[22:11] <llutz> corndoge: then that is totally ok, how would a foreign smtp-server sasl-auth at your server, when trying to send you a mail?
[22:12] <llutz> corndoge: content/spam-filtering is a different job
[22:12] <corndoge> llutz, so the only way to stop those virus mails to myself is just spamfiltering them?
[22:13] <llutz> corndoge: basically yes. look at postscreen, amavisd-new etc.
[22:13] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: you should be able to manually ad it
[22:13] <corndoge> llutz, yeah I'm already filtering them and moving them to a junk folder... but I thought theres a way to stop anonymous people connecting to it :(
[22:14] <llutz> corndoge: not if they send mails to addresses you'e supposed to accept
[22:14] <SCHAAP137> TJ-, when i try to do that to the system-connections files, restart network-manager service, it fails to connect
[22:15] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: you mean you add something like "tls-cipher=..." in the "[vpn]" section
[22:15] <Brandan> Hi, I have this problem to where when the system runs out of ram even by 1 mb, kswapd0 starts using 100% cpu, even when the ram drops back down to 500 mb/4gb.
[22:16] <llutz> corndoge: we run postscreen on some servers with good results. still, it's not perfect
[22:16] <Brandan> The only way to fix it I've seen is to reboot everytime ram was exhausted for any amount of time.
[22:17] <Razzdoll> hey guys. does anyone know how to fix this issue: when i open up a terminal (i use konsole), and ssh into somewhere, it timesout/freezes on me so i am forced to open a new window and re-ssh into somewhere. is that my machine or is that the ssh box doing it and if it is mine how could i fix it? Wily ubuntu here
[22:17] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: ahhh, yes, nm-openvpn-service.c doesn't define ta-cipher in ValidProperty
[22:20] <Brandan> I'm running Ubuntu Server 14.04.4 btw.
[22:30] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: this should add the functionality: http://paste.ubuntu.com/15483315/
[22:31] <Optiprism> So whenever I install a new windows I always first disable the microsoft spyware on it
[22:31] <Optiprism> What spyware products do I have to worry about on ubuntu?
[22:32] <k1l> Optiprism: there is no spyware on ubuntu. you can look at the privacy settings in system settings to adjust the online search to your needs
[22:33] <Brandan> Probably just your ISP and swap using 100% cpu for no reason.
[22:33] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: sorry, that was terrible! got TA and TLS mixed up. Try this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/15483339/
[22:33] <Optiprism> Oh that's kinda surprising when seeing all those icons on the bar when installing ubuntu I assumed there would be some spyware that's included that you had to disable
[22:34] <Optiprism> Alright then
[22:34] <Hesulan> Optiprism: The beauty of open-source software is that it's made exclusively by its users, not by a company looking to sell it. We don't want spyware on our system any more than you do.
[22:36] <SCHAAP137> excellent, gonna try that, thanks TJ-
[22:42] <SCHAAP137> TJ-, i'm getting this error when compiling: /usr/include/NetworkManager/nm-version.h:89:2: error: #error "NM_VERSION_MAX_ALLOWED must be >= NM_VERSION_MIN_REQUIRED
[22:42] <mustmodify> I'm using top and two of the processes are highlighted... any ideas why?
[22:44] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: hmmm; let me check. Which release of Ubuntu are you on?
[22:44] <kuomi> I'm currently running Ubuntu MATE 15.10 and I've edited my fstab to auto-mount an NTFS drive on boot. It's working fine and does auto-mount but one thing that is slightly annoying me is that it doesn't show up in devices and I have to go into the dir I created in /mnt/. I had this same problem in Mint but had no idea how/if I fixed it. Could anyone help?
[22:44] <SCHAAP137> 15.10
[22:45] <SCHAAP137> hm, weird, getting it when compiling without the patch as well...
[22:45] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: how did you build it? I've just done "fakeroot debian/rules binary" and it worked fine
[22:46] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: you did use the latest pastebin I gave you ?
[22:46] <Bashing-om> kuomi: Make the mount point in /media ??
[22:46] <SCHAAP137> TJ-, yes i did; but i'm just using apt-get source network-manager-openvpn, ./configure and make
[22:46] <SCHAAP137> got all the build-deps needed
[22:47] <kuomi> Bashing-om: I followed this, http://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/debian-ubuntu-linux-auto-mounting-windows-ntfs-file-system/. It is mounted to /mnt/share
[22:48] <Ch3ck> Is there anyone here from the Ubuntu user groups? or Ubuntu community?
[22:48] <k1l> Ch3ck: we are all the community :) what is the issue?
[22:49] <Bashing-om> kuomi: Nothing wrong with mounting at /mnt ; as I understand it however gvfs system will not see it .
[22:49] <kuomi> Bashing-om: Ah so best if I just mounted to /media/share and that would show up?
[22:49] <Bashing-om> kuomi: Yeah, is what I think .
[22:50] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: I've got the proper patch here, including the changelog and quilt series patches: https://iam.tj/projects/misc/nm-openvpn.patch
[22:50] <kuomi> Bashing-om: I'll give it a bash, cheers.
[22:51] <Bashing-om> kuomi: Let us know the result .
[22:51] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: the debian/rules Makefile may be setting configuration options you're not setting. That's why it helps to use "fakeroot debian/rules build" (or binary to create packages)
[22:52] <SCHAAP137> cool, will try that one, using that fakeroot command now you said, seems to work
[22:53] <SCHAAP137> okay, that's useful info, thanks
[22:53] <TJ-> I bumped the version but used a ~ so any newer Ubuntu version will replace it properly
[22:53] <kuomi> Bashing-om: Perfect, thanks very much!
[22:54] <Bashing-om> kuomi: :) Pretty smart system, huh ?
[22:56] <Beko12> I accitently pressed ctrl+f4 and a black ttyl screen came in. How do I go back to my desktop?
[22:56] <TJ-> Beko12: Alt+F7
[22:56] <Beko12> TJ-,  thanks!
[22:56] <TJ-> Beko12: the GUI is almost always on tty7 (Alt_F7) (sometimes on tty8 - Alt+F8)
[22:57] <Beko12> thanks
[22:59] <SCHAAP137> excellent, that seems to work TJ-
[23:01] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: great! in which case I'll fire it upstream tomorrow see if we can get it adopted
[23:01] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: I guess network-manager-openvpn-gnome needs editing too, to offer it in the GUI
[23:01] <SCHAAP137> that's excellent, would be awesoem
[23:01] <SCHAAP137> *awesome
[23:02] <SCHAAP137> easier than manually editing the connection file
[23:02] <SCHAAP137> and there would be at least 1 user
[23:02] <SCHAAP137> =þ
[23:02] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: indeed; it's 2300 here so I'll look at that tomorrow. Are you able to test the gnome side, I don't use it
[23:03] <SCHAAP137> not using gnome here either, MATE
[23:03] <TJ-> haha, but do you use the -gnome GUI connection editor though?
[23:04] <TJ-> anything based on the GTK/GDK libraries uses the -gnome connection editor GUIs I believe
[23:04] <SCHAAP137> ah i can test that, sure
[23:05] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: ok; I'll ping you tomorrow once I've got a package built
[23:06] <SCHAAP137> okay, cool
[23:07] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: there doesn't look to be any spare space in the dialog on its TLS tab, grr
[23:08] <SCHAAP137> hmm, it would need some text as well, like "check 'openvpn --show-tls' for valid entries, use colons as separators"
[23:08] <SCHAAP137> or maybe not
[23:09] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: could get 'complicated' real quick. For what you describe the code should call openvpn --show-tls and populate the chooser based on it
[23:09] <Ch3ck> We have a Local Dev Summit coming up. I don't know who to talk to in relation to event support. Can anyone please point me out here?
[23:10] <SCHAAP137> hmm, that would get more complicated indeed. I was just imagining an input field
[23:13] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: I'll think about it... might be best to leave it as an ultra-advanced option that requires the manual settings file editing :)
[23:13] <SCHAAP137> TJ-: a chooser would not support the option of creation a sequence of ciphersuites, separated by colons
[23:13] <SCHAAP137> *creating
[23:13] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: I was thinking a chooser that can string them together... think of an +Add... button
[23:14] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: obviously with the option of inserting a negate "!" in front of the entry
[23:14] <SCHAAP137> true, that's fine with me as well; it's good the command is accepted now by the service applet
[23:14] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: what I could do is have the settings file when created have a comment in it about the tls-cipher option and how to configure it
[23:15] <SCHAAP137> yeah, that's what i was thinking, might be more efficient
[23:15] <SCHAAP137> when the .ovpn is imported, that it would just read and save/use that option as well
[23:15] <SCHAAP137> in the connection file
[23:15] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: as in "# tls-cipher= please see "man openvpn" and the --show-tls and --tls-cipher options"
[23:16] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: yes, I'd need to ensure there's no barrier in the import functions that might drop the option
[23:16] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: do you know if importing a .ovpn with tls-cipher= does bring it through, or drop it?
[23:16] <SCHAAP137> TJ-, it dropped it
[23:17] <SCHAAP137> although, did not test it after patching yet
[23:18] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: OK, I'll check on that. I would *guess* now tls-cipher is added to the ValidProperty it would be imported
[23:19] <lee_g750jm> everyone  building a vpn
[23:19] <SCHAAP137> TJ-: yes, it drops it, verified
[23:19] <SCHAAP137> saved an unchanged imported config, no tls-cipher
[23:21] <Bouncer> What term command would I Use to find my wifi card model?
[23:21] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: no, properties/import-export.c needs it adding manually I notice
[23:22] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: I'll sort that out tomorrow and then you can test it
[23:22] <SCHAAP137> very nice, looking fwd to it
[23:22] <TJ-> Bouncer: depends if its PCI or USB. "lspci -nn" or "lsusb"
[23:22] <k1l> Bouncer: "lspci" or "lsusb".
[23:22] <ihavekews> Hello all.
[23:23] <ihavekews> I have a quick question.. If i'm logged in as root, but i log in as a user on terminal and launch IRSSI, is it still a security risk?
[23:23] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: thinking about it, it is quite an oversight not to support tls-cipher already
[23:24] <Bouncer> k1l TRied that its a broadcom chip, DOesnt SEEM to be tehre
[23:25] <SCHAAP137> TJ-, true, it has been in OpenVPN since version 2.3.4 or something
[23:25] <ihavekews> Bueller?
[23:25] <k1l> Bouncer: can you put both outputs into paste.ubuntu.com and show the link?
[23:27] <qu4nt1n> !s iron man
[23:27] <k1l> qu4nt1n: no warez here
[23:27] <ihavekews> Anyone?
[23:28] <SCHAAP137> anyway, thanks a lot TJ-, for that quick patch
[23:28] <TJ-> SCHAAP137: well, I'm on the way to bed; chat tomorrow :)
[23:28] <nacc> ihavekews: your sentence didn't make a lot of sense to me ... if you're logged in as root, how are you logged in as a user?
[23:28] <SCHAAP137> cool, sleep well :)
[23:28] <TJ-> nacc: 'su' probably
[23:29] <k1l> ihavekews: the matter is as whom the process is running. so if you start irssi as user that is fine. but login to root is not the ubuntu way at all.
[23:29] <ihavekews> @nacc At the login screen i choose to login as root. Then in a terminal i changed user to a regular account..
[23:29] <k1l> ihavekews: never login as root on the login screen
[23:29] <k1l> !sudo | ihavekews
[23:29] <rdh> ihavekews, Yes, because you can escape to root
[23:30] <nacc> ihavekews: that was a mistake, just login as your regular user
[23:30] <mia> how can I make flash player work with my ubuntu
[23:30] <ihavekews> Well currently i'm going through http irc, but i'm just curious what the security risk is.. and what does it mean that you can 'escape' to root
[23:31] <xyzabc> http://goo.gl/Vj7Eep
[23:31] <k1l> !danger
[23:31] <rdh> ihavekews, when you open the terminal, it'll be logged in as root. Then your just logging into another user right? well if you wanted to go back to root... you just type exit.
[23:32] <k1l> dont go to that shortened url. its a malicious website
[23:32] <nacc> ihavekews: so if somehow the application in the terminal was compromised, it could in theory have root access
[23:33] <ihavekews> ohhh
[23:33] <k1l> ihavekews: if someone can enter that process from outside he got root permissions and can do everything on your system. that is the worst szenario.
[23:34] <ihavekews> so hows that work? They find a exploit of some kind and gain access through your IRC port?
[23:34] <ihavekews> then have access to your terminal?
[23:34] <k1l> ihavekews: that works for every program you use as root.
[23:34] <rdh> ihavekews, find away to crash/pass connection back.
[23:35] <nacc> ihavekews: i'm not saying it will happen, but it certainly can and you shouldn't be running anything as root that you don't need to, and certainly not irssi
[23:35] <rdh> ihavekews, Completely depends on the software running, but there is no need to take chances.
[23:35] <ihavekews> lol well, thanks for the advice and clearing that up.
[23:36] <nacc> ihavekews: the more important question is why are you logging in as root?
[23:36] <rdh> ihavekews, https://www.exploit-db.com/ database of exploits
[23:36] <spammy> ok, so the openstack manual install instructions suddenly were replaced with an openstack-install program...which isn't working for me...juju bootstrap bombs out because it isn't set to use "ubuntu/trusty"
[23:37] <spammy> on ubuntu.com
[23:37] <ihavekews> I'm going to school for a BA in computer science, and i've been messing with Kali Linux at home on my network, and i was just curious on the matter.
[23:37] <nacc> spammy: you'll probably more luck on #ubuntu-server
[23:37] <spammy> ok, thx
[23:37] <nacc> spammy: err, "have" more luck :)
[23:39] <Guest8466> ol[a
[23:39] <Guest8466> oi
[23:39] <ihavekews> So i suppose socializng on kali distro is not a spart idea
[23:39] <Guest8466> ipconfig
[23:39] <rdh> ihavekews, create a user, do your stuff logged in as the user.
[23:40] <k1l> ihavekews: read what the purpose of kali is. or ask their support why they use that root only setup. ubuntu got a totally differen approach using sudo. so dont use root
[23:40] <ihavekews> k1 its for penn testing, I think it just makes running everthing much more fluid as oppose to having to SU every command and terminal screen
[23:41] <nacc> ihavekews: kali isn't supported here, regardless, though -- work with the
[23:41] <nacc> them
[23:41] <error-537> Anyone have suggestions for a touch friendly DE/WM that works nicely on small screens?
[23:41] <ihavekews> Of course. I realize this is a ubuntu channel, I also have ubuntu, but i'm much more familiar with this community so i figured i'd ask about the irc
[23:43] <Optiprism> When using ssh and starting for example gedit, it starts on my client, but when I try to do "startx" it appears on the host, how come?
[23:43] <Ben64> don't do startx
[23:43] <k1l> Optiprism: dont run startx on ubuntu
[23:44] <k1l> Optiprism: you can use ssh to start the gui of a program that started on the server on your client.
[23:44] <nacc> Optiprism: why are you running startx?
[23:44] <Razzdoll> So can anyone help me please with my issue? I dont mean to be annoying. I just cant seem to find the right fix on google either (Because I dont even know the correct wording)
[23:44] <Optiprism> I wanna get the server's screen
[23:44] <k1l> Optiprism: but servers usually runs programs that get handled on the CLI. so there is no need for guis
[23:44] <Ben64> Razzdoll: you'd need to explain it first
[23:45] <Razzdoll> well i wanted to know how to fix this issue: when i open up a terminal (i use konsole), and ssh into somewhere, it timesout/freezes on me so i am forced to open a new window and re-ssh into somewhere. is that my machine or is that the ssh box doing it and if it is mine how could i fix it? Wily ubuntu here
[23:45] <Optiprism> Ah I see, i think...
[23:46] <Ben64> Razzdoll: it's the server doing it, you can usually trick it by running something that keeps data flowing
[23:47] <nacc> Optiprism: you mean you want to access a remote servers X screen? why?
[23:48] <Optiprism> Seems like a useful thing to do? It's like a windows remote desktop right
[23:48] <Razzdoll> Ben64, in putty, there is an option to change the timeout, but this is linux not windows and I have no idea what to do.
[23:48] <Ben64> Optiprism: a server normally doesn't have a desktop
[23:48] <k1l> Optiprism: servers  are meant to run with no desktop. that is useless waste of ressources.
[23:48] <Optiprism> oh ok
[23:49] <Ben64> Razzdoll: you can configure ssh client to send keep alive messages.. https://forum.ivorde.com/how-to-prevent-linux-ssh-client-from-disconnecting-using-serveraliveinterval-t19451.html
[23:49] <k1l> Optiprism: server tasks are made for CLI. you dont need click them in gui.
[23:49] <nacc> Optiprism: sorry, I undrestand in broad strokes what you're saying, but it doesn't seem like you really want to do what you're suggesting
[23:50] <SchrodingersResc> so, restarted my computer, when it came back up I can ping it, but I get, ssh: connect to host domain.com port 22: Network is unreachable
[23:50] <Razzdoll> Ben64, ok thank you. Should I add that info to -my- client or the one I ssh into, which is also my vps
[23:50] <Ben64> Razzdoll: the link i gave you is for the client
[23:50] <Razzdoll> Wait, mine right?
[23:51] <Razzdoll> Thought so. Just had to double make sure - Thanks again
[23:52] <SchrodingersResc> things I'm thinking I may have touched include but not limited to, sshd_config, /etc/hosts , /etc/hostname , and may be some others but I'm open to suggestions of where to start.


[00:55] <thumper> mwhudson: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~thumper/launchpad/remove-thumper-from-sample-data/+merge/22189 diff still pending
[00:57] <mwhudson> thumper: done
[00:58] <james_w> thumper/mwhudson: could you take a look at https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~james-w/launchpad/code-imports-for-source-packages/+merge/21821 please?
[00:58] <mwhudson> james_w: after lunch ok?
[00:58] <james_w> sure
[00:58] <mwhudson> cool
[00:59] <james_w> I meant to do it as two branches, but got carried away it seems
[00:59] <james_w> I can split it up if you like
[00:59] <mwhudson> doesn't seem too large
[01:02] <james_w> I'm going to do it, as it makes the tests a bit clearer as to what they are doing
[02:13] <james_w> hi mwhudson
[02:14] <mwhudson> james_w: hello
[02:14] <james_w> mwhudson: do you have time to look now?
[02:14] <mwhudson> james_w: i guess you'd like me to look at that branch?
[02:14] <mwhudson> yeah
[02:14] <mwhudson> james_w: can you paste the link again?
[02:14] <james_w> if not, then I'll sign off and we can do this another time
[02:14] <james_w> sure
[02:14] <mwhudson> resume didn't, again
[02:14] <james_w> thanks
[02:14] <james_w> heh
[02:15] <james_w> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~james-w/launchpad/new-code-import-method-on-branchtarget/+merge/22190
[02:15] <james_w> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~james-w/launchpad/code-imports-for-source-packages/+merge/22191
[02:15] <james_w> the first is another refactoring-type branch, and then the second flips the switch and adds tests for source package imports
[02:15] <mwhudson> james_w: is there an order to them?
[02:15] <mwhudson> ah ok
[02:16] <mwhudson> james_w: the diff for https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~james-w/launchpad/new-code-import-method-on-branchtarget/+merge/22190 has conflicts
[02:16] <james_w> I'm not sure that AssertionError is the right error to be raising
[02:17] <mwhudson> um
[02:17] <james_w> yeah, I don't see them
[02:18] <mwhudson> or at least the mp page claims it has conflicts
[02:18] <mwhudson> that's a bit odd
[02:18] <james_w> I think it's something to do with the prerequisite branches
[02:22] <james_w> yeah, a prerequisite branch has conflicts with devel, fixing that now
[02:27] <mwhudson> james_w: it all looks good, apart from a few details on whitespace of all things
[02:27] <james_w> great
[02:33] <mwhudson> james_w: balls, reviewed the wrong proposal
[02:34] <james_w> oops
[02:34] <james_w> conflicts fixed
[02:39] <mwhudson> james_w: anyway, both branches reviewed
[02:40] <james_w> thanks mwhudson. Both fixed as well.
[02:41] <mwhudson> james_w: cool
[02:41] <mwhudson> james_w: can you land these yourself yet?
[02:41] <james_w> I cannot
[02:42] <james_w> now I must depart
[02:42] <james_w> thanks for your help
[02:42] <mwhudson> bye
[09:08] <wgrant> I'm guessing that there will be no OCR today, since Bugs is sprinting?
[12:45] <salgado> wgrant, I see only one branch from you on https://code.edge.launchpad.net/launchpad-project/+activereviews
[12:45] <salgado> is the topic here correct, do you have 2 branches for review?
[13:59]  * bigjools waves at salgado
[14:00] <salgado> howdy bigjools!
[14:01] <bigjools> salgado: hey dude, how's it going?
[14:01] <bigjools> I've got a nice branch for you :)
[14:01] <salgado> you soyuz people always do. :P
[14:02] <bigjools> this one's pretty easy as soyuz goes
[14:02] <salgado> :)
[14:03] <bigjools> popped you on the list of reviewers, you should get some email
[14:03] <salgado> cool.  will get to it in a minute.  just need to submit one of my own branches to ec2
[14:03] <bigjools> I should expand the MP description really
[14:03] <bigjools> thanks salgado
[14:22]  * bigjools needs food, bbiab
[16:32] <sinzui> EdwinGrubbs: can you review https://code.launchpad.net/~sinzui/launchpad/do-not-release/+merge/22239 for me. We need this landed today, or we must ask for an RC next week
[16:34] <jtv> henninge: not good English: "# Not matching format specifiers will not be validated."
[16:34] <jtv> "Mismatched" would work, or "non-matching."
[16:36] <jtv> henninge: about "# Failing is usually propagated by an exception."—that'd be "Failure."  And... when does it not cause an exception?
[16:37] <jtv> henninge: do you know it's safe to unicode(message_or_exception) in the GettextValidationError constructor?  You might trigger an encoding error right there.  May be safer to use repr(message_or_exception) instead.
[16:38] <jtv> henninge: in the validate_translation docstring, please backquote the reference to GettextValidationError
[16:39] <jtv> henninge:
[16:39] <jtv> 779+    elif len(translation):
[16:39] <jtv> 780+        msg.set_msgstr(translation[0])
[16:39] <jtv> len(translation) > 0
[16:39] <jtv> and, our coding standards require an else.
[16:40] <jtv> henninge: in "# Hide gettextpo.error in GettextValidationError."—"hide" doesn't sound right... how about "wrap"?
[16:41] <jtv> henninge: finally, "ignore_errors" doesn't seem to mean "ignore errors," but select between exceptions and a bool return code to indicate validation failure.  Assuming this is not easy to clean up, can you come up with a better name?
[16:43] <EdwinGrubbs> sinzui: sure, I'll review that now.
[17:23] <bigjools> salgado: hi there
[17:24] <bigjools> nearly done with the branch changes, but I'm struggling to get cancel_url and next_url working, it's completely ignoring them, any advice?
[17:24] <salgado> bigjools, that's weird. is it redirecting somewhere or nowhere?
[17:26] <bigjools> salgado: nowhere
[17:26] <bigjools> salgado: current diff: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/401913/
[17:27] <salgado> +    @property
[17:27] <salgado> +    def next_url(self):
[17:27] <salgado> +        # We redirect back to the PPA owner's profile page on a
[17:27] <salgado> +        # successful action.
[17:27] <salgado> +        canonical_url(self.context.owner)
[17:27] <salgado> bigjools, maybe if you return the value?
[17:27] <salgado> ;)
[17:28] <bigjools> fuck sake :)
[17:28] <bigjools> it's friday ok?
[17:30] <bigjools> salgado: so with those changes how's it looking?
[17:30] <salgado> bigjools, you know what, I've made this same mistake a couple weeks ago and it took me quite a while to figure out what was wrong.  maybe I caught your mistake so quickly because of that
[17:31] <bigjools> salgado: it's so easy to do, I really wish Python would warn if you don't return stuff from a @property
[17:31] <bigjools> defaulting to None is crap
[17:31] <salgado> indeed
[17:32] <salgado> bigjools, you can easily teach pyflakes to do that, I think
[17:32] <sinzui> salgado: how?
[17:33]  * sinzui has a custome pyflakes + pep8 linter and it does not report that case
[17:33] <salgado> sinzui, I might be wrong
[17:33] <sinzui> pep8 could be taught though
[17:34] <salgado> but I'd expect it'd be possible to hack pyflakes to check for @properties that don't return
[17:34] <sinzui> well, I think it would be easier to teach pep8 that pyflakes
[17:35] <salgado>          if not archive.private:
[17:35] <salgado>              link.enabled = False
[17:35] <salgado> -        if archive.status in (
[17:35] <salgado> -            ArchiveStatus.DELETING, ArchiveStatus.DELETED):
[17:35] <salgado> +        if not archive.is_active:
[17:35] <salgado>              link.enabled = False
[17:35] <salgado> bigjools, care to combine those two if blocks?
[17:36] <bigjools> salgado: right yep
[18:02] <bigjools> salgado: I have to finish now, I'll pop back later.  I'm not landing this branch this cycle anyway, I just need to be ready to land it at the start of the next so it can get some beta testing.
[18:02] <salgado> bigjools, cool.  I've just approved it, btw
[18:03] <bigjools> salgado: ok thanks duderino
[18:03] <salgado> you're welcome
[18:04] <salgado> sinzui, is the one you have queued the one that EdwinGrubbs is reviewing?
[18:04] <bigjools> rockstar: do you want to take a final look at https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~julian-edwards/launchpad/ppa-deletion-ui/+merge/21925 ?
[18:04] <bigjools> (ppa deletion)
[18:04] <sinzui> salgado: I hope so
[18:04]  * bigjools runs, goodnight all
[18:05] <EdwinGrubbs> sinzui: r=me
[18:06] <sinzui> EdwinGrubbs: thanks? did you have any concerns about the filtering of the obsolete/old packages?
[18:10] <sinzui> EdwinGrubbs: I think I may want to adjust to sorting of Product.sourcepackages next month. The order is alphabetical. It kinds of works, but If the primary use case is listing important packages, I think I want to switch to newest first. We will have to change this eventually because we as half way through the alphabet
[18:28] <EdwinGrubbs> sinzui: well, I saw that the test determined obsolete by whether there was a spph. I don't know if it would make more sense to check the distroseries status.
[18:29] <sinzui> EdwinGrubbs: the series status and is the cause of the no currentrelease. We removed the release. This will fix the old packages that are listed on bzr page
[18:30] <sinzui> s/and is/is/
[18:31] <EdwinGrubbs> sinzui: what do you mean by "we removed the release".
[18:31] <sinzui> EdwinGrubbs: I took the two properties from the branch that lets users say the project is not packaged. I can fix the sort order when I land that branch. I still am not certain the sort order is wrong. I just think the order can have surprises.
[18:31] <sinzui> EdwinGrubbs: We purge the old packages when the series goes obsolete
[18:32] <sinzui> EdwinGrubbs: looking at https://edge.launchpad.net/gedit, you can see that every package that is missing a currentrelease is also an obsolete series
[18:36] <EdwinGrubbs> sinzui: I think you are right that sorting by date would be better than the current sorting by name.
[18:36] <sinzui> right, hardy and hoary look wrong
[18:37] <sinzui> That comes from the model. Since it appears to be fore display purposes, I think I will try to change that in my next branch
[18:49] <gary_poster> james_w: switching here because I suppose this is the proper thing to do. :-)
[18:49] <james_w> I guess :-)
[18:53] <gary_poster> james_w: Did you consider AssertionError over ValueError?  I was gung ho for AssertionError, but then started convincing myself of ValueError.  I still lean towards AssertionError...ooh, no I have an idea I like better, maybe.  One sec, looking up.
[18:55] <james_w> I don't really mind what the error type is
[19:05] <gary_poster> OK, james_w, here is the trivia I'm struggling with.  Normally, the right thing to do in this case is to write a function (I'm going to suggest that we switch the class to a function anyway) that returns None.  That behaves properly with standard Zope calls: getMultiAdapter will raise a ComponentLookupError, and queryMultiAdapter will return None or the provided default.
[19:05] <gary_poster> By explicitly raising an exception we're breaking the pattern.  Raising ComponentLookupError (what I was considering) is not appropriate here because that's the responsibility of something higher up.  And the reason we are doing this is to help the user figure out what they did wrong.  In would be nice if the zope machinery had a spelling for that, but it doesn't.
[19:05] <gary_poster> So, I think an AssertionError is the right thing to do for our intentions: we're doing this to help a poor developer debug and fix their problems, which is the domain of an AssertionError.  A ValueError is an attempt to raise a "real" error, and would be the wrong "real" error (ComponentLookupError is the right error, if we get one at all).
[19:05] <gary_poster> So with all that, I would suggest changing the ChoiceErrorMarshaller class to something like this:
[19:05] <gary_poster> def choiceMarshallerError(field, request, vocabulary):
[19:05] <gary_poster>     # We don't support marshalling a normal Choice field with a
[19:05] <gary_poster>     # SQLObjectVocabularyBase-based vocabulary.
[19:05] <gary_poster>     # Normally for this kind of use case, one returns None and
[19:05] <gary_poster>     # lets the Zope machinery alert the user that the lookup has gone wrong.
[19:05] <gary_poster>     # However, we want to be more helpful, so we make an assertion,
[19:05] <gary_poster>     # with a comment on how to make things better.
[19:05] <gary_poster>     assert False, (...your message...)
[19:06] <james_w> ok
[19:06] <gary_poster> james_w: other than that, r=gary.  You cool with that?
[19:07] <james_w> yeah, let me make the changes so that you can confirm
[19:07] <gary_poster> ok cool
[19:15] <james_w> gary_poster: please re-check
[19:15] <gary_poster> ack james_w
[19:17] <gary_poster> james_w: +1.  I really would like (something like) the comment I gave to be there too.  People who know the Zope pattern will appreciate reading what's going on (like me, when I've forgotten all about this!)
[19:17] <james_w> oh
[19:18] <gary_poster> Other than that, that's what I had in mind.  I need to step out to the bank.  Would you like me to give you a merge-conditional approve so you can proceed without me?
[19:18] <james_w> done
[19:19] <james_w> I can't merge anyway, so there's no rush
[19:19] <gary_poster> heh, ok
[19:22] <gary_poster> you might not have pushed the branch, James, but I gave a merge-conditional
[19:24] <james_w> it was just waiting for the puller, it's there now
[20:05] <henninge> jtv: http://paste.ubuntu.com/401997/


[13:24] <benji> heh, I logged on twice to the canonical server instead of once there and once here
[13:29] <gary_poster> :-)
[13:30] <gary_poster> bac benji danilos gmb: call momentarily
[13:43] <bac> gary_poster: FYI, one of my friends tweeted this morning that there are TSA backups at RDU since they moved more airlines to terminal 2.
[13:44] <gary_poster> bac: :-( but thanks for heads up
[13:44] <bac> gary_poster: in the past i could go from parking the car to being at the gate in 12 minutes.  better plan for longer now.
[13:44] <gary_poster> yeah
[13:45] <danilos> bac, I missed your first sentence and was just imagining you with a very large backyard and a gate in the distance :)
[13:46] <bac> :)
[13:46] <gary_poster> The Crittenden Estate
[13:46] <benji> yay, text-overflow: ellipsis is finally in webkit, maybe Firefox 6 will have it
[13:47]  * gary_poster figures benji des not mean that he thinks Firefox 6 will have webkit :-P
[13:47] <gary_poster> does
[13:49] <benji> nope, that sentence was garbled :)  it was supposed to be something like "Gecko finally has text-overflow: ellipsis (like webkit)..."
[15:10] <danilos> benji, btw, are you finding your way around translations? would you need any help from me?
[15:11] <benji> danilos: I don't have any questions at the moment.
[15:11] <danilos> cool
[15:29] <bac> gary_poster, benji: some guys are asking about ways to efficiently handle large team (>10,000 members) queries over the API.  is there anyway to get a minimal reference to a person in a team membership list without grabbing all of the person data?  i don't see how and suspect there isn't
[15:30] <benji> bac: I don't think there is, let me double-check.
[15:30] <bac> benji: i've been using httplib2.debuglevel to watch the traffic back and forth
[15:30] <bac> it would be cool if, fer instance, you could just get a self_link or similar
[15:30] <bac> not in the current architecture i don't think
[15:31] <gary_poster> bac, yeah I don't think so.  This was the kind of thing that we were trying to rearchitect for this past Nov/Dev.  We don't have it. :-/
[15:32] <bac> drats
[15:32] <benji> bac: there is team.members_details which might fit the bill
[15:32] <benji> it doesn't give much info about the person, but depending on what they're looking for it might be enough
[15:33] <benji> if you want user names you could even be hacky and extract it from member_link
[15:33] <benji> bac: https://launchpad.net/+apidoc/devel.html#team_membership
[15:33] <bac> benji: hey that looks promising!
[15:34] <bac> benji: it is a unique identifier
[15:34] <benji> cool
[15:34] <benji> umm, I can't parse "it is a unique identifier" :)
[15:34] <bac> yeah, ok
[15:35] <bac> touche
[15:35] <bac> unfortunately it only shows direct members...  so, they'll have to work a bit
[15:40]  * danilos off to do some errands, see you in Dublin
[15:43] <bac> i think to efficiently support what they want to do we'd need to export participant_details
[16:02] <gary_poster> CHR!
[20:11]  * benji does CHR.
[20:38] <bac> bbiab
[20:38] <gary_poster> k
[21:27] <benji> gary_poster: I'm going AFK to finish packing.  Have to do lights/sound at church tonight for VBS closing so need to finish up.
[21:28] <gary_poster> ack benji.  have a safe trip & see you in Dublin!
[21:30]  * benji wonders if they'll let me check into my flight yet, goes to check.
[21:42]  * gary_poster goes to pack also.  bac, see you tomorrow
[21:42] <bac> bye
[21:42] <bac> it's mighty quiet here now


[22:43] <RavenholmDX> Heyo
[22:44] <zmoylan-hp> hi
[22:44] <RavenholmDX> What's up?
[22:45] <zmoylan-hp> not much. yourself?
[22:45] <RavenholmDX> Nothing much now
[22:46] <RavenholmDX> Where abouts you from?
[22:46] <zmoylan-hp> dublin
[22:46] <RavenholmDX> Cool, same
[22:46] <RavenholmDX> well, live there :P
[22:46] <zmoylan-hp> so new to irc?
[22:47] <RavenholmDX> Ha, no
[22:47] <RavenholmDX> just not a big freenode'r
[22:47] <RavenholmDX> think I've been on this channel before
[22:47] <RavenholmDX> years back
[22:47] <RavenholmDX> just hopped in for a gander
[22:48] <zmoylan-hp> not much activity here some days
[22:49] <RavenholmDX> Ah
[22:49] <RavenholmDX> I presume you're a 'buntu user?
[22:49] <zmoylan-hp> yup, xububtu usually
[22:49] <RavenholmDX> nice
[22:49] <RavenholmDX> long?
[22:49] <zmoylan-hp> light on old hardware.
[22:50] <zmoylan-hp> as main desktop since 10.04
[22:50] <RavenholmDX> Yeah, XFCE is pretty nice
[22:50] <zmoylan-hp> but used linux on and off since redhat 5.2
[22:51] <RavenholmDX> for enterprise?
[22:51] <RavenholmDX> or commercial I should say
[22:51] <zmoylan-hp> nah, home use or trying stuff at work
[22:51] <RavenholmDX> :P
[22:51] <RavenholmDX> cool
[22:52] <RavenholmDX> Never actually used Red Hat
[22:52] <RavenholmDX> Only computer I have right now, is running Ubuntu 12.10 for work stuff and Crunchbang for personal
[22:52] <zmoylan-hp> now it's all about the server but back in 5.2 it was use on any computer, even gasp a desktop
[22:53] <zmoylan-hp> always liked the look of crunchbang, just never got around to it
[22:53] <RavenholmDX> I have a bunch of Ubuntu Server VMs too
[22:53] <RavenholmDX> and ordered parts for an HTPC last week
[22:53] <RavenholmDX> so will be putting 13:10 on that
[22:53] <RavenholmDX> 13.10*
[22:58] <zmoylan-hp> if you want linux in dublin there will be a linux potd next week.  mostly folk from #linux on ilug.ie
[23:01] <RavenholmDX> forgive my ignorance
[23:01] <RavenholmDX> POTD?
[23:01] <zmoylan-hp> pint of the day
[23:02] <RavenholmDX> lol
[23:02] <RavenholmDX> just a meetup?
[23:04] <zmoylan-hp> crimbo meetup for the #linux irc channel
[23:04] <RavenholmDX> what server is that on?
[23:05] <zmoylan-hp> linux.ie
[23:06] <RavenholmDX> cool
[23:06] <RavenholmDX> already on :P


[17:56] <pavlushka> zaki: o/
[17:59] <pavlushka> zaki: have you tried cmus? (one aspect of it is hilarious, you can play music even in your server with no GUI, lol)
[17:59] <zaki> pavlushka, no
[18:00] <zaki> :|
[18:00] <zaki> pavlushka, https://cmus.github.io/
[18:00] <u-la-la> [ C* Music Player ] - cmus.github.io
[18:00] <zaki> this one?
[18:02] <pavlushka> zaki: yep