[22:47] <rohan> gordonjcp: no, i still want to know what's wrong with that question.
[22:47] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: or something else that has an effect on the *entire thing*
[22:47] <KR-data> Cream, I think you are best of with asking in the irc-channel for alsa (#alsa) than asking me, they know a lot more about the topic than me
[22:47] <ChrisC35> so it is not as painful as Vista then in that regard?
[22:47] <gordonjcp> rohan: well, don't ask it in here
[22:47] <Hacksmith> Sensae: Intially it was cloned.  Then I ran the Envy app and i had two separate workspaces.  Different task bars and I could not drag an app from one desktop to another.
[22:47] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: I've never tried Vista but I've only ever heard bad things about it
[22:47] <rohan> gordonjcp: the question, or the justification?
[22:48] <jrib> rohan: it's not about *ubuntu support*
[22:48] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, all of this while running Vista. The Ubuntu system allows a non-admin desktop user to use the computer extensively without nagging for passwords for such things
[22:48] <rohan> jrib: it most definitely is
[22:48] <Crashed> Vista :(
[22:48] <holyguyver> When I try to use Synaptic I get this message Failed to run /usr/sbin/synaptic as user root.Unable to copy the user's Xauthorization file.
[22:48] <Kouza1> Looking for help getting my wireless card working please pm if you are available to help =-)
[22:48] <Sensae> Hacksmith: Oh well without dragging it's not as much worth it. Especially if it sounds like a PITA
[22:48] <rohan> jrib: if i ask, "can i install ubuntu on machine foo", it classifies as support
[22:48] <gordonjcp> !ask | Kouza1
[22:48] <Cream> KR-data i got no answer there, but thankyou veeeeeery much for your time and support! much appriciated, im going to bed and ill look into it tomorrow again :) thankyou again :)
[22:48] <Sensae> Hacksmith: Thanks
[22:48] <plummet> can anyone explain to me how to manually install programs i downloaded? specifically folding@home
[22:48] <Pici> rohan: The question was "can I install hackintosh on my dell". thats not Ubuntu support.
[22:49] <ChrisC35> one thing I notice about linux, its harder to install and update software. You cant just go to a web page, click the download link, and install run the update
[22:49] <rohan> i'm not trying to make a mountain out of a molehill - it's just that such pedantic behaviour is what turns off new users, gordonjcp, jrib , and Pici
[22:49] <hischild_> gordonjcp: i have a dualboot with vista. I use vista for my heavy 3d apps that won't run under linux. For the rest, i use ubuntu. It works fine so far.
[22:49] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: you can actually just run ubuntu from the CD
[22:49] <KR-data> gordonjcp, I'm told that Vista isn't as bad as it's rumors (if it was Vista would be the end of the world though)
[22:49] <ChrisC35> you have to put a command line in right?
[22:49] <Hacksmith> Sensae: Yeah and I could not get the computer to come back from locked screen at all.  Had to Ctrl+Alt+Bckspce
[22:49] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: into what?
[22:49] <xc_dht> !videosz
[22:49] <Hacksmith> Sensae: It was very buggy.
[22:49] <hischild_> KR-data: it started as the beginning of the end. IT's a lot better now though.
[22:49] <Pici> rohan: It had nothing to do with ubuntu and was offtopic.
[22:49] <KR-data> Cream, no problem, I hope it'll be fixed :)
[22:49] <ChrisC35> you have to type a command
[22:49] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, in that regard it could be said that is easier to have a non-admin using the system. BUt the access to the NTFS system will leave you vulnerable from file reading etc, unless your user data is encrypted under Vista ;)
[22:49] <Kouza1> I have a Atheros, for my Toshiba Satellite, and ubuntu acts like i dont have one at all can any one help me with this issue?
[22:49] <rohan> Pici, jrib, gordonjcp : i am so sorry, i thought you all were against his question about ubuntu! sorry once again!
[22:49] <jrib> rohan: meh, what's your question exactly?  Thought you were with the hackintosh crowd
[22:49] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: type a command for what?
[22:49] <preki> I can no longer boot to the latest 8.04 kernel.  What should i do?  is there a way to refresh the filesystem?
[22:49] <Pici> rohan: Its okay :)
[22:49] <Sensae> hischild_: Not sure of the context, but that's my setup right now. I have Vista x64 for heavy stuff and my 3D work, and just got Ubuntu installed.
[22:49] <rohan> jrib: no, i did not follow the flow properly
[22:50] <gordonjcp> rohan: oh, no I missed the Ubuntu question - what was it?
[22:50] <ChrisC35> for installing and updating programs
[22:50] <Kouza1> I have a Atheros, for my Toshiba Satellite, and ubuntu acts like i dont have one at all can any one help me with this issue?
[22:50] <erUSUL> preki: what error are you getting?
[22:50] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: no, you'd use Synaptic for it
[22:50] <rohan> gordonjcp: is it legal to install ubuntu on dell, he'd asked somewhere up there
[22:50] <KR-data> hischild_, well when I got a faster computer I might try it, just to know a little about what people ask me about
[22:50] <jrib> eduardo: try #compiz-fusion
[22:50] <ChrisC35> what is Synaptic?
[22:50] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: you *can* use a command-line program to do it, which is what I generally do
[22:51] <Kouza1> I have a Atheros, for my Toshiba Satellite, and ubuntu acts like i dont have one at all can any one help me with this issue?
[22:51] <gordonjcp> rohan: can't see why it would be illegal, unless it's not your computer
[22:51] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, is entirely GUI based and the command line could be thought of as  an add on for more advanced users. For admin tasks you have to type your password too, but it's far from often and it envolves just very specific tasks
[22:51] <hischild_> KR-data: 800 Mhz apparently is good enough to run it (that's battery saving mode on my laptop) and still runs fine then.
[22:51] <preki> erUSUL, sometimes a blank screen on boot up, sometimes a pile of messages I can't decipher
[22:51] <ChrisC35> I tried updating Firefox on my Ubuntu machine. I went to the site, downloaded the upgrade, and that was it. it just unpacked it. It did not get installed
[22:51] <rohan> gordonjcp: right
[22:51] <gordonjcp> Kouza1: didn't you just ask that about 10 seconds ago
[22:51] <gordonjcp> ?
[22:51] <preki> is there a way to retrieve the error message?
[22:51] <Mudassar> How can I install from *.repo file ?
[22:51] <erUSUL> preki: can you boot into recovery mode?
[22:51] <Kouza1> Gordon: Diddent i not get a answer 8-P
[22:51] <KR-data> hischild_, sounds strange compared to what I've heard
[22:51] <jrib> Mudassar: what are you trying to install?
[22:51] <preki> erUSUL: yes, to a command line
[22:52] <hischild_> KR-data: i have much stranger stories ;-)
[22:52] <jrib> ChrisC35: let the update-manager in ubuntu take care of updates
[22:52] <SlimThug875>  anyone in here know how to break into networks?? i have a network ip if that is any help..its a school network???
[22:52] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, in Ubuntu every single app downloads, installs and upgrades cventrally.. You will never have to go to the site and grab it. Just add a centralized source (called repository) and go with it
[22:52] <Crashed> What's the apache config file called?
[22:52] <SlimThug875>  anyone in here know how to break into networks?? i have a network ip if that is any help..its a school network???
[22:52] <plummet> ChrisC35: we are trying to do the same thing, i dont know what to do with the files after unpacking from the tarball
[22:52] <gordonjcp> Kouza1: you might have to wait - in case you hadn't noticed it's a bit busy in here ;-)
[22:52] <jrib> Crashed: /etc/apache2/apache2.conf
[22:52] <XLV> upgrade from 7.10 to 8.04 32bit... update manager doesnt work, it gets stuck at wait-cursor state, when check for updates button is pressed.. also many things in system>administration menu dont start, eg hardware drivers, hardware testing etc
[22:52] <GhostFish> ATI CARD ERROR : Desktop effects could not be enabled ?????//
[22:52] <gordonjcp> Kouza1: what kind of atheros card?
[22:52] <hischild_> KR-data: how about the story that vista and xp in a virtual pc run more then 3 times as fast as a normal installation, even though it only uses one core with 256 ram (yes on vista as well)
[22:52] <SlimThug875>  anyone in here know how to break into networks?? i have a network ip if that is any help..its a school network???
[22:52] <Mimi> Question :  Everytime I drag something to another window... Nautilus goes gray... and gray... and eventually I get a error message about dbus... any help O.o
[22:52] <SlimThug875> message me if anyonfo?
[22:52] <KR-data> hischild_, and seen btw. I've seen computers much more powerful than my driven to the edge of breakdown by Vista (though the person behind it was trying to get it there, so it was his own fault)
[22:52] <jrib> SlimThug875: that's not discussed here
[22:52] <ChrisC35> hubuntu how does that work then? if you dont go to the vendor website, where do  you go?
[22:53] <SlimThug875> where can i get answers??
[22:53] <jrib> SlimThug875: not here.
[22:53] <SlimThug875> do you kn ow where?
[22:53] <Crashed> Thanks jrib
[22:53] <KR-data> hischild_, sounds like I'm gonna install Viista on my vmware soon
[22:53] <erUSUL> preki: maybe you can take a look at /var/log/syslog (from the end backwards) or try to "sudo /etc/init.d/gdm start" and get any information about what may be wrong?
[22:53] <eduardo> Question: how do i install a compiz theme? (compiz-fusion is not active)
[22:53] <KR-data> hischild_, I gotta try that myself
[22:53] <S3M> si ora va grazie
[22:53] <jrib> eduardo: did you try #compiz-fusion?
[22:53] <S3M> notte
[22:54] <eduardo> jrib: yes, its inactive
[22:54] <keanu> I have a Brother HL-1440 printer connected to a Windows XP computer.  When trying to print from my laptop (running Ubuntu 8.04) the printer warms up, but doesn't print.  The only way I can get it to print the document is to print another document from the XP machine.  Any ideas why?
[22:54] <hischild_> KR-data: i didn't believe it myself at first .... that's why i was pretty surprised myself ...
[22:54] <ChrisC35> what does it mean to 'add a centralized source' aka repository?
[22:54] <hubuntu> you use synaptic as metioned earlier ChrisC35
[22:54] <KR-data> hischild_, was it vmware or another virtual machine?
[22:54] <hubuntu> Let me give you an example
[22:54] <plummet> hubuntu: how exactly do you use synaptic
[22:54] <mudd`Hossam> i am having difficulty install libssl-dev on 8.04 amd64, i get this error   libssl-dev: Depends: libssl0.9.8 (= 0.9.8g-4ubuntu2) but 0.9.8g-4ubuntu3 is to be installed
[22:54] <hischild_> KR-data: kvm and vmware. both yield the same results.
[22:55] <hubuntu> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Repositories/Ubuntu
[22:55] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: hubuntu beat me to it ;-)
[22:55] <ChrisC35> What distro of linux would be easiest to use for non techies (like the wife) - and would they be supported on a new laptop?
[22:55] <KR-data> hischild_, interesting, I gotta try it, it sounds like too much fun not to do it
[22:55] <hischild_> ChrisC35: IMO ubuntu.
[22:55] <rohan> mudd`Hossam: i think it's a bug, you should file it
[22:55] <rambo3> ChrisC35, kubuntu
[22:55] <plummet> regular ubuntu is easiest ive seen
[22:55] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: any of them
[22:55] <rohan> ChrisC35: ubuntu
[22:55] <ChrisC35> and should I just blow away Vista on it and put Ubuntu?
[22:55] <Invert314> X.org on the Ubuntu Live CD is taking up 40% CPU usage while idle on a 1.7Ghz celeron (from 2002).  this is after i turned off compiz.  why is that?
[22:55] <t0dz> hello.. i was seting up a theame.. on my ubuntu and i want to make those proc info counters like u can see in the right hand... http://www.xfce-look.org/content/preview.php?preview=1&id=73210&file1=73210-1.jpg&file2=73210-2.jpg&file3=73210-3.jpg&name=Slickness+Black
[22:55] <preki> erUSUL: I'm currently logged running on the older kernel.  can I access /var/log/syslog from here - i.e. is the log common to both kernels -  or do i have to reboot into the new kernel?
[22:55] <ChrisC35> or should I go with MacOS?
[22:55] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: of course, that depends on what you want to do
[22:55] <rambo3> ChrisC35, kubuntu with kd4
[22:55] <jrib> mudd`Hossam: run 'sudo apt-get update'.  If you still receive the error, pastebin your sources.list
[22:55] <rohan> ChrisC35: no ,keep vista just in case
[22:55] <Pici> ChrisC35: If you're expecting an answer other than Ubuntu, I suggest asking in ##linux, not #ubuntu
[22:55] <hubuntu> plummet, you search for an apps and install it. For instance you can search for "browser" or for "galeon" and you will find a web browser called galeon in both cases
[22:55] <rohan> ChrisC35: mac os? it's useless P
[22:56] <hischild_> KR-data: true that. I have a whole bunch of images on an external HD with all kinds of tweaked and clean systems. Fun to test stuff on ;-)
[22:56] <mudd`Hossam> rohan, alrighty i am having some other packages giving the same errors
[22:56] <mudd`Hossam> jrib, will do
[22:56] <erUSUL> preki: so the older kernel is still instaled and works fine?
[22:56] <KR-data> hischild_, indeed :D
[22:56] <rohan> mudd`Hossam: yes, but before filing, do what jrib said :)
[22:56] <ChrisC35> Pici are  you saying everyone in here are biased idiots?
[22:56] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: put it this way, my woefully non-technical Mum was perfectly able to use Slackware on my old PC
[22:56] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, put the Ubuntu CD while in Vista and follow the instructions. It is really as painless as that
[22:56] <Pici> ChrisC35: Those arent the words I would use, but yes.
[22:56] <preki> erUSUL, yes, seems to
[22:56] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: if you're just poking about on the web and reading email, there's basically no difference between *any* distro once it's installed
[22:57] <Sensae> How do I zoom out with compiz running?
[22:57] <erUSUL> preki: have you installed your video drivers through envy or manually?
[22:57] <wolfy> Can anyone here help me with a small driver issue?
[22:57] <rohan> gordonjcp++
[22:57] <jrib> Sensae: ask in #compiz-fusion
[22:57] <ChrisC35> she would also need to use photoshop though
[22:57] <KR-data> hischild_, though I miss my gentoo, I just don't have the time for that anymore ;(
[22:57] <preki> through envy
[22:57] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, Ubuntu has arised as the GNU/Linux standard. It is just simple as that
[22:57] <rohan> !ask | wolfy
[22:57] <plummet> so it is not possible to install something without using repositories?
[22:57] <Woob1> Hello all.. I'm a brand new ubuntu/linux user and have just installed ubuntu then added mythbuntu.  When I load up the mythtv frontend, I get a message that the UPnP backends are not found and then after scrolling through a couple of pages I get a message that I cannot login to database.I appreciate a little help if anyone might have a clue?
[22:57] <hischild_> KR-data: i've heard great stories about it. I've taken a look at it, but it seems like you need at least a fulltime week for it to setup.
[22:57] <caleb_> I am trying to make wget download the zip file from the US mirror at http://linux.softpedia.com/progDownload/Eternal-Lands-Download-611.html here is what I have so far:
[22:57] <caleb_> wget -H -l1 -np -nd -A.zip -erobots=off --exclude-domains=download.softpedia.ro http://linux.softpedia.com/progDownload/Eternal-Lands-Download-611.html but it doesn't work
[22:57] <t0dz> hello.. i was seting up a theame.. on my ubuntu and i want to make those proc info counters like u can see in the right hand... in that page... can sombody help me ??http://www.xfce-look.org/content/preview.php?preview=1&id=73210&file1=73210-1.jpg&file2=73210-2.jpg&file3=73210-3.jpg&name=Slickness+Black
[22:57] <wolfy> Very well. I'd need help locating a driver for my wifi
[22:57] <keanu> If I have the Printers and Faxes open on windows, I see it show 0 documents waiting, then 1 (when I print), then go back to 0 a few minutes later, so the computer's recognizing that it should print, it just delays it
[22:57] <jrib> plummet: it is, but it's not recommended.  Using the repositories is easier anyway
[22:58] <wolfy> Realtek 802.11 g/b wireless
[22:58] <KR-data> hischild_, depends on the computer, but taken first time errors in account, then it sounds pretty realistic
[22:58] <hubuntu> plummet, it is, it's just not as easy to keep it up to date. There are over 20000 applications available in the repositories... You almost lways find what you are looking for
[22:58] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: like I said earlier, you can run it from the CD while you try it out
[22:58] <hubuntu> google, as usual, is your best friend there ;)
[22:58] <Mathman> gordonjcp: up to a point.  stability could be an issue with various distros.  fedora springs to mind.
[22:58] <ChrisC35> I thought openSUSE is supposed to be growing in popularity a lot faster?
[22:58] <KR-data> hischild_, I think a stage 3 install with a gui and all that would take me around 48 hours to get up and running
[22:58] <hischild_> KR-data: well, i got a CLI system installed properly. But then ran into some other errors. So i got back to ubuntu and i'm happy again.
[22:58] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: it'll be a lot slower but the user experience will be more-or-less the same
[22:59] <ChrisC35> is it plausable to run Photoshop in Wine? and IE as well?
[22:59] <keanu> Going into notepad and pressing enter a few times and printing the 'document' causes both pages to print, but something must be printed from the XP machine for it to print the document from my laptop.  Any ideas?
[22:59] <preki> erSULU: is it a problem to use envy to install the video drivers?
[22:59] <ChrisC35> or however that is supposed to be done
[22:59] <cpk1>  /msg ubottu repomirror
[22:59] <ChrisC35> or in windows on vmware maybe
[22:59] <cpk1> oops
[22:59] <KR-data> hischild_, it's a great system for some things, but if you like things nice and easy, keep away :p
[22:59] <t0dz> hello.. i was seting up a theame.. on my ubuntu and i want to make those proc info counters like u can see in the right hand... in that page... can sombody help me ?? http://www.xfce-look.org/content/preview.php?preview=1&id=73210&file1=73210-1.jpg&file2=73210-2.jpg&file3=73210-3.jpg&name=Slickness+Black
[22:59] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, depends who you ask. If you need help with Ubuntu, here we are. If you want to know more about distros go to distrowatch.com or other channels
[22:59] <KR-data> hischild_, since I like to play, get errors and try to fix then I love gentoo
[22:59] <caleb_> ChrisC35: you can only run cs2 in wine, not cs3. You can run ie, by downloading it here: http://www.tatanka.com.br/ies4linux/page/Main_Page
[22:59] <Mathman> ChrisC35: never tried it, but photoshop is one of the big things wine devs concentrate on, so yeah, I'd imagine it runs.  or at least some version of it.  IE?  why I'd ask.
[23:00] <hubuntu> search the wine database for that ChrisC35: http://appdb.winehq.org/
[23:00] <mudd`Hossam> jrib, http://pastebin.ca/1011134 - having issues with package dependencies
[23:00] <KR-data> hischild_, the errors of course can be avoided easily, but for me they are part of the fun ;)
[23:00] <Fishscene> Would running IE in WINE subject you to the same vulnerabilities as in Windows?
[23:00] <ChrisC35> what about running windowsXP in vmware, with CS3, etc - would all that work well enough using 2GB ram?
[23:00] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: you might want to look into ies4linux if you *must* have IE in Wine
[23:00] <gordonjcp> Fishscene: not really, no
[23:00] <hubuntu> Ubuntu is no cheap windows. So you can't expect everything to just work. Somethings do, and some donæt
[23:00] <hischild_> KR-data: i love errors. I love to fix them as well. But i also need it for school, which is when i can't use errors or anything else. It just needs to work. Windows isn't stable enough for me, so i use ubuntu which is just perfect :_)
[23:00] <Fishscene> gordonjcp, ok thanks :)
[23:00] <KR-data> Chipsa964, it should
[23:00] <ramb0> hardy-FireFox-Flash sound issue ... this is for flashplayer9 on FF3.0b5 -- installing libflashsupport fixes it ... I'll look into fixing it upstream
[23:00] <hischild_> !appdb | ChrisC35
[23:01] <Mathman> Fishscene: nah.  I mean, I suppose your wine setup could get screwed.  even your home directory if you got something nasty and your wine setup was such that it had access.  but nah, your linux install would be fine
[23:01] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: what kind of things do you intend on using it for?
[23:01] <ChrisC35> so wine rungs things natively?
[23:01] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: mmmm, kind of
[23:01] <ChrisC35> web development
[23:01] <gordonjcp> ah righty
[23:01] <ChrisC35> therefore I NEED PS and to test in IE
[23:01] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, running XP under VirtualBox or VMWare for Linux should do the trick, yes
[23:01] <jrib> mudd`Hossam: pastebin your error (output of 'sudo apt-get install libssl-dev' I guess) and the output of 'apt-cache policy libssl-dev libssl0.9.8'
[23:01]  * gordonjcp doesn't bother testing in IE any more
[23:01] <keanu> Based on what I've done, it seems that down at the bottom of the page printed from Ubuntu, it shows @PJL JOB NAME="Test Page" [break] PJL PRINTLOG ITEM = 1, PRINTER [break] @PJL PRINTLOG ITEM = 2,Wed,7 May 2008 17:47:38
[23:02] <KR-data> hischild_, well I need mine for school too, so it seems we think pretty much the same
[23:02] <ChrisC35> and as for games.... ? i will assume that Wine or VMware will not cut it
[23:02] <caleb_> I am trying to make wget download the zip file from the US mirror at http://linux.softpedia.com/progDownload/Eternal-Lands-Download-611.html here is what I have so far:
[23:02] <caleb_> wget -H -l1 -np -nd -A.zip -erobots=off --exclude-domains=download.softpedia.ro http://linux.softpedia.com/progDownload/Eternal-Lands-Download-611.html but it doesn't work
[23:02] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: for the most part IE7 does the Right Thing, and no-one should even be using IE6 any more
[23:02] <wolfy> ANyone have any sudgestions where i can get a driver for a Realtek 802.11 g/b wireless? I need it for ndsiwrapper
[23:02] <keanu> "Test Page" also switches to "Untitled - Notepad" depending on what I used as the second document.  Is this a problem caused by the Ubuntu driver, or the XP machine?
[23:02] <hischild_> KR-data: but i need some sleep. GF is coming by tomorrow :-) Good luck on it. We'll see each other again sometime around here I hope.
[23:02] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: games, er yes well...  I hope you like FPSes
[23:02] <Mathman> ChrisC35: wine definitely cuts it for games.  least on my end.
[23:02] <ChrisC35> gordonjcp IE6 is still in wide use. And no you can't assume IE7 follows standards properly. You still need zoom:1 for eg
[23:02] <Mathman> gordonjcp: nonsense.  I mean, a whole slew of poker apps run under wine
[23:03] <KR-data> hischild_, I hope too, though I'm not in here that often. Sleep well
[23:03] <ChrisC35> FPSes?
[23:03] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: tbh I don't really care about IE
[23:03] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, agaion the winedB is the best resource and Cedega is the best commercial app if you really can't dual boot
[23:03] <preki> erUSUL: is it a problem to use envy to install the video drivers?  would it help to see a screenshot of the error message?
[23:03] <fastfret79> t0dz - looks like it might be screenlets
[23:03] <t0dz> :/ ?
[23:03] <t0dz> im new..
[23:03] <erUSUL> preki: the problem is that you have to reinstall the drivers everytime you change your kernel :-/
[23:03] <ChrisC35> ya i supposed i could duo boot for games, and use vmware for PS/IE
[23:04] <hubuntu> IE runs ok under Ubuntu, but I would encourage to use XP on a Virtual Machine (whatever kind) if you want to do the CS IE trick
[23:04] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: at work I care about it a *little* bit, but only about 15% of hits are from IE anyway
[23:04] <hubuntu> yep
[23:04] <ChrisC35> gordonjcp IE still has the vast majority of the market
[23:04] <ChrisC35> and stats are unreliabel
[23:04] <gordonjcp> ChrisC35: that's not been our experience, but then it's mostly public sector and the tech market we're in
[23:05] <ChrisC35> hehe thats kind of contradictory isnt it
[23:05] <jtickle> is there an easy way to get in touch with another user of the wiki at help.ubuntu.com/community?
[23:05] <gordonjcp> jtickle: maybe they have a talk page
[23:05] <hrocha> good evening
[23:05] <wolfy> no one?
[23:05] <Gibby69> how can i change resolution for log in page
[23:05] <jtickle> doesn't look like it :-/
[23:05] <jtickle> would that be Talk:username ?
[23:05] <hrocha> did anyone read the ubuntu-girlfriend experience?
[23:05] <fastfret79> t0dz: try following this - http://tombuntu.com/index.php/2008/03/17/os-x-like-widgets-with-screenlets-on-ubuntu-3rd-update/
[23:05] <preki> erUSUL: it has been working fine for a couple of weeks in Hardy with the newer kernel.  Is the older kernel listed as 8.04 the same as the 7.10 kernel then?
[23:05] <ChrisC35> gordonjcp i'm talking about the full scale. My clients range so I have to support everything
[23:05] <gordonjcp> hrocha: yeah, seemed a bit contrived to me
[23:05] <m11> hello
[23:06] <jtickle> gordon, would that be Talk:username?
[23:06] <jtickle> er
[23:06] <gordonjcp> jtickle: possibly
[23:06] <ChrisC35> can you do any decent games through wine? Like Gothic 3
[23:06] <hrocha> gordonjcp: i've done an ubuntu-father experience in caso you want to read it
[23:06] <ChrisC35> or recent stuff
[23:06] <jtickle> cool
[23:06] <hrocha> gordonjcp: http://rochahenrique.blogspot.com
[23:06] <gordonjcp> hrocha: my Mum has been using Ubuntu for about two years now
[23:06] <preki> erUSUL: and how can I reinstall with envy if I can't get to the desktop?
[23:06] <hrocha> gordonjcp: it's a little long
[23:06] <m11> how can one mount .bin on ubuntu ?
[23:06] <erUSUL> preki: ? you cnaged the kernel since you used envy or not?
[23:07] <GhostFish> I have a ATI Catalyst CONtrol Center and it won't let me change the screen size .. Is there somewhere else I can change it ?
[23:07] <hubuntu> ChrisC35, this is not a wine support channel. If you have specific questions as such go to a wine channel or please see the site we have refered to you.
[23:07] <jrib> !iso > m11 (read the private message from ubotu)
[23:07] <hrocha> gordonjcp: my mom too, maybe not 2 years, but 1 at least
[23:07] <gordonjcp> hrocha: see this is the point exactly
[23:07] <jrib> m11: convert it to iso as ubottu's link explains, then mount that
[23:07] <preki> erUSUL: yes, but it worked fine for two weeks or so
[23:07] <gordonjcp> hrocha: my Mum doesn't know how to change the brake discs on her VW Golf, does that mean that VW Golfs aren't ready for non-techy drivers?
[23:08] <gordonjcp> of course it doesn't
[23:08] <erUSUL> preki: so the problem wasn't coused by the new kernel ...
[23:08] <caleb_> to all those listening, i fixed the problem with this: wget -rH -l1 -np -nd --accept=.zip -erobots=off --exclude-domains=download.softpedia.ro http://linux.softpedia.com/progDownload/Eternal-Lands-Download-611.html
[23:08] <hrocha> gordonjcp: obviously :)
[23:08] <gordonjcp> it means that she brings it round to me to get the brakes done
[23:08] <RickX> does anyone have onboard SIS Mirage 1 graphics working?
[23:08] <m11> tnx jrib i try that
[23:08] <hrocha> gordonjcp: i completely disagree with his "not ready for the desktop"
[23:08] <mudd`Hossam> jrib, http://pastebin.ca/1011141 sorry for the delay
[23:08] <preki> erUSUL: maybe not, no.. but I can't boot the new kernel and I can boot the old one.
[23:09] <gordonjcp> hrocha: I've been using computers for most of my 34 years and I still run into *exactly* the problems he described when I try to use Windows
[23:09] <gordonjcp> so does that mean that Windows isn't ready for the desktop?
[23:09] <harphazo> virtualbox?
[23:09] <sirjoebob> hey all... anyone know of a cli-based p2p program? kind of a weird request but I like the terminal interface
[23:09] <hrocha> gordonjcp: for example, when you install windows you can't read pdf files, which is really annoying
[23:09] <gordonjcp> hrocha: you want more RAM in that PIII, it would be fine with 512M
[23:09] <jrib> mudd`Hossam: If you ran 'sudo apt-get update' successfully, then your mirror must be flaky.  Here, I have libss-dev at version 0.9.8g-4ubuntu3
[23:10] <Mathman> 3rd party apps and drivers is why linux isn't ready for the desktop.  in the most general sense at any rate.  Linux has been my desktop for years of course, and quite a number of my co workers too.
[23:10] <hrocha> gordonjcp: he's not using the p3 now, i gave him my desktop, i only use a sony vaio laptop now
[23:10] <cheesebob> why does `sudo apt-get upgrade` take so long?
[23:10] <cheesebob> it seems to randomly get stuck on some steps
[23:10] <jrib> mudd`Hossam: so if you want to get this fixed immediately, you probbaly just need to use a different mirror
[23:10] <gordonjcp> hrocha: I mean my Mum doesn't *need* to know how to patch kernel drivers and stuff, in much the same way she doesn't need to know how to change brakes on a car
[23:10] <erUSUL> preki: maybe you can try try 'sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg' and choose the free driver (nv for nvidia or ati for radeon) to get a uable desktop ? and retry with envy (if it is true that the problem is this)
[23:11] <mudd`Hossam> jrib, i remember having to add the universe repositories and whatnot for some applicatio where can i find the 8.04 distribution version of the sources.list?
[23:11] <gordonjcp> hrocha: the fact that she can turn it on and start browsing the web is good enough
[23:11] <jrib> !repomirror > mudd`Hossam (read the private message from ubotu)
[23:11] <Ysangko1> /msg ubottu repomirror
[23:11] <hrocha> gordonjcp: yes, my mom too, and i didn't change her desktop, she's using the default one, even with the same wallpaper
[23:11] <Jeruvy> can we move the chat to #ubuntu-offtopic?
[23:11] <mudd`Hossam> jrib, thank you for all your help!
[23:12] <IDADan> Long time windows user installing Ubuntu for the first time
[23:12] <Pici> jrib: you may want to update your script to say ubottu (I just changed mine today)
[23:12] <preki> erUSUL: thanks for your help - i will try that.  For your info, here is a screenshot of the error message - does it me anything to you/others? http://www.maths.nottingham.ac.uk/personal/spp/DSCF0910.JPG
[23:12] <jrib> Pici: good point, thanks
[23:12] <hrocha> Jeruvy: don't worry, i was just leaving
[23:12] <DanaG> !find libsocket.so
[23:13] <DanaG> wtf?
[23:13] <Jeruvy> hrocha: it's cool but this channel is too busy
[23:13] <zChris> !find libsocket
[23:13] <erUSUL> preki: you should also file a bug report to the kernel what you have on the screen is an oops and is a serious kernel bug
[23:13] <hrocha> Jeruvy: np ;)
[23:13] <hrocha> gordonjcp: bye, take the time to read the article if you want to
[23:13] <preki> erUSUL: I will do, thanks again
[23:13] <erUSUL> preki: if the oops is not triggered when booting in recovery mode it may be coused by the video driver but i dunno
[23:14] <DanaG> zChris: I have that installed, and the library is there... but it's not in the ld path.
[23:14] <zChris> DanaG: okey
[23:14] <noelferreira> my keys get stuck sometimes and other times don't work. can anyone help me with this huge bug: http://pastebin.com/m7bc88052
[23:16] <DanaG> Odd.. even logging out and back in doesn't seem to fix it.
[23:16] <ldiamond> How can I get another boot option in grub with kernel 2.6.25?
[23:16] <m11> jrib i dl files and put them in /opt/bin2iso, after that i runed command "gcc -o bin2iso bin2iso-0.4.c" and console just drop me in new row. can u give me tip on how to work on this ?
[23:16] <Ysangko1> ldiamond: edit /boot/menu.lst ?
[23:17] <ldiamond> thats it?
[23:17] <jrib> m11: I've never used it.  You probably have a program called bin2iso you can use now though.  You would run it by doing: ./bin2iso
[23:17] <zaputr> Please? help, Mixxx writes "Audio device could not be opened", (Intel HDA)
[23:17] <ziomorti87> ciao a tutti
[23:17] <m11> ah ok, tnx for info
[23:17] <jrib> !it | ziomorti87
[23:17] <Ysangko1> ldiamond: well it oughtta work
[23:17] <ldiamond> where can I get 2.6.25 source?
[23:18] <jrib> !kernel > ldiamond (read the private message from ubottu)
[23:18] <Ysangko1> ldiamond: http://kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.6/linux-<IP_ADDRESS>.tar.bz2
[23:18] <DanaG> zChris: I just symlinked the files into /usr/lib.
[23:18] <DanaG> They were in /usr/lib/happycoders.
[23:18] <zaputr> Please? help, Mixxx writes "Audio device could not be opened", (Intel HDA)
[23:19] <DanaG> What the ¿?¿? is "happycoders"?
[23:19] <dholiday> I am a happycoder
[23:19] <dholiday> except I am not in your /urs/lib directory
[23:19] <DanaG> I'm NOT a happy coder when ld can't find -lsocket.
[23:20] <DanaG> ... especially when installing the package still didn't fix it.
[23:20] <dholiday> :(
[23:20] <Ysangko1> zaputr: does sound work in other programs?
[23:20] <zaputr> yes? in all programs
[23:20] <jrib> DanaG: you installed happycoders-libsocket-dev ?
[23:20] <zaputr> yes!
[23:21] <DanaG> Yup.
[23:21] <DanaG> But it didn't put the library in the ld path, apparently.
[23:21] <Creationist> Could someone please help me get my Microsoft (gasp!, it was cheap) Wireless Laser Desktop 4000 working?  Everything appears to work fine except for the middle mouse button... the wheel works fine, though.
[23:21] <Ysangko1> zaputr: there is a #mixxx channel
[23:21] <zChris> DanaG: that worked?
[23:22] <Trae> anyone here use imwheel and know how I get get Button4 and Button3 to switch?
[23:22] <GhostFish> brb
[23:22] <DanaG> zChris: It only started finding the library when I symlinked it into /usr/lib itself.
[23:23] <jtickle> has anyone experienced strange VIM behavior after upgrading to Hardy?
[23:23] <jtickle> in my case, it's like the letter 'd' was pressed before I do anything
[23:23] <Ysangko1> zaputr: check the FAQ, theres something about /dev/dsp problems: http://www.mixxx.org/wiki/doku.php/faq
[23:24] <jtickle> so, if I edit a file with VIM, and then press the down arrow, it appears exactly the same as if, on another machine, I had opened VIM and pressed 'd' then [down]
[23:24] <jtickle> but if I open vim and immediately hit [esc] everything is fine
[23:24] <sls_> how can I tell how many sockets are populated with sticks of ram in linux?
[23:24] <sls_> on a server where i do not have physical access.
[23:24] <Mudassar> hello, how can I install pidgin from *.repo file ?
[23:24] <Mathman> sls_: try dmidecode
[23:25] <jrib> jtickle: are you sure you are using vim-full, not vim-tiny?
[23:25] <sls_> okk
[23:25] <jtickle> jrib, yeah
[23:25] <spiniker> hello room
[23:25] <Mathman> Mudassar: apt, aptitude, synaptic.  one of those I think
[23:25] <belor1> Folder Icons wont Change Please HELP
[23:25] <spiniker> is there a room for technical questions
[23:25] <Mathman> Mudassar: synaptic is the gui thingy I believe.  you'd maybe like that one.
[23:25] <Mudassar> plz give me the command how to do that
[23:25] <jtickle> jrib, this is definitely different behavior than if I had vim-tiny; once that initial [esc] happens, everything else works as it always has
[23:25] <ibleed> i am using gnome and i'm not sure what i installed that had this dependancy but now i have knetattach and i'm unsure of what it does
[23:26] <Mathman> Mudassar: look on your menu for synaptic and run it.  or type that command at a terminal
[23:26] <Mudassar> I couldn't figure out..
[23:26] <nano_> how can i stop ubuntu from creating default folders such as "Music" and "Videos" in ~/
[23:26] <Mathman> Mudassar: figure out....what?
[23:27] <Mudassar> how to add that *.repo file in synaptic package manager
[23:27] <jrib> Mudassar: what are you trying to install...?
[23:28] <jrib> nano_: check out /etc/xdg/ probably
[23:28] <Mudassar> pidgin messenger
[23:28] <Kuroachia> Quick question, has anyone else had any issues with their audio upon updating to 8.04? Suddenly my max volume is abnormally quiet.
[23:28] <Mathman> Mudassar: ha, spose I misunderstood the question.  why would you need a .repo file to install pidgin?  just install the pidgin that comes with ubuntu
[23:28] <nano_> jrib: thnx
[23:28] <jrib> Mudassar: pidgin is installed by default.  It's in your Internet menu
[23:28] <jrib> !software > Mudassar (read the private message from ubottu)
[23:28] <Mudassar> I saw a popup when I opened pidgin that I must install the latest version of pidgin to avoid many bugs ..
[23:29] <jrib> Mudassar: what version of ubuntu is this?
[23:29] <Mudassar> 7.10
[23:29] <Creationist> Could someone please help me get my Microsoft (gasp!, it was cheap) Wireless Laser Desktop 4000 working?  Everything appears to work fine except for the middle mouse button... the wheel works fine, though.  Also, if you have info on how to configure the extra keys, I would accept that :)
[23:29] <Mathman> Creationist: ha.  not with that nick.   heh, nah, no idea, sorry.
[23:29] <jrib> Mudassar: as long as you have the -security and -updates repo you are fine
[23:30] <Creationist> Mathman: My nick is that threatening to you, huh?  Fascinating.  Thanks for the commentary.
[23:30] <TooFly> hello! i had ubuntu installed, and i just installed windows as well. now, i dont get a boot menu at all - how do i get back to ubuntu?
[23:30] <jrib> !grub > toofly (read the private message from ubottu)
[23:30] <mudd`Hossam> does anyone know how i can restore my sources.list to its default values?
[23:30] <Mathman> Creationist: ha, who every said threatening?
[23:30] <jrib> mudd`Hossam: use system -> administration -> software sources
[23:30] <cheesebob> The Update Manager is frozen :(
[23:30] <cheesebob> help?
[23:30] <Mudassar> http://pidgin.im/download/fedora_core/             this is the link where I downloaded the repo file from
[23:31] <tj83> Hello all.... Have any of you experienced extreme instability in Ubuntu 8.04?
[23:31]  * Creationist is amazed people would refuse him support based entirely on his differing views on anything.   But at last... I'll concede.
[23:31] <Starnestommy> Mudassar: fedora and ubuntu are very different
[23:31] <Pici> Mudassar: Are you using Ubuntu or Fedora?
[23:31] <McRib> Mathman: You don't have anything against cows, do you?
[23:31] <Hirato> I decided to venture to the intrepid repos yesterday, I just thought I'd point out that X fails to start as it's unable to locate fonts for some reason, and the '/usr/bin/cvs' bins are broken too when you try to update a repo
[23:31] <Mathman> jrib: I dunno about that exactly.  I mean, im protocols tend to change, so I could see him encountering bugs.  but I'd give the junk that comes standard a try first at least
[23:31] <Mudassar> I installed it before from the same site ...
[23:31] <^Tech-Help^> lmao McRib
[23:31] <Trae> Anyone know about imwheel and buttons?  I'm trying to get button3 and button4 to switch.
[23:31] <Mudassar> it is creating some problems with me
[23:31] <NotPresent> Hirato: bad ideas are bad
[23:31] <NotPresent> Hirato: and it's off topic for here
[23:32] <Hirato> sorry, which channel then?
[23:32] <Mathman> McRib: easy buddy.  easy.  I said I have no idea.  if I did I'd probably help out, so there you go.
[23:32] <jrib> Mathman: ubuntu updates the pidgin package for security and "big" bugs
[23:32] <Pici> Hirato: #ubuntu+1
[23:32] <McRib> ^Tech-Help^: A bad nickname of mine :)
[23:32] <Hirato> thanks :)
[23:32] <tj83> is there any goog support channels i can be referred to?
[23:32] <tj83> good*
[23:32] <hagane> is this the place for noob question ?
[23:32] <Pici> tj83: #ubuntu, which is here
[23:32] <Pici> Hirato: yes.
[23:32] <jrib> hagane: for every question about ubuntu support
[23:32] <hagane> how do I install graphic driver? I donwloaded it, but it doesn't run. I found 3 NVIDIA binary X org driver in add/remove... do I need to install one of these instead of downloaded one ?
[23:32] <Starnestommy> hagane: it's the place for all ubuntu-related questions
[23:33] <tj83> Is it common for extreme instability in Ubuntu 8.04?
[23:33] <mudd`Hossam> jrib, ah i thought you had left, i did select the best server, should i uncheck  universe, restricted and multiverse?
[23:33] <tj83> I am coming from debian  to Ubuntu
[23:33] <jrib> mudd`Hossam: nah, those are fine
[23:33] <McRib> hagane: The easiest way to install the nVidia drivers is by going to System -> Administration -> Hardware Drivers
[23:33] <Mathman> hagane: it's always best to go with your package manager
[23:33] <mudd`Hossam> jrib, darn i still get the same errors then... how can i report this?
[23:33] <jrib> tj83: no, tell people exactly what issues you are having
[23:33] <XiD`> Hi folks, I'm a complete linux/ubuntu newbie and looking for a place to learn about why I should switch to ubuntu. I'm extremely unfamiliar with linux and am very interested to learn more, I just need a webpage or poke in the right direction to see what it offers beyond the general information at ubuntu.com
[23:34] <Marcus_Intalex> nvidia driver issue  -> did you install build-essential ?
[23:34] <jrib> mudd`Hossam: I'll pastebin my sources.list and see if you still get errors
[23:34] <mudd`Hossam> alrighty, thanks
[23:34] <hagane> I downloaded specific driver for my video card and for this specific Linux version :] So I'm interested how do I use that file (why did I downloaded it anyway ?) :]
[23:34] <McRib> XiD`: I've written two articles on the subject:  http://elyon225.wordpress.com/2007/03/18/linux-vs-windows/  and http://elyon225.wordpress.com/2007/10/12/why-do-you-need-windows/
[23:35] <XiD`> thanks McJerry
[23:35] <XiD`> er
[23:35] <hagane> I'm gonna do th system trick though
[23:35] <jrib> mudd`Hossam: use http://paste.ubuntu.com/10831/, run sudo apt-get update and then see if you can install libssl-dev
[23:35] <XiD`> McRib
[23:35] <azeem_> anyony help i have lost my desktop envierment
[23:35] <^Tech-Help^> XiD` have you tried Wubi? http://wubi-installer.org/
[23:35] <McRib> XiD`: I'm no expert, but those two short articles sort of chronicle my experiences with Ubuntu.
[23:35] <Styles___> What is "Swap"?
[23:35] <jrib> !swap > Styles___ (read the private message from ubottu)
[23:35] <hagane> Styles - swap is like pagefile
[23:35] <XiD`> roger.
[23:35] <Styles___> k
[23:35] <McRib> XiD`: But the best way to learn is to actually get hands-on and try it. :P
[23:35] <hagane> make it on different partition twice as big as your RAM and format it SWAP :]
[23:35] <Marcus_Intalex> hagane please install the build-essential package
[23:35] <Styles___> jrib: How do I set it up?
[23:35] <XiD`> ^Tech-Help^: cool, looks neat. does it run on x64?
[23:36] <XiD`> windows xp pro x64.
[23:36] <Marcus_Intalex> afterwards kill x server
[23:36] <jrib> Styles___: it should have been done when you installed
[23:36] <Styles___> jrib: Fudge..
[23:36] <XiD`> McRib noted, i'll have to check it out 8)
[23:36] <Styles___> jrib: really?
[23:36] <John117> Where can i get some good compiz fuzion cube backgrounds?
[23:36] <hagane> Marcus_Intalex: yes master! :]
[23:36] <Styles___> jrib: Do I make another partition?
[23:36] <jrib> Styles___: are you sure it isn't set up already?
[23:36] <Styles___> jrib: Well I don't think so because its not in the System Monitor its _________________ at the bottom.
[23:37] <^Tech-Help^> XiD` yes
[23:37] <XiD`> wooooot
[23:37] <cheesebob> I'm having serious trouble with 8.04 and using synaptic.
[23:37] <Trae> can someone point me to some docs where: Option "ButtonMapping" "1 2 3 6 7 4 5" could be explained?  I don't mind RTFM I just haven't found anything yet useful to explain what that stuff is.  Plus what's a good tool to test what buttons are which?
[23:37] <Marcus_Intalex> browse to the folder where you have placed the driver
[23:37] <cheesebob> When I try to reload the list it hangs
[23:37] <jrib> Styles___: what does the command 'swapon -s' return?
[23:37] <cheesebob> 15/24
[23:37] <NMajik> Is there a way to display raw data from my wireless card?
[23:37] <McRib> Hmm... that's weird.  I'm using Konversation in Ubuntu 8.04.  But clicking on web links doesn't open them in Firefox (granted, it doesn't open them at all).  I've tried using the custom web browser setting of "firefox %u" but that still doesn't work.  Any ideas?
[23:37] <cheesebob> does anyboyd have any idea?
[23:37] <Marcus_Intalex> install driver in a non graphical environment
[23:37] <level09> how do I create tar.gz files from directories ? will this work "tar -vzf dirname" ?
[23:37] <Styles___> jrib: Nothing, it returns Filename Type Size Used Priority, but nonthing is in the liste.
[23:38] <jrib> Styles___: the link ubotu gave you, tells you how to add more swap then
[23:38] <mudd`Hossam> jrib, YES that was it, thanks alot sir/ma'am!
[23:38] <Marcus_Intalex> using the sh <drivername>
[23:38] <kitche> level09: tar -czvf <filename>.tar.gz dirname
[23:38] <Marcus_Intalex> commando
[23:38] <Mathman> NMajik: wireshark I spose?
[23:38] <level09> kitche: thanks ! i'll write that down
[23:38] <McRib> cheesebob: Just for future reference, it is a very good idea to write your entire question on just one line.  It is often difficult to follow all the parts of a question if it is dispersed throughout other conversations.
[23:38] <tj83> ok, well I Installed Ubuntu 8.04 the first time reccomended by a friend.... I wanted to experience the compiz features and they were quite impressive... but my system began to crash about every 5 in would ahve to ctrl+alt+backspace to get out... and then try again.. I re-installed and didnt enable compiz... runs much better but has frozen twice today.... . I have ATI X1200 radeon... I thought maybe it was the proprietary drivers but i have n
[23:38] <tj83> ot enabled them since re-install.
[23:38] <tj83> actually partially frozen now
[23:39] <TooFly> i have ubuntu installed, and just installed windows. now i can't boot from my ubuntu CD! it loads the kernel, and restarts my computer
[23:39] <Mathman> TooFly: mess with the boot order in your bios setup
[23:40] <Styles___> So for a swap, I have to resize this partition, then create another one ~3gigs large and (thats my ram) yeah..
[23:40] <sharperguy> what s the maximum filesize on ext3 in a default ubuntu install?
[23:40] <tj83_> sorry... crashed. i didnt get any replies? did my entry show?
[23:40] <Mathman> TooFly: oops, nevermind.  misread that
[23:40] <TooFly> Mathman:
[23:40] <TooFly> haha yeah
[23:40] <jrib> Styles___: no, you can create a swap file.  The wiki page explains this
[23:40] <Mathman> tj83_: update your system?  test your ram?  test your cpu?  dunno...
[23:40] <tj83_> its not a hardware issue.. debian runs perfect
[23:40] <NMajik> Mathman: How about as a hex stream or something though. It doesn't have to be usable but I want to try using it for RNG (granted, not very good randomness though)
[23:40] <tj83_> for weeks without reboot
[23:41] <freestyle10> hi
[23:41] <tj83_> and i did test ram and cpu when having the issue first
[23:41] <Mathman> NMajik: dunno....cat /dev/something or other?
[23:41] <freestyle10> i have problem with wine
[23:41] <billenium> How do i set a folder to not 777, but the files to 777?
[23:41] <McRib> Could someone please help me get my Microsoft (gasp!, it was cheap) Wireless Laser Desktop 4000 working?  Everything appears to work fine except for the middle mouse button... the wheel works fine, though.  Also, if you have info on how to configure the extra keys, I would accept that :)
[23:41] <jrib> billenium: what folder?  What are you doing exactly?
[23:41] <NMajik> Mathman: I was hoping something like that but I don't see "eth1" or whatever in /dev, what should I look for?
[23:42] <tj83_> seems like a memory leak to me... I was waching "top" it climbs and cimbs... after just boot..... used 500mb to just boot up.
[23:42] <freestyle10> preloader: Warning: failed to reserve range 00000000-60000000
[23:42] <Mathman> NMajik: beats me.  that was just a wild guess
[23:42] <billenium> jrib : i have a webserver, and i only want people to access the files inside the folder, not the folder itself. So they cant see what is inside.
[23:42] <thespecialone200> Hey
[23:42] <billenium> I dont know what to set the folder/files to.
[23:42] <level09> kitche: does it matter the order of the parameters ? ex: can I use tar -vczf or tar -zcvf ?
[23:42] <NMajik> Mathman: OK, thanks. Is there a way to determine what raw device eth1 references?
[23:42] <Mathman> tj83_: well, spose this is why I don't always upgrade to the latest and greatest distro foo the day it comes out
[23:42] <thespecialone200> Im having problems getting my integrated X3500 intel graphics to work....
[23:43] <kitche> level09: well f has to be last
[23:43] <thespecialone200> shouldnt that work with the newest ubuntu?
[23:43] <level09> kitche: thanks :)
[23:43] <tj83_> mathman..... what ver do you have?
[23:43] <jrib> billenium: so don't give them read permissions on the directory
[23:43] <Mathman> tj83_: ha, me?  I don't even run ubuntu.
[23:43] <tj83_>  sorry memory full again!
[23:44] <Esotericisms> evening
[23:44] <TooFly> I am having trouble installing from the Live CD -- my computer loads the kernel, waits ~15 seconds, and restarts
[23:44] <Esotericisms> I need a little help with getting ubuntu up and going
[23:44] <Plummet> whats the WINE channel? is there one?
[23:44] <billenium> jrib: how? (newb)
[23:44] <jrib> !permissions > billenium (read the private message from ubottu)
[23:44] <Mathman> Plummet: #winehq for user stuff
[23:44] <Brent^> is there a channel I should go to for help with compiz things or should I ask here?
[23:44] <thespecialone200> Should i try a more "experimental" ubuntu version to make X3500 work? its a asus p5-e vm hdmi mobo...
[23:44] <kitche> Plummet: #winehq most likely :)
[23:44] <Esotericisms> for some reason I cannot route past my firewall with my new ubuntu install, but every other machine on my network works just fine, so I am thinking it is ubuntu specific
[23:44] <jrib> Brent^: #compiz-fusion
[23:44] <freestyle10> Plummet you have problem with wine
[23:44] <kitche> Brent^: #compiz-fusion
[23:44] <Esotericisms> can anyone help?
[23:44] <freestyle10> ??
[23:45] <Mathman> tj83: have you tried a different desktop?  xfce or kde or something?
[23:45] <tj83> mathman.. what distro do you use then?
[23:45] <Plummet> freestyle10: i just dont know how to get it started at all :)
[23:45] <tj83> i am thinking i am going back to debain... not quite as user friendly... but much more PC friendly.
[23:45] <Esotericisms> anyone?
[23:45] <Mathman> tj83: depends on what machine we're talking I spose.
[23:45] <kitche> Plummet: umm wine <path/to/exe/ is how it;'s run it's a cli application
[23:45] <jrib> tj83: does the computer crash if you don't use X?
[23:46] <luigy> i need some help with my nvidea 8800m gts
[23:46] <Mathman> jrib: the computer isn't crashing I think he said, just X is getting screwed somehow
[23:46] <luigy> i have ubuntu 8.04 lts
[23:46] <statim> anyone know why there is no libmagick10-dev but there is a libmagick9-dev?
[23:47] <Mathman> jrib: ha, maybe he's just a debian troll.  who knows
[23:47] <iceolate> anyone figured out how to clone view for monitor and tv using svideo for hardy?
[23:47] <Jeruvy> Esotericisms: ...route past...?  Did you check you IP settings to make sure you've picked up a IPv4 address?
[23:47] <Trae> Hey guys I hate to be a broken record here, but surely someone knows a tool that lets you see what buttons you are pressing the output of such operations are?  I did this years ago but can't remember what the program was called and Google isn't loving me right now.
[23:47] <luigy> i need help installing my nvidia 8800m gts
[23:47] <Mathman> Trae: as far as a mouse goes you mean?
[23:48] <Trae> Mathman, yah just need to know what buttons are which when I'm pressing them.  Trying to setup my xorg.conf so it works right.
[23:48] <kmee> did u look at restricted drivers on your system for your 8800?
[23:48] <Trae> Mathman, and experimenting with ButtonMapping numbers blindly isn't fun.
[23:48] <Mathman> Trae: yeah, and that sounds way familiar too.  give me a sec
[23:48] <Esotericisms> can anyone help me with a networking problem?!
[23:49] <Trae> Mathman, thanks bud.
[23:49] <Mathman> Trae: hmm, or I could be thinking game pads...but give me a sec
[23:49] <luigy> i dont think they have the restricted drives option in hardy ubuntu
[23:49] <Trae> Mathman, you'd think the discover mech would be the same probably.
[23:49] <SeaPhor> Esotericisms, depends, whats the problem
[23:49] <cmw72> is there no longer a "screens and graphics" menu item in ubuntu ?
[23:49] <Esotericisms> SeaPhor: I just got ubuntu installed, got my interface setup but ubuntu won't route past my firewall
[23:50] <cmw72> (in 8.04)
[23:50] <kmee> i have hardy and i saw my 8600m gs in restricted drivers, i belive under administration, i just enabled it and i was fine
[23:50] <Esotericisms> SeaPhor: I have two other linux boxes and three windows machines that work just fine
[23:50] <SeaPhor> Esotericisms, hardware or software firewall?
[23:50] <Trae> Esotericisms, I hate to ask this but... (and please don't think I'm being mean)  have you double checked the physical connections.
[23:50] <K-Rich> Will programs i compiled under gutsy still work under hardy or will i need to recompile?
[23:50] <luigy> kmee i just enabled it... am gonna restart rite now
[23:50] <Esotericisms> Trae: ues
[23:50] <Esotericisms> yes
[23:50] <Esotericisms> cause I can get to all my devices on the internal side of my network
[23:51] <kmee> god luck luigy
[23:51] <kmee> good*
[23:51] <luigy> thanx bro
[23:51] <kmee> np
[23:51] <toreador> Enter text here...
[23:51] <spanther> omg nice luigy xD
[23:51] <Esotericisms> SeaPhor: its a hardware firewall that allows all traffic out from my lan
[23:51] <Trae> Esotericisms, Have you tried this...  Take out one of the working cables and swap it.  So you know that the cable is good.  (Cables do go bad)
[23:51] <toreador> by
[23:51] <spanther> luigy,  super mario :D
[23:51] <luigy> i heard that so many times
[23:51] <luigy> used to it already
[23:51] <spanther> xD
[23:51] <Esotericisms> Trae: I have no packet loss and I can get to the internal side
[23:51] <K-Rich> Will the programs i compiled under gutsy still work under hardy or will i need to recompile?
[23:51] <kmee> lol
[23:51] <spanther> luigy,  be happy luigy is a cool name x3
[23:52] <Esotericisms> if I try and ping google I get destination not available
[23:52] <Trae> Esotericisms, ahhh so you can ping your router?
[23:52] <Esotericisms> but if I ping my gateway it is fine
[23:52] <Esotericisms> yeah
[23:52] <luigy> i like it.. n that is wat i care
[23:52] <Trae> Esotericisms, sounds like a defaultroute issue.
[23:52] <Mathman> Trae: yeah, sorry.  I gave it a shot though.
[23:52] <spanther> luigy, yeah ^.^
[23:52] <SeaPhor> Esotericisms, this is kinda off topic if you want to join me in #SeaPhor, I'll try all I know
[23:52] <Trae> Mathman, np
[23:52] <John117> any suggestions on where i can get skydome backgrounds?
[23:53] <espinha_> heelo
[23:53] <hagane> if I have Ubuntu 64, do I need programs for Linux 64 specificly ?
[23:54] <espinha_> someone can help me?
[23:54] <spanther> hagane,  you can run 32bit applications without problems too
[23:54] <hagane> Yey :]
[23:54] <McRib> !ask | espinha_
[23:54] <spanther> hagane, just install 32bit librarys
[23:54] <cmdbbq> wondering if i could get an opinion of filesystems; I have a 1TB external drive and a 300GB external drive i am going to use them to store movies (dvd rips) file sizes between 350MB - 3GB what is the best file system performance and stability wise?
[23:54] <McRib> Could someone please help me get my Microsoft (gasp!, it was cheap) Wireless Laser Desktop 4000 working?  Everything appears to work fine except for the middle mouse button... the wheel works fine, though.  Also, if you have info on how to configure the extra keys, I would accept that :)
[23:55] <hagane> spanther:  I understood, thank you for information :]
[23:55] <DShepherd> John117, http://www.compiz-themes.org/
[23:55] <spanther> McRib, mine was cheaper :P    speedlink LASER USB mouse xD  10euro :> but works nice ^^
[23:55] <spanther> hagane,  no problem hehe :)
[23:55] <kmee> For skydomes, try this site : http://beryl-themes.org/
[23:55] <trebel> i just made the jump from gutsy to hardy and i'm having all kinds of nvidia driver problems.  Xorg keeps loading vesa for some reason and I can't build the drivers myself because they were compiled on gcc 4.1 and i have 4.2.  Anyone have any ideas on a work around?
[23:55] <rodolfo> anyone here uses evolution to access hotmail inox?
[23:55] <rodolfo> ops, inbox* :P
[23:56] <eugman> Anyone know how to add people to my buddy list in finch?
[23:56] <luigy> cant wait to install compiz
[23:56] <espinha_> hello, i will install fedora core, and this is not the currectly channel, someone knows the name of fedora channel (sorry my bad english :P)
[23:56] <DShepherd> eugman, you can try asking in #pidgin
[23:56] <DIL> rodolfo, you have to have full version paid to forward mail
[23:56] <Starnestommy> espinha_: #fedora
[23:56] <McRib> spanther: You had no problems getting all the mouse buttons recognized?
[23:56] <eugman> DSheperherd, good idea, thanks
[23:56] <sockel1> irc.abjects.net/evil
[23:56] <DShepherd> eugman, your welcome
[23:56] <gobbo> alright, so, I didn't do anything other than upgrade to Hardy Heron, but I can't seem to mount any flash drive.  I checked the mount points and, before the upgrade, to mount a USB port, it was "mount /dev/sda1", but now it says sda1 is my hard drive, so... does anyone here have an idea of what I should do?
[23:56] <rodolfo> DIL: what?
[23:56] <DIL> rodolfo, you have to have full version paid version of hotmail
[23:57] <Esotericisms> Trae: what is build-essential?
[23:57] <spanther> McRib, nope hehe :)
[23:57] <trebel> gobbo check sdb1
[23:57] <rodolfo> DIL: what do you mean by 'full version paid'?
[23:57] <Trae> Esotericisms, gcc and such
[23:57] <Starnestommy> Esotericisms: it's a package that lets you compile things from source
[23:57] <TuPari> I just upgraded to 8.04 and now I can't adjust my sound settings
[23:57] <nano_> whats the name of avant-windows-manager channel?
[23:57] <espinha_> ohh yeah, tanks, and a a portuguese channel? u know?
[23:57] <DShepherd> gobbo, you are mounting your thumb drive from the command-line?
[23:57] <spanther> McRib, maybe (like so often -.-" ) microsoft mouse doesnt follow actual standards
[23:57] <gerardoj> Hello guys, Im having a problem with my GTK theme, when I open any gnome application as sudo, everything looks like I have no theme, but normal user it works fine. What could be the problem?
[23:57] <Esotericisms> sweet thanks
[23:58] <DShepherd> nano_, #awn
[23:58] <nano_> DShepherd: thnx
[23:58] <prakriti> Does anybody know why compiz is putting a purple glow around my windows and how to change it?
[23:58] <Starnestommy> espinha_: #fedora-br
[23:58] <DShepherd> nano_, your welcome
[23:58] <DIL> rodolfo, there is a free version and then there is a full version that one has to pay for.  with that version you can forward mail similar to using gmail or other
[23:58] <rodolfo> DIL: do you know any evolution-dev's channel? if that exists..
[23:58] <sockel1> irc.abjects.net/evil
[23:58] <espinha_> thank you :'D
[23:58] <espinha_> huhu
[23:59] <TuPari> Is there some reason kmix won't work with pulseaudio?
[23:59] <DShepherd> prakriti, that's the group tab plugin. open up ccsm and go to the glow tab for that plugin
[23:59] <McRib> spanther: I actually was worried they had some kind of software in the keyboard and mouse to detect if the OS is Linux and thus refuse to work.
[23:59] <McRib> :)
[23:59] <DShepherd> prakriti, you can disable the group tab plugin if you are not using it


[00:50] <bradm> anyone about who can help with a problem deploying something in juju?  I'm getting an odd traceback when I try to add a service using juju deployer
[01:17] <LinStatSDR> What is the error bradm
[01:19] <bradm> LinStatSDR: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/9276609/, using a juju deployer config
[02:19] <lamont> I say juju upgrade-charm and the bundle it delivers is the _old_ contents of the charm directory.. (juju 1.16.5)  - thoughts?
[04:14] <captine> Hi all.  Can anyone point me to a write up (if available) of using Juju and MAAS in a corporate environment.  My company currently has an IBM pureflex running Hyper-V on all nodes and VM's on them.  All is managed as if the machines were physical e.g. no automated provisioning etc.  I am just trying to see if Juju is more for dev type people or if there is a usecase for it in a corporate where vm's dont chane much.
[11:57] <mgz> gnuoy: how busy are you today?
[11:57] <gnuoy> mgz, that seems like a loaded question...
[11:57] <gnuoy> mgz, I'm working on adding a feature so I can take a pause
[11:58] <mgz> so, I was looking on the train at the 'right' way of doing devel tools with juju and simplestreams
[11:58] <mgz> I think I have all the bits down now
[11:59] <mgz> so, if you want to retry the windows workloads tools part the right way, we could have a quick bash at that
[11:59] <gnuoy> ok, I have a call in 1 min, then I was hoping to grab some lunch but it'd be great to catch up about that this afternoon if taht's ok?
[11:59] <mgz> that works for me, poke when available
[13:37] <gnuoy> mgz my world is running behind, I'm heading to lunch now
[14:05] <hazmat> bradm, do you have a pastebin for the traceback?
[14:05] <hazmat> bradm, what version of juju?
[14:06] <hazmat> bradm, do you have a service 'infra' in your deployer config?
[14:17] <gnuoy> mgz, I'm champing at the bit
[14:45] <mgz> gnuoy: okay, I'm back from lunch too
[14:47] <gnuoy> mgz, ok, hit me
[14:49] <mgz> so, rough plan
[14:49] <mgz> make tools tarballs for a trunk juju version for trusty and windows
[14:49] <mgz> generate tools streams
[14:50] <mgz> bootstrap with --metadata-source pointing at that directory
[14:52] <gnuoy> mgzAre you suggesting I bootstrap with 1.20.12 tools?
[14:55] <mgz> gnuoy: no
[14:56] <mgz> we bootstrap with the devel, we just need to give bootstrap the path to our carefully constructed simplestreams version
[14:57] <gnuoy> ok
[15:02] <mgz> gnuoy: do you want to ssh into a box I have to poke things? or some other means to pair on this?
[15:03] <gnuoy> mgz, I need to disappear for 20mins but I'll be back after that. I'd like to get you access to the lab I'm working in tbh
[15:03] <mgz> ah, I should check if I have the vlan stuff set up on here
[15:31] <gnuoy> mgz, do you have vpn access to the qalab ?
[15:32] <gnuoy> mgzare you happy with juju-1.21-beta3-trusty-amd64.tgz juju-1.21-beta4-win2012hvr2-amd64.tg being the tools?
[15:37] <mgz> gnuoy: they need to be the same beta
[15:40] <gnuoy> mgz so there's a trusty beta 3 but no windows and a windows beta 4 but no trusty, right ?
[15:42] <mgz> gnuoy: there are both, it's just a question of putting in the same versions
[15:43] <mgz> sec, I just need to restore all my sessions (X login had a bit of a fit)
[15:43] <gnuoy> mgz, Are you saying that there is trusty beta 4 out there somewhere ?
[15:43] <mgz> there is trunk 1.21 which reports as the upcoming beta4
[15:44] <gnuoy> mgz, I'm looking at https://streams.canonical.com/juju/tools/devel/ fwiw
[15:44] <mgz> gnuoy: actually, let's just use tools from this job: <http://reports.vapour.ws/releases/2121>
[15:47] <gnuoy> mgz, Build Artifacts  empty  <- on the few I've tried
[15:50] <mgz> gnuoy: `wget http://data.vapour.ws/juju-ci/products/version-2121/win-client-build-installer/build-1325/juju-1.21.0-win2012-amd64.tgz`
[15:51] <mgz> gnuoy: `wget http://data.vapour.ws/juju-ci/products/version-2121/publish-revision/build-1237/juju-core_1.21.0-0ubuntu1~14.04.1~juju1_amd64.deb`
[15:51] <mgz> then `dpkg-deb -x juju-core_1.22-alpha1-0ubuntu1~14.04.1~juju1_amd64.deb extracted-bin
[15:52] <mgz> and get the jujud binary from in there for the trusty/amd64 combo
[15:53] <mgz> gnuoy: then my instructions from earlier has `tar -cf tools/devel/juju-`~/go/bin/juju version`.tgz -C ~/go/bin jujud` - but this is going to be different for these two tools
[15:54] <mgz> then we put the two tarballs in tools/devel/ under our working dir
[15:54] <mgz> and run `juju-metadata --debug generate-tools --clean --stream devel -d .`
[15:55] <mgz> check that the streams data generated has both tools
[16:00] <gnuoy> mgz ok so far: http://paste.ubuntu.com/9284701/
[16:03] <gnuoy> let me redo with the devel dir
[16:03] <mgz> gnuoy: okay, do releases rather than devel (pretty much the same, just different environments.yaml setting fun)
[16:03] <mgz> releases is fine
[16:04] <mgz> I did devel mostly because it seemed more fun
[16:04] <gnuoy> mgz happy for me to: juju bootstrap --metadata-source /var/lib/jenkins/.juju/tools  ?
[16:05] <mgz> gnuoy: next step is bootstrap with that `juju --debug bootstrap --metadata-source . -e $ENV`
[16:05] <mgz> gnuoy: I think not with the tools, it's the dir containing the tools
[16:05] <gnuoy> ack
[16:06] <mgz> I'd use a big buffer or tee out/err somewhere
[16:06] <mgz> because you need to read a lot of simplestreams junk if something's not right
[16:07] <mgz> after that it's add-machine with da windows
[16:25] <mgz> gnuoy: how it going?
[16:25] <mgz> I'll need to reboot for standup ina sec so will be off irc briefly
[16:25] <gnuoy> mgz one explosion down to the tgz not really being z
[16:25] <gnuoy> rebootstrapping now
[16:28] <mgz> yeah, I did .tar.gz first time around... which tar did z for me, but juju metadata refused to acknowledge
[16:29] <gnuoy> mgz, bootstrap done.Happy for me to go on to the windows deploy ?
[16:32] <gnuoy> me goes for it
[16:33] <mgz> go for it
[16:33] <gnuoy> arggh, I missed a v out of the windows tools name
[16:34] <mgz> gnuoy: whoops
[16:34] <mgz> I'll be back in ~10 or so, tell me how you get on
[16:35] <mgz> (and yes, this streams assembly stuff is all very error prone... does juju-metadata validate-tools help at all?
[16:35] <mgz> )
[16:46] <gnuoy> mgz http://paste.ubuntu.com/9285206/
[17:30] <mgz> gnuoy: how goes?
[17:31] <gnuoy> mgz, do you see my pastebin?
[17:31] <gnuoy>  http://paste.ubuntu.com/9285206/
[17:48] <mgz> gnuoy: looking now
[17:50] <mgz> gnuoy: can you kill that machine, do set-env with the debug log config (we should have supplied on bootstrap really..) and look at machine-0.log
[17:51] <gnuoy> mgz debug was set in the environments.yaml
[17:52] <mgz> okay, ace, then just look at machine-0.log for the provisioner bit that says "no matching tools available"
[17:54] <gnuoy> mgz I've popped the log on chinstrap
[17:56] <mgz> you're liam on chinstrap? not gnuoy?
[17:58] <mgz> 2014-11-28 16:45:46 DEBUG juju.environs.simplestreams simplestreams.go:428 read metadata index at "https://streams.canonical.com/juju/tools/streams/v1/index2.json"
[17:58] <mgz> 2014-11-28 16:45:46 DEBUG juju.environs.simplestreams simplestreams.go:436 index file has no data for product name(s) ["com.ubuntu.juju:win2012hvr2:amd64" "com.ubuntu.juju:win2012hvr2:i386" "com.ubuntu.juju:win2012hvr2:armhf" "com.ubuntu.juju:win2012hvr2:arm64" "com.ubuntu.juju:win2012hvr2:ppc64el"]
[17:59] <mgz> graaaaa
[19:43] <themonk> lazyPower, hi
[19:43] <themonk> i am getting a strange error after updating juju
[19:44] <themonk> few hours back
[19:44] <themonk> this is the error: WARNING discarding API open error: unable to connect to "wss://172......:17070/environment/4aaa9a83............/api" ERROR Unable to connect to environment "amazon". Please check your credentials or use 'juju bootstrap' to create a new environment.
[19:44] <themonk> credentials are ok
[22:23] <lkraider> hello, we are looking into extending juju to notify charm relations when their machines restart (right now only config-changed is called when the machine boots). Any pointers?
[22:39] <lkraider> we want to call relation-changed when a machine reboots
[22:39] <lkraider> is this possible?
[22:40] <sarnold> lkraider: i'm just a spectator, but that feels like it'd introduce a huge amount of overhead when machines reboot... running scripts to take that unit out of service in all N relations that know about it might take longer than the machine rebooting will take..
[22:41] <sarnold> lkraider: I suspect providing a unit-reboot hook would let charms that care about it handle it and let other charms ignore it without the overhead..
[22:43] <lkraider> @sarnold I mainly want to update the old relations with new IP when the machine reboots
[22:44] <sarnold> lkraider: aha :)
[22:46] <lkraider> sarnold: am I right in that there's no provision in Juju right now for that?
[22:47] <lkraider> sarnold: this is my understanding of the hooks as they are now: http://stackoverflow.com/a/25980368/324731
[22:47] <sarnold> lkraider: sorry, I'm too much of a bystander for that -- I wouldn't be surprised if semi-stable IPs are assumed though, and teardown / re-provision in the case of new unit IP addresses..
[22:48] <sarnold> lkraider: nice graph :)
[22:51] <lkraider> sarnold: yep, I found the docs confusing so I made it from what I gathered
[22:51] <lkraider> sarnold: not sure if its 100% accurate tho
[22:54] <lkraider> sarnold: thanks for your help, I'll try asking sometime later to the folks here again
[22:54] <sarnold> lkraider: good luck :)


[00:01] <tomreyn> hehe
[00:02] <tomreyn> i realized this mistake all too soon
[00:03] <tomreyn> i guess there will be no ssh tunneling with this user
[00:05] <tomreyn> Bashing-om: did you know unmkinitramfs nad the current initrd file format? i learnt something new today during my PEBCAK session this afternoon
[00:18] <Bashing-om> tomreyn: not in the leaast .. the term " unmkinitramfs ' is UNfamiliar :(
[00:18] <tomreyn> http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/bionic/man8/unmkinitramfs.8.html
[00:19] <tomreyn> Bashing-om: i didnt know it either, just wondered how to peek into an initramfs in 2018 <tomreyn> binwalk to the rescue! https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/MQ296gq7RQ/
[00:20] <tomreyn> (or rather: since the past few years, where i never did)
[00:21] <tomreyn> there's not a huge trove of documentation on this format which every systemd based distro seems to use nowadays.
[00:22] <Bashing-om> tomreyn: a new toy :) .. I had always done 'cpio' direct to extract the ramfs .
[00:23] <tomreyn> Bashing-om: so didi, and ended up with https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/mbZKvWfMzz/
[00:23] <tomreyn> *did i
[00:24] <tomreyn> which made me think it was broken, since my desktop would not boot at the time, stopping after "Loading initrd". took me a while to realize it was this other issue.
[00:24] <Bashing-om> added to my notes on the to-do list :)
[00:25] <tomreyn> :)
[00:26] <Bashing-om> tomreyn: I had followed along with what you were doing .. but as I am booting 18.10, I did not feel I could add anything .
[00:27] <Bashing-om> tomreyn: Also kinda procrastinating on doing UWN - can not seem to get in the frame of mind to do article summaries .
[00:29] <tomreyn> Bashing-om: thanks for following my chat there. is 18.10 different in terms of initrd?UWN = ubuntu weekly news?
[00:32] <Bashing-om> tomreyn: can not say what may have changed in the cosmic kernel space as I have yet to look and see . // Yes, UWN us Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter . Got to get hot on it if it is to meet the Monday deadline .
[00:34] <Bashing-om> tomreyn: to tell the truth. last time I seriously looked at the kernel was the change from 10.04 to 12.04 .
[00:36] <tomreyn> hehe
[00:36] <tomreyn> time flies
[00:41] <Bashing-om> Time - Tell me ! .. Can not believe tghe time lapse since I was *forced* to relinguish 10.04 .. it is now 18.10 time . A lot of support time !
[05:07] <lotuspsychje> good morning to all
[05:40] <lotuspsychje> !info clonezilla
[05:49] <Bashing-om> Toddl'n off to bed ,,, G Night \o
[06:39] <ducasse> good morning
[09:39] <blackflow> moaning!
[11:14] <lotuspsychje> any of you guys saw automatic kernel cleanup in update-manager yet?
[11:14] <lotuspsychje> i seen it once GUI
[11:17] <lotuspsychje> hmm seems like my bug about it dissapeared
[11:20] <lotuspsychje> !kernelcleanup
[11:52] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[11:52] <lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
[11:53] <lotuspsychje> support is ZZZzzzZZZ at the moment
[11:54] <blackflow> Sat afternoon for the european shift :)
[11:54] <lotuspsychje> yeah
[11:54] <lotuspsychje> and sunny, and vacation, and grocerys
[12:02] <lotuspsychje> https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/banking-trojan-found-in-over-40-models-of-low-cost-android-smartphones/
[12:03] <lotuspsychje> android is safe heh, what a joke
[12:03] <BluesKaj> Hey lotuspsychje
[12:04] <BluesKaj> i don't bank on my phone unless I feel safe on the network i'm using
[12:04] <BluesKaj> think i did it once only a few weeks ago
[12:07] <blackflow> to be fair, the problem is not really in android, it's in malicious vendors.
[12:08] <blackflow> the lower the price of something, the higher the "price" of it :)
[12:12] <lotuspsychje> thats only what they know, im sure many other rootkits floating around unknown tru all kinds of mobile Oses
[12:14] <lotuspsychje> welcome revenant
[12:15] <revenant> Hello world.  I've got a friend claiming Ubuntu's full of proprietary awfulness and lots of restrictions, but I've never seen any restrictions.  Does anyone see practical differences between Ubuntu and Debian?
[12:16] <blackflow> you sure she didn't mean Apple/OSX/IOS?
[12:17] <blackflow> (it's UNIX, you know, so maybe there's the confusion with (Ubuntu) Linux)
[12:22] <lotuspsychje> !debian | revenant
[12:33] <revenant> blackflow - she definitely didn't mean Apple. She's just pretty extreme about the FOSS stuff.  I wonder how much truth there is to it, because the only thing I have trouble modifying is the Gnome terminal, nothing to do with Ubuntu.
[12:35] <blackflow> revenant: there's no truth to it. Ubuntu _may_ be opinionated on how certain things are pre-set, but it's all open and GPL compliant (and compliant to any other license some software might come with, in official Ubuntu repositories).
[12:35] <blackflow> on the other side of the spectrum, it is not strict wrt Libre software, and thus it support installation of non-libre software, like nvidia proprietary drivers, for example.
[12:38] <revenant> blackflow: that's been my experience.  I've seen some nice things about the Debian repositories, but Ubuntu seems more up to date, and I wonder if installing drivers for my NVidia graphics card would be difficult under Debian.
[12:38] <blackflow> Debian supports "nonfree" repositories.
[12:52] <BluesKaj> sometimes debian permissions can be a pita, but otherwise it's a top notch OS IMO
[12:53] <BluesKaj> their support chat is populated by some really pedantic assh*les too
[12:54] <blackflow> it's a quality OS, no doubt about it. personally I prefer the better hardware and software support, and the whole release model of Ubuntu, esp. LTS + 6-month dev versions inbetween for some new software love affair :)
[12:55] <BluesKaj> yeah, I like testing new Kubuntu dev releases
[13:01] <blackflow> sometimes the NIH stuff like netplan can be a bit annoying :)
[13:01] <blackflow> but Unity was awesomest thing. bestest DE out there. I have had sads that it's no longer officially supported.
[19:23] <EriC^^> hello all
[19:26] <blackflow> 'elo
[19:26] <Bashing-om> EriC^^: :)
[19:27] <jink> :')
[23:09] <pauljw> hi everyone


[18:46] <cyberanger> wb ChanServ
[18:46] <cyberanger> err
[18:47] <Unit193> :D
[18:47] <cyberanger> wb chris4585
[21:30] <wrst> cyberanger: glad to know I'm not the only one that makes that tabcomplete error :)
[21:30] <wrst> and wb chris4585
[22:32] <chris4585> hey
[23:18] <wrst> all going well chris4585 ?
[23:45] <chris4585> yeah I got my beer and just put out a fire
[23:47] <wrst> ha ha
[23:48] <Unit193> wrst: Shamed him right out.


[02:28] <mdeslaur> teward: you append a new files paragraph to the copyright file with the information pertaining to the new files you've added. The format is documented here: https://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/copyright-format/1.0/
[02:29] <teward> mdeslaur: thanks
[02:29] <teward> (always love learning things! ^.^)
[02:30] <teward> (especially when i forget things too xD)
[08:10] <dholbach> good morning
[11:11] <bluesabre> good morning dholbach :)
[11:11] <dholbach> hi bluesabre
[11:12] <bluesabre> how's it going in the land of the motu?
[11:14] <dholbach> I'm currently in working-on-a-help-app land, but I'm doing well, thanks
[11:14] <dholbach> how about you?
[11:17] <bluesabre> oh, that sounds cool. alternative to yelp, something for ubuntu-phone, something else?
[11:18] <bluesabre> finally got xfce 4.12 in (huge thanks to infinity), so doing well


[07:54] <dpm> good morning everyone!
[10:48] <cjohnston> mornin
[10:49] <dpm> hey cjohnston :)
[10:52] <cjohnston> :-)
[10:52] <dpm> happy new year!
[10:53] <cjohnston> same to you
[10:56] <cjohnston> Up a whole lot earlier than I wanted to be :-(
[11:12] <AlanBell> http://alanbell.libertus.co.uk:8000/uds-q/meeting/1/testmeeting/
[11:12] <AlanBell> if someone could have a look at that it would be rather smashing
[11:13]  * jussi prods AlanBell
[11:15] <AlanBell> nearly there I think
[11:16] <jussi> :)
[11:17]  * AlanBell ponders a heretical thought
[11:18] <AlanBell> I was just about to rip out the chat thing in the etherpad, because we use IRC for the UDS rooms with mixed success
[11:18] <AlanBell> and it occurred to me that we might contemplate considering the possibility of putting the pad pages with chat on the projectors instead of IRC
[11:19] <jussi> but you want to move away from irc ?
[11:19] <cjohnston> AlanBell: -2
[11:19] <jussi> AlanBell: not a good idea.
[11:19] <AlanBell> it possibly isn't a good idea
[11:19] <cjohnston> AlanBell: how about make it inherit the  fact that your logged into summit
[11:20] <jussi> Does the chat have moderation capabilities? (easily?) does it have exposure?  work on mobile?
[11:20] <AlanBell> but one of the main frustrations for remote users is that nobody pays any attention to the IRC
[11:20] <popey> Also nice to have the pad and the chat in the same place
[11:20] <jussi> AlanBell: Ill tell you what to do, embed the freenode webchat into the page ;)
[11:20] <AlanBell> I am going to add moderation (ban a launchpad ID)
[11:20] <cjohnston> AlanBell: i think they would pay less attention when its on pad page
[11:21] <cjohnston> its way too small
[11:21] <jussi> thats also a problem.
[11:21] <cjohnston> has to be minimized and max'ed
[11:21] <AlanBell> you can resize it and I can change that anyway
[11:21] <jussi> AlanBell: or have the page monitor the irc channel and alert when the nick is highlighted
[11:21] <cjohnston> but if you make it bigger its going to take up the space of the pad
[11:23] <AlanBell> that is just a matter of finding a happy compromise
[11:24] <cjohnston> I'm -1 on the idea
[11:28] <AlanBell> chat works on android (and presumably iphone) the pad itself is readonly because mobile browsers don't do contenteditable mostly
[11:32] <AlanBell> I don't know if I am +1 or -1 on the idea, but I have spent a lot of time doing remote participation for UDS, I love IRC in general but the room based system doesn't feel like it is unimproveable
[11:33] <AlanBell> cjohnston: I don't think it is feasible to inherit the fact you are already logged into launchpad because the pad server can't read a cookie belonging to the summit server
[11:34] <popey> they could probably improve the irc experience by simply moving the irc projector so it is next to the pad projector
[11:34] <cjohnston> AlanBell: the pad is on the same server as summit
[11:34] <popey> that way your head is facing the same way
[11:34] <AlanBell> popey: there *isn't* a pad projector
[11:34] <popey> technically there is
[11:34] <AlanBell> there is an IRC projector and a floating VGA cable
[11:34] <popey> the one people use in the room
[11:35] <popey> in most rooms that gets used for pad projection
[11:35] <cjohnston> AlanBell: not all sessions use the cable for etherpad.. some use it for demo's and such. what would you do for chat then?
[11:35] <czajkowski> popey: aye I suggested that in the feedback or movin the fish bowl a bit wider to see the screens
[11:35] <AlanBell> cjohnston: ok, if we moved it into the summit realm it might be possible to do something
[11:35] <popey> whilst not every session uses the cable for etherpad, the vast majority of sessions have people _looking_ at the non-irc display
[11:36] <popey> which means that they are _not_ looking at the irc one
[11:36] <cjohnston> i agree.
[11:36] <popey> for the vast majority of the time
[11:36] <AlanBell> popey: indeed
[11:36] <czajkowski> yup
[11:36] <popey> put them next to eachother and you very quickly fix that
[11:38] <AlanBell> cjohnston: so what I am thinking is an optimised display that shows the pad for the current session, with chat (possibly styled differently in terms of size, translucency, more like libnotify)
[11:39] <AlanBell> and that goes on the fixed display, and the floating VGA is just floating for demos etc
[11:39] <AlanBell> the pad and chat about the session *stay together* so people can leave notes in the chat before the session and after the session you can refer to the chat about the session
[11:40] <cjohnston> AlanBell: if you lose etherpad then you lose chat
[11:40] <AlanBell> I can't now easily go from say http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-p/meeting/19599/servercloud-p-php54 to the chatter that happened in the IRC channel about that session
[11:40] <cjohnston> if you wanted to do that with a regular irc window that may work
[11:41]  * cjohnston has g2g
[11:43] <AlanBell> I am not too worried about losing etherpad, I think this will be stable, I will be doing load testing with a few thousand connections (not with launchpad accounts)
[11:46] <AlanBell> an IRC<->pad chat gateway would be feasible
[12:39] <doctormon> AlanBell: Considering the way the pad works, why not ditch irc altogether and move to the pad? It has a chat facility as well as being logged in the right place, attached to the discussed data and insitue.
[12:39] <AlanBell> doctormon: that is exactly what is being considered
[12:41] <doctormon> I see, I do have a gold medal in pointing out the obvious.
[12:42] <AlanBell> it should be an olympic event
[12:42] <doctormon> So is anything else going on community wise other than uds/summit?
[12:44] <jussi> doctormon: Im getting stressed out by the waiting... :/
[12:44] <AlanBell> jussi: star jumps ;)
[12:44] <doctormon> jussi: What are you waiting for?
[12:45] <jussi> doctormon: same thing as you got not so long ago ;)
[12:45] <jussi> due date is 6th Jan.
[12:58] <doctormon> jussi: Wonderful!
[12:59] <doctormon> jussi: Violet was just sick all over the place, she really got into New Year celibrations ;-)
[13:03] <doctormon> I think you've gone further term than we did. We were 2 weeks early.
[13:13] <jussi> :)
[13:21] <AlanBell> pad chat popups are mor libnotifyish now
[13:35] <jussi> doctormon: yeah, we are a bit on from that. I just hope it comes soon!
[14:12] <mhall119> good morning and happy new year
[14:26] <dpm> hey mhall119, happy new year :)
[15:12]  * nigelb waves from the beachside
[15:20] <AlanBell> hi nigelb
[15:20] <nigelb> Hey AlanBell!
[16:59] <AlanBell> http://alanbell.libertus.co.uk:9001/chat/testpad experimental and rather rough chat only interface
[16:59] <AlanBell> http://alanbell.libertus.co.uk:9001/p/testpad is the corresponding page including the editor
[19:41] <AlanBell> greg-g: hi
[19:41] <AlanBell> yeah, I don't have username switching on the chat only pad
[19:42] <AlanBell> and that padname doesn't need launchpad login
[19:42] <greg-g> AlanBell: ah, I just see links and click on them, no worries :)
[19:43] <AlanBell> thats fine :)
[19:43] <AlanBell> it was a good test, I had only used it after already logging in to launchpad
[19:45] <greg-g> ah, then you're welcome ;)
[19:45] <AlanBell> I have an idea of some awesomeness relating to a mobile chat-only interface
[20:12] <cprofitt> afternoon all


[07:45] <Madpilot> Gah. Irritating when people come on with "My Grand Project", and dismiss all suggestions to join existing ongoing projects by repeating how cool they imagine their Grand Project to be...
[07:51] <nixternal> link? :)
[07:53] <Madpilot> just a guy in #ubuntu who wants to start something called "The Ubuntu Experiment"
[07:53] <Burgundavia> umm?
[07:53] <Madpilot> file under yet-another-intro-for-new-users
[07:53] <nixternal> ahhh, ya...another great flop
[07:53] <Burgundavia> ahh
[07:54] <Burgundavia> well, we do need to solve some problems, but the devs are making our work irrelevant
[06:51] <jlk> Is there a reason why there are no example images in help.ubuntu.com wiki?
[07:36] <willvdl> jlk, you mean like screenshots?
[09:02] <jlk> yes, screenshots
[11:15] <bdmurray> Is there any documentation about when you would need to reinstall Ubuntu?


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[08:54] <cthuluhA908QS> pavlushka physicist Project Researcher GodMother Suntop Researcher- ubuntulog habbasi PKBot dan-


[19:31] <xevious> Is there any work being done towards integrating root-on-ZFS support into the installer?
[20:49] <tsimonq2> yeah, that's be interesting
[20:50] <tsimonq2> AFAIR Debian/kFreeBSD can do it