[00:00] <guiverc> as for strikethru... maybe just a discourse.addon tweak to the 'red'  we're using;  we made need to switch to  or greenish...
[00:11] <Bashing-om> guiverc: ^ reasonable assumption - as also on the skeleton where we had not made any recent edits - notice too that the page layouts are also chnaged for the worsing space usage.
[00:14] <guiverc> aesthetics are not my thing... I may not even notice layout changes.. but if they've changed defaults to Ubuntu Discourse/Hub, we'll need to just *adjust* for future issues (I'll suggest we ignore released issues; maybe current if its worth it)
[00:19] <guiverc> to remove the crossout; we'll just replace  with  & have it green... I'm happy with green...
[00:22] <guiverc> ^ is my proposal anyway.. (there maybe better alternatives; but not an issue that really worries me.. I'll look for page layout changes when I do summaries (later today))
[00:29] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Thanks heaps - all under advisement and noted down for actions.
[00:30] <guiverc> i'm happy to amend too (when I next edit)
[00:32] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Unless something new crosses my horizon - will not do further edits to UWN untill my morrow.
[00:35] <guiverc> strikeout removed...  (that didn't look good & it changed meaning..  we're now using a washed-out old green highlighter)
[00:35] <guiverc> I didn't touch skeleton though
[00:40] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Green works for me :D
[01:52]  * guiverc going to add some summaries shortly..
[01:57]  * guiverc out.
[02:11]  * guiverc adding another..
[02:49]  * guiverc going to add some more (shortly)
[02:55]  * guiverc out
[03:23] <guiverc> Bashing-om, https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/modern-communication-platforms-call-for-feedback/36763/33 maybe worth included (post on existing thread.. agree? want summary for it?)
[03:25] <Bashing-om> guiverc: looking
[03:27] <Bashing-om> guiverc: We can if ya want - my thought was that this is an update to old news from last week - my memory however might be corrupt :)
[03:31] <guiverc> Mauro Gaspari writes an update on an existing thread; that people have "been working hard" to improve Matrix documentation, which is still a work in progress. We're invited to join in on this writing task if we can. Thanks are given to Aaron Prisk, Philipp Kewisch, as well as members of the Matrix Council (Seth Arnold, Nils Büchner, Marc Gilligan & Merlijn Sebrechts) as well as to Aaron Rainbolt.
[03:31] <guiverc> the thanks is maybe why to include I suspect...
[03:32]  * guiverc scanning 823
[03:33] <guiverc> I don't see any repeat of anything in 823
[03:36] <guiverc> maybe s/Matrix Council/[temporary] Matrix Council/  (Mauro didn't use temporary in post)
[03:37] <guiverc> I'm not fussed.. I think worth including as shows progress..
[03:43] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Agreed . has our full support :D
[04:12] <guiverc> added ^ to uwn
[04:15] <Bashing-om> \o/
[05:04] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::planet:: Ubuntu Blog: Meet Canonical at Mobile World Congress Barcelona 2024 @ https://ubuntu.com//blog/canonical-at-mwc-barcelona-2024
[05:04] -ubottu:#ubuntu-news- ::planet:: Stéphane Graber: Announcing Incus 0.5 @ https://stgraber.org/2024/01/26/announcing-incus-0-5/
[07:56] <guiverc> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/introducing-kernel-6-8-for-the-24-04-noble-numbat-release/41958
[07:58] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Yup - we can jump on that :S
[07:59] <guiverc> Andrea Righi reports the "tentative target kernel" for Ubuntu 24.04 LTS is Linux 6.8. Reminding us of the deadline dates for this release, we're told an experimental build of the latest Ubuntu kernel can be found on the Canonical Kernel team unstable PPA, which will be updated weekly until in Ubuntu repositories. We're reminded this is still experimental at this stage, before being given the "most noticeable changes" and more.
[08:01] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Looks great to me :)
[08:01] <guiverc> want me to add? or you?
[08:02] <Bashing-om> guiverc: You may if up to it - I am barely hanging in right now // open to bad errors here :P
[08:02] <guiverc> np... will add, thanks Bashing-om
[08:08] <guiverc> done
[08:15] <Bashing-om> :D
[14:55] <tsimonq2> In case we even considered it, my trust in Phoronix is wearing thin: https://www.phoronix.com/news/Endeavour-OS-Linux-6.7
[14:55] <tsimonq2> Why would they not simply check the Calamares version?
[14:55] <tsimonq2> *shrug* :)
[22:55] <Bashing-om> UWN: Accessing 824 - Saturday wrap-up - small things to add no summaries.


[00:49] <mup> PR snapcraft#3371 opened: snap: get legacy branch from local <Created by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/3371>
[06:49] <mborzecki> morning
[06:50] <mborzecki> re
[07:23] <zyga> mborzecki: hello
[07:23]  * zyga installed kubuntu and now wonders how to do stuff in kde :P
[07:23] <mborzecki> hahah
[07:23] <mborzecki> zyga:  hey
[07:24] <zyga> I'm back on the x240 until the new one arrives, need to do some serial port things and I wanted to avoid doing it from window
[07:24] <zyga> *windows
[07:24] <zyga> how's uc20?
[07:40] <mborzecki> zyga: it was moving, i was off for 2 days, but there's 2.48 branch, so things are looking good?
[07:41] <zyga> mborzecki: ooh, new house time?
[07:42] <mborzecki> zyga: nah, i mean uc20 was moving, albeit slowly ;)
[07:42] <zyga> ohhh
[07:42] <zyga> well, :)
[07:56] <mup> PR snapd#9629 opened: spdx: update to SPDX license list version: 3.10 2020-08-03 <Simple 😃> <Created by bboozzoo> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9629>
[08:03] <zyga> +1
[08:03] <zyga> though it remains to be seen if this can be merged
[08:03] <pstolowski> morning
[08:03] <zyga> hey pstolowski
[08:03] <pstolowski> hey zyga
[08:07] <mborzecki> pstolowski: hey
[08:07] <mborzecki> no mvo today?
[08:07] <zyga> I haven't seen him yet
[08:09] <zyga> hey mvo :)
[08:10] <mborzecki> mvo: hey, i see 2.48 is branched, yay!
[08:10] <mvo> zyga: good morning
[08:10] <mvo> mborzecki: yes! but one bug is being fixed right now, there is a open PR from ian
[08:11] <mborzecki> pedronis: hi, i've updated the list of licenses, but iirc you mentioned that some store tooling may be affected, best if you take a look https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9629
[08:11] <mup> PR #9629: spdx: update to SPDX license list version: 3.10 2020-08-03 <Simple 😃> <Created by bboozzoo> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9629>
[08:13] <mborzecki> wonder whether we should keep some of the osi approved identifies that are deprecated
[08:13] <pedronis> mborzecki: it's timing question, let's chat in the standup about it
[08:13] <mborzecki> eg the non deprecated ids have GPL-3.0-only instead of GPL-3.0
[08:14] <mborzecki> pedronis: sure
[08:14] <pedronis> mvo: mborzecki: we have nested failures here: https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9626
[08:14] <mup> PR #9626: snap-bootstrap,secboot: call BlockPCRProtectionPolicies in all boot modes <Run nested> <UC20> <Created by chrisccoulson> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9626>
[08:15] <pedronis> mvo: I think the PR your merged from sergio broke nested tested, that's fixed I think but was a bit annoying
[08:15] <mvo> uh, sorry!
[08:15] <pedronis> nested.sh itself uses systemd stuff
[08:15] <mvo> pedronis: did https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9626/commits/39c2f79922cae157076784705deca45487144d79 fix it?
[08:15] <pedronis> seems so, but we have other failures now
[08:15] <pedronis> about gadget
[08:15] <pedronis> stuff
[08:16] <pedronis> that's why somebody should look
[08:16] <mborzecki> [change 2 "Setup system for run mode" task] failed: cannot use gadget: gadget does not support encrypted data: volume "pc" has no structure with system-save role
[08:16] <mborzecki> hmm
[08:17] <pedronis> mvo: ah, but the fix is not quite right? I honestly didn't look at it
[08:17] <pedronis> it was late
[08:17] <mborzecki> i can take a look
[08:17] <mborzecki> seems like it's not using the right helper to build the image
[08:18] <mvo> 2020-11-12T04:33:57.7272622Z Nov 12 04:19:39 ubuntu snapd[1240]: taskrunner.go:271: [change 2 "Setup system for run mode" task] failed: cannot use gadget: gadget does not support encrypted data: volume "pc" has no structure with system-save role
[08:20] <pedronis> mborzecki: 9628 has the same failure plus one more
[08:20] <pedronis> might be order though
[08:22] <mborzecki> pedronis: mvo: the test is setting NESTED_BUILD_SNAPD_FROM_CURRENT: false, which will not repack the gadget snap with ubuntu-save
[08:23] <mborzecki> s/with/adding/
[08:23] <mvo> mborzecki: nice find
[08:23] <pedronis> mborzecki: but I suppose it's intentional not to use the current snapd
[08:23] <pedronis> so the fix is not just to flip it, no?
[08:24] <pedronis> it seems we are mixing different stuff together
[08:24] <mborzecki> pedronis: i think we can use 20/edge/next for the gaget snap
[08:25] <mborzecki> or not, there's no 20/beta/next :/
[08:29] <mvo> mborzecki: let me check
[08:30] <mvo> mborzecki: 20/edge/next
[08:32] <mborzecki> mvo: so the test wats to switch between 20/beta and 20/edge, but none of those revisions can be used when encryption because it lacks ubuntu-save
[08:35] <pedronis> why did it start failing only now though?
[08:35]  * pedronis is missing something
[08:36] <pedronis> are we resuing the wrong vm?
[08:36] <pedronis> those tests are not about encryption
[08:37] <pedronis> mborzecki: we had passined nested tests yesterday, they started failing only late
[08:37] <pedronis> after the systemd merge afaik
[08:38] <mvo> pedronis: fwiw https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9606 was merged by sergio not me, I did approve it though
[08:38] <mup> PR #9606: tests: Use systemd-run on tests part2 <Created by sergiocazzolato> <Merged by sergiocazzolato> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9606>
[08:39] <pedronis> mvo: it has one review fwiw
[08:39] <mvo> pedronis: yes, it was a premature merge :(
[08:39] <pedronis> mvo: anyway I'm still quite confused what is going on
[08:39] <mvo> pedronis: same here, just wanted to clarify that I did not hit merge on this one :)
[08:40] <mvo> pedronis: and looking at the diff it seems largely unrelated to nested
[08:41] <mborzecki> mvo: pedronis: the test would also be skippd if the revisions in beta & edge are the same, maybe something changed there?
[08:42] <pedronis> https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9619 this passed with nested
[08:42] <mup> PR #9619: cmd/snap-bootstrap,o/devicestate: use a secret to pair data and save <Run nested> <UC20> <Created by pedronis> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9619>
[08:45] <mvo> mborzecki: 20/beta 2020-09-02 and 20/edge 2020-10-21 seem to be not that :/
[08:45] <mvo> mborzecki: I mean, it looks like they have not recently changed
[08:46] <pedronis> anyway I thought we run only a few tests with the tpm ?
[08:46] <pedronis> and those are not part of it? or are they?
[08:47] <pedronis> mborzecki: one question is what changed between 9169 and those prs
[08:47] <pedronis> heh, 9619
[08:55] <mborzecki> hm we don't run tests after merging to master, do we?
[08:57] <pedronis> not anymore I think
[09:25] <mborzecki> pedronis: the test also runs with TPM expliciltly enabled, i suppose it is to catch the resealing scenarios too
[09:30] <mborzecki> mvo: i think we should always run nested tests on 2.48 branch, they are skipped right now
[09:32] <mvo> mborzecki: +1
[09:38] <mvo> mborzecki: let me know if I can help in any way btw, i.e. if it would help to have a 20/beta/next branch I could push that
[09:40] <mborzecki> mvo: i'm running this spread test on release/2.48 now, but yeah we could poke xnox to publish a gadget with ubuntu-save to 20/beta/next maybe and then go a fix the test
[09:41] <mvo> mborzecki: I can do that to if it unblocks us
[09:43] <mvo> mborzecki: just say the word :)
[09:45] <mborzecki> hmm `Nov 12 09:44:48 ubuntu snapd[1258]: taskrunner.go:271: [change 2 "Setup system for run mode" task] failed: cannot use gadget: gadget does not support encrypted data: volume "pc" has no structure with system-save role` on release/2.48 branch
[09:48] <mvo> mborzecki: so it's broken everywhere and we don't know what/when :/ let's fix it :)
[09:48] <mborzecki> mvo: mhm, poking xnox on mm
[09:49] <mvo> mborzecki: if he does not reply I can also do a upload to pc into 20/beta/next
[09:51] <mborzecki> mvo: mhm, in the meantime i'll look into having nested tests run on all pushes to release/** branches
[09:51] <mvo> mborzecki: \o/
[10:05] <mvo> mborzecki: I have a pc gadget based on beta with ubuntu-save that we could use, I'm building it right now but lxd is a bit slow it seems
[10:07] <mborzecki> mvo: that would work, is it just repacking the snap from 20/beta?
[10:08] <mvo> mborzecki: correct, i took 20/beta and applied the diff from edge -> edge/next (which is just adding ubuntu-save)
[10:08] <mborzecki> mvo: ok, that should be fine then
[10:16] <mvo> mborzecki: released into 20/beta/next
[10:16] <mborzecki> mvo: thanks, let me fix the test now
[10:17] <mvo> xnox: I uploaded a new pc gadget into 20/beta/next that contains ubuntu-save, it's otherwise just a repack of 20/beta. this will unbreak our tests and just fyi, it's a branch so noone outside of our tests is affected
[10:17] <mvo> xnox: hope you don't mind :)
[10:33] <mborzecki> mvo: ok, trying with updated test now, wish we didn't have so much magic hardcoded in NESTED_* env variables
[10:35] <mvo> mborzecki: :( yes
[10:51] <xnox> mvo:  that's fine! thanks.
[11:02] <mborzecki> mvo: omg, heh
[11:02] <mvo> mborzecki: hm?
[11:02] <mborzecki> mvo: how can i get a revision of a snap from a branch? it's not shown in snap info
[11:05] <mborzecki> mvo: and not downloading the snap :)
[11:06] <mvo> mborzecki: the revision is 117
[11:06] <mborzecki> mvo:  i know, the problem is that the tests uses snap info to find the revision of a snap :/ which does not work ofc
[11:07] <mvo> mborzecki: oh, I see, yes, that is unfortunate :/
[11:08] <mvo> mborzecki: as a workaround you could download the pc snaps, they are small. or we use the store api directly, I don't think we have something currently for this :/
[11:08] <mvo> mborzecki: shall I have a look at store api? would that help you?
[11:09] <mborzecki> mvo: hmm i'll come up with something
[11:17] <pedronis> mborzecki: this works curl -s -H "Snap-Device-Architecture: amd64" -H "Snap-Device-Series: 16" -X POST -H "Content-Type: application/json" --data '{"context": [], "actions": [{"action": "install", "name": "pc", "channel": "20/beta/next", "instance-key": "1"}]}' https://api.snapcraft.io/v2/snaps/refresh|jq
[11:19] <pedronis> mvo: mborzecki: I pushed my tweaks to https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9628#pullrequestreview-528983238, needs more reviews (but probably after Chris PR), also the state machine diagram is wrong again :/
[11:19] <mup> PR #9628: secboot,cmd/snap-bootstrap: fix degraded mode cases with better device handling <Needs Samuele review> <Run nested> <UC20> <Created by anonymouse64> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9628>
[11:22] <pedronis> mvo: btw should we squash-merge things for 2.48 ?  you added and removed the lable on 9628, same question for #9626
[11:22] <mup> PR #9626: snap-bootstrap,secboot: call BlockPCRProtectionPolicies in all boot modes <Run nested> <UC20> <Created by chrisccoulson> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9626>
[11:25] <guiverc> `snap search libreoffice` (executing for a uf support query) gets error (403)..   just an FYI  https://api.snapcraft.io/v2/snaps/find?architecture=amd64&confinement=strict%2Cclassic&fields=base%2Cconfinement%2Ccontact%2Cdescription%2Cdownload%2Clicense%2Cprices%2Cprivate%2Cpublisher%2Crevision%2Csummary%2Ctitle%2Ctype%2Cversion%2Cwebsite%2Cstore-url%2Cmedia%2Ccommon-ids%2Cchannel&q=libreoffice
[11:26] <guiverc> actually the error occurs on lots of queries (error on firefox..)
[11:32] <mvo> guiverc: looks like the store has some trouble right now :/
[11:33] <guiverc> yep, thanks mvo, just saw popey tweet on #ubuntu-desktop
[11:37] <mup> PR snapd#9630 opened: tests: fix nested tests <Run nested> <Simple 😃> <Created by sergiocazzolato> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9630>
[11:37] <mup> PR snapd#9631 opened: cmd/snap: add snap debug connections/connection commands <Created by stolowski> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9631>
[11:39] <mvo> pedronis, mborzecki I just looked at 9626 again - given that a) it got two reviews already b) we know why the nested test fails - I would like to merge it ? release/2.48 has the same test issue as this PR
[11:53] <zyga> pstolowski: reviewed
[11:57] <pstolowski> zyga: thanks!
[12:07] <pstolowski> cachio_: hey, can you take another look at #9617?
[12:07] <mup> PR #9617: tests: compare options of mount units created by snapd and snapd-generator <Created by stolowski> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9617>
[12:12] <cachio> pstolowski, left a comment there
[12:12] <cachio> it is quick to fix
[12:12] <pstolowski> cachio: thx, updated
[12:13] <mborzecki> mvo: something is not quite right, is it possible to tell which github rev is the snapd in beta? snap info show it's latest/beta: 2.47.1+git1221.ge4f8507 2020-11-11 (10106)
[12:14] <cachio> pstolowski, +1
[12:14] <pstolowski> ty
[12:14] <cachio> yaw
[12:15] <mborzecki> mvo: i suspect it's missing the changes we added for luks/ext4 sizes
[12:20] <mborzecki> hmmm
[12:20] <mborzecki> w8, but we moved the keys to a new location right?
[12:21] <mborzecki> and the kernel was not rebuilt with new initramfs, so there's only theold snap-bootstrap which expects keys at the old location, so it's not possible to get a bootable system with stuff from the store atm
[12:21] <mborzecki> mvo: ^^
[12:22] <mborzecki> so even if i kinda made a part of the test work (it installs atm), the system does not go past initramfs
[12:22] <mvo> mborzecki: about the revision, you can "git show e4f8507 " or checkout etc
[12:23] <mvo> mborzecki: so this is broken until we rebuild the kernel?
[12:23] <mvo> mborzecki: with 2.48?
[12:23] <mborzecki> mvo: heh, i was searching in git log, but didn't find the rev, maybe had a typo there /o\
[12:23] <mvo> mborzecki: in this case we need to put it to manual and move on and enable it again
[12:23] <mborzecki> mvo: yeah, i think so
[12:23] <mvo> mborzecki: the leading "g" needs to be removed
[12:23] <mvo> mborzecki: it's a bit confusing
[12:24] <mborzecki> mvo: removed the 'g', nvm it's pebkac most likely
[12:25] <mvo> could be a out-of-date local tree or something. anyway, given that we cannot fix this easily right now I will merge the branch from chris
[12:27] <mvo> pedronis: do you want to review 9626 before it lands? ian had some questions. otherwise I land once tests have completed
[12:28] <mborzecki> i suppose pc-kernel 20/beta is not built with snapd beta right?
[12:30] <pedronis> mvo: I worked on it
[12:31] <pedronis> mvo: anyway I addressed Ian comments
[12:31] <pedronis> in fact
[12:31] <pedronis> I mean about 9626
[12:31] <mborzecki> mvo: hmmm we may as well disable tpm/secure boot, so no encryption, but the test should work
[12:31] <mborzecki> guess it's beter than disabling it completely
[12:32] <pedronis> mborzecki: yes
[12:43] <mup> PR snapd#9632 opened: tests/nested/manual/refresh-revert-fundamentals: temporarily disable secure boot <Run nested> <Simple 😃> <Created by bboozzoo> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9632>
[12:53] <mup> PR snapd#9633 opened: github: run nested suite when commit is pushed to release branch <Run nested> <Simple 😃> <Created by bboozzoo> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9633>
[13:04] <pstolowski> ijohnson: hey, can you take another lokk at #9617? i've added proxy support
[13:04] <mup> PR #9617: tests: compare options of mount units created by snapd and snapd-generator <Created by stolowski> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9617>
[13:12] <mborzecki> hmm: apparmor="DENIED" operation="exec" profile="snap.test-snapd-after-before-service.before-middle" name="/bin/systemd-notify" pid=342298 comm="start" requested_mask="x" denied_mask="x" fsuid=0 ouid=0
[13:12] <mborzecki> ehh, silly me
[13:29] <ijohnson> pstolowski: yeah sure
[13:33] <mborzecki> is the "service-control" task being used anywere? pstolowski, ijohnson any chance you remember?
[13:35] <pstolowski> mvo: yes, in #8960
[13:35] <mup> PR #8960: o/snapstate,servicestate: use service-control task for service actions (9/9) <Needs Samuele review> <Services ⚙> <⛔ Blocked> <Created by stolowski> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/8960>
[13:35] <pstolowski> ups, mborzecki ^
[13:37] <pstolowski> mborzecki: why?
[13:40] <mborzecki> pstolowski: i'm looking at https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/use-of-before-and-after-keywords-to-define-the-start-order-of-snap-daemons/21082/5 i thought that snap start was fixed to use the right order, but it's not working
[13:42] <mborzecki> pstolowski: and there's actually 2 places doing something similar, but not quite? one is servicestate.Control which gnerates some commands, and the other is servicemgr.doServiceControl
[13:43] <pstolowski> mborzecki: are you looking at master?
[13:43] <pstolowski> or my branch?
[13:43] <mborzecki> pstolowski: master
[13:44] <pstolowski> mborzecki: ok. my branch centralizes things around services. would be good to have a spread test with reproducer and then run it against 8960
[13:45] <pstolowski> mborzecki: i can look at this after standup
[13:45] <pstolowski> seems like there is an example already
[13:45] <pstolowski> on the forum
[13:48] <mborzecki> pedronis: there, but it shows there's a bug somewhere
[13:49] <mborzecki> this used to work iirc ;)
[13:49] <pedronis> mborzecki: ?
[13:59] <mborzecki> heh it's not fixed, found an unpushed commit from 2018 which does that
[14:03] <mup> PR snapd#9634 opened: boot,dirs,c/snap-bootstrap: avoid InstallHost* at the cost of some messiness <UC20> <Created by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9634>
[14:28] <pstolowski> mborzecki: is that old fix for services large? does it have a spraed test already? i wonder if it makes sense to land it or if i should take over it and re-work on top of 8960
[14:29] <mborzecki> pstolowski: it's here https://github.com/bboozzoo/snapd/commit/3b5103daf07141d0fefa02f2d774a3f4869aa684 half done and imo it thousl be fixed in servicestate.Control() instead of this
[14:32] <pstolowski> mborzecki: okay. probably makes sense to tackle it after 8960 as otherwise it would again delay landing of 8960 and possibly lead to annoying and confusing conflicts
[14:32] <pstolowski> mborzecki: and i can start with a spread test
[14:36] <mborzecki> pstolowski: hmm looking at 8960 again, this issue should be fixed there
[14:37] <pstolowski> mborzecki: that would be great. i'm going to create a spread test anyway to verify
[14:51]  * cachio lunch
[14:53] <mup> PR snapd#9630 closed: tests: fix nested tests <Run nested> <Simple 😃> <Created by sergiocazzolato> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9630>
[14:59] <mup> PR snapd#9626 closed: snap-bootstrap,secboot: call BlockPCRProtectionPolicies in all boot modes <Run nested> <UC20> <Created by chrisccoulson> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9626>
[15:09] <pedronis> ijohnson: thanks for answering to https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/configure-grub-with-ubuntu-core-20/20835
[15:12] <ijohnson> pedronis: yah no problem, there have been a few other folks asking questions on uc20 on the forum I have tried to keep up with and answer
[15:17] <pedronis> #9628 needs reviews
[15:17] <mup> PR #9628: secboot,cmd/snap-bootstrap: fix degraded mode cases with better device handling <Needs Samuele review> <Run nested> <UC20> <Created by anonymouse64> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9628>
[15:17] <ijohnson> hmm pedronis not sure I agree with 898ade549228a6ae93f117f91c57fe5a1325cca3 there
[15:17] <ijohnson> let me think about it a bit more, I'm concerned that by saving/observing m.isEncryptedDev we are giving too much meaning to that, when it could be false just by default
[15:18] <ijohnson> i.e. we don't have a nice way to tell "we definitely saw an unencrypted disk before" and "we haven't yet seen any disk (encrypted or not) yet"
[15:18] <ijohnson> but let me look a bit more maybe it's fine
[15:19] <pedronis> ijohnson: I'm also checking that data is marked found
[15:21] <pedronis> it's not that different from how the setUnlockStateWithFallbackKey uses that flag
[15:21] <pedronis> in theory we could even push that check down (not sure it woudl be clearer code)
[15:21] <ijohnson> yes I see that, I'm trying to think about if that's good enough yet
[15:21] <ijohnson> sadly it's a bit difficult to reason about finding a counter-example where this logic is wrong
[15:22] <pedronis> ijohnson: you need to look at all the places we set found for data, all those places make also a definitive decision about whether the device is encrypted
[15:23] <pedronis> if we don't find data of course we don't have a decision
[15:25] <mborzecki> mvo: looks like the unit test job failed in the spread run you mentioned https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/runs/1224993441 ?
[15:25] <mvo> mborzecki: oh, maybe this was just coincidence, hold on
[15:26] <mvo> mborzecki: this one is a better example https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/runs/1386207780
[15:27] <mborzecki> hmm `2020-11-11 16:40:13 Cannot allocate google:debian-9-64: google: read JWT from JSON credentials: 'type' field is "authorized_user" (expected "service_account")`
[15:28] <mborzecki> mvo: aren't we using the same spread binary?
[15:30] <ijohnson> pedronis: ok yeah I think you're right I can't find a counter-example of where the logic is wrong
[15:31] <ijohnson> checking FindState is the right thing to do
[15:31] <pedronis> ijohnson: tbh though, I don't want to poke at this more right now, but probably IsEncryptedDev should become a tristate Unknown,Encrypted,Unencrypted  some checks/things would be clearer
[15:32] <ijohnson> pedronis: yes that would be a nice thing to have, but agreed for now is fine to leave as-is
[15:46] <mup> PR snapcraft#3372 opened: tests: make each static test available as a make target <Created by cjp256> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/3372>
[15:47] <ijohnson> pedronis: well regardless I looked over all your changes to 9628 and they all lgtm, so if/when that pr is green I think we should land it
[15:47] <ijohnson> as you say we might need the nested test which disables the tpm/secureboot
[16:11] <zyga> mvo: FYI: groovy's go has a bug in its internal IO loops
[16:12] <zyga> I just spent a better part of the day wondering WTF is going on
[16:12] <zyga> https://go-review.googlesource.com/c/go/+/232862/ is the fixed bug with details
[16:12] <zyga> if you see funny errors in groovy, this _may_ be related
[16:12] <zyga> also if you build with 1.14
[16:14] <mvo> zyga: oh, fun! thanks for letting me know
[16:17] <zyga> mvo: I poked mwhudson but not sure if there's any priority to backport this
[16:17] <zyga> 1.13 and 1.15 are okay
[16:31] <mup> PR snapcraft#3373 opened: ci: migrate static checks from travis to github actions <Created by cjp256> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/3373>
[16:39] <Nemesis> Hello everyone, i can see there is still issue with snap packages for latested version of manjaro. Does someone know when the issue will be fixed?
[16:39] <Nemesis> or some workaround known?
[16:42] <zyga> Nemesis: what's the problem?
[16:44] <Nemesis> zyga:  since about 7-10 days all packages instelled on Manjaro (lateset version) does not work (when i start the pakache just showing loading and in 1-2 seconds disapears and nothing else happens).
[16:45] <Nemesis> i had another issue with 1-2 programs which was able to open (they had squears insted of alphabets).. i read on internet that fonts might be a problem, i changed the font - dint help
[16:46] <ijohnson> does manjaro use x11 or wayland ?
[16:48] <zyga> Nemesis: can you open any of those apps from command line please
[16:48] <pedronis> mvo: ijohnson: I'm going to force merge https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9632 , it affects only nested tests and those passed (in other tests we have store issues)
[16:48] <mup> PR #9632: tests/nested/manual/refresh-revert-fundamentals: temporarily disable secure boot <Run nested> <Simple 😃> <UC20> <Created by bboozzoo> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9632>
[16:48] <ijohnson> pedronis: ack sounnds good to me
[16:48] <Nemesis> [martin@nemesis ~]$ loginctl show-session 2 -p Type
[16:48] <Nemesis> Type=x11
[16:52] <Nemesis> I have most of the packages installed using flatpak/pacman or not installed at all. Give me 1 seconds to go install 2-3 new snap packages
[16:54] <mup> PR snapd#9632 closed: tests/nested/manual/refresh-revert-fundamentals: temporarily disable secure boot <Run nested> <Simple 😃> <UC20> <Created by bboozzoo> <Merged by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9632>
[16:59] <ijohnson> cachio: I want to add a uc20 specific nested helper, should I add a function to nested.sh and expose it via the new nested-state binary?
[17:00] <cachio> ijohnson, depends on the funtion
[17:00] <cachio> if it is to manage the service/vm yes
[17:00] <cachio> otherwise it should so directo to nested.sh
[17:01] <zyga> ijohnson: if you can consume it exclusively from nested-state, it'd probably be okay to add to nested-state without adding to nested.sh
[17:01] <ijohnson> the function is this
[17:01] <ijohnson> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/H0orv42g/
[17:01] <Nemesis> zyga:  http://ix.io/2DVd -  there is one
[17:02] <ijohnson> it's fairly simple but I need to do it many times in one specific uc20 nested test
[17:02] <ijohnson> it's kinda managing the VM insofar as it is rebooting the VM and changing the state of it, etc.
[17:02] <cachio> ijohnson, I'd add that to nested.sh
[17:03] <cachio> I'll include that in the following pr to move that to the nested-state tool
[17:03] <Nemesis> zyga:  there is another: http://ix.io/2DVe
[17:03] <ijohnson> cachio: ok, I will just add it to nested.sh in my PR and use it directly
[17:04] <Nemesis> there was much more, just i already have them installed using another packages
[17:04] <cachio> ijohnson, nice
[17:04] <cachio> I'll take a look once it is ready
[17:09] <ijohnson> thanks cachio
[17:09] <ijohnson> I hope to have it open today
[17:34] <mup> PR snapd#9634 closed: boot,dirs,c/snap-bootstrap: avoid InstallHost* at the cost of some messiness <UC20> <Created by pedronis> <Merged by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9634>
[17:35] <mvo> pedronis: thanks for mergning! I will get dinner and then review 9628 again
[17:35] <mvo> (unless someone else beats me to it)
[17:35] <mvo> and then we should be done, yes?
[17:37] <pedronis> mvo: yes, I'm merging master into it, and adding a couple not urgent TODOs
[17:41] <mup> PR snapcraft#3374 opened: [wip] ci: migrate spread tests github actions <Created by cjp256> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/3374>
[17:48] <ijohnson> gah
[17:49] <ijohnson> pedronis: mvo: we need one more fix I just found writing a spread test
[17:49] <ijohnson> copySafeDefaultData is wrong, it puts the complete file on /run/mnt/host/.../console-conf when it should be putting it on /run/mnt/data/.../console-conf/
[17:50] <ijohnson> shall I push the fix to 9628 ? or open a new PR?
[17:51] <pedronis> ijohnson: push it to 9628
[17:51] <ijohnson> k, one moment
[17:51] <pedronis> ijohnson: I just pushed there though, so you need to pull
[17:51] <ijohnson> right
[17:51] <pedronis> I merged master and tweaked a couple of things
[17:53] <pedronis> ijohnson: ah, I see, it needs to match the dest part of the if stanze
[17:53] <pedronis> stanza
[17:53] <ijohnson> yes
[17:53] <pedronis> boot.InitramfsDataDir
[17:53] <ijohnson> yep precisely
[17:53] <pedronis> so the test is also wrong?
[17:53] <ijohnson> yeah
[17:53] <pedronis> :/
[17:53] <ijohnson> this is why spread tests are good though
[17:54] <pedronis> yes
[17:54] <pedronis> but also why constant for dirs are a mixed bag
[17:54] <pedronis> I'm starting to believe that unit test should try to actively spell directories more explictly/differnelty from code
[17:55] <pedronis> anyway
[17:55] <ijohnson> I was wondering if instead of using what you proposed in the SU which would be more work, if we instead had functions from boot that took as an argument the time in which they are being called (or otherwise figured out what time/mode they are being called from directly)
[17:55] <ijohnson> then you would have for example DataDir(initramfs) or SeedFDEDir(initramfs) and BootFDEDir(install)
[17:56] <pedronis> I don't think time is the only relevant variable here
[17:56] <pedronis> there's also host vs not
[17:56] <pedronis> for recover
[17:56] <pedronis> as in your case here
[17:57] <ijohnson> right but in this case it would be HostDataDir(intitramfs) vs DataDir(initramfs)
[17:57] <ijohnson> I think the issue here is just that it is confusing that we have both a tpmfs "data" mount and the "host" data mount
[17:57] <ijohnson> well one of many issues
[17:59] <pedronis> ijohnson: it's still an unclear/growing family of functions
[18:00] <pedronis> it might be better but is work, if we are going to do work maybe we should do the full work
[18:00] <ijohnson> pedronis: ok, so side-stepping all that for a second to talk about one other thing I just found with your marker file impl
[18:00] <ijohnson> I just noticed that if we fail to mount save at all, we treat data as not trusted, is that intentional
[18:01] <pedronis> yes
[18:01] <ijohnson> this means for example that if I just totally wipe ubuntu-save from the face of the earth and leave data normal, the marker file for ubuntu-save doesn't exist, and so data is treated as not trusted since we can't compare the marker files
[18:01] <ijohnson> and as such we don't copy any data from ubuntu-data for i.e. logging in
[18:01] <mup> PR snapcraft#3375 opened: [wip] ci: migrate spread tests github actions <Created by cjp256> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/3375>
[18:02] <pedronis> we could try to be more specific, but in general unless we are sure that there is no way to get to save after the fact
[18:02] <pedronis> we can't trust data
[18:02] <ijohnson> I guess you will still have your recover mode snaps that run which could try and do something
[18:03] <ijohnson> I guess this is fine then, I guess I had it in my head that we only check the marker files if we have both partitions
[18:03] <ijohnson> ok, nvm me then this is intentional, but unfortunate
[18:04] <pedronis> we can do better, but it needs careful thinking
[18:04] <pedronis> the worst scenario is save open but not mounted for some reason
[18:05] <ijohnson> yeah I guess we could copy data if we know for sure that save is not unlocked or maybe if we know that data was unlocked not with the recovery key
[18:06] <ijohnson> but I suppose those are improvements we could make later
[18:06] <pedronis> ijohnson: if we would need to be sure that save is open and that we managed to lock the keys
[18:06] <pedronis> sorry *save is not open*
[18:06] <pedronis> right now the code isn't quite there
[18:06] <pedronis> it would need more states
[18:07] <pedronis> ijohnson: you can leave a todo somewhere if you want
[18:07] <ijohnson> sure
[18:10]  * pedronis goes to have dinner
[18:11] <ijohnson> pedronis: pushed
[19:09]  * ijohnson goes to grocery store for ~ 2 hours
[20:15] <mup> PR snapd#9628 closed: secboot,cmd/snap-bootstrap: fix degraded mode cases with better device handling <Needs Samuele review> <Run nested> <UC20> <Created by anonymouse64> <Merged by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9628>
[20:33] <mvo> merging master back into 2.48 caused a merge conflict, how did that happen :(
[20:33] <mvo> anyway, had to open 9635 because of this, no ff possible
[20:35] <mup> PR snapd#9635 opened: many: merge current master into 2.48 <Run nested> <Created by mvo5> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/9635>
[20:39]  * mvo lets the test run for a bit
[20:52] <mup> PR snapcraft#3376 opened: tests: add missing mock for rust unit tests <Created by cjp256> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/3376>
[23:03] <mup> PR snapcraft#3377 opened: launchpad tests: mock git source handler <Created by cjp256> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/3377>


[00:02] <jjesse> i think everyone is either out enjoying a beatufiful saturday evening or in bed :)
[00:02] <jjesse> maybe they are recovering from UDS
[00:06] <jjesse> if i pause my vm and the resume it, does uptime count the time the vm was paused or jnot?
[00:07] <Jucato> uptime in a vm? :D
[00:07]  * Jucato is neither in bed, nor recovering from UDS, nor is it a saturday :)
[00:08] <jjesse> sure uptime :)
[00:08] <jjesse> smart a$$ happy sunday
[00:08] <Jucato> hahah :P
[00:08] <jjesse> i'm working on the kget documentation and it hasn't been updated since version .8 of kget
[00:09] <jjesse> still tons of references to auto-disconnceting your modem ;)
[00:22] <mhb> evening fellas
[00:22] <mhb> anyone from UDS made it home safely already?
[00:22] <mhb> well I think so
[00:22] <mhb> just want to hear it from you
[00:37] <jjesse> evening mhb
[00:43] <mhb> jjesse: hi
[03:06]  * vorian waves
[03:09]  * jdong waves at vore
[03:09] <jdong> vorian rather
[03:09] <vorian> ah!
[03:09] <vorian> the dong!
[03:09] <jdong> stupid tab complete
[03:09] <vorian> hehe
[03:09] <vorian> poor vore
[03:09] <jdong> vorian: the dong had lots of fun in his 300C today :)
[03:09] <vorian> wooo hoo!
[03:09] <vorian> congrats!
[03:10] <jdong> vorian: gonna cruisade into Ohio once I secure my laser jammer funding :)
[03:10] <vorian> jdong: I'll be in D-town in August
[03:10] <vorian> excellent
[03:10] <jdong> cool
[03:11] <Jucato> isn't "vorian" the adjective form of "vore"?
[03:11] <vorian> I'll be confinded to the GM center, but still close enough to town to get killed and burned
[03:11] <vorian> Jucato: :)
[03:11] <vorian> noun
[03:12] <Jucato> oh...
[03:12] <Jucato> I suck :P
[03:12] <vorian> no!
[03:13] <vorian> building kde from svn is kicking my arse
[06:00] <Serega> morning
[12:06]  * uga watches Riddell's video and wonders how wps (words per second) he manages doing
[12:06] <uga> s/how/how many
[14:27] <Riddell> uga: too many for you?
[14:44] <Arby> Riddell: around?
[14:49] <Riddell> hi Arby
[14:50] <Arby> Riddell: I've been reading the UDS specs and thinking about getting into PyKDE
[14:50] <Arby> is there any reason I shouldn't tackle porting jockey
[14:51] <Arby> it seems ~relatively~ straight forward and not too high risk
[14:54] <Riddell> Arby: it's been done
[14:54] <Arby> ah OK
[14:54] <Arby> that was quick
[14:54] <Riddell> Arby: although worth checking over for bugs
[14:54] <Riddell> Arby: oh, it's been done to pyqt4
[14:55] <Riddell> our spec would have said port to pykde4
[14:55] <Riddell> which would be good
[14:55] <Arby> that makes more sense
[14:55] <Arby> I'm reading the source now
[14:55] <Riddell> not hard at all
[14:55] <Arby> it isn't pyKDE4
[14:55] <Riddell> no, just qt
[14:55] <Arby> how does PyKDE relate to PyQt, is it an extension?
[14:55] <Arby> i.e kde inherits from qt
[14:59] <Arby> also, am I right in thinking that the XML ui files will also need porting to the corresponding KDE widgets? or are the existing files OK?
[15:16] <nixternal> mornin'
[15:28] <nixternal> woo, Riddell between all of the interviews on ubuntudevelopers (youtube), you are currently in 2nd, to jono, for most views :) you whooped mark! \o/
[15:32] <Riddell> Arby: the existing ones will be mostly fine
[15:32] <Riddell> Arby: the main change that's needed is QApplication -> KApplication and loading icons
[15:32] <Arby> Riddell: thanks, just looking at icons now
[15:33] <Arby> Riddell: is there a reference somewhere on how to do Icons the kde way
[15:33] <Arby> I'm currently failing with a type error
[15:34] <Riddell> Arby: maybe look at printer-applet in KDE trunk kdeutils, or guidance-power-manager in kdereview
[15:34] <Arby> OK
[15:36] <seezer> will an hardy->intrepid upgrade (still?) work?
[15:37] <Riddell> seezer: intrepid is in rapid flux, maybe you'll be lucky, maybe not
[15:37] <seezer> alright
[16:48] <uga> Riddell: hehe yes, it was hard to follow sometimes ;)
[18:30] <seele> yay.. all my pictures from prague are up: http://obso1337.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=3301
[18:31] <uga> seele http://obso1337.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=3303 <-- you need a tripod ;)
[18:31] <seele> uga: that was from my hotel window
[18:31] <seele> uga: and i take pictures for memories not art.  i dont have a $1000 camera rig like some people :)
[18:32]  * seele is hearing it from her photography friends too
[18:32] <uga> heh http://obso1337.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=3367
[18:32] <seele> "You used the wrong exposure!"
[18:32] <uga> seele: when your art is misfocused, sometimes memories turn blurry ;)
[18:32] <seele> uga: that was called "Hot Love"
[18:32] <uga> rofl
[18:32] <seele> i'm not kidding either, hehe
[18:34] <uga> seele: 1000 is low end gear ;)
[18:35] <uga> my last lens alone was 1000eur...
[18:35] <uga> and it's not high-end
[18:35] <uga> seele: http://www.ugarro.com
[18:35] <uga> most of those were taken with my first (low-end) gear
[18:36] <seele> wow.. yeah see.. that's definitely not me, hehe
[18:36] <seele> this is the first time in a long time i actually took my camera out for more than a few pictures
[18:36] <seele> while i know others who don't leave home without their camera
[18:37] <uga> heh, I try not to, unless I go pubbing
[18:39] <uga> seele: the problem now is I need a couple new monitors to fit these: http://www.ugarro.com/gallery/v/Norway/Pano+-+img_6762+-+11400x2930+-+SCON+-+Blended+Layer.jpg.html
[18:39] <uga> http://www.ugarro.com/gallery/v/Norway/Pano+-+img_6841+-+10538x2344+-+SCON+-+Blended+Layer.jpg.html
[18:40] <uga> unless kubuntu i... what's next, impetuous indian? features a panoramic 3d view desktop
[18:41] <seele> wow
[18:41] <seele> i want three monitors just so i can have that background
[18:42] <uga> =)
[18:51] <seele> wow.. there are some good pictures of the friday event
[18:51] <seele> of course.. those are also the people with $1000 lenses ;P
[18:55]  * ryanakca wishes he could dream of affording 1554CAD dollar lenses... however... that's a laptop... or a third of a year of Uni... or food for a few months...
[18:57] <crimsun> you don't need food, a laptop, or a university education.
[18:57] <crimsun> guess that's settled.
[18:57] <ryanakca> lol :)
[18:59] <uga> seele: where?
[19:14] <uga> ryanakca: get one of these http://www.engadget.com/2008/05/20/olpc-unveils-first-prototype-of-xo-2-0/
[19:14] <uga> they claim they'll put them down to $75
[19:16] <ryanakca> uga: heh, interesting :)
[19:18] <ryanakca> uga: 2010... just as I graduate and head off to Uni... splendid :)
[19:19] <uga> lol
[19:20] <seele> uga: planet ubuntu
[19:21] <uga> seele: I prefer your shots to those ;)
[19:23] <nosrednaekim> ryanakca: wow... you're that young?
[19:24] <ryanakca> nosrednaekim: umm... well... not /that/ young... but younger than most, yes.
[19:24] <nosrednaekim> ^_^ i'm 18... im not insulting you :P
[19:25] <ryanakca> lol, just a few years older than I am :)
[19:44]  * mhb suddenly feels ancient :o)
[20:04] <uga> mhb: yeah, those kids these days...
[20:05] <mhb> uga: right :o)
[20:06] <mhb> uga: seen my photo at the UDS?
[20:11] <uga> mhb: not sure which of them that is
[20:27] <uga> mhb: I couldn't see any shots by/of you there
[20:58] <Riddell> Czessi: how did informationdays go?
[22:58]  * seele yawns
[22:59] <seele> is it 17:58 or 23:58?  my body can't tell the difference yet :P
[22:59] <DaskreecH> 16:58 here
[22:59] <DaskreecH> 59
[23:00] <DaskreecH> 17:00 :-)
[23:13] <seele> Riddell: have you uploaded the three pictures you took?
[23:15] <Riddell> seele: which three?
[23:15] <DaskreecH> "those" three
[23:20] <Riddell> seele: this one? http://www.flickr.com/photos/jriddell/2522718840/
[23:21] <seele> Riddell: no.  great one of my mouth open though :P
[23:21] <seele> Riddell: didn't see you posted them on flickr yet.
[23:21] <Riddell> still uploading
[23:22] <Riddell> seele: that should be it
[23:44] <DaskreecH> seele: Yellow hair :-)
[23:47] <DaskreecH> seele: Hmm strange
[23:47] <DaskreecH> one of your pictures comes out black
[23:47] <Riddell> black?  must be seele :)
[23:47] <DaskreecH> Riddell: Well kinda it comes out black in the slideshow
[23:47] <DaskreecH> Ha ha :-)


[04:47] <nickrud> hahahaha
 If you have Ubuntu 8.04 what actual version of Ubuntu are you using?
[04:58] <Hobbsee> ubuntu version 42.
[04:58] <bazhang> haha
[04:59] <nickrud> another crazy brit clone
[05:03] <bazhang> nice.
[05:04] <nickrud> good thing he left, I was about to take up some slack
[05:04] <bazhang> his ban was clearly lifted too early
[05:05] <nickrud> was lifted, eh? I don't think that's a nick I'll forget
[05:05] <bazhang> * Neo_The_User<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has joined #ubuntu so it would be /cs b Neo_The_User ?
[05:07] <bazhang> seeing as he is banned in ot, xubuntu, and one other channel (need to double check at btlogin)
[05:08] <nickrud> bazhang yeah, or forward him hre
[05:08] <nickrud> if you're up for it
[05:08] <bazhang> that user name is still banned though nickrud ; at least according to btlogin
[05:09] <bazhang><EMAIL_ADDRESS>seems to what I should ban, right?
[05:09] <nickrud> the details of how bans work, how people get around them is on my to do list, but not very high up
[05:10] <bazhang> haha
[05:10] <bazhang> hate to mess it up and ban all comcast users though :)
[05:11] <nickrud> I depend on that script from seveas myself. And yes, I remember some situation where a few extras got caught in your net ;)
[05:11] <bazhang> most of canada iirc :)
[05:12] <nickrud> hahahha. I'm gonna be incommunicado for a while, inspector lewis is on.  Thought it was me for a while, then realized it's not working. What's with the *
[06:54] <nickrud> note the ff , not ff3
[07:30] <Flannel> Anyone awake?  floods in #ubuntu
[07:31] <Flannel> and no, floodbot won't take care of it
[07:31] <Myrtti> !staff
[07:31] <Flannel> Thanks
[07:32] <Hobbsee> [16:32] [Whois] lnX is a user on channels: #lugtucuman #open-eslack #slackware-es #tuquito-es
[07:32] <Hobbsee> [16:32] [Whois] lnX is online via irc.freenode.net (http://freenode.net/).
[07:32] <Hobbsee> [16:32] [Whois] lnX has been idle for 5 hours, 55 minutes, and 16 seconds.
[07:33] <Hobbsee> okay then?
[07:34] <Myrtti> is he the one doing this?
[07:34] <nalioth> klined
[07:34] <Hobbsee> Myrtti: same IP
[07:34] <Hobbsee> nalioth: thanks
[07:37] <Hobbsee> mneptok: ping?
[07:48] <Hobbsee> nalioth: i've got a problem user here.
[07:48] <Hobbsee> nalioth: <IP_ADDRESS>
[07:48] <Hobbsee> nalioth: guy spamming me in pm
[07:48] <Hobbsee> i think i banned him earlier
[07:49] <nalioth> yes, you did.
[07:49] <nalioth> he's not in any channel, just /quote silence him
[07:49] <Myrtti> he is
[07:49] <Myrtti> just joined #ubuntu
[07:49] <Hobbsee> http://rafb.net/p/QraU2978.html and such
[07:50] <Hobbsee> ban went in slightly late
[07:50] <Hobbsee> gotta love the quality of people on this network.
[07:51] <Myrtti> Hobbsee: welcome to IRCnet
[07:51] <Myrtti> Hobbsee: you'll love freenode immediately
[07:52] <Hobbsee> yeah...
[08:22]  * Myrtti sighs
[08:23]  * jussi01 wakes up
[08:29] <Myrtti> for crying out loud
[08:30]  * jussi01 raises an eyebrow...
[08:33] <Myrtti> someone wants me to to sign their openpgp key just because they've signed mine
[08:33] <nalioth> Myrtti: didn' you both sign at the same time?
[08:33] <Myrtti> NO?
[08:34] <Myrtti> >__<
[08:34] <nalioth> ya snooze ya lose  :(
[08:34] <Myrtti> I need my porridge
[08:37]  * jussi01 overslept today
[08:38] <Myrtti> hmmles
[08:38] <Myrtti> music!
[09:10]  * Myrtti huggles everyone
[10:02] <Gary> I needs huggles :'(
[10:03]  * Myrtti considers making a hug ticket system for LRL
[10:10] <elky> Myrtti, we may need to consider moving wols on
[10:14]  * elky waits for the torrent of abuse
[10:14] <soundray> elky: that was *way* over the top
[10:14] <elky> soundray, wols is not a nice person
[10:14] <soundray> elky: considering that wols had settled down and was actually trying to help
[10:14] <elky> soundray,  he wasnt. he's constantly berating our users like that
[10:15] <soundray> elky: one shouldn't be kicked for "not being a nice person"
[10:15] <elky> soundray, he was flaming, he needed to be removed
[10:16] <elky> soundray, he was asked twice by me alone to cease, and he's only been removed. there's nothing over the top about that
[10:17] <soundray> What happened to wols could easily have happened to me...
[10:17] <elky> soundray, just because others can make the same mistake, doesnt mean we dont enforce the no-flaming rule.
[10:17] <soundray> I still think there Unislash gave much more reason for a reprimand
[10:18] <soundray> He was utterly advice-resistant
[10:18] <elky> that's no reason to be flamed
[10:19] <soundray> Anyway -- not my decision. I hope wols comes back again to help. I know that I wouldn't.
[10:19] <elky> i dont like his version of help. i see enough of it in #debian
[10:22] <nalioth> quite so.
[10:22] <elky> for example:
[10:22] <elky> * osh_<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has joined #debian
[10:22] <elky> * Shisui has quit ("Quitte")
[10:22] <elky> * Gunirus_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
 In postfix, how do I rewrite the email address so that it doesn't show  <root><EMAIL_ADDRESS> osh_: #ubuntu
[10:22] <elky> that is not a helper i advocate for.
[10:22] <nalioth> we try not to treat our ignorant users as stupid cows
[10:23] <nalioth> ignorance can be overcome - stupidity is forever
[10:24] <elky> soundray, we daily get complaints about wols from at least one unique individual
[10:27] <Myrtti> elky: I agree
[10:27] <Myrtti> elky: I dislike him greatly
[10:27] <Myrtti> his attitude is disturbing
[10:28] <elky> Myrtti, he must whois everyone who joins #debian, seriously
[10:29] <Myrtti> ... could be, I whoissed everyone who joined #ubuntu for a while to get realnames
[10:29] <Myrtti> thought that was my client doing it
[10:29] <elky> heh
[10:30] <Myrtti> s/thought/though/
[10:31] <elky> hmm, im being trolled by wols in #debian now. i think this has gone past namespace
[10:31] <Myrtti> lovely character
[10:32] <elky> ever so
[10:35] <soundray> Okay, I'm taking it all back and admit that I was wrong.
[10:36] <Myrtti> I've seen him doing "since you've not listened to me, I'm putting you on /ignore"
[10:36] <Myrtti> more than once
[10:39] <elky> Myrtti, i reguarly end up on that list. i've been derided by him in #debian for asking debian questions about debian things, from a debian machine, just because he knows i run ubuntu too.
[10:40] <Myrtti> how ... rude!
[10:42] <elky> yeah
[11:03] <jussi01> sigh... [13:01:56] <flaccid> asraniel__, your girlfriend is probably not suited for linux. mac os x or windows is probably more appropriate
[11:04] <Myrtti> where is he so I can emp him
[11:04] <Myrtti> KILL
[11:05] <jussi01> #k
[11:07] <elky> jussi01, what was the context?
[11:08] <jussi01> elky: http://paste.ubuntu.com/23919/
[11:09] <nalioth> i'm handling it
[11:09] <jussi01> :)
[11:10] <Myrtti> KILL
[11:10] <Myrtti> emp?
[11:10] <Myrtti> hellokitty emp?
[11:10] <elky> um, had that been his father complaining about buggyness, would it have been bad to say his father was not suited?
[11:11] <jussi01> BonezAU: Hi
[11:11] <jussi01> @btlogin
[11:11] <BonezAU> jussi01, Hi are you able to help?
[11:11] <jussi01> BonezAU: Im looking at the situation now
[11:12] <flaccid> i just got banned for no reason.
[11:12] <flaccid> i would like to lodge a complaint against an op
[11:12] <Myrtti> jolly good
[11:12] <nalioth> flaccid: speak your piece ( and you were not banned )
[11:12] <flaccid> nalioth, tried to say that i used the word 'dumb' when the logs clearly show that i did not.
[11:13] <elky> some context for those who did not witness this might help
[11:13] <flaccid> banned from speaking in #kubuntu at least
[11:13] <elky> pastebins are common enough
[11:13] <flaccid> which is pretty insulting considering i help more than the person who muted me
[11:13] <jussi01> BonezAU: Unfortunately jack_sparrow is not around at the moment, he was the one who banned you.
[11:13] <nalioth> flaccid: if i say that your intelligence quoteient lies somewhere in the antarctic temperature range, this is the same as calling you "dumb", but not so succinctly.
[11:14] <BonezAU> jussi01, oh ok.. umm when was this ban put in place do you know?
[11:14] <jussi01> !patience | BonezAU
[11:14] <flaccid> nalioth, that sentence doesn't make any sense
[11:14] <elky> flaccid, he was calling you mute?
[11:14] <flaccid> i've never met you so you cannot judge me on that level
[11:14] <nalioth><PHONE_NUMBER> 05:01 < flaccid> asraniel__, your girlfriend is probably not suited for linux. mac os x or windows is probably more appropriate
[11:14] <elky> since 'dumb' means mute as well.
[11:14] <flaccid> and what is wrong with that? i never used the word dumb
[11:14] <jussi01> BonezAU: yesterday.
[11:14] <BonezAU> jussi01, I was not on IRC yesterday
[11:15] <Myrtti> ok, could we handle one thing at a time?
[11:15] <flaccid> common sense would depict if you are a new user to linux and it hard crashes on you frequently then maybe another OS is better for your hardware
[11:15] <jussi01> BonezAU: could you wait a moment please :)
[11:15] <nalioth> flaccid: i never said you used the word 'dumb'.  you were very inconsiderate with your statement, which for all intents and purposes calls the girlfriend "dumb"
[11:15] <BonezAU> jussi01, unless it was my flat mate... oh dear.. i'll be off to talk to him
[11:15] <BonezAU> jussi01, sure
[11:15] <flaccid> can an operator please address my problem with nalioth
[11:15] <flaccid> nalioth, you seem to be the only one interpretting it that way...
[11:15] <Myrtti> oh, REALLY
[11:16] <elky> when someone provides me with context, i may have some basis on which to address
[11:16] <flaccid> i've seen people make this same comment dozens of times, they didn't get muted. i mean this is freenode not censornode isn't it?
[11:16] <jussi01> flaccid: elky and Myrtti are attempting to do so.
[11:16] <flaccid> im a regular helper and it appears that ops lack respect to me
[11:16] <elky> flaccid, you're being inciteful now, and i do not appreciate that. it makes me less inclined to abandon a deadline to help you
[11:16]  * Myrtti growls
[11:17] <flaccid> elky, thats funny because nalioth was the one who was originally incitefull
[11:17] <elky> flaccid, you are not doing yourself *any( favour at all
[11:17] <Myrtti> 13:04 <+Myrtti> where is he so I can emp him
[11:17] <flaccid> its only human to be frustated when this happens and i feel your pain
[11:18] <flaccid> elky, thats fine, i'll just stop helping people and contributing and submitting bugs and ....
[11:18] <Tm_T> flaccid: please dont
[11:18] <elky> flaccid, i havent the time to deal with your rudness. you're not excused to do so by anyone else's behaviour.
[11:18]  * Myrtti lols
[11:18] <flaccid> so will someone fix this up for me or do i just discontinue my 50hours a week helping the project?
[11:18] <Tm_T> flaccid: calming down would help now
[11:18] <jussi01> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23924/ for context
[11:18] <flaccid> fixing my problem would help even more
[11:19] <elky> thank jussi01 i may be able to now
[11:19] <Tm_T> flaccid: fixing without calming down is hard to do
[11:19] <elky> and stop being so impatient, this is *not* the only thing im tryign to do right now
[11:19] <flaccid> im totally calm. there is no tone on irc.
[11:19] <Tm_T> flaccid: there is ;)
[11:19] <elky> flaccid, your comments have been nothing but inciteful.
[11:19] <Myrtti> I've been on IRC too long, I note again
[11:20] <flaccid> elky, so were nalioth and yours.
[11:20]  * Tm_T hugs Myrtti
[11:20] <Myrtti> where to start...
[11:20] <Myrtti> flaccid: first of all
[11:20]  * flaccid waits 10mins
[11:20] <Myrtti> "Wrongdoings of others do not justify yours"
[11:20] <elky> flaccid, it would have been less than that if you had have provided me context from the start. I am *not* in #k*
[11:20] <flaccid> the channel is logged
[11:21] <elky> jussi01, provided context, i am able to start looking
[11:21] <flaccid> Myrtti, i don't need your lecture ok, thanks anyway.
[11:21] <elky> flaccid, i am doing numerous things. i am not at people's beck or call
[11:21] <flaccid> how many ops are in this channel?
[11:21] <Myrtti> flaccid: well thanks, then I'll just take a step back and not even try to help you
[11:22] <flaccid> Myrtti, no you have it the wrong way around. you would be helping the project, not me.
[11:22] <Myrtti> since you clearly don't need my point of view
[11:22] <flaccid> exacly.
[11:22] <Myrtti> to be honest, from what I gathered from the paste of jussi01...
[11:22] <elky> flaccid, your comment in #k appears to be supporting someone say his girlfriend 'does not make the difference'. i can see how nalioth has interpreted it as you joining an insult.
[11:22] <Myrtti> well that settles it then
[11:22]  * Myrtti wipes her hands
[11:23] <Myrtti> so, any plans for dinner?
[11:23]  * jussi01 takes a deep breath
[11:23] <Tm_T> Myrtti: my place
[11:23] <jussi01> BonezAU: you are up!
[11:23] <Myrtti> Tm_T: oooh!
[11:23] <elky> you then accused naliioth of beeaking the CoC because he interpreted it that way.
[11:23] <jussi01> BonezAU: please repeat what you just told me in pm
[11:23]  * Myrtti rolls her eyes
[11:23] <Tm_T> elky: gone
[11:24] <nalioth> elky: flaccid has gone.
[11:26] <elky> nalioth, lift the ban. i think it was just unfortunate words. im about to rile him in PM for being so rude as to not wait for me to get to the issue.
[11:26] <nalioth> it was only a 10 minute quiet
[11:26] <elky> so he's talking there again already?
[11:26] <nalioth> evidentally so
[11:27] <Tm_T> yes
[11:27] <elky> for the record: /MSG flaccid you know, waiting would do you alot of justice, and be courteous since im risking a conference paper submission for your pride, your comment in #k appears to be supporting someone say his girlfriend 'does not make the difference'. i can see how nalioth has interpreted it as you joining an insult. you then accused naliioth of beeaking the CoC because he interpreted it that way. the ban was only a mute, and lifted lon
[11:27] <elky> g before you parted #ubuntu-ops. next time, dont be so damn rude -- you wasted my time.
[11:28] <soundray> elky: the 'does not make the difference' statement was not from flaccid
[11:28] <elky> i know it wasnt. read the words around the quote
[11:29] <soundray> elky: but what about the statement '[13:01:56] <flaccid> asraniel__, your girlfriend is probably not suited for linux. [...]'
[11:30] <soundray> Wasn't that the real CoC breaker? ;)
[11:30] <elky> soundray, no, should it be?
[11:31] <BonezAU> jussi01, Thank you, I found out it was my flatemate on my PC last night when I was not here
[11:32] <BonezAU> jussi01, I have changed my password and created him his own account on my ubuntu box so it wont happen again
[11:32] <soundray> elky: sounds very disrespectful
[11:32] <elky> soundray, against what?
[11:32] <soundray> elky: against the girlfriend
[11:33] <nalioth> elky: flaccid insulted the girlfriends intelligence
[11:33] <jussi01> Does anyone have any objections to me lifting the ban on BonezAU? it was set by jack_sparrow - you can see it on the bt
[11:33] <nalioth> it's the same as saying " you're too dumb to run linux "
[11:33] <Myrtti> @btlogin
[11:34] <soundray> elky: I think it's insulting, and it's degrading a person to something material that can be 'compatible' or 'incompatible', like hardware
[11:34] <elky> erk, now i have to find a way to stop flaccid inform me that we are a service to him.
[11:35] <Myrtti> we need FSoE
[11:35] <Myrtti> sorry, but we do
[11:35] <Myrtti> jussi01: seems ok to me
[11:35] <elky> i would comment but it'd end up at a CC meeting.
[11:35] <Myrtti> well I need it atleast
[11:35] <Myrtti> I know a certain Finnish person who'd I'd use it on
[11:36] <elky> i have just placed flaccid on ignore as he would not cease PMing me after numerous requests to cease.
[11:36] <nalioth> elky: /quote silence ( then you can watch him put his foot in his mouth in public )
[11:37] <elky> well by ignore, i mean, i cease responding.
[11:37] <elky> he's still rabbiting at me, very rudely
[11:37] <Myrtti> "mental woolly sock"
[11:37] <Myrtti> stuffed into his mouth
[11:38] <Myrtti> as we Finns use the "internal woolly shirt" in the wintertime
[11:38] <elky> i cannot comment as it would be wrongly interpreted as a threat.
[11:38] <jpds> Hmm, he left.
[11:38] <Myrtti> elky: mental bananas in your ears?
[11:39] <Myrtti> bananas are good mmmkay
[11:39]  * Myrtti flips
[11:39] <elky> jpds, no great loss if my PM log is anythign to go by. we apparantly owe him and should exalt him from every wrongdoing becase he helps people (gee, where've i heard that one before). i am apparantly also supposed to suck something.
[11:43] <jpds> Hmm
[11:45] <elky> @btlogin
[11:45] <elky> i hate you, ubottu
[11:50] <elkbuntu> !login
[11:51] <elkbuntu> she's all laggy
[11:51] <nalioth> isn't it @login and @btlogin ?
[11:52] <bazhang> aye
[11:53] <elkbuntu> yeah, i was waiting for a the btlogin in pm, and wanted to see if she knew about logins
[11:53] <Myrtti> note to self: boiling water is boiling
[11:53] <elkbuntu> Myrtti, really?
[11:53] <elkbuntu> did someone deal with bonez yet?
[11:54] <Myrtti> note to self, 2: sieve is a thing that passes things through
[11:56] <elkbuntu> jussi01, did you finish with bonez?
[11:57] <jussi01> elkbuntu: no. I got busy here. would you mid finishing it up?
[11:57] <elkbuntu> i would actually. it's 9pm and ive only got a heading for the 'due in 3 hours' paper presentation, and i go to bed in 90 minutes
[11:58]  * bazhang waits for neo_the_user to show up again
[11:59] <Myrtti> BonezAU:
[11:59] <Myrtti> still therE?
[12:00] <bazhang> talk about overreaction
[12:00] <Myrtti> bazhang: I didn't ban him ;-)
[12:00] <bazhang> yet :)
[12:01] <bazhang> I meant oli not you Myrtti :)
[12:01] <Myrtti> well...
[12:01] <Myrtti> http://pastebin.com/m595f31b6
[12:03]  * Myrtti pokes BonezAU
[12:10] <bazhang> since we are sharing pastebins; here is neo_the_user from earlier-->http://paste.ubuntu.com/23865/
[12:11] <Myrtti> lovely
[12:12] <elkbuntu> is it a full moon somewhere?
[12:12] <Pici> On the moon.
[12:12] <elkbuntu> ha.
[12:12] <bazhang> his name is banned but the @etc.com has been unbanned (not by me)
 is it true that ubuntu will be take over by microsoft
[12:13] <Pici> Yeah, watching him.
[12:13] <elkbuntu> as i asked before...
[12:21] <BonezAU> Myrtti, I am here, sorry
[12:22] <Myrtti> and so is Jack_Sparrow, I note
[12:23] <BonezAU> yes, he is
[12:24] <Pici> !-fat32
[12:24] <Pici> !windowsdrives
[12:25] <Pici> !windowsdrives =~ s/write/NTFS write/
[12:25] <Myrtti> !windowsdrives ~= /write/NTFS write/
[12:25] <Myrtti> !windowsdrives
[12:25] <Pici> !ntfs =~ s/write/NTFS write/
[12:25] <Myrtti> right
[12:26] <Pici> !no fat32 is <alias> ntfs
[12:26] <Pici> !no fat32 is <alias> ntfs
[12:26] <Jack_Sparrow> Myrtti Sort of awake and here
[12:26] <Myrtti> BonezAU: I note that you've been removed from the channel before
[12:26] <Jack_Sparrow> Pici thanks for adjusting that
[12:26] <BonezAU> Myrtti, really? When was that?
[12:27] <Myrtti> May 15 2008 15:00:55 UTC
[12:28] <BonezAU> Myrtti, that's interesting.. perhaps there is more to it than I know about. As I said earlier, my flatmate now has his own account on my box and will no longer auto-login with my user account and have access to IRC under my nick
[12:29] <nalioth> Jack_Sparrow: can you do the honors?  ^^
[12:29] <Jack_Sparrow> These excuses that it wasnt me it was my room mate are wearing thin.
[12:30] <BonezAU> Jack_Sparrow, I am sure they are wearing thin - I can assure you that this is genuine though. I have taken action to prevent it from happening again
[12:31] <BonezAU> I regularly contribute to the IRC channel and have been using ubuntu for quite a while.. I enjoy contributing to the community as much as I do getting assistance
[12:31] <Jack_Sparrow> Were you not demanding that since you often helped out in the channel you deserved your answer now and deserved to repeat
[12:31] <BonezAU> I am not sure what you are talking about
[12:32] <Jack_Sparrow> the pm after the ban yesterday
[12:32] <BonezAU> Is there an IRC log or something so I can see what was written using my nick?
[12:32] <Jack_Sparrow> Sure is
[12:32] <BonezAU> Where do I find this?
[12:33] <BonezAU> I have stated my case, I don't know why it's so difficult to be unbanned... I want to get back in the ring and help others
[12:33] <BonezAU> I have made the changes to ensure it won't happen again
[12:33] <BonezAU> There's not much more to it ?
[12:36] <Jack_Sparrow> It is difficult as I dont believe it was your room mate... I am still reading .. give me a sec
[12:37] <BonezAU> okay
[12:39] <Jack_Sparrow> You were only logged in for three minutes when you started Hello? because you felt you were being ignored
[12:40] <BonezAU> ?? I was not even home last night
[12:41] <Myrtti>   ... so...
[12:41] <elkbuntu> hrm... was i disconnected from freenode or just my bip?
[12:42] <Pici> elkbuntu: I'm guessing just bip, you havent left here.
[12:42] <BonezAU> ... so... as I said earlier, I have removed the auto-login to my gnome session, changed my password and created my flatmate his own user account on my ubuntu pc
[12:42] <elkbuntu> *another* roommate story?
[12:43] <Jack_Sparrow> elkbuntu Yes.. but the room mate must know his habits quite well
[12:43] <Jack_Sparrow> [14:25] <BonezAU> I always help others, but can't get a straight answer to my question
[12:44] <BonezAU> Jack_Sparrow, yes he does, we share a similar interest in computers and ubuntu, he could come on here right now and take over from me and you'd never be able to tell the difference
[12:45] <elkbuntu> BonezAU, just so you know: roommate is the excuse of the month... we need photos of you busting your cohabitor before we genuinely believe it.
[12:45] <elkbuntu> we dont believe alot of the stories we get. call it learned cynicism.
[12:46] <BonezAU> that's fine, you can believe what and who you want, you are entitled to
[12:46] <BonezAU> but this feels like a police investigation
[12:46] <BonezAU> it's a damn irc channel
[12:46] <elkbuntu> BonezAU, its an irc channel of 1200 people.
[12:46] <BonezAU> you can unban me, monitor me, and kick me out if you don't like what I am doing
[12:46] <elkbuntu> it's not 'just' an irc channel.
[12:46] <BonezAU> you can't just presume that i am a bad person
[12:47] <elkbuntu> we can actually. we rarely do so without cause though.
[12:47] <Jack_Sparrow> We can review your bahavior that has got your account banned twice so far.. we do have that to go on.
[12:47] <elkbuntu> Jack_Sparrow, if he's 'rectified' the situation, let him back in. he knows it wont be so easy if it happens again.
[12:47] <BonezAU> well I see #ubuntu as a valuable source of information and I enjoy being a part of the community
[12:47] <Jack_Sparrow> agreed
[12:48] <Jack_Sparrow> Done
[12:49] <elkbuntu> always nice to get that thankyou.
[12:49] <Jack_Sparrow> Im waiting for his first question to be the one that got his room mate banned
[12:49] <BonezAU> yeah lol lol
[12:50] <elkbuntu> BonezAU, what now?
[12:50] <Jack_Sparrow> BonezAU Is there anything else
[12:50] <Jack_Sparrow> !idle
[12:52] <BonezAU>  [ryanakca] idle 16:29:23, [tonyyarusso] idle 06:47:10, [juliux] idle 53:03:26, [JanC] idle 13:25:22 - Why the special rules for me?
[12:52] <elkbuntu> BonezAU, those are not idlers, they're helpers.
[12:52] <BonezAU> maybe I want to help too
[12:52] <BonezAU> they are still idlers
[12:52] <Jack_Sparrow> Again wanting special treatment?
[12:53] <elkbuntu> BonezAU, dont argue.
[12:53] <Jack_Sparrow> I am rethinking my decision
[12:59] <elkbuntu> not worth it
[12:59] <elkbuntu> you can however tell me what you think of my proposal abstract!
[13:00] <elkbuntu> the topic being working with proprietary software companies from a FOSS advocacy pov...
[13:00] <elkbuntu> Title: Keep Your Enemies Closer: FOSS versus The World
[13:00] <elkbuntu> Abstract: By the time of the GNU project was founded in 1983, proprietary licencing software had become the norm. 25 years later, the software liberation movements are increasingly gaining ground and coming closer to bringing back the "good old days" However, we're not there yet and sometimes we need to work with those who we do not trust or agree with. This paper asks that critical question: Should we, or shouldn't we?
[13:02] <bazhang> should not.
[13:02] <bazhang> nice proposal by the way elkbuntu
[13:02] <elkbuntu> hehe
[13:13] <Pici> Does ubottu do the "see my private message" for all !$0 > $1 now? even if there are ($comments) ?
[13:14]  * Hobbsee eyerolls
[13:14] <Hobbsee> flaccid ending up here again...
[13:14] <bazhang> more roommates in the mix?
[13:14] <bazhang>  /j #ubuntu-roommate
[13:16] <elkbuntu> hahhaa
[13:16] <Jack_Sparrow> cute
[13:16] <bazhang> :)
[13:17] <Hobbsee> or #ubuntu-lame-excuse-for-the-week-decisions
[13:17] <bazhang> hahaha
[13:18]  * Hobbsee wonders...
[13:18] <ikonia> limcore in #ubuntu is about to kick off as usual
[13:18] <Hobbsee> oh, excellent.
[13:18]  * Hobbsee sharpens her stick
[13:18] <ikonia> "this is rubbish etc etc"
[13:18] <ikonia> standard issue
[13:19] <PriceChild> Hobbsee: whatcha doing?
[13:19] <Myrtti> BonezAU: yes?
[13:19] <Hobbsee> PriceChild: nothing to concern you.
[13:19] <PriceChild> Ok then, was referring to you going +o in #ubuntu, which concerns me.
[13:19]  * Hobbsee coudl be doing any number of things.
[13:19] <PriceChild> Either way, I hope you would be polite enough so not be so accusatory.
[13:20] <Myrtti> BonezAU: anything we can help you with?
[13:20]  * bazhang checks the phase of the moon
[13:20] <Hobbsee> accusatory?  you were the one accusing me of doing something sinister, by being concerned.
[13:20]  * Myrtti coughs
[13:20]  * Myrtti larts bazhang
[13:20] <Hobbsee> as it was, i'm watching limcore, and looking at old bans.  is that okay by you?
[13:20]  * bazhang is defeated
[13:21] <Hobbsee> PriceChild: also, not telling you what my infinite plans are are not being impolite, nor being accusatory.
[13:21]  * Myrtti twiddles her thumbs
[13:21] <Hobbsee> s/are/is/
[13:21] <Myrtti> now that's disturbing
[13:22] <Myrtti> 0 days 0 hours 28 mins 51 secs
[13:33] <Pici> hi
[13:33]  * Pici hugs #ubuntu-ops
[13:33] <Myrtti> I guess I'll have to start waiting for Severed Fifth since... Lugradio is quitting
[13:34] <bazhang> \0/
[13:34]  * Myrtti larts bazhang
[13:34] <Myrtti> I like Jono's voice.
[13:34]  * Myrtti has a trembling lower lip
[13:34]  * bazhang is doubly-larted
[13:35] <Myrtti> rightly so
[13:36] <Pici> Myrtti likes Jono
[13:36]  * Pici runs
[13:36] <Myrtti> pft
[13:36] <Myrtti> I like you too
[13:36] <Pici> :)
[13:36]  * Myrtti shrugs
[13:36] <Pici> \o/
[13:37] <Myrtti> I'm past Jono already :->
[13:37] <Myrtti> and no, I will *not* comment more
[13:40] <Daviey> Myrtti: If you knew how much gas Jono releases during the night.. i wonder if you'd be so keen :)
[13:41]  * Myrtti shrugs
[13:41] <Myrtti> I love my mom too?
[13:41] <Myrtti> BonezAU: yes=
[13:41] <BonezAU> Hi Myrtti
[13:41] <Pici> BonezAU: Can we help you?
[13:41] <BonezAU> How are you
[13:41] <BonezAU> Hi Pici
[13:42] <Myrtti> fine thanks, I'd like to know what we can do to you now?
[13:42] <Myrtti> you surely have some reason to come here?
[13:42] <Pici> s/to/for/  maybe.
[13:43] <Jack_Sparrow> BonezAU We made the no idling policy quite clear yet you continue to rejoin...
[13:43] <BonezAU> No, no reason, I just like to hang out
[13:43] <BonezAU> It's IRC after all
[13:43] <BonezAU> and i'm entitled to join whatever channel I want without breaking the freenode policies
[13:43] <Myrtti> BonezAU: sure you are
[13:43] <Myrtti> though, we as operators can also ban you
[13:44] <Pici> BonezAU: Channels still have their own policies though.
[13:44] <Myrtti> for not adhereing to the channel no-idling rule
[13:44] <BonezAU> You can, but you would need a valid reason to do so
[13:44] <Jack_Sparrow> I am ready to reinstate the ban in ubuntu
[13:44] <BonezAU> That is not a freenode rule
[13:44] <Myrtti> BonezAU: so?
[13:44] <BonezAU> Well as you reside on the freenode network, you have to abide by their rules
[13:45] <Myrtti> channel rules extend freenode rules
[13:45] <Myrtti> freenode rules do not run channel rules over
[13:45] <BonezAU> Well i'm not causing anyone any trouble by idling in this channelk
[13:45] <BonezAU> I would just keep quiet if you didn't keep targeting me
[13:45]  * bazhang points to the /topic
[13:45] <Jack_Sparrow> BonezAU You are not allowed to idle in this channel
[13:46] <Myrtti> BonezAU: we keep track on issues handled here by keeping idlers off
[13:46] <BonezAU> okay, well I won't idle
[13:46] <BonezAU> I'll just keep talking
[13:46] <BonezAU> there's no grounds to ban me for simply talking
[13:46] <Jack_Sparrow> offtopic
[13:46] <Myrtti> other than disrupting our work
[13:46] <Myrtti> ?
[13:46] <Pici> BonezAU: This channels logs are available if you are curious as to what goes on here, but this *is* a working channel
[13:46] <BonezAU> That's not against the freenode policies
[13:46] <Pici> BonezAU: Try #ubuntu-offtopic if you just want to chat.
[13:46] <Pici> BonezAU: Freenode doesnt run this channel, we do.
[13:47] <Myrtti> 0___0
[13:47] <BonezAU> Why are others allowed to idle in here
[13:47] <BonezAU> even though you continue to pick on me for idling
[13:47] <Hobbsee> because they're operators....
[13:47] <BonezAU> well I don't see them operating
[13:47] <BonezAU> I see them idling
[13:47] <Hobbsee> and are here to deal in operator-based discussions.
[13:47] <BonezAU> Why are you singling me out
[13:47] <Pici> thats enough.
[13:48]  * Myrtti yawns
 /cs k Jack_Sparrow
[13:48] <bazhang> nice.
[13:49] <Jack_Sparrow> cute
[13:49] <bazhang> and then quit
[13:53] <elkbuntu> how he even knows the script shortcuts i dun wanna know
[13:53] <bazhang> he saw it a few moments before he got kicked
[13:54] <elkbuntu> ah
[13:56] <Jack_Sparrow> I hit space before the /cs earlier
[13:56] <Jack_Sparrow> fat fingers in the am
[13:57] <bazhang> removus interruptus
[13:57] <Myrtti> lol
[13:57] <Myrtti> bazhang: no, actually ircus interruptus
[13:58] <bazhang> Myrtti, haha
[13:58] <Jack_Sparrow> PriceChild Will expect him to return soon
[13:58] <PriceChild> Jack_Sparrow: hmm?
[13:58] <Pici> Seeing how hes banned again in #ubuntu, probably.
[13:58] <bazhang> bonezau
[13:58] <bazhang> PriceChild, ^^
[13:58] <Jack_Sparrow> Sure .. it was his room mote
[13:59] <bazhang> remove the mote in your roommate before you troll on ubuntu
[13:59] <Pici> Its everyone's roomate, brother, cousin, friend, split personality, doppleganger, etc...
[13:59] <bazhang> hehe
[14:00] <Myrtti> doppleganger ex's are scary
[14:00] <bazhang>  /j #ubuntu-exorcism
[14:02] <Jack_Sparrow> Abby........  Abby Who?     ....      Abby-Normal
[14:02] <bazhang> haha
[14:02] <bazhang> classic movie
[14:02] <Pici> eh?
[14:02] <Jack_Sparrow> Young Frankenstein
[14:02] <bazhang> frau bluchner
[14:02] <Pici> I've never seen it :|
[14:02] <Jack_Sparrow> weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeehehehe
[14:02] <Hobbsee> Pici: you forgot the pet cat.
[14:03] <Hobbsee> Pici: and baby.
[14:03] <bazhang> and wolf
[14:03] <Hobbsee> bazhang: people can keep wolves as pets?
[14:03] <Jack_Sparrow> Pici black and white.. mel brookes  classic
[14:03] <bazhang> Hobbsee, not safely :)
[14:03] <Jack_Sparrow> Hobbsee yes, father in law has one
[14:04] <bazhang> they tend to take over user accounts and spam in #ubuntu
[14:05] <Jack_Sparrow> I'll paste a picture of the beast when I find one
[14:06] <bazhang> Pici, it is a must-see :)
[14:06] <Pici> bazhang: I'll put it on Netflix
[14:06] <Hobbsee> hehe
[14:10] <bazhang> :)
[14:40] <Pici> ugh
[15:34] <Hobbsee> is 124-171-7-116.dyn.iinet.net.au a common address?
[15:34] <Hobbsee> well, a known address for #ubuntu or something?
[15:37] <jpds> Sorted.
[15:37] <Pici> that was fast
[15:37] <bazhang> whoa that was sooper fast
[15:38] <jpds> Pici: That's Captain Jack Sparrow for you. ;-)
[15:38] <bazhang> hehe
[15:39] <bazhang> m3talgod> great! thank you very much for your support! <--one of the bright spots for today :)
[15:43] <jpds> Hobbsee: meh, *stabs*
[15:45] <Hobbsee> jpds: heh, yes
[16:44]  * Myrtti sighs
[16:44] <Jack_Sparrow> More sangria for Myrtti
[16:44] <Myrtti> nope, none of that
[16:45] <Pici> why is Myrtti sighing?
[16:45] <Myrtti> I think I'll get a cup of chamomille
[16:45] <Pici> mm
[16:45] <Myrtti> and then perhaps tweak my Skype
[16:46] <Pici> I think I'm going to upload a hackergotchi head
[16:47] <Pici> my own ;)
[17:00] <jussio1> Myrtti: server going down for approx ½ hour, please ready ubott2
[17:01] <jussio1> heya Pricey
[17:03] <Myrtti> mmm marinated zucchinis
[17:04] <jussio1> oh ssh you
[17:04] <Myrtti> and chicken
[17:04] <Myrtti> well... not yet
[17:04] <Myrtti> just was popping the zucchinis in the marinade
[17:04] <Myrtti> whut
[17:04]  * jussio1 is still trying to figure out what to cook for dinner
[17:04] <Myrtti> basic summer food
[17:05] <Myrtti> well that was something new
[17:07] <Myrtti> exiting!
[17:07] <Myrtti> exciting...
[17:07] <Myrtti> ex... whatever
[17:07] <jussio1> Myrtti: you have ex's on the brain
[17:08] <Myrtti> jussio1: don't tempt me to grab the brain bleach bottle
[17:08] <Myrtti> I had too much of that already on Thursday
[17:27]  * Myrtti finds receipts from Thursday in her purse and cringes
[17:31] <nalioth> this year, Myrtti ?
[17:31] <Myrtti> this year, last Thursday
[17:32] <nalioth> ah, that's good then.
[17:32] <Myrtti> ...
[17:32] <nalioth> beats finding receipts from 2004
[17:32] <Myrtti> receipts from bars I don't remember been to
[17:32] <nalioth> oooh, fun times
[17:32] <Myrtti> two bars
[17:33] <Myrtti> though I remember commenting the football match to a couple of English fellers
[17:33] <Myrtti> >___<
[17:34] <Myrtti> oh SIGH.
[17:36] <Ziroday> Hi, the bots dont seem to be working
[17:36] <Myrtti> I guess that's my cue
[17:36] <jussio1> yep. sounds it
[17:36] <Myrtti> !test
[17:36] <Ziroday> please
[17:37] <jussio1> ok, go for it
[17:37] <Myrtti> already launched
[17:38] <Myrtti> oh sigh
[17:38] <Myrtti> I forgot to sync the database
[17:38] <Myrtti> oh well
[17:39] <Ziroday> so is our dear ubottu back up
[17:39] <Myrtti> nope
[17:39] <Ziroday> because were useless without him
[17:39] <Myrtti> that's just the temporary one for the duration while ubottu is being relocated
[17:39] <Myrtti> be gentle to HER
[17:39] <Myrtti> they're both females.
[17:39] <nalioth> Myrtti: you can sync it with the bot running
[17:40] <Myrtti> ah, true
[17:40] <Ziroday> okey dokey
[17:40] <Myrtti> there
[18:05] <Myrtti> !test
[18:05] <ubott2> Failed!
[18:05] <Pici> weird.
[18:05] <Myrtti> what is
[18:05] <Pici> Someone in #kubuntu was asking if another user was a bot.
[18:11] <Myrtti> !test
[18:11] <ubott2> Failed!
[18:12]  * Myrtti yawns
[18:19] <jussio1> Pici: who was that someone?
[18:20] <Pici> jussio1: rickest thought ilya was a bot
[18:20] <jussio1> oh
[18:31] <Myrtti> oh, there was an extra chicken thingie in the package
[18:31] <Myrtti> joy
[18:32] <Pici> oh
[18:32] <nalioth> two clucks for the same buck? fun times  :)
[18:32] <Pici> I was thinking .deb package for a moment.
[18:32] <jussio1> arrrgh, I kill you (firefox)
[18:34] <jussio1> Myrtti: look who I met last night: http://lifematta.com/jussi01/event/11407/
[18:34] <jussio1> :D
[18:34] <Myrtti> LOL
[18:38] <Myrtti> everyone has eaten again?
[18:38] <Myrtti> http://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/2624672799/
[18:39] <Pici> yummy
[18:40] <Pici> I has a head: http://planet.ubuntu.com/heads/bnrubin.png
[18:53]  * jussio1 counters Myrtti with this: http://lifematta.com/jussi01/event/11404/
[18:54] <jussio1> nom nom
[18:54] <Myrtti> aaaaaaaaannnnd epiphany...
[18:54] <Pici> the browsr? or the philosphical thing?
[18:54] <Jack_Sparrow> :)
[18:55] <Myrtti> the browser
[18:55] <Myrtti> ....
[18:55] <Myrtti> crashes on that link
[18:55] <jussio1> Myrtti: dunno what it is, but firefox has bee crashing like crazy also - see my killing earlier
[18:56] <Pici> It was a cake with about two inches of icing on it
[18:56] <Myrtti> is that the cheesecake?
[18:56] <jussio1> yes, its the cheesecake
[18:56] <Pici> oh, so thats not icing?
[18:56] <jussio1> Pici: its not icing
[18:56] <Pici> ah
[18:57] <jussio1> its very yummy, but quite rich...
[18:58] <Myrtti> we don't do icings in Finland really
[18:59] <Myrtti> whipped cream if anything
[19:01] <Myrtti> I've once had US style layer cake with icing and it was horrible
[19:01] <Myrtti> my skin oozed preservatives and artificial aromas for weeks
[19:03] <nalioth> Myrtti: home made is best
[19:20] <Myrtti> I HATE MY OLD BANK
[19:20] <Myrtti> KILL IT
[19:21] <Pici> o.o
[19:21]  * Myrtti grumbles
[19:21] <ompaul> one emp cannon pointed at $bank (there is a pun there somewhere)
[19:21] <nalioth> Myrtti: WITH FIRE?
[19:22] <Myrtti> WITH NAPALM AND TAR
[19:22] <Pici> ooh
[19:22] <Myrtti> burning oil
[19:22]  * Myrtti twitches her fingers
[19:23]  * Pici gives Myrtti back her stapler
[19:23] <Myrtti> I've got a few select nouns and adjectives reserved for those .... gits.
[19:28] <Myrtti> ... GRRRR
[19:32] <PriceChild> Did ubott2 not rejoin all channels?
[19:32] <Pici> Seems that way.
[19:32] <Pici> its not in -offtopic at least.
[19:33] <PriceChild> Or is it another bot down? (just chucked it into -uk)
[19:33] <Myrtti> it did not join all channels
[19:33] <Myrtti> I've taken some of the channels it joins off because there is no guarantees of how much load it can take
[19:34] <PriceChild> sounds smart
[19:34] <Myrtti> currently the loads are ok, but there's not been any testing on it, so I'd rather not risk it
[19:34] <Myrtti> I don't even dare to think what the loads would be if it were ubottu instead of ubott2
[19:35] <Myrtti> since then people would pm it
[19:35] <Myrtti> s/would/would know to/
[19:36] <Pici> no, the first way made sense.
[19:36]  * nalioth needs to get his remote servers supybot capable
[19:37] <Myrtti> !login
[19:37] <ubott2> Factoid login not found
[19:37] <Myrtti> @login
[19:37] <ubott2> Myrtti: The operation succeeded.
[19:37] <Myrtti> @join #ubuntu-uk
[19:39] <ompaul> Pici, ~ in the past we have had people troll no end when they "discover" there is no longer support for 5.04
[19:42] <ubott2> ASULutzy called the ops in #ubuntu (Anon9189)
[20:03] <Pici> well, hes not getting unbanned
[20:03] <Jack_Sparrow> Ever
[20:04] <Pici> 15:03:05 <FloodBot1> WARNING: Neo_The_User appears to be abusive
[20:04] <nalioth> dynamic account
[20:04] <nalioth> oh, him.
[20:04] <nalioth> yeah, floodbot1 is the understater of the year on that one
[20:05] <Pici> nalioth: What do you think about people in ##politics trolling about DoSing #ubuntu ?
[20:05] <nalioth> Pici: they troll about everything in there
[20:05] <nalioth> it is the same feculent scum that used to infest #Politics, you know
[20:06] <Pici> I stayed out of there
[20:07] <nalioth> #politics is closed.  all the scum was flushed to ##politics
[20:38]  * Myrtti sighs
[20:48] <ubott2> In ubott2, cliff_ said: ok at this link http://xorg.freedesktop.org/releases/X11R6.7.0/doc/radeon.4.html but confused as to what to do next is there a remote desk top i can activate and have you help me?
[20:48] <jussio1> cliff_: hi
[20:49] <cliff_> hey
[20:49] <jussio1> cliff_: dont streess about it we saw
[20:49] <jussio1> :)
[20:49] <cliff_> man this so so diffrent then widows
[20:50] <jussio1> cliff_: if you tell the bot x is y then it reports it to us here.
[20:50] <cliff_> bot?
[20:50] <jussio1> [06/30/08 22:47:56] < ubott2> In ubott2, cliff_ said: ok at this link http://xorg.freedesktop.org/releases/X11R6.7.0/doc/radeon.4.html but confused as to what to do next is there a remote desk top i can activate and have you help me?
[20:51] <jussio1> cliff_: why did you join here?
[20:51] <cliff_> oh ok
[20:51] <cliff_> well do you know if you can help me?
[20:51] <jussio1> cliff_: join #ubuntu for help
[20:51] <jussio1> :)
[21:02] <Tm_T> hi kids
[21:06]  * Myrtti yawns
[21:25] <jussio1> Myrtti: unfortunately looks like an overnight thing :/ think you bot will be ok?
[21:26]  * jussio1 sighs
[21:26] <Myrtti> looks like it
[21:26] <Myrtti> the loads have been relatively cool
[21:26] <jussio1> great :)
[21:26] <Myrtti> yeah, could take even more strain
[21:27] <Myrtti> I'm tempted to rename her ubottu and check where the loads would go
[21:27] <Myrtti> they're about 0.05 now
[21:28] <Myrtti> but I really can't be bothered, considering going to bed and sleep
[21:28] <Myrtti> have to go to damned Helsinki tomorrow
[21:38] <Myrtti> ... yeah.
[21:38] <Myrtti> anyway, good night
[21:40] <jussio1> night
[21:56] <ikonia> are any of the USA guys awake ?
[22:10] <tonyyarusso> yes
[22:10] <tonyyarusso> It's 4:00 PM here.
[22:10] <ikonia> Hmmm, I may be sorted, so I'm ok
[22:11] <ikonia> thank you though
[23:41] <stdin> Myrtti: ping
[23:44] <bazhang> * FloodBot1 has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) uh oh
[23:45] <nalioth> ruhroh
[23:45] <nalioth> i'll fix it
[23:45]  * gnomefreak wonders why dana always has issues that noone else has :(
[23:46] <bazhang> hehe
[23:46] <gnomefreak> every release he does this and its everyday
[23:46] <gnomefreak> most of it is him hacking something in /etc or / for that matter
[23:47] <nalioth> floodbot1 is now running on a remote server
[23:47] <bazhang> yay!
[23:47]  * bazhang hugs nalioth
[23:47] <bazhang> arch might be better for danaG
[23:49] <gnomefreak> honestly after looking at access list i only see 4 or 5 people that havent been around for a while (this is to the person that cares who is oped in #ubuntu)
[23:49] <gnomefreak> i so want to mute him/her on some days or tell him/her to join #ubuntu-offtopic since it was a problem he/she introduced
[23:49] <bazhang> him iirc
[23:49] <gnomefreak> hacking intrepid is stupid for 1
[23:50] <gnomefreak> or any dev sysle
[23:50] <gnomefreak> cycle
[23:50] <gnomefreak> IMO if its his hack its offtopic\
[23:51] <bazhang> but will he admit its his hack is the question
[23:51] <gnomefreak> sometimes after 3-4 days of complaining
[23:51] <bazhang> whoa
[23:52] <gnomefreak> it gets very old and i think its more of an attention getting tacktic
[23:53] <bazhang> undoubtedly
[23:59] <gnomefreak> :(