future!
[19:09] <wxl> seems there's a ppa that should solve all your problems
[19:10] <wxl> and keep you from having to manually download and install updates
[19:10] <wxl> http://www.webupd8.org/2012/09/install-oracle-java-8-in-ubuntu-via-ppa.html
[19:10] <wxl> wow it does have 9 in there
[19:10] <wxl> https://launchpad.net/~webupd8team/+archive/ubuntu/java
[19:11] <genii> Yes, 9 has been in there a while now
[19:12] <wxl> last version of 8 was uploaded on the 21st of July, so seems fairly updated
[19:14] <Skyrider> wxl: Is this because lubuntu is so light?
[19:15] <wxl> Skyrider: hahah yeah we eliminate everything XD
[19:15] <Skyrider> Hopefully you know I'm referring to my issue :p
[19:16] <wxl> Skyrider: no, it should be totally unrelated. especially at the kernel level, we're all the same as ubuntu itself.
[19:16] <Skyrider> There must be a difference somewhere.. Linux mint / Lubuntu both use 16.04
[19:17] <wxl> Skyrider: i'm not sure how mint does things. it's possible they might not actually use the lubuntu seeds.
[19:18] <Skyrider> mmmhhh
[19:18] <Skyrider> Weird, weird, weird.
[19:20] <wxl> now there's a question i didn't ask you
[19:20] <wxl> are you absolutely 100% sure that you downloaded and copied the image without failure
[19:20] <wxl> i.e. did you check the hashes?
[19:21] <Skyrider> That, I did not. I just expected it to work properly..
[19:21] <charlie_sanders> wxl: oh ok, thx
[19:21] <wxl> np charlie_sanders
[19:21] <wxl> Skyrider: cuz 1 bit of difference could result in weird inconsistencies
[19:23] <Skyrider> Current usb is at 4.576.088.064 bytes
[19:23] <Skyrider> let me rewrite the image file.
[19:24] <wxl> you should ALWAYS check hashes
[19:24] <wxl> always always always
[19:24] <wxl> of course if you use torrents, that's already done for you
[19:24] <wxl> still, there's the matter of checking the media (which you can do at the grub menu)
[19:24] <Skyrider> Not much of a hash person, as 99% of all time it d/ls correctly :p
[19:25] <wxl> there's that 1%
[19:25] <Skyrider> Very rarely, corrupted installations ^^.
[19:26] <lynorian> Skyrider, but the 1 percent of the time it does finding the problem is really hard
[19:26] <Skyrider> Where's the hash located.
[19:27] <Skyrider> Found the md5.
[19:28] <Skyrider> MD5 checks out.
[19:30] <wxl> now boot the live system and "check the cd for defects"
[19:30] <wxl> man we have to change that language
[20:00] <skyrid3r> meh..
[20:00] <skyrid3r> I apologise.
[20:01] <wxl> Skyrider: copying error?
[20:01] <skyrid3r> wxl: While the MD5 was correct, the writing didn go well to USB.
[20:01] <skyrid3r> I re-did it, and installed.. its working perfectly now.
[20:01] <wxl> skyrid3r: yeah it happens, man, don't sweat it. that's usually the first place to look if things are just *weird*
[20:01] <wxl> skyrid3r: in any case, glad you're all fixed :)
[20:01] <skyrid3r> Indeed ^_^
[20:02] <skyrid3r> still have to get used to this GUI though.
[20:02] <skyrid3r> Dont have a super slow system, but it aint fast either.
[20:02] <skyrid3r> Cinnamon was actually, laggy for me.
[20:02] <wxl> lubuntu's about the best there is from what i've found
[20:03] <wxl> well, lxde
[20:03] <skyrid3r> What do you use for start-menu search?
[20:03] <skyrid3r> Found out it has no function for that.
[20:03] <wxl> you could arch your way to an absolutely perfect system for only what you want
[20:03] <wxl> we don't have anything like that, and i really haven't had the need, so can't speak to it personally
[20:04] <skyrid3r> Alrighty :), I often search stuff through the start menu on w10.
[20:04] <skyrid3r> Easier to find things without blogging my desktop.
[20:06] <skyrid3r> Appreciate all the help btw :)
[20:06] <wxl> np :)
[20:07] <skyrid3r> Will have to reinstall lubuntu later on anyway..
[20:07] <skyrid3r> Currently just installed on a 60gb partition... unless I mount the home to another one in the future
[20:11] <skyrid3r> Familiar with windows wxl ?
[20:12] <wxl> skyrid3r: a bit.
[20:12] <skyrid3r> I believe in windows, the bottom right side mouse is being blocked to go to the second monitor.
[20:12] <skyrid3r> In order to use minimize all function properly.
[20:12] <skyrid3r> Not sure if possible with (l)ubuntu / the GUI.
[20:13] <wxl> tl;dr you want to be able to move the mouse to the bottom right and make it minimize all windows?
[20:13] <skyrid3r> Without it moving to the second monitor, ya.
[20:13] <wxl> yeeeeeah i'm not sure that works or not
[20:14] <wxl> i'm not even sure there's a mouse corners option
[20:14] <skyrid3r> Ugh.. need to change keyboard settings as well.. ' / " not working properly
[20:14] <skyrid3r> Found the minimize all function
[20:14] <skyrid3r> Though it won't revert it
[20:14] <skyrid3r> brb, update on some stuff / nvidia, etc.
[20:26] <exwindows10user> is 14.04.1 out?
[20:26] <wxl> !trusty | exwindows10user
[20:27] <exwindows10user> sorry I just uninstalled Windows :D
[20:27] <exwindows10user> And installed ubuntu, but people keep telling me to try lubuntu because use less resources.
[20:27] <exwindows10user> so what you sent me says, that no, right? 14.04.1 is not out yet
[20:27] <wxl> the more current LTS release is xenial
[20:27] <wxl> !xenial
[20:27] <wxl> exwindows10user: no it says check for point releases at releases.ubuntu.com :)
[20:28] <exwindows10user> I don't get it
[20:28] <exwindows10user> who is ubottu
[20:28] <exwindows10user> it's weird
[20:28] <exwindows10user> ubottu: your links are sending me to ubuntu not lubuntu
[20:29] <wxl> exwindows10user: lubuntu is ubuntu. all of ubuntu's flavors are at release.ubuntu.com
[20:29] <wxl> releases, that is
[20:29] <wxl> to make it real easy for you:
[20:29] <wxl> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/lubuntu/releases/
[20:29] <exwindows10user> but then I must be in the wrong site
[20:29] <exwindows10user> I can't find the 14.04.1 download link
[20:29] <exwindows10user> :/
[20:30] <wxl> 14.04.1 is technically kind of old
[20:30] <wxl> are you sure you don't mean 16.04.1?
[20:30] <exwindows10user> 16.04.1
[20:30] <exwindows10user> Im sorry!
[20:30] <lynorian> yeah the updates would take a while
[20:30] <wxl> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/lubuntu/releases/16.04.1/release/
[20:37] <exwindows10user> wxl and ubottu your help is not really clear
[20:37] <exwindows10user> This is my first time in Linux
[20:37] <exwindows10user> Now I'm really confused
[20:54] <Fr_Dae> thanks wxl
[20:54] <Fr_Dae> i have same the exacte Same on hilm
[20:54] <Fr_Dae> him


[00:01] <MrChrisDruif> I only seemed to have your @ubuntu email. Should be fine I guess ^_^
[02:31] <bkerensa> Mmm Pizza
[03:23] <doctormon> mhall119: GitHub support! http://imagebin.org/196812
[08:01] <dholbach> good morning
[08:15] <dpm> good morning all
[08:16] <benonsoftware> Hello dpm
[08:16] <dpm> hi benonsoftware
[08:17] <dholbach> benonsoftware, happy birthday! :)
[08:17] <benonsoftware> Thanks :p
[08:20] <dholbach> ok, I think I'll take the plunge and take the dog for a walk
[08:20] <dholbach> it's -13°C
[08:20] <bkerensa> hmm
[08:21] <dholbach> if I don't come back you know what happened
[08:21] <bkerensa> wow
[08:21] <bkerensa> thats 8.6 degrees
[08:21] <benonsoftware> lucky
[08:24]  * nigelb waves from a toasty 21 C
[08:25] <alourie> good morning
[08:25] <dholbach> wow, I just had a look, it just seem to be United States, Cayman Islands and Belize who use the Fahrenheit scale - that's not many :)
[08:26] <nigelb> Yeah. Everyone else in the world uses common sense and Celsius :P
[08:26] <bkerensa> heh
[08:27] <nigelb> I just washed my bike 15 minutes back.
[08:27] <nigelb> The sun is hot enough that its completely trdry.
[08:28] <czajkowski> forecastis for -16 this weekend in Brussels
[08:28] <czajkowski> I may in fact curl up and die!
[08:28] <bkerensa> Europe used to use Fahrenheit right?
[08:28] <nigelb> ooh, you're already in Brussels?
[08:29] <bkerensa> see when I see people saying its going to be negative any temp it just gives me goose bumps because I think freezing :D
[08:29] <czajkowski> nope London
[08:30] <dholbach> bkerensa, at least the UK seems to have used it before the 70s (according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celsius)
[08:30] <czajkowski> minus figured do tend to be freezing
[08:30] <nigelb> technically, negative in celsius is freezing.
[08:30] <dholbach> but anyway, I'll go out now - see you in a bit :)
[08:32] <bkerensa> Oh Fahrenheit was invited by a German :D
[10:50] <s-fox> Ping for jcastro when you are around / awake
[10:55] <czajkowski> s-fox: is this re the FC by any chance?
[11:01] <s-fox> Yes czajkowski
[11:02] <czajkowski> s-fox: anything I can help wiht , follwoing the ticket
[11:02] <s-fox> Which ticket czajkowski ? We have 2 issues at the moment. ;)
[11:02] <czajkowski> the sso
[11:03] <s-fox> We were confused by Marks reply on the mailing list. We want to know what is going to happen now regarding SSO vs the security issue we found.
[11:04] <czajkowski> s-fox: the way I read it was jcastro has found someone to work on it and mark was happy about that
[11:05] <s-fox> Have you seen the information regarding the  security & privacy breaches ?
[11:05] <czajkowski> yes
[11:05] <czajkowski> but that is on the same ticket no?
[11:06] <s-fox> Our concern is the privacy of our userbase vs a nice to have feature.
[11:06] <czajkowski> s-fox: it's not just a nice feature, its a necessity though
[11:06] <s-fox> Privacy is not?
[11:06] <czajkowski> I do appeciate the security breach is an issue though
[11:07] <s-fox> 4 administrator accounts have had problems in the last 6 months.
[11:07] <czajkowski> s-fox: is there a ticket specifically about the breach ??
[11:08] <s-fox> I believe the ticket is 16733
[11:08] <s-fox> ticket 19247 is also related to the breach.
[11:09] <czajkowski> thats the one I was asking for
[11:09] <czajkowski> ok
[11:09] <czajkowski> cant view it
[11:09] <czajkowski> let me go and see if I can get more info on it
[11:10] <s-fox> czajkowski,  I have just read marks email to the list.
[11:11] <s-fox> It appears SSO is being put on hold in view of the security issue.
[11:11] <s-fox> Or at least a point upgrade.
[11:15] <czajkowski> s-fox: so it's been looked into
[13:11] <mhall119> morning
[13:15] <mhall119> dholbach: ping
[13:15] <dholbach> mhall119, pong
[13:16] <mhall119> can you merge from lp:~mhall119/+junk/unity-stats/ again?
[13:16] <mhall119> and can you also delete data/unity-patch-bugs on cranberry, that data was bad
[13:17] <dholbach> just a sec
[13:17] <mhall119> thanks
[13:17] <mhall119> oh, and is ./ubuntustats/ in bzr for you?  On my local checkout it's saying it's unknown
[13:18] <dholbach> no, I just branched it into there
[13:18] <dholbach> from ~dholbach/+junk/ubuntustats
[13:19] <dholbach> merged your branch, deleted the file and now running the script for you
[13:19] <mhall119> is there a reason for having it separate?
[13:19] <dholbach> I use it in a couple of other places too
[13:20] <mhall119> but not the udd-sponsoring-stats?
[13:20] <dholbach> err, you mean http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring-stats/?
[13:20] <mhall119> I'm trying to pull your contributor graphs from udd into unity
[13:21] <mhall119> yeah
[13:21] <dholbach> it uses it too
[13:21] <dholbach> but not all parts of it are fully ported to it yet
[13:21] <dholbach> I just keep of running out of time to move everything to it
[13:21] <mhall119> understood
[13:22] <mhall119> mind if I add tools.py from udd-sponsored-stats/stats into unity-stats/ubuntustats?
[13:22] <dholbach> not at all - there should be no conflicts I guess
[13:22] <mhall119> if there are I'll clean them up
[13:23]  * dholbach hugs mhall119
[13:23] <dholbach> one day, maybe during a sprint we can sit together and make it all tidy, tight and nice
[13:24] <dholbach> most graphs were "we need this data and we should have had it yesterday" jobs
[13:24] <dholbach> and I mostly just went back to fix them when they were broken
[13:24] <dholbach> :-/
[13:26] <dholbach> wow, my mouse pointer is moving around on its own
[13:26] <dholbach> what the ...
[13:27] <mhall119> dholbach: I've been thinking of how we can convert it all into a django app
[13:27] <dholbach> that'd be nice indeed
[13:27] <dholbach> with proper logging, so if data sources get broken, we can go back and fix them
[13:27] <mhall119> maybe even unity tests
[13:27]  * mhall119 *gasps*
[13:27] <mhall119> unit,
[13:27] <mhall119> I've got unity on the brain
[13:27] <mhall119> I can't type unit without my fingers adding the y
[13:28] <dholbach> ok, I'll reboot - this is getting weird
[13:30] <dholbach> ok, now I can go back to work :)
[13:36] <mhall119> oh, I have a classroom session in 2.5 hours
[13:40] <alourie> balloons: ping
[13:40] <Pendulum> mhall119: good thing you remembered now?
[13:40] <alourie> balloons: sorry for being MIA a bit, I'm still getting used to the new schedule
[13:41] <mhall119> Pendulum: yeah
[13:42] <mhall119> have a little time to prepare
[13:42] <mhall119> though, I'm not sure what to prepare...
[13:56] <akgraner> pleia2, cjohnston  - sorry I missed the request somewhere (or just spaced it) - I have meetings from 1500 Sunday until (I'm hoping the until doesn't last the entire length of the Super Bowl) - however, I should know more tomorrow and I can let you know then if that's not to late.
[14:13] <james_w> dholbach, hi. So I stupidly booked a dentist appointment for the same time as my developer week session
[14:14] <mhall119> james_w: the anesthetics are going to make for an amusing session, I'm sure :)
[14:22] <cjohnston> hehe
[14:24] <snap-l> Have someone at the dentist office transcribe your talk
[14:24] <nigelb> popey: You're awesome. Just sayin.
[14:25] <snap-l> "And furthermore blarf nargle bip garflnargin"
[14:26] <nigelb> wow. http://www.cmu.edu/homepage/computing/2012/winter/ipad-course.shtml
[14:29] <popey> lol
[14:31] <dpm> james_w, perhaps you can ask some of the guys that come before your session if they'd want to swap. I see seb128, om26er, mhall119, tumbleweed, coolbhavi and jbicha have sessions before your one
[14:31] <james_w> swapping later would be better actually, I'll see if aq doesn't want to go back-to-back
[14:32] <mhall119> I can't swap, I have a call at 1800
[14:49] <dholbach> james_w, or swapping with kirkland maybe?
[14:50] <nigelb> 41
[14:51] <dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek Day 3 (last day) starting in 8 minutes in #ubuntu-classroom
[14:52] <dpm> \o/
[14:54] <dpm> james_w, let me know how the swapping goes, and once you know the new time, I'll announce the session on the ubuntuappdev social media channels
[14:57] <nigelb> AlanBell: Had you seen http://sharejs.org/ yet?
[15:01] <nigelb> dholbach: How does doing shorter UDW feel like? Good? Bad?
[15:01] <dholbach> nigelb, good
[15:01] <dholbach> we had a lot of short topics we could handle very well
[15:01] <nigelb> \o/
[15:01] <nigelb> Buy sil a drink next time you see him :)
[15:02] <nigelb> (I *think* he suggested it)
[15:02] <dholbach> ah nice
[15:02] <dholbach> on the other hand it was quite a bit of work to get the schedule together
[15:02] <nigelb> heh
[15:03] <nigelb> The original idea was
[15:03] <nigelb> 30 mins is easier to sell.
[15:03] <dholbach> yeah, but more slots to fill ;)
[15:07] <jcastro> yeah, all that was sil's idea
[15:07] <jcastro> it's only like 3 more slots, we did the math
[15:08] <nigelb> Oh. right. I remember that now.
[15:08] <jcastro> don't worry, I wouldn't conciously add more work
[15:08] <jcastro> 3 extra sessions is worth dropping 2 days worth imo
[15:08] <nigelb> We should cut down user days too. That should make it easier.
[15:08] <nigelb> jcastro: YES
[15:08] <jcastro> I believe the google term is "less arrows, but more wood behind each one."
[15:08] <nigelb> And it saves weekend!
[15:09] <nigelb> (especially for classroom team)
[15:09] <jcastro> yup
[15:09] <jcastro> plus no monday first thing blam IRC week when you're not even awake yet
[15:09] <nigelb> heh
[15:31] <james_w> dpm, dholbach: schedule updated. kirkland couldn't swap, but aq could
[15:31] <dholbach> james_w, awesome
[15:32] <dpm> james_w, great
[15:32] <dholbach> james_w, all the best with the dentist programme
[15:32] <james_w> thanks
[15:32] <dpm> james_w, now make sure the dentist leaves you in a state you can type at least :)
[15:32] <dholbach> I'm happy for om26er - he just told the audience "I had my first ever date yesterday <3"
[15:32] <nigelb> haha
[15:32] <nigelb> :)
[15:32] <jcastro> hah you know what that means
[15:32] <doctormon> Hey nigelb
[15:32] <jcastro> he'll disappear at some point
[15:33] <nigelb> hey doctormon
[15:33] <nigelb> jcastro: lol
[15:33] <jcastro> remember when robert carr discovered women? He was gone for like 3 years
[15:33] <nigelb> dholbach: So, I joined the Mozilla webdev team when they did an AMA on reddit.
[15:33] <nigelb> One of the questions was "Are women impressed when they hear you're part of mozilla dev team"
[15:34] <dholbach> I guess it very much depends on the type of women
[15:34] <dholbach> some impressed, some depressed, I guess
[15:34] <nigelb> Yeah, we had fun answering that question :)
[15:34] <nigelb> http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/oonrg/iama_member_of_the_mozilla_webdev_team_ama/c3itqoz
[15:34] <doctormon> nigelb: Collectively or on average?
[15:35] <jcastro> cjohnston: mhall119: nigelb: You guys have seen this right? http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap/
[15:35] <cjohnston> interesting
[15:35] <cjohnston> i hadnt
[15:35] <nigelb> jcastro: already using it at work.
[15:35] <jcastro> ah excellent
[15:36] <jcastro> just making sure someone knew it was there
[15:36] <jcastro> cjohnston: it's pretty bad ass
[15:36] <doctormon> jcastro: Talking of github http://imagebin.org/196812
[15:36] <jcastro> Oh man, NICE NICE!
[15:37] <jcastro> the little cat guy is cute!
[15:37] <mhall119> jcastro: yes
[15:37] <jcastro> or octocat or whatever they call it
[15:37] <mhall119> jcastro: we did a prototype in ISD using it,  very slick
[15:37] <doctormon> Yeah got an svg of him. hard to find.
[16:25] <jcastro> mhall119: ping
[16:25] <mhall119> jcastro: teaching
[16:25] <jcastro> k
[16:29] <mhall119> jcastro: ok
[16:32] <balloons> jcastro, last night i had a dream google bought juju.. more importantly, if I'm dreaming with google, does that means they really own all my data and know everything about me? :-) I dream with google! number one dream search engine
[16:33] <jcastro> you need a hobby. :)
[16:33] <koolhead17> juju dream
[16:34] <mhall119> balloons: this is what happens when you don't read the Terms of Service
[16:35] <mhall119> you agree to let them implant Google DreamAds into your brain
[16:35] <balloons> mhall119, isn't there an adblock for that?
[16:35] <balloons> :-)
[16:36] <mhall119> balloons: yes, but you've got to pay for them
[16:37] <balloons> shoot.. they told me everything was free ... no consequence...
[16:40] <technoviking> jcastro: ping-a-ling
[16:41] <mhall119> balloons: no consequence to *them*
[16:42] <jcastro> technoviking: yo
[16:42] <technoviking> jcastro: you need anything from me for the php SSO forum volenteer
[16:43] <jcastro> Him and Newz talked
[16:43] <jcastro> can you ping newz? He should know the details
[16:43] <jcastro> But they've been linked up already
[16:43] <technoviking> sure
[16:44] <jcastro> Hey so, would now be a bad time to bring up this phpbb thing?
[16:44] <technoviking> seeing if upgrade to 3.8.7 will fix the security issues on the forums
[16:44] <technoviking> it is always a bad time, but I think it is the right thing to do
[16:44] <jcastro> I can't believe we pay for something that doesn't even have openid support
[16:45] <technoviking> I'm totally for moving the old forums to an forums archive linked to phpbb front end
[16:46] <technoviking> not sure if transfer accounts would work, people make have to start from scratch
[16:46] <technoviking> would lose alot of the forums community
[16:46] <jcastro> what do you mean?
[16:47] <jcastro> oh, a large percentage of people have local only accounts?
[16:47] <popey> most probably do
[16:47] <snap-l> jcastro: Pretty sure anything you do with the forums will piss off a lot of people
[16:47] <technoviking> I have not found a way to transfer the vBB database to phpbb, even only the user account
[16:47] <snap-l> even if you just leave it as it is
[16:47] <jcastro> snap-l: owned forums will probably piss them off more
[16:47] <technoviking> 97%+ I bet
[16:48] <mhall119> jcastro: did you need me?
[16:48] <snap-l> phpbb is a strange beast
[16:48] <snap-l> there's a lot of "interesting" design decisions
[16:49] <jcastro> mhall119: yeah
[16:49] <jcastro> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/TechnicalOverview#preview
[16:49] <jcastro> so skaet will usually ping you the day before an alpha/beta to give these a once over
[16:50] <jcastro> and I used to just add links to upstream projects in the notes
[16:50] <jcastro> to ensure that upstream projects are getting proper attribution
[16:50] <jcastro> so for example, in the line about rhythmbox, I change that to add a link to the upstream page, etc.
[16:51] <jcastro> then when you're done you say "ok ready" and she passes it on to the web team for proper publication
[16:52] <jono> morning all
[16:52] <cjohnston> morning
[16:52] <doctormon> hello jono
[16:52] <jono> hey doctormon
[16:52] <jono> hows things?
[16:52] <jono> hey cjohnston
[16:53] <dholbach> hey jono
[16:53] <jono> hey dholbach
[16:54] <doctormon> jono: doing great http://imagebin.org/196903 How's you?
[16:54] <mhall119> jcastro: alright is she waiting on me currently?
[16:54] <mhall119> or did you update this one
[16:55] <jcastro> I took care of it
[16:55] <jcastro> but she's going to ping you for future releases
[16:55] <jcastro> It's basically just ensuring our upstreams get a shout out in the release notes.
[16:56] <mhall119> jcastro: will do, thanks
[17:10] <jcastro> technoviking: s-fox: ok the forums issue is at the top of IS level of attention already.
[17:11] <pleia2> thanks jcastro
[17:13] <technoviking> jcastro: who should I ping IS if vb 3.8.7 will work
[17:13] <jcastro> I am not sure yet
[17:14] <technoviking> will ping the RT once I heard
[17:14] <s-fox> jcastro,  Thank you :-)
[17:15] <jcastro> technoviking: you're looking for mbarnett
[17:21] <technoviking> jcastro: cool thanks
[17:29] <bodhizazen> Anyone here familiar with Launchpad might have a minute to help me set up a team ?
[17:33] <jussi> bodhizazen: probably better to ask in #launchpad?
[17:37] <bodhizazen> Thanks, I am getting help =)
[17:41] <balloons> jcastro, mhall119 there's a weird line in the release notes preview on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/TechnicalOverview#preview. Both of this reduces power consumption and thus battery lifetime. should be like "Both of these changes help reduce power consumption and thus increase battery life".
[17:42] <jcastro> balloons: fix it in the wiki and then ping skaet or someone on #ubuntu-release
[17:43] <balloons> ohh.. I haz the powerz...
[17:44] <doctormon> balloons: Can I suggest "These changes increase battery life through reducing power consumption"? Marketing says accent the recognisable.
[17:45] <balloons> doctormon, yes.. the sentence didn't make sense.. but your right. .It could also be said in a better way
[17:46] <doctormon> balloons: Or even "reducing power waste", :-)
[17:49] <mhall119> doctormon: IMO, "consumption" is more easily measurable and verifiable than "waste"
[17:50] <doctormon> mhall119: Yes, and it's also meaningless in real terms, I can reduce the power consumption to zero by making the kernel shutdown the computer on each boot.
[17:50] <doctormon> The question is, is the computer using less power but doing the same things as before.
[17:50] <doctormon> If yes, then logically we have less waste.
[17:51] <mhall119> likely it's doing less than before, just not in a way that the user will mind
[17:51] <mhall119> but yes, people care about wasting power more
[17:52] <doctormon> s/doing the same things/doing the same useful work/
[17:53] <mhall119> yes
[17:53] <mhall119> personally, I prefer talking about consumption for two reason
[17:53] <mhall119> as an engineer, I natually ask "how much less", and units of energy are more meaningful than units of waste
[17:54] <mhall119> as a human, I negatively association the word "waste", so I don't want people reading about waste (even the reduction of it) in the context of Ubuntu
[17:55] <doctormon> There's a study in there somewhere
[17:55] <mhall119> while "this sucks 50% less" is literally good, the mood it puts the reader in isn't
[17:55] <jono> ok in ~5?
[17:55] <mhall119> jono: yup
[17:55] <jono> mhall119, sweet
[17:55] <doctormon> mhall119: Lasts longer then?
[17:56] <doctormon> Makes better use of electrons than leading brands of soap.
[17:57] <mhall119> heh
[17:57] <mhall119> I think 'reduces power consumption' is good
[17:57] <mhall119> both 'power' and 'consumption' generally put people's brains into a positive mood
[17:57] <mhall119> and 'reduces' make it literally good as well
[17:58] <doctormon> I'm convinced.
[17:58] <mhall119> :)
[17:59] <mhall119> I'm putting "Convinced somebody on IRC to agree with me" on my list of this week's achievements
[18:00] <jono> LOL
[18:01] <jono> mhall119, creating a hangout
[18:02] <doctormon> mhall119: maybe an acheivement trophy?
[18:03] <mhall119> doctormon: nah, that's too hard
[18:03] <doctormon> hard to verify anyway
[18:03] <jono> mhall119, invite sent
[18:04] <nigelb> dholbach: ping?
[18:04] <dholbach> nigelb, pong
[18:05] <nigelb> dholbach: what was the change after james_w shift?
[18:05] <nigelb> there seems to be a missing session
[18:05] <nigelb> I moved sil around in the calender just now.
[18:05] <dholbach> eh?
[18:05] <dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek
[18:06] <dholbach> 18 UTC: Adding Ubuntu One to your applications -- aquarius
[18:06] <dholbach> 18:30 → 19:29 UTC: Pair Programming and Code Review in the Cloud! -- kirkland
[18:06] <dholbach> 19:30 UTC: Syncing your app data everywhere with U1DB -- aquarius
[18:06] <dholbach> 20:00 UTC: Automated packaging with pkgme -- james_w
[18:06] <dholbach> ...
[18:07] <dholbach> nigelb, ^ does that look alright to you?
[18:07] <nigelb> sec
[18:07] <nigelb> let me compare
[18:08] <nigelb> dholbach: ok, is that after james's switch for the dentist?
[18:09] <dholbach> yes
[18:09] <nigelb> ok, so apparently, it is.
[18:09] <nigelb> let me fix classroom calender.
[18:09] <nigelb> You forgot that bit :)
[18:09] <dholbach> thanks muchly
[18:09] <dholbach> yes, I was in the middle of 5 things throughout the day
[18:09] <dholbach> sorry
[18:09]  * dholbach hugs nigelb
[18:09]  * nigelb hugs dholbach
[18:09] <nigelb> Happy to help, just let me know if you want to delete stuff like this.
[18:10] <dholbach> delete what?
[18:10] <nigelb> dholbach: *delegate
[18:10] <dholbach> ahhhhh
[18:10] <dholbach> :-)
[18:11] <nigelb> Missed two chars :)
[18:11] <nigelb> dholbach: Is Fixing internationalisation bugs still on?
[18:12] <nigelb> Its not on the calender. I wonder if I accidentally screwed it up.
[18:12] <dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek should be accurate
[18:12] <s-fox> Goodbye.
[18:12] <bodhizazen> 'lo doctormon
[18:13] <doctormon> hey bodhizazen
[18:14] <nigelb> dholbach: okay, all fixed!
[18:15] <technoviking> bodhizazen: I'm looking to make sure we can patch the 3.8.7 to fix the security hole
[18:15] <dholbach> nigelb, ROCK
[18:15] <dholbach> thanks! :)
[18:15] <nigelb> :)
[18:16] <cjohnston> Does anyone know if we have any iPhone devs in our community?
[18:16] <nigelb> popey!
[18:16] <nigelb> I think he does.
[18:19] <dholbach> alrightie - have a great rest of your day everyone
[18:19] <dholbach> and see you tomorrow
[18:19] <dholbach> HUGS
[18:20] <nigelb> g'nite dholbach!
[19:41] <jcastro> pleia2: around?
[19:42] <jcastro> kirkland tells me there's a problem with them getting voice on -classrom
[19:42] <bkerensa> jcastro: http://i.imgur.com/LSaDJ.jpg
[19:42] <akgraner> jcastro,  does he need voice now?
[19:42] <jcastro> I think so
[19:43] <akgraner> ok
[19:43] <jcastro> bkerensa: I'm the cloud guy, I don't do local music. :)
[19:44] <bkerensa> ;)
[19:45] <akgraner> jcastro, aq and kirkland have been voiced
[19:58] <bodhizazen> jcastro: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntuforumssso
[19:58] <jcastro> I saw the post, thanks!
[19:59] <bodhizazen> If you know anyone else interested, have them email myself or another of the FC
[19:59] <bkerensa> :D
[19:59] <jcastro> is that guy going to put his code there?
[19:59] <bodhizazen> I have asked the forms staff to hand in this channel a bit more
[19:59] <bodhizazen> We are hoping to keep code in LP, yes
[19:59] <jcastro> ok
[19:59] <jcastro> let me tell newz
[20:00] <bodhizazen> FWIW - The "chat" feature on ask ubuntu is not well liked by my corporate firewall =(
[20:00] <bkerensa> If you are transitioning to vb4 there was a vbulletin developer who tried to get SSO going on vb4 but I think he abandoned such efforts
[21:50] <s-fox> Hello, I need to get in touch with someone at canonical legal. Anyone know a good place to start?
[21:55] <doctormon> s-fox: They have a good email address. check canonical.com if it's not about a community issue.
[22:00] <s-fox> I've been looking on the website doctormon , I can't see a contact email for the legal dept.
[22:00] <s-fox> :-(
[22:01] <balloons> s-fox, hmmm
[22:01] <doctormon> s-fox: Have you tried emailing<EMAIL_ADDRESS>?
[22:01] <s-fox> No doctormon , I couldn't see that listed so have not emailed it. Thank you. :-)
[22:18] <bkerensa> :)
[22:48] <doctormon> mhall119: ping


[13:35] <blackhat> Hellow how i compile a c++ program using g++
[14:02] <blackhat> please show me how to configure wow.js


[13:39] <xypron> I am looking for a sponsor for LP #1995860
[13:39] -ubottu:#ubuntu-devel- Launchpad bug 1995860 in u-boot-nezha (Ubuntu) "Emulation of fence.tso hangs in endless loop" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1995860
[14:24] <tsimonq2> ...so, why does debdiff not follow symlinks again? :P
[14:24] <tsimonq2> I would sponsor bug 1995612 as-is, but it creates it as an Actual File, not a debdiff :)
[14:24] -ubottu:#ubuntu-devel- Bug 1995612 in debootstrap (Ubuntu Kinetic) "Add Ubuntu Lunar as a known release" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1995612
[14:24] <tsimonq2> s/debdiff/symlink/
[14:46] <enr0n> tsimonq2: maybe we should add a debian/debootstrap.links instead?
[14:55] <enr0n> Can a core dev or MOTU please retry this test? https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=kinetic&arch=arm64&package=xen-tools&trigger=openssh%2F1%3A9.0p1-1ubuntu7.1
[15:03] <dbungert> enr0n: clicked
[15:04] <enr0n> dbungert: thanks!


[00:14] <ParadoxGuitarist> For audio stuff would there be any downside to writing a front end in python vs. C++?
[00:17] <astraljava> ParadoxGuitarist: Not an expert, but even though there's a slight delay in interpreted languages versus compiled languages, I highly doubt it would make a big enough difference in front end development.
[00:30] <ParadoxGuitarist> Ok, thanks
[00:32] <astraljava> ParadoxGuitarist: I guess it kinda boils down to which language you are more comfortable developing with, and thus being able to make better choices in the implementation.
[00:34] <ParadoxGuitarist> astraljava: Ok thanks. I've never done any real coding I'm just trying to decide what is going to be best for the project and trying to weigh what is best for getting others involved and willing to contribute vs. what is going to perform best.
[00:36] <astraljava> ParadoxGuitarist: Then I would make a poll regarding what tech the others are more willing to use.
[00:36] <astraljava> ParadoxGuitarist: These days there are so many possibilities out there.
[18:23] <g0z> hello
[18:26] <holstein> g0z: o/
[18:30] <g0z> I'm trying to figure out what it'd take to convert my old analog studio set up to the digital realm right now. besides mics I'm not real sure what else I can salvage due to sheer ignorance about digital recording. any ideas/links on this kind of thing?
[18:34] <holstein> sure, join #opensourcemusicians
[18:34] <holstein> im about to head out the door
[18:34] <holstein> g0z: ^
[18:34] <g0z> cool thanks
[18:34] <holstein> really, just a machine and interface probably
[18:34] <holstein> assuming you have some console with balanced outs that you like
[18:35] <holstein> anyways, those guys will be helpful... enjoy, and welome to the channel :)
[18:35] <g0z> thanks checking it now


[16:11] <scott-work> final release discussion for ardour 3.0 http://ardour.org/node/5682
[16:11] <holstein> woohoo!
[16:26] <ttoine> yes !
[16:27] <ttoine> scott-work, zequence, knome, I had a chat with pleia2 from the xubuntu team, she gave me the email of the person who help her to get the @xubuntu for their community. I just sent an email to this contact, I hope that it wil help
[16:27] <scott-work> very cool
[16:31] <len-dt> How long before ardour3 makes it to debian?
[16:31] <len-dt> (after release)
[16:32] <falktx> ardour doesnt like to be packaged
[16:32] <falktx> it goes against their source of revenue (downloads asking for donations)
[16:32] <falktx> but there's already an ardour3 package in debian-multimedia
[16:33] <falktx> just waiting for the "ok, now it's safe to package" from the devs
[16:33] <falktx> len-dt: so I say, although ardour devs might not be very happy with it, it should only take a few days or weeks after official release
[16:36] <len-dt> Sounds good.
[16:37] <len-dt> I understand how they feel, but I also feel that US should come with ardour and that it should be up to date.
[16:37] <len-dt> However, I have set up our menu in such a way that the user can install the original package and it will show up in the right place.
[16:38] <len-dt> If a user is having trouble getting support they can install the ardour site version and go from there.
[16:39] <len-dt> To put it another way... if it was easy to do, I would be happy to ship our ISO with the ardour site version.
[16:39] <len-dt> I don't think it will ever be though.
[16:40] <ttoine> len-dt, would it be possible to create a kink of "donate screen" in US ?
[16:41] <len-dt> ttoine, There is a longer story that that I think.
[16:41] <ttoine> a kind of
[16:42] <len-dt> Ubuntu uses deb source to make ubuntu packages. to do that we would have to do what happens with the flash installer
[16:42] <ttoine> and this is not possible ?
[16:42] <len-dt> We would create a package that just downloads and installs ardour
[16:43] <len-dt> we would have to coodinate with ardour because it is not a licence issue
[16:43] <len-dt> they want people to see their screens on their site with links to their donate software.
[16:43] <len-dt> this is fundamentally different than the flash instance
[16:44] <len-dt> Generally in Ubuntu an open source version is desirable
[16:44] <len-dt> And it does exist. So it is the first choice
[16:49] <len-dt> ttoine, in other words I don't think we would be able to ship the ardour version.
[16:50] <ttoine> ok
[16:50] <ttoine> But I was not thinking about that
[16:50] <ttoine> I was more thinking about a general donate screen, not only for ardour
[16:51] <len-dt> I don't know what the legal aspect of that is. I will note there is no such thing anywhere else in Ubuntu.
[16:52] <len-dt> Our biggest lack in my opinion, is time... people's time.
[16:52] <len-dt> Money is not really an issue.
[16:53] <ttoine> yes
[16:54] <ttoine> but it was just to make a kind of reminder for user that yes it is free (so free of charge, too) but maybe they can contribute a bit to the projects they use
[16:54] <len-dt> Having a page on our website that has links to pages of the software we use where people could donate might be ok.
[16:54] <ttoine> it is a good idea
[16:55] <len-dt> I think we have a contribute to Studio page where we ask for help.
[16:55] <len-dt> that may be a good place to link from.
[17:08] <len-dt> ttoine, there is a link from the main menu to our contribute page (or there could be, I think right now it goes to the dev mailing list page)
[17:08] <ttoine> yes
[17:09] <ttoine> len-dt, should I add this in PR blueprint ?
[17:09] <len-dt> I think that is valid. both repointing the menu item to the correct page and expanding the contribute page.
[17:20] <ttoine> hum
[17:20] <ttoine> I can't add a work items...
[17:21] <ttoine> scott-work, I can't add a workitem on the PR blueprint.
[17:22] <len-dt> are you logged in?
[17:27] <scott-work> ttoine: hmmm, as long as you are logged in it should work
[18:46] <ttoine> knome, zequence, len-dt, could you have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ttoine ?
[18:46] <ttoine> I would like to become a "Member" and would have your opinion on my wiki page ?
[18:49] <knome> ttoine, the lists in "contributions" aren't working correctly, for starters
[18:56] <knome> ttoine, fixed it. will add a testimony later
[19:10] <ttoine> knome, oh, thank you very much


[02:27] <pieq> duflu, hi! Thanks for checking https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1845623
[02:28] <pieq> I added a comment and a snapshot. Looks xorg-related
[02:28] <pieq> duflu, is lightdm/gdm using xorg?
[02:31] <duflu> pieq, the gdm login screen is always using Wayland, and then after you login always using Xorg by default. Lightdm is always Xorg
[02:31] <pieq> duflu, ha... which one is used on 19.10?
[02:33] <duflu> pieq, in modern Ubuntu we use gdm3. So it launches a gnome-shell process running as user gdm that is Wayland for the login screen. But if you then log in to an 'Ubuntu' session that will be Xorg
[02:33] <duflu> The gnome-shell process running as you will then be using Xorg
[02:33] <pieq> duflu, got it... so, well, that means I can reproduce it on Wayland as well then :D
[02:34] <duflu> pieq, to verify that you need to log in to the option called 'Ubuntu on Wayland'
[02:34] <duflu> Ah, or the login screen
[02:34] <duflu> as you say
[02:35] <pieq> ha yes, I can reproduce it on Wayland
[02:35] <pieq> I mean even inside a "Ubuntu on Wayland" session
[02:37] <pieq> duflu, added some info to reproduce it on Wayland as well
[03:02] <duflu> pieq, please create an upstream bug for it at https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues
[03:03] <pieq> duflu, just saw your comment, thanks! So the gnome-shell version is 3.33.91?
[03:03] <pieq> that's what I see in the About section of the settings screen
[03:03] <duflu> pieq, ah, that's old now. Please update to get 3.34.0 before reporting the bug to upstream
[03:03] <pieq> duflu, how can I do this?
[03:04] <duflu> pieq, nevermind -- that GUI is wrong...
[03:04] <pieq> haha
[03:04] <pieq> ok, I'll just mark 3.34 then
[03:05] <duflu> pieq, try: dpkg-query --show gnome-shell
[03:05] <pieq> duflu, oh yeah, 3.34.0-1ubuntu1
[03:06] <duflu> robert_ancell_, gnome-control-center reporting 3.33.91, is that because of the old gnome-session?
[03:07] <robert_ancell> duflu, in the about dialog?
[03:08] <duflu> robert_ancell, yes
[03:08]  * duflu tries to make a bug
[03:09] <robert_ancell> duflu, it pulls it out of /usr/share/gnome/gnome-version.xml
[03:09] <robert_ancell> Which is gnome-desktop3-data
[03:10] <robert_ancell> Which is 3.33.91-1ubuntu2, so yeah it will look wrong
[03:11] <duflu> OK, but at least explained
[03:11] <duflu> bug 1846147
[03:11] <pieq> duflu, is there a way to link the LP issue to the Gnome one? (I just added a comment for now)
[03:12] <duflu> pieq, yes and I will do it
[03:12] <pieq> duflu, cool, thanks!
[03:13] <duflu> pieq, but for future reference, just click "Also affects project"
[03:17] <pieq> duflu, ok, I saw the link but was not sure if it only meant another project on LP
[03:19] <duflu> Technically it does
[03:19] <duflu> You need to make a project exist in LP in order to link to it on other sites
[03:26] <pieq> OK! I'm not well-versed in the intricacies of Launchpad :)
[06:17] <didrocks> good morning
[06:21] <duflu> Morning didrocks
[06:22] <didrocks> hey duflu
[06:24] <jibel> Hi all
[06:28] <didrocks> salut jibel
[06:29] <jibel> Salut didrocks
[06:29] <jibel> didrocks, I fixed the failed to unmount, it was due to the swap still being active. And a bug introduced with the quotes added everywhere
[06:30] <jibel> didrocks, now looking at EFI systems
[06:30] <didrocks> jibel: ah nice! I think I have an idea for the mount generator issue, but let's have a look together later
[06:59] <oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
[07:03] <duflu> Morning jibel and oSoMoN
[07:03] <oSoMoN> good afternoon duflu
[07:03] <oSoMoN> salut jibel
[07:23] <didrocks> hey oSoMoN
[07:25] <oSoMoN> salut didrocks
[07:39] <willcooke> moin moin
[07:40] <didrocks> hey willcooke
[07:43] <Wimpress> Morning o/
[07:43] <duflu> Morning Wimpress and willcooke
[07:44] <willcooke> afternoon duflu
[07:44] <willcooke> hi Wimpress
[07:45] <Wimpress> May I request a favour from a friendly neighborhood desktopper?
[07:45] <Wimpress> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubuntu-mate-eoan/+merge/373371
[07:45] <Wimpress> ;-)
[07:45] <Wimpress> Something, something will buy beer.
[07:46] <willcooke> Wimpress, looks like you've changed some strings there, do you need to let translators know?
[07:47] <willcooke> and you should probably file a UIFe too, e.g. https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2019-September/020666.html
[07:48] <willcooke> but if a desktopper tells me I'm being unnecessary, I'll accept it :)
[07:48] <willcooke> do we need to do that for flavours I wonder... probably
[07:49] <Wimpress> The few translators on LP working on Ubuntu MATE know this change is coming.
[07:52] <didrocks> they need to tell it on the bug as per UIFe procedure
[07:52] <didrocks> (same for doc)
[08:00] <Laney> moinington crescent
[08:00] <didrocks> hey Laney
[08:00] <willcooke> hi Laney
[08:01]  * willcooke is going to Mornington Crescent later
[08:02] <seb128> goooood morning desktopers!
[08:02] <willcooke> hey seb128
[08:02] <oSoMoN> salut seb128
[08:02] <seb128> hey willcooke, lut oSoMoN, how are you?
[08:03] <duflu> Morning Laney and seb128
[08:03] <willcooke> good seb128, you?  nice weekend break?
[08:04] <seb128> hey duflu, had good holidays?
[08:04] <seb128> willcooke, yeah, centerparc was relaxing, but the kid got some cold/fever so we didn't do that much (like he didn't want to go into the water at all...)
[08:04] <duflu> seb128, it was nice but only really 3 days off before it became just a cold and jet lag
[08:05] <seb128> duflu, :-(
[08:05] <willcooke> bad luck seb128
[08:05] <willcooke> bad luck duflu
[08:05] <didrocks> salut seb128
[08:05] <duflu> That's OK. I also had a 3 day weekend pre-sprint
[08:05] <Laney> hi didrocks willcooke duflu wb seb128
[08:11] <marcustomlinson> good morning duflu, didrocks, jibel, oSoMoN, willcooke, Wimpress, Laney, and seb128!
[08:11] <duflu> hi marcustomlinson
[08:11] <willcooke> hi marcustomlinson
[08:11] <Laney> peace
[08:14] <didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
[08:15] <seb128> lut didrocks, hey Laney marcustomlinson
[08:15] <jibel> seb128, that's why parents must go on holidays alone
[08:15] <jibel> no kids = really relaxing holidays
[08:16] <oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson
[08:16] <oSoMoN> also good morning willcooke and Laney
[08:16] <willcooke> morning oSoMoN
[08:17] <seb128> jibel, that's right!
[08:18] <jibel> or just don't take holidays and give me your days.
[08:19] <seb128> lol, nice try
[08:26] <Laney> o/ oSoMoN
[08:35] <seb128> sorry team for posting my weekly update on tuesday, I didn't initial plan to take monday off and failed to think about that when I did yesterday...
[08:48] <didrocks> whyyyyyyyyyyyyyy a libreoffice update
[08:48] <didrocks> making the testing in the live hard, have libreoffice in the update list, and so got OOM killed and so, and so, and so…
[08:48] <seb128> did it DoS the builders?
[08:48] <seb128> ah :/
[08:48] <didrocks> nope, just my snapshotted VM for tests :p
[08:49]  * didrocks will only use the ppa in the live to skip that update
[08:51] <oSoMoN> didrocks, you should rejoice in libreoffice updates!
[08:51] <didrocks> oSoMoN: it's only tears when I can't update-initramfs because of libreoffice is stealing my precious VM memory ;)
[08:57] <marcustomlinson> didrocks: I sorry
[08:58] <marcustomlinson> (but also not really)
[08:58] <marcustomlinson> :D
[09:02] <didrocks> marcustomlinson: yeah, I saw it was just lies in your eyes! ;)
[09:41] <xnox> jibel:  hi! for the desktop live sessions that is failing to shutdown, i'm thinking to make casper depend on finalrd for clean shutdowns, done reliably.
[09:42] <xnox> jibel:  could you please try to `apt update; apt install finalrd` in the live session, once snapd is settled etc. Then do the shutdown? it should be a lot quicker, and like instant after hitting enter key, on remove media.
[09:42] <xnox> (remove installation medium and press enter screen....)
[09:45] <duflu> ❤
[09:47] <jibel> xnox, hi, sure I can do thatr
[11:55] <ricotz> oSoMoN, hi :)
[11:55] <oSoMoN> hey ricotz, how are you?
[11:55] <ricotz> oSoMoN, I am well, thanks, and you?
[11:55] <oSoMoN> I'm good!
[11:56] <ricotz> oSoMoN, are you running firefox 70 beta?
[11:56] <oSoMoN> not much tbh, are there problems with it?
[11:58] <ricotz> I am having issues with the locale, it feels like the strings are translated at random
[11:58] <ricotz> so please give it a spin, I assume you are using a non-english locale
[11:59] <oSoMoN> yeah, my desktop is in French, I'll test this this afternoon
[11:59] <ricotz> thanks
[13:25] <hellsworth> good morning all
[13:27] <didrocks> hey hellsworth
[13:28] <kenvandine> good morning!
[13:28] <seb128> hey hellsworth kenvandine
[13:30] <hellsworth> the desktop meeting happens here, right?
[13:30] <seb128> yes, now
[13:30] <seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2019-10-01
[13:30] <meetingology> Meeting started Tue Oct  1 13:30:59 2019 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[13:30] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[13:31] <didrocks> hey
[13:31] <seb128> Roll call:  didrocks, duflu (out), hellsworth, jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney, marcustomlinson, oSoMoN, seb128 , tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
[13:31] <oSoMoN> o/
[13:31] <marcustomlinson> \o
[13:31] <tseliot> o/
[13:31] <kenvandine> \o
[13:32] <hellsworth> /o
[13:32] <Laney> yo
[13:32] <seb128> seems like most people are around, let's get started!
[13:32] <seb128> #topic rls-bb-bugs
[13:32] <seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
[13:33] <seb128> nothing for desktop
[13:33] <Trevinho> hi (also)
[13:33] <seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
[13:34] <seb128> 3 bugs unassigned and !fix-commited there that seem didn't follow the process
[13:34] <seb128> bug #1753070
[13:34] <seb128> while that would be nice to fix I think it's -1 for rls specific tracking
[13:34] <seb128> others?
[13:35] <Laney> yes
[13:35] <Laney> file that upstream, maybe Robert will fix it anyway
[13:35] <seb128> right
[13:35] <oSoMoN> yeah, -1 for rls tracking
[13:35] <seb128> k, deleting the extra lines
[13:35] <Trevinho> -1
[13:36] <seb128> thx
[13:36] <seb128> next
[13:36] <seb128> bug #1781428
[13:36] <seb128> kenvandine, should that be assigned to jamesh?
[13:36] <seb128> or jamie?
[13:37] <kenvandine> jamesh ,i'll assign
[13:37] <seb128> I'm assuming it's important enough to be rls tracked
[13:37] <seb128> thx
[13:37] <seb128> next
[13:37] <seb128> bug #1845317
[13:38] <seb128> that looks like standard hwd enablement so probably a valid one to accept
[13:38] <seb128> tjaalton, should that be assigned to you? (and when you nominate something you plan to work on please assign directly so we don't spend meeting time reviewing those)
[13:39] <seb128> I will assign to him if he doesn't reply, moving on
[13:39] <seb128> #topic rls-dd-incoming
[13:39] <seb128> #topic rls-dd-bugs
[13:39] <seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-incoming-bug-tasks.html
[13:39] <seb128> no desktop item
[13:39] <seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-tracking-bug-tasks.html
[13:40] <seb128> only the g-c-c default sound one we just discussed
[13:40] <seb128> #topic rls-ee-bugs
[13:40] <seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-incoming-bug-tasks.html
[13:40] <seb128> no desktop one
[13:40] <tjaalton> seb128: done
[13:40] <seb128> tjaalton, thx
[13:41] <seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-tracking-bug-tasks.html
[13:41] <seb128> the g-c-c one is there
[13:41] <seb128> and
[13:41] <seb128> bug #1841718
[13:42] <seb128> tjaalton, do you know what's the status of that one?
[13:42] <tjaalton> not a mesa bug, just -ati
[13:43] <seb128> do you think it should be tracked for eoan? do you want to deal with it?
[13:43] <seb128> looks like fedora backported that patch https://src.fedoraproject.org/fork/ofourdan/rpms/xorg-x11-drv-ati/c/95ce6272
[13:44] <tjaalton> there was supposed to be a point-release last month, pinged upstream about it
[13:44] <tjaalton> again
[13:45] <seb128> meanwhile do you want it rls tracked and assigned to you? ;)
[13:45] <tjaalton> done
[13:45] <seb128> thx
[13:45] <seb128> that should be it for bugs then!
[13:45] <seb128> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
[13:45] <seb128> Laney, yours!
[13:45] <Laney> k
[13:45] <Laney> please just promote those perl things
[13:46] <didrocks> speaking of which…
[13:46] <didrocks> 15:21:33      doko | didrocks: please file MIRs for libcairo-gobject-perl, or forward to desktop
[13:46] <didrocks> from our MIR team ^
[13:46] <seb128> let me ping foundations/MIR people just in case, I'm always nervous during promotion during freezes without being r-t
[13:46] <Laney> I think he's wrong on that
[13:46] <seb128> those are also depends of libglib-perl
[13:46] <didrocks> I prefer the person who dealt with it to look at it
[13:46] <seb128> which is in the foundations section of the report
[13:46] <Laney> Adam has told me in the past a few times that there's a policy to allow these perl packages to be promoted without MIR
[13:47] <Laney> but you can check on that if you want
[13:47] <didrocks> please do, and if you need seb128 or I promoting them to main, just ping us
[13:47] <Laney> think you misread that as me volunteering to do something :p
[13:47] <didrocks> ah, I read "you" as "I" :) sorry
[13:48] <seb128> I pinged on #ubuntu-release
[13:48] <Laney> going to make a card for the gvfs thing
[13:48] <Laney> it is high time this got worked on
[13:48] <seb128> right
[13:48] <Laney> and the other thing I'm looking at is ruby-gnome, I tried for some time to fix that
[13:48] <Laney> but I don't understand it well enogh
[13:48] <Laney> other option is to remove that small stack
[13:48] <Laney> 4 packages I think
[13:49] <seb128> ask foundations if they care about keeping it? technically it's on their report...
[13:49] <seb128> I'm fine with deleting ruby-gnome for this cycle
[13:49] <Laney> ok will follow up on that
[13:49] <Laney> fin de report
[13:49] <seb128> thx
[13:50] <xnox> Laney:  cyphermox was actually doing perl MIRs.....
[13:50] <seb128> (I will look at the libgdata pb since I created it by adding the installed tests, they are fine in Debian but I think their setup let online access and the failure is due to internet being bloked for us)
[13:51] <seb128> thx Laney
[13:51] <Laney> it's not, but you need to use the proxy that is set in the environment
[13:51] <Laney> for http anyway
[13:51] <seb128> oh ok, let's discuss that post meeting
[13:51] <seb128> #topic AOB
[13:51] <seb128> other topics?
[13:52] <Laney> xnox: yeah ok, looks like ones for formality
[13:52] <Laney> yes, reminder to fill out https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/release-bugs-for-week-commencing-monday-30th-september/12785
[13:52] <seb128> I mean to do more tracking/nagging about that in the futur, I failed at it this week due to my day off
[13:52] <Laney> one biscuit to those who did already
[13:52] <seb128> thx for the reminder :)
[13:53] <seb128> shrug, I screwed the style on my editing, I though it was missing
[13:53] <seb128> but it's just title style comments I did :p
[13:53] <seb128>
[13:53] <seb128> anything else?
[13:54] <marcustomlinson> Am I supposed to get some +1's on my app on<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[13:55] <seb128> no idea about that...
[13:55] <Laney> no
[13:55] <marcustomlinson> ok the request is enough then
[13:55] <marcustomlinson> cool thanks
[13:56] <seb128>
[13:56] <Laney> it's not
[13:56] <Laney> sorry I was getting the url
[13:56] <Laney> you should follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard/ApplicationProcess
[13:56] <seb128> that doesn't need to be a meeting topic
[13:56] <Laney> no
[13:56] <Laney> it does nto
[13:56] <seb128> anything else or should we wrap and finish that discussion?
[13:56] <Laney> specifically the part about adding yourself to the agenda
[13:57] <marcustomlinson> ah TLDR'ed that
[13:57] <marcustomlinson> oops
[13:57] <seb128> k, seems no other topic, so let's wrap
[13:57] <seb128> thanks everyone
[13:57] <seb128> #endmeeting
[13:57] <meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Oct  1 13:57:42 2019 UTC.
[13:57] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2019/ubuntu-desktop.2019-10-01-13.30.moin.txt
[13:57] <didrocks> thx
[13:57] <marcustomlinson> it wasn't a meeting topic it was OB
[13:58] <oSoMoN> thanks
[14:08] <jibel> Laney, we fixed several things on the ubiquity MP. When do you think you can give it another look?
[14:08] <Laney> first thing tomorrow
[14:09] <jibel> Cool thanks
[14:09] <Laney> I'll try it again on the inspiron ;-)
[14:14] <seb128> Laney, so, proxy ... where/how should I set that?
[14:14] <Laney> it's set in the environment already
[14:14] <Laney> you have to make sure your tests respect http_proxy / https_proxy / no_proxy if it's set
[14:15] <Laney> (that might not be the problem, it's just the main thing which comes up)
[14:16] <Laney> independent of the question as to whether it's actually a good idea for the tests to be using the internet ;-)
[14:22] <seb128> right
[14:22] <seb128> thx
[14:41] <Laney> ok, we have a new casper which is supposed to fix rebooting
[14:41] <Laney> new iso time
[15:01] <jibel> Laney, you're triggering a build?
[15:02] <Laney> oui
[15:02] <jibel> i'd like to verify the fix really works with automated tests
[15:02] <jibel> merci monsieur
[15:22] <Laney> jibel: it is done
[15:22] <Laney> not sure if you need to trigger the testing manually for an out of cycle build?
[15:35] <oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, at some point the libreoffice snap will need to be updated to use the audio-playback interface, instead of pulseaudio (see https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/197)
[15:35] <gitbot> ubuntu issue (Pull request) 197 in snapcraft-desktop-helpers "snapcraft.yaml: add audio-playback for audio" [Closed]
[15:36] <oSoMoN> this is not urgent, but something to put on the backlog (and the change is trivial)
[15:36] <marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: ah ok, thanks for the heads up
[15:36] <oSoMoN> yw
[15:36] <oSoMoN> I just did that for the chromium snap
[15:42] <marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: where is the chromium snap source?
[15:43] <oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, https://code.launchpad.net/~chromium-team/chromium-browser/+git/snap-from-source
[15:43] <marcustomlinson> thanks
[15:55] <marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: wouldn't removing pulseaudio break the snap for all users not on snapd 2.41? Or do we expect they will upgrade?
[15:56] <oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, one cannot upgrade a snap and hold back the upgrade of the core snap, which has the interface definitions
[15:56] <oSoMoN> so removing pulseaudio should be safe
[15:56] <oSoMoN> jdstrand, can you confirm the above?
[16:04] <marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: easy way to find out would be to see if audio works on Bionic after your change
[16:04] <oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, I tested successfully on xenial
[16:05] <marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: ok nice! I'm building libreoffice now with that update, I'll confirm in many hours time :P
[16:05] <oSoMoN> according to https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/upcoming-pulseaudio-interface-deprecation/13418 the future-proof way is to plug both pulseaudio and audio-playback
[16:05] <marcustomlinson> yeah that's how I read it
[16:05] <oSoMoN> I guess that's to cater for the case of other distros where the core snap 2.41 is not available yet?
[16:07] <marcustomlinson> yeah better safe than sorry
[16:07] <oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, note that when you change only interface definitions, there's no need to fully rebuild the snap: you can grab the .snap file, unsquashfs it, do the modifications to the yaml files, then repack it with "snapcraft pack squashfs-root", and you have a .snap file ready to test locallyu
[16:07] <oSoMoN> -u
[16:07] <marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: there's a USN anyway so might as well
[16:08] <oSoMoN> right, in that case…
[16:17] <oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, I have updated the chromium snap to add back pulseaudio
[16:18] <marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: cool, yeah I just added the 2 audio plugs to LO
[16:18] <oSoMoN> not rebuilding it now though, the next rebuild will pick it up
[16:19] <marcustomlinson> ack
[16:19] <jdstrand> oSoMoN, marcustomlinson: there is no pressing need to remove pulseaudio at all in chromium and libreoffice since a) snapd isn't going to remove the interface and b) these will be grandfathered. you should add audio-playback for future-proofing.
[16:19] <oSoMoN> jdstrand, thanks for the confirmation
[16:20] <jdstrand> oSoMoN, marcustomlinson: once 2.41 is everywhere, I will do another PR to snapcraft-desktop-helper to remove pulseaudio
[16:20] <marcustomlinson> thanks jdstrand
[16:20] <oSoMoN> I'll be watching and will update chromium accordingly when that happens
[16:20] <marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: on that point, do you know of a situation where recording audio is a thing in LO?
[16:20] <jdstrand> oSoMoN, marcustomlinson: but that is just for cleanliness for new snaps. they can still plugs pulseaudio, it would just be manually connected while audio-playback is auto
[16:21] <oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, not off the top of my head
[16:21] <marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: I guess you could record on Chromium through some web app
[16:21] <oSoMoN> yeah, in chromium definitely
[16:21] <oSoMoN> it's needed for all webrtc apps
[16:22]  * jdstrand would expect chromium to have a snap decl for auto-connect of audio-record
[16:22] <jdstrand> in fact, whenever I grandfather chromium, I will try to remember to give it audio-record at that time
[16:25] <oSoMoN> jdstrand, thanks!
[16:28] <jdstrand> np
[16:31]  * oSoMoN calls it a day
[16:31] <oSoMoN> have a good evening everyone
[16:37] <hellsworth> cheers!
[16:53] <jibel> Laney, .2 is the image with the fix?
[16:53] <jibel> (just confirming the tests grabbed the right one)
[16:54] <jibel> anyway, it's still failing the same way
[16:55] <Laney> looks like it
[16:55] <jibel> triggering again to confirm
[16:56] <Laney> wasn't it a timeout before?
[16:59] <jibel> it's a timeout because it fails to reboot at the end of the test and run the post-installation test
[16:59] <Laney> right
[16:59] <Laney> this time I see some libvirt error
[16:59] <jibel> s/end of the test/end of installation/
[16:59] <jibel> I killed it
[17:00] <jibel> it was spitting the same squashfs error all over the console
[17:00] <Laney> oic
[17:00] <Laney> guess xnox gets to try again :(
[17:03] <xnox> Laney:  jibel: let me run it interractively to see what's happening.
[17:04] <Laney> guess: interacting badly with casper-stop?
[17:05] <xnox> Laney:  so yeah, the other things i had locally / been trying is to unmask cdrom.mount and make it stop after casper.service is done
[17:05] <Laney> wouldn't be a problem when apt installing into the overlay
[17:05] <xnox> maybe
[17:06] <Laney> I'm off anyway, this cold sucks and I'm going to have a nap :-)
[17:07] <marcustomlinson> get better Laney
[17:11] <xnox> jibel:  so interractively, booting in bios; using try ubuntu; waiting for snap changes to finish, then rebooting, shows remove installation medium page, and then it reboots fine without errors.
[17:11] <xnox> jibel:  which automation tests are you looking into?
[17:12] <xnox> stuff here https://platform-qa-jenkins.ubuntu.com/view/Eoan/ ?
[17:13] <jibel> xnox, ah installation on this run is successful
[17:14] <jibel> xnox, https://platform-qa-jenkins.ubuntu.com/view/Desktop/job/ubuntu-eoan-desktop-amd64-smoke-default/
[17:14] <jibel> now why the post installation tests are not running is another story
[17:15] <xnox> jibel:  i can't remember, do i have ssh access to the worker?
[17:15] <xnox> to inspect the vm, via virsh
[17:16]  * xnox sadly purged his local utah deployment a while back
[17:17] <jibel> xnox, yes you do
[17:32] <jibel> Woohoo, SUCCESS \o/
[17:32] <jibel> Jenkins build is back to normal : ubuntu-eoan-desktop-amd64-smoke-default #138
[17:32] <jibel> I'll trigger a couple more runs to make sure it is not luck
[18:02] <xnox> awwww
[19:48] <ejat> anyone can advise me how to debug/get log can't login after locking screen/ come back from sleep ?
[19:59] <ejat> anyone can advise me how to debug/get log can't login after locking screen/ come back from sleep ?
[20:58] <sarnold> ejat: how far back does it come? do you get error messages when you unlock?


[06:49] <dholbach> good morning
[17:17] <wendar> mterry: sorry, wasn't on earlier. In general, if it can go in /opt, it should.
[17:18] <mterry> wendar, yar, I figured a way for it to go in opt.  Thanks!
[17:19] <wendar> mterry: cool. If you get a second, add a brief note on how you got it to work for /opt to the wiki documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard/Submissions/InstallPathTips
[17:22] <mterry> wendar, the "Tips for python apps" link there is dead
[17:22] <wendar> mterry: I noticed that, checking if the link is just wrong
[17:42] <wendar> mterry: it looks like I never added the file, just added it now
[17:43] <mterry> wendar, I've got a big branch getting ready for SRU to fix extras support in quickly.  I was dismayed to see how broken it was!  I've added a bunch of tests to help make sure we don't do that again
[17:58] <mterry> wendar, we're generating metadata like "XB-Screenshot-Url: https://software-center.ubuntu.com/screenshots/t/testapp-quantal.png
[17:58] <mterry> XB-Thumbnail-Url: https://software-center.ubuntu.com/screenshots/t/testapp-quantal.thumb.png"  Is that still correct?
[17:58] <wendar> mterry: that can all disappear now
[17:59] <mterry> wendar, oh really?  XB-AppName, XB-Icon, all that?
[17:59] <wendar> mterry: they've made some changes in MyApps, so Software Center can now pull that data from the MyApps submission
[17:59] <wendar> mterry: no need to add it to the package files
[18:00] <mterry> wendar, OK.  You also recommend things like Standards 3.9.2, debian/source/format, and dropping cdbs.   How much do you really care about that?  (like is format 1.0 a blocker, is cdbs depends but not being used a blocker)
[18:00] <wendar> mterry: the debian/rules file has been simplified too, so it no longer needs ('icons', glob.glob('icons/*.png')),
[18:01] <wendar> mterry: er, that's no longer needs override_dh_gencontrol
[18:01] <mterry> wendar, you mean the "dpkg-distaddfile testapp.svg raw-meta-data -" bit?
[18:02] <wendar> mterry: we'll rip out cdbs if it comes through, and will update the standards version to the recommended version for the distro release
[18:02] <wendar> mterry: (IIRC, that is 3.9.2 for Oneiric)
[18:02] <wendar> mterry: yes, the raw-meta-data bit
[18:02] <wendar> mterry: not needed anymore
[18:02] <mterry> wendar, ok, can drop that too
[18:03] <wendar> mterry: if you're using the simple dh template recommended on the ARB wiki pages, it doesn't use cdbs anyway
[18:03] <wendar> mterry: so the dependency is unnecessary
[18:05] <mterry> wendar, agreed, it's just that those nits I described come from a separate package.  So if we really wanted to get rid of them, I'd have to add code to quickly to change them
[18:06] <wendar> mterry: which nits? We're fine on manual package generation now, either with dh_make, or dumping simple template files.
[18:06] <wendar> mterry: doesn't seem like we need to edit any other packages to get it working.
[18:07] <wendar> mterry: just change how quickly spits out the package templates
[18:07] <mterry> wendar, quickly uses python-mkdebian from python-distutils-extra to generate its debian/* files
[18:08] <wendar> mterry: long-term, we can get around that by using pkgme instead
[18:08] <mterry> wendar, agreed.  But my concern right now is 12.04
[18:08] <wendar> mterry: but, for the moment, can you just skip python-mkdebian for ARB packages
[18:08] <wendar> mterry: use static templates
[18:09] <wendar> mterry: the ARB python packages are my definition *very* simple
[18:09] <wendar> "by definition"
[18:09] <wendar> they don't need to detect a lot of complex options
[18:10] <mterry> wendar, um...  they are if the developer has changed their actual code to support only ARB style.  To support normal style as well as ARB, let me show you the current debian/rules I'm using in my extras branch
[18:10] <mterry> wendar, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1006807/
[18:10] <mterry> Not that simple
[18:13] <wendar> mterry: taking a look
[18:14] <wendar> mterry: ugh, yeah, override_dh_install is pretty terrible
[18:14] <wendar> mterry: why is it so complex? --prefix should take care of it all
[18:14] <wendar> mterry: that's python's way of changing the path on everything
[18:15] <wendar> mterry: maybe the Quickly setup.py script needs to be modified to respect --prefix?
[18:15] <mterry> wendar, we have to edit the desktop file, we have to compile the schemas manually because the normal trigger doesn't fire, we have to point to a special XDG_DATA_DIRS so GNOME picks up the write schemas and help files, etc
[18:16] <mterry> We want to fix the gettext usage to point to our translations...
[18:16] <wendar> mterry: that could all go in setup.py
[18:17] <mterry> Sure, if you have an ARB-only app.  But that's not how quickly is constructed currently.  Certainly not for 12.04.
[18:17] <mterry> wendar, the decision of whether to build for ARB is made at debian package time
[18:17] <wendar> mterry: right, by passing the --prefix option to setup.py
[18:18] <mterry> wendar, again, none of the things I mentioned above are fixed by --prefix
[18:18] <wendar> mterry: but they *could* be, if setup.py handled the --prefix option appropriately
[18:18] <mterry> (unless I'm horribly wrong about that -- I don't believe that changes where gettext points and such)
[18:19] <wendar> mterry: the changes aren't specific to ARB, they'd have to be made for any installation on a different path
[18:19] <wendar> mterry: if, for example, a user wanted to install the package in /home/me/my/custom/path...
[18:20] <mterry> wendar, ah, I certainly agree.  But I think you are discussing this with a view to the future.  I'm discussing this with a view to fixing 12.04 to make quickly rock for ARB
[18:20] <wendar> mterry: I added some more details to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard/Submissions/PythonTips, with links to the python documentation
[18:21] <wendar> mterry: well, we don't want to review all that stuff in override_dh_install
[18:21] <wendar> mterry: if it was anything other than a Quickly package, we'd probably reject it if they needed that many install hacks in debian/rules
[18:21] <mterry> wendar, guh, hmm
[18:21] <wendar> mterry: but, if we need a "pass" for Quickly in 12.04, that's okay
[18:22] <wendar> mterry: we'll aim to make it rock even more in 12.10 :)
[18:22] <wendar> mterry: my advice, aim for a setup.py that's no more complex than the example on the PythonTips wiki page
[18:23] <wendar> mterry: arbitrary code in setup.py is a big "Red Flag" for python modules
[18:23] <wendar> mterry: (that's for 12.10)
[18:26] <wendar> mterry: oh... you know, we made some changes to some older Quickly submissions and didn't need all that... let me look for the diffs...
[18:26] <mterry> wendar, I think that simple of a setup.py is unrealistic.  You'll probably need to at least also edit fields in the desktop file and compile the schema.  But I agree that the simpler the better
[18:29] <mterry> wendar, but for 12.04.  So far the code I have generates that awful debian/rules file and also does not hit the following recommendations you have on your QuicklyTips page:  cdbs depend, standards version, debian/source/format, and older format for debian/copyright.  Without those fixes, is this all even saving you any effort?
[18:30] <wendar> mterry: it looks like --prefix does work
[18:30] <wendar> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~allison/+junk/opensinhalease-precise/revision/2
[18:31] <mterry> wendar, sorry, what do you mean by work?  I'm not arguing that --prefix isn't helpful, just that it doesn't do all the things you need it to, so you'll need special setup.py logic regardless
[18:32] <wendar> mterry: as in, setting --prefix gets Quickly to install everything under /opt
[18:32] <mterry> wendar, sure, agreed.  But things won't actually work when you run them
[18:32] <wendar> mterry: and then it only needs specific code to convince it to move the .desktop file out of /opt
[18:33] <wendar> mterry: yes, there were a couple places in the code where it needed to check if the filepath was /opt
[18:33] <wendar> mterry: but, it could do that and work for both /opt installation and normal installation
[18:34] <mterry> wendar, in addition to code changes to support arbitrary prefixes (like gettext, xdg_data_dirs, media file lookups), you will need to edit the desktop file and compile the schemas.  Those are not code changes, so will have to live in setup.py
[18:34] <wendar> setup.py is already editing the .desktop file, setting it by --prefix
[18:36] <mterry> wendar, in a quickly package?  Yes (though it doesn't adjust Exec in 12.04, which is a problem)  But not in your ideal PythonTips page, which is what I was warning about.  Just that such a simple setup.py is unrealistic.  You'll need desktop editing code and schema compilation code
[18:36] <wendar> mterry: ah, I get you now
[18:37] <wendar> mterry: yes, there is some additional work required in setup.py
[18:37] <wendar> (for quickly)
[18:37] <wendar> mterry: I don't want to make this stressfull :) Make whatever hacks you need to make in debian/rules for 12.04, and aim to push them into setup.py for 12.10
[18:37] <mterry> wendar, well, for any app not only targetted at ARB.  Obviously if they only target ARB, they can take all sorts of shortcuts
[18:38] <wendar> mterry: and, yes, *any* changes you can make to Quickly so the generated packages require less manual editing is a big help
[18:38] <wendar> mterry: if we can get it to "no manual edits required" that would be awesome, but even just getting closer would help
[18:39] <wendar> mterry: the example you sent, with the lengthy override_dh_install, should be fine
[18:39] <wendar> mterry: it looks like it'll get the packages to the point where they aren't breaking any ARB policy
[18:40] <mterry> wendar, except for packaging nits, yeah
[18:40] <mterry> wendar, OK, will settle where I am for 12.04 then, get it reviewed and landed on trunk, then SRU'd
[18:40] <wendar> mterry: yup, that's good
[18:41] <mterry> wendar, thanks for your time!  Hopefully quickly will actually be useful for ya'll again
[18:41] <wendar> mterry: thanks much for working on quickly!