[00:03] <tedg> sergiusens: So feeling a bit weird, I have to put the getting source options in setup_stage_packages() now
[00:03] <tedg> sergiusens: Because I need the source to know which packages we need.
[00:03] <tedg> sergiusens: It seems to be working, but seems kinda broken.
[00:06] <sergiusens> tedg, ok, but what are you talking about, I am missing some context
[00:07] <tedg> sergiusens: Porting catkin to snapcraft 0.3
[00:07] <tedg> sergiusens: So I need to get the source if it's on git or something to get the packages.xml
[00:10] <sergiusens> tedg, right, but this problem was alway there, right?
[00:10] <sergiusens> too many right don't make a wrong ?
[00:10] <sergiusens> rights
[00:10] <sergiusens> tedg, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ted/snapcraft/ros-catkin-plugin/view/head:/snapcraft/plugins/catkin.py#L121
[00:10] <tedg> sergiusens: Hmm, it worked before....
[00:11] <tedg> sergiusens: And I just changed my pull to override setup_stage_packages()
[00:11] <sergiusens> tedg, in your MP you inverted the setup_stage_packages and pull calls
[00:11] <sergiusens> tedg, I think that's why
[00:11] <tedg> sergiusens: What changed is the ordering in pull()
[00:11] <tedg> Oh, I must have unmerged that change.
[00:12] <tedg> So do you like reordering that or overrideing setup_stage_packages() better?
[00:12] <sergiusens> tedg, I'll answer with another question; are we ever going to need something from stage pacckage to satisfy a pull
[00:14] <sergiusens> tedg, ftr https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/snapcraft/ros-catkin-plugin/+merge/273048#diff-line-508
[00:14] <sergiusens> that's the inversion
[00:15] <sergiusens> tedg, I haven't checked if this change would break pip and friends
[00:15] <tedg> I'm curious if we just have bad naming.
[00:15] <tedg> If we shouldn't just call it "pre-stage-packages" and "post-stage-packages"
[00:16] <tedg> It's not that we don't need both, but we need to be clear about how they go.
[00:16] <tedg> Or, perhaps, put setup_stage_packages in the pull() for the super class.
[00:16] <tedg> Then the subclass could move it where it needs it.
[00:19] <sergiusens> tedg, I was wanting to implement pull in the base class today but I am waiting for your plugins to not cause one more update you need to do ;-)
[00:21] <tedg> Ha
[00:21] <tedg> This has touched more files than I expected
[00:22] <tedg> Everything is at least building now.
[08:15] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Thursday, and happy Conflict Resolution Day! 😃
[09:13] <biezpal> Hi all! We have a problem with random string in package version and apparmor profiles
[09:13] <biezpal> Apparmor profile:
[09:13] <biezpal> profile "ovs_init-db_0.0.1" {
[09:13] <biezpal> But system is waiting for:
[09:13] <biezpal> ovs_init-db_IDKQMVPQVIGN
[09:13] <biezpal> We cannot specify random version while preparing snap package. How should we handle it?
[09:13] <jjohansen> biezpal: did you have a chance to talk to jdstrand
[09:14] <biezpal> jjohansen, nope :(
[09:14] <biezpal> seems like we have a 12-hours difference in time :)
[09:14] <jjohansen> sadly I am going to give the same recommendation, he is the guy you should talk to
[09:15] <jjohansen> biezpal: yeah, that is a problem, I can ping him about it tomorrow for you but I don't know how much time he will have, so he may not get back right away
[09:16] <biezpal> jjohansen, thanks
[11:45] <Chipaca> Ooops, I did it again.
[11:45] <Chipaca> https://code.launchpad.net/~chipaca/snappy/lock-ness/+merge/274547
[11:45] <Chipaca> 1k lines
[11:45] <Chipaca> how did that happen
[11:47] <davmor2> Chipaca: they let you write the code, that's normally how it happens
[11:48] <Chipaca> and i'm lovin' it
[12:14] <Chipaca> mvo_: ogra2: fwiw, the lock adds 5ms, or 10%, to the quickest rest query on bbb
[12:19] <ogra_> Chipaca, stop taling to that test guy :P
[12:19] <ogra_> *talking
[12:20] <Chipaca> ogra_: why? beuno hardly ever has time for epic dissing contests these days, so i'll take it piecemeal from davmor2
[12:20] <ogra_> haha
[12:24] <davmor2> ogra_: someone has to deflate his head otherwise he can't get through doorways and it's expensive to get building modifications done in the UK
[12:24] <ogra_> oh, and i always thought that was a beard !
[12:28] <jdstrand> biezpal: fyi, your profile name is due to the fact that you are sideloading. there was a change in snappy not too long ago that does that. it changes not only the profile name but install dir, etc, etc
[12:28] <jdstrand> jjohansen: (fyi ^)
[12:29] <Chipaca> oh, missed that
[12:29] <Chipaca> biezpal: jjohansen: holler if you need more help with that
[12:29] <Chipaca> jdstrand: good catch :)
[12:29] <jdstrand> biezpal: if this isn't working right for you, I suggest talking to Chipaca or someone else here
[12:30]  * Chipaca wonders what the problem is
[12:36] <biezpal> jdstrand, we know about random string version for sideloaded apps. The problem is that we cannot specify apparmor profile because of random string version
[12:37] <biezpal> before, we could specify number version in apparmor profile, but now it doesn't work
[12:37] <Chipaca> where/why do you have to specify the version?
[12:37] <biezpal> profile name contain version which is now random
[12:38] <biezpal> apparmor profile config, first line
[12:38] <biezpal> profile "ovs_init-db_0.0.1" {
[12:38] <jdstrand> biezpal: are you using 'security-policy' in your yaml?
[12:39] <biezpal> jdstrand, yes
[12:39] <jdstrand> biezpal: see this: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~snappy-dev/snappy-hub/snappy-examples/view/head:/framework-template/meta/svc.apparmor.boilerplate
[12:40] <jdstrand> biezpal: basically, have ###VAR### in there, and use ###PROFILEATTACH###, then it all gets filled in for you
[12:41] <biezpal> jdstrand, so, we can use {APP_VERSION} in our profiles, right?
[12:41] <jdstrand> yes
[12:41] <jdstrand> ###VAR### gets expanded to all those vars
[12:42] <mvo_> Chipaca: nice
[12:45] <biezpal> jdstrand, ok, thanks, we'll try it now
[12:57] <biezpal> jdstrand,  seems like I didn't get you right.. How should we define @{APP_VERSION} for our app before installation?
[13:03] <Chipaca> biezpal: so
[13:03] <biezpal> ah, I see now..
[13:03] <jdstrand> biezpal: you don't have to. it gets filled in for you on install
[13:03] <Chipaca> biezpal: do you have click-review?
[13:03] <Chipaca> biezpal: click-review would've told you about ###vars### and ###profileattach###
[13:04] <biezpal> jdstrand, Chipaca yes, I see how it works now, thanks
[13:06] <Chipaca> biezpal: holler if you get stuck again please
[13:07] <biezpal> Chipaca, sure, I will :)
[13:07] <biezpal> thanks
[13:29] <tbr> aj
[13:29] <tbr> EWINDOW
[13:35] <Chipaca> tbr: ENOCOOKIE
[13:36]  * davmor2 gives Chipaca a Cookie now will you stop complaining?
[13:38] <Chipaca> davmor2: http://i.imgur.com/05bXjHW.jpg
[13:39] <davmor2> Chipaca: say Cookie one more time......I dare you!
[13:39] <kenvandine> Cookie
[13:41]  * Chipaca gets behind the bulletproof glass
[13:42] <kenvandine> :)
[13:59] <longsleep> Hey folks, what does "support for secure boot" mean with the latest stable release mean?
[14:00] <longsleep> -mean
[14:04] <mvo_> longsleep: that you can enable uefi and secure boot and the system will boot signed kernels
[14:04] <mvo_> longsleep: useful for systems who need a higher level of trust etc
[14:05] <ogra_> longsleep, after you switched yu rodroid to UEFI you can use signed kernels ;)
[14:05] <ogra_> *your
[14:10] <longsleep> mvo_: signed kernel wit UEFI and microsoft keys you mean?
[14:10] <mvo_> longsleep: yes
[14:10] <longsleep> mvo_: ah ok - thanks - so not relevant for arm
[14:11] <mvo_> well, the shim is signed with the microsoft key and that uses our key for the subsequent steps
[14:11] <mvo_> longsleep: yeah
[14:11] <longsleep> yes true, is it the same shim as with normal ubuntu?
[14:11] <mvo_> yes
[14:11] <tbr> well AArgh64 servers with UEFI...
[14:11] <tbr> if they ever ship
[14:11] <ogra_> longsleep, the last two releases were rather irrelevant to arm overall
[14:11] <mvo_> I guess the mail should have clarified that its about uefi secure boot
[14:12] <longsleep> ogra_: yeah i figured that, my odroids updated flawlessly from 5 to 6 and 7 though
[14:12] <ogra_> and the next one likely as well
[14:12] <longsleep> ogra_: did you look into possibilies for secure boot on armhf?
[14:13] <ogra_> not really ... would that be possible with uboot at all ?
[14:13] <longsleep> tbr: somewhere i read that 2016 will be the year of arm64 servers
[14:13] <ogra_> wasnt that arm64 laptops ?
[14:14] <longsleep> ogra_: mhm could have been laptos - i remember it not very good
[14:14] <longsleep> ogra_: i saw some code in u-boot with which was labled secure boot using some keys fused into the soc
[14:15] <longsleep> ogra_: did not look closes yet though
[14:16] <ogra_> "fused into the soc" heh
[14:16] <ogra_> might be hard to do if you are not a manufacturer
[14:16] <longsleep> true, but getting the uboot signed might be possible somehow
[14:17] <tbr> HS silicon often uses keys from a PROM inside the soc
[14:18] <longsleep> yeah - without knowing anything .. how are the phones which use u-boot protect their bootloader?
[14:19] <ogra_> usualyl from the preloader as i understand
[14:20] <longsleep> right, and how is the preloader protected from beeing overwritten with a preloader which does not validate anything?
[14:22] <tbr> longsleep: e.g. QC usually only loads a signed loader and will not boot if it's not signed
[14:22] <ogra_> yeah
[14:22] <tbr> and most phones don't use u-boot but a-boot or that other thing
[14:22] <ogra_> and you cant easily overwrite it either
[14:22] <longsleep> right
[14:23] <ogra_> some use uboot, but only chainloaded
[14:23] <longsleep> tbr: so i asume it is pretty hard to get secure boot on arm when the soc would boot any loader
[14:24] <tbr> longsleep: just as on x86, it's not an arch dependent problem
[14:24] <longsleep> tbr: right, i see - thanks!
[14:24] <longsleep> ogra_: are there any device which do not chain load uboot with some binary boot loader blob?
[14:24] <tbr> intel will also want your firstborn if you want the secure version of their CPUs
[14:24] <longsleep> hehe
[14:25] <ogra_> longsleep, yeah, most of them ...
[14:25] <ogra_> uboot on phones is rather a rare case ... it exists though
[14:25] <tbr> TI SoCs can usually be booted with u-boot directly
[14:25] <tbr> e.g. the BB with its AM335x
[14:25] <tbr> MLO is just a minimal u-boot
[14:25] <longsleep> oh, thats cool, so no proprietary part required to boot them up?
[14:25] <tbr> correct
[14:26] <tbr> not like RPi that requires that ginormous blob to boot the GPU before it even thinks about ARM cores
[14:26] <tbr> also u-boot on x86 works well
[14:26] <tbr> and I don't mean chain loaded
[14:27] <longsleep> is that in use on x86 in some machines one can buy?
[14:27] <tbr> yes, the minnowboard max for example
[14:28] <tbr> I'm not sure if it still requires the FSP blob or if someone figured that out yet
[14:29] <ogra_> i think you can re-flash the bnootloader on ALIX boards easily
[14:29] <ogra_> they come with coreboot preinstalled though
[14:30] <longsleep> coreboot is nice, though i read that most coreboot devices still load some blob to make hardware components work
[14:30] <ogra_> might be, i have two alix boards but never examined that level
[14:30] <tbr> that's the FSP and SM
[14:31] <tbr> you can get around those in some cases
[14:31] <tbr> you will still very much need the microcode updates though
[14:32] <longsleep> yeah - i would like to know what this stuff is doing though
[14:32] <tbr> the microcode in the soc is most often barely functional
[14:32] <tbr> fsp mostly sets up RAM timings and such IIRC
[14:32] <tbr> I've heard of a coreboot fork called libreboot (how inventive!) that manages on a few devices without those
[14:33] <longsleep> oh let me google that
[14:33] <longsleep> Ministry of Freedom (UK) lol
[14:34] <longsleep> they support the t400 - not so bad
[14:36] <ogra_> t400 ... pfft ...
[14:37]  * ogra_ wants a t1000 to mow his lawn
[14:37] <longsleep> eheh
[14:37] <ogra_> but thats still 600 revisions away
[14:38] <longsleep> the t400 is a little old
[14:39] <longsleep> libreboot can be flashed on the bbb
[14:39] <longsleep> that would be awesome if it then could boot snappy
[14:39]  * tbr fails to see the appeal on BBB, it already has a fully open source boot process
[14:40] <longsleep> oh it has? sorry then i was just ignorant
[14:40] <tbr> 14:25:22< tbr> TI SoCs can usually be booted with u-boot directly
[14:40] <tbr> 14:25:42< tbr> e.g. the BB with its AM335x
[14:40] <tbr> 14:25:50< tbr> MLO is just a minimal u-boot
[14:41] <longsleep> so the sources for MLO are public - i did not know that
[14:41] <longsleep> i do not have a BBB either though
[14:58] <ogra_> longsleep, MLO is uboot on a diet :)
[15:40] <tbr> which is necessary due to the internal SoC ram being only 32k or such. so all it does is try to set up the RAM and find the proper U-Boot binary
[15:59] <elopio> sergiusens: I'll review your code iff you upload the licensed snap.
[15:59] <elopio> that's my price :)
[16:02] <sergiusens> elopio, deal
[16:03] <Chipaca> elopio: "licensed snap"?
[16:03] <elopio> sergiusens: do you like or dislike docstrings?
[16:03] <sergiusens> elopio, wait, can we upload now?
[16:04] <sergiusens> elopio, I like!
[16:04]  * ogra_ buys a license from elopio
[16:04] <elopio> Chipaca: yes, the one that has a funny paragraph that you have to agree with.
[16:04] <Chipaca> elopio: dude
[16:04] <sergiusens> elopio, I've just never done them properly, but I want to document the base plugin with docstrings
[16:04] <Chipaca> elopio: snappy-examples/licensed
[16:04] <elopio> I suspect you wrote that one.
[16:04] <sergiusens> Chipaca, he wants me to upload that ;-)
[16:04] <sergiusens> Chipaca, to the store
[16:04] <Chipaca> to the stoar
[16:05] <Chipaca> ok :)
[16:05]  * Chipaca gets it now
[16:05] <sergiusens> elopio, I'll check on the 'all reviews must be manual' thing first
[16:05] <elopio> ogra_: the first one is free.
[16:05] <ogra_> yay
[16:05]  * ogra_ feels the greed for more coming up
[16:06] <elopio> sergiusens: I was just thinking that it's so hard for me to understand the snapcraft code because it doesn't have comments. Like this compose method.
[16:06] <elopio> I think I'd even like an example in the docstring.
[16:06] <sergiusens> elopio, ah, give me an example on how to write a 'proper' docstring and I'll do it :-)
[16:06] <sergiusens> elopio, it is not as easy as it was to do in go ;-)
[16:07] <elopio> sergiusens: https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0257/
[16:07] <sergiusens> elopio, in go I jst started writing them and all was fine, the world was happy; in python there are many iplicit semantic rules :-P
[16:08] <elopio> sergiusens: I'll start documenting some things I understand.
[16:08] <elopio> then you can copy the format.
[16:18] <sergiusens> elopio, does that work for you http://paste.ubuntu.com/12791820/
[16:18] <sergiusens> elopio, ignore the runtests.sh part (that will be a separate MP)
[16:19] <sergiusens> elopio, wht is the correct way to add an example?
[16:32] <elopio> sergiusens: looks good, but not perfect.
[16:33] <elopio> sergiusens: instead of Returns, it should be Return.
[16:33] <elopio> and the first sentence should be a single line.
[16:33] <elopio> there are some tools that take the first line of the docstring as a summary.
[16:33] <sergiusens> elopio, so I have around 50 chars to express it?
[16:34] <elopio> sergiusens: yes, the short summary. Then you write as many lines you want in the following paragraphs.
[16:35] <sergiusens> elopio, it seems there are many ways to write docscrings
[16:35] <sergiusens> which I dislike
[16:35] <sergiusens> elopio, http://paste.ubuntu.com/12791994/
[16:36] <elopio> sergiusens: yes. The form we tried to follow in the tests was to stick to pep 257 as much as possible, using the sphinx tags.
[16:36] <sergiusens> elopio, I found that and then a ::param ...:: format
[16:36] <sergiusens> elopio, I saw ``keyword`` as well
[16:37] <sergiusens> elopio, just show me one docsrting from a test I can follow and I will write awesome docstrings
[16:37] <sergiusens> I dislike the fact that there is choice on how to do this ;-)
[16:38] <ogra_> but linux ius abouot choice !
[16:38] <elopio> sergiusens: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sdk-team/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/trunk/view/head:/tests/autopilot/ubuntuuitoolkit/_custom_proxy_objects/_common.py#L121
[16:39] <elopio> sergiusens: there's free will, but we crush it on code reviews.
[16:39] <sergiusens> elopio, does help(something) pretty format all those ::param:: declaratons btw?
[16:39] <sergiusens> elopio, should I use ''' or """ ?
[16:39] <elopio> sergiusens: I don't know about help. But the idea is to generate an sphinx html out of this.
[16:39] <elopio> sergiusens: """
[16:41] <sergiusens> elopio, is multiline allowed after ::param keyword:: ?
[16:41] <elopio> sergiusens: yes.
[16:41] <sergiusens> elopio, ah, I see it now
[16:42] <sergiusens> elopio, how do I ref a :param keyword: in return?
[16:42] <sergiusens> elopio, see, this is why I did not start doing this :-)
[16:43] <sergiusens> vmayoral, hey, since you joined, I'm interested in knowing if you have tried experimenting with faster sdcards
[16:44] <vmayoral> hey @sergiusens,
[16:44] <sergiusens> vmayoral, I talked about some of the i/o slowness with ogra_ and mvo_ and there are some ideas floating around aside from just slow sdcard that might affect you; primarily the shared usb bus
[16:44] <elopio> sergiusens: uhm, I don't know. Just name it.
[16:44] <vmayoral> sergiusens: we've ordered them, should be able to test it soon
[16:45] <elopio> http://sphinx-doc.org/domains.html#cross-referencing-python-objects
[16:45] <elopio> sergiusens: it seems you can reference attr, but not parameters.
[16:46] <elopio> sergiusens: this is the examples I mostly follow: http://sphinx-doc.org/domains.html#info-field-lists
[16:52] <sergiusens> elopio, how about this http://paste.ubuntu.com/12792139/?
[16:53] <elopio> sergiusens: perfect.
[16:53] <elopio> I tend to be more verbose on the second paragraph instead of the return keyword.
[16:53] <elopio> but as you prefer.
[16:54] <sergiusens> elopio, I wasn't sure, I just saw duplication and then saw the doc you sent me and the example from ui-toolkit :-P
[16:55] <elopio> sergiusens: just choose whatever makes you happy, and we'll copy that style. The things that are important for me are the param and return tags, and the one line summary.
[16:56] <sergiusens> elopio, great, I'll stick to this, I don't like free form :-)
[16:56] <sergiusens> elopio, the paragraph could be used to go into detail with examples
[16:56] <sergiusens> elopio, which I haven't seen how to do yet
[16:57] <elopio> sergiusens: ah, right.
[16:57] <elopio> there are two options for the examples. You can write doctest  https://docs.python.org/3/library/doctest.html
[16:58] <elopio> or you can make it free form with the sphinx syntax. Let me see if I can find a nice one.
[16:58] <sergiusens> elopio, I don't mind doctest as long as they can access the network or if that won't be a problem we will be facing on and on in the future
[16:59] <elopio> sergiusens: we don't necessarily run the doctests. We need to add a command that runs them, and we can choose not to run them while the package is being build, for example.
[17:00] <sergiusens> elopio, I'll table the doctest/examples with sphinx for now then and think about it
[17:00] <sergiusens> elopio, I've already pushed the docstring while you weren't looking
[17:01] <sergiusens> :-)
[17:01] <elopio> sergiusens: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~autopilot/autopilot/trunk/view/head:/autopilot/matchers/__init__.py#L49
[17:01] <sergiusens> vmayoral, great, we are looking forward to isolating the issue
[17:06]  * sergiusens will brb
[18:02] <sergiusens> elopio, I uploaded licensed.canonical
[18:03] <sergiusens> tedg, is the catkin plugin ready for review? I saw some code changes but not sure if I should start code review yet
[18:03] <zyga> sergiusens: hey!
[18:03] <zyga> sergiusens: how are you
[18:03] <sergiusens> zyga, doing good, what's up?
[18:04] <zyga> sergiusens: holidays, a bit ill, enjoying rain and wind in Poland :)
[18:05] <elopio> sergiusens: thanks. I'm still confused by your branch.
[18:06] <elopio> I'm slow today.
[18:06] <sergiusens> elopio, the tests don't make it clear either?
[18:07] <elopio> sergiusens: it's like you are filling the missing properties with the values from the wiki, right?
[18:07] <sergiusens> elopio, exactly; and you might ask why I don't use .update() I guess
[18:08] <sergiusens> elopio, 1 I've had issues with it, 2 there is more to come (properties from the wiki will also do var expansion for the values)
[18:08] <elopio> sergiusens: no, I would just phrase the comments differently.
[18:10] <sergiusens> elopio, this is why we have reviews :-)
[18:10] <sergiusens> zyga, well go and relax if you are on holidays AND ill ;-)
[18:11] <elopio> sergiusens: yeah, but I don't know how to make it better. I'm trying...
[18:12] <sergiusens> elopio, exactly, I tried to explain using only a few words, maybe compose is what causes confusion and that word needs to be changed
[18:12] <elopio> sergiusens: :return: a dictionary that fills the missing values from the properties passed as an argument with values from the part in the wiki.
[18:13] <elopio> sergiusens: just a suggestion. Not sure if yours is better.
[18:13] <elopio> sergiusens: also I don't understand why would you return something if there is no wiki part. Shouldn't it raise an exception?
[18:13] <sergiusens> elopio, ah, I was trying to not use the word dictionary as that was implied in the type, but if that is fine, I don't mind using that
[18:13] <sergiusens> elopio, I can raise an exception too, that is debatable; I don't mind
[18:14] <elopio> sergiusens: I think it's clearer to raise an exception than to return a null value that later has to be interpreted.
[18:14] <sergiusens> elopio, I will raise an exception
[18:14] <sergiusens> elopio, right, as it is now, it is not a nul value, it is a nop
[18:14] <elopio> sergiusens: also, the docs are to be read by people, so make them as readable as possible. Don't worry that much about the metadata or duplication.
[18:15] <elopio> sergiusens: ah, I see. You return the same thing you get.
[18:17] <elopio> I'm inclined for the exception. The caller can take care of catching it to make it no-op.
[18:18] <sergiusens> elopio, ok, let me change that
[18:20] <elopio> sergiusens: and about the tests, I think that the name is the most important thing to make them readable.
[18:20] <elopio> instead of test_compose, I see three tests. something like
[18:20] <elopio> test_compose_must_update_missing_value_from_wiki -> you pass no source as argument
[18:20] <elopio> test_compose_must_keep_value_from_properties -> you pass source as an argument
[18:20] <elopio> test_compose_unexisting_wiki_part_must_raise_exception
[18:20] <elopio> sergiusens: and starting to nitpick, s/part1/part-from-wiki.
[18:20] <sergiusens> elopio, the nitpick I refuse as the part lives in both places :-)
[18:21] <sergiusens> elopio, but if it makes it clearer, then yeah, for the test it is fine
[18:22] <elopio> sergiusens: well, it wouln't hurt to make it more verbose like: part-that-exists-in-wiki
[18:22] <elopio> not a big deal if the name of the test is clear. And you can always throw comments instead.
[18:22] <elopio> sergiusens: anyway, now that I get what your branch does, +1. It looks correct to me.
[18:23] <elopio> I'll top approve after lunch.
[18:23] <sergiusens> elopio, I'll be fixing in the meantime :-)
[18:23] <elopio> sergiusens: and I would throw in an integration or example test.
[18:26] <elopio> but maybe not yet. We only have the curl part in the wiki, and there's no much sense in overwriting its properties. Maybe an example when we have more parts that make sense to extend
[18:52] <mvo_> Chipaca: *if* you are still around, I followed up on the snappy-snapfs-mount MP would love to hear your thoughts, but no rush, I call it a day now
[19:54] <sergiusens> tedg, maybe envvars can all be driven by the plugin and no need to have it in the parts?
[19:57] <tedg> sergiusens: Eh, I'm not sure that many people will use plugins though. I'd like to have less of them.
[19:57] <tedg> sergiusens: For instance if ROS didn't have so many relocation issues, it'd be nice if that didn't have to be a plugin. Just a repo and some stage-packages in the wiki.
[19:58] <tedg> I'm just not sure we're ever gonna live in a world where the libraries end up where we want.
[19:58] <tedg> And I hate pushing people to write shell scripts all the time.
[20:06] <sergiusens> tedg, well the thing is, for a part, we can't
[20:06] <sergiusens> tedg, as in, hey look for stuff here too
[20:10] <tedg> sergiusens: I guess I was thinking that the part would provide environment variables for things it builds. For instance "I put my data here"
[20:12] <sergiusens> tedg, right, I have that email in draft :-)
[20:12] <sergiusens> tedg, The wrapper thing is all fine and dandy to some extent for running, but building is so disparate
[20:14] <tedg> I feel like we're walking a dangerous path with encouraging so many wrappers.
[20:34] <sergiusens> tedg, so I replied and not sure if it will be for the worse :-)
[20:34] <sergiusens> tedg, wrt actual things in the pipeline, just leave a coment in the catkin branch when it is ready for another look
[20:44] <tedg> sergiusens: I think that it is, I'm building a test snap to see if it still all works.


[22:36] <jwill> pinkisntwell: Going back to kde3 would be just as much work as reinstalling kde4.
[22:36] <pinkisntwell> jwill: so what should i do?
[22:36] <Daughain> Prolly more work....
[22:36] <Daughain> Is kde3 still in the repos?
[22:37] <Daughain> pinkisntwell,  Install Ubuntu, or debian, or reinatsll kubuntu.
[22:37] <jwill> pinkisntwell: If making a new user doesn't work, you should just back up your data and reinstall
[22:37] <Daughain> All eaqually easy, at this point.
[22:38] <pinkisntwell> jwill: but the same thing will happen again after i reinstall
[22:39] <jwill> pinkisntwell: I don't follow your logic.
[22:39] <pinkisntwell> i installed kubuntu 3 days ago
[22:39] <pinkisntwell> it asked to update itself and it broke plasma-desktop
[22:39] <jwill> pinkisntwell: You were the one who manually removed his video driver, right?
[22:39] <pinkisntwell> if i reinstall the same thing will happen right?
[22:39] <pinkisntwell> jwill: no i'm not
[22:40] <jwill> pinkisntwell: It probably won't.  If you're afraid of it happening, you could just not update, except for security updates.
[22:40] <pinkisntwell> jwill: is this supposed to be a solution?
[22:40] <pinkisntwell> jwill: it probably won't? so i'm just gonna update and cross my fingers?
[22:41] <jwill> pinkisntwell: I'm sorry, I thought we were helping people in our free time with no compensation except said person thanking us...
[22:41] <pinkisntwell> jwill: ?
[22:41] <jwill> pinkisntwell: I guess I'll ship you a replacement computer.
[22:41] <Daughain> pinkisntwell,  If you want a solution, I gave you one. , jwill  gave you one and mgt_  have you one
[22:42] <pinkisntwell> Daughain: is a reinstall considered a solution?
[22:42] <pinkisntwell> Daughain: is like cutting off your hand being a solution for when your hand hurts
[22:42] <Daughain> pinkisntwell,  In the situation you are in yes.
[22:42] <Daughain> pin, I did four total instals before I got this sys configured the way I like, so what?
[22:43] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: did you try making a new user as mentioned by jwill?
[22:43] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: yes
[22:43] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: i tried deleting all plasma config files too
[22:43] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: have you installed any plasmoids recently?
[22:43] <jwill> pinkisntwell: Reinstall with kubuntu takes half an hour of your time, tops.
[22:43] <Daughain> Ands, pinkisntwell , two people suggested installing a different OS.
[22:44] <jwill> wankdanker: Can't be that, because he tried removing his .kde, which takes all widgets off his desktop (except default ones...)
[22:44] <pinkisntwell> jwill: even booting the cd takes 10 minutes
[22:44] <wankdanker> jwill: just curious if one of the plasmoids from the repos is causing the issue
[22:45] <pinkisntwell> jwill: and what about the time to reinstall and reconfigure all my apps?
[22:45] <mgt_> pinkisntwell: Unless you're on a slow net connection, apt-getting your programs doesn't take very long. As for configuration, just back up /etc
[22:47] <jwill> pinkisntwell: Back up your .folders in your home dir.  They have all your config.
[22:47] <jwill> pinkisntwell: If you don't want to download again, checkout aptoncd, which easily backs up packages to a cd/dvd.
[22:48] <pinkisntwell> jwill: look
[22:48] <pinkisntwell> jwill: let's forget about the reinstall, if i'm gonna reinstall it certainly won't be with kubuntu again, so the point is moot
[22:49] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: ok, if you aren't going to re-install, did you try removing the plasma desktop components and then reinstalling?
[22:49] <Edo> does anyone have experience in openvpn?
[22:49] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: how do i do that?
[22:49] <mgt_> Edo: I have some.
[22:50] <jwill> Ahh, the good old windows-user-threatening-to-switch-back-if-we-don't-help-him
[22:51] <pinkisntwell> jwill: huh? when did i do that?
[22:51] <pinkisntwell> jwill: you brought up windows
[22:51] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: it would be something along the lines of sudo apt-get remove kdebase-plasma
[22:51] <Edo> Excellent. Currently I'm having issues with using my newly setup vpn. I followed the ubuntu docs in setting up the openvpn server and have successfully connected to it, but I am unable to use it.
[22:51] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: along the lines? how can i find out for sure?
[22:51] <Daughain> jwill,   I remember when reinstall was an expected part of the yearly windows ritual. =)
[22:51] <mgt_> Edo: Is it a routed VPN or a bridged VPN?
[22:52] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: i will let you know for sure. i just need to test it out here.
[22:52] <mgt_> Daughain: It still is. You got to clear the registry somehow. =)
[22:52] <Edo> if i followed the instructions, it should be ether bridged
[22:52] <inclement> I think I've force killed something important in the window manager. I still have a terminal. Is there something I can type to logout safely?
[22:52] <Daughain> mgt_,   Wel, they do have a god assortment of apps for uch issues these days, but.....
[22:52] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: ok
[22:53] <Edo> mgt_: here are the instructions I followed. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/OpenVPN
[22:54] <mgt_> Edo: Yeah, I remember coming across that myself.
[22:55] <Edo> mgt_: as for the client, I used the windows GUI app from here. http://openvpn.se/
[22:55] <mgt_> Edo: So you can connect to it?
[22:56] <Edo> mgt_: I can actually and I'm given an ip. However, I am not able to see my servers samba or tunnel through it or anything really.
[22:56] <mgt_> Edo: Ah ok.
[22:57] <mgt_> Edo: So you want access to services on the same LAN as the openVPN server?
[22:57] <Edo> mgt_: I wish to use it, just like a local network. In which I can do Lan games, file share, web browse, etc.
[22:58] <Nete> Hello, I have no sound. And I just did a little bit ago. All the mixer levels are all the way up.
[22:58] <Edo> mgt_: I want all activity to go through my VPN.
[22:59] <Edo> mgt_: as if I was at home hooked up to my router.
[22:59] <Daughain> Nete,   Do you have no sound at all, or only no sound for a particular device/format?
[22:59] <pinkisntwell> Nete: try going into systemsetting to the audio options and pick a different device, same thing happened to me today
[22:59] <pinkisntwell> Nete: it fixes itself and breaks again randomly with each boot
[23:00] <mgt_> Edo: I've been using ALS so much I'm a bit rusty on my bare-iron openVPN. Can you ping the other machines on the LAN?
[23:00] <Nete> Daughain: I have no youtube, mp3, m4u etc
[23:00] <mgt_> Edo: e.g. ping the samba server?
[23:00] <Daughain> Nete,  cd or dvd?
[23:01] <Edo> mgt_: No. So far only my laptop is connected to the VPN. The server which is running VPN also runs samba in which I'm trying to connect. Do I need my server to connect to the VPN service?
[23:02] <Nete> Daughain: Haven't tried it yet. pinkisntwell:
[23:02] <Nete> both my devices dont work
[23:02] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: sudo apt-get remove kdebase-workspace-bin
[23:02] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: that will remove plasma-desktop
[23:02] <Edo> mgt_: I've tried all the ips. The vpn and the fixed ip the router at home gives my server.
[23:02] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: and then i reinstall the same package?
[23:02] <Daughain> Nete,  How recently were they working?
[23:02] <Edo> mgt_; neither work.
[23:03] <mgt_> Edo: So you get "Host not found" if you try and ping the IP?
[23:03] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: be sure to note what other packages will be automatically uninstalled so that you can install install it again.
[23:03] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: yes, sudo apt-get install kdebase-workspace-bin
[23:03] <Nete> Daughain: I think they were working before I hibernated my machine. I'
[23:04] <Nete> I'm going to restart.
[23:04] <Daughain> Nete,  Have you tried a full reboot?
[23:04]  * Daughain nods.
[23:04] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: thanks, i will try this now
[23:04] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: what i would do is remove kdebase-workspace-bin, noting the other packages, then re-install kdebase-workspace-bin, then try to run plasma-desktop to see if you get the same error
[23:04] <Edo> mgt_: "7Ping request could not find host RedQueen"
[23:04] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: indeed this sounds smart
[23:04] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: after that, then install the other packages that were auto-removed
[23:05] <pinkisntwell> k3b kdebase-workspace-bin kpackagekit kubuntu-desktop plasma-widget-networkmanagement update-notifier-kde
[23:05] <pinkisntwell> these packages will be removed
[23:05] <mgt_> Edo: Right, so evidently you're not actually connected to the LAN.
[23:05] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: then try killing plasma-desktop and restarting it to see if the error occurs again.
[23:05] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: ok that's what was removed on mine as well.
[23:05] <pinkisntwell> ok moving on
[23:06] <Daughain> WB jwill .
[23:06] <Edo> mgt_: I see, so my guess that my ethernet bridge is not working is correct?
[23:07] <jwill> Daughain: Computer hung to the extent that neither ctrl+backspace nor ALT+SYSREQ+R-E-I-S-U-B did anything... o_o
[23:07] <Nete> Daughain: I'm back...
[23:07] <jwill> Mouse cursor wouldn't even move
[23:07] <pinkisntwell> ok i reinstalled and reran plasma-desktop and they same thing happened
[23:07] <Nete> *is testing
[23:07] <mgt_> Edo: Precisely. But we need to know why.
[23:07] <Torch> hi there
[23:07] <Daughain> jwill,  Yeah, I had a similar issue earlier, I managed to shut down befor it got that bad though. =)
[23:07] <Daughain> Need nmore ram.
[23:07] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: do i need to reboot in between?
[23:07] <mgt_> Edo: Chances are it's the bridged network interfaces. They're infamously problematic.
[23:07] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: no
[23:07] <Daughain> Nete,  Any love?
[23:08] <jwill> Daughain: That's the thing, it didn't get worse.  It just stopped instantly and completely.
[23:08] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: so then it didn't work
[23:08] <Daughain> jwill,  Ouch, which process?
[23:08] <pinkisntwell> so how do install kde 4.3.4 then?
[23:08] <Edo> mgt_: If this is true then I have this thing here... http://openvpn.net/index.php/open-source/documentation/miscellaneous/76-ethernet-bridging.html
[23:08] <Torch> pinkisntwell: see topic ;-)
[23:08] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: please run "aptitude search plasma | grep ^i" and paste the contents to some online paster thing.
[23:08] <jwill> pinkisntwell: What version do you currently have, anyways?
[23:08] <Nete> Daughain: Loud classic "Dies Aeire" blaring in my ears, what a sound :)
[23:09] <pinkisntwell> 4.3.2
[23:09] <Daughain> Nete,   There've ben a bunch of reports dealing with swap issues during hibernation.
[23:09] <Edo> mgt_: at the bottom of the page are the startup and down executables
[23:09] <Nete> Daughain: I see
[23:09] <luis_> i need help i am desesperated already! for some reason firefox download helper conversions are failing!!! but before christmas i could download and convert any song from flv to mp3 from youtube, whats happening people...!?
[23:09] <Edo> mgt_: the problem is I ddon't know how to implement them. The page is misleading.
[23:09] <Daughain> Nete,  Ya, its a bug, but I dont know if a fix is out yet.
[23:10] <Nete> Daughain: BTW how do you set a status in irc?
[23:10] <Daughain> Nete,  HUnh?
[23:10] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: http://pastebin.ca/1740784
[23:10] <Nete> Like * Daughain nods
[23:10] <Edo> mgt_: as for the network/interfaces file just refer back to the first link. That is how I have it setup, word for word.
[23:11] <Daughain> Thaqts not a status, thats an action, use ./me <action>
[23:11] <mgt_> Edo: What, as in you don't know how to run the Up and Down executables?
[23:11] <Nete> ./me test
[23:11] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: looks normal?
[23:11] <Nete> ./me <test>
[23:11] <Daughain> the . is a placeholder, remove it before typing.
[23:12] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: yeah looks ok, but you have less stuff installed than i do. but you are also on 4.3.2, i'm on 4.3.4
[23:12] <Edo> mgt_: those two files that I am to use, I don't know how to make them run automatically... or whatever. OR what directory they should be in.
[23:12] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: ok can you help me install 4.3.4?
[23:12]  * Nete <test>
[23:12] <Daughain> Nete,  Now remove the <> from your action.
[23:12] <Edo> mgt_: then again I am not sure if I am suppose to use those or not either....
[23:12] <mgt_> Edo: They should be in /etc/openvpn/
[23:12] <Nete> Daughain: Thanks for the help!
[23:13] <mgt_> Edo: You definitely do need to run them. They bring the bridged interfaces up and down.
[23:13] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: which version of kubuntu are you using? "cat /etc/lsb-release"
[23:13] <Daughain> Nete,  NP.
[23:13] <pinkisntwell> 9.10
[23:13] <Edo> mgt_: Okay, I'll add those now, and do a service restart on openvpn and see if that works. It should only take a minute.
[23:14] <mgt_> Make sure to run the "Up" script after you start the openVPN daemon.
[23:14] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: you should be able to upgrade with "sudo apt-get update &&  sudo apt-get upgrade"
[23:15] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: i think not
[23:15] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: i already tried that
[23:15]  * Daughain laughs.
[23:15] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: you may want to finish re-installing the other packages that were auto-removed first
[23:15] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: did you try sudo apt-get dist-upgrade?
[23:15] <Torch> wankdanker: nah, he needs to add the kubuntu ppa first
[23:16] <pinkisntwell> Torch: ppa?
[23:16] <Torch> pinkisntwell: yep ;-)
[23:16] <pinkisntwell> Torch: what's that?
[23:16] <wankdanker> Torch: oh, i forgot that i might have added those.
[23:16] <wankdanker> Torch: i thought 4.3.4 was in karmic by default. sorry.
[23:16] <Torch> pinkisntwell:  http://pastebin.ca/1740792
[23:17] <pinkisntwell> Torch: extra repos?
[23:17] <Torch> pinkisntwell: yes, 4.3.4 is unofficial on karmic
[23:17] <Torch> pinkisntwell: so you need to add an extra repo for it
[23:17] <pinkisntwell> Torch: ok adding them now
[23:18] <pinkisntwell> first line gives no such file or directory
[23:18] <Torch> pinkisntwell: wait.. that wasn't for you to type ;-)
[23:18] <pinkisntwell> Torch: what was it then?
[23:18] <Torch> pinkisntwell: create a file with that name. it won't exist. and insert those two lines i cat'ted
[23:19] <Torch> pinkisntwell: as root, of course. then apt-get update.
[23:19] <pinkisntwell> Torch: oh sorry
[23:19] <pinkisntwell> Torch: thanks
[23:19] <Torch> pinkisntwell: np
[23:19] <kamola> i'll install kubuntu in 6 hours
[23:20] <kamola> do ya guys think my belkin g wireless adapter driver is included in the kernel?
[23:20] <kamola> sry
[23:20] <kamola> i'm just a real noob
[23:20] <Daughain> kamola,   Why wait so long to install?
[23:20] <kamola> but ni nwill support kubuntu as long i live
[23:20] <wankdanker> Torch: i have 4.3.4 without ppa, is it possible that it's in karmic backports?
[23:21] <kamola> i have only 768 kbit/s internet
[23:21] <Daughain> kamola,  Ouch........That sucs.
[23:21] <kamola> yes :|
[23:21] <pinkisntwell> what's a notepad-like text editor on kde?
[23:22] <kamola> but a friend told me that we'll become vdsl
[23:22] <Daughain> kwrite
[23:22] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: kate
[23:22] <comawhite> pinkisntwell: kate?
[23:22] <comawhite> kwrite?
[23:22] <kamola> and this would be enouigh for almost 1 year i think...
[23:22] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: kwrite is like notepad, kate is like notpad on steroids
[23:22] <Daughain> kwrite
[23:23] <Daughain> Or, gedit if you upgraded from ubuntu, instead of doing thr kubuntu instal. =)
[23:23] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: thanks
[23:23] <Edo> mgt_: nothing still
[23:23] <pinkisntwell> Torch: ok i created that file now what?
[23:23] <Daughain> kamola,  I feel your pain, I recently spent a month on dialup.
[23:23] <Daughain> Err....A year, sorry.
[23:23] <mgt_> Edo: Did you run the Up script?
[23:24]  * comawhite shudders at thought of being on dialup
[23:24] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: http://www.kubuntu.org/node/126
[23:24] <Daughain> rule #1  CHeck net access *befre* worrying about the lease. =)
[23:24] <kamola> it has been pretty ok for the last years
[23:24] <kamola> but now
[23:24] <kamola> i want to become a small linux nerd
[23:25] <comawhite> by the time you download KDE-4.3.4, KDE-4.4.4 will be released :P
[23:25] <Daughain> comawhite, lol.
[23:25] <kamola> ^^
[23:25] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: does that mean i should try apt-get update and upgrade?
[23:25] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: apparently as of yesterday, the 4.3.4 packages should be pulled from karmic backports
[23:25] <Edo> mgt_: how do I run an .sh script actually. This is where my skills show
[23:26] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: after ensuring that the backports line in your /etc/apt/sources.list is enabled
[23:27] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: either way if you use Torch's advice and use the ppa or use the advice from kubuntu.org, after you have the appropriate settings in /etc/apt/sources.list, you will need to apt-get update and upgrade
[23:27] <Daughain> kamola,  I;m a newb too, so I dunno the answer to your driver question, though, I would expect it to be.
[23:27] <mauri> how can i install msdos into pendrive
[23:27] <kamola> Daughain: i think it will work....
[23:28] <Daughain> mauri unet
[23:28] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: you may also need to do sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
[23:28] <kamola> if it doesn't a buy another wifi stick
[23:28] <Daughain> kamola,  I expect it will.
[23:28] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: too late, i already started
[23:28] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: it's ok.
[23:28] <kamola> thx for help Daughain
[23:28] <pinkisntwell> it complains that some amarok packages are unauthenticated
[23:28] <pinkisntwell> what's that?
[23:28] <mauri> Daughain: unet?
[23:28] <Daughain> Oh, are youp using kubuntu 9.10?
[23:29] <Daughain> mauri,  google unet bootin
[23:29] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: those may be being pulled from the ppa
[23:29] <Edo> mgt_: I just tried to run it and I receive an error
[23:29] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: it's likely to be ok and will probably work, but are not official packages
[23:29] <pinkisntwell> ok upgrading now
[23:30] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: godspeed :)
[23:30] <mauri> Daughain: i've already tried it but it installs syslinux as bootloader and i want only dos to start at the start up...i dont know if it possibile
[23:30] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: i'm fast at the keyboard and slow in the head
[23:30] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: those two go together
[23:31] <Edo> mgt_: mtu: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device
[23:31] <Edo> mtu: ERROR while getting interface flags: No such device
[23:31] <Edo> Incorrect number of arguments for command
[23:31] <Edo> Usage: brctl addif <bridge> <device>	add interface to bridge
[23:31] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: i hear you. i'm that way a lot of the time too. the good thing about apt is that you can usually work your way back to a working system if you mess anything up
[23:31] <FloodBotK1> Edo: Please don't flood, use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste, don't use Enter as punctuation.
[23:31] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: it's got like a 100 packages lined up i hope more stuff don't break
[23:31] <Daughain> mauri, Hmmmmm DOS....Might try an autoexec.bat edit.
[23:31] <ubuntu> hiiiiiiiiiiiii
[23:31] <Edo> woops
[23:31] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: yeah, a lot of stuff is going to change going from 4.3.2 to 4.3.4, i hope it fixes!
[23:32] <Daughain> mauri, I dont remember how many decades its been since I messed around with dos.=)
[23:33] <mauri> Daughain: I know.... but it is only a trial in order to understand how to use fdsisk in linux
[23:33] <Daughain> Also, you will need to edit the BIOS boot settings before anything will boot off of USB.
[23:34] <Daughain> And,if the mobo doesnt support USB boot options, you wot be able to at all.
[23:34] <Daughain> wot==wont.
[23:34] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: going to make some milk until it downloads and hope it gets fixed so i don't bother you guys again
[23:35] <mauri> Daughain: yes yes i konw......tnk for youur time
[23:36] <Daughain> mauri,   Np, not sure how much help I was, though.
[23:37] <BixOun3y> COucou :)
[23:37] <BixOun3y> il ya peut etre personne qui me voit ?
[23:37] <Torch> pinkisntwell: 100 packages is rather normal for a kde minor upgrade in kubuntu
[23:38] <mauri> Daughain: do you know when will be releaseed a new kernel version for karmic?
[23:38] <Daughain> mauri,  No.....#ubunbtu would be a better place to ask about that.
[23:38] <Daughain> Err..#ubuntu
[23:38] <Edo> mgt_: still there?
[23:38] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: ok. i hope it works out for you. i
[23:40] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: when it's done do i need to restart?
[23:41] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: technically, probably not, but it might be a good idea. if you don't want to restart, i'd suggest at least doing /etc/init.d/kdm restart or service kdm restart (the new way)
[23:41] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: ok
[23:42] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: you're really helpful, thanks for going through the trouble to help me
[23:42] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: you are welcome. i know how it goes. :)
[23:44] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: i'm logging right now. i may log in again in a few hours and look for you if you still need help.
[23:45] <pinkisntwell> wankdanker: ok thanks for all the help
[23:45] <wankdanker> pinkisntwell: you bet! good luck.
[23:47] <Daughain> darkdelusions, I beleive sleep is calling. Peace.
[23:49] <Torch> pinkisntwell: so how's it going?
[23:49] <pinkisntwell> Torch: just finished installing 4.3.4
[23:49] <pinkisntwell> Torch: and the same thing happens
[23:49] <pinkisntwell> Torch: so...
[23:49] <Torch> pinkisntwell: and you did log out, restart x and log in again?
[23:50] <pinkisntwell> Torch: i did service kdm restart
[23:50] <Torch> pinkisntwell: that't basically the sam
[23:50] <Torch> e
[23:50] <Torch> pinkisntwell: oh well.
[23:50] <pinkisntwell> Torch: so it's well broken then
[23:50] <Torch> pinkisntwell: apparently yes, indeed.
[23:51] <pinkisntwell> Torch: so what am i gonna do now?
[23:51] <pinkisntwell> Torch: i don't feel like going through the trouble of installing again only to end up with the same problem
[23:51] <Torch> pinkisntwell: well... i'm out of ideas
[23:51] <Torch> pinkisntwell: reinstalling will take you ONE hour.
[23:51] <Edo> mgt_: still there?
[23:51] <Torch> pinkisntwell: how long have you fought this already?
[23:51] <pinkisntwell> Torch: yes but i will get the same problem right?
[23:52] <pinkisntwell> if you don't fix something it will come back
[23:52] <Torch> pinkisntwell: i see and understand your point. but the options are few.
[23:52] <pinkisntwell> Torch: actually reinstalling only to get the same problem is not an option
[23:53] <pinkisntwell> Torch: i think i'm just gonna install a different distro
[23:53] <pinkisntwell> let's take it to #kde
[23:53] <Dau`Gone> pinkisntwell,   Install Ubuntu, not kubuntu, then add kde4.3, that way you will still have gnome if you have any more kde problems.
[23:53] <Torch> pinkisntwell: #kde-chat, please
[23:56] <Dau`Gone> Night all.


[11:28] <Vanfanel> hi there
[11:29] <Vanfanel> I'm trying to install Ubuntu Core on an OMAP board, following these instructions here:
[11:29] <Vanfanel> http://www.omappedia.com/wiki/OMAP_Ubuntu_Core
[11:29] <Vanfanel> what are the repositories to add for 13.04, please??
[14:14] <Vanfanel> Hi, is the Pandaboard binary-based 3D system (EGL, GLES) supported on Ubuntu 13.x?
[14:16] <ogra> yes, it should be installed and set up by default
[14:23] <Vanfanel> ogra: and what about setting up the system from Ubuntu-core?
[14:24] <Vanfanel> is it possible to setup 3D on ubuntu-core 13.x?
[14:24] <ogra> ubuntu core isnt for endusers .... it is supposed ot be a base for image designers and the like (you can also abuse it as cheap chroot for building things)
[14:25] <ogra> use the desktop install if you want working GLES out of the box
[14:26] <Vanfanel> I have setup ubuntu-core already on 12.04 and could install TI's kernel and 3D support
[14:26] <Vanfanel> so I'm up to the task... with the proper PPA
[14:26] <Vanfanel> because I'm following this guide: http://www.omappedia.com/wiki/OMAP_Ubuntu_Core
[14:27] <Vanfanel> and it seems impossible to add the PPA on 13.04
[14:27] <Vanfanel> I also tried "add-apt-repository ppa:tiomap-dev/release"
[14:27] <Vanfanel> but it only works on 12.04
[14:28] <Vanfanel> So, how could I add the "binary" TI PPA on 13.x?
[14:28] <Vanfanel> once I have that set up, I should be ready to go on with 13.x
[14:31] <Vanfanel> If I asked an stupid question, please tell me also :D
[14:35] <ogra> no, but you are using a totally unsupported and untested setup
[14:35] <ogra> and the PPA will most likely break your install if you have working GLES now
[14:36] <ogra> (the panda is dead beef since quite some time, the TI team that cares for it is gone ... the panda images in ubuntu are largely unmaintained)
[14:39] <Vanfanel> ogra: thanks, I know I am on an unsupported setup
[14:40] <Vanfanel> but I have GLES working on 12.04
[14:40] <ogra> well, its rather unpredictable what will happen ...
[14:40] <Vanfanel> (12.04 Ubuntu core)
[14:40] <ogra> so i guess it means trial and error for you and keep the pieces if it breaks
[14:41] <Vanfanel> yes, so I am trying but there seems to be no good way to do "add-apt-repository ppa:tiomap-dev/release" on 13.04
[14:41] <Vanfanel> it only works on 12.04 systems
[14:41] <Vanfanel> does that make any sense?
[14:42] <ogra> yes
[14:42] <Vanfanel> but... if 3D comes included on 13.04...
[14:42] <Vanfanel> how comes the PPA cant be added?
[14:43] <Vanfanel> is 13.04 an "ubuntu arm" thing without any TI's support?
[14:43] <ogra> the PPA only has gstreamer codecs ... no GLES drivers ... the archive has GLES drivers that only work with the kernel in the archive (nobody wanted to port the 1700 patches to mainline for PVR support)
[14:43] <ogra> if you use the PPA you get a kernel update ... that breaks the drivers in the archive
[14:44] <ogra> (somewhere between these two bits appeared, TI shot down the mobile division including panda development)
[14:45] <Vanfanel> sorry if I look a bit dumb, english is not my main language: does that mean that, with 13.04, there's no need for an external PPA and 3D support comes included with the default kernel??
[14:46] <ogra> the 3D support didnt change between 12.04 and today
[14:46] <ogra> it should still work the same as long as you only use the archive
[14:47] <Vanfanel> ogra, what archive?
[14:47] <ogra> ubuntu
[14:48] <Vanfanel> ehm...
[14:48] <Vanfanel> the default install image?
[14:49] <ogra> yes
[14:56] <Vanfanel> ogra: is there an special omap4 package containig /usr/lib/GL/gl.h or should I install the mesa dev package?
[14:56] <ogra> no, you want the pvr driver
[14:56] <ogra> use the desktop image ...
[14:56] <ogra> i doubt anyone will remember off the top of his head what you need to do to set it up
[14:57] <Vanfanel> the desktop image is unusably slow
[14:57] <Vanfanel> and I don't need a desktop enviroment at all
[15:17] <Vanfanel> ogra: It seems I don't need GL/gl.h after all :)
[15:18] <ogra> just for building stuff
[15:18] <ogra> and there indeed the mesa package should have all you need
[15:21] <Vanfanel> I'm trying to compile a program that uses KMS+EGL, no need for desktop GL if well configured before compiling