[07:34] <ara> good morning
[11:35] <davmor2> morning all
[11:57] <davmor2> ara: don't tell me you moved to Germany just to get free last.fm,  that's really drastic ;)
[12:00] <ara> davmor2, hehehe :D
[12:00] <ara> davmor2, no, but it is a side benefit


[12:21] <oSoMoN> tsdgeos, is bug #1654974 still affecting you?
[12:21] <tsdgeos> let me see
[12:26] <tsdgeos> oSoMoN: there's your answer :D
[12:26] <tsdgeos> yes, it still locks me up
[12:26] <tsdgeos> food, bbl
[12:27] <oSoMoN> tsdgeos, ack, thanks
[12:28] <greyback> oSoMoN: I tried it here, no lock-up for me
[12:30] <oSoMoN> interesting
[12:30] <oSoMoN> greyback, tsdgeos: I upgraded to zesty yesterday, so I’ll test it myself
[12:31] <greyback> might be gpu specific
[13:07] <tsdgeos> greyback: probably?
[13:50] <greyback> tsdgeos: probably??
[13:51] <tsdgeos> greyback: i mean could be lots of other things (the webbrowser-app crash)
[13:56] <greyback> tsdgeos: yeah, it only one of many possibilities
[14:57] <shakes808> Hello all,  I just seen this article from someone in the office: https://goo.gl/sHDTe4  Is Touch in the same boat or is it more secure?
[14:58] <dobey> would have to know exact details of how each attack works on android 4.4 and 5.1 to say for sure
[14:59] <shakes808> Yeah, those details are going to be a little more difficult to find.  How close is Android to Ubuntu?  I know they are both built from Linux.
[15:00] <dobey> the ubuntu phone/tablet images have to use android for the kernel and drivers to get the hardware to work. the android services bits that are needed are in a container though
[15:01] <shakes808> interesting.
[15:02] <shakes808> thank you dobey
[15:05] <dobey> so in some ways it is more secure, but ubuntu phone/tablet images don't yet have encrypted storage support, so in some ways not as secure. and it will depend on specific attacks on whether it's protected against or not
[15:05] <dobey> i think a lot of the attacks are actually malware that has to be installed in android though
[15:19] <mterry> tedg: I'm testing UAL on deb-based-unity8 some more and see more examples of missing icons.  For example, "Brightness & Lock" uses an icon name of "system-lock-screen" -- this is stored in the "actions" subfolder of most icon themes, but UAL only looks at the "apps" subfolder.  Do you want to grow the icon search to be more robust/complicated (more complete
[15:19] <mterry> .theme parsing etc), bandaid patch for now to add a couple common subfolders (actions, status), or what?
[15:22] <tedg> mterry: I think we probably need to grow it :-(  None of the toolkits exposed enough of their parsing that we could use it. So we're gonna have to grow our own.
[15:22] <tedg> mterry: FYI that is larryprice's code there, so good to ask him if you have questions.
[15:23] <dobey> mterry, tedg: we should probably patch those classic system settings things to not show up in unity8 perhaps.
[15:24] <larryprice> hmm thought i had fixed ual to recursively find app icons... though that could have just been desktop files
[15:25] <mterry> larryprice: it's definitely got some smarts, just happens to not check theme dirs that aren't 'apps'
[15:26] <larryprice> mterry, o yeah that makes sense actually
[15:26] <larryprice> wouldn't be too difficult to add that in... i can look into it
[15:27] <mterry> larryprice: OK that would be swell, probably faster for you than me, you know the code
[15:27] <mterry> larryprice: I was using bug 1669913 for UAL icon issues in deb-u8
[15:28] <larryprice> mterry, great thanks
[15:35] <mterry> larryprice: I'm going through the icons I can see on my laptop that are missing.  So far I've seen icons that live in actions, places, mimes, mimetypes...  So yeah, looks like you need full index.theme parsing
[15:36] <larryprice> mterry, heh ouch
[15:36] <larryprice> mterry, tbh i was about to task switch so this was a great time for this problem to come up
[15:37] <mterry> :)
[15:45] <shakes808> For your phones and tablets, are there any more being built and sold or are they all going to be rooted from here on out?
[15:50] <larryprice> tedg, having trouble building u-a-l on zesty? i've installed the deps using mk-build-deps. https://paste.ubuntu.com/24139540/
[15:52] <dobey> shakes808: that's a question for manufacturers to answer. we couldn't answer about unannounced devices in here, even if we knew. :)
[15:55] <tedg> larryprice: You need the glib in proposed, I thought it'd migrated by now (uploaded yesterday)
[15:55] <shakes808> dobey: :) HAHA gotcha.  I just see that they are all sold out ( tablets and phones ) on the website.  And I know a few years ago you had the Ubuntu Edge on Indigogo.  I was really looking forward to that.  Is that a completely dead project or is it still in development?
[15:55] <tedg> larryprice: But if you're just working on it you can ignore that failure
[15:55] <larryprice> tedg, heh ok
[15:55] <dobey> shakes808: the edge didn't reach funding goal, so not happening
[15:56] <shakes808> :| that sucks.
[15:56] <shakes808> is there a possibility that something of that caliber will be released ever?
[15:57] <larryprice> anything's possible
[15:58] <dobey> no idea. we don't make hardwre here. :)
[15:58] <larryprice> plenty of people seem to be interested in such a device, that's for sure
[16:00] <larryprice> mterry, do you think it's fine to continue to limit the theme dirs to those 4 (adwaita, humanity, gnome, hicolor)? or do you think we'll need to include everything...
[16:01] <mterry> larryprice: for now it's fine I think, those are all reasonable fallbacks -- at some point we should actually respect theme
[16:02] <mterry> larryprice: suru is notably missing...  but that's not really a fallback so much as a real theme
[16:02] <larryprice> right - there seems to still be an open question of what "theme" will mean in a native unity8 world
[16:04] <mterry> larryprice: we don't allow setting it...  but UAL could pick something up from env if it were set by unity8...  or notice it's in u8 and use suru...  Or just assume it's in u8 and use suru. not sure
[16:07] <dobey> larryprice, mterry: bigger problem is there is no unity-settings-daemon running for apps started in xmir
[16:13] <mterry> I believe uitk just hardcodes icon lookup as suru
[16:17] <dobey> well uitk hardocdes everything as suru
[16:18] <dobey> but uitk apps will work under xcb qpa with different icon theme set, as long as the theme has the icons
[16:18] <dobey> i think
[16:18] <dobey> ie under unity7
[16:19] <dobey> but x11 apps under xmir in unity8 are all a hodgepodge of themes. some are humanity, some are plain gtk. none of the Xatoms get set to make things work
[16:36] <larryprice> although it seems we can't limit ourselves to just "Applications" type icons, it seems a bit irresponsible to parse *all* the dirs... deciding which ones to skip seems a little arbitrary, though
[16:38] <larryprice> although i can now say with confidence all my icons are visible
[16:38] <larryprice> and it didn't seem any slower
[17:25] <dobey> larryprice: well, really, we should probabl actually follow the spec
[17:26] <larryprice> dobey, currently i'm "following the spec" as in iterating through the dirs listed in index.theme - not sure if the spec tells us which "types" are appropriate, since we were surprised to see "devices" and "places" icons used for apps
[17:27] <larryprice> for reference: https://standards.freedesktop.org/icon-theme-spec/icon-theme-spec-latest.html
[17:28] <larryprice> Places not even listed on freedesktop... /me sighs at liberal spec use
[17:31] <dobey> places is listed in freedesktop
[17:33] <larryprice> i'll happily take a reference link if the one i posted is wrong/outdated
[17:33] <dobey> https://standards.freedesktop.org/icon-naming-spec/icon-naming-spec-latest.html
[17:33] <dobey> the icon theme spec doesn't specify contexts
[17:33] <dobey> or well, it doesn't specify all the contexts
[17:34] <dobey> i mean, it doesn't list apps in the icon theme spec either in that section
[17:34] <dobey> that whole subsection should just be removed from the icon theme spec
[17:34] <dobey> but eh, whatever
[17:42] <mterry> larryprice: if you want to get real fun, implement Inherits support and do recursive icon theme parsing
[17:43] <larryprice> alt i  could be a few minutes from finished with a working impl...
[17:43] <larryprice> :)
[17:45] <dobey> or just use glib to do it
[17:45] <dobey> instead of re-implementing stuff with bugs :)
[17:46] <larryprice> i could limit the search to Applications, Devices, and Places, which seem to be the 3 contexts that apps use... that way we don't unnecessarily parse through MimeTypes, Emotes, International,  etc.
[17:47] <mterry> larryprice: one app used "categories" too.  Another used mimes/mimetypes -- some icon themes had one or the other name for that
[17:47] <dobey> well we aren't "parsing" them
[17:47] <dobey> we're building a single file name and then testing if the file exists, for each directory
[17:47] <larryprice> mterry, ick ok - i'm just going to leave it alone at this point
[17:48] <dobey> and most of these "apps" should be hidden in unity8 anyway i think
[18:01] <larryprice> mterry: wasn't sure whether to merge into your branch or main, so i chose main https://code.launchpad.net/~larryprice/ubuntu-app-launch/better-icon-themes/+merge/319358
[18:03] <dobey> larryprice: i guess ICON_THEME_DIRS there should be in order of preference, with suru being first
[18:04] <dobey> suru -> Humanity -> Adwaita -> gnome -> hicolor
[18:05] <mterry> larryprice: if you implemented Inherits, you'd just need to specify suru  :P
[18:05] <mterry> I guess you'd miss Adwaita that way
[18:05] <larryprice> so we do want to add suru?
[18:05] <larryprice> easy change
[18:05] <mterry> larryprice: naw I was just joshing
[18:05] <dobey> we don't want to find hicolor icons before everything else
[18:07] <neerad> CONFIG_USER_NS=y causes kernel compilation error how to solve this please
[18:07] <mterry> larryprice: I don't mind you obsoleting my branch at all  :)
[18:09] <larryprice> ok so i'll reorder the list as above (good idea), including the addition of suru?
[18:09]  * larryprice doesn't know much about which themes trump one another
[18:10] <dobey> hicolor is meant to be the ultimate fallback; there should never be anything checked after it
[18:11] <dobey> i'm not sure we would even have Humanity in the list at all there, but with it, the ordering i suggested above seems correct
[18:12] <dobey> larryprice: you can also just have the theme names in that list, and just put "icons" as the argument before that value, in g_build_filename
[18:13] <larryprice> dobey, we're on the same page - i just pushed up a change doing that :)
[19:08] <neerad> constant bootloop
[19:09] <mterry> tedg: using silo 2531 (not sure if it's this silo -- will downgrade in sec to test), a second app launch in unity8 takes down unity8
[19:10] <mterry> oh yeah hard to downgrade out of stable overlay
[19:10] <mterry> can build from trunk
[19:19] <tedg> mterry: I think it's just XMir and U8 -- they're not really friends right now.
[19:28] <mterry> tedg: I'll start looking into why -- do you have any background on that?  presumably out of my graphics-knowledge league
[19:28] <ChrisTownsend> mterry: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtmir/+bug/1670710
[19:29] <tedg> Thanks ChrisTownsend, was just looking for that :-)
[19:29] <mterry> ChrisTownsend: cheers
[19:29] <ChrisTownsend> tedg: I finally beat you to something!
[19:29] <ChrisTownsend> :)
[19:30] <tedg> Haha, I'll get you next time! ;-)
[19:30] <ChrisTownsend> lol
[19:39] <MIkeTheWolf83> Hi there I am trying to install Ubuntu on a Alacatel One Touch pop c1
[19:40] <MIkeTheWolf83> anyone can tell me if that is possible???
[19:41] <MIkeTheWolf83> It is possible to install Ubuntu on a Alacatel One Touch pop c1?????????
[19:44] <OerHeks> MIkeTheWolf83, i see no port here .. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
[19:45] <MIkeTheWolf83> Ok thanks but even if there is no port it is possible????
[19:46] <mimecar> you must use a port in order to install ubuntu touch
[19:46] <mimecar> with not ports, you can't
[19:47] <OerHeks> If you start a port, maybe you can.
[19:47] <mimecar> the other option is create a new port...
[19:49] <OerHeks> Porting is not that easy, https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/phone/devices/porting-new-device/
[19:53] <MIkeTheWolf83> thanks everyone I quite understand
[19:53] <MIkeTheWolf83> do not think I could create a new port
[19:54] <MIkeTheWolf83> I just asked because the matter is very interesting and have that phone with no use and wanted to experiment
[20:02] <neerad> neerad@neerad-Satellite-L850 ~/phablet_CM_12.1/out/target/product/wt88047 $ abootimg -i boot.img
[20:02] <neerad> Android Boot Image Info:
[20:02] <neerad> * file name = boot.img
[20:02] <neerad> * image size = 8361984 bytes (7.97 MB)
[20:02] <neerad>   page size  = 2048 bytes
[20:02] <neerad> * Boot Name = ""
[20:02] <neerad> * kernel size       = 7566616 bytes (7.22 MB)
[20:02] <neerad>   ramdisk size      = 618925 bytes (0.59 MB)
[20:02] <neerad> * load addresses:
[20:02] <neerad>   kernel:       0x10008000
[20:02] <neerad>   ramdisk:      0x12000000
[20:02] <neerad>   tags:         0x11e00000
[20:02] <neerad> * empty cmdline
[20:02] <neerad> * id = 0x3b9aebda 0xa1e37ea2 0xfa56a91f 0x7f3a21df 0xe8a9949b 0x00000000 0x00000000 0x00000000
[20:02] <neerad> boot.img is empty no command line ?
[20:02] <dobey> neerad: pastebin in future please :)
[20:03] <neerad> okay but please give the solution ?
[20:03] <dobey> sorry i do not know
[20:03] <neerad> What does your boot.img kernel command line contains ?
[20:05] <dobey> i don't know
[20:05] <dobey> i don't have any phones with ubuntu running on them and powered on, and i've not done any device porting
[21:26] <neerad> Bootloop continously ?


[04:47] <InHisName1> any Pidgin users here ?     Want at least 36 - 48, if I can change it.
[05:33] <ChinnoDog> KyleYankan: Where are you located? And, are there repeater networks we can both reach?
[10:56] <rmg51> Morning
[11:07] <lazypower> Morning rmg51
[13:30] <ChinnoDog> Morning
[13:30] <jedijf> morning
[13:32] <jedijf> ChinnoDog: congrats and you got general too!
[13:32] <jedijf> ChinnoDog: look for w3wan in your area - should have a repeater - it's allstar system
[13:34] <jedijf> http://www.wanrepeater.com/
[13:34] <jedijf> i talk to one of the core members usually every morning from 5-6am tim
[13:38] <jedijf> http://wanrepeater.net/WAN_Repeater_System.php
[14:33] <ChinnoDog> There is one in DC
[14:37] <sadin> morning all
[14:37] <sadin> long time no irc :D
[14:37] <ChinnoDog> I get nothing on 2m from DC and get blips of static from 70cm.
[14:37] <ChinnoDog> hi sadin
[14:38] <sadin> Im stuck in bed ChinnoDog got my wisdom teeth out
[14:39] <ChinnoDog> I am 15 floors up. I should be able to receive a lot.
[14:44] <KyleYankan> ChinnoDog: what radio are you using?
[14:44] <ChinnoDog> Baofeng UV-5R Plus
[14:45] <KyleYankan> Your building might be the problem. Concrete, steel, etc. Try taking a walk?
[14:46] <ChinnoDog> I was on the porch yesterday trying to get a different signal
[14:46] <ChinnoDog> I could go to the roof.
[14:46] <ChinnoDog> I heard CW on the 70cm station a few minutes ago.
[14:46] <KyleYankan> Which 70cm station? A lot of repeaters and some users use it to identify their call.
[14:47] <ChinnoDog> I don't hear any beacons on it. 447.675 in DC
[14:47] <ChinnoDog> wanrepeater.net says call is K3WS
[14:47] <KyleYankan> beacons?
[14:48] <KyleYankan> I mean, the CW counts as a beacon AFAIK
[14:48] <KyleYankan> Although many also use a voice announcement as well
[14:48] <ChinnoDog> I thought that repeaters have an automated message to repeat their call sign.
[14:48] <ChinnoDog> So.. the CW could have been it? I can't understand morse yet. :-p
[14:48] <KyleYankan> yep.
[14:49] <ChinnoDog> oh. Well there was actual reception
[14:49] <ChinnoDog> I am still in my apartment
[14:50] <ChinnoDog> If I knew my call sign I would send a test.
[14:51] <KyleYankan> Yeah, you definately don't want to transmit until then.
[14:51] <KyleYankan> Some repeaters( 50/50 in my area) will play a confirm tone when you tx to them.
[14:51] <KyleYankan> As in You key up "K3YLE mobile listening in"
[14:51] <ChinnoDog> I just wanted to listen in to people so I could get a better idea what I should sound like.
[14:51] <KyleYankan> and a second lat erhe repeater goes: "*Beep*" and sometimes identifies then
[14:52] <KyleYankan> w3wan has a broadcastify link
[14:52] <KyleYankan> or tune a few repeaters into the baofegna nd scan
[14:52] <KyleYankan> but first, forgive my typing
[14:53] <JonathanD> no
[14:53] <KyleYankan> JonathanD: You're the worst. Go get your ham license.
[14:53] <KyleYankan> and/or upgrade my linode
[14:53] <KyleYankan> either or.
[14:53] <JonathanD> lol
[14:56] <ChinnoDog> hmm
[14:57] <ChinnoDog> I will need to make a list of nearby repeaters.
[14:57] <KyleYankan> theres websies
[14:57] <KyleYankan> repeaterbook comes to mind
[14:57] <ChinnoDog> Is that the best way? And do they have /all/ of them?
[14:59] <KyleYankan> AFAIk
[14:59] <KyleYankan> and its what I use.
[14:59] <KyleYankan> in fact, Chirp can pull right from it
[14:59] <KyleYankan> if you have a programming cable
[15:02] <JonathanD> we can all leave freenode, start hamnode
[15:03] <KyleYankan> less netsplits
[15:03] <JonathanD> more Id argue.
[15:03] <JonathanD> at least ircds dont sleep
[15:06] <ChinnoDog> I have a cable and installed Chirp, have not used it for programming yet.
[17:27] <ChinnoDog> This is complicated. lol
[17:27] <ChinnoDog> Where does Chirp show the firmware version??
[17:32] <ChinnoDog> I guess it doesn't for this radio.
[19:27] <jedijf> ChinnoDog: chirp works
[19:27] <jedijf> and wan activity now
[19:27] <jedijf> if your listening i'll key up - i'm on web transceiver
[19:28] <jedijf> ChinnoDog: ping me when you're listening
[19:28] <jedijf> i want to try web transceiver now
[22:51] <ChinnoDog> Not yet. I am gathering local repeaters for my radio.
[22:52] <ChinnoDog> Q: Why do nearly all the repeaters have a 88.5hz tone squelch? I see that in Chrip. How am I even supposed to know to set that?
[22:54] <jedijf> ChinnoDog: ctss is the one that matters - like 3kz is mostly 131.8
[22:55] <jedijf> ChinnoDog: repeater networks are the way to go - like w3wan if it's in your area - then within the region you can stay 'connected' as they are linked
[22:55] <jedijf> linked repeater networks
[22:57] <jedijf> and practice manual entry with your baofeng - there will be a time when you need it - while i waited for my callsign to hit the database, i listened and got to know my baofeng
[22:57] <ChinnoDog> I already screwed around with that it a bit. That was confusing.
[22:57] <ChinnoDog> I need a manual for my radio. I can't find one online and it didn't come in the box.
[22:58] <jedijf> frequency mode - only the a - menu 11 - 13 -27 then freq of offset - menu 27 again
[22:58] <jedijf> ChinnoDog: the niklor site - best stuff
[22:58] <jedijf> miklor
[22:58] <ChinnoDog> Oh wait. There is a manual I used that was in the box. It has more info than I thought.
[22:58] <ChinnoDog> I didn't understand the info in it before but since reading stuff online now I do.
[22:59] <jedijf> http://miklor.com/
[22:59] <jedijf> ChinnoDog: the manual has been re-written - use the miklor site - look for newest for your rig
[22:59] <KyleYankan> I just use chirp. I get too annoyed with the menu
[23:00] <jedijf> http://www.miklor.com/uv5r/   <<<has *all* the answers
[23:01] <ChinnoDog> It is a uv-5r+. The "*" is the problem.
[23:03] <ChinnoDog> jedijf: Why do they all use DTCS Code 23?
[23:03] <ChinnoDog> And, why do they use 23 receive DTCS? I thought that the repeater usually removed the tone when it broadcasts.
[23:04] <jedijf> you need to hear the tone so you know when the transmit is done - wait - then key up so everyone doesn't step on each other
[23:05] <jedijf> just set frq - ctss (both) save - then offset freq and save again -
[23:05] <jedijf> that's manual ^^^
[23:06] <jedijf> only the a band in freq mode
[23:06] <ChinnoDog> I thought the repeater broadcasts without the tone though
[23:06] <jedijf> that's the save band (not b)
[23:06] <jedijf> they say that - but they don't
[23:06] <ChinnoDog> i.e. If I get a direct communication the tone will be there. If it comes through repeater then no tone.
[23:06] <ChinnoDog> oh
[23:06] <jedijf> you won't hear until you set - that's old info
[23:07] <ChinnoDog> Now I am extra confused. Why won't I hear until I set it?
[23:07] <ChinnoDog> I thought that if I disable the tone I hear all chatter.
[23:07] <ChinnoDog> meaning the receive tone
[23:07] <jedijf> that was test stuff - real life - if you are setting the channel - when you put in the ctcss - bam - you will hear if there is a transmit
[23:08] <jedijf> maybe that's why your area is dead
[23:08] <jedijf> lol
[23:08] <ChinnoDog> Probably!
[23:08] <jedijf> put in the ctcss'
[23:08] <ChinnoDog> operator error.
[23:08] <ChinnoDog> Why do I need it on to receive??
[23:09] <jedijf> nah, i thought the same thing - that's why, get all this out the way while you wait for callsign to drop
[23:09] <jedijf> to hear
[23:09] <jedijf> you'll see - nike
[23:09] <jedijf> just f'in do it
[23:10] <jedijf> hold on i'll link you one of my chirp csv's
[23:17] <jedijf> i pulled that original file from the repeaterbook chirp feature iirc
[23:23] <ChinnoDog> I just programmed a bunch of stations in
[23:23] <ChinnoDog> Pretty much every 2m and 70cm station within 8-9 mi
[23:32] <jedijf> you'll see, some may have great coverage - the w3wan repeater in philly covers an amazing amount of ground
[23:34] <KyleYankan> it's pretty decent.
[23:35] <jedijf> KyleYankan: and it's 100 feet lower than another repeater, but gets out further - heard some tower talk the other day
[23:36] <KyleYankan> Better antenna / more power?
[23:36] <jedijf> yeah aa3e is 100 ft higher - don't know - they were just ragchewing - could just be a propagation thing
[23:36] <jedijf> like how n3kz philly has weird coverage
[23:37] <jedijf> but dstar aa3e kicks butt
[23:38] <jedijf> n3kz covers well south and west - not so much north and east - it's physically at u of p - i hit kop from home, can't hit philly
[23:39] <jedijf> w3wan is in roxborough - tower central for the philly area
[23:40] <jedijf> ok time to gamble - in ac for the weekend
[23:40] <jedijf> almost bedtime
[23:42] <KyleYankan> Seeya jedijf. I'm packing up to head home


[02:58] <mark920> Does anybody know how to get DVI-D enable using the bootargs omapdss.def_disp=dvi and omapfb.mode=dvi:1024x600MR-24@60 ?
[02:58] <mark920> I dont know how to add these bootargs to the kernel properly
[02:59] <mark920> I tried adding them to the boot.script and through U-boot.
[03:15] <mark920> admin
[07:59] <olegfink1> mythos: hi, is http://pastebin.de/22381 from hp t5[23]35z? and if so, what have you found so far?
[11:17] <xranby> is there a way i can flag a bug in launchpad that this package needs to get rebuilt? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mplayer2/+bug/921621
[11:17] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 921621 in mplayer2 "mplayer: relocation error: mplayer: symbol __aeabi_d2lz, version LIBAVFORMAT_53 not defined in file libavformat.so.53 with link time reference" [Undecided,Fix committed]
[22:18] <goupilapps> hi, i need help, i cannot connect to nettwork with my pandaboard, with ubuntu
[22:21] <j_ack> hallo, how do i enable bluetooth on pandabord (ubuntu 1204) .the blootooth i grayed out.
[22:28] <GrueMaster> goupilapps: Wired or wireless?  I have both working here.  Which Ubuntu release?
[22:29] <GrueMaster> j_ack: Not sure, haven't looked into it.  Could be a firmware issue, waiting on the TI ppa.
[22:29] <j_ack> GrueMaster, ok,thank you


[20:57] <starcraftman> folks Beginners team wiki FG meeting in a few minutes.
[21:01] <lukjad007> Hi
[21:02] <PabloRubianes> hello
[21:02] <jjesse> hello
[21:03] <Rocket2DMn> yo
[21:03] <duanedesign> better, not so many people in #ubuntu-docs
[21:03] <duanedesign> :p
[21:03] <starcraftman> Hey guys, hmmm, maybe wait a few more minutes for any late comers. I shall much on some fresh oatmeal cookies meanwhile.
[21:04] <jjesse> ah i always get confused on the difference between #kde-docs and #ubuntu-doc :)
[21:04] <Rocket2DMn> lol yeah
[21:05] <drs305> I only came for the cake!
[21:05] <jjesse> theres cake?
[21:05] <starcraftman> drs305: what? Who said anything about cake?
[21:05] <duanedesign> Kashi makes a good oatmeal raisin cookie
[21:05] <drs305> starcraftman: You did, yesterday. Check the logs!
[21:05] <Rocket2DMn> i heard there would be an open bar
[21:05] <duanedesign> \o/
[21:06]  * drs305 Admits it might have been only virtual cake ...
[21:06] <starcraftman> drs305: Oh right. Lemme just go fetch it.
[21:06] <PabloRubianes> drs305: any cake is good!
[21:06] <Rocket2DMn> ok starcraftman , let's do this
[21:07] <Rocket2DMn> want me to begin starcraftman ?
[21:07] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: Sure thing. Your up first on agenda. We go by list.
[21:07] <Rocket2DMn> Ok guys, so we finished the Summer of Documentation a few weeks ago, you can see the results here - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/Wiki/SoD2009
[21:08] <Rocket2DMn> Thank you all for your efforts and excellent work!
[21:08] <starcraftman> hear hear, was a good productive effort :).
[21:08] <Rocket2DMn> of course, that doesn't mean that we stop doing work, which leads to the next agenda item: Fall/Winter Activities
[21:09] <Rocket2DMn> As of right now there is nothing we have organized, but wiki work will continue, and anybody interested in system documentation can talk to me or any doc-team member for that matter
[21:09] <Rocket2DMn> Karmic is due out in a few days, so the Wiki will have a bunch of stuff that needs to be updated
[21:10] <Rocket2DMn> if you have any pages that you "maintain", have a look at them soon once you have Karmic up and running and see if anything needs to be changed
[21:10] <lukjad007> o/
[21:10] <Rocket2DMn> go for it lukjad007
[21:10] <lukjad007> If we are not immediately upgrading to karmic, what should we do in the meantime?
[21:11] <starcraftman> lukjad007: virtualbox? Clean up tags? Orphan pages? Lots of things :)
[21:11] <Rocket2DMn> well lukjad007 , nobody owns wiki pages, you don't have ultimate responsibility for them since it's a community effort
[21:11] <Rocket2DMn> You can install in a VM, or ask somebody to review the page for you to see if anythin actually has changed
[21:11] <lukjad007> starcraftman Good points, just asking for suggestions.
[21:12] <Rocket2DMn> otherwise, just wait and have a look after you do upgrade, in that time, perhaps somebody else will step forward and update the page
[21:12] <drs305> o/
[21:12] <Rocket2DMn> oterhwise, yes, there are other tasks :)
[21:12] <Rocket2DMn> go ahead drs305
[21:13] <drs305> Graphics w/ backgrounds still use LTS (Hardy)?
[21:13] <Rocket2DMn> drs305, if screenshots already exist on pages and are still applicable, then you can keep the old ones.  If things have changed, then new screenshots are needed
[21:14] <Rocket2DMn> that may require pages to be refactored to support older and newer versions
[21:14] <Rocket2DMn> if you are doing fresh screenshots, use the latest release
[21:14] <drs305> Ok, but I'm NOT using any with that yellow background!
[21:14] <drs305> Ok.
[21:15] <Rocket2DMn> haha, drs305 if the material is the same between Hardy and Karmic, you can use Hardy :)
[21:15] <drs305> ty
[21:15] <starcraftman> drs305: or just take screenshots limited to the window of the program, avoids background.
[21:15] <Rocket2DMn> I think the most important thing is that you use the default theme, the background image isn't as important
[21:15] <drs305> That's what I normally do starcraftman
[21:16] <starcraftman> drs305: roger, just noting.
[21:16] <Rocket2DMn> Any other questions?
[21:17] <Rocket2DMn> Ok, next agenda item is Other doc team activities
[21:17] <Rocket2DMn> I don't think anything out of the ordinary is going on
[21:17] <Rocket2DMn> You can always see Doc Team wiki tasks here - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Wiki/Tasks
[21:17] <duanedesign> we are still using https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Beginners/Development ?
[21:17] <Rocket2DMn> duanedesign, yeah, for internal usage.  At some point I need to put something together for the whole doc team to use, at mdke's request
[21:18] <Rocket2DMn> at that time we'll migrate
[21:18] <Rocket2DMn> System documentation also has tasks here - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/Tasks
[21:18] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: Sounds good. Still gonna be a system based on the wiki though?
[21:18] <Rocket2DMn> so if anybody is interested in writing material from scratch, there are some options there
[21:19] <Rocket2DMn> starcraftman, yes
[21:19] <starcraftman> I'd just like to note, these links all listed under the Current Tasks section of the homepage :)
[21:19] <Rocket2DMn> starcraftman, in fact, it may be a good idea to just give a link to the doc team list so we don't duplicate material
[21:19] <lukjad007> afk, brb.
[21:20] <Rocket2DMn> it would help us integrate even better with the doc team
[21:20] <Rocket2DMn> If anybody has suggestions or ideas for tasks or improvements in any way, please don't hesitate to bring them forward to the doc team directly
[21:20] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: Sure thing. If ya need a hand on new track system, long as I'm around I'll try and help.
[21:21] <Rocket2DMn> any questions about tasks?
[21:21] <Rocket2DMn> sure thing starcraftman
[21:21] <duanedesign> what is this doc team list?
[21:22] <Rocket2DMn> duanedesign, the doc team mailing list is here - https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-doc
[21:22] <starcraftman> duanedesign: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/Wiki#Joining%20the%20Teams
[21:22] <Rocket2DMn> that is their primary form of communication since IRC isn't as popular as it is with the BT
[21:22] <starcraftman> Ah, rats, Rocket2DMn by 5 seconds.
[21:22] <duanedesign> oh ok the ,ailing list
[21:22] <duanedesign> *mailing
[21:23] <Rocket2DMn> Ok, well then my final announcement today is this: I am stepping down from the lead position in the Wiki FG and handing over leadership to starcraftman .  It's been a year and a half since we formed the FG, and I'd like to give somebody else a chance, as well as free up some time for myself
[21:24]  * starcraftman dons requisite crown ready to become a tyrant.
[21:24] <Rocket2DMn> A handful of Wiki FG members spoke a couple of weeks ago and everybody supported him for leadership
[21:24] <Rocket2DMn> I believe he is looking for a co-lead as well, that is further down on the agenda
[21:24] <drs305> All hail the RocketMan! Well done!
[21:24] <Rocket2DMn> I'll still be around of course :)
[21:25] <Rocket2DMn> thanks drs305 , i can't believe it's been as long as it has
[21:25]  * PabloRubianes claps!!
[21:25] <Rocket2DMn> thank you thank you, i accept donations via check or paypal
[21:25] <Rocket2DMn> ;)
[21:25] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: ya deserve the break, former boss. Take it easy and relax to some DT :)
[21:25] <duanedesign> I have been reADINg the doc team mailing list rather religiously lately interested in any doc team activities at UDS
[21:25] <drs305> Seriously.  Great job putting the team together and all the work you did.
[21:26] <Rocket2DMn> duanedesign, are you going to UDS?
[21:26] <drs305> Now The king is dead. Long live the king. All hail starcraftman
[21:26] <duanedesign> Rocket2DMn: That is the plan
[21:26] <duanedesign> :)
[21:26] <Rocket2DMn> duanedesign, very cool dude, there was an email thread about UDS which I think you saw.  Pics or it didn't happen!
[21:26] <starcraftman> drs305: You have a bright future. :)
[21:27] <drs305> It's NEVER too early to suck up.
[21:27] <Rocket2DMn> lol ok guys, let's keep moving so we don't drag this out
[21:27] <Rocket2DMn> Saj0577, are you here?
[21:28] <starcraftman> duanedesign: I wish I could go, they need to hold one near Montreal again.
[21:28] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: nope, I was told PabloRubianes filling in for edu.
[21:28] <PabloRubianes> Saj0577 won't be here... some problems with a friend... he was taking him to hospital...
[21:28] <duanedesign> I am lucky it is in Dallas 4 hours from me
[21:28] <starcraftman> duanedesign: rubbing it in eh? You going far, not so much...
[21:28] <Rocket2DMn> ok PabloRubianes , then the floor is yours, enlighten us as to what is happening with edu FG and it's effec ton the Wiki FG
[21:28] <duanedesign> I am working on a wiki page(s) for Launchpad. This is a project with me and Pablo right now
[21:29] <duanedesign> sorry go ahead PabloRubianes
[21:29] <PabloRubianes> duanedesign just tell everything ;-)
[21:29] <duanedesign> :x
[21:30] <PabloRubianes> now we are working on google docs... and we are goona use that material for launchpad wiki page, tutorials for edu FG, and for the launchpad FG
[21:31] <PabloRubianes> I imagine that Saj0577 was trying to find more people to help with the job
[21:32] <duanedesign> yes I just did the 'getting started' section and Bodhi is working on a packaging blog post which i am hoping to use :)
[21:32] <PabloRubianes> because this topic could be a inter FG work
[21:33] <duanedesign> But Launchpad is a fairly complex with a lot of tools. The result will be used between the Ubuntu wiki and the Education FG
[21:33] <Rocket2DMn> Don't forget to integrate with existing resources when working on any kind of documentation.
[21:33] <starcraftman> PabloRubianes: hmmm, didn't he want to talk about getting mentors from the FG to follow people after they pass through new Wiki course he was planning? I could be wrong, that's what told me I think.
[21:34] <duanedesign> Rocket2DMn: good point. Their is a lot already donee on the Launchpad wiki
[21:35] <duanedesign> Rocket2DMn: in a case like that is it better, in your opinion, to link to LP or duplicate the documentation w/ attribution
[21:35] <PabloRubianes> starcraftman: i don't know that Saj0577 ask me in a rush to be here...
[21:36] <PabloRubianes> starcraftman: he told me you could explain...
[21:36] <Rocket2DMn> duanedesign, better to link rather than to duplicate material.  That means if the original documentaiton changes, you don' thave to keep up
[21:36] <starcraftman> PabloRubianes: ah, hmmm, lemme get my logs then, think he explained it quite well on em.
[21:36] <Rocket2DMn> if the exisitng documentation is incorrect, you should alert the maintainer
[21:36] <Rocket2DMn> if it's a wiki page that is wrong, you can update it yourself
[21:37] <duanedesign> Rocket2DMn: good point. Launchpad does have a Doc Team :)
[21:37] <Rocket2DMn> yeah, you can file bugs against LP itself
[21:38] <duanedesign> Also Launchpad has a few screencasts up on youtube
[21:38] <duanedesign> I thought these were helpfull as I like screencasts.ubuntu.comm
[21:38] <duanedesign> does antone know the status of the screencast team
[21:39] <duanedesign> anyone*
[21:39] <duanedesign> I thought at one point it was part of the doc team
[21:39] <Rocket2DMn> duanedesign, you should ping pleia2 , she might know
[21:39] <duanedesign> kk
[21:39] <starcraft-ntbk> PabloRubianes: hurrah, I have the logs.
[21:40] <starcraft-ntbk> lp discussion done?
[21:40] <PabloRubianes> that's great
[21:42] <starcraft-ntbk> well from silence, I assume convo done, so back on topic.
[21:42] <starcraft-ntbk> Saj0577's proposal > http://pastebin.com/m521f705a
[21:42] <starcraft-ntbk> Not too much reading.
[21:43]  * starcraftman waits for people to read and turns futurama on.
[21:44] <Rocket2DMn> It sounds like not much is needed from our end in this.
[21:44] <Rocket2DMn> If the Edu FG ends up with users who are interested in documentation, they get sent our way
[21:44] <Rocket2DMn> we're more or less a back door direct to the ubuntu doc team
[21:44] <Rocket2DMn> We are happy to help people learn how to write documentation
[21:45] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: aye, from my understand intention was to set up some sort of course they give to new prospects and then we can look over em. Saves us some question answering I suppose.
[21:46] <Rocket2DMn> starcraft-ntbk, I think your rewrite of the Wiki FG page handles that pretty well, there is a section specifically for new users which includes links to getting started with the wiki
[21:47] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: hehe, thanks. I tried to make it simple. I'm with ya on your points, I don't mind answering questions, and if others wanna answer too, all the better :).
[21:47] <Rocket2DMn> We have found in the past that having a prolonged mentor/mentee system doesn't work that well in a distributed development environment - it is really up to the new person to ask questions and have others review their work
[21:48] <Rocket2DMn> that means that the user needs to be active in seeking advice and getting involved.  However, that's not to say that providing valuable information up front is not important.  One of the biggest problems some users have is knowing WHERE to get help/support
[21:48] <Rocket2DMn> It sounds like the Edu FG's goal is to make it easier for people to get involved in different areas by knowing where the knowledge base is
[21:49] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: indeed, I guess so. In any event, what Saj0577 is asking isn't too different from way we operate now with new folks I suppose so no problem.
[21:50] <starcraftman> Maybe once he flushes it out a bit more we'll get better idea.
[21:50] <starcraftman> I'm not privy to all his ideas, so maybe he had more than what was in my logs.
[21:51] <Rocket2DMn> starcraft-ntbk, it sounds like they act as traffic cops and a GPS - they can direct users in where to go in order to get involved, and where to get the initial information from
[21:51] <Rocket2DMn> perhaps they also help those seeking to contribute in finding what they are actually interested in doing
[21:52] <Rocket2DMn> in any case, i think we need more information, so let's move on and we can discuss it more later when Saj0577 gets back
[21:52] <starcraftman> indeed, before we move on, we still got other folks right? Us two been only ones talking!
[21:53]  * starcraftman pokes drs305 and nhasian who been particularly quiet.
[21:53] <drs305> I'm reading, but no inputs.
[21:53] <Rocket2DMn> lukjad007, duanedesign , you still with us, too?
[21:53] <duanedesign> My understanding of the Edu FG was that it was to handle..
[21:54] <starcraftman> Well you guys say something once and a while, just so we know ya there. :)
[21:54] <duanedesign> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Learning    How to Develop    How to spread
[21:55] <lukjad007> yes
[21:55] <Rocket2DMn> duanedesign, i think that is part of what they were doing, but they are trying to let that be a separate project now
[21:55] <Rocket2DMn> let's move on with our agenda
[21:55] <duanedesign> ohhhh,ok
[21:56] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: roger, ok, all mine.
[21:56] <starcraftman> Well first thing is new page as was already mentioned and linky > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/Wiki
[21:57] <starcraftman> Just wanted some feedback on new layout, and people might wanna look over it again much improved organization wise. :)
[21:58] <drs305> I think I've already said I like it.  ... repeats himself.
[21:58] <drs305> Very nice look.
[21:59] <Rocket2DMn> I think it looks good, definitely more user friendly than it was before
[22:01] <starcraftman> K, well moving on. I was wanting to be sure everyones on the new BT mail list, uptake was a little slow (per nhandlers numbers), and I was thinking of maybe having a lil informal newletter once in a while.
[22:02] <starcraftman> Newletter go out by email to bounce off our bt list and it'd maybe detail certain projects to work on for a period, stuff folks could pick up. Just a thought, we don't seem to use the bt list so often.
[22:02] <Rocket2DMn> I like that idea, it's a good way to keep an open dialog between meetings (which only happen a few times a year)
[22:03] <duanedesign> starcraftman: good idea. I have implemented a newsletter awhile back with OKlahoma LoCo and it helps with momentum, keeping people excited about projects and they are informative
[22:04] <ZachK_> hello?
[22:05] <starcraftman> duanedesign: thanks. I'll look into it, that was about what I hoped. Probably not too much, just to keep people working on pages. Maybe have some special weeks where we do one task or other. Also, not too often, maybe every 2nd week or 3rd, depending how much going on.
[22:05] <ZachK_> hi team
[22:06] <Rocket2DMn> hey ZachK_ , we're finishing up a Wiki FG meeting - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/Wiki
[22:07] <starcraftman> Well, I guess that's about it for that topic, I'll either write it up or co-lead which leads to last topic!
[22:07] <duanedesign> starcraftman: just an idea we might think about all the FG pitching in on one every so often.
[22:07] <ZachK_> Rocket2DMn, starcraftman just linked me the pages
[22:07] <starcraftman> duanedesign: one page?
[22:08] <duanedesign> starcraftman: i would hate for it to get to long and discourage people from reading it is the major drawback. I guess that would depend on the amount of info thought necessary by each group
[22:09] <ZachK_> Rocket2DMn, you're stepping down?!?!!?
[22:09] <duanedesign> and not every group would have something to contribute every few weeks
[22:09] <Rocket2DMn> ZachK_, yes
[22:10] <duanedesign> starcraftman: I always like reading the team reports from all the different teams to see what is going on
[22:10] <duanedesign> something like that from the FG would be neat
[22:10] <starcraftman> duanedesign: ahhhh, I see, a unified newsletter ya mean. I gotcha, sounds good, and your right, could be a sort of rolling thing since not everyone has something going on every week.
[22:11] <Rocket2DMn> ok, well let's start with an email for ourselves, and if other FGs want to try something similar, that is fine.  Discussion about implementing a unified email between FGs is material for a BT meeting discussion
[22:11] <starcraftman> Will have to bring it up at our regular team meeting on 4TH.
[22:11] <Rocket2DMn> ^5 starcraftman , we're on the same page
[22:11] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: Roger, just what I was saying. An intriguing idea. I Shall put it on docket.
[22:12] <starcraftman> So moving to last topic!
[22:13]  * ZachK_ claps
[22:13] <starcraftman> I'm thinking on a co-lead and I want to know who would be interested in assisting with whatever (probably most often when I'm not available or other tasks to assist). Nothing too glorious. So volunteers?
[22:14] <Rocket2DMn> i would nominate drs305 and lukjad007 as candidates
[22:14]  * ZachK_ volunteers of course
[22:15] <lukjad007> Heehee
[22:15] <drs305> Just got called to work. lukjad007 would be my recommendation. Talk to you all later. Bye.
[22:15] <lukjad007> Later drs305
[22:15] <ZachK_> he left pretty fast
[22:15] <starcraftman> and that was a quick departure.
[22:15] <Rocket2DMn> work on a saturday, what a pity
[22:15] <lukjad007> Yeahh
[22:15] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: Worse than exams on Saturday!
[22:16] <ZachK_> haha
[22:16] <starcraftman> lukjad007: So you'd be interested? I put ya and zack down for consideration.
[22:16] <ZachK_> So.......
[22:16] <lukjad007> I would be interested, yes
[22:16] <starcraftman> duanedesign: No thoughts?
[22:16] <ZachK_> nice
[22:16] <duanedesign> lol
[22:17] <ZachK_> be back gents...gotta eat my chicken/bacon/and ranch sandwhich
[22:17] <duanedesign> I think lukjad007 has shown a definite amount of dedication over time making hima good candidate
[22:17] <duanedesign> ZachK_: me hungry too
[22:17] <starcraftman> ZachK_: later, enjoy.
[22:17] <ZachK_> k
[22:17] <ZachK_> starcraftman, i expect to hear results? when i get back
[22:18] <starcraftman> Well I guess I only got two candidates atm, unless maybe I pull someone unexpected out of hat. I shall deliberate!
[22:19]  * ZachK_ crosses fingers
[22:19] <starcraftman> Shouldn't be too long, I guess that's end of meeting unless anyone have any last minute items?
[22:19] <ZachK_> ok i'm on lunch
[22:20] <starcraftman> K, well I guess /endmeeting
[22:20] <starcraftman> Thanks a bunch folks for showing up.
[22:20] <Rocket2DMn> cool
[22:20] <starcraftman> Oh and the cake I promised > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6ljFaKRTrI
[22:20] <starcraftman> :D
[22:21] <duanedesign> nice
[22:21] <starcraftman> Too bad drs left before.
[22:21]  * lukjad007 secretly bribes starcraftman
[22:21] <starcraftman> lukjad007: lol
[22:21] <starcraftman> I'll have ya know I have high standads lukjad007.
[22:21] <Rocket2DMn> that was a long meeting
[22:21] <starcraftman> i.e. better be a good bribe!
[22:22] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: indeed, 70 minutes.
[22:23] <duanedesign> :) good meeting all
[22:23] <lukjad007> :D
[22:23] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: now, how do we make the log? I can't just copy this all right? Some means of formatting right?
[22:24] <Rocket2DMn> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/
[22:25] <Rocket2DMn> files get updated every hour, so you will need to wait a bit
[22:25] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: ah right, thanks, that's going in bookmarks.
[22:26] <Rocket2DMn> it's not the end of the world if sometimes oy have to use logs straight from your irc client
[22:28] <starcraftman> Rocket2DMn: k.
[22:52] <ZachK_> so...
[22:52] <ZachK_> who's the co-lead?


[00:06] <cjohnston> Ursinha: if there is anything we can do to help please let us know
[00:07] <Ursinha> wgrant, cjohnston , that page is only used by summit?
[00:07] <cjohnston> AFAIK
[00:08] <wgrant> Ursinha: Yes
[00:09] <Ursinha> and who maintains summit?
[00:09]  * cjohnston points to mhall119
[00:09]  * cjohnston hopes wgrant doesn't point at cjohnston
[00:09] <Ursinha> lol
[00:10] <Ursinha> I ask because if we change launchpad and that causes summit to go crazy, that wouldnt be a launchpad problem :)
[00:10] <cjohnston> Ursinha: its me
[00:10] <cjohnston> and yes
[00:10] <cjohnston> :-)
[00:10] <Ursinha> given that summit people are aware and so
[00:10] <Ursinha> ah, good then
[01:27] <StevenK> wgrant: I might have to fix the garbo job to use memcache. Or we deploy it and then cowboy disable it until the next NDT
[01:32] <wgrant> StevenK: Why?
[01:33] <wgrant> Oh, you mean to stop it running more than once?
[01:35] <StevenK> wgrant: Yeah.
[01:36] <wgrant> StevenK: Depending on timing we'll want to run it at least twice anyway
[01:36] <StevenK> wgrant: Really?
[01:36] <wgrant> I'd personally have used a feature flag to just run it once when we wanted to
[01:36] <wgrant> But it doesn't really matter
[01:36] <wgrant> StevenK: Because it's possible that garbo will start before everything that creates previewdiffs has the new code.
[01:37] <StevenK> Ah, true
[01:37] <wgrant> eg. code deploys to ackee, garbo runs and updates MP 1234, taotie updates MP 1234's diff with the old code, then taotie gets the new code
[04:56] <StevenK> wgrant: https://code.launchpad.net/~stevenk/launchpad/deny-ddeb-deletion/+merge/163633 or shall I refactor out and have the same thing for changeOverride() ?
[04:59] <wgrant> StevenK: I'd consider explaining that you should delete the deb instead, but otherwise fine
[05:02] <StevenK> wgrant: "Cannot delete debug publications directly, please delete the publication" doesn't sound right either
[05:03] <wgrant> "Cannot delete ddeb publications directly; delete the corresponding deb instead."?
[05:05] <StevenK> wgrant: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5663470/
[05:07] <wgrant> StevenK: right
[05:12] <StevenK> wgrant: I'll land it with --incremental, since the bug also mentions changeOverride()
[05:12] <wgrant> StevenK: Yep
[05:12] <wgrant> StevenK: Or do changeOverride in the same branch
[05:12] <wgrant> Because it's like two lines
[05:12] <wgrant> + a test
[05:13] <StevenK> So 12
[05:13] <wgrant> Won't quite be over the limit :)
[05:13] <StevenK> And I have like 35k LOC credit
[05:18] <StevenK> Hmmm, how do you pass kwargs through assertRaisesWithContent
[05:18] <StevenK> TypeError: assertRaisesWithContent() got an unexpected keyword argument 'new_phased_update_percentage'
[05:36] <StevenK> wgrant: changeOverride() now complains too
[05:38] <wgrant> StevenK: 50	+ AssertionError, "Cannot override debug publications directly; "
[05:38] <wgrant> 51	+ "please override the publication."
[05:39] <StevenK> wgrant: Hmmmm?
[05:40] <wgrant> StevenK: That's the old message
[05:40] <wgrant> You used the old message in changeOverride
[05:44] <StevenK> wgrant: PopulatePreviewDiffMergeProposal is done on prod, landing the branch to drop it
[05:44] <wgrant> StevenK: Do run a query to confirm that it worked first, pls.
[05:51] <StevenK> wgrant: The ddeb MP has updated
[06:20] <StevenK> wgrant: Can haz +1?
[06:26] <wgrant> StevenK: Should that be OverrideError rather than AssertionError? Otherwise +1
[06:27] <StevenK> Oh, I didn't realize there was an OverrideError
[23:55] <StevenK> Bah, MPJs can't really run on qas either
[23:55] <StevenK> But they're run under cron


[00:04] <h3sp4wn> maybe it breaks bash - it definately doesn't break zsh
[00:14] <cafuego> DanaG: They just get escaped.
[00:35] <askand> !ati
[00:35] <ubotu> To install the Ati/NVidia drivers for your video card, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto
[00:35] <askand> !info ati
[00:35] <ubotu> Package ati does not exist in hardy
[00:35] <askand> !info fglrx
[00:35] <ubotu> Package fglrx does not exist in hardy
[00:36] <askand> !info fglrx-driver
[00:36] <ubotu> Package fglrx-driver does not exist in hardy
[00:36] <askand> -_-
[00:37] <mrsno> !info xorg-driver-fglrx
[00:37] <ubotu> xorg-driver-fglrx: Video driver for ATI graphics accelerators. In component restricted, is optional. Version 7.1.0-8.42.3+<IP_ADDRESS>-14.1 (hardy), package size 12154 kB, installed size 31348 kB
[00:37] <mrsno> askand you can also browse packages.ubuntu.com
[00:37] <DanaG> pm the bot instead, if not sure of what command you want.
[00:38] <askand> DanaG: mrsno: thanks!
[00:38] <mrsno> no problem
[01:55] <WorkingOnWise> Is Koffice 1.9.95 Koffice 2.0 prerelease, or the last of Koffice 1.x?
[01:55] <WorkingOnWise> in the repos
[01:58] <WorkingOnWise> nm. Google is awesome! KOffice 1.9.95 is KOffice 2.0 Alpha5
[03:38] <hwilde> ever seen the loopback address just disappear?
[03:41] <hwilde> ever seen the loopback address just disappear?
[03:41] <hwilde> ever seen the loopback address just disappear?
[03:43] <hwilde> after a reboot the local loopback address is missing.  I have to run ifconfig lo up.  It is specified in /etc/network/interfaces.  why would his happen?
[03:46] <Hobbsee> !patrience
[03:46] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about patrience - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[03:46] <Hobbsee> !patience
[03:46] <ubotu> The people here are volunteers, your attitude should reflect that. Answers are not always available. See http://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcGuidelines
[03:51] <bazhang> already impatient? nearly four more months til release :}
[03:55] <hwilde> my interfaces file is correct so how could this happen
[03:55] <hwilde> it is very bad all networking dies because it cannot find localhost <IP_ADDRESS>
[03:56] <crimsun> sanity-check whether it appears in /etc/hosts
[03:56] <crimsun> next ensure that loopback is up with `ip a`
[03:56] <hwilde> after reboot loopback is down and must be brought up with ifconfig lo up
[03:57] <hwilde> /etc/hosts has first line=  <IP_ADDRESS> localhost
[03:57] <crimsun> pastebin your /e/n/i
[03:58] <hwilde> I cannot show you the wireless card settings but it starts with   auto lo;  iface lo inet loopback
[03:58] <crimsun> and you're current w/ today's updates?
[03:59] <hwilde> I don't think it is related to the new version;  it was working before
[03:59] <hwilde> then randomly it drops
[03:59] <crimsun> well, it's not going to randomly drop
[03:59] <hwilde> yes that is why I am so shocked and apalled
[03:59] <crimsun> something with privileged access is either downing it, or there's a serious networking bug.
[04:00] <hwilde> this is correct syntax right?
[04:00] <hwilde> auto lo
[04:00] <hwilde> iface lo inet loopback
[04:00] <crimsun> yes, that matches mine.
[04:00] <hwilde> ~$ cat /etc/hosts
[04:00] <hwilde> <IP_ADDRESS> localhost
[04:01] <hwilde> oh well I am going to hack rc.local to run ifconfig lo up and get on with it
[06:53] <DanaG> wtf? ctrl-tab changes by TWO tabs in firefox-3.0.\
[07:50] <khermans> libfaad2-dev depends on specific version of libfaad2-0
[07:50] <khermans>  libfaad2-dev: Depends: libfaad2-0 (= 2.0.0+cvs20040908+mp4v2+bmp-0ubuntu5) but it is not going to be installed
[07:50] <khermans> why is in not >= rather than just =???
[07:51] <khermans> how to get this fixed?  file bug?  report to someone else?
[07:52] <bazhang> latest update?
[07:52] <khermans> bazhang, yes
[07:53] <khermans> is there a process for resolving issues of the class?
[07:53] <bazhang> khermans: perhaps wait until one of the devs/packagers stops in to comment, or file a bug on launchpad--you can search launchpad from within firefox you know? there is a plugin in the repos for it
[07:55] <khermans> bazhang, yeah i dont see a bug on it
[07:55] <khermans> ill file one
[07:56] <bazhang> good to know; thanks for that khermans
[07:59] <khermans> bazhang, np
[08:22] <RAOF> khermans: Devel libraries *always* depend on the exact version.
[08:22] <khermans> RAOF, hrm, in case type changes?
[08:22] <khermans> RAOF, well it is still not installable
[08:23] <khermans> the package is not included
[08:23] <RAOF> *That* is a bug.
[08:23] <RAOF> On the other hand, I thought we had faad 2.5 now :)
[08:23] <khermans> RAOF, apparently not yet :-)
[08:25] <khermans> RAOF, changed bug to "libfaad2-dev depends on uninstallable version of libfaad2-0 in hardy"
[08:25] <khermans> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/faad2/+bug/176859
[08:25] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 176859 in faad2 "libfaad2-dev depends on uninstallable version of libfaad2-0 in hardy" [Undecided,New]
[08:25] <RAOF> khermans: Of course, the package that you're *after* is libfaad-dev
[08:25] <RAOF> khermans: *That* works.
[08:25] <khermans> RAOF, not really if I want version 2!
[08:26] <khermans> libfaad2-dev has been around since at least feisty
[08:26] <khermans> RAOF, am i missing something here?
[10:50] <Le-Chuck_ITA> hi all, is there an easy way to install hardy on a spare partition without rebooting gutsy?
[10:50] <Le-Chuck_ITA> e.g. running ubiquity from the hardy iso mounted in loopback?
[11:09] <BUGabundo> g'morning
[12:16] <tarzeau> what's after hardy?
[12:17] <Pici> tarzeau: Usually isnt announced until hardy is released or very close to release.
[12:18] <tarzeau> can someone think of interesting information to be extracted from http://krum.ethz.ch/udc/ ?
[12:18] <tarzeau> Pici: ok thanks, probably something starting with i ?
[12:18] <Pici> presumably.
[12:18] <Pici> Yikes, thats some color shceme.
[12:37] <mrtimdog> Has the 'No Wallpaper' wallpaper disappeared from the Appearance Prefs, Background options (in gnome)?
[12:52] <tarzeau> Pici: if you use a browser without css, it looks all classic
[12:52] <Pici> tarzeau: but then
[12:52] <tarzeau> Pici: or if you have a browser that can use different CSS files...
[12:52] <Pici> er, but then I'd be using a browser without css ;)
[12:53] <tarzeau> no opera can do CSS but you can replace any css with your own
[12:53] <tarzeau> and i believe a good browser would allow that and also allow to put the data it shows through a pipe and some command and then render it
[12:53] <tarzeau> (i'm still waiting for that graphical interactive browser)
[12:54] <tarzeau> actually, that browser existed... the NeXT systems had a WWW browser with a built-in editor and the Services menu
[12:54] <tarzeau> anyways
[12:55] <tarzeau> Pici: if you can give me a different css, here you can try: http://asdfasdf.ethz.ch/~tar/bts/?www.icebrrg.com/Styles/Master/c/style.css
[12:55] <tarzeau> Pici: and if i like it, i might install it (or can i use the ubuntu css?)
[12:55] <Pici> tarzeau: I'm just fooling around, I like it :)
[12:56] <tarzeau> oh looks much better http://asdfasdf.ethz.ch/~tar/bts/?www.ubuntu.com/themes/ubuntu07/style.css
[12:56] <tarzeau> i guess i'll put that for the ubuntu devel changes pages...
[12:58] <tarzeau> Pici: does ubuntu also have a mascot? like debian? http://asdfasdf.ethz.ch/~tar/www.debian.org/
[12:58] <tarzeau> i mean debian is moo and milk and a supercow
[13:59] <arbus> hi, got dependency errors with "apt-get install kubuntu-desktop" on alpha 1 standard install (over the net). kde-core install goes thru fine. Anyone else with this problem?
[15:43] <eshat> hi all ,.. which sources do i need to change to ubuntu testing ????
[15:45] <eshat> how do switch to hardy from gutsy ???
[15:45] <compwiz18> gutsy to hardy, or hardy to gutsy?
[15:49] <eshat> compwiz18: gutsy to hardy
[15:56] <pvandewyngaerde> eshat:   in /etc/apt/sources.list   change gutsy to hardy
[15:57] <PJC> ah, the info I wanted but was afraid to ask
[20:33] <tumbleweed__> hmmm
[20:33] <tumbleweed__> Hardy is pretty damn stable for an alpha
[20:33] <tumbleweed__> I'm impressed.
[20:42] <tumbleweed__> tumbleweed@tumbleweed:~$ sudo apt-get install sun-java6-plugin
[20:42] <tumbleweed__> Reading package lists... Done
[20:42] <tumbleweed__> Building dependency tree
[20:42] <tumbleweed__> Reading state information... Done
[20:42] <tumbleweed__> Package sun-java6-plugin is not available, but is referred to by another package.
[20:42] <tumbleweed__> This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
[20:42] <tumbleweed__> is only available from another source
[20:42] <tumbleweed__> E: Package sun-java6-plugin has no installation candidate
[20:43] <tumbleweed__> :/
[20:45] <void^> pastebin, and 64bit?
[20:47] <tumbleweed__> yeah, I'm on 64-bit
[20:47] <tumbleweed__> why?
[20:47] <void^> there's no sun-java6 plugin on 64bit
[20:48] <tumbleweed__> ah
[20:48] <tumbleweed__> any way to pull in the 32bit package?
[20:49] <void^> sure, with nspluginwrapper. better try icedtea.
[20:49] <tumbleweed__> aright
[23:10] <tumbleweed__> xfce is yummy
[23:12] <nomasteryoda> and fluxbox is the cats meow
[23:15] <tumbleweed__> yus
[23:15] <tumbleweed__> I like both
[23:16] <tumbleweed__> i generally only use fluxbox when I want an ultra-light os, though


[13:59] <DMDean> Can anyone help me install Kdenlive? I downloaded it and now when I open it it immediately crashes
[22:19] <antoni> hi. i need help making echo mia work under 10.10, it did after fresh install, but after some time (updates? installs?) it ceased to work
[22:23] <ailo> antoni, Hi. Does it work with jack?
[22:24] <antoni> ailo, let me check again for sure
[22:28] <ailo> antoni, You could try "cat /proc/asound/cards" to see if it shows as well
[22:30] <antoni> ailo, okay, just a moment
[22:33] <antoni> ailo, it DOES work with jack! either i haven't checked (my bad, though i doubt) or something was rectified via another update
[22:34] <ailo> antoni, But, does it not work with pulseaudio?
[22:36] <antoni> ailo, yes it doesn't. rhythmbox's mute, for example
[22:38] <ailo> antoni, Does this happen right after you login? qjackctl suspends PA on Lucid and Natty, but I don't think it does on Maverick. Make sure it is not running either way
[22:39] <antoni> ailo, you mean i should log out and in and check immediately?
[22:40] <ailo> antoni, That would be a good way to find out. Do you have any special startup applications? Just want to make sure you are not starting qjackctl at startup, for instance
[22:41] <antoni> no, not that i know of. automount on startup, i believe
[22:41] <antoni> okay, let me try, i'll be back
[22:49] <antoni> ailo, me again. okay, it does work. i have changed the audio preference from internal soundchip to mia, and it works. however i DID check it before, and it was wrong, so something must have been rectified. anyway it's a good turn out
[22:49] <antoni> ailo, sorry for trouble
[22:50] <ailo> antoni, No problem. It can be a little tricky sometimes
[22:51] <antoni> ailo, well, i had HELL with it on 10.04 and 9.10, as far as i remember, while earlier it worked okay. no idea what and why, i suspect firmware was omitted from some versions
[22:52] <ailo> antoni, was it giving you problems with jack also? I think there have been a lot of problems with PA, and not all of them because of PA
[22:53] <ailo> I used to have PA crashing now and then, but not for quite a while
[22:53] <ailo> At least not from normal usage
[22:53] <antoni> yes, with jack also. as far as i remember, someone from linux audio helped me forcing some firmware files (?) into the system, and it started to show in jack, but was still mute.
[22:54] <ailo> That's too bad. Hope support won't discontinue at any point. Don't think that card is supported on many systems anymore
[22:54] <antoni> it's most confusing when your soundcard stops working after upgrade to new release
[22:55]  * holstein is running 10.04
[22:56] <antoni> still, it would be the only reason for me to change it (when it'd be not supported)
[22:56] <ailo> I had that problem with my network cards on Debian, but that was because I think the firmware is non-free, and Debian ships a fully free kernel. Could be there's some problem with the firmware, that someone just needed to sort out
[23:06] <antoni> thanks again!