[00:25] <wrst> how you doing Unit193
[00:42] <Unit193> Watching First Class right now.
[00:45] <Unit193> Have Russian tea as well.
[01:09] <wrst> russian
[03:30] <wrst> what makes Russian tea Russian Unit193 ?
[03:31] <Unit193> The Vodka.
[03:31] <Unit193> Heh, don't know.
[03:33] <Unit193> 2 cups Tang 2 cups Sugar 2 pkgs lemonade (kool-aid) 1 tsp cinnamon 1/2 tsp cloves 1 1/2 cups instant tea
[03:34] <wrst> doesn't sound all that Russian to me but what do i know?
[17:32] <netritious> I think it's legit wrst. Compared to 1 cup sugar, hot tea from stove, add water and stir....^^that tea sounds pretty foreign.
[18:59] <Unit193> \o/
[18:59] <Unit193> :P
[19:00] <Unit193> It's great, when you add the hot water, it bubbles like crazy. :P
[21:47] <wrst> ha ha :)


[06:37] <lordievader> Good morning
[06:52] <heller_> hey
[06:53] <heller_> how do you guys keep track that your servers are up to date with security?
[08:14] <yossarianuk>  Hi - for the zombieload bug - when using VMs do I need to update the VMs as well as Hypervisors or is just the hypervisor enough
[08:19] <heller_> im trying to dry-run unattended-upgrades but i get error about "sudo unattended-upgrade --dry-run
[08:19] <heller_> An error occurred: '404  Not Found'
[08:19] <heller_> The URI 'http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/c/cups-filters/libcupsfilters1_1.8.3-2ubuntu3.4_amd64.deb' failed to download, aborting"
[08:19] <heller_> Does this mean that UU requires manual apt update?
[08:22] <lordievader> I don't think unattended-upgrades promises to run 'apt update' before the actual update run.
[08:24] <lordievader> There should be an `/etc/apt/apt.conf.d/10periodic` where this period of `apt update` is defined.
[12:22] <ahasenack> rbasak: I would like to update the importer whitelist
[12:22] <ahasenack> rbasak: the code is updated already, but the snap that is doing the import isn't
[12:42] <rbasak> ahasenack: to do that I grab the latest nightly build from Jenkins and push it to edge in the store
[12:42] <rbasak> ahasenack: then eventually promote it up to beta, and refresh and restart the importer service
[12:43] <rbasak> ahasenack: or alternatively move the importer service instance to the edge snap temporarily
[12:45] <ahasenack> rbasak: this is really just a config file in the end, right
[12:48] <rbasak> Yes
[12:48] <rbasak> It can be overridden on the command line
[12:49] <rbasak> But I've never been confident about keeping that in sync properly, so have been going via the snap
[12:49] <rbasak> Suggestions welcome
[12:52] <ahasenack> rbasak: how can we see what changed between the snap that is running and the one to be pushed to edge?
[12:53] <ahasenack> rbasak: would another option be to import the package manually from somewhere else?
[12:54] <rbasak> ahasenack: yes you can just run the importer on the importer service instance in a different screen window
[12:54] <rbasak> ahasenack: for the differences, snap info git-ubuntu and look for the git commit hashes?
[12:54] <ahasenack> let me check
[12:55] <ahasenack> ok, edge is just one commit behind my whitelist change, as expected
[12:55] <ahasenack> beta is quite behind
[12:55] <ahasenack> does not have the --split change
[12:56] <ahasenack> nor the cache changes? That's odd
[12:56] <rbasak> Did I leave the importer service instance on edge?
[12:56] <ahasenack> rbasak: let's check
[12:56] <rbasak> Yes, I did
[12:56] <ahasenack> well, good for me :)
[12:56] <ahasenack> and it's been working for a couple of weeks now?
[12:57] <rbasak> So we could probably upload the latest nightly to edge and beta together, and move the importer service instance back to beta.
[12:57] <rbasak> Yes
[12:57] <ahasenack> rbasak: ok, want to walk me through it, or do it yourself this time?
[12:57] <rbasak> I can walk you through it
[12:57] <ahasenack> h/o?
[12:58] <rbasak> ack
[12:58] <ahasenack> let me fetch my headset
[14:21] <tobias-urdin> coreycb: hello :) quick questions, will ubuntu keep neutron-lbaas packages for the train release?
[14:21] <tobias-urdin> it will be retired in Train, but RDO will keep the packages pinned to latest version https://review.rdoproject.org/r/#/c/20683/
[14:21] <tobias-urdin> will ubuntu do something the same, or will it be completely removed in Train?
[14:22] <tobias-urdin> s/latest version/latest commit/g
[14:22] <tobias-urdin> then drop next release
[14:22] <coreycb> tobias-urdin: that's a good question. i think we can keep them around.
[14:23] <coreycb> jamespage: +1 on keep neutron-lbaas* around for train?
[16:14] <jerichowasahoax> "journalctl -u postfix" used to bring me my mail logs in 16.04, but in 18.04 it comes up empty, and my postfix logs are in /var/log/mail.log instead. Can I switch back to journalctl? I don't want to rework my scripts today.
[16:32] <TJ-> jerichowasahoax: are you sure you've not got that inverted? the 16.04 Xenial package has no systemd-related files or config, but the 18.04 Bionic package does
[16:47] <jerichowasahoax> TJ-: does 16.04 have some kind of package that lets journalctl read "classic" log files?
[16:47] <jerichowasahoax> it's possible that in 16.04 "journalctl -u postfix" was just some kind of fancy pants "cat /var/log/mail.log"
[16:49] <jerichowasahoax> but like, my daily report scripts are reading mail logs via https://pypi.org/project/systemd/, and i wrote these scripts back in 2017, so i was most definitely for sure using journald
[16:49] <jerichowasahoax> somehow
[16:50] <TJ-> jerichowasahoax: I'd suspect a custom config to route the mail logs to journald
[16:51] <jerichowasahoax> TJ-: depends on how custom we're talking - i could definitely have filled in "syslog" for a log file somewhere but i wouldn't have gone more complex than that
[17:12] <TJ-> jerichowasahoax: I would presume that journald was configured to take over the syslog function, via its /run/systemd/journal/dev-log (symlink to /dev/log). That's where the syslog() library function writes to (and Postfix uses syslog() by default)


[20:40] <lifeless> StevenK: reckon we could use https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lxc/+bug/807351/+attachment/2196930/+files/lxc-start-aufs on hudson ?
[20:40] <_mup_> Bug #807351: it would be cool to be able to clone an lxc container onto aufs for test runs - ephemeral containers <lxc (Ubuntu):Confirmed> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/807351 >
[20:40] <lifeless> StevenK: for the parallel test job
[20:48] <lifeless> time for testrepository features I think
[21:02] <lifeless> ugh, faceplant
[21:02] <lifeless> ok, time to fix bin/test
[22:02] <wgrant> lifeless: Oh? What's borked about it?
[22:07] <lifeless> --list
[22:07] <wgrant> Ah, yes.
[22:07] <lifeless> a) it includes non test ids in its output
[22:08] <wgrant> And it includes the prefixes.
[22:08] <lifeless> b) it does daftness when --subunit is passed
[22:08] <lifeless> wgrant: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/808513 https://dev.launchpad.net/ParallelTests#preview
[22:08] <_mup_> Bug #808513: testkeyserver uses fixed path <paralleltest> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/808513 >
[22:08] <wgrant> I quickly worked around it with:
[22:08] <wgrant> +test_id_option=--subunit --load-list $IDFILE
[22:08] <wgrant> +test_list_option=--list
[22:09] <wgrant> Not perfect, but it got me somewhere.
[22:09] <lifeless> yeah
[22:09] <lifeless> that brakes with 'testr -- -t stories/gpg'
[22:09] <wgrant> Yeah
[22:11] <wgrant> (aufs does normally permit rm, but the kernel's new hardlink security pedantry somewhat breaks it. sysctl -w kernel.yama.protected_nonaccess_hardlinks=0 might help.
[22:11] <lifeless> also have you seen the sudo glitch I mention in #tech ?
[22:24] <wgrant> lifeless: (catching up on email, your JS concerns are pretty much correct)
[22:26] <lifeless> thanks
[22:51] <lifeless> wgrant: ah, I see why you were talking about /tmp - its how the load-list was being passed around
[22:53] <wgrant> lifeless: Yes.
[22:53] <lifeless> whats the env variable to export?
[22:53] <wgrant> lifeless: So I bindmount /tmp/testr now and then TEMP=/tmp/testr testr run --parallel
[22:54] <lifeless> lets put TEMP in ./temp
[22:54] <wgrant> If you bindmount ~, sure :)
[22:54] <wgrant> I didn't.
[22:54] <lifeless> we need the sourcecode bind mounted minimally ;)
[22:55] <wgrant> Well, I ran with an entirely separate tree.


[13:21] <Eisbrecher_xnox> 3.13.0-31-generic is my new favorite =)
[17:46] <zequence> infinity: I'll be away between Fri-Thu, and will not be reachable, so if ou
[17:46] <infinity> zequence: Before then, would you rebase your current trees for saucy (last one!) and precise?
[17:47] <zequence> infinity: Yes, I did that already :)
[17:47] <infinity> zequence: Oh, so you did.
[17:47] <infinity> zequence: Will review and copy.  Awesome.
[17:47] <infinity> zequence: If you have time to smoketest before Friday, cool.  If not, I'll catch you when you get back.
[17:47] <zequence> infinity: But, the changelog? It only has the changes since last -proposed, not -updates. Is that a problem?
[17:48] <zequence> Or, the diff, that is
[17:48] <infinity> zequence: Yeah, I'm not concerned about the changelog being a bit goofy.  Rebase kernels are always a bit goofy anyway.
[17:48] <zequence> Ok, great.
[17:48] <infinity> zequence: As long as the code itself is correct, which I'm checking now.
[17:49] <infinity> zequence: saucy looks good.
[17:50] <infinity> zequence: And precise looks good.  You win.
[17:50] <zequence> The god of faulty RAMs is not against me then
[17:52] <infinity> zequence: I think that particular deity has started pestering kamal instead.
[17:52] <kamal> geez, ya flip *one* bit and infinity never forgets it!  ;-)
[17:53] <infinity> ;)
[17:57] <infinity> zequence: Alright, copied to the kernel PPA and building.  Will get them in -proposed ASAP.  If you have time to test tomorrow, awesome.
[17:57] <infinity> zequence: If we break your world while you're gone, apw and I will handle it.
[17:58] <infinity> apw: FYI, zequence is out next week, so it we have another emergency respin (man, we'd better not), it's up to us.
[17:58] <infinity> s/so it/so if/
[17:59] <zequence> infinity: Great. I'll test them tomorrow then.
[22:02] <apw> infinity, ack


[15:36] <barry> wgrant: hi.  i'm trying to grab ubuntu:alacarte and i get: BzrCheckError: Internal check failed: Cannot add revision(s) to repository: missing referenced chk root keys: [StaticTuple('sha1:9b260410e3a944e4c8081f77cf2ba750576baa53',)].Run 'bzr reconcile --canonicalize-chks' on the affected repository.
[15:37] <barry> wgrant: but 'bzr reconcile --canonicalize-chks ubuntu:alacarte' fails.
[15:37] <barry> wgrant: can/should i just import-dsc the .dsc from apt-get source and push --overwrite the branch?  or is there a better remedy?  is there *any* remedy? ;)
[15:38] <barry> (it might be a bit late for wgrant ;)
[15:40] <fullermd> Great, now you've got some Black Crowes running in my head.
[23:28] <wgrant> barry: push --overwrite probably won't work. How does the remote reconcile fail?
[23:30] <barry> wgrant: hi!  let me try to reproduce
[23:32] <barry> wgrant: oh, well that's very interesting.  i uploaded a new version of alacarte earlier today and now the trusty branch seems okay (albeit out of date)
[23:32] <wgrant> Yay :/
[23:35] <barry> wgrant: indeed ;)


[16:13] <cjwatson> nacc: Nagios says 1014 GB free (uh, which is 6 GB more than when you were at 1%, so either that's actually a used value or somebody deleted a load of stuff)
[16:29] <nacc> cjwatson: :)
[16:55] <nacc> cjwatson: we're upping to 10% since the 1% - 2% went pretty smoothly; hopefully we'll see actual change in the disk usage this way too
[16:57] <cjwatson> nacc: *nod*
[16:58] <nacc> cjwatson: i'll keep you posted when it finishes
[16:58] <cjwatson> thanks


[03:23] <Subhadip> Hi, I have worked in c++ and I wish to contribute to this project but not really sure where to start. Could any of you please help?
[18:03] <tgm4883> bobweaver, CrestedNewt meeting time?
[18:03] <bobweaver> woops I forgot about that joining channel now
[19:00] <bobweaver> so tgm4883  again
[19:00] <bobweaver> er sorry mhall119
[19:01] <bobweaver> so I went to will and Jim and said hey I know that you all can not talk to me about things that are happening in the uture but if you see soething just email me saying "that is not a good idea "
[19:01]  * tgm4883 wonders if we should try to work some of these issues out
[19:01] <bobweaver> I get emails that tell me what is going on
[19:01] <bobweaver> brb phone
[19:01] <CrestedNewt> OK, there are many issues here. I think that it's time to get them in the open, seeing that this is an OPEN source project :D
[19:03] <bobweaver> these are the type of emails that I get
[19:03] <bobweaver> Anyway... remember at UDS we had a quick conversation outside during a smoke break.  We agreed that if I could give you any direction about where to focus your efforts that I'd give you a heads-up and that you wouldn't ask any questions for the time being.... well, guess what....
[19:03] <CrestedNewt> mhall119, bobweaver had it working in Unity 3D but there were changes to something - exactly what I can't remember as it was above my 'pay grade' :D that is why he went back to 2D
[19:04] <bobweaver> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QcepB1E1lX0
[19:04] <bobweaver> unity 3d ^^
[19:04] <bobweaver> formfactor tv
[19:04] <bobweaver> everyone hated it
[19:05] <bobweaver> then libunity got changed and it would not work
[19:05] <bobweaver> I guess I am just not good at working with others
[19:05] <bobweaver> Listen I like to program
[19:05] <bobweaver> it is FUN
[19:06] <bobweaver> but I only like to program things that are fun
[19:06] <bobweaver> If something puts me into tears then I am not going to do it unless I am getting paid to
[19:06] <CrestedNewt> For this project to work, bobweaver needs some form of direction from canonical. Be that in the form of a NDA but at least he then has direction and is not wasting his time on re-doing work
[19:06] <CrestedNewt> NDA = Non Disclosure Agreement
[19:06] <bobweaver> and I dont even think that I would take a job that makes me cry all the time
[19:07] <bobweaver> If canonical wants Ubuntu TV on unity 3d they can pay me
[19:07] <bobweaver> bottom line
[19:07] <bobweaver> and on top of that I dont think that I would take the job
[19:08] <bobweaver> So this is what I am going to do
[19:08] <CrestedNewt> bobweaver - hang fire for a min before you say something you may regret - ok?
[19:09] <bobweaver> I am going to give it a weekend to cool down and then I will make emails to send out . If things do not go right then so be it
[19:09] <bobweaver> sorry CrestedNewt  you are right
[19:09] <bobweaver> But I am done wasting all my time
[19:09] <jhodapp> Is there a problem?
[19:09] <CrestedNewt> You have created what looks like something special.
[19:09] <tgm4883> jhodapp, lol
[19:09] <tgm4883> jhodapp, I can fill you in if you want
[19:10] <CrestedNewt> jhodapp - yes - there are problems in the community with those working on TV - bobweaver is talking of quitting
[19:10] <mhall119> bobweaver: we've told you all that we know about the direction Unity is taking
[19:10] <jhodapp> tgm4883, sure
[19:10] <bobweaver> "we want app developers"  ok I will make app "what you changed the design every 4 hours " how can a programmer keep up with that
[19:10] <tgm4883> jhodapp, pm?
[19:10] <mhall119> the fact that we don't know more is frustrating to all of us
[19:10] <jhodapp> tgm4883, yep
[19:10] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  in channel please
[19:10] <tgm4883> ok
[19:10] <bobweaver> it invols all of us
[19:10] <tgm4883> bobweaver, not keeping anything secret, I just didn't want to clog any more conversation that was taking place
[19:11] <jhodapp> CrestedNewt, ah ok
[19:11] <CrestedNewt> I like to call a shovel a shovel :D
[19:11] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  +1 I think that it is good that we are talking about this
[19:12] <tgm4883> jhodapp, so we just had the weekly meeting. It's starting to become increasingly apparent that the canonical is making all the rules, and bobweaver is doing all the work (i'm just doing scope stuff)
[19:12] <mhall119> bobweaver: you know the situation as well as jhodapp and I know it, you know that we've been struggling to get answers for you and to provide you with the best direction available
[19:12] <bobweaver> I just want to say that I am not mad if it comes across like that blame dyslisica and keyboards :)
[19:12] <tgm4883> jhodapp, while this isn't necessarily an issue, things keep changing on bobweaver and he can't get a straight answer from anyone for direction
[19:12] <mhall119> tgm4883: things have been changing on everybody, inside and outside of Canonical
[19:13] <tgm4883> mhall119, yea, but the people inside of canonical get to know about it
[19:13] <mhall119> we let you guys know about the changes as soon as we can, but we're not the ones making them
[19:13] <jhodapp> bobweaver, yes, what mhall119 just said is very much the reality
[19:13] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  also I would like to add that I am not going to do 3d it is done tell people to use it
[19:13] <bobweaver> again not mad stupid keyboards lol
[19:13] <CrestedNewt> OK guys, I have a business background. Let me put it in simple terms. Canonical is based in London UK. Someone there must have accountability for this project there. Who is this person and can I talk to them to get bobweaver the help he needs?
[19:13] <mhall119> tgm4883: we don't usually know about it inside of canonical
[19:14] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: Canonical staff are all over the world
[19:14] <bobweaver> I Love to program..... in some langs :)
[19:14] <tgm4883> jhodapp, mhall119 in that case, we shouldn't be using Unity
[19:14] <bobweaver> tgm4883, and everyone please think about the phone
[19:14] <bobweaver> is the phone using unity ?
[19:14] <tgm4883> jhodapp, mhall119 we should never have picked a platform that was such an unstable moving target
[19:14] <mhall119> tgm4883: Canonical wants a Unity that will work on TV, that's what our goal is for this project
[19:14] <jhodapp> tgm4883, well you should if you care about a converged device
[19:15] <bobweaver> mhall119,  what is Unity ?
[19:15] <bobweaver> think about that
[19:15] <tgm4883> mhall119, jhodapp unless canonical start putting resources toward the project, I don't care what canonical wants
[19:15] <mhall119> bobweaver: it's a set of APIs and UI/UX principles
[19:15] <tgm4883> mhall119, jhodapp which sucks, because I honestly like Unity
[19:15] <CrestedNewt> Unity = wat we aren't at the moment :D but we will get there :D
[19:15] <jhodapp> tgm4883, yeah I know, I wish we could get resources as well
[19:15] <tgm4883> (setting aside the obvious patent violation)
[19:15] <mhall119> tgm4883: that's fine, it's a reasonable position for you to have, if your goals don't line up then it's a shame, but no hard feelings
[19:16] <mhall119> we don't want the community to be free labor
[19:16] <tgm4883> mhall119, jhodapp I think if your goals don't line up then we have a problem here.
[19:16] <mhall119> if you have the same end-goal in mind as us, we want to work togther
[19:16]  * bobweaver dosent care what canonical thinks is a good idea. He cares about having a good working tv at home/ If other want to use Ubuntu tv from now on Out I am telling them to use it from 3d
[19:16] <tgm4883> mhall119, that is just the thing, you want to work together, but you can't
[19:17] <bobweaver> the goal is to have on Unity 3d then I am not porting to phone as "Ubuntu TV "
[19:17] <bobweaver> that can be done via 3d
[19:17] <bobweaver> we will see about hardware sccel on that
[19:17] <bobweaver> accell *
[19:17] <bobweaver> rotflol
[19:18] <bobweaver> also if that is the case then I step aside and other can do the work of porting to NUX as they are bangging on the door to help
[19:19] <tgm4883> mhall119, jhodapp my understanding from the last year of discussing Ubuntu TV with you guys is that everything is "Nux All the Unity Things", then phone comes out in qml?
[19:19] <bobweaver> because NUX can not be on phones
[19:19] <bobweaver> lets be honest here
[19:19] <jhodapp> tgm4883, yes, what bobweaver said
[19:19] <bobweaver> Nux is a great tool
[19:20] <CrestedNewt> mhall119, correct me if I am wrong.... Linux is all about 'Community' providing solutions and free to all. If the flavour of Linux is controlled and changes so much, that does not help the 'Community' especially when those changes can't be told to others outside the Illuminati which affects the 'communities' work.
[19:20] <tgm4883> mhall119, jhodapp keep in mind, I'm only doing the scopes stuff, and that works in any unity, so I'm probably one of the more impartial people here as I don't have a lot of work invested in something that is getting scraped
[19:20] <mhall119> tgm4883: we were being told, internally, to "Nux all the Unity Things"
[19:20] <bobweaver> but it is def not for accell hardware
[19:20] <tgm4883> mhall119, so how did phone get away with it?
[19:20] <bobweaver> also Nux could be ported to QML
[19:20] <bobweaver> as a plugin
[19:21] <bobweaver> this would be real hard and pointless
[19:21] <mhall119> you guys make it sound like we have some secret cabal, deciding on changes and never telling you, but I promise we're just as suprised and frustrated by the changes as you are
[19:21] <jhodapp> bobweaver, no, we're not doing that
[19:21] <bobweaver> as qt rendering system is well Honest here better
[19:21] <tgm4883> mhall119, and then what is the future of phone? it seems that "Unity" is becoming less of a unified codebase and more of a unified UI
[19:21] <mhall119> tgm4883: I don't know the details, but I do know that the original plan for the Phone shell was to do it in Nux
[19:21] <bobweaver> again NUX is a great tool
[19:21] <bobweaver> but If I am to go out side to change the oil on my GF car I am not using a hammer
[19:22] <bobweaver> I need a oil wrench some gloves aka the right tools
[19:22] <jhodapp> tgm4883, yeah, NUX didn't meat the requirements, so at least for the phone, we're not using it
[19:22] <tgm4883> mhall119, jhodapp while I know that you guys do know stuff you can't tell us, trust me, I don't think you have some secret cabal. The fact that you, mhall119, the lasian between community Ubuntu TV and canonical has secrets kept from him is a very bad thing
[19:22] <bobweaver> also with qx11info comming back tp qt5 that opens up all sorts of cool dors
[19:23] <bobweaver> doors *
[19:23] <mhall119> tgm4883: I don't have any secrets about this
[19:23] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  jhodapp  maybe We should talk about the convo we had at UDS
[19:23] <tgm4883> mhall119, thats exactly my point. You have secrets being kept from you
[19:23] <mhall119> bobweaver knows as much about the phone/tv/unity plans as I do
[19:23] <CrestedNewt> mhall119 - no he said that secrets are being kept from you as liason
[19:24] <bobweaver> about if I am doing something that is beeing worked on you all send me email saying that is not a good idea
[19:24] <mhall119> tgm4883: nobody knows, it hasn't been decided yet what's going to happen, we're *all* waiting on a decision to be made
[19:24] <bobweaver> this is good because it stops us and also doesent give away secerts
[19:24] <mhall119> secrets aren't being kept from me
[19:24] <mhall119> and secrets aren't being kept form bobweaver
[19:24] <mhall119> we just plan don't know
[19:24] <tgm4883> mhall119, I feel you're talking about Ubuntu TV there, when I'm hearing the issues are not with Ubuntu, but actually with Unity
[19:24] <mhall119> tgm4883: the Unity team doesn't know
[19:25] <mhall119> there's a lot of talk but no decisions have been made
[19:25] <tgm4883> mhall119, the unity team doesn't know when they do Unity changes?
[19:25] <tgm4883> that's not very good
[19:25] <mhall119> they don't know which Unity changes they're going to have to make until they're told to make them
[19:25] <jhodapp> tgm4883, which is no different than any company
[19:25] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  please listen to me on this one I think that in 14.01 where are going to see massive changes to the dash
[19:25] <CrestedNewt> So the question is - who is it that makes that decision for the change?
[19:26] <bobweaver> good question CrestedNewt
[19:26] <tgm4883> jhodapp, most companies don't have the community do all the work
[19:26] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: someone very high up, usually Mark and his immediate management team
[19:26] <jhodapp> tgm4883, true, though most companies don't interface with communities at all
[19:27] <tgm4883> mhall119, mark! That guy isn't even CEO :P
[19:27] <CrestedNewt> jhodapp - I was problem and Change manager, Europe for a large oil company. I know what it is like and transparency is what provided the best solutions
[19:27] <bobweaver> :)
[19:27] <tgm4883> mhall119, jhodapp ok, so how about this. What should bobweaver do.
[19:27] <jhodapp> CrestedNewt, absolutely, I totally believe in transparency
[19:28] <bobweaver> jhodapp,  I have meet with CrestedNewt  and CrestedNewt  dont take this the wrong way but I did check him out his is legit
[19:28] <bobweaver> meaning looking at his past
[19:28] <CrestedNewt> no offence taken - transparency
[19:29] <jhodapp> bobweaver, my transparency or CrestedNewt's?
[19:29] <CrestedNewt> mine :D
[19:29]  * bobweaver is lost lol
[19:29] <tgm4883> bobweaver, you shouldn't be, everything is transparent ;)
[19:29] <mhall119> tgm4883: I'd suggest that bobweaver wait until the 21st and then look at the phone code
[19:29] <jhodapp> bobweaver, nevermind, I just didn't understand your statement
[19:29] <CrestedNewt> lol guys - at least I'm starting to get a smile back on my face
[19:30] <jhodapp> tgm4883, I completely agree
[19:30] <jhodapp> tgm4883, that is the platform going forward
[19:30] <bobweaver> and PHONE CAN NOT RUN NUX
[19:30]  * tgm4883 jots that down
[19:31] <bobweaver> sorry about that caps
[19:31] <tgm4883> mhall119, jhodapp so are we going to meet the 14.04 goal set by Mark?
[19:31] <jhodapp> bobweaver, indeed, it's not Nux based at all
[19:31] <jhodapp> tgm4883, I believe so
[19:31] <bobweaver> I need to look at why my light is not turning on when caps is onn
[19:31] <tgm4883> mhall119, jhodapp or are we going to have to just say that goal was met by Mythbuntu
[19:32] <jhodapp> tgm4883, which goal specifically?
[19:32] <tgm4883> jhodapp, I believe the goal was "ubuntu running on tv's"
[19:32] <tgm4883> jhodapp, it was during the keynote
[19:33] <mhall119> tgm4883: that can mean many things
[19:33] <bobweaver> jhodapp,  mhall119  tgm4883  CrestedNewt  you all are awesome
[19:33] <tgm4883> the whole "ubuntu on tv's tablets phones etc"
[19:33] <mhall119> ubuntu-core, the kernel and foundation stuff, can already run on TVs
[19:33] <mhall119> Unity can too, but it doesn't work well in the desktop configuration
[19:33] <bobweaver> jhodapp,  esp for taking time to talk about this with the community
[19:33] <bobweaver> mhall119,  that is not true
[19:34] <jhodapp> thanks bobweaver, you're great for wanting to help out too and sticking with it
[19:34] <bobweaver> most tv are still amel like same as pi
[19:34] <tgm4883> mhall119, I'd really hope that mark's keynote wasn't meant to be completed via some technicality
[19:34] <bobweaver> which I dont have the hardware so I can not test
[19:34] <mhall119> I'm pretty sure compiz can run on arm
[19:34] <bobweaver> mhall119,  again right tools for right job
[19:35] <bobweaver> hardware acell is not that easy
[19:35] <bobweaver> ask anyone at linaro
[19:35] <mhall119> tgm4883: what Mark intends and what we can acheive are not always the same thing
[19:35] <bobweaver> If canonical plain is to use 3d then let it be
[19:35] <mhall119> bobweaver: I've seen Unity 3d running on Linaro's boards, they used them for the hall-monitors at UDS
[19:35] <bobweaver> yeah and they over heat
[19:36] <bobweaver> and they run slow
[19:36] <mhall119> I didn't say it was great :)
[19:36] <bobweaver> again Not putting it down
[19:36] <bobweaver> what I am trying to say is that there are the right tools or in this case right toolkits for jobs
[19:36] <tgm4883> so this is what I'm going to do. I'm going to continue working on my unity scopes. I'm also going to finish the Mythtv backend quick start guide. I'll do both of those because any work I do on them can be used on the desktop unity
[19:37] <tgm4883> unfortunately, work that bobweaver does isn't the same
[19:37] <bobweaver> if I am going to fix leakey roof I do not want to use a car
[19:37] <bobweaver> though I want a car in my tools it helps me get to the job
[19:37] <bobweaver> but I am not going to drive it up on the roof
[19:38] <bobweaver> it would fail
[19:38] <bobweaver> that would be one big holw
[19:38] <bobweaver> hole
[19:38]  * bobweaver goes to google to look for pics of cars in roofs
[19:38] <CrestedNewt> I was talking to a friend of mine this evening and he said that Texas Instruments have some fantastic A9 boards out there that run 'cool' - he should know about these things as he has an electronics company creating embedded applications for welding and sewage monitoring
[19:39] <bobweaver> http://thewildones.faketrix.com/content/pictures/page-7/large/car-crashes-into-house-roof.jpg
[19:39] <bobweaver> :D
[19:39] <bobweaver> that is not how to fix a roof
[19:40]  * popey is glad he doesn't live there
[19:40] <CrestedNewt> lol
[19:40] <bobweaver> popey,  do you need that person to fix your roof ?
[19:40] <popey> heh
[19:40] <mhall119> even popey doesn't know what' going to happen with Unity
[19:40] <bobweaver> I would not trust tools like that
[19:40] <mhall119> if popey doesn't know, it's not knowable
[19:40] <tgm4883> mhall119, of course not, he'd just blab it on UUPC
[19:40] <popey> hey bobweaver I can only echo what the guys have said. some of the architectural decisions are made by the people involved, and nobody finds out until the decision has been made
[19:41]  * tgm4883 blames popey for being british
[19:41] <popey> some of those processes take w a y too long
[19:41] <popey> pip pip tgm4883 !
[19:41] <CrestedNewt> OI!! I resemble that remark tgm4883
[19:41] <bobweaver> correct popey
[19:41] <mhall119> popey: should have stuck to playing TF2 today :P
[19:41] <popey> and sometimes we screw it up
[19:41] <tgm4883> speaking of british, isn't it tea time?
[19:41] <popey> sometimes we end up making the wrong decision
[19:41] <popey> "we" as in "canonical"
[19:41] <CrestedNewt> yep - my dinner is in the oven and family are waiting for me to finish with this
[19:41] <popey> and have to figure out a way to work forwards without taking 3 steps back
[19:41] <popey> and it's not easy
 "we" as in "the british" FTFY ;)
[19:42] <popey> especially when we have the steady march of releases every 6 months
[19:42] <popey> and a target of 200 million devices by 2014
[19:42] <popey> oh and run ubuntu on everything pls
[19:42] <bobweaver> popey,  would you be willing to meet up with CrestedNewt  in person at the office ?
[19:42] <mhall119> if American TV has taught me anything, it's that someone with a British accent is always right
[19:42] <tgm4883> sorry popey, daviey hasn't been around that much and I've got pent up anti-british remarks to make
[19:42] <popey> bobweaver: not sure that would help anything
[19:42] <popey> tgm4883: i went out for lunch in a real english pub with him recently.
[19:42] <mhall119> or evil
[19:43] <popey> he wore a flat cap and everything
[19:43] <mhall119> or both
[19:43] <popey> he was even in the pub before it opened!
[19:43] <tgm4883> popey, a real english pub?
[19:43] <popey> yes
[19:43] <tgm4883> popey, are there fake ones?
[19:43] <mhall119> popey: but was he out before it closed?
[19:43] <popey> there are
[19:43] <popey> yes, he even bought beer!
[19:43]  * popey falls over
[19:43]  * tgm4883 wonders what a fake english pup entails
[19:43] <popey> no, wait, hang on, I bought it
[19:43] <popey> bah
[19:43] <mhall119> tgm4883: bud light I suspect
[19:44] <tgm4883> mhall119, ah
[19:44] <popey> "Warm, flat and cloudy"
[19:44] <CrestedNewt> popey, if you are ever up my way near Stansted, give me a shout and I'll take you to one or two pubs :D
[19:44] <popey> heh
[19:44] <tgm4883> mhall119, cause 'Merica
[19:44] <mhall119> damn right
[19:44] <mhall119> see, now I'm smiling again, thanks guys
[19:44] <bobweaver> cool well can we al get over the whole Unity 3d thing now ?
[19:44] <popey> I'd say as soon as the code is dropped for Ubuntu phone next week.. we should discuss this further
[19:45] <mhall119> bobweaver: not just yet, but I hope we can someday
[19:45] <bobweaver> that has been the plain for me popey
[19:45] <popey> wise
[19:45] <tgm4883> popey, no, I think we should discuss fake english pubs now!
[19:45] <popey> oh okay.
[19:45] <popey> Opressive yanks..
[19:45] <popey> :þ
[19:45] <CrestedNewt> Sceptic Tanks :D
[19:45] <popey> tgm4883: or are you canadian?
[19:45] <tgm4883> popey, don't make us come spread our freedom to you
[19:45] <bobweaver> mhall119,  what I mean is if you want to tell people to use it on Unity 3d then feel free
[19:45] <tgm4883> popey, 'Merica
[19:45] <popey> daddy no
[19:45] <popey> fsck yeah!
[19:45] <bobweaver> not sure how that would work with peoples thoughts on Ubuntu TV
[19:46] <CrestedNewt> well seeing that I'm married to a longhorn ....
[19:46] <tgm4883> where everything is right, and we use the imperial system
[19:47] <CrestedNewt> OK guys, so nothing is going to happen until the phone OS is out - correct?
[19:47] <popey> Seems like a prudent thing to do
[19:47] <mhall119> CrestedNewt: we're hoping to have some answers about Unity starting then
[19:47] <tgm4883> CrestedNewt, nothing I do matters in regards to what the phone code says
[19:47] <popey> Given that's actually the code which the phone runs.
[19:47] <mhall119> it doesn't necessarily mean we'll *have* more answers then
[19:47] <popey> tgm4883: too many words
[19:48] <popey> "< tgm4883> CrestedNewt, nothing I do matters"
[19:48] <tgm4883> lol
[19:48] <popey> ☺
[19:48] <tgm4883> popey, no, I said I was from 'Merica, not Canada
[19:48] <Jim_Lahey> er everytime well almost every time I take a phone call I lose connection either that Or popey  keeps on kicking me
[19:48] <Jim_Lahey> <<bobweaver
[19:48] <popey> muhahah
[19:48] <popey> no, not me
[19:48] <Jim_Lahey> how to do ghost thing in IRC
[19:48] <tgm4883> popey, you should know that, based on my distinct lack of appologizing for anything
[19:48] <mhall119> popey shuts down all of the things
[19:48] <popey> \o/ shut it down
[19:49] <Jim_Lahey> says that I am on line
[19:49] <mhall119> Jim_Lahey: /msg nickserv ghost bobweaver
[19:49] <tgm4883> Jim_Lahey, upgrade from your 56k modem?
[19:49] <mhall119> Jim_Lahey: I bet you have a cordless phone, don't you?
[19:49] <popey> DECT?
[19:49] <popey> same frequency as wifi innit
[19:49] <popey> guv'nor
[19:50] <CrestedNewt> Wooden DECT :D
[19:50] <tgm4883> popey, so behind the queen and prince william, how many people away are you from the throne?
[19:50] <bobweaver> thansk all
[19:50] <popey> about 8 feet
[19:50] <bobweaver> tgm4883,  wait you are going to give me Money !
[19:50] <CrestedNewt> good job bobweaver - keep the faith!! Will hangout at some stage over the weekend
[19:50] <popey> oh, not that throne
[19:51] <bobweaver> that is great
[19:51] <bobweaver> I love money
[19:51]  * tgm4883 is disturbed that popey hangs out in the royal bathroom
[19:51] <bobweaver> you can send it to care of mr awesome router blah blah blah :)
[19:51] <CrestedNewt> popey IS the royal bathroom
[19:51] <popey> bobweaver: I did tell you to setup an amazon wishlist ☺
[19:51] <popey> (then make it pop up every time someone turns on their TV)
[19:52] <popey> that's what we do, right?
[19:52] <bobweaver> Oh I did I need to post that
[19:52] <bobweaver> :)
[19:52] <bobweaver> it has things like a pony and a castle .. a white one and little burgers on it
[19:53] <CrestedNewt> ok - change of tack here once again.... Oscar Pestorious has pleaded guilty today. His lawyer said that he didn't have a leg to stand on - BOOM BOOM!!
[19:53]  * bobweaver wants white castle in upstate NY
[19:53] <bobweaver> mhall119,  yeah phone is cordless (from thrift store )
[19:54] <mhall119> bobweaver: I bet it uses the same frequency as your wifi
[19:54] <mhall119> I had that issue a while back, took me months to figure it out
[19:54] <bobweaver> yeah I should get a new one like a 1980-70s phone or make one
[19:54] <bobweaver> it happens right after I hang up
[19:55] <bobweaver> mhall119,  was it like that for you also ?
[19:55] <bobweaver> after hangup ?
[19:55] <mhall119> bobweaver: it happened as soon as I picked up the call for me
[19:56] <mhall119> I ended up changing the frequency setting on my AP
[19:56] <bobweaver> also mhall119  do you think that me and you and david plantilla or what ever his name is could sit down and talk apps for phone
[19:56] <bobweaver> and design mainly design part
[19:56] <bobweaver> I have some great ideas that I think could help developers
[19:56] <bobweaver> what i he dpm ?
[19:56] <mhall119> planella
[19:56] <bobweaver> nick that is ^^
[19:57] <mhall119> bobweaver: we've got wiki pages for posting links to designs
[19:57] <mhall119> Kevin Wright is leading the development effort around the core apps
[19:57] <bobweaver> yeah but they keep changeing ever 4 hours !
[19:57] <mhall119> bobweaver: it's open submission, there was never a "chosen" design to change
[19:57] <bobweaver> and if people could use different tools it would make devs life al9ot better
[19:58] <bobweaver> maybe we can talk about that ?
[19:58] <bobweaver> that is what I would like to talk about
[19:58] <mhall119> about the tools?
[19:58] <bobweaver> tieing in developers with designers
[19:58] <bobweaver> making a stream
[19:58] <bobweaver> ideas that I was thinking about
[19:58] <bobweaver> I seen that there is rss right for when it is changed
[19:59] <CrestedNewt> Laters all - gtg have dinner.
[19:59] <mhall119> the stream right now is to use Balsamiq, which lets us host many revisions and give comments to the designer
[19:59] <bobweaver> mhall119,  like if we look at weather app
[19:59] <bobweaver> I started making that 2 days ago
[19:59] <bobweaver> I am getting close to done
[20:00] <bobweaver> but I can not find the design's that I was using before :/
[20:00] <bobweaver> I think that they got changed ?
[20:00] <bobweaver> maybe this is my fault because I did not contact designer
[20:00] <bobweaver> maybe we can make a thing that has button to contact designer
[20:00] <bobweaver> you know to work togeather
[20:00] <mhall119> bobweaver: the Canonical design team just posted some, I added them to the wiki page
[20:01] <bobweaver> Yeah but I dont want to re-design my full app
[20:01] <mhall119> you can browse all the balsamiq ones here: https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/grid
[20:01] <bobweaver> that would be point less
[20:01] <bobweaver> see that means that I just spent 2 days working on something to change the full thing
[20:01] <bobweaver> that is frustating fro devs
[20:01] <bobweaver> I dont care my self
[20:02] <bobweaver> but I cuuld see how someone would walk away after something like that
[20:02] <mhall119> you don't have to change anything, people can use your app how it is if they want to
[20:02] <bobweaver> that is stupid
[20:02] <bobweaver> wrong words
[20:02] <bobweaver> dang keyboard
[20:03] <bobweaver> what I mean is if canonical has and wants community to make apps for phone then there should be things like this person is doing it also work with him
[20:03] <bobweaver> not talking about making my own app
[20:03] <mhall119> bobweaver: we have that here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/CoreApps/Weather
[20:03] <mhall119> add links to your code and screenshots
[20:03] <bobweaver> I want to make Ubuntu Better that makes me better I do not need to make only me better
[20:03] <mhall119> so the other contributors know about it
[20:04] <bobweaver> I need upload right
[20:04] <mhall119> to the wiki?
[20:04] <bobweaver> I have branch want it
[20:04] <mhall119> you should haveit
[20:04] <bobweaver> no to the launchpad team
[20:04] <mhall119> you can push your bzr branch to Launchpad
[20:04] <bobweaver> maybe Not it says I do not have permission
[20:04] <mhall119> bzr push lp:~<your_lp_username>/ubuntu-weather-app/<name_of_your_branch>
[20:04] <bobweaver> or do I need to push to junk and propose medge
[20:05] <mhall119> not to junk, you should use the URL above
[20:05] <bobweaver> cool so like the Ubuntu TV one
[20:05] <bobweaver> << n00b
[20:05] <mhall119> yeah, all Launchpad projects work this way
[20:05] <bobweaver> alright next quetion :
[20:05] <bobweaver> do you know of any copywrite tools for gpl
[20:06] <bobweaver> like that add to the top of each page ?
[20:06] <mhall119> what kind of tools?
[20:06] <mhall119> oh, no, I usually just include a COPYING file in the branch root
[20:06] <bobweaver> it is a pain in the a%% to go into each one and add the canonical branding licence
[20:06] <bobweaver> let me show you a example
[20:07] <bobweaver> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/u2t/dailybuilds/view/head:/shell/common/PictureGlowButton.qml
[20:08] <bobweaver> see how I did that even though I wrote that code
[20:08] <bobweaver> I was just copy and pasteing all files pain the the but
[20:08] <bobweaver> I was going to make sed script but did not know if tools are out there
[20:08] <bobweaver> Or if that is the prefereed way that canonical likes to see things
[20:08] <mhall119> there might be, it's likely even, but I don't know of any
[20:09] <bobweaver> I mean if it is a Core app then I should include canonicals name in file
[20:09] <bobweaver> << lost
[20:09] <mhall119> if there's a preferred way, it would be what Debian prefers
[20:09] <mhall119> no, if it's not Canonical's code, it's not copyrighted to us
[20:09] <bobweaver> ok
[20:10] <mhall119> Copyright attribution should be to the author or originating organization
[20:10] <mhall119> we don't require copyright assignment for the core apps either, just a broad license
[20:10] <mhall119> see http://www.canonical.com/contributors
[20:11] <bobweaver> thanks
[20:11] <mhall119> np
[20:11] <bobweaver> I will ask question about putting in "header " in motu maybe there is thing
[20:11] <bobweaver> I did not know about "wrapandsort" before I asked
[20:17] <bobweaver> mhall119,  ok I am looking at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/CoreApps/Weather   and it changed again
[20:19] <mhall119> what changed?
[20:20] <bobweaver> The whole thing
[20:20] <bobweaver> there was no pictures like that and there is alot more info
[20:21] <bobweaver> I just sent mika a pm  asking him for that artwork
[20:21] <bobweaver> piece by piece if he has them
[20:22] <mhall119> that's what the design team just released
[20:22] <mhall119> there's no more information other than the images
[20:22] <bobweaver> the api stuff
[20:22] <bobweaver> That looks new also
[20:22] <bobweaver> could be wrong
[20:22] <bobweaver> but I have backend done
[20:23] <bobweaver> op mika is pming me back
 hey, you're searching for a different mika :)
[20:24] <mhall119> heh
[20:24] <bobweaver> email then unless you all know how to get a hold of him popey  mhall119   ?
[20:24] <mhall119> 8:30pm on a Friday? email's your best option
[20:29] <bobweaver> that suxx


[00:21] <orospakr> hey, can I ask juju to shrink the number of machines if they are not being used as any service units?
[00:21] <orospakr> or do I just have to manually use destroy-machine?
[00:40] <sidnei> orospakr: you have to do it manually
[00:40] <orospakr> fair enough.
[00:41] <orospakr> tx. :)
[00:45] <marcoceppi> orospakr: terminate-machine for reference :) Juju will try to make sure it saves your data as best as possible!
[00:45] <orospakr> iirc terminate-machine and destroy-machine are aliases?
[01:09] <sidnei> stub: https://bugs.launchpad.net/charms/+source/postgresql/+bug/1172086 when you get around
[01:09] <_mup_> Bug #1172086: Database creation fails with syntax error <postgresql (Juju Charms Collection):New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1172086>
[01:17] <stub> Indentation wars are starting
[01:26] <sidnei> he
[01:26] <sidnei> some of it i could have left alone but flake8 is really picky
[01:32] <sidnei> i see that in create_user it uses  action.append('"{}"'.format(user))
[01:33] <sidnei> but maybe the right way to do it is to sanitize the database name like the username is sanitized
[01:43] <sidnei> stub: any suggestion?
[01:44] <stub> sidnei: just added comments
[01:46] <stub> sidnei: I've linked code to do the quoting correctly. Sanitizing is good too, because if we create things like databases or roles with names requiring the quotes it causes headaches
[01:46] <sidnei> great, thanks!
[01:47] <stub> Because nobody ever remembers to add the quotes, and you are left scratching your head because the tablename is in mixed case and without the quotes it gets munged by the SQL parser
[01:48] <stub> CREATE TABLE "Foo" (a text); SELECT * FROM Foo; -- Fail
[01:52] <stub> sidnei: I'm torn. I'd normally recommend sanitizing the database name to avoid the quoting foot gun. Even if you write good code that always quotes the identifiers correctly, not every tool you might want to use is good code.
[01:53] <stub> sidnei: But that creates namespace issues, and annoys people who want to shoot themselves in the foot.
[01:56] <sidnei> in the specific case (-joined hook) where the database name comes from the service name, i believe it makes sense to sanitize
[01:57] <sidnei> not sure if it should be also sanitized in the -changed hook for consistency or left alone for the shoot-themselves-in-the-foot crowd
[01:59] <sidnei> also, can't decide if im annoyed that "SELECT datname FROM pg_database WHERE datname = %s" doesn't complain about the single quote
[02:02] <mwhudson> sidnei: you do know the difference between single and double quotes in sql, right?
[02:02] <sidnei> is it the same difference as in shell scripts? *wink*
[02:02] <mwhudson> no :)
[02:02] <mwhudson> single quotes are string literals
[02:03] <mwhudson> double quotes are for identifiers
[02:04] <sidnei> the distinction is a bit blurry, i guess. but it makes more sense now.
[02:21] <sidnei> stub: in the create role, does the password need to be quoted too?
[02:23] <stub> sidnei: The password is not an SQL identifier, just a string, so needs standard single quoting
[02:23] <stub> sidnei: yay SQL standards committee
[02:24] <sidnei> stub: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5597272/
[02:24] <stub> I'm sure there is a reason. Maybe parser implementation. Maybe LSD.
[02:26] <stub> sidnei: that looks fine
[02:28] <stub> I should submit quote_identifier to psycopg2 to add as an extension
[02:31] <sidnei> progress. and fail. and progress and fail. http://paste.ubuntu.com/5597289/
[02:33] <stub> yay. guess the publication of the names needs to be moved then.
[02:34] <stub> Or dump AsIs and do the interpolation yourself, safe with quote_identifier.
[02:35] <sidnei> stub: is that related to the error above? if so im confused ;)
[02:35] <stub> There is so much of this sort of cruft... branches get scope creep.
[02:36] <stub> sidnei: Yes. I suspect you will find we are now calling 'relation-set user="foo"' instead of 'relation-set user=foo'
[02:36] <stub> Assuming it was working before this change ;)
[02:37] <sidnei> stub: nope, im using quote_identifier inside create_user(), so it doesn't leak the quoting outside to db_relation_joined_changed which is what calls relation-set
[02:38] <stub> mmm...
[02:38] <sidnei> stub: the error here is that relation-get didn't return a user for a relation
[02:38] <stub> There might be race conditions in the hook logic still
[02:38] <sidnei> maybe because it wasn't flushed yet, or something
[02:38] <stub> one end trying to get the username before the remote end set it. Needs a guard.
[02:39] <sidnei> something like that yes
[02:39] <stub> My functional tests are on hold until I'm back from leave.
[02:39] <sidnei> but also, we just created the user above, why not pass it to generate_postgresql_hba directly instead of getting it from relation-get?
[02:42] <stub> sidnei: Probably no reason at all
[02:43] <stub> sidnei: except I've been trying to limit my diff sizes - too tempting to just rewrite the whole thing in one hit.
[02:44] <sidnei> i'll hack it until it works (tm) then let's see about splitting this diff
[02:44] <stub> sidnei: I've been promising myself to just make minimal changes until I've got some sort of test harness
[02:46] <stub> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~stub/charms/precise/postgresql/tests/view/head:/test.py
[02:47] <sidnei> stub: ah, nice. i'll see about adding some unit-y tests instead.
[03:12] <mwhudson> hm
[03:13] <mwhudson> juju bootstrap (pointed at a maas install) fails with "error: no tools available"
[03:13] <mwhudson> any ideas?
[03:17] <sidnei> mwhudson: being really nosy, i saw mention of using --upload-tools to fix that
[03:18] <sidnei> no idea if it actually fixes the problem
[03:18] <mwhudson> hm
[03:18] <mwhudson> sidnei: thanks, that just gets me stuff like
[03:18] <mwhudson> 2013/04/24 04:18:39 ERROR command failed: build command "go" failed: exit status 1; can't load package: package launchpad.net/juju-core/cmd/jujud: import "launchpad.net/juju-core/cmd/jujud": cannot find package
[03:19] <mwhudson> do i need to go install a bunch of things?
[03:19] <mwhudson> or whatever the command is
[03:19] <sidnei> sorry, haven't got to that part yet.
[03:19] <mwhudson> "Ahh, yes, --upload-tools is a developer flag, it won't work unless you have built juju from source."
[03:20] <mwhudson> i guess i'm going to give up on this until some more devs are around
[07:11] <AskUbuntu> juju with openstack on precise | http://askubuntu.com/q/284846
[11:45] <marcoceppi> jcastro: the first of the gojuju related problems are coming in to AU now
[12:55] <jcastro> excellent. :)
[13:23] <orospakr> how do I ask juju debug-log to give me more lines of tail?
[13:23] <orospakr> (I'm running -core, if that matters)
[13:50] <jcastro> hey mgz
[13:54] <mgz> hey jcastro
[13:55] <jcastro> hey so for the packages
[13:55] <jcastro> can you explain how that will work?
[13:55] <jcastro> like, apt-get install juju does both python and go with an alternative or what?
[13:58] <mgz> apt-get install juju will install python juju
[13:59] <mgz> but, you can install juju-core, and that also provides the juju binaries and so on
[13:59] <mgz> so, if you just install that, go juju is what you get when you run juju
[14:00] <mgz> install both and you can pick which you want under the juju name with alternatives, or run under the juju-0.7 and juju-core names
[14:03] <jamespage> mgz, gah :
[14:03] <jamespage> src/launchpad.net$ find . -size +1000
[14:03] <jamespage> ./juju-core/cmd/juju/juju
[14:05] <jamespage> 9.8MB
[14:05] <jamespage> ooops
[14:05] <mgz> this is.. not unusual
[14:05] <mgz> yeah, it's painful
[14:05] <mgz> but at least it's only *one* 10MB binary rather than three these days
[14:06] <jamespage> mgz, yep - can we get that cut from the tar.gz please
[14:06] <mgz> wait, the binary is *in* the tar?
[14:06] <mgz> gah
[14:07] <mgz> okay, I'll start from scratch on that, also omitting the junk we don't need
[14:07] <mgz> but could really do with some confirmation on exactly what we're trying to ship from someone else
[14:08] <mgz> fwereade: we don't need lbox for juju-core, right?
[14:08] <fwereade> mgz, we shouldn't no
[14:08] <jamespage> great - that solves one problem!
[14:10] <mgz> we do need, from code.google.com/p/go.net and mgo from labix.org
[14:10] <mgz> then of...
[14:10] <mgz> go/src/launchpad.net/:
[14:10] <mgz> gnuflag  gocheck   gomaasapi  goyaml	 lbox  tomb
[14:10] <mgz> goamz	 goetveld  goose      juju-core  lpad
[14:11] <mgz> we want everything but lpad and lbox?
[14:12] <mgz> ...and not goetveld
[14:14] <marcoceppi> I've got some jitsu questions
[14:15] <marcoceppi> Can jitsu watch for a machine-state in addition to agent-state?
[14:16] <jcastro> mgz: seen this before? http://askubuntu.com/questions/284846/juju-doesnt-bootstrap-due-to-error-command-failed-no-tools-available-error
[14:18] <m_3> marcoceppi: don't remember, but `jitsu watch -h` is pretty verbose
[14:19] <marcoceppi> m_3: yeah, doesn't appear so
[14:20] <fwereade> jcastro, that indicates that we need to upload the new tools to the juju-dist bucket
[14:21] <fwereade> mgz, AIUI you have the keys necessary to do so?
[14:22] <jcastro> fwereade: ok
[14:23] <ahasenack> jcastro: that was happening to me too a few times this week, they said it was "broken on purpose until the right fix lands"
[14:23] <fwereade> mgz, pretty sure that's correct -- if you want to be really really sure move your src out of the way and go get juju-core into a fresh src/ again ;)
[14:23] <jcastro> ahasenack: so if we redeploy over and over will it eventually work?
[14:24] <jcastro> also does anyone have a bug report handy?
[14:24] <mgz> I do, when we have something built (I could upload from the ppa for now... but would prefer not to)
[14:24] <fwereade> mgz, ah, what's the problem with the ppa?
[14:24] <fwereade> mgz, just not the same in actuality even if it is in theory?
[14:25] <jcastro> this guy would be using juju from the PPA no?
[14:27] <ahasenack> jcastro: I don't know, I haven't tried today
[14:31] <mgz> fwereade: no problem, just doing the stuff we need for the archive has to happen like, now
[14:31] <fwereade> mgz, ah, ok: yes, I agree that it takes precedence
[14:34] <jcastro> fwereade: ok so I can just tell the guy to sit tight for a bit until we sort ourselves?
[14:35] <fwereade> jcastro, I'm afraid that's the best we can do right now
[14:35] <jcastro> no worries, I prefer to tell people to wait than be silent, heh.
[14:39] <jcastro> man, I wasn't expecting people to be playing with juju on openstack so soon after ODS.
[14:46] <jcastro> arosales: ok so there's no way to record a meeting from the G+ URL in the calendar invite
[14:46] <jcastro> so I am going to try launching the hangout early and updating the link on the invitation
[14:46] <jcastro> if that ends up not working I'll ask you to send everyone from the hangout to the new URL so we can record the charm meeting
[14:59] <arosales> jcastro, I looked at this last week.
[14:59] <arosales> jcastro, what the person launching the G+ has to "check box" hangout on air
[14:59] <arosales> jcastro, from I can see that can't be done via google cal invite
[15:00] <arosales> jcastro, what you can do is fire up a indiv hangout, check box on air, and then capture the embedded link
[15:00] <arosales> jcastro, only question if that persists week to week
[15:01] <jcastro> right
[15:02] <jcastro> I think what I will do is fire it up early, and see if I can replace the existing link in the invite with the new one
[15:02] <jcastro> so people get the updated URL in the invite
[15:18] <marcoceppi> jcastro: I wonder if you can find a URL variable that you can overload the hangout link to force it to be on-air
[15:20] <arosales> jcastro, sounds good lets see if it works.  I am sure it will work this week, I am just not sure if it will persist week-to-week. But good experiment to find out.
[15:21] <jcastro> nod
[15:50] <jcastro> OK everyone
[15:51] <jcastro> here's the hangout URL for the charm call in 10 minutes:
[15:51] <jcastro> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/ca6e8841c9aed5e51daf941607b9613f93bd0261?authuser=0&hl=en
[15:54] <jamespage> jcastro, charmers hangout?
[15:54] <jcastro> weekly call
[15:55] <jcastro> we're just recording them now so we can make them public, etc.
[15:58] <marcoceppi> jcastro: may be a few mins late. About to reboot
[15:58] <jcastro> no worries
[16:18] <m_3> arosales: how do you get that banner on the bottom
[16:18] <m_3> it's perdy
[16:18] <marcoceppi> m_3: "hangout tools" on the left
[16:18] <arosales> m_3, add the hangout tool box
[16:19] <arosales> m_3, http://pad.ubuntu.com/Q01gbDLLfh
[16:20] <arosales> m_3, ubuntu orange is able.virginmedia.com) has joined #juju
[16:20] <arosales> * eschnou has quit (Quit: Leaving)
[16:20] <arosales> wrong paste
[16:20] <arosales> dd4814 is the ubuntu orange
[16:21] <arosales> m_3, http://newraycom.com/how-to-set-up-google-hangout-lower-third/
[16:21] <m_3> arosales: thanks
[16:21] <arosales> sorry about my clipboard buffer being defunc
[16:37] <jcastro> aha
[16:38] <jcastro> arosales: for next time I'll add a pad.u.c to the invite, so we don't split brain again
[16:38] <arosales> jcastro, ok thanks. Sorry for not thinking of that earlier
[16:39] <jcastro> it's ok, first one's always rough
[16:39] <jcastro> or second
[16:39] <jcastro> or third. :)
[16:40] <marcoceppi> jcastro: FYI for the notes: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Precise/view/Precise%20Charms/
[16:43] <jcastro> got it!
[16:45] <marcoceppi> it takes about 3 years to load, but it has all the tests so far
[16:47] <m_3> marcoceppi: we might need to get james or somebody to create other/better views in there
[16:47] <marcoceppi> m_3: yeah, there is a Charms view, but it doesn't have openstack
[16:54] <m_3> marcoceppi: those're custom views... created by somebody with auth into j.q.u.c
[16:54]  * m_3 doesn't know how to do it
[19:30] <imsplitbit> I wonder if anyone here has experience connecting juju with rackspace cloud
[19:31] <imsplitbit> https://juju.ubuntu.com/get-started/rackspace/
[19:31] <imsplitbit> if you look there it says "heres an example configuration..." but theres no example :-)
[19:32] <imsplitbit> I tried using the openstack_s3 provider as some google searches said to do but it fails because the api returns a 404 for os-security-groups
[19:32] <imsplitbit> not sure if thats a bug or if there's some special things you need to do with rackspace to make it all go
[20:07] <marcoceppi> imsplitbit: rackspace provider does not work as they have a non standard open stack. they're changing this soon which will fox this problem in juju
[20:08] <marcoceppi> not sure an eta... jcastro ?
[20:13] <rshade98> I keep getting no matching tools on amazon.
[20:13] <rshade98> Is there a package I need to upload to s3
[20:17] <jcastro> they said "soon" and wouldn't really commit to anything
[20:25] <marcoceppi> rshade98: see this: http://askubuntu.com/q/284846/41
[20:28] <rshade98> oh, haha, sorry for the ask guys, I saw this, just didn't realize it was 5 hours ago
[20:30] <marcoceppi> rshade98: NP, still a bit of a new issue :)
[20:38] <jcastro> rshade98: that's inprogress
[20:38] <jcastro> the fix for that
[20:38] <jcastro> mgz: you still around doing distro things or will we likely see this fix tomorrowish?
[20:43] <rshade98> thanks guys
[20:50] <mgz> I'll sort it out tonight
[20:50] <mgz> jcastro: ^
[20:51] <jcastro> <3 thanks dude
[21:03] <mgz> okay, tools in the ec2 public bucket for the ppa
[21:03] <mgz> I don't have credentials for any of the other ones
[21:04] <mgz> also need to do a release announcement...
[21:04] <mgz> well, four release announcements now
[21:09] <jcastro> heh
[21:09] <jcastro> rshade98: wanna give it a shot now?
[21:25] <rshade98> looks good
[21:26] <jcastro> ok so it worked?


[00:29] <tgBot> Ion S was added by: Ion S
[00:29] <tgBot> <Ion S> hi!
 Hi there!
 I’ve got a question, is it possible we could see Ubuntu Touch OS on any of the Blackberry 10 devices ? Like the passport?
 @onajjar, did they publish the device tree for those?
 need kernel + drivers and firmware blobs to be able to do a port
 @Hunter616, mx4??
 i am running ubports on mx4, not canonical image, very nice, and flashed with the gui ubports installer
 other than that i still hv an old stock image for that phone
 @Ion S, Hello Ion and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
[06:30] <tgBot> <Big ET> Hei, about the push server, I am using also gmail on my UT the pushing is working for now, do you guys know what we need to ask google for to have push moved to the ubport push server?
 @Big ET, This is a question for @Flohack /Florian, i am PM him this way to not get lost your question
 @Big ET, I dont think Google is pushing these messages, that must be a local daemon polling from gmail and generating a local notifiction
[08:27] <tgBot> okaantara was added by: okaantara
 Hello @okaantara and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 Also, you might be overwhelmed by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @UBports_News
 I Guys, why do I get decryption error in loquilm?
[09:16] <tgBot> Marc was added by: Marc
 Hello Marc and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 Also, you might be overwhelmed by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @UBports_News
 Also hi here
 @Rawcode, Do you use WhatsApp in another device with SIM card? If so that is the problem.
 Nope, I've installed whatsapp in my tablet, but this morning I've  installed loquilm in my phone
 The best would be to ask at OpenStore, but I remember there or in Spanish group they said to get loquim working you have to cancel, delete the account on the other devices. Not UT problem, but WhatsApp rules.
 Understand
 Thanks
 here is the link to loqui.im group: https://telegram.me/joinchat/BlpqfQk1L0l0PJTnM02yxQ
 Thanks :)
 @milkor73, Is it enough to uninstall the app?
 Ok
 I will try to ask at spanish group
 @Rawcode, so the answear: in accordance to MD / @malditobastardo you have to disable the SIM conected to the Whatsapp on your tablet and enable it on your N5 with UT, you have to keep the SIM in your N5. Nevertheless it become very often crazy, especially when connected to mobile internet LTE, 3G. Another solutions is the web app Whatsapp, I remember @samzn  was trying to develop more user friendly design for it. and do not forget, if some of your
[12:28] <tgBot> friends want to send you PM he cand find you on Telegram!!! 😉
 @Flohack, Indeed, they are not push. Neither is Twitter. Only telegram is push.
[13:02] <tgBot> <Mario Grasso> (Voice, 499s)https://irc.ubports.com/dK3JvuVS/file_2819
 @Mario Grasso, what's going on
 I think this is a modern pocket dial? ;)
[13:04] <tgBot> <Mario Grasso> @neothethird, Sorry, i pushed the button without any intention
 lol
[13:05] <tgBot> <Mario Grasso> (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/IkSK9ICi/file_2820
 @Mario Grasso, haha, ok, at least we got an interesting insight to your life
 @wayneoutthere, We need a new term for this.... "I pocket messaged you"?
 I pocket Telegrammed you?
 I pocketed you
 hahaha
 nice!
 done. it's law.  ship it
 @Flohack, this allows for all future pocket fails
 hehe
 Sorry I clicked on a wrong blue text
 i wrote a small shell script to replace you, stored it on a flash, and pocketed you
[14:06] <tgBot> Yu Owen was added by: Yu Owen
 @Yu Owen, Hi Yu and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and subscribe to the news feed by clicking this: https://t.me/ubports_news Thanks again for joining us! :)
[15:37] <tgBot> Miguel Gutiérrez was added by: Miguel Gutiérrez
 Hello Miguel and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 Also, you might be overwhelmed by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @UBports_News
 is there anyway to dual boot buntu touch?
 @XavierXX, I don't think so, it is at least not designed to do so. It might very well be possible with the right modification, but I bet there is no one in this community who could now say "Yes, I know what you have to do to make this" — no even starting on what unexpected problems might arise from this
 How different is the file structure?
 @XavierXX, I think the issue is rather with the absence of a typical BIOS as on computers, so you need a very different approach to just get some basic functions working in parallel
 i think EFIDroid may be a sollution then?
 Help with using a multiboot is welcome
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/zZ81CWrZ/file_2822.jpg
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/Bilv0B8k/file_2824.jpg
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/veXr0Tgi/file_2826.jpg
 EFIdroid
 what exactly does Ubuntu touch change?
 it also allows seperate recoveries  between roms
 so would it maybe be a good idea for the ubuntu touch devs to get in touch with the developer of EFIdroid?
 what device do you have? you can try MultiROM
 I tried multirom multiple times in the past and i always got the same result unfortunately
 and a oneplus one
 I don't have oneplus one but MultiROM has been working on my Nexus 7 and Nexus 5
 there's a modified apk of MultiROM that uses UBPorts
 for anyone who's intrested this is the slack link to EFIdroid; efidroid.slack.com
 @bhdouglass …  i have installed  … https://docs.ubports.com/en/latest/appdev/clickable/setup.html and run it with these result: … "cannot stat '/home/dreamland/ut-app-template/build/app.bhdouglass_1.0_armhf.click': No such file or directory … Command 'adb push /home/dreamland/ut-app-template/build/app.bhdouglass_1.0_armhf.click /home/phablet/' returned non-zero exit status 1" … What can i do? Thx.
 @wilder_Hund, Can you send me your clickable.json and manifest.json?
 done
 @samzn What about the process of your WhatsApp implementation? Can we help?
 I used to inject custom js and css code into the webapp since whatsapp is disgustingly proprietary
 But it's obsfucrated and it doesn`t work anymore
 it would be awsome if the ubports installer would regocnize the special efidroid fastboot mode as that would enable easy installation in a seperate partition
 or is there any manual installation method available?
 @samzn Ah, okay! Thanks anyway for your attempts!
 Seriously, screw whatsapp
 It's ridiculous how much dependency people have on it
 A lot of people would use ubuntu & sfos if it had this simple shitty chat app
 why  it's shitty why don't they just use IRC
 whatsapp is proprietary and they ban unofficial clients, and the people using them
 @XavierXX, Peer pressure, plus accessibility
 still IRC you cann verify as secure and you can controll the server yourself
 @samzn, maybe we need to consider voting whatsapp in or out of the UBports community once and for all.  that would make a fun event!  It seems like it's a waste of time.  A better use of time would be Anbox which would make this and other fake robot apps work for those people who like robots.   … But seriously - if all the developers in this group stopped and focused on getting Anbox working... we can end these discussions until Umatriks anh
[21:22] <tgBot> them all. … Am I wrong?
 @XavierXX, IRC?  I have been forbidden to speak on this topic ;)
 @wayneoutthere, I wouldn't waste time on anbox either. It's just going to be a tremendous amount of headache, for very little gain.
 (Sticker, 357x512) https://irc.ubports.com/UM3RY5qf/file_2827
 @dohbee, how so? if it works it makes all android apps work...
 because android and ubuntu security models don't match
 and at that point, why wouldn't i just run lineageos instead of ubuntu?
 @wayneoutthere, Well, not really, we also need a libre implementation of Google Play Services as I doubt those are allowed in an emulator like that. Also in development though but still
 ubuntu won't buy anything if you get rid of the security
 well the idea is a 'stop-gap' solution until something like Umatriks is rocking and rolling
 if someone wants UT and can run anbox in a sandbox (neat) then... seems like it solves some things for many people and gets these conersations about 'apps' out of the way.
 if you think making android apps work on ubuntu is easier than making a matrix client work, something is seriously wrong :)
 @wayneoutthere / dear Wayne, it is just as you and Joe have always stressed in your audiocasts: Whatsapp is not in any line with Ubuntu Touch philosophy. From my point of view It is Whatsapp that has to accept first the right and proper for users secure communication standards, otherwise will never gain the invitation from any current or future secure and safety looking for ecosystem.
 i have a question now why is porting whatsapp even considered?
 it's not open source, so nobody here can "port" it
 @milkor73, The puzzling thin is that WhatsApp security is rated higher than Telegram and compared to Signal e.g. its not so bad ^^ - WhatsApp is more or less secure, except for the Metadata which belongs to FB
 people can write unofficial clients that will get blocked and result in the users getting banned, but that's not at all helpful
 @Flohack, i don't think that's very puzzling. but it's not open source, so really shouldn't matter too much :)
 the only reason anybody ever talks about whatsapp is because it's what everyone uses in certain parts of the world, to communicate
 if everyone used signal instead, we'd already have an awesome app on ubuntu for it
 @Flohack, I know that, but the code is closed, so we do not know what is going on under the hood. Than it is all irrelevant.
 You either surrender to Facebook/WhatsApp or you don't. Peer pressure exerts their monopoly of communications. I can explain my position on it, using only one finger
 @wayneoutthere, Out +1
 @milkor73, well, do you know whats going on under the hood of telegrams servers?
 evil
 that's why i really support matrix :)
 @mariogrip, That is very correct point, but we know you are working, in your personnel time, on uMatriks!!! 🙂
 @dohbee, I rest my case. :P
 the only secure messaging is to not talk to anyone
 @dohbee, 🙈 that's no messaging
 :))
 Technically secure
 null encryption is also the most secure
 No one can read your messages if there aren't any
 replace all data with 0s
[22:23] <prasket> Has anyone gotten ubports installed on a nexus 7?
 @dohbee, Hope this will not lead to silence messages here now 🙃
 @dohbee, I agree to Rodneys point of view, in theoretical computer science these are edge cases you need to define stuff ^
 @prasket, Which one?
[22:23] <prasket> 2013
 which one :)
 There are two
 though either should work i think
 @Stereofont, lol +1
 @Flohack, the only secure encryption is one which cannot be decrypted
[22:25] <prasket> the nexus 7 2013 wifi only model is the one I have and looking to install ubports or anything that isnt android :)
 iirc 2012 version is not very well supported. 2013 wifi is nice.
 @dohbee, I don't believe this exists... or ever will exist.
 @prasket, The installer should work for you.
 @Crash_Burn, save all your data to /dev/null
 @Crash_Burn, It... It's a joke, will.
 @LarreaMikel, 2012 model is not supported at all
 Not really... its a pipe dream.  Its about managing expectations
 Encryption that can't be decrypted is useless. :P
 Every system is hackable.. .as the head of the fbi once said... I computer burried, 200 feet down in concrete... and I still doubt it is secure.
 @UniversalSuperBox, not at all.
 Encryption that can't be decrypted is useful for passwords
 You encrypt because you want the message you're encrypting, but you want to make sure that only the people who you want can read it
 @UniversalSuperBox, its not exactly... I can define a use case.
 @UniversalSuperBox, no. one-way encryption is how you secure data such that it can only be known if it is already known (ie, your password)
 I get the joke... and am dragging this conversation out ;P
 destroy physical copies (well, except for your neurons of course, but destroying those is kind of painful)
 But you can kinda decrypt it with brute force
 well, guessing the password with brute force isn't decrypting
[22:30] <tgBot> Antonio Izquierdo Álvarez was added by: Antonio Izquierdo Álvarez
 But at the end you get the password
 And thats the point
 @Antonio Izquierdo Álvarez, \o/
[22:30] <tgBot> <Antonio Izquierdo Álvarez> XD
 New member party dance!
 @Jonasz, But you don't get the method for the next password …
 🕺
 right, guessing one password doesn't grant you all passwords
 which is what decryption would do
[22:31] <tgBot> <Antonio Izquierdo Álvarez> 🕺
 @Antonio Izquierdo Álvarez, Hello Antiono of the very cool name and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 Hello Antonio and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :) … Note also that there is an important news feed which condenses the 'many words' here into notable news chunks:  click this to subscribe to that channel: https://t.me/ubports_news
 Aha, I see. Brain fart on my side.
 I forgot what a hash is. -_-
 I heard that quantum computers will make brute forces extremely easy. I don't know why tho
 @Jonasz, 👍
 I don't know if there's anyone here who could explain it
 42?
 yes
 Would it be possible to port UT on quantum smart phone @mariogrip ?
 @UniversalSuperBox, There was something about them having more nodes than there are muons in 30 universes. If so, that would definitely explain it
 because quantum computers don't operate on binary
[22:39] <tgBot> Smartman_ru was added by: Smartman_ru
 @milkor73, Not until at least April…
 @Smartman_ru, Hello Smartman and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 @Stereofont, Not good but OK
 Is it more difficult than porting to mediatek?
 @Jonasz, all the bits are always both on and off
 @Jonasz, 😱
 @Smartman_ru, Welcome smartman... since you have joined us I will credit you with being smart
 @dohbee, But you don't know which
 if you want to wrack your brain for a while: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qubit
 @wayneoutthere, Ty :)
 I read it but I just don't get it why is it so much faster than normal computers
 @Jonasz, Not universally faster, as I understand it. Faster at some things though
 @Jonasz, For the same reason 64-bit is faster than 32-bit is faster than 16-bit etc…
 Except now you throw in Schrödinger's cat
 except a 64-bit number can only be one value, while a 64-qubit number is 2^64 values
 @Jonasz, Its not linear... it finds all the solutions in parallel.  Looking for solution that fit best.  (I think)... Its like a dream state of waves... it will be awsome when we are all using water as our computational array.
 it will be awesome when you don't need to have a quantum computer at near absolute 0 to be remotely useful :)
[23:04] <prasket> OK installer did see the Nexus 7 and tried to install. Ended up in an Ubuntu screen saying “This phone needs restoring from a PC or service center”  :( going to try reinstalling stock OS and try again
 @prasket, OEM unlocked and USB debugging?
[23:09] <prasket> Yes
[23:09] <tgBot> Ricardo was added by: Ricardo
 @Ricardo, Hello Ricardo and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    … To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
 help, I have restarted the phone and I have everything in English that can be due?
 @Ricardo, Which phone and which OS?
 Open system settings and go to language and text. Choose display language
 This Spanish post (Spain)
 Choose Spanish in the language list
 I'm on the r12
 https://t.me/UBPorts_ES
 There is an icon for Settings
 Open that to find languages
 nobody answers me, that's why I put it in this
 There is a pull down list
 No problem
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/FwIDo1lx/file_2829.png
 the system settings page has been put to me in Spanish and after a while it has been only in English
 Look on the screenshot. At the top is a globe symbol. That is a menu
 (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/y0NabKol/file_2831.jpg
 (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/Y8F01Lvj/file_2833.jpg
 (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/R3lrWFpY/file_2835.jpg
 (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/SjrHHULa/file_2837.jpg
 @Stereofont, I've been looking for the keyboard vibration toggle switch!  Yay :)
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/lyMj2rMg/file_2838
 System settings third line down. Language and Text
 (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/VHdmicJG/file_2840.jpg
 Ahah
 it's all in English, up to the applications
 You are on rc channel?
 yes
 r12
 Try go to development channel then return to rc?
 I flashed it from the terminal and it keeps coming out in English
 ok
 Do it in system updates
 Interesting to see if it persists in development channel
 I'm on it
 En and Es are close. So I wonder …
 This is a new one for me... curious.
 Typo in compiling?
 I'm always in english, so not surprising ;P
 Also try Italian and see if that works
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/0ZuEhg9L/file_2841.png
 Wrong screenshot. Anyway, my tablet is now Italian
 Needed a restart, which is triggered by a popup
 @Stereofont, Lionelb offre il miglior supporto!
 😂😎
 Vi vedo troppo intraprendenti qua! :P
 salve brav'uomo 😆
 andiamo extra chilometro 😎
 tre italiani 😆
[23:55] <tgBot> <Antonio Izquierdo Álvarez> Hello, anyone knows how to install 16.04 for the OP3? … I'm new in this little Ubuntu's world, I have seen the page in the UBports but the links doesn't work 🙃, please help me to be part of UBports
 @Antonio Izquierdo Álvarez, Don't!
 16.04 based Ubuntu Touch is experimental. Lots of stuff will fail and crash
 @Stereofont, Sounds like something broke translation rather. Check app log.
 Unless you are a developer …
 I've gone to the developen channel and it's still in English. Then I've put the rc channel and it's still in English. I'll format it again.
[23:59] <tgBot> <Antonio Izquierdo Álvarez> @Stereofont, Yeah, I'm used to it
 Not a bug in the revision then. Something you have done in terminal