[07:53] <danfish> good morning all!
[07:55] <danfish> czajkowski: good game that. Re a match, I suggest a Quins game in Feb/Early March. The Turks Head is a great pub for before the game.
[07:56] <danfish> AlanBell: after discussion with the better half, Thursday 8th December looks good for a Surbiton Happy Hour :)
[09:13] <AlanBell> excellent danfish
[09:19] <danfish> I will look at public houses tomorrow - it's a chore I'm happy to do in the name of software freedom!
[09:23] <AlanBell> well done that man, take one for the team
[09:50] <czajkowski> danfish: sounds like a plan
[10:04] <AlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1412/detail/
[10:04] <AlanBell> and http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1409/detail/
[10:25] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[10:28] <asaaki> hello
[10:28] <asaaki> anyone home?
[10:29]  * AlanBell is at home
[10:29]  * brobostigon is also at home.
[10:29] <brobostigon> o/
[10:31] <asaaki> i'm trying to run a perl tool but get something like this: sh: /home/nlp/yamcha-0.33: Permission denied
[10:32] <asaaki> (is "anyone home?" actually a command on XChat?)
[10:35] <asaaki> howdee
[10:35] <asaaki> anyone
[10:35] <asaaki> ?
[10:35] <LSymonds> Asaaki: Are you using sudo?
[10:35] <LSymonds> Asaaki: and are you a super user?
[10:35] <asaaki> no
[10:35] <asaaki> i tried it as root and tried as a regular user
[10:37] <asaaki> yes i'm a super user
[10:37] <brobostigon> superuser is another word for root.
[10:38] <asaaki> if i work as a regular user and say run the program with sudo, it says: can't locate .pm in @INC
[10:39] <asaaki> even though i just set the variable using export PERL5LIB
[10:39] <brobostigon> did you set it only within your normal user? or within root aswell?
[10:40] <asaaki> both
[10:40] <asaaki> but i dont need to use "sudo" while working as "root", right?
[10:40] <AlanBell> what is it trying to do that it doesn't have permission to do?
[10:40] <AlanBell> is it something that would need root access?
[10:41] <AlanBell> or is it perhaps looking for a file that should have execute permissions?
[10:41] <AlanBell> is yamcha something that we should have heard of?
[10:41] <asaaki> no yamcha is just a tool
[10:41] <asaaki> and the tool i'm using (AMIRA), it uses yamcha
[10:42] <asaaki> but i installed yamcha and i think it's working fine. the make install and everything ran ok
[10:42] <brobostigon> !info yamcha
[10:42] <asaaki> AMIRA's also running okay... except for this
[10:42] <lubotu3`> Package yamcha does not exist in natty
[10:42] <asaaki> http://chasen.org/~taku/software/yamcha/#download
[10:42] <asaaki> it's an external tool
[10:43] <asaaki> nothing to do with ubuntu
[10:43] <asaaki> written in perl i guess
[10:43] <AlanBell> what does it do?
[10:43] <asaaki> it uses support vector machines to organize a given text into linguistic chunks
[10:44] <AlanBell> ah, I see
[10:44] <asaaki> :)
[10:44] <AlanBell> there is *no* way that should need root access
[10:44] <asaaki> so it should work as a regular user..
[10:44] <AlanBell> yes
[10:44] <asaaki> i get the same error, either way
[10:45] <asaaki> what does .sh: /home/nlp/yamcha-0.33: Permission denied even mean? i get that when using another tool that uses this yamcha
[10:45] <AlanBell> is your username nlp?
[10:45] <asaaki> i thought AMIRA is trying to use .sh or something... ?
[10:45] <asaaki> no its not nlp.. thats just the folder where i keep everything
[10:46] <LSymonds> try sudo sh /home/nlp/yamcha-0.33
[10:47] <AlanBell> no, it doesn't need root
[10:47] <asaaki> i just tried sh /home/nlp/yamcha-0.33
[10:47] <asaaki> um nothing happened.. just came on to the next prompt, no permissino denied
[10:47] <AlanBell> so you have a folder in /home/nlp that isn't your home folder
[10:48] <brobostigon> does your current user, have the right permissions to access that folder/directory?
[10:48] <AlanBell> are you the owner of that folder?
[10:48] <asaaki> yes i'm the owner of everything this is my personal laptop
[10:48] <asaaki> i just checked permissions and got this: drwxrwxrwx 13 asaaki asaaki   4096 2011-11-13 09:43 yamcha-0.33
[10:49] <asaaki> so i (asaaki) have full permissions on the yamcha-0.33 folder, no?
[10:49] <AlanBell> at that level you do
[10:49] <AlanBell> what is the command you are running?
[10:49] <asaaki> i run the AMIRA tool which then runs yamcha...
[10:49] <AlanBell> where is the data it is supposed to be reading and where is it supposed to be putting the output?
[10:50] <asaaki>  perl AMIRA.pl config=configs/my.amiraconfig file=firsttest/mada_unbwt_35349_sentences.txt
[10:50] <brobostigon> and isnt sh meant for executing scripts, not folders? as the previous example command was trying to do? or am i missing something.
[10:51] <asaaki> okay let me explain how it's working...
[10:51] <asaaki> i have /home/nlp/AMIRA-2.1 and /home/nlp/yamcha-0.33
[10:51] <asaaki> and the path for yamcha is mentioned right in the AMIRA tool
[10:51] <asaaki> so i go into the amira folder and run amira
[10:51] <asaaki> which is supposed to run yamcha
[10:51] <asaaki> i mean yamcha is just one of the things it runs... it has its own scripts and stuff
[10:52] <asaaki> so it works... but somewhere along the way it gives that permission denied thing, and it gives out the final output, but the output is all blank,because yamcha never worked, or was amira was denied permission to use it or something...
[10:52] <asaaki> i don't know because i'm not sure what sh does
[10:53] <asaaki> example:
[10:53] <asaaki> perl bin/AMIRA.pl config=configs/my.amiraconfig file=firsttest/arabic.SGM
[10:53] <asaaki> Running AMIRA ...
[10:53] <asaaki> Cleaning and converting input...
[10:54] <asaaki> Running yamcha for Tokenization
[10:54] <asaaki> sh: /home/nlp/yamcha-0.33: Permission denied
[10:54] <asaaki>  Producing formatted Tokenization output
[10:55] <asaaki> so the final "formatted tokenization output" just ends as a blank file, since AMIRA didn't get to run yamcha
[10:55] <AlanBell> so in the AMIRA tool it asked for the path to yamacha?
[10:55] <asaaki> yes, and i provided the path correctly (or so i believe):
[10:56] <asaaki> YAMCHA_EXEC = /home/nlp/yamcha-0.33
[10:56] <AlanBell> type "which yamacha"
[10:56] <AlanBell> yeah, that bit is wrong!
[10:56] <asaaki> oh!
[10:56] <AlanBell> it is installed now, /home/nlp/yamacha-0.33 is just the place you built it
[10:56] <AlanBell> so the executable has now been installed at /usr/local/bin/yamacha or /usr/bin/yamacha right?
[10:57] <asaaki> yes!
[10:57] <asaaki> k lemme change it and try
[10:57] <AlanBell> /home/nlp/yamacha-0.33 has no further use, you can delete that if you want :)
[10:58] <asaaki> aha! it's working now! :D
[10:58] <asaaki> thanks
[10:58] <asaaki> first it said the .pm thing not in @INC, so i did export PERL5LIB
[10:59] <asaaki> where can i set this permanently though, so i don't need to export each time?
[10:59] <AlanBell> not sure
[11:00] <asaaki> /home/nlp/AMIRA-2.1/bin/AMIRA-BPCFinal.pl: Error - Unable to open final tokenization output file firsttest/mada_unbwt_35349_sentences.txt.amirabpc for writing.
[11:00] <asaaki> don't think this is a tool-specific problem... but ubuntu permissions again?
[11:01] <asaaki> i looked at the folder and that long file with .amirabpc extension has a lock on it
[11:24] <asaaki> ok it's working fine now
[11:24] <asaaki> :)
[11:24] <asaaki> bye have a nice day! :)
[11:26] <czajkowski> http://glow-london.blogspot.com/2011/11/glow-on-november-28th.html  if anyone is interested
[11:27] <brobostigon> lol, reginald d hunter, just mentioned using a schredder, to shred marajuana, on the bbc.
[12:54] <penguin42> anyone know a source of cheap dual port pci-e low profile network cards? There are loads of places that google search shows as having startech ones for about £25 - but they're all out of stock, and the next ones are ~£100
[13:29] <popey> wheee
[13:40] <DaveBug> woo - übersplit!
[13:56] <bigcalm> So far only 6 people might or might not be attending the xmas meal. I wish more peepes would sign up: http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1409/detail/
[14:04] <nymwar> This may sound like a strange request, but how do I edit my user details on http://ubuntuforums.org ?
[14:04] <nymwar> If I click on "user CP" (don't no what CP means) I just get a message saying "you do not have permission to access this page"
[14:09] <nymwar> My user details on ubuntuforums are way out of date.  According to this I'm still on 9.04
[14:11] <AlanBell> bigcalm: I did email the canonical-uk list but I got held in moderation, no idea if my mails there ever get through
[14:13] <czajkowski> AlanBell: just ask one of the London offices to forward it on
[14:15] <nymwar> Also another question.  I've developed some software and packaged it, but I'd like to include a screenshot when it gets opened in the Software Center.  Any ideas on how to do that?
[14:15] <czajkowski> I think maybe not having a date in mind may be a factor for some
[14:15] <AlanBell> probably, bit catch 22 though
[14:16] <AlanBell> well I will set a date for it on Monday
[14:16] <czajkowski> aye
[14:16] <czajkowski> nice idea
[14:17] <czajkowski> for something different mind you
[14:17] <AlanBell> emailing people at canonical tends to be less than entirely productive
[14:17] <czajkowski> I may pop along afterwards for drinks, but the dininig experience is not something I'd enjoy tbh
[14:17] <czajkowski> but I think tis a nice idea for something new
[14:17] <czajkowski> AlanBell: I poked TREllis for the happy hour to send mail to the office
[14:17] <AlanBell> print announcement, take train to millbank, beg to be let in, stick announcement on fridge
[14:18] <AlanBell> that appears to be the correct procedure
[14:18] <czajkowski> heheh
[14:19] <AlanBell> I emailed marianna and silbs about it a few weeks ago, before UDS and got no reply
[14:20] <Pendulum> AlanBell: unfortunately that's a bad time to e-mail those 2
[14:20] <AlanBell> and I emailed them again on thursday
[14:22] <AlanBell> nymwar: http://screenshots.ubuntu.com/upload (ignore the debian branding)
[14:23] <nymwar> I've looked at that, but my package isn't an official debian repository one.
[14:24] <czajkowski> 6
[14:25] <czajkowski> AlanBell: I'm sure someone will get it circulated, I'd say they probably do their own xmas bash as well
[14:25] <AlanBell> probably
[14:26] <TREllis> AlanBell: ah, never saw a mail from you on canonical-uk
[14:26] <AlanBell> does anyone do moderation on that list?
[14:27] <AlanBell> do my mails just go to /dev/null
[14:27] <TREllis> I expect there is someone doing it, but it might have got put to /dev/null :-)
[14:27] <czajkowski> TREllis: morning :)
[14:27] <TREllis> czajkowski: morning
[14:28] <TREllis> of course, now you can bribe popey to posting it to an internal list :-)
[14:29] <AlanBell> yeah, but that will cost me a lot of beers
[14:30] <Pendulum> AlanBell: he doesn't owe you a lot of beers already?
[14:30] <AlanBell> there are various people I can poke to send mails internally, (chris kenyon, popey, TREllis, Matt Barker, Amanda Brock) but they all seem to be kind of an unofficial route in
[14:31] <Pendulum> I don't think there is an official route in for non-Canonical folks
[14:31] <AlanBell> Pendulum: oh, probably :)
[14:31] <TREllis> AlanBell: 2nd Dec is the Canonical party, so if you want a chance of anyone making it... don't book anything up for that date :)
[14:31] <Pendulum> which isn't surprising
[14:31] <AlanBell> TREllis: good to know, thanks
[14:32] <AlanBell> TREllis: there is a happy hour in surbiton on the 8th December
[14:32] <AlanBell> I sent an email about that to canonical-uk as well
[14:34] <bastubis> Speaking of meetups, Flossie London meetup starts in 30 mins - we'll be tweeting on #flossie and in the #fossbox channel on freenode as well as hanging out here messing about with alternive social networking. All women welcome
[14:35] <TREllis> AlanBell: ah. No sign of that one either, if you want something fwded on, I'm happy to do that
[14:36] <AlanBell> just this https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/2011-November/032000.html I put canonical-uk in bcc
[14:37] <AlanBell> I think very few people in the office are on the ubuntu-uk mailing list, which is fine, but occasionally it would be nice to invite them to events we are organising
[14:39] <penguin42> file a lp entry....
[14:40] <AlanBell> penguin42: what do you mean?
[14:40] <penguin42> AlanBell: Bug on Ubuntu 'Christmas party bookings not needed' and assign it to a bunch of people :-)
[14:41] <penguin42> ^needed^added
[14:41] <AlanBell> interesting idea!
[14:43] <penguin42> (but don't blame me.....101 tips for abusing bug trackers....)
[15:00] <DJones> Hmmh, which ubuntu download do I need when I get this error message Ubuntu – This kernel requires an x86-64 CPU, but only detected an i686 CPU.
[15:00] <DJones> I'd downloaded the default 32 bit version, but thats the error I get
[15:02] <DJones> I thought the i386/32 bit version was the right one
[15:06] <popey> is it an old computer?
[15:06] <popey> whats the filename of the iso?
[15:06] <DJones> Hmmh, i386 desktop cd gives the error, i386 alternate cd doesn't
[15:06] <DJones> Its about 4-5 years old
[15:07] <DJones> iso is ubuntu-11.10-desktop-i386.iso
[15:07] <popey> what cpu is it?
[15:07] <DJones> alternate cd is working ok
[15:07] <DJones> Not sure, its my mums old laptop
[15:07] <popey> what make & model?
[15:08] <DJones> Its a compaq presario c300
[15:09] <popey> which specific one?
[15:09] <popey> there's loads
[15:09] <popey> should have a model number on the underside
[15:09] <popey> http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechSupport/ProductList.jsp?lang=en&cc=us&prodTypeId=321957&prodSeriesId=3213865&taskId=135
[15:10] <DJones> I know, I can't tell, the labels have faded on it
[15:10] <DJones> Thats the list I'm looking at
[15:10] <popey> heh
[15:10] <DJones> I'll see what comes up when its installed
[15:11] <DJones> Looks like it might be a celeron M 1.6Ghz
[15:12] <DJones> The rest of these spec's look the same & I think when I went into the bios it said 1.6Ghz http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080330041427AATaUuX
[15:12] <Oli> That should be well within the realms of i386.
[15:13] <Oli> I'd just try to verify that whatever you're booting it from is actually using the 32bit ISO. Sounds like an impossibly simple mistake but I'm sure it's possible!
[15:15] <DJones> "ubuntu-11.10-desktop-i386" Downloaded direct from ubuntu website
[15:15] <popey> i have burned two coasters now
[15:15] <popey> this is getting annoying
[15:17] <popey> md5sum is okay
[15:17] <DJones> md5 for the iso matches c396dd0f97bd122691bdb92d7e68fde5 *ubuntu-11.10-desktop-i386.iso
[15:17] <popey> brasero barfs at the very end
[15:18] <Oli> popey: have you turned off manual checking? I know we've had a few people on AU who find that turning off the verification process lets the disk finalise.
[15:18] <Oli> I'll try and find a thread to confirm that.
[15:18] <popey> what option is that?
[15:18] <Oli> http://askubuntu.com/questions/20148/how-can-i-disable-checksum-future-in-brasero
[15:19] <popey> I only have a 'use burnproof' option
[15:19] <popey> the error I am getting is media sense failure
[15:19] <DJones> I downloaded Ubuntu 11.10 - Latest version, 32-bit (recommended) from http://www.ubuntu.com/download/ubuntu/download
[15:20] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/737300/
[15:20] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/737301/
[15:20]  * popey smiles at 737300
[15:20] <popey> errors at the bottom
[15:21] <popey> the second one was burned at a much lower speed
[15:21] <popey> both on CRR
[15:21] <popey> *CDR
[15:21] <christel> bigcalm: done, albeit depending on the final date :)
[15:22] <buzz_> grumble. svn-load worked a couple of years ago.. then it broken with newer python. then it worked again for natty and now it's broken again on oneiric :(
[15:22] <buzz_> back to old perl then
[15:22]  * popey tries those options
[15:36] <popey> yay
[15:36] <popey> burned better
[15:36] <popey> thanks Oli
[15:37] <Oli> That worked? I'm surprised - I thought your issue looked a little different. There are certainly some bugs in Brasero that need serious attention.
[15:40] <popey> well, also I used a dvdr rather than cdr, so could be a different code path
[15:40] <popey> i didnt want to waste another cdr
[16:17] <Azelphur> got a networked printer, when I try to print on it from another machine it's demanding authentication. How do I turn that off?
[16:22] <Azelphur> it's quite annoying, I see no settings for it in the printer settings, all the info I've found so far on the web is outdated/wrong, and I never set a password in the first place for there to be one!
[16:26] <popey> Azelphur: when you say "in the printer settings" where is that?
[16:26] <popey> cups on your pc or browser pointed at the printer IP?
[16:26] <Azelphur> system-config-printer
[16:26] <popey> try pointing a browser at it
[16:27] <Azelphur> what port?
[16:27] <popey> they often have a webserver with settings in there
[16:27] <popey> 80 ☺
[16:27] <popey> or nmap it ☺
[16:27] <Azelphur> I already have a webserver running on port 80 so it's not 80
[16:27] <popey> no, on the printer
[16:27] <popey> http://ip_address_of_printer/
[16:27] <Azelphur> sorry, I mean I have a normal printer and am trying to share it
[16:27] <Azelphur> really bad wording there
[16:28] <popey> ah, sorry, thought it was networked
[16:28] <Azelphur> hehe
[16:28] <Azelphur> so laptop is trying to connect to pc to print
[16:28] <Azelphur> but pc is asking for authentication, which is silly :S
[16:31] <popey> its samba innit?
[16:32] <Azelphur> nah, cups
[16:32] <Azelphur> oh hey, success, re-added it as ipp instead of cups and now it seems to be going
[16:45] <christel> AlanBell: hoi! you around?
[16:48] <freakyclown> guys... anyone xubuntu gurus about?
[16:53] <Azelphur> !ask | freakyclown
[16:53] <lubotu3`> freakyclown: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience
[16:54] <freakyclown> er.. i was asking if someone who might be able to help was about...rathe rthan waste my time asking a question that will be ignored by those that cant help...
[16:57] <penguin42> freakyclown: Indeed but it's quicker to ask the question :-)
[16:57] <Azelphur> ^
[16:57] <penguin42> so, what was the question anyway?
[17:00]  * AlanBell wonders whether to say yes to christel
[17:01] <Azelphur> AlanBell: don't do it, it's a trap. Run.
[17:01] <AlanBell> I think it might be
[17:01] <AlanBell> freakyclown: there is #xubuntu which might be a better place to ask unspecified xubuntu questions
[17:02] <Azelphur> this is why I use the bot to reply to people that don't ask a question, 99% of the time no matter what you do, they won't actually ask the question.
[17:02] <Azelphur> It's like they want you to bludgeon them with a baseball bat to extort the question :P
[17:03] <AlanBell> I suspect freakyclown was going to ask a difficult question anyway :)
[17:03] <Azelphur> hehe
[17:03] <Azelphur> I've been using xfce for a while and I'm quite familiar with it now \o/
[17:03] <Azelphur> been using it as my main OS since 11.10 beta
[17:03]  * penguin42 tried it for a while, but decided to go with KDE in the end
[17:04] <AlanBell> because they haven't broken multimonitor support in that?
[17:04] <Azelphur> AlanBell: correct
[17:04] <Azelphur> AlanBell: not only is it not broken, but it actually seems to be supported, I can set my wallpaper per monitor and stuff
[17:04] <AlanBell> nice
[17:05] <Azelphur> I actually quite like Unity, I use it on my laptops
[17:05] <Azelphur> but when it comes to my PC, it just doesn't work so I can't use it :P
[17:06] <christel> AlanBell: hehe -- do you know of any car rental places closer to farnham than farnborough? :)
[17:06] <AlanBell> yeah, unity is OK, just various things like multi monitor and accessibility were not considered in the design phase, so got broken by design and now they are gradually being unbroken again
[17:06] <christel> renault needs 10 working days to replace the key for my car apparently
[17:07] <AlanBell> christel: there is one in Aldershot fairly near the station
[17:07] <christel> (admittedly it may have been silly of me to step on it with heels)
[17:07] <christel> i tried to google and it wanted to send me to somewhere in liphook, i've no idea where that even is!
[17:07] <AlanBell> I avoid wearing heels specifically to not break my car keys
[17:07] <Pendulum> christel: 10 working days o.O
[17:07] <christel> AlanBell: lovely! i shall stalk it
[17:07] <christel> Pendulum: yeah, they insist they need that long to get one from the manufacturer
[17:08] <christel> at which point they insist on towing my car from my house to their place to program the new key
[17:08] <christel> they tried to insist i drive it there
[17:08] <AlanBell> enterprise on arthur street
[17:08] <penguin42> christel: So if you stood on that one with the heels what did you do with your spare?
[17:08] <Azelphur> christel: if they are cheap, perhaps get a spare in case one gets lost or stepped on :)
[17:08] <christel> but after i while they understood that i couldn't start it
[17:08] <Azelphur> then you won't be out of a care should something go wrong next time lol
[17:08] <AlanBell> keys are no longer simple things
[17:08] <christel> penguin42: well.. i had two spares.. they have vanishd
[17:08] <Azelphur> car*
[17:08] <Azelphur> haha
[17:08] <Azelphur> now that's just bad luck
[17:08] <christel> Azelphur: mmm 200 for the replacement, 50 for the programming and god knows what for the towing!
[17:09] <Azelphur> christel: ouch :/
[17:09] <AlanBell> keys are getting so complicated now that if you lose one it is probably easier to get a new car
[17:09] <christel> no kidding!
[17:09] <penguin42> anyone use lxc ? How easy is it to setup?
[17:10] <christel> my car is rubbish mind, i think i've spent a lot more on parts and silly repairs than the car actual cost me
[17:10] <christel> (i am very much not buying a renault again)
[17:10]  * bigcalm returns from shopping!
[17:11] <penguin42> bigcalm: What did you get?
[17:12] <bigcalm> penguin42: half of Sainsbury's stock by the looks of it
[17:18] <penguin42> bigcalm: Oh cool, in that case just let me store the chocolate for you....
[17:27] <freakyclown> back sorry - major problem just then when i broke things worse :/
[17:28] <freakyclown> so running ubuntu 11.10 with unity etc... installed xubuntu-desktop - logged out/reboot and at the purple login screen I select xfce||xubuntu session
[17:29] <freakyclown> i see the xfce/xubuntu desktop flash up but then the purple screen is laying on top of everything so i cant use anythign at all
[17:29] <Azelphur> is the purple screen the default Ubuntu wallpaper? perhaps nautilus is drawing the desktop for some reason
[17:30] <freakyclown> dont think its the deafult desktop
[17:30] <bigcalm> freakyclown: open a terminal and kill nautils(sp?)
[17:30] <freakyclown> i cant open a terminal ;)
[17:30] <bigcalm> ctrl + alt + f2
[17:30] <freakyclown> oh i guess i could switch tty
[17:31] <freakyclown> ok brb let me log out and try again
[17:33] <bigcalm> freakyclown: how did you install xubuntu ?
[17:33] <freakyclown> right... ok nautilus wasnt running
[17:34] <freakyclown> and its definatly not the default desktop
[17:34] <bigcalm> I made the mistake of installing xfce instead of xubuntu-desktop
[17:34] <freakyclown> its the purple screen with the white dots over it.. and ubuntu 11.10 written on the bottom left
[17:35] <darael> freakyclown: Does an alt-click and drag do anything to the floating whatsit?
[17:36] <freakyclown> http://www.extremetech.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/ubuntu-11.10-login-crop.jpg
[17:36] <freakyclown> i get that screen but without the login prompt/other/guest account part
[17:36] <freakyclown> so i select xfce/xubuntu from the drop down box..put in my password
[17:37] <freakyclown> xfce loads and the screen flickers back and forth btween the xfce desktop and the purple screen
[17:37] <freakyclown> then finishs on the purple screen
[17:37] <bigcalm> Your machine is possessed
[17:37] <freakyclown> and i cant do anything :/
[17:37] <freakyclown> indeed :(
[17:37] <Azelphur> freakyclown: did you install xubuntu-desktop or xfce
[17:38] <freakyclown> xubuntu-desktop
[17:38] <Azelphur> hmm
[17:38] <Azelphur> does Ubuntu work?
[17:38] <freakyclown> i uninstalled unity...and well...lets just say that was a scary moment :/
[17:38] <freakyclown> yeah im on that now
[17:38] <darael> If it's a window being drawn by some program, dropping to a tty and doing "DISPLAY=:0.0 xprop | less", going back to the desktop, clicking it, and returning to the tty /might/ get some info on it.  Just an idea.
[17:39] <Azelphur> that's a good idea ^
[17:41] <freakyclown> ok let me try that...brb
[17:44] <freakyclown> mmm ok i get alot of stuff back
[17:45] <freakyclown> what am i trying to find?
[17:49] <Azelphur> freakyclown: DISPLAY=:0.0 xprop | pastebinit
[17:49] <Azelphur> give link to us so we can see it :D
[17:50] <popey> I appear to have managed to install a system with username and hostname swapped
[17:50]  * penguin42 gives up on lxc
[17:50] <penguin42> doing a lxc-start on my newly created container kills the X of the host
[17:51] <bigcalm> popey: are you going to the xmas uu meal?
[17:51] <popey> hard to say without knowing when it is
[17:52] <AlanBell> when would you like it to be?
[17:52] <bigcalm> popey: then you can put yourself down as a maybe :)
[17:52] <popey> hmm
[17:53] <DJones> Finally, 11.10 installed, updated & broadcom wireless hit with a mallet
[17:56] <freakyclown> http://pastebin.com/BTNvxbgz
[18:26]  * freakyclown gives in trying to get it working
[18:26] <freakyclown> i need a working lappy for work tomorrow
[18:26] <freakyclown> :/
[18:32] <penguin42> freakyclown: Which display manager are you using? Lightdm?
[18:39] <popey> in unity2d is it possible to make the launcher not hide/
[18:46]  * mattt can't wait to get his hands on a raspberrypi board
[18:47]  * penguin42 can't wait to get his hands on his apple crumble; it should be done in about 15mins
[18:47] <mattt> mmm
[18:49] <czajkowski> .c
[19:00] <ixxvil> anyone codes in php a lot?
[19:00] <ixxvil> whats with php converting . to _?
[19:01] <ixxvil> unexpected behaviours
[19:02] <bigcalm> ixxvil: in what context?
[19:02] <LSymonds> ixxvil: what do you mean?
[19:02] <ixxvil> http://ca.php.net/variables.external
[19:03] <ixxvil> Dots in incoming variable names
[19:03] <bigcalm> Note:
[19:03] <bigcalm> Dots and spaces in variable names are converted to underscores. For example <input name="a.b" /> becomes $_REQUEST["a_b"].
[19:04] <ixxvil> so question is why does it convert dots to _?
[19:04] <bigcalm> It's intended behaviour
[19:04] <ixxvil> intended?
[19:04] <ixxvil> how so?
[19:04] <bigcalm> It's within the description on the page, not as part of a user comment
[19:07] <ixxvil> interesting
[19:14] <freakyclown> arggghhh help guys... i tried removing xubuntu-desktop
[19:14] <freakyclown> and now for some reason on reboot i get an xubuntu splash loading bar/screen
[19:14] <freakyclown> and it hangs there
[19:22] <darael> freakyclown: Dost thou get a grub menu on boot?  If so, edit the entry before booting (e, I think, but it's displayed what key to use) and remove the word "splash" from the kernel line.  That ought to bypass the splash screen.
[19:22] <freakyclown> nope
[19:23] <ubuntubhoy> press 'esc' after the bios screen
[19:23] <ubuntubhoy> should bring up grub
[19:23] <darael> The grub menu is usually accessed, when it's set not to display, by holding shift immediately after the bios screen.
[19:24] <darael> ubuntubhoy: My memory is that that's for grub.  For grub2 (which has been default for a few releases now) it's shift.
[19:24] <freakyclown> ok ill have to try that
[19:24]  * penguin42 burps in an appley manner
[19:24] <ubuntubhoy> TBH I've not used it since legacy
[19:24] <freakyclown> i can see the boot sequence
[19:24] <freakyclown> and i see the userspace splash start and stop
[19:25] <freakyclown> and i get to "stopping boot sequence OK"
[19:25] <darael> And it hangs there?  If so, canst thou drop to a TTY, or have they not started yet?
[19:28] <penguin42> freakyclown: try a ctrl-alt-f1 to see if you get any more
[19:29] <freakyclown> ok so i got rid of the splash and quiet from the startup
[19:30] <freakyclown> still stuck :/
[19:30] <penguin42> freakyclown: Did you change display manager or are you still on lightdm?
[19:30] <freakyclown> i had changed it to gdm
[19:31] <freakyclown> but changed it back
[19:31] <penguin42> freakyclown: OK, it's probably lightdm freaking out - it tends to break badly
[19:31] <freakyclown> awesome :(
[19:31] <penguin42> freakyclown: try ctrl-alt-f1 when it hangs to see if you get a login
[19:32] <freakyclown> yeah im on another tty to chat on irc
[19:32] <penguin42> freakyclown: OK, so nuke lightdm
[19:32] <penguin42> freakyclown: There may be some useful logs in /etc/lightdm as to why it broke - possibly because you haven't reinstalled the greeter it's configured for
[19:33] <popey> more likely /var/log/lightdm than /etc/lightdm
[19:33] <penguin42> oops yes, sorry
[19:34] <freakyclown> ooooooooook thats odd
[19:34] <freakyclown> ......
[19:34] <freakyclown> lightdm wasnt running
[19:34] <freakyclown> so i run it and got a login screen!
[19:34] <penguin42> hmm curious
[19:35]  * freakyclown ponders
[19:40] <freakyclown> mmm installed gdm
[19:40] <freakyclown> and thats fixed it
[19:40] <freakyclown> still no idea why i have a xubuntu splash screen though
[19:40] <freakyclown> but sod it - its working enough for work tomorrow!
[19:41]  * freakyclown owes penguin42 a pint
[19:41] <freakyclown> wouldnt have found the lightdm thing not working when i assumed it was!
[19:41] <penguin42> freakyclown: It seems to be a generic known bug with lightdm that it has many ways in 11.10 of just going 'no, I'm sulking'
[19:42] <freakyclown> rofl
[19:43] <freakyclown> anyway gotta get on the road now - cheers
[19:43] <penguin42> no problem; I'll remember the IoU for a pint of hot chocolate....
[20:31] <czajkowski> hmm I've been asked to speak at a scotish event ;)
[20:32] <mgdm> czajkowski: In April?
[20:34] <ubuntubhoy> Does it involve booze ?
[20:35] <czajkowski> mgdm: aye
[20:35] <czajkowski> ubuntubhoy: no idea
[20:35] <ubuntubhoy> Being a Scot, I can tell you it will go better if it does
[20:35] <mgdm> czajkowski: Cool, if you go, I'll see you there
[20:40] <mattt> ubuntubhoy: where in scotland?
[20:48] <ubuntubhoy> mattt, Glasgow
[20:58] <mattt> ubuntubhoy: nice, you enjoy living there?
[20:58]  * mattt wants to move to skye
[20:59] <ubuntubhoy> Skye, and Glasgow are worlds apart
[20:59]  * mgdm moved from Lewis to Glasgow last year
[20:59] <ubuntubhoy> feck, its jock city in here :D
[20:59] <ubuntubhoy> but yeah, I like Glasgow
[20:59] <ubuntubhoy> most of the time
[21:00] <mattt> ubuntubhoy: yeah, wasn't implying they were similar :P
[21:00] <mattt> mgdm: what'd you do that for?
[21:00] <ubuntubhoy> the grass is always greener
[21:00] <mgdm> mattt: got bored of Lewis, and got a job here
[21:01] <mattt> yeah, to be honest, i'd probably go mental on skye :P
[21:01] <mattt> but would love to give it a shot
[21:02] <ubuntubhoy> I am and think always will be a city boy
[21:02] <mgdm> I think I am too, despite not having been born in one :-)
[21:10] <mattt> mgdm: what kind of work did you do while in lewis?
[21:11] <mgdm> mattt: sysadmin/PHP coder
[21:11] <mgdm> now I just do the PHP
[21:12] <mattt> mgdm: work from home or something?  :P
[21:12] <mgdm> mattt: nope
[21:14] <mattt> jeez, must have been a miracle finding that
[21:15] <mgdm> Not really
[21:15] <mgdm> there's a lot of IT companies in Stornoway
[21:18] <LSymonds> Jobs.
[21:18] <LSymonds> If only I had one.
[21:26] <czajkowski> http://www.open-source-scotland.com/
[21:30] <ubuntubhoy> east coast
[21:30] <LSymonds> czajkowski, shame I'm no where near Edinburgh!
[21:32] <czajkowski> LSymonds: neither am I
[21:40] <mattt> jeez, some good speakers at that conference
[22:04] <diplo> evening all
[22:04] <AlanBell> happy hour \o/ http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1412/detail/
[22:39] <AlanBell> window 28


[00:35] <Kangarooo> hello. in https://help.launchpad.net/BlueprintDocumentation theres link https://help.launchpad.net/GreatSpecifications Examples of good specifications and it doesnt opens.
[00:36] <Kangarooo> ups.. in that 2nd liink theres 4th link https://launchpad.canonical.com/TranslationUploads and its not allowed to be seen..
[00:36] <Kangarooo> Carlos Perello Marin's Rosetta Import Process spec thats not posible to view
[00:36] <Kangarooo> and why i cant make blueprint about ubuntu package exo ?
[10:29] <rigved> hi everyone
[10:29] <rigved> has anyone checked the bug - UnknownTimeZoneError-Asia/Kolkata?
[12:28] <ari-tczew> 503 Service Unavailable         No server is available to handle this request.
[12:28] <ari-tczew> :(
[16:58] <bulldog98> is an launchpad admin in here?
[16:58] <bulldog98> because I wanted to ask how I can speed up PPA delation (I need to create an new PPA named that way)
[17:27] <ikus060> Hello, I need some help of how to use launchpad to make a nightly build of a project that have it's source code in SVN
[17:28] <ikus060> by nightly build, I mean debian package nightly build
[17:33] <ikus060> Hello ?
[18:13] <rigved> hi everyone
[18:14] <rigved> will launchpad upgrade to the new moin version any time soon?
[22:35] <Kerrick> How the do I hide my email address?
[22:37] <wgrant> Kerrick: Down the bottom of https://launchpad.net/people/+me/+edit.
[22:39] <Kerrick> OK, thank you. The interface is very counterintuitive; I'd expect the option to be on the same page where you add and remove e-mail addresses.
[22:41] <wgrant> Kerrick: Bug #109500
[22:42] <sinzui> Maybe I can fix that as a part of the bugjam...and move mailing list subscriptions to a separate form
[22:43] <wgrant> The email address form is a bit special, IIRC.
[22:46] <KombuchaKip> I'm having trouble checking out my bzr repo on Launchpad. I think I might be using the wrong checkout URL. This is the branch: https://code.launchpad.net/~kip/avaneya/trunk
[22:46] <blueglasses> how do i configure the project branch in lauchpad? it says the word for my project is too small
[22:46] <KombuchaKip> I am trying bzr checkout lp:avaneya to no avail.
[22:46] <KombuchaKip> Keep getting bzr: ERROR: Not a branch: "bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/%2Bbranch/avaneya/"
[22:46] <wgrant> KombuchaKip: There's nothing there to check out -- you need to push to the branch first.
[22:47] <KombuchaKip> wgrant: So there is no empty repository even?
[22:47] <wgrant> blueglasses: What exactly are you trying to do, and what's the error message that you're getting?
[22:47] <wgrant> KombuchaKip: No.
[22:47] <KombuchaKip> wgrant: I thought push was just for the decentralized model? Do you mean commit in my case for centralized model?
[22:47] <blueglasses> let me think a bit
[22:47] <blueglasses> ...
[22:48] <wgrant> KombuchaKip: You need to push the first time, to get the branch onto the server.
[22:48] <wgrant> So.
[22:48] <wgrant> 'bzr init' in your code directory, to create the branch.
[22:48] <wgrant> Then 'bzr push --use-existing-dir lp:avaneya' to push the branch up to LP.
[22:48] <KombuchaKip> wgrant: Ok. I don't want to commit the stuff in there yet though. Can I push nothing?
[22:49] <wgrant> Then 'bzr bind lp:avaneya' to automatically push future commits.
[22:49] <wgrant> KombuchaKip: I think so.
[22:49] <KombuchaKip> wgrant: Ok
[22:50] <KombuchaKip> wgrant: Thanks! It worked.
[22:51] <wgrant> KombuchaKip: Normally you wouldn't create the branch on LP first. You'd just push up to a new name.
[22:51] <KombuchaKip> wgrant: Ah makes sense.
[22:53] <KombuchaKip> wgrant: I'm finding the nautilus plugin pretty helpful.
[22:54] <blueglasses> I'm trying to configure project branch
[22:57] <wgrant> blueglasses: Which project? Do you want to host a new branch on Launchpad?
[22:57] <blueglasses> the project name is already defined: story
[22:58] <blueglasses> I also have files already there, just to test
[22:58] <wgrant> In the 'testingbzr' branch?
[22:58] <blueglasses> probably
[22:58] <blueglasses> i'm still a noob on bzr


[02:48] <dobey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-touch-meta/+bug/1265689 has been very annoying since saucy
[08:00] <timppa> Hi, when is the terminal app going to be repaired?
[09:39] <leemeng0x61> Nexus4 4.4.3  wifi is connected, but can't connect to www
[09:39] <drubadur> What about an instant messenger? Anything's going on?!
[10:04] <davmor2> Morning all
[10:55] <davmor2> Who is the best person to quiz on bluez?
[10:58] <popey> davmor2: cyphermox?
[10:59] <davmor2> popey: oh okay I thought it was someone else unfortunately I've been alseep and stuff since then :D
[11:10] <johnny_|_> Hi. In integration mode with desktop during phone calls -- does this use microphone of the desktop computer. If yes, how is input routed to the phone? (via hdmi or via software by sockets or something else?)
[14:09] <tobCO44> Any efforts to create a jabber cilent?
[14:10] <popey> tobCO44: not that I'm aware of, would be interesting to see something that maybe re-used existing libraries
[14:10] <popey> with a qml frontend
[14:11] <tobCO44> popey: pitty that there is no core app.. :-/
[14:12] <popey> I'd love to see one that supported more protocols
[14:12] <popey> and more secure protocols like bitmessage or torchat
[14:18] <davmor2> popey, tobCO44: I don't think it would be that hard if you got the mission-control plugin from telepathy installed and then you just need a qml frontend that speaks to it
[14:37] <Tachyon`> any updates to fix the missing update command issue on 4.4.2 yet?
[14:45] <tobCO44> davmor2, popey: I wonder why it's missing! Seems so basic, at least it 'feels more core' than e.g. a stock ticker... Maybe there is more complication behind?!
[14:45] <popey> tobCO44: there's no backstory. Just that nobody has stepped up to make one yet
[14:46] <davmor2> tobCO44: someone has to care enough to write it and it's really not a 5 minute job but it is a doable one
[14:46] <popey> There's a small problem that it can't run in the background, so you'd have to have the app open to receive notifications
[14:46] <davmor2> tobCO44: also I'm not sure there is an easy way currently to install the plugin
[14:48] <tobCO44> popey: no background service? That's huge! Are they gonna fix/change this?
[14:49] <tobCO44> so it's not surprising that there is no IM yet
[14:54] <sergiusens> davmor2, popey the messaging app can service as a chat application, or use to be able to at least
[14:54] <popey> true
[14:56] <davmor2> sergiusens: right so you just need to be able to add the plugins that you need and add an account, but there is currently no way to do that is there?
[14:56] <sergiusens> davmor2, from cli there should be
[14:57] <davmor2> sergiusens: you need to get your head out of cli land ;)  CLI is no place for a phone user thank you very much ;)
[14:58] <sergiusens> davmor2, ah, yeah, but building the ui into settings to add an account should be much easier than creating a messaging app ;-)
[15:00] <davmor2> sergiusens: yeah indeed, my point was though if you wanted a dedicated app then in theory you should only need to write a nice gui in qml and just plug it into accounts and telepathy right?
[15:01] <sergiusens> davmor2, yup
[15:03] <dobey> davmor2: problem is that you need new account plug-ins for UOA, and some way to install them, first
[15:03] <johnny_|_> In integration mode with desktop during phone calls -- does this use microphone of the desktop computer. If yes, how is input routed to the phone? (via hdmi or via software by sockets or something else?)a
[15:03] <davmor2> sergiusens: in which case there needs to be a way to add the telepathy plugins into mission-control correct which is possibly harder in click form than on the desktop deb
[15:03] <dobey> davmor2: the current ones are just the code in empathy being patched, which isn't acceptable for the phone
[15:04] <davmor2> dobey: indeed there are lots of flaws that need to be ironed out, it is more just the simplest theory :)
[15:05] <dobey> davmor2: i wouldn't call it simple, but telepathy would be the way to have IM, indeed. the problem is all the integration work that hasn't been done :)
[15:07] <Dandel> davmor2, I was wondering if there is any plans for a modified recovery image that can be used to ease porting ubuntu touch to devices.
[15:08] <davmor2> Dandel: no idea
[15:08] <Dandel> I figure it would be extremely useful to kickstart some devices... namely an image that is meant to test most of the basic functions that users would expect.
[15:10] <Dandel> basic features such as Correct Screen Resolution, Buttons ( Power/volume keys), touchscreen configuration, wifi ( a must for most devices), and led settings.
[15:12] <cwayne> cyphermox, hi, are you the correct one to ping re: gallery-app autopilot tests?
[15:12] <cyphermox> don't know about correct one, but you can certainly ask about it
[15:12] <cyphermox> what's up?
[15:13] <cyphermox> you want me to get tests re-run in jenkins?
[15:14] <cwayne> cyphermox, nah i'm seeing a lot of issues with the tests running on the touch_custom image, and I'm having trouble figuring out why
[15:14] <untitled1> Hello there I have a bunch of questions today.  1)  my creator is not working at all I have tried to launch it from the command line and also tried to launch it in customwizard verbose and nothing. All I get is  Registered the AalSensorPlugin types  ,  then a seg fault. I am on trusty and fully updated.  any one else have this trouble ?  I know tha
[15:14] <untitled1> t the libs are working because I can use them in other versions of the creator and also can use via command line.
[15:14] <cwayne> it seems to not be loading our custom theme, which is breaking all the tests, but when you launch gallery-app normally, it works fine
[15:14] <cwayne> but launching from autopilot shows no theme
[15:14] <cwayne> cyphermox, ^
[15:15] <cyphermox> ok
[15:15] <sergiusens> Dandel, there is no generic image like on x86 if that is what you are asking for
[15:16] <pmcgowan> untitled1, are you referring to the startup disk creator?
[15:16] <cyphermox> cwayne: tbh I have no idea what that might be, but I accept the challenge ;)
[15:16] <untitled1> 2) I have mad a chroot of ubuntu armhf and have compiled a debian package from it.  I then installed this to my phone but it will not show up in unity8 nor can I run it via ssh I get a QUbuntu can not and then crash any tips
[15:17] <untitled1> pmcgowan: no I am talking about qtcreator sorry sould have said that
[15:17] <davmor2> cyphermox: are you the man to annoy with bluetooth issues.  Headset connects now but doesn't actually work.  Just installed android to confirm it isn't the headset but it is working perfectly there :(
[15:17] <Dandel> sergiusens, Thanks... I was just was wondering since this type of image is generally extremely useful for porting ( cyanogenmod porting is usually started by porting clockworkmod to the device )
[15:17] <pmcgowan> untitled1, not aware of any issues, maybe bzoltan would know
[15:18] <untitled1> ping bzoltan ^^ :)
[15:18] <cyphermox> davmor2: yeah, I know about the problem. the headset doesn't get properly paired up in the bluetooth applet
[15:18] <cwayne> cyphermox, i like it :)  so does autopilot launch the app differently or anything?  we're definitely seeing errors that the theme isn't found, but launching from the app scope always finds it..
[15:18] <cyphermox> cwayne: no idea. I'll take a look at the code
[15:18] <cyphermox> cwayne: could you paste me the errors?
[15:19] <untitled1> I am also looking for someone to make autopilot scripts and tests for me as I am not good at python.
[15:19] <davmor2> cyphermox: no that is fixed now, this seems to happen on the desktop too, it connects but if I run the sound test on the device nothing
[15:19] <cyphermox> davmor2: you on a thinkpad?
[15:19] <davmor2> cyphermox: ideapad
[15:20] <cyphermox> nothing related to bluetooth has changed. the indicator on touch fails miserably to properly connect the device, it pairs but incorrectly connects the audio part
[15:20] <untitled1> Like I have some c++ functions that could be tested the QQuickView could be tested ect.  But never used auto pilot
[15:20] <davmor2> cyphermox: but I have a usb BT connector I can add too
[15:20] <cyphermox> davmor2: it might be the bluetooth adapter on your ideapad if it's a broadcom
[15:20] <cwayne> cyphermox, http://ci.ubuntu.com/smokeng/trusty/touch_custom/mako/105:20140103:20131223.2/5854/gallery-app-autopilot/631630/
[15:21] <davmor2> cyphermox: ah okay so before it wasn't doing the pairing bit so that bit is now fixed and is displaying a different underlying issue then right?
[15:21] <cyphermox> cwayne: "Theme not found: " "themes.Ubuntu.Custom" ?
[15:21] <cwayne> cyphermox, yep
[15:21] <cyphermox> davmor2: I would say so yes
[15:21] <davmor2> cyphermox: right thanks
[15:22] <cwayne> cyphermox, but the theme is most definitely there, especially since some of the gallery-app tests do work
[15:22] <cwayne> and all the other apps (most of them) seem to use it just fine as well
[15:22] <cyphermox> cwayne: maybe it's not installed in the environments where the autopilot tests run
[15:22] <pmcgowan> untitled1, updating my trusty now and will see what qtc does here
[15:22] <untitled1> thanks pmcgowan
[15:23] <untitled1> pmcgowan: I was looking at #1178401 this is kinda what is going on
[15:23] <cwayne> cyphermox, but then how would some of the gallery-app tests pass?
[15:23] <untitled1> !bug 1178401
[15:27] <cyphermox> cwayne: alright. well, one of the tests that pass is test_double_click_zoom. that woudln't be something affected by theme
[15:28] <cwayne> cyphermox, the nav_bar tests also pass though, that'd be theme dependent
[15:30] <cyphermox> nice catch
[15:31] <cwayne> i'd say it seems random, but it is *always* at 28%
[15:31] <cyphermox> yeah, well
[15:31] <cyphermox> there has to be something special done either to start the tests, some kind of environment is being set
[15:31] <cwayne> right
[15:31] <cyphermox> or as the tests run, something is getting changed
[15:32] <cwayne> does it ever run confined?
[15:32] <cyphermox> I have no idea
[15:32] <cyphermox> my experience with those has been to start them in jenkins, and to run the manually
[15:32] <cyphermox> I haven't ever looked at the code
[15:33] <mhall119> ralsina: you around today?
[15:33] <ralsina> mhall119: yes
[15:33] <cwayne> cyphermox, ah, ok, do you know who wrote them?
[15:34] <cyphermox> no
[15:34] <cwayne> cyphermox, it also seems weird that all the failures have this as well: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6685184/
[15:36] <cyphermox> I wouldn't worry about that, I think I've seen it before in other tests
[15:37] <mhall119> ralsina: hey, did you read the backlog from my chat with Chipaca yesterday?
[15:37] <mhall119> re: software-center
[15:37]  * mhall119 realizes now that this isn't the right channel
[15:38] <ralsina> mhall119: nope, have a pastebin or something?
[15:39] <ralsina> mhall119: you can bring it to #u1-client in the canonical server if you want
[15:39] <sforshee> kdub: I pushed some code which seems to fix the unity8 / display device interaction problems to lp:~sforshee/powerd/fix-display-timing
[15:39] <cyphermox> cwayne: do you know where these tests are being run in jenkins?
[15:39] <sforshee> kdub: I still need to test it on devices other than mako
[15:40] <cwayne> cyphermox, http://q-jenkins.ubuntu-ci:8080/view/Touch/view/Ubuntu%20Touch%20Master%20Jobs/job/trusty-touch_custom-mako-smoke-master/
[15:41] <cyphermox> d'oh
[15:41] <cyphermox> of course :)
[15:41] <cwayne> :)
[15:49] <cyphermox> cwayne: do you know what goes to get the themes? is it done directly in qml magic or is there some kind of python glue?
[15:51] <cwayne> cyphermox, i thought it's supposed to be qml magic
[15:51] <untitled1> Themes like suru and what not are qml styled items i think
[15:52] <untitled1> cwayne: is there room for more themes ?
[15:52] <untitled1> Like if I was to make one or two ?  I see that there is some if statements in the themes that are hard coded and would have to add some theme names in these statements but might work
[15:53] <untitled1> Like in MainViewStyle.qml
[15:54] <untitled1> or maybe it is best to only make my own StyleItems
[15:54] <cwayne> untitled1, yeah, i think(?) the plan is to have themes as click packages eventually
[15:56] <untitled1> cool cwayne like have them as a model maybe a abstract list model ?  or not lol . maybe just more qml files
[15:57] <cwayne> it'd be qml files
[15:58] <davmor2> cyphermox: balls my chipset in the bluetooth dongle is broadcom too grrrrr
[15:58] <untitled1> like each abstractlistmodel could hold things like "default color" , theme name  ,  ect ect then expose that to qml and then app devs could use these models or register there own in the models ..... I am confused , you are right best to be Cmake or click  packages that are all qml
[15:59] <cwayne> untitled1, it'd be a theme Palette, much like Suru and SuruDark
[16:00] <untitled1> cwayne: cool
[16:00] <untitled1> cwayne: or anyone could you all take a look at this and see what it is that I am doing wrong ? thanks    https://plus.google.com/106122674051576198224/posts/Drtd235v8t6
[16:02] <kdub> sforshee, great :)
[16:02] <untitled1> before I was just compiling everything on my device (before flipp happened )
[16:07] <pmcgowan> untitled1, fwiw qtc running fine here on updated trusty
[16:07] <greyback> untitled1: does your package install a "something.desktop" file?
[16:08] <untitled1> greyback yes it does
[16:08] <cyphermox> davmor2: take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1065400
[16:08] <untitled1> from my data dir there is a <appname>.desktop.in that is installing and is installing to the correct place
[16:08] <greyback> untitled1: it possible newly installed desktop file not being noticed. Could you restart the phone/unity8?
[16:09] <untitled1> greyback: yeah I tried that nothing
[16:09] <untitled1> I will push code give me a second
[16:09] <greyback> untitled1: use "dpkg-deb -c something.deb" to check the file is installing to a correct place: /usr/share/applications or ~/.local/share/applications
[16:11] <untitled1> greyback: it is in the correct place
[16:12] <untitled1> so are the icons and every thing else I even looked at each dir manual
[16:13] <greyback> untitled1: mind pastebin-ing me the output of "dpkg-deb -c something.deb" and the contents of the .desktop file, just so I can confirm?
[16:13] <untitled1> sure greyback give me a minute I forgo my lp password and am dealing with that atm
[16:14] <greyback> untitled1: no rush
[16:15] <untitled1> greyback: here is src with debian built in it you can see that there is tmp still there in debian also  http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/+junk/testing_armhf_build/files
[16:16] <greyback> untitled1: cool, let me try it on my phone
[16:16] <untitled1> greyback: I can upload the deb package if you like
[16:16] <untitled1> built that is
[16:17] <greyback> untitled1: would be even better, thanks!
[16:17] <untitled1> greyback: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6685411/   << paste of ldpkg-deb -c
[16:19] <untitled1> greyback:   http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/+junk/testing_armhf_build/download/josephjamesmills%40gmail.com-20140103161900-s4rzcmm1x5ne5kc3/directions_0.11_armh-20140103161842-qc9t6ax0d53mk3ea-1/directions_0.1-1_armhf.deb
[16:20] <untitled1> built deb from chroot armhf ^^
[16:20] <greyback> untitled1: okay. desktop file in correct location at least
[16:21] <untitled1> greyback: code is not done 100% but should launch and run as it does on the desktop
[16:21] <untitled1> like there are feature that are not implanted aoy
[16:21] <greyback> untitled1: 1 problem I see if in the desktop file, the Exec= line is incorrect
[16:22] <greyback> Exec=/opt/Directions/bin/Directions
[16:22] <untitled1> yeah I changed that manual still nothing
[16:23] <untitled1> used nano to do it new desktop file looks like this.    http://paste.ubuntu.com/6685441/
[16:23] <greyback> also, since you're not using click packaging, you'll have problems getting this approved to be in the app store (since deb files don't respect application confinement, the app id isn't correct, files are installed in disallowed locations)
[16:24] <untitled1> correct My thought was to take the binarys and build them into click. but still not sure.
[16:24] <greyback> ah ok, at least you are aware of it
[16:25] <untitled1> there are c++ apps in the click store though I would just look at them and use that model.  but before all of that I must make sure that it will run all things are working.  EXample GPG and updatin the map and having the plugins talk to you on upddate ect
[16:25] <untitled1> It is set up the same way that say unity8 is or the address-bok-app or well any apps that are cmake
[16:25] <untitled1> for now
[16:26] <greyback> understood
[16:26] <untitled1> pmcgowan: that is good I wonder what it is that is going on in my host machine. with qtcreator.
[16:27] <pmcgowan> untitled1, indeed, maybe reinstall it
[16:27] <untitled1> this is what I get  $ qtcreator
[16:27] <untitled1> Registered the AalSensorPlugin types
[16:27] <untitled1> Segmentation fault (core dumped
[16:27] <untitled1> dang white space sorry
[16:28] <untitled1> pmcgowan: I tried re-installing
[16:28] <pmcgowan> untitled1, apt-cache policy qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu ?
[16:29] <greyback> untitled1: ok, I can confirm your desktop file isn't being seen. Digging into why
[16:29] <untitled1> greyback: thansk pmcgowan just a minute
[16:30] <greyback> untitled1: dsktop file probably needs the "X-Ubuntu-Touch=true" hint
[16:30] <untitled1> pmcgowan: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6685482/
[16:31] <untitled1> greyback:  ok I will try that
[16:31] <pmcgowan> untitled1, try updating it, its not the latest, not sure that will help
[16:32] <greyback> tho it still not being found for me, hmmm
[16:33] <untitled1> greyback: and if you try to launch it do you get a QUbuntu instance not created
[16:33] <untitled1> like from ssh
[16:34] <greyback> untitled1: ah, that's different. You need to launch with "directions --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/directions.desktop" for testing.
[16:34] <davmor2> pmcgowan: just the man I've done a fresh install from android all has gone well except mtp is failing on saucy.  Whose the best person to speak to about that?
[16:34] <pmcgowan> davmor2, I suspect cyphermox
[16:35] <pmcgowan> davmor2, have you tried the new dual boot installer?
[16:35] <davmor2> pmcgowan: no but I have an s3 available if it works there
[16:35] <cyphermox> how is mtp failing?
[16:36] <greyback> untitled1: with that, the app launches, but I get just a grey screen
[16:36] <pmcgowan> davmor2, probably not
[16:36] <davmor2> cyphermox: no idea, I just get a  popup on the desktop saying it failed to connect
[16:36] <cyphermox> oh
[16:36] <greyback> untitled1: ah file:///usr/share/directions/imports/main.qml: File not found
[16:36] <davmor2> cyphermox: give me a second
[16:37] <untitled1> greyback: that is not good
[16:37] <greyback> untitled1: it should be /usr/share/directions/main.qml
[16:37] <untitled1> that should be under /usr/share/directions/
[16:37] <untitled1> lol
[16:37] <greyback> :)
[16:37] <davmor2> cyphermox: this is a fresh install of saucy (well it's about a week old) and a fresh 108 install from android
[16:38]  * untitled1 Looking at CMakeLists.txt
[16:38] <greyback> mhr3: on phablet, is there any way I can get the apps scope to do a full re-scan of desktop file directories?
[16:39] <untitled1> greyback: error in var in cmake file fixing and building brb
[16:39] <untitled1> pmcgowan: upgraded and still no deals
[16:40] <greyback> untitled1: ok. I just want to confirm the desktop file thing works
[16:40] <pmcgowan> untitled1, so strange
[16:40] <greyback> oh, gotta run, bbiab
[16:42] <davmor2> cyphermox: http://ubuntuone.com/4us9MAEAmSCsgUl0eYnkIj
[16:45] <mhr3> greyback, it doesn't do that
[16:45] <mhr3> greyback, everything is clicks + a few hardcoded exceptions
[16:48] <pmcgowan> untitled1, the AalSensorsPlugin is only relevant on the touch images, not on the desktop, so I am rather confused why that message apears
[16:49] <untitled1> pmcgowan: maybe I should un-install the sensors ?
[16:49] <untitled1> pmcgowan: I had them installed to test GPS on the desktop
[16:50] <pmcgowan> untitled1, hmm could be
[16:53] <untitled1> pmcgowan: guess what \o/ after removing qtubuntu-android qtubuntu-sensors  up and running again
[16:53] <untitled1> thanks for your help
[16:53] <pmcgowan> untitled1, sure
[16:57] <brupp> anyone got their Fairphone and tried Ubuntu Touch already?
[16:59] <untitled1> greyback: new build def installs main,qml in the correct place just waiting on OptiPng now will push when done
[17:09] <mhall119> ralsina: you're familiar with the click store right?
[17:14] <ralsina> mhall119: yes, mostly client side
[17:14] <mhall119> ralsina: well maybe you can help me anyway, I asked beuno yesterday but I don't think he's back to work yet
[17:14] <ralsina> mhall119: yes, he's out until monday
[17:15] <ralsina> mhall119: I can try :-)
[17:15] <mhall119> ralsina: so both of my kids are writing apps with the Ubuntu SDK, and I'd like to upload them to the store with their own names showing in the Dash as author, but I don't want to setup separate accounts for them on myapps, is that possible?
[17:15] <ralsina> mhall119: I don't think so
[17:16] <mhall119> ok, I'll have to decide which is more important to me then, thanks ralsina
[17:16] <ralsina> mhall119: np
[17:16] <ralsina> mhall119: ask beuno again on monday but I am 99% sure :-)
[17:17] <untitled1> greyback: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/+junk/armhf_build2/download/josephjamesmills%40gmail.com-20140103171441-1liqgbklma4cyni3/directions_0.11_armh-20140103171354-fmuqdhmamyy05dj8-1/directions_0.1-1_armhf.deb
[17:17] <untitled1> round 2 :)
[17:19] <untitled1> Oh wow emulator in the creator now... This is awesome !
[17:21] <mhall119> emulator is the creator?
[17:21] <mhall119> what does that mean
[17:24] <greyback> untitled1: hmm, I still don't get the app to show up in unity8. Same error: file:///usr/share/directions/imports/main.qml: File not found
[17:25] <greyback> untitled1: I suspect it's not our fault, but we've to kick the desktop file indexer to see the new desktop file somehow
[17:27] <untitled1> greyback: yeah I am just rebooting the phone now to test
[17:27] <untitled1> had to purge all the other files
[17:27] <untitled1> still nothing here also
[17:28]  * greyback confused
[17:28] <untitled1> main.qml is there for me desktop files are also there and so is icons
[17:28] <untitled1> maybe the icon needs to be different ?
[17:29] <untitled1> like the size ?
[17:30] <greyback> I doubt zeitgeist would all-out reject your desktop file just because of a bad icon size.
[17:30] <greyback> unfortunately I don't understand this layer of the ubuntu phone very well.
[17:34] <untitled1> well I just changed the icon and rebooted and ... still nothing I am going to ssh in and see if It will at least run
[17:35] <davmor2> cyphermox: are there any logs anywhere for mtp connections and I'll write up a bug. The annoying thing is android on the same device mtp worked fine :(
[17:38] <untitled1> huh well after launching it and it not finding main.qml it is now in the launcher though still not in the dash.  and main.qml is installed to /usr/share/directions/   *o
[17:40] <cwayne> i wonder if it's a confiment issue untitled1
[17:42] <untitled1> cwayne: not sure if I follow what you are saying
[17:43] <untitled1> like permissions ?
[17:43] <cwayne> your qml should live in /opt/click.ubuntu.com/ instead of /usr/share
[17:43] <cwayne> so i wonder if apparmor is denying it
[17:43] <cwayne> do a 'grep directions /var/log/kern.log' and see if you get some DENIED messages
[17:43] <untitled1> ok
[17:44] <untitled1> thanks cwayne
[17:44] <untitled1> cwayne: it returns nothing
[17:45] <sergiusens> cwayne, from reading above, untitled1 is not doing click yet so the app should be unconfined
[17:45] <cwayne> hm, there goes that theory
[17:45] <greyback> untitled1: have you a package handy I could try? Else I'll symlink to try it
[17:45] <sergiusens> davmor2, .cache/upstart/mtp*.log
[17:46] <davmor2> sergiusens: ah thanks
[17:47] <untitled1> greyback: you mean like with directions-dbg ?
[17:48] <greyback> untitled1: nope, just to get the app running
[17:49] <davmor2> sergiusens: meh none there
[17:50] <untitled1> greyback: yeah pushing now
[17:50] <untitled1> greyback: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/+junk/armhf_build2/files
[17:51] <greyback> untitled1: thanks
[17:53] <untitled1> maybe bamf index needs to be rebuilt to see app in dash ?
[17:54] <greyback> there's no bamf on phablet. Think it is zeitgeist which indexes apps
[17:54] <sergiusens> davmor2, is mtp down?
[17:54] <sergiusens> davmor2, what device is this? what's the usb android property set to?
[17:55] <greyback> pastebin.ubuntu.com working for anyone else? By which I mean, if you enter text and submit, do you see your paste?
[17:55] <greyback> I get white screen only
[17:55] <untitled1> greyback: I just built app on desktop and it is also not finding main.qml either
[17:55] <untitled1> maybe it is my c++ looking at it now
[17:55] <davmor2> sergiusens: checking mtp first, maguro, no idea how do I check that re: what's the usb android property set to?
[17:56] <untitled1> duh it is looking in imports and sould not be it should be looking in /usr/share/directions
[17:56] <untitled1> DOH   greycat cp /usr/share/directions/main.qml /usr/share/directions/imports/
[17:56] <greyback> untitled1: I'm getting a crash - but I'm not working with a clean image, so it could be my fault: http://pastebin.ca/2524027
[17:58] <greyback> /usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/libubuntu_application_api.so.1 is a file I was hacking on, so quite possible I broke something
[17:58] <sergiusens> davmor2, run getprop|grep usb
[17:58] <sergiusens> should say mtp,adb
[17:59] <untitled1> greyback: it is working on my sausy now
[17:59] <untitled1> still not in dash though lol
[17:59] <davmor2> sergiusens: mtp, adb for all 3
[17:59] <greyback> untitled1: ok, well that's something. I'm on trusty, possible that's to blame
[18:00] <sergiusens> davmor2, at least your bus is properly configured; does it work if you replug the device in?
[18:00] <untitled1> greyback: I will build on my tusty also I have multirom installed and like 4 different touchs also
[18:00] <davmor2> sergiusens: nope
[18:01] <greyback> untitled1: cool, I've not dared try the multirom. Nice. Yep, the desktop file thing annoying me
[18:03] <untitled1> greyback: works great I have 4 touchs FFOS cm 10 and google android on my white n4
[18:04] <greyback> untitled1: yeah there's some indexing thing we're missing. To test I copied /usr/share/applications/friends-app.desktop into an enemies-app.desktop file, and changed the Name. That /should/ appear in dash as a new app, but hasn't even after reboot. Somehow need to trigger a re-index, but I don't know how.
[18:05] <greyback> mhr3 could help, but I guess he's afk
[18:05] <mhr3> lucky you then
[18:06] <mhr3> but i already replied
[18:06] <mhr3> there's no indexing thing
[18:06]  * greyback didn't see a reply
[18:06] <davmor2> sergiusens: so initctl list is showing anything with mtp in it
[18:06] <davmor2> isn't even
[18:06] <cyphermox> you should have at least mtp-server in all cases
[18:06] <cyphermox> oh wait
[18:06] <greyback> mhr3: okay, so I added a new dummy desktop file to /usr/share/applications. Should it just appear in the app lens?
[18:07] <cyphermox> davmor2: as your own user (no sudo)  /sbin/initctl list mtp-server
[18:07] <mhr3> greyback, no, only clicks work on the phone
[18:07] <cyphermox> it's going to be in your own user, not in the system upstart jobs
[18:07] <greyback> mhr3: really? So the non-clicks are hardcoded in somehow?
[18:07] <mhr3> greyback, yep
[18:07] <greyback> mhr3: ah, that was driving me nuts, okay
[18:08] <greyback> untitled1: so I guess you'll have to use click
[18:08] <greyback> mhr3: thanks for the help!
[18:08] <mhr3> np
[18:08] <greyback> ah, now I see your reply. Dammit, why didn't I read up
[18:09] <davmor2> cyphermox, sergiusens: ah thanks.  phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ /sbin/initctl list | grep mtp  mtp-server stop/waiting
[18:09] <cyphermox> and the cable is connected?
[18:09] <sergiusens> what device is this?
[18:09] <cyphermox> and mtp,adb is set in the usb props... hmm
[18:10] <cyphermox> davmor2: /sbin/initctl start mtp-server, then send me the file .cache/upstart/mtp-server.log
[18:10] <cyphermox> if it's not there, then for some reason you wouldn't have the binary at all?
[18:15] <untitled1> mhr3: where is this hardcoded thingy ?
[18:15] <untitled1> some JSON file  ?
[18:15] <mhr3> compiled in the click scope
[18:16] <davmor2> cyphermox: now there is a log and now it connects woohoo! http://ubuntuone.com/2ZZHIuI7UqzpdiYgDwYKEW
[18:16] <cyphermox> crap, that doesn't help
[18:17] <davmor2> cyphermox: I can try rebooting the phone and see if it still works
[18:17] <cyphermox> yes, please
[18:17] <untitled1> mhr3: is there a way for me to make a click package out of my binary or deb package ? thanks
[18:18] <untitled1> because there are c++ plugins
[18:18] <untitled1> << dont know anything about click
[18:18] <mhr3> untitled1, me neither really
[18:18] <mhr3> but i think c++ plugins are supported in clicks these days
[18:19] <mhr3> but how to actually create one... beats me
[18:20] <greyback> bzoltan: do you know? Click packages support C++ plugins, right? Could you point untitled1 to an example where he could figure out what he needs (or even better, docs)?
[18:21] <davmor2> cyphermox: reboot and mtp is back to stop/waiting
[18:21] <bzoltan> greyback:  not yet
[18:21] <untitled1> I see that there are other packages like the reminders app that is using extrenal libs packaged in there click
[18:22] <davmor2> cyphermox: grabbing the log to see if it is different
[18:22] <bzoltan> greyback: this is something I want to see done next week... the click chroot building is the first step
[18:23] <greyback> bzoltan: ok, thanks for the update
[18:23] <bzoltan> greyback: sorry mate I could not give you better answer ... this whole click chroot and fat packaging is a forming piece of the dev story
[18:24] <davmor2> cyphermox: it's bigger so http://ubuntuone.com/6zUg41WdAwIM692CVfF8jH
[18:24] <davmor2> cyphermox: back in 30 tea time
[18:24] <greyback> bzoltan: understood, we're almost there.
[18:26] <cwayne> balloons, ping
[18:28] <greyback> untitled1: I notice that the notes-app (https://code.launchpad.net/notes-app) does have a binary included for a shared library (see /usr/share/click/preinstalled and look for .so files) so I think it's possible, just the SDK tooling doesn't support it yet.
[18:28] <greyback> could be wrong though
[18:29] <bzoltan> mhall119: ping
[18:30]  * greyback has to go
[18:31] <untitled1> thanks greyback and bzoltan
[18:31] <cyphermox> davmor2: nothing special there
[18:37] <mhall119> bzoltan: pong
[18:44] <untitled1> Ok I think that I have now built the click package lol.  how to install .
[18:48] <cyphermox> cwayne: I can't find anything wrong with the gallery-app tests... what package ships the theme?
[18:49] <cwayne> cyphermox, it's not in a package, it's in custom.tar.xz that gets installed with the -customized images
[18:49] <cyphermox> only in the customized?
[18:50] <cwayne> yeah
[18:50] <cwayne> it's a customized theme, after all :)
[18:50] <cyphermox> so why is this showing up at all in the smoketests?
[18:50] <cwayne> because touch_custom is one of the smoketested images
[18:50] <cyphermox> I hadn't noticed this was for custom
[18:51] <cyphermox> either the theme is installed wrong or some piece that should read it isn't doing it right, but things look fine to me for what I could find, the test cases, gallery-app, etc.
[18:51] <cyphermox> I don't know what else to look for -- I'd ask the QA team
[18:51] <cwayne> cyphermox, the theme works when you launch gallery-app from the app scope, and it works in every other app
[18:51] <cwayne> cyphermox, well, thanks for taking a look!
[18:51] <cyphermox> sure
[18:53] <cwayne> sergiusens, would you have any idea of why the gallery-app autopilot cases are failing to load our custom theme?
[18:54] <sergiusens> cwayne, not really, but I can look; I never used custom themes yet
[18:54] <cwayne> sergiusens, the thing is, when you launch the app normally, it works perfectly fine
[18:54] <cwayne> but when you launch from autopilot, it can't find the themes
[18:55] <cwayne> even though all the other apps seem to work just fine
[18:55] <sergiusens> cwayne, how are you launching manually?
[18:55] <cwayne> sergiusens, by clicking on gallery from app scope
[18:56] <sergiusens> cwayne, ah; does this depend on env vars?
[18:56] <sergiusens> cwayne, try manually launching with upstart
[18:56] <sergiusens> start application APP_ID=gallery-app iirc
[18:56] <cwayne> sergiusens, trying now
[18:57] <cwayne> sergiusens, theme works
[18:57] <cwayne> at least with sudo -iu phablet start application APP_ID=gallery-app
[18:58] <sergiusens> cwayne, oh wait, gallery is a legacy app still; and it's not being launched by upstart with autopilot; it's using that desktop file hint thing
[18:58] <cwayne> ah there we go
[18:59] <cwayne> sergiusens, if i do 'sudo -iu phablet gallery-app --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/gallery-app.desktop' it doesn't get the theme
[18:59] <davmor2> cyphermox: sadtrombone.com
[19:00] <cyphermox> davmor2: I can't do anything unless I was able to reproduce the issue or if there is a lot that tells us why mtp isn't being started
[19:00] <cwayne> sergiusens, but it seems that it *can* launch with upstart though?
[19:00] <cyphermox> oh wait
[19:00] <cyphermox> davmor2: you're rebooting, with the cable plugged in?
[19:00] <davmor2> cyphermox: yes
[19:01] <cyphermox> davmor2: what if you just disconnect and reconnect?
[19:01] <cyphermox> I know why this is happening
[19:01] <cyphermox> that's something that was being handled by the system upstart job before sergiusens killed it :)
[19:01]  * davmor2 glares at sergiusens
[19:02] <cyphermox> on boot, if the cable is already connected the user session will not get a *connected event, so it can't start mtp
[19:02] <cyphermox> sergiusens: I'm just harassing you for fun ;)
[19:02] <cyphermox> there were two things in that upstart job, and this one was a one-liner hidden in it
[19:02] <sergiusens> cyphermox, I need to get rid of the adb situation (that last disconnect)
[19:03] <davmor2> cyphermox: that still got the error, so I'm now disconnecting the cable turning the phone off and back on once that is complete I'll reattach the cable
[19:03] <cyphermox> sergiusens: not sure it's going to change anything, you stil lwouldn't get the connected event
[19:03] <cyphermox> davmor2: you need to wait a bit, just to give things the time to settle
[19:03] <cyphermox> you shouldn't have to reboot it to make it work
[19:03] <cyphermox> I'll fix that by adding the job again with that emit line
[19:05] <sergiusens> cyphermox, are the session jobs guaranteed to get all events from the system?
[19:06] <sergiusens> rephrasing, are the jobs loaded before everything starts shooting out events
[19:06] <cyphermox> sergiusens:  they are not, at least that I know of
[19:06] <cyphermox> the events should depend on udev, which ought to be started before the session upstart ;)
[19:06] <cwayne> sergiusens, okay, is there any reason gallery-app and ubunti-ui-toolkit-gallery *cant* be launched with upstart?
[19:07] <cyphermox> however, the cable is already connected so udev won't be firing a usb-device-connected event
[19:07] <sergiusens> cwayne, non at all; I talked about that on the phone mail list when people were complaining about tests not passing
[19:07] <sergiusens> cwayne, just needs implementation on autopilot or migration in the test itself
[19:08] <sergiusens> cyphermox, yeah; so the part I'm missing and I haven't implemented yet since we were in crux with how to solve this in the settings side is that I wanted to trigger the start mtp thing when the usb config says mtp
[19:09] <cyphermox> sergiusens: yes, makes sense
[19:09] <sergiusens> cyphermox, that happens on every boot if mtp is enabled;
[19:09] <cyphermox> we don't have the settings bridge yet?
[19:09] <cwayne> sergiusens, ah, okay, i'll see if i can whip up some MR's to get our tests green as well :)
[19:09] <cyphermox> you'd send an event for every setting?
[19:09] <Rienzilha> hmm
[19:09] <sergiusens> cyphermox, writing android properties requires root
[19:09] <Rienzilha> do I need to have an ubuntu one account in order to install apps?
[19:09] <sergiusens> cyphermox, no, not every setting ;-)
[19:09] <cyphermox> sergiusens: don't want to write, just read in upstart ;)
[19:10] <sergiusens> cyphermox, assign the bug to me, I'll get something proposed in today
[19:10] <cyphermox> there is no bug yet
[19:10] <sergiusens> no bug, not task? :-P
[19:10] <sergiusens> kidding
[19:10] <cyphermox> I'm not sure we actually need that... the setting part is actually separate from running the service
[19:10] <sergiusens> cyphermox, I'll get something today and send an MR your way
[19:11] <sergiusens> cyphermox, yeah, the thing is; where do we want to store the setting for enabling mtp
[19:11] <cyphermox> sergiusens: I'd just make a system job fire up the right connected signal on boot
[19:11] <cyphermox> sergiusens: we shouldn't have to write the setting in any upstart job
[19:11] <cyphermox> at most, it would be set via a system-settings panel
[19:12] <sergiusens> cyphermox, yeah, but we had some talks of moving all that usb config stuff over to ubuntu
[19:12] <sergiusens> just avoiding doing something twice
[19:12] <cyphermox> forcing that setting in an upstart job is very wrong for various reasons
[19:12] <cyphermox> yeah
[19:13] <sergiusens> cyphermox, no, not setting it in the job, just reading it ;-)
[19:13] <cyphermox> but as I mentioned, you miht want to switch between mtp, adb, rndis, etc., so that makes sense only really in a system-settings context
[19:13] <cyphermox> yeah
[19:13] <cyphermox> I'm not sure we should be reading it either
[19:13] <sergiusens> cyphermox, also would affect multilogin systems
[19:14] <cyphermox> sergiusens: ideally mtp should just always run within a user's session and catch all changes to the media directories (or even better, to the media database itself)
[19:14] <sergiusens> cyphermox, well you don't want the service running unless the user has a config that says it should be running, right?
[19:14] <cyphermox> right
[19:14] <cyphermox> you know what I mean ;)
[19:14] <sergiusens> yeah
[19:14] <cyphermox> it shouldn't have to be killed off and restarted all the time
[19:15] <cyphermox> just when the session changes, if the user doesn't want it to run, or if the session is locked
[19:15] <sergiusens> cyphermox, hmmm, I actually like it being stopped when not plugged
[19:16] <cyphermox> it's not wrong, but it would be simpler if it didn't get stopped
[19:16] <cyphermox> and well, for now listening to that usb event is good enough to deal with the issues
[19:16] <cyphermox> I'd really just make it be emitted in a system job on boot, if it's possible
[19:17] <cyphermox> that would fix it the simplest way for now, until I spend more time hacking at MTP
[19:17] <cyphermox> but first, flight mode :)
[19:17] <cyphermox> I'm close to being done with flight mode too, at least if you omit ofono
[19:24] <sforshee> kdub: https://code.launchpad.net/~sforshee/powerd/fix-display-timing/+merge/200431
[19:24] <madalyn> salutare
[19:25] <kdub> sforshee, will take a look, busy day
[19:26] <sforshee> kdub: np, just thought you'd want to verify that it fixes the problem
[19:26] <davmor2> cyphermox: still no joy however if I start it manually it behaves fine
[19:27] <davmor2> cyphermox: in fact now I've manually started it lets see what happens if I disconnect it
[19:28] <Rienzilha> hmmm
[19:28]  * Rienzilha is highly disappointed
[19:29] <davmor2> Rienzilha: at what?
[19:29] <Rienzilha> I expected ubuntu to offer at least those apps that are free software in a repository that does not require any kind of authentication
[19:30] <Rienzilha> but apparently I either sign in to ubuntu one, or I need to hassle with separate click packages
[19:30] <Rienzilha> or am I mistaken?
[19:31] <davmor2> Rienzilha: why? It works the same way google, ios, chromebooks, windows 8.......
[19:31] <Rienzilha> exactly
[19:31] <davmor2> Rienzilha: the ubuntuone is just a login mechanism
[19:31] <Rienzilha> and it is one of the reasons I want to move away from google, ios, chromebooks and windows 8
[19:31] <Rienzilha> if not the main reason
[19:32] <Rienzilha> it is a login mechanism that ties my phone to me
[19:32] <cyphermox> davmor2: point is, software center does not require login to download free apps
[19:32] <Rienzilha> it is a privacy issue (maybe not a compelling one, right now), but it is one
[19:32] <Rienzilha> and it is unnecessary
[19:32] <cyphermox> how is it a privacy issue?
[19:33] <Rienzilha> at the very least it allows the cloudprovider to track what accounts downloads what software
[19:33] <davmor2> cyphermox: yes it does.  The free apps are the same as the 0$ apps that require a login to give you a subscription to be able to download the app
[19:33] <mhall119> cyphermox: I think it requires login for non-libre gratis apps
[19:34] <cyphermox> mhall119: davmor2: yes
[19:34] <cyphermox> however you can get stuff from the archive for free, without login
[19:34] <Rienzilha> anyway, I may be mistaken, but I just read a thread that stated any click app from the ubuntu infrastructure needs a login to be downloaded
[19:34] <Rienzilha> cyphermox: directly on the phone?
[19:34] <mhall119> Rienzilha: I think the current implementation of the click scope requires it, but it's not strictly necessary AFAIK
[19:34] <davmor2> cyphermox: no you can get stuff from the repos not click apps
[19:34] <cyphermox> Rienzilha: well, yes, but I was just comparing to desktop. on the phone it wouldn't necessarily help you
[19:35] <Rienzilha> mhall119: all right. I most certainly hope so
[19:35] <mhall119> Rienzilha: the upside is that it makes it easier to re-download your apps on other devices (or the same device if you re-flash it)
[19:35] <Rienzilha> but the thread here<EMAIL_ADDRESS>seems to indicat otherwise
[19:36] <cyphermox> davmor2: yes. I'm saying it would be nice for this stuff to be in the repos in a standard sense. I also don't especially enjoy trying to input my U1 creds on the device, when I need two-factor auth and have no USB device... just to download an authenticator
[19:36] <Rienzilha> mhall119: yes I know, but I would like to have a choice in that
[19:37] <mhall119> Rienzilha: for now you can manually download the .click package, adb push it to the phone, and pkcon install-local to install it, but it sure it a pain
[19:37] <mhall119> Rienzilha: do you want to avoid having an Ubuntu SSO account, or just avoid having your app downloads associated with it?
[19:37] <Rienzilha> the former
[19:37] <cwayne> sergiusens, so the way it's being launched is definitely the problem.. now just to figure out how to make it launch the right way from autopilot with the fewest possible changes
[19:38] <mhall119> Rienzilha: you'll find your experience with Ubuntu (software and community) will be less enjoyable without an SSO account
[19:38] <Rienzilha> I know
[19:38] <Rienzilha> the same goes for windows 8, ios and android :)
[19:39] <mhall119> for software yes
[19:39] <Rienzilha> so everybody happily puts all his data into googles or whoever's cloud
[19:39] <mhall119> but Ubuntu SSO is used for many other aspects of the Ubuntu project
[19:39] <Rienzilha> because it's the only way it works
[19:39] <Rienzilha> I know, and I dislike that
[19:39] <mhall119> this isn't about "the cloud", it's just a user account
[19:39] <Rienzilha> sure
[19:39] <Rienzilha> but it stores information about me
[19:39] <Rienzilha> in a place I do not control
[19:40] <mhall119> Rienzilha: it's better than having three dozen different username/passwords to keep track of
[19:40] <Rienzilha> from a usability point of view, yes
[19:40] <mhall119> FWIW, Ubuntu SSO is open source, so you can view the code that's being run
[19:41] <Rienzilha> I was under the impression the entire server side of ubuntu one is -not- open source
[19:41] <Rienzilha> (which was another disappointment, to be fair)
[19:41] <mhall119> the cloud file storage isn't open
[19:41] <mhall119> but the SSO part is
[19:41] <davmor2> Rienzilha: the cloud part isn't, this is sso not the cloud
[19:41] <davmor2> Rienzilha: it is all called UbuntuOne now
[19:41] <mhall119> Rienzilha: https://launchpad.net/canonical-identity-provider is the part that provides SSO
[19:42] <mhall119> everything else consumes that, Ubuntu One storage, Launchpad, loco-team-portal, forums, discourse, summit, etc
[19:42] <Rienzilha> yes, but I bet in a few months or years, that same username/password that I fill in there will be used to conveniently store my calendar data, contacts, app data and what not, so it can be convieniently synched accross my devices
[19:42] <mhall119> one can hope :)
[19:43] <davmor2> Rienzilha: and at that point you just switch off the syncing services
[19:43] <mhall119> though we'll need to support google for calendar/contacts sync too
[19:43] <Rienzilha> sure. I can mitigate it
[19:44] <cwayne> mardy, ping, if you've updated your app-access u-s-s-o-a branch, do I have to update mine that's dependent on it?
[19:44] <cwayne> or does it merge automagically
[19:44] <Rienzilha> but it's kinda disappointing that I need an sso account to access stuff that is free in the first place
[19:45] <Rienzilha> there is no good reason the repository is not just open, at least not from an end user point of view
[19:45] <mhall119> Rienzilha: like I said, there are ways to do it without an SSO account, it's just more work for you
[19:46] <mhall119> the "store" is open, you can currently download click packages from it using your browser, wget, curl, whatever, without SSO
[19:46] <Rienzilha> then why can't my phone?
[19:46] <mhall119> becuase the click scope, that searches, downloads and installs them, is currently written to use it
[19:47] <Rienzilha> so i'd need to make a fork of the click scope in order to work around?
[19:47] <mhall119> it will, very soon I hope, also allow you to send ratings and reviews for those apps from the phone dash (which will require an SSO account)
[19:47] <mhall119> Rienzilha: you can submit a patch to make it optional
[19:48] <untitled1> mhr3: I rebuilt unity-scopes-click and added my app to the list in non-scopes vala code recompiled and installed on phone and it shows right up.  thanks.
[19:48] <mhall119> or file a bug requesting that it be optional (please provide UI/UX designs for it though)
[19:48] <Rienzilha> I'll consider that
[19:48] <Rienzilha> time to do something else, thanks for the conversation :)
[19:49] <mhall119> np, have fun
[19:49] <mhall119> hope you're enjoying your Ubuntu phone otherwise
[19:49] <sergiusens> mhall119, you actually can't download directly
[19:50] <mhall119> sergiusens: did we change that?
[19:50] <davmor2> mhall119: I didn't think you ever could
[19:50] <mhall119> I did it before, when the click store first came online
[19:50] <sergiusens> davmor2, mhall119 there was an interim have where you added something like ?no_login to the download link
[19:51] <sergiusens> until the scope was fully implemented
[19:51] <davmor2> sergiusens: ah that's why then
[19:52] <mhall119> sergiusens: curl https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/click-apps/12/download/ just worked for me
[19:54] <mhall119> hmmm, or did it...
[19:54] <mhall119> maybe that was an existing file
[19:55] <mhall119> ok, yeah, it's redirecting me to login
[19:55] <mhall119> so I must have already has that file in /tmp/
[19:56] <mhall119> ah, duh, becaue I clicked the link in chromium first, ignore me :P
[19:56]  * davmor2 ignores mhall119
[19:57] <mhall119> what else is new? :)
[19:58] <mhall119> Rienzilha: so I was wrong about you being able to download without logging in, sorry about that
[20:10] <sergiusens> np :-)
[20:12] <mardy> cwayne: I think it should merge automatically, I didn't touch conflicting files AFAICT
[20:13] <cwayne> mardy, cool!
[20:15] <cwayne> that's fancy :)
[20:21] <Rienzilha> hm okay
[20:22] <Rienzilha> well then I stay disappointed :)
[20:23] <untitled1> Wow The emulator being in qt creator is great.  Now to figure out how to use it.  Great Job all !
[20:25] <untitled1> Like how do I tell the creator that I want to run it in the emulator and not on a phone ?
[20:28] <untitled1> NM I just unplug the device
[20:28] <untitled1> simple enough
[20:32] <dobey> robru: why is bug #1265630 incomplete? are you asking for some sort of additional info from me?
[20:40] <mhall119> http://developer.ubuntu.com/2014/01/installing-ubuntu-to-phones-using-mac-osx/ thanks achiang!
[21:31] <kenvandine> Saviq, i see bug 1241185 is closed as fixed, but i still don't see a way to add a lifecycle exception for an app
[22:02] <Zampson> Hey I want to run ubuntu touch dual-booted with CM11 nightly on my maguro. I got it working with CM10.2, but in the instructions ubuntu created for dual-booting, the link to the 4.3 radio firmware is broken. Anyone know where I can the 4.3 firmware, or how I can extract it from the phone built with 4.3 or something? Thanks
[22:21] <robru> dobey, whoops, maybe i meant invalid. sorry
[22:35] <dobey> robru: or wontfix? it's obviously not invalid. i'd say it shouldn't be a hard dep in the package until it actually is in the code though
[22:36] <dobey> robru: if my other bug gets fixed though, i'll let it slide
[22:36] <robru> dobey, ok, wontfix then ;-) I don't see the value in fixing it when it'll need to get reverted shortly anyway.
[22:36] <robru> dobey, yeah, I'm looking at that one. I'm less familiar with unity-webapps-service, so I'm waiting to hear back from some other webapps people before I move on that.
[22:37] <dobey> isn't webbrowser-app supposed to be getting converted to a click also?
[22:38] <robru> dobey, not sure
[22:38] <dobey> well if it does, it means the webapps-service deb can't depend on it anyway (when it gets converted and dropped out of archive)
[22:38] <dobey> but anyway
[22:43] <dobey> time to go do other things
[22:43] <anmol> installing ubuntu touch on nexus 4
[22:44] <anmol> using manual method
[22:44] <anmol> stuck on google logo
[22:44] <anmol> help!!!!