[01:22] <waltman> there are several in center city, including a couple in suburban station
[01:22] <JonathanD> Theres one in norristown now.
[01:22] <JonathanD> they're popping up everywhere.
[01:23] <JonathanD> We need one in bridgeport.
[01:23] <pleia2> not everywhere :(
[01:23] <JonathanD> So I can walk to it.
[01:23] <waltman> and one in paoli
[01:23] <JonathanD> pleia2: stock up in July?
[01:23] <pleia2> that and dunkin donuts coffee
[01:23] <waltman> pleia2: yeah, but you can walk across the street to a chipotle with a liquor license :)
[01:24] <pleia2> true
[01:25] <pleia2> I never buy any there though because it's all boring
[01:25] <pleia2> coronas and strange premixed margaritas
[01:25] <JonathanD> mmm chipotle
[01:25] <JonathanD> pleia2: you can only carry 3 oz of DD back on the plane :(
[01:25] <JonathanD> or whatever it is.
[01:26] <pleia2> nah, ground stuff for my coffee maker!
[01:26]  * pleia2 has 1.5 bags left
[01:33] <andrew> Good thing you can buy more online: https://shop.dunkindonuts.com/shoponline/Category.aspx?CategoryId=COFF
[01:34] <pleia2> shipping is killer
[01:34] <pleia2> can actually get it at safeway too, but it's not the same..
[01:35] <andrew> pleia2: Then go with amazon? http://www.amazon.com/Dunkin-Donuts-Original-Medium-Resealable/dp/B001I19IDA
[01:35] <pleia2> sshh, you're ruining my excuses to go back to philly
[01:35] <andrew> pleia2: You were just in philly a week ago
[01:35] <pleia2> it was raining
[01:36] <andrew> so?
[01:36] <PennBot> Somebody said so is it normal behavior for empathy that when you fill the line you're typing in it makes the window bigger instead of going to a new line, andrew
[01:36] <pleia2> and no time between planes to get coffee (I actually had planned on it)
[01:36] <andrew> excuses
[01:59] <andrew> pleia2: http://lookoutpartyevent.eventbrite.com/
[01:59] <PennBot> Title: Party your apps off with Lookout @ Google I/O - Eventbrite (at lookoutpartyevent.eventbrite.com)
[02:00] <pleia2> andrew: I'll be in the wrong country during google i/o
[02:00] <andrew> too bad
[02:00] <andrew> ubuntu stuff?
[02:00] <pleia2> I live right by there though
[02:00] <pleia2> yeah, ubuntu developer summit in budapest
[02:00] <andrew> hmmm budapest
[02:01] <andrew> my boss was in Budapest a few months ago for work
[02:02] <pleia2> I snagged some folks from ubuntu-hu to give us tours :)
[02:02] <pleia2> meeting up with some of them sunday afternoon when I arrive to do some daytime stuff
[02:02] <andrew> first time there?
[02:02] <andrew> hrm, flyers are up 3-0
[02:02] <andrew> they best not mess things up
[02:03] <pleia2> yeah, and only my 4th time to europe (england, belgium, ireland)
[02:04] <pleia2> sheesh, look at me, 3 years ago I'd never even been out of the US :)
[02:04] <andrew> my visits to europe can be represented with an empty set
[02:04] <pleia2> europe doesn't have enough cheese or water pressure in showers
[02:05] <JonathanD> or cheese in showers.
[02:05] <pleia2> cheese should never be in showers
[02:05] <andrew> should showers be in cheese?
[02:05] <JonathanD> it's raining cheese.
[02:06] <JonathanD> hallelujah
[02:06] <pleia2> when I came home from 2 weeks in england I bought a GIANT cheesy pizza
[02:06] <pleia2> it was nice
[02:06] <JonathanD> They always brag about how good their cheese is.
[02:06] <JonathanD> and how crumby ours is.
[02:06] <JonathanD> Perhaps this is because there isn't any.
[02:06] <andrew> did they forget to melt ours?
[02:07] <pleia2> yeah, ours needs to be melted and put on everything
[02:07] <JonathanD> I had a nice piece of NY chedder on saturday.
[02:07] <JonathanD> we cut it in slices, it was yum.
[02:07] <rmg51> cheese-whiz ;-)
[02:08] <andrew> We even put cheese on our steak!
[02:08] <pleia2> mm cheesesteak wit whiz
[02:09] <andrew> I'm pretty sure that statement is shortened to "wit"
[02:09] <pleia2> but what about the onions?
[02:09] <pleia2> I do not want onions
[02:10] <andrew> hrm, dunno
[02:10]  * andrew avoids the city as much as humanly possible
[03:45] <waltman> no, no, no.
[03:45] <waltman> wid/wid-out refers to *onions*, not cheese.
[03:46] <waltman> http://www.flickr.com/photos/kukulu21/544769983/
[03:46] <PennBot> Title: How to Order a Cheesesteak - Pat's Steaks | Flickr - Photo Sharing! (at www.flickr.com)
[03:47] <ChinnoDog> peeps need directions?
[03:47] <waltman> Interestingly, it does say "wit" there, but I'm pretty sure the true Philly accent is more "wid" than "wit"
[03:48] <waltman> ChinnoDog: This is only at pretentious places like Pat's.  Anywhere else you can order in normal English, and they won't have whiz.
[03:48] <pleia2> the cheesesteak place here has whiz, is goooood
[03:49] <pleia2> jakessteaks.net yum yum
[03:49] <waltman> There are 1000s of places to buy cheesesteaks in the Philadelphia area, but I'm guessing less than 10 have whiz.
[03:49] <ChinnoDog> whiz?
[03:49] <andrew> ...
[03:49] <pleia2> cheese whiz
[03:50] <andrew> (did he ask what I think he asked?)
[03:50] <pleia2> lol
[03:50] <pleia2> he's not from around here
[03:50] <ChinnoDog> Why would you put cheese whiz on a cheese steak?
[03:50] <pleia2> oh dear
[03:50] <andrew> define 'here' since you are currently thousands of miles from where i am
[03:50] <pleia2> andrew: philly!
[03:51] <pleia2> I am there in spirit while talking about cheesesteaks
[03:51] <pleia2> except for the jakes steaks thing, that's my little philly enclave in sf
[03:51] <pleia2> their whole wall is a photo of boathouse row
[03:52] <pleia2> and they haz Tastykakes
[03:52] <andrew> for now
[03:52] <waltman> ChinnoDog: You wouldn't. You'd put American or Provolone.
[03:54] <ChinnoDog> So why would a nice cheesteak place have whiz?
[03:55] <pleia2> it's traditional
[03:55] <waltman> it's traditional at like 3 places.
[03:55] <ChinnoDog> lol
[03:56] <pleia2> 3 famous places!
[03:56] <waltman> yeah, yeah
[03:56] <ChinnoDog> I'll take one with swiss, and wid
[03:56] <ChinnoDog> No whiz
[03:56] <waltman> no, swiss isn't an option
[03:56] <ChinnoDog> It isn't?
[03:57] <pleia2> nope, american or provolone
[03:57] <waltman> The traditional options are American (the default), provolone, or mozzarella if you want a pizza steak.
[03:57] <pleia2> I actually prefer chicken cheesesteaks w/ american cheese
[03:57] <ChinnoDog> Maybe I used to get them with provolone then
[03:57] <ChinnoDog> I was never into American
[03:57] <waltman> yeah, provolone's just a better, tastier cheese
[03:58]  * pleia2 gnaws on matzah
[03:58] <pleia2> i want breeeeaaad
[03:58] <ChinnoDog> Poor pleia2
[03:58] <waltman> andrew: You ever go to the Peppermille?
[03:58] <waltman> s/e$//
[03:58] <ChinnoDog> Someone fedex a cheese steak to pleia2
[03:58] <pleia2> the ones from jake's are fine
[03:58] <andrew> the peppermill? you mean "Pepper Mill"?
[03:58] <pleia2> but it's across town
[03:59] <waltman> Oh, is it 2 words?  Yeah, the place at 352 and Paoli Pike.
[03:59] <ChinnoDog> Boyfriends are often useful for tasks such as this.
[03:59] <andrew> waltman: http://maps.google.com/maps?um=1&ie=UTF-8&q=pepper+mill&fb=1&gl=us&hq=pepper+mill&hnear=West+Chester,+PA&cid=0,0,4670750492335660779&ei=c4a3Tbm5MILBtgeUkoXfBA&sa=X&oi=local_result&ct=image&resnum=9&ved=0CKcBEJ8CMAg
[03:59] <PennBot> Title: Google Maps (at maps.google.com)
[03:59] <pleia2> he's even further away than the cheesesteaks!
[03:59] <andrew> yes, plenty of times, but generally for strombolies
[03:59] <andrew> never had a cheesesteak there
[03:59] <waltman> Everything's great there.
[04:00] <ChinnoDog> pleia2: does that mean the cheese steaks are on his way home?
[04:00] <pleia2> ChinnoDog: unfortunately not
[04:00] <waltman> We used to go there a lot when I was working at QVC. My favorite was the South of the Border Chicken Cheesesteak.
[04:00] <andrew> waltman: you used to work at qvc?
[04:00] <pleia2> he was a model
[04:01] <andrew> lulz
[04:01] <waltman> Yep, for most of the 90s
[04:01] <andrew> most of the 90s?
[04:02] <andrew> what year did they open that location up?
[04:02] <waltman> 1986, I think.
[04:02] <andrew> hrm
[04:02] <waltman> I started in 1990, and it was already several years old then.
[04:03] <andrew> in the same building they are in now?
[04:04] <waltman> I started at 1365 Enterprise Drive. I think they still have some office space there, but in the mid 90s they moved most of their operations to the place on Airport Rd.
[04:05] <andrew> I remember when they opened the airport rd location (vaguely)
[04:05] <waltman> Yeah, it was a big deal.  That used to be where Commodore was located.
[04:05] <ChinnoDog> pleia2: When I lived in Jersey I had a short list of cheesteak delivery places. I guess you don't have those...
[04:06] <andrew> uh-oh, delta plane made emergancy landing at phl, reports of smoke in cockpit
[04:06] <pleia2> jake's is run by philly natives, they do it wrong at other places
[04:06] <waltman> ChinnoDog: now she's got a *very* short list :)
[04:07] <pleia2> they do delivery, but not this far out from where they are
[04:07]  * waltman now has a strange craving for a cheesesteak
[04:07] <pleia2> hehe
[04:08] <ChinnoDog> Offer them a few extra bucks!
[04:09] <waltman> ChinnoDog: steaks only travel well up to a certain short distance from the grill.
[04:10] <ChinnoDog> If only there was a cheese steak stand on wheels you could call up.
[04:11] <waltman> ChinnoDog: We've got cheesteak trucks all over the place around Drexel and Penn :)
[04:12] <ChinnoDog> Well tell one of them to drive to SF for a cheese steak emergency
[04:13] <waltman> pleia2: do you have a bear light to bring to the release party on thursday?
[04:13] <pleia2> waltman: it would be red all the time!
[04:14] <waltman> exactly!
[04:15] <pleia2> I wish they had better food, they do tapas, which to them means tiny sf-food appetizers that cost $12 each
[04:17] <pleia2> sf-food == fancy, usually somewhat healthy, fuzion food
[04:18]  * pleia2 likes proper brewpub pub food
[04:18] <pleia2> like sly fox, man I loved sly fox
[04:18] <pleia2> fox > bear
[04:35] <waltman> and sourdough.
[11:15] <JonathanD> Morning PA
[11:26] <rmg51> morning JonathanD o/
[11:31] <JonathanD> heya
[14:28] <InHisName> Good Morning rmg51 and JonathanD
[14:28] <InHisName> .... and to anyone else already awake.
[14:38] <teddy-dbear> I am ;-)
[14:42] <JonathanD> morning InHisName
[15:27] <InHisName> There appears to be a whole slew of web sites 'predicting' the Judgement Day to be May 21, 2011.   And I thought everyone was fixated on 2012 due to the Mayans being so smart with calendars ?
[15:31] <jedijf> InHisName: i saw a billboard yesterday on rt 70 in the pinelands
[15:41] <InHisName> Funny about that,  God said long ago even JESUS doesn't now when......
[15:42] <InHisName> I suspect that on May 21 he will NOT end the world, just because so many are expecting it. (its supposed to be a big surprise)
[15:44] <teddy-dbear> tell me all about May 22nd :-/
[15:49] <InHisName> teddy-dbear: its a Sunday, you are invited to attend my church as I expect most of us will still be around exept for car accidents, disasters, etc.  1/2 mile up Valley Rd from Street Road in Warrington, PA
[15:50] <InHisName> The instigator wrote a book called 1994?  that called that the end.  Ha!
[15:55]  * teddy-dbear belongs to St. Mattress :-D
[16:01] <InHisName> I doubt it, teddy-dbear
[16:02] <InHisName> More like evil devil Chocolate is your idol
[16:17] <teddy-dbear> nothing evil about chocolate
[16:45] <waltman> I'm planning on enjoying some of this on May 21 -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Fin_du_Monde_(beer)
[16:46] <waltman> perhaps some of this, too -- http://beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/22/33
[16:46] <PennBot> Title: Maudite - Unibroue - Chambly, QC, Canada - BeerAdvocate (at beeradvocate.com)
[16:49] <InHisName> waltman: hopefully it is just a short walk from your home.  Ne sense in colliding with the crazed 'near' christians driving insanely on that day.
[20:23] <ChinnoDog> hi freelancer317
[20:25] <freelancer317> Hiya ChinnoDog... How've you been?
[20:26] <ChinnoDog> Been fine. Busy.
[20:26] <ChinnoDog> Need more release parties for distraction
[20:26] <freelancer317> Yea. That would be great.
[20:27] <ssweeny> ChinnoDog, want to throw an ubu release party in pittsburgh?
[20:27] <ssweeny> i'd love to do it but i'm busy
[20:27] <ChinnoDog> haha
[20:27] <ChinnoDog> That venue is not very convenient for me
[20:28] <ssweeny> ChinnoDog, not everything is about you
[20:28] <ssweeny> you're depriving the poor people of pittsburgh of a party
[20:28] <ChinnoDog> Are we going to play the zombie game?
[20:28] <teddy-dbear> what about Philly?
[20:29] <ssweeny> i'll bring the zombie game to the party if you want
[20:29] <ssweeny> it's lots of fun
[20:29] <ssweeny> we can pretend the zombies are mac users
[20:29] <ChinnoDog> The release party happens near the person who is willing to plan it. haha
[20:29] <pleia2> you are all welcome to come to thirsty bear in san francisco
[20:29] <pleia2> jono bacon will be there!
[20:30] <andrew> beer, and bacon!
[20:30] <ssweeny> will he be signing t-shirts?
[20:30] <pleia2> yes, I'll bring a sharpie
[20:30] <freelancer317> pleia2 who cares about jono... will you be there?  lol
[20:30] <pleia2> freelancer317: yep!
[20:31] <ssweeny> man, who knew planning a trip to europe two weeks out would be so stressful? :)
[20:31] <pleia2> I'm sure I'll be budapest-freaking-out soon
[20:31] <pleia2> I am not very ready
[20:32] <ssweeny> my problem is i'm leaving for that trip from another trip so i have to plan twice as hard
[20:32] <pleia2> my weekends in may: fly to budapest, fly from budapest, fly to and from miami, fly to and from edmonton
[20:33] <ssweeny> sounds like fun
[20:33] <ChinnoDog> Is mrs_sweeny going to budapest?
[20:33] <pleia2> june: stay home and sleep
[20:33] <ssweeny> mrs_ssweeny will sadly not be joining me.
[20:33] <JonathanD> SLeeping for a month?
[20:33] <ssweeny> she'll likely be leaving for brazil just as i get back
[20:33] <pleia2> I'll need it!
[20:33] <JonathanD> As long as you're sleeping a whole month, you should stop here on the way back from edmonton... so you can go camping.
[20:34] <JonathanD> Since you'd only be sleeping otherwise, anyway :P
[20:37] <freelancer317> JonathanD How've you been?
[20:38] <JonathanD> I've been good.
[20:38] <JonathanD> busy planning fosscon :D
[20:38] <freelancer317> How's it coming?
[20:40] <JonathanD> Coming along.
[20:41] <JonathanD> It's in Philly this year.
[20:41] <JonathanD> July.
[20:45] <freelancer317> That sounds awesome!  Who many people do you think that it will draw?
[20:45] <freelancer317> attendee wise?
[20:51] <JonathanD> We had about 100 last year, this year is in a more accesible space, so at least that...
[20:52] <JonathanD> shooting for 150
[20:54] <freelancer317> I'll have to clear it with my wife, but hope to make it down there.  Where will it be?  Better to drive to take train?
[20:54] <JonathanD> it's walkable from market east.
[20:55] <JonathanD> Depends on what else you want to do, I suppose.
[20:55] <pleia2> we probably won't even be renting a car (airport to city, then public transit or zipcar if absolutely required for sunday thing)
[20:56] <JonathanD> Theres no need to drive to basekamp, I don't think. So it's really a question of do you want to drive anywhere else.
[20:56] <pleia2> yeah
[20:57] <JonathanD> theres plenty else within walking distance too
[20:57]  * pleia2 nods
[20:59] <andrew> Wait... is pleia2 coming to fosscon this year?
[20:59] <pleia2> si
[20:59] <JonathanD> andrew: pleia2 is keynoting
[21:00] <JonathanD> I'm finishing up the email to plug right now.
[21:00] <freelancer317> JonathanD did you get in touch with CPLUG?
[21:01] <JonathanD> Yeah.
[21:01] <JonathanD> occasionally, anyway :p
[21:01] <JonathanD> flyers will be handed out there.
[21:02] <freelancer317> I haven't been able to make most of their meetings due to tball being every darned Tues...
[21:02] <JonathanD> On that note... there needs to be a ubuntu pa table, I think.
[21:02] <JonathanD> I'm certainly not going to have time to do one.
[21:03] <JonathanD> freelancer317: you're central PA, iirc?
[21:03] <JonathanD> closer to cplug?
[21:03] <freelancer317> yep
[21:04] <freelancer317> I'm in Harrisburg
[21:04] <JonathanD> Right.
[21:05] <freelancer317> If my schedule works out, I may be able to help for the table down there.
[21:06] <freelancer317> I'll see if I can wrangle up some conference stuff
[21:06] <freelancer317> Regardless\
[21:06] <pleia2> requests for natty CDs can be submitted already
[21:07] <pleia2> https://forms.canonical.com/lococd/
[21:07] <PennBot> Title: Local Community (LoCo) CD request (at forms.canonical.com)
[21:07] <freelancer317> k
[21:07] <freelancer317> thanks
[21:12] <freelancer317> Requested


[11:38] <i0CC> såpass.
[12:39] <Izy> Hi im new to this.. dose it work use like obs or other gaming streaming softwear with ubuntu?
[15:33] <Kira9204> OBS should work yeah
[15:33] <Kira9204> I have not usef it personally


[02:37] <[Kid]> in case anyone needs to know, the following fixes my issue: https://github.com/conjure-up/conjure-up/issues/505
[13:03] <erik_lonroth> I'm trying to push a bundle to the cs, but it ERROR:s with a missing metadata.yaml file
[13:03] <erik_lonroth> Its not mentioned in the docs


[05:47] <Unit193> ochosi, bluesabre: (I guess this should go here) Due to lack of a better place for now, they are here: http://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/users/unit193-guest/xfce4-soundmenu-plugin.git/ - http://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/users/unit193-guest/libmpris2client.git/
[06:29] <Unit193> bluesabre: Can you sync xfce4-appfinder from exp?
[08:03] <ochosi> Unit193: o hey! thanks a bunch!
[08:03] <Unit193> Also, in ppa:unit193/xfce.
[08:04] <Unit193> Bleh, should likely have done -0ubuntu1 for them..
[08:07] <ochosi> trying it now
[08:07] <elfy> morning ochosi
[08:07] <ochosi> hey elfy
[08:08] <ochosi> how's it going?
[08:08] <elfy> ok thanks - week off :)
[08:08] <ochosi> \o/
[08:08] <ochosi> lucky you, so what are you doing sitting in front of the computer? :D
[08:09] <elfy> images are fubar atm bug 1352252
[08:09] <elfy> elfy's in his counting house counting out his money, finding that the lack of it is really rather funny
[08:09] <ochosi> hmm, i also had a hard time setting up my partitioning in utopic when i installed it on the weekend
[08:10] <ochosi> ooohh, you have a "counting house" just for that purpose?
[08:10]  * ochosi didn't know elfy was *that* rich
[08:10] <elfy> oh yes - it's always empty though :p
[08:10]  * elfy suspects that ochosi never heard that nursery rhyme and if he did it wasn't in english :p
[08:11] <ochosi> indeed
[08:12] <elfy> it's a standard English August day - cloudy and a bit chilly - so I'm doing as little as I can today
[08:12] <ochosi> Unit193: oooh, sneaky! the soundmenu didn't actually build
[08:13] <ochosi> elfy: sounds like a sane goal for a day :>
[08:13] <ochosi> put that s*** on a t-shirt!
[08:13] <Unit193> ochosi: Dep-wait, I didn't wait long enough after firing up libmprisclient.  There's actually nothing wrong, give it a minute. :P
[08:13] <ochosi> ah, i see :)
[08:13] <ochosi> was just about to look at the build logs
[08:14] <Unit193> Didn't see the big Missing build dependencies: libmpris2client-dev? :D
[08:15] <elfy> ochosi: lol
[08:15] <ochosi> Unit193: well i didn't look in the end, since you threw out that spoiler! :]
[08:16] <Unit193> It's actually on the status page too.
[08:16] <ochosi> elfy: fwiw, utopic should soonishly have quite finalized gtk themes
[08:16] <ochosi> oh
[08:16] <elfy> ochosi: nice :)
[08:16] <ochosi> elfy: so from shimmer-themes 1.8.1 (or so) onwards, please let me know of any visual oddities you encounter
[08:16] <elfy> ok
[08:16] <ochosi> apart from abiword, obviously that one always looks like crap
[08:17] <Unit193> ...And always gets purged before seen.
[08:17] <elfy> stop seeding abiword :p
[08:17] <elfy> lol @ Unit193
[08:17] <ochosi> hehe, that'll be our next team vote then ;)
[08:18] <ochosi> (not kidding)
[08:18] <Unit193> Seeding network-manager has actually caused more problems for me (see my report on the tracker)
[08:18] <Unit193> ochosi: Eh, you wanting to put LO on? :/
[08:18] <ochosi> Unit193: hm which want?
[08:18] <elfy> beta 1 is in a few weeks - I assume we're still going to participate in those
[08:19] <ochosi> Unit193: no, nothing, but i'll probably come up with a concept for that first
[08:19] <ochosi> elfy: yup, i'd say so
[08:19] <Unit193> ochosi: They're done, but not sure if you should copy them over.
[08:20] <elfy> ochosi: good - we need to do some milestones :)
[08:20] <ochosi> elfy: if there's anything in particular that i have to do about these things that i might not know, feel free to "remind" me
[08:20] <ochosi> especially with QA and releases i wasn't really so involved in the past
[08:20] <Unit193> elfy: FWIW, one of mine is on utopic now, so if I'm supposed to be looking for something..
[08:20] <ochosi> knome: the same goes for you ^ (i mean, "reminding" me of the duties i might not be aware of yet)
[08:20] <elfy> ochosi: not really, it's basically mark images as ready, have a release note ready, tell whoever's asking in -release where it is :)
[08:21] <ochosi> mkay, that sounds like work but do-able :)
[08:21] <ochosi> no idea how to mark images ready, but i'll come to you once it comes to that
[08:21] <ochosi> i guess the partitioner problem doesn't only affect us
[08:22] <ochosi> since it's part of ubiquity
[08:22] <elfy> .nope - that's everyone I'd assume
[08:23] <elfy> marking images is easy - the best thing to do is have the release notes almost done - then just fill in the major issues for us, the *buntu major issues get listed anyway
[08:23] <ochosi> oh good
[08:23] <ochosi> do we have any major issues so far that i might not be aware of?
[08:24] <elfy> not that I'm aware of - most of the big stuff was 14.04.1 sru's I tthink
[08:28] <Unit193> ochosi: Do you know if Andrew (asb) still is interested in helping Xubuntu in Debian?
[08:30] <ochosi> Unit193: hm, never knew anything about that
[08:30] <ochosi> elfy: cool, that's good to know
[08:30] <ochosi> well i guess more issues will pop up once we hit beta1 :)
[08:31] <ochosi> Unit193: and i don't think i've heard that name before
[08:31] <elfy> ochosi: it's getting people to look before the end of October :p
[08:32] <Unit193> If it helps, I may upgrade the netbook to utopic too.
[08:33] <ochosi> elfy: yeah, i was lagging a bit behind, now i at least have a vbox set up...
[08:35] <elfy> everything helps :)
[08:36] <Unit193> OK, the upgrade is just going to stink. :P
[08:39] <brainwash> is there even anything new in xubu utopic other than gtk appearance tweaks?
[08:40] <ochosi> brainwash: new power manager?
[08:40] <ochosi> there'll be a new display dialog, new release of xfwm4 etc
[08:40] <Unit193> xfwm+tabwin?
[08:40] <brainwash> :P
[08:42] <brainwash> people are still having issues with xfpm and logind overriding lid close events
[08:42] <brainwash> according to launchpad
[08:42] <ochosi> Unit193: yeah, that one has been released meanwhile
[08:42] <ochosi> bbl
[08:43] <brainwash> so that's one thing which could be tested in utopic with xfpm 1.3.0
[09:28] <knome> ochosi, as if i had time to think about such ;)
[09:28] <knome> ochosi, i'll know afterwards when you didn't do something...
[09:33] <Unit193> knome: Know about the question about Andrew?
[09:34] <knome> no?
[09:34] <knome> tell me?
[11:01] <elfy> sigh, wish we didn't get old installer bugs coming back - bad enough to have current ones :|
[11:04] <Unit193> :/
[11:04] <Unit193> So can anyone here actually subscribe ~xubuntu-bugs to packages?
[11:04] <elfy> yea
[11:05] <elfy> I've done that previously
[11:06] <Unit193> I don't seem to be able to here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thunar-dropbox-plugin/+subscriptions
[11:12] <knome> Unit193, probably has to do with the LP teams review
[11:13] <knome> ~xubuntu-team isn't an administrator for the bugs team any more
[11:13] <knome> i guess we should make -dev an administrator for that team
[11:13] <knome> ochosi, ^ ?
[11:13] <knome> and set owner to xubuntu project lead
[11:14] <Unit193> So for a trial, I created https://bitbucket.com/xubuntu/ so I wouldn't be storing stuff in my alioth user dir and consequently be the only one with commit access.  It's basically for packages that aren't going to Debian (right now), but if others think they have a valid use for it, works for me.
[11:14] <Unit193> bluesabre: I had you as admin, but only removed once I learned it'd email you on every git repo import, and didn't want to spam.
[11:15] <knome> Unit193, i guess with as social media stuff, it'd be good to have at least a few team people as admins
[11:15] <Unit193> He's "developer", which has a lot of access.  I just didn't want to spam his email.  I'm fine with others having admin.
[11:16] <knome> yeah, wasn't referring to the bluesavre situation ;)
[11:16] <knome> bluesabre too!
[11:16] <Unit193> :P
[11:16] <Unit193> I'm only aware of myself, Sean, and Thomas being on there.
[11:17] <bluesabre> I don't mind a ton of emails... I get that with ubuntu-release list
[11:18] <Unit193> Done, you be an admin.
[11:18] <bluesabre> woo!
[11:29] <brainwash> sound menu plugin? a replacement for the unity sound menu?
[11:30] <brainwash> any screenshots? :)
[11:30] <Unit193> Looking at the blueprints I see only the panel switch and lightdm-settings applications to create, were we going to try out any other packages?
[11:30] <Unit193> brainwash: https://github.com/matiasdelellis/xfce4-soundmenu-plugin/releases has a couple.
[11:31] <brainwash> ah, so it's more like a sound actionbar
[11:32] <bluesabre> Unit193: I think that's all.
[11:32] <Unit193> bluesabre: Thanks.  Is skippy on the list somewhere/how?
[11:40] <bluesabre> Unit193: what is skippy again?
[11:41] <Unit193> Same type of thing xfdash is, only perhaps better(citation needed)
[11:41] <bluesabre> ah
[11:42] <bluesabre> suppose I'll need a list of things that I need to upload to ubuntu
[11:42] <bluesabre> :)
[11:43] <Unit193> Going over the packaging, it'll need a little updating.
[11:43] <bluesabre> ok
[11:44] <bluesabre> trying to get shimmer-themes uploaded this morning, but I'll be around for a while tonight
[11:44] <Unit193> Saw my ping about appfinder?
[11:45] <bluesabre> yes
[11:45] <Unit193> Great.
[11:53] <Unit193> Hrm, only git snapshots.  I'll ask if he plans to do a beta or release next time he's online.
[12:40] <bluesabre> shimmer-themes uploaded, bbl
[12:40] <Unit193> Nice.
[12:57] <Unit193> ochosi: If you want the soundmenu in ~extras: https://launchpad.net/~unit193/+archive/ubuntu/test/+packages?field.name_filter=libmpris - https://launchpad.net/~unit193/+archive/ubuntu/test/+packages?field.name_filter=xfce4
[13:07] <ali1234> that's different to the sound plugin andrzejr was working on?
[13:11] <Unit193> I don't believe he was working on this one.
[13:13] <Unit193> I didn't know that he was working on one, much less what one.
[13:46] <ochosi> ali1234: yeah, that's different. it started out as an mpris2 controller for the panel, but now he added pulseaudio volume control to it
[13:47] <ochosi> Unit193: thanks, copying now
[13:48] <Unit193> Sure.
[14:23] <ochosi> knome: do *you* wanna work on an accessibility version of greybird?
[14:24] <ochosi> i'm just asking cause i guess that workitem is a candidate for postponing, don't think i'll get to that at all
[14:44] <knome> ochosi, can't do any promises on whether i'll have time, but sure, it's generally a target i can help reaching
[18:11] <ali1234> ochosi: btw, while i was away the past two weeks i was using xubuntu on my laptop, and i found it doesn't resume properly from suspend
[18:11] <ali1234> it wakes up okay, i get the lock screen, enter password, then a black screen
[18:11] <ali1234> then i have to restart lightdm
[18:12] <ali1234> so looks like a light-locker problem? i'm using all vanilla 14.04 packages so maybe you already fixed this?
[18:13] <knome> it ought to be fixed in .1
[18:13] <knome> so if you have all updates, you should be fine
[18:23] <ali1234> looks like i'm up to date
[18:45] <brainwash> but the user has to change something manually for existing accounts
[18:45] <brainwash> to fully fix this problem
[18:46] <brainwash> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xubuntu-default-settings/+bug/1303736/comments/163
[18:52] <brainwash> should unfinished stuff from https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/xubuntu-14-04-point-1 be moved to point-2?
[18:58] <brainwash> moreover, can we unlink the ibus bug report? ibus has been dropped and there is no indication that it will return in 14.04.x
[19:23] <knome> brainwash, i think it's still warranted
[19:43] <Unit193> So, are we going to keep a hard dep on *-gtk-theme from shimmer-themes?
[20:01] <ali1234> brainwash: yes that works thanks
[20:10] <elfy> mmm
[20:11] <elfy> so they now want to test 12.04.4 upgrade to 12.04.5 anyone got any time :|
[20:12] <elfy> not sure that using a vm for kernel and xorg enablement stack will cut it either
[20:12] <Unit193> Everything I have is 14.04+
[20:12] <elfy> yep
[20:15] <elfy> oh good god - there's only alternate testing available - I've not got 4 hours for an install and an upgrade for that
[20:16] <Unit193> I didn't even think we opted in for .5.
[20:17] <elfy> that'll help enormously ...
[20:17] <elfy> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2014-August/002969.html
[20:17] <elfy> I can tell them we're not interested ;)
[20:21] <Unit193> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2014-February/thread.html#38042 Wrong as always, I don't see a reply.
[20:22] <elfy> mmm
[20:22] <elfy> well that's one of those threads isn't it - not sure who ALL of them are - but a fair few are paid by canonical - easy decision in those shoes
[20:23] <elfy> we can blame ochknomsi
[20:23] <Unit193> Good plan!
[20:24] <elfy> I'm going offline till Friday - it's an SEP now
[20:24] <ali1234> what needs to be done?
[20:25] <elfy> ha ha ha
[20:25] <elfy> Unit193: so ... "No kernel modules found" when I try to install the alternate
[20:25] <Unit193> >_<
[20:26] <Unit193> Pretty sure it doesn't like your hardware, then.
[20:26] <Unit193> Keeps doing that. :D
[20:26] <elfy> ali1234: supposedly we're partaking in the 12.04.5 upgrade thing - but I can find no information on whether we are or not ...
[20:26] <elfy> Unit193: this is just a vm
[20:27] <ali1234> assuming we are, what needs to be tested? install 12.04.4 then try to upgrade it to 12.04.5?
[20:27] <elfy> ochosi knome - are we or are we not partaking in 12.04.5 upgrade
[20:27] <elfy> ali1234: yea - alternate is the only testing option though
[20:27] <elfy> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/320/builds
[20:27] <ali1234> hmm i don't understand... how do you upgrade with an iso?
[20:28] <elfy> image then
[20:28] <elfy> testcase for whole drive upgrade is http://testcases.qa.ubuntu.com/Install/AlternateWhole
[20:29] <knome> ali1234, burn a disc (or have an USB stick) and basically use it as a software repository
[20:29] <elfy> knome: do you remember if we said we'd participate ?
[20:29] <elfy> cos I don't
[20:30] <ali1234> knome: that can only work with the alternate iso anyway right?
[20:30] <knome> don't think we've SRU'd much since .1...
[20:30] <knome> ali1234, no, works with the regular ISO as well
[20:31] <elfy> but the real querstion is are we doing this or not ?
[20:31] <knome> do we get the HWE stack or not?
[20:32] <knome> if not, then .5 [20:32] <elfy> I've no idea knome
[20:32] <knome> me neither
[20:32] <Unit193> I'll check.
[20:32] <knome> cheers Unit193
[20:32] <Unit193> I don't think so.
[20:32] <elfy> we appeared to test .4
[20:33] <knome> elfy, yeah, but we landed the docs SRU for that
[20:33] <knome> right? :)
[20:33] <elfy> sounds right to me
[20:33] <Unit193> Uhhhh.
[20:33] <knome> now we haven't landed anything
[20:34] <Unit193> We have 3.13 modules with a 3.2 kernel...
[20:34] <knome> huh
[20:35] <Unit193> http://paste.openstack.org/show/BGSKeuQgvguT2aW6uRNz
[20:35] <elfy> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-users/2014-February/006526.html
[20:36] <Unit193> Oh duh, I see.
[20:36] <knome> right
[20:36] <elfy> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-users/2014-February/006529.html
[20:36] <Unit193> It's got modules for several, but I don't personally know why.
[20:36] <knome> mhmh
[20:37] <elfy> so - we're not bothered by this then
[20:37] <knome> yep
[20:37] <knome> in that case we don't want the .5 ISO's built for xubuntu at all
[20:37] <elfy> knome: remove from list ?
[20:38] <elfy> will that stop build? or just stop reporting?
[20:38] <knome> talk with somebody technical :)
[20:38] <knome> there might be some reasons to keep building
[20:38] <elfy> :)
[20:38] <knome> but my gut feeling is that it's mostly in vain
[20:38]  * skellat must have had a good day at work to have snuck in a mailing list reply
[20:38] <knome> or completely
[20:39] <Unit193> Indeed.
[20:39] <knome> and clearly, i've had a more clear vision of what is happening then than now ;)
[20:40] <elfy> knome: I asked infinity
[20:41] <knome> okay
[20:41] <elfy> who says ask stgraber ...
[20:41] <knome> well done
[20:42] <elfy> [21:41] <infinity> elfy: If you weren't using HWE stacks (were you?), there's no real reason for you to do the point release.
[20:42] <elfy> [21:41] <infinity> elfy: If you were, though, you don't really want to leave your users with the "current" precise ISO being unsupported.
[20:42] <elfy> Unit193 knome - we definitely are not using them ?
[20:43] <knome> don't take my word for it :P
[20:43] <knome> but i'm pretty sure now that i saw my own email
[20:43] <elfy> I've not - I'll stop panicking now :)
[20:43] <knome> using them would have meant broken PAE support in point releases
[20:43] <elfy> [21:42] <infinity> Yeah, you weren't.  Just double-checked.
[20:43] <elfy> [21:42] <stgraber> elfy: ok, so I'll remove any build you have and that'll be it. Thanks for letting me know.
[20:43] <knome> great :)
[20:44] <elfy> rather glad I saw that -release mail now and not tomorrow morning ...
[20:44] <knome> heh
[20:44] <skellat> That would've been a point release to nuke from orbit
[20:45] <elfy> ali1234: thanks for the offer to get hands dirty - appreciate that a lot :)
[20:47] <elfy> respinning
[20:48] <elfy> bad enough that the unicorn is uninstallable atm without anything else ...
[21:03] <knome> ok, off, bbl
[21:03] <Unit193> G'bye.
[21:07] <brainwash> just realized that ubuntu + spins do/did have serious lock screen issues recently
[21:10] <brainwash> luckily not security related in xubu 14.04.0 :)
[21:12] <brainwash> Unit193: remember the incomplete screen lock in lubuntu 13.10? it never got fixed...
[21:12] <Unit193> Pah, really?  I thought it was at one point. :P
[21:13] <Unit193> Oh dear.
[21:15] <brainwash> by the way.. xmir dead? :)
[21:15] <Unit193> No, no it's not.  utopic just pulled in some libs. :(
[21:16] <brainwash> that's not a bad thing, or?
[21:16] <Unit193> brainwash: Remember, I kind of follow the releases, but you likely know more.
[21:16] <Unit193> Meh, I'd prefer everyone on Wayland (in the future).
[21:17] <brainwash> I did follow the progress somewhat.. but lost track of it due to the lack of news about it
[21:17] <brainwash> and sloooow bug fixing
[21:18] <brainwash> because a software cursor is just a no-go, maybe they managed to fix this in the meantime
[21:18] <elfy> it is also an SEP at the moment
[21:18] <brainwash> sep?
[21:18] <elfy> someone else's problem
[21:19] <brainwash> luckily
[21:19] <Unit193> Meh, I rebuilt ISOs for 0.5.0, 0.5.1 is out now though.
[21:23] <brainwash> so we keep ignoring it for now
[21:24] <Unit193> Basically, except I'll still do an ISO every so often.  knome recommended me talk to oll i, but not sure why exactly.
[21:24] <Unit193> It's sure not landing in utopic.
[22:02] <Unit193> There it is, Mythbuntu isn't doing .5 either.
[22:02] <Unit193> Studio?
[22:02] <elfy> not as far as I know
[22:03] <elfy> I think it is just ubuntu and kubuntu
[23:39] <bluesabre> Unit193: problem with shimmer-themes?  Isn't that how meta-packages usually work?
[23:40] <Unit193> bluesabre: Well, as an added feature it might be possible to remove them, but shimmer-themes depends on all of them, which xubuntu-artwork (thus xubuntu-default-settings) do as well.
[23:41] <bluesabre> ah... it was more for the purpose of being able to install only one if somebody chose to do so (ubuntu-gnome)
[23:41] <bluesabre> or xubuntu-core could just pull greybird, etc
[23:41] <Unit193> I was more asking at the time what Xubuntu's plan was with it.
[23:41] <Unit193> xubuntu-core still pulls -default-settings, so all.
[23:42] <bluesabre> ah ok
[23:42] <bluesabre> current plan is: let me know if something needs to change
[23:42] <Unit193> (x-d-s is kind of what makes Xubuntu, Xubuntu.)
[23:42] <bluesabre> :)
[23:42] <Unit193> Oh bah, you're the tech lead!  I'm following.
[23:46]  * bluesabre looks for packages that need packaging
[23:47] <Unit193> Not more! /o\
[23:53]  * bluesabre starts with xfce4-appfinder


[02:18] <aletheia8556> i need help getting my screen resolution changed.  it is stuck at 800x600 but i want it to be at 1024x768 but it is not even an option
[02:19] <aletheia8556> can anybody help
[04:10] <Deviouz> hi guys
[04:10] <Deviouz> why isnt audacious working in xubuntu?
[04:23] <Balsaq> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=859190
[05:36] <StupidandUgly> does anyone here know what arbitrary packages I can remove to make the size of xubuntu smaller
[05:37] <StupidandUgly> it is like 3.31gb right now
[08:17] <magic_ninja> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1367896
[08:39] <ghostnik11> Hi I need help with xubuntu 9.10
[08:39] <ghostnik11> i read on the xubuntu site that i could come here for help
[08:40] <psycho_oreos> !ask | ghostnik11
[08:41] <ghostnik11> thanks
[08:42] <ghostnik11> okay so I installed xubuntu 9.10 on a toshiba satellite 1005-s157 laptop and know for some reason after just installing when i select xubuntu 9.10 at grub i then get a black screen and can't see anything but know for a fact that xubuntu 9.10 is loading
[08:43] <psycho_oreos> so you still get login screen and all after a black screen?
[08:43] <ghostnik11> so I wanted to know how I could get rid of this black screen problem
[08:43] <ghostnik11> nope no login screen
[08:43] <ghostnik11> after grub it just goes black
[08:43] <psycho_oreos> it could be acpi issue
[08:43] <psycho_oreos> you could try appending noacpi and/or acpi=off
[08:44] <ghostnik11> okay how do i do that
[08:45] <psycho_oreos> when grub says hit Esc to show menu, hit escape, choose the kernel, I think e is to edit.. hit edit when you select kernel line and then at the end of that line add noacpi
[08:49] <ghostnik11> nope added noacpi and it did not work when i pressed ctrl x to boot, still got black screen.  I will know press ctrl alt backspace then ctrl alt del to reboot and try acpi=off
[08:51] <ghostnik11> still won't work, still get black screen
[08:51] <psycho_oreos> hmm
[08:52] <psycho_oreos> if you could somehow obtain the dmesg output, that would be handy
[08:52] <psycho_oreos> I suppose xubuntu is setup on ext4?
[08:52] <ghostnik11> yeah i think so
[08:53] <ghostnik11> i have puppy linux installed also and when i select that at grub it boots fine
[08:53] <psycho_oreos> I'm suspecting its the driver issue
[08:54] <ghostnik11> what do you mean?
[08:54] <psycho_oreos> err video chipset
[08:54] <ghostnik11> yeah but b/4 i installed
[08:54] <psycho_oreos> what xubuntu 9.10 and that it worked?
[08:55] <ghostnik11> i made sure i made a copy of an xorg.conf file from ubuntu 5.10 and then placed it in etc/X11 then told it to install thinking that my videocard and everything on the xorg.conf would be installed also
[08:56] <psycho_oreos> it isn't that
[08:57] <psycho_oreos> if its not working after grub, it may also mean something to do with the kernel based driver of the video chip
[08:57] <ghostnik11> is there a way for me to fix that
[08:58] <psycho_oreos> I'd find out the video chipset on that laptop, and paste the info into google
[08:59] <ghostnik11> i can post the actual xorg file that i have from ubuntu 5.10 b/c in it states my video card info
[09:00] <psycho_oreos> no, lspci output would be handy
[09:01] <ghostnik11> okay but then i would have to use lspci output in the command line of grub then
[09:01] <psycho_oreos> that won't work
[09:04] <ghostnik11> well there is no way for me to see the output through the laptop b/c it just shows a black screen
[09:07] <ghostnik11> i got an idea what if i run ubuntu 5.1 from live cd then go into terminal and type lspci get the output and save it then post it here
[09:07] <ghostnik11> would that work
[09:18] <ghostnik11> okay this is what i got from ubuntu 5.10
[09:18] <ghostnik11> ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ lspci
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:00.0 Host bridge: Intel Corp. 82830 830 Chipset Host Bridge (rev 03)
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corp. 82830 CGC [Chipset Graphics Controller] (rev 03)
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:02.1 Display controller: Intel Corp. 82830 CGC [Chipset Graphics Controller]
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:1d.0 USB Controller: Intel Corp. 82801CA/CAM USB (Hub #1) (rev 01)
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:1d.1 USB Controller: Intel Corp. 82801CA/CAM USB (Hub #2) (rev 01)
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:1d.2 USB Controller: Intel Corp. 82801CA/CAM USB (Hub #3) (rev 01)
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:1e.0 PCI bridge: Intel Corp. 82801 PCI Bridge (rev 41)
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:1f.0 ISA bridge: Intel Corp. 82801CAM ISA Bridge (LPC) (rev 01)
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:1f.1 IDE interface: Intel Corp. 82801CAM IDE U100 (rev 01)
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:1f.3 SMBus: Intel Corp. 82801CA/CAM SMBus Controller (rev 01)
[09:18] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:1f.5 Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corp. 82801CA/CAM AC'97 Audio Controller (rev 01)
[09:19] <ghostnik11> 0000:00:1f.6 Modem: Intel Corp. 82801CA/CAM AC'97 Modem Controller (rev 01)
[09:19] <ghostnik11> 0000:02:04.0 CardBus bridge: Texas Instruments PCI1420
[09:19] <ghostnik11> 0000:02:04.1 CardBus bridge: Texas Instruments PCI1420
[10:05] <jason_> How come whenever I right-click an application it no longer gives me a context menu, but instead starts the program?
[12:55] <kill9> how do you pronounce 'xubuntu'
[12:55] <kill9> the same as 'kubuntu' ?
[12:56] <Sysi> i pronounce how i feel like.
[12:56] <TheSheep> zooboontoo
[12:56] <kill9> ah
[12:56] <kill9> cool thanks
[12:59] <nikolam> I like to say "Ksu" buntu ;)
[13:01] <TheSheep> depends on the language, I guess
[13:01] <TheSheep> in slovio x is ż :)
[13:01] <TheSheep> jooboontoo :)
[13:04] <kill9> there is no windowmaker on synaptic?
[13:04] <kill9> sudo apt-get install windowmaker says there is nothing there
[13:04] <kill9> :\ kinda weird?
[13:04] <kill9> openbox as well. not there.
[13:05] <TheSheep> !info wmaker
[13:05] <kill9> ah ok. thanks :)
[13:08] <kill9> goodnight
[13:57] <Sequeterox> after installing rhythmbox and removing it again totem stopped to play audio
[13:58] <Sequeterox> it requires gnome-media to play audio now
[13:59] <Sequeterox> will I need to use this package or is it possible to use xfce4-mixer instead, again?
[13:59] <Sequeterox> sorry for my bad english
[14:01] <Ov3rf10w> Sequeterox, install audacious and listen music
[14:01] <Sequeterox> Exaile works, I guess Audacious will work too
[14:01] <Sequeterox> it's only totem
[14:02] <Ov3rf10w> totem is for movies
[14:02] <Ov3rf10w> movie player
[14:03] <Sequeterox> Audacious doesn't work either, you are right
[14:03] <Sequeterox> Please check that:
[14:03] <Sequeterox> 1. You have the correct output plugin selected.
[14:03] <Sequeterox> 2. No other programs is blocking the soundcard.
[14:03] <Sequeterox> 3. Your soundcard is configured properly.
[14:04] <Sequeterox> as long as I use the PulseAudio-driver Audacious doesn't play music
[14:04] <Sequeterox> if I use ALSA, it does
[14:04] <Ov3rf10w> change to alsa
[14:06] <Sequeterox> do you mean in xfce4-mixer? it is set so alsa by default at my machine
[14:06] <Ov3rf10w> no on audacious
[14:06] <Sequeterox> yeah it works with alsa
[14:07] <Sequeterox> music is playing when I change PulseAudio-driver to alsa in audacious
[14:09] <Sequeterox> I guess that installing pulseaudio again could help, or am I wrong?
[14:15] <Sequeterox> pluseaudio wasn't even installed on my machine
[14:16] <Sequeterox> after installing it all applications that use alsa don't play audio anymore
[14:30] <Sequeterox> I installed pulseaudio and removed all packages that were installed after then
[14:31] <Sequeterox> now audio is playing in every player I use
[14:31] <Sequeterox> Ov3rf10w: thanks for the hint on pulseaudio
[15:42] <ljamisonii> hello everyone
[15:43] <Ov3rf10w> hello
[15:48] <ljamisonii> I have a problem with my Xfce clock..the Time/Date Settings display the proper time, but the clock itself displays 3 hours behind the current time...any suggestions?
[15:57] <hal__9001> good morning. can anyone recommend the bst antivirus for xubuntu?
[15:58] <Sysi> you don't need antivirus
[15:58] <Ov3rf10w> hal__9001, you don't need av
[15:58] <djura-san> use clamav
[15:58] <djura-san> or you can use avast or fprot
[15:59] <Sysi> ljamisonii: remove it from panel and then add again
[15:59] <djura-san> what kind of computer is running your xubuntu?
[15:59] <Ov3rf10w> djura-san, he don't need av on linux, only if shares files with windows
[15:59] <hal__9001> a toshiba laptop. 1.7ghz 2g ram
[15:59] <Ov3rf10w> slow cpu
[16:00] <Sysi> not if dual core
[16:00] <hal__9001> works for  me
[16:00] <djura-san> Ov3rf10w, that is not correct. If he has mail server than what?
[16:00] <djura-san> *if  he has
[16:00] <hal__9001> no mail server
[16:00] <Ov3rf10w> :D
[16:00] <pingo-> hi, does anybody know how to boot from a live-cd (xubuntu) , with mounting a swap partition on the HD
[16:00] <pingo-> ?
[16:01] <Sysi> for basic use your shouldn't use av
[16:01] <hal__9001> thanks for the info
[16:01] <ljamisonii> thanks Sysi
[16:01] <Sysi> pingo-: you can set it off after booting, would you need to do it before?
[16:01] <hal__9001> i wont be sharing files
[16:01] <aletheia84> i need help getting my maximum screen resolution changed in xubuntu 9.10, i used to be able to do it by editing the xorg.conf file
[16:02] <djura-san> hal__9001, you use linux for your personal pc?
[16:02] <djura-san> then there is no need for av
[16:02] <hal__9001> yes
[16:02] <hal__9001> linux is perfect for me
[16:02] <pingo-> sysi , how??? i need to resize one partition....
[16:03] <Sysi> pingo-: you can set swappiness of from gparted
[16:04] <hal__9001> thank you again
[16:04] <aletheia84> can someone please help me???
[16:04] <djura-san> hal__9001, i would suggest to use good firewall rules. explore that filed :)=
[16:04] <djura-san> *field
[16:04] <hal__9001> i have a firewall :)
[16:05] <Ov3rf10w> aletheia84, yea, you can edit xorg.conf
[16:05] <pingo-> it worked!!!! thx Sysi!
[16:05] <djura-san> hal__9001, is it configured right?
[16:06] <hal__9001> not sure of that.
[16:06] <aletheia84> I have been able to do that in the previous versions of ubuntu but it seem that in 9.10 there is no xorg.conf fil
[16:06] <aletheia84> *file
[16:06] <Ov3rf10w> no xorg.conf file?
[16:06] <Ov3rf10w> lol
[16:06] <Sysi> you can create it
[16:07] <aletheia84> the normal command "sudo gedit /etc/X11/xorg.conf" doesn't get me to it in 9.10
[16:07] <aletheia84> r u talking to me sysi
[16:07] <Sysi> yes
[16:07] <aletheia84> you have to create that file in 9.10
[16:07] <aletheia84> ??
[16:07] <Sysi> you need to create it from the empty but it works
[16:07] <Sysi> i think so
[16:07] <aletheia84> how?
[16:08] <Ov3rf10w> aletheia84, try with this sudo dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg
[16:08] <Sysi> if you have xubuntu replace "gedit" with "mousepad" on command
[16:09] <aletheia84> I've tried that before the sudo reconfigure stuff and it didn't work
[16:09] <aletheia84> sysi why did the command change from gedit to mousepad?
[16:09] <Ov3rf10w> lol
[16:09] <Sysi> gedit don't come with xubuntu
[16:09] <Ov3rf10w> gedit is ubuntu text editor
[16:09] <Ov3rf10w> mouse pad is in xfce
[16:09] <Ov3rf10w> mousepad*
[16:10] <aletheia84> so gedit is a program?
[16:10] <Sysi> yes
[16:10] <Sysi> a text editor
[16:10] <aletheia84> sysi are you running Karmic??
[16:10] <aletheia84> and can you get to the xorg.conf file?
[16:11] <Sysi> no, it don't exist by default
[16:11] <Sysi> that's why you create it
[16:11] <aletheia84> how do i create it?
[16:11] <Sysi> it should be possible with that command
[16:12] <aletheia84> so i type "sudo mousepad /etc/X11/xorg.conf"  ??
[16:12] <Sysi> it should work
[16:12] <aletheia84> now will that command create the file if it doesn't exist?
[16:13] <Sysi> i think it should
[16:13] <Sysi> but it's empty of course
[16:13] <aletheia84> ok, what do i put in the empty space then?
[16:13] <Ov3rf10w> aletheia84, i will send you my xorg.conf
[16:13] <aletheia84> thanks
[16:15] <Ov3rf10w> aletheia84, allow
[16:15] <Ov3rf10w> aletheia84, i try to send you file wia DCC
[16:16] <Ov3rf10w> xD
[16:18] <aletheia84> i did allow it and then nothing followed
[16:18] <Ov3rf10w> hmmm...
[16:18] <Ov3rf10w> wait for sec
[16:19] <aletheia84> iok
[16:19] <aletheia84> *ok
[16:19] <aletheia84> can you post it online?
[16:20] <Ov3rf10w> http://www.megaupload.com/?d=JSHBKEOY
[16:20] <Ov3rf10w> :)
[16:21] <pingo--> sysi, im w another problem, when I unmount one partiton, xubuntu mount the another partiton on HD. im using the live cd.
[16:21] <pingo--> does anybody know why
[16:21] <Sysi> sudo umount /dev/sda* ?
[16:22] <pingo--> no Gparted
[16:22] <Sysi> you could try that
[16:22] <pingo--> (im a newbie)
[16:22] <pingo--> ok
[16:22] <pingo--> i ll
[16:26] <pingo--> it worked, thx again
[16:43] <Paulcasals> hello
[16:44] <Paulcasals> I'm new to linux in general, and am running xubuntu currently on a netbook with no external memory. How would I go about searching if there is python installed?
[16:50] <likemindead> Paulcasals, you can look in Synaptic Package Manager or run "sudo apt-get install python" in a terminal.
[16:51] <Paulcasals> thank you
[16:52] <ron_o> I got a couple of programs that I no longer need, however, when I try to get rid of them *or* upgrade them, a host full of other apps are to be removed
[16:53] <ron_o> one programs is: libavutil-unstripped-49 (ffmpeg utility library - transitional package)
[16:53] <Sysi> well, it won't remove anything that is still needed
[16:53] <ron_o> and the other is: libavcodec-unstripped-52 (ffmpeg utility library - transitional package)
[16:53] <ron_o> I can't even upgrade it..
[16:54] <ron_o> when I try to remove either one then 20 or so other applications are to be removed with it.
[16:55] <ron_o> for synaptic it says: This package can be safely removed if no other packages depend on this
[16:55] <ron_o> weird stuff.
[16:55] <ron_o> and* when I try to upgrade it the same thing happens....
[16:59] <ron_o> I took the medibuntu repos out of synaptic and no longer have the problem.
[16:59] <ron_o> whatever. :)
[17:01] <ron_o> furthermore, somehow I got the karmic repository in my repo list and it's checked. I just unchecked that one and now it's OK. I never added that. :/
[17:02] <ron_o> it's fixed now.
[17:11] <Paulcasals> Where should I go for an easy to understand  tutorial for linux?
[17:12] <hal__9001> google search for; ubuntu pocket guide. free download
[17:12] <Paulcasals> k
[17:12] <hal__9001> thats one source
[17:13] <Paulcasals> I'll try that out. Thanks
[17:16] <hal__9001> yw
[17:52] <DasBlub> hi. someone here who could help me with the nvidia drivers for geforce 9600m ? i got graphic-problems after installing them
[17:52] <DasBlub> oh... and my scren freezes after a while (just happened right now) :(
[17:52] <Sysi> how did you install them?
[17:53] <DasBlub> with apt, i took the 185 package
[17:53] <DasBlub> just rebooting, then i can tell you the exact name
[17:54] <DasBlub> nvidia-glx-185
[17:56] <Sysi> didn't it suggest automatically installing drivers on first boot?
[17:56] <DasBlub> uhm.. no?
[17:56] <DasBlub> well, it worked fine with the default drivers
[17:56] <DasBlub> screen resolution and everything was correct from the first installation of xorg on
[17:57] <DasBlub> but it had no hardware acceleration, so installed the drivers and after that the problems started
[17:58] <DasBlub> maybe i should add, that i used the alternate-cd and did only a basic installation without x-server and after that i used "apt-get install xorg gdm xfce4 xfce4-goodies xubuntu-default-settings" to get the gui
[18:03] <DasBlub> when i rename /etc/X11/xorg.conf and then restart gdm (/etc/init.d/gdm restart), it works fine again... but ofc only with the default drivers and not with the nvidia drivers :/
[18:21] <DasBlub> hm... seems like nobody knows it :/
[18:21] <Sysi> wrong driver possibly?
[18:22] <DasBlub> well.. i doubt so, as my graphic-card is listed on the driver
[18:23] <DasBlub> i even tried it with the drivers i got from the nvidia page. i selected there my graphic-card and downloaded the linux-drivers it gave me, i started the setup which didn't throw any error and after a restart from gdm i had the same problems
[18:23] <DasBlub> and when i remember right, the driver was rev. 185 too
[18:28] <charlie-tca> Think that might be because of the changes made in gdm and gnome during the karmic cycle
[18:29] <charlie-tca> you are using a bare install, and may not have all the dependencies satisfied now
[18:29] <charlie-tca> which desktop manager are you using?
[18:31] <superos> Sometimes when I (try to) start xfce4 from gdm I am returned to gdm, and I have to try again to login to my desktop. Often I have to try 2-3 times before I get to my desktop. Is this a known bug?
[18:32] <charlie-tca> As I recall, it is reported, but I may be wrong.
[18:33] <charlie-tca> They said the karmic screensaver was fixed, too, but it has not worked yet here
[18:34] <superos> Where is the xubuntu bug issue tracker? are they using the same as ubuntu?
[18:34] <charlie-tca> yes, launchpad
[18:35] <superos> charlie-tca: ty
[18:35] <charlie-tca> welcome
[19:07] <DasBlub> charlie-tca: the normal one from xfce (i think it's called xfwm4 ?)
[19:14] <DasBlub> btw, another question: using network manager (in xfce) i can connect to my wlan which is secured with wpa (wpa-psk), but with wpa_supplicant it doesn't work (i want it to be connected also when i'm not logged in to the x-server session as i'm often using only the console). can someone explain me, how to set up wpa_supplicant correctly? i've been searching the whole day for that but i can't...
[19:14] <DasBlub> ...find a solution :/
[19:14] <DasBlub> i always get "Association request to the driver failed"
[19:28] <gnat_x> is the alternate install cd also a live cd?
[19:28] <gnat_x> i need to get into a drive from another machine, so i need a live cd with lvm.
[19:29] <TheSheep> gnat_x: not exactly livecd, it doesn't have a usable system on it, just a shell and basic commands
[19:29] <gnat_x> shell is fine.
[19:30] <TheSheep> not sure if lvm is not loaded by the installer during the installation
[19:30] <gnat_x> as long as i can mount the disc, and maybe ssh.
[19:31] <DasBlub> the alternate cd has a shell
[19:32] <DasBlub> but i'm unsure if you've to start the setup and then abort at the first possibility and then select the shell or if you can already select it at the bootscreen
[19:39] <charlie-tca> DasBlub: the network manager is a gui, so it will only work with the X-server running
[19:39] <DasBlub> yes, that's my problem :)
[19:39] <DasBlub> that's why i'm poking around with wpa_supplicant
[19:39] <charlie-tca> You will need to create the proper files for wpa-supplicant, takes a lot of reading, if I remember right.
[19:40] <charlie-tca> I haven't tried it since Ubuntu 5.10
[19:40] <DasBlub> yes, i'm playing around with that file.. but i can't connect :/
[19:40] <DasBlub> i always get "Association request to the driver failed"
[19:40] <charlie-tca> You probably have to do an ifup eth0 or wlan0
[19:41] <charlie-tca> you have to do all the work of network manager connecting, including the ifup and ifdown commands
[19:41] <charlie-tca> pain in the ???
[19:43] <DasBlub> oh yes, it is pain :(
[19:44] <DasBlub> hm, my interface is up and running, that i can see
[19:44] <charlie-tca> some things never change, I guess
[19:44] <DasBlub> i can even do an iwlist on it and i can see my wlan in there
[19:45] <charlie-tca> My guess would be to look in the server documentation. It should tell how to get that working without a gui
[19:46] <charlie-tca> Maybe here: https://help.ubuntu.com/8.04/serverguide/C/index.html
[19:48] <DasBlub> hm, i doubt so... i don't know any server using wlan :/
[19:49] <charlie-tca> hmmm; probably right, too
[19:49] <charlie-tca> but, server could be both, wired and wireless
[19:51] <charlie-tca> hmmm, lucid is failing to restart in VirtualBox
[19:51] <DasBlub> if gave me an error, that there's no wlan0 interface, altough i can see it with iwconfig and ifconfig. i've added it to /etc/network/interfaces (just copied the eth0 entry) and now it does dhcpclient... and ofc that doesn't work :/
[19:52] <charlie-tca> Where does it get the ip address?
[19:52] <DasBlub> s/if/ifup/
[19:52] <DasBlub> DHCP server
[19:52] <charlie-tca> then going through dhcpclient should work?
[19:52] <DasBlub> the router is also the wlan access point and the dhcp server and all that stuff
[19:53] <DasBlub> it *should*, yes. but already wpa_supplicant can't connect to the network ("Association request to the driver failed"), so it can't request an IP
[19:53] <charlie-tca> You will have to disconnect the wired interface maybe to get the wireless working
[19:53] <charlie-tca> Ohhh
[19:54] <DasBlub> but network-manager works too when i have both enabled ?
[19:54] <charlie-tca> you got to add all the ssid and wireless stuff into the /etc/network/interfaces file for wlan0 to use it
[19:54] <DasBlub> oh, so it isn't enough to add that to /etc/wpa_supplicant.conf and then give that file to wpa_supplicant?
[19:55] <charlie-tca> I don't think so, not to get the interface to connect. That should be for the password.
[19:55] <DasBlub> i wrote my wpa_supplicant.conf according to the examples in the man-page and on the websites and then i just started "wpa_supplicant -D wext -i wlan0 -c /etc/wpa_supplicant.conf"
[19:55] <charlie-tca> but you still need the interfaces file to work
[19:56] <charlie-tca> and I think it needs to know about the wpa_supplicant.conf file, but I may be wrong now
[19:57] <charlie-tca> Well, I gotta go shovel snow now. good luck
[19:59] <gnat_x> it does need to know about the conf file.
[20:00] <DasBlub> i've added it now
[20:00] <DasBlub> damn... killall with the wrong arguments is bad... *restarts computer* :S
[20:01] <gnat_x> woops.
[20:01] <gnat_x> DasBlub: does your conf file have one of these "ctrl_interface=/var/run/wpa_supplicant"
[20:02] <DasBlub> yes, in wpa_supplicant.conf
[20:02] <gnat_x> also is the network that you are trying to connect to wpa, or open?
[20:02] <DasBlub> the network is using WPA2 (WPA-PSK)
[20:02] <gnat_x> and your conf has the info from wpa-passphrase?
[20:04] <DasBlub> yes
[20:04] <gnat_x> that's generally all i've ever needed to make mine work, so i'm prett close to out of ideas. :(
[20:05] <DasBlub> :'(
[20:05] <DasBlub> why is there no make_it_work.sh ? :P
[20:06] <DasBlub> (it would most likely only contain a simple 'echo "do it yourself!"' :( )
[20:06] <DasBlub> grml... i'll stick with network-manager until i figure out, how to do it with wpa_supplicant :S
[20:14] <DasBlub> i've now added all options to /etc/networking/interfaces (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=263136&page=8 post #74) but when i do /etc/init.d/networking restart, eth0 works fine but wlan0 still doesn't work :/
[20:14] <DasBlub> it keeps on DHCPDISCOVER but can't connect
[20:15] <kidko> Anybody know why my system beep won't work in XFCE? If I go to one of the virtual terminals (CTRL+ALT+F1, for example) 'echo -e "\a"' *does* give me a bell; no such luck in the GUI though
[20:26] <DasBlub> LOL. i got it working :)
[20:26] <TheSheep> kidko: man xset
[20:26] <DasBlub> i just dropped almost all options from the co
[20:26] <DasBlub> *config file
[20:27] <DasBlub> now, my wpa_supplicant.conf only contains ssid, key_mgmt and psk in the network-section and the /etc/network/interfaces contains only the path to the wpa_supplicant.conf for the wlan0 interface =)
[20:30] <DasBlub> damn... after a reboot it doesn't work anymore :S
[20:34] <slow-motion> hi
[20:41] <DasBlub> well... i'll stick with network-manager until i find a solution for it -.-
[20:50] <DasBlub> how can i modify softkeys from my laptop? most of them work (volume +/-) but some have a little problem, e.g. the mute button works to mute, but when i press again, it doesn't unmute but it does mute again (the notify icon pops up again)
[20:51] <Dracari> im going to use xubuntu on my older machine (a Dell workstation model) 500MHZ 256MBram) which version of xubuntu should i use?
[20:56]  * Dracari waits
[20:56] <Sysi> 256 isn't much but at least 8.04 worked well with that
[20:57] <Dracari> itd be better w/ xubuntu than XP
[20:57] <Sysi> a lot
[20:59] <Dracari> i see two versions on the US mirror 8.04 and 8.04.1 which i should use?
[21:08] <Pres-Gas> Dracari, I would use the 8.04.1 as it has many of the updates since 8.04 rolled into it.  Less downloading.
[21:09] <Dracari> thanks Pres-Gas and Sysi
[21:25] <balvonas> Dracari: i think it's better for you to pick up a different distribution, that is designed to run on that type of "typewriting" machines
[21:25] <balvonas> ;]
[21:26] <balvonas> xubuntu will use all of your 256MB of ram
[21:26] <Dracari> well i only have 1 black cd left what would you suggest?
[21:27] <balvonas> i think you can read about salix, zenwalk
[21:27] <knome> !minimal | Dracari
[21:27] <knome> Dracari, that might be a good choice for one cd only
[21:28] <knome> Dracari, at least you wouldn't be tied to one "flavor"
[21:30] <balvonas> well, i had that kind of computer, and i can say that slack based distributions runs a little faster
[21:30] <balvonas> and more responsive
[21:31] <Dracari> ok
[21:31] <Sysi> i had xubuntu 8.04 with 256mb, ran very well
[21:31] <Sysi> lubuntu or crunchbang could still be better
[21:32] <knome> well, ram is cheap now and if there is any way to upgrade it...
[21:32] <balvonas> good point
[21:32] <Sysi> old ram isn't :/
[21:33] <knome> Sysi, it is. come get dozens of free chips from me
[21:33] <knome> and really, upping from 256 to 512 would bring a few years more lifetime for the old pc
[21:34] <knome> if there's no way you can buy a new one or just want to keep one for browsing or if your parents just need a pc to write documents or...
[21:35] <Dracari> i think this dell workstation can handle 512MB just i dont have the ram unless i ruip it out of my old PPC imac
[21:37] <Dracari> i dont use it much (the imac) but still as it Is a usable pc im hesiant of yanking out ram expecially as it runs OSX Tiger
[22:07] <spanky1980> warning irc noob here.... I have a question about xubuntu, am I in the right place?
[22:07] <Sysi> yes
[22:09] <spanky1980> cool!  I've got ubuntu 9.04 and every logout/ login the display resolution is set to 800X600, frustrating as all get out, how do make my display cutomization stick?
[22:36] <likemindead> What's your graphics hardware, spanky1980?
[22:36] <spanky1980> vmware esx 3.5.1
[22:43] <knome> spanky1980, have you installed the guest tools?
[22:44] <spanky1980> that's a good point, in short NO guest tools are not installed.  Maybe I should start there... I'll try the install again, I'm thinking there where some errors preventing the installation
[22:44] <knome> ;)
[22:46] <spanky1980> i found a walk through @ help.ubuntu.com/community/VMware/Tools
[22:46] <knome> yeah
[22:46] <spanky1980> the menu command to install into VM just doesn't work
[22:46] <likemindead> Sorry, I've never used VMware...
[22:47] <knome> i've never used vmware to run linux guests
[22:48] <knome> spanky1980, "You should see a mounted CD image show up on the desktop."
[22:48] <knome> spanky1980, did that happen or not?
[22:48] <spanky1980> no don't see it yet
[22:49] <knome> see the page and look for the manual way to mount the cd
[22:49] <knome> it's right below
[22:50] <spanky1980> I had my VM settings pointing to an ISO... switched it back to client drive and now I see the VMware Tools disk
[22:50] <knome> ;)
[22:53] <spanky1980> i'd really like to be able to cut and past in to this machine... :)
[22:59] <spanky1980> I'm seeing : None of the pre-built vmmemctl modules for VMware Tools is suitalbe for your running kernel.  Do you want this program to try to build the vmmemctl module for your system?
[22:59] <spanky1980> not metioned in the walk through... anybody seen it?
[23:00] <spanky1980> same for vmhgfs module
[23:01] <spanky1980> ditto vmxnet
[23:01] <spanky1980> vmblock
[23:09] <knome> just build then
[23:09] <knome> *them
[23:09] <knome> i've had that, no problem
[23:09] <knome> building works fine


[06:02] <ioxon> Greetings!
[06:03] <ioxon> Anyone here able to help me find something in Ubuntu where I can change the monitor driver - preferrably like you can with YaST in SuSE
[06:03] <ioxon> ?
[10:21] <ibmt23> hi, ubuntu work perfectly on my ibm t23


[12:52] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[12:58] <santa_> hi BluesKaj
[12:59] <BluesKaj> hi santa_
[17:03] <Eickmeyer> santa_, RikMills: Did either of you see this? https://invent.kde.org/plasma/plasma-workspace/-/commit/6379d1ec8d4a1fce141280eead930a6cdd9282d1
[17:03] <Eickmeyer> Seems pretty important for a patch.
[19:49] <santa_> Eickmeyer: I got the mail, patch included
[19:49] <santa_> thanks for noticing
[19:49] <Eickmeyer> santa_: Sweet, thanks.
[21:57] <magic_ninja> did some major libs get updated?
[21:57] <magic_ninja> I've had two electron apps fail (steam and discord) and am having other stuff fail to start (caprine)
[22:14] <magic_ninja> here is what I'm getting on caprine and discord: [5084:0907/171330.632633:FATAL:gpu_data_manager_impl_private.cc(442)] GPU process isn't usable. Goodbye.


[00:00] <doko> any reason for the differences?
[00:01] <xnox> doko: you should compare with http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/html/html/python3.3-4.html on ubuntu side i think.
[00:02] <doko> xnox, why two sets of pages?
[00:02] <xnox> doko: because you asked me for the second one =)
[00:02] <xnox> doko: we appear to be diverged on the syntax with debian... do you want one that matches theirs?
[00:02] <doko> no
[00:03] <doko> just wanted to understand why the first ubuntu url was showing things that seemed odd
[00:13] <tkamppeter> doko, no, I was completely into mobile printing, see https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/client-1305-printing-stack-with-mobile-in-mind. I did not try to test s-c-p on Python3.
[00:14] <tkamppeter> pitti, how far has the GNOME tool advanced? Is it ready for replacing s-c-p's GUI? Or should such stuff inm general be better done post-LTS?
[00:15] <pitti> tkamppeter: I don't know, I'm afraid
[04:00] <hyperair> has anyone successfully remapped keys using the new /etc/udev/hwdb.d stuff before?
[04:01]  * hyperair is trying to swap alt and meta on apple keyboards
[07:19] <infinity> TheMuso: The new speech-dispatcher seems to be pulling $world into main.
[07:20] <infinity> TheMuso: festival-* deps look to be the culprit.
[07:30] <dholbach> good morning
[07:31] <infinity> TheMuso: Oh, that's just because the -dbg package now depends on speech-dispatcher-festival ... We can probably just drop the -dbg out of main to solve that.
[07:32] <infinity> TheMuso: (Will do that now)
[07:40] <rbasak> cjwatson: (re: php-json) I see it. Thank you! For next time, apart from some foresight and advance warning, is there anything else I could have done to cause less pain? I understand that an archive admin was needed to unstick it; is there anything I could have done to not get it stuck in the first place?
[08:18] <tvoss> infinity, around?
[08:18] <infinity> tvoss: Vaguely.  What's up?
[08:49] <Saviq> pitti, hey, Q: so there's a bunch of ddebs in http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/pool/universe/u/unity8/ from PPAs, which are not indexed in http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/dists/trusty/universe/binary-armhf/Packages - does apport-retrace deal with that somehow?
[08:52] <zyga> hey everyone
[09:18] <tvoss> pitti, around?
[09:28] <cjwatson> rbasak: It's sometimes possible to bootstrap this kind of thing in a devirt PPA with multiple uploads, and then copy the result in.  It's not always worth it though.
[09:30] <rbasak> OK, thanks.
[09:44] <tseliot> didrocks: hi, can you accept jockey into precise-updates please? (bug #1279229)
[09:45] <didrocks> tseliot: I'm not part of the SRU team
[09:45] <tseliot> didrocks: oh, sorry
[10:00] <brendand> what's the difference between X-GNOME-Gettext-Domain and X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain in .desktop files?
[10:00] <brendand> should i use one (which one) or both?
[10:02] <brendand> dpm ^
[10:02] <seb128> brendand, we support both
[10:08] <brendand> seb128, but i guess gnome doesn't support X-Ubuntu-, so is X-GNOME- 'better' so to speak?
[10:08] <infinity> brendand: Depends on if you plan to upstream it, but yes, probably.
[10:08] <seb128> brendand, right, we added the X-Ubuntu one before, then got support accepted by GNOME iirc
[10:09] <seb128> so yeah, use X-GNOME
[10:34]  * cjwatson uses http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/mp/ in production code
[10:34] <cjwatson> Or at least a small amount of it :-)
[11:49] <smoser> pitti, have you verified cloud image fixed?
[11:54] <bluesabre> I know it's crunch time around here, but could somebody please review https://bugs.launchpad.net/light-locker-settings/+bug/1281536 ?
[11:54] <bluesabre> ochosi ^
[11:55] <bluesabre> Seeking sponsorship for the above package, which will ship in xubuntu 14.04 assuming it can make it to the archive prior to FF
[11:57] <ochosi> yup, +1 on that ^
[11:57] <ochosi> would be great to get it in
[12:10] <hakermania> What is the process of uploading a new version of an app into the repos?
[12:20] <shadeslayer> tseliot: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-drivers-common/+bug/1282059
[12:41] <doko> jtaylor, did you start looking at https://github.com/PyTables/PyTables/pull/311/commits ?
[12:52] <tseliot> shadeslayer: you might want to ask pitti about that
[13:03] <shadeslayer> pitti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-drivers-common/+bug/1282059
[13:03] <doko> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/166754677/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-amd64.libpeas_1.8.1-2ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[13:03] <doko> DEB_MAKE_CHECK_TARGET unset, not running checks
[13:03] <doko> HOME=/build/buildd/libpeas-1.8.1 xvfb-run /usr/bin/make check
[13:03] <doko> xvfb-run: error: Xvfb failed to start
[13:03] <doko> make: *** [build/libpeas-1.0-0] Error 1
[13:04] <doko> mlankhorst, ^^^ any known issues with xvfb?
[13:04] <mlankhorst> doko: yeah it tends to die when building xorg-server
[13:04] <mlankhorst> for no good reason
[13:05] <doko> so give back until the build succeeds?
[13:06] <mlankhorst> erm say again?
[13:25] <doko> dholbach, the synced nmap ftbfs on arm64 again
[13:28] <caribou> I need to tell the duplicity package in Trusty that it breaks deja-dup versions prior to trusty
[13:28] <caribou> deja-dup in Saucy is 27.3.1-0ubuntu1 and I added a "Breaks: (<= 27.3.1 ) in duplicity's control file but it doesn't seem to work
[13:29] <caribou> am I missing something ? (I guess I do)
[13:32] <cjwatson> You need a package name there, not just a version
[13:32] <cjwatson> And I suspect << is more appropriate than <=
[13:32] <cjwatson> So Breaks: deja-dup (<< 27.3.1)
[13:33] <cjwatson> Actually, that's not right either
[13:33] <cjwatson> I see you want to break the version in saucy, and 27.3.1 is less than 27.3.1-0ubuntu1
[13:34] <cjwatson> I suggest you find out exactly which version broke, at a finer grain than "prior to trusty" - that is, find out exactly which deja-dup version you need
[13:34] <caribou> cjwatson: I know, that's the first thing I tested
[13:35] <caribou> then anything before and including 27.3.1-0ubuntu1
[13:35] <caribou> cjwatson: ^^
[13:35] <cjwatson> That's not logically correct
[13:35] <cjwatson> At some point, deja-dup acquired the fix you need
[13:35] <cjwatson> It wasn't in anything infinitesimally after 27.3.1-0ubuntu1
[13:35] <cjwatson> It's quite possible that somebody has a 27.3.1-0ubuntu1ppa1 in some PPA, for instance, and you would want to break that too
[13:36] <cjwatson> This is why you need to know the version where the change you need was introduced
[13:36] <cjwatson> Am I making sense here?
[13:36] <caribou> cjwatson: the fix is in deja-dup 29.5-0ubuntu2 (version in trusty)
[13:36] <cjwatson> Was it introduced in exactly that version?
[13:36] <cjwatson> The rm-full-path thing?
[13:37] <cjwatson> That doesn't look right, that claims to be the fix for a DEP-8 test ...
[13:37] <caribou> cjwatson: yes; and I need to backport it to saucy & precise
[13:37] <caribou> cjwatson: the DEP-8 was in the same commit afaik
[13:37] <cjwatson> And the DEP-8 test wasn't even in precise
[13:38] <cjwatson> Could you give more detail?  Which upstream commit are we talking about?
[13:38] <caribou> cjwatson: the revision history is a bit tedious upstream (3 commits to solve the problem)
[13:38] <cjwatson> I'm hoping you'll tell me what the problem is :)
[13:39] <cjwatson> Because it doesn't make sense to me that we'd need Breaks for just a test failure - so it must be something else
[13:39] <caribou> cjwatson: 1527, 1528 and 1529 upstream
[13:39] <caribou> cjwatson: duplicity in trusty introduces a locking mechanism based on a locfile in the cache directory
[13:40] <caribou> cjwatson: deja-dup may not handle the lockfile properly prior to the version in trusty (those 3 commits do remove the lockfile)
[13:41] <cjwatson> OK, this makes more sense.  From duplicity's point of view, it just needs 29.5
[13:41] <caribou> cjwatson: it is a remote possibility (like if the user does kill -9 on deja-dup) but it may happen
[13:41] <cjwatson> (-0ubuntu2 was further cleanup, but doesn't have compatibility relevance here)
[13:41] <cjwatson> So I would advise Breaks: deja-dup (<< 29.5)
[13:42] <caribou> cjwatson: ok, make sense; now how do I handle the backport of that 'evolution' to Saucy and Precise ?
[13:42] <cjwatson> In the backports, you will need different Breaks versioning
[13:42] <cjwatson> Breaks: deja-dup (<< first-backported-version-containing-the-fix)
[13:43] <caribou> cjwatson: ah, ok I get it. But does the version needs to include the 0ubuntu{something} suffix ?
[13:43] <cjwatson> (Assuming you aren't going to backport the entire new upstream)
[13:43] <caribou> cjwatson: no, just that small fix
[13:43] <cjwatson> For the backport, yes.  For trusty, no
[13:44] <caribou> cjwatson: ok, makes total sense to me. I'll worry about trusty for now as I want it in before the freeze
[13:44] <caribou> cjwatson: thanks a lot
[13:44] <cjwatson> (Generally, things work better if you keep the specification minimal, so just the upstream version if you can; but that won't work for the backport)
[13:44] <cjwatson> np
[13:45] <cjwatson> Going back to the original example you gave, it *is* important to understand that <= 27.3.1 does not match 27.3.1-something
[13:46] <cjwatson> You can use dpkg --compare-versions to check:
[13:46] <cjwatson> $ if dpkg --compare-versions 27.3.1-0ubuntu1 le 27.3.1; then echo yes; else echo no; fi
[13:46] <cjwatson> no
[13:49] <caribou> cjwatson: hmm great test; I'll write it down somewhere
[14:40] <dholbach> seb128, does the existence of https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8-desktop-session mean that the package was uploaded already?
[14:40] <seb128> dholbach, uploaded to a ppa yes
[14:40] <dholbach> ah ok
[14:41] <dholbach> doko, I followed up on the sync request - thanks
[14:42] <doko> dholbach, fix uploaded
[14:42] <dholbach> doko, yep, I pointed that out on the bug - thanks a lot
[14:42] <xnox> dholbach: or e.g. a branch is pushed =) like i now did -> lp:~xnox/ubuntu/trusty/dholbach/rules resulted in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dholbach
[14:43] <dholbach> xnox, so people can start filing bugs on 'dholbach' - great
[14:44] <Laney> heh
[14:45] <xnox> dholbach: [needspackaging]
[14:45] <xnox> =)
[14:46] <xnox> dholbach: actually that's very good for needs packaging bugs. push an empty branch to create package, then copy ITP from debian or file needs-packaging bug, but at least then you can close the needs-packaging bug with first upload.
[14:47] <dholbach> yeah, that's right :)
[15:25] <ritz> Sweetsha1k, hi, any thoughts on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-advantage/+bug/1275574
[15:30] <seb128> ritz, have your seen sarnold comment on that bug? seems an accurate summary of where Ubuntu stands on the question
[15:31] <ritz> seb128, hmm, thanks . so, we could ship this be default, but turned off
[15:31] <seb128> right
[15:32] <ritz> thanks a ton
[15:43] <hallyn> jibel: oh yay, thanks for commit 84 to auto-upgrade-testing (fixing python3/distroinfo)  :)
[15:46] <jibel> hey hallyn, yw
[16:39] <seb128> bdmurray, hey, did you have any chance finding why retracings often don't work for e.u.c trusty reports?
[16:39] <pitti> Good morning
[16:39] <bdmurray> seb128: not specifically, I did notice that the trusty version of gdb often produces better results than the precise one
[16:40] <bdmurray> seb128: I think that's a corner case though
[16:40] <pitti> Saviq: when did unity8 get uploaded? index generation takes a few hours
[16:40] <pitti> tvoss: hey
[16:40] <seb128> bdmurray, the retracers run precise?
[16:40] <bdmurray> seb128: the ones for errors do
[16:41] <pitti> smoser: no, I'm afraid not: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/trusty-adt-setup-testbed/123/ARCH=amd64,label=wazn-adt/console
[16:41] <seb128> bdmurray, can you have access to one of the reports and try to retrace manually to see if that hits an error?
[16:41] <Saviq> pitti, well there's only one version in the indexes anyway, while the packages come from PPAs, so I assume they'd never end up in the index, would they?
[16:42] <pitti> Saviq: ah; yes, if they are not in the distro, then they won't get indexed
[16:42] <pitti> Saviq: and they will also get cleaned up again, as they really ought to live in the PPA only
[16:42] <mapreri> dholbach: sorry, but I can't reproduce the bug you reported against liferea. I can start it even on a clean install on virtualbox...
[16:42] <Saviq> pitti, indeed, any pointers on how to retrace .crashes from PPAs? can I download the ddebs and put them in the cache somewhere? would that help at all?
[16:43] <bdmurray> seb128: I'll see what I can do
[16:44] <pitti> Saviq: they should be in the PPA's Packages, are they not?
[16:44] <pitti> Saviq: then, if you add an apt source for them it should Just Work
[16:44] <dholbach> mapreri, maybe it doesn't work if you have preferences stored locally from a previous version?
[16:44] <Saviq> pitti, ah are they?
[16:45] <Saviq> pitti, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6960750/ doesn't look like it
[16:46] <seb128> bdmurray, thanks
[16:47] <smoser> pitti, yeah, i see that.
[16:47] <smoser> so the 20140219 build is just not marked current
[16:47] <smoser> utlemming, ^
[16:47] <smoser> http://cloud-images.ubuntu.com/trusty/current/ is 20140218,
[16:48] <smoser> did publish to ec2 fail ?
[16:50] <mapreri> dholbach: I don't think so: I had a previous configuration from a quite old installation (during quantal maybe) and worked fine (after that I delete all config file to see what happen on a new installation). Can you try with a guest user to exclude user config issues (or confirm)?
[16:50] <dholbach> mapreri, hah! now it works! :)
[16:51] <dholbach> I have no idea what happened in the meantime
[16:51] <mapreri> dholbach: automagically?
[16:51] <dholbach> sorry for the noise - maybe it was intermittent
[16:51] <dholbach> but I just started it again, just to try - because I had tried it at least 4-5 times earlier
[16:51] <dholbach> now it works
[16:52] <mapreri> dholbach: is the messaging menu working fine? (I had some trouble during the merging..)
[16:52] <dholbach> mapreri, this is really bizarre
[16:53] <dholbach> mapreri, yep, it works
[16:53] <dholbach> mapreri, let me close the bug again
[16:53] <dholbach> thanks for your work on this!
[16:53] <mapreri> dholbach: yeah, casual failures are always "weired"
[16:54] <dholbach> mapreri, if it should ever act up again, I'll let you know! :)
[16:54] <mapreri> dholbach: good! let's go on with another piece of software :)
[16:54] <dholbach> :)
[17:15] <pitti> smoser, utlemming: yep, jibel forced a manual build with 0219 instead of /current, works fine again
[17:17] <smoser> pitti, k. thanks.
[17:18] <smoser> pitti, so is this a test taht coudl get done in a dep-8 package test ?
[17:18] <smoser> i'd have to download the image, patch in the new cloud-init and then boot it.
[17:18] <pitti> smoser: you mean s/i/it/ ?
[17:18] <smoser> which is all reasonably well do able. with root and kvm.
[17:19] <pitti> smoser: indeed
[17:19] <pitti> smoser: if you boot the image with a seed the first time, it modifies the image, right?
[17:20] <pitti> smoser: but even at the second time cloud-init is still active and needs the seed, so it would still be an useful test
[17:20] <smoser> well, with root i'd just place it in
[17:20] <pitti> smoser: or wait, we could qemu-nbd mount the image, schroot in, dpkg -i the new cloud image
[17:20] <pitti> and then boot it
[17:20] <smoser> right.
[17:21] <smoser> i'd use mount-image-callback as that is why it exists. but that is somethign that is doable ?
[17:21] <smoser> ie, its ok to require nbd kernel module loaded, access to root and to kvm ?
[17:21] <pitti> ah, I wasn't aware of mount-image-callback, that sounds interesting
[17:21] <smoser> i told you about it on your blog!
[17:21] <pitti> smoser: yes, it is
[17:21] <smoser> you should at least read your *own* blog :)
[17:22] <pitti> heh; sorry, forgot about it
[17:22] <pitti> smoser: so yes, as long as this test runs in a full qemu, that'll work fine
[17:22] <pitti> qemu nests well
[17:22] <smoser> "well"
[17:22] <pitti> it won't work on arm/ppc64 in LXC containers
[17:22] <pitti> but that's ok
[17:23] <pitti> (and I'll soon add restrictions to declare which isolation level you need, it has recently been discussed in Debian)
[17:23] <smoser> we could actually test part of it though lxc, althoguh i've not done it.
[17:23] <smoser> you should be able to create a loop block device, and then present that to the container.
[17:23] <smoser> thanks
[17:24] <pitti> yes, but without nbd and qemu it's virtually impossible to mout and modify a qcow image
[17:25] <pitti> smoser: but I don't expect the cloud-init/seed logic to be much platform specific, is it?
[17:25] <pitti> i. e. testing it on x86 initially should be by and large sufficient
[17:27] <smoser> pitti, right. its not arch specific.
[17:28] <smoser> you dont need qemu to do qemu-nbd
[17:28] <smoser> anyway. thanks
[17:30] <pitti> smoser: right, but you need root, and modprobe nbd, which you don't have in lxc
[17:30] <pitti> (you have root, but not modprobe)
[17:37] <jtaylor> doko: pinged the maintainer about pytables
[17:41] <pitti> hm, so pyzmq, dh_python, ubuntu-release-upgrader, and perhaps some other tests are now broken with py 3.4 as a default
[17:41] <cjwatson> pitti: With pygobject/gi, is there any way to annotate a GVariant* parameter such that Python keyword arguments or maybe a Python dictionary get translated to/from a GVariant automatically, or do I have to write wrapper code for that?
[17:42] <pitti> cjwatson: there is no implicit conversion, but there is an override class for GLib.Variant which makes this relatively easy
[17:43] <pitti> https://git.gnome.org/browse/pygobject/tree/tests/test_overrides_glib.py#n11
[17:43] <jtaylor> pitti: pyzmq just needs a rebuild
[17:43] <jtaylor> I'm on it
[17:43] <pitti> cjwatson: or rather, https://git.gnome.org/browse/pygobject/tree/tests/test_overrides_glib.py#n64
[17:43] <jtaylor> just checking the build failure on ppc
[17:43] <pitti> jtaylor: ah, thanks
[17:43] <jtaylor> zeromq
[17:44] <jtaylor> ipython is also in works
[17:44] <cjwatson> pitti: GLib.Variant("a{ss}", {"foo": "bar"}) and suchlike?
[17:44] <pitti> cjwatson: i. e. it's GLib.Variant(signature, pydict)
[17:44] <pitti> cjwatson: right
[17:44] <cjwatson> pitti: OK, that'll do, thanks; just the first time I've written a library with gobject-introspection support and I wanted to check I wasn't missing something cleverer
[17:46] <cjwatson> Looks like roughly 3x/4x lines of code in C vs. Python, which I suppose isn't *terrible*
[17:49] <smoser> pitti, ah. ok. that makes sense.
[17:49] <hallyn> rbasak: uvt-simplestreams-libvirt sync release=quantal arch=i386   fails?
[17:50] <hallyn> maybe i'm in a bad state...  this doesn't make sense
[17:51] <hallyn> rbasak: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6961095/  does that look familiar to you?
[17:52] <rbasak> hallyn: not seen that before, no. otp right now.
[17:52] <hallyn> rbasak: kthx
[17:57] <jtaylor> fun zeromq does nto fail in debian ppc porterbox ._.
[17:58] <jtaylor> I assume we still don't have ubuntu porterboxes?
[18:02] <hallyn> Hm, update/reboot didn't help, and even  uvt-simplestreams-libvirt sync release=saucy arch=amd64 dies
[18:05] <pitti> fginther, barry: hey guys, how are you? greetings from Oakland!
[18:05] <pitti> fginther, barry: would you mind giving me a quick heads-up about the current state of running py3 ap tests in CI?
[18:06] <barry> pitti: hi!
[18:06] <pitti> fginther, barry: AFAIUI, there were some blockers to that a few weeks ago
[18:06] <pitti> I suppose once we can run py3 autopilot tests in CI at all, then the rest is just relatively simple porting that parallelizes well
[18:06] <barry> pitti, fginther yeah, unfortunately i got totally sidetracked on a deep image upgrade issue.  but i think i have fixes for that now and plan on getting back to py3 ap
[18:06] <pitti> and we'd like to do that on the sprint this afternoon
[18:07] <barry> pitti: i have many ports in progress.  we need the ci infrastructure to support it.  xnox iirc landed phablet-test-run changes and i have some autopilot changes that thomi has looked at and needs fixing.  once we get the autopilot reexec branch landed, we can port individual tests one at a time
[18:08] <pitti> barry: ah, so phablet-test-run is done
[18:08] <pitti> re-execing ap sounds a bit scary :)
[18:08] <barry> pitti: double check with xnox
[18:09] <barry> pitti: naw, not scary!  clever and fun! :)
[18:09] <pitti> barry: ah, you don't want tests to declare themselves whether they use py2 or 3?
[18:09] <barry> pitti: (like just a few lines of code)
[18:09] <pitti> barry: hehe, h4cks 4r3 us ☺
[18:09] <barry> pitti: we thought about that, but it's just temporary.  we *really* want everything ported to py3 by 14.04
[18:09] <pitti> barry: yes, understood
[18:09] <pitti> barry: ok, thank you!
[18:10] <barry> pitti: np!  thanks for helping get the ci infrastructure working.  please let me know how that goes
[18:10] <pitti> barry: I thought there was also some discussion about eliminating py2/3 from the installation, and building a chroot/virtualenv in $HOME for installing AP and the tests, or so?
[18:11] <pitti> barry: hm, I can't see that on https://code.launchpad.net/autopilot/+activereviews
[18:11] <barry> pitti: that was part of the "make tests work in read-only image and don't include autopilot in the sdk".  fginther and thomi might be able to answer that better. we had discussions about it in london, and came with some ideas, but i don't know what they decided
[18:12] <barry> pitti: thomi put the mp on hold, which is why that doesn't show up: https://code.launchpad.net/~barry/autopilot/reexec/+merge/203765
[18:12] <pitti> barry: ah, so ATM we still have both and thus this ^ is independent from porting tests and making AP do the "guess which py version I want" trick
[18:12] <pitti> ah
[18:13] <barry> right
[18:13] <pitti> barry: TBH I'm not that thrilled about that blatant violation of the py3 packaging policy by shipping both versions in python-autopilot
[18:14] <pitti> as that's not just a temporary hack but a long-term commitment (we can basically never clean that up without breakage)
[18:14] <pitti> barry: what's bad about having separate python3-autopilot* packages?
[18:14] <barry> pitti: there is a python3-autopilot package, right?
[18:14] <pitti> barry: yes, but I thought that MP removed it
[18:15] <pitti> This also collapses all the python3-* packages into the python-* packages. This supports a transition where we'll eventually delete all Python 2 support.
[18:15] <pitti> barry: I think that does quite the opposite
[18:15] <pitti> with separate py2/3 packages it is much easier to remove py2 support without breakage
[18:15] <barry> pitti: hmm.  i thought it would be easy to just remove /usr/bin/autopilot
[18:15] <barry> (from the python-autopilot package)
[18:16] <pitti> barry: but from the reverse depends of that hybrid python-autopilot you can never be quite sure whether they expect py2 or 3
[18:17] <thomi> barry: if you need that branch merged, ping me, and I'll have a look at adding the tests that are required. It was put on hold because it regressed test coverage :)
[18:17] <barry> pitti: i think i may have had other reasons for doing that too, but that's all been swapped out since london :/  please do me a favor and add a comment to the mp.  as long as we keep focused on getting rid of py2 on the phone, i'm for whatever makes the transition work best.
[18:17] <thomi> but it sounds like there's some discussion that still needs to happen
[18:18] <barry> thomi: yep, will do.  i really hope i can get back to that this week.
[18:18] <thomi> ok
[18:18] <pitti> barry: python3-autopilot could divert python-autopilot's /usr/bin/autopilot as long as it has your "reexec with py2" trick?
[18:18] <pitti> if /usr/bin/autopilot-py3 is not working for some reason
[18:19] <pitti> barry: ack, will do
[18:19] <barry> pitti: thanks.  i'm multi-multi-tasking atm ;)
[18:21] <barry> lifeless: http://bugs.python.org/issue20687
[18:22] <lifeless> barry: yay
[18:23] <barry> lifeless: yeah.  at least it's reported now.  given the changeset and age of the change, i'm not optimistic this will be fixed before 3.4 final :(
[18:23] <barry> *maybe* by 3.4.1, but by then, you're kind of screwed
[18:24] <pitti> barry: followed up
[18:25] <lifeless> barry: I'd call this a regression though; whats the process for dealing with regressions?
[18:26] <barry> lifeless: i would too.  if it's a critical regression, then it could hold up rc2.  you'd have to convince larry hastings (3.4 rm) about that.  probably a post on python-dev if you think it's critical enough, and bump the priority to release blocker
[18:26] <pitti> xnox: so what does phablet-test-run do these days in terms of py2 vs. 3?
[18:27] <lifeless> barry: well you must have opinions too ;) - what do you think, a break in a public API ?
[18:28] <barry> lifeless: that's the question - was testtools relying on documented public api, or implementation details.  i probably have an opinion, but right now my stack is too deep and i get a recursion error when i try to access it :)
[18:29] <barry> lifeless: so i would recommend commenting on the bug stating the public api that got broke.  if you need me to ping larry, i can do that, but not sure i'll have the resources to chime in
[18:29] <barry> *cycles
[18:33] <lifeless> barry: btw I'm rbcollins in the tracker
[18:33] <barry> lifeless: ah, that's why i couldn't find you ;)
[18:35] <lifeless> commented
[18:36] <lifeless> thomi: are you working up a patch to fix Python3.4?
[18:37] <barry> lifeless: i nosied larry and bumped it to release blocker
[18:56] <pitti> xnox, barry: so thomi and I just discussed this, and we think the main problem that's left is how tests declare that they got ported to py3
[18:57] <pitti> xnox, barry: for packaged tests we could check their deps, but that doesn't work for click and tests from bzr (which apparently we need to support)
[18:57] <pitti> xnox, barry: so we found that it might be easiest to just add a magic comment or a global _AP_PY3 = True variable into the tests
[18:58] <pitti> xnox, barry: and then phablet-test-run or /usr/bin/autopilot could check that and call autopilot-py3 (for p-t-r) or run python[3] -m autopilot (for /u/b/ap)
[18:59] <pitti> xnox, barry: that ought to work for all scenarios, is explicit (i. e. we can measure/check the porting status), and we can drop that flag variable in the future again
[18:59] <pitti> xnox, barry: we can also have a hangout if you wish
[19:04] <pitti> I summarized that in https://code.launchpad.net/~barry/autopilot/reexec/+merge/203765
[19:05] <rbasak> hallyn: looks like maybe you have a corrupt or missing file in /var/lib/uvtool/libvirt/metadata/
[19:05] <rbasak> hallyn: that might be a bug. I'm not sure if I atomically move new files in, or write them in place.
[19:06] <rbasak> hallyn: fix: remove the offending file, and resync.
[19:09] <pitti> barry: wow, this problem violates the laws of projectivity; it becomes bigger the closer you get to it :(
[19:10] <barry> pitti: i need to be afk for a while.  can you set up a hangout with you, me, xnox, and thomi for tomorrow?
[19:10] <hallyn> rbasak: after removing the cache i had to purge and reinstall uvtool-libvirt to get directories re-created with the right perms
[19:11] <hallyn> rbasak: but now it's building, thanks
[19:12] <pitti> barry: would tomorrow 1700 UTC work for you?
[19:14] <hallyn> rbasak: another q: is there a way to shut up the 'Warning: this CLI is experimental and may change.' ?
[19:15] <hallyn> (not very amenable to scripting)
[19:16] <pitti> barry: done
[19:54] <rbasak> hallyn: I've left a "uvt-simplestreams-libvirt purge" command that wipes all volumes (potentially breaking any existing VMs that might use them).
[19:54] <rbasak> Though it's broken in Trusty (fixed locally; I'll upload before FF)
[19:54] <hallyn> rbasak: what do you mean by 'left' ?
[19:54] <rbasak> Er, working in Trusty, broken in Precise.
[19:54] <rbasak> hallyn: as in it's there, though really intended for cleaning up after a mess; it's still a bug if a mess occurs.
[19:55] <hallyn> ok
[19:55] <hallyn> i'm slowly making progress;  now have an unbootable quantal vm, but at least i have it :)
[19:55] <rbasak> hallyn: uvtool issues? Or elsewhere?
[19:56] <hallyn> not sure.  i don't see where i had room (before this failure) to mess up the image...  but lemme try by hand
[19:56] <rbasak> About the CLI experimental warning - I'm just about ready to drop that. Also before FF.
[19:56]  * rbasak has a few more things to do today :-/
[19:58] <hallyn> rbasak: oh, it's on stderr, so i should be able to tell subprocess to ignroe it
[19:58] <rbasak> hallyn: ah yes; that's intentional for that reason.
[19:58] <hallyn> i just didn't think subprocess would give me stderr by default
[19:58] <rbasak> It does, but separately, IIRC.
[20:00] <hallyn> actually no,
[20:00] <hallyn> subprocess.check_output(["uvt-kvm", "list"], stderr=None)
[20:00] <hallyn> Warning: this CLI is experimental and may change.
[20:02] <rbasak> hallyn: None doesn't do what you think. You want:
[20:03] <rbasak> with open('/dev/null', 'wb') as null_file:
[20:03] <rbasak>   subprocess.check_output(["uvt-kvm", "list", stderr=null_file)
[20:03] <jtaylor> *nitpick* os.devnull
[20:03] <rbasak>                                             ^
[20:04] <rbasak>                                             ]                  # :)
[20:04] <rbasak> Oh, that exists?
[20:04] <jtaylor> yes but only relevant for windows
[20:04] <hallyn> rbasak: well that's a pain :)  ok, thx.  first to see why my vm wont' boot
[20:05] <rbasak> Oh I see. Just the path, rather than a file object. Thanks ;)
[20:05] <hallyn> hangs on 'booting from Hard Disk'.  maybe it's a qemu bug.
[20:05] <rbasak> hallyn: two ways to debug. --log-console-output, then look at /var/log/libvirt/qemu/<machine>.log
[20:05] <cjwatson> rbasak: There's also stderr=subprocess.STDERR, but that's new in 3.3
[20:06] <rbasak> hallyn: or, no --log-console-output, and then "virsh console <machine>" to get an interactive VT
[20:06] <cjwatson> err
[20:06] <cjwatson> stderr=subprocess.DEVNULL I mean
[20:06] <rbasak> Nice. I've always wanted that :)
[20:06] <rbasak> Getting an interactive VT with "virsh console" races VM start though I think. Should be good enough if you're ready for it though.
[20:12] <hallyn> rbasak: but so yes, uvt-kvm create xxx release=quantal arch=i386 --ssh-public-key-file ~/auto-
[20:12] <hallyn> upgrade-tester/ssh-key
[20:12] <hallyn> gives me an unbootable vm.  sigh
[20:13] <rbasak> It really shouldn't do that.
[20:13] <hallyn> mind you i'm nested
[20:14] <rbasak> How many levels?
[20:15] <rbasak> One level (of nesting) works fine for me. One additional level caused the middle kernel to hang, IIRC. I didn't experiment further.
[20:15] <hallyn> just one level - running quantal vm in a trusty vm on precise
[20:16] <jpds> You need to go deeper.
[20:17] <rbasak> Each level does appear to run at a fraction of the speed :)
[20:17] <hallyn> jpds: yup that'll solve it :)
[20:17] <hallyn> you know, if my problem is a race condition when things run too fast
[20:17]  * rbasak wonders if that's backwards
[20:30] <frafu> Hi, We have just published an update of Onboard, the default on-screen keyboard shipping with Ubuntu. Could anybody please review the debian package I prepared for trusty before feature freeze is in place? Many thanks in advance.
[20:31] <frafu> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/onboard/+bug/1282231
[20:48] <infinity> Setting up python3-minimal (3.4~rc1-1) ...
[20:48] <infinity> Exception ignored in: <bound method Popen.__del__ of <subprocess.Popen object at 0xf75c1610>>
[20:48] <infinity> Traceback (most recent call last):
[20:48] <infinity>   File "/usr/lib/python3.4/subprocess.py", line 897, in __del__
[20:48] <infinity> TypeError: 'NoneType' object is not callable
[20:48] <lifeless> classic
[20:48] <infinity> doko: ^-- I'm seeing a lot of that.  Do you know what's going on?
[20:53] <roadmr> can I get "apt-get install" to fully expand the list of unmet dependencies? e.g. it can't install X because it depends on Y, but it won't tell me why Y can't be installed (it may depend on Z which *is* uninstallable)
[21:01] <cjwatson> roadmr: Sadly AFAIK you generally just have to keep supplying additional package names from the error output until you get a useful answer
[21:01] <roadmr> cjwatson: oh bummer... that's what I'm doing but it's cumbersome :/ thanks anyway!
[21:51] <frafu> TheMuso: I suppose that we missed feature freeze with this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/onboard/+bug/1282231   ?
[23:04] <pitti> cjwatson: jibel and I believe we understand what happened last week in britney with gccgo; I just committed a test case which reproduces that: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~canonical-platform-qa/britney/tests/revision/397
[23:21] <roaksoax> has something changed packaging wise that python mpackages are installing in /usr/lib/pythonX.y/etc/etc instead of creating the symlink to /usr/share/pyshared?
[23:23] <cjwatson> roaksoax: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-defaults/2.7.5-5ubuntu3
[23:23] <cjwatson> (I think.  Yes, anyway.)
[23:24] <roaksoax> cjwatson: cool thanks!