[21:11] <jackhum> ppf: i want to know about ubuntu 16.04 , i see a utility named systemback
[21:11] <abhinavmehta> see line#14, 15
[21:11] <ppf> (also, this is linux, now windows, so you can basicly recover from anything )
[21:11] <danm> jackhum: Yeah that's just backup
[21:11] <eightfold> hi. noob here. i installed f.lux according to http://ubuntuhandbook.org/index.php/2016/03/install-f-lux-in-ubuntu-16-04/
[21:11] <eightfold> that is, i added the ppa
[21:12] <abhinavmehta> I want to move hello and pello file to bin/ how can I do that in 1 command?
[21:12] <eightfold> and instaled via apt-get
[21:12] <jackhum> abhinavmehta: wait , i will tell you this
[21:12] <eightfold> but how do i start the app
[21:12] <jackhum> please dont answer his question
[21:12] <jackhum> i want to answer :)
[21:12] <abhinavmehta> jackhum: ok, thanks in advance
[21:12] <backbox> i have Ubuntu 16 so useful
[21:12] <k1l_> eightfold: why dont you use redshift, that is in the repos and has a applet too
[21:12] <jackhum> using wildcard
[21:12] <jackhum> *
[21:12] <jackhum> let me be more specific
[21:13] <abhinavmehta> jackhum: can you share 1 liner command?
[21:13] <kazuistik> merhabaaaaaaaaaaaa
[21:13] <eightfold> k1l_: read abou that in the comments to the blog post i linked above. is it just as good?
[21:13] <Exagone313> eightfold: you don't need f.lux, redshift is open source and better
[21:13] <kazuistik> türk var mı
[21:13] <backbox> anyone from uae
[21:14] <kazuistik> hi
[21:14] <jackhum> abhinavmehta: go to your directory , than mv * ./bin maybe
[21:14] <k1l_> eightfold: honestly the only reason why people install f.flux with all that manual work is because they know it from windows. redshift is in the repos. that works.
[21:14] <backbox> hi
[21:14] <jackhum> abhinavmehta: let me try first
[21:14] <eightfold> Exagone313: thanks. but question remains, where do installed apps end up on ubuntu
[21:14] <ppf> abhinavmehta: no don't do that
[21:14] <eightfold> on the disk
[21:14] <ppf> jackhum: don't do that
[21:15] <abhinavmehta> jackhum: * gives you  src/.. prefixed, which we dont want. We need only the file name eg. hello, pello
[21:15] <Exagone313> eightfold: from apt?
[21:15] <ppf> the * glob matches everything
[21:15] <abhinavmehta> ppf: why?
[21:15] <abhinavmehta> ok
[21:15] <abhinavmehta> ppf: but then I'm doing a grep using pipe
[21:16] <ppf> abhinavmehta: ?
[21:16] <ppf> you said you wanted to move two files
[21:16] <abhinavmehta> Exagone313: which redshift you talking about, share link.
[21:16] <abhinavmehta> ppf: 2 or more files
[21:16] <eightfold> Exagone313: yeah, installed redshift via apt-get now. but how do i start it?
[21:16] <eightfold> Exagone313: where is it located
[21:16] <jackhum> ppf: so basically he wants to move all the file from one directory to another?
[21:17] <k1l_> eightfold: its in the $PATH. so just type it
[21:17] <Exagone313> eightfold: redshift --help in terminal, or install redshift-gtk, or ask somebody else I have to go
[21:17] <abhinavmehta> ppf, jackhum - basically I want to move all files from one directory to another, but want to keep same file name.
[21:17] <abhinavmehta> right.
[21:17] <eightfold> Exagone313: is it command line only?
[21:17] <eightfold> ok, thanks
[21:17] <ppf> abhinavmehta: * matches all files and folders
[21:18] <eightfold> k1l_: is redshift command line only?
[21:18] <abhinavmehta> ppf thats right, I didnt get you you asking or telling something.
[21:18] <ppf> actually i should say, the shell will exapnd * to all files or folders
[21:18] <Exagone313> eightfold: don't be scared to command line, it's powerful
[21:19] <abhinavmehta> ppf, jackhum - ok, what I want is - after all my files gets compiled in src folder, I want to move them to bin/ folder
[21:19] <abhinavmehta> offcourse with the same name
[21:19] <eightfold> Exagone313: i have no trouble using it, but i feel there's no concistency as to where the apps end up and how i start  them. how should i know redshift ended up in PATH?
[21:19] <eightfold> without asking that is
[21:19] <ppf> why not compile them to that place directly
[21:19] <k1l_> eightfold: redshift-gtk
[21:19] <abhinavmehta> I tried, but failing to get it using Makefile.
[21:19] <k1l_> eightfold: that will make you a indicator
[21:20] <abhinavmehta> Have to learn makefile further .. so for meanwhile this is hack.
[21:20] <jackhum> abhinavmehta: maybe cp dirname bin/
[21:20] <jackhum> man i need to learn a lot
[21:21] <abhinavmehta> jackhum: nope wont work, cp first parameter dirname is src/* ... which will contain lets say src/hello.c as well as src/hello ... where I want to move only src/hello -> bin/hello
[21:21] <ppf> abhinavmehta: figure out how to do it in make
[21:21] <ppf> that's the proper way
[21:21] <danm> Sorry if I stress on this question but: Does Ubuntu know how to switch gpus by default?
[21:22] <ppf> danm: depends
[21:22] <abhinavmehta> ppf: for a second, lets keep build tools away .. just curious how to do using shell also. What option do I have if I was using let say shell-scripts
[21:22] <ppf> on the kernel and the gpus
[21:22] <danm> ppf: Ubuntu 16.04
[21:22] <JosephineBlack> hi
[21:23] <danm> ppf: intel + nvidia
[21:23] <jackhum> abhinavmehta: why mv ./src/* ./bin/ wont work?
[21:23] <Capum321> how to configure samba file share to a ntfs partition?
[21:23] <abhinavmehta> Makefile is just a build tool, does something more then shell/bash script .. but at end of the day its shell script which makes it work
[21:23] <jackhum> abhinavmehta: i think this command will transfer all the src files to bin
[21:23] <abhinavmehta> jackhum: because mv ./src/* will match *.c files too ..  which I dont want
[21:24] <abhinavmehta> I need only binaries to be moved to bin/ folder
[21:24] <JosephineBlack> Hallo :-)
[21:24] <JosephineBlack> Is der any social chat about debian or ubuntu on freenode please?
[21:24] <ppf> danm: then you should get familiar with optimus and bumblebee
[21:24] <AarQun> Hi all
[21:24] <Capum321> JosephineBlack: you mean off-topic?
[21:24] <danm> ppf: So the open source default won't do?
[21:25] <JosephineBlack> yes maybe just to talk and hang out and chill
[21:25] <lordcirth> !ot
[21:25] <JosephineBlack> u got a link please mine pc is slooooooow
[21:25] <abhinavmehta> ppf jackhum - so is there any bash/shell script channel? Ubuntu is quite generic I assume.
[21:25] <JosephineBlack> how are the ICQ dtatabases hosted?
[21:25] <mo1991reg> I am trying to install ubuntu on my surface pro 4.   I have used gparted to shrink windows partition and installed ubuntu 16.04 on the free space.   I do not get a grub loader on reboot, however.   Can anyone help me install grub properly?
[21:26] <ppf> abhinavmehta: ##bash
[21:26] <abhinavmehta> any channel recommendations?
[21:26] <ppf> or #bash
[21:26] <danm> ppf: Also I've seen that even then the switch is made manually by the user:
[21:26] <abhinavmehta> ok, thanks ppf. :)
[21:26] <ppf> danm: yes
[21:26] <Bashing-om> porkstore: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2159449 <-easiest way to cp files 'tween two 'buntus that share the same router/house (Morbius1) .
[21:26] <danm> ppf: Thanks! Do newer kernels handel it automatically? 4.8?
[21:27] <ppf> no, and i don't think anyone intends to
[21:27] <jackhum> abhinavmehta: how about mv ./src/!(*.c) ./bin/ ?
[21:27] <danm> ppf: Sad, windows does it. Well the drivers for Windows do.
[21:28] <ppf> yes
[21:28] <ppf> the question is, what kind of automatism do you really need?
[21:28] <porkstore> anyone know why ubuntu file sharing with samba would not be working
[21:28] <porkstore> i have a '2 in 1' cable modem
[21:28] <porkstore> i wonder if that's an issue
[21:28] <ppf> porkstore: need more details
[21:29] <porkstore> i shared the folder in nautilus
[21:29] <porkstore> installed samba
[21:29] <porkstore> opened "network" on the other machine, but it doesn't see anything
[21:29] <JosephineBlack> restarted samba and nagios servicesß
[21:29] <JosephineBlack> ?
[21:30] <porkstore> what is nagios ?
[21:30] <k1l_> made a "share" on the first machine?
[21:30] <porkstore> Failed to restart samba.service: Unit samba.service is masked.
[21:30] <porkstore> yeah k1l_
[21:31] <porkstore> $ service samba status
[21:31] <porkstore> ● samba.service Loaded: masked (/dev/null; bad) Active: inactive (dead)
[21:32] <Capum321> how to share a ntfs partition?
[21:32] <porkstore> looks like i have ipv6 ip
[21:32] <pavlos> do you have systemctl? if so, try systemctl status smbd.service
[21:32] <JosephineBlack> what about DNS?
[21:32] <JosephineBlack> gateways and resolver?
[21:33] <JosephineBlack> masked?
[21:33] <JosephineBlack> ask root lol*
[21:33] <porkstore> that did something pavlos
[21:33] <porkstore> what am i looking for
[21:33] <Capum321> talking about samba, how to share a ntfs partition?
[21:34] <pavlos> are you ruunning 16.04?
[21:34] <porkstore> yeah
[21:34] <Jordan_U> Capum321: Mount the ntfs partition then share it as you would any other directory.
[21:34] <porkstore> Started LSB: start Samba SMB/CIFS daemon (smbd). / pam_unix(samba:session): session closed for user nobody
[21:34] <pavlos> so you need to use systemctl, not the old stuff (service, upstart, etc)
[21:35] <porkstore> k
[21:36] <pavlos> instead of status, you can try restart as a parm
[21:37] <porkstore> well it didn't change anything
[21:38] <Capum321> Jordan_U: no, it isn't like that. if i set a ext4 path at smb.conf custom share it works, but not with a ntfs?
[21:38] <porkstore> i wonder if this masking is an issue
[21:39] <Jordan_U> Capum321: What happens when you try to share a directory on an ntfs filesystem? Does the user samba is running as have permissions to read that directory and its files?
[21:39] <skinux> I need some help. I'm using Apache 2.4 with FastCGI and PHP 7.0, having a lot of problems with slow loading and 503 error pages.
[21:39] <skinux> Here is recent contents of Apache error log https://gist.github.com/skinuxgeek/e478a49039a346c761a79fe963f05cd6
[21:39] <porkstore> Bashing-om - can i do that with FTP so i can preserve directories ?
[21:39] <pavlos> porkstore, I assume both systems are in the same WORKGROUP
[21:40] <porkstore> i have no idea what a workgroup is
[21:40] <Capum321> Jordan_U: i assume i have to fix this at /etc/fstab?
[21:40] <Jordan_U> porkstore: systemctl status smbd
[21:41] <Capum321> Jordan_U: or elsewhere?
[21:41] <Jordan_U> Capum321: Fix what exactly?
[21:42] <Capum321> Jordan_U: give permissions to read the directory and below...
[21:42] <pavlos> Capum321, you can usually share ntfs using <IP_ADDRESS>:/vol /shared with some parms in /etc/fstab
[21:42] <pavlos> Capum321, adjust ip and dirs
[21:43] <Capum321> pavlos: I didn't understand how/where to do this fix
[21:43] <pavlos> porkstore, help me understand your setup ... from 16.04, you right click on a floder, enable sharing. samba is restarted. You go to another machine, look at network and how to see your shared dir. Am I close ?
[21:44] <Jordan_U> Capum321: Have you confirmed that permissions are the issue? You never actually anwswered my question about permission.
[21:44] <Capum321> Jordan_U: where I confirm that information at first place?
[21:44] <porkstore> http://pastebin.com/Z2hWHDrS
[21:45] <porkstore> pavlos - yeah
[21:45] <Capum321> Jordan_U: just a ls?
[21:45] <docasii> hi
[21:45] <porkstore> i go to another computer and i don't see it
[21:45] <docasii> whats up
[21:45] <Jordan_U> Capum321: ls -ld /path/to/shared_directory/
[21:46] <porkstore> if i just install ftp will i get local network speed ?
[21:46] <porkstore> ftp server
[21:46] <wabbits> what is the speed of you local network?
[21:46] <k1l_> porkstore: use openssh-server. it got a sftp server included
[21:47] <porkstore> this is a pain in the rear
[21:48] <porkstore> oh snap
[21:48] <Capum321> Jordan_U: drwxrwxrwx 1 root root 4096 date /path/to/directory is the output
[21:48] <Bashing-om> porkstore: Anytbing one has not done before is a pain . Try removing the starter from a 2001 4 cyl Pontiac auto .
[21:49] <porkstore> instead i did "connect to server" and did smb:// to the local ip
[21:49] <porkstore> and now i see it
[21:49] <Jordan_U> Capum321: How are you sharing this directory? Please include the actual path.
[21:49] <porkstore> i would not get involved with a gm vehicle
[21:49] <pavlos> porkstore, there are 2 more lines in the pastbin you provided ... it should read 'ready to serve connections
[21:50] <pavlos> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23286442/
[21:51] <porkstore> pavlos - no i don't have that
[21:51] <porkstore> but i am connected, sort of ..
[21:51] <porkstore> via smb://
[21:51] <porkstore> but now it's asking me for a password
[21:52] <porkstore> but not accepting my password
[21:52] <Capum321> Jordan_U: setting up smb.conf with browseable = yes, force user = nobody, read only = yes, guest ok = yes. this same configuration works for a linux path ext4
[21:52] <porkstore> it says domain WORKGROUP
[21:53] <JosephineBlack> Domain\porkstore
[21:53] <JosephineBlack> pass
[21:53] <JosephineBlack> or
[21:54] <JosephineBlack> prkstore@domain?
[21:54] <porkstore> its a popup window
[21:54] <Capum321> Jordan_U: the folder is on /media
[21:54] <porkstore> it says username: domain: password:
[21:54] <porkstore> the domain says WORKGROUP
[21:54] <JosephineBlack> depence on from which machine u try tp connect samba
[21:54] <porkstore> so i put in the user and pass on that machine
[21:54] <JosephineBlack> which os
[21:54] <porkstore> but it doesn't accept
[21:54] <porkstore> ubuntu
[21:55] <nacc> porkstore: i think that's the default domain used by samba (iirc)
[21:55] <k1l_> porkstore: domain doesnt matte.r use the user and password you set on the other machine
[21:55] <JosephineBlack> and u like connect to windows?
[21:55] <porkstore> yeah that seems to be the case
[21:55] <nacc> porkstore: domain in this case is a windows-ism
[21:55] <porkstore> i am doing so k1l_ but not accepted
[21:55] <JosephineBlack> and the windows firewall lol*
[21:55] <porkstore> also tried root
[21:55] <JosephineBlack> or some Mcaffee tec.
[21:55] <pavlos> porkstore, you samba version is 4.3.11 (samba --version
[21:55] <pavlos> your
[21:56] <porkstore> yeah
[21:56] <nacc> porkstore: did you update /etc/samba/smb.conf (or verify its contents)?
[21:56] <JosephineBlack> and kind of windows os 7,8,10 etc.
[21:56] <nacc> porkstore: e.g., https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/serverguide/samba-fileserver.html
[21:57] <Capum321> Jordan_U: /media/username/partitionMountPointName/SomeFolder1/ChildFolder
[21:57] <nacc> porkstore: and possibly https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/serverguide/samba-fileprint-security.html
[21:57] <Bray90820> Can someone help me here my mouse/touchpad pointer changes position every time I try to move it
[21:58] <porkstore> is this related to my encrypted directories ?
[21:59] <pavlos> Capum321, did you figure out the ntfs issue?
[22:06] <porkstore> ok, i had to add a samba user
[22:06] <porkstore> this is really not very out of the box at all
[22:07] <nacc> porkstore: normally, you're using samba to connect to a network that also has windows machines
[22:07] <porkstore> it is working though !
[22:07] <nacc> porkstore: so you have AD or something running and want to auth to that
[22:07] <k1l_> porkstore: you wanted to use samba :)
[22:07] <nacc> porkstore: for ubuntu <-> ubuntu, samba is overkill (generally)
[22:07] <porkstore> yeah that's why i originally came in here wondering why ubuntu is leading me to even use samba
[22:07] <nacc> porkstore: although it does work, as you saw
[22:07] <porkstore> lol no i didn't want to use it
[22:07] <porkstore> but i was in a hurry
[22:08] <nacc> being in a hurry tends to lead to bad choices :)
[22:08] <nacc> porkstore: i would highly suggest you read the serverguide samba section
[22:08] <nacc> porkstore: and probably the samba docs as well
[22:08] <porkstore> preparing to copy 36,000 files
[22:08] <porkstore> i did consult the user guide
[22:08] <nacc> porkstore: are you just copying files between two computers?
[22:09] <porkstore> which is where i found out that i need a separate samba user
[22:09] <nacc> porkstore: i didn't say user guide, i said server guide :)
[22:09] <porkstore> that's what i meant, sorry
[22:09] <porkstore> yeah i am just copying files is there a better way
[22:09] <porkstore> they are on the same network, and i need to preserve directory structure
[22:10] <k1l_> rsync over ssh
[22:10] <Capum321> pavlos: no, i couldn't, Jordan_U left me alone
[22:10] <nacc> porkstore: rsync absolutely
[22:10] <porkstore> is that faster ?
[22:10] <nacc> porkstore: anything else, if just copying, is a waste of resources, afaict :) and a headache
[22:11] <k1l_> porkstore: why faster? last question was "what is safe and keeps directory structure"
[22:11] <nacc> porkstore: that's why it's good to start with a problem description (i'm trying to copy thousands of files between two ubuntu machines); rather than a description of what you tried (why isn't samba working). The latter can follow the former, but if it precedes it instead, it tends to lead down a path like the one you just did :)
[22:11] <porkstore> well faster is good too
[22:12] <porkstore> but i like the concept of rsync so i can keep 2 computers synced
[22:12] <pavlos> Capum321, this may help ... http://askubuntu.com/questions/113733/how-do-i-correctly-mount-a-ntfs-partition-in-etc-fstab
[22:13] <porkstore> so maybe what i sh ould do is let this transfer finish and then set up rsync later
[22:13] <Bray90820> Can someone help me here my mouse/touchpad jumps to the right edge of the screen every time I try to move it
[22:14] <porkstore> i guess rsync will require an ssh daemon
[22:14] <nacc> porkstore: if you do it over ssh yes
[22:15] <porkstore> ssh is the most secure robust thing i think
[22:15] <k1l_> porkstore: if you would actually read what people in here answer you then it would make more sense
[22:15] <porkstore> sorry, i am reading everything
 rsync over ssh
[22:15] <porkstore> missed that
[22:19] <Capum321> pavlos: i see, so a partition /dev/sdaX with `UUID=numbersequence /media/username/ntfsPart    ntfs-3g        auto,user,rw 0 0` isn't the best of the worlds?
[22:21] <check_> up-to-date xubuntu-16.04.1-i386, I installed zsync to sync iso, and on the two times I've run it my system has kernal-panic rebooted??
[22:21] <k1l_> check_: why 32bit OS?
[22:21] <check_> very-old P4
[22:22] <k1l_> uh
[22:22] <check_> ok time to bin the hardware
[22:22] <Capum321> pavlos, so I should remove `auto,user,rw` in place of the uid,gid,umask,(defaults?) ??
[22:24] <porkstore> u guys seem good at computer
 I'll dload the daily iso, reinstall and try again, see what happs!  thanks
[22:26] <Capum321> porkstore: but still i am underpayed anyway
[22:26] <Capum321> porkstore: who gives the ....
[22:27] <porkstore> perhaps you should get involved in the dark side
[22:28] <DP_rision> anyone familiar with ethminer
[22:28] <DP_rision> can't get it to run on my server
[22:31] <OerHeks> DP_rision, ethminer is not in our repos, what guide do you follow?
[22:33] <DP_rision> a pool guide
[22:33] <DP_rision> alrighty
[22:33] <DP_rision> https://ethereumpool.co/how/
[22:34] <pavlos> Capum321, I'd try mount as read only, then go for RW where you have to enter your credentials. 'man mount' explains those options
[22:34] <OerHeks> DP_rision, and on what ubuntu version and what videocard?
[22:34] <DP_rision> 14.02
[22:35] <DP_rision> i believe it's the quadro k50
[22:35] <DP_rision> nvidia
[22:35] <nacc> DP_rision: do you mean 14.04.2?
[22:35] <DP_rision> yeah that's what i mean
[22:35] <nacc> DP_rision: you should upgrade to 14.04.5 (probably unrelated to what you are seeing)
[22:35] <nacc> DP_rision: 14.04.2 is eol (aiui)
[22:35] <nacc> DP_rision: or at least, unsupported now
[22:36] <OerHeks> 14.04.5 is current, but that is a detail
[22:36] <DP_rision> yeah
[22:40] <OerHeks> DP_rision, maybe it is a bug in the latest build, ( build 6,5 hrs ago) ?
[22:41] <OerHeks> just guessing, with sparse info ..
[22:41] <brotherBox> does anyone else have trouble logging in to skype on ubuntu
[22:42] <pavlos> I used skype this morning, did not have any issues
[22:43] <brotherBox> because when i try to log in it takes a minute or two and then it returns an error message that the connection couldnt be established
[22:45] <OerHeks> skype never worked for me, someone should start a #skype-on-linux-issues channel
[22:45] <brotherBox> someone should make a free version of skype
[22:46] <k1l_> didnt mozilla make one? and there is ekiga or such things? and google got something? its just that skype was bought by microsoft
[22:47] <OerHeks> tons of them
[22:47] <pavlos> I used skype from my 14.04 laptop with video ... no issues.
[22:47] <brotherBox> can you login via skype credentals though
[22:48] <pavlos> yes, my userid and pw
[22:48] <brotherBox> if you know what i mea
[22:48] <Yoshimatsu> Ubuntu!
[22:48] <k1l_> brotherBox: do you mean the business version?
[22:48] <brotherBox> no, just the normal version of skype from ubuntu 14.04 repo
[22:49] <pavlos> when skype starts, it pops a light-blue-green window, enter userid, pw and I'm in.
[22:49] <pavlos> dont know the color name
[22:50] <brotherBox> i enter my pass and that swirly thing appears but it doesnt log in
[22:50] <brotherBox> after 2m i get returned to the prompt
[22:50] <brotherBox> stange
[22:51] <Capum321> pavlos: no, i mean what i do with `auto,user,rw` ?
[22:51] <pavlos> remove your ~/.Skype dir and re-install skype ... just a thought
[22:53] <pavlos> Capum321, try this ... /dev/sda2   /mnt/excess ntfs-3g    permissions,locale=en_US.utf8    0   2
[22:53] <Capum321> this is getting nowhere
[22:54] <Capum321> 'permissions', 'locale' ?
[22:56] <pavlos> Capum321, instead of 0 2, use uid=number,gid=number which should be your credentials (type id on a terminal)
[22:57] <pavlos> Capum321, the answer voted 47 times explains those
[22:57] <porkstore> do you guys think i have to remove the samba init files manually to disable samba on reboot ?
[22:58] <Capum321> oh, i miss the link
[22:58] <pavlos> Capum321, http://askubuntu.com/questions/113733/how-do-i-correctly-mount-a-ntfs-partition-in-etc-fstab
[23:00] <Yoshimatsu> Ubuntu!
[23:00] <Yoshimatsu> Is nice
[23:01] <gabriel_> helo !!!
[23:01] <pavlos> porkstore, sudo systemctl disable smbd
[23:02] <gabriel_> Brasil
[23:02] <Yoshimatsu> gabriel_, nice game!
[23:02] <Yoshimatsu> gabriel_, helo
[23:02] <k1l_> !br | gabriel_
[23:02] <Yoshimatsu> gabriel_, Gabriel Knight!
[23:05] <nacc> Yoshimatsu: please stop
[23:06] <Yoshimatsu> nacc, yes!
[23:06] <MonkeyDust> Yoshimatsu  stop
[23:06] <dodge29>
[23:07] <Yoshimatsu> !br
[23:07] <Yoshimatsu> ssorry
[23:08] <gabriel_> Why are they telling her to stop WHAT is she doing?
[23:09] <OerHeks> gabriel_, read the topic, this is ubuntu support only, not a chitchat fun channel
[23:09] <nacc> gabriel_: this is the Ubuntu support channel, please stay ontopic
[23:11] <gabriel_> I'm sorry not aware
[23:17] <Yoshimatsu> is there a ubuntu fun channel?
[23:17] <OerHeks> #ubuntu-offtopic
[23:18] <Yoshimatsu> thx
[23:19] <W0ndrC> exit
[23:19] <RlW> Goodnight guys
[23:27] <xodec> is anyone there ? i need help
[23:27] <OerHeks> !ask
[23:28] <kramun> hi, can someone help me boot 14.04 server custom with PXE?
[23:29] <kramun> as i am not using casper
[23:30] <germangirl> This one minute video is packed to the brim with crucial truth. A small tribe controls mass media and is using their power to destroy us.
[23:32] <kramun> I am getting the no boot media found if i boot it via memdisk, i understand that. but when i use the netboot initrd and  kernel, i can't install my custom iso, as it just installs the normal ubuntu via HTTP
[23:33] <bekks> kramun: I just setup my PXE here.
[23:33] <bekks> kramun: And I am using the netinstall along with a custom kickstart script.
[23:33] <kramun> bekks: so u know how i can boot into a ubuntu based custom image?
[23:34] <bekks> kramun: your custom changes are implemented using kickstart script?
[23:34] <kramun> i see, so u boot into netinst. and then u load your image via FTP or http?
[23:34] <kramun> no, it's actually a complete remastered image
[23:34] <bekks> kramun: I'm using http.
[23:35] <kramun> ok, so that's the way to go.... i thought i maybe can save to put it on my http-server
[23:35] <bekks> kramun: I put all my changes into a kickstart script, for being able to change the base image easily.
[23:35] <kramun> bekks: cuz nfs wasnt working
[23:36] <bekks> kramun: nfs is working fine here, too, after figuring that I'd need to use NFSv3 explicitely.
[23:36] <kramun> bekks: u changed the initrd or the kernel by yourself?
[23:36] <nacc> kramun: did you try what is suggested at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LiveCDNetboot ?
[23:36] <bekks> kramun: As a postinstall action, yes.
[23:37] <nacc> kramun: i'm not entirely sure i know what the use-case is, but kickstart/preseed might be an easier way to go than making a custom image
[23:37] <kramun> bekks: they always suggest the casper, which is not contained in my image
[23:37] <kramun> bekks: cuz i think it's the server version
[23:38] <bekks> kramun: casper was a mess in my testing phase :) Thats why I choose to go the kickstart way.
[23:38] <kramun> ok, thank you for your help, i can figure it out that way, i think, it has been a pain in the a** the last hours
[23:39] <kramun> so i will go with kickstart too, thanks a lot bekks :D
[23:39] <kramun> appreciate your help a lot
[23:39] <bekks> kramun: you're welcome
[23:39] <kramun> cu
[23:44] <porkstore> anyone know the name of the file manager that is a fork from nautilus
[23:44] <thesushimanoftao> hello room
[23:45] <k1l_> porkstore: nemo?
[23:45] <porkstore> i think it is nemo but i can't find nemo on my other computer that i thought was running it
[23:46] <thesushimanoftao> nemo
[23:46] <porkstore> maybe it's not called nemo
[23:46] <porkstore> i mean as a program
[23:46] <thesushimanoftao> http://www.webupd8.org/2016/03/nemo-with-unity-patches-available-for.html
[23:47] <porkstore> it is nemo
[23:47] <porkstore> but when i type which nemo i get nothing
[23:48] <steve973> Hello.  Is there a safe way to upgrade to kernel v 4.7 in xenial?
[23:49] <porkstore> oh i was ssh to another machine doh
[23:49] <nacc> steve973: define safe? not in any supported way
[23:49] <nacc> steve973: wait for 16.04.2 (which will have 4.8)
[23:49] <Jordan_U> steve973: What is your end goal?
[23:49] <cyphase> porkstore, so you were having trouble finding nemo?
[23:50] <steve973> I specifically run elementary os but it is based on xenial.
[23:50] <bekks> !elementaryos | steve973
[23:50] <bekks> !elementary | steve973
[23:50] <StrongJava> snort <IP_ADDRESS> is what comes with Ubuntu 16.04. Pulledpork requires (unless I hardcode the config) me to upgrade snort to <IP_ADDRESS>. Do I have to roll my own snort or is there another way to upgrade it?
[23:50] <steve973> Sure, I'm there too and also asked there, with no reply.
[23:51] <xodec> i am on manjaro i was on arch but i have problem with all linux distrus i can't use a high resolution in my monitor all drivers are good i tested them on samsung tv with HDMI all good but i have an adapter between pc monitor and GPU from DVI output I only have 1024x768 nowin my PC monitor
[23:51] <k1l_> xodec: ask manjoran support or ##linux
[23:51] <k1l_> *manjaro
[23:51] <xodec> same problem was on ubuntu
[23:52] <nacc> StrongJava: you will probably have to build your own
[23:52] <nacc> StrongJava: unless it's in a ppa
[23:52] <xodec> i think its EDID
[23:52] <k1l_> xodec: that is nothing we can change on arch or manjaro. so please ask them.
[23:52] <xodec> but how to fix it
[23:52] <Jordan_U> xodec: Please pastebin the output of "dmesg --human" from Ubuntu then. (Not from Manjaro or any other distro).
[23:52] <xodec> ok what is name of channel i am new
[23:53] <k1l_> xodec: ##linux for general linux support
[23:53] <StrongJava> nacc Good idea. Searching now.
[23:53] <xodec> ok tnx
[23:56] <masnell> xodec: AFAIK randr cmd lets you add or force resolution settings. Ur adapter from DVI to HDMI may be interfering with gfx card / vdu signal
[23:59] <jean_> I AM


[16:56] <OvenWerks> Just had a thought. Maybe not much we can do about it here
[16:58] <OvenWerks> but it sure would be nice if the Ladspa plugin packages could be split into ladspa plugins with no LV2 versions and then all the rest. I would really like not to have to look through all the LV1 plugs if there is already an LV2 of the same thing.
[16:58] <OvenWerks> Those who use only LV1s would of course need the whole pile.
[16:59] <OvenWerks> (LMMS, audacity, non* are some example that only do LV1)
[16:59] <OvenWerks> Someone who has better wording to make a debian bug could do that.
[17:57] <OvenWerks> One of the people on #ubuntustudio was asking about stereo imaging plugins. I find there is such a thing for linux: bs2b-ladspa which plays with the audio so it _should_ sound better in headphones.


[01:50] <designated> Can anyone tell me if configuration options are changed after deployment of an openstack charm, if that information will automatically get updated in the database?  As an example, will changing the VIP update the keystone endpoint list in the DB?
[04:02] <marcoceppi> designated: it should
[04:03] <marcoceppi> designated: however, there are a few configuration options that are immutable, I don't think that is one of them though
[10:54] <mwak_> hey
[12:24] <stub> Can I get a peer unit's public-address ?
[12:25] <stub> Hmm... I guess I can set it myself on the peer relation
[13:21] <marcoceppi_> stub: you'd have to set it on the wire
[13:21] <marcoceppi_> as you allueded to
[15:39] <mwak> marcoceppi_: ping.
[16:02] <dpb1> rick_h_: happy new year!  the store is out of date with bzr for https://jujucharms.com/landscape-client/trusty/10 and https://jujucharms.com/landscape-client/precise -- there are two more revisions for each
[16:04] <rick_h_> dpb1: otp will look
[16:06] <mbruzek> dpb1 did I see you committed changes to the landscape charm to fix automated testing errors?
[16:07] <dpb1> mbruzek: yes
[16:08] <mbruzek> dpb1 it is a happy new year
[16:08] <dpb1> hah
[16:08] <dpb1> :)
[16:19] <lazyPower> \o/
[18:22] <skay> logistics question. I've never submited MR for a charm. and also haven't used bzr much. do people prefer getting small logical MR for something, or is that a pain due to the review process?
[18:23] <skay> e.g. I want submit 2 changes in how pip is handled to the python django charm. 1. support extra args for pip. 2. stop using deprecated options
[18:24] <skay> in some projects, it would be the custom to submit those separately, what is the preference here?
[18:25] <lazyPower> skay: small chunks are fine for MR's
[18:25] <lazyPower> you can make chained dependencies on Merge proposals
[18:25] <lazyPower> the smaller the change, the more likely it is to be merged fairly quickly
[18:25] <skay> thanks lazyPower, I like small changes. (I didn't know about the chained thing)
[18:38] <skay> I forgot where in the docs it lists which config types are allowed. I would like to use a list, but I can't remember if that's allowed
[18:38] <skay> right now I do a split on ' ' or ',' in some places, and a list would probably be more natural
[18:39] <skay> oh derp. I found it. sorry for the trigger happy question
[18:46] <dpb1> rick_h_: gentle ping reminder. :)
[18:46] <rick_h_> dpb1: yes, just finished phone calls and starting to look.
[18:46] <dpb1> ty
[18:46] <rick_h_> dpb1: will be out first time using out fancy ingestion log so looking up how we can use it.
[18:47] <dpb1> oooh, hopefully it's easier this time!
[19:11] <rick_h_> dpb1: these were updated a while ago?
[19:12] <dpb1> let me check the revno
[19:12] <rick_h_> looks like back mid-dec
[19:12] <dpb1> ya, sounds right
[19:12] <rick_h_> trying to see how far back I can get logs for
[19:12] <rick_h_> logging every 15min means that's a while back
[19:12] <dpb1> :)
[19:12] <rick_h_> did find this for you as an fyi https://pastebin.canonical.com/122931/
[19:24] <dpb1> rick_h_: ok... will look at that as I work up the stack
[19:27] <rick_h_> dpb1: well the good news is I found the logs from that timeframe
[19:27] <rick_h_> dpb1: the bad news is that I don't see any reference to your charms in any warning/error logs so no closer to knowing wtf
[19:28] <dpb1> :(
[19:28] <rick_h_> dpb1: so creating a card and will get it assigned to chase it down but probably more time than a quick "oh, there's your problem"
[19:29] <dpb1> rick_h_: ok, thanks for looking. it's not super urgent, as long as we get it fixed.
[19:29] <rick_h_> promise that
[20:23] <skay> \o/ yay, I submitted a small merge request for python-django.
[20:23] <skay> does the ci job get kicked off automatically, or do I need to ask for it here?
[20:39] <jcastro> anyone: I've got a PR to juju-solutions.github.io to add a containers page if someone wants to ack it pls.
[21:48] <marcoceppi_> skay: it'll be kicked off by whoever is doing review
[21:49] <lazyPower> marcoceppi_: mbruzek: https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-core/+bug/1408467
[21:49] <mup> Bug #1408467: juju help-tool does not reflect all options available to relation-set <audit> <docs> <help> <juju> <papercut> <juju-core:Confirmed> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1408467>
[21:50] <mbruzek> Oh I hate that bug!
[21:50] <mbruzek> We should fix that one!
[21:51] <marcoceppi_> bah, what a horrid bug!
[22:03] <johnny_shieh> learning to write charms following tutorial found on web
[22:03] <johnny_shieh> can create/launch the demo wordpress
[22:04] <johnny_shieh> would like to log into container
[22:04] <lazyPower> johnny_shieh: if you dont mind me asking, which tutorial are you following?
[22:04] <johnny_shieh> but ssh <ipaddress> fails with permissions issue.
[22:04] <lazyPower> johnny_shieh: try doing juju ssh service/#
[22:04] <lazyPower> eg: juju ssh wordpress/0
[22:04] <johnny_shieh> https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/
[22:05] <johnny_shieh> hmmm, let me try
[22:05] <mbruzek> https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju-gui/+bug/1408472
[22:05] <mup> Bug #1408472: The juju-run command on the unit does not have help  <docs> <help> <juju> <papercut> <juju-gui:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1408472>
[22:05] <lazyPower> Oo another one!
[22:05] <lazyPower> we should fix that one too
[22:05] <mbruzek> I know!  ... Right?!
[22:06] <johnny_shieh> thanks lazyPower
[22:06] <johnny_shieh> worked
[22:06]  * lazyPower hat tips
[22:07] <johnny_shieh> thx for help, be back in a few days with actual, real problems.  ha-ha
[22:11]  * arosales heads over to the review can for some review time.
[22:11] <arosales> s/can/queue
[22:12] <arosales> marcoceppi_:  mbruzek: any ideas/opions on how we should handle the MPs for tests that are currently failing auto test?
[22:12] <arosales> marcoceppi_: mbruzek: I presume these are due to the charm and not the test as the charm tests do not touch the charm code.
[22:13] <arosales> it seems like it would be good to have these tests included in a charm that failing. Specifically, when someone comes along to fix it then can run the tests and have seed tests to build off from.
[22:13] <mbruzek> arosales: tvansteenburgh had some strong opinions
[22:13] <mbruzek> on this subject.
[22:14] <mbruzek> arosales: I reluctantly agree with you and tvansteenburgh
[22:14] <mbruzek> But that still feels "bad"
[22:15] <arosales> mbruzek: is the concern that the charm is failing auto charm testing but the MP is still accepted?
[22:15] <mbruzek> arosales: yes because that sets a bad precedent, other folks are going to ask them to merge their changes while the tests STILL fail
[22:17] <arosales> mbruzek: I see that point. Whats interesting here is that for tests they don't touch charm code.
[22:17] <arosales> and in the case for failing tests adding tests actaully may help debug the charm.
[22:17] <mbruzek> arosales: agreed
[22:17] <arosales> my opinion is that it helps get the charm into a better passing state
[22:17] <arosales> so the decision is to nack or ack the MP
[22:18] <arosales> on the one had if you nack, then the next person doesn't have seed tests or a charm tests to run against the charm to see what the failure was
[22:18] <arosales> on the other hand if you ack, then at least the next person has a test to run and try to reproduce and a seed test to build off from.
[22:18]  * arosales 2 cents
[22:19] <mbruzek> arosales: we already get requests to merge MPs that fail charm proof, or other minor problems that "the change did not touch"
[22:19] <arosales> are those tests or charm code?
[22:20] <arosales> jose, dbp, marcoceppi_, mbruzek, lazyPower, niedbalski, tvansteenburgh, lazyPower: any opinons ^
[22:20] <mbruzek> charm code, that someone is adding, they say since they didn't make the charm proof any worse they want their MP merged
[22:21] <arosales> its a fair question and good point for not accepting the charm test.
[22:21] <tvansteenburgh> if adding tests to to a charm that has none, i'd merge even if they fail
[22:21] <tvansteenburgh> b/c at least now we know there's a problem
[22:21] <arosales> my 2 cents is that the charm tests actaully help get the charm into a good state (passing tests) and thus should be accepted there. A charm code MP may not be able to state that, in general.
[22:21] <mbruzek> arosales: to be clear I agree with you and tvansteenburgh, we should merge the failing tests
[22:22] <arosales> mbruzek: I appreciate you are trying to weight both sides.
[22:22] <arosales> My proposal is to get a few charms, at least 3, to agree so we can clear out the queue with these MPs.
[22:23] <arosales> been in there far too long
[22:23] <arosales> so two charmers +1 any others?
[22:23] <mbruzek> we should resume this conversation when marcoceppi_ has a chance to comment.  I suspect he has strong feelings one way or the other.
[22:23]  * mbruzek believe marcoceppi_ is eating now.
[22:25] <mbruzek> the force is strong with that one
[22:25] <tvansteenburgh> he agrees
[22:25]  * arosales pinged other charmers too
[22:25] <arosales> at least the ones I could recall.
[22:26]  * arosales will wait patiently
[22:26] <arosales> tvansteenburgh: mbruzek: in the mean time is there any thing I can to to help wth those MPs?
[22:26] <arosales> leave a comment in them or does a charmer just need to take action on them once the decsion is made?
[22:27] <mbruzek> pull requests to fix why the test is failing
[22:27] <mbruzek> In the end that is what we are after
[22:27] <tvansteenburgh> :)
[22:27] <arosales> lol mbruzek
[22:27] <arosales> nice one
[22:27] <mbruzek> You can pull request against me or marco's branch to fix the test
[22:27] <mbruzek> or pull request against the charm.
[22:28] <arosales> understood :-)
[22:34] <arosales> marcoceppi_: when you return, for lp 1387465 can you let me now what action is needed to get this item out of the queue?
[22:34] <arosales> marcoceppi_: same thing for 1387467
[22:40]  * arosales taking a +1 look @ 1396237
[22:44] <lazyPower> wat
[22:47] <lamont> lazyPower: brain dump to follow...
[22:47] <lazyPower> mbruzek: ^
[22:49] <lamont> what we have: maas node with 2ea openvpn-server charms and 1 openvpn-p2p charm forced onto one node (along with a few subordinates).  the other side of the p2p link is outside of maas/juju, as is the entire pki infra.  ergo, the openvpn-server and p2p charms have a bunch of config vars to delvier ca.crt and host key/cert and such
[22:49] <lamont> which makes reading/deploying the charms problematic for someone using just juju (no PKI wat?)
[22:50] <lamont> enter the openvpn-pki charm, which optionally relates to the other 2, and provides a PKI infra (most notably, today it delivers the ssh pubkey and IP address that will be doing the syncing)
[22:51] <lamont> currently coded as "when this relation comes up, dump some config vars into a file on the unit, and silently override the juju config variables with the actual answers from the openvpn-pki unit)
[22:51] <lazyPower> lamont: i can understand the situation you're trying to solve - however relationship data should not overwrite config data coming from teh user - that alone would get a nack on a charm review. My thoughts would be if you have a third party PKI utility - it should either proxy the information in from your existing infra, or allow those bits to be set by the user, that way the onus of where the config is coming from is not on the openvpn server
[22:51] <lazyPower> itself but on the PKI charm you're relating to the unit. In which case - depending on if its coming from a proxy or being set by the user is dependent on how the charm is deployed
[22:51] <lamont> which is vomitworthy
[22:51] <lazyPower> and you could then send that information via the relationship to openvpn and not worry about this
[22:53] <lazyPower> this way both scenarios are modeled in the juju language, and both are actionable
[22:53] <mbruzek> So lamont what happens to the ca.cert if the user sets a ca.cert on the openvpn charm and then the openvpn-pki charm comes by with a different ca.cert?
[22:53] <lazyPower> you can then say "if user config data" is present, that will override any relationship data - so it follows the juju tenants, and if that data is not present, it sends the data from the proxy
[22:54] <lamont> I was just thinking...  how horrible would it be to have the charm behave correctly, and then have a subordinate charm that eliminates the need for a relationship to openvpn-pki?
[22:54] <lazyPower> a subordinate woudl be a fine approach too - you dont necessarily need to tie up a unit for data-pass
[22:54] <lazyPower> actually - a sub would be the preferred route forward
[22:54] <lamont> mbruzek: as it sits, openvpn-pki wins:  code says "conf = config(); if-file-exists { read yaml and overwrite into conf}'
[22:55] <mbruzek> lamont that would break the user experience.
[22:55] <lamont> mbruzek: hence the "how much would you guys scream" that brought me here...
[22:55] <lazyPower> lamont: <3
[22:56] <mbruzek> lamont: if a user sets something with config-set or from the gui we should do EVERYTHING possible to preserve that
[22:57] <lamont> if I understand this, the correct solution is: openvpn-pki <-> openvpn-{server,p2p} quietly delivers the info over the relation (and server/p2p spill it to a file which is used in config), and an "openvpn-external-pki" subordinate provides all of the variables for juju set to let a non-juju pki be used instead of the charm.
[22:57] <mbruzek> Making the user know/care about the order of charms deployed is ALWAYS a "bad idea"
[22:57] <lamont> and server/p2p do not have settable variables for the pki meta
[22:58] <lamont> mbruzek: If it helps, I was feeling dirty.
[22:58] <lazyPower> lamont: that soudns correct to me in the ascii diagram above - the subordinate allows for you to either proxy the info in or configure it, correct?
[22:58] <mbruzek> lamont: clean your self up this is a family show.
[22:58] <lamont> it felt _wrong_, which led me to seek help
[22:59] <lamont> so that summary sounds right?
[22:59] <mbruzek> lamont: Yes I like you ascii diagram solution
[22:59] <lamont> ascii ftw
[22:59] <lamont> all of which means I have my work cut out for me.
[22:59] <mbruzek> lamont: dont' forget to write the README.md too.
[23:00] <lamont> and stupid question: subordinate charms... will I need a relationship there, too?
[23:00] <mbruzek> The openvpn-p2p readme was VERY sparse
[23:00] <lazyPower> well, *good* charms can be difficult to write as complexity grows. but a bundle/bundle(s) will make this simple for users to get setup and moving with, and we'll give you much fanfare when it lands
[23:00] <lamont> mbruzek: there is this significant feedback item about how terse (or, conversely, verbose) my explanations are.  working onit.
[23:01] <lazyPower> lamont: expect some blogging / an instructional video when it lands tho - we'll give ya the red carpet for your efforts.
[23:01] <mbruzek> lamont: subordinate charms relate on the juju-info relationship to a container charm (non subordinate)
[23:01]  * lamont still gets grief from a former coworker from many years ago for a program of several hundred lines, with the singular comment "do stuff" in it.
[23:01] <mbruzek> lamont: so you get the subordinate relationship for "free"
[23:02] <sarnold> lamont: at least it wasn't misleading or incorrect, right? :)
[23:02] <lamont> mbruzek: for the charm writer of poor literacy.... does that mean that config() in the container charm returns the set variables from the subordinate?
[23:03] <mbruzek> lamont: something that lazyPower and I talked about just *today* was that subordinates can have peers too, so one subordinate can be related to different container charms and the subordinates can use the peer relation
[23:03] <lamont> sarnold: fact
[23:03] <lamont> actually, hrm.
[23:03] <lazyPower> sarnold: *rimshots*
[23:03] <lazyPower> o/
[23:03] <skay> hehe do stuff
[23:03] <lamont> sarnold: it's from the "self documenting code" era
[23:04] <skay> I like "read my mind and do what I want"
[23:04] <lazyPower> lamont: re: your question to mbruzek - no, config() will continue to only return the config data from that charm. Data being sent over the wire is in relation-get
[23:04] <lamont> sarnold: that code used a 400MB (yes, MB) disk to transfer files between a un*x box and a non-un*x box.  beacuse of reasons
[23:05] <lamont> lazyPower: and the relation is "just there" by right of the subordination?
[23:05] <lazyPower> lamont: now we're talking about interfaces and properly consuming/documenting interfaces+data in the readme/contributing documents. But when you get to that point, feel free to tap me in and i'll help.
[23:05] <lazyPower> you define it by every variable you send OTW via relation-set
[23:05] <sarnold> lamont: at least it wasn't "literate programming".. I'll take self-documenting code any day :)
[23:05] <lazyPower> this is why its super important to document it, otherwise users have to read teh code to know what its doing, and we as charmers will hate you forever. we already have a truckload of interfaces to document
[23:05] <mbruzek> lamont: re: config - No the subordinate configuration are not in the container charm's config
[23:05] <lamont> lazyPower: I'm guessing that I still need Provides/Requires?
[23:06] <lazyPower> lamont: thats depreciated, its the wild west with interfaces - no forced gets/sets
[23:06]  * lamont drops the side conversation with sarnold. :p
[23:06] <lazyPower> its even been removed from the documentation
[23:06] <lazyPower> you just arbitrarily set them, and consume them
[23:06] <lazyPower> skay: sounds about right :D
[23:06] <lamont> ok.  this'll be fun. :D
[23:07] <lamont> config-changed only triggers on juju set, correct?
[23:07] <lazyPower> config-changed triggers when the charm config changed
[23:07] <lazyPower> so 'yes' to juju-set triggering it
[23:07] <lazyPower> but it also runs after install and upgrade-charm
[23:07] <mbruzek> lamont:  don't forget the gui
[23:08] <lamont> mbruzek: right.  was thinking api-speak.
[23:08] <lazyPower> relation-name-changed triggers when relation-set is called on any of teh charms in the relationship chain "do stuff" that sets a variable.
[23:08] <lamont> sometimes, I hate computers
[23:08] <lamont> lazyPower: and (duh) relation-setting doesn't trigger config-changed
[23:09] <lamont> is it true that both hooks will never run concurrently? (only one hook to a unit, at a time, yes?)
[23:09] <lazyPower> correct
[23:10] <lamont> what I really want is a juju status item that says "and no hooks are queued or running at this time"
[23:10] <lamont> (though there could be one queued/starting right after the status, don't care)
[23:10] <lazyPower> lamont: we all want that. its a work item in the near cycle(s) to get better information from status about whats going on in the unit
[23:11] <lamont> \o/
[23:11] <lamont> with that, time to go rewrite some charms.
[23:14] <lazyPower> lamont: all the best o/ cheers
[23:20] <lamont> example of a subordinate charm that does things by the new /current method?
[23:21] <lazyPower> lamont: one doesn't exist as we dont have many/any ['proxy','configurable'] subordinates that I'm aware of. But again, tap me in and I can help when you get to writing the hooks
[23:22] <lazyPower> and/or planning of said charm
[23:22] <lamont> ah, well... that'd be "about now", since it basically consists of ripping out a bunch of config vars from openvpn-serfver and creating said charm.
[23:22] <lamont> here, or /pm?
[23:23] <lazyPower> Lets do it here so others can benefit from our riffing
[23:24] <lamont> ok.
[23:24] <lamont> categories:
[23:24] <lamont>   - misc
[23:24] <lamont> subordinate: true
[23:24] <lamont> :D
[23:24] <lazyPower> you'll need to add a requires relation that is scope: container
[23:24] <lazyPower> https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/authors-subordinate-services.html
[23:25] <lamont> requires:
[23:25] <lamont>   openvpn-pki-recipient:
[23:25] <lamont>     interface: openvpn-pki-sync
[23:25] <lamont>     scope: container
[23:25] <lamont> cool
[23:25] <lazyPower> ok, so you've now got an openvpn-pki-recipient ['joined','changed','broken','departed'] relationship on both sides
[23:25] <lazyPower> the subordinate unit itself shoudl relation-set the relevant parts, if its coming from proxy or from user config (possibly both are user config, depends on how you build it)
[23:26] <lazyPower> and the openvpn-pki-recipient service itself will need to consume whats being sent via relation-set
[23:26] <marcoceppi_> mbruzek: why is lp 1408472 targeted at juju-gui?
[23:26] <lazyPower> seem straight forward enough?
[23:26] <lazyPower> (so far anyway)
[23:26] <lamont> lazyPower: yep
[23:26] <lamont> ta
[23:27] <arosales> lazyPower: any opinions on the earlier conversation on approving MPs that only add tests even though the charm is failing those tests?
[23:27] <lamont> in config-changed (yes), how do I find the relations(s) to do the relation-set calls? (python, with charmhelpers)
[23:27] <mbruzek> marcoceppi_: because I made a mistake
[23:28] <lamont> lazyPower: (in a clean/current way - I'm learning that nagios-external-master is not a charm to crib from)
[23:28] <mbruzek> no
[23:29] <marcoceppi_> arosales: I just linked a new branch and initiated tests against the new branch so that we can know if it passes or not for 1387465.  1387467 needs another test run executed. I just queued it up
[23:29] <mbruzek> lamont: we have several flagbearer charms
[23:29] <marcoceppi_> mbruzek: <3
[23:29] <lazyPower> mbruzek: fyi - rails is not one of them, i've gone back through and started re-working that one, so anyone asking about chef - send them to me direct until I can get the charm reworked and the docs updated to reflect the new pattern i'm working on.
[23:30] <marcoceppi_> arosales: I'm a plus one, but we have another issue steming from that. Whos responsible to fix that? Should we hault all further changes to that branch until someone fixes it? or just keep merging things that address issues even though the tests continually fail
[23:30] <arosales> marcoceppi_: once those tests are done for 1387465 and 1387467 will those fall out ofthe queue. Seems odd they are still in the queue even though the bug is marked as "Fix Released"
[23:30] <mbruzek> lamont: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/servercloud-s-juju-flag-bearer-charms
[23:31] <lamont> ta
[23:31] <marcoceppi_> arosales: that is weird.
[23:31] <mbruzek> personally I recommend the lamp charm for the tests, but I don't remember if the _charm_ code is any good
[23:31] <marcoceppi_> arosales: one sec
[23:31] <arosales> marcoceppi_: in regards to charm tests. Per policy https://jujucharms.com/docs/charm-unmaintained-process
[23:31]  * mbruzek knows the tests are "awesome" because he wrote them.
[23:32] <mbruzek> That is all from me tonight, I have guests coming over and need to go for the evening.
[23:32] <lazyPower> oh nice - rails didnt make the list. <3
[23:32] <arosales> if the charm continues to fail tests (ie deploy is broken) then it becomes a candidate to move into un-maintained if no action is take on it to fix it
[23:32]  * mbruzek waves
[23:32] <lazyPower> i'll get that fixored eventually
[23:32] <lazyPower> arosales: how long is that period after we start accepting contributions? anotehr 15 day grace period?
[23:32] <marcoceppi_> arosales: fixed
[23:33] <arosales> marcoceppi_: thanks I don't see them in the queue anymore
[23:33] <arosales> lazyPower: sorry I didn't properly parse your question
[23:34]  * marcoceppi_ decides to do a bunch of fixes to the review queue tonight
[23:34] <arosales> lazyPower: in regards to unmaintained charms; if a bug is logged against a charm and no action is taken to fix it 1 month after the bug is failed the charm will then be moved into the unmaintained branch.
[23:35] <lazyPower> arosales: right - but you were saying if the tests continually fail
[23:35] <lazyPower> at this point, we know there is an issue with the charm when we start accepting these contributions cognisent of them having failing tests
[23:35] <arosales> lazyPower: ah
[23:35] <lazyPower> it doesn't seem right to just merge that in and reset the countdown timer on unmaintained.  Maybe i'm being a stickler though
[23:35] <arosales> the way I read policy is that if active work is going on in the charm then the charm is not a candidate for unmaintained
[23:36] <arosales> the issue is when there is a bug against a charm and no work is being done to address it
[23:36] <lazyPower> 10-4
[23:36] <lazyPower> so if i'm reading htis properly - we file a bug about the failing test
[23:36] <lazyPower> if nobody comes around to fix that, but they keep adding MP's we just ignore the failing test for the time being until someone gets around to fixing it
[23:36] <arosales> currently auto testing will only run against a charm when there is a MP agaist it which would signal an effort to bring the charm into good standing.
[23:37] <lazyPower> ok, i mean seems fair enough as we dont really know what the community at large will do with this information against their charms, we only have a handfull right now failing tests right? ~ 30 or so?
[23:37] <lazyPower> or am i looking at the wrong data sheet
[23:38] <arosales> ya, I think it was around 30
[23:38] <marcoceppi> I hope to add failing charms in to the review queue soon
[23:38] <marcoceppi> as a section
[23:38] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: <3 you and the rev queue magic, all the new queues and what not
[23:38] <marcoceppi> yeah...as soon as they show up...one day
[23:38] <lazyPower> marcoceppi: i have an idea that we kind of riffed out tonight about the store + recommended that I want to send to teh charmers team for pre-feedback in the near future
[23:38] <marcoceppi> lazyPower: okay, there is the monthly thingy
[23:38] <lazyPower> it will address a few different areas that we're experiencing pain in one move
[23:38] <lazyPower> we are still doing that?
[23:39] <lazyPower> i thought we didnt want to do that
[23:39] <arosales> lazyPower: so to mbruzek's earlier point if an MP comes in and touches charm code but the charm tests are failing a charmer would need to decide if that MP should be accepted
[23:39] <arosales> lazyPower: so I don't think we should ignore the failing tests
[23:39] <lazyPower> arosales: i'll put on my "take me seriously hat" and put googley eyes on the review about the tests.
[23:39] <arosales> but what we shouldn't do is move the charm into unmainted as there is "active" work on it.
[23:39] <lazyPower> yeah, i'm +1 for that... We already have a high bar for getting into recommended status
[23:40] <lazyPower> if we just start nuking charms because we have a stickler for tests, we will be alienating people working
[23:40] <arosales> ya moving to unmaintained is really a last resort when a charm is broken and there is zero work to bring the charm back  to a working state.
[23:41]  * lazyPower recalls there being a yoda image at one point that summed it up nicely
[23:41] <arosales> the thought being that the recommeded charm store should always have charms that are in a working state or at least a state of being fixed
[23:41] <lazyPower> well i'm a fan of ~recommended being the de-facto best of the best
[23:42] <lazyPower> namespaces are around for the rest, for in-dev, community love, and development focus
[23:42] <arosales> so lazyPower marcoceppi: my original question to the charmers team is do you guys agree the oustanding MPs in the queue to add tests should be accepted even though the charm is failing tests?
[23:42] <lazyPower> but this is starting to touch on what i want to riff with marcoceppi and other ~charmers about - kind of our curation process and bits - but it is goign to take a lot fo fleshing out as i'm sur ei've got gaps in what i'm thinking.
[23:43] <arosales> my comment was that the tests actually help get the charm fixed as it provides a reproducibile failing environment, and add seed tests to the next person wanting to improve the charm. Plus the tests don't touch charm code.
[23:43] <marcoceppi> arosales: I agree, but with reservations
[23:43] <lazyPower> arosales: yeah, if there's work going on towards a charm - and it doesnt effect the tests - file a bug against the charm about tests and move on
[23:43] <lazyPower> keep making it happen
[23:43] <lazyPower> marco will have a test failure queue soon(ish) that we can address when we have more info about longevity of a charms failure rates
[23:43] <arosales> lazyPower: in this case we don't know if there is work on the charm outside of the tests
[23:44] <arosales> we only know that marcoceppi and mbruzek added seed tests to charms
[23:44] <lazyPower> welp, getting the tests in there is the first step right?
[23:44] <arosales> some of those charms fail the tests
[23:44] <arosales> so we got a load of those in the charm queue
[23:44] <lazyPower> seems wrong to stop progress at step 1 if we have a course of action to completion
[23:44] <arosales> and we just need to make a decision to nack or ack those
[23:44] <marcoceppi> I was going to say it's the author of the tests job to fix the charm
[23:44] <marcoceppi> then I realized how much more work that was for me
[23:44] <marcoceppi> and decided to not say that
[23:44] <marcoceppi> except right then
[23:44] <arosales> lazyPower: agreed
[23:44] <marcoceppi> when I said it
[23:45] <lazyPower> arosales: because that basically says "We gave basic deploy tests, and its failing - so due dilligence is needed. No maintainers in 30 days step up? time to hit the eject button"
[23:45] <lazyPower> this will do a couple things
[23:45] <lazyPower> ditch some old charms people dont want to undertake updating, and give us metrics to empower the decision
[23:45] <lazyPower> and i'm all for making data driven decisions
[23:45] <arosales> lazyPower: ya I agree it helps get the charm into a fixed state by first identiying there is a problem
[23:46] <lazyPower> arosales: so, can we make that the workflow? file a bug after the MP lands with the failing est
[23:46] <arosales> thus my proposal is for the charmers to accept charm tests even if the charm is failing those tests
[23:46] <lazyPower> and that kicks off the countdown timer
[23:46] <lazyPower> arosales: i'll be happy to go through and verify everything that i run across during review time if you leave a breadcrumb trail that its been filed and identified as a failure
[23:46] <lazyPower> and we can pass off a notice to other charmers that this is what we are donig
[23:46] <lazyPower> *doing
[23:47] <arosales> lazyPower: so all the charms @ http://review.juju.solutions/
[23:47] <lazyPower> arosales: woo all of them are failing? hooo boy
[23:47]  * lazyPower puts on his firemans hat
[23:47] <arosales> from mbruzek and marcoceppi with "add-tests" or "tests" branch are what need approval
[23:47] <lazyPower> 10-4
[23:47] <lazyPower> if you pre-triage i'll follow behind you before i EOD or first thing tomorrow
[23:47] <lazyPower> i still owe for review this week - i managed to miss my slot on Tuesday
[23:47] <arosales> also tvansteenburgh and mbruzek +1ed accepting these tests
[23:47] <arosales> jsut wanted at least charmers to +1
[23:48] <lazyPower> yeah, still need votes from jose, dpb1, and niedbalski if they are around and want to chime in
[23:48] <lazyPower> but i'm all for it
[23:48] <arosales> so if lazyPower and marcoceppi +1 then it sounds like it ok for your to accept these tests for the above reasons
[23:48] <lazyPower> you sold me, good salesmanship
[23:48]  * arosales already pinged them ealier
[23:48] <lazyPower> ah, then we'll silently discard those votes if they are negative ;)
[23:49] <arosales> no replies yet
[23:49] <lazyPower> <3 if they read scrollback
[23:49] <arosales> well you have the majority of charmers +1ing it
[23:49] <arosales> but I would be interested to hear an objection if there is one
[23:50] <lazyPower> yeah i'm just being obtuse. its late in the day.
[23:50]  * lazyPower goes back to hacking on subordinate logic
[23:50] <arosales> lazyPower: I am happy to traige those test MP,  what specific action do you need from me a +1 on the syntax of the charm tests?
[23:51] <lazyPower> I would say that, and i'll go through and add bugs to the charms when the MP's land for failing tests
[23:51] <lazyPower> that way its part of my wrap-up email to the list
[23:51] <lazyPower> which can serve as day 1 of notice
[23:51] <lazyPower> 30 days to fix failing tests, unless other active dev is going on - if active dev is going on - they get an extension to fix the tests basically. but it puts us 1 step closer to trimming the warts on the store.
[23:52] <arosales> sounds good
[23:52] <arosales> I am going to finish up my review of OpenID/SSO  and then work on the testing MPs
[23:52] <arosales> lazyPower: thanks!
[23:52]  * lazyPower hat tips


[02:43] <blar> hey all, i'm trying to install the java development kit so i can work with the google web toolkit, but i'm having some problems
[02:44] <blar> could anyone lend some assistance?


[08:36]  * apw watches 100s MB of updated download
[08:52] <smb> Which was even there yesterday...
[08:53] <smb> including just a new gcc... nothing to worry about...
[08:56] <apw> smb, was that my '100s MB of updates' you are talking about ?
[08:56] <apw> are you seeing "waiting for network configuration" as a plymouth message during boot?
[08:56] <smb> apw, Only when my network is bust usually
[08:57] <smb> So by now its a bad sign to me if I see it
[08:57] <apw> smb, this is on everything and on multiple networks all of a suddent
[08:58] <smb> Hm, strange. But then you don't see the waiting 60s more message?
[08:58] <smb> And your network is up when you log in?
[08:59] <smb> apw, ^
[08:59] <apw> yep just a single message
[09:01] <smb> The question now is whether it is always there and just now long enough for you to notice or whether it gets printed when network setup is delayed for a certain time
[09:01] <smb> any way, something seems slower for you
[09:02] <apw> i don't normally see any messages on the boot screen other than whn its doing an fsck
[09:02] <apw> this message i have never seen before, and indeed i thought networks were done after you logged in
[09:03] <smb> apw, No that changed a while ago
[09:03] <smb> Even with nm, your network was running even you being on the lightdm or gdm screen
[09:04] <apw> ok, still never ever seen that message with network or without
[09:04] <apw> and its all of a sudden on both my main machines and with two different network setups
[09:05] <smb> ok, so something became slower. I assume just this mornings update (if one can say just to that)
[10:25] <smb> apw, Hm, finished updating a test laptop and I do not see that message in my environment
[10:25] <apw> smb, hrm, will do the same in a bit
[10:26] <smb> apw, ok
[10:26] <smb> cking, we are talking to you
[10:27] <apw> cking, we heard you, a bit at least
[10:27]  * cking gives mumble a kick
[11:09] <ppisati> brb
[12:34]  * apw loses mumble too
[12:34] <apw> wtf is with this stuff these days
[12:35] <ogra_> its all hangouts now anyway :(
[12:36] <apw> bah
[13:38] <awe> cking: ping
[13:59] <cking> awe, pong
[14:01] <awe> hi
[14:01] <awe> so my machines has shutdown on me a few times in the last week
[14:01] <awe> I tracked it down to excessive CPU temp
[14:01] <awe> I was going to enter a bug against the kernel this morning, but noticed a new kernel was released
[14:02] <awe> should I wait to hit the bug again before reporting?
[14:02] <awe> ( also can it really be considered a kernel bug? )
[14:03] <cking> awe I'd say file a bug so at least we can track this
[14:03] <cking> you are not the first to report this
[14:03] <awe> ok
[14:03] <awe> thanks
[14:03] <awe> is there already a bug?
[14:04] <cking> awe, file a new bug, as I expect your H/W is different
[14:04] <awe> right
[14:04] <awe> will do
[14:06] <cking> awe, I have a bunch of things for you to try, which will help me corner this issue
[14:06] <awe> ok
[14:06] <awe> I'm in crunch mode right now, but will file a bug today
[14:06] <cking> ack
[14:07] <awe> ttyl
[14:07] <pgraner> sforshee, ping
[14:08] <sforshee> pgraner, hi
[14:08] <pgraner> sforshee, hey, so I think the mystery of the dropping wifi is solved
[14:09] <sforshee> really! what's causing it?
[14:09] <pgraner> sforshee, I checked yesterday and running up2date precise kernel it happened twice yesterday on that netbook
[14:10] <pgraner> I found https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/937118
[14:10] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 937118 in linux "Wireless stops passing packets" [High,Confirmed]
[14:10] <pgraner> and  mainline 3.3.0-030300rc6-generic  has made it work
[14:11] <jsalisbury> pgraner, sforshee yeah, the  linux-backports-modules-cw-3.3-precise-generic package solved that bug because the bug was fixed upstream.
[14:11] <pgraner> looks like its a dd-wrt issue and I'm guessing whatever it is exists on the cisco fw we use at events
[14:11] <pgraner> sforshee, Its been running now for over 8 hours and no issue
[14:12] <pgraner> sforshee, I could trigger it here in a matter of 2-3 hours
[14:12] <sforshee> pgraner, interesting. I use dd-wrt on one of my routers, but it wasn't the one I was using to test that machine.
[14:12] <sforshee> we may want to bisect then to see what fixed it so we can backport it to precise
[14:13] <pgraner> jsalisbury, sounds like a job for you my friend :-D
[14:13] <jsalisbury> pgraner, sforshee will do.  I think it may be this that fixed it: eea79e0713d94b02952f6c591b615710fd40a562
[14:14] <jsalisbury> pgraner, sforshee But I didn't do an actual bisect yet.  I came up with that commit after reviewing the git log.
[14:14] <sforshee> jsalisbury, that's a merge commit, so it's not _the_ fix
[14:14] <sforshee> it's just when the fix got merged to linus's tree
[14:14] <jsalisbury> sforshee, ahh right.  So a bisect of the merge commit will need to be done.
[14:16] <cking> awe, can you boot with an oneiric kernel and see if the overheating re-occurs?
[14:16] <awe> cking, let me catch you in a few minutes...
[14:18] <awe> cking, I've only hit it twice in the last week...
[14:18] <awe> unfortunately it's not reproduce on demand.  ;(
[14:19] <cking> awe, well, I can write up a bunch of things to try once you've file a bug ;-)
[14:20] <awe> cking, ok cool
[14:40] <akgraner> apw, cking - still no crash today - and I've been stressing my machine pretty hard over the last couple of days - the fan thing seems to have fixed it
[14:41] <cking> akgraner, that wasn't a fix, it was step #1 in me seeing what the problem could be - I've updated the bug - can you try the next step as instructed
[14:43] <akgraner> cking, sure
[14:43] <cking> thanks!
[14:43] <akgraner> sorry I didn't see it sooner - I thought I would get an email when someone comments on it...weird
[14:43] <cking> akgraner, LP email isn't instantaneous at times
[14:44] <akgraner> cking, I didn't need to update a filter :-)
[14:44] <akgraner> ugh
[14:45] <akgraner> I meant - I did  get it - just need to update my filters - English and typing fail today it seems
[14:49] <cking> ah, no worries
[14:50]  * ogasawara back in 20
[15:02] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, bug 952698
[15:02] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 952698 in linux "Backlight no longer works on Macbook Pro5,5 with EFI boot" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/952698
[15:02] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, backlight actually works with nouveau driver w/ EFI boot
[15:02] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, and backlight is controlled by the nouveau driver instead of apple_bl
[15:03] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, backlight used to work w/ BIOS compatible mode, I'll need to test again
[15:04] <sforshee> ericm|ubuntu, apple_bl doesn't work on all macbooks, nouveau might be the only way to change it
[15:04]  * cking -> back in 20min
[15:04] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, apple_bl works sometimes as I remember but not reliable
[15:05] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, there is a small issue w/ nvidia-current though, when de-activating it in jockey, it makes nouveau un-usable, I have to purge it to get nouveau back again
[15:06] <sforshee> ericm|ubuntu, it may be that it only works in bios-compatibility, or that it needs changes to work with efi boot. I'm not sure.
[15:06] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, I believe it's nvidia-current black-listed nouveau
[15:06] <sforshee> that's nasty, probably need to file a bug for that
[15:06] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, yeah I doubt the I/O ports are still valid w/ EFI boot - brightness control never seems to be reliable to me
[15:07] <sforshee> ericm|ubuntu, adjusting via the graphics card is probably your best bet then
[15:08] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, yes
[15:08] <sforshee> the backlight situation on macbooks is horrendous
[15:08] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, and we won't have it w/ nvidia-current I guess
[15:08] <sforshee> ericm|ubuntu, no, and there's nothing we can do about it
[15:09] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, there is a backlight driver in mactel ppa - but that's a bit hackish
[15:10] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, one other problem w/ nvidia-current + EFI boot, I cannot seem to find my framebuffer consoles
[15:11] <sforshee> ericm|ubuntu, hackish yes, and I don't know what happens if you have it installed and try to use the nouveau driver
[15:11] <sforshee> EFI boot still has lots of issues to iron out
[15:11] <sforshee> graphics is the biggest one
[15:12] <sforshee> most of the drm drivers rely on having access to the vbios, which doesn't seem to be possible in EFI boot
[15:12] <mjg59> Sure it is
[15:12] <ericm|ubuntu> sforshee, yeah that's one issue
[15:12] <mjg59> But Apple don't provide it on Radeon-based machines for reasons that are unclear
[15:13] <mjg59> You can work around this by grabbing it out of the firmware during boot services and handing it off to the kernel
[15:13] <mjg59> I've a patch for grub that does that, but haven't forward-ported it to grub2 yet
[15:13] <sforshee> mjg59, thanks for the explanation. I confess I haven't looked into it much yet.
[15:13] <mjg59> But yeah nvidia is going to work badly on EFI Macs
[15:13] <mjg59> nouveau is a much better choice there
[17:00] <awe> bjf, any idea who I talk to about problems with ubuntu-bug?  I tried to run 'ubuntu-bug -p linux' and it just returns on my system...
[17:00] <awe> I have a power-mgmt problem which I guess I'll report directly via LP, and then try to apport attach...
[17:16] <bjf> awe, i think pitti knows more about ubuntu-bug than anyone
[17:20] <Sarvatt> awe: its ubuntu-bug linux
[17:21] <awe> Sarvatt, someone should fix: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Bugs
[17:21] <awe> cause that's where I got the command-line from
[17:21] <awe> '$ ubuntu-bug -p linux'
[17:22] <Sarvatt> sorry about that, fixed the wiki
[17:22] <Sarvatt> -p linux is for apport-collect
[17:23]  * ppisati -> brb
[17:27] <philipballew> If i install a mainline upstream kernel to fix a bug, does that mess up updating from the repos or will it detect my newer kernel?
[18:06] <apw> o
[18:07] <apw> ogasawara, the enforcer deliberatly uses the enforcer file on master ... so that the rules are consistant on all branches
[18:07] <ogasawara> apw: just saw your email
[18:07] <apw> ogasawara, and it has expressive power in theory at least to allow different rules to be expressed for different flavours
[18:08] <ogasawara> apw: will yank the patch from master-next
[18:28] <apw> ppisati, you gave the arm peeps a way to test with an initramfs-less kernel didn't you, using the overlapping partition tables with puid fields ... right ?
[18:33] <GrueMaster> apw: being one of those arm peeps directly involved with testing, I have heard nothing yet.
[18:53] <jsalisbury> cking, another overheat related bug reported, bug 953205  Looks like the same type of hardware as bug 751689 so it may be a duplicate.
[18:53] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 953205 in linux "System shuts down due to CPU temp exceeding critical thresh-hold (100C)" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/953205
[18:53] <ubot2`> Launchpad bug 751689 in linux "ThinkPads overheat due to slow fans when on 'auto'" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/751689
[18:54] <cking> jsalisbury, cool, I was talking to tony about that early
[18:54] <cking> earlier
[18:54] <jsalisbury> cking, ahh, ok.
[18:54] <ohsix> are the fans on the thinkpad not managed by acpi or are the thermal zones just wrong?
[18:55] <cking> ohsix, they can be managed by the firmware or by the thinkpad_acpi driver (by prodding the EC memory if I recall correctly)
[18:55] <ohsix> interesting
[18:56] <ohsix> also strange that even if you can do it with thinkpad_acpi, TMM1/2 don't work; or the critical thermal zone in acpi doesn't overrule it
[18:56] <cking> it's all in the thinkpad_acpi driver if you want to see the gory details
[18:56] <ohsix> okie dokie
[18:57] <cking> jsalisbury, I hacked up some code to monitor what's going on so I can get an idea of what's causing the grief
[18:58] <jsalisbury> cking, cool.  I can reproduce an overhead pretty quickly on my x201, so I can do some testing if needed.
[18:58] <cking> jsalisbury, so is this happening more with precise than oneiric?
[18:59] <ohsix> burnmmx ftw
[18:59] <jsalisbury> cking, In my case, I would say it happens the same.  My laptop will overheat and hit 100C shortly after kicking off a kernel build.
[19:00] <jsalisbury> cking, That was also the case in Oneiric
[19:00] <cking> jsalisbury, ok - that's bad, but not looking like a glaring regression.
[21:05]  * cking --> EOD


[09:39] <rmg51> Morning
[09:42] <JonathanD> Howdy.
[10:57] <waltman> Foggy out there.
[12:04] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples, dogs, turkeys and everything else
[13:10] <ChinnoDog> morning
[13:10]  * ChinnoDog noms a waffle
[20:16] <InHisName> Hey I am using ffmpeg and avconv to messs with some videos.   I want to convert to a plain vanilla movie that can be played by the oldest XP unmodified.   Will it play at least one movie format ?
[20:17] <InHisName> I want to send a movie to someone who wont do installs and runs XP pretty plain from the box.
[20:20] <rmg51> xp should play many formats
[20:21] <rmg51> avi should be a safe bet