[01:38] <Kent_> Hi,I dualboot, and would like to have an encrypted partition that I can access from windows and ubuntu. Whats the best, most convenient way of doing this?
[01:38] <Kent_> I already have the spare partition, but I'm just thinking of what programs would make the process easiest. truecrypt?
[01:52] <duanedesign> hello Kent_
[01:52] <duanedesign> this wiki page is pretty good https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EncryptedHome
[02:24] <Kent_> Thanks duane, that works
[07:45] <master> hi :)
[07:46] <master> could someone tell me how can i read the ext4 filesystem from windows?
[08:28] <JackyAlcine> That's a good question he brought up.
[08:28] <JackyAlcine> I found a few drivers online for it, but they didn't work too great.
[08:28] <JackyAlcine> only with ext2, you'd think it would have fell back or something.
[08:30] <trinikrono> i think he left jacky
[08:31] <bioterror> JackyAlcine, ext2fs
[08:31] <bioterror> that might be the closest, and ext4 might be too new for it
[08:31] <JackyAlcine> lol, trinikrono, I know, but it just got me thinking.
[08:32] <trinikrono> i would use samba :D
[08:32] <JackyAlcine> trinikrono: Crazy question, are you from Trinidad?
[08:32] <JackyAlcine> lol
[08:32] <trinikrono> JackyAlcine: :D you know trinidad?
[08:33] <JackyAlcine> My best friend is from there, and I know about bake, sorrel and all the foods his grandmother makes.
[08:33] <JackyAlcine> I'm Haitian myself, though.
[08:33] <trinikrono> im the loco contact for here , well thats not too far
[08:34] <JackyAlcine> Woah! That's cool. Oh, I live in New York, though; my parents are Haitian and Cuban.
[08:35] <trinikrono> maybe i better pm you before we get in trouble lol JackyAlcine
[08:35] <JackyAlcine> Off to #-team?
[08:36] <trinikrono> #ubuntu-tt JackyAlcine we have no mods
[08:36] <JackyAlcine> Okay.
[09:23] <Andreas__> Hi
[10:37] <s-fox> Hello.
[10:37] <head_victim> Evening s-fox
[10:38] <s-fox> Good afternoon head_victim  :)
[10:39] <head_victim> How goes in your neck of the woods?
[10:42] <s-fox> Alright thank you, just working on my ubuntu wiki page ( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Silver_Fox ). How are things with you ?
[10:44] <head_victim> Thinking about working on my wiki page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JaredNorris after seeing how impressive yours is.
[11:18] <s-fox> head_victim,   I would hardly call my wiki impressive. It is just a list of things I get up to :)
[11:18] <s-fox> head_victim,  I like your wiki :)
[11:18] <head_victim> s-fox: well you get up to a lot ;)
[11:23] <head_victim> Wiki's are about the one thing I'm comfortable with
[11:30] <s-fox> head_victim,  I was just about to say if you need any help I don't mind helping you out
[11:32] <JoeMaverickSett> hello, s-fox & head_victim , good evening/afternoon :)
[11:32] <head_victim> s-fox: Hah, well artistic style is my weak link, I'm a fan of structure and order. I gave up on making things "pretty" a long time ago, probably why I like wikis, only so much you can do.
[11:32] <head_victim> JoeMaverickSett o/
[11:33] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: how's it going? MOAR WIKI? :D
[11:34] <head_victim> Heh wiki wiki wiki wiki wiki. You tell me how's it going, do you use chromium much and if so have you noticed the UBT header change recently?
[11:34] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: i've been using daily builds of Firefox4 lately. might check on it for ya. ;)
[11:36] <head_victim> I asked enough questions to work out a fix for the rounded corners on chromium browsers.
[11:36] <JoeMaverickSett> funny thing, chromium is now opening slower than firefox4 :)
[11:36] <head_victim> Loaded to ram?
[11:36] <JoeMaverickSett> nope, never done such things
[11:38] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: firfox4 and chromium (all daily builds) shows the same rounded corners. ;)
[11:38] <head_victim> JoeMaverickSett: yay, still working then. I stole the header concept for my loco so when I poked enough people to get a fix I wanted to release back upstream to UBT
[11:38] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: hope you don't have visitors with Opera, coz it's not showing rounded corners :P
[11:38] <head_victim> JoeMaverickSett: yeah apparently that's another bit of editing that they weren't sure what to do with
[11:39] <head_victim> Same with IE
[11:39] <JoeMaverickSett> ah, ok.
[11:39] <head_victim> Apparently they all have different border calls
[11:39] <head_victim> So essentially I just added webkit ones
[11:39] <duanedesign> motning
[11:39] <JoeMaverickSett> i think there's more of firefox and chromium users than opera or IE, head_victim
[11:39] <duanedesign> hmmm
[11:40] <duanedesign> m o r n i n g
[11:40] <JoeMaverickSett> duanedesign: morning :)
[11:40] <duanedesign> there we go
[11:40] <duanedesign> :)
[11:40] <head_victim> If you find out what the opera or ie ones are please let me know, would be good information to have
[11:40] <head_victim> It's nearly morning here duanedesign
[11:40] <duanedesign> ahhhh ie
[11:40] <head_victim> Well lets be honest, if you're advocating Ubuntu you'd be doing it wrong if you didn't have IE people visiting your wiki
[11:40] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: you live on the far east side of Australia?
[11:41] <head_victim> JoeMaverickSett: Brisbane, so yeah, Eastern Seaboard
[11:41] <JoeMaverickSett> IE = headache is all i could think about :P
[11:41] <duanedesign> head_victim: sure. Still a lot of IE users out there. For some reason
[11:41] <head_victim> Hah I'm about as technical as a 3x4 so no idea where to start
[11:41] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: ah, my timezone fits more with the Western Seabord of Australia (GMT +8) :)
[11:42] <head_victim> Ah I win, I'm +10!
[11:42] <JoeMaverickSett> :\
[11:42] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: if GMT+10 shouldn't you be in bed. :P
[11:43] <head_victim> JoeMaverickSett: well actually, yes I should be as I have to be awake in 6 or so hours, shiftwork is a pain
[11:43] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: oh and btw, Opera is still showing square corners btw, for you to take note :)
[11:43] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: :|
[11:43] <JoeMaverickSett> i have a whole day of lecutres tomorrow too :\
[11:43] <head_victim> JoeMaverickSett: I have a whole day of pacing the floor making sure 20 people are doing their job properly :/
[11:44] <head_victim> Swap?
[11:44] <JoeMaverickSett> head_victim: ah, sorry, nope. :D
[11:44] <JoeMaverickSett> i'm better with what i'm currently doing. ;)
[11:44] <head_victim> Oh, I just realised we're not in -team
[11:45] <JoeMaverickSett> :o
[11:45]  * JoeMaverickSett runs and hides.
[11:47] <s-fox> Hello JoeMaverickSett
[11:48] <JoeMaverickSett> s-fox: hiyas, how do you do? :)
[11:48] <s-fox> I am okay thank you, just working on my wiki
[11:48] <JoeMaverickSett> great. :)
[11:48] <s-fox> Also getting slightly annoyed at unicode
[11:48] <s-fox> But bleh
[11:48] <s-fox> How are you ?
[11:49] <JoeMaverickSett> i'm fine. thank you for asking.
[16:24] <mtkorb> I'm experiencing an issue similar to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.20/+bug/117303 and I ran the command "iptables -t nat -D POSTROUTING -j MASQUERADE" to fix it. This works for the current session, but when I reboot, the error comes back. How can I make this change permanent?
[16:24] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 117303 in linux-source-2.6.20 "lo ate my ip address" [Undecided,Won't fix]
[16:25] <charlie-tca> You have to save the iptables, and reload that table each restart
[16:27] <charlie-tca> I do that with a script in /etc/init.d/ and a link to it in /etc/rc2.d . I don't link anywhere else, since rc2.d is the one run when starting Ubuntu
[16:31] <mtkorb> charlie-tca: Ok I'll try that. Thanks.
[16:33] <doez> Hello. Would I need apache or whatever to make firefox understand that my file is php-scripted in Ubuntu 10.10? Right now its asking me to download the file when i load it in firefox.
[16:34] <bioterror> yes
[16:34] <bioterror> I remember so
[16:34] <bioterror> you need apache with php module
[16:35] <doez> Kay, thanks.
[16:35] <doez> Kind of retarded, but ok.
[16:35] <bioterror> hmmm
[16:35] <doez> When you download php you expect the stuff to work. Well, I did anyways.
[16:39] <mtkorb> What is the naming convention of files in rc2.d? They start with S and a 2-digit number...what does the number mean?
[16:52] <charlie-tca> the number is approximately where to run it, they run in sequence starting at 01 to 99
[16:52] <charlie-tca> the iptable should be somewhere around S90
[16:53] <charlie-tca> and yes, the capitol S is important
[16:53] <charlie-tca> They are just a link to the files in /etc/init.d, with the S and number in front
[16:59] <mtkorb> charlie-tca: The script doesn't seem to be working. It just consists of the command I mentioned and is executable by all. It's in /etc/init.d and /etc/rc2.d/S99iptables is a symlink to it. Is there anything else I need to do?
[17:00] <charlie-tca> You are using restore iptables command, right? since you saved it manually, that should be all it needs
[17:01] <charlie-tca> No, if you put that iptables command in a file by itself, it should work
[17:01] <mtkorb> ohh... How do I save and restore iptables?
[17:07] <halpbatman> k so guys.. I have a 10 inch screen and when ubuntu preference windows open
[17:07] <halpbatman> they often go outside the screen
[17:07] <halpbatman> how do i put a scroller on the side
[17:07] <halpbatman> or something
[17:13] <charlie-tca> mtkorb: I can not remember. I use a script, that is huge, to write a new firewall and masquerade every boot
[17:13] <mtkorb> charlie-tca: That's ok I think I've found it on the Ubuntu site. Thanks.
[17:14] <charlie-tca> take it back... looks like iptable-save and iptable-restore
[17:14] <charlie-tca> take it back... looks like iptables-save and iptables-restore
[17:16] <charlie-tca> mtkorb: might even be easier to use ufw, the ubuntu fire wall
[17:19] <mtkorb> I tried adding this to /etc/network/interfaces ....
[17:19] <mtkorb> pre-up iptables-restore < /etc/iptables.rules
[17:19] <mtkorb> post-down iptables-save > /etc/iptables.rules
[17:19] <mtkorb> but it didn't work
[17:29] <hggdh> mtkorb: /etc/network/interfaces carries the definitions of your interfaces (see 'man interfaces'), not commands
[17:33] <johnny77> Is there a way to find out what version of Ubuntu a certain software got added to the repositories?
[17:33] <charlie-tca> yes, johnny77
[17:33] <charlie-tca> rmadison PACKAGE
[17:34] <charlie-tca> will tell us the earliest active release it is in
[17:34] <charlie-tca> I don't know anything that tells you if it was added before the current releases
[17:35] <charlie-tca> what is the package?
[17:36] <johnny77> I'm looking to edit the Seamonkey wiki page. It has a command line installation instructions that are basically download unpack tar ball.
[17:36] <johnny77> However it is now in the repository.
[17:37] <johnny77> I'm just wondered when from the time the page was written to now was it put in the repository.
[17:37] <charlie-tca> seamonky has only been there since 8.04
[17:37] <mtkorb> iptables-save isn't printing anything. Isn't it supposed to print to standard out?
[17:38] <charlie-tca> not to my knowledge, it doesn't print
[17:38] <mtkorb> man iptables-save says "iptables-save is used to dump the contents of an IP Table in easily parseable format to STDOUT"
[17:39] <johnny77> charlie-tca: Since 8.04 is about to become EOL, then would it be safe to only include instructions that install through the repositories?
[17:39] <charlie-tca> I thought you had to direct it, though? It has been too long
[17:39] <charlie-tca> johnny77: yes
[17:40] <charlie-tca> It was in 8.04, too.
[17:42] <johnny77> charlie-tca: Thank you. That helps a lot.
[17:43] <charlie-tca> You are welcome
[17:44] <charlie-tca> wiki is a bear to maintain, once anything gets in it
[17:45] <mtkorb> charlie-tca: ok it works if I run with sudo. I noticed there's a file in /etc called iptables.sav. But even "sudo iptables-save > iptables.sav" says Permission denied.
[17:47] <charlie-tca> That's when you run sudo iptables-save > iptables.mine  and see if it works
[17:48] <mtkorb> still says Permission denied
[17:48] <charlie-tca> and if that works, does     iptables-restore > iptables.mine put it back?
[17:51] <mtkorb> it only works if i put it in my home directory...
[17:57] <mtkorb> charlie-tca: and when I run "sudo iptables-restore > iptables.mine" it just hangs...
[17:58] <charlie-tca> well, that ain't the right way then
[19:05] <gaurav_pawaskar> Hi guys, I have some basic doubts in coding in Ubuntu
[19:07] <bioterror> !ask | gaurav_pawaskar
[19:07] <bioterror> ;D
[19:07] <bioterror> oh
[19:07] <bioterror> is our bot in split
[19:07] <bioterror> gaurav_pawaskar, dont hesitate to ask
[19:07] <ubot2> gaurav_pawaskar: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
[19:09] <gaurav_pawaskar> I just got assigned with 2 bugs to fix. I found this command to get source package:  bzr branch lp:ubuntu/<packagename>
[19:09] <gaurav_pawaskar> is that correct?
[19:12] <seidos> gaurav_pawaskar: you might try in #ubuntu-bugs.  i need to install bzr
[19:12] <seidos> but i'll try it out if you give me a sec
[19:12] <gaurav_pawaskar> okey
[19:12] <ddecator> gaurav_pawaskar: yes, that will copy a branch that you can work on and then upload to lp as a personal branch, then request a merge of the changes
[19:12] <charlie-tca> actually, got to ask that in #ubuntu-devel. #ubuntu-bugs does not do the fixing, we do the getting ready to fix things
[19:13] <ddecator> charlie-tca: +1
[19:13] <ddecator> gaurav_pawaskar: there are wiki pages on how to fix bugs, let me find one a sec
[19:13] <charlie-tca> gaurav_pawaskar: thanks for not asking in #ubuntu-bugs
[19:15] <seidos> charlie-tca: thanks for letting me know
[19:15] <gaurav_pawaskar> then who actually write code to fix bug.. I am getting confused now :(
[19:15] <bioterror> gaurav_pawaskar, you're up late? ;)
[19:15] <ddecator> gaurav_pawaskar: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO/Bugs
[19:15] <seidos> *then who actually writes code to fix bugs
[19:15] <ddecator> you *should* be able to get all of the information you need from that link
[21:00] <mtkorb> I've been booting Ubuntu from a flash drive. I recently tried to mount 2 hard drives, and now I can no longer boot from the flash drive. It says "Begin: Running /scripts/local-bottom ... Done. Done. Begin: Running /scripts/init-bottom ... Done." And it freezes here.
[21:14] <kosaidpo|> hello guys
[21:15] <kosaidpo|> i cant make this radio extention  https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/hgjdhckebbdoobhniheihpdogeoeelbn to wok im using chomuim
[21:22] <mtkorb> Is there a way to manually unmount devices? Since I can't boot Ubuntu, I need to do it by changing something in the file system.
[22:28] <javatexan> is there a way to default all new monitors to twinview auto in Nvidia X Server settings app?
[22:29] <javatexan> I am running a laptop with ubuntu and it has a docking station, I would like for it to always use the 2 monitors hooked to the docking station instead of local screen.
[22:30] <javatexan> I travel so the docking station setups do vary, sometimes one monitor hooked to docking station, but most of the time there are two monitors


[23:56] <Asatru> Hi guys (im 24/7 in this channel) What script/software should i use to host a full mirror for ubuntu?
[23:56] <Asatru> Soon i get 8 gbit Fiber
[23:59] <Asatru> So i want to use 1 or 2 gbit to be a a mirror in northern Netherlands


[15:24] <ret2libc> hi! was the CONFIG_DYNAMIC_DEBUG always on in ubuntu kernels? I'm compiling a very simple HelloWorld module and I don't remember having to deal with /sys/kernel/debug/dynamic_debug/control ever
[15:25] <TJ-> ret2libc: it's been on for some time; can't say exactly when though
[15:26] <ret2libc> TJ-: would say at least 2 years?
[15:26] <TJ-> Yes, I recall using it
[15:30] <ret2libc> interesting... most probably i was using printk(KERN_DEBUG instead of pr_debug. Thanks
[15:38] <TJ-> according to my git repo, it was introduced to the common configs in ubuntu-saucy
[15:38] <TJ-> ubuntu-saucy:debian.master/config/config.common.ubuntu:CONFIG_DYNAMIC_DEBUG=y
[15:39] <ret2libc> wow... pretty old then! yeah it must be that i was using printk instead of pr_debug. That's why I didn't deal with dynamic_debug
[23:38] <ali1234> does the hwe-edge kernel have this patch? https://patchwork.kernel.org/patch/10009311/
[23:38] <ali1234> if so, it does not fix the deadlock :(
[23:38] <ali1234> if not, can it please have it?
[23:39] <ali1234> i guess since i am building dummy_hcd out of tree with dkms, i can just apply it myself
[23:42] <ali1234> hmm okay it does not have the patch


[00:04] <cjwatson> infinity: no - the situation on arm64 was a bit unclear and clouded by how unstable they are at the moment
[08:17] <flocculant> I assume people know, but just in case Xubuntu and Ubuntu xenial's didn't build yesterday, ubuntu hasn't today so I'm guessing xubuntu won't either
[09:43] <sil2100> Hello! I'm disabling the system-image importer for a short while again
[22:07] <superm1> could someone help me understand why fwupdate hasn't migrated from proposed?  it looks like all the builds were full of success and it's not in NEW or unapproved
[22:08] <doko> superm1, looks like it's waiting for fwupdate-amd64-signed ?
[22:08] <superm1> doko: how does that happen?
[22:11] <superm1> i'm not sure anything about how the signed packages get built, is it just a manual bump to fwupdate-signed's changelog and it will pull down a new binary from the archive during build?
[22:18] <xnox> superm1, i think you want to poke cyphermox about matching https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fwupdate-signed upload to get fwupdate migrating.
[22:21] <superm1> cyphermox: is it  just a new upload of fwupdate-signed like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/14057549/ ? if so i'll upload it
[22:22] <cyphermox> yeah that should be all, if fwupdate didn't change filenames or something
[22:23] <superm1> shouldn't have
[22:24] <cyphermox> right, doesn't look like it did
[22:25] <xnox> superm1, and e.g. signed files look to be in place e.g. http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/xenial-proposed/main/uefi/fwupdate-amd64/0.5-1/ and http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/xenial-proposed/main/uefi/fwupdate-i386/0.5-1/ are available.
[22:29] <superm1> okay thanks guys, i'll upload that diff then.  didn't realize the -signed packages were all manually done
[22:31] <xnox> superm1, it's a bit triky, as first package needs to build and publish, then a signed version is published into the archive in magic paths (e.g. /uefi/) and then we build another package which at build time fetched signed copy back from the archive and packages it into a deb.... to publish as normal "apt-get"-able package.
[22:32] <xnox> superm1, new apt has support to download and fetch arbitrary files, maybe eventually such chicken-egg-dances will be gone. and apt will simply download arbitrary files in release manifest.
[22:32] <xnox> superm1, but for obvious reasons builders do not have access to signing keys to do everything in one go.
[22:32] <superm1> xnox: ah yeah i was just wondering about if new apt might help here make this prettier


[01:16] <Electroale27> tod
[04:29] <Arcademan> May I ask is unity installed on Ubuntu-Studio :)
[04:30] <holstein> Arcademan: you have options
[04:30] <holstein> hmmmm
[04:31] <holstein> Arcademan: you can use ubuntustudio packages with unity
[04:31] <holstein> !vanilla | Arcademan
[04:32] <holstein> you can just install normal ubuntu with unity, and install the metapackages for the audio/video tasks
[04:32] <holstein> *not* ubuntustudio-desktop for example
[04:33] <holstein> that is gnome2 right now, and will be XFCE soon
[04:34] <Arcademan> may I ask for a list of packages that get installed in Ubuntu Studio :)
[04:34] <holstein> you could also install ubuntustudio and add unity to that
[04:34] <holstein> Arcademan: depends on what metapackages you choose
[04:35] <holstein> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudio/Audio
[04:35] <holstein> this is actually not bad https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudio
[04:36] <Arcademan> Thanks :)
[04:36] <Arcademan> Exactly what I was looking for :)
[04:36] <holstein> this is a package list
[04:36] <holstein> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/PackageList
[04:37] <Arcademan> :)
[04:39] <Arcademan> I may do Ubuntu Unity with the packages Thanks :) great dist :)
[04:39] <holstein> sure
[04:39] <holstein> you also dont need any ubuntustudio packages if you prefer
[04:40] <holstein> you can just install JACK, ardour, whatever else...
[04:40] <Arcademan> Yeah some of the packages don;t work on every hardware config ;)
[04:40] <holstein> hmm... not sure about that
[04:41] <holstein> some hardware is not very well supported in linux
[04:41] <Arcademan> like jack is not supported on my laptop lol yeah
[04:41] <holstein> but, thats going to be true of all, ubuntustudio and ubuntu or whatever else
[04:41] <Arcademan> Yip
[04:41] <holstein> Arcademan: the internal card works?
[04:41] <holstein> with alsa?
[04:41] <holstein> anything alsa uses, JACK uses
[04:42] <Arcademan> Umm no
[04:42] <holstein> if the card works with ubuntu, it'll work with JACK
[04:42] <Arcademan> Ah great :)
[04:42] <Arcademan> It works ok in Ubuntu but not in Ubuntu Studio
[04:42] <holstein> maybe you had differing versions
[04:43] <holstein> ubuntu = ubuntustudio
[04:43] <holstein> the hardware support is really quite similar depending on the kernel you are using
[04:43] <Arcademan> Umm it was 10.04 = 10.04 :P
[04:43] <holstein> should be the same kernels
[04:44] <holstein> Arcademan: you might want to look and see what kernel installed in ubuntustudio then
[04:44] <Arcademan> Yeah I plan to :)
[04:44] <holstein> eitherway, you dont need to install ubuntustudio
[04:45] <Arcademan> Right :)
[04:45] <holstein> just add JACK to what you got
[04:46] <Arcademan> ty mikeh789 :)
[04:46] <Arcademan> hmm seems Ubuntu Studio kernel is one ver behind
[04:46] <Arcademan> I should update lol
[04:47] <holstein> right, its probably the last -rt kernel
[04:47] <holstein> you can decide what to do about that... if its the -rt one, that the latest one
[04:47] <Arcademan> k
[04:47] <holstein> you can install linux-generic, and probably get the functionality from the hardware you seek
[04:48] <Arcademan> Yeah I played around with a few other dist I think I can get it :P)
[04:48] <Arcademan> Welll bbl ty ;)
[04:48] <holstein> o/
[04:49] <Arcademan> @set #ubuntustudo
[04:49] <Arcademan> K added :)
[07:11] <stephenthemartyr> hi had error that could not open synaptic because it could not copy users xauthority??
[09:02] <holstein> stephenthemartyr: thats something you need to use as root
[09:02] <holstein> not sure what the issue is... how were you opening synaptic? clicking on it?
[09:03] <holstein> open a terminal and type
[09:03] <holstein> sudo synaptic
[09:03] <holstein> and report any errors
[09:21] <stephenthemartyr> i ran out of memory because sbackup was making files like 14gig worth
[09:21] <jussi> holstein: gksudo ;)
[09:23] <holstein> jussi: good call :)
[09:23] <holstein> stephenthemartyr: you mean hard drive space?
[09:24] <stephenthemartyr> yes thats what i mean
[09:25] <stephenthemartyr> so i autocleaned and autoremoved in apt-get freed a little space
[09:25] <stephenthemartyr> been up all night.....again
[09:25] <holstein> yeah, my smoke alarm just woke me up
[09:25] <holstein> its malfunctioning
[09:26] <stephenthemartyr> damn that sucks
[09:26] <holstein> eh.. could have been worse.. could have been fully functional, reporting a fire :/
[09:28] <stephenthemartyr> yes that would be worse
[17:22] <HaNI_> excuse me, i have a problem... when i install ubuntu studio with vmware, i get this: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/14539054/random/PiX/US11.04.jpg
[17:23] <HaNI_> and the question is: how do i start graphical interface? i'm total beginner in linux
[17:25] <holstein> HaNI_: personally, you wont be able to take advantage of anything in VM
[17:25] <holstein> i wouldnt bother
[17:26] <HaNI_> i used backtrack5 and opensuse yesterday, and they worked just fine. so, studio wouldn't work in VM?
[17:28] <holstein> sure, and im sure you can 'get it to work'
[17:28] <holstein> im just saying, you wont be able to take advantage of any of the features really
[17:28] <holstein> JACK wont run well
[17:29] <holstein> any graphics or video editing you do would be *much* better on metal
[17:29] <holstein> i mean, you will get it working
[17:29] <holstein> im just saying, you will spend time on it, and the performance will be awful
[17:30] <HaNI_> hm, can you recommend me something else? i'm windows user, and i would like to learn about linux... what distro?
[17:30] <HaNI_> of course, it will run on VM
[17:31] <holstein> sure, just plain ubuntu
[17:31] <holstein> normal vanilla ubuntu
[17:31] <HaNI_> thank you :)
[17:31] <HaNI_> bye


[00:31] <apachelogger> stgraber: I think lxc-info output broke because stdout got messed up or something due to excessively too high load, also code wise it didn't make sense that for example the Name: line would be repeated so for now I'll let it pass as a load problem and keep an eye out
[01:30] <kees> tedg: if I have a gtk application, and it doesn't show menus due to whatever has been done to shove menus into the global menu bar... and I'm not running compiz.. how do I get my menus back?
[01:35] <mdeslaur> kees: what app is it?
[01:37] <mdeslaur> kees: chances are they migrated to gtk appmenus
[01:38] <mdeslaur> kees: oh, if you're not running the menu indicator, you can launch the app with UBUNTU_MENUPROXY=0
[01:41] <Bluefoxicy> that reminds me, I have to find the tweak that puts menus back somewhere sane
[01:43] <Bluefoxicy> I'd like to think one day, in 5 or 10 years, people will awaken from whatever confusion of ideas leads them to put menus at the top of the desktop space
[01:44] <Bluefoxicy> but I'm well aware that certain inobvious facts are hopeless to reason a normal person into
[01:44] <Bluefoxicy> It's not UI designers that put menus at the top of the screen; it's programmers who think it's a good idea
[01:44] <Bluefoxicy> they have the mistaken belief that the screen has an origin point, that the top left corner is (0,0), and that this has some meaning
[01:44] <mdeslaur> Bluefoxicy: menus are going away, they're all being put in hamburger icons now
[01:45] <Bluefoxicy> in truth, the computer screen is an artificial idea.  It's a position in space; the relative position of a window on that screen is also a position in space.  If you move the screen, you can move the window to put it back into the same position in space it was previously occupying
[01:45] <mdeslaur> Bluefoxicy: so you're saying Apple doesn't have UI designers? :P
[01:45] <Bluefoxicy> ... and then the menus have moved.
[01:45] <Bluefoxicy> mdeslaur: apple has a paradigm.
[01:46] <Bluefoxicy> It's well-known Apple does things the way Apple does them because either A) that's how Apple does it; or B) it's different and shiny and distinctly Apple (this is how Apple gets new things done the way Apple does them)
[01:47] <Bluefoxicy> anyway the simple version is this:  a window is a concrete, independent object; the desktop around it isn't.  Moving the window moves it arbitrarily relative to the desktop, meaning it moves the relative position of the window and the menu.
[01:48] <Bluefoxicy> When working within an application--when working on a sketch pad in real life, or any other physical object--the workspace shrinks down to that object.  In real life, you can reach to the same spatial position and grab something, so multiple things in your workspace are easily handled.
[01:48] <Bluefoxicy> On a computer, you manipulate a pointer device.
[01:49] <Bluefoxicy> Rather than reach to the absolute position on-screen, you have to judge the relative positions of objects in the full workspace (the whole screen) before moving from one to another.
[01:49] <Bluefoxicy> Putting the menus away from the application window means suddenly having to assess where the menu is in relation to the window when you want to use the menu
[01:50] <Bluefoxicy> That's the cold truth.  There are other esoteric arguments, like working with multiple windows with their own menus (seriously, two clicks instead of one); but the basis of it is that an application window is a whole thing, and putting the window at the top of the screen separates it into two things.
[01:50] <RAOF> Unless the menu is in an absolute location, in which case it's always “move the pointer top left”?
[01:50] <Bluefoxicy> RAOF: how far is the top left?
[01:50] <RAOF> Doesn't matter
[01:50] <RAOF> There's an edge.
[01:51] <mdeslaur> it's always in the same place :)
[01:51]  * RAOF → lunch, anyway :)
[01:51] <sarnold> besides vim doesn't have menus anyhow
[01:51] <Bluefoxicy> For me to traverse the entire screen can become physically challenging.  Particularly, I can't reach the bottom right; top-right corner is actually the easiest position for a right-handed person
[01:51] <Bluefoxicy> of course, I'm using a single 32 inch display
[01:51] <Bluefoxicy> a WIDE SCREEN 32 inch display
[01:51] <mdeslaur> Bluefoxicy: so you must be happy that you can move the menus back to windows in Ubuntu 14.04
[01:52] <Bluefoxicy> mdeslaur:  I'm having an odd time where some of my applications have menus in windows, and others have no menus and I've recently discovered how to access the menu
[01:53] <Bluefoxicy> LibreOffice has a menu bar, but also a top menu that brings up Preferences, About, Help, and Quit
[01:53] <mdeslaur> wow, that's weird
[01:53] <Bluefoxicy> try grokking that.  I have two menus, one in-window and one out, in LibreOffice
[01:54] <Bluefoxicy> and menu->preferences is the same thing as tools->options
[01:54] <mdeslaur> Bluefoxicy: what desktop environment are you seeing that?
[01:54] <Bluefoxicy> mdeslaur:  14.10 Gnome shell here
[01:54] <mdeslaur> ah, yeah, gnome split the menus in half
[01:54] <Bluefoxicy> Well
[01:54] <Bluefoxicy> that's stupid.
[01:54] <Bluefoxicy> I'll add that as #3 on my list
[01:54] <mdeslaur> yes, I definitely agree
[01:54] <mdeslaur> I don't like that at all
[01:55] <Bluefoxicy> #1 is the alt-tab behavior (applications instead of windows) in gnome-shell, which is so useless I no longer use alt-tab at all, ever.
[01:55] <sarnold> what was #1 and #2? :)
[01:55] <mdeslaur> wow, I didn't realize people still used alt-tab
[01:55] <Bluefoxicy> The most productive feature of the desktop environment--Gnome's old alt-tab behavior, where it grouped (Current desktop | other desktops) and would bypass the separator if you tabbed QUICKLY--has been turned into a pile of garbage
[01:55] <mdeslaur> isn't that a windows thing?
[01:55] <Bluefoxicy> Old Gnome did alt-tab well
[01:56] <Bluefoxicy> it was great if you were swapping between precisely two windows on the same desktop (on different desktops, just use ctrl+arrows to swap desktops back and forth)
[01:56] <Bluefoxicy> Often I'd be typing a response to an e-mail, and be able to tab between Thunderbird and the Compose window
[01:57] <Bluefoxicy> thus I could scroll a long e-mail in the main mail window, rather than scroll around in my quoted reply; or look at a different e-mail in a thread for reference
[01:57] <Bluefoxicy> with new Gnome, you hit alt-tab and it goes, "Well, your last window was Thunderbird.  So is your current one.  You must want CHROMIUM ON ANOTHER DESKTOP!" and takes you away
[01:58] <Bluefoxicy> no, my last window was another Thunderbird window, and that's what I want to tab back to.
[01:58] <Bluefoxicy> anyway
[01:58] <Bluefoxicy> #2 is that they altered the scroll wheel behavior in Activities
[01:58] <Bluefoxicy> Activities is the reason I use gnome-shell.
[01:58] <Bluefoxicy> it shows you an exposé view of a single desktop, and you can move up and down through desktops, created dynamically.
[01:59] <Bluefoxicy> You can drag windows to other desktops, or between desktops (to create a new one); and you can just type and it'll give you the application you want to launch.  So awesome
[02:00] <mdeslaur> in Unity, you can use Alt-# to switch between windows of the same app
[02:00] <Bluefoxicy> Previously, scroll wheel did mnay things.  Notably, moving the pointer over the virtual desktops and scrolling would move you up and down; while pointing at a window and scrolling would zoom in and out on it without having to leave Activities view, raise the window, and change pointer focus.  Leaving activities view sent you back to the window last used on the current desktop
[02:00] <Bluefoxicy> now, scroll wheel ALWAYS switches desktops
[02:00] <Bluefoxicy> I can't get a closer look at a small window in a cluttered desktop by zooming
[02:00] <Bluefoxicy> so, I will make split menus in Gnome-shell my gripe #3
[02:00] <mdeslaur> sounds like gnome-shell isn't for you
[02:00] <sarnold> control+scrollwheel? alt+scrollwheel? numlock+scrollwheel?
[02:01] <Bluefoxicy> gnome-shell is the best desktop I've used in history.
[02:01] <Bluefoxicy> I've used KDE, enlightenment, and even recent versions of xfce4 and unity
[02:01] <Bluefoxicy> unity is MUCH lighter than gnome-shell
[02:01] <Bluefoxicy> bring 2GB of RAM if you want to run gnome-shell.  Bring under a gig if you want Unity.  But I can accept that.
[02:02] <Bluefoxicy> That doesn't mean it isn't broken in a few places
[02:02] <Bluefoxicy> It's like a golf club
[02:02] <sarnold> wow, coming from i3-wm land, unity feels huge and bloated :)
[02:02] <Bluefoxicy> almost a straight stick, except for that bit at the end
[02:02] <Bluefoxicy> sarnold:  I used to use icewm exclusively for a few months too :)
[02:03] <mdeslaur> activities sounds a lot like what Super+S does in unity
[02:03] <Bluefoxicy> does it?
[02:03] <sarnold> .. icewm was the first win95-alike window manager, right?
[02:03] <Bluefoxicy> I thought Unity just brought up the 4 desktop quadrants
[02:03] <Bluefoxicy> and there are only 4 desktops; you can't drop windows between them to create new desktops, and it doesn't auto-destroy empty desktops.
[02:03] <mdeslaur> oh, I missed the part where you can launch apps
[02:03] <mdeslaur> right, and the dynamic number of tem
[02:04] <mdeslaur> them
[02:04] <Bluefoxicy> the Windows key goes straight into Activities on Gnome.  I tend to tap teh top left corner; really, hitting the Super key if you want to launch an app is better, since navigating the applications menus is ... a feature that should be left in for the curious alone.
[02:05] <mdeslaur> ok, so not similar at all
[02:05] <Bluefoxicy> never bother navigating the applications menu
[02:05] <Bluefoxicy> it's a pointless exercise
[02:05] <dupingping> Hi I hope become a ubuntu devel member.
[02:05] <dupingping> What do I do to do it?
[02:06] <Bluefoxicy> super -> s o f -> "Software Updater" "Ubuntu Software Center" "Additional drivers" -> click or use arrow keys to select the application to launch
[02:06] <Bluefoxicy> unity has a search bar too though.
[02:06] <Bluefoxicy> last I checked, it doesn't pick up immediately if you start typing; you have to explicitly tell it you want to search.
[02:07] <Bluefoxicy> anyway
[02:08] <Bluefoxicy> haha.  I remember how awesome Gnome's deskbar was supposed to be
[02:08] <Bluefoxicy> and that it never actually worked (it crashed a lot)
[02:08] <Bluefoxicy> by the time it was shaped up, nobody cared anymore
[06:13] <kees> mdeslaur: makerware! :)
[06:13] <kees> mdeslaur: UBUNTU_MENUPROXY=0 did not work.
[06:18] <kees> oh, whoops, it's Qt not GTK
[06:19] <kees> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/appmenu-qt/+bug/1045640 <- maybe?
[06:43] <pitti> Good morning
[09:05] <LocutusOfBorg1> Laney, what happens if I cannot reproduce the insighttoolkit amd64 failure in a clean pbuilder-dist vivid environment?
[09:05] <LocutusOfBorg1> I build it successfully with sid and vivid both amd64
[09:05] <LocutusOfBorg1> I can mail you both build logs
[09:26] <pitti> Riddell: hmm @ https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kde-workspace/+publishinghistory
[09:26] <Laney> LocutusOfBorg1: Erm, does it work in a PPA?
[09:26] <pitti> Riddell: so kde-workspace got removed in vivid, then apparently reintroduced with a security update, which failed to upload everywhere (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/vivid/+source/kde-workspace/4:4.11.12-0ubuntu2)
[09:27] <pitti> Riddell: and stuff like kdevelop needs kdebase-workspace (https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/vivid-adt-kdevelop/12 just failed)
[09:27] <Laney> bdmurray: looks like I forgot to push upload maybe
[09:28] <Laney> bdmurray: there
[09:28] <pitti> Riddell: I take it kdevelop and friends will be updated to thew new plasma-workspace, so that's temporary, but there was apparently some confusion about reintroducing kde-workspace?
[09:32] <Riddell> pitti: I uploaded the kde-workspace security, realised that wouldn't work since we had plasma-workspace to replace it and deleted kde-workspace
[09:32] <Riddell> pitti: there will be stuff like kdevelop that I need to fix up now yes
[09:32] <pitti> Riddell: ah, so we'll need to delete it again, I figure?
[09:32] <Riddell> pitti: did it reappear?
[09:33] <pitti> Riddell: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/vivid/+source/kde-workspace/4:4.11.12-0ubuntu2 is in vivid-proposed (the source)
[09:33] <pitti> the binaries failed to upload
[09:38] <Riddell> pitti: oh I guess I need to delete it from -proposed as well, no problemo
[09:38] <pitti> doko_: btw, gcc-4.9 has been a "valid candiate" since yesterday, but http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_output.txt complains about some uninstallability (i386: libstarpu-dev)
[09:39] <pitti> doko_: that one depends: gcc-4.9 (<< 4.9.1A) (WTF??)
[09:40] <pitti> doko_: looks like it's autogen'ed, I'll check if a rebuild fixes it
[09:48] <pitti> doko_: yep, helps; uploaded
[10:28] <cjwatson> flexiondotorg: I'm generally stepping back from this stuff over the next couple of months (see my blog), so it would be advisable to find somebody else release-team-ish to help you out.  If you have packages in trusty-updates then riding along with the next point release ought not to be horribly difficult, I'd have thought, maybe
[10:33] <lifeless> cjwatson: good luck with the move, hope it achieves your goals!
[10:41] <cjwatson> lifeless: thanks :)
[12:02] <Tribaal> hi all. Who should I talk to to resync the bzr branches for a particular package? It seems the branches are out of date compared to what is uploaded.
[12:09] <geser> Tribaal: have you checked if it's listed on http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/ with a reason why it failed?
[12:09] <Tribaal> geser: I hadn't, and it seems to be listed there indeed
[12:11] <Tribaal> geser: I'm not sure I understand what the failure means, however
[12:13] <geser> in most cases it either a bug or the package importer found the branch in a state which it can't handle on it's own
[12:13] <cjwatson> The whole package-import system is pretty much unmaintained at this point; any substantial bugs probably won't be fixed.  Should be much easier to do with git.
[12:14] <Tribaal> so, it's this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/udd/+bug/494481
[12:15] <Tribaal> I'd like to fix the situation for the package I'm interested in (landscape-client)
[12:16] <Tribaal> geser: so, what is the "current best" way to go?
[12:17] <cjwatson> Surely for landscape-client you should *not* be using UDD anyway, but rather proposing merges to lp:landscape-client.
[12:17] <cjwatson> The parallel import is counterproductive there.
[12:23] <Tribaal> cjwatson: so, what I'm currently trying to do is: build and release a new landscape-client pacakge to Ubuntu (starting with devel). Last time this involved attaching debdiffs to bugs, and was quite painful for everyone involved. So I suspect there is a better way to do it, and I'm trying to find what that is.
[12:23] <Tribaal> I thought it would be udd, but apparently not :)
[12:24] <cjwatson> UDD is not likely to make anything less painful at this point.
[12:24] <Tribaal> cjwatson: hehe noted :)
[12:24] <cjwatson> I don't quite get why you wouldn't just branch lp:landscape-client as needed.
[12:26] <Tribaal> cjwatson: so, maybe I misunderstand how the process works then. Let's say we'r ready to release now, I branch, push a "landscape-client-14.10" or whatever to lp. What happens then?
[12:27] <Tribaal> (how do we go from  lp branch to an available deb package)
[12:27] <ogra_> you make your branch a merge proposal against lp:landscape-client
[12:27] <ogra_> upstream merges it and releases a package from it
[12:27] <Tribaal> we do this on a daily basis, and merge on a daily basis
[12:27] <Tribaal> I am upstream :)
[12:27] <mdeslaur> kees: perhaps just uninstall appmenu-qt and appmenu-qt5?
[12:28] <Tribaal> I'm trying to figure out "..and releases a package from it" :)
[12:28] <cjwatson> you build and upload it from the relevant branch
[12:28] <cjwatson> "debuild -S" or "bzr bd -S" or whatever
[12:29] <ogra_> yoou call bzr bd in the branch
[12:29] <Tribaal> ok
[12:29] <Tribaal> and the SRU process remains debdiffs?
[12:29] <cjwatson> the SRU process does not require attaching patches of any kind ...
[12:29] <cjwatson> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
[12:30] <cjwatson> however if it is useful to point to the specific broken-down commits (and it may well be) you can just link to the commits on LP
[12:30] <Tribaal> well, so, we need a branch per release we target, at least
[12:30] <cjwatson> Sure
[12:31] <Tribaal> ok, I think I'm starting to see things a bit more clearly
[12:31] <Tribaal> thanks
[12:31] <cjwatson> np
[12:31] <Tribaal> I will probably shoot more questions - but at least that's a good start
[12:32] <Tribaal> :)
[13:52] <LocutusOfBorg1> I need a builder with at least 60GB of space, because insighttoolkit needs 55 and doesn't finish the build :(
[13:52] <LocutusOfBorg1> I tried to package the new release on costamagnagianfranco/locutusofborg-ppa
[13:52] <LocutusOfBorg1> to help finish the itk transition
[13:52] <LocutusOfBorg1> s/itk/gdcm
[14:10] <mdeslaur> cjwatson: my google-foo is failing me...what mounts /boot/efi at boot?
[14:14] <cjwatson> mdeslaur: should be in /etc/fstab
[14:14] <cjwatson> put there by partman-efi
[14:17] <mdeslaur> cjwatson: hrm, ok, thanks
[15:41] <bdmurray> Laney: did you want 2.4.6 in trusty or 2.4.7?
[15:42] <Laney> bdmurray: 7, did I miss that one too?
[15:42] <Laney> I probably dputted them at the same time and missed some error
[15:42] <bdmurray> Laney: its still 2.4.6 in the trusty queue
[15:43] <Laney> okay I just uploaded .7


[00:04] <mwhudson> menn0: do we have any friends at mongodb inc or who really know mongo details inside out?
[00:05] <menn0> mwhudson: I think niemeyer might know some people there, not sure otherwise
[00:06] <mwhudson> menn0: ok
[00:11] <mwhudson> to by now what is by now a general lack of surprised, switching to the mmapv1 storage engine makes the test much faster
[00:12] <menn0> mwhudson: doh ... so maybe wiredtiger sucks
[00:12] <mwhudson> yeah it's a bit odd
[00:12] <menn0> or maybe it's something about the way we use it
[00:12] <mwhudson> i wonder if there's some tuneable
[00:12] <mwhudson> this is why i would like to talk to someone who really knows their shit
[00:14] <menn0> mwhudson: start with niemeyer I guess
[00:14] <mwhudson> niemeyer: hello hello
[00:15] <mwhudson> huh i wonder about using https://docs.mongodb.org/manual/core/inmemory/ for tests one day
[00:15] <mwhudson> oh, enterprise only
[00:31]  * mwhudson is now reading spinlock code in wiredtiger...
[00:38] <redir> until tomorrow juju-dev
[00:47] <mwhudson> hee hee
[00:47] <mwhudson> After this operation, 1,356 MB of additional disk space will be used.
[00:47] <mwhudson> (installing juju-mongodb3.2-dbgsym)
[00:56] <niemeyer> mwhudson: heya
[00:57] <niemeyer> I'm on my phone so apologies in advance if the communication breaks up
[01:09] <mwhudson> niemeyer: ok, just wondering if you know a good person to poke at mongo inc
[01:10] <mwhudson> niemeyer: we have an issue where index creation with wiredtiger takes ~100ms vs ~1ms with mmapv1, makes some tests veeeerrrry slow
[01:12] <mwhudson> niemeyer: also it's 100ms of wall clock time but <<100ms of cpu time so i suspect it's waiting on a lock or something
[01:16] <niemeyer> mwhudson: Let me find a bug #.. Just a sec
[01:18] <niemeyer> mwhudson: https://jira.mongodb.org/browse/SERVER-21198
[01:19] <niemeyer> mwhudson: Very unfortunate indeed, and I could not find much support to actually fix the underlying problem
[01:20] <niemeyer> mwhudson: I haven't yet finished testing with libeatmydata
[01:21] <mwhudson> niemeyer: huh, let's try turning --nojournal off
[01:21] <niemeyer> mwhudson: You can't if --config is used, but you probably don't need that
[01:22] <niemeyer> (mgo does as it needs to ensure replicas work well too)
[01:22] <mwhudson> hm seems to help
[01:23] <mwhudson> of course i have so much debugging crud patched into my tree that its hard to tell
[01:25] <niemeyer> mwhudson: If you find something interesting please do let me know.. I'm struggling with the same issue.. Still using mmapv1 on CI due to that
[01:26] <mwhudson> niemeyer: will do
[01:26] <mwhudson> i should actually read the whole ticket too...
[01:27] <axw_> thumper: why should a non-controller-administrator model owner not be allowed to grant access to their model to someone else?
[01:28] <thumper> axw_: this is what I'm fixing
[01:28] <axw_> thumper: didn't you change it to that tho? was that temporary?
[01:28] <thumper> axw_: no, it was done that way when grant/revoke were added
[01:28] <thumper> in error
[01:29] <axw_> thumper: ah ok, I'm looking at the wrong function
[01:29] <axw_> thumper: so what will it be? only model owners can share?
[01:30] <thumper> anyone with write access to the model can share
[01:30] <thumper> and admins
[01:30] <axw_> thumper: hmm ok. I guess if you give someone write access, then it makes sense that they can delegate that to someone else. ok, thanks
[01:30] <axw_> thumper: just clarifying some docs
[01:31] <thumper> np
[01:33] <mwhudson> niemeyer: blah, 3.2 is still a LOT slower even without --nojournal
[01:34] <mwhudson> but it certainly does help
[01:35] <mwhudson> 3.2/nojournal: 20s 3.2/no-nojournal: 6.5s 2.4/nojournal: 0.3s 2.4/no-nojournal: 0.8s
[01:40] <mwhudson> and 3.2 with mmapv1 is ~the same as 2.4, this is mmapv1 vs WT, nothing else afaict
[01:45] <mwhudson> huh mongod doesn't start with eatmydata for some reason
[02:17] <mwhudson> menn0: btw i also filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1573286
[02:17] <mup> Bug #1573286: juju/mongo: oplog tests fail with mongod 3.2 <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573286>
[02:18] <menn0> mwhudson: yep I saw that
[02:18] <menn0> mwhudson: thanks
[02:18] <menn0> mwhudson: I'll jump on that once this SSH host key work is done
[02:18] <mwhudson> cool
[03:00] <menn0> axw_: do you happen to know off the top of your head what happens with "juju ssh" and windows machines?
[03:00] <menn0> do we explicitly block it or will it just fail because there's no SSH server?
[03:00] <axw_> menn0: windows client?
[03:00] <menn0> windows workload machine
[03:01] <axw_> menn0: I'm pretty sure it'll still try to connect
[03:01] <axw_> (and fail)
[03:01] <menn0> axw_: ok thanks
[03:01] <axw_> menn0: I'm bootstrapping azure, I can try it if you like
[03:02] <menn0> axw_: it's ok, it doesn't matter too much, more curious than anything
[03:03] <axw_> okey dokey
[03:10] <mup> Bug #1571687 changed: Azure-arm leaves machine-0 from the admin model behind <azure-provider> <ci> <destroy-controller> <jujuqa> <repeatability> <juju-core:Invalid> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1571687>
[03:19] <mup> Bug #1573365 opened: Can't bootstrap --upload-tools on trusty <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573365>
[03:49] <mup> Bug #1573365 changed: Can't bootstrap --upload-tools on trusty <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573365>
[04:25] <mup> Bug #1573382 opened: only one user can create local users <juju-core:In Progress by thumper> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573382>
[04:57]  * thumper goes for a wander
[05:46]  * menn0 is done
[06:01] <mup> Bug #1572707 changed: 2.0b5: panic when running juju register <juju-release-support> <landscape> <juju-core:Invalid by axwalk> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1572707>
[06:01] <mup> Bug #1573407 opened: juju show-user/list-users do not check authorisation <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573407>
[06:52] <mup> Bug #1573410 opened: trusty juju 1.25.5 having issues deploying xenial lxc containers <canonical-bootstack> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573410>
[07:31] <rogpeppe2> perrito666: i do now :)
[08:15] <dimitern> I figured out how to trick the unit tests into thinking trusty is still the latest lts :)
[08:17] <dimitern> mv /usr/bin/distro-info /usr/bin/distro-info-org && ln -s /usr/bin/fake-distro-info /usr/bin/distro-info
[08:18] <dimitern> fake-distro-info is just `#!/bin/bash\necho trusty`
[08:23] <dimitern> and make check passed for the first time since yesterday, just like on a good ol' trusty machine \o/
[08:41] <dimitern> babbageclunk: morning
[08:41] <dimitern> babbageclunk: any luck with the maas upgrade yesterday?
[08:44] <babbageclunk> dimitern: morning!
[08:45] <babbageclunk> dimitern: Well, it came back up when I restarted the vm this morning, but it's still reporting the wrong version.
[08:45] <dimitern> babbageclunk: via the CLI ?
[08:45] <babbageclunk> I'm doing the update/dist-upgrade dance now.
[08:45] <babbageclunk> yup
[08:46] <babbageclunk> I got a bit confused by the fact that apt doesn't have a dist-upgrade command, so I just did an upgrade (which definitely mentioned maas packages).
[08:46] <dimitern> babbageclunk: the vm where the maas contoller runs is xenial, right?
[08:46] <babbageclunk> do I still need to do a apt-get dist-upgrade as well?
[08:46] <babbageclunk> dimitern: yes
[08:47] <dimitern> babbageclunk: sudo apt dist-upgrade works for me btwq
[08:47] <dimitern> btw even
[08:48] <babbageclunk> dimitern: tsk, doesn't appear in the help or the man page! Presumably there for backwards-familiarity?
[08:49] <dimitern> babbageclunk: ha! you're correct - it doesn't appear in the help, but bash completion seems to suggest it.. I guess it's aliased to full-upgrade
[08:50] <babbageclunk> dimitern: I don't understand the difference - reading on askubunut
[08:50] <babbageclunk> uhbuntu
[08:50] <dimitern> babbageclunk: full-upgrade vs dist-upgrade ? it appears to do the same thing on my machine at least :)
[08:51] <babbageclunk> dimitern: sweet, that's emitting lots of messages about upgrading the maas installation
[08:51] <babbageclunk> dimitern: well, migrating it
[08:51] <babbageclunk> dimitern: It was the difference between upgrade and dist/full-upgrade I didn't grok
[08:52] <babbageclunk> but now I think I do!
[08:52] <babbageclunk> ha, didn't realise maas was django
[08:53] <dimitern> heh I still don't get the difference between full- vs dist-upgrade
[08:55] <babbageclunk> dimitern: yay, version is upgraded now - between that and bumping up the ram on the controller everything seems good now.
[08:55] <babbageclunk> dimitern: thanks for the help!
[08:56] <dimitern> babbageclunk: awesome! I'm glad it ok, as I was already feeling bad for suggesting it :)
[08:56] <babbageclunk> dimitern: :) would have been straightforward if I was a bit more familiar with all of the tools.
[08:57] <dimitern> babbageclunk: well, with my experience maas upgrades are rarely a walk in the park :D although it seems to be improving with each release
[08:58] <babbageclunk> dimitern: ooh, I wonder if that fixes the bug with the power settings getting cleared when the machine gets allocated via the API.
[09:00] <dimitern> babbageclunk: hopefully - they've made changes to the power handling, esp. around what's considered 'fatal error' (not to be retried)
[09:34] <voidspace> babbageclunk: dimitern: frobware: dooferlad: you updated your main machines to xenial yet?
[09:34] <babbageclunk> nope
[09:34] <dooferlad> voidspace: noooooo
[09:34] <voidspace> :-)
[09:34] <voidspace> dooferlad: I thought you probably wouldn't have
[09:34] <dimitern> voidspace: yeah
[09:35] <voidspace> dimitern: hah, cool
[09:35] <voidspace> I might wait a few days, I don't generally wait very long
[09:35] <dimitern> voidspace: I was eager to try maas2 2 weeks ago so I did
[09:35] <rogpeppe> a trivial change to the lxd provider, review appreciated please: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/4682/
[09:36] <voidspace> rogpeppe: LGTM
[09:37] <rogpeppe> voidspace: ta!
[09:38] <dimitern> rogpeppe: wait a sec please
[09:38] <frobware> voidspace: yes, for about 2 months now
[09:38] <dimitern> rogpeppe: why panic?
[09:38] <rogpeppe> dimitern: we've had this conversation before
[09:39] <dimitern> rogpeppe: I guess so, but can you remind me? :)
[09:39] <rogpeppe> dimitern: config.Schema is deterministic
[09:39] <rogpeppe> dimitern: and configSchema is a global variable that never changes
[09:40] <rogpeppe> dimitern: and we've run a test that calls environprovider.Schema
[09:40]  * dimitern has another look
[09:40] <rogpeppe> dimitern: so if config.Schema returns an error, there is some serious problem
[09:41] <rogpeppe> dimitern: the interface contract for Schema doesn't return an error (and why should it? a provider should be able to return its own schema without errors)
[09:42] <dimitern> rogpeppe: right, got it
[09:42] <simonklb> hi, I've experienced some problems with the hostname not being set in /etc/hosts when Juju with LXD as provider
[09:42] <rogpeppe> dimitern: this code is just the same in the other providers
[09:42] <simonklb> this is on 2.0 beta4
[09:42] <dimitern> rogpeppe: :) thanks for explaining
[09:42] <simonklb> I saw this: https://github.com/lxc/lxd/issues/1759
[09:43] <simonklb> would it be up to Juju to set this up correctly?
[09:46] <rogpeppe> jamespage: did that work OK for you?
[09:57] <voidspace>    []
[10:01] <voidspace>
[11:03] <simonklb> jamespage: I saw that you were involved here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/charms/+source/ceph/+bug/1365671
[11:03] <mup> Bug #1365671: juju + maas provider: ceph-mon doesn't listen on localhost and /etc/hosts points fqdn to <IP_ADDRESS> <cloud-installer> <landscape> <openstack> <ceph (Juju Charms Collection):Won't Fix> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1365671>
[11:03] <simonklb> Could you please clarify how this works now in Juju 2.0?
[11:04] <simonklb> I'm trying to setup the hbase charm on a local LXD environment but it complains about the hostname not being set in /etc/hosts
[11:04] <jamespage> simonklb, tbh I don't know how that would work in a LXD environment - the original bug was with MAAS doing some config it did not need todo.
[11:05] <simonklb> jamespage: do you know how cloud-init is configured? Is that something you can do with Juju?
[11:06] <jamespage> simonklb, juju manages all of that complexity
[11:06] <jamespage> simonklb, this charm? https://jujucharms.com/hbase/
[11:07] <simonklb> jamespage: yes!
[11:07] <simonklb> from that bug-thread you were in it said that MAAS was configured with manage_etc_hosts localhost - so is cloud-init configured per provider somehow?
[11:08] <simonklb> it seems like manage_etc_hosts is unset with the LXD only setup
[11:08] <jamespage> simonklb, its certinaly not the same with every provider...
[11:08] <jamespage> cory_fu, hey - do we have a more recent hbase charm than https://jujucharms.com/hbase/
[11:09] <jamespage> I wrote that for 12.04 and I suspect it needs to be removed from the charmstore....
[11:09] <jamespage> its certainly not been tested recently by the looks of things...
[11:09] <jamespage> dammit need to stop doing ...
[11:09] <jamespage> gnuoy is going to start fining me about that
[11:09] <gnuoy> I am...
[11:10] <jamespage> my fingers do it on auto
[11:11] <simonklb> jamespage: a more recent hbase would be even better, but it might be useful to know how to configure cloud-init with Juju (if it's possible)
[11:11] <jamespage> simonklb, juju intentionaly abstracts that away from the end user
[11:12] <jamespage> there may be configuration knobs per provider that change cloud-init behaviour, but nothing that will allow you to touch it directly...
[11:13] <simonklb> jamespage: right, seems wierd that they wouldn't make cloud-init setup /etc/hosts though
[11:14] <jamespage> "they" are right here so someone will be able to answer that definatively...
[11:14] <jamespage> ;-)
[11:16] <simonklb> haha yea, unfortunately the timezones make it so that my work day is almost over when they wake up :)
[11:16] <simonklb> atleast the americans
[11:34] <Garyx> Is the MAAS 2.0 support still wip?
[11:35] <Garyx> Just tried a new xenial MAAS setup and it gives me a runtime panic when trying to bootstrap
[11:36] <Garyx> Xenial repository seems to use Beta4
[11:42] <simonklb> jamespage: is it possible to run the hbase charm in hbase standalone mode?
[13:06] <mup> Bug #1571687 opened: Azure-arm leaves machine-0 from the admin model behind <azure-provider> <ci> <destroy-controller> <jujuqa> <repeatability> <juju-core:Incomplete> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1571687>
[13:28] <frobware> dimitern, voidspace, babbageclunk|run, dooferlad: going dark for a bit. need to get back to a working graphical login. my dist-upgrade didn't go so well.
[13:28] <dimitern> frobware: ok, best of luck then :)
[13:30] <frobware> I can't get my monitor out of 640x480... :(
[13:33] <voidspace> Garyx: latest master bootstrap should work, but containers aren't yet supported
[13:33] <voidspace> Garyx: so yes, WIP and you need to set the MAAS2 feature flag
[13:33] <voidspace> Garyx: it shouldn't panic though - although older versions did
[13:34] <voidspace> Garyx: so it's probably an older version you have (I hope)
[13:52] <cory_fu> jamespage: We have https://jujucharms.com/u/bigdata-dev/apache-hbase/ which is a bit newer...
[13:52] <cory_fu> But I don't think it's really been tested much...
[13:53] <cory_fu> HBase hasn't been a priority for us...
[13:53] <jamespage> cory_fu, probably more than my 4 year old bash version....
[13:53] <jamespage> py-juju tastic...
[13:53] <cory_fu> :)
[13:53] <simonklb> jamespage: I actually got your hbase bash charm working :D
[13:54] <jamespage> simonklb, wow
[13:54] <jamespage> simonklb, I struggled to remember I actually wrote it until I dropped into the code...
[13:55] <jamespage> must remember to leave more bug comments as mental notes for +4 years time...
[13:55] <jamespage> 1804
[13:55] <jamespage> golly
[13:55] <jamespage> oh no 2004
[13:55] <jamespage> apparenlty I can't add up either...
[13:55] <simonklb> haha, I had to modify it a bit to get hbase to work in standalone mode, but its running at least!
[13:56] <simonklb> for some reason I have an issue pinging the machine using it's domain name, pinging other machines by hostname works, but not the one running hbase
[13:56] <simonklb> the only difference is that the hbase machine is running precise but the other are running trusty
[13:56] <simonklb> is this a known problem?
[14:02] <Garyx> voidspace: happened on beta5 and beta4 for me :/
[14:02] <Garyx> voidspace: I set the featur flag so that it would try to bootstrap.
[14:31] <babbageclunk> ok, this is getting ridiculous - I'm going to have to spend some time working out why my computer keeps freezing.
[14:33] <ericsnow> katco: are we having our retrospective or just a normal standup today?
[14:33] <katco> ericsnow: standup i think... no need for a retro yet. although we should schedule one for resources before too long
[14:34] <katco> ericsnow: sorry, forgot to take it off the calendar
[14:34] <ericsnow> katco: np :)
[14:45] <simonklb> I checked /var/lib/misc/dnsmasq.lxdbr0.leases and saw that the hostnames are not registered properly
[14:45] <simonklb> it's not depending on the series though, scratch that, same problem with machines running trusty
[14:46] <simonklb> one machine registered ubuntu * and another just
[14:46] <simonklb> * *
[14:47] <simonklb> the ones that I'm able to ping obviously registered the hostname correctly, i.e. something like "juju-01f074e8-8788-44d6-87a3-a1861bd1e906-machine-0 *"
[14:47] <simonklb> any dnsmasq gurus here? :)
[14:51] <simonklb> looks like the machines register themselves with a different hostname first and then try to register again with the real hostname
[14:51] <simonklb> is this some kind of race?
[14:53] <marcoceppi> can we not bootstrap remote lxd servers?
[14:54] <simonklb> saw this came up years ago as well https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/maas/+bug/1043121
[14:54] <mup> Bug #1043121: deployed node cannot be looked up with dnsmasq on MAAS <amd64> <apport-bug> <precise> <maas (Ubuntu):Won't Fix> <maas (Ubuntu Precise):Won't Fix> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1043121>
[14:54] <simonklb> but for MAAS
[14:54] <simonklb> I'm hitting this with local LXD
[14:59] <natefinch> marcoceppi: we don't support remote LXD currently
[15:01] <katco> ericsnow: standup time
[15:09] <mup> Bug #1573659 opened: Panic in when bootstrapping MAAS 2.0 <maas-provider> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573659>
[15:12] <dimitern> frobware, voidspace, dooferlad, babbageclunk: guys, I'd appreciate a review on this: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/4685/
[15:12] <babbageclunk> voidspace, dooferlad, dimitern - I think we had this discussion last week, but no Juju-spaces sync meeting anymore? I should delete the appointment.
[15:13] <dimitern> babbageclunk: ooh.. I forgot, but yeah I guess no call today as well
[15:14] <babbageclunk> dimitern: oh, but should I keep the appointment in my calendar?
[15:14] <dimitern> babbageclunk: delete it, we will likely reschedule anyway once it starts regularly again
[15:14] <babbageclunk> ok
[15:17] <babbageclunk> dimitern: wow, that's a lot of scrolling
[15:18] <dimitern> babbageclunk: hopefully not too hard to follow - tried to mostly remove stuff and resist the occasional urge to refactor :)
[15:20] <babbageclunk> dimitern: yeah, it looks like just deletia. (And comment rewrapping.)
[15:24] <dimitern> babbageclunk: thanks!
[15:27] <mup> Bug #1573665 opened: Drop special-casing of precise once we no longer support it. <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573665>
[15:27] <mup> Bug #1573668 opened: bootstrap should really be add-controller <docteam> <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573668>
[15:28] <dimitern> voidspace, dooferlad, frobware: ping
[15:30] <dooferlad> dimitern: pong
[15:30] <dimitern> dooferlad: here it is http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/4685/ :)
[15:31] <dooferlad> dimitern: will take a look in a moment.
[15:31] <dimitern> dooferlad: ta!
[15:34] <dimitern> babbageclunk: btw that panic when bootstrapping maas2 seems to be when a machine has at least 1 nic with mode=auto and no subnet
[15:37] <babbageclunk> dimitern: ok - can I reproduce that in vmaas?
[15:40] <dimitern> babbageclunk: yeah, should be easy - just add a second nic to a node, recommission it, and try to bootstrap +maas2 ff on and --to my-node-hostname
[15:42] <dimitern> babbageclunk: this might help: http://paste.ubuntu.com/15983759/
[15:42] <babbageclunk> dimitern: thanks - I was still trying to unpack it. +maas2? ff on?
[15:42] <dimitern> :) sorry - too concise
[15:42] <dimitern> babbageclunk: with the maas2 feature flag enabled
[15:43] <babbageclunk> dimitern: Ha! should have known that.
[15:43] <alexisb> fwereade, ping
[15:43] <babbageclunk> dimitern: ok - I'll try to chase it down now.
[15:46] <dimitern> babbageclunk: thanks! cherylj filed a bug 1573659
[15:46] <mup> Bug #1573659: Panic in when bootstrapping MAAS 2.0 <maas-provider> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573659>
[15:48] <dimitern> babbageclunk: some logs/context here as well -  https://github.com/juju/juju/issues/5259#issuecomment-213466954 (telltale sign of a link without subnet - mode=auto, is this log message `interfaces.go:274 interface "eno4" has no address`, just before the panic)
[16:04] <voidspace> dimitern: another monster review from dimitern
[16:04] <voidspace> dimitern: grabbing coffee first
[16:04] <babbageclunk> dimitern: hmm, I added another nic and recommissioned, but now it doesn't show any network for the node. Do I need to add both of them?
[16:04] <dimitern> voidspace: it's mostly removals :)
[16:05] <dimitern> babbageclunk: doesn't show *any* interfaces after commissioning?
[16:05] <babbageclunk> dimitern: nope
[16:06] <dimitern> babbageclunk: can you paste the output of 'maas .. interfaces read <node-id>' ?
[16:07] <perrito666> anyone else experiencing tests not passing for xenial?
[16:07] <babbageclunk> dimitern: hang on, I tried removing it and recommissioning to see what I saw then.
[16:09] <dimitern> perrito666: you're on xenial?
[16:10] <dimitern> perrito666: I managed to get them passing by moving /usr/bin/distro-info out of the way and replacing it with a bash script that simply outputs "trusty"
[16:10] <perrito666> dimitern: that is..... no, I wont do that, tests need fixing
[16:11] <dimitern> perrito666: yeah, I tried that for 2h yesterday and decided I have enough other stuff to do :)
[16:11] <perrito666> dimitern: ok, that gives me an idea of the order of magnitude
[16:11] <perrito666> but, this is also something that broke recently
[16:13] <babbageclunk> dimitern: should I add the nic on a different network?
[16:14] <dimitern> babbageclunk: just leave it unconfigured
[16:14] <alexisb> fwereade, I am going to have cherylj hand off the quick fix for bug 1572237
[16:14] <mup> Bug #1572237: juju rc1 loses agents during a lxd deploy <lxd-provider> <juju-core:Triaged by fwereade> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1572237>
[16:15] <alexisb> unless you speak now
[16:15] <alexisb> we will need to try and get something in today
[16:15] <babbageclunk> dimitern: ah, ok - that's probably what I got wrong.
[16:15] <cherylj> ericsnow, katco ping?
[16:15] <ericsnow> cherylj: hi
[16:15] <babbageclunk> dimitern: (sorry to keep bugging you)
[16:16] <cherylj> hey ericsnow, that bug alexisb just mentioned is super critical and we need someone to see if there's a quick fix we can do for it.
[16:16] <babbageclunk> dimitern: how do I leave it unconfigured?
[16:16] <ericsnow> cherylj: I'll take a look
[16:16] <cherylj> ericsnow: want to do a quick HO to see if you would be comfortable taking it?
[16:16] <dimitern> babbageclunk: leave both dropdowns (subnet and address) Unconfigured?
[16:16] <babbageclunk> dimitern: just leave out the bridge name?
[16:17] <dimitern> babbageclunk: what bridge?
[16:17] <ericsnow> cherylj: only if you think it would help :)
[16:17] <babbageclunk> dimitern: the dropdowns are network source and device model.
[16:18] <cherylj> ericsnow: I looked through the bug again, and fwereade did put in his update about a possible solution, so just let me know if you have questions
[16:18] <babbageclunk> dimitern: hang on - dropdowns in VMM or MAAS ui? I'm talking about the VMM ui
[16:18] <ericsnow> cherylj: k
[16:18] <cherylj> I couldn't remember if he had updated the bug with that info or not
[16:19] <dimitern> babbageclunk: ah, sorry
[16:19] <dimitern> babbageclunk: in the virt-manager connect both NICs to the same bridge (maas-19-int in my case)
[16:23] <babbageclunk> dimitern: Ok, now I've got two interfaces, one unconfigured.
[16:24] <babbageclunk> dimitern: Does this look right? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15984913/
[16:24] <perrito666> cherylj: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/5262
[16:25] <dimitern> babbageclunk: great, so bootstrapping with --upload-tools --to <node-name> should (hopefully) reproduce the panic
[16:25] <perrito666> as small as it looks, that fixes most of the remaining windows tests
[16:25] <dimitern> babbageclunk: yeah - notice how the second (ens9) is mode=link_up only, no subnet
[16:28] <babbageclunk> dimitern: ok, go it!
[16:28] <babbageclunk> dimitern: duh, got
[16:29] <dimitern> babbageclunk: nice!
[16:29] <babbageclunk> dimitern: I mean, the panic at least.]
[16:31] <dimitern> babbageclunk: passing also --config=logging-config='<root>=TRACE' combined with some additional trace logging (if needed) around maas2Interfaces should show the cause
[16:32] <cherylj> perrito666: did you live test on windows?
[16:32] <babbageclunk> dimitern: ok, thanks - I can see where it is, although it's odd - there's a nil check immediately before it.
[16:32] <babbageclunk> dimitern: ok, digging a bit more.
[16:32] <dimitern> babbageclunk: thanks for looking into that
[16:33] <dimitern> babbageclunk: nil checks on an interface value might be misleading btw
[16:33] <dimitern> babbageclunk: the infamous double nil dereference
[16:33] <babbageclunk> dimitern: Ok - that's almost certainly the problem.
[16:33] <dimitern> (usually concerns errors only, but..)
[16:33] <babbageclunk> dimitern: I've heard of that but hadn't ever seen it in the wild before!
[16:34] <perrito666> cherylj: I did, I actually am fixing those on windows
[16:35] <cherylj> perrito666: nice :)
[16:36] <katco> cherylj: wow sorry i completely missed your ping... did you get what you needed?
[16:36] <babbageclunk> dimitern: hmm. It sounds like the right fix for that is to make the subnet methods handle a nil receiver.
[16:36] <dimitern> babbageclunk: here's some info on that if you're interested: http://devs.cloudimmunity.com/gotchas-and-common-mistakes-in-go-golang/index.html#nil_in_nil_in_vals
[16:36] <cherylj> katco: yes, thanks :)
[16:36] <katco> cherylj: k, sorry about that
[16:36] <katco> ericsnow: ta
[16:36] <cherylj> katco: no worries
[16:36] <babbageclunk> dimitern: given that I can't cast to the real underlying type.
[16:36] <babbageclunk> dimitern: since it's private in another package.
[16:37] <babbageclunk> dimitern: and reflection seems like the wrong thing to use here.
[16:37] <dimitern> babbageclunk: well, if the gomaasapi.Subnet interface's implementation uses non-pointer receivers (as they just access the data already populated in the unexported fields)
[16:37] <perrito666> cherylj: I need to suffer to fix those in order to feel the same that windows feels :p
[16:37] <cherylj> haha
[16:39] <babbageclunk> dimitern: no, no value receivers.
[16:41] <voidspace> dimitern: that's a lot of code removed!
[16:41] <voidspace> dimitern: still reading
[16:46] <dimitern> voidspace: :) hopefully more to come soon
[16:47] <babbageclunk> dimitern: were you halfway through a thought?
[16:47] <voidspace> dimitern: heh
[16:47] <voidspace> dimitern: I'm on page 3
[16:47] <voidspace> of 76 apparently...
[16:47] <voidspace> possibly a slight exaggeration
[16:47] <dimitern> voidspace: might be easier to look the diff on github instead
[16:48] <babbageclunk> dimitern: Hmm - I could add an IsNil method to gomaasapi.Subnet. Is that idiomatic?
[16:48] <dimitern> babbageclunk: I wanted to also remove a few other things, but that would have made it harder to follow
[16:48] <voidspace> dimitern: appreciated
[16:49] <dimitern> babbageclunk: nope, how about just changing gomaasapi.subnet's methods to use non-pointer receivers?
[16:50] <babbageclunk> dimitern: oh, I see. Does that work? Trying now in the playground. If so I'll do that.
[16:52] <dimitern> babbageclunk: for example: http://play.golang.org/p/pAHQEQEunJ
[16:56] <babbageclunk> dimitern: How does that help? They both panic.
[16:56] <babbageclunk> dimitern: oh, hang on - I think I'm misreading
[16:57] <dimitern> babbageclunk: that might be a better example actually: http://paste.ubuntu.com/15985771/
[16:57] <dimitern> babbageclunk: it's not quite there yet, but it's a start
[16:57] <babbageclunk> dimitern: not quite analogous - they they're both == nil.
[17:00] <babbageclunk> dimitern: but the problem is that the subnet's nil - do you mean do the same thing to the links?
[17:01] <dimitern> babbageclunk: yeah, that's one option
[17:02] <babbageclunk> dimitern: why does that help? you've just changed the point at which the address gets taken - does that change how the interface gets constructed?
[17:02] <babbageclunk> dimitern: sorry if I'm being dense.
[17:02] <dimitern> babbageclunk: basically change the whole chain interface->link->subnet->vlan to ensure no dangling pointers
[17:02] <babbageclunk> dimitern: ok, I think I see
[17:03] <dimitern> babbageclunk: or, alternatively make sure any method that returns an interface does check the pointer field != nil before
[17:04] <babbageclunk> dimitern: I think it has to be that, right?
[17:04] <dimitern> babbageclunk: the crux of the problem is that getters-returning-interfaces should also return either an error or at least a "exists" bool flag
[17:04] <babbageclunk> So interface.Subnet() shouldn't return Subnet(nil), it should return nil
[17:05] <dimitern> babbageclunk: that' won't help though
[17:05] <babbageclunk> Oh, but can it do that? It doesn't return a *Subnet.
[17:05] <dimitern> babbageclunk: as the compiler will silently wrap the nil in a non-nil interface instance
[17:06] <babbageclunk> dimitern: ok, that's what I thought.
[17:06] <dimitern> babbageclunk: e.g. if link.Subnet() returned (Subnet, bool) instead of just Subnet, and use the bool to indicate whether l.subnet == nil..
[17:07] <babbageclunk> dimitern: Ok, so then I think you're right
[17:07] <cherylj> perrito666: can we count on c: always being the root?
[17:07] <dimitern> it will be a lot more natural to the caller to check firs the flag and only then try to use the subnet interface
[17:07] <perrito666> cherylj: I was clear on "just do this for tests and fake paths" :)
[17:07] <perrito666> cherylj: otherwise no, you cant
[17:07] <perrito666> cherylj: there is no "root" on windows, or at least is not such a clear concept
[17:08] <babbageclunk> dimitern: Or the other way would be to have IsNil methods on all of those interfaces. But I think you're right, the other way is probably more Go-y.
[17:08] <cherylj> perrito666: okay, thanks.   :)
[17:08] <perrito666> cherylj: ask as much as you like I am really happy to share the windowsness
[17:09] <babbageclunk> dimitern: that's kind of a nasty gotcha.
[17:09] <dimitern> babbageclunk: you can check for if subnet != nil, assuming 'subnet' is an interface, coming from a func that returns either the implementation or a plain nil
[17:10] <dimitern> babbageclunk: and because this happens a lot with errors, that's why we have jc.ErrorIsNil vs gc.IsNil
[17:10] <voidspace> dimitern: LGTM
[17:10] <dimitern> voidspace: \o/ tyvm
[17:11] <voidspace> dimitern: nice work, thank you
[17:11] <dimitern> dooferlad: I'll wait for your review as well - will check back in a hour or so
[17:11] <babbageclunk> dimitern: but there's no way we can change our interface to do that, right?
[17:12] <dimitern> voidspace: cheers
[17:12] <dimitern> (well  - it was a pleasure to see old mistakes go away)
[17:12] <babbageclunk> dimitern: If the implementation methods returned (eg) *vlan instead of VLAN would that help?
[17:13] <dimitern> babbageclunk: yeah, but that trail has long left :)
[17:13] <babbageclunk> dimitern: because the interfaces would still return VLAN
[17:13] <dimitern> babbageclunk: another reason why you should take interface arguments but return concrete (pod) types
[17:13] <babbageclunk> dimitern: *interface methods I mean
[17:15] <babbageclunk> dimitern: hard to do testing with that, though.
[17:16] <dimitern> babbageclunk: I need to leave now, but I'm sure you can figure it out
[17:16] <dimitern> :)
[17:16] <babbageclunk> dimitern: same!
[17:16] <babbageclunk> dimitern: Thanks for all the help - have a lovely weekend!
[17:16]  * babbageclunk isn't as sure he can figure it out.
[17:16] <dimitern> changing a few methods to return (interface-result, bool-flag) should be easy (and also to test)
[17:17] <dimitern> babbageclunk: cheers! likewise ;)
[17:17] <babbageclunk> yup yup
[17:43] <mup> Bug #1573681 opened: conflict when managing LXD storage with Juju 2.0 <kanban-cross-team> <landscape> <juju-core:New> <Juju Charms Collection:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573681>
[18:35] <redir> ericsnow: you wanted to review this WIP?
[18:38] <ericsnow> redir: sure
[18:38] <ericsnow> redir: it might be a little while as I'm working on a priority bug
[18:38] <redir> ericsnow: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/4689/
[18:38] <redir> np
[18:39] <redir> I'll keep chugging on the other LTS things.
[18:39] <redir> They need to land all at once. But incremental reviews would make it much easier.
[18:39] <redir> ericsnow: ^
[18:39] <ericsnow> redir: k
[18:43] <mup> Bug #1573741 opened: 2.0-rc1 cannot deploy in azure <azure-provider> <blocker> <ci> <deploy> <regression> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573741>
[18:43] <mup> Bug #1573742 opened: Newly provisioned machines start off at the controller's version. <juju-core:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1573742>
[20:45] <redir_lunch> does juju still use zookeeper?
[20:47] <katco> redir: it does not
[20:48] <redir> katco: that was my understanding. Just see comments referencing making sure it is configured to start...
[20:48] <katco> redir: where is that?
[20:49] <redir> provider/ec2 tests
[20:49] <redir> katco: ^
[20:49] <katco> redir: if you're nearby, create a small patch to remove those comments
[20:50] <redir> katco: I am working on that test so I'll do it in the drive by
[20:50] <katco> redir: nice, good find :)
[20:50] <katco> redir: and ta
[20:50] <redir> katco: I think I'll have a qq here in this test. i
[20:51] <redir> katco: It is testing the cloud-init stuff which will be significantly different in xenial due to the change to systemd
[20:51] <redir> katco: wondering if we need seperate tests for xenial and pre-xenial
[20:53] <katco> redir: i didn't want to get into it this morning, but the fact that our tests don't work on different releases is a huge smell to me
[20:53] <katco> redir: i.e. unit tests really shouldn't be affected by what release you're on
[21:03] <redir> katco: agreed.
[22:56] <redir> ericsnow: resubmitted a PR that has all passing tests rebased on master. RB: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/4691/
[22:56] <ericsnow> redir: k
[22:59] <redir> or if there's anyone else that wants to review that ^^ feel free
[22:59] <alexisb> ericsnow is busy
[22:59] <alexisb> saving the world
[23:01] <redir> alexisb: yeah, that's why I said or anyone else. ericsnow has a full plate
[23:02] <redir> and it is late on friday, so the reviewer pool is shallow
[23:03] <alexisb> redir, I would do it for you but I am not an official reviewer so you would need another +1 besides me
[23:03] <redir> alexisb: understood:)
[23:04]  * redir goes to look at the board
[23:09] <mgz> ha!
[23:09] <mgz> redir: (looking, btw)
[23:10] <mgz> one of the ec2 local server suite tests actually had 'zookeeper' in a commen
[23:10] <mgz> so not only was it ported verbatim from pyjuju and not corrected, no one looked at it since
[23:11] <alexisb> heh
[23:14] <redir> mgz: tx
[23:15] <mgz> not wild about the way these bundle tests are written, but I guess it's 2 years before we have to edit all these strings again
[23:15] <mgz> the alternative is I guess faking out the series selection stuff at the suite level,
[23:16] <redir> mgz: you are not alone
[23:16] <redir> 2.1!
[23:16] <redir> :)
[23:24] <mgz> redir: and the ec2 bootstrap test is just a fork of the existing one in two, so I won't nitpick it
[23:26] <redir> mgz yeah that could have been smarter
[23:27] <mgz> redir: review'd
[23:29] <alexisb> mgz, thank you especially given it is nearly  your saturday
[23:29] <mgz> alexisb: it is totally saturday :)
[23:30] <alexisb> mgz, are you UTC or UTC+1
[23:30] <mgz> In summer time so... +1 atm?
[23:30] <alexisb> :) well in that case, dude! go enjoy your weekend
[23:32] <mgz> hey, I've got 9 hours till saturday morning squash
[23:33] <perrito666> mgz: here we call this friday night, and spend it drinking
[23:36] <mgz> perrito666: what's the bootstrap wait loop change about in your windows tests pr?
[23:36] <mgz> it looks reasonable, just not sure how it's connected
[23:37] <perrito666> a race condition
[23:38] <mgz> perrito666: review'd
[23:38] <perrito666> mgz: in go 1.6, in windows, it will sometimes end withouth returning lastErr because of the select having hc.closed firing first
[23:38] <perrito666> mgz: why this happens only in windows, beats me
[23:39] <perrito666> it should be happening in linux too
[23:39] <mgz> perrito666: some socket implementation detail? I'd expect that to be the case on all platforms.
[23:39] <perrito666> mgz: could be
[23:39] <perrito666> in any case, the logic was begging for that race to happen
[23:40] <perrito666> I wish it was easier to track though :p
[23:41] <redir> mgz: commented on your comment.
[23:43] <mgz> redir: don't see it? hit publish mabe?
[23:43] <redir> mmm yup I was muted on RB
[23:44] <redir> mgz: the tests fail if they don't match up.
[23:44] <mgz> redir: right, I expect that to be the case
[23:44] <redir> so they can't be unique
[23:45] <mgz> the question is do we care to fix them so the tests actually end up with exactly one image
[23:45] <redir> or they are unique in export_test
[23:45] <mgz> which they know what it is
[23:45] <redir> they do end up with one of the images in export_test
[23:45] <mgz> but, if it makese sense in the context of the test, feel free to drip the issue
[23:45] <redir> depending on what constraints are applied
[23:45] <redir> OK
[23:45] <redir> dropping
[23:45] <redir> or dripping
[23:45] <redir> as it were
[23:45] <redir> tx
[23:46] <mgz> perrito666: you win funny find/replace error of the day
[23:46] <perrito666> mgz: lol, tx
[23:48] <mgz> perrito666: `git diff 5d2acdb0^..5d2acdb0 -- environs/config/config.go` - spot the funny mistake
[23:48] <perrito666> mgz: could you pastebin? I am in an odd repo status
[23:48] <mgz> perrito666: I'll fix and make you review
[23:50] <perrito666> aghh logger
[23:50] <mgz> perrito666: :P
[23:50] <perrito666> (I had a seccond repo)
[23:50] <perrito666> I suck
[23:51] <redir> oh, are we on next again?
[23:51] <redir> or is master just closed for a while
[23:51] <mgz> we're not on next
[23:52] <redir> well yeah we prolly don't want to land that thing you just reviewed
[23:53] <mgz> alexisb: are we keeping master blocked just for eric's fix?
[23:53] <redir> are the test slaves setup to have distro-info --lts return trusty?
[23:53] <alexisb> mgz, it is blocked for the azure bug
[23:53] <alexisb> but yeah no other commits atm please
[23:54] <mgz> redir: yeah, we moved our setup in time
[23:54] <mgz> so, we have another month of trusty as the default
[23:54] <redir> mgz OK because that PR you reviewed is to fix it to work when --lts returns xenial.
[23:55] <redir> mgz: which means it will prolly break on your time shifted slaves
[23:55] <mgz> redir: we can coordinate that monday
[23:55]  * redir is unclear on the transition process
[23:56] <mgz> redir: probably just want me or curtis to revert the hack as your branch lands
[23:56] <redir> hopefully it still merges cleanly and passes then:o
[23:56] <redir> OK. I'll follow up with whomever is around then.
[23:57] <redir> Good luck at squash in 8 hours
[23:57] <mgz> I played quite well on two hours sleep last week, though... not generally a good idea
[23:58] <redir> indeed