[03:35] <studiobot> AlexPedreros was added by: AlexPedreros
[05:23] <studio-user407> join
[12:19] <studiobot> <Bayu Setiawan> I've some problem with system speed, but i think it might be strange, sometimes i booted ubuntu studio for 1st time i got slow system, slow opening menu, slow opening folder, slow opening file and very slow opening app.  The problem is gone after several restart, but sometime it will come again.  Anyone does have similar problem
[12:19] <studiobot>  like me? … Spec : core i3 2100, 4gb ram ddr3 1330mhz, ssd sandisk plus 120gb, ubuntu studio 18.10
[13:00] <studio-user869> Am currently running US 16.04 LTS and am trying to upgrade. When I launch SoftwareUpdater and click on "Upgrade", nothing happens. I've looked for the sudo apt.. way to do this, but am not finding it specific to Ubuntu Studio upgrades. I did try "sudo apt update && sudo apt dist-upgrade" though only very minor changes occurred. What should I try next?
[13:02] <tarzeau> i always use sed -i s,OLDDISTRO,bionic,g /etc/apt/sources.list; apt-get update; apt-get dist-upgrade
[13:02] <tarzeau> and keep running upgrade; until dpkg -l |grep -v ^ii shows almost nothing
[13:02] <tarzeau> works for me since 15+ years
[13:03] <studio-user869> Ok, so that is 3 commands, starting with  "sed -i s,OLDDISTRO,bionic,g /etc/apt/sources.list"?
[13:03] <studio-user869> And the "apt-get update", etc?
[13:05] <tarzeau> replace OLDDISTRO for whatever you have now in that file
[13:05] <tarzeau> probably xenial
[13:05] <tarzeau> all as root, yes
[13:06] <studio-user869> Is there any reason I can't (or shouldn't) upgrade directly to 18.10?
[13:07] <tarzeau> no, you can also put the codename of 18.10
[13:07] <tarzeau> i'm running 19.04 (unreleased), so my codename is disco
[13:07] <studio-user869> Thank you very much, I will give this a try now
[13:07] <tarzeau> ubuntu-distro-info -af
[13:08] <tarzeau> good luck
[13:08] <tarzeau> what music software do you use mainly? what country from?
[13:08] <studio-user869> Rosegarden, Musescore, Ardour
[13:08] <studio-user869> US
[13:11] <studio-user869> And you?
[13:13] <studio-user869> you used "bionic", though the distro-info shows LTS "Bionic Beaver". Will "bionic" by itself work or do I need to include the entire string?
[13:13] <tarzeau> i have no idea of music, i just like to listen to music
[13:13] <tarzeau> my favourite music players are also trackers: hivelytracker, protracker, fasttracker2, cheesecutter
[13:13] <tarzeau> ubuntustudio doesn't want to ship them
[13:14] <tarzeau> bionic is the right thing to use
[13:14] <tarzeau> ubuntu-distro-info -ac
[13:14] <studio-user869> Ah, I see
[13:14] <studio-user869> thanks
[15:44] <studio-user831> I've started an upgrade of US 16.04 to 18.10, though ran into "no space left on disk" and it terminated with an error. I no longer can launch Thunar or Nemo to free up space as I get a "symbol lookup error" for each. Not finding much in the way of Ubuntu Studio specific advice in this area in regular Ubuntu forums. Is there a way for me to recover from this?
[15:45] <studio-user831> And yes, df shows my drive has 0% available
[15:45] <Eickmeyer> studio-user831: Join #ubuntu and see if anyone in there can help. That channel handles all Ubuntu flavors, and this one is definitely not an Ubuntu Studio-specific issue.
[15:46] <Eickmeyer> Ubuntu Studio _is_ Ubuntu, anything you found on the Ubuntu forums should help.
[15:47] <Eickmeyer> Unless you've added the KXStudio repos, which can mess things up pretty badly.
[15:48] <Eickmeyer> studio-user831: Also, upgrading from 16.04 directly to a non-LTS is generally considered a bad idea. You may have to completely reinstall.
[15:50] <studio-user831> Hmm, ok, I was advised here that upgrading to 18.10 would not be an issue. I'll shift over to the other forum, thanks
[15:54] <Eickmeyer> tarzeau: That was bad advice. Please try to stick with the standard "sudo do-release-upgrade" method. Manually switching the sources.list can be bad practice, and in the case of that user, it screwed up his system. Please stick to official Ubuntu methods if you're going to help.
 (Photo, 1920x1080) https://i.imgur.com/hSWYOzj.jpg
 I could not solve the problem of associating the audio output to the keyboard keys to adjust the volumes, I was also interested in having this possibility for the firewire sound card only through the ffado mixer, but I can only do it via the mouse
 (Photo, 1920x1080) https://i.imgur.com/xeFdnyi.jpg
 That the audio mixer in Xfce goes to whatever the default device is set to for PulseAudio, if that's what you mean.
 the funny thing is that the xfce mixer does not appear in the xfce editor
 (Photo, 1920x1080) https://i.imgur.com/ZMTgu2E.jpg
[17:03] <OvenWerks> It is not an xfce volume control it is a pulseaudio control and works through pavucontrol
 Try installing xfce-pulseaudio-plugin.
 (Photo, 1920x1080) https://i.imgur.com/rvwGatR.jpg
 it's a installed
 Okay, next step is to add it to the panel.
 in editor xfce ?
 ah, ok at the panel
 erich but already there is the icon of the audio settings in the upper right of the ubuntu studio panel
 (Photo, 1920x1080) https://i.imgur.com/7uBwx6i.jpg
 Yeah, I'm stumped.
 the problem is that the volume or pulse audio or ffado mixer works only through the use of the mouse
 This is probably true. Unless you have an external volume control or those other links I gave you helped, then what you're asking for might not be possible. Not all hardware is supported.
[17:35] <Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Any ideas on this one? I'm completely stumped.
[17:35] <Eickmeyer> Or anyone else in the channel?
[17:37] <Eickmeyer> @gennargiu I'm going to just throw this your way.
 I do not have any external drives to control the volume except the firewire maudio firewire sound card only
[17:37] <OvenWerks> build actkbd and find out what the keyboard is actually putting out?
[17:38] <Eickmeyer> !patience
[17:38] <OvenWerks> controlling firewire using faddo with keyboard will not likely happen except when pulse is bridged to jack
[17:39] <OvenWerks> compare with the same version of xubuntu
[17:40] <OvenWerks> if it doesn't work in xubuntu, it won't work studio either...
[17:41] <OvenWerks> I was hoping the keyboard settings might show the shortcuts
 first with cadence it worked, at least the management of the volumes of pulseaudio, those of ffado mixer I always had to manually adjust them
[17:43] <OvenWerks> Hmm, are you expecting to actually adjust the alsa controls or just the pulse level?
 (Photo, 1920x1080) https://i.imgur.com/9tvQoxb.jpg
[17:44] <OvenWerks> when jack owns the device pulse doesn't know about its controls and only controls the pulse level to jack
 only the mute key that works is detected on the keyboard
 I understood
[17:47] <OvenWerks> If you stop jack with ubuntustudio-controls does it start to work?
[17:47] <OvenWerks> (for your internal audio)
[17:49]  * OvenWerks notes that his wifes keyboard does still control the level.
 if i stop jack audio on ubuntu control,pulse audio is ok but keyboards volume don't recognized
[17:50] <OvenWerks> Good the problem is not -controls related.
 👍
[17:51] <OvenWerks> Another question... if you create another user, does the keyboard v control work for them?
[17:52] <Eickmeyer> For me, in order to get my keyboard volume controls to work in xfce, I have to execute "killall xfce4-volumed && xfce4-volumed" from the terminal.
[17:54] <OvenWerks> so does ok so does ps x |grep xfce4-vol*
[17:54] <OvenWerks> show anything?
[17:54] <OvenWerks> IE is it started on the affected system?
 when I used debian stretch with the kxstudio repository the volume adjustment keys, at least for pulse audio, worked, for the ffado mixer instead I always had to manually use the mouse except when I tried as distribution i gnu linux based on debian unstable where also the ffado mixer was regularly associated with the volume keys of
[17:55] <studiobot> the keyboard to be adjusted
[17:56] <OvenWerks> gennargiu is xfce4-volumed installed (and running) on your system?
 I do not have another user ... I'm just me as a user
 That's not what he was asking.
[17:58] <OvenWerks> gennargiu: I understand that. However, if you create another user temporarily and login to that user dose the KB vol controls work there?
 (Photo, 1920x1080) https://i.imgur.com/sWFFZqH.jpg
[17:59] <OvenWerks> gennargiu: good and the output of ps x |grep xfce4-vol*
 I must then try to create a new user and see if I have the same problems
 gennarogiugliano@gennarogiugliano-HP-Compaq-8200-Elite-SFF-PC:~$ ps x |grep xfce4-vol* …  1609 ?        Ssl    0:00 xfce4-volumed … 11576 pts/0    S+     0:00 grep --color=auto xfce4-vol* … gennarogiugliano@gennarogiugliano-HP-Compaq-8200-Elite-SFF-PC:~$
[18:01] <OvenWerks> so it _is_ running then
 👍
[18:02] <Eickmeyer> (that was a thumbs up, doesn't show in all fonts)
[18:03] <OvenWerks> irssi shows it
 Nice. Quassel doesn't.
[18:04] <OvenWerks> gennargiu: in settings->keyboard->Layout ... which keyboard is selected?
 generic 105-pc
 italien
 sh -c "pactl set-sink-mute 0 false ; pactl -- set-sink-volume 0 -1%" (Lower volume)
[18:07] <OvenWerks> my wifes KB is set to generic 105 and still works...
 h -c "pactl set-sink-mute 0 false ; pactl set-sink-volume 0 +1%" (raise volume)
 comand associate at volume - and + of my keybard
[18:10] <OvenWerks> OK, those get errors on my system
[18:10] <OvenWerks> Failed to get sink information: No such entity
[18:11] <OvenWerks> I wonder what the scroll wheel uses
 no, for manual  regolation volume ffado or pulseaudio i used mouse
[18:13] <OvenWerks> pactl set-sink-volume jack_out +1%
[18:13] <OvenWerks> works for me
 now I try to give the commands you wrote in the keyboard mapping
[18:15] <OvenWerks> pactl set-sink-volume @DEFAULT_SINK@ +1%
[18:15] <OvenWerks> would be better
 and to lower the volume the string to put which is?
[18:15] <OvenWerks> (and does work)
[18:15] <OvenWerks> use -1%
 ok
[18:17] <OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: pactl --help  gives this info
[18:18] <Eickmeyer> Good to know!
[18:18]  * Eickmeyer has made a resolution to use Xfce more
[18:18] <OvenWerks> That is not xfce dependant, it is a part of the pulseaudio package
[18:19] <Eickmeyer> True, but at least I can be more familiarized.
 i must restar computer or only stop and restart jack audio server ?
[18:20] <OvenWerks> if it doesn't just work... probably logout and in
 ok
[18:21] <OvenWerks> because you have only changed the kb mapping not audio setup
 then after the commands entered now the volume keys of the keyboard work and the volume can be adjusted in input and output. The only thing that does not work is the display of the functions both from the mixer volume of the audio pulse and from the ffado mixer
[18:29] <OvenWerks> I am not sure which display that is. ffado is not something I can comment on as I do not have a fw device
 (Photo, 1920x1080) https://i.imgur.com/AgeiXNH.jpg
 now regolation volume after insert comand in key map is ok,many thanks for help me......only problem is only visual volume but in the mixer photo is ok functionality
 ffado now is konnect at pulseaudio jack sync and after comand key map the regolation out a in audio is ok......only visual mixer i have a regolate manual for out and in audio maudio firewire solo 😊
[19:02]  * Eickmeyer is off to fix son's windowshade


[05:12] <cpaelzer> DD is released, are we really still in FF/DIF (for EE then) as stated by the topic?
[05:13] <cpaelzer> I know there usually is a lot of cleanup/copy going on to open it up fully, so I wonder if we can already upload EE fixes or not
[05:13] <cpaelzer> juliank: I checked the queues and saw https://launchpadlibrarian.net/420798523/lvm2_2.03.02-2ubuntu1_source.changes
[05:13] <cpaelzer> juliank: this is clearly no old upload that just now happens to build, so taking that as an example we should already be open then - is that correct?
[06:10] <doko> Odd_Bloke: it already is there, but I don't expect it to be there as "supported", because the release will be only in December
[06:31] <Kendos-Kenlen> Hi :)
[06:32] <Kendos-Kenlen> is it here I am supposed to ask questions about deb packaging ?
[06:42] <juliank> cpaelzer: yeah, lots of uploads happening already
[06:42] <juliank> cpaelzer: no toolchain changes early this cycle
[06:50] <cpaelzer> ok, thanks juliank
[06:50] <cpaelzer> that confirms what I saw in the queue
[09:12] <GunnarHj> jdstrand: Hi Jamie! I updated the im-config package and wonder if the patch https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/f8TxJTTY22/ is still useful. Actually, since Ubuntu 17.10 we have let GDM launch IBus, which in other words has been launched without the --address option. (Doing so was a hack to deal with an urgent IM issue before the 17.10 release.) With the latest im-config upload to eoan the patch again adds that --address option.
[11:02] <rbasak> ahasenack, cpaelzer, or maybe nacc or cjwatson: I need a peer review for https://code.launchpad.net/~racb/usd-importer/+git/usd-importer/+merge/366504 please, which should hopefully fix the importer.
[11:05] <cjwatson> LGTM
[11:05] <rbasak> Thanks :)
[11:43] <Wafficus> Hi there, I help out the Lubuntu team and I am wondering, who could I ask for help in terms of utilizing the Ubujtu Server ISO tester for use with Lubuntu isos?
[11:43] <Wafficus> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-server-iso-testing-dev/ubuntu-server-iso-testing/trunk
[11:47] <rbasak> Wafficus: paride might be able to help you, but he's out today
[11:51] <Wafficus> rbasak: gotcha at least i know who i can ask this week. thanks!
[11:58] <rbasak> Oh lovely, another bug.
[12:06] <rbasak> In [8]: [s.name for s in lp.distributions['debian'].series if s.active]
[12:06] <rbasak> Out[8]: [u'sid', u'stretch', u'jessie', u'wheezy']
[12:06] <rbasak> cjwatson: LP lists 'wheezy' as "active", so the importer is assuming it's available in the Debian apt archive, but wheezy is now gone from there.
[12:07] <rbasak> cjwatson: is the assumption valid, or do we need to now flag wheezy in Launchpad as inactive?
[12:07] <cjwatson> I need to consult on our process for that
[12:07] <cjwatson> Can you send me an email or open a ticket or something?
[12:08] <rbasak> Sure. Where should I open a ticket? Launchpad answers?
[12:08] <cpaelzer> rbasak: for the time being you might stip it from the returned list to get along right?
[12:08] <cjwatson> rbasak: Yeah
[12:08] <cjwatson> answers.launchpad.net/launchpad
[12:08] <rbasak> OK will do. I guess I can strip it from the returned list, though the "production" (experimental) importer runs from the snap, so hacking the code is a little painful.
[12:09] <rbasak> (I'll probably add a workaround to the code and deploy that for now)
[12:09] <cjwatson> We can probably just change the status since there are no publication records to change, but I don't want to accidentally break something that's complicated to unwind
[12:09] <rbasak> Sure. I appreciate this needs care.
[12:09] <rbasak> I'll add a workaround for now.
[12:15] <rbasak> cjwatson: https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/680444
[12:15] <cjwatson> ta
[12:44] <Odd_Bloke> doko: Thanks!
[14:35] <xnox> slashd, hey, so you are changing ceph from using openssl 1.0 to 1.1.1 in an SRU? i thought we agreed to fix build-dependencies and use openssl 1.0 in bionic, as it did before.
[14:36] <xnox> slashd, or does that not work for some reason?
[14:52] <rbasak> cpaelzer or ahasenack: may I have a quick review of https://code.launchpad.net/~racb/usd-importer/+git/usd-importer/+merge/366519 please? It's quite small. Hopefully this will be the final importer fix needed.
[14:53] <rbasak> (I'm triggering a CI run now)
[14:54] <cpaelzer> rbasak:  I'm taking a look
[14:54] <cpaelzer> oh I remember that fromt he discussion this morning
[14:54] <ahasenack> "Some seriess are listed a...." typo
[14:55] <cpaelzer> snake series
[14:55] <cpaelzer> ssss
[14:55] <rbasak> It's the plural of series
[14:55] <ahasenack> really?
[14:55] <rbasak> Not really English, but I'm not sure how to represent that better. It's a pattern I've used elsewhere in the codebase also.
[14:57] <cjwatson> LP uses serieses when it has no alternative, but it's awkward
[14:57] <cjwatson> and also not English
[14:58] <cjwatson> new rule: all terminology must have distinct singular/plural forms
[15:00] <ahasenack> rbasak: shouldn't that check be in self.active_series?
[15:05] <TJ-> shouldn't it be "series's" ?
[15:05] <cjwatson> Hell no
[15:06] <cjwatson> Plural is not possessive :)
[15:06] <TJ-> sorry, typo! "series' "
[15:06] <cjwatson> Even worse
[15:07] <cjwatson> The actual plural is just "series", but randomly adding a possessive doesn't make it any clearer (and is no use as an identifier anyway) ...
[15:07] <Odd_Bloke> It should be "series", but that doesn't really help. :p
[15:10] <TJ-> oh, so it should be "an array of series" then :)
[15:10] <TJ-> so "series[]"
[15:12] <rbasak> How about: serie's
[15:43] <Odd_Bloke> s/series/animal/g
[15:59] <rbasak> anima'l? :-P
[15:59] <rbasak> Also, Debian. wheezy, etc.
[16:00] <cpaelzer> char's then
[16:42] <slashd> xnox, actually it's the opposite, I'm switching from 1.1 to 1.0
[16:42] <xnox> slashd, ack, that's what i thought we agreed. let me reread the diff, the merge proposal looks odd, with many commits.
[16:42] <slashd> xnox, https://git.launchpad.net/~slashd/ubuntu/+source/ceph/commit/?id=8023c8cd12ac82c0f2ea76e0cd0ec796abd35307
[16:43] <xnox> slashd, this looks right!
[16:43] <slashd> jamespage fyi ^
[16:43] <xnox> slashd, does it build & work?
[16:43] <slashd> xnox, yes and tested with impacted users
[16:43] <xnox> slashd, but the changelog entry is bad.
[16:44] <slashd> xnox, I'm open to re-phrase it
[16:44] <rbasak> ahasenack: updated https://code.launchpad.net/~racb/usd-importer/+git/usd-importer/+merge/366519 (force push
[16:44] <rbasak> )
[16:44] <xnox> slashd, it should say "use openssl 1.0 at build and runtime, as it's incompatible with 1.1 abi"
[16:44] <xnox> slashd, cause you clearly did not fix incompatibility =)
[16:44] <slashd> xnox, yeah make more sense you are right
[16:45] <slashd> xnox, jamespage, so I'll SRU it if you guys are +1 on this (with the d/changelog modification)
[17:08] <slashd> xnox: https://git.launchpad.net/~slashd/ubuntu/+source/ceph/commit/?id=1abb386339c34bb793f1d7caa168930217724c71
[17:13] <ahasenack> rbasak: back
[17:15] <ahasenack> rbasak: is this change worth a test?
[17:15] <ahasenack> are there other tests around this area in the code? I haven't checked
[17:18] <rbasak> There aren't tests in this area of code currently.
[17:18] <ahasenack> k
[17:18] <rbasak> Hopefully the workaround will be gone very soon also.
[17:19]  * rbasak EODs
[17:19] <ahasenack> rbasak: +1
[17:20] <rbasak> Thanks!
[21:05] <ahasenack> hi, I was searching for the proper procedure to request that a package be removed from ubuntu, but couldn't find it. I filed a bug, but is there some team I should subscribe to it, like the release team perhaps?
[21:05] <ahasenack> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gadmin-samba/+bug/1826458
[21:12] <gQuigs> ahasenack: I think it could be added to this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArchiveAdministration .. unfortunately viewing subscribed bugs (linked from that page) for examples fails for me..  I end up just looking at one of my old removal bugs as an example like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar-record-activity/+bug/1558718
[21:13] <gQuigs> but archive admins get cleared after the removal... I guess
[21:14] <ahasenack> gQuigs: did you subscribe a team? I'm looking at your template bug
[21:15] <gQuigs> ahasenack: yup,. ubuntu-archive, but don't your bug won't qualify
[21:15] <gQuigs> 1 sec
[21:16] <ahasenack> it's the reverse-depends?
[21:16] <gQuigs> yup
[21:16] <ahasenack> it looks like the whole suite is obsolete
[21:16] <ahasenack> gadmintools
[21:17] <ahasenack> gadmintools is a metapackage
[21:18] <ahasenack> but thanks
[21:18] <ahasenack> I have to run
[21:18] <gQuigs> ahasenack: so it comes from Debian, you likely want to request removal from their first..
[23:02] <vorlon> ginggs: no we should not sync ttf-mscorefonts-installer
[23:04] <vorlon> ginggs: that bug wasn't on my radar but I'll have a look at it tomorrow, thanks (I'm out sick today)
[23:04] <sarnold> :(


[04:06] <pitti> Good morning
[04:15] <TheMuso> Hey pitti, how are you?
[04:25] <pitti> hey TheMuso! a bit tired still, but good, thanks! how about yourself?
[04:27] <TheMuso> pitti: Not too bad thanks, glad to have air conditioning here today, 40+ degrees in Sydney, can't wait for the southerly cool change so I can open my windows again. :)
[04:27] <pitti> urgh, steaming
[04:27] <TheMuso> Pretty much.
[04:33] <pitti> Laney: meh, more weird MemoryErrors and segfaults -- time to reboot this box
[04:33] <pitti> Laney: maybe the piled up ksplices eventually made the kernel's head explode
[05:51] <darkxst> pitti, how did this manage to migrate through proposed? bug 1518035
[05:52] <pitti> darkxst: we don't do upgrade tests as part of proposed-migration
[05:52] <pitti> apparently a fresh install works
[05:57] <darkxst> pitti, right that makes sense
[06:06] <didrocks> good morning
[06:14] <pitti> bonjour didrocks !
[06:20] <hikiko> Morning !
[06:27] <didrocks> good morning pitti, hikiko!
[06:39] <pitti> Laney: dbus tests are reeeeally unhappy, the root tests keep timing out
[06:39]  * pitti cancels the currently running ones, no point
[06:52] <seb128> good morning desktopers
[06:52] <seb128> hey didrocks, pitti
[06:52] <seb128> pitti, Laney is off today :-/
[06:52] <pitti> bonjour seb128 !
[06:52] <seb128> though I would not be surprised if he reads IRC
[06:57] <didrocks> re seb128
[06:58] <didrocks> Laney: preventively: "go away"! :)
[08:04] <pitti> ok, that should have cleared a lot of -proposed stuff
[08:06] <seb128> pitti, "that"?
[08:07] <pitti> seb128: retrying tests, adding hints, retrying some failed builds
[08:07] <seb128> ah, ok
[08:07] <pitti> a lot of arm64 builds failed in a weird way
[08:07]  * seb128 wonders what transitions is the solid block at the bottom of update_output
[08:07] <pitti> seb128: and bringing moah powah to my clouds, so the queues finally cleared up \o/
[08:08] <pitti> seb128: isn't that just the concatenation of everything it tries to migrate?
[08:08] <pitti> that "autohinter" thing
[08:08] <seb128> does it always does that?
[08:09] <pitti> there's certainly a bunch of valid candidates which wait for finishing lib transitions, like imobiledevice
[08:09] <seb128> libimobiledevice seems to miss a upower rebuild
[08:10] <seb128> pitti, did you have any content to include for that one or should we go for a no change?
[08:10] <pitti> ah, easy; want me to, or are you on it?
[08:10] <seb128> I can do it
[08:10] <pitti> heh
[08:10] <seb128> just wanted to check if you had actually patches pending or something
[08:10] <pitti> seb128: I suppose your "upload a no-change rebuild" script is as good as everyone else's :)
[08:10] <seb128> doing it then ;-)
[08:11] <pitti> cheers
[08:11] <seb128> yw!
[08:21] <larsu> happy Friday!
[08:21] <seb128> hey larsu, happy friday!
[08:21] <seb128> wie gehts?
[08:23] <Trevinho> morning
[08:27] <seb128> hey Trevinho!
[08:27] <Trevinho> hey seb128
[08:28] <seb128> how are you?
[08:28] <larsu> seb128: gut danke. und idr?
[08:28] <larsu> *dir
[08:28] <didrocks> happy Friday larsu, Trevinho!
[08:28] <larsu> hi Trevinho! Sup?
[08:28] <seb128> larsu, auch gut, danke :-)
[08:28] <larsu> bonjour didrocks
[08:38] <Trevinho> hi larsu .... Trying to fix my broken head... :-/
[08:40] <larsu> Trevinho: oh what's up?
[08:42] <Trevinho> larsu: still the same.... I've not been able to fix myself yet. Trying to fight with nightly panic attacks.
[08:42] <larsu> Trevinho: sorry to hear. All the best!
[08:42] <Trevinho> larsu: thanks
[08:43] <pitti> hey larsu!
[08:43] <pitti> hello Trevinho
[08:43]  * seb128 just spent ~1.5 hours going through the 300 or so "most recently changed" bugs on launchpad, enough triaging for today
[08:44] <seb128> (trying to do a bit of that every day since wily to keep on top of new issues reported/important ones)
[08:44] <larsu> morgen pitti! Wie gehts?
[08:44] <Trevinho> hi pitti
[08:44] <larsu> seb128: good work! Thanks
[08:44] <pitti> larsu: prima, danke!
[08:44] <seb128> :-)
[08:45] <seb128> shotwell is another unhappy program because of the glib file monitor improvements :-/
[08:45] <seb128> segfault when editing photos with an external editor
[08:45]  * pitti hugs seb128
[08:46]  * seb128 hugs pitti back
[08:49] <larsu> seb128: "improvements"
[08:50] <seb128> larsu, yeah :-)
[08:52]  * didrocks will not get the card of backward compatibility in term of behaviors :p
[08:52] <larsu> didrocks: that would mean we could never fix behaviour bugs
[08:52] <larsu> there's a balance
[08:52] <larsu> but yeah ... this situation is breaking all kinds of things
[08:53] <didrocks> larsu: well, some frameworks do that and add new calls
[08:53] <didrocks> or flags to enable the new "fixed" behavior
[08:53] <didrocks> larsu: the extreme would be to fix "this" in javascript for instance :p
[08:53] <didrocks> it's the kind of things we do, and thus, the result in crashing apps…
[08:56] <larsu> indeed
[08:56] <larsu> like I say, it's a balance :)
[08:58] <larsu> seb128: which nautilus version do you need the menubar patch for? Will we stay on 3.14?
[08:58] <seb128> larsu, 3.18
[08:58] <larsu> nice :)
[08:58] <seb128> larsu, no, if we were to stay on 3.14 we wouldn't need a patch since that has a menubar :p
[08:58] <larsu> not for me :/
[08:58] <seb128> well or at least our package has one
[08:59] <seb128> but it's built on old code
[08:59] <larsu> ah, restart
[08:59] <seb128> which got rewriten to use moder gaction, etc
[08:59] <larsu> weird
[08:59] <larsu> right right
[09:06] <larsu> woah, got asked about which login manager I want to use, again
[09:12] <larsu> and I need to restart nautilus after logging in before I have correct fonts or the global menubar
[09:12]  * larsu blames xsettings not being there from the beginning
[09:12] <didrocks> pitti: do you know well how subprocess and os.environ interacts? I'm really puzzled on some weird behaviors when running tests…
[09:14] <larsu> hm firefox theme as well
[09:14] <larsu> is anyone else seeing this?
[09:20] <seb128> larsu, I don't
[09:20] <seb128> but I didn't upgrade yet today
[09:22] <happyaron> where is the latest snappy image?
[09:25] <seb128> happyaron, #snappy should know
[09:37] <pitti> didrocks: normally the spawned process should inherit the parent's env, unless you explicitly set env=
[09:37] <happyaron> seb128: thanks, :)
[09:37] <didrocks> pitti: agreed, it's not what happens here though
[09:38] <didrocks> pitti: I have reduced it to few lines, and it behaves different if I have one test class or multiple…
[09:56] <didrocks> pitti: if you have a minute, I have a gist to reproduce the issue: https://gist.github.com/didrocks/ae12d61138090b837c18
[09:57] <pitti> didrocks: oh, are you sure that assigning the whole os.environ array works?
[09:58] <pitti> didrocks: I'm not sure, but I faintly remember having run into this before too
[09:58] <pitti> didrocks: untested, but can you try instead:
[09:58] <didrocks> pitti: it does from the output, like the output doesn't contain http_proxy for instance
[09:58] <pitti> os.environ.clear()
[09:58] <pitti> os.environ.update(self.original_env)
[09:58] <didrocks> ah
[09:59] <didrocks> pitti: but it's still weird that a impacts b, isn't it?
[09:59] <pitti> i. e. keep the os.environ dict object itself unchanged, but only change its keys
[09:59] <didrocks> let me try
[09:59] <didrocks> (I can see that SHELL is restored though)
[10:00] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, it passes now :)
[10:00] <didrocks> I'm still unsure what happens under the hood though
[10:00] <didrocks> ohhhhhhh, I see
[10:00] <didrocks> so, what happens is that subprocess still reference os.environ, the original one
[10:00] <pitti> didrocks: os.environ is "magic" -- changing the reference to a different object apparenlty loses that magic
[10:00] <didrocks> not the one we replaced
[10:00] <pitti> and you assign it to a normal "dumb" dict
[10:01] <pitti> right
[10:01] <pitti> you shouldn't change the object itself (i. e. the reference to it)
[10:01] <didrocks> that's why it still got the env variable only if a ran
[10:01] <didrocks> happened before*
[10:01] <didrocks> pitti: it all makes sense now :)
[10:01] <didrocks> thanks a bunch, I was really fighting on that one (first, to reduce at that state)
[10:02] <didrocks> and so, if I only ran b, there was no issue, because I didn't touch os.environ assignement before
[10:02] <didrocks> still weird that in this magic, when I changed b, it was changing the new os.environ that I assigned
[10:02] <didrocks> but subprocess keeps using the old os.environ
[10:02] <didrocks> even if not called before
[10:03] <pitti> self.original_env = os.environ.copy()
[10:03] <pitti> didrocks: ^ maybe the .copy() just returns an ordinary dict, not the special "magic" one that actually calls setenv()?
[10:03] <pitti> but I don't know for sure
[10:04] <didrocks> pitti: that would make sense, indeed
[10:04] <pitti> just as far as "never assign os.environ", got burned and only remembered the "don't do that then"
[10:04] <didrocks> so we don't have anymore _Environ
[10:04] <didrocks> and so, it doesn't setenv()
[10:04] <didrocks> ahah :)
[10:04] <didrocks> pitti: rightly noted now!
[10:04] <didrocks> thanks a lot
[10:04]  * didrocks hugs pitti
[10:05] <pitti> de rien !
[10:26] <Laney> pitti: ERROR:../../test/uid-permissions.c:129:test_uae: assertion failed (dbus_message_get_type (m) == DBUS_MESSAGE_TYPE_METHOD_RETURN): (3 == 2) <- there's a related UpdateActivationEnvironment change in this release - check with smcv?
[10:26] <Laney> might be that this should fail now
[10:27] <Laney> (3 is error)
[10:32] <seb128> hey Laney
[10:37] <Laney> hi seb128
[10:37]  * Laney is looking at cake recipes
[10:37] <Laney> what's up?
[10:37] <seb128> how did the cake go?
[10:37] <Laney> not made yet
[10:37] <seb128> oh, not done yet :-)
[10:37] <seb128> new gtk migrated!
[10:38] <Laney> so I saw
[10:38] <Laney> yay cloud
[10:40] <Laney> someone can follow up with that dbus thing if they want or I can look on monday
[10:46] <seb128> if somebody things it's urgent I can have a look
[10:46] <seb128> otherwise I think it can wait monday
[10:51] <Laney> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=93036
[10:51]  * Laney goes to buy more ingredients now
[10:51] <Laney> later!
[10:51] <seb128> Laney, have fun!
[10:52] <seb128> oh, good, libimobiledevice transition went through
[10:52] <Sweet5hark> hmmm, no will.cooke in here today?
[10:52] <seb128> he said he would swap the morning
[10:52] <seb128> he should be there after lunch
[10:52] <seb128> speaking of lunch I start being hungry ;-)
[10:53]  * didrocks does as well, going out for lunch, see you later guys :)
[10:53] <seb128> didrocks, enjoy!
[10:53] <didrocks> thanks, you too seb128
[11:25] <pitti> Laney: FYI, memory errors seem to be real; committed https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-release/+git/autopkgtest-cloud/commit/?id=17776035 and will re-deploy once the queue settled down
[12:26] <desrt> hello desktop-types.  i hope you are having a good morning.
[12:40] <seb128> hey desrt, happy friday!
[12:40] <desrt> indeed!
[13:56] <didrocks> phew, all tests passed, finally! :p
[13:56] <pitti> didrocks: \o/
[13:57] <didrocks> pitti: thanks again! And with the large tests refactoring, I divided the testing time by two!
[13:57] <didrocks> (~50 minutes vs 1h40)
[13:57] <pitti> wow
[14:14]  * didrocks celebrated with pushing 3 new tests
[14:51] <didrocks> tkamppeter: hey, why is hplip depending on pexpect? It seems just to be for testing, right? So build-dep, but not runtime dep?
[14:52] <didrocks> hum, seems that hplip has a pexpect embeeded version…
[14:53] <didrocks> and the dep was added in 2009 with the idea of removing the embeeded version
[14:53] <didrocks> which wasn't done in 5 years :p
[14:53] <didrocks> 6*
[14:54] <didrocks> ok, they are using pexpect in utils.py for handling some subprocess and giving password and such to it (urgh)
[14:56] <tkamppeter> didrocks, this is not done by me but by the Debian folks, perhaps a Debian bug should get reported.
[14:56] <didrocks> tkamppeter: mind opening one? are you maintaining this stack as well? :)
[14:56] <didrocks> tkamppeter: sounds like this kind of things shouldn't even be in main
[14:57] <didrocks> maybe I should ask for some security team review, but passing password to subprocess sounds like something I would have kicked the MIR out
[15:02] <didrocks> seb128: mind creating a https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/ubuntu-make-builddeps ppa?
[15:02] <didrocks> I want to ensure that testing/build-deps are not installed on user's machine if they add the ubuntu make ppa
[15:03] <didrocks> (like… pexpect that we install by default :/)
[15:03] <seb128> didrocks, done
[15:03] <didrocks> thanks!
[15:05] <seb128> yw!
[15:18] <didrocks> Sweet5hark: it seems that willcooke is here. I think you were looking for him ^
[15:18] <didrocks> btw, good morning willcooke :-)
[15:18] <willcooke> morning
[15:31] <Sweet5hark> heya! :)
[15:32] <Sweet5hark> willcooke: was just wondering about the lack of feedback on the 2oitg thing ... but I assume, if this is "morning" you are sprinting somewhere in the US?
[15:32] <willcooke> Sweet5hark, just swapped some hours this week
[15:33] <willcooke> Sweet5hark, seen you mail, but not digested it yet
[16:29] <attente> how does someone grep the archive?
[16:31] <didrocks> attente: what do you mean, grepping through all the sources ?
[16:32] <attente> didrocks: yeah. i think Laney had a web interface for it, but the url doesn't work any more
[16:32] <didrocks> attente: oh, I don't know about a web interface. archive admins can grep directly in the source file system, but that's it
[16:33] <didrocks> attente: if you only look for file names, though, you can do it throuh a web interface
[16:34] <attente> didrocks: could you do a couple greps for me? i'm looking for QT_IM_MODULE and maliitphablet
[16:34] <didrocks> attente: quite late to do that (I'm leaving in ~10 minutes), could do on Monday for sure
[16:34] <didrocks> or if seb128 is still there for some times, he might (or wait for Laney if he thinks there is a web interface)
[16:34] <attente> ah, ok, sure. have a good w.e!
[16:35] <didrocks> thanks (not left yet, but soon) ;)
[16:35] <seb128> I don't know of an handy way no
[16:35] <seb128> jdstrand had a script I think
[16:35] <seb128> Laney had a https://codesearch.debian.net/ equivalent up somewhere
[16:35] <seb128> but unsure if that's still a thing
[16:36] <attente> yeah, i think it used to be http://ubuntu-codesearch.surgut.co.uk/, but it hasn't been online in a while
[16:54]  * didrocks goes, see you on Monday guys!
[16:54] <willcooke> see ya didrocks
[16:54] <didrocks> have a good week-end willcooke :)
[17:09] <seb128> have a good w.e!
[17:11] <willcooke> see ya seb128
[17:11] <seb128> see you on monday ;-)
[17:19] <Trevinho> guys, have nice weekend !
[17:20] <willcooke> see ya Trevinho
[17:20] <Trevinho> willcooke: see u
[19:13] <willcooke> g'night


[12:21] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90500 in malone "Project group Bugs page has no link for reporting a bug" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90500
[12:23] <mooey> howdy. i'm trying to push bug 88158 upstream, but launchpad doesn't seem to have an upstream product for ontv
[12:23] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 88158 in ontv "[feisty]  OnTV does not show 24-hour clock properly" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/88158 - Assigned to Chris Rose (chris-vault5)
[12:24] <mooey> the bugs are tracked in gnome bugzilla, not sure what to do about that
[12:24] <mpt> mooey, you could register the ontv product in Launchpad yourself
[12:25] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90502 in launchpad "class="highlight" and class="highlighted" shouldn't coexist" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90502
[12:28] <mooey> mpt, done :-) ty
[12:29] <mpt> and let Launchpad know that it uses bugzilla.gnome.org as it's bugtracker
[12:29] <lifeless> barry: ping
[12:29] <barry> lifeless: pong
[12:29] <lifeless> did you see my note yesterday about spamming from your server in response to bugs ?
[12:30] <lifeless> I have the mail sent out which I can forward you if you want
[12:30] <lifeless> it starts out 'This is an automated response.  I have received your message, but'
[12:30] <barry> i've gotten quite a few messages on that, but i don't remember yours specifically ;)
[12:30] <barry> a couple of things:
[12:31] <barry> this is really caused by a (reported bug) in lp because it doesn't add Precedence: bulk header to outgoing messages.  it should, and that would prevent the replybot from replying.  i think you'd get the same spam from someone who used vacation on a subscribed address.
[12:32] <lifeless> well, I'm not ascribing blame
[12:32] <barry> until that bug gets fixed (but maybe permanently anyway) i've switched my contact address to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>so no more replybot
[12:32] <lifeless> I just dont want users reporting bugs in bzr to get this response
[12:32] <lifeless> ok thats cool, thanks.
[12:32] <barry> lifeless: no, me neither, but it's a good thing for lp to add that header for the future
[12:33] <barry> np!  i know that'll make the 10 or so people who pinged me today about that happy :)
[12:33] <kiko> barry, hey, I'll r= a patch which adds that header. I hear you have pqm access!
[12:33] <barry> kiko: friday /is/ coming up soon :)
[12:34] <kiko> it all adds up
[12:34] <barry> this'll be a fun one for FiF!
[12:37] <lifeless> mpt: btw, for the evo guys, there is an answer to their response 'be generous in what you accept'
[12:37] <lifeless> founding concept in the IETF
[12:37] <mpt> lifeless, yes, Postel's Law
[12:37] <mpt> I've been trying to think of a nice way of putting it, though
[12:38] <lifeless> bluntly I think
[12:38] <mpt> i.e. one that actually gets the bug fixed in Evolution instead of just irritating them :-)
[12:38] <lifeless> :)
[03:00] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90534 in launchpad-bazaar ""Related Branch" table in confusing location with confusing data and confusing columns" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90534
[03:40] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90537 in launchpad-bazaar "add action "import to Bazaar"" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90537
[04:26] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90545 in launchpad "beta.launchpad.net doesn't display correctly in IE7" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90545
[04:32] <asepn> ngbrol
[04:40] <asepn> exit
[06:11] <jml> RAOF_: hi
[06:46] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90561 in launchpad "Broken link to "Register a spec"" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90561
[06:48] <RAOF> jml: Hi.
[07:22] <Hobbsee> wow, a fair few bugs for malone there
[07:22] <Hobbsee> and launchpad
[09:14] <carlos_> morning
[11:20] <Ubugtu> New bug: #44390 in malone "Bug number entries should allow "#n"" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/44390
[12:33] <ddaa> Good morning.
[12:51] <cprov> morning folks
[12:54] <Hobbsee> hey cprov
[12:54] <cprov> Hobbsee: hi there
[12:55] <statik> morning
[12:56] <bac> hello
[12:56] <cprov> Before you start to complain about me and delays in my emails, let me blame my oddness and warn that I won't have emails back for the next 4 hours (my server link is broken).
[01:00] <SteveA> Welcome to this week's Launchpad developers' meeting.  For the next 45 minutes we'll be coordinating and reporting on the state of Launchpad development.
[01:00] <SteveA> Who is here today?
[01:00] <cprov> me
[01:00] <danilos> me
[01:00] <BjornT> me
[01:00] <barry> me
[01:00] <bac> me
[01:00] <matsubara> me
[01:00] <statik> me
[01:00] <sinzui> maybe me
[01:00] <salgado> me
[01:00] <mpt> me
[01:00] <mrevell> me
[01:00] <flacoste> me
[01:01] <ddaa> here
[01:01] <ddaa> jml not here but ddaa is
[01:01] <ddaa> thumper not here but ddaa is
[01:01] <danilos> carlos?
[01:01] <SteveA> ddaa: are you acting as the envoy for the bzr launchpad team?
[01:01] <carlos> me
[01:01] <SteveA> spiv sends apologies
[01:01] <ddaa> SteveA: yes
[01:01] <danilos> stu1?
[01:01] <heno> me
[01:01] <SteveA> thanks ddaa
[01:02] <SteveA> matsubara: kiko still out biking?
[01:03] <bigjools> me
[01:03] <cprov> bigjools: welcome to your first lp meeting
[01:03] <matsubara> SteveA: jus tarrived
[01:03] <jamesh> me
[01:03] <SteveA> welcome bigjools!
[01:03] <bigjools> hello!
[01:03] <barry> welcome bigjools
[01:03] <SteveA> welcome sinzui
[01:03] <stu1> me
[01:03] <stub> and me
[01:03] <barry> welcome sinzui
[01:03] <kiko-afk> me
[01:03] <cprov> sinzui: welcome dude !
[01:03] <salgado> welcome bigjools and sinzui!
[01:04] <mrevell> welcome :)
[01:04] <bac> welcome guys
[01:04] <bigjools> thanks all!
[01:04] <SteveA> == Agenda ==
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Roll call
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Agenda
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Next meeting
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Activity reports
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Actions from last meeting
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Oops report (Matsubara)
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Bug report (mpt)
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Bug tags
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Production and staging (Stuart)
[01:04] <SteveA>  * Launchpad 1.0 status reports
[01:05] <SteveA>  * Sysadmin requests
[01:05] <SteveA> ----
[01:05] <SteveA>  * A top user-affecting issue (mrevell)
[01:05] <SteveA>  * Launchpad buzz report (mrevell)
[01:05] <SteveA>  * (other items)
[01:05] <SteveA> ----
[01:05] <SteveA>  * Three sentences
[01:05] <SteveA>
[01:05] <SteveA> next meeting...
[01:05] <SteveA> Now that we have the bzr launchpad team having a separate meeting, accounting for almost all of the australasians
[01:05] <SteveA> and we have more people more to the west
[01:05] <mpt> uh oh
[01:06] <SteveA> I want to look at having the weekly launchpad meeting at a different time
[01:06] <kiko> wow, really?
[01:06] <SteveA> I'll talk with mpt and stub about this after the meeting
[01:06] <SteveA> and jamesh, as they are the most easterly people here
[01:07] <danilos> SteveA: where's that Wiki page which had a table of what time suits everybody?
[01:07] <SteveA> for now, same time next week please
[01:07] <jamesh> westerly, actually
[01:07] <SteveA>  * Activity reports
[01:07] <stub> Up to date
[01:07] <jamesh> oops.  stub and me are the most westerly of the australians
[01:07] <SteveA> I suck, again.  Who can report perfect activity reporting today?
[01:07] <mpt> up to date
[01:07] <kiko> no
[01:07] <jamesh> not up to date
[01:07] <danilos> up to date
[01:07] <bac> up to date
[01:07] <ddaa> here
[01:07] <ddaa> jml not here but ddaa is
[01:07] <ddaa> thumper not here but ddaa is
[01:07] <BjornT> up to date
[01:08] <flacoste> up to date
[01:08] <ddaa> oops
[01:08] <ddaa> up to date
 up to date
 up to date
[01:08] <barry> up to date
[01:08] <matsubara> not up to date
[01:08] <cprov> not up to date (again)
[01:08] <salgado> up to date
[01:08] <SteveA> spiv: My activity reports are up to date.
[01:08] <sinzui> up to date
[01:08] <statik> up to date (just sent missing reports)
[01:08] <SteveA> or rather:
 My activity reports are up to date.
[01:08] <bigjools> kinda up to date if you ignore the potentially very boring ones I'd be doing for my first few days :)
[01:08] <mrevell> up to date
[01:08] <matsubara> danilos: https://launchpad.canonical.com/MeetingTimes
[01:10] <danilos> matsubara: thanks
[01:10] <SteveA> on the notes for the last meeting, I have:
[01:10] <SteveA> == People who were lax with activity reporting last week ==
[01:10] <SteveA>  * carlos
[01:10] <SteveA>  * cprov
[01:10] <SteveA>  * danilos
[01:10] <SteveA>  * jamesh
[01:10] <SteveA>  * kiko
[01:10] <SteveA>  * stub
[01:10] <SteveA>  * SteveA
[01:10] <SteveA> (mpt, I should be on that list too)
[01:11] <danilos> SteveA: do you want to ask "new" people like mrevell, bigjools, statik, sinzui to fill the table at https://launchpad.canonical.com/MeetingTimes so you can better decide when to hold a meeting?
[01:11] <mpt> SteveA, you weren't there to say whether you were up to date or not, so I gave you the benefit of the doubt :-)
[01:11] <SteveA> mpt: ok, thanks :-)
[01:11] <SteveA> carlos: please do send those couple of days
[01:11] <barry> danilos: i'll fill out a row after this meeting
[01:11] <mrevell> danilos: same here
[01:11] <SteveA> cprov: please start again today
[01:12] <bac> danilos: me too
[01:12] <carlos> steveA: Will do, yes
[01:12] <SteveA> danilos: well done for being up to date this week
[01:12] <danilos> barry: thanks (and sorry for missing you and bac out, there are a lot of new people in the team :))
[01:12] <SteveA> jamesh: please send a summary report today
[01:12] <jamesh> okay
[01:12] <SteveA> kiko: you know what to do ;-)
[01:12] <cprov> SteveA: sure, as soon as I can get my emails again (within 2 or 3 hours)
[01:12] <barry> danilos: no problem! it's kind of like getting carded, but maybe in reverse :)
[01:12] <SteveA> stub: well done for getting up to date
[01:12] <SteveA> SteveA: you suck ;-)
[01:13] <SteveA> everyone else, well done.
[01:13] <SteveA>  * Actions from last meeting
[01:14] <SteveA>  * '''jamesh''' and '''BjornT''' to agree on a proper fix to the problem of unregistered subscribers to imported bug reports
[01:14] <SteveA>  * '''SteveA''' and '''mpt''' to have a UI catchup
[01:14] <mpt> we did
[01:14] <SteveA> great
[01:14] <SteveA> spiv mailed me to say:
[01:14] <SteveA> Oh, and regarding the action item for bug 86171 (if there is one, I forget):
[01:14] <SteveA> I've updated the bug.  There's a very very weird problem I've encountered in
[01:14] <Ubugtu> Bug 86171 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/86171 is private
[01:14] <SteveA> writing the test for it.
[01:14] <SteveA>
[01:14] <SteveA> jamesh, BjornT ?
[01:15] <BjornT> jamesh and i haven't agreed to a proper fix yet
[01:15] <jamesh> I think the correct course of action is to verify the created accounts from the schooltool import
[01:15] <BjornT> jamesh: can you respond to the relevant e-mails? or should we have a call or something?
[01:15] <SteveA> I guess this is quite important to fix before the zope import
[01:16] <BjornT> if it's possible, i'd prefer if the imported users could be verified, though.
[01:16] <jamesh> and do the same for the zope import.  Then decide what should be done.
[01:16] <SteveA> what's it to be:  a call, or responding to emails?
[01:16] <jamesh> I'll respond to the email.
[01:16] <SteveA> cool
[01:16] <BjornT> SteveA: well, if jamesh is happy with verifying the users that's ok with me.
[01:16] <SteveA> that's all the meeting actions from last week
[01:16] <jamesh> BjornT: we can identify the created accounts via the creation rationale
[01:16] <SteveA>  * Oops report (Matsubara)
[01:16] <matsubara> Today's oops report is about bug 90386 and yesterday's timeouts.
[01:16] <Ubugtu> Bug 90386 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/90386 is private
[01:16] <matsubara> I welcome developers to comment on bug 90386. It's a private bug, so I'm not sure if it's ok to discuss it here.
[01:17] <matsubara> Yesterday we had lots of complains about launchpad timing out. Checking today's report, we can see a huge increase in the number of timeouts on production and beta. The majority of those timeouts are on gangotri (production1 - oops prefix A). lifeless checked the production servers yesterday and told me that rosetta import was chewing up loads of cpu time and re-niced it. stub, was this the cause behind those time outs?
[01:17] <stub> no idea. if so, it wouldn't explain the similar timeouts from gandwana.
[01:18] <matsubara> indeed, so it's probably something else.
[01:18] <stub> If it is poimport, they may go away as of a few hours ago with the last rosetta cherry pick.
[01:18] <kiko> lifeless also reniced the script
[01:19] <matsubara> stub: is it possible to find something out looking at those machines logs?
[01:19] <kiko> which may have helped
[01:19] <carlos> stub: please ,renice it again as we killed it
[01:19] <carlos> just in case
[01:19] <stub> (from my production report) Some odd timeouts are appearing on beta, with requests reported as having 20+ seconds of non-SQL time. If the reports are accurate, I have no idea what to blame for this apart from the Launchpad code as they are happening on both servers and the only common code on both is Launchpad (production and beta).
[01:19] <SteveA> maybe, like, we should run scripts on a different machine than app servers?
[01:20] <SteveA> stub: possible the servers were swapping?
[01:20] <SteveA> or had IO starvation?
[01:20] <stub> If the app servers stopped accepting connections when they got loaded, it wouldn't matter due to the load balancer.
[01:21] <stub> Not that I can tell. I'm no Linux expert though.
[01:21] <SteveA> stub: please ask the admins to check their logs
[01:21] <ddaa> had a lot of overruns on the branch scanner tonight (running on gandwana), might be load, or might be mplayer and samba imports going through.
[01:21] <stub> SteveA: check their logs for what?
[01:22] <stub> oh... io starvation, swap etc.
[01:22] <SteveA> to see if the servers in question had any issues
[01:23] <SteveA> matsubara: anything more on the oops report?
[01:24] <matsubara> done here SteveA, thanks.
[01:24] <SteveA> thanks matsubara
[01:24] <SteveA>  * Bug report (mpt)
[01:24] <mpt> There are 2146 known bugs in Launchpad without released fixes. The first seven by importance are:
[01:24] <mpt>  * Bug #46982 (Need to support KDE like plural forms), Critical, Confirmed, carlos
[01:24] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46982 in rosetta "Need to support KDE like plural forms" [Critical,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/46982 - Assigned to Carlos Perell Marn (carlos)
[01:24] <mpt> carlos, is this still blocked on Firefox support? If so, what is the next step for that? Does it have a bug number?
[01:24] <mpt>  * Bug #30602 (Timeout errors in +translate), Critical, In Progress, kiko
[01:24] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 30602 in rosetta "Timeout errors in +translate" [Critical,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/30602 - Assigned to Christian Reis (kiko)
[01:24] <mpt> kiko, last week you said you'd look at the Oops report to see whether your changes had fixed the problem. Did they?
[01:24] <stub> carlos: reniced, and crontab updated too
[01:24] <mpt>  * Bug #85519 (Appserver leaving 'IDLE in transaction' connection open on launch), Critical, Confirmed, stub
[01:24] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 85519 in launchpad "Appserver leaving 'IDLE in transaction' connection open on launch" [Critical,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85519 - Assigned to Stuart Bishop (stub)
[01:24] <kiko> mpt, they seem to have been made worse!
[01:24] <mpt> stub, any progress on this so far this week?
[01:24] <stub> nope
[01:24] <danilos> mpt: yes, but carlos and myself switched tasks
[01:25] <carlos> mpt: I took over Firefox branch
[01:25] <mpt> kiko, are you sure, or have they been swamped by the general timeout problems?
[01:25] <danilos> mpt: so, I'll be working on that after all, and carlos will finish the ff stuff so we don't get stuck on my getting bored with ff branch
[01:25] <kiko> mpt, it's hard to tell tbh; let's see danilo's change
[01:25] <carlos> it's faster to finish the bits remaining there instead of extract the infrastructure
[01:25] <mpt> danilos, so 46982 should be assigned to you?
[01:25] <carlos> stub: cool, thanks
[01:25] <mpt> kiko, "danilo's change"?
[01:25] <mpt> stub, ok, thanks for the update
 Re: ~vcs-imports/+registered-branches Oops, the branch refactoring has landed on rocketfuel which batches these views.  I didn't think it was worth the  effort backporting to production due to it only effecting robots.
[01:26] <mpt>  * Bug #86171 (private), Critical, Confirmed, spiv, who's not here
[01:26] <Ubugtu> Bug 86171 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/86171 is private
[01:26] <carlos> mpt: danilo applied a small performance improvement change
[01:26] <danilos> mpt: that's right, I'll reassign it
[01:26] <mpt> ok, thanks danilos
[01:26] <mpt>  * Bug #84361 (New translation form is too-wide), Critical, Fix Committed, carlos
[01:26] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 84361 in rosetta "New translation form is too-wide" [Critical,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84361 - Assigned to Carlos Perell Marn (carlos)
[01:26] <mpt> carlos, did you succeed in getting a cherrypick?
[01:26] <mpt> ah, you've updated it, thanks :-)
[01:26] <mpt>  * Bug #90384 (private), Critical, Confirmed, unassigned
[01:26] <Ubugtu> Bug 90384 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/90384 is private
[01:26] <mpt> Who should take this one? It's about Oops reports, so I guess jamesh?
[01:26] <carlos> mpt: yeah, and I already closed the bug (but too late to remove it from your list ;-)
[01:27] <mpt>  * Bug #44 (Translations should be searchable), High, Confirmed, danilos
[01:27] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 44 in rosetta "Translations should be searchable" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/44 - Assigned to   (danilo)
[01:27] <mpt> danilos, will you have time to start this this week?
[01:27] <mpt> Poor Rosetta developers, they're always swamped
[01:28] <danilos> mpt: I doubt it, and since it will require db changes, I'll first have to discuss that with SteveA and kiko
[01:28] <mpt> danilos, ok
[01:28] <jamesh> mpt: I'll handle it.
[01:28] <mpt> thanks james
[01:28] <mpt> h
[01:28] <jamesh> (90384, that is)
[01:28] <mpt> That's all SteveA
[01:28] <SteveA> thanks mpt!
[01:28] <SteveA>  * Bug tags
[01:29] <SteveA> there are no proposed tags this week
[01:29] <SteveA>  * Production and staging (Stuart)
[01:29] <stub> Production systems running as normal. All pending cherry pick requests where rolled out a hour or three ago. Rosetta imports are hopefully going faster now.
[01:29] <stub> beta has been running solidly - running HEAD code is working surprisingly well, and I think we have our test suite to thank for that.
[01:29] <stub> Some odd timeouts are appearing on beta, with requests reported as having 20+ seconds of non-SQL time. If the reports are accurate, I have no idea what to blame for this apart from the Launchpad code as they are happening on both servers and the only common code on both is Launchpad (production and beta).
[01:29] <stub> I am ready for our PostgreSQL 8.2 update. I have proposed Monday as the day to switch production over and am awaiting a reply from mdz.  Yay! Hopefully most of my production responsibilities can be transferred over the comming month.
[01:29] <dholbach> heya
[01:30] <dholbach> does http://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs time out for somebody else as well?
[01:30] <danilos> dholbach: welcome to the lp meeting :)
[01:30] <mpt> dholbach, yes
[01:30] <dholbach> (with and without beta)
[01:30] <dholbach> mpt: *WHINE*
[01:30] <kiko> I think we have our engineers to thank for the good code on beta.
[01:30] <mpt> We've just been discussing that
[01:30] <dholbach> mpt: thanks a lot - I'll read up in the log
[01:30] <kiko> thanks to everybody who's been landing quality changes carefully
[01:30] <ddaa> kiko: I thought we had hackers here, not engineers
[01:31] <danilos> stub: will you be cherrypicking bug 90309 and re-enabling poexport-queue.txt test?
[01:31] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 90309 in launchpad "poexport-queue.txt test disabled" [High,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90309 - Assigned to   (danilo)
[01:31] <SteveA> stub, matsubara: I want you guys and the new "operational administrator" we'll be welcoming next week to have a regular weekly conference call
[01:31] <stub> danilos: If it applies cleanly
[01:31] <danilos> kiko: I didn't land anything, so don't blame me :P
[01:31] <SteveA> matsubara: I'd like you to be responsible for organising this call.  Is that okay?
[01:31] <kiko> ddaa, we have those too, but they get caught in the firewall
[01:31] <mrevell> stub: Will you announce to the launchpad list when you have a confirmed time for Monday's downtime?
[01:32] <stub> mrevell: Sure
[01:32] <danilos> stub: it's a one line change, fwiw
[01:32] <matsubara> SteveA: yes, it's fine.
[01:32] <mrevell> stub: cool, thanks
[01:32] <SteveA> thanks matsubara !
[01:32] <stub> mrevell: You want to handle -users, etc. as last time?
[01:32] <mrevell> stub: Sure, will do.
[01:32] <SteveA> stub: what benefits will using postgres 8.2 give us?
[01:32] <matsubara> SteveA: but last time stub and I tried to have a weekly call we realized was bit redundant with things discussed in the lp weekly meeting
[01:33] <SteveA> matsubara: it is, while things are working with no problems...
[01:33] <SteveA> matsubara: but it's worth having a regular call slot, so that you can use it when there are problems
[01:33] <stub> speed improvements, ability to rebuild indexes on the live system without blocking, UTF8 support in tsearch2 (required for translation searching amongst other things)
[01:33] <SteveA> matsubara: particularly when only one person of the attendees realizes there's a problem
[01:33] <kiko> heh
[01:33] <matsubara> SteveA: roger that.
[01:34] <kiko> stub, do you forsee that tom would be able to do DBA adjustments such as add indexes?
[01:34] <SteveA> thanks stub
[01:34] <SteveA>  * Sysadmin requests
[01:34] <SteveA> any sysadmin requests?
[01:34] <stub> kiko: I expect I'll still be handling the DBA side of things, with tom handling rollouts and scripted updates.
[01:35] <SteveA> mrevell: I spoke with elmo about the blog software
[01:35] <mrevell> SteveA: Thanks.
[01:35] <mpt> How often should I nag about #92?
[01:35] <SteveA> mrevell: he promised to get to it soon
[01:35] <SteveA> mpt: what is it?
[01:35] <mrevell> SteveA: Great news! :)
[01:35] <mpt> SteveA, it's about serving an up-to-date 503 error page
[01:35] <stub> now open for over a year?
[01:35] <mpt> (one that doesn't say "Copyright 2004-2005" and have circa-September-2005 Launchpad stylezz)
[01:35] <SteveA> we should get our 503 pages in good shape.
[01:36] <SteveA> it's important
[01:36] <SteveA> here's what I propose:
[01:36] <stub> - make tom do it
[01:36] <SteveA>  - we have the 503 pages we want in a standard place in the launchpad tree
[01:36] <mpt> That can be our new answer for everything
[01:36] <ddaa> who's tom?
[01:36] <SteveA>  - we tell the admins to take the page from there, when we ask for it
[01:36] <stub> ddaa: new production bitch
[01:37] <SteveA> mpt: where are the 503 pages we want, right now?
[01:37] <stub> erm... 'operational administrator'
[01:37] <mpt> SteveA, I already asked for that in the RT request
[01:37] <mpt> SteveA, lib/canonical/launchpad/offline.html
[01:37] <stub> SteveA: it is irrelevant until Apache is actually configured to serve the 503s, as pound doesn't do what we need it to.
[01:37] <mpt> (if there's a better place, let me know)
[01:37] <SteveA> mpt: 503.html would be better
[01:37] <mpt> ok
[01:38] <SteveA> and it should be in a directory specifically for "offline pages"
[01:38] <SteveA> so offline/503.html
[01:38] <mpt> More than one?
[01:38] <jamesh> I suppose pound treats a 503 from apache as "check the other app server" rather than showing it to the user
[01:38] <SteveA> we have one for beta, one for production
[01:39] <SteveA> and there are other 50x codes that we see from time to time
[01:39] <mpt> okie dokie
[01:39] <stub> jamesh: pound helpfully assumes the document is plain text and wraps it in html
[01:39] <SteveA> mpt: so perhaps classic-503.html, beta-503.html etc.
[01:39] <jamesh> I suppose we don't want to be theming the beta 503 page as the new UI
[01:39] <jamesh> since it would be visible to everyone
[01:39] <SteveA> the beta one needs to direct people to the front page of the classic site
[01:40] <SteveA> so they can disable their redirection for a while
[01:40] <stub> (or better yet, turn off the redirection for them if that is possible)
[01:40] <SteveA> mpt: please get these in good order, tell me when it's on mainline, and I'll talk with the admins then
[01:40] <SteveA> stub: not better.
[01:40] <SteveA> stub: it'll cause more confusion than anything else
[01:40] <danilos> jamesh: beta login page is already visible to everybody, afaik
[01:40] <danilos> jamesh: though, there's not much on it
[01:41] <SteveA> danilos: right -- it's not skinned
[01:41] <jamesh> danilos: and doesn't use any of the new UI's style
[01:41] <SteveA> ok, stop
[01:41] <mpt> So we don't want a beta-styled 503 page
[01:41] <SteveA> mpt: correct
[01:41] <SteveA> ok, stop
[01:41] <SteveA> we're running over time
[01:41] <mpt> and looking at the list of HTTP codes I don't see any other 5xx codes we'd be interested in
[01:41] <SteveA> and there are 4 more agenda items
[01:41] <mpt> ok, I'll report a bug and it can be discussed there
[01:42] <mpt> (actually, I'll use the existing bug report)
[01:42] <SteveA> mrevell: I'd like to ask for your reports, but ask for no discussion of them, just reporting.
[01:42] <SteveA>  * A top user-affecting issue (mrevell)
[01:42] <mrevell> In yesterday's Launchpad user's meeting, I asked people to report issues that had frustrated them. Heno reported continued slowness with beta and asked for:
[01:42] <mrevell> "instructions on how to use firebug sensibly and collect logs, or whatever it does"
[01:42] <mrevell> Two people expressed their frustration at the lack of a fixed date for Feisty translations opening and suggested that the Launchpad team has been dismissive of Ubuntu translators. Danilo, Carlos and Kiko explained what work had been going on and explained how future Ubuntu translations openings will be improved.
[01:42] <mrevell> I think we have an opportunity, once about.launchpad.net is set up, to communicate just what a great job the Rosetta guys are doing. A "day in the life" article might show that the Rosetta guys are human and that they are working hard.
[01:43] <SteveA> thanks
[01:43] <SteveA>  * Launchpad buzz report (mrevell)
[01:43] <mrevell> Apologies, the buzz report was one day late this week. I sent it to the list this morning. I'm working with stub on improve metrics.
[01:43] <kiko> danilos is human?
[01:43] <mrevell> kiko: I have no proof
[01:43] <danilos> kiko: SteveA said *no* discussion!
[01:44] <kiko> next!
[01:44] <danilos> :)
[01:44] <SteveA>  * Launchpad 1.0 status reports
[01:44] <danilos> Rosetta 1.0  weekly report:
[01:44] <danilos> - firefox import/export: switched tasks, now carlos on it
[01:44] <danilos> - oo import/export: no progress this week
[01:44] <danilos> - essential docs: no progress this week
[01:44] <danilos> - TranslationImportContinuityThreshold: no progress this week
[01:44] <danilos> - UI stuff: bug 79674 (small progress, start page modified, new page missing)
[01:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 79674 in rosetta "List translatable upstreams on separate page, sample on front page" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/79674 - Assigned to   (danilo)
[01:44] <mpt> UI 1.0: No substantial achievements this week, except SteveA implemented the mechanism for multiple page layouts.
[01:44] <BjornT> Malone 1.0:
[01:44] <BjornT> malone-essential-docs: No progress since last week. bjornt still to send an e-mail to matthew r describing what information the different sections should contain in more detail.
[01:44] <ddaa> Code 1.0: I think the only bit missing is a page for "import your project"
[01:44] <flacoste> AnswerTracker 1.0: rename almost complete, URL renaming compled and will land after 1.0 roll-out, database rename in review. Rename in public doc will be done once beta becomes public.
[01:45] <cprov> Soyuz 1.0:  nothing relevant for 1.0 series this week.
[01:45] <SteveA> thanks
[01:45] <SteveA>  * Three sentences
[01:46] <ddaa> DONE: complete-revisions for review, code import ui fixes, small fixes, lots of discussion
[01:46] <ddaa> TODO: land complete-revisions, fill in jml on some items out of my todo list, review automatic-bug-branch-link spec again.
[01:46] <ddaa> BLOCKED: complete-revisions review
 DONE: landed branch redirection (removing +branch from traversal tree), landed branch view refactoring, working on private branches
 TODO: continue working on private branches, dbschema refactoring
[01:46] <flacoste> DONE: AnswerTracker DB renameing, bug fixes, reviews, wrote check-sampledata.py
[01:46] <flacoste> TODO: sprint
[01:46] <flacoste> BLOCKED: no
 BLOCKED: scanner-email still blocked on complete-revisions branch landing
[01:46] <barry> DONE: PyCon catchup, mm/lp integration roadmap draft
[01:46] <barry> TODO: expenses, mm/lp milestones, get back to xmlrpc
[01:46] <barry> BLOCKED: none
 DONE: Commit message UI. Bug branch linking spec.
[01:46] <BjornT> DONE: code reviews. fixed a number of bugs.
[01:46] <BjornT> TODO: code reviews. fix more bugs, mostly related to 1.0.
[01:46] <BjornT> BLOCKED: no
[01:46] <danilos> DONE: bug 90309, poimport use proper index fix + profiling, rosetta-users and launchpad-users, re-assigned ff task, ooo migration script, 1.0 ui page
[01:46] <danilos> TODO: ooo migration script, lots of bugfixing, licensing
[01:46] <danilos> BLOCKED: no
[01:46] <bac> DONE: Submit proposal LP at UbuntuLive, begin work on file mgmt (upload/download), setup local bugzilla
[01:46] <bac> TODO: Work with Elliot to finish file mgmt spec, attend Z3 training (Sat-Tues)
 TODO: Bug branch linking. revprop ui for bzr.
[01:46] <bac> BLOCKED: No
[01:46] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 90309 in launchpad "poexport-queue.txt test disabled" [High,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90309 - Assigned to   (danilo)
 DONE: fix a bunch more bzr smart server problems, reviews
 TODO: reviews, bzr smart server
 BLOCKED: no
 BLOCKED: no (but it would very nice if complete-revisions-landing landed)
[01:46] <salgado> DONE: Wrote the person's table of contributions, some random fixes, tweaks to the image widget, including an unsuccessful attempt of making it simpler and some code review
[01:46] <salgado> TODO: Land all branches which are on the review queue, code review and shipit
[01:46] <salgado> BLOCKED: No
[01:46] <mrevell> DONE: Dealt with community situation, worked on docs spec, worked on beta tester guide, buzz and usage report, made announcements/apologies, prepared PQM log to hand over to Joey, first user meeting, irc user support, worked on pain points.
[01:46] <mrevell> TODO: Finish doc spec, finish beta reviewer guide, sort commercial presentation for Maria, produce 1.0 microsite content, hand over FiF and PQM log to Joey, another user meeting, and work on pain points.
[01:46] <mrevell> BLOCKED: about.launchpad.net by RT.
[01:46] <matsubara> DONE: triage, fixed #30277, checking oops reports, fixed beta configs to be equal to production, investigated timeout problems.
[01:46] <matsubara> TODO: more triage, more oops reports, .
[01:46] <matsubara> BLOCKED: no
[01:46] <statik> DONE: working with customers, working on filedownloads, recruiting
[01:46] <statik> TODO: the same
[01:46] <statik> Blocked: no
[01:46] <jamesh> DONE: code review, robots.txt for codebrowse, fix codebrowse for branch names with dots
[01:46] <jamesh> TODO: code review, storm integration, bug imports
[01:46] <jamesh> BLOCKED: no
[01:46] <cprov> DONE: Fix #89846, #89260, #52025, #78672, #85732 and 70 % done on nascentupload-cataclysm (NUC)
[01:46] <cprov> TODO: merge NUC, remove warty/hoary from archive, backport recent changes to PPA
[01:46] <cprov> BLOCKED: no
[01:46] <SteveA> DONE: pycon, management, ui
[01:46] <SteveA> TODO: management, ui
[01:46] <SteveA> BLOCKED: no
[01:46] <carlos> DONE: Feisty translations babysitting, virtual hosting fixes for translations.launchpad.net, bug #70074, Native Firefox support
[01:46] <carlos> TODO: Native Firefox Support, Meet with Danilo to improve Ubuntu import process
[01:46] <carlos> BLOCKED: No
[01:46] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 70074 in rosetta "Add direct link downloads" [Low,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/70074 - Assigned to Carlos Perell Marn (carlos)
[01:47] <mpt> DONE: Menu cleanup; bug fixes; inducting new Brilliant developer
[01:47] <mpt> TODO: review OneZero specs and finish implementing them
[01:47] <mpt> BLOCKED: no
[01:47] <kiko> DONE: interviews, report, assist julian's intro, coding work with cprov, salgado, matsubara
[01:47] <kiko> TODO: clear out dirty trees
[01:47] <kiko> BLOCKED: no
[01:48] <sinzui> DONE: setup rocketfuel
[01:48] <sinzui> TODO: report bugs found in edgy ftests, list of issues for flacoste
[01:48] <sinzui> BLOCKED: no
[01:48] <SteveA> thanks everyone
[01:48] <stub> DONE: PostgreSQL 8.2 prep work
[01:48] <stub> TODO: PostgreSQL 8.2 upgrade, OpenID
[01:48] <stub> BLOKED: no
[01:48] <SteveA> I don't see any BLOCKED issues that haven't been mentioned already
[01:48] <ddaa> can I have my complete-revisions-landing review, pretty please?
[01:49] <SteveA> ddaa: who needs to do that?
[01:49] <ddaa> salgado
[01:49] <salgado> I'm finishing it
[01:49] <SteveA> cool
[01:49] <SteveA> thanks everyone
[01:49] <SteveA> MEETING ENDS
[01:49] <salgado> today!
 Also, perhaps Tasmania should be detached from the Australian mainland and moved to the Mediterranean.
[01:50] <SteveA> apologies for runningn 5 mins over
[01:50] <kiko> thanks stever
[01:50] <mrevell> thanks all
[01:50] <bac> SteveA: can you look at the Terms of Service fix in your review queue?
[01:50] <bac> mrevell: good job on the meeting yesterday
[01:50] <barry> time for coffee!
[01:50] <SteveA> bac: ok, thanks
[01:50] <mrevell> bac: Thanks :) Plenty of room for improvement, though
[01:50] <sinzui> ddaa: Tasmania goes to Siberia. Wont they be surprised in the morning?
[01:51] <ddaa> sinzui: http://www.satirewire.com/news/jan02/australia.shtml
[01:52] <sinzui> ddaa: ha
[01:52] <ddaa> sinzui: Siberia wouldn't do
[01:52] <ddaa> besides, Tasmania is an island, how could it go to Siberia?
[01:53] <stub> SteveA: So you wanted to talk to me and James re: meeting time?
[01:54] <SteveA> stub: yes, but perhaps not today.  I will email.
[01:54] <mpt> ddaa, the same way India did
[01:54] <heno> my sister once shot at a polar bear in Siberia
[01:55] <heno> (that's not even a monty python moose ref. joke)
[01:55] <ddaa> mpt: according to geologists, India is just humping Siberia
[01:56] <mpt> Second base!
[01:56] <sinzui> ddaa: well first I locate Australia on the map. the I ask What's Tasmania doing there? I cut it out. Then I paste it in Siberia.
[01:57] <ddaa> SteveA: you're not making any sense
[02:15] <salgado> mpt, ping, ping
[02:50] <ddaa> salgado: huge branch? complete-revision-landing is less than 2k diff lines...
[02:51] <ddaa> large, yes, but not huge...
[03:22] <gnomefreak> still cant file bug reports. this time i have a trace back
[03:23] <matsubara> gnomefreak: do you have the oops id?
[03:24] <gnomefreak> Include the error ID  OOPS-432BB597  in your message.
[03:24] <gnomefreak> yep :) always
[03:24] <gnomefreak> its oopsing all over the place atm
[03:25] <gnomefreak> here is another one nclude the error ID  OOPS-432BB596  in your message.
[03:25] <gnomefreak> OOPS-432BD622
[03:26] <matsubara> you got tracebacks on all of them?
[03:26] <gnomefreak> no just the first one
[03:26] <gnomefreak> matsubara: the first one i was attaching something to a bug the last 2 were trying to report a bug
[03:29] <matsubara> right, thanks for the info gnomefreak. we're investigating the timeout problems. A traceback should never be displayed to users, though.  [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90621
[03:35] <Kmos> :)
[03:35] <gnomefreak> Kmos: attach the full crash report please. is this edgy or feisty?
[03:48] <Hobbsee> nope, out of luck
[03:48] <Hobbsee> If this is blocking your work, let us know on the launchpad-users mailing list (requires subscription). Include the error ID  OOPS-432BB619  in your message.
[03:49] <kiko> stub, can you please do some research into why we're getting so many timeouts with beta?
[03:50] <kiko> stub, before you leave for the day.
[03:50] <Hobbsee> kiko: it's been like this for weeks.
[03:50] <Hobbsee> kiko: just seems worse today
[03:50] <kiko> Hobbsee, timing out? no, it's a lot worse since yesterday
[03:51] <Hobbsee> 20+ second load times seem to have been standard in the last few weeks
[03:51] <Hobbsee> which is unacceptable for a simple webpage.
[03:51] <kiko> even when you're in australia
[03:51] <Hobbsee> kiko: true that
[03:51] <Hobbsee> hah.  yes
[03:52] <Hobbsee> kiko: i dread the thought of doing bug triage, or where i'm trying to use LP for a long period of time.  i suspect that'll just induce head bashing.
[04:00] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90628 in launchpad "Subscribers to a spec are randomly arranged" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90628
[04:03] <Kmos> gnomefreak: it's edgy.. i'm submitting the crash report 34.5 mb
[04:03] <gnomefreak> Kmos: ty :)
[04:04] <Kmos> gnomefreak: I'm Gothic..
[04:04] <Kmos> so u're vivirito =))
[04:04] <gnomefreak> yep
[04:06] <jkbys> Hi all, would you tell me whether importing templates for feisty had finished or not yet?
[04:08] <kiko> not yet
[04:08] <jkbys> thanks
[04:10] <seb128> kiko: do you know if somebody is working at fixing lp to no timeout on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs for example?
[04:10] <kiko> seb128, I wish I could say stub, but I'll look into it
[04:10] <seb128> thank you
[04:10] <seb128> that's not on beta
[04:11] <seb128> that's on normal production lp
[04:11] <dholbach> http://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gimmie/+bugs times out too (not on beta) - which should be around 6-7 bugs
[04:34] <Kmos> gnomefreak: can i dcc send it to you ?
[04:34] <gnomefreak> no need if you attached it to bug
[04:35] <Kmos> it give me 500 internal error
[04:35] <Kmos> 500 Internal Server Error
[04:35] <Kmos> An internal server error occurred. Please try again later.
[04:40] <kiko> Kmos, when uploading your file?
[04:41] <pochu> heya carlos :)
[04:41] <Kmos> kiko: yes
[04:42] <pochu> do you guys know when the imports will be finalized? just curiosity :)
[04:42] <kiko> Kmos, can you retry? you didn't get an OOPS ID for that perchance, did you?
[04:42] <kiko> pochu, I think next wednesday. yes, that sucks :-(
[04:42] <pochu> kiko: ok, ty :)
[04:43] <pochu> kiko: that's fine, because I have an exam on Tuesday :)
[04:43] <kiko> heh
[04:43] <Kmos> kiko: oops id ?
[04:43] <Kmos> i only got 500 internal server error
[04:43] <Kmos> nothing more
[04:43] <kiko> Kmos, when you uploaded the file. launchpad often.. yeah.
[04:43] <kiko> it's a librarian problem, isn't it matsubara?
[04:44] <matsubara> it's likely to be. I'm looking for the bug number.
[04:45] <kiko> matsubara, when the librarian dies do we have logs or an oops?
[04:47] <matsubara> kiko: I think it's bug 86171 and if you check the oopses there you'll see that the librarian raised an 500 internal server error.
[04:47] <Ubugtu> Bug 86171 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/86171 is private
[04:49] <kiko> yeah.
[04:49] <kiko> spiv said he instrumented the librarian or did something about it?
[04:50] <gnomefreak> Kmos: try again sorry was busy
[04:50] <kiko> Kmos, yeah, can you try again?
[04:51] <Kmos> i'll send it to gnomefreak
[04:51] <kiko> Kmos, well, if you could try to upload I'd determine whether it's deterministic or not
[04:51] <Kmos> ok
[04:51] <Kmos> ill upload again
[04:51] <gnomefreak> not letting me grab it. Kmos email it to me at<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[04:51] <kiko> thanks very much
[04:52] <Kmos> request: how about to have an option to give a url of a website with the report crash ?
[04:52] <Kmos> like i upload it to somesite.com/filecrash
[04:52] <Kmos> and when reporting.. give that url
[04:52] <gnomefreak> ill see if i can grab it
[04:52] <gnomefreak> its not there
[04:53] <Kmos> it's my problem.. irssi
[04:53] <Kmos> lan IP address
[04:53] <Kmos> right'
[04:53] <Kmos> ?
[04:53] <Kmos> i'm uploading again to launchpad
[04:53] <gnomefreak> k
[04:53] <gnomefreak> brb
[04:55] <PecisDarbs> launchpad has problems?
[04:55] <kiko> today in particular yes
[04:56] <Kmos> when there is a new firefox patched ? there are so many crash's
[04:57] <Kmos> kiko: tu es brasileiro =) portugues aki :P
[04:57] <kiko> fala luso
[04:57] <Kmos> :)
[04:57] <Kmos> hehe
[04:58] <Kmos> esta adsl com 128 kbps de upload nao da com nada
[04:58] <Kmos> demora anos
[04:58] <Kmos> lol
[04:58] <kiko> Kmos,  o mesmo que ns temos. uma @##!
[04:58] <Kmos> -rw------- 1 kmos kmos 36110512 2007-03-08 13:51 _usr_lib_firefox_firefox-bin.1000.crash
[04:58] <Kmos> yeah
[04:58] <kiko> Kmos, talvez gzipar antes de mandar ajude.
[04:58] <Kmos> aki ha comea a haver 256 e 512, mas fica mt caro
[04:58] <kiko> idem
[04:58] <Kmos> da pra enviar assim ?
[04:58] <Kmos> tar.gz ?
[04:59] <gnomefreak> yes
[04:59] <gnomefreak> save a few mb that way
[04:59] <Kmos> nice
[04:59] <Kmos> yeah
[04:59] <gnomefreak> sady i understood more of that than i thought
[04:59] <kiko> sadly?
[05:00] <gnomefreak> yeah
[05:00] <Kmos> 10 mb
[05:00] <Kmos> :)
[05:00] <kiko> you should be proud of your pt_BR skillz
[05:00] <kiko> or pt as is the case
[05:00] <Kmos> :)
[05:00] <Kmos> thx
[05:01] <Kmos> rw-r--r-- 1 root root 26902342 2007-03-08 16:00 firefox1000crash.tar.gz
[05:01] <Kmos> now it's better
[05:01] <Kmos> :)
[05:33] <kiko> *** We're doing some online maintenence work on Launchpad -- the site will be slow and unstable for a few minutes ***
[05:34] <kiko> so hold off posting that form until I say finished
[05:34] <Kmos> :)
[05:36] <gnomefreak> Kmos: ill be in and out for the next few hours just let me know once its there ill try to get it done today
[05:36] <bac> kiko: steveA says you are trying to get a<EMAIL_ADDRESS>address set up.  how's that going?
[05:37] <bac> i need to add an address on the /legal page to request permission for automated script access
[05:37] <kiko> ah, thanks for asking, I have no idea. it's been requested
[05:37] <kiko> to the admins but I don't think done
[05:37] <bac> you have an RT number?  you setting it up as mailman or just an alias?
[05:37] <kiko> mailman IIRC
[05:37] <kiko> yes I do
[05:37] <bac> it might be good for me to reference it
[05:37] <kiko> bac, #26676
[05:38] <bac> thx
[05:38] <kiko> bac, what's your email?
[05:38] <bac> i'm sneaky -- it's 'bac'
[05:39] <kiko> bac@canonical?
[05:39] <bac> yep
[05:39] <kiko> sent to you
[05:39] <bac> thanks
[05:42] <seb128> hum
[05:42] <seb128> "OperationalError
[05:42] <seb128> A server error occurred. "
[05:42] <seb128> kiko: who broke launchpad? ;)
[05:42] <FunnyLookinHat> Is there maintenance being performed on launchpad right now?
[05:42] <FunnyLookinHat> Lol.
[05:42] <gnomefreak> ki`broke it ;)
[05:42] <gnomefreak> kiko: broke it ;)
 *** We're doing some online maintenence work on Launchpad -- the site will be slow and unstable for a few minutes ***
[05:42] <kiko> yes
[05:43] <seb128> kiko: oh, ok, good ;)
[05:44] <FunnyLookinHat> I blame Rinchen personally.
[05:44] <Rinchen> Honest, I haven't touched LP all day.
[05:44] <Rinchen> well, not much
[05:44] <Rinchen> since it's been down
[05:45] <FunnyLookinHat> hahaha
[05:46] <Seveas> OperationalError
[05:46] <Seveas> A server error occurred.
[05:46] <Seveas> I call that unstable :)
[05:47] <ddaa> kiko: maybe it would be better to shut launchpad down in those situations...
[05:47] <ddaa> getting random crashes is more frustrating than a "sorry, maintenance in progress" page
[05:51] <dneary> Hi
[05:51] <dneary> I'm not the only one seeing OperationalErrors then
[05:55] <pirast> ugh-oh..
[05:55] <xdatap> hey boy, you already know about launchpad offline? "A server error occurred."
[05:56] <radix> see topic
[05:56] <xdatap> ops :D
[05:56] <xdatap> ok
[05:56] <pirast> few minutes are over :-P
[05:56] <xdatap> ok, np
[05:56] <xdatap> bye
[06:06] <gnomefreak> kiko-fud: Lp is still down?
[06:06] <pochu> gnomefreak: at least for me :)
[06:06] <gnomefreak> everyone than
[06:07] <gnomefreak> i wasnt sure, stub removed it from topic so i assumed it was back up
[06:13] <AlinuxOS> danilos, ping
[06:13] <pochu> online
[06:13] <pochu> gnomefreak: ^
[06:13] <stub> it is now
[06:14] <stub> I changed the topic too soon sorry
[06:14] <pochu> np
[06:15] <gnomefreak> np just making sure
[06:19] <danilos> AlinuxOS: pong
[06:22] <AlinuxOS> danilos, private ping ;)
[06:35] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90651 in launchpad "Need mugshot images for product, project, distribution and sprint" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90651
[07:15] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90655 in launchpad "Launchpad prompts once for new tags, accepts all" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90655
[08:07] <carlos> cheers
[09:24] <tsmithe> where's mrevell when you need him :P
[09:24] <kiko> well, I'm a close second. :)
[09:26] <tsmithe> it was only for idle chitter :P :: you didn't just publish *my* blog post :P
[09:29] <beuno_> hey carlos!    any news on the Feisty Translations imports?
[09:30] <pochu> beuno_: they told me that it's scheduled for next wednesday :)
[09:30] <beuno_> thanks pochu!
[09:30] <pochu> beuno_: np :)
[10:05] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90702 in malone "Broken link in bug tracker front page pointing to CVE references" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90702
[10:34] <moyogo> hi
[10:35] <moyogo> I'd like to contact a translator but there's no contact information on his launchpad page
[10:35] <moyogo> How can I get in touch with him?
[10:41] <kiko> moyogo, who's the person?
[10:42] <moyogo> kiko: https://launchpad.net/~gontcho
[11:26] <lamby> where should one submit bugs wrt. bugs in launchpad?
[11:28] <apokryphos> lamby: https://bugs.beta.launchpad.net/launchpad
[11:28] <apokryphos> or malone, if it's to do with the bugtracker
[11:28] <kiko> lamby, launchpad.net/launchpad/+filebug
[11:30] <lamby> woo, already fixed according to the bugreport.
[11:33] <thumper> ddaa: bug 90725 may be slightly contriversial
[11:33] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 90725 in launchpad-bazaar "batching size in branch listings is too small" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90725
[11:34] <thumper> kiko: do you see any problem with different batch sizes?
[11:34] <thumper> kiko, ddaa: personally I don't but I want to solicit opinions
[11:36] <kiko> thumper, for what? for a specific page?
[11:37] <thumper> kiko: like branch listings
[11:40] <Ubugtu> New bug: #90725 in launchpad-bazaar "batching size in branch listings is too small" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90725
[11:43] <ddaa> thumper: I have no problem in being controversial.
[11:43] <ddaa> you might even call that a cultural trait, if you wish
[11:45] <ddaa> jml: about AutomaticBugBranchLinks
[11:45] <jml> ddaa: yes?
[11:46] <ddaa> jml: I'd like if you could think a bit more about how BugBranchRevision relates to productseries and bugtasks
[11:46] <ddaa> I have the impression there is a lot of fuzziness in this spec because the terminology surrounding bugs, bugtasks, branches, and branches-of-series is not used consistently.
[11:47] <ddaa> also, it's not clear to me how BugBranchRevision relates to BugBranch
[11:47] <jml> ddaa: you are right about the first thing. I haven't thought about productseries etc, except to think that they aren't relevant for the first phase.
[11:48] <ddaa> they are essential to automatic bugtask closure
[11:48] <jml> right
[11:48] <ddaa> not bug closure, we close bugtasks, that's one instance where the terminology needs to be fixed
[11:49] <jml> but that's not part of the first step :)
[11:50] <jml> ddaa: as for the relation between BugBranch and BugBranchRevision: BugBranch has the information that's in the UI, and BugBranchRevision is essentially the parsed record of revprops.
[11:51] <jml> ddaa: I had a chat w/ thumper and jamesh about possibly removing the branch attr from BBR
[11:51] <ddaa> you mean the revision_hint?
[11:51] <ddaa> ha...
[11:52] <ddaa> okay, but how do BB and BBR relate?
[11:52] <ddaa> I feel that a BBR should be subordinate to a BB, somehow
[11:52] <jml> ddaa: care to elaborate?
[11:53] <ddaa> I said "I feel", it's a gut thing.
[11:53] <ddaa> I will elaborate when i get some solid time in front of that spec tomorrow.
[11:54] <jml> ddaa: ok
[12:07] <ddaa> Good night folks.
[12:07] <jml> ddaa: g'night


[18:39] <AlanBell> hi all, what is the aspect ratio and screen resolution of the tablet you are targetting?
[19:07] <Myrtti> too bad there hasn't really been any discussion yet
[19:08] <Myrtti> don't even know if everyone is just a lurker end-user or if there are any developers here
[19:13] <MrChrisDruif> I'm not a real developer, but before developers get active there has to be some discussion first Myrtti
[19:13] <MrChrisDruif> But have you got some ideas, suggestions for Ubuntu Tablet?
[19:13] <Myrtti> I know, which is why I'm here, trying to chip in in a small way to get the experience on my ExoPC a bit better
[19:13] <MrChrisDruif> Great =)
[19:14] <Myrtti> I was just considering should I install 12.04 on it
[19:14] <MrChrisDruif> (Sorry I didn't activate this channel much, I've been busy with Ubuntu TV mainly)
[19:20] <MrChrisDruif> Myrtti; what is currently lacking for tablets?
[19:20] <MrChrisDruif> In your opinion of course =)
[19:27] <MrChrisDruif> I hope I didn't scare you?
[19:27] <Myrtti> OnBoard needs more work, Gwibber is horrible to use (it is horrible to use on a desktop as well tho) some UI elements should be configurable to be a bit bigger and/or touch-friendly
[19:28] <Myrtti> sorry, I started cooking late dinner
[19:28] <Myrtti> my udon noodles have gone out of date so needed to put rice to cook
[19:29] <MrChrisDruif> Myrtti; late night dinner? What timezone are you? =)
[19:30] <Myrtti> the same timezone approximately 1/4 of all IRCers are on (all statistics are lies!): Finland
[19:35] <MrChrisDruif> Haha, UTC+2 I think it is?
[19:45] <Myrtti> yeah
[19:46] <MrChrisDruif> Ever tried Gnome Shell on it?
[19:54] <Myrtti> yeah, it was nice, some things in Unity are better tho
[19:54] <Myrtti> I like the messaging menu
[19:55] <MrChrisDruif> Yes?
[19:55] <MrChrisDruif> I forgot how the messaging menu is in Unity, I've run shell for pretty long time already =)
[19:56] <imnichol> I love the messaging menu, and webos 3 actually stole the idea(unintentionally I'm sure)
[19:57] <imnichol> It's an awesome way to do alerts
[19:59] <MrChrisDruif> Hai Ian
[20:01] <imnichol> Hi
[20:44] <MrChrisDruif> What is better to Ubuntu's messaging menu vs. gnome-shell one?
[20:45] <imnichol> I haven't used gnome-shell's message menu so I can't speak to that
[20:47] <Myrtti> there is one for gnomeshell?
[20:48] <MrChrisDruif> Well, I don't know how it's called, but there is a dropdown-menu for some online stuff
[20:50] <imnichol> Any chance you could point me at a screen shot of it?
[20:50] <MrChrisDruif> That's easier indeed, I'll do it
[20:51] <MrChrisDruif> It looks a bit like this: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-QCP_2UKsFgU/TksaT91iIYI/AAAAAAAAG6M/9lAK2X_IVY0/s1600/6.jpg but mine looks differently
[20:51] <MrChrisDruif> I'll take a screenshot of it
[20:51] <imnichol> Ohhhh
[20:51] <imnichol> Ok
[20:53] <imnichol> Does it do alerts when someone IMs/emails/tweets you?
[20:54] <MrChrisDruif> imnichol; http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3216976/screenshot.png
[20:54] <MrChrisDruif> Nope, the thing in the bottom does that
[20:55] <imnichol> What thing in the bottom?
[20:55] <MrChrisDruif> Yeah, it pops up when you get a mention/tweet/what-have-you
[20:55] <MrChrisDruif> And when you got to activities
[20:56] <imnichol> OH ok
[20:57] <MrChrisDruif> So yeah, you don't really need that messaging menu in gnome-shell
[20:57] <MrChrisDruif> Did you notice the accessibility icon in the top? (That small guys in a circle)
[20:58] <imnichol> Yes, what functionality does that provide?
[20:58] <MrChrisDruif> You can turn on the On screen keyboard, among other things for accessibility
[20:58] <MrChrisDruif> I'll take another screenie of it
[21:00] <MrChrisDruif> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3216976/accessibility.png
[21:00] <imnichol> That link 404ed
[21:00] <imnichol> Nevermind, there we go
[21:01] <MrChrisDruif> So if you look at it like I do, I don't think we need do much fancy work for tablets
[21:01] <imnichol> I agree
[21:02] <MrChrisDruif> I'd actually think we might need to do something for desktop, but either gs or unity are good enough for tablet & desktop
[21:02] <MrChrisDruif> Phones on the other hand ;-)
[21:03] <imnichol> I think everyone knows my feelings about eating your own dog food, but I would be totally satisfied with a gnome-shell tablet as well, even though Unity is my first choice
[21:03] <imnichol> I think that tablets represent sort of a middle ground between the TV and Phone projects
[21:03] <MrChrisDruif> How so?
[21:04] <imnichol> In that the Tablet project isn't going to see too many problems that are unique to it, and will likely draw solutions from the TV and Phone projects
[21:04] <MrChrisDruif> I see Tablet like a Desktop but without a (solid) keyboard and mouse.
[21:05] <imnichol> Pretty much
[21:05] <MrChrisDruif> The mouse can be replaced with just touching, the keyboard with an onscreen keyboard
[21:06] <MrChrisDruif> Made add some fancy multi-touch wizardry
[21:06] <MrChrisDruif> Like "pinch-to-zoom"
[21:07] <imnichol> Which, I believe, is being developed pretty rapidly IIRC
[21:09] <imnichol> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTeUbx_nnM4 that's a pretty cool video from 2009 showing multitouch capabilities
[21:13] <MrChrisDruif> Yeah, those kinds of actions =)
[21:13] <imnichol> So like I said, I don't think that the tablet project will cause quite as much grief as the tv/phone projects will
[21:14] <MrChrisDruif> Indeed...
[21:14] <MrChrisDruif> So...shall we continue this conversation over there? ;-) (There being #ubuntu-phone)
[21:15] <imnichol> I was just about to suggest that ;)