[00:32] <ST47> Gosh. I just ran a dist upgrade and came back to see it finished, and I have 22 more upgradable packages.
[00:34] <BUGabundo> ST47: you are better of running UM
[00:34] <BUGabundo> other wise I may end up with partial installs
[00:35] <ST47> Yeah, that's what I meant.
[00:35] <BUGabundo> ah ok
[00:35] <ST47> I ran it, checked for and installed updates, then checked again and got more :)
[00:36] <BUGabundo> devel branchs are like that....
[00:36] <BUGabundo> lots of packages on queue
[00:36] <bruce89> I'm surprised, as this is a weekend
[00:37] <ST47> Oh. Maybe it just missed one package download and skipped it and its dependencies, and then I ignored the error message and had it try again. Either way, lots of updates.
[00:40] <BUGabundo> bruce89: Global Bug Jams helps
[00:40] <bruce89> ah
[00:40] <Andre_Gondim> is there any problem in this compilation http://paste.ubuntu.com/121257/ ?
[00:45] <nilson> A lot of problems with the new X.org?
[00:45] <nilson> Mine is extremely slow with nvidia card
[00:51] <pavs> ok notify-osd is installed.... wondering how to test it :) what will trigger a notification?
[00:52] <nilson> Why did my logout option disappear from the Gnome menu?
[00:52] <nilson> It used to be under System... now its gone
[00:52] <pavs> because its on the top right hand side under your username
[00:53] <nilson> Ah.. dumb me
[00:53] <nilson> thanks :)
[00:53] <pavs> :)
[00:53] <nilson> I'm hoping the nvidia-180 drivers will fix my Xorg slowness
[00:53] <nilson> I'm still with 173 for some reason
[00:54] <pavs> I am hoping I can find out how to trigger notify-osd to see it in action
[00:54] <bruce89> nilson: I don't like that either
[00:54] <nilson> bruce89, have you tried upgrading drivers?
[00:55] <bruce89> no, I meant the logout thingy
[00:55] <nilson> my xorg is slow as hell, feels like im on a 200MHz box
[00:55] <nilson> Ah yeahm takse getting used to
[00:55] <crdlb> wow, removing log out from System was intentional?
[00:55] <nilson> Ill be back, need to restart X
[00:55] <bruce89> crdlb: yup
[00:55] <crdlb> ugh
[00:55] <bruce89> I don't like the changes made to fusa at all
[00:56] <crdlb> maybe some people don't have the screen real estate for that behemoth?
[00:56] <BUGabundo> pavs: just change your volume!
[00:57] <ian1> anyone else seeing occasional graphics freezes (intel driver)?
[00:57] <bruce89> I presume there's supposed to be things in the black box when pressing the volume buttons
[00:57] <crdlb> yes
[00:58] <ian1> bruce89: that's been fixed
[00:58] <crdlb> ubuntu's testing is second to none; they didn't test it with icon theme != human :P
[00:58] <pavs> BUGabundo hmm doesnt do the trick... I am on VM. It shouldnt matter though right?
[00:58] <bruce89> I evidently don't have the fix yet
[00:58] <bruce89> crdlb: ouch
[00:58] <ian1> bruce89: hm maybe not fixed for non human themes, not sure ;)
[00:59] <bruce89> not a major issue, my volume buttons don't work
[00:59] <crdlb> apparently whoever wrote that really needs to learn about fd.o icon themes
[01:00] <bruce89> the code in notify-osd is a bit odd anyway
[01:00] <BUGabundo> pavs: no idea. try pidgin
[01:00] <crdlb> also, is sytem -> prefs -> popup notifications supposed to let me put it in the bottom left?
[01:00] <bruce89> for instance, no namespace, not using normal constuctors
[01:00] <BUGabundo> bruce89: wait until it stack a few hunders notices, and take 15 mins to show them all
[01:00] <BUGabundo> just stupid
[01:01] <bruce89> and that
[01:01] <BUGabundo> crdlb: I no longer have that menu option
[01:01] <bruce89> I'm writing a e-mail to post to ubuntu-devel about the notifications
[01:01] <bruce89> I'd be happy to voice anyone's concerns
[01:02] <ian1> BUGabundo: why would it accumulate hundreds?
[01:02]  * crdlb definitely wants it in the bottom right
[01:02] <BUGabundo> ian1: pidgin, and gwibber
[01:02] <bruce89> BUGabundo: are those dialogues?
[01:02]  * BUGabundo kills notification-osd once again. 'cause the queue is to big
[01:03] <BUGabundo> $ pkill notify-osd
[01:03] <pavs> ok BUGabundu got working with system -> pref -> popup -> preview  duh! :). I was expecting it to work a lot like "gowl" on OS X, but not quite there yet.
[01:03] <BUGabundo> pavs: I don't have that menu entry either...
[01:03] <BUGabundo> I must be missing something
[01:04] <pavs> yeah I didnt notice that either till the latest update I did few minutes ago.
[01:05]  * BUGabundo runs UM -d again
[01:05]  * BUGabundo warns: there goes my 3G bw
[01:06] <BUGabundo> does anyone else have ephifany on queue?
[01:06] <bruce89> in which sense?
[01:06] <BUGabundo> its been there waiting to install since morning
[01:07] <BUGabundo> no idea what package is still waiting to be built
[01:07] <BUGabundo> I hate to have packages wait....some, take weeks to fix, when fail
[01:08]  * bruce89 wonders why u-m wants to install python3.0
[01:09] <BUGabundo> I already had it
[01:10] <BUGabundo> but got 2.6 this afternoon
[01:10] <bruce89> nothing depends on 3.0 though
[01:11] <BUGabundo> are you sure?
[01:12] <BUGabundo> check for rdepends
[01:12] <BUGabundo> or it could be a policy thingy
[01:12] <BUGabundo> but that would be plain stupid
[01:13] <bruce89> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/121264/
[01:14] <BUGabundo> eheh
[01:14] <BUGabundo> now do rdepends on all of those
[01:15]  * BUGabundo bets on LP api
[01:15] <bruce89> well, unless aptitude says to install it, I'm not going to
[01:16] <BUGabundo> ok
[01:18] <Volkodav> update-notifier does not work seems like ?
[01:18] <bruce89> likely it's being told to install stuff by big brother
[01:19] <BUGabundo> as I said, it may be a Ubuntu Policy
[01:20] <BUGabundo> but still it would be stupid to FORCE Py3
[01:23] <bruce89> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/121268/ is my draft message
[01:24] <BUGabundo> bruce89: you sound to arrogant on that email
[01:24] <BUGabundo> light up a bit
[01:24] <bruce89> I don't really know how to do that
[01:25] <BUGabundo> yeah I know the feeling
[01:31] <voix> hi
[01:31] <voix> lol
[01:31] <voix> wai
[01:31] <voix> keikoz
[01:32] <BUGabundo> bed time
[01:32] <BUGabundo> see you guys tommorow
[01:38] <ian1> hitting the Sound Up hardware button adds *two* bars to the popup :/
[01:38] <ian1> that just seems wrong
[01:42] <bruce89> ian1: bug time
[01:45] <ian1> ah no, it's brightness that jumps 2, volume is more like 1, but sometimes 0 per press
[03:03] <dyf> hello.. how do i know which "version" i currently have?
[03:03] <dyf> i've been doing lots of partial upgrades in the last few days
[03:04] <bruce89> there is no version for everything
[03:04] <les> you're between versions techinically :) Go by the last alpha release and you're in Alpha 4.
[03:05] <dyf> ok
[03:05] <dyf> brb.. restarting after this last partial upgrade :P
[03:06]  * DanaG still dislikes the annoying glitchy popup notifications.
[03:06] <WelshDragon> glitchy?
[03:06] <DanaG> Try holding the volume-down key so it repeats... and you'll see it go blinky twitchy spastic.
[03:06] <DanaG> .... and it eats CPU, too.
[03:06] <DanaG> And keeps going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going and going
[03:07] <LinkinX64> going going
[03:07] <DanaG> Same thing if you hit "previous song" hotkey a bunch of times while at the beginning of a playlist in quodlibet -- in one case, it kept popping up the same track-change notification multiple times for around 15 minutes!
[03:08] <DanaG> ... even after it had gone on to other tracks.
[03:10] <DanaG> Oh, and try rolling your mouse over it... the "disappearing" is rather jarring (not smooth).
[03:11] <bruce89> thanks, yet more for my e-mail
[03:11] <DanaG> Oh yeah, and where's my update-notifier icon?
[03:11] <DanaG> As far as I'm concerned, this force-opened window of update-manager fails -- it doesn't even update the package list before displaying itself.
[03:12] <DanaG> It also manages to make itself look like malware.
[03:12] <bruce89> DanaG: I've been rallying against that for days
[03:13] <bruce89> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/331054
[03:13] <DanaG> And I want my damned ICON back.
[03:13] <DanaG> It doesn't even do its stated purpose of staying up to date...
[03:13] <bruce89> gconf-editor - /apps/update-notifier
[03:13] <DanaG> ... it didn't update the package list.
[03:13] <DanaG> So, it was showing 2-day old updates.
[03:14] <dyf> trust me.. you don't want the notifier on.. there are about 50 updates every single day
[03:14] <bruce89> hadn't thought of that
[03:14] <bruce89> the 2 day old thing that is
[03:15] <DanaG> I want the icon back, though -- the one that looked vaguely like a sun, as I'd describe it.
[03:16] <DanaG> Oh yeah, and on an old laptop I have around here, the mere act of updating package lists... bogs everything down for a while.
[03:16] <bruce89> actually, that voids any "benefit" it would have, as the window is only supposed to appear when there are updates, but if you don't specificity check for them, it won't automatically thanks to mobile restrictions
[03:16] <dyf> lol.. i like mike shuttleworth's reply to that bug
[03:16] <DanaG> It's a P4-Celeron laptop, 1.6GHz.  Old 60-gig WD PATA 5400RPM drive.
[03:17]  * crdlb went with a smaller HDD to get 7200RPM
[03:17] <DanaG> That was an old system.
[03:18] <bruce89> feel free to comment, I'm drafting an e-mail about the whole dialogue notification thing
[03:18] <DanaG> Oh yeah, and another thing about the notifications: the hardcoded black clashes violently with my whole desktop theme.
[03:18] <bruce89> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/121268/
[03:19] <crdlb> this thing is from 2004, it's not exactly new either
[03:20] <DanaG> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotificationDesignGuidelines
[03:21] <DanaG> "Someone is offering to send you a file over the local network. If you do not accept it within about 30 seconds, the offer will be withdrawn."
[03:21] <DanaG> That's lame.. what if I'm AFK?
[03:21] <bruce89> currently, you'll get loads of dialogues piling up
[03:22] <DanaG> http://users.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/screenshot.png
[03:22] <DanaG> Note how black just plain doesn't fit in.
[03:22] <DanaG> Oh, and if you think I can't see my desktop icons... you'd be right.
[03:22] <dyf> well, i use fluxbox.. so i don't have any of these issues
[03:22] <DanaG> But I only use them once every quite-a-long-time.
[03:22] <dyf> but it's interesting to see
[03:23] <bruce89> there's no chance any of this notification stuff can stay now
[03:23] <bruce89> even if I wanted it to
[03:23] <DBO> audio is really jumpy on jaunty...
[03:23] <DBO> anyone else experiencing this?
[03:24] <dyf> DBO: yes.. i've been experiencing *serious* problems with pulseaudio
[03:24] <dyf> it sometimes brings applications to a halt
[03:24]  * DBO kills pulseaudio and tries again
[03:24] <bruce89> DanaG: gconftool-2 --set --type bool /apps/update-notifier/auto_launch false
[03:24] <syockit> you should check if the appropriate pulseaudio packages are installed or not
[03:24] <syockit> especially, module-hal, for the pulse-rt support
[03:25] <TuTUXG> DBO, reload it every few hrs, that's my "solution"
[03:25] <DBO> TuTUXG, it does it right after reload
[03:25] <dyf> sometimes an applications is trying to play an event sound and it halts because of audio problmes
[03:25] <dyf> problms*
[03:25] <dyf> problems*
[03:26] <ali1234> it happens if pulse cannot open the audio because some other program already opened it
[03:26] <TuTUXG> i do get lots crash with skype
[03:26] <dyf> ali1234: and would that be considered a bug?
[03:27] <dyf> i thought pulseaudio should mix sounds
[03:27] <dyf> it shouldn't halt if more than one app tries to play a sound
[03:27] <ali1234> example: i want to play some game that doesn't support pulse. i pulseaudio -k, play the game then quit. after i am finished i quit the game, but forget to restart pulse
[03:27] <ali1234> i look at a video on youtube. flash opens the sound device directly, because pulse is not available. later i notice that sound doesn't work in other programs and restart pulse
[03:28] <ali1234> now, programs that try to use pulse will lock up because flash is holding the sound device open
[03:28] <DBO> killing pulseaudio made it play nice
[03:28] <DBO> at least I can code now...
[03:28] <DBO> daaaaaaaaaaaaaamnit
[03:28] <DBO> it skipped...
[03:28] <dyf> i am able to listen to music while playing youtube videos, no problems
[03:28] <DBO> i cant even listen to music
[03:28] <DBO> it skips just sitting there
[03:29] <DBO> I have a friggin intel core 2 duo at 2.4GHZ
[03:29] <ali1234> dyf: kill pulse and then watch a youtube video, then restart pulse and attempt to play music
[03:30] <DBO> jaunty is shaping up to be a very VERY scary ubuntu release...
[03:30] <dyf> bottom line is gnu/linux systems still suck at software mixing
[03:30] <syockit> DBO: install pulseaudio-module-hal and pulseaudio-esound-compat, kill pulseaudio (pulseaudio -k) and restart the daemon (pulseaudio -D)
[03:30] <ali1234> dyf: it has nothing to do with software mixing
[03:30] <DBO> syockit, I already have those installed
[03:31] <ali1234> dyf: pulse can mix all it wants, if there is no sound device available to play it on, it wont matter
[03:32] <dyf> ali1234:  so the problem is between pulse and the actual sound device?
[03:32] <ali1234> dyf: the problem is that not all applications support pulse
[03:32] <dyf> i see
[03:33] <dyf> that reminds me.. audacious was not able to play audio with pulse.. i changed it to alsa and it played nicely
[03:33] <ali1234> dyf: other programs will try to autodetect
[03:34] <ali1234> dyf: if any program manages to open the sound device when pulse is not running, then when pulse is restarted, any app that tries to play sound through it will freeze up or crash
[03:34] <ali1234> to rectify the situation you must stop whatever program is holding the alsa device open, and then restart pulse
[03:34] <ali1234> and then restart any program that uses pulse, if it crashed
[03:35] <dyf> ali1234: that made a lot of things make sense.. thanks
[03:36] <ali1234> about 6 months ago this was happening to me all the time randomly... but as more programs start to support pulse it is happening less and less
[03:37] <DanaG> I get PulseAudio glitching when pidgin makes sounds.
[03:37] <ali1234> it now only seems to happen when i manually stop pulse to use some old app
[03:37] <DanaG> I also get PulseAudio dying on resume from suspend.
[03:37] <ali1234> (and then forge to restart it)
[03:38] <ali1234> the only time i get glitches from pulse is when i go to slashdot in firefox and it maxes out the cpu for 5 seconds - then the audio also stops
[03:39] <DanaG> one bug I have:
[03:39] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/314600
[03:39] <DanaG> another:
[03:40] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/284319
[03:40] <DanaG> yay for /google plugin.
[03:47]  * DBO sighs
[03:48] <DBO> so from what I read, jaunty is going to have screwed intel drivers, screwed sound because of that (they cause the sound to skip I am reading)...
[03:58] <DanaG> Ugh, try hitting "previous track" and "next track" multiple times, rapidly, in a media player app that uses notifications -- you'll see it lag behind the track changes by an annoyingly long time.
[03:58] <ali1234> yes it queues them up
[03:59] <ali1234> i wonder what happens if the queue overflows
[04:00] <DanaG> So far, I am quite not-impressed with this new feature.
[04:03] <DanaG> Is that black color just plain hardcoded?
[04:05] <DanaG> Ooooh:
[04:05] <DanaG> "6.12.0 will be soon to follow with accel support for r6xx/r7xx chips "
[04:08] <ali1234> it looks like if the notification queue gets full it just blocks :/
[04:09] <ali1234> either that or it's just really slow
[04:17] <DanaG> Yeah, it sucks.
[04:19] <Volkodav> how come update notifier does not pop up anymore ?
[04:20] <maco> Volkodav: because now if there are security updates, the update window itself will just pop up
[04:20] <maco> and if you havent installed any updates in a week (whether through there or apt) it'll pop up in that case too
[04:23] <DanaG> Oh yeah, they said OS X automatically pops up the notification...
[04:23] <DanaG> I don't remember ever seeing that on my mom's iMac.
[04:23] <Volkodav> well it popped up just once
[04:24] <DanaG> Instead, I think it just sat there in the dock, hopping for attention.
[04:24] <Volkodav> about 3 days ago
[04:24] <Volkodav> and today I checked with synaptic - it had about 80 updates
[04:24] <Volkodav> which I did
[04:24] <Volkodav> so I doubth the auto part works right
[04:25] <DanaG> Same for me...
[04:25] <DanaG> ... it doesn't update the package list.
[04:26] <Volkodav> just like nothing happens
[04:27] <DanaG> Lots of the new stuff sucks.
[04:28] <DanaG> Notifications are very glitchy -- and the volume and brightness ones started out completely BLANK.
[04:28] <Volkodav> untill it is all sorted out
[04:28] <DanaG> Just a big, hideous black rounded-rectangle, that clashes with its background.
[04:29] <TuTUXG> DanaG, you have to use the human icons
[04:29] <Volkodav> as long as it works via synaptic or just dist-upgrade - who cares
[04:29] <DanaG> Yeah, having to use one icon set is just stupid.
[04:29] <DanaG> I like my Tangerine icons.
[04:30] <TuTUXG> DanaG, or u can just link those icons to whatever you use
[04:30] <DanaG> I just copied them.
[04:30] <DanaG> yay, xargs.
[04:30]  * crdlb would rather just wait for it to be fixed
[04:32] <TuTUXG> crdlb, i doubt, ubuntu's icon themes are always acting wired except you just stick with human
[04:33] <crdlb> meh, I like 'gnome'
[04:33] <TuTUXG> always something missing...
[04:33] <crdlb> well, if they wouldn't screw with gnome so much ... :)
[04:33] <TuTUXG> just fallback fallback fallback then nothing
[04:34] <maco> TuTUXG: that's because human is a *very* complete theme. most themes only cover the essentials, and then someone goes and uses some weird icon that's rarely used, and then that one is missing
[04:35] <crdlb> the fd.o spec is designed so that there will always be some icon if you follow the spec
[04:35] <maco> a lot of icons are symlinks to other icons in some themes
[04:36] <DanaG> They should've put the special icons in highcolor, too.
[04:36] <TuTUXG> i have my own icon set anyway
[04:36] <maco> DanaG: yeah, i'm pretty sure osx tiger does just pop it up.
[04:36] <TuTUXG> only complete icon theme is human, isn't that funny?
[04:37] <maco> Volkodav: its supposed to be security updates every 2 days, regular 1/wk, but during testing time they're setting everything to 2 days that way testers are hopefully not reporting already-fixed bugs
[04:37] <DanaG> Well, for me, it's launching and showing the updates that were available... 2 days ago.
[04:37] <DanaG> Not those available today.
[04:37] <DanaG> I have to manually refresh the package lists.
[04:38] <maco> yeah i see what you said about it not refreshing. i dont have a properly-working gui right now, and i update multiple times a day, so i have no way to confirm that
[04:39] <crdlb> meh, that's useful, notify-osd has builtin fade instead of just allowing compiz to do it? :/
[04:39] <DanaG> "the ppa packaes" -- which ones?
[04:39]  * DanaG checks the bug...
[04:39] <DanaG> bug 332270
[04:39] <dtchen> DanaG: tj/intuitivenipple
[04:39] <DanaG> intuitive.... nipple?  That's an odd name.
[04:40] <maco> DanaG: the basis is that the nipple is the only intuitive interface. a new mother says even *that* isn't intuitive
[04:40] <DanaG> =þ
[04:40] <DanaG> Handy thing I can do even if my system won't boot:
[04:40] <DanaG> Serial Over LAN.
[04:41] <maco> netconsole?
[04:41] <DanaG> netconsole?  Not sure what that is.  I'm using the AMT virtual serial port.
[04:41] <DanaG> In fact, I've put a getty on it.
[04:42] <pwnguin> fun. checkbox blocked in embeddedVT
[04:44] <pwnguin> good thing we dont use packageKit!
[04:45] <DanaG> oh yeah, netbook-launcher + radeon == ouch.
[04:49]  * DanaG doesn't use lvm.
[04:50] <TuTUXG> pwnguin, what's wrong with packagekit?
[04:50] <pwnguin> TuTUXG: if a package install requires stdin, packagekit won't give it
[04:51] <TuTUXG> huh
[04:51] <TuTUXG> i c
[04:51] <DanaG> That does bug me about update-manager...
[04:52] <DanaG> ... you can't even use "less" as a pager.
[04:52] <pwnguin> i have a setting thats supposed to use gnome UI
[04:52] <pwnguin> for questions and such
[04:52] <pwnguin> i thought it had a etc config setting too
[04:53] <dyf> DanaG: by the way, i have a macbook and apple updates also pop up a window
[04:53] <dyf> just saying
[04:53] <DanaG> It doesn't set $DISPLAY, either.
[05:02]  * DanaG likes having a software-usable hddprotect LED.
[05:02] <DanaG> I have it set so that it blinks blue (in hardware) on HDD activity, and orange (in software) on SD card activity.
[05:11] <Stralytic> what needs to be done to banshee to get its notifications to use the new framework?
[05:16] <DanaG> heh, Tracker is telling me to "right-click here"
[05:16] <DanaG> in the notification.
[05:16] <DanaG> And there's no icon.
[05:16] <maco> is it showing a dialog instead of the new notification?
[05:16] <maco> oh
[05:16] <maco> its supposed to convert all notifications that ignore the fact that notifications cant have actions into dialogs automatically. but i guess right-click and dialog dont go together eithe...
[05:17] <DanaG> NOpe, just a balloon.
[05:17] <DanaG> Telling me to right-click "here"
[05:17] <DanaG> where there's no "here" to right-click on.
[05:19] <maco> hahah
[05:19] <wgrant> Notifications that have custom actions turn into dialogs, and all others turn into notifications that don't point anywhere.
[05:19] <wgrant> I'm not sure I can call this progress, although it is shiny.
[05:20] <DanaG> Ugh, that blinking on mouseover sucks.
[05:20] <DanaG> It doesn't faaade nicely....
[05:20] <DanaG> it BLINKS.
[05:20] <wgrant> I think it wouldn't be so bad if it didn't fade so far.
[05:20] <DanaG> It doesn't fade -- that's the thing.
[05:20] <DanaG> it goes like *ON* off *ON*
[05:20] <DanaG> not a smooth transition.
[05:21] <DanaG> And the black color... is that hardcoded?
[05:21] <DanaG> If so, I have a bone to pick with the developer.
[05:21] <wgrant> It seems so :(
[05:21] <DanaG> It clashes violently with my theme.
[05:21] <ali1234> how can black clash?
[05:21] <DanaG> www.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/screenshot.png
[05:21] <DanaG> Note the style... and think of how the black rectangle would fail to fit in.
[05:21] <crdlb> also, I don't see why it doesn't respect struts to stay away from panels :/
[05:22] <ali1234> *anything* woudl clash with that :P
[05:22] <wgrant> DanaG: IMO that theme clashes with itself... :P
[05:22] <DanaG> Yeah, it's harsh, but fun.
[05:22] <DanaG> Oh, and try holding a volume or brightness key and let it go to the end of its range... and keep holding the key.
[05:23]  * DanaG is going to go off for now.
[05:23] <DanaG> I think.
[05:23] <DanaG> But it goes all spastic-glitchy.
[05:23] <crdlb> the empty rectangle looks very clean here :P
[05:23] <DanaG> =þ
[05:23] <DanaG> Oh, and it eats CPU, too.
[05:52] <DanaG> ooh, shiny.  www.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/screenshot-glassybleu.png
[06:01] <DanaG> odd .... cd drive just randomly reset.
[06:46] <pavs> Is this image of notify-osd a mockup or an actual demo? http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/265 because I have been using notify-osd and it looks nothing even close to this... I understand this is early development process but atleast I know I didnt screw up anything from my side.
[06:47] <TuTUXG> pavs, sudo aptitude install notify-osd
[06:48] <DanaG> Fades?  It doesn't "fade" away -- it *BLINKS* to darker.
[06:48] <pavs> I installed it andit works but its doesnt look the image I gave you on the link by mark shuttleworth
[06:49] <wgrant> DanaG: It fades for me...
[06:50] <wgrant> pavs: How is it different?
[06:50] <WT-Udev> DanaG: what video card do you have, do you have composit support enabled, and etc?
[06:50] <wgrant> It looks practically identical for me.
[06:50] <DanaG> Mouse over the thing...
[06:50] <DanaG> it doesn't fade to dim.
[06:50] <wgrant> DanaG: For me it does.
[06:51] <pavs> oh I need composit enabled? :)
[06:51] <wgrant> And I'm even using UXA, which has horrible transparency bugs.
[06:51] <wgrant> pavs: How does it look without it?
[06:54] <pavs> on my VM without composit it looks like this: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3374/3299722902_ebdc5c0ec0_o.png
[06:55] <wgrant> Ah. Ew.
[06:55] <DanaG> That's the old one.
[06:55] <pavs> lol. thats the one that available with jaunty update
[06:56] <WT-Udev> wgrant: DanaG I'm unsure if you -need- composit but from what I understand 2d transparency and such is much better when used through it... maybe I should look that up on wikipedia or something.
[06:57] <WT-Udev> http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/CompositeExt
[06:58] <WT-Udev> http://people.freedesktop.org/~keithp/screenshots/
[06:58] <DanaG> I do have Metacity compositing enabled.
[06:58] <DanaG> For me, the notifications don't "fade" on hover.. .they just drop to lower opacity rather jarringly.
[06:59] <WT-Udev> DanaG: ok, that's the next question, what video-drivers are you using with what card?  It sounds like it might be trying to fade gradually but instead gets very jerky frames from the process
[07:02]  * DanaG is using radeon on an r600 card.
[07:05] <WT-Udev> http://www.x.org/wiki/radeon
[07:07] <DanaG> very jerky frames... more like, one frame.
[07:08] <DanaG> And try holding volume-down or brightness-down, letting the key repeat.
[07:08] <DanaG> It goes all glitchy-spastic.
[07:08] <DanaG> and blinky-twitchy.
[07:08] <WT-Udev> DanaG: you might try the radeonhd driver and/or the binary driver
[07:08] <DanaG> binary driver is a no-go for me, even on Intrepid.
[07:09] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/314600
[07:09] <DanaG> Even on Intrepid.
[07:09] <WT-Udev> DanaG: I suggest you complete the bug report then
[07:10] <DanaG> What's not complete?
[07:10] <DanaG> I even have a stacktrace.
[07:11] <DanaG> My biggest gripe with radeon is the power draw -- when in Linux, my system draws 30 watts on battery with the 'radeon' driver.
[07:11] <DanaG> In Windows, it's 16 to 19.
[07:11] <WT-Udev> http://www.x.org/wiki/RadeonFeature << ick, found the table I wanted.
[07:11] <DanaG> Same for Linux when fglrx was working.
[07:12] <WT-Udev> 20090221-23:09:05 < ubottu> Ubuntu bug 314600 in fglrx-installer "fglrx versions newer than 8.543 cause system hang and panic" [Undecided,Incomplete]
[07:12] <WT-Udev> The bug report is listed as 'incomplete'
[07:19] <ian1> I'd like to look for when this bug showed up http://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19879 -- how can I walk through the driver versions?
[07:19] <ian1> should I just boot various kernels?
[07:31] <DanaG> WT-Udev: duh, I know it's marked incomplete.
[07:31] <DanaG> It just hasn't been UN-marked.
[07:31] <DanaG> and there's no statement of what's missing.
[07:36] <WT-Udev> DanaG: has it been confirmed by someone else?  If yes, change it to confirmed.
[07:36] <WT-Udev> Then let whoever think's it's not complete change it back with a reason
[07:38]  * DanaG does that.
[07:38] <DanaG> Good advice.
[08:38] <WT-Udev> Morning IntuitiveNipple.  How's the udev stuff going?
[08:39] <IntuitiveNipple> WT-Udev: morning. My machine got hit by it this morning when it was powered on. Had to boot to live-CD and install the modified package via a chroot
[08:40]  * DanaG will have to see what his machine does on boot.
[08:40] <DanaG> Luckily, I'll be able to get a stacktrace even if it won't boot.
[08:41] <IntuitiveNipple> DanaG: Before you do, make sure you have an alternate install to boot into, or the live-CD to hand. You'll have to remove the udev "watch" rules
[08:41] <IntuitiveNipple> I'd like to reproduce it in a VM if possible
[08:41] <DanaG> I do have a LiveCD on hand.
[08:42] <IntuitiveNipple> I have a Hardy install to boot to, *but* the Jaunty file-systems are ext4, so couldn't create a mount to chroot to from their
[08:42] <IntuitiveNipple> s/their/there/
[08:42] <IntuitiveNipple> I'm wondering if it's the dmsetup change - its had a udev rule for 'watch' added too
[08:43]  * DanaG doesn't have dmsetup installed.
[08:47] <IntuitiveNipple> WT-Udev: Does your affected machine have the dmsetup package installed?
[08:49] <WT-Udev> ii  dmsetup                                       2:1.02.27-4ubuntu4                            The Linux Kernel Device Mapper userspace library
[08:50] <IntuitiveNipple> okay, same here
[08:50] <IntuitiveNipple> I'll check whether the VM does
[08:50] <IntuitiveNipple> it ought to :)
[08:51] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: It may not occur in VM due to the fact that real devices have latency but memory has -much- less
[08:52] <IntuitiveNipple> there should still be signs of the activity
[08:52] <IntuitiveNipple> when inserting host USB devices, for example
[08:52] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270/comments/29
[08:53] <IntuitiveNipple> ok... the reason the VM didn't do it was, I installed my package in there lol
[08:55] <WT-Udev> I should note, I still haven't gotten around to arranging for swap that's wiped out and encrypted on boot
[08:55] <WT-Udev> I wanted to get suspend/resume working first so I could ensure that doing that didn't blow away the suspend/resume.
[08:59] <Fudged_that_up> hello all, recomended I chat here - I have problem in gutsy that might be cured or at least party cured with jaunty. How do I upgrade to jaunty, and if I do can I expand my partition to fill my 1tb drive (at the moment ext3 not ext4)
[09:00] <Fudged_that_up> sort to gutsy but intrepid ibex
[09:00] <Fudged_that_up> *sorry to gutsy but intrepid ibex
[09:00] <IntuitiveNipple> Jaunty is an alpha developer test right now
[09:01] <WT-Udev> Fudged_that_up: at least wait a tiny bit until udev is fixed...  We have a workaround/solution but it hasn't made it in to the main packages yet.  I don't know what's holding it up.
[09:01] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270  << Crippling
[09:02] <Fudged_that_up> ok - i have a problem with intrepid proventing me from filling my drive and was told I should try it.ok back to the drawingboard!
[09:02] <Fudged_that_up> ok
[09:02] <WT-Udev> Fudged_that_up: Upgrade cleanly to Intrepid, once you've done that... hum
[09:02] <Fudged_that_up> ?
[09:02] <WT-Udev> What kind of setup do you have right now?  Are you trying to grow your root partition, your home, or an extra partition?
[09:03] <WT-Udev> Home is painful but if you log in in console mode you can do it without anything extra (if you know how)
[09:04] <WT-Udev> Otherwise you might want to use something like the install CD/DVD to do it from within that (when none of your disk partitions are mounted) OR even with a dedicated partitioning tool like in systemrescuecd http://www.sysresccd.org/Main_Page
[09:04] <WT-Udev> If you're trying to grow / (root) you probably have to boot off other media.  The last time I resized an ext filesystem it didn't support online resize
[09:05] <Fudged_that_up> I did a default install telling it to use the whole disk. it says there is no space left it says it's formated to 4.6gb!!!!!
[09:05] <WT-Udev> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ext3 << oh that does support online growth
[09:08] <WT-Udev> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gparted << Fudged_that_up probably you want to install that and take a LOOK at your drive.  be -extrmely careful- you might accidently destroy your data.
[09:09] <Fudged_that_up> thanks guys will try trhat
[09:09] <Fudged_that_up> :)
[09:09] <WT-Udev> gparted (or qtparted if you have KDE) will show you where you're using your disk.
[09:09] <IntuitiveNipple> I may be a while... I've enabled udev debug logging and downgraded to udev 138-1 ... gonna restart and try to capture the log
[09:10] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: Gods... good luck
[09:11] <IntuitiveNipple> :)
[09:59] <rohdef> how do I upgrade from an terminal?
[10:00] <WT-Udev> http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/upgrading << follow the server upgrade method
[10:00] <rohdef> thanks
[10:01] <WT-Udev> rohdef: if you have an LTS version of ubuntu installed there's an extra step, but Ibex's notes contain it
[10:04] <rohdef> WT-Udev, I'm on Ibex, but the commands doesn't seem to work
[10:04] <rohdef> when I run do-release-upgrade it just says that there isn't a new version
[10:05] <WT-Udev> do-release-upgrade -h
[10:06] <WT-Udev> To upgrade to a dev release (like 9.04) use: do-release-upgrade -d  I think.
[10:06] <rohdef> I'll try
[10:06] <rohdef> seems to work
[10:06] <WT-Udev> Um, rohdef btw
[10:07] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270
[10:07] <WT-Udev> read that
[10:13] <rohdef> I'll read
[10:14] <WT-Udev> wb
[10:14] <WT-Udev> How'd it go?
[10:15] <IntuitiveNipple> no luck unfortunately. The event storm meant it never got beyond the initial ramdisk read-only file-system so the udev log wasn't saved to disk. I gave it 15 minutes
[10:15] <IntuitiveNipple> I'm now trying to reproduce it on a PC with the console logged via serial cable
[10:15] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: Yeah, I was going to ask before you left if... Yeah
[10:15] <WT-Udev> Is there a way to netconsole log the udev results?
[10:15] <WT-Udev> My laptop doesn't have serial
[10:15] <WT-Udev> It -only- has USB and ethernet
[10:16] <WT-Udev> (well and wifi, but wifi in initrd?  no.)
[10:16] <IntuitiveNipple> That's the issue with many laptops. I've got a  test-bed ATX mobo here that I'm just firing up
[10:22] <IntuitiveNipple> I
[10:26] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270/comments/32 << Interesting
[10:28] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: Now... for an experiment.
[10:28] <WT-Udev> Well, actually first
[10:28] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: Does your ppa-2 version of udev still have watch support, just not watch in the file?
[10:29] <Cruster> hi, when i copy files to ntfs partitions, the files are copied, but dolphin reports: cannot change permissions for [filename]. is there any workaround?
[10:31] <IntuitiveNipple> WT-Udev: yes
[10:32] <IntuitiveNipple> WT-Udev: I used "for rule in /lib/udev/rules.d/*; do sed -i 's/watch//g' $rule; done" earlier to clear all the watches out
[10:32] <WT-Udev> Cruster: I believe that depends on which NTFS driver you are using, however I'm unsure if there's anything to map ubuntu users on to NT users.
[10:33] <WT-Udev> Yeah, I want to take your package and put -just- those back in.
[10:33] <WT-Udev> Also, can I command the initrd to cache and auto-probe modules?
[10:33] <WT-Udev> Like netconsole
[10:33] <IntuitiveNipple> By 'those' you mean the rules?
[10:33] <IntuitiveNipple> If so, just re-install udev 138-1
[10:34] <WT-Udev> Some genius decided they wanted to have a debugging utility as a module... /lib/modules/2.6.28-8-generic/kernel/drivers/net/netconsole.ko
[10:37] <Cruster> WT-Udev: I think it's about root permissions...
[10:38] <dtchen> WT-Udev: just add the module name to /etc/initramfs-tools/modules and update-initramfs -u
[10:38] <IntuitiveNipple> WT-Udev: add the module name to /etc/initramfs-tools/modules
[10:39] <IntuitiveNipple> Grrr. This thing is conspiring against me. hased together cross-over serial cable has pulled some wires out
[10:44] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: take a break from that for a moment and catch up on the bug page.
[10:48] <geser> I got hit by the udev bug too :( Luckily I had still the old version on disk so I could downgrade to get a working computer again
[10:52] <idorock89> just gave command to upgrade to jaunty as i coudnt resis t the temptation anymore
[10:52] <idorock89> it still says 8 hours remaining
[10:52] <idorock89> btw anyone with nvidia gph card on jaunty here?
[10:53] <IntuitiveNipple> that's better... multimeter and a screwdriver and it's working now
[10:54] <Ademan> i need newer versions of the xcb libraries in order to build awesomewm trunk, i realize this is somewhat offtopic, but is there any easy way to tell if i can get them through backports? (i'm on intrepid)  Oh and if i say intrepid-backports, that's jaunty packages backported to intrepid, right?
[10:56] <rww> Ademan: http://packages.ubuntu.com/intrepid-backports/allpackages has a list of all the packages in intrepid-backports, which should help you with the first question.
[10:56] <Ademan> thanks rww
[10:57] <WT-Udev> I hate problems like this udev one...
[10:57] <WT-Udev> I can't tell for SURE if I've reproduced it for like... 20 min, when the first crap gets tossed on to the screen.
[10:58] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270/comments/42
[10:59] <Ademan> rww: hrm it isn't there, that's unfortunate.  there's always upgrading to jaunty i suppose.  do you guys need any more testers? :-D
[10:59] <WT-Udev> Ademan: No... I was finally able to get a result.  Unless you want to deal with a mess of udev initrd level pain.
[11:00] <idorock89> btw anyone with nvidia gph card on jaunty here?
[11:00] <Ademan> WT-Udev: my knowledge of pre-X-being-started stuff is pretty limited, so i guess i don't.  is that a pretty common problem?
[11:00] <IntuitiveNipple> idorock89: Yes; GeForce Go 7600
[11:01] <Ademan> not to say i'm lost when i get dropped into a stinking busybox shell though... heh
[11:01] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: yes, 8400m
[11:02] <idorock89> IntuitiveNipple: and do u have restriceted nvidia ghpx drivers in jaunty?
[11:02] <WT-Udev> Ademan: it seems to effect anyone with LVM or raid (or EVMS etc); is that correct IntuitiveNipple ?
[11:02] <WT-Udev> idorock89: I do
[11:02] <WT-Udev> You have to add a line to the xorg.conf file
[11:02] <Ademan> s/(?=lost)/totally/
[11:03] <idorock89> any probs bcoz of nvidia gphx drivers as compared to intrepid?
[11:03] <IntuitiveNipple> idorock89: Yes, 180.29
[11:03] <IntuitiveNipple> idorock89: There's a few nasty issues with 180.29, depending on which chipset is used
[11:04] <idorock89> IntuitiveNipple: i have nvidia 6200. do u think i will have any probs
[11:04] <idorock89> ?
[11:04] <IntuitiveNipple> idorock89: Couldn't say; best to scan the Nvidia forums at nvnet
[11:05] <IntuitiveNipple> sorry, nvnews.net
[11:05] <idorock89> k
[11:05] <WT-Udev> idorock89: dunno, I mostly use the xv interface, not gl
[11:08] <idorock89> WT-Udev: pls explain what the xv and gl interface are? and how to change them
[11:08] <idorock89> ?
[11:09] <WT-Udev> xv is x-video, it's used to make video playback faster (possible in some cases)
[11:09] <rww> LP:332270 only affects systems using LVM, right?
[11:09] <WT-Udev> xvmc is even faster yet
[11:09]  * maxb is amused. Ubuntu is inviting me to report the fact that my machine failed to resume from suspend so that the developers can fix the problem. Somehow I doubt they can fix "running out of battery" :-)
[11:09] <WT-Udev> rww: I think it might be any system using ANY device mapper items.
[11:10] <WT-Udev> maxb: what I never got about suspend
[11:10] <rww> WT-Udev: so LVM and EVMS?
[11:10] <WT-Udev> Why can't the system hibernate, but keep the resume stuff in ram too.
[11:10] <WT-Udev> rww: "Is anyone that does -not- use LVM or RAID or other device-mapper items effected?"
[11:11] <WT-Udev> I've not yet seen a testcase involving dmraid, but I suspect they would have ones as well
[11:13] <maxb> WT-Udev: It can.
[11:13] <IntuitiveNipple> WT-Udev: hibernate and suspend are designed for different purposes.  It takes a lot longer to prepare than a pure suspend, though
[11:15] <maxb> You can invoke that kind of suspend with pm-suspend-hybrid -- don't know if there's any GUI exposure of the functionality
[11:16] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: Yeah, but it does have an advantage.  If you're syspended and disk-backed then you can resume just fine even if you loose power.
[11:17] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: are you aware, off the top of your head, of udev syntax to print the types of information for a given device that udev rules would run on?
[11:17] <WT-Udev> like...
[11:17] <WT-Udev> MagicUdevThing /dev/sda1 -> would tell me the kernel, attrs, etc.
[11:19] <WT-Udev> http://wiki.debian.org/udev
[11:19] <WT-Udev> installing udevinfo
[11:20] <IntuitiveNipple> udevadm info --query=all --name=
[11:21] <IntuitiveNipple> You can also use udevadm monitor --environment to watch events
[11:27] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: Doesn't quite get me everything.  It's not listing any ATTRS
[11:28] <WT-Udev> KERNEL=="hd*[0-9]", ATTRS{removable}=="1", GOTO="persistent_storage_end" << I have no way of seeing if attrs removable == 1
[11:28] <WT-Udev> Oops, forgot to replace every instance of the data...
[11:28] <WT-Udev> oh well it's gone now
[11:29] <idorock89> which ff version is there currently?
[11:29] <idorock89> firefox
[11:30] <WT-Udev> 3.0.6+nobinonly-0ubuntu1
[11:33] <idorock89> why not 3.1 its at beta 3 or something and if we are including 3.1 in jaunty then we should upgrade right?
[11:33] <idorock89> or is 3.1 not in jaunty?
[11:34] <WT-Udev> idorock89: dunno, why not check the bug reporting system for it and/or add a bug to that effect if it's in the proposed list
[11:51] <IntuitiveNipple> Oh well, I give up! Daily live-CD x86, ubiquity fails to start because Dbus denies it permission to pass messages
[12:06] <WT-Udev> This is somewhat annoying... I have the netconsole module in place, but it doesn't seem to be working.
[12:06] <IntuitiveNipple> Have you added the console= directives to the kernel command line?
[12:08] <WT-Udev> gunzip -dc initrd.img-2.6.28-8-generic | cpio -t | grep netcon
[12:08] <WT-Udev> lib/modules/2.6.28-8-generic/kernel/drivers/net/netconsole.ko
[12:08] <WT-Udev> [    0.000000] Command line: root=/dev/mapper/rootvolume ro no_console_suspend netconsole="6665@<IP_ADDRESS>/eth0,6660@<IP_ADDRESS>/00:40:f4:cb:7a:f9"  crashkernel=384M-2G:64M@16M,2G-:128M@16M
[12:09] <WT-Udev> the mac address is correct and even tcpdumping for that port has no result
[12:18] <IntuitiveNipple> have you enabled syslogd on the target to accept TCP connections?
[12:19] <WT-Udev> They're UDP and there's no firewall
[12:19] <WT-Udev> port 6666 (another system I've got configured to netconsole log) logs just fine
[12:20] <WT-Udev> I'll try a netcat simulation of logging on that port
[12:20] <IntuitiveNipple> have you set console_loglevel?
[12:20] <WT-Udev> Hum, no
[12:21] <IntuitiveNipple> I'm using debootstrap to install Jaunty on this test-bed PC, since the daily CD ubiquity fails
[12:22] <WT-Udev> cat something | nc -u -p 6665 <IP_ADDRESS> 6660
[12:22] <WT-Udev> which worked
[12:26] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: I should note, the other system that's done netconsole logging is an 8.10 system, so I don't see why it would fail here when I used that system'
[12:26] <WT-Udev> s netconsole string as the basis
[12:27] <WT-Udev> I literally only changed the source IP and dest port, but I tested that in netcat
[12:29] <WT-Udev> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackalope_(disambiguation) << I just noticed... Jackalope?  Are we eventually going to get up to Unix Unicorn or Domesticated Dragon?
[12:30] <IntuitiveNipple> netcat's -p option on Jaunty seems to have changed. I got caught out by that too. it now means the port to listen on, not port to listen for. So you need -p 6660
[12:31] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple:        -p port      local port number (port numbers can be individual or ranges: lo-hi [inclusive])
[12:31] <IntuitiveNipple> In Hardy/Intrepid, the command appeared to work differently.
[12:31] <WT-Udev> right from the manpage
[12:31] <WT-Udev> IN JJ
[12:31] <WT-Udev> The local port will be the source when sending, or the listener port when recieving
[12:32] <IntuitiveNipple> And you did nc -u -p 6665 <IP_ADDRESS> 6660 ?
[12:32] <IntuitiveNipple> Should be nc -u -p 6660 <IP_ADDRESS> 6665 ?
[12:32] <IntuitiveNipple> Or  nc -l -u -p 6660 <IP_ADDRESS> 6665 ?
[12:32] <WT-Udev> netconsole="6665@<IP_ADDRESS>/eth0,6660@<IP_ADDRESS>/00:40:f4:cb:7a:f9" << srcprt:srcip:srcif targetprt:targetip:targetmac
[12:33] <WT-Udev> So send from port 6665 to ip and port
[12:43] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: do you have a craskhernel line?
[12:45] <IntuitiveNipple> No
[12:45] <WT-Udev> Odd, I wonder why that's there....
[12:45] <WT-Udev> Maybe if I remove it netconsole logging will work
[12:46] <WT-Udev> Odd... it's being tacked on automatically but isn't listed in any section of menu.lst I can see
[12:49] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: do you have kdump installed?
[12:52] <WT-Udev> kexec-tools: /etc/init.d/kdump
[12:52] <WT-Udev> rather
[12:55] <IntuitiveNipple> no
[12:55] <IntuitiveNipple> I leave all that VMs
[12:56] <WT-Udev> ... kexec-tools is auto-installed... but how do I tell by what?
[12:57] <WT-Udev> Ah found it
[12:58] <WT-Udev> removing makedumpfile
[13:04] <WT-Udev> doesn't seem to have fixed it
[13:04] <WT-Udev> Arg, it's not even loaded now
[13:05] <WT-Udev> Anyone in here know a kernel paramater to pass it to tell the kernel to ask for a module?
[13:09] <IntuitiveNipple> I thought the fact netconsole was on the command-line caused it to be loaded if it was there as a module?
[13:10] <IntuitiveNipple> if not, you need to add it to the initramfs loaded modules list
[13:11] <WT-Udev> I edited that file from before
[13:11] <WT-Udev> The module's in the image.  Is there something else I need to edit?
[13:12] <IntuitiveNipple> It won't be loaded unless specifically asked for though, and no hardware is going to prompt that
[13:14] <IntuitiveNipple> actually, it should be if it is in the modules file
[13:14] <IntuitiveNipple> see https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/initramfs-tools/+bug/16622
[13:14] <IntuitiveNipple> Yay! the new PC has hit the udev inotify storm immediately
[13:14] <IntuitiveNipple> As soon as I added an LVM partition
[13:15] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: can test with adding a raid one first as well?
[13:16] <IntuitiveNipple> Not yet
[13:16] <IntuitiveNipple> I just want to capture the storm in a log file
[13:19] <idorock89> can someone tell me which version of empathy is in jaunty right now?
[13:21] <IntuitiveNipple> http://packages.ubuntu.com
[13:24] <idorock89> !332270
[13:28] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270
[13:28] <idorock89> WT-Udev thx
[13:29] <WT-Udev> Yup... what the udev
[13:29] <WT-Udev> more literally what the udev !?!???!??
[13:30] <blueyed> Is there a known problem with a raid+cryptsetup+lvm setup? I cannot boot my system anymore..
[13:30] <WT-Udev> blueyed: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270
[13:30] <blueyed> ah.. looking at topic.
[13:31] <WT-Udev> read the whole thing first
[13:31] <blueyed> thanks, WT-Udev!
[13:32] <ronny> anyone aware of a tool te find/remove broken gnome menu entries - i have collected a few hundred broken menu entries over the time
[13:33] <IntuitiveNipple> ronny: user-profile stores them in ~/.local/share/applications
[13:34] <ronny> aware of a tool that collects the broken ones (ie all entries that don't work any more)
[13:34] <IntuitiveNipple> Your brain :)
[13:35] <WT-Udev> maybe it would be better to just regenerate them?  I have no idea since I loath the gnome interface (it is all nurfed... and you need to know voodoo to enable nice features that are fixed to a default...)
[13:35] <WT-Udev> ronny: maybe they're text based, you could probably write or find a shell-script to audit that and remove any which point to bad locations
[13:35] <ronny> IntuitiveNipple: these files are a bitch to parse, and there is enough of them there to waste days
[13:41] <IntuitiveNipple> ronny: This will help you identify the executables: for app in  ~/.local/share/applications/*; do EXE="$(grep -o '^Exec=.*' "$app")"; echo $EXE; done
[13:42] <IntuitiveNipple> Or, you could do: for app in  ~/.local/share/applications/*; do EXE="$(grep -o '^Exec=.*' "$app")"; echo "$app = $EXE"; done
[13:42] <ronny> IntuitiveNipple: it nests paths
[13:43] <cumulus007> Hi, I'm looking for the Launchpad translations of the Live CD installer
[13:45] <WT-Udev> maybe
[13:46] <WT-Udev> if [ ! -f "$EXE" ] ; then rm $app ; fi     or something like that
[13:52] <cumulus007> anyone?
[13:52] <WT-Udev> no idea
[13:52] <cumulus007> hm :(
[13:57] <blueyed> cumulus007: ubiquity?
[13:57] <cumulus007> i checked the Ubiquity project, but their translation is not maintained on Launchpad
[14:00] <nblracer> i thought gparted came with ubuntu :(
[14:01] <nblracer> i also remember in ubuntu 6 there was a nice GUI manger for mounting and formating and partion drives
[14:01] <cumulus007> it does
[14:01] <WT-Udev> nblracer: not with xubuntu by default anyway;  it might be on the livecd though.  pn  gparted                                       <none>                                        (no description available)
[14:02] <nblracer> did not come with my install, ubuntu Jaunty
[14:02] <WT-Udev> Odd, maybe ubuntu-desktop depends on it but not xubuntu-desktop?
[14:03] <nblracer> i; not on Xfc
[14:03] <nblracer> gnome
[14:03] <nblracer> installing it now though...
[14:04] <nblracer> but does any one recall that manger that came with ubuntu 6.06 for formating and mount HDD
[14:05] <blueyed> WT-Udev: what's the preferred workaround for the bug? Commenting out the problematic "watch" line?
[14:06] <WT-Udev> blueyed: you have to regenerate the initrds as well
[14:06] <blueyed> yes. but that appears to be the best workaround, yes?
[14:06] <WT-Udev> You can do both manually, or you can add IntuitiveNipple's ppa so you get the package with the rulsets like that, which then automatically does the initrd
[14:07] <WT-Udev> Either way, you can work around the problem like that
[14:09] <laputa> Is here the channel #Ubuntu+1?
[14:09] <WT-Udev> You can't tell?
[14:10] <laputa> I have some trouble...
[14:10] <laputa> I need help...
[14:10] <WT-Udev> You use LVM and your system won't boot anymore?
[14:11] <laputa> processing was halted because there were too many errors.
[14:11] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270 << If your system won't boot anymore and the hard drive light shows heavy activity...
[14:12] <WT-Udev> laputa: during startup?
[14:12] <laputa> when I do: sudo dpkg --configure -a
[14:12] <WT-Udev> Hum... returns quite rapidly on mine.
[14:15] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dpkg/+bug/108189 <??
[14:16] <laputa> WT-Udev:can you send me a file:/usr/share/gconf/schemas/metacity.schemas?
[14:16] <laputa> It seems the file missing...
[14:16] <WT-Udev> laputa: I have xubuntu... not ubuntu so...
[14:17] <WT-Udev> ah but I do seem to have that file
[14:18] <WT-Udev> can you take the file?
[14:19] <laputa> I don't have that file, you can send<EMAIL_ADDRESS>Thank you so much!
[14:19] <WT-Udev> laputa: nope... I don't feel like logging in to my mail right now
[14:19] <WT-Udev> can you just take it via dcc?
[14:20] <laputa> what's mean: via dcc?
[14:21] <WT-Udev> the irc method of sending files
[14:21] <laputa> how to accpet it?
[14:21] <WT-Udev> that's client specific
[14:22] <WT-Udev> /dcc get WT-Udev
[14:22] <WT-Udev> do that
[14:22] <WT-Udev> there you go
[14:22] <laputa> oh! I got it! It's funny!
[14:22] <WT-Udev> it should be in yoru home folder someplace
[14:23] <WT-Udev> Here I was about to toss it on to pastebin
[14:25] <IntuitiveNipple> WT-Udev: got an interesting situation here
[14:25] <WT-Udev> Oh?
[14:25] <laputa> I have done it! Thank you!
[14:26] <laputa> I give the error log to you, OK?
[14:26] <IntuitiveNipple> With udev_log="debug" or "info" the system can reach a root prompt. When it is set to "err" it hits the event storm at 6.5 seconds and thrashes the hard disk and doesn't seem to recover.
[14:26] <IntuitiveNipple> This looks like a timing-related issue - the log type affecting it. The actual storm didn't start until I installed lvm2 though
[14:26] <WT-Udev> Er no thank you... the error log won't be useful for me.
[14:27] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: That sounds amazingly like a race condition.  It also sounds like enabling the other logging events buffers it out enough to avoid it.
[14:28] <laputa> WT-Udev:Package metacity-common is not configured yet. so?
[14:28] <WT-Udev> laputa: you try what you were doing all over again.  dpkg --configure -a should run to completion without error
[14:29] <WT-Udev> If it has an error, you need to figure out what it is and fix it
[14:32] <laputa> I do dpkg --configure -a, and it show me much error.
[14:32] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dpkg/+bug/108189 << read this yet?
[14:34] <laputa> w3m cann't load the url...
[14:34] <laputa> https? not http?
[14:34] <WT-Udev> It redirects
[14:35] <laputa> sorry, it's my fault!
[14:35] <WT-Udev> laputa: There are really two options at this point depending on the effort each might cost you.
[14:35] <WT-Udev> 1) Backup anything you want to keep, re-install.
[14:35] <WT-Udev> 2) Go through the process listed in that thread and try to fix it.
[14:35] <WT-Udev> There are also an unknown number of unknown options.
[14:36] <laputa> I will choose 2
[14:36] <WT-Udev> Then you'll -have- to view that thread
[14:37] <SiDi> Hi people
[14:38] <gnomefreak> can you pastebin the error
[14:38] <WT-Udev> laputa: there seems to be a lot of 'It may be media corruption' or bad memory/etc.  Have you run a S.M.A.R.T. test on your hard drive?  Checked the CDs for defects?  Checked your memory with the memtest?  Maybe checked the cpu with a prime-stress tester or some other tool?
[14:39] <WT-Udev> laputa: are you stuck in console?
[14:40] <gnomefreak> ok lets try this again. WT-Udev Lunar_Lamp can you pastebin everything after the dpkg command. i would liket o see these
[14:40] <WT-Udev> gnomefreak: I don't have the problem
[14:40] <gnomefreak> damnit not Lunar_Lamp but laputa
[14:40] <gnomefreak> wt`your helping him so maybe he pastebined it and i missed it
[14:41] <gnomefreak> WT-Udev: ^^
[14:41] <WT-Udev> Nope, but I did mention pastebin, just not as pastebin.com
[14:42] <gnomefreak> i have no errors that is why i want to see them to see what paackages are failing and if able to be fixed
[14:43] <WT-Udev> gnomefreak: it sounds remotely like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dpkg/+bug/108189
[14:44] <WT-Udev> * being variable, but always showing up on a given install
[14:44] <gnomefreak> exact would be better the part where it sounds remotely like) is the problem there
[14:44] <WT-Udev> Yeah, I know... laputa ?
[14:45] <gnomefreak> ill be back need smoke just ping me when if you pastebin it.
[14:45] <WT-Udev> http://pastebin.com/m55d6beee
[14:46] <WT-Udev> There's the bug thread, laputa you can look at that, right?
[14:47] <laputa> WT-Udev:I searched some messages just now,sorry!
[14:47] <laputa> I only under console.
[14:47] <laputa> I can't got in gnome...
[14:48] <laputa> It seems like the package libmetacity0 was not configured yet.
[14:53] <gnomefreak> thats what sudo dpkg --configure -a is for
[14:54] <laputa> gnomefreak:for configure the installed package.
[14:55] <gnomefreak> all first than show me errors. why cant you boot into failsafe? did it not give you option?
[14:55] <gnomefreak> the bug is too old nothing for jaunty in it that is why i need the exact message
[14:57] <gnomefreak> laputa: is the error from a upgrade from 8.10 or have you upgraded already and this is just errors you get on normal package upgrade?
[15:02] <SiDi> Hm, got a question about the new notification system
[15:02] <SiDi> did anyone manage to have it shown on another place than top right ?
[15:03] <gnomefreak> SiDi: never tried but since your apps are in upper right it only makes sense they are there
[15:04] <SiDi> what i mean is that there's a tool in the systems menu that allows you to put it on the other corners, but it doesnt work
[15:04] <gnomefreak> SiDi: you can try in gconf but i doubt you will find it
[15:04] <SiDi> anyways i'm gonna reboot on jaunty and download the latest updates
[15:04] <SiDi> brb asap
[15:04] <gnomefreak> than not sure
[15:04] <nblracer> is there a tool, to extract an iso
[15:05] <scizzo-> nblracer: you mount it
[15:05] <scizzo-> nblracer: gmountiso
[15:05] <nblracer> rgr
[15:09] <nblracer> one more thing, is there a plan to have a tool like this is in the jaunty repos. http://flomertens.free.fr/disk-manager/index.html
[15:09] <nblracer> if there is what is it called
[15:09] <laputa_> I have started gnome!
[15:10] <amoblin> a mobline linux, that the mean!
[15:10] <amoblin> that's the meaning.
[15:16] <Finnish> Hello
[15:17] <Finnish> I'm not able to install this daily build
[15:17] <BUGabundo1> Finnish: sintoms?
[15:17] <Finnish> _
[15:17] <Finnish> Sorry, I don't understand
[15:17] <BUGabundo1> what happened?
[15:18] <WT-Udev> Finnish: he typoed symptoms
[15:18] <WT-Udev> I think
[15:18] <BUGabundo1> yeah
[15:18] <BUGabundo1> lost in translation
[15:18] <Finnish> I'm trying to install this daily build from USB stick. First time when I tried to click install, it gave me an error^crash report
[15:18] <BUGabundo1> ehehe
[15:18] <BUGabundo1> nice
[15:18] <BUGabundo1> did you report it ?
[15:19] <Finnish> After that when I click install-button, nothing happens
[15:19] <BUGabundo1> seems like ubiquity is a bit lost there
[15:19] <Finnish> I was in a rush and a bit hangover, so I ignored it
[15:20] <BUGabundo1> try the next daily or previous
[15:20] <Finnish> So what can I do to install
[15:20] <BUGabundo1> if it also fails
[15:20] <BUGabundo1> please report a bug
[15:20] <BUGabundo1> against ubiquity
[15:20] <BUGabundo1> so that colin (or is it cjwatson?) can take a look at it
[15:21] <Finnish> Ok, I'll try. But is this usual
[15:22] <cumulus007> does anybody know where the translation of Ubiquity is located?
[15:22] <BUGabundo1> bugs happen
[15:23] <BUGabundo1> and lots of stuff have changed on the last few days, do to FF
[15:23] <BUGabundo1> plus kernel changes (ext4, speed boot up, etc)
[15:23] <hey_joe> anyone know the status of the intel 845g under 9.04? is compiz working? or must i still revert to 8.04 to get desktop effects?
[15:24] <hey_joe> what is the newest available version of ubuntu to fully support the intel845g?
[15:24] <BUGabundo1> dunno
[15:24] <amoblin> hey_joe:if 8.04 can, 9.04 can,too.
[15:24] <hey_joe> amoblin, really?
[15:25] <amoblin> if 9.04 cannot, there is only one reason...
[15:25] <hey_joe> with the i810 driver or what?
[15:25] <hey_joe> what reason would that be?
[15:25] <TuTUXG> BECAUSE ITS STILL ALPHA
[15:26] <hey_joe> hrm
[15:26] <amoblin> in order to rapid the speed, it was removed from the kernel. but alpha is another factor.
[15:26] <WT-Udev> Well, EVENTUALLY older drivers will be dropped off the current releases... but yeah, not anything on this timescale
[15:26] <SiDi> hey_joe: Jaunty uses Xorg server 1.6, it's possible the drivers of your GPU still cant manage it
[15:26] <SiDi> though if you're using a nvidia card it should be ok
[15:27] <hey_joe> it didn't work in 8.10...
[15:27] <hey_joe> works great in 8.04
[15:27] <hey_joe> i guess im just debating trying to install the beta..
[15:27] <SiDi> i think there are backport packages for that
[15:27] <WT-Udev> hey_joe: try the beta off a livecd?
[15:27] <hey_joe> WT-Udev, if the liveCD works with desktop effects, then most certainly a full install would to correct?
[15:28] <WT-Udev> Users of Intel i845 or i865 video chipsets are unable to load X, getting an error message of "Fatal server error: Couldn't bind memory for BO front buffer". Users on these systems are advised to wait for a resolution to this bug before upgrading. 304871
[15:28] <hey_joe> WT-Udev, i dont get that error..
[15:28] <WT-Udev> www.ubuntu.com/testing/jaunty/alpha4 -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/304871
[15:29] <hey_joe> hrm
[15:29] <WT-Udev> hey_joe: Yeah, if the live CD works then it should.  I don't know if the livecd HAS those effects though
[15:29] <hey_joe> hrm
[15:29]  * hey_joe cries in the corner
[15:29] <hey_joe> it seems i remember trying 9.04, and it not working.. but maybe that was 8.10
[15:30] <hey_joe> is this the best sources? >> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/
[15:31] <WT-Udev> Hum... as long as you aren't planning on using any LVM partitions for a bit
[15:31] <BUGabundo1> hey_joe: no
[15:31] <BUGabundo1> that's alternate cd
[15:31] <BUGabundo1> you want daily-live
[15:31] <BUGabundo1>  !daily
[15:32] <hey_joe> ubottu. hah. thats rich.
[15:32] <hey_joe> thanks guys
[15:32] <hey_joe> ill give 9.04 a whirl
[15:32] <WT-Udev> hey_joe: so the second link
[15:32] <WT-Udev> if you want to run off the CD
[15:32] <hey_joe> yep
[15:41] <amoblin_> hello
[15:42] <WT-Udev> wb
[15:44] <BUGabundo1> amoblin_: hi
[15:46] <amoblin_> who use zhcon?
[15:47] <thehook> is there any jaunty minimal cd?
[15:47] <siegie> thehook: i think not, i used the intrepid mimimal cd and upgraded
[15:47] <WT-Udev> thehook: I'd consider the server one... but that's me.
[15:48] <amoblin_> alternate jaunty?
[15:48] <WT-Udev> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/
[15:48] <WT-Udev> yeah
[15:48] <WT-Udev> Those are oversized, but you can usually get away with running that off of a DVD
[15:49] <amoblin_> you can use alternate jaunty cd to minimally installed ubuntu.
[15:49] <WT-Udev> I haven't tested that, but I think I've run cd images on dvds back when I was out of cds for a bit
[15:49] <thehook> siegie: how was it that you upgraded to jaunty? minimal cd doesn't have either dist-upgrade or update-manager
[15:49] <SiDi> see you people
[15:50] <siegie> thehook: just a mimimal install and upgrade
[15:50] <thehook> amoblin_: is there a option for that?
[15:51] <BUGabundo1> siegie: thehook I think there's a minimal cd. let me check archive
[15:52] <BUGabundo1> siegie: thehook i386 http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/jaunty/main/installer-i386/current/images/
[15:52] <Laibsch> I am just in the process of upgrading from hardy to Jaunty
[15:52] <BUGabundo1> 64 bits http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/jaunty/main/installer-amd64/current/images/
[15:52] <BUGabundo1> Laibsch: do you need a stable system?
[15:53] <BUGabundo1> ave you read the technical and release notes?
[15:53] <Laibsch> I get lots of errors "$dir is not empty, some byte-compiled code may be left behind".  I think that is non-serious, but did anybody else see that?
[15:53] <BUGabundo1> prior to upgrade?
[15:53] <thehook> I already istalled intrepid ibex and upgraded to jaunty, but it seems a bit unstable, and this time I upgraded it wont boot.. the other computer is just displaying /sys/devices/virtual/block/dm-0 (some incremental number)
[15:53] <thehook> BUGabundo1: thanks :)
[15:53] <WT-Udev> thehook: Congradulations you have the udev bug... https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270
[15:53] <BUGabundo1> Laibsch: please comment any other repo on your Sources.list
[15:53] <BUGabundo1> and use update-manager -d to upgrade
[15:53] <Laibsch> BUGabundo1: While I do need a stable system, I think I am technically savvy enough to survive Jaunty at this point in time.  If not, I have a complete backup
[15:54] <BUGabundo1> great
[15:54] <BUGabundo1> bakcups are important
[15:54] <BUGabundo1> please read the release notes
[15:54] <BUGabundo1> so you can avoid common probs/questions
[15:54] <BUGabundo1> http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/jaunty/alpha4
[15:54] <BUGabundo1> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyJackalope/TechnicalOverview
[15:54] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: Looks like it's been confirmed for raid users, but with a different file.
[15:54] <thehook> WT-Udev: thanks, I feel like a winner :P hahahah
[15:55] <Laibsch> I always use aptitude only, because the 1G+ download won't fit on my 1G /var partition
[15:55] <Laibsch> I update piecemeal
[15:55] <Laibsch> starting with the kernel and libc6
[15:56] <WT-Udev> Laibsch: got a partition with more room?
[15:56] <BUGabundo1> Laibsch: UM currently checks for free space
[15:57] <BUGabundo1> and an apt-get clean && apt-get autoremove can help a bit
[15:57] <Laibsch> BUGabundo1: Again, /var is 1G separate partition
[15:57] <Laibsch> Normally fine, but not at dist-upgrade time
[15:57] <BUGabundo1> AFAIK you will need about 400MiBs of download plus about the double for install
[15:57] <Laibsch> WT-Udev: I do have a partition with more room
[15:58] <Laibsch> So, I guess I should keep the old udev, he?
[15:58] <WT-Udev> Laibsch: try copying /var/cache/apt/ to another partition, then either mount -o bind new-area /var/cache/apt/  OR make apt a symlink to the new storage area.
[15:58] <Laibsch> BUGabundo1: I had more than 1G coming from hardy
[15:58] <WT-Udev> Laibsch: read the bug, make up your own mind
[15:59] <Laibsch> Well, if there is a chance for serious trouble, I'll stay with current udev until things are definitely fixed
[15:59] <WT-Udev> Laibsch: There's a full workaround, and even a PPA you can add to bypass most of the issues
[16:00] <Laibsch> WT-Udev: Good idea. I wonder if just using plain aptitude is potentially problematic?  Worked nicely since etch
[16:00] <Laibsch> WT-Udev: The topic specifically advised against the ppa
[16:01] <WT-Udev> Laibsch: The topic was set back when they wanted more info, and didn't realize the CRIPPLING COSTS of getting NOTHING from the average user
[16:04] <Laibsch> ???
[16:04] <Laibsch> who is they?
[16:05] <WT-Udev> Laibsch: /topic to see who set it ( I don't know them) and read the bug thread
[16:06] <Laibsch> My client tells me the topic, but I don't get any history (I assume you do)
[16:08] <WT-Udev> /topic
[16:08] <WT-Udev> 20090222-08:08:06 -!- Topic set by dtchen<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[Sat Feb 21 20:39:03 2009]
[16:08] <savvas> bug 332270
[16:09] <Laibsch> BTW, I just booted the daily CD image fine about three hours ago.  I guess, that makes it unlikely, I will be affected?
[16:09]  * bruce89 just sent my widely-anticipated post to ubuntu-devel
[16:11] <BUGabundo1> ehheh bruce89
[16:11] <bruce89> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/121458/ , but it's too late to change it now mind
[16:11] <BUGabundo1> humm so is dtchen > crimsun !?!
[16:13] <WT-Udev> Laibsch: If you use raid, LVM, cryptosetup etc, then you are at risk
[16:13] <Laibsch> I don't
[16:13] <Laibsch> Very plain setup, single spin
[16:15] <WT-Udev> Then it is currently believed you are at no risk from that bug
[16:18] <Laibsch> cool
[16:19] <Laibsch> I shall always keep the USB bootable stick handy ;-)
[16:19] <WT-Udev> Ya, I have sysresccd on a stick
[16:26] <NoelJB> Just checking, since I haven't found a (current) bug report for it.  Is update-notifier working for anyone?  The icon in the notification area stopped working a few days ago (yes, I have rebooted) for me.
[16:26] <WT-Udev> NoelJB: can't really provide a yes/no answer.  I use aptitude too often
[16:27] <NoelJB> WT-Udev: but if you run aptitude update from the command line, and if there are available updates, you should get the icon in the notification area.  I no longer do under Jaunty.
[16:27] <charlie-tca> One of the updates uninstalled update-notifier on mine. I reinstalled it and it is working again
[16:28] <NoelJB> charlie-tca: Hmmm ... no, I see it running, but I could try to force a reinstall.
[16:28] <NoelJB> Or is this not the right process?
[16:28] <NoelJB> noel      5050  0.0  0.4<PHONE_NUMBER>2 ?        S    11:17   0:00 update-notifier --startup-delay=60
[16:29] <WT-Udev> I wonder if that is in seconds, or min?
[16:29] <charlie-tca> It looks right, but mine did not have update-notifier installed. I did not check if it was running.
[16:30] <BUGabundo1> NoelJB: charlie-tca it was abandoned
[16:30] <charlie-tca> What replaced it?
[16:30] <BUGabundo1> there is a thread on devel ML
[16:31] <BUGabundo1> now it just POPUP when it finds updates
[16:31] <BUGabundo1> with the new notifications, there was no way for a user to click on the bubble
[16:31] <charlie-tca> Well, the POPUP failed for me
[16:31] <WT-Udev> mine still has the stuff
[16:31] <WT-Udev> not forced either
[16:31] <charlie-tca> Are you sure? I just did it
[16:31] <BUGabundo1> so the icon went way too
[16:31] <BUGabundo1> you said you reinstaled it
[16:31] <BUGabundo1> so sure, you have it
[16:32] <BUGabundo1> but UM should have removed it
[16:32] <NoelJB> BUGabundo1: interesting.  I never saw it uninstalled.
[16:32] <charlie-tca> I see. That's why the thing pops up at boot, now
[16:32] <NoelJB> BUGabundo1: which package should uninstall it, and can you point me to the thread?  :-)
[16:32]  * BUGabundo1 thinks beta tests should stop using aptitude and distupgrade so oftem
[16:32]  * BUGabundo1 ubuntu != debian
[16:33] <BUGabundo1> NoelJB: let me search for it on the archive
[16:33] <NoelJB> Thank you :-)
[16:34] <NoelJB> BUGabundo1: so what is the new idea for how you would look at your system and see that there are available upgrades, if there is not to be a notification icon?
[16:34] <BUGabundo1> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2009-February/027416.html
[16:34] <BUGabundo1> starts here
[16:34] <BUGabundo1> and it's a bit long
[16:34] <NoelJB> Looking
[16:35] <BUGabundo1> reasoning should be here https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2009-February/027434.html
[16:35] <NoelJB> That's the one I was just up to reading.
[16:35] <BUGabundo1> NoelJB: the down side: users are force to navigate into the menu to open UM
[16:35] <BUGabundo1> charlie-tca: I have no idea "what" replaced it, even if there is a subs prepared
[16:36] <charlie-tca> Thanks
[16:36] <BUGabundo1> np
[16:37] <BUGabundo1> we all learn from each others
[16:37] <BUGabundo1> eheh
[16:37] <NoelJB> I don't see *anything* when there are available updates.
[16:38] <NoelJB> No OSD notification of any sort.  Surely that cannot be desirable.  In fact, it violates the reasoning in that message about a problem being how bubbles disappear.
[16:39] <BUGabundo1> yeah
[16:40] <BUGabundo1> I ve lost the auto launch of notifications too
[16:41] <BUGabundo1> anyone knows what packages has the orthographic corrector on kmail? mine is acting up (I guess since friday updates)
[16:45] <NoelJB> Ah, I see the new plan: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2009-February/027445.html and I consider that sheer idiocy.
[16:46] <NoelJB> I wonder if there real reason is to distribute load across the distribution network.
[16:46] <BUGabundo1> and it still offers NO visual aid
[16:46] <NoelJB> Well, opening the APP will be a "visual aid"
[16:47] <charlie-tca> Yeah, "just like windows"
[16:48] <NoelJB> I was thinking that if this change came from Microsoft, we'd be shaking our heads about the idiots in Redmond.
[16:48] <unixdawg> nice just did a dist-upgrade and now my laptopis fully updated and man jaunty is a great os
[16:51] <BUGabundo1> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/aspell/+bug/332940
[16:51] <BUGabundo1> is any one having this?
[16:51] <WT-Udev> NoelJB: I think most users will gravitate towards either the default, in which case they'll all hit on the week after the last security update, OR for them to fall on a single day of the week
[16:54] <BUGabundo1> plus they won't reboot!
[16:54] <BUGabundo1> I just close that stupid box when I get it
[16:54] <BUGabundo1> and text is so unclear that many will lose work, by accepting to reboot without any more confirmations
[16:55] <BUGabundo1> hummm let me just get the next popup, and I'll test and file a bug stating that
[17:00] <NoelJB> BUGabundo1: I'm filing a bug report to fix (revert) the behavior.
[17:00] <NoelJB> Will post the # after I finish.
[17:00] <BUGabundo1> ok
[17:00] <BUGabundo1> eheh
[17:00] <BUGabundo1> mpt is NOT going to like it
[17:00] <BUGabundo1> better make a blueprint first
[17:01] <NoelJB> MPT is in the wrong.
[17:02] <NoelJB> Was there a blueprint for breaking this in the first place?
[17:02] <charlie-tca> It is telling, when even some developers are saying it is wrong
[17:03] <BUGabundo1> sure
[17:04] <BUGabundo1> I just said he won't like it
[17:04] <BUGabundo1> not that you are not right
[17:04] <BUGabundo1> I agree with you
[17:04] <BUGabundo1> and so will others on that thread
[17:11] <NoelJB> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-notifier/+bug/332945
[17:13] <BUGabundo> subing to it
[17:14] <BUGabundo> $ mkdir -p .launchpadlib/cache/
[17:14] <BUGabundo> done
[17:14] <BUGabundo> opps
[17:17] <Exilant> i somehow must have missed that controversy
[17:17] <BUGabundo> Exilant: its new
[17:17] <Exilant> what is that mysterious update-notifier?
[17:17] <BUGabundo> LOL
[17:17] <BUGabundo> update-notifier is the "old" way to let you know about updates
[17:18] <BUGabundo> and even had a RED arrow for critical updates
[17:18] <BUGabundo> but most users would never click on it
[17:18] <Exilant> hm, no clue there, always used alias distup=... update dist-upgrade
[17:19] <Exilant> i dislike phone-home automatically apps, so i guess i'm happy it's removed
[17:20] <BUGabundo> Exilant: you had an option on the updates to never check
[17:20] <BUGabundo> and then manually run it when you need it
[17:21] <BUGabundo> but its recommend for non-paroic users to do regular check on fixes and security updates
[17:23] <charlie-tca> Exilant: now you will get the update-manager popping up on the screen instead of the icon
[17:24] <charlie-tca> confirmed bug 332945
[17:25] <Exilant> i guess you are right, it should be there for normal users
[17:27] <joaopinto> NoelJB, I agree with you
[17:28]  * BUGabundo wishs LP add a Vote This Bug, or at least showed Me Too counts
[17:28] <lfaraone> Hi, my laptop (8.10 upgrade with LVM partitioning, NOT encrypted) is unable to boot right after upgrading. It seems to stop right after detecting my HID devices. (broadcom touchpad)
[17:29] <lfaraone> I think it might not be finding my LVM partitions properly
[17:29] <BUGabundo> lfaraone: see Topic
[17:29] <WT-Udev> bug 332270
[17:31] <lfaraone> BUGabundo: ... so, what should I do to get my laptop booting again?
[17:31] <WT-Udev> lfaraone: read the thread
[17:31] <BUGabundo> lfaraone: WT-Udev is the guy you need
[17:31]  * WT-Udev is considering going to bed in the 'near' future...
[17:32] <BUGabundo> ehehehee
[17:32] <WT-Udev> lfaraone: short answer, hope you have an older kernel.  BOOT THAT.  Then https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270/comments/31 << Do the PPA steps in this.
[17:33] <lfaraone> WT-Udev: doesn't the topic say NOT to use the PPA?
[17:33] <WT-Udev> lfaraone: to understand why you should, read the bug thread.
[17:33] <WT-Udev> To understand how to manually do what the ppa does, login, get a root console follow https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/332270/comments/53
[17:35] <BUGabundo> WT-Udev: humm should this new info be on Alpha5 wiki ?
[17:36] <WT-Udev> BUGabundo: I don't know, hopefully this goes away before that
[17:37] <BUGabundo> hope so
[17:41] <Ienorand> Hmm, if no upgrading is done on udev I should be able to stay clear of this bug yes?
[17:43] <WT-Udev> Ienorand: udev 138-1 is broken IF you have LVM, raid, cryptosetup etc
[17:44] <Ienorand> Okay, then I'm hoping ther'll be no worries.
[17:51] <skyjumper> Ienorand: the fix is simple
[17:53] <skyjumper> anyone know why networkmanager would decide to "not manage" a wired ethernet device?
[17:53] <skyjumper> it started happening after the upgrade from intrepid to jaunty
[17:55] <DanaG> IntuitiveNipple: looks like I'm now also getting t hat udev issue, though I'm on 2.6.29 kernel.
[17:55] <DanaG> I don't have time to deal with it right now, but this evening some time, I'll grab a log of it.
[17:56] <BUGabundo> skyjumper: if you had checked the logs
[17:56] <BUGabundo> you should have seen it echoing a bug id from LP
[17:56] <BUGabundo> with further details
[17:56] <BUGabundo> for the manage vs UNmanage use case
[17:56] <BUGabundo> probably you used a manual setting
[17:57] <skyjumper> i don't recall that bug discussion being of any use... checking again
[17:58] <BUGabundo> skyjumper: maybe it was not
[17:58] <BUGabundo> but asac did it as he felt best
[17:58] <salty-horse> hi. from a default configuration of vlc, it doesn't seem to attach the video window to the controls window (though the option is set). anyone else having the same issue?
[18:03] <ubuntistas> what's new about ubunt 9.04?
[18:04] <ubuntistas> is it going to have good look?
[18:04] <scizzo-> !jaunty
[18:04] <scizzo-> !whatsnew
[18:04] <scizzo-> ubuntistas: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing
[18:05] <NoelJB> skyjumper: depends on what you have in your network configuration.  Jaunty actually tried to manage my vmware software NICs.  For eth0, I have:
[18:05] <NoelJB>   auto eth0
[18:05] <NoelJB> but for my vmware NICs I added: iface vmnet<x> inet manual
[18:06] <NoelJB> skyjumper: so what do you have for the wired network in /etc/networks/interfaces?
[18:06] <skyjumper> NoelJB: it's doing that for vmware interfaces here too
[18:07] <ubuntistas> is it good for testing?
[18:07] <skyjumper> i did have eth0 setup manually in /etc/networks/interfaces but removing that solved the networkmanager problelm for eth0
[18:07] <ubuntistas> any new llok?
[18:07] <NoelJB> skyjumper: yeah, quite annoying.  So I added that line for vmnet1 and vmnet8 into /etc/networks/interfaces, and now it shows them as unmanaged, which is what I want.
[18:07] <skyjumper> anyone know of a way to restart networkmanager manually?
[18:07] <charlie-tca> ubuntistas: it is always good for testing
[18:07] <scizzo-> ubuntistas: did you even look at the site I gave you?
[18:07] <ubuntistas> yes
[18:07] <skyjumper> NoelJB: trying that now...
[18:08] <scizzo-> then you should know the answer...
[18:08] <scizzo-> ubuntistas: jaunty is still alpha
[18:08] <scizzo-> ubuntistas: if you have experience with ubuntu and can handle some broken stuff....then _maybe_....depends on where you test it and so on....
[18:10] <alex-weej> does anyone know how i can make apt/dpkg operate on a filesystem mounted in /media/something
[18:10] <alex-weej> i want to try and fix my jaunty installation
[18:10] <scizzo-> alex-weej: why not mount it and then chroot?
[18:10] <alex-weej> scizzo-: because... http://rafb.net/p/qIFeEL70.html
[18:10] <scizzo-> alex-weej: if you chroot to it then it will become mounted as / if you are using a live-cd
[18:11] <alex-weej> the system is so hosed. not even /bin/true runs inside it
[18:11] <alex-weej> i don't know what happened
[18:11] <scizzo-> alex-weej: ummmm
[18:11] <alex-weej> i guess it's a library problem. maybe libc or something
[18:11] <alex-weej> but i figure i can just upgrade the packages (without running the hooks)
[18:12] <alex-weej> somehow. with apt/dpkg
[18:12] <alex-weej> so then i can get the libraries on the filesystem at least, and run bash, and then dpkg configure
[18:12] <scizzo-> what happens if you only run: mount /dev/disk /mnt/ && cd /mnt/ && chroot
[18:13] <alex-weej> er
[18:13] <scizzo-> the first command there look ok
[18:13] <alex-weej> well it'smounted in /media/Ubuntu\ Root right now
[18:13] <scizzo-> the other commands I don't really understand what you are doing with
[18:13] <alex-weej> i am just testing other executables
[18:14] <scizzo-> alex-weej: look....the first command looks right
[18:15] <scizzo-> alex-weej: if I would mount my disk it would be: sudo mount /dev/sda7 /mnt/ && sudo chroot /mnt/
[18:15] <scizzo-> alex-weej: thats it...then it would be mounted to /
[18:15] <alex-weej> ubuntu@ubuntu:/mnt$ sudo chroot .
[18:15] <alex-weej> chroot: cannot run command `/bin/bash': No such file or directory
[18:15] <scizzo-> alex-weej: and you can work with it there
[18:15] <Cruster> I have a weird bug in kubuntu, don't know how to describe it. look at this screenshot http://img294.imageshack.us/my.php?image=snapshot4.png the white line below the plasmoids.
[18:15] <alex-weej> scizzo-: chroot works by executing something... the problem is that within the root i am choosing NOTHING runs
[18:16] <scizzo-> alex-weej: then check the / tree first
[18:16] <scizzo-> alex-weej: to see wether it has /bin /sbin and so on
[18:16] <alex-weej> it does
[18:16] <alex-weej> i can run bash from /mnt/bin/bash in my existing root
[18:17] <alex-weej> and i guess it loads the libs from /usr/lib
[18:18] <alex-weej> but if it were to try loading the libs in /mnt/usr/lib i guess it would fail the same way
[18:18] <scizzo-> well the chroot /mnt/ should load it to /
[18:18] <idorock89> hey guys i am currently as we speak upgrading to jaunty from intrepid initially it told me a 1 gb download was reqd.
[18:19] <scizzo-> that is the disk /mnt/ should be mounted to /
[18:19] <idorock89> and i have a256kbps conenction
[18:19] <Volkodav> mplayer and xine can not get the sound initialized - only vlc
[18:19] <Volkodav> what might be the problem ?
[18:19] <idorock89> and i have fetched abt 1072 files of 1188 files. and the downloader is stuck at this file for the past 1.5 hrs
[18:19] <scizzo-> Volkodav: need more info...
[18:19] <Volkodav> if it does not work - won't work on all apps
[18:19] <idorock89> and it is downloading contiuously . can there be such a big file?
[18:20] <idorock89> one file that big ? should i cancel and start  over again?
[18:20] <skyjumper> NoelJB: did "iface vmnet<x> inet manual" stop networkmanager from messing with your vmware interfaces?
[18:20] <alex-weej> scizzo-: yes it IS but then once it is "mounted" it cannot run any executable so it just quits straight away. there is no shell i can run
[18:20] <scizzo-> idorock89: how are you trying to upgrade?
[18:21] <alex-weej> and even if i could run a shell, ic an't run apt-get to fix my system because apt-get requires many libraries that are broken
[18:21] <Volkodav> more info is simple mplayer says couldnot open/initialize audio device > no sound
[18:21] <idorock89> by typing alt+f2 and then typing there taht apt get upgrade d thing
[18:21] <idorock89> scizzo-: ^^
[18:21] <scizzo-> alex-weej: what are you trying to fix exactly?
[18:21] <Volkodav> xine says it is being used by another program
[18:21] <Volkodav> and vlc just opens the same file with sound ?
[18:22] <scizzo-> Volkodav: does the soundcard really support duplex stuff?
[18:22] <alex-weej> scizzo-: it doesn't boot. /sbin/init fails to run
[18:22] <Volkodav> yes
[18:22] <alex-weej> every single executable fails to run
[18:23] <scizzo-> alex-weej: grub error?
[18:23] <scizzo-> alex-weej: or after grub?
[18:23] <alex-weej> never mind
[18:23] <Volkodav> and I have no other audio programs open neither
[18:23] <alex-weej> scizzo-: thanks, but i think this is beyond you
[18:23] <scizzo-> alex-weej: haha! okie dokie
[18:24] <idorock89> so ppl anyone upgraded recently?and had the prob taht i had
[18:25] <scizzo-> idorock89: do you mean the update-manager -d upgrade?
[18:25] <scizzo-> Volkodav: no sound server either?
[18:25] <idorock89> scizzo-: yes
[18:25] <Volkodav> I have sound around the sustem OK
[18:26] <Volkodav> but on players only vlc will work
[18:26] <scizzo-> Volkodav: can you try turn off the soundserver to see if any player can play the sound?
[18:26] <scizzo-> Volkodav: or check the configs for pulse and alsa
[18:29] <scizzo-> idorock89: I had a simular problem but this was for configuration of a package...
[18:29] <scizzo-> idorock89: I might be wrong but is there some information about details of what the manager is doing?
[18:30] <Finnish_> Hello
[18:30] <Finnish_> Is the latest daily build fixed? Previous was unable to install
[18:31] <NoelJB> skyjumper: sorry, didn't see the message.  Will post the contents in a direct message.
[18:31] <idorock89> scizzo-: well it jsut says fetching file 1072 of 1188 at 30 kbps
[18:32] <idorock89> and in the progress bar it is decresing the time .
[18:32] <idorock89> but still stuck at the same file for sSO long
[18:32] <Finnish_> Anyone know the status of the latest build?
[18:33] <NoelJB> skyjumper: done.  see the private chat.
[18:34] <IntuitiveNipple> Finnish_: I tried the i386 live-CD this morning and ubiquity crasheed
[18:34] <Finnish_> Yeah same thing for me
[18:34] <Finnish_> What is the latest working version?
[18:34] <IntuitiveNipple> I had to install using debootstrap in the end
[18:35] <Finnish_> And it worked?
[18:35] <Finnish_> Can you show it to me?
[18:36] <charlie-tca> Finnish_: I can't get any installs off the livecd, but the alternate cd works
[18:37] <FFForever> is this also the dev room for kubuntu (jaunty)
[18:37] <NoelJB> skyjumper: working now?  Glad to have helped.  :-)
[18:37] <Finnish_> Ah, so yesterday's version is not installing?
[18:37] <skyjumper> NoelJB: thanks
[18:37] <skyjumper> yeah, networkmanager is a pain in the ass
[18:38] <FFForever> how can i set dns servers in stone (as in not let network manager change them)
[18:39] <IntuitiveNipple> Define a connection in NM with the DNS servers declared
[18:39] <Finnish_> charlie-tca: Did you try build from yesterday?
[18:40] <charlie-tca> I did not try yesterdays
[18:40] <Finnish_> I'm downloading it right now
[18:40] <pop79> if i have ideas for jaunty, where should i put them?
[18:41] <IntuitiveNipple> pop79: Too late now, Feature Freeze is upon us... you should put them up for Karmic
[18:41] <FFForever> IntuitiveNipple, i am on wifi i always change dns servers =P i wanted to just use opendns since its faster for me and less hops
[18:42] <pop79> oh... is Jaunty launching next mont?
[18:42] <pop79> What, Karmic Koala, or is it called Karmic Kiwi
[18:42] <IntuitiveNipple> Configure the connection with those servers then
[18:42] <charlie-tca> pop79: it is due April 23
[18:42] <pop79> woohoo!
[18:42] <FFForever> would be funny if u guys launched jaunty on april 1st =D
[18:43] <charlie-tca> The next version is Karmic Koala
[18:43] <FFForever> who the heck names the ubuntu distro's and wow....
[18:43] <idorock89> mark shuttleworth
[18:43] <pop79> FFForever: it'd probably reck or system as a prank :)
[18:43] <FFEMTcJ> I'm getting an error when trying to install alpha 4.. At first it had to do with GIMP, now its copying files to HDD.. is anyone else having similar problems?
[18:43] <FFForever> pop79, nah it forces you to use xubuntu all day and xubuntu users would have to use gnome =P
[18:45] <pop79> lol
[18:46] <WT-Udev> FFForever: I think I'd go with debian at that point.
[18:47] <WT-Udev> Speaking of the names, Jackalope?  That's about as real as a dragon or a unicorn or other mythical creatures.
[18:48] <IntuitiveNipple> Languid Llama ?
[18:50] <WT-Udev> Isn't a Llama a real animal though?
[18:51] <WT-Udev> Logical Leopard... no wait, that's too close to one of apple's codenames.
[18:51] <SiDi> the camels thatspit ?
[18:51] <SiDi> I want "Lobotomized Lemur" ! :O
[18:52] <FFEMTcJ> anyone?
[18:52] <WT-Udev> SiDi: I like that
[18:52] <SiDi> yeh
[18:52] <WT-Udev> FFEMTcJ: what?
[18:52] <WT-Udev> Oh, I don't think anyone that's installing saw that.
[18:52] <SiDi> a faq ?
[18:52] <SiDi> !faq
[18:53] <SiDi> !slap ubottu
[18:53] <FFEMTcJ> hmm.. I cant get todays daily to burn either
[18:53] <FFEMTcJ> uggh
[18:53] <charlie-tca> I burned it, but installing is different
[18:53] <FFEMTcJ> wont install charlie-tca ?
[18:55] <rdw200169> gah!  ffforever left right after he asked his question!  and i had the answer when i saw it in #ubuntu-meta... gah!
[18:55] <SiDi> hello charlie-tca
[18:58] <ikonia> pop79: what sort of "ideas" ?
[18:58] <charlie-tca> FFEMTcJ: won't install
[18:59] <FFEMTcJ> k
[18:59] <charlie-tca> SiDi: Hello
[19:01] <pop79> ikonia: sorry, i was eating, what?
[19:01] <ikonia> pop79: what sort of "ideas" do you want to submit ?
[19:01] <pop79> ikonia: why do you ask?
[19:02] <ikonia> curious, and the type of idea you want to submit determains the metods, eg: different processes
[19:02] <pop79> hmm, i don't think ill be telling anyone yet
[19:02] <ikonia> errr ????
[19:02] <ikonia> jaunty is open source - it's not "secrect2
[19:02] <ikonia> "
[19:03] <pop79> ikonia: are you trying to copy my idea or what?
[19:03] <ikonia> secret even
[19:03] <ikonia> pop79: no, I'm curious to what you want to submit, but also I'm trying to offer the correct route to submit it
[19:03] <ikonia> as the different types of content have different methods to submit
[19:03] <pop79> well, it's an idea... maybe ill just submit it in ubuntu brainstorm
[19:04] <pop79> ikonia: we haven't really been great friends anyway
[19:04] <ikonia> yes, if it's an idea thats "pie in the sky" at the moment, brainstorm is a good tool to use
[19:04] <ikonia> pop79: what has not being friends got to do with anything ?
[19:04] <pop79> umm, i dunno...
[19:04] <ikonia> pop79: be aware that nothing will get into jaunty now as it's on feature freeze
[19:04] <pop79> i mean, why would you be helping me?
[19:05]  * SiDi tries to find a way to sneak into pop79 to steal his idea.
[19:05] <ikonia> pop79: why would I not help you ???
[19:05]  * SiDi goes back home to take a drill.
[19:05] <ikonia> pop79: just because I don't know you - why would I not help you ?
[19:05] <pop79> ikonia: it is nothing to do with that...
[19:05] <ikonia> ????
[19:05] <ikonia> then why did you just say it ?
[19:06] <pop79> i cant tell you, because you might get mad
[19:06] <ikonia> why would I get mad ?
[19:06] <pop79> at me
[19:06] <ikonia> I don't run jaunty
[19:06] <ikonia> you can submit what you want
[19:06] <pop79> a look, just forget i said anything
[19:06] <ikonia> I am just trying to point out that nothing will get into jaunty due to being passed feature freeze (I think it's just passed)
[19:06] <ikonia> hence "trying to help"
[19:06] <WT-Udev> pop79: the short answer is, by helping anyone, there is a chance it will improve the community, in one way or another.  Thus we are helping our selfs as well.
[19:07] <ikonia> yes a good idea is a good idea, pop79 I don't know you, I don't like you or dislike you - but I'd help or dicuss the topic with anyone
[19:07] <ikonia> that's the point of the channel
[19:07] <pop79> I know, but it was something between me and ikonia. Ani know ikonia, i respect it too...
[19:07] <ikonia> there is nothing between me and you ???
[19:08] <pop79> bye now...
[19:08] <ikonia> what ?
[19:08] <WT-Udev> However, ikonia is pointing out that there are established conventions in this community.  Such as Jaunty being too close to done to add anything more to it.   There are also other conventions, which ikonia is trying to tell you about.  Those conventions determine the best place to start with an idea at a given stage so that it will be considered as a useful part of a future release.
[19:08] <WT-Udev> ... O... Kayyy   Maybe pop will grow up a little and return someday.
[19:09] <ikonia> I have no idea what he's on about
[19:09] <ikonia> he sent me a message saying "we are great friends" - I said I don't know you, and he now seems to think I dislike him ????
[19:09] <WT-Udev> ikonia: I've seen that reaction with others as well my self.
[19:10] <WT-Udev> A friend is someone I'd go out of my way to be around, to help, to seek help from in a time of need.
[19:10] <ikonia> yes,
[19:10] <ikonia> considering that was the first line of a conversation...........not sure how I could be a great friend, but anyone back to normality
[19:10] <WT-Udev> There's not really anyone in here I'd consider a friend, but there are those I have respect for, and most others I see as peers involved in trying to move in the same general direction.
[19:10] <SiDi> What the hell did this guy take before joining the chan ? Oo
[19:11] <WT-Udev> SiDi: American Culture?
[19:11] <tretle> :)
[19:11] <WT-Udev> (he?) sounds like a lot of the people around where I live
[19:11] <SiDi> that's not nice to the US citizen WT-Udev :)
[19:11] <SiDi> Well, i'm sure there are normal people in the US, too
[19:12] <WT-Udev> SiDi: I am one though, and it's true.  It's not defimation (sp) if it's true.
[19:12] <NoelJB> ikonia: don't sweat it.  I just read the entire interaction, and he was just odd.
[19:12] <WT-Udev> We have a serious problem in this country... well several.    Though not quite as bad...
[19:14] <WT-Udev> The war on terra (intentional spelling, slur it slightly) just greased the slope we were already on.
[19:15] <NoelJB> No comment, considering that this is *UBUNTU+1*.
[19:15] <NoelJB> :0)
[19:16] <WT-Udev> Right, solutions.
[19:17] <WT-Udev> Search engines, then google, started improving my life around the end of high-school and through college.  Wikipedia is even better, not always fully accurate, but if you take it with salt it's a great starting point.
[19:20] <WT-Udev> Fundimentally I think our educational system is where things should start.  Memorising booring facts to select from multiple choice of fill in the blank questions no longer serves our species.  That menial labor is what databases and computers help us solve.  Instead we should run schools with the students on a self-paced path in loosely forming teams that are modeled after migrating from pre-history through history as we know ...
[19:20] <WT-Udev> ... it, with various skills of the era taught to the children in those groups and problems of the time presented to them to solve.  As they get closer to the modern era they'd be tackeling problems of the cold war, the 80's etc, in what would be seen as high-school level.  College and higher levels would be directly working on current problems and research.
[19:21] <WT-Udev> With a model like that I think education could actually be -fun- and hence people would enjoy it and respect it.
[19:25] <WT-Udev> Actually, this is a fairly diverse group; is there any country using a system like that alraedy?
[19:26] <FFEMTcJ> its not possible to upgrade from 8.10 to 9.04 alpha and switch to ext4 is it?
[19:27] <WT-Udev> FFEMTcJ: You have to be running a -very- recent kernel to do ext4, well or a patched one.
[19:27] <FFEMTcJ> im running whatever the current one on the repos is
[19:27] <WT-Udev> If you have ext3 you can mount it in such a way that it will convert to ext4, but your old files will still be laid out in the ext3 way.
[19:28] <ikonia> WT-Udev: really ?
[19:28] <FFEMTcJ> so better to wait till i can get a 9.04 to install
[19:28] <ikonia> WT-Udev: have you got details on that ?
[19:28] <ikonia> WT-Udev: a migration method ?
[19:28] <WT-Udev> http://ext4.wiki.kernel.org/ http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-ext4/ << top two results on google for: ext3 to ext4
[19:29] <ikonia> WT-Udev: mega, thank you
[19:29] <ikonia> I'd not heard about that
[19:30] <maxb> How are people finding the new notifications system (notify-osd)? Personally I'm feeling that it's inferior in all ways to what existed before, and am wondering whether to post to u-d-d@ suggesting that it shouldn't be the default in Jaunty.
[19:30] <WT-Udev> http://ext4.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Ext4_Howto <<
[19:31] <WT-Udev> http://ext4.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Ext4_Howto#Converting_an_ext3_filesystem_to_ext4 << There you go, read very carefully, BUT you need to have a kernel and libraries that work with ext4...
[19:33] <WT-Udev> So, looking at that, I remembered it correctly.  Also, as always, when altering the fundimentals of a partition, such as filesystem version, you must do it offline (unless an exception is noted).  Break out your recent copies of install/live cds or a recovery cd.
[19:35] <duncan-nz> Where has directory searching and indexing gone?
[19:35] <ikonia> duncan-nz: ahh did you not get any further with that
[19:35] <ikonia> duncan-nz: I've not had chance to do a clean install to verify that
[19:35] <duncan-nz> nope.
[19:36] <SiDi> maxb: its really nice but i cant get use to the fact that i cant click it
[19:36] <WT-Udev> duncan-nz: by 'searching' you mean slocate?  I never really used that often enough for it to be worth it.
[19:36] <SiDi> maxb: though its definately more beautiful than what we used to have with libnotify. now just waiting for the tools to customize it... and to ***in put it on the bottom right of my screen !
[19:37] <Jordan_U> SiDi, You already can
[19:37] <duncan-nz> WT-Udev, I don't know what slocate is. But I know that the Tracker application was good for searching and indexing my directories. It was installed by default but now it's gone.
[19:37] <Jordan_U> SiDi, Nvm, the preference is there but I guess it doesn't work yet
[19:38] <SiDi> Jordan_U: no it doesnt :)
[19:38] <SiDi> But  i must say i like how it renders, though
[19:38] <SiDi> i just do hope exaile will use it instead of their ugly notification OSD
[19:38] <maxb> SiDi: I agree it's pretty, but pretty means nothing to me, when it disappears too quickly to read all the text, or truncates the text.
[19:38] <Klanticus> hello guys, I'm getting this error when I try to run firefox: http://pastebin.com/d27005b51
[19:39] <Jordan_U> SiDi, Make sure there is a bug filed against it, Canonical is planning to patch a lot of apps
[19:39] <Klanticus> I'm using kde4 64bits... Any idea about this?
[19:39] <ikonia> Klanticus: how did you install firefox ?
[19:40] <charlie-tca> maxb: I kinda hate it. It gets in the way, but I have no idea what it says since it does go away so fast.
[19:40] <Klanticus> ikonia: it was installed via the package manager. It was working some time ago. I think some update broke it
[19:40] <charlie-tca> Just seems to add to the misery of poor eyesight
[19:40] <ikonia> Klanticus: I'm more interested because it's gdk erroring
[19:41] <Klanticus> ikonia: also, looks like all gtk apps are having a similar problem. OOWriter also give me a similar error
[19:41] <ikonia> Klanticus: ooh really, now that is interesting
[19:42] <SiDi> Jordan_U: on launchpad i presume ?
[19:42] <duncan-nz> ikonia, I'm not getting the gtk error these people are talking about
[19:42] <duncan-nz> running Jaunty as we speak.
[19:42] <Klanticus> ikonia: this is the oow error: http://pastebin.com/d22b45d70
[19:42] <ikonia> duncan-nz: me neither I wonder if it's because I'm not using kubuntu
[19:42] <Jordan_U> SiDi, Yes
[19:43] <SiDi> Jordan_U: there are a lot of reports :( i gotta check if it isnt there now :(
[19:43] <WT-Udev> http://www.google.com/search?q=X-Error%3A+badname+GTK << Seems like there's some company
[19:44] <duncan-nz> Tracker! So now one knows what's happened to searching and indexing?
[19:48] <WT-Udev> Klanticus: What was your install path to get to 9.04?  Directly from 8.10 or from something earlier?
[19:48] <WT-Udev> Or fresh
[19:49] <SiDi> Jordan_U: there already was on :)
[19:49] <ronny> yo
[19:49] <SiDi> one*
[19:49] <ronny> imm having a weird issue, when tracker is running vim sometimes hangs on io
[19:50] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: I made a fresh install of 9.04. I think I used the alpha 3 iso
[19:50] <duncan-nz> ronny, I can't help with that problem, but did you have to install tracker? I don't seem to have it under jaunty.
[19:51] <ronny> duncan-nz: i did have it before, just updated
[19:51] <duncan-nz> ronny, so you didn't install Jaunty fresh?
[19:51] <WT-Udev> Klanticus: Sorry then, I was reading https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=430416 and that seemed like a possibility
[19:52] <ronny> duncan-nz: did a distupgrade
[19:52] <duncan-nz> ronny, ok thanks.
[19:52] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: ff was working some days ago, but I can't tell exactly when the things got broken
[19:53] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: hmm.. may this be related to the video driver? I was using nv, then switched to nvidia these days
[19:53] <WT-Udev> I was using nvidia and ff and had no issues though
[19:53] <WT-Udev> That was only 2 days ago though... when did it break for you?
[19:54] <Klanticus> I noticed this yesterday, but I wasn't using ubuntu for some days before
[19:54] <ronny> anyone got an idea how to work around the io load issues?
[19:54] <Klanticus> and I did a somewhat big update the last time I used and ff was working
[19:55] <WT-Udev> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/287601 << this your bug?
[19:58] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: hmm.. looks like it is the same problem I'm having
[19:58] <Klanticus> but the report is a bit old
[19:58] <WT-Udev> Klanticus: they've all been old... do you have XFS installed at the moment?  That is...
[19:58] <WT-Udev> xfs - X font server
[19:59] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: dunno.. how do I check this?
[20:01] <WT-Udev> Open a console
[20:02] <WT-Udev> sudo -s
[20:02] <WT-Udev> dpkg -l xfs
[20:02] <WT-Udev> un  xfs << not installed
[20:02] <WT-Udev> ii  xfs << installed
[20:02] <Klanticus> it's installed
[20:03] <WT-Udev> aptitude remove xfs
[20:03] <WT-Udev> Does it want to remove anythign besides xfs?
[20:03] <WT-Udev> Actually before you do that
[20:03] <WT-Udev> Can you file a bug report?
[20:04] <WT-Udev> Say, bug 287601 is still broken, you need to get on with your life, and could they please push the fix already?
[20:04] <Klanticus> it wanna remove the kernel headers
[20:05] <WT-Udev> anything else?
[20:05] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: no.. just these
[20:05] <Finnish> Aargh, I'm trying daily build from yesterday, I'm stuck in Step 5 0f 8 in installer. It has been doing something at least 10 minutes, it seems its not going further
[20:06] <Finnish> Should I just wait?
[20:06] <WT-Udev> Klanticus: *shrugs* proceed if you want.  I can't think of any way that removing kernel headders would give you anything less functional of a system.
[20:06] <WT-Udev> Besides if something else needed them it'd be asking to remove that too
[20:07] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: i think i just need them to compile nvidia drivers
[20:07] <WT-Udev> Finnish: are you trying to use lvm, raid, or crypto
[20:07] <WT-Udev> Klanticus: then it'll ask for them again later
[20:07] <WT-Udev> remove xfs, and log out of x, then log back in.  Let us know if it worked or not.
[20:07] <Finnish> No, I'm not trying anything special
[20:07] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: I'll do some tests here before removing xfs... brb
[20:08] <Finnish> WT-Udev: I'm just trying to install it to my laptop, nothing special
[20:09] <WT-Udev> Finnish: just directly to bare partitions, no lvm or anything?
[20:09] <Finnish> Whats lvm?
[20:09] <WT-Udev> you're absolutely sure you aren't running any of the fancy stuff covered in bug 332270 ?
[20:11] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: ah.. found the problem
[20:11] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: nvidia-xconfig messed up my xorg.conf
[20:12] <WT-Udev> Oh yeah, that's kind of a no-duh.  Nvidia's drivers aren't technically 'released' for xorg 1.6 yet
[20:12] <WT-Udev> Why'd you run that instead of just letting the restricted driver manager do it for you?
[20:13] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: i coudn't find the package in the repositories
[20:14] <WT-Udev> ii  nvidia-180-modaliases                         180.29-0ubuntu2                               Modaliases for the NVIDIA binary X.Org driver
[20:14] <WT-Udev> ii  nvidia-glx-180                                180.29-0ubuntu2                               NVIDIA binary Xorg driver
[20:15] <WT-Udev> Or more to the point, the restricted driver manager should find and install it for you.
[20:15] <WT-Udev> There's still a minor bug (or was anyway) where you have to add some stuff to your xorg.conf to tell nvidia's drivers you really do want to use them.
[20:16] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: I think there isn't such thing in kde 4 yet
[20:16] <WT-Udev> Klanticus: Oh yeah, you might have to run that manually
[20:16] <Klanticus> WT-Udev: the ignoreABI thing?
[20:16] <WT-Udev> They actually have it in xubuntu...
[20:16] <WT-Udev> Klanticus: yup
[20:17] <ronny> ok, now x11 and sound started hanging, too
[20:18] <ronny> that fail is pathethic
[20:26] <WT-Udev> Should I take that as Klanticus fixed it?
[20:46] <SiDi> see you people
[20:46] <Jordan_U> I can't create a system setting ( "Available to all users" ) in network-manager
[20:46] <Jordan_U> When I hit apply nothing happens
[20:47] <Jordan_U> The window doesn't close, no authentication window pops up, it's just as if I hadn't pressed the button at all
[21:04] <charlie-tca> FFEMTcJ: I got the desktop cd to install. You have to install 'python-numpy' and then it works.
[21:05] <FFEMTcJ> charlie-tca: pardon my not knowing, but how do you do that?
[21:05] <charlie-tca> open a terminal at the desktop and run 'sudo apt-get update'
[21:05] <charlie-tca> Then run 'sudo apt-get install python-numpy'
[21:06] <charlie-tca> then close the terminal and do the normal install
[21:06] <FFEMTcJ> ok, so boot the live cd then
[21:06] <FFEMTcJ> i gotcha
[21:06] <charlie-tca> It probably won't get fixed until after tomorrow.
[21:07] <FFEMTcJ> k
[21:07] <FFEMTcJ> if i can install then im all good
[21:09] <charlie-tca> yeah, I'm working an on install now. But it is a really slow system
[21:12] <WT-Udev> That makes me think of something.  Currently the 'cds' are 'oversized' What ever are we going to do to fix that?  Dynamically linked open office or something?
[21:13] <charlie-tca> Current daily images have been resized already.
[21:18] <BUGabundo> WT-Udev: only release targets have special admin care
[21:18] <BUGabundo> like alphas, betas,rc and of course FINAL
[21:18] <FFEMTcJ> charlie-tca: im getting tons of buffer io errors when tryin to boot
[21:18] <charlie-tca> ouch
[21:18] <BUGabundo> this images are meant for VM or usbdisks
[21:18] <charlie-tca> I didn't get that
[21:19] <charlie-tca> I seem to have two systems hung at the partitioner instead
[21:20] <Sjimmie> so what's the next theme color gonna be?
[21:20] <FFEMTcJ> nrown
[21:20] <FFEMTcJ> brown
[21:20] <Sjimmie> boooooooo
[21:21]  * Sjimmie stops shouting boo and starts on working on a kick ass theme
[21:21] <charlie-tca> I hear Mr. Shuttleworth want a change for Karmic Koala
[21:22] <mkokotovich> Hello everyone, pulseaudio is broken for me in 8.10 - not sure if it is my fault or not.  I did an upgrade from 8.04, so maybe I have . Does anyone know if pulseaudio is going to be in tip-top condition in 9.04?
[21:22] <BUGabundo> that's in 6 months
[21:22] <BUGabundo> we can't wait anymore
[21:22] <mkokotovich> (sorry, jaunty)
[21:22] <BUGabundo> mkokotovich: hope so
[21:22] <charlie-tca> hope is good
[21:22] <BUGabundo> but currently there are still many corners to edge out
[21:22] <mkokotovich> me too
[21:22] <mkokotovich> where is the most work needed?
[21:22] <DanaG> IntuitiveNipple: oddly enough, I seem to be getting the same udev issue on a c ompletely non-LVM system... without the LVM package even installed.
[21:23] <Sjimmie> charlie-tca:  that's why I asked!
[21:23] <Sjimmie> but i'm in the wrong channel, should go to +2 :)
[21:23] <BUGabundo> on my system, withc have endured PA 9.14, 9.15 test1 and test2, and is now back to 91.4
[21:23] <WT-Udev> DanaG: Got any other device-mapper stuff?  Raid, cryptosetup etc?
[21:23] <BUGabundo> most stuff works
[21:23] <BUGabundo> still I have a few that fail!
[21:23] <IntuitiveNipple> DanaG: What is the disk arrangement?
[21:23] <charlie-tca> Sjimmie: yeah, we gotta get this one out first
[21:24] <BUGabundo> Sjimmie: or artwork team
[21:24] <charlie-tca> I just want the installer to work today
[21:24] <IntuitiveNipple> I'm getting close to the root of the problem now
[21:24] <Sjimmie> aight
[21:24] <DanaG> sda1: ntfs.  sda2: extended, I think.  sda3: fat32.  sda4: swap.  sda5: ext4 root.  sda5: ext4 home/
[21:25] <WT-Udev> IntuitiveNipple: did you see the other posts about the 65-dm-setup stuff too?
[21:25] <DanaG> Or something like that.
[21:25] <IntuitiveNipple> WT-Udev: yes.
[21:25] <mkokotovich> BUGabundo: is there anything that i could do to help get it rock-solid? Any specific bug reports to work on or something?
[21:25] <WT-Udev> Hum... DanaG that's really interesting.  What do your spam messages talk about for devices?  Mine were all sdaX and dm-X things.
[21:25] <DanaG> Hmm, I'll check.
[21:26] <WT-Udev> Lets see... wouldn't be a cdrom... but it could be a usb hard disk?
[21:29] <BUGabundo1> mkokotovich: sure
[21:29] <BUGabundo1> just keep informed on the news
[21:29] <Jordan_U> I can't seem to change any system wide settings in network-manager. When I hit apply nothing happens, no authentication window pops up, the window doesn't close. It's just as if I hadn't clicked the button at all
[21:29] <BUGabundo1> try to get intel from upstream
[21:29] <BUGabundo1> and report all bugs you find on PA, via LP
[21:30] <BUGabundo1> so that the audio team can have ROCK STEDY PA for jaunty
[21:30] <BUGabundo1> my main bug right now, are random disconects, VLC no audio, and pidgin crashing 'cause of sound
[21:31] <Jordan_U> Can anyone else try to setup a connection in network-manager with the "available to all users" box checked and see if they get the same problem?
[21:32] <BUGabundo1> Jordan_U: NM from archive or PPA?
[21:33] <Jordan_U> BUGabundo, Archive
[21:33] <BUGabundo1> yeah archive has higher version right now
[21:36] <DanaG> IntuitiveNipple: looks like I don't have the udev issue, after all -- it booted fine.
[21:36] <IntuitiveNipple> you just wished you did, huh?
[21:36] <DanaG> No, but my previous boot did hang on heavy HDD activity, according to the LED.
[21:36] <DanaG> This one worked fine.
[21:37] <DanaG> Oh yeah, my biggest issue with PA 0.9.15 (from PPA): crashes on resume from suspend.
[21:37] <DanaG> And is very glitchy when playing login sound.
[21:38] <BUGabundo1> DanaG: I stopped using 9.15
[21:38] <DanaG> heh, my HDD LED is cool: It has the hardware activity-LED in blue, and a software hddprotect LED in orange.
[21:38] <BUGabundo1> to unstable
[21:38] <BUGabundo1> but at least if fixed my pidgin prob
[21:38] <DanaG> Hmm, what did 0.9.15 bring, anyway?  I don't remember.  = þ
[21:38] <BUGabundo1> 9.14 makes pidgin crash more
[21:38] <BUGabundo1> DanaG: lots of changes
[21:38] <BUGabundo1> specially in the user space
[21:39] <BUGabundo1> so we are going to be again sound ginepigs for koala
[21:39] <DanaG> It now detects my HDMI port.
[21:39] <BUGabundo1> great
[21:39] <DanaG> Not that I use it. =þ
[21:39] <BUGabundo1> but that proprietary stuff
[21:39] <BUGabundo1> I don't care!
[21:40] <DanaG> anyway, with the orange hddprotect LED... I have it set to blink on SD-card activity.
[21:40] <dyf> BUGabundothere is no 9.14
[21:40] <DanaG> With my Firefox and Thunderbird profile on an SDHC card, it will blink blue and orange.   Trippy.
[21:41] <BUGabundo1> dyf: 9.14 is the one on jaunty
[21:42] <BUGabundo1> $ apt-cache policy pulseaudio  Installed: 0.9.14-0ubuntu7
[21:42] <dyf> BUGabundo1: you mean 9.04?
[21:42] <BUGabundo1> NO
[21:42] <BUGabundo1> I mean Pulse Audio 0.9.14
[21:42] <BUGabundo1> get your act strait!
[21:42] <dyf> oh ok
[21:42] <BUGabundo1> im talking to DanaG about PA
[21:43] <DanaG> =þ
[21:43] <FFEMTcJ> charlie-tca: i installed that app, now im tryin the install
[21:45] <charlie-tca> FFEMTcJ: like I said, I have two systems spinning at the partition editor. Appears to be another issue
[21:47] <FFEMTcJ> mine was getting all the way to upper 90%'s of installing and then would have the issue.. right now im at 55% copying files
[21:51] <charlie-tca> Great. Glad to hear it is working for you.
[21:58] <DanaG> hmm, last boot was 35 seconds.
[21:58] <FFEMTcJ> charlie-tca: booting into it.. install worked.. lets see what happens now
[21:59] <FFEMTcJ> booted fine.. yay
[21:59] <FFEMTcJ> thanks for tellin me how to do it!
[22:00] <charlie-tca> np. I'm glad it worked
[22:05] <thehook> I think I have found a bug, but I cant seem to find anything in the logs.. I have made a minimal installation, installed xorg and xfce4, and when I "startx" it will load and hang, one time it loaded the desktop and i right-clicked and got the menu and while hovering the menu it got really distorted and the computer hang again..
[22:06] <DanaG> odd, this one was 45 seconds... and 10 seconds or so was a "sleep" in somewhere, perhaps bluetoothd.
[22:06] <IntuitiveNipple> DanaG: Boot without "quiet splash" and add "debug" and you'll see precisely what is happening when the 'sleep' happens
[22:06] <thehook> when i installed gdm and was typing my username the a and e was really funny like japanese signs or something..
[22:07] <thehook> any ideas?
[22:07] <Jordan_U> I can't seem to change any system wide settings in network-manager. When I hit apply nothing happens, no authentication window pops up, the window doesn't close. It's just as if I hadn't clicked the button at all
[22:07] <DanaG> That boot was a UEFI boot, rather than the normal BIOS-based boot.
[22:07] <BUGabundo> Jordan_U: you have to talk to asac
[22:08] <BUGabundo> you can reach him on #ubuntu-dev and #ubuntu-mozillateam
[22:10]  * DanaG wishes grub2 had a savedefault option.
[22:10] <Jordan_U> BUGabundo, Is it appropriate to mention this sort of thing in #ubuntu-dev ?
[22:10] <BUGabundo> DanaG: it *used* to have
[22:10] <BUGabundo> got broken around hardy
[22:11] <BUGabundo> humm if asac is online, sure
[22:11] <BUGabundo> but #u-mt is already used to it too
[22:11] <DanaG> grub has savedefault, and it works.
[22:12] <DanaG> grub2 doesn't offer the feature.
[22:12] <DanaG> I don't truly "need" grub2, though.
[22:12] <BUGabundo> humm what do we have?
[22:12] <BUGabundo> 1.99? is grub2 right?
[22:12] <DanaG> nope.  grub2 is grub2.
[22:12] <Jordan_U> BUGabundo, Ubuntu-dev is invite only]
[22:12] <BUGabundo> naaa
[22:13]  * BUGabundo joins #u-dev
[22:13] <Jordan_U> DanaG, 1.99 is grub2, unless you are saying that grub2 does not exist yet
[22:13] <DanaG> ah.
[22:13] <DanaG> !info grub-efi
[22:13] <DanaG> ah.
[22:14] <BUGabundo> ahh I thought I was right
[22:15] <Jordan_U> DanaG, But it's still at version 1.96, it hasn't reached 2.0
[22:15] <DanaG> www.csc.calpoly.edu/~dgoyette/bootchart
[22:15] <DanaG> check the last two, for today.
[22:16] <DanaG> Now if only I could split out the two EFI binary types from the rEFIt tools.
[22:17] <DanaG> They're all "fat binaries" -- so I can't run them.
[22:17] <DanaG> odd... my shutdown dialog is unthemed.
[22:18] <BUGabundo> lol my 3G is so slow I can see my self timeing out on IRC
[22:40] <nemo> say, what's the easiest way in ubuntu to forcibly roll back libqt and all its dependancies from 4.5 to 4.4?
[22:41] <nemo> getting this 100% CPU consumption in Qt apps. due to something odd in QEventDispatcherGlib::processEvents
[22:41] <bruce89> I don't think you can
[22:41] <dtchen> there is no easy way
[22:41] <nemo> :-/
[22:41] <billybigrigger> go back into your apt cache and dpkg -i install the 4.4 .debs you want????
[22:42] <nemo> hm.
[22:42] <nemo> bit tedious.
[22:42] <billybigrigger> yup
[22:42] <dtchen> it's partly because new binaries immediately supercede existing ones on Launchpad, unlike with Debian
[22:42] <dtchen> with sid, you can pass an explicit previous version to {apt-get,aptitude} install
[22:43] <Theuntje> hello?
[22:43] <dtchen> (and it will work, because the older ones aren't immediately pruned)
[22:43] <dtchen> the only way i can see of doing it is to pull the superceded ones from launchpadlibrarian
[22:43] <Theuntje> Oké.. Can someone help me? I just can't seem to update the linux kernel
[22:44] <dtchen> Theuntje: what precisely is the issue?
[22:44] <Theuntje> well when I update he gives me this
[22:44] <Theuntje> E: /var/cache/apt/archives/linux-image-2.6.27-7-generic_2.6.27-7.16_amd64.deb: kan geen reservekoppeling van `./boot/vmlinuz-2.6.27-7-generic' maken voor de installatie van de nieuwe vers
[22:45] <Theuntje> (can't create reserve *something* for installation of new version)
[22:45] <Theuntje> the strange thing is that I've got the problem with 8.10 and 9.04 alpha 4
[22:46] <WT-Udev> Theuntje: might it be saying /boot is out of space?
[22:46] <dtchen> either /boot or /tmp
[22:46] <WT-Udev> 'df' to check your mounted filesystem space use
[22:46] <dtchen> dpkg will unpack into /tmp
[22:47] <Theuntje> Nope there is lots of space
[22:47] <dtchen> are both /boot and /tmp writeable?
[22:47] <Theuntje> how can I check? :$
[22:48] <WT-Udev> Theuntje: simple way?  touch /boot/test (tries to make a file) touch /tmp/test
[22:48] <WT-Udev> don't forget to rm the files when you're done
[22:48] <Theuntje> when I'm in the 'boot' directory I can't make an new folder.. so I quess that's not right..
[22:49] <Theuntje> in the folder 'tmp' I can create
[22:49] <WT-Udev> 'mount'
[22:49] <WT-Udev> /dev/sda4 on /boot type ext3 (rw,relatime)
[22:49] <WT-Udev> You see ro, ?
[22:49] <WT-Udev> mount -o remount,rw /boot   << to fix it being read-only
[22:51] <Theuntje> after doing the mount -o it is still not writeble
[22:51] <IntuitiveNipple> permissions? Are you using sudo?
[22:51] <Theuntje> yes
[22:51] <WT-Udev> Theuntje: odd that should have worked.
[22:52] <WT-Udev> dmesg | tail
[22:52] <WT-Udev> did it give you an error?
[22:52] <Theuntje> nope just moved to next line
[22:52] <WT-Udev> I mean, in the kernel messages
[22:52] <Theuntje> when I tried updating again?
[22:52] <WT-Udev> No
[22:52] <WT-Udev> when you run dmesg | tail
[22:52] <WT-Udev> to see the messages that normally just get logged to a file
[22:53] <Theuntje> theuntje@ubuntu:~$ dmesg | tail
[22:53] <Theuntje> [   35.525381] hda-intel: Invalid position buffer, using LPIB read method instead.
[22:53] <Theuntje> [   37.141396] NET: Registered protocol family 10
[22:53] <Theuntje> [   37.142671] lo: Disabled Privacy Extensions
[22:53] <Theuntje> [   47.232021] eth0: no IPv6 routers present
[22:53] <Theuntje> [13051.575415] usb 6-3.2: USB disconnect, address 7
[22:53] <Theuntje> [13051.575428] usb 6-3.2.1: USB disconnect, address 8
[22:53] <Theuntje> [13051.706167] usb 6-3.2.2: USB disconnect, address 9
[22:53] <Theuntje> [13336.864754] zc3xx: probe 2wr ov vga 0x0000
[22:53] <Theuntje> [13342.524752] zc3xx: probe 2wr ov vga 0x0000
[22:53] <Theuntje> [15948.681973] npviewer.bin[10518]: segfault at ff9d0aa0 ip 00000000ff9d0aa0 sp 00000000ff88a45c error 14
[22:53] <bruce89> !flood
[22:53] <Theuntje> sorry!
[22:53] <WT-Udev> Theuntje: nothing interesting there.
[22:54] <WT-Udev> Ah, however
[22:54] <WT-Udev> sudo -s
[22:54] <WT-Udev> just do that to grab a root shell since you'll be running so many commands
[22:54] <Theuntje> ok
[22:54] <Theuntje> so I'm root now
[22:54] <WT-Udev> Try installing it again
[22:54] <WT-Udev> still get the error?
[22:56] <Theuntje> using the installer yes
[22:56] <Theuntje> do I need to do it tru the command line?
[22:56] <WT-Udev> try the touch /boot/whatever again
[22:57] <WT-Udev> Does it work now that you're # and not $?
[22:57] <Theuntje> when i do touc h It doesn give any message
[22:58] <WT-Udev> rm /boot/whatever you touched
[22:58] <dtchen> i need any army. people should take jaunty daily-live cds into their nearest retail computer stores and give me alsa-info.sh output so i can fix the HDA buffer issues.
[22:58] <Theuntje> well that worked
[22:59] <Theuntje> but now I've lost my memtest86+.bin
[22:59] <Theuntje> XD
[22:59] <maco> dtchen: i think i get why people call Network Manager "Network Mangler"
[22:59] <Theuntje> is that memtest important? (A)
[22:59] <maco> dtchen: don't you want them to include a list of things that seem broken on the machines that correspond to those alsa-info outputs?
[22:59] <WT-Udev> Theuntje: only if you want to test your computer's memory
[23:00] <Theuntje> I think it's fine :p
[23:00] <Theuntje> whatś the command to update thru command line
[23:00] <WT-Udev> Theuntje: BTW, I'll assume you're testing Jaunty.  Do you have any lvm, cryptsetup, or raid partitions?
[23:01] <Theuntje> No.. but I did install jaunty thru windows (blergh)
[23:01] <WT-Udev> dtchen: what is this alsa-info.sh
[23:01] <WT-Udev> As long as you installed it on to bare partitions you own't have a problem.
[23:02] <WT-Udev> Theuntje: apt-get update
[23:02] <WT-Udev> apt-get upgrade
[23:02] <WT-Udev> in that order
[23:02] <maco> WT-Udev: http://alsa-project.org/alsa-info.sh
[23:02] <WT-Udev> if you're not #, add sudo to the front
[23:02] <maco> WT-Udev: download and run it in bash, it spits out all the info about the sound devices
[23:02] <maco> WT-Udev: if you use --debug it'll put it in /tmp so you don't need to worry about being online
[23:02] <Theuntje> Fouten gevonden tijdens behandelen van:
[23:02] <Theuntje>  /var/cache/apt/archives/linux-image-2.6.27-7-generic_2.6.27-7.16_amd64.deb
[23:02] <Theuntje> E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
[23:03] <Theuntje> http://paste.ubuntu.com/121599/
[23:05] <WT-Udev> dtchen: maco I don't have that issue on my laptop but http://www.alsa-project.org/db/?f=696411d7532edfe9c9cb73faec83e25bbe121544
[23:08] <WT-Udev> dtchen: maco http://www.alsa-project.org/db/?f=f236149833d9209374ac9211de647b22e25cf5c1 << Desktop system, this one had working audio on the integrated sound card, and then... sort of fizzled and wouldn't work anymore at all.
[23:10] <Theuntje> well thanks for the help but Gotta goo to sleep and stuff
[23:10] <Theuntje> I'll come back tommorow to ask all of you questions again :D
[23:12] <Theuntje> ow yeah.. when does Ubuntu comes with her mobile phone platform?
[23:12] <maco> attention kontact: please stop crashing!
[23:12] <maco> phone? i thought ubuntu mobile was for netbooks
[23:13] <Theuntje> I know.. but a ubuntu for mobile phones would be nice ;)
[23:13]  * bruce89 doesn't think that OO.o on a phone would be a good idea
[23:13] <maco> hahaha
[23:14] <dtchen> WT-Udev: please don't direct that url to me, because i get far too many to triage them effectively. instead, a wiki page along the lines of https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2009-February/007156.html would be more useful.
[23:15] <WT-Udev> Theuntje: not that I know of... and I'd rather see a netbook that happened to have a wan device to talk to a cell network
[23:15] <WT-Udev> dtchen: Oh, I thought you wanted more data, sorry.
[23:15] <Theuntje> why doesn chmodd works? :p
[23:16] <dtchen> WT-Udev: i do, but not directed *to me* :-)
[23:16] <WT-Udev> dtchen: being about... 5-6 hours past when I'd planned to go to bed, I'll try to remember the urls are in my logs somewhere.
[23:17] <maco> i'll move 'em
[23:18] <ph03n1ks> anyone here know anything about any problems with the install image for the jaunty netbook remix alpha 4?
[23:19] <Theuntje> well I've updated jaunty to alpha 4 on my eee also but no problems there
[23:20] <ph03n1ks> i habe the remix 8.04,
[23:20] <ph03n1ks> was going to put an im
[23:20] <ph03n1ks> oops
[23:21] <ph03n1ks> was going to install alpha 4 on a seperate partition on my aspire one but the gui is thr wrong resolution, cant access the buttons
[23:22] <dudus> ph03n1ks: hold alt button to move the window up so you can access the buttons
[23:22] <ph03n1ks> argh, i spent hours at it the other nite trying to guess which button i was tabbing to!
[23:22] <ph03n1ks> will try alt.
[23:23] <maco> dtchen: do you want a 4th column for listing any oddities that occur with that device in current jaunty?
[23:23] <ph03n1ks> is it a known issue? i searched and couldnt find a bug report
[23:23] <crdlb> ph03n1ks: note that if compiz is enabled, you can't move a window beyond the panels (by default)
[23:24] <dtchen> maco: that would explode the necessary columns (e.g., links to diffs against default - as shipped - conffiles)
[23:24] <maco> dtchen: so you just want the alsa-info without any info as to whether the sound device works correctly or not?
[23:25] <ph03n1ks> hmm, what is compiz (n00b here :) )  i dont there are panels on the netbook remix?
[23:25] <dtchen> maco: i'm not attempting to fix jack sensing or init verbs. this procedure is solely for fixing the buffer issues
[23:26] <maco> ph03n1ks: compiz is desktop effects. and if you're a "n00b" as you say...why use alpha? or are you just testing a live cd?
[23:26] <maco> dtchen: well how will you know if the device has buffer issues or not then?
[23:26] <WT-Udev> dtchen: my laptop doesn't show a buffer issue, at least not on the current boot
[23:26] <maco> dtchen: or is it "only list devices with buffer issues"?
[23:26] <dtchen> maco: simple, they all do.
[23:27] <dtchen> the current driver is *broken*
[23:27] <dtchen> i.e., there's not a single *working* hwptr case
[23:27] <WT-Udev> [   26.425566] hda_codec: Unknown model for ALC883, trying auto-probe from BIOS...
[23:27] <WT-Udev> that's my desktop
[23:27] <BUGabundo> I really need to reboot this laptop and to properly test my sound
[23:28] <ph03n1ks> maco: i have 8.04 and the boot time isnt grat, i read shuttleworths comments about how the target boot time for jaunty on a netbook was 25 seconds so i had to try it! plus he said they were looking for testers so i thought i might be able to report bugs or something
[23:28] <BUGabundo> I have to kill PA a few times a day to get it working
[23:28] <BUGabundo> ph03n1ks: good luck! mine are of 60-85 secs
[23:28] <dtchen> BUGabundo: already known; takashi and i narrowed that down with lennart a few days before i made the autospawn change
[23:28] <BUGabundo> http://fileland.bugabundo.net/fotos/Linux/bootchart
[23:28] <nemo> dtchen: yeah. normally I don't have a problem with this superceding thing, except that Qt 4.5 seems badly badly broken
[23:29] <BUGabundo> dtchen: stuff like VLC are hard to make work
[23:29] <ph03n1ks> bugabundo: is that on jaunty?
[23:29] <dtchen> BUGabundo: i.e., bug 330814
[23:29] <BUGabundo> today took me 4 times to get it working
[23:29] <maco> dtchen: all HDA or all-all?
[23:29] <BUGabundo> ph03n1ks: many, since hardy up to a few days ago
[23:29]  * BUGabundo looks at bug
[23:29] <dtchen> maco: all.
[23:30] <BUGabundo> dtchen: humm pidgin still crashs a lot with 9.14
[23:30] <maco> ph03n1ks: ah ok. this is your *spare* machine, right?
[23:30] <BUGabundo> 9.15 was much smoother
[23:30] <BUGabundo> got only on sound related pidgin crash on 9.15
[23:30] <ph03n1ks> maco: no spare machine, just one netbook,  was gona partitionto test it.
[23:30] <dtchen> BUGabundo: same issue outlined in bug; newer versions of PA just take somewhat longer to trigger the broken hwptr
[23:31]  * bruce89 is amazed that the powers that be voted to change the number of months this year to 20
[23:31] <maco> ph03n1ks: ok. i just dont recommend having only-jaunty unless you know how to fix breakage
[23:31] <maco> bruce89: those are pulseaudio version strings
[23:31] <ph03n1ks> maco: ok, thanks, should be ok with partition id say. thx.
[23:31] <maco> bruce89: ubuntu is shipping 9.14, but themuso has 9.15 in his PPA for esting
[23:31] <BUGabundo> dtchen: my symptoms don't resemble that bug
[23:32] <bruce89> I never let facts get in the way of a bad joke
[23:32] <dtchen> BUGabundo: i can guarantee you're hitting the hwptr bug at the very least
[23:32] <dtchen> BUGabundo: so while your symptoms may not directly correspond, you *are* affected
[23:32] <BUGabundo> ok
[23:32] <BUGabundo> thanks
[23:33] <BUGabundo> I'll sub to it
[23:33] <dtchen> people can complain about PA breaking stuff, but it has been immensely useful in exposing vast breakage in alsa-driver
[23:33] <BUGabundo> dtchen: one more thing
[23:33] <BUGabundo> my padevchooser keeps getting disconnected from PA
[23:34] <dtchen> BUGabundo: yeah, a bt thread apply-all would show it not handling null events
[23:34] <BUGabundo> 2nd Q: who can I keep an app LONG enough on the Applicantions list of pacontrol to set it with a lower volume?
 hello there - I upgraded to Jaunty (9.04) and everything works except wireless: Network Manager shows list of available network, but when I select my wifi network, the connection keeps happening.. after 3 mins or so.. it failes. any idea why?
[23:34] <dtchen> there're two bugs at play there, but i'm not going to worry about it right this moment.
[23:34] <BUGabundo> pidgin "pings" are so fast I don't have the time to move my mouse
[23:34] <srid> wifi signal strenth is good, etc.. I suspect some bug. my hardware is T61 intel wireless card
[23:35] <BUGabundo> srid: have you looked on LP?
[23:35] <srid> BUGabundo, I tried to searching for this in launchpad, but couldn't find any relevant bug.
[23:35] <srid> right now, i'm on windows
[23:35] <BUGabundo> dtchen: can apps be made a few more secs persistent on that list?
[23:36] <BUGabundo> should I file a wish bu for that, and link upstream?
[23:36] <srid> should I send any log files?
[23:36] <BUGabundo> srid: you need to talk to asac (on #ubuntu-mozillateam)