[09:13] <livram79> hello everyone
[09:14] <livram79> I have just installed ubuntu 13.10 beta 2 i386 on my IBM Thinkpad R31 (i915 video module)
[09:15] <livram79> both when I tried it live and after installation there was no panel or application launcher
[09:15] <Noskcaj> livram79, Do whatever you can to install all upgrades, then run "ubuntu-bug PACKAGE" for what you think is the cause
[09:15] <livram79> I can only see the Desktop image and when I right-click on it I can get to desktop settings
[09:16] <livram79> I did apt-get dist-upgrade but same result
[09:16] <livram79> no Panel or Launcher
[09:17] <livram79> where can I report this bug???
[09:18] <Noskcaj> livram79, Try "ubuntu-bug" in the terminal and go from there
[09:18] <Noskcaj> But it could be an issue with your iso, see !md5
[09:19] <Noskcaj> !md5
[09:19] <livram79> the ISO is ok
[09:20] <Noskcaj> I have to go sorry, bye.
[09:21] <livram79> the problem is that I cannot open a Terminal, nothing happens when I press Ctrl+Shift+T
[09:21] <smartboyhw> livram79, Ctrl+Alt+T?
[09:22] <livram79> oh, I forgot about it! thanks
[09:22] <livram79> I will try to run "ubuntu-bug"


[00:27] <tsimonq2> The vast majority of LXQt 1.2 just hit the Lunar proposed pocket.
[00:27] <tsimonq2> Further progress will be uploaded straight to the archive for Lunar, and straight to Backports Staging for Jammy
[00:27] <tsimonq2> Hone stretch...
[00:28] <tsimonq2>  * Home stretch...
[00:28] <tsimonq2> # category LXQt in not yet in freedesktop specs - no bug
[00:28] <tsimonq2> lxqt-session: desktop-entry-invalid-category LXQt usr/share/applications/lxqt-*.desktop
[00:28] <tsimonq2> what was that bug again
[00:53] <Eickmeyer[m]> Simon Quigley: So what you're saying is Launchpad didn't eat your uploads. I was about to claim responsibility because I was hungry.
[00:54] <tsimonq2> HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
[01:22] -queuebot:#lubuntu-devel- New binary: libfm-qt [s390x] (lunar-proposed/universe) [1.2.0-0ubuntu1] (lubuntu)
[01:31] -queuebot:#lubuntu-devel- New binary: libfm-qt [amd64] (lunar-proposed/universe) [1.2.0-0ubuntu1] (lubuntu)
[01:32] -queuebot:#lubuntu-devel- New binary: libfm-qt [ppc64el] (lunar-proposed/universe) [1.2.0-0ubuntu1] (lubuntu)
[01:41]  * tsimonq2 takes a short break while Backports Staging settles down, before working on the last three packages
[01:43] <tsimonq2> teward Dan Simmons: Since you two have the necessary powers, I'd appreciate some retry button hitting. I uploaded the entire LXQt stack at once, but it all builds, when it's done in the correct order :P if you don't have time today, no worries
[01:43] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: you, get your darn powers already, so you can help >:P
[01:44] <arraybolt3[m]> Oh great, what scary thing are you going to try to make me able to do this time? :P Just kidding, whenever you and the rest of the Council think I'm ready to be grilled for getting extra powers, I'll find time to prepare for the grilling.
[01:44] <arraybolt3[m]> s/rest of the//
[01:46] <tsimonq2> Let's put a date on the calendar of your choice, to hold the IRC meeting. Ideally it would be one with full attendance from ~lubuntu-dev. Then, prepare for that date :)
[01:46] <arraybolt3[m]> Doodle poll, maybe?
[01:47] <tsimonq2> In my personal opinion, you recently crossed the threshold of "ready" for PPU (per-packageset uploader, which is what becoming a Lubuntu Developer is)
[01:47] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: Great idea :)
[01:48] <tsimonq2> The reason the Phab wiki page has high standards is because I'd rather the applicant vastly over-prepare (and I enjoy curveball questions). You're eventually going to need to use all of those resources :)
 "teward Dan Simmons: Since you..." <- I won't be able to look at it until the morning but I will give it a look.
[01:49] <tsimonq2> kc2bez[m]: No worries, thank you!
[01:49] <tsimonq2> (As in, please do if you still have the time in the morning, whatever is left ;) )
[01:57] -queuebot:#lubuntu-devel- New binary: libfm-qt [arm64] (lunar-proposed/universe) [1.2.0-0ubuntu1] (lubuntu)
[02:01] -queuebot:#lubuntu-devel- New binary: libfm-qt [armhf] (lunar-proposed/universe) [1.2.0-0ubuntu1] (lubuntu)
[04:27] <tsimonq2> Alright, looks like we're set.
[04:27] <tsimonq2> All of LXQt 1.2 has now been uploaded to Lunar, and should publish to Backports Staging in the next hour 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
[04:28] <tsimonq2> I'll be putting it through a manual "does it install" test and hand off to QA to help with the rest, if possible :)
[05:07] <tsimonq2> https://gcdnb.pbrd.co/images/aqzp8qWiByLG.png?o=1
[05:21] <tsimonq2> guiverc, Leo K et al.: https://lubuntu.me/lxqt1-2-jammy-backports-cft/ have at it :)
[05:25] <guiverc[m]> ack..   me still without reliable internet (up for secs only), ETA is next Friday for fix (in 3rd week without internet as of tomorrow anyway) so my capacity to test is minimal.... haven't updated my system since I lost internet
[05:26] <guiverc[m]> thanks Simon Quigley
[05:37] <tsimonq2> guiverc: No worries, I wish you the best of luck :)
[05:38] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3: I added two new shiny items to The List :P
[05:39] <tsimonq2> That being said, I think the next thing is to help you get all of this into Debian... so let's see what progress is made this week
[05:39] <tsimonq2> guiverc: to be fair too, dailies still aren't out yet :)
[05:40] <tsimonq2> I plan on taking a mob to the mailing list on Monday or so if I don't hear anything :P
[05:42]  * guiverc[m] isn't worried about dailies yet... I've delayed replacing my dead-primary-PC as without internet, my capacity to install/setup system is limited anyway, so I don't need to lunar-daily until I've got (a) working internet & (b) purchased my replacement primary desktop.
[05:44] <tsimonq2> If there's anything we/I can do to help, don't be afraid to reach out :)
[05:50] <RikMills> tsimonq2: lubuntu backports ppa. what happens if someone wants to upgrade 22.04 to 22.10?
[05:51] <RikMills> i.e. they have lxqt 1.2 depending on Qt 5.15.3 ABI from backports, but 22.10 has lxqt depending on qt 5.15.6 ABI
[05:52] <RikMills> *22.10 has lxqt 1.1
[05:52] <RikMills> so upgrading QT breaks the installed 1.2?
[06:08] <tsimonq2> That's a really good point... hm
[06:38] <RikMills> tsimonq2: https://i.imgur.com/hzzD1oL.png
[06:39] <RikMills> is that acceptable?
[06:41] <guiverc[m]> thanks for checking/testing RikMills
[06:42] <RikMills> similar situation I face as to whether to backport plasma 5.26
[06:46] <guiverc[m]> there are a load of LTS users who won't release-upgrade to the non-LTS releases (22.10 etc) thus still useful to many, but a disclaimer on usage of lxqt 1.2 maybe required to make users aware of the issue with using it.
[06:48] <tsimonq2> RikMills: Very good point yet again, yeah, looks like we have work to do ;)
[06:49] <RikMills> guiverc[m]: might be ok for lubuntu, as backports ppa is not such an established thing. saying that, many people will not read or follow 3rd party instructions from the click bait bloggers
[06:50] <RikMills> with kubuntu it is such a 'thing' now to add backports, that people will rarely check for caveats
[06:53]  * RikMills goes for more coffee
[06:55] <guiverc[m]> I suspect 95%+ of all users don't read doco or official posts anyway so yeah the point is extremely valid.. Me, I'm happy as long as we have the usage documented officially  (something I can point users too as a warning..)
[07:03] <tsimonq2> A couple initial thoughts:
[07:03] <tsimonq2>  - The standard workflow to upgrade from release to release is indeed `do-release-upgrade`. If there's a GUI tool we ship that does the same, I'd like to know about it, and if we don't, that's a bug.
[07:03] <tsimonq2>  - Through that workflow, users should really have two choices: you either downgrade LXQt to match what is in the archive (e.g. 22.10), and we deal with backwards-migration (ugh.) *or* you upgrade straight to the development release, which will be unstable but at least it'll match Backports
[07:06] <tsimonq2> And if we're going the route of "hey, downgrade back to what's in the archive" and trying to support that even somewhat competently, we'd make sure that the downgrade is only of *features* and that we're SRUing the noticeable bugfixes
[07:07] <tsimonq2> That would certainly work around the alternative, which is (I can't believe I'm even saying this) maintaining a full Qt stack in that PPA :/
[07:07]  * RikMills chokes
[07:07] <tsimonq2> Maybe if we had like... two extra people, just dedicated to Backporting, I could see maintaining a full Qt stack
[07:09] <tsimonq2> Anyway, let me actually sleep on this and see if I change my mind re: rationale in the morning. That's the best thing that comes to mind immediately
[07:10] <RikMills> indeed
 "All of LXQt 1.2 has now been..." <- Heh. I guess I don't have to worry about retries 🤣 Nice work Simon.
[16:57] <kc2bez[m]> > <@tsimonq2:linuxdelta.com> A couple initial thoughts:
[16:57] <kc2bez[m]> >  - The standard workflow to upgrade from release to release is indeed `do-release-upgrade`. If there's a GUI tool we ship that does the same, I'd like to know about it, and if we don't, that's a bug.
[16:57] <kc2bez[m]> >  - Through that workflow, users should really have two choices: you either downgrade LXQt to match what is in the archive (e.g. 22.10), and we deal with backwards-migration (ugh.) *or* you upgrade straight to the development release, which will be unstable but at least it'll match Backports
[16:57] <kc2bez[m]> There is a gui tool, it is the same one that Kubuntu uses. The upgrade process is covered in the Ubuntu wiki and in an appendix to our manual. The wiki actually points to our manual.
[16:59] <kc2bez[m]> I think the downgrade option is doable we just need to document it very well. Perhaps we carve out another appendix in the manual?
 "Heh. I guess I don't have to..." <- Thanks! Glad to have finished it heh
 "> <@tsimonq2:linuxdelta.com> A..." <- Sounds good
[20:33] <tsimonq2> lubuntu-qa and testers: Please be careful updating your Lunar installation today, the LXQt 1.2 stack half-migrated.
[20:34] <tsimonq2> Currently working through excuses to see what's up
[20:38] <RikMills> apport might need some migration-reference running, as it blocks qterminal and konsole, and likely broken in release for its tests
 "lubuntu-qa and testers: ..." <- Ouch, thanks for the heads-up.
[20:39] <tsimonq2> RikMills: Any further details you're able to give would be appreciated
[20:40] <RikMills> https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/a/apport/lunar/amd64
[20:40] <RikMills> especially the current top test
[20:41] <RikMills> or fix the dbus-x11 mess :P
[20:41] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3 @arraybolt3:matrix.org: This is why you don't intentionally start transitions by yourself, word of advice
[20:42] <tsimonq2> RikMills: challenge accepted, we ball
[20:42]  * tsimonq2 finds a caffeine source
[22:38] <tsimonq2> Quite a bit of the LXQt stack *just* migrated (as in < 5 minutes ago). I'm looking at the fresh excuses file now, to see if there's any remaining bit of the LXQt transition that needs to be dealt with
[22:39] <tsimonq2> In the meantime, publishing (including to mirrors) will take sometime in the neighborhood of an hour or two. Most of the desktop should now be installable :)
[22:42] <tsimonq2> The libfm-qt part of the stack migrated, leaving liblxqt and friends as "still needing to migrate" :P
[22:46] <tsimonq2> Good news: the last run was waiting on riscv64 builds for everything, so it should all *finally* migrate with the next run
[22:46] <tsimonq2> Bad news: runs have been taking (at minimum) 3 or 4 hours, so that plus another publisher + mirror cycle and we should be okay. Should. I'll have to check back at the end of that run
[23:03] <arraybolt3[m]> o/
[23:03] <tsimonq2> Hey Aaron :)
[23:03] <tsimonq2> How goes it?
[23:03] <arraybolt3[m]> Not bad at all, just getting stuff set up!
[23:04] <tsimonq2> Very nice :)
[23:17] <tsimonq2> First orders of business on my end...... (full message at <https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/v3/download/libera.chat/2657852e2da3c1e22f2aded0e73f2c5e13a7cf28>)
[23:18] <tsimonq2> I was recently reminded of https://github.com/lubuntu-team/ppa-britney and I think it would be a great thing to get up-to-date again. It seems as if my only patches to Britney itself were to add the Jenkins policy, blocking migration of packages if the Jenkins job is unstable.
[23:20] <tsimonq2> In terms of "most effective places to put engineering work" right now, well, someone from the Debian LXQt Team finally decided to step up and finish the LXQt 1.1 transition. If we wanted to be good open source citizens, we'd help them with 1.2. I have not witnessed Andrew pop into this discussion, so it looks like we're slightly moving on without him. I'm also part of the Debian LXQt Team, and I can review + upload merge requests. Let's
[23:20] <tsimonq2> get that done if there's still work to do
[23:20] <tsimonq2> That being said, immediately after that's done, the next order of business is our own internal processes. OpenQA, ppa-britney to auto-migrate Backports once it's fully installable (given the context of the rest of the archive), and lubuntu-installer-prompt
[23:21] <tsimonq2> The first item I'll be knocking out right now is related to the build graph, so I can at least have a visual view of what's going on in lunar-proposed right now
[23:21] <arraybolt3[m]> Sounds like a plan. I'm going to temporarily give up on setting up an IRC bouncer and try to just finish as much of Debian LXQt as possible.
[23:22] <arraybolt3[m]> (adduser is proving to be a bit of a Pain to make work right :P)
[23:22] <tsimonq2> Sounds good. I'll give you some time (it'll probably take me 30 minutes or so for this graph), but if you could ensure the aforementioned document tracking this is up-to-date, I'd appreciate it
[23:22] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: Indeed :P
[23:23] <arraybolt3[m]> tsimonq2: You mean this right? https://notes.lubuntu.me/h4b5fQtYQFS1t_oRwAT-ZQ?both
[23:24] <tsimonq2> That link doesn't seem to work for me, for some reason
[23:26] <tsimonq2> OH I can see it now
[23:26] <tsimonq2> yeah
[23:26] <tsimonq2> okay, I don't have the necessary ACLs to edit that, wat o_OI
[23:26] <tsimonq2> s/o_OI/o\_O/
[23:31] <arraybolt3[m]> ?!
[23:31] <arraybolt3[m]> It's set to Limited, it should let you in...
[23:31] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: ALright, I set it to Protected and then back to Limited, try that.
[23:32] <tsimonq2> nope
[23:35] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: Are you actually in? I see that it says you edited it 8 minutes ago, but it also only says "1 online".
[23:35] <arraybolt3[m]> (Like, are you actually logged in...)
[23:35] <arraybolt3[m]> Oh also, that thing with filing an upstream bug about the GPL problems...
[23:36] <tsimonq2> maybe just create a brand new doc, copy the contents over, and don't touch perms?
[23:36] <tsimonq2> (and actually give it a clear level-one title at the top so as to not confuse CodiMD :P)
[23:36] <arraybolt3[m]> Will try, I didn't intentionally touch perms last time but it's CodiMD, it's supposedly a mess.
[23:37] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: https://notes.lubuntu.me/RnmnL-WpRAqZkWZQ7gaNpA
[23:38] <arraybolt3[m]> Hey, that looks like it's working!
[23:38] <tsimonq2> yeah that one works :)
[23:38] <tsimonq2> \o/
[23:38] <tsimonq2> perfect :)
[23:46] <arraybolt3[m]> Simon Quigley: Don't forget, for a package you do in Debian, the copyright file needs *fully rebuilt*. Every single one I've tackled was either not done right, or missing tons of info.
[23:46] <arraybolt3[m]> I'm fully rebuilding every copyright file that I do.
[23:46] <tsimonq2> Sounds good to me :)
[23:46] <tsimonq2> arraybolt3[m]: I appreciate that


[00:46] <elky> tonyyarusso, i don't know /why/ there was a world war, why couldn't the countries just merge?!
[00:46] <h00k> I lol'd, was about to say something similar
[00:47] <elky> I really hope he's not being willfully...  Took car eof it.
[00:53] <h00k> *care of it.
[01:03] <elky> A friend whom I recounted that conversation to: "We could apply the same to Israel and Palestine, right? Oh, oh, and Ireland and Northern Ireland."
[01:03] <h00k> America and Russia!
[01:03] <h00k> or...something.
[01:11] <elky> North America should just merge with South America. I mean, they're both /America/ right?
[01:12] <h00k> and Canada, too, they're just a bit north.
[01:13] <elky> They're technically part of North America.
[01:16] <h00k> Yep.
[01:20] <mneptok> except for Quebec
[01:20] <mneptok> which is part of France.
[01:23] <elky> Sure, that part of the North America continent is actually attached to Europe.
[01:23] <elky> It's an optical illusion that makes it appear in North America.
[01:25] <mneptok> hop ... Iceland
[01:25] <mneptok> skip ... Greenland
[01:25] <mneptok> jump ... SALUT! CA VA?
[01:35] <IdleOne> heh
[01:36] <IdleOne> mneptok: must of been mugged when he lived in QC
[01:37] <IdleOne> s/of/have (I hate you rww) "(
[03:20] <Pici> hm
[03:20] <IdleOne> ?
[03:20] <Pici> hunterm
[03:20] <IdleOne> been doing that for a few days
[03:20] <IdleOne> don't see a ban
[03:21] <Pici> Me either.
[03:21] <IdleOne> unless he is being forwarded from a channel that doesn't us BT
[03:21] <Pici> I doubt it.
[03:21] <IdleOne> yeah me too
[03:21] <IdleOne> use*
[03:24] <elky> Well he ought to fix his connection then.
[03:25] <h00k> Ljl is allowed to have metabot in #ubuntu, yes?
[03:26] <Pici> Yes
[03:26] <Pici> h00k: hi
[03:26] <Pici> er
[03:26] <h00k> I figured :)
[03:26] <h00k> Pici: hi
[03:26] <Pici> h00k: mistab
[03:26] <h00k> I know ;)
[03:33] <IdleOne> h00k: I had set a ban because it kept disconnecting
[03:37] <Pici> I messaged hunterm, no response.
[03:37] <h00k> is it a banforward?
[03:38] <IdleOne> no ban in BT
[03:39] <Pici> I'm talking to him now.
[03:39] <Pici> Apparently some random channel is forwarding him here.
[03:40] <h00k> That's fun
[03:41]  * IdleOne guessed right
[03:41] <IdleOne> :)
[03:41] <IdleOne> sorta
[03:41] <Pici> IdleOne: Well its a first.
[03:41] <IdleOne> Pici: :(
[03:41] <h00k> do....we know what one?
[03:41] <IdleOne> I used to love you.
[03:42] <h00k> IdleOne: but I still love you.
[03:42] <Pici> h00k: yes.
[03:42] <IdleOne> h00k: All is well in my universe again
[03:45] <Pici> So... either I talk to this guy or we need to do something else.
[03:46] <hunterm> sorry :(
[03:46] <h00k> er
[03:46] <h00k> can I help with this at all? Where is he banned from?
[03:47] <Pici> I'm messaging the op who set the bans, we'll see what happens.,
[03:47] <Pici> The channel is ##lessthanthree, dunno what its for.
[03:48] <IdleOne> set a ban forward back to that channel, infinite loop
[03:48] <IdleOne> watch the hilarity ensue
[03:48]  * h00k facepalms
[03:48] <Pici> And this person is screening their pm, umode +g
[03:48] <Flannel> it's probably not +F, also you can't do that, I believe.  Although you might be able to do it with a third channel in the loop.
[03:49] <IdleOne> chanA > chanB > ChanC
[03:49] <elky> Pici, i believe that's the new home of the arch trolls
[03:49] <elky> so you may want to bring staff in to this.
[03:50] <h00k> oh, fantastic.
[03:50] <Pici> elky: wonderful.
[03:50] <h00k> tempted to fire up xchat here to see what's in there.
[03:50] <Pici> Nothing so far.
[03:50] <IdleOne> 30 @ in there
[03:50] <elky> they were being watched in the archlinux offtopic channel and banned whenever they trolled -women and other things, so they disappeared and some of the watchers heard about ^^
[03:51] <Pici> I see a few familiar names in there though.
[03:51] <elky> Pici, i imagine so
[03:55] <marienz> you can set such bans just fine, but the ircd stops chasing forwards after a certain depth, so they'll just get "banned" if they try to join any channel in the loop, fwiw
[03:55] <Pici> marienz: Are we pretty much out of luck if some random channel is setting banforwards here?
[03:56] <marienz> I imagine we could have a word with them
[03:56] <Pici> I'll see if the person who set them responds, but I have a feeling they wont.
[03:58] <marienz> I don't currently have the time to deal with it, but I've relayed it to other staff and can do something tomorrow myself if it's still an issue then
[03:58] <Pici> marienz: Thanks :)
[03:59] <marienz> a way to figure out where a forward originated would be useful, but I can't really think of a way that'd work
[03:59] <Pici> marienz: ##lessthanthree
[03:59] <marienz> I can't think of an obvious interface to the feature, that is
[03:59] <marienz> yeah, I saw
[03:59] <Pici> Oh, I see what you're saying now, nevermind.
[04:08] <rww> h00k: fyi, I removed one of your bans yesterday, dunno if you noticed.
[04:09] <KB1JWQ> Hello.
[04:09] <h00k> rww: I did not :) Thanks, though, no problem.
[04:09] <KB1JWQ> If we track down abusive channels, let me know.
[04:09] <KB1JWQ> I'll have a polite word with 'em.
[04:09] <h00k> dowhatchugottado
[04:11] <bazhang> KB1JWQ, thanks :)
[04:11] <h00k> KB1JWQ: Thank you :)
[04:18] <h00k> MetaBot is having connection issues, apparently
[04:21] <Flannel> h00k: What else is new!
[04:21] <elky> KB1JWQ, see my comment abotu the channel above.
[04:21] <Pici> KB1JWQ: Thank you for looking into it for us.
[04:23] <h00k> Flannel: I like turtles!
[04:24] <KB1JWQ> No worries.
[04:24] <elky> h00k, have you been spending too much time with rww?
[04:24] <bazhang> any clue what gmote is
[04:25] <h00k> bazhang: it's some Android application for remote control
[04:25] <h00k> bazhang: http://www.gmote.org/
[04:25] <bazhang> h00k, ok thanks, thought he was simply trolling
[04:26] <h00k> bazhang: he might be...
[04:26] <KB1JWQ> The issue has been resolved.
[04:26] <h00k> KB1JWQ: thanks a ton.
[04:26] <Pici> KB1JWQ: Thank you.
[04:26] <KB1JWQ> Of course.
[04:26] <KB1JWQ> Sorry for the delay.
[04:30] <h00k> Cash appears to be MasterP
[04:30] <bazhang> h00k, seems clear, that gmote is very easy to setup and use
[04:30] <bazhang> ie he's trolling
[04:30] <h00k> yes.
[04:30] <h00k> and has now been removed.
[04:30] <bazhang> strike2
[04:31] <h00k> and now WarenG
[04:31] <bazhang> yeppers
[04:40] <h00k> well, that's taken care of
[06:40] <rww> while I'm thinking, the ops factoids need updating at some point ;)
[06:47] <tonyyarusso> somebody grant the fool editor access
[06:49] <IdleOne> no access :/
[06:50] <Flannel> serial commas are good :(
[06:50] <elky> whee, i'm first
[06:51] <tonyyarusso> Put a comma after Jordan_U or we're revoking your ops.
[06:51] <rww> IdleOne: yeah, in my head I was all, "Oh, the ops factoid will need updating! ... hrm, maybe I shouldn't test with that" ;P
[06:51] <Jordan_U> So what list of ops is used when you /msg ubottu? #ubuntu ?
[06:51] <elky> Well, to be fair, rww, the people who can give you editor access are in the op list.
[06:52] <IdleOne> Jordan_U: yes
[06:52] <elky> And their slackness should be punished with annoying highlights and the wrath of others who were necessarily highlighted.
[06:52] <rww> Jordan_U: /msg ubottu !factoid will give you a non-channel-specific version /msg ubottu !factoid-#ubuntu-offtopic will give you the #ubuntu-offtopic-specific factoid
[06:53] <IdleOne> Jordan_U: /msg ubottu ops-#ubuntu-*
[06:53] <rww> #ubuntu's ops factoid is just the global one. some of the other channels have specific ones.
[06:53] <tonyyarusso> rww: http://files.tonyyarusso.com/auto_bleh.pl
[06:54] <elky> is pricechild even around anymore?
[06:54] <tonyyarusso> He's priceoldman now.
[06:54] <rww> ta. now I need to reconcile this one, Flannel's, and the one from the site linked in !autobleh...
[06:54] <tonyyarusso> No you don't - mine is the best.
[09:06] <DJones> Hi could somebody with bot update powers update the channel specific !logs for #ubuntu-uk to take account of the new log location (or possibly just delete it so that the default is displayed assuming that they're all in the same location now)
[09:07] <DJones> I tried /msg ubottu, but because of the channel specific extension, I don't think I got the format right so it may not have come through
[09:07] <DJones> Thanks
[09:08] <rww> DJones: I don't have editing permission, but I'll make sure someone gets to it. Thanks :)
[09:08] <DJones> Thanks rww
[09:08] <Tm_T> hmm
[09:08] <Tm_T> !logs-#ubuntu-uk
[09:08] <DJones> I would guess all the channel specific loco ones will need amending/deleting
[09:08] <rww> probably best to !forget logs-#ubuntu-uk and edit !logs to note that LoCo logs are moving to irclogs.ubuntu.com
[09:09] <Tm_T> ye
[09:09] <Tm_T> !logs
[09:09] <rww> !search ubuntu-eu
[09:09] <rww> looks like it's just -uk
[09:10] <DJones> Somebody must have been awkward when it was set, thanks for looking into it
[09:11] <rww> Perhaps !no, logs is <reply> Official channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ . LoCo channels are now logged there too; for older LoCo channel logs, see http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/
[09:12] <Tm_T> hmm
[09:12] <rww> the logs from ubuntu-eu might be being moved to irclogs.ubuntu.com at some point, at which time it can be changed again, I guess
[09:12] <Tm_T> ubottu: ping
[09:12] <Tm_T> !logs
[09:13] <Tm_T> !no, logs is <reply> Official channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ . LoCo channels are now logged there too; for older LoCo channel logs, see http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/
[09:13] <Tm_T> rww: was writing similar but yours were bette
[09:14] <Tm_T> r
[09:14] <Tm_T> !forget logs-#ubuntu-uk
[09:14] <Tm_T> !logs
[09:14] <Tm_T> done
[09:36]  * rww ponders /lastlog <IP_ADDRESS> in #ubuntu
[09:39] <rww> whois for that IP looks like a school, and "ucenik" (from the ident) means student. so there we go.
[09:52] <bilalakhtar> Should I get #ubuntu+1 op as well?
[09:52] <bilalakhtar> I am an op for #ubuntu alreasy
[09:52] <bilalakhtar> *already
[09:53] <rww> bilalakhtar: 17:18:10 <+Pìci> rww: Yeah.  We're not sure if we want to do that until your probationary period is over.
[09:53] <rww> (talking about automatic #ubuntu+1 opship for the new #ubuntu ops)
[09:53] <bilalakhtar> thanks for the info rww
[12:51] <ikonia> did we just have a netsplit ?
[12:51] <ikonia> 1/join s
[12:52] <Pici> ikonia: you timed out.
[12:52] <Pici> ikonia: also, you're a computer.
[12:53] <ikonia> I wonder why I timed out, I'm on a box in a DC thats maintained connection
[12:53] <ikonia> I'm a computer ?
[12:53] <jussi> ikonia: [14:45:59] <-- ikonia (~mattd@unaffiliated/ikonia) has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
[12:53] <jussi> and hai!
[12:54] <ikonia> the odd thing is, I even saw that on my own screen ?
[12:54] <jussi> ikonia: also, I noticed metabot was having connection issues again - did you ever talk to LjL about that?
[12:54] <ikonia> that why I wondered if it was a split
[12:54] <ikonia> yes, he said the connection he was on was stable so didn't need to move it
[12:54] <ikonia> (guess he's wrong)
[12:54] <jussi> ok
[12:55] <Pici> ikonia: http://www.engadget.com/2010/11/23/acer-rivals-libretto-w105-with-iconia-dual-screen-laptop-table/
[12:55] <ikonia> ha ha ha, lets read this
[12:57] <jussi> I loved the "better idea" in the comments :D http://oi52.tinypic.com/r8xov6.jpg
[12:58] <Pici> Hah
[13:55] <ikonia> once again ubuntu-tweak breaks a system
[14:06] <popey> ikonia: interesting.. is this in #u?
[14:06] <popey> nvm, got it
[16:38] <Pici> erkk indeed
[16:49] <Angah_Eypoh> As`saLamuaLaikum WarahmatuLLah Hiwabarakatuh ~~:)
[16:49] <Angah_Eypoh> apa bnda?
[16:49] <ikonia_> darn it, I just have changed that quit message
[16:49] <ikonia_> apologies -ops
[16:50] <Angah_Eypoh> hurm
[16:50] <ikonia> Malaysia: please leave this channel
[16:51] <Malaysia> why?
[16:51] <ikonia> Malaysia: because unless you have an issue with the #ubuntu channel and you be banned, we don't allow users to idle
[16:51] <Malaysia> mak hang
[16:52] <ikonia> I don't know what that means
[16:52] <Malaysia> where u form?
[16:52] <ikonia> that doesn't matter
[16:53]  * Malaysia (~_~) Duk Tepi Sambil-Senyum Tenguk Dalam Channel IRC.....
[16:53] <ikonia> Malaysia: please leave this channel
[16:53] <ikonia> please stop that
[16:53] <Malaysia> What Da Fuck!!!!
[16:53] <Pici> ikonia: let me know if you need assistance.
[16:53] <ikonia> you've been told to stop that
[16:53] <ikonia> Pici: last chance, then it's over to you
[16:53] <Angah_Eypoh> Bye all I am out
[16:54] <ikonia> there we go
[16:54] <ikonia> Pici: thank you
[16:54] <Pici> ikonia: anytime.
[16:55] <ikonia> I'll give it an hour and remove that ban so he stops trying to get in
[17:48] <ikonia> what are surprise taylanub is from archlinux
[17:49] <Pici> surprise, they added another banforward to our channel.
[17:49] <ikonia> staff should kline the whole lot
[17:49] <Pici> ikonia: I'm going to grab lunch, I'll deal with it when I return.
[17:51] <ikonia> Pici: I'll sort it now,
[17:59] <Pici> ikonia: KB1 JWQ had helped with it yesterday.
[18:00] <IdleOne> Good morning
[18:00] <ikonia> Pici: they have removed the bans now as they fear staff killing the whole channel
[18:00] <Pici> ikonia: oh?
[18:01] <IdleOne> bilalakhtar: Congrats on +o, not sure if I had said it to you already
[18:01] <bilalakhtar> IdleOne: Thanks, even I don't remember that :)
[18:02] <bilalakhtar> though Pici spelt my nick wrong in the announcement
[18:02] <ikonia> Pici: I joined and asked them to remove the ban, some of them where laughing at it, then tried to come up with crap excuses for it,
[18:02] <ikonia> it's clear it's a troll pit, staff need to action
[18:02] <ikonia> KB1JWQ: ping
[18:03] <mneptok> shutting down the channel will result in whack-a-mole, IMO
[18:04] <mneptok> better to leave them right where they are. which is a known quantity.
[18:04] <IdleOne> I have to agree, better to have them all in one place we know about
[18:05] <ikonia> I disagree
[18:05] <Pici> bilalakhtar: Er, sorry. It wasn't intentional
[18:05] <bilalakhtar> Pici: no probs, atleast the flags got set on me and not someone else
[18:05] <IdleOne> ideally they would all be banned from the network
[18:07] <Tm_T> ideally they would all be good
[18:07] <IdleOne> Tm_T: +1
[18:08] <IdleOne> but they have proven no interest in being good IRC citizens
[18:08] <Tm_T> still its ideal (:
[18:08] <IdleOne> kline them all and let the gods sort them out
[18:09] <Tm_T> ban or other "punishment" is never a good thing, although necessary evil way too often
[18:13] <jussi> Isnt "all" a bit over inclusive term? I mean is _every_ archlinux user in that channel at fault? is it not a bit unfair to brand them all the same?
[18:13] <ikonia> it is
[18:13] <ikonia> they are ALL ops
[18:13] <ikonia> they are all doing it
[18:13] <ikonia> so it's not unfair
[18:16] <jussi> wait, we are talking about #archlinux-offtopic ? or?
[18:16] <Pici> Actually it looks like one of them is setting the bans.
[18:16] <IdleOne> jussi: no
[18:16] <Pici> From what I've seen at least.
[18:16] <IdleOne> #lessthenthree
[18:16] <IdleOne> something like that
[18:17] <jussi> so what was with the comment that he was from arch?
[18:17] <IdleOne> they are a group from arch that formed this channel
[18:17] <ikonia> because the users who where a problem in arch linux have joined that channel to continue to be a problem
[18:17] <Pici> jussi: A number of people who are in that channel are people who were in the arch -offtopic channel.
[18:17] <ikonia> as the archlinux guys have got a bit tougher
[18:18] <IdleOne> Good to know that the arch people are being less tolerant of bad behavior
[18:18] <ikonia> it's the usual idiots, like thewizord and all that lot with "FUCK FREENODE YOU  CAN'T STOP US" approach
[18:19] <ikonia> the channel appears to have not intended to be a trollpit, but the usual trolls joined it and are abusing it
[18:20] <jussi> ok, just that "no suprise $user is from $group" and then "kline the lot of them" sounds like "them" = "$group"
[18:20] <ikonia> it is
[18:20] <ikonia> it's meant to sound like that
[18:20] <jussi> So you think we should kline the whole of archlinux then...
[18:20] <IdleOne> hehe no
[18:20] <ikonia> no, the whole of that community that is a problem
[18:21] <IdleOne> without having all the info, my comment does sound extreme I agree
[18:21] <jussi> because: [19:48:30] <ikonia> what are surprise taylanub is from archlinux - then - [19:49:33] <ikonia> staff should kline the whole lot
[18:21] <ikonia> yes and ?
[18:22] <jussi> so, we should kline all of arch?
[18:22] <ikonia> or we could get a grip
[18:22] <ikonia> it's clear from the ensuing discission and the previous discussion there are a group of archlinux channel users who have made their own troll pit
[18:22] <jussi> No, we could just not give everyone in a certain group a bad name, just because some idiots come from that group.
[18:23] <IdleOne> jussi: we were discussing "all" the people from the certain channel and they happen to be arch users who have been removed from the arch channels.
[18:23] <ikonia> jussi: get a grip
[18:23] <ikonia> seriously
[18:24] <IdleOne> I think we are making this a bigger discussion then it needs to be, the people in that channel are known trolls.
[18:24] <ikonia> exactly
[18:26] <jussi> Im just trying to point out that the way your words sound give people reason to complain about our attitude and our motivation - regardless of how they were meant. So lets try to be careful with our words and not give trolls fuel for their fires.
[18:26] <IdleOne> fair enough
[18:27] <ikonia> jussi: you're just being stupid
[18:27] <IdleOne> ikonia: no need for that.
[18:27] <IdleOne> step back for a minute please
[18:27] <ikonia> lets not try to be careful, lets try to talk openly and honestly
[18:27] <ikonia> IdleOne: no
[18:27] <ikonia> you step out
[18:27] <IdleOne> ok
[18:27] <ikonia> thank you
[18:28] <mneptok> ikonia: i think the name-calling needs to stop.
[18:28] <ikonia> I'm not calling anyone names
[18:28] <mneptok> ikonia: calling jussi's or his opinions "stupid" adds noting to the discussion.
[18:28] <ikonia> making an issue out of nothing to try to be politically super clean, is stupid
[18:29] <ikonia> rather than just reading the actial conveation and understand it is the group we are talking about
[18:30] <mneptok> banning groups of people based on the actions of a few people with no direct evidence that the *entire* group is responsible does not put us on the high road.
[18:31] <ikonia> the evidence is that the enitre group is in the other channel
[18:31] <ikonia> put us on the high road ?
[18:31] <ikonia> what are you talking about
[18:31] <ikonia> there are a known group of users that have been a problem, they have formed a new channel, staff can deal with it, or not
[18:32] <ikonia> and picking up on wording on so that people who read the logs of this channel can't nit pick is just poor
[18:32] <ikonia> and a step away from reality, this channel is logged, as is the content of the previous discussions, it should not be hard to show the context of the problem
[18:33] <ikonia> and to be honest, we spend hour entertaining these issue users who read the logs and nitpick on wording rather than actually stopping their pointless complaint earlier
[18:34] <mneptok> but no comments from the Ubuntu ops should require that others go looking for context. we should say what we mean, and it should be clear within its own context.
[18:34] <ikonia> so telling me to "watch what I say" is offensive, rather than culling the pointless complaints that could come from this minor wording issue
[18:34] <mneptok> one man's opinion.
[18:34] <ikonia> yes
[18:34] <ikonia> if this is the councils view, then in my opinion it is futher out of touch than I first suspected
[18:35] <ikonia> jussi: I'll email you the logs, and you can sort it out with perfectly worded discussion in here
[18:35] <ikonia> you can raise it with staff and you can progress it
[18:36] <mneptok> ikonia: someome telling me "watch what you say" would result in me looking at what i said and evaluating it. not an immediate reason to take offense. so i'll submit that jussi's admonishment was not inherently offensive, but rather that the problem lies with how you decided to interpret it.
[18:36]  * mneptok may well be wrong
[18:36]  * charlie-tca agrees with mneptok
[18:36] <ikonia> mneptok: you're not wrong,
[18:36] <jussi> ikonia: we all should be striving to be better ops, so rather than just critiscing me, would it not be easier to just say, oh, yeah, that didnt come out as clear as it could, heres what I meant?
[18:36] <ikonia> jussi: would it have been easy to say nothing
[18:37] <_____________> Hi!
[18:37] <ikonia> ahhh one of the channel trolls users now
[18:37] <ikonia> I'll leave this to jussi to sort out
[18:37] <_____________> me?
[18:37] <_____________> i'm not a troll
[18:38] <jussi> hi _____________
[18:38] <_____________> i came here because i'm curious
[18:38] <_____________> hi jussi
[18:38] <Pici> About?
[18:38] <_____________> about the fuss
[18:38] <_____________> in general
[18:38] <Pici> I'm sorry, what fuss are you talking about?
[18:38] <Pici> joeDeuce: How can we help you?
[18:39] <joeDeuce> just dropping by to say hey
[18:39] <joeDeuce> ikonia visited our channel earlier, so i thought i'd at least show the same respect :)
[18:39] <_____________> same here
[18:39] <_____________> i just read the topic
[18:39] <_____________> this chan is only for people with problem
[18:40] <_____________> *problems
[18:40] <Pici> Correct.
[18:40] <_____________> must be a pretty depressing chan
[18:40] <_____________> so, i'll just say bye and leave
[18:40] <Pici> Okay then.
[18:41] <joeDeuce> have a good day gentlemen, gentlewomen
[18:41] <ikonia> 18:41 <@_____________> joeDeuce: u trollin?
[19:09] <ikonia> irc council members, I expect you to progress the issue of the actions of ##lessthanthree with freenode
[19:49] <tsimpson|n800> ikonia: we already did
[19:52] <Pici> tsimpson|n800: It happened again today.
[19:54] <mneptok> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWa0dZMHYeE
[19:54] <tsimpson|n800> click-fail
[19:56] <tsimpson|n800> Pici: maybe we should think about removing +F temporarily, or creating a +m channel explicitly for forwards? (thinking out loud)
[19:56] <Pici> tsimpson|n800: I don't really think either are good solutions.
[19:58] <tsimpson|n800> well, there's nothing we can activity do about it, so other than just hope they stop...
[19:59] <tsimpson|n800> *activly
[19:59]  * tsimpson|n800 has spelling fail and gives up
[20:15] <ikonia> I believe they will now stop
[21:49] <_Techie_> is anybody other than jrib active at the moment?
[21:51] <_Techie_> i wish to 'commune' with the otehr 'gods'
[21:51] <IdleOne> _Techie_: how can I help you?
[21:51] <_Techie_> i wish to know why as a community ubuntu is so screwed up
[21:51] <IdleOne> for the record we aren't gods
[21:52] <IdleOne> _Techie_: you are welcome to help make it better
[21:53] <_Techie_> IdleOne, do you agree that changing nick to define away status, causes no more channel spam than someone closign their client and re joining it when back?
[21:54] <IdleOne> _Techie_: I agree that if we allow 1 person to do it then we need to allow all the people to do it. Imagine 1400+ users setting away nicks on and off all day long
[21:54] <IdleOne> #u is confusing enough as it is
[21:54] <_Techie_> imagine 1400+ users joining and parting from #ubuntu all day long... oh wait that already happens
[21:54] <IdleOne> exactly
[21:54] <IdleOne> so lets not add to it with away nicks
[21:55] <_Techie_> so why am i singled out for using an away nick when the alternative produces no more spam
[21:55] <IdleOne> because we can't tell people not to join the channel or not to part/quit
[21:56] <IdleOne> but we can ask that users who are in the channel not add to the already heavy scroll with nick changes
[21:58] <IdleOne> _Techie_: was there anything else I could help with?
[21:59] <_Techie_> i can see that obviously this is going to be of no use as you seem to be as blind as other ops
[21:59] <_Techie_> actually there is one other thing
[22:00] <_Techie_> i currently havea ban in #ubuntu for protesting this point
[22:00] <IdleOne> _Techie_: my personal beliefs on the matter are of no consequence. the rules are that users in #ubuntu don't use -away nicks because it adds to scroll
[22:00] <IdleOne> _Techie_: give me a minute to look up the ban
[22:00] <_Techie_> i would like to have this ban remove, if you wish to make me seem like the bad person here, then so be it... i will become that person
[22:01] <IdleOne> _Techie_: nobody wants to make you out to be the "bad person"
[22:01] <IdleOne> I just need to know that you understand the !guidelines and agree to follow them before I can lift the ban
[22:02] <_Techie_> give me a few minutes to read over them in detail
[22:02] <IdleOne> sure thing
[22:03] <IdleOne> feel free to ask if you have any questions about them
[22:04] <_Techie_> i guess that im going to be finding a different distribution
[22:04] <_Techie_> because i will not remove my away nick
[22:05] <IdleOne> alright then, sorry we couldn't agree
[22:05] <_Techie_> i do however agree to the other terms
[22:06] <IdleOne> well, being part of a community is accepting to follow all the rules not just those we agree with
[22:06] <IdleOne> but like I said, you can help make the community better, work from within the system.
[22:06] <topyli> no need to change distributions, the rules apply just to the irc channels. :)
[22:08] <_Techie_> topyli, im glad you dont want a user ot have to change distributions, but i however am not willing to push a distribution that i dont fully agree with
[22:09] <topyli> ok :(
[22:10] <IdleOne> _Techie_: if you change your mind you can come back here and we can remove the ban.
[22:10] <_Techie_> when asa  group you decide that away nicks are contributing to spam no more than if those users were joining and parting, then i will be more than glad to come back to ubuntu, its a great project, the community however needs to think rules through
[22:12] <_Techie_> the only agreement we can come to without a rule change is for me to join and part #ubuntu every time i DC, which would be no better than my current away nick setup, but it would however conform tothe rules
[22:14] <IdleOne> _Techie_: if you are willing to not set away nicks I can lift the ban but understand that if you are going to join/part every 2 minutes that might result in another ban for join/part spamming.
[22:14] <IdleOne> but I don't think that was your intentions
[22:15] <_Techie_> the away nick will remain, and the only reason i joined and reconnected repeatedly other than in protest was when restarting to apply cahnges, which couldnt be helped
[22:15] <IdleOne> Alright then, I guess there is nothing else to discuss.
[22:21] <topyli> _Techie_: if there's nothin else, please part this channel. idling is not allowed here, as stated in the channel topic
[22:22] <_Techie_> okay, farewell. IdleOne if you wish to ban be from #ubuntu-server aswell, you may do so
[22:22] <IdleOne> up to -server ops to decide that
[22:25] <IdleOne> I do think he had a bit of a point. What I mean is a nick change is not that big a deal, it's when some users away annouce scripts that it becomes an issue.
[22:25] <Pici> How many times did he change his nick?
[22:26] <IdleOne> s/some users/some users use/
[22:26] <IdleOne> he changed his nick and then got !away
[22:26] <Pici> Once?
[22:26] <IdleOne> from the ban comment he then spammed the channel with nick changes
[22:26] <IdleOne> which I assume is what prompted the ban
[22:27] <IdleOne> hmm it was more then once
[22:27] <IdleOne> within a few minutes
[22:28] <Pici> I'd say thats a valid situation to use !away in
[22:28] <IdleOne> yup
[22:29] <IdleOne> it was
[22:29] <IdleOne> anyway, I'll ammend my previous comment with, a nick change every now and then is ok. 7 in a few minutes is too much.
[22:29] <Pici> Agreed.
[22:31] <IdleOne> it is funny what some people will chose to fight over.
[22:31] <IdleOne> this away nick thing was not worth a continued ban
[22:31] <IdleOne> he chose it though
[23:34] <IdleOne> -server op might want to talk to _techie_
[23:35] <_Techie_> are there any #ubuntu-server ops present?
[23:39] <_Techie_> i am about to reboot into windows, expect a nick change for away
[23:39] <elky> Pici, i think you're the only -server op here
[23:39] <IdleOne> _Techie_: different ubuntu channels have different cultures and may be more or less strict when applying the guidelines
[23:41] <_Techie_> are there any #ubuntu-server ops present?
[23:42] <IdleOne> As i was saying before you rudely changed your nick in defiance, some channels apply the rules less strictly, #ubuntu-server may be one of them. #ubuntu is not.
[23:43] <_Techie_> i know this, i still wish to talk with an operator of #ubuntu-server
[23:43] <Flannel> _Techie_: there don't appear to be any #ubuntu-server operators present at this time, no.
[23:43] <_Techie_> thankyou for your respone Flannel i will come back at a later time
[23:44] <IdleOne> I would like to point out there is no chance in heck that he booted to windows that fast


[01:25] <Who_> troy_s: have you put the svgs for your lsplash's somewhere?
[01:26] <kwwii> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Kubuntu-Edgy-Ideas?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=kdm-21.07.06.png
[01:26] <kwwii> ideas?
[01:26] <kwwii> I think the logo is still kinda fscked up (too dark) but in general the idea is good
[01:27] <kwwii> Who_: the bg is based on your stuff
[01:27] <kwwii> I mention that on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/_Incoming/Kubuntu-Edgy-Ideas
[01:27] <Who_> cool. I'll look now
[01:28] <Who_> while I wait for it to load....kwwii: did you get the xcf for the blue bubbles?
[01:29] <Who_> it's cool,
[01:29] <kwwii> yes, I did, but I work with inkscape so I did not use them to be honest
[01:29] <kwwii> it still needs a lot of work
[01:30] <Who_> only suggestion would be to change (that means 'I don't know quite what isn't right but something doesn't quite scan'..) the inner most glass section
[01:30] <kwwii> but it shows, basically, what is possible
[01:30] <Who_> indeed :)
[01:30] <kwwii> yeah, i used two simple round gradients
[01:30] <kwwii> it needs to be improved
[01:31] <Who_> but the design is cool.
[01:31] <kwwii> I will upload the svg tomorrow
[01:31] <Who_> I was just going to ask :P
[01:31] <kwwii> it looks better in a browser on my osx then on linux
[01:31] <kwwii> It needs a lot of work
[01:31] <kwwii> I told you that I liked your work :-)
[01:32] <kwwii> now you know that I do
[01:36] <kwwii> anyway...time for sleep
[01:36] <kwwii> see you tomorrow
[02:28] <troy_s> who_ i sent you mail with the link
[02:28] <Who_> troy_s: Thanks
[02:28] <troy_s> did you get them?
[02:29] <Who_> just looking, gimmie 2 mins
[02:32] <Who_> yea, sorry - on your wikipage, right?
[02:32] <Who_> troy_s: Did you get the mail I just sent?
[02:32] <troy_s> uh... not yet... let me look
[02:32] <troy_s> mail lag
[02:41] <troy_s> got your mail who_, thanks for taking the time.
[02:41] <Who_> no problem :)
[02:41] <Who_> is pdf ok?
[02:41] <troy_s> shower time for me...
[02:41] <Who_> bed for me!
[02:41] <Who_> it took me longer to write that than I had expected...
[02:50] <troy_s> who_ you still in?
[02:50] <troy_s> Who_, Who_ Who_
[03:01] <Who_> troy_s: kinda
[03:02] <troy_s> did you get that pm?
[03:02] <Who_> yea, you get my reply?
[03:03] <troy_s> nope
[03:03] <troy_s> you got a registered nick???
[03:04] <troy_s> Who_, i don't know if your nick is registered with nickserv
[03:04] <Who_> no, it isn't :S
[03:04] <Who_> you got gmail or msn?
[03:05] <troy_s> who_ yeah and jabber.
[03:05] <troy_s> who_ registering is one line of text :)
[03:05] <troy_s> something like /msg nickserv blah
[03:05] <troy_s> but you should probably get me on your instant messenger anyways... jabber of google talk works for me.
[03:06] <troy_s> s/of/or
[03:06] <Who_> only I would have to choose a new nick - someone has Who and Who_ is owned by them too :S
[03:07] <troy_s> you add me yet on your im>?
[03:08] <Who_> well, I am signed into gmail hoping to use Gchat from there, but it doesn't just work (tm)
[03:09] <Who_> I should explain: I am in a it of a hurry as my housemate needs to go to bed but I need to re-install grub for her before she does as she is taking her PC away tomorrow morning
[03:16] <troy_s> okie... well get in touch via email... work out the im thing later.
[07:52] <newz2000> troy_s: ping
[07:53] <mhb> hey everyone
[07:53] <newz2000> hi
[07:55] <mhb> seems like "sincerity day" today on the ML
[10:26] <Viper550> Excuse me, does anyone have SVG's of Human's "close" icon?