[12:52] <ScottK> toma: Yes.  It's a new "Feature" of Launchpad.
[12:53] <toma> ScottK: wow. when i would suggest that for kde, i would have been kicked out of the project ;-)
[12:54] <toma> i wont attack you, i was just surprised
[12:54] <ScottK> I already duked it out with sabfl today over the LP U/I changes, so I'm not going to do it again.
[12:55] <toma> is there an announcement somewhere with the thought behind it?
[12:56] <ScottK> It's in the LP 1.1.9 release notes.  That's all I saw.
[12:56] <toma> okay thnxs for the info
[01:00] <coreymon77> fucking hell!!!
[01:00] <coreymon77> i finally complete the report...again! and guess what happens
[01:00] <toma> hey, hey, !language
[01:01] <coreymon77> now the authentication database (logging in) doesnt work and i cant edit, causing me to loose my work again and have to start over
[01:01] <coreymon77> again!
[01:01] <coreymon77> ScottK: this is unbelieveable
[01:03] <ScottK> This is because our ever reliable Launchpad is down for maintenance right now.
[01:04] <ScottK> coreymon77: For future reference, write such stuff in an editor and then copy/paste it into the wiki.
[01:07] <ScottK> Heh.
[01:28] <nosrednaekim> Kubuntu can't stray away from the base, system packages offered by ubuntu can it?
[01:29] <nosrednaekim> like, to provide better 32 bit support
[01:30] <nosrednaekim> *64 bit
[02:28] <gnomefreak> nosrednaekim: not really since they are mostly restricted apps that dont work for 64bit
[02:29] <nosrednaekim> well, I mean, at least install a 32 bit firefox?
[02:29] <gnomefreak> nosrednaekim: most of the apps in main updates are fine with 64 its things like flash java and so on
[02:29] <nosrednaekim> and some 32 bit libs
[02:29] <nosrednaekim> exactly.
[02:29] <gnomefreak> nosrednaekim: nspluginwrapper will allow you to use java flash and so on with 64bit ff
[02:29] <gnomefreak> gnash in gutsy rocks too much better than it was
[02:29] <nosrednaekim> nspluginwrapper isn't in the repositories...
[02:30] <gnomefreak> yes it is
[02:30] <nosrednaekim> (at least not in fiesty)
[02:30] <gnomefreak> not feisty no
[02:30] <gnomefreak> this is all gutsy support apps, asac really rocked on them
[02:30] <nosrednaekim> thats good!
[02:30] <nosrednaekim> i'm looking forward to some good 64 bit support.
[02:31] <gnomefreak> so when you upgrade to gutsy you will find a bit better 64 support (its not without issues though)
[02:31] <nosrednaekim> except there is still no tickless kernel for x86_64
[02:31] <gnomefreak> afaik there is
[02:31] <nosrednaekim> I have it installed on another partition
[02:31] <gnomefreak> i saw this being talked about today it was 386 and amd64 or 86_64
[02:32] <gnomefreak> cant remmeber
[02:32] <gnomefreak> i wanna say its with -12 but i missed most of the convo as i was a bit angry at that time
[03:15] <Jucato> hm... ok... ubuntu-resstricted-extras has msttcorefonts but kubuntu-restricted-extras doesn't.... bug or feature?
[04:27] <mluser> Not sure if this is just happening to me or someone else is experiencing it too, but in the last couple days when I run any application that needs sound a POP is heard comming from the audio card.
[04:28] <mluser> but sound continues to work fine
[04:31] <nixternal> Jucato: I think that the msttcorefonts are useless and unnecessary...truthfully there is no major reason for having them if you ask me
[04:31] <nixternal> mluser: no problems here with audio
[04:32] <mluser> nixternal: Ok.. thanks, I'm wondering if maybe its related to the new kernel
[04:32] <Jucato> nixternal: I don't mind not having them myself... I'm not a font guy. but I was thinking more of other users :)
[04:32] <Jucato> as for a reason... um.. consistency?
[04:32] <nixternal> why would anyone need them? to me it isn't as important as the audio/video codecs...
[04:32] <nixternal> bah, KDE is different than Gnome correct? :p
[04:33] <Jucato> but this goes more towards the Kubuntu is part-Ubuntu :P
[04:33] <Jucato> anyway, just wondering if it were a bug or a feature. more like a feature then :)
[04:34] <nixternal> who in here uses the msttcorefonts?
[04:34] <nixternal> ask in #kubuntu and see how many people use them, and then ask why
[04:35] <Jucato> too much work. nvm :)
[04:35] <nixternal> haha
[05:28] <manchicken> Riddell: Do you know why synaptic doesn't have an apply-patches rule?
[05:28] <manchicken> That's just weird.
[05:31] <nixternal> becuz it isn't groovy?
[05:32] <manchicken> But it's gonna help fix the changelog issue :)
[05:46] <Jucato> because synaptic isn't groovy like nixternal? hm...
[05:47] <manchicken> I'm about 30 seconds from just stealing the RPackage class from synaptic.
[05:47] <manchicken> There wouldn't be any licensing issues on that, would there?
[05:47] <Jucato> um... wouldn't know... until now I don't know my basic Licensing stuff :(
[05:47] <manchicken> heh, gotta love the function `const char *RPackage::vendor()`.
[05:48] <manchicken> The full body of that method is `return "dunno";`
[05:48] <manchicken> heh
[05:48] <Jucato> lol
[05:48] <Hobbsee> manchicken: it's gotta be redistributable, or under a free licnence, as it's in main...
[05:57] <manchicken> Grr... just not enough time to sort this one out.
[05:57] <Hobbsee> manchicken: haha, nice
[05:58] <manchicken> We need some documentation on it.
[05:58] <Jucato> libapt-pkg-doc?
[05:58] <manchicken> nixternal: You want to be my favorite person in all of history?  Document libapt-front and libapt-pkg :)
[05:58] <Jucato> -front and -pkg...
[05:58] <nixternal> I am sure I could whip up something, but I think Jucato should learn how to do that :p
[05:58] <manchicken> Okay.
[05:58] <nixternal> haha
[05:59] <Jucato> I have no idea
[05:59] <nixternal> either do I :)
[05:59] <Jucato> I haven't even seen a single code of APT :)
[05:59] <manchicken> I want docs.   I don't even know what that is!!
[06:00] <nixternal> Jucato: cluster fu*k, in other words, a huge mess
[06:00] <Hobbsee> Jucato: you dont want to.
[06:00] <Jucato> isn't Kubuntu a fork of KDE? bwahahah!
[06:00] <nixternal> gahahahaha
[06:00] <Hobbsee> nixternal: there's an ubuntu team by that name, btw.
[06:00] <nixternal> ubuntu-cf?
[06:00] <manchicken> Okay, I'm going to go to sleep.
[06:00] <Hobbsee> yes
[06:00] <nixternal> hrmm
[06:00] <Jucato> g'night manchicken! :)
[06:00] <manchicken> I'm too cranky to remain conscious for now.
[06:00] <nixternal> Hobbsee: does it stand for cluster fork?
[06:01] <manchicken> See you when I'm a little less pissed at all software.
[06:01] <nixternal> I stay pissed at software, it is kind of fun
[06:01] <Hobbsee> nixternal: https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-clusterfuck
[06:01] <nixternal> gahahahahaha
[06:01] <Jucato> lol
[06:01] <Hobbsee> nixternal: no one emailed me about them, either.
[06:01] <nixternal> well i'll be damned
[06:02] <nixternal>  Do the impossible bugs get assigned to you? Does your significant other whisper ASM syntax to turn you on? Do you favor rm and killall and mkfs as solutions? Have you ever used a punch card? Welcome home.
[06:02] <nixternal> hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
[06:03] <nixternal> omg, the team icon freakin' rocks
[06:03] <nixternal> I want to join just to have that icon show up on my LP page :)
[06:03] <Hobbsee> hehe :D
[06:03] <Hobbsee> nixternal: it sounds very much like kurt and fabbio, too.
[06:03] <nixternal> fabbione is crazy
[06:03] <Hobbsee> true that.
[06:04] <Hobbsee> i thought kurt was more so, though.
[06:04] <nixternal> wth is the purpose of that team btw?
[06:04] <Hobbsee> amusement.
[06:04] <nixternal> oh
[06:04] <Hobbsee> and to take advantage of the cool icon.
[06:04] <nixternal> ya, I want that damn icon..it is great
[06:06] <nixternal> what I like is the ASM line...seeing as we are learning that now in our insane java course
[06:07] <nixternal> funny thing, the servers we are working on are all IBM..and people don't even know how to ssh into a machine to work on code...I can't stand stoopid people :)
[06:07] <nixternal> damn MySpace junkies!
[06:08] <nixternal> oh btw Hobbsee, if you make any new friends on MySpace from the Chicago land area, it could very well be my fault
[06:08] <Hobbsee> nixternal: someone deleted my myspace.
[06:08] <nixternal> argh, that sucks
[06:08] <nixternal> hopefully that wasn't my fault
[06:08] <nixternal> although, I don't blame someone for doing so
[06:08] <nixternal> :)
[06:09] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:09] <Hobbsee> it was a *lovely* page!
[06:09] <nixternal> I think one time, I heard my video card call me a bastard for going to it
[06:10] <nixternal> you know, I was looking at taking the Ubuntu Certification Exam...and low and behold, it doesn't cover anything really technical from what I have read
[06:10] <nixternal> I mean, I don't get why LPIC 1 would be a prereq for the exam, seeing as the Ubuntu one mainly covers LP
[06:11] <nixternal> I just found out about LPIC 301...there is no way in hell I could even come close to passing that one
[06:11] <nixternal> I took both LPIC 1 exams twice, and both LPIC 2 exams twice...failed the first time around, and this was not even 2 years ago
[06:12] <nixternal> those exams were hard
[06:13] <nixternal> it asked me all kinds of RPM crap
[06:13] <Jucato> now if there were a KDE Certification Exam.. count me in!
[06:13] <nixternal> reiserfs, and other junk I had no clue about
[06:13] <nixternal> I don't even think I got half of the questions right the first go round either
[06:13] <Jucato> these certification stuff is more about system administration right? more fore system administraitors?
[06:13] <Jucato> um.. administrators
[06:14] <nixternal> usually, I do pretty good bs'ing my way through certification exams (ie. MCSE, CCNA)
[06:14] <nixternal> pretty much so, yes
[06:14] <Jucato> MSCE!?!? O.o
[06:14] <nixternal> ya, I remember when MCSE was the bomb
[06:14] <nixternal> we had to get it for a job back in the 90s
[06:14] <Jucato> no wonder you love Vista :)
[06:14] <nixternal> it bumped my pay out of the military an extra $15k a year
[06:15] <Jucato> but only because I never got a chance to use NT or 2000
[06:15] <nixternal> NT was a fun beast to admin back in the day
[06:16] <nixternal> when 2k came out, you seen the mcse pay drop $15k...hell high school kids were being hired on to do admin work
[06:16] <Jucato> heh
[06:16] <stdin> win2000 is just win98 with a new splash
[06:16] <nixternal> when I worked at AT&T, we had to get all of the Sun certifications, which were easy, except for the server/hardware certs, and the RHCE...which was a pita
[06:17] <nixternal> they used to do the RHCE certs like you were going for your CCIE...we had to do a lab, 200 written exams, 4 polygraphs, and 2 physicals
[06:17] <nixternal> :)
[06:18] <nixternal> AT&T was so evil...all of the opensource/free software we used and worked on, that never got contributed back
[06:18] <nixternal> I wonder why they have never gone after AT&T for GPL infringements
[06:19] <nixternal> only development certs I have seen are Oracle, DB stuff, and MCP or MCD
[06:20] <Jucato> I see
[06:20] <nixternal> well, there are C++ certs and what not, but they tend to be rather generic
[06:20] <nixternal> I know, because I am working towards a C++ cert and degree, as well as a Java cert and degree
[06:21] <manchicken> Boo, certs suck, boo.
[06:21] <nixternal> hehe
[06:21] <nixternal> most certs are useless, except for a select few
[06:21] <Jucato> would be nice for the resum :)
[06:21] <nixternal> Cisco certs are always good, a Foundstone security cert is really good to have, or at least it used to be
[06:21] <manchicken> Experience is better :)
[06:22] <nixternal> Sun hardware certs are awesome to have
[06:22] <manchicken> Hardware certs are different.
[06:22] <manchicken> I almost did the CCNA
[06:22] <nixternal> and the nice thing about paying $10k for their course, you get $5k in Sun hardware field manuals which will help you troubleshoot every error code that solaris and the sun firmware can spit at you
[06:23] <manchicken> Which is even nicer now that Solaris is Free Software.
[06:23] <nixternal> I did CCNA through CBT at AT&T with an HP :)
[06:23] <Jucato> hm.. me thought Solaris != OpenSolaris
[06:23] <nixternal> ya, me too
[06:23] <nixternal> I didn't know Solaris was free
[06:23] <manchicken> Solaris9 is CDL
[06:24] <nixternal> nice
[06:24] <manchicken> CPL*
[06:24] <nixternal> I didn't know that
[06:24] <Jucato> all I know is that OpenSolaris is shipping free CD's
[06:24] <nixternal> Commercial Driving License
[06:24] <Jucato> or was it a free DVD
[06:24] <manchicken> YEah.
[06:24] <Jucato> lol
[06:24] <manchicken> OpenSolaris is a full OS and such, I don't know about the full solaris9 distro.
[06:24] <manchicken> But I do know that the core of Solaris9 is CPL
[06:24] <nixternal> I haven't messed with Solaris in quite some time
[06:25] <nixternal> odd that CDE was my favorite DE for it as well
[06:25] <nixternal> I know that Solaris 8 had some funky DE that was horrid
[06:25] <nixternal> man, those were the Netscape days :)
[06:27] <nixternal> man, I know I tried the desktop solaris last year, and they had this nasty desktop environment that was java based..and it wasn't project looking glass
[06:27] <nixternal> it was so slow
[06:28] <Jucato> didn't they call it slowaris before? :)
[06:28] <nixternal> sounds about right
[06:28] <nixternal> solaris 2.6, 2.7, and 8 were pretty tight
[06:29] <nixternal> I had an Ultra 80 that I just loved..it was my favorite machine in the whole world
[06:29] <nixternal> now all I have is a E3500 that I bought on Craigslist for $250
[06:29] <nixternal> 4 cpus, 8gb of ram, and 5 9gb scsi drives
[06:29] <nixternal> looks like one of them mini fridges
[06:30] <manchicken> Where's mvo when you need him?
[06:30] <Jucato> hm.. I was supposed to ask mvo something about a month ago... and I forgot now...
[06:32] <manchicken> I'm totally stealing mvo's rpackage class.
[06:34] <nixternal> is it stealing if it is for free?
[06:36] <manchicken> Argh... stealing it isn't going to help much either.
[06:36] <manchicken> It's tied into synaptic.
[06:37] <nixternal> heh
[06:37] <nixternal> want some spaghetti with that code?
[06:37] <Jucato> but still I'm not at ease with trying to make everything cross-DE
[06:39] <manchicken> I should have had mvo explain this libapt to me at UDS Sevilla.
[06:40] <manchicken> But nooo, I decided to go after the adept kde4 port.
[06:41] <nixternal> heh
[06:41] <Jucato> are we at the point where adept is being inadept? :(
[06:42] <manchicken> To be honest, I think it's more libapt that's the problem.
[06:43] <Jucato> heh
[06:51] <Hobbsee> yay!  car starts now
[06:52] <Jucato> yay!
[06:52] <Jucato> road trip!
[06:52] <Hobbsee> nah.  just work later.
[06:52] <Jucato> aw... bummer
[07:43] <gustavonarea> Hello, I have a Toshiba Satellite laptop and the Kubuntu Tribe 5 CD doesn't work under this laptop, while Ubuntu Edgy does work. I'm getting this error: Try the "8139too" driver instead. I've added "brokenmodules=8139too" to the boot options and it doesn not work either. What should I do? I'm now downloading Ubuntu Tribe 5 to try it out too.
[08:19] <yuriy> bugs expire now? O_o
[08:21] <Jucato> hi yuriy! long time :)
[08:41] <yuriy> hey Jucato
[08:41] <yuriy> nice post on KDE
[08:41] <yuriy> a little too buzzword-ish for me, but it would make a good poster type thing
[08:42] <Jucato> hehe yeah I sort of intended it to be buzzwordish... sort of a first-time/one-time (read that nixternal) marketing stint for me :)
[08:42] <Jucato> thanks :)
[08:43] <yuriy> so i've also been learning c++/qt4
[08:43] <yuriy> by rewriting a project for class in it
[08:43] <Jucato> ooooh :)
[08:44] <yuriy> we were given java code and some things we had to add to it (it's a raytracer, pretty cool stuff)
[08:44] <yuriy> i took it and rewrote it in c++ before doing the actual hw
[08:44] <Jucato> hm... java... might be a nice opportunity to try out Jambi?
[08:45] <yuriy> i've got the first homework done, now i've decided to really jump in and try out threading
[08:45] <yuriy> which is killing me so far
[08:45] <yuriy> Jambi would be interesting, but not a challenge
[08:45] <Jucato> hahah
[08:46] <yuriy> I would definitely use it though if I was writing a program in java and had a choice of not using swing
[08:46] <Jucato> yeah I can imagine porting from Java to C++ is quite an adventure :)
[08:46] <yuriy> well porting wouldn't be hard
[08:46] <yuriy> but i basically didn't know c++ before
[08:46] <yuriy> primarily, no garbage collection
[08:46] <Jucato> yeah
[08:47] <n8k99> c++? no garbage collection
[08:47] <Jucato> I heard they might be considering implementing one in the next C++ standard
[08:47] <Jucato> n8k99: C++ itself doesn't have one
[08:47] <Jucato> but you can use libraries that implement it
[08:47] <n8k99> interesting
[08:47] <Jucato> perhaps garbage collection wasn't much of an issue back then...
[08:48] <yuriy> so you can't just go new this new that all the time like in sloppy java programming
[08:48] <n8k99> ah ha!
[08:48] <yuriy> which is good, gets you to put more thought into your code
[08:49] <Jucato> but Qt slightly has garbage collection (I think)
[08:49] <yuriy> hmm?
[08:49] <Jucato> does it? haven't gone into much detail yet :)
[08:49] <yuriy> not that i know of, but i haven't studied it much
[08:49] <n8k99> so jambi allow you to write Qt/KDE apps but in Java right?
[08:49] <Jucato> all I know it is if you new a child widget, those get automatically destroyed along w/ the parent
[08:49] <yuriy> and most of my stuff aren't QObjects
[08:50] <yuriy> n8k99: Qt, i don't think KDE
[08:50] <Jucato> n8k99: no KDE yet I think
[08:50] <yuriy> Jucato: oh yeah, that. but not for the non-gui part
[08:51] <Jucato> yep
[01:49] <fdoving> wow, with some tweaking powertop reports my estimated battery life time to 6.2 hours.
[02:41] <Jucato> nixternal_ does the dance again :)
[02:42] <fdoving> hmm.. in gutsy my screensaver is crazy.
[02:42] <fdoving> it doesn't fill the screen.
[02:43] <Jucato> weheh
[02:43] <fdoving> well, the upper left corner is in the center of the screen.
[02:44] <Jucato> er... yeah that falls under krazy
[02:46] <fdoving> and googling for 'kdm fullscreen problem' does hot help.
[02:46] <fdoving> kscreensaver != kdm :)
[02:47] <Jucato> heheh
[02:53] <fdoving> oh, it does not happen with opengl screensavers.
[02:53] <fdoving> ohwell.
[02:54] <Jucato> only with kscreensavers? weird indeed
[04:29] <mhb> see you all in a week, folks!
[04:30] <Jucato> mhb: where ya goin?
[04:30] <mhb> Crete
[04:30] <Jucato> oooh
[04:30] <nosrednaekim> fun!
[04:30] <Jucato> take care and have fun :)
[04:31] <mhb> you take care of Kubuntu .o)
[04:31] <nosrednaekim> K ;)
[04:32] <Jucato> kthxbye
[04:32] <Jucato> :)
[04:33] <nosrednaekim> oh... we are such Kooks..
[04:34] <Jucato> :D
[04:37] <Hobbsee> mhb: have fun!
[04:37] <Hobbsee> nixternal: you *still* owe me an email.
[04:38] <Jucato> has he stopped dancing yet?
[04:38] <Hobbsee> seems so
[04:39] <Jucato> oh btw... hi Hobbsee!!!!!
[04:39] <Hobbsee> hiya Jucato1
[04:45] <Jucato> there was a Jucato_ a while ago. but he expired
[05:03] <bddebian> Heya
[05:03] <Jucato> heya bddebian
[05:03] <bddebian> Hi Jucato
[05:05] <mhb> off-topic: I wonder how many visa applicants have marked "Yes" at the question " Have you taken part in any terrorist activity?"
[05:05] <mhb> U.S. visa for the UDS, to be exact
[05:05] <nosrednaekim> haha
[05:05] <ScottK> I'm sure none, but that's not why it's there.
[05:06] <mhb> ScottK: what's the purpose then?
[05:07] <mhb> ScottK: so that the embassy can say "they said they aren't terrorists, it's not our fault?"
[05:07] <nosrednaekim> probably so VISA can't get sued for knowingly taking part in terrorist money transfers.
[05:07] <ScottK> Lieing on the visa application is grounds for being expelled/denying entry.
[05:07] <nosrednaekim> sued..... or worse
[05:07] <ScottK> If they have/find any dirt on someone it's easy to through them out for having lied.
[05:07] <ScottK> Than having to sort through was the thing they did bad enough.
[05:08] <ScottK> It's the same reason (basically) you are required in the US to pay taxes on profits from illegal activities.
[05:08] <ScottK> It's quite often easier to get court proof someone had money and didn't pay tax on it than that they did the actual crime.
[05:09] <nosrednaekim> which is how Al Capone got convicted.
[05:09] <ScottK> Exactly.
[05:25] <Hobbsee> i'm so glad i'm not in hte US.
[05:25] <Hobbsee> everyone seems to seem to want to sue their neighbour, and everyone else they meet.
[05:25] <ScottK> Hobbsee: There is a certain amount of that, but I think it's not as bad as it appears in the media.
[05:27] <Jucato> (nothing is as bad as they appear in the media... except for natural disasters...)
[05:28] <nosrednaekim> and Katrina was nothing like it looked in the media
[05:28] <nosrednaekim> way worse
[05:28] <nosrednaekim> and I was there a year later
[05:28] <nosrednaekim> in New Orleans that is.
[06:05] <coreymon77> okay
[06:05] <coreymon77> team report completed
[06:05] <Hobbsee> woot :)
[06:06] <coreymon77> sorry about it being slightly late
[06:06] <coreymon77> there were login problems yesterday
[06:06] <coreymon77> and i just got home right now
[06:06] <coreymon77> Hobbsee: take a look at it?
[06:07] <coreymon77> Hobbsee: decided to lighten the mood a bit by adding in the last point
[06:07] <Hobbsee> where is it?
[06:07] <coreymon> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/TeamReports/September2007#preview
[06:08] <Hobbsee> coreymon: nice work :)
[06:09] <coreymon77> thanks
[06:09] <nosrednaekim> lol...
[06:11] <coreymon77> whats the matter
[06:11] <coreymon77> that was s-cottk's idea
[06:11] <Jucato> nothing much. just dolphin :)
[06:13] <ScottK> No it wasn't.  It was nixteral.
[06:13] <ScottK> nixternal even
[06:13] <ScottK> coreymon77: Remember, we agreed to blame him.
[06:14] <coreymon77> ScottK: im talking about the python thing
[06:14] <ScottK> Oh.
[06:14] <ScottK> Nevermind then.
[06:15] <coreymon77> Jucato: the riddell thing was nixternals though
[06:16] <Jucato> er.. 3rd item is about dolphin :)
[06:17] <coreymon77> i know
[06:17] <coreymon77> miscounted
[06:17] <Jucato> :)
[06:51] <coreymon77> so, did i do i good job/
[06:51] <coreymon77> ?
[06:52] <nixternal> what's new :)
[06:52] <coreymon77> nixternal: i finished
[06:52] <nixternal> I am always getting beat, and oddly enough, it is by women :p
[06:53] <Hobbsee> nixternal: that i havent seen what you want uploaded yet.
[06:53] <nixternal> rock on coreymon77
[06:53] <coreymon77> nixternal: take a look at it
[06:53] <Hobbsee> nixternal: i'm sure you wouldnt want to be beaten by another man anyway.
[06:53] <nixternal> hehe
[06:53] <nixternal> well, I can't upload it, so someone else needs to
[06:54] <coreymon77> Hobbsee: we need to make a page where we can store points that you want ot be in the next report
[06:54] <coreymon77> because i didnt know what to put in it
[06:54] <Hobbsee> coreymon77: meeting agenda could double as that
[06:54] <Hobbsee> of course, it would help if i was spending more time on kubuntu, i expect
[06:54] <Jucato> nixternal: you were dancing again in so many rooms :)
[06:54] <nixternal> ya, I noticed
[06:55] <nixternal> I am starting to totally dislike comcast
[06:55] <nixternal> it is hard for me to complain since my connection is totally free
[06:55] <nixternal> I haven't paid for broadband service since 2000
[06:55] <Jucato> wow
[06:56] <nixternal> when I was an AT&T employee, the broadband was called @Home, and I got it for free, then they sold it to comcast, and I still got it free
[06:56] <nixternal> so that goes to show that comcast does not do any types of audits
[06:56] <Jucato> lol
[06:56] <nixternal> hell, they sold it to comcast after I left AT&T
[06:56] <nixternal> so AT&T didn't do their job either
[06:57] <Jucato> but it benefits you that they didn't :)
[06:57] <Jucato> very convenient :P
[06:57] <nixternal> Hobbsee: I left a comment asking for a status on the kdebase patches for Dapper -> Feisty
[06:57] <nixternal> hopefully that will wake someone up
[06:58] <Hobbsee> nixternal: ah, you assume that people read bugmail.
[06:58] <nixternal> well, I assume the security people do
[06:58] <Hobbsee> it's a sunday
[06:58] <Hobbsee> unless you're backwards
[06:58] <Hobbsee> but even then, it's still a saturday, and therefore a weekend.
[06:59] <Hobbsee> and the priority is on that gutsy one
[06:59] <nixternal> there, I just pinged keescook
[06:59] <nixternal> well the gutsy one is in bzr
[06:59] <nixternal> I would think the priority would be on dapper
[07:02] <coreymon77> when is gutsy being released?
[07:02] <nixternal> next month
[07:02] <coreymon77> oh
[07:02] <nixternal> the 19th I believe
[07:02] <coreymon77> not waiting for kde4?
[07:02] <nixternal> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GutsyReleaseSchedule
[07:02] <nixternal> nope
[07:02] <nixternal> KDE 4 won't be until December
[07:03] <Jucato> we can't wait :)
[07:03] <nixternal> at the earliest
[07:03] <Jucato> one of the quirks of being a *buntu :P
[07:03] <nixternal> heh
[07:03] <coreymon77> ah
[07:03] <coreymon77> but i take it guty has being made to work perfectly with kde4 right?
[07:03] <coreymon77> because its a little long to wait until heron to have kde4 supprot
[07:04] <coreymon77> the next release is called heron right?
[07:04] <Jucato> who says we'll wait that long? :)
[07:04] <nixternal> you know...I have been messing with other KDE distros...and using them big time...and even got in a bit with other devs...and the one thing I have to say, is I think we are w/o a doubt the best...I know I am biased, but I just couldn't work with the other distros like I can with Kubuntu
[07:04] <coreymon77> of course
[07:04] <coreymon77> i think kubuntu is increbile
[07:04] <coreymon77> its definitely the best distro out there
[07:05] <nixternal> openSUSE is pretty damn good though once you get past yum
[07:05] <Jucato> nixternal: of course. and I'm sure *some* openSUSE devs believe they are the best too :)
[07:05] <nixternal> Yast to me is pretty decent
[07:05] <Jucato> yum?
[07:05] <coreymon77> it took me 5 years to find kubuntu
[07:05] <Jucato> suse don't use yum :)
[07:05] <nixternal> !yum
[07:05] <ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about yum - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
[07:05] <nixternal> !apt
[07:05] <ubotu> APT is the Advanced Package Tool, which together with dpkg forms the basic Ubuntu package management toolkit. Short apt-get manual: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/AptGetHowto - Also see !Synaptic (Gnome) or !Adept (KDE)
[07:05] <nixternal> hrmm, it is their version of apt
[07:05] <coreymon77> and its the only linux distro that i have been able to stick with for so long
[07:05] <Jucato> it's rh's/fedora's
[07:05] <nixternal> managing openSUSE repositories is like pulling teeth from a lion who is wide awake and hasn't had anything to eat in a month
[07:06] <coreymon77> uyp
[07:06] <coreymon77> yup*
[07:06] <coreymon77> but its probably better than YAST (**hack hack cough cough puke**)
[07:06] <nixternal> PCLOS has a nice systems management setup, probably the nicest I have seen...
[07:06] <Jucato> hehe yeah.. one of my biggest complaints too
[07:06] <Jucato> but don't equate YaST with their package manager btw :)
[07:07] <coreymon77> umm, last time i used suse it was their package manager
[07:07] <nixternal> PCLOS is an all around nice setup, and even though I hate the fact all of the non-free stuff is included, I am starting to see that people want it, and it is drawing in new users much easier than we are
[07:07] <Jucato> YaST is the whole configuration system
[07:07] <Jucato> it just gives a front end to the package management.
[07:07] <Jucato> so there are part s of yast that are great
[07:08] <coreymon77> well, back to watching hot fuzz
[07:08] <Jucato> nixternal:  and it helps that they dropped the silly Windows-like logo :)
[07:08] <nixternal> Fedora does not implement KDE very well...it is slow and unorganized
[07:08] <nixternal> heh, no doubt
[07:08] <Jucato> it's only recently that they started to take KDE seriously. to they're still catching up
[07:08] <nixternal> the first time I seen PCLOS I seen that windows logo
[07:08] <nixternal> true
[07:09] <nixternal> I like Fedora's Gnome setup
[07:09] <Jucato> but they still have to impress me with Fedora KDE config apps :)
[07:09] <nixternal> for Gnome I think Foresight does it the best justice
[07:09] <nixternal> Foresight is supposed to release a KDE distro here soon
[07:09] <Jucato> oooh more and more KDE! yummy
[07:10] <nixternal> I was actually asked by Ken Vandine and some other devs if I was interested in helping them out...but you know what they did? they brought over quite a few of the PCLOS devs
[07:11] <Jucato> O.o
[07:11] <nixternal> I told Ken that he should not deflect from software freedom, and he promised he wouldn't
[07:12] <nixternal> Ken is a cool dude, he comes to a lot of the Chicago events because we have a lot of Foresight devs here...it is always a fun battle between Ubuntu Chicago and them
[07:12] <nixternal> as a matter of fact, they included us in one of their newsletters
[07:15] <nixternal> http://wiki.foresightlinux.com/confluence/display/newsletter/2007/07/01/#ForesightLinuxNewsletter%2CVolume1%2CIssue4%28June2007%29-BarcampChicago
[07:15] <nixternal> there is the newsletter
[07:16] <ScottK> nixternal: The fundamental problem, IMO, with OpenSuse (it's what I used before Kubuntu) is that opensuse is NOT Novell/SUSE's product.  SLES is.
[07:17] <Jucato> (neither is Kubuntu Canonical's...)
[07:17] <Jucato> nixternal: aw.. no mention or pictures of you? :)
[07:18] <ScottK> Jucato: But Ubuntu is.  Close enough.  We are downstream of the product, not free beta testers for the product.  All the difference in the world.
[07:19] <Jucato> I think opensuse is less of a "beta test" product of Novell than Fedora is/was of RH... for example, opensuse and sles/sled are diverging a lot in terms of package management
[07:20] <Jucato> but that's just what I think. :)
[07:21] <ScottK> You obviously weren't running opensuse 10.1 right after they released it.
[07:21] <ScottK> I had this nice shiny KDE desktop that could never be updated.
[07:21] <Jucato> I have the 5 cd's but didn't have the time/chance to use them
[07:21] <Jucato> I did use 10.2
[07:21] <Jucato> yes, that's why opensuse is now diverging from sled
[07:22] <Jucato> they're ditching zen, but sled will still continue to use it
[07:22] <nixternal> ScottK: ya, but I prefer a community based distro truthfully
[07:23] <Jucato> but it can be a pain when you start getting compared with your more "supported" older siblings..
[07:24] <nixternal> I tend to look past it...I think crimsun said one time that we had it made, being in the shadow causes us to not be scrutinized as harshly as Ubuntu is
[07:24] <Jucato> er... half true..
[07:24] <nixternal> but that can be a bad thing at the same time
[07:24] <ScottK> The thing that really got me was that they changed out the update technology compeltely with Zen AFTER the last public beta and defended it as an appropriate thing to do.
[07:24] <nixternal> what is Zen?
[07:24] <Jucato> suse's package manager
[07:24] <ScottK> The thing that made updating in opensuse 10.1 compeletly broken
[07:24] <nixternal> oh
[07:25] <ScottK> That's all I know.
[07:25] <nixternal> heh
[07:25] <Jucato> not yum :)
[07:25] <Jucato> the thing that made opensuse 10.0, 10.1, and 10.2 terrible
[07:25] <ScottK> If yum ~ apt then zen ~ dselect or dpkg.
[07:25] <nixternal> I help teach the Linux classes at the local college, and the one thing I hear the most complaints about is updating..and we use SLED there because of their huge Novell deal
[07:25] <Jucato> (10.2 being the least)
[07:25] <nixternal> I hated the fact that they wouldn't listen to me when they chose a new Linux distro this year
[07:26] <Jucato> nah. yum is fedora's. opensuse uses zypp and zen
[07:26] <nixternal> there is nobody at that college that knows one thing about Linux, but maybe 5 of us, and not one of us was included in, nor even asked about, the Linux upgrades
[07:26] <Jucato> zypp from ximian I think..
[07:26] <ScottK> Dunno.  I've done my best to forget the experience.
[07:26] <Jucato> hehe
[07:26] <nixternal> heh
[07:27] <Jucato> nixternal: but they almost also say the same thing about us btw..
[07:27] <Jucato> but less terrible than the latest suse releases
[07:27] <nixternal> well, here is my unbiased opinion...apt owns them all and conary is coming up quicly to the level of apt
[07:28] <nixternal> conary is lovely...in less than 5 minutes you can package just about anything you can think of
[07:28] <Jucato> yeah I don't think there's anything better than apt when it comes to binary package management
[07:28] <nixternal> you put together the recipe, and then you cook it
[07:28] <Jucato> never tried conary...
[07:28] <nixternal> literally
[07:28] <nixternal> all you need to know is very little python in order to do so
[07:29] <nixternal> I am wearing a rPath t-shirt right now :)
[07:41] <nixternal> you can't do tabs in dolphin?
[07:43] <Jucato> of course you can't :P
[07:43] <ScottK> nixternal: No because dolphin is supposed to be simple.
[07:43] <mhb> hehe
[07:43] <nixternal> bah
[07:43] <Jucato> or rather...
[07:43] <nixternal> that knocks it down a notch for me
[07:43] <Jucato> Dolphin is a powerful file manager for simple uses
[07:43] <nixternal> the split view kind of works
[07:43] <Jucato> :)
[07:43] <mhb> nixternal: try to google some info up, it's been discuss a milion times
[07:43] <nixternal> to lazy to google
[07:44] <nixternal> or to busy
[07:44] <nixternal> one of the two :)
[07:44] <nixternal> have fun mhb
[07:46] <ScottK> I didn't know that Gnomes were aquatic.
[07:46] <Jucato> Nautilus is :)
[07:46] <nixternal> ;)
[07:47] <ScottK> Gnomes?
[07:47] <nixternal> no, Dolphins :D
[07:47] <ScottK> Oh.   Not sure if that's a good idea still. :-)
[07:49] <nixternal> hahahaha
[07:50] <Jucato> lol
[07:50] <nixternal> well, actually, we would need to beat all of the XP users first, they still rule the world in shear amount
[07:50] <nixternal> XP is about the size of China, and Vista is about the size of....ummm, Diego Garcia
[09:06] <_StefanS_> evening!
[09:18] <nixternal> howdy
[11:32] <davmor2> guys doing iso testing on my 32 bit laptop.  I have tried to link to my network wirelessly and it is not havin' any of it.  Is this known ?  Do I need to right click to connect or am I doing something else daft?
[11:43] <jjesse> in gutsy is that what you are working on davmor2?>
[11:43] <davmor2> yes iso testing beta
[11:44] <jjesse> is the beta, the current iso?
[11:45] <davmor2> yesish 20070921.1 is the image we are using for testing
[11:46] <jjesse> so knetworkmanager is not connecting automatically?
[11:46] <davmor2> I right click on the icon, select my network which it can see then nothing
[11:47] <jjesse> think a bug needs to be set then
[11:50] <davmor2> ok ta
[11:59] <Riddell> manchicken: I'd have thought synaptic would be a native package
[12:02] <davmor2> Riddell: did you know that install and qtparted are still in the menu system on an install system dead links just still there?
[12:03] <Riddell> err, that's strange
[12:03] <Riddell> however I'm off to bed, will look at it soon


[08:35] <seb128> how often are git ubuntu imports done? like casper 1.403 was uploded almost a week ago and https://git.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/casper?h=ubuntu%2Fdevel still has 1.402
[08:35] <seb128> or does that need to be manually updated?
[09:47] <tarzeau> seb128: there's a freeze?
[09:48] <tarzeau> seb128: 19.04 to be released shortly. see http://bootes.ethz.ch/bts/
[09:48] <seb128> tarzeau, that package was accepted, see https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/casper
[09:48] <cjwatson> That doesn't seem hugely relevant in the case of something that's already in the archive though?
[09:49] <cjwatson> Snap
[09:49] <seb128> :)
[09:49] <tarzeau> ah sorry then i have no idea
[10:04] <rbasak> seb128: in a loop, but reliability is still a bit limited. Let me check casper.
[10:06] <seb128> rbasak, thx, is there any log/service where I can check mysefl maybe for next time?
[10:07] <rbasak> seb128: there's a ML you can subscribe to
[10:08] <seb128> rbasak, do you have the name on the list? I'm unsure where to look at
[10:08] <rbasak> Looking for it
[10:11] <rbasak> seb128: looks like the importer hung a week ago :-/
[10:11] <rbasak> I have plans to add a watchdog, but de-prioritised that when it seemed more reliable.
[10:11] <seb128> DOH
[10:11] <rbasak> I will need to bump the priority of that now
[10:12] <seb128> k, well I guess it also means you will look at restarting it now
[10:12] <seb128> thx for poking :)
[10:14] <rbasak> I'm running casper manually for you now, then I'll restart
[10:15] <rbasak> cpaelzer, ahasenack: ^ FYI
[10:15] <rbasak> It had been doing so well!
[10:22] <seb128> rbasak, thank you!
[10:28] <rbasak> It seems to be hanging still. I'm investigating.
[10:47] <rbasak> seb128: this is going to take a while, sorry. The hang is reproducible, and it's during a completely innocuous seeming Launchpad API call.
[10:48] <cjwatson> Even if the API call times out or something it should, well, time out rather than hang
[10:48] <cjwatson> Unless it's retrying indefinitely
[10:59] <rbasak> cjwatson: here's the bottom of the backtrace: https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/DkDNbDKN2y/ and call details: https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/FzdKNM9bdG/
[11:00] <rbasak> I've seen hangs before that never time out. I never figured out if I was calling something wrong, so I never raised it with you.
[11:00] <rbasak> (hard to reproduce etc)
[11:00] <rbasak> What's odd about this is that we're possibly calling the API repeatedly when we should just cache the result.
[11:01] <rbasak> And I'm pretty sure it's not the first call with these parametrers that is hanging
[11:02] <rbasak> I need to run an errand. Back later.
[11:05] <cjwatson> rbasak: Gotta be a client-side problem, maybe incorrect timeouts being set somewhere or something
[11:51] <rbasak> cjwatson: can you think of any easy way for me to record all API interactions via launchpadlib, and then replay them from outside my application?
[11:51] <rbasak> (replay using launchpadlib again, I mean)
[11:53] <cjwatson> rbasak: I don't have a complete answer, but I'd start with "import httplib2; httplib2.debuglevel = 1" at the top of your program
[11:53] <rbasak> That's useful. Thanks!
[13:24] <cjwatson> didrocks: hi - when there's a comment in a file saying "make sure <thing> remains the last entry", would you mind not adding things after it? :-)  https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/+git/ubuntu/commit/?id=4e86b50e3d368718cd8b0afbc0bc041554bd905d
[13:24] <cjwatson> (fixed now)
[13:25] <didrocks> cjwatson: ah, as it's not the last line, I missed it, I guess it's not possible to add the comment as the last one?
[13:25] <didrocks> (thanks for fixing, I guess this created side-effects?)
[13:25] <cjwatson> The comment could be moved to the end
[13:25] <cjwatson> I'm not sure that would reliably help people not reading it though :)
[13:26] <cjwatson> And yes, it broke source image generation for arcane reasons
[13:26] <didrocks> cjwatson: oh, ok :) TBH, I think comment as last item would have really helped (in my case at least)
[13:26] <cjwatson> I've moved it to the end
[13:26] <didrocks> thx!
[13:27] <cjwatson> thanks for the suggestion
[13:29] <didrocks> (and sorry to have broken it)
[13:29] <didrocks> only tested binary iso build, not source one (not even sure how this can be done locally)
[13:29] <cjwatson> Pretty hard
[13:30] <cjwatson> A slightly more immediate consequence (on the chain of events) was that https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.disco/desktop-minimal-default-languages+build-depends currently exists instead of https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.disco/supported+build-depends
[13:42] <jamespage> hey sil2100 - any chance we can get the bionic part of bug 1818614 accepted into proposed?
[13:47]  * sil2100 looks
[14:14] <jamespage> and....
[14:15] <jamespage> sil2100, bdmurray: any chance we can get the fix for https://bugs.launchpad.net/oslo.cache/+bug/1812935 fastracked to the updates pocket - that's blocking rocky deployments under python 3 right now which is impacting the charm release alongside 19.04
[14:16] <bdmurray> sil2100: do you want me to look at those?
[14:17] <jamespage> and then I see verification has not been done for cosmic - sorry - let me do that now....
[14:18] <sil2100> bdmurray: I'm reviewing the bionic neutron
[14:18] <sil2100> I mean, I'll finish reviewing it once I find the terminal with it
[14:18] <sil2100> It's somewhere there...
[16:14] <Logan> vorlon: I see you going through all of my removal tickets. Appreciate it :)
[16:14] <vorlon> Logan: managed to get the ~ubuntu-archive subscribed bugs list long enough to go through some of them, yeah ;)


[16:11] <Sarvatt> RAOF, mlankhorst: check out one of the newest entries in the steam app database - http://cdr.thebronasium.com/app/4
[16:11] <Sarvatt> linux client for the steam summer sale? :)
[16:12] <mlankhorst> Sarvatt: doubt it, they already tested portal on linux
[16:12] <mlankhorst> seems more like what they use for the linux dedicated servers though
[16:13] <Sarvatt> ah that lists been around for awhile, they just added more games to it


[01:42] <briedy1> I'm having trouble with the sound on my laptop after installing xubuntu, where can I find help on that issue?
[02:04] <joedoe47_> briedy1: here. just post your problem and someone will get to it.
[02:04] <joedoe47_> I don't know much about sound but just like post what the problem is and someone will tell you.
[02:05] <joedoe47_> you can also search online too. stackexchange and archwiki have lots of info.
[08:31] <Mizzu> hello everyone. quick question: does the xubuntu livecd come with boot-repair?
[10:34] <xubuntu17i> anybody here?
[10:34] <knome> no.
[10:34] <knome> hello.
[10:34] <knome> do you have a support question?
[10:37] <xubuntu17i> nothing just waiting my xubunto to be install
[10:37] <xubuntu17i> what is the different between ubunto and xubunto?
[10:37] <xubuntu17i> except from gui?
[10:39] <knome> default applications, default settings...
[10:46] <vlammer> hello all :)
[10:46] <knome> hello
[10:46] <vlammer> I have installed xubuntu on my laptop since gnome was a little to much for it to hanle
[10:47] <vlammer> I can live without the multipe screen option, but I would like to have some sort of option like in gnome to get an overview of all the progams open
[10:47] <vlammer> like this: http://orig05.deviantart.net/2a72/f/2011/267/1/a/arch_linux_gnome_3_new_2_by_cra1g321-d4au4ff.png
[10:48] <vlammer> is it possible to add that to xubuntu or is there a shortcut that I am missing?
[14:15] <irgendwer4711> hi, after upgrading to 16.10, my wine program group got lost. I can the is in the menu setup, but it is already active.
[16:21] <_rafaelo> Does anyone knew where I can find a mouse hover click settings in xubuntu 16.04?
[17:27] <irgendwer4711> I have another problem, after upgrading to 16.10 my Wine startmenu group disappeared.
[17:29] <_rafaelo> You shouldn't upgrade.
[17:31] <irgendwer4711> _rafaelo: why?
[17:32] <_rafaelo> Because it isn't LTS. It's new and unsecure. I always wait for LTS version.
[17:32] <_rafaelo> Before LTS it's buggy.
[17:33] <_rafaelo> (have bugs)
[17:33] <irgendwer4711> LTS is unsecure too
[17:33] <_rafaelo> Yes, but less I think
[17:33] <irgendwer4711> no, more, because most packages have very short maintenance
[17:35] <_rafaelo> I don't knew. I am beginner at Linus os. You are probably right.
[17:35] <irgendwer4711> try: ubuntu-support-status --show-unsupported
[17:36] <_rafaelo> But I knew that when xubuntu 16.04 had final release it have bugs which later were fixed.
[17:36] <_rafaelo> Thank you. I must continue to learning. See you!
[17:37] <_rafaelo> Do you knew how to turn off mouse hover click in xubuntu 16.04?
[17:39] <irgendwer4711> no
[17:39] <_rafaelo> ok, thank you again.
[18:29] <irgendwer4711> after upgrading to 16.10 my Wine startmenu group disappeared. In menu editor it is shown, but not setup to invisble.
[19:44] <Israphel> when I look my screen, can I avoid turning it black?
[19:51] <tsglove> Israphel, you mean "lock" ?
[19:51] <Israphel> oh sorry, lock
[20:17] <xubuntu47d_Dan> Hi. Upgraded from 16.04 to 16.10 yakkeys a few weeks ago. Updates are no longer working. Tried changing xenial to yakkety in other software (updater) - please help!!!
[20:20] <Israphel> more info? apt log? output?
[20:22] <xubuntu47d_Dan> sorry only moved to linux after xp launched, still don't know much. where do I get apt log?
[20:23] <Israphel> in a terminal
[20:23] <Israphel> run
[20:23] <Israphel> sudo apt update
[20:24] <Israphel> use http://paste.ubuntu.com to share text
[20:26] <xubuntu47d_Dan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23417762/
[20:26] <Israphel> is your internet working?
[20:26] <Israphel> can you ping www.ubuntu.com ?
[20:27] <xubuntu47d_Dan> yes, just as normal - i'm chatting with you now
[20:27] <Israphel> so the ping works?
[20:28] <Israphel> ping archive.ubuntu.com -> 64 bytes from steelix.canonical.com (<IP_ADDRESS>)
[20:29] <xubuntu47d_Dan> usually good, i can run a speed checker
[20:30] <Israphel> but the command ping,  right now, works with archive.ubuntu.com ?
[20:30] <Israphel> just run ping archive.ubuntu.com
[20:31] <xubuntu47d_Dan> ping: archive.ubuntu.com: Name or service not known
[20:32] <Israphel> well
[20:32] <Israphel> now, ping <IP_ADDRESS>
[20:34] <xubuntu47d_Dan> 64 bytes from <IP_ADDRESS>: icmp_seq=36 ttl=58 time=36.2 ms
[20:34] <Israphel> well your current DNS server is not working
[20:34] <Israphel> set different DNS servers with networkmanager (network icon near the clock)
[20:35] <Israphel> google dns are <IP_ADDRESS> and <IP_ADDRESS>
[20:37] <xubuntu47d_Dan> In network Setting, DNS Servers is in the middle tab shows <IP_ADDRESS>
[20:39] <xubuntu47d_Dan> could the main DNS servers have changed following the large scale DDOS attack last week?
[20:39] <Israphel> automatic dns always shows <IP_ADDRESS>, that means it's getting them from your router
[20:39] <Israphel> I don't know which dns server you usually use
[20:39] <Israphel> I always use openDNS, but google DNS works ok
[20:40] <Israphel> you can change them anytime
[20:40] <Israphel> if you can ping a dns server by IP, but you cant ping a domain (ubuntu.com) then your problem is there
[20:40] <genii> the main problem with openDNS is that if a name can't be resolved, it redirects to it's own internal page. So things like traceroute or dig don't work properly
[20:41] <xubuntu47d_Dan> so shall I change the DNS to <IP_ADDRESS> and try another update?
[20:41] <knome> most ISPs offer their own DNS servers, at least in this part of the world
[20:41] <Israphel> yes, If you don't touch anything you'll using your ISP dns servers
[20:41] <Israphel> maybe they're failing at the moment
[20:41] <Israphel> set <IP_ADDRESS> and <IP_ADDRESS> and then ping again
[20:42] <knome> or add them, if your router supports using more than two servers
[20:45] <xubuntu47d_Dan> Fixed!!! changed dns to <IP_ADDRESS> for the opendns. One final question.
[20:46] <nuxubuntunu> hello everybody
[20:46] <knome> nuxubuntunu, hello.
[20:46] <nuxubuntunu> is everbuddy pro linux user here?
[20:46] <xubuntu47d_Dan> No that's it. very happy. Thanks fellow Xubuntu'rs!
[20:47] <knome> nuxubuntunu, no.
[20:47] <xubuntu47d_Dan> Pro MS-Vista! lol
[20:47] <nuxubuntunu> haha
[20:47] <knome> nuxubuntunu, but if you have a support question, fire away.
[20:47] <Israphel> what's the final question
[20:47] <nuxubuntunu> im new to xubuntu
[20:47] <nuxubuntunu> just wanted to give it a shot
[20:48] <nuxubuntunu> im a fan of xfce
[20:48] <Israphel> I love kde, but it changes so much
[20:48] <Israphel> so I work with xfce always
[20:50] <nuxubuntunu> well i have a strange issue with a notebook of a friend...which is this actullay...i installed mint 17.4 and mint 18 both xfce, but i get a very strange issue
[20:50] <knome> nuxubuntunu, this isn't a mint support channel though
[20:50] <nuxubuntunu> well its more like 2 issues
[20:50] <nuxubuntunu> i know...im on xubuntu now
[20:50] <xubuntu47d_Dan> Israphel - I need to fix my software cuz all the other software is greyed out but I shoudl be able to fix that on my own. Will revert if I get any other problems. Thanks for all your help Israphel!
[20:51] <Israphel> you're welcome
[20:51] <nuxubuntunu> still it appears....maybe someone got an idea...
[20:51] <Israphel> remember the command "sudo apt-get install -f" often does miracles
[20:52] <nuxubuntunu> 1. issue....the keyboard and pad randomly wont work
[20:53] <nuxubuntunu> like now when i booted from usb to install xubuntu it happened again...i had to restart...i somehow think it might be connected to the numlock key...its does blink on boot
[20:53] <nuxubuntunu> when i wont hit it it seems to appear.....SOMETIMES
[20:54] <nuxubuntunu> when i hit the numlock key on boot it always worked....what this could be i dont know....maybe a BIOS problem
[20:54] <mrkramps> when it is blinking in terms of on and off there's most probably a hardware issue
[20:55] <nuxubuntunu> no...not on off
[20:55] <nuxubuntunu> its just on on boot for a while .... then its off....not blinking
[20:56] <mrkramps> that's not unusual
[20:56] <mrkramps> by default numlock is off
[20:56] <nuxubuntunu> thing is...when the computer was with cough...windows...it hasnt been like that
[20:56] <mrkramps> on linux, but not in bios
[20:57] <nuxubuntunu> i was looking for a numlock option in BIOS...not there
[20:57] <mrkramps> nuxubuntunu, gp to settings → keyboard → behavior
[20:57] <mrkramps> [x] Restore num lock state on startup
[20:57] <nuxubuntunu> im installing at the moment...could be a good tip mate


[00:00] <asac> http://hg.mozilla.org/pyxpcom/
[00:05] <asac> fta: i think the idea would be to make a substantial amount of patches. try to upstream them and if unresponsive make "cdbs2" project ;)
[00:05] <asac> or cdbsng
[00:07] <bdrung> asac: i am back
[00:07] <bdrung> asac: did i miss something?
[00:07] <asac> no
[00:07] <asac> actually i dont know
[00:07] <asac> just came back a few minuites ago ;)
[00:07] <bdrung> asac: the feature to use the first binary package name by default for MOZ_XPI_PACKAGE_NAME is already in version 0.14
[00:07] <asac> bdrung: ;)
[00:07] <asac> well done
[00:08] <bdrung> asac: i was the complete day away
[00:08] <asac> thats good ;)
[00:08] <asac> i mean really ;)
[00:08] <asac> tomorrow i will be away i hope
[00:08] <bdrung> asac: now i have to read 58 mails :)
[00:09] <asac> thats still managable
[00:09] <asac> :-P
[00:10] <bdrung> asac: when i am off the mail flood is lower :)
[00:10] <asac> hehe
[00:11] <fta> asac, it seems we have our own branch: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/karmic/cdbs/karmic
[00:11] <asac> what is the "ubuntu-branches" team?
[00:11] <asac> never heart of it
[00:12] <asac> yeah. so start developing
[00:12] <asac> also we should commit the change we had in firefox i think
[00:13] <micahg> oh, will there be a TB <IP_ADDRESS> anytime soon asac?
[00:13] <asac> yes
[00:13] <asac> i need to uploade it to -security ppa now that you say that
[00:13] <micahg> last release for FF 3.0.13, I couldn't d/l from security ppa for about 13 hours after it was built
[00:13] <asac> really?
[00:13] <micahg> yeah
[00:13] <micahg> idk why
[00:14] <asac> probably a publishing bug i guess
[00:14] <micahg> ok
[00:14] <micahg> I'll bug the LP admins if it happens again
[00:14] <asac> hmm. armel build queue doesnt look good
[00:14] <asac> i guess i should get that up asap
[00:14] <asac> yeah ... do that
[00:15] <micahg> ok, enjoy your day off if I don't mention it later asac
[00:15] <asac> hehe. yeah.
[00:15] <asac> feels like i will upload tbird tomorrow :/
[00:16] <asac> but thats ok. own fault. forgot completely even though getting mails about that for a while
[00:16] <micahg> I saw it yesterday on the Mozilla Planet blog
[00:20] <BUGabundo> htheeh
[00:20] <BUGabundo> thanks for the ping
[00:20] <BUGabundo> lolol
[00:20] <asac> oh you are there ;)
[00:20] <asac> here
[00:20] <BUGabundo> I am
[00:20] <asac> i would have replied here then ;)
[00:20] <BUGabundo> im everywhjere
[00:20] <BUGabundo> np
[00:20] <BUGabundo> I was going to ask you something
[00:20] <asac> about 3g? ;)
[00:20] <BUGabundo> but my brain already shutdown
[00:20] <BUGabundo> no idea :(
[00:20] <asac> thats good
[00:21] <asac> rest is good for you and me ;)
[00:21] <BUGabundo> fyi 3G is a bit unstable
[00:21] <BUGabundo> when I downgraded it fixed
[00:21] <BUGabundo> but won't work after hiberna
[00:21] <asac> downgraded NM?
[00:21] <BUGabundo> yep
[00:22] <BUGabundo> now with all upgrade I guess I upgraded again
[00:22] <asac> yeah hibernate could be mm ... but also linux more likely
[00:22] <BUGabundo> asac another guy with the same MM bug as me https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/modemmanager/+bug/412570
[00:22] <BUGabundo> got that on identica
[00:22] <BUGabundo> guess that what I have too
[00:22] <BUGabundo> ahhh now I recall
[00:23] <BUGabundo> loved htat paux de faul joke you did with multisearch addon
[00:23] <asac> you see the same problem?
[00:23] <BUGabundo> damn you must have been mad
[00:23] <BUGabundo> with all that ppl poking at you and saying nasty stuff
[00:23] <asac> which one? ;)
[00:23] <BUGabundo> asac I see. it keeps spining
[00:24]  * BUGabundo is too sleepy to keep two conversations
[00:24] <BUGabundo> back to MM
[00:24] <BUGabundo> asac I see. it keeps spining
[00:24] <BUGabundo> seems very similar to what the bug describes
[00:24] <BUGabundo> nothing even remotely useful in the logs
[00:25] <asac> BUGabundo: you need to run modemmanager with --debug
[00:25] <BUGabundo> yeah
[00:25] <BUGabundo> will do next time I plug the dongle
[00:25] <BUGabundo> better ask that on the bug too
[00:26]  * BUGabundo is toooo sleepy to read http://seclists.org/bugtraq/2008/Apr/0250.html but its nice to see how lame ISPs and Manufactures are
[00:26] <asac> (driver: 'option1')
[00:26] <BUGabundo> Default key algorithm in Thomson
[00:26] <BUGabundo> llololol
[00:27] <BUGabundo> asac that bug already has debug log
[00:27] <BUGabundo> is it useful?
[00:27] <asac> i think so ... yes.
[00:28] <BUGabundo> ok
[00:28] <fta> asac, are your nm branches ready?
[00:28] <BUGabundo> then no need for me to debug it
[00:28] <BUGabundo> :)
[00:29] <asac> fta: not for LOCAL_BRANCH
[00:30] <asac> besides from that i would think so.
[00:30] <asac> they produce good orig.tar.gz on get-orig-source
[00:30] <asac> BUGabundo: if its exactly your issue then yet
[00:30] <asac> yes
[00:30] <asac> BUGabundo: you sure you have novatel?
[00:30] <BUGabundo> guess so
[00:30] <BUGabundo> by the description and symptoms
[00:30] <BUGabundo> novatel??
[00:31] <BUGabundo> what's that?
[00:31] <asac> well... the description and symptoms dont really matter
[00:31] <asac> its the log that must match
[00:31] <BUGabundo> ok
[00:31] <asac> e.g. fail at the same point after the same series of commands
[00:31] <BUGabundo> ill get mine now
[00:31] <BUGabundo> just a sec
[00:31] <BUGabundo> back
[00:31] <BUGabundo> dongle in hand
[00:31] <BUGabundo> what you need?
[00:31] <fta> asac, once everything is there, give me the branch urls, and where i should push (i need perms) - in an email
[00:31] <BUGabundo> I'm on wifi, so what ever we do that may affect that , let me know ahead
[00:32] <asac> fta: yes. i would think monday
[00:32] <asac> thx
[00:32] <BUGabundo> asac: where do you want me to start?
[00:32] <asac> BUGabundo: wifi can interfere. but as long as you have a good thing thats ok
[00:32] <asac> good connection
[00:32] <BUGabundo> nm stop,
[00:33] <BUGabundo> mm --debug?
[00:33] <asac> BUGabundo: yes. then sudo killall modem-manager; modem-manager --debug 2>&1 > /tmp/mm.log.txt
[00:33] <asac> err
[00:33] <asac> BUGabundo: yes. then sudo killall modem-manager; sudo modem-manager --debug 2>&1 > /tmp/mm.log.txt
[00:33] <BUGabundo> before or after pluging the dongle?
[00:34] <asac> BUGabundo: dont plug it in
[00:34] <asac> then do that
[00:34] <BUGabundo> ok
[00:34] <asac> then plug in ;)
[00:38] <BUGabundo> back
[00:38] <BUGabundo> !ping
[00:38] <BUGabundo> !ping
[00:38] <BUGabundo> back
[00:38] <BUGabundo> asac http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/112892/mm.log.txt
[00:39] <asac> ack
[00:39] <BUGabundo> asac it is as if it connects
[00:39] <asac> so different plugin -> different bug ;)
[00:39] <BUGabundo> starts with red lead (3G) then falls to GPRS
[00:40] <BUGabundo> transfer speed stays at 0
[00:40] <BUGabundo> diff bug, but exactly same behaviour
[00:40] <BUGabundo> lets see how long until a triagger dupe them
[00:40] <BUGabundo> ahah
[00:40] <BUGabundo> filling now
[00:40] <asac> BUGabundo: please add [huawei] to the title
[00:41] <asac> and [novatel] in front of the other
[00:41] <BUGabundo> Package modem-manager does not exist
[00:41] <BUGabundo> grrrr
[00:41] <asac> BUGabundo: also please downgrade and do the same and attach the log from the successful attempt ;)
[00:41] <BUGabundo> $ ubuntu-bug modemmanager
[00:41] <asac> that probably makes it trivial
[00:42] <BUGabundo> [] added to both bugs
[00:44] <BUGabundo> downgrading now
[00:45] <BUGabundo> asac will I have to reboot ?????
[00:45] <asac> BUGabundo: no.
[00:45] <BUGabundo> ok
[00:45] <asac> at least i hope so
[00:45] <asac> stop NM kill mm and start with --debug  ... then start nm
[00:48] <BUGabundo> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/modemmanager/+bug/413333
[00:48] <BUGabundo> killing NM now
[00:48] <BUGabundo> brb
[00:51] <BUGabundo> !ping
[00:52] <BUGabundo> !ping
[00:52] <BUGabundo> dsdfdsbgsgbdb
[00:52] <BUGabundo> !ping
[00:52] <BUGabundo> !ping
[00:52] <BUGabundo> is this thing on???
[00:53] <BUGabundo> !ping
[00:54] <Mook_sb> BUGabundo: yes, it is
[00:54] <BUGabundo> oh ok
[00:54] <BUGabundo> why aint the bot replying ??
[00:54] <BUGabundo> asac https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/modemmanager/+bug/413333
[00:54] <BUGabundo> updated with new log
[00:54] <BUGabundo> take a look please
[00:55] <asac> k
[00:56] <BUGabundo> asac also I still get hitted by that very annoying bug where the 1st connect doesn't work
[00:56] <BUGabundo> and re-connecting just disconects
[00:56] <BUGabundo> that should be visible in those logs
[00:58] <asac> ** (modem-manager:27265): DEBUG: (ttyUSB1): probe requested by plugin 'Generic'
[00:58] <asac> ** (modem-manager:27265): DEBUG: (ttyUSB1): --> 'AT+GCAP<CR>'
[00:58] <asac> ** (modem-manager:27265): DEBUG: (ttyUSB1): <-- 'AT+GCAP<CR><CR><LF>+GCAP: +CGSM,+DS,+ES<CR><LF><CR><LF>OK<CR><LF>'
[00:58] <BUGabundo> that's tells me nothing
[00:58] <BUGabundo> I can only read 10
[00:58] <BUGabundo> :D
[00:58] <asac> its different ;)
[01:01] <asac> seems like the successful one tries to use manual CREG
[01:01] <asac> and the unsuccessful one uses unsolicited CREG
[01:02] <BUGabundo> ok
[01:02] <BUGabundo> that affects many many users
[01:02] <BUGabundo> who don't understand why they are "connected" but don't have net
[01:02] <BUGabundo> I noticed it clearly
[01:02] <BUGabundo> because I have an applet
[01:02] <BUGabundo> netspeed
[01:03] <BUGabundo> and since it stays at zero, I immediately reconnect
[01:04] <BUGabundo> asac if you don't need anything else
[01:04] <BUGabundo> I'm going to bed
[01:05] <BUGabundo> im up in 6 h
[01:07] <asac> well.
[01:08] <asac> many many users is exaggeration
[01:08] <asac> its karmic
[01:08] <asac> we have to flash things out
[01:08] <asac> it claims your port as a secondary por
[01:08] <asac> t
[01:08] <BUGabundo> ehehe
[01:08] <asac> thats wrong
[01:08] <asac> and fixing that will fix it i guess ,)
[01:08] <BUGabundo> I didn't say that bug was karmic only
[01:08] <BUGabundo> I see it too on jaunty
[01:08] <BUGabundo> ill request a couple of logs
[01:09] <BUGabundo> bed
[02:02] <bdrung_> Jazzva: thanks for the man pages. -devscripts is now lintian clean. :)
[02:03] <Jazzva> bdrung_: no problem :)
[02:05] <bdrung_> Jazzva: but why didn't you use utf-8 for your name in the man page?
[02:05] <bdrung_> Jazzva: btw, you can wrap long lines.
[02:06] <Jazzva> bdrung_: I figured it autowraps, and just left them as they are (though it's cleaner if I wrap them...)
[02:07] <Jazzva> bdrung_: as for the utf-8... I have no idea... I think I just started without š and ž, and then I was lazy to change :).
[02:07] <bdrung_> Jazzva: :)
[02:08] <bdrung_> good night
[02:09] <Jazzva> good night
[02:09] <Jazzva> i'm off too
[02:11] <fta> bdrung_, you should not have touched changelog, some tools use diffs to show new revs, you broke them
[02:12] <bdrung_> fta: which tools?
[02:20] <asac> fta: whats broken?
[02:20] <fta> +if
[02:21] <asac> fta: what context i mean?
[02:21] <asac> fta: you mean the cleanup of previous changelog?
[02:21] <fta> yes
[02:21] <fta> it's like rewriting history
[02:22] <asac> fta: well. its just line wraps ;)
[02:22] <asac> i didnt even know that mozilla-devscripts is maintained by a bot
[02:23] <asac> otherwise i would have been more careful
[02:25] <asac> fta: what tool is broken now?
[02:35] <asac> ok off for today.
[07:00] <Kamping_Kaiser> hi team.
[07:00] <Kamping_Kaiser> I was hoping to confirm that Ubuntu removes mozillas proprietary crash reporting module
[07:01] <Kamping_Kaiser> from Thunderbird.
[11:28] <asac> Kamping_Kaiser: we dont remove it ... we have it disabled
[11:30] <Kamping_Kaiser> asac: so (aiui) its in the source tarball, but not included in the binaries?
[11:31] <asac> Kamping_Kaiser: we strip binaries out of tarball. also we strip non-free stuff that we are aware off
[11:31] <asac> checkout our tarball and if you see something that is not free let us know+
[11:32] <asac> vi ./toolkit/crashreporter/google-breakpad/COPYING
[11:32] <asac> -> thats a free license
[11:32] <asac> i dont think its proprietary afaik
[11:32] <asac> at least not the client side
[11:33] <Kamping_Kaiser> asac: thanks. that was my understanding of what happened, but I thought before I close the bug in question I should double check.
[11:34] <asac> Kamping_Kaiser: yeah. if the user has specific files in mind we should check that
[11:35] <Kamping_Kaiser> asac: None that I'm aware of. If some come to light, I'll get it investigated. thanks for your help
[11:39] <asac> if user is just ranting. close the bug
[15:20] <fta> asac, reed is "on indefinite leave from the Mozilla project" ?
[16:11] <asac> fta: hmm. how do you know?
[16:11] <asac> fta: i think he has some study things still going on
[16:12] <fta> in bugzilla
[16:12] <asac> hmm. i think he would probably even mark a leave of 3 weeks like that ;)
[16:15] <asac> maybe we should send him a mail ;)
[16:18] <fta> asac, he subscribed us to mozilla 510358 yesterday
[16:18] <asac> yay
[16:18] <fta> that's how i found out
[16:26] <asac> updated https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=447771
[16:27] <asac> lets hope we can move forward
[16:27] <asac> ok out for some pre-dinner and relaxing in sun
[17:18] <tyn0r> hi
[17:18] <micahg> tyn0r: Can I help you?
[17:20] <tyn0r> On ubuntu with Thunderbird 3.0b4pre install with the ppa mozilla-daily, when i install the french xpi (http://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/thunderbird/nightly/latest-comm-1.9.1-l10n/thunderbird-3.0b4pre.fr.langpack.xpi) It doesn't change thunderbird in french ... Any ideas to make it works ?
[17:20] <tyn0r> Only add the french dictionnary ...
[17:20] <micahg> sorry, I don't have any experience with i18n
[17:20] <tyn0r> Maybe it's the wrong file ?
[17:21] <micahg> idk if the lang packs are working yet for tb3
[17:21] <tyn0r> ok thanks ... i'm going to mail the ml !
[17:21] <tyn0r> so why give them ?
[17:21] <micahg> well, they might be :)
[17:21] <micahg> I really don't know
[17:22] <asac> tyn0r: check that "matchOS"="true" in the preferences of tbird
[17:22] <asac> also ensure that LANG=fr
[17:22] <asac> in your env
[17:23] <tyn0r> in the preference menu .. .?
[17:23] <asac> tyn0r: in the advanced config editor search for matchOS
[17:23] <tyn0r> ok
[17:23] <asac> yeah
[17:23] <asac> its false
[17:23] <asac> thats a packaging bug actually
[17:24] <asac> set that to true
[17:24] <micahg> hi asac, I thought you were off :)
[17:24] <asac> intl.locale.matchOS
[17:24] <asac> micahg: i am ;) ... just checked if anything blew up :)
[17:24] <micahg> should I ask you about ff-kde blueprints or wait til monday?
[17:24] <tyn0r> so i put intl.locale.matchOS => true ?
[17:24] <asac> yes
[17:24] <tyn0r> and restart th ?
[17:24] <asac> could be that having that in your user config doesnt help
[17:24] <asac> yes
[17:25] <asac> you might need to put it in /etc/thunderbird-.3.0/pref/...
[17:25] <asac> but first try to set it in your user account
[17:26] <asac> tyn0r: remember that if installing a .xpi it will hide your system extensions/translations forever. so as soon as we have proper translations support for tbird, remove your .xpi again
[17:26] <tyn0r> so matchOS to true ... restart and nothing ... i had to edit something in my ~/.thunderbird-3.0 ?
[17:26] <asac> no
[17:27] <asac> tyn0r: you have to edit it here i guess: /usr/lib/thunderbird-3.0b4pre/greprefs/all.js
[17:27] <asac> unfortunately that will get overriden on every update ;)
[17:27] <tyn0r> ok i'll tri
[17:28] <asac> the packages are not properly hooked up
[17:28] <asac> with system configs yet
[17:28] <asac> tyn0r: are you sure your whole desktop is in french `
[17:28] <asac> ?
[17:28] <tyn0r> i didnt have the directory : /usr/lib/thunderbird-3.0b4pre/greprefs/all.js
[17:28] <asac> yes
[17:28] <tyn0r> yes it's in french
[17:28] <asac> you didnt have that?
[17:28] <asac> ls /usr/lib/thunderbird-3.0b4pre/greprefs/
[17:28] <asac> all.js	security-prefs.js  xpinstall.js
[17:29] <asac> thats what i have
[17:29] <asac> you sure you have our package installed?
[17:29] <asac> /usr/lib/thunderbird-3.0b4pre/greprefs/all.js -> thats a file not a dir
[17:29] <tyn0r> no thunderbird dir in /usr/lib ...
[17:29] <asac> tyn0r: then you dont have our package
[17:29] <asac> and we cannot help you ;)
[17:30] <asac> install thunderbird-3.0 package
[17:30] <asac> from our ppa ;)
[17:30] <tyn0r> yes install by an apt-get install thunderbird-3-gnome-support
[17:30] <tyn0r> it's done !
[17:30] <asac> 3.0
[17:30] <tyn0r> i'llcheck
[17:30] <asac> great
[17:31] <tyn0r> oups ...
[17:31] <tyn0r> sorry my term was in a ssh on my server ...
[17:32] <tyn0r> so in this file i had to change ?
[17:32] <asac> the option we discussed
[17:32] <asac> its already in there
[17:32] <asac> just set to "false"
[17:33] <tyn0r> i had to remove the french xpi from the addon menu ?
[17:33] <tyn0r> ok
[17:33] <asac> no
[17:33] <tyn0r> pref("intl.locale.matchOS",                 false);
[17:33] <asac> yes that needs to be true
[17:33] <tyn0r> ok
[17:33] <tyn0r> Works fine !
[17:33] <tyn0r> thanks !
[17:34] <tyn0r> and so, when the release will came up, i had to change this to false and install the future thunderbird-3-language-fr (exemple)...
[17:36] <tyn0r> It's a quite good work that you make !
[17:36] <asac> tyn0r: no. so on every update you get this will get changed
[17:36] <asac> tyn0r: back
[17:36] <asac> unfortunately
[17:36] <asac> we will change it in the package
[17:36] <tyn0r> thanks ... (i'll post the trick in my blog for all french thunderbird 3 users !)
[17:36] <asac> just ping us if it breaks on next update
[17:36] <asac> so i remember to fix it
[17:36] <tyn0r> ok
[17:36] <tyn0r> Thanks
[17:36] <tyn0r> & bye
[17:36] <asac> tyn0r: well
[17:37] <asac> tyn0r: if you tell that to users, please tell them that they must remove the addon when we get real translations
[17:37] <asac> at some point it will break tbird badly
[17:37] <asac> e.g. when tbird strings changes
[17:37] <tyn0r> yes ... because the xpi is remplace with a real package ? as in firefox !?
[17:37] <asac> it might break the complete UI
[17:37] <tyn0r> ok
[17:37] <asac> tyn0r: no. its just that the xpi you installed wont get auto updated
[17:38] <asac> so when string changes in tbird, you dont have all strings translated
[17:38] <asac> and in some situation that will bust the UI
[17:38] <tyn0r> ok
[17:38] <tyn0r> noted !
[17:38] <asac> good
[17:38] <tyn0r> thanks for your help !
[17:38] <asac> even if it doesnt break they should remove the addon as they will not get any system translations otherwise ;)
[17:38] <asac> and latest for 3.1 it will break for sure :)
[17:38] <asac> ok off too
[17:38] <asac> no problem
[17:53] <asac> jdstrand: ok requested review from fta for packaging aspects. when he is happy i am happy and you can ask anyone here to merge it in (or bug me on monday)
[17:53] <asac> (on apparmor merge request)
[17:57] <jdstrand> asac: thanks
[18:13] <mac_v> hi... is there a way to backup Firefox History  ?
[19:24] <bernhard> is there somebody who can tell me when the official bits of firefox 3.5.x will be available for ubuntu 8.04 ?
[21:20] <fta> asac, Jazzva: still red.. http://launchpadlibrarian.net/30320748/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-amd64.prism_1.0b2%2Bsvn20090813r49078-0ubuntu1~umd2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[21:22] <Jazzva> fta: I'll take a quick look now
[21:50] <micahg> fta: are you going to branch into 3.6 and 3.7 for nightlies?
[21:52] <fta> micahg, yes, i was waiting for it to start but it apparently started
[21:52] <fta> *ERROR* 3.7~a1~hg20090814r31562+nobinonly doesn't match ^3\.6(\~|\.). Abort
[21:53] <micahg> http://blog.mozilla.com/bhearsum/archives/108
[21:54] <fta> and i need to rebranch 3.6 to Namoroka
[22:00] <micahg> yep :)
[22:01] <micahg> I just e-mailed asac about getting namarooka into karmic
[22:01] <micahg> RC is scheduled for end of October
[22:04] <fta> which just a1? lol
[22:05] <micahg> fta: https://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox/Namoroka
[22:05] <pace_t_zulu> micah sounds like it belongs in karmic+1
[22:06] <fta> i will close 1.9.2~a1 and 3.6~a1 anyway (even if it doesn't go to karmic), it's better to fork the branch at a milestone
[22:07] <pace_t_zulu> you guys able to use code.launchpad.net ?
[22:07] <pace_t_zulu> i get a timeout error
[22:07] <micahg> try again
[22:07] <micahg> sometimes the servers are overloaded
[22:08] <micahg> there's already a xul2.0?
[22:08] <micahg> oh, that's old
[22:10] <pace_t_zulu> micahg: it has been this way for days... i think it's because i am a beta tester.. "As a member of the Launchpad Beta Testers team, you're more likely to experience them"
[22:10]  * micahg is also a beta tester
[22:10] <micahg> actually I haven;t had problems recently
[22:11] <pace_t_zulu> i cannot access http://code.launchpad.net/~fta
[22:11] <pace_t_zulu> https
[22:11] <micahg> wfm
[22:11] <fta> micahg, yes, after 3.0 they did 4.0->3.1->3.5   (1.9 => 2.0->1.9.1)
[22:11] <micahg> :)
[22:12] <fta> and during 3.1, 3.2->3.6
[22:34] <Jazzva> fta: I won't be able to look into this more tonight. I experienced this type of things with some extensions, but it's not the same cause of problem. It seems like the XPI_FILE parameter is lost somewhere (even if there is valid MOZ_XPI_FILE in debian/rules). If no one gets to it, I'll check it tomorrow about 11, 12.
[22:35] <pace_t_zulu> fta: i am unable to view your code through launchpad... could you pass along the location for your bot scripts and confs?
[22:35] <fta> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~fta/+junk/ppa-scripts
[22:35] <fta> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~fta/+junk/ppa-confs
[22:36] <pace_t_zulu> ah code.edge ... ty fta
[23:04] <BUGabundo> hey guys
[23:09] <pace_t_zulu> hey BUGabundo
[23:09] <BUGabundo> hey pace_t_zulu
[23:09] <pace_t_zulu> fta:  just now tried to set up the ppa bot... haven't had time to work on it since you first showed me
[23:09] <pace_t_zulu> fta: almost have it working
[23:10] <pace_t_zulu> BUGabundo: micahg wants ff3.6 in karmic... what do you think of that?
[23:11] <BUGabundo> ohh
[23:11] <BUGabundo> don't be stupid
[23:12] <pace_t_zulu> haha
[23:12] <pace_t_zulu> BUGabundo: sounds like a karmic
[23:12] <pace_t_zulu> BUGabundo: sounds like a karmic+1 kind of thing
[23:13] <pace_t_zulu> BUGabundo: FF3.5 just landed in karmic
[23:13] <BUGabundo> maybe
[23:13] <BUGabundo> not sure what the roadmap for 3.7 or 4 will be
[23:13] <micahg> BUGabundo: 3.6 is supposed to be out in Nov
[23:14] <BUGabundo> really?
[23:14] <BUGabundo> didntknow there would be a release for 3.6
[23:14] <BUGabundo> only 3.7 and 4
[23:15] <pace_t_zulu> micahg: but karmic is out in october...
[23:15] <micahg> right
[23:15] <micahg> so?
[23:15] <micahg> jaunty had 3.5 before release
[23:15] <pace_t_zulu> micahg: but 3.0 was default
[23:15] <micahg> so?
[23:16] <micahg> 3.5 is default in Karmic
[23:16] <pace_t_zulu> micahg: 3.6 could be in main but the 'firefox' meta should point to firefox-3.5 ... not firefox-3.6
[23:16] <pace_t_zulu> micahg: well i agree with you then
[23:16] <micahg> nah, throw it in universe
[23:16] <micahg> i don't care
[23:16] <micahg> just get it in there
[23:16] <pace_t_zulu> as long as firefox => firefox-3.5
[23:16] <micahg> I'll talk to asac Monday
[23:16] <micahg> right
[23:16] <pace_t_zulu> micahg: you can get it from the ppa
[23:16] <BUGabundo> not enoug test for 3.6
[23:16] <BUGabundo> forget that idea ok ?
[23:17] <micahg> BUGabundo: 3.6 isn't trunk anymore :)
[23:17] <BUGabundo> maybe in universe
[23:17] <pace_t_zulu> BUGabundo: micahg's idea is actually a good one... it'll help karmic+1
[23:17] <BUGabundo> but it would be too much work to put on the team
[23:17]  * micahg can help :)
[23:18]  * pace_t_zulu can help too :)
[23:19] <BUGabundo> on karmic+1 we can put 3.6 on universe
[23:19] <BUGabundo> and then replace 3.5 before FeatureFreeze
[23:19] <micahg> BUGabundo: karmic + 1 it'll be the default :)
[23:20] <BUGabundo> or even 3.7 or 4
[23:26] <micahg> ok, I'm off
[23:39] <fta> or Chromium ;)
[23:45] <BUGabundo> ehehe
[23:45] <BUGabundo> fta: are 64build ready?
[23:45] <fta> no
[23:46] <BUGabundo> :(
[23:46] <fta> no update today either
[23:46] <fta> the tree was closed for almost 48 hours
[23:49] <BUGabundo> why?
[23:56] <asac_> fta: nice... i see the "version" safety net worked ;)
[23:56] <asac_> 22:52 < fta> *ERROR* 3.7~a1~hg20090814r31562+nobinonly doesn't match ^3\.6(\~|\.). Abort
[23:56] <asac_> 22:52 < fta> *ERROR* 3.7~a1~hg20090814r31562+nobinonly doesn't match ^3\.6(\~|\.). Abort
[23:56] <fta> yep
[23:56] <BUGabundo> hey asac
[23:57] <asac_> hi
[23:57] <BUGabundo> fta: so why was the tree closed?
[23:57] <BUGabundo> fta: what do I need to make this vids play on chromium ? http://p.bugabundo.net/
[23:57] <asac_> too many reds/orange most likely
[23:57] <fta> yep
[23:58] <asac_> the schedule looks really slick
[23:58] <asac_> https://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox/Namoroka
[23:58] <asac_> just one alpha
[23:58] <fta> 120 commits on top of red, today's sheriff was mad and closed the tree
[23:58] <asac_> then beta1/2 in sep and RC in 09?
[23:58] <asac_> err oct
[23:59] <asac_> i dont believe it yet :)
[23:59] <asac_> yeah
[23:59] <asac_> i guess folks think now that 3.7 is trunk they can throw in crazy stuff


[00:02] <juliank> test works now (and fails in 1.2.8!)
[00:04] <infinity> juliank: Always a good sign for a test.
[00:04]  * infinity decides it's pizza and TV time.
[00:11] <juliank> lamont: Fixed in https://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/apt/apt.git/commit/?id=6df5632
[00:13] <juliank> infinity: It was TV time for me, and then lamont returned with bug details. So it became bugfixing time :D
[00:15] <juliank> Off to bed now, it's 1am...
[00:22]  * juliank should write a tool to create minimal apt test cases ...
[00:33] <juliank> lamont: infinity: Uploaded 1.2.9 to Debian, should be part of the next dinstall run in an hour.
[00:33] <juliank> => can be synced in a few hours
[00:33] <infinity> juliank: Is "aptget" in the testcase a typo, or a wrapper?
[00:33] <juliank> infinity: A wrapper
[00:33] <infinity> Check.
[00:35] <juliank> infinity: apt-get still runs the host apt-get, and aptget the one in the build tree
[00:39] <juliank> Oh really, the armhf test suite for 1.2.8 now failed in another test... :/
[00:40] <juliank> We run those flaky tests 10 times, and they still fail :/
[00:41] <juliank> Maybe we should run them in qemu to slow things down ...
[00:43] <infinity> juliank: Meh, they'll magically all work in 1.2.9 for no good reason anyway.
[00:44] <juliank> Let's hope so.
[00:44] <juliank> It's almost always armhf and i386 failing
[00:44] <infinity> Coincidentally, the only 32-bit arches in adt?
[00:45] <juliank> Yeah. I suppose those are the slowest ones
[00:45] <infinity> I didn't say slowest, just 32-bit.
[00:45] <juliank> Yes, but I said
[00:45] <infinity> The amd64 and i386 tests run on exactly the same hardware.
[00:45] <juliank> hmm
[00:46] <juliank> Somewhat surprising
[00:47] <infinity> These same tests are run at build-time, right?
[00:47] <juliank> No
[00:47] <infinity> Ahh.  Kay.
[00:47] <infinity> Cause I'd be even more confused if they did.
[00:47] <juliank> At build-time we only run small unit tests
[00:47] <juliank> CI systems (autopkgtest, travis) also run full integration test suite
[00:48] <juliank> or actually, they only run the integration tests...
[00:48] <juliank> Well, travis runs both
[00:49] <juliank> I think the problem with the download progress testing is that curl does not really respect speed limits you tell it
[00:50] <juliank> It starts fetching at full speed and then adjusts down to reach the requested speed
[00:50] <juliank> which fails on localhost for 800KB files
[00:50] <infinity> So you need bigger files?
[00:50] <infinity> Or less curl.
[00:51] <juliank> That might make sense
[00:51] <juliank> Well, the https method uses curl
[00:51] <infinity> Oh, right.
[00:51] <infinity> Bigger files, then.
[00:52] <juliank> Yes
[00:52] <juliank> And the other failing test, I have no idea yet.
[00:52] <juliank> It's supposed to test that fetching A, and B (which redirects to A) only cause one download of A
[00:53] <juliank> It actually does, but the 103 Redirect message from the method to the main process is never shown
[00:53] <juliank> It says " @ Queue: Action combined for http://localhost:35267/foo and http://localhost:35267/foo"
[00:54] <infinity> Weren't you supposed to be sleeping? :)
[00:54] <juliank> Yes, unfortunately, yes.
[00:55]  * juliank should just grep for "@ Queue: Action combined for" instead of "103 Redirect", that would be more reliable
[00:57] <juliank> I see what's going on
[00:58] <juliank> GET /foo with "Range: bytes=64350-" cannot work on a 64350 byte fil
[00:58] <juliank> Going to feed that bug to DonKult
[01:03] <juliank> So this one might actually be a real bug
[01:07] <juliank> I feel like I just lost one hour :/
[01:08] <juliank> Hello summertime, I suppose :/
[01:12] <lamont> juliank: thanks!
[01:24] <karstensrage> infinity, cant thank you enough, works flawlessly on 16.04
[01:25] <karstensrage> freaking brilliant
[01:25] <karstensrage> very happy
[01:34] <karstensrage> can someone help me with backports?
[05:03] <fo0bar> to request a (universe) package be synced from debian after the import freeze, should I request an SRU?  I've only had to do this once before years ago, and seem to remember the process was SRU-like, but can't remember if it was an SRU specifically
[05:05] <fo0bar> (package update, not new package)
[05:18] <fo0bar> ah, found my previous request (from 2012).  looks like it's just a matter of "please sync" against the package, with an explanation of the rationale
[05:21] <karstensrage> fo0bar, are you familiar with the rationale's for backports?
[05:21] <karstensrage> for new stuff
[05:23] <fo0bar> karstensrage: in general, or for my specific request?
[05:26] <karstensrage> fo0bar, in general
[05:27] <karstensrage> i have two new packages that got into xenial and id like them backported to trusty and precise
[05:29] <fo0bar> karstensrage: ahh yes, I do happen to.  that is a Stable Release Update (SRU), and is explained at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
[05:30] <karstensrage> that doesnt seem like its for new packages?
[05:31] <fo0bar> karstensrage: I believe the process is the same.  I'm not an Ubuntu developer, but I do know that once releases are finalized (and especially LTSes), SRU requests get more scrutiny than normal sync requests, so you'll need to read over and closely follow that doc
[05:31] <karstensrage> hmm ok
[05:48] <infinity> fo0bar: That's not an SRU he's asking for, it's a backport.
[05:48] <infinity> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBackports
[05:48] <infinity> Very different (goes to a different pocket, managed by different people, etc)
[05:49] <infinity> karstensrage: The process is as laid out on the wiki page.  Expecting immediate response to backports bugs is probably your failing.  Be patient, once you've followed the right steps.
[05:49] <infinity> fo0bar: What are you looking to get synced?
[05:50] <fo0bar> infinity: ah sorry, my mistake
[05:51] <fo0bar> infinity: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/2ping/+bug/1562455
[05:51] <infinity> ubottu: Your parser sucks.
[05:51] <fo0bar> haha
[05:51] <fo0bar> 2ping used to be the first sorted package in the archive, before that damned 0ad came around
[05:51] <infinity> fo0bar: Done.
[05:52] <fo0bar> infinity: ta!
[05:55] <infinity> fo0bar: Oh, if I'd seen who the upstream was, I might have not synced it.
[05:55] <infinity> fo0bar: Can we trust that guy?
[05:55] <fo0bar> that jerk
[05:57] <fo0bar> 2ping protocol is about 99.5% binary data and lives happily (and safely) in bytearray() land, but that other .5% is optional text notice data, and of course that's the part I screwed up
[05:57] <fo0bar> luckily when not in debug mode, all untrusted parsing is handled in a failsafe exception handler
[05:58] <infinity> I should write a second implementation of the protocol called bigping.
[05:59] <infinity> Full name, of course, Notorious P.I.N.G.
[05:59] <fo0bar> haha
[06:39] <karstensrage> infinity, i just want to make sure i have a properly worded rationale for the backport, i am anxious but not expecting an immediate response
[06:40] <karstensrage> ive been looking over other rationales that i can find but i dont see any patterns
[06:40] <karstensrage> i mean for golang backports the rationale i guess i obvious
[06:40] <karstensrage> ... is obvious
[06:40] <infinity> karstensrage: The only real rationale for a NEW package needs to be "this package doesn't exist in trusty, but I'd like to use it there".
[06:40] <infinity> karstensrage: The backports pocket isn't particularly strict in what it accepts.
[06:41] <karstensrage> ok that makes sense
[06:41] <infinity> (Which is why we don't install it by default)
[06:42] <karstensrage> oh sure, these packages dont even make sense as defaults
[06:42] <karstensrage> for anything
[06:42] <infinity> I meant we don't install anything from backports by default.  ie: if there's an upgraded version of something in backports, apt won't offer it to you unless you explicitly request it.
[06:43] <infinity> With, say "apt-get install package/trusty-backports"
[06:43] <karstensrage> hmm so like even if you already have the package installed it doesnt say an update is available?
[06:43] <infinity> Exactly.
[06:43] <infinity> Because we don't support backports.
[06:43] <infinity> So auto-upgrading people to it would be irresponsible.
[06:43] <karstensrage> oh but security updates are handled differently right?
[06:43] <infinity> It's a use-at-your-own-risk service to people who prefer new shiny over well-supported.
[06:44] <infinity> -security and -updates pockets are automatic.  -backports isn't.
[06:44] <karstensrage> oh i see
[06:44] <karstensrage> ah now i see
[06:45] <karstensrage> ok that really is different than what i thought, let me re-read backports with this new context to see if i get something different
[06:46] <infinity> karstensrage: Backports is almost certainly where your "I want my new package on old releases" request belongs.  It's not even remotely acceptable as an SRU.
[06:46] <infinity> karstensrage: Alternately, you could just tell your users to use xenial if they want your package.  Your call.
[06:47] <karstensrage> yeah i get that, but what happens if a security issue or bug is found, and then you want that backported as well?
[06:47] <infinity> You just submit another backport request.
[06:47] <karstensrage> but it wont show to be updated?
[06:47] <infinity> So, the security fix lands in xenial-security, then you ask the backporty people to re-backport the xenial-security version to trusty-backports.
[06:47] <karstensrage> since its -backport?
[06:47] <infinity> Oh, once something is installed from -backports, you get updates from -backports.
[06:47] <karstensrage> ah ok
[06:47] <karstensrage> ok gotcha
[06:48] <infinity> It's the initial install/upgrade to/from backports that has to be explicit.
[06:48] <karstensrage> yes of course
[06:48] <karstensrage> yes that makes sense
[06:49] <karstensrage> alright thank you, ill re-read again in the morning, kind of bleary eyed, must get some sleep, good night
[06:51] <infinity> 'Night.
[09:38] <ginggs> infinity: was that you rebuilding fpc just now?
[09:51] <juliank> infinity: I guess we're not that lucky with apt 1.2.9, the i386 autopkgtest failed the flaky progress detection twice :(  - either retry a third time (or how much more is needed) or ignore the issue (if possible). I'm currently testing a way to make the test less flaky, by using 16MB test files instead of 800KB ones
[12:15] <juliank> cjwatson: Does openssh-server really need a strictly versioned dep on openssh-client? This can cause APT to switch architectures if the native arch is not available in the wanted version, but the other arch is (https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/272416/why-installing-openssh-server-would-remove-openssh-client)
[12:16]  * juliank has a fix for that on the APT side too, but not sure if he will roll it out
[12:17] <juliank> APT fix: https://github.com/julian-klode/apt/compare/master...julian-klode:bugfix/cross-arch-candidate?expand=1
[12:35] <mapreri> can somebody mark lp #1562114 as triaged/minor (or whatever severity launchpad offers for this)
[16:54] <mitya57> mapreri, done
[16:54] <mapreri> mitya57: ta :)
[18:19] <infinity> ginggs: It was not me.
[18:20] <infinity> juliank: Retried yet again.  The odds aren't playing out for us right now, though. :P
[18:22] <juliank> infinity: Yeah, I have not seen that fail that often (3 runs until now, and all 3 failed the same flaky test) - hopefully this gets better when the test uses 16 MB files instead of 800 KB ones...
[18:22] <juliank> I could also start at 1MB, and then double the size with every failure
[18:23] <infinity> Heh.
[18:23] <infinity> That's assuming upping the size really helps.
[18:23] <infinity> If the problem is that you need a (vaguely) consistent throttled speed, could you throttle it from the server side instead?
[18:23] <infinity> (not sure what you're using as your https server in the tests)
[18:27] <juliank> It's a custom built server, so the answer is yes, we can throttle there.
[18:28] <juliank> s/built/written/
[18:28] <juliank> I tried adding usleep(100) between each 500  byte block, that made things less bad
[18:29] <juliank> but larger file size produced less retries on my test system, so I suspect it's the same on i386
[18:31] <juliank> It tries 16 MB files, starting with a limit of 16 MB/s and then throttling down, dividing by the number of the retry
[18:32] <juliank> This actually seems to throttle, as a run at half speed takes 5 seconds instead of 3
[18:51] <ginggs> infinity: no worries, i guess it was Logan wondering why his lazarus sync wouldn't build on powerpc. I've filed bug LP: #1562480
[18:53] <juliank> infinity: no luck :(
[18:54] <juliank> infinity: Is it possible to just force accept it?
[18:55] <infinity> juliank: It is, yeah.
[18:55] <infinity> juliank: But I'm bored enough to retry a few dozen more times too.
[19:00] <juliank> Such a waste of resources ...
[19:01] <juliank> With the larger size coming in 1.2.10 I have not yet seen a single failure or even a retry
[19:01] <infinity> juliank: That's promising.
[19:01] <juliank> in my i386 chroot
[19:02] <juliank> which failed quite easily before (1 of 5 tries I think)
[19:02] <juliank> s/tries/runs/
[19:03] <juliank> Now I have done 15 runs already
[19:03] <juliank> every check passed
[19:15] <infinity> juliank: Hey look, 5th time's the charm. :P
[19:15] <juliank> <insert random exclamation here>!
[19:16]  * juliank should really implement rate limiting on the server
[19:17] <infinity> juliank: That's probably the only way tests like this won't be an arms race.
[19:18] <infinity> juliank: I note that the 800k file was "testfile.big", which is hilarious.
[19:18] <infinity> If 800k is "big", I think we found a time machine.
[19:19] <juliank> I think with 800k, the bytes were already buffered in the kernel sometimes
[19:20] <juliank> causing the whole issue of directly going from 0 to 100
[19:20] <juliank> Actually, I'm not sure how much the method(s) request at once.
[19:20] <juliank> But it's definitely less than 16 MB :D
[19:23] <juliank> Our time out is 500ms
[19:24] <juliank> That is, we print progress every 500 ms
[19:24] <juliank> If two tests take 1.3 seconds or something like that as they used to do, that can't work
[22:16] <juliank> Is it possible to lock down launchpad bugs?
[22:16] <juliank> bug #1558331 is getting a bit out of control
[22:20] <cjwatson> juliank: There's some common functionality in both packages and I'd rather not have confusion due to "apt-get install openssh-server" not upgrading both.  Surely this isn't the only package with this pattern of dependencies?
[22:21] <juliank> OK
[22:40]  * juliank does not understand why users are so whiny about a very small minority of neglected repositories not working with a not-yet-released Ubuntu release...
[22:41] <juliank> Especially Nvidia is terrifying: They only have MD5 checksums.
[22:42] <ari-tczew> cjwatson: is there still actual problem with syncpackage?
[22:43] <juliank> ari-tczew: (not cj, but: ) It at least imported apt fine, so it seems OK to me ...
[22:44] <ari-tczew> juliank: I've already synced one package for me and it works as well. however, I did a sponsor sync and I guess there is something missed..
[23:02] <Logan> ginggs: good deductive skills! :P
[23:02] <Logan> that's exactly why I retried
[23:40] <duobix> Hi there, is there a plan to support devices with 32bit uefi and 64bit cpus? (bay trail/cheap x86 tablets)