[12:32] <kiko> ddaa, I think that caching of images/other references would be a much greater speed improvement than your former suggestion, tbh.
[12:33] <ddaa> I think that the caching issue is tied to the https issue, isn't it?
[12:34] <ddaa> And they are two sides of the same coin. Improving perceived speed involves improving actual speed, but also providing early feedback.
[12:38] <kiko> ddaa, yeah, it is tied to the https issue. but that would be the largest speed gain we could produce today.
[12:39] <ddaa> ack, I thought that streaming pages could be magically produced by the right zope incantations.
[12:39] <ddaa> I certainly see nothing in TAL that would prevent that.
[01:02] <elmo> ehm, so.  lightweight checkouts are cool and all
[01:03] <kiko> elmo, but...?
[01:04] <elmo> ah, nm, let me try something before making myself look stupid(er)
[01:05] <LarstiQ> elmo: you have quite some credit to burn through before that happens though.
[01:26] <lifeless> elmo: also, #bzr may be better
[01:28] <elmo> lifeless: I doubt it ;-) it was how do I implement this on sodium question
[01:28] <elmo> but I'm muddling through
[01:28] <elmo> p.s. y'all suck at documenting LP development, kthx
[01:30] <lifeless> elmo: on sodium?
[01:35] <elmo> lifeless: I'm trying to work out how to do lightweight checkouts without having to sync my lightweight-but-still-way-too-large-for-my-adsl repo directory up to sodium
[01:36] <lifeless> elmo: have a local repo, use a lightweight checkout from that, rsync the repo to sodium
[01:36] <lifeless> as jamesh documents
[01:36] <lifeless> lightweight checkouts are only of use within a LAN/local disk
[01:36] <elmo> rsync which repo?
[01:37] <elmo> the one with the 200Mb .bzr?
[01:38] <lifeless> https://launchpad.canonical.com/WorkingWithSharedRepositories
[01:39] <elmo> yeah, I know, I've read it
[01:39] <lifeless> maybe the question I should ask is 'why do you want to have a lightweight checkout' ?
[01:39] <elmo> because the last time I did anything with LP, I ran out of disk space on my laptop
[01:39] <elmo> so having them locally is very attractive
[01:40] <lifeless> do you mean 'not having..' ?
[01:40] <elmo> blink
[01:41] <elmo> no, I mean "having light weight checkouts as opposed to space sucking heavyweight ones, is very attractive"
[01:41] <elmo> anyway, don't worry about it, I'm probably being stupid - I'll try again tomorrow morning when I'm awake, and go back to normal branches which I know to handle with pqm if I fail
[01:42] <lifeless> do you have a local repository ?
[02:02] <lifeless> sabdfl: btw - https://launchpad.net/products/bzr/+roadmap - is not optimal for us at the moment
[02:03] <lifeless> there are specs scattered all over by priority. is it possible to get jamesh or someone to look at tuning the roadmap algorithm ?
[02:03] <lifeless> I would, but I'm a little short on time
[02:15] <sabdfl> lifeless: it's certainly way off base there
[02:15] <sabdfl> by all means ask him to redo it
[02:15] <sabdfl> he's welcome jsut to reimplement rather than trying to unparse the illogic
[02:16] <lifeless> thanks
[02:30] <lifeless> jamesh: ping
[02:56] <lifeless> BjornT: around ?
[03:52] <jamesh> lifeless: pong
[03:54] <lifeless> hi
[03:55] <lifeless> I've filed a bug on the spec roadmap
[03:55] <jamesh> okay
[03:55] <lifeless> are you interested in making it display useful things ? :)
[03:55] <lifeless> if you are, I'll ask steve about scheduling of it
[03:56] <jamesh> I'll be doing some spec/sprint tracker stuff between now and the next conf
[03:56] <jamesh> so I can probably look at it
[03:56] <jamesh> what's the bug?
[03:56] <lifeless> just look at blueprint
[03:56] <lifeless> latest-bugs :)
[03:57] <jamesh> https://launchpad.net/products/blueprint/+bug/56398
[03:57] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 56398 in blueprint "roadmap should be useful" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]
[03:58] <lifeless> assuming you are interested, I'll chat with steve. IMO it should be 1.0 for blueprint
[03:58] <lifeless> because its really a bad shock to look at that page at the moment
[04:07] <jamesh> lifeless: just replied to the bug with a short description of what it is doing now and what you are probably asking for it to do
[04:08] <lifeless> thank you!
[04:22] <jamesh> does what I wrote sound like what you're experiencing?
[05:15] <lifeless> jamesh: I've replied
[05:31] <jamesh> lifeless: (a) I don't think specs get attached to series, do they? and (b) milestones can have dates attached, so can have order
[05:32] <lifeless> yes, specs get targets at series
[05:32] <lifeless> see https://launchpad.net/products/bzr/+specs for instance
[05:32] <jamesh> so they do.  That must be new :)
[05:49] <jamesh> looks like SteveA will be able to carry his laptop on as hand luggage
[06:00] <lifeless> they are relaxing again ?
[06:01] <jamesh> one piece of hand luggage measuring 45cm by 35cm by 16cm
[06:01] <jamesh> can put a laptop in, but need to remove it from the bag for screening
[06:01] <jamesh> still can't take a bottle of water on
[06:02] <jamesh> unless it is prescription water :)
[06:07] <lifeless> is 45/35/16 the old size?
[06:07] <lifeless> or have they resized it ?
[06:16] <jamesh> I think that's a fair bit smaller than before
[06:16] <jamesh> 16cm is not very thick for luggage
[06:32] <lifeless> meh, I'll need to get new travel gear then
[06:32] <lifeless> sucks
[08:44] <sabdfl> lifeless: at the rate you're going you'll be able to check yourself as cargo baggage soon ;-)
[08:45] <sabdfl> jamesh: thanks for taking on the spec-roadmap, the idea is just to show "what you have to do to get the most important, approved specs nailed first"
[08:45] <lifeless> sabdfl: lol
[08:45] <sabdfl> showing their dependencies ahead of them
[09:41] <SteveA> morning
[09:42] <jamesh> SteveA: sounds like you can carry your laptop on the plane now
[09:43] <jamesh> but no cosmetics
[09:54] <SteveA> hmm, got a URL for that?
[10:08] <jamesh> SteveA: www.baa.com
[10:59] <SteveA> thanks james
[11:03] <SteveA> jamesh: I want to do a bzr log, but for one particular file, and see only revisions where that file was updated
[11:03] <SteveA> how can I do that?
[11:04] <jamesh> SteveA: "bzr log filename" should do it, but it seems pretty slow
[11:04] <SteveA> it is giving me lots of revisions when that file was not updated
[11:05] <jamesh> I think it shows the log message for each mainline revision where it was changed (which includes all the log messages for merges)
[11:05] <jamesh> iirc they were looking at improving it for 0.9
[11:09] <spiv> SteveA: if you pipe the log output through 'grep -v "^    "' you'll filter out all the merged revisions.
[11:09] <jamesh> spiv: --short also trims the merges
[11:09] <SteveA> spiv thanks
[11:09] <SteveA> I have the revisions I'm after now
[11:09] <spiv> jamesh: ah, that's probably nicer :)
[11:10] <jamesh> but that doesn't give you the log messages for the revisions that changed the file
[11:10] <jamesh> it gives you the log messages of the merges
[11:34] <sivang> re
[11:34] <sivang> sabdfl: pong
[11:35] <sivang> spiv: pong
[11:36] <stub> Znarl: asuka is borked. I can't ssh in. I would suspect carlos chewing up the resources, but he isn't online, so I think it needs a power cycle unless someone happens to be in the data centre
[11:37] <spiv> sivang: I don't think I pinged?
[11:38] <sivang> spiv: ah right
[11:38] <sivang> 06:00 #launchpad: < spiv> sivang reported the problem.
[11:38] <sivang> spiv: sorry
[11:45] <spiv> sivang: ah :)
[11:45] <spiv> Hmm, that merge didn't happen.
[11:48] <danilos> stub: ping
[11:49] <stub> danilos: pong
[11:49] <danilos> stub: do you perhaps have the last queries carlos executed for xaraxl translation removal?
[11:49] <danilos> stub: or he never sent them to you (and run them only on staging so far)
[11:50] <stub> I haven't seen anything about xaraxl
[12:02] <danilos> stub: ok, thanks
[12:10] <SteveA> stub: hi
[12:10] <SteveA> stub: would you look at bug 56397 please?  I think it is a cookie naming issue or something like that.
[12:10] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 56397 in launchpad "App subdomains require separate login" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56397
[12:32] <SteveA> stub: assigned to you.
[12:33] <SteveA> bug 56397
[12:33] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 56397 in launchpad "App subdomains require separate login" [High,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56397
[12:46] <sivang> laters
[12:48] <jamesh> morning ddaa
[01:03] <stub> SteveA: Did you take down staging?
[01:21] <SteveA> stub: no
[01:51] <sabdfl> sivang: please update your branch and fix the trivial issue I mailed about, and i'll land it
[01:53] <jamesh> sabdfl: for the BranchIndirection spec (lp:... URLs for bzr), are you attached to lp://$product, or would you be happy with lp:/$product or lp:///$product?
[01:54] <sabdfl> jamesh: whats the semantic difference in url-speak?
[01:54] <jamesh> the latter two leave the door open for talking to non-default launchpad instances (e.g. staging)
[01:54] <sabdfl> and what's the difference between the latter two?
[01:55] <jamesh> sabdfl: if you have a URL like "scheme://foo/bar", the "//foo" bit is the authority component which generally refers to a host
[01:56] <jamesh> "lp:/$product" is a URL without an authority component, and "lp:///$product" is a URL with a blank authority -- I was thinking it would be good to accept either of them and treat them as the default LP instance
[01:56] <sabdfl> are there cases where people have agreed to treat scheme:///bar and scheme:/bar differently?
[01:57] <jamesh> not to my knowledge (there are only a few schemes using blank authority sections like file:///)
[01:57] <sabdfl> who has a landing due today? i have a one-line .pt fix that i'd like to get it
[01:58] <sabdfl> ok, +1 on your recommendation, and thanks
[01:59] <jamesh> while lp:///$product is one extra character to type, if we accept lp:/$product as a synonym it can be one less character to type :)
[02:24] <sabdfl> stub: ping
[02:24] <stub> sabdfl: pong
[02:24] <sabdfl> stub: did you take a look at that idea of keeping a spare test_db handy at all times?
[02:24] <sabdfl> to reduce test runner time?
[02:25] <stub> It seemed a valid idea. Only trying it will let us know how much of a saving it would be.
[02:27] <stub> It will increase complexity in parts of the code (need a daemon or thread that creates and drops the dbs), but will simplify some of the existing code that needs to deal with race conditions in creating and dropping databases.
[02:28] <stub> (Hmm... although the daemon will likely need to deal with this too...)
[03:07] <stub> SteveA: We will likely have trouble testing cookies with our existing development domain setup
[03:08] <stub> btw. If you follow the documented procedure for setting up /etc/hosts, Gnome will blow it away when you reconfigure your network through the configuration applet.
[03:09] <stub> Hmm... actually should be fine
[03:13] <stub> Anyone know the difference between request.getURL and request.getApplicationURL ?
[03:55] <SteveA> stub: yes
[03:55] <SteveA> stub: the application URL is the root, taking virtual hosting into account
[03:55] <stub> ta
[03:55] <SteveA> there are args you can apply to count up URL segments and include them.  or is it down?  whatever.  not all that useful.
[03:56] <SteveA> getURL gets you the currnetly published URL.  gets weird if you ask for it during traversal, as in, during the process of publication
[03:56] <SteveA> basically, the zope3 model of a request is rather too bound to "traversal" in a zope2-ish-way
[03:56] <SteveA> well, not really a zope2-ish-way
[03:56] <SteveA> more of a zope3-ish-way
[04:19] <salgado> stub, ping?
[06:13] <bradb> BjornT: ping
[06:52] <sabdfl> anybody have a landing due shortly and willing to slipstream in a 1-line template fix?
[06:53] <sivang> sabdfl: I'm sending the patch shortly
[06:53] <sivang> sabdfl: send it to your email ?
[07:15] <sivang> sabdfl: I have the patch ready, after applying kiko's and your comments. Sending it to you now via email.
[07:19] <sivang> sabdfl: sent, kiko CC'd
[07:22] <sivang> be back alters.
[07:22] <sivang> argh, that is - laters.
[07:35] <ddaa> Call for bikeshedding
[07:35] <ddaa> I'm modifying branch/+edit to allow changing the product and name of a branch
[07:36] <ddaa> Now, when changing those attributes, we can have an unique-name constraint violation if there is already a branch existing with that owner, product and name.
[07:36] <ddaa> So, when the user just changed the name, it's easy, the error should be displayed on the name field.
[07:36] <ddaa> But when the user changed the product, that probably means the user _really_ means that branch should be in the product.
[07:37] <ddaa> So the right way to get that done is to change the name...
[07:37] <ddaa> But... displaying an error for the name field, which was not modified would probably be confusing...
[07:37] <ddaa> Same problem if the user changed the product _and_ the name.
[07:37] <ddaa> Does anybody have an idea to make that non-confusing?
[07:39] <salgado> ddaa, maybe displaying a custom "The project you've chosen already has a branch with this name, you'll have to either rename this branch or the existing one" (or something to that intent) at the top of the page?
[07:39] <salgado> s/project/product
[07:40] <ddaa> Alternatively, we could show the same error on both the product and name fields, saying "There is already a branch registered by $owner in product $product with name $name. We suggest you change the name of this branch to avoid the conflict."
[07:40] <ddaa> salgado: two remarks: the owner of the branch is as important as the product, and in the general case the user does not own the branch with the conflicting name.
[07:40] <ddaa> And so cannot change its name.
[07:40] <salgado> I think that gives the impression that the user has to change both fields, when in fact changing only one would be enough
[07:41] <ddaa> Right.
[07:41] <ddaa> That's my concern, but showing an error on name when the user just modified product would be confusing IMO.
[07:41] <salgado> agreed
[07:42] <salgado> that's why I suggested a message on the top of the page
[07:42] <salgado> (using top_of_page_errors of GFV/LFV)
[07:43] <ddaa> I see. But don't you think we should also provide a marker on the field to change?
[07:43] <ddaa> It's going to be a pretty large form, so some assistance would be welcome.
[07:44] <salgado> yes, that would be like the ideal solution, but if this is not a hand-crafted form, this is not going to be trivial, as I don't think we have the necessary infrastructure
[07:44] <salgado> (maybe I'm wrong and there's something new with zope3.2, but I can't tell for sure)
[07:45] <ddaa> jamesh: can any of your new magic help me there?
[07:52] <ddaa> Mh... +addbranch does not appear to handle name conflicts anyway...
[09:12] <kiko> SteveA, BjornT: ping?
[09:12] <kiko> ValueError: Unknown SQL builtin type: <type 'zope.security._proxy._Proxy'> for <Person at 0x31c18450>
[09:12] <kiko> SteveA, BjornT: this error occurs when we try to do a selectBy(person=self) when the object we have is actually a security proxy.
[09:13] <kiko> SteveA, BjornT: is it possible to work around this? Can I simply allow __sqlrepr__ in some base interface?
[09:14] <kiko> SteveA, BjornT: or is there somewhere else where I can allow __sqlrepr__ to be called on all our objects?
[09:14] <bradb> kiko: personID=self.id?
[09:14] <kiko> bradb, that is the bug I am trying to work around.
[09:14] <kiko> err fix.
[09:14] <kiko> using personID=self.id is arguably a bug
[09:14] <kiko> we should be able to do person=self
[09:14] <kiko> and in most cases it works
[09:15] <kiko> however, in code which uses a proxy object as its argument..
[09:15] <bradb> we should, i agree. i thought you were asking if you could work around person=self
[09:15] <kiko> well, I don't want to work around that error -- I want to fix it (that was the purpose of my current branch :)
[09:16] <BjornT> kiko: what's the traceback?
[09:16] <kiko> BjornT, one moment.
[09:16] <kiko> https://sodium.ubuntu.com/~andrew/paste/file4mJIz8.html
[09:19] <BjornT> kiko: i'd guess, that in _SO_columnClause, obj.id should be replaced with getID(obj)
[09:19] <BjornT> kiko: we override getID to make it aware of security proxies
[09:19] <kiko> BjornT, a bug in SQLObject? aha.
[09:19] <BjornT> kiko: actually, the whole if-else clause could probably be replaced with getID(obj)
[09:23] <BjornT> kiko: i leave it to you to decide wheter it's a bug in SQLObject or not. i'm trying to stay away from the SQLObject code as much as possible :), so i'm not 100% sure what's the correct thing to do.
[09:46] <ddaa> bradb: I think Launchpad demonstrates that sqlobject has quite a thorough support for duct taping.
[09:46] <bradb> sqlobject is some craaazy glue
[10:04] <ddaa> from canonical.launchpad.scripts.importd.tests.sourcetransport_helpers import (
[10:04] <ddaa>     ImportdSourceTarballTestCase, ImportdSourceTransportTestCase)
[10:04] <ddaa> that's sick
[10:05] <ddaa> somebody said that "flat is better than nested", maybe we should flatten the canonical namespace a bit...
[10:06] <kiko> BjornT, so I ended up doing something different, which does work. the issue is that I don't want to just cut sqlrepr() out of there completely.
[10:08] <kiko> (it may be a high-impact change)
[10:29] <kiko> stub!
[10:29] <kiko> good that you showed up
[10:56] <lucasvo> does LP have some sort of a source viewer?
[10:57] <lucasvo> for bzr branches
[10:58] <kiko> lucasvo, not yet. is there a source viewer for bzr at all? what does #bzr say?
[10:59] <lucasvo> crap, I am in a discussion about what to use as a dev-plattform lp and bzr or svn and trac
[11:03] <lucasvo> can a bug be closed on lp by stating "fixes #18" in a commit message?
[11:04] <kiko> lucasvo, not yet, but it will be possible in the short term.
[11:04] <ddaa> not yet, but we do plan to do that soon
[11:04] <ddaa> I should be there three months from now
[11:04] <ddaa> s/I/it/
[11:05] <ddaa> same for the branch viewer
[11:05] <lucasvo> in three months?
[11:05] <ddaa> yeah, same time frame
[11:06] <lucasvo> I guess that's kinda too late for a project starting now :(
[11:06] <lucasvo> ddaa: but linking a bugfix to a bzr ci is not possible now?
[11:06] <ddaa> there was some work done before on that, but it was overriden by work to make hosted branches and mirrors faster
[11:06] <ddaa> lucasvo: yes it's possible now
[11:06] <lucasvo> ddaa: how?
[11:07] <ddaa> from the bug page, click "Add Branch"
[11:07] <ddaa> the branch must already be hosted or mirrored on Launchpad
[11:08] <ddaa> what's missing is adding some smarts to e.g. create bug-branch links, or updating bug status by scanning commit messages and merges.
[11:09] <kiko> bradb, is the XMLRPC interface to +filebug actually deployed?
[11:09] <bradb> kiko: it should be, but I haven't tested it yet, because I didn't want to send my p/w over the network
[11:10] <kiko> bradb, even over https?
[11:10] <kiko> or is xmlrpc not over https?
[11:10] <ddaa> bradb: mh, eventually we should put an easy path to registering an external branch and explaining how to host one from the bug/+addbranch page.
[11:10] <ddaa> it's a bit mysterious at the moment
[11:11] <lucasvo> are there any plans that LP will have a wiki per project?
[11:11] <lucasvo> such as trac?
[11:11] <ddaa> lucasvo: not AFAIK, but there are plan to add a simple wiki langage to the specifications tracker.
[11:11] <lucasvo> ok
[11:12] <bradb> kiko: it's over https, but, aiui, the credentials seem to be passed in the URL, which i thought might be a security concern. maybe that doesn't matter?
[11:12] <sabdfl> it does
[11:13] <lucasvo> btw, on https://launchpad.net/products/harmony/+specs "mozilla specifications" is more or less a deadlink
[11:13] <kiko> bradb, the credentials are passed in the URL? really?
[11:13] <ddaa> mpt: copy that? ^^
[11:13] <ddaa> mh.. crap mpt is likely not around at this time
[11:14] <mpt> hi ddaa
[11:14] <bradb> kiko: yes, and no, i think. /me verifies the xmlrpclib docs
[11:14] <ddaa> mpt: see last message from lucasvo
[11:14] <bradb> Both the HTTP and HTTPS transports support the URL syntax extension for HTTP Basic Authentication: http://user:pass@host:port/path. The user:pass portion will be base64-encoded as an HTTP `Authorization' header, and sent to the remote server as part of the connection process when invoking an XML-RPC method. You only need to use this if the remote server requires a Basic Authentication user and password.
[11:15] <mpt> lucasvo, good point, report a bug and assign it to sabdfl :-P
[11:15] <mpt> It's hard to show a good example until upstreams start using Blueprint, though
[11:15] <kiko> bradb, it seems to suggest that you use that syntax to /specify/ a user and password, but that an Authorization: header is what's shipped to the remote server.
[11:15] <bradb> yeah
[11:15] <mpt> bzr specs would be a good example
[11:15] <bradb> so, perhaps it's ok
[11:16] <kiko> sabdfl, bradb, why would the URL be an issue, btw? it is also encrypted in HTTPS traffic.
[11:16] <sabdfl> mpt: woncha fix that with your long-approved-conflict-free-but-unlanded-bazaar UI cleanup? and that oneliner I gave you earlier?
[11:16] <mpt> okie dokie
[11:17] <lucasvo> mpt: I still don't really get what a spec is, maybe writing a doc would be better than linking to upstream
[11:17] <mpt> lucasvo, like a bug report on steroids
[11:17] <sabdfl> kiko: if it's passed in url arguments it would be logged, for a start
[11:18] <sabdfl> it it's in an auth header, that's different, but not what bradb said
[11:18] <sabdfl> mpt: thanks
[11:18] <kiko> sabdfl, logged by.. whom?
[11:19] <sabdfl> kiko: by us
[11:19] <sabdfl> remember we don't as a rule know anybody's password
[11:19] <sabdfl> it's not evern recoverable from the db, given the digesting we do
[11:19] <kiko> ah
[11:20] <sabdfl> however, if it were logged, it would be at risk of lying around
[11:20] <sabdfl> and being exposed
[11:20] <kiko> I don't think the password is ever passed over the URL, though
[11:20] <sabdfl> we should not be loggin in through xmlrpc
[11:20] <bradb> sabdfl: not in url args, just in the URL, as per the syntax taken from the xmlrpclib docs
[11:20] <sabdfl> it should be a key that can be exchanged
[11:20] <sabdfl> so that scripts etc can keep the key in the clear
[11:20] <sabdfl> without exposing a password
[11:20] <kiko> user-agents allow specifying the user/password that way
[11:20] <sabdfl> make sense?
[11:21] <sabdfl> bradb: as long as it turns into auth headers, that's no problem for now
[11:21] <sabdfl> but the proper xmlrpc interface needs keys
[11:21] <kiko> sabdfl, the server doesn't actually receive the URL the client is accessing though!
[11:21] <kiko> it receives the path and host portions
[11:21] <kiko> the path in the GET or POST line
[11:21] <kiko> and the host portion (post HTTP/1.0) in a header
[11:22] <kiko> ah
[11:22] <kiko> I see, you were confused by brad's suggestion of "URL arguments".
[11:22] <sabdfl> (22:12:37) bradb: kiko: it's over https, but, aiui, the credentials seem to be passed in the URL, which i thought might be a security concern. maybe that doesn't matter?
[11:22] <kiko> right
[11:22] <sabdfl> that's all i was commenting on
[11:22] <kiko> sorry :)
[11:22] <kiko> as for the token idea.
[11:23] <sabdfl> it would be perfeclty possible to write an xmlrpc interface this way if you did not know better
[11:23] <sabdfl> i have seen worse done
[11:23] <kiko> so the user would post an auth header and get back a token which he could then keep on using for a while?
[11:23] <sabdfl> kiko: no, the user goes to lp.net, goes to a page in their account, requests a key and is given one
[11:23] <sabdfl> it has a lifespan of n days
[11:24] <sabdfl> it can be revoked
[11:24] <kiko> ah.
[11:24] <bradb> bug 56523
[11:24] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 56523 in malone "xmlrpc works" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56523
[11:24] <bradb> w00t
[11:24] <kiko> VF
[11:24] <sabdfl> we correlate the key to the account, and use that person
[11:24] <bradb> kiko: that was a test with a python script
[11:24] <sabdfl> if a project has a special need for a long-lived key, we can give them that
[11:24] <bradb> https://help.launchpad.net/MaloneXMLRPC
[11:24] <sabdfl> we can throttle on the basis of keys without hitting the db
[11:24] <sabdfl> if we need to raise the throttle for a key, we can do that too
[11:24] <sabdfl> all making sense?
[11:25] <kiko> sabdfl, by throttle do you mean "time-limit"?
[11:25] <sabdfl> rate-of-query-limit
[11:26] <sabdfl> typicla limit would be 1 query per second over any given minute
[11:26] <sabdfl> so, you can burst, but then have to wait, or you can just slowly trawl
[11:27] <kiko> sabdfl, and rate-limit where in the software stack? iptables?
[11:38] <sabdfl> kiko: most anything that can do rate-limiting can do it on the basis of a header like that
[11:39] <kiko> sabdfl, oh. apache has a mod_throttle, right?
[11:39] <sabdfl> kiko: yes, and i'm sure pound has something similar, and there are very good appliances that can do it too
[11:40] <kiko> right.
[11:40] <sabdfl> xmlrpc is great but also a risk, we can invest in doing it properly
[11:40] <sabdfl> on the icon - doh
[11:42] <kiko> ok
[11:44] <lifeless> squid-3 can throttle on anything it can filter on :0
[11:44] <lifeless> so yeah, lots of things as sabdfl
[11:44] <lifeless> says
[11:45] <kiko> salgado, have you seen bug 35099?
[11:45] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 35099 in launchpad "feedback about karma" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/35099
[11:47] <salgado> kiko, no, first time I'm seeing it
[11:47] <kiko> yeah, me too
[11:47] <kiko> sabdfl, about karma in LP: http://alligevel.blogspot.com/2006/07/karma-in-launchpad.html
[11:48] <kiko> salgado, assign to you?
[11:49] <salgado> kiko, sure
[11:50] <kiko> salgado, also, see the blog above.
[11:52] <kiko> BjornT, bradb, salgado: there's no<EMAIL_ADDRESS>right?
[11:52] <bradb> no idea
[11:53] <salgado> AFAIK, the email interface of the support tracker can only be used to add new comments
[11:53] <kiko> salgado, thanks.
[11:55] <sabdfl> we should definitely let folks create a question via email
[11:55] <kiko> agreed, just checking.
[11:55] <kiko> salgado, is there a bug filed on that?
[11:56] <salgado> not sure, let me check
[11:57] <kiko> yes
[11:57] <kiko> there is
[11:57] <kiko> https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad-support-tracker/+bug/53292
[11:57] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 53292 in launchpad-support-tracker "Email submit support ticket feature" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]
[11:58] <salgado> this is not really that, it's something more complex
[11:58] <kiko> salgado, I think aaron is just confused, that would solve his problem
[11:59] <salgado> yeah, maybe
[11:59] <kiko> if he sets the mailing list to be his support contact
[11:59] <kiko> and we allow replies to the support requests
[12:00] <kiko> and email to new@support
[12:00] <kiko> then, well, it would work out.
[12:05] <sabdfl> that's a little heath robinson, but creative and yes it would work
[12:05] <sabdfl> we do need mailing list integration. would you put a penny in that jar, please, kiko?
[12:06] <kiko> sabdfl, heh, okay. I'm not sure what that has to do with aaron's problem though. he wants to use gmane and our ticket tracker together. and we do support that already!
[12:07] <sabdfl> has anybody tried to run LP with python-twisted 2.4.0 in edgy? spiv?
[12:07] <sabdfl> i just KNOW you must have made that work
[12:07] <kiko> I hope spiv's still in bed!
[12:09] <sabdfl> one eye open, thats how it's done


[02:46] <linocisco> hi everyone
[02:47] <linocisco> is there any site where we can dowload tar ball file for all ubuntu packages rather than packages.ubuntu.com which only give us .deb file.?
[02:48] <patdk-lap> hmm, packages.ubuntu.com
[02:49] <patdk-lap> personally, I perfer to just use, apt-get source
[02:49] <lifeless> linocisco: yes, archive.ubuntu.com
[02:49] <lifeless> linocisco: has everything.
[02:50] <tonyyarusso> linocisco: Look over in the right sidebar - it has the original tarball, dsc, and diff.
[02:51] <tonyyarusso> but apt-get source is certainly more convenient.
[02:52] <linocisco> tonyyarusso, lifeless, patdk-lap , Dear all, thanks for your input. As I have internet at work only on windows machine as office standard, I would like to take all necessary ubuntu packages and copy to flash drive and install on my home ubuntu test server which has no internet
[02:53] <tonyyarusso> linocisco: Have you seen the apt-on-cd project?
[02:54] <linocisco> tonyyarusso, yes. to do so, I need on ubuntu machine at least.  But I have only windows machine at work. No other OS is allowed here.
[02:54] <tonyyarusso> linocisco: Trying to manually download dependencies would be a giant pain.  I'd suggest firing up a virtual machine in VBox or something with Ubuntu to run that.
[02:55] <tonyyarusso> Also, get a better job.
[02:56] <linocisco> tonyyarusso, ok. another thing is that we use NOvell GRoupwise at worik. That is only compatiable with windows's Novell Remote Groupwise. I tried with ubuntu. but in vain
[02:57] <tonyyarusso> How are the '90s, btw?  :P
[02:58] <tonyyarusso> Evolution has a groupwise connector, supposedly
[03:02] <linocisco> http://www.brighttalk.com/webcast/6793/54727 is cool?
[05:03] <Kentos> hey guys, question quick, i've set up some raid arrays, and was wondering if i have one hardware raid and another configured through software raid, do I partition the boot array as an autconfig, flagged for boot, and then for the second array (which i intend to set up through software on ubuntu) configure it normally but select a sub-root mount directory?
[05:04] <Kentos> sub-root might not be discribing it properly, but mounting it say, in the /usr directory would be a viable option if its not the boot partitions
[05:31] <Assid> err whats a suggested virtualization environment on ubuntu-server?
[05:31] <lifeless> kvm, or openstack.
[05:31] <lifeless> depending on the scale you need
[05:32] <Assid> 2-5 vm's
[05:33] <Assid> i used to mostly use openvz .. but thats not really "officially supported"
[05:33] <Assid> however, it used to be the best of the lot for me
[05:37] <Assid> lifeless: can you help me get started on this?
[05:37] <Assid> what kernel etc do i need to kvm
[05:37] <lifeless> any Ubuntu kernel
[05:38] <Assid> 3.2.0-30-generic  would do ?
[05:39] <Assid> there really should be a ncurses based app to manage the vms
[05:39] <lifeless> Assid: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/KVM
[05:40] <Assid> yeah im reding this : https://help.ubuntu.com/community/KVM/Installation#Installation_of_KVM
[05:42] <Assid> err
[05:43] <Assid> lifeless: need some help in the networking section..i already have a bond setup.. now its asking me to bridge
[05:44] <Assid> so do o i bridge my bond ?
[05:48] <lifeless> depends on what you're doing, but if you need to connect the VM network to the outside world, a bridge is the usual answer.
[05:49] <Assid> the server itself has a bond setup..
[05:50] <Assid> so i created a new bridge. and i setup the bond to be part of the bridge
[05:52] <Assid> okay that seems to work.. the server is reaacable
[05:52] <Assid> whats virbr0 ?
[06:27] <Assid> err can someone help me with this.. im getting  error: internal error cannot load AppArmor profile 'libvirt-c2c3f180-8795-e662-5a16-40db34c4bcd2' when i try and start a kvm instance
[07:59] <koolhead17> hello all
[08:28] <mp_> good morning
[08:33] <koolhead17> all this while i though mp_ is a bot
[09:03] <balboah> aah. Why isn't my content filter for postfix executing
[09:29] <linocisco> hi
[09:30] <linocisco> how to disable screen saver or sleep mode  on server ?
[10:14] <jamespage> jdstrand, is there a specific reason why we only have iptables 1.4.12 in quantal?  The changelog entries look a bit screwy and I wanted to check whether I was missing something
[10:18] <linocisco> how to install Keryx on ubuntu server?
[10:18] <linocisco> I tried apt-get install keryx, not ok
[11:15] <orogor> hi
[11:16] <orogor> considering than system-config-lvm is broken , is there any gui left for managing lvm ?
[11:17] <xnox> orogor: gnome disk utility
[11:17] <xnox> orogor: palim (precise and older) something or gnome-disks (quantal)
[11:18] <xnox> orogor: plus command line for lvm is easy: pvs, vgs, lvs for Physical Volume, Volume Group, Logical Volume Status
[11:18] <xnox> and then you really need lvcreate & lvremove to add/remove logical volumes.
[11:20] <orogor> running 12.4 here
[11:21] <orogor> rnunning dist upgrade
[11:26] <orogor> xnox, can t  create lvm with it it seems
[11:26] <orogor> ohhh maybe i can
[12:03] <vanmik> i'm trying to make sendmail work with this manual: http://jonsview.com/how-to-setup-email-services-on-ubuntu-using-postfix-tlssasl-and-dovecot .The problem is when i do 'telnet localhost 25' and then 'ehlo localhost' the only line i get is "250 ENHANCEDSTATUSCODES". Any ideas how to fix that?
[12:51] <zul> good morning
[13:11] <hallyn> pmatulis: hi, could you take a look at serverguide merge request https://code.launchpad.net/~serge-hallyn/serverguide/serverguide-dns-varlibbind
[13:11] <hallyn> (about the start lxc updates)
[13:23] <pmatulis> hallyn: alright
[13:26] <hallyn> pmatulis: thanks
[13:26] <ninjix> I'm working on a little kvm script for running precise cloud images on my laptop and am looking for a way to manage DNS registration with the dnsmasq daemon I have listening on the kvm virtual bridge
[13:27] <raub> ninjix: So what is biting you?
[13:28] <ninjix> raub: looking for some doc on how to tell dnsmasq to assign DHCP to the kvm and register the dns
[13:29] <ninjix> googling isn't turning up good answers so far this morning, figured I ask in channel
[13:29] <raub> To the KVM or to the vm you built in kvm?
[13:30] <raub> If the latter, there is a way to dump the config for the vm using virsh
[13:30] <ninjix> laptop <---> kvmnet br0 <---> i-kvm0, i-kvm1, i-kvm(n)
[13:31] <ninjix> I want the kvm to be able to find each other by dns dynamically
[13:31] <raub> How many kvm hosts (not vms) do you have then?
[13:31] <ninjix> just my laptop
[13:32] <raub> once you create the vm, you can get the mac addresses using virsh
[13:33] <ninjix> I'm setting this up for clean environment testing and don't always have access to our private openstack
[13:33] <raub> then feed that to dnsmasq, with the vm name
[13:33] <raub> For each vm
[13:33] <ninjix> ah... assign it all ahead of time
[13:34] <raub> That said, if you do not care about the ip given for each vm, just have them configured to send their hostname to dnsmasq
[13:34] <raub> I think that is the default for ubuntu
[13:34] <raub> i.e. nothing to do
[13:35] <jcastro> SpamapS, CFP for SCALE is open, I take it you'd like to redo?
[13:36] <jcastro> SpamapS, I don't want to submit the same talk as last year, so I figure we can just chat about it whenever
[13:36] <ninjix> raub: that was my first inclination but the cloud-image registers itself as "ubuntu" before cloud-init takes configures it
[13:36] <raub> ninjix: in that case, I would get the macs and assign ips for each vm
[13:37] <ninjix> raub: yeah, that way seems like the least complicated
[13:37] <raub> Asa bonus you can number them in a sane way ;)
[13:37] <ninjix> thanks for bouncing the idea around with me
[13:38] <raub> ninjix: Me? I am just here to spread lies ;)
[13:38] <ninjix> ;)
[13:39] <raub> FYI, there are little scripts out there to generate macs for you vm
[13:39] <raub> I like that since I can make them all have the same first half
[13:39] <raub> so I can quickly figure out they are my, say, cloud vms
[13:40] <ninjix> yup, I use those already
[13:41] <Daviey> roaksoax: hey, do we still run maas-import-iso's on precise, weekly?
[13:41] <roaksoax> Daviey: yes
[13:41] <ninjix> everyone seems to go pre-assign networking (amazon, openstack, MAAS, orchestra...)
[13:41] <Daviey> roaksoax: thanks
[13:41] <ninjix> must be a good reason
[13:41] <raub> Makes life easier
[13:41] <raub> including when you have to do monitoring
[13:43] <raub> Or crap like puppet
[13:43] <raub> and, I would imagine, juju
[13:44] <ninjix> me likes juju
[13:52] <zul> hallyn: i think we might need this: http://libvirt.org/git/?p=libvirt.git;a=commit;h=a4fd740561aaf4c48b5fefd6b7a39d9963d1147a
[14:17] <SpamapS> jcastro: yeah I was thinking we might get a little more creative with the submission this time
[14:18] <zul> Daviey: websockify packaged and novnc do you want me to do a FFE and you can review them?
[14:29] <Daviey> zul: ok
[14:34] <hallyn> zul: i'm not sure.  will it even properly detect 'mount -t cgroup cgroup /cgroup'?  i think it might still require the cgroups to be separately mounted under it
[14:34] <zul> hallyn: yeah after second thought i dont think we need it
[14:36] <hallyn> zul: ok, so there's no specific open bug you thought it should address?
[14:36] <zul> hallyn: nope ignore my ramblings in this case :)
[14:37] <zul> hallyn: the rantings of a madman
[14:40]  * koolhead17 pokes zul and hides
[14:46] <hallyn> zul: everyone turns a little mad as release approaches :)
[14:52] <zul> Daviey: for websockify https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1048679 and novnc https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/novnc/+bug/1048676 (websockify is sitting in binary new (just uploaded))
[14:55] <zul> hallyn: um...does this look weird to you? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1196779/
[14:57] <Daviey> zul: otp
[14:57] <zul> Daviey:  ack
[15:11] <hallyn> zul: looking (graphics all effed up, including fonts...)
[15:11] <hallyn> zul: yeah that's messed up
[15:12] <hallyn> zul: what are the perms on the parent dir?
[15:12] <zul> hallyn: rwxr-xr-x
[15:13] <hallyn> zul: hm, no, it's normal
[15:13] <hallyn> zul: only root user can write, and you can't read that file
[15:14] <hallyn> (you read devices.list)
[15:14] <zul> hallyn: but if i do something like http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1196803/
[15:16] <hallyn> zul: that's the wrong way to do it
[15:16] <zul> hallyn: whats the right way?
[15:16] <hallyn> your doing sudo echo' and then piping that into the file (as you)
[15:16] <hallyn> echo wahtever | sudo tee thefile
[15:17] <hallyn> echo 'b *:* rwx' | sudo tee devices.allow
[15:18] <zul> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1196809/
[15:20] <hallyn> zul: jinkeys, could tee be parsing your input?
[15:20] <hallyn> no, wrks here for me
[15:20] <zul> son of a bitch
[15:21] <hallyn> do you have tee aliased?
[15:22] <hallyn> zul: oh, i see
[15:22] <zul> no alias
[15:22] <hallyn> the 'invalid argument' is returned by the file write :)
[15:22] <hallyn> zul: 'b' is bad.  try 'a'
[15:23] <zul> hallyn: whats the difference between b and a?
[15:24] <hallyn> a is all.  b in my mind meant 'both', but it means nothing, hence -EINVAL :)
[15:25] <titaniumNoob_> \msg
[15:26] <zul> hallyn: so is https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/nova/virt/disk/api.py#L160 still valid?
[15:45] <hallyn> zul: hm.  maybe b is supposed to be valid...
[15:50] <hallyn> zul: oh b is block
[15:50] <zul> right thats what i thought
[15:51] <hallyn> zul: does 'b *:* rwm' work for you?  x was wrong
[15:51] <zul> hallyn: yeah
[15:55] <hallyn> zul: sorry :)
[16:11] <Lavvy> Hello guys am a newbei here i have some questions pls
[16:12] <Lavvy> Please doesnt ubuntu cloud have a dashboard, non linux experts can use .
[16:13] <Lavvy> Something like in rackspace
[16:16] <Lavvy> I tested it on amazon today
[16:17] <Lavvy> Please anyone to help?
[16:19] <hggdh> smoser, roaksoax: I am testing the upstream fix for bug 967815 in the QA lab; I will -- being successful -- propose a merge for Precise, and I will also check Quantal for applicability
[16:20] <smoser> hggdh, oh. good. thats nice.
[16:21] <hggdh> smoser: if you are interested, the change is at https://code.launchpad.net/~hggdh2/ubuntu/precise/cobbler/lp-967815
[16:23] <Lavvy> How can i see ubutu public cloud dashboard? Just like in rackspace
[16:23] <smoser> the package is horizon, Lavvy
[16:25] <Lavvy> Ok, do i install it sepratly
[16:25] <smoser> i'm not sure i know what you mean. i dont think its really separable from openstack.
[16:25] <smoser> it requires admin access, which you dont have if you're just a client.
[16:25] <smoser> hm..
[16:25] <smoser> at least i wouldhave thought it did
[16:26] <smoser> but i have limited knowledge here.
[16:27] <Lavvy> Ok thanks smoser
[16:29] <Lavvy> Can ami image be used with the current ubuntu/openstack version
[16:30] <Lavvy> In private cloud
[17:07] <zul> hallyn: ping
[17:11] <koolhead17> Lavvy, kindly check/refer the doc  before asking here
[17:15] <hallyn> zul: .
[17:19] <zul> hallyn: nm...figured it out :)
[17:22] <hallyn> zul: ok
[17:23] <hallyn> terrific :)
[17:34] <wuhaa11> Hi everyone
[17:34] <wuhaa11> anyone know how to combine bandwidth from multiple snmpd servers into one graph in mrtg?
[17:52] <icebourg> anybody here an expert with lvm / raid settings in an ubuntu pre-seed file? Having issues allocating space the way I would like it
[17:55] <hallyn> stgraber: i think the python-lxc api should uppecase states passed into c.wait()
[17:56] <stgraber> hallyn: that sounds like a good idea indeed
[17:58] <hallyn> stgraber: is there a trick to getting 'c.start()' to not crash due to console errors?
[17:59] <hallyn> i though it daemonized by default?
[17:59] <stgraber> it should
[17:59] <zul> smoser/hallyn: lxc-attach isnt going to work
[18:01] <hallyn> stgraber: I'm getting http://paste.ubuntu.com/1197133/ (implying, i think, it's trying to hook up /dev/console?)
[18:02] <stgraber> hallyn: I'm not overriding start() in python, it's just calling start() from the API so in theory you should get the same result when running it from C...
[18:02] <hallyn> stgraber: it works with 'lxc-start -n C2", but i haven't tried with the C api
[18:03] <hallyn> hm.  very curious
[18:03] <hallyn> i just didn't want ot lie in my little example in the server guide :)
[18:06] <xnox> icebourg: i am listening?!
[18:07] <stgraber> hallyn: are you running an up to date quantal system or something weirder than that?
[18:08] <stgraber> hallyn: I just tried starting a container here and it seems to be working fine
[18:10] <stgraber> hallyn: https://github.com/lxc/lxc/pull/2
[18:10] <stgraber> hallyn: try processing it with the command line to avoid the merge commit (git pull git://github.com/stgraber/lxc.git && git push)
[18:14] <smoser> stgraber, does it seem reasonable to you that /etc/init/iscsi-network-interface.conf (http://paste.ubuntu.com/1197158/) needs to call /etc/network/if-up.d/000resolvconf ?
[18:16] <stgraber> smoser: no, that seems a bit wrong
[18:17] <stgraber> smoser: whatever configures the network interface, in this case, I'm assuming initramfs-tools, should be creating the matching entry in /run/resolvconf/interface/
[18:17] <stgraber> smoser: you may want to look at how we're doing this in casper (with a similar networked root kind of case)
[18:18] <smoser> stgraber, if i did create that in the initramfs, would resolvconf in the real root dtrt ?
[18:18] <smoser> ie, would it handle already existing data there?
[18:19] <stgraber> smoser: I believe it does, at least I can't remember having to do any extra hack when doing a similar thing in casper
[18:19] <smoser> hm..
[18:19] <smoser> this would be generic change in initramfs-tools
[18:20] <stgraber> smoser: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1197168/ is the code we have in casper
[18:20] <smoser> as openiscsi just uses 'configure_networking' from initramfs /usr/share/initramfs-tools/scripts/functions
[18:21] <smoser> where did that come from ?
[18:21] <smoser> your paste
[18:21] <rtdos> one more question (2 parts): does ubuntu server come with sdl / opengl installed ? if not how do i install the sdl / opengl libraries ? namely the development libraries ?
[18:21] <stgraber> smoser: casper, scripts/casper-bottom/23networking
[18:21] <stgraber> smoser: I don't believe configure_networking actually configures /etc/resolv.conf
[18:21] <smoser> right. it does not.
[18:21] <stgraber> smoser: that's why we have the extra code in casper to deal with that
[18:22] <smoser> well, i'd suggest that *that* code was wrong.
[18:22] <smoser> you should have made initramfs configure_networking pre-populate /run/resolvconf/interface
[18:22] <stgraber> well, there are cases where you may not want configure_networking to touch the disk
[18:22] <smoser> (at least thats what your'e telling me)
[18:22] <smoser>  /run not disk
[18:22] <stgraber> right, s/disk/anything but the kernel interfaces/ :)
[18:23] <stgraber> for example in LTSP we have ipconfig run but we don't want it to configure the DNS as we'll then spawn udhcp which will do it
[18:23] <smoser> that seems liek not the right solutoin to me
[18:23] <smoser> to expect every single user of 'configure_networking' to have to implement resolvconf support
[18:23] <stgraber> adding an extra configure_resolving would work
[18:23] <stgraber> and then have people call that one if they want
[18:23] <smoser> still seems wrong
[18:24] <smoser> what is the case where you do not want resolvconf to work?
[18:24] <stgraber> I can't think of a case where you don't want resolvconf to work, but there are cases where you don't want ipconfig to configure resolvocnf
[18:24] <stgraber> basically any case where you'll then spawn a real dhcp client
[18:25] <stgraber> these clients could try and figure out what interface file ipconfig modified and remove it, but that's also a bit wrong
[18:25] <smoser> true
[18:26] <smoser> stbut actaully...
[18:26] <smoser> i think you've convinced me that i need this code in the rootfs
[18:26] <smoser> as i cannot / should not assume that /root/etc/resolv.conf is editable
[18:27] <smoser> but obvioyusly need to write it if there is no resolvconf
[18:29] <stgraber> I'm not sure I'm seeing why this would be better to have on the rootfs than in the initramfs as both have access to the ipconfig output and /run
[18:29] <smoser> because in the initramfs i cannot write to /etc/resolv.conf
[18:30] <smoser> post initramfs / becomes mounted RW so i can
[18:30] <smoser> (note, that post initramfs, you do have access to the ipconfig output in /run)
[18:30] <stgraber> hmm, right, I guess in the other cases we had the initramfs mount / read/write already so it wasn't a problem that / would be ro
[18:31] <hallyn> stgraber: oh, actually feh, maybe i have a test lxc from a friday test.
[18:32] <stgraber> smoser: not sure if you already did it, but might be worth checking that you don't have any remaining reference to /tmp/net-* as quantal's initramfs now moved it to /run/ (I already fixed a bunch of these)
[18:32] <stgraber> hallyn: I really need to setup automated builds from the staging tree (without any debian/local overrides) so we can easily test that stuff :)
[18:33] <smoser> stgraber, i stumbled on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/klibc/+bug/1047722
[18:33] <smoser> in precise this is busted.
[18:34] <hallyn> stgraber: (pushed github.com/stgraber/lxc master to lxc/lxc staging)
[18:34] <hallyn> stgraber: hm, maybe we can combine UTAH with juju for that
[18:34] <hallyn> i need to get lxc-test running under UTAH - hopefully this week.  so should all be easy as pie :)
[18:35] <stgraber> hallyn: well, automated builds I can get LP to do with a build recipe. I already have them running for the SF tree. Just need to change them to point to github and cleanup the packaging
[18:35] <stgraber> but yeah, tests should then be triggered with utah
[18:35] <hallyn> stgraber: care to do a quick review of the updates from lp:serverguide .. https://code.launchpad.net/~serge-hallyn/serverguide/serverguide-q-lxc ?
[18:35] <hallyn> stgraber: and provisioned with juju :)
[18:35] <stgraber> hallyn: can you take a minute to look at the two last patches from Dwight Engen? they are for config_cb and some extra APPARMOR ifdef
[18:36] <stgraber> so not things I'm confident in reviewing and commiting myself :)
[18:36] <hallyn> stgraber: can you push them to a temp branch on github?  (i deleted the emails)
[18:36] <stgraber> hallyn: sure
[18:37] <LinuxAdmin> hi guys
[18:37] <smoser> hm.. i had dealt with writable /etc/resolv.conf once before at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/isc-dhcp/+bug/857524 and it seems that might have regressed.
[18:38] <LinuxAdmin> I've recently installed ubuntu server 12.04 and configured automatic security updates
[18:38] <stgraber> hallyn: https://github.com/stgraber/lxc/tree/for-review
[18:38] <stgraber> hallyn: if they look good, just pull them directly to staging
[18:39] <LinuxAdmin> after updates were installed I could no more start the server, it starts in grub rescue console
[18:39] <hallyn> stgraber: will do, thx
[18:39] <LinuxAdmin> I'm trying to reinstall grub but I'm getting no luck
[18:39] <LinuxAdmin> is this a bug?
[18:40] <LinuxAdmin> is it normal that updates affect grub?
[18:40] <smoser> mdeslaur, ping
[18:40] <mdeslaur> smoser: yes?
[18:40] <hallyn> first one certainly looks good
[18:41] <smoser> i'm looking at http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/quantal/isc-dhcp/quantal/revision/56
[18:42] <LinuxAdmin> I reinstalled the server and restarted it before I made any upgrades and I could restart
[18:42] <smoser> and not understanding how you did not regress http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/quantal/isc-dhcp/quantal/revision/36
[18:42] <LinuxAdmin> after the updates get installed, I cannot boot any more
[18:43] <smoser> is there some reason now that we do not have to wait for /etc/resolv.conf to be writable ?
[18:43] <LinuxAdmin> so, for sure the problem is created after kernel updates
[18:43] <smoser> mdeslaur, ^
[18:44] <mdeslaur> smoser: one sec, I'm trying to figure out why the auto-importer turned by 2-line package change into that gigantic merge
[18:44] <smoser> yeah, that was annoying :)
[18:45] <LinuxAdmin> I'm tempted to not configure automatic security updates but I think it's not the way to deal with that, because I will not update important security problems
[18:45] <LinuxAdmin> have someone experienced this?
[18:50] <mdeslaur> smoser: looks like stgraber 's merge to 4.2.4 regressed that: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+source/isc-dhcp/4.2.4-1ubuntu1
[18:50] <mdeslaur> stgraber: was that an oversight, or was there a reason?
[18:53] <hallyn> stgraber: after cleaning up my pkgs c.start() works fine :)  sorry.  i guess this was actually while we were playing iwth the reaper
[18:54] <rtdos> ok lost sudo capability, am getting weird messages when i try to use sudo. how can i fix this without logging in as root?
[18:55] <hallyn> commits should be pushed (with my ack) to lxc/lxc #staging
[18:55] <hallyn> biab
[18:57] <stgraber> mdeslaur: ? was there anything related to iscsi in there?
[18:57] <smoser> mdeslaur, so why did you get blamed for it?
[18:57] <mdeslaur> smoser: because UDD doesn't actually work :)
[18:58] <mdeslaur> smoser: the auto-importer failed to import a bunch of uploads
[18:58] <smoser> suck.
[18:59] <mdeslaur> stgraber: isc-dhcp used to wait for /etc/resolv.conf to be writable, it was an ubuntu-specific delta, and that got dropped when you merged to 4.2.4...could you take a look?
[19:00] <smoser> hm.. i'm missing something.
[19:00] <stgraber> mdeslaur: ok, so completely unrelated to smoser's problem (dhclient doesn't run in his case)
[19:01] <smoser> well, its not completely unrelated.
[19:03] <mdeslaur> stgraber: I'm just responding to his ping about that missing delta, I didn't read scrollback
[19:03] <smoser> stgraber, it would seem that you regressed the non-resolvconf case
[19:03] <smoser> but i admit that i may be missing something here.
[19:04] <smoser> /sbin/dhclient-script used to wait to make sure /etc/resolv.conf was writable before calling scripts in /etc/dhcp/dhclient-enter-hooks.d
[19:04] <stgraber> smoser, mdeslaur: ok, putting on my list of stuff to look at
[19:05] <smoser> i only got here because i was trying to think of how to update this in the iscsi root case.
[19:05] <smoser> and clearly you need to wiait for rw root.
[19:05] <smoser> hm..
[19:05] <smoser> wow.
[19:06] <smoser> this is really a mess.
[19:06] <smoser> wait. no, its not so bad.
[19:06] <smoser> but i do think its regressed now.
[19:09] <stgraber> yeah, seems likely that it regressed when merging the ton of changes done on Debian's side. I'd have to look at it and figure out if just re-introducing it is enough.
[19:09] <stgraber> keeping in mind that we shouldn't wait when using resolvconf as otherwise we may well end up waiting indefinitely
[19:09] <stgraber> anyway, I have other isc-dhcp stuff to do this week, so I just added this one to the list
[19:10] <rtdos> ok lost sudo capability, am getting weird messages when i try to use sudo. how can i fix this without logging in as root?
[19:22] <rtdos> i get this error message when using sudo: http://pastebin.com/tqT1ysPF
[19:23] <sazawal> Any help for configuring gmail account in thunderbird?
[19:25] <patdk-wk> sazawal, login to google mail, click setup email for thunderbird?
[19:26] <sazawal> patdk-lap, I have done whatever was given in google and mozilla pages. Still couldnt get it working :(
[19:27] <sazawal> patdk-lap, it is showing Unable to connect to IMAP server. You may have exceeded the maximum number of connections to this server
[19:28] <rtdos> i get this error message when using sudo: http://pastebin.com/tqT1ysPF
[19:41] <guntbert> rtdos: does http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/fixsudo help?
[21:18] <leojrfs> do anyone here run ubuntu server in a flash drive?
[21:26] <Lavvy> Hello we need a good ubuntu expert that can help us out (on a commercial basis), please you could you pm me.


[02:12] <EvilResistance> did processing of ppa uploads get... faster in the past few weeks?
[02:12] <EvilResistance> i uploaded a source package and it was almost immediately detected
[02:12] <EvilResistance> (and processed/built)
[05:30] <EvilResistance> any LP admin around?
[05:31] <StevenK> !ask
[05:32] <EvilResistance> there's a reason i ask
[05:32] <EvilResistance> i have reason to believe someone's violating Oracle licensing by distributing Sun java
[05:32] <EvilResistance> hence the reason i'm seeking an *admin*
[05:33] <EvilResistance> (via a PPA, hence the LP admin thing)
[05:33] <StevenK> Well, sure. I'm an LP dev, so I can investigate if you wish
[05:33] <EvilResistance> good, privmsg OK?
[05:34] <StevenK> Sure.
[05:38] <EvilResistance> sent
[14:46] <davmor2> czajkowski, mrevell: is there a good guide to how to import apps from a git trunk into and bzr trunk/lp ?
[14:47] <mrevell> davmor2, Hey. This is what we have: https://help.launchpad.net/Code/Imports
[14:47] <davmor2> mrevell: thanks dude I'll go have a read
[14:48] <mrevell> np


[05:54] <inetpro> magespawn: pong
[05:54] <inetpro> good mornings
[06:04] <Kilos> hi charl psychicist Squirm  et al
[06:15] <Squirm> morning
[06:20] <ThatGraemeGuy> mornings
[06:22] <Kilos> hi ThatGraemeGuy
[06:34] <superfly> morning ThatGraemeGuy
[06:34]  * ThatGraemeGuy nods
[06:43] <Kilos> hi superfly
[06:46] <superfly> hi Kilos
[06:50] <Kilos> hi Cantide
[06:51] <Cantide> hello Kilos '-'/
[07:23] <nuvolari> o/ hello's
[07:23] <nuvolari> any BB-gurus around?
[07:23] <nuvolari> Packaging especially
[07:35] <Kilos> yo nuvolari
[07:45] <magespawn> good morning
[07:46] <Kilos> morning magespawn
[07:47] <magespawn> inetpro i just wanted to let an 'official type' person there is a new server book available for the loco
[07:47] <magespawn> hey Kilos
[07:49] <Kilos> isnt maia the go to person still magespawn ?
[07:49] <magespawn> Just about to go another drive
[07:50] <Kilos> lekker
[07:50] <magespawn> I did leave her a message with Maaz
[07:50] <Kilos> zerlgi, wb
[07:50] <Kilos> aha
[07:50] <zerlgi> Hi Kilos
[07:50] <zerlgi> tx
[07:51] <Kilos> sometimes only way to get to her is by email
[07:51] <Kilos> lemme know when you back magespawn
[07:51] <Kilos> wanna know if you installed extras with idle
[07:51] <magespawn> will do, later
[07:52] <magespawn> No not yet
[07:52] <Kilos> enjoy
[07:52] <Kilos> oh so its basic install that just works?
[07:52] <Kilos> whew
[07:53] <magespawn> Anyway, will chat when i get back.
[07:53] <Kilos> have a good time
[07:55] <Kilos> hi psyatw
[07:55] <psyatw> hi Kilos
[09:02] <charl> hi psyatw, Kilos, magespawn
[09:02] <charl> Maaz: coffee on
[09:02]  * Maaz puts the kettle on
[09:02] <psyatw> hi charl
[09:02] <psyatw> hi magespawn
[09:02] <psyatw> hi zerlgi
[09:06] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for charl!
[09:07] <charl> Maaz: thanks
[09:07] <Maaz> charl: Sure
[09:07] <Kilos> hi charl
[09:07] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee please
[09:07] <Maaz> Kilos: There isn't a pot on
[09:07] <Kilos> aw
[09:08] <Kilos> magespawn, has gone on a game drive
[09:09] <Kilos> hopefully buck and timid things
[10:51] <nuvolari> hi oom kilos, gaan dit goed?
[10:52] <Kilos> ja dankie nuvolari en jy?
[10:52] <Kilos> ons gaan slang leer. jy moet begin tyd maak
[11:15] <nuvolari> lol, slang leer?
[11:16] <Kilos> haha ja ons gaan byteofpython in n klas doen
[11:16] <Kilos> of in my kanaal of daai #linux-studies
[11:18] <Kilos> maar soos gewoonlik sukkel ek met iets voor ons even begin
[11:23] <Kilos> wbb
[12:20] <Vince-0> hi!
[12:20] <Vince-0> superfly, you here?
[12:20] <Kilos> hi Vince-0
[12:23] <Vince-0> Hi Kilos
[12:23] <zerlgi> afternoon folks. am signing off now. Hope to lurk again soon.
[12:39] <Kilos> hehe
[12:40] <Cantide> zergling rushhhhhhh
[12:40] <Cantide> his nick reminds me of zergling .-.
[12:41] <Kilos> hehe
[12:57] <magespawn> afternoon all
[12:57] <Trixar_za> Afternoon magespawn
[13:01] <magespawn> i see there is a new ubuntu server book out
[13:02] <Kilos> wb magespawn
[13:02] <magespawn> hey Kilos
[13:04] <superfly> hi Vince-0
[13:04] <magespawn> did you get your idle sorted
[13:04] <magespawn> ?
[13:05] <Kilos> just helping ian quick magespawn
[13:06] <magespawn> no worries
[13:06] <Vince-0> hey!
[13:08] <Vince-0> superfly, I'm looking for someone to make a tiny device (large scale) that fetches an audio file and plays it over 3.5mm audio jack - know anyone?
[13:11] <superfly> Vince-0: not really... are you thinking of a Raspberry Pi sort of device?
[13:12] <Vince-0> kinda, current software (closed) doesn't run on arm - only thing that even comes close are the Android MK806 devices
[13:13] <Vince-0> Rasp isn't really for production environment
[13:13] <superfly> Well, I was just trying to get a clearer idea of what you meant by "device"
[13:14] <Vince-0> well its pretty open ended 'cos eventually they'd change the software
[13:15] <Vince-0> so I was looking at openbroadcaster.com AGPL license
[13:16] <Vince-0> and the scenario is mostly for a CMS for media that the remote device downloads and plays. Seems there are only _very_ expensive proprietary solutions
[13:17] <Vince-0> anyways, not many "embeded device" types in ZA
[13:17] <superfly> in all honesty, I'd just look at one of the many linux-based devices that are around
[13:18] <superfly> then write the software part in something like Python
[13:19] <Vince-0> yep, x86 linux devices aren't as cheap as the Pi. Will see what these openbroadcaster guys can do
[13:19] <Vince-0> best case would be an android client customized to run on boot
[13:20] <superfly> there are quite a few of those sorts of boards
[13:23] <magespawn> Vince-0: what sort of application would that be used for?
[13:25] <Vince-0> this company here is managing in store broadcasting for thousands of stores
[13:25] <magespawn> in store radio?
[13:25] <Vince-0> ya but with local storage, no stream
[13:25] <magespawn> ahh right
[13:25] <Vince-0> and customized per store/region/client etc
[13:26] <magespawn> thats why no stream
[13:26] <Vince-0> and most of the stores are in the bush
[13:26] <Vince-0> current software is discontinued
[13:27] <magespawn> does music stream use a lot of data?
[13:28] <Vince-0> no stream, files are usually a couple of megs worth of mp3 type format
[13:31] <magespawn> so somebody would need to change them out, stored on sd cards or such?
[13:33] <Vince-0> sdcard/internal but the current apps use DSL to fetch media from FTP each night over DSL
[13:35] <Vince-0> they got me involved to try run their windows client on a Pi - can't emulate x86 (wine) on ARM...
[13:35] <Vince-0> so now its a whole long story
[13:36] <magespawn> ouch
[13:37] <Vince-0> found some sneaky Russians who got Win3.1 on a Pi once...
[13:37] <magespawn> sounds like it would be a lot easier to find the hardware and then write the software
[13:38] <magespawn> i found a site that had managed to get windows 95 or 98 onto the n900
[13:38] <Vince-0> yoh, but not exactly production capable. I had an N900 - sweet device
[13:39] <magespawn> if i had the spare cash i would buy 4 more to play around with
[13:40] <Vince-0> haven't seen a phone with an FM transmitter elsewhere
[13:41] <magespawn> did you try the ir port as a tv remote?
[13:42] <Vince-0> nope, IR! that's something you don't see on mobiles
[13:42] <Vince-0> I did try some data transfer on it with a USB adapter on my PC
[13:42] <magespawn> there was a piece of software that had all the key mappings for various remotes and the tv that they could work with
[13:43] <Vince-0> I remember
[13:52] <magespawn> i keep thinking they would make a great in car tracking monitering onboard pc
[13:53] <magespawn> there was some guy who had developed a brain scanner that worked off the n900
[13:58] <Vince-0> on only 600mhz
[13:59] <magespawn> i would love them to build something similar using the latest hardware
[14:03] <magespawn> maybe something like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUa5Iy9uj6g
[14:11] <Vince-0> sms to toast teknologie lol
[14:44] <charl> what and it can charge your car?
[14:44] <charl> and it has an built-in induction cooking?
[14:44] <charl> ich mag
[14:45] <Vince-0> *concept
[14:45] <charl> what a 48 megapixel camera
[14:46] <charl> this is a brilliant parody
[14:47] <charl> and a nuclear power generator !
[14:47] <charl> what the
[14:53] <magespawn> now there is a phone worth $32 million
[14:57] <Vince-0> yaa
[14:58] <magespawn> later all
[14:58] <Vince-0> cya
[14:58] <Kilos> go safe magespawn
[15:38] <Kilos> whats the aptitude command to see dependancies please
[15:48] <Kilos> apt-cache showpkg
[15:48] <Kilos> that seems to work
[16:08] <Kilos> wbb
[17:32] <Kilos> oh my friday again
[17:50] <Kilos> charl: you on kubuntu?
[17:50] <Kilos> im lost
[18:31] <magespawn> hey Kilos
[18:31] <Maaz> magespawn: By the way, Kilos on freenode told me "tell magespawn on freenode. sorry battling to get ian to connect from live cd with 3g but struggling" 2 hours, 13 minutes and 33 seconds ago
[18:31] <charl> Kilos: yes
[18:32] <Kilos> my archives dont save
[18:32] <charl> archives?
[18:32] <Kilos> as in /var/cache/apt/archives/
[18:32] <charl> oh apt archives, they don't save? weird
[18:33] <Kilos> i cant find where to save downloaded packages
[18:33] <charl> can't say i've heard of that before
[18:33] <Kilos> you uncapped peeps dont worry about that
[18:33] <Kilos> grr
[18:33] <charl> hmmm, yeah i would be the wrong person to ask about something like that it seems
[18:34] <charl> i just download the latest whenever i need to install something
[18:34] <charl> apt-get takes care of it
[18:34] <Kilos> not lekker when you pay for every update/upgrade
[18:34] <charl> that sucks
[18:35] <Kilos> i dunno what ive done wrong. the kde i had on another drive didnt have the prob
[18:36] <charl> sorry but i'm not really familiar with the process of doing this
[18:36] <Kilos> np
[18:36] <Kilos> the pro or fly will know
[18:36] <Kilos> the pro will first say ai!
[18:36] <charl> cool
[18:36] <charl> lol
[18:36] <Kilos> ty
[18:36] <charl> np
[18:37] <charl> hi psychicist
[18:37] <charl> how's it going in poland
[18:37] <Kilos> hi psi
[18:38] <psychicist> hi charl
[18:38] <psychicist> hi Kilos
[18:38] <psychicist> all is going well here, charl
[18:38]  * Kilos wonders if nano would work with python programming
[18:38] <psychicist> I'm just working the boring job and doing my own stuff besides
[18:39] <psychicist> but I've decided to improve my knowledge of Java (J2EE) and to learn Oracle
[18:39] <psychicist> so all will be well in a few months and I hope to find another job then
[18:40] <charl> oracle database?
[18:40] <Kilos> keep learning
[18:40] <psychicist> yes
[18:40] <Kilos> knowledge is power
[18:40] <charl> isn't there more of a demand for mysql/postgres?
[18:41] <charl> i work with oracle database but i wish i could dump it and mysql in favour of postgres
[18:41] <psychicist> not in big enterprises I guess
[18:41] <psychicist> I know mysql
[18:41] <psychicist> it's not that I learn one in favour of another
[18:41] <charl> oh then oracle would be easy, you just have to get used to the fact that everything is much more difficult
[18:41] <psychicist> why not learn them all? :)
[18:41] <charl> yeah exactly my mentality too
[18:42] <Kilos> hey charl are you gonna join the python classes
[18:42] <charl> whatever you can do in mysql you can do in oracle by writing 3x as much sql
[18:42] <charl> Kilos: i already know python but it sounds interesting, which are these?
[18:42] <psychicist> yeah, I figured
[18:42] <charl> i might know some other people who should attend
[18:43] <charl> i don't really know oracle database well myself, i never bothered studying it properly
[18:43] <Kilos> we gonna have them in #linux-studies as soon as the other guys can get to spend an hour a week or so
[18:43] <charl> i just use it and whenver i get stuck i google
[18:43] <charl> usually you end up finding the answer on stack overflow or a similar site
[18:44] <Kilos> we going to use byteofpython
[18:45] <psychicist> my uncle is an oracle certified professional
[18:45] <Kilos> im sure superfly will nurse maid us
[18:45] <charl> Kilos: cool i will tell some people
[18:45] <charl> psychicist: i heard certified dba's can make a good living
[18:45] <magespawn> Kilos: did you get the files i shared?
[18:46] <psychicist> charl, yeah, that's one of the reasons for me to learn it
[18:46] <charl> Kilos: nurses and maids?! :)
[18:46] <charl> Kilos: you will attract the wrong type of people with that :P
[18:46] <psychicist> :D
[18:46] <Kilos> those i couldnt see names magespawn ?
[18:46] <psychicist> no, the right ones :D
[18:46] <magespawn> yes
[18:46] <charl> :D
[18:46] <Kilos> i didnt download  them no. what are they
[18:47] <Kilos> im on kde now will get them tomorrow
[18:47] <magespawn> simple python programs
[18:47] <Kilos> that do what?
[18:48] <Kilos> oh something i wanted to ask , must one start idle with sudo?
[18:48] <magespawn> showing various programming ideas
[18:48] <Kilos> i tried it again but first deleted hello world everywhere now i cant even get it working with gedit
[18:49] <magespawn> not aas far as i know
[18:49] <Kilos> must i tick each one to download or will the whole batch come
[18:49] <Kilos> had a massive job this avy trying to get nm and then sakis going by ian
[18:50] <magespawn> i think you can do a ba5ch download
[18:50] <magespawn> i see i got your message
[18:50] <Kilos> spent hours mailing him packages that he got on fone then put on stick then installed
[18:50] <Kilos> but no go
[18:51] <Kilos> he took modem and kubuntu cd to another pc and sakis worked first time
[18:51] <Kilos> some thing blocked usb access
[18:51] <magespawn> might be the pc then
[18:51] <Kilos> methinks
[18:52] <Kilos> ya but its a pc he has to fix
[18:52] <Kilos> whew
[18:52] <magespawn> do people really need dba that much?
[18:52] <Kilos> before i said go to another pc and try i first said the modem is dead
[18:52] <Kilos> hehe\
[18:58] <Kilos> night all . sleep tight
[19:04] <magespawn> charl what sort of salary are they paying?
[19:38] <magespawn> later all
[19:39] <Cantide> good night magespawn >.</


[12:43] <superm1> Seveas, , we wanted to know how to setup ubotu to post new mythtv/mythplugins bugs in #ubuntu-mythtv
[02:44] <tcarter> hello, i change to port 8001 but I still get the Fixdccexploit message. can you plz test me
[02:45] <nalioth> hmmm
[02:47] <nixternal> Georgia ey, I am picturing him saying that sentence with that deep southern drawl
[02:59] <Trae> test me please.
[02:59] <nalioth> Trae: ok.
[02:59] <Trae> nalioth, :)
[03:00] <Trae> new Dell machine, forgot to fix the 8001 on it earlier lol
[03:00] <nalioth> Trae: you're good to go, thanks for your patience  :)
[03:00] <Trae> nalioth, any time bud
[03:01] <Trae> thanks for fixing this stuff for us.
[03:01] <Trae> I still need to fix my stupid router
[03:01] <Trae> lol
[03:01] <Trae> cheers mates.
[04:31] <poningru> someone tell Burgundavia that he needs to pong me one of these days
[04:31] <Burgundavia> poningru: hmm?
[04:32] <poningru> ...
[04:32] <poningru> Burgundavia: dude cant find anything on gnome 2.19
[04:32] <poningru> atleast was trying yesterday
[04:32] <poningru> and anything worth putting in the walkthrough
[04:33] <Burgundavia> right
[04:33] <Burgundavia> live.gnome.org/RoadMap
[04:35] <poningru> Burgundavia: right that wasnt loading for me yesterday
[04:35] <poningru> seems same thing today
[04:36] <Burgundavia> gnome.org resources are being really slow right now
[04:36] <mneptok> hang on. let me check the load on window.g.o
[04:36] <Burgundavia> mneptok: does window run at the dc?
[04:36] <mneptok> RH DC in Arizona
[04:37] <Burgundavia> ahh
[04:37] <Burgundavia> didn't realize you had access to it
[04:38] <Burgundavia> excellent, good to know
[04:40] <mneptok> yup. there are DC issues the RH admins are working on.
[04:40] <Burgundavia> ok
[04:40] <Burgundavia> isn't one of the GNOME machines in the canonical DC?
[04:41] <mneptok> progress.
[04:41] <mneptok> progress.g.o that is
[04:41] <Burgundavia> and what does that run?
[04:41] <mneptok> Dapper
[04:41] <Burgundavia> which services?
[04:42] <poningru> wtf
[04:42] <mneptok> i18n stuff. some backend stuff.
[04:42] <Burgundavia> ahh
[04:42] <mneptok> poningru: wtf, wtf?
[04:50] <mneptok> poningru: http://live.gnome.org/RoadMap
[04:50] <mneptok> it's slow, but should be better.
[05:05] <Hobbsee> hi all
[05:07] <effie_jayx> lol
[05:07] <effie_jayx> Hobbsee,  hey there Hobs :D
[05:34] <mneptok> Hobbsee: sweet booty!
[05:59] <mneptok> poningru: *.gnome.org/* should be fine now
[06:08] <nalioth> is there an Ubuntu swiss channel/
[07:35] <Hobbsee> mneptok: heh
[07:51] <ubotu> cafuego called the ops in #ubuntu
[07:52] <nixternal> haha, Amaranth doesn't mess around :)
[11:00] <ubotu> cafuego called the ops in #ubuntu
[11:01] <gnomefreak> sorry Myrtti
[11:02] <Myrtti> np, it's my script that lags
[01:43] <usuario><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[01:46] <usuario><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[01:47] <usuario><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[02:09] <apokryphos> oO
[02:24] <ubotu> In #edubuntu, moquist said: !! OK, so is it acceptible to use the server upgrade even on a desktop system?
[05:38] <ubotu> hwilde called the ops in #ubuntu
[07:11] <Myrtti> may I? please?
[07:11] <Myrtti> /me itches
[07:13] <vorian> hmm?
[07:13] <Myrtti> no, nevermind
[07:51] <ubotu> Merchelo called the ops in #ubuntu-offtopic
[09:13] <ikonia> greetings to you all
[09:23] <nalioth> salutations
[09:25] <GazzaK> greetings earthlings
[09:30] <jrib> GazzaK: do you come in peace?
[09:30] <GazzaK> jrib, I'm not allowed to answer that
[09:32] <ubotu> ikonia called the ops in #ubuntu
[09:32] <ikonia> The_machine in channel being offensive
[09:33] <Seveas> saw it, he's out
[09:33] <ikonia> ta
[09:59] <popey> greetings!
[09:59] <popey> ubotu, he um... left our channel in a huff
[10:00] <popey> can we have him back please?
[10:00] <GazzaK> heheeee
[10:00] <popey> #ubuntu-uk
[10:00] <GazzaK> you lie
[10:00] <popey> penfold, shush
[10:19] <GazzaK> PriceChild, can you test angelic13 you the dcc test?
[10:19] <GazzaK> s/you/for
[10:19] <PriceChild> looks good :)
[10:19] <GazzaK> it's not a ubuntu thing
[10:20] <PriceChild> ah ok. well all is good :)
[10:20] <GazzaK> okie, thanks
[10:20] <GazzaK> what did you do?
[10:20] <PriceChild> a test :)
[10:21] <GazzaK> dodgy connection?
[10:22] <GazzaK> keeps disconnecting
[10:22] <PriceChild> ah ok :)
[10:22] <GazzaK> so I thought, erm, maybe dcc exploit
[10:22] <PriceChild> I just did the test on the new connection and that seems ok :)
[10:22] <GazzaK> any other ideas?
[10:22] <PriceChild> shout at the isp?
[10:23] <GazzaK> hehe, yeah, other irc networks are okay, it's just freenode
[10:27] <SWAT> hmmmm, there is a user here (Mark_Shuttlewort) and it's not him (obviously). I might be too strict, but what do you guys think about this?
[10:27] <GazzaK> sounds a bit naughty
[10:27] <GazzaK> is he registered?
[10:27] <SWAT> yes he is
[10:29] <SWAT> in the dutch channel I asked him to change his nick, he left the channel, then he came back stating (in dutch): I can only speak African, then he left the channel again.
[10:30] <GazzaK> it's a dutch isp anyways
[10:31] <JanC> SWAT: sabdfl doesn't speak Afrikaans, so...   ;-)
[10:34] <PriceChild> I think we've got a couple in #ubuntu...
 no ops nice
[10:51] <Seveas> @join #ubuntu-uk
[10:51] <Seveas> popey, what did you do to the poor bot?
[10:53] <Seeker`> has popey been killing bots again?
[10:55] <popey> Muhahahahahaha
[10:55] <popey> it's GazzaKs fault
[10:55] <popey> he made me do it
[10:58] <SWAT> trying to blame others, that's low
[10:59] <Seveas> SWAT, blaming GazzaK is not low
[10:59] <Seveas> it's pretty common out here
[10:59] <Seeker`> its all GazzaK's fault
[10:59] <Seveas> of course
[11:06] <GazzaK> :'(
[11:06] <GazzaK> and i was defenceless in the bath
[11:06] <GazzaK> tsk
[11:07] <PriceChild> haha


[06:33] <shirish> does anybody know how can I install gnash on icecat?
[07:57] <asac> hi
[08:31] <MechtiIde> asac, ping
[08:47] <asac> MechtiIde: hi
[08:47] <MechtiIde> hello Alexander
[08:48] <MechtiIde> do you speak German? asac
[08:49] <asac> MechtiIde: yeah, but not in this channel :) and these things are good for publ
[08:49] <asac> ic
[08:50] <asac> iirc it is https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~saivann/ who prepared the last update of sunbird locales
[08:51] <asac> he regularly pops in this channel
[08:51] <MechtiIde> My question is how can we integrate the locales in the iceowl-extension in Debian
[08:51] <asac> yes, i know :-D
[08:51] <MechtiIde> I saw that in ubuntu there is version 0.7 and in dEbian/sid 0.8
[08:51] <asac> i think the sunbird-locales package does that
[08:52] <fta> hi
[08:52] <asac> did someone upload a broken package to debian
[08:52] <asac> ?
[08:52] <fta> asac, http://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Road_Map_To_XULRunner
[08:52] <asac> hi fta
[08:52] <MechtiIde> My Intension is: many user of OpenOffice.org want something like Outlook
[08:52] <MechtiIde> And we prefer to use Thunderbird/Lightning
[08:52] <asac> MechtiIde: prefer over what?
[08:53] <MechtiIde> asac, the sunbird-locales depends on sunbird (For Debian: iceowl-locales depends on iceowl and doesn't except iceowl-extension
[08:54] <asac> hmm
[08:54] <MechtiIde> I think this must be possible also when someone use Debian
[08:55] <MechtiIde> I don't want that the Debian user must install the upstream to use the whole functionality
[08:55] <asac> MechtiIde: i agree
[08:55] <MechtiIde> I try to describe it in english. I know it is very difficult for me to describe such a complex theme
[08:56] <asac> actually i thought that that was done already
[08:56] <MechtiIde> if I look on packages.debian.org for iceowl
[08:57] <MechtiIde> I find the l10n-packages (lenny/sid) for iceowl and not for the iceowl-extension
[08:57] <asac> MechtiIde: try to ln -s<EMAIL_ADDRESS>/usr/lib/thunderbird/extensions/
[08:58] <asac> and add thunderbird with the proper versioning as  a target app to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[08:58] <MechtiIde> then I must also install iceowl beside iceowl-extension?
[08:58] <asac>  /install.rdf
[08:58] <asac> no
[08:59] <asac> first see if you can use them for iceowl-extension
[08:59] <asac> if that works we have to fix the packaging
[08:59] <asac> aka link it properly
[08:59] <asac> add proper target application
[08:59] <asac> fix Depends so it doesnt require you to install iceowl
[08:59] <MechtiIde> If I want to install  iceowl-l10n-de I must also install iceowl
[08:59] <asac> yeah for now
[08:59] <asac> try what i said above
[09:00] <MechtiIde> I'm not a developer, only a user
[09:00] <asac> then you cannot help ;)
[09:00] <asac> file a bug
[09:00] <MechtiIde> I don't understand why you have a "@" in a path
[09:00] <asac> against iceowl-locales
[09:01] <asac> and sunbird-locales
[09:01] <asac> e.g. "please support iceowl-extension"
[09:01] <asac> saivaan will probably take care
[09:01] <MechtiIde> ok I will do it
[09:01] <asac> thanks
[09:04] <MechtiIde> I saw there is already a Bugreport
[09:04] <MechtiIde> #436297
[09:06] <MechtiIde> The other extension I described was enigmail. There it is possible to use the locales from the upstream extension
[09:13] <MechtiIde> asac
[09:13] <MechtiIde> I miss my comment from yesterday to this issue
[09:14] <MechtiIde> The mail you have aswer with the hint to this channel
[09:14] <asac> MechtiIde: enigmail was discussed with others as well
[09:14] <asac> most likely we will drop locale packages completely
[09:14] <asac> and just ship translations in-package
[09:14] <asac> fta: why did you test the .head patch in hardy? hardy is not affected
[09:14] <asac> e.g. hunspell is 1.1
[09:15] <asac> anyway thanks
[09:16] <MechtiIde> How must I address the comment that it is published under the Number #436297
[09:17] <MechtiIde> or do you have the mail adress of saivaan then I can send him a copy
[09:21] <MechtiIde> asac, so what can I do to push it a bit
[09:22] <asac> MechtiIde: as a user there is not much you can do
[09:22] <asac> filing bug and prodding the folks regularly is pretty much what you can do
[09:22] <asac> which you are already doing
[09:22] <MechtiIde> My comment from yesterday I can't see in the Bug description
[09:22] <MechtiIde> so what is wrong
[09:22] <asac> the mail has to go to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[09:22] <asac> thats all
[09:23] <MechtiIde> and what must I do?
[09:23] <asac> send a mail
[09:23] <MechtiIde> to??
[09:23] <asac> include proper subject (e.g. bug title)
[09:23] <asac> the email address above
[09:23] <asac><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[09:24] <MechtiIde> that's what I did
[09:24] <fta_> asac, well, if we can use the .head branch for both a little longer, why not.
[09:25] <asac> MechtiIde: then maybe you got spam filtered ... no idea
[09:26] <asac> fta_: no idea. dont feel good about it. most likely it will be applied for 3.0.1 anyway. so its not really diverged
[09:28] <fta_> here, it doesn't hurt, there's no code change
[09:28] <asac> ill think about it
[09:29] <asac> i already uploaded .hardy 122 to hardy-proposed ... so if we resync then for final
[09:29] <asac> fta_: can you merge .head to .dev?
[09:29] <asac> please rebump time so we get a clear RELEASE commit on dev
[09:30] <asac> or release on .dev and merge that commit to .head
[09:30] <asac> let me know so i can upload xul 1.9 to intrepid :)
[09:31] <asac> i think everything is blocked on that there atm
[09:34] <asac> fta_: ah ... and please cherry pick the Breaks: commit from .hardy branch to .head
[09:35] <asac> fta_: that should be 121
[09:36] <asac> if you find any other app that needs a respin let me know. miro worked here without respinning
[09:40] <asac> liferea works too
[09:52] <asac> darn ... xul 1.9 hardy branch doesnt update on code.launchpad.net
[09:52] <asac> should be 122 not 120
[09:52] <asac> fta_: if you need it, cherry pick 121 through bzr+ssh
[09:52] <asac> i definitly pushed it
[10:12] <armin76> where's rc1!1!1! :D
[10:17] <asac> uploaded :)
  uploaded :) <= what ? where ?
[10:22] <asac> to proposed
[10:22] <asac> intrepid was technically already uploaded ;)
[10:23] <asac> fta_: wanna cherry pick the Breaks commit and merge that as RELEASE to .dev ?
[10:24] <fta2> yep
[10:24] <asac> let me know
[10:24] <asac> fta_: you can rename the last changelog as it was never build
[10:24] <asac> otherwise i have to remember to include the previous one in .changes
[10:24] <asac> :)
[10:26] <asac> fta_: according to launchpad folks the commit is also on http ... the website sync is just broken
[10:26] <asac> cherry pick 122 from .hardy
[10:27] <asac> jimmy_: cwong1: wake up ;)
[10:27] <fta2> i know, code.lp was already broken yesterday. but bazaar.lp is ok, even on ssh
[10:27] <asac> i need to release midbrowser :-P
[10:27] <asac> yep
[10:27] <asac> well ... ssh is naturally ok because that accesses the non-mirrored place
[10:37] <asac> fta_: btw, did you ever come back to the party?
[10:37] <asac> or did you go home right after dinner?
[10:43] <fta2> i've been there for a while. we went to dinner and after that we've visited the TV tower with the babies
[10:53] <asac> fta_: he? you went to dinner right when we arrived, didn't you?
[10:54] <asac> at least reed did iirc
[10:54] <fta2> i shoud have said little while, i'm not fond of that kind of places anymore
[10:55] <fta2> but i understand people like that :)
[10:56] <fta2> saturday, the weather was great, at last
[11:15] <asac> fta_: well... the band was cool
[13:06] <asac> bug #231410
[13:14] <fta2> asac, xul.head already has Breaks: epiphany-gecko (<< <IP_ADDRESS>-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>)
[13:15] <asac> fta2: yes, but 122 adds more
[13:15] <asac> just try merge -c 122
[13:16] <asac> bug 215728
[13:19] <fta2> hm, it's already merged.
[13:19] <fta2> xul.head #263 => 263: Alexander Sack 2008-05-22 * pull 'RELEASE 1.9~rc1+nobinonly-0ubuntu1 to ubuntu/intrepid' from
[13:23] <asac> fta2: its merged yes.
[13:23] <asac> fta2: the idea is that you add a new release
[13:23] <asac> ubuntu2
[13:23] <fta2> but i already have thatr
[13:24] <fta2> http://paste.ubuntu.com/14769/
[13:25] <fta2> should I just close ubuntu2 and merge into .dev ?
[13:25] <fta2> unless you have something to add
[13:26] <asac> fta2: you dont have the Breaks: ?
[13:26] <asac> from .hardy
[13:26] <asac> thats what i asked for
[13:26] <asac> thats 122 on .hardy branch
[13:26] <asac> lunch now
[13:35] <fta2> oh, from *.hardy ! I checked from *.dev
[13:45] <fta2> bug 233922
[13:51] <fta2> asac, done. xul dev and head
[13:51] <fta2> feel free to push xul.dev (124) to intrepid
[14:26] <asac> yup
[14:28] <asac> fta2: you dropped the breaks changelog changes?
[14:28] <asac> wanna readd them in rc1?
[14:28] <asac>   * 1.9b5 to 1.9rc1 upgrade Breaks: epiphany-gecko (<< <IP_ADDRESS>-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>)
[14:28] <asac>     - update debian/control
[14:28] <asac> thats the line i added it too on .hardy
[14:29] <fta2> did i ? i don't think so. epiphany-gecko is in rc1 ubuntu1, yelp and the rest in ubuntu2
[14:30] <asac> ok
[14:30] <asac> keep the credits :-P
[14:30] <asac> jk
[14:30] <fta2> oh, sorry, i mentioned cherry pick
[14:31] <fta2> for once i used dch
[14:31] <asac> yeah ... one can still give credits in cherry pick changelog entries ;)
[14:31] <asac> i dont mind though
[14:32] <asac> building
[14:35] <asac> ok uploaded
[14:40] <asac> fta2: is bug 209607 reproducible for you?
[14:45] <asac> Bug 223357
[14:46] <asac> bug 220504
[15:04] <asac> fta2: do we have the right cairo hardy-proposed?
[15:12] <armin76> bumb cairo!
[15:16] <asac> armin76: you obviously have too much time ... wait
[15:16] <asac> you are using gentoo :-P
[15:27] <fta2> i've merged cairo 2 weeks ago for intrepid, without the band-aid
[15:28] <fta2> but i need to work a bit more to fix ftbfs for some arches
[15:28] <asac> ok
[15:28] <fta2> why do you want cairo hardy-proposed? 1.6.0 is not good enough ?
[15:28] <asac> i talked about hardy though
[15:28] <asac> fta2: we should use the version mozilla ships for final
[15:28] <asac> otherwise we will see rendering bugs that upstream doesnt see
[15:29] <asac> at least we should look what bugs were fixed since 1.6.0
[15:29] <fta2> changes are minimal
[15:30] <asac> yeah. we should review them to be sure
[15:31] <asac> bug #215016
[15:47] <armin76> fails on hppa :P
[15:47] <fta2> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/14717619/buildlog_ubuntu-intrepid-hppa.xulrunner-1.9_1.9~rc1%2Bnobinonly-0ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[15:48] <fta2> armin76, do you have a fix ?
[15:48]  * armin76 blames asac
[15:48] <armin76> nope
[15:48] <asac> fta2: look at mikes package
[15:48] <asac> he might have a patch
[15:48] <asac> though not in a patch system
[15:48] <armin76> its the same error as always, warnings being treated as errors :)
[15:49] <asac> but most you can probably diff the appropriate hppa xpcom files
[15:49] <asac> armin76: yeah right
[15:49] <asac> but why is that only on hppa? is that 64 bit?
[15:50] <armin76> because hppa is picky like sparc
[15:50] <armin76> sparc will fail on the same way
[15:50] <asac> good
[15:50] <asac> well if its an alignment issue its good to fail i'd say
[15:51] <armin76> gimme a patch and i'll test, i have no clue how to fix that :P
[15:57] <asac>   // The internal storage
[15:57] <asac>   char mAutoBuf[sizeof(Impl) + (kAutoBufSize - 1) * sizeof(void*)];
[15:57] <asac> i dont understand why this is calced that way
[16:02] <armin76> hrm...
[16:03] <armin76> it could be related that you're using -Os?
[16:03] <armin76> because i wasn't able to reproduce it, but i'll try again
[16:03] <fta2> http://www.ubuntugeek.com/how-to-install-firefox-3-rc1-in-ubuntu-hardy.html
[16:04] <armin76> woot, sparc compiled :D
[16:10] <asac> fta2: does he patch our package?
[16:11] <asac> fta2: If so we have to ask him to remove his packages immediately. He is certainly not allowed to distribute that with official marks
[16:12] <fta2> no, he just explains how to add my ppa to sources.list
[16:13] <asac> thats not good either
[16:13] <asac> he tells them to add the ~adnarim thing
[16:14] <fta2> hm, i guess adnarim has nothing to do with that, it seems to me it's there for other purposes (unrelated to the post)
[16:14] <fta2> yep: https://edge.launchpad.net/~adnarim/+archive
[16:15] <asac> still he appears to trick the users to use that archive
[16:24] <fta2> done
[16:27] <asac> huh?
[16:28] <asac> whats done?
[16:28] <armin76> bumbed!
[16:28] <fta2> i've asked that guy to either hide/blur adnarim or to redo the screenshots
[16:29] <asac> fta2: he should use ~mozillateam for this release
[16:29] <asac> otherwise people will ride the lighning
[16:29] <asac> i posted that in comments too ... but awaits moderation
[16:29] <armin76> why ppl don't upgrade to gutsy
[16:29] <armin76> ?
[16:29] <fta2> oh, ok, i don't mind
[16:30] <asac> armin76: no idea ... feisty is like fawn
[17:19] <fta2> armin76, upgrade to gutsy ? you mean downgrade ? or what?
[17:29] <fta2> asac, are you sure your yelp << 2.22.1-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS> is correct ??? intrepid has 2.22.1-0ubuntu2.. you should have used 2.22.1-0ubuntu2~8.04.1
[17:30] <fta2> hardy-* should always be lower than intrepid
[17:31] <asac> fta2: no intrepid has ubuntu3 now
[17:31] <asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+source/yelp/2.22.1-0ubuntu3
[17:32] <asac> last hardy upload was ubuntu2
[17:32] <asac> <IP_ADDRESS> is the correct SRU version
[17:32] <fta2> hm
[17:32] <asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/yelp/
[17:33] <fta2> ok
[17:33] <armin76> fta2: guess i meant upgrade to hardy :P
[21:02] <sebner> fta: I now also have a testcase :)
[21:02] <fta> sebner, ok
[21:02] <sebner> fta: http://-kol.deviantart.com/
[21:04] <fta> hm, apparently, the dns seems to accept that, while according to RFC 2396, it does not seems to be valid
[21:04] <sebner> fta: a user found this issue and asked me to ask one of you (seems to occur with every browser on linux but he said it's fixable in the /etc/hosts)
[21:05] <sebner> fta: but he told me it's working on windows and mac with the broswers
[21:06] <fta> even with firefox (win and mac) ?
[21:07] <sebner> fta: he told me, yes. So it seems its not a bug in firefox but an issue with linux
[21:08] <fta> i can see firefox doing the dns lookup, it's just fine
[21:09] <sebner> fta: I will ask him what he has done in the /etc/hosts to fix this
[21:16] <sebner> fta: RC1 is pretty fast. nice job =)
[21:17] <fta> well, it's mostly upstream work :)
[21:17] <sebner> fta: sure but the packaging is apparently not that easy ;)
[21:17] <fta> indeed
[21:18] <sebner> asac: also congratz to you :)
[21:20] <fta> i can't find a related bug in bugzilla for this http://-foo
[21:20] <sebner> fta: as I said. may be a linux issue
[21:22] <fta> even so, upstream doesn't seem to be aware of it
[21:24] <fta> sebner, do we have a bug on lp for that ? if not, could you please file one ?
[21:25] <sebner> fta: I could but I'm not really sure if this is a real bug, maybe it's a security feature on linux. dunno
[21:25] <fta> i don't think so. try: host -a -- -kol.deviantart.com
[21:26] <fta> in a shell
[21:27] <sebner> fta: hmm. then it's the question if this URL is valid
[21:28] <Jazzva> fta: Remember that assembler assignment I had for school? I had been doing it for the most part of the last week and it's done. Now I did some beautification of code, although it's not so pretty yet. But it's working well :)...
[21:28] <Jazzva> (now i finished last code checking and preparing the report on it for tomorrow)
[21:29] <fta> sebner, URI are defined in RFC 2396
[21:29] <fta> Jazzva, i read your blog :)
[21:29] <sebner> fta: so?
[21:29] <Jazzva> fta: You do? Didn't know that :)...
[21:30] <fta> Jazzva, yes, read your post about that, excellent
[21:31] <fta> sebner, quick read yesterday, i was convinced it's invalid
[21:31] <sebner> but?
[21:31] <Jazzva> fta: Thanks :)... I suppose I'll get maximum points on it. I don't think I missed something. Ok, back to report :)
[21:36] <fta> sebner, http://paste.ubuntu.com/14888/
[21:36] <fta> sebner, i've pointed 2 lines
[21:37] <fta> 34 and 35
[21:37] <sebner> so it's allowed
[21:37] <fta> no, it has to start with alpha or alphanum
[21:38] <fta> and end to
[21:38] <fta> the "-" is not allowed in 1st or last positions
[21:38] <sebner> ok
[21:38] <sebner> then it's not a bug
[21:39] <fta> I'd say DNS permits it, URI doesn't
[21:39] <fta> but that's just my interpretation
[21:42] <sebner> fta: so linux(/etc/hosts) is so strict and windows/mac not?
[21:42] <Volans> Hi all :)
[21:44] <fta>  /etc/hosts is used by the resolver, hence it's DNS rules. browser are parsing URIs, then they do a DNS lookup. here, it seems ff is doing the "-foo" lookup and it receives the correct answer, then it displays an error. Have to look at the code
[21:45] <sebner> fta: but I was told that it occurs on every browser on linux and fixable through /etc/hosts
[21:47] <fta> i'd be curious to know how. if it's just -foo => foo then http://foo, it only works without virtual hosts
[21:47] <sebner> fta: I'll tell you tomorrow but this solution seems to be the only one
[21:49] <fta> ok
[21:49] <fta> i just don't understand why someone would want a hostname like that but well, why not.
[21:50] <sebner> fta: dunno ^^ but it's working on windows so maybe people expect it to work also on linux but now is the question if we want that
[21:55] <fta> hm, annex B doesn't match annex A
[21:55] <fta> fta@ix:~ $ perl -e '$_ = "http://-kol.deviantart.com/"; m,^(([^:/?#]+):)?(//([^/?#]*))?([^?#]*)(\?([^#]*))?(#(.*))?,; print $4."\n";'
[21:55] <fta> -kol.deviantart.com
[21:55] <fta> that RFC is bogus ;)
[21:56] <sebner> fta: Sry I'm a total n00b in these things. what does this mean?
[21:58] <fta> the BNF (grammar) wants the hostname part of the URI to both start and end with an alphanum, while the regexp in annex B allows it to contain anything anywhere except '/', '?' and '#'
[21:59] <fta> most likely the regexp is wrong (ie too simple)
[21:59] <fta> i'm referring to http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc2396.html
[22:00] <sebner> fta: ah, k. so no bug =)
[22:01] <fta> asac, what do you think of this ? ^^
[22:01] <sebner> fta: we should inform microsoft and apple :P
[22:29] <fta> mozilla bug 355181
[22:30] <sebner> fta: ahhh!! so what does this mean? ^^
[22:31] <fta> donno yet, reading code
[22:34] <sebner> fta: I mean the bug report. It's about this issue
[22:35] <fta> yes, the code is doing something like the regexp above, ie just looking at allowed chars, no particular order
[22:36] <sebner> fta: how similar is the firefox linux code compared to the firefox windows code?
[22:36] <fta> that part should be almost identical, if not entirely
[22:37] <sebner> I still don't understand why it's working on windows then
[22:48] <fta> seems we end up there: http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla/source/docshell/base/nsWebShell.cpp#1179
[22:51] <sebner> fta: DisplayError. ok. but why not on win?
[22:52] <fta> i don't know, yet
[22:52] <fta> it's late, i'll investigate later
[22:55] <sebner> fta: thanks for your interest =)
[23:04] <Volans> night :)
[23:15] <sebner> gn8 folks