[17:41] <blackboxsw> paride: Odd_Bloke rharper I can't remember if we no longer support CentOS/7 source rpm builds
[17:41] <blackboxsw> to upload to copr repo
[17:50] <blackboxsw> ./tools/run-container --source-package centos/8 works
[17:50] <blackboxsw> but dependency issues trying centos/7 . I think I recall paride mentioning a few weeks back that we can no longer support centos/7 builds there
[18:00] <blackboxsw> falcojr: for the moment, I think building centos/8 --source-package and uploading and requesting a build for el8 should suffice
[18:37] <rharper> blackboxsw: master cannot build centos7 since we dropped py2 support; I discussed with paride that we'd want the copr builds for centos7 to happen against 19.4-stable;
[18:48] <chillysurfer> is the cloudinit.util dict merging functions for general use? i'm assuming those are for merging cloud config. but is it normal to use them for typical dict merging in the rest of the code base?
[18:52] <Odd_Bloke> chillysurfer: If you grep for mergemanydict in the codebase, you can see it's used for a few different things; it might depend a little on what you consider "typical" dict merging as to whether or not it's appropriate in your case. :)
[18:57] <chillysurfer> Odd_Bloke: yep that's the one i'm specifically looking at. we even use it in our azure data source
[18:58] <chillysurfer> i might try to get around that though if possible. like most things, it doesn't seem free :)
[19:13] <blackboxsw> +1 rharper I had forgotten the context around that.
[19:13] <blackboxsw> thanks
[19:17] <meena> Odd_Bloke: so twitter actually worked!
[19:20] <Odd_Bloke> meena: Yep!
[19:20] <Odd_Bloke> That explains why the checkmarks on that PR are all blue now.
[21:44] <Ac-town> hmm not seeing anything on the docs for this, how can I return an error during a runcmd step? so that the error is passed down into data/status.json?
[21:46] <Ac-town> or even scripts-per-boot
[21:46] <Ac-town> ideally I want to collect that file and parse it to see if we failed any boot steps and if so what
[22:37] <blackboxsw> Ac-town: cloud-init status --long should report errors. https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/mZmwvqMpVW/  I get that error when I lxc launch ubuntu-daily:xenial  -c user.user-data="$(cat bogus_runcmd.yaml)"
[22:37] <blackboxsw> where bogus_runcmd.py contains "#cloud-config\nruncmd:\n  - 1/0"
[22:39] <blackboxsw> one thing to wonder/check is whether your runcmd content is actually valid cloud-config yaml on the system: https://cloudinit.readthedocs.io/en/latest/topics/faq.html#how-can-i-debug-my-user-data
[22:40] <Ac-town> do these errors only report when cloud-init fails to parse? or when those commands fail
[22:41] <Ac-town> for one example, we have our first puppet run in scripts-per-boot, and if that fails for some reason the host is going to fail, I'm looking for a sane way to report back what failed so I can watch the status across our whole deploy
[22:42] <Ac-town> but there are no errors in status.json under modules-final
[22:48] <blackboxsw> that doc url I linked only validates user-data cloud-config. (which actually produces some semblance of error through cloud-init status --long though those errors surfaced are widely different depending on what problems there are in the user-data YAML.)   I'll have to check scripts-per-(boot|instance|always) to see how cloud-init behaves there on failed "external" scripts
[22:49] <blackboxsw> I would want cloud-init to try processing and running all scripts in those directories and not stop after the first error, but I'd also want cloud-init to collect any and all errors and surface them from cloud-init status --long (which reads /run/cloud-init/status.json and result.json)
[22:51] <blackboxsw> Ac-town: I'm trying to think of how best to handle this, if cloud-init isn't surfacing an error in a scripts-per-boot maybe that's worth a bug and we can discuss on the bug whether that is out of scope for cloud-init.
[22:52] <Ac-town> I can easily see the errors section to be in the case that there was a cloud-init level error, but when I have puppet and commands in runcmd that are critical to boot it would be nice to avoid parsing logs
[22:52] <blackboxsw> I'm trying to launch a broken instance now with a bad script to see
[22:52] <blackboxsw> Ac-town: especially parsing cloud-init logs to be frank (as they are way too busy)
[22:53] <blackboxsw> Ac-town: your puppetmaster doesn't represent puppet apply's that fail on given nodes?
[22:53] <blackboxsw> or maybe you are running masterless
[22:53] <Ac-town> it's not an ideal puppet in any sense
[22:53] <Ac-town> no puppetdb
[22:54] <Ac-town> but there's still a puppetmaster
[22:54] <Ac-town> puppet is also managed by an external team, so getting those tools isn't trivial
[22:55] <blackboxsw> +1  right, understood. I'm trying to think of the best approach to take into account custom script failure (which doens't really fail cloud-init proper)
[22:56] <blackboxsw> I was toying with minor abuse/use of the  existing call home functionality  https://cloudinit.readthedocs.io/en/latest/topics/examples.html#call-a-url-when-finished
[22:56] <blackboxsw> which could post your custom script success failure exit codes maybe?
[22:56] <blackboxsw> to some url or your choosing
[22:56] <Ac-town> that would cool actually
[22:56] <blackboxsw> but again you want an easy way to "see" that failure from cloud-init I suppose
[22:57] <Ac-town> the idea of having it from the machine would be it's better for us to reach out to a host than a host to reach out
[22:57] <Ac-town> since I was going to write a small service to allow us to collect this data, or ansible
[22:58] <Ac-town> a vm workflow is this:
[22:58] <Ac-town> scale out, vm is created, puppet runs in scripts-per-boot and sets up all our basic host things and some packages used in runcmd, runcmd uses those packages to setup our data and start the service
[22:59] <Ac-town> my ideal would be to look across the infra to either follow the status or to see if there is a problem across the stack
[22:59] <blackboxsw> ok validated that I dump the same bogus script from runcmd in /var/lib/cloud/scripts/per-boot/1.sh
[22:59] <blackboxsw> and I see the error ('scripts-per-boot', RuntimeError('Runparts: 1 failures in 1 attempted commands',))
[22:59] <blackboxsw> across reboots
[23:00] <Ac-town> what about runcmd?
[23:00] <Ac-town> (it's possible we're not passing down puppets exit code)
[23:00] <blackboxsw> and same-ish from runcmd: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/mZmwvqMpVW/
[23:00] <Ac-town> I see a rsync step that fails and runcmd says success
[23:01] <blackboxsw> note note 'scripts-user' instead of ';scripts-per-boot'
[23:01] <blackboxsw> interesting, so I imagine you see that rsync failure in cloud-init-output.log instead of cloud-init.log?
[23:01] <Ac-town> I'm looking at the cloud-final journalctl
[23:02] <Ac-town> for some reason we're not writing out the logs in /var/log, why I'm not sure yet
[23:02] <Ac-town> but it's always been the case
[23:02] <blackboxsw> interesting. ok, might be rsyslog custo configuration on the system
[23:03] <Ac-town> could be, either way I see that scripts-per-boot return "SUCCESS" and same with scripts-user
[23:03] <blackboxsw> log configuration can/does get manipulated in  /etc/cloud/cloud.cfg.d/05_logging.cfg on a lot of systems
[23:05] <blackboxsw> on recent versions of cloud-init can show you what cloud-init sees a logging configuration   via `cloud-init query merged_cfg._log`
[23:05] <Ac-town> I see a cloud-init.log file managed there and the file does get made but it has a size of zero
[23:05] <blackboxsw> as root user
[23:05] <blackboxsw> ahh interesting
[23:05] <Ac-town> what version should that query work? I got an error from that
[23:05] <blackboxsw> could it be puppet manifest clearing it out?
[23:05] <Ac-town> we're on 18.5
[23:05] <blackboxsw> v. 20ish
[23:05] <blackboxsw> what disto?
[23:06] <blackboxsw> distro?
[23:06] <Ac-town> centos7 atm
[23:06] <blackboxsw> ahh, best we can get you is 19.4 via our copr repos. cloud-init upstream dropped python2 support end of 2019
[23:08] <blackboxsw> which lives @ https://copr.fedorainfracloud.org/coprs/g/cloud-init/el-testing/
[23:09] <blackboxsw> our daily upstream builds py3 only support https://copr.fedorainfracloud.org/coprs/g/cloud-init/cloud-init-dev/
[23:10] <blackboxsw> which will get you el8 deb packages
[23:10] <Ac-town> swapped out info for generic names, but this is the runcmd section https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/HQ6WhxhCkt/
[23:16] <blackboxsw> interesting, here's my same section with a broken runcmd script https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/mDCwCXSyX5/
[23:16] <blackboxsw> I also see the failure noted in cloud-init-output.log for that runcmd script that was created
[23:17] <blackboxsw> so it may be easier to parse WARNING out of /var/log/cloud-init-output.log for that case if upgrading to 20.3 of cloud-init is not possible on those images
[23:17] <Ac-town> what if multiple commands are listed in the runcmd? we have 10 steps in ours and at least one of those steps should always work
[23:18] <Ac-town> I can see if we can get it updated, but that's also managed by another team as they make the images :(
[23:20] <blackboxsw> right. so the runcmd section is written into a single consolidated script I think. that makes for a very long script that would have to take into account your separate steps/scripts running.
[23:21] <blackboxsw> makes me think maybe you'd want to emit separate per-boot scripts in cloud-config write_files section maybe so they can operate independently but I probably don't understand the problem you are trying to solve.
[23:22] <Ac-town> that's a decent option
[23:22] <Ac-town> didn't think about that
[23:23] <blackboxsw> I did a sample write_files puppet setup here earlier for a feature test https://github.com/cloud-init/ubuntu-sru/blob/master/bugs/d3e71b5e.txt
[23:24] <blackboxsw> you could b64 your content to make it easier to provide  your big scripts
[23:25] <Ac-town> so user write_files to write out scipts into scripts-user?
[23:25] <Ac-town> yep, we do that for some things already
[23:26] <Ac-town> I guess per-instance would make sense, it's after per-boot
[23:26] <blackboxsw> problem is if users try to provide user-data to their instance launch (if that's a thing you support) it would override that
[23:26] <blackboxsw> gotta run.
[23:26] <blackboxsw> see folks later
[23:26] <Ac-town> ty
[23:26] <blackboxsw> I'll check in later/tomorrow Ac-town good luck :)


[02:00] <mpt> Gooooooooooooooood afternoon Launchpadders!
[02:07] <LaserJock> hi mpt
[02:10] <ajmitch> good afternoon mpt
[03:15] <Ubugtu> New bug: #87471 in launchpad "Grey text is unnecessarily difficult to read" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87471
[03:47] <sistpoty> hi
[03:48] <sistpoty> how can I make the member techboard an administrator of the team motu?
[04:01] <ajmitch> they should be owner
[04:02] <ajmitch> so I think dholbach should change that
[04:02] <sistpoty> *cough*
[04:02] <ajmitch> heh
[04:02] <ajmitch> oh my
[04:03] <sistpoty> at least I wasn't stupid enough to rip myself of admin privileges yet *g*
[04:55] <Ubugtu> New bug: #87483 in launchpad "Need "Register a product" action button images" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87483
[08:29] <sabdfl> morning mpt
[08:30] <Fujitsu> Hi sabdfl.
[08:30] <sabdfl> hey Fujitsu
[08:31] <sabdfl> Fujitsu: liking the beta?
[08:31] <Fujitsu> sabdfl: It's soooo much better in a lot of ways :) Still needs some improvements, obviously.
[08:31] <sabdfl> yup, but i think we will start pushing it harder in a week or two once the initial cleanup is done
[08:33] <Fujitsu> Sounds good.
[08:33] <Fujitsu> It should be less of a maze, with the application tabs, for example.
[08:36] <sabdfl> agreed, it has a much more consistent and understandable navigation system
[08:37] <Fujitsu> Some of it (parts of the navigation within distribution source packages, for example) is still pretty terrible.
[08:49] <sabdfl> yes, agreed
[08:50] <Fujitsu> It's one of the most complex mazes I've found in such a web application, unfortunately.
[08:58] <mpt> hi sabdfl
[09:01] <sabdfl> morning mpt
[09:01] <sabdfl> good day?
[09:02] <mpt> SMTP problems, but apart from that, yes
[09:03] <Fujitsu> mpt: Are there any improvements in line for the distro source package stuff on LP? Or should I complain to somebody else?
[09:03] <sabdfl> mpt: will merge your branch into mine shortly
[09:04] <sabdfl> there is a test failure i'm fixing, then i'll send it off to PQM too
[09:04] <sabdfl> thanks for the update
[09:04] <sabdfl> let's speak again monday morning my time, and we'll identify more snags
[09:04] <mpt> ok
[09:04] <sabdfl> mpt: do you have any unmerged work at this stage?
[09:05] <mpt> yes, the work I'm doing right now :-)
[09:05] <sabdfl> ok then :-)
[09:05] <sabdfl> i just don't want to create unnecessary conflicts
[09:06] <sabdfl> if you could leave time at the end of your day to make sure your work passes page tests, then push the branch and ping me, i will integrate, review and possibly land it
[09:07] <sabdfl> main thing I want to get right this w/e is the navigation between /products/, /distributions/, /meetings/ and /people/
[09:07] <sabdfl> if you could get the template for that right I will happily do the menus
[09:08] <sabdfl> i will also fix up those pages to deal with the register-if-you-could-not-find-it cases
[09:08] <sabdfl> though of course they will just be rough links and will have to wait for action buttons
[09:13] <mpt> I have numerous other lists of problems to fix too
[09:20] <Ubugtu> New bug: #87497 in launchpad "Tab (facet) text should not be customizable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87497
[09:21] <sabdfl> ok, let's get as many of the one-liners and easy fixes in as possible this w/e
[09:31] <Ubugtu> New bug: #87499 in blueprint ""Register a spec" button should be "Register a blueprint"" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87499
[10:55] <Ubugtu> New bug: #87513 in rosetta "Combine "Change" and "Filter" buttons on translation page" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87513
[11:14] <sabdfl> ...that only moved in one direction...
[11:15] <mpt> oh, that would be a bonus
[11:16] <sabdfl> mpt: it does!
[11:17] <mpt> In Edgy at least, it goes in one direction on startup, the other direction on shutdown
[11:17] <sabdfl> mpt: i'm changing the order of these action items on the products/distros/sprints pages
[11:17] <mpt> I guess someone thought that was cute...
[11:17] <sabdfl> the "switch views" links should be at the top, then the "register" and "show all" ones
[11:17] <mpt> ok
[11:18] <sabdfl> mpt: oh, that's because shutting down is not the unwinding of starting up
[11:18] <sabdfl> it's a train leaving a station
[11:18] <sabdfl> also, the capitalisation of the menus should I think be "Show projects" not "Show Projects"
[11:18] <sabdfl> sentence caps
[11:18] <mpt> 1.1!
[11:19] <mpt> Seriously, that would be an easy but very long task
[11:20] <sabdfl> i'll do it
[11:20] <sabdfl> just for the menus i touch today
[11:21] <mpt> I think the inconsistency would look bad - better to change it in one go
[11:24] <Fujitsu> Speaking of consistency... Is the lack of it on the action (`Report a bug', 'File a ticket', 'Translate') buttons on product pages known/deliberate?
[11:25] <mpt> Fujitsu, if you're referring to "Ask a question" being slightly different from the others, yes, that's known and not deliberate
[11:25] <Fujitsu> mpt: That's the one. Good.
[11:25] <Fujitsu> It does look somewhat odd at the moment.
[11:26] <sabdfl> mpt: the watermarks don't use a consistent amount of space
[11:26] <sabdfl> as a result, it looks like the text is jumping around
[11:26] <sabdfl> when it isn't
[11:26] <sabdfl> need to get that fixed
[11:26] <mpt> They are different sizes, yes
[11:26] <mpt> ranging from ~70px to ~100px
[11:26] <sabdfl> yowser
[11:26] <sabdfl> that's terrible
[11:26] <sabdfl> they should occupy the same size, and left/right/top/bottom whitespace should be consistent
[11:27] <sabdfl> please won't you drop usman a note?
[11:27] <sabdfl> thanks
[11:27] <mpt> ok
[11:31] <BjornT> mpt: you get a progress indication if you supply -p to the test runner
[11:40] <Ubugtu> New bug: #87518 in launchpad "Watermarks should be a consistent size" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87518
[12:05] <Ubugtu> New bug: #2497 in rosetta "/people/*/+translations times out for prolific translators" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/2497
[12:35] <Ubugtu> New bug: #52806 in rosetta "interface: "next" should be at the bottom, too" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/52806
[12:50] <Ubugtu> New bug: #87525 in rosetta ""New translation" box out of screen" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87525
[02:29] <kgoetz> i'm wondering if its posible to disable displaying the 'tags' list. i'm finding this list is longer then the useful content on  the page, and probably takes more bandwidth
[02:30] <kgoetz> for the record, theres tags there
[02:30] <kgoetz> * 798 tags
[02:36] <kgoetz> mmm. i'm off to sleep, but question remains ;)
[02:37] <kgoetz> night all
[04:26] <dsas> hi, I'm wondering if I could be added to the launchpad-beta-testers team? I applied and sent an email to matt revell nearly two weeks ago saying I won't post any screenshots...
[06:36] <sabdfl> dsas: done
[07:04] <cbx33> does LP authenticate you via your gpg key when uploading and commiting to bzr branches?
[07:04] <dsas> cbx33: ssh key
[07:04] <cbx33> ahh ok
[07:04] <cbx33> thanks dsas
[07:05] <dsas> sabdfl: cool, thanks!
[07:05] <sabdfl> np
[07:06] <dsas> wow, this looks great.
[07:10] <cbx33> ok, if someone wants to check otu a branch on LP for commiting to
[07:10] <cbx33> is it
[07:11] <cbx33> bzr branch <sftp://branch etc>
[07:12] <sabdfl> cbx33: roughly, yes
[07:12] <sabdfl> that will branch
[07:12] <cbx33> cool
[07:12] <cbx33> thanks sabdfl
[07:12] <sabdfl> if you want to checkout, i think you use bzr checkout url://
[07:12] <cbx33> ahh i see
[07:12] <sabdfl> difference is where you commit to
[07:12] <cbx33> i mean I am in a team on LP with another user
[07:12] <cbx33> ahhh i see
[07:12] <sabdfl> typically, i branch to a local dir, hack hack hack local, commit offline etc, then push
[07:13] <cbx33> that's what I want to do
[07:13] <sabdfl> cbx33: ok, then you probably want to checkout a shared branch
[07:13] <sabdfl> you both then commit to the same place
[07:13] <cbx33> yes
[07:13] <sabdfl> LP acts like a free file storage space then
[07:13] <cbx33> well i want us both to push to the same place???
[07:13] <cbx33> currently I push to it
[07:13] <dsas> which would be bzr push sftp://bazaar.launchpad.net/~teamname/product/branchname
[07:14] <cbx33> so does my team mate need to branch or checkout?
[07:14] <sabdfl> ok, slow down
[07:15] <sabdfl> separate two concepts
[07:15] <sabdfl> one concept is the "branch", which has a lot of history associated with it
[07:15] <sabdfl> that's where all the old revisions are stored
[07:15] <cbx33> right
[07:15] <sabdfl> when you commit, that gets updated
[07:15] <sabdfl> the other concept is your "working directory" or "working tree" (because in bzr it's the whole directory tree in one)
[07:15] <sabdfl> when you checkout, you leave the branch where it is, and you create a local working directory
[07:16] <sabdfl> inside that, when you commit, the changes are recorded in the branch that you checked out
[07:16] <cbx33> ahh i see
[07:16] <cbx33> so at the moment I must have a branch
[07:16] <cbx33> as when i commit it's local
[07:16] <cbx33> and I push to the location
[07:16] <cbx33> right?
[07:16] <sabdfl> so if you do "bzr checkout lp:~team/product/branch" you are creating a local working directory, but the branch stays at lp
[07:16] <sabdfl> cbx33: exactly right
[07:17] <cbx33> so...
[07:17] <cbx33> would it be safe/good idea for my team mate to branch out too?
[07:17] <sabdfl> when you do "bzr branch lp:xxx" you are making a local branch
[07:17] <sabdfl> cbx33: sure
[07:17] <sabdfl> BUT
[07:17] <sabdfl> then he should not push to the shared location
[07:17] <sabdfl> he will overwrite any changes
[07:17] <cbx33> ahhh
[07:17] <cbx33> sooo
[07:17] <cbx33> if iwanted him to be able to commit to the server.....
[07:17] <cbx33> would he have to checkout instead
[07:17] <cbx33> and me too?
[07:17] <sabdfl> so... if you want a shared branch, you create the team, push to a branch for the team, then BOTH check it out
[07:18] <sabdfl> then you can ALSO branch it locally
[07:18] <cbx33> ok...
[07:18] <sabdfl> now you have two things
[07:18] <cbx33> or you can do commit --local i hear ?
[07:18] <sabdfl> a local working directory of the shared branch
[07:18] <sabdfl> and a branch+working directory
[07:18] <sabdfl> do your work in the branch
[07:18] <sabdfl> merge into the local-wd-of-checkout
[07:18] <sabdfl> commit
[07:18] <cbx33> jee this gets confusing
[07:19] <cbx33> hehe
[07:19] <sabdfl> it's easier with pictures
[07:19] <sabdfl> and once you get it, you fly
[07:19] <cbx33> if i checkout...i saw someone say you can commit --local ?
[07:19] <sabdfl> bzr is the easiest of the distributed ones to use
[07:19] <sabdfl> yes, i believe you can, but have never used that so don't know how it works
[07:19] <cbx33> i have used it for a while....but not..."properly"
[07:19] <cbx33> ok
[07:20] <cbx33> thanks sabdfl that's a great help
[07:21] <cbx33> how do i create the branch from the checkout?
[07:21] <sabdfl> hmmm
[07:22] <cbx33> my local one i mean
[07:22] <sabdfl> try just bzr branch checkoutdir newdir
[07:22] <cbx33> ok
[07:22] <sabdfl> it might automatically fetch the stuff from the branch associated with that checkoutdir
[07:22] <cbx33> ok
[07:29] <cbx33> sabdfl, if I want to check for updates
[07:30] <cbx33> I presume I'd have to first run bzr update in the chreckout?
[07:30] <cbx33> then again in the working branch?
[07:30] <sabdfl> the working branch and the checkout are different
[07:31] <sabdfl> so, if you are in the working tree, and do update, it looks at the branch and says "are there new commits in this branch since I was last updated"
[07:31] <sabdfl> if your buddy committed to the shared branch, those changes will come into your checkout working directory
[07:31] <sabdfl> and you may have to resolve conflicts
[07:31] <cbx33> ahhh
[07:31] <cbx33> ok
[07:31] <cbx33> what if i worked in my checkout?
[07:32] <sabdfl> now, if you then cd to the working BRANCH you made locally (it's actually a workingtree+branch)
[07:32] <sabdfl> and do bzr update
[07:32] <sabdfl> then you will see "nothing to do"
[07:32] <sabdfl> why?
[07:32] <sabdfl> because nobody else is committing to your local branch
[07:32] <sabdfl> make sense?
[07:32] <sabdfl> in the WT of the checkout, someone else might commit to the shared branch
[07:32] <sabdfl> so bzr update will look for that
[07:32] <sabdfl> but in a local branch (which is a WT+branch), your buddy can't commit to that
[07:33] <sabdfl> so bzr update will never see anything there new
[07:33] <cbx33> indeed
[07:33] <cbx33> so
[07:33] <sabdfl> bzr merge is what you want
[07:33] <cbx33> is it just bad practice to "work" in my checkout
[07:33] <sabdfl> will pull in new revisions from the shared branch into your local WT+branch
[07:33] <sabdfl> cbx33: no
[07:33] <sabdfl> the bzr developers often do that
[07:33] <sabdfl> when they are rapidly collaborating
[07:34] <sabdfl> (i think they know how to commit locally with a checkout too)
[07:34] <sabdfl> if say they are offline and want to commit
[07:34] <sabdfl> bzr gives you this flexibility
[07:34] <sabdfl> but MOST people don't need this
[07:34] <sabdfl> i've never used a shared branch and checkout
[07:34] <sabdfl> i just use branches
[07:34] <sabdfl> however
[07:34] <cbx33> yes
[07:35] <cbx33> it seems less complicated
[07:35] <sabdfl> in order to make it perform better, i use another concept that I haven't told you about
[07:35] <sabdfl> ready for it?
[07:35] <cbx33> yup
[07:35] <sabdfl> ok
[07:35] <cbx33> oh hang on 2 secs
[07:35] <cbx33> I'm getting my team mate to join
[07:35] <sabdfl> what i have been describing as a "Branch" is actually 2 things
[07:35] <encompass> ok
[07:35] <sabdfl> too late - he missed the early stuff, so this will be confusing
[07:35] <sabdfl> sorry encompass
[07:35] <cbx33> bno he hasn't
[07:35] <sabdfl> ok
[07:35] <cbx33> I've been pasting
[07:36] <sabdfl> ok
[07:36] <encompass> howdy
[07:36] <sabdfl> so what i've been calling a "Branch" is 2 things
[07:36] <sabdfl> first, it's a "cloud of revisions"
[07:36] <sabdfl> second, it's a "listing of the sequence of revisions that describes the history of THIS branch"
[07:36] <encompass> ok
[07:36] <encompass> I get that
[07:36] <sabdfl> you can actually separate those two
[07:37] <cbx33> oh really?
[07:37] <sabdfl> and share the "cloud of revisions" across multiple branches
[07:37] <sabdfl> think about it
[07:37] <sabdfl> the cloud of revisions contains EVERY version of EVERY file that has EVER existed
[07:37] <cbx33> yeh i see
[07:37] <sabdfl> if you make a new branch, and put 1 commit on it, you may touch, say 5 files
[07:37] <sabdfl> why store ALL the other revisions as well?
[07:38] <sabdfl> more importantly, why not put all of them into one shared cloud?
[07:38] <sabdfl> you have to keep the history of each branch separate
[07:38] <encompass> that way everyone gets changes at once
[07:38] <sabdfl> encompass: yes, if they are all sharing the cloud
[07:38] <sabdfl> but usually, this shared storage is all done locally
[07:38] <encompass> k
[07:38] <cbx33> indeed
[07:38] <sabdfl> what i'm describing now is called a repo
[07:38] <sabdfl> for repository
[07:39] <sabdfl> if i make a repository, and then underneath it I do a "bzr branch", all the revisions will be stored in the repo, and the branch sequence-of-revisions history gets stored in the branch
[07:39] <sabdfl> the sequence detail is tiny
[07:39] <sabdfl> compared to the cloud of revisions
[07:40] <sabdfl> so, this means then that when I merge into my branch from yours, all the revisions i have never seen before go into the cloud
[07:40] <sabdfl> if I then merge from someone else, and you already provided me with a bunch of those revisions, I don't need to get them from you
[07:40] <sabdfl> sorry, from them
[07:40] <sabdfl> more importantly
[07:40] <sabdfl> say I merge mainline into my branch A
[07:40] <sabdfl> I get all the newer revisions
[07:40] <encompass> so when I make changes I get all his revisions too?
[07:41] <encompass> or "their"
[07:41] <sabdfl> if I immediately then merge mainline into my branch B, I don't need ANY new revisions, i can find them all locally
[07:41] <sabdfl> hm...
[07:41] <cbx33> ahh
[07:41] <sabdfl> think of each change they made as a "revision"
[07:41] <cbx33> so...
[07:41] <sabdfl> actually, it's not the change, it's the "state of the files at the time of commit"
[07:41] <cbx33> there is a local cloud of all revisions?
[07:41] <encompass> ok
[07:42] <sabdfl> when I go commit, hack, commit, hack, commit, i make a set of revisions
[07:42] <sabdfl> when you merge from me, you will get each of those revisions
[07:42] <cbx33> yes
[07:42] <sabdfl> cbx33: there isn't, unless you setup a repo and use it
[07:42] <cbx33> right i see
[07:42] <sabdfl> by default, each branch has its own cloud
[07:42] <cbx33> yes
[07:42] <sabdfl> so, imagine this setup
[07:42] <sabdfl> you have a big mainline over there on a server
[07:43] <sabdfl> you do this:
[07:43] <sabdfl> bzr branch sftp://server/path/to/mainline foo
[07:43] <sabdfl> bzr branch sftp://server/path/to/mainline  bzr
[07:43] <sabdfl> now
[07:43] <sabdfl> i have TWO branches
[07:43] <cbx33> yup
[07:43] <sabdfl> each of them has ALL the revisions EVER from mainline
[07:43] <cbx33> yes
[07:43] <sabdfl> they are complete branches, totally independent
[07:43] <sabdfl> i sucked down a lot of network bandwidth to do that
[07:44] <sabdfl> actually, right now they are identical
[07:44] <sabdfl> assuming nobody commited in between my branches
[07:44] <sabdfl> now I hack on the one branch for a while
[07:44] <cbx33> yeh
[07:44] <sabdfl> people commit to mainline
[07:44] <sabdfl> in the branch i am working on, i do a "bzr merge sftp://mainline..."
[07:45] <sabdfl> now, in the cloud for that branch, i have all the new revisions
[07:45] <cbx33> yes
[07:45] <sabdfl> but in the other branch, it's cloud is separate, i never merged into that
[07:45] <cbx33> got it
[07:45] <sabdfl> now, if the branches used a shared repo, things would be different
[07:45] <sabdfl> when i merge into branch foo, the following happens:
[07:45] <sabdfl>  1. the new revisions come into the shared cloud
[07:46] <sabdfl>  2. my working tree for *foo* gets the new changes, and maybe i have to update conflicts
[07:46] <sabdfl>  3. the working tree for *bar* is unaffected
[07:46] <sabdfl> but
[07:46] <sabdfl> say i now cd into bar
[07:46] <sabdfl> and merge from mainline
[07:46] <sabdfl> now, all the revisions are already in the shared cloud
[07:46] <sabdfl> so there's very little network traffic
[07:46] <cbx33> yes i see
[07:47] <encompass> ok... cool
[07:47] <sabdfl> (this is the smartness spiv is working on with the smart server, to optimise that sort of dialog between client and server)
[07:47] <sabdfl> so the merge goes very quickly
[07:47] <encompass> really quick
[07:47] <sabdfl> the client and server establish that we already have all the revisions locally
[07:47] <sabdfl> so its just the merge calculation
[07:47] <cbx33> right...
[07:47] <sabdfl> and my working directory is updated locally
[07:47] <cbx33> so a question
[07:48] <sabdfl> and of course the branch for bar also gets told "you have now included these revisions"
[07:48] <cbx33> encompass, and I are working on a very small...file quantiy.....project
[07:48] <cbx33> I have a branch that I have been working on
[07:48] <cbx33> and it is registered with LP
[07:48] <cbx33> as the team
[07:48] <sabdfl> sure
[07:48] <sabdfl> what do you mean "as the team"
[07:49] <cbx33> i created a team for our project
[07:49] <sabdfl> you mean you pushed the branch to a shared space, under a team account?
[07:49] <sabdfl> cool
[07:49] <cbx33> yes
[07:49] <sabdfl> you can have multiple branches of course, individually and in the team
[07:49] <cbx33> yes
[07:49] <cbx33> so would you recommend us having personal branchs
[07:49] <sabdfl> yes
[07:49] <sabdfl> it depends
[07:49] <cbx33> and then for example I could tak control of pushing to the server
[07:49] <sabdfl> do you  imagine adding features that will require substantial orthogonal work?
[07:50] <sabdfl> cbx33: that's one way
[07:50] <encompass> no
[07:50] <cbx33> we're pretty seperate
[07:50] <sabdfl> cbx33: you just merge from encompass, and push to the server
[07:50] <cbx33> :p
[07:50] <cbx33> ok
[07:50] <sabdfl> guys, i'm out of time
[07:50] <cbx33> np
[07:50] <sabdfl> hope this has helped
[07:50] <cbx33> thank you SOO much
[07:50] <cbx33> we owe you
[07:50] <encompass> it did it was a lease to chat with you
[07:50] <encompass> pleasure is all mine sire
[07:51] <cbx33> so i propose we create personal branches
[07:51] <encompass> yeah
[07:51] <encompass> ok I will go back to phimage
[07:51] <cbx33> and then i will take control of merging the changes into the team repo
[07:51] <encompass> he?


[09:42] <erichammond> http://cloud.ubuntu.com/ami/ is broken on my browser (chromium): "DataTables warning: JSON data from server failed to load or be parsed. This is most likely to be caused by a JSON formatting error."
[09:56] <kim0> erichammond: It's not browser specific .. something seems to have went wrong .. thanks for the heads up
[15:26] <kim0> Can anyone help me answer that:   Will Eucalyptus be 2.0.1 (upstream released Oct 20) be in Natty ?
[15:34] <smoser> Daviey, ?
[15:38] <Daviey> kim0: can't say for certain, but 'probably'... depending if there are any difficult regressions when one of us has a smoke test.
[15:38] <Daviey> kim0: certainly will not have 2.1
[15:48] <kim0> Daviey: thanks :)
[15:54] <kim0> Daviey: Any luck thinking of some community contribution venues
[15:55] <kim0> smoser: your input is much appreciated as well :)
[16:06] <Daviey> kim0: smoser has an AMAZING idea.
[16:07] <smoser> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/cloud-server-n-image-rebundle
[16:07] <smoser> :)
[16:07] <smoser> mostly seriously on that.  rebundling is a very important area of our images that isn't addressed in documentation or tools terribly well.
[16:09] <TeTeT> smoser: we have an exercise on it in the UEC training
[16:10]  * kim0 in a call
[16:10] <kim0> but I would like to understand exactly what would contributors do ?
[16:10] <kim0> is it documentation
[16:11] <smoser> some is documentation, yes. but some is development of utilities for "cleaning" or making that process easier.
[16:19] <kazade> hi smoser, I've just been asking some questions in #ubuntu-uk about Amazon EC2 and Daviey mentioned you might be able to help me (they aren't Ubuntu related, just general EC2 questions). you free?
[16:20] <smoser> sure.
[16:20] <kazade> basically, I have this running EC2 instance and I'd like to create a duplicate
[16:20] <kazade> the EC2 instance has a single EBS root device..
[16:21] <smoser> kim0, this is the type of thing that i'd like better covered
[16:21] <smoser> (it almost smells like a setup)
[16:21] <smoser> kazade, what release ? 10.10 ? 10.04 ?
[16:21] <kazade> 10.04
[16:21] <kazade> basically, if I click "Create Image" will it freeze/pause the running instance? and will that create me an image I can create a new EC2 vm with?
[16:22]  * kazade is confused generally
[16:22] <kim0> smoser: I'll ping ya in a 20 mins or so .. thanks a lot though! :)
[16:23] <kazade> also, if I create a snapshot of the EBS device... would restoring that snapshot essentiall "rollback" the EC2 vm?
[16:24] <smoser> if you hit 'Create Image', that makes the 'CreateImage' (i think thats the api name) call , which can also be done via 'ec2-create-image'.
[16:24] <smoser> it will stop the instance (by issuing 'shutdown'), and then snapshot the volume and create a new ami from that snapshot, then start the instance back up.
[16:25] <smoser> this is probably what i would recommend you do. it is very easy and very effective.
[16:25] <kazade> ok cool that sounds like exactly what I needed to know. How long would the image creation take normally?
[16:29] <smoser> couple minutes
[16:29] <smoser> i might advise that you shut down your instance (/sbin/poweroff) yourself
[16:29] <smoser> it just seems cleaner to me, but i believe it does work the other way.
[16:30] <kazade> smoser, thanks  just one final question: is taking a snapshot of the EBS device exactly equivalent of taking a snapshot in virtualbox (for example)
[16:30] <smoser> i dont know what it means in virtualbox, but its pretty much a volume snapshot
[16:30] <smoser> ie, it saves all data at the block device level
[16:31] <kazade> what I mean is, if I reverted the snapshot and booted the EC2 vm, would it essentially rollback? (I mean, the EC2 wouldn't break or anything)
[16:31] <smoser> did i answer your question ?
[16:31] <smoser> the running instance is not affected by any snapshots of its root device
[16:32] <kazade> right..
[16:32] <smoser> you can even do them to a mounted filesystem
[16:32] <kazade> if I restored a snapshot of the device though, what would that do to the running machine? (or is that not possible?)
[16:32] <smoser> you cannot reset an existing volume's content to a snapshot you can only create new volumes from the snapshot.
[16:32] <kazade> smoser, right ok, that makes sense
[16:33] <kazade> Can an EC2 machine change it's root device?
[17:00] <smoser> kazade, sort of.
[17:00] <smoser> what do you want to do ?
[17:01] <kazade> I just wondered if I could snapshot the EBS device, and then if I screwed up the VM, restore the EBS device
[17:01] <kazade> (e.g. by pointing the EC2 machine at a newly restored snapshot)
[17:37] <smoser> Daviey, if you see kazade, you can tell him that you can easily attach a volume of a snapshot to runnign instance, mount that volume, diff it against / anda sync contents that way.
[18:02] <kim0> Hi everyone, anyone new around here ? say Hi please
[18:07] <daker> poor kim0
[18:08] <kim0> daker: It takes some effort man :)
[18:09] <kim0> However I am presistent hehe
[18:09] <daker> yes
[18:17] <kim0> Daviey: must the CLC be configured to NAT packets manually ? i.e. is that not part of setup ?
[18:17] <kim0> Daviey: I'm trying to answer http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1646048 .. where basically NC doesn't have internet connectivity
[18:28] <kim0> kirkland: ^
[18:34] <kim0> smoser: Hi! so you're basically proposing people attack https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/cloud-server-n-image-rebundle
[18:34] <smoser> sure.
[18:34] <kim0> smoser: did you ever blog or write something explaining what needs to be done
[18:34] <kim0> manually
[18:35] <smoser> well if you have a way they can do it automatically (as opposed to manually) i'm happy to hear it!
[18:36] <kim0> what I'm saying this .. did you ever explain the manual steps, so that I have a better understanding of what needs to be done
[18:36] <kim0> s/this/is/
[18:42]  * kim0 reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CloudServerNattyCloudUtils
[18:44] <DigitalFlux> kim0: Interesting
[18:44] <DigitalFlux> smoser was talking about it i think today at #openstack
[18:45] <kim0> yeah interesting indeed :)
[18:45] <smoser> kim0, no. not really. theres a bunch of things covered there.
[18:45] <kim0> smoser: by first impression .. that's a whole lot of things :) can u pick an important one or two scenarioes to tackle
[18:46] <kim0> I guess downloading ec2 images .. boot in kvm .. modify .. republish
[18:46] <smoser> i've probably covered many of them before on posts to ec2ubuntu and such
[18:47] <kim0> smoser: what about if this "cleaning" utility records files at ~ while booting .. and at cleaning stage presents the user with all newly created files to delete or keep
[18:48] <kim0> we could have defaults based on regex matches .. like for /var/log/* -> delete
[18:48] <kim0> for /etc/ -> keep
[18:48] <kim0> it may monitor the whole system .. not just ~
[18:48] <kim0> don't know .. comments
[18:48] <smoser> yeah, its really crappy and heuristic
[18:48] <smoser> so it needs config options
[18:49] <smoser> and its going to be wrong in many cases in both ways
[18:51] <kim0> smoser: what's the main purpose of uncloud-init
[18:51] <kim0> can't find any proper page talking about that
[18:51] <smoser> to hackily boot one of our images without a ec2 metadata service
[18:52] <kim0> without cloud-init blocking for ages
[18:52] <kim0> that once bit me :)
[18:53] <smoser> that problem sucks in general
[18:53] <smoser> there is no way to tell if i'm on EC2, and thus should wait for the metadata service
[18:53] <smoser> but on EC2 (or on UEC), i *have* to wait for the metadata service, indefinitely.
[18:54] <kim0> yeah!
[19:17] <raymdt> hey
[19:32] <kim0> raymdt: hey
[19:43] <soren> smoser: This is my last working day of the year. If you want to chat about stuff, this is a good time :)
[19:45] <smoser> hm..
[19:45] <smoser> give me a couple minutes ?
[19:49] <soren> smoser: Sure, I'm not going anywhere.
[19:49] <soren> yet :)
[19:59] <smoser> soren, ok
[19:59] <smoser> so
[20:01] <smoser> our cloud images, i *want* them to be bit for bit identical on different clouds.
[20:01] <smoser> or as close to it as possible
[20:01] <smoser> i want the download on uec-images.ubuntu.com to not need a bunch of "fixing" for before its useable on EC2, UEC, openstack, and ideally "raw kvm/libvirt"
[20:04] <smoser> but we have this metadata service thing, that i want/have-to wait around for in some cases (uec / ec2) and not in others ('raw kvm/libvirt')
[20:05] <smoser> right now in the .tar.gz files, there is a -floppy file, which is a bootable floppy, and documentation, then that says how to boot it (boot with floppy bootable).
[20:05] <soren> smoser: Right.
[20:05] <smoser> the floppy then boots the kernel in the instance with special args telling it "hey, theres no cloud here"
[20:06] <soren> smoser: What is the canonical use case that makes us have to wait for the meta-data service (rather than just handling it in the background once it turns up).
[20:06] <soren> ?
[20:06] <smoser> but even that is yucky. ideally, it would boot up, find that there was no metadata service or any other method of letting a user log in, and "uncloud" itself.
[20:07] <smoser> well, righ tnow it actually blocks boot.
[20:07] <smoser> which allows the user to do things (via user data) when it runs
[20:08] <smoser> some of these things might include modifying the system in ways that are difficult to do once it is further up
[20:08] <smoser> ie, at that point you can still mount another volume over the top of /home or modify config of a server before it has started.
[20:09] <smoser> so those things are valuable, and backgrounding would make them impossible (or require restart/reboot)
[20:09] <soren> right, ok.
[20:10] <soren> Do we have any data on how long it takes before the meta-data service turns up?
[20:11] <smoser> we have annoyances
[20:11] <soren> min/max/mean time sort of stuff?
[20:11] <smoser> i would have marked this as not an issue sometime about 6 months ago on EC2.
[20:11] <smoser> i have never really seen a "waiting for metadata service" message there.
[20:11] <smoser> and i had even turned it down to something small, 20 seconds or something, maybe less.
[20:12] <smoser> but UEC started failing, and we were told "you have to wait longer"
[20:12] <smoser> so, wait longer we did.
[20:12] <soren> :(
[20:12] <smoser> in the vast majority of the cases, waiting more than 30 seconds was not that useful, i thikn, but dont have a lot of data on it. although we did at the time.
[20:15] <soren> smoser: So the difficult case is UEC.
[20:15] <soren> smoser: Luckily, that's the one we control.
[20:15] <smoser> mostly, yes, but then it came about because of EC2
[20:15] <smoser> so UEC is feature compatible :)
[20:16] <soren> Sure, sure.
[20:16] <soren> How about we change UEC to pass a "Hi, I'm UEC. Please bear with me while I get off my a*** and get the meta-data service up and running for you" sort of kernel parameter?
[20:17] <smoser> soren, well, i can somewhat control the kernel parameters that are passed
[20:18] <smoser> however, the control i have over that is via /boot/grub/grub.cfg
[20:18] <soren> Eh?
[20:18] <smoser> which would ideally be read by kvm or openstack "full disk" or ...
[20:18] <soren> UEC never boots an out-of-image kernel anymore?
[20:18] <smoser> remember my 'loader' hack/feature in eucalyptus
[20:19] <soren> I didn't think that was used all the time.
[20:19] <smoser> it does, and in that case, sure, you could hard code a "you're running on UEC" parameter.
[20:19] <soren> That's a start, at least.
[20:19] <smoser> its not used all the time, but that is the "right way" going forward (or some other mechanism that is more 'normal' to allow guest to control its own kernel loading)
[20:19] <smoser> so that solution is really only for "legacy"
[20:20] <soren> Can't we ask the BIOS how it booted?
[20:20] <soren> If it's from floppy, there's a 99.999% chance it's UEC.
[20:21] <smoser> well, the way i have to run kvm without cloud for those right now is via a floppy also
[20:21] <soren> Doh.
[20:21] <smoser> that was the easiest way to inject kernel parameters
[20:21] <soren> Wait, what?
[20:21] <smoser> (the -floppy disk distributed is hacky
[20:21] <smoser> but it basically does: boot (hd0,1)/vmlinuz some-kernel-args NOCLOUD
[20:22] <smoser> so its quite less than ideal.
[20:22] <smoser> in natty cycle, i hope to have full disk images, and just say "kvm -hda disk.img"
[20:23] <smoser> btw, i'm thankful for your input, please dont' think i'm just shooting down ideas
[20:23] <smoser> one thing i've considered is putting something into the image, which could be written to without understanding the filesystem
[20:23] <smoser> and the providing a tool that could muck that bit
[20:30] <kim0> smoser: what about providing different kernels, such that the user would choose a different kernel for a direct kvm boot
[20:31] <smoser> well that would incur the overhead of maintaining 2 kernels.
[20:32] <smoser> we recently got a *major* feature add when we dropped the -ec2 kernel
[20:32] <soren> smoser: You've lost me. I thought you said you used grub.cfg for something.
[20:32] <kim0> smoser: not really different kernels .. just 2 kernel entries .. booting same kernel with different params
[20:33] <soren> smoser: (/me is catching up on the conversation... Many things going on at the same time)
[20:33] <soren> smoser: re: "btw, i'm thankful for your input, please dont' think i'm just shooting down  ideas
[20:33] <soren> "
[20:33] <soren> smoser: Not a problem at all.
[20:34] <smoser> kim0, in which case i'd still have to get the user (or cloud) to select the kernel to boot.
[20:34] <smoser> soren, currently we jsut ship a partition image
[20:34] <kim0> smoser: defaults to cloud kernel .. and kvm user chooses a different one
[20:34] <smoser> that partition image has no bootloader in it
[20:34] <smoser> but, it has both /boot/grub/grub.cfg and /boot/grub/menu.lst in it
[20:35] <smoser> grub.cfg is used if you boot with 'loader support' on UEC
[20:35] <smoser> menu.lst is used if you boot with pv-grub on EC2
[20:35] <smoser> then, there is a floppy disk in the .tar.gz file.
[20:36] <smoser> when you boot off of that, it does a dirty hack and says "boot /vmlinuz from inside disk 1 partition 1, and pass 'nocloud' as a kernel parameter"
[20:37] <kim0> what about a count down .. like Press N for no-cloud 5 4 3 2 1
[20:37] <smoser> kim0, i'd like to avoid manual action on every reboot (even the first)
[20:38] <kim0> so cloud kernel works ok for ec2 and uec .. only problem is, direct kvm case
[20:39] <kim0> well u just have to detect run time env I guess then .. somehow
[20:39] <kim0> no detectable info on ec2 xen store ?
[20:40] <smoser> there is definitely stuff in the xen store, but not something published that i could rely on being there.
[20:40] <smoser> the thing that is documented is the metadata service :)
[20:41] <smoser> and even then... ideally.... the image is easily used as xen instance.
[20:41] <smoser> i know that i'm asking a lot, but thas what the goal is... this disk image "just works"
[20:42] <smoser> so far, your timeout on selection of non-EC2 cloud kernel entry is about the best i have.
[20:42] <smoser> the issue with that is that
[20:43] <smoser> a.) then you penalize the UEC boot by 5 seconds
[20:44] <smoser> b.) that default isn't easily modifyable without mounting the image -- this is what i really want to stay away from.
[20:45] <kim0> what about a no-penalty .. press shift while booting kinda thing ?
[20:45] <euca> hi guys! I'm trying to run a private cloud with UEC and I want all my machines to have a static IP on the network. The VMs get an IP, but then they don't boot. There is a script that tries to obtain metadata from a server it can't reach, and so it just keeps looping.
[20:45] <euca>  DataSourceEc2.py[WARNING]: waiting for metadata service at http://<IP_ADDRESS>/2009-04-04/meta-data/instance-id
[20:46] <euca>  DataSourceEc2.py[WARNING]:   16:06:10 [ 1/100]: url error [timed out]
[20:46] <kim0> lol :)
[20:46] <kim0> haahaahh .. speak of the devil
[20:48] <kim0> euca: how long did you wait for them to boot ?
[20:48] <euca> I've read that this happens when the private IP is the same as the public IP.. but I can't seem to make them be different. Has anyone dealt with this? I'm using the cloud controller runs Ubuntu Server 10.10, the node runs CentOS, both with eucalyptus 2.0.0
[20:48] <euca> kim0:  I let it stay overnight
[20:49] <kim0> ew!
[20:49] <kim0> why aren't you running one software stack in all ur cloud
[20:49] <euca> kim0:  because Ubuntu Server failed to install on the node
[20:49] <kim0> :)
[20:49] <euca> and CentOS didn't
[20:49] <kim0> euca: how did it fail
[20:50] <euca> it didn't detect any storage
[20:50] <euca> devices
[20:50] <kim0> can you post a bug report please
[20:50] <euca> well, I can, but this is sort of urgent for me
[20:50] <kim0> hmm
[20:51] <euca> I'm sure the underlying OS is not the issue
[20:51] <kim0> try asking in #eucalyptus maybe
[20:52] <smoser> euca, make sure you're not running a dhcp server on your network
[20:52] <euca> smoser:  I don't have control over the network
[20:52] <euca> but there is a dhcp server
[20:52] <euca> on that network
[20:52] <smoser> then you really can't run eucalyptus
[20:53] <smoser> the guests will dhcp, which gets put onto the network of the host
[20:53] <smoser> there are 2 dhcp servers
[20:53] <smoser> it will take the lease from whichever runs first
[20:53] <smoser> returns first
[20:53] <kim0> wild west competition
[20:53] <euca> the guest get the correct IP
[20:53] <euca> I configured it to be STATIC
[20:54] <euca> I can traceroute and ping the machine. I even checked the MAC and the IP. They are both correct.
[20:55] <euca> when I try to ssh, I get a connection was reset error. and the guest is trying to fetch metadata from that URL
[20:55] <euca> I tried the URL manually, and it returns 404 Not Found
[20:55] <euca> I've read that this used to be a bug in lucid, when both the public and private IPs are the same
[20:55] <smoser> euca, that url will only be good from inside the guest
[20:56] <euca> smoser: I suspected as much, but I thought I'd try ;)
[20:56] <smoser> i wonder how you configured the IP to be static, though, and which IP you chose.
[20:56] <euca> smoser:  hold on, I'll post the eucalyptus.conf somewhere
[20:56] <smoser> because the instance should be configured with the private ip
[20:57] <smoser> (ie, ifconfig inside it will show the private IP)
[20:57] <smoser> and routing magic on the node lets it through
[20:58] <smoser> euca, for debugging, you can try running my ttylinux images, which do not depend on the metadata service
[20:58] <smoser> http://smoser.brickies.net/ubuntu/ttylinux-uec/
[20:58] <kim0> smoser: btw for UEC, does CLC perform NATing as part of default setup, or is the user expected to do that manually
[20:58] <smoser> use the latest there, use uec-publish-tarball to publish it, run an instance, and you can ssh in.  of course you have to somehow set your IP address (those expect that they get dhcp)
[20:59] <smoser> they will also, after a time, start dumping debug info on their view of the world.
[20:59] <smoser> kim0, i dont belive it does any natting, i'm not really certain on the config of that stuff.
[21:00] <kim0> so out of the box, NCs doesn't have internet connectivity
[21:01] <euca> smoser: http://codepad.org/uwgop8kl (eucalyptus.conf on the CC)  http://codepad.org/BoFMV18z (part of eucalyptus.conf from the NC)
[21:03] <euca> smoser:  euca-describe-instances output http://codepad.org/OUozYObx
[21:03] <smoser> so how do you think that you made the instances use a static IP address ?
[21:03] <smoser> i could be incorrect, but i believe that everything is based on dhcp
[21:04] <euca> I thought so too.. but then I ran nmap and saw the MAC associated to that IP
[21:05] <smoser> well, it could very well get that.
[21:05] <smoser> but its a race
[21:05] <smoser> run one of those ttylinux images
[21:05] <euca> I'll try doing that in a sec
[21:05] <smoser> and see what happens.
[21:06] <smoser> they'll open up a ssh server on 22 with a password
[21:08] <euca> what's the username and password?
[21:08]  * euca 30k/sec
[21:08] <smoser> really ?
[21:09] <euca> yes
[21:09] <smoser> i think its ubuntu:passw0rd
[21:09] <smoser> hm..
[21:09] <euca> and it's stuck now
[21:09] <euca> hm
[21:09] <euca> 40k now ;)
[21:10] <smoser> hm.. that stinks. i just pulled to here *michigann) at 600k, but my ec2 instance is only getting it at ~ 30 k
[21:11] <euca> I'll wait
[21:13] <smoser> no idea whats wrong there, maybe i should get a mirror for those
[21:28] <euca> smoser: can I run it in a t1.small ?
[21:29] <smoser> m1.small you mean ?
[21:29] <smoser> yes, it should fit inside your pocket
[21:29] <euca> yes, m1.small :)
[21:29] <smoser> (it has a 24M root filesystem i think)
[21:31] <euca> pending..
[21:37] <euca> interesting
[21:37] <euca> I can't run it
[21:38] <euca> the machine doesn't show up in 'xen list'
[21:38] <euca> and there are no errors in the error log
[21:38] <euca> and it's not in /usr/local/eucalyptus/admin/
[21:38] <euca> i.e the folder is there, but there are no files
[21:39] <euca> and on the second try, only kernel and kernel-digest were copied to the NC
[21:42] <euca> hm, apparently it failed to delete  /usr/local/eucalyptus//eucalyptus/cache/eki-457115F8/kernel-staging
[21:43] <euca> i'm deleting the cache and retrying
[21:47] <euca> nope
[21:47] <euca> it's not running it
[21:47] <euca> and I can't find an error in nc.log
[21:49] <euca> nothing in xend.log
[21:50] <euca> :/


[01:15] <Azendale> marcoceppi: I know this is like a little kid asking "are we there yet?". Do you think you'll get to review my merge proposal (for etherpad-lite) today?
[01:17] <marcoceppi> Azendale: if you're curious of progress, you can check the review queue out, we typically go in order top to bottom (a bunch of old stuff just showed up).  http://manage.jujucharms.com/tools/review-queue
[01:18] <marcoceppi> So if not tonight, then tomorrow
[01:22] <Azendale> marcoceppi: ok, thanks. Psychologically, it's kind of like waiting for a package to to get here. :)
[01:23] <marcoceppi> Azendale: :)
[02:46] <sbbrtn> Just playing around with Juju.  I added a mysql server.  If I expose this, should I be able to connect to it from the internet?  It appears that it only allows connections via relationships.
[02:47] <sarnold> yikes, you're brave to consider exposing mysql to the world :)
[02:47] <Azendale> sbbrtn: what environment are you running on?
[02:47] <sbbrtn> aws
[02:48] <Azendale> sbbrtn: ok, in that case I believe it would (but I haven't used AWS before, so I could be wrong)
[02:48] <sbbrtn> sarnold:  I wouldn't typically expose it to the outside world but just playing around
[02:53] <sarnold> sbbrtn: I didn't see any calls to the 'open-port' juju hook in the mysql charm; I don't think you can directly expose its port by just running "juju expose mysql"
[02:54] <sarnold> sbbrtn: (there is a defined python functio nthat run it, but I don't see it used anywhere: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~charmers/charms/precise/mysql/trunk/view/head:/hooks/lib/utils.py#L119  )
[02:54] <sbbrtn> sarnold: ok, thanks.  It wasn't opening up the port on my amazon firewall so I figured it wasn't opening..
[02:55] <sbbrtn> sarnold: how do I execute that function from the juju command prompt? juju mysql expose ?
[02:58] <sarnold> sbbrtn: if you're just goofing around, you can juju ssh mysql/0    -- once you're logged in, you can run open-port <mysql port number>   and then connect your machine's mysql to the remote server ...
[02:58] <sarnold> sbbrtn: I'm trying to find if there's anything you have to do once you're logged in to make the 'open-port' command "available" for you to run .. I'm having trouble finding that. :)
[02:59] <sbbrtn> Ok.  Thanks.  I figured there might be a different option short of going in via SSH
[03:00] <sarnold> sbbrtn: this might be the way to get there... https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/authors-hook-debug.html
[03:00] <sarnold> (it'll fire up ssh too. hehe. :)
[03:00] <sarnold> sbbrtn: it -could- be; if you really wanted this, you could fork the charm and modify one of the hooks to expose the port for you
[03:01] <sbbrtn> not a big deal.  I'm really just playing around to see how Juju works.
[03:01] <sbbrtn> thanks for the help
[03:02] <sarnold> connecting the local mysql client to a remote hosted server would be a fun thing to see. I'd just be afraid to leave it up for very long, who knows how long it'd take before it's discovered and potentially abused. :)
[03:06] <sbbrtn> yeah.  I see why you wouldn't want to expose it.  On my current web server I have multiple MySql instances running.  One is open to the public and is a development database so not too concerned with the contents.  The other two servers are only available via localhost and my VPN if I connect to it via OpenVPN.  I need access to the DB since the updates are made directly to the database and that is the best way I have
[03:06] <sbbrtn> found.  I wonder if this is possible with Juju...
[03:15] <sbbrtn> any way to kill a service after getting a hook failed?  I can't bring it down with destroy-service
[03:27] <marcoceppi> sbbrtn: run `juju resolved <unit>` a few times
[03:28] <marcoceppi> sbbrtn: sarnold it's odd that MySQL doesn't expose 3306. I should have that port "opened" and waiting for juju expose to be run. I'll look in to that
[03:29] <sbbrtn> marcoceppi: Thanks (this is Jason955 from earlier BTW)
[03:29] <marcoceppi> o/
[03:30] <marcoceppi> sbbrtn: if you could open a bug against the MySQL charm that it doesn't expose the default port, I'll have it patched https://bugs.launchpad.net/charms/+source/mysql/+bugs
[03:30] <sarnold> marcoceppi: I dunno, I kind of like the idea that it isn't just easily exposed. it feels like every CPU from oracle includes at least one remote unauthenticated mysql attack. :(
[03:30] <sarnold> marcoceppi: maybe a config option yes-really-expose-my-database   or something? :)
[03:31] <marcoceppi> sarnold: it won't be exposed unless the user really wants it to. What would be a better idea is to have the port configurable and have it use a non-standard port by default (if that was a concern)
[03:31] <sbbrtn> marcoceppi: will do
[03:31] <sarnold> marcoceppi: that'd be a help, but I wouldn't be surprised if mysql advertises itself on its port somehow..
[03:32] <marcoceppi> sbbrtn: feel free to open bugs for any other things you find odd. If you search for the charm in https://manage.jujucharms.com/ you'll find a link for "Bugs" that you can use
[03:36] <marcoceppi> Azendale: Wasn't able to get to your merge tonight, but it's next on the list for tomorrow!
[03:36] <sbbrtn> marcoceppi: will do.  I just got my launchpad account.
[03:38] <Azendale> marcoceppi: Awesome!
[03:38]  * marcoceppi heads to bed
[03:38] <sarnold> g'night marcoceppi :)
[03:42] <sbbrtn> Can I create multiple Mysql instances on different ports with Juju?
[06:04] <davecheney> sbbrtn: possibly
[06:04] <davecheney> but not using the same machine
[06:12] <sbbrtn> There isn't a way to change the port?
[06:20] <davecheney> sbbrtn: there might be
[06:20] <davecheney> didn't you say you wanted to have multiple mysqls ?
[06:23] <sbbrtn> Yes.  I wanted one exposed to the web on a non-default port.
[06:27] <davecheney> sbbrtn: the mysql charm doesn't currently support this, please raise a feature request, https://launchpad.net/charms/+source/mysql
[06:28] <sbbrtn> will do
[06:57] <stokachu> anyone awake that has any insight into the progress of https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1233457
[06:57] <_mup_> Bug #1233457: service with no units stuck in lifecycle dying  <cts-cloud-review> <destroy-service> <state-server> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1233457>
[14:23] <jcastro> hey marcoceppi
[16:18] <jcastro> hey evilnickveitch
[16:18] <jcastro> can you index the local troubleshooting page?
[16:18] <jcastro> I am unsure if you're making a new troubleshooting section or putting it somewhere else
[16:22] <evilnickveitch> jcastro, i am making a new section, but i will do it today
[16:23] <evilnickveitch> makes a nice change from trying to reverse engineer interfaces
[16:32] <jcastro> heh


[02:19] <chaddy> evening all
[02:19] <ajehuk> evening
[02:19] <chaddy> http://www.ubuntu.com/news/spotlight link here to sign up with Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter redirects to an O'Reilly registration page
[02:19] <chaddy> which wasn't really what I was after
[02:20] <chaddy> s/weekly news/newsletter
[02:20] <chaddy> *sigh*, /me is overtired
[02:20] <ajehuk> no that doesnt look right...
[02:21] <ajehuk> give me a moment...
[02:22] <chaddy> it's not really a problem, just added an RSS feed to the fridge
[02:22] <chaddy> that'll get me all the info I need, I'm sure
[02:22] <ajehuk> nah it is right, once you sign up you get to choose what you would like in the way of news letters, the ubuntu live one is listed there...
[02:23] <chaddy> ahh, ok, just looked wrong
[02:23] <chaddy> thanks a lot, ajehuk
[02:23] <ajehuk> chaddy - its not that obvious - I ended up searching for ubunut...
[02:23] <ajehuk> chaddy - way down at the bottom.. :)
[02:25] <ajehuk> right Im out of here for a while - g'night all
[02:27] <chaddy> ahh, I see what the problem is, the link doesn't specify that it's the "Live" newsletter for the conference
[02:28] <chaddy> pebcak at this end, mainly, though
[02:33] <chaddy> s/cak/kac
[02:44] <Burgwork> chaddy: that is clearly just the newsletter for Ubuntu live, not the UWN
[02:44] <chaddy> yeah, you're right, Burgwork; /me should sleep and consider more
[05:13] <elkbuntu> omg it's a John Little
[05:25] <johnlittle> Hey ;)
[05:25] <johnlittle> Sorry our new Houston LoCo ppl were chatting me up
[05:26] <johnlittle> elkbuntu
[05:26] <elkbuntu> oh? on irc or release partay?
[05:27] <johnlittle> irc
[05:27] <johnlittle> How have you been?
[05:27] <elkbuntu> good, busy, yourself?
[05:27] <johnlittle> Same..still plugging away at ubuntu stuff just not on IRC much
[05:28] <elkbuntu> :)
[05:28] <elkbuntu> been keeping up to date on us all then i suppose
[05:29] <johnlittle> I try..mostly focused on ubuntuvideo but I monitor everything and blog a lot. Writing something tonight for the Houston paper's tech blog.
[05:29] <elkbuntu> nice
[05:30] <johnlittle> Still haven't been to any events so I'm not jetting around like some people ;)
[05:30] <elkbuntu> :
[05:30] <johnlittle> I just toil away in the basement
[05:30] <elkbuntu> have you spoken to dinda/belinda recently?
[05:30] <johnlittle> Nope..about?
[05:31] <elkbuntu> whether she's going to be in spain or not
[05:31] <elkbuntu> she seemed to have a potential work conflict but i didnt hear how it ended up
[05:31] <johnlittle> No idea
[05:32] <johnlittle> But if you run into her record me a video :p
[05:32] <elkbuntu> hehe
[05:33] <elkbuntu> i have not the facilities for that :(
[05:33] <elkbuntu> i have video in my camera, but no sound
[05:33] <johnlittle> I still need one from Jono
[05:34] <johnlittle> I'm hoping release party vids show up. You hitting any parties?
[05:35] <elkbuntu> nope unfortunately
[05:35] <elkbuntu> if there were to be one in my area, i'd like have to organise it, and well... i havent
[05:35] <johnlittle> Same here :)
[05:36] <johnlittle> I've been cutting back on projects lately. Not all the way back but I'm not taking on new ones anytime soon.
[05:38] <johnlittle> Hows the freelancing thing going?
[06:10] <Burgundavia> nixternal: http://blog.lobby4linux.com/archives/145-Tux500-Where-are-we-now.html
[06:11] <nixternal> I can only imagine
[06:11] <nixternal> did he sell me out?
[06:11] <Burgundavia> nah, just more blather
[06:12] <nixternal> ya, I have been in communication with the REAL people behind the Tux500 campaign about that guy and the threats he sent me
[06:12] <Burgundavia> oh?
[06:13] <nixternal> I provided them the entire conversation and told them he is the reason I will not support the project was well as thousands of others
[06:13] <nixternal> I told them people know him as the "idiot on digg" and the "moron on slashdot"
[06:13] <nixternal> ya, I was on the phone with them this week, they are cool people and are dead serious about the project
[06:13] <Burgundavia> ah, interesting
[06:13] <nixternal> I wish them luck, but as long as that idiot is apart of their team, they get no monetary support from me
[06:14] <Burgundavia> well, they are not communicating very well
[06:14] <Burgundavia> nor did they get anybody to sign on
[06:14] <Burgundavia> they also have a history of announcing their projects as if they are the only ones that will ever market Linux well
[06:14] <nixternal> I told them they need to do something, as I have spoken to a few people who are aggregated on a few planets, and all it takes is one of us to blog about this guy and you are through
[06:14] <nixternal> but I told them that they are safe as long as they control this guy, otherwise they are a sinking ship with him
[06:15] <nixternal> well, they couldn't market linux if their lives depended on it
[06:15] <nixternal> you don't market Linux to a bunch of toothless drunks at "Americas" race
[06:15] <nixternal> people go to Indy for 1 or 3 or 4 things
[06:15] <nixternal> 1) get drunk
[06:15] <nixternal> 2) watch girls get naked
[06:16] <nixternal> 3) listen to the loudest crap ever for 3 hours and see these little blurs fly by you
[06:16] <nixternal> 4) get drunk
[06:16] <boredandblogging> i see nothing wrong with 1, 2, and 4
[06:16] <Madpilot> nixternal, 5) hope for large messy high-speed car crashes
[06:16] <boredandblogging> ;-)
[06:16] <nixternal> I have only missed 2 races in the past 25 years
[06:16] <nixternal> Madpilot: yes, forgot about that one
[06:16] <nixternal> oh, and the driver they got, he will be in a messy car crash
[06:19] <johnlittle> Just think of the "Linux crashed" jokes
[06:22] <Burgundavia> johnlittle: long time, no see
[06:22] <johnlittle> I only come out of my basement for releases..canonical orders
[06:22] <johnlittle> how you doing?
[06:23] <Burgundavia> not bad
[06:23] <Burgundavia> going to be on the road for tomorrows release
[06:23] <johnlittle> Any marketing team activity going down?
[06:24] <nixternal> johnny!!
[06:25] <johnlittle> are we putting nixternal in a tux suit or something?
[06:25] <nixternal> johnlittle: I already told that joke, and pissed that Helio idiot off
[06:25] <johnlittle> :p
[06:25] <nixternal> I am wearing a Tux suit on Sunday thank you very much
[06:25] <johnlittle> awesome
[06:25] <johnlittle> get me some video
[06:25] <nixternal> everyone in my lug is to broke to own a camera
[06:26] <nixternal> and I am not about to let them use mine
[06:26] <johnlittle> I hope release party footage shows up - i cant bear to watch another beryl demo
[06:27] <nixternal> lol
[06:27] <nixternal> Ya, Ubuntu chicago is doing their thing on Saturday, but I won't be there
[06:27] <nixternal> I have a LUG event to get setup, and for some reason they don't want to listen
[06:28] <nixternal> I have space to hold 250+ people, projectors, computers, podiums, workstations, you name it
[06:28] <nixternal> all free
[06:28] <johnlittle> nice
[06:28] <nixternal> no, they would rather go and sit in a church basement
[06:28] <Burgundavia> wierd
[06:28] <Burgundavia> people are very wierd
[06:28] <johnlittle> now just get someone to shoot me some video :)
[06:28] <nixternal> ya, we need to do that
[06:28] <johnlittle> oh that is weird
[06:29] <johnlittle> are ya'll gonna handle snakes or something? :p
[06:29] <nixternal> well, the video for this weekend will be LUGish and not Ubuntu'ish
[06:29] <nixternal> although 90% of the LUG is Ubuntu/Kubuntu
[06:29] <johnlittle> I do LUG videos...whatever
[06:29] <nixternal> one of the guys is a church leader, so he has the space to hold a few people
[06:29] <nixternal> OK, I will have some flourish video of me spaning the Red Hat teams ass in a battle of the distros
[06:29] <nixternal> s/spaning/spanking
[06:30] <johnlittle> Tell him you can't go...Ubuntu is a cult and it just isn't right
[06:30] <nixternal> oh, and I hugged Tom "Spot" Callaway too, so that might be on video as well
[06:30] <nixternal> haha
[06:31] <johnlittle> hey I put up video of jono dancing...I will run anything
[06:31] <nixternal> I have the Subversion developers giving a talk this weekend at my LUG, and then we have a couple of the original apache devs from back in the day coming out to talk
[06:31] <johnlittle> cool
[06:31] <nixternal> and then it is hackathon 2007
[06:33] <johnlittle> you see the michael dell story making the rounds today?
[06:33] <nixternal> ya, whoopy
[06:33] <nixternal> Jesus uses Ubuntu as well, and he is a hell of a lot more powerful
[06:34] <nixternal> now if we could get Gates or Ballmer to say they use Ubuntu
[06:34] <nixternal> then we are talking
[06:34] <johnlittle> good luck with that
[06:34] <Madpilot> what I found more interesting that "Mr. Dell has one Ubuntu machine" is "Mr. Dell has *no* Vista machines"...
[06:34] <johnlittle> Gates will roll out a blu themed Warty and call it innovation
[06:34] <nixternal> Dell used to be a big Linux and Oracle guy back in the day, it does surprise me to see him only running one machine with it
[06:34] <johnlittle> blue
[06:34] <nixternal> it being Linux
[06:35] <nixternal> Madpilot: which I find funny because on CNBC, they interviewed him in his office and he had a Vista machine on his desk
[06:35] <nixternal> he was showing it off and the dell xps stuff
[06:35] <nixternal> could have just been for promotional use only though
[06:35] <Madpilot> evidently it was only there for the interview ;)
[06:35] <johnlittle> I don't think for a minute that it's his primary machine...but it is interesting that they chose to mention it like that.
[06:35] <nixternal> ya exactly
[06:36] <nixternal> well he used to talk highly of Debian back in the 90's and early 2000s
[06:37] <johnlittle> It's going to be an interesting year. Lots of the old school types will probably end up jumping out of windows
[06:38] <Burgundavia> well, there was much made of Mark using Kubuntu on his desktop
[06:38] <johnlittle> Yeah I remember that
[06:38] <Burgundavia> what most people didn't realize is that Mark uses his Laptop as his primary machine
[06:38] <Burgundavia> his desktop is rarely used
[06:39] <Burgundavia> so he had a Kubuntu machine, he just uses Ubuntu primarily
[06:39] <nixternal> It would be fun though...but it wouldn't be fair. Windows gets to restart after a crash.
[06:39] <nixternal> gahahahahahahahahahaha
[06:39] <johnlittle> We all dabble here and there
[06:39] <nixternal> that is talking about Linux vs. MS at the Indy 500
[06:40] <nixternal> that is one of the comments from that lame dudes blog
[06:40] <johnlittle> how about "at least when windows crashes the driver doesn't die a fiery death"
[06:41] <nixternal> ermm, did you mean Linux
[06:41] <nixternal> because when Windows crashes the only answer you get from Microsoft is reinstall
[06:42] <johnlittle> no..talking about that silly linux car blasting into a wall at 200mph and becoming the laughing stock of the tech world
[06:44] <johnlittle> I worked for NASA..trust me people only remember things that crash. It's wasted money.
[06:44] <Burgundavia> given the insane cost too
[06:44] <johnlittle> 350k?
[06:51] <nixternal> johnlittle: that is because they bought the worst driver money could buy
[06:51] <nixternal> dude finished 8th by a stroke of luck years ago
[06:51] <nixternal> other than that, he started 33rd and finished either 28th or 33rd, or hell he didn't even qualify
[06:51] <nixternal> I will pee myself if he doesn't even qualify
[06:51] <johnlittle> I haven't followed it - seemed doomed from the start
[06:51] <nixternal> ya, they won't make the money because they have pissed off the leaders of every Linux community
[06:51] <nixternal> CEOs of Red Hat, Novell, Canonical, and more
[06:51] <johnlittle> If you're going to spend a ton of money to sponsor something stick a logo on of of branson's space rockets or something
[06:51] <johnlittle> Even that would be a waste really
[06:51] <johnlittle> those deals are for megacorps with money to burn
[06:51] <johnlittle> we could go the goldenpalace route and fund streakers ;)
[06:51] <johnlittle> It only costs 10,000 to get someone to paint an Ubuntu logo on their back and run through the superbowls 50 yard line
[06:51] <johnlittle> naked
[06:51] <Burgundavia> hmm
[06:51] <Burgundavia> not certain we really want to be associated with such things :)
[06:52] <johnlittle> No it wasn't a proposal..I'm just saying
[06:52] <Burgundavia> then again, Linux for (Naked) Human Beings
[06:53] <johnlittle> Well..that's how we started
[06:53] <johnlittle> Remember the porn distro comments?
[06:53] <Burgundavia> indeed
[06:54] <johnlittle> I thought those wallpapers were a cool idea. No chance of those coming back
[06:55] <Madpilot> pity, that
[06:55] <johnlittle> they didn't exactly scream "enterprise distribution"
[06:58] <nixternal> Burgundavia: why not associate with nakedness, I seem to remember a wallpaper that showed a nipple. what's so bad about some super fat drunk dudes ass running across the field?
[06:58] <Burgundavia> yep
[06:59] <johnlittle> ubuntuvideo.com just passed the 600,000 page view mark (98% of those views being videos)
[07:00] <nixternal> ya, I keep putting on the walls of bathroom stalls at truck stops "FREE PORN AT UBUNTUVIDEO.COM"
[07:00] <nixternal> guess it is working out
[07:00] <johnlittle> just over 100,000 unique IPs - 53% windows
[07:00] <johnlittle> whatever works ;)
[07:00] <nixternal> hehe
[07:01] <johnlittle> the geekier you are the truer that is
[07:01] <nixternal> haha
[07:01] <johnlittle> so what time does 7.04 official go live?
[07:02] <Madpilot> when it's ready
[07:02] <johnlittle> why did I know someone was going to say that
[07:02] <Mithrandir> johnlittle: before I go to bed. :-P
[07:02] <Madpilot> or sometime after the ops in #ubuntu completely loose it and kickban everyone there
[07:02] <johnlittle> welcome to the jungle
[07:04] <johnlittle> I hope ubuntu ops have a jar of happy pills..it's going to be a fun week or so
[07:08] <johnlittle> Burgundavia are you working on any more books?
[07:09] <Burgundavia> currently working on the revision to the official book
[07:09] <Burgundavia> in fact, as we speak I am reviewing a cpater
[07:10] <johnlittle> bad omen...hope you aren't looking for typos
[07:10] <johnlittle> "cpater"
[07:10] <Burgundavia> for edgy they had to quiet the whole channel
[07:10] <Burgundavia> whatever
[07:10] <johnlittle> I imagine it will only get worse with each release
[07:11] <boredandblogging> isn't it a nice problem to have?
[07:12] <johnlittle> There are worse problems to be sure.
[07:13] <Burgundavia> channel is jsuta bout as busy and NA has not yet hit the 19th
[07:14] <johnlittle> 19th +14 minutes here
[07:14] <johnlittle> you are on the east coast right?
[07:15] <Mithrandir> #ubuntu or some other channel?
[07:16] <Burgundavia> the former
[07:17] <johnlittle> I've been watching it for a while. It's like watching one of those video compilation shows full of explosions and car wrecks.
[07:23] <johnlittle> I think Madpilot just booted a troll
[07:23] <Madpilot> a very minor troll.
[07:23] <johnlittle> stop them before they get started
[07:23] <Madpilot> something like that
[07:23] <Madpilot> we haven't even broken 1200 yet on #ubuntu - I was excpecting that a while ago
[07:24] <johnlittle> Is there a known record?
[07:25] <Madpilot> I suspect we might be at a record right now - 1175
[07:28] <johnlittle> I bet the www stats are interesting
[07:29] <tonyyarusso> Madpilot: I believe we hit 1200 last time
[07:29] <Madpilot> for Edgy? can't recall
[07:29] <Burgundavia> hmm, the website seems to be doing better
[07:30] <johnlittle> nixternal did you do the template change for chi?
[07:30] <nixternal> yup
[07:30] <johnlittle> How difficult was it?
[07:30] <Burgundavia> Mithrandir: did the tour end up on the website?
[07:31] <Mithrandir> Burgundavia: not yet, but it will.
[07:31] <Burgundavia> ok, no worries
[07:31] <Mithrandir> I'll wait for newz2k to wake up and get him to move it.
[07:32] <Burgundavia> I will bug newz2k post-release to get the communtiy access back up and running
[07:37] <Mithrandir> yeah, it's easier if you work directly with him about how to do that.
[07:38] <Burgundavia> given the timeframe between the new website and the release, it is understandable access for the communtiy fell to the side
[07:39] <Mithrandir> yeah; I doubt it's intentional.  Just so much to do, so little time.
[07:41] <johnlittle> i still need to wrap that new template around ubuntuvideo ..it isn't going to be trivial
[09:01] <elkbuntu> Mithrandir, do you need sanity hugs yet?
[09:02] <Mithrandir> elkbuntu: no, I'm quite enjoying #ubuntu, #ubuntu+1 and #ubuntu-release-party.
[09:02] <elkbuntu> Mithrandir, :)
[09:02] <elkbuntu> the party channel has really calmed the others, tonyyarusso is a clever man
[09:02] <tonyyarusso> :)
[09:03] <Mithrandir> indeed.
[09:04] <elkbuntu> congrats on another good job though tollef :)
[09:06] <Mithrandir> tonyyarusso: what's a while?
[09:06] <Mithrandir> elkbuntu: cheers.  It's fun.
[09:07] <tonyyarusso> Mithrandir: Depends whether the alarm works ;)  With no alarm I'd probably sleep 10 hours.  With, I can do anything 30 minutes on up (although my family might think it odd)
[09:09] <Mithrandir> then I'd cut myself a couple of hours of sleep.
[09:09] <tonyyarusso> Sounds like a plan.
[09:11] <juliux> good morning
[09:13] <elkbuntu> ooh.. #ubuntu's broken 1200.. nice
[09:15] <johnlittle> a new record
[09:17] <elkbuntu> i think so
[09:17] <elkbuntu> cant remember the tops from last release
[09:47] <juliux> jenda_, i have here 3 mc murphy fourth edition books;)
[09:54] <Mithrandir> elkbuntu: you're doing a great job in #u-r-p, btw.
[09:54] <elkbuntu> Mithrandir, thanks :)
[09:55] <elkbuntu> tony's a genius for thinking of it :) much easier than dealing the same shit in 3 channels
[10:11] <Mithrandir> indeed.
[10:58] <juliux> http://www.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx/corp/biographies/en/msd_computers?c=us&l=en&s=corp michael dell runs ubuntu;)
[11:12] <juliux> hi mindspin
[11:20] <MenZa> Awesome, juliux
[11:20] <MenZa> I'm surprised they haven't stuffed Linux in their products earlier then
[11:21] <jenda> juliux: pong
[11:21] <jenda> awesome! :)
[11:21] <juliux> jenda, i will wait for more;)
[11:22] <juliux> #ubuntu 1316 user;)
[11:25] <jenda> sweet
[11:25] <jenda> on both accounts
[11:25] <jenda> juliux: how quick do you need to get rid of them?
[11:25] <jenda> because if you're in no hurry, I'll keep ordering till at least 10 accumulate...
[11:25] <juliux> jenda, do what you want;)
[11:26] <jenda> the more books, the less the trip will cost me :)
[11:26] <jenda> ok, cool :)
[11:26] <juliux> jenda, if the snow comes back i will use them to make some fire here;)
[11:26] <jenda> chances are, even, that we'll both save a lot of money shipping on the next batch of stickers and shirts :D
[11:26] <jenda> hahhaaha :)
[11:53] <jenda> Cnl_Delta: welcome
[11:55] <Cnl_Delta> ty jenda
[11:55] <Cnl_Delta> how ya doing jenda? is Fesity Fawn officially releades
[11:55] <Cnl_Delta> *released
[11:55] <Mithrandir> Cnl_Delta: not yet.
[11:56] <jenda> Not just yet, but soon! :)
[11:57] <juliux> hmpf the bittorrent tracker is not working for feist
[11:57] <juliux> y
[11:57] <Cnl_Delta> i hope all the sources are complete. wouldn't want a d/l to be currupted
[03:16] <johnlittle> ubuntu-release-party is turning into a riot
[03:16] <tonyyarusso> You could say that
[03:21] <nixternal> jenda: do you do cloak configs for people?
[03:22] <elkbuntu> johnlittle, but at least it's a riot in only 1 channel :D
[03:23] <jenda> nixternal: yep
[03:23] <jenda> johnlittle: aloha! :)
[03:23] <johnlittle> yeah we have the confined to the square. Hiya jenda
[03:23] <nixternal> jenda: ScottK has been waiting for one. It seems Seveas already set it up and what not via the LP cloak account
[03:24] <nixternal> is it #ubuntu-release-party?
[03:24] <johnlittle> yeah
[03:25] <jenda> nixternal: yeah right
[03:26] <jenda> nixternal: 15:23 <+Seveas> jenda, pretend you're nalioth and set the cloak
[03:26] <jenda> That's how he sets it up ;)
[03:26] <nixternal> hahahaha
[05:44] <Burgwork> Mithrandir: is there a reason the static page doesn't link to our Tour?
[05:46] <Mithrandir> Burgwork: not that I know of; ask newz2000?
[05:46] <Burgwork> ok
[05:49] <poningru> Burgwork: ping
[05:49] <poningru> do you know where the thing is?
[05:49] <poningru> the tour I mean
[05:50] <Burgwork> poningru: on the wiki
[05:50] <poningru> where?
[05:50] <poningru> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeistyFawn/RC
[05:50] <poningru> disappeared
[05:51] <poningru> nm
[05:51] <poningru> Burgwork: [11:51:05]  <newz2000> poningru: when traffic dies down, we'll get rid of the static page and the tour is featured prominantly on the homepage
[05:53] <Mithrandir> poningru: it was move to the web site at the request of Burgwork, iirc.
[05:53] <poningru> ah gotcha
[09:21] <sid> elkbuntu: Are the poll statistics up somewhere?
[10:59] <tonyyarusso> Did Canonical come through on the non-tech-press release?
[11:03] <jenda> juliux: sweet... I can get to dresden for... well... the price of a shirt :)
[11:03] <jenda> in fact, I can almost get there and back for the price of a business shirt :-D
[11:04] <juliux> jenda, cool
[11:04] <juliux> jenda, by car?
[11:04] <jenda> no, no - bus
[11:04] <juliux> ah
[11:05] <juliux> with rvd?
[11:05] <jenda> Student Agency and Eurolines have similar prices...
[11:05] <jenda> what's rvd?
[11:05] <juliux> a company from dresden
[11:05] <jenda> nope - it's the two I named.
[11:05] <juliux> they are also driving by bus to prag every day
[11:06] <jenda> cool
[11:06] <juliux> but i think they more expanisve
[11:06] <jenda> I'll Czech out their site ;)
[11:07] <jenda> But gargh, both SA and EL only offer such lines that I'd either need to spend the night there, or arrive at some crazy time like 3 AM
[11:10] <jenda> juliux: wow, actually, their prices are comparable.
[11:10] <juliux> ah
[11:11] <jenda> There are three items there... what does "
[11:12] <jenda>  Dresden bis  Possendorf"
[11:12] <jenda> mean, compared to "Dippoldiswalde und  Schmiedeberg"
[11:12] <jenda> and "Kurort Kipsdorf und  Altenberg"
[11:12] <jenda> (looks like place names to me...)
[11:12] <juliux> this are cities in germany
[11:12] <jenda> ah
[11:12] <jenda> and 'bis' is 'or'?
[11:13] <juliux> yes
[11:13] <jenda> Dresden is the most expensive of the three options, then :)
[11:13] <juliux> dresden bis possendorf == from dresden to possendorf
[11:13] <juliux> so bis is not or
[11:13] <jenda> (26 return ticket)
[11:13] <jenda> aah, ok
[11:13] <jenda> I wonder where I'd buy a Prague-Dresden-Prague ticket with them...
[11:14] <juliux> i have no idea
[11:14] <juliux> i arrived at an central bus station in prag
[11:14] <jenda> I know which one... I'll try asking there.
[11:16] <jenda> Now all that remains is finding a morning route to Dresden and an evening one to Prague.... and not too late because I'll have a very, very heavy backpack :-D
[11:18] <juliux> hehe
[11:18] <juliux> i was 2004 for one day in prag
[11:20] <jenda> cool
[11:20] <Tm_T> hi kids
[11:20] <jenda> I could also try hitchhiking...
[11:20] <jenda> hello Tm_T
[11:21] <jenda> ...or ask for a sponsor who'd pay me a luxury hotel on one of Dresden's beaches 'just becaues'...
[11:21] <jenda> you've got beaches, don't you? ;)
[11:32] <tsmithe> jenda, you really should learn german
[11:33] <tsmithe> it's a really nice language
[11:33] <tsmithe> juliux kann nicht jedesmal ubersetzten
[11:33] <tsmithe> i always mess up the genders :'(
[11:35] <juliux> jenda, we don't have beaches here
[11:35] <juliux> jenda, i have a guest bed here;)


[02:13] <wos> anyone here?
[02:32] <wos> could anyone tell me if ubuntu and mythbuntu are the same thing basically if you take out the TV features?
[02:35] <tgm4883_laptop> wos, kinda
[02:36] <tgm4883_laptop> I mean, they have different things installed
[02:36] <tgm4883_laptop> but underneath, they run the same kernel
[02:37] <wos> tgm4883_laptop, could i get support for mythbuntu in the ubuntu channel, for non tv related problems?
[02:38] <foxbuntu> wos, yes, for the most part, but folks here know a little more than MythTV
[02:39] <hads> Mythbuntu is Ubuntu, it's all the same packages.
[02:39] <wos> oh cool
[02:39] <foxbuntu> essentially
[02:39] <wos> then why is there a separate install CD?
[02:40] <hads> Same reason there;'s Kubuntu etc.
[02:40] <wos> yes but Kubuntu has a lot of differences
[02:40] <foxbuntu> its customized to the user groups, to make it very easy
[02:41] <foxbuntu> believe me when I say there is allot of differences between Ubuntu and Mythbuntu
[02:41] <hads> wos: Kubuntu is the same also, it's all the same packages.
[02:41] <hads> It's one repository.
[02:41] <foxbuntu> hads, I think that might be confusing for someone not knowing what the packages are
[02:42] <wos> kubuntu has separate packages for certain items though
[02:42] <hads> As does Mythbuntu, but you can install any of them on any install.
[02:42] <foxbuntu> wos, the point hads is making is that they all reside in the same repository
[02:42] <hads> foxbuntu: *shrug* I guess it could be, doesn't seem confusing to me.
[02:43] <foxbuntu> hads, nor me
[02:43] <foxbuntu> :)
[02:43] <hads> :)
[02:43] <wos> does mythbuntu have a different user interface?
[02:43] <foxbuntu> its XFCE
[02:43] <foxbuntu> so like Xubuntu
[02:43] <hads> Just with a customised theme etc.
[02:43] <foxbuntu> indeed
[02:44] <hads> From a package ;)
[02:44] <foxbuntu> haha
[02:44] <wos> its xfce? fxck
[02:44] <foxbuntu> wos, ?
[02:44] <foxbuntu> wos, its easily changed
[02:44] <foxbuntu> you dont like XFCE, pick KDE, or Gnome
[02:44] <wos> how?
[02:45] <hads> Or start mythfrontned from xinit or whatever :)
[02:45] <foxbuntu> Mythbuntu-Control-Centre
[02:45] <hads> So when it crashes you're not left with a blank screen :)
[02:45] <foxbuntu> lol
[02:45] <foxbuntu> hads, you are a cli hooker arent you
[02:45] <hads> :)
[02:46] <foxbuntu> always whoring out the cli
[02:46] <hads> Maybe a little
[02:46] <foxbuntu> lol
[02:46]  * hads cranks out irssi mutt and links
[02:47] <foxbuntu> lol
[02:47] <foxbuntu> I'll stick with xchat and gnome
[02:47] <foxbuntu> with FF
[02:48] <hads> I only actually use irssi daily out of those.
[02:48] <hads> KMail and FF usually.
[02:50] <foxbuntu> ah, figures, usually those that are hardcore cli use KDE for their GUI
[02:50] <foxbuntu> ;)
[02:52] <hads> I've actually been undecided lately, switching back and forth.
[02:53] <hads> But I just really prefer KMail to any other mail client, especially the keyboard shortcuts. Pity it eats my mail every once in a while but I've got backups :)
[02:53] <foxbuntu> I've never been into KDE
[02:54] <foxbuntu> but thats just me
[02:54] <foxbuntu> I should prob look at the new KDE4 though
[02:55] <hads> I'm looking forward to 4.2, 4.0 and 4.1 haven't really done it for me yet. Their work is amazing but just didn't quite fit me yet.
[02:55] <hads> The polish that Ubuntu has with Gnome is unrivaled though.
[02:56] <foxbuntu> indeed
[02:56] <foxbuntu> and its only getting better
[02:57] <hads> Yup
[03:37] <Chaorain> I am a linux newb and I would like to know how do I get a free tv guide for Myth TV
[03:53] <mee> i just installed mythbuntu, can anyone tell me how to watch tv now
[03:53] <mee> i have a hauppage wintv hvr 950q
[03:53] <mee> when i press "watch tv" nothing happens
[03:55] <rhpot1991_laptop> !blank | mee
[03:55] <Zinn> Sorry I don't know about blank
[03:55] <rhpot1991_laptop> !blank% | mee
[03:55] <Zinn> mee: If you try to watch tv and are greeted with a blank screen and a return to the menu then please check the permissions on your recording directory.  It should be owned by mythtv:mythtv, have permissions of 775, and not be inside your home directory
[03:57] <mee> where is the recording direcrtory?
[04:01] <mee> rhpot1991_laptop, where is the recording directory
[04:04] <mee> can anyone help me please
[04:05] <foxbuntu> mee, its where ever you setup your storage group to reside, the default is /var/lib/mythtv/recordings/
[04:06] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, did you get the firmware for that card?
[04:06] <mee> no
[04:07] <tgm4883_laptop> thats probably your problem
[04:07] <tgm4883_laptop> were you able to scan for channels?
[04:08] <mee> http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Hauppauge_WinTV_HVR-950
[04:08] <mee> no
[04:09] <mee> im confused
[04:09] <tgm4883_laptop> yea follow those directions
[04:12] <mee> tgm4883_laptop, i dont understand those directions
[04:13] <tgm4883_laptop> what part?
[04:13] <tgm4883_laptop> ]
[04:13] <tgm4883_laptop> download the firmware first: wget http://www.steventoth.net/linux/xc5000/HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip
[04:13] <tgm4883_laptop> Extract the file hcw85bda.sys from the zip into the current dir: unzip -j HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip Driver85/hcw85bda.sys
[04:13] <tgm4883_laptop> Copy the resulting firmware file into /lib/firmware: cp xc3028-v27.fw /lib/firmware
[04:14] <tgm4883_laptop> actually, i missed this step Next, go into the v4l/linux/Documentation/video4linux directory, there will be a file called extract_xc3028.pl Copy this file into the directory where you originally placed hcw85bda.sys. Run the file with the command: ./extract_xc3028.pl
[04:15] <mee> what?????  Extract the file hcw85bda.sys from the zip into the current dir: unzip -j HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip Driver85/hcw85bda.sys
[04:16] <tgm4883_laptop> did you download the file?
[04:16] <mee> yes sir
[04:16] <tgm4883_laptop> ok, then open a terminal and do
[04:16] <tgm4883_laptop> \unzip -j HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip Driver85/hcw85bda.sys
[04:16] <tgm4883_laptop> unzip -j HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip Driver85/hcw85bda.sys
[04:16] <mee> which one
[04:17] <tgm4883_laptop> the second one
[04:17] <tgm4883_laptop> just like the directions say
[04:17] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$ unzip -j HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip Driver85/hcw85bda.sys
[04:17] <mee> unzip:  cannot find or open HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip, HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip.zip or HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip.ZIP.
[04:17] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$
[04:17] <tgm4883_laptop> where did you download the file to?
[04:17] <mee> desktop
[04:18] <tgm4883_laptop> ok
[04:18] <tgm4883_laptop> cd Desktop
[04:18] <tgm4883_laptop> then run the command
[04:18] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$ cd desktop
[04:18] <mee> bash: cd: desktop: No such file or directory
[04:18] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$
[04:19] <tgm4883_laptop> capitol D
[04:19] <tgm4883_laptop> it's case sensitive
[04:20] <mee> ok
[04:20] <mee> im done
[04:20] <mee> now try it?
[04:20] <tgm4883_laptop> yea
[04:21] <mee> no
[04:21] <mee> no its not working
[04:21] <tgm4883_laptop> ok
[04:21] <tgm4883_laptop> error?
[04:21] <mee> blank
[04:21] <tgm4883_laptop> what do you mean blank?
[04:21] <mee> then returns to the main screen in a half of a second
[04:22] <tgm4883_laptop> sec
[04:22] <tgm4883_laptop> do this
[04:22] <tgm4883_laptop> cd ~/
[04:23] <tgm4883_laptop> wget http://www.steventoth.net/linux/xc5000/HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip
[04:23] <tgm4883_laptop> unzip -j HVR-12x0-14x0-17x0_1_25_25271_WHQL.zip Driver85/hcw85bda.sys
[04:24] <mee> ok
[04:24] <mee> done
[04:24] <tgm4883_laptop> and it unziped?
[04:25] <mee> i followed your directions so i think so
[04:25] <mee> but the directions say something about a tarball
[04:25] <tgm4883_laptop> it would say something like   inflating: hcw85bda.sys
[04:26] <mee> yes it did say that
[04:26] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, are you running 8.10 or 8.04?
[04:26] <mee> 8.10
[04:26] <tgm4883_laptop> good
[04:26] <tgm4883_laptop> so you don't have to worry about the tarball part
[04:26] <mee> ok
[04:26] <mee> ill try it now
[04:27] <mee> it doesnt work
[04:27] <tgm4883_laptop> what doesn't work?
[04:27] <mee> tv
[04:27] <tgm4883_laptop> not done yet
[04:27] <mee> ok
[04:29] <tgm4883_laptop> ok now do
[04:29] <tgm4883_laptop> cp /usr/src/linux-headers-2.6.27-7/Documentation/video4linux/extract_xc3028.pl ~/
[04:29] <mee> ok
[04:30] <mee> i did that
[04:30] <mee> nothing happened
[04:30] <tgm4883_laptop> ok, did it copy
[04:30] <mee> i dont know, how would i know?
[04:30] <tgm4883_laptop> did it say not found?
[04:30] <mee> no
[04:32] <tgm4883_laptop> ok then it should have worked
[04:32] <tgm4883_laptop> now do
[04:32] <tgm4883_laptop> ./extract_xc3028.pl
[04:33] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$ ./extract_xc3028.pl
[04:33] <mee> bash: ./extract_xc3028.pl: Permission denied
[04:33] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$ sudo ./extract_xc3028.pl
[04:33] <mee> [sudo] password for mee:
[04:33] <mee> sudo: ./extract_xc3028.pl: command not found
[04:33] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$
[04:33] <tgm4883_laptop> whats the output of ls /usr/src/
[04:34] <mee> cmee@mee-desktop:~$ ls /usr/src/
[04:34] <mee> linux-headers-2.6.27-7  linux-headers-2.6.27-7-generic  nvidia-177.80  rpm
[04:34] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$
[04:34] <tgm4883_laptop> ok
[04:35] <tgm4883_laptop> ls -l ~/extract_xc3028.pl
[04:35] <tgm4883_laptop> whats the output of that
[04:35] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$ ls -l ~/extract_xc3028.pl
[04:35] <mee> -rw-r--r-- 1 mee mee 24285 2008-11-21 23:29 /home/mee/extract_xc3028.pl
[04:35] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$
[04:36] <tgm4883_laptop> strange
[04:36] <tgm4883_laptop> ./extract_xc3028.pl
[04:36] <tgm4883_laptop> that should have worked
[04:36] <MythbuntuGuest14> i am trying to edit my fstab and it is telling me i do not have the permissions needed, can anyone help me
[04:37] <tgm4883_laptop> MythbuntuGuest14, what are you using to edit it?
[04:37] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, ah, do chmod +x extract_xc3028.pl
[04:37] <tgm4883_laptop> then try ./extract_xc3028.pl
[04:38] <MythbuntuGuest14> gedit
[04:38] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$ ./extract_xc3028.pl
[04:38] <mee> Firmwares generated.
[04:38] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$
[04:39] <tgm4883_laptop> MythbuntuGuest14, open a terminal and do "gksudo gedit /etc/fstab"
[04:39] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, great, now do
[04:39] <tgm4883_laptop> cp xc3028-v27.fw /lib/firmware
[04:39] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, you will probably have to use sudo on that
[04:39] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$ sudo cp xc3028-v27.fw /lib/firmware
[04:39] <mee> mee@mee-desktop:~$
[04:40] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, looks like it worked
[04:40] <mee> ok
[04:40] <tgm4883_laptop> you should be able to just reboot and it should work after you scan for channels and do mythtv-setup stuff
[04:40] <mee> ok ill try. will you be tha here
[04:41] <tgm4883_laptop> i'm playing gears of war 2, but I should be around
[04:41] <tgm4883_laptop> or you can bug foxbuntu ;)
[04:41] <mee> ok
[04:42] <MythbuntuGuest14> laptop, got any ideas of why i cannot edit my fstab now?
[04:42] <foxbuntu> tgm4883_laptop, no bugging foxbuntu tonight, I am busy with stupid web junk again
[04:42] <tgm4883_laptop> MythbuntuGuest14, did you do what I said?
 MythbuntuGuest14, open a terminal and do "gksudo gedit /etc/fstab"
[04:42] <MythbuntuGuest14> i just saw that i am going to try it
[04:42] <tgm4883_laptop> foxbuntu, ok, i'll field his questions then
[04:42] <tgm4883_laptop> I do have about the same hardware
[04:43] <mee> ok how do i scan for channels, it did the  blank screen agian
[04:43] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, you have to go though mythtv-setup and run the channel scanner
[04:43] <mee> ok
[04:43] <mee> wheree is that
[04:44] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, in a terminal, type mythtv-setup
[04:44] <MythbuntuGuest14> that worked, why do i have to do that now, i have edited it before without gksudo
[04:44] <tgm4883_laptop> MythbuntuGuest14, you have to have root privledges to edit system files
[04:45] <tgm4883_laptop> so you got them before somehow
[04:45] <MythbuntuGuest14> cool...one more question i just reinstalled and now my portable drive will not show up on the desktop
[04:49] <tgm4883_laptop> MythbuntuGuest14, does it show up in your file manager?
[04:50] <mee> tgm4883_laptop, how do i scan for channels?
[04:50] <mee> foxbuntu are you there??
[04:50] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, it's like step 4
[04:50] <foxbuntu> mee, sorry I can't provide help tonight
[04:51] <mee> step 4 in what
[04:51] <mee> ok
[04:51] <tgm4883_laptop> mythtv-setup
[04:52] <mee> its not working
[04:52] <mee> :(
[04:52] <mee> its grayed out
[04:52] <MythbuntuGuest14> laptop i don't see it in file manager
[04:54] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, you are going to have to refer to http://www.mythbuntu.org/documentation/mythbuntu_8.10_installation.pdf
[04:54] <mee> can you help me
[04:55] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, i'm not paid support, I can assist you and guide you along the way, but ultimatly you will have to want to do this
[04:55] <mee> i do want to do this
[04:55] <mee> a lot
[04:55] <tgm4883_laptop> good
[04:56] <mee> can you please help me
[04:56] <tgm4883_laptop> I am helping you
[04:56] <mee> the channel scanner is grayed out
[04:56] <tgm4883_laptop> Did you do step 1?
[04:56] <tgm4883_laptop> note that my answers will come slow
[05:11] <mee> tgm4883_laptop, do i have to do step 6?
[05:11] <mee> tgm4883_laptop, does mythbuntu allow you to watch tv in a window?
[05:14] <tgm4883_laptop> mee, you can put mythtv in a window if you like
[05:14] <tgm4883_laptop> it's a setting under settings > appearance in the frontend
[05:14] <mee> thanks
[05:15] <mee> do you have to do step 6
[05:15] <tgm4883_laptop> yea
[05:15] <hads> I guess that's why it's a step :)
[05:15] <tgm4883_laptop> yep
[05:17] <mee> the channel scanner should work before i do step 6 shouldnt it?
[05:17] <tgm4883_laptop> yes
[05:18] <mee> hmmm what is the problem here
[05:18]  * hads pulls out his crystal ball
[05:19] <tgm4883_laptop> what type of card did you set it up as in step 1?  DVB?
[05:20]  * tgm4883_laptop has to run to the store real quick
[05:20] <mee> it says  HVR
[05:20] <mee> hads are you there
[05:21] <mee> anyone?
[05:22] <hads> Not really, cooking.
[05:23] <mee> hads how do i get this thing to recognize my usb
[05:23] <mee> my usb tv adapter
[06:30] <iuaudio> so what's happened to weekly builds for intrepid?
[12:53] <safcsat> Afternoon
[12:53] <safcsat> dont suppose anyone has a recent guide for setting up mythbuntu with vdr 1.71 and getting dvb-s2 working?
[12:54] <safcsat> sick of crapy windows and mediaportal so gonna give mythbuntu a bash :)
[13:33] <safcsat> hey Penfold - dont suppose u can point me in direction of an uptodate guide for getting vdr 1.71 dvb-s2 etc working on mythbuntu?
[13:40] <Penfold> in one, I can't :) sorry :) my install is a WinTB150
[13:41] <safcsat> no worries thanks anyway :)
[14:11] <laga> now there was someone who totally missed the point :)
[15:11] <wise_tamas> re all! I've just started using Mythbuntu 8.10( backend+frontend on a desktop, frontend only on a notebook ), and I'm bumped with settings and video windows... can anyone help me out? (more info on my system setup to come if wanted)
[15:18] <bobbob1016> How can I get mythbuntu to talk to my receiver?  I have a pioneer vsx-01txh.  It has USB but for ipod connectivity.  It has a com-port (9pin I think), anyone know how to get this working?
[15:36] <laga> bobbob1016: ask pioneer?
[15:37] <bobbob1016> laga, Ok, I wasn't sure if there was mythtv thing to do it.
[15:38] <laga> bobbob1016: the commands are most likely vendor specific. i'd find out what commands are available and then go from there, eg write a script
[20:32] <Dennis_> Hello , when i start watch tv the picture freeze , sound is ok?
[20:52] <LyosNorezel> quiet today
[23:22] <MythbuntuGuest82> Hey guys, how do I delay the loading of the backend?  I did it before, but had to reformat and install and I can't remember how to do it.  Seems like I changed it from S20 to S99, but I don't remember what folder.
[23:23] <MythbuntuGuest82> I also need to get more volume out of Myth.  Alexis is turned up all the way and the volume is 100%, but it's still very quiet.  Again, I did this before, but I can't remember how I did it.
[23:32] <Tooncis> I mean alsamixer
[23:44] <LonEagle> there's a volume control in the setup in mythfrontend
[23:45] <LonEagle> you can max that one out too
[23:56] <Tooncis> I'll check...
[23:58] <ajhtwolf> hey i tried to setup my mythfrontend to connect to a remote backend and now mythfronent wont even start