[12:03] <LaserJock> I'm starting pretty much from scratch, very nice
[12:03] <mdke> cool
[12:03] <LaserJock> the only problem is that I also have a Windows drive
[12:03] <mdke> I did a clean install this time too
[12:04] <LaserJock> The computer was originally an HP that I bought in 2002 when I started grad school
[12:04] <LaserJock> but I put a new motherboard in and added an Ubuntu hard drive
[12:05] <LaserJock> but now Windows is totally screwed. It doesn't recognize my product key
[12:05] <LaserJock> it must be tied to the hardware somehow :(
[12:05] <mdke> haha
[12:05] <mdke> that sucks so bad
[12:05] <LaserJock> yeah, because my wife still uses Windows :(
[12:05] <mdke> what for?
[12:05] <LaserJock> and she is mad at me for mucking with the computer
[12:06] <mdke> tell her that you're the computer boss, and she has to use Ubuntu
[12:06] <mdke> (WORKSFORME)
[12:06] <LaserJock> actually, the only thing she uses it for is to access the printer from our laptop
[12:07] <LaserJock> so if I can set up the printer as a samba share or something, then I think it might work
[12:07] <mdke> cups printer
[12:07] <LaserJock> but it did have a lot of data on it, I will need to get that off
[12:08] <LaserJock> but it just makes me soooo mad that MS would do that
[12:08] <LaserJock> at least it gives me an example for my wife that MS is from the devil
[12:09] <mdke> yeah
[12:10] <LaserJock> and that computer didn't even come with recovery discs or Windows CDs. You have no access to your OS
[12:20] <LaserJock> way to go mdke, that's the way to get things done ;-)
[12:21] <mdke> it's all about hitting the right person
[12:21] <LaserJock> very true
[12:21] <LaserJock> that and not making the right person mad
[12:21] <mdke> last time I chatted to pitti and ogra, they didn't know why
[12:21] <mdke> this time, you get keybuk, he sorts it straight away
[01:06] <poningru> robotgeek: ping
[01:07] <robotgeek> poningru: pong
[01:08] <robotgeek> poningru: did you get those messges in you away log?
[01:08] <poningru> robotgeek: yeah apologies about adding easyubuntu
[01:08] <poningru> I had asked a ton of people
[01:08] <poningru> just didnt find you
[01:08] <robotgeek> poningru: heh, no worries.
[01:08] <robotgeek> i got most of my stuff from that page, it will soon be ready :)
[01:09] <poningru> robotgeek: I would like to contribute...
[01:09] <poningru> summer is coming up, I dont really have anything to do
[01:09] <robotgeek> poningru: http://tinyurl.com/kw4u
[01:09] <poningru> ???
[01:09] <robotgeek> wtf, not again
[01:10] <poningru> whats wrong now?
[01:10] <robotgeek> i made a clever list of pages in tinyurl, it doesn't seem to stick
[01:10] <robotgeek> bugs list, err
[01:11] <robotgeek> poningru: #easyubuntu-dev please :)
[01:14] <mdke> ooh, we can do lots of playing with our lulu storefront
[01:14] <mdke> good
[01:21] <LaserJock> mdke: URL?
[01:23] <mdke> http://www.lulu.com/ubuntu-doc
[01:26] <LaserJock> heh, somehow I thought it would be messier then that
[01:27] <robotgeek> nice
[01:34] <LaserJock> interesting
[01:40] <mdke> man, lulu is pretty cool
[01:41] <LaserJock> heh, I didn't look to bad, just not very Ubuntu-like
[01:41] <mdke> what's that?
[01:41] <LaserJock> the green you had
[01:41] <mdke> ah, I was just scrolling through the various themes
[01:41] <LaserJock> ah, well I must have refreshed on one
[01:42] <mdke> went back to the simple one and added some brown
[01:46] <mdke> ok, night all
[01:50] <LaserJock> cya mdke
[04:42] <LaserJock> darn, I should have said something about the espresso -> ubiquity change
[04:43] <robotgeek> hah, i havent mentioned espresso at all :P
[04:44] <robotgeek> i thing only about Kubuntu and release notes will need to be changed
[04:44] <robotgeek> s/thing/think
[04:44] <LaserJock> I haven't either, but I knew about the change a while ago
[05:21] <jjesse> !yup already have them changed and submitting tomorrow :)
[05:21] <jjesse> about kubuntu and releasenotes
[05:21] <jjesse> night folks
[05:23] <robotgeek> jjesse: night, awesome!
[09:11] <mdke_> morning
[09:12] <highvoltage> morning
[05:02] <mdke> ooh paris eh
[05:02] <mdke> good call
[05:24] <LaserJock> morning doc people
[05:24] <robotgeek> morning LaserJock
[05:24] <mdke> hiya
[05:25] <LaserJock> robotgeek: you interested in packaging electronics apps?
[05:27] <robotgeek> LaserJock: hmm, i don't know if i have time right now
[05:28] <LaserJock> robotgeek: well, I was thinking more in general
[05:28] <mdke> what do people think about adding LTS to the version number entities?
[05:28] <mdke> i think we may have to, but it will result in a decent number of translations breaking :-(
[05:28] <LaserJock> mdke: well, I sorta think it is important that we have the name of the distro right
[05:28] <mdke> if that is part of the name, then yes
[05:29] <LaserJock> mdke: it would only reflect badly on the doc team if we don't, even though I don't really think it is our fault exactly ;-)
[05:29] <mdke> if it's part of the version number, then we should add it, I suppose.
[05:29] <robotgeek> but would we have to rewrite all translations? that would suck, really bad
[05:29] <mdke> robotgeek: not all, but quite a few strings probably
[05:30] <robotgeek> mdke: can't we entitize even that?
[05:30] <mdke> no
[05:30] <LaserJock> seemes like there should be a better system that way for translations
[05:30] <robotgeek> LTS is LTS, and maybe add one line somewhere about LTS = Long Term Support
[05:30] <LaserJock> like you just translate the entitity or something
[05:32] <mdke> robotgeek: it would go in the "Version and release numbers" section of the desktopguide and about ubuntu, dunno if you have that section in kDG
[05:33] <robotgeek> Yeah, i have that section
[05:34] <mdke> best to make it a separate paragraph, if possible, so that the string doesn't need to be changed
[05:35] <mdke> oh.,
[05:36] <mdke> changing the entity results in 2 string changes to UDG
[05:36] <mdke> that's not bad :D
[05:37] <LaserJock> heh, mdke is all excited about nothing ;-) oh the drama :p
[05:37] <mdke> 4 strings in serverguide
[05:38] <mdke> nothing in PG
[05:38] <mdke> ok, this is all fine then
[05:41] <mdke> robotgeek: so perhaps we should add a section to explain the long term nature of dapper, do you think it is warranted?
[05:42] <LaserJock> mdke: I think sabdfl would be pleased
[05:43] <mdke> well, in *that* case :)
[05:43] <robotgeek> mdke: heh, go for it
[05:43] <mdke> I'm going to put it in after "The Difference"
[05:43] <mdke> and I'll post it here for review
[05:53] <mdke> meh, I can't think of anything to say
[05:54] <robotgeek> mdke: copy paste from sabdfl's announcement :)
[05:54] <mdke> ok, looking. In the meantime, I've done this:
Every   <para>Every Ubuntu release is supported for 18 months with security and other updates. However, Ubuntu &distro-rev; is a special enterprise release, and is supported for 3 years on the desktop, and 5 years on the server. As a result, it will be possible to rely on Ubuntu &distro-rev; for a longer period than usual. Therefore this release of Ubuntu is referred to as "LTS" or "Long Term Support".</para>
[05:55] <robotgeek> nice, good enough i think
[05:56] <mdke> do we want to ham it up any more than that, you think?
[05:56] <mdke> the word "polish" might be used, I spose
[05:56] <LaserJock> yeah, that will get all the people from Poland reading ;-)
[05:57] <mdke> so, I'll leave it like that, unless you guys have anything you'd like to add
[05:59] <robotgeek> if i'm reading the mailing list in webbroswer, i can't view signed messages. any hints?
[05:59] <LaserJock> hmm, I would want to throw in that 6.06 LTS had a longer development cycle to ensure that it is enterprise ready
[05:59] <LaserJock> or something to the fact that something was actuallly *done* to make it LTS
[06:00] <LaserJock> robotgeek: signed? you should only not be able to see encrypted messages, I would think
[06:00] <robotgeek> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/sounder/2006-April/006275.html for example
[06:01] <mdke> robotgeek: it's a mailman bug I suppose
[06:02] <robotgeek> hmm, i am able to read it on gmane, though
[06:06] <mdke> hmm
[06:06] <robotgeek> food beckons, later
[06:10] <mdke> alright
[06:10] <mdke> http://mdke.org/images/lts.png
[06:12] <mdke> LaserJock: ^
[06:12] <LaserJock> mdke: on it
[06:13] <LaserJock> awesome
[06:14] <LaserJock> I think it says a lot to why we had the 6 week delay and the idea of having an LTS release
[06:15] <mdke> ok, I'm going to post to the list and ask for feedback before committing
[06:15] <mdke> maybe -devel too
[06:15] <LaserJock> yeah,  you are sure to get feedback from -devel ;-)
[06:16] <mdke> hmm
[06:16] <LaserJock> but to be honest, I didn't really realize what this was all about until today
[06:16] <LaserJock> so I think it might be worthwile to get the word out
[06:17] <LaserJock> I assumed that every release from Dapper onward was going to have 3/5 year support
[06:18] <mdke> ouch, string freeze was yesterday too
[06:19] <LaserJock> heh, what's a few freeze exceptions between friends?
[06:19] <LaserJock> I wish we (as a Project) were a little better about Freezes
[06:20] <LaserJock> in the MOTU world it seems more like a Chill rather than Freeze
[06:20] <mdke> great word
[06:20] <mdke> mdz is pretty strict about freezes actually, generally
[06:21] <LaserJock> yeah, Universe seems to be a bit of an exception (pun intended)
[06:28] <LaserJock> hi jsgotangco
[06:28] <jsgotangco> LaserJock: hi!
[06:33] <mdke> robotgeek: ok, check out the text, if you're happy for me to add it to the KDG too (with s/Ubuntu/Kubuntu), I'll commit everything
[06:33] <mdke> hey jerome
[06:34] <jsgotangco> mdke: good morning
[06:36] <mdke> jjesse: ping
[06:37] <jsgotangco> mdke: how goes the translations?
[06:37] <mdke> they're going well, subject to some more string freeze exceptions coming their way ;)
[06:38] <jsgotangco> heh
[06:42] <mdke> hiya joachim-n
[06:42] <jsgotangco> hey
[06:46] <robotgeek> mdke: looks good to me :)
[06:47] <mdke> robotgeek: alright. I'll upload. what do you think about putting it in about kubuntu, after "The Difference"?
[06:48] <mdke> robotgeek: also, have a look at the second half of this patch: http://mdke.org/ubuntu/desktopguide.patch (for the renaming of the install cds), shall I apply that to KDG too?
[06:48] <mdke> sorry for the absence of wrapping
[06:49] <robotgeek> mdke: ooh, nice work
[06:50] <mdke> ok for KDG?
[06:50] <robotgeek> does rosetta automagically handle line numbers?
[06:50] <robotgeek> yes, okay for KDG
[06:51] <mdke> thanks.
[06:51] <mdke> yes, it merges line numbers
[06:51] <robotgeek> mdke: thank you!
[06:52] <joachim-n> hi
[06:52] <robotgeek> hi joachim-n
[06:55] <mdke> I'll commit, then at the worst we can tinker if necessary.
[07:20] <jjesse> mdke: wrote back to you, go and ahed and change about kubuntu as i'm swamped right now at work, everyone else has the day off :(
[07:21] <mdke> jjesse: did it. Your email is broken still
[07:21] <jjesse> hmmm wonder what is wrong with it as I'm sending and receiving other email
 host mail.iserv.net[<IP_ADDRESS>]  said: 553 5.3.0 Rejected by Iserv RBL - <IP_ADDRESS> (in reply to MAIL FROM command)
[07:23] <jjesse> mdke: is your email on a blacklist someplace?
[07:24] <mdke> not to my knowledge.
[07:24] <LaserJock> hehe, jjesse blacklists mdke
[07:24] <jsgotangco> ehhehe
[07:27] <jjesse> ok gotta contact my isp then
[07:31] <jjesse> sent an email to my isp to try and figure this out, wonder how many other emails i'm missing
[07:52] <highvoltage> hi docteam
[07:52] <jjesse> helo highvoltage
[07:52] <highvoltage> you know those templates that wikipedia uses in mediawiki?
[07:52] <highvoltage> hi jjesse
[07:52] <highvoltage> do we have something similar in moinmoin for the ubuntu wiki?
[07:53] <highvoltage> i need something that says something to the lines of "This dodgy documentation, follow at your own risk"
[07:53] <highvoltage> for an example, see: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/MondoMindi
[07:54] <jsgotangco> i dont think we such kind of templates that look like those in mediawiki
[07:54] <jsgotangco> we have
[07:54] <jsgotangco> i mean
[07:55] <jsgotangco> err we don't have
[07:55] <jsgotangco> gahh
[07:55] <jsgotangco> (2am)
[07:55] <highvoltage> hehe
[07:55] <highvoltage> is it moin that doesn't support them, or is it just not used at the moment?
[07:55] <highvoltage> it would even be nice just to say that this page is still a stub, and that you can improve it.
[07:56] <highvoltage> there are also a few pages that really shouldn't be there, i mean, that's really not good advice.
[07:58] <jsgotangco> it would be nice to have something like {{dodgy}} template
[07:58] <jsgotangco> then automagically adds that at the top
[07:58] <LaserJock> wouldn't that be something for CategoryCleanup, or no?
[08:00] <jsgotangco> sure but i think CamelCase doesn't grab attention unlike what mediawiki uses
[08:04] <highvoltage> and that also just adds one word way at the bottom of the doc.
[08:04] <highvoltage> with the template you can put up something big and noticable
[08:04] <mdke> I'm not sure about what you want to do, but I think it's likely that you can do it in moin. Best to ask in #moin
[08:05] <jsgotangco> mdke: something similar to what wikipedia uses for current events/disputable entries
[08:12] <highvoltage> mdke: those two block at the top in this page are templates: http://wiki.clug.org.za/wiki/Roaming_between_wireless_and_wired
[08:12] <highvoltage> so you just add {{newpage}} or {{debian}} in the page, and the blocks are there
[08:12] <highvoltage> if you look at this page: http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Linus_Torvalds
[08:12] <jsgotangco> yeah that's mediawiki style
[08:13] <highvoltage> there's a template there tha links to the wikipedia page
[08:13] <highvoltage> jsgotangco: yeah, i just want to show him what we're talking about
[08:13] <jsgotangco> i love that feature
[08:14] <jsgotangco> you can just make a template with virtually any size you want and just embed it
[08:53] <jsgotangco> have a good weekend guys
[09:29] <jjesse> how do i make a link in a wiki page to a sub page for example want to link to KubuntuDocs/Dapper
[09:31] <highvoltage> just like that :)
[09:31] <highvoltage> KubuntuDocs/Dapper will link do KubuntuDocs/Dapper :)
[09:31] <jjesse> hmm didn't do it correctly look at KubuntuDocs on the wiki
[09:37] <highvoltage> jjesse: it seems to work by adding it in  [" "]
[09:38] <highvoltage> so putting ["KubuntuDocs"]  should work (just tested it there)
[10:06] <jjesse> thanks highvoltage
[10:07] <highvoltage> you're welcom
[10:07] <highvoltage> e


[01:17] <adrien2> Hello
[01:17] <adrien2> I have reason to believe 5 or so people are attempting to hack my computer
[01:17] <adrien2> is there any recent security flaws in ubuntu 11.10?
[01:17] <twb> Yes.
[01:17] <adrien2> I'm scared
[01:17] <adrien2> I logedd off from there though
[01:17] <twb> Then unplug all your computers and leave them off forever
[01:18] <adrien2> Why? I did nothing wrong
[01:18] <twb> That's the only way to be safe
[01:18] <adrien2> You guys sure are helpful
[01:18] <twb> Also run an angle-grinder through your hard disks
[01:18] <adrien2> what is your problem?
[01:18] <twb> Man, he was uptight.
[01:18] <fyrfaktry> lol
[01:19] <twb> I was just trying to give him some perspective.
[01:27] <twb> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_security offers some background theory
[01:33] <twb> Also http://cwe.mitre.org/top25/
[01:47] <CyberAlejo17> Hello, someone speaks Spanish?
[01:59] <virusuy> CyberAlejo17: si
[01:59] <CyberAlejo17> Hola :) que gusto
[01:59] <virusuy> :-D
[01:59] <CyberAlejo17> será que puedes ayudarme con un pequeño problema que tengo en un server openvpn?
[02:00] <CyberAlejo17> mas precisamente en la configuracion de iptables con politica por defecto drop
[02:00] <virusuy> uy.. conozco poco de iptables
[02:00] <CyberAlejo17> mira mas info: http://www.ubuntu-es.org/node/166700
[02:00] <twb> CyberAlejo17: are you using ucf, or iptables directly?
[02:01] <CyberAlejo17> ucf?
[02:02] <twb> ucf is Ubuntu's wrapper around iptables
[02:02] <twb> http://cyber.com.au/~twb/doc/iptab is an example using iptables directly
[02:03] <CyberAlejo17> Estoy aplicando iptables directamente.
[02:03] <CyberAlejo17> Mediante un script.sh
[02:04] <twb> CyberAlejo17: please pastebin your script.sh
[02:05] <twb> Also please read http://jengelh.medozas.de/documents/Perfect_Ruleset.pdf, and consider joining #netfilter (which is English only)
[02:06] <CyberAlejo17> ohhh, no tengo ahora acceso al servidor. No puedo hacer conexión mediante SSH, creo que quedó confgurado con DROP cuando salí.
[02:06] <CyberAlejo17> De esta forma no es mucho lo que se pueda hacer :(
[02:16] <twb> CyberAlejo17: I'm sorry to hear that.
[02:17] <twb> CyberAlejo17: ask me again, when you have access to your server.
[02:20] <CyberAlejo17> ok. Eso haré. Muchas gracias. Disculpa la molestia.
[02:22] <stgraber> hallyn: I pushed a very minor fix to ubuntu:lxc (won't upload just for that), just adds a missing space before the = sign of "lxc.network.hwaddr"
[02:23] <stgraber> hallyn: http://paste.ubuntu.com/912396/
[02:43] <psusi> bug #919281 appears to be an iso spin error for the server iso... kernel modules are missing... what is the correct package that should be assigned to?
[04:58] <Hodgy> I just installed Ubuntu Server 11.10 and I am accessing it from SSH, is there anything neat I could try out with it?
[05:06] <FrozenFire> For some reason, on my gateway/router server running Ubuntu Server, the internal interface which is supposed to always be set to <IP_ADDRESS>, dhclient is reconfiguring that interface with a DHCP address.
[05:06] <FrozenFire> The interface is set to static in /etc/network/interfaces
[05:06] <FrozenFire> And I've even set supersede fixed-address <IP_ADDRESS> in dhclient.conf
[05:06] <FrozenFire> But it keeps happening
[05:07] <FrozenFire> It's getting frustrating as heck, because something's causing dhclient to reconfigure the interfaces on a regular basis
[05:08] <FrozenFire> Any ideas as to why?
[05:12] <FrozenFire> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=556001 Essentially equivalent to this
[06:06] <RoyK> hi all. I have two kvm nodes setup with ssh auth between them, both running oneiric.   They're from the same source package.
[08:46]  * smb chants iscsitarget into Daviey 's generic direction...
[08:50] <Tm_T> language ...
[08:52] <_ruben> iscsitarget as in iet? yuck :P
[08:53] <twb> _ruben: it's OK provided you remember to use a non-terminated BLACK goat
[09:02] <_ruben> twb: hehe
[09:09] <twb> OK, this is confusing.  lucid's grub-efi-amd64 says that it needs an EFI partition, and doesn't take a device.  The same program in precise, DOES take a device, and if you just do "grub-install /dev/sda" without an EFI partition on that device, it succeeds without output.  Looking at the partition table afterwards shows there is still no EFI partition.  WTF?
[09:09]  * twb reboots to see if anything has changed
[09:09] <twb> rebooting makes it boot from the MBR still
[09:38] <kokyu> is anyone here (kind of) experienced with Ubuntu plus OpenStack?
[09:39] <uksysadmin> kokyu: what do you need to know? dev support or end user help/
[09:39] <kokyu> I just installed 12.04 (daily build) and despite the fact, that OpenStack enabled during installation process, it did not succeed without telling me why, so I excluded it again, and did continue install
[09:39] <kokyu> (still writing my issue :-) )
[09:39] <kokyu> now, after install reboot, I see, that it actually has installed OpenStack, but SWIFT failed to start up, Compute (nova) seems to be running, at least when checking the process list.
[09:40] <kokyu> I am kind of new to both, Ubuntu (not Linux et al) and OpenStack, so I am a little confused on how to fix things now. is OpenStack now half or fully installed, or am I missing just some db configuration bits?
[09:41] <kokyu> maybe choosing 12.04 wasn't that a great idea, but this is going to be the next LTS and to be released in a few weeks, so I chose this one (also due to the recent kernel and userland :)
[09:42] <kokyu> uksysadmin: I kind of need someone to give me hints to get OpenStack initially running :)
[09:42] <kokyu> we're currently using Proxmox 1.9 with OpenVZ, with LTS 8.04 and would like to switch to OpenStack for the new hardware with 12.04 LTS ideally
[09:43] <kokyu> and since OpenStack seems to be core part of Ubuntu now, it just seems ideal.
[09:45] <uksysadmin> kokyu: check this out: http://uksysadmin.wordpress.com/2012/03/28/screencast-video-of-an-install-of-openstack-essex-on-ubuntu-12-04-under-virtualbox/
[09:45] <kokyu> oha, interesting. I'll watch that. many thanks so far ;)
[09:51] <kokyu> uksysadmin: thanks :)
[09:52] <uksysadmin> np kokyu - check out #openstack too - other guys can help you in there with OpenStack issues
[10:04] <kokyu> uksysadmin: is your vimeo video guide really without sound, or is it my audio messing up right now?
[10:05] <uksysadmin> ah - sorry - I should put a message up - it is without sound
[10:05]  * uksysadmin went for the 1900s silent movie genre ;-)
[10:05] <kokyu> lol damn it, and I was searching for the issue locally :D
[10:06] <uksysadmin> I'll update my blog. sorry! :S
[10:07] <kokyu> never mind, now that I now, I really apreciate ppl doing screencats, however, I can just encourage you to actually speak with it, it is really much more helpful with audio text :)
[10:08] <kokyu> uksysadmin: I also found this one, btw: http://www.hastexo.com/resources/docs/installing-openstack-essex-4-ubuntu-1204-precise-pangolin
[10:09] <koolhead17> uksysadmin: ^^
[10:10] <uksysadmin> that's a great tutorial too
[10:10] <uksysadmin> and don't encourage koolhead17 to make me do a voice over
[10:10] <uksysadmin> ;-)
[10:10] <uksysadmin> There are some great guides coming out now that accompany the documentation
[10:10] <kokyu> hehe
[10:10] <koolhead17> lol. you should definately do that man
[10:11] <uksysadmin> ok ok, I'll try and find some time to add some audio
[10:25] <sergevn> hi
[10:45] <ironm> !daily
[11:07] <sergevn> hi
[11:08] <ironm> !ubuntu-server+1
[11:08] <ironm> !ubuntu-server
[11:24] <hlan> hello, I'm using the ppa ondrej/php5 because I need php 5.4 but php segfaults so I also need the debug symbols so I can do a gdb backtrace... how do I proceed?
[11:58] <ironm> hello. Please allow me one question. I use XCP 1.5 (xen) as host and I can successfully install ubuntu-server 11.10 as VM but I am running in "CD-ROM mount" issue with ubuntu-server 12.04. Mor detals are in: xcp1.5-ubuntu-server12.04.error.txt
[11:58] <ironm> http://paste.debian.net/161870/
[11:59] <ironm> can anyone confirm this issue? Thank you in advance for any hints.
[12:02] <ironm> would be #ubuntu+1 channel better for the question above?
[12:18] <alein> Hi can I ask in the channel?
[12:18] <uksysadmin> alein: I can't speak for everyone, but I'll let you. :p
[12:20] <alein> Ok thanks, I have one big problem with one of my servers. The problem is that some bad person make a huge ddos syn flood on port 80. That overload my server, http stop working and other services become slow and useless.
[12:21] <ahxcjb> your front end firewalls should mitigate against syn floods
[12:21] <alein> I don't talk about webserver flood - I mean tcp syn flood on port 80
[12:21] <alein> I talk about 200Mbps syn flood traffic
[12:22] <uksysadmin> +1 on ahxcjb.
[12:22] <alein> ahxcjb what you mean? my ISP should stop the flood?
[12:22] <rbasak> alein: what's your question?
[12:22] <uksysadmin> ok, few solutions - set up your systems to not allow the creation of many syn connections without the full ack etc... firewall, ips.
[12:22] <alein> how to deffend myself
[12:23] <uksysadmin> if its to port 80... another quick win - check out www.cloudflare.com and have your site live behind that
[12:23] <ahxcjb> set your front end firewall to mitigatge against the attack
[12:23] <ahxcjb> what is your front-end firewall?
[12:23] <ahxcjb> is it Ubuntu?
[12:23] <rbasak> Enabling syn cookies should protect against a plain syn flood
[12:23] <alein> ahxcjb iptables doesn't help at all
[12:23] <ahxcjb> http://www.lainoox.com/tag/syn-flood-iptables/
[12:24] <ahxcjb> alein: of course it does!
[12:24] <alein> I can drop all the traffic and the server gets overloaded
[12:24] <ahxcjb> then you're not doing it correctly
[12:24] <alein> lol
[12:24] <ahxcjb> if you're getting a 200Mbps syn flood, you should involve your ISP
[12:24] <alein> iptables -I INPUT -i eth0 -s <IP_ADDRESS>/0 -j DROP
[12:24] <patdk-wk> http://www.symantec.com/connect/articles/hardening-tcpip-stack-syn-attacks
[12:24] <ahxcjb> well that's just silly
[12:24] <alein> that doesn't help
[12:25] <ahxcjb> it doesn't help because you clearly haven't got clue
[12:25]  * patdk-wk has never been syn flooded
[12:25] <alein> ;)
[12:25] <patdk-wk> atleast not more than my server could handly by itself
[12:25] <patdk-wk> without adjustments
[12:26] <patdk-wk> people do love to do POST floods for some reason
[12:26] <ahxcjb> if you're suffering a major DoS you need to involve your ISP
[12:26] <ahxcjb> as they can mitigate against the flood far better than a home user can.
[12:27] <alein> ahxcjb I call them, wtite them a letter nad the answer was "We can't handle it"
[12:27] <ahxcjb> alein: then change ISPs
[12:27] <alein> write*
[12:27] <alein> its not that easy
[12:27] <alein> so  http://www.lainoox.com/tag/syn-flood-iptables/ should help?
[12:28] <ahxcjb> I think if you are being hit by the size of DoS  that you state, then you have to involve your ISP
[12:28] <ahxcjb> and if your ISP doesn't act, then MOVE ISP
[12:28] <alein> I have 1gbps connection so they hardly can owerload my bandwith
[12:28] <alein> but that last flood was ugly
[12:29] <ahxcjb> if you have a 1gbps connection, then you're a fixed line user
[12:29] <ahxcjb> and should have budget for proper firewalls
[12:29] <ahxcjb> which i suggest you purchase
[12:29] <ahxcjb> to allow you to mitigate against such attacks
[12:29] <alein> Nope, I don't have it
[12:30] <ahxcjb> then how and why do you have a 1gbps connection? Are you a business?
[12:30] <alein> Nope, I'm not a business, I have little game server
[12:30] <ahxcjb> on 1gbps? pull the other one
[12:30] <alein> just have friends in that ISP and I have 1 Gbps
[12:31] <ahxcjb> so are you paying for this co-lo
[12:31] <ahxcjb> ?
[12:31] <alein> Yes with 9 years work in that company
[12:31] <patdk-wk> sound like a, I'll put it under my desk, deal
[12:32] <alein> possible SYN flooding on port 80.  Changing it to /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-openjdk fixed it. Is this a bug? Any idea why I don't have a /usr/lib/jvm/default-java?
[12:39] <jamespage> rbasak, bug 971952
[12:40] <rbasak> thanks :)
[12:40] <jamespage> jenkins depends of default-jre-headless | java6-runtime-headless...
[12:40] <jamespage> rbasak, you can fix it bey installing default-jre-headless
[12:41] <jamespage> it works differently in precise so its an oneiric specific issue
[12:41]  * jamespage wishes for good JAVA_HOME detection
[12:41] <jamespage> virtually every server type package has this problem
[12:42] <jamespage> rbasak, hence things like bigtop-utils....
[12:42] <ironm> hello. Does anyone run ubuntu-server 12.04 on XCP 1.5 host? (free xen-server)
[12:43] <rbasak> jamespage: that worked - thanks!
[12:45] <jamespage> rbasak, its a PITA
[12:46] <jamespage> rbasak, BTW I've been backporting precise jenkins to ppa:hudson-ubuntu/backports if you want something a bit more up-to-date for the next few weeks
[12:47] <rbasak> jamespage: thanks, I'll use that if I find something I need that's missing
[14:08] <ironm> hello. Anyone around running a kvm  based host on ubuntu-server 11.10 or 12.04? I am looking for some documentation about configuring and running kvm VMs
[14:10] <SpamapS> lynxman: pong, was out yesterday.
[14:11] <SpamapS> ironm: https://help.ubuntu.com/8.04/serverguide/C/libvirt.html
[14:11] <ironm> thanks a lot SpamapS :)
[14:12] <lynxman> SpamapS: hey I'm having some problems with the splice command, wanted to pick your brain for a bit :)
[14:12] <SpamapS> hrm.. why does google insist on giving me the hardy docs? We need to setup a sitemap for help.ubuntu.com
[14:12] <lynxman> SpamapS: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/913051/ <-- already converted all the soft links to regular files, still errors
[14:12] <SpamapS> ironm: https://help.ubuntu.com/11.10/serverguide/C/libvirt.html probably more current :)
[14:13] <ironm> SpamapS,  I will check this one too. Merci :)
[14:16] <SpamapS> lynxman: hmm
[14:18] <lynxman> SpamapS: easily reproducible, negronjl suggested me that soft links wouldn't work so I ran a small script to convert them
[14:18] <lynxman> SpamapS: the error message is kinda confusing, that's why I wanted to ask you :)
[14:18] <SpamapS> lynxman: the logic looks a bit out of order
[14:19] <lynxman> SpamapS: what would you suggest?
[14:19] <lynxman> SpamapS: do the charms need to be in any special order?
[14:19] <lynxman> SpamapS: even if I try to do one it's failing I'm afraid
[14:20] <SpamapS> lynxman: yeah I think the lack of tests for splice is showing. ;)
[14:20] <lynxman> SpamapS: hah yeah :)
[14:20] <koolhead17> Daviey: around?
[14:20] <SpamapS> lynxman: I believe the simple fix is to add an os.mkdir before the proxy_relation calls
[14:22] <lynxman> SpamapS: just create a silently failing os.mkdir before the proxy_relation call to create the dir if it doesn't exist?
[14:24] <SpamapS> lynxman: yeah, or perhaps move the make_hook calls before the proxy relation calls.
[14:25] <SpamapS> (they do a mkdir)
[14:27] <lynxman> SpamapS: could you pass me a small diff so I know where to look at quickly? :)
[14:28] <lynxman> SpamapS: ah neverminds scripts/splice
[14:29] <lynxman> SpamapS: I've been too long doing ruby, almost forgot python now ;)
[14:31] <lynxman> SpamapS: yeah that worked \o/
[14:32] <SpamapS> lynxman: I think its probably time that we merge splice into charm-tools
[14:32] <lynxman> SpamapS: would be good, it's extremely useful
[14:33] <SpamapS> lynxman: still feels very experimental though.. hrm
[14:35] <ironm> SpamapS, I am wondering a bit, why virtinst has not been installed even I have chosen the host tasksel option (for kvm)
[14:38] <SpamapS> ironm: dunno, I have to admit, my libvirt knowledge is pitiful, I usually just use virt-manager
[14:40] <ironm> SpamapS, wirt-manager hasn't been installed too
[14:40] <SpamapS> ironm: its a GUI so thats no surprise
[14:41] <ironm> oh .. I see :)
[15:01] <hlan> I'm trying to automate apt and I'm copying sources.list however that makes apt hang on /var/lib/dpkg/info/base-passwd.postinst
[15:02] <hlan> I guess some trust/security files must also be copied...  what more files do I need to copy except /etc/apt/sources.list
[15:02] <hlan> ?
[15:02] <SpamapS> hlan: what exactly are you trying to automate?
[15:03] <SpamapS> hlan: sources.list would have nothing to do with /var/lib/dpkg/info/base-passwd.postinst ..
[15:03] <SpamapS> hlan: if you want to create a new, tiny ubuntu, you want debootstrap, not apt
[15:03] <hlan> SpamapS: apt-get spawns that process and it waits for some kind of user prompt
[15:04] <SpamapS> hlan: that process is the post install script for a package. dpkg is spawning it, not apt
[15:04] <hlan> SpamapS: what kind of information is it asking for?
[15:04] <hlan> it's trying to read from stdin
[15:04] <hlan> unfortunately I can't see stdout
[15:05] <SpamapS> hlan: no idea, but if you want to not be prompted you can use export DEBIAN_FRONTEND=noninteractive
[15:06] <SpamapS> hlan: it wil then choose defaults for all questions
[15:09] <konradb> hi, is it possible to make dist-upgrade without rebooting?
[15:24] <NGNTNT> hi everybody
[15:24] <konradb> everypony*
[15:25] <NGNTNT> can anyone help me with my stucked-at-the-boot ubuntu server ?
[15:29] <NGNTNT> noone ?
[15:33] <SpamapS> NGNTNT: can you be more specific than "stuck at the boot" ?
[15:33] <SpamapS> konradb: yes you can upgrade almost anything without rebooting.. notable exceptions are upstart and the kernel (though there is 'ksplice' for kernels, I don't know how stable it is)
[15:42] <NGNTNT> at the boot sequence the server goes to busybox prompt. The previouse lines said mounting /dev to /root/dev failed
[15:42] <NGNTNT> I tried to launch fsck booting from a live cd but nothing worked yet
[15:44] <jamespage> Ursinha,  http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ubuntu-server/triage-report.html is looking better (if a little scary)
[15:45] <Ursinha> jamespage, is the data correct? I removed one constraint that was making that miss some bugs
[15:45] <jamespage> Ursinha, well I could see bugs moving through the queue so I think so
[15:46] <jamespage> Ursinha, ~260 New bugs was the scary bit (was 275 this morning :-))
[15:54] <raubvogel> Does ubuntu now do disk alignment when partitioning hard drives?
[15:55] <SpamapS> Ursinha: thanks for fixing that
[15:55] <SpamapS> jamespage: and well done noticing it was wrong ;)
[15:55] <Ursinha> thanks guys for using it
[15:55] <Ursinha> :)
[15:55] <jamespage> Ursinha, makes my life easier (well it does now)
[15:56]  * jamespage thinks we need to have a blitz on New bugs
[16:01] <jamespage> ubuntu-server team meeting in #ubuntu-meeting about to start...
[16:14] <ironm> SpamapS, I used the following line to create VM. I am not sure if it is correct syntax. How can I connect to the install console?
[16:14] <ironm> virt-install -n web70 -r 2048 --disk path=/dev/sdd -c /var/lib/libvirt/ubuntu-11.10-server-amd64.iso  --network network=default --connect=qemu:///system --graphics none -v
[16:15] <ironm>  10 web70                running
[16:17] <ironm> hmm... : ironm@dev10:~$ virt-viewer --connect qemu:///system 10
[16:20] <SpamapS> ironm: you're asking the wrong person. ;)
[16:20] <SpamapS> hallyn: ^^ perhaps you can help ironm ?
[16:21] <ironm> ok .. thanks a lot anyway SpamapS :)
[16:21] <ironm> it looks like the VM is running. I don't know how to connect to console using virt-viewer
[16:22] <ironm> console of this VM ...
[16:23] <hallyn> i don't use virt-install.  but perhaps 'virsh console 10', if you have a serial console hooked up inthe guest
[16:23] <ironm> thank you hallyn  .. i will check it
[16:24] <ironm> hmm ... I am gettint the following output but nothing happen anymore and I am not able to type in  ...
[16:24] <ironm> Connected to domain web70
[16:24] <ironm> Escape character is ^]
[16:28] <ironm> hallyn, has the following line a correct syntax? virt-install -n web70 -r 2048 --disk path=/dev/sdd -c /var/lib/libvirt/ubuntu-11.10-server-amd64.iso  --network network=default --connect=qemu:///system --graphics none -v
[16:29] <hallyn> ironm: as I say I don't use virt-install.  looks fine based on what i know
[16:30] <hallyn> i wonder if mdeslaur uses it...
[16:30] <hallyn> i'll give it a whirl though
[16:30] <ironm> thanks a lot hallyn
[16:33] <hallyn> looks fine especiallly per https://help.ubuntu.com/11.10/serverguide/C/libvirt.html
[16:34] <mdeslaur> ironm: I don't think you can connect to a virt-install console
[16:34] <hallyn> ironm: why exactly did you say --graphics=none?  if you do vnc, you'll get the console over vnc
[16:34] <hallyn> which i think is what you need right now
[16:34] <hallyn> it won't cause x to be installed
[16:34] <mdeslaur> ironm: ah, I take it back, hallyn is right
[16:35] <ironm> hallyn, I am on console of the host (ssh)
[16:36] <ironm> it looks like I need a client with vnc ...
[16:36] <hallyn> ironm: i'm afraid we have terminology confusion.  'ssh' gives you a pty, fwiw.  'console' usually means a getty running on /dev/ttyX
[16:37] <hallyn> right.  once it's all set up you can then ssh into the guest
[16:37] <hallyn> virsh console itself "works", but I dont' knwo if virtinst is setting /dev/ttyS0 up, nor do i think ubuntu server is setting it up
[16:37] <hallyn> so virsh console gives nothing bc there is no getty running
[16:37] <utlemming> kirkland: ping
[16:37] <ironm> hallyn, yes .. I thought it is possible to use an install console also from the KVM host
[16:38] <hallyn> i don't know what you mean
[16:38] <smoser> kirkland, you see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/byobu/+bug/966686
[16:38] <ironm> hallyn, I try to follow you
[16:38] <smoser> RoyK, you were asserting somewhere that a cd install in a vm results in an empty console on server install, is that right?
[16:39] <smoser> gah
[16:39] <smoser> s/RoyK/RoakSoax/
[16:39] <roaksoax> smoser: i'm here
[16:40] <smoser> roaksoax, then look above. stupid caps change.
[16:40] <smoser> anyway
[16:40] <roaksoax> lol
[16:40] <roaksoax> smoser: yeah, I've seen that issue
[16:40] <smoser> can you open a bug.
[16:40] <smoser> hallyn, ^
[16:40] <roaksoax> smoser: sure, let me test it again to confirm and will open a bug
[16:40] <smoser> and we should determine if thats vm only.
[16:41] <roaksoax> k ;)
[16:42] <hallyn> smoser: eh what?
[16:43] <hallyn> if you install a non-server iso without x, grub.conf still redirects you to vt7, which is empty.  is that what you're referring to?
[16:43] <hallyn> it's not only in vms
[16:43] <hallyn> you can edit /etc/default/grub, or jsut hit alt-left to get a console
[16:43] <smoser> this was server iso install
[16:43] <smoser> but admittedly possibly via preseed and cobbler/maas
[16:44] <hallyn> and what does /proc/cmdline show
[16:44] <roaksoax> hallyn: yes
[16:44] <roaksoax> hallyn: that's it, it shows a black screen with cursor, but changing ttys gives you the login prompt
[16:45] <hallyn> I assume there is vt.handoff=7 in /proc/cmdline
[16:45] <roaksoax> let me check, doing a new install
[16:47] <kirkland> utlemming: howdy
[16:48] <utlemming> kirkland: have you perchance seen my bug on byobu clearing the screen on login?
[16:48] <utlemming> bug 966686
[16:48] <kirkland> utlemming: yeah, haven't had time to look into that
[16:48] <kirkland> utlemming: is that a difference between tmux and screen, perhaps?
[16:49] <kirkland> utlemming: I think that's because the older byobu used the /usr/bin/byobu-shell to launch a shell
[16:49] <kirkland> utlemming: which cats the motd
[16:50] <utlemming> kirkland: yeah, the tmux version is the one that clears the screen
[16:54] <kirkland> utlemming: do you think this is release critical?
[16:54] <kirkland> utlemming: I reckon it is, since it removes the landscape commercial, huh?
[16:55] <utlemming> kirkland: yes...we are putting some logic in to warn people of invalid or uninstalled locales. There is a problem with some packages where if LC_* variable are exported, the package may not installed.
[16:55] <utlemming> kirkland: and it removes the blatant commerical advertising too
[16:55] <kirkland> utlemming: well, byobu is off by default now, so meh :-)
[16:56] <utlemming> kirkland: hence the reason I filed it as "high" instead of critical. Although, the tmux version of byobu is pretty slick. I'm using it a whole lot more myself.
[16:56] <kirkland> utlemming: okay, I'll get that one fixed, please assign it to me, mark it triaged/high and milestone it appropriately
[16:56] <kirkland> utlemming: i *love* it ;-)
[16:56] <kirkland> utlemming: 1920x1080 with about ~6 splits usually
[16:56] <kirkland> utlemming: and rarely more than 1 window
[16:56] <kirkland> utlemming: okay, i'll get on that today
[16:57] <utlemming> kirkland: thanks :) Marked triaged, assigned and targeted
[17:35] <hallyn> roaksoax: i really don't know what's to be done about htat :)  unless we have the core x package do the appending of vthandoff line
[18:01] <bobweaver> Does anyone know where to get this how much it costs . Is it real ? does it work on deb systems or only rpm ? ect   http://www.hepsia.com/ .Talk about bad advertising, All I can find is demo lol
[18:01] <jamespage> adam_g, around? want to discuss squid3?
[18:16] <dexter76> hello, on a fresh ubuntu 11.10 server virt-install raise "Could not find an installable distribution at" error whatever iso/http/ftp i give to the --location
[18:16] <dexter76> any ideas what to check?
[18:20] <adam_g> jamespage: sorry, lost in an email. yea
[18:21] <adam_g> jamespage: still around or did i miss you?
[18:40] <kklimonda> huh, it seems like idmapd doesn't start early enough on precise when used with autofs..
[18:42] <kklimonda> ah, it's a different issue - my network doesn't start early enough so idmapd can't figure out the domain..
[18:42] <kklimonda> but that makes no sense
[18:54] <imjustmatthew> I'm having some trouble getting an upstart job to work right, is there an even fires when a DHCP lease is accepted?
[19:05] <smoser> hallyn, ping
[19:05] <hallyn> .
[19:05] <KM0201> !ping
[19:05] <KM0201> lol
[19:06] <smoser> how would you boot a kvm instance with networking other than guest net
[19:06] <smoser> ie, i'd like to use kvm without libvirt, but the only time i ever do something other than guest net is with libvirt
[19:07] <hallyn> smoser: hold on lemme pastebin what i do
[19:08] <hallyn> smoser: http://paste.ubuntu.com/913492/
[19:09] <hallyn> or are you asking for libvirt xml to do that?
[19:09] <smoser> hallyn, thats what i wanted
[19:09] <smoser> minus...
[19:09] <smoser> how do you get a network interface there
[19:09] <hallyn> you mean br0?
[19:10] <smoser> in the guest
[19:10] <smoser> static?
[19:10] <hallyn> i dno't understand.  the cmds above will give you an eth0 in the guest
[19:11] <smoser> right.
[19:11] <smoser> but how does it get an IP
[19:13] <hallyn> depends on how br0 is set up
[19:13] <smoser> ah
[19:13] <smoser> i see
[19:13] <smoser> br0 from libvirt ?
[19:13] <hallyn> it should ping the same dhcp sever as your host does
[19:14] <hallyn> or br0 that eth0 is slaved to
[19:14] <smoser> ah.
[19:14] <smoser> yeah.
[19:14] <smoser> i need to provide it one then.
[19:14] <smoser> k.
[19:14] <hallyn> or,
[19:14] <hallyn> you can set one in the guest by hadn i suppose, but it probably won't talk to the network right
[19:18] <smoser> hallyn, thanks.
[19:20] <hallyn> np
[19:34] <hlan> will the log rotator process any log directly stored in /var/log ?
[19:34] <hlan> or just "syslogs"
[20:29] <zul> adam_g:  so novnc doesnt have tarballs per say, like release tarballs, so i think we should be doing another snapshot with the horizon patches applied
[20:30] <alein> hi all
[20:30] <alein> I would like to ask, is there any way to catch NULL TCP packets with tcpdump?
[21:02] <RoyK> alein: "Null Packets are neither sent nor acknowledged when not received."
[21:04] <RoyK> 2.1. Formal Definition
[21:04] <RoyK> [This section is intentionally left blank, see also Section 0 of [NULL].]
[21:05]  * RoyK loves april fool RFCs :D
[21:05] <alein> RoyK I'm trying to catch the true ip address of spoofed syn flood attack.
[21:05] <alein> Can I do this with tcpdump and wireshark
[21:06] <RoyK> how do you want to catch the real IP when it's spoofed?
[21:06] <RoyK> spoofed means it's overwritten
[21:07] <RoyK> and the routers don't track what they do
[21:07] <alein> The only way to detect default ip is to looking for NULL TCP packets (meaning no TCP flags set) with destination ports of 0.
[21:09] <alein> but I'm not sure that I can do this with tcpdump or only with an intrusion-detection system
[21:21] <RoyK> alein: what should generate that null packet, then?
[21:21] <alein> meaning no TCP flags set
[21:21] <zul> adam_g: we 600 the keystone config files dont we?
[21:23] <adam_g> zul: keystone.conf, yeah, we should
[21:24] <adam_g> zul: also, /var/lib/keystone/keystone.db if it exists
[21:24] <zul> k
[22:09] <rmk> Alright so the Ubuntu dhcp client seems to just give up and die if the dhcp server is down during the time a request is bad..
[22:09] <rmk> s/bad/made
[23:15] <rmk> So, when we lose our dhcp server, our dhclient process retries for about a minute then exits rather than sleeping.  Ubuntu 11.10 64-bit server.  Is this expected behavior and is there a way to change that?
[23:15] <rmk> I can obviously script aorund it but I figure there has to be a cleaner way.
[23:16] <jiboumans_> hi smoser, just tried to launch a new ami (ami-37af765e) in us-east-1a and cloud-init exited with code 1. Using the slightly older ami-3e9b4957 everythings works just dandy. figured you'd want to know.
[23:20] <dork> it is expected behavior because it's assuming you chose the wrong interface, meant to provision a static ip, etc
[23:20] <dork> just hit go back and do it again
[23:22] <smoser> jiboumans_, i suspect mirror issues. but will give a quick check.
[23:22] <smoser> hm.. i dont know of ami-37af765e
[23:22] <jiboumans_> http://uec-images.ubuntu.com/query/lucid/server/released.current.txt
[23:22] <jiboumans_> smoser: it's listed there ^
[23:23] <smoser> ah. k.  my cache was just out of date
[23:23] <jiboumans_> smoser: this is the last bits in the syslog: https://gist.github.com/2296262
[23:23] <smoser> well, i can't be sure why your pupet died.
[23:23] <dork> rmk: oh nevermind thought you meant during installation
[23:23] <smoser> perhaps it could not reach the master ?
[23:24] <rmk> no I need it to retry forever
[23:24] <dork> rmk: try dhclienf.conf
[23:24] <jiboumans_> smoser: possibly, but it left the ami in a non-good state and appeared to exit the run.
[23:24] <dork> dhclient.conf
[23:24] <jiboumans_> am i seeing that wrong?
[23:24] <dork> looks like the params are in there
[23:25] <jiboumans_> there was no /etc/puppet generated for example
[23:26] <smoser> jiboumans_, console output (get-console-output) is more helopful. it will have more info. i suspect it has a apt-get update failre.
[23:26] <smoser> but there will probably be something meaningful to you there.
[23:26] <jiboumans_> smoser: i've scrapped the instance, but happy to respin one if it helps you diagnose
[23:26] <smoser> (and note, in later releases, you should set
[23:26] <smoser>  output: {all: '| tee -a /var/log/cloud-init-output.log'}
[23:26] <smoser> you have access to the instance up to 1 hour after termination
[23:27] <smoser> jiboumans_, so above, then you'll have everything that output by cloud-inti or subprocess in that log file.
[23:28] <smoser> just easier to get at thene console
[23:28] <jiboumans_> smoser: i don't seem to be able to start it up again from the console though.. am i missing something?
[23:28] <jiboumans_> thanks, adding that to our start up script
[23:28] <smoser> you cant start it up again
[23:28] <smoser> but at least from the tools, you'll be able to get console output
[23:28] <smoser> its just stored for 1 hour.
[23:29] <smoser> ie, euca-get-console-output <i-iabababab>
[23:30] <jiboumans_> checking
[23:31] <jiboumans_> smoser: you're right. updated the gist: https://gist.github.com/2296312
[23:31] <jiboumans_> W: Failed to fetch http://us-east-1.ec2.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/lucid-updates/main/source/Sources.bz2  Hash Sum mismatch
[23:31] <smoser> jiboumans_, you  might be a good candidate for our s3 mirrors.
[23:32] <jiboumans_> smoser: i'm listening :)
[23:32] <smoser> which (given disabled apt pipelining , which is current in daily images, or anything with up to date cloud-init)
[23:32] <smoser> should be more stable.
[23:32] <smoser> we'll have offically released amis later this week that have the optoin already disabled inside them
[23:33] <utlemming> smoser, jiboumans_: lucid was officially released today with the update
[23:33] <smoser> but you can either laucnh the daily, or set the option in apt yourselfbefore update.
[23:33] <jiboumans_> sorry, you mean that new images will use the s3 mirror by default?
[23:33] <smoser> jiboumans_, so there ya go.
[23:33] <smoser> jiboumans_, no, htye use the other mirrors. but you can tell them fairly easily to use the s3
[23:33] <smoser> utlemming, can tell you how
[23:34] <utlemming> run 'sed -i "s,ec2.archive.ubuntu.com,ec2.archive.ubuntu.com.s3.amazonaws.com,g" /etc/apt/sources.list'
[23:34] <jiboumans_> then i didn't quite follow; what's the apt-pipelining option? I see the lp repo, but not the rationale behind it
[23:36] <utlemming> APT uses a micro-enhancement (HTTP Pipelining) to eak out a few microseconds of performance. S3, well, it doesn't get along with pipelining. If you disable apt's pipelining, then S3 works well.
[23:36] <jiboumans_> ah, that makes sense
[23:37] <jiboumans_> utlemming/smoser: is the s3 apt repo code viewable somewhere? it's on my bucket list to do that internally for our own apt repo too
[23:38] <utlemming> yup... lp:s3aptmirror
[23:39] <jiboumans_> thanks utlemming smoser, very helpful :)
[23:43] <smoser> utlemming, could you open an RT about the apt mirror issue
[23:47] <smoser> utlemming, oh, its the stale issue


[04:02]  * ianorlin installed ubuntu onto his mom's computer today so I get my external hard drive back which I had previously installed it on
[14:33] <Roguehorse> Good Morning


[05:37] <ESphynx> I get the weirdest build error now on Lucid related to PTHREAD_MUTEX_RECURSIVE :S It built fine a week and a half ago...
[07:12] <dholbach> good morning
[07:28] <geser> good morning
[13:06] <tumbleweed> Laney: mitya57 thinks ubuntu_upload_history is out of date. Can you poke it? where do I find logs?
[13:07] <tumbleweed> oh, hrm, found the stuff in your homedir
[13:07] <tumbleweed> it looks up to date
[13:07] <Laney> might not be running
[13:07] <Laney> the import side
[13:08] <tumbleweed> yeah, guessing so
[13:08] <tumbleweed> no idea where the logs for that live
[13:08] <Laney> cron email
[13:08] <Laney> upload-history: lockfile found, exiting.
[13:08] <tumbleweed> :P
[13:10] <Laney> just revved it manually
[13:10] <Laney> seems ok now
[13:10] <tumbleweed> ta
[13:10]  * Laney wonders whether to break the lock
[13:11] <Laney> lucas: ^?
[18:33] <jtaylor> is there a way to install raring without booting the iso?
[18:33] <jtaylor> like some clever dd of a chroot to the partition?
[18:34] <jtaylor> (I'm asking because the isos don't work for me for some undebuggable reason and I slowly need a proper installation for testing :/ )
[18:35] <tumbleweed> um, debootstrap into a blank partition, and do the rest by hand?
[18:35] <tumbleweed> it's not much - install a kernel, grub, set up an fstab, and hosts
[18:36] <ogra_> using ubuntu-core tarballs heps to skip debootstrap :)
[18:36] <ogra_> *helps
[18:36] <jtaylor> I'll try that thanks
[18:38]  * tumbleweed almost always installs with debootstrap, but maybe that's weird or I use odd hardware
[18:44] <jtaylor> seems to be much easier than I though, why did I waste my time with these isos all thes years :)
[19:06] <ogra_> haha
[20:11] <ajmitch> wendar: congratulations on MOTU, sorry I missed the meeting :)
[20:13] <wendar> ajmitch: thanks :)
[20:15] <jtaylor> hm ok not so easy
[20:15] <jtaylor> can't get grub to work
[20:15] <jtaylor> not helped by that it doesn'T detect my keyboard properly on startup
[21:25] <micahg> wendar: Logan_: have at it :)
[21:26] <wendar> micahg: thanks!
[21:29] <tumbleweed> Logan_: if you're looking for lists of thnigs that need work... http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/
[21:33] <tumbleweed> bdrung: the thing I just committed to mk-sbuild depends on a recent schroot, do you think that's a problem?
[21:35] <bdrung> tumbleweed: define recent
[21:36] <tumbleweed> since august - 1.6.4-1
[21:36] <bdrung> tumbleweed: btw, mk-sbuild should move into sbuild
[21:36] <tumbleweed> they already have their own tool
[21:36] <tumbleweed> but yes, it should
[21:38] <ESphynx> hey guys :)
[21:38] <bdrung> tumbleweed: so debian testing and raring ship a recent enough schroot package. i am fine with that. ubuntu backporters have to take care of it (in case someone wants to backport it)
[21:38] <tumbleweed> bdrung: it's also easily worked around by providing a custom template
[21:38] <bdrung> tumbleweed: if sbuild has it's own tool, how about combining these tools?
[21:39] <tumbleweed> bdrung: yes


[23:45] <arraybolt3> I know I was talking about it being strange that Lunar hadn't gotten kernel updates in a while, but I'm more worried about that now that I'm looking at this: https://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=linux-image-generic
[23:45] <arraybolt3> Kinetic's kernel package version is <IP_ADDRESS>.23, while Lunar is on <IP_ADDRESS>.21. What happened?
[23:47] <arraybolt3> Actually, this might be better in -devel since something's awry here I think.


[08:08] <ochosi> micahg: i'm pessimistic about "soonish", but we'll see..
[08:16] <ochosi> bbl
[10:25] <mr_pouit> knome: I supposed someone had been working on that blueprint and could give me .desktop files =]
[10:26] <mr_pouit>  indicator-application-gtk2 : Depends: indicator-application (= 0.5.0-0ubuntu1) but 12.10.0-0ubuntu2 is to be installed
[10:26] <mr_pouit>  indicator-sound-gtk2 : Depends: indicator-sound (= 12.10.0-0ubuntu1) but it is not going to be installed
[10:26] <mr_pouit> micahg: ^ dailies fail to build, I guess that's why gilir dropped the indicators
[11:06] <ochosi> knome: i see you finished the testcase yesterday. well done
[11:51] <knome> Unit193, can you send mr_pouit the .desktop files? :]
[13:17] <knome> got a reply from the guy running the linux-classes with xubuntu. he says they're excited about xubuntu and will happily cooperate
[13:17] <knome> pleia2, ^
[13:18] <knome> bluesabre, hey!
[13:18] <bluesabre> Hiya knome!
[13:19] <knome> bluesabre, PM ok? :)
[13:19] <smartboyhw> knome: Eventually, is there only you to test the upgrade?:)
[13:19] <smartboyhw> I mean 12.04.1
[13:19] <bluesabre> PM..?
[13:19] <knome> smartboyhw, yes, i did all the tests, and there was one test done by somebody else
[13:19] <bluesabre> (private message?)
[13:19] <knome> bluesabre, private message, /q
[13:20] <smartboyhw> :)
[13:32] <smartboyhw> o/ genii-around
[13:33] <knome> bluesabre, motion carried :)
[13:33] <knome> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel/2012-August/008382.html
[13:33]  * genii-around makes more coffee
[13:33] <smartboyhw> knome: :)
[13:33] <bluesabre> Yay!
[13:33] <smartboyhw> Congrats bluesabre:)
[13:33] <knome> mr_pouit, next thing is to get him some push rights to the xubuntu-set... :)
[13:33] <smartboyhw> Just got the e-mail:)
[13:34] <GridCube> Congrats bluesabre :D
[13:37] <knome> bluesabre, i'm suggesting you'll apply for a ubuntu membership :)
[13:37] <knome> err, suggesting you to
[13:37] <smartboyhw> bluesabre: Yay, give me your wiki and I'm write a testimonial for you:)
[13:37] <knome> bluesabre, that should be a trivial task now...
[13:38] <bluesabre> knome: How do I apply for ubuntu membership?
[13:38] <knome> bluesabre, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership
[13:38] <bluesabre> Cool
[13:38] <bluesabre> I'll do that now :)
[13:38] <knome> bluesabre, basically, you write a wiki page of what you've done, ask for a few testimonials and go to a membership board meeting
[13:39] <knome> bluesabre, if they approve you, you get a ubuntu member IRC cloak as well as a<EMAIL_ADDRESS>email address
[13:39] <smartboyhw> bluesabre: You do have a wiki page?
[13:39] <bluesabre> Doesn't sound too painful.
[13:39] <knome> bluesabre, and, well, +1 for applying for sponsorship for UDS and all that stuff... :)
[13:39] <bluesabre> I don't have a wiki page yet.
[13:39] <smartboyhw> bluesabre: I'm not a member, and I do have one:)
[13:39] <bluesabre> Or if I do, I didn't make it :)
[13:40] <knome> bluesabre, lol :)
[13:43] <GridCube> i dont have an ubuntu membership :(
[13:43] <knome> GridCube, go get one tiger.
[13:43] <knome> :)
[13:43] <smartboyhw> GridCube: Get one:)
[13:43] <smartboyhw> I'll wait till Dec to get one, I'm new:)
[13:45] <GridCube> :P but i havent done much to ubuntu besides bother people on -devel channels
[13:45] <knome> GridCube, giving user support counts too
[13:45] <GridCube> :D that i do do
[13:46] <smartboyhw> GridCube: :D
[13:46] <knome> GridCube, and testing.
[13:46] <knome> GridCube, and bug triage-related stuff
[13:46] <knome> GridCube, and creating a FAQ
[13:47] <smartboyhw> GridCube, and documentation
[13:47] <GridCube> :P
[13:47] <GridCube> no, i didnt do documentation
[13:47] <smartboyhw> GridCube: That's enough to gain you a membership:)
[13:47] <GridCube> :D awesome
[13:47] <smartboyhw> :D
[13:47] <knome> GridCube, you can now, we're rewriting ;)
[13:47] <GridCube> i already have a wiki page tho :P
[13:47] <smartboyhw> knome: Can I have your wiki page?
[13:48] <knome> "have my wiki page" ?:P
[13:48] <knome> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PasiLallinaho/
[13:48] <knome> and my page for running for the XPL https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PasiLallinaho/XPL
[13:49] <smartboyhw> What's XPL?
[13:49] <knome> xubuntu project lead
[13:49] <smartboyhw> Ah.
[13:50] <smartboyhw> Ow man, when will Ubuntu 11.10 finish install/
[13:52] <smartboyhw> knome: How long did astraljava did testing and QA for Xubuntu? Just want to know:)
[13:56] <knome> smartboyhw, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel/2012-June/008242.html and https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel/2012-June/008247.html officially, but he was active before that, and that's why he was made the QA lead
[13:57] <smartboyhw> Wow.
[13:57] <knome> wow what
[13:57] <smartboyhw> knome: Wow on astraljava and your work:)
[13:58] <knome> thanks
[14:04] <bluesabre> Here's my wiki page now.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeanDavis
[14:05] <smartboyhw> That's quick:)
[14:05] <knome> i'll take the first lock.
[14:06] <smartboyhw> knome: You mean look?
[14:06] <knome> no, lock.
[14:06] <knome> i'm editing the page, and you can't. that's a lock.
[14:06] <smartboyhw> Oh
[14:06] <smartboyhw> BTW, added a testimonial already:)
[14:07] <bluesabre> Thanks smartboyhw
[14:14] <knome> smartboyhw, did you know that testimonials for these kind of things are usually given by senior community members to the junior members, or those applying to be one?
[14:14] <smartboyhw> :)
[14:15] <smartboyhw> Kidding: Someone write ME a testimonial:)
[14:15] <knome> smartboyhw, continue contributing to testing as you've done now, and i will some day.
[14:15] <smartboyhw> Thanks
[14:32] <elfy> anyone know what the state of the docs is at the moment - don't want to start duplicating effort
[14:32] <knome> state? :)
[14:32] <smartboyhw> Status.
[14:32] <knome> smartboyhw, i know
[14:32] <knome> elfy, in what sense?
[14:33] <knome> elfy, i believe people working with it are constantly sending their updates to the wiki, so it should be as it looks like :)
[14:33] <elfy> knome: :) in the - which one's are in need of work - has there been any sort of record kept about what's been done
[14:33] <knome> the wiki serves us that
[14:33] <elfy> ok - so it's still - look and fix as you see things
[14:33] <knome> yes, it will be that until we convert to docbook
[14:33] <elfy> okey doke
[14:34] <knome> and we will let you know once we do
[14:34] <knome> (not planned yet)
[14:34] <elfy> I don't want to start doing things someone else is half way through basically
[14:34] <knome> if you know about the internet stuff (how to connect/troubleshoot different ways), that would be good to get in shape
[14:35] <knome> eg. the "Internet and Networks" section under "Quick guide to default applications"
[14:35] <knome> (which is a bit weird place, but we can fix that later)
[14:35] <elfy> yea - I am not good at that stuff - I've never really had a need - but I will look at existing and see what I can do then
[14:35] <knome> ah, in that case probably look at something else
[14:35] <knome> this needs to be correct, since this documentation might be everything somebody has, because he can't connect to internet
[14:36] <knome> even i am not confident enough to go poking, yet
[14:36] <elfy> ok - 2 minutes and I will have a look at the new wiki stuff and come back
[14:36] <knome> sure
[14:39] <elfy> knome - I'll take section 8, check section 11 and make a start on section 12
[14:40] <knome> elfy, awesome
[14:40] <elfy> now - suspending/hibernating for instance - hibernate is disabled - so do we assume that the manual should ONLY deal with default setup
[14:40] <knome> elfy, if you want, you can add a short notification at the start of those pages
[14:40] <elfy> yea - that makes sense
[14:41] <knome> elfy, yeah. and i just looked at that page too; i don't know if it makes sense to basically say "if you have problems, file a bug or restart the computer"
[14:41] <elfy> lol
[14:42] <knome> so consider dropping that.. :P
[14:42] <elfy> :)
[14:43] <elfy> ok - so I have my little list of jobs then ... I assume that waht you are aiming at is not so much information someone would just think - what? I'm new - what does that mean? and enough to get them working and able to dig further elsewhere if they want
[14:43] <knome> yes
[14:43] <elfy> excellent
[14:43] <knome> we should link to applications' own docs as much as possible
[14:44] <knome> no reason to duplicate information and make our maintaining burden bigger
[14:44] <elfy> yep
[14:45] <knome> i'm hoping it is realistically possible to update the docs every release after this rewrite
[14:46] <elfy> yea - I would suggest that if that is the plan - then a doc somewhere with the index - so people can put name against things
[14:46] <knome> well
[14:46] <knome> updating the docs every release after the rewrite should be such an easy thing that one person is able to do that
[14:46] <elfy> knome: if this set of docs is well written then 6 month release should be a piece of cake
[14:47] <elfy> yea - just got there :)
[14:47] <knome> exactly
[14:47] <knome> being relatively short helps too
[14:47] <elfy> yep
[14:47] <knome> doesn't look too big task either
[14:47] <smartboyhw> unless you got a big change:)
[14:48] <knome> smartboyhw, yes, but even then there isn't much to rewrite.
[14:48] <elfy> yea - big pile makes it easier to think - tomorrow perhaps, don't have the time now
[14:48] <elfy> talking of which - at some point one of the xubuntu.org pages could do with a little fiddle - who's best person to talk to about that?
[14:49] <knome> smartboyhw, think about rewriting one page of the changed feature versus rewriting 10 pages of the changed feature
[14:49] <knome> elfy, tell me which page
[14:49] <knome> elfy, i am, or pleia2
[14:49] <elfy> http://xubuntu.org/help/
[14:49] <smartboyhw> knome: :)
[14:49] <knome> elfy, yeah, do you mean just to include the offline docs, or something else too?
[14:50] <elfy> online forums etc the forum bit knome - at the moment says "mention in your post that you are using Xubuntu." can be amended
[14:50] <elfy> tell them to use the Tag system - there are xfce and Xubuntu tags available
[14:51] <knome> elfy, would you be willing to do the rewrite part? if yes, just send me email with the new text and i'll update
[14:51] <elfy> ok - I will do that and e-maill you it
[14:52] <elfy> right - I shall get on with something now then
[14:52] <knome> e thanks :)
[14:52] <knome> +lfy,
[14:52] <elfy> welcome k
[14:52] <elfy> nome
[14:52] <knome> ;)
[14:52] <elfy> :)
[14:53] <knome> meh, i promised my wife to get out of the house today
[14:53] <elfy> best get a move on then lol
[14:53] <knome> haha
[14:54] <knome> soon...
[14:54] <knome> she's at work, so no schedule :P just promised to go out... ;)
[14:54] <elfy> :) I have just delivered little one to her mum - have whole weekend of peace
[14:54] <knome> could take the garbage out and go for a walk
[14:54] <knome> congrats
[14:55]  * knome slept almost until 15
[14:55] <knome> have been awake for about three hours now :P
[14:55] <elfy> blimey - I've had a mad couple of days tbh - not sure where I was at all
[14:55] <knome> haha
[15:13] <smartboyhw> knome: Is astraljava on holiday these days?
[15:14] <knome> smartboyhw, no, i'm sure he's working like a mad
[15:14] <smartboyhw> knome: OK, wanted to ask him about a upgrade testcase in 12.10 for Ubuntu Studio:)
[15:14] <knome> good luck in getting a hold of him
[15:14] <smartboyhw> knome: Am I wrong, or are you a Testcase Admin?
[15:14] <knome> i am
[15:15] <smartboyhw> I am just two days ago:)
[15:19] <knome> bluesabre, you probably want to mention menulibre and any postponed projects for Q too in your wiki page
[15:21] <sj> Hi, I just joined the xubuntu-devel mailing list and had a quick look through the launchpad bug list, I was wondering if there's a wiki page to get started fixing bugs
[15:22] <sj> Or if anyone would like to mentor me
[15:22] <smartboyhw> You mean http://xubuntu.org/contribute/development/?
[15:22] <knome> sj, you might want to hang around at this channel for a while to get a grasp how the community works :)
[15:23] <knome> sj, there's no specific list of bugs the xubuntu team works on, but any package with xubuntu or xfce in their name are a good start
[15:23] <sj> knome yeah certainly. smartboyhw, I've read all the related pages from there.
[15:23] <sj> knome: ok, thanks
[15:23] <smartboyhw> knome: Been looking at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Leaders I thought of one thing: Isn't elfy the doc lead?
[15:24] <knome> smartboyhw, nope, the page is current
[15:24] <smartboyhw> But there's no doc lead there...
[15:24] <knome> smartboyhw, that's true
[15:25] <smartboyhw> Now I'm confused??
[15:25] <knome> the whole community just takes care of that
[15:26] <bluesabre> knome, Yeah, I'm going to add MenuLibre and the other things :)
[15:26] <smartboyhw> Oh
[15:27] <knome> bluesabre, is the music on the menulibre video yours?
[15:27] <bluesabre> knome, no, it's using YouTube's audio swap with CC-A music I believe
[15:28] <knome> bluesabre, mmhmm :) nice choice though
[15:28] <bluesabre> Usually I find CC-SA music on my own and add it, but I was lazy that day :D
[15:28] <bluesabre> Thanks
[15:41] <elfy> smartboyhw: I am nothing to do with xubuntu - other than hanging about and helping where and when I can
[15:41] <smartboyhw> :)
[15:52] <knome> jjfrv8, read your comments on the strategy document yesterday and most of them are applied as is to strategydoc.knome.fi
[15:52] <knome> jjfrv8, they were really helpful, thanks!
[15:53] <jjfrv8> Great.  Glad I could contribute something.  Thanks.
[15:54] <knome> of course. looking forward to your contributions to the docs if you are still up to it :)
[15:54] <jjfrv8> Yup.  I'm still plugging away as we speak.
[15:55] <knome> great
[15:58] <micahg> mr_pouit: re dailies, yeah, lubuntu had the same issue, seems to me that those dependencies should be >= rather than = or something's fishy there
[16:12] <micahg> \o/ alternates not oversized and desktop images down to 717/733
[16:12] <knome> yay
[16:12] <knome> but they are wondering if it's a bug :P
[18:41] <Unit193> knome: Sure I could, anything other than the plain Xfce tag?  But alrighty.  When is that needed in at the latest?
[18:55] <knome> UIF
[19:11] <knome> wait, ubuntu is going to drop alternative?
[19:12] <holstein> interesting...
[19:12] <knome> or alternate
[19:12] <knome> :P
[19:12] <knome> yeah.
[19:17] <Unit193> What? Well that's not good.
[19:22] <holstein> seems like there would be community support for one.. maybe just one minimal "netinstall" kind of alternate iso
[19:24] <knome> well there is the minimal cd already!
[19:24] <knome> !minimal
[19:48]  * pleia2 frowns at the wiki
[19:48] <pleia2> no worky
[19:48] <knome> meh
[19:48] <knome> how's the about page?
[19:49] <pleia2> http://princessleia.com/temp/about-xubuntu.txt
[19:50] <pleia2> that's what I would have put in the wiki ;)
[19:50] <pleia2> it merges the three, I think I got all the main points
[19:50] <knome> why wiki?
[19:50] <knome> why not the website
[19:50] <knome> and remove the wikipage
[19:50] <knome> wasn't that our idea anyway
[19:50] <knome> silly girl
[19:50] <pleia2> I am putting it on the wiki for review and edits
[19:50] <pleia2> eventually the canonical one will be xubuntu.org/about
[19:50] <pleia2> still drafting though :)
[19:51] <knome> oh, the *canonical* one
[19:51]  * knome giggles
[19:51] <pleia2> littlt c
[19:51] <pleia2> little too
[19:51] <knome> i didn't know they were writing their own version too
[19:51] <knome> yeah yeah
[19:51] <knome> :P
[19:53] <knome> i'm a bit against listing the application "categories"
[19:53] <pleia2> where?
[19:53] <knome> "...desktop offering that includes a variety of useful applications for every day use."
[19:53] <knome> last paragraph, second sentence
[19:53] <pleia2> ah
[19:54] <pleia2> ok, can refresh
[19:54] <knome> another one i'm thinking is if we want to mention Unity
[19:54] <pleia2> also need to sort out pronouns, I think sometimes it's written as if we-the-project-members are writing it, and sometimes it's a bit more removed
[19:55] <pleia2> "Xubuntu is" "We provide"
[19:55] <pleia2> I'm leaning toward "Xubuntu is" "Xubuntu provides"
[19:55] <knome> "...operating system. Xubuntu uses the Xfce DE and comes with a defaul set of..."
[19:55] <knome> -typos
[19:56] <knome> meh
[19:56] <knome> http://www.typewith.me/p/x_about
[19:56] <pleia2> :)
[19:57] <knome> marking links with _link text_ for better readability
[19:57] <pleia2> k
[19:58] <knome> are we repeating ourselves?
[19:58] <pleia2> in the last paragraph?
[19:58] <knome> see the blue dots
[19:59] <pleia2> there
[19:59] <knome> yeah bot
[19:59] <knome> but
[19:59] <pleia2> oh that
[19:59] <knome> read the first <p>
[19:59] <pleia2> yeah
[20:04] <knome> familiar/conservative?
[20:04] <pleia2> familiar is too vague (familar to what?)
[20:05] <knome> heh
[20:05] <knome> conservative isn't without problems either
[20:05] <pleia2> yeah
[20:06] <pleia2> I think what we're trying to communicate easy, not hard to learn
[20:06] <knome> eh, tautology
[20:06] <knome> "immediately ready to use"
[20:07] <knome> wait, what?
[20:07] <knome> :D
[20:07] <pleia2> ready to use
[20:07] <pleia2> that's good
[20:07] <knome> that's meh
[20:07] <knome> :D
[20:07] <knome> we use that in the sentence before
[20:07] <pleia2> wait, we say ready to use just before that
[20:07] <knome> yeah
[20:07] <knome> we said "immediately ready to use"
[20:07] <knome> :P
[20:07] <pleia2> there
[20:08] <knome> i'd say elegant, but
[20:08] <knome> ;)
[20:08] <pleia2> hehe
[20:08] <knome> what about simple/straightforward?
[20:08] <pleia2> oh right, what do we say in strat doc
[20:08] <pleia2> yeah, straightforward
[20:08] <knome> we need to change that too
[20:08] <Sysi> put intuitive somewhere so we can start telling people how we're not copying os x because of unity
[20:08] <knome> :P
[20:09] <knome> i'm not sure if that belongs to the about page :P
[20:09] <pleia2> i hate inuitive
[20:09] <pleia2> if you read the unity list, you quickly learn that it means nothing :)
[20:10] <pleia2> (also, don't read the unity list if you have better things to do, like watching tv)
[20:11] <GridCube> or picking your nose
[20:11] <knome> pleia2, ha! it just struck me
[20:11] <knome> pleia2, read the mission statement and the target page at strategy document
[20:12] <knome> whenever you hit "elegant", think "straightforward"
[20:12] <pleia2> straightforward and ease of use are very similar
[20:12] <knome> yes
[20:13] <knome> but by straightforward, i mean: keeps out of the way
[20:13] <pleia2> I think by elegant we were meaning we think it's pretty
[20:13] <pleia2> or similarly nice
[20:13] <knome> that too, partly
[20:13] <knome> but polished is there too
[20:13] <pleia2> yeah
[20:13] <knome> i'll fix that
[20:13] <pleia2> like, we're saying it's easy and not yucky to look at
[20:14] <pleia2> (not 2nd choice for refugees :))
[20:14] <knome> " This is why Xubuntu should be easy to use and have an elegant appearance that doesn't get in the way. "
[20:14] <knome> in that, just remove 'elegant'
[20:14] <knome> works?
[20:15] <pleia2> I dunno, I'm in the "I like elegant" camp :)
[20:15] <pleia2> I think it communicates what I want it to say
[20:15] <knome> that's under " Focus 1: Usability "
[20:15] <knome> maybe we can remove it there
[20:15] <pleia2> fair enough
[20:15] <knome> i like elegance too
[20:16] <knome> the several nuances its telling are the reason why i picked it
[20:16] <pleia2> yeah
[20:18] <knome> http://strategydoc.knome.fi/target/
[20:19] <pleia2> good
[20:19] <knome> " It is important for us to provide a polished and unified product that is ready for our users. "
[20:19] <knome> does that sentence suck a bit?
[20:19] <pleia2> nah
[20:19] <knome> ok.
[20:20] <knome> ...ready for end-users ?
[20:20] <knome> dunno.
[20:20] <knome> we say so in the mission statement
[20:20] <knome> Xubuntu delivers a polished and unified product ready for end-users.
[20:20] <knome> ^MS
[20:20] <pleia2> sure
[20:21] <knome> with these changes, i'm ready to go public.
[20:21] <pleia2> \o/
[20:38] <mr_pouit> Unit193: xfce4-settings-manager 4.10 has categories
[20:39] <mr_pouit> Personal/Hw/System, like you wrote on the wiki page
[20:40] <mr_pouit> Unit193: just add the .desktop filename for each item, that's good enough for me :P
[20:42] <mr_pouit> knome: anyway, that's related to the topic "do we want to drop the submenu and put everything in xfce4-settings-manager?" :)
[20:42] <knome> :)
[20:43] <Unit193> mr_pouit: I'll remove the compiz one and add all the ones I have in info, sound cool?  (I don't have compiz, or a couple others as they were ideas, but I may find them)
[20:44] <knome> mr_pouit, the new SD is public ;)
[20:44] <mr_pouit> yep, thanks (I only need the filename to add it to the settings manager, e.g. users.desktop :>)
[20:44] <mr_pouit> knome: SD, as in Steve Dodier? :P
[20:44]  * mr_pouit runs
[20:44] <knome> haha
[20:45] <knome> i wish i could make new steves
[20:45] <knome> ;)


[15:02] <sil2100> o/
[15:02] <robru> \o
[15:02] <chiluk> o/
[15:03] <cyphermox> \o
[15:03]  * slangasek waves
[15:04] <slangasek> #startmeeting
[15:04] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Jul 23 15:04:23 2015 UTC.  The chair is slangasek. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[15:04] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[15:04] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Lightning round
[15:04] <slangasek> $ echo $(shuf -e barry doko bdmurray slangasek caribou infinity sil2100 robru cyphermox pitti)
[15:05] <slangasek> doko pitti robru sil2100 slangasek caribou barry bdmurray infinity cyphermox
[15:05] <slangasek> and go :)
[15:05] <bdmurray> pitti is on vacation right?
[15:05] <slangasek> yes
[15:06] <slangasek> doko: here?
[15:06] <doko> hi
[15:07] <doko> - GCC 5.2 release, 5.2 updates
[15:07] <doko> - ongoing landing-016 fun
[15:07] <doko> - packaged libdfp 1.0.11
[15:07] <doko> - update gdb to 7.9.1, started gdb-7.10
[15:07] <doko> - still looking at apt building with -O3
[15:07] <doko> (done)
[15:07] <robru> Not much to report, been working closely with IS and struggling through various iterations and setbacks of mojo spec and train deployments. (Done)
[15:07] <sil2100> o/
[15:07] <sil2100> - Landing team work, silo coordination, preparing landing e-mails
[15:07] <sil2100> - Investigated the recent i386 touch rootfs build failure
[15:07] <sil2100> - Investigated the meizu.en-proposed channel not picking up new custom builds
[15:07] <sil2100> - Prepare OTA-5 release notes
[15:07] <sil2100> - Re-spinning the OTA-5 arale image based on the snapshot PPA + new custom tarball
[15:07] <sil2100> - Releasing OTA-5 for all channels
[15:07] <sil2100> - Discussions regarding some touch packages and gcc-5 buildability
[15:07] <sil2100> - Started work on a helper script to perform merges of hand-built branches
[15:07] <sil2100> - Helping with packaging issues in some upstream projects
[15:07] <sil2100> - Appmenu-qt5:
[15:07] <sil2100>   * More digging into bug with missing menus after hide+show
[15:07] <sil2100>   * Prepare landing of existing changes
[15:07] <sil2100> - Rebased PPA rebuild branch for CI Train, waiting for staging to test on
[15:08] <sil2100> - Sick day on Tuesday
[15:08] <bdmurray> doko: do know much about what's new in gdb?
[15:08] <sil2100> - Looking into LP translations
[15:08] <sil2100> (done)
[15:09] <slangasek> working through batch uploads for the python3.5 and gcc5 transitions
[15:09] <slangasek> (done)
[15:09] <doko> bdmurray, http://paste.ubuntu.com/11925600/
[15:09] <caribou> Bugfix:
[15:09] <caribou>  - makedumpfile kernel support on trusty
[15:09] <caribou> Charm dev
[15:09] <caribou> - Applied latest review suggestions
[15:09] <bdmurray> doko: thanks
[15:09] <caribou> Merges - Completed rsyslog merge - waiting for sponsor
[15:09] <caribou> Sosreport upstream
[15:09] <caribou> - bugfix
[15:10] <caribou> ☑
[15:10] <bdmurray> added a tag in the apport retracer hack branch so staging can be updated
[15:10] <bdmurray> tested staging rollout of new version of apport
[15:10] <bdmurray> fixed crash in retracer-hack branch of apport due to keyword change of md5 vs hash in python-apt
[15:10] <bdmurray> submitted RT regarding updating production version of apport
[15:10] <bdmurray> pinged webops about oops.canonical.com being slow as heck
[15:10] <bdmurray> investigation into left over core files in swift
[15:10] <bdmurray> fixed apt-clone merge proposal regarding foreign packages
[15:10] <bdmurray> worked on displaying the owning team from the package to team mapping in m-o-m
[15:10] <bdmurray> updated code on merges.ubuntu.com to display the owning team
[15:10] <bdmurray> review of merges report to find unsubscribed packages, subscribing teams
[15:10] <bdmurray> testing of apport-noui systemd / upstart changes
[15:10] <bdmurray> reported systemd bug LP: #1476849
[15:10] <bdmurray> investigation into apport adt test failures
[15:10] <sil2100> robru: is wendigo back up?
[15:11] <bdmurray> ✔ done
[15:11] <slangasek> infinity:
[15:11] <infinity> - Kernel SRU work
[15:11] <infinity> - Work with Andy on getting FAN stuff in for 14.04.3
[15:11] <infinity> - General SRU/AA work
[15:11] <infinity> - Work on a bunch of IBM/POWER bugs for 14.04.3
[15:11] <infinity> - Fix live-build bugs leading to debsums failures
[15:11] <infinity> - Sort out arm64 grub2-signed issues
[15:11] <infinity> - Begin investigating 14.04.3 build failures for {l,k}ubuntu
[15:11] <infinity> (done)
[15:11] <sil2100> hm, doesn't look like it...
[15:12] <cyphermox>  * started some work on converting NM bzr branches to git & syncing with Debian
[15:12] <cyphermox>  * some investigation / question answering on preseeding oem-config
[15:12] <cyphermox>  * reviewed & merged some NetworkManager code branches from Tony Espy.
[15:12] <cyphermox>  * reviewed/sponsored new ubuntu-mate-welcome package
[15:12] <cyphermox>  * I am in multipath-tools patch hell: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JtEkUmYecnk
[15:12] <cyphermox> (done)
[15:14] <slangasek> bdmurray: bug #1476849 - that's the expected behavior, that there would be an instance of watershed for each of the files... that's what happens on the upstart side too
[15:14] <slangasek> bdmurray: watershed just ensures that the whoopsie-upload-all processes are serialized
[15:14] <slangasek> so maybe this is working "as designed"?
[15:15] <bdmurray> slangasek: ah, okay
[15:15] <slangasek> bdmurray: however systemd *might* have a better way to express this such that we could manage to get only one instance running at boot; I just don't know what that way is
[15:16] <slangasek> ok, anything else to discuss re: status?
[15:17] <slangasek> or are we all busy watching the youtube video cyphermox posted? :)
[15:17] <sil2100> ;)
[15:17] <cyphermox> I'm already back on the patches tbh :)
[15:18] <cyphermox> nothing to discuss, except I'll be happy for any and all distraction from anything multipath once I'm done.
[15:18] <slangasek> heh
[15:18] <slangasek> [TOPIC] AOB
[15:18] <caribou> cyphermox: care to merge ifenslave in Wily, I'm waiting for a fix I submitted upstream ;-)
[15:19] <cyphermox> caribou: ok
[15:20] <slangasek> ok
[15:20] <slangasek> anything else?
[15:21] <caribou> cyphermox: FYI - Bug #1326854
[15:21] <cyphermox> caribou: thanks. hopefully it shouldn't be much longer, things nearly compile.
[15:22] <caribou> cyphermox: wave at me if I can help. I was tempted to do it myself
[15:22] <slangasek> #endmeeting
[15:22] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Jul 23 15:22:25 2015 UTC.
[15:22] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2015/ubuntu-meeting.2015-07-23-15.04.moin.txt
[15:22] <slangasek> righty-o, thanks all
[15:22] <caribou> slangasek: thanks!
[15:22] <cyphermox> caribou: do you have upload rights? I could also just review your work and sponsor
[15:22] <cyphermox> slangasek: thanks!
[15:22] <sil2100> Thanks!
[15:23] <caribou> cyphermox: no I don't & there's a lot of upstart specifics that I'm not sure I know about
[15:23] <caribou> cyphermox: let me give it another look
[15:23] <cyphermox> caribou: ok, well I'm thinking one or two more hours on this and I should be done


[00:22] <pmatulis_> how do i disable gnome keyring daemon for SSH?  the Desktop Session Settings applet has it disabled.  still, it is running
[00:22] <pmatulis_> i prefer to use the OpenSSH SSH agent
[00:44] <phillw> pmatulis_: that would be better asked on the mailing list.
[00:44] <pmatulis_> phillw: how so?
[00:46] <phillw> pmatulis_: well, from your intiall thoughts it may be a bug... using the mailing list is the next step up.... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing#Reporting_Bugs
[00:47] <pmatulis_> phillw: ok ok
[00:50] <phillw> pmatulis_: the truth is there, i only try to make it an easier way to discuss things. We do need a bug report for any changes to how things owrk can be applied.
[00:50] <phillw> *work*
[01:11] <pmatulis_> phillw: caught in the list's moderator web.  i used the wrong email address
[03:22] <billytwowilly> how goes the start menu with search?
[03:23] <holstein> billytwowilly: ?
[09:23] <redtape-renegade> morning
[11:40] <akhilleus> qualche italiano?
[11:40] <jared> !it | akhilleus
[11:42] <jared> L'dovrebbe essere in grado di assistere con maggior parte delle richieste Lubuntu nonché sistemi sono molto simili.
[12:25] <jirido> Hi. Is it possible to get lxpanel to recognice twinview and not treat it like one monitor?
[12:56] <redtape-renegade> How do I add midori to Lubuntu ?
[13:12] <jared> redtape-renegade: should just be able to install it straight from the repositories, either with the software centre or apt-get
[13:29] <redtape-renegade> jared. I want to change my tray icons etc to something different than the standard version.. how do i do that ?
[13:32] <jared> redtape-renegade: ah that's a bit outside my scope of knowledge. I'd suggest shooting an email to the mailing list and seeing if anyone there knows if no one else is along to help out shortly.
[13:33] <redtape-renegade> jared, thanx, I was getting tired of those icons :)
[13:34] <redtape-renegade> Also, I don't have a "wireless" icon in the syst. try .. where is that ?
[13:36] <jared> Probably something for the same email thread :)
[13:36] <redtape-renegade> k thanx
[14:19] <redtape-renegade> what is the best program for dns cache-ing in Lubuntu software centre ?
[16:14] <thunder1212> is lubuntu faster that ubuntu?
[16:20] <phiscribe> thunder1212, in my opinion, yes
[16:22] <thunder1212> will i be able to use gtk based apps like inkscape, openshot, audacity, gimp?
[16:36] <phiscribe> yes
[16:36] <phiscribe> i have inkscape audacity and gimp installed.  not familiar with openshot
[18:59] <sagar_> hello
[18:59] <sagar_> whats planned for lubuntu 13.04
[19:00] <sagar_> can anyone tell me
[22:05] <cerebrate> how many colors does the cli terminal support?  i mean the one that you have to identify to and also key in a password


 does anybody know how to write a text file in bash without echo?
 suggest use one of the general ubuntu support channels for non-testing questions @GalacticLion7   ... askubuntu.com or ubuntuforums.org


[09:01] <Burgundavia> hey mdke_
[09:24] <mdke_> channel has been quiet lately
[09:30] <pygi> mdke_, well ...
[09:36] <mdke_> pygi: hmm?
[09:36] <pygi> mdke_, just responding to constatation it's quiet :)
[09:37] <Liz> hey..someone removed me off the moderators list
[09:37] <Liz> oops
[09:37] <Liz-bedtime> oh well
[09:37] <Liz-bedtime> nite
[09:37] <mdke_> Liz-bedtime: yeah, sorry - were you still doing it?
[09:38] <mdke_> we had quite a few volunteers
[09:38] <rob> hiya
[09:39] <rob> mdke_:  so is there anything stopping anyone from forking the documentation under just one license?
[09:39] <mdke_> rob: no, I don't think so
[09:40] <rob> so, in that case can't the doc team just choose one license and go with that, without obtaining copyright holder approval?
[09:40] <mdke_> yes, I think you are right.
[09:40] <rob> problem solved then :)
[09:41] <mdke_> I think we have copyright holder approval anyway
[09:41] <mdke_> but yeah, problem solved
[09:41] <rob> cool, well as I said on the list, go for it
[09:42] <rob> was a license actually decided by consensus at a past meeting already?
[09:43] <mdke_> yes
[09:44] <rob> nice
[09:48] <Burgundavia> we are not changing license, merely dropping one
[09:48] <Burgundavia> that requires approval going forward, but not going back
[09:50] <Madpilot> So the Dapper & Edgy stuff will still be dual; the Feisty docs will be only ccbysa?
[09:51] <rob> Burgundavia: why, does everyone else need approval to use our docs if they just want to pick one licence?
[09:51] <Burgundavia> no
[09:52] <rob> so why does the doc team?
[09:52] <Burgundavia> I am saying that if, we, as a team agree to drop the one license, it should be a team decision
[09:52] <joachim-n> you guys dropping gfdl?
[09:52] <rob> oh, ok, yes I agree on that at least :)
[09:52] <Burgundavia> hwoever, we don't need to ask anybody for relicensing
[09:52] <Burgundavia> joachim-n: considering it
[09:52] <joachim-n> heh. so is the gnome docs team :)
[09:53] <Burgundavia> I read that
[09:53] <rob> heh, gnu project dropping a gnu license in favor of a third party one
[09:54] <mdke_> the dual licensing wasn't doing us any good
[09:54] <rob> that has to tell you something at least
[09:54] <mdke_> and now we can use other cc-by-sa material
[09:54] <rob> is the gnome docs team going to use the same CC license?
[09:55] <mdke_> we don't know
[09:55] <joachim-n> the gnome docs team is pondering a new license
[09:55] <joachim-n> not sure why shaun doesn't want a CC license
[09:55] <rob> completely new?
[09:55] <mdke_> you're going to write your own?
[09:55] <mdke_> crazy
[09:56] <joachim-n> I don't entirely know what the plan is :)
[09:56] <Madpilot> NIH syndrome?
[09:57] <joachim-n> I'm going to shut up before I start rumours :(
[09:57] <joachim-n> all I really know is what's here: http://live.gnome.org/ProjectMallard
[09:57] <joachim-n> and a recent heated discussion on our list between Shaun and some lackey from GNU
[09:58] <mdke_> yes, I read that
[09:58] <mdke_> that guy is crazy :)
[06:59] <Liz-bedtime> mdke_: yeah i was, but its all good.
[07:30] <mdke_> Liz: I'll add you back, the more the merry
[07:31] <Burgwork> mdke_: we just got Liz back?
[07:31] <Burgwork> yay!
[07:32] <mdke_> I removed her without realising she was still doing moderation work
[07:32] <Liz>  :D
[07:32] <Liz> its no biggie
[07:32] <Liz> im glad we have alot more volunteers now
[07:32] <Liz> neway..work
[07:32] <mdke_> what's your email address?
[07:33] <Liz_work><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[07:33] <mdke_> thx
[07:33] <Liz_work> no worries
[07:33] <Liz_work> bye now
[09:30] <Ubugtu> New bug: #70958 in ubuntu-docs "missing /usr/share/gnome/help/libs/generic.ent" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/70958
[11:18] <jrib> hi, what's the difference between wiki.ubuntu.com and help.ubuntu.com/community?  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Kernel/Compile has a broken link to KernelGitGuide, because KernelGitGuide is still in the wiki
[11:19] <LaserJock> jrib: help.ubuntu.com/community houses the help documentation
[11:20] <LaserJock> it used to reside on wiki.ubuntu.com along with developer pages, etc.
[11:20] <LaserJock> so it was moved
[11:22] <dsas> nixternal: shouldn't https://wiki.ubuntu.com/bzr be on h.u.c ? The fine line confuses me sometimes...
[11:22] <jrib> LaserJock:  so should KernelGitGuide be considered help and there was a mistake when the transfer to help.ubuntu was done or 0should I just relink to the wiki?
[11:22] <nixternal> dsas: if you think it is clean and ready go for it..i just did it a couple days of go and was using that as a staging page until it was good
[11:23] <dsas> nixternal: Ok, was just wondering when browsing RecentChanges a while ago and made a mental note to ask...
[11:23] <mdke_> jrib: KernelGitGuide might be considered development information, rather than documentation for users, I would suppose. I havne't looked at the page though. If you think that's right, you can just fix the link
[11:23] <nixternal> i will put that on my to do list, as i would like some extra input tweaks and what not
[11:24] <LaserJock> it does look more like developer documentation
[11:24] <LaserJock> I'd fix the link
[11:24] <nixternal> it will be fixed and deleted as soon as it is done ;)
[11:24] <jrib> LaserJock: well it's both imo, since the kernel guide recommends that method.  But I'll fix the link
[11:25] <nixternal> oh
[11:25] <nixternal> i thought you were talking about my garbage page ;)
[11:25] <dsas> nixternal: you and your garbage are your business :p
[11:26] <LaserJock> jrib: sure, but I think it makes more sense to shuffle people to the development wiki for that page then to shuffle the developers to the help wiki :-)
[11:26] <nixternal> hehe
[11:26] <nixternal> gee thanks dsas
[11:26] <jrib> LaserJock: haha, yes I will agree with taht one
[11:26] <nixternal> g'nite master obi want kin'mdke'obi
[11:26] <nixternal> s/want/wan


[04:53] <cyborg> Hello
[04:54] <JohnTheBike> Hello
[04:55] <JohnTheBike> If anyone could help me with a behavior I would like to get sorted.....
[04:56] <JohnTheBike> Can someone advise me how I can stop 18.04 from scanning my drive after every boot for updates?
[04:58] <diogenes_> JohnTheBike, there's no such thing as scaning drive for updates
[04:59] <JohnTheBike> Please, I'm searching for a resolution to this if you don't mind.
[05:25] <valorie> JohnTheBike: what makes you think that your drive is being scanned?
[05:27]  * valorie has never seen behavior like that
[05:29] <valorie> people do sometimes complain about baloo, which scans for new files to index
[05:29] <valorie> if you want search to work well, leave it alone
[05:29] <valorie> otherwise, tell it to stop
[05:39] <JohnTheBike> Indexing has absolutely nothing to do with my enquiry.
[05:39] <JohnTheBike> Search has absolutely nothing to do with my enquiry.
[05:40] <valorie> ok
[05:40] <valorie> updates are presented
[05:40] <valorie> there is no scanning
[05:41] <valorie> I ask again what makes you believe that your drive is being scanned?
[05:43] <JohnTheBike> Please stop trolling me. Thank you.
[05:44] <JohnTheBike> I'm looking for a resolution to this issue for anyone who is knowledgeable it would be appreciated.
[05:56] <diogenes_> valorie, it's all useless, better have a cup of tea )
[05:57] <valorie> lol
[05:58] <valorie> 11 pm - too late for caffeine!
[05:59] <diogenes_> :) then apple juice
[06:06] <valorie> water, at least
[09:11] <alekksander> hi. i'd like to remove snapd (snap support). it wants to take squashfs-tools with it. is it safe to proceed?
[09:54] <BluesKaj> Howdy folks
[10:00] <bones> It's safe, squashfs is used to compress things into read only images
[10:01] <bones> Or read them, that includes remxiing livecds
[10:15] <IrcsomeBot2> Luis Jorge was added by: Luis Jorge
[20:30] <IrcsomeBot2> <Oph nono> (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/QqaZjU4O/file_14204.webp
[23:18] <olivier_ubuntu> salut
[23:18] <olivier_ubuntu> ubuntu est génial
[23:19] <olivier_ubuntu> je suis en formation technicien supérieur systèmes et réseaux
[23:19] <olivier_ubuntu> je débute
[23:20] <olivier_ubuntu> vos connaissances envers un débutant sont les bienvenues
[23:20] <olivier_ubuntu> bonne nuit