[00:56] <darkmatter> hmmmmmm
[00:58] <darkmatter> evilvish: left/right screen edge scroll arrows or a floating "swipe bar" for a window switcher. which do think would be more bettah?
[00:58]  * darkmatter is working on some window management plugins/ideas
[00:58] <mvit> :o
[00:58] <mvit> well, im kinda new here then
[00:59] <mvit> I basically had an idea on how to merge the old look of ubuntu with the newest
[01:00] <mvit> lemme just find the mockup..
[01:00] <mvit> http://cl.ly/36030P1g2g2q2i102l3V
[01:01] <mvit> is the style unchangable now or will it allow exceptions?
[01:03] <darkmatter> mvit: I assume you mean unity? at the moment it's not themable (well... the launcher icons can change with the theme, but the panelicons/ and unity theme are hardcoded atm.  dunno the plans on ctual theme support (tolazy to check statuses :P)
[01:03] <mvit> I meant ubuntu
[01:03] <mvit> I just added unity to see how it would look with that style
[01:03] <mvit> http://cl.ly/3a1d0v2Q0m063p2k352W < this should be the separate window
[01:04] <mvit> I really liked the old color pallete
[01:11] <darkmatter> mvit: I found the old palette a bit on the rich side myself (and heavily over-saturated). but personal opinions being what they are
[01:12] <mvit> At least it has some color, the grey in the newest ubuntu makes it seem kinda boring in my opinion
[09:55] <kwwii> guten morgen
[10:39] <thorwil> good morning
[11:59] <thorwil> ivanka: i thought photos and drawings for the showcase were meant to be non-wallpapers this time?
[12:00] <thorwil> evilvish: one week until the ubuntu-art logo has to be discussed. what will you do?
[12:27] <ivanka> thorwil: good point - I will update myself
[12:34] <thorwil> iainfarrell, ivanka: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuFreeCultureShowcase needs a minus-wallpaper edit, then
[12:35] <iainfarrell> thorwil: yep indeed
[12:35] <iainfarrell> I'll get on it shortly
[12:38]  * thorwil hits the list
[13:32] <evilvish> thorwil: i give up.. lets just name the baby boy Elizabeth …
[13:32] <evilvish> and just hope it is a girl..
[13:33] <thorwil> evilvish: heh. we could of course remain silent and hope nobody remembers ... :}
[13:34] <evilvish> thorwil: yea.. i dont plan on bringing up the topic.. but the one who shall not be named might not forget … ;)
[20:07] <coz_> good day all
[20:19] <doctormo> hey coz
[20:21] <thorwil> hola
[20:24] <coz_> hey gusy :)
[20:24] <coz_> guys
[20:24] <doctormo> hey thorwil, for a second I thought your blog post was going to be all religious
[20:24] <coz_> ah oh already I am mis spelling :)
[20:25] <doctormo> coz_: Are you suggesting I'm a gusy? some kind of tart for your textual lingering? :-P
[20:25] <coz_> lol
[20:25] <coz_> doctormo,   I deserve that
[20:25] <coz_> doctormo,   there are days my big fingers just wont respond the way I want :)
[20:25] <thorwil> doctormo: omg, jesus, praise the lord that i would not write something all religious, good heavens!
[20:26] <doctormo> thorwil: That's right, we like a respectful community, where we keep our magic men and imaginary friends in our heads where they belong ;-P
[20:27] <thorwil> doctormo: would you like to talk about your magic men and imaginary friends that you think belong in your head?
[20:29] <thorwil> only minutes after writing that blog post, i stumbled over some ugly issues with thunderbird. so far, it still beats evolution, but it seem every email client sucks in one way or the other
[20:29] <doctormo> thorwil: Deisgn wise, email clients are bunk. Would you like to see my idea of an email client?
[20:30] <doctormo> http://doctormo.deviantart.com/#/d37k1o8
[20:30] <thorwil> doctormo: i'm in favor of the beos approach, with emails directl yin the filesystem
[20:30] <doctormo> TBH, I'm sick of the Inbox thinking, and I'm sick of closed data stores.
[20:31] <thorwil> yeah
[20:31] <doctormo> I like email in my file system, I like email indexed for search and sorting. I don't like email to be all about a single folder where you go to pick up messages, like we had a postbox in the flintstones.
[20:34] <thorwil> as i had such troubles with evolutions editor, i once again had to think about a reason given for mail, news and whatever else clients in emacs: familiar editing environment, shortcuts and all
[20:35] <thorwil> that approach should be turned inside-out: chose an editor as system wide preference that will appear embedded everywhere needed
[20:35] <doctormo> Yes, instead of emacs the os.
[20:36] <darkmatter> yeah. things like mail should be global. so should contacts (shared between mail/chat/what the hell ever (even the browser where suited, like fore facebook or twitter type social stuff))
[20:36] <darkmatter> per application data stores have there place, but also usually present way to much duplication (and repetitive setup)
[20:36] <darkmatter> their*
[20:37] <thorwil> darkmatter: and a backup/restore/migration disaster
[20:37] <darkmatter> ya
[20:37] <thorwil> it's so damn obvious, i wonder why not more people see it
[20:41] <thorwil> considering issues my mother had with email, thunderbird specifically, something would have to be done to make clear how mails get into the inbox and how stuff ends up in Drafts and Sent
[20:42] <thorwil> now if writing a new mail would put you in the *place* where Drafts will be kept, too, that could help
[20:42] <darkmatter> thorwil: I was planning (wherever possible) to just use the filesystem as the backend for the library component I'm going to be working on (just need stable gtk3 damnit). I don't see the need for a music database etc in banshee et al either (or photo libraries for that matter) when the file manager (or whatever you chose to call it) can have a "library view" frontend or similar
[20:43] <darkmatter> plus you can slim down a system dramatically
[20:45] <darkmatter> share the data, just imbed the view in an the app
[20:45] <darkmatter> -an*
[20:45] <darkmatter> it's not _that_ hard to figure out
[20:46] <thorwil> doctormo: differentiating one-on-one(-or-few) correspondence from groups and notifications could be worthwhile
[20:46] <thorwil> doctormo: but where do you see the difference between Groups and Discussions?
[20:47] <doctormo> thorwil: Groups are public (mailing lists, public as in recorded in a third location) and Disucssions are private, as in they only happen between these people.
[20:47] <darkmatter> atm probably 30% of my home directory is duplicate crap because everything is stored in triplicate. lol
[20:48] <thorwil> darkmatter: especially the handling of email attachments is handled so *brilliantly *. ugh. there should be versioning and dependency tracking
[20:49] <doctormo> Or just a folder where they get saved
[20:49] <darkmatter> hehe
[20:50] <darkmatter> oh nice. real name memenu works in lucid too (not that it matters, since I'm switching to maverick tonight)
[20:51] <darkmatter> </off topic>
[21:05] <thorwil> http://createdigitalmusic.com/2011/01/score-an-operating-system-music-sound-and-ubuntu-free-culture-showcase-on-soundcloud/
[21:07] <darkmatter> thorwil: lol@ the pic. I don't even wanna go there....
[21:07] <coz_> thorwil,  another sound submission ?
[21:07] <thorwil> coz_: why another?
[21:08] <thorwil> coz_: the blog author is one of the jurors for the free culture showcase
[21:08] <coz_> thorwil,  here was a "contest of sorts"  last year that ended in October for new sounds  for Natty
[21:08] <thorwil> coz_: this is about music, not desktop sounds
[21:09] <coz_> thorwil,   ah ,, I better pay more attention
[21:09] <thorwil> coz_: nah, that would reduce opportunities of entertainment :)
[21:10] <coz_> lol
[21:10] <darkmatter> Immersion is nice. an abbreviated version would be great for startup :D
[21:10] <coz_> I deserve  that
[21:10] <coz_> so this is for music  on the system  ..how?
[21:10] <coz_> when?
[21:11] <thorwil> coz_: content for the Examples folder. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuFreeCultureShowcase
[21:11] <coz_> huh!  ok  I can get into this
[21:12] <darkmatter> http://soundcloud.com/anthony-distefano/immersion   <-- edit and use for login (or a startup sound just before gdm)
[21:13] <thorwil> good night! :)
[21:16] <coz_> mm I am still confused,, I dont understand the purpose of this
[21:17] <darkmatter> coz_: to showcase the talent lurking in free culture basically
[21:17] <coz_> darkmatter,  but some of these dont seem to be original works
[21:18] <darkmatter> coz_: lol. yeah. like I said *talent* :P
[21:18] <coz_> :)
[21:18] <coz_> darkmatter,  well I was kind of hoping to hear some cool compositions
[21:19] <coz_> LOL    "MOOOOOO"    http://soundcloud.com/groups/ubuntu-free-culture-showcase/tracks?page=4
[21:20] <darkmatter> coz_: but off topic. I figured out task management for my cuddy lil brainchild!
[21:20] <coz_> cool
[21:21] <darkmatter> not "ideal" (I'm not anb idealist damnit!) but will work nicely within the ui constraints
[21:24] <darkmatter> coz_: basically a glorified window switcher (keyboard and/or mouse driven )or touch ftm)). currently selected window centered/larger than the others (with dropshadows) others smaller, going off the screen (with a mask to make them fade near the scroll markers). app icon centered at bottom edge of window. in "always group" displays an "^" on the icon. activating the icon instead of the window in group mode will show a "popup" of open w
[21:24] <darkmatter> want it to work in 2d as well
[21:25] <coz_> darkmatter,  ooo sounds interesting... how far from testing?
[21:25] <darkmatter> oh. and a search filter for quickly finding an app/window
[21:25] <darkmatter> coz_: far. just mocked it up on paper last night ;)
[21:25] <coz_> darkmatter,  oh ok :)
[21:26] <darkmatter> but basically a more "natural" (or organic) feeling replacement for switching
[21:26] <coz_> darkmatter,  I like the idea... sounds real interesting
[21:29] <darkmatter> coz_: oddly enough. the inspiration came (partially) from multitasking on smartphones. I just "reconceptualized" it to something more suited to standard computing (while still maintaining portability).
[21:30] <coz_> darkmatter,  I wouldnt mind trying something like this at all. :)
[21:31] <coz_> ok I did not get much sleep last night.... I need to lay down for a few hours.... darkmatter  sorry guy... I cant keep my eyes opened
[21:32] <darkmatter> coz_: I think currently things feel to artifical on the "desktop". I'm also considering a panoramic style of activity (workspace) switching instead of flippy floppy. gracefully move across the landscape. almost like the display is a window out on the world (if you get the meaning)


[02:24] <mneptok> any opers active?
[02:24] <Flannel> not you!
[02:24] <mneptok> quite right. i may be a bit crazy, but not enough to take a position as Freenode staff ;)
[02:34] <Hobbsee> hah
[02:35] <ajmitch> mneptok: 'a bit'?
[02:36] <mneptok> ajmitch: i love you, too. :/
[02:36] <mneptok> :)
[02:36]  * ajmitch feels loved
[03:44] <xgfhsdgfhsd> Gramps and KiteWhamoBall spammed me when I joined #ubuntu
[03:49] <Flannel> xgfhsdgfhsd: alright, we'll look into it.
[03:49] <xgfhsdgfhsd> ok
[03:49] <Pelo> evening folks
[03:49] <Pelo> I joined the network about 2 min ago and I've gotten 2 pms from nicks that instantly disapears
[03:50] <Flannel> Which nicks?
[03:50] <Pelo>  Sheri-Preston Micah29392939239
[03:51] <Pelo> Flannel, dmsuperman says he's getting them to
[03:51] <Flannel> Pelo: yeah, the problem is they
[03:51] <Flannel> theyre not actually in the channel, so its someone else doing the watching.  We'll see what we can do though.
[03:51] <Pelo> they ? are we not blaming "them" anymore ? we're blaming "they" now ?
[03:51]  * Pelo is getting slow in his old age
[03:52] <Flannel> Pelo: You're welcome to leave now.  Don't want to keep you here more than you're comfortable. :)
[03:52] <Pelo> I feel dirty already
[03:53] <Flannel> All four of htose names have a gecos and realname of "m", and the same IP
[03:53] <Hobbsee> who else is on that IP?
[03:53] <Flannel> Last person with a name of m in #ubuntu is alraun(e|1)
[03:53] <Flannel> <IP_ADDRESS>
[03:53] <Flannel> Not in my lastlog
[03:53] <Flannel> but alraune/alraun1 isn't on that same IP
[03:53] <Flannel> and isn't currently in the channel
[03:54] <Flannel> (and had real conversations while here)
[03:56] <Flannel> Ad, more people with same IP
[03:58] <Myrtti> #freenode been told?
[03:58] <Flannel> No
[03:58] <Flannel> Or, not that I know of
[04:26] <Myrtti> I think I might try to get few more hours of zzZZzz's
[07:26]  * nalioth hates disconnections
[07:26]  * Flannel disconnections nalioth.
[07:37] <mneptok> nalioth: murp?
[07:37] <jussi01> mrgh... who invented hangovers... :/
[07:38] <bazhang> * [Herma] (n=m@<IP_ADDRESS>): m  another 'm'
[07:39] <bazhang> think that was a hitchcock movie
[07:39] <Flannel> jussi01: just be glad the patent has expired
[07:39] <mneptok> why not just ban the "m" ident?
[07:39] <Flannel> mneptok: Theyre not in the channel, theres someone in the channel sending nicks to rotating nicks
[07:39] <jussi01> mrgh. shush you
[07:40] <nalioth> they are gone.
[07:40] <nalioth> if they come back, it's because they forgot their k-ticket
[07:40] <bazhang> that sounds final :)
[07:40] <nalioth> no, they left on their own
[07:40] <Flannel> bazhang: Don't talk about the people who have disappeared
[07:40] <mneptok> nalioth: could i get a /canonical/staff/ubuntu/member/mneptok cloak for this nick?
[07:41] <Flannel> mneptok: want a /kitchen-sink/ in there as well?
[07:41] <bazhang> haha
[07:41] <nalioth>  hunky/dory/
[07:41] <mneptok> Flannel: both my role as a staffer and as a community member are important to me
[07:42] <Flannel> mneptok: I'm not trying to diminish the cloak in any way.
[07:42] <bazhang> but would it make the floodbots react?
[07:44] <bazhang> just kidding btw.
[07:44] <mneptok> gunh ... Tokyo is HOT today
[07:45]  * mneptok is meeeeeeelting
[07:45] <bazhang> wow!
[07:45] <bazhang> thats close to here
[07:45] <bazhang> hot here as well :(
[07:46] <mneptok> bazhang: where are you?
[07:46]  * mneptok is actually in Kawasaki0ku, Kanagawa
[07:47] <mneptok> *Kawasaki-ku
[07:47] <bazhang> taipei mneptok
[07:47] <mneptok> bazhang: fancy a swim? we could have dinner. ;)
[07:47] <bazhang> hehe
[07:47] <bazhang> have to work mneptok :(
[07:59] <robotgeek> hmm, had to kickban a troll after a long time!
[07:59] <mneptok> robotgeek: hmm?
[08:00] <robotgeek> posting links to obviously racist things.
[08:00] <mneptok> robotgeek: i got 'im
[08:00] <robotgeek> sporkf , i guess
[08:01] <robotgeek> sporkf<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[08:01] <robotgeek> a bit rusty, have not opped in a long time.
[08:10] <robotgeek> @btlogin
[08:10] <robotgeek> obviously, i am missing some piece of information :)
[08:10] <davidwhitewings> about what?
[08:11] <robotgeek> i was trying to try out the new bantracker commands
[08:14] <robotgeek> well, its time to go to bed. works beckons tomorrow. have a nice day
[09:04] <Flannel> What are
[09:04] <Flannel> hmm
[09:07] <jussi01> Flannel: ?
[09:08] <Flannel> jussi01: walrus.
[09:08] <mneptok> OMG!
[09:08] <mneptok> OMG OMG OMG
[09:08] <mneptok> the HDTV in the hotel room has an SD card slot!
[09:08] <Flannel> mneptok: What about your god?
[09:08]  * mneptok transfer videos
[09:10] <mneptok> hmmm ... the TV remote has a button labelled "BS"
[09:10] <mneptok> i pressed it and got FoxNews
[09:10] <mneptok> *bah dum tish*
[09:10] <jussi01> rofl
[09:12] <Myrtti> !instantrimshot
[09:49] <Mez> having issues Seeker` ?
[09:50] <Seeker`> trying to get irssi sorted to connect to 3 networks properly
[09:50] <Seeker`> managed to do everything but set up a different nick on this network to the others
[09:51] <jpds> Hmm.
[09:53] <mneptok> Seeker`: /network add -nick efnetnickname -user efnetusername -realname efnetrealname EFnet /network add -nick freenodenickname -user freenodeusername -realname freenoderealname Freenode
[09:53] <mneptok> etc etc
[09:53] <jpds> http://osdir.com/ml/network.irc.irssi.user/2006-12/msg00009.html
[09:54] <Seeker`> yeah, just saw that
[09:54] <Seeker`> found the syntax in the config and updated it
[09:54] <Seeker`> hopefulyl this wil be the last restart
[09:54] <Seeker`> w00t
[09:55]  * jpds suggests Seeker` add: /wait 2000 to the end of his autosendcmd
[09:56] <ikonia> mneptok: don't bother arguing it, he's like this with everything
[09:57] <Seeker`> jpds: I dont have it auto-identify - I dont like having stuff store passwords on my laptop
[09:58] <mneptok> Seeker`: you don;t use LVM encryption?!!?
[09:58] <ikonia> mneptok: I try to ignore him and just give a correcting stance to the user in question
[09:58] <Seeker`> mneptok: nope
[09:58] <mneptok> *gasp*
[09:59] <ikonia> or a more "objective" stance I should say
[09:59] <jpds> Encryption FTW:
[10:00] <Seeker`> hmm, ive got 2 channels with the same name on different networks; any way to get the statusbar to reflect which network they belong to?
[10:00] <jpds> Seeker`: So why identify at all?  I should have it snarf "irssi" and respond with "Use Quassel!"
[10:12] <jussi01> :P
[10:12] <mneptok> wtf is "getdeb?"
[10:12]  * jussi01 larts Myrtti
[10:12] <jussi01> mneptok: horrible
[10:12] <Hobbsee> mneptok: you don't know?
[10:12] <Hobbsee> mneptok: http://www.getdeb.net/
[10:12] <ikonia> ha ha
[10:13]  * jussi01 larts mneptok
[10:13] <mneptok> do i want to?
[10:13] <Hobbsee> mneptok: it's where kmos helps out with, if that helps.
[10:13] <Myrtti> mneptok: whhhuuttt?
[10:13] <Myrtti> mneptok: you're so... out of date
[10:13] <mneptok> i pay attention to technologies that matter
[10:13] <Hobbsee> mneptok: it's similar to automatix, except that you download each bit separately, and you have to uninstall it all before upgrading (at all), as they don't support upgrades.
[10:13] <Myrtti> mneptok: even I knew getdeb... IN FREAKING 2003!
[10:13] <jussi01> mneptok: you are so 2006
[10:13] <Myrtti> or something alike
[10:14] <mneptok> that explains why i don't know it.
[10:14]  * Myrtti runs sudo aptitude update; sudo aptitude safe-upgrade to mneptok
[10:14] <Hobbsee> mneptok: ie, it's crack
[10:14] <Myrtti> bwah
[10:14] <Myrtti> my laundry duty starts in 45
[10:15] <jpds> Seeker`: Whay does "window =" in "statusbar" in your .irssi/config say?
[10:17] <jpds> What*
[10:20] <Hobbsee> #ubuntu's very quiet...it's disturbing
[10:20] <Myrtti> not as quiet it was 14 hours ago
[10:23] <Hobbsee> oh?
[10:25] <Myrtti> I saw five minutes nobody said a thing
[10:26] <ikonia> most rare
[10:43] <ikonia> flannel your way too quick
[11:05] <ikonia> advice time please
[11:05] <ikonia> who's awake
[11:05] <jussi01> me
[11:05] <jussi01> ikonia: ask
[11:05] <ikonia> ok the user Lifeisfunny in #ubuntu
[11:05] <ikonia> was a bit of a jerk last time he was in
[11:06] <ikonia> repeating the question every minute, getting a bit arsey when no-one responded and parting with a smart ass comment
[11:06] <ikonia> when he came back in, I asked him to calm down in a, be a little patient and people will help if you give them time
[11:06] <jussi01> ikonia: im reading.
[11:06] <ikonia> his response was 1:04 <Lifeisfunny> oh go the hell a way
[11:06] <ikonia> 11:04 <Lifeisfunny> you freakin idiot
[11:08] <jussi01> ikonia: I think he will earn a forward here soon anyway
[11:08] <ikonia> yes it would appear that way
[11:08] <ikonia> but I didn't want it to "start" in the channel, I wanted it to not start, hence pm'ing him
[11:11] <jussi01> hehe, maybe he just needed to be told... ala Flannel :P
[11:12] <jussi01> spoke too soon
[11:12] <ikonia> he's done
[11:15] <Flannel> ikonia: I had to go look at my /var/www (but don't remember setting them +x anyway, perl/cgi usually needs +x though.
[11:16] <ikonia> Flannel: ahhh maybe thats why I have +x in my mind
[11:16] <ikonia> but I would have put money on it until you said it needs +x for php too
[11:16] <Lifeisfunny> how about a take a number system assigned to Ubotu or something
[11:16] <jpds> Host looks familiar.
[11:16] <jussi01> tight...
[11:18] <Flannel> ikonia: doesn't, you mean
[11:18] <jussi01> meh, there must be thousands on comcast
[11:22] <Lifeisfunny> just to let me know,  a mandated half hour delay doesn't guarantee a person would be next, huh?
[11:23] <ikonia> Flannel: no, I meant I would have put money it needed it until you said the opposite
[11:23] <Flannel> ikonia: Ah I see
[11:23] <ikonia> Lifeisfunny: there is no queue system
[11:23] <Flannel> ikonia: I think fast_cgi doesn't require +x, but I honestly don't remember.  Its because php is run by apache itself, whereas the perl stuff would be run on the OS, with the output going through apache
[11:23] <ikonia> Lifeisfunny: people will help when they are free/or can help
[11:23] <Lifeisfunny> as I thought
[11:24] <Flannel> Lifeisfunny: Half hour delay between repeats of the question.
[11:24] <ikonia> Flannel: ah, I see the difference
[11:24] <Flannel> Lifeisfunny: Thats a safe rotation for new people waking up, etc.
[11:24] <Lifeisfunny> Flannel, is that not what I posted?
[11:24] <Flannel> Lifeisfunny: While you wait, search the forums/google/etc
[11:24] <Lifeisfunny> maybe you don't knwo what mandated means
[11:24] <ikonia> Lifeisfunny: it's not "mandated" it's a guide to help the channel flow
[11:25] <Flannel> Lifeisfunny: also, I was clarifying, not correcting.
[11:25] <Lifeisfunny> sounds mandated to me
[11:25] <ikonia> Lifeisfunny: eg: asking every 2 minutes as you have been doing with such a long question is the same as flooding the channel for other users
[11:27] <elkbuntu> Lifeisfunny, we mandate against excessive repetitiveness. however we only advise half an hour delay. it's up to common sense.
[11:28] <Lifeisfunny> elkbuntu wants to get in on it now
[11:28] <elkbuntu> common sense indicates that if it's still on your screen, it's still on other peoples screens, so you dont need to repeat it
[11:28] <Lifeisfunny> anyone else want to take a turn at the flog?
[11:28] <ikonia> Lifeisfunny: that attitude is not helpful
[11:28] <ikonia> Lifeisfunny: you've come here for clarification, your getting clarification and your mocking it
[11:28] <elkbuntu> Lifeisfunny, if you're not going to take advice, just move along and stop wasting people's time.
[11:34] <jussi01> Lifeisfunny: anything else we can help you with?
[11:34] <Lifeisfunny> hey,   I'm sitting watching the clock
[11:34] <Lifeisfunny> what's this latest problem?
[11:37]  * Hobbsee notes that it's becomming a disturbingly popular trend to waste time, here
[11:39] <elkbuntu> is he one of the unnameables?
[11:39] <Seeker`> Hobbsee: what else are ops for?
[11:39] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu: not sure.
[11:39] <Hobbsee> Seeker`: oh, i don't know.  actual useful stuff?
[11:40] <Hobbsee> elkbuntu: i don't recognise the nick, but there are lots of people, from many places, in that category.
[11:40] <Seeker`> Hobbsee: pfft, lies
[11:44] <Myrtti> elkbuntu you go, girl!
[11:44] <elkbuntu> heh
[11:44] <elkbuntu> it just grates me every time some horny idiot in there talks about picking up chicks
[11:45] <Seeker`> mmm...chicken
[11:45] <Flannel> elkbuntu: but... dude!  dude, hot babes! dude!
[11:45] <elkbuntu> !pickup
[11:45] <elkbuntu> eeexellent
[11:46]  * Flannel notes that person in question is *not* from California.
[11:46] <elkbuntu> !pickup is <reply> Just a tip: talking about finding and/or picking up chicks is rude to the girls and women who are in this channel and dont feel like being 'found' or 'picked up'. This is not a speed dating channel.
[11:46] <Myrtti> Elkbuntu hes an allround one, not just horny.
[11:46] <elkbuntu> Myrtti, i dont doubt it
[11:46] <Flannel> Don't want you all getting the wrong idea about Californians.
[11:46] <Hobbsee> i prefer "sorry, I will never, ever sleep with you."
[11:46] <Seeker`> i'm assuming that factoid is for the benifit of -women?
[11:47] <elkbuntu> Seeker`, no, it's for the benefit of stopping -ot being the 'talk about picking up chicks' channel
[11:47] <Myrtti> Oh, that factoid means I cant try to pick up guys... Meh.
[11:47] <Myrtti> :-)
[11:47] <elkbuntu> heh
[11:47]  * jussi01 slaps Myrtti
[11:48] <jussi01> naughty!
[11:48]  * Myrtti cries
[11:48] <elkbuntu> !no pickup is <reply> Just a tip: talking about finding and/or picking up guys/chicks is rude to the people of whichever gender who are in this channel and dont feel like being 'found' or 'picked up'. This is not a speed dating channel.
[11:49] <elkbuntu> probably safer from the trolldiots
[11:54]  * Flannel mentions that meta-discussion about the above topic is probably safe.  Not that it ws the original purpose of factoid.  And also, not that I think factoids *ever* get misused.
[11:55] <Flannel> But, its always editable if it gets misued, so I'm not going to worry about it currently.
[11:55] <Flannel> Seriously though, what is this guys obsession with J-_?
[11:55] <elkbuntu> Flannel, meta discussion is, someone like Z blurting out about picking up chicks after an interrogation session... not cool
[11:56] <elkbuntu> it's not saying it's forbidden, just that it's rude.
[11:56] <Flannel> elkbuntu: Yes, Im aware.  But factoid seems to imply its not.  But Im not worried about it, because we can edit factoid if it gets used.
[11:57] <Flannel> but, more pressing issues: I can only imagine how uncomfortable J-_ is
[12:01] <Myrtti> Flannel: he's not obsessed with j-_
[12:01] <Myrtti> he's obsessed with EVERYONE
[12:01] <Myrtti> he pm'd me the other day
[12:01] <Myrtti> "please tell me about Finland and it's culture and people"
[12:02] <Myrtti> he's been on my ignore and still is, the problem is that he changes his nick and ident and ip more often I change my socks.
[12:02] <ikonia> who's this user ?
[12:02] <Seeker`> Myrtti must have manky socks :P
[12:02] <jussi01> ikonia: which name you want?
[12:02] <Flannel> Its obvious that J-_ doesn't appreciate it though.  His responses have been increasing in reluctance.
[12:02] <Myrtti> ASUS-tek, ZAXSES, MSI whatever
[12:03] <ikonia> ooh
[12:03] <ikonia> he has many nicks
[12:03] <Myrtti> and his English really SUCKS. no matter how many times you lart him with !u - no effect
[12:03] <Seeker`> lo J-_
[12:03] <J-_> You can take care of it if you want. :)
[12:04]  * Myrtti hugs J-_
[12:04] <Myrtti> I feel for you
[12:04] <Myrtti> the problem is...
[12:04]  * J-_ huggles
[12:04] <Myrtti> I'd love to kick him
[12:04] <Myrtti> but there is no rule against that that I know of
[12:04] <Myrtti> he's just being a general pain in the butt
[12:05] <Flannel> Myrtti: "Don't be annoying", "Be considerate", "Be Respectful"
[12:05] <Myrtti> perhaps...
[12:05] <Myrtti> but where do you draw the line?
[12:05] <Seeker`> about 10ft <- way
[12:05] <Myrtti> his behaviour is borderline teenager
[12:06] <Flannel> Myrtti: Its stifling other conversations in the channel, which is against freenode policy as far as I know (from memory anyway)
[12:06] <J-_> I don't mind really. But just hate how the conversing is directed directly to me, and I dunno. Feeling weird, but I don't care. :) I'm an adult.
[12:06] <Myrtti> someone should have a talk with him - I however am not volunteering since I really don't know what to tell him
[12:06] <Myrtti> I'm not motherly enough to know what to tell him
[12:07] <Flannel> Alright, Ill see what I can do.
[12:07] <Myrtti> he should just be taken into pm and have a chat
[12:07] <Myrtti> there's plenty of people his behaviour has been putting off
[12:08] <Myrtti> I for one take a deep breath whenever I see him saying "I'm going to bed now" and he quits
[12:08] <Flannel> Myrtti: six lines in already :)
[12:09] <J-_> Thanks
[12:09]  * Myrtti hugs Flannel
[12:23] <Flannel> Well... Ive technically talked to him about it.
[12:24] <Flannel> In that Ive mentioned it on two ocassions now
[12:24] <Flannel> but we'll see if he takes it to heart, even without acknowledging that Ive mentioned it.
[12:32] <Flannel> ikonia: If he has a root password set, it will.
[12:33] <ikonia> Flannel: yes, but he says it's not - it's scrabmled
[12:33] <ikonia> if he's set the root password, then he should know it
[12:33] <Flannel> thats the theory anyway :)
[12:34] <ikonia> you set it - you should know it
[12:34] <ikonia> or how to hack it
[12:35] <Flannel> Unfortunately, people follow stupid guides that tell them to set root passwords and they don't know what theyre doing
[12:38]  * elkbuntu waits patiently for the relevent bits of the array.org kernel to get into the intrepid kernel
[12:38]  * elkbuntu wants eee with wifi kthxbai
[12:39] <jpds> -> #ubuntu-kernel
[12:40] <elkbuntu> yeah, because i will be the first person to have gone in there to bitch today
[12:40] <elkbuntu> not
[12:41] <elkbuntu> it'll happen when it happens
[12:41] <elkbuntu> (-eeepc is also relevent to the interests)
[12:42] <elkbuntu> it's just boring to keep getting updates that are not 'really cool kernel fixes to make your stuff work' updates.
[12:48] <Flannel> mneptok: actually, it was SSL
[12:49] <mneptok> Flannel: i beg to differ
[12:49] <Flannel> mneptok: http://www.debian.org/security/2008/dsa-1571
[12:50] <mneptok> http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-612-2
[12:50] <mneptok> Flannel: the weakness was in SSL. the problem manifested itself in SSH.
[12:50] <Flannel> mneptok: the vulnerability was in OpenSSL
[12:50] <mneptok> (SSL certs were *mostly* OK)
[12:52] <Flannel> I can't think up a good analogy right now, but if X happens because of Y, fixing X doesn't actually fix the problem.
[13:11] <Myrtti> honeypuff cereal <3
[13:12] <Myrtti> Flannel: bridge broken, cars drop to river; solution: make cars that fly.
[13:16] <elkbuntu> can we make them fly anyway?
[13:29] <ikonia> jrib: nice spot !
[13:32] <jrib> ikonia: I was really confused the first time someone started talking about the sabayon distro and I had learned of the program first as well :)
[13:33] <ikonia> good spot though,
[14:01]  * Myrtti sighs
[14:10] <Myrtti> see?
[15:06] <soundray> Has IdleOne been banned from #ubuntu ?
[15:06] <Myrtti> yes
[15:06] <Myrtti> 16:34 <+FloodBot1> WARNING: Channel CTCP/NOTICE from IdleOne, banned
[15:06] <Myrtti> ~30 mins ago
[15:06] <ubot3> Factoid 30 mins ago not found
[15:06] <Myrtti> heh
[15:07] <soundray> Myrtti: I don't know what that means... I have him in PM, can you unban him?
[15:07] <Myrtti> soundray: why does he need you as a proxy?
[15:07] <Myrtti> brb
[15:07] <soundray> Okay, I'll ask him to join here
[15:08] <soundray> Not banned here, good
[15:08] <soundray> IdleOne: Myrtti said she'd brb
[15:08] <IdleOne> can I get some help being unbanned from #ubuntu please. not sure why I was banned in the first place
[15:08] <IdleOne> thanks soundray
[15:08] <pleia2> IdleOne: 10:06:29 <+Myrtti> 16:34 <+FloodBot1> WARNING: Channel CTCP/NOTICE from IdleOne, banned
[15:09] <IdleOne> ctcp notcie?
[15:09] <pleia2> apparently you issued a channel wide ctcp notice?
[15:09] <IdleOne> lol that is nuts. I would never flood notice
[15:09] <IdleOne> what did it say? any idea?
[15:11] <jrib> I don't even see one in my scrollback
[15:11] <Hobbsee> hmm.  not an irssi user.
[15:11] <soundray> IdleOne: it was when we were playing around with Ctrl-Shift-U combinations. I suspect you triggered it with a special key :)
[15:11] <IdleOne> soundray, hahah that was it
[15:12] <IdleOne> yes I did issue a notice somehow but was not sure how I did it. using shft ctrl u7c or somesuch
[15:13] <Hobbsee> IdleOne: removed.  see the usual stuff on "please don't ping the channel, it's annoying", although i can tell it was an accident ;)
[15:13] <IdleOne> lol Hobbsee /me will read the irc ettiquette :P
[15:13] <IdleOne> thanks for your help folks :)
[15:13] <Hobbsee> :P
[15:15] <soundray> Thanks Hobbsee
[15:16] <Myrtti> ah jolly good
[15:17] <Myrtti> mwhahaha
[15:18]  * Myrtti looks at -ot
[15:18] <Myrtti> MWHAHA
[15:18] <Myrtti> *cough*
[15:23] <Myrtti> I'll lart ZAXSES to kingdom come some day
[15:28] <Myrtti> my brain seriously hurts
[15:28] <Myrtti> ;__;
[15:43] <Myrtti> FCOL
[16:34] <Myrtti> !away
[16:35] <Myrtti> !nick
[16:40] <ikonia> jussi01: is your website down ?
[16:40] <ikonia> I can't get to BT
[16:40] <jussi01> @btlogin
[16:41] <jussi01> wfm
[16:41] <ikonia> of course
[16:41] <jussi01> hehe
[16:41] <Myrtti> answers to ping...
[16:41] <jussi01> why of course?
[16:41] <ikonia> the bots working
[16:41] <ikonia> but the URL appears dead
[16:41] <ikonia> jussi01: of course as in "of course it works for you...typical"
[16:42] <jussi01> heheh
[16:42] <ikonia> Hmmm I can't get dns resolution on your domain
[16:43] <ikonia> just your domain failing
[16:43] <stdin> works for me too
[16:43] <ikonia> Hmmmm I'm getting no available servers,but only on your domain
[16:43] <bazhang> @btlogin
[16:43] <stdin> what DNS(es) are you using
[16:43] <ikonia> my own
[16:44] <ikonia> and my ISP's now
[16:44] <ikonia> same result
[16:44] <ikonia> (just tested against them)
[16:44] <bazhang> works here
[16:45] <ikonia> just tried Demon Internet (another UK ISP) and it can't find an SOA record
[16:46] <ikonia> are your dns servers alive and well, and are people just running of cache ?
[16:46] <ikonia> http://www.demon.net/cgi-bin/dig?www.jussi01.com.
[16:47] <ikonia> or is it just me ?
[16:47] <ikonia> (could well be just me, but 2 UK isp's and my own dns servers are failing)
[16:47] <stdin> http://dnstools.com/?lookup=on&portNum=80&target=jussi01.com&submit=Get+Info
[16:48] <ikonia> Hmmm now I've got a different UK server responding
[16:48] <ikonia> stdin: dnstools.com doesn't resolve either, looks like some uk dns servers are having issues
[16:49] <stdin> ikonia: resolves for me on that site, and I'm in the UK
[16:49] <ikonia> really ??
[16:49] <ikonia> stdin: who are you on ?
[16:49] <stdin> blueyonder/virgin media
[16:50] <mc44> http://mjg59.livejournal.com/97151.html  <-- in case mr Almighty show up again, fyi
[16:50] <Myrtti> <IP_ADDRESS>
[16:50] <ikonia> ok, as I've got some uk servers (one of my own in London and a Clients) resolving fine, but my own ISP, my Own DNS and my ISP's refusing
[16:50] <ikonia> Myrtti: yeah, got the IP
[16:50] <Myrtti> mc44: intresting
[16:50] <Myrtti> mc44: thank you
[16:51] <mc44> I thought it would end up being him ;)
[18:12] <Pricey> All well?
[18:25] <Myrtti> so so
[18:29] <Pricey> :)
[18:41] <jpds> evening.
[18:43] <Flannel> Myrtti: He did mention that he'd try and be better
[18:43] <Myrtti> lol
[18:43] <Myrtti> right
[18:43] <Myrtti> well he was *marginally* less annoying
[18:44] <Myrtti> except doing /me is watching Some Pirated [lololo]XVid.avi
[18:44] <Flannel> Myrtti: No idea how well he's doing, having just woken up of course
[18:44] <Myrtti> and hugging people out of the blue, and greeting everyone joining the channel, and asking me to tell MORE about midori and webkit and what not
[18:45] <Flannel> Myrtti: I think he justdoesn't know when he's doing it. It might be that just mentioning "hey, youre doing it right now" will be enough
[18:45] <Myrtti> and there he is again
[18:45] <Flannel> Perhaps he's merely an untrained Bayesian filter.
[18:45] <Flannel> Or, maybe not, who knows.
[19:14] <Mez> jussi01, I just did a quick scan over your DNS server, and cant find anything wrong other than your MX setup
[19:14] <jussi01> MX setup?
[19:15] <Mez> jussi01, yeah... your MX records point to a CNAME record, rather than an A record, which is against about... 4 RFCs?
[19:15] <jussi01> Mez: hehe - its the generic godaddy setup...
[19:59] <PriceChild> Who runs ubot5?
[20:00] <nalioth> PriceChild: /whois it
[20:00] <PriceChild> gawd I'm rubbish lately
[20:00] <PriceChild> hmm and its caught up anyway, thanks nalioth
[20:08]  * jpds is going to get bashed.
[20:09]  * Mez is going to get zsh's
[20:09] <Mez> s/'s/'d/
[20:09] <jpds> Yay, zsh!
[20:10] <Mez> jpds, Ah yes, I hear you recently discovered it ?
[20:10] <jpds> Mez: I've been using it for months.
[20:10]  * Mez has been using it for years :D
[20:11] <jpds> Mez: http://ks33313.kimsufi.com/~jpds/configs/zshrc
[20:12]  * jussi01 recently dicovered it...
[20:13] <Mez> o_O
[20:13] <Mez> see, me...  Yes.
[20:16]  * jussi01 just added his blog to planet...
[20:17]  * Myrtti curtseys
[20:18] <jpds> Mez: But, I need my Zsh powered Tetris.
[20:18] <jussi01> jussi01.com for all interested parties...
[20:18] <Mez> jpds, I did notice that
[20:18] <Mez> jussi01, no SEF urls?
[20:19] <Mez> s/SEF/HR?
[20:19] <Mez> s/\?/\//
[20:19] <jussi01> huh?
[20:19]  * Myrtti giggles
[20:19] <Mez> jussi01, Human Readable URLs
[20:19] <Mez> compare
[20:19] <Mez> http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/category/ubuntu/ to http://jussi01.com/?cat=16
[20:20] <Myrtti> "the other one is shorter!"
[20:20] <jussi01> meh, thought about it, like shortness.
[20:20] <jussi01> hehe
[20:20] <Mez> jussi01, what's more important to you. That people can find easily where they are on your website by manipulating the URL, or the URLs not changing?
[20:22] <Myrtti> note to self: HOT WATER IS FRICKING HOT!
[20:22] <Myrtti> </end of public informational notice>
[20:23] <Mez> Myrtti, that just broke my mind
[20:23] <Mez> it should have been either
[20:23] <Mez> <end of public informational notice />
[20:23] <Mez> or
[20:23] <Mez> </public informational notice>
[20:23] <Myrtti> burns
[20:23] <Myrtti> ow.
[20:23] <Myrtti> I gots a booboo :-<
[20:24] <Mez> go run it under cold water
[20:24] <Mez> for 10 mins
[20:24] <Myrtti> but I don't want to get undressed...
[20:24] <Myrtti> ahem
[20:25] <Mez> would you rather horrid scars then ?
[20:25] <Mez> go run it under cold water..
[20:25] <Mez> I'm a trained medic..
[20:25] <Myrtti> actually the pain subsided as I screamed loudly by opened window the F word
[20:25] <Mez> RESPECT MAH AUTHORITAH!
[20:25]  * Myrtti whimpers
[20:25] <Myrtti> no spankin
[20:26] <Mez> go run it under cold water if you've burnt yourself...
[20:26] <Myrtti> it's FINE.
[20:26] <Mez> the pain WILL subside, but thats due to tormented nerve endings
[20:26]  * Mez growls
[20:27] <jussi01> hehe
[20:27]  * Myrtti goes to have a cold shower
[20:28] <Myrtti> and you can think in your sick little minds *what* for
[20:29] <Myrtti> Mez is a meanie
[20:29] <Flannel> Myrtti: You'll thank him later
[20:32]  * Mez hugs Myrtti
[20:32] <Mez> good
[20:36]  * nalioth issues a curse towards his ISP
[20:41]  * Myrtti peeks out behind the shower curtain
[20:42] <Myrtti> UNCLE MEZ CAN I COME OUT NOW?
[20:42] <jussi01> uncle?
[20:42] <Mez> you must already be
[20:43]  * Myrtti shows her tongue at Mez
[20:43] <Myrtti> fooled you
[20:43]  * Mez sighs
[20:44] <Myrtti> :-þ
[21:04]  * jpds just noticed: http://mjg59.livejournal.com/97151.html
[21:04] <Flannel> jpds: Some people only have fun by causing trouble
[21:04] <Myrtti> jpds: you're lagging
[21:05] <Myrtti> 18:50 < mc44> http://mjg59.livejournal.com/97151.html  <-- in case mr Almighty show up  again, fyi
[21:05] <Myrtti> 23:04  * jpds just noticed: http://mjg59.livejournal.com/97151.html
[21:05] <jpds> Blah, I never bother with blogs.
[21:05] <jpds> s/never/rarely/
[21:06] <Myrtti> jpds: that was mc44 here
[21:06] <Myrtti> on this channel.
[21:06] <Myrtti> you're lagging, as I said.
[21:31]  * Myrtti sighs
[21:32] <PriceChild> Myrtti: what's up?
[21:32] <Seeker`> the ceiling
[21:33] <Myrtti> I should leave home tomorrow morning to first have a meeting with The Customer and then off to drink alcholic beverages supplied by my employer.
[21:33] <Myrtti> I really couldn't be bothered to do either, as I'd rather be someplace totally else, but...
[21:34] <Myrtti> also, bored to pieces
[21:51] <mneptok> ikonia: around?
[21:51] <ikonia> just about
[21:51] <mneptok> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[21:51] <ikonia> I'd just set my status to asleep
[21:51] <mneptok> 05:03 -joaopinto(n=future@nat/ibm/x-411bd08e5e5937aa)- You really need to control your "show-off" abilities
[21:51] <ikonia> but saw your highlight
[21:51] <ikonia> mneptok: what's that about ?
[21:52] <mneptok> dunno. just woke up and had that /notice
[21:52] <ikonia> mneptok: from who ?
[21:52] <ikonia> mneptok: about who ?
[21:52] <mneptok> joaopinto, to me
[21:52] <mneptok> pot. kettle. etc.
[21:53] <ikonia> ahhh
[21:53] <ikonia> took me a second for the nick to kick in
[21:53] <ikonia> he's an issue
[21:53] <mneptok> he is for me. now.
[21:54] <mneptok> i note the IBM hostmask
[21:54] <ikonia> yes,
[21:54] <mneptok> nice way to address a longtime shareholder.
[21:54] <ikonia> ha ha ha
[21:54] <ikonia> "fire him"
[21:54] <ikonia> you pay his wages
[21:55] <mneptok> nah. i wouldn't do that, as i'm not a vindictive show-off.
[21:55] <ikonia> ha ha
[21:55] <mneptok> if i was, we'd know each other better because i'd attend Guild meetings.
[21:55] <ikonia> he is worth keeping an eye on, as he doesn't do what's best for the user, just what's best in his mind for an elite status
[21:56] <mneptok> exaaaaaactly
[21:56] <mneptok> "show off"
[21:56] <ikonia> mneptok: I get that sort of thing from him all the time
[21:56] <ikonia> because I don't tell the normally new user in question the %100 correct way to do something, rather the best way to achieve there goal
[21:57] <ikonia> anyway, bed, you caught me as I was about to log off
[21:57] <ikonia> night
[21:59] <mneptok> nighty
[22:03] <ompaul> morning
[22:05] <mneptok> heya ompaul
[22:05] <ompaul> mneptok, welcome
[22:08] <mneptok> gunh. 16 hours of flying today.
[22:08] <mneptok> *retch*
[22:08] <PriceChild> mneptok: how come you're all over the place?
[22:09] <mneptok> PriceChild: training
[22:09] <PriceChild> you're training others?
[22:10] <mneptok> yessir
[22:10] <PriceChild> I'm going to allow that.
[22:10] <PriceChild> have fun :)
[22:11]  * Myrtti huggles mneptok
[22:11] <ompaul> mneptok, where you these days?
[22:12] <mneptok> ompaul: this morning? Tokyo. this afternoon? Montreal.
[22:12] <mneptok> (yay for the international dateline)
[22:14] <ompaul> mneptok, and you are where?
[22:16] <Myrtti> hm
[22:16] <Myrtti> I need a way to crash something so badly it evokes apport
[22:17] <ompaul> Myrtti, what kind of a program?
[22:17]  * ompaul grins evilly
[22:17] <Myrtti> oh, did that already
[22:18] <Myrtti> sh -c 'kill -SEGV $$'
[22:18] <Myrtti> now I need to poke pitti
[22:18] <nalioth> Myrtti: Microsoft can oblige you.
[22:19] <ompaul> nalioth, they would never support apport
[22:19] <ompaul> reveal what the program was doing
[22:20] <ompaul> ohh noes couldn't have that
[22:20] <Myrtti> I just need to ask him if it's possible to make such a version of apport that would allow me to modify some information of the report before sending it to launchpad
[22:21] <Myrtti> because I'd really love to send in all the bug reports I can, but I need so check that they don't contain any unnecessary information and sanitize them if needed...
[22:22] <Myrtti> oh sigh
[22:22] <Myrtti> I'm procrastinating going to bed again
[22:24] <ompaul> Myrtti, go
[22:24] <ompaul> no don't
[22:24] <ompaul> go
[22:24] <ompaul> go
[22:24] <ompaul> whatever ;-)
[22:36] <Myrtti> gunatt
[22:39] <PriceChild> http://mjg59.livejournal.com/97151.html
[22:40] <Myrtti> you're definitely lagging
[22:40] <Myrtti> PriceChild: hop into a time machine, go back six hours
[22:40] <Myrtti> really, really going to bed now.
[22:41] <PriceChild> Myrtti: hehe sorry :)
[22:41] <PriceChild> just noticing this on planet
[22:41] <jussi01> ooh, thanks for the mail PriceChild :D
[22:42] <ompaul> that is nice
[22:43] <ompaul> don't mess with mr angry
[22:46] <PriceChild> Daniel Stone's blog also makes me happy.
[22:47] <PriceChild> well not happy seen as it was a bad thing that happenned
[22:48] <PriceChild> but I'm sure you know what I mean
[22:55] <jussi01> hehe, yeah
[23:09] <moo_cow> the colors arent displaying correctly with videos in ubuntu. the people are purple.
[23:11] <PriceChild> moo_cow: you might want to try turning compiz off, and asking in the support channel, #ubuntu
[23:53] <moo_cow> PriceChild: when i go to system>preferences>appearance, it is set to none. here's an example of what im talking about. http://img123.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn6595kf3.jpg


[08:56] <admcleod> kwmonroe: yep that similar
[09:43] <jamespage> lukasa, thanks for approving the switch to apache 2.0
[09:43] <lukasa> jamespage: No problem. =)
[10:55] <jamespage> beisner, https://code.launchpad.net/~james-page/charms/trusty/mongodb/ch-resync-newton/+merge/297046
[11:28] <beisner> jamespage, ack, will watch for tests to complete.
[11:32] <xilet> I am running into issues connecting the cinder container to local block devices, was curious if anyone has that working. (beta7)
[11:48] <beisner> jamespage, merged
[11:55] <jamespage> xilet, is that with cinder/iscsi?
[11:55] <jamespage> and with which provider? LXD/local or MAAS?
[11:56] <beisner> jamespage, that's landed
[11:56] <xilet> lxd
[11:57] <xilet> and honestly I am not sure with iscsi or not,  I got the services fixed on the cinder container but I still can't see any of the volume groups passed through from the host
[11:58] <xilet> (I am new to juju and cinder so I may be missing something fundemental)
[12:15] <jamespage> beisner, also https://code.launchpad.net/~james-page/openstack-charm-testing/ext-port-configuration/+merge/297035
[12:16] <jamespage> xilet, atm its not possible to consume block devices from within a container in the way I think you are trying todo
[12:17] <jamespage> xilet, so the only option at the moment are cinder backends that are 100% userspace - like ceph for example
[12:17] <jamespage> xilet, so for cinder/iscsi (the defautl) you have to run the cinder-volume service outside of containers...
[12:17] <xilet> Ahh ok
[12:17] <jamespage> api and scheduler can be run in container still
[12:17] <jamespage> xilet, the cinder charm supports this type of split - its a config option
[12:18] <jamespage> so you can deploy it twice - once for schedule/api in lxd container, once for volume on hardware
[12:18] <xilet> Is there harm in living the container volume service running?
[12:20] <jamespage> xilet, well for ceph its still required - it just manges the ceph backend rather than trying todo stuff locally with lvm + iscsi
[12:21] <xilet> Thanks, I can dig through the docs, just curious if you know offhand, is there is a decent guide out there about adding additional duplicated services to openstack?
[12:27] <xilet> Ah ok, there is one already.
[12:43] <jamespage> rick_h_, marcoceppi: is there some sort of flag to ensure that test usage of the charm store does not get registered into the stats? we're about to switch our amulet testing to use cs:xxxxx but I don't want to bloat out the stats.
[12:54] <rick_h_> rogpeppe1: do you know the flaf and how it would work from a bundle, cli, and the querystring? ^
[12:54] <rick_h_> flag that is
[12:55] <rogpeppe1> rick_h_, jamespage: yeah, one mo, i'll check
[12:56] <rogpeppe1> jamespage, rick_h_: make the request with &stats=0
[12:56] <rogpeppe1> jamespage: ah, but is this using the charm tool?
[12:58] <rick_h_> rogpeppe1: right how would we get that through the tooling, bundle format so a bundle deploy, juju deploy, etc don't count
[12:59] <rogpeppe1> rick_h_: currently I don't think there's a way to do that
[12:59] <rogpeppe1> rick_h_: we could support an environment variable to disable stats, i guess
[12:59] <rick_h_> rogpeppe1: yea, something like that
[13:00] <rogpeppe1> rick_h_: i'm not entirely sure we want to enable anyone to do it, but i'm not sure there's an alternative
[13:00] <rick_h_> rogpeppe1: taking this to the other channel to include uros
[13:02] <rick_h_> jamespage: how much of this is juju1 vs juju2? (is any of it juju2?)
[13:03] <jamespage> rick_h_, well right now its both :-)
[13:03] <rick_h_> jamespage: ok, yea just thinking of the patch we need and going ruh roh...prolly need it on juju1  as well
[13:03] <rick_h_> jamespage: so I'd say go ahead please and we'll work with the teams to get you a way to set it, but it's on the API but not exposed through clients atm :(
[13:08] <rogpeppe1> jamespage: looks like you can disable stats by including a "test-mode: true" field in the model config
[13:08] <jamespage> beisner, hey - for the switch to cs I'm going to deal with the fact that some other charms don't support all series, by testing with the closest match
[13:08] <jamespage> rogpeppe1, I thought there was something like that!
[13:08] <jamespage> beisner, ^^ we'll need to turn that on!
[13:09] <beisner> jamespage, so, we'll need to have the amulet helper add &stats=0 to the cs: charm url;  and do the same when we update mojo/o-c-t bundles, yah?
[13:10] <jamespage> beisner, no we can just set this in the environments.yaml for the overall environment
[13:11] <jamespage> test-mode: true
[13:11] <beisner> jamespage, ok i missed something in backscroll then
[13:11] <beisner> boom right there it is :)
[13:11] <beisner> jamespage, ok i can add that to all of our enviros
[13:11] <jamespage> sounds like a plan
[13:18] <beisner> jamespage, ok test-mode is true everywhere
[13:18] <jamespage> \o/
[13:19] <rick_h_> awesome beisner
[13:20] <beisner> jamespage, thx for the ext port fixup (merged)
[13:20] <jamespage> beisner, np
[13:23] <beisner> jamespage, rick_h_ - curious, since juju-deployer (and amulet + bundletester) fetch the charm ahead of deploy, will that model config be effective?
[13:23] <rick_h_> beisner: no, that only effects calls to juju client itself
[13:23] <beisner> yep makes sense rick_h_
[13:23] <rick_h_> beisner: if other clients fetch the charm they need to update the query string for getting the archive
[13:25] <beisner> jamespage, seems like a juju-deployer test-mode flag needs to grow, and be plumbed upward to amulet, bundletester and mojo.
[13:25] <beisner> that, or we hackily munge the heck out of things on the fly
[13:28] <beisner> rick_h_, jamespage - 100% of os-charm testing currently has src ip of our company's known wan IPs.  do you know if are we already excluding ourselves from cs stats?
[13:30] <kjackal> petevg: Hey are you around?
[13:30] <petevg> kjackal: I am. What's up?
[13:30] <kjackal> Just saw you comment on the failing test
[13:30] <kjackal> how do you run the test?
[13:31] <petevg> With bundletester.
[13:31] <petevg> The exact invocation: bundletester -t ~/Code/charms/trusty/kafka
[13:31] <rick_h_> beisner: no, we're not removing those from stats, just the long running juju usage numbers
[13:32] <petevg> It actually seems to successfully deploy -- I have a kafka server running that is not in an errored state.
[13:32] <petevg> kjackal: I suspect that there's a timing issue in the test -- maybe it gets past the point where it has that message too quickly?
[13:32] <rick_h_> beisner: I'm of two minds of just excluding ourselves, might be coming time to do that though
[13:33] <kjackal> petevg: did you change this line before running the test: https://github.com/juju-solutions/bigtop/blob/kafka/bigtop-packages/src/charm/kafka/layer-kafka/tests/01-deploy.py#L18
[13:33] <kjackal>  ?
[13:33] <beisner> rick_h_, yah ditto.  there are deploys happening for real production workloads, so that may not be best.  it'd be an easy big hammer though ;-)
[13:33] <petevg> kjackal: I did not.
[13:34] <kjackal> petevg: So let me explain what might be going wrong
[13:34] <kjackal> petevg: this test says, go to the store and fetch the kafka charm that should be the same as cs:trusty/kafka
[13:35] <kjackal> so this test is supposed to run when we have the charm in the right place
[13:35] <kjackal> if we are to test this right now we should change it to something like local:trusty/kafka
[13:36] <kjackal> so that it picks-up the charm you are building/reviewing....
[13:36] <petevg> kjackal: Hmmm ... bundletester seems to be smart enough to just go and grab the charm locally if you pass the local path to -t.
[13:36] <kjackal> it does? Nice, didnt know that
[13:37] <kjackal> ok then it is a real error, I will take a look
[13:37] <petevg> Cool.
[13:39] <petevg> Now I know why the team has been giving me funny looks when I've been talking about running bundletester from a locally built charm -- maybe it's not widespread knowledge that it works :-)
[13:40] <kjackal> :)
[13:41] <kjackal> pgrep of java in a kafka deployment gives this output: https://pastebin.canonical.com/158511/
[13:41] <jamespage> beisner, https://code.launchpad.net/~james-page/charm-helpers/amulet-switch-to-cs/+merge/297060
[13:46] <beisner> jamespage, that looks like it will do the trick.   did you see the convo ^ re: test-mode only applying to juju proper cmds, and not juju-deployerisms (amulet, mojo)?
[13:46] <jamespage> beisner, I've tested precise/trusty/xenial with with that in keystone - raised https://review.openstack.org/#/c/328305/ to test in full
[13:47] <jamespage> beisner, hmm does deployer collect the charms itself?
[13:47] <beisner> jamespage, awesome i was just thinking:  we should sync this and push a thing or two through the pipeline.  :)  good deal
[13:47] <beisner> jamespage, yes i believe so
[13:47] <beisner> jamespage, at least for all non cs: it does.
[13:53] <jamespage> beisner, it downloads cs ones directly to a local cache dir
[13:54] <beisner> jamespage, seems like a juju-deployer test-mode flag needs to grow, and be plumbed upward to amulet, bundletester and mojo.
 that, or we hackily munge the heck out of things on the fly
[13:54]  * beisner refers to self in the third person ;-)
[13:54] <beisner> so glad it's friday
[13:56] <beisner> jamespage, but since we're in control of that cs url in the amulet helper, we could also address it there and fix one test-mode path
[14:00] <jamespage> beisner, oh - btw I poked at a few instances I got doing manual testing that did not bootstrap as juju nits
[14:00] <jamespage> units rather
[14:00] <jamespage> beisner, I did a rebuild on the existing machines, and post rebuild they got metadata and joined OK
[14:00] <jamespage> which is frustrating
[14:01] <jamespage> so its some sort of race between the instance booting and metadata being present/provided.
[14:03] <beisner> jamespage, interesting.  any clues in timing on serverstack hosts?
[14:04] <beisner> (logs on hosts i mean of course)
[14:04] <jamespage> beisner, no waiting to hit another so I can log dive at the same time
[14:10] <beisner> jamespage, can you review / button poke @?:  https://github.com/openstack-charmers/bot-control/pull/1    ... fyi: https://github.com/openstack-charmers/bot-control/blob/charm-what/tools/README.charm-what.md
[14:14] <jamespage> stokachu, does conjure-up have a KVM option for the all-in-one under LXD deployment?
[14:14] <stokachu> jamespage: not by default, i wanted to make openstack-base conjure-up enabled which would provide that
[14:14] <jamespage> beisner, lgtm
[14:15] <jamespage> stokachu, also does the LXD deployment include cinder atm?
[14:15] <stokachu> jamespage: yea
[14:15] <jamespage> stokachu, that's not going to be functional with nova-lxd
[14:15] <jamespage> nova-lxd does not support persistent block storage options atm
[14:15] <jamespage> as lxd can't do it securely just yet
[14:15] <kjackal> petevg: I cannot confirm the error you see in kafka . This is what my test run got me https://pastebin.canonical.com/158519/
[14:15] <stokachu> jamespage: this is the bundle im using https://github.com/battlemidget/openstack-novalxd/blob/master/bundle.yaml
[14:16] <stokachu> jamespage: should i remove cinder?
[14:16] <jamespage> yes
[14:16] <stokachu> jamespage: ok
[14:16] <petevg> @kjackal: Hmmm ... I'll run the tests again, and do some more digging.
[14:17] <stokachu> jamespage: https://github.com/battlemidget/openstack-novalxd/tree/master/conjure i was going to propose something similar for openstack-base
[14:17] <kjackal> petevg: I will redo the test again
[14:17] <beisner> thx jamespage
[14:17] <petevg> Hopefully, we are not looking at something unique to my machine.
[14:18] <jamespage> stokachu, I think you adapted the nova-lxd bundle from my original kvm one right?
[14:18] <stokachu> jamespage: yea
[14:21] <kjackal> petevg: it is strange that your test did run.... but the assertion failed....
[14:22] <kjackal> i suspect some race condition there.... let me add a wait for the Ready message
[14:24] <aisrael> tvansteenburgh: Do you know anything about limitations in testing juju storage via amulet?
[14:28] <tvansteenburgh> aisrael: nop.
[14:28] <tvansteenburgh> nope
[14:32] <tvansteenburgh> aisrael: that doesn't mean there aren't some though, i just don't know. haven't really done anything with storage
[14:39] <aisrael> tvansteenburgh: Thanks. I'll get some clarification on what they mean
[14:40] <aisrael> tvansteenburgh: This is the issue: https://github.com/juju/amulet/issues/112
[14:43] <tvansteenburgh1> marcoceppi: ^
[14:44] <aisrael> tvansteenburgh: An unrelated amulet/bundletester question. If a test should be skipped because some requirement isn't met (env variables, running on lxc, etc), is there a way tell bundletester to consider the test skipped vs. failing it?
[14:44] <tvansteenburgh> marcoceppi: shall i carve out a little time for that?
[14:44] <marcoceppi> tvansteenburgh: yes
[14:48] <tvansteenburgh> aisrael: bt doesn't have the notion of skip, only pass/fail. you can control which tests are run with the tests key in tests.yaml though
[14:50] <aisrael> tvansteenburgh: ack, thanks
[14:50] <tvansteenburgh> aisrael: feel free to open a bug for the skip feature though, if you want
[14:51] <aisrael> tvansteenburgh: will do!
[15:17] <jamespage> icey, I will look in detail at charms.storage but can you add the testr/tox configuration as per https://github.com/openstack-charmers/charms.openstack
[15:17] <jamespage> and drop all the legacy makefile stuff
[15:17] <jamespage> icey, this will ease migration under /openstack
[15:17] <icey> jamespage: I can work on that; first time intentionally using tox :-P
[15:17] <jamespage> icey, essential for migration to openstack infra
[15:18] <jamespage> icey, we also need to get setup with publishing these modules to pypi and doing propoper releases; some of that we shoudl defer until we migration as there is alot of automation we can leverage there...
[15:39] <marcoceppi> cory_fu: I have a crazy idea wrt tactics
[15:40] <marcoceppi> nvm
[15:40] <cory_fu> That was quick
[15:40] <aisrael> tvansteenburgh1: Another bundletester question. If a charm requires a kernel module be loaded (local provider/lxd, so must be loaded on host), is that an option? There's nothing explicit in tests.yaml, but what about a makefile target to do it?
[15:41] <marcoceppi> cory_fu: I wanted to do something crazy, but then I thought about it and changed my mind
[15:41] <cory_fu> Indeed
[15:41] <tvansteenburgh1> aisrael: sure
[15:42] <tvansteenburgh> aisrael: you can run whatever code you want, either in a make target or in a test itself
[15:43] <aisrael> tvansteenburgh: k, thanks. It may not be an issue if we're able to skip certain environments (like local)
[16:32] <icey> jamespage: build is passing, using the tox settings and travis settings from charms.openstack :)
[16:39] <jamespage> \o/
[17:01] <thedac> DNS HA charm helpers ready for review https://code.launchpad.net/~thedac/charm-helpers/dnsha/+merge/297009
[18:19] <rick_h_> beisner: can I bug you a second on connecting to an openstack please?
[18:19] <beisner> howdy rick_h_
[18:19] <rick_h_> beisner: I'm poking at someone running a hosted openstack cloud and tring to figure out how I'd setup juju config to talk to it
[18:20] <rick_h_> They've got me creating an application and having an application key and a secret key, sound familiar at all?
[18:26] <beisner> rick_h_, generally you'll need the keystone endpoint address of their cloud, plus your tenant username, password and region name.
[18:42] <natefinch> can anyone give me a simple example of a bundle that deploys units to lxc containers?
[18:48] <rick_h_> natefinch: not off the top of my head but built one with the machine view on demo.jujucharms.com and exported it here: https://pastebin.canonical.com/158543/
[18:48] <rick_h_> just made up something
[18:48] <cherylj> natefinch: here's one I had for a bug a while ago:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/17180954/
[18:54] <mattrae> hi, is it possible to upgrade-charm, going from the charm store to a local charm? it doesn't seem to work to specify --path https://pastebin.canonical.com/158545/
[18:54] <natefinch> rick_h_, cherylj: thanks.
[18:54] <rick_h_> mattrae: normally you have to update-charm --switch
[18:55] <rick_h_> mattrae: that will let you go from one charmstore url to another.../me hasn't tested if that lets you go to local?
[18:58] <mattrae> thanks rick_h_ yeah looks like for a local charm you may need to use --path rather than --switch.. according to the help --path and --switch are mutually exclusive, so i thought it may not work
[20:17] <cory_fu> Oh, hey, kwmonroe.  I forgot that I got the bundle_deploy added to bundletester.  That was to fix an issue we had in one of our bundles, to give us more control over the initial deploy.  I forget what the issue was, though.
[20:18] <cory_fu> However, we could use that to manage the deployer timeout ourselves
[20:21] <kwmonroe> cory_fu: i dont recall what you mean by 'bundle_deploy added to bundletester'
[20:22] <kwmonroe> oh, yes i do
[20:22] <cory_fu> kwmonroe: https://github.com/juju-solutions/bundletester#testsyaml
[20:22] <kwmonroe> https://github.com/juju-solutions/bundletester/issues/43
[20:22] <cory_fu> Yeah, that
[20:22] <kwmonroe> why the heck aren't we using that?
[20:22] <cory_fu> Ok, so it was to fix something where we needed to reset the env.  Hrm.  Wish I could remember what the failure was
[21:04] <icey> jamespage: the hardening one has me stumped, it's now using tox but still no module named apt: https://travis-ci.org/ChrisMacNaughton/charms.hardening
[21:34] <cory_fu> Can someone remind me how to run bundletester with a bundle from the store?
[21:34] <cory_fu> Ah, never mind.  I remembered how to read
[21:35] <cory_fu> Though the --help output on BT could be better (I would never have guessed TESTDIR is what I wanted)
[21:39] <cory_fu> kwmonroe: Hey, how is BT not failing every time on hadoop-processing given that it doesn't contain a Makefile?
[21:48] <kwmonroe> cory_fu: what happens if you run bt from a local copy of the bundle?
[21:48] <kwmonroe> so like, bundletester -vF -c bundle.yaml
[21:49] <kwmonroe> also cory_fu, i don't see any of our bundles with Makefiles
[21:50] <kwmonroe> exhibit a: https://jujucharms.com/realtime-syslog-analytics/, b: https://jujucharms.com/apache-analytics-sql/, etc
[21:50] <cory_fu> Right.  I'm trying to figure out why I'm getting this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/17188103/
[22:03] <kwmonroe> dunno cory_fu, i always run like this: ubuntu@a5d019db9619:~/charms/bigtop/bigtop-deploy/juju/hadoop-processing$ bundletester -Fvl DEBUG -t tests
[22:03] <kwmonroe> i'm guessing cwr does too
[22:05] <cory_fu> kwmonroe: cwr runs it from the store, but it uses bundle:hadoop-processing instead of cs:hadoop-processing
[22:06] <cory_fu> Oh, drat.  That didn't actually fix it
[22:14] <cory_fu> kwmonroe: Apparently, running bundletester with Juju 2.0 hits that issue but 1.25 does not


[15:25] <jbicha> fossfreedom: I can drop the mutter revert patch for artful now, right?
[15:26] <jbicha> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/3.23.91-0ubuntu1.1
[16:02] <jbicha> oh, never mind you updated the metapackage, not Budgie itself