[04:49] <SoundSouldier> hello?
[04:50] <SoundSouldier> hello?
[16:28] <angs> is it enough to install "apt-get install build-essential" to have the toolchains to cross-compile C code for beagleboard-Xm?
[16:28] <angs> do I need to install apt-get install gcc-4.7-arm-linux-gnueabihf ?
[16:43] <angs> I am using gcc-arm-linux-gnueabihf to cross compile, what path do I need to link for libusb-1.0?
[16:50] <prpplague> angs: where every you have the libusb libraries compiled for arm
[16:51] <prpplague> angs: not your local ones that are most likely compiled for x86
[16:52] <angs>  I used to link lusb-1.0 on eclipse as /usr/include/libusb-1.0 on "C/c++ general> paths and symbols >library paths" and it was working fine to build the code on my desktop. To cross-compile, I added "/usr/arm-linux-gnueabihf/lib" before "/usr/include/libusb-1.0"", now  I get "cannot find -lusb-1.0" error when I build the code.
[16:52] <angs>  should I copy the libusb-1.0 directory under  /usr/arm-linux-gnueabihf/lib
[16:53] <angs> or do I suppose to install libusb-1.0 for arm?
[17:00] <angs> prpplague: how can I add libusb on arm's gcc ?
[17:26] <angs> can anyone tell me how do I suppose to use libusb on ubuntu-arm?
[17:27] <prpplague> angs: did you add libusb files that were complied for arm in the directory - /usr/arm-linux-gnueabihf/lib ?
[17:34] <angs> prpplague: I copied libusb* files from /usr/lib to /usr/arm-linux-gnueabihf/lib and libusb-1.0 from /usr/include to /usr/arm-linux-gnueabihf/include however I still have the same problem
[17:34] <angs> I get this error when I build the program "skipping incompatible /usr/arm-linux-gnueabihf/lib/libusb-1.0.a when searching for -lusb-1.0"
[17:35] <prpplague> angs: the libusb files in /usr/lib on your host pc are for x86
[17:35] <prpplague> angs: they are not for arm
[17:35] <angs> where can I download libusb files for arm?
[17:35] <prpplague> angs: i would assume there is a ubuntu package you can get, however i alway build them myself
[17:37] <angs> prpplague: do you have built libusb files on your machine that you can share?
[17:37] <prpplague> angs: easier for you to do it yourself of find the ubuntu packages
[17:37] <prpplague> angs: what hardware platform are you using?
[17:38] <angs> prpplague: I am using beagleboard-Xm. I am a beginner linux user, I do not know how to build package
[17:39] <prpplague> angs: then download the ubuntu pre-built package
[17:42] <angs> I already installed libusb-1.0 and libusb-dev, do you know is there any portal to search pre-built package for ubuntu arm?
[17:43] <prpplague> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+package/libusb-dev
[17:43] <prpplague> just one example
[17:43] <prpplague> angs: you installed the libusb for you host machine which is x86
[17:43] <prpplague> not the arm ones
[17:45] <angs> prpplague: thank you very much, I am installing the package for beagleboard now
[17:45] <prpplague> angs: google is your friend
[17:46] <angs> right, I was using the wrong keyword to search on google. thank you very much for your help
[17:56] <angs> prpplague: I have one last question. dpkg -i libusb-dev_0.1.12-20_armhf.deb outputs "package architecture (armhf) does not match system (i386)" error. Do you know if it is possible to install that package under /usr/arm-linux-gnueabihf directory?
[17:56] <prpplague> angs: yea, there should also be a cross compile package somewhere
[17:59] <angs> do you know name of the package?
[18:00] <prpplague> angs: no, like i said, i normally build everything from source
[18:00] <prpplague> angs: i am certain there is a howto on the ubuntu wiki pages for what you want to do
[18:00] <prpplague> angs: please check there
[18:01] <angs> prpplague: thank you I will check there


[00:00] <Eickmeyer[m]> arraybolt3: Looks like it was updated with newer graphics in the css.
[00:00] <arraybolt3> Odd, it loads right in an Incognito tab for me. Nevermind, must be my cache.
[00:01] <Eickmeyer[m]> Pretty cool that it's seeing some love.
[00:03] <arraybolt3> Gah, what in the world? Even clearing all of my cache, cookies, etc., Chrome is still loading it entirely mangled.
[00:03] <arraybolt3> Oh. Found it. It's my adblocker.
[00:03] <arraybolt3> So now I just signed out of everything when I didn't need to. Nice. :P
[10:08] <RikMills> kio-admin is in backports-landing
[10:08] <RikMills> mmikowski: Eickmeyer[m] etc ^
 👍 (re @IrcsomeBot: <RikMills> kio-admin is in backports-landing)
[14:10] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[14:18] <Roberalz> hi BluesKaj
[14:20] <BluesKaj> hey Roberalz0


[07:27] <mapp> hi all
[07:55] <MooDoo> morning
[07:58] <mapp> morning MooDoo
[07:58] <mapp> hows it going pal
[08:16] <MooDoo> yeah it's going fine, just ordered myself a server for home
[08:19] <mapp> nice
[08:19] <mapp> :D
[08:20] <mapp> i cant order anything no bloody room here
[08:21] <MooDoo> mapp: having a garage helps and when they are 1u, they stack ;)
[08:22] <mapp> well no garage here;p
[08:22] <mapp> cant even have a desk here
[08:22] <mapp> no room for a desk or a tv
[08:22] <MooDoo> sounds like my home...
[08:22] <mapp> :D
[08:22] <mapp> its a sacrifice
[08:22] <mapp> weather vs space
[08:23] <MooDoo> yeah that's why i'm glad I have a garage....server room in the rafters
[08:23] <MooDoo> lol
[08:23] <mapp> well
[08:23] <mapp> enjoy your 2c:P
[08:23] <mapp> 16c for me
[08:23] <mapp> heh
[08:46] <MooDoo> 2c?
[09:16] <awilkins> or not 2c?
[09:17] <awilkins> That is the question.
[09:33] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Joy Germ Day! :-D
[09:34] <MooDoo> morning JamesTait
[09:34] <JamesTait> MooDoo, o/
[09:47] <MooDoo> :)
[10:49] <daubers> Hello!
[10:49] <popey> Hello!
[10:49] <popey> Hows tricks?
[10:50] <daubers> popey: Tricky
[10:50] <daubers> popey: How be thee?
[10:50] <popey> much the same as usual
[10:50] <daubers> Fair do's
[10:51] <davmor2> popey: Magic but not a lot :)
[10:51] <daubers> I have a really random, kinda off topic question
[10:51] <popey> \o/
[10:51] <popey> we love those
[10:51] <daubers> Has anyone here had an RFID implant?
[10:51] <davmor2> no
[10:51] <popey> hah, no
[10:51] <daubers> Hmmm, I might be crazy then. Going to get one done soon-ish
[10:51] <popey> well. my cats do
[10:51] <davmor2> JamesTait: nice a germ that spread joy,  is it called popey ?
[10:52] <JamesTait> davmor2, I thought it was me! :-P
[10:52] <popey> daubers: for what purpose?
[10:52] <popey> unlocking devices etc?
[10:52] <daubers> popey: Fun! And that
[10:52] <daubers> popey: Also, for unlocking the Hackspace door and so forth
[10:53] <davmor2> JamesTait: no you brighten the day with your greetings for real joy it's all on popey :D  no pressure
[10:53] <popey> what would you progam the rfid with?
[10:53] <popey> I mean, a code or something?
[10:53] <daubers> They each have a unique serial, but there is a secure handshakey crypto way of doing it too
[10:54] <popey> where you having it done? the vet?
[10:54] <daubers> popey: Body Mod place in Southampton
[10:54] <popey> that makes more sense
[10:55] <daubers> :)
[10:55] <daubers> Maybe do the magnet thing next year
[10:55] <daubers> see how I get on with RFID first
[10:55] <popey> i had a friend who had a bar through his ear
[10:56] <popey> was told "don't touch it, let it scab up"
[10:56] <popey> he went home, had a shower, in the shower he tweaked it a tiny bit
[10:56] <popey> went to bed, woke up with head stuck to pillow with dried blood
[10:56] <daubers> Not surprising!
[10:56] <popey> collapsed due to blood loss
[10:56] <daubers> Ouch
[10:57] <daubers> This is effectivley just an injection
[10:57] <popey> where would you put it?
[10:57] <popey> behind your neck like a cat? ☻
[10:57] <popey> the sole of your foot!?
[10:57] <popey> would make for opening doors ninja style fun
[10:57] <daubers> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5zAZq1p0d0 <- For those not scared of needles
[10:57] <davmor2> popey: I assume wrist if it is opening doors
[10:58] <daubers> Between yourthumb and fingers
[10:59] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[11:01] <diplo> Update us on how and what you do with it daubers, I'm interested
[11:01] <daubers> diplo: I'll ask them nicely to video it
[11:02] <diplo> That is one big device to inject it! Not to worried about seeing it daubers :)  more on what you do after :)
[11:02] <daubers> diplo: I'm quite scared of the big needle, but it'll be fun!
[11:02] <daubers> (and painful)
[11:04] <diplo> Yeah, I expect it'll be more than a little prick
[11:04] <diplo> :D
[11:05] <daubers> :)
[11:05] <daubers> A lot of people on youtube who had it done said it wasn't that painful, but you don't know if their saying that just because they don't want to be seen as a wimp
[11:06] <diplo> The guy didn't seem to flinch much on that video
[11:07] <diplo> Just reading up on the one that guy had injected, can link to your phone
[11:07] <diplo> Good security feature to unlock your phone
[11:07] <daubers> Yeah, there are NFC phone unlock apps that work with them
[11:09] <brobostigon> i just noticed something strange, after a while on my nexus 4, things like irssinotifier and pushover messages fail to get through, untill i stick it in airplane mode and back, and then they all suddenly flow back, very strange.
[11:10] <bashrc> gremlins
[11:10] <brobostigon> yep.
[11:11] <Myrtti> well there are cat flaps that read the chip on the cats neck and open it only to them
[11:14] <popey> yeah, i have one of them, not installed it because it's mains powered
[11:19] <daubers> popey: So if it's not your cat it tasers whoever is trying to get in?
[11:20] <popey> heh
[11:20] <awilkins> You can get rat killing traps powered by electricity
[11:20] <awilkins> That would be a logical application
[11:20] <awilkins> I nearly got one but they were hard to come by in the UK
[11:20] <awilkins> (for my loft squirrels)
[11:21] <bashrc> secure all the cat entries
[11:33] <MooDoo> :)
[12:20] <Laney> grr
[12:20] <Laney> just got a call saying the nest installer can't come this afternoon
[12:20] <Laney> what if I'd taken some time off to wait in :(
[12:21] <Myrtti> I almost bought one for the future inlaws, they don't have a thermostat of any kind, just a timer
[12:22] <Myrtti> but couldn't be sure if it'd get used so I didn't
[12:22] <ali12341> what does it do?
[12:27] <Myrtti> learning thermostat is the sales quip
[12:32] <awilkins> I have a radio thermostat
[12:33] <awilkins> Presume it's one of those with some fuzzy logic in it
[12:33] <awilkins> And wifi
[12:39] <directhex> okay, gentlehumans. here is a video of a new game controller. it's bluetooth based, designed for use with an android phone/tablet or PC. your mission is to guess the RRP of this game controller. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMCR1LEfTjI
[12:41] <directhex> the price reveal is at around 7:50. don't spoil it!
[12:42] <zmoylan-pi> if it's been announced at ces, silly money
[12:43]  * zmoylan-pi wonders when it became ok to fleece gamers...
[12:44] <directhex> zmoylan-pi: since forever. see also http://shop.gunnars.com/gaming-eyewear/l/200
[12:44] <shauno> I think half the time they're asking to be fleeced.  a lot of 'gamer' products makes them look like the audiophiles of the IT world
[12:44] <zmoylan-pi> no, i remember my zx spectrum, a game for ir£2.75 or ir£3.80 on budget games
[12:45] <zmoylan-pi> full price was ir£15
[12:45] <zmoylan-pi> i could easily get a game a week, when i got a nintendo ds for commuting a game a month as they cost €40+
[12:46] <zmoylan-pi> bbc, amstrad, commodore games were the same
[12:46] <zmoylan-pi> only when nintendo consoles kicked off with cartridges in 80s did the gouging begin in earnst.  to my mind anyway
[12:47] <directhex> prices have been decreasing over the years, accounting for inflation
[12:47] <directhex> N64 games were often £50 or £60 new, in the mid 1990s
[12:48] <zmoylan-pi> yes... and no. most of the early games were trivial to copy so most games were bought to be shared with others
[12:48] <shauno> I honestly don't remember game prices.  almost everything I had on the amiga was courtesy of xcopy
[12:49] <ali12341> they were like £35
[12:49] <ali12341> £19 for older releases and £10 for "budget" games
[12:49] <shauno> by time I started working most of them were being sold on whitelabels in EB
[12:50] <zmoylan-pi> wow, my last computer didn't cost that much! (the bt controller)
[12:54] <directhex> ali12341: games still cost around that.
[12:55] <ali12341> sure, on PC
[12:55] <zmoylan-pi> amiga games were cheaper than nintendo games in 80s.  and you could still copy them so actual cost wasn't so high as % of your collection would be copies
[12:57] <zmoylan-pi> sony playstation has or at least had (when i had a ps1) their platinum collection where you could get 2-3 year old games cheap plus you had second hand games.
[12:57] <TwistedLucidity> directhex: What on earth are those glasses supposed to do?
[12:57] <zmoylan-pi> but now the consoles seem to be eliminating the second hand market
[12:57] <ali12341> yeah i think those were like £20
[12:58] <zmoylan-pi> i really liked sim city on playstation, harder on controller than keyboard and mouse but still a good game
[12:58] <zmoylan-pi> i got it second hand. cheap
[12:58] <TwistedLucidity> Games: https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos_games/v2
[12:58] <TwistedLucidity> Games: https://archive.org/details/classicpcgames
[12:59] <directhex> TwistedLucidity: um... eliminate glare, i think
[12:59] <directhex> ali12341: on console
[12:59] <zmoylan-pi> isn't the correct way to eliminate glare to play in basement or some room blocked off forever from natural light? :-)
[12:59] <TwistedLucidity> directhex: Eliminate. Glare. So...polarised. For that moment. Morons.
[12:59] <TwistedLucidity> "that money"
[13:00] <directhex> ali12341: some games cost more. but plenty of "proper" games ship brand-new on current-gen consoles for very little more than amiga games did. sometimes less.
[13:00] <ali12341> i think they are supposed to reduce blue/white light
[13:00] <directhex> not accounting for inflation
[13:01] <directhex> e.g. smash bros wiiu is £35 at game, that came out for xmas. halo master chief colection (a 4-game HD remaster) is £35 at game. less at tesco
[13:02] <ali12341> yeah, the mid 2000s was the peak pricing, when games were selling for £60
[13:02] <ali12341> now they sell half the game for £30 then hit you for another £60 in DLC
[13:03] <directhex> in some cases, yeah
[13:03] <zmoylan-pi> so real pricing has gone up. or rather the gouging
[13:03] <directhex> basically call of duty. which people will pay anything for
[13:04] <directhex> some gouging is gougier than other gouging
[13:04] <ali12341> is elite dangerous good?
[13:04] <directhex> a lot of it is... a workaround for firing 200 people every time a game is nearing completion
[13:05] <zmoylan-pi> so hollywood accounting gamer style
[13:10] <directhex> zmoylan-pi: nah, hollywood accounting is different. game publishers don't want losses on paper
[13:11] <zmoylan-pi> don't want to much profit either... all those poor companies going bust
[13:12] <Myrtti> well that was quick
[13:12] <directhex> zmoylan-pi: the budget for a modern game is, dev+marketing, 8 figures.
[13:12] <Myrtti> got the Ubuntu stickers already today
[13:12] <Myrtti> only ordered them yesterday
[13:13] <directhex> zmoylan-pi: let's say a 50:50 split. up to 300 staff working on a game at once, but with elastic team size from around 30 minimum to that 300 maximum.
[13:14] <directhex> zmoylan-pi: once a game is "done" (i.e. sent to publisher for QA, pressing, distribution, sale), what do you do with the 270 people not needed at the start of a project?
[13:14] <Myrtti> perfic
[13:15] <zmoylan-pi> tag them and release them into the wild to be free?
[13:15] <Myrtti> there, covered the Dell logo on the lid and Windows logo on the Super key
[13:15] <directhex> and with $80M on the line, you *cannot* afford to make a loss. the game needs to be a success, one way or another. hence gouging with microtransactions. "smartphone generation gamers demand the ability to boost their progress by buying cars & guns!"
[13:16] <directhex> and "okay, now the team is moving into production on DLC, rather than being fired, to help prop up the release and keep working" is where DLC comes from
[13:16] <directhex> split into smaller teams, work on multiple DLC packs in tandem
[13:24] <ali12341> i would put them to work porting games to linux
[14:15] <popey> blinkbox now part of talktalk...
[14:15] <popey> https://support.blinkbox.com/hc/en-gb/articles/204428707
[14:20] <Myrtti> how unsurprising
[14:20] <Myrtti> Tesco is closing stores and selling stuff that isn't their core business
[14:20] <popey> yeah
[14:20] <popey> yet they are planning to open a new one near me
[14:20] <popey> small one, annoying people in the process
[14:20] <Myrtti> old pub refurbed?
[14:21] <Myrtti> that seems to be the MO everywhere
[14:21] <Myrtti> and not only for Tesco
[14:21] <zmoylan-pi> the lidl near me is the one that does all the business
[14:22] <Myrtti> I don't mind shopping at Tesco nowadays after ours was refurbed
[14:22] <Myrtti> it doesn't feel like a miserable old cave anymore
[14:22] <zmoylan-pi> as long as they have staff who understand stock rotation...
[14:22] <Myrtti> and having done the Christmas food shop in Finland in a big supermarket, I nearly cried when I got home to UK
[14:22] <zmoylan-pi> they did stop our nearby tescos been 24 hours as the only ones who used it at night were drug dealers
[14:23] <directhex> ali12341: not the same people. environment artists aren't good at porting.
[14:23] <directhex> you need your programmers on hand until past release, for patching
[14:24] <Myrtti> I hadn't been so surprised for a good while, 21st of Dec and store full of people trying to do their Christmas shop before it all descends into madness, and not a shop assistant in sight
[14:24] <ali12341> well they'd have to learn
[14:24] <Myrtti> took me a good 10 minutes to find a person to ask if they've got molasses somewhere to get a response "if it's not on the shelf, then no"
[14:24] <Myrtti> "thanks"
[14:25] <popey> Myrtti: one was indeed an old pub
[14:25] <popey> another is to demolish a car sales place
[14:25] <zmoylan-pi> a grade ii listed car dealer? :-P
[14:27] <popey> conveniently the local paper scanned their front page so I didn't need to buy it to read the article
[14:27] <popey> https://twitter.com/FarnboroughNews/status/553127873629130752
[14:29] <zmoylan-pi> so you won't be downloading their app then? :-)
[14:31] <popey> nah
[14:48] <popey> Sudden flashback to using Berol handwriting pens at school
[14:49] <zmoylan-pi> i used cartridge pens as my handwriting was unreadable otherwise
[14:57] <TwistedLucidity> popey: There were some...concerns over how a certain large supermarket chain arrived here. Not sure how libellous the accusations are...
[15:27] <brobostigon> would there be a way, to stream a video, from my desktop to my smart-tv, by some means, like with chromecast.?
[15:28] <diplo> dlna server on the desktop brobostigon
[15:28] <diplo> That's what my friend does
[15:28] <Myrtti> yup
[15:28] <Myrtti> dlna of somekind, be it Plex or minidlna or mediatomb
[15:28] <diplo> MiniDLNA i think he uses
[15:29] <diplo> :P
[15:29] <brobostigon> ok, so i could point said dlna server at lets say a dvd, and do that?
[15:29] <zmoylan-pi>  dlna... attack!! :-)
[15:30] <brobostigon> my dvd player has packed up the ghost, hence the question.
[15:30] <SuperMatt> anyone got a good command for restoring all the permissions for someone who has run chown -R / ?
[15:31] <diddledan> SuperMatt, that's a pain to fix
[15:31] <brobostigon> could i push the vide from vlc to the tv, for example?
[15:31] <brobostigon> dvd*
[15:33] <diplo> brobostigon, I honestly don't know, sounds doable
[15:33] <diplo> But may be a little trouble
[15:33] <brobostigon> i agree, i just cant find a solution to it.
[15:34] <diplo> Rip the dvd to mkv ? :)
[15:35] <diplo> not sure how the menu would be supported
[15:35] <zmoylan-pi> i spent 18 months ripping my dvd collection.  still adding to it
[15:35] <brobostigon> thats an idea diplo
[15:35] <diplo> Same here zmoylan-pi, 600+ films now
[15:35] <diplo> Handbrake is the simple solution I found
[15:35] <diplo> http://handbrake.fr
[15:36] <zmoylan-pi> i used handbrake a lot as i was using a mac at the time.  also on linux at the moment but i have dabbled in others when they've put up resistance
[15:37] <MooDoo> I use dvdshrink in wine, works a treat rip to vob or iso
[15:37] <MooDoo> vlc does play iso dvds
[15:37] <zmoylan-pi> vlc seems to play everything...
[15:38] <zmoylan-pi> when the aliens arrive to invade, their announcement will be played via vlc :-)
[15:38] <popey> mpv > vlc
[15:38] <popey> IMO
[15:41] <ali12341> vlc can't play h264 correctly
[15:42] <ali12341> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vlc/+bug/1391837
[15:42] <DJones> brobostigon: I've just set up minidnla on my server to stream to a smart tv, took about 5 minutes to set up
[15:43] <ali12341> it also produces different output depending on how fast your computer is, apparently
[15:43] <brobostigon> DJones: yep, i have minidlna setup on my rpi, to share videos of iplayer, works well.
[15:46] <diddledan> ali12341, weird that the bug has been marked "invalid" when you've provided evidence
[15:46] <ali12341> i wish it was weird, sadly it's what i have come to expect
[15:47] <diddledan> it would be understandable if other players also did the same thing, but you've shown that two players behave differently
[15:52] <ali12341> not just differently, *correctly*
[15:59] <awilkins> Hrrmph
[15:59] <awilkins> My broadband upgrade came through
[16:00] <awilkins> Operational config : 100Mbit/s
[16:00] <awilkins> Actual speed : still less than 20Mbit/s
[16:01] <zmoylan-pi> tsk, you're slumming it at 20Mbit/s :-)
[16:01] <awilkins> My upstream doubled
[16:01] <awilkins> 6Mbit/s now
[16:02] <diddledan> wow, awilkins that's bad
[16:02] <awilkins> Have posted on their forums
[16:02] <diddledan> awilkins, issat virgin?
[16:02] <awilkins> Yeah
[16:02] <awilkins> Checked my power levels
[16:02] <awilkins> They're off, apparently
[16:02] <awilkins> Removed the attenuator and they're still off
[16:03] <awilkins> Think I need a 10dB attenuator rather than 20
[16:13] <diddledan> awilkins, that'll not be "half the attenuation"
[16:13] <awilkins> diddledan, I know :-)
[16:13] <diddledan> that'll be more like 1/8th the attenuation?
[16:14] <awilkins> But you can still use addition on the decibel scale because it's log
[16:14] <awilkins> Removing it put me from about -9 to +11
[16:14] <diddledan> every 3db step is a doubling iirc
[16:14] <diddledan> so it's a curve rather than linear
[16:14] <awilkins> No idea what the right power levels are supposed to be
[16:14] <diddledan> me either :-p
[16:15] <zmoylan-pi> but you're at +11 that should be best!!
[16:15] <diddledan> zmoylan-pi, it's 1 more powers than 10
[16:15] <zmoylan-pi> exactly :-)
[17:02]  * diddledan reading about political fallout from paris sadness
[17:03] <diddledan> nigel ferage has gone on record stating that britain and france (and presumably others) have a "fifth column" of people who hate us
[17:07] <diddledan> there's talk of a bomb having gone off in lyon, today, now
[17:14] <zmoylan-pi> i thought farage was in the fifth column who hated britain
[17:14] <diddledan> perhaps that's why he said it - hide in plain sight?
[17:15] <zmoylan-pi> don't get much plainer
[17:15] <diddledan> my response to the news is: je suis charlie
[17:19] <intrbiz> groups of people have hated other groups of people for a long time
[17:19] <intrbiz> and will continue to do so
[22:09] <mapito> anyone used a dual sim phone? wonder if its possible to have 2 sims in..1 set as  active so would be using that BUT if a call comes into other sims number you can still answer it?
[22:55] <diddledan> apparently gay can cause accidents: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30735673
[22:56] <sebsebseb> hi
[22:56] <sebsebseb> anyone about?
[22:56] <diddledan> nope
[22:57] <intrbiz> sebsebseb: hi
[22:57] <intrbiz> diddledan: wow, that is not good
[22:57] <sebsebseb> intrbiz: oh it's you
[22:57] <intrbiz> sebsebseb: yeh
[22:57] <sebsebseb> anyway Jimmy Wales on Question Time hmm
[22:58] <sebsebseb> Wikipedia founder
[22:59] <intrbiz> sebsebseb: yeh
[23:03] <diddledan> no spoilers on qt please. I've just started watching
[23:04] <intrbiz> diddledan: ok
[23:12] <sebsebseb> diddledan: ar you watching live or behind?
[23:12] <diddledan> behind - iplayer timeshiting
[23:13] <sebsebseb> oh
[23:13] <diddledan> +f
[23:16] <mapito> whats fsf sebsebseb
[23:17] <mapito> i ordered my new phone motorola g dual sim :D sick of taking phone out of case to switch rom EE to gibtel
[23:18] <sebsebseb> hmm interesting:  http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/01/intel-compute-stick-specs-ubuntu-version
[23:18] <sebsebseb> mapito: realy you don't know what FSF is?
[23:18] <zmoylan-pi> half the ram for the linux version though is annoying
[23:18] <sebsebseb> how long have you used  Desktop LInuxfor?
[23:18] <sebsebseb> zmoylan-pi: yeah lesser specs, but may be able to put it on the  better specs
[23:19] <zmoylan-pi> while paying for windows licence...
[23:19] <sebsebseb> mapito: you don't know what FSF is really?
[23:19] <sebsebseb> mapito: you must be quite new to Linu etc if so
[23:20] <mapito> free software foundation?
[23:20] <mapito> i was only asking
[23:20] <sebsebseb> yep bingo free software foundation
[23:20] <mapito> ;]
[23:20] <intrbiz> mapito: the Ubuntu phone davmor2 has is dual sim
[23:21] <sebsebseb> intrbiz: should have phooted yu maybe at the event heh heh, oh well
[23:21] <sebsebseb> ah yes I coudn't anway since.  full phone  etc uh
[23:21] <intrbiz> sebsebseb: should have what me?
[23:22] <mapito> nice didnt knw any ubuntu phones were out
[23:22] <mapito> also
 anyone used a dual sim phone? wonder if its possible to have 2 sims in..1 set as  active so would be using that BUT if a call comes into other sims number you can still answer it?
[23:22] <mapito> anyone got any ideas
[23:23] <sebsebseb> mapito: no Ubuntu phone isn't out yet
[23:23] <sebsebseb> ,but the first one should go on sale next month
[23:23] <mapito> ah
[23:23] <sebsebseb> for now the most interesitng phone out
[23:23] <sebsebseb> is proaby Jolla really :)
[23:23] <intrbiz> mapito: as I understand it, both sims are active and you can make / recieve calls on both
[23:23] <mapito> sweet
[23:23] <mapito> so you dont have to switch between
[23:23] <sebsebseb> my one  came on Monday, and Jolla really is awesome it seems :)
[23:24] <intrbiz> mapito: that will depend on the software I expect
[23:24] <mapito> wonder how it works so i can make it use 3G on gibtel sim thats basically why i wanted dual sim
[23:24] <mapito> 3g on gibtel calls'texts on ee
[23:24] <intrbiz> mapito: IIRC the one davmor2 has, was 3G on one sim, 2G on the other
[23:24] <mapito> I'd need to make sure it doesnt use 3g on ee tho as id be charged roaming
[23:25] <intrbiz> mapito: sure, that is gonna depend on what device / software you are running I suspect
[23:26] <intrbiz> well, QT seems to have descended into a slagging match again
[23:26] <sebsebseb> yeah ee sucks really iti seems, or it's just m sucky oragne contract that mainly ame over
[23:26] <sebsebseb> ,but nah  giffgaff seems it's going t be better for me
[23:26] <sebsebseb> soon I wil switch :)
[23:26] <sebsebseb> a month left on the sucky contract though I think or porbaby
[23:26] <mapito> well i use my ee for calls to eu and texts
[23:26] <mapito> as im abroad
[23:26] <mapito> butdata costs too much
[23:26] <zmoylan-pi> geek aquarium to look at and relax... :-) http://www.flightradar24.com/RYR73NC/53a74cf
[23:27] <sebsebseb> then I can get the right card for my Jolla pone to.  microsim or whatever it was yeah, and hten I can start using that as an actsaul phone to
[23:27] <sebsebseb> instead of just a toy
[23:27] <sebsebseb> mapito: yeah I have used Orange/EE abroad to.  probably be doing that again soon for my last time
[23:28] <sebsebseb> where are you at the moment then?
[23:28] <intrbiz> zmoylan-pi: yeh I spent too much time there
[23:28] <mapito> its decent tho having free calls when abroad..so if youre in Eu its free calls to EU BUT only when travelling..if i called spain from my ee contract while in uk it isnt free
[23:28] <mapito> Gibraltar
[23:28] <mapito> sebsebseb, surely on this Motorola G it will be possible to turn data off for a specific sim or chose whic to use? has to be id think
[23:28] <sebsebseb> it's a £2 a day deal thing on my thing
[23:28] <sebsebseb> or
[23:28] <sebsebseb> paying  for what is used
[23:29] <sebsebseb> when abroad
[23:29] <mapito> yea id rather use my gibtel unlimited 3g
[23:29]  * sebsebseb I wonder how giffgaff works when abroad hmm
[23:30] <mapito> going from ios to android..used iphone for years
[23:30] <sebsebseb> mapito: Gibratler is nice went thee years ago
[23:30] <sebsebseb> mapito: oh and watch out for the monkeys at the top of  the rock
[23:30] <mapito> hahaha yea been up there..sometimes see them just in the street
[23:30] <mapito> at the top of main street
[23:30] <sebsebseb> yeah, but  they wil do stuff that you don't want done to you
[23:30] <sebsebseb> if your not careful
[23:31] <sebsebseb> or when I was there anyway
[23:31] <sebsebseb> did you move there, or just visiting?
[23:32] <mapito> working here till end of March minimum
[23:32] <sebsebseb> oh ok nice
[23:32] <mapito> http://twitter.com/mapppps can see photo of moinkey at top;p
[23:33] <sebsebseb> mapito: so what money do they have there now.  Euro, and  some sort of Gibralten pound ?
[23:33] <mapito> GIP
[23:33] <mapito> Gibrsltar pound
[23:33] <mapito> but
[23:33] <mapito> you can use UK pounds its 1:1 and the machines and shops take/give both
[23:34] <mapito> ut cant spend GIP in UK
[23:34] <sebsebseb> when I was there  it was  before euro,  so  Spannish money and their own thing
[23:34] <sebsebseb> altough yeah I think UK money  coul get accepted to
[23:34] <sebsebseb> what about teh euro?
[23:34] <sebsebseb> or they don't do that?
[23:34] <mapito> yea can pay in euros most places like restaurants/bars
[23:34] <mapito> or even Morrisons
[23:34] <sebsebseb> hmm so it's three currencies
[23:35] <mapito> its handy though here we can use UK debit and credit cards with 0 fees/charge :D
[23:35] <sebsebseb> also oh Morisions is in Gibralter,  well  yeah it's like Britian in quite a fewways really from waht I remember, but with differneces, and nicer place
[23:35] <intrbiz> GIP is essentially like scotish bank notes, issued locally but backed by the bank of england
[23:35] <mapito> yep
[23:35] <mapito> but
[23:35] <sebsebseb> oh
[23:35] <mapito> if you havce GIP ou cant use it in the UK
[23:35] <mapito> places wont take it
[23:35] <intrbiz> sure
[23:35] <sebsebseb> indeed Gibrlten money won't be accepted in UK
[23:36] <mapito> but its a 1:1 ratio..the notes ive got on me atm are UK notes..but casino atm usually gives GIP
[23:36] <intrbiz> scotish bank notes aren't strictly legal tending in england + wales
[23:36] <zmoylan-pi> can't you exchange them in bank in uk?
[23:36] <mapito> dont think so
[23:36] <intrbiz> you should be able to
[23:37] <sebsebseb> three currencies for Gibralter, wel you said euro as well it seems
[23:37] <sebsebseb> ,but that's intersting
[23:37] <sebsebseb> such a small place
[23:37] <intrbiz> Gib have to back in the BoE anything they print
[23:37] <sebsebseb> and three currencies
[23:37] <mapito> well
[23:37] <sebsebseb> what's BoE ?
[23:37] <intrbiz> bank of england
[23:37] <mapito> i mean GIP IS GBP basically i think it always says £ gbp most places
[23:37] <intrbiz> so if RBS want to print a £10 note, they have to deposit £10 with the BoE
[23:38] <sebsebseb> mapito: the Spannish won't like you if you try and get in there :d
[23:38] <mapito> and euros will be accepted by big stores..and restaurants..gauchos..gatsbys ...morrisons and a few bars
[23:38] <mapito> been to spain (La Linea) a few times
[23:38] <sebsebseb> how long has Morrisons been in Gibralter?
[23:38] <mapito> 30 years
[23:38] <mapito> says it at the store entrance
[23:38] <sebsebseb> reallly o
[23:38] <sebsebseb> oh
[23:39] <sebsebseb> oh right wel I dind't go there
[23:39] <mapito> and luckily for me..I live RIGHT by morrisons i can get there in say 2minutes lol
[23:39] <sebsebseb> I don't think when I went
[23:39] <sebsebseb> ,but
[23:39] <sebsebseb> is there only like one super market
[23:39] <mapito> right by Morrisons and right by McDonalds...5minutes from work
[23:39] <sebsebseb> for whole of Gibrlater
[23:39] <sebsebseb> or smething
[23:39] <sebsebseb> it's small
[23:39] <mapito> if you know where Waterport place  is?
[23:39] <sebsebseb> no  not at all, long time ago when I went there to
[23:39] <intrbiz> mapito: what are you working on out there?
[23:39] <mapito> I work there..wakk there in 5..handy as being near morrisons..so i dont have far to walk with my shopping
[23:39] <mapito> there's an Eroski right by the border now sebsebseb  near the airport
[23:40] <mapito> but i man or me..without a car way better to be near morrisons
[23:40] <mapito> oh
[23:40] <sebsebseb> Eroski yeah I been to those in  uhmm  Menorca
[23:40] <mapito> and i can walk to ocean village in say 15
[23:40] <mapito> you know ocean village? casino/bars etc there..
[23:40] <mapito> work for bet365.com intrbiz
[23:40] <sebsebseb> no don't kmnow  the casions etc there
[23:40] <sebsebseb> would be nice to go back to Gibralte at same stage
[23:40] <intrbiz> mapito: ah ok
[23:40] <sebsebseb> I went as a teenager
[23:40] <mapito> did you see my picture?:D
[23:40] <mapito> use it as twitter
[23:41] <intrbiz> mapito: I was approached by a recuriter for a postgresql job for a 'gaming' company out there a few years back
[23:41] <sebsebseb> mapito: one ISP for whole of Gibrlater? :D
[23:41] <intrbiz> mapito: took me a while to realise that meant gambling
[23:41] <mapito> nice intrbiz  wonder who and what pay
[23:41] <mapito> yea basically ..gibtelecom
[23:42] <intrbiz> mapito: I never new the actual company, it was a 'html5 gaming' company
[23:42] <mapito> its ok being here
[23:42] <mapito> we got a good deal they wanted us to come
[23:43] <mapito> so we all got a decent offer
[23:43] <intrbiz> mapito: the sunshine was kind of appealing
[23:43] <mapito> wanted 40people to come from UK/externals by end of september
[23:48] <intrbiz> anyone there watch this week?
[23:48] <mapito> whats that
[23:48] <diddledan> "next week on this week, tonight."
[23:49] <mapito> O_o
[23:49] <intrbiz> mapito: political comentary show on bbc one after bbc qt
[23:49] <mapito> ah


[00:52] <anastasiamac> davecheney: ping
[01:10] <anastasiamac> davecheney: all sorted
[01:11] <wallyworld> thumper: menn0: waigani: anyone else: I unblocked trunk by reverting a regression commit and reclassifying the associated bug as High for trunk (still critical for 1.22, 1.21)
[01:11] <wallyworld> this was a per agreement with curtis
[01:11] <thumper> ok, cool, ta
[01:14] <waigani> wallyworld: thanks :)
[01:14] <wallyworld> np :-)
[01:24] <menn0> wallyworld: tyvm
[01:29] <thumper> fuck fuck fuck fuck
[01:30] <rick_h_> thumper: you rang?
[01:30] <rick_h_> :P
[01:30]  * thumper sighs
[01:30] <thumper> we are starting lxc containers on a power machine with amd64 tools
[01:31] <thumper> and wondering why it is erroring weirdly
[01:31] <rick_h_> thumper: hmm, that seems less than ideal
[01:31] <thumper> I'm trying to work out where it got the wrong tools set
[01:35] <thumper> fark
[01:48] <thumper> wallyworld: bot still showing blocked
[01:48] <thumper> wallyworld: regression query not showing blocked
[01:48]  * thumper is confused
[01:48] <wallyworld> thumper: huh? anastasiamac told me she got something accepted
[01:49] <thumper> ok, maybe I tried too soon
[01:49] <wallyworld> there were 2 bugs - one i marked fix released, ther or as high
[01:49] <thumper> it was just after you mentioned above
[01:49] <wallyworld> ah, i was in the process of marking as fix released
[01:49] <wallyworld> sorry
[01:50] <thumper> ok
[01:50] <thumper> I've tried them again
[01:50] <thumper> we'll see if they land now?
[01:54] <anastasiamac> wallyworld: i got something accepted by the bot but not landed
[01:54] <anastasiamac> wallyworld: machine_test.go:1102:
[01:54] <anastasiamac>     c.Assert(sortedUnitNames(got), gc.DeepEquals, expect)
[01:54] <anastasiamac> ... obtained []string = []string{"s2/2", "s3/2"}
[01:54] <anastasiamac> ... expected []string = []string{"s2/2", "s3/1"}
[01:54] <wallyworld> sure, false error
[01:54] <wallyworld> but it wasn't rejected due to policy
[01:54] <anastasiamac> wallyworld: as in re-$$merge
[01:54] <wallyworld> yep
[01:55] <wallyworld> that's one of our aewsome transient errors
[02:01] <ericsnow> wallyworld: I got bit by that one 3 or 4 times in a row last night
[02:01] <wallyworld> sigh
[02:01] <wallyworld> is there a bug raised? who does annotate say added the test?
[02:03] <wwitzel3> ok, so we've run into an issue with the rsyslog direct connections, when we ensure-availability, all of the state machines end up with different rsyslog certs.
[02:03] <wwitzel3> and the logging is distributed to all 3 of them, so we end up with 1 successful connection, and two failed connections for every nodes rsyslog worker, in a constant loop and it floods the error log.
[02:04] <wallyworld> wwitzel3: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1417875 ??
[02:04] <mup> Bug #1417875: ERROR juju.worker runner.go:219 exited "rsyslog": x509: certificate signed by unknown authority <canonical-bootstack> <logging> <regression> <juju-core:Triaged by wwitzel3> <juju-core 1.21:Triaged by wwitzel3> <juju-core 1.22:Triaged by wwitzel3> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1417875>
[02:04] <wwitzel3> wallyworld: correct
[02:04] <wallyworld> so you managed to diagnose the cause :-)
[02:04] <wwitzel3> wallyworld: I wasn't able to reproduce until I worked with Paul and figured out it was ensure-availability
[02:04] <wallyworld> ah, good effort!
[02:04] <wwitzel3> wallyworld: yep, all my attempts to reproduce were non-HA
[02:05] <wwitzel3> so manual work around is copy the rsyslog-cert and rsyslog-key from machine 0 to 1 and 2
[02:05] <wwitzel3> that resolves the issue
[02:06] <wallyworld> so the fix will be to hand out the machine 0 certs when adding new state servers?
[02:06] <wwitzel3> wallyworld: right, for the rsyslog certs
[02:07] <wallyworld> or master
[02:07] <wallyworld> s/0/master
[02:07] <wwitzel3> wallyworld: right
[02:07] <wallyworld> a couple of day's work i guess
[02:07] <wwitzel3> wallyworld: I didn't see an easy way
[02:08] <wallyworld> yeah, me either at first glance
[02:11] <anastasiamac> thumper: let's not be greedy with bot...
[02:12] <wallyworld> thumper? greedy? never
[02:13] <thumper> anastasiamac: it is only two
[02:13] <thumper> geez
[02:13] <anastasiamac> thumper: hmm... keeping score?..
[02:14] <thumper> anastasiamac: I'm aiming for that 'nothing better' feeling of landing code
[02:14] <anastasiamac> thumper: ahh, then we'd beta not disturb
[02:18] <thumper> rick_h_: you around?
[02:18] <thumper> still?
[02:27] <anastasiamac> thumper: there goes that feeling
[02:58] <rick_h_> thumper: no, I ran away
[02:58] <thumper> rick_h_: ok, I hear you are ill, go to bed :)
[02:58] <rick_h_> yea, keep thinking about that
[02:59] <rick_h_> figured I'd listen to you guys talk and it'll put me to sleep :P
[03:10] <axw> wallyworld: ah, I just noticed there's a page 2 :)
[03:10] <axw> hence why I didn't see the upgrade step before
[04:06] <jog> wallyworld, I'm seeing "ERROR juju.cmd supercommand.go:323 connection is shut down" intermittently with 1.21. Do you know anything about that?
[04:06] <wallyworld> no :-(
[04:07] <jog> happens when attempting 'juju deploy'
[04:07] <jog> mainly seeing it with MaaS 1.8
[04:08] <jog> but I'm looking for more instances of it on other substrates
[04:09] <jog> wallyworld, the red failures from Feb 11 and 12 on this page are examples: http://juju-ci.vapour.ws:8080/job/test-maas-1_8/
[04:10] <wallyworld> jog: sadly our CLI sucks - it doesn't report the real root cause error
[04:10] <wallyworld> it just gives that connectio shutdown
[04:11] <wallyworld> so you'd need to go look at the debug log
[04:11] <jog> wallyworld, I've added --debug for future runs, will that help?
[04:12] <wallyworld> jog: maybe, but likely not - it's the server side logs (machine-X.log or allmachines.log) that would be needed
[04:12] <jog> ok, I'll see what I can do about capturing those...
[04:14] <dimitern> jog, you could bootstrap the environment with "logging-config: <root>=INFO,unit=DEBUG"
[04:15] <dimitern> jog, and then the unit-X.log files are likely to contain useful data, in addition to the machine logs
[04:16] <jog> dimitern, alright that's an entry in the environments.yaml right?
[04:17] <dimitern> jog, yeah; for existing envs, you can also change it with juju set-env logging-config='<root>=INFO,unit=DEBUG'  << thumper, this should work, right?
[04:29] <jog> dimitern, with MaaS... juju status gives the dns-name: as a FQDN only know to the MaaS server for example: 'maas-node-402.maas'
[04:29] <jog> most clients don't point there DNS as the MaaS server, so they can really do anything with that information.
[04:30] <jog> Is it possible to provide the IP? dimitern if you're not the right person to ask do you know who is?
[04:30] <dimitern> jog, that's true I guess - for that reason I had fixes a few issues around api endpoints (e.g. resolving hosts if possible)
[04:30] <dimitern> jog, by juju you mean?
[04:31] <jog> the 'juju status' output
[04:32] <dimitern> jog, how about public-address field for units?
[04:32] <dimitern> jog, I think this is an IP even with MAAS
[04:32] <jog> it's the same, there is an example: http://juju-ci.vapour.ws:8080/job/test-maas-1_8/22/console
[04:34] <dimitern> jog, how about juju run --unit dummy-source/0 'unit-get private-address' ?
[04:34] <dimitern> jog, well, you can also (e.g. in a script) just try resolving the dns-name using the maas DNS server I guess
[04:38] <jog> dimitern, I'll try the unit-get method and yeah I can script a way to resolve the dns-name... just wondering if it's a usability issue.
[04:39] <dimitern> jog, it has been brought up before
[04:39] <jog> ok, I thought I'd seen a bug for it before
[04:39] <dimitern> jog, and now in pretty much all other providers we do return resolved IPs instead of hostnames, except for maas (as it prefers to refer to nodes by dns names)
[04:51] <jog> dimitern, so I must be doing something wrong when setting logging-config:
[04:52] <jog> I've tired both "logging-config: <root>=INFO,unit=DEBUG" and "logging-config: '<root>=INFO,unit=DEBUG'" in my environments.yaml
[04:53] <jog> but get ERROR juju.cmd supercommand.go:323 there was an issue examining the environment: unknown severity level "INFO,unit=DEBUG"
[04:53] <dimitern> jog, ah, I see - so the second one is fo the command line only, as in juju set-env logging-config='<root>=TRACE'
[04:54] <dimitern> jog, while the first one is for envs.yaml
[04:54] <dimitern> jog, but as now I actually checked "juju help logging", the format uses "; " not "," as separators
[04:55] <menn0> jam: ping
[05:00] <davecheney> review board is a piece of shit
[05:01] <davecheney> why does it publish all your comments, when you push the "publish" buttont
[05:01] <davecheney> ****EXCEPT***** the ones where you have commented in the review branch (not review diff) screen
[05:01] <davecheney> that has a seperate, partially obscured, publish button
[05:02] <dimitern> davecheney, you can do it for single comments, but IIRC you have to publish each one after adding, rather than hitting the "review-wide" publish
[05:02] <davecheney> dimitern: the way it works out for me
[05:02] <davecheney> there are comments when you are reviewing the diff
[05:02] <davecheney> then there is the hovering button at the top of the page to publish or review them
[05:02] <davecheney> there is the 'review' and 'ship it' buttons on the view diff and view review pages
[05:03] <davecheney> but if you're having a conversation in the comments section (not on the view diff)
[05:03] <davecheney> there is an entirely seperate and different "publish" button hidden just below the list of issues on the view reviews page
[05:03] <davecheney> you only know if you ened to push it by looking on the dashboard
[05:03] <davecheney> seeing the icon is orange (?) not blue, and hte mouse over hover says "comments drafted'
[05:03] <dimitern> yep, not quite thought through UX
[05:06] <dimitern> also, beware - if you're editing a comment and you wifi connection drops (or is down) when you submit the comment (still draft) UI-wise it appears on the page, but a few seconds later you're taken to a nasty "connection failed" page and "back" doesn't help getting your comment text back
[05:17] <davecheney> yay, cloud!
[05:44] <thumper> dimitern: we append the unit=DEBUG unless they explicitly set unit to be otherwise
[05:44] <thumper> dimitern: so you were mostly right
[05:44] <thumper> be careful about setting <root> to debug
[05:44] <thumper> as that'll get golxc and other libraries that also use loggo
[05:45] <thumper> juju=DEBUG is good
[07:01] <wallyworld> axw: i've updated the storage pools PR for your viewing "pleasure"
[08:26] <axw> wallyworld: sorry, I was out before. will look shortly
[08:27] <TheMue> morning o/
[08:33] <Muntaner> good morning devs o/
[08:33] <Muntaner> gsamfira: hi! adventuring myself in trying http://www.cloudbase.it/ws2012r2/
[09:14] <jam> menn0: poke
[09:14] <jam> I tried poking earlier but didn't see you online
[09:31] <axw> wallyworld: reviewed
[09:31] <axw> sorry for the delay
[09:32] <frankban> dimitern: morning, I updated my branch as suggested, could you please take another look?
[09:32] <dimitern> frankban, yes, I'm already looking
[09:32] <dimitern> frankban, thanks for doing all that so quickly btw!
[09:33] <frankban> ty
[09:33] <dimitern> frankban, 99% of the PR looks great, I just want to double-check TestMachinePrincipalUnits as I've seen it fail on ppc64el recently due to some sort ordering
[09:34] <frankban> dimitern: sortedUnitNames failing on ppc?
[09:35] <frankban> sounds weird
[09:35] <dimitern> frankban, nope, sorry - run-unit-tests-trusty-amd64 build #2145 was the one that failed
[09:35] <dimitern> frankban, http://juju-ci.vapour.ws:8080/job/run-unit-tests-trusty-amd64/2145/console
[09:38] <dimitern> frankban, it seems the culprit is line #1077 - units[3], err = s3.AllUnits()
[09:39] <dimitern> frankban, so I was thinking if I could suggest a fix for you to include there
[09:40] <frankban> dimitern: go ahead
[09:41] <dimitern> frankban, will do, once I can see where's the issue and reproduce it :)
[09:41] <frankban> dimitern: heh, ok ty
[09:42] <Muntaner> guys - a non Juju related question here - is "sed" the best way to edit conf files via a bash script?
[09:49] <frankban> dimitern: can it be something related to units slices mutated by append? should we reslice in sortedUnitNames(append(a.units, a.subordinates...))?
[09:52] <dimitern> frankban, perhaps, still looking
[09:57] <voidspace> dimitern: TheMue: dooferlad: making coffee, be with you in a couple of minutes
[09:58] <TheMue> voidspace: ok
[09:58] <dimitern> voidspace, ok
[10:00] <jam> team standup
[10:01] <dimitern> TheMue, voidspace, dooferlad, oh, yeah - it's team standup now and ours after
[10:05] <Muntaner> gsamfira: ping
[10:05] <voidspace> oh yeah
[10:08] <voidspace> firefox crash again, yay
[10:16] <wallyworld> axw: team meeting?
[10:16] <axw> wallyworld: bollocks, be there in a minute
[10:16] <jam> mgz: did you want to attend the Juju team meeting ?
[10:26] <dimitern> frankban, you've got a review BTW
[10:27] <frankban> dimitern: ty
[10:34] <wallyworld> axw: thanks for review, will look real soon
[10:35] <voidspace> TheMue: dimitern: dooferlad: standup?
[10:35] <dooferlad> voidspace: works for me
[10:35] <TheMue> voidspace: sounds good for me
[10:35] <dimitern> voidspace, TheMue, dooferlad, I need 5m
[10:36] <voidspace> ok, I'll go make more coffee
[10:36] <TheMue> aka one cigarette ;) *scnr*
[10:36] <dimitern> but go ahead :)
[10:42] <dimitern> voidspace, dooferlad, ok, let's do it
[10:43] <voidspace> omw
[11:00] <frankban> dimitern: done, can I $$merge$$ it?
[11:03] <dimitern> frankban, I'm having a last look
[11:03] <dimitern> frankban, go for it, and thanks again!
[11:04] <frankban> dimitern: ty, should I have to propose it also against 1.21 and 1.22?
[11:04] <Muntaner> gsamfira: ping!
[11:04] <gsamfira> Muntaner: pong
[11:06] <dimitern> frankban, yes, please, but in both 1.21 and 1.22 my patch has landed, so you'll need to do some cherry picking
[11:07] <frankban> dimitern: should we land the revert patch first?
[11:08] <dimitern> frankban, I don't think it's needed, as your patch builds on top of it anyway
[11:14] <Muntaner> hi gsamfira :)
[11:14] <Muntaner> just installed the Windows Server 2012 R2 evaluation by cloudbase
[11:14] <Muntaner> the VM is in the same subnet of Juju VMs
[11:14] <Muntaner> now... how can I interact with this VM with Juju?
[11:14] <Muntaner> or am I confused about what I can do?
[11:19] <gsamfira> Muntaner: a few basics first. Juju has several "providers" it can use to create a juju environment (manual, local, MaaS, OpenStack, etc). The manual provider attempts to connect to an already installed machine and add it to juju. This provider however is not yet supported on windows. It will be in the (hopefully) not to distant future, just not yet.
[11:20] <gsamfira> Muntaner: if you used the image I pointed you to, that means you have an Openstack environment all set up
[11:20] <gsamfira> correct?
[11:20] <Muntaner> gsamfira: yes, everything is working fine atm
[11:21] <Muntaner> downloaded the qcow2 image of Windows, created a VM in the same subnet of juju VMs
[11:21] <Muntaner> juju actually is bootstrapped on this OpenStack environment
[11:21] <gsamfira> cool
[11:21] <Muntaner> (which is a private cloud, basically)
[11:21] <Muntaner> if you need screens/logs, ask me whatever it's needed :)
[11:22] <gsamfira> have you done the whole juju-metadata generate-image song and dance? Or are you using the official simplestream feed?
[11:23] <Muntaner> gsamfira: did nothing with juju :/ just downloaded the image, added it to OpenStack via glance, and created a VM with the image in it
[11:24] <axw> wallyworld_: review can wait for tomorrow, but FYI http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/923/
[11:24] <Muntaner> gsamfira: I did that stuff in the past days, to bootstrap my OpenStack with Juju
[11:24] <wallyworld_> axw: np, will try and look
[11:24] <Muntaner> and basically I used an Ubuntu Cloud 14.04 image to do all the stuff
[11:24] <gsamfira> Muntaner: okay. So you have not yet deployed a massive indispensable infrastructure using juju yet :). There is one last hoop to jump through to get windows in. And that is juju agent and simplestreams that includes a Windows image
[11:26] <Muntaner> gsamfira: afraid I don't know how that works: (
[11:26] <gsamfira> Muntaner: no worries. I can guide you through it.
[11:26] <gsamfira> I just need to get a handle on what you already have
[11:26] <Muntaner> gsamfira: ask me whatever you need to know :)
[11:32] <Muntaner> gsamfira: background. We set up a private OpenStack cloud, with all of the components installed on a single server. We have everything working (cinder, glance, swift, etc). Then, we bootstraped Juju on this Openstack. After some problems we got with metadatas (I opened a launchpad about it), also this step has been successfull, and I have Juju working on this Openstack. Now, I wanted to understand how Juju and Windows machine are r
[11:34] <gsamfira> so first things first. Lets get you the widows agent tools.
[11:34] <gsamfira> I'm guessing you are using 1.21.2 ?
[11:35] <Muntaner> 1.21.1-trusty-amd64, gsamfira
[11:35] <gsamfira> perfect. Building you a windows binary now
[12:20] <frankban> dimitern: 1.22 backport https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/1594
[12:21] <dimitern> frankban, looking
[12:23] <dimitern> frankban, LGTM
[12:23] <frankban> dimitern: thanks, shipping it
[12:25] <dimitern> frankban, +1
[13:08] <wwitzel3> so I am thinking in the rsyslog worker there is the handle config changes, that reacts based on new state servers getting added, so I think I can force the recreation of the rsyslog server certs there and that should fix up the connection issues
[13:09] <wwitzel3> re: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1417875
[13:09] <mup> Bug #1417875: ERROR juju.worker runner.go:219 exited "rsyslog": x509: certificate signed by unknown authority <canonical-bootstack> <logging> <regression>
[13:09] <mup> <juju-core:In Progress by wwitzel3> <juju-core 1.21:Triaged by wwitzel3> <juju-core 1.22:Triaged by wwitzel3> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1417875>
[13:35]  * dimitern steps out for 1/2h
[16:15] <voidspace> dimitern: when all the pieces are in place, what's the command line incantation to create a new container on a machine?
[16:21] <dimitern> voidspace, sorry, in a meeting, bbiab
[16:21] <voidspace> dimitern: no problem, dooferlad remembered anyway
[16:21] <dimitern> +1
[16:21] <TheMue> phew, first restructured test works. but nested map[string]interface{} for marshaling tests are a pain in the ass
[16:22]  * TheMue needs to write some helper
[16:31] <dimitern> TheMue, consider using something like type M map[string]interface{} + helpers around it in the tests
[16:31] <TheMue> dimitern: that's how I changing it currently ;)
[16:31] <dimitern> TheMue, cheers :)
[16:33] <dimitern> voidspace, so I'll propose the PCII() API tomorrow as it happens
[16:34] <natefinch> This is why you shouldn't use map[string]interface{} in the first place :)
[16:34] <katco> natefinch: +1
[16:34] <dimitern> natefinch, :) if you can avoid it, yeah
[16:35] <dimitern> natefinch, however writing generic json serialization tests with strings like `....25 lines later...`[1:] is even worse
[16:35] <TheMue> ah, this looks definitely better
[16:36] <dimitern> :) I had a feeling it will
[16:36] <dimitern> ok
[16:36] <dimitern> I'm outta here
[16:36] <TheMue> dimitern: yeah, strings are even worse
[16:36] <dimitern> g'night all, see you tomorrow ;)
[16:36] <TheMue> dimitern: cu
[16:36] <katco> dimitern: take a look at that PR tomorrow?
[16:37] <dimitern> katco, oh, sorry - I promise (bookmarking now)
[16:37] <katco> dimitern: no worries at all... have a wonderful evening :)
[16:37] <frankban> dimitern: here is the 1.21 backport: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/1595 could you please take a look? (slightly different code base there)
[16:37] <dimitern> katco, thanks!
[16:38] <dimitern> frankban, ok, I can take one last review I guess :)
[16:38] <katco> dimitern: i see how it is! haha jk ;)
[16:38] <dimitern> (for a backport I reviewed already..)
[16:39] <frankban> dimitern: ty
[16:40] <frankban> dimitern: oh, didn't notice you were done for the day, sorry
[16:40] <ericsnow> voidspace: FYI, the webhook worked for PR 1588 yesterday when I tried (after the RB downtime)
[16:40] <dimitern> frankban, np
[16:40] <voidspace> ericsnow: cool, good to hear
[16:40] <dimitern> frankban, ship it!
[16:41] <frankban> dimitern: thanks! and have a nice evening
[16:41] <dimitern> ta!
[16:45] <frankban> sinzui: how do I spell that https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/1595 fixes that bug?
[16:47] <sinzui> frankban, include fixes-1420403
[16:47] <voidspace> frankban: $$fixes-1420403$$ I believe
[16:47] <frankban> sinzui: in the description?
[16:47] <voidspace> frankban: in the merge comment
[16:47] <natefinch> you just need the string fixes-1420403 in a comment somewhere, and then the standard $$merge$$ will work
[16:48] <voidspace> frankban: doesn't need to be in the $$ but it's common
[16:48] <natefinch> ^
[16:48] <frankban> ty
[18:54] <katco> is anyone familiar with the WADL format?
[18:57] <voidspace> right, going jogging
[18:57] <voidspace> probably back around in a bit
[18:57] <katco> have fun voidspace
[19:00] <voidspace> katco: thanks, good luck with the WADL :-)
[19:00] <katco> voidspace: hehe thanks
[19:03] <sinzui> abentley, my azure delete script says juju-functional-backup-restore-tyx8o23ojf is about 24 hours old. If you agree via the console it is more than 12 hours old, I will run the script in real
[19:04] <perrito666> sinzui: that last sentences terrified me
[19:05] <sinzui> perrito666, I am dealing with azure instances being left behind after destroy env. and since the Azure console doesn't work well with chrome or firefox, I am scripting an executioner
[19:05] <perrito666> the onlypart that terrified me is backup-restore :p
[19:06] <perrito666> btw, just to fill you with expectancy, I PRd the last piece of the new restore
[19:07] <sinzui> thank you perrito666
[19:08] <sinzui> I think the restore test job dies because of azure. we never actually bootstrapped http://juju-ci.vapour.ws:8080/view/Juju%20Revisions/job/functional-backup-restore/2180/console
[19:08] <sinzui> well, I can see we aren't running any env like that, so I will use my new axe
[19:12] <perrito666> who here knows anything about multiwatcher?
[19:20] <jw4> perrito666: a very little bit...
[19:20] <perrito666> git says I am looking for francesco banconi
[19:20] <rick_h_> perrito666: that's frankban who's EOD working with dimiter
[19:21] <jw4> perrito666: ah
[19:21] <perrito666> rick_h_: tx, ill try to catch him in my AM
[19:21] <rick_h_> perrito666: we use it on the GUI to track all the things
[19:22] <perrito666> rick_h_: I assume you mean megawatcher and not frankban :p
[19:22] <rick_h_> perrito666: yea pretty much :)
[19:23] <perrito666> "so frank, here is the debug log, you read it all and let us know when things change"
[19:23] <rick_h_> for everyone running a gui, hope you read fast
[19:24] <jw4> lol
[19:25]  * perrito666 sees a chance to "import" a new dell for him.. anyone got one of the new xps13 and ran linux on that?
[19:25] <perrito666> I kind of lack return policy where I am :p
[19:27] <natefinch> perrito666: google will help, or try posting on warthogs.  I think the XPS laptops are generally pretty far up the chain of laptops that Linux geeks want support for (and that Dell wants linux support for), so usually they work pretty well pretty soon after release.
[19:31] <abentley> sinzui: looking...
[19:32] <abentley> sinzui: Not seeing it.  Did you go ahead?
[19:34] <sinzui> abentley, I did. I found the job that created it and it was 24 hours old
[19:41] <perrito666> now, this is rather frustrating:  Error: entity mismatch; got len 1; want 1
[19:44] <jw4> perrito666: uh oh.. which test?
[19:45] <perrito666> storeManagerStateSuite.TestStateBackingGetAllMultiEnv
[19:46] <jw4> perrito666: hmm - just makes me nervous because I was in that general area recently
[19:47] <perrito666> jw4: I know, but this broke something that its still not prd
[19:47] <perrito666> so worry not, alwhough the test's output is all but helpful, I might fix that
[19:47] <jw4> perrito666: lol
[19:47] <jw4> whew
[19:51] <jw4> perrito666: interesting... it looks like setUpScenario returned only one entity instead of two (my naive reading of it)
[19:54] <jw4> perrito666: units not entities
[19:55] <perrito666> jw4: ?
[19:55] <jw4> perrito666: n/m -- I'm chasing the squirrel of understanding your error
[19:56] <perrito666> jw4: you should see my codebase for it
[19:56] <perrito666> :)
[19:56] <jw4> perrito666: heh
[19:57] <perrito666> I have a big change in the middle that breaks Unit.SetStatus and Unit.Status
[19:57] <jw4> perrito666: that explains it
[19:57] <perrito666> jw4: buuut
[19:57] <perrito666> there is a deepequals for 2 maps
[19:58] <perrito666> and then, if that fails, you tell me their lenght missmatches, assuming that the only thing that can fail is getting different lenghts
[19:58] <jw4> perrito666: that's making more sense as I look at the trunk version of assertEntitiesEqual too
[19:59] <jw4> although it looks like there should be more descriptive information after that first message
[20:00] <jw4> but logged at INFO instead of ERROR
[20:00] <perrito666> jw4: there is, but its Logf
[20:00] <perrito666> which sucks in my opinion
[20:00] <jw4> perrito666: +1
[20:10] <sinzui> abentley, a newly stuck machine in azure
[20:10]  * sinzui get's his new axe
[20:12] <perrito666> grc does not work with go's log output... what have I dont to deserve this monochromatic nightmare
[20:53] <perrito666> sinzui: do you know why ssl-hostname-verification could be not working for canonistack?
[21:01] <sinzui> perrito666, no, I never worked that out
[21:01] <perrito666> sinzui: that means this is a known issue?
[21:02] <sinzui> perrito666, it is and I am looking for the bug.
[21:28] <perrito666> jw4: ok I might ask for your help
[21:28] <perrito666> :)
[21:29] <perrito666> do you know how does *watcher prompt for status changes on units?
[21:36] <jw4> perrito666: ah
[21:36] <jw4> gimme a sec
[21:40] <jw4> perrito666: if I understand your question... allWatcherStateBacking has a method Watch(in chan<- watcher.Change) which sets up a watcher for each collection it's watching
[21:40] <perrito666> jw4: tx a lot
[21:40] <jw4> in this case a backingUnit
[21:42] <perrito666> bbl
[21:45] <marcoceppi> who created juju-backup ?
[21:45] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: thumper?
[21:45] <thumper> nope
[21:46] <thumper> marcoceppi: the plugin was created by a team effort
[21:46] <thumper> just over a year ago
[21:46] <thumper> while I was on leave :)
[21:46] <marcoceppi> thumper: it's not a very good plugin, it doesn't have a --description or --help flag and breaks juju help plugins
[21:46] <marcoceppi> ;)
[21:48] <marcoceppi> is it in the juju-core repo?
[21:48] <marcoceppi> I'll submit a patch
[21:48] <thumper> not sure... maybe
[21:48] <thumper> marcoceppi: yes
[21:48] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: cmd/plugins/juju-backup/juju-backup.go
[21:48] <thumper> cmd/plugins/juju-backup
[21:49] <marcoceppi> thumper: well, interesting. the juju-backup I have is a bash script
[21:49] <thumper> marcoceppi: yep, that's the one
[21:49] <thumper> there is no .go at the end
[21:49] <marcoceppi> oic
[21:49] <ericsnow> oh, yep :)
[21:50] <ericsnow> I was thinking of restore
[21:50]  * marcoceppi goes for is 3rd commit to core
[21:50] <marcoceppi> well
[21:51] <marcoceppi> it's kind of moot now, why even maintain the juju-backup command if it just shells out to core again?
[21:55] <natefinch> marcoceppi: juju-backup is a bad plugin for a lot more reasons than its description and help ;)
[21:56] <natefinch> marcoceppi: we're replacing the old backup command with a built-in command.  It is a lot more maintainable
[21:56] <natefinch> sorry, gotta run, but ericsnow and perrito666 are the backup and restore masters :)
[21:59] <marcoceppi> well, it's worse than that, everytime anyone runs juju help plugins, the backup plugin is executed
[21:59] <marcoceppi> so it's just dumping backups everywhere
[21:59] <marcoceppi> it's a pretty big bug, but if 1.21 fixes this (by removing the old logic) then fine
[22:00] <marcoceppi> but 1.21-beta4 still executes the plugin from what I can tell
[22:02] <ericsnow> 1.22 is when we added the new backup command (and updated the plugin)
[22:02] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: we kept the plugin around for backward compatibility
[22:03] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: but it should probably still handle --help and --description
[22:03] <marcoceppi> ericsnow: so if I wanted to patch this for 1.21 how would I do this?
[22:03] <marcoceppi> I'll file a bug now, but since 1.22 is like the next release
[22:03] <ericsnow> handle those two options at the beginning of the shell script
[22:04] <ericsnow> there's already a bug
[22:04] <marcoceppi> right, I understand technically how to implement it in the script
[22:04] <hatch> hey could someone point me to the golang file where the api routes are defined?
[22:04] <marcoceppi> I just don't know the whole process
[22:04] <marcoceppi> I'll just open a merge request
[22:04] <ericsnow> #1389326
[22:04] <mup> Bug #1389326: juju-backup is not a valid plugin <backup-restore> <plugins> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1389326>
[22:05] <hatch> found it
[22:06] <ericsnow> hatch: apiserver/apiserver.go (see the Server.run)
[22:06] <hatch> ericsnow: thanks - I just found it :) github's search is not too great :)
[22:13] <voidspace> ok, g'night all
[22:24] <marcoceppi> ericsnow: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/1596
[22:28] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: thanks
[22:29] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: would you do me a favor and log into reviews.vapour.ws
[22:30] <marcoceppi> ericsnow: okay, logged in.
[22:31] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: we have a webhook on github for PRs that adds the patch to our review tool there
[22:31] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: but it only works if you've logged in at least once :)
[22:31] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: so the PR should be updated now with a link to the review request
[22:33] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: you should also set the bug status to "In Progress"
[22:33] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: thanks for working on this, by the way :)
[22:39] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: that patch looks good
[22:39] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: you just need to get a "senior reviewer" to check it out before merging
[22:42] <marcoceppi> ericsnow: thanks, updated the testing stuff
[22:42] <ericsnow> marcoceppi: cool
[22:52] <jw4> does anyone know of a state transition diagram for the uniter?
[23:16] <katco> jw4: no, but if you happen to make one, i would love for you to do it in plantuml and place it in the docs like we recently did for storage: https://github.com/juju/juju/blob/master/doc/storage-model.txt
[23:17] <jw4> katco: oh cool - I'm 20 lines into a graphviz .dot file...
[23:17] <katco> jw4: relevant doc if you're interested: http://www.plantuml.com/state.html
[23:17] <jw4> katco: I'll check it out.
[23:17] <katco> jw4: plantuml uses graphviz under the covers, but has a much simpler syntax
[23:17] <jw4> katco: nice.  Yeah I have 3.5 modes semi-accounted for
[23:19] <katco> jw4: online interface if you want an easy repl: http://www.plantuml.com/plantuml/
[23:20] <jw4> katco: suhweet!
[23:21] <jw4> katco: the storage model is quite sophisticated compared to what I was doing... I aspire... :)
[23:21] <katco> jw4: :) axw did that one, and -- as far as i know -- without ever having touched plantuml prior
[23:21] <katco> jw4: in my experience they tend to grow quite organically
[23:22] <jw4> yes, I imagine with a good foundation people like to incrementally improve them over time