[00:17] <arraybolt3> Easter egg in LXD - if you don't specify a name for your new container, rather than telling you to specify a name, it will make one up for you. So my new Debian Sid container is now named "moral-terrier".
[00:18] <arraybolt3> Reminds me of GitHub's automatic repo name generator that comes up with names like "awesome-watermelon" as suggestions.
[00:33] <tsimonq2> Finally wrapped up with $dayjob. My plan now is to look at all the source:NEW pings I received overnight.
[00:33] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: I'm around if you're still actually awake. :P
[00:34] <tsimonq2> @lynorian: You're the best! I don't know if you listened to the Linux Saloon episode, but we received so many comments about the manual. Really first-class.
[00:34] <tsimonq2> s/comments/compliments/
[00:35] <arraybolt3> tsimonq2: yeah I'm awake :P
[00:35] <arraybolt3> working on rapid-photo-brainfrazzler now.
[00:35] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: Easter Egg> I never actually specify a name for my containers unless I know they'll be up for a while. :P
[00:35] <tsimonq2> hahahahahahaha
[00:36] <arraybolt3> lol
[00:36] <arraybolt3> I always have a name for *something*, it's passwords I have a hard time with, and that's what KeePassXC is for :D
[00:37] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: Does Debian bug 1056897 qualify for an NMU, and if it does, which DELAYED queue should it go into? Explain your answer. :P
[00:37] -ubottu:#lubuntu-devel- Debian bug 1056897 in src:slic3r-prusa "FTBFS: Plater.cpp:5313: error: call of overloaded ‘load_files(<brace-enclosed initializer list>)’ is ambiguous" [Serious, Open] https://bugs.debian.org/1056897
[00:38] <arraybolt3> hang on, cleaning an immersion blender, will answer soon
[00:38] <tsimonq2> No worries heh :D
[00:40] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: rapid-photo-brainfrazzler> Is Eickmeyer good at packaging? :P
[00:40] <arraybolt3> oh the packaging's fine, it's the diff3 markers that are being problematic
[00:40]  * Eickmeyer tosses molten lava on top of tsimonq2
[00:40] <tsimonq2> XD
[00:42]  * tsimonq2 looks at the list I gave arraybolt3, notes it's been less than a month and he's already halfway+ through...
[00:43]  * Eickmeyer makes sure some of the lava hits arraybolt3 for the brainfrazzler thing
[00:43] <arraybolt3> Eickmeyer: Hey, you can't blame me for the fact that diff is awful
[00:44] <Eickmeyer> Can't blame me either. I haven't touched that package in over a year and Debian had to fix a build issue there that wasn't ours.
[00:45] <arraybolt3> Eickmeyer: I didn't blame you :P
[00:46] <Eickmeyer> Honestly, if Damon ever releases a new version and Debian grabs hold of it, it'll just take a forced sync and all will be well because it won't even need a repack.
[00:51] <arraybolt3> tsimonq2: I would say that bug does *not yet* qualify for an NMU, as per Debian Developers' Reference version 13.3, section 5.11.1. No intention to NMU has been expressed in the bug report yet. Whether the patch submitter has attempted to contact the maintainer in other ways is unknown. However, assuming they already have attempted to contact the
[00:51] <arraybolt3> maintainer and it has not succeeded, the next step would be to express the intention to NMU in the BTS. Assuming that was not responded to right away (as bullet point 3 states, "Being busy for a week or two isn't unusual. Is the bug so severe that it needs to be fixed right now, or can it wait a few more days?"), then the NMU would be elligible for
[00:51] <arraybolt3> the DELAYED-5 queue assuming it only fixed this bug and other bugs with "important" or higher severity (of which this bug is one).
[00:53] <arraybolt3> Also, while the bullet point I referenced is a something for the developer to "consider", note below the list of bullet points, "When doing an NMU, you must first make sure that your intention to NMU is clear." This is a MUST and has not yet been met.
[00:55] <arraybolt3> (it should also be noted that the Debian 3-D Printing Packages team is not in the LowThresholdNmu list, so there isn't an exception to the need for a delay, which is another MUST point. Even if they were in that list, however, expressing the intention to NMU would still be mandatory.)
[00:57] <arraybolt3> corrections - after expressing the intent to NMU, it might be allowable to immediately upload to DELAYED/5. And it's DELAYED/5, not DELAYED-5. Sorry about those.
[01:31] <tsimonq2> Does being a team-maintained package change any of the points you mentioned? Lastly, is this bug severe enough in your opinion to warrant followup regarding intent on the BTS, and if not, how long is appropriate?
[01:32] <tsimonq2> I *was* going to follow up on those packages tonight, but I'm a bit zapped.
[01:34] <arraybolt3> tsimonq2: Being a team-maintained package would mean that a maintainer as part of that team could do a team upload if the team's policy allowed that, but that isn't an NMU. That's just a direct upload (with the proper changelog entry).
[01:35] <arraybolt3> Is the bug severe enough in *my* opinion? If we're bringing my opinion into it, no, I don't think it warrants prepping for an NMU yet. In a couple days I might change my mind, but right now it's still "fresh" to to speak.
[01:35] <arraybolt3> *so to speak
[01:35] <tsimonq2> You've passed my random grilling this time. 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
[01:35] <arraybolt3> woot!
[01:36] <tsimonq2> You can also just join a team to make an upload. Usually it's just a Salsa request. That's not documented or "recommended" though. :P
[01:36] <arraybolt3> lol, yeah that sounds a bit like a loophole :)
[01:36] <arraybolt3> not that loopholes are bad in these instances, they just need to be used very carefully and with people's permission.
[01:36] <tsimonq2> Right, exactly. Just be conscious.
[01:37] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: If you get done with foobarbazrazzledazzle tonight, feel free to ping LocutusOfBorg/subscribe the sponsorship queue and I can give him a link.
[01:37] <tsimonq2> I'm gonna head out earlier than expected.
[01:37] <tsimonq2> o/
[01:38] <arraybolt3> kk, thanks!
[01:38]  * tsimonq2 waits for more molten lava from Eickmeyer
[01:39]  * arraybolt3 sneaks into te_ward's armory and steals some  flamethrowers, then hands them to Eickmeyer
[01:42]  * Eickmeyer abstains from using the flamethrowers but does detonate a nuke just above tsimonq2 for giggles
[02:35] <Eickmeyer> arraybolt3, tsimonq2: Add gir1.2-unity-5.0 to Depends, requested by upstream > OH YEAH! Forgot about that! Debian doesn't have gir1.2-unity-5.0
[02:38] <arraybolt3> Eickmeyer: Caught that :)
[02:39] <arraybolt3> Did a merge rather than a sync.
[02:39] <Eickmeyer> arraybolt3: Good job!
[02:39] <arraybolt3> I *just about* did a sync though :P
[02:39] <arraybolt3> Eickmeyer: are you sure Debian doesn't have that though? I did an apt-cache show on it on Sid and it said it was purely virtual, and had al ater version of that thingy
[02:40] <Eickmeyer> arraybolt3: Pretty sure. Debian has never had unity unless they *finally* took it upstream.
[02:40] <arraybolt3> It's purely virtual on Ubuntu too.
[02:40] <Eickmeyer> *confusion intensifies*
[02:40] <arraybolt3> hmm. Well might be worth a look.
[02:41] <Eickmeyer> If it's purely virtual then there might not be a reason to keep the change.
[02:42] <arraybolt3> it'll pull in a later version though right?
[02:43] <arraybolt3> both Debian and Ubuntu have later versions of that package
[02:43] <arraybolt3> I think if the package didn't exist, like, at all, it would cause an FTBFS.
[02:44] <Eickmeyer> Correct, since hard dep.
[02:44] <arraybolt3> Perhaps then it's worth trying to get *in* Debian.
[02:46] <arraybolt3> Anyways, taking a break and getting some food (just about typoed that as "foot"), then going to probably try to work on the network editor some more.
[02:47] <Eickmeyer> Cool, I'm going to be on a twitch stream anyways.
[05:34] <arraybolt3> Breaking news: lubuntu-connection-editor now has the ability to create new Ethernet connections. So now as far as Ethernet connectivity goes, it is now "fully functional" (though undoubtedly a bit buggy).
[05:34] <guiverc> :)
[05:34] <arraybolt3> I have some weirdness to work out with IPv4 manual configuration still, BUT this means that Ethernet is very close to "done enough" and I can move onto WiFi now.
[05:35] <arraybolt3> About to push changes, then it'll be ready for playing around with.
[05:36] <arraybolt3> And there we go, it is now public.
[05:36] <arraybolt3> At any rate, if someone wants to play around with it on a test machine and see if they can break it, it's at https://git.lubuntu.me/Lubuntu/lubuntu-connection-editor.
[14:08] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: Thank you!
[14:08] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: Is it ready for an alpha-level upload yet? :P
[14:08] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: And more importantly, is this reliable enough for an LTS?
[17:15] <arraybolt3> tsimonq2: This is still very shaky right now. Given the number of gotchas this NetworkManager API has, I fear it may not be stable or feature-rich enough for the LTS this cycle.
[17:16] <arraybolt3> However, it's coming along. It probably isn't ready for an alpha level upload yet, but it's getting there (I'd like it to have WiFi support first).
[21:08] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: Ack, thanks.
[21:08] <tsimonq2> Respinning the daily to pick up https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lubuntu-artwork/24.04.3
 https://github.com/lubuntu-team/lubuntu-update-notifier/pulls
[21:52] <arraybolt3> Should I add that to my to-do list (test out the translations and then get them added into our code)?
[22:22] <arraybolt3> OK, this is a problem we've had since a while ago (at least since Lunar, I'm pretty sure earlier) and I'm wanting some feedback on how we might fix it.
[22:22] <arraybolt3> You probably remember on Focal that the QTerminal scrollbar had a white background behind it.
[22:22] <arraybolt3> On newer versions of Lubuntu, the background is solid black, and the scrollbar is solid black with no border unless it's being hovered over, which means it's invisible.
[22:23] <arraybolt3> And that makes it very very hard to find it when it's not at the very bottom of the terminal, making scrolling a pain (and I do quite a bit of scrolling so it used to mess with my workflow a bit). Any clue if this is a theme issue, Breeze issue, or LXQt issue?
[22:23] <arraybolt3> s/white background/white-ish background/
[22:27] <tsimonq2> Niiiiiiiice. Probably a theme issue?
[22:27] <tsimonq2> I'll take care of the translations right now
[22:28] <arraybolt3> dawns on my I'm about to be installing a new Sid VM, I can check and see if they have the same problem in just a bit.
[22:28] <arraybolt3> (*still* fighting with openMSX :P)
 @Roberalz You may have received an email... I merged your PR adding translations to the .desktop file. Long overdue, thank you!
[23:02] <tsimonq2> Uploaded all three translations PRs to Backports {Mantic,} Staging. I'll do a quick test with Spanish.
[23:02] <tsimonq2> If anyone is able to actually parse Japanese or Estonian, we should also test that translations work for that as well. :P
[23:04] <arraybolt3> I think Roberalz said he knows Estonian the other day (could be wrong?). As for Japanese...
[23:04] <arraybolt3> ...we may be in a bit of a lurch there. :P
[23:04] <tsimonq2> @Roberalz is a polyglot XD
[23:05] <tsimonq2> FYI: https://github.com/qtilities/sddm-conf/issues/36
[23:05] -ubottu:#lubuntu-devel- Issue 36 in qtilities/sddm-conf "Please make a new tag" [Open]
[23:05] <tsimonq2> I agree with the maintainer that config handling needs some work, tbh.
[23:05] <arraybolt3> wasn't Estonian, it was Basque. So nevermind, we have possible issues with Estonian too.
[23:09] <arraybolt3> I see Google Translate has support for Estonian, might be worth a shot?
 https://matterbridge.lubuntu.me/e14e867e/file_10170.jpg
[23:09] <arraybolt3> for making sure the translations are OK
[23:09] <tsimonq2> Spanish works for the desktop entry. Switching to Estonian and going by icons :P
[23:09] <arraybolt3> I don't think we should blindly accept translations after what happened to the Flutter installer in 23.10...
[23:11] <tsimonq2> That pre-dates the issues surrounding them. I did a cursory check to make sure most of the translations seem sane, they do.
[23:11] <arraybolt3> ah ok
[23:11] <tsimonq2> Anyway, the application is *mostly* translated when using Estonian!
[23:12] <tsimonq2> I think we have a fully translated menu, y'all.
[23:12] <arraybolt3> woohoo!
[23:47] <arraybolt3> alright, QTerminal bar issue is definitely theming-related.
[23:47] <arraybolt3> er... maybe not definitely, but I see what's happening and it's probably theming-solvable.


[03:39] <conorkirk> Hi
[03:39] <conorkirk> Could someone kick "conorkirkpatrick"? I lost my connection, and it stayed in, check our hostnames to be sure ;)
[03:39] <conorkirk> from #ubuntu
[03:40] <nalioth> conorkirk: /msg nickserv help ghost
[03:40] <conorkirk> ok
[03:41] <conorkirkpatrick> Thank you, worked like a charm! :D
[04:30] <nigglet> what kinda bug has #ubuntu informed me of
[04:33] <nalioth> nigglet: a router bug.  have you changed your port or upgraded your firmware?
[04:35] <nigglet> haha
[04:35] <nigglet> its not my router
[04:38] <nalioth> ready for the test, nigglet ?
[04:45] <nigglet> go for it
[04:45] <nigglet> at least like to know what freakin bug it is
[04:45] <nalioth> now you know
[04:50] <nalioth> wonder when he'll come back . .
[04:50] <atoponce> heh. he probably still isn't aware what happened...
[05:20] <Amaranth> nalioth: when he comes back tell him to change his nick too
[05:20] <Amaranth> blatant racism is not cool
[05:21] <nalioth> noted
[06:09] <elkbuntu> tonyyarusso, please dont encourage drug discussion in there
[06:10] <tonyyarusso> elkbuntu: True, true - 'twas an odd little bit of legal argument though, I'll give the lawyer credit for some ingenuity
[06:11] <tonyyarusso> elkbuntu: (what's the status in AU?)
[06:12] <elkbuntu> tonyyarusso, complicated. varies from state to state
[06:13] <tonyyarusso> ah
[06:14] <elkbuntu> afaik in the capital it is legal to have a plant and carry personal use quantities, but still illegal to sell, whilst other states and territories are basically 0-tolerence but dont take small quantity possession too seriously
[06:18] <Tm_T> steal?
[06:19] <rob> find
[06:19] <Amaranth> grow
[06:19] <Tm_T> no I won't grow
[06:19] <tonyyarusso> #1 and 3 are likely illegal too
[06:20] <Amaranth> ' legal to have a plant'
[06:21] <Tm_T> my biggest drug problem is caffeine
[06:22] <Tm_T> hum, actually, maybe sugar is bigger
[06:22] <Tm_T> if that counts
[06:22] <tonyyarusso> I'll probably develop one for both - we get free pop from Chipotle when I'm at work
[06:23] <Tm_T> I hate this "modern culture"
[06:23] <elkbuntu> small quantity possession is still technically outlawed, but the cops generally let you slip so long as you tell them you got it so as to get the dealer.
[06:23] <Tm_T> people keeps asking "how you can relax without getting drunk?"
[06:24] <Tm_T> bah
[06:24] <Tm_T> frustration ->
[06:33] <Talaman72> ok, how do i get back into ubuntu?
[06:35] <elkbuntu> according to the logs, you had a bot or AI script going.
[06:36] <elkbuntu> 2007-07-12T11:46:54 <nikin> !seen p99
[06:36] <elkbuntu> 2007-07-12T11:46:54 <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen p99 - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[06:36] <elkbuntu> 2007-07-12T11:46:55 <Talaman72> p99 was last seen Thu Jul 12 01:52:56 2007 changing nick from afk|p99 in #ubuntu
[06:38] <Talaman72> ??
[06:38] <Hobbsee> an away script?
[06:39] <Talaman72> away script?
[06:39] <elkbuntu> on multiple occasions you've had a bot script
[06:40] <elkbuntu> !seen p99 triggered a bot script in his client
[06:40] <Talaman72> i have many scripts
[06:40] <Talaman72> ot sure which ones would qualify as bot scripts though
[06:40] <elkbuntu> Talaman72, disable them in our channels please. they add spam. you've been removed twice now for this
[06:40] <Talaman72> spam?
[06:40] <elkbuntu> 2007-05-20T21:34:47 *** tweako has joined #ubuntu
[06:40] <elkbuntu> 2007-05-20T21:34:47 *** ankur has joined #ubuntu
[06:40] <elkbuntu> 2007-05-20T21:34:47 <Talaman72> hello<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[06:40] <elkbuntu> 2007-05-20T21:34:47 <Talaman72> hello<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[06:40] <Talaman72> they don't advertise
[06:41] <elkbuntu> Talaman72, spam is not just advertising, it is useless noise as well
[06:41] <Talaman72> they only reply when triggered..kind of like  2007-07-12T11:46:54 <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen p99 - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
[06:41] <Talaman72> that's kind of subjective
[06:42] <Hobbsee> so they reply when triggered, which is part of the defining factors of a bot, and bots are not allowed on #ubuntu, unless they're for a specific purpose, like ubuntu bots
[09:42] <elkbuntu> mneptok, what's the sysadmin channel? moreso, who do we harrass about the LoCo servers when neither newz2000 or heno are around?
[09:49] <Amaranth> *boggle*
[09:50] <elkbuntu> according to my logs, he's a troll
[09:50] <elkbuntu> in this channel... Dec 26 22:50:22 <rob>   <raf256> my black friend told me that ubuntu if NOT an african word connected to ability of configuring anything, is he telling the truth?
[09:50] <elkbuntu> ah, not in this channel... but still
[09:52] <elkbuntu> Amaranth, we're upping the vigilance in this channel after last week's event
[09:52] <Amaranth> so limit it to members
[09:53] <Burgundavia> elkbuntu: isn;'t there that product you file bugs against?
[09:53] <Burgundavia> elkbuntu: the sysadmin chan is #canonical-sysadmin
[09:54] <elkbuntu> Burgundavia, it's quicker to harrass the admins directly, and newz2000 prefers to be poked anyway ;)
[02:12] <Hobbsee> is it acceptable *anywhere* to repeat your question 9 times in a couple of minutes?
[02:12] <Hobbsee> where most of those times are just a flood?
[02:12] <Hobbsee> with no other people talking?
[02:12] <Seeker`> Hobbsee: I'd say no
[02:13] <Seeker`> maybe except ubuntu-repeat-questions-here. But I dont think that exists
[02:13] <Pici> Someone had asked for him/her to rephrase the question since it wasn't getting answers, but that didn't have any effect. :/
[02:13] <Hobbsee> hah
[02:16] <Hobbsee> [22:10]  <vbanait> IR_Nub: hi nobody helped me. nobody will help you
[02:16] <Hobbsee> [22:10]  <Pici> IR_Nub: Greetings
[02:16] <Hobbsee> was the bit that only i saw
[02:16] <Hobbsee> (due to the +qz
[02:16] <Hobbsee> )
[02:25] <Hobbsee> and now we think that lots of dots will help in the question.....
[02:26] <Seeker`> you mean it doesn't...................?
[02:26] <Hobbsee> or correction, usings lots of ----- 's instead
[02:26] <Hobbsee> :P
[03:38] <atoponce> can i add a factoid to ubotu for the #ubuntu-us channel?
[03:38] <Hobbsee> sure
[03:39] <atoponce> how are they added? i mean, what's the syntax;?
[03:40] <Hobbsee> foo-#ubuntu-us is bar
[03:40] <Hobbsee> iirc
[03:40] <atoponce> and, what's the difference between ubot3 and ubotu?
[03:40] <atoponce> i have both in the channel, and i don't know why
[03:41] <nalioth> atoponce: ubotu is malfunctioning
[03:41] <Hobbsee> one's there for when the other dies
[03:41] <nalioth> i'll remove ubot3
[03:41] <atoponce> well, which would be better to have in the channel?
[03:42] <nalioth> does ubotu work?
[03:42] <atoponce> yeah. seems to
[03:42] <Pici> Kinda.
[03:42] <Pici> I !ops'ed before in #ubuntu but didnt see it come up in here.
[03:42] <atoponce> ubotu is Seveas' bot? does he still provide support for it?
[03:43] <elkbuntu> atoponce, seveas is on a sabbatical
[03:43] <atoponce> yeah. i heard
[03:43] <atoponce> is everything ok, or does he just need a break?
[03:43] <elkbuntu> i think it's just busybusy
[03:43] <nalioth> i think it's stuck in a loop
[03:44] <nalioth> if it was busy, it'd eventually relay or spew a factoid
[03:44] <elkbuntu> i was referring to seveas, not ubotu
[03:44] <mc44> seveas spews factoids too
[03:45] <nalioth> atoponce: seveas is taking care of personal business
[03:54] <atoponce> hmmm. can't add a factoid to the bot
[03:54] <atoponce> can't seem to register either, per the wiki documentation
[03:58] <gnomefreak> atoponce: afaik someone has to approve you and since seveas isnt around thats unlikely to happen soon.
[03:58] <PriceChild> suggest them and we can add them
[03:58] <gnomefreak> right
[03:59] <nalioth> the bot is malfunctioning
[03:59] <atoponce> ubuntu-us is a mentoring project to build LoCo Teams in the United States.  This is not a support channel.  Please join #ubuntu.  Please refer to the topic in the channel and the ChanServ message.  Refer to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/USTeams for more information.
[03:59] <nalioth> which is why ubot3 has moved into some channels
[03:59] <atoponce> is what i had. i would rather have it channel specific to #ubuntu-us if possible
[04:00] <nalioth> atoponce: you have to do !factoid is blah blah blah
[04:00] <atoponce> nalioth: yeah, and it said that it was forwarding the message to #ubuntu-ops for approval
[04:00] <Hobbsee> atoponce: then it's working as intended...
[04:00] <nalioth> atoponce: no, cuz it's not here  :(
[04:00] <Hobbsee> well, yeah, should be
[04:00] <nalioth> Hobbsee, too
[04:01] <atoponce> yeah. i didn't see it come through
[04:01] <Hobbsee> it half worked
[04:01] <atoponce> that's ok. i can just use !support for the time being
[04:05] <bbrent> can i be tested for the dcc problem
[04:05] <PriceChild> Hey bbrent
[04:05] <bbrent> hello
[04:05] <PriceChild> looks good
[04:05] <bbrent> the kick i got was rather cryptic
[04:05] <PriceChild> You may now rejoin #ubuntu :)
[05:58] <sape> hola
[05:59] <Tm_T> familiar ip
[06:00] <Hobbsee> yeah
[06:03] <mc44> because its forwarded here :)
[06:04] <PriceChild> mc44, is it?
[06:05] <PriceChild> ah yes
[06:05] <Pici> I was under the impression all 83.230s where banforwarded to -ops.
[06:05] <nalioth> yup
[06:06] <PriceChild> its just a few subnets... i did put the whole of 83.230 here but it created loads of spam here and I didn't really know what to do.
[06:12] <atoponce> 83.230... madrid, spain?
[06:17] <Hobbsee> atoponce: used to be the turks
[06:17] <Hobbsee> we thought
[06:18] <elkbuntu> i'd say it's not a niche ip
[06:18] <elkbuntu> er, s/ip/subnet/
[06:19] <atoponce> 83.* is definitely european. not sure how it breaks down after that, though
[06:28] <atoponce> heh. <IP_ADDRESS> to <IP_ADDRESS> is spain
[11:44] <Jordan_U> Why is zilliot not banned?
[11:44] <Jordan_U> nvm
[11:45] <PriceChild> nalioth, I banned him by hostmask a while ago... shall we change your mute to a ban on nick?
[11:46] <nalioth> PriceChild: do as you wish
[11:46] <PriceChild> but I would appreciate your "blessing" :)
[11:48] <nalioth> that was it
[11:52] <PriceChild> hmmm chanserv.py didn't like /cs u %zilliot!*@*


[16:32] <mdeslaur> \o
[16:32] <jdstrand_> hi!
[16:32] <jdstrand_> #startmeeting
[16:32] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Sep 30 16:32:42 2013 UTC.  The chair is jdstrand_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[16:32] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[16:32] <jdstrand_> The meeting agenda can be found at:
[16:32] <jdstrand_> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/Meeting
[16:32] <jdstrand_> [TOPIC] Weekly stand-up report
[16:32] <jdstrand_> I'll go first
[16:33] <jdstrand_> I'm in the happy place this week
[16:34] <mdeslaur> you do indeed look happy
[16:34] <jdstrand_> I'm working on an apaprmor-easyprof-ubuntu upload which should finish out all the policy/reserved vs common policy groups/etc. I'm waiting for bug #1231863 to be fixed before uploading
[16:34] <jdstrand_> heh
[16:34] <jdstrand_> I also am doing stuff with appstore reviews this week-- various updates for recent changes
[16:35] <jdstrand_> including working with SDK team on filing path bugs against apps now that they are fixed
[16:35] <jdstrand_> "now that they are fixed" referes to the path bugs being fixed in the sdk
[16:35] <sbeattie> \o/
[16:36] <jdstrand_> but apps are now broken-- so I am going to enumerate them
[16:36] <jdstrand_> also continue various followups on https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/+bugs?field.tag=application-confinement bugs
[16:36] <jdstrand_> I have some patch piloting to do
[16:37] <jdstrand_> and think there is a decent chance I might pick up an update this week
[16:37]  * jdstrand_ crosses fingers
[16:37] <jdstrand_> mdeslaur: you're up
[16:37] <mdeslaur> I'm on triage this week
[16:37] <mdeslaur> I have a short week as I'm off thursday and friday
[16:37] <mdeslaur> I'm about to push out a few USNs
[16:37] <mdeslaur> and I have a bunch more in our PPA that are in the testing phase
[16:38] <mdeslaur> I may get to a couple more before thursday
[16:38] <mdeslaur> that's about it
[16:38] <mdeslaur> sbeattie: you're up
[16:38] <sbeattie> I'm on apparmor again this week, trying to offload work from jjohansen
[16:39] <sbeattie> I'm poking at the very early ipc prototype kernel he got me, now that I finally got it booting :/
[16:39] <sbeattie> I also need to followup with jdstrand on the hardware apparmor policy proposal he had made earlier.
[16:40] <sbeattie> and I need to track down why the parser commits broke both my jenkins build and the daily apparmor ppa builds
[16:40] <tyhicks> uh oh
[16:40] <sbeattie> I think it's the newly added dependency on libapparmor for the parser build
[16:41] <sbeattie> (but we don't need to solve that here)
[16:41] <sbeattie> I think that's it for me; tyhicks, you're up
[16:41] <jjohansen> oh, yeah likely, sorry
[16:41] <tyhicks> I'm testing dbus, apparmor, and evince uploads that fix several bugs
[16:41] <tyhicks> One of the fixes in dbus-daemon looks like it may affect some of the dbus policy in apparmor-easyprof-ubuntu, so I'll need to coordinate w/ jdstrand
[16:41] <tyhicks> Then I've got an embargoed issue to work on
[16:41] <tyhicks> Then I've got one more dbus bug to fix (bug #1229280)
[16:42] <tyhicks> I think that's it for me
[16:43] <tyhicks> jjohansen: you're up
[16:44] <jjohansen> I'll be working on more apparmor IPC mediation this week
[16:45] <jjohansen> hrmm I think that is about it for me sarnold your up
[16:45] <chrisccoulson> jjohansen, oh, i've been looking at your earlier ping
[16:46] <jdstrand_> I'm not sure sarnold is here yet. chrisccoulson feel free to go ahead
[16:46] <sarnold> (hello :)
[16:46] <chrisccoulson> jjohansen, http://hg.mozilla.org/releases/comm-esr24/rev/16e20df57d08 is what removed the ability to set the Follow-Up header
[16:46] <chrisccoulson> anyway
[16:47] <jjohansen> chrisccoulson: thanks for looking
[16:47] <chrisccoulson> this week, i'll hopefully be getting back to my oxide bug / feature list :)
[16:47] <jdstrand_> sarnold: ah, didn't see you come in :)
[16:47] <sarnold> jdstrand_: heh, that was me coming in :) sorry.
[16:47] <jdstrand_> no need to be sorry
[16:47] <chrisccoulson> we've got pretty good test coverage for the actual API now, although i'm still adding bits (and fixing bugs as I find them)
[16:47] <chrisccoulson> i think that's me done
[16:48] <mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: any progress on the nss ftbfs?
[16:48] <mdeslaur> although I guess it's a little late now to get it in saucy
[16:49] <chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, oh, i need to get back to that. sorry. i've got my pandaboard all set up here again now so I've got a bit more flexibility with the test environment
[16:49] <mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: cool, thanks
[16:49] <chrisccoulson> i planned to roll back some of the recent updates to see when it fails. the main suspects are gcc, binutils and eglibc, which were all updated since the last time it worked
[16:51]  * mdeslaur rolls dice
[16:51] <mdeslaur> gcc!
[16:51] <chrisccoulson> heh
[16:51] <chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, it doesn't matter which one it is. they're all doko's packages anyway :)
[16:51] <chrisccoulson> that's why i picked them out as suspects ;)
[16:52] <chrisccoulson> (just kidding btw)
[16:52] <jdstrand_> heh
[16:52] <jdstrand_> chrisccoulson: did you have more to report?
[16:52] <mdeslaur> hehe
[16:53] <chrisccoulson> jdstrand_, no, i'm done
[16:53] <jdstrand_> sarnold: you're up
[16:53] <sarnold> I'm on community this week, and have two more MIR audits to finish up, MIR and open-vm-tools; I would very much like to do both of them this week, but Mir is a large and complicated codebase, I may not make enough progress to finish both this week.
[16:53] <sarnold> s/MIR and/Mir and/
[16:54] <sarnold> at least the unity-system-compositor was written in idiomatic c++11, which isn't one of my strong languages, so the going was slower than I'd like.
[16:54] <sarnold> but hey I'm getting to learn c++11 while I'm at it, and that's fun. :)
[16:55] <sarnold> I think that's it for me, jdstrand_ back to you
[16:55] <jdstrand_> :)
[16:55] <mdeslaur> sarnold: you've been redefining the word "fun" again, haven't you? :)
[16:55]  * jdstrand_ hugs sarnold
[16:55] <chrisccoulson> sarnold, want to port chromium to c++11?
[16:55] <sbeattie> sarnold: when you're done, can you teach me those bits of c++11?
[16:56] <sbeattie> mdeslaur: he overloaded the fun operator.
[16:56] <mdeslaur> return True;
[16:56] <sarnold> mdeslaur: lol :) yes, just operator_fun() { ... } and away you go!
[16:56] <sarnold> chrisccoulson: nothanks :)
[16:56] <chrisccoulson> heh
[16:56] <jdstrand_> [TOPIC] Highlighted packages
[16:57] <chrisccoulson> i really want to be able to use final and override
[16:57] <jdstrand_> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/argyll.html
[16:57] <jdstrand_> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/passenger.html
[16:57] <jdstrand_> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/gridengine.html
[16:57] <jdstrand_> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/salt.html
[16:57] <jdstrand_> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/pkg/openswan.html
[16:57] <jdstrand_> The Ubuntu Security team will highlight some community-supported packages that might be good candidates for updating and or triaging. If you would like to help Ubuntu and not sure where to start, this is a great way to do so.
[16:57] <jdstrand_> See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures for details and if you have any questions, feel free to ask in #ubuntu-security. To find out other ways of helping out, please see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/GettingInvolved.
[16:57] <jdstrand_> [TOPIC] Miscellaneous and Questions
[16:57] <jdstrand_> Does anyone have any other questions or items to discuss?
[17:07] <jdstrand_> mdeslaur, sbeattie, tyhicks, jjohansen, sarnold, ChrisCoulson: thanks
[17:07] <jdstrand_> #endmeeting
[17:07] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Sep 30 17:07:54 2013 UTC.
[17:07] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-09-30-16.32.moin.txt
[17:07] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-09-30-16.32.html
[17:07] <jjohansen> thanks jdstrand_
[17:07] <sarnold> thanks jdstrand_ :)
[17:07] <mdeslaur> thanks jdstrand!
[17:08] <sbeattie> jdstrand: thanks!
[19:58] <pitti> stgraber, soren, kees, cjwatson: meeting in 2 mins?
[19:58] <stgraber> yep, I'll be there
[19:59] <cjwatson> Here
[20:01] <pitti> cjwatson chaired last time AFAICS, so kees today?
[20:01] <pitti> and as he seems absent, I guess it's my turn
[20:02] <pitti> #startmeeting
[20:02] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Sep 30 20:02:39 2013 UTC.  The chair is pitti. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[20:02] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[20:02] <mdz> pitti, hi
[20:02] <pitti> hey mdz, how are you?
[20:02] <mdz> busy! :-)
[20:03] <pitti> #topic action review
[20:03] <mdz> do we have quorum today?
[20:03] <pitti> Martin Pitt to contact Mark Shuttleworth to organise nominations and elections
[20:03] <pitti> done
[20:03] <pitti> mdz: 4 members, so yes
[20:03] <mdz> ah great
[20:03] <pitti> kees still wanted to review MREs, no visible progress there
[20:03] <cjwatson> re nominations
[20:04] <pitti> #topic TB elections
[20:04] <cjwatson> I guess the plan is to renew just those members who haven't declared an intent to stand down?
[20:04] <kees> o/
[20:04] <pitti> oh, hey kees
[20:04] <cjwatson> as in, temporarily extend terms pending elections
[20:04] <kees> yeah, so no progress on MRE review. still need to gather bug details. it is not trivial :)
[20:04] <pitti> cjwatson: I actually meant it "extend membership of the whole board for a month"
[20:04] <pitti> cjwatson: but if you want to leave now, that's fine too
[20:05] <pitti> I'm just concerned that suddenly nobody of us would have tb powers any more, which makes some things difficult
[20:05] <pitti> (cleaning up MPs and similar)
[20:05] <cjwatson> just wondering if I get to stop turning up to Monday evening meetings ... ;-)
[20:05] <cjwatson> cleaning up MPs - I think core-dev can do that now
[20:05] <cjwatson> given that ~ubuntu-branches > ~ubuntu-core-dev
[20:05] <pitti> cjwatson: well, you can :)
[20:06] <pitti> cjwatson: oh, good
[20:06] <cjwatson> I agree that the TB slots in Launchpad shouldn't be left unstaffed
[20:06] <cjwatson> I got infinity to add me to ~launchpad-buildd-admins, though, so I think that's the main TB power I use routinely
[20:06] <kees> do we need to have offset terms for the incoming folks?
[20:06] <cjwatson> If there are others, I would be interested to discover them :-)
[20:07] <cjwatson> kees: Seems unnecessary
[20:08] <pitti> ok, other than that I guess we need to wait on sabdfl's reply on a candidate list now, and the actual elections
[20:08] <pitti> #topic Requiring TB members to be Ubuntu core developers
[20:09] <pitti> just as some people already said by mail, I generally agree that TB members *should* be core devs
[20:09] <soren> o/
[20:09] <pitti> but I'm not even sure whether we can even instantiate that requirement
[20:09] <soren> Sorry I'm late.
[20:09] <pitti> given that ultimately sabdfl decides on the nominations
[20:09] <cjwatson> My feeling on this is that it can be left up to the good sense of the electorate, given (a) a reasonable slate of nominees and (b) a secret ballot so that there's no undue pressure
[20:09] <micahg-work> why should this be different than any other board?
[20:10] <pitti> we could, as a TB, give him a recommendation to consider core-devs only
[20:10] <pitti> micahg-work: how do you mean?
[20:10] <cjwatson> I agree that it's a reasonable default, but I can easily imagine exceptions, and indeed some were suggested
[20:10] <pitti> no other board is "core dev only"
[20:10] <kees> why not making it a requirement, and then if it needs to be violated, that can be discussed at the time.
[20:10] <stgraber> cjwatson: I did a milestone cleanup last week which IIRC requires TB privileges so we're good for a bit
[20:10] <micahg-work> well, to have prerequisites in terms of who can serve
[20:11] <cjwatson> stgraber: Yeah, that and I suspect that I may run into something with packagesets but we'll see
[20:11] <micahg-work> even the CC has a public nominations period
[20:11] <stgraber> cjwatson: oh yeah, good point, that's one TB-related right I use quite a bit
[20:11] <cjwatson> micahg-work: I think we can have recommendations and/or requirements
[20:11] <stgraber> (for those that aren't DMB owned)
[20:11] <cjwatson> stgraber: It might be ~ubuntu-archive.  I'll find out
[20:11] <micahg-work> sorry
[20:11] <pitti> it just feels odd to me that an existing board can restrict its own successors
[20:11] <micahg-work> getting 2 topics crossed here
[20:12] <cjwatson> What I mean is, I think we can have core-dev as a soft requirement / recomendation, without having to make it a rule and then argue about violations
[20:12] <pitti> micahg-work: that's fine, your's is the current one
[20:12] <micahg-work> no, I meant I was bringing up 2 topics :)
[20:12] <micahg-work> let's focus on the core dev issue first
[20:12] <cjwatson> pitti: heh, British constitutional principle
[20:13] <micahg-work> so, maybe I should ask the CC to make it a requirement if the TB doesn't feel it has the right to do so
[20:13] <pitti> by the same reason we coudl decide that members must only be "pitti", "cjwatson", "kees", and so on
[20:13] <soren> I still haven't understoo the motivation, to be honest.
[20:13] <cjwatson> micahg-work: In my case, it's not that I don't think the TB has the right, it's that I think it shouldn't make it a hard rule
[20:13] <cjwatson> micahg-work: Furthermore, the CC does not have authority over the TB
[20:13] <pitti> but still, if there's a very active MOTU with a good technical understanding and he gets a majority of ubuntu dev's trust, why not
[20:13] <micahg-work> I thought the CC has some authority as the ultimate community governance structure
[20:13] <cjwatson> The governance structure has the CC and TB at the same level, under sabdfl
[20:14] <soren> If sabdfl and the everyone who can vote wants someone to be in the TB who isn't a core-dev... Why not?
[20:14] <cjwatson> I was there when it was written
[20:14] <micahg-work> ok, I guess that's good to know then
[20:14] <soren> This is news to me, too. I thought CC>TB.
[20:14] <pitti> also, if someone is a very active, say ~ubuntu-desktopper
[20:14] <cjwatson> soren: Right, this is my "set general principle but let the electorate decide" preferred approach
[20:14] <mdz> cjwatson, I recall sabdfl remembering differently and/or wanting to change that, a while back
[20:14] <pitti> (we have package sets now)
[20:15] <soren> cjwatson: Right. That's what I tried to express in my e-mail as well, but you managed it much more eloquently :)
[20:15] <cjwatson> mdz: Well, if so, I don't think http://www.ubuntu.com/about/about-ubuntu/governance implies that right now ...
[20:16] <cjwatson> (And I think it would be unfortunate)
[20:17] <mdz> cjwatson, I agree
[20:17] <pitti> micahg-work: under the circumstances (no majority for a requirement, and doubts that we even have the ability to make it a requirement), would you settle for the TB giving this as a reocmmendation to sabdfl?
[20:17] <mdz> at least on the former. I should probably be neutral on the latter
[20:18] <cjwatson> FWIW, the current set of nominees being tossed around in private mail doesn't include any non-core-devs, I believe; I don't know if sabdfl has other ideas
[20:18] <micahg-work> pitti, if that's the best I can get, I guess I"ll take it
[20:18] <micahg-work> but I was very concerned with the last election
[20:18] <micahg-work> it seemed to be too close for comfort
[20:18] <pitti> right, and admittedly I used ~core-dev/+members as input for my own recommendations
[20:18] <cjwatson> micahg-work: Was it really a problem, given that the electorate made its feelings clear?
[20:19]  * soren tries to recall the last election..
[20:19] <micahg-work> cjwatson, I don't want it to get to a point where it is a problem
[20:19] <mdz> I'm in favor of fewer rules where guidelines and judgment suffice
[20:20] <cjwatson> The non-dev candidates in the last election placed 10th and 13th
[20:20] <cjwatson> I don't recall exactly who was core-dev at the time but I think all the top 9 were
[20:20] <micahg-work> oh, hrm, I thought one placed 7th
[20:20] <micahg-work> if I"m misremembering, I guess it might be a non-issue after all
[20:20] <cjwatson> micahg-work: No, history from LP is clear that that wasn't the case
[20:20] <cjwatson> http://www.cs.cornell.edu/w8/~andru/cgi-perl/civs/results.pl?id=E_3896e483ca548c95 if anyone else wants to data-mine
[20:21] <micahg-work> ok, must have been thinking of something else then
[20:21] <cjwatson> Looks like all of 1-9, 11, 12 were core-dev at the top
[20:21] <micahg-work> then, I guess the recommendation will suffice
[20:21] <cjwatson> *time
[20:21]  * soren doesn't recall whether Clint was core-dev at the time, tbh.
[20:21] <micahg-work> I'm pretty sure he was
[20:22] <cjwatson> soren: He was, by a few months
[20:22] <cjwatson> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/+members has joining dates
[20:22] <soren> cjwatson: Are those trustworthy? It used to show the date when someone applied for membership, not when they were approved.
[20:23] <soren> Bah. It doesn't matter.
[20:23] <cjwatson> I'n not certain.  Could check, but not within meeting time :-)
[20:23] <micahg-work> ok, I think that suffices then, thank you all
[20:24] <cjwatson> soren: In Clint's case, -devel-announce archives confirm that it was approval date
[20:24] <pitti> so is everyone ok with an explicit recommendation about core-dev to sabdfl?
[20:24] <cjwatson> +1
[20:24] <pitti> or any new/other discussion aspects?
[20:24] <pitti> +1
[20:25] <pitti> soren, kees, mdz: opinions?
[20:25] <mdz> +0
[20:25] <pitti> (mdz is actually an interesting case as he voluntarily stepped out of core-dev)
[20:25] <mdz> I'll support the consensus
[20:26] <stgraber> +1
[20:26] <pitti> and collective wisdom via vote should do the rest :)
[20:26] <mdz> I think it's worth asking the question, it would be unusual I agree
[20:26] <soren> +1
[20:27] <cjwatson> unusual> Yes, I'm definitely in favour of it as a default and as a (strong) recommendation, just have qualms about it as a hard requirement
[20:27] <kees> +1
[20:28] <pitti> ack, thanks
[20:28] <pitti> #topic Provisional MRE Request For KDE Telepathy
[20:28] <pitti> (via email)
[20:29] <pitti> this seems rather obvious to me really, as these are now under the KDE microrelease policy
[20:29] <pitti> and don't influence other flavours
[20:29] <kees> yeah
[20:30] <pitti> any objections?
[20:30] <soren> Nope.
[20:30] <kees> nope; I'm for it.
[20:30] <pitti> ack, so granted (will do bureaucracy after meeting)
[20:31] <pitti> #topic ML scan
[20:31] <cjwatson> Oh, I thought I'd replied to that by mail
[20:31] <pitti> nothign else that I can see
[20:31] <cjwatson> I agree, the MRE looks like an easy signoff
[20:31] <pitti> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-community/+bugs?field.assignee=techboard -> zarro
[20:31] <pitti> #topic Select a chair for the next meeting
[20:31] <pitti> kees: would you do the honors?
[20:31] <pitti> kees: (as it would have been your turn today)
[20:32] <kees> yup!
[20:32] <kees> sorry about being late :(
[20:32] <pitti> np
[20:32] <pitti> #topic AOB
[20:32] <micahg-work> o/
[20:32] <pitti> micahg-work: go ahead
[20:33] <micahg-work> so, I was wondering why there was no public call for nominations for the TB this time around, ISTR one happening last time
[20:35] <pitti> I'm not sure whether there is a final nomination list already, so far Mark just asked for some recommendations from the current TB
[20:35] <micahg-work> right, I saw that
[20:35] <cjwatson> The nomination process is running rather behind, of course
[20:35] <cjwatson> I think partly because Mark was on holiday
[20:36] <micahg-work> ok, ISTR dholbach gathering nominations
[20:36] <micahg-work> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2011-September/000895.html
[20:38] <pitti> I'll forward that question to Mark, CC'ing the list (need to write him anyway for the core-dev recommendation)
[20:38] <micahg-work> the CC just had a public call for nominations as well: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/community-announce/2013-September/000013.html
[20:39] <cjwatson> I think it'd be a good idea, although bearing in mind that we're late
[20:40] <pitti> AOB 2?
[20:40] <pitti> going once..
[20:40] <pitti> twice..
[20:41] <pitti> #endmeetnig
[20:41] <pitti> #endmeeting
[20:41] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Sep 30 20:41:21 2013 UTC.
[20:41] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-09-30-20.02.moin.txt
[20:41] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2013/ubuntu-meeting.2013-09-30-20.02.html
[20:41] <pitti> thanks everyone!
[20:41] <micahg-work> thanks pitti
[20:41]  * cjwatson waves
[20:41] <kees> thanks pitti!
[20:41] <stgraber> thanks!
[21:09] <pitti> ok, all mopped up I think
[21:09] <pitti> good night
[21:57] <u-k-i-t> Could a tech board member check the emails requiring moderation on their list. It did not make the meeting and does not appear on the web based list archive. Thanks.


 @Brokera, 😢
 @tsimonq2, wxl, I'm doing some changes in lubuntu.me, replacing some proprietary-code shortcodes by opensource Genesis (also their columns plugin looks way better in mobiles)
 question, should I add the phabricator to the support page? is it that public?
 (Photo, 299x353) https://i.imgur.com/8GqZPGF.jpg also, wxl, I added the option to toot every site modification (including blog posts, updates, links changed, etc). you happy now? ;)
 @VikingRedwolf, OK 👍
 is that a YES to add the phab link?
 @VikingRedwolf, Yes?
 👍🏻
[14:11] <wxl[m]> @vikingredwolf toot something so we can see it in action
 I modified a page and it tooted it automatically :$ I deleted it
 but I shall, I'll prove that feature when I "fix" the homepage (something broke it, sigh)
[14:12] <wxl[m]> K
[14:12] <wxl[m]> Or announce phab?
 better :)
 if you're so kind, wxl, can you think about what to say? :) you know a can be very "spartan" sometimes :)
[16:36] <wxl> "Inspired by the wonderful KDE folks, Lubuntu has created a Phabricator instance (http://phab.lubuntu.me) for our project. Phabricator (https://www.phacility.com/phabricator/) is an open source, version control system-agnostic collaborative development environment similar in some ways to GitHub, GitLab, and perhaps a bit more remotely, like Launchpad. We were looking for tools to organize, coordinate,
[16:36] <wxl> and collaborate, especially across teams within the project. In particular, we wanted a taskbaord similar to Trello, which Phabricator does a great job with. It also has lots of other features (including continuous integration which perhaps we may make use out of). We encourage you to get an account and play with it, find places that you can contribute (such as deciding on Lubuntu Next apps:
[16:36] <wxl> http://phab.lubuntu.me/T14). We're working on Ubuntu One authentication (http://phab.lubuntu.me/T11) but you can do a normal user/password as well as GitHub or Twitter OAuth. Let us know if you have any questions, comments, or concerns."
[16:36] <wxl> ^^ @VikingRedwolf
[16:36] <wxl> OH WAIt
[16:37] <wxl> Add this in there: After you're done checking it out, you might want to contribute to this poll about adding a Canonical-hosted Phabricator: https://community.ubuntu.com/t/poll-phabricator-versus-launchpad/2119/8"
[16:40] <wxl> omg the community support for phabricator is discourse. w t f
[16:44] <agaida> at least they use the right language in the support :P
[16:45] <wxl> as opposed to?
[16:45] <agaida> ruby vs php
[16:45] <wxl> oh oh oh yeah...
[16:46] <agaida> :) and discourse isn't that bad - if one install it without docker
[16:47] <wxl> the irony is that all the functionality of discourse exists within phabricator
[16:47] <wxl> tl;dr poor dogfooding
 @wxl, O.O
 I certainly prefer the spartan way
[16:48] <agaida> ouch
[16:48] <wxl> you asked for it
[16:49] <agaida> wxl: see it that way - if they wreck phabricator they can give support or ask for help  :P
 Like... "hey, we have Phab now. Cool, ey?" 😐
[16:49] <wxl> agaida: right, and that's why you run all your lxqts in vms inside windows, right? XD
[16:50] <agaida> no, to complicated
[16:50] <agaida> but i tend to agree that windows would be a nice and stable base
[16:50] <agaida> :P
[16:50]  * wxl facepalms
[16:51] <agaida> maybe with the windows virt solution
[16:51] <agaida> hihihi
[16:52] <agaida> but i have found a rock stable and production ready solution for LXQt - i simply run a rock stable sid :D
[16:53] <agaida> and the best is: no need to reinstall, no need to mention a new name every few month or all two years - just use it without any problems
[16:53]  * agaida hide
 wxl, @VikingRedwolf: Mention our current Phab hosting provider in that post
[17:16] <wxl> yes
[17:16] <wxl> btw i am annoyed by that "check them out at blah blah blah"
[17:16] <wxl> just put a link in there
 @wxl, BTW that poll sucks. Canonical hosting for this beast would be a nightmare...
[17:17] <wxl> that's nice
 So shush about the Altispeed plug :P
[17:18] <wxl> the plug is no problem
[17:18] <wxl> the implementation is dumb
 Same thing with hosting of Phab. The Phab site is fine, but implementation on Canonical servers where nobody on the Lubuntu team can just SSH in and make fixes is dumb.
 I would be totally fine with it if it was in like an LXD container and multiple members of the team had root SSH access.
 But that's not the case.
[17:20] <wxl> you're comparing apples and oranges
 And afaict can't be the case.
 Maybe. ;P
[17:21] <wxl> 1. you're arguing against something on the basis of the potential of an unlikely edge case
[17:23] <wxl> 2. the plug is poorly implemented because it fails to utilize a core technology of the web: hyperlinks. few people will bother copying and pasting.
[17:24] <RedWolf[m]> Question: are we able to install phab in the future Canonical server? In that case, can we move it without losing its contents?
[17:24] <RedWolf[m]> Ok. That was 2 questions 😊
[17:26] <wxl> 1. doubtful if it isn't widely supported by canonical, thus the poll
[17:26] <wxl> 2. yes
[20:45] <wxl> @VikingRedwolf why don't you change the support page to be called contacts?
[20:45] <wxl> although ideally we would have a redirect since people probably got used ot support
 "links" is more likely
[20:45] <wxl> so maybe you should just split it
[20:45] <wxl> HOW TO GET SUPPORT
[20:45] <wxl> OTHER CONTACTS
 so "links" then
[20:45] <wxl> or
[20:45] <wxl> leave support but move all the contacts to a different page
[20:46] <wxl> ^^ probably the best idea
 too many pages
 let me try something and I'll show you
[20:46] <wxl> too bad
 actually, only AskUbuntu and #lubuntu are support things
[20:47] <wxl> and the mailing list, no?
 yup
 I'll add the word SUPPORT to those three
[20:48] <wxl> and actually we don't have lubuntu-devel mailing list on there
 missing?
[20:48] <wxl> yep
[20:48] <wxl> there's just "Mailing list"
 you're right. I put only "users mailing list". please, send me the dev link.
[20:50] <wxl> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/lubuntu-devel
 ta!
 shit. now they're 13!!
 http://lubuntu.me/links/
 @VikingRedwolf, Redirect from Support
 there's no support anymore
[21:06] <wxl> devel list says support
 O.O
[21:07] <teward> timeToFixIt :P
 yes, my bad
 done!
 now if you try lubuntu.me/support it goes to lubuntu.me/links
 .___.
 the rest of possible 404 errors still show a sad Lenny 😀
[21:18] <wxl> so no lubuntu.me/yourmom?
 no, simon's mum
[21:18] <wxl> ooooh
[21:19] <lynorian_next> I was asked in a bug report to attach an strace by agaida but am having trouble saving the output to be attached.
[21:20] <wxl> -o filename, lynorian_next
[21:21] <lynorian_next> wxl thanks
[21:21] <wxl> np
 now, time to hang the balls. the shiny ones, for the tree, you know...
[22:33] <agaida> and the strace was helpful
[22:41] <agaida> https://pb.5id.eu/DOJw -- erm, really
[22:42] <agaida> if a program should read a configuration it it at least helpful if the configuration file is within the search path
[22:44] <agaida> with the xdg-patch applied the standard locations could and should be used - for downstream that would be /etc/xdg/lxqt/$foo and /etc/$foo - there is no need to be creative with the xdg search pathes