[14:52] <screcorder> Hi, I want to capture my screen in windows but I can't use video_size, can anyone help me ? it always capture fullscreen desktop ! http://pastebin.com/KR1Ajy6E


[17:11] <micahg> \o/ oneiric lightdm doesn't work without unity greeter :P
[17:11] <pleia2> oh dear
[17:14] <madnick> charlie said we are gonna use the unity greeter, but modified to display sessions in the panel
[17:15] <micahg> madnick: hmm, why not use the GTK greeter modifieD>
[17:15] <micahg> unity greeter depends on libindicate
[17:15] <madnick> micahg: I wanted to make a modified gtk greeter
[17:16] <madnick> but charlie wanted the unity one
[17:16] <micahg> eh, I suppose that we have the dependency already
[17:16] <madnick> when i looked at the unity greeter source
[17:16] <madnick> everything was pretty much hardcoded
[17:16] <madnick> i do not like that
[17:17] <micahg> right
[17:18] <madnick> the only things missing from the unity greeter in xubuntu is some stock icons, a bg and moving the session list to the panel
[20:44] <GridCube> hello people
[20:44] <GridCube> :)
[20:47] <GridCube> Today's my brother birthday so I wont be able to attend the meeting, please share my progress on the TOP 10 FAQ  https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HyhsMPDyyN-mRWRujfZX3JuKX9aWFQPWsxMEiJX99gQ/edit
[20:48] <micahg> GridCube: thanks
[20:49] <GridCube> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HyhsMPDyyN-mRWRujfZX3JuKX9aWFQPWsxMEiJX99gQ/edit?hl=es
[20:50] <GridCube> the first link was broken
[20:53] <GridCube> micahg, thanks :)
[20:56] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu community meeting in #xubuntu-devel in 64 minutes. Everyone is invited to attend. Agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Meetings
[21:08] <charlie-tca> live session auto-login works using today's images.
[21:08] <charlie-tca> Thank you! whoever made that work. We also only have two sessions today, xfce and xubuntu.
[21:11]  * micahg thinks that was mr_pouit's upload of xubuntu-defailt-settings
[21:11] <micahg> but unity-greeter is needed to login now :(
[21:11] <charlie-tca> Even the encrypted whole drive install worked
[21:12] <charlie-tca> Is that what we got now?
[21:12] <charlie-tca> madnick is going to fix that, right?
[21:12] <micahg> no
[21:12] <charlie-tca> no? unity-greeter?
[21:12] <micahg> well, we have lightdm-gtk-greeter seeded and I had seb128 fix the recommends so we would get the gtk greeter again, but unity-greeter seems to be hardcoded now
[21:12] <charlie-tca> madnick is building us a xubuntu-greeter
[21:13] <charlie-tca> I see
[21:13] <charlie-tca> seems like every step forward pushes us back again
[21:13]  * micahg isn't sure if we're just missing a conf file or if it's not customizable
[21:14] <charlie-tca> I think we are missing a conf file. We are supposed to be able to replace unity-greeter with our own
[21:14] <charlie-tca> The difference from Friday's images to todays images is big! We got things working, at least
[21:15] <micahg> well, I can't look into it today, I need to catch up on work, I should be around for the meeting though
[21:15] <charlie-tca> Okay
[21:15] <charlie-tca> I was going to skip today, but I guess I will be around too
[21:20] <charlie-tca> micahg: no, unity-greeter can not be hard coded. seb128 been following our lightdm bugs closely, and has assured me we can put our own settings in now and over-ride Ubuntu settings
[21:42] <charlie-tca> I am seeing a different login screen today than friday, too. It has the old gdm user list centered on a dark blue background, instead of the all black background with the names offset to the left.
[21:43] <charlie-tca> micahg: unity-greeter Installed: (none)
[21:44] <charlie-tca> fresh install using today's image
[21:46] <charlie-tca> apt-cache policy lightdm-gtk-greeter Installed: 0.9.3-0ubuntu3
[21:46] <micahg> yeah
[21:46] <micahg> I guess something's not right with my install then
[21:47] <charlie-tca> Yeah, friday's images were bad, too, for that. They were using unity-greeter
[21:48] <charlie-tca> The problem is, when they change these files around, they do not fix the "already installed" user base files
[22:01] <madnick> meeting time? :)
[22:01] <micahg> o/
[22:01] <charlie-tca> oops
[22:01] <charlie-tca> sure
[22:02] <charlie-tca> #startmeeting
[22:02] <meetingology> Meeting started Sun Aug 14 22:02:21 2011 UTC.  The chair is charlie-tca. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot.
[22:02] <meetingology> Useful Commands: #topic #action #link #idea #voters #vote #chair #action #agreed #help #info #endmeeting.
[22:02] <charlie-tca> #link The agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Meetings
[22:02] <charlie-tca> I hope that works, anyway
[22:03] <charlie-tca> * Old business
[22:03] <charlie-tca> * Team updates
[22:03] <charlie-tca>   * Packaging & Development
[22:03] <charlie-tca>   * Bug Triage & Testing
[22:03] <charlie-tca>   * Website & Marketing
[22:03] <charlie-tca>   * Artwork
[22:03] <charlie-tca>   * Documentation
[22:03] <charlie-tca> * Announcements
[22:03] <charlie-tca> * Governance structure
[22:03] <charlie-tca> * Any Other Business
[22:03] <charlie-tca> Reminder:   please use ".." on separate line when you've finished typing.   If someone wants to comment during the updates, please "o/", so we know to wait.
[22:04] <charlie-tca> #topic Old business
[22:04] <meetingology> TOPIC: Old business
[22:04] <charlie-tca> * GridCube to put together the "TOP 10" for Xubuntu - In-work
[22:04] <charlie-tca> GridCube: update on this?
[22:04] <micahg> [15:49] <GridCube> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HyhsMPDyyN-mRWRujfZX3JuKX9aWFQPWsxMEiJX99gQ/edit?hl=es
[22:05] <charlie-tca> Very nice! Thanks for working on those, GridCube
[22:05] <charlie-tca> Thank you for the link, micahg
[22:05] <charlie-tca>  * madnick to look into building a lightdm greeter - In-work
[22:05] <GridCube> :) ok
[22:05] <charlie-tca> madnick: update?
[22:05] <GridCube> i meant, you are welcome
[22:05] <madnick> Well
[22:05] <charlie-tca> If you haven't heard yet, today's images are the ones to grab to see how lightdm is working for us
[22:06] <madnick> Im not sure, because you told me that we should pretty much use the unity greeter
[22:06] <charlie-tca> We no longer have unity-greeter, but are using lightdm-gtk-greeter today
[22:06] <ChristopherNG> hello
[22:06] <charlie-tca> oh, confusion then?
[22:06] <charlie-tca> hello, ChristopherNG
[22:07] <madnick> Well, the confusing is, should i modify that
[22:07] <madnick> Or should I wait for final words :)
[22:07] <charlie-tca> madnick: if it is easier to take unity-greeter and rebuild it for us, you can do that. If it is easier to write your own, that is fine too
[22:07] <charlie-tca> I leave it up to you. I will be happy with either solution.
[22:08] <charlie-tca> I just don't want a stupid gear to click for sessions
[22:08] <madnick> Well, I can do either, I just need a good theme, Im working on a draft, but i really like knome or oschi to tell me where they stand on the matter
[22:09] <madnick> I know knome wanted to center the unity greeters login box
[22:09] <madnick> And I know you wanted to move / fix the session stuff
[22:09] <charlie-tca> Okay. That will be fine. Seeing that we just got something to work with, we should be able to get freeze exceptions to get it in, if we really need them.
[22:10] <madnick> Okay :)
[22:10] <madnick> ..
[22:10] <charlie-tca> What do you think would be best? offset or centered?
[22:10] <madnick> Im not sure, I like the current style of it
[22:10] <madnick> The positions*
[22:11] <micahg> UI freeze is in a week and a half
[22:11] <charlie-tca> Then you can put them there. We can change it if the users hate it for the next release.
[22:11] <madnick> Okay, ill set that up in the week that follows
[22:11] <charlie-tca> Press on, put the list where you like it, but give me a sessions text please.
[22:12] <charlie-tca> If knome don't like it, well, we can work with him on that. But I think you have a good grasp on it, and will let you build it for this release.
[22:13] <charlie-tca> Go for it, please
[22:13] <madnick> okay, thanks :)
[22:13] <charlie-tca> Any other comments or questions on old business?
[22:13] <ChristopherNG> Hello, I hate to say something because im very new here, I was actually at the last meeting but remained silent.
[22:13] <charlie-tca> go ahead
[22:13] <ChristopherNG> I would like to confirm if xubuntu has an "add monitor" button like ubuntu and if not will it ever add one?
[22:14] <charlie-tca> where would it be?
[22:14] <ChristopherNG> display settings
[22:14] <ChristopherNG> i see it in ubuntu, never seen it for xubuntu
[22:14] <charlie-tca> Never seen it, maybe it is something from gnome instead of gtk
[22:15] <charlie-tca> We will not have one unless Xfce adds one to the settings panel
[22:15] <charlie-tca> ..
[22:15] <charlie-tca> #topic [22:15] <meetingology> TOPIC: [22:16] <charlie-tca> #topic [22:16] <meetingology> TOPIC: [22:16] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: Your turn, please
[22:17] <charlie-tca> micahg: Got an update?
[22:17] <micahg> last week we got a few updates from Debian
[22:17] <micahg> mr_pouit uploaded a new xubuntu settings package
[22:18] <micahg> we still have a couple of transitions to do (dh_python2 and libssl)
[22:18] <charlie-tca> We have pastebinit seeded, right?
[22:18] <micahg> yep
[22:18] <charlie-tca> and the big questions, a few bugs still to work on:
[22:18] <micahg> we're at 700MB onthe i386 live ISO ATM
[22:18] <charlie-tca> Bug #799754 Please let vendors easily provide their own config
[22:18] <charlie-tca> Is this fixed for us now?
[22:19] <micahg> idk
[22:19] <charlie-tca> Bug #799514 xubuntu-restricted-extras doesn't contain Java - non-default repository
[22:19] <charlie-tca> java is part of partners now, I don't know if we can add it to the package
[22:19] <charlie-tca> since partners is not enabled by default
[22:20] <micahg> so, there are 2 parts, right, adding sun-java is complicated for that reason
[22:20] <charlie-tca> right
[22:20] <micahg> openjdk is in there right now though
[22:20] <charlie-tca> yes
[22:20] <micahg> Ubuntu can't seed openjdk due to space
[22:20] <charlie-tca> So we should be able to sign that bug off with that
[22:21] <charlie-tca> We are close on space again. 386 desktop is now 700mb
[22:21] <micahg> charlie-tca: well, in theory, I guess we could at least suggest a partner package in xubuntu-restricted-extras, I didn't ask about that specifically
[22:22] <charlie-tca> If partner is not turned on by default, the user will have to specifically add it or we will get a broken package report, won't we?
[22:22] <micahg> hmm, I don't think so, on a suggests it for sure won't be a problem, gmusicbrowser suggests a package we dropped from the archive
[22:23] <charlie-tca> wait, if we provide openjdk, we don't need to provide sun java also
[22:23] <madnick> \o
[22:23] <charlie-tca> We give the user one of those, not both
[22:23] <charlie-tca> go ahead, madnick
[22:23] <madnick> openjdk cannot really measure with sun-java
[22:23] <micahg> well, openjdk is already in the restricted-addons package, the question was to actually see it or not, the reporter thought that sun-java made more sense in a restricted addons metapakcage
[22:23] <micahg> s/see/seed/
[22:24] <charlie-tca> but it is considered a valid open source replacement
[22:24] <charlie-tca> micahg: that is wishlist then. I don't think we should seed sun java.
[22:24] <micahg> no, we wouldn't seed sun-java, we could seed openjdk if we had the space and desire to though
[22:25] <charlie-tca> Yes, let's get things settled down, and see if that is possible.
[22:25] <charlie-tca> If we don't get it for Oneiric, that's not a problem, though.
[22:26] <charlie-tca> and, my last bug:
[22:26] <charlie-tca> Bug #789333 users-admin crashes on start because of mixed GTK2 and 3 symbols - we are the fix team if we plan to use this for the gui settings.
[22:26] <charlie-tca> If we aren't fixing this, we need to remove menu item
[22:27] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: any comment on this?
[22:27] <micahg> well, if we can't remove the dependency on the ported to GTK3 libraries, we'd have to drop it in favor of something else (if it exists)
[22:27] <charlie-tca> yup
[22:28] <micahg> or upload another copy of the GTK2 versions of those libs
[22:28] <charlie-tca> If nothing else exists, then users will have to use the CLI
[22:29] <charlie-tca> Any other comments or questions for Development?
[22:29] <micahg> mythbuntu, ubuntustudio, and lubuntu are all in the same boat, we should probably have a collective meeting about it
[22:29] <charlie-tca> Good idea, but that takes you and mr_pouit, right?
[22:30]  * astraljava would probably attend as well
[22:30] <micahg> + gilir, superm1, scottl
[22:30] <charlie-tca> oh, and let's not forget, astraljava would like to help with development too
[22:31] <charlie-tca> Okay, who is going to set that up?
[22:32] <micahg> hmm, I probably should I guess
[22:32] <charlie-tca> [ACTION] micahg will set up meeting with derivatives to decide what to do with bug 789333
[22:32] <meetingology> ACTION: micahg will set up meeting with derivatives to decide what to do with bug 789333
[22:33] <charlie-tca> Okay, include astraljava
[22:33] <charlie-tca> #topic [22:33] <meetingology> TOPIC: [22:33] <charlie-tca> We got working images!
[22:34] <charlie-tca> Very hard to test things when we don't get images all week
[22:34] <charlie-tca> today's images appear to be working fully.
[22:34] <charlie-tca> Any body that can test these this next week, please do so. We need to find out now what is working and what is broken.
[22:35] <charlie-tca> madnick: is plymouth ready to add to the images?
[22:35] <madnick> charlie-tca: yes and no:
[22:35] <madnick> oschi did not like it 100% knome said he'd think of something, but i have not recvied any word on it
[22:35] <charlie-tca> okay
[22:36] <charlie-tca> We got to have that next week
[22:36] <charlie-tca> I can't throw a new plymouth out for final, and then find out it don't work for most users
[22:36] <madnick> perhaps we could get people to look into what they think
[22:36] <madnick> Oh, it works technically
[22:36] <madnick> Its artistically they dont like it
[22:37] <madnick> well, "Not like", they wanted to change the progress bar
[22:37] <charlie-tca> Well, I would lean more to what ochosi thought at this point.
[22:37] <madnick> Problem is that ochosi is away
[22:38] <charlie-tca> okay, let's wait for them to do something. If we don't get them to decide, though, it may wind up waiting for the next release.
[22:39] <madnick> Okay, it be too bad, because its just a little detail :(
[22:39] <charlie-tca> yes, but a little detail is holding it up for at least two weeks already, right?
[22:39] <madnick> Yes, unfortunetly
[22:39] <charlie-tca> I still can't get it to work here, except for shutdown
[22:40] <madnick> Well, that is a plymouth problem, in that plymouth application itself, not sure if there is anything to do about that
[22:40] <madnick> The script I wrote works on all machines that usually get a splash
[22:41] <madnick> We are several versions behind on plymouth also
[22:41] <charlie-tca> !info plymouth
[22:42] <charlie-tca> !info plymouth oneiric
[22:42] <charlie-tca> Those aren't the latest, huh?
[22:42] <charlie-tca> 0.8.2
[22:43] <madnick> Hm
[22:43] <madnick> Now Im unsure about that
[22:43] <charlie-tca> Okay, try and get those two artists to give you something. I need this plymouth package ready by the next meeting
[22:44] <madnick> okay
[22:44] <charlie-tca> I think ochosi is back Monday, but I am unsure
[22:44] <charlie-tca> Does anyone besides me find the bug tracker at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Bugs/OneiricOcelot handy?
[22:45] <charlie-tca> I seem to find myself looking at that daily
[22:45] <astraljava> Looks handy indeed. Just didn't know about it until now.
[22:45] <charlie-tca> #topic [22:45] <meetingology> TOPIC: [22:45] <charlie-tca> pleia2, knome : any update?
[22:46] <charlie-tca> #topic [22:46] <meetingology> TOPIC: [22:46] <charlie-tca>  * The next meeting will be on Sunday, 2011-08-22 at 19:00 UTC
[22:46] <charlie-tca>  * Important dates coming up:
[22:46] <charlie-tca>   * 11.10 FeatureFreeze : In effect as of August 11, 2011 at 21:00 UTC
[22:46] <charlie-tca>   * 11.10 BetaFreeze: Aug 25, 2011 at 21:00 UTC
[22:46] <charlie-tca>   * User Interface Freeze : August 25, 2011 at 21:00 UTC
[22:47] <charlie-tca>   * 11.10 Release Date: October 13, 2011
[22:47] <charlie-tca>   * UDS-P will be in Orlando, Florida the week of October 31 - Nov 4. Please apply for sponsorship by August 24.
[22:47] <charlie-tca>   * UDS-P information at http://ubuntu-news.org/2011/07/15/ubuntu-developer-summit-sponsorship-now-open-2/
[22:47] <charlie-tca> Thik I covered all the important ones there
[22:47] <charlie-tca> s/thik/think
[22:47] <charlie-tca> #topic [22:47] <meetingology> TOPIC: [22:47] <charlie-tca> [22:48] <charlie-tca>  * The governancy part of the current Strategy Document can be found at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/StrategyDocument#Xubuntu_Governance_.26_Team_Structure
[22:48] <charlie-tca> Since I have gotten a couple of comments/questions concerning the proposed, the review period will run one more week.
[22:49] <charlie-tca> #topic [22:49] <meetingology> TOPIC: [22:49] <charlie-tca> anything can be brought up at this time.
[22:49] <charlie-tca> Are there any comments or questions still out there?
[22:50] <charlie-tca> I will thank each and every one of you for participating in this meeting.
[22:50] <charlie-tca> We will meet again right here in one week.
[22:50] <micahg> err, 8 days :)
[22:50] <charlie-tca> anything...
[22:51] <charlie-tca> um, okay, just over one week
[22:51] <charlie-tca> lol
[22:51] <charlie-tca> anything at all?
[22:51] <charlie-tca> Let's go get something done.
[22:51] <charlie-tca> #endmeeting
[22:51] <meetingology> Meeting ended Sun Aug 14 22:51:36 2011 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot . (v 0.1.4)
[22:51] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2011/xubuntu-devel.2011-08-14-22.02.moin.txt
[22:51] <micahg> thanks charlie-tca
[22:51] <madnick> :)
[22:51] <charlie-tca> Thank you
[22:52] <astraljava> Wait, what?
[22:52] <charlie-tca> madnick: I know, I know. getting pushy
[22:52] <astraljava> Sunday's not 22nd.
[22:52] <charlie-tca> Should be Monday next time
[22:52] <charlie-tca> Let's keep it a little bit confusing, right? ;)
[22:52] <astraljava> Hehe. :D
[22:53] <astraljava> Sure.
[22:53] <astraljava> Okay, off to bed. Later!
[22:53] <madnick> later
[22:53] <charlie-tca> Good night
[22:54] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit is back, but must be busy, I see he removed the away today.
[22:56] <ChristopherNG> is the meeting over?
[22:56] <madnick> yes
[22:56] <ChristopherNG> that was really short :(
[22:56]  * madnick is getting awesome download speed on todays images :)
[22:56] <charlie-tca> rub it in... ;)
[22:57] <charlie-tca> 386 alternate install gives a beautiful pink lightdm screen
[22:57] <ChristopherNG> its on charlie-tca you have all the hershey bars
[22:57] <ChristopherNG> ok*
[22:57] <madnick> Ill put this on my devstation, and start building the LDM greeter
[22:57] <charlie-tca> at least 64bit had blue backgrounds
[23:34] <madnick> whats a aLinux? :)
[23:34]  * madnick files bug report
[23:38] <charlie-tca>  a what?
[23:39] <madnick> additonal drivers wants to install "support for aLinux host"
[23:39] <madnick> Just a typo


[10:26] <daftykins> phew still got aches today xD
[10:27] <daftykins> if i did work like that more often, i would probably invest in some proper knee pads for all the floor time
[10:28] <daftykins> hmm so nvidia outed nothing at their computex event, or at least not the new generation of consumer graphics cards the rumour mill was expecting
[10:32] <zxmpi> next time aldi or lidl have a garderning sale get a foam kneeling pad https://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/371241560370-0-1/s-l1000.jpg
[10:33] <zxmpi> costs a fiver or less and is much more comfy to kneel on while working
[10:33] <zxmpi> doesn't take much space in bag and will add protection beside laptop
[10:35] <daftykins> ah yeah i think i've seen my parents have one similar, don't have those shops here though mind
[10:36] <daftykins> so i mostly focussed on that cupboard and the office it was in yesterday, but the big cheese's desk has two cables i can't locate the other ends of xD bit of a dealbreaker at present
[10:36] <zxmpi> life without access to aldi or lidl? what do you do when you want to go for a pint of milk and come home with scuba and welding gear?!
[10:36] <daftykins> still got to head out across all 4 storeys of the property and replace white plastic sockets for his silly new metal ones
[10:37] <zxmpi> but any gardening place should have the foam kneelers
[10:37] <daftykins> yeah that's true
[10:38] <daftykins> hmm wonder how to track down the missing one
[10:38] <zxmpi> or even a bigger kneeler that's also a seat which might suit having to sit/kneel in awkward places for hours at a time
[10:39] <daftykins> even with a tone generator clipped onto a single wire, i was finding nothing in the cupboard end D:
[10:44] <zxmpi> you may be working under the assumption that a wire has 2 ends :-P
[10:44] <daftykins> :D
[10:44] <daftykins> it is quite funny that there's a set of 4 that neither me nor the electricians can work out where lead to (they predate both our involvement with the property though)
[10:45] <zxmpi> a common fallacy that any electrician will quickly correct
[10:46] <daftykins> the pair i'm lost on were previously something else and have been repurposed, so it could be that i should be checking the telephone box, hrmm
[10:47] <daftykins> his PA's desk is fine :D all 4 were brand new!
[10:50] <zxmpi> get a metal detector and try and follow them in wall/floor?
[10:52] <daftykins> too close to everything else really
[11:04] <zxmpi> and your tricorder project isn't complete then? :-P
[11:07] <daftykins> something something supply chain :(
[11:07] <zxmpi> getting your mitts on tachyon tubes is next to impossible at the best of times :-P
[11:09] <daftykins> have you given that "Strange New Worlds" Trek a try yet?
[11:10] <zxmpi> watched first episode of st:std and was put right off. in no hurry to watch new series not even lower decks thingy
[11:10] <daftykins> what's that, Discovery? that's another of the hollywood-ised action packed junk i won't touch
[11:10] <daftykins> SNW is great though :D ye olde style
[11:11] <zxmpi> if they had of called it something else other than trek i would have watched and enjoyed. but once the trek label is on it it will be compared to every trek before it
[11:12] <zxmpi> now when series ends and is on dvd i might find it in bargin bin and buy and like it. kinda what happen with voyager where i gave up on it while it was on air
[11:16] <daftykins> i'd be surprised if that continues to happen in future
[11:18] <zxmpi> yeah, i can see dvd releases being fewer and further between. but paramount makes a fortune on box sets i would think
[11:19] <daftykins> certainly a preference to my mind, not like they can disappear from your shelves :D (aside from theft or loaning to unreliable individuals)
[11:19] <zxmpi> tos on vhs kerching, dvd ditto, blu ray remasters again. 3 sales for the cost of 1 series
[11:20] <zxmpi> probably some bugger still trying to get it on betamax :-D
[11:20] <daftykins> heh
[11:21] <daftykins> who did i see repairing a VCR the other day, i think it was Adrian Black... classic
[11:21] <zxmpi> remember laserdisc is the best version of first star wars movie as it's the highest rez version where hans shoots first and no tacked on cgi
[11:24] <zxmpi> took me ages to rip all of ds9 to my mac mini at the time. but those files sit on my phone 24x7 along with voyager, enterprise, animated plus a dozen other tv shows
[11:24] <daftykins> seems like such a bad medium, but then i'm no fan of the content either (:
[11:25] <zxmpi> star wars is... nice. i liked it as a kid and i'd watch it again. but i'm not a star wars fanboy. a trekkie yes.
[11:26] <daftykins> hmm maybe i'll visit the cabling job again today, unanswered questions and unfinished tasks just sit and prey on my mind until i do!
[11:27] <zxmpi> drives you bonkers till you reach the end of your cat-5 cable :-P
[11:51] <daftykins> 6! 5 is ancient :P
[11:51] <zxmpi> solid reliable. almost as good as co-ax :-D
[11:54] <daftykins> no you wouldn't pick an older standard just 'cause you think it's somehow reliable, times moved on
[11:54] <daftykins> price difference is negligible too
[11:55] <zxmpi> i don't know. this new fangled wish washy namby pamby cat 6... :-P
[11:56] <daftykins> hmm thinking more, maybe i won't go up there today... have to cook tonight and i don't want to be similarly knackered xD that can be Wednesday's job
[11:56] <zxmpi> get a foam pad. your knees will thank you
[11:56] <zxmpi> even a block of polystyrene in a pinch
[12:04] <daftykins> i had taken up a pair o' trousers yesterday but it was too hot to work in them, i knelt on those instead xD
[12:36] <zxmpi> time to break out the cargo pants of tech support :-)
[12:37] <daftykins> some 3/4 length shorts with many pockets might work well
[12:41] <zxmpi> and the brown sandals of unix geekdom
[12:42] <daftykins> davef took my allocation of questionable footwear ;)
[12:42]  * daftykins ducks
[12:45] <davef> that maybe so, but at least i'm comfortable
[12:46] <davef> I used to be an adventurer like you, until I took a croc to the knee.
[12:46] <daftykins> xD
[17:44] <daftykins> zxmpi: hey there's a guy near you selling a 'QuikLoader' card for the Apple II :D https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/125328658604
[19:33] <zxmpi> based in ireland is... vague. could be in arse end of donegal or kerry. about 12 hours away be car and 10 years of time dilation :-P
[19:34] <zxmpi> when our gopher had to drive to donegal or kerry he added a few hours to drive though sheep, geese, cattle, llamas to reach destination :-)
[19:36] <daftykins> but it says Ratoath!
[19:36] <zxmpi> ah missed that bit
[19:36] <daftykins> pretty funny name
[19:37] <zxmpi> rath means ring and so it means ring of tó
[19:37] <zxmpi> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ratoath
[19:38] <zxmpi> a solid hour out of dublin
[19:39] <daftykins> :D
[19:39] <daftykins> so that's 1.33 laps o' Guernsey


[08:08] <phr34k> can anybody help me, yesterday suddenly snapcraft stopped working (version was bumped from 7.5.3 to 7.5.4) -- and now some vague error about craft providers cannot start instance and check lxd logs, and inside of the lxd logs there is some error that instance type is not operational because kvm support is missing.
[08:08] <phr34k> I am not sure what is wrong here, but i am pretty annoyed at this fragile system because everything was working fine before, and now even reverting snapcraft didn't actually do anything.
[14:12] <mup> PR snapcraft#4474 closed: chore(deps): update internal packages <Dependencies> <Created by renovate[bot]> <Merged by mr-cal> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/4474>
[15:21] <mup> PR snapd#13401 opened: o/snapstate: make tests work consistently also in containers <Skip spread> <Created by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13401>
[15:31] <mup> PR snapd#13402 opened: boot: prune some bootchains that should not happen <Created by valentindavid> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13402>
[16:38] <mup> PR snapcraft#4449 closed: [WIP] feat: craft-application basic scaffolding <Created by lengau> <Closed by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/4449>
[16:38] <mup> PR snapcraft#4473 closed: chore(deps): update bugfixes <Dependencies> <Created by renovate[bot]> <Merged by sergiusens> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/4473>
[16:42] <mup> PR snapd#13401 closed: o/snapstate: make tests work consistently also in containers <Skip spread> <Created by pedronis> <Merged by pedronis> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/13401>
[17:48] <mup> Issue snapcraft#4476 opened: Support a Snapcraft ROCK <Enhancement> <Created by tigarmo> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/issues/4476>
[19:33] <mup> PR snapcraft#4477 opened: snapcraft: Allow equal sign in commands <Created by 3v1n0> <https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/4477>


[01:10] <jac76> euxneks: if it's not to late, and not knowing how many users are on your "mint" system, you might want to keep a copy of the /etc/passwd and /etc/group files to make sure your users get back the same "uid" and "gid" numbers.
[01:20] <jac76> The file header info on files store user numbers not the actual user names.  Names are interpreted from the numbers.
[02:09] <Snowie> Hi all. Upgrade 16.04 to 17.04 and have the no mouse keyboard issue. Trying to fix that and I have a DNS issue. Trying to enable networking in recovery tells me cannot find resolved.conf and even manually creating it didn't seem to work. Can ping my router and google.dns <IP_ADDRESS> but can't get this thing resolving names. Any advice?
[02:09] <Snowie> *resolv.conf damn android autocorrect
[02:10] <Snowie> Sorry, also 16.10 to 17.04. can't blame autocorrect for that
[02:20] <Bashing-om> Snowie: Maybe: https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2358660 .
[02:21] <Snowie> Thanks, will take a look
[02:22] <getynge> Is there a way to reconfigure input devices on 17.10 (wayland)?  I'm using x11 right now and I have a config that treats my touchscreen digitizer as a wacom pen, which I then change the writing behavior of to fix some issues I've been having with my pen.  The pen works fine in x11 but I want to be able to use wayland instead, namely for DPI scaling
[02:29] <Snowie> Methods 1 and 2 no joy. Can't do 3 as need GUI and have no keyboard or mouse there. Recovery mode when choosing enable networking gives error grep: /etc/resolved.conf: no such file or directory
[02:30] <Snowie> At that point I can ping gateway and <IP_ADDRESS> but not resolve any names.
[02:35] <Bashing-om> Snowie: ' ls -al /etc/resolv.conf ' . where I expect a symlink to /run/resolvconf/resolv.conf .
[02:37] <Snowie> No synlink that I see. How to add please?
[02:37] <Snowie> Wait
[02:38] <Snowie> Link is to /var/run/Network manager/resolv.conf
[02:38] <Snowie> Excuse the autocorrect
[02:39] <Snowie> I guess that's the issue? I don't have that file in /run on my system either though :(
[02:40] <Bashing-om> Snowie: Humm .. I do not have access to 17.04++ so can not verify that 16.04 (my install ) is the dame : " ../run/resolvconf/resolv.conf " .. that is a different path than yours !
[02:40] <Bashing-om> same*
[02:41] <Snowie> Yeah, 17.04 switched to systemd's resolver is what I'm reading. What a PITA! Not bashing systemd, just frustrated.
[02:41] <Bashing-om> Snowie:
[02:41] <Bashing-om> Snowie: ' ls -al /run/resolvconf/resolv.conf ' shows what ?
[02:42] <Snowie> Think I'm due for a clean install anyway. This must be my 3rd dist-upgrade on this box.
[02:42] <jac76> I have installed 17.10 on an old netbook, booting....  I'll check
[02:42] <Snowie> It doesn't exist, but I'll double check.
[02:42] <Bashing-om> jac76: :) ... thanks .
[02:43] <Snowie> Cannot access: no such file or directory
[02:43] <Bashing-om> Snowie: ^^ we await jac76 results  .
[02:44] <jac76> in /etc I have a soft link named resolv.conf pointing to ../run/systemd/resolve.stub-resolv.conf
[02:45] <jac76> oops resolve/stub-resolv.conf
[02:45] <Snowie> Haha. Thanks for your help guys. Really just want to get back to playing F1 2017 lol. I upgraded as recommended. Should have known, I've been way too lucky with this system. First real problem I've had
[02:46] <Snowie> Ok, let me check if that exists on my system first
[02:47] <Snowie> Wait /etc/run... No run directory in etc here???
[02:48] <jac76> the ".." means go up a directory level
[02:48] <jac76> so "../run" means that "run" is at the same level as etc, not under etc
[02:49] <Snowie> Ok. In /run/systemd there is no folder called resolve
[02:49] <jac76> hmmm....
[02:50] <Snowie> Circular loop lol, can't install if can't resolve and can't resolve if can't install it seems
[02:51] <Bashing-om> Snowie: " sysop@x1604:~$ ls -al /run/resolvconf/resolv.conf >> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 172 Nov  3 11:43 /run/resolvconf/resolv.conf
[02:51] <Bashing-om> "
[02:52] <Snowie> Only thing in that folder is is another folder called "interface"
[02:53] <Snowie> No other file there at all.
[02:53] <oerheks> changes do no good, without systemctl restart resolvconf
[02:54] <Bashing-om> Snowie: Suspicious, but I can not confirm .
[02:54] <jac76> The file " stub-resolv.conf" has the following comments
[02:54] <jac76> This file is managed by man:systemd-resolved(8). Do not edit
[02:55] <jac76> run "systemd-resolve --status" to see details about the actual nameservers."
[02:56] <jac76> then it has an entry of "nameserver <IP_ADDRESS>"
[02:56] <twistedline> anyone know how I can fix these giant gnome-shell notification icons https://i.imgur.com/3bXMjhN.png
[02:56] <twistedline> its so annoying
[03:01] <jac76> snowie: do a "ps ax | grep systemd"
[03:01] <jac76> see if there is a "systemd-resolved" process running
[03:02] <jac76> that is apparently the new DNS resolver
[03:13] <jac76> Apparently a whole lot has changed in 17.10 regarding setting up networks see this link "https://websiteforstudents.com/configuring-static-ips-ubuntu-17-10-servers/"
[03:25] <jac76> according to this web site tutorial you creat/edit a file named "/etc/netplan/*.yaml"
[03:25] <jac76> once you insert the correctly formatted information into that file you then run a tool "sudo netplan apply" which sets up all the related network files.
[03:27] <jac76> so it's all text based and Snowie could do it at the command line.
[03:28] <Bashing-om> jac76: However, with a GUI does not network-manager still controll networking ?
[03:31] <jac76> In looking at my 17.10 system that configuration file appears to call NetworkManager as the "renderer".  But it looks like you can by pass NetWorkManager and completely configure a static IP address and DNS route from that one file
[03:31] <jac76> that one file being "/etc/netplan/*.yaml"
[03:32] <Bashing-om> jac76: :) . See how this plays .
[03:33] <jac76> The first paragraph in that web site I referenced talked about how completely network setup had change in 17.10
[03:34] <jac76> I wonder if anyone will notice?
[03:34] <jac76> :-)
[03:36] <jac76> to bad Snowie didn't stick around long enough for me to read these files, but then I am sort of a slow reader.
[03:41] <Bashing-om> jac76: Any consolation, noted here for the next time .
[03:42] <jac76> yep, do the following google search "how to setup DNS in ubuntu 17.10" and prepare to be surprised.
[03:44] <Bashing-om> hanna: Ho kay ,, I do ^ ,
[04:08] <Bashing-om> jac76: http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-16-10-yakkety-yak-switches-to-a-universal-local-dns-resolver-service-504770.shtml // universal local DNS resolver service for all Ubuntu Linux flavors, including Ubuntu Desktop, Ubuntu Server, and Ubuntu Touch.
[04:11] <jac76> I continued to read and found several instances of people upgrading from 16.04 to 17.10 and running into DNS problems.  People are finding several way to work around their problems, not all of the are things I would recommend at this point.
[04:12] <jac76> desperation and confusion breed unsound solutions.
[04:14] <metaphysician> What is Ubuntu kernel SAUCE?
[04:18] <jac76> I did a google search and "SAUCE" appers to be a patch
[04:20] <jac76> apparently based on an older kernel "3.13.0-21.43"
[04:20] <lu_tze> holy sh*t, disabling language support keyboard input did wonders for the performance.
[04:21] <bcowan> SAUCE are patches that havent made it into the mainline kernel
[04:21] <bcowan> thats all
[04:22] <metaphysician> bcowan: Or rather, SAUCE are Ubuntu-specific modifications to kernel source? Not always intended to be upstreamed?
[04:23] <bcowan> SAUCE are intended to be upstream waiting to be included, not ubuntu specific
[04:24] <metaphysician> Ok
[04:24] <bcowan> metaphysician, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/FAQ/UbuntuDelta
[04:24] <wyseguy> hey all
[08:30] <taneli> i can no longer use thinkpad dock audio in 17.10---it shows up, and if i select it in sound settings, the test sounds are still routed to internal speakers
[08:31] <taneli> how do i even start debugging this?
[08:36] <morphles> rx 570, ubuntu 17.10 installed amdgpu pro tryting to get hdmi audio, now "get no graphics" in a strange way. Seems gdm things it started, mouse shows if I move, but nothing graphical is vissible, instead tty is visible, well not tty as no login prompt just boot log message (no errors)
[08:36] <morphles> anyone familiar with such
[08:37] <morphles> seems like gdm is in some transparent framebuffer above tty/boot log, but no pixels are being drawn for gdm, just mouse, and only while moving...
[08:39] <morphles> how is the channel with 1k users so quet?!
[08:43] <hrzhu> I wonder what program provides the support for laptop keyboard shortcuts? I'm using Xubuntu 17.04
[08:43] <hrzhu> all of my laptop shortcuts works in Xfce4-session
[08:45] <hrzhu> they don't work if I log into awesome wm. I want to know what program controls these shortcuts so that I can run it in awesome wm.
[08:55] <luc4> Hello! Anyone actually running ubuntu wayland on a laptop including nvidia? Can nvidia be completely disabled in favor of intel ro be able to run wayland?
[09:35] <arunkumar413> unable to install opera browser
[09:36] <arunkumar413> can someone help
[09:36] <arunkumar413> getting this error message
[09:36] <arunkumar413> dpkg: regarding opera-stable_45.0.2552.898_i386.deb containing opera-stable:i386, pre-dependency problem:
[09:36] <arunkumar413>  opera-stable:i386 pre-depends on apt-transport-https
[09:36] <arunkumar413> dpkg: error processing archive opera-stable_45.0.2552.898_i386.deb (--install):
[09:36] <arunkumar413>  pre-dependency problem - not installing opera-stable:i386
[09:36] <arunkumar413> Errors were encountered while processing:
[09:36] <arunkumar413>  opera-stable_45.0.2552.898_i386.deb
[09:38] <taneli> arunkumar413, "sudo apt-get install apt-transport-https" then try again
[09:39] <arunkumar413> tried  but still getting the same error
[09:45] <ledeni> arunkumar413, install proper file opera-stable_48.0.2685.52_amd64.deb
[09:47] <arunkumar413> ledeni: seems like i'm installlingn the i386 version
[09:47] <arunkumar413> is there an amd64 version
[09:47] <arunkumar413> I don't see any on the opera website
[09:48] <ledeni> arunkumar413, tell us uname -r
[09:48] <arunkumar413> arun
[09:57] <arunkumar413> ledeni: what is uname?
[09:58] <arunkumar413> ledeni: 4.10.0-38-generic
[09:59] <ledeni> arunkumar413, you running ubuntu 17.10?
[09:59] <arunkumar413> ledeni: just upgraded not sure to which version it's upgraded
[10:00] <ledeni> arunkumar413, with kernel you have look like it is 17.10
[10:00] <ledeni> arunkumar413, you need  opera-stable_48.0.2685.52_amd64.deb
[10:01] <arunkumar413> ledeni: 17.04
[10:02] <arunkumar413> ledeni: where do i get it
[10:02] <ledeni> arunkumar413, from web page
[10:02] <arunkumar413> ledeni: there isn't any link
[10:02] <ledeni> arunkumar413,yes it is
[10:03] <arunkumar413> found it
[10:05] <arunkumar413> ledeni: now its installling
[10:05] <arunkumar413> first time it downloaded the i386 version
[10:05] <ledeni> arunkumar413,:)
[10:05] <ledeni> arunkumar413,that is old file
[10:11] <FManTropyx> this is impressive: Downloaded: 26 files, 1.0G in 12s (87.5 MB/s)
[10:27]  * FManTropyx 109MB/s
[10:28] <bazhang> FManTropyx, support issues related to that?
[10:29] <FManTropyx> no, for once things are working for me :D downloading to my German VPS from fau.de ftp server
[10:29] <bazhang> lets keep the chatter to the offtopic channels please FManTropyx
[10:30] <arijit_> Any support guys here who could help me out??
[10:30] <FManTropyx> bragging about transfer speed is not on topic???
[10:30] <bazhang> FManTropyx, no
[10:30] <FManTropyx> okay then :)
[10:30] <arijit_> I am facing trouble with some updates and install isssues..
[10:31] <arijit_>  sudo apt install hexchat
[10:31] <arijit_> E: Could not get lock /var/lib/dpkg/lock - open (11: Resource temporarily unavailable)
[10:31] <arijit_> E: Unable to lock the administration directory (/var/lib/dpkg/), is another process using it?
[10:31] <arijit_> Whenever I m trying to install or update through terminal I m facing this above error.
[10:31] <bazhang> arijit_, do you have more than one instance of apt running
[10:32] <arijit_> Nopes..Just my terminal..
[10:33] <Duku98> arijit do sudo rm /var/lib/apt/lists/lock and then sudo rm /var/cache/apt/archives/lock and finally sudo rm /var/lib/dpkg/lock
[10:33] <alkisg> arijit_: it might be the unattended upgrades task
[10:33] <alkisg> software-properties-gtk => put them to prompt you
[10:34] <arijit_> How to do it @alkisg..
[10:34] <arijit_> Sorry I m new to ubuntu..Thinking of switching to ubuntu forever..
[10:35] <arijit_> But I m facing a bit of obstacles..
[10:35] <Duku98> i installed ubuntu 4 days ago from win10
[10:35] <arijit_> @duku98 it worked thanks man.
[10:36] <Duku98> no problem arijit_
[10:36] <arijit_> haha. I have worked with ubuntu but only in dual boot or VM.. Thinking to switching on to it as permaneent..
[10:37] <Duku98> I had Win10 for 2 years and then i switched
[10:37] <Sveta_> great
[10:37] <bazhang> Duku98, did you mean wsl ubuntu on windows?
[10:37] <Duku98> what is wsl?
[10:38] <bazhang> Duku98, ubuntu on windows
[10:38] <Duku98> nope
[10:38] <alkisg> arijit_: run the command i said from a terminal
[10:38] <bazhang> Duku98, you said /from win10'
[10:38] <Duku98> Switched from Windows 10 to Ubuntu 17.10
[10:39] <Sveta_> yes, I got that
[10:41] <arijit_> Ok @alkisg
[10:41] <Duku98> :)
[10:42] <arijit_> Is everyone over here are from different countries ??
[10:42] <Sven_vB> yes
[10:42] <Duku98> I'm from Italy
[10:42] <arijit_> I'm from India.
[10:43] <Duku98> afk for a second
[10:44] <arijit_> Are u all developers or programmers ?? Or some normal guys are also out ere ??
[10:44] <arijit_> *here
[10:44] <bazhang> arijit_, thats a great topic for #ubuntu-offtopic , here is ubuntu support not chit chat
[10:45] <Duku98> @arijit im a normal guy
[10:45] <arijit_> Sorry bazhang..
[10:45] <arijit_> Thanks guys..Prob. Solved..
[11:10] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[11:17] <_vince> guys what is the best script blocker extension for chromium?
[11:17] <_vince> the equivalent on noscript
[11:17] <_vince> of
[11:38] <CptLuxx> okay.. what the heck.. i need to do some things on ubuntu in a long time and "systemctl restart network" is not found.. any one know why? i use centos normaly
[11:40] <brainwash> CptLuxx: you probably want to restart the networkmanager
[11:40] <CptLuxx> what
[11:40] <BluesKaj> CptLuxx, tell us your real issue
[11:41] <CptLuxx> no? i just want to restart the network on this machine oO
[11:42] <brainwash> could be "networking" instead of "network"
[11:43] <CptLuxx> nope
[11:43] <TJ-> CptLuxx: "sudo systemctl restart network-manager.service"
[11:43] <TJ-> CptLuxx: if not that service, then check which you need. possibly "networking.service"
[11:43] <brainwash> wow
[11:43] <CptLuxx> *sighs* nope
[11:44] <brainwash> I've already mentioned both possibilities
[11:45] <TJ-> CptLuxx: which release of Ubuntu is it, which network config tool is the system using?
[11:45] <CptLuxx> brand new 17.10
[11:45] <CptLuxx> installed 30min ago i think
[11:45] <TJ-> CptLuxx: is it server or desktop?
[11:45] <BluesKaj> CptLuxx, sudo systemctl disable NetworkManager.service, then sudo systemctl enable NetworkManager.service
[11:45] <CptLuxx> server
[11:46] <CptLuxx> realy BluesKaj?
[11:46] <TJ-> CptLuxx: OK, it'll have used netplan to configure systemd-networkd.service
[11:46] <TJ-> CptLuxx: "sudo systemctl restart systemd-networkd.service" should do it
[11:46] <CptLuxx> m( thats it TJ-!
[11:47] <TJ-> CptLuxx: right... networking is in a state of flux. In 17.10 we dropped the old ifupdown in favour or systemd-networkd, but on desktops it's still using Network Manager for obvious usability reasons
[11:48] <TJ-> CptLuxx: configs are in /etc/systemd/network/
[11:48] <CptLuxx> well.. why not like on centos?
[11:48] <BluesKaj> CptLuxx, it used to work when I used NM, but I haven't used them since I stopped using NM
[11:49] <TJ-> CptLuxx: Ubuntu mostly follows Debian althougn in this we've diverged, mostly due to Canonical's focus on servers/VMs
[11:49] <CptLuxx> right but i remember that it was even systemctl restart networking on debian
[11:50] <TJ-> CptLuxx: it'd be "networking.service"  ... which called the sysvinit ifupdown /etc/inti.d/networking script which called ifup/ifdown using the config in /etc/network/interfaces
[11:50] <CptLuxx> finding this out on ubuntu took me 15 minutes..
[11:50] <TJ-> CptLuxx: it's in the 17.10 release notes :)
[11:50] <CptLuxx> damn
[11:50] <CptLuxx> well i did not install this.. :p
[11:50] <TJ-> CptLuxx: :p
[11:51] <TJ-> CptLuxx: I do think it'd be nice that when things change a surrogate is put in place to tell you the new way of doing things when you use older familiar commands
[11:51] <CptLuxx> yes
[11:51] <TJ-> Seems to me like all this race into Machine Learning ought first to be applied to the machines themselves!
[11:52] <CptLuxx> ahhh why did this coworker install this
[11:52] <CptLuxx> not even powershell is available as package for 17.04
[11:52] <TheWild> hello
[11:54] <TheWild> not about Ubuntu specificaly, rather Linux in general, there's one question that still bugs me. I want to run closed-source programs, but since "this is *my* computer and *I* will decide how it works", I would like to hook specific operations like requesting current time (so that I can fake the current time), receiving/sending packets (so that I can intercept and modify them), etc.
[11:54] <TheWild> so, is Linux the OS that would let me do so or it is just a dream?
[11:55] <tesla_> you're losing the element of control when you run closed source programs
[11:56] <brainwash> !ot
[11:56] <Duku98> :)
[11:57] <TheWild> I've asked on #linux, but they haven't answered yet (or just haven't answered).
[11:58] <tesla_> i think linux is more 'the kernel' rather than the operating system
[11:58] <tesla_> is that not true ??
[11:58] <TheWild> but if the program uses shared linux libraries, wouldn't it be possible to hook some functions?
[11:58] <tesla_> you should install ubuntu in a VM and try it
[11:59] <TJ-> TheWild: you can use the kernel netfilters layer (via the iptables/ip6tables) tools to intercept network packets and redirect them to some process that wants to do something with them. You can use fakeroot/chroot type tools or containers/VMs to restrict them. There are standard library shims that allow you to intercept/modify library calls (LD_LIBRARY_PATH is one, basic, way to implement that)
[12:01] <BluesKaj> CptLuxx, install nmcli then these commands should work, sudo nmcli networking off, and, sudo nmcli networking on
[12:02] <TheWild> okay, thank you TJ-
[12:03] <CptLuxx> k BluesKaj
[12:04] <CptLuxx> i.. think i can work for a while with that till there is an powershell release
[12:05] <jeremies> preserving /home directory in a reinstallation of ubuntu can cause conflicts in configuration (because of new versions of software)?
[12:06] <TJ-> jeremies: it's possible. Always best to back-up at least the $HOME/.dotfiles and .dotdirectories
[12:09] <jeremies> TJ-: but I mean if its safe to preserve home directory or it can cause security threats?
[12:12] <TJ-> jeremies: I can't imagine a security threat based on contents of $HOME config files. What I have seen in the past is a /home/ file-system shared amongst different distros/releases with different versions of the same application, and that application upgrades the schema on an internal database table. When older versions of that application are run they fail since they don't understand the newer schema
[12:18] <rh10> guys. i've canon LBP2900 and there are drivers for it (CAPT) http://support-sg.canon-asia.com/contents/SG/EN/0100459601.html
[12:18] <jeremies> TJ-: ok. And when you use the update manager to install a new version of ubuntu, do you know if in some way the configuration files are processed to agree with the new version of the software?
[12:18] <rh10> i see printer in system, any params. but it's not print anything :)
[12:19] <rh10> jobs go to que, and nothing
[12:19] <rh10> i've rebooted system too
[12:19] <rh10> ubuntu 16.04
[12:19] <rh10> xfce desktop
[12:20] <rh10> what i did wrong?
[12:24] <TJ-> jeremies: yes. Every Debian package has upgrade scripts. there's .preinst, .postinst, .prerm, .postrm which the 'dpkg' tool runs as it is installing/upgrading packages. The package maintainers add code to those to cope with supported version upgrades
[12:28] <jeremies> TJ-: So, suppose you have ubuntu 16.04 and you install 17.04 from a live cd if you preserve $HOME, then these upgrade scripts will be run?
[12:29] <TJ-> jeremies: I'm not 100% sure for that. As far as I was aware from the installer it'll just write over everything in-place. upgrade scripts are run as a result of "apt-get dist-upgrade" or "do-release-upgrade"
[12:31] <jeremies> TJ-: ok, thank you very much!! :)
[12:34] <BluesKaj> jeremies, my experience with /home is to put it  and / on separate partitions. then during an upgrade just install to / and set the mountpoint for /home thus prederving all your DE configfiels and default app configs. I've never had problems using that method including upgrading LYS releases.
[12:34] <beanbagula> I primarily use my laptop (osx) for development, but have recently started using a desktop box running ubuntu. I would like as much consistency between keyboards as possible - is there some tool that solves the ctrl/cmd problem?
[12:34] <BluesKaj> LTS releases
[12:35] <beanbagula> That is, you might use cmd t to open a new tab on osx, but ctrl t on ubuntu. I feel like people must have run into this before.
[12:36] <BluesKaj> jeremies, hope you were able to decode my spelling mistakes :-)
[12:37] <jeremies> BluesKaj: yes, I do this way too, but in some cases I have problems with the wifi passwords sharing across users
[12:38] <jeremies> BluesKaj: Do you know how to purge wifi configurations, to resolve the problem?
[12:38] <BluesKaj> jeremies, ok, never encountered that , I'm a single home user
[12:38] <EriC^^> jeremies: click on the network manager > edit connections
[12:40] <jeremies> EriC^^: And then erase all the connections?
[12:41] <EriC^^> jeremies: yeah
[12:42] <littlepython> could anyone tell me a book to learn under the hood what happens whenever we run any command
[12:42] <littlepython> or about internals
[12:42] <kostkon> littlepython, that's way too vague
[12:42] <littlepython> kostkon: you would suggest any good linux books?
[12:42] <jeremies> EriC^^: Ok, I'll try that later (I've to restart the computer for that)  but I think in the past I did this and the problem was not resolved.
[12:43] <kostkon> littlepython, no, but the web is full of either free ebooks or recommendations for good dead tree ones
[12:43] <littlepython> oh ok
[12:47] <TJ-> littlepython: try the Linux Documentation Project http://tldp.org/
[13:04] <alkisg> (02:28:19 μμ) jeremies: TJ-: So, suppose you have ubuntu 16.04 and you install 17.04 from a live cd if you preserve $HOME, then these upgrade scripts will be run? => upgrade scripts never touch home, as part of the debian policy. They can only change some settings in /etc, and not even settings provided by other packages.
[13:05] <alkisg> $HOME settings upgrade can happen only after user login
[13:09] <TJ-> alkisg: correct; and only as a result of executing the application (which could be autorun of course)
[13:21] <chris__>  When you say things couldn't suck more (compiz)  ubuntu switches to gnome. Omg this freaking mutter compositor completely cripples any 3d game !!
[13:23] <rh10> i 've tried https://askubuntu.com/questions/805015/how-to-install-lbp-printer-driver-in-ubuntu-16-04lts
[13:23] <rh10> but nope
[13:25] <skinux> Anyone have a trusted app that takes a screenshot, uploads it to the web and provides a link to share?
[13:27] <scattrbrain> hey i could use some help guys
[13:27] <alkisg> !ask
[13:28] <scattrbrain> sorry lol
[13:29] <alkisg> skinux: https://askubuntu.com/questions/177921/whats-a-screenshot-application-which-will-auto-upload-to-imgur
[13:32] <scattrbrain> !ask i'm dual booting windows 10 and ubuntu 16.04 LTS. my wifi on windows is fine, my wifi on ubuntu has been crap even after multiple fresh install attempts. i initally had the problem shown in this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dahjlku7idQ) where my router signal was "out of range". the solution in the vid allowed me to connect to the router but the speed is still ridiculously low compared to windows. pls help me senpai
[13:33] <scattrbrain> !patience
[13:34] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: I would download and boot the 17.10 iso, and see if that works better
[13:36] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: you should check the systemlog (via journalctl in a terminal window) for wifi related messages
[13:36] <brainwas1> on top of that
[13:36] <scattrbrain> actually the reason i updated to 16.04.3 from 16.04.1 is coz of this issue
[13:37] <scattrbrain> multiple fresh install attempts of 16.04.3 didn't resolve it. in light of this info do u think i should try 17.10?
[13:38] <scattrbrain> i'll check the log
[13:39] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: that's what I suggested
[13:39] <brainwas1> download it and boot into the live session
[13:39] <cool_dude> hi i want to access website’s login page in terminal and fill it up possible ?
[13:40] <brainwas1> cool_dude: you want this? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Text-based_web_browser
[13:41] <cool_dude> i also have to design website for it !
[13:41] <scattrbrain> brainwas1, yeah i know. i phrased that like an idiot. i just meant that i'm skeptical that updating would solve the issue since i still had the issue after an update from 16.04.1 to 16.04.3
[13:43] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: luckily, it's easy to do and does not require much time
[13:43] <brainwas1> you could even test with a different distribution, like fedora
[13:43] <brainwas1> see if it's a general issue
[13:44] <scattrbrain> oh true
[13:44] <brainwas1> another approach would be to search the web for information about your wifi chip and linux compatibility
[13:45] <scattrbrain> this issue props up often actually
[13:45] <scattrbrain> i've searched the forums but i'm hesitant to use the exact same solutions coz it involves some l33t ubuntu code tweaks
[13:45] <Sbur3> I'm looking for a way to access an MP4 file that I haven't been able to watch from any of the media players and converters I have on my Ubuntu 17.10 system But I had been able to watch it in the past
[13:46] <scattrbrain> anyways i'm tryna upload that log for ya
[13:46] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: feel free to ask here if you have doubts about those "tweaks"
[13:47] <Sbur3> Is there a converter that will recover any MP44 or other video file?
[13:48] <brainwas1> Sbur3: not sure. I suggest asking in #ffmpeg
[13:48] <akik> scattrbrain: newer  kernels  bring new hardware support.  for ubuntu  you can install "mainline  kernel"
[13:49] <Sbur3> brainwas1: Ok, thx.  I knew I was in the wrong channel, but don't know which is the right one too often ... Bye and thx
[13:49] <scattrbrain> cool thanks guys. still tryna upload this log but shutter keeps freezing when i try to upload it to imgur
[13:51] <scattrbrain> https://imgur.com/pXxJit8
[13:51] <scattrbrain> here it is
[13:52] <scattrbrain> wait that's low res af
[13:53] <kostkon> scattrbrain, better use a pastebin for text output
[13:53] <kostkon> !paste
[13:54] <scattrbrain> cool thx
[13:55] <scattrbrain> brainwas1, here's the results of the journalctl
[13:55] <scattrbrain> https://pastebin.com/0RXS79KB
[13:56] <brainwas1> isn't that only the first page?
[13:56] <brainwas1> journalctl > output.txt
[13:59] <scattrbrain> https://pastebin.com/S1d7TGn1
[13:59] <scattrbrain> that's the full one i think
[14:00] <scattrbrain> https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2364068 this is one solution i tried for a similar problem
[14:00] <scattrbrain> but it didn't work for me
[14:00] <scattrbrain> worked for him tho
[14:01] <nightwalkerkg>  Hi, i am running Ubuntu 17.10 on AMD A10-5800k. I found that most of the animations are very laggy (mostly minimize, maximize). I am running open source radeon drivers ( AMD Aruba ) with the latest Oibaf PPA.
[14:01] <nightwalkerkg> I can provide you with any kind of logs.
[14:02] <nightwalkerkg> Do you have any ideas how i can improve the performance ?
[14:07] <jiaming> ls
[14:07] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: your log mentions the wifi driver rtl8821ae, the ubuntuforums thread is about rtl8723be
[14:08] <gareppa> hi, how do i ugrade directly from 15.4 to 17.10, without having to pass trough 17.04?
[14:08] <gareppa> i mean 16.04 lts
[14:08] <scattrbrain> yeah i switched it brainwas1
[14:08] <scattrbrain> i tried it with rtl8821ae
[14:09] <scattrbrain> didn't work :(
[14:09] <brainwas1> you did try with "options rtl8821ae ant_sel=1"?
[14:10] <scattrbrain> yep
[14:11] <brainwas1> I guess you have to test with 17.10 then
[14:11] <scattrbrain> iight
[14:12] <scattrbrain> thanks brain
[14:12] <kostkon> gareppa, you can't. Only way is to do a fresh install
[14:12] <gareppa> ok
[14:12] <scattrbrain> i'll brb
[14:13] <scattrbrain> so i just have to download it on my flash drive and "test" it to see if the internet works better right? brainwas1
[14:13] <scattrbrain> no need to install?
[14:14] <brainwas1> exactly
[14:14] <scattrbrain> cool brb
[14:22] <tacomaster> I have my full home computer environment with windows server and windows 10. I am trying to move my entire home to ubuntu server and desktop installs. My concerns is having sso for all computers with out a windows ad server.
[14:23] <TJ-> tacomaster: it's possible to set up an ldap server with samba to do the same thing
[14:24] <Mr_Cyclops> TJ-, any links to setting up ldap for such an environment? I have a similar requirement btw
[14:24] <TJ-> tacomaster: this might get you started with what is required: https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/serverguide/samba-ldap.html
[14:24] <tacomaster> so basically ldap just handles the login part or will it do stuff like gpo as well?
[14:24] <Mr_Cyclops> tx
[14:24] <tacomaster> TJ-: thanks
[14:26] <Mr_Cyclops> TJ-, can you suggest a live video recording software in Ubuntu? I need to put a 1080p USB webcam, and record live footage of the front side of my house
[14:27] <Mr_Cyclops> Also I will be using my Raspberry Pi Model 3 running Ubuntu Mate
[14:27] <erle-> Why are all the binaries not executable ELF files any more?
[14:27] <erle-> Execute "file /bin/cp" to see what I mean.
[14:27] <erle-> All the commands are shared libraries now.
[14:27] <TJ-> Mr_Cyclops: CCTV? there's zoneminder
[14:28] <TJ-> !zonemindoer | Mr_Cyclops
[14:28] <TJ-> !info zonemindoer | Mr_Cyclops
[14:28] <TJ-> !info zoneminder | Mr_Cyclops
[14:28] <Mr_Cyclops> yeah like CCTV .. zoneminder, is it part of Ubuntu repo or external repo
[14:28] <Mr_Cyclops> aha got it
[14:28] <TJ-> got it, finally!
[14:28] <Mr_Cyclops> he he tx
[14:28] <rcombs> who should I report this crash to? (happens when switching my receiver's input back to the machine after previously having switched it away; crashes gnome-shell; exits the session; only in the Ubuntu session, not in the GNOME one): https://gist.github.com/7a8a067741594a77cb756748588ab840
[14:44] <arunkumar413> I'm trying to install the python stats model but getting a permission denied error
[14:44] <arunkumar413> using the pip command
[14:46] <alkisg> erle-: $ file /bin/cp: /bin/cp: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked, interpreter /lib64/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2, for GNU/Linux 2.6.32, BuildID[sha1]=5a9675e90d7775415eb5e406b7d7602490ea8941, stripped
[14:47] <erle-> alkisg, regular Ubuntu 17.10
[14:47] <erle-> ?
[14:47] <alkisg> 16.04
[14:47] <erle-> in 17.10 it's a shared library
[14:48] <alkisg> OK, you didn't specify that :)
[14:48] <erle-> aka “not executable ELF files”
[14:49] <erle-> >/bin/cp: ELF 64-bit LSB shared object, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked, interpreter /lib64/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2, for GNU/Linux 3.2.0 ...blablabla
[14:51] <alkisg> erle-: https://askubuntu.com/questions/690631/executables-vs-shared-objects
[14:52] <alkisg> "A shared object executable, so to say, is a positional independent executable (PIE) using address space layout randomization (ASLR). "
[14:52] <alkisg> Might be the reason they switched the defaults, additional security... something to google about
[14:54] <alkisg> erle-: found it, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Security/Features#pie => since 16.10
[14:56] <alkisg> Ouch. " PIE has a large (5-10%) performance penalty " ... "As of 17.10,... PIE is now enabled across all architectures "...
[14:58] <nullray> it also says "PIE on 64-bit architectures do not have the same penalties,"
[14:58] <alkisg> Yes, I'm using i386 :/
[15:21] <tete_> hi, i just installed on my new htpc (i3 8100) ubuntu mate 17.10. the first start went fine, now i changed the start scripts so that lightdm is not started and instead xinit with kodi, but the performance is horrible. when i move the mouse, it jumps over the screen, because its so laggy
[15:21] <tete_> can someone tell me what could went wrong or how to investigate into the problem?
[15:23] <BluesKaj> tete_, check your kodi system settings video performance
[15:24] <tomreyn> glxinfo -B | grep -i accelerated
[15:24] <tomreyn> ^ should say 'yes'
[15:26] <tete_> hm, when i try to execute that in the console, i get Error: unable to open display. At the moment i am connected from my machine -> sshd to ubuntu. is there some way to run this without disabling kodis autostart, start lightdm?
[15:26] <tomreyn> DISPLAY=:0 glxinfo -B | grep -i accelerated
[15:27] <tete_> root@htpc:/home/oli# DISPLAY=:0 glxinfo -B | grep -i accelerated
[15:27] <tete_>     Accelerated: no
[15:27] <tomreyn> there's your problem, video acceleration isn't working
[15:27] <irgendwer4711> hi, how to switch off mainboard beep in 17.10. 17.04 had a souncard beep only.
[15:27] <tete_> i thought so too, but how can i start that?
[15:28] <tete_> i think the driver in use is i915 which seems wrong to me
[15:28] <tete_> because its quiet old isnt it
[15:28] <tomreyn> tete_: normally, it should happen automatically, controlled by the i915 intel video driver (which controls your CPU embedded GPU) and mesa
[15:29] <scattrbrain> hey guys
[15:29] <scattrbrain> earlier i posted this question
[15:29] <scattrbrain> "i'm dual booting windows 10 and ubuntu 16.04 LTS. my wifi on windows is fine, my wifi on ubuntu has been crap even after multiple fresh install attempts. i initally had the problem shown in this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dahjlku7idQ) where my router signal was "out of range". the solution in the vid allowed me to connect to the router but the speed is still ridiculously low compared to windows. pls help me senpai"
[15:29] <scattrbrain> brainwas1 was helping me out
[15:29] <scattrbrain> he advised to try ubuntu 17.10
[15:29] <tomreyn> tete_: check the /var/log/Xorg.*.log logs for (EE) records.
[15:29] <scattrbrain> i did but it didn't solve the issue
[15:29] <scattrbrain> so here i am
[15:30] <tete_> there are some errors, yes. i will pastebin that
[15:30] <tomreyn> tete_: i'll bbl
[15:31] <J3089TE> hi. is Vega frontier edition supported on Ubuntu 17.10?
[15:31] <MonkeyDust> is that a game?
[15:32] <tete_> here is the output https://pastebin.com/fYwkZF2J
[15:32] <J3089TE> that is a graphics card.
[15:32] <tete_> @tomreyn,
[15:33] <J3089TE> what is the best variant of Ubuntu with gnome as default desktop?
[15:39] <sticky_> Hi. I have configured bind9 (named) according to (few) tutourials. The name resolution from works, but only from localhost.  named.conf.options have listen-on port 53 for <IP_ADDRESS> and my internal IP address. recursion is set to yes, allow-recursion is set to localnets and my internal network. allow-query is set to any. Somebody has idea where to seek for solution?
[15:39] <sticky_> (name resolution from localhost* works.)
[15:40] <adrian_1908> J3089TE: Regular Ubuntu 17.10 for Gnome.
[15:40] <J3089TE> adrian_1908, can I use ubuntu 17.10 with kernel version 4.10.x?
[15:41] <adrian_1908> J3089TE: Why, any issues with later kernels?
[15:41] <J3089TE> AMD only offer linux 4.10.x driver support.
[15:41] <adrian_1908> Ah I see.
[15:41] <adrian_1908> I'm not sure about that, sorry.
[15:41] <tete_> https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=coffee-uhd-graphics&num=1
[15:41] <tete_> seems like thats my problem
[15:41] <J3089TE> adrian_1908, can gnome do dpi scaling?
[15:42] <adrian_1908> While different kernels can be installed as packages afaik, i'm not sure how hard it is to enforce this change persistently.
[15:42] <adrian_1908> J3089TE: No idea, I only use XFCE.
[15:43] <oerheks> 17.10 comes with kernel 4.13
[15:43] <J3089TE> 4.13 is not supported
[15:44] <scattrbrain> #arch
[15:44] <oerheks> J3089TE, strange statement, why would a newer kernel not be supported?
[15:45] <tpw_rules> hi, i somehow broke the package manager. http://paste.ubuntu.com/25887395/
[15:45] <scattrbrain> #xubuntu
[15:45] <J3089TE> because 4.10.x is the kernel used in the LTS version of Ubuntu
[15:45] <scattrbrain> sorry i keep omitting the /join command
[15:46] <J3089TE> can some one check if Ubuntu 17.04 support fractionaly scaling or now?
[15:46] <J3089TE> not*
[15:46] <adrian_1908> scattrbrain: hehe :D
[15:46] <scattrbrain> :)
[15:50] <erle-> J3089TE, Display settings have 100 or 200 percent as options. Fonts are freely scalable.
[15:50] <erle-> that's a wayland feature anyway
[15:54] <J3089TE> mhh but wayland is not stable enough
[15:54] <J3089TE> this is a deal breaker.
[15:59] <kk4ewt> J3089TE,  so try mate
[16:01] <deiks> Hi, is there a way to reinstall all default themes and icons etc., I accidentally deleted my default icon pack, now cant see some icons, even "show applications" icon on ubuntu 17.10
[16:05] <brainwas1> deiks: you could look at the history log in /var/log/apt/
[16:05] <brainwas1> see what exactly you've removed
[16:20] <nathaneltitane> hello
[16:20] <nathaneltitane> what is the package name i can file a bug with using apport against wayland
[16:20] <nathaneltitane> my session keeps on freezing after X amount of time, even when not sleeping
[16:24]  * vegombrei what is the lightest version of ubuntu i have an old 1 gb ram single core 2 ghz thingie
[16:25] <nathaneltitane> vegombrei: you can install ubuntu core nd build on that
[16:25] <nathaneltitane> and*
[16:25] <nathaneltitane> are you familiar?
[16:26] <vegombrei> nathaneltitane: nope im kinda noob
[16:26] <nathaneltitane> then maybe find a lighter spinoff like xubuntu
[16:26] <vegombrei> nathaneltitane: oh ok ill try zubuntu
[16:26] <nathaneltitane> the desktop environment is less resource hungry
[16:27] <vegombrei> x
[16:27] <vegombrei> nathaneltitane: is it gui or text ?
[16:27] <nathaneltitane> or even lubuntu if xfce is still too heavy
[16:27] <brainwas1> nathaneltitane: against gnome-shell
[16:27] <nathaneltitane> brainwas1: not xwayland itself?
[16:28] <brainwas1> nathaneltitane: xwayland is used to run X applications
[16:28] <nathaneltitane> ah
[16:29] <nathaneltitane> thank you brainwas1
[16:29] <brainwas1> :)
[16:29] <nathaneltitane> has anyone else reported experiencing something similar here?
[16:29] <brainwas1> I would check launchpad
[16:29] <nathaneltitane> 16.10 was flawless for my thinkpad
[16:30] <brainwas1> you can select the classic Xorg session before login
[16:30] <nathaneltitane> yeah, but the issue is that things are broken on xorg now on 17.10
[16:31] <nathaneltitane> i feel like there are too many regressions
[16:31] <brainwas1> so, both options are buggy for you?
[16:31] <brainwas1> wayland and xorg
[16:31] <nathaneltitane> trackpad doesnt work and other input related things are failing
[16:31] <nathaneltitane> under 17.10 yes
[16:31] <nathaneltitane> i had 16.10 gnome edition and it was beautiful
[16:31] <nathaneltitane> no issues whatsoever
[16:32] <nathaneltitane> had been a while since a fresh install so i decided to give the new edition a go
[16:32] <brainwas1> that's odd then
[16:32] <nathaneltitane> very
[16:32] <brainwas1> did you try the normal gnome session under 17.10
[16:33] <brainwas1> ?
[16:33] <brainwas1> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bugs?orderby=-id&start=0
[16:34] <thaurwylth> Hey, I have a related light-footprint system question. Wait a moment...
[16:35] <nathaneltitane> brainwas1: yes
[16:35] <nathaneltitane> it doesn't freeze but has different weird issues that 16.10 didn't have
[16:36] <nathaneltitane> i find it regrettable that such thing happen
[16:38] <scattrbrain> brainwas1, i tried booting ubuntu 17.10
[16:38] <scattrbrain> didn't work :(
[16:38] <scattrbrain> i also posted the issue on the forums https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2376653
[16:38] <thaurwylth> I want to experiment with this one old machine I have.  Some Ubuntu 13-or-so runs reeeeeally slow on it as you might imagine. Anyways I'll try current Lubuntu or Xubuntu on it next. But let's say even those are not enough. In that case this is no longer a Ubuntu question but a generic Linux question, hum? Sorry about that. In any case what would be an even ...
[16:38] <thaurwylth> ... lighter-footprint faster to run minimal system? It has to be able to run SSHD and probably also Screen + Irssi, and perhaps prospectively, although not planned right now, perhaps some mail server stuff and the like.
[16:41] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: :/
[16:42] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: why didn't you create the thread in the "Networking & Wireless" sub-forum?
[16:44] <scattrbrain> the introduction pm i got told me new issues by newcomers should be posted in the newcomers section
[16:44] <brainwas1> ok then
[16:44] <scattrbrain> "
[16:44] <scattrbrain> If you are looking for support on a technical issue, please post in the Absolute Beginner section (if you are new) or in the appropriate sub-forum in Ubuntu General Support or Ubuntu Specialised Support (if you are not new). There are also some specialised support sub-forums in Ubuntu Specialised Discussions.
[16:44] <scattrbrain> "
[16:45] <scattrbrain> i hope i did the right thing
[16:45] <mirak> hi
[16:45] <scattrbrain> hi
[16:45] <mirak> is there a way to disable the uefi update for grub when the kernel updates ?
[16:46] <scattrbrain> you told me i could try fedora if ubuntu doesn't work for me. is that one of your fav alternatives? brainwas1
[16:47] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: it was just an example of another big distro
[16:48] <thaurwylth> Aren't Ubuntu and Fedora like the ones with a big conglomerate behind them with long term involvement? So in that sense they are good comparable examples.
[16:48] <brainwas1> also one that isn't based on ubuntu or debian
[16:49] <brainwas1> testing with one or two other distributions is certainly something I would do
[16:50] <brainwas1> in case of hardware specific issues
[16:51] <alkisg> thaurwylth: I run ubuntu mate on pentium 4's with 512 MB RAM, it's ok except for browsing where it's slow
[16:52] <alkisg> What's the cpubenchmark.net score of your cpu?
[16:54] <scattrbrain> my internet suuucks
[16:55] <scattrbrain> brainwas1, i dunno if u responded to me but if u did pls copy and paste it coz i was disconnected
[16:55] <thaurwylth> Alkisg, thanks mate. Web browsing more or less does not matter. The SSH server and stuff like that are important.
[16:55] <thaurwylth> Let me check this benchmark data list.
[16:59] <brainwas1> scattrbrain: fedora was just an example of another big distro
[16:59] <thaurwylth> Alkisg, it's one of the worst ones listed, benchmark score 131.
[16:59] <scattrbrain> thx brainwas1
[17:01] <thaurwylth> Pentium fours seem to score way higher.
[17:08] <mguy> Were P4's 64 bit
[17:16] <thaurwylth> Mguy, how much does that matter if the hardware has less than 3 GB of RAM? I guess it matters SOME amount, but is it crucial?
[17:18] <UukGoblin> hiya, I've got an 17.10 installer running on a new PC
[17:18] <UukGoblin> the network adapter doesn't seem to be supported? lspci is showing Intel Gigabit I211 adapter, `ip l` only shows loopbach
[17:19] <Sircle> Hi
[17:19] <Sircle> I have a laptop with no cd rom. How can I install kubutnu?
[17:20] <oerheks> Sircle, use an USB device?
[17:20] <thaurwylth> New systems should work with an USB install no problem, right? And I'm slow.
[17:20] <oerheks> !usb
[17:21] <Sircle> oerheks:  but the .iso downloaded needs a cd to be burned? no? How to use a usb there?
[17:21] <thaurwylth> A backup plan is that you get or borrow a USB connecting external CD/DVD drive. I for instance have one. But this should be necessary only with reaaaaaly old motherboards.
[17:21] <oerheks> Sircle, see ubottu's answer
[17:21] <ilyaigpetrov> Hi. I install ubuntu server with encrypted partitions for the first time. I create swap partition and encrypt it too and ubuntu asks for a second passphrase -- is this correct, can I use the same passphrase for swap
[17:21] <thaurwylth> That link will have a tutorial on getting the image on a USB stick.
[17:22] <ilyaigpetrov> I actually have no desire to enter passphrase too times during boot
[17:24] <konrados> Hi. I have the /etc/hosts file - can I be... IDK how to express myself, but more verbose? Like adding comments etc? Like this pseudo - something:  https://fpaste.ca/apD ?
[17:25] <Sircle> oerheks: but this link assume that I have a cd / linux but I am on windows
[17:25] <konrados> or at least putting stuff in multiple lines, the one like like <IP_ADDRESS>	localhost  project1.local ... project111.local quickly becomes unreadable
[17:25] <alkisg> (06:59:53 μμ) thaurwylth: Alkisg, it's one of the worst ones listed, benchmark score 131. ==> well, for sshd it should be fine, as long as you don't try to transfer files via sshfs
[17:25] <oerheks> Sircle, no, that url does not assume that, just download the iso, use rufus and make the usb
[17:27] <Sircle> thanks
[17:32] <thaurwylth> Alkisg, so SSHFS is something that makes a virtually local looking remote drive, do I get this right? I guess I don't need that, but who knows. Secure copy like stuff over SSH and possibly with piping surely needs to work, though.
[17:35] <thaurwylth> In any case I already know that an old 12 or 13 version Ubuntu already allowed running the required SSH stuff on it. It's just that the graphic interface was painfully slow. So thinking about the installation is mostly about the new OS allowing to do stuff, not whether the processor is capable of it.
[17:36] <thaurwylth> Except of course in the case that the OS has different limitations for different kinds of processors.
[17:36] <mbff> Hello! I'm trying to setup port forwarding to my Ubuntu Server. I tested the port forwarding bit by having my laptop run a python http server temporarily and I could connect from my Phone on Data. Now however when I set the forwarding rule to the NAS it will not respond. What configs/network info can I check to try and troubleshoot this?
[17:36] <mbff> I have tried disabling UFW already
[17:37] <alkisg> thaurwylth: copying over ssh will be slow because of encryption, e.g. 2 MB/sec or so
[17:38] <imgay> yo
[17:40] <thaurwylth> Some of the connections I'm going to be using probably already have a 2 MB/s ceiling set by the connection itself, so that is not really a slowdown.
[17:42] <thaurwylth> Anyways I was looking around a bit for information about MATE. For some reason it looks to me that it's mostly a different desktop environment project for Ubuntu but there is no mention that it would be specifically intended for use on low capability systems. Compare this to X and L. So is it actually going to be heavier to run than those?
[17:43] <thaurwylth> Or perhaps I just happened to find the sources with wrong information.
[17:46] <CowNorris> hey everyone, I've ran into a little issue after upgrading to 17.10
[17:47] <CowNorris> I've been working with LiClipse for my python 3.5 projects
[17:47] <CowNorris> and unfortunately after upgrading I seem to run into this issue
[17:47] <CowNorris> '' ImportError: No module named '_tkinter', please install the python3-tk package''
[17:47] <CowNorris> when attempting to use the matplotlib package
[17:48] <CowNorris> i've tried installing python3-tk but that was to no avail
[17:48] <CowNorris> during installation though, one weird thing that I might've done was keeping some installed packages from 16.04
[17:48] <CowNorris> any help is very much appreciated :)
[17:48] <brainwas1> !info python3-tk artful
[17:48] <tgm4883> !info python3-tk
[17:49] <tgm4883> CowNorris: have you tried an 'sudo apt update'
[17:49] <CowNorris> no, not yet - i'm trying it now :)
[17:49] <CowNorris> doesn't seem to fix the problem just yet
[17:50] <tgm4883> you still can't install the packge?
[17:50] <CowNorris> when running pip3 install python3-tk, it tells me that nothing has been changed - apparently it is already installed
[17:51] <tgm4883> CowNorris: why.... have you tried 'sudo apt install python3-tk'
[17:51] <CowNorris> ah yeah, sorry, that was what i've tried
[17:52] <CowNorris> '0 to upgrade, 0 to newly install, 0 to remove and 0 not to upgrade.' was what it returns
[17:52] <thaurwylth> Updating Ubuntu on an older version can occasionally leave these kinds of odd and really hard to solve problems. That's why I do a fresh update every time, or this has been the case for some time.
[17:53] <thaurwylth> Not necessarily saying you shoul, just stating that this is the case.
[17:54] <CowNorris> ah, i see. that is unfortunate - I didn't know about it
[17:54] <CowNorris> i'm still quite new to ubuntu
[17:54] <CowNorris> i will remember to do that next time
[17:54] <CowNorris> do you think reinstalling python3 will be of any help?
[17:55] <thaurwylth> Well, it's worth a try!
[17:55] <CowNorris> :) I'll let you know if it does anything
[17:55] <thaurwylth> Or any other packages that might be having leftover 16 version dependencies.
[17:56] <oerheks> unlikely, 16.x packages left ..
[17:56] <thaurwylth> Anyways, about that fresh install, it's not exactly the road to paradise.  So for me I think of this as a choice between two evils.
[17:56] <brainwas1> CowNorris: is the module name actually correct?
[17:57] <oerheks> unless you installed something manually, but your issue is something else > <tgm4883> CowNorris: why.... have you tried 'sudo apt install python3-tk'
[17:57] <brainwas1> _tkinter vs tkinter'
[17:58] <CowNorris> hmm
[17:58] <CowNorris> python3-tk was what the error message suggested
[17:59] <thaurwylth> This just popped to my mind: do these Python or other related packages create things that are stored in .files under /home/<username> ?
[18:01] <delboy1978uk> https://hastebin.com/iqehicikur.sh can anyone help me bin bad repositories? this is what's happening to me
[18:04] <kostkon> delboy1978uk, still on 12.04?
[18:05] <alkisg> (07:42:55 μμ) thaurwylth: Anyways I was looking around a bit for information about MATE.  => all ubuntu flavours are the same for what you want, which is console based, before the DE loads. There's no different optimization etc, they all use the same compiled programs
[18:05] <thaurwylth> 2012 was a perfectly fine year, Cognac casks from that era can't even be sold under XO yet.
[18:05] <alkisg> thaurwylth: for your purposes, you can start with the ubuntu server cd; I just mentioned mate because I'm using it, not as a suggestion for you
[18:05] <delboy1978uk> kostkon yes, i want to get everything upgraded but i have a website running on it and want to do so with the least problems and downtime
[18:05] <alkisg> thaurwylth: i.e. that ubuntu can run with old processors
[18:06] <thaurwylth> Oh, I see, I see! Sorry if I sounded a bit snappy there.
[18:06] <delboy1978uk> first thing i need to do is get rid of the unofficial repo, update all my packages, and then i think i'll be set to upgrade
[18:06] <kostkon> !ppapurge
[18:07] <thaurwylth> Anyways I guess the first thing I'll try is with a random choice between Lubuntu and Xubuntu, because I also intend to log in via the graphical interface and those are decidedly less costly on the system.
[18:07] <delboy1978uk> thanks kostkon
[18:08] <thaurwylth> But is there something that is even more low-key? I've heard that this thing called Damn Small Linux exists, does it already have limitations on what it can do? I'm guessing it most certainly has.
[18:09] <kostkon> delboy1978uk, looks like they've removed support for 12.04 so that PPA is useless now anyway
[18:09] <delboy1978uk> yup
[18:09] <delboy1978uk> how easy is it to move from 12 to the latest?
[18:10] <kostkon> delboy1978uk, you can directly upgrade to 14.04 which is still supported
[18:10] <delboy1978uk> thaurwylth: damn small linux rocks!
[18:10] <delboy1978uk> kostkon: how do i do that?
[18:10] <thaurwylth> It might very well do that. But does it support all kinds of stuff? What do people use it for?
[18:14] <delboy1978uk> excellent all my packages are now up to date and that error has gone away, thanks kostkon
[18:15] <delboy1978uk> thaurwylth: you can install as much as you like and make it bigger, but its a super small 50MB linux. I once ran a PHP invoice system I built on an Apache server i installed on DSL, for an office intranet
[18:15] <thaurwylth> Mmm hmmm.
[18:16] <delboy1978uk> and that in itself ran on a 486
[18:16] <thaurwylth> Is it built on some known distribution and what sort of packages does it use?
[18:17] <kostkon> delboy1978uk, I hope the 12.04 repos are still up so have a look at this https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/serverguide/installing-upgrading.html
[18:17] <delboy1978uk> i cant remember, it was over 10 years ago last i saw it, it had a weird window manager not gnome or kde
[18:17] <thaurwylth> Okeys!
[18:17] <thaurwylth> I'll go take a shower ==>
[18:19] <delboy1978uk> do-release-upgrade doesn't exist!
[18:19] <delboy1978uk> so apt dist-upgrade?
[18:22] <delboy1978uk> 0 packages ? https://hastebin.com/obuqopituv.zsh
[18:24] <kostkon> delboy1978uk, try to sudo apt-get install update-manager-core first
[18:24] <delboy1978uk> ah ok cheers
[18:24]  * delboy1978uk tries
[18:24] <kostkon> delboy1978uk, if the repos still work and you get to install the package, then try again with do-release-upgrade
[18:26] <TJ-> !eol | delboy1978uk you might need to alter source.list to use old-releases.ubuntu.com
[18:32] <thaurwylth> Brrrrr, it's cold, I need to put a woollen shirt on. Showering brought to mind this: what will be the case for support for printable or wearable electronics in the future? Will we have Ubuntu towels and Ubuntu woollen shirts?
[18:33] <BudgetSlug> Does Ubuntu 17.xx have the same issues with integrated graphics (Radeon R7) as it would with graphics cards?
[18:33] <thaurwylth> Is this internal card a part of APU?
[18:35] <thaurwylth> At least the ones on AMD APU's are often based on designs of typical AMD Radeon designs, so the answer is 'probably, possibly.' It's best to cross-check a list of known issues to be sure.
[18:35] <BudgetSlug> thaurwylth: Yes, the R7 is.
[18:38] <BudgetSlug> So, stay away from AMD GPUs still?
[18:39] <BudgetSlug> For Ubuntu 17.xx that is..
[18:41] <thaurwylth> If there are issues with any hardware, I am rather sure they are not much concerned with how the card is connected to the system. So if you know of a lethal issue that exists for a Radeon card, I guess that settles the case then.
[18:41] <BudgetSlug> thaurwylth: Gotcha, Thanks.
[18:42] <mirak> anyone knows how to multiboot with EFI ?
[18:43] <erle-> BudgetSlug, what? AMD is better on Linux than NVIDIA for a decade now.
[18:44] <BudgetSlug> erle-: For GPUs? I have a R9 390 and have never been able to get it to work. (14.04, 16.04, and 17.10)
[18:45] <bcowan> AMD support is definitely better on linux than nvidia
[18:47] <brainwas1> I heard that the nvidia driver is quite good
[18:47] <brainwas1> the open source alternative not so much though
[18:47] <erle-> brainwas1, some 90 percent of all kernel panics reported are due to NVIDIA
[18:48] <nchambers>  erle-: it’s a feature (tm)!
[18:49] <oerheks> 90% ??? .. lot of drunk talk tonight
[19:00] <x22017> I'm installing xubuntu on a thinkpad that came with windows 7 preinstalled. Is the "erase disk and install xubuntu" option in the ubuntu installer sufficient to wipe the windows OS completely? I don't want to see boot options for windows 7 in BIOS post-installation
[19:01] <tomreyn> x22017: yes
[19:01] <x22017> ok, cool
[19:01] <x22017> thanks
[19:01] <oerheks> jups, you will get a fresh MBR
[19:01] <x22017> nice
[19:02] <x22017> so windows 7 won't be listed in grub?
[19:02] <x22017> after I wipe the disk using the installer tool
[19:03] <tomreyn> this is essentially the same question again, and the answer is still: yes (windows will no longer be listed)
[19:04] <x22017> just checking, thanks
[19:05] <x22017> anyone know how to safely reboot from the windows installer?
[19:05] <x22017> ctrl+alt+delete does nothing and I'd rather not hard shutdown
[19:25] <_matix> hello.  i'm having errors with a program i'm installing with apt-get.  it's being linked with the wrong version of sqlite3 (i've determined this using ldd).  how can I make sure it gets linked to  the right version when it gets installed?
[19:27] <Megabyte> hey
[19:27] <Megabyte> Does anyone here know how to use ffmpeg?
[19:27] <_matix> Megabyte for what
[19:28] <Megabyte> _matix, I need to convert a wav file to mp4 and add an image to it
[19:28] <genii> ffmpeg is an enigmatic mystery shrouded in darkness
[19:28] <Megabyte> genii, YES.
[19:28] <Megabyte> Yes, it is.
[19:29] <Megabyte> So far I got this
[19:29] <Megabyte> ffmpeg -loop 1 -i snes_super_mario_rpg_p_7qdpfi_scaled.jpg -i "01_1-01 Super Mario RPG - Happy Adventure, Delightful Adventure.wav" -c:v libx264 -tune stillimage -c:a aac -b:a 192k -shortest out.mp4
[19:29] <kostkon> Megabyte, convert it to aac for example and by image you mean an album cover?
[19:29] <Megabyte> BUT it doesn't add the image as I hoped it would :/
[19:29] <Megabyte> kostkon, I want a static image to be displayed from start to end
[19:29] <genii> Megabyte: I'd try just ffmpeg -i wavfile.wav -i imagefile.img outfile.whateverextension
[19:30] <kostkon> Megabyte, right
[19:32] <Megabyte> genii, let me see if that works
[19:32] <Megabyte> genii, it runs, but it doesn't add the image
[19:32] <Megabyte> :/
[19:33] <genii> Megabyte: Try reversing the order then of the wav file and image file
[19:34] <Megabyte> genii, let's see
[19:34] <Megabyte> genii, nope :/
[19:35] <genii> I'm not sure if you can use -ss 12:34:56 -t 12:34:56 with -ss all zeroes for beginning and -t the length of the wav as options on the image, but maybe
[19:38] <Sircle> I am installing kubutn 16.04.3 LTS by usb. Its stuck on the initial kubuntu logo. Caps lock and keyboard goes unresponsive as well. How can I debug ?
[19:43] <Megabyte> genii, Apparently I got a command that works
[19:43] <Megabyte> I just was looking at the wrong file :O
[19:47] <mlrn> hi there. just updated and got strange effects on window manager. i'm on 17.04. on my primary screen, window manager barely works (can't move windows, programs only react when in full screen). on secondary screen it works like it always did. any ideas?
[19:51] <delboy1978uk> kostkon. i am now on ubuntu 16. thanks!
[19:52] <kostkon> delboy1978uk, you upgraded twice?
[19:52] <delboy1978uk> why the hell not?
[19:53] <delboy1978uk> only problem is i've broke my lamp stack. apache still looking for php 5
[19:54] <genii> use a2dismod then on it
[19:54] <genii> or a2rmmod, I forget which it is
[19:55] <kostkon> delboy1978uk, no problems here, good job
[19:55]  * delboy1978uk edits php-fpm.conf
[20:11] <Sircle> I am installing kubutn 16.04.3 LTS by usb. Its stuck on the initial kubuntu logo. Caps lock and keyboard goes unresponsive as well. How can I debug ? I am on dell inspiron 7559
[20:13] <ioria> Sircle, already tried nomodeset ?
[20:13] <Sircle> ioria:  how to do that?
[20:13] <ioria> Sircle, press F6
[20:14] <Sircle> at which point?
[20:14] <ioria> Sircle,  main menu
[20:15] <Sircle> ioria: hm
[20:18] <ioria> Sircle,  disabling secure boot might help
[20:21] <Bashing-om> Sircle: Also: in the system's firmware setup, you'll need to ensure that "Legacy USB support" is enabled - it means the firmware continues providing USBHID services to GRUB until the OS starts and takes over.
[20:37] <Iarfen> hi!
[20:37] <Iarfen> is there a hosting for open-source projects?
[20:37] <Iarfen> something as GitHub Pages but that allows dynamic content
[20:37] <nchambers> I doubt it
[20:38] <nchambers> Probably just easier to roll your own web server
[20:38] <nchambers> Well actually, what do you mean by dynamic content?
[20:39] <nchambers> Because gh pages allows JavaScript
[20:39] <Bashing-om> Iarfen: How about: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Git ? The new set up .
[20:42] <Bashing-om> Iarfen: OOOpps that ^ is the old one . Let me see what about the "new" git .
[20:46] <platz> help - I'm in a cafe and it seems to only allow me to connect via ipv6; it works but i can only access google,facebook,wikipedia.. is there a way to access the rest of the internet on an ipv6 connection?
[20:46] <nchambers> You could connect to a vpn maybe
[20:47] <platz> interesting, so one really is cut off from all ipv4 sites
[20:48] <TJ-> platz: can you get to http://test-ipv6.com/
[20:48] <platz> TJ-: no
[20:48] <nchambers> Idk about that but I’m not exactly in a place to confirm that
[20:48] <TJ-> platz: that suggests the cafe is actually restricting the sites you can reach then
[20:49] <platz> wierd, ok thanks
[20:49] <platz> ipv6 is confusing
[20:49] <nchambers> What error do you get when trying to get those sites?
[20:50] <platz> test-ipv6.com’s server IP address could not be found.
[20:51] <nchambers> Oh that sounds like shitty dns filtering
[20:52] <elisa871> so my flash drive is read only
[20:52] <nchambers> What if you run dig @<IP_ADDRESS> test-ipv6.com +short?
[20:52] <elisa871> what should I do
[20:53] <platz> ; (1 server found) ;; connection timed out; no servers could be reached
[20:54] <nchambers> Interesing
[20:54] <Iarfen> Bashing-om: which is the new git?
[20:57] <Soltis> Running `apt upgrade` just spiked the load on a server I'm running up to around 34
[20:57] <Soltis> What could possibly cause something like that?
[20:57] <jackhum> hello channel., i am using http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/06/quickly-change-folder-color-ubuntu  , this program to color my folder in my ubuntu 16.04 using unity
[20:57] <Soltis> Load is ordinarily around 3
[20:58] <jackhum> but problem is for default theme icon is turning to a white file
[20:59] <jackhum> i mean its working for some of the themes , but for the humanity dark theme , folder icon changes to a white solid rectangle , somehow i think that some icon files are missing. can anyone help me to debug this issue
[21:00] <taneli> platz, does this work: dig @2001:4860:4860::8888 -t aaaa debian.org +short ?
[21:00] <jackhum> or maybe if there is anyway i can see how nautilus is working when i am clicking the options
[21:13] <platz> so ipv6-test.com works, not test-ipv6.com.  ipv6-test.com says my ipv4 is not supported, ipv6 is supported (native)
[21:16] <platz> this appears to describe my situation https://blog.widodh.nl/2015/11/using-the-internet-on-a-ipv6-only-network/
[21:20] <Bashing-om> Iarfen: https://insights.ubuntu.com/2017/07/24/developing-ubuntu-using-git/ . As one other .
[21:21] <thaurwylth> Does right shift on beginning of boot still bring up GRUB menu?
[21:22] <TJ-> thaurwylth: Escape key
[21:23] <TJ-> thaurwylth: shift would only work on BIOS/legacy boots, not UEFI, so the key go changed. The only issue is you have to tap it, rather than holding it down as you can with shift
[21:23] <thaurwylth> I was checking out this old one at ctrl+f ' Black/purple screen after you boot Ubuntu for the first time '  https://askubuntu.com/questions/162075/my-computer-boots-to-a-black-screen-what-options-do-i-have-to-fix-it
[21:24] <thaurwylth> Okey, is it hard to guess the correct moment to do it?
[21:25] <TJ-> thaurwylth: tap like mad as soon as the firmware's POST screens disappear :)
[21:26] <thaurwylth> Thanks. Not a problem right now but I'm recalling myself these things for the future.
[21:26] <thaurwylth> I guess the last time I needed to fix it was when BIOS systems were still around.
[21:29] <sphalerite> I want to set up an ubuntu chroot on another distro using debootstrap, but I can't find a place to bootstrap the trust for the archive keyring. Is it served via HTTPS somewhere?
[21:32] <TJ-> sphalerite: fetch the Ubuntu archive signing cert from a GPG key-server, HTTP fetch the ubuntu-keyring.deb from archive.ubuntu.com, and check the signature with gpg
[21:33] <sphalerite> TJ-: where do I get the ID for the signing cert?
[21:33] <sphalerite> FWIW I found https://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/all/ubuntu-keyring/download which lists a SHA256 checksum via HTTPS which I guess will do fine for me
[21:38] <MWM> I just did an inplace upgrade from 17.04 to 17.10 (Budgie) and now the top panel is fat... and I cant figure out how to make it "not that way" anymore
[21:38] <TJ-> sphalerite: at http://keyserver.ubuntu.com search for "ubuntu archive automatic signing key" and get the 4096/C0B21F32 if you want to do it manually
[21:41] <sphalerite> TJ-: cool thanks
[22:01] <Sircle> HI
[22:02] <Sircle> How to add trackpad support and genstures in kubuntu 16.04.3 lts for dell inspiron 7559
[22:02] <Sircle> ?
[22:11] <Sircle> How to add trackpad support and genstures in kubuntu 16.04.3 lts for dell inspiron 7559?
[22:22] <StumpDumb> Hello all, im having some difficulties with writing to an external cdrom, it looks like a problem with wodim. is someone familiar with this issue and know of a fix or work around? Thx
[22:22] <Paprikachu> https://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial/openjdk-9-jdk-headless -- why is this in the official package repository? it's an old early access build...
[22:22] <HorribleProgram> You know what's fucken weird? If I restart from Windows to Ubuntu, the sound won't work. If I restart from Ubuntu to Windows, the sound works, but the time is always 4hrs ahead.
[22:23] <HorribleProgram> I guess they don't play well together
[22:24] <HorribleProgram> Also, anyone use Unity with Ubuntu (Unity the game engine)?
[22:31] <StumpDumb> im having some difficulties with writing to an external cdrom, it looks like a problem with wodim. is someone familiar with this issue and know of a fix or work around? Thx
[22:39] <MrSassyPants> What happened to vmware-player in ubuntu 17.10 ?
[22:40] <MarkB2> In 16.04 there was a large bar on the left of the display.  I installed 17.10, that bar was still there... and I turn on the computer this evening and it's gone.
[22:40] <MarkB2> I can't remember what that bar is called.
  --crickets-- ?  What's up there now is an "Applications" header on the top bar.  Left-clicking that produces a drop-down with a Windows XP-style collection of icons to click on.
[22:56] <MarkB2> It's the DOCK!  I've lost the DOCK in 17.10 .  How do I get the dock back?
[22:58] <MonkeyDust> MarkB2  HUD, or simply the launch bar
[22:59] <MarkB2> Okay, I'll buy that.  It's missing.
[23:01] <MarkB2> My desktop now looks like a Raspberry Pi!  <yow>
[23:11] <Sircle> my laptop hardware inspiron 7559 does not supports ubuntu well. What options do I have? Use vbox on top of windows? any other?
[23:15] <Bashing-om> Sircle: https://xubuntu.org/download .
[23:16] <Sircle> my laptop hardware inspiron 7559 does not supports ubuntu well. What options do I have? Use vbox on top of windows? any other?
[23:16] <Sircle> Bashing-om:  I have no problems in downloading
[23:16] <debsan> Sircle, https://connorkuehl.github.io/dell-inspiron-7559-linux-guide/
[23:17] <Sircle> debsan:  should I just go with virtualization?
[23:18] <tomreyn> Sircle: what makes you think it's not supporting (ubuntu) linux well?
[23:19] <Sircle> tomreyn:  does not shuts down, no trackpad gestures and smoothness like windows,
[23:19] <Sircle> tomreyn:  resolution issues but can be dealt
[23:20] <tomreyn> Sircle: ok, trackpad gestures are a rather specific feature. maybe you should sell it and buy some hardware which is known to be well supported then.
[23:20] <Sircle> tomreyn: with vbox, all of it will be gone
[23:21] <Sircle> tomreyn:  I just bought today. can't sell.
[23:21] <tomreyn> well then i guess you can maybe return it?
[23:22] <tomreyn> running your main OS virtualized is not exactly convenient
[23:22] <Sircle> long story it is.. got to ride it now
[23:22] <tomreyn> i guess i'd work on lowering my expectatrions then
[23:23] <tomreyn> and work on improving support for the hardware if that's something you can do
[23:23] <Sircle> tomreyn:  convenient or efficient?   It will be convinient though as I won't have to install the same on every of my computer (or at upgrades). One usb portable will do all for me (that having the vbox vm file)
[23:25] <tomreyn> you'll have toi do pci / usb passthrough for all externally attached devices you want to use on linux, you'll have not much fun working with >1 monitor, and you'll have more complexity.
[23:25] <tomreyn> anyways, up to you.
[23:26] <tomreyn> personally i would never consider trackpad gestures a mandatory feature
[23:26] <Sircle> tomreyn:  hm
[23:27] <Sircle> I wonder why it does not shuts down. I think I have to go through your link
[23:28] <tomreyn> oh so you have not even made attempts to make things work?
[23:28] <Sircle> for this:  https://connorkuehl.github.io/dell-inspiron-7559-linux-guide/ no
[23:28] <tomreyn> i didnt post said link, but for me it was the first result on a web search, too
[23:28] <tomreyn> "ubuntu trackpad gestures" also has some
[23:29] <Sircle> k
[23:36] <CarlFK> how do I tell what res monitors I can hook up to a laptop?  I was expecting xrandr --prop --verbose to do it, but nope: http://paste.ubuntu.com/25890461/
[23:41] <MarkB2> There is an icon that looks like a file cabinet.  It shows up in Applications-->Preferences-->File Manager.  I'm trying find that icon... and have no idea what it's name is.  Please, a hint?
[23:43] <asarch> Can you do smartcl --test=long on a USB 3.0 stick?
[23:48] <allizom> MarkB2: are you referring to nautilus? Icons are in /usr/share/icons
[23:48] <kirkobang> richard stallman hates ubuntu because of the amazon shiet. Should i change distro
[23:49] <MarkB2> allizom: That's where I've been looking... but the file cabinet icon is hiding somewhere...
[23:49] <allizom> just search for "nautilus" there, with nautilus :P
[23:51] <MarkB2> &$#$% It's an SVG file, not PNG <grrr>
[23:52] <MarkB2> In my install of 17.10, the dock was on the left... and that was fine.  I turned off the 'puter, took a nap, woke, turned it back on.. and the dock is gone.
[23:56] <bloop> ubuntu 16.04 + nvidia 340 or nvidia 304 are totally busted for nvidia gt geforce 240m machines
[23:56] <bloop> nvidia 304 doesn't register mouse clicks in the window manager
[23:57] <bloop> and nvidia 340 randomly crashes
[23:57] <bloop> randomly freezes and turns black and crashes
[23:57] <bloop> all nvidia drivers for gt geforce 240m ought to be removed if they do not work