[00:18] <wgrant> wallyworld: Hmm, you left the testtools addition in when you merged?
[00:18] <wallyworld> wgrant: yes. bin/test failed to run properly without it
[00:19] <wallyworld> wgrant: atm i'm waiting on launchpadlib to build so i can run the upload script
[00:19] <wgrant> Great.
[00:49] <bac> wgrant: can you connect to anything coming out of the data center?  it is dead to me.
[00:51] <bac> spm: ^^
[00:51] <wgrant> bac: WFM
[00:51] <spm> wfm, what does mtr stay?
[00:51] <wgrant> Terribly slow.
[00:51] <wgrant> Like 600ms.
[00:51] <wgrant> Hm. Lots of that is within Optus, though.
[00:51] <wgrant> So it's fine.
[00:51] <bac> lp.net, irc.c.com, imap -- all ead
[00:51] <spm> seems about the same for me. you're on optus tho = so cause and effect
[00:51] <bac> dead
[00:51] <bac> wgrant: wfm?
[00:52] <wgrant> bac: Works for me.
[00:52] <spm> yeah. same for me. 330ms
[00:52] <bac> ok.  so perhaps it is just the transatlantic pipe
[00:52] <wgrant> Back down to 320ms now.
[00:52] <spm> bac: we go via the USA, fwiw.
[00:52] <wgrant> bac: Well, except that my route is via the US (L3)
[00:52] <bac> even better, perhaps just my isp
[00:52] <spm> sydney -> lax ->
[00:53] <spm> wgrant: tho interestingly, I'm staying internode routers right thru to london. curious.
[00:54] <spm> 9. gi0-0-1.bdr1.lon1.internode.on.net
[00:54] <wgrant> I didn't know they had their own routers there.
[00:54] <spm> neither did I. must be a new thing. might ping Mark and ask.
[00:54] <wgrant> That's pretty nice.
[00:56] <spm> I stick iwth internode for many reasons; knowing their router god, who's a damn nice guy; is but one of them :-)
[00:56] <bac> i can only get as far as atlanta before traceroute shows it dying.  best to call it a day then.
[00:57] <spm> maybe atlanta has been nuked?
[01:00] <lifeless> wheee, I can see why https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/cve/2010-4080/+index was having trouble rendering
[01:01] <wgrant> spm: I've wanted to switch to Internode for a long time, but DSL here is bad :/
[01:01] <wgrant> lifeless: Uh, yeah.
[01:01] <lifeless> 12 pages
[01:01] <spm> wgrant: NBN will fix it
[01:01] <wgrant> Indeed.
[01:02] <spm> bac: looks like you were'nt alone. see a few folks have been impacted.
[01:08] <wallyworld> gary_poster: are you able to give me permission to register a new lazr.restful release on pypi?
[01:10] <wallyworld> wgrant: i'm not sure what to do with the natty source package side of things for the new release
[01:11] <wgrant> wallyworld: Is lazr.restful packaged?
[01:11] <wgrant> Huh, so it is.
[01:12] <wgrant> But it seems to be prehistoric.
[01:12] <wgrant> So ignore it.
[01:12] <wallyworld> wgrant: ok. i had to upload the tarball by hand because i couldn't get the uplaod script to run properly. that's for another day
[01:13] <wallyworld> wgrant: any idea why the 0.18.1 milestone is not showing up on the timeline?
[01:13] <wgrant> wallyworld: Some of the timelines are cached.
[01:13] <wallyworld> what's the cache refresh interval?
[01:13] <wgrant> Huh.
[01:13] <wgrant> Something strange is going on here.
[01:15] <wgrant> It's not showing up in the milestone listing either, but it is in the release listing...
[01:15] <wgrant> https://launchpad.net/lazr.restful/+series
[01:15] <wallyworld> wgrant:  look at the bottom :-)
[01:16] <wallyworld> wgrant: it's because i entered the release date
[01:16] <wgrant> Bottom of where?
[01:17] <wallyworld> wgrant: sorry. wrong url. https://launchpad.net/lazr.restful/+milestones
[01:17] <wallyworld> wgrant: but 0.18.1 is on the +series url for me
[01:18] <wallyworld> wgrant: ah, no its not
[01:18] <wgrant> Code time.
[01:19] <wallyworld> wgrant: i think it's got the ordering wrong because of the release date being set for 0.18.1 and not the others
[01:20] <wgrant> Ah.
[01:20] <wgrant> Could be.
[01:21] <wgrant> The release data is set on the rest, but the target date is not.
[01:21] <wgrant> I removed the target date and now it's showing in the timeline.
[01:21] <wgrant> And bypassing the cache now shows it everywhere else.
[01:23] <StevenK> wgrant: Have you seen the stable->db-devel conflict, or shall I fix?
[01:24] <wgrant> StevenK: I already fixed one this morning.
[01:24] <wgrant> And there were two or three fixed yesterday.
[01:24] <wgrant> Is there another?
[01:24] <wgrant> No.
[01:25] <StevenK> wgrant: Ah, you already handled the garbo one?
[01:25] <wgrant> If it's not spamming more than every 20 minutes, it's fixed :)
[01:25] <wgrant> Yes.
[01:26] <poolie> does jc's recent proposal <https://code.launchpad.net/~jcsackett/launchpad/apparently-we-support-basic-auth/+merge/55845> mean lp actually will support basic auth?
[01:27] <thumper> no
[01:27] <thumper> I'm pretty sure basic auth is only supported in tests
[01:27] <wgrant> It does support basic auth.
[01:27] <thumper> in order to get windmill logged in without openid
[01:27] <wgrant> But we need to delete it.
[01:28] <thumper> the zcml to configure basic auth is only in the testrunner profile
[01:28] <thumper> AFAIK
[01:28] <poolie> ok
[01:28] <wgrant> Are you sure? It is actively OOPSing on production and IIRC it works in the past...
[01:28] <wgrant> But it won't for long :)
[01:28] <poolie> :/
[01:29] <thumper> really?
[01:29] <thumper> ok
[01:29] <wgrant> poolie: Why?
[01:29] <thumper> I've not tried
[01:29] <poolie> on the api it seems to just be ignored
[01:29] <wgrant> poolie: Right, it's not supported by the API.
[01:29] <wgrant> That uses different auth.
[01:29] <poolie> wgrant, i think it's a good model for some api users
[01:29] <poolie> it would shortcircuit some of the flying circus about getting credentials
[01:29] <wgrant> poolie: Why?
[01:30] <wgrant> Well, LP doesn't have passwords any more.
[01:30] <poolie> specifically the text mode/server case
[01:30] <wgrant> So it can't use basic auth.
[01:30] <poolie> from the inside, no, you don't; from the outside obviously you do
[01:30] <poolie> lp is tied 1:1 with a password database
[01:30] <wgrant> Assuming that we make launchpadlib better, what's wrong with OAuth?
[01:31] <wgrant> poolie: Yes, and that is stupid.
[01:31] <wgrant> And an awful, awful hack.
[01:31] <poolie> the main problem with oauth is that it pretty much requires an interactive graphical browser
[01:31] <poolie> but this is an implementation problem not an essential problem
[01:31] <wgrant> It doesn't.
[01:31] <wgrant> It requires that you somehow navigate to that page.
[01:32] <wgrant> It can be done on any host, but *should* work in text browsers anyway.
[01:32] <poolie> you could implement something in lplib that takes a username and passowrd password and gives back a token
[01:32] <wgrant> That's been rejected.
[01:32] <wgrant> The policy is that your password must only be given to the SSO UI.
[01:33] <wallyworld> wgrant: i'm coming in late to this discussion, but with firefox 4, you no longer get that annoying authorisation dialog pop up when running windmill tests
[01:33] <wgrant> wallyworld: I saw your fixes.. does it actually work with 4 now?
[01:33] <wgrant> It crashed terribly when I last looked, but that was some weeks ago.
[01:33] <wallyworld> wgrant: *almost*. there's a few tests failing due to some keypress event handler weirdness
[01:33] <wgrant> poolie: While LP doesn't maintain SSO any more, I think the policy is mostly sane.
[01:34] <wgrant> Hmm. Except that there is now the desktop SSO client.
[01:34] <wgrant> So maybe it has changed.
[01:34] <wgrant> But still, I don't think launchpadlib is the place.
[01:34] <poolie> that policy seems almost superstitious
[01:34] <wgrant> If people are having issues opening the URL that it gives, then we should fix that.
[01:34] <poolie> as if there is a difference between showing a form running in lynx, and showing the same forms in controls drawn by the application itself
[01:34] <lifeless> wgrant: the oopses in prod fro base64 are bad filebug data attachments
[01:35] <wgrant> lifeless: Ah.
[01:35] <poolie> or in fact a captive webkit form is an even better example
[01:35] <wgrant> poolie: Why would you use lynx instead of your local browser?
[01:35] <wgrant> Unless you're using launchpadlib from a server console.
[01:35] <poolie> yes, that
[01:35] <wgrant> In which case you're more than likely doing it wrong.
[01:36] <poolie> so, to back up
[01:36] <wallyworld> thumper: how's natty going?
[01:36] <poolie> how are people to get api credentials onho a server?
[01:36] <poolie> *onto
[01:36] <wgrant> poolie: launchpadlib gives a URL. They open the URL in their desktop browser.
[01:36] <gary_poster> wallyworld, would you still like that pypi permission?
[01:36]  * gary_poster just asked that question on #clojure.  oops.
[01:37] <wallyworld> gary_poster: yes please. there's a lazr.restful 0.18.1 release to upload
[01:37] <gary_poster> got it.  are you "wallyworld" there?
[01:37] <thumper> wallyworld: stopped with unity as I couldn't get any work done
[01:37] <wallyworld> gary_poster: yeah
[01:37] <gary_poster> k
[01:37] <thumper> may poke it with a stick again later
[01:37] <lifeless> gary_poster: how do you like it?
[01:37] <wgrant> thumper: Sounds like you have a big job in a couple of weeks :P
[01:37] <wallyworld> thumper: ah, but i wouldn't use Unity. KDE Rulez!
[01:37] <poolie> hm, i guess so
[01:37] <poolie> so lplib should not try to open a browser in that case
[01:38] <thumper> wgrant: yeah, seems so
[01:38] <wgrant> poolie: Does it try to open a non-X browser? That's somewhat insane.
[01:38] <gary_poster> lifeless, I like it quite a bit.  It's been four or five months since I actually played with it though. :-/
[01:38] <lifeless> wgrant: w3m
[01:38] <lifeless> wgrant: its *why* we fixed
[01:38] <lifeless> (not saying thats sane, just history)
[01:39] <poolie> i think it still does; imbw
[01:39] <poolie> the other case i've hit this is when trying to file bug reports from a machine with no working k
[01:39] <gary_poster> wallyworld you have the POWER
[01:39] <poolie> *x
[01:39] <poolie> but that might be too much of an edge case
[01:39] <wgrant> So, I don't want to be giving my Ubuntu SSO password to arbitrary remote servers. (I also don't want to be giving them authenticated Launchpad tokenas at the moment, since they have unlimited scope, but that's a separate issue)
[01:39] <lifeless> we explicitly support that; login with w3m
[01:40] <wallyworld> gary_poster: awesome thanks. why am i now thinking of spiderman. "with great power comes great responsibility"
[01:40] <gary_poster> wallyworld, :-) go save the world, man
[01:40] <poolie> anyhow, this is fine
[01:40] <poolie> i just wondered what the patch was about
[01:41] <wallyworld> gary_poster: i'm saving the world one windows installation at a time :-)
[01:41] <poolie> lifeless, so you're saying lplib should not launch w3m by default, but ... should give an option or something?
[01:41] <poolie> or i should retype the url on a different console?
[01:41] <gary_poster> wallyworld, lol, sounds like a good plan
[01:42] <gary_poster> have a great day/night/etc., everyone!
[01:42] <lifeless> poolie: I'm saying we support logging in using w3m so folk on server consoles can report bugs using apport
[01:43] <lifeless> I think the launchpadlib story has gotten convoluted with different scenarios and use cases over time and could benefit from a ground up refresh; however its extremely low priority given our critical bug list
[01:43] <poolie> i agree on both counts
[01:43] <wgrant> Definitely.
[01:44] <wallyworld> wgrant: lazr.restful up on pypi now :-)
[01:44] <wgrant> wallyworld: Great! Shall I handle the upgrade?
[01:44] <wallyworld> wgrant: you mean to lp versions.cfg?
[01:44] <wgrant> Yeah.
[01:44] <lifeless> which is of course a bit circular given that we choose what defines critical :P
[01:44] <wgrant> Since I have immediate need for it.
[01:45] <wallyworld> wgrant: i've already uploaded to download-cache and i've got a mp that should be ready to go but needs a final +1
[01:45] <lifeless> poolie: btw you r oops on ~mbp/+branches
[01:45] <wallyworld> https://code.launchpad.net/~wallyworld/launchpad/show-ajax-notifications/+merge/54342
[01:45] <wgrant> wallyworld: Ah, great.
[01:45] <lifeless> poolie: different bug; cold cache impact of a query examining every bug branch link you ever made
[01:46] <lifeless> thumper: wgrant: which team is on CHR this week ?
[01:46] <poolie> the one i mentioned yesterday?
[01:46] <poolie> or maybe filed
[01:46] <wgrant> wallyworld: Are the notifications always correctly escaped?
[01:46] <wgrant> lifeless: thumper's, I think, but they aren't really their own any more...
[01:46] <lifeless> also
[01:46] <lifeless> wow
[01:46] <lifeless> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+filebug does an ajax request
[01:46]  * thumper shrugs
[01:46]  * thumper looks at wallyworld
[01:47] <lifeless> wgrant: so I ask because we have lots of untriaged bugs
[01:47] <thumper> wallyworld: care to triage?
[01:47] <wallyworld> wgrant: it depends. it pulls the notifications from the request so however they are put there....
[01:47] <wallyworld> thumper: ok
[01:49] <wgrant> wallyworld: OK, at the moment addNotification escapes them if necessary. So it's OK.
[01:50] <wallyworld> wgrant: that's what i thought
[01:50] <wallyworld> wgrant: but given all the holes lately, i wasn't confident to say "yes" to your question :-)
[01:50] <wgrant> Heh
[01:51]  * wgrant mauls IE.
[01:54] <lifeless> wgrant: we need to rollback
[01:54] <wgrant> lifeless: What's regressed?
[01:54] <lifeless> wgrant: go to https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/746866 and edit the description using ajax
[01:54] <_mup_> Bug #746866: Person:+branches timeout: sometimes-slow bug-branch link query <timeout> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/746866 >
[01:55] <lifeless> wgrant: make a trivial change - extra space at the end or something
[01:55] <wgrant> Eep. wallyworld ^^
[01:56] <wgrant> The saved data is OK, FWIW.
[01:56]  * wallyworld looks
[01:56] <wgrant> wallyworld: It uses 'undefined' as the new description representation.
[01:57] <wgrant> Hmm. Is this the one widget which uses _defaultFormatter for HTML? :)
[01:57] <wallyworld> oh bollocks
[01:59] <wallyworld> it worked fine for blueprints etc on qastaging i think
[01:59] <wallyworld> wgrant: yes, believe so
[02:00] <wgrant> wallyworld: Yeah, I QAd all the blueprint widgets and a few things on bugs.
[02:00] <wgrant> Blueprint description worked fine, but I mustn't have checked bug descriptions.
[02:01] <wallyworld> wgrant: me too. i checked a few other places and it looked good
[02:01] <wgrant> wallyworld: Can you see exactly what's going on here?
[02:01] <wgrant> Ah, nevermind, we missed the buildbot run.
[02:01] <wallyworld> wgrant: not yet. looking at qastaging
[02:02] <poolie> lifeless, is "loses your data" enough to bump bug 735290 to critical?
[02:02] <_mup_> Bug #735290: changing Project drop down in project group +filebug loses all your work <ajax> <bugs> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/735290 >
[02:02] <poolie> it's basically as bad as an oops
[02:03] <poolie> indeed, worse, because you can retry an oops, but you can't retry this
[02:03] <poolie> s//retry a POST
[02:04] <lifeless> poolie: I don't think so
[02:06] <poolie> :(
[02:06] <poolie> fair enough
[02:06] <poolie> it's awful when it happens though
[02:08] <lifeless> it is
[02:08] <wgrant> wallyworld: Huh, it seems to work OK locally.
[02:08] <lifeless> unlike all the oopses and javascript fails, its not a complete blocker
[02:08] <wallyworld> wgrant: yeah, i can't see in the code what's wrong
[02:08] <lifeless> I suggest taking those keys off your keyboard :)
[02:08] <wallyworld> wgrant: i was just about to run it up
[02:10] <wgrant> Oh, it helps if my copy of devel is up to date.
[02:10] <wgrant> stable was, but not devel.
[02:10] <wgrant> Fail.
[02:11] <wgrant> wallyworld: Is it because a Node doesn't have an innerHTML?
[02:12] <wgrant> Still waiting for new devel to build.
[02:12] <wallyworld> wgrant: nodes should all have that. which bit of code do you mean?
[02:13] <wgrant> Hm, yeah, that's it.
[02:14] <poolie> lifeless, lp may be getting to the point where fixing bugs like this is more important to user experience than making it faster
[02:14] <wgrant> Now, how do I stringify a Node...
[02:24] <wgrant> wallyworld: I have a hack that works.
[02:24] <wgrant> I presume there's a more direct way.
[02:24] <wgrant> -            return result.getHTML(attribute).get('innerHTML');
[02:24] <wgrant> +            return Y.Node.create('<p/>').append(result.getHTML(attribute)).getContent();
[02:24] <wgrant> I couldn't see a way to get a string representation directly.
[02:24] <wallyworld> wgrant: i'm trying something atm. give me a minute
[02:25] <wgrant> So, erm, bugs and blueprints use different AJAX textarea widgets?
[02:26] <wgrant> I wasn't aware we had more than one :/
[02:26] <lifeless> poolie: perhaps
[02:27] <lifeless> poolie: I think there is great value in actually reaching a goal
[02:27] <lifeless> poolie: it will take considerable time to turn around the perception that lp is slow
[02:27] <lifeless> poolie: firstly we need to make it not slow, and then we need to keep it that way for a while ;)
[02:27] <wgrant> (Windmill didn't catch this breakage, FWIW)
[02:29] <lifeless> booyah
[02:30] <lifeless> https://bugs.staging.launchpad.net/ubuntu
[02:30] <lifeless> its not quite subsecond
[02:30] <lifeless> but not terribly far off
[02:30] <wgrant> I am disappoint.
[02:30] <poolie> yeah, i do also agree with hammering it thoroughly flat
[02:30] <poolie> just sayin
[02:32] <wallyworld> wgrant: this is what we want
[02:32] <wallyworld> -      return Y.Node.create(value);
[02:32] <wallyworld> +      var result = Y.Node.create("<span/>");
[02:32] <wallyworld> +      result.setContent(value);
[02:32] <wallyworld> +      return result;
[02:33] <wgrant> wallyworld: How is that different?
[02:33] <wgrant> Apart from adding another layer, it looks like it should be the same.
[02:33] <wgrant> Oh.
[02:33] <wgrant> Does it get an innerHTML if it's a single element, whereas this is a sequence of <p>s?
[02:34] <wallyworld> wgrant: it's done in the getHTML method, not the _defaultFormatter method
[02:34] <wallyworld> wgrant: i think the getHTML method was constructing the node incorrectly
[02:34] <wallyworld> with the above change, there's no need to change _defaultFormatter
[02:35] <lifeless> I consider this timing a success: 03976-04169@SQL-launchpad-main-master SELECT BugTask.assignee, BugTask
[02:36] <wgrant> wallyworld: A span is not the right thing, but we do need something like that.
[02:36] <wgrant> Ugh, this is hard to do correctly.
[02:37] <lifeless> good things often are
[02:37] <wallyworld> wgrant: the span is just a container - it doesn't come out in the final html
[02:44] <lifeless> *blink* 40 /   54  BugTask:+index
[02:45] <thumper> that's good right?
[02:46] <lifeless> yeah
[02:46] <lifeless> was sitting at 180/* before
[02:46] <lifeless> I'm wondering wtf changed
[02:53] <lifeless> thumper: I really wouldn't tackle what you're working on by blocking branch renames.
[02:54] <lifeless> thumper: Its up to you of course, but I fear it will just decrease usability and increase user frustration
[02:54] <thumper> lifeless: I'm not
[02:54] <lifeless> thumper: oh cool; what are you doing?
[02:55] <thumper> lifeless: I'm trying to catch the object modified event for the branch and checking the unique name
[02:55] <thumper> lifeless: creating a rename job if the unique name has changed
[02:55] <thumper> and there are branches stacked on it
[02:55] <thumper> however, since the unique name is a string col that is updated with a db trigger
[02:55] <thumper> it isn't being reloaded on Store.flush
[02:55] <lifeless> yeah
[02:56] <thumper> I could easily use old skool logic
[02:56] <thumper> which would work
[02:57] <lifeless> thumper: _mark_autoreload
[02:58] <lifeless> is related
[02:58] <lifeless> obj_info.variables[column].set(AutoReload)
[02:58] <thumper> looks private(ish) though
[02:58] <lifeless> IIRC you do this:
[02:58] <lifeless> obj.column = AutoReload
[03:00] <lifeless> thumper: did you consider making the stacking location be id based rather than unique-name ?
[03:00] <lifeless> thumper: and rewriting all the current branches Just Once to stack by id ?
[03:01] <thumper> lifeless: I don't know how do work that well for HTTP access, or enough in the smart server to do it right
[03:02] <lifeless> thumper: so for http its pretty easy - we already export branches by id in the dc; we just need to make a matching export to the world with the existing branch-privacy logic attached to it.
[03:03] <lifeless> for the smart server, we have a hook already that mangles the stacked on location on branch open - a 95% solution would just decorate the set_stacked location in the backend
[03:05] <thumper> actually that may well be a better solution than what I'm doing
[03:05] <thumper> bugger!
[03:05] <lifeless> I suspect its a little more fiddly, but much more robust - no race conditions, immune to any changes we make to branch names in the future etc
[03:05] <thumper> yeah
[03:06] <wallyworld> wgrant: https://code.launchpad.net/~wallyworld/launchpad/text-area-widget-html-fix/+merge/55860
[03:08]  * lifeless forces himself away from coding
[03:08] <thumper> lifeless: I think what we need is a special traversal hook, like +branch-id
[03:08] <wgrant> wallyworld: I don't quite understand what the root problem is. Is it that we can't get the innerHTML from a Node created from a fragment, instead of a single element?
[03:08] <thumper> lifeless: so we could stack on /+branch-id/12345
[03:08] <thumper> internally
[03:08] <thumper> not sure what it would look like to the outside world
[03:09] <wallyworld> wgrant: no exactly. innerhtml assumes that there is an element eg <div>, <span> etc wrapping the content
[03:09] <lifeless> thumper: I think exporting that to the outside world would be fine
[03:09] <wallyworld> wgrant: and so innerhtml returns what's inside that containing node
[03:10] <lifeless> thumper: that is the heart of the solution (for working with http and sftp)
[03:10] <thumper> yeah...
[03:11] <thumper> unfortunately I think I'm probably the most qualified to actually implement this
[03:11] <thumper> given jml and mwhudson not actively coding on LP now
[03:11] <wgrant> wallyworld: This is probably a hack, but it seems to work.
[03:11] <thumper> at least I understand much more of it now since my sloecode workl
[03:12] <wallyworld> wgrant: not sure if it's a hack or not. seems to match what i've seen elsewhere. but i'm not expert
[03:23] <LPCIBot> Project windmill build #128: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 11 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill/128/
[03:26] <wgrant> wallyworld: You've tested a good variety of (potentially duplicated) widgets?
[03:27] <wallyworld> wgrant: i tested bugs, blueprints and am about to double check recipes
[03:28] <wgrant> Great.
[03:28] <wgrant> We have more than two hours to confirm everything's really working.
[03:31] <sinzui> huwshimi: have you formed an opinion of the my revision to the mailing list archive header?
[03:31] <huwshimi> sinzui: ah sorry, yes, I think it's good
[03:32] <huwshimi> sinzui: Again it would be nice to have this fully integrated, but let's go with this for now
[03:32] <huwshimi> sinzui: At least it's consistent with Loggerhead
[03:33] <sinzui> huwshimi: Then are the wiki's next? The Lp primary css is now usable by other Lp wsite
[03:34] <wgrant> sinzui: The spacing under the "$TEAM team mailing list archive" seems to be a little small, but it looks good to me too.
[03:35] <huwshimi> sinzui: I'm not sure what to do with the wikis. At the least the help wiki should probably look more like Launchpad, but it's difficult to know exactly what to do when the auth system etc. isn't integrated.
[03:36] <huwshimi> sinzui: We have deeper issues about navigation etc. that need to be resolved to help us with that
[03:38] <sinzui> wgrant: I thought so to. I suspect that lose of the image changed the positioning. I can ad some pixels
[03:38] <sinzui> of white-space
[03:38] <wgrant> sinzui: Is the title an h1?
[03:39] <wallyworld> thumper: textareawidget - if hide_empty=True, then there's no way to enter text apart from using the html form. why do we have a hide_empty?
[03:39] <wallyworld> eg sourcepackagerecipe index page
[03:39] <wgrant> Was that for the recipe description?
[03:39] <wallyworld> wgrant: yes
[03:40] <wgrant> Most recipes don't have descriptions, so it took up too much room for too little gain, IIRC.
[03:40] <wallyworld> but if you wanted to enter a description later...
[03:40] <wallyworld> and it doesn't take up *that* much room
[03:40] <wgrant> Then you're screwed, yeah.
[03:41] <wgrant> It could be like the MP's commit message widget, I guess.
[03:41] <wallyworld> i mean, in the context of what else is on the page, it's stuff all wasted space
[03:41] <wgrant> That's just a single line when empty (an add button, not a normal textarea widget)
[03:41] <thumper> yes, it is for the commit message and description
[03:41] <thumper> it has been suggested that we integrate the menu items into the widgets themselves
[03:41] <thumper> and have the code in one place for showing and hiding
[03:41] <wgrant> That would be very sensible.
[03:41] <thumper> but I didn't get that far
[03:42] <wallyworld> thumper: and now you're desserting us
[03:42] <wallyworld> or deserting, i can't spell
[03:42] <thumper> wallyworld: I'll leave it in your capable hands :)
[03:42]  * thumper is eating dessert
[03:42]  * wallyworld lols
[03:49]  * wallyworld needs food. dessert even
[03:54] <wgrant> I could sit here and play with the blueprint implementation status widget all day. The way the other fields magically change...
[03:56] <lifeless> bacj shortly, vet run
[03:56] <wgrant> wallyworld: lifecycle_status was relying on getHTMLOrDefault?
[04:11] <wallyworld> wgrant: yes. there is no html representation for that field
[04:48] <wallyworld> thumper: bug 745230. it that really a bug or do they just need to edit their recipe when they rename a branch? or perhaps there was already a build pending when the branch was renamed, hence the error?
[04:49] <_mup_> Bug #745230: recipe fails when branch gets new owner <Launchpad itself:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/745230 >
[04:49] <wgrant> wallyworld: Ah, I didn't realise a bug was filed for that.
[04:49] <wgrant> wallyworld: It is the stacked-on-a-renamed-branch bug.
[04:51] <huwshimi> Is there any way to make my local launchpad dev server accessible over my network?
[04:51] <wallyworld> wgrant: ah yes. i knew about that one. i didn't pick up that was at play here though. it looked like just a simple branch rename and a recipe referring to the old branch
[04:51] <wgrant> huwshimi: https://dev.launchpad.net/Running/RemoteAccess should still mostly work.
[04:51] <wgrant> huwshimi: You're not going to try and unbreak some of our JS in IE, are you?
[04:52] <StevenK> huwshimi: The other thing you can do is 'utilites/ec2 demo'
[04:52] <wallyworld> i reckon we shouldn't even attemp to support IE < 9 :-)
[04:52] <huwshimi> wgrant: Would I dare? :P
[04:52] <wgrant> StevenK: That was broken at one point.  We have a significant number of stakeholders that fall into that category.
[04:56] <wallyworld> huwshimi: how should i triage bug 744808? i'm thinking medium? or high?
[04:56] <_mup_> Bug #744808: Redrawing of Bug View page very slow in Firefox <Launchpad itself:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/744808 >
[04:57] <wallyworld> huwshimi: yes, i realise corporates still use ie 6 - i used to work at one. i didn;t realise there were that many of them
[04:57] <wallyworld> or that they couldn;t install ff for lp use
[04:58] <wallyworld> even at my old employer where ie 6 was the standard, we could still install ff etc. i went one step further and used linux :-)
[04:59] <huwshimi> wallyworld: I don't know how you should classify that bug. We're going to need some more info about browser version etc.
[04:59] <wgrant> huwshimi: It's an nvidia driver bug :/
[04:59] <wgrant> huwshimi: Well, plus Firefox, I guess.
[04:59] <wgrant> But all the other drivers do fine.
[04:59] <wgrant> So I tend to blame nvidia.
[05:00] <huwshimi> wgrant: If it's just one image that is cause it there are things we can do.
[05:05] <wallyworld> huwshimi: i'll mark it as medium i think then
[05:06] <wgrant> wallyworld: lifeless will hate you forever.
[05:06] <huwshimi> wallyworld: I don't think we use medium
[05:06] <wgrant> Medium doesn't exist :)
[05:06] <huwshimi> wallyworld: It should probably be high
[05:06] <wallyworld> high it i
[05:06] <wallyworld> is
[05:06] <wallyworld> oh, i forgot about not using medium
[05:08] <lifeless> wallyworld: the rationale is this: high is nominally 6 months worth of work queued; with reviews to winnow it; anything below that is simply 'unscheduled'
[05:09] <wallyworld> thanks for the reminder
[05:11] <wallyworld> jtv: do you think 743913 is a duplicate as suggested in the bug report?
[05:11] <jtv> wallyworld: looking
[05:11] <wgrant> Bug #743913
[05:11]  * wgrant pokes _mup_
[05:11] <wallyworld> mup has been a bit slack of late
[05:14] <jtv> wallyworld: that does look like it's probably the same issue—even though it's not a simple one and the individual reporters may just as well have run into different sides of the problem.
[05:15] <wallyworld> jtv: thanks. i'll mark it as a dup
[05:18] <wallyworld> jtv: dpm poses an interesting question in this bug #743029 - when you have a moment it would be cool if you could take a look to provide an answer. regardless of the answer, it's a problem that needs fixing it appears
[05:18] <_mup_> Bug #743029: Launchpad Translations only allows submitting 3 translation suggestions and discards the rest <Launchpad itself:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/743029 >
[05:19] <lifeless> wallyworld: if you're doing triage; there are a couple of links in the BugTriage wiki page that jointly should be driven to 0
[05:19] <wallyworld> ok
[05:21] <huwshimi> I'm guessing there is no way to log into launchpad.dev without openid?
[05:21] <wgrant> huwshimi: Basic auth might work.
[05:21] <wgrant> admin@canonical.com:test
[05:22] <huwshimi> wgrant: how do I get a prompt for that?
[05:22] <lifeless> huwshimi: you don't
[05:22] <wgrant> huwshimi: Put it in the URL.
[05:22] <wgrant> Although I guess you'll need to escape the @...
[05:22] <wgrant> Let's see if it works.
[05:22] <lifeless> huwshimi: note that we don't support basic auth in prod
[05:23] <huwshimi> lifeless: Yeah this is just to test over my network
[05:23] <huwshimi> lifeless: From a vm running ie that doesn't like the openid stuff
[05:23] <wgrant> Hm, doesn't seem to work.
[05:23] <jtv> wallyworld: wow, that one is just insane.  But frankly it sounds as if it's more of an "only the latest suggestions are displayed" issue.  I'm not aware of anything like that having been done deliberately while we still had the Rosetta team, though I could well imagine someone deciding that if the same user enters successive suggestions for the same message in the same language, it's probably to improve on the older ones rather than to offer lots of alternati
[05:23] <StevenK> huwshimi: How does it error?
[05:24] <huwshimi> StevenK: It won't load https://testopenid.dev/+openid
[05:24] <huwshimi> StevenK: I don't know how to get the header code
[05:24] <StevenK> Can it even resolve it?
[05:24] <wgrant> I think I ended up with SSL errors of some kind last time i tried... I don't remember details.
[05:24] <wallyworld> jtv: yeah weird. thanks for looking
[05:25] <huwshimi> StevenK: Possibly not. I assumed it was something to do with my network setup
[05:25] <jtv> wallyworld: first I'd make sure that we understand what steps dpm went through.
[05:25] <StevenK> Can haz review? https://code.launchpad.net/~stevenk/launchpad/dsd-dont-request-child-diff/+merge/55863
[05:25] <lifeless> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/741092/comments/11 <- and they say python is slow
[05:25] <_mup_> Bug #741092: Archive:+subscriptions times out with many subscribers <qa-ok> <timeout> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/741092 >
[05:26] <wgrant> wallyworld: It's almost buildbot time.
[05:26] <jtv> wallyworld: that may sound strange given his description, but our UI doesn't actually support the steps he describes directly.  He'd have to submit the page every time, then page back to get to the message he was entering suggestions for.
[05:26] <wallyworld> jtv: i'm going to try it on qastaging using the bug report as a guide
[05:26] <wgrant> wallyworld: Your branch seems fine, so it should probably get into the next buildbot run.
[05:26] <jtv> wallyworld: same here
[05:26] <jtv> I'll try a different page then
[05:27] <wallyworld> wgrant: i've submitted it to ec2 just after it was approved
[05:27] <huwshimi> wgrant: Damn, doesn't like that either
[05:27] <wgrant> wallyworld: Hmm, but we don't run windmill in ec2 yet, so will that actually test anything?
[05:27] <wgrant> huwshimi: No :/
[05:27] <wgrant> huwshimi: Can you see if the testopenid.dev request is making it to the appserver?
[05:27] <jtv> wallyworld: by the way, be careful to do this in Translator mode.  Do it in Reviewer mode once, and the translation you enter will become official and your old ones will be counted as reviewed.
[05:27] <huwshimi> wgrant: erm...
[05:28] <wallyworld> wgrant: the tests are plain javascript ones. i thought windmill ones were separate again?
[05:28] <wgrant> huwshimi: 'make run' prints all the requests it receives.
[05:28] <huwshimi> wgrant: Ah
[05:28] <wgrant> wallyworld: Ah, they're not still run in WindmillLayer?
[05:28] <wgrant> test_yuitests lives in lib/lp/*/windmill....
[05:29] <wallyworld> jtv: ok. on qastaging though i can mess up as much data as i want though?
[05:29] <wgrant> class CodeYUIUnitTestCase(YUIUnitTestCase):
[05:29] <wgrant> layer = CodeWindmillLayer
[05:29] <jtv> wallyworld: yes, but:
[05:29] <wallyworld> wgrant: i didn't appreciate that fact. i would have thought they were separate :-(
[05:30] <jtv> wallyworld: dpm gave a specific link, and on staging you can tell that link doesn't do quite what he expected any more.  Be careful not to change the effect of the same link on qastaging—it can be a useful reference.
[05:30] <wgrant> wallyworld: I guess they need similar infrastructure, to actually get them to run in the browser and such.
[05:30] <wallyworld> jtv: yes, true
[05:30] <huwshimi> wgrant: This is what I get after clicking on the login link: http://paste.ubuntu.com/588109/
[05:32] <wallyworld> jtv: so to double check, the fact that it says "Your suggestions will be held for review ...." means I am in reviewer mode?
[05:32] <jtv> No
[05:33] <jtv> That means you're in translator mode.
[05:33] <wallyworld> ah sorry, my fingers got mixed up
[05:34] <wallyworld> i meant to say translator mode
[05:35] <jtv> wallyworld: I just tried it and yes, it only shows my latest 3 suggestions for that one particular message.
[05:35] <wallyworld> jtv: so the bug is legit
[05:35] <wallyworld> ?
[05:36] <wallyworld> or if it's be design we need to say that
[05:36] <wallyworld> by
[05:36] <wallyworld> and why
[05:36] <jtv> In the sense that we can reproduce it, yes it's legit.  Another question is whether it's a bug.  To be honest I don't see why, if a single person suggests >3 different translations for the exact same message into the exact same language, we should expect all of those to be useful.  I think it makes sense to assume that the person is improving, rather than throwing a bunch of garbage the reviewer's way after making a good suggestion.
[05:37] <jtv> Think about the spam or shelf-stuffing potential alone.
[05:37] <wgrant> huwshimi: Hm, do other browsers work?
[05:37] <wgrant> huwshimi: I'm able to log in from another machine OK.
[05:37] <wgrant> huwshimi: Although it's not Windows.
[05:38] <StevenK> huwshimi: Do you happen to have Firefox on that Windows machine?
[05:38] <wallyworld> jtv: i agree, and it seems any change was likely done for that reason. so i can mark it as won't fix and explain why?
[05:38] <huwshimi> StevenK: Just installing it
[05:38] <jtv> wallyworld: to be blunt, "won't fix" may be too mild.
[05:39] <jtv> More of a feature-not-bug.
[05:39] <lifeless> opinion
[05:39] <wallyworld> :-)
[05:39] <huwshimi> wgrant: Firefox doesn't work either
[05:39] <jtv> lifeless: I agree completely with that being an ideal resolution for this, except in this case the discussion hasn't played out to that point yet.
[05:40] <jtv> wallyworld: BTW the messages are not actually gone.
[05:40] <wgrant> huwshimi: What error does the browser show?
[05:40] <jtv> wallyworld: The reviewer can still get to them by "zooming in" on the message.
[05:40] <huwshimi> wgrant: Same thing. Can't find the server
[05:40]  * wallyworld tries that
[05:40] <jtv> wallyworld: They just don't clutter up the regular translation page which must show multiple translations.
[05:41] <wgrant> huwshimi: You added testopenid.dev and launchpad.dev and bugs.launchpad.dev and anything else of interest to C:\Windows\System32\drivers\etc\hosts, or whatever it is these days?
[05:41] <wgrant> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/588111/ is the config diff I use.
[05:41] <jtv> wallyworld: …which on the one hand makes perfect sense, though on the other the reviewer obviously has no sane reason to assume that the translator may still want them to see the suggestion they made 4 page submissions ago.
[05:41] <huwshimi> wgrant: Yeah it's all there. The other urls work so it must be working
[05:42] <StevenK> I thought testopenid.dev was a different IP
[05:42] <wallyworld> jtv: all valid points.
[05:42] <jtv> wallyworld: bear in mind that, thanks to the back-paging, the translator must go to considerable extra trouble to enter the redundant messages.  So it ends up being a bit of a "doctor it hurts when I punch myself in the eye."
[05:42] <wgrant> StevenK: It's not really configured properly.
[05:42] <wallyworld> jtv: i didn'h have to backpage at all
[05:42] <wallyworld> perhaps there's an ajax version working for me
[05:44] <jtv> wallyworld: no, that's probably because you happen to be on a view that only has one page to display then.
[05:44] <jtv> Even so, it's not like the submit is instantaneous.  So this is a pretty rare case.
[05:45] <jtv> Or should be.
[05:45] <wallyworld> yeah
[05:47] <jtv> If anyone's running into this, I think it's probably because of some tangentially-related misconception or misleading UI subtlety.
[05:49] <wallyworld> jtv: i'm commenting on the bug now and we'll see what reply we get. did you want me to subscribe you to it?
[05:49] <jtv> wallyworld: sure, thanks
[05:49] <wallyworld> jtv: thanks for your help with this
[05:51] <jtv> No worries.  Bear in mind by the way that this is David acting as a conduit, which is part of the Ubuntu Translations Coordinator role he's been fulfilling wonderfully.  It's great for all of us to establish contact with him about these things; he lost a Rosetta team as a support point so it'd be good to know he's gaining a Launchpad team in its place.
[05:52] <huwshimi> wgrant: Any other ideas :)
[05:52] <wgrant> huwshimi: How does your Apache config look compared to the diff I provided?
[05:52] <wallyworld> jtv: agreed. the past few times i've come across input from him i've tried to act promptly on it.
[05:52] <wgrant> I don't *think* I changed anything else to get it to work.
[05:53] <wgrant> But I remember it didn't initially.
[05:53] <jtv> That's great.  He represents a lot of people's needs!
[05:54] <huwshimi> wgrant: http://paste.ubuntu.com/588114/
[05:54] <huwshimi> wgrant: Not a diff
[05:56] <wgrant> huwshimi: Try http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/588115/ (you might need to fix the branch-rewrite path, but I don't think Apache will complain too much if it's wrong)
[06:03]  * wallyworld does the school run
[06:04] <huwshimi> wgrant: No change
[06:04] <wgrant> huwshimi: Do you even get to the login prompt?
[06:05] <huwshimi> nope. I think it's just 404ing
[06:05] <huwshimi> but I don't know the actual status code cause the browsers are trying to be nice and hiding that info from me
[06:05] <wgrant> Firefox at least should be able to tell you.
[06:06] <wgrant> Otherwise maybe tail /var/log/apache2/other_vhosts_access.log?
[06:07] <huwshimi> wgrant: Yeah pretty sure it's a 404
[06:08] <huwshimi> wgrant: "Firefox can't find the server at testopenid.dev"
[06:08] <StevenK> tcpdump ? :-)
[06:08] <wgrant> That doesn't sound like a 404.
[06:09] <wgrant> Can you ping testopenid.dev OK?
[06:10] <wgrant> Ah hm.
[06:10] <huwshimi> wgrant: It gives exactly the same error when I go to a non-existent url
[06:10] <wgrant> Is the default-ssl site enabled in /etc/apache2/sites-enabled?
[06:10] <wgrant> Mine isn't.
[06:10] <wgrant> That may be what I did to fix it.
[06:10] <wgrant> sudo a2dissite default-ssl
[06:11] <huwshimi> wgrant: Pinging fails
[06:11] <wgrant> That could also be a problem.
[06:11] <wgrant> Sounds like your C:\Windows\System32\Drivers\etc\hosts is broken...
[06:11] <huwshimi> wgrant: it's possible
[06:12] <huwshimi> but it's weird that it works for some urls
[06:13] <huwshimi> wgrant: This is what I have in my hosts: http://paste.ubuntu.com/588122/
[06:13] <wgrant> Yet 'ping testopenid.dev' fails to resolve?
[06:13] <huwshimi> wgrant: yep
[06:14] <huwshimi> wgrant: "Ping requests could not find host testopenid.dev. Please check the name and try again."
[06:16] <wgrant> And it's XP, so it's not UAC virtualisation...
[06:16] <wgrant> I'm out of ideas :(
[06:16] <huwshimi> wgrant: Ok thanks anyway :)
[06:16] <huwshimi> I guess I'll leave IE broken for now, I can't think of anything else to try either.
[06:28] <lifeless> 7M renders yesterday
[06:30] <wgrant> lifeless: Nice.
[06:31] <huwshimi> wgrant: If this helps all the base urls: bugs. translations. etc. work but anything else breaks: shipit. lists.
[06:31] <lifeless> wgrant: after opstats etc
[06:31] <wgrant> huwshimi: Interesting.
[06:31] <huwshimi> wgrant: I think I must have some kind of port set up incorrectly or something
[06:31] <wgrant> huwshimi: That doesn't explain why ping wouldn't work.
[06:32] <huwshimi> wgrant: by breaks I mean I can't ping any of them
[06:33] <wgrant> huwshimi: I wonder if Windows' hosts file implementation has a limited line length.
[06:33] <wgrant> huwshimi: I would not put it past them. Try removing all except the hostnames you need.
[06:33] <huwshimi> wgrant: I thought about that but they're spread out through that list
[06:34] <wgrant> Bah
[06:34] <huwshimi> wgrant: I actually wonder if it's the Allow from in the apache file
[06:34] <wgrant> huwshimi: That doesn't affect name resolution.
[06:34] <huwshimi> wgrant: Ah right
[06:35] <wgrant> testopenid, lists and shipit are all in the last half of the line.
[06:36] <huwshimi> wgrant: oh, maybe I was wrong before
[06:37] <huwshimi> wgrant: Oh I am going to stab things. Hard.
[06:37] <wgrant> huwshimi: Oh?
[06:37] <huwshimi> wgrant: Moving it to the start of the line makes it work
[06:37] <wgrant> Yeah.
[06:38] <wgrant> When in doubt, suspect shoddy Microsoft code? :)
[06:40] <huwshimi> wgrant: That really is aweful. I just don't understand.
[06:42] <wgrant> Yes :/
[06:43] <wgrant> huwshimi: So, it's all working now?
[06:44] <huwshimi> wgrant: It exploded in an oops at first, but now it's working fine. Thanks heaps for your help :)
[06:44] <huwshimi> wgrant: Now I probably owe you cake too
[06:44] <wgrant> Haha.
[06:44] <wgrant> I'm glad that it's working.
[06:44] <wgrant> Maybe you can even make it work slightly in IE9 :)
[06:45] <huwshimi> wgrant: Maybe I should just stab myself in the face with my desk?
[06:45] <wgrant> IE will encourage you to sharpen your desk.
[06:46] <wgrant> So maybe.
[06:46] <StevenK> Haha
[06:47] <wgrant> (if the hosts brokenness didn't already)
[06:47] <lifeless> huwshimi: hosts files in windows have a maximum line length
[06:47] <poolie> huwshimi, i would love it so much if you proceeded with your idea to remove the variable sizes from the bug tag cloud
[06:47] <huwshimi> wgrant: I think I just blunted my desk from that
[06:48] <huwshimi> lifeless: hahahahaha, thanks :D
[06:48] <poolie> ever since i saw the mockup, the current ui hurts me even more
[06:48] <huwshimi> poolie: Me too!
[06:48] <wgrant> lifeless: Yes, we worked that out after an hour or so :P
[06:48] <wgrant> Which mockup?
[06:48] <poolie> so i think you're morally obligated
[06:48] <lifeless> wgrant: I was writing a mammoth mail; sorry
[06:49] <huwshimi> wgrant: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/709009
[06:49] <_mup_> Bug #709009: Tag clouds are very hard to read <ui> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/709009 >
[06:49] <huwshimi> oh so *now* mup decides to work, just after I've given up and started pasting bug links into the channel
[06:50] <wgrant> Bug #1234
[06:50] <_mup_> Bug #1234: Gina is an unmaintainable mess of command line options, environment variables and shell scripts <lp-foundations> <Launchpad itself:Fix Released by debonzi> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/1234 >
[06:50] <wgrant> Huh.
[06:50] <wgrant> Indeed.
[06:50] <wgrant> Bad _mup_
[06:50] <huwshimi> wgrant: Specifically: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/62993362/tag_cloud.png
[06:50] <wgrant> (nice mockup)
[06:50] <huwshimi> wgrant: But I think I would like to revise that slightly again when I get to it
[06:51] <wgrant> Yeah.
[06:51] <wgrant> A lot of other things need revision, too :/
[06:51] <poolie> i wonder now, given robert's point about performance
[06:51] <poolie> if it would be better to just simply show all the official tags
[06:55] <huwshimi> poolie: My brain no longer functions. I can not reply
[06:59] <poolie> ! sorry
[07:04] <LPCIBot> Project windmill build #129: STILL FAILING in 48 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill/129/
[08:03] <poolie> wow, trying to get a sorted list of tagged bugs is awful
[08:06] <wgrant> As awful as <script> tags in TAL?
[08:06] <wgrant> Because fuuuu
[08:06] <poolie> i want a list of bugs in bzr tagged doc, sorted newest first
[08:06] <poolie> you'd think clicking the tag then clicking sort would get this, but no
[08:07] <poolie> i know there's already a (bunch of) bugs for that
[08:10] <wgrant> poolie: Yeah, easiest way to search is URL-hacking.
[08:10] <wgrant> &orderby=-datecreated is handy
[09:21] <bigjools> morning people
[09:26] <poolie> hi jools
[10:11] <poolie> mrevell, "we have a different definition of success" nice
[10:11] <poolie> i wonder if we can articulate it?
[10:12] <poolie> i guess it's something like "the success of our users, rather than the number of users"
[10:13] <mrevell> poolie, And perhaps, "the success of free software, in particular as distributed by Ubuntu."
[10:13] <poolie> yeah, but that's getting pretty diffuse
[10:17] <mrevell> Yeah, it is but I worry that the word "users" is perhaps too narrow. People with LP accounts is probably what I'd first think of as a "user" in this context. So, we see their success as a good thing but our vision is for a success that helps Ubuntu in particular and free software projects in general. Maybe that doesn't all need to be said in that short paragraph.
[10:18] <wgrant> bigjools: Yes, deprecate partner and delete most of IDistroSeries and IDistribution please :)
[10:18] <poolie> mrevell, it seems like pinning it down precisely is a lot like hard work and doesn't obviously pay off
[10:18] <bigjools> wgrant: :)
[10:18] <poolie> or maybe it is super important
[10:19] <poolie> understanding it is more important than saying it
[10:19] <bigjools> wgrant: the soyuz stuff in those two model classes is all pretty awful old code, we need to move it out
[10:19] <bigjools> or delete it
[10:20] <wgrant> Yeah, but some of it has good reason for being there.
[10:20] <bigjools> IArchive seems like the obvious place but it's already too bloated
[10:20] <wgrant> It default to all_distro_archives if archive is not specified.
[10:20] <wgrant> s/It/They/
[10:20] <bigjools> h I missed that
[10:20] <bigjools> still not right for us
[10:21] <wgrant> Partner is not right for anyone :)
[10:21] <bigjools> and I hate the word
[10:38] <gmb> stub, lifeless: Could you take a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~gmb/launchpad/team-subscription-opt-out/+merge/55779 for me?
[10:47]  * stub has a look
[10:50] <stub> gmb: Do we have any future plans for people tweaking their subscription type, such as... umm... summary only, or digest modes, or selecting alternate email addresses?
[10:51] <gmb> stub: Not that I'm aware of (though those are all good ideas and I'm going to pretend you haven't suggested them so that I don't have to think about them)
[10:52] <stub> I thought they were sucky ideas but the best I could come up with on the spot
[10:52] <stub> I'm just wondering if we want BugSubscriptionFilterPreferences instead that can hold more than just a single boolean state.
[10:53] <stub> Its probably YAGNI
[10:53] <gmb> Yeah, I suspect to.
[10:53] <gmb> (Mainly because I don't think anyone's going to be touching subscriptions for a while once we're done with ti)
[10:54] <stub> Nothing to stop us migrating to that with the suggested data model anyway
[10:54] <gmb> True.
[10:55] <stub> gmb: Do you have any objection to dropping the id column? We are starting to do that in places where it makes sense, and here is such a case (we just need to declare (filter, person) the primary key instead)
[10:56] <gmb> stub: No, that's fine. In fact Gary suggested it and I forgot to make the change.
[10:56] <stub> cool. The relevant code changes just look like removals.
[10:56] <gmb> Right.
[10:57] <stub> Missing a NOT NULL on the date_created.
[10:58] <gmb> Whoops. Mea culpa; I cargo culted that from somewhere else.
[11:00] <stub> gmb: So... how do we cope with people dropping out of teams (or teams dropping out of teams)?
[11:00] <stub> gmb: Do those rows just rot?
[11:00] <gmb> stub: The idea is that we'll drop those rows.
[11:01] <stub> So they won't be matched when sending notifications, and there will be a garbo job to remove the noise?
[11:02] <stub> (A case could be made for not having the garbo job - drop out of a team and rejoin and your settings are the same as they used to be. Or maybe that is suprising?)
[11:03] <gmb> stub: Sorry, can you repeat your last two messages? My IRC client went all wibbly after my "drop those rows"
[11:04] <stub> (17:01:29) stub: So they won't be matched when sending notifications, and there will be a garbo job to remove the noise?
[11:04] <stub> (17:02:21) stub: (A case could be made for not having the garbo job - drop out of a team and rejoin and your settings are the same as they used to be. Or maybe that is suprising?)
[11:04] <gmb> Ta
[11:04] <gmb> I think the Garbo job would be the way to go. It seems more logical that your settings dissappear with your membership
[11:07] <stub> With a garbo, your settings *might* disappear - depends if you rejoin before it kicks in :)
[11:08] <stub> Anyway - that is irrelevant to the DB patch.
[11:09] <wgrant> stub: Speaking of garbo, is there any specific QA for your parallelisation?
[11:09] <stub> wgrant: If the garbo script runs without exploding, it is qa-ok
[11:10] <stub> Maybe we should check it defaulted to > 1 thread too if the debug output is enabled
[11:12] <stub> gmb: r=stub, approved version of script in the mp
[11:12] <gmb> stub: Brilliant, thanks.
[11:58] <gmb> stub: Off the top of your head, do you know how to declare the composite primary key in Python for Storm's sake?
[12:00] <stub> __primary_key__ = 'person', 'filter'
[12:00] <gmb> stub: Ah, thanks.
[12:00] <stub> Sorry - __storm_primary__ = 'person', 'filter'
[12:00] <stub> gmb: ^^
[12:00] <gmb> Right, ta
[12:03] <deryck> Morning, folks.
[12:05] <danilos> mrevell, how can we tell if LP downtime announcement is not an April 1st prank? :)
[12:05] <mrevell> danilos, Hah, I did wonder about putting something in there about that.
[12:06] <henninge> Hi deryck!
[12:06] <henninge> deryck: If you have some time to chat about the js code.
[12:06] <danilos> mrevell, you should have announced it as "On April 6th, we are scheduling the final downtime for Launchpad: after this one, there won't be any more because we are not bringing it back"
[12:06] <mrevell> heh
[12:06] <henninge> s/to/we could/
[12:07] <deryck> henninge: I can chat here certainly.  If you want to do voice, I try to hold voice calls until top of the next hour if possible....
[12:07] <mrevell> danilos, bigjools suggested changing the font to comic sans
[12:07] <deryck> henninge: children sleeping nearby :-)
[12:07] <danilos> mrevell, heh, I'd prefer "dingbats" or something like that
[12:07] <jml> mrevell: google beat us to it
[12:07] <henninge> deryck: since it's just us two, we can do it at the regular time.
[12:07] <jml> search for "Helvetica" in google
[12:07] <deryck> henninge: standup time?  Sure.  That works for me.
[12:08] <mrevell> oof
[12:08] <henninge> deryck: yes
[12:08] <deryck> henninge: ok, thanks.  Sorry to put you off about it.
[12:08] <henninge> deryck: np at all!
[12:08] <bigjools> mrevell, jml: searching for launchpad, we're only the 4th result :/
[12:08] <henninge> ;-)
[12:09] <henninge> bigjools: on German google we are first
[12:09] <deryck> bigjools: first for me too.  Logged in or not.
[12:09] <bigjools> I was using .co.uk
[12:09] <bigjools> oddness
[12:10] <deryck> yeah, weird.
[12:10] <henninge> bigjools: even there
[12:10] <elmo> it's pretty hard to get untainted results from google these days
[12:10] <bigjools> I jsut did it again and we're 4th
[12:10] <jml> bigjools: that's google UK, right?
[12:10] <elmo> unless you're on a fresh IP (range) with no cookies etc.
[12:10] <bigjools> yes
[12:10] <jml> bigjools: yeah. I get the same as you then.
[12:10] <henninge> bigjools: ah, now I get it, too.
[12:11] <henninge> (needed to switch to English)
[12:11] <jml> tbh, not sure I care too much about being #1 on everyone's google search
[12:11] <jml> would rather be #1 for "project hosting" or something like that
[12:12] <bigjools> jml: and for that we're not even on the first page
[12:12] <jml> bigjools: yeah.
[12:12] <bigjools> oddly, google is top.  fancy that
[12:12] <jml> bigjools: turns out you get what you put in.
[12:12]  * jml rebooting for upgrade
[12:12]  * deryck really meant to take today off to avoid the Internet
[12:12] <bigjools> deryck: +1
[12:13] <wallyworld> henninge: hi. are you able to +1 on that notification mp? me and wgrant need the lazr restful upgrade to land
[12:14] <henninge> wallyworld: oh sorry, forgot about that
[12:14] <wallyworld> henninge: np.
[12:15] <henninge> wallyworld: I also thought you had mentioned another reviewer ...
[12:15] <henninge> going there now
[12:16] <wallyworld> henninge: i didn't have anyone picked out. it's only a fairly small branch :-)
[12:16] <henninge> ok
[12:16] <henninge> ah, at the end of your comment "Of course! I've asked Benji to review it."
[12:17] <henninge> but you were referring to the lazr-js branch
[12:17] <henninge> my erro
[12:17] <henninge> r
[12:17] <wallyworld> henninge: i think i was referring to the lazr restful one
[12:17] <henninge> what I meant ;)
[12:17] <wallyworld> yeah, just messing with you
[12:20] <henninge> wallyworld: how does "node.set('innerHTML', notification);" scale up to wgrant's mail about xss attacks?
[12:20] <wgrant> It's evil but fine,.
[12:20] <wgrant> Since our notifications are escaped by addNotification.
[12:21] <wallyworld> henninge: what he said
[12:21] <henninge> ok, cool
[13:03] <henninge> wallyworld: approved although I have a further refactoring suggestion that I put in a branch. Have a look at my reply, please.
[13:04] <henninge> wallyworld: thanks for bearing with me. ;-)
[13:04]  * henninge is off to lunch
[13:24] <jelmer> jml: Hi
[13:25] <jelmer> jml: Do you if there was any discussion about the security implications of bfbip ? The LEP mentions it's something that should be considered but it doesn't have any further details.
[13:25] <jml> jelmer: yes, there were lots
[13:25] <jml> jelmer: on ubuntu-devel
[13:26] <jelmer> jml: Ah, I'll have a look in the archives. Thanks.
[13:29] <wgrant> The security issues are going to be a little interesting :/
[13:31] <jelmer> wgrant: yeah
[13:31]  * jelmer was thinking it would make sense to generate a manifest file that included the signed bzr testaments for the revisions involved
[13:31] <jelmer> but I'll catch up on the ubuntu-devel thread first
[13:31] <wgrant> jelmer: I think that's what we'll have to do.
[13:38] <LPCIBot> Project windmill build #130: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 11 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill/130/
[14:04] <jml> gary_poster: we were going to have a meeting *next* week to talk about bug subscriptions, right?
[14:06] <gary_poster> jml, right.  Monday?
[14:06] <jml> gary_poster: Monday's perfect.
[14:08] <henninge> Hi deryck! Sorry for the delay, I'll abe with you in a few minutes
[14:09] <deryck> henninge: no worries.  I thought you april fooled me for the standup today. ;)
[14:09] <gary_poster> jml, cool.  The big change from last time is that things have landed on qastaging.  So it can be a quick one probably.  I'll send you an email with details as before and you can propose a time for the meeting?
[14:09] <jml> gary_poster: sounds great, thanks.
[14:09] <henninge> deryck: gah, missed a chance ...
[14:09] <henninge> ;-)
[14:09] <gary_poster> cool
[14:10] <deryck> henninge: I would have hated you deeply for it ;)
[14:22] <wallyworld> henninge: thanks for the suggested changes. i've merged them in. i considered setting up a structure like that but with only 4 levels, it seemed ok without. but i like your changes
[14:30] <deryck> henninge: http://javascript.crockford.com/private.html
[14:33] <wallyworld> deryck: i'm landing the windmill prerequisit branch now. i've merged in your other changes into mine. will run that through ec2 over the w/e and keep my fingers crossed :-)
[14:33] <deryck> wallyworld: awesome, thanks!
[14:33] <wallyworld> np. i sure hope it passes ok :-)
[14:39] <deryck> henninge: 2 minutes and I'm ready again
[14:57] <deryck> henninge: http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/3/api/
[14:57] <deryck> henninge: http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/3/api/YUI~oop.html#method_bind
[14:59] <deryck> henninge: http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/3/api/module_widget.html
[15:03] <jtv> allenap: did you say you reformed how our CSS is composed as well?  My "make" breaks on picker-skin.css not being where it's supposed to.
[15:04] <allenap> jtv: No, I didn't change that. There have been some changes in that area recently though. Does it break after a make clean?
[15:04] <jtv> Oh, the softlink there makes no sense at all…
[15:04]  * jtv tries that
[15:05] <jtv> (May be why I've got the EC2 script hanging as well… I hope the meter isn't ticking while it's ignoring my instructions to shut down)
[15:10] <jtv> allenap: yup, "make" works.  Thanks.  Perhaps I rely in rocketfuel-get too much.
[15:11] <allenap> jtv: Cool :)
[15:16] <allenap> sinzui: Have you got a few minutes? In https://dev.launchpad.net/LEP/DerivativeDistributions, the mock-up for the amended +addseries page shows fields for name and displayname. There is no title field any more. However, for Ubuntu, displayname is always an init-capped name (see http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/588237/). I would prefer to keep the name and title fields, and auto-fill displayname. Do you have any thoughts about this?
[15:17] <sinzui> allenap: we want to remove title from all our objects
[15:17] <sinzui> We have spent about 4 years ignoring it, but we really do mean to do it
[15:18] <sinzui> Title was only intended to be used for the title in the browser (which will not work any more) and on the index page, which causes confusion between what you see and what you get.
[15:19] <allenap> sinzui: Okay. In the case of Ubuntu series, will people expect to put "The Natty Narwhal", for example, in as the displayname instead of title?
[15:20] <sinzui> allenap: I think people are being senseless. "The" make no more sense than "The Mozilla Firefox". It does not work in a sentence or a title.
[15:21] <sinzui> allenap: I want to look up one or two series bugs that are relevant to how we present names.
[15:21] <allenap> sinzui: I agree, but I don't think there's another field that holds the full series codename: name and displayname have just "natty" and "Natty". Only title contains "Natty Narwhal".
[15:21] <jml> oh hmm
[15:22] <jml> this reminds me of a spec thing that mpt wrote
[15:22] <jml> https://dev.launchpad.net/RegistrySimplifications
[15:22] <mpt> I'm old enough to remember back in 2005 when "Launchpad" was called "The Launchpad".
[15:23] <jml> "it's cleaner"
[15:24] <sinzui> allenap, jml, mpt: bug 419788, bug 493024 and bug 547082
[15:24] <_mup_> Bug #419788: Display name for distribution series doesn't follow vendor conventions <distributions> <lp-registry> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/419788 >
[15:24] <_mup_> Bug #493024: Debian sid/experimental have meaningless numeric versions assigned for Launchpad's internal purposes only <lp-registry> <series> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/493024 >
[15:24] <_mup_> Bug #547082: LTS series are not designated as such <distributions> <lp-registry> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/547082 >
[15:26] <sinzui> allenap: I think we also need to backout the named_version attr I added. Users are confused by the version and display name. And we used them inconsistently. We may want to make displayname a smart property that know to show both
[15:29] <gmb> Can anyone remind me how to export a property that returns a Boolean via the webservice? I can't export Attribute()... BooleanField maybe?
[15:29] <allenap> sinzui: Would the codename field then contain "Natty" or "Natty Narwhal"? If the former, is there any place for the full codename or will we assume that it will be added to the summary?
[15:30] <james_w> gmb, IArchive.isSourceUploadAllowed might give you inspiration
[15:30] <gmb> james_w: Aha, ta.
[15:32] <sinzui> allenap: *I think* code name should be "natty", isn't is used in URL? version is "11.04". displayname in the db is "Natty Narwhal"
[15:33] <mpt> codename != name
[15:33] <mpt> name = "natty", codename = "Natty" or "Natty Narwhal" (at the driver's discretion)
[15:34] <sinzui> allenap: but please consider that while we develope, pages need to say Natty Narwhal, when it is release, we refer to it as Ubuntu 11.04
[15:34] <jml> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric ← Apparently -1 packages need linking.
[15:34] <allenap> At the moment we have name=natty, displayname=Natty and title="Natty Narwhal".
[15:34] <mpt> My spec doesn't solve bug 493024, but I guess that would involve making version nullable -- and then deriving displayname from codename not just  before release date, but also after release date if there is no version.
[15:34] <_mup_> Bug #493024: Debian sid/experimental have meaningless numeric versions assigned for Launchpad's internal purposes only <lp-registry> <series> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/493024 >
[15:35] <sinzui> jml: the copying of package data took a few days for M and L.
[15:35] <mpt> (I guess sid/experimental don't have release dates anyway, so it's moot.)
[15:35] <sinzui> jml: I was terrified at first because I kept seeing my name appear for packages I linked months before
[15:35] <allenap> So that would migrate to name=natty, codename="Natty"-or-"Natty Narwhal" and displayname=(... a property ...)
[15:36] <sinzui> allenap: I think that gets us close to what we want
[15:37] <sinzui> I am unsure of LTS. I think it needs its own field/flag so that we can show Ubuntu 10.04 LTS
[15:37] <allenap> sinzui: Can that go in the version field?
[15:39] <sinzui> allenap: no, version must be a debversion
[15:39] <allenap> sinzui: I will just capture name and displayname for now then, auto-fill title, and discuss fixing bug 419788 with bigjools.
[15:39] <_mup_> Bug #419788: Display name for distribution series doesn't follow vendor conventions <distributions> <lp-registry> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/419788 >
[15:39] <allenap> sinzui: Ah, okay.
[15:40] <sinzui> though I recall we have two definitions of debversion. While both will oops with if you try to add SPACE  " LTS", the oopses may be different
[15:40] <jml> huh. Launchpad has a million revisions.
[15:41] <sinzui> \o/
[15:41] <sinzui> We have reached the end of development
[15:41]  * sinzui gets out the django books
[15:41] <mpt> Is debversion some rule set by Debian? If so, why do non-Debian distributions in Launchpad have to follow it?
[15:41] <jml> please go to the main dais to collect your prize
[15:42] <sinzui> mpt: you will find one or two bugs that strongly state Lp cannot support non-debian distros. those that we have work by accident, though I would hardly call them weorking
[15:43] <sinzui> mpt: we cannot support non-debian packages names either
[15:48] <mpt> By "non-Debian" I meant Ubuntu, actually
[15:54] <bigjools> mpt: Debversion is not connected to Debian other than that they use it and they named it.  Ubuntu uses it too.
[15:54] <bigjools> but also Launchpad uses it
[15:56] <mpt> bigjools, well either "10.04 LTS" is a valid debversion (I'm assuming it isn't), or Ubuntu occasionally uses a version which isn't a debversion.
[15:57] <bigjools> mpt: that looks more like a title :)
[15:58] <mpt> heh
[15:58] <mpt> If Windows had been Debian-based, "98 SE" would still be a very different version from "98".
[16:00] <mpt> (yeah, I know, it was really version 4.10 underneath.)
[16:04] <james_w> hi, is someone available to debug bug 745801?
[16:04] <_mup_> Bug #745801: system-based authorization doesn't store useful credentials in gnome-keyring <amd64> <apport-bug> <natty> <launchpadlib :New> <python-launchpadlib (Ubuntu):New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/745801 >
[16:04] <james_w> it's not obvious to me, and may break launchpadlib entirely for some people with the move to system-wide credentials
[16:36] <jtv> Does anyone have any ideas why my ec2 instance seems to be hanging where it's supposed to be branching off db-devel?  I can ssh into the instance and "bzr ls" to the same branch URL so I don't understand why the dev script isn't moving on from that point.
[16:38] <jml> jtv: no.
[16:38] <jml> jtv: tried strace?
[16:39] <jtv> No… but I'm wondering if maybe either ssh or bzr is waiting for input.
[16:40] <jtv> It'd have to be bzr.
[16:40] <jml> Wondering is a good start.
[16:40] <jtv> I hit enter just now, and then I got a traceback saying the bzr command failed.
[16:42] <jtv> It's going to be a noninteractive shell, so weird things happen if the remote command prompts for input—though normally I think that means it will fail rather than block.
[16:43] <jtv> Nope, nope, "ssh cat" will happily take client-side input and forward it to server-side stdin.
[16:44] <jtv> As will subprocess.call.
[16:44] <jtv> Let's see whether the bzr command actually has a process on the instance.
[16:51] <jtv> Holy cow!
[16:51] <jtv> It's not hanging, it's busy.
[16:52] <jtv> Or was.
[16:52] <jtv> Then it falls idle, and when I hit enter in the terminal that's running the ec2 script, I get the traceback.
[16:53] <jtv> So it looks as if bzr is sitting there forever waiting for input.
[16:53] <jtv> What input does a "bzr branch" ever ask for?
[16:55] <jml> jtv: none that I know of.
[16:55] <jtv> I just got a "broken pipe" during instance startup, by the way.  That's unusual.
[16:56] <jml> jtv: if you can reproduce the problem, use strace, then you'll see if it's writing a prompt, what it's writing, whether it's waiting for input etc.
[16:56] <jtv> That's what I'm doing now, yes.
[16:56] <jtv> It's completely reproducible so far.
[16:59] <jtv> Oh private parts!
[17:00] <jtv> The "bzr branch" seems to complete.
[17:00] <jtv> write(2, "Branched 10381 revision(s).\n", 28) = 28
[17:00] <jtv> ioctl(2, SNDCTL_TMR_TIMEBASE or TCGETS, 0x7fff18dd7ce0) = -1 EINVAL (Invalid argument)
[17:01] <jml> jtv: what's going on locally?
[17:01] <jtv> On my system?  Just a RunTimeError saying the "bzr branch" command failed.
[17:02] <jtv> It happens in this order:
[17:02] <jtv> "bzr branch" does its work, and prints its "Branched 10381 revision(s)" which normally means success.
[17:03] <jtv> It then does that ioctl, which fails, and it exits.
[17:03] <jtv> The ec2 script, which is doing a subprocess.call on an ssh command line that runs the "bzr branch," doesn't notice this until I hit enter on my client system.
[17:04] <jtv> When I do, it reports failure without further details.
[17:04] <jtv> Oh, here's more fun:
[17:04] <jtv> ettimeofday({1301673535, 408435}, NULL) = 0
[17:04] <jtv> write(3, "96.727  return code 0\n", 22) = 22
[17:04] <jtv> exit_group(0)                           = ?
[17:04] <jtv> No idea what that last write means, but it sort of suggests success as well.
[17:05] <jtv> Maybe it's just a crappy connection.  On one connection I use a lot I've been completely unable to use ec2.
[17:06] <jml> me neither. lsof could probably tell you what fd 3 means. what's the local traceback?
[17:06] <jtv> And my IRC connections keep dropping in several places ("because TCP connections use port 80 and are short-lived," I guess)
[17:07] <allenap> There is an inverse correlation between my patience with diff generation in merge proposals and my age.
[17:07] <jml> allenap: nice patch. couple of questions.
[17:07] <allenap> bac: Do you fancy taking a gander at a very short improvement for LayeredDocFileSuite? https://code.launchpad.net/~allenap/launchpad/sensible-test-ids-for-doctests/+merge/55959
[17:07] <jml> allenap: have you tried it?
[17:07] <jtv> jml: the local traceback just says that prepare_tests failed in run_with_ssh_agent, doing the "bzr branch <…> /var/launchpad/test"
[17:07] <allenap> bac: Cancel; jml's seen it.
[17:07] <allenap> Thanks though.
[17:07] <allenap> jml: I've tried it only for a limited set of tests.
[17:08] <jml> allenap: and, also, it might be nice to normpath the id, since the __repr__ tends to have "/../" in it.
[17:08] <jml> allenap: I'll give it a go locally.
[17:09] <allenap> jml: Okay, good idea. Do you think I should normpath(test._dt_test.filename) then, instead of using __repr__?
[17:09] <jml> allenap: uhhh... pass.
[17:10] <allenap> jml: I'll be brave and do it then ;)
[17:10] <jml> wait, Henri II, no crap that's University Challenge
[17:13] <jml> test: lib/lp/code/tests/../doc/branch-notifications.txt
[17:13] <jml> successful: lib/lp/code/tests/../doc/branch-notifications.txt
[17:13] <jml> \o/
[17:13] <allenap> Woohoo :)
[17:14] <jml> and it works for pagetests too
[17:14]  * allenap is getting dizzy.
[17:16] <benji> bac: incoming: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~benji/launchpad/better-HTML-generation/+merge/55960
[17:16] <jml>             test.id = lambda: os.path.normpath(repr(test))
[17:17] <jml> that works.
[17:19] <allenap> jml: But the right hand side of the lambda is references test from the local scope doesn't it, so all tests would have the same id as the last.
[17:19] <allenap> jml: My solution is: test.id = partial(os.path.normpath, test._dt_test.filename)
[17:19] <bigjools> jml: when is convenient to have a phone call about derived distros next week?
[17:19] <jml> allenap: well spotted
[17:19] <jml> allenap: if that works, do it. thanks so much for the patch. this has been bugging me for ages.
[17:20] <allenap> jml: Cool, I'll send it off. Thanks for looking at it.
[17:20] <jml> bigjools: any time in the morning.
[17:20] <jtv> jml: got a bit further by setting ServerAliveInterval to 5!  Still failing, but it's progress
[17:21] <bigjools> jtv: shouldn't you be down at the banana bar at your time of night?
[17:21] <jtv> the what now?
[17:21] <jtv> I've got a watermelon… does that count?
[17:21]  * bigjools 's eyes water
[17:23] <jtv> Bit out of my daylight cycle; had a lat-night call from the West Pole.
[17:28] <jcsackett> hm. it would seem none of the hardwaredb unittests are hooked up to test discovery...
[17:30] <jtv> jml: victory!  Lowered the ServerAliveInterval to 2 and now I'm failing with a regular merge conflict.
[17:30] <jml> jcsackett: blink.
[17:31] <bigjools> I've come across tests that were not in test discovery before, can't remember why though
[17:32] <jcsackett> jml: not as dire as i thought, but there are tests in lib/lp/hardwaredb/scripts/tests that i cannot seem to fire off.
[17:32] <jcsackett> perhaps they're hooked in some funny way so bin/test can't do its name matching magic.
[17:38] <jml> jcsackett: could you please file a bug about this?
[17:38] <jcsackett> jml: i fully intend, just as soon as i have some more information.
[17:38] <jml> jcsackett: thanks.
[17:39] <jcsackett> s/i fully intend/i fully intend to/
[17:39] <jcsackett> and then i'll have to close that bug to close the one i'm working on. :-P
[17:39] <jml> dig.
[17:42] <jtv> This had me forgetting what day it was for a moment… http://chromeadblock.com/freedom/
[17:45] <jtv> OMG my "ec2 land" detached successfully.  I'm keeping protocol keepalives in my ssh config.
[17:51] <jcsackett> jml: so, just moving the tests from script/tests into the regular tests folder makes them discoverable, which works as a work around--should bin/test be able to find any tests in a "tests" folder?
[17:51] <jcsackett> (regular here being "hardwaredb/tests")
[17:53] <LPCIBot> Project windmill build #131: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 11 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill/131/
[18:12] <bigjools> night everyone, have a nice weekend
[18:34] <bac> benji: can you fix the conflicts in your branch and repush?
[18:34] <benji> bac: sure
[18:35] <bac> benji: "Ititilize"?
[18:35] <bac> i'm not sure what that is meant to say
[18:36] <benji> heh; "Initialize" probably
[18:36] <bac> ah, that makes sense.  i was going for 'utilize'
[18:47] <benji> bac: conflict fixed
[19:30] <bac> benji: in add_recipient_picker you reverted to the old style string catenation method.  why is that?
[19:31] <benji> bac: looking
[19:32] <benji> bac: there is some string concatination, but it's for string constants, which I believe is kosher
[19:34] <bac> benji: ok.  i just hope it isn't a vector for future mods to revert us to the bad way
[19:35] <benji> yeah, I've given some thought as to how to validate or at least lint against bad string injection and I haven't had any great ideas; maybe something to research (I think Google has a JS to JS compiler somewhat along those lines)
[19:52] <benji> gary_poster: Feature Work 2 is empty! (other than the over-arching card)
[19:52] <gary_poster> benji, yay!  I'll close it down!
[19:52] <gary_poster> bac, benji, yay & congrats!
[19:53] <benji> gary_poster: I'm trying to find the next card I should start, but I've lost it.  Any hint as to where it went?
[19:53] <bac> \0/
[19:53] <gary_poster> benji, "Link bug target subscription edit page from target's main page and bug pillar main page." I think?
[19:53] <gary_poster> bottom left of FW 1
[21:03] <deryck> have a nice weekend, everyone!
[21:19] <jcsackett> anyone fixing that merge error? and if not, can someone sanity check this fix: http://paste.ubuntu.com/588384/
[21:21]  * sinzui looks
[21:22] <sinzui> jcsackett: that looks good to land
[21:24]  * jcsackett goes to land it.
[21:24] <jcsackett> thanks.
[22:15] <sinzui> jcsackett: looks like answers were ignored this week :(
[22:15] <sinzui> jcsackett: do we have any power to delete bug spam yet
[22:16] <jcsackett> sinzui: yeah, we can kill bug spam, but i am still hunting down the hiding-comments script, so we have to do it the hard way.
[22:16] <jcsackett> i can tell you how, or you can assign the answers to me and i'll go whack 'em.
[22:19] <sinzui> jcsackett: I asked a losa for the script.
[22:20] <jcsackett> sinzui: i emailed him about that this morning, since i think they are getting a tad hammered. have not yet heard back. which confirms some of the hammered.
[22:21] <mbarnett> jcsackett: i saw your email earlier today but have been running about all day.  I'll shoot it over to sinzui momentarily
[22:21] <mbarnett> sinzui: this staging lists thing is also going to be a bigger project than just flipping a bit in the vhost.  The relevant tools don't appear to even be installed, so this is going to take some doing to get fixed up.
[22:22] <jcsackett> mbarnett: figured you were just really busy. :-)
[22:23] <sinzui> mbarnett: noted. I will rethink this issue. either we convince ISD to restore the feature, or we introduce a hack that generates apache handler rules. I think we may want to remove the feature temporarily next week so that we can test. I will be in touch with the losa next week
[22:24] <LPCIBot> Project windmill build #132: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 11 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill/132/
[22:24] <mbarnett> sinzui: okay.  i'll revert the current changes.  Sorry it wasn't a quick fix.  Is there anything else (barring the entire archive!) that woudl help you qa right now?
[22:26] <sinzui> mbarnett: the script I provided does not use the web, so we are not blocked form running it next week, we can choose to make the staging list server use the inline team setup (add admin and launchpad) so we can test. Actually that might be the correct hack until we have a long term fix
[22:26] <mbarnett> sinzui: jcsackett: devpad:~mbarnett/tmp/hide-comments.py
[22:27] <jcsackett> mbarnett: you are my new best friend.
[22:27] <jcsackett> so it doesn't live in a branch anywhere?
[22:27] <mbarnett> jcsackett: it used to live on asuka, but with some SSO changes, we have to now run it locally
[22:27] <mbarnett> jcsackett: so... not really no.
[22:29] <mbarnett> jcsackett: if you send me a patch, i'd check it back in on asuke
[22:29] <mbarnett> asuka, so we have a current copy in the place it used to run from.
[22:29] <mbarnett> that is the closest thing to a home the thing has.
[22:31] <jcsackett> mbarnett: dig.
[22:31] <jcsackett> mbarnett: i will send the patch to you as soon as it's ready.
[22:31] <mbarnett> many thankses
[22:38] <sinzui> jcsackett: I am hacking on the script now. it does not immediately work on my machine. It assumed old Lp and launchpadlib
[22:38] <sinzui> My setup is current since I use lplib almost every day
[22:39] <jcsackett> sinzui: on the spam front; we should have the power to kill question spam ourselves in the next day or two; branches all actually landed.
[22:39] <sinzui> I saw
[22:40] <jcsackett> *such* bad luck landing those things.
[22:40] <sinzui> I have been distracted planing mailing list archive qa
[22:40]  * jcsackett nods.
[22:40] <jcsackett> that would be distracting.
[22:41] <sinzui> jcsackett: I now have a working version\o/
[22:41] <sinzui> I do not recall authorising it though
[23:00] <sinzui> jcsackett: here is the version I used to hide the bug comments mentioned in the open questions: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/588419/
[23:03] <jcsackett> sinzui: i was just disconnected from my irc bouncer; i was alerted you messaged me, but didn't get the message.
[23:05] <sinzui> jcsackett: here is the version I used to hide the bug comments mentioned in the open questions: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/588419/
[23:06] <sinzui> jcsackett: I will update the maintenance page on dev Monday. I on on Maintenance for the day (you being off), so I am sure to remember to do it
[23:10] <jcsackett> sinzui: dig. i'll use your updated comment to add the question stuff too.
[23:11] <LPCIBot> Project windmill build #133: STILL FAILING in 47 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill/133/
[23:16] <jcsackett> sinzui: we're at EOD. did you want to do the mumbly standup thing?
[23:27] <sinzui> jcsackett: No, we chatted. we both struggled to get things done
[23:28] <jcsackett> sinzui: works for me. :-)
[23:28] <jcsackett> have a good weekend!


[06:23] <flocculant> bluesabre: well - I can get thunar to crash pretty much at will
[06:39] <flocculant> sigh - seems the wiki's locked up again ...
[11:13] <flocculant> akxwi-dave: ack on thunar not crashing on you - thanks :)
[12:03] <akxwi-dave> anytime..... tried really hard to get it to...
[13:10] <flocculant> akxwi-dave: hilarious situation - trying to force a crash - and it doesn't :p
[13:11] <davmor2> flocculant: use a bigger hammerf
[13:11] <davmor2> -f
[13:11] <flocculant> knome: beginning to wonder whether we'd be better off moving the release wiki page(s) if w.u.c keeps being shut down - can't remember rationale for not doing that
[13:12] <flocculant> davmor2: :)
[13:12] <flocculant> I can get it to crash without hammerf
[13:12] <davmor2> Daves first rule of testing if at first it doesn't break use a bigger hammer
[13:12] <flocculant> :)
[13:13]  * flocculant prefers the other way
[13:13] <flocculant> use enormous hammer first and work backwards to the pin hammer
[13:13] <akxwi-dave> hell yeah... if that don't work.. get the 20lb sledgehammer
[13:17] <davmor2> akxwi-dave: pffff you and your pathetic 20lb Sledge this is where you aim to get to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mj%C3%B6lnir if it survives that it ain't breakin and can be released :D
[13:18] <akxwi-dave> lol
[13:21] <knome> flocculant, includes from the main release notes being the main reason
[13:22] <knome> flocculant, but i guess we can move them anyway
[13:22] <knome> flocculant, did you see the discussion about some wiki pages being deleted from the community wiki by spammers?
[13:22] <knome> flocculant, we might want to take action relatively soon to get our release notes into safety
[13:23] <flocculant> knome: yea some conversation re that somewhere
[13:23] <flocculant> and the ticket
[13:23] <flocculant> knome: re existing pages - yup - was thinking about
[13:27] <knome> flocculant, i just read your proposal for the council with good thought the first time
[13:27] <knome> it is actually one proposal, not 7 separate ones
[13:27] <knome> am i right?
[13:29] <flocculant> it is really - s/proposal/points
[13:29] <flocculant> knome: got the raw text for currently supported releases now
[13:30] <flocculant> knome: given that we don't <include> currently, just [[link|blah]] then no reason to not move them
[13:30] <knome> ack, edited that in the wiki
[13:31] <knome> err
[13:31] <knome> pad
[13:31] <knome> ^ re: proposal/point
[13:31] <flocculant> only pita for me is [[Bug:number]] from launchpad if we move
[13:31] <flocculant> yup okey doke
[13:32] <flocculant> knome: also want to have a chat at some point re cont.docs vs wiki now that we've got both under our control
[13:35] <knome> yep
[13:35] <knome> basically i'm fine with whatever you want
[13:36] <knome> but i think it's a good idea to have the contributor docs as is for the more technical and boring bit
[13:36] <knome> +s
[13:37] <flocculant> yea - was thinking of moving the user facing stuff to wiki - easier to get changes out there
[13:37] <flocculant> the more tech qa 'team' stuff I wasn't going to touch
[13:39] <knome> what user facing stuff?
[13:40] <knome> remember that our main outlet for user facing stuff is still website;)
[13:40] <knome> i guess you mean the "this is how you get started" kind of material?
[13:40] <flocculant> by user I'm talking about 'testers' rather than 'qa team'
[13:40] <flocculant> yup
[13:41] <flocculant> knome: like chapter 4-6 http://docs.xubuntu.org/contributors/
[20:30] <ochosi> evening all
[20:30] <Unit193> Howdy.
[20:33] <ochosi> what's new?
[20:36] <Unit193> Lots of emails.
[20:38] <ochosi> well i tried to stop it as soon as i saw it coming!
[20:38] <ochosi> (:
[20:46] <flocculant> evening ochosi Unit193
[20:47] <Unit193> Howdy.
[20:48]  * ochosi is catching up on the pad
[20:50] <flocculant> better there than an everexpanding email :)
[20:54] <flocculant> assumption being people are in the pad team I guess
[20:55] <ochosi> mhm
[20:55] <ochosi> anyway, added some colors to the text now
[20:59] <flocculant> :)
[21:13] <ochosi> fwiw, i prolonged my xpl team membership for 2 more months
[21:14] <ochosi> consider this an interim action
[21:14] <flocculant> makes sense
[21:14] <flocculant> wandering off - night all :)
[21:18] <slickymaster> night flocculant
[21:21] <ochosi> night all
[21:21] <Unit193> krytarik: I removed a bunch of double spaces, you may catch a few I missed though.
[21:23] <slickymaster> night ochosi
[21:44] <bluesabre> evening all
[21:45] <Unit193> Howdy, bluesabre.
[21:45] <slickymaster> hey bluesabre
[21:46] <bluesabre> hey Unit193 slickymaster
[21:49] <Unit193> bluesabre: Ported anything to GTK3 today? ;)
[21:50] <bluesabre> Unit193: not today, might get started on that tonight, or fix some bugs somewhere
[21:50] <Unit193> Hah, just harassing you.  'Tis all good.
[21:50] <bluesabre> :D
[21:50] <bluesabre> but first
[21:50] <bluesabre> dinner
[21:50] <bluesabre> :D


[14:17] <s10gopal> how to convert ubuntu to ubuntu budgie ?
[23:26] <matlock> you should just need to add the ubuntu budgie ppa and can install from there
[23:27] <matlock> well it looks like it's in the main repos now
[23:27] <matlock> https://www.ubuntuupdates.org/package/core/bionic/universe/base/ubuntu-budgie-meta


[11:52] <BluesKaj> Hi sll
 hiyas
[11:53] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[18:31] <mmikowski> RikMills sgmoore: Any thoughts about backporting 5.27.12 to Kubuntu 22.04 LTS?
 Seeing as I am on jammy now, I am in favor. /me wonders if there is fancy tooling to make this easy. I will look into it.
 though I reckon you mean 5.27.11 ?
[19:23] <mmikowski> sgmoore: Ah, there you are! :)
[19:24] <mmikowski> sgmoore RikMills: There appears to be a 5.27.12 in the works. I saw it in a KDE development report IIRC. Lemme check ...
 I am here, seems I forgot to setup IRC. Oops.
[19:49] <mmikowski> sgmoore RikMills: In Nate Graham's blog, he mentions 5.27.12: "Installing a font on Wayland now actually works, rather than crashing System Settings (Nicolas Fella, Plasma 5.27.12. Link)"
[19:50] <mmikowski> However, the bug link points to "fixed in 5.27.11". So, eh?
[19:50] <mmikowski> So maybe just a typo. sgmoore RikMills ^^
[19:52] <mmikowski> According to the schedule, it does not yet exist. https://community.kde.org/Schedules/Plasma_5.
[19:53] <mmikowski> sgmoore RikMills: We have run desktop checks before releases before, and can do so again if this is placed in a testing repo first. So if you want that, we're here.
 OK, I will do that
[20:03] <mmikowski> kbuntu-ppa-ubuntu-backports-landing or kubuntu-ppa-ubuntu-experimental-jammy were used in the path. I think -landing is /likely/ better for this, but certainly that's RikMills call :)


 :D it's very easy :)
[10:09] <Kilos> i used to have one there years ago i hink
[10:10] <Kilos> explain whats easy
[10:11] <elacheche> You need only to get the ubuntu-planet configuration file from lp, then add your blog rss in that file → only 3 lines to add (link, name, hackergotchi), then copy your hackergotchi to the rigth file.. then commit the changes to lp
[10:12] <Kilos> whew
[10:12] <Kilos> no you do it
[10:13] <Kilos> you want to split my head again
[10:13] <elacheche> If the project maintainer tell me that there is no problem in that I'll do it..
[10:14] <Kilos> do you know how to search the planet stuff, there might be residue left behind after i had my last blog removed
[10:15] <elacheche> Kilos, come to #canonical-sysadmin to ask them if I can add your blog
[10:15] <elacheche> No idea Kilos
[10:15] <Kilos> ok be there now
[10:26] <elacheche> Kilos, you're blog link again please :D and you're hackergotchi via email :)
[10:26] <elacheche> or a link to it
[10:26] <Kilos> lol
[10:26] <Kilos> QA  kilos.newblog
[10:26] <QA> Kilos: Huh?
[10:26] <Kilos> ai!
[10:27] <elacheche> hahah :D
[10:27] <Kilos> QA  kilos.newblog is <reply> http://kilosubuntu.blogspot.com
[10:27] <QA> Kilos: One learns a new thing every day
[10:28] <elacheche> it's ok I find the hackergothi kenju254
[10:28] <elacheche> Kilos,
[10:28] <Kilos> haha
[10:29] <Kilos> where did you find the gotchi thing?
[10:29] <elacheche> blog
[10:30] <Kilos> haha
[10:31] <elacheche> Kilos, I add all the blog or only one label? → some blogs don't talk about ONLY ubuntu, so you can tag the posts using labels..
[10:31] <Kilos> you see my old blog there too?
[10:32] <Kilos> only the new link i think, the old one was like my history
[10:32] <Kilos> i dunno
[10:32] <Kilos> labels are things you stick on botles when you make canned fruit
[10:32] <elacheche> No no not like that :D
[10:33] <elacheche> Yeah it's like canned fruits :D I'll explain
[10:33] <Kilos> lol what you talking about then
[10:33] <Kilos> lol
[10:35] <elacheche> My blog talks about Ubuntu, and some other stuff like my personal life.. the guys don't like that I add all my blog to the planet, because nobody wanna know about my personal life :D So I TAG my blog posts using a tag called ubuntu-planet, and add ONLY that RSS' tag to the planet.. So only Ubuntu related things are showed in my blog :)
[10:36] <Kilos> yes thats good. my new blog will only be on ubuntu stuff anyway
[10:36] <elacheche> If your blog will be ONLY about Ubuntu so I'll add all of it :D
[10:36] <elacheche> OK then :)
[10:41] <Kilos> ty elacheche
[10:43] <elacheche> it's done http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~planet-ubuntu/config/main/revision/1785 Kilos
[10:44] <Kilos> w0000
[10:44] <elacheche> Now you need just a to write a blog post :D And it'll be in the planet :D
[10:44] <Kilos> oh isnt this one there
[10:45] <Kilos> this one is the important one
[10:46] <Kilos> hmm...
[10:46] <Kilos> maybe i can just republish it
[10:46] <elacheche> Remove it then add it again.. The planet shows only posts newer than 7 days
[10:46] <Kilos> will do ty
[10:47] <Kilos> eating lots of dates and drinking camel milk makes you clever hey
[10:47] <Kilos> hehe
[10:47] <elacheche> anyway if you do we need to wait for at least 2hours so the cron job add you to the live website
[10:48] <elacheche> hahaha :D why you still taling about camel milk and dates :p We have an African/European life style here.. And never have the chance to drink camel milk in my life x)
[10:48] <elacheche> talking*
[10:49] <Kilos> lol
[10:49] <Kilos> i love ragging people
[10:50] <elacheche> :D :D
[10:50] <Kilos> i do the same with neil thats in UAE
[10:51] <elacheche> hahaha :D He should have try camel milk at least once :D
[10:52] <Kilos> i dont know if one can even get camel milk
[10:52] <elacheche> I think that you can :D
[10:53] <Kilos> and my brother is in dubai at rotek head quarters
[10:54] <Kilos> he is going to some africa country soon to start a project for new power stations or something
[10:54] <elacheche> Good :)
[11:11] <elacheche> Kilos, your blog is live now :D You can add new post to see it in the planet :d
[11:25] <Kilos> im tring to find how to republish or delete it
[11:25] <Kilos> ill get there
[11:29] <elacheche> Or maybe write a new one :D
[11:29] <Kilos> lol you want me to think again
[11:30] <Kilos> ill just copy paste it into a new blog
[11:33] <Kilos> haha 2 with same name
[11:33] <Kilos> what a twit
[11:52] <Kilos> eish elacheche  how come that blog shows with red c overing it
[11:52] <Kilos> oh my
[12:32] <elacheche> What!
[12:32] <Kilos> lol
[12:32] <Kilos> http://planet.ubuntu.com
[12:33] <elacheche> You did removed it → http://kilosubuntu.blogspot.com/2015/06/well-well-long-time-since-i-last.html ?
[12:33] <Kilos> some weird thing when copy pasting to next blog
[12:34] <Kilos> all red
[12:35] <elacheche> I saw it.. You removed it and it will be removed from the planet after thenext cron
[12:35] <Kilos> oh
[12:39] <Kilos> maybe i must try sleep a while
[13:00] <elacheche> Yep
[13:00] <elacheche> Kilos, Change your confuiguration so the blog post tittle will show up before the blog post
[13:00] <Kilos> let me try
[13:07] <Kilos> na too much rtfs to try find the config stuff, used to be so easy now blogging is hard work
[13:18] <elacheche> x)
[15:23] <elacheche> Kilos, can you please remind me about adding the new slot to the calender?
[15:23] <Kilos> ok
[15:23]  * elacheche is decaffeinated, so he can't focus on many things at one..
[15:23] <Kilos> elacheche  dont forget to asdd the new slot
[15:23] <Kilos> hehe
[15:24] <Kilos> there
[15:24] <elacheche> hahaha :D
[15:24] <elacheche> Thanks you :D
[15:24] <Kilos> you welcome
[15:24] <Kilos> :D
[15:25] <elacheche> I'm a coffee addicted.. And I stop drinking coffee during day since yesterday, so I'm not in a good mental situation right now :D
[15:25] <Kilos> oh my
[15:26] <elacheche> And am not going back to coffee soon.. Maybe I'll go back to coffee by July, not before that x)
[15:26] <Kilos> whew
[15:27] <elacheche> :)
[15:28] <Kilos> i love coffee as wel but drink mosly tea, beer mugs full
[15:28] <elacheche> I don't like tea..
[15:39] <Kilos> green tea very healthy
[15:39] <Kilos> or try get rooibos tea
[16:04] <elacheche> I hate tea :D
[17:03] <Kilos> elacheche  go watch meetings channel
[18:11] <Kilos> elacheche  Kilos, can you please remind me about adding the new slot to the calender?
[18:29] <Kilos> ubuntiste-msakni  elacheche  Kilos, can you please remind me about adding the new slot to the calender?
[18:47] <uxfi> hi there
[18:47] <uxfi> ANyone around?
[18:48] <Kilos> hi uxfi
[18:48] <Kilos> welcome to ubuntu-africa
[18:49] <uxfi> Anyone here watch Nollywood?
[18:54] <uxfi> thx Kilos
[18:54] <Kilos> you welcome
[18:55] <Kilos> stickyboy  help here with movies info please
[18:55] <Kilos> you know more than me
[19:20] <Kilos> elacheche  elacheche  Kilos, can you please remind me about adding the new slot to the calender?
[19:33] <uxfi> anyone here?
[19:33] <Kilos> yeah just busy atm
[19:34] <uxfi> ah
[19:34] <uxfi> Anyone here watch movies African movies?
[19:37] <uxfi> brb
[20:08] <Kilos> sorry melodie  membership meeting atm
[20:08] <melodie> Kilos have a good meeting
[20:08] <Kilos> ty


[02:33] <rtg> Hi
[02:34] <rtg> So... some of my packagesources no longer have release files. Notably http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/impish-security/Release  and the http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/impish-security/Release related ones.
[02:35] <rtg> i should upgrade to 22.04 , now these no longer having relase files for me however does itself get in the way though
[02:41] <arraybolt3[m]> rtg: There's official docs for how to upgrade from an EOL release, I'll find 'em real quick...
[02:41] <arraybolt3[m]> rtg: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EOLUpgrades
[02:41] <arraybolt3[m]> rtg: Please back up your important data before doing this, Ubuntu upgrades can go poorly all too often.
[02:43] <rtg> right
[02:43] <rtg> thx
[02:44] <arraybolt3[m]> 👍
[02:50] <rtg> Sorry but gonna head off to install a harddrive ive got lying around for that purpose then
[03:20] <rtg> fascinating
[03:24] <rtg> that harddrive i dug up has an image of the two windows based SSDs in this machine which... well, i havent changed the contents of those in a long time - since windows destroyed itself, essentialy
[03:25] <rtg> at least not significantly
[06:31] <akshat_> hello, world!
 Yelp! After changing my DNS in the GUI - which did not work - so I changed it back, I now no longer have wifi connection. I get 'Waiting for authorization' I have re-installed Network Manager but cannot get wifi again. What can I troubleshoot?
[11:17] <mparillo> I have had success deleting the SSID from Network Manager, rebooting and adding it back again.
 nmcli connection up [network-name] —ask lets me connect, but the GUI does not.
 How do I do that? (re @IrcsomeBot: <mparillo> I have had success deleting the SSID from Network Manager, rebooting and adding it back again.)
 Delete from Settings Network Manager then reboot. Hmm, I tried deletion - but maybe not reboot before reconnection. (re @IrcsomeBot: <mparillo> I have had success deleting the SSID from Network Manager, rebooting and adding it back again.)
 Delete from Settings Network Manager then reboo?. Hmm, I tried deletion - but maybe not reboot before reconnection. (re @IrcsomeBot: <mparillo> I have had success deleting the SSID from Network Manager, rebooting and adding it back again.)
 Delete from Settings Network Manager then reboot? Hmm, I tried deletion - but maybe not reboot before reconnection. (re @IrcsomeBot: <mparillo> I have had success deleting the SSID from Network Manager, rebooting and adding it back again.)
 Nope. (re @Anarchotaoist: Delete from Settings Network Manager then reboot? Hmm, I tried deletion - but maybe not reboot before reconnection.)
[12:05] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[22:31] <user|39> hola, tengo un problema. Recientemente instalé kubuntu 22.04.4 y cuando quiero descargar algo ya sea desde el terminal o por discover descarga lentísimo. Pero internet funciona perfectamente con buena velocidad. Que puedo hacer?.