[00:35] <neversfelde> There is a kdeui/widgets/:wq vi accident in kde4libs_4.2.96-0ubuntu2. Someone around who can fix this?
[00:36] <neversfelde> "kde4libs source: patch-system-but-direct-changes-in-diff kdeui/widgets/:wq  "
[00:42] <neversfelde> I reported a bug #398596
[01:09] <ScottK> neversfelde: nixternal uploaded that one, perhaps he should have a look.
[01:10] <neversfelde> ScottK: I will ask him, next time he's around
[01:10] <ScottK> We may have already.
[01:10] <ScottK> neversfelde: Is it breaking anything or just not the best way to do it?
[01:12] <neversfelde> ScottK: it does not break anything as far as I know, only an accidental add of a new file, I suppose
[01:13] <ScottK> neversfelde: OK, so not urgent so nixternal can fix it when he's here.
[01:13] <ScottK> Thanks.
[01:13] <neversfelde> yes
[03:00] <ScottK> New qt-creator in Debian if someone wants to look into a merge.
[04:23] <ScottK> Riddell: The sematic linker in http://people.ubuntu.com/~jriddell/akademy/akademy-2009-group-photo.html is very cool.
[05:46] <ScottK> ryanakca: I'd appreciate it if you'd apply some of your wikifoo to this page: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Netbook
[05:46] <ScottK> I can't understand why the hardware testing heading doesn't work.
[05:46] <ScottK> Feel free to make any other changes you'd think would make it better.
[07:08] <Sput> ScottK / Daskreech: with KDE integration enabled, Quassel is a proper KApplication that makes use of knotify
[07:09] <Daskreech> Sput: ok
[07:09] <Sput> if someone wants us to react to an external event properly, make sure that an appropriate signal is sent by the KNotification
[07:09] <Sput> I think we connect to activated()
[07:09] <kb9vqf> ScottK: I fixed your heading...
[07:09] <Daskreech> Sput: Yeah we covered that :) I was trying to figure out now if Kwin could duplicate that
[07:09] <Sput> current systray notification implementation fails to send a signal when clicked though :/
[07:10]  * kb9vqf thinks he did anyway
[07:10] <Sput> Daskreech: if there's anything we can do app-side, let me know.
[07:10] <Daskreech> Sput: File a bug on that :)
[07:23]  * Daskreech pokes Sput into putting in shortcuts to switch channels
[07:23] <Sput> Daskreech: ah yeah. on the agenda.
[07:24] <Sput> currently I have a hard time making KToolBars work though. they never seem to reload their settings :/
[07:24] <Daskreech> When do you want them to reload?
[07:24] <Sput> on app restart
[07:24] <Daskreech> ah yeah that might be a problem
[07:24] <Sput> so I use the context menu to e.g. change the text-under-icons thing, and it should save that and restore next time I start the app
[07:25] <Sput> even reading KDE source hasn't helped me so far :) it's stored, but not loaded again
[07:25] <Daskreech> what happens if you force it to save?
[07:25] <Daskreech> Ah it's the reading that's the problem
[07:25] <Sput> I seem to be able to save just fine, but can't restore... maybe I have trouble working with KConfigGroups though
[07:26] <Sput> so more source reading required. nice task for the day, I reckon. :)
[07:26] <Sput> hint for API developers: "silently failing" doing something and providing no way to check for errors or current state is bad
[07:26] <Daskreech> Yeppers
[07:27] <Sput> in this particular case, it's KConfigGroup silently failing to write stuff if it's in read-only mode, and not providing a way to check if it's in read-only mode
[07:28] <Sput> ah well. first finish the upgrade to 4.3.60, then try to figure out how to cope with the jetlag, then care about KToolBar again :)
[08:18] <Daskreech> hi mgraesslin
[08:18] <mgraesslin> morning Daskreech
[08:19] <Daskreech> How are you?
[08:20] <Daskreech> WE got our Kwin ranter in the kwin Chann
[08:20] <mgraesslin> omg
[08:20] <mgraesslin> something useful?
[08:21]  * Daskreech shrugs
[08:22] <Daskreech>  los of snide comments on how Kwin developers like kitchen sinks without understanding plumbing
[08:22] <Daskreech> And the idiocy of having a bug that was seen but not reported since before KDE 4.0 shipped still be in here
[08:22] <Daskreech> THen emerged val grind and cache grind
[08:23] <Daskreech> So we should probably be seeing more from hom
[08:25] <mgraesslin> hmm I will need an ignore mode ;-)
[08:32]  * jussi01 waves
[11:11] <ryanakca> ScottK: Sure, I'll get it done during a quiet time at work today...
[11:18] <ryanakca> Could somebody provide some input on bug 389245 please? I'm not sure what I should do with it, just display the last part of the title (/a/b/c -> c, in which case, if both Ubuntu/FAQ and Kubuntu/FAQ exist, it isn't glaringly obvious which one you're at... use the a/b/c format instead of abc... what else? I'm thinking of keeping the breadcrumbs since they provide an easy way to go one/two/three/... up from the current page.
[11:25] <ScottK> neversfelde: What kind of wifi did the NM widget not work with on your eee?
[11:26] <ScottK> neversfelde: If it was any kind of WEP/WPA then it's known breakage and not eeepc specific.
[11:26] <neversfelde> ScottK: it's an atheros chip and WPA
[11:26] <neversfelde> ScottK: ok, I will change it
[11:29] <ScottK> neversfelde: Does it work on an unencrypted network?
[11:30] <neversfelde> ScottK: I am using the jaunty package, so I have not tested, but I am going to search something unencrypted here
[11:33] <ScottK> neversfelde: That or setup wpa through /etc/network/interfaces and ifup.
[12:13] <ScottK> In Karmic Firefox actually knows about Okular and PDFs.  That's progress.
[12:23] <jussi01> ScottK: o.O wow!!
[12:23] <ScottK> Yes, I was quite suprised.
[12:38] <ScottK> Riddell: (this is a re-ping from when you were at GCDS): When you updated https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Ninjas/DependencyGraph last month you updated the image, but didn't update the textfile, if you'd please upload that, I have some additional changes to make.
[13:00] <ryanakca> ScottK: Hardware header appears to work fine in the old kubuntu and the kubuntu-new themes...  what should it be like?
[13:06] <ScottK> ryanakca: It should be like other Kubuntu stuff.  kb9vqf did a bit of fixing on it already (thanks).  I'm not much of a web person, so feel free to make it wonderful.
[13:07] <ryanakca> ScottK: OK
[13:52] <Quintasan|Szel> oh god
[13:53] <Quintasan|Szel> I borked my system with RC 2
[13:53] <Quintasan|Szel> anyone got problems with truncated libs?
[13:54] <Quintasan|Szel> /sbin/ldconfig.real: file /usr/lib/libkdeinit4_kwin.so is truncated
[13:54] <Quintasan|Szel> same goes to libkdeinit4_plasm-desktop.so
[13:55] <ScottK> Quintasan|Szel: Nope.
[13:55] <ScottK> Fine here.
[13:56] <Quintasan|Szel> argh
[13:56] <a|wen> Quintasan|Szel: does all the borken libs seem to be from the same package?
[13:57] <Quintasan|Szel> wait, I'm reinstalling kdebase-workspace-bin and kde-window-manager, that should help
[13:57] <Quintasan|Szel> phew, looks like it worked
[13:57] <Quintasan|Szel> @_@
[13:57] <a|wen> nice
[14:01] <Quintasan> looks like reboot hurt the libs
[14:01] <Quintasan> :/
[14:01] <a|wen> disk full?
[14:01] <Quintasan> yup :D
[14:01] <a|wen> that might explain things ;)
[14:02] <Quintasan> I moved some err.. video files and it worked ;D
[14:02] <a|wen> good
[14:03] <a|wen> as long as "we" have no part in the error, we are happy :P
[14:03] <Quintasan> oh god, I just discovered folder with three karmic images
[14:03] <Quintasan> @_@
[14:05]  * Quintasan must get a bigger HD
[14:06] <a|wen> he, it is never big enough
[14:06] <Quintasan> well I have only two disks: 250GB and 80GB
[14:06]  * a|wen has one 80GB ... and no more
[14:06] <Daskreech> Quintasan: Or les ...errr videos ?
[14:07] <Daskreech> mgraesslin: Oh I have the nick of the profiling participant if you like
[14:07] <Quintasan> Daskreech: er, not even CD of those :P
[14:07] <Quintasan> Daskreech: Anime dir == OVER9000
[14:07] <Daskreech> LOL
[14:08] <Quintasan> humm, external 150 GB full of anime
[14:08] <Quintasan> main disk 45GB of anime
[14:09] <Quintasan> and hurr durr only 20 on Kubuntu partition
[14:09] <Quintasan> ohshi-
[14:09]  * Quintasan notices a big spider on his wall
[14:27] <ScottK> ryanakca: It might be nice if the Kubuntu wiki page header mentioned #kubuntu-netbook.
[15:26] <Daskreech> hi rickspencer3
[15:27] <rickspencer3> hi Daskreech
[15:27] <Daskreech> How did your presentation go?
[15:28] <rickspencer3> it was "ok" I suppose
[15:29] <Daskreech> Ha ha What would be your definition of "ok" ?
[15:37] <seele> rickspencer3: i'm sorry i missed it, i had to chair a session that afternoon
[15:38] <rickspencer3> seele: it
[15:39] <rickspencer3> s kind of a weird concept for people, to do user-centered design for developers
[15:40] <seele> mmm.. i guess so
[15:41] <seele> maybe it's just new to the gnomies, i've been preaching to kde about ucd for 5 years now ;)
[15:41] <seele> they might not get it yet, but theyre familiar with it i think
[15:41] <rickspencer3> seele, what I mean is, treating developers as users
[15:41] <rickspencer3> going user-centered design when developers are the users
[15:42] <seele> ah, interesting
[15:43] <seele> what did you talk about? development processes?
[15:44] <rickspencer3> I talked about what an "opportunistic" programmer is ... how important they are to the success of a platform, and what their expectations are
[15:53] <Daskreech> rickspencer3: Slides?
[15:53] <maco> seele, i cant find a sponsor :(
[15:59] <ScottK> maco: I'd suggest those changes should go upstream first.  I'd be glad to sponsor them for our 4.3 if they are in KDE trunk.
[15:59] <ScottK> Daskreech: Likely there will be a video.
[16:00] <maco> ScottK, they need to go into both, but Nightrose was telling me upstream had a string freeze at the time
[16:00] <ScottK> maco: They don't now.
[16:00] <Daskreech> ScottK: I know but I'm intrigued NOW
[16:01] <maco> ok, will send my svn diffs
[16:01] <ScottK> maco: It also occurs to me we might want to wait and see if the KDE translations importing is going to work this time or not.
[16:02] <ScottK> All these strings will need to be retranslated.
[16:05] <maco> fun fun
[16:05] <ScottK> Yes.  So let's make sure we'll have the ability to do that before we upload the changes.
[16:09] <Daskreech> Why do I get a disabling trackerd when I startup from a CD? Why does the CD have tracker?
[16:23] <rgreening> kde microblog seems broken since last update.
[16:23] <rgreening> only shows my tweets from identi.ca
[16:23] <rgreening> and the configure button isn't going away... weird
[16:23] <maco> dents?
[16:24] <maco> oh oh you see the configure button too????
[16:24] <rgreening> dents, ya...
[16:24] <maco> not just me!!!
[16:24] <rgreening> yep
[16:24] <jjesse> does the kde mircoblog suffer from the sam problem choqok used to w/ twitter?
[16:24] <rgreening> worked perfect in last release
[16:24] <neversfelde> I had to delete the plasmarcs
[16:24] <jjesse> choqok broke in the twitterapolocypse
[16:24] <maco> rgreening, does the comic widget show the configure button? that one did that to me too
[16:24] <rgreening> hmmm... never used it.
[16:24] <neversfelde> at least that fixed a similar problem with the comic plasmoid
[16:24] <maco> jjesse, when twitter started rate-limiting?
[16:24] <rgreening> I'll try removing the plasmarc and restarting kde...
[16:25] <maco> oh....i just installed last night
[16:25] <jjesse> there was a problem when twitter broke the api or something, choqok had to be reved to work again
[16:25] <rgreening> have to go for lunch first though...
[16:25] <maco> this is my first login, so my plasmarc ought to be pretty clean
[16:26] <neversfelde> maco: mhh, comic plasmoid is allright here again
[16:26] <maco> i havent tried comic one since new install. that was at ds
[16:26] <maco> *uds
[16:26] <maco> but this install has been around for about 12 hours now, and the microblog one isn't happy
[16:28] <neversfelde> I do not use the microblog thing, but will test it
[16:28] <neversfelde> btw choqok rocks :)
[16:30] <neversfelde> maco: yes, same problem here, microblog seems to be broken
[16:30] <maco> im looking at that other social widget.  opendesktop.org?
[16:30] <maco> what is that?
[16:31] <maco> um, arora is really slow
[16:31] <Daskreech> \sh: Opendesktop is interesting
[16:32] <Daskreech>  It lets you know about other people in say the same city that use KDE
[16:32] <maco> oh. it says "opendesktop.org websites" ...there's no relation to the kde-look/gnome-look stuff right? it says my usual nick is already in use, and im not sure if it's me
[16:33] <\sh> Daskreech: hmmm? I don't know anything about opendesktop ;)
[16:33] <maco> (that'd be "maco" if you couldn't guess)
[16:33] <Daskreech> Errant tab
[16:33] <Daskreech> maco: It is kde-look/gnome-look/kde-apps etc
[16:33] <Daskreech>  they are the main site of the opendesktop network
[16:34] <maco> then it is me
[16:42] <ScottK> You should speak to yourself about that.
[16:47] <maco> hey apparently i used a different email address than usual when i registered too, leading to"where's that password reset email?" confusion
[16:52] <nixternal> oi oi
[16:53] <jjesse> you turn jewish?
[16:53] <ScottK> And a poor speller?
[16:53] <ScottK> I think that'd be oy.
[16:53] <ScottK> nixternal: You see in the scrollback about kde4libs cleanup needed?
[16:54] <nixternal> I see I need to fix that kubuntu_51 patch again as I s/P/p/ when it was changed to PID and not package, so I have to revert that :/
[16:54] <nixternal> ya, going to do that now
[16:54] <ScottK> nixternal: Great.  Also something about inline changes sneaking into the package.
[16:54] <maco> uh, i was assuming he was oi-ing like he was in an Oi Band
[16:55] <maco> oooh that makes me wanna listen to Oi to the World
[16:56] <neversfelde> nixternal: are you a communication ninja?
[17:03] <nixternal> I have to head out for a bit, family un-emergency I guess...I will finish up kdelibs when I get back
[17:03] <nixternal> neversfelde: communication ninja?
[17:04] <neversfelde> nixternal: people who read backlogs, see Nightrose last blog post
[17:05] <nixternal> no I haven't yet...had a super busy weekend, just fired up my computer for the first time since friday :)
[17:06] <neversfelde> nixternal: bug #398596 probably happened during your last upload
[17:07] <Daskreech> neversfelde: You mean about contentless pings ?
[17:08] <nixternal> heh, neversfelde I am not a communication ninja...I do read my backlog and respond only to those that I feel like responding to
[17:08] <neversfelde> hehe
[17:08] <nixternal> you and ScottK didn't deserve a response as I read it, and knew what had to be done ;p
[17:08] <neversfelde> :)
[17:09] <maco> oh did you report that one?
[17:13] <nixternal> ya, thanks for linking me that bug :)
[17:13] <nixternal> :wq - interesting...I wasn't using emacs obviously :p
[17:14] <nixternal> uploaded and fixed
[17:14] <nixternal> now I can leave feeling good about myself :p
[17:15] <Daskreech> Who owns identi/ca/kubuntu ?
[17:36] <apachelogger> Nightrose: CMake Error at /opt/amarok-nightly/share/apps/cmake/modules/MacroLogFeature.cmake:141 (MESSAGE):
[17:36] <apachelogger>   Exiting: Missing Requirements
[17:36] <apachelogger> Call Stack (most recent call first):
[17:36] <apachelogger>   CMakeLists.txt:131 (macro_display_feature_log)
[17:36] <apachelogger> Nightrose: I suppose you should have reverted to what eean reverted ;-)
[17:36] <Nightrose> apachelogger: can you post that in the other channel for lfranchi please?
[17:37] <Nightrose> i am on the eepc
[17:37] <Nightrose> pasting is a pain
[17:37] <Nightrose> thanks :)
[17:37] <Nightrose> Daskreech: me why?
[17:37] <Nightrose> oh you mean the user?
[17:37] <Nightrose> no idea
[17:37] <Nightrose> the group is mine
[17:37] <Daskreech> Nightrose: What?
[17:38] <Daskreech> Oh the Kubunu account?
[17:38] <Nightrose> yea
[17:38] <ScottK> Nightrose: Please keep in mind https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Netbook/HardwareTesting for the eeepc.
[17:39] <Nightrose> ScottK: i have a running jaunty system on an eeepc700 installed from cd - anything you need me to do?
[17:39] <Nightrose> (besides installing a new system)
[17:40] <ScottK> Nightrose: I mostly want to know what works and what packages you need to add for drivers so we can fix bugs and make sure we have all the right stuff seeded for KNE.
[17:40] <ScottK> Nightrose: Checking out the multimedia keys in karmic is also important since that stuff is all being redone.
[17:41] <Nightrose> ScottK: stock jaunty works just fine - the only thing that does not work is Fn+F2 to toggle wifi
[17:41] <ScottK> Karmic will likely be different.
[17:41] <Nightrose> i see - ok then i should probably test to make sure i am happy with karmik :D
[17:42] <Daskreech> Nightrose: are there plans to use it?
[17:42] <Nightrose> working wifi toggle would be the awesome to save me some battery power
[17:42] <ScottK> Sooner the better your chances of ending up happy
[17:42] <Nightrose> hehe yea
[17:42] <Nightrose> thought so
[17:42] <Nightrose> Daskreech: the user kubuntu is not mine so no idea - the group is mine and it is being used just fine imho
[17:43] <Daskreech> Ah yeah the group rocks
[17:43] <Nightrose> :)
[17:44] <Nightrose> ScottK: what do i need for testing? I amnot too keen on whiping my harddisk tbh
[17:44] <CIA-76> Kubuntu: apachelogger * r10 kde-l10n-orphans-parser/list-processor/ (karmic-templates-kubuntu.log process.rb):
[17:44] <CIA-76> Kubuntu: * Update LP templates list
[17:44] <CIA-76> Kubuntu: * Make the list-processor take the last-upload-date into account...
[17:44] <CIA-76> Kubuntu:  + if the pot is unfindable and the last upload was >180 days ago => kill
[17:44] <CIA-76> Kubuntu:  + if the pot is unfindable but the last upload was <180 days ago => likelykill
[17:46] <ScottK> Nightrose: Kubuntu Netbook ISO is Live, so use usb-creator to make a "Live CD" usb and test without installing.
[17:47] <Nightrose> sounds good - hope i have a big enough usb stick
[17:48] <apachelogger> talking about that
[17:48] <apachelogger> I need to find a stick that fits kubuntu
[17:48] <apachelogger> oh dear
[17:49] <neversfelde> Nightrose: wifi button works on my 900 in karmic, I think for the first time
[17:50] <neversfelde> so try it :)
[17:50] <Nightrose> nice
[17:51] <apachelogger> uh
[17:51] <apachelogger> explorer.exe keeps crashing
[17:52] <ScottK> Sounds like time for a different operating system
[17:56]  * apachelogger is wondering how to stop that crash action
[17:56] <ScottK> Don't restart it is one way.
[17:57] <apachelogger> it autorestarts
[18:00] <Tscheesy> ScottK : do you have me a KNE Download-Hint (or your Blog-Address)?
[18:01] <apachelogger> ScottK: why is the netbook iso bigger than the desktop one?
[18:02] <ScottK> Tscheesy: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu-netbook/daily-live/current/
[18:03] <Tscheesy> fine - thx.. live :)
[18:03] <ScottK> apachelogger: I put all the lang packs in.
[18:04] <ScottK> We have a 1GB limit.
[18:04] <ScottK> So plenty of room.
[18:04] <apachelogger> well
[18:04] <apachelogger> TBH
[18:04] <apachelogger> the smaller the faster downloaded the better
[18:04] <ScottK> apachelogger: Sure, but also supporting people in their language is good too.  If translations get better, it might actually be worthwhile.
[18:05] <apachelogger> not sure, since it will download the lang-pack after installation anyway
[18:06] <ScottK> Yes, but people complain about that and it sort of breaks the promise the installer makes.
[18:06] <apachelogger> hm, ok
[18:06] <apachelogger> are they compressed with lzma? ;-)
[18:06] <ScottK> apachelogger: Dunno.  You should take that up with dpm-afk.
[18:06] <Tscheesy> the less the better - you can customize a USB-Live later - improving this would be Great
[18:07] <ScottK> apachelogger: BTW, I'm test building KDE stuff against liblzma in my PPA so maybe we get lzma support in ark.
[18:07] <apachelogger> yay
[18:08] <ScottK> Of course the needed library isn't actually in the archive yet ....
[18:08] <ScottK> Let alone in Main .....
[19:16] <maco> when the quassel core drops offline momentarily and thus gets disconnected from the server and from the client... when i reconnect the client to the server, only like 1/2 the channels i was in still have buffers in the buffer list. they look like i parted, but i can right click and join. the other half just disappear. have to join those more manually. find it odd.
[19:16] <maco> Sput, any idea why?
[19:17] <maco> (idk if this is a quassel thing or a limitation of how irc servers behave)
[19:17] <Sput> depends if you have more than 20 channels :)
[19:17] <Sput> in which case you'll hit a problem with quassel's autoidentify support, which will ident you only after joining (thus, you won't get your +u in time)
[19:18] <Sput> which you can workaround by setting your nickserv pass as server pass
[19:19] <maco> nope, only like 6
[19:20] <ScottK> 6 total or 6 missing?
[19:20] <maco> 6 total
[19:21] <maco> i wonder if its because of hide inactive buffer setting?
[19:21] <maco> none of them re join after the core reconnects
[19:21] <maco> but of the 6 i had 2 buffers just weren't in the buffer list at all anymore
[19:28] <Zorael^2> hm? kubuntu netbook iso? where?
[19:29] <ScottK> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu-netbook/daily-live/
[19:29] <ScottK> It isn't particularly different than the regular one at the moment, but it will be.
[19:29] <ScottK> Also todays seems somewhat borked.
[19:29] <ScottK> You might go back a couple of days.
[19:41] <apachelogger> Riddell: http://patches.ubuntu.com/k/kdebase-workspace/extracted/kubuntu_80_fix_includes.diff
[19:41] <apachelogger> not documented in changelog
[19:41] <apachelogger> actually, not documented at all
[19:41] <apachelogger> not even the commit messages is any useful
[19:41] <apachelogger> also
[19:41] <apachelogger> not upstreamed
[19:41] <maco> hahaha
[19:44] <CIA-76> Kubuntu: apachelogger * r121 kdebase-workspace/debian/patches/kubuntu_73_ksysguard_search_box_fix.diff: Remove debian/patches/kubuntu_73_ksysguard_search_box_fix.diff for real from VCS
[19:50] <apachelogger> rgreening: why did kubuntu_63_ksplash_fix.diff not get upstreamed?
[19:50] <apachelogger> workspace that is
[19:51] <neversfelde> apachelogger: is it possible to use an i386 plattform together with amd64 with icecc?
[19:52] <apachelogger> neversfelde: as long as the i386 is the target, I suppose so
[19:52] <apachelogger> neversfelde: better read up on the opensuse wiki page about icecream
[19:53] <neversfelde> mhh, it is an i386 chroot on a amd64 machine and the scheduler runs on an i386 machine, but jobs are not exported to the other machine, wehn running pbuilder in the chroot
[19:53] <neversfelde> although icemon shows both machines
[19:53] <neversfelde> apachelogger: already did, but it is very confusing and way to short
[19:54] <neversfelde> btw you can't use the icecc hook with the DIST=distro skript, probably worth to include a hint in the README
[19:55] <apachelogger> DIST=distro skript?
[19:55] <neversfelde> apachelogger: the one which is include in the pbuilderrc from the MOTU docs
[19:56] <apachelogger> bah
[19:56] <apachelogger> motu docs
[19:56] <neversfelde> :)
[19:56] <apachelogger> only trust the ninjas and only follow certified ninja docs
[19:57] <apachelogger> seriously most scripts out there are more than doubtable
[19:57] <apachelogger> like the one which is supposed to detect binary blob
[19:57] <apachelogger> while indeed it's output is mostly crap
[19:58] <apachelogger> of course my reimplementation is superior in any possible way
[20:00] <neversfelde> hehe :)
[20:02] <Monika|K> What's the difference between MOTU and Ninja?
[20:06] <tsimpson> ninja are shadows in the night, turning out kde packages like flashing Shuriken in the night
[20:06] <tsimpson> motu are just "normal" ;)
[20:13] <ScottK> Speaking of MOTU: kdenlive, mlt, mlt++ could all stand some updating in Karmic.
[20:15] <neversfelde> I can have a look at kdenlive
[20:17] <neversfelde> apachelogger: I uploaded a new kodama package to revu
[20:17] <neversfelde> and bug #398900 also needs a sponsor
[20:19] <ScottK> neversfelde: Great.  In addition to mlt/mlt++ (update these first) there are some plugins too that we have the IIRC Debian doesn't that should also be checked.
[20:20] <neversfelde> k
[20:20] <ScottK> neversfelde: frei0r-plugins
[20:20]  * ScottK looked it up and everything
[20:53] <neversfelde> oho, that icecc thing is working
[21:14] <Ke> has anyone noted some colored rectangles on krfb
[21:15] <Ke> (where there shouldn't be colored rectangles)
[21:24] <seele> wow so i didnt know plasma review board rejected the kickoff avatar patch.. was this posted to the devel list?
[21:24] <seele> kubuntu-devel
[21:25] <maco> kickoff avatar?
[21:26] <Quintasan> hiho
[21:26] <seele> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/389744
[21:26] <seele> dave siegel said it got rejected for "breaking visual consistency"
[21:26] <Quintasan> what's up?
[21:26] <Quintasan> they rejected it?!
[21:26] <Quintasan> lol
[21:27] <maco> hm that is knda weird that its next to search instead of my name
[21:27] <maco> what's my picture have to do with searching?
[21:27] <seele> yeah exactly
[21:28] <Quintasan> that guy must have been drunk
[21:28] <Quintasan> srsly
[21:28] <seele> http://reviewboard.kde.org/r/870/
[21:28] <seele> which both Jonathan's and the proposed 2 line option are fine
[21:28] <seele> the existing solution makes no sense
[21:29] <maco> search icon?
[21:29] <maco> i dont know what aaron's talking about. search is just text, no icon
[21:31] <seele> the binoculars icon next to search
[21:31] <seele> see the first screenshot linked in review board
[21:31] <maco> uh...i dont see that in karmic
[21:31] <seele> SVN
[21:32] <seele> not Karmic
[21:32] <maco> ah ok
[21:32] <seele> i think the second linked screenshot is what is acceptable but JJanz doesnt know how to implement it
[21:32] <maco> er...i only see 1 screenshot. it says "after" below it
[21:33] <maco> on reviewboard. or should i be looking at lp?
[21:33] <seele> review board.. it is a link
[21:33] <seele> http://juniorjanz.net/files/avatar2.png
[21:34] <nixternal> seele: don't know if I said it or not, but congrats btw :)
[21:34] <maco> oh ok gotcha
[21:34] <maco> oh yeah congrats on the boardship!
[21:35] <nixternal> I am fairly certain my vote went to you :)
[21:35] <maco> anyone wanna explain to me how this reviewboard thing works?
[21:35] <maco> what's "base diff path"?
[21:35] <maco> and "change number"?
[21:36] <maco> (trying to submit patches. failing.)
[21:36] <nixternal> maco: it doesn't work, that is the fun part about it :p
[21:36] <maco> well how's it *supposed* to work?
[21:36] <seele> nixternal: thanks
[21:36] <nixternal> base diff path is where at in the dir structure you created the patch I believe
[21:36] <seele> maco: thanks too
[21:37] <nixternal> and the change number is the revision of the checkout that you created the diff on
[21:37] <nixternal> iirc that is how it goes
[21:37] <nixternal> but I haven't used it in quite some time
[21:38] <maco> ok. how do i get svn to tell me what revision i checked out?
[21:38] <neversfelde> bug #399001 needs a sponsor
[21:38] <neversfelde> hope I did it right
[21:38] <nixternal> svn info will tell you the revision you are working on
[21:38] <maco> thanks
[21:38] <nixternal> or you stop using bash, setup zsh with zsh-lovers and that way there you will always know what revision and branch you are working in :)
[21:39] <maco> so my path would be: trunk/KDE/kdebase ?
[21:39] <maco> (in the kdebase example)
[21:39] <nixternal> sounds right to me
[21:40] <maco> ok thank youi
[21:40] <nixternal> if you ran diff from there yes
[21:40] <nixternal> or it could be 'trunk/KDE/kdebase/workspace'
[21:40] <nixternal> and such
[21:40] <maco> loks like js is needed
[21:40] <maco> i ran "svn diff" from there
[21:45] <nixternal> what is the purpose of having friends on opendesktop.org?
[21:45] <nixternal> I keep getting requests from you nutjobs :p
[21:46] <neversfelde> uh, forget about mlt, it needs some more deps, can I unsubscribe the universe sponsors?
[21:47] <nixternal> neversfelde: you should be able to, I can do it if you can't though
[21:47] <neversfelde> nixternal: seems that I can't
[21:47] <nixternal> neversfelde: done :)
[21:48] <neversfelde> please unsubscribe
[21:48] <nixternal> I was already looking at it :)
[21:48] <neversfelde> thank you
[21:48] <nixternal> np
[21:48] <maco> can you put> 1 diff on one reviewboard thing?
[21:48] <nixternal> hurry up, get your ducks in a row and become a MOTU already :p
[21:48] <nixternal> maco: is this for the kde review board?
[21:48] <maco> yes
[21:48] <nixternal> I haven't even used that (yet)
[21:49] <Monika|K> ducks?
[21:49] <nixternal> ask that one in kde-devel --- someone should know that answer as I don't
[21:49] <nixternal> Monika|K: http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/get+ducks+in+a+row
[21:49] <maco> hey, do you need to file a bug in kde bugzilla before filing a reviewboard ticket?
[21:49] <nixternal> silly american figure of speach
[21:50] <nixternal> maco: you might have to do so now if you aren't a developer maybe
[21:50] <nixternal> then again, I don't know 100% on that
[21:50] <Monika|K> idioms involving ducks are cute :)
[21:51] <Monika|K> makes me think of http://xkcd.com/537/
[21:53] <nixternal> hahaha, that is great!
[21:55] <ryanakca> yuriy: ping
[21:59] <yuriy> ryanakca: pong
[22:00] <maco> nixternal, lemma says bug not necessary
[22:10] <maco> oy. one patch submitted. only 10 more to go.
[22:17] <Riddell> ScottK: sorry still not home, don't know where that dot file went
[23:04] <shtylman> ScottK: bug #398059
[23:05] <shtylman> this is a showstopper ... anyone we know in the proper channels that can take a closer look at it? I really have no clue where to start
[23:07] <maco> shtylman, -kernel?
[23:08] <shtylman> maco: will try :/
[23:31] <maco> alright you folks that use the reviewboard.kde.org thingy. how do i get it to both show the "what revision?" box AND have a usable submit button, at the same time? the revision box is there only without js and the button works only with js.


[08:23] <ochosi> mr_pouit: did you see xfce bug 7564 is marked as resolved? maybe that would be something worth backporting/pushing to natty...
[08:24] <ochosi> darn you, ubottu
[08:24] <ochosi> i mean xfce 7564
[08:24] <ochosi> meh :/
[09:28] <mr_pouit> ochosi: no, I didn't =]
[09:28] <ochosi> well, it's brand new anyway
[09:28] <mr_pouit> yeah, it's probably worth  doing smothing to natty
[09:28] <ochosi> but it would be pretty cool if indicators would support vertical panels
[09:28] <mr_pouit> can you file a bug on LP about that?
[09:28] <ochosi> i think xfce would be the first DE to sport that feature
[09:29] <mr_pouit> otherwise it'll get lost
[09:29] <ochosi> sure, np
[09:33] <ochosi> mr_pouit: bug 787977
[09:37] <mr_pouit> thanks
[09:56] <ochosi> np
[15:11] <charlie-tca> Good morning
[15:12] <micahg> good morning charlie-tca
[15:15]  * drc hands charlie-tca a cuppa...noting that tea has been added to the menu.
[15:20] <charlie-tca> Thank you, drc
[15:28] <charlie-tca> Ubuntu daily, daily-live, and ubuntu-server images for oneiric are available from http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/
[15:29] <drc> Oh darn...time to go to work :(
[15:30] <charlie-tca> No, you are waiting for Xubuntu images
[15:31] <drc> oh...yeah...I'm just so used to people saying "I installed Ubuntu" for all three flavors
[15:32]  * drc returns to his dozing.
[15:43]  * drc suddenly wakes up, thinking he'll just DL it anyway, just to see if common things like the "activated but not in use" bug is still there.
[15:45] <charlie-tca> These are the first images, most bugs will not fixed yet
[15:45] <drc> I know, but I'm bored...and who knows?
[15:46] <drc> Maybe I'll like Unity so much now, I'll switch.
[15:47] <charlie-tca> hehheh
[15:48] <drc> No really, I *want* to like Unity, I just...can't.
[15:51]  * drc checks to make sure the Get Off My Lawn sign is still up.
[15:58] <charlie-tca> I do like unity! I just don't like to use it for me
[16:01] <drc> "Oh no! Something has gone wrong."
[16:03] <drc> 32 bit Oneiric won't even boot to the try/install screen...something about /run/udev not writable (error message flashes to fast to read all of it).
[16:03] <micahg> drc: it should fall back to /dev/.udev
[16:03] <drc> Well, considering it's not even alpha yet...not to shabby :)
[16:06] <drc> micahg: It boots to a screen with the "Oh no!" message, with what looks like an incomplete nautilus window on to of it (you can close that window)
[16:06] <drc> One day down, only 150 to go.
[16:09]  * drc has had a very tiring day now...decides to take a nap.
[16:10] <charlie-tca> \o/
[16:19] <charlie-tca> still need to get word, I guess - "didn't knwo xubuntu 11.04 was already out! great, thanks"
[16:21] <drc> charlie-tca: No, that was <U>buntu Oneiric.
[16:21] <charlie-tca> what was?
[16:22] <charlie-tca> the tiring day?
[16:22] <drc> Never mind, I thought you were replying to my "Oh no!" series.
[16:23] <charlie-tca> oh,
[16:23] <charlie-tca> no, that was a comment from another channel
[16:23] <drc> ohhhh...multichanneling...how cool ;)
[19:15] <ochosi> charlie-tca: the bugfix for the indicators was just uploaded to -proposed
[19:15] <ochosi> yay! :)
[19:15] <ochosi> that means that vertical panels will work _a lot_ better than before, even better than in maverick
[19:17] <drc> Yeah Redux...er...that was bug 	759312, correct?
[19:18] <ochosi> drc: no, it's bug 787977
[19:19] <drc> rats!
[19:19] <ochosi> drc: what you have to uninstall to get rid of the envelope is "indicator-messages"
[19:19] <ochosi> it always worked for me
[19:20] <ochosi> (meaning i can't confirm your bug)
[19:21] <ochosi> drc: after uninstalling the indicator-messages package you obviously need a "xfce4-panel --restart"
[19:22] <drc> ochosi: no, it goes away automagically soon after I use pidgin the first time (at least I think that's the when, so systematic testing...Maybe I'll do that sometime during my daily tests).  But after it goes away, the spacing is all messed up (re: 759312)
[19:23] <drc> ochosi: The spacing is *still* off after...how many reboots has it been since I files it?
[19:24] <ochosi> drc so you really uninstalled indicator-messages? (uninstalling gwibber is not enough), your /usr/lib/indicators kinda suggests otherwise...
[19:25] <ochosi> reboots shouldn't change much, restarting the panel should be fine for the indicators
[19:25] <drc> No...let me see if I can explain it a little better.
[19:26] <ochosi> sure, go ahead
[19:27] <drc> When I first started with xubuntu, gwibber was installed by default.  I usually uninstalled it early in my config process (I never used it and did not like the indicator being present).
[19:28] <drc> This resulted in the spacing proiblem I indicated.
[19:29] <drc> Since then, gwibber appears to not be installed by default, but the "envelope" is still present (with a pidgin message).
[19:30] <ochosi> right
[19:30] <ochosi> i understand all that
[19:30] <drc> The envelope now goes away (after some unspecified time, but I *think* it's relatively soon after using pidgin the first time, and rebooting).  The spacing problem is, however still there.
[19:32] <drc> Using a "light" theme (say clearlooks), one can detect what looks like a spacing holder in the inidicators.  I'll do a screenshot and post it in just a moment.
[19:32] <ochosi> drc: i know the "spacing" problem
[19:32] <ochosi> no need for the screenshot
[19:33] <drc> ok...then what am I not telling you that you need to know? ")
[19:34] <ochosi> open a terminal, what does "sudo apt-get remove indicator-messages" say? :)
[19:35] <drc> duh!
[19:36] <drc> The indicator messages was removed....I did a "xfce4-panel --restart" and the spacing problem was fixed.
[19:36] <ochosi> k, then you know what you have to write in your bugreport ;)
[19:37] <drc> Yup, but the question remains...without removing the indicator-messages, why does the "envelope" disappear, but the spacing remain?
[19:38] <drc> Not that it matters, just curious
[19:38] <ochosi> i assume because there's nothing the indicator can show. you could try the same in ubuntu, wondering what would happen there
[19:39] <ochosi> in fact it's a teensy bit better to not show the envelope when there are no apps installed that use it than showing it
[19:39] <ochosi> but i agree that maybe it should either be completely hidden or completely shown
[19:39] <ochosi> so basically you can confirm the bug but explain how to "fix"/workaround it
[19:42]  * drc is trying to figure out how to word this so he doesn't look totally stupid :)
[19:43] <ochosi> hehe
[19:44] <drc> ochosi: Could this have something to do with the fact the I never stared pidgin thru the indicatore but always used the menu/icon on the panel?
[19:44] <ochosi> nope, not as far as my experience goes
[19:44] <ochosi> wait, i think you're talking about two different bugs here
[19:45] <ochosi> one is: if there are no apps using indicator-messages but the package is still installed, there is some empty spacing
[19:45] <ochosi> the other is: for some reason the envelope appears/disappears randomely when pidgin is installed
[19:45] <ochosi> did i get that right now?
[19:47] <drc> Almost
[19:48] <drc> Gotta run for about 5 min...puppy wants out...NOW
[19:48] <ochosi> k, good luck with that
[19:49] <ochosi> gotta go too
[19:49] <ochosi> see you around
[19:52] <drc> Back...and see you later.
[20:24] <foobar> Hi :)
[20:24] <foobar> Where should I report a bug concerning xfapplet? At xfce or launchpad?
[20:24] <foobar> After installation on one PC only stock-market quotation can be chosen and on the other system none...
[20:25] <foobar> Both systems running Xubuntu 11.04
[20:28] <micahg> foobar: ubuntu-bug xfce4-xfapplet-plugin
[20:29] <foobar> Thanks micahg - I'll post it there.
[20:29] <foobar> Have a nice day.
[20:51] <drc> Well, that was interesting...never installed from the ALT series before...why does everyone think an ncurses install is "hard"?
[20:52] <drc> BTW, Ubuntu Alt64 install get the same /run/udev notwritable error (although it does try to fall back to .udev (?)
[20:55] <Soupermanito> i installed from alt the other day, had to use another live cd to use gparted, which is ghey if ask me
[20:57] <drc> I never had to repartition...I just used my existing testing partition and formated, so I can't speak to that.
[22:46] <micahg_> BTW, lightdm seems to work great ATM
[22:53] <charlie-tca> Glad to hear that
[22:53] <charlie-tca> me and Luke are up for insuring it is fully accessible in Oneiric, too
[22:53] <charlie-tca> We promised at UDS that it will be
[22:55] <micahg_> same list of users as default GDM ATM, hopefully we can make that a preference
[22:55]  * micahg_ also has to add some stuff to the Firefox apparmor profile for it
[23:33] <Soupermanito> micahg, does lightdm allows user pictures to be added?
[23:34] <micahg> Soupermanito: no idea
[23:35] <Soupermanito> mmmkay
[23:35] <Soupermanito> thanks anyway
[23:36] <charlie-tca> yes
[23:36] <charlie-tca> it will use html and css too
[23:36] <Soupermanito> :D that is awesome


[00:00] <andrzejr> ask ofourdan?
[00:11] <ochosi> yeah, a direct email might help
[00:11] <andrzejr> ali1234, reported that cairo issue in https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=72551
[00:13] <ali1234> hmm i htink i figured it out
[00:18] <ochosi> you did?
[00:20] <ali1234> maybe
[00:20] <ali1234> i need to write a test program or something
[00:20] <ochosi> is notifyd not good enough?
[00:30] <ali1234> well it's outside my control
[00:30] <ali1234> weirdly, this does not happen with my test program...
[00:30] <ali1234> does xfce-notifyd use gtk2 or gtk3?
[00:31] <ali1234> maybe it never was a bug in gtk2
[00:33] <ochosi> gtk2
[00:33] <ali1234> hmmmm
[00:33] <ali1234> that gtk patch got reverted anyway
[00:35] <ali1234> hmm, that patch is bonkers, actually
[00:35] <ali1234> so... xfwm4 must be doing something... silly
[00:35] <ali1234> er, i mean the notifyd
[00:36] <ochosi> so rather than being a corner-case with xfwm4, it's a bug in notifyd?
[00:38] <ali1234> both probably
[00:39] <ali1234> this is super confusing
[00:41] <ali1234> every window has TAKE_FOCUS
[00:41] <ali1234> but for most windows this doesn't cause a problem
[00:41] <ali1234> maybe because the client doesn't quit... hmm
[00:42] <ochosi> so if i understand you correctly, the focus goes back to the next instead of back to the "previous" window after notifyd exits
[00:43] <ali1234> er... kind of, but no
[00:44] <ali1234> notifyd opens a window, focus doesn't change
[00:44] <ali1234> notifyd closes window, focus jumps to "top most" window
[00:44] <ali1234> when really it should stay the same
[00:44] <ali1234> but i can't reproduce this with a test program, so it's not caused by that gtk bug
[00:44] <ali1234> if i just open a window with no focus it doesn't happen
[00:45] <ali1234> so it must be something else
[00:46] <ochosi> sounds like it's notifyd specific then
[00:47] <ochosi> g2g, night everyone
[00:47] <ali1234> ah ha
[00:47] <ali1234> it's one of the other hints that does it...
[00:47] <ali1234> night :)
[00:48] <ali1234> keep_above
[00:49] <ali1234> yeah, it happens if the window is no_focus and keep_above
[00:49] <ali1234> ok, so i guess i was totally looking in the wrong place all this time
[01:11] <ali1234> argh... this is a tricky one
[01:12] <ali1234> right, i see the problem
[01:13] <ali1234> if a window with above and no accept focus opens on a different layer to the current focus, it triggers a spurious focus change event
[02:30] <ali1234> anyone know where i can find the old svn for xfwm4?
[02:33] <ali1234> oh, nvm, it's all on the git
[02:45] <ali1234> hmm... actually i need the old cvs :(
[05:09] <ali1234> ok, so #gtk+ clued me in on how to fix the focus stealing in a better way
[05:09] <ali1234> fixed it in xfce4-notifyd
[05:09] <ali1234> the focus code in xfwm4 has so many workarounds and dodgy hacks i don't even know where to start
[05:10] <ali1234> anyway, by using override-redirect on the notify windows, this stops the window manager from seeing them at all. and so they don't interfere with anything
[08:08] <elfy> skellat: when you're about later today can you ping me please
[09:02] <ochosi> ali1234: that sounds quite reasonable, can't think of a reason the notifications should steal the window focus at all
[09:30] <ochosi> jjfrv8: hey there! was pretty much afk over the weekend so i'm just looking at the prefs in the xfdesktop-docs now
[09:33] <ochosi> jjfrv8: as you don't seem to be here now, i'll write up my thoughts/notes on a separate wiki page
[09:50] <ochosi> jjfrv8: for my comments, see http://smdavis.us/doku/doku.php?id=xfdesktop-docs:preferences:comments
[09:51] <ochosi> jjfrv8: great work on the prefs, there are just some issues we need to iron out, we can also discuss the transparent-option together when we're both around
[10:01] <lderan> good morning all :D
[10:05] <bluesabre> ali1234: that would fix one of my biggest gripes :)
[10:06] <ochosi> bluesabre: you mean the tearing with xfwm4 compositor?
[10:06] <bluesabre> notifications making me lose focus in my current window for a brief moment
[10:07] <ochosi> ah
[10:08] <slickymaster> morning all
[10:10] <ochosi> morning
[10:10] <bluesabre> hey slickymaster
[10:10] <slickymaster> ochosi, bluesabre hi
[10:11] <slickymaster> I haven't forgot xfdesktop documentation :)
[10:11] <ochosi> no worries ;)
[10:12] <ochosi> i just went through jjfrv8's preferences part
[10:12] <slickymaster> ochosi, we'll have to blame knome on my delay
[10:12] <slickymaster> ;)
[10:12] <knome> woot
[10:12]  * ochosi blames knome
[10:12] <knome> huh
[10:12] <slickymaster> morning knome
[10:12] <knome> thanks!
[10:12] <knome> good day slickymaster
[10:13] <ochosi> bluesabre: i'm sometimes wondering whether we should set up a bug-bounty programme somehow
[10:13]  * slickymaster is safely hidding
[10:13] <knome> what did i do this time?
[10:14] <bluesabre> ochosi: tempting, but what would be the bounty, hopefully not money
[10:14] <knome> bluesabre, well we have some project moolah
[10:14] <knome> bluesabre, and we can send stickers
[10:14] <knome> bluesabre, and finnish candy :d
[10:14] <ochosi> bluesabre: not sure, i think money could work. we could also do other stuff though
[10:14] <knome> except if my wife eats them first
[10:14] <ochosi> elementary did some bug-bounty for a geary backport to their luna release
[10:14] <ochosi> and it was monetary, iirc
[10:14] <knome> so it should/would be a bounty with a deadline :P
[10:15] <bluesabre> so many pings! :D
[10:16] <knome> i read "pigs"
[10:16] <ochosi> :)
[10:17] <bluesabre> :(
[11:18] <ochosi> oha, gtk3.10 is about to hit the trusty archives
[11:45] <bluesabre> wha
[11:45] <bluesabre> I thought trusty was sticking with 3.8?
[11:46] <bluesabre> so, from a design standpoint, do we want to force disable button images in gtk2 to make those apps match a bit more with gtk3.10?
[11:46] <bluesabre> and menu images
[12:25] <ochosi> bluesabre: good question
[12:25] <ochosi> i'm +1 on button images
[12:26] <ochosi> i've been using that myself for quite some time now
[12:48] <ochosi> Unit193: so wait, your session changes seem quite important for 14.04, can a live-session even be started without them?
[13:41] <jjfrv8> ochosi, good afternoon. Saw your comments on Preferences. Snow day here so I'll be around if you want to set a time to discuss.
[14:17] <ochosi> jjfrv8: hey there
[14:17] <jjfrv8> howdy
[14:18] <jjfrv8> ochosi, do you want to discuss preferences now?
[14:19] <ochosi> yeah, i can take a few minutes now
[14:20] <jjfrv8> I think I can do your points 1-4 with no problem but need to ask you about 5 & 6
[14:20] <ochosi> yeah, especially with 6 i expected that
[14:21] <ochosi> what version of xfdesktop are you using at the moment again?
[14:21] <ochosi> 4.11 from the xfce4.12 PPA?
[14:21] <jjfrv8> yeah, just checked again. xfdesktop4 4.11.1
[14:22] <ochosi> hm, ok, let me see what i have here then
[14:22] <jjfrv8> but I've got both the 4.12 and the 4.10 PPAs installed per the recommendation on the archive
[14:22] <ochosi> yeah
[14:22] <ochosi> that's fine
[14:23] <ochosi> so for me there's a header stating the workspace-name in the windowlist
[14:24] <ochosi> i can quickly take a screenshot
[14:24] <jjfrv8> k, I think that would help
[14:24] <ochosi> http://imagebin.org/281647
[14:24] <ochosi> where 1,2 and 3 are workspace names
[14:25] <ochosi> that seems to be missing in your screenshot
[14:25] <skellat> elfy: ¡PING!
[14:26] <jjfrv8> well, actually, it is there in the last screenshot
[14:26] <ochosi> oh
[14:26] <ochosi> let me look again
[14:26] <jjfrv8> I probably should not have combined two settings in one screenshot
[14:26] <jjfrv8> and I renamed the workspaces to 'primary' and 'secondary'. probably shouldn't have done that either
[14:27] <ochosi> ah
[14:27] <ochosi> yeah, now i understand
[14:27] <ochosi> so that's pretty much fine then i guess
[14:27] <jjfrv8> so I can use the default names and split out all four settings separately
[14:29] <ochosi> you could put the small screenshots next to each other if you wanna save vertical space
[14:29] <ochosi> but yeah, it's not terribly important
[14:29] <jjfrv8> ok, that's an idea
[14:29] <ochosi> the users can figure these easy settings out themselves too
[14:29] <ochosi> and you've described them well enough i think
[14:29] <jjfrv8> the only reason I did the screenshots was the that 4.10 explanations weren't clear to me
[14:30] <jjfrv8> but I might just be dense :)
[14:30] <ochosi> hehe
[14:30] <ochosi> well depends on whether you have ever touched/tried these settings i think
[14:30] <jjfrv8> that's true
[14:30] <ochosi> without that it always seems more odd i guess
[14:30] <ochosi> ok, so point 5
[14:30] <jjfrv8> yeah
[14:31] <ochosi> knome did such a wallpaper for xubuntu as a tryout a longer while ago
[14:31] <ochosi> basically you can use a semi-transparent image, and the color/gradient you set on the desktop will "show through"
[14:32] <jjfrv8> so the "transparent" setting applies to the image, not the color, right?
[14:32] <ochosi> no, those are two separate things
[14:33] <ochosi> i haven't mentioned the transparent option yet in my comments, because i'm not sure myself how that works these days
[14:33] <ochosi> iirc, it was meant for e.g. the compiz-cube to have a transparent wallpaper
[14:33] <ochosi> not sure what it currently does
[14:33] <ochosi> (probably just show the root pixmap)
[14:33] <ochosi> i have to ask eric_the_idiot about that
[14:34] <jjfrv8> i couldn't see where it did anything. and there are apparently no opacity controls or anything
[14:35] <ochosi> yeah, could be that it's even deprecated, i'm not sure and a bit too lazy to dig through the code right now ;)
[14:35] <ochosi> i'd rather wait for eric to reply
[14:35] <jjfrv8> sounds good
[14:35] <ochosi> so let's keep that on our list of open issues
[14:35] <jjfrv8> sure
[14:36] <ochosi> what i haven't checked yet, how does this version compare to what's currently in the xfce-docs?
[14:36] <ochosi> i mean for 4.10
[14:36] <ochosi> cause it seems to me that we need to keep the 4.10 references there
[14:37] <ochosi> and e.g. the first screenshot/folder stuff is a rather big departure from the old desktop
[14:37] <jjfrv8> yeah, the only real diffs are in the first tab, but they are significant
[14:37] <ochosi> nick said he would like to keep the docs for 4.10 there as well
[14:38] <ochosi> and only not the diffs to 4.12
[14:38] <ochosi> so we have to find a way to illustrate that
[14:38] <jjfrv8> hmm
[14:38] <ochosi> possibly by first showing the 4.10 screenshot + explanation, then the 4.12 screenshot+explanation
[14:38] <ochosi> with a <note>This only applies to Xfce4.12</note> or something
[14:39] <ochosi> in between
[14:39] <jjfrv8> ok, that makes it a little tricky but I'll see what I can do
[14:39] <ochosi> i know, it doesn't have to be beautiful, it should mostly be functional i guess
[14:40] <ochosi> as soon as we have a proposal for that, i'll send an email to nick and eric and ask them for feedback on that
[14:40] <jjfrv8> ok
[14:40] <ochosi> i'll cc you and slickymaster and then we'll see what route they wanna go
[14:40] <ochosi> so let's finalize the prefs-page first and then see
[14:41] <ochosi> i'll quickly try to tackle the bugs page today
[14:42] <jjfrv8> by 'finalize' you mean a combo 4.10/4.12 version or just making the changes in your comments today
[14:42] <jjfrv8> ?
[14:43] <ochosi> ideally both
[14:43] <ochosi> but i'm mostly waiting for how the 4.10/4.12 stuff will look
[14:43] <ochosi> if it looks awful, we need to discuss that with the others
[14:43] <ochosi> maybe we have to take a different route then
[14:44] <ochosi> but it'll be mostly copy-paste i assume (either to a separate page or whatnot)
[14:45] <jjfrv8> ok, I'll see what I can come up with and ping you if I have questions
[14:47] <ochosi> thanks!
[14:47] <jjfrv8> thank you!
[14:52] <ochosi> jjfrv8: btw, the comments are meant as feedback and suggestions, if you don't agree with some of them let me know!
[14:53] <jjfrv8> thanks, but I think all of the suggestions were good ones.
[14:53] <ochosi> ok, great
[14:54] <ochosi> andrzejr, ali1234: any idea why gtk3 indicators in the gtk2 panel would not use symbolic colors for the indicator-icons? (in the menu they seem fine)
[14:59] <jjfrv8> bbs
[16:27] <ochosi> andrzejr, ali1234: nvm, seems upstream doesn't support it :/
[19:16] <Unit193> ochosi: Sure, just AFAIK, won't autostart the live user.
[19:17] <ochosi> hm, that doesn't sounds very nice
[19:24] <Unit193> It's not so bad if you know the user is $flavorname.
[19:33] <elfy> default settings looks to be wrong on the current daily
[19:34] <knome> in what way?
[19:34] <elfy> settings manager apps are in the settings menu or system menu - like they used to be
[19:34] <knome> hmm
[19:34] <elfy> and the daily is defaulting to bangla as language
[19:35] <elfy> at least it boots now
[19:35] <elfy> not sure which package to put that last one against
[19:35] <knome> heh
[19:37] <elfy> knome: you got any idea which package the default language should be reported against?
[19:37] <knome> not really
[19:37] <elfy> unless that's xubuntu-default-settings as well
[19:37] <knome> i guess you could ask in -release though
[19:39] <elfy> or -bigs
[19:40] <elfy> s/i/u
[19:41] <knome> i mean you could ask release if it's probably something they poked that broke it
[19:41] <knome> there shouldn't be that much anomalies ;)
[19:41] <elfy> I'd suspect it's tied up with lightdm things they did yesterday/today
[19:44] <knome> possibly
[19:44] <elfy> bug 1259662
[19:47] <elfy> seems to be a lot of people reporting issues with bugs against testcases instead of the package concerned
[19:47] <elfy> bug 1259525
[19:49] <Unit193> I've got a merge in for that one, user is xubuntu there is no password.
[19:50] <Unit193> Oh, I see.
[19:50] <elfy> Unit193: yea - but it shouldn't ask
[19:50] <elfy> but the bug is wrong :)
[19:50] <elfy> shall slap obrien in the morning :)
[19:50] <Unit193> https://code.launchpad.net/~unit193/xubuntu-default-settings/session-fix/+merge/198177 look at the date.
[19:51] <elfy> mmm
[19:51] <elfy> so that deals with the username issue I assume
[19:51] <elfy> still got the menu's as an issue
[19:58] <Unit193> (Also have the merge request in for Lubuntu, and my goodness they have many sessions...)
[19:58] <knome> heh
[20:00] <Unit193> (https://code.launchpad.net/~unit193/lubuntu-default-settings/fix-session/+merge/198189)
[20:00] <Unit193> knome: Can you, or did you review the other one?
[20:04] <jjfrv8> elfy, yeah there seems to be lots of stuff wrong with this daily - like most of the app shortcuts are missing
[20:04] <jjfrv8> I haven't had time to do a full post-install test
[20:05] <elfy> I'm guessing something is awry with the default-settings somewhere
[20:05] <elfy> but I'm not the person to ask to pin down a package :p
[20:05] <jjfrv8> did I miss the discussion on the new panel config option that appears on reboot?
[20:06] <Unit193> Got a shot?
[20:07] <jjfrv8> I'll have to do another install. give me a few minutes.
[20:08] <elfy> if you did I missed it as well
[20:08] <Unit193> !info xubuntu-default-settings trusty | Look at the version, nope.
[20:12] <elfy> Unit193 knome - current settings menu http://imagebin.org/281717
[20:12] <elfy> #wrong :p
[20:13] <Unit193> elfy: rm -rfv .config && sudo service lightdm restart  check your session, did you get a dialog box when you logged in?
[20:16] <Unit193> Or, just echo $XDG_CONFIG_DIRS
[20:16] <Unit193> The point is, you're in session Xfce.
[20:17] <jjfrv8> Unit193, elfy: http://imagebin.org/281720
[20:18] <Unit193> Yes, confirmed that it's defaulting to the Xfce session.
[20:18] <Unit193> (I booted vbox.
[20:18] <Unit193> )
[20:19] <Unit193> jjfrv8: If you remove .config and .cache, at the login screen change it to the Xubuntu session (top right button)
[20:20] <Unit193> ...And it's half English.
[20:21] <jjfrv8> Unit193, that worked.
[20:23] <jjfrv8> I told it I wanted it to log in automatically but it ignored that and made me log in on first reboot
[20:24] <Unit193> elfy: Should I/we/someone link the branches to the bugs?  And the packages are {l,x}ubuntu-default-settins (re: 1259525)
[20:24] <elfy> Unit193: aaah - right ok - so that default settings thing IS affecting that as well
[20:25] <Unit193> Sure, but it boots, not as big of an issue as -gtk-greeter.
[20:25] <elfy> yep
[20:35] <elfy> Unit193: I'd assumed you were including that language in this
[20:36] <brainwash> is the language wrong on first session startup? it used to fall back to non english after a logout from the live session
[20:36] <elfy> it's wrong at boot to live session - though it is wrong that it's booting to login on live session
[20:37] <elfy> or #ubuntu-quality
[20:37] <Unit193> elfy: I have no idea what that is, but could be what the Washer of Brains said.
[20:37] <elfy> bah
[20:37] <brainwash> I noticed the described behavior in saucy back then
[20:38] <brainwash> after a logout the language was set to bengali(?)
[20:38] <elfy> bangla perhaps
[20:38] <brainwash> something like that, yes
[20:38] <elfy> so that's wrong anyway
[20:39] <brainwash> so there should already exist a report for this issue
[20:39]  * elfy votes for fixing the sound indicator and calling saucy trusty and having 6 months off
[20:39] <brainwash> I prefer the real deal, gtk3 indicators :)
[20:40] <brainwash> sync indicator and message indicator are awesome
[20:40] <Unit193> That didn't work as well.
[20:42] <elfy> I'd prefer lots of things - I'll settle for something that works
[20:43] <elfy> but as I can't code I'll not whine - I just won't +1 releasing :p
[20:43] <elfy> in the meantime - I've gtg now
[21:31] <Unit193> http://unit193.net/dump/xubuntu-14.04-test-i386.iso{.zsync) should be the fixed version of todays daily.
[21:38] <slickymaster> night all
[21:40] <ochosi> hey slickymaster
[21:40] <slickymaster> hi ochosi
[21:54] <Unit193> brainwash: That's a mighty weird bug, but hitting that one as well as the user one.
[21:56] <jjfrv8> Unit193, that iso looks much more betterer.
[21:58] <Unit193> jjfrv8: Yep, it's just the one merge in, though bugs would have to be filed against the other one of course.  Good that it works for you as well.
[21:59] <jjfrv8> it fixed the automatic login thing too.
[21:59] <Unit193> Yep, was expected.  The language fix is weird, for sure.  That's still a bug.
[22:36] <Unit193> Hopefully I didn't mess that up too much: bug 1259525