[00:32] <rick_h_> sweet, Foord seems cool with the interview, pubbing it mightily.
[00:50] <rick_h_> snap-l: we've passed more s3 bandwith than all of last month, with 10 days still to go :)
[00:54] <rick_h_> DBO: email on the way for google doc, and snap-l it's up there
[00:58] <snap-l> rick_h_: That is awesome!
[00:59] <rick_h_> I need to get that script up for the traffic on that from s3
[00:59] <rick_h_> ugh
[00:59] <rick_h_> maybe just pay the guy with the solution, just hate giving out the aws key
[01:01] <snap-l> wow, 80 visits on one day
[01:16] <snap-l> If you haven't checked out the Mastodon LIve at the Aragon DVD / CD combo, you're seriously missing out
[11:52] <tjagoda> Ahoy
[11:54] <wolfger> morning
[11:56] <rick_h_> party
[11:56] <wolfger> rick_h_ and snap-l: a bit of (not-very-)constructive criticism... the Pycon wrapup podcast? Worst sound levels, ever. If I turn the volume up enough to hear rick_h_ I get my eardrums blasted by the loudest guy at the table. If I turn it down to where I can listen without pain, I can't hear anything rick_h_ says.
[11:57] <rick_h_> wolfger: yea, I think I apologize for it in the post
[11:57] <rick_h_> it was a mess
[11:57] <rick_h_> we had a big room, peopel kept turning around talking behind them, etc
[11:57] <rick_h_> I tried to keep adjusting the levels to keep up
[11:57] <rick_h_> very sorry, lessons learned, won't happen again
[11:58] <wolfger> Sure, I understand it's a logistical nightmare. :-)
[11:58] <rick_h_> it gits a bit better once you get into it
[11:58] <rick_h_> but even still :/
[11:58] <rick_h_> but it was considered good material we wanted to still put out
[11:58] <wolfger> Oh, I finished it on my ride in.
[11:58] <rick_h_> and no chance to rerecord it
[11:58] <wolfger> and I'm sure road noise played a factor in my displeasure
[11:58] <rick_h_> heh, well I take 100% responsibility
[11:59] <rick_h_> I didn't do a good job forcing people to talk into the mics
[11:59] <rick_h_> and I played with levels on the hardware too much to compensate which just made it worse
[11:59] <rick_h_> unfortunately it was my second run with the new gear
[12:00] <rick_h_> and been a lot of learning on my end
[12:02] <rick_h_> love this: http://twitter.com/#!/voidspace/status/50011778788245504
[12:03] <wolfger> Anybody see the O'Reilly disaster relief sale today? http://post.oreilly.com/form/oreilly/viewhtml/9z1zga584ka0cs8c3j3seujd5hvqramv99us79d73h0?utm_content=em-orm-books-videos-ddjpn-elists&utm_campaign=Books+Videos&utm_source=iPost&utm_medium=email&imm_mid=06c4a7&cmp=em-orm-books-videos-ddjpn-elists
[12:06] <wolfger> Thinking about picking up a book or two. Javascript: The Good Parts sounds useful. Learning Android sounds like something I'll set on my bookshelf and plan to read someday.
[12:06] <rick_h_> yea, grabbing the hadoop book now actually
[12:06] <rick_h_> JS the good parts is one of the best 2/3 JS books out there
[12:07] <rick_h_> thought about learning android, but don't know when I'll get to it
[12:07] <wolfger> The Book of Audacity for you podcasters. :-)
[12:07] <rick_h_> already have a couple of books in line on the kindle
[12:07] <rick_h_> that's snap-l's job :P
[12:07] <wolfger> rick_h_: exactly!
[12:07] <wolfger> I've had Android Dev Meetup on my calendar for months now. Never make it.
[12:08] <rick_h_> booooo
[12:08] <rick_h_> you make that lug meeting you were talking about?
[12:08] <wolfger> Yes, I did. Same evening as the meetup
[12:09] <rick_h_> cool
[12:09] <wolfger> but now I have a string of poker tournies on Thursday nights
[12:09] <wolfger> so no more Thursday meetings for the next.... 3 weeks? Something like that
[12:10] <wolfger> Did really well last Thursday. Had a good shot at some serious cash
[12:10] <wolfger> instead, walked away with a buck-oh-five
[12:10] <wolfger> :-p
[12:10] <wolfger> but... I got paid to have fun. Can't beat that.
[12:12] <wolfger> would've gone to CHC-AA Monday, but I wasn't in Dundee for a change :-p
[12:13] <wolfger>  your comments on one of those podcasts I listened to this morning rekindled my interest in a project I planned out some months ago
[12:13] <wolfger> Basically, a specialized Twitter client to turn a hashtag into an impromptu IRC channel
[12:15] <wolfger> Some folks I know have a Twitter #wineparty every Friday, and it's so hard to keep up with that using any standard Twitter client, that I started making plans to do this.
[12:15] <rick_h_> http://thechangelog.com/post/4005924669/earthquake-twitter-client-on-terminal-with-streaming-api
[12:15] <rick_h_> I've got that in my list of things to check out
[12:15] <rick_h_> might be part of that
[12:15] <wolfger> and your whine about Twitter replacing IRC as the backchannel told me, "hey, there's probably a number of geeks who would dig this"
[12:16] <wolfger> I'll check that out
[12:17] <wolfger> but I was thinking of doing an xchat style interface, complete with "user list" based on how recently somebody's used the hashtag (virtually entering/leaving the channel)
[12:17] <wolfger> and set up "private channels" when you get @'d without the hashtag
[12:21] <tjagoda> http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2011/03/blackberry-playbook-launching-april-19-pre-orders-start-at-499-for-16gb.ars
[12:21] <tjagoda> Squeeeee
[12:22] <brousch> a blackberry fanboy?
[12:22] <rick_h_> uh oh, let's not go through this again
[12:22] <brousch> that's like an excel fanboy
[12:22] <rick_h_> read yesterday's morning if you're interested :)
[12:23] <tjagoda> I do use excel to great extent here
[12:23] <tjagoda> =p
[12:23] <brousch> at least you're consistent
[12:23] <tjagoda> I like the comments on that article
[12:23] <tjagoda> "I have a blackberry for work and it's fine as far a business  applications go.  I also like the fact that it is secure enough that  certain governments are a bit jaded by that fact they can't crack my  email. "
[12:25] <brousch> greg-g: wtf is this brownie recipe? hav you actually eaten that?
[12:26] <tjagoda> Brownies?
[12:26] <tjagoda> Wuh?
[12:26] <brousch> on his buzz feed
[12:26] <tjagoda> link?
[12:27] <wolfger> brownies... buzz... :-)
[12:28] <brousch> i lied, it's on his google reader shares
[12:29] <brousch> http://paridy.blogspot.com/2011/03/meal-in-brownie-and-chia-pudding.html
[12:29] <tjagoda> holy christ
[12:29] <tjagoda> that cant be a real brownie
[12:32] <brousch> it frightens and confuses me
[12:49] <snap-l> Good morning
[12:49] <snap-l> wolfger: Sorry for your tender ears
[12:49] <snap-l> The levels were the best that I could do. :)
[12:52] <snap-l> Also, I <3 O'Reilly
[12:52] <snap-l> (the book publisher, not the pundit)
[12:54] <tjagoda> Whyfor?
[13:00] <snap-l> Their sales, and overall plesant experience downloading books from them
[13:00] <snap-l> and that they are donating to Japan
[13:04] <rick_h_> man I hate this code base
[13:04] <snap-l> Which one now?
[13:04] <rick_h_> the original one done by the .net guys
[13:05] <rick_h_> with the C style for loops and db table/columns like HotAlert.HotAlertID
[13:05] <rick_h_> or HotAlert_Status.HotAlert_StatusID
[13:05] <rick_h_> as the pk
[13:05] <brousch> what should it be?
[13:05] <rick_h_> hotalert_status.id
[13:06] <rick_h_> or better yet, status.id
[13:06]  * snap-l quietly thanks brousch, because he didn't see the problem either
[13:06] <rick_h_> ?! Try typing it a ton of times, you'll think about it
[13:06] <brousch> why type when the tools type it for you?
[13:06] <snap-l> rick_h_: That's what autocompleting IDEs are for. ;)
[13:07] <rick_h_> bah, you guys are helpless :P
[13:07] <snap-l> hopeless
[13:07] <snap-l> not helpless
[13:07] <rick_h_> that too
[13:07] <rick_h_> ide completion == helpless, don't think about things like that when you don't have to type it out
[13:07] <rick_h_> makes my eyes bleed
[13:07] <snap-l> Though I'll agree that repeating the name over and over and over is pretty dumb
[13:07] <rick_h_> I mean really, wtf do you need case in table column names for?
[13:08] <snap-l> BecauseTheLastLanguageYouLookedAtWasJava?
[13:08] <rick_h_> "well mysql is case insensitive so I didn't think it mattered"
[13:08] <rick_h_> except when you go to any other db backend...we're supposed to be using an ORM
[13:08] <rick_h_> ugh
[13:08] <rick_h_> anyway, back to work, just had to rant for a second, slowly morphing the code base around
[13:09] <snap-l> Well, and God help you when you hit a database that does care about case sensitive columns
[13:09] <rick_h_> finally have declarative ORM models, but all the queries are still by hand
[13:09] <snap-l> though I'm not sure if PostgreSQL cares
[13:09] <rick_h_> I think it does
[13:09] <jrwren> learning android?  as in Java??? ugh, I feel for your.
[13:09] <jrwren> err, feel bad for you
[13:09] <rick_h_> thankfully SA loves me
[13:09] <rick_h_> next step is to remap the ORM objects names to lower/sensible names
[13:10] <rick_h_> and map to the ugly column names
[13:10] <snap-l> PostgreSQL didn't care in the test select that I did.
[13:10] <rick_h_> and I can slowly remove them from my eyeballs
[13:10] <snap-l> at least, 8.4.7 didn't care.
[13:12] <rick_h_> man I love python
[13:12] <jrwren> just give me regular brownies please.
[13:12] <jrwren> there is already lots of sugar in those bean and squash brownies, I'd rather just have the extra sugar fat and wheat version
[13:13] <jrwren> and yes, I'm sure that is a real brownie, having cookied a lot with all of those ingredients the proportions and textures add up to something that isn't bad.
[13:13] <jrwren> just think of it like a brownie flavored bean pie
[13:13] <jrwren> and if you have not eaten bean pie, then you are lame :p
[13:14] <jrwren> what is wrong with  HotAlert_Status.HotAlert_StatusID ?  I mean sure, just .ID would suffice, but come on, if htat is all you have to bitch about, count your blessings.
[13:14] <rick_h_> hah
[13:14] <rick_h_> sorry, when it's one of a dozen tables/each with 10+ fields all done that way
[13:15] <rick_h_> it's a bit much
[13:15] <rick_h_> you don't need to prefix every column with the table name
[13:15] <jrwren> snap-l++ even vim will autocomplete that shit for you. hit ctrl-n
[13:15] <rick_h_> it's in the table name
[13:15] <rick_h_> it's still ugly as hell, less readble, and harder to keep line lengths in order
[13:16] <jrwren> sounds like you need to man up.
[13:16] <rick_h_> :)
[13:16] <rick_h_> it's my job, I'm supposed to be fixing/exampling how to write this crap better
[13:16] <jrwren> CamelCaseIsPrettyNormalTheseDays_Although_IWill_Admit_Mixing_TheUnderScoreDelimiterRAndomlyIsVeryWeird
[13:16] <jrwren> SoundsLikeYouAreFocusingOnThingsThatDon'tMatter
[13:17] <rick_h_> pep8
[13:17] <rick_h_> meh, whatever
[13:17] <jrwren> is it a python code base?
[13:17] <rick_h_> standards win
[13:17] <rick_h_> yea
[13:17] <jrwren> what does your database design and naming convention have to do with python and pep8 ?
[13:17] <jrwren> C style for loops in your python code?
[13:17] <rick_h_> because it turns into ORM model/attrib names
[13:17] <rick_h_> yea
[13:17] <jrwren> ok, now I understand your gripe.
[13:17] <jrwren> please continue.
[13:18] <rick_h_> sorry, not for, if
[13:18] <rick_h_> if x == 1 or x == 2 or x == 3
[13:18] <jrwren> what is C-sytle if?
[13:18] <rick_h_> if x in [1,2,3]
[13:18] <jrwren> hehehe, just proof someone didn't know python.
[13:18] <rick_h_> right
[13:18] <rick_h_> thus my refactoring, teaching
[13:18] <jrwren> even still on the database front, your ORM should let you map the model/attrib names, if you can't, get a new ORM.
[13:18] <rick_h_> and I get to come here and gripe
[13:19] <rick_h_> jrwren: yea, I'm doing that now, which is why I <3 Sqlalchemy
[13:19] <rick_h_> but the code is still using old names
[13:19] <rick_h_> so it's not a one step rename
[13:19] <rick_h_> and there are many manually constructed queries
[13:19] <jrwren> awesome.
[13:19] <rick_h_> anyway, too much time on this, didn't mean to create an hour long disucssion
[13:19] <rick_h_> just mornnig cranky gripes...ugh hate this codebase
[13:20] <jrwren> i understand the problems now. Sounds pretty typical.
[13:20] <jrwren> I deal with that kind of crap all day long in C#.
[13:20] <rick_h_> but I have to do it, clean it as I go
[13:20] <rick_h_> get new features released tomorrow
[13:20] <rick_h_> oh yea, everywhere has those codebases that were new, done by the new guy, etc
[13:21] <jrwren> yup.
[13:21] <jrwren> or old guy that was new to the language.
[13:21] <jrwren> my huge gripe is people misunderstanding books.
[13:22] <jrwren> you don't need to apply every patter from the gang of four.
[13:22] <rick_h_> well, they don't get past chapter 4 of the books
[13:22] <rick_h_> heh, we don't get any patterns
[13:22] <rick_h_> guys here more likely to treat python as php straight one page script
[13:22] <jrwren> EWE
[13:22] <jrwren> figures.
[13:22] <rick_h_> I've got a meeting this afternoon to try to convince peopel to do more objects using those magic methods we talked about yesterday
[13:22] <jrwren> that actually makes some sense. python seems to be a popular next leap language from php
[13:22] <rick_h_> making custom iterable objects/etc
[13:23] <rick_h_> well, they come from C/C# background, thus the c-like if
[13:23] <rick_h_> but python lets you do whatever
[13:23] <jrwren> what py webframework are they uysing?
[13:23] <rick_h_> since you can write a straight up/down shell script with it without ever calling a method
[13:23] <rick_h_> pylons
[13:23] <rick_h_> but still, they put app config in cotrollers/appconfig.py
[13:23] <jrwren> C and C# have about as much in common as PHP and Python... so if their background is really strong in both C and C#, then they are pretty versatile.
[13:23] <rick_h_> they import into templates because they can
[13:23] <jrwren> hrm.
[13:24] <rick_h_> and reusable isnt the name of the game
[13:24] <jrwren> I don't know pylon well enough I guess.
[13:24] <rick_h_> copy/pasted crap all over
[13:24] <jrwren> ewe.
[13:24] <jrwren> gross.
[13:24] <rick_h_> meh, not much to know
[13:24] <jrwren> that is bad no matter what the lang/platform
[13:24] <rick_h_> it gives you a directory structure to put your stuff in
[13:24] <brousch> so strict django-like templates would help keep your people in line?
[13:24] <rick_h_> yea, exactly
[13:24] <rick_h_> but so easy in python to copy/paste
[13:24] <jrwren> its easy in any lang, you stil don't do it.
[13:24] <rick_h_> no, tempaltes are more flexible, which is awesome when you need it
[13:24] <rick_h_> but yea, gun, bullet have fun
[13:27] <snap-l> New Open Metalcast is up. http://openmetalcast.com/2011/03/22/open-metalcast-episode-17-with-a-little-help-from-my-friends/
[13:27] <rick_h_> yay
[13:27] <brousch> pygame on android? i don't suppose anyone has tried this http://pygame.renpy.org/
[13:28] <snap-l> There's a branch of pygame that someone is working on for Android
[13:28] <snap-l> (subset, rather)
[13:28] <binbrain> rick_h_ you have to have a meeting to convince people to programmer in Python like Python programmers?
[13:29] <binbrain> my last place was like that
[13:29] <binbrain> getters and setters, crap like that
 getters and setters that is
[13:29] <jrwren> i can't wait until ruby gets to this point.
[13:29] <jrwren> 8then people will STFU about how great ruby is, and realize that any lang is great when its in great hands.
[13:30] <snap-l> Hasn't it already gotten to that point?
[13:30] <snap-l> or am I misremembering
[13:30] <rick_h_> binbrain: it's slow. We don't tend to work on the same projects at the same time
[13:30] <rick_h_> don't do code reviews
[13:30] <rick_h_> and meetings are rare/far between where I can show stuff like this
[13:31] <rick_h_> so it's more a personal, "hey, I changed xxx in your project, isn't that cool" type of things
[13:31] <binbrain> we have a small shop, and we actually do code reviews, this would be my 1st job that actually put the effort in
[13:31] <binbrain> only 4 python folks, and before a release, everybody has to go through and validate other peoples code
[13:31] <binbrain> 1st for me
[13:31] <binbrain> validate the code and the test
[13:32] <jrwren> code reviews are overrated.
[13:32] <rick_h_> yea, and here I'm just finally getting us to do feature branches on our own
[13:32] <rick_h_> and work on pulling them together pre-release bit by bit
[13:32] <jrwren> shared code ownership can be just as effective.
[13:32] <snap-l> jrwren: Depends on the shop
[13:33] <binbrain> jrwren I don't have a problem with them, takes a few days, and we've caught things with them
[13:33] <jrwren> right, and I wouldn't want to work in a shop were code reviews were rated highly
[13:33] <rick_h_> jrwren: yea, but a code review would give me a place to give constructive notes like the if statements "did you know you could write it like xxx"
[13:33] <jrwren> rick_h_: patch it and make those be the commit notes and then make sure everyone reads the commit log.
[13:33] <rick_h_> yea, but they don't :P
[13:34] <jrwren> if you can't justify it in the commit notes, then you are just being a zealot about subjective opinion
[13:34] <binbrain> like, you changed xyz, did you consider abc over here though? and crap like that
[13:34] <rick_h_> I send out emails/notes/links to articles all the time
[13:34] <jrwren> the focus on reading the commit log :)
[13:34] <rick_h_> mark as read, delete
[13:34] <tjagoda> http://cdn.theatlantic.com/static/infocus/libya0309/s_l21_RTR2JKJ9.jpg
[13:34] <rick_h_> oh, I can commit all day, doesn't mean they read the logs
[13:34] <tjagoda> That is one bad ass Libyan.
[13:34] <jrwren> so people aren't interested in doing a better job? that is a shame. you can't improve teams that don't want to improve.
[13:35] <rick_h_> well, they have the attitude of "I'm so busy, I'll look at that when I have time"
[13:35] <rick_h_> but don't realize that some of the improvements save them time
[13:35] <rick_h_> a change comes in and needs to go through 10 copy/pasted places == longer than extract class/method and update
[13:35] <rick_h_> and if they don't know the python tricks to make life easier, I need a chance to show/teach
[13:35] <jrwren> right.
[13:36] <rick_h_> "oh look, you can just pass that validator method in, and call it there...don't need to copy/paste the validator code"
[13:36] <jrwren> if they acknoledge that doing the same thing in 10 places is bad, then you at least have a place to start.
[13:36] <rick_h_> right
[13:36] <jrwren> if htey think that its supposed to be that way, then you are wasting your time.
[13:36] <binbrain> I'd say a large percentage of programmers just want to get the job over with and collect a paycheck
[13:37] <rick_h_> binbrain: ++
[13:37] <jrwren> have you ever met any of them?
[13:37] <binbrain> huh, all the time
[13:37] <jrwren> I haven't. I've only met people who want to do a better job.
[13:37] <binbrain> interesting
[13:37] <jrwren> I've met lots of devs that honestly don't know any better.
[13:37] <rick_h_> I've met people that build a lot of false blockers as to why they can't do better
[13:38] <rick_h_> don't have time is the biggest thing
[13:39] <binbrain> its easy to find people who want to do a better job, you find them at meetups usually
[13:39] <binbrain> you find them at coffee house coders ;)
[13:39] <jrwren> I'm talking about going into clients.
[13:40] <jrwren> But yes, the meetups, user groups, and conferenes are an echo chamber of people who want to do better and know where to look to do better.
[13:40] <jrwren> right, its thoe false blockers that are the problem.
[13:41] <jrwren> I think everyone wants to do better, there are just a lot of misguided people out there about how to do better.
[13:41] <rick_h_> right, but CHC is 6-10 people, how many devs are in the area?
[13:42] <binbrain> jrwren, I think your glass might be slightly half full on that one, but its not a black and white issue anyways, takes all kinds
[13:42] <jrwren> oh sure.
[13:43] <jrwren> but if you ask anyone in any profession if they want to do a good job, very rarely will you get the answer "no"
[13:45] <binbrain> just like when you ask most people how things are and they tell you just fine even though their car just died
[13:46] <binbrain> ;)
[13:46] <jrwren> holy shit, my tweet is getting replies. *sigh* I was just throwing away a tweet.
[13:47] <rick_h_> lol
[13:47] <jrwren> that is two very different things, although both lead to volumes on human psycology
[13:47] <binbrain> time for coffee and a meeting
[14:20] <brousch> it's kind of creepy to run across rick_h_ in random places on the internet http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5155135/how-to-organize-a-python-project
[14:20] <rick_h_> I'm everywhere!
[14:20] <rick_h_> boo, no votes for my answer
[14:20] <rick_h_> what a crock :P
[14:21] <rick_h_> oh crap, and top answer has a import *
[14:21]  * rick_h_ facepalms
[14:21] <_stink_> record a rant!
[14:21] <_stink_> there is no shortage of topics. :)
[14:21] <brousch> i was especially surprised to see you there since the question was originally about pydev
[14:22] <rick_h_> lol
[14:23] <rick_h_> well, it was organizing your own packages, and modern-package-template helps with a lot of that
[14:29] <brousch> what is paster? i can find docs on PAste, but that's web stuff
[14:34] <brousch> nvm, finally found it
[14:36] <jrwren> I'l go vote you up and down vote that :)
[14:38] <jrwren> well, no i won't. I think that is a better answer
[14:38] <jrwren> but I'll up vote ya anyway :)
[14:45] <rick_h_> lol, thanks
[14:49] <greg-g> brousch: yeah, it is effing good too! (the brownies)
[14:50] <snap-l> Yay, I've got a file cabinet that will be delivered tomorrow
[14:50] <greg-g> and to the rest of you: yes, it is a great effing brownie. I had a coworker blind taste it and they loved it, then I told them what was in it (hence that comment on the post)
[15:38] <snap-l> Ordered a bike rack for our bikes
[15:38] <snap-l> Looking to do some riding this year. Didn't get much of a chance last year.
[15:39] <rick_h_> cool, I've got a goal of getting a new one with a kid friendly ride of some sort
[15:41] <snap-l> Yeah, I want to take our bikes to get them checked out
[15:44] <greg-g> yay!
[16:03] <jrwren> whoa... so with js-ctypes I could call open from JS and get a fstream!?!?
[16:03] <jrwren> err get a file descriptor rather?
[16:18] <snap-l> I want to know why Jono Bacon's Art of Community ePub makes my ereader go for a toss
[16:19] <greg-g> go for a toss? Did it also implant British English in your head?
[16:19] <rick_h_> read it fine on mine :P
[16:20] <rick_h_> lol
[16:20] <rick_h_> maybe he just means he's reading it "your community has gone for a toss"
[16:20] <snap-l> blame working with some Indian co-workers. :)
[16:21] <rick_h_> so how does one go for a toss?  Start->Run->Fonts (to open the windows font dir) Then in the file menu click "install new font.."  its a windows 3.1 dialog!
[16:27]  * rick_h_ looks around our complete XP corporate environment...ummm
[16:28] <jrwren> I know there are XP folks in here.
[16:28] <greg-g> that's what a lot of the computers at the library are still running
[16:28] <snap-l> jrwren: Yep, there's a lot of Win3.1isms still in XP
[16:28] <greg-g> all new machiens are Win7, they did skip vista
[16:28] <snap-l> I just tried it, and yes it's uuuuuugly
[16:29] <snap-l> I never liked the Win3.1 dialog box for files.
[16:29] <rick_h_> yea, we're supposed to be rolling out new desktops with win7 this year
[16:29] <rick_h_> but let's just say it's towards the end of march and not seen any yet
[16:29] <rick_h_> and I don't think win7 plays nice with our old novell ldap box
[16:30] <snap-l> At the risk of getting jrwren to correct me, I don't think moving from XP to Win 7 is terribly easy.
[16:31] <DBO> it is if you upgrade the apple way
[16:31] <snap-l> DBO: Ala new desktop machines?
[16:31] <DBO> yeps
[16:33] <rick_h_> well that part is ok
[16:33] <rick_h_> but the network, when you're a fake MS shop like us, is the issue
[16:33] <rick_h_> ldap via novell, file share servers, keriomail exchange mail faker, etc
[16:33] <rick_h_> we're wanna be AD without the AD
[16:34] <snap-l> I love that my kobo has a sqlite3 database on it
[16:34] <rick_h_> hey, bookie is making me like sqlite more and more (well and hate it some as well though)
[16:35] <rick_h_> can you access it? view it?
[16:35] <snap-l> I have a love / hate relationship with it
[16:35] <snap-l> Yeah, it's under the .kobo directory
[16:35] <snap-l> has .conf files under there as well
[16:36] <snap-l> and a Trolltech.conf file. ;)
[16:36] <rick_h_> the limits on table alterations, and the complete crap rules with fulltext indexed 'virtual tables' is maddening
[16:36] <snap-l> Damn thing is probably running Qt.
[16:36] <rick_h_> nice, qt based eh?
[16:37] <snap-l> except this fucking thing isn't updating the library
[16:38] <snap-l> and much like banshee, it takes forever to see new content when it is working
[16:48] <rick_h_> ok, so the printer let's me download a driver for 'linux' that's got cups in the name, but ends in .exe
[16:49] <snap-l> wine?
[16:49] <rick_h_> file says "PE32 executable for MS Windows (GUI) Intel 80386 32-bit, LHa self-extracting archive"
[16:49] <binbrain> don't proceed any further, might be a virus
[16:49] <rick_h_> well, got it from the manufacturer site, but ok
[16:49] <binbrain> do you have antivirus software installed
[16:49] <rick_h_> have clamav around
[16:50] <binbrain> dude, just joking
[16:50] <rick_h_> :P
[16:50] <binbrain> clamav, I hope your CPU is ok
[16:50] <rick_h_> don't keep it running, it's installed
[16:50] <jrwren> snap-l: lol, how about i agree with you. moving from XP to Win7 is not easy.
[16:51] <rick_h_> hmm, so maybe I can open that up on windows and extract some ppd files or something
[16:51] <jrwren> did you know PPD files can shell out to executables?
[16:51] <jrwren> some mac printer drivers are PPD and then have mac-only binaries that won't work on linux.
[16:51] <jrwren> stpuid dell
[16:53] <rick_h_> heh, did not know that, nice
[16:55] <rick_h_> ok, that worked
[16:55] <rick_h_> extraxted to just a .ppd file, love plaintext
[16:56] <rick_h_> sweet, and test page
[16:59] <jrwren> http://signup.balanon.com/yu3m1
[16:59] <jrwren> i spam channel with that link :p
[17:01] <ColonelPanic001> anyone install Firefox 4 on ubuntu yet?
[17:13] <greg-g> ColonelPanic001: I've been running the mozilla-next PPA, so I've be following the betas just fine
[17:15] <ColonelPanic001> just curious. I just put it on this macbook here at work, but haven't bothered finding the PPA or whatnot for the linux boxes yet
[17:15] <ColonelPanic001> and by that I mean, I installed it today
[17:21] <greg-g> ColonelPanic001: btw: http://askubuntu.com/questions/6339/how-do-i-install-firefox-4/612
[17:25] <brousch> rick_h_: you'd be proud of me. i'm running pylint over my code now
[17:25] <ColonelPanic001> greg-g: thanks
[17:51] <ColonelPanic001> completely unscientific/etc, but FF4 does feel a little zippier
[17:55]  * greg-g nods
[17:56] <jrwren> oh it feels WAY faster.
[17:56] <jrwren> not just hte JS either.
[17:56] <jrwren> but i typically have 20+ tabs
[17:56] <ColonelPanic001> Sync was something I've been hoping to get to trying, too. Nice
[17:57] <jrwren> and just changing tabs feels far faster
[17:57] <ColonelPanic001> yeah, me too
[17:57] <ColonelPanic001> same here
[17:57] <jrwren> js-ctypes looks awesome too
[17:57] <ColonelPanic001> have a bad habit of leaving tabs laying around
[17:57] <ColonelPanic001> js-ctypes?
[17:57] <ColonelPanic001> hah, nice
[17:57] <jrwren> you can call native C functions from js now.
[17:57] <ColonelPanic001> I hadn't heard of this
[17:57] <ColonelPanic001> crazy
[18:51] <snap-l> Hurray, I have discovered how to do album art for both mp3 and ogg
[18:51] <snap-l> Now to figure out how to programmatically do it, and then use it for both lococast and open metalcast
[18:53] <rick_h_> brousch: hah, good stuff
[18:53] <rick_h_> after that make sure to run pep8
[18:54] <snap-l> http://blogs.forbes.com/jeffbercovici/2011/03/22/aol-folds-30-brands-including-politics-daily/ <- I'll give someone a dollar per site if they can prove that any one of these sites was in their history before today.
[18:54] <snap-l> (barrig huffington post)
[18:55] <jjesse> i read Luxist every day
[18:55] <snap-l> screenshot, or no cash
[18:56] <jjesse> lol i had no idea any of those sites existed
[19:00] <snap-l> Jeez, who at PyCharm thought having 5 licenses for the same codebase was a good idea?
[19:00] <rick_h_> lol
[19:01] <rick_h_> choice!
[19:01] <tjagoda> mmm
[19:01] <tjagoda> speedy firefox 5
[19:01] <tjagoda> wow
[19:01] <tjagoda> uh
[19:01] <tjagoda> yeah
[19:01] <tjagoda> 5
[19:01] <tjagoda> bet you wish you had 5 and not 4
[19:01] <snap-l> Commercial, Personal, Academic, Classroom, and Open Source
[19:01] <brousch> there's also Expired, which lets you run it for 30 minutes before it shuts down
[19:03] <snap-l> Why not the odd license, which allows you to run every other line of code, which you'd think might not work, but instead plays the collected organ works of Reggie Wilson
[19:04] <snap-l> Sorry, but 5 licenses means I'm not touching that fucker with a 10 foot pole.
[19:04] <_stink_> haha
[19:04] <snap-l> (of course, what they mean is 5 different ways of paying for the software)
[19:20] <brousch> ug, i used to enjoy speccing out new workstations. now it's just tedious. is this a sign of old age?
[19:20] <snap-l> No, it's a sign that there aren't that many compelling options anymore?
[19:21] <brousch> it's all tiny variations on cpu and graphics cards
[19:21] <brousch> everything looks the same
[19:22] <brousch> and this is a drafting/3d workstation, so they get fancy stuff
[19:31] <windows> hey all
[19:32] <snap-l> hola
[19:34] <_stink_> hi
[19:34] <windows> how's in going snap-l
[19:34] <windows> it*
[19:35] <snap-l> It goes, and goes, and ...
[19:35] <snap-l> Yourself?
[19:37] <windows> bout the same
[19:37] <windows> at work
[19:39] <snap-l> God, I hate door-to-door folks
[19:48] <windows> that's understandable
[19:51] <_stink_> kick them
[19:55] <rick_h_> I hate mysql, that is all, wasting my freaking afternoon
[20:02] <wolfger> woo
[20:13] <rick_h_> that good eh?
[20:16] <wolfger> It was a day...
[20:16] <wolfger> normally I'm bored and/or this channel is slow, so I can keep up all day long
[20:16] <wolfger> today I was busy and the channel was hopping. i gave up :-p
[20:17] <wolfger> and now I'm just unwinding finally. On the plus side, my wifi finally seems to be stable. :-)
[20:17] <snap-l> heh
[20:22] <snap-l> GBS = Google Books?
[20:27] <snap-l> Yep, it is
[20:28] <snap-l> A federal judge in Manhattan on Tuesday rejected Google Inc.'s settlement with authors and publishers that would allow it to make millions of books available online, saying it would give the Internet giant the ability to "exploit" books without the permission of copyright owners.
[20:28] <snap-l> After all, the ability to exploit authors should be the purey of the publishers alone
[20:28] <snap-l> stupid.
[20:32] <greg-g> heh
[20:33] <greg-g> my personal opinion: the settlement went too far, over stepped what a normal class action lawsuit can do. I agree with Judge Chin's opinion. If they turn it in to an opt-in it should be fine.
[20:34] <greg-g> remember, we're no longer talking about just scanning, searching, and showing snippets. The settlement gave Google a monopoly on scanning, searching, showing full books, and selling orphan books
[20:34] <greg-g> my wording was a bit wrong, it gave Google only a monopoly on the orphans and showing full text part
[20:35] <greg-g> from his opinion: "The case was about the use of an indexing and searching tool, not the sale of complete copyrighted works."
[20:36]  * greg-g stops yaking about GBS
[20:37] <binbrain> am I behind that I just found out about the glow.mozilla.org easter egg?
[20:38] <greg-g> easter egg?
[20:38] <binbrain> ahh huh, at least I'm not the last to find out
[20:38] <ColonelPanic001> wat
[20:39] <greg-g> TELL ME!
[20:39] <binbrain> :)
[20:39] <wolfger> what glow.mozilla.org easter egg?
[20:39] <ColonelPanic001> vee have vays of making you talk
[20:39] <binbrain> its only fair to hint, as that is the way I was told about it
[20:39] <binbrain> hint: try the number keys
[20:40] <ColonelPanic001> ARG!
[20:40] <greg-g> nice
[20:40] <ColonelPanic001> kill it with fire
[20:40] <snap-l> ?
[20:41] <snap-l> I'm messing wiht the num keys, and not getting anything
[20:41] <wolfger> Nice.... glow.mozilla.org tells me to "Please find a browser that supports javascript and <canvas>. Get Firefox" despite the fact that I'm using Firefox
[20:41] <greg-g> what version?
[20:41] <ColonelPanic001> I'm not sure how I did it, snap-l. it only did it once, keep trying
[20:41] <ColonelPanic001> "1.5"
[20:41] <binbrain> it doens't seem to be consistently possible
[20:41] <wolfger> Natty version.... with NoScript :-)
[20:42] <snap-l> wolfger: That's likely 3.6
[20:42] <Blazeix> wolfger: I have bad news for you. NoScript can adversely affect javascript.
[20:42] <ColonelPanic001> there it goes again
[20:42] <greg-g> I know I know, simple 2 presses
[20:42] <wolfger> snap-l: it's 4.0
[20:42] <greg-g> not the number 2, mind you
[20:42] <snap-l> Cute. I think I found it
[20:43] <wolfger> but despite me not allowing scripts wily-nily, they should be able to detect I'm using their damned product
[20:44] <snap-l> wolfger: You're the one  breaking the web, not them. ;)
[20:45] <wolfger> I am so ridiculously happy that I'm still online. I think this is a record.
[20:46] <wolfger> 90 minutes on the hotel wifi without the realtek module crapping out
[20:47] <wolfger> To celebrate, I think I'll write some code
[21:00] <snap-l> http://programming-motherfucker.com/
[21:02] <wolfger> Anybody running Natty want to confirm this bug for me? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gwibber/+bug/740486
[22:31] <brousch> am i missing something? why would i buy a 27" 1080p monitor over a 24" 1080p monitor? wouldn't the 27" just have bigger pixels?
[23:14] <rick_h_> brousch: yea, but it's bigger
[23:14] <rick_h_> bigger == better
[23:15] <rick_h_> else why get a 42" 1080p tv over a 36" 1080p :P
[23:16] <rick_h_> bah, twitter search on bookie is useless
[23:29] <brousch> well for TVs it's so you can sit farther away
[23:40] <snap-l> http://doctormo.org/2011/03/22/firefox-4-0-utterly-worse-than-useless/ <- Seriously?
[23:42] <rick_h_> dammit, are you your grandmother?  Via Lynx. Which is, of course, a bug. So.
[23:52] <rick_h_> lol
[23:53] <rick_h_> come on, someone send it in to us, I dare you
[23:53] <rick_h_> let me warm up the mic first
[23:55] <snap-l> I understand Martin's problem
[23:56] <snap-l> but he's putting the onus of blame on the wrong people
[23:56] <rick_h_> who is martin?
[23:56] <snap-l> The original "bzip no installed" dude
[23:56] <rick_h_> dr schmo guy?
[23:56] <snap-l> yes
[23:56] <rick_h_> gotcha
[23:56] <snap-l> Because it's not Firefox's problem
[23:57] <snap-l> It's like complaining when you go to Astoria that they have all that sugar when you're diabetic
[23:57] <snap-l> Here's a novel one: patience?


[00:09] <Takyoji> http://marshall-williams.blogspot.com/2009/06/steam-native-linux-client-right-around.html


[01:18] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- amurray, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4797 Pending binary packages
[01:38] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- amurray, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4797 Diff missing
[01:50] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- amurray, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4797 Preparing packages
[02:17] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- amurray, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4797 Successfully built
[13:55] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- xnox, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4794 Uploading build
[14:14] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- xnox, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4794 Pending binary packages
[14:34] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- xnox, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4794 Diff missing


[00:19] <owh> Is there any reason that the ubuntu-jeos-builder script installs stuff like alsa or is that just because it's in main?
[02:17] <Centaur5> I'm trying to setup chillispot and freeradius and it appears that everything should be working but when I try to login it says login failed.  syslog says that the radius request times out.  When running radtest on the radius server it does accept my credentials.  Do I have to open mysql to accept connections from other hosts?
[02:36] <mralphabet> Centaur5: is the radius request from a different machine?
[02:36] <mralphabet> Centaur5: if so, then probably
[02:40] <Centaur5> mralphabet: Well the wireless client connects to chillispot on the radius server which is forwarded to a hotspotlogin script.  I'm probably wrong but I just assumed chillispot controls everything else that goes on and would seem to be coming from localhost to the other daemons.
[07:24] <kraut> moin
[07:30] <_ruben> mornin
[09:18] <_ruben> hmm .. having a problem with ubuntu server gutsy under vmware:
[09:19] <_ruben> * Loading hardware drivers...
[09:19] <_ruben> error receiving uevent message: No buffer space available
[15:03] <bluefoxicy> anyone know about the new encrypted lvm in gutsy
[15:03] <bluefoxicy> particularly how to change the password
[15:07] <soren> bluefoxicy: I guess you have to add a new key and remove the old one.
[15:08] <soren> bluefoxicy: cryptsetup(8) is your friend.
[15:09] <bluefoxicy> soren: fixed in hardy right?  ;)
[15:09] <bluefoxicy> GUI tools etc???
[15:09] <soren> bluefoxicy: No.
[15:09] <bluefoxicy> bah, I can dream :P
[15:09] <soren> bluefoxicy: You can't fix something that's not broken.
[15:10] <bluefoxicy> missing useful feature == broken
[15:10] <soren> That's hardly useful.
[15:10] <bluefoxicy> just lower priority than crashers and holes
[15:10] <soren> In that case all software is broken. Perpetually so.
[15:11] <soren> Which renders any efforts towards the opposite useless.
[15:11] <bluefoxicy> no
[15:11] <soren> Yes.
[15:11] <soren> How's that for an argument.
[15:11] <soren> ?
[15:11] <bluefoxicy> have you ever noticed some software is abandonware and unmaintained?
[15:11] <soren> Yes.
[15:11] <soren> Point being?
[15:11] <bluefoxicy> and that software eventually gets replaced by something else actively maintained?
[15:12] <soren> Yes....
[15:12] <soren> go on.
[15:12] <bluefoxicy> The assessment that all software is perpetually broken is correct
[15:12] <bluefoxicy> But the fact is
[15:12] <bluefoxicy> you can make the software less broken now, but it becomes more broken when someone else looks at it and goes "it should do XXXX" and 10% of the user base nods its heads
[15:13] <soren> So bugs don't exist until they're observed?
[15:13] <bluefoxicy> so, effectively, untouched software simply decays, as it becomes less and less suited to peoples' needs
[15:13] <bluefoxicy> YES :D
[15:13] <soren> That's not very useful either.
[15:14] <bluefoxicy> it doesn't have to be useful, it's just the truth
[15:15] <soren> We have too different views of what constitutes truth for this conversation to have any point in continuing.
[15:15] <dantalizing> lol
[15:15] <bluefoxicy> it's an observed fact then ;p
[15:15] <soren> We have too different views of what constitutes facts for this conversation to have any point in continuing.
[15:15] <bluefoxicy> pornview was great until a year or two after it stopped getting maintained for example
[15:16] <dantalizing> so, does windows 3.1, for instance, have more bugs now than in 1993 because its missing features?
[15:16] <soren> dantalizing: Depends... Noone's using it, so noone's observing said lack of features.
[15:16] <bluefoxicy> dantalizing:  could you use windows 3.1 on a daily basis to get your work done effectively in 1993 without much trouble besides random hangs?
[15:16] <soren> bluefoxicy: Is that a rhetorical question? Is this?
[15:17] <bluefoxicy> well
[15:17] <kronus_> Hi, I'm having a problem with my server's routing table, I think
[15:17] <bluefoxicy> point, back when 3.1 came out it landed on a bunch of business desktops.  The had e-mail and word and image processing apps and databases and proprietary applications and all kinds of specialized things
[15:17] <dantalizing> ok, windows 98... i know some of the freegeek chapters are installing windows98 because they have old PCs.. .does windows98 have more bugs now than in 1999?
[15:18] <soren> kronus_: What's the problem?
[15:18] <MenZa> I'd hope not :p
[15:18] <kronus_> the problem is that `man route` is not clear on what the routing table actually does
[15:18] <bluefoxicy> TODAY, if you go to an insurance company or to a dentist office or anything else and drop 3.1 in, it won't authenticate to the domain, won't run their proprietary apps, and won't run much else
[15:18] <kronus_> and I'm having trouble accessing one subnet of my college network from another (wireless -> wired)
[15:18] <soren> kronus_: Well... It doesn't do much. It's a table :) The kernel does something based on its contents, though :)
[15:19] <kronus_> and... I know the problem is an extra route somewhere, because it's been fixed before that way
[15:19] <kronus_> but apparently only temporarily
[15:19] <kronus_> soren - what does the kernel do with it?
[15:19] <soren> routes
[15:19] <soren> Clever, huh?  :)
[15:19] <kronus_> ok, back to basics :P what is a route?
[15:19] <bluefoxicy> a routing table basically says "I have 2 interfaces.  Stuff going here goes out this one"
[15:20] <soren> It takes packets' destination IP, looks it up in the table and sends it to whereever the routing table says it should go.
[15:20] <kronus_> ok, I have 5 routes in my table
[15:20] <kronus_> and only 2 interfaces
[15:20] <soren> That's fine.
[15:20] <soren> Put the output of "route -n" on pastebin.
[15:21] <soren> ...along with a simple explanation of your network and then tell us the specific problem, you're seeing.
[15:21] <soren> !pastebin
[15:21] <ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
[15:21] <kronus_> that's exactly what I'm doing
[15:21] <soren> Cool
[15:21] <CarstenQ> Hi o/, I've just installed Ubuntu server 7.10 (Gutsy) with the OpenSSH server (4.6p1), but when trying to ssh from or to my Mac OS X 10.4.11 (ssh 4.5p1) the user or password isn't recognized (keeps asking for password), though it returns no errors.   Next question.
[15:22] <CarstenQ> yeah, guessed that, so i made an extreme simple username + pw
[15:22] <soren> CarstenQ: Look in /var/log/auth.log
[15:22] <CarstenQ> haha, noticed that
[15:22] <bluefoxicy> soren:  indeed.  I've seen such systems, they were easier to break into (found default users, looked up default passwords ;)
[15:22] <soren> CarstenQ: It's likely to give you info on why your login was rejected.
[15:23] <CarstenQ> looking for it now
[15:23] <dantalizing> do you have any DenyUsers or DenyGroups in your sshd_config?
[15:24] <CarstenQ> erm, I can't find that log in /var/log or /private/var/log, 'nother Mac thing?
[15:25] <soren> Er... Forget the mac.
[15:25] <CarstenQ> not that I know of (didn't change anything from fresh install)
[15:25] <soren> ...or ask someone else about it.
[15:25] <soren> Look on the Ubuntu box.
[15:25] <CarstenQ> nope, no denied users or groups
[15:26] <CarstenQ> well, thanks for the help anyway :)
[15:26] <soren> CarstenQ: We can help you with the failing to login on Ubuntu.
[15:27] <soren> CarstenQ: The other way? Not so much.
[15:27] <PecisDarbs> How to properly enable site to work with mod_perl?
[15:27] <PecisDarbs> in Apache
[15:27] <PecisDarbs> Google is full of suggestions, but nothing concrete
[15:27] <CarstenQ> yeah, shame I don't have an ubuntu box any more to test it with
[15:28] <soren> CarstenQ: Eh?
[15:28] <soren> CarstenQ: 16:21:42 < ~CarstenQ> Hi o/, I've just installed Ubuntu server 7.10 (Gutsy) with the OpenSSH server (4.6p1),
[15:28] <CarstenQ> you mean I should try to ssh from the server to itself? is that possible?
[15:29]  * CarstenQ starts trying
[15:29] <soren> CarstenQ: From your mac to ubuntu.
[15:29] <soren> CarstenQ: Or from the server to the server is fine, too.
[15:30] <dantalizing> CarstenQ i think the point is you need to check the /var/log/auth.log on the ubuntu machine that you cannot ssh to, not your mac
[15:30] <CarstenQ> ah, ok, misunderstood that
[15:30] <soren> PecisDarbs: Noone is is likely to give you more exact and concrete info than google... It's pointless. People have spent a lot of time writing the stuff you found from google, and now you want us to write all the same stuff again.
[15:30] <kronus_> soren - http://rafb.net/p/OoALbZ20.html
[15:30] <soren> kronus_: That's not the output of "route -n"
[15:31] <kronus_> >__> yeah, that's route -v
[15:31] <kronus_> force of habit, one sec
[15:31] <kronus_> http://rafb.net/p/us9ZgB76.html
[15:32] <soren> kronus_: The computer is on both networks.
[15:32] <CarstenQ> soren: found the log, will type in pastebox
[15:32] <kronus_> only the wireless link is active (eth1)
[15:32] <soren> kronus_: No.
[15:32] <kronus_> ..oh
[15:33] <kronus_> well, only the wireless link is SUPPOSED to be active
[15:33] <kronus_> which routes should I try to get rid of?
[15:34] <soren> kronus_: You should disable the wired network altogether.
[15:34] <soren> kronus_: ifdown eth0 (if eth0 is the wired)
[15:34] <kronus_> ifdown eth0?
[15:34] <kronus_> ok, trying
[15:34] <soren> if eth0 is the wired network.
[15:34] <kronus_> it is
[15:34] <kronus_> and... it works
[15:34] <kronus_> thanks
[15:34] <soren> Yay.
[15:35] <soren> You might want to remove "auto eth0" from /etc/network/interfaces
[15:35] <CarstenQ> Hmm, my roommate just came in with his ubuntu laptop and has no problems to ssh to the server...
[15:35] <rodpod> whats the difference between auto eth0 and the allow-hotplug eth0
[15:36] <kronus_> soren  - this server is an old laptop I have, and sometimes I have it on the wired net
[15:37] <kronus_> wouldn't removing 'auto eth0' then stop any automatic network switching?
[15:37] <soren> rodpod: It's in the interfaces(5) man page.
[15:38] <soren> kronus_: It clearly was causing you more trouble than it was fixing?
[15:38] <kronus_> ok, what the hell
[15:38] <rodpod> damn, i got man page'd
[15:38] <kronus_> there's a new route
[15:38] <rodpod> lol
[15:38] <kronus_> and it doesn't work again :/
[15:38] <CarstenQ> soren: /var/log/auth.log shows nothing when I try to log in, though when in verbose mode ssh says: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/48547/
[15:39] <soren> CarstenQ: Ah.. It's your client that's doing it wrong.
[15:39] <soren> CarstenQ: Keyboard-interactive is disabled by default.
[15:39] <soren> CarstenQ: In favour of password.
[15:39] <CarstenQ> soren: Ah ok... so I guess it's fixable and the answer is in the man page ;)
[15:40] <kronus_> soren - something automatically added a route for eth0 just now, even though eth0 is down
[15:40] <soren> kronus_: Then eth0 is not down.
[15:40] <soren> kronus_: ...anymore.
[15:41] <kronus_> ifdown: interface eth0 not configured
[15:41] <kronus_> bringing it up and back down removed the extra route
[15:41] <soren> You probably have a dhclient running..
[15:41] <soren> That keeps configuring it.
[15:42] <MatBoy> does someone know a good opensource bootcd that can image HD's to a networkshare ?
[15:43] <maswan> the default ubuntu one should have netcat available, it can do that kind of thing
[15:43] <maswan> (just a bit tricky)
[15:48] <MatBoy> ok
[15:48] <MatBoy> thanks
[15:52] <maswan> something like "nc server 2318 < /dev/hda" and on the server "nc -l -p 2318 > client.hda.imgage"
[15:52] <maswan> except with the right syntax etc, that's from mostly memory. :)
[15:55] <rodpod> that sounds pretty cool, never thought of using nc to image
[16:53] <adelie> Hello. I want to setup an LTSP server, but don't want it to be the DHCP. Is it possible to setup a thin clients boot loader to get the image some way other than the traditional 'network boot'?
[16:54] <adelie> err... LDAP.. sorry
[17:18] <compbrain> adelie: For what did you mean LDAP?
[17:19] <RCOMALTA> hello there
[17:19] <RCOMALTA> i am david
[17:19] <RCOMALTA> can some help please
[17:20] <dantalizing> rcomalta: possibly, fire away
[17:23] <limbeaux> i am following the nagios quick start, but it was written for desktop 6.10  server 7 doesn't have the file libgd2-dev, anyone know what its equivalent might be?
[17:24] <ivoks> quick start for nagios on all ubuntu version would be:
[17:24] <ivoks> sudo apt-get install nagios-text
[17:24] <limbeaux> thanks!!
[17:25] <RCOMALTA> i am new in ubuntu server
[17:25] <RCOMALTA> ubuntu server is gui ???
[17:25] <ivoks> no
[17:25] <ivoks> no gui
[17:25] <RCOMALTA> can i do it gui ???
[17:26] <ivoks> do what?
[17:26] <RCOMALTA> ivoks hi my name david nice to meet you
[17:27] <RCOMALTA> ubuntu when we do on box can we dawn load gui for it
[17:27] <ivoks> yes
[17:27] <ivoks> ubuntu-server is just a part of ubuntu
[17:27] <ivoks> you can install kubuntu ubuntu or xubutnu desktop on top of it
[17:28] <RCOMALTA> a rely
[17:28] <RCOMALTA> that nice
[17:28] <RCOMALTA> sory i am ask i am rely new in linux i be 10 years working witn 2003 sever but know we like to do some box with linux we chouse ubuntu
[17:28] <RCOMALTA> sory for many qutions
[17:30] <RCOMALTA> to make a web server and mail sever there is gui for it
[17:30] <ivoks> no
[17:31] <RCOMALTA> can be in futer time gui for mail sever and web server
[17:32] <ivoks> there are plans to create web based interface for 8.04
[17:33] <RCOMALTA> i see
[17:33] <ivoks> installation of web server is easy
[17:33] <ivoks> just choose LAMP stack during installation and that's it
[17:33] <ivoks> you get mysql+php+apache environment
[17:33] <RCOMALTA> yes ok but for mail server smtp and pop 3 is problem
[17:34] <ivoks> what's the problem?
[17:34] <RCOMALTA> i have here 5 computer runs vista ok
[17:34] <RCOMALTA> mail smpt pop 3
[17:34] <RCOMALTA> can be conect with as mail server ubutu
[17:35] <ivoks> ok
[17:35] <ivoks> then also choose mail server during installation
[17:35] <RCOMALTA> i see
[17:35] <RCOMALTA> pop 3 smtp
[17:35] <ivoks> and imap
[17:35] <ivoks> and pop3s and imaps
[17:35] <RCOMALTA> ohhh i see
[17:36] <RCOMALTA> smtp no
[17:36] <ivoks> yes, both smtp and smtps
[17:36] <RCOMALTA> ok
[17:36] <RCOMALTA> nice
[17:36] <RCOMALTA> i will dawnlodit
[17:36] <ivoks> once you set it up, you just have to create users...
[17:37] <RCOMALTA> ok
[17:47] <adelie> compbrain:still there?
[17:48] <adelie> compbrain: I figured out what I want to do... just not sure how to do it exactly, but want to setup a boot via http using gpxe.
[17:48] <adelie> Oh, and i meant LTSP, not LDAP
[17:58] <adelie> I am not sure if I am lost or not (isn't that the worst?). Can "pxe.0" be any bootable image?
[18:28] <RCOMALTA> ivoks still there
[18:29] <RCOMALTA> adeli
[18:29] <RCOMALTA> are you fix up server my ask
[18:39] <RCOMALTA> can i do ubutu server on my desctop computer to see how it works
[19:05] <RCOMALTA> any one here
[20:13] <dantalizing> so, i'm upgrading a server with raid5 from dapper to feisty ... going through the verification process for md .... what do i do if my UIDs do not match between what mkconf tells me and what is in mdadm.conf ?
[20:14] <dantalizing> mdrun starts the raid just fine with the existing mdadm.conf
[20:51] <RCOMALTA> dantalizing  you there
[21:14] <dantalizing> yes, but i have to leave...


[01:30] <knobydobs> Hello, I have a perixx gaming mouse which is basically 2 HID keyboards and an HID raw input, unfortunately, none of these inputs are recognized by going to the device file in /Dev/inputs and using sudo cat. I have already edited HID.d in an attempt to let the mouse be recognized but to no avail.
[19:38] <emby> hi
[19:38] <len-dt> hello
[19:39] <emby> who has already use a m-audio fast trackpro (usb sound card) with ardour but not the midi in, only audio in?
[19:40] <len-dt> No idea. Is there a problem? The midi ports should just show up in the alsa tab of qjackctl.
[19:42] <emby> i want record a guitar in analogic, but qjackctl don't see audio in
[19:43] <len-dt> Ah, so this is not a midi question but an audio question.
[19:44] <emby> yes just audio
[19:47] <len-dt> I know there used to be a patch required to get full functionality
[19:47] <len-dt> https://community.ardour.org/node/4423
[19:47] <len-dt> But it should still work without that.
[19:48] <len-dt> "Without the patch, the FTP can only achieve 16bit/44.1KHz quality recordings. After the patch, you can record at 24bit/96KHz and the digital outputs are enabled as well."
[19:48] <len-dt> That was 2011, and there was talk about adding that to vanilla ALSA.
[19:49] <emby_> thank you very much, i'll go read that
[19:50] <len-dt> My personal experience was that I tried one in a music store and  had similar problems so I bought something else.
[19:51] <emby_> ok
[19:51] <len-dt> That was over a year ago too.
[19:55] <emby_> Thks for your help, i go to lunch.
[20:22] <len-dt> emby_, see bug #1095315 This may be what I hit when I tried one. Make sure you are updated to kernel 3.2.0-38
[20:22] <len-dt> Do a uname -a to see what you have.
[23:43] <studio-user207> sitting in the library installing studio for the 5th time I have this fetish installing linux distros
[23:43] <studio-user207> and staring at the screen as i update
[23:44] <studio-user207> Goodtimes
[23:46] <SunStar> lol
[23:46] <SunStar> sounds familiar
[23:47] <studio-user207> I figured it would thats just the alchemy between my dry sense of humor  and ocd
[23:54] <MaynardWaters> anyone interested in helping me troubleshoot a tascam us-122 configuration
[23:55] <timothymillar> hi everyone. I just joined the team for this project and am eager to dive into whatever is needed. Any guidance/assignments would be great to get me going
[23:55] <zequence> timothymillar: So, if I understood you right, you're interested in helping out with Ubuntu Studio development?
[23:56] <MaynardWaters> timothymillar: lets figure out how to install to an usb stick and be able to plug it into any hardware with a tascam us-122 attached and rock so hard, we melt everyones face
[23:56] <zequence> MaynardWaters: What kind of problem are you having? There was another guy on #jack earlier, who wasn't able to start it all. Have you ever been able to?
[23:56] <MaynardWaters> zequence: I had a buddy in my previous house who had this us-122 set up with UStudio 11.04
[23:57] <MaynardWaters> we used it for 2 track recording successfully
[23:57] <timothymillar> you got it. I've toyed around with Ubuntu Studio a while ago, and actually used a lot of the programs affiliated. I'm interested in getting it up and running and thought joining the team would be of use
[23:57] <timothymillar> I've actually used the US-122 in ubuntu studio, I might be able to help troubleshoot, but don't have the device in front of me
[23:58] <zequence> timothymillar: Join #ubuntustudio-devel, and we'll talk some more


[02:58] <doctormo> akgraner: Hey, did you get my message before?
[02:59] <akgraner> doctormo, yep - sorry I just got called into a meeting
[02:59] <akgraner> think I got it all worked out now  - will know in the am - thank you!!
[03:03] <doctormo> akgraner: Is it a surprise?
[03:04] <akgraner> yep :-)
[03:04] <JFo> the bacon is everyewhere
[03:05] <akgraner> but an awesome one if it all works out :-)
[03:05] <doctormo> JFo: Isn't that the problem though? I feel like I just became vegetarian for maverick.
[03:05] <nhandler>             dest = realloc(dest, (destsize + STRBUFSIZE) * sizeof(char));
[03:05] <nhandler> (ignore that)
[03:05] <jcastro> hello JFo
[03:05] <jcastro> how is acting coming along?
[03:05] <JFo> doctormo, so sad
[03:05] <JFo> hiya jcastro
[03:06] <JFo> very well thanks ;)
[03:07] <doctormo> JFo: What are you acting in?
[03:07] <JFo> doctormo, see the topic :)
[03:07] <JFo> jcastro says the guy from Deadwood looks like me :)
[03:08] <JFo> he is right though
[03:08] <JFo> scary
[03:08] <doctormo> JFo: I think I'm lacking context to that picture.
[03:08]  * doctormo is wondering how you get advertising space int he community irc channel title.
[03:08] <nhandler> jcastro: Think we could add LoCo Day to the /topic ;)
[03:08] <JFo> doctormo, that is from an HBO show
[03:09] <jcastro> nhandler: yep
[03:09] <doctormo> JFo: And that's you in the HBO show? or is that jcastro having a pull on your leg?
[03:09] <jcastro> nhandler: can you add it? I'm on a friend's machine and my pasting and copying is useless
[03:09] <jcastro> doctormo: that's actually him
[03:10] <JFo> doctormo, no, that is a guy that resembles me.
[03:10] <JFo> jcastro is pulling your leg :)
[03:10] <doctormo> What is LoCo day?
[03:11] <nhandler> doctormo: You should have gotten an email about it (it was also on the planet).  :p
[08:09] <akgraner> hehe - just cc'd you on it since I told people to contact  -backstage as well
[08:10] <nigelb> Yeah, I noticed :)
[08:10] <duanedesign> lol, i love the session title 'Have you tried turning it off and then on again? '
[08:10] <nigelb> duanedesign: that one's going to rock :)
[08:10] <nigelb> ubuntu women ftw :)
[08:11] <duanedesign> ugh, toDo list is big today...
[08:13] <nigelb> So much fun to see ubuntu being talked about in a web framework channel
[09:33] <czajkowski> aloha
[09:51] <nigelb> morning czajkowski :)
[09:51] <czajkowski> how we all doing with 3 days to go :)
[09:55] <nigelb> inspiration for today => http://www.zdnet.com/blog/education/is-ubuntu-1010-yet-another-chance-to-ditch-windows/4262
[09:55] <dpm> man, I'm so happy, I've just found the zoom slider in Calc! I've been looking for a Zoom menu for ages...
[09:55] <kim0> :D
[09:55] <kim0> talk about usability
[09:55]  * dpm goes back to writing presentations with healthy eyes
[09:56] <nigelb> dpm: time to send robert hugs :)
[09:57] <dpm> nigelb, who's robert? I don't follow much OO.o development
[09:57] <nigelb> dpm: ah, Calc! okay, I thought gcalctool
[09:58] <dpm> oh, robert_ancell, no, no, that was oo.o's calc :)
[09:58] <dpm> gcalctool is awesome as it is, no need for a zoom button
[09:58] <nigelb> heh
[09:58] <dpm> :)
[10:04] <nigelb> morning jono :)
[10:10] <kim0> o/
[10:11] <jono> hey nigelb
[10:12] <nigelb> jono: millbank?
[10:14] <jono> nigelb, yup
[10:14] <nigelb> :)
[10:27] <duanedesign> morning all I have missed since last time I said good morning :)
[10:38] <nigelb> lol
[10:40] <jussi> hello duanedesign!
[10:47] <nigelb> morning jussi :)
[10:47] <jussi> hello nigelb
[10:47] <nigelb> jussi: did you ever get your cam working with gtalk voice plugin?
[10:47] <jussi> nigelb: havent played with it
[10:47] <AlanBell> jono: going to any of the London events?
[10:48] <nigelb> AlanBell: I can't believe you're missing it!
[10:48] <nigelb> AlanBell: just wait till czajkowski lands in london :p
[10:49] <czajkowski> :)
[10:50] <AlanBell> I am missing the one on 10/10/10, but I will try to get to the other two
[10:50] <AlanBell> and maybe the Swindon one
[10:53] <popey> the other two?
[10:53] <popey> http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-uk
[10:53] <popey> ahhh
[10:55] <AlanBell> yup
[10:57] <czajkowski> nigelb: I'll miss the release parties in UK, but we've had good ones over here in the past and pleia2 will be at ours this time.
[10:57] <doctormo> Who's missing what where when?
[10:57] <doctormo> And why are we surprised?
[10:58] <doctormo> What what is California pleia2 doing in Ireland... visiting?
[10:58] <czajkowski> yup
[10:58] <doctormo> nice
[10:58] <czajkowski> she arrives sunday
[10:58] <czajkowski> so I get to hang out with her for a few days :)
[10:59] <doctormo> Cool, I'll be hanging with a high ranking kernel developer from Israel. FOSS is a funny world wide meeting place.
[10:59] <czajkowski> we're having a a pub quiz
[10:59] <czajkowski> well dinner first, followed by pub and quiz
[11:02] <nigelb> czajkowski: yeah, sort of envious of the fun you're going to have :)
[11:02] <czajkowski> yeah my loco isn't exactly thrilled to see me leave :)
[11:03] <jussi> czajkowski: pub in Dublin? where are you going?
[11:03]  * nigelb hugs doctormo.
[11:03] <nigelb> Thanks for adding that bit in.
[11:04] <nigelb> Should ask amber to factor that in to her mail announcement format :)
[11:04] <doctormo> thanks nigelb
[11:04] <doctormo> nigelb: She already replied.
[11:04] <czajkowski> jussi: we;re going to the Market bar
[11:05] <doctormo> czajkowski: Will the loco be ok without you? I know lugs that collaps when one high profile person goes.
[11:05] <czajkowski> doctormo: oh it'll be fine there are loads of folks who do most of the stuff already
[11:05] <czajkowski> I just have the pointy poking stick
[11:05] <doctormo> Lucky!
[11:05] <doctormo> You could do that from afar, those pointy sticks come in extra long.
[11:06]  * jussi wonders if there is a mini czajkowski... then puts the scary image out of his brain :P :P
[11:06] <AlanBell> we already know the pointy pokey stick is long enough to cover the dublin-london distance
[11:06] <czajkowski> doctormo: we have a team contact and eafter that everyone has a job in the team, I dont actually have a specific role but we have 1 person who does the team reports, another few mail man admin  website admin, and we have a chair and then someone mails out the team the mins of meeting
[11:07] <doctormo> czajkowski: All those jobs were mine in the loco, heh. No wonder you guys can do more.
[11:08] <czajkowski> we're rather fortunate people offered to help, the down sides are our loco is very small and spread out over ireland and dont always like face to face events
[12:02] <jono> dholbach, dpm, jcastro, kim0 hey guys
[12:02] <kim0> hey
[12:02] <dpm> hey jono
[12:03] <jono> dholbach, dpm, jcastro, kim0 I would like to ask you to take a look at the list of LP graphs available and go and review each of your 11.04 plans and identify which graphs help us track progress
[12:03] <jono> if no graphs are suitable for tracking progress, I want you to identify what we *could* track
[12:03] <jono> this will just help us track our progress better
[12:05] <jono> dholbach, dpm, jcastro, kim0 is that cool?
[12:05] <jono> dpm, how are you getting on with the Chinese report?
[12:06] <dpm> jono, yes, that's cool. Report: I'm on it since yesterday. Not finished yet, but it will be ready today. I can show you a preview in ~5 mins if you like
[12:12] <cjohnston> Someone is awake way too early.. /me looks at jono
[12:15] <jono> dpm, thanks!
[12:15] <jono> dpm, heading to lunch now, we can review in a bit
[12:15] <jono> cjohnston, I am in London :)
[12:15] <jono> heading back tomorrow
[12:15] <jono> biab
[12:17] <cjohnston> Gotcha
[12:19] <doctormo> cjohnston: Not early then, late ;-)
[12:19] <doctormo> jono: Hey jono, community here. *waves*
[12:21] <cjohnston> It'l only 1120 then
[12:21] <cjohnston> lol
[12:24] <duanedesign> czajkowski: with your loco so spread out what do you find are good things for the LoCo to work on?
[12:24] <jono> doctormo, :)
[12:26] <duanedesign> czajkowski: i know that is a rather vague question. See myy loco is fairly spread out geographically and i am trying to plan some projects. Just fishing for ideas. :)
[12:28] <czajkowski> duanedesign: the ubuntu hours have worked well
[12:28] <czajkowski> mainly in DUblin we get the largest turn out, with limerick having 3-6 people and cork only getting 2-4 people
[12:28] <dholbach> jono, ok
[12:30] <czajkowski> duanedesign: got to find something that works for ye though every team is so different, we mixed things up during the summer with geeknics
[12:34] <duanedesign> czajkowski: yeah so true. i have been trying to find someone who wants to be an organizer on Oklahoma City. A lot of our members are spread between the two major metro areas.
[12:43] <doctormo> cjohnston: I've never put your name into so much python before, heh
[12:49] <czajkowski> duanedesign: it'll only really work if there is someone in the area interested if 2 people meet up that;s great and that's 2 people more who can meet face to face than wouldnt have done in the past
[14:03] <jcastro> dpm: dholbach: kim0: what lp graphs is he referring to?
[14:03] <kim0> jcastro: https://lpstats.canonical.com/graphs/
[14:03] <kim0> thanks to dpm for pointing to them
[14:04] <jcastro> thanks
[14:04] <AlanBell> url for special people only :(
[14:06] <doctormo> AlanBell: Not for us community people :-/
[14:06] <dpm> AlanBell, I think most of the info there is harmless, but there might be some sensitive stats, hence the permissions. I know some of the LP stats would be useful to the community, but that's how permissions work there right now
[14:06] <AlanBell> oh don't worry I don't mind :)
[14:06] <doctormo> AlanBell: We'll make our own stats, with hookers and blackjacks!
[14:06] <Pici> I know this isn't the right place to ask, but I have a user here (#ubuntu) thats trying to contact the Ubuntu Training Team via Canonical's site.  He says that he hasn't gotten a reply after 7 days.  I'm not sure where to send him next.
[14:07] <dpm> dinda perhaps? ^
[14:07] <doctormo> Pici: This is the right place for that question.
[14:07] <Pici> doctormo: :P
[14:07] <doctormo> dpm: She's doing materials in education now.
[14:07] <Pici> doctormo: oh, I read an "isn't" in there somehow.
[14:07] <AlanBell> Pici: what country?
[14:08] <Pici> AlanBell: France.
[14:08] <doctormo> I think it would depend on what kind of training. Certification, educational, events or just general training as might be provided by the community etc.
[14:09] <popey> There is no training team any more inside canonical
[14:09] <popey> As I understand it
[14:09] <AlanBell> personally I would give Boris Devouge a prod and see what he says
[14:10] <Pici> http://www.canonical.com/enterprise-services/training still exists.
[14:10] <JFo> there is still a training team as far as I know
[14:12] <JFo> my guess is that they are a bit busy this week
[14:12] <JFo> but I am not positive that is the case
[14:13] <Pici> Well, I'd really like to just either throw this person at them, or get confirmation that they're backed up with work.
[14:13] <JFo> Pici, let me see what I can find out
[14:15] <Pici> JFo: Do you want the user's nick?
[14:15] <JFo> sure
[14:15] <Pici> Its 'azertyuio'
[14:16] <JFo> thanks :)
[14:16] <AlanBell> certainly french then!
[14:16] <Pici> I have to get back to real work.  Thanks for looking into this for us :)
[14:17] <JFo> Pici, no problem :)
[14:29] <popey> wonder if lists.ubuntu.com is having issues at the moment
[14:31] <cjohnston> why is my name going into python doctormo ?
[14:32] <doctormo> cjohnston: I figured out why you didn't appear in my irc log analysis (remember last weekish?). turns out your cjohnston|cell alias is never renamed into cjohnston and visa versa, sot he script was confused about who you were and assumed you had no name.
[14:33] <doctormo> I was using your name in the python to print out "THE MAN IS HERE" when your name was processed correctly.
[14:33] <doctormo> I assume you just quit and boot up your phone irc.
[14:33] <cjohnston> lol
[14:34] <cjohnston> This connection is 24/7.. my phone I just jump on when I need to
[14:34] <doctormo> cjohnston: It just took a lot of cjohnstoning to debug, about 15 instances of 'if 'cjohnston' in something: print "THE MAN IS HERE". heh
[14:34] <cjohnston> lol
[14:38] <dinda> Pici:  hey there
[14:39] <Pici> dinda: hey
[14:39] <dinda> Pici: your person might want to poke<EMAIL_ADDRESS>for anything training related these days
[14:40] <Pici> dinda: Of course, it seems like the person has signed off.  I'll keep it in mind for their return.
[14:40] <Pici> Thanks :)
[14:50] <JFo> Pici, yeah, I just chatted with billycina, apparently they didn't get an e-mail as all their e-mail is answered
[14:51] <JFo> or maybe their response went to a filter
[14:51] <JFo> so next time we see them we should chat about that
[14:54] <cjohnston> doctormo: so is your script working now?
[14:55] <doctormo> cjohnston: Well yes, I'm just annoyed that while I could write most of this in python, I had to fall back to perl for the visualisation part since python lacks the libs.
[14:56] <cjohnston> lol
[14:57] <cjohnston> has it updated to include me?
[14:57] <doctormo> cjohnston: Your there now. I added in a special manual aliases input file which links you up.
[14:57] <cjohnston> link?
[14:58] <doctormo> cjohnston: Not finished yet.
[14:59] <doctormo> cjohnston: if your curious: 799 lines 4464 words for cjohnston aliased to cjohnston|cell
[15:00] <cjohnston> ahh.. where does that put me in the rank?
[15:11] <doctormo> cjohnston: 17th
[15:11] <Pendulum> cjohnston: talk more to boost your rankings? ;-)
[15:12] <cjohnston> I guess I need to
[15:12] <doctormo> cjohnston: Heh the rank is hard to beat, from 1st place down to 16th: nigelb, czajkowski, paultag, jcastro, dholbach, jono, doctormo, akgraner, popey, alanbell, jfo, vish, sense, qense, dpm, pleia2
[15:13] <Pici> and now you've pinged all of them.
[15:13] <JFo> what did I win?
[15:13] <JFo> :)
[15:13] <doctormo> Pici: Yea, I figured that would happen.
[15:13] <cjohnston> hehehe
[15:13] <JFo> and how did I wind up on a list
[15:13] <JFo> :-)
[15:13] <cjohnston> I'd like to see it in -locoteams
[15:13] <cjohnston> hehe
[15:13] <Pendulum> JFo: you talk a lot in here :-)
[15:14] <JFo> :-(
[15:14] <doctormo> Take nigelb for instance, 5587 messages to cjohnston's 799, that's 7x as many messages.
[15:14] <Pendulum> wow
[15:14] <Pendulum> cjohnston: you'd need to gag nigelb
[15:14] <cjohnston> he talks too much
[15:14] <Pendulum> aww
[15:15] <doctormo> OK I'll post the raw ranks: http://paste.ubuntu.com/508037/
[15:15] <Pendulum> although, to be fair, I'm pretty meh on ranking systems based on volume over quality
[15:15] <jcastro> what is this now?
[15:16] <cjohnston> nigelb talks too much jcastro
[15:16] <jcastro> there's no way paultag talks more than me
[15:16] <doctormo> jcastro: Do you have an alias that's not on there?
[15:16] <cjohnston> by like 13 lines
[15:16] <jono> doctormo, what are those ranks for?
[15:16] <jcastro> no
[15:17] <jcastro> jono: who's talking the most.
[15:17] <cjohnston> fun
[15:17] <jono> wow, and I am near the top?
[15:17] <doctormo> jono: Number of messages in #ubuntu-community-team over 6 months
[15:17] <jono> I try to avoid talking to you people :-)
[15:17] <cjohnston> ouch
[15:17] <cjohnston> that hurts
[15:17] <doctormo> messages / words / name / aliases
[15:17] <jono> lol
[15:17] <jono> j/k
[15:17] <popey>  /kickban jono
[15:17] <Pendulum> doctormo: btw, you might want to check for pendulum|phone (I don't think I've said anything in here using it, but it's what I'm using from my phone these days)
[15:17] <jcastro> lol jdub came in here once
[15:18] <popey> is that stats for _this_ channel?
[15:18] <doctormo> popey: yes
[15:18] <Pendulum> jcastro: I think that might have been when he was trying to figure out how to become a member again
[15:18] <popey> ah
[15:18] <jcastro> oh right
[15:18] <cjohnston> doctormo: I think since all of nigelb's talking comes from my server, you should alias his nicks to me
[15:18] <jcastro> and then he promptly disappeared again
[15:18] <JFo> Pendulum, I agree which is why I shouldn't be ranked at all :)
[15:19] <Pendulum> jcastro: I think he did maybe one blog post about how he was getting back involved in Ubuntu and then disappeared
[15:19] <doctormo> I cropped the rank at 5 messages, there were 12 <5 users too.
[15:19] <Pendulum> JFo: so stop talking :P
[15:21] <JFo> where's the fun in that? :-P
[15:21] <cjohnston> fun for us
[15:21] <cjohnston> did I say that outloud
[15:21] <doctormo> jono: Isn't it interesting that we've said about the same amount in terms of lines, but I've said twice as many words in each line. heh I never thought I was verbose before but I guess everyone needs a place to write their blog.
[15:22]  * jcastro goes back to work
[15:22] <Pici> Perhaps you should be doing word counts then?
[15:23] <popey> http://popey.com/~alan/community/
[15:23] <doctormo> Pici: You mean sorting by word count?
[15:23] <popey> \o/ graphs
[15:24] <jono> jcastro, call?
[15:24] <doctormo> popey: Interesting differences, where do your logs come from?
[15:24] <jcastro> jono: yeah
[15:24] <jcastro> jono: like, weekly call or quick UDS type call?
[15:24] <popey> my local irssi logs
[15:25] <jono> jcastro, let's do a general catch up
[15:25] <doctormo> popey: could you package them up and let me have a proc?
[15:25] <jono> I know I have been AWOL this week while at the office
[15:25] <jcastro> jono: can you give me 10? I need to get this summit thing outta the way
[15:25] <jono> jcastro, sure
[15:25] <jono> thanks, bro
[15:25] <jcastro> <3
[15:25] <doctormo> popey: The logs from the official website has gaps
[15:25] <jcastro> don't tase me bro!
[15:25] <jono> haha, comedy
[15:25] <jono> zzzzap
[15:25] <cjohnston> I have that shirt jcastro
[15:26] <popey> hmmm
[15:29] <dholbach> haha
[15:29] <dholbach> dholbach always lets us know what he/she's doing: 633 actions!
[15:29] <dholbach> For example, like this:
[15:29] <dholbach>      * dholbach hugs you all
[15:29] <JFo> nice
[15:29] <dholbach> jono couldn't decide whether to stay or go. 961 joins during this reporting period!
[15:30] <dholbach> that's proper data analysis for once :-p
[15:30] <JFo> be better if it said "dholbach is a huggy bear, 10,000 hugs during the reporting period." :-)
[15:30] <JFo> dholbach, true
[15:30] <dholbach> JFo, yeah, most important data criteria are missing :)
[15:30] <popey> :)
[15:30] <JFo> indeed
[15:31] <Pendulum> JFo: that could go without saying, I think
[15:31] <JFo> Pendulum, true
[15:31] <JFo> but should still be called out in graph form :)
[15:31] <Pendulum> heh
[15:31] <JFo> I think who got hugged the most is important too
[15:31] <maco> nigelb is a very aggressive person. He/She attacked others 18 times.
[15:31] <maco> For example, like this:
[15:31] <maco>      * nigelb pokes duanedesign in the eye
[15:32] <cjohnston> lol
[15:32] <maco> so THATs why they wont let him into the country!
[15:32] <Pendulum> aww
[15:33] <JFo> nigel 'eye-poker' b
[15:34] <maco> jcastro also makes sailors blush, 0.0% of the time.  <--- now thats just reaching
[15:34] <JFo> I like that metric
[15:34] <jcastro> jono: I am ready, skype or mumbles?
[15:34] <doctormo> What is mumbles[not a question mark]
[15:35] <jcastro> http://mumble.sourceforge.net/
[15:36] <doctormo> thanks
[15:37] <popey> mumble > skype
[15:43] <jono> jcastro, logging on
[15:43] <jono> skype
[15:44]  * popey notes unsurprisingly that creating similar graphs for #ubuntu kills the cpu for "Some time"
[15:44] <jono> jcastro, log on please :)
[15:45]  * jcastro watches swirling login logo
[15:47] <jcastro> it appears to not be signing in
[15:47] <jcastro> jono: you're trying jcastro1975 right?
[15:47] <jono> I only have on ejcastro on skype
[15:47] <jono> the normal one
[15:47] <jono> jcastro, ^
[15:47] <jcastro> yeah it's not signing in, it's just the spinning logo, weird, give me a sec
[15:48] <jono> jcastro, I will call your phone
[15:51] <paultag> jcastro, haha, you serious?
[15:51] <paultag> jcastro, I rocked you and you know it
[15:51] <duanedesign> ~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~/9
[15:52] <highvoltage> popey: moo
[15:52] <popey> moo indeed!
[15:54] <nigelb> doctormo: wow, I won! yay
[15:55] <nigelb> at least I didn't lose everything
[15:55] <nigelb> maco: right!
[15:55] <highvoltage> popey: can I give it a shot? my youtube username is jonathancarter1982
[15:56] <doctormo> nigelb: Don't rush to the chapagine. popey's logs/code show something different and I'm waiting on popey to respond to getting access to those logs for comparison. I think he's busy.
[15:57] <nigelb> doctormo: my other nicks aren't on popey's chart
[15:57] <popey> sorry, killed my vps generating stats
[15:57] <doctormo> dholbach is the loco directory AGPL or GPL?
[15:57] <nigelb> "Poor jcastro, nobody likes him/her. He/She was attacked 7 times."
[15:58] <doctormo> nigelb: You're the one doing the attacking!
[15:58] <dholbach> doctormo, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~loco-directory-dev/loco-directory/0.2/annotate/head:/COPYING
[15:58] <nigelb> doctormo: No, I don't attack jcastro
[15:59] <doctormo> dholbach: mhall says launchpad says GPL only.
[15:59] <paultag> doctormo, we've talked about this downtown ;)
[15:59] <dholbach> https://edge.launchpad.net/loco-directory
[15:59] <dholbach> Licenses:
[15:59] <dholbach> GNU Affero GPL v3
[15:59] <paultag> doctormo, sorry, i read that wrong
[15:59] <nigelb> ohai there paultag
[15:59] <paultag> nigelb, ohai
[16:00] <doctormo> paultag: Different and old flamewar.
[16:00] <nigelb> paultag: got some time for a chat?
[16:00] <paultag> nigelb, yessir :)
[16:00] <paultag> doctormo, ahha
[16:03] <akgraner> whew - I am learning to be quiet :-)  - awesome!
[16:03] <nigelb> akgraner: haha
[16:03] <nigelb> I should talk less
[16:03] <nigelb> but this is like the chatroom to be!
[16:08] <nigelb> hahaha
[16:08] <nigelb> seen on facebook "read somewhere that Microsoft is going to make smartphones..wonder where they'll fit Ctrl, Alt and Del keys.."
[16:08]  * nigelb totally LOL'd at that one :)
[16:08] <duanedesign> geesh. My connection is terrible today
[16:09] <highvoltage> popey: so? can you give me access?
[16:11] <duanedesign> nigelb: have you seen this xkcd http://revista.python.org.ar/1/html-en/xkcd.html
[16:11] <JFo> you talk more than me akgraner... WIN! \o/
[16:11] <scott-work> lol nigelb
[16:11] <akgraner> DOH!
[16:11] <nigelb> duanedesign: looking
[16:11] <nigelb> scott-work: heh
[16:12] <nigelb> duanedesign: hahaha
[16:12] <nigelb> good one
[16:12] <nigelb> I think it can be updated to windows visa
[16:12] <duanedesign> :)
[16:12] <duanedesign> right!
[16:13] <duanedesign> that is a magazine published by py-argentina. They just recently translated it to English
[16:13] <popey> highvoltage: what do you need?
[16:14] <doctormo> XKCD, bah, that Randall put himself on his own map of the internet.
[16:14] <popey> haha
[16:15] <sense> good afternoon
[16:15] <doctormo> I think I'm going to go down to Sommerville and shake my fist at his ball pit (yes he does have a ball pit)
[16:15] <highvoltage> popey: I guess I need the login details or otherwise rights to change the channel theming
[16:19] <popey> phew, finally when I ask people not to act up on ubuntu-users people are speaking up in support!
[16:20] <akgraner> popey, nice!
[16:28] <czajkowski> hmm no jono
[16:36] <nigelb> czajkowski: ^^
[16:37] <czajkowski> jono: you free?
[16:37] <jono> czajkowski, kinda
[16:37] <jono> whats up?
[16:37] <czajkowski> stuff I talked about the other day with you
[17:34] <nigelb> who's got experience with python's subprocess module?
[17:45] <doctormo> nigelb: me
[17:46] <nigelb> doctormo: I think I'll need your help in some time.  Let me see if I can do magic on my own :)
[17:46] <doctormo> nigelb: Sure thing, let me know when you need my python voodoo.
[17:47] <nigelb> doctormo: thanks :)
[17:53] <Technoviking> morning all
[17:56] <Technoviking> at the booth at the Utah Open Source Conference
[17:57] <jcastro> hi teh
[17:57] <jcastro> er, Technoviking
[17:57] <jcastro> <--- autocomplete fail
[17:58] <nigelb> more like typing fail
[17:58] <Technoviking> I should Skype some folks in later
[18:02] <czajkowski> Technoviking: cool, how big is the event
[18:03] <Technoviking> about 750 people last year
[18:05] <czajkowski> Technoviking: pretty big
[18:10] <nigelb> doctormo: ping.  Can I PM? :)
[18:11] <doctormo> nigelb: sure
[18:13] <Technoviking> need tshirt swag
[18:17] <Technoviking> http://yfrog.com/jk5g4vj
[18:18] <doctormo> Technoviking: Nice, needs banner too.
[18:19] <Technoviking> doctormo: my big printer died:(
[18:23] <doctormo> Technoviking: You can order one for your loco team...
[18:23] <Technoviking> doctormo: hopefully next year we can get the loaner booth
[18:29] <Technoviking> the Fedora booth are being snarky
[18:30] <JFo> who is there for Fedora Technoviking?
[18:30] <JFo> that isn't normally like them
[18:36] <jcastro> Technoviking: are they burning ubuntu CDs again?
[18:40] <jcastro> sooo, jill yells "I need your help getting the cat in the bag to take him to the vet."
[18:40] <jcastro> so I am thinking "ok, just a minute"
[18:40] <jcastro> I look like I've been mauled by 15 lions.
[18:41] <sense> Cats can be vicious indeed.
[18:41] <Technoviking> jcastro: tender vittles in a cat carrier
[18:41] <jussi> large welding gloves ftw ;)
[18:41] <popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0ffwDYo00Q
[18:41] <popey> ^^^^ all cats
[18:41] <jcastro> I am proud of the little guy, instead of just scratching me randomly he dug into my chest, gunning for the heart.
[18:42] <Pendulum> jcastro: just think you'll have sexy battle scars :P
[18:42] <jcastro> or I'll be dead!
[18:42]  * JFo plays Cat Scratch Fever
[18:44] <nigelb> This is precicely why I dodn't like cats
[18:44] <nigelb> Dogs have owners, cats own YOU
[18:45] <JFo> nah, cats have staff
[18:46] <sense> Cats don't own or are owned, they just appropriate themselves whatever they need.
[18:46] <jcastro> he'll pay for letting me live; he's tired, I just need to find him and spring the trap
[18:56] <Pendulum> I <3 cats
[18:56] <JFo> taste great
[18:57] <JFo> with a little salt that is
[18:57] <JFo> cats need salt
[18:57] <JFo> :)
[19:07] <jono> JFo, I physically LOLed
[19:07] <JFo> :)
[19:08] <JFo> I try to get you to laugh daily jono
[19:08] <czajkowski> JFo: is this how you cope with bug reports :p
[19:08] <JFo> no, I'm crazy from that... there is no coping
[19:09] <JFo> I'm so burnt out on bugs right now I am like a struck match
[19:10]  * Pendulum hugs JFo
[19:10] <JFo> thanks Pendulum :)
[19:10] <JFo> I have 11000 bug mails that I have yet to read too
[19:10]  * czajkowski hugs the crazies in ubuntu-community-team
[19:10] <JFo> just can't get motivated to look at them
[19:11] <czajkowski> JFo: I cant bribe you with white choclate and JD can I, that works wonders with me
[19:11] <JFo> nah, I need to lose weight now
[19:11] <JFo> waiting for my treadmil to get here tomorrow
[19:12] <jcastro> JFo: it sucks, ellipticals ftl.
[19:12] <JFo> yeah, I am going to try walking on the tread during the day
[19:12] <Pendulum> is everyone I know on a diet? it's starting to feel that way :-/
[19:12] <JFo> I have GOT to get out of this chair
[19:13] <JFo> Pendulum, no, I'm not on a diet
[19:13] <JFo> I just need to move more than I do
[19:13] <Pendulum> JFo: ah, fair enough :)
[19:13] <jcastro> 20 more pounds is all I need
[19:13] <JFo> I need ever so much more than 20 :)
[19:14] <JFo> my doctor says that in order not to be considered obese I need to lose 100
[19:14] <JFo> \which would put me under 200
[19:14] <JFo> which would make me a little guy
[19:14] <JFo> I told him I'd lose 'some'
[19:14] <JFo> but it would be no 100 lbs :)
[19:14] <jcastro> I started lifting
[19:14] <jcastro> I am heavier but less fatty
[19:15] <Pendulum> heh
[19:15] <JFo> I plan to do cardio first and then lift
[19:15] <JFo> need to cut before I build
[19:15] <Pendulum> I was not criticising (considering I'm doing the diet/exercise thing myself)
[19:16] <JFo> Pendulum, I understand :)
[19:16] <jcastro> my sugar tests came back way better last time so I am making progress
[19:16] <Pendulum> jcastro: yay!
[19:16] <JFo> I am afraid of what mine look like
[19:16] <jcastro> I'll have my gear at UDS, I'd be more than happy to confirm what you probably already know. :p
[19:17] <jcastro> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ubuntutheproject-community-n-launchpad-for-upstreams
[19:17] <jcastro> JFo: sub to that please
[19:17] <jcastro> that shall be our annual lp grilling
[19:17] <JFo> loadin
[19:18] <JFo> done
[19:18] <JFo> works for me jcastro
[19:18] <JFo> I still owe you a plan for how we deal with +patches
[19:19] <jcastro> you owe me docs for the forums too
[19:19] <jcastro> but I don't expect interest in them anyway
[19:19] <JFo> yep
[19:19] <JFo> well... we will discuss at UDS :)
[19:19] <czajkowski> I folks are going to UDS can you please update your details into https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDS-N/Attendees
[19:19] <czajkowski> *if
[19:20] <Pici> ooh, figlet
[19:21] <JFo> I so listen to the wrong kind of music when working
[19:21] <JFo> :)
[19:21] <jcastro> ugh, lp keeps logging me out today
[19:21] <JFo> jcastro, don't get me started
[19:21]  * JFo stabs malone
[19:21] <jcastro> yeah
[19:23] <czajkowski> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLeuRLhoexg  blaring while I tackle emails
[19:23] <czajkowski> by taackling I mean mailing everyone else with action items :)
[19:24] <JFo> <- listening to Kid Rock
[19:24] <JFo> and catching myself singing it
[19:24] <JFo> and I jump genres too much... was listening to Utah Saints and The Crystal Method earlier
[19:47] <doctormo> Why did I skip calculus at the sixth form I didn't go to!
[20:37] <Pendulum> doctormo: huh?
[21:50] <doctormo> Woot, finally finished.
[21:51] <doctormo> nigelb: Are you still here?
[21:51] <nigelb> doctormo: yup
[21:51] <nigelb> doctormo: Here's my reason for staying up till 2:30 am -> http://github.com/nigelbabu/git-impact-graph
[21:52] <nigelb> paultag: ^^ I haz something for you :)
[21:56] <doctormo> nigelb: http://divajutta.com/doctormo/report/ubuntu-community-team.svg <- this is what I just completed.
[21:56] <doctormo> jono: this is a community connectivity graph: ^ you may be interested.
[21:57] <doctormo> Although it is 10pm in London, so he's probably down the pub.
[21:58] <AlanBell> sweet, what is that based on doctormo?
[22:00] <AlanBell> are the lines based on the number of times someone says someone else's nick?
[22:00] <doctormo> AlanBell: IRC logs in this channel between the dates. It's basically a connectivity graph.
[22:01] <doctormo> Basically
[22:01] <AlanBell> cool stuff
[22:01] <nigelb> I'm like at the center :p
[22:01] <AlanBell> I have never spoken to Pendulum
[22:01] <AlanBell> oh, have now
[22:02] <doctormo> nigelb: You talk a lot to everyone :-P
[22:02] <nigelb> AlanBell: *blink* you never have?
[22:02] <doctormo> Code for those interested: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~doctormo/doctormo-random/irc-graphing/files
[22:02] <AlanBell> nigelb: surprised me too
[22:03] <AlanBell> pretty hard to work it out for everyone else, but Pendulum is right next to me and there is no connecting line
[22:03] <AlanBell> between me and Pendulum
[22:04] <nigelb> Now there should be :p
[22:05] <nigelb> I have now learned that python sucks with array keying compared to php
[22:10] <paultag> nigelb, what's up?
[22:10] <nigelb> paultag: http://github.com/nigelbabu/git-impact-graph
[22:11] <nigelb> (work in progress)
[22:12] <paultag> nigelb, kickass :)
[22:13] <nigelb> paultag: I'll get it something for fancy over the weekend :D
[22:13] <paultag> nigelb, for sure, for sure
[22:14] <paultag> nigelb, I never knew your github
[22:14] <paultag> nigelb, folowing you now :)
[22:14] <nigelb> paultag: first project on github :)
[22:14] <nigelb> I signed up to branch cakephp and submit a fork for merging I think
[22:14] <nigelb> but instead submitted a patch :p
[22:14] <paultag> nigelb, haha aye
[22:17] <doctormo> nigelb: What is it about python lists that are defective compared to php?
[22:18] <nigelb> doctormo: I couldn't key it as easily I could key php
[22:18] <doctormo> nigelb: I don't know how more flexible lists could be keyed, the python implimentation seems perfect, much better than perl.
[22:18] <doctormo> nigelb: Can you give me an example?
[22:19] <nigelb> doctormo: in php I do
[22:19] <doctormo> nigelb: proceed
[22:19] <nigelb> foreach($line in $array):
[22:20] <nigelb> gah
[22:20] <nigelb> I'm too sleepy to type it out
[22:20] <nigelb> morning
[22:22] <doctormo> nigelb: That looks very possible in python. for line in array:
[22:23] <nigelb> doctormo: there's more
[22:23] <nigelb> how do you have string keys?
[22:23] <doctormo> nigelb: That's a dictionary, not a list.
[22:24] <nigelb> doctormo: I shall look at that code again when I'm sane
[22:24] <doctormo> doing for x in y: is an iterator. You can make your own itterators with yield (which is fun). To iterate over a dictionary you just have to decide what it is you want to iterate over.
[22:25] <nigelb> doctormo: can I iterate over a dicationary and creaaate fields dynamically?
[22:25] <doctormo> for key in dict.keys(): or for (key, value) in dict.iteritems(): etc
[22:25] <nigelb> we should continue this conversation in about 5 hours when I'm sane
[22:25] <nigelb> 3 am isn't my best
[22:25] <doctormo> nigelb: Get more sleep than 5 hours :-)
[22:26] <nigelb> nah, work
[22:26] <nigelb> TGIF :D
[22:56] <highvoltage> jcastro: I updated the theme on http://www.youtube.com/user/ubuntudevelopers , let me know if it's ok or if there's something you'd like changed
[22:57] <jcastro> that's way better than before!
[22:59] <pleia2> doctormo: hm, where does it get the pictures?
[23:00] <nigelb> pleia2: gravatar apparently
[23:00]  * nigelb goes to bed for real.
[23:00] <pleia2> ah
[23:18] <doctormo> pleia2: headochies from planet ubuntu
[23:20] <doctormo> Some people don't show because their headochi is differently named, I think your was lyz.png instead of pleia2.png
[23:20] <nhandler> doctormo: Isn't it hackergotchi
[23:20] <doctormo> nhandler: Some kind of shrunken head thing.
[23:21] <pleia2> yeah, my lp name is different than my irc nick
[23:22]  * nhandler is installing the perl modules to run the script.
[23:22] <nhandler> Later, I'll modify it to work with my local irssi logs
[23:24] <doctormo> nhandler: The processing time on the Aesthetic graph goes up exponentially with more nodes.
[23:25] <nhandler> doctormo: I'll look at the code. I might take out some of the graph stuff and just focus on the hard data
[23:26] <doctormo> nhandler: It's seperate anyway, just use the generate-index and generate-connections scripts for your data mining.
[23:26] <nhandler> One thing I've wanted to do for a while is load my irssi logs into a database of some sort so that I could run queries on it. I just need to come up with a good/logical way to store it
[23:26] <doctormo> But do pass back your irssi mods, I could use them for double checking.
[23:27] <nhandler> Hmm...I just ran the generate-all scrript, and I ended up with all 'Linked image not found' circles
[23:29] <nhandler> doctormo: Is it just looking for the nick change messages to determine aliases (for the most part)?
[23:30] <doctormo> nhandler: Ah your right I didn't commit the default circle
[23:31] <doctormo> nhandler: There is a users.aliases file it will accept for manual connections too.
[23:31] <nhandler> doctormo: Yeah, I saw that mentioned in the code.
[23:32] <doctormo> nhandler: The date related indexing it for eventual animation.
[23:45] <jcastro> highvoltage: great job, it doesn't make my eyes bleed
[23:45] <highvoltage> jcastro: what a co-incidence! that was the goal
[23:47] <akgraner> News Team Meeting in 12 minutes if anyone wants to pop in
[23:47] <akgraner> ubuntu-news


[19:08] <blkperl> slangasek: is there a way to set apport settings? It asks me the same questions every single time
[19:17] <slangasek> blkperl: not to my knowledge; you can set it to not submit crash reports at all, but if you want it to submit them I don't think there's a way to auto-submit
[19:21] <blkperl> slangasek: the user expierence is severly lacking in apport :)
[19:21] <blkperl> should I file a bug?
[19:21] <blkperl> :P
[19:22] <blkperl> my number one issue with it is it uses popups, then thinks for a while, then creates a new popup
[19:28] <slangasek> feel free to file bugs, yes :)