[02:26] <abdullah> any one can help me with my wifi adapter " netgear wn11 "
[02:27] <hggdh> abdullah, this is not a support channel. Please go to #ubuntu+1 (if running Karmic), or #ubuntu for help
[02:28] <abdullah> there not token to me
[14:19] <davmor2> Morning fader_ cr3
[14:19] <fader_> davmor2: Howdy
[18:54] <davmor3> sbeattie: can you do a quick test and see if bug 408603 is still in effect it seems the upstream have fixed it?
[18:54] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 408603 in evolution "Evolution not restoring data from backup archive" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/408603


[07:51] !adml:*! Hi all.  One of our main rotation servers pinged out.  It hasn't been in rotation since for a few hours, but it still had a considerable amount of users on it.  We're looking into what's going on; as always, thanks for using freenode.
[09:05] !BearPerson:*! Hi all! Just a quick announcement that our ircd source is publicly available again under http://svn.freenode.net/hyperion/trunk/ now that we've restarted the servers and are running the new code.
[09:05] !BearPerson:*! I'm sorry we had to temporarily shut down public access while we were forced to run on vulnerable ircds while fixes were in svn and being tested. Oh, and the url for the code we're running is actually http://svn.freenode.net/hyperion/branches/2006-11-bugfix/ 8)
[09:08] !BearPerson:*! oops, goes to show that one shouldn't trust one's memory on urls... the url actually is http://svn.freenode.net/hyperion/branches/bugfix-2006-11/ :)


[07:25] <alourie> good morning
[07:35] <alourie> how should I triage a request for package update, which already exist in Debian? bug #429137
[07:36] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 429137 in gnumeric "Update gnumeric to 1.9.12 in Karmic 9.10" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429137
[21:31] <bdmurray> How do I add an attachment to a wiki page at help.ubuntu.com?  It seems different than wiki.ubuntu.com
[21:40] <bdmurray> Okay, I sorted it out
[21:40] <Flannel> bdmurray: If you refer to an attachment, you'll get a dead link thing which you can then use to upload the attachment
[21:41] <bdmurray> yes, that's rather silly


[16:57] <mhaberler> skunkworks,PCW: in case you have a ubc3-7i80 branch running.. could you try if the normal hm2 support still works with that branch (i.e. non hm2_eth, any Mesanet board)?
[16:58] <mhaberler> oops. wrong channel, sorry
[17:22] <zeorin_> Hi all, I have a question about Ubuntu ARM on the Asus EeePad Transformer Prime (tf201).
[17:22] <zeorin_> It runs on a tegra3 SoC
[17:22] <zeorin_> I installed it using instructions from http://lifeinarootshell.blogspot.it/2013/03/howto.html
[17:23] <zeorin_> and then upgraded to 12.10
[17:23] <zeorin_> installed the nvidia-tegra3 package, but it's still using Noveau
[17:24] <zeorin_> Then I installed the drivers manually using Nvidia's instructions, which is only marginally better. Unity 3D doesn't work properly, and the system seems slow despite my class 10 sd card
[17:24] <zeorin_> wifi also constantly bombs out
[17:24] <zeorin_> the transparent parts of unity (sidebar), and even the top menu bar look like transparent white noise
[17:25] <zeorin_> I don't know what the issue is and perhaps someone here could point me in the right direction
[17:35] <zeorin_> I think it might be due to the driver being incompatible with the kernel, or perhaps the kernel modules aren't loaded? Seeing as how I'm using the kernel that was provided in the initial install instructions. With the Nvidia kernel it doesn't boot at all
[21:17] <Wilsonb> Howdy
[21:19] <Wilsonb> What 8s the best way to backup/ image my Mini pc T428(Rk3188 chipset) system? I installed ubuntu via Windows firmware loader


[09:05] <brendand> got a bug i need to raise about the volume change notification not working properly, anyone have any ideas which package it should go to?
[09:08] <brendand> is there such a package as indicator-sound?
[09:19] <brendand> anyone can confirm this bug in Oneiric? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-sound/+bug/805857
[09:19] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 805857 in indicator-sound (Ubuntu) "Volume slider in sound applet cannot be dragged easily (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[09:42] <brendand> jibel - that bug is quite annoying, can it be set to high at least? it's a regression from natty
[09:42] <brendand> if you can confirm it that is
[09:43] <brendand> actually it probably fits more as a medium
[09:43] <brendand> strictly speaking
[09:43] <brendand> but it's annoying me a lot :)
[10:11] <jibel> brendand, it's already reported. Let me find the dup
[10:12] <brendand> we should really have a smarter duplicate matching algorithm
[10:19] <jibel> brendand, bug 804009
[10:19] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 804009 in indicator-sound (Ubuntu Oneiric) (and 1 other project) "clicking on the volume slider closes the SoundMenu (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804009
[10:21] <jibel> brendand, bug 805822 is also a known issue in Natty
[10:21] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 805822 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "manual partitioning in ubiquity doesn't allow individual changing of mount targets any more (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805822
[10:21] <jibel> its in the release notes iirc
[10:26] <brendand> any sign of A2 yet?
[10:29] <jibel> brendand, we need to validate a fix for lighdm first. but you can smoketest the latest daily builds.
[10:31] <jibel> brendand, desktop images are on the tracker
[10:32] <brendand> \o/
[10:38] <htorque> hey everyone! how can i append an .apport file to an existing bug? couldn't figure that one out from man apport-cli
[10:39] <brendand> 'apport-collect BUGNUMBER'
[10:42] <htorque> can't do that, that's sending too much private data :-(
[10:43] <htorque> i wrote the report to a file and cleaned that, should i just attach it?
[10:43] <brendand> htorque - bug number?
[10:44] <htorque> bug 805808 again
[10:44] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 805808 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "NM slow to connect through WPA2 on boot and after resuming from standby [Intel Centrino Ultimate-N 5300 & 6300] (affects: 1) (heat: 10)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805808
[10:44] <brendand> just making sure :)
[12:18] <hggdh> htorque: as a rule of thumb, we disregard .apport attachments
[12:20] <htorque> hggdh: k, but why doesn't apport-cli let me add it then? i can't do '-u <bug> -c <file>'.
[12:22] <hggdh> htorque: use 'apport-collect' to add data (i.e., attachments) to an existing bug
[12:26] <pedro_> hello hggdh!
[12:37] <hggdh> pedro_: good morning, sir (and jibel as well)
[12:38] <jibel> Good morning hggdh and pedro_
[12:38] <pedro_> good morning jibel!
[12:38] <pedro_> or noon/afternoon
[12:38] <hggdh> hum. It rhymes
[12:41] <hggdh> pedro_: I guess 'good morningnoon' covers morning, noon, and afternoon
[12:41] <pedro_> hahahaha
[12:41] <pedro_> hggdh, now we just need a word that also covers night for the Australian folks :-P
[12:42] <jibel> does good mornoong suites any diurnal period too ?
[12:42] <hggdh> even better! It is more, ah, soundfull (or soundfool?)
[12:44] <hggdh> ** bug-controllers **: we have two pending membership requrest in the queue. How about looking at them?
[12:44]  * hggdh goes do the needful, and all that
[12:45] <hggdh> jibel: do we already have a candidate?
[12:45] <jibel> anyone can confirm bug 805923, it's a mouse attack against lightdm
[12:45] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 805923 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "lightdm-example-gtk-greeter crashed with SIGABRT in raise() (affects: 1) (heat: 10)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805923
[12:46] <jibel> hggdh, yes we do.
[12:47] <hggdh> jibel: I will try 805923, I have to rebbot anyway
[12:47] <hggdh> brb
[12:54] <hggdh> where are my workspaces? And what happened to Unity?
[12:54] <hggdh> and is there a meaning to life, after all?
[12:55] <yofel> sure, 42
[12:55] <hggdh> heh. I *knew* ;-)
[12:55]  * penguin42 nods
[12:56] <hggdh> Can some one explain to me, in few, short, and simple sentences, what happened to Unity?
[12:56] <seb128> "nothing"?
[12:56] <seb128> works for me at least
[12:56] <hggdh> LOL
[12:56] <penguin42> broken for me on OO
[12:56] <pedro_> works ok for me too
[12:56] <seb128> jibel, don't hammer too much on the greater it's an hello world one
[12:56] <seb128> jibel, it will be replaced by the unity one when robert_ancell write it in the next weeks
[12:56]  * penguin42 has a recurring segfault in unity-panel-services
[12:56] <ikt> ohh
[12:57] <seb128> jibel, not sure it's worth opening bugs about it
[12:57] <ikt> is alpha 2 out?
[12:57] <seb128> ikt, no, testing is just starting
[12:57] <hggdh> it does work for me. I lost two workspaces, gained an 'Activity' tab in the top, and all my shortcuts are gone
[12:57] <seb128> ikt, it's scheduled for thursday
[12:57] <ikt> ah ok
[12:57] <seb128> hggdh, seems like you are using gnome-shell
[12:57] <hggdh> bloody hell.
[12:57] <jibel> seb128, if a double-click is hammering what is real hammering .
[12:58] <seb128> jibel, lol
[12:58] <hggdh> I tried so hard not to even get there...
[12:58] <seb128> jibel, double click is fine, I was telling you in case you planned to hammer and open 25 bugs
[12:58] <hggdh> seb128: so there is a bug lurking here somewhere, will find it
[12:58] <seb128> jibel, like you did for gnome-control-center to the poor rodrigo ;-)
[12:58] <jibel> seb128, that was not my intention :-)
[12:58] <seb128> ok, great, ignore me then
[12:59] <seb128> jibel, thanks for the great testing btw ;-)
[12:59] <hggdh> seb128: it *was* his intention, pedro_ and I can testify
[12:59] <seb128> now we need to get pedro to send those bugs to GNOME
[12:59] <jibel> pedro_, btw there are some g-c-c bugs to upstream.
[12:59] <pedro_> oh yes he said 'i'm going to open thousand of reports just so they get assigned to rodrigo'
[12:59] <pedro_> i heard that
[12:59] <seb128> never trust the frenchs...
[13:00] <seb128> pedro_, you stop kicking in my door btw!
[13:00] <pedro_> !!
[13:00] <pedro_> ahahahaha!
[13:00]  * pedro_ hugs seb128
[13:00] <pedro_> that was funny :-P
[13:00]  * seb128 hugs pedro_
[13:00] <seb128> we just need to hide next time or I'm sure you guys will take your revenge
[13:01] <seb128> ;-)
[13:01] <pedro_> sleep with one eye open :-P
[13:01] <hggdh> heh. Nice start of day today -- I already feel happier (and I know it will pass, sigh)
[13:02]  * hggdh goes in 'recherche de la unity perdue
[16:37] <kamusin> am trying to get a full backtrace from a gwibber issue but I can't find which dbg package is missing,  actual backtrace at http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/638478/
[16:37] <kamusin> any help is well received and appreciated
[16:39] <hggdh> kamusin: would it generate an apport report if it failed on normal usage? If so, you can use apport-retrace to grab the dbgsyms
[16:40] <kamusin> actually it does, but it's still incomplete , don't know why
[16:40] <deuxpi> gwibber is written in Python, so it does have backtraces, but it doesn't need debug symbol packages
[16:43] <Ampelbein> deuxpi: if the crash is in gwibber itself, yes. if the crash is in a library called from gwibber, you still need debugging symbols.
[16:44] <hggdh> kamusin: you can also use 'apt-file' -- ápt-file search /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/appindicator/_appindicator.so
[16:45] <kamusin> I did hggdh, I have installed python-appindicator-dbgsym but is still incomplete
[16:45] <kamusin> libappindicator1-dbgsym, libappindicator3-1-dbgsym and nothing happens.. still incomplete
[16:45] <hggdh> try installing libappindicator1dbgsym
[16:46] <hggdh> libappindicator1-dbgsym
[16:46] <hggdh> darn!
[16:46] <kamusin> yep, weeird...
[16:47] <kamusin> by the way, am running Oneiric
[16:47] <hggdh> kamusin: are all the libraries up-to-date?
[16:47] <kamusin> hggdh, all is up to date
[16:47]  * hggdh grumbles a bit about debug libraries
[16:48] <kamusin> :(
[16:50] <hggdh> and the python debug libraries as well, are they installed? It looks -- apart from frame 5 -- that these are calls from within Python
[16:51] <kamusin> ok I will check them as the last resort
[16:54] <kamusin> nope, nothing changed... oh god..
[16:57] <jibel> hm, nice bug with dbus menu, when there are 2 windows with the same menu, dbusmenu sends the command to both not only the active window. interesting
[17:03] <kamusin> jibel, heh
[17:03] <kamusin> ok time for lunch (brb)
[18:41] <Elbrus> if a bug makes the package uninstallable, what should the severity be? high? (bug 805677)
[18:41] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 805677 in lazarus (Ubuntu) "Oneiric: please rebuild lazarus, it depends on an old fpc version (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805677
[18:41]  * Elbrus is wondering if he should rephrase the bug summary of his own bug
[18:42] <charlie-tca> Depends on the package, according to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance
[18:43]  * Elbrus is looking into that page
[18:46] <Elbrus> I would go for: A bug that has a severe impact on a non-core application.
[18:46] <Elbrus> so can somebody set the bug to medium for me please?
[18:47] <charlie-tca> done
[18:48] <Elbrus> charlie-tca: thanks
[18:48] <charlie-tca> no problem
[18:53] <Ampelbein> charlie-tca, Elbrus: I disagree. If the package has wrong dependencies it can't be installed at all, which (to me) is "Has a severe impact on a small portion of Ubuntu users", ergo -> High.
[18:54] <Ampelbein> Additionally, in this case unrelated packages fail to build from source and FTBFS bugs are of High Importance.
[18:59] <charlie-tca> developers would know that better than myself. I would expect them to raise it when needed
[19:00] <Elbrus> hmm, my package (winff) FTBFS indeed
[19:00] <charlie-tca> Where would I find FTBFS bugs are HIGH? It is not in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance
[19:00] <Elbrus> and lazarus (and fpc) doesn't have much caretakers in ubuntu.. (I am one of them)
[19:01] <Elbrus> as my package depends on it
[19:01] <micahg> Elbrus: if it won't affect the images, I'll take care of it tomorrow when I'm piloting
[19:02] <Elbrus> alpha image you mean?
[19:02] <micahg> Elbrus: right, we're frozen until thursday for those
[19:02] <Elbrus> right, I don't think my package or lazarus are on the image (if that is what you are talking about)
[19:03] <charlie-tca> Ampelbein: Where would I find FTBFS bugs are HIGH? It is not in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance
[19:04] <Ampelbein> charlie-tca: I guess it's not mentioned explicitly, but if you look at recent FTBFS bugs filed they are all classified as "High".
[19:04] <charlie-tca> I don't think I ever saw that anyone as justification to set any importantance.
[19:06] <Elbrus> charlie-tca: well, Debian considers them grave: http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Developer#severities
[19:06] <Elbrus> which is pretty high ;)
[19:06] <charlie-tca> Elbrus: I will agree with that. I think Debian grave == Ubuntu critical
[19:07] <micahg> hmm, I would think Debian grave = high
[19:07] <Ampelbein> charlie-tca: In Debian, they are RC-Critical, meaning a package gets removed from the release. In Ubuntu we generally don't remove packages from releases because they fail to build.
[19:07] <Elbrus> I think Debian critical == Ubuntu critical
[19:08] <charlie-tca> I thought grave was higher than critical in Debian?
[19:08] <Elbrus> nope
[19:08] <Elbrus> see my link
[19:08] <charlie-tca> Then I am wrong.
[19:10] <Elbrus> Amplebein: actually, the bug in question here doesn't FTBFS, it causes other packages to
[19:10] <Elbrus> so how does this dependecy walk through?
[19:11] <Elbrus> s/dependecy/dependency
[19:11] <Ampelbein> Elbrus: See https://launchpadlibrarian.net/74230317/buildlog_ubuntu-oneiric-amd64.winff_1.3.2-4_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[19:11] <Elbrus> well, I put that in the report myself...
[19:12] <Elbrus> I mean, how does the severity of one bug depend on the severity of an other bug that it causes
[19:13]  * Elbrus hasn't reported the FTBFS for winff yet, but has it on his radar
[19:13] <Ampelbein> Elbrus: If a bug is self-contained so that it only affects it's own package I consider it less serious than a bug making other packages fail.
[19:14] <Elbrus> I agree
[19:14] <Elbrus> but I can't remember that I saw this in Ubuntu's wiki's or similar
[19:18] <Elbrus> related question, should the FTBFS of winff be "Also affects project" or should it really be an other bug. It should be blocked by this one, but I don't know how to achieve that in launchpad
[19:20] <Ampelbein> Elbrus: sadly, launchpad doesn't support "Blocked" bugs like bts does :-(
[19:20] <Elbrus> shame
[19:20] <Ampelbein> Elbrus: Just use 'Also affects distribution', choose Ubuntu and the correct sourcepackage
[19:21] <Elbrus> Ampelbein: that is what I assumed
[23:11] <valorin> Anyone around who can help get Bug #755842 noticed by the right people? It's a serious usability bug imho and it would be great to get it fixed before Oneiric.
[23:11] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 755842 in unity (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Non-maximized windows which sit on the border of a workspace move when called (affects: 25) (dups: 4) (heat: 98)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/755842
[23:27] <penguin42> well I guess it needs an importance setting - I suggest a 'Medium' ('A usability issue that does not limit the functionality of a core application' or possibly 'A bug that has a moderate impact on a core application') ?
[23:34] <pedro_> which bug are you folks talking?
[23:34] <pedro_> hello again btw
[23:34] <penguin42> bug 755842
[23:34] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 755842 in unity (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Non-maximized windows which sit on the border of a workspace move when called (affects: 25) (dups: 4) (heat: 98)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/755842
[23:37] <pedro_> that seems fine, yes, i've changed it to triaged/medium
[23:41] <penguin42> Thanks
[23:44] <valorin> pedro_, Thank you.
[23:45] <pedro_> you're welcome


[00:21] <JanC> how2hack: is there any reason why you have to use “pdfcreater”?  (e.g. CUPS has its own PDF creation driver)
[00:22] <JanC> also, it seems like you have to enable LPD support on the Windows PC to use it from CUPS
[00:27] <JanC> see e.g. https://danielgibbs.co.uk/2012/03/printing-from-cups-to-a-printer-attaches-to-windows-xpvista7/
[00:29] <JanC> or http://www.printmanager.com/cms.php?aid=82&fullpage=1&support=8
[00:32] <how2hack> well it's just homework, the problem is ubuntu server 18.10 (the version i installed) is missing the smb backend
[00:33] <how2hack> i copied the binary from my computer to the vm, but for some reason it doesn't work
[00:33] <how2hack> i'm checking the links, thanks
[00:33] <JanC> you mean you copied a Windows printing driver binary to linux?
[00:34] <how2hack> no, the cups smb backend from my linux system to the ubuntu-server vm
[01:30] <Deihmos> when server boots it flashes fw status recovery error for a split second
[01:30] <Deihmos> no idea what it means
[02:55] <SJr> Did openjdk-8 get removed from Ubuntu 18.04?
[02:57] <SJr> Nevermind
[16:57] <Deihmos> does server have built in backup and restore?
[17:06] <andol> Deihmos: Aside from there being suitable software availible in the package repos, no.
[17:13] <Deihmos> i wonder if acronis will work. looking into it
[17:35] <blackflow> Deihmos: i'd use either filesystem snapshotting capabilities like btrfs or zfs have (+ offsite send|recv), or base it on rsync with something like rsnapshot.
[19:04] <tanja84dk_> I have just got a weird error when I tried to ssh into my online server that I have not tried before. It asked to add the shh fingerprint to the known_host file because I have not visit the server from that client before so I said yes. Then it said right after it added it that the host key differs from the key for the ip
[19:04] <tanja84dk_> how come could it differs when it just have added it
[19:13] <kinghat> does ubuntu server block ports 80/443 by default? i have them forwarded to the machine but am having timeout issues with lets encrypt.
[19:13] <kinghat> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/TMXMsAHq/
[19:14] <kinghat> this is a scan i did from outside the network: https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/jtnWLfMB/image.png
[19:34] <tomreyn> kinghat: ubuntu server does not filter any ports by default.
[19:35] <kinghat> huh
[19:37] <blackflow> kinghat: you can check with `iptables -L -n`   and ip6tables for ipv6
[19:39] <kinghat> ya i dont see anything in there about 80 or 443. though i do see that one of my docker containers mapped to port 9000.
[19:39] <kinghat> https://paste.debian.net/hidden/5cb118d8/
[19:39] <tomreyn> kinghat: it's not uncommon that cable television (as well as DSL) providers restrict / block traffic to and from specific ports.
[19:40] <kinghat> so i added ports 80/443 in another section on my router and i got a little further: https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/yPVQpFGw/image.png
[19:42] <kinghat> and now only an issue with the hostname? odd: https://paste.debian.net/hidden/634648bf/
[19:45] <kinghat> actually. if i scan it over and over again it goes from being closed to filtered.
[19:45] <kinghat> hmm
[19:48] <blackflow> kinghat: there's no response at port 80
[19:54] <kinghat> they are bouncing between filtered/closed when i scan from outside my network. odd
[20:04] <tomreyn> your isp doesn't even allow anyone not in US to visit their corporate website - all traffic dropped.
[20:06] <kinghat> huh?
[20:13] <tomreyn> kinghat: this is kind of !ot here, but i'm happy to discuss in #ubuntu-offtopic
[20:49] <JanC> every ISP that blocks foreign IPs from accessing their website should be blackholed by all other ISPs
[23:15] <SJr> Um what is the recommended way to install java 11 on Ubuntu 18.04, given that java-11 is actually java 10 in the packages?
[23:17] <blackflow> eww unicode in irc


[04:40] <cpaelzer> good morning
[06:03] <lordievader> Good morning
[06:20] <cpaelzer> hiho lordievader
[06:20] <lordievader> Morning cpaelzer
[06:20] <lordievader> How are you doing?
[06:21] <cpaelzer> good, and you?
[06:21] <lordievader> Doing good here :)
[06:21] <cpaelzer> glad to hear that
[07:40] <Gargoyle> Hey there. If I manually remove a package with "apt remove some-package" does this prevent it from being installed again automatically in the future? (I now see it listed in dpkg --get-selections with "deinstall")
[07:41] <Gargoyle> I'm trying to recreate a scenario where php7.2 seems to have been, allegedly, automatically upgraded to 7.3RC.
[08:20] <DenBeiren> for some reason one of my machines is in read only filesystem.
[08:20] <DenBeiren> I guess there should be a forcefsck run on reboot
[08:20] <DenBeiren> is there a way to make it reboot and check?
[08:22] <hateball> DenBeiren: differs a bit depending on your version
[08:22] <DenBeiren> latest,.. 18.04.1
[08:23] <hateball> DenBeiren: you'd need to change kernel parameters to force
[08:24] <hateball> that said, systemd should notice it has failed and run an fsck itself
[08:25] <hateball> DenBeiren: are all partitions mounted ro ?
[08:26] <hateball> DenBeiren: basically these are your options<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[08:37] <DenBeiren> the problem is that i have no options editing or creating any files
[08:37] <DenBeiren> since i am stuck in read only mode
[08:43] <cpaelzer_> DenBeiren: those are kernel commandline options consumed by systemd
[08:43] <cpaelzer_> DenBeiren: you can set them from grub or whatever your bootloader is
[08:43] <cpaelzer_> disk being readonly isn't preventing you to do that
[08:50] <DenBeiren> i'm afraid i don't understand what i should do,.. never had/did this before :s
[08:50] <hateball> DenBeiren: do you have physical access to the server?
[08:50] <hateball> by physical I mean can you interupt the boot process and get into grub
[08:50] <DenBeiren> no, not now,.. alls is done trough ssh
[08:53] <hateball> DenBeiren: is your /boot partition also mounted ro ?
[08:56] <DenBeiren> https://pastebin.com/biu1d2cM
[08:59] <DenBeiren> https://pastebin.com/yFKNs7sX
[09:01] <hateball> DenBeiren: run "mount |grep sda"
[09:02] <hateball> that should how /boot is currently mounted. if you can mount it rw, you can edit /boot/grub/grub.cfg manually to force fsck next reboot
[09:51] <DenBeiren> /boot/grub/grub.cfg is empty,... is that ok?
[09:51] <DenBeiren> oops
[09:51] <DenBeiren> i was wrong
[09:53] <DenBeiren> how should i edit grub? where and what?
[09:54] <blackflow> DenBeiren: looking at the context of the convo above, it appears you should edit that grub.cfg with any text editor and add fsck.mode=force to the vmlinuz kernel command line
[09:56] <blackflow> DenBeiren: in the first "menuentry 'Ubuntu' ....."  section, there's "linux" line above "initrd", at the bottom of the { } group. The "linux" line is the kernel command line.
[09:56] <blackflow> Add that fsck.mode=force at the end of that line, save the file, umount /boot and reboot
[09:57] <DenBeiren> here goes nothing ;-)
[09:58] <DenBeiren> in beaver we trust :-)
[10:11] <hateball> famous last words, it would seem
[10:37] <Gargoyle> I didn't think you were supposed to edit grub.cfg manually anymore?
[10:55] <blackflow> Gargoyle: you aren't. the user couldn't get to root and had the option to mount /boot separately for that one tiem fix and boot regularly.
[10:55] <blackflow> (being a remote server with no accses to grub menu itself)
[11:45] <DenBeiren> not last words hateball :-)
[11:45] <DenBeiren> it rebooted but i can't say for sure if it did the check
[11:45] <DenBeiren> my errors aren't gone in any case
[11:48] <blackflow> DenBeiren: but did you manage to boot regularly?
[11:49] <DenBeiren> it rebooted and came back up,..
[11:49] <DenBeiren> i'm not there with the machine to check the monitor
[11:49] <blackflow> what errors then?
[11:50] <DenBeiren> for example when i want to edit a file, sudo nano /etc/"tabkey" it gives me the following
[11:51] <DenBeiren> https://pastebin.com/jeSQMWLN
[11:53] <blackflow> DenBeiren: pastebin   mount | grep tmp     please?
[11:53] <Ussat> \o/ Xwiki server upgraded from 16.x --> 18.x
[11:54] <DenBeiren> https://pastebin.com/CaEiW5yY
[11:55] <blackflow> DenBeiren: and what about just `mount`, no grep?
[11:56] <DenBeiren> https://pastebin.com/Am0f9gLd
[11:56] <blackflow> DenBeiren: try   mount -o -remount,rw /
[11:57] <blackflow> DenBeiren: also please pastebin your /etc/fstab
[11:58] <Gargoyle> Do you have any kind of message in dmesg suggesting why / is being mounted ro?
[12:01] <DenBeiren> https://pastebin.com/CahVM1Bx
[12:03] <blackflow> "floppy:"  !!!
[12:04] <Gargoyle> ext2 !!!
[12:04] <Gargoyle> How old is this machine?
[12:05] <Gargoyle> Looks like it's a VM too. Do you control the hypervisor?
[12:05] <blackflow> DenBeiren: can you pastebin fstab?   Looks like something is not remounting root rw after root pivot.
[12:06] <Ussat> ext2...wow
[12:08] <hateball> it's not *that* long ago since ext2 was default on /boot if you installed with LVM :p
[12:09] <blackflow> Looks like Bionic according to uname
[12:10] <DenBeiren> https://pastebin.com/PqSxrNLL
[12:12] <blackflow> DenBeiren: typo on line 7? looks like no root mount in fstab, and that initial ro is never remounted
[12:12] <Gargoyle> is line 7 a copy and paste error?
[12:13] <blackflow> DenBeiren: hit enter after <pass>   on line 7
[12:13] <blackflow> also............ floppy? really?
[12:13] <hateball> dont copy that floppy
[12:20] <DenBeiren> hey, it's standard :-)
[12:20] <DenBeiren> i guess
[12:20] <blackflow> what!
[12:20] <DenBeiren> i can't edit the file,..
[12:20] <blackflow> DenBeiren: did you run that remount?
[12:21] <blackflow> of course you didn't. you users never read the support advice you ask for.       mount -o remount,rw /              and then you can edit stuff freely. edit fstab, fix line 7 and reboot for test. you're welcome.
[12:22] <DenBeiren> blackflow: of course i did,.. but the level of knowledge with us n00bs is never as high as you guys might expect ;-)
[12:24] <blackflow> you can always ask if something is not clear. that's what support is for ;)
[12:25] <Gargoyle> DenBeiren: Show us the remount command and the output.
[12:25] <DenBeiren> i was able to edit, found the typo and waiting to login after reboot atm
[12:25] <Gargoyle> ah. ok
[12:26] <DenBeiren> yep! seems like that did the trick guys and gals,..
[12:30] <DenBeiren> thx a lot for the help!
[13:12] <ahasenack> rbasak: hi, I have an sru question
[13:12] <ahasenack> I'm working on a fix for a bug, and it has been fixed in bionic+ already
[13:12] <ahasenack> rbasak: the fix I intend to apply to trusty and xenial is from upstream and is simpler
[13:12] <ahasenack> rbasak: but different from what is applied to bionic+
[13:13] <rbasak> I think that's fine
[13:13] <rbasak> As long as there isn't expected to be a user visible functional regression on upgrade
[13:13] <ahasenack> rbasak: the bionic one comes from debian, so changing that to the upstream one (better and simpler) adds to delta,
[13:13] <ahasenack> rbasak: and the debian fix relies on a config change, so backing that out now would mean another config change
[13:14] <ahasenack> rbasak: so I think leaving bionic alone is best at this time
[13:14] <rbasak> That sounds right to me
[13:14] <rbasak> Probably good to explain in the SRU description what you just said though.
[13:14] <ahasenack> agreed
[13:27] <v0lksman> hey all!  trying to figure out how to remove all packages installed from a particular source
[13:28] <v0lksman> running `grep Package: /var/lib/apt/lists/archive_name_*_Package but it's listing packages that aren't currently installed
[13:42] <rbasak> v0lksman: use dpkg-query to get a list of installed packages. Then xargs over "dpkg -s" or similar to look for Source:. grep-dctrl might be useful. If there is no Source: header, the source package name is the same as the binary package name.
[13:49] <sdeziel> v0lksman: less elegant an possibly showing some false positives but I usually use that: for p in $(dpkg -l | awk '/^ii/ {print $2}'); do apt-cache policy "$p" | grep -qF "ppa.launchpad.net/foo" && echo "$p"; done
[13:54] <Ussat> ubuntu 12.......srsly.....he is running 12
[13:54]  * Ussat cries
[13:56] <v0lksman> thanks guys...looking at options.
[13:56] <v0lksman> Ussat: hope that wasn't directed at me
[13:56] <Ussat> no, it was not
[13:59] <sdeziel> 12.04 is still supported via ESM so there is still a chance was not left there rotting
[15:00] <ahasenack> cpaelzer: I think I can add dep8 tests to that backuppc package
[15:00] <ahasenack> rbasak: in terms of an sru, adding a dep8 that doesn't exist in the development release, is that a no-no?
[15:00] <ahasenack> rbasak: scenario is bionic+ has the fix, but no dep8, and I'm adding the fix *and* a dep8 test for it to trusty and xenial
[15:01] <ahasenack> it's just the dep8 fix that isn't in the distros I'm not touching
[15:04] <rbasak> ahasenack: I think an upload to Cosmic (or Cosmic+1 as needed) to add the dep8 would be appreciated.
[15:04] <ahasenack> rbasak: sure, but would it block the sru?
[15:04] <rbasak> I wouldn't block an SRU just because Cosmic is frozen and therefore you can't add the dep8 righ tnow.
[15:04] <ahasenack> rbasak: I'm thinking weeks until that could happen
[15:04] <ahasenack> ok
[15:04] <ahasenack> that would be my intention, sorry for not making it clear. I would definitely add the dep8 test to c+1 when it opens
[15:05] <rbasak> Perhaps you could leave the upload for cosmic+1 ready somewhere and link to it in the bug, and explain that you can't do it now due to freeze?
[15:06] <ahasenack> sure
[15:06] <ahasenack> what about the releases in the middle?
[15:06] <rbasak> But yeah if you agree to put it in later, it doesn't make sense to me to block the SRU.
[15:06] <ahasenack> bionic and cosmic itself
[15:06] <rbasak> What is it, tough SRU question day today? :)
[15:06] <ahasenack> I've done an sru in the past which was about fixing an *existing* dep8 test, but not one to add one
[15:06] <ahasenack> sure :)
[15:06] <rbasak> I won't make you do the releases in the middle given that you've said the issue doesn't affect them.
[15:07] <ahasenack> ok, as I thought :)
[15:08] <ahasenack> I'll still see how tough adding the dep8 test will be, but from what I've seen just by writing the testing instructions, all that can be scripted easily
[15:08]  * rbasak tries to be pragmatic about these things; if the underlying reasons for a policy look like a bad trade-off, let's skip the policy :)
[15:08] <rbasak> (in a specific case for specific reasons only, of course; otherwise the policy should be questioned/changed first)
[15:18] <teward> rbasak: i saw your reply, and sarnold's on that bug.  It's a bit late in the Cosmic cycle to add that, so it'll get added in Dd-series
[15:18] <teward> (nginx --with-compat)
[15:20] <sam_w> rbasak: we're having some preseed issues with 14.04, install completes fine but apt is left in a funky state due to shim: https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/2uSLUZYU/ manually upgrading dpkg to 1.17.5ubuntu5.8 over 1.17.5ubuntu5 works... is this something we'll just have to add as a postinstall task or something or is there a better fix?
[15:27] <rbasak> sam_w: not sure why you're asking me?
[15:27] <rbasak> sam_w: that's interesting though. You do need the newer dpkg from trusty-updates first it seems if you want to install other things from trusty-updates. I'm not sure what mechanism exists (if any) to make sure that dpkg is updated before attempting to install shim.
[15:28] <rbasak> sam_w: is the newer dpkg available in the same apt repository? IOW are you using a custom hacked mirror or something, or the official upstream repositories there?
[15:28] <teward> rbasak: wasn't that a known upgrade-blocker a long time ago in the 14.04 -> 16.04 blocker there?
[15:28] <teward> i coulda sworn we had some kind of upgrade-blocking evil like that at that cycle
[15:28] <rbasak> I don't remember, but it would affect release upgrades too I think.
[15:29] <sam_w> rbasak: I think kierank was talking to you about it the other day? Apologies if not!
[15:34] <rbasak> sam_w: I remember a conversation about preseeding and hacking an apt repository but not about shim!
[15:34] <rbasak> sam_w: conclusion in #ubuntu-devel is that it's a bug. Please could you file one against shim, and tag it "regression-update"?
[15:34] <sam_w> rbasak: no hacked mirror, it's just in trusty-updates
[15:35] <sam_w> rbasak: sure
[15:35] <rbasak> Yeah I'm told it should declare a Pre-Depends, and doesn't, for some complicated reasons due to how it got there.
[18:36] <ahasenack> hm, with bileto, do I need one ticket per ubuntu release?
[18:36] <ahasenack> looks like yes
[18:36] <ahasenack> even though a ppa can hold packages for multiple releases
[18:44] <RoyK> !bileto
[18:48] <ahasenack> RoyK: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bileto
[18:48] <ahasenack> and bileto.ubuntu.com
[19:25] <xnox> ahasenack, it's the best recommended practice, yes. one ticket per ubuntu release.
[19:26] <xnox> multi-release publish is hard
[19:38] <ahasenack> I don't use it for publishing, just running dep8 tests in all arches and also the dependent tests
[19:38] <RoyK> xnox: it should be easy if a ticket could be marked with all relevant releases


[00:38] <davecheney> alexisb: bauer is down again, :( RT 75536
[08:35] <dimitern> fwereade, hey
[08:36] <dimitern> fwereade, updated http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/141/diff/3-4/ if you can have a look?
[08:58] <fwereade> dimitern, cheers
[09:07] <fwereade> dimitern, on further inspection today, I'm worried that we really rather need to define how relation ports work at the context level
[09:08] <fwereade> dimitern, otherwise when we start using ones that aren't -1 we *will* forget to test it all properly
[09:08] <fwereade> dimitern, because anyone seeing the try* funcs will assume that relationId is a meaningful parameter
[09:08] <dimitern> fwereade, I was hoping to discuss this in brussels
[09:08] <fwereade> dimitern, tell you what
[09:09] <dimitern> fwereade, yeah?
[09:09] <fwereade> dimitern, take relationId out of the signatures of the try funcs
[09:09] <fwereade> dimitern, we'll still need to rewrite them to take it into account properly
[09:09] <dimitern> fwereade, and hardcode -1 inside?
[09:10] <fwereade> dimitern, but it'll do what we need to today, and we won't be able to fool ourselves into believing the logic is more capable than it is
[09:10] <fwereade> dimitern, yeah
[09:10] <fwereade> dimitern, the first line can be "relationId := -1" even
[09:11] <dimitern> fwereade, ok, will this be sufficient for now? I can also add a TODO comment about refactoring both funcs to take relation ids properly into account
[09:11] <fwereade> dimitern, I think so, yeah
[09:12] <dimitern> fwereade, cheers!
[09:21] <fwereade> dimitern, given that, LGTM with trivials
[09:22] <dimitern> fwereade, great, just finished with the changes and re-proposing, thanks again
[09:54] <dimitern> fwereade, last step - a small branch that implements the "opened-ports" hook tool to return a list of ports or ranges opened by the unit: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/144/
[10:15] <fwereade> dimitern, hmm, I'm wondering how that will mesh with (again) per-relation ports
[10:15] <fwereade> dimitern, there's an uncomfortable tension between implicit -1 and implicit current relation
[10:18] <dimitern> fwereade, we can add [-r relid] argument later perhaps?
[10:20] <fwereade> dimitern, yeah, the concern is that all the *other* -r flags assume current relation
[10:21] <fwereade> dimitern, so there's a change in behaviour for charms that open/close/opened in a relation context
[10:21] <fwereade> dimitern, OTOH it'll be exactly the same problem for open/close, there's nothing special about opened
[10:22] <dimitern> fwereade, yeah, I think so
[10:22] <fwereade> dimitern, I'm worrying a bit about output format though
[10:22] <fwereade> dimitern, is a list sufficient?
[10:23] <fwereade> dimitern, I guess it probably is
[10:23] <fwereade> dimitern, we can have an --all flag with a map or something
[10:25] <fwereade> dimitern, LGTM with --format yaml, --format json
[10:25] <dimitern> fwereade, the format flag is common to all commands btw
[10:25] <fwereade> dimitern, yeah, I expressed it insanely, but I'm mainly whining about the lack of tests
[10:26] <fwereade> dimitern, doesn't need to be super-complex, just make sure they work
[10:26] <dimitern> fwereade, sure, np
[10:26] <dimitern> fwereade, thanks!
[11:54]  * perrito666 bags ready
[13:34] <perrito666> natefinch: going to the 1:1?
[13:34] <natefinch> perrito666: yep
[14:00] <perrito666> nate switched to stdup
[15:10] <sinzui> natefinch, perrito666 This issue is blocking the cloud installer. We need to understand if this is juju, ,maas, or both, and do we need a backported fix to 1.20, see bug 1376952
[15:10] <mup> Bug #1376952: juju machine stuck on 'pending' with no error message: juju <IP_ADDRESS>, maas provider <cloud-installer> <deploy> <maas-provider> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1376952>
[15:11] <stokachu> natefinch, perrito666 - mmcc_ is here if you have further questions
[15:12] <mmcc_> yep, hi - the environment has been torn down but the systems are available to try to reproduce, and if anyone wants access to look themselves, that’d be fine
[15:17] <sinzui> stokachu, does machine 1 exist? Can you get a copy of the /var/log/cloud-init-output.log to tell about what happened before juju's agent was started
[15:18] <stokachu> mmcc_, ^
[15:19] <mmcc_> sinzui: that machine is not up, and has been recommissioned a couple of times. I’ll try to reproduce and see if I can get that log for you
[15:19] <perrito666> the only strange thing I see and can somehow understand is that peergrouper complains that it cannot determine the replicaset
[15:19] <perrito666> which leads me to know that the state server might be failing while trying to create the replicaset
[15:20] <perrito666> natefinch: any input?
[15:21] <natefinch> looking
[15:22] <perrito666> natefinch: did you by any change got my package?
[15:24] <natefinch> perrito666: I haven't gotten anything yet, I was actually going to ask about that.  Do you have tracking info on it?
[15:24] <natefinch> perrito666: if you ever need to get anything here in a short period of time, I have Amazon Prime, so I can get stuff shipped 2nd day for free
[15:25] <natefinch> perrito666: hell, I can get something delivered tomorrow morning for $5, if you really want :)
[15:30] <perrito666> natefinch: lol :p I think this is not amazon delivering so It might take a lot longer, its the size of a usb thumb so you can store it until the next sprint if you get it after :p I would say you can use it but it only is useful on thinkpads
[15:30] <natefinch> haha
[15:31] <natefinch> perrito666: ahh, yeah, I never buy anything that isn't shipped by amazon unless I'm desperate for that very specific thing... because you never know how long some schmoe is going to take to get it to you, and chances are he's going to send it the slowest, cheapest way possible
[15:32] <perrito666> natefinch: well its a bit of a specific part so it was only available from that source
[15:35] <natefinch> perrito666: yeah, figured. bummer.  Hope it makes it here.   It's probably being sent via US Post Office, which delivers today and tomorrow, so we might get lucky.
[15:36] <perrito666> natefinch: well laptop spare parts (in this case is the bluetooth module) are almost always sent from china, what I dont understand is why someone made this laptop without the bluetooth module in the first palce
[15:37] <katco> i'm running into an ordering issue using gocheck; i'm trying to use SetUpTest, but that is precluding something else from setting up state... does this sound familiar to anyone?
[15:37] <perrito666> I use a usb bluetooth dongle but I keep breaking those against things
[15:37] <perrito666> katco: not following
[15:38] <katco> perrito666: are you familiar with gocheck's SetUpTest functionality?
[15:38] <katco> perrito666: it basically is a special function that will be run before every test in a suite
[15:39] <katco> perrito666: the problem is, if i define it, then state in an embedded suite never gets set up
[15:39] <natefinch> katco: you have to manually call sub-suite's setup functions too
[15:40] <natefinch> remember, the methods on the struct you're defining override the ones on embedded structs, so you have to manually call the ones on the embedded structs
[15:41] <katco> natefinch: ah that was exactly it
[15:41] <katco> natefinch: dependency model i didn't fully understand
[15:41] <natefinch> katco: yep.  happen to uh... a friend of mine. ;)
[15:41] <katco> haha
[15:42] <katco> in the perfect world in my brain, nothing is ever that obscure
[15:42] <natefinch> yeah, it's really the fault of the magic in gocheck
[15:43] <katco> i would have thought that gocheck would handle that for you
[15:43] <katco> since it has all the suites which have been registered
[15:43] <katco> ok, back to hacking. thanks perrito666, natefinch
[15:44] <natefinch> well, it just looks for the top level method and calls it
[15:46] <perrito666> ok bbl, going lunch with the wife to compensate for 1 week driking with friends in brussels
[15:51] <natefinch> haha sounds fair ;)
[15:56] <hazmat> cmars, mongo ++ :-)
[15:56] <hazmat> cmars, er. gonzo ++
[15:57] <cmars> hazmat, fear and loathing in nosql databases
[15:57] <cmars> idk
[15:57] <cmars> fun little side project i've been hacking on
[15:58] <cmars> hazmat, https://github.com/cmars/gonzodb
[15:58] <hazmat> cmars, yeah. i saw
[15:58] <hazmat> cmars, reminds me of https://github.com/rick446/MongoTools/blob/master/mongotools/mim/mim.py
[15:58] <hazmat> mongo in memory .. make unit tests FAST
[16:01] <natefinch> hazmat: that would be amazing
[16:02] <cmars> hazmat, that python version is impressive. even embeds JS. nice!
[16:02] <hazmat> natefinch, cmars alexisb we should schedule a topic on this for next week
[16:03] <alexisb> hazmat, I was not following the discussion, give me a minute and will do
[16:06] <hazmat> alexisb, i'll add, just wanted to put it on your radar
[16:06] <hazmat> actually we already have an agenda item that matches this topic
[16:06] <hazmat>  Juju Testing: Better Merge Gating, Faster Testing
[17:09] <wwitzel3> we used MIM at SourceForge for our testing
[17:22] <mmcc__> sinzui, natefinch, perrito666 - trying to reproduce bug 1376952 just now, the machine came up correctly, so I will just go ahead and use it. if it breaks again, I’ll update the bug. thanks for looking, and let me know if I can enable any extra logging or anything that’d help diagnose it next time
[17:22] <mup> Bug #1376952: juju machine stuck on 'pending' with no error message: juju <IP_ADDRESS>, maas provider <cloud-installer> <deploy> <maas-provider> <juju-core:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1376952>
[17:24] <natefinch> mmcc_: ok, thanks


[02:27] <harlowja> linuxgeek_ hmmm, no bites on the question in #openstack-neutron, hmmm, maybe next week ?
[02:27] <harlowja> never can tell if people are gonna respond
[04:36] <linuxgeek_> harlowja, yep never can say if ppl will respond
[17:13] <linuxgeek_> hey harlowja_at_home, in continuation of testing different os for cloudinit windows is next in line.
[17:13] <linuxgeek_> i asked this on openstack asking you in case you would know
[17:14] <linuxgeek_> is windows a supported deployment in openstack with esxi hypervisor?
[17:14] <harlowja_at_home> unsure :-/
[17:14] <harlowja_at_home> i haven't done much with windows, i know some person at yahoo got it running under kvm
[17:14] <harlowja_at_home> openstack + kvm
[17:14] <harlowja_at_home> but likely u want to use https://github.com/cloudbase/cloudbase-init for that
[17:15] <linuxgeek_> yep, Hyper-V, KVM, and XenServer/XCP is in the supported list per the openstack guide
[17:15] <linuxgeek_> there is no reference of esx
[17:15] <harlowja_at_home> ya, i'm not so sure, never done much with esx
[17:17] <linuxgeek_> ok sure, thanks for replying though :-). enjoy the rest of the weekend
[17:17] <harlowja_at_home> np
[17:18] <harlowja_at_home> best of luck :)


[07:37] <seb128> goood morning desktopers!
[08:02] <lissyx> seb128, hello
[08:03] <lissyx> seb128, FTR https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapd/+bug/2039052
[08:03] <seb128> lissyx, hey, how are you?
[08:03] -ubottu:#ubuntu-desktop- Launchpad bug 2039052 in snapd "blocking refresh does not block auto-refresh" [Undecided, New]
[08:15] <seb128> lissyx, I don't understand what is described in there
[08:15] <seb128> lissyx, do you mean you would expect the hold to make snapd refuse the manual sudo snap install --dangerous?
[08:20] <lissyx> seb128, all I see is I instructed snapd to hold refreshes for 24h and when I perform the next step, it does a refresh
[08:20] <lissyx> seb128, that sounds like a bug to me
[08:21] <lissyx> and at best an undocumented behavior because I have searched docs on that matter and found nothing
[08:21] <seb128> where does it do a refresh?
[08:21] <seb128>  > [task 2023-10-10T15:05:08.798Z] + sudo snap install --name firefox --dangerous ./firefox.snap
[08:21] <seb128> that's the end of the log?
[08:21] <seb128> you manually call an install, what would you expect? a reject msg?
[08:22] <lissyx> https://treeherder.mozilla.org/logviewer?job_id=431990807&repo=try&lineNumber=80-83
[08:22] <seb128> oh
[08:22] <lissyx> looks like copy/pasting cut one line
[08:22] <seb128> ok, without the line the report didn't make sense
[08:22] <lissyx> yeah sorry, I fixed it
[08:23] <seb128> are you sure the auto-refresh was not already started when you called the hold cmd?
[08:23] <seb128> you could argue than calling hold should discontinue a started refresh
[08:23] <seb128> my guess is that it's what is happening there
[08:25] <lissyx> either way, it's a bug
[08:25] <lissyx> if auto-refresh was already in progress, my hold request should either cancel it or fail
[08:25] <lissyx> not succeed and then blow like that
[08:26] <lissyx> I have not seen a way to block auto-refresh vs refresh
[08:26] <lissyx> (for now I'm going to force a refresh before)
[08:26] <seb128> I'm unsure what you mean auto-refresh vs refresh
[08:27] <seb128> you mean as a sysadmin you want to forbid refresh even done manually from a sudo user?
[08:27] <seb128> hold is meant to stop the snap refreshing under your control
[08:27] <seb128> under->outside
[08:28] <lissyx> part of the problem is actually I could not find accurate docs on auto-refresh
[08:28] <seb128> I think snapd just don't handle great 'conflicting' request
[08:28] <lissyx> until I find some, I assume that holding "refresh" should also impact "auto-refresh"
[08:28] <seb128> or isn't able to discard a started auto-refresh
[08:28] <seb128> you see it also from report like https://askubuntu.com/questions/1167566/snap-not-allowing-me-to-remove-or-refresh-anything
[08:29] <seb128> what do you call 'refresh'?
[08:29] <lissyx> whatever this is doing: snap refresh --hold=24h firefox
[08:29] <seb128> I'm not a snapd expert but my understanding is that there is only 'auto-refresh'
[08:29] <seb128> refresh --hold is telling snapd to not update the snap for you during that time
[08:30] <seb128> so basically inhibiting autorefresh for a period
[08:30] <seb128> there is no 'refresh' concept outside of you calling sudo snap refresh manually
[08:30] <seb128> but then holding that wouldn't make sense
[08:30] <seb128> just don't run that cmd :p
[08:31] <seb128> https://snapcraft.io/docs/keeping-snaps-up-to-date
[08:31] <seb128> ```
[08:31] <seb128> The refresh hold is:
[08:31] <seb128>     Effective on auto-refreshes and general snap refresh requests
[08:31] <seb128>     Not effective on targeted snap refreshes
[08:31] <seb128> ```
[08:32] <seb128> $ snap refresh -h
[08:32] <seb128> Usage:
[08:32] <seb128>   snap refresh [refresh-OPTIONS] [<snap>...]
[08:32] <seb128> The refresh command updates the specified snaps, or all snaps in the system if
[08:32] <seb128> none are specified.
[08:32] <seb128>
[08:32] <seb128> so basically refresh --hold blocks the auto-refresh in background
[08:32] <seb128> and exclude the snap from a 'snap refresh' call
[08:32] <seb128> but if you snap refresh <snapname> then it's not blocked
[08:33] <seb128> and I think your error is due to the fact that an auto-refresh was already started by the time you call the hold cmd
[08:34] <seb128> and snapd isn't smart enough to handle an install request where there is already a transition ongoing, as also mentioned in that askubuntu 'can't remove snap being refresh' post I shared
[08:34] <lissyx> well this needs fixing in a way :p
[08:40] <seb128> lissyx, it's tricky, I think telling you that there is already an active transaction for that snap is ok
[08:40] <seb128> but maybe it should ask you if you want to cancel/replace with the one you try to install
[08:41] <seb128> or block//wait on the current transaction to be over then do the install (but then it would be a blocking call and I don't know if the snapd team want snap calls to be potentially blocking)
[08:42] <seb128> lissyx, to fix the CI you can probably check the 'snap changes' status before calling the install
[08:42] <lissyx> I am just forcing a refresh
[08:42] <seb128> if there is a firefox auto-refresh entry then sleep & retry until it's fdone
[08:42] <lissyx> like it's not a big deal.
[08:43] <lissyx> I just felt it was awkward and needed an upstream fix, whatever the fix would be
[08:43] <seb128> well, it's like if you try to dpkg -i a deb while a dist-upgrade is ongoing
[08:43] <seb128> dpkg is going to tell you there is a lock in place and bail out
[08:44] <seb128> that's the snap equivalent
[08:44] <seb128> I think nowadays apt does the 'display a warning that it can't get the lock, sleep and try again until it can get the lock'
[08:45] <seb128> snap should probably learn to do something similar
[08:45] <lissyx> I think as long as there's a "snap refresh hold" option, it's different
[08:45] <lissyx> and either snap should gracefully honor it and cancel a pending auto-refresh, or explicitely fail "cannot hold with auto-refresh in progress"
[08:51] <seb128> fair enough
[08:51] <seb128> it should at least warn you at the time of the hold if there is an ongoing refresh
[14:14] <luna-> 23.10 time :)
[16:05] <luna-> https://releases.ubuntu.com/23.10/ubuntu-23.10-desktop-amd64.iso


[03:42] <maxiaojun> is bzr dead
[03:57] <maxiaojun> wgrant, is bzr dead?
[04:22] <wgrant> maxiaojun: Depends on your definition of "dead". There's no team within Canonical dedicated to adding features to bzr today, but there are still various bug fixes and such going in.
[04:22] <wgrant> And we're still successfully using it for all our projects.
[04:23] <maxiaojun> thank you
[12:04] <NCommander> When did LP's behavior on browsing a PPA's dists change?
[12:04]  * NCommander has a modded version of d-i in a PPA, and can't browse through the dist folder unless I use lynx
[12:04] <NCommander> chromium and firefox get redirected to a 404
[12:06] <cjwatson> Never, as far as I know.  http://ppa.launchpad.net/cjwatson/ppa/ubuntu/dists/saucy/ etc. work fine for me in firefox.
[12:07] <cjwatson> Indeed I can get to e.g. http://ppa.launchpad.net/mcasadevall/ppa/ubuntu/dists/precise/main/installer-amd64/current/images/ just fine in firefox.
[12:08] <NCommander> cjwatson, I get redirected to https, and then a 404
[12:08] <NCommander> If I use lynx I'm ok
[12:08] <NCommander> Happens with both firefox and chromium in privacy mode as a SAN check
[12:08] <cjwatson> *shrug* dunno, WFM
[12:09] <cjwatson> maybe some extension?
[12:10] <wgrant> Which URL?
[12:12] <cjwatson> (Private PPAs may be different, of course; you didn't say ...)
[16:59] <bjsnider> what's the deal with this build failure "Bareword found where operator expected"
[20:17] <bellasbells> hi, is there anyone here who can increase my repository size? My ppa is https://launchpad.net/~sandyd/+archive/chromium-browser/+packages


[01:39] <Elon> iam having some trouble getting ubuntu installed, am i in the correct channel for help?
[01:40] <Elon> (on a dell 2950 server)
[02:37] <Guest6990528> HELP
[02:38] <Guest6990528> icant get this ubuntu to work whit my dell 2950
[08:44] <BonBonTheJon> hello
[08:45] <BonBonTheJon> can someone help me with a network problem
[09:19] <Madeye> do we have ubuntu-server mailing list?


[00:13] <ozkrk> hi guys I need something
[00:14] <ozkrk> I need a panel appelt which I cah usee for a spessific folder
[00:14] <ozkrk> I mean like folders menu but I want to use something like that for show a spessific folder
[00:18] <ozkrk> and that appaelt should shows the items which that folder includes
[00:20] <rcman> if i add a file ~/.config/openbox/mycustom-rc.xml  .. will that get loaded before of after lubuntu-rc.xml?
[00:20] <rcman> will it get loaded at all?
[00:22] <ozkrk> what ?
[00:23] <rcman> u mean me ozkrk?
[01:17] <cdrkeen> Hey anyone around to assit me?
[01:22] <Hundred> do you have to setup anything in particular when installing lubuntu on an sdd
[01:47] <cdrkeen> Hundred, i just disabled the swap
[01:50] <Rexter> hello, I'm looking for a way to change the icon on a desktop icon.
[01:52] <Rexter> I mean I'm trying to change the icon on a desktop item.
[01:57] <ianorlin> what kind of item?
[01:59] <rourick> 13.10 rocks! best lubuntu i used :)
[02:02] <Rexter> well in this case it's a symlink, but I don't think it makes a difference. I don't know how to change any icon in PCmanFM.
[02:08] <Hundred> on the start menu you can change an icon just by right clicking and going to properties, but i don't know about the desktop and folders
[02:08]  * ianorlin didn't think he was meaning start menu
[02:09] <Hundred> what if you set the icon on the start menu and send it to desktop after
[02:09]  * ianorlin isn't sure it is on the menu in the first place
[02:10] <Rexter> ok, so how do I get it in the start menu?
[02:11] <Hundred> is it a folder or app
[02:11] <Rexter> it's a shell script.
[02:11] <Hundred> oh
[02:13] <Hundred> i'm not sure, probably go to #LXDE on OFTC network
[02:18]  * ianorlin didn't see a way to get a shell script to right click on it to change icon
[06:16] <greeter> greetings. i'm thinking about migrating to lubuntu and i just have a few questions
[06:16] <greeter> i'm thinking of downloading the intel x86 desktop image. is that a live cd or is it an installer only?
[06:17] <mysteriousdarren> greeter: both
[06:18] <greeter> excellent. thank you mysteriousdarren
[06:19] <mysteriousdarren> greeter:sorry for the wait
[06:20] <greeter> that's no problem. i'm still looking for information and planning out how i'm going to backup my files
[06:21] <mysteriousdarren> greeter:what program? be more specific
[06:21] <greeter> well i'm just looking for more information in general about lubuntu. i picked it because it's supposed to run well on older machines
[06:22] <mysteriousdarren> yes well ask away
[06:22] <mysteriousdarren> have you checked out ubuntu forums?
[06:23] <greeter> i have browsed through them on occasion when trying to troubleshoot issues with linux in general. i'm not a huge forums guy myself though
[06:24] <mysteriousdarren> what problems?
[06:25] <greeter> well the main reason i'm migrating is because getting audio to work consistiently has just been a nightmare. i've filed bug reports, been following them, tried every solution i can find, i still have problems
[06:25] <mysteriousdarren> what hardware?
[06:25] <greeter> hmm i don't know off hand but if you give me a minute or two i can find that out
[06:26] <mysteriousdarren> ok sounds good
[06:27] <greeter> i'm on fedora and after looking through the bug reports it just seems a number of fedora users out there have issues with pulseaudio or pnmixer
[06:28] <mysteriousdarren> yes, I had so much trouble with audio problems with Fedora ive not gone back for some time
[06:28] <greeter> hmm this is odd. it no longer shows my hardware, it just shows pulseaudio sound server. maybe my issues are finally fixed
[06:29] <greeter> well still i'm going to download the iso. if audio gives up and dies on me again i'll try switching to lubuntu and see if that works
[06:31] <mysteriousdarren> good luck doesnt hurt to ask.
[06:31] <greeter> thanks. i do have one last question. about how often does lubuntu update? is it like fedora where it updates often or is it more stable?
[06:32] <mysteriousdarren> depends on what you decide to choose. LTS updates are more stable or you can do bleeding edge if you'd like
[06:33] <greeter> i think lts would be best. my experience with fedora and always getting the latest packages leave me a bit gunshy
[06:33] <mysteriousdarren> if you know what packages cause you problems such as audio you can always keep them too
[06:34] <greeter> hmm i'm not sure what it is. the bug reports said it was pnmixer so i removed that, still had issues. then someone said it was pulse. switched to alsa still had issues
[06:35] <mysteriousdarren> depends I have audio problems on my workstation in windows but lubuntu just works :)
[06:35] <mysteriousdarren> depends on the drivers and hardware sometimes
[06:35] <greeter> well my hardware is ancient, which was the big draw to lubuntu, and for that matter the lighter version of fedora which wound out breaking sound
[06:36] <mysteriousdarren> did the heavier versions work?
[06:36] <greeter> yeah, fedora 11 with kde played sound, eventually. fedora 18 with lxde would play it if i restarted pulse and then logged back in
[06:37] <greeter> fedora 19, if sound breaks, i can only  play it again if i run the application as root. with audacity or mplayer who cares, but i'm not trying that with skype lol
[06:37] <mysteriousdarren> ouch
[06:38] <mysteriousdarren> I have to head to bed have a good night. Let the force be with you
[06:38] <greeter> alright then, thank you mysteriousdarren :-) goodnight
[07:43] <LuvLinuxOS> Hi all
[07:43] <LuvLinuxOS> I just blogged about Lubuntu 13.10 Please let me know what you think http://luvlinuxos.blogspot.com/
[09:58] <brainwash> bug 1205384 still needs some attention
[10:03] <jarnos> bt
[10:03] <jarnos> It needs to be mentioned in known issues of release notes.
[10:04] <brainwash> right, the user should be warned before downloading the 13.10 image
[10:05] <brainwash> it is easy fixable, but most users just won't know about this security issue
[14:07] <ray9na> Hello.  I just got the notification to upgrade to 13.10, but the entire thing just said Ubuntu. Will this properly upgrade me to Lubuntu 13.10 and not Ubuntu 13.10?
[14:14] <ray9na> Hello, Sergio.
[14:16] <ray9na> I have a question if anyone is able to answer it.
[14:28] <SergioMeneses> ray9na, sure! what is it?
[14:32] <ray9na> I'm running Lubuntu 13.04 on a netbook. I just got the notification to upgrade to 13.10, but the entire thing just said Ubuntu. Will this properly upgrade me to Lubuntu 13.10 and not Ubuntu 13.10?
[14:33] <ray9na> Or are there other ways to painlessly upgrade?
[14:35] <SergioMeneses> ray9na, upgrade is not something too rude if you use the update-anager application :)
[14:36] <SergioMeneses> I think if you want to taste it, do it https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SaucySalamander/ReleaseNotes/Lubuntu Saucy has a lot of good things :)
[14:36] <ray9na> System Tools | Software Updater ?
[14:38] <SergioMeneses> ray9na, you get the advice to update your system on your desktop, right?
[14:39] <ray9na> Yeah, I had just booted up and there was a big window saying that I could upgrade to Ubunto Saucy
[14:39] <ray9na> I accidentally closed it...
[14:39] <SergioMeneses> ray9na, but you want to upgrade or stay on 13.04?
[14:41] <ray9na> Well, I know I'll have to upgrade pretty soon, since Lubuntu doesn't have LTS like Ubuntu does.
[14:42] <SergioMeneses> ray9na, yes
[14:43] <SergioMeneses> there is a program called update-manager, open it and you will see the upgrade option
[14:44] <ray9na> Yep, there it is. :)
[14:44] <SergioMeneses> ok :)
[14:45] <ray9na> It's entirely possible this line of questioning could have been prevented by a cup of coffee first. :-P
[14:45] <SergioMeneses> :O
[14:46] <ray9na> Thanks. :)
[14:46] <ray9na> And all my data, etc., will be safe? I don't have to frantically back everything up first, make a list of the programs I have installed, etc.?
[14:47] <SergioMeneses> ray9na, dont worry all will be fine ;)
[14:47] <ray9na> *whew*
[14:48] <ray9na> All righty, thank you. :)
[14:49] <ray9na> (And away I go...)
[14:51] <munerf> hello, I've updated to lubunto 13.10 and lost network access
[18:40] <rourick> hi :)
[18:40] <rourick> 13.10 has been awesome for me, but i been getting random restart's
[18:40] <rourick> is a log i can check 2 see what is going on?
[18:42] <brainwash> rourick: maybe you can find something in /var/log/syslog
[18:42] <rourick> brainwash: ok ty
[18:43] <brainwash> every kernel/system message comes with a timestamp, so the related information should be easy to find
[20:10] <Meris> I have installed Lubuntu 13.10 on a 2007 MacBook (Intel Core 2 Duo 1,987 GHz, 4GB RAM) but I can't see any battery indicator. That is pretty critical when working on a laptop...
[20:13] <likevel> meris: check your ~/.config/lxsession/Lubuntu/desktop.conf
[20:13] <likevel> is laptop_mode set to yes?
[20:14] <Meris> likevel, just a sec. let me check that
[20:15] <Meris> It wasn't, but now it is, just edited it.
[20:15] <Meris> likevel, shoul I log off/ on to see the difference?
[20:15] <likevel> yep :-)
[20:15] <Meris> shoul => should
[20:16] <Meris> likevel, that worked like a charm, thx :-)
[20:17] <likevel> np :-)
[20:18] <Meris> likevel, I'm puzzled why it doesn't detect that on installation though. It's not that hard to detect that the processor supports stepped frequencies (which is almost uniquely reserved for mobile processors)
[20:20] <likevel> Yeah. I noticed that when I ran Lubuntu from usb disk it was set correctly, however, when I had installed it to disk it was gone. Took me a while to figure out what setting was changed.
[20:22] <Meris> likevel, anothor thing you might be able to help me with...After adding the battery status indicator, the desktop pager disappeared from the indicator panel, even though it does register as being loaded.
[20:25] <likevel> hmm, is it listed in "panel applets" in panel settings?
[20:25] <Meris> likevel, It is, but is sandwiched between two "spacer" items
[20:26] <likevel> does it reappear if you move it up or down in the list?
[20:27] <Meris> That's odd, it only remains visible if it is on a certain position. Either between the indicator panel and the clock, or at the extreme right side. In other places, it's completely invisible.
[20:28] <Meris> More than that, it is neither visible, nor active. Right clicking on the desktop pager tries to start up Openbox Configuration manager, which immediately crashes. This can be repeated over and over on my system.
[20:29] <Meris> Another oddity is that the Dekstop Pager seemed to be sliced in half horizontally, I can only see the bottom part
[20:29] <likevel> seems like there is a problem with the desktop pager. mine crashes too if i try to configure it.
[20:31] <Meris> 13.10 is of course rather new, so it might be one of the many bugs that have to be ironed out before the system becomes really stable. Ubuntu has LTS releases. How about Lubuntu? This laptop is meant for business, not for tinkering.
[20:35] <likevel> it seems that 14.04 might be LTS
[20:36] <phillw> hi Meris and likevel https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Overview/#Reporting_Bugs
[20:36] <Meris> That would be great. Well, as long as it has a stable version of tmux/ screen I can manage, it's mainly for remote terminal fiddling anyhow.
[20:37] <phillw> Do please the time to do so; they will not get fixed if we are not aware of them, thanks :)
[20:37] <phillw> likevel: 14.04 IS going to be an LTS; so get the bug reports of 13.10 in :)
[20:38] <Meris> phillw, I will report the bug, if it has not been reported yet, else I'll add to the counter that this is also affecting me.
[20:39] <phillw> many thanks, it is appreciated.
[20:41] <Meris> phillw, it is the least I can do. After all, I'm using free software since 1997 now.
[20:41] <Meris> phillw, I have used Ubuntu since version 5.04
[20:41] <Meris> Not as my main OS however, that was SuSE 6.4 at the time.
[20:44] <brainwash> phillw: can you please triage bug 1205384 and set the importance to "critical"?
[20:46] <LuvLinuxOS> hi all
[20:47] <phillw> Meris: we have a small, dedicated, testing team. But, we cannot catch every bug on all machines. brainwash if you have a bug that you feel is un-loved nag the QA mailing list :) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing#Getting_Involved
[20:48] <Meris> phillw, one thing that is infuriating as a user (yes I feel this strongly about it...) is that when you search for lubuntu on launchpad.net you need to know which project your bug belongs to. That is something which is inside information. Users should not have to bother with that distinction.
[20:50] <Meris> phillw, I can choose from: lubuntu-artwork, lubuntu-software-center, lubuntu-tweaks, lxfind and lxscreenshot. None of these so-called projects within Launchpad seem to match the target I want to report a bug for.
[20:50] <phillw> Meris: I do agree, and as part of the classroom sessions last series; Brian held a fantastic session http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/06/24/%23ubuntu-classroom.html#t21:30
[20:50] <melodie> hi
[20:51] <melodie> hello phillw
[20:51] <phillw> hi melodie
[20:51] <brainwash> phillw: right, it's not about testing anymore, it's about fixing a critical security issue
[20:51] <brainwash> the testing should have been done before release
[20:52] <melodie> phillw brainwash about the xlock thing, I just checked what is in Xubuntu, in order to compare, and in the live they don't have a screenlock option at all
[20:52] <brainwash> they use xscreensaver
[20:53] <phillw> brainwash: when I catch breath, I will directly email to our dev. However "the testing should have been done before release" would have been picked up on, where someone to have tested it :)
[20:53] <brainwash> phillw: thanks :)
[20:54] <brainwash> I would have assumed that especially new features (lightdm locking) do get tested
[20:56] <brainwash> to make sure that it is not broken and works as intended
[20:56] <melodie> brainwash it does not show in the logout screen
[20:56] <melodie> and it does not lock the session either, at least in the live it doesn't
[20:56] <brainwash> melodie: are you referring to xuubntu?
[20:57] <melodie> yes brainwash I just tried in virtualbox
[20:57] <phillw> brainwash: we test the installer, and believe me here when I say that there has been several major issues with it that would stop an install completing. We're not overly happy with that happening as it sucked time from the testers that could have been used for 'how does it actually run'. We're always on the hunt for more testers, and if anyone here wants to help out for 14.04 they will be welcomed with open arms.
[20:58] <melodie> I started it from console, looked at some options, tried '--lock' and also '--activate' and also started the --prefs to see if I could get hands on the configuration
[20:58] <brainwash> melodie: I can lock the session via the session drop down menu (panel) or via keyboard shortcut
[20:58] <Meris> phillw, I tried to reproduce the bug. Well, the bug is still there, but the after having put the UI into laptop mode, the "Desktop Pager settings" as invoked from a right click from the desktop pager doesn't even try to launch anything, it does not even crash the openbox configuration screen, it just doesn't do anything at all anymore. Hence the trick that Brian described : "ubuntu-bug -w" doesn't work here... I'll try to find out the
[20:58] <Meris>  package name from apt-cache.
[20:58] <brainwash> and it runs xflock4 which calls xscreensaver-command -lock
[20:59] <melodie> brainwash I restart it immediatly
[21:00] <brainwash> phillw: don't worry, I'm just a bit upset because many people I know use lubuntu and are affected by this issue (not knowingly)
[21:00] <melodie> brainwash when I locked the session from the command line, the screen turned black but as soon as I moved the mouse cursor above it the desktop was there again: however it is not installed, it's a live. maybe that doesn't count?
[21:01] <brainwash> melodie: probably
[21:01] <phillw> melodie: my machine is still not clean install. I've just not had time. I do have a couple of VM's I can fire up that are 'virgin' if there is any help I can give.
[21:02] <melodie> brainwash I start the install in vbox to compare with what will show after install
[21:03] <Meris> Hmm, phillw On my search for the package I have encountered no less than 8 different bugs. I am beginning to have serious doubts about the stability of Lubuntu 13.10 as a whole )at least on my system)
[21:03] <melodie> I think if the bug related to (xlock?) is in lubuntu it should also be found in other versions, such as Xubuntu?
[21:03] <brainwash> yes, 13.10 is unpolished and was not ready for public release
[21:03] <brainwash> ^ every spin
[21:03] <melodie> same thought here
[21:04] <brainwash> it feels like a snapshot on the way to 14.04 LTS
[21:04] <melodie> I don't know, I would not say the same
[21:05] <Meris> Right now, it seems to be this broken that I cannot report the bug on the system that is experiencing this bug. That is what I call alpha-quality, not more.
[21:05] <melodie> last LTS also needed polish when it came out
[21:05] <phillw> melodie: lubuntu has never had an LTS :D
[21:05] <melodie> Meris I have often seen apport solved
[21:06] <melodie> phillw yes but it is a special case, it's young
[21:06] <melodie> the main distro itself and other derivated needed to get the updates during one or two months before being on the smooth run
 Meris I have often seen apport solve
 Meris I have often seen apport fail
[21:07] <melodie> I meant fail
[21:07] <greeter> lol
[21:07] <melodie> not good for me doing two or three things at same time and think about several
[21:07] <Meris> melodie, well, now I'm searching for the name of the crashing panel application, but when I use standard apps on the way (lxterminal, synaptic, apt-cache), I have encountered 8 more bugs.
[21:08] <melodie> so much?
[21:08] <Meris> Ah, yes, I forgot grep and less...
[21:08] <Meris> Yes, alas so
[21:08] <melodie> do they also fail?
[21:08] <melodie> what does the crash you meet with look like?
[21:09] <Meris> They don't fail completely, but they have quirks. Than again, it might also be specific for my system. After all, it's at a venerable age for a computer, 6 years old.
[21:12] <malaphus> Hi all.  I did a do-release-update today and everything went fine, however I have a problem now; my SSH Keyring is no longer working.  I am forced to enter my passphrase every time I SSH to a remove server, whereas before the first time (after a reboot) I'd get a dialog asking for the passphrase, then it would be remembered
[21:12] <malaphus> (went from 13.04 to 13.10)
[21:12] <Meris> Ah, now we are getting somewhere. I've started openbox while redirecting stderr. and I get loads and loads of Gtk-Warnings about hidden elements.
[21:13] <phillw> melodie: there were a lot of zero day updates launched today. Can you all please ensure you have them installed. nothing more annoying for a bug than "please update".
[21:14] <phillw> It will be a couple of hours for my VM do update.
[21:14] <Meris> On top of that, it eats through my battery life at an alarming rate. "Something" is clearly looping, leaking memory and performing a lot of unneeded opcodes on the way...
[21:16] <melodie> Meris the computer on which I tested last is a T30 laptop of 13 years old
[21:17] <melodie> the worse part of it is the FSB which is running at 99Mhz
[21:17] <melodie> Meris I am unaware of opcodes, I have read the word here and there but I don't have any idea what it refers to
[21:18] <melodie> phillw ok for the updates. Is zero day the other words for "critical bug updates"?
[21:18] <Meris> melodie, opcodes are the things that are executed at the processor level: machine code.
[21:20] <melodie> the strings containing hexa code?
[21:20] <phillw> melodie: they are bugs that where known of, but not critical enough to make re-spins of the ISO's. Each respin of an ISO eats so much time up that the bug and release team do have to make a call as to what gets in.
[21:20] <melodie> ok
[21:21] <phillw> after installing, the 1st thing people need to do is to update their system, bug fixes do get queued up.
[21:22] <melodie> ok
[21:22] <melodie> Xubuntu has provided their version with vboxadditions :p
[21:22] <melodie> I like that
[21:23] <Meris> melodie, here you are, this Wiki article is quite summarized, so it won't take that long to read through: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opcode
[21:23] <greeter> hmm. sounds like i have some documents to read :-)
[21:23] <melodie> greeter :p
[21:23] <melodie> thanks Meris
[21:23] <Meris> np
[21:23] <greeter> i'm migrating from fedora to lubuntu today. it's a nightmare trying to back up all the files i want to keep
[21:24] <phillw> melodie: there is a new vbox out! I did have someone report that lubuntu would not run for him in Vbox; it behaved well for me. and I'm not someone who uses vBox as their default VM system :D
[21:24] <melodie> 14 updates to do
[21:24] <Meris> greeter, try to stick to your documents, e-mail and browser settings.
[21:24] <melodie> phillw I run vbox in Archlinux
[21:24] <melodie> Arch is my main distro :)
[21:24] <Meris> greeter and if you have a password safe, be sure to include that one as well ;-)\
[21:24] <phillw> I use virt-manager :)
[21:24] <malaphus> I have a problem after upgrading to 13.10, my SSH Keyring is no longer working.  I am forced to enter my passphrase every time I SSH to a remote server, whereas before the first time (after a reboot) I'd get a dialog asking for the passphrase, then it would be remembered
[21:25] <greeter> thank you Meris. that's basically all i'm saving. any larger files i want to keep i have backed up to usb devices
[21:25] <Meris> malaphus, do you get an error message about "offending keys"?
[21:25] <greeter> the nightmare part comes from that feeling that i'm forgetting some super important document somewhere that i'm only going to remember after clobbering the current system lol
[21:26] <Meris> greeter, in that case splurge on a external HDD and backup your *entire* /home
[21:26] <malaphus> Meris: Nope, no error, SSH just prompts for the passphrase instead of the dialog that normally appears
[21:27] <greeter> well my /home is on a separate partition just for this kind of situation. although when i booted up the live cd i couldn't access the partition :-S
[21:29] <Meris> greeter, I'm assuming that you've kept saves limited to your /home partition only. When my grandfather was still among the living, I was scouring the C:\ drive for any rogue .txt's, .doc's, and wp documents, which took a lot of time. After a while I felt I needed to be strict with him: "Only files that you save within "My Documents" will get backed-up and nothing else (apart from e-mail and browser settings of course... He learned qui
[21:29] <Meris> ckly :-)
[21:30] <greeter> basically that's it Meris. except for a cron job and one other configuration file everything i want to keep is in /home
[21:30] <Meris> greeter, you did not encrypt your /home, now did you? It comes standard with *buntu installations nowadays...
[21:31] <greeter> i didn't encrypt it. i tried encrypting a partition once and it was just an utter disaster so i've since stayed away from that lol
[21:31] <melodie> phillw I don't know about virt-manager
[21:31] <phillw> greeter: also, do make /home a separate partition :)
[21:32] <greeter> i thought that's what i did. hmm
[21:32]  * greeter shrugs
[21:32] <greeter> ok one more thorough check to see if i forgot to back up anything
[21:32] <melodie> phillw and in Archlinux Virtualbox is always the latest stable available (unless we would not update the system regularly or often)
[21:33] <phillw> melodie: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Virtual_Machines
[21:33] <Meris> greeter, me as well. My laptop does use encrypted drives though, along with 2 factor authentication. Let them try brute-forcing a 5120 bits encryption with passphrase ;-) Of course, an assailant might go for the $5 wrench instead ;-)
[21:34] <greeter> lol true enough
[21:34] <greeter> well with me it's just one computer that is 11 years old in an old house with nothing valuable in it. not worried about intruders physically accessing the machine
[21:35]  * greeter wonders why there's a copy of the fedora 13 live cd in his home directory
[21:36] <Meris> greeter, if your / is on the same physical drive as your /home partition, why not go for a hard-link for that config-file and that cron-job?
[21:37] <greeter> i'm not all that smart when it comes to linux :-S
[21:37] <Meris> greeter, man ln
[21:37] <greeter> ooh two more documents that need to be backed up
[21:39] <greeter> should save my resumes and cover letters. i might need to waste hard drive space someday
[21:39] <melodie> phillw "KVM (using virt-manager). Totally open source. " : I don't have any KVM capable cpu on my machines
[21:39] <Meris> Gibarian, did you choose your nickname in honour of the cyber specialist featured in the movie Solyaris (1972)?
[21:40] <phillw> melodie: ah well, it was worth a try!
[21:40] <melodie> phillw is it faster than vbox?
[21:40] <Gibarian> Yes, I did :-P
[21:41] <Gibarian> I'ts my favorite novel
[21:41] <Meris> Gibarian, ah, by Stanislaw Lem ! Yes, an absolute classic indeed :-D
[21:42] <phillw> melodie: depends on faster.... kvm is built into the kernels so needs no added stuff. I started out with vBox but learned about kvm on a training course. It's what I use as default now, but do still have vBox for times when people have questions about it.
[21:43] <melodie> phillw ok
[21:43] <greeter> ok i think i have everything backed up now
[21:43] <greeter> i can install new software from the command line with sudo apt-get right?
[21:43] <melodie> Meris what about the gtk-warnings and so? Have you found what "eats" your battery life and how to handle it?
[21:43] <melodie> "<Meris> On top of that, it eats through my battery life at an alarming rate. "Something" is clearly looping, leaking memory and performing a lot of unneeded opcodes on the way..."
[21:43] <Meris> melodie, it is normally faster, but it has no GUI. That's why it might take a little longer to become comfortable with.
[21:44] <melodie> Meris I'll see if one day I have a kvm capable cpu
[21:44] <Meris> melodie, not yet. Nothing out of the ordinary shows up in ps or top.
[21:44] <Meris> melodie, whcih cpu do you currently have?
[21:44] <Meris> whcih => which
[21:48] <phillw> Meris: it has a nice GUI.... virt-manager :)
[21:49] <melodie> Meris hover above the icon "machine": http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/305/builds/55590/testcases/1302/results
[21:49] <melodie> this is on a Dell
[21:49] <Gibarian> Yes Meris, it is indeed :-)
[21:49] <melodie> and there is a T30 with Pentium 4 with 1.86 Ghz
[21:50] <melodie> the machine I am using to talk here has more power
[21:50] <melodie>  AMD Athlon(tm) II X2 260 Processor
[21:50] <Meris> T30's are nice machines, but they are getting a bit old indeed...
[21:50] <melodie> but no KVM in the flags i the amd II X2
[21:51] <Meris> no, alas
[21:51] <melodie> Meris yes, so I use it to demonstrate the GNU/Linux distros
[21:51] <melodie> and have children play on light edu games on it one a while too (it's a strong machine)
[21:51] <ianorlin> what part of panel is failing?
[21:52] <Meris> melodie, my newest machine has a Haswell Hexacore i7 chip with integrated graphics HD4400
[21:52] <melodie> the keyboard is in qwerty and we need azerty, but I'm used to have it mapped to azerty and else I can plugin a keyboard
[21:52] <melodie> is hexacore 6 cores? :p
[21:52] <Meris> ianorlin, are you talking to me? In that case, it's the Desktop Pager that's failing
[21:53] <Meris> melodie, yes 6 corres, paired with 8GB of RAM. Plenty for my for school latop ;-)
[21:53] <Meris> corres => cores
[21:53] <melodie> Meris are you student or teacher?
[21:54] <Meris> melodie, you should be able to select which keyboard yu are using, using the keyboard widget
[21:54] <Meris> melodie, actually both. I'm a student of informatics and a trainer at my work.
[21:55] <phillw> melodie: we had a very recent update for keyboards with 13.10. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Keyboard#Keyboard_mapping_for_13.10_and_beyond
[21:55] <ianorlin> yes sorry was afk reading up
[21:56] <Meris> melodie, we mostly use Linux at work, but there are also a few people using a Mac(Book). No Windows, except for testing within a sandboxed virtual machine running on a stand-alone machine.
[21:59] <melodie> Meris I am used to azerty and using qwerty is for me an intellectual exercise, I have no wish to learn qwerty
[21:59] <melodie> and I mostly don't need to look at the keyboard while typing
[22:00] <Meris> melodie, Azerty should be selectable from within the greeter, it's called French keyboard layout.
[22:00] <greeter> hmm?
[22:00] <phillw> melodie: is the azerty keyboard not listed? I only know of qwerty and dvorac
[22:00] <Meris> melodie, you might be using Canadian or Belgian layout, it can't hurt to try.
[22:00] <melodie> I don't understand what you do not understand
[22:01] <melodie> the T30 has a qwerty keyboard: I could not find an azerty for it, so I just map it to azerty
[22:01] <greeter> i don't understand why my nick was mentioned :-S
[22:01] <melodie> Meris I don't use canadian or belgium layouts, I use fr with oss variant
[22:02] <Meris> melodie, oss? what does that stand for?
[22:02] <melodie> no idea
[22:02] <melodie> it allows me to do this:
[22:02] <melodie> Œ œ Æ æ
[22:02] <melodie> and also:
[22:02] <melodie> →
[22:02] <melodie> ↑
[22:03] <melodie> ↑↓
[22:03] <melodie> À
[22:03] <melodie> Ç
[22:03] <melodie> …
[22:03] <Meris> melodie, ah, AltGr Deadkeys I presume.
[22:03] <melodie> AltGr and also AltGr+Shift
[22:04] <Meris> melodie, wow, that's a lot of choices :-)
[22:05] <melodie> ÆæÂâ¢€ÊêÞþŸÿÛûÎîŒœÔôä„ßËë‚‘¥’ÐðÜüÏïĿŀĿÖĿ
[22:05] <melodie> quite a lot
[22:05] <melodie> “«”»®©← ↑↓→¬…×⋅÷−
[22:05] <melodie> :D
[22:05] <greeter> ok wish me luck, going to install lubuntu now. bbl
[22:05] <melodie> greeter good luck
[22:06] <greeter> thanks melodie. i'll either be back thanking you all for your help or cursing the day i thought i could do something intelligent :-P
[22:06] <Meris> melodie, not sure about the proper name for that variant. Try selecting French Keyboard layout and selecting AltGr Deadkeys on the advanced settings,. That should work just fine.
[22:06] <Meris> greeter, fingers crossed here,
[22:06] <greeter> same here lol
[22:06] <phillw> melodie: would be so kind as too look at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Documentation/LanguageSupport It's a long time since it was written and will most likely need updating :)
[22:07] <melodie> I can look
[22:08] <melodie> phillw it seems correct as far as I remember (not long ago)
[22:09] <melodie> phillw about this: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Keyboard#Keyboard_mapping_for_13.10_and_beyond
[22:09] <melodie> lxkeymap was not working, or not anymore, is that right?
[22:14] <Meris> melodie, greeter, Nice having you here (please be sure to greet phillw as well when he has recovered from the time-out). I need to sleep now.
[22:31] <melodie> phillw !
[22:31] <melodie> Meris> melodie, greeter, Nice having you here (please be sure to greet phillw as well when he has recovered from the time-out). I need to sleep now.
[22:31] <melodie> melodie> phillw about this: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Keyboard#Keyboard_mapping_for_13.10_and_beyond
 lxkeymap was not working, or not anymore, is that right?
[22:37] <melodie> phillw ?
[22:42] <phillw> melodie: ??
[22:43] <melodie> ah
[22:43] <melodie> phillw read above please?
[22:43] <phillw> the mapping of keyboards has been changed, Pierre was kind enough to send a set of instructions. If they do not work, i really do need to know!
[22:44] <melodie> this is what I have used in Ubuntu Openbox Remix since : http://meets.free.fr/Downloads/BentoVillageProject/Configurations/System/usr/share/applications/keyboard-configuration.desktop
[22:44] <melodie> not only used but provided. this is the safe way so far
[22:45] <melodie> the Bento Village version (name of the project) has been provided only as a Desktop version, it's a very modest project, at same time it is provided as a "all languages" version, not localized to French for instance.
[22:46] <melodie> what has changed in the mapping of keyboards ? Is that the reason why lxkeymap was not working anymore?
[22:48] <phillw> melodie: " lxkeymap application is no longer installed by default,"
[22:49] <phillw> hence the addition to the wiki and release notes.
[22:51] <melodie> well this I have read, and what about former versions who would like to use a gui app?
[22:52] <melodie> (I'll read your answer a little later)
[22:52] <phillw> melodie: nothing has changed for the older versions... https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Keyboard
[23:36] <melodie> hi again
[23:37] <melodie> phillw this does not answer my main question. this would be a lead to my question: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=lxkeymap&searchon=names&suite=all&section=all
[23:37] <melodie> lxkeymap is still available, but, does -it- work?
[23:37] <melodie> in the latest spin I had done it didn't work at all, no effect
[23:41] <melodie> never mind, good night